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True freedom comes, as we'll see
in the next episode, True 

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freedom comes from the grace of 
God, where you are not not doing

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something because you've been 
taught not to. 

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No, but it's that you don't even
have the desire in your hearts 

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in the 1st place. 
That is true freedom. 

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Right now, it may seem like 
we've deviated from backsliding,

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but you know what? 
This is exactly what, what, what

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the whole thing of backsliding 
looks like. 

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You know, it's that it is always
based on actions, right? 

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And, and, and rightfully so, 
because we see in the Old 

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Testament. 
But the truth is that we are not

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under the law. 
Hello Grace and chic Ben. 

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Well, all our face. 
Welcome back to another episode.

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Yes, it's going to be a 
beautiful one as you can see 

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what of course you know you can 
see for yourself. 

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We have an exciting episode, a 
topic, rather, that you want to 

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talk about today, you want to 
introduce it. 

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No, it's OK. 
I think you are the best 

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introducer. 
We want to discuss and talk 

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about it and just unpack a topic
that's actually been have you on

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my heart the past couple of 
days. 

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And that is the topic of 
backsliding. 

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And I think, you know, as a, as 
an average Christian, I believe 

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like everyone has heard that 
word before, right, backsliding.

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But we want to unpack it. 
We want to talk about it and 

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also just shed some new covenant
lights when it when it comes to 

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backsliding. 
And yeah. 

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Yes, yeah. 
No, that's exactly what we want 

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to do, guys. 
I believe all of us have some 

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kind of definition of what 
backsliding is, and we, as 

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always, want to look into 
Scripture about what exactly 

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does the Bible say about it. 
And yeah, from there, just share

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some biblical perspective on 
this topic. 

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Yeah. 
So I'm going to go ahead and 

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just read what Copilot says, our
trusted AI advisor. 

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Not an advisor. 
I'm joking, just a source of 

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information. 
Amen. 

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So yeah, I'm just going to read 
what copilot says is a 

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definition of backsliding. 
So it says in Christianity, 

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backsliding refers to a believer
drifting away from a previously 

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committed relationship with God,
especially in faith, obedience, 

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or spiritual practices. 
What backsliding means in simple

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terms is that one gradually 
turns, oh, sorry, one gradually 

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returns to old habits or 
behaviors that go against their 

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faith. 
One stops practicing things like

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prayer, reading scripture or 
church fellowship. 

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Or one becomes spiritually 
indifferent, even if they still 

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identify as Christian. 
And it's usually understood as a

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process. 
Or I think if you ask the 

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average person, backslider is 
not just, oh, I missed the 

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history of backslidden. 
You know, I think everyone will 

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describe it as it's a series of 
things. 

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It's not just the ones of your 
dying, you know. 

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Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
So can you just share your from 

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personal experience, what for 
you is backsliding in the past? 

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Yeah, you know, what have you 
been taught? 

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What is your understanding and 
what is your experience? 

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Yeah. 
Regarding backsliding. 

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So, you know when you get saved,
Well, not, you know, but what I 

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learned back then when I got 
saved is that once you see it, 

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you are supposed to live in such
a way, you know, let go of old 

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habits like this. 
Just this. 

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I don't want to just say an 
expectation, but it's almost 

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like a. 
Rules. 

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That say, OK, now that you're 
saved country 123, you know, 

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those things that aren't 
necessarily in the Bible or for 

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example, so you know when you 
get saved, do you there's this 

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basically almost in the 
requirements, you know, that get

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placed on your things you must 
do or things you must not do. 

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And for example, you know, 
reading your Bible every day and

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spending X amount of in prayer 
every day or every week. 

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It's why I said the list goes 
on, right? 

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And yeah, there's just certain 
times where I felt like I'm not 

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really living up to that 
expectation, you know, And I 

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felt like it's this backsliding,
you know, sometimes having found

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myself maybe like going back to 
my pastor or before I went, 

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before I got sick, do you know, 
making a mistake. 

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Yes, I would see that as, oh, 
OK, I've backslidden and I've 

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come back to court. 
Yeah. 

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But like you said, we, we want 
to share some, some light, you 

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know, in reference to the 
Scriptures. 

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So yeah, let's let's read a few 
scriptures of art backsliding. 

