1 00:00:02,040 --> 00:00:04,040 Welcome back to the Stop to Think podcast. 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:07,520 Before you begin today's episode, I'd just really like to 3 00:00:07,520 --> 00:00:10,160 set the scene. If this is your first time 4 00:00:10,160 --> 00:00:12,640 listening then firstly I want to thank you. 5 00:00:13,040 --> 00:00:16,360 But whilst every episode can absolutely be enjoyed on its 6 00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:22,440 own, this podcast is a real journey and in an ideal world, 7 00:00:22,520 --> 00:00:25,960 I'd encourage you to start at the very beginning and walk 8 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:30,920 alongside Doctor Ray and me as these conversations unfold. 9 00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:33,760 The reason I say this is because many of the episodes you're 10 00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:36,520 hearing now were actually recorded over three years ago, 11 00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:39,840 just a few weeks after my wife Hannah passed away. 12 00:00:40,160 --> 00:00:43,680 And at the time, neither of us knew where these conversations 13 00:00:43,680 --> 00:00:46,320 would go. We weren't creating a podcast 14 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:48,360 series, we were simply stopping to think. 15 00:00:48,880 --> 00:00:52,280 And looking back now, I can see these conversations became the 16 00:00:52,280 --> 00:00:55,320 foundations of everything. That Stop to Think has grown 17 00:00:55,320 --> 00:00:59,560 into the last few episodes have explored the difference between 18 00:00:59,560 --> 00:01:03,080 our front stage, the person we present to the world, and our 19 00:01:03,080 --> 00:01:06,680 backstage, the private conversations we have with 20 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:09,680 ourselves. Today's conversations build on 21 00:01:09,680 --> 00:01:12,320 that in what I believe to be one of the most important 22 00:01:12,320 --> 00:01:16,360 discussions we will ever have. Because stopping really isn't 23 00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:19,080 the destination. It's just the beginning. 24 00:01:19,800 --> 00:01:22,880 It's the beginning of seeing yourself with a fresh pair of 25 00:01:22,880 --> 00:01:26,640 eyes, of becoming curious instead of judgmental, of 26 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:31,040 discovering not only what's in the way, but perhaps more 27 00:01:31,040 --> 00:01:36,160 importantly, what is your way. None of us can become someone 28 00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:38,320 else. None of us can simply follow 29 00:01:38,320 --> 00:01:42,400 another person's blueprint. This is an invitation to slow 30 00:01:42,400 --> 00:01:46,080 down long enough to discover who you are, what matters to you, 31 00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:50,440 and how you want to live. This journey isn't always 32 00:01:50,440 --> 00:01:52,840 comfortable. In fact, it can be one of the 33 00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:55,400 most challenging journeys you will ever take. 34 00:01:55,720 --> 00:01:58,880 But I also believe it's one of the most rewarding. 35 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:02,360 So wherever you're listening today, I simply invite you to 36 00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:07,000 pause for a moment, take a breath and listen. 37 00:02:07,640 --> 00:02:11,720 And ask yourself, what might I discover about myself if I stop 38 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:16,000 long enough to really listen? I hope you enjoyed this 39 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:20,000 conversation that was recorded three years ago and I'll see 40 00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:23,320 you. With Doctor Ray after this. 41 00:02:24,480 --> 00:02:26,600 The greater things that are stuck in somebody. 42 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:49,920 Happy mindful intentions. Good morning to you, Ray. 43 00:02:50,000 --> 00:02:52,640 How are you? Good morning, Pete. 44 00:02:53,320 --> 00:02:55,560 Great to be here again. How are you? 45 00:02:56,720 --> 00:02:57,960 Yeah. I am. 46 00:02:58,480 --> 00:03:05,160 I'm in a very good place space, a very good a very good place at 47 00:03:05,160 --> 00:03:09,640 the moment where things are are are changing. 48 00:03:09,720 --> 00:03:13,440 They're definitely changing. And I've really enjoyed these 49 00:03:13,440 --> 00:03:16,600 conversations that we've had. I think the more you and I talk, 50 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:21,560 the more kind of we get to the heart of some topics that people 51 00:03:21,560 --> 00:03:25,080 are finding really interesting. The last few podcasts have been 52 00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:28,200 about front stage and backstage and kind of what's going on 53 00:03:28,200 --> 00:03:34,240 behind the scenes and that kind of stopping to enquire about the 54 00:03:34,240 --> 00:03:37,680 experience of being ourselves. I think it's a very challenging 55 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:40,400 thing to do for for lots of reasons, but I think it's one of 56 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:41,920 the most incredible things to do. 57 00:03:42,080 --> 00:03:44,480 I think people are are interested in the fact that 58 00:03:44,480 --> 00:03:47,760 there are two forms of communication going on. 59 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:52,120 One that we we can have with ourselves, the backstage and one 60 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:54,920 we have with the world. And if our conversation with the 61 00:03:54,920 --> 00:03:59,200 world dominates and if our backstage is just time prepping 62 00:03:59,200 --> 00:04:04,480 for our social interaction, then we can end up with imbalance. 63 00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:06,520 And imbalance has all sorts of things. 64 00:04:06,520 --> 00:04:10,840 And good example is just people pleasing and not being your 65 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:13,840 authentic self. So I'm excited by that feedback 66 00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:16,560 because it means that people are connecting with the fact that 67 00:04:18,480 --> 00:04:22,480 being busy, being busy. It could be said, Pete, when 68 00:04:22,480 --> 00:04:24,800 you've said that in the past that you spent a lot of time 69 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:28,600 front staging and becoming really good at performance, 70 00:04:29,160 --> 00:04:31,080 cowardly. And what we're saying is that 71 00:04:31,080 --> 00:04:36,040 there's time to perform inwardly because it's therapeutic, it's 72 00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:38,520 good for you, and it brings about balance. 73 00:04:39,640 --> 00:04:41,520 But. When, when you, when you discuss 74 00:04:41,520 --> 00:04:44,320 that and you talk about it again, I, I just start thinking 75 00:04:44,320 --> 00:04:46,120 about what's going on backstage for me. 76 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:51,080 And I was thinking, is it like this for a lot of people where 77 00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:54,640 you're not really listening to what's going on And it's like, 78 00:04:54,640 --> 00:04:56,440 it's almost like someone's talking to you, but you're not 79 00:04:56,440 --> 00:04:57,920 listening. You're listening to something. 80 00:04:57,920 --> 00:05:00,360 Else. And you're being guided by that. 81 00:05:00,840 --> 00:05:04,880 And, you know, does that create some discourse within people? 82 00:05:04,960 --> 00:05:06,920 From my experience, most definitely, yes. 83 00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:09,720 But of course, you know, I don't know everybody. 84 00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:12,800 And then the other thing I was thinking, raise if you could 85 00:05:13,000 --> 00:05:17,240 hear what goes on inside people's minds today based on 86 00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:20,440 what was going on inside people's minds 20304050, a 87 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:22,680 hundred years ago, what's different? 88 00:05:22,680 --> 00:05:26,920 Is there more noise going on inside people's minds? 89 00:05:27,400 --> 00:05:28,720 I would imagine, again, I don't know. 90 00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:31,680 I don't know whether we can prove it, but there's more going 91 00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:35,920 on because there is more going on externally in our worlds 92 00:05:35,920 --> 00:05:39,920 right now that often we get engaged with to the point where 93 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:42,840 we're not really aware of the narrative. 