1 00:00:00,400 --> 00:00:02,240 JD We were supposed to have an interview today. 2 00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:05,520 We were indeed. We were we were supposed to talk 3 00:00:05,520 --> 00:00:07,760 about me and Rez Moz. You've let me down. 4 00:00:07,760 --> 00:00:10,240 But hopefully we can reschedule talk later in the month, Moz. 5 00:00:10,480 --> 00:00:13,600 But until then, we're without content plan today. 6 00:00:13,960 --> 00:00:17,560 So I know you hate to be unprepared when it comes to 7 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:20,520 content. It irks you, doesn't it? 8 00:00:20,520 --> 00:00:23,160 Like you're you're. With most things, yeah. 9 00:00:23,200 --> 00:00:31,920 Not just content. You're uneasy about about a lack 10 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:34,520 of preparation and because because we've got nothing 11 00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:37,400 planned for the show, but we've got to put out the shows today. 12 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:41,160 So I thought we were just we're just going to make a few phone 13 00:00:41,160 --> 00:00:43,880 calls and see what happens. No agenda. 14 00:00:43,880 --> 00:00:47,000 I don't know we're calling them, but just going to call a few a 15 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:49,400 few friends, the show a few a few a few fund managers that 16 00:00:49,800 --> 00:00:51,440 have been on in the past several times. 17 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:53,680 I don't know if they're going to answer B, they don't know. 18 00:00:53,680 --> 00:00:56,720 I'm calling and see don't know if they really want to be 19 00:00:56,720 --> 00:00:58,560 recorded on a podcast when I do call them. 20 00:00:58,560 --> 00:01:00,640 So we're just going to see how this goes because this could 21 00:01:00,640 --> 00:01:03,920 either be excellent content or it could be awful content and. 22 00:01:04,239 --> 00:01:07,800 We're we're really becoming sort of like calling radio type type 23 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:09,640 program. The other way around is a bit 24 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:11,560 more desperate when we're calling people. 25 00:01:12,320 --> 00:01:13,840 No, I like it. We're going to, we're going to, 26 00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:16,160 by the sounds of it, call some much more switched on people 27 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:18,440 than us. And yeah, well, I've got a lot 28 00:01:18,440 --> 00:01:20,400 of questions to ask, right. We're coming into quarterly 29 00:01:20,400 --> 00:01:22,960 season. We're in a super volatile market 30 00:01:23,600 --> 00:01:26,080 for commodities. Things are bouncing up and down 31 00:01:26,520 --> 00:01:30,440 all sorts of directions as as same goes for the stocks. 32 00:01:30,440 --> 00:01:33,560 So, yeah, and and capital raisings, there's been actually 33 00:01:33,640 --> 00:01:35,160 a lot of capital raisings lately, so. 34 00:01:35,160 --> 00:01:36,640 Right, so you got prepared. I'm. 35 00:01:36,720 --> 00:01:37,880 I'm not even going in with questions. 36 00:01:37,880 --> 00:01:39,800 You've got questions. Anyway, we'll see what happens. 37 00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:43,120 Let's give it a go. First up, Rusty, see if he 38 00:01:43,120 --> 00:01:50,880 answers me. Hey mate. 39 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:54,160 Hey, hey mate. Sorry I'm coming through. 40 00:01:54,720 --> 00:01:57,280 But wire it in. Hey mate, can you hear me now? 41 00:01:57,280 --> 00:01:59,440 Yeah, go. Yeah, yeah, do. 42 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:01,240 You know what happened there, buddy? 43 00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:03,880 Oh, neither do I. I was, I was trying to connect. 44 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:09,080 You're going to hate this, but we, we had an interview planned 45 00:02:09,080 --> 00:02:14,080 today and, and that, that, that interview has cancelled. 46 00:02:14,080 --> 00:02:17,800 So we're going rogue and we're trying to make a show out of 47 00:02:17,880 --> 00:02:22,080 spontaneously calling a few insightful fundies like yourself 48 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:27,200 for a 5 minute little bit of off the cuff commentary, which does 49 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:29,360 mean that I, I do have recording equipment right now. 50 00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:31,080 You're not live. We can always cut things out. 51 00:02:31,120 --> 00:02:33,560 You can, you can say yes, you're interested or B, you're not 52 00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:35,040 interested. But yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 53 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:38,160 Yeah, OK, so he's going to try and sort of stitch something 54 00:02:38,200 --> 00:02:41,840 together on the fly. I'm always happy to help, mate, 55 00:02:42,080 --> 00:02:44,000 always happy to help. I'm just walked into my. 56 00:02:45,440 --> 00:02:48,360 That's the background noise. Yeah, but. 57 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:49,960 How good's that? What? 58 00:02:50,880 --> 00:02:53,040 Do you want to chat about? I want to know what is most 59 00:02:53,040 --> 00:02:54,320 interesting to you right now mate. 60 00:02:55,560 --> 00:03:01,000 Oi, big picture macro I reckon is the most fascinating dynamic 61 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:03,880 and maybe the hardest Riddle to read. 62 00:03:05,840 --> 00:03:08,560 Where is Trump at? Where is Elon at? 63 00:03:09,360 --> 00:03:14,600 And it's this amazing tension between a desire for pure 64 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:25,240 disruption, which is Elon versus pragmatic realism, you know, US 65 00:03:25,240 --> 00:03:32,200 fiscal and thereby, you know, implications for gold and other 66 00:03:32,200 --> 00:03:36,520 commodities, et cetera. So that to me is the most sort 67 00:03:36,520 --> 00:03:38,880 of interesting thing going on out there in the broader 68 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:45,040 landscape. And and happy to sort of tease 69 00:03:45,040 --> 00:03:47,160 that out a bit if, if you so desire. 70 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:49,360 I would love, I very much do desire mate. 71 00:03:50,440 --> 00:03:52,320 Rusty, I'm, I'm here as well mate. 72 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:55,360 I, I would love to, to flesh that one out with you. 73 00:03:55,360 --> 00:04:00,560 Just quickly on the, on the tariff aspect of, of that, we're 74 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:03,480 in that sort of quiet period. Do you, do you think the tariffs 75 00:04:03,480 --> 00:04:06,920 come back in a in a big way or we've kind of heard the last of 76 00:04:06,920 --> 00:04:09,880 that in in a kind of disruptive fashion? 77 00:04:10,280 --> 00:04:14,360 Yeah, of you and apologies guys, I'm just I'm in the vehicle, so 78 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:15,800 apologies. If the oh good. 79 00:04:15,840 --> 00:04:19,279 Is not ideal. Our view has always been that, 80 00:04:19,519 --> 00:04:24,400 that the tariffs were really an overstatement of where the US 81 00:04:24,400 --> 00:04:30,840 really could go. And so, yeah, I think, I think 82 00:04:30,840 --> 00:04:35,680 that's been borne out. And I think where we're at now 83 00:04:35,680 --> 00:04:40,080 is probably more likely where things truly land. 84 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:43,080 That means there will be some version of tariffs. 85 00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:45,640 But how they're applied, they'll be knowing they're as aggressive 86 00:04:45,800 --> 00:04:48,840 as the US postulated that they might be. 87 00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:51,720 They just can't do it. They're they're too constrained. 88 00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:55,920 And the big the big hell on that is the tenure. 