1
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Right eye money miners, we're 
just ripping straight in men Rez

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00:00:03,440 --> 00:00:09,080
and Bald Hill, bit of news there
and we have some deal action in 

3
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the sort of sandstone sort of 
land or a sort of Laverton and 

4
00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:17,040
it's some bloody regular 
offenders here. 

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00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:19,320
Forget Gina, mate, there's a New
Deal blocker in town. 

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Maybe God? 
Oh, to compare these people to, 

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right. 
Take it, take it away. 

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We'll save that one. 
That's going to be a big 

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segment. 
JD Minrez, Bald Hill on us. 

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00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:36,120
Yeah, first and foremost the 
Ding, Ding, Ding from Ali, the 

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customary one there, she's a 
Minrez shareholder. 

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Minrez chucking Bald Hill on us.
Like you said, Maddie, it is 

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00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:46,840
actually, it's only the the 
second WA mine to go on full 

14
00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:49,440
care and maintenance, which is 
kind of a bit funny to think 

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about with. 
But you've had a lot of sort of 

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production, you know, slow downs
and these sorts of things, 

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00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:56,600
Pilbara, Lion Town and 
everything. 

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But yeah, they also actually 
slipped in late on Tuesday, a 

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response to an ASX query which 
I'll give a couple comments on 

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00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:08,000
to start with and then we'll get
into the Bald Hills sort of 

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00:01:08,000 --> 00:01:09,880
story. 
But Long story short, the Min 

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00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:13,680
Res Board admitted they should 
have said two years ago when 

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00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:16,880
they first found out about these
events that there were in fact 

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00:01:16,880 --> 00:01:20,000
related party transactions. 
So that's a sort of another 

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00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:23,040
strike against the the board. 
Obviously there's a very similar

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board to what it was two years 
ago. 

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00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:27,760
Not quite the case with 
everything that happened in the 

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the mid to late 2000s, but they 
the current board that is deemed

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it immaterial to shareholders. 
And I think like we sort of 

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touched on in the past that hey,
a managing director profiting at

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the expense of a shareholder, no
matter really what the quantum 

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is, whether it's 10 bucks or 
whether it's a few 1,000,000 

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bucks is material and people 
should know. 

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But unless you guys had sort of 
extra comments on that one, I 

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think we can jump into the bald 
hillside of things. 

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Well, it's not. 
It's not material financially, 

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but it's material on a corporate
governance standpoint. 100% is, 

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00:01:58,920 --> 00:02:00,320
yeah, yeah, I think. 
Leave it at that. 

39
00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:03,720
Yeah, absolutely. 
Needless to say, the AGM in one 

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week's time, 21st of November is
going to be a juicy one. 

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00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:09,360
I'm looking. 
Forward to that in a week. 

42
00:02:09,880 --> 00:02:11,760
Yeah, one week. 
Fuck, that's awesome. 

43
00:02:12,120 --> 00:02:14,000
Yeah, it's going to be, it's 
going to be large. 

44
00:02:14,400 --> 00:02:15,960
So let's talk a bit about bold 
here. 

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00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:17,960
Like we said, care and 
maintenance will run through a 

46
00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:20,960
couple of the details. 
Just looking back at the clock, 

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00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:24,480
it was almost a year ago to the 
day, roughly within a couple of 

48
00:02:24,480 --> 00:02:28,160
weeks of Minres officially 
scooping up Bald Hills. 

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00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:29,800
So they haven't had it for all 
that long. 

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00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:33,600
Unfortunately, the the shutdown 
is going to impact about 300 

51
00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:35,120
employees. 
That's sort of sad to say. 

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00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:38,600
Minerals did say they'll try and
redeploy a few people, but there

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00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:43,240
will undoubtedly be a few 
redundancies happening now, 

54
00:02:43,240 --> 00:02:45,960
given that the care and 
maintenance decision was almost 

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00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:48,360
with immediate effect. 
The spot plant will be running 

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00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:51,680
for a few more weeks, but by 
early December things will be 

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00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:55,400
kind of shut down. 
Shipments for FY25 will be 

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00:02:55,680 --> 00:02:59,440
therefore kept at about 60,000 
dry metric tonnes as opposed to 

59
00:02:59,440 --> 00:03:04,880
the 1:20 to 1:45 guidance on an 
SC6 basis that they had given 

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00:03:04,920 --> 00:03:07,240
not really that long ago. 
I think in in August is when 

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00:03:07,240 --> 00:03:10,120
that guidance had come out. 
Care and maintenance estimates 

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00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:12,680
sort of 15 to $20 million per 
annum. 

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That's kind of standard. 
But importantly on a free cash 

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flow basis, they're saying that 
this will save them money. 

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That's the the most important 
decision in min res and that's 

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the kind of lens that they've 
taken. 

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Although, you know, again, as 
we've kind of touched on in the 

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past, it, it is a bit surprising
that they've made the decision 

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right now. 
I mean, for one, why not just a 

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couple weeks ago with the 
quarterly with all that info? 

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Granted, they did have a bit 
going on, but I think most 

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people that follow the lithium 
space quite closely be saying 

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why they why didn't they do this
a while ago? 

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But you know, hindsight's kind 
of 2020 the, the main decision 

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has been made and it's, yeah, 
it's, it's the right thing to do

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and something they needed to do.
Just just looking at the the 

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cash balance. 
It's tough, very tough to 

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redeploy people when you're all 
the lithium, the lithium part of

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the business have gone from even
time to two on one. 

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00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:05,040
And so there's already been 
pressure there. 

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00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:06,240
So it's. 
Yeah, I mean even. 

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00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:10,520
Very hard to redeploy them, so 
redundancies would be a cost. 

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00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:13,000
Your point of redeploying is 
actually really interesting on 

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Maddie because I the most 
staggering part about the 

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00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:19,760
announcement, to me it was a 
statement that if the market 

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00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:22,920
turned, it would only take four 
to six weeks to restart, which 

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00:04:22,920 --> 00:04:26,240
is bonkers. 
Surely there's no way. 

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00:04:26,840 --> 00:04:29,080
Yeah, I think of think of the 
restart of what you know that 

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00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:31,760
was that was like like a six 
month process. 

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00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:40,400
Because you got the you got some
whether they keep coming, keep 

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00:04:40,400 --> 00:04:43,120
some of the gear at Mount Marion
lot near Bola. 

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00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:45,240
They keep the gear there like 
they've redeployed some of the 

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00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:48,360
gear to Mount Marion. 
Like you might be able to get it

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00:04:48,360 --> 00:04:50,880
up and going pretty quickly. 
I'm not sure. 

95
00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:56,360
Not a not a not a restart expert
in terms of how long it would 

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00:04:56,360 --> 00:04:56,840
take. 
So. 

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00:04:56,880 --> 00:04:59,120
Anyone can restart a plan in 
four to six weeks. 

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00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:01,560
I'll just. 
They probably could. 

99
00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:03,160
But did they actually? 
Why couldn't I? 

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00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:04,880
Did they actually say to 
nameplate capacity? 

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00:05:04,880 --> 00:05:06,160
I think that's an important 
detail. 

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00:05:06,720 --> 00:05:09,080
When is that ever happened in 
history? 

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00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:12,040
Someone restarting a plan in 
four to six weeks with it after 

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00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:14,280
after you've made a care 
maintenance decision, you've 

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00:05:14,280 --> 00:05:15,960
reduced your staff, like you 
said, 300 people. 

106
00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:18,680
You've got to rehire people. 
You've got to, you know, retrain

107
00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:20,720
people in a lot of instances. 
You can't just pick up where you

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left off and like it just there 
is the it's just AI believe a 

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00:05:27,080 --> 00:05:29,440
bonkers statement. 
Yeah, I mean, you can I. 

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00:05:29,840 --> 00:05:32,000
Think, I think when you've got 
people on other sites that you 

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can redeploy and when you 
probably possibly could be over 

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00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:38,880
manned at the time, you can 
redeploy processing personnel to

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00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:41,480
restart. 
I don't think it's not doable. 

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00:05:41,760 --> 00:05:44,480
I think it's I think it'd be too
hard to make an assumption from 

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00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:46,560
where we sit to say it's not 
doable. 

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00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:49,960
Yeah, Yeah, I lean towards what 
you're kind of saying on, on 

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00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:51,840
that one. 
I think the the big kind of 

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talking point here is why Bald 
Hill versus the the other 

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00:05:55,520 --> 00:05:58,720
operations and then we'll check 
up the FY25 guidance that they 

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00:05:58,720 --> 00:06:00,280
give. 
And you can pretty clearly see 

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00:06:00,520 --> 00:06:03,800
on an FOB basis that Mount 
Marion has slightly high cost. 

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00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:08,120
Now the, you know, FIB, it's not
the the Bay all and end all. 

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00:06:08,120 --> 00:06:10,720
There are a couple other costs. 
But I think the, the big point 

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00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:14,120
to address is that the other 
operations are joint ventures. 

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00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:17,120
You've obviously got Albemarle 
at Wodgina and at Matt Marion 

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00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:19,760
you've got Gangfang. 
Both of them are 5050 splits. 

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00:06:19,760 --> 00:06:23,920
So firstly on on Wodgina, it's 
no secret that Albemarle have 

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00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:26,400
been bleeding cash. 
They reported a $1 billion loss 

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00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:30,760
for the quarter just gone, not a
complete cash loss. 

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00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:33,520
There was a big write down in 
there, but they're in a pretty 

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00:06:33,640 --> 00:06:35,920
fragile position. 
Although I was actually 

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00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:38,960
surprised to see that the 
quarter over the last quarter, 

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00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:42,000
the stock has jumped 50%. 
But that sort of comes with the 

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00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:44,680
the volatility and it's 
undoubtedly been a downward 

135
00:06:44,680 --> 00:06:48,720
trend for some time now. 
But they're a bit complex to 

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00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:51,720
kind of read and it's, it's 
harder to make a judgement on 

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00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:54,000
what their kind of thinking is 
because they've got downstream, 

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00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:57,680
not that their partners at Matt 
Marion don't have downstream as 

139
00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:00,560
well, but you're piercing in a 
lot of pieces together. 

140
00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:03,400
You've obviously got Greenbush's
interest in Australia, you've 

141
00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:07,080
got downstream in China. 
It's it's kind of hard given 

142
00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:10,520
we're not as close with album 
out to see how many spongemen 

143
00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:12,640
tonnes do they actually need to 
meet the requirements that 

144
00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:16,640
they've got the offtake 
commitments to fulfil, You know,

145
00:07:16,640 --> 00:07:19,920
the the hydroxide plants and all
these kind of things. 