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Yeah, because it is a look. 
Is there such a thing as 

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actually backsliding publicly? 
And you know the answer is 

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actually yes, that is from the 
Word of God, right? 

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So one of the scriptures that we
want to share where you actually

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do find the word backsliding is 
in Jeremiah chapter 2. 

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So if you read the title there 
at the top of the chapter, it 

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says Israel forsakes God and God
talks about how they were 

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devoted to him. 
So starting at the beginning, it

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says the word of the Lord came 
to me. 

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Go and proclaim in the hearing 
of Jerusalem. 

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This is what the Lord says. 
I remember the devotion of your 

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youth, how as a bride you loved 
me and followed me through the 

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wilderness, through a land not 
sown. 

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Israel was holy to the Lord, the
first fruits of his harvest. 

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All who devoured her were held 
guilty, and disaster overtook 

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them, declares the Lord right. 
And so God keeps talking about 

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them and their devotion to him 
initially as he walked with them

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in the wilderness. 
But if you continue to read and 

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I want to jump when you have 
time, you can read the the whole

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chapter. 
But when you continue to read, 

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God begins to talk about how 
basically their hearts turned 

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against him. 
And so we actually find the word

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backsliding is in verse 19 where
it says this is what God says to

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them. 
Your wickedness will punish you.

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Your backsliding will rebuke 
you. 

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Consider then and realize how 
evil and bitter it is for you 

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when you forsake the Lord your 
God and have no awe of me, 

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declares the Lord Almighty. 
And so in the book of Jeremiah 

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2, you see basically God talking
about as we read how you know 

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they had devotion to Him, but as
time went on, as he walked with 

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them in the wilderness, their 
hearts basically turned away 

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from the Lord. 
And the same thing you find in 

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Hosea Chapter 11 and the title 
there is God's love for Israel, 

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right? 
And it says from verse one, when

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Israel was a child, I loved him,
and out of Egypt I called my 

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son. 
But the more they were called, 

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the more they went away from me.
They sacrificed to the boughs 

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and they burned incense to 
images. 

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And so God begins to talk about 
all the wickedness that they 

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were doing. 
And in verse 7 he says, my 

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people are determined to turn 
from me. 

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Even though they call me God 
Most High, I will by no means 

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exalt them. 
That actually reminds me of that

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first in Romans chapter 3. 
I think we can read it. 

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We're also talks about how 
everyone has turned away from 

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the Lord, right? 
Yeah, let's read it. 

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Yeah, no, exactly. 
So because now what I think a 

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lot of us when we read the 
journey of the Israelites with 

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the Lord and we see, you know, 
them turning from the Lord all 

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of their complaining, I believe 
we tend to have this perspective

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that it can never be me. 
Basically we we think, no, it, 

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it can never be me. 
Sure, right. 

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And in the context of 
backsliding, as we saw in 

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Jeremiah, that's what God 
describes as backsliding, is 

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that, you know, your, your heart
is turned away from the Lord 

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like he describes with the with 
the Israelites, which is the 

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same thing that he says in the 
book of Hosea as well. 

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Right now. 
The truth is that actually we 

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are all on equal footing, right?
We are all in equal footing. 

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And we want to jump to Romans 
chapter 3 because you see the 

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Israelites at that point in 
time, like we know in terms of 

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their work with God, they were 
under the law. 

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And so God was judging them 
based on their works, right? 

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And that's why you'll find that 
as they were walking, you know, 

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for example, when they were 
complaining in the wilderness 

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and you know, the snakes, they 
in the desert started biting 

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them. 
You know, God's judgement came 

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upon them because of their 
works. 

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Right? 
Now, this is the unfortunate 

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thing. 
It's that today, though we are 

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not under the law, we still 
teach, for example, backsliding,

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because you know, this whole 
thing has to do with our 

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relationship with God, right? 
And so backsliding you can 

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describe as this is you and God,
right? 

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Maybe when you got saved or at 
any given point in your 

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relationship, you are like this 
with God. 

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And it's like at some point, 
because of most, most of the 

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time it's because you are not 
doing certain things or you 

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started doing certain things 
which are displeasing to the 

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Lord. 
That backsliding is you are like

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this, but now you've distanced 
yourself. 