89 00:04:56,400 --> 00:05:00,240 And, you know, we all saw what happened when they really tried 90 00:05:00,240 --> 00:05:04,080 to squeeze everyone at the same time. 91 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:09,560 And so, you know, the other sovereign nations can play that 92 00:05:09,560 --> 00:05:12,080 game too. And the squeeze point back to 93 00:05:12,080 --> 00:05:17,040 the US is clearly the tenure and they require foreign 94 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:23,040 jurisdictions to fund their this sort of fiscal situation. 95 00:05:23,040 --> 00:05:27,400 So the reality at the moment, like, how are we seeing it? 96 00:05:27,400 --> 00:05:29,760 It's fuck, it's, it's interesting and it's 97 00:05:29,760 --> 00:05:32,800 complicated. But, and, and all of this, you 98 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:35,440 know, is always just probabilistic estimations of 99 00:05:35,440 --> 00:05:38,920 future events. No one owns a truth or a crystal 100 00:05:38,920 --> 00:05:42,080 ball here. What does it look like really? 101 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:46,680 Well, Elon's done a lot of hard work on the disruption and that 102 00:05:46,680 --> 00:05:51,760 is all meaningful. But it will take time for Doge 103 00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:55,800 to play out because Trump is more of a realist and knows that 104 00:05:56,280 --> 00:06:01,320 that level of disruption is actually going to put you in a 105 00:06:01,320 --> 00:06:06,960 place of high risk because you and then Lynn Aldrin and other 106 00:06:06,960 --> 00:06:11,840 there's other very good macro brains out there who speak about 107 00:06:11,840 --> 00:06:14,360 this. Well, highlights that, that, 108 00:06:14,480 --> 00:06:17,640 that and you can actually create a sort of doom loop with that. 109 00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:21,000 You can disrupt economic growth so much and tax receipts so 110 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:24,440 much, actually worsen your fiscal situation even through 111 00:06:24,920 --> 00:06:28,720 sort of austerity and and you know, efficiency at the at the 112 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:32,440 governance level. So I think that works important, 113 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:33,840 but it will take time to implement. 114 00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:37,240 And I think where Trump is more pragmatically landing is no, no, 115 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:39,960 I'm going to spend my way out of this in many ways. 116 00:06:40,760 --> 00:06:44,520 I'm going to I'm going to come to the efficiency at governance 117 00:06:44,760 --> 00:06:48,720 over time. I've exposed now the truth of 118 00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:53,560 things for one of a better word. We can now come at that over 119 00:06:53,560 --> 00:06:58,840 time and with AI, and we will profligate still. 120 00:06:58,840 --> 00:07:00,680 We will still spend more than we have. 121 00:07:01,200 --> 00:07:07,120 We will look to financial repression to reduce the debt, 122 00:07:07,520 --> 00:07:11,160 which is effectively tolerating a higher rate of inflation, 123 00:07:12,280 --> 00:07:16,200 pushing hard for a lower cost of capital, which is clearly doing 124 00:07:16,680 --> 00:07:23,120 with how he speaks to and of the Federal Reserve Chair. 125 00:07:24,160 --> 00:07:25,960 And so and but you can never admit this. 126 00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:28,640 And so I think the most likely part is that sort of financial 127 00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:32,720 repression and the safety valve on that, right where that is a 128 00:07:32,720 --> 00:07:37,760 dangerous place is if inflation goes to like 5 or 6%, that's 129 00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:40,560 kind of OK. Goldilocks is probably more like 130 00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:44,320 4 cost of capital two. But if it's five or six, then it 131 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:47,200 can then run away to like 810. You know, suddenly you might 132 00:07:47,200 --> 00:07:49,400 have some hyperinflation, then you got a real problem. 133 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:55,720 I and again, this is guesswork, so please, I hope the listeners 134 00:07:55,720 --> 00:07:57,000 don't throw too many stones at me. 135 00:07:59,400 --> 00:08:07,960 You can then use, you know, get your get your efficiency 136 00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:13,440 dividend through ongoing reform of governance and waste and 137 00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:18,600 fraud, etcetera, implementation of AI to governance and more 138 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:22,840 broadly implementation of AI across both the public and 139 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:25,640 private sector. And that implementation then 140 00:08:25,640 --> 00:08:32,159 brings you efficiencies and so you get productivity growth as 141 00:08:32,159 --> 00:08:37,559 the natural brake Tapper against any runaway inflation. 142 00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:39,880 Does that make sense? I'd love to see that. 143 00:08:39,919 --> 00:08:42,120 I'd love to. I'd love to see the, Yeah, the 144 00:08:42,360 --> 00:08:45,680 the the government spend reduced from productivity gains in the 145 00:08:45,680 --> 00:08:46,760 government sector. My God. 146 00:08:47,400 --> 00:08:50,960 Yes, but it has to happen. It can't happen all at once, 147 00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:53,240 right? And there's some great pieces 148 00:08:53,240 --> 00:08:55,920 out there on this, like if you do it all at once, which is 149 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:58,600 Elon's natural place, right? That dude just does not fuck 150 00:08:58,600 --> 00:09:01,560 around. He's like problem solution. 151 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:05,600 Good. He, he is the ultimate 152 00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:10,840 disruptor, which has an enormous amount of value to all of us 153 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:14,880 across, you know, Western society and then beyond. 154 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:17,840 But there is a pragmatic reality to that. 155 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:20,720 The pace of change and the level of disruption. 156 00:09:20,720 --> 00:09:23,880 When you're talking about such fundamental things as 157 00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:28,400 governance, there are natural realities to how quickly you can 158 00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:33,080 adopt that. And my sense is perhaps Trump is 159 00:09:33,080 --> 00:09:36,160 a lot smarter than he looks. And I, you know, I've wrestled 160 00:09:36,160 --> 00:09:38,440 with this over the last few weeks even like being kind of 161 00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:41,520 disappointed at moments where I'm like, oh, fuck, he 162 00:09:41,520 --> 00:09:44,040 represented so much. Now he's not delivering. 163 00:09:44,360 --> 00:09:47,600 You know, he's not supposed to be expansionary, but he's going 164 00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:51,320 after Iran. The big beautiful bill is 165 00:09:51,320 --> 00:09:53,560 anything but beautiful. It's fucking big. 166 00:09:53,560 --> 00:09:55,800 But it's, you know, it's just more of the same. 167 00:09:56,400 --> 00:10:00,000 But then on reflection, I sort of look at that and I'm like, is 168 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:05,520 he kind of the man for the moment, which is an awkwardness. 169 00:10:06,160 --> 00:10:08,400 There's an inherent awkwardness in that because there's so much 170 00:10:08,400 --> 00:10:12,640 to dislike about a lot of it. But is that more the pragmatic 171 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:15,080 needle threading that needs to happen? 172 00:10:15,480 --> 00:10:18,640 And if that environment is the environment we are most likely 173 00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:20,880 to get and it and it, you know, again, right, this is all just 174 00:10:20,880 --> 00:10:23,000 probabilistic estimations of future events. 