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Hi, and welcome to the Stop to 
Think podcast with me, Pete 

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Cohen and my coach, and my great
friend and mentor, Doctor Ray 

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Sylvester. 
Now, if you've been following 

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this series, you'll know that 
after sharing a number of brand 

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new conversations that we've had
in 2026, we're now taking you 

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back to a series of 
conversations Ray and I recorded

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three years ago in 2023. 
And at that time, I had no idea 

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that these discussions would 
become the foundation of what 

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Stop to Think is today. 
Now, looking back, it's 

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fascinating to hear ideas that 
were only just beginning to 

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emerge. 
Many of the principles we now 

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teach and live by were born in 
these conversations. 

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And in our last episode, we 
explored the difference between 

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our front stage and our 
backstage. 

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We asked the question, who are 
you when nobody's watching? 

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Now, in this episode, we take 
the conversation one step 

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further. 
It's it's one thing to 

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understand your backstage, what 
goes on behind the scenes. 

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It's another to intentionally 
design it. 

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Because look, every day, whether
we realize it or not, we're 

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creating the environment that 
shapes our thoughts, our habits,

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our emotions, and ultimately, 
our lives. 

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The spaces we live in, the 
routines we follow, the people 

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we surround ourselves with, and 
even the conversations we have 

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with ourselves all become part 
of our backstage. 

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As you listen today, I encourage
you to reflect on three 

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questions. 
What does my backstage currently

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look like? 
Is it helping me become the 

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person I want to be? 
And if you could redesign it, 

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where would you begin? 
This isn't simply a conversation

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about creating about home or 
better habits. 

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It's deeper than that. 
It's about intentionally 

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creating the conditions that 
allow you to thrive. 

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Because when you invest in the 
person you are when no one else 

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is watching, everything else 
begins to change. 

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So thank you for joining us on 
this journey back in time. 

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This is episode 15 of the Stop 
to Think podcast called 

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Designing Your Backstage. 
I'll see you with Doctor Ray 

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after. 
This the greater things that are

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stuck in somebody 
We're live. 

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So good morning to you Ray. 
Thank you so much for being with

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me once again today. 
Good morning, Peter. 

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How are you? 
Peter Well, that's not, that's 

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not something I hear that often,
but I suppose that is my name. 

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So that's what my mum calls me. 
And and a few. 

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Other people but. 
That is my name, you know, my 

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passport, my birth. 
Certificate it says Peter. 

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What about yours? 
Does it say Ray or Raymond or 

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Raymond though? 
I walked straight into that, 

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didn't I? 
Yeah, I'm Raymond. 

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Raymond Well, I'll just. 
Call you Ray, Doctor Ray, and I 

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really wanted to talk to you, 
Ray. 

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In the last podcast, we talked 
about backstage front stage and 

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it was a beautiful podcast. 
If you guys get a chance to 

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listen to that prior to this, 
please do. 

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Ray, you said you. 
Really enjoyed that podcast and 

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I listened to it back myself. 
I listened to it. 

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While I was driving to London. 
So the first thing, just to put 

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my academic hat on, most of my 
inspiration comes from a guy 

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called Irving Goffman who wrote 
a book and the focus of his book

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was on what he called the 
dramatological narrative of 

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life. 
So he basically says, Pete, 

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right now you and I are 
performing and those people 

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listening, maybe listening 
privately could be backstage or 

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they could be on a front. 
And what I like about fronts, 

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and I'll extend it a little bit 
more, is that we all perform in 

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the front stage. 
I call it front stage. 

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He originally called it fronts. 
My connections in music 

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industry. 
I like front stage backstage 

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because I've seen it practically
when people are prepping to go 

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on stage, what people do behind 
stage before they go on stage. 

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But there are there are three 
key things he talks about in 

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this book, presentations, our 
everyday life. 

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If anyone wants to look the book
up, it's still available and it 

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was published in the late 50s. 
So it shows you the how relevant

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some things are. 
But he talks about setting and 

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he talks about the furniture or 
the setting. 