94 00:05:42,840 --> 00:05:46,360 We're not really aware of how we are moving through the world and 95 00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:48,880 how that is impacting us. I just wondered what your 96 00:05:48,880 --> 00:05:52,920 thoughts are on that before we do a bit of a a deeper dive into 97 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:57,600 stopping. What if we look at the the 98 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:04,160 various ages that society has gone through, the agricultural 99 00:06:04,160 --> 00:06:08,640 age, I suppose in in recent times, the Industrial Revolution 100 00:06:09,160 --> 00:06:14,200 information was driven by our explicit immediate physical 101 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:17,480 environment. So you may be a farmer or an 102 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:21,160 engineer, you may be someone in a coal mine. 103 00:06:21,520 --> 00:06:24,760 Things were very much at arm's length. 104 00:06:24,760 --> 00:06:29,600 You engaged it, so information gathering was really predicated 105 00:06:29,680 --> 00:06:33,800 on your geographical location. What we have today for young 106 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:38,200 people is they have a global infrastructure of information 107 00:06:38,200 --> 00:06:41,360 through digital means. We're digital immigrants, 108 00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:44,440 they're digital natives. So we've spent our time 109 00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:47,200 transitioning. We remember the time when there 110 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:50,640 was just one phone in the house and it was in it was in the the 111 00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:52,840 hallway and you're trying to have a pro conversation. 112 00:06:52,840 --> 00:06:55,960 I want can hear. We remember the phone boxes. 113 00:06:56,080 --> 00:06:57,560 Yep. We remember all of that. 114 00:06:57,560 --> 00:07:00,400 So dialling. Yeah, dialling. 115 00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:04,080 And so my empathy is very much for the way things are. 116 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:08,360 But actually, it's infiltrated all of us in what? 117 00:07:08,640 --> 00:07:09,520 In what? In what? 118 00:07:09,960 --> 00:07:13,440 In what way do you think? I mean, I remember having AZX 81 119 00:07:13,440 --> 00:07:16,280 where the literally and then AZX Spectrum where literally you'd 120 00:07:16,280 --> 00:07:19,640 have to load a game and it could take 30 minutes and sometimes it 121 00:07:19,640 --> 00:07:21,080 would crash and you have to start again. 122 00:07:21,640 --> 00:07:24,160 That you'd almost have to have a degree of patience. 123 00:07:24,640 --> 00:07:28,080 You know your focus, so your focus is all on that. 124 00:07:28,280 --> 00:07:33,280 But now you could be gaming, you know, whatever it might be. 125 00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:36,840 If you look at something like, I don't know, Fortnite came out a 126 00:07:36,840 --> 00:07:40,720 few years ago and turned over a billion dollars very relatively 127 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:43,800 quickly. And they gave the game away for 128 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:46,440 free. But then kids would buy skins, 129 00:07:46,440 --> 00:07:49,520 and if you got to certain levels, the characters would 130 00:07:49,520 --> 00:07:51,200 dance. And the dances came from 131 00:07:51,200 --> 00:07:54,520 contemporary recognized dance moves in the world. 132 00:07:54,640 --> 00:07:58,320 So all of a sudden now there's this convergence of culture and 133 00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:03,920 music and visuals, and then they've probably got something 134 00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:04,920 else going on. The background. 135 00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:08,720 Particularly young people are adverse at dealing with lots of 136 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:12,040 different data sets coming at them all at the same time. 137 00:08:12,400 --> 00:08:16,320 However, that means they have a diminished focus on one thing. 138 00:08:16,920 --> 00:08:20,200 And we're seeing that play out in the way they're they deal 139 00:08:20,200 --> 00:08:22,600 with the world when they're asked to do one thing. 140 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:27,920 So responsibility, I will say, is your ability to respond well. 141 00:08:27,920 --> 00:08:31,400 If you've got lots of data sets to deal with, your ability to to 142 00:08:31,400 --> 00:08:34,919 deal with one of them very clearly and succinctly becomes 143 00:08:34,919 --> 00:08:37,120 more challenge. It's not impossible, but it 144 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:40,480 comes more challenge. So one of the things is I think 145 00:08:40,480 --> 00:08:45,000 in this day and age for all of us with all this information is 146 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:50,200 how do we focus? I know in my experience teaching 147 00:08:50,200 --> 00:08:55,160 and working with young adults at university for many, many years 148 00:08:55,160 --> 00:08:58,080 now, I've often asked them, do they switch their phone off at 149 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:00,720 night? And I can tell you the majority 150 00:09:01,040 --> 00:09:05,480 never switch that phone off. They, they, if they hear it beep 151 00:09:05,480 --> 00:09:09,200 or something happens, the last thing they do, the the last 152 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:12,080 friend they say goodnight to is normally their phone and it's 153 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:15,160 the first thing they see in the day and they're back with it all 154 00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:17,600 through the day. That's a completely different 155 00:09:17,600 --> 00:09:19,760 lived experience from when we were younger. 156 00:09:21,440 --> 00:09:24,200 It's interesting because I just start to think about, well, you 157 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:27,440 know, how we've evolved. So we've definitely evolved to, 158 00:09:28,560 --> 00:09:30,560 to the point where we're able to, to live in this modern 159 00:09:30,560 --> 00:09:33,720 world. Will we evolve to be how perhaps 160 00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:37,560 some computers are working now where they are able to do 161 00:09:37,560 --> 00:09:43,760 multiple things at a time rather than because we're not evolved 162 00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:45,920 to do that. You know, we can multitask 163 00:09:45,920 --> 00:09:51,160 obviously, but we have evolved to focus on one thing very well 164 00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:54,800 and be able to do that. Do you think that there will 165 00:09:54,920 --> 00:09:58,880 become a time in the future where we will be able to do more 166 00:09:58,880 --> 00:10:02,280 than one thing at a time and do both of those things as well as 167 00:10:03,040 --> 00:10:08,840 each other? I mean, stargazing and future 168 00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:13,440 gazing is not something I like to do too much of because I 169 00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:18,280 think AI can create a lot of fear in us. 170 00:10:18,280 --> 00:10:21,760 But humans have a capacity. We have approach the, the, the 171 00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:24,080 modern commuter is based on our brain. 172 00:10:24,160 --> 00:10:28,320 We have a, an active conscious mind, but we have this 173 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:30,680 subconscious mind. And part of what we're talking 174 00:10:30,680 --> 00:10:34,040 about today is that when we're backstage, understand the 175 00:10:34,040 --> 00:10:37,520 relationship between our consciousness, which is a small 176 00:10:37,520 --> 00:10:40,960 part of our brain, but it makes a lot of decisions, but the 177 00:10:40,960 --> 00:10:45,600 decisions are driven by our sensory felt state. 178 00:10:45,800 --> 00:10:50,120 And that's the engine room. So it's a bit like a big oil 179 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:53,120 tanker. It takes a long time to turn or 180 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:55,000 move. But if it does move, it's 181 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:58,000 because the captain of the ship, your conscious mind says, right, 182 00:10:58,000 --> 00:11:02,640 we're changing direction because the engine is only capable of 183 00:11:02,640 --> 00:11:07,000 firing up and moving the ship, it doesn't direct it. 184 00:11:07,280 --> 00:11:13,680 So part of a back is recognising that if we slow down, we can 185 00:11:13,680 --> 00:11:17,760 start to become mindful in an information age where we're 186 00:11:17,760 --> 00:11:22,320 overloaded in the front stage and it gets so much so that we 187 00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:24,400 are, we don't really have any downtime. 