175 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:28,560 If that is the most likely path we walk, then that inflationary 176 00:10:28,560 --> 00:10:32,600 environment should by and large be very healthy for capital 177 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:36,400 flows into commodities. Now, that's a great thing, 178 00:10:36,400 --> 00:10:41,840 particularly for gold. Where it gets more complicated 179 00:10:41,840 --> 00:10:46,160 again though, in commodities is, you know, in the here and now. 180 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:49,720 What does the real world demand picture look like? 181 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:53,560 And it's a bit soggy. You know, tariffs are still a 182 00:10:53,560 --> 00:10:57,360 thing. They are coming, They will 183 00:10:57,720 --> 00:10:59,800 dampen some level of consumption. 184 00:10:59,800 --> 00:11:02,480 They're not going to be as catastrophic as previously 185 00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:05,800 prognos, that's for sure. But they will be somewhat 186 00:11:05,800 --> 00:11:09,160 disruptive. And you know, the reality for 187 00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:13,360 things like steel and steel derivatives is that China has 188 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:16,840 had a property market implosion. It's occurred over three or four 189 00:11:16,840 --> 00:11:21,360 years and all of that steel that no longer gets consumed in that 190 00:11:21,360 --> 00:11:25,800 sector has then been exported in, you know, the overcapacity 191 00:11:25,800 --> 00:11:30,840 of of goods production. Now you know, tariffs will be 192 00:11:30,840 --> 00:11:34,040 disruptive to that. So my sense is that in the very, 193 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:38,000 very short term, you still want to be a little bit cautious. 194 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:42,160 And I know like today's market said anything but that today's 195 00:11:42,160 --> 00:11:46,120 market is like Nah, Nah, fiscal flow they're on by commodities 196 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:50,280 because they're under ride. It may be that because commodity 197 00:11:50,720 --> 00:11:55,000 producers are on such shitty multiples already, maybe the 198 00:11:55,000 --> 00:11:58,240 sector can re rate even in the face of sort of, you know, 199 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:01,720 average commodity pricing environment for six or nine 200 00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:05,800 months, while China's a little bit soggy and still getting its 201 00:12:05,800 --> 00:12:10,680 policy setting sorted because it's such an under owned space. 202 00:12:10,920 --> 00:12:13,800 I think, you know, day like today sort of shows that that 203 00:12:13,800 --> 00:12:17,240 you can have, you know, big ripping rallies in lithium and 204 00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:20,120 metco. Nothing fundamental to, you 205 00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:23,520 know, last night changed the environment for producing 206 00:12:23,520 --> 00:12:27,160 lithium or met coal. These are just, you know, 207 00:12:27,360 --> 00:12:29,960 financial flows and and short covering in the light. 208 00:12:29,960 --> 00:12:31,440 But they but you know, they matter. 209 00:12:31,680 --> 00:12:35,600 So what am I saying with all of that waffle? 210 00:12:37,360 --> 00:12:41,720 I think the real world demand for the mods in a broad sense is 211 00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:45,640 still tricky. It's still you're going to want 212 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:49,000 to be commodity selective and and very much stock selective. 213 00:12:49,320 --> 00:12:52,480 But there is lots of value down the curve and we've seen lots of 214 00:12:52,480 --> 00:12:55,040 takeouts recently. You know, we've had new world 215 00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:58,960 and Xanadu both bid for now books recently. 216 00:12:58,960 --> 00:13:00,600 I think Jupiter gets to be there. 217 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:03,480 There are these obscure ones that you know are getting 218 00:13:03,480 --> 00:13:05,640 swallowed. And so there's lots of value 219 00:13:05,640 --> 00:13:08,560 down the curve still. So you still can hunt, but hunt 220 00:13:08,560 --> 00:13:11,920 intelligently. It's not a, you know, shotgun 221 00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:15,360 type of broach float all boats type of environment, but the 222 00:13:15,360 --> 00:13:18,000 broader macro setting I think is good. 223 00:13:18,080 --> 00:13:22,320 I think a lower USD will be good ultimately for emerging markets 224 00:13:22,320 --> 00:13:24,040 and lowering their cost of capital. 225 00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:28,800 And that will eventually flow into what is most important, 226 00:13:28,800 --> 00:13:31,640 which is that real world demand for commodities. 227 00:13:32,040 --> 00:13:34,360 And at the same time, you know, with that sort of maybe 12 228 00:13:34,360 --> 00:13:37,280 months view, it should give China time to get their policy 229 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:42,120 sitting better to actually, you know, soak up commodity demand. 230 00:13:42,120 --> 00:13:46,680 So we are like mid long term remain very constructive gab cow 231 00:13:46,680 --> 00:13:48,640 do great work on this. There's still a billion odd 232 00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:51,440 people to pull out of poverty in Southeast Asia. 233 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:54,640 There's so many great reasons to like Southeast Asia and the 234 00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:58,840 supply commodities into that dynamic. 235 00:13:59,480 --> 00:14:03,240 In the short, short term though, there is some choppy water still 236 00:14:03,240 --> 00:14:08,120 to navigate. And I guess the one frustration 237 00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:11,760 I've got is like I actually thought the sell off in Feb, I 238 00:14:11,760 --> 00:14:15,080 think it was, was was really healthy and for us to see lots 239 00:14:15,080 --> 00:14:20,200 of flow of capital into commodes, maybe we needed to see 240 00:14:20,640 --> 00:14:24,000 that sell off across that concentrated US and concentrated 241 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:27,760 tech space. Maybe we don't maybe there's 242 00:14:27,760 --> 00:14:31,280 enough capital out there to still have that space buoyant 243 00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:34,800 and, and see, you know, what is ultimately probably the most 244 00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:38,640 underrated asset class globally being materials and energy. 245 00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:40,960 Catch a bid. I, I, I don't know. 246 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:45,920 My, my sense is I'd rather see some of that capital blow off in 247 00:14:45,920 --> 00:14:48,760 US and tech and then make its way across. 248 00:14:48,960 --> 00:14:52,040 So, so I think ultimately, again, short term, but could 249 00:14:52,040 --> 00:14:57,240 that run in US tech and, and stuff that's kind of a little 250 00:14:57,240 --> 00:15:03,840 bit unhelpful because that that that provides sort of bigger 251 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:07,440 picture market risk, You know, you could easily have the Dow 252 00:15:07,680 --> 00:15:10,640 pull back again. Just just one quick one to add 253 00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:12,600 into that, Rusty. When, when you're thinking in 254 00:15:12,600 --> 00:15:16,440 regards of being fully invested or with a bit of cash on the 255 00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:20,440 side or or hedges in place, how, how do you take that everything 256 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:22,600 you said there and yeah, and paste in the portfolio. 