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Righto money miners, welcome 
back to another week. 

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The flu's finished. 
But yeah, caught up with the UNI

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mates, you know I did Mustang 
bar Friday and Saturday night. 

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What a business development 
innings from. 

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That is one sponsor I want to 
get. 

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That is the greatest place on 
earth. 

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Good. 
Venue oh so good. 

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It's a lot of. 
But our goods are frigging iron 

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ore price, buddy. 
What up 13%? 

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13% on open up the Shanghai 
exchange I think. 

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Yeah, mate, it's just, well, 
that's pretty. 

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Good. 
The majors RIP higher, all of 

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them. 
Large cat watch list. 

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Oh my energy is up a minimum 13 
1/2 percent everyday when I just

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before I RIP and access mine and
technology ad Jesus Christ. 

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Nothing better than Oh my 
favourite pastime telling 

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everyone about the trusted 
advisor and drill Isle survey 

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instrumentation. 
Life has never been better it. 

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Just makes you feel good. 
Oh makes. 

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Go access. 
You want to feel good, give them

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a call, but you'll feel great. 
Your energy will be up 20%, 

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right? 
China stimulus, big, big news. 

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This could be, as you said, 
trap. 

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Is this the start of a commodity
super cycle? 

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He said it just like that. 
No, no mail at all. 

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It's a big U turning policy, 
right? 

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Like this is, yeah, like we're 
seeing it in the in the, in the 

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stocks, we're seeing it on the, 
you know, in the futures 

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markets. 
It's like this is kind of the 

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only story that really matters 
right now in the markets that we

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all care about is the policy 
environment in Beijing, which is

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maybe that's always been the 
case to be honest. 

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But you know, it's certainly 
right now feels like an elevated

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time of importance on on this. 
I just can't believe how quick 

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things have changed. 
Like we were talking about min 

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rez at 30 bucks the other day 
and they're bloody 52 again but 

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it's just. 
Min rez is definitely definitely

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getting a mention but yeah, I 
think you're dead right Trav. 

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This is this is the thing we've 
we've got to talk about. 

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Obviously a lot of the news 
started dribbling out late 

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Tuesday, Wednesday and it's just
sort of shaken commodities as 

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well as, you know, heaps of 
other markets. 

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You can see the the sort of 
ramifications in European 

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markets you can look at like the
the luxury stocks, they get a 

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pick up when Chinese buyers want
to buy more. 

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So I reckon we should sort of 
run through it in, you know, the

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best, the best way we kind of 
can. 

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And then in the background, 
we're going to keep working on 

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getting some China experts on 
the show. 

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So if you've got any 
recommendations for people, just

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flick us an email, put a comment
or just let us know and we will 

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try get them on the show. 
But. 

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If you live in Singapore, get in
touch with All the gurus are in 

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Singapore it appears. 
Good time zone as well. 

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So to start with, let's let's 
run through like what's kind of 

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gone on. 
Oh yeah, we got, we got Long 

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Town in Kingston as well. 
But but China, we do China. 

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Don't forget about that. 
All right, so, so everyone sort 

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of knows that the the the 
property market in China has 

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been under a bit of a drag for 
four years. 

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I want to say we started, you 
know, hearing about Evergrand 

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and some of these other 
companies in China really 

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starting to slow down in 2020 
through 2021. 

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So it's been going on a while 
and China's kind of policy has 

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been pretty different, like 
pretty Needless to say, the way 

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they operate is very different 
to the West. 

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Not these massive rounds of 
stimulus and you know, on the 

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right side of things, they've 
been actually cutting for a 

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while. 
So they're in a a bit of a 

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different sort of sink to what 
we are in Australia to what 

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they're in in the US and all 
these sorts of things. 

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They've also kind of steered 
clear of this individual 

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stimulus just kind of handing 
out money to individuals for 

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kind of ideological type reasons
as well. 

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But like you said, Trav, a lot 
of this kind of changed last 

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week. 
They announced big measures 

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which were kind of run through 
the the kind of key points on, 

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but the the pretty clear results
of all of this can be seen in 

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the stocks. 
So the Shanghai index had its 

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best week in 16 years. 
And if you look at the Hong Kong

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index, the Hang Seng, that had 
its best week since 1998. 

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So absolutely flying. 
You have to caveat this with the

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point that the Chinese real 
economy is very firmly different

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from the stock market that they 
have. 

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So there is not the same 
correlation between the real 

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economy as there is perhaps 
between the, the S&P and the, 

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the broader U.S. economy. 
So that's something you really 

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need to note because the the 
Chinese first and foremost, they

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want to stimulate the the real 
economy. 

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They want people to feel richer,
spend more, all these sorts of 

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things as opposed to just see 
them the stock market go up 

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today. 
Well, this is this is a big, you

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know, policy difference between 
the the largely the Western and 

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China is like a lot of the the 
policy settings that we see in 

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the West are actually more 
accommodative of just of just 

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higher asset prices rather than 
rather than being more in touch 

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with the real economy. 
A. 100% that's, that's been a 

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feature since the the global 
financial crisis in particular 

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since 2008, a lot of the policy 
that we've seen has just seen 

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inflation in asset prices across
the, the Western world. 

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So to get into what the Chinese 
have done in the past week or 

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so, the the highlights are that 
they have cut some interest 

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rates. 
These, like I mentioned before, 

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have been cut in the past, but 
they did a bit more of a 

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substantial cut. 
They lowered the bank reserve 

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requirement ratios, essentially 
meaning that banks need to hold 

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a bit less capital to again, 
stimulate liquidity throughout 

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the economy. 
Then to boost the stock market, 

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this is a bit of a different 
one. 

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Again, they've done things like 
this, but not to this degree in 

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the past. 
They're going to help firms buy 

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back their own shares by 
refinancing bank loans that 

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they've got essentially this 
this kind of helps leverage 

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investment. 
I think that the kind of 

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takeaway is that they don't like
the sentiment that is present in

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China. 
When people see the stock 

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market, they see it continuously
going down. 

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They feel, you know, less 
inclined to invest in assets 

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like the like the stock market 
because they just feel like 

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they're losing wealth. 
So they kind of want to put a 

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put a hold to that. 
They've never been outwardly 

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massively supportive of just 
saying the, the stock market RIP

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higher, but they kind of want a 
bit of put a bit of a pause on 

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it just trending downward and 
downward over time. 

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But the signalling is super 
vital. 

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And we see that in the West as 
well. 

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You know, the signalling around 
the the central bank 

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discussions, the Fed, the RBA 
here in Australia, what they 

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kind of signal is super, super 
important. 

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And some of the messaging they 
were giving is that they would 

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be comfortable and it's a 
possibility that they would 

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double or even triple the limits
on some of these packages of 

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stimulus, for example, the the 
stock stimulus there. 

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Isn't that, isn't that the whole
stock stimul? 

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I mean, it's like there is a big
difference between like, you 

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know, stimulating the real 
economy and then like letting, 

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letting companies effectively 
borrow more and have more 

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fragility in your in your 
financial system in order to 

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just buy back stock. 
That's not buying back stock is 

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well capital allocation that 
doesn't go to the real economy. 

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It just goes to sort of the 
wealth effect to the extent that

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exists. 
Yeah. 

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And it it seems from the outside
much more sort of short term in 

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nature just to put a bit of a a 
bit of a halt on the decline. 

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But you can see because they had
a Politburo meeting at the end 

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of last week, this was sort of 
seemed to be pulled forward a 

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month from when it otherwise 
would have happened. 

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And some of the wording stopping
the decline and stabilising the 

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property market, that was 
mentioned as a goal for the 

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first time. 
That sort of explicit wording 

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hasn't kind of been used before.
And there's still questions 

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about how they're going to kind 
of execute that and put it into 

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implementation. 
But the, the fact that that is 

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like the the first ticket on the
menu there is, is pretty 

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telling. 
They're also talking about 

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issuing bonds to the equivalent 
of 1.5% of its GDP to kind of 

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raise capital again. 
That's interesting. 

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That's a pretty big number. 
It's nowhere near the biggest 

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that China has done in the past,
but it is a very, very big 

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number. 
But this whole stimulus package 

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it, it's not necessarily 
massive, but the the wording 

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that they will do more of it and
that they're open to doing more 

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of it. 
I think it's just got everyone 

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super excited out there. 
Isn't it? 

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Isn't it funny how the the this 
is all about China stimulating 

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China, but how it actually just 
stimulates the world because the

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the fact that they are just a 
buyer of so much stuff? 

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Raw material which? 
You're gonna go into. 

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Totally, yeah. 
And I'm, I'm no macro expert, 

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I'll be the first to admit that 
I still clear of it as much as I

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possibly can, but I do love 
following the views of of some 

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of the the large money managers 
that have a firm view on China. 

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I don't know if you caught the 
commentary from David Tepper 

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just a couple of days ago. 
JD David Tepper, he's a, he's a,

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he's a billionaire fund hedge 
fund manager. 

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He runs Appaloosa management, 
which I think over the last few 

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years has, has been kind of 
returning it's external funds 

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and it basically managers mostly
tap his own capital these days, 

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which is just a casual $14 
billion or their thereabouts. 

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He, he went on CNBC at the end 
of last week. 

