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Welcome to Be on Sunday, a 
podcast that is an extension of 

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the preaching ministry here at 
Leamington EMC. 

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I am Pastor Jonah Chitty and I 
am joined as always by Joe Joe, 

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Pastor Joe Penner. 
On Sunday, Pastor Joe preached 

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from Nehemiah 5 right. 
Yeah, I did. 

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I just something just came to my
mind as you said that. 

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So like we have to be, we have 
to be careful, I guess as 

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pastors. 
I know like, I don't know, you 

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probably wrestle with this 
sometimes too. 

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Like some people, people will 
text me and they'll be like, 

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hey, Pastor Joe and I'm just 
like, Joe is great. 

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Just just Joe is just fine. 
It reminds me of something that 

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John MacArthur said years ago. 
He's very well renowned pastor. 

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You know that many, many people 
know him and he had just. 

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He's he's sort of well known. 
Sort of well known, like some 

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people may know, may have heard 
of him, but he had just said he 

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had just said, you know, talking
about this in a passage that 

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specifically says like he was 
condemning the Pharisees for 

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going around like wanting to be 
called rabbi and teacher. 

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And he says you shouldn't desire
that. 

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And and John MacArthur talking 
about that just said, you know, 

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Jesus was good for Jesus. 
And so John is good for me, you 

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know. 
So I'm Jonah. 

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I'm not saying that, you know 
what? 

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And I, and I, I say that to also
say I know that some parents 

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like are wanting to teach their 
children to like learn to be 

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respectful and people are trying
to be respectful. 

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And so I'm not saying that to be
like, you shouldn't do it. 

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I'm just saying I always try to 
come back with that and be like,

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you know what, Joe is just fine.
You know, we're just. 

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Joey. 
Joe. 

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Joe. 
Anyway, we all have J names. 

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Yeah, we do. 
Joe, Jake, Jonah. 

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Yeah. 
So anyway, that was good. 

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That's a good segue. 
In the NEMI 5, you think he was 

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like wanted to be called like 
like Governor Nehemiah. 

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Governor Nehemiah, I don't, I 
don't think so. 

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Yeah, I mean, really. 
Like, that's a good point. 

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Like nobody goes around saying 
hey, bricklayer, Bricklayer 

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Pete. 
Yeah. 

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Oh, whatever. 
It's like or. 

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Even if if you're like ACEO or a
supervisor or a manager, like 

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nobody, yeah, nobody says that. 
Like, hey, Manager Bill, you 

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know, nobody does that. 
That's a good point. 

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So I'm sorry, Joe. 
I'll never call you Pastor Joe 

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again. 
Never, ever again. 

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No, you're never. 
You'll forever now be known as 

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Joe being silly. 
All right? 

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You did preach a you did preach 
a sermon. 

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Yes, Sir. 
On Nehemiah 5, and you named it.

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Hang on, not remember the 
Titans? 

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That was your opening 
illustration. 

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We are one body. 
Let's live like it. 

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Would you put an exclamation 
point at the end? 

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Maybe I should have? 
OK, but he didn't. 

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I didn't. 
Yeah. 

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So we are one body. 
Let's live like it. 

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Give us a rundown of what you 
had for your outline. 

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Yeah. 
So essentially in this chapter 

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we have infighting, we have 
division from the inside, right,

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which is very different from 
fighting from the outside. 

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We've had what we've had the 
sorry to interrupt you there, 

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but to get us in the context of 
Nehemiah, we have experienced 

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lots gone on and they started 
construction on the wall. 

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They have experienced some 
outside opposition. 

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Now we face Yeah. 
Internal opposition and and 

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they're beginning to to fight 
against one another, right? 

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Maybe they don't see it that 
way, but but we see this sin 

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sort of going through the the 
body where people that are poor 

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people that are not very well 
off and are struggling, are 

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being oppressed by those who are
wealthier and have the 

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opportunity to take advantage of
them, which goes against God's 

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word. 
And so they're not acting like 

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one body. 
They're not living like like one

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people and they're taking 
advantage of each other. 

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And so that's where I tied in. 
And I use the opening 

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illustration you alluded to the 
remember the Titans, you know, 

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these high schools that were 
brought together, there was 

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segregation, blacks and whites 
at different schools. 

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But now they were forced to 
integrate and they combined the 

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school and the football team was
made-up of white and black 

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players. 
And the biggest opposition they 

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faced was internal struggle, the
fighting with each other. 

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And you know, the scene where 
they meet at the Gettysburg 

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Cemetery and and the coach 
delivers this legendary speak 

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out of speech. 
I don't know if it was if it was

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a real thing or not. 
I don't know the movies based on

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a true story. 
I don't know if that scene is 

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like accurate or not, but at 
least in the movie. 

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Played well. 
Yeah, and they played really 

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well in the movie. 
They come to the, the cemetery 

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in Gettysburg and, and it's a 
reminder of, you know, the, the,

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the American Civil War where 
America was fighting against 

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itself because they believe 
different things and, and, you 

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know, 51,000 people died. 
And so this, the coach sort of 

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delivers the speech. 
It's like if we don't come 

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together, you know we're going 
to destroy ourselves just like 

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they did. 
Let me ask you a question. 

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Did you, when you were watching 
the clip, you've watched the 

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movie a long time ago. 
When you were watching the clip,

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did you cry a little bit? 
Not that, no, not this week. 

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If, if I'd watched a whole 
movie, if I get into like the 

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context of a movie, I probably 
would have teared up a bit. 

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We were talking yesterday a 
little bit about this and I, I 

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just mentioned to you that I 
don't really like movies that 

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like play on my emotions and 
really like try to, to like get 

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me in the fields. 
And you said something like that

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you just don't like to cry 
movies. 

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And I was like, you're right, I 
don't. 

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So yeah, that's a really, it is 
a really moving scene. 

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And it, and it really helps like
figure out, hey, if we don't 

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work together, if we don't like 
in, in this context, if Israel, 

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if they don't work together, 
then they're they're they're 

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going to destroy themselves from
within essentially. 

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So yeah, it's good. 
Exactly. 

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And that's exactly what was 
going to happen here, right? 

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It's like they literally were 
going to risk like because, 

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because some, because some 
commentaries that I read, I 

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didn't, I didn't mention this in
my sermon, but some commentaries

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sort of alluded to like it may 
have been the wealthy people 

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that refused to join in 
rebuilding of the wall who were 

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taking advantage of these 
people. 

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And so I know Jake mentioned in 
one of his sermons that I think 

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it was the dacoits, the the 
leaders, the nobles of the 

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dacoits refused to join in. 
And then but the people from 

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Dacoa came. 
Right. 

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But it may have been those 
leaders and we have no way of 

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knowing, right? 
But it may have been, you know, 

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wealthy people like that, 
including them, who are sort of 

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oppressing these people. 
It's like, and so if these 

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people are oppressed beyond a 
breaking point, right? 

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Like we can't eat anymore. 
It's like, well, guess what, now

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you can't. 
You die or you know you. 

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Can't work. 
You for sure can't work if you 

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can't eat. 
Right. 

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So at a minimum, you know, the 
work of the wall is going to 

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stop because they're going to 
have to go back to their fields,

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they're going to have to go back
to their farms, they're going to

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have to go back to these things.
But the the the longer picture, 

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the bigger picture is like as a 
nation, they could have just 

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been destroyed and disbanded. 
But, and so it's that fighting 

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from within that they needed to,
to confront. 

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And so my points in, in the 
sermon were the first thing is 

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that we need to expose sin in 
the body. 

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And so the, as the chapter 
progresses, it begins with the 

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people who are oppressed, They 
bring this sin forward, they 

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expose it, they sort of shed 
light to what's going on. 

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They bring this to Nehemiah and 
expose what's going on. 

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And so, and then Nehemiah 
confronts the sin, right. 

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So that's my second point, that 
therefore we need to confront 

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sin in the body. 
And so Nehemiah then goes on 

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from there to go and confront 
those leaders and confront the 

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sin that that is exposed to him 
by these people and he goes and 

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confronts it. 
And then the Third Point was 

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that we need to be killing sin 
in the body. 

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And so there at the end of the 
chapter, we see Nehemiah's 

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example that, you know, he 
avoided the sin, this specific 

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sin of oppressing people by 
himself, being willing to be a 

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servant. 
And so by doing that, it's like 

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I, I was just mentioning to you 
that I think this is probably 

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the point that I maybe took a 
little bit of the most creative 

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license. 
But I think it is, I think it is

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true that he is killing sin by, 
by being a servant. 

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And, and he, he doesn't, you 
know, sin against the people and

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harm the people because he's, 
he's choosing to be a servant. 

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And so I think, yeah, I think in
all these ways, it, it helps us 

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sort of the point like to be 1 
body, right? 

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If we're a body, we're one. 
And so when sin happens, we have

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to expose it and then we have to
confront it so that we can seek 

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reconciliation. 
And then as we move forward, 

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it's like as much as we can, we 
have to be killing sin in our 

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lives personally and as a whole 
so that we can be pure and that 

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we can truly be the body of 
Christ and and live like it so 

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that the world will know that 
we're Christ's followers. 

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Yeah, I don't think you, I don't
think you'd stretched it. 

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I I didn't even like when you 
mentioned that earlier. 

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I I I never even considered that
you took license right to go 

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further than you should have 
because I mean, you didn't you 

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you didn't like say thus says 
the word of Joe. 

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You're like you pointed us to 
other parts and and scripture 

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that that told us gave us like 
examples from the New Testament,

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like you, you in that point. 
You went to James one or excuse 

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me, James 41 to three and 
talking about what what causes 

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quarrels and fights among you, 
right. 

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It is not it is it not this that
your passions are at war within 

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you. 
And so like, yeah, I mean, 

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Nehemiah, dude had a good life 
before he came back, right? 

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So I mean, he could have, he 
could have still had that life 

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if he wanted to. 
And so like, you know, he he had

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to like, say, hey, we've got to 
give up these passions and, and 

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like focus on this one thing. 
Yeah, so. 

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Well, it I had wanted, I thought
of using this, this illustration

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sort of throat throughout the 
sermon. 

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I mean, you know this, you know 
that I had a toothache a couple 

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weeks back. 
And as I was thinking about the 

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body, like the fact that we're 
one body, I sort of alluded to 

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this in, in the first point 
that, you know, we we don't 

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usually do things intentionally 
to harm ourselves, right? 

