Have you ever walked into a room and been completely drawn into
someone's personality? They were like almost kind of
magnetic and so charismatic and you're like, what do they have?
And how can I have some of that? This episode we're going to
discuss. How to talk to?
Anyone already? Let's dive in.
Let's do it. Hi, I'm Jean and I'm Cherie and
and we're the Tiger Sisters. Welcome to the season finale of
Tiger Sisters. Yay.
I can't believe it's been 10 episodes.
Yeah, it went by. Really.
Fast. Yeah, it went by really fast.
I am excited about the evolution of topics.
Yeah. Discovered.
Yeah, I think. I think like some of the more
recent episodes have been a lot more like fun and not just like,
informative. And hopefully the audience is
enjoying that. Yeah, I think.
We've covered a lot of like, professional stuff in the
beginning, mixed in some personal stuff and yeah, it's
just been such an amazing season.
You've done really well. Thank you.
I know. Thank you.
My first. Season your first season, first
time podcasting. Yeah, and 10 kind of just like
flew by. Yeah, and I feel like I'm also
just getting more comfortable with, like, speaking on camera
and being more candid and just being more, like vulnerable and
honest. I love that for you, Thanks.
OK so before we go any further, please like, comment and
subscribe if you haven't already.
We have such an amazing season 2 planned out and if you haven't
seen the season 1 episodes like they, some of them I honestly
will say are so, so good. I'm so proud of them.
Yeah, and then also Jean and I read every single comment that
you guys leave on our YouTube videos.
And so if you have any suggestions, comments or
questions, leave them down below and we'll respond to them and
maybe even bring them into our next mailbag and our next season
and episodes. Yes.
So, Speaking of Mailbag. Mailbag.
Bag OK, so the inspiration for this episode, it actually came
from a mailbag. So Jamie Coleron said I would
like to see the Tiger Sisters talk about how to talk to anyone
and how to be a better communicator for the next
episode. You got it Jamie.
You got it Jamie from. Riyad.
Does anyone get that reference? Yeah, it's from Full House.
Yeah, I don't know it. I I dabbled.
You watched Full House? Yeah, I had the biggest crush on
Uncle Jess. Oh, my God.
Everyone did. John Stamehouse.
I'm kidding. It was like the definition of
like 90s dreamy. Oh, for sure.
OK. I think a good way to start out
this topic is to focus first on, like, work and career aspects of
how to talk to anyone. Yeah.
And then we can, you know, devolve into.
Whatever our topic is podcast my attorney.
But let's start with, like, what are some tips you have for
talking to older people or more like, senior people, meaning,
like, leaders in the company and, like, execs or maybe even
people you feel intimidated by? I feel like you're a really good
person. This is a big topic because you
can talk to anyone. And, yeah, like, I feel like
it's one of your superpowers. Oh, thank you.
Yeah, I think I really struggled with this when I first graduated
because when you're like a 22 year old in the workplace and
you're like, Oh my God, so much of myself worth is tied to what
I say and how I present myself. It was really nerve wracking.
But I think just getting more repetitions in and getting more
practice and talking to people who are older than you, who have
more like years of experience than you and like getting those
reps in really helps. But I think honestly, it's a
mindset shift for me where you're just like, even if I'm
talking to someone who's like 5 levels above me or the CEO of a
company, at the end of the day, they are just a person.
Yeah. And like if you can connect on a
human to human level, like no sucking up, no like ass kissing.
It's like how do you connect with another person and
genuinely be curious in them and what their story is and what
they care about? Then I feel like that's where it
becomes less scary. Well, on the topic of getting
Rep, getting your reps in and like getting exposure, I feel
like one of the ways you did that was through your
internships and at Morgan Stanley.
I remember you interned there when you were in college and one
of your specific assignments was to interview all these like VPS
and other sort of leaders at the company.
For the project that you're working on, you're making like
an internal directory of information or something like an
internal resource director. Exactly.
And as part of my internship, it was my like role, my job, my
project to talk to a bunch of Morgan Stanley technologists and
vice presidents in their very, like, specific domain.
And a lot of it is just like asking questions, being curious,
and then also knowing that you yourself have something to
offer. I think that's like a comment I
see quite often on social media. It's just like, Oh my God, like,
you know, I'm in high school, I'm in college or like I'm a new
grad. Like talking to these people who
are much more experienced is kind of scary because.
Like, what do I have to offer? Well, but so like how when you
were doing it, were you like, were you nervous or were you
like, oh, it's just my assignment.
Like I was told to do this. I was definitely nervous because
I wanted to make a good impression.
