1
00:00:06,680 --> 00:00:10,280
Welcome to Judaism Demystified, 
a podcast for the Perplexed. 

2
00:00:10,760 --> 00:00:12,720
We are joined by Professor 
Daniel Matt. 

3
00:00:13,360 --> 00:00:15,960
Professor Matt is a scholar of 
Kabbalah and the Zohar. 

4
00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:18,840
He has been featured in Time and
Newsweek and has appeared on 

5
00:00:18,840 --> 00:00:21,120
National Public Radio and The 
History Channel. 

6
00:00:21,560 --> 00:00:24,360
He has published over a dozen 
books, including The Essential 

7
00:00:24,360 --> 00:00:28,400
Kabala, Translated into 8 
Languages, Zohar, Annotated and 

8
00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:31,240
Explained, and God in The Big 
Bang, Discovering Harmony 

9
00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:33,080
Between Science and 
Spirituality. 

10
00:00:33,560 --> 00:00:37,560
Several years ago, Daniel 
completed an 18 year project of 

11
00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:39,400
translating and annotating the 
Zohar. 

12
00:00:39,760 --> 00:00:44,400
In 2016, Stanford University 
Press published his 9th volume 

13
00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:48,240
of the Zohar Pritzker Edition, 
concluding the Zohar's main 

14
00:00:48,240 --> 00:00:52,040
commentary on the Torah. 
For this work, Daniel has been 

15
00:00:52,040 --> 00:00:55,000
honored with a National Jewish 
Book Award and a Corret Jewish 

16
00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:58,040
Book Award. 
The Corret Award hailed his 

17
00:00:58,040 --> 00:01:01,840
translation as a monumental 
contribution to the history of 

18
00:01:01,840 --> 00:01:05,040
Jewish thought. 
Daniel received his PhD from 

19
00:01:05,040 --> 00:01:09,520
Brandeis University and for 20 
years served as Professor of 

20
00:01:09,520 --> 00:01:13,360
Jewish Spirituality at the 
Richard S Dinner Center for 

21
00:01:13,360 --> 00:01:16,840
Jewish Studies at the Graduate 
Theological Union in Berkeley, 

22
00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:20,000
CA. 
He has also taught at Stanford 

23
00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:22,800
University and the Hebrew 
University of Jerusalem. 

24
00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:25,520
Daniel lives in Berkeley with 
his wife Hannah. 

25
00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:29,880
His book Becoming Elijah, 
Prophet of Transformation was 

26
00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:32,760
the Rabbi Sacks Book Prize 
winner in 2022. 

27
00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:35,280
He currently teaches Zohar 
online. 

28
00:01:35,520 --> 00:01:42,920
For information, visit 
www.danielcmattthats2tsdanielcmatt.com.

29
00:01:43,200 --> 00:01:45,880
Without further ado, Professor 
Matt. 

30
00:01:50,040 --> 00:01:53,080
Thank you for joining the 
Judaism Demystified podcast. 

31
00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:57,400
This is actually Judaism 
Mystified, as you mentioned off 

32
00:01:57,400 --> 00:01:59,280
camera. 
I think that's a great moniker. 

33
00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:04,600
So we were going to discuss your
book Becoming Elijah. 

34
00:02:05,760 --> 00:02:08,199
Why is your book called Becoming
Elijah and what's the 

35
00:02:08,199 --> 00:02:13,040
significance of his name? 
Yeah, I entitled the book 

36
00:02:13,040 --> 00:02:17,080
Becoming Elijah for two reasons 
and one I'll explain and the 

37
00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:21,480
other I think we'll discover 
later as we as we discuss this 

38
00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:26,040
amazing unique figure. 
It means through throughout most

39
00:02:26,040 --> 00:02:28,440
of the book, through I think 95%
of the book. 

40
00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:32,800
What becoming Elijah means is 
how did he undergo this 

41
00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:37,000
transformation from who Eliyahu 
is like in the Bible? 

42
00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:41,240
He's really a a zealot, A fierce
zealot for the one true God. 

43
00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:44,480
And then who he becomes in 
Jewish tradition, which is 

44
00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:49,200
really a kind of compassionate 
Jewish superhero, right? 

45
00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:51,880
He shows up in the nick of time 
to save people. 

46
00:02:52,280 --> 00:02:55,960
He somebody's falling from the 
roof, he'll swoop by almost like

47
00:02:55,960 --> 00:03:00,240
Superman, and scoop him up. 
He can help people who are in 

48
00:03:00,240 --> 00:03:02,880
poverty. 
He can inspire rabbis or or 

49
00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:05,240
Mystics. 
So it seems so different than 

50
00:03:05,240 --> 00:03:08,040
this fierce quality in the 
Bible. 

51
00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:11,680
So I really try to trace how he 
goes through this transformation

52
00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:15,000
from the biblical zealot to a 
compassionate hero. 

53
00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:19,720
In that sense how does he become
the Eliahu Hanavi we all know 

54
00:03:19,720 --> 00:03:25,840
and and love and wait for each 
each Pesach as to his name. 

55
00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:28,840
Really you know you find so many
names in the Bible that have a 

56
00:03:28,840 --> 00:03:34,080
divine element right Shimu Al 
many names that end with Al Dani

57
00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:39,560
Al and or you have Yahoo right 
Yerma Yahoo Yusha Yahoo. 

58
00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:43,120
Many biblical names have a 
divine element but Elijah is 

59
00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:48,800
unique because he has two Ali 
Yahoo My God is yudhay vave 

60
00:03:48,840 --> 00:03:51,000
right? 
Yudhay Vav is just a urban 

61
00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:55,080
abbreviation for Yudhay Vave. 
So my God is Yahoo. 

62
00:03:55,400 --> 00:03:57,880
It's almost that. 
He's permeated by God. 

63
00:03:57,880 --> 00:04:02,760
He's suffused with God. 
Maybe he's intoxicated with God.

64
00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:07,200
He's such an intense figure, and
his name really reveals that. 

65
00:04:08,760 --> 00:04:12,400
You know, it's I'm excited to 
see this journey of how we go 

66
00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:15,720
from Eliahu and Tanakh to to the
Eliahu we know today. 

67
00:04:16,240 --> 00:04:20,240
I learnt the story of Eliahu 
Navi during COVID, actually, 

68
00:04:20,680 --> 00:04:23,560
when we were in lockdowns and I 
was going to say from a Lahim at

69
00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:28,320
that time we had time, you know,
And it struck me as I was 

70
00:04:28,320 --> 00:04:30,440
reading it for the first time. 
I'm like, whoa, like, you know, 

71
00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:35,440
like this is not how how I'm 
used to picturing him. 

72
00:04:35,880 --> 00:04:40,960
And this, this idea of of how 
how this metamorphosized 

73
00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:43,280
throughout time always interests
me. 

74
00:04:43,280 --> 00:04:45,320
So this is this is going to be 
exciting. 

75
00:04:46,440 --> 00:04:49,040
Yeah, for me too. 
I really worked on Eliahu during

76
00:04:49,040 --> 00:04:51,520
COVID especially. 
It was kind of going, it was 

77
00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:55,480
going slow, and then I didn't 
have the excuses I usually have 

78
00:04:55,480 --> 00:04:58,960
and I actually got a lot done 
during during that strange time.

79
00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:03,200
Fantastic, so. 
Yeah, go ahead. 

80
00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:08,760
So I was going to say, so let's 
start with Eliahu in Tanakh. 

81
00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:14,840
Let's start with his demeanor 
and his his persona in Tanakh. 

82
00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:16,040
Right. 
Yeah. 

83
00:05:16,040 --> 00:05:18,920
Let let's run through a few of 
the of the stories and and what 

84
00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:22,360
what his character is like. 
First of all, he seems to pop up

85
00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:25,000
out of nowhere, right? 
We don't hear anything about his

86
00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:27,280
birth, his growth, his 
childhood. 

87
00:05:27,280 --> 00:05:30,400
I mean that's true of many 
prophets, but with Elijah, it's 

88
00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:33,880
even more so Right in the middle
of the Book of Kings, we just 

89
00:05:33,880 --> 00:05:37,160
hear all of a sudden that he's 
confronting the king of Israel, 

90
00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:39,960
right? 
He's confronting Akhav, Ahab. 

91
00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:45,120
And what does he say to Ahab? 
We don't know why he says this, 

92
00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:48,400
but he basically, he just 
declares there will be no rain. 

93
00:05:48,920 --> 00:05:52,360
So the first thing we hear from 
Elijah is this is this prophecy 

94
00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:55,400
of a drought. 
He says there'll be a drought. 

95
00:05:55,400 --> 00:05:57,880
He doesn't say why, but it's 
pretty clear that this is 

96
00:05:57,880 --> 00:06:02,040
because Ahab and Jezebel, right,
the wicked Jezebel things are 

97
00:06:02,040 --> 00:06:05,600
usually blamed on the woman Ahab
and Jezebel have been 

98
00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:08,480
worshipping. 
Baal have been promoting the 

99
00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:13,080
worship of Baal and Asherah in 
Israel, and that's why God is 

100
00:06:13,080 --> 00:06:15,480
now going to punish. 
Well, we have already in the 

101
00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:17,640
Shema, right? 
If you don't follow the word of 

102
00:06:17,640 --> 00:06:20,760
Hashem, if you don't follow 
God's word, then the rain will 

103
00:06:20,760 --> 00:06:23,040
stop. 
And Elijah says there'll be no 

104
00:06:23,040 --> 00:06:26,520
rain. 
So this doesn't go over very 

105
00:06:26,520 --> 00:06:28,320
well with the king and the 
queen, obviously. 

106
00:06:28,320 --> 00:06:32,480
And Elijah has to flee. 
He flees to a Creek by the 

107
00:06:32,480 --> 00:06:36,840
Jordan River and he's fed 
miraculously by Ravens. 

108
00:06:37,200 --> 00:06:40,120
This is the first miracle. 
Elijah's really characterized by

109
00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:42,600
miracles. 
In fact, really there this is. 

110
00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:47,400
Elijah and his disciple Alicia 
are the great miracle workers. 

111
00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:50,840
Throughout the whole Bible, no 
one else performs as many 

112
00:06:50,840 --> 00:06:53,280
miracles as the as the two of 
them. 

113
00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:56,640
So the Ravens feed him 
miraculously. 

114
00:06:56,640 --> 00:06:59,840
He can drink water from the 
Creek, but after all, he's 

115
00:06:59,840 --> 00:07:02,520
declared A drought and pretty 
soon the Creek dries up. 

116
00:07:03,160 --> 00:07:07,800
He has to flee again, and God 
says flee to the area near near 

117
00:07:07,800 --> 00:07:11,720
modern day Lebanon. 
And there God says, you'll 

118
00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:13,600
you'll find someone who will 
sustain you. 

119
00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:18,560
He goes there he finds a widow, 
and this widow doesn't seem very

120
00:07:18,560 --> 00:07:23,640
able to sustain Eliyahu. 
The widow is is cooking the last

121
00:07:23,640 --> 00:07:24,600
meal. 
She says. 

122
00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:28,040
I'm going to cook one more meal 
for my little boy and myself and

123
00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:33,680
then we'll die. 
Elijah miraculously provides her

124
00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:37,240
with with food. 
He says your your jug will never

125
00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:39,240
run out of oil. 
Your jar. 

126
00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:43,000
We'll never run out of grain 
until the drought finishes. 

127
00:07:43,440 --> 00:07:47,480
So the woman is overwhelmed, and
she recognizes the holiness, the

128
00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:51,480
power of Eliyahu. 
But before too long, her little 

129
00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:54,600
boy gets very sick. 
He's on the verge of death. 

130
00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:57,280
Perhaps he dies. 
He at least goes into a coma. 

131
00:07:57,680 --> 00:08:01,200
Or he dies and the widow lashes 
out at Elijah. 

132
00:08:01,200 --> 00:08:05,080
Why did you come here? 
Why did you kill my son so? 

133
00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:08,680
Eliyahu prays to God and 
miraculously brings the boy back

134
00:08:08,680 --> 00:08:13,000
to life. 
Perhaps through resuscitation 

135
00:08:13,600 --> 00:08:17,120
that the boy is is brought back 
to life and. 

136
00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:20,680
He reads kind of like a ancient 
CPR, like he discovered CPR 

137
00:08:20,680 --> 00:08:23,600
unless he blows into. 
Yeah, yeah, you, you know, you 

138
00:08:23,600 --> 00:08:28,280
can explain how how it happens. 
And still the the widow is, you 

139
00:08:28,280 --> 00:08:31,280
know, overwhelmingly it's 
overwhelmed and eternally 

140
00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:34,720
grateful. 
And then it turns out it's it's 

141
00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:37,760
a few years have passed since 
the beginning of the drought and

142
00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:41,600
God tells Eliahu the time has 
come for the for the drought to 

143
00:08:41,600 --> 00:08:44,400
end. 
So Elijah needs to meet again 

144
00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:46,600
with King Ahab. 
He hasn't seen him since that 

145
00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:49,400
first declaration of the 
drought. 

146
00:08:49,920 --> 00:08:54,960
He runs into King Ahab's 
steward, Obadiah, Obadiah. 

147
00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:58,680
And Elijah says, I I I need to 
meet with Ahab. 

148
00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:01,720
And Obadiah says, well, you 
know, I might if I set up a 

149
00:09:01,720 --> 00:09:03,840
meeting with Ahab. 
How do I know you'll show up? 

150
00:09:03,840 --> 00:09:07,480
You never You never seem to. 
No one can locate you right 

151
00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:11,120
Elijah really already, even 
before he later becomes who he 

152
00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:14,080
becomes. 
He already in the Bible, appears

153
00:09:14,080 --> 00:09:17,560
and disappears very quickly. 
In fact, Ovadja says something 

154
00:09:17,560 --> 00:09:20,800
interesting. 
He says when I leave you, Ruach 

155
00:09:20,880 --> 00:09:27,120
Hadonai, the spirit of Yudhevave
will carry you off to I know not

156
00:09:27,120 --> 00:09:29,240
where. 
So already there. 

157
00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:32,400
It seems that Elijah can be 
carried by the wind, can can be 

158
00:09:32,400 --> 00:09:36,000
carried by the spirit, but a 
lot, Eliao says. 

159
00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:38,160
I'm going to be here, I'm going 
to meet with Ahab. 

160
00:09:38,160 --> 00:09:42,240
And he tells the king that he 
wants to have a contest, Wants 

161
00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:46,680
to have a contest between Baal 
and the true God of Israel on 

162
00:09:46,680 --> 00:09:50,320
Mount Carmel or at that 
beautiful and impressive 

163
00:09:50,320 --> 00:09:54,880
mountain, modern day Haifa. 
So Ahab gathers all of Israel, 

164
00:09:54,880 --> 00:09:57,000
or at least many, many 
Israelites. 

165
00:09:57,440 --> 00:10:01,160
They come to the mountain, and 
Elijah basically wants to have a

166
00:10:01,160 --> 00:10:06,480
contest between hundreds of 
prophets of Baal, 450 prophets 

167
00:10:06,480 --> 00:10:10,920
of Baal and Elijah alone. 
He's very often the loner. 

168
00:10:11,400 --> 00:10:16,400
Elijah alone. 
And Elijah says each of us, the 

169
00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:20,720
prophets and and I, each of each
team is going to sacrifice a 

170
00:10:20,720 --> 00:10:25,880
bull and we'll see who can call 
down fire from heaven to burn up

171
00:10:25,880 --> 00:10:29,360
the sacrifice. 
So at this at this point, just 

172
00:10:29,360 --> 00:10:35,360
for context for everybody who's 
listening the up until now the 

173
00:10:35,360 --> 00:10:39,200
Israelites are are having 
they're kind of having like a 

174
00:10:39,200 --> 00:10:41,680
dual loyalty right. 
They're they're it's not like 

175
00:10:41,680 --> 00:10:44,160
they're just following ball. 
They're also following Hashem. 

176
00:10:44,160 --> 00:10:45,880
They're kind of like playing it 
safe. 

177
00:10:46,280 --> 00:10:50,000
They're, they're, they're, you 
know, having an affair. 

178
00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:53,440
Yes, yes, really. 
Elijah is forcing them finally 

179
00:10:53,440 --> 00:10:55,440
to choose, right? 
Everyone likes a contest. 

180
00:10:55,800 --> 00:10:59,480
So the people, they're somewhat 
attracted both to Baal, Baal and

181
00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:03,480
Asherah, the male and female 
Canaanite deities, on the one 

182
00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:06,320
hand, and still they haven't 
rejected the God of Israel, that

183
00:11:06,320 --> 00:11:08,040
they don't know who's going to 
answer their prayer. 

184
00:11:08,040 --> 00:11:10,160
They want to, you know, cover 
their bets. 

185
00:11:10,600 --> 00:11:14,480
But Elijah is really black and 
white, OK, later he becomes 

186
00:11:14,480 --> 00:11:15,640
something different, as we'll 
see. 

187
00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:19,200
But the biblical Elijah is very 
much a dualist. 

188
00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:21,760
It's either you're with 
Yudhavate or you're rejecting 

189
00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:23,680
Yudhavave. 
So in fact, he says to the 

190
00:11:23,680 --> 00:11:28,880
people Adbatai a tempo srim Al 
snehasi IPM. 

191
00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:32,600
How long are you going to jump 
back and forth between the two 

192
00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:35,760
branches, right? 
You're like a bird, not sure 

193
00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:37,320
which branch it's going to land 
on? 

194
00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:39,520
Elijah's says. 
Elijah says stop acting like 

195
00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:42,240
that. 
Pick Yuthe Vave or pick Baal, 

196
00:11:42,240 --> 00:11:43,880
we're going to have a contest 
and see. 

197
00:11:44,560 --> 00:11:46,880
So he lets the prophets of Baal 
go first. 

198
00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:50,720
They start crying out to their 
to their God, calling out to 

199
00:11:50,720 --> 00:11:53,720
Baal for hours. 
Nothing happens. 

200
00:11:54,280 --> 00:11:57,720
Then Elijah says, You know, why 
don't you try a little harder? 

201
00:11:57,720 --> 00:11:59,560
Maybe, maybe your God is 
sleeping. 

202
00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:03,560
Maybe he's off on a journey. 
Maybe he's trying to relieve 

203
00:12:03,560 --> 00:12:05,960
himself. 
Seems that's what the Hebrew is 

204
00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:09,200
really saying, although very few
translations take it that way. 

205
00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:13,200
But this could, you could say, 
is the first moment of sarcasm 

206
00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:16,000
in the Bible. 
Some people say that Elijah 

207
00:12:16,000 --> 00:12:20,560
invented sarcasm. 
You know, just cry out a little 

208
00:12:20,560 --> 00:12:22,320
louder, maybe you can wake up 
your God. 

209
00:12:22,320 --> 00:12:25,040
So now the prophets have all go 
into a frenzy. 

210
00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:29,480
They start gashing themselves. 
They dance, they cry out. 

211
00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:32,000
Still nothing. 
They finally give up. 

212
00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:36,400
Elijah steps forward with a very
short prayer, one or two line 

213
00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:38,560
prayer. 
He calls down fire from heaven. 

214
00:12:38,560 --> 00:12:44,240
The fire comes, incinerates his 
sacrifice, and the people are 

215
00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:47,160
won over. 
The people bow down and what do 

216
00:12:47,160 --> 00:12:51,720
they cry out? 
Hashem Hu Ha Elohim, Hashem Hu 

217
00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:54,560
Ha Elohim Yudhay Vave Is the 
true God. 

218
00:12:55,080 --> 00:12:57,400
OK, that may sound familiar, 
because that of course has 

219
00:12:57,440 --> 00:13:00,200
entered Jewish liturgy. 
And when is it? 

220
00:13:00,280 --> 00:13:02,760
When is it chanted? 
At one of the most dramatic 

221
00:13:02,760 --> 00:13:06,440
moments in the entire Jewish 
year, the very conclusion of Yom

222
00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:09,840
Kippur. 
But at the end of NI Allah the 

223
00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:12,880
Cantor chants, and the 
congregation responds not two 

224
00:13:12,880 --> 00:13:16,800
times as it was chanted on Mount
Carmel, but seven times. 

225
00:13:17,320 --> 00:13:20,240
But it's clearly taken from 
this, from this passage in the 

226
00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:22,520
Book of Kings. 
So the great declaration of 

227
00:13:22,520 --> 00:13:25,520
faith, right? 
Elijah has won the people back 

228
00:13:25,520 --> 00:13:27,720
to God. 
You could say it's his greatest 

229
00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:31,760
moment of triumph. 
But it doesn't last too long, 

230
00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:35,840
because meanwhile Jezebel is 
back at the palace, and it was 

231
00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:39,080
her prophets who were defeated. 
And of course, after Elijah 

232
00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:42,480
wins, soon after that, rain 
comes down South. 

233
00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:44,920
Fire has come down. 
The rain has come down to end 

234
00:13:44,920 --> 00:13:47,400
the drought. 
But Elijah isn't very 

235
00:13:47,400 --> 00:13:49,640
magnanimous toward the prophets 
of Baal. 

236
00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:52,680
He doesn't try to win them over 
to monotheism. 

237
00:13:52,680 --> 00:13:56,760
What does he do? 
He slaughters all 450 prophets 

238
00:13:56,760 --> 00:13:58,920
of Baal. 
Maybe it means he had them 

239
00:13:58,920 --> 00:14:01,320
slaughtered. 
But the Hebrew is of Ayish 

240
00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:03,800
Khatim, right? 
He was the shokrate. 

241
00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:06,680
He slaughtered them, perhaps. 
And with his own hands, he kills

242
00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:11,400
all 450 prophets of Baal. 
Isabel is incensed. 

243
00:14:11,400 --> 00:14:16,400
When Ahab gets back to the 
palace, she now wants to take 

244
00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:20,880
her vengeance on Elijah. 
And she actually says, tomorrow,

245
00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:23,000
Elijah, you're going to be like 
one of them. 

246
00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:25,240
You'll be like one of those 
prophets. 

247
00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:27,920
What? 
Isn't she just outright kill 

248
00:14:27,920 --> 00:14:30,200
him? 
She says she's going to kill him

249
00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:32,320
by the next day. 
That really gives Elijah a 

250
00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:36,200
window of opportunity, a window 
of escape, and Elijah escape 

251
00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:39,600
southward out of the Kingdom of 
Israel into the Kingdom of 

252
00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:43,360
Judea, where Ahab really can't. 
Yeah, but Jezebel really can't 

253
00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:45,400
catch him. 
But he goes further, to 

254
00:14:45,400 --> 00:14:49,360
Beersheva, into the desert of 
the Negev, and he's really 

255
00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:52,240
broken. 
So soon after his great moment 

256
00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:55,480
of triumph, he feels that what's
going to happen now, Isabel will

257
00:14:55,480 --> 00:14:57,600
bring the people back to the 
worship of Baal. 

258
00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:01,840
The Israelites are so ambivalent
for the moment they've been won 

259
00:15:01,840 --> 00:15:04,640
over, but he really feel he 
really feels he's a failure. 