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So basically we perform in 
particular settings. 

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And this is really interesting, 
Pete, because I'd like you to 

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share this. 
Just work this through then over

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our 2% today. 
What settings have you set up 

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for yourself when you wake up in
the morning? 

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Well, you know, the thing about 
what's going on behind the 

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scenes, I just, it's one of the 
most fascinating conversations 

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you can ever have. 
And the experience that you and 

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I have had working together has 
made me even more aware of my 

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own narrative. 
Because to me, that's what backs

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part of backstage is it's what 
you're saying to yourself. 

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And as someone who's worked in 
the world of coaching and 

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working with world class 
athletes like, you know, Ronnie 

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O'Sullivan, seven time snooker 
world champion, has been staying

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with me. 
He's just gone off her to to 

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China. 
When you work with someone, when

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they're performing, you've got 
to know what's going on 

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backstage. 
You got to know. 

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Because if if you don't know, I 
think that affects everything. 

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It affects performance. 
So this doesn't answer your 

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question directly, but I think 
it's one of the most fascinating

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things we will ever do. 
Become aware of what's going on 

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backstage and how that's 
affecting up front stage, how 

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that affects how we move through
the world. 

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For me, right when I wake up 
every day, I've become pretty 

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aware of my narrative quite 
quickly. 

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What I'm saying to myself, 
what's going on behind the 

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scenes. 
And I know that if I don't start

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my day off with intention, 
specific intention, that and put

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myself in a place where I'm 
ready for anything or ready for 

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what's coming after. 
I've been very intentional about

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a few things, which I tend to do
every day, which is a little bit

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of learning, definitely 
exercising, cold shower, a bit 

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of meditation. 
And then I'm just, I feel that 

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my backstage is more in 
alignment with my purpose of 

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what I want to do, which is 
serve. 

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What about you? 
So the the reason I asked the 

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question is that Doffman first 
observed that our front is 

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shaped with things like setting 
our appearance and our manner. 

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And we spoke in our last podcast
about creating a balance between

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that front stage and the 
backstage. 

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And what you've just done there 
by default is that you've 

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deliberately, intentionally 
created settings in your 

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backstage. 
So what I wanted to get across 

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today to people is that settings
aren't just for the performance 

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outward in a social context, but
backstage when you are what you 

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are, when no one's looking at 
you, if you're intentional, when

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no one's looking at you. 
So for you to do Wim Hof and the

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cold showers and other 
processes, you've got a, a gym 

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outside in a garden or a yard 
for American listeners. 

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That's intentional. 
And what I think, Pete, we 

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should focus on as we, we look 
at this 2% is that many people 

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are spending their time working 
in settings that they don't 

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control. 
And they come and they try to 

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appear like they fit in and they
try to put a manner on and a 

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personality on that is one 
that's yearning to be accepted. 

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And when the last podcast we 
talked about how exhausting that

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is, is if you're backstage is 
just built to prepare for that 

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performance all the time. 
So it's literally like a musical

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performance. 
You're backstage, you've got 

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your costume on, you've done 
your your sound check, your 

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line, check and boom, you're out
there and you're doing the 

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lights are on. 
And what I'm saying in life, if 

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you do that, it's exhausting. 
There is also a performance to 

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self. 
So when you do Wim Hof in a cold

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shout, I'm pretty sure that the 
region, the area you live in, 

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you're not doing that as a a 
David Blaine stunt in a 

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translucent box, suspending it 
on a crate so everyone can see 

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it. 
You're making an investment in 

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you when no one is seeing that. 
So I suppose my question today, 

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Pete, because you've answered it
by default, which is awesome, is

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that you have on some level 
become very intentional about 

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creating settings and 
environments and making sure 

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that you equip yourself so you 
can appear and have the right 

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manner. 
And as we talk about this, we've

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recently had the last month or 
so talked about how difficult it

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has been as you've adjusted 
coming back to your home after 

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Hannah has passed. 
And we've talked to lots of 

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about strategy. 
One of them I suggest to you 

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was, you know, make the space 
your own. 

