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Hello and welcome to embodied 
astrology. 

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My name is Renee Sills. 
I'm a Consulting. 

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Astrologer astrology teacher and
somatic. 

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Educator. 
I'm interested in the ways 

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astrology helps expand 
conversations around embodiment 

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art process, politics and more. 
In this special episode. 

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I'm talking with Evian Whitney 
about embodiment and Technology,

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the evolution of sensual and 
sexual identities. 

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Non-binary anus asexuality. 
Feminism and sexuality. 

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And of course astrology. 
We'll be considering all of 

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these themes in relation to 
current astrology, and 

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everyone's natal chart. 
Evian Whitney is a sexuality, 

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Doula sex educator. 
And sensualist, since 2011, 

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their work has focused on 
decolonizing and shaming and 

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liberating sexuality at the 
intersections of identity 

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trauma, healing pleasure and 
embodiment. 

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Evian is the author of sensual 
self prompts and practices for 

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getting in touch with your body,
a self-guided journal that will 

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help you prioritize your 
pleasure and come home to 

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yourself. 
Through your senses. 

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They're also the host of the 
Central Self podcast, which is a

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wonderful resource for sex and 
sexuality education, pleasure 

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practices embodiment and more. 
I'm releasing this episode on 

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May 1st 2022. 
The day after a new moon and 

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solar eclipse in the sign. 
Taurus Taurus is often 

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considered the Earth. 
Easiest of all the Earth signs. 

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It relates directly to our 
bodies and our sensate, sensual 

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existence in this way. 
Taurus is closely associated 

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with pleasure, desire. 
Fire and satisfaction the outer 

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planet, Uranus is transiting 
Taurus, between 2018 and 2016, 

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Uranus in astrology represents 
queerness Innovation 

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destabilization and Revolution. 
This Transit has accompanied a 

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huge wave of interest and 
embodiment, and somatic 

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practices with eclipses, in 
Taurus and Scorpio this year 

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needs for evolution and 
Revolution when it comes to 

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embody autonomy, pleasure 
trauma, and somatic 

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Consciousness are emphasized. 
Everyone's work with Directly 

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with all of these themes and the
Insight that they bring around. 

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Their work is necessary 
medicine. 

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In these times. 
I'm so excited to share this 

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conversation with you and I hope
you enjoy it as much as I did. 

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First of all, let me just say 
thank you for being a guest on. 

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Embodied astrology. 
It is a real pleasure to have 

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you here. 
Oh my gosh. 

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It's an honor. 
Honestly to be here. 

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I'm really excited about our 
conversation. 

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Yeah, yeah, me too. 
I'm going to probably ask you a 

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fair amount of questions about 
what it is that you do and I 

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feel like you're, you know, 
sometimes like there's an 

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introduction to a guest or 
something like that and I feel 

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like that's going to unfold and 
of course if I was talking but I

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also wonder if yeah, if there's 
any particular way that you 

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really feel like you like to 
kind of introduce yourself to 

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people or want people to know. 
You right off the bat. 

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Yeah. 
Well, my name is Evie on and we 

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will start there. 
I call myself a sexuality Doula,

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and these days, I'm really 
leaning into my sex, educator 

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background and refining that, 
too, or at least expanding that 

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to be inclusive of sensuality 
and wanting to be like a 

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sensuality educator. 
I think that, that is an aspect 

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of our sexuality, that is really
important. 

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That not a lot of people talk 
about. 

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So I'm really jazzed about this 
space that I'm in really 

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defining that not even just 
within my work but within my own

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personal process, like learning 
who I am as a sexual being or a 

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sensual being, and like learning
learning what my body can do and

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learning what my body feels. 
And yeah, I there's so many 

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things, there's so many things 
but I'll I'll just I'll stop 

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there. 
Yeah. 

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Yeah, thank you for that. 
I feel like you're also a person

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and I identify like this to like
that you bring a lot of 

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different streams together and 
that you're also like knowledge 

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hungry, you know, and like 
you're just probably going to 

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keep learning and maybe changing
the name of what it is that you 

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do and how it is that you do 
that for a long time. 

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Just so good to meet you today. 
Yeah. 

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Exactly. 
It's totally that. 

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I've been thinking about that a 
lot as I get older, and I'm 

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starting to add different 
labels. 

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And descriptors of who I am, 
like really embodying those 

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things. 
And I'm like, wow, you know, I'm

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literally transforming every 
single day. 

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You know, there's always 
something new for me to discover

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and I am very hungry. 
Like, I'm always wanting to 

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learn more. 
Like I have this imperative to 

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to evolve and I think that is 
really Ali reflected in my work.

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I try not to make it so apparent
because it could get a little 

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scattered. 
But, yeah, my work is, I think 

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an expression of the constant 
work that I'm doing on myself 

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personally boo. 
Yeah, I feel you. 

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So, yeah, I first came into 
contact with your work. 

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I believe it was in 2016. 
When you were also living in 

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Portland, where I am on Chinook 
territory, and I was producing 

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them pan. 
On on, on sexual healing and I 

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was interested in talking to 
people about their Journeys with

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healing through sexuality. 
And so you were for by some of 

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the folks at shoo-bop at the 
feminist sex store. 

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Yeah, sure. 
And I remember we had a couple 

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of back and forth and it didn't 
quite work out for you to be on 

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the panel at that time. 
And then as it happens, you 

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know, it was like I know my life
was in a big space of transition

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at that time and I lost track of
you for a while and then came 

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back in contact with your work 
last year and was just astounded

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to see what you had built. 
And this like, incredible. 

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I want to call it a Ministry, 
like, that's kind of what it 

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feels like to me. 
You know, that, that you're 

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really creating a lot of 
sanctuary and healing space for 

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people through embodiment. 
And uplifting the energy of 

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pleasure, and sensuality and 
sexuality and desire, and 

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healing. 
So yeah, it's been real cool to 

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kind of come back into orbit 
with you and into contact with 

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all the things that you're 
doing. 

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And I feel like they're doing a 
lot. 

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And yeah, before I get into all 
that, I want to say that this 

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morning. 
I was listening to a recent 

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podcast episode of yours when 
you talk to Adrian Marie Brown, 

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Who's a big inspiration for me? 
And it was, it was such a 

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pleasure to hear the two of you 
in conversation together. 

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I love that conversation. 
It was so good. 

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Yeah. 
Yeah, I I felt like I learned a 

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lot and that listening to both 
of you and the ways that you 

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boast frame, your Journeys and 
wisdom around embodiment and 

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pleasure and activism, really 
helped me like, remember and 

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clarify, deep truths. 
That have also felt resident for

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me, and my journey And it's like
I went thing that I really love 

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about, you know, there's a lot 
to say about living in 2021. 

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But one thing that I love about 
living at this time is that 

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there's this kind of chorus and 
like synchronicity. 

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I feel like with a lot of folks 
like coming to certain wisdoms 

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through various different paths 
and like speaking. 

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Yeah, speaking to this 
remembering and and then when I 

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was I was reading your workbook 
that you sent me and in the 

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beginning of it, you know, you 
have this offering around like, 

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tuning in with relationship to 
technology and your you've made 

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this workbook to be tactile and 
sensory and like to write to 

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bring people into this bodily 
process. 

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And all that to say is like I 
Was preparing for this 

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conversation today and we were 
emailing and we're going to get 

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together on zoom and I was like,
I have never even met this 

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person in real life. 
Like I don't know how they 

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smell. 
I don't know how tall they are. 

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And I feel like a friend but 
then this distance and I have a 

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lot of questions about 
technology. 

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Anyway, I'm like, how do you 
feel about, you know, coming 

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into this space? 
And is there anything I guess 

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that you want to like offer at 
the beginning of this podcast? 

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As we come into this 
conversation, either for 

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listeners or for us together to 
like help us ground in this time

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and through this medium? 
Yeah, that's so real. 

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I think about this a lot as 
someone who is really putting a 

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lot of focus on. 
Since you ality and somatic 

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work, like, I mean, kind of 
touching back to the scattered 

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nature of all, the things that 
I'm interested in. 

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I got really really inspired 
this year at the beginning of 

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this year, really to study 
somatic work and to really dive 

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deep into the deeper Realms and 
nuances, and Landscapes of the 

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body, and the feelings, and 
Sensations, and emotions. 

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And Stories and traumas, like I 
really in my work. 

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I I think my education has been 
focused on the body through sex 

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and pleasure and orgasm. 
And, you know, I sort of regret 

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that The other Realms and 
experiences of being in the 

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body. 
I didn't really explore all that

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much. 
And so, I mean, that's really 

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exciting time thinking about the
ways that my body and habits 

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space and the things that the 
information that my body is 

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constantly taking in and the 
information that my body is 

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trying to give to me as well. 
As this really weird, kind of 

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contradiction that I'm rubbing 
up against around the work that 

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I do and And the podcast that I 
have and the social media 

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presence that I have, it's all 
very digital, you know, so like 

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on the one hand, in my personal 
life. 

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I'm really trying to ground 
myself into my body and even 

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ground myself into my work and 
new ways. 

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We're like, that's one of the 
reasons why I'm so excited about

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this journal because it is, it 
is something that I created that

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is outside of me. 
It doesn't live in the digital 

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space. 
It'll be something that can rest

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on somebody's bookshelf and they
can hold and Put in there, you 

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know bags and they can doodle on
like, I'm so jazzed about that. 

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So I've been having a lot of 
excitement around the sensual 

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experience of being in space, 
with people, or being, or 

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creating space for people like 
something. 

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I'm thinking about even now is 
us having this conversation. 

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Usually, when I do podcasts, 
it's like, you know, I'm in a 

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dark closet and like are Cameras
are closed or off and it's just 

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audio. 
And so I've been playing with 

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like what does it feel like for 
me to actually take up space 

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with my body and to like show up
in ways that are physical 

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tangible sensual, you know, 
while also again that 

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contradiction of being on the 
internet. 

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I mean, it's probably one of the
least sensual places is to be on

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the internet, you know, and What
I try to do with my work is. 

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I try to marry those things. 
I don't even know if Mary's the 

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right word, but I tried to find 
a way like, how can we have both

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at the same time? 
You know, like how can I use the

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internet to help people connect 
to their bodies and connect to 

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themselves? 
And how can I use the essential 

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practices that I have cooked up 
to get people maybe off the 

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internet, you know? 
And and to be in touch with 

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their bodies and this is really 
new territory for me. 

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You know, I've always wanted to 
have my work be More received in

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the Physical Realm and to, you 
know, have these very tactile 

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and sensory experiences with the
work. 

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I mean, right, before, covid 
happened. 

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I was just starting to get into 
this groove of doing like 

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speaking events and teaching 
workshops and then covid 

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happened. 
And so, you know, kind of like 

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threw off my groove. 
But now it's like, okay. 

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This is an invitation for me to 
explore. 

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What is possible here, you know,
and Yeah, lots lots of good 

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stuff in there around boundaries
and making sure that, you know, 

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I'm able to hold space for 
myself as I'm exploring these 

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contradictory spaces of being in
the digital realm and also in a 

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non digital realm and off of the
internet, you know? 

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Yeah. 
Yeah. 

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All that resonates so much for 
me. 

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I remember talking to a friend 
of mine. 

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Moms when I was 12 or 13 and the
internet was a new thing. 

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Like it was a, it was a real new
thing. 

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And yeah, yeah, and I was, I was
really excited about it. 

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I was definitely like an early 
internet proponent, and my mom 

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was pretty witchy and she had 
kind of witchy friends, and I 

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remember talking to one of them 
and saying, I think the internet

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is training wheels for humans. 
To remember that were psychic. 

225
00:13:59,500 --> 00:14:03,100
And it's, it's been curious to 
me over the last several years, 

226
00:14:03,100 --> 00:14:07,300
especially after getting a 
smartphone. 

227
00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:11,900
And then also, especially since 
Instagram, where I've developed 

228
00:14:11,900 --> 00:14:14,600
relationships with the internet 
and with social media in 

229
00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:20,500
particular, that feel like 
simultaneously, so, generative 

230
00:14:20,500 --> 00:14:26,800
and life-giving, because I'm 
coming into contact with like 

231
00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:28,900
what. 
I feel to be true kin like as a,

232
00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:31,700
you know, I Person that I felt 
lonely a lot of my life. 

233
00:14:31,700 --> 00:14:35,200
And I'm like, I have all these 
like, kind of bizarre interests 

234
00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:41,300
and I feel like, I don't always 
find community so easily, and 

235
00:14:41,300 --> 00:14:43,400
then it's like being on social 
media. 

236
00:14:43,400 --> 00:14:46,000
Sometimes I'm like, oh, this is 
like Hogwarts, like here, all 

237
00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:49,400
these other magical people, like
wow. 

238
00:14:49,500 --> 00:14:55,000
Oh my gosh, like how exciting. 
But then at the same time my 

239
00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:59,100
relationship to my devices and 
to these platforms like can feel

240
00:14:59,100 --> 00:15:03,600
really addictive and can feel 
very dissociative. 

241
00:15:06,500 --> 00:15:10,900
I feel that so much and I 
wrestle with that daily, you 

242
00:15:10,900 --> 00:15:13,800
know, it was actually I feel 
like you gave me a reading at 

243
00:15:13,800 --> 00:15:18,500
the beginning of 2021 or around 
around the beginning of 20 21. 

244
00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:23,600
And one of the things that you 
said in this reading that has 

245
00:15:23,600 --> 00:15:26,700
ranked true for me throughout 
this entire year, but it's like 

246
00:15:27,000 --> 00:15:30,900
if you feel like you want to get
off the internet, sometimes like

247
00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:33,600
follow that impulse, you know, 
like if you feel like you want 

248
00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:36,300
to go dark and you Really 
understand why I like follow 

249
00:15:36,300 --> 00:15:40,800
that impulse and that I've been 
really internalizing that 

250
00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:43,900
because I've had those impulses 
a lot this year. 

251
00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:47,300
Yeah, and I think it's because 
of the work that I'm doing right

252
00:15:47,300 --> 00:15:54,400
now, that is really not meant to
be explored with with the gazes 

253
00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:56,300
of other people, you know, 
right? 

254
00:15:56,300 --> 00:15:59,000
It's meant to be solitary. 
It's meant to be quiet. 

255
00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:01,600
It's meant to be private, you 
know, exactly. 

256
00:16:01,700 --> 00:16:04,200
And that's a, that's way 
different from when I first 

257
00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:07,700
started And I mean, I I was on 
the internet, I'd been on the 

258
00:16:07,700 --> 00:16:10,500
internet for a long time. 
But I mean, most people know me 

259
00:16:10,500 --> 00:16:15,900
from a very, very old blog that 
I had called apricot tea which 

260
00:16:15,900 --> 00:16:20,300
was a fashion blog. 
And so fashion blogging is very 

261
00:16:20,300 --> 00:16:22,500
much about. 
Like here's what I'm wearing. 

262
00:16:22,500 --> 00:16:25,400
Here's what I'm doing, you know,
is before vlogging was a thing. 

263
00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:27,300
So it was later. 
I would be blogging like 

264
00:16:27,300 --> 00:16:30,300
sometimes twice three times a 
day just showing people. 

265
00:16:30,300 --> 00:16:33,500
Wow, when I'm eating and what 
I'm wearing. 

266
00:16:33,500 --> 00:16:35,800
And these random What's that? 
I'm having. 

267
00:16:36,100 --> 00:16:38,600
So like that was that was kind 
of my lineage. 

268
00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:42,200
You know, I came to the internet
being like see me watch me, 

269
00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:46,500
uh-huh, consumed me and and 
that's, that's been fine. 

270
00:16:46,500 --> 00:16:48,500
I've enjoyed it. 
But now I'm like, what does it 

271
00:16:48,500 --> 00:16:51,800
look like to be a little bit 
more quiet, you know, to wow, 

272
00:16:51,900 --> 00:16:55,600
reserve some things for me and 
that's, that's been, that's been

273
00:16:55,600 --> 00:16:57,900
fun to navigate. 
Wow. 

274
00:16:57,900 --> 00:17:01,800
Thank you for saying all that. 
It's like it leads me right into

275
00:17:01,800 --> 00:17:04,400
this question that I have 
prepared. 