260
00:15:05,240 --> 00:15:07,360
You could say he has a kind of 
death wish. 

261
00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:10,720
He actually asks God to take his
life. 

262
00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:14,360
He says I'm no better than my 
parent, my father's. 

263
00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:16,560
I'm no better than my ancestors 
take my life. 

264
00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:21,000
Fortunately, God doesn't give 
in, at least not right away. 

265
00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:24,320
An Angel revives Elijah and he 
finds himself. 

266
00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:27,360
Elijah finds himself wandering. 
He doesn't really know where. 

267
00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:32,320
Perhaps he walks for 40 days. 
You can kind of get a hint. 40 

268
00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:36,480
days has some connection with a 
famous mountain and he ends up 

269
00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:38,960
at Mount Sinai. 
Read the Book of Kings. 

270
00:15:38,960 --> 00:15:42,640
Calls it Horreve. 
But Horreve is Sinai, Jewish 

271
00:15:42,640 --> 00:15:45,960
tradition. 
So he's at Mount Sinai. 

272
00:15:46,480 --> 00:15:49,680
Moses, you remember, was on 
Mount Sinai for 40 days with 

273
00:15:49,680 --> 00:15:51,720
Elijah. 
It's taking him 40 days to get 

274
00:15:51,720 --> 00:15:54,920
there. 
And he has an encounter with the

275
00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:58,080
Holy One, blessed be he. 
He has an encounter with God, a 

276
00:15:58,080 --> 00:16:01,280
direct encounter with God. 
In some ways there, you know, 

277
00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:03,800
there are parallels here between
what happened to the people of 

278
00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:07,240
Israel at Mount Sinai, 
originally hundreds of years 

279
00:16:07,240 --> 00:16:10,280
earlier, and what happens with 
Elijah at Mount Sinai. 

280
00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:14,120
You remember in the Book of 
Exodus, there's fire and smoke. 

281
00:16:14,520 --> 00:16:17,320
Seems like the mountain is 
burning, There's trembling, a 

282
00:16:17,320 --> 00:16:20,280
kind of earthquake. 
And similar things happen with 

283
00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:23,520
Elijah. 
You have a very powerful wind, 

284
00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:27,360
then you have an earthquake, 
then you have fire. 

285
00:16:27,880 --> 00:16:32,520
But the Book of Kings goes out 
of its way to say Lo baruach 

286
00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:35,080
Adonai. 
God was not in the wind. 

287
00:16:35,880 --> 00:16:37,600
Lobarash. 
I don't know. 

288
00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:39,600
God was not in the earthquake. 
Lobaesh. 

289
00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:41,240
I don't know. 
God was not in the fire. 

290
00:16:41,800 --> 00:16:45,160
So if God is not in these loud 
phenomena of nature, where is 

291
00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:48,400
God? 
God is to be found one of the 

292
00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:51,880
most beautiful phrases I think 
in the whole Bible after these 

293
00:16:51,880 --> 00:16:54,520
loud natural phenomena. 
What is it? 

294
00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:58,720
What happens? 
Elijah senses or he hears call 

295
00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:03,360
de Mamma daka, right? 
This is often translated from 

296
00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:08,599
the King James Bible and onward.
A still small voice, but that's 

297
00:17:08,599 --> 00:17:10,160
not actually what the Hebrew 
means. 

298
00:17:10,160 --> 00:17:13,040
Call can mean voice or sound. 
Here. 

299
00:17:13,040 --> 00:17:19,200
It's really, I would translate 
it, a sound of sheer stillness. 

300
00:17:20,079 --> 00:17:22,680
Call de Mama daka. 
For those of you who know Hebrew

301
00:17:22,680 --> 00:17:26,119
grammar, it's really a smihud. 
It's really a construct. 

302
00:17:26,480 --> 00:17:29,320
Call de Mama the sound of de 
Mama. 

303
00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:34,000
It's not the call that is daka, 
because call is masculine. 

304
00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:38,960
It's the de Mama, that's daka. 
It's the sound of of thin 

305
00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:42,080
silence, the sound of thin 
stillness. 

306
00:17:42,560 --> 00:17:46,200
That's where God is to be found.
You could say it's almost a 

307
00:17:46,200 --> 00:17:49,640
precursor of meditation. 
You don't look, you don't find 

308
00:17:49,640 --> 00:17:52,560
God in these loud phenomena. 
You find God in a moment of 

309
00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:57,080
silence, a sound of silence. 
It could be that Simon and 

310
00:17:57,080 --> 00:18:01,200
Garfunkel got the name of their 
famous song from this phrase in 

311
00:18:01,200 --> 00:18:03,960
the Book of Kings. 
It's really a sound of silence. 

312
00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:07,800
That's where God has found. 
But Elijah doesn't really get 

313
00:18:07,800 --> 00:18:10,440
the message because actually, 
what happens? 

314
00:18:10,440 --> 00:18:13,280
God says before this, the sound 
of silence. 

315
00:18:13,280 --> 00:18:17,000
God says, Malachafo Eliyahu, 
what are you doing here? 

316
00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:19,280
Maybe that's a critique of 
Elijah. 

317
00:18:19,280 --> 00:18:20,800
Why have you fled from the 
people? 

318
00:18:20,800 --> 00:18:23,600
You should be with the people. 
You should still be trying to 

319
00:18:23,600 --> 00:18:26,240
bring them back to God. 
Well, Elijah says what am I 

320
00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:28,800
doing here? 
Kano Kineti. 

321
00:18:29,280 --> 00:18:32,160
I've been zealously zealous, 
right? 

322
00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:34,520
He really identifies himself as 
a zealot. 

323
00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:37,080
This is a self identification, 
Elijah says. 

324
00:18:37,080 --> 00:18:41,840
I am zealotry personified and 
the people have rejected your 

325
00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:44,400
covenant. 
Elijah says they're out to get 

326
00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:47,040
me. 
He really feels persecuted. 

327
00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:50,440
He has something of a 
persecution complex reasons for 

328
00:18:50,440 --> 00:18:52,680
that. 
He is being persecuted, but he 

329
00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:57,200
somehow can't let go of that. 
Then, after that question from 

330
00:18:57,200 --> 00:19:00,880
God and the answer, it's then 
that you have the wind, the 

331
00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:04,960
earthquake, the fire, finally 
the sound of sheer stillness. 

332
00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:08,360
And then God asks again, 
Malachafo. 

333
00:19:08,360 --> 00:19:10,320
Eliahu, what are you doing here?
Elijah? 

334
00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:13,480
The same exact question. 
Now how does Elijah respond? 

335
00:19:13,480 --> 00:19:15,760
Has he finally learned? 
Has he discovered God's 

336
00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:17,760
presence? 
Has he learned maybe. 

337
00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:20,920
For this critique, you don't 
have to be loud, and you don't 

338
00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:23,520
have to lash out at the people. 
You should try to be gentle. 

339
00:19:23,520 --> 00:19:26,560
No, he just answers the question
the same way. 

340
00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:29,040
Kano Quineti, I've been very 
zealous. 

341
00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:32,760
They're out to get me. 
They've rejected your covenant. 

342
00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:38,080
So it seems that Elijah doesn't 
really learn the lesson, you 

343
00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:41,720
might say. 
And then it's almost that God 

344
00:19:42,800 --> 00:19:46,120
gives in to Elijah's request. 
You could say. 

345
00:19:46,120 --> 00:19:48,920
Some people would say he's the 
only prophet who's fired. 

346
00:19:50,440 --> 00:19:53,240
God says go. 
In a moment, resignation. 

347
00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:57,000
I'm sorry. 
Resignation. 

348
00:19:57,360 --> 00:20:00,600
Yeah yeah, he resigned or God. 
Well, God says go find your 

349
00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:02,560
successor. 
But he says go find your 

350
00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:05,000
successor. 
I want you to anoint Elisha. 

351
00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:08,200
Elisha Ben Shafat is going to be
your successor. 

352
00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:10,760
Elijah's never met him. 
God says go find him here. 

353
00:20:11,160 --> 00:20:13,840
You'll find him in a certain 
place and he's your successor. 

354
00:20:14,360 --> 00:20:17,760
And Elijah realizes his time is 
now drawing close. 

355
00:20:18,120 --> 00:20:20,640
He wanted God to kill him. 
God hasn't killed him, but. 

356
00:20:21,120 --> 00:20:22,640
His career is drawing to a 
close. 

357
00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:25,240
He anoints Alicia. 
Other things happen. 

358
00:20:25,240 --> 00:20:29,400
Afterward he he confronts King 
Ahab again over the famous 

359
00:20:29,400 --> 00:20:32,240
vineyard of Navote. 
But we'll leave that for another

360
00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:37,320
time and please. 
Before you move on from the 

361
00:20:37,320 --> 00:20:43,360
story, first of all with the 
sound of sheer stillness, it 

362
00:20:43,360 --> 00:20:45,440
reminds me of TI Liam the Khadu 
Miyati. 

363
00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:54,080
La Silence is the brave. 
Do you understand it as that he 

364
00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:59,440
didn't get the message or is it 
more that he's rejecting the 

365
00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:02,920
message? 
Yeah, it's hard to know. 

366
00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:05,480
You know, there's so many 
ambiguous things in in the 

367
00:21:05,480 --> 00:21:07,480
Elijah's story. 
We'll come to a very dramatic 

368
00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:10,960
one very soon. 
You really can't tell. 

369
00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:13,720
You know, some people say, in 
fact we have the same question 

370
00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:16,440
from God, right? 
Malachafoeliahu. 

371
00:21:16,840 --> 00:21:19,040
And then Elijah's answer is 
exactly the same. 

372
00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:21,440
Conocanati. 
I've been zealously zealous. 

373
00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:24,720
Some Bible scholars say, well, 
they're not really two passages.

374
00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:28,320
It was one passage and some 
scribe mistakenly copied it. 

375
00:21:28,320 --> 00:21:32,240
Again, it only happened once. 
And then you have the the wind, 

376
00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:34,720
earthquake, fire, and and the 
sound of silence. 

377
00:21:35,360 --> 00:21:39,120
But from the way we read the the
passage now, it seems that 

378
00:21:39,120 --> 00:21:44,280
Elijah hasn't learned anything. 
Maybe he's rejecting this idea 

379
00:21:44,280 --> 00:21:48,560
of of gentleness. 
He says he he condemns the 

380
00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:50,880
people. 
He can't stop condemning the 

381
00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:54,400
people. 
So in a sense he's in a sense 

382
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:57,760
he's giving up. 
It is a kind of of resignation. 

383
00:21:58,040 --> 00:22:05,120
He's he's unable to reframe his,
his understanding of, of or his.

384
00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:10,600
He's unable to reframe, reframe 
his, his attitude towards the 

385
00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:11,880
people. 
He just can't do it. 

386
00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:14,800
Yeah, and that really explains 
what we're gonna get to soon, 

387
00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:17,960
how he changes his 
transformation in the Bible. 

388
00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:20,560
He can't do it. 
But before you know it, by the 

389
00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:23,360
time we get to rabbinic 
literature, he he can do it. 

390
00:22:23,640 --> 00:22:25,720
So I think it's really I I think
it's exactly that. 

391
00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:29,600
The rabbis are are troubled by 
the fact that Elijah can't 

392
00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:32,600
change course and they make him 
change course. 

393
00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:36,880
You know, I think, I think 
what's what's always striking to

394
00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:40,640
me when reading these, I mean 
I've been I I read this story 

395
00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:43,280
very early on in my life. 
My father used to tell me 

396
00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:48,760
stories of Tanakh since I was a 
little boy and he, you know, I I

397
00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:51,760
noticed that there's like a 
juxtaposition obviously between 

398
00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:56,000
Moshe Moshe's experience at 
Harsenai and his are obviously 

399
00:22:56,320 --> 00:22:59,120
obviously the the text is trying
to bring those two stories 

400
00:22:59,120 --> 00:23:02,360
together and make us realize the
contrast in. 

401
00:23:02,360 --> 00:23:06,080
In a way the role is reversed 
where God is playing the role of

402
00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:08,840
kind of what Moshe did, where 
he's like defending the people 

403
00:23:08,840 --> 00:23:12,080
and don't give up on the people.
And Mahaney not in a way like do

404
00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:14,920
not do not do this. 
But Eliah, he's almost 

405
00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:18,640
challenging Eliahu the same way 
he God kind of plays that role 

406
00:23:18,640 --> 00:23:20,440
the opposite way in in this sort
of Moshe. 

407
00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:23,520
I always find that to be very, 
very fascinating. 

408
00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:27,240
Yes. 
That wouldn't be the only time. 

409
00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:31,760
There's also textual comparisons
between Noah and Yona and the 

410
00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:35,480
roles are reversed again there 
too there are textual 

411
00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:41,280
similarities which enough of the
extent but in in by know off God

412
00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:43,840
is playing the I'm gonna destroy
the world they're evil. 

413
00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:48,360
But by Yonah he's playing the 
you know benevolent like forgive

414
00:23:48,360 --> 00:23:52,440
them and you know these are 
these are you have compassion on

415
00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:54,400
the board you know and I can 
have compassion on everyone. 

416
00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:59,360
So we see that there's a this 
interplay is more than it's more

417
00:23:59,360 --> 00:24:02,360
than just here it's it's sort of
something that goes on in 

418
00:24:02,360 --> 00:24:03,400
Tanakh. 
It's interesting. 

419
00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:05,440
Just wanted to add that, that's.
What I want to do? 

420
00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:09,160
Another another observation is 
also how they exit. 

421
00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:12,840
You know, their story ends. 
Moshe's is like a humble kind of

422
00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:16,400
private burial where we don't 
know where he's going and and 

423
00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:19,240
the whole like, you know taken 
up in a chariot to the heavens. 

424
00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:22,000
It's a very it's it's like 
purposefully. 

425
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:25,160
It seems like it's a 
purposefully like kind of 

426
00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:27,840
exactly trying to make a 
different differentiation 

427
00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:30,320
between the two characters. 
Yeah, yeah, I know there are a 

428
00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:33,520
lot of comparisons and then some
important contrast between 

429
00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:36,120
Eliyahu and Moshe. 
You know the midrash, I think 

430
00:24:36,120 --> 00:24:40,120
it's it's Pasichta Rabati, 
relatively late midrash, It 

431
00:24:40,120 --> 00:24:42,560
lifts. 
I think it's something like 30 

432
00:24:42,560 --> 00:24:47,080
or 40 parallels between Moshe 
and Eliahu. 

433
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:50,840
There's many, many things but 
but the differences are really 

434
00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:53,280
striking too. 
And Moshe learns to be 

435
00:24:53,280 --> 00:24:55,400
compassionate a lot earlier than
Eliahu. 

436
00:24:55,720 --> 00:24:58,360
But we're really coming now to 
the to the end of of Eliahu's 

437
00:24:58,360 --> 00:25:01,800
biblical career. 
You could say he he anoints 

438
00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:04,040
Elisha, he does one or two more 
things. 

439
00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:08,120
There's a couple more things. 
But then we find Elijah and 

440
00:25:08,120 --> 00:25:12,400
Alicia walking by the Jordan. 
They kind of do a farewell tour 

441
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:15,000
actually. 
Eliahu goes to various places 

442
00:25:15,360 --> 00:25:18,960
around the Jordan visiting 
Binet, Hanne, Viim, kind of the 

443
00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:21,960
profits and training. 
And there seemed to be a school 

444
00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:26,760
of prophets and they they 
recognize Eliahu as a master and

445
00:25:26,760 --> 00:25:32,480
Eliahu wants to to bid farewell.
And then Eliahu and Alicia are 

446
00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:37,000
all alone right by the Jordan. 
And we have this spectacular 

447
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:39,880
description, one of the most 
dramatic moments in the whole 

448
00:25:39,880 --> 00:25:43,080
Bible. 
Perhaps a chariot of fire and 

449
00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:46,480
horses of fire appear. 
In fact, the movie Chariots of 

450
00:25:46,480 --> 00:25:50,600
Fire took its name from from 
this scene a chariot of fire and

451
00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:54,080
horses of fire appear. 
They come between Elisha and 

452
00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:58,320
Eliahu, and Eliahu is 
transported, carried up to 

453
00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:01,960
heaven in a whirlwind. 
So it's in a chariot and in a 

454
00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:04,400
whirlwind. 
Again we have the wind, not 

455
00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:07,440
here, it's a Sahara. 
But like the ruach alia was 

456
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:11,840
carried off by the wind. 
And the question really is, here

457
00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:15,160
we have a beautiful moment of of
ambiguity. 

458
00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:20,280
Did Eliahu die? 
Does this mean he died of 

459
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:24,840
spectacular death or does it 
mean he escaped death entirely? 

460
00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:27,800
And I've asked you know scholars
about this. 

461
00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:30,680
A11 wonderful scholar in 
Jerusalem Shlomo na a. 

462
00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:34,480
He said it's it's intentionally.
It's intentionally ambiguous. 

463
00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:36,640
The Bible doesn't want to let 
you know. 

464
00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:38,600
But something interesting 
happens. 

465
00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:46,160
How does Alicia react? 
Alicia, says Avi Avi Rekhavistra

466
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:49,720
El Farashov. 
But my father, my father, my 

467
00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:54,440
master, my mentor, the chariot 
of Israel and its horsemen. 

468
00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:56,440
Now, is he talking about the 
chariot? 

469
00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:58,480
Maybe he's talking about Elijah 
himself. 

470
00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:01,360
Elijah is the chariot. 
Elijah is the one who's fighting

471
00:27:01,360 --> 00:27:03,680
for Israel. 
But more significantly, what is 

472
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:05,240
a lot? 
What does Elisha do? 

473
00:27:05,640 --> 00:27:10,600
He tears his clothes. 
Of course, in Judaism, you tear 

474
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:13,200
your clothes when you're in 
mourning, right? 

475
00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:15,000
If you're mourning over someone,
we're right. 

476
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:17,920
We have Jacob tearing his 
clothes, other biblical 

477
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:23,240
characters tear their clothes, 
and Alicia is tearing his 

478
00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:24,240
clothes. 
Why? 

479
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:27,240
Because he thinks Elijah has 
died. 

480
00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:30,640
We don't know if he's died or if
he's up there in heaven. 

481
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:35,080
Alicia thinks he's died. 
But this is the opening for the 

482
00:27:35,120 --> 00:27:38,560
traditional belief in Judaism 
and in Christianity and in 

483
00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:42,840
Islam, that Eliyahu never died. 
He's up there in heaven. 

484
00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:46,080
He's still in heaven. 
And if we're moving to perhaps 

485
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:49,040
the last thing in the Bible, 
that will speak about the 

486
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:53,120
prophet Malachi, right? 
The prophet Malachi, the last of

487
00:27:53,120 --> 00:27:56,200
the minor prophets. 
At the very end of the entire 

488
00:27:56,320 --> 00:27:58,680
section of Niveem, right? 
Torah. 

489
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:01,760
Niveem Kituvim. 
The Torah, the writing, the 

490
00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:03,520
Torah, the Prophets, the 
writings. 

491
00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:08,280
The very last lines of the 
prophets is the this brief book 

492
00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:10,200
of Malachi. 
The final chapter of Malachi. 

493
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:12,960
Where do you what do you hear 
there? 

494
00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:17,600
Hinay Anokhi Sholayakhlakhem ET 
Eliya Hanavi here. 

495
00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:20,320
He's called Eliya rather than 
Eliyahu. 

496
00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:22,920
I'm go. 
I'm sending to you Elijah the 

497
00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:27,920
prophet before the coming of Yom
Hashem before the coming of the 

498
00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:30,200
day of Yudhevawe, the day of the
Lord. 

499
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:33,600
So that's about as close as the 
Bible ever comes to saying the 

500
00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:37,160
day of the Messiah, the days of 
the Messiah, the the Bible 

501
00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:41,760
speaks about Yom Hashem, the day
of of the Lord, the day of Udave

502
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:46,920
Elijah is going to appear again 
right before the culmination of 

503
00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:50,280
history, right before the time 
of the Messiah, you could say 

504
00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:52,080
that's how the rabbis understand
it. 

505
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:57,640
So this must mean that Elijah is
still alive, he's in heaven, 

506
00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:00,240
he's waiting there, could mean 
that he'll be brought back to 

507
00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:01,680
life. 
But that that's not what the 

508
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:04,560
verse says. 
I'm sending to you Elijah the 

509
00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:07,360
prophet. 
So Elijah is in heaven and he 

510
00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:10,240
will reappear. 
That's already being stead in 

511
00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:13,080
the Bible itself that allows the
rabbis. 

512
00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:16,120
In a moment we'll get to who 
Eliyahu becomes in the Talmud of

513
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:18,520
the Midrash. 
That allows the rabbis to say, 

514
00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:21,880
look, the Bible itself is 
telling us that Elijah didn't 

515
00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:25,040
die even though Elisha was 
fooled to thinking he died. 

516
00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:27,160
He was really up in heaven and 
available. 

517
00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:33,800
Amazing. 
Well, why do you, why do you 

518
00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:41,440
think that the Naville left it 
ambiguous to begin with his 

519
00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:43,040
death? 
What do you think was the 

520
00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:47,440
significance of that ambiguity? 
I'm not sure. 

521
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:50,000
I mean 11. 
Possibility is that it means he 

522
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:52,680
did die, but he died in a 
spectacular way. 

523
00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:56,440
You know, you could say everyone
goes to the other world, to the 

524
00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:59,200
other dimension after death, But
Elijah did it in the 

525
00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:02,240
spectacular, dramatic way, and 
Alicia tears his clothes. 

526
00:30:02,520 --> 00:30:06,200
Maybe the Pshad is that he died,
but it's it's left open. 

527
00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:08,120
I don't know. 
Maybe just because it's great 

528
00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:12,280
literature, it's great writing, 
and it's it's more powerful and 

529
00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,720
something is, is mysterious. 
There's something so 

530
00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:19,360
intrinsically mysterious about 
Eliyahu, right? 

531
00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:21,280
He's really, he's really 
one-of-a-kind. 

532
00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:23,960
He's a loner. 
It's interesting how later he 

533
00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:27,280
becomes so much of the part of 
the Jewish family, right? 

534
00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:28,960
We'll end up talking about the 
Seder. 

535
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:32,840
Elijah's at the Seder as Lida I 
lodges at every circumcision. 

536
00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:35,920
Elijah's there every every 
Saturday evening when we 

537
00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:38,440
conclude Shabbat. 
He's part of the Jewish 

538
00:30:38,440 --> 00:30:40,920
families. 
He's in the Jewish Home in the 

539
00:30:40,920 --> 00:30:42,360
Bible. 
He has no home. 

540
00:30:42,360 --> 00:30:45,200
He has no family. 
He may never have married. 

541
00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:46,920
We never hear that he had a 
child. 

542
00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:49,800
He's the ultimate loner. 
He's a he, he, he. 

543
00:30:49,800 --> 00:30:53,040
In fact, he says I'm alone. 
Aninish Arti livadi. 

