1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:02,640 You've seen all those. Let them Tik Toks, Let them 2 00:00:02,640 --> 00:00:05,720 this, let them that. But is Mel Robin secretly just 3 00:00:05,720 --> 00:00:08,640 selling us a bogus reason to ignore all of our problems? 4 00:00:09,040 --> 00:00:13,240 Hold up the rule works until it doesn't, like when you're the 5 00:00:13,240 --> 00:00:16,160 intern and your reputation is on the line or you're the only 6 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:19,400 woman in the boardroom. If you don't apply the let them 7 00:00:19,400 --> 00:00:23,160 theory correctly, it can tank your love life or your career. 8 00:00:23,560 --> 00:00:25,800 I'm. Cherie, I'm Jean and. 9 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:29,160 We're the Tiger sisters. We are your Wall Street and 10 00:00:29,160 --> 00:00:32,840 Silicon Valley Big Sisters. And we're a top ten business 11 00:00:32,840 --> 00:00:36,960 podcast on Spotify where we talk about money, power and love. 12 00:00:49,760 --> 00:00:52,160 In this episode, we're going to tell you exactly what the Let 13 00:00:52,160 --> 00:00:53,960 Them theory is and how to use it. 14 00:00:53,960 --> 00:00:56,240 We're going to define it and we're going to use case studies 15 00:00:56,400 --> 00:00:58,560 just like we did at Harvard Business School and Stanford 16 00:00:58,560 --> 00:01:00,800 Business School and some mini exercises. 17 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:04,000 Then we're going to give you the upgraded version, which is let 18 00:01:04,000 --> 00:01:05,920 me. So it's Let them and let me. 19 00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:08,320 And then finally, we're going to do a takedown where we talk 20 00:01:08,320 --> 00:01:10,680 about all the places where Let Them doesn't work. 21 00:01:11,200 --> 00:01:14,000 So if you've ever implemented the Let Them theory and then 22 00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:17,560 still felt screwed or unsure about yourself, stay for our 23 00:01:17,560 --> 00:01:20,480 playbook throughout this episode and we'll get into it right 24 00:01:20,480 --> 00:01:23,400 after this break. This episode of Tiger Sisters is 25 00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:24,720 brought to you by. Read AI. 26 00:01:24,880 --> 00:01:27,200 Yes, and it's not just another note taker. 27 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:32,360 It's like an AI copilot that can read, transcribe and summarize 28 00:01:32,360 --> 00:01:35,880 your meeting notes. It reads the energy and vibe of 29 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:38,920 your meetings to give you the next smart steps. 30 00:01:39,200 --> 00:01:41,680 I'm obsessed because it's like having a chief staff that 31 00:01:41,680 --> 00:01:44,800 manages your inbox, your work meetings, basically your entire 32 00:01:44,800 --> 00:01:46,840 work life. Yeah, last week I missed a 33 00:01:46,840 --> 00:01:50,320 meeting and I was able to type. What did I miss And read AI was 34 00:01:50,320 --> 00:01:53,840 able to give me the top takeaways, the key points, and 35 00:01:53,840 --> 00:01:56,160 also the sentiment. It was kind of like magic. 36 00:01:56,360 --> 00:02:01,040 And it works across Gmail, Teams, Notion, Salesforce, Zoom, 37 00:02:01,080 --> 00:02:02,920 basically wherever you do your work. 38 00:02:03,480 --> 00:02:06,160 And you know me, I never give apps access to my Gmail because 39 00:02:06,160 --> 00:02:08,600 that's super private. But I actually made an exception 40 00:02:08,600 --> 00:02:12,240 for Read AI because I personally know the founder, David Shim, 41 00:02:12,400 --> 00:02:14,320 because we used to work together at Snapchat. 42 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:17,480 And you guys might remember we actually interviewed David Shim 43 00:02:17,480 --> 00:02:20,240 on Season 3 of Tiger Sisters when he was talking about his 44 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:22,200 new startup, which is actually Read AI. 45 00:02:22,440 --> 00:02:25,400 And now Reid has over 4 million users. 46 00:02:25,480 --> 00:02:28,800 Wow, wow. And they're giving Tiger Sisters 47 00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:33,760 listeners a 30 day enterprise trial, which is worth $30 and 48 00:02:33,960 --> 00:02:36,240 that does not require a credit card to sign up. 49 00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:39,120 We don't know how long this 30 day free offer is going to last, 50 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:41,600 so if you're at all curious, try it right now. 51 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:46,080 Go to www.read.aislashtigersisters for 52 00:02:46,080 --> 00:02:49,160 a free 30 day extended trial and you don't need to put in your 53 00:02:49,160 --> 00:02:51,240 credit card. Sign up through our link because 54 00:02:51,240 --> 00:02:52,400 then they'll know that we sent you. 55 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:55,240 We're obsessed with Read AI and we think you're going to love it 56 00:02:55,240 --> 00:02:57,280 too. And we're back. 57 00:02:57,440 --> 00:03:00,760 First, we're going to quickly define the Let Them theory. 58 00:03:01,240 --> 00:03:04,960 So the Let Them theory states that you should let people do, 59 00:03:04,960 --> 00:03:08,720 believe, behave, think whatever they want instead of using your 60 00:03:08,720 --> 00:03:11,320 own energy to manage their decisions. 61 00:03:11,600 --> 00:03:14,160 Yeah, and this theory has gone totally viral. 62 00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:16,960 It is everywhere. There's so many like funny memes 63 00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:21,720 about it where people are like oh this dog like pooped in my 64 00:03:21,720 --> 00:03:24,400 yard or like this dog shit on my driveway. 65 00:03:24,480 --> 00:03:27,240 Like let them. Yeah, it's almost a meme at this 66 00:03:27,240 --> 00:03:28,840 point where like it's gone so far. 67 00:03:28,880 --> 00:03:31,400 You're like how do I even apply the let them theory? 68 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:33,640 Yeah, there's so many good jokes about it. 69 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:37,520 So Mel Robbins made the Let Them theory popular and basically 70 00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:41,040 what it's stating is that it is the emotional labor tax. 71 00:03:42,360 --> 00:03:46,040 Studies show that monitoring other people's feelings raises 72 00:03:46,040 --> 00:03:49,480 your own stress and cortisol by almost 30%. 73 00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:53,840 Oh damn, that's so me. So what the Let Them theory does 74 00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:56,880 is it interrupts this rumination loop where you're constantly 75 00:03:56,880 --> 00:03:59,640 like spiraling, thinking about the other person, how they're 76 00:03:59,640 --> 00:04:01,640 feeling and managing what they're feeling. 77 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:05,440 And then it frees up your own time so that you take control of 78 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:08,760 your own life. It's kind of like a radical sort 79 00:04:08,760 --> 00:04:13,080 of concept because it's like radically letting go in a way 80 00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:16,560 where you're just like, not my problem. 81 00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:19,920 Like this thing that you've been thinking about for so long and 82 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:23,840 is driving you crazy. It's like you just put it in 83 00:04:23,840 --> 00:04:25,760 this box and throw it away and you're like, let them. 84 00:04:25,840 --> 00:04:27,480 Yeah. I think that's why it's like 85 00:04:27,520 --> 00:04:33,720 been very so popular and so powerful, because it's dramatic, 86 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:36,560 it's radical, it really. Is and there's examples of 87 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:39,960 people doing this both in the workplace, in business, and 88 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:42,160 we'll get into one of those examples shortly. 89 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:44,680 And also we're gonna bring in personal examples throughout 90 00:04:44,680 --> 00:04:48,080 this episode where we talk about where this theory has worked and 91 00:04:48,320 --> 00:04:50,000 also has not worked in our own lives. 92 00:04:50,320 --> 00:04:53,360 So Gene, could you tell us a more business case study of 93 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:55,120 where this has worked? Yeah. 94 00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:57,320 So one of the business case studies I like the most where 95 00:04:57,320 --> 00:05:00,040 this worked is about Satya Nadella. 