257 00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:26,240 Great, great question. And are we walking the walk is, 258 00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:28,680 is really the reality of that question as well. 259 00:15:29,560 --> 00:15:34,000 So we went to the lowest weight cash I think I've had in 13 260 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:36,320 years. We went to basically 0 weight 261 00:15:36,400 --> 00:15:42,360 cash in in Feb with a view that things that were already cheap 262 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:47,000 were just suddenly getting faciled and the this 263 00:15:47,000 --> 00:15:51,560 hyperventilation around tariffs. Ultimately we couldn't see how 264 00:15:51,560 --> 00:15:54,760 the how the US could affect anything like what they were 265 00:15:54,760 --> 00:15:58,480 sort of postulating. And I think we got that call 266 00:15:58,480 --> 00:16:01,680 correct. Since then, obviously we've had 267 00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:04,480 things move, move up, we've had a few things taken out. 268 00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:10,480 So we've moved to, I would say we're sitting around 15% cash 269 00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:16,680 waiting at the moment. And yeah, again, just hunting, 270 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:21,080 hunting opportunities very much with the rifle, not the shotgun. 271 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:26,440 We expect fully that some of our small caps will either be taken 272 00:16:26,440 --> 00:16:28,960 out or rewrited if there's liquidity through those 273 00:16:28,960 --> 00:16:31,280 processes. And yeah, will naturally take a 274 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:35,360 bit along the journey. Maybe a bias at the moment 275 00:16:35,360 --> 00:16:39,920 slightly towards harvesting a few things and adding a bit more 276 00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:43,200 cash. But you know, yeah, we're pretty 277 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:44,920 comfortable around that sort of waiting. 278 00:16:44,920 --> 00:16:49,480 Maybe it's 15 to 25% would be a healthy place to be. 279 00:16:49,680 --> 00:16:51,800 You know, if everything runs away, you're still going to 280 00:16:51,880 --> 00:16:56,200 participate in that. And if we do get a bit of AUS 281 00:16:56,200 --> 00:16:59,880 correction, then then then amazing. 282 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:02,960 You know, you're gonna get a chance to go shopping again. 283 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:07,240 So yeah, well, that's that. Is that us having our cake and 284 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:08,680 eating it too? Maybe, I don't know. 285 00:17:09,079 --> 00:17:11,720 That's great mate. I I get that I've interrupted 286 00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:14,040 today, so I'll let you go after this last one from me. 287 00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:16,599 Yeah, no worries. Where can you still find value? 288 00:17:16,599 --> 00:17:18,240 Like where are you looking for value right now? 289 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:22,000 If it's. Yeah, yeah, you gotta go sift 290 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:25,440 through a lot of shit. As you guys know, we we love our 291 00:17:25,440 --> 00:17:30,720 data and we love using AI. So that's a big part of our 292 00:17:30,720 --> 00:17:33,760 investment process, an increasingly large part of our 293 00:17:33,760 --> 00:17:36,160 investment process. You still got to go then do the 294 00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:39,360 human work on the back of the filtration through the data. 295 00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:43,760 And and it's kind of sporadic where we're finding it like 296 00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:46,880 obscure places like I would, I would argue, think outside the 297 00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:47,680 square. Look at something like a 298 00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:53,040 Jupiter, you know, that is just such a screaming, the obvious 299 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:55,960 thing to get taken out. And if you're wrong, you're 300 00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:57,880 going to get paid and ask me while you wait. 301 00:17:58,320 --> 00:18:02,760 So yeah, I couldn't sort of point to just some like obvious 302 00:18:02,760 --> 00:18:10,040 sector, but yeah, that's sort of that's, you know, yeah, hunting. 303 00:18:10,040 --> 00:18:12,160 You got to go hunt. You got to go look under rocks. 304 00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:15,400 Others aren't. And yeah, that's probably just a 305 00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:16,720 name that sort of represents that. 306 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:20,320 If I if I give you one example. We could, really. 307 00:18:20,320 --> 00:18:22,520 Like that phrase? Look under rock's. 308 00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:24,680 Others aren't. Yeah, awesome. 309 00:18:25,000 --> 00:18:27,320 Thanks. No problem, boys. 310 00:18:27,320 --> 00:18:28,800 Thanks for the call. Appreciate it. 311 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:30,320 Way over to you for a proper catch up. 312 00:18:30,760 --> 00:18:33,720 Let's let's do that. I'm away next week with the 313 00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:35,360 family but let's do it on the on the way back. 314 00:18:35,720 --> 00:18:36,760 Awesome mate. Awesome. 315 00:18:36,760 --> 00:18:38,480 OK, have a good day mate. Too mate. 316 00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:39,600 Cheers. Yeah, love you. 317 00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:41,840 Bye. What a legend. 318 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:45,480 That's funny, so good. Sorry money minus for the hiccup 319 00:18:45,480 --> 00:18:47,440 in in audio at the start there. I thought I was connected by 320 00:18:47,440 --> 00:18:51,600 Bluetooth, but I wasn't and then I had to just get Ausb cord 321 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:54,240 while Rusty was still talking to to hook him up properly. 322 00:18:54,560 --> 00:18:57,320 An absolute legend. Every time he talks about, you 323 00:18:57,320 --> 00:19:00,480 know, getting a bit futuristic. You know what I think of mate? 324 00:19:00,520 --> 00:19:05,880 I think of the futurism embraced by Derek Heard at Sandy Ground. 325 00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:07,760 Support I. Was thinking of the same thing 326 00:19:07,760 --> 00:19:08,960 mate. Mate, he he is. 327 00:19:09,640 --> 00:19:13,200 In fact, I think he actually made and designed this app for 328 00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:15,080 Sandy down ground support himself. 329 00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:16,200 I'll, I'll just let him talk about it. 330 00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:18,920 You've tried your hand at app development. 331 00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:21,200 Yes. Tell us a bit about that 332 00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:23,000 journey. Yeah, that was pretty exciting 333 00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:25,440 actually. And it's really taken off in the 334 00:19:25,440 --> 00:19:27,240 past few months, actually the app development. 335 00:19:27,240 --> 00:19:31,280 So my vision was always to have it as a customer engagement 336 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:34,160 tool. So not just simple data sheets, 337 00:19:34,160 --> 00:19:36,960 you know, on a catalog, you know, tools that customers can 338 00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:41,520 use, reference materials. And so the app these days, you 339 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:43,760 know, has all the data sheets, the technical data sheets, 340 00:19:43,760 --> 00:19:45,320 safety data sheets of the product. 