Like, I didn't want to like, sound like an idiot, but I think
before even talking to the person doing, like a lot of
research, okay. And like every conversation, it
goes well because I'm prepared. Like I've done research on the
person. I know what their purview is.
And it's not like I'm asking like, you know, level 1
questions that I can just Google.
I'm asking level 10 questions that only this specific person
in this specific domain would have the answer to.
Yeah. It's kind of funny because I
feel like Cherie's Corner was like an evolution of like
looking back on it now, right? Like have you ever had that
song? No, I haven't.
That's what you do for Cherie's corner.
So for Cherie's Corner, Cherie's other podcast that is wrapping
up its. Last season, her other podcast.
Was wrapping up its last season so she could focus fully on
Tiger Sisters. Yeah, she has interviewed some.
Like true, like Titans of industry, like people who are
just like, I don't know, like single name people kind of yeah,
in a way. And but you do a so much
preparation. Yeah.
And that's what I think people don't see is how much behind the
scenes goes into these. I mean, the podcast obviously,
but then also just like having like one-on-one coffee chats
with people, like never ever go into a coffee chat.
Like cold bare minimum is spending 5 minutes on their
LinkedIn profile to know more about them.
And that's like the bare minimum I would say, especially if
you're the person who is asking for the coffee chat and you know
it in the like power differential is asking for help.
Yeah. I feel like that's a very good
practical tip. Yeah.
I think one of the most powerful ways to talk to anybody is to
identify what your shared interests are or like, even
better, like, over time, like, cultivate some sort of, like,
shared interests and shared experience together.
Like, I feel like you have like, so much to say about that.
When I was in school, one of the big things that I did and I
would suggest that other people do as well, is like join clubs
or get involved in groups where you can like find a common
interest. For example, in the last few
months of my time at Stanford, I helped organize, Co organize the
Stanford Women's Golf Clinic. And it was just, you know, a few
of us ladies where we got together and we created a
three-week series to bring other Stanford women in business to go
all learn golf together. And we got so much feedback from
these ladies that they're like, this was amazing.
I've never played golf before. It's so safe.
It was just like a good environment.
And then also, like, for example, we had like a mini
creator club at Stanford. And it's just like common
interest. And it's not just at school.
Too, It's at work, right? And a lot of companies, they're
different sort of affinity groups that you can join.
And even outside of that, like some of the things that I've
done is remember like I've created this with my friends,
like this annual retreat with my HBS girlfriends where we get
together every year in Newport and it's about like 20 of us.
And we basically like have this weekend of like learning and
growing together, like reconnecting and bonding.
It's like creating you can like you can actively create these
experiences where you can like bond with people and like get to
know them better. Well, I think it also starts
from like a shared understanding to like we all have a common
something. And then from there you create
the shared experiences where you dive in even deeper.
And one way we were able to do this at Stanford DSB that I
absolutely loved was going on trips together.
Big proponent of traveling together to experience things in
a new way. And Speaking of trips, you may
have seen that Cherie and I recently announced our Trova
trip to Japan together, which we kind of put together because we
wanted to create this opportunity to bond with and
build community with all of you guys.
So you can find more information in the description in this
video. But basically it's going to be
Jean and I as the host of this trip.
But we will definitely have someone on the ground in Japan
leading us and guiding us through all the different
points. We'll be in Tokyo and then also
near Mount Fuji. And we'll have up to 15 people
join us on this trip and like to spend time with you guys.
I'm so excited because I've never been to Japan before
somehow, but Sheree has been and she's like a total, I feel like,
expert on Japan now because you've spent some Japan on fire.
Yeah. And so I'm like super excited to
like, get to know Japan and like experience it and also like have
like her expertise and her personal experiences to guide us
as well. And I just think it's going to
be a totally magical experience. And I can't wait to meet you
guys and to, like, get to actually spend time together
face to face as opposed to just like, messaging and like, you
know, DM ING and like responding to comments.
Yeah. So excited for this and check
out the link in the description for more details.
Speaking of exposure therapy, I feel like another way that we
had exposure therapy was just kind of the environment and
neighborhood that we were in growing up.
So Sheree and I grew up on Long Island.
Well, actually, I grew up in Brooklyn and then I moved to
Long Island in the middle of 4th grade.
I was born in Brooklyn. Yeah.
And then Sheree moved when she was like, I don't know, three or
four years old or something. Really young, but we grew up in
what was essentially like a very white and affluent community.
And so I feel like, yes, there were many, many times where I
never felt fully comfortable because I was like one of one
Asian people, like in my not just in my friend group, but
like in my entire grade, maybe one of two actually.