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And that's not, it's not 
disenfranchising anything of the

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wonderful memory you've had with
Hannah. 

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But now you've got to create a 
setting and you need to have an 

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appearance in that setting 
that's comfortable. 

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And it was clear that you were 
uncomfortable initially. 

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But you said to me yesterday, 
you know, I'm making great 

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strides, right? 
I'm really the home feels more 

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like me. 
I've done some stuff and then 

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you sent me a link of a, a crane
operation, which I thought 

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fantastic. 
I wondered if you could just 

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share. 
So it's helpful to people to go,

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wow, he's actually creating the 
right setting for him personally

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to edify him, to give him the 
balance when no one's looking. 

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What have you been doing? 
Our first thing is what we would

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love you to do is become aware 
of your own backstage narrative,

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not to judge, not blame, not 
shame, not criticize, just 

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become aware. 
It is what it is. 

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How's that working out for you? 
And you know what you just said 

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there about where I am right now
and creating the space. 

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I think it was Serena Williams. 
I heard her say discipline 

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equals freedom. 
And I, I, I never used to like 

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that word discipline because it 
remind me of being at school. 

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But I know myself well enough 
that if I don't intentionally 

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put myself into a space where 
I'm focused, I can just be all 

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over the place. 
And what's really interesting is

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that, you know, with my wife 
passing away, that created a 

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space that I obviously didn't 
want that to happen. 

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I really, of course, I didn't 
want it to happen. 

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But it's it's almost made me 
appreciate even more the 

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importance of being my own best 
friend. 

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As we've spoken about, you know,
you, you've mentioned on an 

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Instagram post that you saw when
I'm talking about us being at 

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war with ourselves, and I agree 
with you. 

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I, I used to say that a lot. 
And I think it's, it's great to 

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have a narrative where you 
become your own best friend. 

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You become curious. 
And I do feel so much better 

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because right now time is a 
definitely is a great healer, 

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but I am a product of my 
environment. 

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This environment that I live in 
was a house that my wife and I 

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moved in together. 
I let her take care of a lot of 

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the environment because I knew 
how important it was to her. 

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And now I've started to change 
it around and it feels like this

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is my house, that this is where 
I live. 

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This is where I, I, it's even 
hard to be even don't even know 

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what the word is, but I can come
back to that. 

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And you asked me about the 
table. 

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I don't hear if anyone's ever 
bought anything and done it 

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impulsively, right? 
What's the most impulsive thing 

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you've ever bought? 
Right? 

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For me, it was a table I bought 
in Guilin in China in 1999. 

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I lived on a boat at the time. 
If it had been put on the boat, 

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the boat would have sunk. 
So it was actually in Sally 

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Gunnell, former Olympic 
champion. 

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World record holder. 
Within her barn for 20 years and

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I finally got it to my house 
because she moved out. 

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My wife didn't like it and the 
house because it's so big. 

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We had to get a circus removal 
company to move. 

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It in we then. 
Moved into a new house and had 

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to keep outside and we've had 
some real interesting stories to

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tell of having to move it around
outside. 

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But now I finally have got it 
moved into the house, it was 

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very difficult to get it. 
In we had to get a crane. 

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And but wow, does it feel 
amazing, like this is my space. 

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And you know, as much as that 
space is important is only 

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because it nourishes my internal
space. 

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So I feel like I'm at home. 
And I wonder, you know what, 

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what your thoughts on that, Ray?
In fact, what's the most 

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impulsive? 
Thing you've ever. 

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Bought and what's your take on 
managing your backstage and 

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having the environment that 
supports that? 

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So the narrative we're talking 
about here is about 

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intentionality. 
So intentionally setting out to 

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create a setting that no one 
sees, but is about, as you 

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talked about discipline and, 
and, and if you look at the root

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word of discipline is a Latin 
word dupulous, and it means 

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student. 
And if you're involved in being 

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disciplined outwardly so people 
can see it, you're basically a 

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student to the setting. 
You're creating an appearance 

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for the environment of others 
and you're creating a manner for

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other people. 
What we're talking about here is

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what you do internally. 
So, you know, the spontaneous 

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consumption of a, a large table 
or something. 