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Yeah, yeah. 
From God. 

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So this has to do like you see 
with the Israelites, it is 

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solely based on what they did, 
their performance, their 

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performance. 
Works their actions. 

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Yeah, yes, yeah. 
And I believe for most of us as 

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Christians, unfortunately, 
that's how even today we walk 

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with the Lord. 
Sure, that's why we feel far 

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from God. 
We. 

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Have done wrong when we've done 
wrong or when we have been 

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inconsistent? 
Yeah, I know, I know. 

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You know, I can. 
I can say from personal 

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experience that in terms of 
backsliding, the one thing that 

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used to really get me was the 
lack of consistency when it 

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comes to spending time with the 
Lord. 

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Because, you know, I was taught 
that the best time to spend with

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the Lord is when you start your 
day in the morning. 

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And it happened so many times 
that, you know, because of the 

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business of life, I just wake 
up, I take a shower and I'm 

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running to wherever I need to 
be, right? 

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And because now I believe that 
because I didn't spend time with

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him, there's a distance that I 
begin to feel. 

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And it's like even when things 
happen in the day, I feel like I

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can actually even rely on the 
Lord. 

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You just feel like ash. 
I'm far from God, you know? 

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So, you know, it's like in my 
mind, I don't even bother to ask

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for, for help, you know, for 
wisdom, for guidance, because 

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it's like, I mean, what's the 
point? 

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So why, why would I, why would 
God respond to me if you know, 

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if, if I haven't done what I was
supposed to do? 

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And so in Romans chapter 3, you 
will see something very 

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interesting, which in essence is
a revelation, yeah, of God to 

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the apostle poet regarding this 
whole matter of your 

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relationship go with God 
basically depending on on you. 

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And he says from verse 9 of 
Romans 3. 

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What shall we conclude then? 
Do we have any advantage? 

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Not at all, for we have already 
made the charge that Jews and 

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Gentiles alike are all under the
power of sin as it is written. 

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There is no one righteous, not 
even one. 

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There is no one who understands.
There's no one who seeks God. 

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All have turned away. 
And I mean to stop here. 

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I'm sure you, you you have an 
experience in your past where 

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you feel like you are far from 
God because you haven't been 

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seeking him. 
Yeah. 

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You know, not not seeking God, 
not pursuing him because you 

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know, again, we work with that 
low perspective of if I am not 

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doing what I'm supposed to do, 
then basically it's like I'm 

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turning away from the Lord. 
And Romans 3 continues to say 

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all have turned away. 
All have turned away. 

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They have together become 
worthless. 

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There is no one who does good, 
not even one. 

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Their throats are open graves, 
their tongues praxis, deceit. 

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The poison of Vipers is on their
lips. 

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Their mouths are full of cursing
and bitterness. 

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Their feet are swift to shed 
blood. 

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Ruin and misery mark their ways 
and the way of peace. 

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They do not know. 
There is No Fear of God before 

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their eyes. 
And you know, in case you may 

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think that, ah, you know that's,
that's not me. 

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Let me tell you, when the Bible 
says these things, it's talking 

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about all of us. 
Yes, yeah. 

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All of us have actually turned 
from the Lord, you know, even 

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now being saved as Christians, 
you know, a lot of the time we 

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actually do our own thing. 
Yeah. 

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We, we don't keep him, step with
the Lord. 

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And there is something here that
is so amazing that the apostle 

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Paul is about to ship through 
the Spirit. 

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Because, you know, when the 
Bible talks about how we have 

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all turned away, actually you 
must. 

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That should actually set you 
free from the pressure of yeah, 

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but but not me. 
You know, it should actually set

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you free because that's what all
of us do a lot of the time. 

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We choose other things. 
We choose to spend more time 

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doing other things other than 
spending time with the Lord. 

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You know, you may say that, you 
know, at least I do this, I do 

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this. 
You know, the truth is all of us

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on a daily basis, you know, if 
you count the 24 hours you have,

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I mean, let's say excluding 
sleep, maybe 16 hours you have 

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read. 
How much of that time do you 

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spend with the Lord? 
Not too bad rights. 

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And so the Bible continues in 
verse 19 to say, now we know 

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that whatever the law says, it 
says to those who are under the 

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law, which we know is the Jewish
people. 