96 00:05:00,040 --> 00:05:03,800 So he is the current CEO of Microsoft, and he's the third 97 00:05:03,840 --> 00:05:06,960 ever CEO of Microsoft. And he actually came in after 98 00:05:06,960 --> 00:05:10,000 the second CEO, who was named Steve Ballmer, who was like 99 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:13,640 famously hard charging and had a very big, like, cult of 100 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:17,320 personality around him and was like, very like hardcore. 101 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:21,680 Brash and loud, he like created a very like bro Y culture. 102 00:05:21,840 --> 00:05:23,840 Sure. There's a lot of memes around 103 00:05:23,840 --> 00:05:25,120 Steve Ballmer as well. There's a. 104 00:05:25,120 --> 00:05:26,280 Lot. He's part of the lore. 105 00:05:27,280 --> 00:05:30,320 And then Satya Nadella came in from like the totally opposite 106 00:05:30,320 --> 00:05:34,520 position where he had this very sort of like empathy first 107 00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:37,320 leadership approach. And he even sort of instilled 108 00:05:37,320 --> 00:05:40,800 that approach throughout the entire company and built it into 109 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:42,760 the culture. And a lot of analysts and 110 00:05:42,760 --> 00:05:46,280 employees were sort of like making fun of him for this 111 00:05:46,280 --> 00:05:48,040 because they were so used to the Ballmer approach. 112 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:49,880 And they're like, he's not intense. 113 00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:52,280 He's not like the leader we're used to, you know, he's like 114 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:57,360 kind of soft. So what Satya did was he said 115 00:05:57,440 --> 00:06:00,160 let them and he. Let them criticize. 116 00:06:00,160 --> 00:06:03,360 Let them criticize. He went with his mobile first 117 00:06:03,360 --> 00:06:06,960 cloud first strategy for the business and his empathy first 118 00:06:06,960 --> 00:06:09,520 leadership. And he built the company from a 119 00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:14,600 $300 million company in 2014 to now over a $3 trillion market 120 00:06:14,600 --> 00:06:16,680 cap company, which is unheard of. 121 00:06:17,680 --> 00:06:21,600 And now Satya is constantly cited in Business School studies 122 00:06:21,760 --> 00:06:25,160 for his quiet confidence and his culture. 123 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:28,280 Turn around at Microsoft. And briefly, you were an 124 00:06:28,280 --> 00:06:30,280 employee of Satya Nadella, weren't you? 125 00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:34,880 More than briefly girl I worked at, I worked at LinkedIn, which 126 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:37,480 was owned by Microsoft for almost five years. 127 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:40,800 And what was the the lore? Were you one of these employees 128 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:43,440 that criticized him for being soft? 129 00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:47,000 No, because I wasn't there. I didn't know Steve Ballmer like 130 00:06:47,880 --> 00:06:50,200 Steve Ballmer's way of running the show. 131 00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:53,680 I was, I was only knew Satya's way of doing it. 132 00:06:53,800 --> 00:06:57,520 But it was interesting because the company is very kind, 133 00:06:57,520 --> 00:07:00,920 compassionate and like prioritizes like the well-being 134 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:03,360 of others, like employees and stuff. 135 00:07:03,360 --> 00:07:06,520 So like, it definitely was felt during my time there. 136 00:07:06,800 --> 00:07:08,480 Yeah, and that's why I love of this example. 137 00:07:08,480 --> 00:07:11,080 It's because you see Satya saying let them doubt me, let 138 00:07:11,080 --> 00:07:15,680 them criticize me, and then let me build a $3 trillion company. 139 00:07:15,720 --> 00:07:17,880 Hell yeah. You go, Satya. 140 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:20,240 You make that Microsoft stock price go up. 141 00:07:20,400 --> 00:07:22,720 We're so proud of you, baby. Keep going. 142 00:07:23,560 --> 00:07:25,520 Sheree has a vested, may or may not have a vested. 143 00:07:25,520 --> 00:07:27,280 Interest, Yeah. Do I need to disclose that? 144 00:07:27,280 --> 00:07:30,040 Obviously I don't think you miss you in Microsoft. 145 00:07:30,040 --> 00:07:31,960 So this is. Not We're not pitching the. 146 00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:33,800 Stock. I don't know, just you know, 147 00:07:34,840 --> 00:07:37,320 know that I am a big fan of Microsoft for many reasons. 148 00:07:39,440 --> 00:07:43,600 OK, so Cherie, why don't we talk about, do you have like a 149 00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:47,080 personal anecdote or your personal experience with let 150 00:07:47,080 --> 00:07:48,680 them? Yeah, I do. 151 00:07:48,680 --> 00:07:52,120 And this is pretty recent, so it's like very much on my mind. 152 00:07:53,080 --> 00:07:55,920 It's about a friendship that I had. 153 00:07:55,920 --> 00:08:01,480 And I'm using the past tense because let them, let them. 154 00:08:02,800 --> 00:08:05,480 And it's actually like, we're kind of joking about it now, but 155 00:08:05,480 --> 00:08:08,240 it's like a very painful thing that's happened because Gina and 156 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:11,200 I have talked about friendship breakups and how they're like 157 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:14,160 potentially even worse than like, romantic breakups. 158 00:08:14,440 --> 00:08:16,360 But I had this very close girlfriend. 159 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:19,080 And for the sake of anonymity, we will call her Sam. 160 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:25,800 But we were very, very close. And I always felt that I had put 161 00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:30,520 more time in the relationship with her and effort in reaching 162 00:08:30,520 --> 00:08:32,640 out. So like whenever like I would 163 00:08:32,640 --> 00:08:36,240 reach out to her for plans for brunch and like, you know, check 164 00:08:36,240 --> 00:08:40,200 up on her and whenever that would happen, like, and we 165 00:08:40,200 --> 00:08:42,039 actually met up in person, it was amazing. 166 00:08:42,159 --> 00:08:45,040 But she never really took the effort or reciprocated the 167 00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:47,840 effort to like, reach out to me in any way. 168 00:08:47,880 --> 00:08:49,200 And that's important to you and that's. 169 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:51,760 Like the reciprocal nature of a relationship and like the 170 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:54,640 respect for each other in a relationship is super important 171 00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:55,640 to me. And I didn't feel like I was 172 00:08:55,640 --> 00:08:59,000 getting that from her. And she totally knows that too. 173 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:01,160 Because whenever like I would bring it up to her, she'd be 174 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:03,600 like, Oh my God, I'm so sorry. Even actually without me 175 00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:06,120 prompting, she would be like, it's been so long since we've 176 00:09:06,120 --> 00:09:07,280 talked. I know it's my fault. 177 00:09:07,280 --> 00:09:09,880 It's like I'm so busy. And it's not just with me. 178 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:13,040 She's with, she's like this with so many people in her life. 179 00:09:14,080 --> 00:09:16,240 And like, you know, we've talked like me and other people have 180 00:09:16,240 --> 00:09:18,320 talked about, like how she's not good at keeping up. 181 00:09:18,320 --> 00:09:19,840 Well, it's good you didn't take it personally. 182 00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:23,200 I mean, I kind of do take it personally when I see her in 183 00:09:23,200 --> 00:09:25,760 person, it feels great. But then like in the in between 184 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:27,920 moments she's like kind of, she's like ghosts. 185 00:09:28,120 --> 00:09:29,440 Like I'll be like, hey, how are you? 186 00:09:29,440 --> 00:09:30,760 Check in on her? And like, I won't hear a 187 00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:32,560 response. And I'll like text her again the 188 00:09:32,560 --> 00:09:34,840 next week and then like, you know, 3 texts and she'll be 189 00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:36,200 like, Oh my God, I'm so busy with work. 190 00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:37,880 It's like been like that for years. 191 00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:39,720 Yeah, so. It was really frustrating 192 00:09:39,720 --> 00:09:42,160 because I have so much love for this woman in my heart. 