1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:03,120 Friday money miners. We're giving hope to bag holders 2 00:00:03,120 --> 00:00:05,160 today. We're talking about stuff out 3 00:00:05,400 --> 00:00:07,600 out of flavour. Well, mostly rare earths, but 4 00:00:07,600 --> 00:00:09,280 it's coming back in flavour I reckon. 5 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:12,200 Rare earth and rare earth applications I believe you're 6 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:14,920 gonna go into. Mate and we've got bloody a bit 7 00:00:14,920 --> 00:00:19,320 of gold deals going on. Small for a big company, you'd 8 00:00:19,320 --> 00:00:20,600 say. Totally mate. 9 00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:23,800 There's it could be, could be, yes, a reason to be more excited 10 00:00:23,800 --> 00:00:26,320 about the juniors if the if the majors are getting active on a 11 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:28,040 deal front. I don't need a reason to be 12 00:00:28,040 --> 00:00:30,200 excited for Underground Operators Conference. 13 00:00:30,200 --> 00:00:33,400 No 'cause I am and everyone else should be excited to get 100 14 00:00:33,400 --> 00:00:35,240 bucks off a ticket. Rapidly, these are the. 15 00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:40,200 Codes MONMOM 100 hundred bucks off a ticket like it. 16 00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:42,920 It is the only place in the world where you get that offer. 17 00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:47,440 So it's the greatest underground conference in the world and I am 18 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:50,520 going to have a fat time in Adelaide April 7th tonight. 19 00:00:50,680 --> 00:00:53,240 Get your tickets now. It's going to be a sell out. 20 00:00:53,360 --> 00:00:54,680 Is it? Underground is the conference 21 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:55,640 underground. It should be, yeah. 22 00:00:56,280 --> 00:00:58,760 We're it's we're actually having it at an Olympic dam. 23 00:01:01,080 --> 00:01:03,440 There's an idea for you, Jimmy Masters. 24 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:06,160 Right. Let's get into it Linus. 25 00:01:07,640 --> 00:01:11,560 By the way lads, thank you for balance sheet tutorials today. 26 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:13,960 I have much more appreciation for half yearly's. 27 00:01:14,320 --> 00:01:16,320 Probably should have learned it all before the half yearly 28 00:01:16,320 --> 00:01:18,960 started getting released. You can pay me back in mining 29 00:01:18,960 --> 00:01:21,440 knowledge, Maddie. Take it away, Linus. 30 00:01:21,440 --> 00:01:24,360 Let's talk about Linus, a super interesting company. 31 00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:28,320 So half yearly results came out that actually interesting 32 00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:33,560 quarterly results with a bit going on between Mount Weld, 33 00:01:33,880 --> 00:01:37,560 Kalgoorlie, obviously trying to get up to speed and everything 34 00:01:37,560 --> 00:01:40,200 going on in Malaysia. So we're kind of put it all 35 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:42,480 together because I think there's a lot of interesting forces 36 00:01:42,480 --> 00:01:46,040 moving this business at the moment, moving the the stock 37 00:01:46,040 --> 00:01:49,320 price specifically. You've got all this drama about 38 00:01:49,320 --> 00:01:54,880 the US, Ukraine, Russia, rare earth, very tense geopolitical 39 00:01:54,880 --> 00:01:58,840 sort of moment in the face of very depressed rare earths 40 00:01:58,840 --> 00:02:01,520 prices. So there's a there's a lot going 41 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:04,800 on for this 6 1/2 billion dollar mining company and I thought 42 00:02:04,800 --> 00:02:07,000 it'd be. Interesting, a rich 70 year old 43 00:02:07,000 --> 00:02:09,039 lady. Yeah. 44 00:02:09,160 --> 00:02:11,480 Well, to you know, you can specifically mention her here 45 00:02:11,480 --> 00:02:14,960 because I was going to compare Linus and MP Materials of which 46 00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:18,960 that worthy woman is a substantial shareholder in both. 47 00:02:18,960 --> 00:02:23,120 So Linus has for a long time been a much bigger company than 48 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:26,600 MP Materials, which sort of burst onto the scene through 49 00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:31,120 that 2020-2021 period. But right now, as you look at it 50 00:02:31,120 --> 00:02:33,880 in U.S. dollar terms, the market cap of Linus is 4 billion. 51 00:02:34,200 --> 00:02:37,280 The market cap of MP Materials is 3.9 billion. 52 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:40,120 So just an interesting 1. You can slot that in your your 53 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:42,120 hedge fund as a bit of a pairs trade if you want, Maddie. 54 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:46,000 Because wasn't Linus is due to produce about double the NDPR? 55 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:48,120 Yeah, eventually. We're talking about. 56 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:51,640 The mountain pass isn't it? Yeah, 10 1/2 six, yeah, kind of 57 00:02:51,640 --> 00:02:53,200 thing. So mountain passive. 58 00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:56,640 Have done a lot more work on actually the the the downstream 59 00:02:56,640 --> 00:02:59,360 like you've got magnet manufacturing going on now. 60 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:02,800 Yeah, Where is it? In Texas, isn't it? 61 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:06,200 The miners in California. But the the downstream. 62 00:03:06,200 --> 00:03:09,800 They've done stuff, yeah. And I mean, liners to an extent 63 00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:12,840 is trying to do stuff at at sea drift in, in Texas as well with 64 00:03:12,840 --> 00:03:15,720 the with the heavies. But that's a a bit of ways away. 65 00:03:15,720 --> 00:03:19,240 And that came off the back of a bit of helpful funding as well. 66 00:03:19,240 --> 00:03:21,480 These these sorts of companies are pretty prone to getting 67 00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:23,400 favourable financing. Yeah. 68 00:03:23,800 --> 00:03:26,040 But the half year itself it wasn't a great result. 69 00:03:26,040 --> 00:03:29,480 EBITDA was a 44% miss on consensus expectations that 70 00:03:29,480 --> 00:03:32,520 largely came off the back of higher unit costs and we're 71 00:03:32,920 --> 00:03:35,600 expected. So that's absolute terms because 72 00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:38,280 they are sort of ramping up and producing a bit more than they 73 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:41,400 were if you look at the the previous sort of periods, but on 74 00:03:41,400 --> 00:03:43,880 a unit basis as well. And they kind of point to that 75 00:03:43,880 --> 00:03:48,080 being a result of a lot of one off payments, sort of FX 76 00:03:48,080 --> 00:03:51,800 movements, these these kind of things which they don't say will 77 00:03:52,040 --> 00:03:55,320 be a constant kind of feature. But there's a lot of moving 78 00:03:55,320 --> 00:03:57,480 parts here. There's a lot of various bits of 79 00:03:57,480 --> 00:04:00,720 kit being commissioned that's happening at Mount Weld, that's 80 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:05,560 happening at the new facility in Kalgoorlie and also in Malaysia. 81 00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:08,320 So they're in a bit of a moment of flux. 82 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:12,120 They they call it, you know, they're still making money. 83 00:04:12,120 --> 00:04:14,720 EBITDA was $38 million. But if you look at the CapEx 84 00:04:14,720 --> 00:04:19,200 side of things, $267 million spent in this half year alone. 85 00:04:19,200 --> 00:04:23,160 All up that means that the cash position has retreated over $200 86 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:27,720 million to about a $300 million cash position. 87 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:31,120 So that's. Could be running running the 88 00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:33,920 Kitty pretty low by the end of this this half without a 89 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:35,240 liquidity injection of some sort. 90 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:37,080 Yeah, that's that's the crux of it, right? 91 00:04:37,080 --> 00:04:42,920 The the sustainability of this rarest price environment for 92 00:04:44,080 --> 00:04:46,920 everyone, including Linus at this moment in time is is very 93 00:04:46,920 --> 00:04:50,200 tough and. So even in the low fifties, even 94 00:04:50,200 --> 00:04:54,080 like it's arisen from the low 40s, that's still still not 95 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:56,680 cutting the mustard. Yeah, they'd, they'd love to see 96 00:04:56,680 --> 00:04:59,760 it, you know, another notch higher than where we are today 97 00:04:59,760 --> 00:05:02,920 to, to go beyond especially after this in, you know, really 98 00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:05,960 intense period of capital investment in the business. 99 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:08,320 You want, you want a bit of a buffer, you know, you need, you 100 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:10,880 need a buffer in the business. And I think the, the question 101 00:05:10,880 --> 00:05:13,720 we'll kind of get to today is, is that buffer running a bit 102 00:05:13,720 --> 00:05:15,240 skinny? And are they going to have to 103 00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:19,120 you know, look at various ways of of topping that up and to 104 00:05:19,120 --> 00:05:22,880 having a bit more sort of support or insurance in the in 105 00:05:22,880 --> 00:05:26,240 the business? There's, there's, there's a few 106 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:28,640 kind of cash drawers that have been at the company for a while. 107 00:05:28,640 --> 00:05:32,040 The expansion at Mount Well, which I think is, is complete 108 00:05:32,040 --> 00:05:35,080 the concentrator expansion. But the, the Kalgoorlie cracking 109 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:37,280 and leaching facility, which to the best of my knowledge, 110 00:05:37,840 --> 00:05:40,760 they're still, they're still capitalizing expenses there. 