188 00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:26,720 So this, this front stage backstage is becoming 189 00:11:26,760 --> 00:11:28,680 indivisible because of information. 190 00:11:29,400 --> 00:11:31,720 We now have to explicitly slow down. 191 00:11:31,720 --> 00:11:33,840 So when you turn your Wi-Fi off at night, you're going to sleep. 192 00:11:33,840 --> 00:11:37,160 You're trying to say to the world, this is Pete's time, this 193 00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:39,800 is my recuperation time, this is my sleep time. 194 00:11:41,200 --> 00:11:43,760 That's healthy because you need that time. 195 00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:49,520 But it's very difficult for a young person who who basically 196 00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:53,360 sees their their phone as an extension of their identity. 197 00:11:55,160 --> 00:11:59,480 You know, I think, I think I like what you said there about, 198 00:11:59,480 --> 00:12:03,000 well, I'm not into this future gazing because I don't know. 199 00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:06,960 And what difference does it matter if I knew anyway rather 200 00:12:06,960 --> 00:12:08,480 than what's actually going on now? 201 00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:14,000 And I think what I see is the lifestyle, the way we are living 202 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:17,800 is definitely resulting in a lot more mental health challenges, a 203 00:12:17,800 --> 00:12:22,200 lot more issues around anxiety and depression and, and suicide. 204 00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:26,600 There's no question about how I think modern living is affecting 205 00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:29,400 people's health, mental and physical health. 206 00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:31,920 And it's like, well, what can we do about it? 207 00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:34,720 And this is obviously one of the things that we talk about, which 208 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:39,080 is just about let's stop and step back and let's, let's 209 00:12:39,080 --> 00:12:42,320 observe what's going on. And before we started recording 210 00:12:42,320 --> 00:12:46,200 today, Ray, you and I were talking about the the power of 211 00:12:46,640 --> 00:12:51,680 of intention, but behaving in ways that perhaps are not 212 00:12:51,680 --> 00:12:54,400 serving you. Can you just elaborate a little 213 00:12:54,400 --> 00:12:57,400 bit on on what we were saying before so our listeners because 214 00:12:57,480 --> 00:13:00,440 can kind of get a sense of where we're coming from with this? 215 00:13:00,640 --> 00:13:04,080 Being being intentional is very nuanced. 216 00:13:04,080 --> 00:13:06,680 So are we talking about being intentional on your front stage? 217 00:13:06,680 --> 00:13:09,600 So that means being intentional in your social settings with 218 00:13:09,600 --> 00:13:12,720 others and then being intentional with yourself. 219 00:13:13,040 --> 00:13:16,680 So I think today we're talking about being intentional in those 220 00:13:16,680 --> 00:13:18,600 two spaces. And then what does intention 221 00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:21,680 mean when you're intentional? Should it always be something 222 00:13:21,680 --> 00:13:24,920 that serves yourself productively and positively or 223 00:13:24,920 --> 00:13:27,440 serves others well? There are lots of habits and 224 00:13:27,440 --> 00:13:33,440 things in the world that have a hedonic dimension. 225 00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:37,840 When you say hedonic, can you just give your interpretation of 226 00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:40,840 what hedonic means to you? Yeah, hedonic. 227 00:13:40,920 --> 00:13:43,640 I mean, we, we are all sense beings. 228 00:13:43,640 --> 00:13:46,080 And then we've talked about the fact that we make sense of the 229 00:13:46,080 --> 00:13:51,240 world through our five senses and our hedonic sensory system 230 00:13:51,240 --> 00:13:56,440 is deriving, I suppose, pleasure from our sensory space, 231 00:13:56,440 --> 00:13:58,600 particularly touch, taste, smell. 232 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:02,720 And we can all you know, if you, if you smell a fragrance that 233 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:06,640 you like, there is a, an element of hedonism going on there. 234 00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:10,400 Because what it does do go back to the the captain of the ship, 235 00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:14,520 the data sensors come in or I can smell something that's your, 236 00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:16,360 but then your subconscious kicks in. 237 00:14:16,680 --> 00:14:21,560 I like your smell because so intention is very complex. 238 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:25,160 So the rally call to be intentional, I think can be be 239 00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:28,160 confusing something because it's like what intentional doing 240 00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:30,440 what? And then we can do cliched 241 00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:33,280 headlines like you got to eat well. 242 00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:36,480 Well, what does that mean? That goes down so many paths. 243 00:14:36,880 --> 00:14:38,680 You, you, you've got to sleep well. 244 00:14:38,800 --> 00:14:42,720 And I think some of the feedback is that, and I would encourage 245 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:47,680 people to feedback is what is it particularly for you that you 246 00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:48,880 want to be more intentional about? 247 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:52,080 Because everyone's unique. And I suppose this discussion 248 00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:58,200 today is about trying to get a balanced perspective so that 249 00:14:58,200 --> 00:15:03,720 people can then take from it and then direct it explicitly to 250 00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:06,760 themselves. Because one size doesn't fit all 251 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:09,880 so. Let's, let's look at that for a 252 00:15:09,880 --> 00:15:13,760 moment, because we, we would love everyone to take a moment 253 00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:16,200 and think, where would you like to be more intentional? 254 00:15:17,680 --> 00:15:20,600 For me, I, I can, one of those is definitely with cooking at 255 00:15:20,600 --> 00:15:23,080 the moment and just eating better. 256 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:29,760 I can be more intentional about that, but again, what we were 257 00:15:29,760 --> 00:15:35,120 talking about before, which is where where are you intentional 258 00:15:35,120 --> 00:15:37,560 of? But you don't want to be, you 259 00:15:37,560 --> 00:15:40,680 know, where is it that you're behaving in a way and and you 260 00:15:40,680 --> 00:15:44,080 know that you're behaving in a way that you kind of wish that 261 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:47,280 you didn't. This is what really interests 262 00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:48,720 me. And this is something, again, we 263 00:15:48,720 --> 00:15:50,760 have spoken about you and I before. 264 00:15:51,520 --> 00:15:53,280 I just love your thoughts on that. 265 00:15:55,640 --> 00:15:59,400 Very delicate space because we then start getting into 266 00:16:02,400 --> 00:16:06,000 prescription and moral and ethical codes. 267 00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:11,320 And I feel it's really important to be sensitive about mine 268 00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:14,480 because, you know, I'm very mindful about it. 269 00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:18,720 That we appreciate who our audience is, where people are, 270 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:22,920 and we already know from some of the people that we know we serve 271 00:16:22,920 --> 00:16:27,600 that they have all different lifestyles and situations. 