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We don't purposely hurt our own 
bodies. 

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And as I was thinking about 
this, you know, I, I had a tooth

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that was causing me just an 
incredible amount of pain for 

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about a week, maybe not quite a 
week. 

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Joe had a rogue tooth. 
It was and I went in, I went 

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into the, I mean, I, I couldn't 
sleep. 

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It woke me up at night like no 
pain medication was helping at 

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all. 
So I went to the dentist and he 

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said I had an abscessed tooth. 
And so there's an infection in 

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the bottom of one of my teeth. 
And you know, but as I was 

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thinking about that as an 
illustration, I'm like a tooth 

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is a very small part of my body.
And yet when it, when it hurt, 

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my entire body was affected, 
right? 

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Like, like it was hard for me to
work. 

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I would sometimes just lay down 
and like just, you know, if your

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hand comes up and like holds the
side of your face, 'cause you're

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just in pain. 
And it just made me think like 

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you expose K you, you've exposed
the problem. 

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A problem has been exposed. 
But now for me just to pretend 

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like, well, whatever, I'm just 
going to deal with it, that that

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goes terribly wrong because now 
I'm in pain for like, I'd be in 

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pain for weeks, right? 
In unbearable pain. 

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And so at some point, it's like 
you have to confront the issue. 

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And that's like going to the 
dentist and coming up with a 

223
00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:46,040
plan of like how we're gonna fix
this thing. 

224
00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:49,320
And, you know, it's like, I just
felt like that was such a, like,

225
00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:51,120
such a good illustration. 
And hopefully that's helpful for

226
00:10:51,120 --> 00:10:53,360
people to see here because it's 
like, we're one body. 

227
00:10:53,600 --> 00:10:56,960
And so, you know, like, like, 
like Paul writes to the 

228
00:10:56,960 --> 00:11:00,840
Corinthians, when one part 
suffers, they all suffer. 

229
00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:04,720
And so like, we can't, we can't 
watch one part suffering and be 

230
00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:07,040
like, oh, OK, fine, whatever. 
You just go suffer over there in

231
00:11:07,040 --> 00:11:09,800
the corner while I continue 
doing what I'm doing. 

232
00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:12,520
No, we have to deal with the 
issue and we have to confront 

233
00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:14,040
it. 
And you know, whether it's like 

234
00:11:14,080 --> 00:11:17,840
weeping with someone who weeps 
or, or, you know, confronting 

235
00:11:17,840 --> 00:11:20,360
sin and dealing with the issues 
so that reconciliation can 

236
00:11:20,360 --> 00:11:22,240
happen. 
But that's what it means to be 1

237
00:11:22,240 --> 00:11:25,760
body. 
But we often do do the opposite.

238
00:11:26,600 --> 00:11:31,360
Why do you think that is? 
I, I, I mean, we're, our Western

239
00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:33,160
society probably plays a big 
role in that. 

240
00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:36,800
The fact that we really have 
been conditioned to think 

241
00:11:36,800 --> 00:11:41,400
individualistically, like, like 
everything is, is a, it's mine, 

242
00:11:41,400 --> 00:11:45,440
it's my life, it's my money, 
it's my car, it's my house, all 

243
00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:47,160
of these things. 
Is we've, we've thought so 

244
00:11:47,160 --> 00:11:50,200
individualistically that it's 
like it's just when we're 

245
00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:53,480
together on a Sunday morning 
that that we see ourselves as a 

246
00:11:53,480 --> 00:11:55,600
body. 
And, you know, maybe part of 

247
00:11:55,600 --> 00:11:57,880
that is like, throughout the 
week, it's like we don't really 

248
00:11:57,880 --> 00:11:59,160
spend a whole lot of time 
together. 

249
00:11:59,160 --> 00:12:01,680
And that's true. 
I think that honestly, I think 

250
00:12:01,680 --> 00:12:03,720
that's really the autonomy 
thing. 

251
00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:08,840
Like we feel like we have 
personal autonomy, man. 

252
00:12:08,840 --> 00:12:11,160
That that's, I think that's all 
I think you're hitting on it. 

253
00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:15,800
We don't, we don't see ourselves
as a body. 

254
00:12:16,560 --> 00:12:21,760
We we almost see ourselves as I 
don't want to say it out loud as

255
00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:25,640
a social club, like we just meet
on Sundays or Wednesdays or 

256
00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:28,160
whatever it is. 
We and it's not like I really 

257
00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:32,680
have this relationship with 
these people that's like deeper 

258
00:12:32,680 --> 00:12:35,600
than just like a cordial. 
Hey, how you doing? 

259
00:12:36,120 --> 00:12:40,080
Well, how was your week? 
Did you eat any good food? 

260
00:12:41,280 --> 00:12:42,880
Whatever? 
What are the other questions you

261
00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:43,920
have? 
Like, you know, even if it's 

262
00:12:43,920 --> 00:12:44,920
painful things you're going 
through. 

263
00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:48,160
Oh, I'm so sorry to hear that. 
If you need anything, let me 

264
00:12:48,160 --> 00:12:52,840
know. 
Those are, those are like, I 

265
00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:54,520
don't know, they're like the 
same thing you would get at 

266
00:12:54,520 --> 00:12:57,280
work, right? 
Or maybe less actually. 

267
00:12:57,280 --> 00:12:59,280
Yeah, how that's, And that's a 
really good question to ask, 

268
00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:02,120
right? 
How are your relationships with 

269
00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:05,840
your brothers and sisters in 
Christ different than your 

270
00:13:05,840 --> 00:13:08,640
relationships with just 
acquaintances, right? 

271
00:13:08,640 --> 00:13:10,480
People that you work with or 
people that you know. 

272
00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:13,040
Yeah, Yeah, that's true. 
There should be a difference. 

273
00:13:14,400 --> 00:13:16,160
Yeah, there should be. 
When we look at the book of 

274
00:13:16,160 --> 00:13:18,680
acts, like what happens, right? 
Like they've shared what they 

275
00:13:18,680 --> 00:13:20,000
had, right? 
They ate together. 

276
00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:22,000
They met and ate together in one
another's homes. 

277
00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:24,760
They they were selling stuff to 
share it with those who had a 

278
00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:27,200
need. 
You know, they were, they were, 

279
00:13:27,240 --> 00:13:29,240
they were acting like the 
church. 

280
00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:31,000
They were acting like one body. 
Right. 

281
00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:34,440
Yeah, that was yeah, exactly. 
And Acts, they're they're, 

282
00:13:34,560 --> 00:13:36,680
they're there Pentecost, right? 
They're there at the time. 

283
00:13:36,680 --> 00:13:38,640
And then they don't want to 
leave because they love what 

284
00:13:38,640 --> 00:13:39,600
they're what's happening right 
then. 

285
00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:43,600
But yeah, that's, that's, that 
is it. 

286
00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:45,840
I, I think you hit it, man. 
You, you're like, you're like 

287
00:13:46,400 --> 00:13:49,880
picking at this festering scar 
on my body somewhere. 

288
00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:50,560
I don't know. 
It's weird. 

289
00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:52,880
I'm just saying it's like 
you're, you're scratching an 

290
00:13:52,880 --> 00:13:53,800
itch. 
You know what I mean? 

291
00:13:53,800 --> 00:13:55,320
Like that's that is what it 
feels like. 

292
00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:57,720
Well, maybe we should take a 
moment to like talk practically 

293
00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:01,120
about that because I, I think 
the solution to the problem is 

294
00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:03,280
not that like, because we 
realized that like, you know, as

295
00:14:03,280 --> 00:14:06,800
a church, you know, we have, you
know, somewhere around 600 

296
00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:10,320
people that are coming on a 
regular basis, including kids, 

297
00:14:10,640 --> 00:14:13,960
adults, teens, kids, young 
adults, all like all the range, 

298
00:14:13,960 --> 00:14:17,760
whatever. 
And so you can't, it's, it's not

299
00:14:17,760 --> 00:14:21,800
possible to have an intimate 
relationship with all of those 

300
00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:23,760
people. 
Like that is, that is physically

301
00:14:23,760 --> 00:14:27,480
impossible. 
And So what are practical ways 

302
00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:31,760
that people can be the body of 
Christ to one another? 

303
00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:39,280
I mean, I feel like we're 
beating like the same drum over 

304
00:14:39,280 --> 00:14:41,480
and over again. 
One way would be, like, find a 

305
00:14:41,480 --> 00:14:43,480
way to, like, be intentional 
about discipleship in like a 

306
00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:47,720
group. 
Yeah, where you can, you can, 

307
00:14:47,720 --> 00:14:50,360
you can have, like, deeper 
conversations. 

308
00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:53,560
I don't know, man. 
Like that. 

309
00:14:53,560 --> 00:14:55,080
I think that's probably the 
answer. 

310
00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:56,080
I don't. 
I don't know what are other 

311
00:14:56,080 --> 00:14:57,880
ways. 
Well, I think, and I think 

312
00:14:57,880 --> 00:15:00,640
that's faithful because we think
about the church in Acts, right?

313
00:15:00,640 --> 00:15:04,240
Yeah, you know, Acts 2, Acts 2 
tells us that 3000 people were 

314
00:15:04,240 --> 00:15:06,360
added to their number that day. 
You know when, when? 

315
00:15:06,360 --> 00:15:07,800
It says, oh, well, then they 
met. 

316
00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:10,160
They met in homes, eating and, 
you know, sharing food. 

317
00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:12,040
It's like, well, did all 3000 
people. 

318
00:15:12,040 --> 00:15:14,600
No, no they didn't. 
I think, I think it could be 

319
00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:16,480
broader than just discipleship 
groups, though. 

320
00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:20,520
Yeah, I think like, like last 
night we had, we we watched the 

321
00:15:20,520 --> 00:15:22,680
Super Bowl together. 
We invited some other couples 

322
00:15:22,680 --> 00:15:24,080
and their families to come as 
well. 

323
00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:26,400
And our kids invited some 
friends over as well. 

324
00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:27,760
Right. 
We had it, we had, it was a fun 

325
00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:29,600
time. 
We had lots of food, lots of 

326
00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:31,360
fellowship. 
We watched, we watched a stupid 

327
00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:34,520
ball game that the only person 
in the room that liked it was me

328
00:15:34,520 --> 00:15:36,360
and maybe, maybe some one of the
other guys. 