111 00:05:41,400 --> 00:05:44,240 So, yeah, even though they're the unit costs have gone up, 112 00:05:44,240 --> 00:05:46,720 that's not baking in any OpEx from from Kalgoorlie because 113 00:05:46,720 --> 00:05:48,240 that's still being capitalized. Yeah. 114 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:50,160 And I think we should just put that in a nutshell real quickly 115 00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:52,800 for the for the mining folk, what we're kind of talking 116 00:05:52,880 --> 00:05:54,280 about. Do you want me to explain it, 117 00:05:54,280 --> 00:05:56,400 Jada? Go for it. 118 00:05:56,600 --> 00:06:02,080 Are you confident it's, it's a, it's an accounting sort of 119 00:06:02,240 --> 00:06:05,080 practice right before you hit, you know, in very simple terms, 120 00:06:05,080 --> 00:06:08,320 before you hit commercial production, you can capitalize 121 00:06:08,320 --> 00:06:10,120 your cost. You're looking at them as 122 00:06:10,120 --> 00:06:13,920 investments in the business as opposed to thinking about them 123 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:16,480 as just cost of goods sold and netting them off against the 124 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:19,720 revenue that you're earning. Hence you can get an EBITDA 125 00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:23,680 number that is a positive number when your actual cash balance is 126 00:06:23,680 --> 00:06:26,680 coming off substantially. And it's not totally clear here 127 00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:29,880 because I'm not saying that that whole CapEx number is just going 128 00:06:29,880 --> 00:06:32,760 to be an ongoing capitalized expense. 129 00:06:32,760 --> 00:06:36,000 A lot of that was a one off, you know, buying bits of massive 130 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:40,440 equipment. But what is the actual loss or 131 00:06:40,440 --> 00:06:43,120 earnings on an ongoing basis of Kalgoorlie? 132 00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:47,160 That facility specifically is an open-ended question which we'll 133 00:06:47,920 --> 00:06:50,520 we'll find out in in due course. They've now reported that 134 00:06:50,520 --> 00:06:54,920 they're at a period of continuous operations at 135 00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:57,760 Kalgoorlie. There's a lot of ironing out 136 00:06:57,760 --> 00:06:59,920 that needs to be done. In the December quarter, they 137 00:06:59,920 --> 00:07:02,680 had impurities from the EMREC material. 138 00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:06,040 These things sort of happened. I would love to see as DK 139 00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:09,160 brought up with us when we first spoke with him the the Mcnulty's 140 00:07:09,160 --> 00:07:12,080 chart just to see where they are on that, how they're actually 141 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:14,720 tracking against nameplate capacity. 142 00:07:14,720 --> 00:07:17,040 We know that's very telling how you're tracking in the in the 143 00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:20,520 first sort of half year and and beyond about what the plant is 144 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:23,360 actually going to produce that in the long term. 145 00:07:23,360 --> 00:07:27,880 But, you know, they need to get to about 1/3 of their material 146 00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:33,400 coming from, from Cal, from Cal feed to hit the target run rate 147 00:07:34,000 --> 00:07:36,120 by the end of this financial year. 148 00:07:36,120 --> 00:07:38,800 So that's, that's kind of pretty soon, you know, that's, that's 149 00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:41,240 not too far away. So, you know, we hope they can 150 00:07:41,240 --> 00:07:43,360 kind of get there. You've also got the acid 151 00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:45,640 problem, which we've spoken about in the past. 152 00:07:46,240 --> 00:07:47,880 They reckon there's a, there's a workaround. 153 00:07:47,880 --> 00:07:49,800 It just comes at a slightly higher cost. 154 00:07:50,200 --> 00:07:54,600 They said it's, you know, not not super material, but no 155 00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:55,920 specific numbers on that one yet. 156 00:07:55,920 --> 00:07:58,360 So we don't know what the actual cost is going to be that of 157 00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:01,280 course coming from nickel W being shut down, that's sort of. 158 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:05,560 One thing on acid that when we're in the DRC where we 159 00:08:05,560 --> 00:08:10,120 visited a couple of you know, copper copper oxide plants where 160 00:08:10,320 --> 00:08:12,440 they're producing the copper from mining the oxide and then 161 00:08:12,440 --> 00:08:14,800 putting it through a solvent extraction Electro winning all 162 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:17,600 these mines. They had acid plants built at on 163 00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:20,480 site in some cases 2 acid plants on site to produce. 164 00:08:20,480 --> 00:08:24,480 I think that mine was doing 50,000 tons of of of of copper 165 00:08:24,480 --> 00:08:28,840 cathode per annum and the the capital required to just whip up 166 00:08:28,840 --> 00:08:30,800 an acid plant. It seemed like it was, it was 167 00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:36,360 like AUSUS 40 million I had in my head and they could like turn 168 00:08:36,360 --> 00:08:39,080 it around pretty quickly. Which, yeah. 169 00:08:39,200 --> 00:08:41,440 Contextual costs probably costs a bit more in Australia. 170 00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:45,000 A lot more in Australia, but yeah, the the sulfuric acid 171 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:47,360 constrain that we talked about with uranium a lot just felt 172 00:08:47,360 --> 00:08:50,640 contextualized in a different way after kind of seeing how how 173 00:08:50,880 --> 00:08:53,880 like abundant these plants were and how how like quick the turn 174 00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:55,280 around could have been to whip them up to. 175 00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:56,880 Yeah. Absolutely. 176 00:08:56,920 --> 00:08:58,440 Because what? The whole uranium thing isn't 177 00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:00,040 it? Wasn't it the Italians are 178 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:02,080 building the one in Kazakhstan or something? 179 00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:03,960 I don't know. They keep blaming the Italians 180 00:09:03,960 --> 00:09:06,040 or something, Italian or French or something. 181 00:09:06,520 --> 00:09:07,720 You've got to point the finger somewhere. 182 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:10,240 Right. Or is it getting the sulfur is 183 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:12,160 the? Well, you have to you have to 184 00:09:12,760 --> 00:09:16,480 import these massive bags to, to be a part of that chemical 185 00:09:16,480 --> 00:09:19,840 process. So it's yeah, it's there's big 186 00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:22,200 logistics kind of involved in in making that kind of happen. 187 00:09:23,360 --> 00:09:27,000 We'll sort of say just just to round out on Cow and the the 188 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:29,360 broader company in their production rate, 10 1/2 thousand 189 00:09:29,400 --> 00:09:32,320 ton per annum. NDPR oxide is what they want to 190 00:09:32,320 --> 00:09:35,640 get to the very steadfast. That's the goal to get to by mid 191 00:09:35,640 --> 00:09:39,000 this year. But it's not totally clear what 192 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:41,120 what they're going to do beyond that, whether they just keep 193 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:43,920 keep that constant, what they look to expand, whether they 194 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,680 dial back given the unfavorable market conditions, whether they 195 00:09:46,680 --> 00:09:48,000 have to. You know, they say that they 196 00:09:48,000 --> 00:09:51,280 haven't had any problems marketing their material and and 197 00:09:51,280 --> 00:09:54,160 selling it, but it always comes at a price. 198 00:09:54,160 --> 00:09:58,440 And as a as a relatively larger producer in this market, do they 199 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:02,200 kind of tinker with it a bit? Do they pull a bit of supply out 200 00:10:02,200 --> 00:10:04,920 of the market like we've seen lithium and other sort of 201 00:10:04,920 --> 00:10:07,440 producers do when the market is quite bearish? 202 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:10,680 We'll we'll see. It's again another open-ended 203 00:10:10,680 --> 00:10:16,080 question in this opaque market. So Lioness, can you say that the 204 00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:19,800 Australia was there, they've got no incentive to acquire more to 205 00:10:19,800 --> 00:10:22,080 produce more rare earths at another operation? 206 00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:26,040 We do though. Well, would they, would they 207 00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:28,360 acquire something else in Australia ever or they just 208 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:30,120 don't need to, I think. They're. 209 00:10:30,120 --> 00:10:33,680 Be too dilutive not. In Australia, yeah, they, they 210 00:10:34,320 --> 00:10:36,760 like, let's say they're ironic clays, you think come in lower 211 00:10:36,760 --> 00:10:39,600 on the cost curve in the long run then yes, you do that. 212 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:42,200 But they're they're by and large, the better deposits are 213 00:10:42,200 --> 00:10:43,880 not in Australia, Yeah. Yeah. 214 00:10:44,080 --> 00:10:47,560 And right now, you know, that would come with not too distant 215 00:10:47,560 --> 00:10:49,400 big CapEx, Bill, if you're gonna build the thing. 216 00:10:49,400 --> 00:10:52,160 And that's not really what the market wants to see right now. 217 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:54,280 I think they're quite content with what they can do in the 218 00:10:54,640 --> 00:10:59,120 they want to see them prove out the the capital investments that 219 00:10:59,120 --> 00:11:01,240 they've done and that they can produce at this higher rate. 220 00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:04,200 So I think, I think the market's sort of wanting to say that 221 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:08,320 first and foremost. Well, it'd be like like talent, 222 00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:12,320 the Talison JV going to buy another lithium deposit. 223 00:11:12,320 --> 00:11:15,480 It's like you never find one as good as that because Mount Wells 224 00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:18,320 such a stand out. Yeah, that's sort of challenge. 225 00:11:18,960 --> 00:11:20,840 I think we should make a couple of comments on the the railroad 226 00:11:20,840 --> 00:11:23,920 market in in general and probably look like an idiot when 227 00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:27,120 I say this because it's just such an opaque market. 