272 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:30,200 There are people that can't run around the block, for example, 273 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:32,480 with exercise because they might be in a wheelchair. 274 00:16:32,920 --> 00:16:36,240 So then they have to make specific decisions about their 275 00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:39,320 situation. So I'm very cautious about 276 00:16:39,320 --> 00:16:43,600 making A1 size fits all. What I'm saying is I want to 277 00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:47,680 hear from someone who discovers because they've given themselves 278 00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:52,160 more time in their backstage, they discover their mindfulness, 279 00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:55,600 what they choose to do as opposed to me telling them what 280 00:16:55,600 --> 00:16:57,880 that is. And that's very subtle. 281 00:16:57,920 --> 00:17:04,680 And it's arguably different from what the world of, let's say, 282 00:17:04,920 --> 00:17:07,240 dietitians have done. They will prescribe. 283 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:11,319 And then if you go online now, you can watch doctors argue 284 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:15,520 about diet. So for me, that means you gather 285 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:20,560 information, you're mindful, and you just discover yourself 286 00:17:20,560 --> 00:17:24,839 because I think the the geniuses in with all of us to find out 287 00:17:24,839 --> 00:17:27,400 what works for us. Sometimes it's trial and error, 288 00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:31,600 you're failing forward. Sometimes you need good counsel 289 00:17:31,600 --> 00:17:35,120 and people you trust. But I would say even on a 290 00:17:35,120 --> 00:17:38,200 podcast like this, we are not sitting here prescribing an 291 00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:41,000 explicit lifestyle change for you. 292 00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:45,200 We're saying the principle of intentionality is powerful and 293 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:48,120 for most people to become intentional, they need to slow 294 00:17:48,120 --> 00:17:51,000 down and get a perspective and a balance between the backstage 295 00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:54,720 and the front stage. And I believe, and I'm excited 296 00:17:54,720 --> 00:17:56,880 by the prospect that we all take the journey in. 297 00:17:57,200 --> 00:18:01,360 So if someone's listening here and they've been a vegan for a 298 00:18:01,360 --> 00:18:03,800 year and they've really benefited from that, I'm 299 00:18:03,800 --> 00:18:05,760 delighted. If someone else has been 300 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:09,800 intimate or someone's been on a carnival diet and this is just 301 00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:15,760 diet, then great, that works for them for now because everything 302 00:18:15,760 --> 00:18:19,920 is about sustainability as well. So that's why that is a 303 00:18:19,920 --> 00:18:21,960 challenge, Pete. Yeah, I know. 304 00:18:21,960 --> 00:18:23,400 I like it. I, I, I, I'm. 305 00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:25,280 I, I'm. I'm all over. 306 00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:27,800 That I, I'm like you. I think it's it is a very 307 00:18:27,800 --> 00:18:31,560 delicate space because I can assume that I know better, but 308 00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:33,520 you know, I don't and I, I like the way. 309 00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:36,280 You. Encourage people like I do to 310 00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:40,840 find your own way because you know as as we face each other 311 00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:43,640 now you know my right is your left. 312 00:18:44,040 --> 00:18:48,160 So to think that I am right and you are wrong and and to come 313 00:18:48,160 --> 00:18:50,280 across that way, that's not my way. 314 00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:53,880 However, what I do like to do with people, Let's look at 315 00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:57,960 behaviour, perhaps that people want to stop or the habits they 316 00:18:57,960 --> 00:19:01,480 want to break. I have always enjoyed giving 317 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:04,640 people the perspective of whatever it is that you do that 318 00:19:04,640 --> 00:19:09,040 perhaps you wish you didn't do or you want to stop, but you 319 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:11,480 find it hard to stop, whatever that is. 320 00:19:12,040 --> 00:19:15,120 Again, it's it's, it's hard not to kind of generalize around 321 00:19:15,120 --> 00:19:19,360 this, But my thoughts on that are you do what you do because 322 00:19:19,360 --> 00:19:22,040 there's part of you that maybe still wants to do it, that 323 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:24,320 there's still something that you get from doing it. 324 00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:30,440 Like I've spoken really publicly about when my wife was dying, 325 00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:35,400 when my my mother was dying, when my dad was dying, I sought 326 00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:40,680 solace in food that there is a part of me that goes, I know 327 00:19:40,680 --> 00:19:43,880 this isn't the best thing for me to eat, but I really want to eat 328 00:19:43,880 --> 00:19:46,800 it because it's giving me something in this moment. 329 00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:51,400 And I think it's very easy for humans to blame and shame and 330 00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:55,920 criticize themselves that I have always thought that we do what 331 00:19:55,920 --> 00:19:58,480 we do because there's part of us that still thinks that maybe 332 00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:00,320 that is the best thing for us to do. 333 00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:03,560 Or there's a Like I say, it's a delicate. 334 00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:07,960 Subject, but I think it's important like what I think if 335 00:20:07,960 --> 00:20:11,440 I'm understanding you correctly, what you're encouraging people 336 00:20:11,440 --> 00:20:16,320 to do is to to have that awareness of self and to be to. 337 00:20:16,320 --> 00:20:19,160 Become more curious. About what is going on? 338 00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:21,520 Is that where you're kind of coming from? 339 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:30,400 Yeah, I think let's use your example to having sweets or 340 00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:32,160 candy as they would say in the States. 341 00:20:34,120 --> 00:20:41,600 They're simple carbohydrates, so they they can elicit chemical 342 00:20:41,600 --> 00:20:44,760 response in the body and we can get highs, but they're also lows 343 00:20:44,760 --> 00:20:47,320 in there. So it's an addictive aspects of 344 00:20:47,320 --> 00:20:49,280 sugars, more addictive than cocaine. 345 00:20:49,600 --> 00:20:53,720 Now I can shout that from the hilltops, but if someone is in 346 00:20:53,720 --> 00:20:57,160 that cycle and lifestyle, I believe they have to discover 347 00:20:57,160 --> 00:21:00,400 that for themselves if they discover that. 348 00:21:00,400 --> 00:21:04,480 So they have to slow down and have a moment of going, wow, is 349 00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:06,920 this is this what I'm doing? Because being told here, 350 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:09,360 research shows doesn't change them. 351 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:14,000 So me saying here's the right way and they're going the wrong 352 00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:18,600 way. We wouldn't have an epidemic of 353 00:21:19,520 --> 00:21:24,720 diabetes and obesity in America and and the UK. 354 00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:28,200 You know, it has to be about lifestyle and culture. 355 00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:31,760 And I, I think I read an article yesterday about someone living 356 00:21:31,760 --> 00:21:37,040 in America and then they went to Japan and just lifestyle changed 357 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:43,600 their whole quality of life. And I think I read something 358 00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:47,880 crazy that only 4% of Japanese are obese. 359 00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:53,400 But yet you think about pan and sumo wrestlers and others, you 360 00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:54,560 might have a different perspective. 