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If it's turned out to be the 
place that you've written all 

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your best selling books on or 
whatever, then you can see that 

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it can link directly to that 
setting. 

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But actually what I saw you do 
when you sent me those those 

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pictures is you were creating a 
setting at home that that is 

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part of your history. 
It's part of your relationship 

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with your coach, it's part of 
your relationship with Hannah. 

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And you wanted to give it, you 
wanted to honour it in a space 

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not for anyone else, but because
it was for you. 

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So that's part of your internal 
settings. 

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So lots of things have symbolic 
articulation. 

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That table in of itself, it's 
weight, it's size isn't really 

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why it's in your home. 
P It's in your home because it 

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represents something about you 
and your history. 

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And that's so important because 
what you're sharing with me is 

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it's made you feel comfortable. 
Now here's the beautiful thing 

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is that table has got and 99.9% 
of people could come in your 

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home and say, don't like that 
table. 

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It doesn't matter because it's 
the what we're talking about 

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here is your internal backstage 
setting, creating your own 

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environment that works for you. 
That's different from the front 

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stage setting, which is 
deliberately designed to be 

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socially orientated. 
And what we're talking about is 

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a balance between the two and an
internal setting. 

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So you know, you what you talked
on tables. 

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What came straight to mind, so I
have to be authentic is nearly 

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eight years ago coming to 
America. 

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I thought, right, I'm going to 
buy a desk. 

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We had an office space and I buy
all this nice furniture and I 

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was writing up research thesis 
at the time. 

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I said, yeah, I'll get this 
table, It'll be wonderful. 

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Pete, do you know I didn't spend
any time around that table? 

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The setting for me to find the 
rhythm was a round kitchen table

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in an eating area. 
In fact, when you've come over, 

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we've sat around a table, but 
it's not that table. 

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We were given a table 
benevolently by some wonderful 

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people. 
We we got to know and I sat 

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around that not round the flash 
office table and what I've 

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worked out is sometimes, and 
some of you may smile, we create

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these settings for that. 
Now I also grew up in an era, 

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and you may not be familiar with
this, some listeners may, but I 

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grew up in a house where we had 
the best room and the best 

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cutlery and the blessed 
glassware. 

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00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:15,480
This is interesting. 
You have a home and your setting

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is to build something up where 
you live. 

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00:17:18,839 --> 00:17:21,720
But then you have a best room 
you don't use and guess what 

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00:17:21,720 --> 00:17:23,800
that's for? 
It's for the front stage when 

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00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:25,680
you have guests coming round. 
Yeah. 

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00:17:26,359 --> 00:17:28,600
And I never understood that. 
I never understood it. 

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00:17:28,600 --> 00:17:31,240
Why have we got why have we got 
this wonderful weird, this 

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00:17:31,240 --> 00:17:33,600
beautiful rooms? 
Why don't we ever hardly use it?

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00:17:35,400 --> 00:17:39,360
Because it. 
Was it's, it's like people that 

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00:17:39,360 --> 00:17:43,280
put covers over their best 
furniture and then they would 

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00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:44,600
actually even take the cover 
off. 

294
00:17:45,120 --> 00:17:49,640
You know, this, this whole 
experience of being a human 

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00:17:49,640 --> 00:17:53,200
being is something that you and 
I are very intentionally looking

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00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:56,760
at and sharing our journeys with
other people. 

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00:17:56,760 --> 00:18:00,000
And you know, it's that 
encouraging of you wherever you 

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00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:03,000
are in the world to come on that
journey with us. 

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00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:06,920
It's not always the easiest of 
journeys, but I think it's the 

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00:18:06,920 --> 00:18:10,640
most beautiful because what we 
all then have the opportunity is

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00:18:10,640 --> 00:18:12,440
to feel more comfortable at 
home. 