193 00:09:42,160 --> 00:09:44,240 Last year. What happened is like we got on 194 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:48,040 the phone for after a long period of time and since like 195 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:51,720 I'm usually the one scheduling like our phone catch UPS or like 196 00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:54,520 Hangouts or whatever. Like we were on the phone and I 197 00:09:54,520 --> 00:09:57,880 was basically like, hey, like this relationship is super 198 00:09:57,880 --> 00:10:02,040 meaningful to me and I would love, like for you to be like 199 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:06,120 more available and proactive in our friendship. 200 00:10:06,160 --> 00:10:09,160 So I, I arranged this call, like you can arrange the next call 201 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:11,440 for us to catch up. And she's like, Oh my God, I 202 00:10:11,440 --> 00:10:13,760 totally will. Like, yeah, I'll, I'm like so 203 00:10:13,760 --> 00:10:15,680 excited to hear you say that because like, I know I've been 204 00:10:15,680 --> 00:10:18,640 like so Mia and missing, but like, yes, I'll arrange the next 205 00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:20,200 call and I'm like, OK, that's perfect. 206 00:10:20,560 --> 00:10:23,080 You know, a month goes by and she like texts me. 207 00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:24,480 She's like, hey, let's catch up this week. 208 00:10:24,480 --> 00:10:26,000 And I'm like, great, what time are you free? 209 00:10:26,000 --> 00:10:28,000 And I text her back. Nothing. 210 00:10:28,760 --> 00:10:34,320 And that was a year ago, but. Sorry, but that was just like a 211 00:10:34,320 --> 00:10:38,360 dramatic That was a year ago. But like. 212 00:10:39,520 --> 00:10:42,040 It was the dramatic reveal. I'm and that was a year ago, 213 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:44,120 right? And so, so she I was just like, 214 00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:45,920 yeah, what time are you free? And she just never responded 215 00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:46,680 then. But then she. 216 00:10:46,680 --> 00:10:50,080 Hasn't been free. God forbid a girl have a busy 217 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:53,640 schedule for one full year and not be able to schedule a catch 218 00:10:53,640 --> 00:10:56,640 up call with you. God forbid, God forbid for the 219 00:10:56,640 --> 00:10:58,680 last like decade we've known each other. 220 00:10:58,920 --> 00:11:02,040 This type of behavior would frustrate me, but over the last 221 00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:05,600 year, I've really embrace the let them theory to be like, if 222 00:11:05,600 --> 00:11:08,920 she wanted to, she would. And she's A and like she's a 223 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:12,280 very competent woman. She's like a boss in her own 224 00:11:12,280 --> 00:11:15,800 right with work and like her schedule and everything. 225 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:18,920 Like she's not like a la Dee da person. 226 00:11:18,920 --> 00:11:21,120 She's like a very competent lady. 227 00:11:21,160 --> 00:11:22,640 And I have a lot of respect for her in that way. 228 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:25,880 But you know, it's just like, OK, I gave her this option and 229 00:11:25,880 --> 00:11:30,160 she could do it. I'm tired of doing it myself and 230 00:11:30,440 --> 00:11:32,040 it didn't happen. So like, let them. 231 00:11:33,800 --> 00:11:39,320 Your girl was tired. I'm exhausted for for being an 232 00:11:39,320 --> 00:11:44,600 emotional crutch for people who do not return that to me when I 233 00:11:44,600 --> 00:11:45,800 feel like I give so much to them. 234 00:11:46,240 --> 00:11:49,280 Yeah, yeah. So you've been using let them 235 00:11:49,280 --> 00:11:52,040 for a while now? Specifically with this one 236 00:11:52,040 --> 00:11:55,040 instance, I was like, I feel like I've put in a lot of effort 237 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:58,960 and here is one way you can show me to put in effort, Sam. 238 00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:02,000 And if you do, we can continue to have a relationship. 239 00:12:02,000 --> 00:12:04,680 But if not, like this is kind of where I draw the line. 240 00:12:04,680 --> 00:12:07,000 And if she next week was just like, hey, let's schedule a 241 00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:09,440 call, I'd be more than happy to be on the phone with her. 242 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:14,560 But it just hasn't happened and she said she would do it. 243 00:12:14,800 --> 00:12:16,840 Well, it's actually interesting. We're going to talk about this 244 00:12:16,840 --> 00:12:19,680 later in the episode where we talk about all the places where 245 00:12:19,680 --> 00:12:22,480 let them kind of fails. But you actually took an extra 246 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:24,240 step. You didn't just say let them. 247 00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:29,000 You communicated to her like what your sort of needs and 248 00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:32,040 expectations were in order to continue the relationship in a 249 00:12:32,040 --> 00:12:35,040 healthy way. And you sort of like gave her 250 00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:38,560 this sort of opportunity on a silver platter, right? 251 00:12:38,560 --> 00:12:41,600 And she didn't take it. So you didn't just do let them. 252 00:12:41,920 --> 00:12:43,520 Let them was like the beginning of. 253 00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:46,480 Your That's fair, but it. I think it helped you because it 254 00:12:46,560 --> 00:12:51,880 allowed you to like, let go of. Responsibility, Yeah, yeah. 255 00:12:51,880 --> 00:12:54,800 After I've been, like, holding the responsibility for the 256 00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:59,400 friendship on my own for like a decade, I felt like it actually 257 00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:03,440 is so freeing because I'm like, I didn't ask for her to do much. 258 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:04,720 I'm just like, schedule the next call. 259 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:07,720 And she almost got there. You know, she did reach out 260 00:13:07,720 --> 00:13:09,480 after a month and be like, hey, let's talk. 261 00:13:09,680 --> 00:13:11,200 And then I'd be like, what times are you available? 262 00:13:11,200 --> 00:13:12,680 And then, like, nothing came. Like, nothing. 263 00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:14,680 Yeah. I mean, maybe she doesn't want 264 00:13:14,680 --> 00:13:19,240 to be friends. Anymore maybe I mean she's 265 00:13:19,240 --> 00:13:23,240 gotten her wish like we we haven't communicated yeah so 266 00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:26,760 yeah that's one way to ditch a friendship just ghost great 267 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:29,120 that's very emotionally mature happy for. 268 00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:30,120 Her. Is that OK with you? 269 00:13:31,000 --> 00:13:34,760 I mean clearly not have a conversation. 270 00:13:35,720 --> 00:13:39,040 Some people are avoidant. We'll talk about more of that in 271 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:44,120 this episode of the problematic avoidance nature of the Let Them 272 00:13:44,120 --> 00:13:45,360 Theory. But yeah, some people are 273 00:13:45,360 --> 00:13:48,840 avoidant. And I honestly just feel sad for 274 00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:50,800 her. I'm a very good friend. 275 00:13:50,960 --> 00:13:54,600 Sometimes I'm avoidant. What are you avoiding? 276 00:13:54,960 --> 00:13:57,120 No, just in general. Sometimes I can have. 277 00:13:57,440 --> 00:13:59,880 I'm like conflict avoidant more so than you. 278 00:14:00,360 --> 00:14:06,400 Yeah, I'm pretty fiery nowadays. I bring things up. 279 00:14:06,760 --> 00:14:10,680 I'm more likely to just do the first part of what you did, 280 00:14:10,680 --> 00:14:13,800 which is just the like, let them and kind of like let someone's 281 00:14:13,800 --> 00:14:17,640 actions speak for themselves without prompting them so 282 00:14:17,640 --> 00:14:21,440 explicitly and being like, well, if you wanna continue this 283 00:14:21,440 --> 00:14:23,160 friendship, like you can do this. 284 00:14:23,440 --> 00:14:26,080 It depends though she and I have been friends for a decade. 285 00:14:26,200 --> 00:14:28,600 I have to say something to her to be like. 286 00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:30,560 And it wasn't like a harsh conversation. 287 00:14:30,560 --> 00:14:34,040 I was just like, I really love our friendship and really 288 00:14:34,040 --> 00:14:38,120 respect you as a person, but like, I like want to see more 289 00:14:38,120 --> 00:14:40,800 effort from you, like in our relationship because it means a 290 00:14:40,800 --> 00:14:43,280 lot to me. You know, it wasn't like me like 291 00:14:43,280 --> 00:14:44,840 yelling at her. Like I literally talked to her 292 00:14:44,840 --> 00:14:46,560 and she was very understanding on the phone. 