But and I always felt like I was very like defined by my
ethnicity. But the, like, flip side of that
is that I feel like I had to learn how to become very
comfortable with people who were different from me.
Yeah, yeah. I have like, I have girlfriends
who have told me who have grown up in California and they've
like, grown up with mostly Asian people.
And they're like, yeah, I just don't feel, I like to this day,
I still just, I just don't feel like fully, fully comfortable
talking to white people, like, or as comfortable as I feel
talking to to Asian people. So that's something I feel like
never really gets like talked about.
Totally. I mean, there's so much to dig
in there, perhaps with a therapist for us, but like I, I
loved. I have other higher priority.
I know we have other things to talk about in therapy, but
underneath the surface, that is one thing.
But yeah, I mean it. There's both pros and cons.
Like Gina and I grew up in a nice neighborhood.
Even though we didn't come from that world, we were very much,
like, exposed to that world and exposed to, I know the latter,
like, behave. Yeah, that world as a Christian.
Still ways of speaking the expectations.
Some people would see that as a Jurich though.
For like oh you need a code switch.
I mean, you know me, I'm like, the world is the world, right?
Are you going to exist in the world today?
And how can you change the world if you're not going to like?
Be a part of it. Yeah.
And if you're not going to make yourself into a person of
influence in the world today in order to affect change, that's
my perspective. I agree.
With that, but I I also see the other side as well.
But I guess all of that to say, like it was a really good
experience to be exposed to that.
So then we can kind of. Yes.
Like looking back at it, like at the time, like did I enjoy being
like feeling alone and being bullied when I was growing up?
Like no. But now.
Yeah. But now, now I like see the
value of having been put into that situation.
So maybe one take away out of all of this is that that wasn't
something that we like opted into, but it is something that
you can opt into. Like basically you can choose to
put yourself into situations that are outside of your comfort
zone. Yeah.
In order to kind of like learn more about different cultures.
Yeah. And, and honestly, it just goes
back to like how to talk to anyone.
Like, I think that is a strength if you're able to relate to many
different types of people, especially if it's outside of
the environment that you're comfortable with.
And I think it'll be good professionally.
It'll it'll be good personally. It'll widen your worldview.
And I think like, yeah, like talking to some and this very
this specific stories like some of our Asian girlfriends who are
not comfortable with it. Like you can stay in the
comfortable spot or you can like lean into the discomfort and
like grow in different ways. And I I would argue it would
help your career to do so. Yeah.
And one specific example I have of this is or like one or like
one specific method you can do at work is you can seek out sort
of like opportunities to interact with different people,
especially senior people. If you feel nervous about
connecting with or you don't know how to talk to them, seek
out opportunities to interact with them that are outside of
your typical like meetings or like super like straightforward
interactions where you're like presenting to them or like, you
know, not the like cut and dry work interactions.
So like, what's an example? When I worked at Goldman, one of
the things that my group did every year, I don't know why,
but one of the things that we did was we put together this
like a holiday music video. And do you?
Still have access to it. No, but it honestly was so
freaking good. It was like, I was like so proud
of it. We and we like made ourselves
like little awards for it too. But anyway, it was one of the
things that we did and it was like day-to-day.
Like we thought we day-to-day, like the work was so serious.
Like everyone. We literally thought we were
doing God's work because that's what Lloyd had said to us.
Lloyd Blankfein. Yeah, he he was like, we're
doing God's work. And I was like, yes, we are
because I was like 2021 and I was like, I'm doing God's work.
Everyone took everything so seriously.
But we had this holiday video and I like, volunteered or was
volunteered, I don't remember, to become one of the producers.
And so my job was to help like write the scripts.
It was like an SNL thing to like write the scripts and like help
like direct and have and like make the MD's and VP's like lip
sync to all these different songs.
They're like it's. My job, you have to lip sync
Taylor Swift. Yeah.
And I would like, give them these, like, costumes.
And it was just, like, so fun. And it was a way to interact
with each other. Oh, I love that.
That was not work, yeah, but it was work.
But like it wasn't work. No, it was, it was fun, it was
silly, and you're able to like bring a fun side out of the VPS
and MD's as well. Yes, and then they get to like
see me for a person too, not just like a robotic minion got
in the machine, the machine. But yeah, so like, I would just
encourage even like other like now that I'm thinking about it,
like other little things, like we had this annual baking
competition and like me, like, you know, me, I'm not a Baker,
much less a cook at all. But for some reason, me and my
my, my friend slash fellow first or second year, I don't remember
which year this was fellow first year Christine.
We were like, let's enter the competition together.
And we made these sticky toffee pudding cupcakes.
I will never forget this and we won.
Yeah, I know. My God, I.