329
00:15:37,280 --> 00:15:41,600
But like, like the conversation.
We, we skipped the, the men and 

330
00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:44,600
anyway skipped the halftime show
and we made coffee in the 

331
00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:46,400
kitchen. 
And so we just chatted. 

332
00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:50,400
But I felt like, I felt like the
conversation in the room and and

333
00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:54,320
granted, we, we like our work, 
like our work mine and your work

334
00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:59,160
is, is Christian, right? 
So like we, we're pastors or 

335
00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:00,400
we're actually, we're Joe and 
Jonah. 

336
00:16:03,240 --> 00:16:07,920
But, but so our conversation 
sort of naturally comes down to 

337
00:16:07,920 --> 00:16:10,600
like what we, what we think 
about all the time. 

338
00:16:10,960 --> 00:16:13,200
But fortunately, the other 
people that were there, they 

339
00:16:13,200 --> 00:16:15,400
also enjoyed talking about that 
stuff. 

340
00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:21,960
And I think like I was thinking 
about like the idea of communal 

341
00:16:21,960 --> 00:16:25,440
living is not the right word, 
but like friendship and like 

342
00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:27,720
expanding friendship out to 
include families. 

343
00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:31,280
And like then you then you get 
together frequently and you like

344
00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:34,440
you have meals together and 
around the converse and around 

345
00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:36,960
the dinner table and around like
the sitting on the sofas 

346
00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:39,480
together. 
The conversations are always 

347
00:16:39,480 --> 00:16:42,160
about life and always about and 
they do include work. 

348
00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:45,800
But like a conscious Christian 
will bring up how does the 

349
00:16:45,800 --> 00:16:49,560
gospel affect this right? 
And what is what is it about 

350
00:16:49,600 --> 00:16:52,400
like Christ and how he's working
in my life? 

351
00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:54,640
How does that affect what's 
going on in our lives right now?

352
00:16:54,640 --> 00:16:57,360
And I think that that came up, 
you know, those things came up 

353
00:16:57,360 --> 00:16:58,520
with us. 
We were talking about, we're 

354
00:16:58,800 --> 00:17:00,520
talking about sermons and all 
these other things. 

355
00:17:00,520 --> 00:17:03,720
But like, I just think that 
that's part of it too. 

356
00:17:03,720 --> 00:17:06,680
Like it has to be like the 
discipleship group can almost 

357
00:17:06,680 --> 00:17:09,079
always can almost come into this
thing like the church does too 

358
00:17:09,079 --> 00:17:11,800
and, and feel OK that I'm the 
body when I'm with my 

359
00:17:11,800 --> 00:17:14,079
discipleship group, when I'm not
with them. 

360
00:17:14,960 --> 00:17:19,359
So that's like, how do we flesh 
this out and like forming 

361
00:17:19,359 --> 00:17:22,040
another program, forming another
like small groups where you meet

362
00:17:22,040 --> 00:17:23,200
with different families in your 
house. 

363
00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:25,160
That might be something that's 
helpful, but I don't think it's 

364
00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:28,119
the true answer. 
I think like the true answer is 

365
00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:31,400
like, I'm going to be Jonah and 
I'm going to bring my family to 

366
00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:33,200
Joe's house. 
And we're going to have live 

367
00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:35,840
conversations about what what 
like, what interests us. 

368
00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:38,360
But also like being very 
intentional about like 

369
00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:42,600
sharpening each other with the 
word, talking about what God is 

370
00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:45,160
teaching us in the Bible, you 
know, as we read it and then our

371
00:17:45,280 --> 00:17:48,760
kids hear that and then that's 
the norm, right? 

372
00:17:48,760 --> 00:17:51,160
That's like the normal thing dad
dads talk about. 

373
00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:55,240
They could talk about cars and 
and beers and cigars and 

374
00:17:55,280 --> 00:17:58,000
whatever else that dads are 
known for talking about. 

375
00:17:58,000 --> 00:18:01,160
Or they could talk about what is
Christ doing in your life in 

376
00:18:01,160 --> 00:18:04,040
your heart? 
How is like, you know, that's a 

377
00:18:04,040 --> 00:18:07,080
hard thing you had to go 
through, but you had, how did 

378
00:18:07,080 --> 00:18:08,840
you get through it? 
Well, I had hope because of, you

379
00:18:08,840 --> 00:18:10,160
know, the Lord's work in my 
life. 

380
00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:12,840
I don't know, maybe I'm just 
rambling now, but. 

381
00:18:12,840 --> 00:18:13,960
No, that's really helpful 
though. 

382
00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:15,880
Like like it's, it's doing life 
together. 

383
00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:17,440
I mean, that's. 
That's a It's cliche. 

384
00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:20,040
I'm trying to avoid saying that.
It is a really cliche thing to 

385
00:18:20,040 --> 00:18:22,560
say because it gets said so 
much, but it's it, it is. 

386
00:18:22,560 --> 00:18:23,880
I mean, that's what a body does,
right? 

387
00:18:23,880 --> 00:18:26,240
Like my entire body follows me 
everywhere I go. 

388
00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:27,920
That's right. 
And experiences everything that 

389
00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:30,240
I experience and goes through 
whatever I go through and. 

390
00:18:30,240 --> 00:18:33,120
Feels pain whenever. 
Yeah, like a part of it feels 

391
00:18:33,120 --> 00:18:35,600
pain. 
And so like instead of, you 

392
00:18:35,600 --> 00:18:38,640
know, that that pithy comment in
the in the foyer where you say, 

393
00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:40,440
oh, I'm so sorry to hear that 
happened to you. 

394
00:18:40,760 --> 00:18:43,760
It's like going to their house 
and just sitting with them, not 

395
00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:47,120
saying anything, just being 
there or answering a text. 

396
00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:53,040
You know, I was talking to a 
friend the other day on like on 

397
00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:57,480
a phone call and he said the 
like, if you, if there's 

398
00:18:57,480 --> 00:19:00,120
somebody in need that the 
difference in like somebody like

399
00:19:00,320 --> 00:19:03,440
going down like the path of like
suicide. 

400
00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:06,760
Like for some people, like is 
like a 6 minute conversation 

401
00:19:06,760 --> 00:19:09,040
with a friend. 
And it's not even like, it 

402
00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:13,080
doesn't necessarily even have to
be about anything like, hey, you

403
00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:17,320
know, you got a second and then 
like the person doesn't respond 

404
00:19:17,320 --> 00:19:19,600
or they respond two hours later 
or whatever. 

405
00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:22,560
And sure, whatever. 
And then like that could be like

406
00:19:22,560 --> 00:19:24,960
the moment like this, it's you 
don't have, it's not, doesn't 

407
00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:27,680
take a lot of time. 
Like, you just have to be 

408
00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:31,440
willing to be there for 
somebody, you know, like to be, 

409
00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:34,280
to be willing to spend. 
I think Simon Sinek is the 

410
00:19:34,280 --> 00:19:36,880
person he got this, this idea 
from talking about the six 

411
00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:40,000
minute thing. 
But anyway, I, I just think like

412
00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:42,440
we're, we're overthinking it. 
Yeah. 

413
00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:44,360
Like a lot of times. 
Like what does the body mean? 

414
00:19:44,360 --> 00:19:47,120
It just means being like a 
human, decent human that cares 

415
00:19:47,120 --> 00:19:49,280
about other people. 
Yeah, like genuinely cares about

416
00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:51,360
other people. 
And I think that goes back to 

417
00:19:51,360 --> 00:19:55,280
your autonomy comment. 
Like if I'm autonomous and 

418
00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:57,200
that's the only thing I care 
about, that I'm a super selfish 

419
00:19:57,200 --> 00:20:01,720
person because I'm only always 
thinking about myself, right. 

420
00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:05,360
And so I think that that would 
be, I think that's the that's 

421
00:20:05,360 --> 00:20:08,280
the shift in pattern. 
We have to think about is how 

422
00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:12,880
are we others focused? 
And I don't know if I know I'm 

423
00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:14,200
not. 
And it's hard. 

424
00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:16,360
And it, and that's why the 
sermon really, it was a good 

425
00:20:16,360 --> 00:20:19,040
sermon, but the good kind that 
like, you know, punches you in 

426
00:20:19,040 --> 00:20:22,040
the gut or, you know, kicks you 
in the pants, whatever. 

427
00:20:22,200 --> 00:20:23,680
Right. 
And it did for me too, right? 

428
00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:26,360
Like I was telling people, you 
know, as people came up and 

429
00:20:26,360 --> 00:20:29,280
asked questions or talked about 
it, it's like, man, you're, 

430
00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:31,320
you're, you're preaching to 
yourself all the time, right? 

431
00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:32,920
I feel like that's the hardest 
part about preaching is 

432
00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:35,160
realizing that like you have so 
much room to grow. 

433
00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:39,160
And so I hope never, nobody ever
sees me as, as preaching. 

434
00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:41,800
And you know, I'm, I'm, you 
know, pointing the finger. 

435
00:20:41,800 --> 00:20:44,840
It's like I'm quite often and I 
most times pointing it more at 

436
00:20:44,840 --> 00:20:47,640
myself than anybody, right? 
You, you as the guy who's 

437
00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:49,480
saturating your mind in the text
all week. 

438
00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:51,880
It's like, man, I feel guilty 
all week long. 

439
00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:53,160
I know, isn't that the way it 
works too? 

440
00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:56,280
It's like like we don't, we 
don't, I mean, there is a 

441
00:20:56,280 --> 00:20:58,760
rotation of pastors preaching in
the church, right? 

442
00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:00,840
We have. 
But like, it just seems like, 

443
00:21:00,840 --> 00:21:02,880
and no one's like saying, all 
right, this text right here is 

444
00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:07,000
assigned to, to Jonah because he
deals with this garbage in his 

445
00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:09,480
life the most. 
But like, that's almost what it 

446
00:21:09,480 --> 00:21:10,320
seems like. 
You're right. 