302
00:18:13,360 --> 00:18:17,680
And I'm never and I, and I never
forget saying this to my coach 

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00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:21,040
Raphael when he was alive, I 
said to him once I can't wait to

304
00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:22,720
go home and he goes, where's 
home? 

305
00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:26,880
And then I told him, but I said,
but you know where that is, 

306
00:18:26,880 --> 00:18:28,080
You've been there. 
He goes, no, that's where you 

307
00:18:28,080 --> 00:18:29,080
live. 
That's not your home. 

308
00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:33,000
Your home is within you. 
You're always at home and 

309
00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:36,680
learning to feel at home 
wherever you are in the world, 

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00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:40,280
whatever is around you. 
I suppose is, is that not maybe 

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00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:44,280
one of the greatest things I 
will ever do is learning to be 

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00:18:44,280 --> 00:18:48,880
at peace with myself, to love 
myself, to accept myself. 

313
00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:52,360
And my environment most 
definitely supports that. 

314
00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:56,320
You know, my environment in 
which I live, but also the 

315
00:18:56,320 --> 00:19:00,440
people I spend my time with. 
So, you know, my life has hugely

316
00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:04,320
evolved because of the quality 
of the people I put in my 

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00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:06,680
environment that actually 
support my backstage. 

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00:19:06,880 --> 00:19:10,080
You support my backstage. 
I support your backstage. 

319
00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:14,040
I don't know all that goes on 
behind your backstage, but I 

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00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:17,680
know a fair bit from just 
talking to you. 

321
00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:24,000
And I know the impact that your 
faith has on how you manage, you

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00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:26,200
know, that relationship with 
yourself. 

323
00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:31,040
And I'm curious, I'm curious in 
terms of the relationships we 

324
00:19:31,040 --> 00:19:34,240
have with ourselves, why is that
so fraught? 

325
00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:37,280
Why is that so challenged? 
I know we've discussed this 

326
00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:40,320
before, but I'd just be curious 
as to, you know, what's on your 

327
00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:46,040
heart around what I'm saying. 
Well, I I do believe, as I said,

328
00:19:46,040 --> 00:19:49,320
that I love Goffman. 
And before that, William 

329
00:19:49,320 --> 00:19:53,600
Shakespeare talks about the 
world's a stage and we all have 

330
00:19:53,600 --> 00:19:56,720
roles, we have entrances and we 
have XS. 

331
00:19:57,240 --> 00:20:02,120
And that's true in terms very 
acutely true when we think about

332
00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:05,720
our social self. 
But I think what I've come to 

333
00:20:06,120 --> 00:20:12,640
think about and and really 
reflect on is that you are what 

334
00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:17,560
you are when no one's looking. 
And for you, I'd be mindful that

335
00:20:17,560 --> 00:20:21,480
going back to your home. 
There's not anyone looking, but 

336
00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:25,120
you spend a lot of your time in 
public and social environments. 

337
00:20:25,320 --> 00:20:31,000
You ran a an event last weekend.
So for me, it's been very much 

338
00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:32,560
and we've not explicitly said 
this. 

339
00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:36,240
I've just tried to encourage you
this ways to make the home and 

340
00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:40,280
yourself comfortable with that 
and the word discipline. 

341
00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:45,040
As I said, you can break it 
down, disciple and and disciple,

342
00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:47,920
what are we a disciple to? 
And obviously many people think 

343
00:20:47,920 --> 00:20:50,840
about that in a religious 
context, Jesus and his 

344
00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:54,400
disciples, but we are basically 
end up becoming disciples to the

345
00:20:54,400 --> 00:20:58,280
world at the front stage. 
We are just trying to be 

346
00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:00,240
accepted. 
We're the student and we're 

347
00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:02,800
dealing with the master. 
The master is the front stage in

348
00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:06,080
the audience and everyone else. 
And that's exhausting playing to

349
00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:08,360
that. 
But what about being student to 

350
00:21:08,360 --> 00:21:11,440
yourself? 
You are serving self and that's 

351
00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:14,280
the backstage. 
What's right for Pete Cohen, 

352
00:21:14,280 --> 00:21:17,400
What's right for race or Vesta, 
what's right for other people? 