Was. Shocked.
I would have been shocked that you'd want a bacon.
But we like beat all of the like EAS and admins who had all these
like amazing like pass down wrestlers.
But anyway, that was just like another way for us to like like
did we think we were good cooks or good bakers?
Like no, but we're like, OK, let's just do it.
And then it's like another way to like, interact with people
and like, have connections and also, like, make little jokes,
right? And like be and like.
It also helps if you're the one organizing the event as well.
Yeah, because then you can bring people together and everyone can
see you and then come to you because you are the organizer.
Yeah, I organized a baking competition at LinkedIn for my
larger like team and like org. Get copier.
I didn't even know you won your your sticky toffee cupcakes.
But yeah, I organized this baking competition and got like
engineers on our team and like sister teams to like sign up and
it really brought people together.
We were able to vote and everything.
I've actually done it twice and they were mega successes.
People loved it and it was a way for like us to engage.
It was a way for me to engage with people who were not on my
team but on partner teams and in different roles because it was
super cross team, cross functional.
So designers came, engineers came, data scientists came, and
it was a way to also talk to people but then also be known.
Obviously it was for baking, It wasn't for like.
She was known. But it was also a way to.
Known for. It was a way to get known, you
know? OK, yeah.
Or I was like, I was kind of making fun of it.
But you're right, you know, it is.
It's a way, yeah. It's a way for you to like put
your name out there that is kind of like low stakes or it's just
like a reason for. People to like know your name
and also like talk to you to engage in conversation in the
next time I was in the micro kitchen and someone who like I
literally don't need to remember because since you're the
organizer, there's like so many people you're dealing with.
They're like, oh, you organized it.
I was like, oh, did you partake? And like it was a conversation.
They're like I for sure partook I.
Was like, did you make something?
Yeah, no, I first it was forsake.
Is. Anyways, yeah, those are good
memories. Memories.
It's funny how like I'm like, Oh my years at Goldman Sachs all I
remember so fun music video and the baking contest.
Yeah, seriously, those were probably like micro snippets out
of your. I know it was like 1% of my
time, but it is. I mean, it is, yeah.
It's funny how that's what I remember about what I remember
it, all right? What about communicating as a
woman in the workplace? This is a juicy one.
To have thoughts. Yeah, I do.
It's tough. It also depends on the
environment that you're in and the workplace situation, like
especially if it's a super male dominated field like finance,
tech, I don't know, gaming, like those oil and gas.
Yeah, they're super heavily male dominated.
It's hard sometimes as a woman to be able to have your voice
heard. And there's like many, many
studies on this on like why that is, especially in like
workplaces with that dynamic. I would say if you find yourself
there, my #1 tip is to find male allies who will be able to pull
you into conversations. These are the people.
It could be your boss, it could be a mentor, it could just be
someone who's in meetings with you that you just really trust.
And for me, this was my my boss, Albert, who we had a very close
like relationship and like we would be back channeling all the
time. And then he would give me such
good advice that like in a meeting, if it's like quiet and
someone like ask something, he's like, it's jump ball.
He would like coach me afterwards and before it's jump
ball, meaning like anyone can like chime in and like someone
like lobbed a question in the air chime.
Wow, like, you know, grab the ball and, you know, take it.
So and then there be times where there be conversations happening
in meetings and like I would have like specific knowledge on
an answer, but I'd be like too nervous to speak up.
And then Alba would be like D Ming me on slack be like, go
take this and you know this, blah, blah, blah.
Like, wow, a male ally who is not only encouraging me to take
the jump bowl, but then sometimes even putting like a
layup for me anyway to like dunk it and then he'd pass it over
to. Me.
That's amazing. So it was not only him being a
male ally, but it's also me wanting to have like that,
wanting that exposure and wanting to speak up.
OK, but then how do you how do you cultivate that?
Like let's say didn't have Albert because I'm like, okay,
he sounds like the best boss in the world.
Like, not gonna lie, he really. Was Albert?
If you're watching this, you're a homie for life.
Living his best. Life I know he is.
I need to I need to text him. But like, let's say, OK, Albert,
decide. Let's say he was this, like
outlier. Yeah.
What? Did you have other male allies
that weren't your boss? I do cultivate them.
Yeah, I would say for this, one very tactical thing to do is
that, like, figure out who you admire in the workplace.
It could be a woman, it could be a man.
But if you're looking for male allies who are already in the
room and already have influence, like find someone that you
trust, like, and that can be through.
You have coffee with them, you vibe.
And then after you're in a meeting together, pull them
aside immediately when the meeting ends and then ask them
for feedback. And be like.