447
00:21:10,320 --> 00:21:12,360
It's like, oh, you're going to, 
you're going to have to look 

448
00:21:12,360 --> 00:21:15,560
through this text for like 2 
weeks because you know what, you

449
00:21:15,560 --> 00:21:18,560
need it. 
And it's the pastor, Jake and 

450
00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:21,480
oh, sorry, Jake and Joe aren't, 
aren't, aren't saying that 

451
00:21:21,480 --> 00:21:23,880
they're the Lord is saying that 
he's the one who, you know, 

452
00:21:24,360 --> 00:21:28,120
organizes it all anyway. 
But yeah, and I think like to 

453
00:21:28,120 --> 00:21:31,160
your point about, you know, like
take people taking advantage of 

454
00:21:31,160 --> 00:21:33,480
another because we're 
autonomous, we're thinking too 

455
00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:36,040
much too selfishly. 
You know, I did have someone 

456
00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:38,240
mention, you know, like the way 
the government, you know, takes 

457
00:21:38,240 --> 00:21:39,960
advantage of people. 
And we look at like, we look at 

458
00:21:39,960 --> 00:21:43,160
businesses today and it's easy 
to point towards them, right? 

459
00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:47,960
But they do see people as as in 
a means to an end, right? 

460
00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:51,160
Like, I, I see these millions of
people who are going to buy a 

461
00:21:51,160 --> 00:21:54,000
cell phone as a way for me to 
make a product that they will 

462
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:55,840
buy so that I can become 
wealthy, right? 

463
00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:57,040
Yeah. 
I mean, I want to give them 

464
00:21:57,040 --> 00:21:59,360
something that's going to 
communicate, keep them in touch.

465
00:21:59,360 --> 00:22:01,200
But it's like, at the end of the
day, it's like they're concerned

466
00:22:01,200 --> 00:22:05,040
about making money. 
And and but we can trickle that 

467
00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:07,840
all the way down into our own 
hearts, right? 

468
00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:10,720
Because it's like, you know, at 
my job, you know, it. 

469
00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:14,640
Am I texting this person? 
Am, am I reaching out to this 

470
00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:18,160
person, you know, starting a 
conversation? 

471
00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:21,920
I'm, I'm doing air quotes, 
starting a conversation because 

472
00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:25,400
I'm really their friend or 
because I need to borrow that 

473
00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:27,960
thing from him and I'm just 
starting a conversation. 

474
00:22:27,960 --> 00:22:29,880
You know what I mean? 
It's like it's very subtle in 

475
00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:31,680
that way. 
And I, I have to check my heart 

476
00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:35,480
sometimes too, where it's like, 
am I friend with this person 

477
00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:37,640
because I want to love them and 
I want to care for them and I 

478
00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:39,840
want to minister to them, or 
because of what I might be able 

479
00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:41,640
to get? 
Well, that's, that's 

480
00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:44,320
interesting. 
I've that, I've, I've seen that 

481
00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:47,880
play out like a friend. 
I was talking to a friend once 

482
00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:51,440
and he was saying, yeah, I, I 
went home like he, he lived far 

483
00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:54,640
away and he went home and he was
visiting family for the holidays

484
00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:57,560
or something like that. 
And he said, one of my friends 

485
00:22:57,560 --> 00:22:59,120
from like high school reached 
out to me. 

486
00:22:59,120 --> 00:23:02,240
They saw I was there, came by, 
we had this good conversation. 

487
00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:04,160
And I mean, I was just so 
pumped. 

488
00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:07,560
I was just so pumped and it, you
know, but after, after a while, 

489
00:23:07,560 --> 00:23:11,160
he started talking to me about 
my insurance needs and started 

490
00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:14,760
to try to sell me insurance. 
And it's like, dude, I just 

491
00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:18,000
wanted to like I wanted, I 
wanted so badly to believe that 

492
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:21,040
this was real, like that you 
really wanted to have a 

493
00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:23,120
conversation and find out about 
me. 

494
00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:25,640
But instead you were fact 
finding about my life so that 

495
00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:27,800
you could sell me life insurance
for the four kids I have. 

496
00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:30,200
Yeah, you know what I mean? 
It's like, come on. 

497
00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:32,960
And but yeah, that's right. 
Like, that's that's the 

498
00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:35,560
mentality. 
Like, are you using people right

499
00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:37,160
for your own benefit? 
Are you? 

500
00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:40,080
Do you genuinely care about 
other people? 

501
00:23:40,120 --> 00:23:42,200
Yeah, and I think, I think we've
all probably felt that on 

502
00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:44,720
different levels, right? 
Like you, you, you think 

503
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:47,600
someone's genuine and, and we've
been that person too, right. 

504
00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,520
So we can't, we can't be too 
judgmental about it. 

505
00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:52,600
But it's like we've all felt 
that right, that someone wants 

506
00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:55,160
to be a genuine friend with us 
all to, to find out that it's 

507
00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:58,160
like, oh, they were some 
ulterior motive. 

508
00:23:58,640 --> 00:24:01,320
And I think that's where it's 
important for us to, to truly be

509
00:24:01,320 --> 00:24:04,560
genuinely concerned about each 
other and, and not to see people

510
00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:06,560
as well. 
They're, they're just there to 

511
00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:08,760
get me what I want. 
It's like, no, these are people 

512
00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:11,680
that got us placed in my life, 
people that it's my 

513
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:15,680
responsibility to help them 
grow, to shape and mold them to 

514
00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:19,640
I'm, I'm placed here to be the 
sandpaper that helps them become

515
00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:22,520
more like Christ. 
And equally, they are to be the 

516
00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:25,400
sandpaper in my life that makes 
me more like Christ. 

517
00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:28,200
And, and it's when we're 
committed to doing that for each

518
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:31,720
other that we truly are the body
and we work together to grow. 

519
00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:36,880
Right, So I think that like, I 
think that sometimes like to 

520
00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:41,320
your first point, first point, 
excuse me, like exposing our 

521
00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:43,720
first one and two, actually 
exposing the sand and then 

522
00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:46,040
confronting it. 
Like sometimes that's all you 

523
00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:47,920
need. 
Like if someone is genuinely 

524
00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:50,120
like they don't, maybe they 
don't see what they're doing 

525
00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:52,320
right and they recognize it like
they did here. 

526
00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:56,600
I was just looking here in 
chapter 5 and and 12 it says 

527
00:24:56,920 --> 00:25:01,160
then they said we will restore 
these and require nothing from 

528
00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:03,480
them. 
We will do as you say, right. 

529
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:07,320
It's like they immediately 
responded to what was happening.

530
00:25:07,320 --> 00:25:09,400
Yeah. 
Like Nehemiah basically just 

531
00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:13,800
pointed out, hey, you guys, 
these complaints have come up. 

532
00:25:14,520 --> 00:25:17,600
We don't need to be doing that. 
And like I think they saw 

533
00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:19,960
quickly saw the wisdom in like, 
why are we fighting with each 

534
00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:24,000
other, our real enemies outside?
And that's the same for us. 

535
00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:26,880
Like, why do I need to fight 
with you, Joe? 

536
00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:31,360
My enemy is the world, the flesh
and the devil. 

537
00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:33,320
I need to be fighting that, 
right. 

538
00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:36,560
So yeah. 
But we, I think honestly, 

539
00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:38,800
though, but like, and you may 
point, you pointed this out, 

540
00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:42,200
like more often than not, when 
you expose it, genuine people 

541
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:44,400
respond in a positive way. 
Yeah. 

542
00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:47,400
Yeah, but this, this actually 
reminds me of a conversation I 

543
00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:50,000
had with someone this Sunday 
morning. 

544
00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:53,240
And we were just talking about 
differences in in in beliefs 

545
00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:56,480
and, and what this guy was 
trying to say was that he just 

546
00:25:56,480 --> 00:26:00,360
didn't understand how how people
made some issues such a big 

547
00:26:00,360 --> 00:26:02,560
issue. 
And he's like, we, we agree on 

548
00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:05,960
the fundamentals. 
We agree, but like we're just 

549
00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:07,800
disagreeing on peripheral 
issues. 

550
00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:10,200
And it's like, why are we 
fighting and arguing about that?

551
00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:13,280
Can't we just agree that, you 
know, we're at least following 

552
00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:16,000
the same savior and just we have
these external issues. 

553
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:18,880
And I think that's, that's a 
really good example of, you 

554
00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:21,000
know, certain theological 
viewpoints within the church. 

555
00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:26,320
It's like we, excuse me, you 
know, we're open to as a church 

556
00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:30,120
having allowing different 
viewpoints that we're, we don't 

557
00:26:30,120 --> 00:26:34,360
force people into our belief 
system or like, obviously 

558
00:26:34,360 --> 00:26:35,920
there's certain things that 
we're going to say. 

559
00:26:35,920 --> 00:26:37,760
It's like, well, if you don't 
believe that Jesus was the son 

560
00:26:37,760 --> 00:26:39,600
of God, what then? 
We're not in fellowship 

561
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:41,080
together. 
If you don't believe in the 

562
00:26:41,080 --> 00:26:43,640
Trinity, if you don't believe 
in, you know, salvation through 

563
00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:46,560
by grace alone, through faith 
alone, those sorts of things. 

564
00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:49,920
It's like those are like those 
are non negotiables, but there 

565
00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:52,520
are other things that that we're
not gonna stand on those things 

566
00:26:52,520 --> 00:26:56,160
and force people. 
And so we can have some, some 

567
00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:58,400
abilities like let's not fight 
each other. 

568
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:00,600
Like you said, there's an enemy 
on the outside. 

569
00:27:00,600 --> 00:27:03,160
And it's like if we're so busy 
fighting each other on these 

570
00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:06,360
things that like at the end of 
the day, are, are not salvation 

571
00:27:06,360 --> 00:27:08,920
issues and are are just 
distracting us from the work of 

572
00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:12,240
building God's Kingdom, then 
we're we're failing to see the 

573
00:27:12,240 --> 00:27:14,160
real enemy. 
And Satan likes nothing more 

574
00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:15,800
than to cause us to turn on one 
another. 

575
00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:17,360
He's so happy. 
He doesn't have to do anything. 

576
00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:21,240
Yeah, he just, he just can sit 
back and watch it and laugh 

577
00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:23,840
because if I'm fighting with 
you, I'm definitely not sharing 

578
00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:25,200
the gospel with that guy down 
the road. 

579
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:27,200
Absolutely. 
Or with my neighbor or even with

580
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:28,840
my kid. 
Because all I think about is 

581
00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:30,480
this argument that I have going 
on with you. 

582
00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:32,560
Exactly. 
All week long at work, assumed 

583
00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:35,680
by it, all week long at work, 
you know, we're throwing in our 

584
00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:38,520
earbuds, listening to sermons, 
listening to things, not so that

585
00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:40,840
we can learn and grow and share,
like you said, share the gospel 

586
00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:43,440
or help the church grow, but so 
that the next time me and that 

587
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:45,240
guy have that argument, we can. 
We can. 