293 00:14:46,560 --> 00:14:47,920 She's like, I completely understand. 294 00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:49,560 I'm so happy to hear you say that. 295 00:14:49,560 --> 00:14:52,840 Like I feel the exact same way. Like, let me, she's like, let me 296 00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:54,920 schedule the next call. Like you're totally right. 297 00:14:56,880 --> 00:14:59,320 Hello. Am I being bamboozled? 298 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:01,120 To me, that sounds like pandering. 299 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:04,400 Maybe. I think she was just saying what 300 00:15:04,400 --> 00:15:07,280 you wanted to hear so that like, she didn't have to engage in 301 00:15:07,280 --> 00:15:09,600 conflict on the call. Probably. 302 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:13,680 I mean, there was no conflict. No, because she said exactly 303 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:15,600 what she knew you wanted to hear. 304 00:15:15,600 --> 00:15:17,680 Yeah. She didn't want to engage in 305 00:15:17,680 --> 00:15:18,840 conflict. I see. 306 00:15:18,880 --> 00:15:22,240 As someone who can have avoidant tendencies, that's like me sort 307 00:15:22,240 --> 00:15:26,080 of assessing from an avoidant perspective. 308 00:15:26,200 --> 00:15:29,480 Yeah. If Sam isn't is indeed avoidant? 309 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:35,160 Well, I think that's a great example because we see like. 310 00:15:35,280 --> 00:15:37,520 I mean, I haven't thought about her for the last like year 311 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:39,440 because of that. Which is great. 312 00:15:39,440 --> 00:15:41,400 So let them work. Because it like freed up my 313 00:15:41,400 --> 00:15:44,160 mental space. I have another example but it 314 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:51,000 gets a little bit more personal. Should we move on very quickly? 315 00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:54,880 It's with my ex. K. 316 00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:58,280 So a lot in theory works. I did the exact same thing with 317 00:15:58,280 --> 00:16:00,880 my ex-boyfriend who wanted to get back together. 318 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:06,280 And basically I was like pretty fed up after like being proposed 319 00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:09,040 to get back together with. But anyways, he wanted to get 320 00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:10,920 back together. I don't know if I'm gonna keep 321 00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:16,560 this in the final cut, but I like gave him kind of a plan. 322 00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:19,600 I'm like, if you wanna get back together, these are the things 323 00:16:19,600 --> 00:16:21,400 that need to happen. You're like, here's your. 324 00:16:21,400 --> 00:16:24,240 Performance improvement plan. Yeah, here. 325 00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:28,360 Are the three pillars in which your behavior was. 326 00:16:28,520 --> 00:16:32,240 Unaccepting the bar yeah. And I'm like, and it wasn't like 327 00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:35,680 I was completely shut out of like, I don't want to get back 328 00:16:35,680 --> 00:16:37,400 together. I'm like, OK, I'm open to the 329 00:16:37,400 --> 00:16:42,360 idea, but let them like let them show you like what their true 330 00:16:42,360 --> 00:16:44,160 behavior is after. I was just like, I need these 331 00:16:44,160 --> 00:16:47,160 things from you to like know that you're committed after we 332 00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:50,200 broke up the first time. And I like literally laid out 333 00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:51,600 like these are the things you can do. 334 00:16:51,880 --> 00:16:55,320 And you can brainstorm some things that you could do on your 335 00:16:55,320 --> 00:16:57,600 own to then like bring us together. 336 00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:00,840 And like let them. But he like wasn't willing to do 337 00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:04,920 those things and wasn't even willing to like brainstorm. 338 00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:09,599 So I was just like, you let them like show me who you are. 339 00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:14,079 Some people have no creativity. It's not that hard. 340 00:17:14,079 --> 00:17:16,200 I even was just like use ChatGPT. 341 00:17:16,599 --> 00:17:20,960 He he was like I did. You're like I. 342 00:17:21,319 --> 00:17:23,800 Use AII. Was like, brainstorm things that 343 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:25,200 you could do. You're like to show me you're 344 00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:29,720 committed your group chats. Yeah, anyways, let them. 345 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:34,160 So that's yeah, that's three great examples. 346 00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:38,600 You got Satya Nadella, the CEO of Microsoft, Cherie's former 347 00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:43,240 friend Sam, and then Cherie's ex-boyfriend Sam too. 348 00:17:45,160 --> 00:17:46,640 But yeah, I mean, that's that's great. 349 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:49,520 We're really showing that it can be, it can be applied across all 350 00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:54,320 different areas of career, friendship and love life. 351 00:17:54,560 --> 00:17:59,600 Yeah, and I love like you. You were so perceptive because 352 00:17:59,600 --> 00:18:01,520 you're right. I did the let them theory plus 353 00:18:01,520 --> 00:18:05,080 some more because I gave people like an action item that's 354 00:18:05,120 --> 00:18:07,560 really not that friggin hard. Like I do these things all the 355 00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:10,800 time but like I gave people an action item to see if they can 356 00:18:11,120 --> 00:18:14,120 like meet me where I am. Well, you think it's not hard 357 00:18:14,120 --> 00:18:16,160 because it's something that you naturally do. 358 00:18:16,280 --> 00:18:19,480 It's not something that they naturally do, so it's hard for 359 00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:23,200 them. That is true and that is 360 00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:25,240 unacceptable to me in my friendship and my. 361 00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:27,520 Relationship, I mean like you want to be friends with and 362 00:18:27,520 --> 00:18:32,400 interact with people and, and have like romantic relationships 363 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:35,880 with people who are on your level, who are sort of like 364 00:18:35,880 --> 00:18:39,320 naturally doing the things that you're doing for them because 365 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:42,120 you want some reciprocity in these exact areas. 366 00:18:42,120 --> 00:18:46,640 Exactly and. Sometimes for them, it's just 367 00:18:47,120 --> 00:18:48,800 really, really hard. Yeah. 368 00:18:48,880 --> 00:18:52,200 I feel like that's kind of was the case in the person I was 369 00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:54,200 most recently dating that you were. 370 00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:57,840 Dating yeah, like. I could tell he was trying so 371 00:18:57,840 --> 00:19:01,200 hard, like I knew he really he. Was at his wit's end. 372 00:19:01,640 --> 00:19:03,920 He was at his limit. Like I knew he really, really, 373 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:07,400 really liked me and like you saw like he was trying so hard all 374 00:19:07,400 --> 00:19:10,720 the time, but it wasn't sustainable for him. 375 00:19:11,440 --> 00:19:13,520 He was perceptive enough and tried hard enough to like, 376 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:17,400 figure out all the things that I wanted and like what my sort of 377 00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:23,120 needs and wands were, and he was able to do it, but he just 378 00:19:23,120 --> 00:19:26,640 couldn't do. He's just not really capable in 379 00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:30,880 this moment in time of like doing it for life. 380 00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:44,360 Yeah, let them. OK, well, OK, now on to let me, 381 00:19:44,360 --> 00:19:46,000 we'll, we'll try to run through this quickly. 382 00:19:46,720 --> 00:19:49,240 Quick pause, Tiger fam. This is Cherie and we just 383 00:19:49,240 --> 00:19:51,240 dropped a brand new listener survey. 