353
00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:21,320
And then what you should do is 
createspace. 

354
00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:26,120
Now for all of us, journal 
keeping is another intentional 

355
00:21:26,360 --> 00:21:29,400
environment where you create a 
setting to sit, to reflect, to 

356
00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:37,160
write, meditation, prayer, I've 
just mentioned exercise, you 

357
00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:41,240
know, preparation of food. 
All of these things are things 

358
00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:43,680
that I know Pete, you're 
incredibly passionate about. 

359
00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:47,400
But what I'm suggesting, we 
frame it for people to stop, 

360
00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:51,880
there must be an investment in 
their setting. 

361
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:56,160
So creating environments and 
routines that work, there must 

362
00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:59,160
be something in their 
appearance. 

363
00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:01,480
Are they ready for whatever 
they're supposed to be doing? 

364
00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:04,560
So if you're supposed to go for 
a walk and Are you ready to do 

365
00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:07,480
that? 
And then manner, are they 

366
00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:10,760
motivated? 
Are they ready to do what they 

367
00:22:10,760 --> 00:22:13,840
need to do? 
And if someone's doing that, 

368
00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:15,640
guess what they're doing? 
They're creating a balance 

369
00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:18,200
between their backstage and 
their front stage and they're 

370
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:22,400
not spending their backstage 
preparing for their front stage.

371
00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:25,040
We are more than just our social
settings. 

372
00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:29,760
We we, we need to love others as
we love ourselves is a very, 

373
00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:34,160
very well known biblical term. 
But that has some massive truth 

374
00:22:34,160 --> 00:22:37,880
in it because if you inversely 
flip that you can't love anyone 

375
00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:39,320
else more than you love 
yourself. 

376
00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:43,720
So, you know, committed to 
having to do that. 

377
00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:48,960
There's a there's a film with 
Will Ferrell, I just can't 

378
00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:53,840
remember the name of it, where 
he hears a narrative in his head

379
00:22:54,360 --> 00:22:58,600
and it's Emma Thompson who's 
telling the story of of him. 

380
00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:03,400
It didn't do particularly well, 
but it was a beautiful film 

381
00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:08,600
because definitely made me think
even more about my my narrative.

382
00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:13,320
And, you know, for years I 
didn't even know I had one. 

383
00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:16,440
And then when I did, I just 
thought, well, that's just me. 

384
00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:20,400
You know, to be able to stop, 
which is a key part of what we 

385
00:23:20,400 --> 00:23:25,400
do and what we're encouraging 
you to do, to stop, step back 

386
00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:28,880
and observe. 
And you know then? 

387
00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:31,800
You know the the. 
Thing that separates us from 

388
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:36,240
pretty much everything else is 
OK, well, we have a choice here.

389
00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:38,280
What's the choice we're going to
make? 

390
00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:42,720
And I think what you do so well.
Is again. 

391
00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:46,720
Shine that light on look, you 
can exercise and meditate and do

392
00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:50,920
all of these things because it's
a tick box exercise because you 

393
00:23:50,920 --> 00:23:54,560
think you should as opposed to 
no, I'm doing this because I 

394
00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:59,600
want to manage myself better. 
I want to my backstage to be 

395
00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:02,920
better because I know my I know 
ultimately my backstage of 

396
00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:07,160
friend effects my front stage. 
And you know, this morning I did

397
00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:10,200
a coaching session with a very 
well known. 

398
00:24:11,360 --> 00:24:16,880
Artist who's in a band, young 
guy, world famous, and we were 

399
00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:19,360
talking about this backstage 
front stage, and obviously he 

400
00:24:19,360 --> 00:24:21,600
could relate to that because 
he's an artist. 

401
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:26,040
He performs on stage and has 
done to thousands of people and 

402
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:29,200
he knows he's performing and he 
knows that what goes on behind 

403
00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:31,000
here effects what goes on out 
there. 