588
00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:46,640
Yeah. 
And that's not healthy. 

589
00:27:48,080 --> 00:27:50,000
It's not we're. 
Going to destroy ourselves from 

590
00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:51,960
the inside. 
No, we need to be 1 body, right?

591
00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:56,440
Like you look at one body and 
it's use any example, the 

592
00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:58,280
working out one always comes to 
my mind, right? 

593
00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:00,080
It's like if I'm going to if I'm
going to try to get fit and 

594
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:02,000
healthy, it's like my whole 
body's going to have to work 

595
00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:03,320
together. 
My hands are going to have to 

596
00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:06,160
stop shoving unhealthy garbage 
down my face. 

597
00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:10,400
Sour Patch Kids Mini Kit Kats. 
And and then my whole body's 

598
00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:14,040
going to have to work together 
to like lift weights, run on the

599
00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:16,480
treadmill, go for a walk, be 
healthy. 

600
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:19,520
Like our whole body. 
It takes the whole body working 

601
00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:23,240
together to not sabotage itself,
but to work together to grow. 

602
00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:24,400
And it's the same thing in the 
church. 

603
00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:27,640
It's like we all have to be 
focused, using our gift, using 

604
00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:31,360
our skills, using our ability to
help the church grow so that we 

605
00:28:31,360 --> 00:28:33,240
can become healthy and mature in
Christ. 

606
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:40,200
Yeah, I want to get back to, I 
want to get back to your sermon.

607
00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:47,600
Specifically in .2 you had 4-4 
sub points and basically 

608
00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:53,840
confront sin or confrontation, 
should seek self-control, should

609
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:58,960
seek the truth, should seek 
God's glory, and then should 

610
00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:03,040
seek reconciliation. 
And then you used another New 

611
00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:04,400
Testament passage to talk about 
that. 

612
00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:06,560
Do you remember which one it 
was? 

613
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:09,440
Yeah, Corinthians. 
Yeah. 

614
00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:11,720
And then you pointed back to. 
So I was just like, it was just 

615
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:15,240
really cool to watch. 
I really liked how you connected

616
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:18,480
the New Testament passage that 
you were using to kind of prove 

617
00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:19,760
something out. 
Because often, I mean, I'm 

618
00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:24,360
guilty of this is like, oh, I 
think there's a perfect verse in

619
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:28,320
that Paul's Paul wrote that 
applies here, right. 

620
00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:30,520
And then I just go read the 
verse and I don't. 

621
00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:33,680
And then I don't really like 
tell anyone how it really 

622
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:36,560
connects. 
And so like, I just appreciated 

623
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:37,560
what you did. 
So what? 

624
00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:39,240
What was it in Corinthians that 
you were talking about? 

625
00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:41,560
Yeah. 
And so and so, yeah. 

626
00:29:41,560 --> 00:29:43,480
I mean, my, my, my sermon 
preparation. 

627
00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:46,400
It's, it's not like a, it's not 
rocket science. 

628
00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:48,840
I I can explain it to people. 
It's very, very simple. 

629
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:51,640
What basically what I do when I 
read a text is I read it over 

630
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:54,000
and over and over and over and 
over and over and over and over 

631
00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:55,440
and over. 
Pacing around the gym. 

632
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:58,760
Pacing around the gym, walking 
around parking lot, I saturate 

633
00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:01,000
my mind with the text basically 
so that by the end of the week, 

634
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:04,720
it's like it's, it's locked in 
my mind, essentially not quite 

635
00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:07,880
memorized, but but pretty close.
And then I'm looking for the 

636
00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:09,800
divisions in the text. 
What what are points? 

637
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:11,840
And so in this, so in this 
chapter, it's very clearly 

638
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:13,760
broken up, right? 
You have, you have the people 

639
00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:15,960
come to Nehemiah, then you have 
Nehemiah confronting the 

640
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:18,200
leaders, and then you have 
Nehemiah sharing his practice, 

641
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:19,480
right? 
So there's three parts it's 

642
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:22,880
broken up. 
And then what I do is I explain 

643
00:30:22,880 --> 00:30:26,480
what's there, then I try to use 
an illustration just to help us 

644
00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:28,560
grasp the idea. 
There's usually an idea 

645
00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:30,920
somewhere in there that I'm 
really wanting us to understand 

646
00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:33,800
that I feel like the Holy Spirit
is leading me to like emphasize.

647
00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:37,400
And so I try to come up with an 
illustration and then I apply it

648
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:40,360
to us as a church more directly 
and more specifically. 

649
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:43,960
And so just, I mean, you're now 
that I say it, maybe people will

650
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:45,960
be more keen to like see it in 
the sermon, right? 

651
00:30:46,040 --> 00:30:47,680
Which I don't, it doesn't bother
me at all. 

652
00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:50,760
It's very simple. 
I'd love to, if anybody wants to

653
00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:52,640
learn how to study Scripture 
like that, I'd be more than 

654
00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:54,240
happy to sit down with you. 
But that's basically it. 

655
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:56,680
I explain it, I illustrate it, 
and then I apply it. 

656
00:30:57,280 --> 00:31:00,640
And so in this one, I felt like 
it was a good illustration for 

657
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:02,360
talking about like 
confrontation, right? 

658
00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:06,480
So here you had Paul here he, he
went to Corinth. 

659
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:09,040
He, you know, was with these 
people for a year and a half, 

660
00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:10,440
you know, spending his life 
there. 

661
00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:13,360
And after he leaves, people 
begin to turn on him, right? 

662
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:16,800
Fueled by, you know, some guy 
who came in and began to teach 

663
00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:19,840
them things that were different 
and opposite of what Paul was 

664
00:31:19,840 --> 00:31:23,520
teaching. 
And so Paul, actually, the part 

665
00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:26,360
that I left out of my sermon is 
he actually went back to Corinth

666
00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:30,200
and tried to confront them and 
he got insulted like, and 

667
00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:32,920
rebuked openly. 
And so he just left before 

668
00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:35,640
things got real bad. 
And then he writes them this 

669
00:31:35,640 --> 00:31:40,360
severe rebuke, this really, 
really hard letter that we don't

670
00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:42,760
have. 
He refers to it in Second 

671
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:46,400
Corinthians saying, I, I wrote 
to you and I, I rebuked you. 

672
00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:50,520
And basically he calls them out 
and they, they repent of their 

673
00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:52,120
sin, right? 
They confess that they were 

674
00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:55,480
wrong and they begin to 
discipline this guy who came in 

675
00:31:55,800 --> 00:31:59,720
and he repents too. 
And but then so the point was 

676
00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:01,800
that I was trying to bring up, 
it's like this whole idea of 

677
00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:04,920
confrontation. 
It's that it's to lead to 

678
00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:08,440
reconciliation. 
It's to lead to, like, not just 

679
00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:11,000
venting, not just getting 
something off my chest, not just

680
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:13,160
me letting you have it 'cause 
you sinned against me. 

681
00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:16,120
It's like I should be aimed at 
reconciling the situation. 

682
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:19,000
Let's restore what was broken, 
restore what was lost. 

683
00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:21,520
And that's exactly what Paul 
encourages him to do. 

684
00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:24,120
You now you need to forgive him.
Now you need to welcome him 

685
00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:25,840
back. 
Now you need to reaffirm your 

686
00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:28,640
love for him so that you know, 
'cause we know. 

687
00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:33,040
And he sort of says he may be 
overwhelmed by excess of sorrow,

688
00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:36,080
but he says sort of later on in 
the passage is like we're not 

689
00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:39,440
unaware of Satan's schemes. 
Like this is exactly what Satan 

690
00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:42,480
wants, right? 
He wants to like he wants to to 

691
00:32:42,480 --> 00:32:44,400
separate us, right, to divide 
us. 

692
00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:47,600
But the fact that he's 
repentant, that should welcome 

693
00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:49,240
him back, right? 
That's the goal. 

694
00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:52,040
If he repents, don't just like 
keep making him feel bad. 

695
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:54,880
He's repented. 
Now welcome him back and affirm 

696
00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:56,680
your love for him. 
And that's exactly what we need 

697
00:32:56,680 --> 00:32:59,760
to do as believers, that, you 
know, when there's sin and and 

698
00:32:59,760 --> 00:33:02,960
we confront it then and there's 
repentance that happens. 

699
00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:06,160
It's like, let's reconcile and 
then let's restore that unity, 

700
00:33:06,160 --> 00:33:09,040
that joy in worship. 
Man, that's, that's good. 

701
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:10,960
The reconciliation should be the
goal. 

702
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:13,560
I don't. 
I think that's probably I'm just

703
00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:15,840
thinking about what the world 
says. 

704
00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:17,360
The world says exactly what you 
said. 

705
00:33:17,360 --> 00:33:20,800
You said get it off your chest, 
let them have it because they 

706
00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:23,680
sinned against you, and then 
move on because then because why

707
00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:26,440
they'll be they'll be 6 more 
friends or six more people that 

708
00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:28,080
you can hang out with. 
You can just forget them. 

709
00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:32,120
Yep, the world says forget you. 
Yeah, I'm done with you. 

710
00:33:32,360 --> 00:33:34,520
Write you off forever. 
But in the church, we don't. 

711
00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:36,120
We can't do that. 
Yeah, that's not what? 

712
00:33:36,280 --> 00:33:38,920
Because that's not what Christ 
did for us, right? 

713
00:33:39,280 --> 00:33:46,120
Yeah, we deserve to be said to 
be told forget you, but that's 

714
00:33:46,120 --> 00:33:49,520
not what Jesus did. 
And so like we can't, we can't 

715
00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:52,400
be that We can't do the same 
thing to other people. 

716
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:53,600
Exactly. 
Yeah. 

717
00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:55,800
And I referenced this, this 
quote from John MacArthur where 

718
00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:59,200
he he basically says like Paul 
knew that like there's no room 

719
00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:02,680
for like man made limits, right 
on grace and forgiveness. 

720
00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:06,560
There there is no limit. 
Peter comes to he comes to Jesus

721
00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:08,520
and he says how many times do I 
got to forgive my brother? 

722
00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:12,360
And he's like, there's no end. 
It's, you know, 7 * 70. 