341 00:19:45,800 --> 00:19:48,360 But it's got all these things. If you want to do a resin 342 00:19:48,360 --> 00:19:52,200 encapsulation calculation, what size cartridges should use in in 343 00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:54,360 the hole from installation, it's got that capability. 344 00:19:54,360 --> 00:19:57,320 If you're designing a mesh sheet to assert a certain opening, 345 00:19:57,320 --> 00:20:00,200 you've got that capability. Pull test capabilities, 346 00:20:00,200 --> 00:20:03,800 conference papers, news events, you know, featured products. 347 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:05,840 So it's, it's quite an interactive tool. 348 00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:08,040 But yeah, it's been a bit of a passion for mine for probably, 349 00:20:08,040 --> 00:20:10,680 you know, five years. Downloading it right now JD. 350 00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:13,120 App Store or Google Play, it's all there. 351 00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:16,000 Get on board. Go, Derek. 352 00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:18,280 Go Sandy. OK, I'm going to try. 353 00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:22,800 I'm going to try Dan Porter. Now let's go not. 354 00:20:25,800 --> 00:20:28,280 Too bad I'm literally just sat down boarding a flight. 355 00:20:29,120 --> 00:20:30,480 Oh really? Where are you? 356 00:20:30,480 --> 00:20:32,520 Where are you flying to? I'm with JD, by the way, if 357 00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:34,400 you're wondering whose other voice is around. 358 00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:37,160 Hey, Dan, how are you? Going cool good mate, how are 359 00:20:37,160 --> 00:20:38,280 you? Yeah, going well. 360 00:20:38,280 --> 00:20:42,240 Where are you headed mate? I'm just taking off from Sydney, 361 00:20:42,400 --> 00:20:44,960 heading back to Brisbane. It's probably so. 362 00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:46,400 Probably not a good time to chat then. 363 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:51,760 You know, there's there, there have been better times. 364 00:20:52,360 --> 00:20:55,880 No, that's right. Are you guys maybe free tomorrow 365 00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:59,360 morning, something like that? Yeah, mate, I yeah, let's chat 366 00:20:59,360 --> 00:21:00,120 then. That works. 367 00:21:00,120 --> 00:21:02,400 I was, I was just calling because we don't have a show 368 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:04,040 today. So we're just like calling up a 369 00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:07,120 bunch of random phone managers to get like a two second, two 370 00:21:07,120 --> 00:21:11,240 second, well, one minute view that maybe they have that they'd 371 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:13,240 be willing to just share off the cuff. 372 00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:15,560 So if you're on the plane and you've, you've just got 373 00:21:15,560 --> 00:21:18,560 something on your mind that you want to you want to hash out and 374 00:21:18,560 --> 00:21:20,600 by all means, feel free to air it out right now. 375 00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:21,920 What's just anything or? Yeah. 376 00:21:21,920 --> 00:21:23,680 What's on your mind markets related right now? 377 00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:25,480 What's what's most engrossing to you? 378 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:31,640 Where do these coal markets bottom out? 379 00:21:31,640 --> 00:21:37,200 I reckon, yeah, you're seeing a lot of blood in the streets now. 380 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:41,240 Like we said, Boeing in massive strife. 381 00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:46,200 The bigger guys I know haven't really started to lay people off 382 00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:50,560 yet, but they're starting to. You've seen a reasonable amount 383 00:21:50,560 --> 00:21:52,680 of product coming out of the market as well, like Calm wars 384 00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:57,920 offline and what else has been a few other minds up. 385 00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:03,240 I guess old bones mines are offline, but all the Anglo stuff 386 00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:05,320 offline as well. So there's been capacity coming 387 00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:08,960 into the market. So we must be we must be getting 388 00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:12,640 close. But is it just going to drag on 389 00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:14,680 the bottom here? And if it drags on the bottom, 390 00:22:15,360 --> 00:22:17,160 who's in? Who's got the most balance sheet 391 00:22:17,160 --> 00:22:20,120 risk? You know what's Coronado going 392 00:22:20,120 --> 00:22:22,760 to do there in strife? Looks. 393 00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:25,440 Bad looks bad. Yeah, yeah. 394 00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:31,080 So usually, usually these things don't last too long. 395 00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:33,040 But if you had another four or five months of this, which I 396 00:22:33,040 --> 00:22:36,760 think we probably will, then a lot of these bigger guys could 397 00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:39,720 be start to get into big bit of trouble too, like your 398 00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:43,720 Whitehavens, Sam Moores and those types of guys. 399 00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,840 What what do you think of the the valuations looking across at 400 00:22:46,840 --> 00:22:52,920 at the moment? Good question. 401 00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:56,720 Some like some of them are ridiculously like. 402 00:22:56,720 --> 00:22:58,760 Some of them are factoring in worst case scenarios right? 403 00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:01,840 And I can say why. But then some of them, like the 404 00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:06,640 Whitehavens, seem to be still a bit punchy, I would say, for 405 00:23:06,640 --> 00:23:07,960 where coal prices are at the minute. 406 00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:12,760 Yeah, yeah. Yeah, there you go. 407 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:14,280 All right, mate, that's a wicked thought too. 408 00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:15,480 Cool. That's that's great. 409 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:16,880 I can. I can hear the the flight 410 00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:18,680 attendant in the background. So I yeah, yeah, yeah. 411 00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:20,800 I should really let you turn your phone up before she tells 412 00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:21,600 you to turn your. Phone up. 413 00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:23,400 Yeah. Yeah, exactly. 414 00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:24,160 Exactly. No cheers boys. 415 00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:25,640 Thanks mate. You don't mind if I use that 416 00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:26,640 audio? That's OK. 417 00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:27,720 Cool. Yeah, yeah. 418 00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:28,560 Go for it. Yeah, go for it. 419 00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:29,120 Yeah. Cheers, mate. 420 00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:30,000 Thanks. Thanks, Dan. 421 00:23:30,080 --> 00:23:30,240 Bye. Bye. 422 00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:32,440 Thanks Dan. I love his. 423 00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:35,160 I love his QLD patriotism. Like the first thing on his mind 424 00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:37,360 is coal. He just, he lives, breathes. 