That sounds so scary. I mean, it's scary in the sense
that like your ego might be. Hurt because you're like, oh,
I'm like seeking feedback, but it's only for growth, especially
if you trust this person. Not even that.
Even just like I could imagine someone being like, Oh my God,
like I couldn't imagine like going up to someone more senior
and being like like even like pulling them aside, even like
pushing them. But that's something you have to
like work up to I guess. It's something you have to work
up to, but it's just like you're in a meeting together and you
want to get better. You've already had a coffee chat
with this person. Like they know that you have an
interest in growing. You have like a growth mindset.
And then like, you know when everyone's packing up their
laptops and then everyone's leaving when the meeting's over.
Like you can't, you like you walk out of the meeting room
with someone by your side and you have small talk.
Yeah. So what would you say?
Pretend it's be. I'd be like, hey James, hey
Bert, I walk out. I'd be like, Hey, James.
How that way, Cherie? Hello.
This is based off of someone I know in the world, OK?
I'll be British. Hello there.
I'm like, hey, so do you have a second perhaps for you?
Well, in this meeting, I just wanted to grab your feedback
really quick. If you had a couple of thoughts
on how I presented myself, what I said and how you think I
could, you know, perhaps have more influence in the next
meeting. Like what do you think?
What's a thoughtful question? I will most definitely give you
feedback. Yeah, and and and, you know, if
James is running off to lunch or has another meeting, be like, no
stress. You don't have to answer this
now, but if you can jot down like three thoughts, like I'll
catch you later. Yeah.
OK. As as like a manager.
Yes. Thinking about it now as a
manager in a former like team leader.
I would be receptive to that. Yeah.
I'd be like, oh, wow, like what a thoughtful young person or
just like, what a thoughtful person who, like, actually
really wants to grow. I have some thoughts on it.
They're not fully formed. About communicating in the
workplace as a woman. Yeah, I think the like reality
of it. I feel like I'm like always the
one that's like the cold reality of the world.
The cold art truth. You don't.
Know what this world is like? Yeah, like you don't.
You don't. You don't even.
Know you're not ready for the truth, but God no.
But like I am, you know, I am like half a generation older
than Cherie. So I do think the reality of it
is that you may not necessarily to be in control of everything,
right? Like as a woman, like, you are
still existing in a broader context, and you exist in the
context. Of.
Coconut. You think you just fell out of a
coconut. Exactly.
I think what I'm trying to say is that it's helpful to also be
aware of how other people perceive you.
And it may not even be specific to you.
It may be like you as a category, right?
Like you as a 25 year old woman, how are you perceived?
You as a 30 year old, not single woman, how are you perceived
like? You know how there's been a lot
of discussion about the idea of the Manic Pixie Dream girl?
I feel like there's a version of it that carries over to the
workplace as well, where like when you are a certain age and
you act a certain way, you're kind of viewed as more of like
the ingenue. Like you're like new to the
world. Like you're new.
You're young enough that people don't perceive you as a threat.
And they don't take you seriously like you're, you're,
you're fresh out of school. Great.
You have all this fresh energy. Good job, right?
So that's like kind of, but also it's to your benefit, right?
Because if you go up and ask someone senior like, oh, can you
give me feedback, they will be fully honest with you and be
like trying to help you. Yeah.
As opposed to when you reach a certain point, when you're no
longer like viewed as the ingenue and you are like a
little bit more senior in your career, like those same tactics
may or may not go over the same way because then you kind of
start to be viewed as like competition.
Yeah, totally. So it's kind of like you get
some beginners like leeway. Yeah.
So that's just something that I've seen that I've myself and I
and my, like, fellow millennial women, I feel like we've like
been working our way through. And I don't really have an
answer to that, but it's just something that I can be like,
watch out for, like be aware of it and like understand how
you're being perceived by the people you interact with.
Totally, I think. I mean, I goes it's especially
we're talking on the context of women in the workplace, but I
think like men as well, especially maybe minority men as
well, like like are placed in some sort of like stereotype.
Yeah, I know one of my friends who worked in venture capital,
he was one of like the youngest partners at AVC firm amongst
like other people who are probably like 20 to 35 years
older than him. And then he had gotten married.
But then he, like, very specifically, like, wanted to
get married and have a ring to seem older than he actually was.
And he was very mature and like, But like, in that way, it's like
understanding your reputation and how do you manage it?
And then perhaps surprise people if, you know, they have a
stereotype of you and you completely break out of that in
a good way. Yeah.
And I do feel like that sort of benefit that men get in the
workplace of like, being married and like having kids.