384 00:19:51,480 --> 00:19:54,080 It's different from the audience survey that you hopefully 385 00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:57,040 already filled out. It's 10 quick questions and two 386 00:19:57,040 --> 00:19:59,880 minutes Max. Your support keeps the episodes 387 00:19:59,880 --> 00:20:02,400 free and publishing weekly. Why? 388 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:05,800 Because your answers tell future sponsors that Tiger Sisters is a 389 00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:09,120 show worth investing in. That means better partners, 390 00:20:09,120 --> 00:20:12,680 stronger episodes, and no random ads you don't care about. 391 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:15,760 Tap the listener survey link in the description right after this 392 00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:17,760 episode. Talk it out and help us keep 393 00:20:17,760 --> 00:20:20,480 building a podcast that feels made for you. 394 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:23,680 Thank you from the bottom of our hearts for being the best part 395 00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:25,920 of Tiger Sisters. Now back to the show. 396 00:20:26,520 --> 00:20:29,520 OK, Now really quickly, we're going to run through Part 2, 397 00:20:29,520 --> 00:20:31,680 which is called Let me. And this is essentially the 398 00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:34,280 upgrade to Let them. This is the part of the let them 399 00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:37,920 theory that people don't talk about but is pretty important. 400 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:41,080 Yeah, if not more important than the first part, honestly. 401 00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:42,840 I guess people need to do a step. 402 00:20:42,840 --> 00:20:43,800 One. Yeah, true. 403 00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:45,280 Step one. This is Step 2. 404 00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:48,280 Yeah. So Step 2 let me is that after 405 00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:51,640 you've done the let them part of letting go and allowing people 406 00:20:51,640 --> 00:20:53,880 to take responsibility for their own actions instead of holding 407 00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:58,200 it in yourself, Let me is that now, once you have all that 408 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:02,000 freed up space, both mentally, emotionally, spiritually, you 409 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:06,240 want to actually proactively replace it with something that 410 00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:10,080 you're going to do. And the reason is, is because 411 00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:14,560 psychologically, our bodies are kind of and our minds are 412 00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:18,080 neurologically looking for something to replace an empty 413 00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:20,160 space. And a lot of times, like in this 414 00:21:20,160 --> 00:21:22,960 day and age, the natural thing to do is to fill it with 415 00:21:22,960 --> 00:21:26,840 something mindless like scrolling on TikTok or, I don't 416 00:21:26,840 --> 00:21:28,480 know, Twitter, like, whatever your vice. 417 00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:31,480 And that's why you need to proactively pick something that 418 00:21:31,480 --> 00:21:34,600 you're going to be replacing all of that time that you were 419 00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:38,120 spending on the thing that you were obsessing over before you 420 00:21:38,120 --> 00:21:41,720 use the Lethem theory. Yeah, and scientists say that 421 00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:46,600 your brain hates vacuums or your brain and your body, they don't 422 00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:49,440 like voids. So like, when you honestly like 423 00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:53,240 free up mental space from using the Lethem theory, it is so 424 00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:56,840 important that then you reassign that attention to something 425 00:21:56,840 --> 00:22:00,600 positive in your life so that you know, you're not just kind 426 00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:03,800 of like, you know, like you said, doom scrolling on TikTok 427 00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:06,040 or focusing on something else that's not productive. 428 00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:09,520 Yeah, I feel like I actually naturally did this like by 429 00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:12,760 accident without even knowing the let them theory after I 430 00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:16,680 ended my engagement and my 8 year long relationship there was 431 00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:18,560 obviously. A big gap. 432 00:22:18,560 --> 00:22:23,320 A big gap, a huge void a. We don't talk about that though. 433 00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:25,880 The huge void we don't. Talk about the huge void. 434 00:22:25,920 --> 00:22:30,440 A missing roommate. Then I sort of like almost 435 00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:34,160 immediately thereafter, threw myself into Tiger Sisters and 436 00:22:34,160 --> 00:22:36,960 building this company. Wait, so Tiger Sisters saved 437 00:22:36,960 --> 00:22:40,240 you? Is that what you're saying? 438 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:42,440 So you mean me coming to live with you? 439 00:22:42,920 --> 00:22:46,600 Saved you? Well, it definitely was like a 440 00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:51,240 very productive way for me to focus my energy, Yeah. 441 00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:54,560 And to do something that I felt really like, passionate and 442 00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:58,680 positively about. And to do it with someone that I 443 00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:02,040 love and like, cares about me and like, wants the best for me. 444 00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:05,760 So I do think I kind of did that. 445 00:23:05,920 --> 00:23:07,160 People have said, actually, you know what? 446 00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:09,120 Tom has said that to me before. What did he say? 447 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:14,360 He said Cherie saved you. He said that like you, yeah, 448 00:23:14,360 --> 00:23:17,240 that like you like replaced this like huge thing. 449 00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:19,160 I mean person that was like in my life. 450 00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:22,000 Yeah, that was honestly kind of the point of me like 1 of the 451 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:26,480 points of me like coming here after graduation, like, you 452 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:29,200 know, that I love San Francisco and I like, really wanted to be 453 00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:30,680 there. Wait, what are you making that 454 00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:32,920 pay? I came to fucking save you, 455 00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:37,720 bitch. Or did I save you? 456 00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:40,960 Oh why? Because of my ex. 457 00:23:41,080 --> 00:23:42,880 I don't know. But he was going to the East 458 00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:45,080 Coast. I saved you from. 459 00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:51,800 Tech Bros, yeah. OK, the bad fashion and awkward 460 00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:56,920 people who claim to be on the spectrum are you? 461 00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:00,840 Talking about like tech Bros, Yeah, OK, I can handle tech 462 00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:02,880 Bros. I mean, obviously. 463 00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:05,640 But yeah, actually, that's true. You know what? 464 00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:07,720 I was worried. I was worried that after I 465 00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:11,800 graduated that there was too big of a time gap because there were 466 00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:15,040 like a couple months in between, like the breakup and when I 467 00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:17,320 would come and move down. Oh, me, yeah. 468 00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:19,040 So I was just like, is she going to be OK? 469 00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:24,240 That was fine. You ended up being fine, but 470 00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:27,520 yeah, it's good that I came and then we started a company 471 00:24:27,520 --> 00:24:31,040 together. Wow, this is little sister 472 00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:34,360 energy she loves to take credit for. 473 00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:36,880 It sounds like your friends also pointed this out too. 474 00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:42,240 I don't know what you mean. That's funny actually. 