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And I, I, I cut out a little bit
and I'm keen to just sort of to 

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play it. 
So you guys get get a bit of a 

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00:09:14,800 --> 00:09:17,760
you know, and and the listeners 
get get get an indication of 

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what these like large head funds
managers are making this like U 

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turning policy from China. 
Because the undervaluation as 

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you, you know, listen, you can 
look at your chart and look at 

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the chart above on your on your 
screen right there, whatever 

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stock you like in China, they 
are even with the decent moves, 

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they're like on a flat line low 
compared to where they have been

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in the past. 
And you're sitting there with 

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single multiple PES with double 
digit growth rates for the big 

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00:09:41,280 --> 00:09:44,680
stocks that trade over here. 
That's kind of versus what, you 

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00:09:44,680 --> 00:09:46,840
know, the value. 
You're 20 plus on the S&P. 

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00:09:47,480 --> 00:09:48,800
OK. 
And then you have. 

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So the question was, was China 
going to do the things that you 

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want them to do? 
OK. 

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00:09:53,960 --> 00:09:56,920
Are they going to do the easy 
measures they they that you want

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00:09:56,920 --> 00:09:59,120
them to do? 
So yeah, they came the other 

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00:09:59,120 --> 00:10:00,480
day. 
And what's his name? 

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00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:04,600
Pan Pan Gong Chang. 
And I apologise because I can't 

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00:10:04,600 --> 00:10:07,320
even speak English. 
Well, you know, he came out and 

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00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:09,880
he was like jovial. 
It's like whoa. 

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00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:13,400
Jovial saying we're going to cut
and we're going to and we'll 

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00:10:13,400 --> 00:10:16,200
give you more. 
And he said we'll do more and 

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00:10:16,200 --> 00:10:19,640
more if needed. 
Now, the Chinese to say we'll do

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00:10:19,640 --> 00:10:23,480
more and more if needed. 
They don't say that because it's

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not been healthy to say those 
sort of things in China. 

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00:10:26,520 --> 00:10:27,680
But they said that the other 
night. 

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00:10:27,680 --> 00:10:30,320
And I've listened very carefully
what government officials say. 

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So I took it that they did a 
lot. 

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00:10:32,680 --> 00:10:35,280
They exceeded expectations. 
And he promised to do more and 

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00:10:35,280 --> 00:10:37,160
more and more. 
OK. 

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00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:40,080
And that's very strange 
language, especially for, you 

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00:10:40,080 --> 00:10:42,720
know, any central banker, but 
especially over there. 

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00:10:43,000 --> 00:10:44,680
So that was the first thing that
happened. 

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00:10:45,160 --> 00:10:49,160
And last night, you know, they 
we heard that they were going to

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00:10:49,160 --> 00:10:51,400
have some kind of meaning, but 
they kind of blew away 

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00:10:51,800 --> 00:10:55,480
expectations on the physical 
stimulus, you know, that they 

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00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:57,880
were going to do now physical 
stimulus, if you look at your 

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00:10:57,880 --> 00:10:59,920
charts, if you like charts 
because you used to be a broker.

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00:10:59,920 --> 00:11:02,160
And that was a good way to do 
things fast. 

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00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:05,320
What can happen around the world
when they do that? 

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00:11:05,320 --> 00:11:07,200
That's what you have to ask 
yourself now. 

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00:11:07,600 --> 00:11:09,880
So now you have the Fed. 
So just a backdrop again, the 

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00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:11,160
feds easy. 
And you know, you have a few 

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00:11:11,160 --> 00:11:14,600
more easing coming. 
The Japanese, they don't know 

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00:11:14,600 --> 00:11:16,920
what they want to do right now. 
But it doesn't matter what 

228
00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:18,440
people think. 
They're going to be forced into 

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things. 
And I can talk about that in a 

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second. 
The Europeans are lowering rates

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00:11:23,800 --> 00:11:26,120
and now the Chinese are lowering
rates, OK. 

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And they're going to be they're 
aggressive and how they're going

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00:11:28,120 --> 00:11:30,600
to do it. 
And they're also believe this or

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00:11:30,600 --> 00:11:33,400
not, swap facilities to buy 
stocks. 

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00:11:33,640 --> 00:11:38,120
What encouraging buyback of 
stocks, encouraging buybacks of 

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00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:41,000
stocks. 
OK, this is China, all right. 

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This is box stock buybacks, not 
only encouraging it, lending you

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money to do it. 
And they're giving money like 

239
00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:50,840
health money where you can put 
money out and you have no 

240
00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:53,280
losses. 
If you want to do it, you have, 

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00:11:53,280 --> 00:11:55,080
you know how that thing works. 
You have what only the money you

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00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:56,800
put up and you can don't lose 
money. 

243
00:11:57,200 --> 00:11:59,480
That's a great deal for me. 
I want to be over there bar for 

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00:11:59,480 --> 00:12:01,360
some of this stuff. 
The other thing I thought you 

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00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:04,040
were going to ask us about 
tariffs and stuff like that. 

246
00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:08,320
I do not care. 
This is internal stimulus there 

247
00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:10,360
in the physical stimulus that 
did last night. 

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They're going to encourage 
consumptions directly saying it.

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00:12:13,680 --> 00:12:16,480
So they're really doing all the 
things that people have asked 

250
00:12:16,480 --> 00:12:21,000
them to do over these years. 
Good to say jd.com was up 9%. 

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00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:26,480
What do you guys make of that? 
Well, it's a bit of sounds like 

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a bit of a perfect storm. 
I like if you've got like 

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interest rates going down in the
US and everything, and then 

254
00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:34,040
you've got China's stimulus, 
it's a bit of a double whammy, 

255
00:12:34,040 --> 00:12:36,800
isn't it? 
It's such a, it's such a yeah, 

256
00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:42,520
the entire government regime 
globally now is, is a line to 

257
00:12:43,160 --> 00:12:46,480
focus on these, these 
stimulatory kind of like market 

258
00:12:46,480 --> 00:12:50,240
stimulus activities, which by 
their very nature kind of create

259
00:12:50,240 --> 00:12:52,560
more fragility in the, in the 
financial system. 

260
00:12:52,560 --> 00:12:54,960
Like you heard, China's banking 
sector is now going to have 

261
00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:57,240
lower reserve ratios. 
Well, that definitionally makes 

262
00:12:57,240 --> 00:13:01,960
the banking sector more fragile.
But it's, it's kind of crazy as 

263
00:13:01,960 --> 00:13:03,400
well. 
Like you, you see, you know, you

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00:13:03,400 --> 00:13:06,320
hear it in, in Tepper's voice, 
who's talking, who's been what, 

265
00:13:06,320 --> 00:13:07,680
who's been a China watcher for 
so long. 

266
00:13:07,680 --> 00:13:10,480
And this is just like a, this a 
really kind of unexpected and 

267
00:13:10,480 --> 00:13:13,000
serious kind of U turn in what 
the, what the policy regime has 

268
00:13:13,000 --> 00:13:16,280
been there in relation to the, 
the downturn they've experienced

269
00:13:16,280 --> 00:13:17,840
over the last sort of, you know,
18 months. 

270
00:13:18,440 --> 00:13:22,640
I think historically stimuluses 
are you you think of JFC the 

271
00:13:23,280 --> 00:13:26,400
that was like a stimulus, like 
they're trying to stimulate the 

272
00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:29,520
economy to bloody everyone to 
own their own house and that 

273
00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:34,280
obviously went to shit, but. 
Yeah, it does seem in the, in 

274
00:13:34,280 --> 00:13:38,040
the short term it's very 
encouraging for for asset prices

275
00:13:38,160 --> 00:13:42,360
exactly like as as he outlined 
there, all the measures kind of 

276
00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:46,680
put forward a positive in the 
short term for whether that be 

277
00:13:46,680 --> 00:13:49,120
you know, stocks, houses, any of
these kind of things. 

278
00:13:49,120 --> 00:13:53,160
But you, you kind of got to bear
in mind that the reason it's 

279
00:13:53,160 --> 00:13:56,800
done is because things haven't 
been looking so healthy. 

280
00:13:57,040 --> 00:14:01,280
So that's that's one to keep in 
the back of back of our mind. 

281
00:14:01,280 --> 00:14:04,840
Yeah, I think in like a, the way
I, I, I internalise these 

282
00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:08,520
activities is you, you encourage
your, your banking sector to 

283
00:14:08,520 --> 00:14:12,800
make riskier and riskier loans 
or, or you know, or have like 

284
00:14:12,800 --> 00:14:16,320
lower reserve ratios or whatever
the, the greater proportion of 

285
00:14:16,320 --> 00:14:20,560
those new loans result in, you 
know, kind of can't, can't be 

286
00:14:20,560 --> 00:14:22,240
paid back. 
And that's when you have kind of

287
00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:25,480
the, the you, you grow your, 
your credit, you grow your debt 

288
00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:28,400
and then it kind of compresses 
because at some point the 

289
00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:32,280
marginal kind of like, you know,
person you lend money to can't 

290
00:14:32,280 --> 00:14:33,960
pay back. 
Yeah, I was. 

291
00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:34,920
I was going to. 
Yeah. 

292
00:14:34,920 --> 00:14:37,840
A. 100% I was going to mention 
something further down, but it 

293
00:14:37,880 --> 00:14:39,680
it's appropriate to kind of pull
it up here. 