361 00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:59,320 But if you look at it in Western culture, I've forgotten what it 362 00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:02,200 is in the UKI know in America now it's like 36%. 363 00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:06,760 So it's over 1/3 of people are clinically or morbidly obese. 364 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:10,080 Now that's a label. If I tell someone that, does 365 00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:12,640 that motivate them? Does that get them to think, oh, 366 00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:14,800 I want to change? What they have to do is 367 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:17,920 recognise where they are. And I think what you said is 368 00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:23,600 this backstage aspect of stopping allows people to become 369 00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:26,120 mindful. And this is the exciting thing. 370 00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:31,760 You will discover more about you, no one else. 371 00:22:32,440 --> 00:22:34,200 You will discover more about you. 372 00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:38,960 It's a very fear ridden space because slowing down, stopping 373 00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:43,200 in backstage and not preparing, not using the space of backstage 374 00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:46,160 to prepare for people pleasing and driving your performance in 375 00:22:46,160 --> 00:22:49,320 the world, but doing it for you is scary. 376 00:22:49,320 --> 00:22:53,720 It's the, it's the man in the mirror, you know, it's looking 377 00:22:53,880 --> 00:22:56,520 woman in the mirror looking at yourself and saying OK. 378 00:22:57,280 --> 00:23:01,440 And that journey of self discovery, the inward journey is 379 00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:04,880 what I would advocate and encourage people to discover. 380 00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:06,560 And it doesn't mean they're going to be perfect because 381 00:23:06,560 --> 00:23:08,360 guess what? No one's perfect. 382 00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:13,640 That's the point. I like I like this conversation. 383 00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:17,920 I just landed on this because you probably, I used to watch it 384 00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:21,560 in the UK occasionally, but America had a show once called 385 00:23:21,560 --> 00:23:25,240 The Biggest Loser. And what they did is they, they, 386 00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:29,360 they put people in their front stage through exercise regime, 387 00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:33,120 diet regime and they were in a social setting and people lost 388 00:23:33,120 --> 00:23:36,120 extraordinary amounts of weight and lifestyle. 389 00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:41,520 But sadly, if you look at all the research almost into the 90 390 00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:44,600 percentiles, those individuals in the show, when they were left 391 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:48,000 to themselves, they went back to backstage and they had to be 392 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:51,040 self motivated. They all put the weight on and 393 00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:55,760 then some. So front stage focus on ATV show 394 00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:59,400 has massive change when you've got that support. 395 00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:03,640 But you, you, none of us have the money to pay for a 24 hour 396 00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:05,960 support. And remember it's support over a 397 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:09,840 short period of time as well. So even on that show, if you 398 00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:14,480 sustain that all the time, you would soon get pretty fed up 399 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:17,120 with those people in your life screaming at you and and 400 00:24:17,120 --> 00:24:19,040 eventually you'd say, no, I'm doing it my way. 401 00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:25,360 Well, you know, Ray, it's fascinating because there's a 402 00:24:25,360 --> 00:24:27,440 few things going on for me when you're talking about that. 403 00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:32,920 So one is definitely who we're here to serve, you know, and 404 00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:37,280 it's definitely serving the people that want to do that in a 405 00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:40,720 work as opposed to we're not here to serve the people that 406 00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:43,520 want us to tell them what to do, because there are there's a lot 407 00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:45,920 of people that want to be told what to do. 408 00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:49,040 But I still think that has a place when someone does the 409 00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:50,800 inner work and they're they're aware. 410 00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:54,960 Sometimes I think a lot of the time people then need to be told 411 00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:57,280 what to do, but they're ready to do the work for themselves 412 00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:02,600 because there is a lot of confusion around what is the the 413 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:07,400 best thing for an individual to do for them to get the results 414 00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:08,640 they want. And I suppose that could 415 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:10,560 possibly apply to any area of life. 416 00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:15,400 But the other thing that came to mind, Ray, is about that biggest 417 00:25:15,400 --> 00:25:18,640 loser thing, you know, because I was actually asked to be on that 418 00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:20,240 show here, the English equivalent. 419 00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:23,440 But we did our own version of that called Inch loss Island, 420 00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:26,440 which we did in England. We did it in Mauritius, we did 421 00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:30,640 it in Saint Lucia, taking people over, taking people who were 422 00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:33,320 overweight away. And what, what you said just 423 00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:40,040 made me realize that as as much as I wanted to do that work for 424 00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:44,360 people to to go inside and really see what was going on, it 425 00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:46,400 was always, it was always a challenge to do. 426 00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:50,360 Because the other side of that right is that people need to be 427 00:25:50,360 --> 00:25:53,240 ready to do that. And I suppose it's very easy to 428 00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:56,080 kind of do it in a superficial way rather than going to the 429 00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:59,320 root of something, which sometimes, as you said, is fear 430 00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:02,720 ridden. It's uncomfortable to realise 431 00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:06,240 perhaps why you behave in certain ways that don't serve 432 00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:09,520 you. But once again, this is such a 433 00:26:09,520 --> 00:26:14,000 big topic of conversations like open up this massive box. 434 00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:17,920 But hopefully in opening up the box, we're giving our listeners 435 00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:21,640 the opportunity to just look at things with a with a fresh pair 436 00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:23,800 of eyes. But let me ask you that question 437 00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:28,280 because there is a space. There has to be a space where 438 00:26:28,280 --> 00:26:31,160 you instruct people, but only because they are ready to be 439 00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:33,000 instructed. Tell me what your thoughts are 440 00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:39,000 about that. Oh, well, I don't think we 441 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:42,160 should be telling anyone what to do ever. 442 00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:46,200 Yeah. So there's my permission, 443 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:50,480 clearly. I think if you've been blessed 444 00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:53,840 with knowledge, then you respond to questions. 