723
00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:14,040
Which wasn't the number like he 
was just saying. 

724
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:16,440
Right. 
It's like it's infinite, right? 

725
00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:18,560
Look at God's, like exactly what
you said, right? 

726
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:20,480
God's grace towards us is the 
example. 

727
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:22,880
It's like there's no limit. 
If they come and they're 

728
00:34:22,880 --> 00:34:25,760
repentant, it's like you forgive
and you and you reconcile the 

729
00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:29,199
relationship and you keep going.
Yeah, that's such a good word 

730
00:34:29,199 --> 00:34:33,719
for for all of us to think and 
like and to remember like, like 

731
00:34:33,920 --> 00:34:36,679
you could you could say, OK, 
well, I'm not going to forgive 

732
00:34:36,679 --> 00:34:39,400
that person. 
And then they, what happens to 

733
00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:41,159
them? 
They they end up being so 

734
00:34:41,159 --> 00:34:44,040
uncomfortable in the situation. 
They leave the church and then 

735
00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:46,880
you're like counting on the next
couple, family or whatever 

736
00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:52,480
friend to come in. 
And then, but eventually you're 

737
00:34:52,480 --> 00:34:54,960
going to realize that you're the
problem, right. 

738
00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:57,520
And it wasn't that person all 
along, because I'm having the 

739
00:34:57,520 --> 00:34:59,880
same issue I had with Frank that
now I'm having with Pete. 

740
00:35:00,240 --> 00:35:03,800
And it's all these things like, 
guys, you got it. 

741
00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:06,160
You got to reconcile. 
The goal is reconciliation. 

742
00:35:06,160 --> 00:35:09,480
And that's the same thing for 
someone like the Matthew 18, 

743
00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:11,400
right? 
The the goal is reconciliation. 

744
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:15,400
The goal is to bring a person 
back into the family, not kick 

745
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:16,520
them out. 
Right. 

746
00:35:16,520 --> 00:35:20,160
And there's and it brings about 
this idea that like and and even

747
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:22,400
if you so if you're not going to
reconcile and you're not and 

748
00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:24,200
you're just going to you just 
want to be bitter and you're 

749
00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:26,120
just going to keep that. 
OK, great. 

750
00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:28,080
I mean, I guess that's your 
choice. 

751
00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:30,280
But last week in our Bible 
reading plan, it's like you have

752
00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:31,520
the story of Joseph. 
Yeah. 

753
00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:34,960
And his brothers, you know, one 
day come to Egypt and they don't

754
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:37,920
know they're before Joseph. 
And Joseph begins to test them a

755
00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:40,720
little bit. 
And what do we see immediately, 

756
00:35:40,720 --> 00:35:44,080
Right. 
Their immediate response is, Oh 

757
00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:47,480
man, God is brushing us. 
They felt they felt guilty for 

758
00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:48,680
what they did to him. 
Yeah. 

759
00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:51,120
And they didn't know it was him.
Yeah, And it was like 20 years 

760
00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:55,000
later, they were still carrying 
that burden of guilt. 

761
00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:57,360
And so it's like, do you really 
want that? 

762
00:35:57,360 --> 00:36:00,120
Like if you're going to be 
unforgiving towards a brother or

763
00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:03,280
sister or you really just want 
to carry that baggage for the 

764
00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:05,640
rest of your life? 
I shared a story with my D group

765
00:36:05,680 --> 00:36:08,080
as we were talking about this 
passage and, you know, harboring

766
00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:09,920
bitterness and, and just 
carrying this burden. 

767
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:12,440
I shared a story that a friend 
had shared with me years ago. 

768
00:36:14,240 --> 00:36:15,480
The context of the story is kind
of weird. 

769
00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:17,560
I don't really understand it, 
but anyway, it'll make sense 

770
00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:20,960
when I say it. 
So like, there's this, back in 

771
00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:23,520
the day, you got a horse and 
buggy and this guy has his wagon

772
00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:26,480
and these boys come up and they 
fill his wagon with stones. 

773
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:28,920
And it's like, now he's got to 
take all these stones off, 

774
00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:30,160
right? 
He's like, I can't carry these 

775
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:33,160
stones around, It's too heavy. 
So he empties the stones off the

776
00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:36,840
wagon and then he leaves. 
Well, 20 years later, these got 

777
00:36:36,840 --> 00:36:40,160
these, these boys felt so guilty
that they had done this thing. 

778
00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:42,600
They they come to the guy and 
they confess it was it was us 

779
00:36:42,600 --> 00:36:44,040
who did it. 
We're really sorry. 

780
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:48,120
And he just said, well, he says,
I loaded the stones off my wagon

781
00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:50,640
and I forgot about it. 
You guys have been carrying 

782
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:53,800
those stones for 20 years. 
And it's like just a really 

783
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:55,960
interesting word picture that 
it's like, that's what happens 

784
00:36:55,960 --> 00:36:58,760
with unresolved sin. 
It's like you think you dealt 

785
00:36:58,760 --> 00:37:01,240
with it even for you to go like,
well, it doesn't bother me. 

786
00:37:01,240 --> 00:37:03,360
Yeah, it does. 
You're, you're carrying the 

787
00:37:03,360 --> 00:37:06,280
burden and the weight of that 
because it's in your mind, 

788
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:07,840
right? 
How many times? 

789
00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:10,440
I mean, you just, you just carry
things. 

790
00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:12,800
We have things in our life that 
it's like you, it's unresolved. 

791
00:37:13,080 --> 00:37:15,240
And every time you see that 
person, every time you hear 

792
00:37:15,240 --> 00:37:18,680
something about them, it's like 
it pops up in your mind and you 

793
00:37:18,680 --> 00:37:21,120
carry it. 
So are you willing that that's 

794
00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:22,440
the question you have to ask 
yourself. 

795
00:37:22,760 --> 00:37:27,080
Like, am I willing to carry this
for the rest of my life or 

796
00:37:27,360 --> 00:37:29,320
should I just deal with it now 
and be done with it? 

797
00:37:29,600 --> 00:37:31,160
Right, Right. 
Should I just kill it now? 

798
00:37:31,200 --> 00:37:33,160
Yeah. 
And then and be done with it? 

799
00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:37,600
Or do I want to, do I really 
want to carry this pain and this

800
00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:40,840
like anger, Cause anger is pain 
at some, on some level, like I'm

801
00:37:40,840 --> 00:37:43,040
angry with you. 
It's like I'm carrying something

802
00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:46,160
forward. 
Just get rid of it, right? 

803
00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:48,280
Like seek the truth, right? 
Yeah. 

804
00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:49,760
Confess it. 
Reconcile. 

805
00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:54,320
And, and at the end of the day, 
it's like there's not one that's

806
00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:57,360
easy and one that's hard. 
Like they're both hard. 

807
00:37:57,680 --> 00:37:58,960
You just have to pick your 
heart. 

808
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:01,480
Do do I want to do the hard 
thing of having a really 

809
00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:04,400
difficult conversation? 
But again, if it's aimed at 

810
00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:06,560
reconciliation, I feel like that
helps a lot, right? 

811
00:38:06,560 --> 00:38:08,160
If you're starting the 
conversation with like, hey, I 

812
00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:10,080
just want to make things right, 
but it's still hard. 

813
00:38:10,080 --> 00:38:11,280
I get it. 
It's very hard. 

814
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:14,360
Or you're doing the hard thing 
of like carrying that baggage 

815
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:16,480
for the rest of your life or 
however long you choose. 

816
00:38:17,080 --> 00:38:19,040
Both of them are hard. 
Yeah. 

817
00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:24,480
And the other thing too can't 
neglect is like if you have to 

818
00:38:24,480 --> 00:38:28,360
be willing to like to be OK with
the other person not seeing it 

819
00:38:28,480 --> 00:38:30,320
and not and not reconciling with
you. 

820
00:38:30,960 --> 00:38:34,680
Like at some point you can only 
do, you can only do so much. 

821
00:38:34,680 --> 00:38:37,000
You have to, you have to depend 
on the Lord to do the rest. 

822
00:38:37,160 --> 00:38:40,920
I think that's, that's hard 
because sometimes my excuse 

823
00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:42,440
would be, I don't want to do it 
because they're not going to 

824
00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:44,320
listen. 
They're not, they're not willing

825
00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:47,520
to do whatever. 
And, and I think that for me, 

826
00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:51,000
that would be, that would be the
hardest thing to overcome in my 

827
00:38:51,000 --> 00:38:54,240
mind, right. 
And so we have to like, do I 

828
00:38:54,240 --> 00:38:58,640
want to carry this forever? 
Well, like, no, but my excuse 

829
00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:00,120
would be like, well, they're 
going to carry it forever. 

830
00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:04,040
It's like, So what? 
Like I can only do my part, 

831
00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:05,680
right? 
And then I have to pray for them

832
00:39:05,680 --> 00:39:08,560
and trust the Lord will allow 
them to to see that too, and, 

833
00:39:08,800 --> 00:39:12,000
and to move on eventually. 
Yeah, it's really hard. 

834
00:39:12,160 --> 00:39:16,640
It is dealing with, dealing 
with, I mean, dealing sinners. 

835
00:39:17,080 --> 00:39:19,120
Dealing with sinners is hard 
because you're one too, right? 

836
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:21,360
We're all sinners trying to 
figure this thing out. 

837
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:23,720
Yeah, absolutely. 
The good thing is we don't. 

838
00:39:23,720 --> 00:39:26,720
We don't have to do it alone two
ways. 

839
00:39:26,720 --> 00:39:29,680
We don't have to do it alone 
because we're a body. 

840
00:39:29,720 --> 00:39:30,680
Act like it. 
Yeah. 

841
00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:32,800
And then we have the Lord's 
help, right? 

842
00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:36,040
We, we, we do have the Lord. 
We're if you're a Christian, 

843
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:38,400
you're indwelt by the Lord and 
the Spirit and the Spirit's in 

844
00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:41,800
you. 
And we often just like, think we

845
00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:43,880
can do it on our own, which is 
so crazy. 

846
00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:47,360
It is crazy anyway, but it is it
is so helpful to be thinking 

847
00:39:47,360 --> 00:39:49,520
about the fact that you know, 
like you said, that that we are 

848
00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:52,520
one body. 
Like Jesus wanted unity so much 

849
00:39:52,880 --> 00:39:56,040
that we have an entire chapter 
dedicated to his High priestly 

850
00:39:56,040 --> 00:39:58,720
prayer. 
You know in John chapter 17 of 

851
00:39:58,760 --> 00:40:02,520
of him wanting his disciples and
his people to have unity, so 

852
00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:05,760
much so that he didn't even just
pray for unity just among the 

853
00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:08,120
disciples, but for all who 
would. 