404
00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:35,000
And I suppose what we're also 
asking you to do is you might 

405
00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:37,440
not be an artist like in a band,
or you might not be a 

406
00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:41,600
professional athlete, but we're 
all going out every day and 

407
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:45,440
we're performing. 
And we have spoken about this 

408
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:47,600
before. 
But hopefully when you hear some

409
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:50,040
of these messages, or maybe this
is the first podcast that you're

410
00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:54,720
listening to, what Ray and I 
talk about, and Ray does this a 

411
00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:56,160
lot. 
And his work is about knowing 

412
00:24:56,160 --> 00:25:01,360
who you are at your core and 
knowing what your, your true 

413
00:25:01,360 --> 00:25:03,120
value is. 
What is it that you can bring? 

414
00:25:03,120 --> 00:25:04,440
What is it you do bring to the 
world? 

415
00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:06,360
What do you want to bring more 
to the world? 

416
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:10,320
And we have to stop. 
And I, I have to connect to that

417
00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:12,880
every day, Ray, I, I would say 
to someone else today, I, every 

418
00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:15,880
day I have to connect to that 
because if I don't, I know I can

419
00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:18,680
give in to temptation. 
I know I can get distracted. 

420
00:25:19,480 --> 00:25:24,480
What would you like our 
listeners to to go away and do? 

421
00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:29,800
I think really it is making an 
investment in the same way as 

422
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:33,360
you do for performing to go to 
work, to interact. 

423
00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:36,840
So your your personal life 
experiences with others. 

424
00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:41,520
You need to balance that with a 
personal and intentional life 

425
00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:43,960
with self. 
So I'll say that once more. 

426
00:25:43,960 --> 00:25:48,000
What you need to do is have a 
balance so that you are not 

427
00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:55,880
spending your life in a personal
pursuit of experiences with 

428
00:25:55,880 --> 00:26:01,520
others, but you balance that 
with an investment in time in 

429
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:04,800
yourself. 
And if you get that balance, it 

430
00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:08,600
creates equilibrium, 
homeostasis, whatever you want 

431
00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:12,240
to call it. 
It really does provide fruits. 

432
00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:15,800
But then you have to be a 
student and a servant to self 

433
00:26:16,600 --> 00:26:20,800
and what's best for self? 
I, I loved what you said there. 

434
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:22,560
I didn't know that word. 
Discipline. 

435
00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:25,320
I, I, I, I disciple. 
I knew that. 

436
00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:29,120
But as a, as a, as a, as a 
student, you know, to study 

437
00:26:29,120 --> 00:26:31,560
yourself. 
I think it's just what I would 

438
00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:37,080
encourage everyone to do and 
enjoy it, enjoy that exploration

439
00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:39,280
because it's very easy to go, 
Oh, this is terrible. 

440
00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:42,920
It is what it is, right? 
But we're all in a place where 

441
00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:45,960
we can do something with where 
we are. 

442
00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:51,160
We love spending these times 
Pete, and we've said we're just 

443
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:54,400
having conversation with two 
friends across the pond and 

444
00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:57,000
anyone that wants to join in, 
anyone that enjoys the 

445
00:26:57,000 --> 00:27:00,960
conversation, then please just 
connect with us and we enjoy it.

446
00:27:01,360 --> 00:27:04,160
Thank you. 
My pleasure. 

447
00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:06,400
Have a great day guys. 
We'll see you soon. 

448
00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:10,640
And that brings us to the end of
today's episode. 

449
00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:13,480
Thank you for listening. 
We hope this conversation has 

450
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,400
given you something to think 
about, reflect on, and perhaps 

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even act on. 
Remember, the real work happens 

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away from the spotlight, in 
those quiet moments when you 

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choose who you are becoming. 
If this episode has resonated 

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with you, then take a moment to 
share it with someone who might 

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benefit from it. 
And always, we'd love to hear 

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your thoughts. 
Until next time, keep stopping, 

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keep thinking, and keep 
designing a life that truly 

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works for you. 
Thanks for listening.