294
00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:43,240
A lot of the liquidity measures 
the the lowering of the interest

295
00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:48,160
rates throughout China, you know
that that has been done to 

296
00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:50,800
stimulate the economy in China, 
kind of Needless to say. 

297
00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:53,240
But there hasn't actually been 
the appetite to borrow. 

298
00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:55,520
These rates have been coming 
down since 2023. 

299
00:14:56,120 --> 00:15:00,120
And just, you know, reading, 
reading people who watch this 

300
00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:04,040
stuff religiously, they're 
saying that there hasn't been 

301
00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:06,800
that sort of appetite for 
businesses, for households, 

302
00:15:06,800 --> 00:15:09,480
whoever, to kind of borrow 
despite the cost of capital 

303
00:15:10,120 --> 00:15:14,240
declining over that period. 
So, you know, whether we see it 

304
00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:17,520
again after this sort of bigger 
drop down in interest rates kind

305
00:15:17,520 --> 00:15:20,440
of remains to be seen. 
But there is super weak 

306
00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:23,240
sentiment both in the corporates
and the households there. 

307
00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:26,640
And you know, in, in simple 
terms, if you don't want to 

308
00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:29,560
borrow a cheaper rate doesn't 
really matter. 

309
00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:33,520
So you know, it's, it's just 
something to kind of bear in 

310
00:15:33,520 --> 00:15:35,520
mind. 
And it kind of stood out very 

311
00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:38,080
interestingly that another 
reason why they're trying to do 

312
00:15:38,080 --> 00:15:42,440
this is turn the the sentiment 
around in China to encourage 

313
00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:45,760
people to invest and do these 
sorts of things that lead to 

314
00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:49,800
growth over the longer term. 
Yeah, to focus on what like 

315
00:15:49,800 --> 00:15:52,640
Teppers, you know, he 
highlighted this is just a long 

316
00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:55,760
term chart of Ali Baba, a little
spike at the back end there. 

317
00:15:56,200 --> 00:15:58,480
It's up 30% less than a week, 
but you can still see it's like 

318
00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:02,600
it's pretty subdued relative to 
the, the highs that reach sort 

319
00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:05,000
of, you know, leading up to to 
2021 there. 

320
00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:08,760
I, I don't have the numbers on 
me, but you know, I think it 

321
00:16:08,760 --> 00:16:11,080
still trades at a single digit 
multiple of earnings. 

322
00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:14,280
Like it trades Alibaba this 
phenomenal kind of, you know, 

323
00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:18,200
Amazon equivalent, you know, can
actually trades on some 

324
00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:20,200
instances instances of lower 
multiple of earnings and some of

325
00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:22,320
the mining companies we we we 
talk about and. 

326
00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:25,760
Tepa you don't think Sorry, 
Yeah, I don't think Jack Jack Ma

327
00:16:25,840 --> 00:16:28,240
talking I'll of the the CCP 
helped his and Tepa. 

328
00:16:30,400 --> 00:16:31,960
Is not the only one that thinks 
this way. 

329
00:16:32,200 --> 00:16:34,600
This is from Shanghai Macro on 
Twitter. 

330
00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:37,720
In short, I'm aligned with David
Tepper by China by everything. 

331
00:16:37,720 --> 00:16:42,800
Since the July Politburo meeting
of 2023, I've been unequivocally

332
00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:44,360
bearish. 
China On Tuesday, I ban in that 

333
00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:46,920
bearish view and shifted to a 
tactically bullish stance due to

334
00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:49,120
significant shifts in Beijing's 
communication strategy evidenced

335
00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:51,280
by the financial regulators 
press conference. 

336
00:16:51,280 --> 00:16:54,560
Then, after Thursday's Politburo
meeting, I immediately sent out 

337
00:16:54,560 --> 00:16:58,120
a note titled By China, where I 
turned out right, Bullish over a

338
00:16:58,120 --> 00:17:00,640
cyclical time horizon. 
Fresh off the press today, 

339
00:17:00,640 --> 00:17:02,360
here's a tweet I thought was 
worth sharing. 

340
00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:07,520
Beijing Stock Exchange 50 index 
soars over 14 1/2 percent. 

341
00:17:07,640 --> 00:17:09,400
You record for the largest 
single day gain. 

342
00:17:10,359 --> 00:17:12,240
So there's a couple of stocks 
mentioned to you. 

343
00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:14,400
China extra is more than 10%. 
Cattle. 

344
00:17:14,480 --> 00:17:18,440
Cattle rose more than 5 1/2 
percent despite the HQS 

345
00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:21,040
production site catching big 
fire on Sunday. 

346
00:17:21,280 --> 00:17:24,640
The picture of the fire. 
So it's kind of crazy, isn't it?

347
00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:26,599
Yeah. 
Wow. 

348
00:17:27,599 --> 00:17:30,320
Yeah, that I mean the, the 
common feature there of all the 

349
00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:34,000
commentary I've seen is people 
saying short term, they are not 

350
00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:37,760
out and out long term bullish 
Chinese equities or any other 

351
00:17:37,760 --> 00:17:41,800
sort of such Chinese assets. 
It's kind of 1 to one to very 

352
00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:43,880
much keep front and centre. 
They they're sort of betting on 

353
00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:46,520
a a shorter term reflation if 
you like. 

354
00:17:47,080 --> 00:17:49,040
So where's this? 
Where's this stimulus kind of 

355
00:17:49,200 --> 00:17:50,160
come through? 
Like what? 

356
00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:53,120
What's the biggest sector talk 
in China? 

357
00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:56,480
But the housing sector is one 
that I want to talk about Maddie

358
00:17:56,480 --> 00:17:59,960
for, for a number of reasons, 
mainly because it is the, the 

359
00:17:59,960 --> 00:18:02,360
key asset for household wealth 
in China. 

360
00:18:02,360 --> 00:18:06,440
So roughly like 70% of a, a 
household's wealth is tied up in

361
00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:10,600
the house in China. 
So the, the simple, in simple 

362
00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:13,720
terms, the negative wealth 
effect that we've kind of spoken

363
00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:18,360
around is that when your house 
price declines and your overall 

364
00:18:18,840 --> 00:18:22,040
net worth declines because most 
of your wealth is tied up in it,

365
00:18:22,080 --> 00:18:24,120
Yeah, less inclined to go and 
spend throughout the economy. 

366
00:18:24,120 --> 00:18:27,080
So it's not kind of great. 
But you need to bear in mind in 

367
00:18:27,080 --> 00:18:29,640
China, like this was very much 
intentional. 

368
00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:33,360
They they started this four and 
four or three kind of years ago 

369
00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:36,240
and they wanted to do it because
they didn't want the property 

370
00:18:36,240 --> 00:18:39,720
sector to make up such a large 
portion of the economy. 

371
00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:43,400
They let Evergrande kind of 
collapse essentially country 

372
00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:46,480
garden. 
It's not completely bankrupt, 

373
00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:48,200
but it's a shell of what it kind
of used to be. 

374
00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:51,960
The leverage in China sits 
within these developers, not the

375
00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:55,800
same as it does say in the US 
before the the financial crisis 

376
00:18:55,800 --> 00:18:57,800
where it's all the, the 
individuals who have all the 

377
00:18:57,800 --> 00:18:59,440
leverage. 
It sits much more in these 

378
00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:02,320
developers there. 
And the, the Chinese Communist 

379
00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:06,600
Party was happy to see that kind
of deleverage to become a much 

380
00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:11,200
more kind of normalised, if you 
like, size relative to the other

381
00:19:11,200 --> 00:19:14,080
sectors within the economy. 
Now that the messaging they're 

382
00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:17,120
putting out is very much around 
stabilising this, because if 

383
00:19:17,120 --> 00:19:20,320
everyone thinks that the house 
prices are just going to decline

384
00:19:20,320 --> 00:19:24,400
massively, then they're going to
run and sell and it's not going 

385
00:19:24,400 --> 00:19:26,840
to be good for anyone. 
So they're going out there, 

386
00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:30,440
they're trying to stabilise this
and they're doing these by 

387
00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:32,800
releasing all these measures, 
letting people buy more, letting

388
00:19:32,800 --> 00:19:37,920
people invest in property, all 
these kind of things to to 

389
00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:41,560
counteract that negative wealth 
effect that we're seeing. 

390
00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:43,360
Right. 
So if you're going to make it 

391
00:19:44,160 --> 00:19:49,800
money of mine pertinent with the
mining right talk medals and 

392
00:19:49,800 --> 00:19:53,760
miners for me, Jodie. 
I know mate, first and foremost 

393
00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:54,880
that's the one we've got to talk
about. 

394
00:19:54,880 --> 00:19:57,920
So they had a huge week last 
week and as we just said before,

395
00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:03,680
today has been a massive day. 
So US like roughly 110 bucks a 

396
00:20:03,680 --> 00:20:05,120
tonne. 
Again, we'll flash up a chart 

397
00:20:05,120 --> 00:20:08,840
here. 
That shows FM, GB, HB, Rio and 

398
00:20:08,840 --> 00:20:12,760
Min's year to date performance. 
So still sort of down, not been 

399
00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:16,840
a, a great year, but you can see
that kick up in the last week. 

400
00:20:16,840 --> 00:20:19,880
It's, it's pretty enormous. 
If you look wider across the 

401
00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:23,160
other metals, copper, met coal, 
even lithium, they're all sort 

402
00:20:23,160 --> 00:20:26,280
of moving in the in the right 
direction. 