475 00:24:42,240 --> 00:24:46,280 Someone commented on like a TikTok video of you and me and 476 00:24:46,280 --> 00:24:48,640 was just like, you saved your sister. 477 00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:50,800 Like they, they like watch her podcast or something so they 478 00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:53,720 know your story and they're like, you saved your sister from 479 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,440 like unaliving herself. And I was like, God, I know. 480 00:24:56,440 --> 00:25:00,320 I was like what? I was like #1 no, not like that. 481 00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:06,280 Number 2, who are you? I've never seen that comment. 482 00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:08,160 I'll have to. I maybe I deleted it. 483 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:09,600 I don't know. I was just like, you don't know 484 00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:11,920 what's going on, but like, yeah, the funny. 485 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:15,200 OK, you know, let them. Let them. 486 00:25:15,360 --> 00:25:16,840 Let me. Let you. 487 00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:23,160 Rebuild my entire life, yeah. And build this podcast to be top 488 00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:25,720 ten business podcast. Top ten business podcast on. 489 00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:29,200 Spotify with a sponsor? Read AI. 490 00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:32,680 We won't go to another break. We already had a break in the 491 00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:33,280 beginning. Thank you. 492 00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:34,000 Read AI. Yeah. 493 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:35,760 But we're very proud of the sponsorship. 494 00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:37,560 We love our sponsorship. We love this brand partnership. 495 00:25:38,360 --> 00:25:40,200 OK. And I think the perfect case 496 00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:44,520 study for the let them and let me theory is with Taylor Swift. 497 00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:47,920 Yeah, I love this one because it's very pop culture, but it's 498 00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:50,160 also business related. And it's also like a nice 499 00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:52,760 contrast to the whole Satya Nadella Microsoft one. 500 00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:54,440 True. So if you think back to when 501 00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:58,640 Taylor had her whole controversy with Scooter Braun and those PE 502 00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:01,320 companies coming to buy all her masters, and she had that like, 503 00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:03,560 big public fight with him, she couldn't do anything about it. 504 00:26:03,840 --> 00:26:06,360 She ended up losing the rights to those masters. 505 00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:10,680 But then she said, OK, I let them have those masters that 506 00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:14,800 they paid all that money for. Let me now re record all these 507 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:17,200 masters and make a whole new album of it. 508 00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:21,840 And that was, it was like her turning it, it was like. 509 00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:25,040 Her her turning point I. Feel like it was like a, a 510 00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:29,960 massive milestone in her very long and storied career where 511 00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:32,760 people started to look at her differently and we're like, oh 512 00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:36,400 shit. Like she is masterful. 513 00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:38,720 She is strategic. She is a. 514 00:26:39,120 --> 00:26:42,600 Yeah, huge domino effect too of when she re recorded her 515 00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:48,120 masters, because then it timed nicely with the Eras Tour. 516 00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:51,840 So then in her re recording and re releasing her songs that were 517 00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:55,640 super popular like many many years ago, but like she gave it 518 00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:58,520 a new momentum, a new wave and then she could sing about them 519 00:26:58,520 --> 00:27:01,040 through the Eras Tour. Yeah, and she really did start a 520 00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:02,720 whole new era for herself. Yeah. 521 00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:05,720 And it, like actually made her all the more powerful. 522 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:08,960 Yeah. So that's a great example of how 523 00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:13,280 you can take all that energy of, like, letting go from let them 524 00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,200 and put it into something incredibly productive. 525 00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:18,520 Yeah. It's kind of empowering me. 526 00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:20,720 Yeah, yeah. It's so empowering to see what 527 00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:25,720 she's done because if that that like horrible, like Saga didn't 528 00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:29,280 happen, she wouldn't really be at the same place she is now. 529 00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:31,960 Yes, totally. Which is insane to say, you 530 00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:34,800 know, because like, it must have been horrible, a horrible 531 00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:36,480 feeling to be like going through that. 532 00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:38,320 But now she's at a much better. Place yeah. 533 00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:41,240 And then also doing all that recording, re recording all of 534 00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:45,040 those original songs caused people to rediscover her music 535 00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:49,360 and like appreciate, appreciate it in a way that they never did. 536 00:27:49,360 --> 00:27:53,280 And then like compare the new songs to the old songs. 537 00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:56,080 And how she sang them. Her voice is matured now. 538 00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:58,280 Now that she has a different perspective, how does she say 539 00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:02,560 this line? And it just like it built her 540 00:28:02,560 --> 00:28:06,840 fanbase even more, and it made her existing fans even more like 541 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:08,760 fervent. Yeah, it. 542 00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:10,480 Reignited her fanbase, I think. Yeah. 543 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:14,600 And just a couple of months ago I saw an article where Taylor 544 00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:18,920 Swift now made enough money through her Eris tour to buy 545 00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:20,480 the. To buy the masters. 546 00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:23,320 Yeah. Back for her Reputation album. 547 00:28:23,360 --> 00:28:24,840 Yeah. I think it was like, you know, 548 00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:28,520 something of like 300 to $350 million, which is a lot of 549 00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:31,560 money, but that's also like she can do that and she did that 550 00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:33,400 with the money she earned. Yeah. 551 00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:37,080 Hell yeah, yeah. Let them like let me. 552 00:28:37,120 --> 00:28:42,400 Let them with the. But then let me do something 553 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:43,320 about it. Yeah. 554 00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:47,320 And she, she, what a boss. Yeah, and I like it that the let 555 00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:51,800 me made her even stronger and even more powerful and even 556 00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:55,120 wealthier than ever. Before hell yeah. 557 00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:57,960 It's an amazing story to witness, yeah. 558 00:28:58,120 --> 00:28:59,880 Is that like me? Yeah, it is. 559 00:28:59,960 --> 00:29:02,120 Let them now let me. Exactly. 