425 00:23:37,360 --> 00:23:40,400 Feels the basin. Yeah, love his insight. 426 00:23:40,400 --> 00:23:42,040 So it's it's a really interesting point he makes. 427 00:23:42,360 --> 00:23:45,040 Yeah, super, super beaten up. And I couldn't help but think, 428 00:23:45,040 --> 00:23:47,200 you know, when Dan starts talking about these, these sorts 429 00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:50,920 of players and the sort of commodity, I think of energy, I 430 00:23:50,920 --> 00:23:54,840 think of power and the the next logical step is cross boundary 431 00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:56,760 energy. Cross boundary energy are you? 432 00:23:56,760 --> 00:23:59,400 On the same page with me here. I'm I'm 100% on the same page 433 00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:01,960 with you. In fact I feel energized talking 434 00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:04,880 about that mate, just like a mine site would feel energized 435 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:09,560 with reliable power from like hybrid battery energy storage 436 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:11,520 systems. Be it be it solar, be it wind, 437 00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:15,240 be it hybrid with with base load power all together mate. 438 00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:18,400 That is, that is a solution that cross boundary energy implement 439 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:20,200 all across the. Globe mate, they, they really do 440 00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:21,960 it all. I, I felt that same sort of 441 00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:25,000 level of energy level of power after we caught up with the main 442 00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:27,400 man himself, Tim Taylor just last week. 443 00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:29,480 And you know, it goes beyond what you just said. 444 00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:33,400 It's not just reliable power, it's not just hybrid solutions. 445 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:35,720 It's them looking after the bills for you, right. 446 00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:38,960 They can take the CapEx off, make it an OpEx type thing that 447 00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:42,120 can really get creative and find the solution that you need to to 448 00:24:42,120 --> 00:24:44,960 work for your mind site to work for your project when you're 449 00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:46,520 getting that mine up and running. 450 00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:49,400 So look no further cross boundary energy for all your 451 00:24:49,400 --> 00:24:52,400 energy and power solutions. Get in touch with Tim Taylor. 452 00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:54,880 OK, Next up, mate, I'm going to try Headley with up. 453 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:10,600 No bites from Headley. All right, Who's next on the 454 00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:12,880 hit? List keep scrolling. 455 00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:17,480 I'm going to try Tom Morwick. 7:00 AM and Chairman. 456 00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:27,280 Yeah, it says online. Morning, Trav. 457 00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:29,520 Hi mate. I'm with JD, by the way, just in 458 00:25:29,520 --> 00:25:30,920 case you're surprised. Hey mate, how are you? 459 00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:34,320 Just, we're just, we're just busy reading your book, of 460 00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:37,480 course, at all hours. Rocks, rocks, fossils, 461 00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:40,120 formations through time. In case you, in case you didn't 462 00:25:40,120 --> 00:25:43,800 know that one. No, the, the, we actually don't 463 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:46,480 have a show today, right? So we, we thought we would just 464 00:25:46,480 --> 00:25:49,320 spontaneously call, like go through our contacts and call 465 00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:53,120 just just smart investors like yourself and, and ask for 5 466 00:25:53,120 --> 00:25:54,840 minutes of insight. And we're going to patch it all 467 00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:57,000 together and see if that saves us. 468 00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:00,480 The yeah, maybe, maybe, maybe we'll learn a thing or two in 469 00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:02,600 the process, you know? Yeah. 470 00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:03,920 Sure. So really what I'm asking for 471 00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:06,000 is, do you have any insight? What's on your mind? 472 00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:08,160 On what? Well, I don't know. 473 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:10,280 Whatever's on your mind, what have you been thinking about? 474 00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:17,480 What's on my mind the this morning I'm going to model the 475 00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:20,440 Cocosome drill hits. You probably saw them so. 476 00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:23,800 Well, yeah, they're fine. That's what's on my mind. 12g 477 00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:25,320 per 50 meters. How good? 478 00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:30,320 Exactly. So yeah, that's going to, that's 479 00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:32,880 going to chew up my day or my morning probably. 480 00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:37,080 And then insights. So many people remember your 481 00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:40,480 episode on Money of mine, the first one, and they just think I 482 00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:42,880 owe Tom a beer for We are. That's what they think. 483 00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:47,240 Yeah, there's a couple of blokes that follow me on Twitter. 484 00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:52,720 It's like I've already sold. Shout out to those lads, they 485 00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:56,880 know they are and yeah, no, it's a great story. 486 00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:58,880 I spoke to Joseph yesterday as well. 487 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:03,080 So it's super exciting that they're working through the the 488 00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:10,320 PEA or scoping or yeah, whatever you call depending on what Boise 489 00:27:10,760 --> 00:27:14,280 you look at. So yeah, now that's, that's 490 00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:16,600 going to be a killer resource upgrade. 491 00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:20,600 I'm thinking 3,000,000 oz and then we'll see, you know, the 492 00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:24,520 spreadsheet guys can start chipping away and seeing how 493 00:27:24,520 --> 00:27:28,120 much money it makes. Yeah, it's gonna fantastic. 494 00:27:28,120 --> 00:27:30,200 It's gonna be a lot. What, what, what are the other 495 00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:34,160 explorers around town that you've sort of been been excited 496 00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:37,440 by over the past couple weeks with results out or maybe 497 00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:43,640 results coming up? What have I been looking at? 498 00:27:45,120 --> 00:27:46,760 You caught me right at the start of my day. 499 00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:49,960 I think I checked. That you were online before I 500 00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:51,800 called, by the way, I didn't want to wake you up. 501 00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:58,240 Yeah. No, that's OK, I reckon. 