403
00:20:26,280 --> 00:20:29,520
And as a bit of a side note, Jim
Chama's the Treasurer was in 

404
00:20:29,520 --> 00:20:34,120
China just last week. 
And interesting to note, there 

405
00:20:34,120 --> 00:20:36,400
was a lot of question marks 
about whether there'd be sort of

406
00:20:36,400 --> 00:20:39,680
tariffs put on the EVs that 
we're importing here that you're

407
00:20:39,680 --> 00:20:41,480
seeing more and more on the 
streets here in Australia, the 

408
00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:45,240
Byds and those sorts of ones. 
And kind of good to see from my 

409
00:20:45,240 --> 00:20:47,720
perspective that he didn't put 
any tariffs on them. 

410
00:20:47,720 --> 00:20:51,440
We don't have a car sector to 
protect or anything like that. 

411
00:20:51,440 --> 00:20:54,920
So sort of starting a trade war 
with China again over, you know,

412
00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:57,840
slapping tariffs on their EVs 
would have been kind of shooting

413
00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:00,600
ourselves in the foot. 
Pointless, really. 

414
00:21:01,920 --> 00:21:05,000
You, you mentioned those BIG4 on
all miners, like look at look at

415
00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:06,920
how they opened this morning on 
the Spark chart. 

416
00:21:07,040 --> 00:21:10,560
Like at one point today min res 
was literally 10% up sort of, 

417
00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:13,440
you know, peeled back down to 4%
intraday. 

418
00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:17,720
But and the others all similar 
just yeah, huge volume on open 

419
00:21:18,040 --> 00:21:21,080
in response to the commodity 
moves that kind of unfolding in 

420
00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:22,320
real time thanks to the 
stimulus. 

421
00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:27,560
Yeah, I mean, mins is a really 
interesting example. 

422
00:21:27,560 --> 00:21:30,240
Obviously we've, we've spoken 
about them a bunch lately guys. 

423
00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:33,880
But you can see it will, will 
flash up the the the short man 

424
00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:35,600
chart here. 
And you can see just the kick up

425
00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:40,440
in short interest from sort of 
mid September, sort of 10th of 

426
00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:42,000
September through to like the 
20th. 

427
00:21:42,560 --> 00:21:47,760
And it's jumping from 7 1/2% of 
the shares outstanding to 12 

428
00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:51,880
1/2% in the same time that the 
stock's gone from about 30 bucks

429
00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:54,720
to to 51 bucks. 
So that's a pretty short and 

430
00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:58,480
sharp nasty burn for a lot of 
those people just sort of piling

431
00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:02,520
on as they kind of I guess 
anticipated the writing being on

432
00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:04,600
the wall for for mins a bit. 
Hey. 

433
00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:07,720
Yeah, it's, it's so interesting,
right? 

434
00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:11,000
Like the policy setting was a 
bit of AU turn and then yeah, 

435
00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:13,640
like those people kind of double
down on their existing shorts 

436
00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:15,480
when when you had the share 
price come off. 

437
00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:18,400
And then because it's so levered
as well as a hypersensitive 

438
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:22,680
stock to the commodity price 
deviations which flipped on the 

439
00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:25,120
stimulus sides. 
Hawk was there? 

440
00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:28,920
Was there was there any inkling 
or Goss that this was going to 

441
00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:31,400
happen or coming out very 
abruptly? 

442
00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:33,680
The China stimulus. 
I didn't hear anything, Yeah. 

443
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:38,640
There had been sort of rumours 
or I guess more hopes that this 

444
00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:41,680
would happen for years. 
Like I remember listening to to 

445
00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:45,280
sort of podcast back in 2022, 
people sort of thinking, yeah, 

446
00:22:45,280 --> 00:22:47,960
you know, it's it's sort of time
China's going to light a big 

447
00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:49,360
stimulus. 
If you remember, they, they sort

448
00:22:49,360 --> 00:22:52,520
of suffered from COVID a bit 
longer with these stronger 

449
00:22:52,520 --> 00:22:55,680
lockdowns that they're kind of 
implemented and people have been

450
00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:59,920
anticipating this sort of 
stimulus for a long, long time. 

451
00:22:59,920 --> 00:23:03,360
But you know, the, the timing 
always kind of takes people by 

452
00:23:03,360 --> 00:23:06,320
surprise as well as the, the 
sort of intensity of it. 

453
00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:08,200
You know, they've, they've 
really locked this one in their 

454
00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:10,840
gaze now. 
I remember like, I don't know, 

455
00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:13,720
less than a month ago, 
obviously, but the iron ore was,

456
00:23:13,720 --> 00:23:16,720
I think it was just above 100. 
It was like at 1:05. 

457
00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:20,680
And the Chinese media is calling
that irrational like that, you 

458
00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:24,040
know, the, the, the spark above 
100 is a rational and then iron 

459
00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:26,960
all kind of obviously fell 
pretty rapidly and now it's 

460
00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:31,760
bounced back again. 
Yeah, I mean, you got to give a,

461
00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:34,680
a shout out to La Shrub. 
I reckon he, he was mentioning 

462
00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:40,160
a, a potential sort of catalyst 
at the, you know, the back end 

463
00:23:40,160 --> 00:23:44,920
of his mind of China stimulus. 
You know, he, he had been long 

464
00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:48,960
energy, long commodities more 
more broadly because they were 

465
00:23:48,960 --> 00:23:52,120
just so beaten up. 
And I think the, the best way to

466
00:23:52,120 --> 00:23:54,080
kind of visualise this in 
Australia is just think about 

467
00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:56,360
the relative sort of value of 
the big four banks versus the 

468
00:23:56,360 --> 00:23:58,680
big miners here. 
The performance in the banks 

469
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:00,280
have been so much sort of 
stronger. 

470
00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:04,520
So if you just kind of put on a 
a relative type kind of bet that

471
00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:07,000
they would normalise that kind 
of ratio between them would 

472
00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:09,720
normalise a bit more. 
I mean, the, the big four banks 

473
00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:12,040
were just powering higher and 
higher and higher over the past 

474
00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:14,720
year. 
And the last week or so has been

475
00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:16,360
a pretty nasty one. 
They've sort of corrected a 

476
00:24:16,360 --> 00:24:18,720
little bit and it's been the the
complete opposite. 

477
00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:23,720
So that's pulled way more into a
kind of normalised, you know, 

478
00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:27,800
relative valuations for, for the
two of them. 

479
00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:32,440
The last point I think is, is 
worth noting on this kind of 

480
00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:36,320
China stimulus is that a, a lot 
of it has been financial kind of

481
00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:39,080
related. 
It's not necessarily stimulating

482
00:24:39,080 --> 00:24:40,680
demand for commodities 
themselves. 

483
00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:45,320
It's not as if China announced a
massive infrastructure plan that

484
00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:48,600
is going to soak up a whole lot 
more commodities. 

485
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:50,640
So it'd be sort of interesting 
to see if it gets to the point 

486
00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:51,840
where they'd do something like 
that. 

487
00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:54,760
Like they're they're addressing 
homes that have already been 

488
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:57,800
built that are kind of there 
these kind of things. 

489
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:00,240
They're not talking about 
building a heap more houses. 

490
00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:05,920
So it'd be interesting if that 
takes on another sort of form or

491
00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:09,720
is expanded if they really need 
to address this in a bigger way 

492
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:13,040
down the track. 
And kind of lastly, China has 

493
00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:15,160
announced packages like this in 
the past and just not 

494
00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:18,680
implemented it. 
So kind of worth keeping an eye 

495
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:21,920
out on whether they actually put
this into practise in in the 

496
00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:24,680
future. 
So what's the sum up? 

497
00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:29,360
Real assets, you know, you'd, 
you'd think they're in a kind of

498
00:25:29,360 --> 00:25:31,920
good spot despite all the bad 
stuff out there for the 

499
00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:34,520
remainder of the year, like at 
least at least in the short 

500
00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:37,720
term, you know, oil prices are 
low that that helps a lot of 

501
00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:41,000
people out there. the US is into
a cutting cycle. 

502
00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:44,280
China's kind of stimulating all 
these things around the world 

503
00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:45,960
despite all the challenges out 
there. 

504
00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:48,760
They're just given a, a good 
tailwind. 

505
00:25:48,760 --> 00:25:53,680
So that's the sort of way the 
the funds have been flowing in 

506
00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:55,880
the past couple weeks. 
And you'd kind of imagine like 

507
00:25:56,360 --> 00:25:59,280
the US smashing through records 
on the S&P, the NASDAQ, all 

508
00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:01,520
these kind of things. 
But this one's a bit out of my 

509
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:04,120
pay grade, Maddie. 
So we'll get on some some good 

510
00:26:04,120 --> 00:26:06,200
guests to to run through what 
they're kind of thinking, I 

511
00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:08,360
reckon. 
Yeah, well, as you said, Trav, 

512
00:26:08,360 --> 00:26:11,360
like buddy iron ore and Metcal, 
you think China stimulus they're

513
00:26:11,360 --> 00:26:14,560
the first two things you you 
think of that start flying. 