146
00:07:20,040 --> 00:07:23,560
Is a pretty opaque like. 
Would you be able to figure out 

147
00:07:23,600 --> 00:07:25,360
how much they need from 
Australian operations? 

148
00:07:25,360 --> 00:07:27,320
You definitely would be able to,
yeah, Yeah. 

149
00:07:27,480 --> 00:07:31,760
But I think in comparison to 
Gang Fang, what they're doing 

150
00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:34,800
and what their kind of strategy 
is, it's a little harder because

151
00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:37,120
I think Gang Fang strategy is is
a bit more simple. 

152
00:07:37,440 --> 00:07:40,520
They want to maintain market 
share in, in the downturn. 

153
00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:43,600
That has been the playbook a lot
of a lot of Chinese companies 

154
00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:47,880
and the go to case, you know, 
example for me is what C Mock 

155
00:07:47,880 --> 00:07:51,000
did with 10K finger rumour in 
2016 when everyone else was 

156
00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:53,560
selling assets, they came in. 
I think that's a good sort of 

157
00:07:53,560 --> 00:07:56,720
point to example of how Chinese 
companies have in the past 

158
00:07:56,840 --> 00:08:01,280
operated in mining downturns. 
They're keen to get market 

159
00:08:01,280 --> 00:08:03,880
share. 
And you know, Needless to say, 

160
00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:06,080
everyone wants to pick up market
share in a downturn. 

161
00:08:06,320 --> 00:08:08,800
But some of these players have 
actually gone and done it. 

162
00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:11,960
And I think that I think that's 
the the MO that they're trying 

163
00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:14,000
to stick to here. 
And that's why I think, you 

164
00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:16,400
know, if you're looking at the 
decision they made at Mount 

165
00:08:16,400 --> 00:08:18,920
Marion, I think Gang Fang would 
have just said no. 

166
00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:21,360
I'm not sure if you guys differ 
on on that one. 

167
00:08:21,480 --> 00:08:24,000
On Albemarle, like I listened to
their quarterly call, they were 

168
00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:27,280
asked specifically by an 
analyst, there's been rumours in

169
00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:30,440
the press that you've been 
weighing up selling green bushes

170
00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:32,760
and and Wagina. 
And how did Ken Masters reply? 

171
00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:34,840
He says we would never sell 
green bushes. 

172
00:08:35,159 --> 00:08:37,600
Yeah, full stop. 
Pretty pretty conclusive, isn't?

173
00:08:37,600 --> 00:08:39,960
It Wagen is for sale, I think at
the right price, yeah. 

174
00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:43,760
Yeah, do you think so? 
How is Bald Hill the smallest 

175
00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:46,640
output on the lithium units for 
minrays? 

176
00:08:46,960 --> 00:08:47,640
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

177
00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:51,240
So it's interesting to see they 
they put Bald Hill on care and 

178
00:08:51,240 --> 00:08:53,320
maintenance. 
Spot price went up overnight. 

179
00:08:53,320 --> 00:08:56,280
I'm not sure if it was all 
attributable to Bald Hill being 

180
00:08:56,320 --> 00:08:58,960
put on care and maintenance, but
that's what one note said. 

181
00:08:59,240 --> 00:09:01,640
So it's like you put that on 
care and maintenance, save a bit

182
00:09:01,640 --> 00:09:05,200
of cash, lift the spot price a 
bit, interesting to get a bit 

183
00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:07,520
more cash for watching her and 
Mount Marion operating. 

184
00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:09,840
Yeah, to to the point on the 
price is bouncing, I think maybe

185
00:09:09,840 --> 00:09:13,560
the futures might might even be 
a bit of a better read and that 

186
00:09:13,560 --> 00:09:16,480
they also jumped jumped quite a 
bit and you can sort of see what

187
00:09:16,480 --> 00:09:19,640
maybe financial participants 
might be thinking. 

188
00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:25,400
I mean the overall component of 
global lithium carbonate 

189
00:09:25,400 --> 00:09:28,640
equivalent supply that Bald Hill
makes up is about 1%. 

190
00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:31,920
So it's, you know, it's, it's 
not a massive operation on a on 

191
00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:35,280
a global kind of scale, but 
interesting to kind of think of 

192
00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:38,280
in, in that kind of light. 
Do you do you think that bounce 

193
00:09:38,280 --> 00:09:40,840
could have been like yes, the 
bald hill went on care and 

194
00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:44,440
maintenance better though maybe 
a future signal for intentions 

195
00:09:44,440 --> 00:09:48,760
for other operations? 
I, I probably learned to just 

196
00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:50,240
zooming out. 
One day is one day. 

197
00:09:50,240 --> 00:09:52,440
Let's just let's just kind of 
see what happens. 

198
00:09:52,560 --> 00:09:54,200
It just went up. 
It went up. 

199
00:09:54,360 --> 00:09:56,440
Just went up and that. 
'D be welcome news for for 

200
00:09:56,440 --> 00:09:59,160
plenty of them out there. 
It what it is just surprising 

201
00:09:59,160 --> 00:10:01,760
though, because like even in 
miniser's own numbers, you know,

202
00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:06,520
bald hill is a higher cost. 
Sorry, it is a is a higher 

203
00:10:06,520 --> 00:10:09,320
margin mind and Mount Marion and
they're kind of like you look at

204
00:10:09,320 --> 00:10:11,680
their relative guidance ranges 
and this is a this is a point 

205
00:10:11,680 --> 00:10:13,680
that was sort of like made by YJ
on on Twitter. 

206
00:10:13,680 --> 00:10:16,400
He's like, why, why is it? 
Why is it Bald Hill that's, you 

207
00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:20,760
know, being closed instead of 
instead of Mount Marion? 

208
00:10:20,840 --> 00:10:22,680
Like Mount Marion is the one 
that we thought would close 

209
00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:25,880
first If if it is more 
profitable, Yes, there's the 

210
00:10:25,880 --> 00:10:27,520
mining services business that 
might offset it because you 

211
00:10:27,520 --> 00:10:30,040
share it with gun thing. 
But you know, it's pretty hard 

212
00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:33,640
for for observers and analysts 
and everyone to really believe 

213
00:10:33,640 --> 00:10:37,640
that Bald Hill would be that 
Mount Marion be making more 

214
00:10:37,640 --> 00:10:40,960
money than Bald Hill. 
We all think Matt Marion is a 

215
00:10:40,960 --> 00:10:44,040
less profitable operation. 
And I think that, yeah, I think 

216
00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:46,360
the exact read through is that 
gang for thing don't want to 

217
00:10:46,360 --> 00:10:47,880
shut down Matt Marion. 
Yeah. 

218
00:10:48,920 --> 00:10:52,400
That that's kind of how, how 
else could you kind of explain 

219
00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:53,760
it's a, it's a tough one. 
Yeah. 

220
00:10:54,120 --> 00:10:57,120
You know, we looked at the same 
numbers there and, you know, 

221
00:10:57,120 --> 00:11:00,440
just on paper, I mean, you might
look at FY24 numbers and they're

222
00:11:00,440 --> 00:11:02,160
very different. 
Marion actually came in lower. 

223
00:11:02,160 --> 00:11:07,600
But the guidance for FY25 
clearly indicated that you know,

224
00:11:07,800 --> 00:11:10,480
Bald Hill wouldn't be the one 
you logically pick to to flick 

225
00:11:10,480 --> 00:11:11,640
off first. 
But. 

226
00:11:11,880 --> 00:11:16,280
Was that was that considering 
that min raise as a combined 

227
00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:21,240
entity might possibly lose a bit
more on the lithium compared to 

228
00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:24,240
Bald Hill, but make up more from
the mining services that they 

229
00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:25,200
charge? 
That's a point. 

230
00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:28,320
That's a point, yeah. 
Yeah, I mean you, you make this 

231
00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:30,920
decision on the whole business. 
No, no good. 

232
00:11:31,320 --> 00:11:34,720
You know if the if the net is 
negative, you make it on a net 

233
00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:38,640
basis on how minerals as an 
entity is going to operate and 

234
00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:40,200
what their cash flow is going to
be like. 

235
00:11:40,880 --> 00:11:43,200
That's why we should talk about 
briefly that the mining service 

236
00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:46,400
is part of the business. 
So this is sort of shave off 20 

237
00:11:46,400 --> 00:11:49,800
million tonnes per annum. 
They sort of quite a roughly 2 

238
00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:54,080
bucks EBITDA per tonne. 
So thinking 40 ish $1,000,000 

239
00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:58,520
per annum of EBITDA for the 
mining services business given 

240
00:11:58,600 --> 00:12:01,720
how they kind of separate out 
those the margins that they make

241
00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:05,320
when they report which is which 
is a bit of a hit, but did. 

242
00:12:05,400 --> 00:12:08,320
You did you figure out with that
20 million tonne JD, if it's, 

243
00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:12,880
it's, is that like haulage plus 
crushing of the same tonnes and 

244
00:12:12,880 --> 00:12:14,360
all those tonnes get added up 
together? 

245
00:12:14,360 --> 00:12:15,520
How does that? 
Work. 

246
00:12:15,520 --> 00:12:17,600
Yeah. 
Pit hit to port is kind of how 

247
00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:20,240
they talk about it. 
That's it's everything 

248
00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:23,960
logistics. 
So any piece of tongue that's 

249
00:12:23,960 --> 00:12:25,920
whether even though they're 
crushing the same tongue that 

250
00:12:25,920 --> 00:12:27,920
they've hauled, they get added 
up. 

251
00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:31,040
Yeah, I'm not going to be able 
to say that I can give you the 

252
00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:34,080
full definition, but that is 
broadly how they describe it. 

253
00:12:34,080 --> 00:12:35,400
OK. 
Yeah, yeah. 

254
00:12:35,400 --> 00:12:36,960
I can't get into the 
intricacies. 

255
00:12:36,960 --> 00:12:40,320
I'm not as up to speed, but that
that is how Inres reported. 

256
00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:43,560
So with them saying shutting 
down is net cash flow positive 

257
00:12:43,560 --> 00:12:48,000
means the losses at Bald Hill 
from the lithium part of the 

258
00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:51,880
business must have outweighed 
that 40 million bucks EBITDA 

259
00:12:51,880 --> 00:12:54,280
earnings on the mining services 
side of the business? 

260
00:12:54,560 --> 00:12:56,320
But how does that, how does that
work? 

261
00:12:56,320 --> 00:13:01,760
If you got like let's say Bald 
Hill, you got Min min res have 

262
00:13:01,760 --> 00:13:06,800
to effectively pay CSI for all 
the contracting they do on site.