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So then every mouth may be 
silenced, and the whole world 

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held accountable to God. 
And then verse 20, which is so 

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amazing, says, therefore no one 
will be declared righteous in 

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God's sight by the works of the 
Lord. 

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Amen. 
Rather, through the law, we 

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become conscious of our sin. 
Amen. 

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That is the most freeing verse. 
Amen. 

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Because then we know that. 
Even as believers, when we get 

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it wrong, it doesn't change our 
standing with the Lord. 

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Like you said, we go our days, 
some of us maybe don't even 

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spend a tithe of our day at 10% 
right with the Lord and it's 

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fine, there's no condemnation. 
But to know that even in that 

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state, I'm still righteous 
before the Lord because it's not

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based on my works. 
Amen. 

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There's no such thing as as a 
believer. 

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You are out of fellowship with 
God just because you've done 

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something wrong or just because 
you haven't done what you were 

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supposed to do. 
Literally, our actions don't 

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change our standing before the 
Lord. 

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Amen. 
And so this, this, this really 

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actually sets us free because 
you know, and low mentality in 

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the context of backsliding is 
exactly this. 

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It is a it is, it is a posture 
of law of being under law. 

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You know that really you, you, 
you are in a posture of law when

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you think I have to do this and 
this and this, you know, and, 

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and, and the perspective is 
always because this is what God 

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expects of me, right? 
And we walk with that burden on 

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our shoulders, right? 
When the Bible actually says 

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there is no person that will be 
declared righteous in God's 

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sight by the works of the law. 
In other words, you know it's 

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not possible for you to be in 
right standing with God based on

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your obedience to God's 
commands. 

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That's what the Bible is 
actually saying here. 

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The the idea that one day I feel
confident in my relationship 

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with God because I woke up and I
actually prayed and I actually 

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read my Bible right. 
And we think because of the 

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right that I've done, that's why
we feel confident and we feel 

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like, OK, it means on this day 
I'm actually in right standing 

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with God. 
Sure. 

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And unfortunately, because we 
are so fickle, something happens

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in the day or the next day, you 
know, it's, that's why you find 

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that we always feel like our 
relationship with God is always 

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going up and down and, and, and,
and, and, and the truth about 

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00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:59,960
this Scripture is that for you 
to ever be declared righteous in

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00:22:59,960 --> 00:23:03,640
God's sight is not just doing 
one thing right. 

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It's it's keeping to God's 
standard in all things. 

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All the time. 
Literally exactly. 

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And no one can ever do that. 
No one can actually live like 

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that. 
And so even to people, the 

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Pharisees who thought they were 
better than others because they,

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00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:33,040
they thought, you know, they, 
they keep the law and so they're

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00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:35,480
better than others, You know, 
they, they feel like they are 

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actually closer to God, I 
suppose, as opposed to others. 

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And, and So what Jesus does is 
that he removes them from their 

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00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:53,080
high horses and he says, well, 
you know what the, the standard 

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00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:59,240
of comet when it comes to the 
law is not just the outward 

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action of keeping it. 
You see, if so, he says you have

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00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:12,480
heard and he's quoting now one 
of the commandments from from 

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the law, the 10 commandments. 
If you have heard before, you 

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said you know you shall not 
murder. 

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00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:25,400
But I say to you, if you have 
anger towards a fellow brother, 

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00:24:26,920 --> 00:24:29,200
as far as God is concerned, 
you've committed the ACT. 

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00:24:30,360 --> 00:24:32,520
You know, as far as God is 
concerned, you've committed the 

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00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:36,120
ACT because and, and I think 
this is what we're going to end 

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off with in this, in this 
episode. 

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Is it because the, the thing 
about the law is that the law 

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00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:49,880
can never actually set you free.
The one example that comes to 

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00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:54,520
mind is offense, right? 
I know Pastor Campbell was 

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00:24:54,520 --> 00:25:01,320
talking about this in I think on
on one of the Sundays, right. 

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00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:07,280
So offence for example, right. 
You see teaching that is law 

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00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:12,080
based says when it comes to 
dealing with sin of any kind, 

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00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:20,840
law teaching says you shall not.
That's that's what law teaching.