Like just think about your own perception of like a man with
kids, like you're automatically like, Oh my God, he's a great,
he's a good person because he's a fun.
Like he's responsible. He is, you know, like thoughtful
etcetera. Versus like women don't get that
same sort of. Benefit of the doubt or like
immediate? Positive shift in perception?
I mean, if anything, it could be like the other way.
Oh, yeah. True, true.
That's so unfair. Yeah.
So I I don't know that that wasn't like a.
Fully, fully formed. Thought but it's like something
there's something there. Yeah.
I mean, so I guess the main take away is that like be aware of
what how you may be perceived for whether it's fair or not
like in the workplace. And many times, perception can
be reality. What?
You weren't You weren't ready for that truth.
Bomb, Yeah. So what do you think about
communication when it comes to dating and flirting?
Thoughts. Thoughts I.
Think OK, I think even the kind of like, precursor to explicit
communication is like your energy.
Because vibes. Yeah, because I feel like
something. Why are you laughing?
Communicating through energy. Well, more energy, more energy,
more energy, more passion, more passion, more passion.
No, but I just feel like for myself and my own experience, I
feel like in the last like few months, like something has
shifted in my energy, whereas like I'll be going back to the
same exact places and situations.
But now all of a sudden like people are like approaching me
and like people are like coming up to me and like speaking to
me, you know. Oh, I.
Love that. Yeah.
You're like more. You're more open, I think.
So you're like radiating. You're magnetic.
Or maybe I'm just not and wearing an engagement ring
anymore. That might be that.
That might be part of it. But no, I, I don't know.
I think it's not, it's not just that.
I think it's more like my energy has shifted.
Yeah. And also it's like both my
energy that I'm putting out, but then also like my energy within
myself. Whereas now I am like more like
aware of the world around me. I'm like almost like seeing the
world through like a different perspective.
I love that. I think it's energy that you put
out and then also the energy to receive as well.
So that like if. People come up to you and talk
to you. You're not going to be closed
off. Yeah, Yeah.
And I feel like for me, I'm like, very much like sometimes
I'm in like a state of like mind or energy where I'm like, nobody
better talk to me like I'm not here.
I do not wish to be. I do not.
Yes, exactly. Seriously.
Really. Yeah.
Whereas like you're different. Like you're.
Much and like perceive me everyone, you're more.
Like open all the time. It's about your energy.
So maybe it like kind of like starts there.
Yeah, I think. You can also perceive people's
energy too, before they even, like, open up their mouths like
you could. Yeah.
Before they speak. You're like, oh, do you have
like a positive? Like, are you smiling?
Are your eyes glistening with for the future in the world?
Do you? Glimmer, yeah.
Do you, Glimmer, do you shimmer? Like I, I really believe in
that, that energy. And you can feel it in someone
even if you're just like, interacting with them briefly.
Yeah. But then what about?
OK, energy aside, what are your thoughts?
You guys already know if you've seen the dating episode.
I've said it once and I'll say it again.
What? What'd you say?
I love the banta. Oh, OK, I love yeah, me too.
I think so in terms of communicating with like someone
romantically or dating, like I think it's really attractive.
Obviously when people are intelligent and I saw this from
a like a TikTok video. So if you guys know who it's
from, like definitely at them, but they're just like women in
general. This was a gross generalization,
but I agreed with it. Women are, at least myself, like
really are attracted to people who are intelligent.
And one way to demonstrate intelligence is through like
jokes and being funny. And if you can like engage in
like the witty humor, the banter, the banter, then like I
find that super attractive and it draws me in as well.
Totally. Like it demonstrates that.
It actually, it like demonstrates several things
because it demonstrates that you're smart enough to like,
pick up on and like make jokes in the moment, but also that you
have enough EQ deliver it in a way that's like funny.
And you're like, oh, this kind of joke will connect with this
person. Yeah.
And like, it's going to land. They have the context for this
like blah blah blah. Yeah, it's actually quite
complicated to be funny, I think in a in a good way.
Yeah, it's hard to be funny. It's hard to be funny because
then you have to like, know the other person and what they find
funny and understand what context they have for the jokes
that you're going to make. It's a is it a cultural
reference, a historic reference? It's like, you know, So yeah, I
think being funny, can someone fain humor or being funny?
It's hard. No, I don't think you can.
I think usually a joke will like fall flat and people can
immediately be like that was awkward.
Yeah. I mean, also, like, you like
leading with humor. Like if you are leading with
jokes, you can really, like, understand a person, like pretty
quickly. Like you can be like, oh, like
what kind of references are they picking up or not picking up?
Like what is their response to my like jokes in my banter?