514
00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:16,600
Steel mills. 
Yeah, steel mills, as long as 

515
00:26:16,600 --> 00:26:22,440
old President Z Jay knows like I
guess the pecking order of where

516
00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:25,560
that steel has to go, like, you 
know, the housing market, it's a

517
00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:27,600
big market that's second 
preference. 

518
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:30,440
But as long as he knows the 
first preference, it goes to the

519
00:26:30,840 --> 00:26:36,240
the Sandvik Grand Sport division
for the lot that's that's up 

520
00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:37,560
here. 
Or maybe he's all, I hope he's 

521
00:26:37,560 --> 00:26:40,960
all onto it. 
I think it appears that Sandvik 

522
00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:45,360
have possibly noticed the like 
this meteoric rise of the DSI 

523
00:26:45,360 --> 00:26:49,880
brand on the back of us vouching
for them for the for the whole 

524
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:51,080
past year 100. 
Percent. 

525
00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:55,480
And thought we'd better get it 
on the back of this and great 

526
00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:58,400
thinking. 
Sandvik, it's DSI Underground is

527
00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:02,080
now branded as the Sandvik 
Ground Support Division. 

528
00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:07,680
It's all been swallowed up. 
I actually feel it quite an 

529
00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:09,200
honour. 
One of the most honourable 

530
00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:12,920
things since this podcast has 
started to display the Sandvik 

531
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:17,040
logo on money of mine. 
I never thought it had happened,

532
00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:21,880
but just he. 
Used to he used to have great a 

533
00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:23,160
great relationship with the 
Sandvik. 

534
00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:25,400
Jumbo, well, I had a great 
relationship with both. 

535
00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:29,800
I'll use like you jam ADSI split
set into the ground with the 

536
00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:32,960
Sandvik Jumbo. 
But now operators can use the 

537
00:27:32,960 --> 00:27:35,640
Sandvik Jumbo to jam in a 
Sandvik bowl. 

538
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:37,880
I think it's just great for the 
industry. 

539
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:41,760
But look, don't feel, ladies and
gents, Derek Hurd is still 

540
00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:45,880
running the shot. 
I pack CEO for the same same big

541
00:27:45,880 --> 00:27:48,640
ground sport division. 
Go Derek Hurd, go Sambic. 

542
00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:50,840
Go ground sport. 
Love it. 

543
00:27:51,480 --> 00:27:52,840
Oh, beautiful. 
Right. 

544
00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:57,800
Speaking of, probably a medium 
amount of ground sport going in.

545
00:27:58,040 --> 00:27:59,760
Yeah, good ground, apparently. 
Lawn tear. 

546
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:03,440
There's news out. 
First shipment how of Spodcon 

547
00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:07,400
has been sent. 
Got in a bloody buddy. 

548
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:08,640
Oh it's different to gold, isn't
it? 

549
00:28:08,640 --> 00:28:11,360
I remember, I remember, I'm 
holding the spot in the photos. 

550
00:28:11,360 --> 00:28:13,880
But like God, the amount of time
it takes to frigging get it on 

551
00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:16,600
the ship and everything. 
Bit different to sending it to 

552
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:19,080
the men. 
The joys of bulk commodities. 

553
00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:26,400
So what a let's go through it. 
So 11 and a half, 11,855 wet 

554
00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:33,200
metric tonne of 5.2% spodumene 
concentrate was on the on the 

555
00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:36,120
water going to an existing off 
take customer. 

556
00:28:36,120 --> 00:28:40,200
So they're saying at the moment 
Kathleen Valley they've produced

557
00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:43,600
28,000 wet metric tonnes of 
concentrate to date from first 

558
00:28:43,600 --> 00:28:46,400
production that was announced 
31st of July. 

559
00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:50,080
Yeah, so and they've also 
commenced selling into the spot 

560
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:52,880
market for. 
Uncontracted. 

561
00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:55,680
Uncontracted products. 
So they said there was a spot 

562
00:28:55,680 --> 00:29:01,320
sale of 10,000 tonnes sold to a 
Singapore based trader at a 

563
00:29:01,320 --> 00:29:04,840
premium. 
The spot actually US $802.00 per

564
00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:07,760
dry metric tonne at SC six 
equivalent. 

565
00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:11,720
Now we're going to talk about 
this SC six in a bit, but so 

566
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:14,800
that's considering the spot 
prices currently sitting the two

567
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:17,360
numbers I saw this morning 7:50 
to 786. 

568
00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:22,360
So I look for around 5.2% it's 
about quite still about 10 

569
00:29:22,360 --> 00:29:24,880
million Aussie bucks outside of 
their off takes. 

570
00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:28,720
So scheduled to be shipped early
next quarter that bit. 

571
00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:33,920
So yeah, I'm might be a bit of a
informative week on the line 

572
00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:37,520
town front, I think because I 
think we might say something 

573
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:41,160
from out soon around this sort 
of mine review. 

574
00:29:41,160 --> 00:29:42,960
We're all waiting for, for, for,
you know? 

575
00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:47,680
Costs, costs are one thing, some
guidance like probably and 

576
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:51,600
guidance and timing of the 
guidance hopefully recoveries 

577
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:55,280
maybe but probably clear sight 
also of whether this 4 million 

578
00:29:55,280 --> 00:30:01,280
tonne expansion in 2027 is still
in the pipeline on ice or if 

579
00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:04,240
they're going to commit to that 
or not, that's another thing so.

580
00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:07,960
Remind me again, 'cause I lost 
track at one point it was gonna 

581
00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:09,000
be 6,000,000 tonnes and then 
they. 

582
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:12,240
No, no, no, it was only ever 
gonna be, it was, it was gonna 

583
00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:14,760
be 4-4. 
But then when they when they did

584
00:30:14,760 --> 00:30:17,840
the yeah, the funding and 
everything they sort of and with

585
00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:21,080
the lowering the prices, they 
sort of put the four on ice just

586
00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:24,440
said we're gonna go for 3/3 the 
four's and the four's still an 

587
00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:26,200
optional thing. 
They just weren't firmly 

588
00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:28,000
committing to it like they were 
previously. 

589
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:31,280
Yeah, Yeah. 
And probably another one about 

590
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:35,560
what the, the product product 
spec is going to be. 

591
00:30:35,560 --> 00:30:38,040
So, and I'll get into that a bit
later. 

592
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:41,320
So because to my knowledge, like
we don't really definitively 

593
00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:43,800
know yet when Lawn Town are 
going to sort of get to this 

594
00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:47,120
3,000,000 tonne per run, right. 
And look how many tonnes of 

595
00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:49,920
Spodcon that will entail. 
So I think there was some 

596
00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:54,440
comments around it being about 6
to 8 months or something after 

597
00:30:54,760 --> 00:30:57,800
first production, which would be
sort of Q1 next year because I 

598
00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:00,120
haven't started stopping yet. 
I don't believe they're still 

599
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:02,880
doing all the development and 
getting it all ready. 

600
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:07,120
So I think it's looking to be 
the back end of the year when 

601
00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:10,920
they start stopping or like 
maybe yeah, like AQ four thing. 

602
00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:14,600
So that'll obviously say the 
bloody tonnes really lift 

603
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:16,280
towards that 3,000,000 tonne run
rate. 

604
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:18,200
So I've heard, I've heard they 
might be able to get there 

605
00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:21,880
earlier than Q1 next year. 
So that'll be. 

606
00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:25,520
Impressive like. 
Yeah, and I think it helps with 

607
00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:30,680
the because it's big and bulky. 
Like as long as they got the 

608
00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:33,160
frigging part, there'll be that.
There's that many headings 

609
00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:35,560
there, I think because it you go
and there's just fucking 

610
00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:38,480
spodumain everywhere. 
So it's and once you get it 

611
00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:41,080
bloody get enough to develop 
like you'll be able to RIP a bit

612
00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:44,120
out pretty quickly. 
So and look, since that day of 

613
00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:47,440
fast, there's anything I think 
it was 2021. 

614
00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:52,720
I think so much has changed when
we talk spodumain concentrate 

615
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:55,280
like for the status quo. 
So because you know, back then 

616
00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:58,320
it was everything was like 
right, SC six equivalent. 

617
00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:01,560
Most companies other than green 
bushes were sort of aiming for 

618
00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:07,720
that 5 1/2 SC 5.5. 
But now you see sort of SC 5.2 

619
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:10,840
becoming what you consider 
normal. 

620
00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:12,680
Like that's what Pilgrim 
Minerals is selling. 

621
00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:15,640
So and this is what Lion Town 
have sold in this. 

622
00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:20,480
So I think Lion Town will be 
weighing up the trade off of 

623
00:32:20,480 --> 00:32:26,360
producing an SC 5.2 product, 
which I assume has a lot more 

624
00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:30,320
processing flexibility, probably
less margin for error versus 

625
00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:35,320
having to fuck around to try and
get an SC 5.5 or better. 

626
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:40,080
And depend like and if people 
wanting to buy the 5.2 and you 

627
00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:44,120
can push more through and it's 
easier and and you might you 

628
00:32:44,120 --> 00:32:46,840
might get a better recovery. 
Yeah. 

629
00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:49,480
So it'd be interesting to see if
we get a bit of commentary 

630
00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:50,680
around that. 
So I. 

631
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:53,560
I heard Maddie that the the 
benchmark, the fast markets 

632
00:32:53,560 --> 00:32:57,280
benchmark is, is going to be 
changed to SC 5. 