263
00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:11,520
So Peter's pine Paul. 
Yep, within the same family, but

264
00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:16,960
at Mount Marion you haven't got 
there's that 50% component where

265
00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:21,640
Gang Feng is playing CSI. 
So I know they're getting half 

266
00:13:21,640 --> 00:13:27,360
the only half the revenue from 
it, but there's one less 

267
00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:31,360
component that Min Rez is having
to pay for because you got game 

268
00:13:31,360 --> 00:13:33,280
fan paying that bit whether, 
whereas they're paying 

269
00:13:33,280 --> 00:13:38,280
themselves at Bald Hill. 
Wonder if that's you. 

270
00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:41,480
See what I'm saying? 
Yeah, Yeah, the the JV structure

271
00:13:41,880 --> 00:13:44,760
allows them to maybe operate at 
a, at a below break even price 

272
00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:47,480
they otherwise would because 
your JV partner is is 

273
00:13:47,480 --> 00:13:49,640
subsidising the net. 
You know the the negative 

274
00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:50,760
economics in some ways. 
Oh. 

275
00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:54,560
I suppose this sorry, they're 
they're only getting the margin 

276
00:13:54,560 --> 00:13:56,640
from game thing because they're 
still having to pay the people 

277
00:13:56,640 --> 00:13:59,280
and the equipment to operate the
mining services. 

278
00:13:59,280 --> 00:14:01,280
Yeah, but there is that margin, 
yeah. 

279
00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:04,040
What that is? 
You can only do that to some 

280
00:14:04,040 --> 00:14:05,880
extent too. 
And until you're the negative 

281
00:14:05,880 --> 00:14:09,160
economics of the the mine 
itself, yeah, completely offset 

282
00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:09,800
it too. 
Yeah, and. 

283
00:14:09,800 --> 00:14:11,960
That and that sort of brings me 
to my next point. 

284
00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:15,440
It's, it's interesting looking 
at their FY25 guidance 

285
00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:18,720
presentation on the, I think 
it's the FY24 annual report 

286
00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:21,560
presentation. 
They've, they clearly say that 

287
00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:25,160
their mining services business 
is unlinked to commodity prices.

288
00:14:26,040 --> 00:14:29,120
That's just not, not true. 
If you have to shut down a mine 

289
00:14:29,600 --> 00:14:33,880
because of the commodity prices,
you know, you're stretching the,

290
00:14:33,920 --> 00:14:36,800
the definition there a bit. 
Maybe it maybe it's true if 

291
00:14:36,800 --> 00:14:42,440
you've got the contracts at some
Rio Tinto type iron ore projects

292
00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:45,640
and they're not going to shut 
down in in an iron ore bear 

293
00:14:45,640 --> 00:14:48,760
market. 
But when you know you've got the

294
00:14:48,760 --> 00:14:52,280
contracts at high cost 
operations, can you really say 

295
00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:54,520
that they're completely unlinked
to the commodity price? 

296
00:14:54,520 --> 00:14:57,600
I think it's saying the revenue 
is unlinked because it's just 

297
00:14:57,600 --> 00:14:59,200
per tonne. 
Yeah, it doesn't matter what 

298
00:14:59,200 --> 00:15:01,120
that Tonne's being sold at. 
It's. 

299
00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:04,840
No, they they describe it as it.
I mean the the quote is. 

300
00:15:04,840 --> 00:15:07,920
Politically, they describe 
earnings of mining services 

301
00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:10,040
business, Yeah. 
The, the, the quote here is 

302
00:15:10,040 --> 00:15:12,440
predictable earnings unlinked to
commodity prices. 

303
00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:15,280
Predictable earnings, yeah. 
And the way they, they are 

304
00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:16,800
steady while everything 
operates. 

305
00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:18,760
But there is still, there is 
still the risk. 

306
00:15:18,760 --> 00:15:21,720
So yeah, you can see see sort of
both sides with it. 

307
00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:25,520
Just to round out on the the 
kind of incentive price that we 

308
00:15:25,520 --> 00:15:29,000
touched on along with the the 
four to six week restart and all

309
00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:31,240
that. 
You can kind of back out from 

310
00:15:31,280 --> 00:15:33,920
the break even price mining 
service business and all that 

311
00:15:34,160 --> 00:15:38,960
that you're kind of looking at 
US 12 to 1300 ish is the 

312
00:15:38,960 --> 00:15:42,200
incentive price they would need 
to get back in, back in business

313
00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:45,960
here and flick it back on. 
So given where we are, sort of. 

314
00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:49,320
Casual 50% increase. 
Yeah, yeah. 

315
00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:54,400
Which wow, it doesn't make it, 
you know, it frankly makes it 

316
00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:56,920
look like a pretty disastrous 
transaction to buy this thing 

317
00:15:56,920 --> 00:15:58,600
one year ago. 
You're going to be completely 

318
00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:01,240
blunt about it. 
They spent a fair bit of money, 

319
00:16:01,520 --> 00:16:04,120
spent a fair bit of money on 
CapEx to get it up to shape 

320
00:16:04,120 --> 00:16:07,760
again. 
And you know, you do the MPV 

321
00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:10,480
from from when you got it and 
it's going to be while I mean 

322
00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:13,120
the sort of consensus on the 
street seems to be FY20 8. 

323
00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:15,440
That's when it kind of, you 
know, you plug in your supply 

324
00:16:15,440 --> 00:16:18,200
and demand across the lithium 
market and that's when this can 

325
00:16:18,280 --> 00:16:20,000
piece in. 
Who knows what actually happens 

326
00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:22,120
in reality. 
But every day longer you're not 

327
00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:25,720
earning positive cash flow, that
MPV equation looks more and more

328
00:16:25,920 --> 00:16:27,680
out of whack. 
And, you know, worse. 

329
00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:30,040
Do you think, do you think with 
everything going on with Min Res

330
00:16:30,040 --> 00:16:32,920
that that Bald Hill transaction 
number will one day come out? 

331
00:16:33,560 --> 00:16:36,840
I think some people are are are 
comfortable that they know the 

332
00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:39,320
number based on what's been 
disclosed in the annual, annual 

333
00:16:39,320 --> 00:16:42,080
reports. 
I seem to personally think 

334
00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:45,160
there's a bit extra that's sort 
of being massaged around and the

335
00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:46,440
real numbers a little bit higher
than that. 

336
00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:47,200
What? 
What are they? 

337
00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:49,960
What is the consensus on the 
real number at the moment? 

338
00:16:50,160 --> 00:16:53,960
Think consensus on the real 
number is like 600 ish Aussie 

339
00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:57,080
all in yeah. 
But yeah, I, I probably would, 

340
00:16:57,240 --> 00:17:01,120
would think, you know, there's, 
there's an, an Ato kind of 

341
00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:04,960
payment that is being marked 
sort of below the 200 issue. 

342
00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:07,520
It's required, it's being marked
at 75 on the balance sheet. 

343
00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:12,319
Yeah, the the truth is somewhere
in the vicinity of that. 

344
00:17:12,560 --> 00:17:15,839
Yeah, safe to say it's not the 
200 and a bit that they quoted a

345
00:17:15,839 --> 00:17:17,680
year ago, OK. 
Yeah. 

346
00:17:17,920 --> 00:17:22,280
So except that they're to pay to
write the offtake as well that 

347
00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:25,400
came with the asset, yeah. 
Yes, I think to, to kind of 

348
00:17:25,400 --> 00:17:29,880
round out more broadly on the 
lithium market, some very 

349
00:17:29,880 --> 00:17:32,560
interesting gossip that we've 
kind of heard in in the past 

350
00:17:32,560 --> 00:17:36,920
few, few weeks, various people 
going to China, seeing what's 

351
00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:40,080
going on, you know, analysing 
the market in a different light.

352
00:17:40,080 --> 00:17:42,720
And yeah, I think I'd be 
interested in doing a segment on

353
00:17:42,720 --> 00:17:46,760
what's happening with lithium 
miners in China, you know, the 

354
00:17:47,400 --> 00:17:49,920
vertical integration that we've 
been hearing about and these 

355
00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:52,400
these sorts of things. 
It's a, it's a fascinating 

356
00:17:52,400 --> 00:17:54,400
market. 
It's, it's a young market, you 

357
00:17:54,400 --> 00:17:57,000
know, dynamic and moving bloody,
bloody quickly. 

358
00:17:57,320 --> 00:18:00,640
So that is, yeah, that's 
something I think we should do 

359
00:18:00,640 --> 00:18:03,000
when the time is right. 
What about a bloody YJ map 

360
00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:05,560
Fernley combo? 
That'd be a bloody. 

361
00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:09,000
That would be good. 
Two lithium gurus in the one 

362
00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:13,520
room via computer screens. 
That could be That's God. 

363
00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:16,600
If you want it, let us know. 
We'll make it happen. 

364
00:18:17,360 --> 00:18:19,000
Well said Maddie. 
Why wouldn't you do that? 

365
00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:25,480
I was speaking to a trader last 
night on, on the, in the lithium

366
00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:29,520
market and yeah, he had, I came 
in from a pretty bearish 

367
00:18:29,520 --> 00:18:34,480
perspective and yeah, he, he was
a bit more sombre or any sort of

368
00:18:34,480 --> 00:18:37,840
thought like, you know, there's 
still, there's plenty of demand 

369
00:18:37,840 --> 00:18:39,640
for spod at the moment right 
now. 

370
00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:42,120
He actually, he told me 
something that like some of the 

371
00:18:42,120 --> 00:18:47,640
converters, they actually it's 
like 75% carbonate and then and 

372
00:18:47,640 --> 00:18:51,880
then 25% SPOD might actually 
give them the optimum results 

373
00:18:51,880 --> 00:18:53,720
when they're actually 
converting. 

374
00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:58,160
So there's yeah, it might, it 
might not be terminal broadly 

375
00:18:58,160 --> 00:19:00,000
for spot. 
But I think like the thing that 

376
00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:03,840
you know, ASX investors are 
reckoning with is that WA spot 

377
00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:06,880
in general is the marginal 
supply at the moment. 

378
00:19:07,320 --> 00:19:09,640
So you're saying, so you're 
saying that's not saying that if

379
00:19:10,040 --> 00:19:15,400
bronze go freaking huge like and
DLA is a thing, that spod will 

380
00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:18,480
become completely redundant. 
There will always be a place for

381
00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:20,800
it in the downstream 
optimization. 

382
00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:24,240
It's an evolving, it's an 
evolving market, right like 

383
00:19:24,280 --> 00:19:24,680
that. 
Yeah. 

384
00:19:24,680 --> 00:19:29,520
The, the I came to learn more 
about just the cost you have to,

385
00:19:29,520 --> 00:19:32,600
you got to evaluate on an all in
lithium unit cost, right. 