276
00:17:04,500 --> 00:17:07,000
To ask you which is about 
something that's happening in 

277
00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:13,500
your chart currently. 
And yeah, so for any listeners, 

278
00:17:13,800 --> 00:17:16,300
everyone has given me some 
permission to speak a little bit

279
00:17:16,300 --> 00:17:20,300
about their chart. 
And so I want to just start by 

280
00:17:20,300 --> 00:17:23,900
saying that in astrology a lot 
of what astrologers do is 

281
00:17:23,900 --> 00:17:27,500
compare the cycles of what are 
called transpersonal or outer, 

282
00:17:27,500 --> 00:17:31,000
planets to the cycles of what 
are called personal or the inner

283
00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:34,900
planets, and this is kind of 
like speaking to the That we 

284
00:17:34,900 --> 00:17:37,900
have as human beings to the 
context that were arising in, 

285
00:17:37,900 --> 00:17:41,300
which are so much bigger than 
us, like context of culture, and

286
00:17:41,300 --> 00:17:47,800
time and Society, Etc. 
So there's been a movement in 

287
00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:51,000
the heavens that some people 
would call Pluto in Capricorn. 

288
00:17:51,200 --> 00:17:57,300
It's been going on since 2008, 
but particularly since 2019. 

289
00:17:57,600 --> 00:18:04,300
It has been aspecting your chart
really notably and everyone has 

290
00:18:04,300 --> 00:18:07,600
a Sagittarius ascendant, but you
also have. 

291
00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:10,400
I read a plastic this chart, not
whole science for any nerds out 

292
00:18:10,400 --> 00:18:13,200
there. 
But so you also have Capricorn 

293
00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:17,300
in your first house and Pluto 
has been kind of making its 

294
00:18:17,300 --> 00:18:20,500
transition from your first test.
Your second house. 

295
00:18:20,900 --> 00:18:26,300
And this is a transition that in
some ways describes a movement 

296
00:18:26,900 --> 00:18:31,200
from a self oriented existence 
to a movement. 

297
00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:37,200
That is a sustaining existence 
and One way to think about this 

298
00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:39,800
is like as we come into the 
world. 

299
00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:42,600
We don't really have agency to 
sustain ourselves. 

300
00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:48,300
Like we're very much dependent 
on other people and we need 

301
00:18:48,300 --> 00:18:52,400
attention, you know, we need 
attention in order to survive 

302
00:18:52,800 --> 00:18:56,700
and then at some point fairly 
soon we start to learn how to 

303
00:18:56,700 --> 00:18:59,900
sustain ourselves whether that's
like picking up something tasty 

304
00:18:59,900 --> 00:19:02,100
and like putting it in our 
mouths, you know, or like 

305
00:19:02,100 --> 00:19:04,300
figuring out how to lift 
ourselves away from the ground. 

306
00:19:04,500 --> 00:19:06,500
Like that's all self-sustaining 
energy. 

307
00:19:07,100 --> 00:19:10,900
And so in your chart like I 
could see that there's been this

308
00:19:11,300 --> 00:19:14,400
long-term process of 
transformation since 2008. 

309
00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:18,800
That's about you really coming 
into sustaining yourself and not

310
00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:23,200
a deeper level to sustain 
ourselves means that we have to 

311
00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:26,300
feel that we are valuable and 
worthy enough to sustain. 

312
00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:30,800
And so this kind of question of 
like, what parts of me am I 

313
00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:34,400
investing in? 
And how do I feel my own value? 

314
00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:40,800
And since Pluto as a 
transpersonal planet, kind of 

315
00:19:40,800 --> 00:19:43,400
represents like a collective 
transformation. 

316
00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:47,700
It's moving through a sign 
Capricorn that in a lot of its 

317
00:19:47,700 --> 00:19:53,300
associations, has to do with 
patriarchy white supremacy 

318
00:19:53,300 --> 00:19:58,700
capitalism and this larger kind 
of machine of institutionalized,

319
00:19:58,700 --> 00:20:04,300
oppression and the way that that
machine is becoming so visible. 

320
00:20:04,700 --> 00:20:08,800
Since especially since 2019 and 
2020 that like the workings of 

321
00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:12,000
this machine are being really 
exposed in a lot of ways. 

322
00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:14,900
And I think that's having an 
effect on a lot of us as 

323
00:20:14,900 --> 00:20:18,200
individuals to see how this 
machine works through us. 

324
00:20:18,700 --> 00:20:23,500
And so, when I hear you talking 
about, needing, recognizing your

325
00:20:23,500 --> 00:20:28,700
need to not exhibit yourself and
to not objectify yourself, but 

326
00:20:28,700 --> 00:20:31,900
to like, actually really go 
within and take this Instinct 

327
00:20:31,900 --> 00:20:34,100
towards healing that you have 
and apply it in your own 

328
00:20:34,100 --> 00:20:36,300
practice. 
This and let it transform you 

329
00:20:36,308 --> 00:20:40,600
from the inside out, that feels 
like some of what this Transit 

330
00:20:40,600 --> 00:20:44,800
could do. 
And so, I'll just say a few more

331
00:20:44,800 --> 00:20:46,300
things. 
And then I'm like, what are you 

332
00:20:46,300 --> 00:20:50,700
thinking, which is these images?
Because over the last couple 

333
00:20:50,700 --> 00:20:53,100
weeks, were recording on October
11th. 

334
00:20:53,100 --> 00:20:54,600
And over the last couple of 
weeks. 

335
00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:57,700
There's been all this movement 
in the sign Libra and you have 

336
00:20:57,700 --> 00:20:59,900
Libra up at the top of your 
chart, which is your career 

337
00:20:59,900 --> 00:21:04,100
placement and amongst other 
things. 

338
00:21:04,100 --> 00:21:06,800
One of the things that Libra can
represent is the aesthetic 

339
00:21:06,800 --> 00:21:12,900
appeal of something and over the
last few weeks Mars has been Our

340
00:21:12,900 --> 00:21:17,300
kind of representing the 
potential for separating from 

341
00:21:17,300 --> 00:21:19,600
certain kinds of 
objectification, our ideals 

342
00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:23,700
around Aesthetics. 
The sin has been there bringing 

343
00:21:23,700 --> 00:21:26,500
Consciousness and illumination 
of this part of your chart just 

344
00:21:26,500 --> 00:21:30,300
in general and then mercury has 
been doing its retrograde dance 

345
00:21:31,500 --> 00:21:36,200
and I think asking for a 
rethinking around value and 

346
00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:40,500
aesthetic and relationship and 
for you, particularly, not only 

347
00:21:40,500 --> 00:21:42,400
is this happening in the place 
of your Public Image. 

348
00:21:42,500 --> 00:21:45,500
Age and your career, but it's 
happening in conjunction with 

349
00:21:45,500 --> 00:21:49,200
your natal Mercury, your natal 
mercury in Libra person, and 

350
00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:52,800
Mercury is a thinker and a 
writer and a speaker. 

351
00:21:53,100 --> 00:21:55,400
And you know, that's, that's 
exactly what you are. 

352
00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:57,100
You're a thinker, a writer and a
speaker. 

353
00:21:57,400 --> 00:22:00,900
And you're really working with, 
I think a lot of these, these 

354
00:22:00,900 --> 00:22:04,400
themes. 
So, yeah, one thing that's 

355
00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:08,200
happening in the sky right now 
is that these Libra placements, 

356
00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:10,600
which are personal placements. 
They're moving fast are coming 

357
00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:14,600
into connection with that. 
Doing Capricorn energy. 

358
00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:16,800
And so a lot of folks who have 
been, like, working with these 

359
00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:21,000
Transformations for a long time,
have recently been making really

360
00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:24,200
pivotal shifts and they've been 
rethinking things, and they've 

361
00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:28,100
been kind of restructuring the 
ways that they're doing, 

362
00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:29,700
whatever it is that they're 
doing. 

363
00:22:30,500 --> 00:22:33,600
So, I know you've been through 
like, some major identity 

364
00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:36,300
shifts. 
Very, very recently. 

365
00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:40,700
And yeah, I'm wondering if if 
you would share any Impressions 

366
00:22:40,700 --> 00:22:42,400
that you got or things you're 
thinking about. 

367
00:22:42,500 --> 00:22:45,700
Out without astrology. 
And then also, if you could talk

368
00:22:45,700 --> 00:22:49,900
about like this shift that 
you've been in this past, I want

369
00:22:49,900 --> 00:22:52,700
to say it's a maybe the past 
year or two. 

370
00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:54,700
Not quite sure how long it's 
been going on for you. 

371
00:22:54,900 --> 00:22:58,200
I would I'd say it's been the 
past like couple of years, but I

372
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:04,300
think I've really been rooting 
into it more through 2021 and a 

373
00:23:04,300 --> 00:23:07,600
lot of those things. 
I mean, there's so many things. 

374
00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:12,400
I mean, one of the things that 
came through this year in a row.

375
00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:14,500
Way, although, it's been 
something that I've been 

376
00:23:14,500 --> 00:23:17,900
thinking about for a while is my
gender identity. 

377
00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:26,300
I came out as non-binary in, I 
think it was December 2020 and I

378
00:23:26,300 --> 00:23:30,700
did that from a place of both, 
just like wanting to hold myself

379
00:23:30,700 --> 00:23:33,800
accountable to the feelings that
I have. 

380
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:38,600
And to also just like Really 
literally come out and let 

381
00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:41,000
people know. 
Like, I don't want you to 

382
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:43,900
interact with me and this way 
that you have been interacting 

383
00:23:43,900 --> 00:23:46,100
with me in like, I am a 
different person. 

384
00:23:46,100 --> 00:23:50,900
And I would like, for you to 
respect respect that and then, 

385
00:23:50,900 --> 00:23:53,300
you know, as I mentioned before,
it's that accountability piece 

386
00:23:53,300 --> 00:23:57,100
where I just really need to get 
out of my own head about it. 

387
00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:00,800
And and actually make a 
statement that says like, okay, 

388
00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:03,300
there's no going back, you know,
because for me, my gender 

389
00:24:03,300 --> 00:24:06,500
identity I can very easily 
Gaslight. 

390
00:24:06,700 --> 00:24:11,500
May I do this with everything 
but my gender identity, it was I

391
00:24:11,700 --> 00:24:16,300
I very easily gas-lit myself 
about like a my non-binary 

392
00:24:16,300 --> 00:24:18,200
enough. 
A my trans enough. 

393
00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:20,000
Is it? 
Okay that I'm coming out when 

394
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:26,000
I'm 33 and so I felt like to 
come out publicly. 

395
00:24:26,300 --> 00:24:30,600
You know, it's something that I 
do actually in my work where if 

396
00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:34,700
I'm if I'm chewing on an idea, a
workshop or a book or post or 

397
00:24:34,700 --> 00:24:38,000
something like that I can. 
Get in my head so much about 

398
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:39,900
like, when should I do it? 
How should I do it? 

399
00:24:39,900 --> 00:24:42,400
Is it okay that I do it? 
And sometimes, I'm just like, 

400
00:24:42,500 --> 00:24:43,700
all right. 
I'm going to announce it to 

401
00:24:43,700 --> 00:24:47,100
folks because that way like it's
out of my head. 

402
00:24:47,300 --> 00:24:50,400
And now I have to just like do 
the thing and so in some ways I 

403
00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:54,400
was I was doing that by 
announcing and just like really 

404
00:24:54,700 --> 00:24:57,600
saying like hey y'all. 
I'm non-binary and I did that 

405
00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:00,900
with so much trepidation. 
I mean, it was, it was quite a 

406
00:25:00,900 --> 00:25:02,900
bit. 
It was it was a lot for me to do

407
00:25:02,900 --> 00:25:06,500
that and it was it was so warm 
and I was welcome. 

408
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:11,900
Deeply by my community. 
And even I heard folks be like, 

409
00:25:11,900 --> 00:25:14,800
I thought you came out as 
non-binary years ago. 

410
00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:18,300
So that was really cool, 
especially because of, you know,

411
00:25:18,300 --> 00:25:20,100
the gaslighting nature of my 
brain. 

412
00:25:21,300 --> 00:25:26,100
So yeah, I when I came out, I 
knew that I had to shift a lot 

413
00:25:26,100 --> 00:25:30,600
of things about what what I was 
doing in terms of the work that 

414
00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:33,200
I do. 
And one of those things was my 

415
00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:36,400
podcast, my podcast was called 
the sexually liberated. 

416
00:25:36,700 --> 00:25:40,300
Liberated woman. 
It's been called that since, 

417
00:25:40,300 --> 00:25:46,300
like 2015, and I realized that, 
one of the things that was 

418
00:25:46,300 --> 00:25:50,100
keeping me distant from that as 
a project, was the name. 

419
00:25:50,100 --> 00:25:53,900
I just didn't feel like the more
that I connected to, who I 

420
00:25:53,908 --> 00:25:59,000
really was, and the full 
spectrum of who I really was. 

421
00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:02,200
I realized like, yeah, the 
sexually liberated woman, 

422
00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:04,500
doesn't really include me. 
It includes a lot of other 

423
00:26:04,500 --> 00:26:08,800
people, but it doesn't include 
And so that's actually something

424
00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:11,400
that I've been thinking about a 
lot and I'm not sure if this 

425
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:14,400
tracks with the transits that 
you mentioned. 

426
00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:18,700
But feeling like, you know, I've
done this work in a lot of ways 

427
00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:22,900
for myself, but I've also done 
this work for other people and 

428
00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:28,400
I've put a lot of people, their 
experiences, their stories, 

429
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:32,700
their traumas kind of on the 
Forefront for me, which is kind 

430
00:26:32,700 --> 00:26:37,000
of my nature, but also, I think 
it's just the way that I have 

431
00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:40,700
been taught that I have to do. 
And so this this space that I'm 

432
00:26:40,700 --> 00:26:43,800
in, with my work right now is, 
what does it look like for me to

433
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:48,000
be the center of my work? 
You know, I feel like I tapped 

434
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:51,100
into that a lot within like the 
first few years of the work that

435
00:26:51,100 --> 00:26:52,800
I was doing. 
Like when I first got started 

436
00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:56,800
being a sex educator. 
It was very much about like who 

437
00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:00,500
Am I who do I want to be and 
like you're allowed to come join

438
00:27:00,500 --> 00:27:03,000
me on this journey, but like I'm
not an expert don't listen to 

439
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:08,400
what I have to say and then you 
know things Bend and the work 

440
00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:12,100
just grew and expanded ways that
I just did not expect and I 

441
00:27:12,100 --> 00:27:15,400
think I kind of bumped myself 
off of my access a little bit. 

442
00:27:15,900 --> 00:27:20,000
And so by claiming my 
non-binary, identity bike like 

443
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:24,600
changing the name of my podcast.
It wasn't just about doing 

444
00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:27,300
something that would make me 
feel affirmed. 

445
00:27:27,300 --> 00:27:30,400
And my gender identity was also 
like, I'm including myself into 

446
00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:33,200
my work. 
Like I'm not, this isn't just 

447
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:35,900
for other people. 
It's also about me as well. 

448
00:27:37,700 --> 00:27:39,800
And that's, that's a theme that 
keeps coming up. 

449
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:43,600
I mean, recently kind of, I 
would say that I came out as 

450
00:27:43,700 --> 00:27:47,700
asexual or being on the a 
spectrum, which for me, I it 

451
00:27:47,700 --> 00:27:54,000
feels different than being being
on binary for me, for me being 

452
00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:57,000
non-binary is very personal and 
very intimate. 

453
00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:00,200
Whereas being like coming out as
asexual. 

454
00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:03,200
I'm like, this is so dumb. 
I hate that I have to do this. 

455
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:07,800
Like it's it just feels very 
much like We all just have our 

456
00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:12,000
own nuances and be where we are.
Like, I don't know. 

457
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:15,000
I just it's something that's 
still very alive for me. 

458
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:19,800
As I am still dealing with some 
Fallout from a post that I 

459
00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:24,900
published on Instagram about Ace
phobia and not wanting people to

460
00:28:24,900 --> 00:28:29,700
perpetuate a phobia. 
But yeah, I feel like I kind of 

461
00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:34,400
got away from your intentional 
question, but that's the oh no, 

462
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:36,400
that was incredible. 
Yeah. 

463
00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:37,800
Yeah. 
Yeah, I both of those things 

464
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:40,200
were things that I was. 
I mean, I was definitely 

465
00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:43,200
thinking about your podcast name
change. 

466
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:46,300
I know that, you know, I've been
following you in this last year.

467
00:28:46,300 --> 00:28:50,400
And so I've seen those public 
coming out moments of, you know,

468
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:52,900
coming out as non-binary and 
coming out as asexual. 

469
00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:57,500
And I have to say that, you 
know, I'm you have Venus in 

470
00:28:57,500 --> 00:29:00,000
Virgo, you have a lot in Virgo. 
I also have this. 