560 00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:05,760 OK, so now moving on to the part that you guys have all been 561 00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:08,560 waiting for the roast of the Let Them theory. 562 00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:10,320 Yeah. So we wanted to be a little bit 563 00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:14,120 controversial, but also these are 5 areas where theory really 564 00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:15,760 does fall down. It's not necessarily 565 00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:18,360 one-size-fits-all. And the first place where it 566 00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:21,680 really breaks down is can we please talk about the privilege? 567 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:25,240 Yeah, so let them. Theory is inherently very 568 00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:27,280 privileged. You're coming from a very 569 00:29:27,280 --> 00:29:31,400 privileged position. If you can actually say let them 570 00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:34,840 and not have to worry about the consequence because let them 571 00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:38,640 works if in this situation, you're the one with the power, 572 00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:40,800 you're the one with the money, you're the one with the decision 573 00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:46,640 making resources, the resources. But it doesn't work if you are 574 00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:51,000 the intern who is like, really desperate to get a return offer, 575 00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:56,760 or if you are the only woman in the boardroom and you feel like 576 00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:58,880 you have to be careful about what you say because it 577 00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:01,200 represents all other women. And you could potentially put 578 00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:03,720 other women in jeopardy of not getting the position that you're 579 00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:04,480 in. Yeah. 580 00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:07,160 Just just two examples. Just two. 581 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:07,880 Cat 2. Very. 582 00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:09,920 Light examples, yeah. Yeah. 583 00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:11,920 But I don't know, just saying, like, let them. 584 00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:14,280 It feels like it comes from a place of privilege or you have 585 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:15,960 to have privilege in order to say it. 586 00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:21,040 Because if your circumstances are very fragile, just saying 587 00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:23,760 like, let them. Like oftentimes you can't. 588 00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:27,080 You can't do that. You can't always pull it off in 589 00:30:27,080 --> 00:30:29,840 every situation. Yeah, The next place where it 590 00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:34,520 really breaks down is conflict avoidance excuses, because often 591 00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:37,880 times people can just use the let them theory and just like 592 00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:41,400 say let them because they don't want to confront something going 593 00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:44,560 on in their lives. This was kind of an example that 594 00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:49,520 you used earlier, sorry, where you're just like, you know, if 595 00:30:49,520 --> 00:30:52,120 you are in a fight with your friend and you're just like, let 596 00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:54,960 them, but then you never have like a conversation with them 597 00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:58,200 about it, Then like, I don't know, you kind of take agency 598 00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:01,000 away from you or agency away from them and things kind of 599 00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:03,200 break down there. This one really called you out. 600 00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:06,840 Yeah. And I think the extension of 601 00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:09,960 that is the third place where let them breaks down, which is 602 00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:14,160 that sometimes just saying let them can create sort of a an 603 00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:17,360 accountability vacuum if you're just saying let them and you're 604 00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:19,880 applying it to a situation where the other person is someone that 605 00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:23,160 you come in contact with a lot. So like a really close friend or 606 00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:26,800 a Co worker or family member that you're in continual contact 607 00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:30,680 with, you're not really giving them an opportunity or tools to 608 00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:33,640 sort of like progress the relationship or resolve the 609 00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:36,440 situation. If you don't say anything to 610 00:31:36,440 --> 00:31:37,120 them. Exactly. 611 00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:37,920 You're just like let. Them. 612 00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:39,920 But then like nothing ever happens, right? 613 00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:41,600 Yeah. And you're using that to create 614 00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:44,880 like an accountability vacuum is what I would call it. 615 00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:49,080 And the next place where the Let me theory actually breaks down 616 00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:52,640 is when we talked about, you know, that void after you apply 617 00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:55,680 the let them theory. If you aren't intentional about 618 00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:59,040 replacing that void with something productive, you might 619 00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:02,440 just like naturally slide into, I don't know, like replacing it 620 00:32:02,440 --> 00:32:05,000 with something that doesn't matter or like not being as 621 00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:07,800 productive as you were before. I feel like we touched on that a 622 00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:08,720 little bit too. Yeah. 623 00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:13,200 OK, so then the last part where the let me theory falls down is 624 00:32:13,200 --> 00:32:16,160 what I kind of call the lone, the lone wolf approach. 625 00:32:16,160 --> 00:32:19,440 Because inherently the let me theory has 2 words. 626 00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:21,840 It's let and it's me. So it's very much like a focus 627 00:32:21,840 --> 00:32:24,280 on just me. And it's like looking inwards 628 00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:27,240 and seeing what you can do. But honestly, some of the best 629 00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:30,480 things in life I think are built with other people, right? 630 00:32:30,480 --> 00:32:34,640 So like, unless you're sort of still opening yourself up to 631 00:32:34,640 --> 00:32:37,760 collaboration, to like building with other people, to working 632 00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:40,880 with other people, to welcoming help, it can put you in a very 633 00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:42,880 sort of like lone wolf situation. 634 00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:46,640 So I think let me but don't take let me so literally. 635 00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:49,360 It's like, let me and all of the people who want to help me and 636 00:32:49,360 --> 00:32:52,080 then like invite in help and resources. 637 00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:56,680 OK, to wrap up this episode, we do have a mini exercise for you 638 00:32:56,680 --> 00:32:58,520 to do around the Let Them Theory. 639 00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:02,360 This is how you put the Let Them Theory into practice. 