386
00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:36,440
And just the, the efficiencies 
that are happening kind of over 

387
00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:39,400
and over and over again from the
vertical integration in China or

388
00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:43,480
in, in, in other parts of the 
world too where the Chinese can 

389
00:19:43,520 --> 00:19:46,720
secure sufficient supply. 
It's, yeah, pretty interesting. 

390
00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:50,880
Super, super interesting. 
Well, yeah, as we said, thoughts

391
00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:54,920
going out to everyone at Bald 
Hill, but care and maintenance 

392
00:19:54,920 --> 00:19:57,760
is obviously a horrible thing, 
horrible thing for Kalgoorlie. 

393
00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:01,160
It's like it's just it's more 
pressure on Kadrul usually, 

394
00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:04,600
usually to keep defining more 
deposits in the region to keep 

395
00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:06,800
the industry going. 
Just keep delivering for those 

396
00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:10,320
exploration companies out there.
Like the pressure on Kadrul to 

397
00:20:10,320 --> 00:20:14,200
keep Kalgoorlie, Boulder, 
Coolgardi, that whole Gold 

398
00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:19,080
Fields district afloat is, yeah,
it's pretty much like Batman and

399
00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:20,720
Gotham. 
You're talking about a team that

400
00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:22,040
thrives under pressure. 
That many? 

401
00:20:22,120 --> 00:20:26,040
Yeah. 
I think I always say for the 

402
00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:28,840
goldfields, knowing that K Drill
is going to be punching Arsene 

403
00:20:28,840 --> 00:20:32,200
diamond holes in and bloody, 
that's hey, that's the 

404
00:20:32,200 --> 00:20:35,440
responsibility that Drew Harvey 
and Ron O'Sullivan have taken on

405
00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:39,800
because I know they're duty to 
Australia, keep the economy 

406
00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:41,320
afloat. 
You know what he's called the 

407
00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:43,320
Goldfields after all. 
And and the Goldies, mate, 

408
00:20:43,320 --> 00:20:45,400
they're having a sniff again. 
They're drilling everywhere, 

409
00:20:45,400 --> 00:20:48,920
they're finding deposits. 
And the first people they want 

410
00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:52,360
to speak to about doing just 
that is K Drill, because K is in

411
00:20:52,360 --> 00:20:54,680
the bloody name. 
That's it. 

412
00:20:54,680 --> 00:20:57,000
What other? 
What other drilling companies 

413
00:20:57,000 --> 00:20:58,280
start with K? 
None. 

414
00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:00,200
Just call K. 
Drill call K drill the 1st and 

415
00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:03,840
the last call. 
All right, the regal of 

416
00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:10,640
drilling. 
Oh mate, this side drama, drama,

417
00:21:10,880 --> 00:21:14,880
drama is brewing for something 
we thought was just going to get

418
00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:17,880
over the line. 
The bright star Alto scheme of 

419
00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:20,920
arrangement. 
The last piece of the three way 

420
00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:24,840
deal for the sandstone. 
But holy snap and duck shit some

421
00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:28,480
friends of the show have got 
involved. 

422
00:21:29,120 --> 00:21:32,320
An 11th hour. 
Yeah, like wedge is what is what

423
00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:35,880
I describe it as JD, the 
Deutsche Ballot and Delphi. 

424
00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:40,040
They've done The Dirty on 
another WA gold dealer it 

425
00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:43,440
appears, and I'm going to use 
the word Delphi to describe 

426
00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:46,840
Deutsche Ballot and slash Delphi
slash Petronas. 

427
00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:50,000
It's all the same shit because 
they've what they've done here 

428
00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:52,920
is is in conjunction with the 
listed company Patronus that 

429
00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:56,280
used to be Kin mining until it 
tied up with another Delphi 

430
00:21:56,280 --> 00:21:59,040
company which was PNX Metals. 
For all intents and purposes, 

431
00:21:59,360 --> 00:22:03,680
Patronus is controlled by Delphi
who owns 42% of that company. 

432
00:22:04,120 --> 00:22:08,080
And Delphi are the the German 
sort of asset manager that have 

433
00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:10,200
stakes in a whole bunch of stuff
on the ASX and. 

434
00:22:10,920 --> 00:22:13,800
I think I'll need to put on 
another fucking Nicobite patch 

435
00:22:13,800 --> 00:22:15,760
for this. 
I'm on the patches getting into 

436
00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:18,600
the vibe. 
Or sure, this is going to get 

437
00:22:18,640 --> 00:22:20,680
you get. 
That getting ready. 

438
00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:22,320
Give me the shits, friends of 
the show. 

439
00:22:22,400 --> 00:22:27,440
Anyway, right now we're yeah, 
there's, it's just not a simple 

440
00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:30,920
one of all the bloody variations
and permutations this could 

441
00:22:30,920 --> 00:22:32,560
take. 
But we're we've been on the 

442
00:22:32,560 --> 00:22:37,200
blower to experts in the field 
and yeah, oh jeez. 

443
00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:40,480
I haven't even described what 
they've done yet, Maddie, but So

444
00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:43,280
what? 
What Delphi and Petronas have 

445
00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:48,960
now, they collectively hold 
18.4% of Alto Metals and Alto 

446
00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:51,880
Metals of course is is days away
from a scheme vote to be 

447
00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:56,000
acquired by Bright Star. 
To be explicit, the meeting for 

448
00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:59,840
that vote is on Tuesday next 
week, 1:30 PM. 

449
00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:03,240
But shareholders of Alto, they 
basically need to have their, 

450
00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:07,520
their proxy forms submitted by 
1:30 PM this Sunday, which is 

451
00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:10,480
in, you know, like a couple, 
three days time or whatever, 

452
00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:14,800
unless you intend on actually 
rocking up in person and voting 

453
00:23:14,800 --> 00:23:17,200
in person, which not many 
shareholders bothered to do. 

454
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:22,320
So there's three days for Alto 
shareholders here to, to, to 

455
00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:24,200
kind of, you know, get their 
votes in. 

456
00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:27,920
And in a scheme, remember, you 
need 75% of the vote to be in 

457
00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:30,280
favour of the deal in order for 
it to, to pass. 

458
00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:34,200
You might be thinking, OK, well 
Patronus or Delphi, they've got,

459
00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:39,120
they've got 18.4% as we as we 
learned today, but 75% threshold

460
00:23:39,120 --> 00:23:40,920
is needed is a path forward, 
isn't there? 

461
00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:44,600
And it's true there is a path 
forward, but you need at at 

462
00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:48,440
least 75% of the shareholding 
that actually votes. 

463
00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:52,120
So it's of the shareholding that
votes and there's you know, you,

464
00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:55,440
you, you never get 100% vote 
turn out, in fact you never 

465
00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:56,800
even. 
Like it to get 80 or 90? 

466
00:23:56,800 --> 00:24:01,080
Never, never, never get 80 like 
so so in this in this instance 

467
00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:04,800
you get you need massive voter 
turn out in order to offset that

468
00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:08,040
huge blocking stake that you 
know looks is looking like it's 

469
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:10,440
going to vote no. 
Just based on what we're kind of

470
00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:14,840
seeing pop up here on my math, 
if you, if you assume Delphi 

471
00:24:14,840 --> 00:24:18,080
will vote no, and if you assume 
they are the only Alto 

472
00:24:18,080 --> 00:24:21,920
shareholder that votes no, then 
you need a voter turn out of at 

473
00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:27,240
least 73% of the, you know, Alto
shares to, to vote on the, on 

474
00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:29,040
the scheme. 
That's so high. 

475
00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:31,720
But you know, 73 percent is high
enough. 

476
00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:33,760
I actually think you'll see 
Delphi. 

477
00:24:33,880 --> 00:24:36,120
It just makes sense for them to 
buy on market all the way up to 

478
00:24:36,120 --> 00:24:39,360
19.9% threshold. 
If they do that, you need, you 

479
00:24:39,360 --> 00:24:43,800
need voter turn out of 80 
percent, 80% of the money miners

480
00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:46,000
who are like listening, when 
have you ever fucking voted on 

481
00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:47,000
anything? 
You haven't. 

482
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:49,560
I bet you, I bet you've bet. 
I bet you've never voted on 

483
00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:51,880
anything. 
But people don't vote. 

484
00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:54,640
But you should vote on things 
because it's just what a 

485
00:24:54,800 --> 00:24:56,080
shareholder should do. 
You've got the right to vote. 

486
00:24:56,080 --> 00:24:59,320
So they're going to need crazy, 
crazy vote voter turn out here 

487
00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:00,640
in order to get the deal over 
the line. 

488
00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:02,200
Yeah. 
So Trev, you've spent a bit of 

489
00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:04,440
time and Maddie thinking about 
this one. 

490
00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:09,400
What is the rationale behind the
delfy sort of groups decision 

491
00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:12,440
here Petronas? 
Who's loading away? 

492
00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:15,400
I reckon normally, you know, 
we've both been thinking about 

493
00:25:15,400 --> 00:25:17,960
this a lot and normally when a 
company wedges itself a stake, 

494
00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:22,320
you know, the company wants, it 
often wants to bid for that. 

495
00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:23,880
It's the company itself. 
It's, you know, it wedges 

496
00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:25,400
itself. 
It when, when, when Gina wedged 

497
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:28,040
herself into Azure, it's 
actually one of the asset. 

498
00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:30,440
You know, it's not that 
straightforward in this case. 

499
00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:33,600
I'm not convinced it's that, you
know, sometimes people want an 

500
00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:35,120
uplift as well. 
So they were just taking up. 

501
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:38,520
I'm not convinced it's that. 
I forgot did we say who they 

502
00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:41,560
said that and and they actually 
purchased the IT was a off 

503
00:25:41,560 --> 00:25:47,760
market trade between Horizon who
are the other company in the 

504
00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:51,640
sandstone which would you know 
probably might be part of that 

505
00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:53,720
sandstone consolidation at some 
point. 

506
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:57,640
And that was the state that 
actually West Gold sold that 

507
00:25:57,640 --> 00:25:59,920
they had in Alto back in the 
day. 

508
00:25:59,960 --> 00:26:03,240
Yeah, so and West Gold bought it
from Adam and I believe like 

509
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:07,560
yeah, that stake has done it's. 
Done its rounds so it's plenty 

510
00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:10,120
rare and it's ugly head again. 
Yeah, it's kind of funny. 

511
00:26:10,120 --> 00:26:13,680
And you guys have? 
It was added into because 

512
00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:16,760
obviously Delphi already had a 
stake in Alta and then they've 

513
00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:21,760
got that then 60 million shares.
Petronas has picked up an 8.4% 

514
00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:22,600
line. 
Yeah. 