445 00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:58,320 So any clients I've ever worked with, I encourage them to ask 446 00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:04,520 questions because if someone is forced to ask a question in this 447 00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:07,640 space, it's relative to their own experiences and their own 448 00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:10,080 journey. And the question should inform 449 00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:13,400 anyone who's expert in the space of providing support. 450 00:27:14,360 --> 00:27:17,720 They should also have be an empath and they can then start 451 00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:21,600 to empathize and understand where someone is, show 452 00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:25,680 compassion and in that value exchange, anything's possible. 453 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:29,840 But I, I, I don't advocate and I've been in education for many 454 00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:33,000 years, coaching, consulting. I don't advocate to anyone. 455 00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:38,720 What to do. I think we, we all, we all 456 00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:42,760 opinions about things, but I think it's saying I, I normally 457 00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:45,440 look weight loss is good and someone might say someone, what 458 00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:48,440 do you want? What is it you're looking for? 459 00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:50,480 And I'm trying to understand where they are. 460 00:27:50,480 --> 00:27:52,480 I need to find out where they're located. 461 00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:56,760 Otherwise what I'm saying to them is this is where you need 462 00:27:56,760 --> 00:28:00,040 to be. And you know, I think it's 463 00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:02,880 problematic and, and history research suggests it's 464 00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:06,640 problematic when you do that. I think what I like again, this 465 00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:08,240 is the the way I work with people. 466 00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:11,560 It would be that questioning, so someone might say what? 467 00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:14,360 Tell me what to eat. And then you'd throw it back on 468 00:28:14,360 --> 00:28:16,280 them and say. Well, what do you think? 469 00:28:16,280 --> 00:28:18,800 You need to eat or what are you currently eating? 470 00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:22,320 How's that? So you're encouraging people to 471 00:28:22,320 --> 00:28:25,360 really take ownership of. It'd be great to get some 472 00:28:25,360 --> 00:28:29,000 feedback from people because I think what you're saying is it 473 00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:33,760 might be quite radical for people, you know, but ultimately 474 00:28:33,760 --> 00:28:36,200 I think when you know who you serve and you and I have been 475 00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:39,840 serving people for a long time and we've gotten, I, I think 476 00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:43,880 I've, I've got some amazing results with people by creating 477 00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:46,160 the space for people to work things out for themselves. 478 00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:52,040 Because I, I, you know, I remember, remember for years 479 00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:55,800 working with people who would lose weight and I would not tell 480 00:28:55,800 --> 00:28:57,480 them what to eat, you know, that's just not my way. 481 00:28:57,480 --> 00:28:59,840 It's like helping them work it out for themselves. 482 00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:03,280 And then when you would meet someone that had worked, some 483 00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:06,840 worked this out for themselves, they had owned that what they 484 00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:10,000 were doing, I would stand. I would then stand next to these 485 00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:12,720 people. And it was like I was standing 486 00:29:12,720 --> 00:29:15,600 again next to someone who was far more powerful than the 487 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:18,400 person that they were that I'd have to take often take a step 488 00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:22,640 back because it's like, whoa, you're walking in your 489 00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:25,560 greatness. You're walking in the person 490 00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:28,520 that you have become. And it was because they did it 491 00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:30,480 right. And they then own what they've 492 00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:32,400 done. And when I think when you own 493 00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:34,440 what you have done. It's. 494 00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:39,520 Yeah, I'm sure you could still go back, but you get back much 495 00:29:39,520 --> 00:29:42,080 quicker or not go back at all because that's just not who you 496 00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:46,400 are. And this is such a fascinating 497 00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:49,680 conversation because that's what my work is really all about, 498 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:55,120 Ray, is people owning and and taking pride in in in what 499 00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:57,960 they've done. What's your thoughts on that? 500 00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:06,960 I think we all own what we do. That's the key to it and people 501 00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:10,960 who are successful in this space or anything in personal Wellness 502 00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:15,680 have decided to take responsibility. 503 00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:23,640 And I said earlier, you know that ability to respond at a 504 00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:27,800 default state, for many people, comfort is the key. 505 00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:31,680 And when you recognise there's no such thing as comfort. 506 00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:35,560 So when someone sees someone with a lifestyle and they go, 507 00:30:35,560 --> 00:30:39,360 oh, you have this or you. This has worked out ordinarily 508 00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:42,000 outside of extreme circumstances. 509 00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:44,200 But generally when you look at the patterns of behaviour, 510 00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:49,520 people have had to sacrifice and being able to respond to the 511 00:30:49,520 --> 00:30:52,440 things that are required of them to get where they're going. 512 00:30:52,440 --> 00:30:54,640 Whether we, as we've been talking about weight loss, 513 00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:59,200 whether it's talking about finishing that book, investing 514 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:03,720 in a relationship, whatever it might be, there's some 515 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:07,560 discomfort. And I think we were discussing 516 00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:11,160 several books. There's the The Salah of not 517 00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:15,120 giving an F Mark Manson, he talks about, you know, life is 518 00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:17,160 full of problems. That's just inevitable. 