228 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:31,080 But there has been a bit of a a bit of upward sort of movement 229 00:11:31,080 --> 00:11:33,600 in the price. So just the end of December 230 00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:37,240 we're talking about 49 ish bucks and now we're looking at 54 231 00:11:37,240 --> 00:11:41,400 excluding that. So roughly 10% increase in in 232 00:11:41,400 --> 00:11:43,360 the prices. So that's positive to start 233 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:45,280 with. You've then got some relatively 234 00:11:45,280 --> 00:11:49,680 big news coming out of China and you know, this is in the form of 235 00:11:49,680 --> 00:11:51,960 some draft documents that have come forward. 236 00:11:52,360 --> 00:11:56,000 The crux of it is that we could see more consolidation in the 237 00:11:56,080 --> 00:11:59,200 the Chinese market, which more or less is the railroads market. 238 00:11:59,440 --> 00:12:02,080 I'm talking about the likes of Northern railroads and China 239 00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:05,280 rare earths consolidating power hovering up some of those the 240 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:09,000 smaller producers. That is a draft, as I said. 241 00:12:09,000 --> 00:12:12,680 So that would need to become legislation in time, but that's, 242 00:12:12,680 --> 00:12:15,360 that's one to look out for as well. 243 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:17,880 And the the last sort of comment on the, the market and the 244 00:12:18,400 --> 00:12:22,040 ramifications of this massive drawdown in price is just the 245 00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:25,200 state of the juniors. Trev, you mentioned, you know, 246 00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:30,840 the, the ionic sort of plays in Brazil, they're off 4050 sixty, 247 00:12:31,120 --> 00:12:35,480 70% in some cases. It's it's similar across the 248 00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:37,160 board. No matter what type of rare 249 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:40,840 earth project you are, it's it's pretty grim looking around. 250 00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:42,800 So, you know, you could say that's an opportunity for for 251 00:12:42,800 --> 00:12:45,680 the likes of Linus if they want to look at that different style 252 00:12:45,680 --> 00:12:51,000 of of project or what have you, But it's not being the best 18 253 00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:55,120 odd months or a bit longer now for a lot of these rare earth 254 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:57,320 plays. And I think that sort of ties in 255 00:12:57,320 --> 00:12:59,920 with a weakening demand narrative. 256 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:03,000 You know, the outlook for wind turbines isn't as bullish as it 257 00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:05,880 was in that to the early twenty 20s period. 258 00:13:05,880 --> 00:13:10,040 There's concerns that these credits that you could get for 259 00:13:10,040 --> 00:13:13,080 buying an electric vehicle might be repealed that could hit the 260 00:13:13,320 --> 00:13:17,360 the demand side of things. There's new quotas coming out of 261 00:13:17,360 --> 00:13:19,800 China in the next week or so. So we'll see what that sort of 262 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:23,720 does on the on the supply side. But I think everyone's a a bit 263 00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:26,880 cagey mixed in with the the geopolitical angle that I 264 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:29,160 mentioned at the start. Oh mate, it was getting bloody 265 00:13:29,160 --> 00:13:33,560 talked up down at RIU rehearses because obviously the Hastings 266 00:13:33,560 --> 00:13:36,440 deal coming up so everyone's bloody dreadnought's getting 267 00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:38,560 talked about for rare earths again like. 268 00:13:38,560 --> 00:13:41,880 It's not a goal play anymore. No, no, I think it reconverted 269 00:13:41,880 --> 00:13:43,640 back last week. I'm not sure I've lost track, 270 00:13:44,360 --> 00:13:48,280 but but that, that was a bit of a different change in sentiment 271 00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:52,000 around that. But yeah, as I said, those close 272 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:54,320 ones, you look at the charts, they they look like a lithium 273 00:13:54,320 --> 00:13:57,280 nickel chart. It's just that long, bloody, 274 00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:01,680 steady, steady descent. Yeah, there's a bit in common 275 00:14:01,680 --> 00:14:05,200 with them as well, right. The the end users have a lot of 276 00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:08,600 overlaps between, between lithium, you know, EV demand if 277 00:14:08,600 --> 00:14:09,760 we're talking about that or anything. 278 00:14:09,760 --> 00:14:13,440 So it's not a massive surprise, even though there are different 279 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:17,360 supply side dynamics at play, you know, it's not. 280 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:20,000 Yeah, I'm not shocked to see that they're both in the in the 281 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:22,040 gutter at the moment and maybe we'll see them in time. 282 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:24,640 Both sort of ebb upwards at the same time as well. 283 00:14:24,640 --> 00:14:28,480 Well you think what Jane has got what, 8 and a bit percent of 284 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:30,160 liner, so it's a bit over half a bill. 285 00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:34,880 Twiggy's now got 60% of Yanja banner potential to go to 70% 286 00:14:34,880 --> 00:14:37,680 with another 20 mil. So the the magnets are going to 287 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:39,640 be fighting over rare. Earth magnets. 288 00:14:39,640 --> 00:14:40,640 Magnets. Yeah. 289 00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:43,560 Very good. Very good. 290 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:47,560 In fact, the yeah, the Twiggy 1 is interesting because what came 291 00:14:47,560 --> 00:14:51,320 with the Hastings deal were 20% of the shares in this company 292 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:54,200 called Neo Performance Materials, which is a a magnet 293 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:56,880 manufacturer, which is a really interesting business, one of the 294 00:14:56,880 --> 00:14:59,040 one of the few that exists ex ex China. 295 00:14:59,200 --> 00:15:01,360 Well, and that, but that was the wasn't the whole thing that 296 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:03,840 Hastings was going to. They wanted to, really couldn't. 297 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:06,360 Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so something's getting 298 00:15:06,360 --> 00:15:09,960 built or or I can rearros are the only thing that S WIC hasn't 299 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:13,240 drilled for. I could, I could like consider 300 00:15:13,240 --> 00:15:16,040 an underground like it's all surface stuff. 301 00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:17,640 Don't think there's any underground. 302 00:15:18,040 --> 00:15:20,320 What rarer? So out of that 17,000,000 drill 303 00:15:20,320 --> 00:15:24,200 meters probably getting closer to every time we say 17, it 304 00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:26,960 means we're getting closer to 18,000,001 slope closer to 305 00:15:27,000 --> 00:15:29,080 18,000,000. But I don't think they've done 306 00:15:29,080 --> 00:15:30,720 rare earths. Can you imagine if they started 307 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:32,920 drilling for rare earths? What, like talk about a 308 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:37,680 saturated market if Swick started finding rare earths 309 00:15:37,680 --> 00:15:41,080 underground? So flooded, oversupplied so. 310 00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:43,600 Any way to put? It an absolute foundation of 311 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:47,520 underground exploration drill and boys and mate bloody and the 312 00:15:47,520 --> 00:15:51,400 foundation of drill and belong beyond 2000 meters with the DPX 313 00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:53,600 team. So mate, 2000 meters, 2000 314 00:15:53,600 --> 00:16:00,320 meters mate just +2000. So just let your imagination run 315 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:02,480 wild. So mate, if you want a bloody 316 00:16:02,480 --> 00:16:06,040 drill on one of their 90 rigs, just get in touch with Swig or 317 00:16:06,040 --> 00:16:09,520 the Parenti team and mate go break some records. 318 00:16:09,520 --> 00:16:13,040 Go swig, go swig. Just on, just on rarest. 319 00:16:13,040 --> 00:16:15,920 Before we move on, Maddie, question for you JD. 320 00:16:16,160 --> 00:16:17,560 Do you think Clowners will raise money? 321 00:16:19,160 --> 00:16:23,880 So what I was tossing out is will they raise equity or will 322 00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:25,440 they get another sort of friendly package from the 323 00:16:25,440 --> 00:16:27,200 government? Will they look at something like 324 00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:30,960 a prepayment given their their sort of stranglehold in that 325 00:16:30,960 --> 00:16:32,800 market? Would they consider some form of 326 00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:35,120 debt? They sell a stake in the 327 00:16:35,120 --> 00:16:37,160 project. Would they sell a stake? 328 00:16:37,160 --> 00:16:40,360 Yeah. Be really getting into yourself 329 00:16:40,360 --> 00:16:42,880 in the long term if you're if you're thinking about it that 330 00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:46,920 way, everything's on the table. I think equity is the the route 331 00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:49,960 that they'll go down. And I, I kind of do think, you 332 00:16:49,960 --> 00:16:51,680 know, I had a skim through some of these. 333 00:16:52,760 --> 00:16:53,760 It's massive. It'd be a. 334 00:16:53,760 --> 00:16:56,640 Huge bloody God, imagine that fighting that ticket. 335 00:16:56,960 --> 00:17:00,000 Yeah, and it wouldn't even be massively dilutive. 336 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:02,120 Yeah, right. This is a $6.4 billion company, 337 00:17:02,120 --> 00:17:04,800 I think. They're it's 400 in 2020, I want 338 00:17:04,800 --> 00:17:07,079 to say. Yeah, I think that's the the 339 00:17:07,079 --> 00:17:09,480 route they end up going down. I mean, you have a quick skim 340 00:17:09,480 --> 00:17:11,839 through a lot of these research reports and we're all 341 00:17:11,839 --> 00:17:15,079 forecasting a big tick up in rare earth prices to come in 342 00:17:15,079 --> 00:17:17,560 very soon. And of course they are. 343 00:17:18,160 --> 00:17:20,760 Yeah, of course they are. Exactly. 