471
00:29:00,300 --> 00:29:05,300
I have Venus in Virgo and one of
the ways that I personally have 

472
00:29:05,300 --> 00:29:11,800
felt that placement is I was 
like a very palpable lack of 

473
00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:18,000
connection to what Society has 
prescribed me to be as feminine 

474
00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:20,900
as a person that was assigned, 
female at Birth. 

475
00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:26,400
And I don't particularly have an
argument with femininity or 

476
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:33,300
being related to and with 
femininity, but I also it 

477
00:29:33,300 --> 00:29:36,300
doesn't end there for me and, 
you know, any time. 

478
00:29:36,500 --> 00:29:39,900
I'm and I felt like I've 
experienced this a lot growing 

479
00:29:39,900 --> 00:29:42,500
up in the community that I did, 
which was a very in some ways. 

480
00:29:42,500 --> 00:29:45,700
Like very new age you community,
and there was a lot of talk 

481
00:29:45,700 --> 00:29:49,000
within the healing World about 
like the divine feminine, and 

482
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:52,300
the Divine masculine, but the 
way that it was represented and 

483
00:29:52,300 --> 00:29:56,200
enacted was really along the 
lines of a very strong gender 

484
00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:59,600
binary and a segregation between
people with different genitals 

485
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:06,100
and I felt so enraged by that 
and like very like I did not 

486
00:30:06,100 --> 00:30:07,700
resume. 
For me at all. 

487
00:30:08,600 --> 00:30:13,200
And then, yeah, I've also kind 
of felt like, I don't know. 

488
00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:16,800
I just you made a post about 
asexuality. 

489
00:30:17,100 --> 00:30:21,100
A few months ago. 
I feel like it was in spring or 

490
00:30:21,100 --> 00:30:25,500
summer of 2021 and you 
introduced me to Angela Chen's 

491
00:30:25,500 --> 00:30:29,800
book and that post and your post
was so powerful for me to read 

492
00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:32,400
and it was basically, you are 
saying like you'd been 

493
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:37,500
rethinking sex and you'd been 
naming things like slow dancing 

494
00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:41,000
sex or, you know, different kind
of different forms of intimacy 

495
00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:46,400
and reading your words allowed 
me to ver that verify and 

496
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:49,400
validate for myself that the 
experiences that I've had 

497
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:54,600
throughout my life are real. 
And that my particular knowing 

498
00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:58,100
that, I'm a person that really 
enjoys, like, romance and 

499
00:30:58,100 --> 00:31:02,000
intimacy, but that what a lot of
people consider to be sex in 

500
00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:05,300
terms of like, genital 
stimulation and penetration, 

501
00:31:05,300 --> 00:31:08,000
like isn't always the Thing for 
me, right? 

502
00:31:08,300 --> 00:31:11,600
And it takes a lot for me to 
want that and to sincerely be 

503
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:15,400
able to stay with it and 
continue watching it, and I've 

504
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:17,000
experienced so much shame for 
that. 

505
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:20,900
And it feeling of like, oh God, 
like my, you know, my hormones 

506
00:31:20,900 --> 00:31:24,500
are probably off like something,
you know, blah, blah, blah. 

507
00:31:24,500 --> 00:31:27,400
Like some shit is wrong with me.
And so, reading your post. 

508
00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:30,100
I was like, hugging. 
Thank you. 

509
00:31:30,700 --> 00:31:34,300
You just changed my life. 
You just freaking change my life

510
00:31:34,300 --> 00:31:36,000
with your post. 
I want you to know that. 

511
00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:40,600
Well, thank you that that 
Delights me to hear and also I 

512
00:31:40,600 --> 00:31:44,500
resonate so much with what you 
were saying about kind of this 

513
00:31:44,500 --> 00:31:48,100
like, and you didn't say this, 
but for me what I heard is like 

514
00:31:49,700 --> 00:31:52,100
feeling like am I? 
Okay, like it's not. 

515
00:31:52,100 --> 00:31:55,500
Is it okay that I am? 
I have these experiences because

516
00:31:55,500 --> 00:31:59,800
we are world is so sex-obsessed 
and by sex-obsessed I'm talking 

517
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:01,900
about like a specific kind of 
sex. 

518
00:32:01,900 --> 00:32:05,400
It's not like sex is the word 
that I see it as which is like 

519
00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:08,300
anything can be sexy. 
Your body is turned on enough, 

520
00:32:08,300 --> 00:32:12,300
you know, right. 
But sex as like, penis vagina, 

521
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:18,000
penetration orgasm and I've 
never been my jam. 

522
00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:20,800
And there's many reasons for 
that. 

523
00:32:20,800 --> 00:32:23,300
I'm sure but it's never been my 
jam. 

524
00:32:23,300 --> 00:32:26,100
And I've also, in my work, I've 
seen a lot of people feel like 

525
00:32:26,100 --> 00:32:28,900
it's not there Jam either, you 
know, like they're trying to 

526
00:32:28,900 --> 00:32:32,500
keep up with the Joneses, but 
they're not even sure like that.

527
00:32:32,500 --> 00:32:35,000
They even want to be friends 
with the Joneses, but every 

528
00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:38,000
house that like, This is what 
you should do. 

529
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:39,300
And this is what you should 
have. 

530
00:32:39,300 --> 00:32:41,800
And these are the experiences 
that you should have. 

531
00:32:41,800 --> 00:32:44,400
And if you don't have them, 
there's something wrong with 

532
00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:45,400
you. 
You need help. 

533
00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:47,300
You need therapy. 
You need to heal yourself 

534
00:32:47,300 --> 00:32:49,200
deeper. 
And those are a lot of messages 

535
00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:52,700
that I enforced upon myself, 
when I started doing some work. 

536
00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:58,600
And so this this realization of 
being a sexual being on the a 

537
00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:03,500
spectrum. 
It's almost like, duh, but also 

538
00:33:03,700 --> 00:33:05,600
wow like that. 
What? 

539
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:08,700
That it, just like Shook, it's 
still shaking the foundations of

540
00:33:08,700 --> 00:33:12,000
so many things that I've 
believed about myself 

541
00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:16,100
personally, and also about sex 
as a whole, you know. 

542
00:33:16,100 --> 00:33:19,300
Yeah. 
Me being a sex educator, and it 

543
00:33:19,300 --> 00:33:21,700
really is radical. 
And it's obvious that it's 

544
00:33:21,700 --> 00:33:26,800
radical because I'm like, people
are really upset about about a 

545
00:33:26,808 --> 00:33:30,200
spokes. 
You know, I have a lot of people

546
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:33,400
who are in my comments right now
who are saying all kinds of 

547
00:33:33,700 --> 00:33:38,400
crazy things about asexuality. 
Yeah, really it, you know, it's 

548
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:42,200
so interesting to me because 
it's like I feel you on the like

549
00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:44,800
this is so annoying that you 
even have to come out like this 

550
00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:48,100
because it's like what what 
you're basically doing is just 

551
00:33:48,100 --> 00:33:52,200
decentering sex from like a very
sex Centrist society. 

552
00:33:52,200 --> 00:33:57,000
That also put sex in a box that 
is like very ablest very 

553
00:33:57,000 --> 00:34:02,600
monogamous very like heterosis 
normative and patriarchal and 

554
00:34:02,600 --> 00:34:06,100
white supremacist in the fact 
that it has like erased a whole 

555
00:34:06,500 --> 00:34:10,400
In constellation of ways of 
being, you know Universe of ways

556
00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:13,300
of being inside. 
Like the one way you can have 

557
00:34:13,300 --> 00:34:16,400
sex like that, you know, and 
it's like that way of having sex

558
00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:17,900
is fine. 
Like it's great. 

559
00:34:18,199 --> 00:34:20,400
Nothing no shade on that way of 
having sex. 

560
00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:22,000
It's just like there's so much 
more. 

561
00:34:25,300 --> 00:34:31,300
And yeah, I kind of feel the 
same way with With the gender 

562
00:34:31,300 --> 00:34:35,699
conversation, you know, where 
it's like, what a travesty of 

563
00:34:35,699 --> 00:34:42,199
language to have divided, our 
Consciousness into camps of, did

564
00:34:42,300 --> 00:34:45,199
you know of difference based on 
right? 

565
00:34:45,300 --> 00:34:48,600
Genitals. 
And, and not even based on the 

566
00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:50,300
full spectrum of what genitals 
can be. 

567
00:34:50,300 --> 00:34:55,000
But like, to very homogenous 
examples of what they sometimes 

568
00:34:55,000 --> 00:35:00,100
are. 
Yeah, I mean I have felt so free

569
00:35:00,100 --> 00:35:06,500
and so liberated. 
Now that I'm able to have the 

570
00:35:06,500 --> 00:35:12,100
scam of gender or the gender 
binary, lifted from my eyes, you

571
00:35:12,100 --> 00:35:16,300
know, and I feel the same about 
sexuality which is you know, 

572
00:35:16,300 --> 00:35:19,400
it's a little scary for me to be
honest. 

573
00:35:19,400 --> 00:35:24,700
I think especially because of 
the work that I do and because 

574
00:35:25,100 --> 00:35:30,200
sex sells I mean, don't even get
me started on the sexual 

575
00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:36,700
Wellness industry. 
Um, the ways that yeah 

576
00:35:36,700 --> 00:35:40,700
capitalism is coming into play 
when with things like this. 

577
00:35:40,700 --> 00:35:44,100
It's no longer like have the 
best sex of your life because 

578
00:35:44,100 --> 00:35:46,000
you deserve it. 
It's like have the best sex of 

579
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:47,300
your life because you deserve 
it. 

580
00:35:47,300 --> 00:35:51,400
So by her sex toy, you know. 
And like I get it, we live in a 

581
00:35:51,408 --> 00:35:53,800
capitalist Society. 
So I don't want to shade anyone 

582
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:56,400
who who is selling sex toys. 
It's not that. 

583
00:35:56,400 --> 00:36:02,200
It's just too too decent her sex
and to kind of like put a kink. 

584
00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:07,500
And into the definitions that we
have about sex and sexuality. 

585
00:36:07,700 --> 00:36:12,800
And to also like, give people 
permission to decentralize sex. 

586
00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:15,600
It's making. 
I feel like it's making people 

587
00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:19,600
freak out. 
Yes, like it's a really and I 

588
00:36:19,600 --> 00:36:24,000
understand it's a radical thing 
to think about but for me, I'm 

589
00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:27,000
not doing it to be radical. 
I'm not doing it to be 

590
00:36:27,000 --> 00:36:28,000
contrarian. 
For me. 

591
00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:30,500
It's like this is this is what 
feels good to me. 

592
00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:34,000
And right. 
I'm noticing that It's also what

593
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:35,900
resonates and feels good to 
other people. 

594
00:36:35,900 --> 00:36:40,300
The idea that none of us are the
same like our bodies don't look 

595
00:36:40,300 --> 00:36:42,100
the same or genitals. 
Don't look the same. 

596
00:36:42,100 --> 00:36:44,700
We don't express our genders in 
the same way. 

597
00:36:44,700 --> 00:36:49,700
So why would we have sex or 
experienced our sexualities and 

598
00:36:49,700 --> 00:36:53,200
the same way, you know, right 
and why does it always have to 

599
00:36:53,200 --> 00:36:56,700
be something that is a show? 
I mean, I think one of the 

600
00:36:56,700 --> 00:37:00,900
things I really loved reading 
and Angela Chen's bookcase was 

601
00:37:00,900 --> 00:37:05,400
kind of Of where now? 
I'm forgetting. 

602
00:37:05,500 --> 00:37:08,200
If Aunt, what pronouns Angela 
Chen Yu Suzuki in her. 

603
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:09,200
Yeah. 
She okay. 

604
00:37:09,900 --> 00:37:14,700
So where she's basically talking
about like progression and 

605
00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:18,500
feminist thought or certain 
branch of feminism towards this 

606
00:37:18,500 --> 00:37:23,200
idea of like, okay, we're going 
to be radically empowered women 

607
00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:27,100
and have like crazy sex with a 
ton of people and this is what's

608
00:37:27,100 --> 00:37:29,500
going to Define our radical 
empowerment. 

609
00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:34,300
And meanwhile that sex is 
Objectified, its commodified and

610
00:37:34,300 --> 00:37:38,300
it's performed and it's not 
really necessarily embodied all 

611
00:37:38,300 --> 00:37:41,100
of the time not to say it isn't 
plenty of the time but plenty of

612
00:37:41,100 --> 00:37:44,200
the time it's not. 
And so then I feel like, you 

613
00:37:44,207 --> 00:37:49,200
know, I hear through you as a 
sex educator and sensuality 

614
00:37:49,500 --> 00:37:53,400
Doula, you know that you're 
you're asking people to feel 

615
00:37:53,600 --> 00:37:58,500
their actual bodies and that in 
all of its Simplicity, totally 

616
00:37:58,500 --> 00:38:03,600
is terrifying because you might 
be using Sex, as a way to get a 

617
00:38:03,900 --> 00:38:08,300
get away from, you know, what, 
especially for people who are 

618
00:38:08,300 --> 00:38:11,800
socialized. 
Well, I'm I was about to say 

619
00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:13,600
people who are socialized 
female, but then I'm going, no, 

620
00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:15,700
it's this whole, it's this whole
mess. 

621
00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:19,700
It's how people are socialized 
into these two camps male-female

622
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:24,000
saying your, your desire should 
take this particular shape. 

623
00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:27,500
And if it's not taking that 
shape, then something's wrong 

624
00:38:27,500 --> 00:38:30,800
with you and so, all of us are 
out there. 

625
00:38:31,700 --> 00:38:34,300
Performing outside of our 
bodies, like not actually 

626
00:38:34,300 --> 00:38:38,800
listening which is leading then 
to sexual abuse sexual violence,

627
00:38:39,000 --> 00:38:43,300
manipulation commodification and
bodies on and on and on. 

628
00:38:44,000 --> 00:38:46,100
And so you're asking people to 
feel all this. 

629
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:49,400
Which is what happens, you know,
if we try and get in touch with 

630
00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:53,500
our own pleasure, and it's like 
if my own pleasure actually is 

631
00:38:53,500 --> 00:38:55,900
like me lying on the floor 
alone. 

632
00:38:56,600 --> 00:39:01,100
How do I claim that for myself, 
in the midst of this Society? 

633
00:39:01,100 --> 00:39:03,800
That's telling me that I'm wrong
for wanting that and that's 

634
00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:07,100
making me like a sad sack of 
aloneness to spend the rest of 

635
00:39:07,100 --> 00:39:09,000
my life alone or something like 
that. 

636
00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:11,800
Right? 
It's what's bringing what's 

637
00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:15,300
coming up for me is like, you 
know, I'm thinking about like, 

638
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:18,200
girl, Bosco. 
Culture and there's me know, 

639
00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:23,200
what am I thinking of? 
I'm thinking of like women 

640
00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:26,200
entrepreneur culture, you know, 
it's like there's this, there's 

641
00:39:26,200 --> 00:39:31,000
this like, Resurgence of people 
being very proud of the fact 

642
00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:32,800
that like, okay. 
I'm a woman and I'm going to be 

643
00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:36,800
a CEO or, you know, your next 
president is going to be a woman

644
00:39:36,800 --> 00:39:39,900
etcetera Etc. 
And so what's interesting about 

645
00:39:39,900 --> 00:39:44,800
that for me is that that was 
kind of in response to the ways 

646
00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:51,300
that men occupy and Cap space 
within businesses careers and 

647
00:39:51,300 --> 00:39:54,300
stuff like that. 
And my gripe with that has 

648
00:39:54,300 --> 00:39:59,000
always been like, you know, you 
want to essentially like pink. 

649
00:39:59,000 --> 00:40:04,500
A fi capitalism and patriarchy, 
by just having a woman, do it. 

650
00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:06,700
Right? 
And so, I kind of see the same 

651
00:40:06,700 --> 00:40:10,400
happening with sexuality. 
It's like, and it's been like 

652
00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:13,200
this since the beginning, you 
know, like the idea that in 

653
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:15,500
order for you to be sexually 
liberated, you have to have sex,

654
00:40:15,500 --> 00:40:19,100
like a man. 
Just like in order for you to be

655
00:40:19,100 --> 00:40:22,000
a successful woman business 
owner. 

656
00:40:22,100 --> 00:40:26,500
You have to own a business and 
make as much money as Jeff. 