633
00:32:57,400 --> 00:32:59,200
Yeah, that makes sense, doesn't 
it? 

634
00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:03,800
Yeah, because like why have a 
benchmark that only one mine or 

635
00:33:03,800 --> 00:33:08,240
sometimes 0 mines is producing? 
They're easier on the maths. 

636
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:10,000
So. 
So, yeah. 

637
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:12,600
So that, that'll be interesting 
to see how that all works 

638
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:16,680
because you know, it does. 
That does throw out all the, you

639
00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:19,240
know, from their DFS figures, 
the amount of concentrate 

640
00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:22,160
produced on their old numbers. 
Because if you look at, I'll 

641
00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:24,480
bring up the charts here, if you
look at the DFS figures, like 

642
00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:28,400
two and a half million tonne per
annum gave around 540,000 tonne 

643
00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:31,880
of dry metric tonne SC 6 
equivalents. 

644
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:34,040
I remember, I, I think it was in
a fortnight today. 

645
00:33:34,040 --> 00:33:38,600
So the wet metric tonne contains
about I think it's like 9.3% 

646
00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:40,760
moisture. 
So that's right. 

647
00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:42,960
When you convert it back to dry 
metric tonne, that's how it 

648
00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:45,040
works. 
So I look 3,000,000 tonne should

649
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:49,560
give around 650,000 tonne per 
annum of SC six equivalent. 

650
00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:54,520
But if they're selling 5.2% 
instead of 650,000 tonne, you'd 

651
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:58,760
need 750,000 tonne to be sort of
in line with those DFS numbers. 

652
00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:01,440
So I'm sure there's a bit of a 
balance and act I'll be 

653
00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:04,240
interested to say if the once I 
start punching through all the 

654
00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:07,800
the underground feed like from 
the honeypot areas, which is 

655
00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:12,520
probably high grade, what effect
that has on the whole, you know,

656
00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:17,000
recoveries in the spodumain 
concentrate grade, if that's a 

657
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:21,000
if that's a thing or not. 
So because if you go off what 

658
00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:25,960
they've produced so far, 28,000 
wet metric tonnes since 31st of 

659
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:28,880
July. 
So that's 25,000 drive metric 

660
00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:31,840
tonnes in two months, about 12 
1/2 thousand tonne a month so 

661
00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:33,920
far. 
They're in ramp up, obviously in

662
00:34:33,920 --> 00:34:37,159
ramp up with the open pit feed 
because the run rate they'll be 

663
00:34:37,159 --> 00:34:40,840
chasing, they'll need to be 
around above 50,000 tonne per 

664
00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:42,440
month. 
So about four times what they're

665
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:45,880
currently doing. 
But I feel and but I feel like 

666
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:50,239
if they're already committing 
spod into the spot market, you, 

667
00:34:50,840 --> 00:34:52,960
you would, you would think 
they'd be confident enough that 

668
00:34:52,960 --> 00:34:55,280
they're going to be able to 
fulfil their off take 

669
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:58,160
requirements if they're already 
selling into the spot market as 

670
00:34:58,160 --> 00:34:59,600
well. 
So because if you look at the 

671
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:03,680
amount they have contracted to 
LG, Tesla and Ford, looks like 

672
00:35:03,680 --> 00:35:06,560
their minimal contractual 
commitment for year 1 is about 

673
00:35:06,560 --> 00:35:10,400
265,000 tonnes of spodcon. 
There was there was another off 

674
00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:13,280
taker that came in late as well.
I think it's a Chinese entity 

675
00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:15,440
that took a little. 
Bit a little bit extra during 

676
00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:19,640
ramp up, yeah, Yeah. 
So it looks like, so pretty much

677
00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:23,680
double what they're pumping out 
now for this first two months is

678
00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:25,680
what's actually contracted, 
right. 

679
00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:28,640
So they're obviously must be 
pretty confident they're going 

680
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:32,840
to be able to fulfil all that by
that, Cos I think there's a 10% 

681
00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:39,240
variance on, on the, on the LG 
one and the Ford 1. 

682
00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:42,720
So they can go 10% under those 
numbers if they need to. 

683
00:35:42,720 --> 00:35:46,480
So it'll be once this all comes 
out, it'll be like it'll be 

684
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:49,120
interesting to see all the sell 
side models being updated with 

685
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:52,000
the cost guidance at these 
prices. 

686
00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:55,960
Like, you know, because always 
plenty of rumours were 

687
00:35:55,960 --> 00:35:59,160
circulating in the past like 
month, month or so, and probably

688
00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:02,680
before the cattle announcement 
of the Lupita like mine shutting

689
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:04,520
down. 
But like thinking like God is, 

690
00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:07,400
are we going to see any further 
curtailments? 

691
00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:10,720
So I think on the back of, you 
know, that cattle announcement, 

692
00:36:10,720 --> 00:36:14,760
probably this updated mine plan 
probably should house away those

693
00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:17,240
rumours for them hitting the 
pause button. 

694
00:36:17,240 --> 00:36:22,520
I would imagine I because I get 
in terms of the finance side of 

695
00:36:22,520 --> 00:36:25,720
things, when that LG convertible
note was announced, so it said 

696
00:36:25,720 --> 00:36:30,040
they had like $381 million of 
liquidity after another 120 

697
00:36:30,040 --> 00:36:34,040
million remaining capital costs.
So and they've got, they do 

698
00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:37,440
obviously they've got the $550 
million of debt with Ford and LG

699
00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:40,200
convertibles. 
So you'd think, I think they can

700
00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:43,240
call on another 100 mil of debt 
from LG if needed. 

701
00:36:43,240 --> 00:36:47,520
So but you'd, yeah, obviously 
got a bit of cash to say them 

702
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:48,400
through. 
They're not even bloody. 

703
00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:50,960
It's not that we've got 50 
million bucks left or anything, 

704
00:36:51,160 --> 00:36:53,200
just a real shit time to start a
Lithium 1. 

705
00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:56,360
Yeah, it's it's like, you know, 
they're going to have like while

706
00:36:56,360 --> 00:36:59,040
the market is where it's at, 
they're going to have a period. 

707
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:01,040
It's just like how long is the 
period going to be where the 

708
00:37:01,040 --> 00:37:04,640
costs are going to be greater 
than what they they're able to 

709
00:37:04,640 --> 00:37:07,080
sell their product for, right. 
And it's like that's the whole 

710
00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:10,760
equation for for Lion Town is 
like, you know, how long is that

711
00:37:10,760 --> 00:37:13,040
period going to be? 
Yeah, I suppose. 

712
00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:16,040
I suppose you want, yeah, it's a
tough one. 

713
00:37:16,040 --> 00:37:18,000
You don't. 
You want high prices when it's 

714
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:19,200
low. 
But if you're going to pick a 

715
00:37:19,200 --> 00:37:20,840
time to have low prices, you 
want to. 

716
00:37:21,160 --> 00:37:23,000
You probably want them when 
you've got the least amount of 

717
00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:26,160
product coming, being produced, 
if you've got enough money to 

718
00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:28,960
see you through. 
Yeah, the the the best, the best

719
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:31,560
thing is having. 
Early cash flows, yeah, outweigh

720
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:34,440
a lot. 
Pay back your debt and all that 

721
00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:35,600
sort of stuff. 
Riskier, but. 

722
00:37:35,720 --> 00:37:39,680
It'll be better later on, Yeah. 
So that'll be good. 

723
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:42,640
I'll be interested to see if 
that I don't know if it's coming

724
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:45,120
out next week, but I don't think
it's this week or better. 

725
00:37:45,240 --> 00:37:48,400
I don't think it's too far away 
and especially on the back of 

726
00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:53,360
sort of Y JS comments in in the 
last week, which is probably the

727
00:37:53,360 --> 00:37:57,640
first sort of semi bullish 
episode we've done around 

728
00:37:57,640 --> 00:38:01,400
lithium in in recent times. 
Yeah, it'd be good to say a bit 

729
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:03,760
of a turn around it'd. 
Be great. 

730
00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:08,800
I think like, yeah, calling, 
calling lithium market has 

731
00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:12,160
bottom versus calling like, you 
know, it's gone parabolic again,

732
00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:14,680
a very different sort of calls. 
Just because the lithium 

733
00:38:14,680 --> 00:38:17,320
market's bottom doesn't mean 
that lithium prices go to the 

734
00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:19,240
moon again. 
It just sort of things can 

735
00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:21,800
things can stay bottomed out for
a while and it's just sort of 

736
00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:25,320
grind sideways slightly higher 
over over an extended period of 

737
00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:25,680
time too. 
Oh. 

738
00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:30,360
Mate, that just take that take 
1200 yeah like invited that all 

739
00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:33,200
all they wants. 
They just want lithium to go up 

740
00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:36,200
50% effectively. 
Not asking for a lot. 

741
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:38,800
Not asking for much. 
We just want it up 50%. 

742
00:38:39,080 --> 00:38:41,560
But yeah, but that isn't that an
amazing thing to say. 

743
00:38:41,560 --> 00:38:44,600
Like, yeah, it doesn't sound 
like much that it has to get 

744
00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:47,440
back to 1200, but that is 50% 
higher than what it is now. 

745
00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:49,560
It's kind of crazy. 
The idea is like to ask a 

746
00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:51,280
commodity price to do that. 
Yeah. 