502 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:01,240 I'm super excited about pamper metals. 503 00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:02,840 Oh. Yeah, Yeah, yeah, yeah. 504 00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:06,920 That's. That's I spoke to to Joe their, 505 00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:10,600 their MD as well yesterday. So they're wrapping up the 506 00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:15,240 financing that was $0.16 and it's traded up to 19 cents I 507 00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:17,840 think. So I think what people saw is 508 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:19,840 that, you know, they like Pampered, but they want to make 509 00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:23,160 sure it's financed, right Yeah, that they had cash and the Kitty 510 00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:26,240 and the next the next big unlock for them is just to prove that 511 00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:31,800 they can drill in Colombia. So, you know, if they can well, 512 00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:35,280 when they get drill rigs turning, you know, Pampers going 513 00:28:35,280 --> 00:28:38,280 to be 1 to really watch because, you know, I've seen the I've 514 00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:41,080 seen the core photos. It's it's a confirmed porphy 515 00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,240 system, right. So now you just got to work out 516 00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:46,800 how big it is and you can get all that for, I want to say 517 00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:53,040 3020, five, $30 million at current market cap, yes. 518 00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:55,320 That's an interesting one that starts out, mate. 519 00:28:55,320 --> 00:29:01,120 It's exciting, yeah. And anything I know you've just 520 00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:02,920 got like a good eye for GO Alpha. 521 00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:05,840 Like anything that's a bit unloved at the moment, you think 522 00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:09,240 there's, there's, there's, there's value in that you've 523 00:29:09,240 --> 00:29:17,440 done done the work on. Yeah, one one that's hyper 524 00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:23,560 illiquid. Let me look here, 25,000 shares 525 00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:30,120 traded yesterday at $0.29. It's called FIN X in in Finland. 526 00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:33,400 It's another, it's another beloved part of the world for 527 00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:36,160 me. Yeah, not too far to get to up 528 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:38,480 to the central Lapland greenstone belt. 529 00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:44,960 If you if some smart people around the time Rupert was being 530 00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,920 discovered, you know, they said, OK, here's a here's a Greenstein 531 00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:49,360 belt. It's nothing geologically 532 00:29:49,360 --> 00:29:53,720 different between, you know, parts of Canada or parts of 533 00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:57,240 Australia and and that and why, why haven't there been more oz 534 00:29:57,240 --> 00:29:59,600 down and boom, they found 5 million ounces of Rupert. 535 00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:06,920 So I've always sort of bought into that idea that, you know, 536 00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:09,920 there's got there's going to be a lot more ounces to be found in 537 00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:16,560 the in Lapland. So Fin X is the ticker that is, 538 00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:25,240 yeah, ambitious Finnish people put together some really good 539 00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:28,920 trenching results last year just listed and they're going to go 540 00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:31,920 drill it. So what I'm what I'm what I'm 541 00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:36,640 looking at is for that, for these jaw droppingly good trench 542 00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:40,480 results. If if that can convert to a 543 00:30:40,480 --> 00:30:44,720 drill, a drill hit. So yeah, again, we'll know 544 00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:50,720 pretty soon, I think August and September and yeah, but that's 545 00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:54,160 that's sort of super liquid. We haven't put that one into the 546 00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:56,440 fund. We just did it or just done it 547 00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:58,120 on PA. Yeah, I guess. 548 00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:00,720 Yeah, yeah, exactly. So if that's a confirmed hit, 549 00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:05,440 yeah, you know, we'll be the first people to invest in the 550 00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:07,480 next financing. Yeah, yeah. 551 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:09,200 Wow. Well, you probably should have 552 00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:11,760 mentioned it because maybe it'll be more expensive then. 553 00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:17,440 Yeah, well, I, I don't know, funds are less price sensitive. 554 00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:20,320 I think the market caps yeah, 15,000,000 or something. 555 00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:21,480 So what? What normally? 556 00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:24,600 Happens on discovery day. If you saw Onyx gold, I don't 557 00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:26,480 know if you guys saw that you saw that. 558 00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:31,480 When in Canada? On Now, the Canadian one. 559 00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:34,240 So it it gapped up 30% on discovery day. 560 00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:38,720 Yeah, yeah. But but it didn't really matter. 561 00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:41,960 So it gapped up to $0.32 and now it's run to $2.00, right. 562 00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:45,240 So the, the, the, the and the financing was at 70. 563 00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:47,680 So going going back to what we spoke about. 564 00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:51,360 Was. It two years ago now you know 565 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:56,000 you can if you do the work on after the discovery for that 566 00:31:56,000 --> 00:31:58,480 first financing, that's a super entry. 567 00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:00,520 Yeah. Yeah. 568 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:04,320 And and Finland just quickly as a, as a jurisdiction, there's, 569 00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:07,840 there's obviously plenty of big names in and around there, but 570 00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:10,800 the, the road to getting that permitted and everything 571 00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:12,840 probably a bit misunderstood down here. 572 00:32:12,840 --> 00:32:16,720 How do you say that? Yeah, it's super. 573 00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:22,760 It's super difficult to say. There's multiple challenges. 574 00:32:23,560 --> 00:32:28,480 You've got the indigenous population there. 575 00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:32,400 There they herd reindeer. Yeah. 576 00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:34,440 The, the, the, what are they called? 