519 00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:21,720 But if people are trying to resist problems, then they never 520 00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:23,480 move forward. And I agree with that because if 521 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:25,880 you're trying to resist problems, you just want comfort. 522 00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:30,560 Comfort is no responsibility, so no ability to respond. 523 00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:33,280 You just want to exist and that's what we're talking about. 524 00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:37,280 But once you get into it, you can replace problems with ones 525 00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:41,200 that are easy to manage. So if someone decides that, you 526 00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:44,760 know, eating a bar of chocolate each day isn't working out for 527 00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:48,160 them, then they have to empower themselves to say, I have 528 00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:52,280 chocolate on my cheat day. And then they focus enjoying 529 00:31:52,280 --> 00:31:57,480 that chocolate bar on a Friday as opposed to a Sunday, Monday, 530 00:31:57,480 --> 00:31:59,520 Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday. 531 00:31:59,920 --> 00:32:01,920 But that's something they have to articulate. 532 00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:05,240 And someone working with them provides a good support 533 00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:08,560 construct. But I'm just not comfortable 534 00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:12,080 being the person telling them or screaming at them or telling 535 00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:16,800 them what to do because all the stats work out. 536 00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:20,320 And I think many years ago I was involved in setting up one of 537 00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:23,720 the first cardiac rehabilitation programs with some wonderful 538 00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:29,840 people, doctors and clinical nurses. 539 00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:33,720 But my job and I felt wholly inadequate to do this, was to 540 00:32:33,720 --> 00:32:36,680 encourage these people to be physically active after they've 541 00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:39,680 had a heart attack by past surgery. 542 00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:43,280 But they came in, they were blood pressure checked and they 543 00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:47,920 went through an exercise regime. And I know you've done something 544 00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:51,120 similar. And I did some research on this. 545 00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:55,280 And what horrified me at the time, I'm just a young man, was 546 00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:58,480 that the research at the time and it may not have changed, I 547 00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:02,840 haven't looked at it recently. 50% of people that have a heart 548 00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:07,480 attack or bypass surgery go back to the lifestyle that caused 549 00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:10,960 that six months after then just six months. 550 00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:14,280 And that's always fascinated me over these years. 551 00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:17,880 And it speaks to what we're talking about, Pete, that if 552 00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:24,640 that person is still embedded in a habitual cycle, it's nothing's 553 00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:30,520 going to change because those habits are hard wired in and you 554 00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:34,000 have to change the circuitry to create meaningful change. 555 00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:37,600 And a good example is that the majority of people that have had 556 00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:41,960 a heart incidence, those who have a successful transition is 557 00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:46,120 a body system. So last year I had very good 558 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:51,440 former work colleague, her husband sadly had a heart attack 559 00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:53,640 and it was the one they call the Widowmaker. 560 00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:56,800 And he's just one of the small sample of population who 561 00:33:56,800 --> 00:33:59,680 actually survived this incident. And he did. 562 00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:03,960 And the doctors, you know, shared their views and he was 563 00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:09,199 over £300. He's 195 lbs now. 564 00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:14,840 And when it happened, I said to his dear wife, you know, all the 565 00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:18,280 research suggests that he needs great support, but he has to 566 00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:21,400 take control. And you have to be a really big 567 00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:24,639 fan. And it's extraordinary. 568 00:34:24,719 --> 00:34:28,480 I, you know, that that statement hails into insignificance as to 569 00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:32,120 what that family has done because it's been transformation 570 00:34:32,120 --> 00:34:35,440 beyond anything I've witnessed. And in fact his doctor has said, 571 00:34:36,159 --> 00:34:39,840 I don't think I've met anyone where you are, your bloods and 572 00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:41,560 everything. You know, no one would know 573 00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:43,840 you'd had the situation you'd gone through. 574 00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:50,719 But he has empowered himself through Yusuf backstage and then 575 00:34:50,719 --> 00:34:54,080 being able to exist in front stage and it's wonderful to see. 576 00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:59,200 But if he had been told what to do, I don't think it would have 577 00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:03,080 been as good an outcome. Yeah, I, I, I again, I don't 578 00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:05,880 know. I think that I know myself well 579 00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:09,600 enough and know that I had a coach for 16 years and I think I 580 00:35:09,600 --> 00:35:12,520 could, I think only one time he told me. 581 00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:18,080 And you have as well, right? You know, I've, you've you've 582 00:35:18,080 --> 00:35:23,360 told me one time what you really thought in terms of. 583 00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:27,680 I don't know how you would phrase that, that the rest of 584 00:35:27,680 --> 00:35:31,160 the time you either. My perception is you in the work 585 00:35:31,160 --> 00:35:34,040 that we've done together. It's always been about you 586 00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:36,920 posing the questions. But also give me your. 587 00:35:37,240 --> 00:35:38,800 I think you've given me your opinion. 588 00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:42,760 But opinions are important in a trusting environment though. 589 00:35:43,240 --> 00:35:47,440 If if you share your opinion with someone that you're you 590 00:35:47,440 --> 00:35:49,200 don't trust, it can be problematic. 591 00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:55,040 And I think I mentioned before and quote is that yes, you, you 592 00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:57,840 remember things people say, you remember things people do, but 593 00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:01,000 you never forget the way people make you feel. 594 00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:05,520 And if you ask someone, then your resilience to their 595 00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:09,520 opinions, the tolerance of resilience levels much higher 596 00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:11,800 because you know they're on your side. 597 00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:15,400 It's when someone gives you an opinion and you don't trust what 598 00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:17,960 they're telling you, you reject it. 599 00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:20,240 And it can, it can set people back. 600 00:36:20,240 --> 00:36:22,920 So actually helping someone is not achieved. 