344 00:17:20,760 --> 00:17:25,960 So I, yeah, I don't, I don't totally see it playing out that 345 00:17:25,960 --> 00:17:26,960 way. I just think that needs to 346 00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:29,680 happen way sooner than you kind of like. 347 00:17:29,680 --> 00:17:32,040 And you're just running, running a bit too. 348 00:17:32,360 --> 00:17:34,360 You're flying a bit too close to the sun, if you're, you're 349 00:17:34,360 --> 00:17:36,600 honest. Why not just pop up to the tune 350 00:17:36,600 --> 00:17:40,160 of a few $100 million? Top 20 shorter companies on a 351 00:17:40,160 --> 00:17:44,480 Sxi think I think that I think the reasons, yeah, combination, 352 00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:46,240 maybe the pairs trade, but more likely the funding. 353 00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:49,280 Yeah, 9% short interest right now in in Linus and I think a 354 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:51,880 few people are in anticipating that one and I mean a. 355 00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:56,080 Tie up with MP also, you know, if you if you agree a tie up, 356 00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:58,960 then there's an opportunity for a sort of interim facility to 357 00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:01,720 pop in there in the midst of the deal, which might tie tie any 358 00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:04,160 loose ends over until that deal completes too. 359 00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:07,920 Absolutely, although I think the the ratio is not not what it 360 00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:10,560 once was and Linus are a bit more put off at the moment on 361 00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:12,440 that front. Who do you think benefits more, 362 00:18:12,440 --> 00:18:15,080 an Australian company or AUS company amidst all of the 363 00:18:15,080 --> 00:18:19,520 geopolitical dynamics? Well, I mean, yeah, I do agree. 364 00:18:19,520 --> 00:18:23,720 I think they're both relatively OK at the moment. 365 00:18:23,720 --> 00:18:27,040 But you know, it's a, it's a, it's a bit of pill to swallow at 366 00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:30,000 an individual level. If you've been, you know, such a 367 00:18:30,000 --> 00:18:32,200 stronger market cap for so long and then you have to do the 368 00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:35,280 deal, the big deal at A, at a real markdown. 369 00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:37,800 There's there's another part that we didn't even get to and 370 00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:41,360 that's like the changing ore body at Mount Weld, which I've 371 00:18:41,360 --> 00:18:44,320 spoken to a bit in recent calls. Talking a lot about the heavies 372 00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:46,800 and these sorts of. Things they spin it in a, in a 373 00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:49,640 very positive way about having greater understanding of the, 374 00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:52,000 the, the bigger upsized mineral resource. 375 00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:55,120 But I, my, my layman's understanding is like a very 376 00:18:55,120 --> 00:18:56,560 high grade kind of weathered part. 377 00:18:57,040 --> 00:18:59,160 He's sort of depleting. And now they're getting to like 378 00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:02,480 a different kind of section with a lot more, a lot of various all 379 00:19:02,480 --> 00:19:04,800 types. And maybe the unit costs are 380 00:19:04,800 --> 00:19:06,120 going up as a result of some of that too. 381 00:19:06,280 --> 00:19:07,040 Yeah. You can. 382 00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:10,680 You can spin that positively. But it's all just free dig isn't 383 00:19:10,680 --> 00:19:13,120 it? Like the year I'll support. 384 00:19:13,120 --> 00:19:15,000 It's like then. They're definitely not mining 385 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:17,760 constrained, are they? Not mining constrained, but. 386 00:19:17,880 --> 00:19:19,680 Like the unit process cost of the. 387 00:19:20,120 --> 00:19:23,240 The the grade of the carbon a tight is is super highly 388 00:19:23,240 --> 00:19:25,320 enriched at the top. Yeah, you get this like 389 00:19:25,440 --> 00:19:28,640 weathered zone and then and then the grade tape is massively I 390 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:32,640 think, I think Fact Check this afterwards, but that you know 391 00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:34,720 they're they're getting to the lower grade part now. 392 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:36,920 So they did have the technical people on the half yearly call 393 00:19:36,920 --> 00:19:38,560 to to speak through that. Yeah. 394 00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:41,160 That that those sort of specific questions that were being. 395 00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:43,680 Asked which, if that's the case, then you know the relative value 396 00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:47,200 with MP makes complete sense and don't expect to, you know, be 397 00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:49,280 the be the the bigger company in that tie up. 398 00:19:50,440 --> 00:19:52,800 Time will tell. Right here's buddy, you want to 399 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:58,000 say on my just YouTube surfing check these bloody things out. 400 00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:01,800 This could be bloody talking about prices of rare earths 401 00:20:01,800 --> 00:20:03,840 rising. Have a watch it have a look at 402 00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:06,360 this. AI powered humanoid robots are 403 00:20:06,360 --> 00:20:09,800 officially here, and they're already being deployed at scale 404 00:20:10,680 --> 00:20:14,680 in Shenzhen, China, a city known for its rapid technological 405 00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:17,640 advancements. Humanoids powered by Deep Seek 406 00:20:17,840 --> 00:20:21,600 AI and Engine AI robotics are now assisting in government 407 00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:25,120 operations, public service, and even law enforcement. 408 00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:29,320 Meanwhile, 70 AI powered digital employees have been deployed to 409 00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:32,800 handle government paperwork, making decisions, interacting 410 00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:35,480 with humans, and correcting errors with astonishing 411 00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:38,800 accuracy. Engine AI Robotics is offering 412 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:43,840 the PM 01 at a starting price of just $13,700. 413 00:20:44,520 --> 00:20:50,720 Wow 13,700 bucks USI assume to replace humans doing shit that 414 00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:53,680 humans don't want to do. I'm getting one at my house for 415 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:58,200 for sure humanoid robots but like they. 416 00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:00,760 It's the bull case. Well, you're just thinking, so I 417 00:21:00,760 --> 00:21:06,200 I, I, I, I, I, I always reminded me of the.com bubble. 418 00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:09,760 Like it's just anything with IOI on it at the moment is just, but 419 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:12,520 it's like friggin also, it's like bloody lithium. 420 00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:15,720 It's that it's that many that abundant and it's all just a 421 00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:18,800 branding market share race to the bottom thing at the moment. 422 00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:21,440 And regarding that race to the bottom, I'll just show you 423 00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:23,800 another video of CNBC last night. 424 00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:26,920 Shortly after deep seek released its open source reasoning model, 425 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:31,200 open AI made a free version of its most advanced O3 mini 426 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:33,800 available from their products and features. 427 00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:37,400 Entire models, even from the likes of Google, Microsoft and 428 00:21:37,480 --> 00:21:41,240 XAI made available to users at no cost to them. 429 00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:45,200 So essentially a land grab amid. This rapidly commoditizing 430 00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:47,520 landscape. So you can see like you, you 431 00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:49,280 talk to anyone that's building AI stuff. 432 00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:54,080 It's all, it's like it's all open source central models. 433 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:55,720 It's all, they're all shared models. 434 00:21:55,720 --> 00:21:59,520 It's all, it just seems like a lot of branding front end 435 00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:02,520 changes and everything, but all lot the AI is there. 436 00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:06,840 So it's, but and it's like, what is it all going to be used for? 437 00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:13,080 So we've talked about data centres to death with the, you 438 00:22:13,080 --> 00:22:18,200 know, uranium to potentially power them, the copper wire and 439 00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:23,000 tin soldering bloody what else? All that chips, all the chips in 440 00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:25,320 it and everything. So that's, that's the power to 441 00:22:25,320 --> 00:22:27,160 power the IO. But then what's it going into? 442 00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:30,440 So you look at these like, if this is potentially one thing 443 00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:33,440 that could, we're looking at in the future that these humanoid 444 00:22:33,440 --> 00:22:37,120 robots are going to be frigging replacing all the mundane shit 445 00:22:37,120 --> 00:22:39,880 that we don't want to do and we essentially become redundant. 