657
00:40:26,500 --> 00:40:31,200
Bezos like a man, you know, an 
exhibit, these abuses of power 

658
00:40:31,200 --> 00:40:35,300
and things like that. 
And I'm not going to pretend 

659
00:40:35,300 --> 00:40:38,100
that I wasn't in that frame of 
thought, you know, in the very 

660
00:40:38,100 --> 00:40:40,000
beginning. 
I mean, I'm sure if you dig deep

661
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:43,000
enough, you'll find some 
articles of mine that are 

662
00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:45,700
incredibly outdated and I don't 
believe in them anymore because 

663
00:40:45,700 --> 00:40:48,100
they fall. 
Line with that thinking like, oh

664
00:40:48,100 --> 00:40:51,400
the way to liberate your 
sexuality is to just fuck like a

665
00:40:51,408 --> 00:40:55,500
man, you know have lots of sex 
with many different people, do 

666
00:40:55,500 --> 00:41:00,900
it from a place of physicality. 
Not emotionality, do it from a 

667
00:41:00,908 --> 00:41:04,500
place of maybe even dissociating
from your physical body and just

668
00:41:04,500 --> 00:41:06,900
like focusing, only on your 
genitals. 

669
00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:13,800
And you know, I've tried that 
personally and it doesn't work 

670
00:41:13,800 --> 00:41:15,700
for me. 
It just doesn't work. 

671
00:41:15,800 --> 00:41:20,400
And so like this realization 
that I'm asexual, which has been

672
00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:23,500
a realization that I've had for 
like most of my life, you know, 

673
00:41:23,500 --> 00:41:26,100
it's just really finally 
claiming it very much like, you 

674
00:41:26,100 --> 00:41:30,200
know being non-binary. 
It's like a permission slip for 

675
00:41:30,200 --> 00:41:33,600
me to stop being someone that 
I'm not and there's so much 

676
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:38,100
liberation there for me that I'm
I feel actually in the days that

677
00:41:38,100 --> 00:41:42,400
I have I have been Talking about
asexuality very publicly on my 

678
00:41:42,400 --> 00:41:46,000
podcast on Instagram. 
I've noticed that my body feels 

679
00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:48,800
lighter and I think it's it 
feels very similar to when I 

680
00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:52,300
came out as non-binary. 
It's like I Shrugged off a lot 

681
00:41:52,300 --> 00:41:56,400
of the baggage of performance 
that I felt like I had to do as 

682
00:41:56,400 --> 00:41:59,200
a sex educator, you know, like I
have to be having all kinds of 

683
00:41:59,200 --> 00:42:03,000
sex and have amazing sex toys, 
like all of this. 

684
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:06,400
Like, wow, I that doesn't 
resonate with me, but I can 

685
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:10,300
still do the work that I do and 
I can still do Do it well and I 

686
00:42:10,308 --> 00:42:14,700
can still Champion people's 
pleasure and their Liberation 

687
00:42:14,700 --> 00:42:18,600
and their healing but it doesn't
have to look the same ways that 

688
00:42:18,600 --> 00:42:21,100
I've been doing it or that other
people say that we should be 

689
00:42:21,100 --> 00:42:23,700
doing it. 
So that's liberating and it's 

690
00:42:23,700 --> 00:42:27,400
also like scary a shit because 
it's very counter to what I 

691
00:42:27,408 --> 00:42:29,100
threw. 
A lot of folks are are talking 

692
00:42:29,100 --> 00:42:30,700
about right now. 
Hmm. 

693
00:42:31,500 --> 00:42:35,400
Well, thank you for doing that. 
And and and thanks for saying 

694
00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:39,500
that to you because I feel like 
that's also a good frame. 

695
00:42:39,800 --> 00:42:44,200
For another question I have for 
you about your chart because in 

696
00:42:44,200 --> 00:42:49,700
your chart so your Sagittarius 
rising and then you have Virgo 

697
00:42:49,700 --> 00:42:52,300
on What's called the midheaven 
and that's the highest point in 

698
00:42:52,308 --> 00:42:55,700
your chart and I like to think 
of that place in the chart as 

699
00:42:55,700 --> 00:43:00,000
the light that's drawing your 
your Evian plants, you know that

700
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:02,400
the light that the Evian plants 
is growing towards. 

701
00:43:04,100 --> 00:43:07,700
So up at up there up in the 
heaven of your chart you have 

702
00:43:07,700 --> 00:43:09,400
what's called a stallion, which 
is a grouping. 

703
00:43:09,600 --> 00:43:14,300
A of three or more bodies. 
And in Virgo, you have the sun, 

704
00:43:14,300 --> 00:43:19,100
Mars and Venus, and they're all 
conjunct this place of the 

705
00:43:19,100 --> 00:43:23,600
midheaven and just so briefly. 
So your son is kind of 

706
00:43:23,600 --> 00:43:27,900
Representative of your life, 
force, and vitality and personal

707
00:43:27,900 --> 00:43:34,400
expression, Venus is a really 
important planet for you because

708
00:43:34,400 --> 00:43:36,300
of where it is. 
It's the highest planet in your 

709
00:43:36,300 --> 00:43:39,000
chart and it also rules the 
sign. 

710
00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:40,700
Libra. 
Your natal Mercury is. 

711
00:43:40,700 --> 00:43:45,000
And so you as a figure that is a
communicator and a sharer and 

712
00:43:47,200 --> 00:43:51,300
creator of thought and content 
and learning new language, Venus

713
00:43:51,300 --> 00:43:56,600
is the ruler of that. 
So, Venus is up there and Venus.

714
00:43:58,700 --> 00:44:01,300
Well, Venus can represent a 
whole lot of things but Beauty 

715
00:44:01,300 --> 00:44:03,600
and the feeling of 
attractiveness and also personal

716
00:44:03,600 --> 00:44:09,000
value are really big ones for 
Venus, Mars is there and Mars is

717
00:44:09,100 --> 00:44:10,900
again. 
Then also a lot of things but 

718
00:44:10,900 --> 00:44:14,300
also sometimes a symbol for 
sexual desire and satisfaction. 

719
00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:19,300
And so, this grouping of planets
is square. 

720
00:44:19,300 --> 00:44:23,600
It's 90 degrees to your 
ascendant in Sagittarius to your

721
00:44:23,600 --> 00:44:27,900
rising sign where you have the 
planet, Saturn and Uranus. 

722
00:44:28,900 --> 00:44:35,000
And one of Saturn's symbols is 
Authority and you're in a system

723
00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:37,500
bull is Liberation. 
And so they're kind of like an 

724
00:44:37,500 --> 00:44:41,000
interesting combo. 
We're Iron can be quite rigid 

725
00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:44,300
and Uranus wants freedom and 
they have to figure out how to 

726
00:44:44,300 --> 00:44:48,000
work together those two and 
their they're right on your 

727
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:49,900
ascendant. 
So they're in the they're 

728
00:44:49,900 --> 00:44:52,000
they're kind of directly in 
their field of view. 

729
00:44:52,000 --> 00:44:54,000
I would say they're like the 
glasses that you're wearing 

730
00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:57,100
through your life kind of and 
they're shining the light of 

731
00:44:57,100 --> 00:45:02,100
Sagittarius, which is really 
Associated. 

732
00:45:02,100 --> 00:45:04,500
I mean, I've spoken to 
Sagittarius in some ways as like

733
00:45:04,500 --> 00:45:07,300
this hunger for knowledge, but 
another thing that Sagittarius 

734
00:45:07,300 --> 00:45:09,400
can be associated with is belief
systems. 

735
00:45:09,500 --> 00:45:14,200
Yes, and feelings of Truth or 
right and wrong can sometimes 

736
00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:17,800
come in very strongly with sad, 
especially when when Sagittarius

737
00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:21,000
is aligned with one of the 
things that can be really 

738
00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:27,200
aligned with which is religion. 
So, I don't know, you know it. 

739
00:45:27,600 --> 00:45:32,200
I don't know for you, where you 
feel like certain belief systems

740
00:45:32,800 --> 00:45:36,700
arising from in your life. 
But this aspect in your chart, 

741
00:45:36,700 --> 00:45:41,300
this Square aspect. 
One of the ways that I could see

742
00:45:41,300 --> 00:45:46,600
it embodying or enacting in your
chart is as a person that has 

743
00:45:46,600 --> 00:45:49,700
internalized, a certain side of 
belief systems that they've been

744
00:45:49,700 --> 00:45:54,000
in your full view somehow as you
came into your life and that 

745
00:45:54,000 --> 00:45:57,200
they greatly shaped the ways 
that you were able to embody 

746
00:45:57,200 --> 00:46:01,300
Your vitality, your sexuality, 
and your desire and feeling of 

747
00:46:01,300 --> 00:46:05,200
attractiveness. 
And that part of your life 

748
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:08,300
journey is to awaken to those 
belief systems. 

749
00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:12,500
Eames and to liberate yourself 
within them. 

750
00:46:12,800 --> 00:46:16,100
And sometimes that's going to 
mean radicalizing or revolting 

751
00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:20,100
and sometimes that's going to 
mean like really traveling far 

752
00:46:20,100 --> 00:46:22,400
and wide and digging deep for 
your own truth. 

753
00:46:23,400 --> 00:46:27,400
And as you do that, then how 
you're consistently kind of 

754
00:46:27,400 --> 00:46:31,200
coming into the world is 
through, you know, this light of

755
00:46:31,200 --> 00:46:34,400
Virgo, which is about healing, 
and the body and creative 

756
00:46:34,400 --> 00:46:37,900
intelligence, and then these 
placements of your body. 

757
00:46:37,900 --> 00:46:40,400
Your like, actual. 
Tackle literal body, the sun, 

758
00:46:40,400 --> 00:46:44,300
Venus your beauty, you know, 
your charm. 

759
00:46:44,300 --> 00:46:45,500
What you're putting out into the
world. 

760
00:46:45,500 --> 00:46:50,100
You're speaking about the things
you're speaking about and Mars 

761
00:46:50,100 --> 00:46:52,800
right? 
Sexuality and desire so I don't 

762
00:46:52,800 --> 00:46:55,600
know that was a lot but I'm 
wondering if if you'd be willing

763
00:46:55,600 --> 00:46:59,700
to share with me about this 
journey of Liberation that 

764
00:46:59,700 --> 00:47:02,200
you've been on and anything 
that's like resonating for you 

765
00:47:02,200 --> 00:47:08,100
with those themes and like how 
it began or what first made you 

766
00:47:08,100 --> 00:47:10,400
realize. 
Guys, you know that you were 

767
00:47:10,400 --> 00:47:17,300
being confined in certain 
aspects of you know, what I had 

768
00:47:17,300 --> 00:47:19,100
pulled a quote of yours. 
Can I read it? 

769
00:47:19,200 --> 00:47:23,400
Yeah, from your bio. 
So yeah, this isn't a section of

770
00:47:23,400 --> 00:47:25,400
your bio that you have on your 
website. 

771
00:47:25,400 --> 00:47:28,900
And you said, I entered this 
work of sexual healing and 

772
00:47:28,900 --> 00:47:32,500
Liberation from a selfish place.
I wanted to better understand my

773
00:47:32,500 --> 00:47:36,000
sexuality and sensuality, after 
years of being taught, that 

774
00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:38,700
ownership of those things were 
off-limits. 

775
00:47:38,900 --> 00:47:42,500
A that my body was a side of 
Temptation to myself and others 

776
00:47:42,700 --> 00:47:45,000
that the voice of my desire 
shouldn't be trusted and that I 

777
00:47:45,000 --> 00:47:48,600
wasn't allowed to claim my wants
because of the rigidity of 

778
00:47:48,600 --> 00:47:51,700
respectability. 
I wanted to challenge and 

779
00:47:51,700 --> 00:47:54,800
rewrite those narratives. 
I wanted to claim my sexuality 

780
00:47:54,800 --> 00:47:56,900
as mine outside of the shame and
Trauma. 

781
00:47:56,900 --> 00:48:03,200
I inherited intergenerationally.
So who yeah, I'm like, did I 

782
00:48:03,200 --> 00:48:08,200
write that road that you wrote 
that, that is on here? 

783
00:48:10,900 --> 00:48:13,700
Yeah, so can you talk to me 
about this like about this 

784
00:48:13,700 --> 00:48:17,800
journey and you know your 
journey of Awakening and 

785
00:48:17,808 --> 00:48:21,500
Liberation personally and how 
brought you to this moment. 

786
00:48:21,700 --> 00:48:25,100
Oh, it's so deep. 
It's so so deep and, you know, 

787
00:48:25,100 --> 00:48:28,600
I'm as you're talking about 
this, I was thinking, like, when

788
00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:33,000
did I start to reject Authority?
And my mom. 

789
00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:38,600
Always tells the story about how
I was very independent. 

790
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:43,700
And I was very curious and 
exploratory. 

791
00:48:43,700 --> 00:48:45,400
I'd it's, I've always been this 
way. 

792
00:48:45,400 --> 00:48:47,700
But when I started walking very 
young. 

793
00:48:47,700 --> 00:48:51,400
I think I was like nine months 
old when I started walking. 

794
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:54,000
Oh, well, I was I was a 
go-getter. 

795
00:48:54,000 --> 00:48:56,900
I really wanted to do all the 
things and I would do these 

796
00:48:56,900 --> 00:49:00,200
things where I would like climb 
on things, you know, and my mom 

797
00:49:00,200 --> 00:49:04,300
would be like Evian you're going
to fall and I could talk by then

798
00:49:04,300 --> 00:49:10,300
and I would say no I'm not and I
was you know, but I've always 

799
00:49:10,300 --> 00:49:13,800
wanted to test the boundaries, 
you know, like I've always 

800
00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:19,600
wanted to like figure things out
on my own and the moment that an

801
00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:21,300
authority figure tells me that I
can't do it. 

802
00:49:21,300 --> 00:49:23,700
I'm like, are you kidding? 
Watch me. 

803
00:49:23,700 --> 00:49:26,000
And then, you know, sometimes I 
fail but it's fine. 

804
00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:32,300
So yeah, I'm thinking about how 
how that has been a story for 

805
00:49:32,300 --> 00:49:34,500
me. 
And you know, I feel like 

806
00:49:34,900 --> 00:49:40,300
Throughout my life. 
I've always felt that what was 

807
00:49:40,300 --> 00:49:42,100
presented to me, or what was 
given to me? 

808
00:49:42,100 --> 00:49:46,600
Or what I was taught to do or to
think, or to have or to feel 

809
00:49:46,600 --> 00:49:51,300
wasn't all that there was. 
And, you know, I was raised 

810
00:49:51,300 --> 00:49:53,800
Christian and a pretty 
conservative home. 

811
00:49:53,800 --> 00:49:57,100
I would say we were, I don't 
think my parents would describe 

812
00:49:57,100 --> 00:50:01,100
it as this, but I felt like we 
were Evangelical, you know, I 

813
00:50:01,107 --> 00:50:03,700
grew up signing Purity contracts
and things like that. 

814
00:50:03,700 --> 00:50:08,100
So it was very very much 
indoctrinated and me this idea 

815
00:50:08,100 --> 00:50:13,500
of respectability and the ways 
that I'm supposed to carry 

816
00:50:13,500 --> 00:50:18,300
myself within my body within my 
sexuality within my race, you 

817
00:50:18,308 --> 00:50:24,200
know, and I don't know, I feel 
like I think one of the first 

818
00:50:24,200 --> 00:50:28,800
things that I ever really 
experimenting with in terms of, 

819
00:50:29,600 --> 00:50:32,200
you know, kind of giving a 
middle finger to Authority was 

820
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:36,400
having sex before, I was told 
that I should, you know, I mean 

821
00:50:36,400 --> 00:50:39,900
I was told that I should have 
sex on my wedding day, you know,

822
00:50:39,900 --> 00:50:44,500
save myself until marriage very 
abstinence-only teachings that I

823
00:50:44,508 --> 00:50:49,800
was given and you know, I I made
a choice and I won't say that 

824
00:50:49,800 --> 00:50:54,100
that choice was totally informed
but I made a choice at that time

825
00:50:54,100 --> 00:50:56,500
to be like, I'm not going I'm 
not going to do this. 

826
00:50:56,500 --> 00:51:00,700
Like I'm not going to I'm not 
going to live by these rules 

827
00:51:00,700 --> 00:51:04,800
that I don't understand or I 
don't agree with and I think 

828
00:51:04,800 --> 00:51:07,900
that That was my first me. 
There are many many different 

829
00:51:07,900 --> 00:51:13,200
ways that I have rebelled 
against these systems for me 

830
00:51:13,200 --> 00:51:16,700
that were very oppressive. 
But that was like the major one,

831
00:51:16,700 --> 00:51:19,400
you know, that was like my 
entire religion was talking 

832
00:51:19,400 --> 00:51:22,400
about not doing this thing and 
my parents were talking about 

833
00:51:22,400 --> 00:51:26,700
not doing these things and I was
reading books about not doing 

834
00:51:26,700 --> 00:51:30,000
these things. 
And so that was like one of the 

835
00:51:30,000 --> 00:51:33,700
first steps that I made toward 
my own sexual Liberation and not

836
00:51:33,700 --> 00:51:38,300
even just sexual but just The 
agency of my body and the agency

837
00:51:38,300 --> 00:51:43,300
of my choices and that I want to
do it. 