601 00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:27,000 You set them back. Yeah, I think there's also 602 00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:29,720 something this is going back to something we were talking about 603 00:36:29,720 --> 00:36:35,600 just before in this conversation around people that say X saved 604 00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:37,560 my life, you know, changed my life. 605 00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:41,280 And I've always said, no, they didn't do it, you did it. 606 00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:45,040 You know, they're part of the process, but it's yours. 607 00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:48,400 And again, that might not be what everyone wants to hear, but 608 00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:53,200 where you and I are coming from is helping people work it out 609 00:36:53,200 --> 00:36:57,120 for themselves to, to do that great work of observing oneself 610 00:36:57,120 --> 00:37:00,680 and, and being curious and, and realizing that there's maybe 611 00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:03,520 more to to you than meets the eye. 612 00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:05,520 Because I think it's wedding. That's one of the most 613 00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:09,160 empowering positions that most people ever find themselves in. 614 00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:13,040 Is what you've touched, Yeah, you touched upon some 615 00:37:13,040 --> 00:37:16,920 attribution theory. We, we are as a species, we like 616 00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:20,640 to ultimately, although we say we don't measure and attribute 617 00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:24,280 why something's happened. And when we see people in public 618 00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:27,120 eye and something changes, we want to know why this divorce is 619 00:37:27,120 --> 00:37:28,560 happening. We want to know why this has 620 00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:31,320 happened. We want to know how you know, 621 00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:34,480 you know, both of us are beautifully follically 622 00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:37,400 challenged. But if we both if I showed up 623 00:37:37,400 --> 00:37:42,000 with a an Afro and people were pulling, it was coming out of 624 00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:44,640 head that he's had a hair transplant, it would be a 625 00:37:44,640 --> 00:37:47,720 fascination to people that have got used to seeing me all these 626 00:37:47,720 --> 00:37:53,440 years the way I am. So attribution is something 627 00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:56,280 everyone wants to know the formula for life. 628 00:37:56,800 --> 00:38:00,560 And I'm saying the formula is very personal and that you 629 00:38:00,560 --> 00:38:03,840 should have people around that you know, you love, you trust 630 00:38:04,360 --> 00:38:08,720 and set the stage up right. So think about backstage. 631 00:38:08,720 --> 00:38:14,400 You have people backstage with you prepping wardrobe, everyone 632 00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:17,160 letting you know when your time is to go into a social setting. 633 00:38:17,680 --> 00:38:19,800 That's what you should focus on is that team. 634 00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:23,360 You know, I'll I'll hand it over to you because you're an expert 635 00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:25,760 here. But if you think about Michael 636 00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:31,400 Jordan, who was in his. Backstage, Pete, well is Phil 637 00:38:31,400 --> 00:38:35,360 Jackson for one, his mum who was just, and his dad. 638 00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:41,360 I mean, just huge, huge, huge support, you know, and that I 639 00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:46,000 think is such a huge element also of change in your life is 640 00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:49,840 having that support around you accountability. 641 00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:54,080 Once again, I would love to hear from people around what, what's 642 00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:56,040 your feedback? Because we can have really 643 00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:59,480 meaningful conversations, which Ray and I have, but we would 644 00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:01,720 love to get you involved in the conversations and. 645 00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:03,920 It's the key to what we're doing here. 646 00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:07,840 Yes, we have discussions. Yes, we're sharing our thoughts 647 00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:10,920 and opinions around things. But ultimately, we're trying to 648 00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:16,240 create an ecosystem where we listen to each other and more 649 00:39:16,240 --> 00:39:20,240 importantly, we listen to those who you've listened to this. 650 00:39:20,240 --> 00:39:22,640 And whether you're a first time listener or you've listened to 651 00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:30,200 many shows, it's absolutely our role to just create an 652 00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:36,480 environment where you benefit from listening and your feedback 653 00:39:36,480 --> 00:39:40,280 therefore then is critical. Please just gently consider this 654 00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:43,240 notion that when you're interacting with others, you're 655 00:39:43,240 --> 00:39:46,680 in front stage performance mode, but there is a backstage 656 00:39:46,680 --> 00:39:50,200 performance mode. And what we're saying is you can 657 00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:52,520 be intentional. You are what you are when no 658 00:39:52,520 --> 00:39:55,120 one's looking. There are people that you you 659 00:39:55,120 --> 00:39:58,240 can trust and you can have meaningful dialogue about the 660 00:39:58,240 --> 00:40:02,520 decisions you're going to make. And that that's what I would 661 00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:07,040 probably say at this stage, Pete, is just be mindful of 662 00:40:07,040 --> 00:40:10,320 that. And if, if we're making any 663 00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:12,760 sense to you, then we look forward to. 664 00:40:13,080 --> 00:40:16,880 Having you listen again. So if you're not following Ray 665 00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:20,320 on LinkedIn on this, on this, we'll we'll make sure that the 666 00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:23,840 link to his LinkedIn and mine is there as well. 667 00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:29,480 So thank you so much, Ray. Have a wonderful day and we will 668 00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:31,760 see you. Again, soon. 669 00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:36,920 Thank you for listening, and if there's one thing I'd love you 670 00:40:36,920 --> 00:40:40,280 to take away from this conversation, it's that no one 671 00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:42,880 else can discover your path for you. 672 00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:46,520 People can encourage you, people can support you, people can ask 673 00:40:46,520 --> 00:40:50,080 you great questions, but ultimately, the journey inward 674 00:40:50,240 --> 00:40:53,920 is yours. So this week I simply invite you 675 00:40:53,920 --> 00:40:57,320 to spend a little bit more time backstage. 676 00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:00,200 Notice your thoughts without judging them. 677 00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:03,480 Become curious about the habits that serve you and the ones that 678 00:41:03,480 --> 00:41:05,960 don't. And instead of asking what's the 679 00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:09,840 right way, perhaps ask yourself what is my way? 680 00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:13,560 And if you need help with any of this, then please feel free to 681 00:41:13,560 --> 00:41:16,240 reach out to us and perhaps we can help you or point you in the 682 00:41:16,240 --> 00:41:20,120 right direction. So until next time, keep 683 00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:22,880 choosing to stop, to think.