446 00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:46,040 I'll be the first one become redundant, but what goes into 447 00:22:46,040 --> 00:22:48,720 these friggin things can Can you imagine one of these in every 448 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:52,440 like in all the houses around the world eventually like 449 00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:55,120 manufacturing, like mining? Yeah, yeah, a whole bunch of 450 00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:58,000 applications could. Well, they're like the police 451 00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:00,000 for imagine taking, putting. These in robot. 452 00:23:00,600 --> 00:23:02,600 Well, that's what they're doing in in China. 453 00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:04,320 They're using it for law enforcement. 454 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:08,440 So you imagine you haven't got a person there that if you shoot a 455 00:23:08,440 --> 00:23:12,280 robot, who cares? Like, yeah, like it's like it 456 00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:16,760 totally changes the risk to putting humans in enforcement. 457 00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:18,960 Like going to be fucking intimidating. 458 00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:20,920 Now you're going up to a robot. You're like, what's this thing 459 00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:23,000 going to do to me? Like you can't reason with it. 460 00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:27,280 It'll just fuck, just knock you out with a titanium fist. 461 00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:32,960 But I thought, what goes into this, like the mining materials, 462 00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:37,160 if this is where AI is heading, like, how's it going to affect 463 00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:39,520 commodities? So if you look at what these 464 00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:43,320 things are made of aluminium alloys and titanium for the 465 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:44,920 body. So I'm not sure how much 466 00:23:45,720 --> 00:23:49,240 aluminium these will take compared to massive things of 467 00:23:49,240 --> 00:23:51,320 aluminium. So what that'll do for bauxite, 468 00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:53,520 aluminium and that, but like titanium. 469 00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:57,360 So that's like, you know, the Ilmenot and Rotol industries, 470 00:23:57,480 --> 00:23:59,720 that's that's where the titanium comes from. 471 00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:04,280 Shit load of internal wiring and chips, obviously copper for the 472 00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:07,640 wine, but then all these chips use the rare earths. 473 00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:12,080 So like NDPR, like gallium, cerium, that's all comes from 474 00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:15,240 monocytes. So that's great for rare earths, 475 00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:18,880 the power and charging. So they're all going to have a 476 00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:20,640 lithium ion battery, you would assume. 477 00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:23,880 So that's like this. That could be a rebound for 478 00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:27,000 lithium. All the motors, sensors, 479 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:30,720 actuators for the robotic limbs, that's all rare earth magnets, 480 00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:34,480 so NDPR mainly. But then you know, like the the 481 00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:37,480 heavy rare earths, the DYTB, that's what the temperature, 482 00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:39,600 temperature tolerance for the magnets. 483 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:41,880 So that's what gets added, added into those. 484 00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:46,040 So very, very interesting looking at that. 485 00:24:47,080 --> 00:24:50,120 You're always thinking right, what's what's the next bubble? 486 00:24:50,120 --> 00:24:52,240 What's the next thing to pop and what's the next thing we're not 487 00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:55,320 thinking about? Looking at that last night, it's 488 00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:58,320 like, fuck is this if that's already getting deployed in 489 00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:03,560 China, flat out I'm getting I'm 100% getting one to clean the 490 00:25:03,560 --> 00:25:07,240 ass and fucking cook me shit saved me getting Uber eats and 491 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:12,240 because I hate changing bed sheets, kids school lunches 492 00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:15,200 right the. Possibilities are endless. 493 00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:19,440 But yeah, it was fascinating, I thought. 494 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:23,200 And just just thinking of where this, the whole AI thing first 495 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:26,920 looks like a bubble, like not a bubble, the concept, but a 496 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:30,520 bubble of everyone trying to tack on using AI doing this. 497 00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:33,880 But it just looks like it's so it's just going to get market 498 00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:38,040 shared by obviously your deep sake, your Meta, you Google, 499 00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:41,120 your Microsoft, your Alphabet and Microsoft and that and 500 00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:44,200 they're just looking to do it for nothing at the moment. 501 00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:47,080 What are your boys thoughts on all that? 502 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:51,360 Tech Tech advances wonderfully bring productivity improvements 503 00:25:51,360 --> 00:25:54,360 and those productivity improvements might help us, you 504 00:25:54,360 --> 00:25:57,520 know, in the ways that we use AI to help us already or, or they 505 00:25:57,520 --> 00:25:58,720 can come in the physical world too. 506 00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:00,720 I'm excited to see some of the physical world development 507 00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:02,120 stimulus productivity improvements. 508 00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:04,640 It'll be a wonderful application of the tech advancements that 509 00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:09,560 we've had and a great thesis. If if the I'd love to know when 510 00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:12,760 the first electric vehicle was actually kind of made. 511 00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:15,000 What was the time between that and when you had kind of a 512 00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:17,720 lithium market shortage, right? Because these things take a lot 513 00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:19,480 of time to get real traction and adoption. 514 00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:22,360 It's not just sort of like subsidized kind of adoption and 515 00:26:22,360 --> 00:26:26,160 sometimes there's a, an app or a, you know, a specific use case 516 00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:28,120 of people like, fuck, I need it for that reason, next reason, 517 00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:30,000 And maybe it's a bit clunky until then, it gets a bit 518 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:32,040 better. But I'd love to know, you know, 519 00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:34,640 how long can you expect? But these are pretty new. 520 00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:37,040 I saw the first one when Tesla had their investor day last 521 00:26:37,040 --> 00:26:38,800 year. So it's not, they're not like 522 00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:41,880 it's not like they've been around for a long time yet. 523 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:44,920 But I'd love to to know what's the real time expectation before 524 00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:46,560 you might be able to see some constraints in some of these 525 00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:50,800 markets based on current supply? I think I, I keep going back to 526 00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:55,520 the nickel boom, but it's when, when you're physical the last 527 00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:58,840 one recent the boom that didn't really do anything. 528 00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:02,640 Except the short squeeze. No, no, just the just the hype 529 00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:04,880 around all these nickel mines getting developed, but the 530 00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:08,440 actual nickel price just did not go to where they were 531 00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:11,040 predicting. And that was all on a a thesis. 532 00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:13,960 This this global thesis that was out there is like, we need more 533 00:27:13,960 --> 00:27:17,320 nickel for long range batteries and that's it. 534 00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:21,720 Like the the actual, the demand wasn't there yet, but everyone 535 00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:24,360 started building mines because nickel was going to 16 bucks a 536 00:27:24,360 --> 00:27:26,520 pound. So with this sort of stuff, it's 537 00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:29,720 like we're interested to know once if there's just once the 538 00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:34,800 global thesis changes, if that does similar to what nickel did. 539 00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:37,720 And like prices start going up because everyone just wants it 540 00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:39,480 before they actually need it. Yeah. 541 00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:40,880 So. It's really interesting. 542 00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:46,200 I always think about this, this, this like prologue to a book 543 00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:48,560 that I read ages ago called, I think it's called Capital Cycles 544 00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:52,280 by Marathon Asset Management. And they spoke, they speak about 545 00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:55,240 capital cycles in heaps of different industries and they 546 00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:58,120 highlight that they're very pronounced in natural resources. 