544
00:30:53,400 --> 00:30:55,040
I'm alone, he says again and 
again. 

545
00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:59,680
So he he's unique and alone and 
in his life he was unique. 

546
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:02,640
And in his death he's mysterious
and unique. 

547
00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:04,760
We we just don't know what would
happen to him. 

548
00:31:05,960 --> 00:31:10,680
And that leaves open everything 
else about his post biblical 

549
00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:14,160
career. 
It's almost like it's almost 

550
00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:16,760
like they want to tell you that 
there's unfinished business with

551
00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:18,920
him. 
Yeah, that's a great phrase. 

552
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:21,200
Unfinished business is really 
what it's about. 

553
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:23,840
There's something, there's 
something incomplete. 

554
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:26,640
There's something incomplete in 
the story and there's something 

555
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:28,680
incomplete in Elijah's 
personality. 

556
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:31,560
He he had, he has work to do, 
right. 

557
00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:35,040
He hasn't gotten the message. 
He has work to do and and that's

558
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:37,760
where we'll we can move now. 
Yeah. 

559
00:31:37,760 --> 00:31:41,360
So let's move to the next 
segment about Eliahu and Avi in 

560
00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:45,120
the Talmud. 
So who is he in the Talmud? 

561
00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:47,040
He's. 
He appears a good number of 

562
00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:50,760
times in the Babylonian Talmud, 
in the Jerusalem Talmud, in the 

563
00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:51,960
Midrash. 
So what? 

564
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:55,880
What's he like? 
He hasn't lost his his power, He

565
00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:59,400
hasn't lost his intensity, He 
hasn't lost his zeal. 

566
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:05,120
But he's starting to to to 
transmute that zeal into 

567
00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:07,520
compassion. 
I would say one thing that 

568
00:32:07,520 --> 00:32:12,600
happens with Elijah is his zeal 
or even his rage really becomes 

569
00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:15,920
transformed into compassion. 
He's basically there to to help 

570
00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:18,560
people. 
He'll help people in need. 

571
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:22,040
In the Midrash you find stories 
about people who have lost 

572
00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:25,760
everything, who don't have a 
child, and Elijah announces that

573
00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:28,800
a child will be born. 
Elijah helps somebody find a 

574
00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:31,560
gold coin. 
And the Talmud, it's not so much

575
00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:35,160
that type of miracle story, it's
more that he, he's in touch with

576
00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:38,240
the rabbis. 
You have to be pretty special to

577
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:43,000
to gain what's called Gilui 
Eliyahu, a revelation of Elijah.

578
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:45,680
You don't have that phrase 
exactly in the Talmud. 

579
00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:48,560
It's a later medieval phrase, 
but it really describes what 

580
00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:51,840
happens in the Talmud. 
We have time and again, certain 

581
00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:57,160
rabbis, right, certain special 
worthy rabbis who who merit and 

582
00:32:57,160 --> 00:32:59,440
encounter with Elijah. 
So what happens when they 

583
00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:02,400
encounter Elijah? 
Elijah will will teach them 

584
00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:04,600
something. 
He doesn't necessarily perform a

585
00:33:04,600 --> 00:33:06,880
miracle immediately. 
He'll teach the rabbi something 

586
00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:09,040
and help them understand a 
difficult passage. 

587
00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:13,440
Sometimes he might report a 
teaching from the Heavenly 

588
00:33:13,440 --> 00:33:17,600
Academy. 
From Yeshiva Shomala, right? 

589
00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:19,640
There's an earthly bait, 
Midrash, but there's also 

590
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:23,040
yeshiva Shamala. 
So who's the head rabbi in the 

591
00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:26,040
Yeshiva Shamala, the Holy One, 
blessed be he. 

592
00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:29,680
And who are the students? 
The students are the souls of 

593
00:33:29,680 --> 00:33:32,440
the righteous. 
If you lived a worthy life, if 

594
00:33:32,440 --> 00:33:35,080
you studied a lot of Torah, when
you get to heaven, you get to 

595
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:39,440
study Torah in the greatest 
Academy possible in the Yeshiva 

596
00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:43,720
Shamala. 
So Elijah is is he gains 

597
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:46,440
admission into the Yeshiva 
Shamala. 

598
00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:50,360
In some ways he's an Angel. 
He's described clearly as an 

599
00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:53,280
Angel later, but even in the 
Talmud he's already angelic. 

600
00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:57,520
So he's an Angel who has a 
permanent place of a seat 

601
00:33:57,520 --> 00:33:59,560
reserved for him, the Yeshiva 
Shamala. 

602
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:02,600
And he can convey teachings 
right? 

603
00:34:02,600 --> 00:34:05,960
The other people, you're either 
on earth or you're in heaven. 

604
00:34:05,960 --> 00:34:10,080
Elijah is the in between, right?
We spoke a moment about a moment

605
00:34:10,080 --> 00:34:14,760
ago about the ambiguity. 
Elijah is is the 11 scholars 

606
00:34:14,760 --> 00:34:18,480
called him the the virtuoso of 
the in between. 

607
00:34:19,440 --> 00:34:22,840
That's really who he is. 
So he he he straddles heaven and

608
00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:25,120
earth. 
He'll be in the yeshiva Shamala.

609
00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:28,159
Then he'll meet a rabbi on earth
and teach him something. 

610
00:34:28,159 --> 00:34:30,520
Sometimes the rabbi will ask a 
specific question. 

611
00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:33,639
Elijah will answer it. 
Sometimes in late Midrash, 

612
00:34:33,639 --> 00:34:37,600
Elijah asks the rabbi a question
and the rabbi might come up with

613
00:34:37,679 --> 00:34:41,800
with an answer. 
So he's in dialogue and one of 

614
00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:45,239
his main roles is that he'll be 
the one to announce the 

615
00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:48,080
Mashiach. 
So the rabbis pick this up from 

616
00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:50,080
Malachi. 
I'm sending to you Elijah, 

617
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:53,080
before the day of the Lord. 
For the Rabbis that means he's 

618
00:34:53,080 --> 00:34:55,679
going to announce the Mashiach. 
He even have a discussion. 

619
00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:58,520
When will Elijah arrive? 
Right. 

620
00:34:58,520 --> 00:35:03,120
We're yearning for the Messiah, 
and the Talmud actually says we 

621
00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:06,600
don't know exactly when he'll 
arrive, but we do know when he 

622
00:35:06,600 --> 00:35:11,040
won't arrive. 
Elijah will not appear on which 

623
00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:14,120
day of the week? 
Elijah won't appear on Friday. 

624
00:35:15,240 --> 00:35:18,400
Why? 
Apparently because people are 

625
00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:20,280
too busy getting ready for 
Shabbat. 

626
00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:24,000
If you're preparing for Shabbat,
you don't want to be interrupted

627
00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:26,040
by having to go out and greet 
Elijah. 

628
00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:29,800
So the Talmud says maybe, maybe 
he's half in jest. 

629
00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:33,800
Elijah won't come on on Friday 
because we understand the reason

630
00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:36,360
to be because people are too 
busy getting ready for Shabbat. 

631
00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:39,160
Then the question is, well, 
maybe he can come on Shabbat. 

632
00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:42,360
Wouldn't that be wonderful? 
If Elijah came on Shabbat, the 

633
00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:45,920
Messiah would come right after. 
What's the problem? 

634
00:35:46,800 --> 00:35:51,720
Can you fly on Shabbat? 
But you can't travel more than 

635
00:35:51,720 --> 00:35:54,400
2000 cubits. 
It's more than 2000 cubits from 

636
00:35:54,400 --> 00:35:57,720
heaven to Jerusalem. 
So can Elijah fly on Shabbat? 

637
00:35:57,720 --> 00:36:01,280
The Talmud actually discusses 
this and the question is really 

638
00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:07,440
a halachic question. 
If you're 10 hand breaths above 

639
00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:10,960
earth, OK, I think it's about 
about 2 1/2 feet. 

640
00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:14,160
If your ten hand breadths, this 
is a tephache. 

641
00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:18,560
If your 10 to fahim above earth,
maybe you can fly. 

642
00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:22,320
It's not decided. 
So we don't know if Eliyahu can 

643
00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:25,760
fly on Shabbat or not. 
And actually we can jump ahead 

644
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:28,400
now to something we were going 
to discuss later, but it fits in

645
00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:31,600
beautifully now. 
According to one explanation, 

646
00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:35,680
This is why we chant songs to 
Eliahu ET Havdallah. 

647
00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:40,000
Because he can't come on Friday.
We don't know if he can come on 

648
00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:41,720
Shabbat, so we have to play it 
safe. 

649
00:36:41,720 --> 00:36:45,160
He won't travel on Shabbat. 
OK, Eliyahu, Shabbat is now 

650
00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:47,520
finished. 
No more excuses. 

651
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:50,840
You have to come. 
That's how we sing to Eliahu on 

652
00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:54,280
on every Moto Shabbat. 
I personally, oh, sorry, Say, 

653
00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:56,720
Benji, go ahead. 
No, no, no, go ahead. 

654
00:36:56,720 --> 00:36:58,440
Go ahead. 
I was going to say something 

655
00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:00,840
that's interesting about his 
character development in the 

656
00:37:00,840 --> 00:37:05,600
Talmud also is that he's kind of
like sensitive to you know look 

657
00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:09,160
at look at people from a 
different angle like that. 

658
00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:13,200
He's very black and white in the
Navi, but in the in the Agada 

659
00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:16,360
there's a famous Agada. 
But like one of the rabbis asks 

660
00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:18,640
him which one of these people in
the marketplace are going to 

661
00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:22,120
Allama ban he's he points out 
these, you know, two jesters, 

662
00:37:22,440 --> 00:37:25,120
these two because they make 
people laugh and like God really

663
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:27,760
like that's a side to them that 
only like God sees. 

664
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:31,800
So he he's like he's looking 
deeper into people and giving 

665
00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:36,000
them like kind of like Damakov's
flute, you know versus the the 

666
00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:38,640
Eliahu and the Tanakhu is not 
like that at all. 

667
00:37:39,160 --> 00:37:41,200
Yes, yes. 
That's a beautiful example. 

668
00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:42,720
He's really he's changing. 
He's start. 

669
00:37:42,720 --> 00:37:46,440
He's becoming more of a Mensch. 
He's becoming more human and and

670
00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:49,720
more sensitive. 
You know what you mentioned 

671
00:37:49,720 --> 00:37:51,040
remind me of something 
wonderful. 

672
00:37:51,040 --> 00:37:53,080
You have a great statement in in
the Talmud. 

673
00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:55,000
It comes two times in the 
Talmud. 

674
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:58,960
Ehlu VA ehlu de ray elohim 
Khayim, Right? 

675
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:02,040
If there's a dispute, well, 
maybe only one person is, right.

676
00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:06,200
No, both these and those are the
words of the living God. 

677
00:38:06,640 --> 00:38:10,600
One of the two times that 
appears, it's spoken by Eliyahu.

678
00:38:11,480 --> 00:38:13,920
So in the Bible, he's so black 
and white, right? 

679
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:15,680
You're either for God or you're 
for Baal. 

680
00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:18,400
There's nothing in between. 
And to Talmud, he learns to 

681
00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:21,880
appreciate differences and to to
bridge differences. 

682
00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:25,560
And one of his roles, one of his
messianic roles, according to 

683
00:38:25,560 --> 00:38:29,280
the rabbis, according to the 
Mishnah, is that he will resolve

684
00:38:29,280 --> 00:38:32,040
disputes. 
He'll find a way to bring two 

685
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:34,240
parties together. 
He'll bring peace between 

686
00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:39,480
contending, contending people. 
It's. 

687
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:41,320
Another Yeah. 
Sorry, sorry. 

688
00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:42,880
Go on, go on. 
Go on, go on. 

689
00:38:42,880 --> 00:38:45,600
Another very important thing in 
the Talmud is that he is a 

690
00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:48,600
shapeshifter. 
That's an amazing phrase. 

691
00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:51,920
I used to think that it came 
from Marvel Comics, because 

692
00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:53,960
there you have, you know, 
characters who can take on 

693
00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:56,960
different form, but it actually 
it's a term, it's a term in 

694
00:38:56,960 --> 00:38:59,840
academic study of folklore. 
That's how it first appeared. 

695
00:39:00,240 --> 00:39:03,720
A shapeshifter you find it's an 
ancient folklore. 

696
00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:07,360
You even have it in the Epic of 
Gilgamesh, you have it in Greek 

697
00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:14,720
mythology, you have it, you have
it in in fairy tales and science

698
00:39:14,720 --> 00:39:17,000
fiction. 
You have it in Harry Potter, 

699
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:20,760
Star Trek, Star Wars. 
So a shapeshifter is someone who

700
00:39:20,760 --> 00:39:24,040
can take on a different 
identity, a person who can 

701
00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:28,400
become someone else. 
And Elijah does that OK, in the 

702
00:39:28,400 --> 00:39:31,000
Bible he's always you know who 
he is and intense. 

703
00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:34,560
I mean, he can be compassionate,
he's often zealot, but he 

704
00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:38,640
doesn't change his basic 
characters, basic identity. 

705
00:39:38,640 --> 00:39:42,120
In the Talmud he usually appears
as an old man. 

706
00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:44,400
OK, by the time the Talmud he is
pretty old. 

707
00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:47,560
I mean, he was born in the in 
the 9th century BCE. 

708
00:39:48,320 --> 00:39:51,280
But he's not only an old man. 
He could be a slave. 

709
00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:58,120
He could be a horseman, a 
Persian, a Roman dignitary, an 

710
00:39:58,120 --> 00:40:02,880
Arab. 
His most amazing shape, that 

711
00:40:02,880 --> 00:40:05,480
most amazing shape that he takes
on is in a story about Rabbi 

712
00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:10,400
Mayer, right? 
The great sage, Rabbi Mayer was 

713
00:40:11,240 --> 00:40:16,240
disciple, colleague, disciple of
Rabbi Akiva Remayer one time had

714
00:40:16,240 --> 00:40:19,600
to rescue his sister-in-law. 
His sister-in-law was 

715
00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:22,320
imprisoned. 
In a Roman brothel. 

716
00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:26,520
So Rabaimer rescues her from the
brothel, but because of that, 

717
00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:29,560
the Romans are out to get him, 
and they actually post his 

718
00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:32,640
picture on the gates, On the 
gates of Rome. 

719
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:35,600
They say anyone who finds this 
person, you'll get a reward. 

720
00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:38,720
So Roman soldiers are out 
looking for a bemayor and they 

721
00:40:38,720 --> 00:40:42,280
actually spot him and they're 
about to grab Rabaimer. 

722
00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:44,200
But who shows up in the nick of 
time? 

723
00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:49,120
Eliao and Avi, in the form of a 
prostitute. 

724
00:40:50,600 --> 00:40:53,560
The prostitute Elijah. 
The prostitute embraces Rabbi 

725
00:40:53,560 --> 00:40:55,960
Mayer. 
The Romans say, ah, that 

726
00:40:55,960 --> 00:40:58,480
couldn't possibly be the holy 
Rabbi Mayer we know. 

727
00:40:58,480 --> 00:41:02,760
He'd never do that. 
And in that way, Elijah saves a 

728
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:05,240
great sage of the Talmud. 
So he's a shapeshifter. 

729
00:41:05,480 --> 00:41:07,160
And also that story shows 
something else. 

730
00:41:07,160 --> 00:41:10,000
He kind of he breaks the rules, 
you know? 

731
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:12,120
He doesn't. 
He does the unexpected. 

732
00:41:12,680 --> 00:41:16,080
He he's really unpredictable. 
And he's something of a 

733
00:41:16,080 --> 00:41:19,680
trickster, too, that appears 
already in the Talmud, in the 

734
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:21,840
Midrash, and more so in in later
stages. 

735
00:41:21,840 --> 00:41:25,160
He he is. 
It's hard to It's hard to figure

736
00:41:25,160 --> 00:41:30,600
out. 
You know, as you're telling me 

737
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:39,560
these incidents in the in the 
Talmud, my intuition is telling 

738
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:42,120
me that what the Rabbis are 
trying to do here. 

739
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:44,840
And I'm not saying that with 
conviction. 

740
00:41:44,840 --> 00:41:47,520
I'm just this is just what's 
coming to me as you saying it, 

741
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:52,680
it's almost like they want to 
critique Elio Navi, but the but 

742
00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:56,040
Khazal was is never going to 
critique Elio Navi. 

743
00:41:56,600 --> 00:41:59,640
So what they're actually doing 
is, is that they're portraying 

744
00:41:59,640 --> 00:42:06,040
him in a way that the the reader
who knows him from Tanakh will 

745
00:42:06,080 --> 00:42:09,920
automatically see the difference
of the persona over here. 

746
00:42:10,400 --> 00:42:14,720
And what they're basically 
telling you is, you know, this 

747
00:42:14,720 --> 00:42:18,960
is what God wanted from him to 
be what we're portraying him as.

748
00:42:19,640 --> 00:42:22,400
But they're not gonna say that 
outright because he was one of 

749
00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:25,080
the greatest prophets. 
So what they're gonna do is, is 

750
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:30,560
they're going to anecdote with 
anecdotes, present Eliyao in the

751
00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:35,800
way which maybe God was aspiring
him to be in natural. 

752
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:39,680
That's just. 
That no, that's very good. 

753
00:42:39,760 --> 00:42:42,280
It's very good. 
The the rabbis are really re 

754
00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:46,560
imagining him re refashioning 
him and that that really happens

755
00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:49,240
age by age. 
It's almost that each generation

756
00:42:49,640 --> 00:42:54,000
reimagines Elijah. 
So in a sense who Elijah becomes

757
00:42:54,400 --> 00:42:58,240
shows you the values of that 
particular age, right? 

758
00:42:58,240 --> 00:43:01,560
In the Bible it's the battle 
against idolatry and Elijah 

759
00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:04,920
champions that by the time of 
the rabbis Judaism has 

760
00:43:04,920 --> 00:43:07,320
developed, Judaism has evolved, 
right? 

761
00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:11,120
Ethics are so vital, right? 
The Ahabda, Laura Kamocha, 

762
00:43:11,520 --> 00:43:14,720
Zeklao Gaudobatara, the most 
important principles love your 

763
00:43:14,720 --> 00:43:18,720
neighbor Elijah is one who who 
enables that and furthers that. 

764
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:22,160
But I think you know really the 
the term you could use here is 

765
00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:24,920
tikkun. 
Sounds like a strange term to 

766
00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:28,840
apply to to Eliao and Avi. 
But he undergoes A tikkun really

767
00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:34,560
means a repair or a a amending. 
Something about his his harsh 

768
00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:38,960
character has to be mended. 
And you can say the rabbis are 

769
00:43:38,960 --> 00:43:43,000
bringing that about not overtly 
but by showing as you say 

770
00:43:43,000 --> 00:43:45,440
showing anecdotally how he's 
changed. 

771
00:43:45,800 --> 00:43:48,600
But I I'd like to think also I 
think that's definitely true. 

772
00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:52,640
But I think you could say as 
well taking a broad perspective,

773
00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:57,080
Elijah realizes that he that he 
has to change. 

774
00:43:57,880 --> 00:44:00,560
Yeah. 
So over the ages Elijah is 

775
00:44:00,560 --> 00:44:04,880
changing himself as as he's 
being changed he's being changed

776
00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:07,560
and he's changing himself. 
He he's finally getting that 

777
00:44:07,560 --> 00:44:11,440
message of called the Mama Daka 
of the of the value of of 

778
00:44:11,440 --> 00:44:15,360
gentleness and perhaps 11 more 
brief story we should look at 

779
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:18,760
before we move on to to Kabbalah
and the medieval time. 

780
00:44:19,280 --> 00:44:23,440
The famous story I'm sure many 
of you know what's called Tanu 

781
00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:28,080
tanu or Tanu rochel akhnai. 
The oven the oven of Akhnai. 

782
00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:30,480
It's a famous story in the 
Talmud. 

783
00:44:31,160 --> 00:44:33,960
Rabbis are arguing, they're 
discussing as they're as they 

784
00:44:33,960 --> 00:44:36,800
always do, and they're 
discussing whether a certain 

785
00:44:36,800 --> 00:44:40,240
kind of oven, an oven that's 
constructed in a certain way. 

786
00:44:40,240 --> 00:44:42,920
We don't have to go into all the
details, but basically they're 

787
00:44:42,920 --> 00:44:46,520
trying to decide is this 
particular oven, can it become 

788
00:44:46,520 --> 00:44:49,680
impure? 
Is it subject to tuma? 

789
00:44:49,680 --> 00:44:53,080
Is it subject to impurity? 
And you have a disagreement 

790
00:44:53,080 --> 00:44:56,680
between Rabi Eliezer on the one 
hand and all of the other, 

791
00:44:56,680 --> 00:44:59,320
Hakamim on the other. 
The other Hakamim say it can be 

792
00:44:59,320 --> 00:45:02,360
rendered impure. 
Rabi Eliezer says no, this 

793
00:45:02,360 --> 00:45:04,600
particular type of oven can 
never become impure. 

794
00:45:05,280 --> 00:45:08,280
But they vote. 
And Rabi Eliezer is, you know, 

795
00:45:08,280 --> 00:45:13,680
way, way outnumbered. 
And he says, you know, I'm not 

796
00:45:13,680 --> 00:45:18,480
going to give in. 
He says, if if I'm right, if I'm

797
00:45:18,480 --> 00:45:20,720
right, I want this carob tree to
prove it. 

798
00:45:21,280 --> 00:45:26,160
And the carob tree is uprooted, 
just as Eliezer predicted. 

799
00:45:26,320 --> 00:45:29,000
But the rabbis don't accept it. 
They just said we we don't 

800
00:45:29,000 --> 00:45:32,720
follow carob trees. 
We we follow our own discussion.

801
00:45:32,800 --> 00:45:35,480
Eliezer doesn't give in. 
He says, OK, if I'm right, I 

802
00:45:35,480 --> 00:45:38,920
want the water in that aqueduct 
there to begin flowing 

803
00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:41,320
backwards. 
The water flows backward. 

804
00:45:42,320 --> 00:45:44,720
The rabbis say we don't, We 
don't go by water. 

805
00:45:44,720 --> 00:45:48,160
We go by our discussion. 
Finally, Eliezer's getting 

806
00:45:48,160 --> 00:45:50,400
desperate. 
He says, If I'm right, let the 

807
00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:55,440
walls of this Midrash collapse. 
The walls actually begin to come

808
00:45:55,440 --> 00:45:58,240
in. 
But Rabioshua is there and out 

809
00:45:58,240 --> 00:46:00,960
of Rabioshua's out of respect 
Rabioshua. 

810
00:46:00,960 --> 00:46:03,920
The walls don't collapse. 
They just kind of stay inclined.

811
00:46:05,440 --> 00:46:08,480
Still the rabbis aren't willing 
to to give in to Rabi Eliezer. 

812
00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:10,600
Finally a voice comes out of 
heaven. 