515
00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:24,760
And so you add the two together 
and you're basically looking at 

516
00:26:24,760 --> 00:26:27,680
18.4% right now. 
They paid 8 and a half cents for

517
00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:30,680
it. 
And, you know, like we've seen 

518
00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:32,880
form from this group before. 
These, you know, friends of the 

519
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:37,120
show have have have, you know, 
wedged themselves into deals in 

520
00:26:37,120 --> 00:26:39,200
the past. 
Plenty of people would remember 

521
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,440
the previous incarnation of 
Patronus, which was Kin Mining. 

522
00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:46,720
They wedged itself for stake of 
Dacian after Genesis launched a 

523
00:26:46,720 --> 00:26:49,480
takeover offer on that company 
in 2022. 

524
00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:51,520
Because it was a takeover offer 
then. 

525
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:52,880
There wasn't. 
It's not like you have a 

526
00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:56,640
shareholder vote in a takeover. 
But Kin and Delphi's stake 

527
00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:00,320
collectively meant it was 
impossible for Genesis to reach 

528
00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:03,000
the 90% threshold required for 
the compulsory acquisition. 

529
00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:07,080
As a result of that, you know, 
like the there was a, you know, 

530
00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:10,640
Daisy and remained at a listed 
entity majority owned by, by 

531
00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:12,200
Genesis for a really large 
period of time. 

532
00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:16,440
And at the time I thought Kin's 
intentions by getting that wedge

533
00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:19,000
were actually just to get 
gobbled up themselves by 

534
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:20,840
Genesis. 
That's just how I interpreted 

535
00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:23,640
the events at the time. 
And the fastest way for Genesis 

536
00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:27,000
to to handle that issue of the 
wedge would have been for the 

537
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:32,520
Genesis to to acquire kin and 
then, you know, follow on, you 

538
00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:36,640
know, bid for bid for Dacian 
like after after that once 

539
00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:37,960
you've got kin. 
But they never did that. 

540
00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:40,560
And I can understand why they 
they didn't do that because I 

541
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:43,240
don't think I would have wanted 
to set a precedent that yeah, 

542
00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:47,400
you try to consolidate big M and
a plan and all of a sudden if 

543
00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:49,640
you did that, then anytime 
someone wedges, you know your 

544
00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:51,480
bloody. 
I think almost had a principle. 

545
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:53,640
No bloody way. 
Yeah, exactly. 

546
00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:56,600
And then it sets a precedent. 
You got to pay up, pay more than

547
00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:57,960
you want to for a bunch of 
stuff. 

548
00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:01,040
It'd be ugly. 
So they played the long game and

549
00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:03,640
instead of Kim kind of getting 
gobbled up, they accepted an 

550
00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:06,720
uplift like about a year and a 
half later for the Daisy and 

551
00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:09,800
shares and then and then, you 
know, Genesis made its way to 

552
00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:12,000
get 100%. 
Of that, yeah, they paid a real,

553
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:13,680
real big. 
I forget what it was, but it was

554
00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:15,680
a significant premium for that 
last. 

555
00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:19,080
Little bit yeah, Chunk, they got
the uplift they did and and then

556
00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:21,880
a few months after that, you 
know, Genesis did another deal 

557
00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:24,440
with Kin where they picked up 
some of their assets in the 

558
00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:26,840
region in exchange for some cash
and shares and. 

559
00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:29,320
Again, notably, they didn't pick
up the whole thing because they 

560
00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:31,080
didn't want a bunch of it. 
They just picked up what they 

561
00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:31,720
wanted. 
Yeah. 

562
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:33,200
And yeah. 
And you see the one they picked 

563
00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:35,520
up, like Bruno Lewis was the 
main one. 

564
00:28:35,600 --> 00:28:38,480
It was and you look at the, you 
look at the mineral resource 

565
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:40,480
estimates. 
I'll bring up here like Bruno 

566
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:43,080
Lewis, it had the most answers, 
but it's the one gramme one and 

567
00:28:43,080 --> 00:28:46,080
the other ones like the 
resources are higher grade, but 

568
00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:49,280
they've obviously just wanted 
that and not wanted the rest of 

569
00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:53,000
it for a reason. 
So I am, I would be trusting the

570
00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:58,880
DD of the Genesis team far ahead
of yeah, yeah, the kin, the kin 

571
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:01,520
side of what the value of the 
other assets. 

572
00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:04,120
Are for as long as we're doing 
capital markets people at like 

573
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:07,920
we've we've heard the narrative 
forever that Cardinia doesn't 

574
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:09,360
string together. 
That's just what I've heard. 

575
00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:10,480
That's the word on the street, 
right? 

576
00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:13,280
Yeah, yeah. 
You'd say that bearing in mind 

577
00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:15,880
that genocide, you know, had a 
bunch of assets so that a few 

578
00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:18,200
things in their plate they would
have, you know, obviously had 

579
00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:20,040
that front and centre when 
thinking about what they wanted 

580
00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:23,960
on the other side. 
Yeah, yeah, but so. 

581
00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:26,120
A Ding Ding, Ding as well. 
AJC Genesis. 

582
00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:28,280
Oh, Genesis. 
Yeah. 

583
00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:30,680
God, which one of the three? 
Yeah. 

584
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:35,920
And in this case it's like so 
if, if, if maybe the wedge isn't

585
00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:37,360
because they're actually really 
interested in Alta. 

586
00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:39,760
You got to you got to try and 
think what are the intentions of

587
00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:42,360
Petronas slash Delphi in this? 
I don't, I don't know if anyone 

588
00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:46,200
really knows. 
So you know, it's not like it's 

589
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:47,920
a strategic like game ploy from 
Delphi. 

590
00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:51,000
I actually just think they're, 
they're being reactive to an 

591
00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:52,640
opportunity that presented 
itself. 

592
00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:56,920
From from what I understand, the
shares became available from the

593
00:29:56,920 --> 00:30:00,600
broker because Horizon wanted to
sell the full line and the 

594
00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:03,640
broker has has fished it out to 
a bunch of different people. 

595
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:07,000
Now in this case, it was 
Patronus that that gobbled up 

596
00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:10,400
the entire line, but a bunch of 
different shareholders had the 

597
00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:13,280
opportunity to to bid for, you 
know, some or all of the line. 

598
00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:17,840
And so because because that's 
how the thing that you know, the

599
00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:20,600
circumstances unfolded it, 
that's that's not how it would 

600
00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:24,760
play out if if Delphi tapped 
Horizon on the shoulder and 

601
00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:26,400
said, Hey, I want your shares. 
Why? 

602
00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:28,520
Why is that? 
I don't understand that why? 

603
00:30:28,520 --> 00:30:30,000
Because. 
You can execute an off market 

604
00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:32,360
private sale transfer. 
You don't even have to go 

605
00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:34,720
through Canaccord and pay 2% or 
whatever, whatever you pay. 

606
00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:40,040
Yeah, so but what? 
What is it in Horizons interest?

607
00:30:40,040 --> 00:30:43,360
But if Delphi did tap them on 
the shoulder wanting the shares,

608
00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:47,440
is it in Horizons interest to 
put it out to see if anyone else

609
00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:48,920
would pay more than Delphi was 
offering? 

610
00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:50,280
Yeah. 
You want to auction it? 

611
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:52,600
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
So it's not. 

612
00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:55,400
Is it conclusive that Delphi 
haven't tapped Horizon on the 

613
00:30:55,400 --> 00:30:58,160
shoulder as part of a bigger 
plan for that stock first? 

614
00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:00,960
I think it's unlikely. 
But possible. 

615
00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:02,120
Possible. 
I think. 

616
00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:03,640
It's I think. 
Canaccord would love to have on 

617
00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:06,680
the record that you wouldn't pay
2% on a on a block rate. 

618
00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:11,960
I don't know why, it's probably 
fair be less than yeah. 

619
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:15,080
So you guys have dug into this 
one way more than I have, 

620
00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:17,320
Horizon being the seller. 
Matt, are you saying they want 

621
00:31:17,320 --> 00:31:19,440
to tie themselves into this 
sooner or later? 

622
00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:22,280
Patron Horizon. 
Horizon. 

623
00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:24,120
Yeah. 
Well, what else are they going 

624
00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:25,880
to do? 
They've got the, you know, the 

625
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:30,080
bit up the up the north of, you 
know, I guess the, I guess the 

626
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:33,040
main deposit within the Alto 
that's got the most future is 

627
00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:37,080
the the Alto within the 
sandstone is the Alto project. 

628
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:39,200
What my question would be is 
wouldn't it be in their interest

629
00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:43,120
for the deal to go through? 
In Petronas's interests. 

630
00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:44,840
Horizons. 
Horizons. 

631
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:51,040
Horizon are irrelevant here. 
They've sold the shares, nothing

632
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:51,560
matters to them. 
I. 

633
00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:54,280
I haven't followed Horizon 
closely, but Maddie, Maddie said

634
00:31:54,280 --> 00:31:57,080
they they might down the track, 
want to have themselves tied in.

635
00:31:57,280 --> 00:32:00,000
Well, now that may be like if 
something was to happen in that 

636
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:03,160
sandstone region, maybe that's 
part of future consolidation, 

637
00:32:03,160 --> 00:32:05,200
but. 
Horizons is that's the Zeta 

638
00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:06,120
entity, right? 
Yeah. 

639
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:09,040
And they've just, they've just, 
yeah, they've just sold their 

640
00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:11,640
books I think and got doubled 
down on Panoramic and their 

641
00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:13,520
privatised. 
Yeah. 

642
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:17,560
So yeah. 
Might mightn't be a big big 

643
00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:18,840
ticket item for them now. 
Mightn't. 

644
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:22,320
Need the cash like yeah. 
Yeah, possibly they got it. 

645
00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:25,320
I think just thinking if it was 
in their interest to see the 

646
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:27,960
deal go through on it, do it in 
a couple of days time. 

647
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:30,680
Yeah, yeah. 
I don't know. 

648
00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:33,560
I don't know about that. 
Maybe I haven't thought about 

649
00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:35,520
Horizon too much. 
And maybe they just couldn't 

650
00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:36,720
sell. 
Their shares, yeah. 

651
00:32:37,960 --> 00:32:40,200
What they it wants kind of 
irrelevant now they don't have 

652
00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:41,280
they don't own the shares 
anymore. 

653
00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:42,880
It's sort of like. 
Yeah, of course it is. 

654
00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:45,000
After, I suppose. 
I suppose it doesn't matter if 

655
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:48,320
they what happens in the short 
term if eventually whatever 

656
00:32:48,320 --> 00:32:52,120
happens, but Broadstar and 
bloody Patronus can fight each 

657
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:53,720
other. 
At some point someone will own 

658
00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:56,440
that and then they'll come into 
whatever that vehicle is later. 