747
00:38:51,280 --> 00:38:54,560
It's like saying rare earths, we
needs to go back to 60 or 70. 

748
00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:58,680
But yeah, it'll be like saying 
iron ore should go to plus 200, 

749
00:38:58,680 --> 00:39:01,080
yeah. 
Yeah, yeah, it's, yeah. 

750
00:39:01,160 --> 00:39:05,280
But the the as you said, it's 
just that historic anchoring to 

751
00:39:05,280 --> 00:39:12,480
those to the mania prices. 
So, yeah, but I'm in terms of I 

752
00:39:12,480 --> 00:39:16,680
guess doubts and sort of like 
the confidence in what they're 

753
00:39:16,680 --> 00:39:19,800
doing there. 
Grainlands are on site there. 

754
00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:23,440
They've done some work there. 
Are they Grainlands equipment? 

755
00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:27,560
Yeah, so mate, it's all good. 
You got water specials there, 

756
00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:30,960
like Greenlands equipment, like,
whoa, Jesus Christ, like having 

757
00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:35,360
a comfortable blanket put over 
your proverb proverbially. 

758
00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:37,480
So what did they make everything
safe now? 

759
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:40,120
What did they do? 
I think they're doing some bit 

760
00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:43,440
of Poly work, yeah. 
So yeah, right. 

761
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:44,640
Bloody. 
I wouldn't. 

762
00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:45,840
I don't have any doubts about 
the Poly work. 

763
00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:48,560
Ohh right not not at all. 
The amount of the amount of MD's

764
00:39:48,560 --> 00:39:51,280
I'm speaking to lately after 
listening to when they listen to

765
00:39:51,280 --> 00:39:53,800
the Greenlands, I'd say like 
Jesus cross. 

766
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:56,520
They sound like a perfect fit 
for our operation. 

767
00:39:56,680 --> 00:39:58,240
Yeah, but they were the exact 
words. 

768
00:39:58,240 --> 00:40:01,960
That's because they are. 
So turnkey mine water management

769
00:40:01,960 --> 00:40:04,600
specialist, when I say turnkey 
mine water management, I don't 

770
00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:07,680
have to go through the website 
each individual thing. 

771
00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:10,320
It just means everything. 
Yeah, everything water. 

772
00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:13,520
Like name a random water thing 
that you would require on your 

773
00:40:13,520 --> 00:40:14,920
mind site. 
A Mount Franklin vending 

774
00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:16,040
machine. 
Yeah, they do that. 

775
00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:21,080
Yeah, guaranteed it's turnkey. 
So look, look at the clients, 

776
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:23,520
Genesis, Minres, Pantoro, 
Northern Star. 

777
00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:26,280
And Speaking of Northern Star 
mate, they've done 3 separate 

778
00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:28,920
sites there, Karasuddin, Moon 
Pit and Thunderbox. 

779
00:40:29,120 --> 00:40:32,880
So it obviously they've done one
job and Northern Star were like,

780
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:35,040
shit, how good were they? 
Let's get them back for another 

781
00:40:35,040 --> 00:40:36,440
one. 
They've done the second one. 

782
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:37,840
They're like holy snap and duck 
shit. 

783
00:40:37,840 --> 00:40:39,760
They did the second one better 
than the first one. 

784
00:40:39,920 --> 00:40:41,320
We'll get them in for a third 
one. 

785
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:43,040
Like what? 
A customer review. 

786
00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:47,600
Beautiful mate. 
The Cobar comeback kid. 

787
00:40:48,080 --> 00:40:51,080
Kingston resources show The 
Cobar. 

788
00:40:51,480 --> 00:40:53,400
I was keen to have a chin wag 
brief. 

789
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:56,320
Cobar is the family. 
Kingston is a child, you'd say. 

790
00:40:57,040 --> 00:40:58,800
Yeah, yeah, I suppose you could 
say that. 

791
00:40:59,760 --> 00:41:03,400
Yeah, right. 
So this morning, Kingston, they 

792
00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:06,000
came out with an, an updated 
kind of mine plan. 

793
00:41:06,040 --> 00:41:08,680
I'm I'm getting curious about 
Kingston for a couple of reasons

794
00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:10,080
#1 Cobar. 
We just. 

795
00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:13,360
We love talking about the cobar 
#2 was, I remember our chat with

796
00:41:13,360 --> 00:41:17,160
Dan Porter last year and his his
Pure Resource Fund has they've 

797
00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:20,680
kind of lent this company $15 
million now. 

798
00:41:20,680 --> 00:41:23,280
So Kingston's going to have to 
pay that back and. 

799
00:41:23,280 --> 00:41:25,320
Kind of lent it or like 
literally lent it. 

800
00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:28,320
No, they've lent it. 
They've lent it yeah, they, 

801
00:41:28,440 --> 00:41:30,360
they, they don't con notes 
though. 

802
00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:32,360
So what they do is they lend 
them money which needs to be 

803
00:41:32,360 --> 00:41:35,480
prepaid, but they'll get a 
truckload of out of the money 

804
00:41:35,480 --> 00:41:37,800
options too. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

805
00:41:37,800 --> 00:41:40,800
And the third reason is our good
friends of the show at Delphi or

806
00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:42,120
Deutsche Ballot. 
And you might know the most 

807
00:41:42,120 --> 00:41:45,560
they've they've kind of etched 
up their their shareholding from

808
00:41:45,560 --> 00:41:47,680
12 1/2 to 15% on the register 
too. 

809
00:41:48,400 --> 00:41:51,400
So today, like this funky 
announcement that they they put 

810
00:41:51,400 --> 00:41:53,480
out together with a bit of a 
Schmicko presentation. 

811
00:41:53,600 --> 00:41:57,080
It's essentially a reserves 
update, but the gist of it is 

812
00:41:57,080 --> 00:42:01,200
spun like a a mine life update 
for their Mineral Hill project, 

813
00:42:01,720 --> 00:42:03,360
Kingston. 
They they acquired Mineral Hill 

814
00:42:03,800 --> 00:42:06,000
in 2022. 
They they processed the tailings

815
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:08,960
through the plant as they were 
sort of wrapping together a mine

816
00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:10,840
plan for the for the rest of the
resource. 

817
00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:14,240
Two months ago they started 
running open pit material 

818
00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:17,600
through the mill and they 
reckon, they reckon, you know, 

819
00:42:17,600 --> 00:42:19,920
the mill kind of hit full 
capacity there two weeks ago. 

820
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:23,720
It's a, it's a small meal. 
But under the, the updated mine 

821
00:42:23,720 --> 00:42:26,760
plan drop today, they suggest 
open pit material will run 

822
00:42:26,760 --> 00:42:29,400
through the mill until the back 
end of FY20 6. 

823
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:31,240
That's when Underground will 
take over. 

824
00:42:31,520 --> 00:42:33,240
So there you go, Maddie, 
there's, there's an underground 

825
00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:34,880
contract that's going to be up 
for grabs. 

826
00:42:34,880 --> 00:42:37,240
Development, development work. 
Development work's going to kick

827
00:42:37,240 --> 00:42:40,000
off on the underground next year
there. 

828
00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:42,160
But I know there's not, not too 
many of them coming up. 

829
00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:45,960
So people want to watch out for,
it's a, it's a, it's, it's only 

830
00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:47,920
a 400,000 tonne per annum meal. 
So it's, it's kind of 

831
00:42:47,920 --> 00:42:52,040
interesting how the reserves 
update today, it included this 

832
00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:56,920
production target based on only 
51% of the reserves as I've 

833
00:42:56,920 --> 00:43:00,520
highlighted here, 51% of 
reserves, 11% M and I and then 

834
00:43:00,520 --> 00:43:03,120
38% inferred. 
I think a lot of companies to 

835
00:43:03,120 --> 00:43:06,240
get pulled up by ASX for they 
put a mine scenario up that has 

836
00:43:06,240 --> 00:43:09,200
too much inferred in the mine 
plan and then ASX says you can't

837
00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:11,960
do this. 
So I imagine when I see this 

838
00:43:11,960 --> 00:43:15,320
sort of thing, I imagine that's 
why this announcement doesn't 

839
00:43:15,320 --> 00:43:18,400
include any NPV for this six 
year mine plan. 

840
00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:21,560
If you look at the fine print, 
they, they do say that they ran 

841
00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:24,760
a version of their financial 
model which included only the 

842
00:43:24,760 --> 00:43:26,880
reserves. 
So none of none of the you know,

843
00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:31,480
none of their their resources, 
just the reserves case in which 

844
00:43:31,480 --> 00:43:35,040
they say was NPV positive, 
demonstrating economic 

845
00:43:35,040 --> 00:43:37,720
viability. 
So if that fills you with 

846
00:43:37,720 --> 00:43:41,080
confidence on just the reserves 
NPV positive, they don't put a 

847
00:43:41,080 --> 00:43:44,440
number there, but. 
I think everyone's just trying 

848
00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:47,680
to find where the ASX line is. 
Let's just Chuck keep a 

849
00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:49,200
different shit in and see what 
it. 

850
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:51,840
Depends who your advisor is like
that you have there. 

851
00:43:51,840 --> 00:43:55,240
You can't argue with ASX, but 
there's a lot of different ways 

852
00:43:55,240 --> 00:43:59,320
that, you know, the companies 
are trying to, yeah, convey what

853
00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:01,800
they want to convey on the work 
they've done at these like 

854
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:05,800
projects within the the confines
of what the ASX home permits. 