813
00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:15,120
A but Cole, a heavenly echo, a 
heavenly voice comes out and 

814
00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:20,600
says, uh, Eliezer's right still 
the rabbis won't give in. 

815
00:46:20,720 --> 00:46:24,080
How can you not give in to a 
heavenly voice 'cause Reb Yoshua

816
00:46:24,080 --> 00:46:29,200
says, quoting the Torah Lova 
Shamayimhi, It's not in heaven. 

817
00:46:29,840 --> 00:46:32,600
Torah is no longer in heaven. 
God gave us the Torah and the 

818
00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:36,920
way we decide is how we have to 
decide determine the halacha. 

819
00:46:37,640 --> 00:46:42,360
So it's an amazing story telling
us about the power of rabbinic 

820
00:46:42,640 --> 00:46:44,120
teaching and rabbinic 
discussion. 

821
00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:46,000
But that's not the end of the 
story. 

822
00:46:46,440 --> 00:46:50,440
We find out that sometime later 
another Rabbi Rab in a ton runs 

823
00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:53,440
into Eliahu. 
He has a Gilui Eliyao. 

824
00:46:53,440 --> 00:46:56,520
He has a revelation of Elijah. 
And he says, you know, I'm 

825
00:46:56,520 --> 00:47:00,720
wondering how did God react to 
that when the people rejected 

826
00:47:00,720 --> 00:47:03,000
the heavenly voice, What did God
say? 

827
00:47:03,640 --> 00:47:08,440
And Eliyahu says, famous line, 
you all know Nitsuni Banai, 

828
00:47:09,040 --> 00:47:12,000
Nitsuni Banai. 
My children have defeated me. 

829
00:47:12,440 --> 00:47:16,160
My children have defeated me. 
God was trying to intervene and 

830
00:47:16,160 --> 00:47:20,400
change things and say, let's go 
with Eliezer, but the rabbis now

831
00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:23,640
have the ball in their hands. 
It's an amazing story about the 

832
00:47:23,640 --> 00:47:27,880
power of halachic discussion. 
But what to me is remarkable is 

833
00:47:27,880 --> 00:47:32,960
that we only know what God felt.
We only know what God was 

834
00:47:32,960 --> 00:47:36,520
thinking because of whom, 
Because of Eliahu. 

835
00:47:37,320 --> 00:47:40,360
So even though he has a minor, 
he just has a line or two in 

836
00:47:40,360 --> 00:47:42,360
that story. 
It's a very it's a very 

837
00:47:42,360 --> 00:47:46,560
significant moment. 
He can convey how God feels. 

838
00:47:46,560 --> 00:47:49,520
He knows how God feels. 
He knows what's going on in the 

839
00:47:49,520 --> 00:47:53,480
upper world and he he reveals it
to to the rabbis. 

840
00:47:55,480 --> 00:48:01,640
Amazing. 
Let's let's turn to the mystical

841
00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:09,440
books, Kabbalah Kasidut. 
Let's understand the persona of 

842
00:48:09,440 --> 00:48:14,040
Elio Navi in these texts. 
Yeah, so he's already changed a 

843
00:48:14,040 --> 00:48:15,840
lot, right from the Bible to the
Talmud. 

844
00:48:15,840 --> 00:48:19,040
He's really become kind of the 
Eliyao Hanavi that that we know.

845
00:48:19,560 --> 00:48:22,000
But there's another element 
that's hinted at already in 

846
00:48:22,000 --> 00:48:25,120
rabbinic literature, right? 
Eliahu is teaching the rabbis, 

847
00:48:25,560 --> 00:48:29,360
but with Kabbalah, we really 
find that Eliahu inspires the 

848
00:48:29,360 --> 00:48:32,520
Mystics. 
After all, we said that he's in 

849
00:48:32,520 --> 00:48:35,880
touch with the ruach, right? 
He's carried by the ruach and 

850
00:48:35,880 --> 00:48:39,800
then he's taken up to heaven in 
the Sahara in the whirlwind. 

851
00:48:40,200 --> 00:48:43,280
But really, there's some 
connection here between Eliahu 

852
00:48:43,640 --> 00:48:47,280
and Ruach Akodesh. 
OK, the Holy Spirit. 

853
00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:49,760
Really. 
I would say that in the 

854
00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:57,080
Kabbalah, Eliyahu conveys the 
Holy Spirit to serious spiritual

855
00:48:57,080 --> 00:48:59,120
seekers. 
How do we know this? 

856
00:48:59,600 --> 00:49:03,400
Well, the early Kabbalists, and 
of course Speaking of Kabbalah, 

857
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:05,360
Kabbalah develops very 
gradually. 

858
00:49:05,360 --> 00:49:08,960
But you could say Kabbalah 
really emerges as a full blown 

859
00:49:08,960 --> 00:49:14,520
movement in Judaism in the 12th 
and 13th centuries in southern 

860
00:49:14,520 --> 00:49:19,800
France and Provence and then 
spilling over the the the 

861
00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:23,200
mountains into Spain. 
That's where Kabbalah merges the

862
00:49:23,200 --> 00:49:26,600
12th and 13th century. 
The Zohar is composed in Spain 

863
00:49:26,600 --> 00:49:30,400
in the 13th century. 
But the earliest Kabbalists from

864
00:49:30,400 --> 00:49:32,880
the end of the 12th century, the
beginning of the 13th century, 

865
00:49:33,280 --> 00:49:36,400
they don't themselves claim to 
have encountered Elijah. 

866
00:49:36,840 --> 00:49:40,960
But in many traditions about 
them it's reported that they had

867
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:44,160
Gilui Eliahu, they had a 
revelation of Elijah. 

868
00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:47,240
So what does that mean? 
I think one thing it means is 

869
00:49:47,240 --> 00:49:51,800
that is that if a kabbalist came
up with a radical new idea, 

870
00:49:51,800 --> 00:49:55,960
let's say a kabbalist said God 
isn't male, God is equally male 

871
00:49:55,960 --> 00:49:59,480
and female. 
Or God is Infinity. 

872
00:50:00,080 --> 00:50:05,080
The name for God is insof 
Infinity or God needs us. 

873
00:50:05,560 --> 00:50:08,240
It's not just that we need God, 
God needs us. 

874
00:50:08,720 --> 00:50:12,720
OK, all these ideas have roots. 
They have hints already in 

875
00:50:12,720 --> 00:50:14,840
rabbinic literature, but the 
Kabbalists came out and 

876
00:50:14,840 --> 00:50:19,760
developed them into full blown 
concepts and and ideas, and if 

877
00:50:19,760 --> 00:50:23,880
they were challenged about their
ideas they could say I didn't 

878
00:50:23,880 --> 00:50:28,800
invent it, Elijah told me. 
So I I don't want to say that 

879
00:50:28,800 --> 00:50:31,840
that's simply an excuse. 
I I think what's going on here 

880
00:50:31,840 --> 00:50:36,800
is some it's really the question
what goes on in the creative 

881
00:50:36,800 --> 00:50:40,600
mind? 
How does an artist, how does a 

882
00:50:40,600 --> 00:50:44,520
genius come up with a new idea? 
You know, you can think of this 

883
00:50:44,520 --> 00:50:48,120
in music or sculpture or 
painting. 

884
00:50:48,520 --> 00:50:53,320
Great artists will often say it 
wasn't me, it was the muse, 

885
00:50:53,320 --> 00:50:54,680
right? 
It was the spirit. 

886
00:50:55,040 --> 00:50:56,960
It was somehow a divine 
illumination. 

887
00:50:56,960 --> 00:51:00,280
It came through me. 
I was the channel, but I wasn't 

888
00:51:00,280 --> 00:51:03,000
the inventor. 
And I think that's very, very 

889
00:51:03,000 --> 00:51:05,360
profound and I think it applies 
to mysticism. 

890
00:51:05,720 --> 00:51:08,360
The Kabbalists didn't invent 
these ideas. 

891
00:51:08,360 --> 00:51:11,880
They somehow they somehow, I 
would say they looked so deep 

892
00:51:11,880 --> 00:51:15,360
within that they discovered 
something beyond. 

893
00:51:16,360 --> 00:51:22,080
And Elijah is the figure that 
they attribute the illumination 

894
00:51:22,080 --> 00:51:23,840
to. 
In other words, he's a 

895
00:51:23,840 --> 00:51:27,120
personification of Ruach 
Hakodesh. 

896
00:51:27,880 --> 00:51:30,280
He's a personification of the 
Holy Spirit. 

897
00:51:31,320 --> 00:51:35,560
Now it's very interesting. 
You have one kabbalist, famous 

898
00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:41,200
kabbalist, Moshe Cordevero. 
He actually says, you know, a 

899
00:51:41,200 --> 00:51:46,160
person might feel that he's 
coming up with it himself, but 

900
00:51:46,160 --> 00:51:48,480
that could be Eliahu speaking to
him. 

901
00:51:48,960 --> 00:51:51,960
In other words, the question is,
does this happen within a person

902
00:51:52,320 --> 00:51:55,280
or does it happen by him 
encountering something beyond 

903
00:51:55,720 --> 00:51:58,200
his normal self? 
It's very hard to pin that down.

904
00:51:58,200 --> 00:52:00,840
And the Maharal, The Maharal of 
Prague. 

905
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:05,880
Yehuda Lev of Prague. 
He says it seemed it might seem 

906
00:52:05,880 --> 00:52:09,680
to the person as if those words 
came from himself, but they were

907
00:52:09,680 --> 00:52:12,960
the words of Eliahu. 
So who is what is Eliahu 

908
00:52:12,960 --> 00:52:16,240
becoming? 
He's becoming the the Channel 4 

909
00:52:16,240 --> 00:52:19,680
illumination, the Channel 4 
inspiration. 

910
00:52:20,480 --> 00:52:24,520
And in a remarkable passage, 
Khayyam Vital right. 

911
00:52:24,840 --> 00:52:27,120
One of the great students, 
perhaps the greatest student of 

912
00:52:27,120 --> 00:52:33,800
Isaac Luria in Svat Khayyam 
Vital actually creates a menu or

913
00:52:33,800 --> 00:52:37,360
I would say a a system, a 
technique. 

914
00:52:37,680 --> 00:52:40,800
How can you attain Guilui 
Eliahu? 

915
00:52:41,440 --> 00:52:43,720
He actually like a science. 
Like a science. 

916
00:52:44,000 --> 00:52:45,400
Almost a science. 
Listen, listen. 

917
00:52:45,400 --> 00:52:47,360
To. 
To his list, this This is how he

918
00:52:47,360 --> 00:52:50,120
says It's remarkable. 
He says if you want to encounter

919
00:52:50,120 --> 00:52:51,640
Elijah, here's what you have to 
do. 

920
00:52:52,840 --> 00:52:57,920
First of all, tishuva, OK. 
Turning back to God doesn't 

921
00:52:57,920 --> 00:53:01,320
sound especially mystical. 
In fact, most of this list is is

922
00:53:01,320 --> 00:53:04,960
just normal rabbinic teaching 
fulfilling them its vote. 

923
00:53:05,680 --> 00:53:09,760
It's #2 sincere Kavanaugh during
prayer. 

924
00:53:09,760 --> 00:53:11,600
Really meaning what you're 
saying. 

925
00:53:11,960 --> 00:53:15,720
Intense study of Torah? 
OK, nothing up to theirs at all.

926
00:53:15,720 --> 00:53:20,360
Remarkably, especially mystical.
That's normal, ethical Jewish 

927
00:53:20,360 --> 00:53:21,680
teaching. 
Now it gets a little more 

928
00:53:22,920 --> 00:53:25,120
interesting and ascetic. 
Lifestyle. 

929
00:53:25,400 --> 00:53:28,240
OK, limiting food and drink and 
sensual pleasures. 

930
00:53:28,840 --> 00:53:32,960
Eliminating negative traits? 
That's pretty difficult. 

931
00:53:33,640 --> 00:53:37,520
Seclusion. 
Frequent immersion in a mikvah 

932
00:53:38,360 --> 00:53:41,920
immersion and ritual bath 
meditating this this is 

933
00:53:41,920 --> 00:53:43,600
remarkable. 
I would call it. 

934
00:53:43,680 --> 00:53:46,200
You could call this normal 
mysticism. 

935
00:53:46,800 --> 00:53:49,520
That's a phrase that that Max 
Kaduchen invented. 

936
00:53:49,520 --> 00:53:52,640
A scholar of the 20th century 
said if you really want to 

937
00:53:52,640 --> 00:53:55,280
understand rabbinic Judaism, 
he's not talking about Kabbalah.

938
00:53:55,640 --> 00:53:58,440
If you really want to understand
the Talmud, it's a normal 

939
00:53:58,440 --> 00:53:59,960
mysticism. 
What does that mean? 

940
00:54:00,320 --> 00:54:03,800
There ways that you can 
encounter God through your daily

941
00:54:03,800 --> 00:54:06,480
activities, right through a 
bracha. 

942
00:54:06,960 --> 00:54:10,320
For saying Abraha, you become 
aware of God's presence in the 

943
00:54:10,320 --> 00:54:13,040
world. 
So this isn't an intense an 

944
00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:15,920
intense version of that. 
But Vital is trying to say 

945
00:54:15,920 --> 00:54:18,320
there's a way to encounter 
Elijah. 

946
00:54:18,320 --> 00:54:22,560
But what's significant is that 
he sees Elijah as one who's 

947
00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:26,160
conveying Ruachha Kodesh, the 
Holy Spirit. 

948
00:54:29,920 --> 00:54:33,840
I would say one other thing that
Louis Ginsburg, great Talmudic 

949
00:54:33,840 --> 00:54:38,040
scholar of the 20th century, he 
says something I think is an 

950
00:54:38,040 --> 00:54:39,920
exaggeration, but this is what 
he says. 

951
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:45,040
What Moses was to the Torah, 
Elijah was to the Kabbalah. 

952
00:54:46,800 --> 00:54:49,640
Of course you can't have the 
Torah without Moshe Torat Moshe.

953
00:54:49,640 --> 00:54:53,400
It's the Torah of Moses. 
To say that Elijah is that 

954
00:54:53,400 --> 00:54:55,760
central to Kabbalah. 
I think it's stretching a little

955
00:54:55,760 --> 00:54:59,840
bit, but the reason he says that
is because of the the things 

956
00:54:59,840 --> 00:55:01,760
that I that I mentioned. 
Because the Kabbalists 

957
00:55:01,760 --> 00:55:05,920
attributed their teachings to 
Elijah, and because Vital says 

958
00:55:05,920 --> 00:55:09,760
it's possible to have a 
revelation of Elijah so that to 

959
00:55:09,760 --> 00:55:14,400
be a Mystic is to be in touch 
with something beyond yourself, 

960
00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:17,920
something beyond your normal 
state of consciousness. 

961
00:55:18,280 --> 00:55:21,680
And Elijah is the is the go 
between. 

962
00:55:22,080 --> 00:55:26,160
Elijah is that virtuoso of the 
in between who connects you with

963
00:55:26,160 --> 00:55:28,840
something beyond your normal 
awareness. 

964
00:55:29,680 --> 00:55:36,000
So it's in a way the Kabbalists 
are sort of. 

965
00:55:37,400 --> 00:55:44,920
While the Sages try to bring 
Elijah back down, it seems like 

966
00:55:44,920 --> 00:55:49,200
the Kabbalists, instead of 
rendering him incomplete and 

967
00:55:49,200 --> 00:55:55,280
trying to and trying to fix 
what's left to fix, they kind of

968
00:55:55,280 --> 00:56:00,120
doubled down on the persona of 
who he was and kind of just 

969
00:56:00,120 --> 00:56:02,880
relegate him way up there in the
heavens. 

970
00:56:04,040 --> 00:56:07,200
It's really interesting you say 
that because, you know, it's 

971
00:56:07,200 --> 00:56:09,200
it's hard to be too black and 
white here. 

972
00:56:09,200 --> 00:56:11,280
You know, we've talked about 
his, his change or 

973
00:56:11,280 --> 00:56:13,800
transformation. 
There's a person I I respect 

974
00:56:13,800 --> 00:56:18,280
very much, an Israeli scholar, 
Oded Israeli, the scholar of 

975
00:56:18,280 --> 00:56:21,440
Kabbalah Beersheva. 
But he says this is overblown. 

976
00:56:21,440 --> 00:56:24,560
Elijah doesn't change that much 
between the Bible and the 

977
00:56:24,560 --> 00:56:25,920
Talmud. 
I think. 

978
00:56:25,920 --> 00:56:28,000
I think he's wrong. 
I I think, you know, we can't 

979
00:56:28,000 --> 00:56:31,320
see important change. 
But what you're saying brings 

980
00:56:31,320 --> 00:56:34,080
brings me back to that. 
You know, you do find Elijah 

981
00:56:34,080 --> 00:56:35,880
already compassionate in the 
Bible, right? 

982
00:56:35,880 --> 00:56:37,680
He brings this little boy back 
to life. 

983
00:56:38,160 --> 00:56:41,200
He's trying to bring the people 
back to God because he believes 

984
00:56:41,200 --> 00:56:43,400
in the one true God. 
It's not that he's a vicious, 

985
00:56:43,880 --> 00:56:47,040
but. 
He's detached, but he's 

986
00:56:47,040 --> 00:56:48,760
detached. 
He's detached, right. 

987
00:56:48,760 --> 00:56:50,120
He's not in touch with the 
people. 

988
00:56:50,120 --> 00:56:53,840
He becomes more human in Khazal.
But of course you know for the 

989
00:56:53,880 --> 00:56:56,560
for the rabbis too, he has a a 
unique nature. 

990
00:56:56,560 --> 00:56:59,800
He really, he's really an Angel.
He's really an Angel. 

991
00:56:59,800 --> 00:57:02,520
Already in the Talmud, of fact 
that Talmud near the beginning 

992
00:57:02,520 --> 00:57:05,400
of the entire Talmud right at 
the very beginning of Brachod. 

993
00:57:05,680 --> 00:57:09,160
The rabbis say, you know 
Michael, the Angel, the 

994
00:57:09,160 --> 00:57:13,400
Archangel Michael, he can cross 
the whole world in one swoop. 

995
00:57:14,640 --> 00:57:19,280
For Gavriel it takes 2. 
For Elijah it takes four. 

996
00:57:20,240 --> 00:57:22,920
Elijah can cross the whole world
and four glides. 

997
00:57:23,320 --> 00:57:26,320
So he's an Angel, but he's 
really, he's half human and half

998
00:57:26,320 --> 00:57:27,880
Angel. 
He's the most human of all the 

999
00:57:27,880 --> 00:57:33,000
angels because he's still he 
can, he can be he he can, he can

1000
00:57:33,000 --> 00:57:35,200
get upset, right? 
He can get upset. 

1001
00:57:35,200 --> 00:57:40,160
And the rabbis talk about that. 
But one Rabbi, 1 rabbi who was 

1002
00:57:40,160 --> 00:57:42,560
visited by Elijah. 
Now we've talked about why 

1003
00:57:42,560 --> 00:57:45,920
Elijah will will visit a rabbi 
because the rabbi is a sincere 

1004
00:57:45,920 --> 00:57:49,640
seeker or very great scholar. 
Sometimes Elijah will stop 

1005
00:57:49,640 --> 00:57:53,400
coming to a rabbi, a regular 
rabbi who he's come to very 

1006
00:57:53,400 --> 00:57:54,640
often. 
He'll stop coming to him. 

1007
00:57:54,640 --> 00:57:56,520
Why? 
Because the rabbi did the 

1008
00:57:56,520 --> 00:58:00,120
tiniest thing wrong, the tiniest
ethical infraction. 

1009
00:58:00,400 --> 00:58:04,720
Elijah will stop coming. 
So for one rabbi, Elijah shows 

1010
00:58:04,720 --> 00:58:06,520
up, then he stops coming, then 
he comes back. 

1011
00:58:06,520 --> 00:58:10,040
The rabbi says, you know, you 
know, why did you come back? 

1012
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:13,880
And the rabbi says, well, you 
know, because because you 

1013
00:58:13,880 --> 00:58:17,040
insulted me, you said, you said 
that I get angry. 

1014
00:58:18,040 --> 00:58:21,280
And the rabbi said, look, you're
getting angry right now. 

1015
00:58:21,800 --> 00:58:25,240
So Elijah can get angry and he 
can, he can be upset about 

1016
00:58:25,240 --> 00:58:27,160
things. 
But basically the rabbis are are

1017
00:58:27,160 --> 00:58:28,760
humanizing him. 
And I think you're right, the 

1018
00:58:28,760 --> 00:58:32,800
Kabbalah then almost almost 
divinizes him. 

1019
00:58:33,240 --> 00:58:35,320
Want to read you one, one very 
brief quote. 

1020
00:58:35,320 --> 00:58:37,760
I actually have it at the very 
beginning of of my book. 

1021
00:58:38,960 --> 00:58:42,560
This is from that same 
Kabbalist, Moses Cordavero. 

1022
00:58:43,160 --> 00:58:48,320
Look what he says, his mystery. 
He's talking about Elijah. 

1023
00:58:49,040 --> 00:58:52,760
His mystery is really the 
mystery of divinity spreading. 

1024
00:58:53,880 --> 00:58:58,880
The divine energy clothes itself
in him, extending to the world. 

1025
00:58:59,640 --> 00:59:02,560
Elijah never appears in the 
world without the mystery of 

1026
00:59:02,560 --> 00:59:05,280
divinity revealing itself 
through him. 

1027
00:59:05,960 --> 00:59:10,000
The mystery of God on earth is 
the mystery of Elijah. 

1028
00:59:10,600 --> 00:59:15,440
The closest that divinity can 
possibly come to humanity is the

1029
00:59:15,440 --> 00:59:20,720
mystery of Elijah. 
It's really a remarkable 

1030
00:59:20,720 --> 00:59:23,000
passage. 
I I found that at the very end 

1031
00:59:23,000 --> 00:59:27,760
of my work the book actually 
what was already finished and I 

1032
00:59:27,760 --> 00:59:29,520
found it. 
I found that I couldn't believe 

1033
00:59:29,520 --> 00:59:32,960
that the Cordavero said that. 
He said it's kind of lost in one

1034
00:59:32,960 --> 00:59:35,400
of his multi volume works on the
Zohar. 

1035
00:59:36,400 --> 00:59:39,480
But you know it's shocking to 
say this, but I think you may 

1036
00:59:39,480 --> 00:59:41,280
have thought this already or 
people hearing this. 

1037
00:59:41,360 --> 00:59:46,360
It almost sounds like this is a 
Christian talking about you know

1038
00:59:46,360 --> 00:59:51,920
who the famous, the famous 
Jewish boy in in Galilee to say 

1039
00:59:51,920 --> 00:59:57,400
that divinity has entered him. 
It sounds almost UN Jewish and 

1040
00:59:57,400 --> 01:00:00,160
yet hear Cordoviro saying that. 
But it comes back to what you 

1041
01:00:00,160 --> 01:00:01,920
were saying. 
The rabbis are bringing him down

1042
01:00:01,920 --> 01:00:05,880
to earth somewhat. 
And the Kabbalah sees him as the

1043
01:00:05,920 --> 01:00:10,400
embodiment of of Ruach Hakodesh.
And in some in some kabbalistic 

1044
01:00:10,400 --> 01:00:14,320
literature, correct me if I'm 
wrong, he's kind of associated 

1045
01:00:14,320 --> 01:00:19,320
with the Angel Sandalphon which 
is like it's he's kind of like 

1046
01:00:19,360 --> 01:00:23,880
the the spiritual brother of 
Metatron who's who's Khanoch. 