547 00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:02,440 They always think about it from two sides, demand and supply. 548 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,680 And they never put too much weight in the, the demand side 549 00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:08,880 because they, they find that very hard to quantify. 550 00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:10,600 They always look at the supply side. 551 00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:14,560 So that's much easier to, to put into numbers, not easy, but 552 00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:18,080 easier than the, the other side of, of the equation. 553 00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:21,800 And I mean, these guys are sort of deep value investors, but 554 00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:25,440 the, the stories that get spun and they give so many different 555 00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:27,600 examples about the, the demand side, what's going to be the 556 00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:28,680 next thing, what's going to blow off. 557 00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:31,480 And most of them don't, don't kind of eventuate. 558 00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:34,040 It's all they have. They just come about in a very 559 00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:37,280 different form to what you might have thought earlier and it's an 560 00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:38,520 interesting way to think about it. 561 00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:42,520 But kind of investing with that support of of the cost curve. 562 00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:46,920 And you know, when you're getting into say a commodity 563 00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:50,040 that has had very little CapEx sunk into it over a long period 564 00:28:50,040 --> 00:28:52,720 of time, then you've got a kind of stable foundation. 565 00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:56,120 You pick an asset in the the lower quartile or half of the 566 00:28:56,120 --> 00:28:58,000 cost curve going about it that way. 567 00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:02,280 And, you know, maybe somebody bits during the boom and they 568 00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:05,600 make 10 times their money in in half a year and they they make 569 00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:08,280 all the returns these guys would make over a number of years and 570 00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:11,040 they get there much quicker. Everyone's got their own sort of 571 00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:14,720 style of investing. But yeah, it's it's very hard to 572 00:29:14,720 --> 00:29:17,920 actually forecast where these demand actually comes into the 573 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:18,840 fore. When are you actually going to 574 00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:19,800 see it? When are we actually going to 575 00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:22,080 have these robots in our kitchen doing these things for us? 576 00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:24,960 But completely agree. It's endlessly like fascinating 577 00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:28,320 to watch these videos on YouTube to see the promos from Tesla or 578 00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:30,200 I think Boston Dynamics are another one that make this sort 579 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:32,840 of humanoid robot. It's so, so interesting, right? 580 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:35,520 Yeah, and it's like, and there's one thing predicting when the 581 00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:39,120 demands kind of come in, but it's the the equity hype. 582 00:29:39,560 --> 00:29:41,960 Yeah. In the lead up to it, if you you 583 00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:44,040 get. And nickel was the example, like 584 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:45,840 you could get on that train and get out. 585 00:29:45,840 --> 00:29:49,360 And nothing even happened to the underlying commodity price, 586 00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:51,720 except it went down afterwards. Yeah. 587 00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:54,040 So. Oh, that's the, I'll have a good 588 00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:55,160 punt. Yeah. 589 00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:57,160 How good is it? Who's going to be the first 590 00:29:57,160 --> 00:29:59,680 mover for humanoid robots in Australia, do you think? 591 00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:01,320 Not an Australian? Company. 592 00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:05,840 What about Quattro What what based on everything they've 593 00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:10,840 invented for underground mining and what what I just didn't come 594 00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:13,800 to Jeremy Palmer's the first person that come to my mind of 595 00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:18,200 who's going to be doing party. I'm sure, I'm sure burn Cutter 596 00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:20,000 likes and robots underground because. 597 00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:23,760 It'd be cheaper. Like they they always turn up 598 00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:27,320 for work. I reckon Quattro you're wanting 599 00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:29,600 people. Maybe if you want to work for 600 00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:31,760 Quattro, I'd get in quick because there's a good chance 601 00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:36,000 they're going to be first movers in humanoid robots and they're 602 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,400 going to replace bloody They're going to be building pace 603 00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:42,840 plates, pump stations, installing pace diversion valves 604 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,520 and everything with Quattro humanoid robots. 605 00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:47,360 If I'm a mining company, I can just hire these guys. 606 00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:53,200 Is that easy? You can APC gurus light surface 607 00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:57,720 underground engineer design construct mate they've patented 608 00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:01,280 bloody everything so I just. Best in the biz? 609 00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:03,840 Don't jazz. Don't let these humanoid robots 610 00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:07,920 distract you from your foundations of APC and inventing 611 00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:09,600 great things for underground mines. 612 00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:13,320 There isn't open pits and sorry surface constructions. 613 00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:17,280 As efficient as they get in the, you know, the engineering stuff 614 00:31:17,280 --> 00:31:20,280 mate, the APC sort of things and can see them just embracing the 615 00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:21,960 efficiency of of the humanoid robots. 616 00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:22,960 I'm excited. Go Quattro. 617 00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:26,600 Go Quattro. All right, they're back on. 618 00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:33,400 Just to close off, it's amazing the people that educate me, the 619 00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:35,800 tailings dam chat about Lakewood and that. 620 00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:37,840 So just some great people out there. 621 00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:41,000 Just think Maddie just needs a nudge in the right direction. 622 00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:44,160 So you can actually, when we're speculating of how long this is 623 00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:49,400 approved for this Lakewood TSF tailing storage facility, you 624 00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:54,080 can actually go on to D word Department of Water environment 625 00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,720 regulation or something. They just type in D word 626 00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:01,200 license, that's it, something D word license in the Google. 627 00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:04,000 And then you just type in Lakewood and you can find the 628 00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:08,880 actual licenses and approvals that have been granted for any 629 00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:12,760 sort of any tilings, any whatever relating to water and 630 00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:15,800 environment. So like here's the actual table 631 00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:20,920 showing that for Lakewood and we're talking about if it's five 632 00:32:20,920 --> 00:32:24,400 years. So it says from August 2029, TSF 633 00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:29,040 2 stage 5, which is the final stage approved under this works 634 00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:33,760 has a 7.3 month duration. So it goes out till a bit, you 635 00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:36,880 know, mid 2030. So it was five years. 636 00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:39,960 But, and I'll bring up the pictures here of like when we're 637 00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:44,040 talking about these, these lifts, where are these? 638 00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:45,240 Bloody hell, they're in there somewhere. 639 00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:49,440 So you can see how obviously each lift is built on top of the 640 00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:53,840 tails inside it and it starts concaving in. 641 00:32:53,840 --> 00:32:57,080 So, and you can only pour tailings in or tailings to him 642 00:32:57,080 --> 00:33:00,880 at a certain rate of rise. So that's why you can see the 643 00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:04,640 durations like, you know, TSF stage 120 months. 644 00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:07,440 By the time you get down to stage five, it's seven months. 