Yeah, I think it also can if you're not like a naturally
funny person. I think two things that can
help. One watching like comedy shows
and like picking up on other comedians and figuring out what
do you find funny. And then the second thing is
also self deprecating jokes. Like when you're making jokes,
you never want to like punch down on someone.
You know, if someone that's what they say for like stand up
comedian, you want to like make fun of yourself and you can also
punch up as well. Yeah, or like you, first you can
like make fun of yourself and then you can make fun of someone
else. Yeah, I also, I like being
teased. I think being teased it's it can
be cute. What about the role of like
gossip or tea? Like where does that fall in how
to talk to anyone? I think it's an important part.
Like I think people who believe they're like self-righteous and
like, oh, I don't gossip. I don't, you know, especially
like harmless gossip. I don't gossip.
I think people who like claim to
be self-righteous in that sense. You're just kidding yourself and
you're honestly hurting yourself for making connections with
people. I think hurtful, harmful gossip,
like that's a different thing. But if it's like harmless gossip
and like just a little bit of T sipping can be fine, I think
like. Specifically outside of friend
groups, like on the topic of how to talk to anyone, like a little
bit of harmless gossip is a great way to like breakthrough
like 3 layers of like small talk to then like have like kind of
this like inside joke between the two of you.
Inside jokes also are so powerful.
I was like listening to something the other day on
TikTok where someone was like, oh, like one of the one of the
best hacks to like befriend someone.
It's to like make an inside joke with them right away.
And I was like, oh, yeah, I freaking love that.
Like, I love when people do that with me.
And I also enjoy doing that with other people because then you
have this like little like harmless little secret.
And there's like this little inside joke and it's like, so
like fun. Yeah.
But it's kind of like, I feel
like there's a kind of like a spectrum between like harmless
gossip and inside joke. It's like, can sometimes be like
one in the same. So it's a spectrum.
It's like A and then diagram or something like that, but like, I
don't know, One example is like I was at the gym and then I was
talking to one of the managers and I was like, oh, like I heard
this happen with like the CFO, which is like someone then I
have no idea. Like I've never met this man.
Like, you know, this guy like probably barely knows him and it
was just and he just all of a sudden he like, you know, broke
the 4th wall or like just like broke the actor who's like, Oh
my God, like yes, like this is what happened.
This is blah, blah, blah. And it's like totally harmless.
But it was it or it was great to like just like connect about
something and then now like every time we see each other,
we're like Tiki. Yeah, yeah, it's kind of it.
It builds relationships. Yeah, yeah.
It's the yeah, the power of normal gossip.
Next, we're going to talk about ways to invite people to talk to
you without having to talk to them or without having to
initiate. One of the great things that
Gene and I share is our love for fashion, and in this specific
instance, fashion and statement pieces as a conversation
starter. So if have you ever seen a
person who's just wearing something so freaking cool, it's
a cool blouse. A cool, a pair of jeans or shoes
and you're like, Oh my God, that's amazing.
Sometimes when I see these people walking down the street,
I will stop them and I'll be like, you look in fantastic and
like, where did you get that from?
And so I think if you can incorporate that into your life
and like there are things that you really enjoy that are like
specialty or statement pieces, it really does invite people in
to ask you about it. Yeah, I love a statement piece.
So like especially if you enjoy fashion, like I think that's
something to lean into because that's like a way that you can
express yourself and other people can perceive you and like
sort of like understand who you are without you even opening
your mouth, right? Like without even saying
anything. You're sort of like having a
conversation with them through the way that you choose to like
dress, especially if you have something that is more of a
statement or like more like noticeable or more like cute.
So that's like, that's kind of like informed sort of the way I
shop because I just like, also like, I love like statement
pieces. Like I love like a whimsical
like bag or like a really like unexpected detail or something
like that. Well, that's also why you do a
lot of shopping like abroad as well, because then like want to
commemorate your trip as like, but then like there's a story
behind like what you're wearing. And when people ask you about
it, Oh, my God, My biggest flex, and I am so annoying about this,
like, And I know it is that when I buy things in thrift stores or
consignment shops abroad, I am incredibly insufferable.
And for a good reason because it's so cool.
Yeah, that I got this, like, scarf from.
It was like, it's like a Van Gogh print on a scarf from a
thrift store in Australia and Sydney.
And I've gotten so many compliments on it because I wear
the scarf as a top and then, like, I tie it around on
different things. And people like, oh, my God, I
love your top. Like, where's it from?
And I'm like, yeah. Yeah, it's from A and it's also
like one-of-a-kind because it's from a thrift store.
I mean, I'm sure you can find it online, but who's going to find
it? It's.