838
00:51:43,300 --> 00:51:46,800
So I'm going to do it, you know,
and I think that's one of the 

839
00:51:46,800 --> 00:51:50,400
reasons why sex is been so 
fascinating for me and sort of a

840
00:51:50,400 --> 00:51:53,700
Gateway through which I have 
liberated, all aspects of 

841
00:51:53,700 --> 00:51:56,500
myself. 
It's because it was billed to me

842
00:51:56,500 --> 00:52:00,200
as this thing. 
That was so bad and something 

843
00:52:00,200 --> 00:52:04,000
that you should not do. 
While also, on the other hand 

844
00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:06,600
being like, But it's so 
beautiful and it's there's so 

845
00:52:06,600 --> 00:52:10,000
much love here and sometimes it 
can feel really good. 

846
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:15,000
So, I really wanted to just like
carve my own Road and find find 

847
00:52:15,000 --> 00:52:18,300
my own meaning like make my own 
meaning around these things and 

848
00:52:18,300 --> 00:52:22,000
not necessarily take it from an 
authority figure. 

849
00:52:22,300 --> 00:52:25,800
And that's been really 
challenging for, you know, my 

850
00:52:25,800 --> 00:52:32,000
family to understand, because 
they still have the beliefs that

851
00:52:32,000 --> 00:52:34,200
they do that. 
I was that I was brought up with

852
00:52:34,200 --> 00:52:40,500
and There's I mean, thankfully 
my mom has a lot of respect for 

853
00:52:40,508 --> 00:52:42,800
the work that I do. 
Now in the beginning. 

854
00:52:42,800 --> 00:52:45,500
She was like, not keen on it at 
all. 

855
00:52:46,600 --> 00:52:51,400
My dad is well is very much like
this is not good for you. 

856
00:52:51,400 --> 00:52:53,500
And this is not something that 
you should be doing. 

857
00:52:53,500 --> 00:52:59,700
And so I'm even though I'm in 
the space where I'm very much 

858
00:52:59,700 --> 00:53:05,700
defining the rules and creating 
my own boundaries and And also 

859
00:53:07,300 --> 00:53:10,600
continuing to give a giant fuck 
you to all of these systems of 

860
00:53:10,600 --> 00:53:13,500
Oppression that have told me 
that I'm not allowed to take up 

861
00:53:13,500 --> 00:53:15,300
the space. 
So I'm not allowed to have these

862
00:53:15,300 --> 00:53:19,000
experiences or to claim my body 
as mine. 

863
00:53:19,700 --> 00:53:24,600
I am in it and it feels like 
this is the way that everyone is

864
00:53:24,600 --> 00:53:27,400
occupying the space and I get 
these reminders that like, no, 

865
00:53:27,400 --> 00:53:30,400
it's we're still, we're still in
a world and we're still living 

866
00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:34,600
in a culture that has these 
specific views. 

867
00:53:34,900 --> 00:53:38,700
Seems, you know, these systems 
of Oppression are still are 

868
00:53:38,700 --> 00:53:42,800
still with us. 
And I don't, I don't really know

869
00:53:42,800 --> 00:53:47,600
where where it comes from. 
I mean, I think my reading with 

870
00:53:47,600 --> 00:53:51,700
you recently, really kind of 
shed light on like, oh, it's not

871
00:53:51,700 --> 00:53:55,700
like I'm not just doing this to 
be annoying, like it's me. 

872
00:53:55,700 --> 00:54:00,700
It's literally an imperative for
me to do this and I don't know 

873
00:54:00,700 --> 00:54:06,100
where it comes from Beyond it. 
Just feels like I I want to 

874
00:54:06,300 --> 00:54:09,600
question every single thing that
this world has told me that I 

875
00:54:09,600 --> 00:54:11,800
am. 
And, you know, sometimes that 

876
00:54:11,800 --> 00:54:14,400
questioning leads me to be like,
okay, that's true. 

877
00:54:14,400 --> 00:54:17,100
There's some truth to that. 
Like I can, I can internalize 

878
00:54:17,100 --> 00:54:19,600
that. 
Or I can, I can flip it on its 

879
00:54:19,600 --> 00:54:21,800
head and make it mine in my own 
way. 

880
00:54:22,100 --> 00:54:24,400
But most of the time, it's like,
no, don't tell. 

881
00:54:24,400 --> 00:54:26,400
Don't tell me what to do. 
Yeah. 

882
00:54:26,400 --> 00:54:29,100
It's very much like coming back 
to like, baby Evian room. 

883
00:54:29,100 --> 00:54:31,700
Like, don't tell me what to do. 
Sure. 

884
00:54:31,700 --> 00:54:33,900
But like, don't tell me. 
Don't tell me that I'm going to 

885
00:54:33,908 --> 00:54:34,700
fall. 
Let me find out. 

886
00:54:34,900 --> 00:54:40,700
My own, you know, yeah. 
Yeah, thanks for that. 

887
00:54:40,700 --> 00:54:47,700
Yeah, I'm hearing that in like 
also feeling my God sagittarius 

888
00:54:47,700 --> 00:54:54,300
virgo reality as well and can 
resonate a lot with like Not 

889
00:54:54,300 --> 00:54:57,800
resonating with authority, not 
resonating with what other 

890
00:54:57,800 --> 00:54:59,600
people are telling me to do and 
be. 

891
00:54:59,600 --> 00:55:04,300
And, and then also having the 
experience that, you know, the 

892
00:55:04,300 --> 00:55:07,000
more that I live in, to my 
authentic, self the healthier 

893
00:55:07,000 --> 00:55:11,400
that I feel. 
And the more that I feel like 

894
00:55:11,400 --> 00:55:17,400
the relationships that I'm in, 
can be healthy because I'm at 

895
00:55:17,400 --> 00:55:21,500
least. 
Able more deeply able, probably 

896
00:55:21,500 --> 00:55:27,900
not fully able, but more deeply 
able to not perpetuate, the same

897
00:55:27,900 --> 00:55:32,900
harm that I've come from. 
And, you know, a lot of the harm

898
00:55:33,000 --> 00:55:35,900
is self-harm. 
It's like the way is that I hate

899
00:55:35,900 --> 00:55:39,300
myself, keep myself small, keep 
myself, second-guessing myself. 

900
00:55:39,300 --> 00:55:41,700
And then, of course, that means 
I'm going to show up in my 

901
00:55:41,700 --> 00:55:45,300
relationships, not my whole 
self, and therefore, kind of 

902
00:55:45,308 --> 00:55:53,800
funky and And yeah, I really I, 
you know, feel very just deeply 

903
00:55:53,800 --> 00:55:56,700
appreciative as the way that 
you've gone about this kind of 

904
00:55:57,000 --> 00:56:00,600
work and sentiment, and your 
call for deeper embodiment by 

905
00:56:00,600 --> 00:56:04,000
really living into it yourself, 
you know, and making it a 

906
00:56:04,008 --> 00:56:06,800
practice and being so generous 
with your own process. 

907
00:56:06,800 --> 00:56:10,100
You know, that you're willing to
share this in such a public way 

908
00:56:10,100 --> 00:56:14,500
is like, I mean, it's a true 
gift and it is a lot of Labor to

909
00:56:14,500 --> 00:56:18,400
put yourself out in that way as 
a possibility model, you know, 

910
00:56:18,400 --> 00:56:21,300
and Oh my God, that's so true. 
I was just thinking that 

911
00:56:21,300 --> 00:56:25,000
actually, you kind of read my 
mind like, how, how so much of 

912
00:56:25,000 --> 00:56:27,500
my own work has been me 
pioneering. 

913
00:56:27,500 --> 00:56:31,300
My own path toward what this 
looks like, because I don't, I 

914
00:56:31,300 --> 00:56:34,000
mean, there's there's a lot of 
there's a lot of people that I 

915
00:56:34,008 --> 00:56:38,100
am inspired by but like I'm 
thinking of, you know, this 

916
00:56:38,100 --> 00:56:41,800
thing that me and Jonathan did 
where, you know, we lived apart 

917
00:56:41,800 --> 00:56:45,200
for a year, like there was no 
manual for that. 

918
00:56:45,200 --> 00:56:47,100
There was no like books that I 
could read. 

919
00:56:47,100 --> 00:56:48,600
That was like, this is what you 
do. 

920
00:56:48,700 --> 00:56:52,500
If you have this feeling that 
you love your partner, you love 

921
00:56:52,500 --> 00:56:53,600
being in a relationship with 
them. 

922
00:56:53,600 --> 00:56:56,800
And you also want to separate 
yourself from them while 

923
00:56:56,800 --> 00:57:00,200
spraying relationship. 
Like there's, there's no there's

924
00:57:00,300 --> 00:57:03,800
so much of my process and so 
much of my journey, even when it

925
00:57:03,800 --> 00:57:05,800
came to sexuality and sex 
education. 

926
00:57:05,800 --> 00:57:09,700
I mean, when I started doing 
this work and 2010 2011 there 

927
00:57:09,700 --> 00:57:14,100
was like not as much at all. 
Sex education on the internet. 

928
00:57:14,100 --> 00:57:17,900
Like I really want for Young 
Folks to feel so much gratitude 

929
00:57:17,900 --> 00:57:19,200
for the amount of work. 
Labor. 

930
00:57:19,200 --> 00:57:22,200
That folks like me have done to 
create this. 

931
00:57:22,300 --> 00:57:26,300
This, this container that were 
and now where you have 

932
00:57:26,300 --> 00:57:29,700
comprehensive sex education, 
like, at your fingertips on 

933
00:57:29,700 --> 00:57:33,300
Instagram, but there were no 
people that I looked up to at 

934
00:57:33,300 --> 00:57:37,500
the time who looked like me who 
had experiences like me, that 

935
00:57:37,500 --> 00:57:40,600
was talking about sex in a way 
that resonated with me. 

936
00:57:41,200 --> 00:57:46,000
And yeah, it takes a lot of 
labor at and it takes a lot of 

937
00:57:46,000 --> 00:57:51,100
trial and error as well. 
And oftentimes in my work, even 

938
00:57:51,100 --> 00:57:53,500
with with you know, this new 
conversation that I'm starting 

939
00:57:53,500 --> 00:57:55,900
with myself and other people 
around asexuality. 

940
00:57:56,500 --> 00:58:01,100
I'm learning like oh kind of the
hard way that yeah. 

941
00:58:01,100 --> 00:58:04,300
This is that there's there's a 
lot of pain here and there's a 

942
00:58:04,300 --> 00:58:08,500
lot of confusion here and 
there's a lot of fear here that 

943
00:58:08,500 --> 00:58:12,300
I feel like I'm having to I'm 
trying not to but internalized 

944
00:58:12,300 --> 00:58:16,600
and like do something with 
because these conversations 

945
00:58:16,600 --> 00:58:20,400
aren't being had as much. 
As I thought they would be. 

946
00:58:20,600 --> 00:58:28,600
And so it's not intentional for 
me to be a I don't like the word

947
00:58:28,600 --> 00:58:30,500
pioneer. 
When I said it, I was like, you 

948
00:58:31,800 --> 00:58:35,600
know, it's like milker. 
Yeah, I'm like a Pioneer but 

949
00:58:35,600 --> 00:58:39,600
like yeah like in the psyche, I 
don't want that. 

950
00:58:40,300 --> 00:58:42,800
But yeah, it's not like it's not
like I woke up one day and was 

951
00:58:42,800 --> 00:58:45,800
like, I'm going to like flip 
everything that I've ever known 

952
00:58:45,800 --> 00:58:50,100
on its head and hopes to be a 
role model for other people to 

953
00:58:50,100 --> 00:58:52,100
do it. 
It's yeah, it's not easy. 

954
00:58:52,400 --> 00:58:55,000
It's definitely know when you 
were talking. 

955
00:58:55,000 --> 00:58:59,000
I was thinking about just some 
images that have been kind of 

956
00:58:59,000 --> 00:59:01,800
planted in my head recently by 
two different people like two 

957
00:59:01,800 --> 00:59:05,700
teachers Janice Lee and by a 
common law, if a hoop in there 

958
00:59:05,800 --> 00:59:10,500
both in different ways kind of 
spoke to these ideas of like 

959
00:59:10,500 --> 00:59:14,500
simultaneous, fissures or riffs,
or like collections of 

960
00:59:15,200 --> 00:59:18,200
possibility, kind of opening up 
in the places where something is

961
00:59:18,200 --> 00:59:21,800
failing, you know, where it's 
like, oh God, I can't uphold 

962
00:59:21,800 --> 00:59:24,200
this bullshit anymore. 
It's not feeling good to me. 

963
00:59:24,200 --> 00:59:27,100
I have to try something else. 
This thing is failing me. 

964
00:59:27,400 --> 00:59:31,200
So now I have to fail at it. 
And then when we make this, when

965
00:59:31,200 --> 00:59:35,400
we allow the failing to be like 
a collective offering like when 

966
00:59:35,400 --> 00:59:38,400
it's like, oh, it's not just a 
personal failing, it is a 

967
00:59:38,600 --> 00:59:42,500
Bailing on all of our parts to 
make space for people who have 

968
00:59:42,500 --> 00:59:46,700
this experience, you know, then 
like a big crack in can open the

969
00:59:46,700 --> 00:59:50,100
facade and we can all kind of 
like deep in a little bit more 

970
00:59:50,300 --> 00:59:53,100
into state of humanness. 
Right? 

971
00:59:53,100 --> 00:59:57,800
But that work that that I feel 
like you're in. 

972
00:59:57,800 --> 01:00:00,700
You know, that that I meant to 
of kind of working on the 

973
01:00:00,700 --> 01:00:04,400
Internet or something or like 
making content sometimes I think

974
01:00:04,400 --> 01:00:07,700
of it like dandelion seeds, you 
know, where it's like, okay. 

975
01:00:07,700 --> 01:00:10,900
I'm just going to see See this 
thought and out you go, and 

976
01:00:10,900 --> 01:00:13,100
you're going to float around out
there, and it's like an 

977
01:00:13,100 --> 01:00:17,000
imperfect thought, it's just one
seed, it's a little nugget and 

978
01:00:17,000 --> 01:00:21,100
it's going to land on. 
Someone's Garden patch where 5 

979
01:00:21,100 --> 01:00:23,800
million other seeds, and pollen,
you know, and let, let's just 

980
01:00:23,800 --> 01:00:27,200
hope that the seed that I'm 
blowing out is going to put, you

981
01:00:27,207 --> 01:00:30,300
know, plant into something that 
can nourish its best potential. 

982
01:00:30,700 --> 01:00:34,900
Yeah, and, and that, that is 
something that I'm learning that

983
01:00:35,300 --> 01:00:38,400
especially recently like within 
the last couple of years. 

984
01:00:39,100 --> 01:00:42,500
I have a responsibility to make 
sure that the seeds that I am 

985
01:00:42,500 --> 01:00:47,300
putting out into the world are 
not seeds that are going to be 

986
01:00:48,300 --> 01:00:55,500
confusing or harmful or I'm also
just playing around with like 

987
01:00:55,500 --> 01:00:58,200
it's okay for me to keep some of
these seeds to myself and like 

988
01:00:58,200 --> 01:00:59,900
let them marinate a bit, you 
know? 

989
01:00:59,900 --> 01:01:01,100
Yeah. 
Because I think before in the 

990
01:01:01,100 --> 01:01:04,200
past, I would have been, like, I
have a thought, let me tweet 

991
01:01:04,200 --> 01:01:08,100
about it, you know, and you're 
not fully formed and I'm going 

992
01:01:08,100 --> 01:01:12,400
to Be in process with this 
thought and also have you you 

993
01:01:12,400 --> 01:01:15,100
know, rebuttal back at me about 
this thought that I don't even 

994
01:01:15,100 --> 01:01:17,700
fully know because I literally 
just thought it. 

995
01:01:18,000 --> 01:01:21,700
It's been really interesting for
me to like take a step back and 

996
01:01:22,200 --> 01:01:25,800
and like slow down like slow my 
Pace a little bit and just like 

997
01:01:25,800 --> 01:01:27,700
keep some of those things for 
me. 