854
00:40:08,120 --> 00:40:10,560
Everybody that comes later. 
Everybody's going to come after.

855
00:40:10,560 --> 00:40:11,760
That's the unity that he prayed 
for. 

856
00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:14,560
That's the unity that he wants. 
He wants through his Spirit for 

857
00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:17,480
there to be unity. 
And that if it's important to 

858
00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:19,280
Christ, then it should be 
important to us as well. 

859
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:23,520
We should strive for that unity.
Yeah, there's no Alice. 

860
00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:25,680
There's not. 
Should we have to? 

861
00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:28,600
Yeah, like that's that, that's 
our, that's pretty much. 

862
00:40:28,600 --> 00:40:31,880
I don't know if it's a command, 
but we need to make sure that 

863
00:40:31,880 --> 00:40:33,720
that's what we're doing. 
Yeah, absolutely. 

864
00:40:33,720 --> 00:40:37,360
Yeah. 
Oh, killing sin in the body? 

865
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:38,840
Killing sin or what? 
Who said that? 

866
00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:41,440
John Owen said what? 
I didn't. 

867
00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:44,040
I didn't. 
I didn't quote John Owen, but 

868
00:40:44,040 --> 00:40:45,600
he, he, he. 
Just came up today when we were 

869
00:40:45,600 --> 00:40:46,840
talking. 
Yeah, he said. 

870
00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:50,280
You must be killing sin or sin 
will be killing you. 

871
00:40:51,080 --> 00:40:55,360
And that that's the truth. 
I think so many times I, I 

872
00:40:55,360 --> 00:40:59,920
shared, I shared an article with
my D group this morning and in 

873
00:40:59,920 --> 00:41:03,440
the beginning of that article, 
I'm just going to quickly pull 

874
00:41:03,440 --> 00:41:05,040
it up here. 
He shares this really, really 

875
00:41:05,040 --> 00:41:08,080
interesting anecdote. 
He says the deadliest snake in 

876
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:09,640
the world. 
This is this is on the Gospel 

877
00:41:09,640 --> 00:41:12,200
Coalition website by Grant 
Gaines. 

878
00:41:12,600 --> 00:41:15,960
The the title of the article is 
John Owens 9 instructions for 

879
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:18,800
killing sin. 
He says the deadliest snake in 

880
00:41:18,800 --> 00:41:22,160
the world is Australia's inland 
Taipan. 

881
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:26,760
The venom from one bite can kill
100 full grown humans. 

882
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:31,640
Imagine you come home to find 
this venomous killer coiled up 

883
00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:33,440
in your living room. 
What would you do? 

884
00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:36,240
You wouldn't encourage your kids
to play with it. 

885
00:41:36,240 --> 00:41:37,440
Wait, I would burn the house 
down. 

886
00:41:38,680 --> 00:41:39,880
Me too. 
I hate snakes. 

887
00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:42,240
You wouldn't keep it around as a
pet. 

888
00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:45,080
No, you'd grab a shovel and you 
would aim for its head. 

889
00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:48,680
We have something far more 
dangerous in our homes and our 

890
00:41:48,680 --> 00:41:52,480
hearts sin. 
Sadly, too many people play with

891
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:54,800
sin instead of putting it to 
death. 

892
00:41:55,760 --> 00:41:58,040
And then he goes on to court. 
John Owen, he famously warns 

893
00:41:58,040 --> 00:42:03,040
Christians be killing sin or it 
will be killing you, which is a 

894
00:42:03,040 --> 00:42:05,360
book that he wrote from is from 
a book that he wrote the 

895
00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:08,560
mortification of sin on Romans 
8, verse 13. 

896
00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:11,000
For if you live according to the
flesh, you will die. 

897
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:14,280
But if by the spirit you put to 
death the deeds of the body, you

898
00:42:14,280 --> 00:42:18,000
will live. 
And so, so many, so many times 

899
00:42:18,000 --> 00:42:21,680
it's like we, we play around 
with sin, we minimize its 

900
00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:23,560
effects. 
We minimize, it's not really 

901
00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:25,160
that bad. 
We just sort of like keep it in 

902
00:42:25,160 --> 00:42:26,960
the corner. 
We don't really do all that much

903
00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:28,920
to kill it. 
It's like we sort of become OK. 

904
00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:31,000
You shared the sermon 
illustration, you know, months 

905
00:42:31,000 --> 00:42:34,760
ago about, you know, this, this 
guy and, and you know, this Holy

906
00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:37,600
Spirit that wants to kill this 
sin and this guy and he's like, 

907
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:39,680
he's just trying to justify why 
it's OK. 

908
00:42:39,680 --> 00:42:41,760
It's like he's just become used 
to it being here. 

909
00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:46,360
And, and we need to have a 
hatred for sin, that God, God 

910
00:42:46,360 --> 00:42:51,480
hates sin. 
It, it destroys our relationship

911
00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:53,240
with him. 
It kicked Adam and Eve out of 

912
00:42:53,240 --> 00:42:55,440
the garden. 
Like one sin was enough to 

913
00:42:55,440 --> 00:42:57,800
remove them from the presence of
God. 

914
00:42:57,800 --> 00:43:00,760
And it's like we just have to 
learn to hate sin and to be 

915
00:43:00,760 --> 00:43:03,520
killing it and, and to be very 
diligent. 

916
00:43:03,520 --> 00:43:05,240
And so maybe we can share this 
article. 

917
00:43:05,520 --> 00:43:07,920
Yeah, for sure in the in the 
podcast notes that might be 

918
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:11,280
helpful to some people. 
Yeah, and infighting amongst 

919
00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:15,240
yourselves is sin, yeah. 
Yeah. 

920
00:43:15,240 --> 00:43:16,880
So that was yeah, yeah, 
absolutely it. 

921
00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:19,120
Is like infighting. 
Infighting is sin in itself, but

922
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:22,120
but so is like it's not just 
what happened before the fight. 

923
00:43:22,960 --> 00:43:27,840
Like the one sin calls more sin,
which in turn causes even more 

924
00:43:27,840 --> 00:43:31,640
sin, which in turn causes people
to to harbor bitterness and 

925
00:43:31,640 --> 00:43:34,440
hate, which is more sin like. 
That's how that's how come it 

926
00:43:34,440 --> 00:43:37,000
kills you so fast. 
Yeah, yeah. 

927
00:43:37,000 --> 00:43:40,000
And so the so the point that I 
drew out here is that that way 

928
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:42,960
that we kill sin in the body is 
by being servants, right? 

929
00:43:42,960 --> 00:43:46,760
We serve not to get but to give.
And this is how Nehemiah lived. 

930
00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:49,640
He like what we learned in this 
story is that, you know, rather 

931
00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:52,360
than, you know, using his 
position to take take advantage 

932
00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:54,400
of people, he used his position 
to serve. 

933
00:43:54,720 --> 00:43:57,560
And he provided for himself. 
He provided for his own people. 

934
00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:00,840
He he did that on his own. 
And he even helped with the work

935
00:44:00,840 --> 00:44:02,840
on the wall, right? 
Like he wasn't, he wasn't there,

936
00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:05,040
just standing around. 
Like passive, like an overseer, 

937
00:44:05,040 --> 00:44:08,360
like no, you do this. 
Yeah, I, I worked on the wall. 

938
00:44:08,360 --> 00:44:10,840
I've also persevered in the work
on the wall, he says in verse 

939
00:44:10,840 --> 00:44:13,840
16. 
And so so he was looking for how

940
00:44:13,840 --> 00:44:17,040
to give, you know, not to get. 
He wasn't, you know, OK, I'm now

941
00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:18,440
in this position. 
Now I'm the governor. 

942
00:44:18,440 --> 00:44:21,400
Now I get this is what I get 
because of the position I'm in. 

943
00:44:21,400 --> 00:44:23,040
That's not what his mentality 
was. 

944
00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:26,160
He wanted to give and he also 
wanted to please God. 

945
00:44:26,160 --> 00:44:28,640
And so that was the second part 
that we serve not to please man,

946
00:44:28,640 --> 00:44:30,680
but God. 
You know, his prayer at the end 

947
00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:33,640
of the chapter that you know, 
remember for my good, Oh my God,

948
00:44:33,640 --> 00:44:35,600
all that I have done for this 
people. 

949
00:44:35,600 --> 00:44:37,160
He wants to be pleasing to God 
and I. 

950
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:39,440
And when we do that, we kill sin
in our life, right? 

951
00:44:39,440 --> 00:44:43,840
When we serve out of desire to 
bless others, to help them grow,

952
00:44:44,120 --> 00:44:46,600
to help them and, and 
spiritually nourish and 

953
00:44:46,600 --> 00:44:49,680
strengthen them. 
And our desire is to please God.

954
00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:52,960
You're going to kill sin in your
life because you're seeking to 

955
00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:55,680
do what's what's glorifying to 
God and most beneficial to other

956
00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:57,640
people. 
And it's like sin doesn't have 

957
00:44:57,640 --> 00:44:59,800
room there, right? 
That's so good. 

958
00:45:01,320 --> 00:45:02,720
It's, it was a really helpful 
chapter. 

959
00:45:02,720 --> 00:45:05,120
I don't, I don't know. 
I don't know that I would have 

960
00:45:05,600 --> 00:45:07,000
come to the conclusions that you
did. 

961
00:45:07,440 --> 00:45:10,000
I just appreciated your work on 
this on this. 

962
00:45:10,360 --> 00:45:12,040
You'd had a different flavor and
you'd have done it. 

963
00:45:12,040 --> 00:45:13,280
It would have been slightly. 
It would have been good. 

964
00:45:13,280 --> 00:45:14,600
Yeah, yeah, that's true. 
We do. 

965
00:45:14,600 --> 00:45:16,400
We do come at things from 
different perspectives. 