1047
01:00:24,360 --> 01:00:27,720
So, like, there's yeah, he's, 
he's elevated to that stature. 

1048
01:00:27,720 --> 01:00:30,040
Yes, he's identified with 
Sandalphon. 

1049
01:00:30,040 --> 01:00:33,080
Occasionally he's even 
identified with Metatron, but 

1050
01:00:33,080 --> 01:00:35,520
more more common as you identify
with St. 

1051
01:00:35,520 --> 01:00:38,400
Alphon. 
So he is an Angel and and a very

1052
01:00:38,480 --> 01:00:40,320
prominent Angel. 
And that's in kabbalistic 

1053
01:00:40,320 --> 01:00:42,120
literature. 
Not that you wouldn't find in 

1054
01:00:42,120 --> 01:00:45,440
the Talmud, but you, but you 
find it in Kabbalah, yeah? 

1055
01:00:45,840 --> 01:00:49,920
So I think one of the maybe it's
intentional or not intentional, 

1056
01:00:49,920 --> 01:00:55,120
but I think the the direction 
that the Kabbalah took Elianabi,

1057
01:00:55,800 --> 01:00:59,200
he he's kind of like, you know 
the the rabbinic tradition is 

1058
01:00:59,200 --> 01:01:03,560
kind of kind of feels like it's 
like static or uncreative 

1059
01:01:03,800 --> 01:01:07,880
because there's this Iridata 
Dorot and you have this 

1060
01:01:08,200 --> 01:01:13,520
imaginative new kind of movement
which is like revelatory, right.

1061
01:01:13,520 --> 01:01:16,840
It's a new it's it's, it's it's 
kind of the opposite, where the 

1062
01:01:16,840 --> 01:01:21,440
further down you go in history, 
the more revelations become, you

1063
01:01:21,440 --> 01:01:24,880
know, part of, like you, you 
understand what I'm saying. 

1064
01:01:25,320 --> 01:01:28,400
You're saying it in in Kabbalah.
Kabbalah, it's like the 

1065
01:01:28,400 --> 01:01:30,880
opposite. 
It's almost like, OK, the rabbis

1066
01:01:30,880 --> 01:01:35,400
of the past were were greater in
in let's say tradition, but now 

1067
01:01:35,680 --> 01:01:39,240
it there's this new idea where 
like their imagination can kind 

1068
01:01:39,240 --> 01:01:42,640
of reveal new things that they. 
Yes, yes. 

1069
01:01:42,680 --> 01:01:44,880
Opposite, yeah. 
Very much so. 

1070
01:01:44,880 --> 01:01:46,840
And I would say, you know what? 
What makes it especially 

1071
01:01:46,840 --> 01:01:51,040
interesting is that Kabbalah is 
simultaneously new and ancient. 

1072
01:01:52,480 --> 01:01:53,760
I'll I'll say what I mean by 
that. 

1073
01:01:53,760 --> 01:01:56,760
You know the Zohar, the Zohar 
rite, the masterpiece of 

1074
01:01:56,760 --> 01:02:00,480
Kabbalah which is attributed to 
Rabashima and Barochai, right? 

1075
01:02:00,480 --> 01:02:04,520
Orthodox kabbalists really. 
All Hasidim, all kabbalists 

1076
01:02:04,520 --> 01:02:07,440
would insist that the Zohar 
really goes back to the 2nd 

1077
01:02:07,440 --> 01:02:11,360
century, was composed by or in 
the circle of Rashbir or Bashima

1078
01:02:11,360 --> 01:02:13,840
and Barochai. 
But I think the three of us and 

1079
01:02:13,840 --> 01:02:19,360
most most modern Orthodox and 
non Orthodox Jews would Most 

1080
01:02:19,360 --> 01:02:23,800
most non ultra Orthodox. 
Orthodox Jews would say that 

1081
01:02:23,800 --> 01:02:25,920
that would admit the Zohar is a 
medieval work. 

1082
01:02:26,520 --> 01:02:31,760
And the Zohar calls its 
teachings Milin, Hadatin, 

1083
01:02:31,760 --> 01:02:36,640
Atikin, new ancient words. 
So what does that mean? 

1084
01:02:36,640 --> 01:02:39,080
If something's either new or 
ancient, how can it be new and 

1085
01:02:39,080 --> 01:02:41,560
ancient? 
Well, the Zohar simultaneously 

1086
01:02:41,560 --> 01:02:44,120
knew an ancient. 
First of all because it pretends

1087
01:02:44,120 --> 01:02:46,640
to be ancient. 
It pretends to be the work of 

1088
01:02:46,640 --> 01:02:47,960
Rashby. 
But really it's written in the 

1089
01:02:47,960 --> 01:02:52,120
13th century, I think mostly by 
the Kabbalist Moshe de Leon, 

1090
01:02:53,120 --> 01:02:56,040
Moses de Leon. 
So it's in that sense it's new 

1091
01:02:56,040 --> 01:02:58,760
in ancient. 
It's composed right now in 13th 

1092
01:02:58,760 --> 01:03:02,040
century Spain, but it pretends 
to be 1100 years earlier. 

1093
01:03:02,480 --> 01:03:05,600
But it's also new in ancient in 
a different way, these radical 

1094
01:03:05,600 --> 01:03:09,680
ideas about God. 
Take for example Shekinah the 

1095
01:03:09,760 --> 01:03:12,440
the God is is is a feminine 
presence. 

1096
01:03:12,440 --> 01:03:15,280
Now the Kabbalah does not invent
the word shrinah, right? 

1097
01:03:15,280 --> 01:03:17,560
It never appears in the Bible, 
but you have it a hundreds of 

1098
01:03:17,560 --> 01:03:19,160
times in the Talmud, in the 
Midrash. 

1099
01:03:19,520 --> 01:03:21,560
So the question is, who is 
Shreena? 

1100
01:03:21,560 --> 01:03:25,200
For Khazal, she's not the wife 
of God. 

1101
01:03:25,200 --> 01:03:27,440
You would never find in the 
Talmud that the Shreena is 

1102
01:03:27,440 --> 01:03:29,920
married to the Holy One, blessed
be he. 

1103
01:03:30,240 --> 01:03:33,280
But you do find descriptions of 
Shreena in which she seems to be

1104
01:03:33,280 --> 01:03:37,640
somewhat motherly, somewhat the 
the compassionate protective 

1105
01:03:37,880 --> 01:03:40,000
figure, right? 
She's hovering over the people. 

1106
01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:42,640
Israel. 
She's sharing exile with the 

1107
01:03:42,640 --> 01:03:45,560
people. 
The transcendent Karush Baruchu,

1108
01:03:45,840 --> 01:03:48,480
he's up in heaven. 
But Shrinah is somehow the part 

1109
01:03:48,480 --> 01:03:51,920
of God that's with the people. 
So the roots of the Kabbalistic 

1110
01:03:51,920 --> 01:03:56,040
notion of Shrinah are there. 
But she's not overtly feminine. 

1111
01:03:56,760 --> 01:04:00,720
And in the Zohar, she's misses 
God, you know, she's married to 

1112
01:04:00,720 --> 01:04:03,080
the Holy One, blessed, but he. 
So that's something that's new 

1113
01:04:03,080 --> 01:04:06,360
in ancient in a sense. 
You could say it's even more 

1114
01:04:06,360 --> 01:04:09,000
ancient because we spoke about 
Baal. 

1115
01:04:09,000 --> 01:04:12,320
Right. 
But who's Baal's partner in the 

1116
01:04:12,400 --> 01:04:16,000
ancient Near East? 
Asherah, right. 

1117
01:04:16,000 --> 01:04:18,880
And the people are not only 
worshipping Baal, the masculine 

1118
01:04:18,880 --> 01:04:22,480
Canaanite God, they're 
worshipping the goddess Asherah.

1119
01:04:23,080 --> 01:04:25,280
And we know that this was very 
widespread. 

1120
01:04:25,280 --> 01:04:27,960
You you mentioned then see, I'm 
sorry. 

1121
01:04:28,520 --> 01:04:31,160
They had these notions, OK. 
They had these notions. 

1122
01:04:31,160 --> 01:04:33,840
They were attracted to Asherah. 
You know, you mentioned before 

1123
01:04:33,840 --> 01:04:37,200
the people were torn between the
worship of Baal and the worship 

1124
01:04:37,200 --> 01:04:39,560
of Yudhay Vavehe. 
Some of them wanted to have 

1125
01:04:39,560 --> 01:04:41,680
their cake and eat it too. 
Some of them wanted to worship 

1126
01:04:41,680 --> 01:04:44,640
Baal and Asherah and Yudhay 
Vave. 

1127
01:04:45,320 --> 01:04:47,400
Some of them went. 
Some of them went even further. 

1128
01:04:47,400 --> 01:04:49,880
Archaeologists have found 
inscriptions. 

1129
01:04:50,400 --> 01:04:52,520
You know, I'm offering, I'm 
giving this offering. 

1130
01:04:52,520 --> 01:04:57,440
I'm offering this prayer to 
Yudhay Vavehe and his asherah. 

1131
01:04:58,800 --> 01:05:02,320
So some Jews thought that 
Asherah was the consort of udhe 

1132
01:05:02,400 --> 01:05:04,920
Vavhe, right? 
We know that it was actually a 

1133
01:05:04,920 --> 01:05:09,280
statue of the asherah in the 
temple in the bed of Mikdash for

1134
01:05:09,280 --> 01:05:12,160
a good number of decades, right?
During the rule of Kingman 

1135
01:05:12,160 --> 01:05:15,880
Asherah, I think it was or one 
or another kings had actually a 

1136
01:05:15,880 --> 01:05:19,280
statue of Asherah in the temple,
which meant that must mean that 

1137
01:05:19,280 --> 01:05:22,000
we're Israelites who thought 
that Asherah was the goddess. 

1138
01:05:22,280 --> 01:05:24,680
The rabbis. 
The Bible, of course, eliminates

1139
01:05:24,680 --> 01:05:28,120
this. 
The rabbis speak of God almost 

1140
01:05:28,120 --> 01:05:33,000
solely in in masculine terms, 
but you could say Shekinah is in

1141
01:05:33,000 --> 01:05:36,840
some way, I'm saying to a 
limited extent, is in some way 

1142
01:05:36,840 --> 01:05:41,400
the return of the ancient 
goddess into Judaism. 

1143
01:05:41,760 --> 01:05:44,720
That's what's so shocking about 
Kabbalah, and that's why the 

1144
01:05:44,720 --> 01:05:47,640
Kabbalists were very careful 
about spreading their teachings 

1145
01:05:48,000 --> 01:05:50,080
right. 
They were intentionally cryptic 

1146
01:05:50,400 --> 01:05:53,480
and secretive because they knew 
this was, this is quite 

1147
01:05:53,480 --> 01:05:55,160
shocking. 
Sholem, the great scholar 

1148
01:05:55,160 --> 01:05:58,000
Gershom Sholem has a wonderful 
phrase for this. 

1149
01:05:58,000 --> 01:06:01,600
He he says it's this is the 
revenge of myth. 

1150
01:06:03,240 --> 01:06:05,800
The return of the goddess is the
revenge of myth. 

1151
01:06:05,800 --> 01:06:08,840
That myth, that Canaanite myth, 
which had been battled, which 

1152
01:06:08,840 --> 01:06:11,840
had been defeated by the rabbi, 
by the Bible, already by the 

1153
01:06:11,840 --> 01:06:16,560
rabbis, it somehow retained A 
subterranean life and then it 

1154
01:06:16,560 --> 01:06:20,160
emerges in the heart of rabbinic
Judaism in the Kabbalah. 

1155
01:06:20,160 --> 01:06:23,280
So in that way too, it's new. 
It's new and ancient so. 

1156
01:06:24,520 --> 01:06:25,480
It's so interesting. 
Go ahead. 

1157
01:06:25,480 --> 01:06:26,360
Sorry. 
Go ahead, go. 

1158
01:06:26,880 --> 01:06:27,800
Ahead, go ahead. 
Anjun No. 

1159
01:06:28,000 --> 01:06:31,040
I was gonna say in a way like 
Maimonides lit the match that 

1160
01:06:31,040 --> 01:06:34,760
brought this all from under the 
surface unintentionally. 

1161
01:06:34,760 --> 01:06:37,360
But you know this is now like 
kind of the revenge. 

1162
01:06:37,640 --> 01:06:39,560
It's an anti maimonidean 
movement. 

1163
01:06:39,560 --> 01:06:42,680
Yes, yes. 
Maimonides is so important to 

1164
01:06:42,680 --> 01:06:45,360
the birth of Kabbalah. 
You know, we can talk about this

1165
01:06:45,360 --> 01:06:48,360
more more at length than other 
time, but it's so it's so vital.

1166
01:06:48,640 --> 01:06:52,200
The Kabbalah is in many ways a 
reaction against Maimonides as 

1167
01:06:52,200 --> 01:06:55,440
if he had gone too far, as if he
had rationalized things too 

1168
01:06:55,440 --> 01:06:58,160
much. 
God becomes so abstract and so 

1169
01:06:58,160 --> 01:07:00,160
removed. 
For some of the Kabbalistic 

1170
01:07:00,160 --> 01:07:04,120
theology, Maimonides is very 
important in a positive way, 

1171
01:07:04,120 --> 01:07:06,160
right? 
They basically their idea of God

1172
01:07:06,160 --> 01:07:08,760
is insof. 
God is Infinity. 

1173
01:07:09,200 --> 01:07:11,320
Maimonides never calls God 
insof. 

1174
01:07:11,320 --> 01:07:14,240
But that depiction that the 
scripture of God is very 

1175
01:07:14,240 --> 01:07:17,640
Maimonidean, it's really right. 
God is beyond anything you can 

1176
01:07:17,640 --> 01:07:19,480
imagine. 
God is beyond anything you you 

1177
01:07:19,480 --> 01:07:22,120
can describe. 
There's even a more radical name

1178
01:07:22,120 --> 01:07:26,880
than Insof and that's the name 
Ayan spelled with an Aleph Aleph

1179
01:07:26,880 --> 01:07:28,880
Yud Nun. 
What does Ayyan mean? 

1180
01:07:28,880 --> 01:07:31,080
It means nothing. 
I don't mean it doesn't mean 

1181
01:07:31,080 --> 01:07:32,160
anything. 
It means nothing. 

1182
01:07:32,160 --> 01:07:35,120
It means nothingness. 
That's the name the Kabbalah 

1183
01:07:35,120 --> 01:07:37,480
gives for the highest level of 
God. 

1184
01:07:38,120 --> 01:07:40,360
It's really indistinguishable 
from Insof. 

1185
01:07:41,000 --> 01:07:43,640
Infinity and Ion are are really 
one in the same. 

1186
01:07:43,640 --> 01:07:45,280
Now what? 
Where does Ion come from? 

1187
01:07:45,760 --> 01:07:49,120
It really comes from Maimonides 
negative theology. 

1188
01:07:50,160 --> 01:07:52,440
They're just taking negative 
theology to the extreme. 

1189
01:07:52,440 --> 01:07:55,960
Maimonides says what The more 
you deny about God, the more you

1190
01:07:55,960 --> 01:08:00,320
negate about describing God, the
closer you are to understanding 

1191
01:08:00,320 --> 01:08:02,560
God. 
The Kabbalah just takes that to 

1192
01:08:02,560 --> 01:08:05,040
the extreme. 
Let's actually call God Ion. 

1193
01:08:05,640 --> 01:08:07,480
That's the that's the most 
accurate thing to say. 

1194
01:08:07,480 --> 01:08:09,600
God is No. 
It's not that God is nothing. 

1195
01:08:09,880 --> 01:08:12,160
God is no thing. 
Right. 

1196
01:08:12,160 --> 01:08:14,520
It's it's almost like it's 
almost like they're hedging in a

1197
01:08:14,520 --> 01:08:18,120
way because they're they're 
they're kind of taking this 

1198
01:08:18,120 --> 01:08:22,120
aspect this this ain't self and 
then they're they're adding the 

1199
01:08:22,160 --> 01:08:26,120
other side of it, which is more 
like radical and it's kind of 

1200
01:08:26,120 --> 01:08:28,840
like they they can kind of dance
between the two. 

1201
01:08:28,840 --> 01:08:32,800
But I also wanted to mention 
something that came to my mind 

1202
01:08:32,800 --> 01:08:36,000
and Yermiyahu, there was a there
were a group of Jews who were 

1203
01:08:36,439 --> 01:08:38,680
worshipping the Queen of the 
Heavens. 

1204
01:08:39,359 --> 01:08:41,479
And. 
And and that that in a way that 

1205
01:08:41,479 --> 01:08:46,279
even crept into our Sidor during
during the High Holidays, the 

1206
01:08:46,960 --> 01:08:51,520
Rosh Hashanah Kippur during the 
the Parnassa part where where 

1207
01:08:51,520 --> 01:08:54,640
people did the D carnosa that 
whole there's a pasuka. 

1208
01:08:54,640 --> 01:08:58,240
It's brought in over there from 
Yermiyahu that references that. 

1209
01:08:58,240 --> 01:09:00,399
It's very interesting how that 
part of. 

1210
01:09:00,439 --> 01:09:03,560
The yeah, I think they're 
they're they're weaving Kava 

1211
01:09:03,560 --> 01:09:08,840
note for malkata shamayim. 
So, so that the goddess is 

1212
01:09:08,840 --> 01:09:10,640
there, the goddess is there in 
the background. 

1213
01:09:10,640 --> 01:09:11,800
Right. 
Ashira, Right. 

1214
01:09:11,800 --> 01:09:15,000
You have that word ashira a good
number of times in the Torah, 

1215
01:09:15,000 --> 01:09:16,760
right? 
Don't plant an ashira. 

1216
01:09:17,040 --> 01:09:18,920
So what is an ashira? 
It's a tree. 

1217
01:09:19,120 --> 01:09:21,560
It's either a pole or a tree. 
It's probably a tree. 

1218
01:09:21,560 --> 01:09:24,600
It's a sacred tree. 
So it's nature worship and 

1219
01:09:24,600 --> 01:09:27,120
goddess worship. 
It's there and the Bible is 

1220
01:09:27,120 --> 01:09:29,359
fighting it. 
And my mind is, you could say, 

1221
01:09:29,359 --> 01:09:32,680
you know, it's trying to put the
nail in the coffin by saying God

1222
01:09:32,680 --> 01:09:34,880
is totally abstract. 
The Kabbalists say, what do you 

1223
01:09:34,880 --> 01:09:36,880
mean? 
You know, God is male and 

1224
01:09:36,880 --> 01:09:37,840
female. 
So you're right. 

1225
01:09:37,840 --> 01:09:40,000
It's almost like the Kabbalists 
want to have their cake and eat 

1226
01:09:40,000 --> 01:09:42,680
it too. 
They say ultimately God is in 

1227
01:09:42,680 --> 01:09:46,479
SOF, God is nothingness. 
But and really, there's an 

1228
01:09:46,479 --> 01:09:50,160
amazing passage in the Zohar 
where the Zohar says this fear 

1229
01:09:50,160 --> 01:09:53,520
wrote a real only from our 
perspective. 

1230
01:09:54,560 --> 01:09:58,800
Ultimately, everything is just 
in SOF, but because of the the 

1231
01:09:58,800 --> 01:10:02,760
limits of the human mind, we 
have to picture God in this way.

1232
01:10:02,760 --> 01:10:05,360
So they're kind of admitting 
that this is, to a certain 

1233
01:10:05,360 --> 01:10:08,000
extent, a human projection. 
Right. 

1234
01:10:08,000 --> 01:10:11,720
It's a it's like the what became
known as seder histal shalut in 

1235
01:10:12,480 --> 01:10:16,920
in the Hasidic works. 
But you know what's interesting 

1236
01:10:16,920 --> 01:10:21,040
is that, you know, I, I, we, we 
joke about this a lot. 

1237
01:10:21,040 --> 01:10:23,000
But it's kind of like a literal 
metaphor. 

1238
01:10:23,200 --> 01:10:26,280
So when it when it it suits 
them, when it suits the argument

1239
01:10:26,280 --> 01:10:28,400
for it to be literal, then it's 
literal, but when it doesn't 

1240
01:10:28,560 --> 01:10:31,040
argument then it's. 
So it's interesting how they 

1241
01:10:31,040 --> 01:10:36,240
kind of, you know, have this 
amazing kind of way of 

1242
01:10:36,520 --> 01:10:39,640
introducing these ideas. 
Very unique way of doing it for 

1243
01:10:39,640 --> 01:10:41,040
sure. 
Yeah. 

1244
01:10:41,120 --> 01:10:42,520
No, you're you're right. 
You're right. 

1245
01:10:42,880 --> 01:10:47,200
There's very little in the Zohar
about NSOF, maybe a total of 2 

1246
01:10:47,200 --> 01:10:51,920
pages about NSOF and Ian, the 
thousands of pages on Shrinan, 

1247
01:10:51,920 --> 01:10:54,960
her romance with the Kurdish 
Borochu, with the Holy One, 

1248
01:10:54,960 --> 01:10:56,640
blessed be he. 
So even though ultimately they 

1249
01:10:56,640 --> 01:10:59,840
say it's, it's from our 
perspective, that's what that's 

1250
01:10:59,840 --> 01:11:03,680
what they're writing about. 
So before we move on to I want 

1251
01:11:03,680 --> 01:11:05,880
to plug your your translation of
the Zohar. 

1252
01:11:06,120 --> 01:11:09,800
But I do want to end going back 
to the first before we move to 

1253
01:11:09,800 --> 01:11:15,080
the next segment is the stories 
of Eliana V in on the High 

1254
01:11:15,080 --> 01:11:17,520
Holidays or he comes on Pesa 
right. 

1255
01:11:17,520 --> 01:11:23,720
And he he comes to every Brit 
milah and he, you know he shows 

1256
01:11:23,720 --> 01:11:27,480
up on mute Shabbat. 
So I from what I understand or 

1257
01:11:27,600 --> 01:11:31,960
the way I see it is that in a 
way that's kind of God's quote 

1258
01:11:31,960 --> 01:11:35,160
UN quote punishment for his 
behavior in in the Navi where 

1259
01:11:35,160 --> 01:11:38,920
he's where he has to like you 
wanted to kill all you want all 

1260
01:11:38,920 --> 01:11:40,640
the Jews to die. 
You weren't willing to stand up 

1261
01:11:40,640 --> 01:11:43,040
for them. 
Now, these are the three main 

1262
01:11:43,040 --> 01:11:47,240
ways that Jews declare their 
loyalty to Hashem. 