Like, maybe you won't. Like, who knows who makes it
even? Yeah.
And then also like your vintage leather long jacket from Paris
The Don. Paris Thrift store in Paris at
17. Dollars also like for me like I
also like to buy like special purchases abroad because then
it's like a way to cover commemorate the trip and then
also. It's something that people can
ask you about and then you can tell them the story behind it
and then perhaps they'll purchase it or just like have a
conversation. Or even if they don't ask you,
it's not like they'll like be like, where did you get that?
They'll just be like, oh, like I like your bag.
You'd be like, Oh my God, thanks so much.
Like I got this like on a trip last year in Lisbon or something
like that, or like I got this in Barcelona.
And they'll and then like that's like you like responding to them
with like a little piece of information.
And then that's how you kind of like get into yes, conversation.
And then they're like, Oh my God, like if I was Barcelona or
like I was just there last year, like, blah, blah, blah, yes.
It's such a good conversation starter, yeah.
Especially if there's a story behind it that you care about.
They can sense that excitement that you bring into the
conversation. I think also part of it is that
like I, I genuinely love fashion and have like a true passion for
it. So like passion for fashion,
yeah. So like it whenever people do
ask me about it, like I'm really excited to talk about the topic.
So like maybe that's something that like either if it's not
like natural to you, you can like try it out like little by
little. Or maybe there's like other ways
to convey like things that you're passionate about in like
what you wear or like how you present yourself.
Like if you love golf, like you could be, I don't know, wear
like whatever you go golfing, like buy some of the memorabilia
and wear it and then we'll ask you about it.
Yes, like. Where if you go to Bandon Dunes,
like get a little sweater that's like Bandon Dunes like.
Totally. Or like one of my friend, my
classmates who goes to golf courses around the world, you
always get the little hat. Yeah.
That sent the golf course now. I love buying hats, right caps,
kind of for this reason, yeah, because then you can wear it and
then you can wear it. You can wear it the next time
you play golf in like a normal place, and then it'll strike up
conversation with people, especially if you're already on
the golf course where other people have similar interests to
you and you're like, Oh my God, you went there.
I went there, or I've always wanted to go there.
What like recommendations do you have?
Yes. Or even like, a lot of times
people if they go to like a hotel or something, they'll
like, buy a hat from the hotel. Really.
Yeah. Is that kind of cheesy?
Well, it depends on like the hotel, like people will do it
for like Amangani or like Amangiri or?
People do that for like rest, like the restaurant and not
restaurants, but like dive bars, you know, that's a good.
Yes, yeah. Like something that you like
associate yourself with or like an experience that you had.
And then like other people, I don't know, it's like social
signaling, right? Like.
It's like when I went to the apprais at Shammies in Palisades
Tahoe. You better believe I got a
Shammies hat and I wear it around, you know, if you know,
you know. Shamwa Shamwa, the other part of
the memorabilia that you pick up at Different.
Places. Is that it?
Also kind of as a way of signal signaling to people what sort of
groups you belong to or like what sort of common interests
you may have. So like, why do people buy so
much gear from their undergrad or from their grad schools?
Like why does Sheree have like 50 pieces of Stanford clothing?
It's because one, she's obsessed with Stanford.
I love Stanford and also she has tons of stuff from Barnard in
Columbia too. So she just like obviously she
just like loves it. She's passionate about it, but
like also it's like subconsciously a way of being
like, hey, like this is part of my identity and then you.
Can see it right away when you see me.
And that's also a conversation starter, too, especially if
you're an alum or you'd, you know, you live in Palo Alto or
you're in from the surrounding area.
Like I'm when I'm wearing like a Stanford sweatshirt, like people
can see it. And if they bring it up, I'm
like, obviously I'm going to talk to you about it.
Yeah. You're like you wanted to Zimmer
in Me too. Me too.
What year are you? Oh my God, I was stammered.
Well, I. I'm not a lot of now or if you
go to a concert. That's why people love buying
concert. Anne Marabelia Yeah.
Because it shows you the music that you're into and then you
actually went to the concert. Yeah.
So yeah, there's lots of ways, even if you're not like obsessed
with fashion, like us, to kind of like express who you.
Are without words and then have people come to you.
How to talk to anyone? Yeah, start a conversation with
no words. How to start a conversation
without saying a single word? It's the energy.
Thank you guys so much for tuning in to this episode of
Tiger Sisters. Hope this was helpful.
There's some topics that you know could be discussed further.
They're open discussion, yes. And so Please remember to like,
comment and subscribe. And we would so appreciate it if
you could share this video with someone who might find it
helpful. We'll see you next time.
Thanks. Bye.