640 00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:06,880 So you should create a folder, whether it's on your phone in 641 00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:10,440 your notes or like a Google Drive folder and basically write 642 00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:14,240 a note to yourself whenever you feel the urge to jump into the 643 00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:16,800 drama. So we're going to call this like 644 00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:20,160 the icebox or the parking lot. Because what this does is that 645 00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:24,080 instead of, you know, responding immediately to when someone kind 646 00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:28,040 of like annoys you, you have time to pause and not respond 647 00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:31,160 right away so that you can embrace the let them theory. 648 00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:35,680 I love this because firstly, it buys back like mental and 649 00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:37,640 emotional bandwidth. It's not something you have to 650 00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:40,080 deal with right away. Just write it down in the note. 651 00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:45,280 And next, it gives you time to cool down your emotions because 652 00:33:45,280 --> 00:33:47,200 if you're not dealing with it right away, like you're not 653 00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:49,600 shooting back a quick text message, you have time to 654 00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:53,600 reflect and kind of see if it's something even worth responding 655 00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:56,320 to. You're putting it on ice, which 656 00:33:56,320 --> 00:33:59,520 is why I like calling it the ice box or you call it the parking 657 00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:02,640 lot or like a more techie way of calling it would be like the 658 00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:05,040 backlog, like, you know, things that you're probably never going 659 00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:08,280 to get to, but you're just putting it in there so that 660 00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:10,280 there's like a note of it. Yeah. 661 00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:13,679 And this really helps you build the let them muscle because then 662 00:34:13,679 --> 00:34:16,920 you're resisting the urge to control the situation or 663 00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:19,480 resisting the urge to respond immediately. 664 00:34:19,639 --> 00:34:23,840 Yeah, I also like it because it's sort of like a record of 665 00:34:23,840 --> 00:34:26,920 all of the things that you wanted to do something about 666 00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:29,239 right away. And you look back on it in like 667 00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:31,719 a week's time, a month time and six months time. 668 00:34:31,719 --> 00:34:34,440 And it's sort of like a graveyard of all the things that 669 00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:37,400 you, like, thought were so important and really bugged you, 670 00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:41,320 made you so angry, made you so like riled up at the time. 671 00:34:41,320 --> 00:34:44,120 And you can look back and be like, oh, who the F cares about 672 00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:45,800 this? Like, why was I so mad at the 673 00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:48,199 time? And it can kind of like train 674 00:34:48,199 --> 00:34:54,320 you subtly to in the future just not be so reactive or upset 675 00:34:54,320 --> 00:34:57,200 about things because you can like see all these instances, 676 00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:00,040 examples listed out from your own life of like where it didn't 677 00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:01,840 really matter. And for me. 678 00:35:02,240 --> 00:35:06,720 I mean, whenever there's like a heated, you know, exchange back 679 00:35:06,720 --> 00:35:09,760 and forth over text message, which is absolutely the worst if 680 00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:11,640 that happens, like get on the phone usually. 681 00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:15,560 But if there's like a heated exchange, 9 times out of 10, 682 00:35:15,880 --> 00:35:19,520 it's so much better just to wait on what you're about to say back 683 00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:22,280 to someone rather than like, you know, just like typing something 684 00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:23,760 out. So that's why I like this 685 00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:25,480 icebox. Like, I'm not saying you have to 686 00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:27,800 like, you know, go someone for a month if you're in the middle of 687 00:35:27,800 --> 00:35:29,760 a heat exchange. But like, it's good to take a 688 00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:32,840 pause. And just having this space that 689 00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:35,560 you've intentionally created for yourself forces you to take the 690 00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:38,000 pause. Yeah, I really like that, 691 00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:41,000 although I I'm not having that many heated exchanges to be 692 00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:42,320 honest. 'Cause you're conflict avoid in. 693 00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:49,000 Hey, you said it yourself. I said sometimes, but OK, so 694 00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:53,160 guys do this right now. I'm gonna actually do this. 695 00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:57,000 So take take out your phone, create a note if you have a an 696 00:35:57,000 --> 00:36:00,880 Apple or you know. An Apple, An iPhone if. 697 00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:03,280 You have an iPhone. I think you can also create. 698 00:36:04,160 --> 00:36:06,480 A note. In the Android on a Google. 699 00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:11,080 OK, create a note for yourself, call it icebox or backlog or 700 00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:14,800 parking lot or whatever, and then write in the comments done 701 00:36:14,840 --> 00:36:16,720 once you've actually done that, because that's just the first 702 00:36:16,720 --> 00:36:18,000 step. And then once you've done it, 703 00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:19,880 like you can see all the other people who have done it, and I 704 00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:20,920 think that's cool. Yeah. 705 00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:22,280 And this is just a place to start. 706 00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:24,840 Obviously, there's the let them and the let me theory and I'm 707 00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:26,520 glad we talked through those things today. 708 00:36:26,560 --> 00:36:27,440 Yeah. So that, you know, it's like 709 00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:30,800 kind of a two-part approach. Yeah, and all the warning areas 710 00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:32,720 to like look out for where it doesn't really work. 711 00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:35,080 So I hope you guys enjoyed this episode. 712 00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:37,120 Thank you guys so much for tuning in. 713 00:36:37,360 --> 00:36:41,080 Please remember to like, comment and subscribe because when you 714 00:36:41,080 --> 00:36:44,400 subscribe to our podcast, you get notified every single time 715 00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:47,720 we drop a new episode. And it definitely helps as we 716 00:36:47,720 --> 00:36:50,040 see our subscribers grow. We feel like you guys are part 717 00:36:50,040 --> 00:36:53,280 of this community with us. And if you're listening to this 718 00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:57,280 podcast on Apple or Spotify, please take 3 seconds. 719 00:36:57,280 --> 00:37:01,120 It's literally so quick to just give us a five star review. 720 00:37:01,240 --> 00:37:04,360 And also, if you can type in that you like, like this 721 00:37:04,360 --> 00:37:07,760 podcast, it really helps with distribution and with other 722 00:37:07,760 --> 00:37:09,760 people finding us. Yes, and sign up for the 723 00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:11,960 newsletter. The link is in the description. 724 00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:15,640 And also check out our sponsors. Thanks for being here. 725 00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:17,280 See you guys next time. Bye.