1263
01:11:47,240 --> 01:11:48,880
And I'm gonna make you go to 
each one of these. 

1264
01:11:48,880 --> 01:11:50,960
You're gonna be there, 'cause 
you're gonna, you're gonna bear 

1265
01:11:50,960 --> 01:11:54,080
witness to the continuity that 
you wanted to deny. 

1266
01:11:54,400 --> 01:11:56,480
So I think that's a, you know, 
one of the thing that I wanted 

1267
01:11:56,480 --> 01:11:57,680
to point out before but I 
forgot. 

1268
01:11:58,640 --> 01:12:01,360
Yeah, I I would say that that 
applies especially to one of 

1269
01:12:01,360 --> 01:12:04,080
those three. 
You know, I I think where it's 

1270
01:12:04,080 --> 01:12:08,040
clearest is in Breit Mila Cano. 
Why does Eliahu show up at a 

1271
01:12:08,040 --> 01:12:08,920
circumcision? 
Right. 

1272
01:12:08,920 --> 01:12:11,400
There's actually a chair for 
Eliahu right? 

1273
01:12:11,400 --> 01:12:13,800
Known as Kisei Eliahu. 
There are many of these. 

1274
01:12:13,800 --> 01:12:18,400
There's a woman in Beersheva 
who's written extensive studies 

1275
01:12:18,400 --> 01:12:20,600
on comparing different chairs of
Eliahu. 

1276
01:12:20,880 --> 01:12:26,160
It's an amazing work of art. 
So why does Eliahu show up at at

1277
01:12:26,160 --> 01:12:28,120
the At the Covenant of 
Circumcision? 

1278
01:12:28,560 --> 01:12:31,760
The earliest explanation of this
is in a beautiful midrash. 

1279
01:12:32,760 --> 01:12:37,080
Midrash known as Pirque de Rabi 
Eliezer write the chapters of 

1280
01:12:37,080 --> 01:12:39,240
Rabi Eliezer. 
We mentioned Eliezer before, who

1281
01:12:39,240 --> 01:12:43,000
was the one in that story of the
oven of Achni Very interesting, 

1282
01:12:43,000 --> 01:12:45,360
idiosyncratic figure in the 
Talmud. 

1283
01:12:46,600 --> 01:12:51,680
So there you have in Pircade 
Rabi Eliezer it it retells what 

1284
01:12:51,680 --> 01:12:54,600
happened at Sinai, right? 
God says Malachafo, what are you

1285
01:12:54,600 --> 01:12:57,560
doing here? 
And Elijah says Kano Kineti. 

1286
01:12:57,920 --> 01:13:00,880
I've been so zealous. 
And according to the Midrash, 

1287
01:13:00,880 --> 01:13:03,080
God says, oh, you're always 
zealous. 

1288
01:13:03,480 --> 01:13:05,000
Why are you always zealous, 
Eliao? 

1289
01:13:05,000 --> 01:13:06,680
You can never stop being 
zealous. 

1290
01:13:07,200 --> 01:13:11,720
And Eliao says, well, qui azvu 
brich ha, they've abandoned your

1291
01:13:11,720 --> 01:13:14,360
covenant, right. 
And the word breathe, of course,

1292
01:13:14,360 --> 01:13:17,240
is the same as Brete Mila, the 
covenant of circumcision. 

1293
01:13:17,600 --> 01:13:19,840
God says, you think they've 
abandoned the covenant. 

1294
01:13:20,200 --> 01:13:22,400
From now on, you have to show up
at every breach. 

1295
01:13:22,920 --> 01:13:25,800
You have to show up at every 
covenant to to witness exactly 

1296
01:13:25,800 --> 01:13:28,680
what you said to witness. 
The people of Israel have kept 

1297
01:13:28,680 --> 01:13:30,280
the covenant. 
So there, there. 

1298
01:13:30,280 --> 01:13:32,240
It's the clearest example where 
it's punishment. 

1299
01:13:32,640 --> 01:13:35,200
Some scholars say, you know, 
even there, it's not punishment.

1300
01:13:35,200 --> 01:13:38,400
It's actually it's a reward. 
You care so much about the 

1301
01:13:38,400 --> 01:13:40,320
covenant. 
You can be at every covenant. 

1302
01:13:40,640 --> 01:13:43,320
But I think the simple 
explanation of that passage is 

1303
01:13:43,320 --> 01:13:47,200
that is that really, it's a 
punishment for Elijah's 

1304
01:13:47,520 --> 01:13:49,120
zealotry. 
He's been too zealous. 

1305
01:13:49,120 --> 01:13:51,840
He's been too antagonistic to 
the people. 

1306
01:13:51,840 --> 01:13:53,480
He denies that they keep the 
covenant. 

1307
01:13:53,480 --> 01:13:56,320
Now he'll witness that they have
the covenant, the Seder and 

1308
01:13:56,320 --> 01:13:57,360
Hobdell. 
I think they're a little 

1309
01:13:57,360 --> 01:13:59,480
different. 
The Seder. 

1310
01:13:59,480 --> 01:14:04,280
OK, now anybody who you could 
say every Jew in the world has 

1311
01:14:04,320 --> 01:14:08,080
some relationship with Eliyahu, 
because you know you can find a 

1312
01:14:08,080 --> 01:14:10,560
Jew who doesn't even go to 
Sholan Yom Kippur. 

1313
01:14:10,560 --> 01:14:12,320
They may they may show up at a 
Seder. 

1314
01:14:12,720 --> 01:14:15,520
If not this year, Last year, 
when they were a kid, what 

1315
01:14:15,520 --> 01:14:18,760
Jewish kid was not at a Seder at
some point in his life? 

1316
01:14:18,760 --> 01:14:21,520
There might be a few, but very, 
very tiny percentage. 

1317
01:14:22,400 --> 01:14:23,680
And what it What do you 
remember? 

1318
01:14:23,680 --> 01:14:25,160
You remember what's so 
remarkable? 

1319
01:14:25,160 --> 01:14:27,920
Remember opening the door for 
this figure, even if he doesn't 

1320
01:14:27,920 --> 01:14:30,240
seem to appear? 
You open the door for Elia. 

1321
01:14:30,240 --> 01:14:32,040
You have a cup on the table for 
Eliau. 

1322
01:14:32,040 --> 01:14:34,920
So what's the origin of that? 
It's very interesting. 

1323
01:14:35,400 --> 01:14:39,360
The door actually opening the 
door originally has nothing to 

1324
01:14:39,360 --> 01:14:42,720
do with Eliau, you could say. 
It has to do with what we say at

1325
01:14:42,720 --> 01:14:47,360
the very beginning of the seder 
called Dejfin Ye TE viejul. 

1326
01:14:47,880 --> 01:14:50,040
Anyone who's hungry let him come
and eat. 

1327
01:14:50,600 --> 01:14:53,880
Some people would open the door 
at their seder so that people 

1328
01:14:53,880 --> 01:14:55,520
who needed to come in could come
in. 

1329
01:14:56,760 --> 01:14:59,720
Or another reason before it's 
ever connected to Eliahu. 

1330
01:14:59,720 --> 01:15:02,280
Another reason for opening the 
door is that this is known as 

1331
01:15:02,560 --> 01:15:06,080
Leil Shimurim, right? 
The night of protection. 

1332
01:15:06,600 --> 01:15:08,960
Already in Exodus. 
This night is described as a 

1333
01:15:08,960 --> 01:15:11,360
Leil Shimurim. 
There probably means a vigil. 

1334
01:15:11,720 --> 01:15:13,480
You should keep vigil on this 
night. 

1335
01:15:13,480 --> 01:15:16,280
You're about to leave Egypt. 
You're staying up all night. 

1336
01:15:16,720 --> 01:15:19,680
The first born have just been 
killed or baking matzah, getting

1337
01:15:19,680 --> 01:15:22,360
ready for the the journey. 
This is a night to prepare for 

1338
01:15:22,360 --> 01:15:23,960
the journey. 
It's a little shimmerim. 

1339
01:15:24,960 --> 01:15:27,800
The rabbis took that to mean if 
this is a night of protection, 

1340
01:15:28,240 --> 01:15:31,040
you're so well protected you 
don't have to lock your door. 

1341
01:15:31,720 --> 01:15:35,360
So it was a custom in the Middle
Ages before Elijah ever appears 

1342
01:15:35,360 --> 01:15:37,920
at a Seder. 
There was a custom to have the 

1343
01:15:37,920 --> 01:15:41,520
door unlocked or have to the 
door open, but then it turns 

1344
01:15:41,520 --> 01:15:43,320
into opening the door for 
Elijah. 

1345
01:15:43,320 --> 01:15:46,360
That's a relatively late point. 
The door is open even before the

1346
01:15:46,360 --> 01:15:49,240
door is connected to Elijah. 
Now what about the cup? 

1347
01:15:49,400 --> 01:15:51,640
Having a cup on the table for 
Elijah? 

1348
01:15:52,160 --> 01:15:56,320
The this doesn't appear until 
the 15th century. 

1349
01:15:57,160 --> 01:16:00,240
It's not in the Talmud, it's not
in the early codes, it's not in 

1350
01:16:00,240 --> 01:16:02,320
Maimonides. 
No mention about a cup for 

1351
01:16:02,320 --> 01:16:04,960
Elijah anywhere before the 15th 
century. 

1352
01:16:04,960 --> 01:16:07,280
Why? 
Why do you have a cup? 

1353
01:16:07,920 --> 01:16:10,160
Well, everybody has to have a 
cup. 

1354
01:16:11,160 --> 01:16:14,560
We're hoping that Elijah will 
come to announce the mashiach. 

1355
01:16:14,560 --> 01:16:17,440
He's going to need a cup of wine
too, if he shows up. 

1356
01:16:17,440 --> 01:16:18,800
We don't want to delay the 
seder. 

1357
01:16:18,800 --> 01:16:20,680
The seder takes long enough as 
it is. 

1358
01:16:21,040 --> 01:16:23,760
We don't want to delay the seder
to find a cup, make sure it's 

1359
01:16:23,760 --> 01:16:26,960
clean, make sure it's kosher to 
Pesach to get wine. 

1360
01:16:26,960 --> 01:16:29,440
So we have a cup of wine 
already. 

1361
01:16:30,680 --> 01:16:34,000
But the gallon of Vilna has a 
more interesting explanation. 

1362
01:16:34,520 --> 01:16:37,240
How many cups of wine are you 
supposed to drink at the Seder? 

1363
01:16:37,840 --> 01:16:40,440
There's actually a debate about 
this already in the Talmud. 

1364
01:16:40,960 --> 01:16:43,520
According to the manuscripts of 
the Talmud, it's not clear 

1365
01:16:43,520 --> 01:16:46,360
whether it's four cups or five 
cups, right. 

1366
01:16:46,360 --> 01:16:50,000
We now drink 4 cups, but there's
a reference to to 1/5 cup. 

1367
01:16:50,800 --> 01:16:53,800
But at a certain point there was
a debate about this. 

1368
01:16:53,800 --> 01:16:54,920
In the Talmud. 
There was a debate. 

1369
01:16:54,920 --> 01:16:57,240
The gown of Illness says it's 
still not clear. 

1370
01:16:57,640 --> 01:17:00,040
It's still not clear whether it 
should be 4 cups or five cups. 

1371
01:17:00,040 --> 01:17:04,800
When Elijah comes, he'll he'll 
resolve all doubts, right? 

1372
01:17:04,800 --> 01:17:07,360
We mentioned this before that 
Elijah will resolve disputes. 

1373
01:17:07,360 --> 01:17:10,600
He'll also make. 
He'll help us understand what 

1374
01:17:10,600 --> 01:17:13,160
the right halachic decision is. 
He won't make a decision, but 

1375
01:17:13,160 --> 01:17:16,040
he'll clarify things enough that
we'll see what the right 

1376
01:17:16,040 --> 01:17:18,200
decision is. 
So he's going to resolve the 

1377
01:17:18,200 --> 01:17:21,400
doubt. 
So we pour 1/5 cup, but we don't

1378
01:17:21,400 --> 01:17:24,360
drink it. 
And it's called the Cup of 

1379
01:17:24,360 --> 01:17:26,240
Eliahu. 
Not because necessarily he's 

1380
01:17:26,240 --> 01:17:28,840
going to drink it, but because 
he'll resolve whether we should 

1381
01:17:28,840 --> 01:17:31,360
drink it. 
But once it was poured, it was 

1382
01:17:31,360 --> 01:17:33,120
understood that's is poured for 
him. 

1383
01:17:33,760 --> 01:17:37,040
So that's why the the origin of 
of the door and the origin of 

1384
01:17:37,040 --> 01:17:38,640
the cup. 
And now both of them are are 

1385
01:17:38,640 --> 01:17:42,040
connected directly, directly 
with Eliahu. 

1386
01:17:42,040 --> 01:17:43,920
It's a beautiful. 
Yeah. 

1387
01:17:44,200 --> 01:17:46,600
Please. 
Oh, I was going to say, when we 

1388
01:17:46,600 --> 01:17:51,400
talked about Eliahu and 
resolving old doubt in Tanas, 

1389
01:17:52,080 --> 01:17:56,360
Eliahu was extremely black and 
white in terms of how we went 

1390
01:17:56,360 --> 01:17:57,760
about things. 
Extremely. 

1391
01:17:58,520 --> 01:18:04,280
There was no, he didn't give a 
minuscule and I don't know when 

1392
01:18:04,280 --> 01:18:08,320
I hear the idea of Alia removing
doubt, I think that's that's 

1393
01:18:08,320 --> 01:18:13,720
kind of displaying his persona. 
One that was he was always sure 

1394
01:18:13,720 --> 01:18:18,320
about everything and he was at 
1000 mph and there was no, there

1395
01:18:18,320 --> 01:18:21,640
was no in between for him. 
There was no everything. 

1396
01:18:21,920 --> 01:18:24,400
You got what I'm saying? 
Yeah, but on the other hand, 

1397
01:18:24,400 --> 01:18:26,440
he's going to be able to 
reconcile things. 

1398
01:18:26,640 --> 01:18:28,640
You know, he'll show. 
He'll show when it's clear. 

1399
01:18:28,880 --> 01:18:31,680
So in that case, in that sense, 
he's like he was in the Bible 

1400
01:18:31,880 --> 01:18:34,440
without any doubt. 
But he'll he'll make peace 

1401
01:18:34,440 --> 01:18:37,080
between contending parties. 
And really, what? 

1402
01:18:37,080 --> 01:18:40,280
Remember, remember what Malachi 
says already in Malachi the 

1403
01:18:40,280 --> 01:18:44,480
Hishev Levavot al Banim, the Lev
Banim Alavot Tom. 

1404
01:18:44,840 --> 01:18:47,040
Maybe that's the most messianic 
thing possible. 

1405
01:18:47,040 --> 01:18:50,000
To bring parents, bring 
children's hearts back to their 

1406
01:18:50,000 --> 01:18:52,200
parents, bring parents hearts 
back to their children. 

1407
01:18:52,520 --> 01:18:55,840
So he'll reconcile things. 
Even though he was black and 

1408
01:18:55,840 --> 01:18:58,040
white, he'll be the one to to 
make peace. 

1409
01:18:58,520 --> 01:19:01,320
So he he bridges, he bridges 
those those two extremes. 

1410
01:19:01,520 --> 01:19:03,160
Touches those, those points, 
yeah. 

1411
01:19:03,760 --> 01:19:06,600
One more thing about Pesach that
the real reason, the real 

1412
01:19:06,600 --> 01:19:09,840
connection between El Rio and 
Pesach is not the door, it's not

1413
01:19:09,840 --> 01:19:11,880
the cup, it's that what is 
Pesach. 

1414
01:19:11,960 --> 01:19:14,560
Pesach is the time of 
redemption, right? 

1415
01:19:14,560 --> 01:19:16,680
The redemption from slavery in 
Egypt. 

1416
01:19:16,680 --> 01:19:20,080
And according to the rabbis the 
Mashiach will come on Pesach. 

1417
01:19:21,360 --> 01:19:24,200
So for the final redemption will
be on Pesach, just as the 

1418
01:19:24,200 --> 01:19:26,720
original redemption from 
Mitzrayim was on Pesach. 

1419
01:19:27,160 --> 01:19:29,520
If the Messiah is going to come 
on Pesach, he's going to have to

1420
01:19:29,520 --> 01:19:32,960
be announced by Liahoo. 
So that I think is really the 

1421
01:19:33,000 --> 01:19:35,320
the original connection between 
Elihal and Pesach. 

1422
01:19:35,800 --> 01:19:38,960
Then the door and the cup is 
what we what we remember, what 

1423
01:19:38,960 --> 01:19:40,920
we know now. 
So. 

1424
01:19:42,600 --> 01:19:45,840
And and Abdullah, we really 
spoke about really that Elijah 

1425
01:19:45,840 --> 01:19:48,720
won't come on Friday. 
Well, could he come on Shabbat? 

1426
01:19:48,720 --> 01:19:51,000
Well, we don't know if he can 
fly on Shabbat or not. 

1427
01:19:51,360 --> 01:19:53,680
OK, he can't come on Friday. 
He can't come on Shabbat. 

1428
01:19:53,680 --> 01:19:56,640
As soon as Shabbat is done, no 
more excuses of Liao. 

1429
01:19:56,640 --> 01:19:59,320
You have to come. 
But here too you could say it's 

1430
01:19:59,320 --> 01:20:03,400
really about Mashiach. 
Because after all, Shabbat is 

1431
01:20:03,400 --> 01:20:08,520
Mein olam Haba, a a taste of the
world to come, and the Mashiach 

1432
01:20:08,560 --> 01:20:12,440
is described as Yom shakulo 
Shabbat The time that's in, 

1433
01:20:12,560 --> 01:20:17,160
that's full time Shabbat, seven 
days a week, 724 Shabbat. 

1434
01:20:17,680 --> 01:20:20,360
So it makes sense that Elijah 
would be connected with that 

1435
01:20:20,640 --> 01:20:23,160
messianic aspect. 
Of Shabbat. 

1436
01:20:23,360 --> 01:20:25,560
But singing, you know, singing. 
Tu Eliahu. 

1437
01:20:26,000 --> 01:20:28,720
Singing. 
Invoking his name at the close 

1438
01:20:28,720 --> 01:20:30,000
of Abdallah. 
So beautiful. 

1439
01:20:30,000 --> 01:20:34,240
When I was growing up, my father
taught us a melody that was new 

1440
01:20:34,640 --> 01:20:37,720
then. 
I'm sure I'm sure you know it. 

1441
01:20:37,760 --> 01:20:41,240
Al svat Yam Kineret. 
Right? 

1442
01:20:41,800 --> 01:20:44,600
Al svat. 
Yam kineret. 

1443
01:20:45,120 --> 01:20:58,040
Arman Rafti Ferret gan El 
shamnatua Bo ETS Loya nua niigar

1444
01:20:58,040 --> 01:21:13,480
shamrak na R ka O FIDA R lo me 
sham toh rahu MI π eliahu. 

1445
01:21:14,240 --> 01:21:19,720
What about a little boy studying
Torah at Yom Kineret straight 

1446
01:21:19,720 --> 01:21:23,960
from the mouth of Eliahu? 
So that was a song we sang. 

1447
01:21:23,960 --> 01:21:29,360
It was a poem written in the 
1920s, but my dad fell in love 

1448
01:21:29,360 --> 01:21:32,640
with it and taught us that was 
kind of connecting Eliahu, he 

1449
01:21:32,640 --> 01:21:38,240
didn't want just Eliahu ha Navi.
He wanted some some new melody, 

1450
01:21:38,640 --> 01:21:42,120
some new flavor. 
But I think many Jews connect 

1451
01:21:42,120 --> 01:21:46,400
Eliahu primarily with the Seder,
but for for many of us with with

1452
01:21:46,400 --> 01:21:52,720
havdallah too. 
I couldn't help but notice that 

1453
01:21:52,960 --> 01:21:55,880
it could be purposeful or not, 
and I think it is. 

1454
01:21:55,880 --> 01:22:00,280
But I couldn't help but notice 
that the character of Rabbi 

1455
01:22:00,280 --> 01:22:04,240
Shimon Bar Yokai that's using 
the Zohar kind of has the same 

1456
01:22:04,240 --> 01:22:08,760
kind of motifs where in the in 
the Talmud he is this strict 

1457
01:22:08,760 --> 01:22:11,440
person who only sees black and 
white, and he's sent into The 

1458
01:22:11,440 --> 01:22:17,280
Cave and you know, he he is he 
he's like, he has, he's kind of 

1459
01:22:17,280 --> 01:22:18,760
sent to gehen om right, an 
extra. 

1460
01:22:19,000 --> 01:22:20,840
He sent that extra year back 
into The Cave, 'cause he didn't 

1461
01:22:20,840 --> 01:22:23,240
learn his lesson and he didn't 
know how to, you know, interact 

1462
01:22:23,240 --> 01:22:24,640
with human beings. 
And he thought they should be 

1463
01:22:24,640 --> 01:22:28,840
learning Torah all the time. 
And then and then in this dohar 

1464
01:22:28,840 --> 01:22:31,480
in the Kabbalah, he's like the 
face of God. 

1465
01:22:31,640 --> 01:22:35,040
And he is almost like he becomes
kind of like this kind of 

1466
01:22:35,760 --> 01:22:40,840
deified, deified character in a 
way like like El Yao Navy. 

1467
01:22:40,840 --> 01:22:42,400
So I feel like there's like some
type of. 

1468
01:22:42,400 --> 01:22:44,680
Yeah, very interesting. 
There's definitely a close 

1469
01:22:44,680 --> 01:22:47,840
connection. 
He's so harsh and extreme and 

1470
01:22:48,160 --> 01:22:52,200
you know so chauvinistic in 
terms of Israel and and the and 

1471
01:22:52,200 --> 01:22:56,160
the goyim and then in in the 
Zohar he, he's this beatific 

1472
01:22:56,160 --> 01:22:59,840
figure and he's almost, he's 
really divinized in a sense. 

1473
01:23:00,080 --> 01:23:03,520
So the connection between Rashby
and and Eliyahu and in the 

1474
01:23:03,520 --> 01:23:06,680
Zohar, Eliahu appears and he's 
he's in touch with Rashi. 

1475
01:23:06,720 --> 01:23:10,080
But especially in the later 
parts of the Zohar what's called

1476
01:23:10,080 --> 01:23:14,280
Tikkune Haz Zohar and 
Rayamehemna. 

1477
01:23:14,280 --> 01:23:16,760
They're two later parts of the 
Zohar written a little bit after

1478
01:23:16,760 --> 01:23:21,480
the other parts and there Eliahu
plays a very prominent role And 

1479
01:23:21,480 --> 01:23:25,800
he and Rashbi, he and Rabashimon
are in are in close discussion 

1480
01:23:26,760 --> 01:23:30,200
of and in fact and Eliahu 
praises Rabashimon and says, you

1481
01:23:30,200 --> 01:23:36,000
know you oh it's a really 
connect. 