577 00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:38,440 The Sami. So they have these vast reindeer 578 00:32:38,440 --> 00:32:41,200 herding properties. So the further the basically the 579 00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:46,680 northern end of of Lapland is back is pretty much out of out 580 00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:49,200 of out of bounds. And then so if you're lacking, 581 00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:51,360 you find something on the southern, in the southern end 582 00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:56,120 around where Rupert are, then you've got to go through, you 583 00:32:56,120 --> 00:33:02,400 know, really long, difficult, but you know, robust but fair 584 00:33:03,200 --> 00:33:06,240 permitting process. So that's Rupert Ria stuck in 585 00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:09,800 that sort of permitting hell, but they'll get bought out. 586 00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:14,240 It's a high, you know, extremely high quality discovery. 587 00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:16,880 Shout out Crewy, who's running that now? 588 00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:19,640 Call Graham Crew, former former guest. 589 00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:28,720 OK, Legend. And the other issue is, is it's 590 00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:34,360 a it's a European wide sort of nature reserve. 591 00:33:34,360 --> 00:33:37,280 It's not National Park, but they call them Natura 2000. 592 00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:42,040 So these, these, these big patches of Natura 2000, you can 593 00:33:42,040 --> 00:33:46,400 work in them, but the, the regulations are a lot tighter. 594 00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:48,960 So you need to do a lot more work, spend a lot more money. 595 00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:52,720 Yeah. And the, the other issue in 596 00:33:52,720 --> 00:34:00,400 Finland for juniors, it's just the holding costs, the rents, it 597 00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:05,840 can be several $100,000 a year. So if you're, if you're 10 598 00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:11,120 million market cap and you want to spend, you know, you raise 2 599 00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:13,600 million, you want to spend a million on drilling and then 600 00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:18,480 they whack it with a $200,000 land bill, it's, you know, 601 00:34:18,639 --> 00:34:20,880 you're going to burn through the treasury pretty quick. 602 00:34:21,800 --> 00:34:24,639 How do you feel about being in in some smaller names when 603 00:34:24,639 --> 00:34:26,000 there's a bit of macro uncertainty? 604 00:34:28,040 --> 00:34:29,840 OK. Yeah. 605 00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:37,000 So the, the, the, the Geo Alpha, commodity beta strategies, the 606 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:41,480 barbell strategies was kind of designed for, for that, Yeah, 607 00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:44,480 for that sort of. Yeah, it's a. 608 00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:46,800 Portfolio, right? Portfolio answer to that as 609 00:34:46,800 --> 00:34:49,520 opposed to? Yeah, exactly. 610 00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:53,199 So what? You know what we can do and 611 00:34:53,199 --> 00:34:56,000 actually we have an start trimming, trimming the big gold 612 00:34:56,000 --> 00:34:59,760 positions so you know that they're hyper liquid and get 613 00:34:59,760 --> 00:35:01,400 1,000,000 bucks in and out really quickly. 614 00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:06,600 But things like we are, you know, no, no chance in hell on 615 00:35:06,600 --> 00:35:11,160 selling that now, right. So yeah, we're we might not fly 616 00:35:11,160 --> 00:35:15,800 as if gold, if gold loses 200 bucks, we won't fly as hard as 617 00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:19,640 it would. But it still hasn't, you know, 618 00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:22,880 we haven't achieved our investment outcomes that we want 619 00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:24,880 that. So yeah. 620 00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:27,800 Yeah, yeah. Awesome, awesome. 621 00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:32,800 Tom, any parting thoughts for us or for the audience? 622 00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:38,080 No. Happy hunting. 623 00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:43,480 Let the geology lead. Awesome mate. 624 00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:47,600 Thanks for taking our call at what is a pretty early hour over 625 00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:48,800 there mate, always great to. Chat man. 626 00:35:48,840 --> 00:35:51,960 First you're my first call. First, stop. 627 00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:54,800 Yeah, by his book, By Tom's book, it's on the wall. 628 00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:56,400 Rocks, Fossils. Exactly. 629 00:35:56,480 --> 00:35:58,040 Yeah. Cheers mate. 630 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:01,200 Thanks for all that. That's been really fun back and 631 00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:03,120 forth on that. Yeah, I really enjoyed it. 632 00:36:03,120 --> 00:36:04,400 Thanks guys, it's been hilarious. 633 00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:07,000 If Antonio escalates, I just know I will win. 634 00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:11,880 Yeah, fair warning. I'll make sure. 635 00:36:11,920 --> 00:36:15,800 I'll make sure he gets it. All right, mate. 636 00:36:16,240 --> 00:36:17,240 Have an awesome day mate, see ya. 637 00:36:17,280 --> 00:36:20,080 Cheers. A legend. 638 00:36:20,240 --> 00:36:24,560 I found that as fruitful as ever chatting with the likes of these 639 00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:27,840 super super switched on guys completely unprepared. 640 00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:29,560 How do you know? How do you feel, you know, not 641 00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:31,960 knowing what you were? Mate, I'm not the one on the in 642 00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:34,320 the spotlight there. We're getting the insights from 643 00:36:34,720 --> 00:36:36,640 from the people that think about this stuff all the time. 644 00:36:36,640 --> 00:36:37,760 What? Do you think money miners did 645 00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:39,440 you like that? Yeah, tell us what you think of 646 00:36:39,440 --> 00:36:42,120 the the different sort of format, the different style, and 647 00:36:42,480 --> 00:36:44,720 if you're a fan, yay or nay? Should we let the money miners 648 00:36:44,720 --> 00:36:46,040 call in randomly? Would you like? 649 00:36:46,040 --> 00:36:47,040 Would you? Was that too? 650 00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:49,480 Is that too, you know, Rogue for you, JD? 651 00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:51,760 We've we've always got the power of the edit mate. 652 00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:54,880 It's in our hands mate. A massive thank you to our 653 00:36:54,880 --> 00:36:56,680 partners for making this show possible. 654 00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:59,840 Our thanks go out to mineral Mining services, Rounded 655 00:36:59,920 --> 00:37:02,720 standard ground support and Cross boundary Energy Uduru. 656 00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:06,640 Uduru. Now remember, I'm an idiot. 657 00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:09,400 JD is an idiot. If you thought any of this was 658 00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:11,920 anything other than entertainment, you're an idiot 659 00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:13,440 and you need to read out a disclaimer.