659
00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:58,240
Of course wanted to. 
Get gobbled up. 

660
00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:03,240
This could potentially be a 
delay that takes a long time to 

661
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:07,240
to play out, yeah. 
Yeah, yeah. 

662
00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:11,080
And and then you're trying to 
think, OK, so if if you're not 

663
00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:14,080
convinced on what the ploy here 
is by Patronus, they want Alto. 

664
00:33:14,360 --> 00:33:17,000
That's not that's not actually 
clear at all, given what, you 

665
00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:19,760
know, bizarre stuff that friends
of the show have done in the 

666
00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:21,240
past. 
They want uplifting 

667
00:33:21,240 --> 00:33:23,640
consideration. 
Not convinced, although, you 

668
00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:25,800
know, who fucking knows? 
Do they want some collateral 

669
00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:27,800
benefit? 
And that's risky territory. 

670
00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:30,000
I think we've got to kind of 
talk about all the things that 

671
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:33,280
could be on the cards here 
because it's so, yeah, it's, 

672
00:33:33,280 --> 00:33:35,840
it's just making sense that 
Patronus's intentions in the 1st

673
00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:38,360
place is something that, you 
know, informs what could play 

674
00:33:38,360 --> 00:33:40,600
out here. 
But making sense of that is kind

675
00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:42,320
of pretty damn tricky to think 
about. 

676
00:33:42,520 --> 00:33:43,760
Yeah. 
No, they, OK. 

677
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:47,800
So if you look at what Patronus 
has got, so you've got, they've 

678
00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:50,240
got, as I said, they've got the 
Cardinian stuff which has been, 

679
00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:54,400
which Genesis have taken what 
they want out of it already. 

680
00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:57,440
So we can assume that Genesis 
don't want what the rest of it, 

681
00:33:57,440 --> 00:33:59,760
otherwise they probably would 
have taken that as well. 

682
00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:04,840
They've got and they've got 
tenements South of Leonora. 

683
00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:07,800
So in and around Bright Stars 
stuff, they've got stuff in the 

684
00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:10,280
NT as well. 
So it's like, I got it, they've 

685
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:12,800
got this now. 
And they're like, how do we, I 

686
00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:14,520
believe they think? 
And how do we get a corporate 

687
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:17,159
outcome or an uplifting value 
for what we've got? 

688
00:34:17,679 --> 00:34:21,639
And the based on the fact that, 
well, doesn't appear Genesis 

689
00:34:21,639 --> 00:34:25,880
want to buy it, how do we get 
someone like Broadstar to give 

690
00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:27,960
us an uplift? 
Well, it's like, well, we want 

691
00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:30,199
to be part of this consolidation
as well. 

692
00:34:30,199 --> 00:34:32,960
And we want an uplift on the EV 
of what we've got. 

693
00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:35,080
I think they, because they've 
got, they're like a bloody cash 

694
00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:37,120
box. 
They've got, is it 66 million in

695
00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:39,840
cash? 
Yeah, 101 mil market caps on 

696
00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:41,719
EV35. 
So they want an uplift on. 

697
00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:44,080
The EV they want a bunch of. 
They'd earn a bunch of Genesis 

698
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:45,800
shares as well. 
I think Maddie too when they 

699
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:47,400
sold there. 
Oh yeah. 

700
00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:49,199
Yeah, so the EVs look like less.
Yeah. 

701
00:34:49,199 --> 00:34:53,480
I think most of it was, yeah, 
there's about 2/3 group or 

702
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:56,120
something for that 50. 
I got the where is it? 

703
00:34:56,400 --> 00:35:01,080
It was Let Me Bloody Live demo 
for the 53 and a half million 

704
00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:04,120
consideration. 
It was 15 mil cash and 21 

705
00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:06,880
million Genesis shares. 
So yeah, it's a cashbox. 

706
00:35:07,240 --> 00:35:09,240
Yeah. 
So they're thinking right. 

707
00:35:09,240 --> 00:35:12,840
Can we if they yeah wedge 
themselves in here, are they 

708
00:35:12,840 --> 00:35:15,800
going to again get the uplift 
lock that did in the dice in 

709
00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:17,120
thing? 
All right. 

710
00:35:17,120 --> 00:35:20,720
But let's talk, let's talk about
what collateral benefit is. 

711
00:35:20,720 --> 00:35:24,840
And that's the thing that can be
the, I guess the determining 

712
00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:28,080
factor in these, these schemes 
and how they, how they vote as 

713
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:29,800
well. 
It's it's effectively saying 

714
00:35:29,800 --> 00:35:34,240
that a collateral benefit is 
when Patronus get something in 

715
00:35:34,240 --> 00:35:37,160
return for in a way they vote or
being in a deal that other 

716
00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:39,680
shareholders don't get. 
Perfect. 

717
00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:43,480
Pretty much, Yeah, pretty much. 
So, and this is when we get 

718
00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:46,640
venture into the territory of a 
side deal. 

719
00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:49,360
Well, that, that's, that's the 
thing I can't quite piece 

720
00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:52,320
together. 
Do they want, are they trying to

721
00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:54,480
like get pesky because they 
actually want they have a 

722
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:56,480
different mode if they want 
access to different assets or 

723
00:35:56,480 --> 00:35:57,920
they want to be scooped up in a 
different way? 

724
00:35:57,920 --> 00:35:59,400
Or is it is it actually about 
Alto? 

725
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:02,040
Is it about a broader thing? 
And if it is, that's very 

726
00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:04,080
fucking risky territory. 
Yeah. 

727
00:36:04,120 --> 00:36:08,680
I think my first pass of what 
they want before we get into 

728
00:36:08,680 --> 00:36:14,280
what's actually possible, what 
they want Broad Star as part of 

729
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:17,880
this consolidation to either buy
them or buy the tenements of 

730
00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:22,880
them in the Leonora Laverton 
region and get some value for it

731
00:36:22,880 --> 00:36:25,600
right now. 
That's what that's what I 

732
00:36:25,600 --> 00:36:28,360
believe the intention is of of 
this to disrupt it. 

733
00:36:28,720 --> 00:36:31,320
They want an uplift on the value
of those tenements. 

734
00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:36,400
So, and the only way to do that 
now because just aren't going to

735
00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:36,960
be. 
Sure. 

736
00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:40,000
Because like, yeah, Are you 
sure? 

737
00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:44,440
Because like, if I think of the 
ownership 43% owned by the 

738
00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:47,960
Germans, how do they ever get 
liquidity, even if it's a cash 

739
00:36:47,960 --> 00:36:50,760
box, you know what I mean? 
You only can how they, how can 

740
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:53,600
they ever sell those shares? 
Maybe they could distribute the,

741
00:36:53,880 --> 00:36:56,640
they could potentially 
distribute the, the cash. 

742
00:36:56,960 --> 00:36:59,600
But this tax leakage probably in
doing, in doing that. 

743
00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:03,520
So they might actually just want
to be acquired at a corporate 

744
00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:09,200
level themselves in the most tax
advantage advantage way for for 

745
00:37:09,360 --> 00:37:13,240
for Deutsche Ballotin to get a 
liquidity event by by a major 

746
00:37:13,240 --> 00:37:14,600
like a Genesis or something like
that. 

747
00:37:14,600 --> 00:37:16,760
Yeah. 
And but I think we can, I don't,

748
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:21,000
we can't see Genesis doing it. 
I think what if, what if, what 

749
00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:24,840
if Broadstar as part of this 
consolidation, which would be, 

750
00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:26,680
you know, whether that's a solid
deal and they have to have a 

751
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:30,440
different class of shares that 
they have to like effectively 

752
00:37:30,440 --> 00:37:32,400
abstain from voting in this 
game. 

753
00:37:33,520 --> 00:37:37,120
But if I get then acquired by 
Brightstar for script, doesn't 

754
00:37:37,120 --> 00:37:40,120
that give them rollover relief 
and that's a tax advantage? 

755
00:37:40,600 --> 00:37:44,080
Advented Tigers way of doing it.
Sure. 

756
00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:46,720
Yeah, yeah, they've got they've.
Still got the the shares? 

757
00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:49,920
You know you've got the cash. 
Yeah, but. 

758
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:53,920
The rollover relief would be not
having to pay tax specifically 

759
00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:56,720
on that win. 
Yeah, but you're still having 

760
00:37:56,720 --> 00:37:59,680
shares in your hands, not cash. 
Yeah, but then can't they sell 

761
00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:02,160
them lighter it? 
Could, but they could sell their

762
00:38:02,160 --> 00:38:04,600
shares in, yeah. 
Now there's no that that that 

763
00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:06,040
you can't. 
There's no liquidity for. 

764
00:38:06,640 --> 00:38:08,520
Yeah, I mean, you can't sell 
that Broadstar is not the most. 

765
00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:11,240
No, the plan. 
But Genesis is liquid. 

766
00:38:11,240 --> 00:38:12,440
That's the only thing you can 
sell. 

767
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:14,440
Yeah. 
Yeah, but I was talking to 

768
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:15,960
Maddie's point there, yeah. 
Yeah. 

769
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:18,960
So then well, is it part right 
if they say they get all 

770
00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:23,200
Broadstar script and then that 
combined consolidated entity 

771
00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:26,840
might be either more amenable to
whether it's Genesis or someone 

772
00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:27,640
else. 
Yeah. 

773
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:30,520
To acquire that vehicle, which, 
yeah, that gives them the 

774
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:33,160
liquidity to maybe get out. 
It's I don't know if they're 

775
00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:35,560
thinking that far right. 
All of this, all of this 

776
00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:38,040
conjecture, like one thing's for
sure, we don't really know what 

777
00:38:38,040 --> 00:38:40,600
Petronas intentions are. 
We're kind of speculating and 

778
00:38:40,600 --> 00:38:43,040
we're a bit, you know, we don't 
really fucking know. 

779
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:46,280
But you know, if they, if, if 
there's a collateral benefit in 

780
00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:48,800
mind, they've got to be very 
careful in, in, in that front 

781
00:38:48,800 --> 00:38:51,840
because it's a, it's a scheme. 
The it's tricky. 

782
00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:55,160
If you know, if, if a side deal 
is carved and you know, that's 

783
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:57,360
got to be disclosed, you 
probably have to postpone the 

784
00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:58,800
vote. 
There's got to be a different 

785
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:01,520
class of of shares for the 
purposes devoted. 

786
00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:03,640
Kind of goes through the 
independent experts got to, you 

787
00:39:03,640 --> 00:39:05,000
know, say that it's at arm's 
length. 

788
00:39:05,240 --> 00:39:06,600
Yeah. 
All that sort of stuff. 