1482
01:23:36,000 --> 01:23:37,960
You know, it's interesting you 
mentioned The Cave story. 

1483
01:23:38,200 --> 01:23:42,400
Eliahu makes a short appearance 
there right at after their 

1484
01:23:42,520 --> 01:23:45,360
rubbish Shimon and his son rebel
Lazar in The Cave for 12 years 

1485
01:23:45,680 --> 01:23:47,720
and Eliahu doesn't have direct 
contact with him. 

1486
01:23:47,720 --> 01:23:50,840
What happens is that Liao passes
by at the end of 12 years and 

1487
01:23:50,840 --> 01:23:54,080
says who's going to tell rubbish
Shimon that he can come out 

1488
01:23:54,800 --> 01:23:58,000
because the Roman emperor had 
died, the emperor wanted to kill

1489
01:23:58,000 --> 01:24:01,520
him or the Roman Roman ruler who
wants to kill him had died. 

1490
01:24:01,520 --> 01:24:05,640
And Eliahu makes it known but 
Rabashima has no direct contact.

1491
01:24:05,920 --> 01:24:09,680
Well, what happens in the Zohar?
That story is retold the story 

1492
01:24:09,680 --> 01:24:12,360
of Rabashima in The Cave. 
But what happens? 

1493
01:24:12,360 --> 01:24:16,080
Eliahu goes in every day and 
teaches them Torah. 

1494
01:24:17,440 --> 01:24:19,120
He doesn't appear at the end of 
12 years. 

1495
01:24:19,120 --> 01:24:21,200
He appears every day and teaches
Torah. 

1496
01:24:21,200 --> 01:24:24,440
Trabashima So you could say and 
that's where the the origin 

1497
01:24:24,440 --> 01:24:28,840
story of the Zohar in the Zohar,
the Zora says Herbashima when he

1498
01:24:28,840 --> 01:24:31,080
was in The Cave, Eliahu taught 
him Torah. 

1499
01:24:31,520 --> 01:24:33,800
What's the record of what Eliahu
taught him? 

1500
01:24:34,760 --> 01:24:39,080
The Zohar. 
So the Zohar was born from the 

1501
01:24:39,080 --> 01:24:42,040
Gilui Eliahu from Eliahu 
appearing to Rabishimon. 

1502
01:24:42,480 --> 01:24:45,360
That seems to be the Zohar's own
understanding of how the Zohar 

1503
01:24:45,640 --> 01:24:47,400
emerged. 
And that's how kabbalists 

1504
01:24:47,400 --> 01:24:50,200
understood it, that the Zohar 
was composed in The Cave 

1505
01:24:50,760 --> 01:24:55,480
dictated or inspired by Eliahu. 
So Eliahu and Herbashima really,

1506
01:24:55,480 --> 01:25:00,680
really closely connected. 
So most of our listeners know 

1507
01:25:00,680 --> 01:25:05,040
how much we love the Zohar. 
But I wanted to actually get 

1508
01:25:05,040 --> 01:25:09,200
into your book because the 
translation of the Zohar, which 

1509
01:25:09,200 --> 01:25:12,560
is phenomenal what you've done. 
I want to understand why you 

1510
01:25:12,560 --> 01:25:16,480
felt it was necessary to 
translate the source in so many 

1511
01:25:16,480 --> 01:25:21,480
translations exist and you 
mentioned these controversial or

1512
01:25:21,480 --> 01:25:24,720
revolutionary ideas that that 
introduced. 

1513
01:25:25,120 --> 01:25:28,160
What is it about? 
It's very obvious. 

1514
01:25:28,160 --> 01:25:31,080
I mean, everybody today is most,
most Jews are very interested in

1515
01:25:31,080 --> 01:25:34,360
Kabbalah and Kasidu. 
Why do you feel like it is 

1516
01:25:34,360 --> 01:25:39,320
relevant to today's reader? 
Yeah, well, first my 

1517
01:25:39,320 --> 01:25:41,520
translation. 
The reason I translated it was 

1518
01:25:41,520 --> 01:25:44,120
really because someone asked me 
to. 

1519
01:25:44,680 --> 01:25:48,840
A woman in the Pritzker family, 
Margot Pritzker married to Tom 

1520
01:25:48,840 --> 01:25:51,640
Pritzker, who's the CEO of the 
Hyatt Corporation. 

1521
01:25:51,640 --> 01:25:56,560
And she became in fascinated 
with Jewish mysticism and she 

1522
01:25:56,560 --> 01:25:59,560
started studying with an 
Orthodox rabbi, Emmani Yuhreel 

1523
01:25:59,560 --> 01:26:02,120
Pupko. 
You may know or or know of him 

1524
01:26:02,120 --> 01:26:04,520
of a very well known Orthodox 
family, the Pupko family in 

1525
01:26:04,520 --> 01:26:07,040
Pittsburgh and Montreal and 
Seattle. 

1526
01:26:07,640 --> 01:26:12,800
So Margot Pritzker began 
studying Parsha, Chavua and 

1527
01:26:12,800 --> 01:26:16,280
Torah and Midrash with Rabbi 
Yuhio Pupko in Chicago. 

1528
01:26:16,800 --> 01:26:19,160
And after a while she wanted to 
study Zohar. 

1529
01:26:19,920 --> 01:26:23,160
So they began studying the all 
the Old English translation that

1530
01:26:23,160 --> 01:26:26,760
existed then. 
It was back in the early 1990s, 

1531
01:26:26,760 --> 01:26:30,640
I think, and that's the known as
the Sensino translation. 

1532
01:26:30,640 --> 01:26:33,880
It was done in the 1930s. 
It's actually not bad, but it's 

1533
01:26:33,880 --> 01:26:37,000
more of a paraphrase. 
Sometimes it skips over 

1534
01:26:37,000 --> 01:26:39,800
difficult passages, sometimes 
there'll be a footnote. 

1535
01:26:39,800 --> 01:26:42,400
We've skipped the the next 10 
pages because they're 

1536
01:26:42,400 --> 01:26:45,680
impenetrable and there's no 
commentary. 

1537
01:26:46,080 --> 01:26:49,120
But still I I I found it 
interesting and and useful. 

1538
01:26:49,320 --> 01:26:53,480
So they started studying Zohar 
using that, and after a while, 

1539
01:26:53,480 --> 01:26:56,840
either Margot Pritzker said to 
Rabia Puko or he said to her 

1540
01:26:57,600 --> 01:27:00,600
this is inadequate, let's do a 
new one. 

1541
01:27:01,600 --> 01:27:03,960
So it actually came out of their
Torah study. 

1542
01:27:04,040 --> 01:27:06,960
Their Torah study being 
dissatisfied with what existed, 

1543
01:27:07,480 --> 01:27:12,480
they wanted to have a new one 
translated and they contacted me

1544
01:27:12,480 --> 01:27:18,600
through through Arthur Green and
I originally I was overwhelmed 

1545
01:27:18,600 --> 01:27:20,600
by it. 
I was fascinated, but I I said, 

1546
01:27:20,600 --> 01:27:23,720
you know, I I have to take some 
time to think about this because

1547
01:27:23,720 --> 01:27:25,800
I, I had some idea of what it 
would involve. 

1548
01:27:26,400 --> 01:27:29,560
So I said let me think about it.
I had yet met or even talked 

1549
01:27:29,560 --> 01:27:33,880
with Rabbi Popko or Margot 
Pritzker, just art, Green said. 

1550
01:27:33,920 --> 01:27:35,760
Of course I understand you need 
to think about it. 

1551
01:27:36,520 --> 01:27:39,200
So I thought about it for a 
week, for a few weeks, for a 

1552
01:27:39,200 --> 01:27:43,400
month, for a couple months. 
Then I decided let's let me try 

1553
01:27:43,400 --> 01:27:45,440
it. 
So without contacting them, I 

1554
01:27:45,440 --> 01:27:48,880
just I had a month off from 
teaching in December, January 

1555
01:27:48,880 --> 01:27:51,640
break for one month. 
I sat down and I just translated

1556
01:27:51,640 --> 01:27:54,120
Zohar. 
Every day, three hours a day, a 

1557
01:27:54,120 --> 01:27:56,000
few hours a day, whatever I 
could manage. 

1558
01:27:56,520 --> 01:27:59,400
And after that month I decided 
I'm definitely not doing this. 

1559
01:28:00,520 --> 01:28:04,640
It was just too it was too I 
thought I would drown in the 

1560
01:28:04,640 --> 01:28:06,400
Zohar. 
So I called art. 

1561
01:28:06,400 --> 01:28:08,960
I said it's a wonderful 
opportunity, but I have to say 

1562
01:28:08,960 --> 01:28:13,200
no And Art Green said, He said, 
OK, I understand you you that 

1563
01:28:13,200 --> 01:28:16,680
you're gonna say no, but why 
don't you just meet them and 

1564
01:28:16,680 --> 01:28:19,680
tell them no? 
So that was my mistake. 

1565
01:28:19,680 --> 01:28:22,840
I agreed to meet with them. 
I met with with Margot Pritzker 

1566
01:28:22,840 --> 01:28:25,440
and I'm sitting with Margot 
Pritzker and Rabbit Pupko and 

1567
01:28:25,440 --> 01:28:28,040
Art Green. 
I basically tried to talk Margot

1568
01:28:28,040 --> 01:28:30,640
out of it. 
I said Tishby already has 

1569
01:28:30,640 --> 01:28:33,240
translated a lot of it and 
there's this Ensino translation 

1570
01:28:33,240 --> 01:28:36,520
and and I just, I just feel it's
it's too much. 

1571
01:28:37,160 --> 01:28:40,600
She said OK, I understand, but 
if you did do it, how long would

1572
01:28:40,600 --> 01:28:44,240
it take? 
I said 12 to 15 years. 

1573
01:28:45,320 --> 01:28:48,840
She said you're not scaring me. 
Tell me. 

1574
01:28:48,840 --> 01:28:51,400
When she said that something 
flipped inside of me. 

1575
01:28:51,400 --> 01:28:54,880
I said OK, I'll do it. 
So I was. 

1576
01:28:54,880 --> 01:29:00,120
I was won over and turned into 
18 years with an 18 year project

1577
01:29:01,320 --> 01:29:09,920
from 1998 to 20/16/1997 to 2015.
I actually did 9 volumes which 

1578
01:29:09,920 --> 01:29:13,080
cover the Zohar and the Torah. 
There were three more volumes. 

1579
01:29:13,080 --> 01:29:18,440
We also did other later sections
of the Zohar on Shirhar Shirim, 

1580
01:29:18,440 --> 01:29:20,720
the Song of Songs on Ruth, other
passages. 

1581
01:29:21,080 --> 01:29:23,640
And that's the Pritzkers wanted 
it done by certain date. 

1582
01:29:23,640 --> 01:29:27,600
So at a certain point I agreed 
and I tutored two other people 

1583
01:29:27,600 --> 01:29:29,400
who completed the entire 
project. 

1584
01:29:29,640 --> 01:29:33,560
So the whole thing is 12 volumes
and it ended up taking nearly 

1585
01:29:33,560 --> 01:29:35,880
nearly 20 years, right? 
But. 

1586
01:29:36,560 --> 01:29:39,160
The Zohar people don't realize 
that, you know, A lot of people 

1587
01:29:39,160 --> 01:29:42,000
don't realize that the Zohar's 
like an anthology more than it 

1588
01:29:42,000 --> 01:29:46,360
is a book, 'cause it, it takes, 
you know, it, it developed over 

1589
01:29:46,960 --> 01:29:49,920
time. 
So like did you, did you take on

1590
01:29:49,960 --> 01:29:53,000
all of those parts of it or just
some of? 

1591
01:29:53,000 --> 01:29:56,360
It we we included everything 
that was completed. 

1592
01:29:57,680 --> 01:30:02,320
I would say by the end of the 
13th century we we excluded 2 

1593
01:30:02,320 --> 01:30:07,760
components to later components, 
Tikuniha, Zohar and Raya 

1594
01:30:07,760 --> 01:30:09,280
Mehemna. 
I mentioned them briefly a 

1595
01:30:09,280 --> 01:30:12,000
little while ago. 
Those are imitations of the 

1596
01:30:12,000 --> 01:30:15,440
Zohar, written a little bit 
after the main sections. 

1597
01:30:15,440 --> 01:30:18,920
But even what we translated, as 
you say it's almost a library. 

1598
01:30:19,160 --> 01:30:22,240
The main part of the Zohar is a 
a running commentary on the 

1599
01:30:22,240 --> 01:30:26,800
Torah and that that it's really 
a midrash. 

1600
01:30:26,800 --> 01:30:29,400
It's really a mystical midrash. 
In fact, its earliest, one of 

1601
01:30:29,400 --> 01:30:34,080
its earliest names is Midrashan 
Elam, the Midrash, the which 

1602
01:30:34,080 --> 01:30:37,560
could mean the concealed midrash
or the midrash of the concealed.

1603
01:30:38,320 --> 01:30:41,920
It was also called Midrash 
Rashbi, the Midrash of Rabbi 

1604
01:30:41,920 --> 01:30:44,480
Shimon. 
And gradually it's called the 

1605
01:30:44,480 --> 01:30:45,680
Zohar. 
But to go back to your original 

1606
01:30:45,680 --> 01:30:48,320
question, why I translated it so
I translated it because Margot 

1607
01:30:48,920 --> 01:30:50,760
wanted to be able to understand 
it. 

1608
01:30:51,280 --> 01:30:54,520
But I also translated it because
what they found that the earlier

1609
01:30:54,520 --> 01:30:58,080
translations were inadequate. 
So they were inadequate because 

1610
01:30:58,080 --> 01:31:01,160
they didn't explain the 
symbolism, they didn't explain 

1611
01:31:01,160 --> 01:31:03,160
the sources. 
So a lot of what I do in my 

1612
01:31:03,160 --> 01:31:07,000
notes in half of each page is 
half his translation and half 

1613
01:31:07,000 --> 01:31:10,240
his commentary. 
My commentary I show where the 

1614
01:31:10,240 --> 01:31:13,320
rabbis where the Zohar's drawing
on the rabbis, where they're 

1615
01:31:13,320 --> 01:31:15,200
quoting from the midrash from 
the Talmud. 

1616
01:31:15,560 --> 01:31:19,840
And I explain the the symbolism 
of the sifi rote of Shekinah, of

1617
01:31:19,840 --> 01:31:23,640
the other qualities of God. 
And I also talk about the unique

1618
01:31:23,640 --> 01:31:26,440
Aramaic, because we didn't 
mention so far the Zohar's 

1619
01:31:26,440 --> 01:31:29,440
written in Aramaic. 
Why was it written in Aramaic? 

1620
01:31:29,920 --> 01:31:33,360
Why was it written in Hebrew? 
Hardly anything is written in 

1621
01:31:33,360 --> 01:31:35,320
Aramaic. 
In the Middle Ages, Jewish books

1622
01:31:35,320 --> 01:31:38,040
are written in Hebrew. 
The authors of the Zohar wrote 

1623
01:31:38,040 --> 01:31:39,280
in Aramaic. 
Why? 

1624
01:31:40,160 --> 01:31:42,280
Make it. 
Look to make it look ancient. 

1625
01:31:43,200 --> 01:31:46,000
Actually, Rashbi, you know, 
could have written in Hebrew or 

1626
01:31:46,000 --> 01:31:48,680
Aramaic, but they wrote in 
Aramaic to make it look 

1627
01:31:48,680 --> 01:31:49,920
Talmudic. 
They. 

1628
01:31:50,360 --> 01:31:52,360
Wrote they wrote in Aramaic to 
make it look like the Talmud. 

1629
01:31:52,360 --> 01:31:55,320
Their claim is really this is 
the Talmud that disappeared. 

1630
01:31:55,720 --> 01:31:59,480
This is the part of the Talmud 
that never made it to us and and

1631
01:31:59,480 --> 01:32:02,240
rub Moshe de Leon is making it 
available. 

1632
01:32:02,600 --> 01:32:07,840
But the language the the Aramaic
is obviously the one of the one 

1633
01:32:07,840 --> 01:32:11,160
of the indicators that it's not 
Rabbu Shimon is that it's like a

1634
01:32:11,160 --> 01:32:13,800
very different dialect that he 
would didn't speak. 

1635
01:32:14,400 --> 01:32:17,880
It's a very unique Aramaic. 
It's really there's no existing 

1636
01:32:18,320 --> 01:32:20,480
Aramaic dialect that matches the
Zohar. 

1637
01:32:20,480 --> 01:32:23,920
In fact, in Graduate School, I 
once asked the very fine scholar

1638
01:32:23,920 --> 01:32:26,840
of Aramaic I'll leave out his 
name, 'cause I don't want to 

1639
01:32:26,880 --> 01:32:29,160
cause of what? 
I'm going to say what he said. 

1640
01:32:29,520 --> 01:32:33,200
I I want to do a readings course
in the Zohar with this great 

1641
01:32:33,200 --> 01:32:35,680
scholar of Aramaic because I 
wanted to see how he would 

1642
01:32:35,680 --> 01:32:39,120
analyze exactly what you're 
saying, the unique style of the 

1643
01:32:39,120 --> 01:32:40,680
of Aramaic. 
And what did he say to me? 

1644
01:32:40,680 --> 01:32:43,760
He said I don't deal in corrupt 
Aramaic. 

1645
01:32:46,080 --> 01:32:49,560
So the the Zohar isn't corrupt, 
but the Zohar is is unique, it's

1646
01:32:49,560 --> 01:32:52,720
idiosyncratic because how did 
Moshe delay on write it? 

1647
01:32:53,040 --> 01:32:57,560
He wrote it because he knew what
he knew the Talmud and he knew 

1648
01:32:57,560 --> 01:33:01,000
Targum Unkulus. 
He knew the Aramaic translation 

1649
01:33:01,000 --> 01:33:03,080
of the Torah cause. 
Traditionally that's studied 

1650
01:33:03,320 --> 01:33:05,840
each week with a Torah portion, 
right? 

1651
01:33:05,840 --> 01:33:09,360
Shanaya MI Gravekhad Targum, you
read the Torah portion twice in 

1652
01:33:09,360 --> 01:33:11,440
the original, once in the 
Aramaic. 

1653
01:33:11,440 --> 01:33:15,280
Moshe de Leon grew up reading 
the Torah portion in Aramaic. 

1654
01:33:15,280 --> 01:33:18,360
So he knew Aramaic from studying
the Talmud, from studying the 

1655
01:33:18,360 --> 01:33:21,000
Targum, and that's the Aramaic 
he used for the Zohar. 

1656
01:33:21,360 --> 01:33:24,680
But he, I would say he's really 
thinking in Hebrew and writing 

1657
01:33:24,680 --> 01:33:26,880
in Aramaic and exactly like you 
said. 

1658
01:33:26,880 --> 01:33:29,840
That's how scholars finally 
caught him, 'cause they realize 

1659
01:33:29,840 --> 01:33:32,960
this doesn't match the Bavli, it
doesn't match Unclas exactly. 

1660
01:33:33,040 --> 01:33:35,520
It's here and there. 
Sometimes a Spanish word will 

1661
01:33:35,520 --> 01:33:39,680
drop in, sometimes it'll be 
Hebrew with an olive fatter. 

1662
01:33:39,680 --> 01:33:44,320
At the end, like de Vecuta. 
There's no Aramaic word de 

1663
01:33:44,320 --> 01:33:47,760
Vecuta, it's Hebrew de Vecut 
cleaving to God. 

1664
01:33:48,160 --> 01:33:50,360
Most of land turns it into de 
Vecuta. 

1665
01:33:51,640 --> 01:33:54,200
He does that again and again, 
adding an olive to a Hebrew 

1666
01:33:54,200 --> 01:33:56,880
word. 
So the Aramaic is strange and 

1667
01:33:56,880 --> 01:34:00,200
because of that many 
translations misunderstand it. 

1668
01:34:00,600 --> 01:34:02,920
What's unique about my 
translation, really the most 

1669
01:34:02,920 --> 01:34:06,400
important, one of the most 
important features of it is that

1670
01:34:06,400 --> 01:34:10,880
it's based on not a normal 
printed Zohar. 

1671
01:34:11,720 --> 01:34:15,160
Our normal printed Zohar's have 
already been at the they've been

1672
01:34:15,160 --> 01:34:18,520
gone through such, gone through 
such a process of corruption, 

1673
01:34:18,520 --> 01:34:20,720
you could say. 
What I did is I went back to the

1674
01:34:20,720 --> 01:34:25,760
original manuscripts of the 
Zohar and I changed the text 

1675
01:34:26,160 --> 01:34:30,240
based on better readings, what I
considered better readings in 

1676
01:34:30,240 --> 01:34:33,200
the manuscript. 
So in a sense, I reconstituted 

1677
01:34:33,600 --> 01:34:36,600
an Aramaic text of the Zohar 
that is not in print, although 

1678
01:34:36,600 --> 01:34:39,480
it will be at some point. 
Right now it's on the website of

1679
01:34:39,480 --> 01:34:42,040
Stanford University Press, the 
publisher. 

1680
01:34:42,040 --> 01:34:45,920
There you can find the Zohar, I 
think closer to its original 

1681
01:34:45,920 --> 01:34:49,840
form than anything in print I've
underlined, any time that I've 

1682
01:34:49,840 --> 01:34:53,400
changed, made a change from the 
from the normal printed text so 

1683
01:34:53,400 --> 01:34:57,280
my translation reflects that 
reconstituted text. 

1684
01:34:57,280 --> 01:34:59,800
You could call it a critical 
Aramaic text. 

1685
01:35:00,080 --> 01:35:02,960
It matches up with a normal 
printed Zohar most of the time, 

1686
01:35:03,280 --> 01:35:06,480
but when it doesn't, it's 
because I I prefer to reading in

1687
01:35:06,920 --> 01:35:10,760
in a manuscript. 
So I imagine I I would imagine 

1688
01:35:10,760 --> 01:35:13,600
like translating something like 
the Zohar with all these, since 

1689
01:35:13,600 --> 01:35:17,160
you're a scholar of Kabbalah, 
you know, I imagine that there's

1690
01:35:17,160 --> 01:35:19,880
some influence from let's say 
later cause Kabbalah these 

1691
01:35:19,880 --> 01:35:23,240
concepts developed like Spiro 
did not mean what they meant in 

1692
01:35:23,240 --> 01:35:26,960
the Zohar in earlier time and 
and later obviously they 

1693
01:35:26,960 --> 01:35:31,040
developed how do you were you, 
let's say, very careful in in 

1694
01:35:31,040 --> 01:35:36,760
not, you know superimposing like
modern ideas into solution. 

1695
01:35:37,160 --> 01:35:39,520
That that's very important 
because you know that there are 

1696
01:35:39,520 --> 01:35:43,320
many commentaries on the Zohar, 
traditional kabbalistic 

1697
01:35:43,320 --> 01:35:46,600
commentaries on the Zohar, and I
consulted as many of them as I 

1698
01:35:46,600 --> 01:35:47,840
could. 
I borrowed from them. 