645 00:33:07,920 --> 00:33:11,600 So the decision you can get further lifts approved because 646 00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:15,360 like the original TSF one, that's potentially going to 647 00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:18,120 stage 10 if they get it approved. 648 00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:23,120 But for each lift, it's a CapEx versus how much tiles you can 649 00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:25,960 put in. So the rough number I got tiled 650 00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:29,720 was about 2 bucks a tonne. So like if you got a 1,000,000 651 00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:34,240 tonne plan, it's going to cost you roughly 2 capitalized over 652 00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:37,200 different periods. 2,000,000 bucks a year in in tailings 653 00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:40,200 lifts. So but if you once you get to 654 00:33:40,200 --> 00:33:44,160 the high bid, it's going to cost the same amount per or more to 655 00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:47,320 add a lot less tilings to the future. 656 00:33:47,320 --> 00:33:49,520 So that's where the whole balance comes in. 657 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:53,280 But if you're charging a shit load for toltrating and you make 658 00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:55,680 it a better processing guard, you probably lift the tilings. 659 00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:58,480 Damn. So that was bloody fascinating 660 00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:00,320 stuff. Thank you to the astute 661 00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:05,600 educators out there. Awesome man go D work right. 662 00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:09,000 What's happening? So the I think we've talked 663 00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:12,120 about this Bob about are they going to leave Australia at all? 664 00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:14,520 But they're they're they're coming back in. 665 00:34:14,639 --> 00:34:17,600 Not big, but yeah, yeah, this is expanding. 666 00:34:17,679 --> 00:34:21,440 And like old Ashanti. They are indeed it it appears 667 00:34:21,880 --> 00:34:24,960 Maddie JD Angle got Ashanti. They've, they've come out today 668 00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:29,960 with mats of resources who have advertised that Anglo Gold 669 00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:33,960 Ashanti execute a $101 million deal to pick up the Lake Kerry 670 00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:36,120 gold project. Now there's a bit of mail on 671 00:34:36,120 --> 00:34:38,080 that on that headline, which I'll, I'll tease out. 672 00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:40,960 Anglo, we, like you said, we don't put the spotlight on them 673 00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:44,120 too much, but we, we, we should, I mean, they're a big global 674 00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:47,040 gold miner that doesn't even have an ASX listing anymore. 675 00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:50,679 But that's in, you know, the other reason we maybe haven't 676 00:34:50,679 --> 00:34:53,400 talked about them too much is because their deal activity in 677 00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:54,760 Australia has been sweet fuck all. 678 00:34:54,760 --> 00:35:00,080 And until today, really kind of it's it's it's emerged that that 679 00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:03,160 this deal that they're doing with with with MATSA, what 680 00:35:03,160 --> 00:35:04,760 they're going to do. It's an option agreement with a 681 00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:07,240 few conditions. And the crux of it is that angle 682 00:35:07,240 --> 00:35:10,360 gold Ashanti, they get the option to buy the Lake Kerry 683 00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:14,800 gold project for for 18 months. They can execute it within from 684 00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:16,960 the satisfaction of some conditions precedent. 685 00:35:17,120 --> 00:35:20,360 The only real upfront cash is like 500,000 dollars, 8,000,000 686 00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:23,920 bucks drips in so after the CPS are satisfied and the big chunky 687 00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:27,040 part only if Anglo exercises the option. 688 00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:29,960 The conditions I was talking about, they largely relate to 689 00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:31,800 roofers or consents or approvals. 690 00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:34,000 Nothing you really think will kill the deal but things you 691 00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:37,480 just got to get ticked. But because Anglo has 18 months 692 00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:40,080 to choose to pull the trigger or not, it sort of leaves some some 693 00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:43,640 ambiguity here. Should should Anglo exercise the 694 00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:50,760 option that will pay 1.875% of the in situ value of the 936,000 695 00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:54,760 oz gold resource at that time in cash? 696 00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:57,400 Let's say gold is four and a half $1000 and Angle will pay 697 00:35:57,440 --> 00:36:02,720 four and a half. 1000 * 1.875% * 936,000 equals roughly 698 00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:06,080 75,000,000 bucks. So they're they're effectively 699 00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:09,160 paying a royalty upfront similar. 700 00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:10,800 They're just, they're just breaking down the, the 701 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:13,240 calculation of how they get to the number, which, which is, 702 00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:15,920 which is an informative thing. Like they're, they're, they're 703 00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:20,280 kind of giving us the investors an, an opportunity to understand 704 00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:24,000 what is the value of an in situ oz near a, near a mill of a 705 00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:26,200 major. Well, in Anglo's case they're 706 00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:30,160 saying it's, you know, 1.875%. Or less than you thought. 707 00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:32,240 Well, I think, I think based on your royalty chat, the other 708 00:36:32,240 --> 00:36:35,400 way, it just shows like if they're paying 75 million based 709 00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:39,080 on that, yeah, imagine paying 75,000,000 for it and having a 710 00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:42,800 1.8% royalty attached to it. Yeah, like it just shows the 711 00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:44,440 value. Interesting lens of A. 712 00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:49,160 Royalty, yeah, the, the there's also about 20 million bucks. 713 00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:52,240 That is easy if there's more answers found, but I'm just 714 00:36:52,240 --> 00:36:54,880 going to kind of write that down to a very small number because 715 00:36:54,880 --> 00:36:58,000 it's deferred consideration that, you know, Anglo's in 716 00:36:58,000 --> 00:36:59,920 control of. So it's it's in the never, 717 00:36:59,920 --> 00:37:03,240 never. So I'll, I'll kind of put a 718 00:37:03,240 --> 00:37:04,280 picture in here. Here we have it. 719 00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:06,600 See Sunrise Dam, Matt. So they're, they're selling the 720 00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:08,120 red tenure there. They're keeping the blue. 721 00:37:08,120 --> 00:37:11,120 So there's a few sort of pits that that Matt just holding on 722 00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:12,520 to. They're selling all the red 723 00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:14,320 there. And you can see right there, 724 00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:16,920 it's close proximity to Sunrise, Sunrise Dam. 725 00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:20,440 That's a lot of ground. It's a lot of ground and the 726 00:37:20,440 --> 00:37:24,120 ground is actually important, which I'll I'll get to for for 727 00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:27,200 all intents and purposes, you know, they're getting a fair bit 728 00:37:27,200 --> 00:37:30,040 of regional tenure. I thought the context on Sunrise 729 00:37:30,040 --> 00:37:32,640 Dam is, is important because you know, when a, when a major 730 00:37:32,640 --> 00:37:35,480 finally acts on some regional consolidation, it's why why do 731 00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:37,040 they need the feed or what's going on here? 732 00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:40,920 Sunrise Dam produced 260,000 oz for Angler Gold last year, which 733 00:37:40,920 --> 00:37:43,000 was 10% of their total production. 734 00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:46,200 They they refer to it as a Tier 2 asset amongst their portfolio 735 00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:48,720 of tier one and two mines. So, you know, if context drops 736 00:37:48,720 --> 00:37:52,800 at tier one, this is at Tier 2. And there's a big focus for them 737 00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:55,280 lately has actually just been lifting the recovery at the 738 00:37:55,280 --> 00:37:56,960 mine. One of the initiatives that 739 00:37:56,960 --> 00:38:00,040 they've pulled the trigger on is that a concentrated Leech 740 00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:02,640 project late last year that's going to take them 12 months to 741 00:38:02,640 --> 00:38:04,760 complete. But again, they're they're 742 00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:07,960 hoping to keep lifting recoveries, which averaged 85% 743 00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:10,040 in 2024. They want to get another 3% 744 00:38:10,040 --> 00:38:12,960 uplift from this concentrated Leech project. 745 00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:15,600 The last thing to keep in mind is Sunrise Dam. 746 00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:19,120 It's a combination of low grade open pit and underground ore 747 00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:22,120 feeding a 4.1 million ton per annum bill there. 