789
00:39:07,720 --> 00:39:10,000
Yeah. 
So it it it becomes complicated.

790
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:12,000
You send the timeline, you add 
deal completion risk in the 

791
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:15,680
process. 
Or, or, or Brightstar have a few

792
00:39:15,680 --> 00:39:17,840
options up their sleeve too. 
They could they could swap to a 

793
00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:20,320
takeover offer and just be like,
you know, stuff, you know, I'm 

794
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:22,360
happy to I'm happy to get 80% 
right. 

795
00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:25,600
That's fine, You know, squeeze 
them and play the long game that

796
00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:27,640
way. 
Or or Brightstar could just 

797
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:30,920
rally the troops as hard as they
possibly can. 

798
00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:36,720
Good pan there without rally. 
Oh, so I can pick up that and 

799
00:39:36,720 --> 00:39:39,080
try and get 80% of shareholders 
to vote? 

800
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:41,720
Without soliciting. 
Sorry, sorry, I say Bright Star 

801
00:39:41,720 --> 00:39:43,840
could rally the troops. 
What I really mean is, is Alto 

802
00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:45,440
because it's yeah. 
I'm sure Bright Star would. 

803
00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:46,840
Be working. 
Bright Star wouldn't argue with 

804
00:39:46,840 --> 00:39:48,840
that. 
Because it's, it's, it's, it's 

805
00:39:48,840 --> 00:39:51,080
Alto shareholders that have to 
rock up and and vote here. 

806
00:39:51,080 --> 00:39:53,640
And they do have a relatively 
concentrated register. 

807
00:39:53,640 --> 00:39:57,640
You've got, you know, I think 
Terry Wheeler is a director and 

808
00:39:57,640 --> 00:40:00,160
you know, he has to vote for it.
Like you've got a pretty 

809
00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:03,320
concentrated register of people 
like Gold C is blown. 

810
00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:04,840
Yeah, yeah. 
ACORN. 

811
00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:07,960
Like, you know, they're all 
presumably going to vote for it.

812
00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:09,880
So. 
But you've got to get sufficient

813
00:40:09,880 --> 00:40:14,200
mass of the the lengthy tail to 
vote for it. 

814
00:40:14,360 --> 00:40:16,760
And if they can do that, it 
would be a. 

815
00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:21,880
A truly impressive feat to 
accomplish people when you ask 

816
00:40:21,880 --> 00:40:25,760
for precedence of when there's 
been like a a 19.9% no blocking 

817
00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:28,560
stake and they've voted no and 
they've actually still gotten 

818
00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:30,960
the scheme over the line. 
Everyone only ever points to 1 

819
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:32,840
precedent and that was just like
TAG. 

820
00:40:32,880 --> 00:40:37,520
M Com yeah, M Com got acquired 
and TPG bought a 20% blocking 

821
00:40:37,520 --> 00:40:40,680
stake and it's still got over. 
So worth making a quick comment 

822
00:40:40,680 --> 00:40:44,240
on what the motivations or the 
incentives might be for auto 

823
00:40:44,240 --> 00:40:46,120
then, because they're the ones 
that have to pick up the phone, 

824
00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:48,600
you know, as it kind of is, 
well, their share. 

825
00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:52,120
Price is going to crater if this
doesn't get over the line 

826
00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:55,240
because they've got no cash. 
They've been come rise forever 

827
00:40:55,920 --> 00:41:00,760
and they're going to they've 
just off market traded for eight

828
00:41:00,760 --> 00:41:03,320
cents. 
I think they'll bloody what, 3 

829
00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:06,800
or 433 and something before the 
deal. 

830
00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:09,720
Bull price but ASX. 
Company juniors rallied in in 

831
00:41:09,720 --> 00:41:11,160
that space, yeah. 
Yeah. 

832
00:41:11,160 --> 00:41:15,320
So that you'd think that that 
would easily have like the but. 

833
00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:16,840
Don't know. 
But their salaries? 

834
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:20,640
Might keep their job you. 
Guys have a way of just I, I. 

835
00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:23,640
Think like, I think there's a 
lot of forces implied for them 

836
00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:25,560
to have enough incentive to get 
the deal done like this. 

837
00:41:25,880 --> 00:41:27,880
You've done all this work. 
You're up to this point, you 

838
00:41:27,880 --> 00:41:29,920
know, people are offered in some
advised to get a deal done. 

839
00:41:29,920 --> 00:41:33,200
There'll be, you know, all sorts
of things vest in that process 

840
00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:36,400
and all that sort of jazz. 
And you know, yeah, all, all the

841
00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:38,120
advisors are incentivized for 
deal completion. 

842
00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:40,840
So everyone will be wanting to 
get the deal over the line. 

843
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:43,160
Don't think Alto would be 
particularly resistant. 

844
00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:46,280
I wouldn't have thought I would.
That would be wanting I'd be 

845
00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:48,520
getting on the phone to their 
shareholders or their advisors 

846
00:41:48,520 --> 00:41:50,320
will be getting on the phone to 
their shareholders and 

847
00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:54,240
encouraging them to to, you 
know, plug a couple numbers into

848
00:41:54,240 --> 00:41:58,040
their phone and then click the 
button and vote for for, you 

849
00:41:58,040 --> 00:42:00,040
know, for like submit their 
proxy, whatever, whatever it is 

850
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:01,880
that you got to do. 
It's the deadline for that is 

851
00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:07,720
1:30 on Sunday. 
And yeah, otherwise if, and that

852
00:42:07,720 --> 00:42:10,600
will have a good idea, right? 
Also we'll have a good idea by 

853
00:42:10,600 --> 00:42:14,520
then what the, what the actual 
like results going to be with or

854
00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:19,040
without Patrona slash Delphi's, 
you know, involvement in the 

855
00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:21,440
case. 
Because you know, your proxies. 

856
00:42:22,080 --> 00:42:25,040
And it'll be really interesting 
to see if they then, you know, 

857
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:27,800
if they, if they actually choose
to extend their scam vote, if 

858
00:42:27,800 --> 00:42:31,640
there's a restructure, if, if 
things are, you know, thrown out

859
00:42:31,640 --> 00:42:34,520
from a timeline perspective 
because maybe they just don't 

860
00:42:34,520 --> 00:42:36,840
quite get there. 
I reckon they're so they're 

861
00:42:36,840 --> 00:42:40,280
either gonna, so they either 
could extend it, they could roll

862
00:42:40,280 --> 00:42:44,040
the dice and still hold the vote
and rally like fuck right now, 

863
00:42:44,040 --> 00:42:45,360
which I'm assuming they're 
doing. 

864
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:49,080
How how easy it is to put your 
proxy thing. 

865
00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:52,080
Do they have to like register 
for a autonomic account or 

866
00:42:52,080 --> 00:42:53,280
something? 
Very, very easy. 

867
00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:55,200
Super easy. 
No one does it, but it's super 

868
00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:55,640
easy. 
Yeah. 

869
00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:58,400
Can you like do it as you said, 
plug it on your phone or you 

870
00:42:58,400 --> 00:43:00,440
actually got to register an 
account first you. 

871
00:43:00,440 --> 00:43:03,240
Can do it on your phone. 
You just have to Chuck in your 

872
00:43:03,680 --> 00:43:07,160
your holder identification 
number or your SRN, Chuck it in 

873
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:10,000
and your post code and you just 
click yes or no. 

874
00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:12,120
Yeah. 
Very easy. 

875
00:43:12,160 --> 00:43:15,840
Yeah, yeah, people should vote. 
Stop not fighting people. 

876
00:43:16,240 --> 00:43:19,600
Yeah, because if you don't 
fight, people pull on this 

877
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:22,760
stuff, Yeah, get an outcome for 
themselves. 

878
00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:24,160
Yeah. 
Well, that's it. 

879
00:43:24,160 --> 00:43:26,760
And that's the uncertainty. 
Uncertainty for yeah, Alto 

880
00:43:26,760 --> 00:43:29,800
shareholders is like what what 
actually happens if if the deal 

881
00:43:29,800 --> 00:43:32,240
doesn't go ahead? 
It's a yeah, bit of a more like 

882
00:43:32,240 --> 00:43:34,320
challenging proposition then and
I. 

883
00:43:34,320 --> 00:43:37,160
Could I could I could, I could 
put my fucking cock on the block

884
00:43:37,160 --> 00:43:41,120
and say the share price is going
to go down significantly if it 

885
00:43:41,120 --> 00:43:46,240
doesn't go ahead for Alta. 
Yeah, absent. 

886
00:43:46,320 --> 00:43:49,880
Absent like a takeover offer 
from from the Interlock guy, you

887
00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:52,080
know. 
Yeah, but that, that depends if 

888
00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:54,080
that's. 
Yeah, yeah. 

889
00:43:54,680 --> 00:43:57,120
Yeah, Yeah. 
I don't know now that well, 

890
00:43:57,160 --> 00:44:00,160
because I guess another 
guarantee is that, you know, the

891
00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:05,240
this Patronus entity like that 
now they're looking for, they're

892
00:44:05,240 --> 00:44:07,080
looking for corporate outcomes, 
they're looking for money to 

893
00:44:07,080 --> 00:44:09,360
make off just chairs and stuff 
like that. 

894
00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:11,560
I don't seem bloody mind 
actually wanting to mine 

895
00:44:11,560 --> 00:44:14,400
anything. 
No, the liquidity that, you 

896
00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:18,520
know, Dolphy's made in the 
market is Spartan and Azure, the

897
00:44:18,520 --> 00:44:21,320
two big wins they've had, yeah. 
And then they've torched shit 

898
00:44:21,320 --> 00:44:22,680
loads of money in other parts of
the market. 

899
00:44:22,680 --> 00:44:24,760
But that those two big wins have
offset a lot of it. 

900
00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:29,000
Yeah, yeah, I don't say I'm ever
like making the call to Tim 

901
00:44:29,000 --> 00:44:31,880
Taylor and cross boundary energy
for a hybrid power station. 

902
00:44:31,920 --> 00:44:32,920
Well, they're never going to 
need it. 

903
00:44:32,920 --> 00:44:36,600
They're they're not mining 
anything like yeah, So Tim, if 

904
00:44:36,720 --> 00:44:38,360
don't call them, don't call 
Patron. 

905
00:44:38,360 --> 00:44:41,160
It's probably called Broad Star.
Well, I think they're they're 

906
00:44:41,160 --> 00:44:43,880
setting some like intentions to 
possibly mine something in the 

907
00:44:43,880 --> 00:44:45,360
future. 
Yeah, to consolidate. 

908
00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:48,320
They've been mining, been mining
a second fortune bit of pit 

909
00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:51,040
mining out in the Bloody Menzies
region, right. 