998
01:01:27,800 --> 01:01:30,200
While also realizing that 
whatever I put out into the 

999
01:01:30,200 --> 01:01:33,600
internet, like I have to be 
responsible to, you know, and 

1000
01:01:33,600 --> 01:01:35,800
that's a lot of pressure, 
especially, like I'm thinking 

1001
01:01:35,800 --> 01:01:39,600
about cancel culture. 
Which I don't even know if 

1002
01:01:39,600 --> 01:01:41,700
cancel culture is a thing to be 
honest with you. 

1003
01:01:41,700 --> 01:01:48,200
But this propensity, we have 22 
not giving folks Grace when they

1004
01:01:48,300 --> 01:01:52,400
make a mistake, or yeah, if 
something is confusing and they 

1005
01:01:52,400 --> 01:01:56,800
say it and they're sort of kind 
of like trying to refine it in 

1006
01:01:56,800 --> 01:01:58,700
real time. 
Like there's not a lot of Grace,

1007
01:01:58,700 --> 01:02:02,600
put out for people like that. 
So I've been really, really 

1008
01:02:03,000 --> 01:02:06,800
precious and private with my 
process lately because I'm like,

1009
01:02:06,900 --> 01:02:09,700
there's there's some things that
like Like I want to say and I 

1010
01:02:09,700 --> 01:02:13,600
want to express but I can't 
control how other people are 

1011
01:02:13,600 --> 01:02:17,400
going to receive it. 
And you know, if other people 

1012
01:02:17,400 --> 01:02:20,400
ask me, follow-up questions, I 
don't really have the right 

1013
01:02:20,400 --> 01:02:22,600
answers for them just yet. 
So I'm just going to take a step

1014
01:02:22,600 --> 01:02:26,100
back and I'll let this, yeah, 
Germany and my own brain. 

1015
01:02:26,100 --> 01:02:29,400
And if, and when I'm ready to, 
I'll share it with other people.

1016
01:02:29,900 --> 01:02:30,700
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

1017
01:02:30,700 --> 01:02:34,200
I really appreciate you saying 
that feels feels like important 

1018
01:02:34,200 --> 01:02:38,100
medicine in general thinking 
about any kind of effort that 

1019
01:02:38,100 --> 01:02:40,200
we're doing. 
That's going to be some kind of 

1020
01:02:40,200 --> 01:02:42,600
effort to sustain ourselves in 
like capitalism. 

1021
01:02:42,600 --> 01:02:45,800
But also like, especially 
working in this venue. 

1022
01:02:46,100 --> 01:02:51,500
Yeah, so I'm yeah, wanting to 
talk to you a little bit about 

1023
01:02:51,500 --> 01:02:57,200
this, this new creative baby. 
You've been birthing this 

1024
01:02:57,200 --> 01:03:01,800
workbook, sensual self prompts 
and practices for getting in 

1025
01:03:01,800 --> 01:03:06,400
touch with your body. 
It's such a beautiful offering. 

1026
01:03:06,400 --> 01:03:10,500
I was looking through it and 
Really appreciating that you are

1027
01:03:10,500 --> 01:03:14,800
putting a book out into the 
world, that is a guided self 

1028
01:03:14,800 --> 01:03:18,900
inquiry and that you're, you 
know, you're offering your 

1029
01:03:18,900 --> 01:03:24,000
generosity and facilitation and 
you've given a beautiful 

1030
01:03:24,000 --> 01:03:27,300
introduction and a lot of 
prompts. 

1031
01:03:27,300 --> 01:03:31,000
I think you say, you said it's 
like a hundred over 150 prompts.

1032
01:03:31,000 --> 01:03:36,400
Yeah, for people to, to write 
their own book on what it means 

1033
01:03:36,400 --> 01:03:40,900
to be, they're uniquely sensual 
and For ourselves and like your 

1034
01:03:40,900 --> 01:03:44,000
prompts are awesome. 
They cover such a huge range of 

1035
01:03:44,000 --> 01:03:49,600
what sensuality and sexuality 
can include, but also how it has

1036
01:03:49,600 --> 01:03:53,600
been in a person's life and how 
its developed and their Visions 

1037
01:03:53,600 --> 01:03:58,100
for how it could be. 
So I'm wondering if you could 

1038
01:03:58,100 --> 01:04:02,300
speak to a bit around, you know,
why you have created this book 

1039
01:04:02,800 --> 01:04:06,500
and what the process has been 
for you and your work as a 

1040
01:04:06,500 --> 01:04:12,300
sensuality and sexuality, Tula. 
And sex educator that that has 

1041
01:04:12,300 --> 01:04:16,700
guided you too. 
To work with people in this way 

1042
01:04:17,000 --> 01:04:21,200
of kind of like giving them a 
certain set of tools for 

1043
01:04:21,200 --> 01:04:24,500
awakening and Reawakening 
Awakening their sensuality. 

1044
01:04:25,400 --> 01:04:29,400
Yeah. 
I like to create things that I 

1045
01:04:29,400 --> 01:04:32,800
wish that I had had like 10 
years ago, you know, food. 

1046
01:04:33,300 --> 01:04:37,900
This book for me, was something 
that I wish that I was. 

1047
01:04:37,900 --> 01:04:41,000
I spent a lot of time in Barnes 
& Noble, like, trying to figure 

1048
01:04:41,000 --> 01:04:43,800
out who I was, what was wrong 
with me. 

1049
01:04:43,900 --> 01:04:49,900
Me just to see if like, if if I 
could get to the bottom of the 

1050
01:04:49,900 --> 01:04:53,500
issue that I had around my 
sexuality, or the ways that I 

1051
01:04:53,500 --> 01:04:57,700
felt so much anxiety, whenever I
had sex, like, I wish that this 

1052
01:04:57,700 --> 01:05:01,300
book was on the shelves, because
so many of the books that I read

1053
01:05:01,800 --> 01:05:04,100
were very prescriptive. 
Like, we'll just do this. 

1054
01:05:04,100 --> 01:05:06,900
If you have this issue, do this 
like that'll solve your problem?

1055
01:05:07,000 --> 01:05:11,000
Or try the sex toy or try this? 
Exposition or breathe in this 

1056
01:05:11,000 --> 01:05:13,800
way when you're having sex and 
those things are great. 

1057
01:05:14,000 --> 01:05:19,400
But I wanted something that was 
more empowering, you know, like 

1058
01:05:19,500 --> 01:05:22,000
I didn't want to empower Myself 
by reading a book. 

1059
01:05:22,000 --> 01:05:26,600
I wanted to empower Myself by 
figuring out what feels good for

1060
01:05:26,600 --> 01:05:30,700
me, you know, like what feels 
good for my process at this 

1061
01:05:30,700 --> 01:05:32,900
time. 
Maybe I can pick it back up. 

1062
01:05:32,900 --> 01:05:35,100
Revisit it later when I'm a 
little older. 

1063
01:05:35,100 --> 01:05:39,400
Like I just wanted the process 
to feel alive when it came to my

1064
01:05:39,400 --> 01:05:44,000
Liberation and my healing. 
And so I've really created my I 

1065
01:05:44,000 --> 01:05:48,200
work based off of that 
framework, you know, when I was 

1066
01:05:48,200 --> 01:05:53,800
doing one-on-one client work. 
It's very, very common for me to

1067
01:05:53,800 --> 01:05:56,000
just like, ask a whole bunch of 
questions, you know, like 

1068
01:05:56,000 --> 01:05:58,100
someone would be like, so what 
do you think I should do in 

1069
01:05:58,100 --> 01:06:01,100
order to? 
I don't know, have the best sex 

1070
01:06:01,100 --> 01:06:03,300
of my life and I'm like, well, 
what is the best sex of your 

1071
01:06:03,300 --> 01:06:05,200
life feel like? 
And sometimes clients would be 

1072
01:06:05,200 --> 01:06:07,300
like, why are you just tell me 
what I need? 

1073
01:06:07,300 --> 01:06:10,100
You know, like don't don't ask 
don't turn the questions back 

1074
01:06:10,100 --> 01:06:13,400
over to me, but I want to 
because I want people to empower

1075
01:06:13,400 --> 01:06:16,000
themselves. 
I don't ever want someone to 

1076
01:06:16,000 --> 01:06:19,400
look at me or to other authority
figures and think like, well, 

1077
01:06:19,400 --> 01:06:22,000
that's what they do. 
So that's what I have to do. 

1078
01:06:22,700 --> 01:06:27,100
I want for folks to answer their
own questions and get curious 

1079
01:06:27,100 --> 01:06:31,200
about their own process and kind
of get into the mud, when it 

1080
01:06:31,200 --> 01:06:34,400
comes to discovering who who 
they are. 

1081
01:06:34,400 --> 01:06:39,400
And like these really beautiful 
nooks and crannies of that. 

1082
01:06:40,000 --> 01:06:43,500
And so that's why I wrote this 
book, the way that I did, I 

1083
01:06:43,500 --> 01:06:50,000
really Lee wanted to offer 
people little nuggets of 

1084
01:06:50,100 --> 01:06:55,800
reclamation through question and
through, through practice and to

1085
01:06:55,800 --> 01:06:58,700
make the questions and 
practices, not super lofty 

1086
01:06:58,700 --> 01:07:05,500
because I think sometimes This 
work can feel really lofty, you 

1087
01:07:05,500 --> 01:07:08,600
know, it can feel it can feel 
like a lot to do and I 

1088
01:07:08,607 --> 01:07:15,600
understand why people kind of 
relinquish their power to 

1089
01:07:16,600 --> 01:07:21,400
experts and stuff like that 
because it's a lot to it's a lot

1090
01:07:21,400 --> 01:07:25,000
to be responsible for your own 
pleasure and your own healing 

1091
01:07:25,000 --> 01:07:29,500
and your own trauma, you know, 
so I want to make sure that 

1092
01:07:29,500 --> 01:07:31,100
like, I'm empowering folks to 
ask. 

1093
01:07:31,300 --> 01:07:35,700
Questions, but not to have these
questions be like, think of the,

1094
01:07:36,400 --> 01:07:38,100
let me think of a question. 
That's like really deep. 

1095
01:07:38,100 --> 01:07:41,000
Like why do you think you have 
the trauma that you have like, 

1096
01:07:41,200 --> 01:07:43,600
no one wants to answer those 
questions, you know. 

1097
01:07:43,600 --> 01:07:47,900
Like so I want I want the 
questions to be fun. 

1098
01:07:48,000 --> 01:07:53,900
I want the process to be 
exploratory and curious, and I 

1099
01:07:53,900 --> 01:07:57,400
was making sure that when I was 
in that in that state of writing

1100
01:07:57,400 --> 01:08:01,600
the book and writing the prompts
and the practices, I Thinking 

1101
01:08:01,600 --> 01:08:06,200
about you know, what would I 
have wanted to give myself 

1102
01:08:06,300 --> 01:08:10,300
during the darkest? 
Most confusing times of me 

1103
01:08:10,300 --> 01:08:14,200
trying to figure myself out, you
know, and a lot of these 

1104
01:08:14,200 --> 01:08:17,899
questions were written from that
place and also just like wanting

1105
01:08:17,899 --> 01:08:22,100
to be an invitation for folks to
think about different ways of 

1106
01:08:22,100 --> 01:08:26,000
seeing their bodies and their 
sexuality and I had a lot of fun

1107
01:08:26,200 --> 01:08:30,500
creating it was so fun to be in 
that space to write these 

1108
01:08:30,500 --> 01:08:34,300
questions. 
And think about the practices 

1109
01:08:34,300 --> 01:08:37,300
and also I'm like these just 
feel like really fun and doable 

1110
01:08:37,300 --> 01:08:40,000
things to do. 
You know, like it's I think 

1111
01:08:40,000 --> 01:08:43,000
sometimes we think that healing 
and Liberation looks like 

1112
01:08:43,399 --> 01:08:47,899
crawling on the ground and 
crying and you know, having 

1113
01:08:47,899 --> 01:08:50,500
nightmares and staying up late 
at night and doing like 

1114
01:08:50,500 --> 01:08:54,800
intensive 6, hour-long sessions 
and therapy and sometimes it can

1115
01:08:54,800 --> 01:08:58,000
be that, you know, sometimes it 
can be breathwork that feels 

1116
01:08:58,000 --> 01:09:01,899
like you're exorcising demons 
from like Your great-great 

1117
01:09:01,899 --> 01:09:05,200
great-great-grandfather, you 
know, but other times that that 

1118
01:09:05,200 --> 01:09:07,899
process of healing and 
Liberation can feel light and it

1119
01:09:07,899 --> 01:09:12,399
can be pleasurable, you know, 
and we don't have to take it so 

1120
01:09:12,399 --> 01:09:16,200
seriously, and so, yeah, since 
you will self is like my, my 

1121
01:09:16,200 --> 01:09:20,100
invitation for people to 
literally figure out and like, 

1122
01:09:20,100 --> 01:09:22,399
create themselves a sensual 
beings. 

1123
01:09:23,100 --> 01:09:24,700
Hmm. 
I love that. 

1124
01:09:25,200 --> 01:09:31,700
I love these words, Reclamation 
and practice to feel like For a 

1125
01:09:31,800 --> 01:09:36,399
Venus in Virgo, midheaven 
person, like, Reclamation and 

1126
01:09:36,399 --> 01:09:39,600
practice feel like, such deep 
offerings of this kind of love. 

1127
01:09:40,000 --> 01:09:43,200
Yeah. 
Yeah, that this piece is really 

1128
01:09:43,200 --> 01:09:49,100
important too because I know 
that, you know, I could, I could

1129
01:09:49,100 --> 01:09:51,500
write a book about sensuality 
and have people just like hold 

1130
01:09:51,500 --> 01:09:53,800
it in their hands and 
intellectualize it to think 

1131
01:09:53,800 --> 01:09:56,000
about it. 
But since you ality isn't 

1132
01:09:56,000 --> 01:09:59,400
something that we that's meant 
to be thought about, you know, 

1133
01:09:59,400 --> 01:10:01,000
it's something that we're 
supposed to embody. 

1134
01:10:01,100 --> 01:10:06,200
D and feel out and explore 
brightens, you know, have have 

1135
01:10:06,200 --> 01:10:08,600
these like visceral experiences 
with. 

1136
01:10:08,600 --> 01:10:12,500
So I really wanted to make sure 
that Not only was I asking 

1137
01:10:13,000 --> 01:10:15,600
interesting questions to get you
to think about things but I'm 

1138
01:10:15,600 --> 01:10:21,800
also creating a space for you to
literally embody since you ality

1139
01:10:21,800 --> 01:10:23,600
by. 
Yeah, you know, trying it on for

1140
01:10:23,600 --> 01:10:27,000
size and enjoying that process 
and seeing what it feels like. 

1141
01:10:27,400 --> 01:10:28,200
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

1142
01:10:28,200 --> 01:10:30,200
I love that. 
I mean, I was thinking about 

1143
01:10:30,200 --> 01:10:33,400
like going, Excited for this 
book to come out and I want to 

1144
01:10:33,407 --> 01:10:36,500
hold it in my hands and I want 
to work with this book. 

1145
01:10:36,500 --> 01:10:40,500
And, you know, I was thinking 
like, wow, okay, 150 prompts, 

1146
01:10:40,500 --> 01:10:44,600
you know, like if I really 
committed to working with this 

1147
01:10:44,600 --> 01:10:49,600
guide and doing 150 prompts, you
know, that Evian is suggesting 

1148
01:10:49,600 --> 01:10:53,700
and, you know, let it letting 
them in as questions for myself 

1149
01:10:53,700 --> 01:10:56,600
to reflect on and work with and 
like really writing that book 

1150
01:10:56,600 --> 01:11:00,700
for myself and and committing to
the practice. 

1151
01:11:00,700 --> 01:11:03,900
I I bet that I would be a 
changed person on the other 

1152
01:11:03,900 --> 01:11:06,000
side. 
You know, I bet that I would 

1153
01:11:06,000 --> 01:11:08,800
really reclaim a lot of 
different parts of myself. 

1154
01:11:09,400 --> 01:11:13,100
I hope I mean that's that's my 
sincerest wish and desire that 

1155
01:11:13,100 --> 01:11:15,100
people who pick up this book or 
not. 

1156
01:11:15,100 --> 01:11:20,000
Just going to like look at the 
pretty clothes and the clothes, 

1157
01:11:20,000 --> 01:11:22,200
like I want you to work with it,
you know, this. 