966
00:45:16,600 --> 00:45:18,280
Well, and I think that's, I 
think that's good and healthy, 

967
00:45:18,280 --> 00:45:19,960
right? 
Like all all three of us pastors

968
00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:22,560
preach differently and you draw 
different things out of the text

969
00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:25,360
And, and, and because the truth 
of the truth of the matter is 

970
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:28,760
it's like, I could preach the 
same chapter in a month or two 

971
00:45:28,760 --> 00:45:31,720
months in a year and I and I'd 
probably draw different things 

972
00:45:31,720 --> 00:45:34,520
out then. 
You know, I think a really 

973
00:45:34,520 --> 00:45:36,560
beautiful, and this is, this is 
a really helpful thing to think 

974
00:45:36,560 --> 00:45:39,960
about because some people, some 
you, you might have a favorite 

975
00:45:39,960 --> 00:45:43,400
pastor that you listen to and, 
and you know, you could ask the 

976
00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:44,520
question. 
I ask this question all the 

977
00:45:44,520 --> 00:45:46,200
time. 
It's like, you know, if you can 

978
00:45:46,200 --> 00:45:48,800
listen to, you know, the best 
preachers in the world, why 

979
00:45:48,800 --> 00:45:51,720
would you listen to me? 
I don't really answer that 

980
00:45:51,720 --> 00:45:54,240
question. 
Maybe you shouldn't listen to 

981
00:45:54,240 --> 00:45:56,040
me. 
But I think I think the reason 

982
00:45:56,040 --> 00:45:58,920
why God puts pastors in 
different areas is because we 

983
00:45:58,920 --> 00:46:01,400
live in a world where it's like,
you can listen to the best 

984
00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:05,600
preachers all the time, But our 
job as pastors is, is to take 

985
00:46:05,600 --> 00:46:07,760
this word. 
And what does it mean to this 

986
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:11,360
specific body of believers and 
what they're specifically going 

987
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:15,120
through in this season of life 
in this context in Leamington ON

988
00:46:15,320 --> 00:46:19,520
right in 2025 in February. 
What are we going through that 

989
00:46:19,520 --> 00:46:23,120
this word has to and you know, 
you can't get that from a pastor

990
00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:25,880
who's who's preached this text 
20 years ago. 

991
00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:28,840
It's God's word is still 
obviously going to connect and 

992
00:46:28,840 --> 00:46:30,160
they're still going to be 
connecting points. 

993
00:46:30,160 --> 00:46:32,960
But that's where it's like a 
pastor knows what's uniquely 

994
00:46:32,960 --> 00:46:35,520
going on in that body in that 
season of time. 

995
00:46:35,840 --> 00:46:38,600
And God works through that to to
give them the word that they 

996
00:46:38,600 --> 00:46:39,280
need. 
Right. 

997
00:46:39,280 --> 00:46:41,200
And if he doesn't know he 
should, he shouldn't be their 

998
00:46:41,200 --> 00:46:43,480
pastor, right? 
So that's that's the other thing

999
00:46:43,480 --> 00:46:43,920
too. 
So. 

1000
00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:46,000
Yeah, you got to know the flock.
Yeah, very good. 

1001
00:46:46,880 --> 00:46:55,200
All right, Joe Almost said. 
P Joe, any final thoughts on on 

1002
00:46:55,240 --> 00:46:59,080
the sermon from Sunday? 
I think just a further 

1003
00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:02,680
application of find ways, find 
ways to be the body, you know, 

1004
00:47:03,160 --> 00:47:05,120
I, I don't know, I don't, I 
don't always know what that 

1005
00:47:05,120 --> 00:47:06,360
means for. 
You, man, I really think it's. 

1006
00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:10,000
Dude, eat more food together. 
Like get together. 

1007
00:47:10,080 --> 00:47:12,800
Yeah, take time. 
Like make like we have time. 

1008
00:47:12,920 --> 00:47:14,720
You're not too busy to have a 
meal with your friends. 

1009
00:47:14,720 --> 00:47:17,200
And I'll be the first to 
confess, you know, we visited, 

1010
00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:19,160
we visited a a family this week,
too. 

1011
00:47:19,160 --> 00:47:21,040
And I just said to Jessica on 
the way home, I was like, you 

1012
00:47:21,040 --> 00:47:24,200
know what, we need to sit in 
more people's living rooms, you 

1013
00:47:24,200 --> 00:47:27,400
know, and, and get to know them 
and hear their stories. 

1014
00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:29,640
And there's just, there's 
something that different, Like 

1015
00:47:29,880 --> 00:47:32,720
we can talk on a Sunday after 
church and have a conversation 

1016
00:47:32,720 --> 00:47:35,080
in the foyer or in the sanctuary
or whatever. 

1017
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:37,160
And that's can be great. 
And it can be a great time of 

1018
00:47:37,160 --> 00:47:39,240
blessing. 
There's just something the 

1019
00:47:39,240 --> 00:47:41,240
different that happens, a 
different connection that 

1020
00:47:41,240 --> 00:47:44,120
happens when you're sitting on 
someone's couch exactly and 

1021
00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:46,320
listening to them and you use 
your sharing in life more 

1022
00:47:46,320 --> 00:47:48,240
personally. 
And so that might be a really 

1023
00:47:48,240 --> 00:47:50,200
good encouragement. 
See, I do, man, I think. 

1024
00:47:50,200 --> 00:47:52,720
More people's living rooms. 
Sit down, have real 

1025
00:47:52,720 --> 00:47:55,640
conversations, leave your phone 
in the car, right? 

1026
00:47:55,960 --> 00:47:59,760
Look people in the eye, have a 
conversation with them and I'm 

1027
00:47:59,760 --> 00:48:02,200
like staring at you in the eye. 
Now it's like, I can't say that 

1028
00:48:02,200 --> 00:48:04,360
and not do it, but that's that 
to me, that's it. 

1029
00:48:04,360 --> 00:48:07,960
It's like, dude, just just 
disconnect from whatever it is 

1030
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:10,440
you're trying to like fill in 
this void. 

1031
00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:13,240
You're trying when you use your 
phone or your devices and you 

1032
00:48:13,240 --> 00:48:15,880
whatever, you're trying to fill 
a void that you can get by 

1033
00:48:15,880 --> 00:48:18,240
sitting on the sofa with 
somebody and having a 

1034
00:48:18,240 --> 00:48:21,080
conversation about their life. 
It's just that's what that to 

1035
00:48:21,080 --> 00:48:24,040
me, that's it man Form 
relationships, be willing and 

1036
00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:28,600
open and as hard as it is, be 
vulnerable at times to an 

1037
00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:31,400
extent, you don't need to be 
open, like open the book right 

1038
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:34,080
away, but like just be willing 
to be a friend. 

1039
00:48:34,080 --> 00:48:36,120
Yeah. 
Friendship matters, and 

1040
00:48:36,640 --> 00:48:39,520
specifically Christian 
friendship is the most important

1041
00:48:39,520 --> 00:48:41,240
kind because it's centered on 
Christ. 

1042
00:48:41,440 --> 00:48:43,920
Yeah, and the closer we are, the
less we're going to want to sin 

1043
00:48:43,960 --> 00:48:46,400
against each other, right. 
It's like I and we see this like

1044
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:49,520
when, when you, you know, with 
your kids or your wife or, you 

1045
00:48:49,520 --> 00:48:51,280
know, some people that are 
really close to you, it's like, 

1046
00:48:51,280 --> 00:48:54,120
man, you're you're willing to do
almost anything to protect them,

1047
00:48:54,120 --> 00:48:56,680
to save them, to defend them. 
And that's exactly what we're 

1048
00:48:56,680 --> 00:48:59,640
talking about. 
The closer we are together as 

1049
00:48:59,760 --> 00:49:02,960
the body of Christ, as brothers 
and sisters in Christ, and the 

1050
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:06,440
less sin there's going to be. 
Yeah, it's really good, Really, 

1051
00:49:06,440 --> 00:49:08,840
really good. 
Next week we'll be talking about

1052
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:11,800
EMI 6. 
Professor Jake will be preaching

1053
00:49:11,800 --> 00:49:12,680
that, I think. 
Yep. 

1054
00:49:13,680 --> 00:49:17,320
And then yeah. 
So we're grateful for you guys 

1055
00:49:17,320 --> 00:49:19,720
who are listening. 
If you have questions, send them

1056
00:49:19,720 --> 00:49:20,760
in. 
We haven't received a question 

1057
00:49:20,760 --> 00:49:22,960
in a while from you guys, so I 
don't know if that means that we

1058
00:49:22,960 --> 00:49:26,400
were just doing such a great job
or that you're not listening or 

1059
00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:28,920
whatever. 
If you have a question, send it 

1060
00:49:29,000 --> 00:49:34,080
to beyondsunday@lemchurch.ca and
we'll be glad to answer your 

1061
00:49:34,080 --> 00:49:36,880
questions. 
Why don't I pray and we'll close

1062
00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:41,000
it out. 
Father, thank you so much for an

1063
00:49:41,000 --> 00:49:46,960
edifying conversation about 
reconciliation and dealing with 

1064
00:49:46,960 --> 00:49:51,880
sin inside our inside our church
and inside different 

1065
00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:54,520
relationships we have with maybe
it's a family. 

1066
00:49:55,880 --> 00:49:59,440
You have hard, hard 
conversations that need to be 

1067
00:49:59,440 --> 00:50:00,560
had. 
So Lord, I pray that you would 

1068
00:50:00,560 --> 00:50:04,080
give us the courage to trust 
you. 

1069
00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:08,400
I know that's that seems silly, 
but I sometimes I need courage 

1070
00:50:08,400 --> 00:50:10,360
to trust you. 
So Lord, I pray that that you 

1071
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:15,080
would give us and our church 
courage to to do the hard thing 

1072
00:50:15,480 --> 00:50:19,040
because it's all hard. 
Ignoring it is hard and in doing

1073
00:50:19,040 --> 00:50:22,520
something about like the pain in
the the conflict is hard. 

1074
00:50:22,520 --> 00:50:26,160
But Lord, I pray that you would 
give us the the courage to do 

1075
00:50:26,160 --> 00:50:29,880
it, to step out in faith and to 
trust you to deal with sin, to 

1076
00:50:29,880 --> 00:50:31,400
be killing it before it kills 
us. 

1077
00:50:32,080 --> 00:50:34,160
So when I pray these things in 
Jesus name, Amen. 

1078
00:50:34,440 --> 00:50:36,280
Amen. 
Thanks, LEMC, we're praying for 

1079
00:50:36,280 --> 00:50:37,640
you. 
Have a great week.