855
00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:09,800
Need to get all the MD's in a 
WhatsApp chat just to bloody so 

856
00:44:09,800 --> 00:44:12,960
they can share what they what 
what they got pulled up on Tron 

857
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:16,040
Tron the WhatsApp ASX line they.
Probably. 

858
00:44:16,040 --> 00:44:19,080
They probably exists. 
Yeah. 

859
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:21,840
Anyway, this is this is where 
kind of Kingston I I think where

860
00:44:21,840 --> 00:44:24,440
Kingston fits into the regional 
things and the cobar is the more

861
00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:26,480
interesting sort of story for 
me. 

862
00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:28,800
You see, like Talisman is is 
next door. 

863
00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:32,000
They had they've had expiration 
success this year, AGC another 

864
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:35,480
exploration story this year. 
See Alchemy on this map. 

865
00:44:35,680 --> 00:44:38,520
Today they announced an earning 
agreement with JOGMEC for their 

866
00:44:38,880 --> 00:44:44,440
kind of lithium gold tenure in 
near near Manor in WA mostly 

867
00:44:44,600 --> 00:44:46,080
mostly focused on the lithium 
for Jogmec. 

868
00:44:46,920 --> 00:44:50,480
But there's like with with that 
sort of in their pipeline now, 

869
00:44:50,480 --> 00:44:52,800
does that mean that that, that, 
you know, Kingston could 

870
00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:56,760
potentially do a, a deal with 
Alchemy's overflow tenure, which

871
00:44:56,760 --> 00:45:00,200
has a 342,000 oz gold equivalent
resource? 

872
00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:04,160
I don't know. 
The other 20% owner of that is 

873
00:45:04,160 --> 00:45:08,480
develop mining, which is 
interesting. 

874
00:45:08,480 --> 00:45:10,240
There's there's a bit happening 
in the region. 

875
00:45:10,240 --> 00:45:14,360
Kingston's meal is pretty small 
and like with, with $15 million 

876
00:45:14,360 --> 00:45:18,680
in, in drawn debt, I'm, I'm 
following it closely just to see

877
00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:22,440
how their cash position trends 
because their CapEx isn't, you 

878
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:24,840
know, it's not, you know, 
completely finished with the 

879
00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:27,120
CapEx when you've still got, you
know, underground development 

880
00:45:27,120 --> 00:45:28,800
that needs to be done in due 
course and all that sort of 

881
00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:31,160
stuff. 
But hopefully they're making 

882
00:45:31,160 --> 00:45:33,960
money on the open cut material 
going through the mill at the 

883
00:45:33,960 --> 00:45:36,080
moment. 
They're they're also looking to 

884
00:45:36,080 --> 00:45:40,080
get some coin in the door for 
the sale of of Misima, which is 

885
00:45:40,080 --> 00:45:42,400
the gold project in PNG. 
But I remember them running a 

886
00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:46,240
sale process on that in 2022, 
which seemingly didn't amount to

887
00:45:46,240 --> 00:45:48,520
a deal. 
I think like the best case for 

888
00:45:48,600 --> 00:45:51,760
for Kingston, is it their kind 
of cash flow positive already 

889
00:45:51,760 --> 00:45:54,080
based on, you know, the, the 
open pit material they're 

890
00:45:54,080 --> 00:45:55,880
putting through the mill. 
And that'll be, that'll be great

891
00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:58,760
for them because they could use 
that money to do the underground

892
00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:01,000
development plus pay back the 
debt and all that sort of stuff.

893
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:03,840
But but until kind of the 
quarterly comes out, which 

894
00:46:03,840 --> 00:46:06,160
should be out in about a month's
time, it's pretty hard to get a 

895
00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:09,920
read on on what the economics of
the sort of the mining scenario 

896
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:12,960
is at the moment. 
It seems like you look at that 

897
00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:17,440
map log, especially Mac. 
Mac have named renamed to Mac 

898
00:46:17,440 --> 00:46:19,840
copper. 
Yeah, you'd think, you know, 

899
00:46:19,840 --> 00:46:24,040
they're obviously looking. 
I think every pill mining is 

900
00:46:24,040 --> 00:46:27,080
probably the logical one there. 
Like this is obviously gold. 

901
00:46:27,080 --> 00:46:28,880
Predominantly gold. 
Gold. 

902
00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:30,440
Copper, yeah. 
Little bit of copper, yeah, it 

903
00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:32,280
looks like more gold miner you'd
say? 

904
00:46:32,280 --> 00:46:35,680
Like is that an Aurelia thing on
the back of the lot once Darks 

905
00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:38,640
has finished now, are they going
to be looking to get a bit of a 

906
00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:39,840
rebirth or something? 
Well. 

907
00:46:40,640 --> 00:46:44,400
Came to see how I really get get
federation going now that that's

908
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:50,400
all you know in motion. 
Yeah, there's, there's, there's 

909
00:46:50,400 --> 00:46:54,200
heaps in this region and not a 
lot of MNA, sadly. 

910
00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:56,640
I love to see a bit more MNA in 
this region. 

911
00:46:57,560 --> 00:46:59,560
It's long region's long 
infrastructure. 

912
00:47:01,120 --> 00:47:03,240
Yeah, a lot of short quality 
projects though. 

913
00:47:03,280 --> 00:47:04,920
Yeah. 
And the the projects are all 

914
00:47:04,920 --> 00:47:08,120
kind of sort of subscale ish. 
So, you know, it's the whole 

915
00:47:08,120 --> 00:47:11,080
kind of hub and spoke thing, 
which is of a maligned, you 

916
00:47:11,080 --> 00:47:14,360
know, model for as a mining 
company in the 1st place. 

917
00:47:14,360 --> 00:47:16,920
But there's, you know, there's 
opportunity for the, for the 

918
00:47:16,920 --> 00:47:19,840
lean kind of operators who who 
sort of think differently and 

919
00:47:19,840 --> 00:47:23,120
can kind of just get, you know, 
get, get value additive deals 

920
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:25,800
done with neighbours who have, 
who have resources and all that 

921
00:47:25,800 --> 00:47:28,240
sort of stuff too. 
Yeah. 

922
00:47:28,280 --> 00:47:31,240
You have to sort of be 
convincing and charismatic to 

923
00:47:31,240 --> 00:47:33,240
get a few of those deals over 
the line, I'd imagine. 

924
00:47:33,440 --> 00:47:37,760
Yeah. 
Yeah mate, bloody plenty of 

925
00:47:37,760 --> 00:47:41,120
balls in the air at the moment. 
Yeah, there are. 

926
00:47:41,120 --> 00:47:42,640
It's a, it's a really 
interesting time. 

927
00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:46,400
I reckon like everything, 
everything going on the the last

928
00:47:46,400 --> 00:47:50,080
few weeks in particular, I think
hopefully a bit more of a 

929
00:47:50,080 --> 00:47:53,760
tailwind through our kind of 
neck of the woods until until 

930
00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:55,480
the end of 2024. 
We'll kind of see. 

931
00:47:55,520 --> 00:47:57,880
It's all the stuff that you 
forget about that you don't 

932
00:47:57,880 --> 00:47:59,520
expect. 
Well, you know, you never know, 

933
00:47:59,520 --> 00:48:02,320
we might just see a massive gold
M and a deal coming out in the 

934
00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:04,360
next month. 
Who knows? 

935
00:48:04,360 --> 00:48:06,360
I. 
Mean gold just in the background

936
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:08,360
just keeps going from strength 
to strength, hey? 

937
00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:14,760
Yeah, let's not forget that. 
Hey, Jodie. 

938
00:48:15,560 --> 00:48:18,400
That's it. 
Right, I haven't forget that. 

939
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:21,240
Oh haven't forgotten Axis Mining
technology. 

940
00:48:21,240 --> 00:48:25,000
Love your bloody work and our 
great friends of the rest of the

941
00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:28,800
bloody Partners. 
Mineral Mining Services Verify 

942
00:48:29,120 --> 00:48:30,840
Adia. 
Get your trip tickets for Drill 

943
00:48:30,840 --> 00:48:34,760
24. 
Everyone don't forget previously

944
00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:38,000
DSI Underground, now the CNB 
Ground Support Division, 

945
00:48:38,280 --> 00:48:42,240
Silverstone, CRE Insurance, 
Greenland's Equipment, K Drill 

946
00:48:42,680 --> 00:48:44,400
and here goods a Bloody Spark 
chart. 

947
00:48:45,360 --> 00:48:47,920
Hello to row fellas. 
Hello to Row Money Miners. 

948
00:48:49,240 --> 00:48:51,760
The information contained in 
this episode of Money of Mine is

949
00:48:51,760 --> 00:48:53,960
of general nature only and does 
not take into account the 

950
00:48:53,960 --> 00:48:57,560
objectives, financial situation 
or needs of any particular 

951
00:48:57,560 --> 00:48:59,600
person. 
Before making any investment 

952
00:48:59,600 --> 00:49:02,680
decision, you should consult 
with your financial advisor and 

953
00:49:02,680 --> 00:49:05,800
consider how appropriate the 
advice is to your objectives, 

954
00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:08,000
financial situation and needs.