1158
01:11:22,200 --> 01:11:24,700
Yes. 
Meant to be worked with and and 

1159
01:11:24,700 --> 01:11:29,700
not just, you know, I was, I was
thinking about this book to 

1160
01:11:30,000 --> 01:11:32,700
there's so many different ways. 
Is that a book? 

1161
01:11:32,700 --> 01:11:35,600
Like this has been made, you 
know, like having a diary, or a 

1162
01:11:35,600 --> 01:11:39,100
journal where you answer 
questions about the day or 

1163
01:11:39,100 --> 01:11:42,400
yourself. 
And sometimes, you know, I've 

1164
01:11:42,400 --> 01:11:45,200
worked through journals like 
this in the past like I remember

1165
01:11:45,200 --> 01:11:50,200
being 12 and having a journal 
where I was asked questions that

1166
01:11:50,200 --> 01:11:53,800
were really just like on the 
surface like what's your 

1167
01:11:53,800 --> 01:11:56,300
favorite color today? 
You know, and I mean a there's 

1168
01:11:56,300 --> 01:12:00,600
there's there's space, of 
course, but then I remember 

1169
01:12:00,600 --> 01:12:03,500
having another Other Journal 
that was like, asked me to go 

1170
01:12:03,500 --> 01:12:07,200
really deep. 
Like what is, what is a fear 

1171
01:12:07,200 --> 01:12:10,500
that you have? 
And like what would you, what 

1172
01:12:10,500 --> 01:12:15,300
would you want to say to that 
fear to like, you know, give it 

1173
01:12:15,300 --> 01:12:17,700
some space or some some love or 
some kindness? 

1174
01:12:17,700 --> 01:12:21,900
Like those are, those are 
questions that Just feel really 

1175
01:12:21,900 --> 01:12:27,000
alive, you know, and I feel like
if if you are able to come to 

1176
01:12:27,000 --> 01:12:31,200
this book with intention, I 
really believe that you will be 

1177
01:12:31,200 --> 01:12:33,000
changed by it. 
I really do. 

1178
01:12:33,700 --> 01:12:40,000
So, I hope. 
Well maybe I can ask you one of 

1179
01:12:40,000 --> 01:12:44,200
the prompts that I that I was 
like, ooh, I wonder what Afghans

1180
01:12:44,200 --> 01:12:46,300
answered. 
This would be my gosh. 

1181
01:12:49,000 --> 01:12:54,000
I'm so curious about You're 
about to ask me, you know, I was

1182
01:12:54,000 --> 01:12:57,200
just I was really interested 
just for you to hear from you 

1183
01:12:57,200 --> 01:13:00,300
today about what pleasure feels 
like for you today. 

1184
01:13:00,300 --> 01:13:04,700
And if there are things that are
getting, you feeling good in 

1185
01:13:04,700 --> 01:13:07,500
your own body today, in October 
of 2021. 

1186
01:13:09,000 --> 01:13:12,500
What a beautiful question. 
Thanks for asking me that, I as 

1187
01:13:12,500 --> 01:13:16,600
someone who asks people, lots of
questions, both in the work that

1188
01:13:16,600 --> 01:13:18,200
I do. 
And also like, on my podcast. 

1189
01:13:18,200 --> 01:13:21,700
It's very rare that people ask 
me questions that are poignant, 

1190
01:13:21,700 --> 01:13:25,700
you know, so, thank you, 
pleasure. 

1191
01:13:29,100 --> 01:13:36,800
I'm feeling into pleasure as 
being a full body experience. 

1192
01:13:37,600 --> 01:13:40,200
And that feels really rich for 
me right now. 

1193
01:13:40,200 --> 01:13:47,900
Like I in the past pleasure has 
been centrally located to like 

1194
01:13:47,900 --> 01:13:49,400
one part. 
You know, if I'm eating 

1195
01:13:49,400 --> 01:13:51,300
something good. 
It's like oh, it feels really 

1196
01:13:51,300 --> 01:13:55,200
good in my tongue or I feel I 
feel the sensations of that in 

1197
01:13:55,200 --> 01:13:58,700
my mouth or if I'm having sex, 
you know, it's centrally located

1198
01:13:58,700 --> 01:14:03,500
to my genitals and lately. 
I've been playing with what does

1199
01:14:03,500 --> 01:14:07,300
it feel like to feel this 
pleasurable? 

1200
01:14:07,700 --> 01:14:12,300
Asian, if I'm eating a piece of 
chocolate cake, like can I feel 

1201
01:14:12,300 --> 01:14:16,600
pleasure and other parts of my 
body that may not be engaged, 

1202
01:14:16,700 --> 01:14:20,700
you know, like what does it feel
like for me to feel the pleasure

1203
01:14:20,700 --> 01:14:22,800
of this chocolate cake and my 
fingertips? 

1204
01:14:22,900 --> 01:14:31,900
We're in my thighs or yeah, like
or in my chest, you know, and 

1205
01:14:31,900 --> 01:14:37,100
then like I'm also thinking 
about savoring and stretching 

1206
01:14:37,100 --> 01:14:41,900
that since Ation of pleasure out
from, not just being like, okay,

1207
01:14:41,900 --> 01:14:43,700
I ate the cake. 
The pleasure is done. 

1208
01:14:43,700 --> 01:14:46,800
But like, what does it feel like
afterwards? 

1209
01:14:46,800 --> 01:14:49,700
Like after eat the cake, like 
sometimes that Sugar, I get that

1210
01:14:49,700 --> 01:14:52,800
Sugar Rush like, oh, does that 
feel pleasurable in my body? 

1211
01:14:52,800 --> 01:14:55,600
Can I feel the sugar in my 
bloodstream? 

1212
01:14:55,600 --> 01:15:00,300
What does that we like or even 
like thinking about the memory 

1213
01:15:00,300 --> 01:15:02,700
that I have of like? 
Wow, I an hour ago. 

1214
01:15:02,700 --> 01:15:05,000
I ate chocolate cake. 
I wish I had that cake again. 

1215
01:15:05,000 --> 01:15:10,200
Like I'm just, I'm really, I'm 
really Stared in exploring 

1216
01:15:10,200 --> 01:15:14,600
pleasure. 
And making it into almost like 

1217
01:15:14,600 --> 01:15:17,800
the spiritual experience. 
Like something that sort of 

1218
01:15:17,800 --> 01:15:25,200
transports me both into my body.
And also I don't know if it's 

1219
01:15:25,200 --> 01:15:28,500
outside of my body, but into 
just like different Realms of 

1220
01:15:28,500 --> 01:15:31,200
being with my body if that makes
sense. 

1221
01:15:31,600 --> 01:15:35,800
So yeah, I've been I've been 
really trying to feel into that.

1222
01:15:35,800 --> 01:15:38,200
And in order to do that. 
I have to slow down. 

1223
01:15:38,600 --> 01:15:41,500
I have to you. 
I have to chew my food. 

1224
01:15:41,600 --> 01:15:46,100
I Q. 
Breathe, you know, that's 

1225
01:15:46,100 --> 01:15:48,500
something that I've also been 
inviting into my life. 

1226
01:15:48,500 --> 01:15:54,000
A lot more lately is doing 
breathwork and and feeling into 

1227
01:15:54,100 --> 01:15:57,600
what my body feels like when 
it's fully oxygenated, you know,

1228
01:15:57,600 --> 01:16:01,600
and how foreign of a feeling 
that can be remember the first 

1229
01:16:01,600 --> 01:16:04,700
time that I did breathwork. 
I was like, why do I feel like 

1230
01:16:04,700 --> 01:16:09,000
dizzy but also high and also 
like I have taken psychedelics, 

1231
01:16:09,000 --> 01:16:13,000
that's really weird. 
It's like what up? 

1232
01:16:13,000 --> 01:16:16,700
What an interesting physical 
Sensation that is to feel like 

1233
01:16:16,700 --> 01:16:20,900
my, all of, my, my cells in. 
My body are fully, oxygenated. 

1234
01:16:21,500 --> 01:16:23,500
So. 
Yeah, there's, there's 

1235
01:16:23,500 --> 01:16:26,000
something. 
There's something about seeking 

1236
01:16:26,600 --> 01:16:28,400
seeking pleasure and really 
savoring. 

1237
01:16:28,400 --> 01:16:31,200
It really allowing it to be what
it is. 

1238
01:16:31,200 --> 01:16:34,900
And also, like, can I, can I 
lengthen this pleasure out into 

1239
01:16:34,900 --> 01:16:37,800
every part of my body, you know?
Yeah. 

1240
01:16:37,800 --> 01:16:39,600
Hmm. 
Thank you. 

1241
01:16:42,000 --> 01:16:43,900
Thinking about that for a while.
Yeah. 

1242
01:16:43,900 --> 01:16:46,200
It's interesting. 
Right to think about that. 

1243
01:16:46,200 --> 01:16:49,100
I mean, even as I'm saying, and 
I'm like, like what other, what 

1244
01:16:49,100 --> 01:16:51,400
other ways can I explore that? 
You know? 

1245
01:16:53,400 --> 01:16:55,700
Yeah. 
I'm really feeling when you were

1246
01:16:55,700 --> 01:16:57,100
talking about the chocolate 
cake. 

1247
01:16:57,100 --> 01:17:03,800
I was thinking about how their 
ideas that I have about what's 

1248
01:17:03,800 --> 01:17:08,800
pleasurable to me, and that 
means that their ideas that I 

1249
01:17:08,800 --> 01:17:11,000
have about, what's not 
pleasurable to me, and that I'm 

1250
01:17:11,000 --> 01:17:12,000
dividing them. 
Em. 

1251
01:17:12,700 --> 01:17:17,700
And like I was curious about, 
yeah, kind of holding the 

1252
01:17:17,700 --> 01:17:21,400
chocolate cake metaphor within a
larger day that of core and kind

1253
01:17:21,400 --> 01:17:24,600
of feeling like, oh, could this,
you know, could this offering of

1254
01:17:24,600 --> 01:17:29,600
chocolate cake to my experience,
be an offering to the whole day?

1255
01:17:29,600 --> 01:17:32,300
Like, can I receive this 
pleasure in a way that's going 

1256
01:17:32,300 --> 01:17:35,900
to allow me to like, bring 
chocolate cake to my clients 

1257
01:17:35,900 --> 01:17:39,700
later in the afternoon and then 
share chocolate cake with with a

1258
01:17:39,700 --> 01:17:44,600
partner or like, Bring chocolate
cake into, you know, my writing 

1259
01:17:44,600 --> 01:17:46,600
or dream about chocolate cake 
later. 

1260
01:17:46,600 --> 01:17:50,300
Like, you know, how can this 
really like stimulate more 

1261
01:17:50,300 --> 01:17:56,900
chocolate cake in the world? 
Now, I'm going to think about 

1262
01:17:56,900 --> 01:17:58,500
that too. 
I mean, really, you know, with 

1263
01:17:58,500 --> 01:18:01,700
this book that's kind of what 
I'm asking for people to do with

1264
01:18:01,800 --> 01:18:05,700
everything that they do, like 
just really thinking about. 

1265
01:18:05,700 --> 01:18:09,300
Okay, if I can have this moment,
this five minutes, ten minutes 

1266
01:18:09,300 --> 01:18:13,700
of tuning into my body. 
D tuning in to the sensations of

1267
01:18:13,700 --> 01:18:19,900
my body thinking about myself as
a sensual being and not have 

1268
01:18:19,900 --> 01:18:23,700
that, be an isolated event, but 
like something that hopefully, 

1269
01:18:23,700 --> 01:18:27,400
they have linger throughout the 
rest of their day. 

1270
01:18:27,400 --> 01:18:31,600
Like, I would love to see 
people, not just think about and

1271
01:18:31,600 --> 01:18:36,800
write about who they are as 
sensual beings, but to have that

1272
01:18:36,800 --> 01:18:40,200
be an invitation that gets 
carried out into every act that 

1273
01:18:40,200 --> 01:18:42,400
they do. 
Like if I were to take Could sip

1274
01:18:42,400 --> 01:18:43,900
of water. 
How would I do that? 

1275
01:18:43,900 --> 01:18:46,700
Son? 
Truly, you know more what 

1276
01:18:46,700 --> 01:18:49,100
sensuality can I bring into my 
work? 

1277
01:18:49,400 --> 01:18:52,300
How can I bring since you ality 
into the way that I drive to 

1278
01:18:52,300 --> 01:18:53,400
work? 
You know? 

1279
01:18:53,400 --> 01:18:55,600
Yeah. 
I'm just, I'm really curious 

1280
01:18:55,600 --> 01:18:57,900
about that and I don't, I don't 
even have the answers to those 

1281
01:18:57,900 --> 01:19:00,100
questions. 
Like, I feel like sometimes I 

1282
01:19:00,100 --> 01:19:02,900
think in questions, but but it's
something that I want to 

1283
01:19:02,900 --> 01:19:04,600
explore, for sure. 
Yeah. 

1284
01:19:04,700 --> 01:19:06,600
Yeah. 
What I hear you saying? 

1285
01:19:06,600 --> 01:19:09,500
And then, when I think about a 
moment ago, when you spoke about

1286
01:19:09,500 --> 01:19:11,700
sensuality as a spiritual 
practice, you know. 

1287
01:19:11,900 --> 01:19:15,200
So, I guess, one of the ways 
that I would hear what you just 

1288
01:19:15,200 --> 01:19:19,000
said is as a practice of 
communion and relationality and 

1289
01:19:19,000 --> 01:19:24,100
reciprocity, which I think are 
are our natural ways of being 

1290
01:19:24,100 --> 01:19:29,900
actually as human beings, that 
we ideally live in communion and

1291
01:19:29,900 --> 01:19:34,200
relationality, and reciprocity. 
And that horrible travesties of 

1292
01:19:34,300 --> 01:19:36,600
the last definitely several 
hundred years. 

1293
01:19:36,600 --> 01:19:39,400
And certainly several thousand 
years that have been drawn 

1294
01:19:39,400 --> 01:19:41,300
human, kindness been to separate
us. 

1295
01:19:41,800 --> 01:19:45,100
And make us, non-relational and 
individualistic and 

1296
01:19:45,100 --> 01:19:49,800
hierarchical, and competitive, 
and the, you know, the premise 

1297
01:19:49,800 --> 01:19:54,400
of like, could my life be a 
sensual life is such a huge 

1298
01:19:54,400 --> 01:19:57,500
question because it's like, 
we're none of us are here alone.

1299
01:19:57,500 --> 01:20:02,000
Just creating our soul, you 
know, masturbatory Pleasures. 

1300
01:20:02,000 --> 01:20:04,500
Like that's actually impossible.
Even if we think that that's 

1301
01:20:04,500 --> 01:20:07,900
what we're able to do and to 
really, you know, to be in 

1302
01:20:07,900 --> 01:20:10,900
pleasure for real is like, you 
know, we have to be here, 

1303
01:20:10,900 --> 01:20:14,800
uplifting. 
GE and one another that says my 

1304
01:20:14,800 --> 01:20:17,700
pleasure isn't shit, you know, 
if I'm coming into contact with 

1305
01:20:17,700 --> 01:20:20,600
somebody else and they are not 
having a pleasure filled moment,

1306
01:20:20,600 --> 01:20:23,500
you know, like it's going to 
impact probably pretty 

1307
01:20:23,500 --> 01:20:25,200
substantially. 
That's right. 

1308
01:20:25,200 --> 01:20:27,700
That might have to be my next 
book to be honest. 

1309
01:20:27,700 --> 01:20:31,900
Like how can we Okay, so we've 
figured out and we've gotten to 

1310
01:20:31,900 --> 01:20:34,500
the root of who we are as 
sensual beings and what that 

1311
01:20:34,800 --> 01:20:37,700
what our pleasure looks like. 
Actualized. 

1312
01:20:38,100 --> 01:20:42,800
How can we, how can we bring 
that into the World, you know? 

1313
01:20:42,800 --> 01:20:45,200
And that's why I really 
appreciate adrien-marie Browns 

1314
01:20:45,200 --> 01:20:49,000
work of political activism 
because I feel like she talks so

1315
01:20:49,000 --> 01:20:52,600
much about that. 
And yeah, and it's really 

1316
01:20:52,600 --> 01:20:57,300
inspiring for me as well to 
think about pleasure for 

1317
01:20:57,300 --> 01:21:01,800
Pleasures sake. 
Yes, and also pleasure for The 

1318
01:21:01,808 --> 01:21:07,300
Liberation and connection of 
other people and yeah, I don't I

1319
01:21:07,308 --> 01:21:11,000
don't quite know what that looks
like yet, but I feel like if we 

1320
01:21:11,000 --> 01:21:15,300
start with our Selves first, if 
we begin nurturing and and 

1321
01:21:15,300 --> 01:21:21,100
feeling that we deserve and we 
are valuable enough to 

1322
01:21:21,100 --> 01:21:26,100
prioritize our pleasure. 
Maybe we will start to have 

1323
01:21:26,100 --> 01:21:32,100
ideas come through in terms of 
what that looks like from a 

1324
01:21:32,108 --> 01:21:35,300
salt, not from a solitary 
experience, but from a communal 

1325
01:21:35,300 --> 01:21:37,600
experience as well. 
Yeah. 