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00:25:20,880 --> 00:25:23,400
Yes, don't be offended, you 
know, I suppose. 

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00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:26,400
You're not supposed to be 
offended as a Christian. 

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00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:33,200
Now here's the same thing. 
Is that now I've been taught as 

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00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:38,760
a husband that I should not have
an offence in my heart against 

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00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:44,120
my wife. 
OK, then on a certain day, you 

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00:25:44,120 --> 00:25:48,480
know, things happened and the 
offence now comes to my heart 

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00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:52,960
right now because I've been 
taught that, hey chief, you are 

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00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:58,760
a believer and so you should not
actually be doing this right? 

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00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:04,600
You find what happens a lot of 
the time is that because you've 

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00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:11,160
been taught that you shouldn't 
when, when that offense comes. 

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00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:17,360
Now what happens is maybe 
normally you know, you, you 

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00:26:17,360 --> 00:26:20,600
would express that offense 
through your words or through 

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00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:21,960
your actions, whatever it may 
be. 

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00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:26,680
But now, you know, the teaching 
comes back to your mind that I 

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00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:28,560
was actually taught that I 
shouldn't. 

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00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:33,320
You know, you see, The thing is 
that you, you, you haven't 

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00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:37,080
actually changed in your heart. 
Now, in terms of your actions, 

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00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:43,840
you know, in terms of my actions
in this case, you know, I'll be 

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00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:47,640
holding the offense in my heart,
but you know, towards my life, 

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00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:52,160
I'm not going to express it 
right, because that's what I've 

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00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:54,000
been taught. 
But this is the offense this 

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00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:56,480
day. 
But because I've been taught 

340
00:26:56,480 --> 00:27:00,280
that I shouldn't, you know, 
you'll find in terms of my 

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00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:04,560
physical actions, you know, 
maybe in that moment I'm like, 

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00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:08,240
OK, no, you know, I understand, 
you know, whatever, whatever, 

343
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:11,000
whatever, whatever to my wife. 
And it's like, no, you know, 

344
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:14,320
this piece in the house, but in 
my heart I'm actually burning 

345
00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:17,240
with offence. 
That is exactly what Jesus 

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00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:23,080
Christ was talking about in 
Matthew 6, is that, you see, the

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00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:25,200
law can't set you free. 
Yeah. 

348
00:27:25,480 --> 00:27:31,120
Don't think because you are not 
expressing what is in your heart

349
00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:36,840
physically that you are better. 
Sure, you know that we are 

350
00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:40,920
actually all the same. 
Yeah, true freedom comes, as 

351
00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:44,080
we'll see in the next episode. 
True freedom comes from the 

352
00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:49,840
grace of God, where you are not 
not doing something because 

353
00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:54,400
you've been taught not to. 
No, but it's that you don't even

354
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:57,280
have the desire in your hearts 
in the 1st place. 

355
00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:01,640
That is true freedom. 
Right now, it may seem like 

356
00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:04,120
we've deviated from backsliding,
but you know what? 

357
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:09,480
This is exactly what, what, what
the whole thing of backsliding 

358
00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:12,120
looks like. 
You know, instead, it is always 

359
00:28:12,120 --> 00:28:17,040
based on actions, right? 
And, and, and rightfully so, 

360
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:20,960
because we see in the Old 
Testament, but the truth is that

361
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:25,240
we are not under the law. 
And so we read Romans 3 and 

362
00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:30,320
verse 20 where the Bible clearly
says no one will be declared 

363
00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:34,600
righteous in court's side by the
works of the law, right. 

364
00:28:35,120 --> 00:28:38,440
Rather, through the law, we 
become conscious of our sins. 

365
00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:43,320
In other words, if if you think 
that it, you know everything 

366
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,160
your relationship with God, you 
know, in order to not backlight,

367
00:28:46,280 --> 00:28:49,280
I need to be doing this, I need 
to do it's a law mentality. 

368
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:56,120
And by such a perspective, you 
can never actually that the law 

369
00:28:56,120 --> 00:29:04,880
in fact exposes it. 
It exposes sin that is in your 

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00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:08,160
heart, and that's where we're 
going to leave this episode. 

371
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Yes, we will see you for quite 
tuning the next one.