748 00:38:22,120 --> 00:38:26,200 I think 1/3 of the ore is coming from the open pit at 1.25g per 749 00:38:26,200 --> 00:38:30,680 ton and 2/3 is coming from the underground at 2.5g per ton. 750 00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:34,120 So, you know, if there's regional oz at at higher grade 751 00:38:34,120 --> 00:38:36,400 than that, you can see how there could be a, you know, a bit of a 752 00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:38,520 sugar hit for, for Anglo, especially at healthy gold 753 00:38:38,520 --> 00:38:41,800 prices and. I think it's got much left 754 00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:44,080 either Sunrise Dam underground, from what I hear. 755 00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:46,520 Yeah, I hear gay. I've heard less than two years. 756 00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:50,320 Yeah, they, they still have a reserve on it of of 1,000,000 oz 757 00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:52,760 and it's been 1,000,000 oz for, you know, years. 758 00:38:52,760 --> 00:38:55,720 But yeah, yeah, you know, you've got better contacts for me and 759 00:38:56,080 --> 00:39:00,440 what, what's there but the the. They're pretty deep at the 760 00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:02,760 moment. Yeah, I think it's a very 761 00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:05,880 lateral like I think, I don't know how deep it is, but I know 762 00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:08,600 it's just a rabbit wire, very lateral. 763 00:39:08,720 --> 00:39:10,160 Gotcha. There's two ozones they're 764 00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:12,440 pulling from underground ones carry another one I've forgotten 765 00:39:12,440 --> 00:39:17,280 the name of for now, but the. I won't, I'll, I'll caveat that. 766 00:39:17,320 --> 00:39:20,000 I've heard someone said, oh, look, it might finish up in two 767 00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:21,880 years, but I just said there's reserves there. 768 00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:25,600 It might be might finish up if they don't spend more capital to 769 00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:28,320 go to the rest of it. That's probably a better way to 770 00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:29,000 say it. Sorry. 771 00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:32,640 They, they, with those recoveries as well, keep in 772 00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:34,960 mind, so 85% the big focus on lifting recovery. 773 00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:37,520 So I do wonder if part of this deal as well is like, can you, 774 00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:40,400 can you get a better blend to get better recoveries by kind of 775 00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:42,280 mixing and stuff that Max has got here as well? 776 00:39:42,280 --> 00:39:45,080 Is that part of part of the, the, the rationale for this 777 00:39:45,080 --> 00:39:47,360 deal? And, and an interesting thing 778 00:39:47,360 --> 00:39:50,440 that popped up to me when I was looking at Anglo's reserves. 779 00:39:50,840 --> 00:39:53,120 There's actually, they've got this nearby satellite deposit, 780 00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:56,200 which is 3G per ton, which Anglo mostly owns. 781 00:39:56,200 --> 00:39:59,040 It's called butchers. Well, I've circled it here and 782 00:39:59,040 --> 00:40:01,720 you can see how close it is to, to Sunrise Dam. 783 00:40:01,720 --> 00:40:03,680 It's just on the other side of the lake there now. 784 00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:07,560 It's a 7030 JV with Northern Star of all companies And, and 785 00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:10,960 they just picked it up when by Saracen, it was Saracens back in 786 00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:13,400 the day. There's, there's not an enormous 787 00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:16,400 resource there like you know, it's like 320,000 oz at the 788 00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:18,720 moment, but it's higher grade than the current, you know, all 789 00:40:18,720 --> 00:40:22,080 that they're pulling from the. From from either the underground 790 00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:23,960 or open pit at the moment, but Butcher's well is all open 791 00:40:23,960 --> 00:40:26,760 pitable. So I kind of my first thoughts 792 00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:30,280 here were that it'd be interesting to see if this this 793 00:40:30,280 --> 00:40:32,560 option agreement with Matzo is actually a bit of leverage to 794 00:40:32,560 --> 00:40:35,440 get Northern Star to come to the party faster with Butcher. 795 00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:37,480 Well, if they were, I don't know, dragging their feet in the 796 00:40:37,480 --> 00:40:42,440 JV, not entirely sure, but I got some late mail before we started 797 00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:46,080 recording that. Part of the rationale involves 798 00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:49,200 Butcher's well here because the mats are tenure, which you saw 799 00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:53,080 before highlight. There's a, a, a huge part, part 800 00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:56,120 of that comes with a Causeway that kind of traverses across 801 00:40:56,120 --> 00:40:59,640 the lake. And for Anglo to get a new 802 00:40:59,640 --> 00:41:03,240 Causeway approved across the lake, it it, it, it need a 803 00:41:03,240 --> 00:41:05,880 federal approval process and it just would take them forever. 804 00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:08,400 They'd never be able to do it. So a huge part of the value of 805 00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:11,720 this, this fair for Anglo is actually just, you know, getting 806 00:41:11,720 --> 00:41:15,680 the ability to to utilise the Causeway that is part of that's 807 00:41:15,680 --> 00:41:18,520 his, that's his tenure here. It kind of unlocks that Butcher 808 00:41:18,520 --> 00:41:22,240 Well deposit, which they can actively feed into Sunrise Dam, 809 00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:24,680 you know? Maybe Petronas are going to 810 00:41:25,560 --> 00:41:27,520 disrupt the deal. It's still got the. 811 00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:29,640 You're in favour. Still got the on market 812 00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:32,320 takeover? Yeah, well, doesn't that look 813 00:41:32,440 --> 00:41:34,160 suspicious in hindsight? Hasn't. 814 00:41:34,200 --> 00:41:35,600 Hasn't sold a share or don't they? 815 00:41:35,720 --> 00:41:39,960 Yeah, no, especially when Max's stock is up like 40% at one 816 00:41:39,960 --> 00:41:43,680 point today. All of this is just like kind 817 00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:46,000 of, you know, contextual. But I think the theme, the theme 818 00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:48,080 is important because the dominant theme of the last six 819 00:41:48,080 --> 00:41:51,520 years in WA gold has has been of these major international gold 820 00:41:51,520 --> 00:41:53,280 miners. We've done fuck all except 821 00:41:53,280 --> 00:41:57,120 leave. Late last year we saw Gold 822 00:41:57,120 --> 00:42:00,040 Fields actually try to acquire Corolla, but they weren't 823 00:42:00,080 --> 00:42:01,440 successful. That was revealed in the 824 00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:04,920 information circular. And now Anglo has made a move 825 00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:08,080 for a satellite deposit. I'm hopeful that these, you 826 00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:10,560 know, international major gold miners will will be a bit more 827 00:42:10,560 --> 00:42:13,640 receptive to deal activity and and and and look proactively to 828 00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:16,960 to do do deals to feed their, you know, maybe hungry meals or 829 00:42:16,960 --> 00:42:19,800 displace and lower grade sort of all with higher grade stuff 830 00:42:19,800 --> 00:42:22,000 nearby, because that's that's really healthy for the junior 831 00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:24,520 gold market. And yeah, it just makes the 832 00:42:24,520 --> 00:42:27,440 investment rationale for for juniors that have a higher grade 833 00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:30,840 ounces in close proximity to meals a lot more a lot better if 834 00:42:30,840 --> 00:42:33,200 you're actually seeing the deal activity that's substantiate 835 00:42:33,880 --> 00:42:37,960 corporate outcome. Buddy, imagine, imagine if 836 00:42:37,960 --> 00:42:41,080 either of those two companies got active on M&A in Australia 837 00:42:41,800 --> 00:42:44,320 in the mid cap space. Jeez, that'd be exciting. 838 00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:47,640 Yeah, Gold fields take it over the Murchison. 839 00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:51,360 I can say it just take them all. Oh, I. 840 00:42:53,600 --> 00:42:55,960 Wouldn't hold my breath, but we'll see it's. 841 00:42:56,040 --> 00:43:02,480 Recorded right, buddy? Hold your breath in. 842 00:43:02,480 --> 00:43:04,840 And there's no I got nothing. Get your tickets. 843 00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:07,600 Get your tickets. Hold hold your breath to an 844 00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:09,960 underground operator's conference. 100 bucks off. 845 00:43:10,000 --> 00:43:11,960 Don't sleep on that one. But you're like getting paid to 846 00:43:11,960 --> 00:43:15,120 hold your breath pretty much. And our other great partners 847 00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:17,280 that keep the lights on. Mineral mining services, 848 00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:22,080 grounded, Sambit ground sport, CRE insurance, K drill, selfish 849 00:43:22,080 --> 00:43:25,400 contracting, Quattro project engineering, swig. 850 00:43:25,440 --> 00:43:28,560 See how I mixed them up there? Just keeping everyone guessing. 851 00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:33,600 Cross Boundary Energy and Urdu Money Monitor information 852 00:43:33,600 --> 00:43:36,080 contained in this episode of Money of Mine is of general 853 00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:38,400 nature only and does not take into account the objectives, 854 00:43:38,560 --> 00:43:41,760 financial situation or needs of any particular person. 855 00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:45,080 Before making any investment decision, you should consult 856 00:43:45,080 --> 00:43:48,160 with your financial advisor and consider how appropriate the 857 00:43:48,160 --> 00:43:51,840 advice is to your objectives, financial situation and needs.