1326
01:21:37,700 --> 01:21:38,600
Yeah. 
Definitely. 

1327
01:21:39,200 --> 01:21:42,000
I yeah, really. 
Also just wanted to follow Up 

1328
01:21:42,000 --> 01:21:46,300
and give about a dream Marie 
Brown and also to audre Lorde 

1329
01:21:46,400 --> 01:21:48,700
that you know, and you two 
talked about that in your 

1330
01:21:48,700 --> 01:21:52,300
episode and her essay uses of 
the erotic. 

1331
01:21:52,300 --> 01:21:56,700
I feel like that the first time 
I was really kind of struck with

1332
01:21:57,000 --> 01:21:59,800
that question. 
I was like where where does 

1333
01:21:59,800 --> 01:22:03,500
eroticism actually rest? 
And like what is its potential 

1334
01:22:03,500 --> 01:22:06,600
was encountering that I say? 
Yeah. 

1335
01:22:07,000 --> 01:22:10,700
It's so powerful. 
So I'm wondering I've now it's 

1336
01:22:10,700 --> 01:22:13,000
like as you're thinking In 
forward, are you? 

1337
01:22:13,300 --> 01:22:15,200
What are you excited about? 
You know, what are you leaning 

1338
01:22:15,200 --> 01:22:16,700
into? 
How are you? 

1339
01:22:16,900 --> 01:22:18,300
Where are you on your journey 
right now? 

1340
01:22:18,300 --> 01:22:21,100
And like, what are you opening 
up to, As you move into this 

1341
01:22:21,100 --> 01:22:25,400
next phase. 
Well, a new book is on the 

1342
01:22:25,407 --> 01:22:29,300
horizon, which is exciting 
great. 

1343
01:22:29,600 --> 01:22:32,900
Like, right after actually, this
book wasn't even fully released 

1344
01:22:32,900 --> 01:22:35,400
yet. 
Like, I didn't announce it yet. 

1345
01:22:35,400 --> 01:22:40,700
And I had some literary agents 
that are like, it's time for you

1346
01:22:40,700 --> 01:22:42,900
to write your next book. 
We would like to help you with 

1347
01:22:42,900 --> 01:22:47,900
that. 
So I feel and I so resonate with

1348
01:22:47,900 --> 01:22:53,600
what you said about how, you 
know, you create something and 

1349
01:22:53,600 --> 01:22:56,200
then it's like, oh man, I should
have said this so I should have 

1350
01:22:56,200 --> 01:22:58,100
why tonight? 
I mean, I'm still editing the 

1351
01:22:58,100 --> 01:23:03,700
book in my brain even though so 
I'm actually really excited 

1352
01:23:03,700 --> 01:23:13,600
about really diving deeper and 
refining, but also there's 

1353
01:23:13,600 --> 01:23:18,600
something about I think kind of 
like lingering that I was 

1354
01:23:18,600 --> 01:23:21,600
mentioning like lingering into 
that pleasure and like 

1355
01:23:21,800 --> 01:23:25,800
stretching it out that I feel 
that I didn't really get to do 

1356
01:23:25,800 --> 01:23:28,600
with this book because of the 
format, you know, the format was

1357
01:23:29,000 --> 01:23:31,600
very much like a journal, you 
know, I didn't have a lot of 

1358
01:23:31,600 --> 01:23:39,700
space to to write about my ethos
and to give people more flowery 

1359
01:23:39,700 --> 01:23:44,700
and poetic diatribes about like 
how you should live your life 

1360
01:23:44,700 --> 01:23:46,800
for you. 
No, what what does sensuality 

1361
01:23:46,800 --> 01:23:50,900
look like as a practice? 
And so I'm really interested 

1362
01:23:51,300 --> 01:23:57,200
next into feeling more into that
like diving deeper into this new

1363
01:23:57,200 --> 01:24:04,700
book and continuing this thread 
that I'm following of 

1364
01:24:04,700 --> 01:24:10,700
decentralizing, sex, and 
sexuality and seeing how that is

1365
01:24:10,700 --> 01:24:15,200
going to transform my work. 
And not even just the work. 

1366
01:24:15,400 --> 01:24:19,200
That I do, but the relationships
that I'm in. 

1367
01:24:21,000 --> 01:24:25,200
I mean, I've already started to 
feel that the relationship that 

1368
01:24:25,200 --> 01:24:31,300
I have with my partner. 
Jonathan is being made that much

1369
01:24:31,300 --> 01:24:35,800
more juicier because of my new 
this new lens that I've picked 

1370
01:24:35,800 --> 01:24:37,100
up around. 
Like okay. 

1371
01:24:37,100 --> 01:24:40,500
What if sex wasn't the only way 
that we could experience 

1372
01:24:40,500 --> 01:24:45,100
pleasure with each other and 
also like what if our entire? 

1373
01:24:45,300 --> 01:24:47,800
A body was a pleasure Center, 
you know, like what does it look

1374
01:24:47,800 --> 01:24:49,900
like for us to be in space with 
each other? 

1375
01:24:50,200 --> 01:24:54,000
With that knowledge? 
I'm really excited about 

1376
01:24:54,000 --> 01:24:58,400
exploring those things. 
And I get, I mean, I was 

1377
01:24:58,400 --> 01:25:02,300
actually thinking today because 
as we're recording this is also 

1378
01:25:02,300 --> 01:25:04,400
I think National Coming Out day 
or International. 

1379
01:25:04,400 --> 01:25:05,200
Yeah. 
Okay. 

1380
01:25:05,300 --> 01:25:07,900
Yeah. 
I'm happy coming out there. 

1381
01:25:08,000 --> 01:25:11,500
Yeah, likewise. 
I was thinking today like oh my 

1382
01:25:11,500 --> 01:25:14,100
gosh, what other things could I 
possibly do? 

1383
01:25:15,300 --> 01:25:17,600
Because I always think like 
there's okay. 

1384
01:25:17,600 --> 01:25:22,300
I've done the thing, you know, I
came out as queer in some ways. 

1385
01:25:22,300 --> 01:25:25,600
I feel like I came out as black 
like, that needed to happen. 

1386
01:25:25,900 --> 01:25:31,400
I've come out as a sexuality, 
professional a sex educator as 

1387
01:25:31,400 --> 01:25:33,700
non-binary. 
I mean, I'm like what else could

1388
01:25:33,700 --> 01:25:37,200
I possibly come out as. 
So I'm also thinking that, you 

1389
01:25:37,200 --> 01:25:40,400
know, like what other what other
things am I going to shift and 

1390
01:25:40,400 --> 01:25:44,100
shake up, you know, what other 
new identities or or 

1391
01:25:45,400 --> 01:25:48,500
Embodiments. 
Am I going to bring into my life

1392
01:25:48,900 --> 01:25:51,400
in 2022? 
Because I feel like the work 

1393
01:25:51,400 --> 01:25:57,000
that I'm doing now is setting a 
really sturdy foundation for 

1394
01:25:57,200 --> 01:26:00,900
other rebirths and reclamation's
to happen. 

1395
01:26:00,900 --> 01:26:04,800
So I'm really excited about 
nature. 

1396
01:26:05,100 --> 01:26:06,700
Yeah. 
Wow. 

1397
01:26:07,300 --> 01:26:09,500
Oh thank you so much. 
For all of that. 

1398
01:26:09,500 --> 01:26:12,900
I'm excited about the future 
that you're in and to be, you 

1399
01:26:12,900 --> 01:26:17,000
know, next next to you and Orbit
with you in this future. 

1400
01:26:17,400 --> 01:26:22,400
And I feel like everything that 
you just said, I just was 

1401
01:26:22,400 --> 01:26:26,000
marveling at your chart, that 
your son is exactly Square to 

1402
01:26:26,000 --> 01:26:30,800
Uranus and Uranus inside to 
terius is a little bit of a 

1403
01:26:30,800 --> 01:26:34,000
generational placement, which 
I'm part of to I was born a 

1404
01:26:34,000 --> 01:26:35,800
couple of years earlier than 
you. 

1405
01:26:36,200 --> 01:26:40,200
And so we're in a were in a you 
know, kind of cohort of people 

1406
01:26:40,200 --> 01:26:44,200
that I think are pretty excited 
about self-realization and 

1407
01:26:44,200 --> 01:26:50,300
Awakening of Self and yeah, this
this idea of like coming out I 

1408
01:26:50,300 --> 01:26:55,800
was thinking oh, I hope everyone
is still coming out when they're

1409
01:26:56,500 --> 01:27:00,000
in their 80s and 90s ago, you 
know, I hope that this could 

1410
01:27:00,000 --> 01:27:03,100
just gets to continue to be your
Life Path of like coming out all

1411
01:27:03,100 --> 01:27:05,700
the time and being like Oh, and 
I'm this too. 

1412
01:27:07,200 --> 01:27:08,900
Yeah. 
I want that for every one. 

1413
01:27:08,900 --> 01:27:12,400
You know what I want for us all 
to be curious about the many 

1414
01:27:13,000 --> 01:27:16,000
Transformations that we're going
to go through and the Iterations

1415
01:27:16,000 --> 01:27:19,000
of our beings that we're going 
to go through and you know, I 

1416
01:27:19,008 --> 01:27:22,600
always say in my work like your 
sex education doesn't stop when 

1417
01:27:23,100 --> 01:27:26,100
you know, you're this age. 
Like I'm hoping that you will 

1418
01:27:26,100 --> 01:27:31,600
continually sexually involved or
evolve like as you grow older 

1419
01:27:31,600 --> 01:27:35,000
and that when you're 65, you're 
still going to be educating 

1420
01:27:35,000 --> 01:27:36,400
yourself. 
Yeah. 

1421
01:27:36,500 --> 01:27:39,500
And likewise, with all these 
other, these other pieces. 

1422
01:27:39,900 --> 01:27:44,300
I hope that I'm still coming out
at at 65, you know. 

1423
01:27:45,400 --> 01:27:48,400
And I hope that I'm still coming
out at 85. 

1424
01:27:48,400 --> 01:27:50,100
I have no idea what that would 
look like. 

1425
01:27:50,100 --> 01:27:54,000
And like, what else could I 
possibly know? 

1426
01:27:55,900 --> 01:27:57,600
You're here to surprise 
yourself? 

1427
01:27:57,600 --> 01:28:00,600
Yeah, I guess your life is 
about. 

1428
01:28:02,600 --> 01:28:04,600
Well, thank you so much. 
I'll be on. 

1429
01:28:04,700 --> 01:28:06,700
It has been a real pleasure to 
talk to you. 

1430
01:28:07,000 --> 01:28:08,500
Yeah, thank you so much for 
having me. 

1431
01:28:08,500 --> 01:28:10,800
This was so fun. 
And thank you so much for the 

1432
01:28:10,800 --> 01:28:14,900
work that you do. 
I felt so nourished and nurtured

1433
01:28:14,900 --> 01:28:16,700
by. 
The ways that you show up in the

1434
01:28:16,700 --> 01:28:24,200
world and this this just 
profound way of looking at 

1435
01:28:24,200 --> 01:28:30,400
astrology and as something that 
is not just like up in the sky, 

1436
01:28:30,700 --> 01:28:32,900
but it's something that we can 
bring down into our bodies. 

1437
01:28:32,900 --> 01:28:35,400
I've been, I've been really 
inspired by the work that you 

1438
01:28:35,400 --> 01:28:40,100
do, and it's helped me come into
myself and really beautiful 

1439
01:28:40,100 --> 01:28:41,800
ways. 
So thank you so much for being a

1440
01:28:41,800 --> 01:28:43,900
teacher to me. 
Thank you. 

1441
01:28:43,900 --> 01:28:45,700
Thank you for seeing. 
Peeved. 

1442
01:28:46,700 --> 01:28:50,400
Well, I'll be sharing your 
website and Instagram links in 

1443
01:28:50,407 --> 01:28:52,700
the show notes. 
People can find you at Evian 

1444
01:28:52,700 --> 01:28:56,400
Whitney.com and at Evian Whitney
on Instagram or Evian dot 

1445
01:28:56,400 --> 01:29:00,100
Whitney. 
You're also on Twitter. 

1446
01:29:00,300 --> 01:29:02,300
I'm seeing do tweet or you a 
tweeter. 

1447
01:29:03,600 --> 01:29:09,400
I try not to be. 
I feel like Twitter is a social 

1448
01:29:09,400 --> 01:29:13,200
media platform. 
That is really dangerous for me,

1449
01:29:13,500 --> 01:29:15,100
especially because of what we 
talked about earlier. 

1450
01:29:15,200 --> 01:29:20,500
Like I have this this Legacy of 
being a fully formed that but 

1451
01:29:21,800 --> 01:29:23,800
two thousand strangers that I 
don't know. 

1452
01:29:23,800 --> 01:29:27,400
So I temper, I temper, my my 
Twitter usage. 

1453
01:29:27,400 --> 01:29:30,200
I really just if I have a fully 
Farm thought that's where I'll 

1454
01:29:30,200 --> 01:29:31,800
go, but I don't use it that 
often. 

1455
01:29:32,000 --> 01:29:34,100
Okay? 
Okay, so people can find you on 

1456
01:29:34,100 --> 01:29:36,000
Instagram. 
Also, they can follow your 

1457
01:29:36,000 --> 01:29:39,700
podcasts and fold that self. 
Is there anywhere else you want 

1458
01:29:39,700 --> 01:29:42,200
to let folks know to find you or
to look for you? 

1459
01:29:43,300 --> 01:29:45,000
I mean they can definitely check
out my book. 

1460
01:29:45,200 --> 01:29:48,000
Since you will self. 
I think by the time that this 

1461
01:29:48,000 --> 01:29:50,900
airs, yeah, it'll be out into 
the world which will be really 

1462
01:29:50,900 --> 01:29:52,900
exciting. 
And yeah, you should be able to 

1463
01:29:52,900 --> 01:29:55,200
find it at any bookstore. 
Great. 

1464
01:29:55,300 --> 01:29:56,500
Great. 
All right. 

1465
01:29:56,500 --> 01:29:58,900
Well, I look forward to our next
conversation. 

1466
01:29:58,900 --> 01:30:02,300
And yeah, until then. 
Yes. 

1467
01:30:02,300 --> 01:30:06,000
I'm so excited. 
I'll stop recording. 

1468
01:30:06,000 --> 01:30:10,800
Now. 
For more information on Evian go

1469
01:30:10,800 --> 01:30:14,900
to Evian Whitney.com and follow 
them on Instagram at. 

1470
01:30:15,200 --> 01:30:19,100
On Whitney, you can also find 
these links in the show notes. 

1471
01:30:19,900 --> 01:30:21,700
I also want to give a plug to 
embodied. 

1472
01:30:21,700 --> 01:30:24,700
Astrology, is research resident 
in 2022. 

1473
01:30:24,700 --> 01:30:28,800
Katie Henderson, who in ways 
very different than Evian is 

1474
01:30:28,800 --> 01:30:31,500
also doing some amazing work 
around sex. 

1475
01:30:31,500 --> 01:30:35,600
Sensuality and eroticism, Katie 
just released several episodes 

1476
01:30:35,600 --> 01:30:39,600
of erotic storytelling on their 
podcast erotic embodiment, and 

1477
01:30:39,600 --> 01:30:42,300
you can also find that link in 
the show notes. 

1478
01:30:42,700 --> 01:30:45,000
If you've enjoyed this episode, 
please share it with your 

1479
01:30:45,200 --> 01:30:47,200
friends and networks. 
You can find more guests 

1480
01:30:47,200 --> 01:30:49,500
episodes that embodied 
astrology.com in. 

1481
01:30:49,500 --> 01:30:52,700
The listen section, get free 
monthly horoscopes and stay 

1482
01:30:52,700 --> 01:30:55,700
tuned in with the Earth's skies 
and planets by signing up for 

1483
01:30:55,700 --> 01:30:58,100
one of the embodied, astrology 
membership, Tears. 

1484
01:30:58,500 --> 01:31:02,600
By more information at embodied,
astrology.com /join.