910
00:44:51,560 --> 00:44:54,160
I think a hybrid power station 
supplied by a cross boundary 

911
00:44:54,160 --> 00:44:55,560
energy might be on the cards 
there. 

912
00:44:55,920 --> 00:45:00,000
Power purchase agreement 0 CapEx
straight to the sandstone once 

913
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:01,960
all this shit bloody gets 
sorted. 

914
00:45:02,280 --> 00:45:03,720
Yeah, I've seen the state of 
some of the sandstone 

915
00:45:03,720 --> 00:45:05,640
infrastructure. 
I think Tim's going to have to 

916
00:45:05,640 --> 00:45:07,080
sort that. 
Out, I think a little. 

917
00:45:07,480 --> 00:45:12,600
A little nice bright and shiny 0
CapEx cross boundary energy 

918
00:45:12,600 --> 00:45:14,240
hybrid power plant to go good up
there. 

919
00:45:14,320 --> 00:45:16,720
Right, build and operate. 
What a great model. 

920
00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:19,080
Good on you, Tim. 
Thanks for thanks you and cross 

921
00:45:19,080 --> 00:45:22,400
boundary energy for powering the
Samsung region. 

922
00:45:22,440 --> 00:45:25,880
Potential sense and not powering
for trainers. 

923
00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:30,280
What? 
OK, let's do some predictions 

924
00:45:30,280 --> 00:45:31,880
bets. 
What do we think is going to 

925
00:45:31,880 --> 00:45:38,080
happen? 
Roll the dice I reckon. 

926
00:45:39,720 --> 00:45:42,200
I do think they'll get to 19.9 
but. 

927
00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:45,200
Yep. 
Just give it a go, I reckon they

928
00:45:45,200 --> 00:45:48,840
might get it over the line. 
You think 80%'s 80% turn out's 

929
00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:52,080
gettable? 
It's bloody hard, but super 

930
00:45:52,080 --> 00:45:54,200
hard. 
Surely you can make 100. 

931
00:45:54,200 --> 00:45:57,000
I don't know how many showers 
there are, as you said, like 100

932
00:45:57,000 --> 00:46:01,320
calls and walk them through 
bloody voting on the phone or 

933
00:46:01,560 --> 00:46:03,800
you're not allowed to do that. 
I you can only. 

934
00:46:04,040 --> 00:46:06,800
I don't know exactly what the 
rules are there, but. 

935
00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:08,400
Can't record the phone 
conversations. 

936
00:46:08,400 --> 00:46:11,000
Private conversation. 
What do you recommend? 

937
00:46:11,200 --> 00:46:20,120
I, I think, I think there will 
be a side deal cut which will 

938
00:46:20,240 --> 00:46:26,240
possibly need to be reviewed by 
the independent expert and the 

939
00:46:26,240 --> 00:46:30,200
scheme vote will be delayed. 
But it will be and they'll get 

940
00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:33,880
in a different share class and 
go down that road and abstain 

941
00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:35,560
and that'll get the deal over 
the lawn. 

942
00:46:35,560 --> 00:46:39,400
I think that's the, because if 
you, if they do, if they roll 

943
00:46:39,400 --> 00:46:41,920
the dice. 
And as I said, there's been one 

944
00:46:42,880 --> 00:46:44,800
precedent for it. 
I'm not sure if there's been 

945
00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:46,840
others. 
Mine one main precedent because 

946
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:50,400
you it's just such a risky play 
to then have to go redo the 

947
00:46:50,400 --> 00:46:52,200
whole scheme again. 
Redo the court. 

948
00:46:52,360 --> 00:46:53,320
Be a nightmare. 
I don't. 

949
00:46:53,400 --> 00:46:55,120
I have to look to the register. 
I don't know. 

950
00:46:55,200 --> 00:46:56,960
How I think, I think it's 
doable. 

951
00:46:57,280 --> 00:47:01,480
I think it's doable, but the 
late the the lower risk play or 

952
00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:03,520
delight because it's been going 
for a while already. 

953
00:47:04,560 --> 00:47:08,640
Yes, delighted a bit longer try 
and appease these interlopers 

954
00:47:08,640 --> 00:47:10,120
just to try and get the deal 
done. 

955
00:47:10,520 --> 00:47:13,760
Is is a lower risk play? 
Yeah, way lower risk. 

956
00:47:13,760 --> 00:47:19,680
What do you reckon, Trev? 
My yeah, we haven't talked about

957
00:47:19,680 --> 00:47:21,880
this scenario, but I actually 
think the most likely thing is 

958
00:47:21,880 --> 00:47:23,440
that Petronas votes for the 
deal. 

959
00:47:24,360 --> 00:47:26,920
Oh, OK. 
So, OK, so if they if they did 

960
00:47:26,920 --> 00:47:30,240
vote yes and they're because 
they're already a shareholder of

961
00:47:30,240 --> 00:47:31,680
Broadstar I. 
Think they own a little bit of 

962
00:47:31,680 --> 00:47:33,760
Broadstar? 
And then this 20 of the outside,

963
00:47:33,760 --> 00:47:36,920
the smaller chunk, I think 
that'd be possibly still less 

964
00:47:36,920 --> 00:47:38,920
than 10%. 
Like, yeah. 

965
00:47:38,920 --> 00:47:41,440
Or maybe I'm not sure what that 
number would be, but that. 

966
00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:44,640
The reason I say the most likely
thing for them to his vote for 

967
00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:46,840
is mostly because I've got no 
fucking idea what their actual 

968
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:48,960
intentions are. 
So for all I know, this is just 

969
00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:50,600
the cheaper way to own more 
Broadstar shares. 

970
00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:54,240
Here's an idea. 
Maybe this is just a ploy with 

971
00:47:54,240 --> 00:47:57,560
that shareholding in the pro 
forma that Hans and Rowan can 

972
00:47:57,560 --> 00:48:05,920
get on another board. 
Maybe put it to a shower to 

973
00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:10,080
vote. 
Oh fucking hell, this will be a 

974
00:48:10,600 --> 00:48:13,080
bit of a bloody They're going to
be hustling their ass until 

975
00:48:13,080 --> 00:48:16,480
Sunday trying to rally And I 
suppose like whether what 

976
00:48:16,480 --> 00:48:18,840
happened, whether they there's a
risk you've done after voting 

977
00:48:18,840 --> 00:48:22,080
yes or not, you're still going 
to be rallying the bloody all 

978
00:48:22,080 --> 00:48:24,440
the registry up until that 
Bloody Sunday. 

979
00:48:24,440 --> 00:48:26,520
Get every proxy vote because it 
is possible. 

980
00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:28,720
You have to fuck. 
I'd love to see this get up. 

981
00:48:28,920 --> 00:48:30,440
This would be good for 
Australia. 

982
00:48:30,600 --> 00:48:33,800
This is good for the gambling 
nature of Australia is if they 

983
00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:36,640
roll the dice and get the votes 
over the line. 

984
00:48:36,840 --> 00:48:42,360
And even with the Delphi mods 
voting against, that'd be huge. 

985
00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:44,400
Be massive. 
Go Australia. 

986
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:49,760
This could be the next fucking 
men's 4 by 100 relay from the 

987
00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:52,080
Sydney Olympics. 
This could be a YouTube video 

988
00:48:52,320 --> 00:48:53,720
when this happens. 
This could. 

989
00:48:53,720 --> 00:48:57,200
This could be 2 million views. 
If this happens, this would be a

990
00:48:57,200 --> 00:49:00,480
great Australian moment. 
It's the Stephen Bradbury, yeah.

991
00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:03,960
Oh gal, Australia, come on, come
on. 

992
00:49:05,160 --> 00:49:07,440
Can't tell you how to vote, but.
Jesus Christ. 

993
00:49:07,800 --> 00:49:10,160
Just vote for a great Australian
moment. 

994
00:49:12,040 --> 00:49:15,800
Oh fucking hell. 
Oh this is this would be a good 

995
00:49:16,720 --> 00:49:18,360
Monday's going to be good. 
When's the vote? 

996
00:49:18,360 --> 00:49:21,160
Tuesday. 
The vote's Tuesday, 1:30 PM. 

997
00:49:21,960 --> 00:49:26,160
Yeah, unless it gets perfect. 
Yeah, but showing us the 

998
00:49:26,160 --> 00:49:26,720
standard? 
Time. 

999
00:49:26,720 --> 00:49:28,480
Oh, should we go? 
Yeah, we. 

1000
00:49:29,720 --> 00:49:31,720
Should. 
Yeah, we could do live from the 

1001
00:49:32,480 --> 00:49:34,760
live from the boat they. 
Might, they might lock us out. 

1002
00:49:34,760 --> 00:49:36,400
I got last time I went to a 
shower vote. 

1003
00:49:36,400 --> 00:49:37,480
They fucking didn't let me in 
there. 

1004
00:49:37,760 --> 00:49:40,680
I reckon we'll get into this 
100% we go. 

1005
00:49:41,600 --> 00:49:43,480
Let's do it. 
Right. 

1006
00:49:44,200 --> 00:49:47,200
God, what a bloody what a set of
names to follow. 

1007
00:49:47,760 --> 00:49:50,160
Mineral Mining services. 
They'll be doing a bit of work 

1008
00:49:50,160 --> 00:49:52,960
in this pro forma. 
Not for Patronus, but probably 

1009
00:49:52,960 --> 00:49:56,200
for someone else that wants to 
mine mate. 

1010
00:49:56,200 --> 00:49:59,360
Grounded in the bloody. 
Oh no, we didn't talk about them

1011
00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:00,960
today. 
They're just frigging awesome. 

1012
00:50:01,040 --> 00:50:04,560
Love you, love you Paul, Natalie
crossbound your energy we did 

1013
00:50:04,560 --> 00:50:07,000
talk about. 
Sandy Ground Support also got to

1014
00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:09,800
thank them. 
Oh good old CRA insurance. 

1015
00:50:09,840 --> 00:50:13,880
Hey, Drill and Dysat. 
Hoodoo money minors. 

1016
00:50:13,880 --> 00:50:17,760
Hoodoo information contained in 
this episode of Money of Mine is

1017
00:50:17,760 --> 00:50:20,000
of general nature only and does 
not take into account the 

1018
00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:23,600
objectives, financial situation 
or needs of any particular 

1019
00:50:23,600 --> 00:50:25,640
person. 
Before making any investment 

1020
00:50:25,640 --> 00:50:28,680
decision, you should consult 
with your financial advisor and 

1021
00:50:28,680 --> 00:50:31,840
consider how appropriate the 
advice is to your objectives, 

1022
00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:34,000
financial situation and needs.