1699
01:35:47,840 --> 01:35:49,800
I stole from them. 
You could say. 

1700
01:35:50,200 --> 01:35:52,760
You know, scholars say what's 
the difference between what? 

1701
01:35:52,760 --> 01:35:56,600
What's plagiarism? 
Plagiarism is when you copy from

1702
01:35:56,600 --> 01:36:00,080
a source, right? 
Well, what's research when you 

1703
01:36:00,080 --> 01:36:04,520
copy from many sources? 
So I mean, I I I borrowed, I 

1704
01:36:04,520 --> 01:36:07,000
borrowed, I I identified, I say 
here I'm relying on this 

1705
01:36:07,000 --> 01:36:09,640
commentator or that commentator.
The problem with Zohar 

1706
01:36:09,640 --> 01:36:11,440
commentaries is exactly what you
said. 

1707
01:36:11,440 --> 01:36:16,200
They impose later understandings
of Kabbalah on the Zohar, mainly

1708
01:36:16,200 --> 01:36:18,560
Isaac Luria, right? 
Luria was the most famous 

1709
01:36:18,560 --> 01:36:21,160
Kabbalist. 
He was inspired by the Zohar. 

1710
01:36:21,160 --> 01:36:24,760
His entire Kabbalah is based on 
the Zohar, but it's his own 

1711
01:36:24,760 --> 01:36:28,560
unique understanding of the 
Zohar and a modern kabbalistic. 

1712
01:36:28,560 --> 01:36:32,120
A modern Kabbalist will read the
Zohar through the eyes of Luria.

1713
01:36:32,480 --> 01:36:35,560
I wanted to go back to Moshe de 
Leon or whoever else was 

1714
01:36:35,560 --> 01:36:38,560
involved in the authorship. 
So I try to explain what the 

1715
01:36:38,560 --> 01:36:42,960
Zohar meant in the 13th century 
and not not what it meant in the

1716
01:36:42,960 --> 01:36:45,000
16th century that that's hard to
do. 

1717
01:36:45,600 --> 01:36:47,640
But I bet that was what I what I
tried to do. 

1718
01:36:49,080 --> 01:36:50,360
I should say. 
I should say also what what 

1719
01:36:50,360 --> 01:36:53,880
distinguishes my commentary from
other commentaries is partly 

1720
01:36:53,880 --> 01:36:56,760
that that I'm going back to what
I call Pshatah Zohar. 

1721
01:36:57,400 --> 01:36:59,760
I had one Zohar teacher in 
Jerusalem who spoke of that 

1722
01:36:59,920 --> 01:37:02,600
Pshatah Zohar. 
The Zohar is so, so much 

1723
01:37:02,600 --> 01:37:04,800
secretive but it's beyond the 
pshat. 

1724
01:37:04,800 --> 01:37:08,800
But to see what the Zohar means 
before later Kabbalists do their

1725
01:37:08,800 --> 01:37:11,880
do their their thing on it so. 
I think. 

1726
01:37:11,960 --> 01:37:13,760
I think pshat is important. 
People think it just means 

1727
01:37:13,760 --> 01:37:17,720
simple meaning, but it actually 
means contextualizing, right? 

1728
01:37:17,720 --> 01:37:22,960
You have to right. 
Sometimes it's sometimes it's 

1729
01:37:22,960 --> 01:37:25,720
not the literal but the often 
the contextual, right? 

1730
01:37:25,920 --> 01:37:28,760
So what I do in my commentary, I
draw in traditional 

1731
01:37:28,760 --> 01:37:32,160
commentaries, but I also draw on
modern scholarship, modern 

1732
01:37:32,160 --> 01:37:36,280
academic scholarship. 
Gershom Sholem, Isaiah Tishby, 

1733
01:37:36,920 --> 01:37:41,760
Moshe Idel, Yehuda Libis, who's 
one of the finest Zohar scholars

1734
01:37:41,760 --> 01:37:44,160
in in the world. 
I draw on their works 

1735
01:37:44,160 --> 01:37:46,720
frequently, so it's the only 
commentary. 

1736
01:37:46,720 --> 01:37:49,800
I think that it that it includes
both the traditional Kabbalistic

1737
01:37:50,080 --> 01:37:52,560
approach and a modern academic 
approach. 

1738
01:37:52,560 --> 01:37:56,680
I try to balance the two 'cause 
I think you miss a lot about the

1739
01:37:56,680 --> 01:37:58,400
Zohar. 
If you think it was composed 

1740
01:37:58,400 --> 01:38:01,520
back in the 2nd century, you 
don't realize that the Zohar 

1741
01:38:01,520 --> 01:38:04,240
reflects what is going on in 
Spain at the time. 

1742
01:38:04,760 --> 01:38:08,800
Christian domination, the King 
at the time that the tensions in

1743
01:38:08,800 --> 01:38:11,000
the in the Jewish community, 
Maimonides. 

1744
01:38:11,360 --> 01:38:13,960
Maimonides is is such a force to
contend with. 

1745
01:38:13,960 --> 01:38:17,360
If you think it's composed in 
the 2nd century, Maimonides is 

1746
01:38:17,360 --> 01:38:18,720
irrelevant. 
But the Zoar draws some 

1747
01:38:18,720 --> 01:38:21,400
Maimonides on Rashi. 
Sometimes the Zoar will take 

1748
01:38:21,400 --> 01:38:25,040
something right out of Rashi or 
Ramban or Ibn Ezra, sometimes 

1749
01:38:25,040 --> 01:38:27,000
agreeing with it, sometimes 
disagreeing with it. 

1750
01:38:27,280 --> 01:38:29,520
And in what way would it there's
two. 

1751
01:38:29,560 --> 01:38:33,200
Now that you brought it up, in 
what way #1 does it? 

1752
01:38:33,360 --> 01:38:35,800
Do you see the influence of, 
let's say, the Christian 

1753
01:38:35,800 --> 01:38:40,480
surroundings of De Leon? 
And in what way do we see the 

1754
01:38:40,480 --> 01:38:44,120
contrast between the historical 
Rabbi Shimon and, let's say, in 

1755
01:38:44,120 --> 01:38:48,720
his halakhic opinions and in the
Zohar version of Rabbi Shimon? 

1756
01:38:49,840 --> 01:38:52,000
Yeah, so the Christian influence
is interesting. 

1757
01:38:52,040 --> 01:38:56,080
The Zohar is is attacking 
Christianity, and yet it's also 

1758
01:38:56,080 --> 01:38:59,320
influenced by Christianity at 
the same time. 

1759
01:38:59,320 --> 01:39:02,840
The attack is is, you know, for 
example, the Zohar says it's 

1760
01:39:02,840 --> 01:39:04,880
very important to to have 
children. 

1761
01:39:05,480 --> 01:39:07,760
You can't if you if you really 
want to be holy, you have to 

1762
01:39:07,760 --> 01:39:09,880
have children. 
And they're the probably 

1763
01:39:09,880 --> 01:39:13,440
reacting against monasticism, 
against celibacy. 

1764
01:39:14,800 --> 01:39:16,800
There's one famous passage in 
the Zohar. 

1765
01:39:16,800 --> 01:39:19,080
It's for the most famous passage
in the whole Zohar. 

1766
01:39:19,680 --> 01:39:22,440
We know it because it's part of 
the liturgy, right? 

1767
01:39:22,440 --> 01:39:24,800
There are other passages that 
are part of the spartic liturgy,

1768
01:39:24,800 --> 01:39:27,440
but there's only one Zohar 
passage that's part of the 

1769
01:39:27,440 --> 01:39:33,120
Ashkenazic liturgy and that of 
course is Briksheme, right? 

1770
01:39:33,120 --> 01:39:36,960
Bayana Rakhets that's chanted 
every Shabbat morning when the 

1771
01:39:36,960 --> 01:39:39,720
Torah is taken out of the ark 
that appears in the Zohar. 

1772
01:39:40,000 --> 01:39:42,400
It's actually not part. 
It's actually doesn't appear in 

1773
01:39:42,400 --> 01:39:44,280
the earliest manuscripts of the 
Zohar. 

1774
01:39:44,760 --> 01:39:46,600
But there you have an amazing 
line. 

1775
01:39:47,160 --> 01:39:52,400
La al en Nash rakhizna the LA al
bar elahin samishna. 

1776
01:39:52,920 --> 01:39:56,520
We don't rely on any human we 
don't trust. 

1777
01:39:56,520 --> 01:40:01,800
We don't believe in any bar 
Elahin Ben Elohim. 

1778
01:40:02,280 --> 01:40:05,880
It could mean an Angel. 
But literally it's what a son of

1779
01:40:05,880 --> 01:40:08,280
God. 
We don't believe in any son of 

1780
01:40:08,280 --> 01:40:10,720
God. 
It's really an anti Christian 

1781
01:40:10,720 --> 01:40:13,000
polemic in the Zohra. 
We don't need a son of God. 

1782
01:40:13,000 --> 01:40:16,160
We're all children of God. 
We are all Israel are children 

1783
01:40:16,160 --> 01:40:19,000
of of the Kurdish Barakhu, the 
Holy One, blessed be he. 

1784
01:40:19,000 --> 01:40:20,760
So it's a polemic against 
Christianity. 

1785
01:40:20,760 --> 01:40:24,600
You have sometimes overt, 
sometimes more hidden attacks on

1786
01:40:24,600 --> 01:40:27,640
Christianity. 
Even the demonic, the demonic 

1787
01:40:27,640 --> 01:40:31,480
force, Citra ahra, is identified
with Christianity in some 

1788
01:40:31,480 --> 01:40:34,320
places. 
On the other hand, you have 

1789
01:40:34,320 --> 01:40:36,560
influence of Christian 
symbolism. 

1790
01:40:37,600 --> 01:40:39,040
By this, I want to be careful 
what I'm saying. 

1791
01:40:39,040 --> 01:40:42,200
I'm not saying anyone in the 
Zohar believed in Christianity. 

1792
01:40:42,720 --> 01:40:47,120
Khas for Shalom, God forbid. 
But they're they're, you could 

1793
01:40:47,120 --> 01:40:49,440
say maybe they're parodying 
Christianity. 

1794
01:40:49,440 --> 01:40:51,400
They're they're adopting certain
elements. 

1795
01:40:51,400 --> 01:40:55,360
For example, triads. 
OK, what's the most famous triad

1796
01:40:55,360 --> 01:40:57,920
in Christianity? 
Obviously the Trinity, the 

1797
01:40:57,920 --> 01:41:01,200
Zohar, plays with Trinitarian 
formulations. 

1798
01:41:01,720 --> 01:41:04,320
For example, there were 
Christians who said they were 

1799
01:41:04,320 --> 01:41:06,880
Christians who said to Jews, 
look, you have Trinity in your 

1800
01:41:06,880 --> 01:41:10,760
own in your own prayer book. 
Shema, Yisrael, Hashem Alokino, 

1801
01:41:10,760 --> 01:41:14,520
Hashem, Yudhe Vave, our Elohim 
Yudhe Vave. 

1802
01:41:14,600 --> 01:41:16,280
There you have three divine 
names. 

1803
01:41:16,720 --> 01:41:19,760
The Zor says, well, each of 
those names refers to one of the

1804
01:41:19,760 --> 01:41:23,040
10 Sifi wrote. 
So the Zohar is saying there is 

1805
01:41:23,040 --> 01:41:25,400
a triadic structure, but it's 
not what you think. 

1806
01:41:25,960 --> 01:41:30,400
They're attacking and imitating 
sometimes, sometimes 

1807
01:41:30,400 --> 01:41:36,840
simultaneously. 
As for Bashimon, he appears in 

1808
01:41:36,840 --> 01:41:38,720
the Talmud, right? 
He's a very important figure in 

1809
01:41:38,720 --> 01:41:43,040
in the Mishnah and and the 
Talmud, but halachically his 

1810
01:41:43,040 --> 01:41:46,600
opinion is not followed, right? 
You don't, You don't just 

1811
01:41:46,600 --> 01:41:48,680
determine the halacha according 
to Rabba Shimon. 

1812
01:41:48,960 --> 01:41:52,320
Sometimes his over will go out 
of its way to accept an opinion 

1813
01:41:52,320 --> 01:41:56,200
to Rabba Shimon 'cause he's 
after all the Bozsina Kadisha. 

1814
01:41:56,200 --> 01:42:01,000
He's the holy lamp of the Zohar.
He, as you said, he's given some

1815
01:42:01,000 --> 01:42:03,840
divine qualities. 1 remarkable 
passage, he says. 

1816
01:42:04,080 --> 01:42:08,240
Rabba Shimon says in the Zohar, 
you know my face is shining, 

1817
01:42:09,000 --> 01:42:11,120
just like Moshe's face was 
shining. 

1818
01:42:11,480 --> 01:42:15,960
The difference is he didn't know
his face was shining and I know 

1819
01:42:15,960 --> 01:42:19,360
my face is shining. 
So actually compares himself to 

1820
01:42:19,360 --> 01:42:22,800
Moshe and seems to say in some 
ways he's greater than Moshe. 

1821
01:42:23,680 --> 01:42:29,280
So the Zohar's remarkable and 
very, very beautiful, very 

1822
01:42:29,280 --> 01:42:33,840
inspiring, also very troubling. 
And of course, it was used and 

1823
01:42:33,840 --> 01:42:35,600
misused throughout the 
generations. 

1824
01:42:36,040 --> 01:42:38,960
Then there were later, you know,
attacks on the Zohar, especially

1825
01:42:38,960 --> 01:42:44,160
in the 19th and 20th centuries. 
Sholom really tried to, you 

1826
01:42:44,160 --> 01:42:49,600
know, rescue the Zohar from from
the attacks of the Husqala. 

1827
01:42:50,440 --> 01:42:53,960
And I know your your, your whole
project and your whole podcast 

1828
01:42:53,960 --> 01:42:58,000
is devoted to a a more 
Maimonidean presentation of 

1829
01:42:58,000 --> 01:42:59,840
Judaism. 
Zohar is fascinating there 

1830
01:42:59,840 --> 01:43:03,840
because it's simultaneously 
influenced by the Rambam and and

1831
01:43:04,480 --> 01:43:08,280
and fighting against the Rambam.
Well, we would love to have you 

1832
01:43:08,280 --> 01:43:11,600
on again one day to discuss the 
further development of Kabbalah,

1833
01:43:11,600 --> 01:43:15,240
which would be very interesting.
But before we go, first of all I

1834
01:43:15,240 --> 01:43:19,040
want to say you know give a 
shout out to our mutual friend 

1835
01:43:19,200 --> 01:43:23,320
JJ Kimchi because we also we did
an episode on the Zohar with him

1836
01:43:23,320 --> 01:43:27,240
and you did it on his podcast 
only. 

1837
01:43:27,240 --> 01:43:31,440
So that it kind of that's kind 
of how we came together and I 

1838
01:43:31,440 --> 01:43:35,800
just wanted to allow you to plug
your your course for the 

1839
01:43:35,800 --> 01:43:37,080
audience. 
Great, great. 

1840
01:43:37,080 --> 01:43:39,360
Before I do that, there's one 
other thing I need to say about 

1841
01:43:39,520 --> 01:43:43,760
Eliyahu and that's we talked 
about Kabbalah banakhasirism and

1842
01:43:43,760 --> 01:43:46,640
there's one element of Kasirism.
It's very important and that 

1843
01:43:46,640 --> 01:43:49,440
will explain my title. 
Becoming Elijah. 

1844
01:43:49,880 --> 01:43:53,280
So in Hasirism you have a 
beautiful notion what's called 

1845
01:43:53,280 --> 01:43:56,720
Bukhinat Eliyahu. 
Now some of you might know the 

1846
01:43:56,720 --> 01:43:59,960
word Bukhinas is a test, but it 
really means more than that. 

1847
01:43:59,960 --> 01:44:04,120
It means an aspect. 
And Hasirism teaches, especially

1848
01:44:05,240 --> 01:44:09,240
Menachem Nachum of Chernobyl. 
The Chernobyl Rebbe. 

1849
01:44:09,640 --> 01:44:14,040
In his book MO Ore Naim, The 
Light of the Eyes, he says every

1850
01:44:14,040 --> 01:44:19,320
one of us has Bukhinat Eliyahu. 
Each of us has an aspect of 

1851
01:44:19,320 --> 01:44:22,080
Elijah within. 
So what does that mean? 

1852
01:44:22,080 --> 01:44:27,520
You could say it means passion 
or the the desire to uplift, the

1853
01:44:27,520 --> 01:44:33,120
desire to bring redemption, 
zeal, creative insight. 

1854
01:44:33,480 --> 01:44:37,080
There's some something of that 
intensity of Elijah within each 

1855
01:44:37,080 --> 01:44:39,000
of us. 
You could say it's a spark of 

1856
01:44:39,000 --> 01:44:41,720
Elijah or a Birkinah, an aspect 
of Elijah. 

1857
01:44:42,200 --> 01:44:46,240
But the problem is it's hidden, 
and we have to identify that and

1858
01:44:46,240 --> 01:44:51,560
fan that spark into a flame. 
And in that sense, each of us 

1859
01:44:51,560 --> 01:44:56,360
can, as it were, Caviachal, 
become Elijah. 

1860
01:44:57,160 --> 01:44:59,600
And that's why I called the book
Becoming Elijah. 

1861
01:45:00,040 --> 01:45:03,320
So on the one hand, it means how
did Elijah turn from a zealot 

1862
01:45:03,680 --> 01:45:07,480
into the compassionate Jewish 
superhero he really is, the 

1863
01:45:07,520 --> 01:45:10,320
Jewish superhero. 
That's what becoming Elijah 

1864
01:45:10,320 --> 01:45:13,120
means on the one hand. 
But it also means, as I say at 

1865
01:45:13,120 --> 01:45:16,480
the very end of the book, where 
I talk about this Behnata Liahu,

1866
01:45:16,920 --> 01:45:19,320
that each of us can, can become 
Elijah. 

1867
01:45:20,520 --> 01:45:22,720
So, so you just you're kind of 
taking me on another tangent 

1868
01:45:22,720 --> 01:45:26,960
because the connection between 
Hinhas and Eliahu is, is that is

1869
01:45:26,960 --> 01:45:32,520
that something that like pre pre
gilgul you know Kabbalah is that

1870
01:45:32,520 --> 01:45:36,680
is that something that is based 
on birhina or is that or was 

1871
01:45:36,680 --> 01:45:38,960
that? 
Yeah, that, yeah, that is 

1872
01:45:38,960 --> 01:45:41,840
fascinating. 
And let's spend just a minute or

1873
01:45:41,840 --> 01:45:46,720
two on on that Hinhas Hu Eliahu.
That's the phrase that comes 

1874
01:45:46,720 --> 01:45:50,040
Pinchas. 
Who Eliau Pinchas is Elijah. 

1875
01:45:50,360 --> 01:45:54,480
Now that never appears in the 
Talmud or or the Midrash, but 

1876
01:45:54,560 --> 01:45:59,120
apparently it was around already
in the round the 1st century of 

1877
01:45:59,120 --> 01:46:02,600
the Common Era. 
People identify Pinchas with 

1878
01:46:02,600 --> 01:46:06,200
Elijah and why? 
It's pretty clear because they 

1879
01:46:06,200 --> 01:46:09,840
are the 2 Great Zealots, right? 
They're the 2 greatest. 

1880
01:46:10,000 --> 01:46:12,440
They're the two most zealous 
people in the whole Tanakh. 

1881
01:46:13,040 --> 01:46:17,200
What does Pinchas do? 
He kills a fornicating couple, 

1882
01:46:17,560 --> 01:46:19,360
right? 
A couple who's involved with 

1883
01:46:19,400 --> 01:46:22,000
idol worship and fornication and
a lot. 

1884
01:46:22,040 --> 01:46:25,240
And pirchhas stabs them both in 
the belly. 

1885
01:46:25,720 --> 01:46:27,920
And for that, God actually 
praises him. 

1886
01:46:28,240 --> 01:46:30,000
What does God say? 
I'm going to give you 

1887
01:46:30,000 --> 01:46:31,600
priesthood. 
I'm going to give to you and 

1888
01:46:31,600 --> 01:46:34,240
your descendants. 
Britt again. 

1889
01:46:34,240 --> 01:46:35,040
Britt. 
Britt. 

1890
01:46:35,040 --> 01:46:37,000
Kahunat Alam. 
Why? 

1891
01:46:37,000 --> 01:46:41,920
Because he says pinchas de con O
ET kinati. 

1892
01:46:42,760 --> 01:46:47,600
Because because Pinchas enacted 
my zeal. 

1893
01:46:47,840 --> 01:46:49,640
My my zeal. 
Really. 

1894
01:46:49,640 --> 01:46:53,240
The Hebrews zealously enacting 
my zeal. 

1895
01:46:53,560 --> 01:46:56,400
The Kano at Kinati. 
It's the only two times in the 

1896
01:46:56,400 --> 01:47:00,560
whole Bible that you have that 
that root kanah to be zealous. 

1897
01:47:00,880 --> 01:47:05,960
Only two times Where it appears 
twice in one sentence, once is 

1898
01:47:05,960 --> 01:47:08,720
with Pirghas and the other time 
is with Eliahu. 

1899
01:47:08,720 --> 01:47:12,760
We mentioned Kano Kineti, right?
Elijah describes himself as 

1900
01:47:12,760 --> 01:47:16,040
zealously zealous, so it's clear
they are the 2 great zealots. 

1901
01:47:16,040 --> 01:47:18,120
So what does it mean to say 
Pinchas is Elijah? 

1902
01:47:18,560 --> 01:47:22,320
You could say it just means they
share a personality trait. 

1903
01:47:22,800 --> 01:47:25,000
They are the two zealots in that
sense. 

1904
01:47:25,440 --> 01:47:27,560
Pinchas is Elijah, but it's more
than that. 

1905
01:47:27,840 --> 01:47:30,640
I used to think what you hinted 
at, that it's a gilgul. 

1906
01:47:31,040 --> 01:47:35,160
Maybe Elijah was a reincarnation
of maybe Elijah was a 

1907
01:47:35,160 --> 01:47:38,600
reincarnation of Pinchas. 
But that's not what it means. 

1908
01:47:39,040 --> 01:47:43,760
It means something much simpler.
It really means Pinchas was 

1909
01:47:43,920 --> 01:47:47,400
Elijah. 
They're really one in the same 

1910
01:47:47,400 --> 01:47:49,560
person now. 
How could that be? 

1911
01:47:49,560 --> 01:47:53,880
Historically, it makes no sense.
Pinchas was born probably toward

1912
01:47:53,880 --> 01:47:59,000
the end of the 13th century BCE.
Elijah lived 400 years later. 

1913
01:47:59,600 --> 01:48:01,520
There's no way Pinchas could be 
Elijah. 

1914
01:48:01,520 --> 01:48:03,360
But there's something strange in
the Bible. 

1915
01:48:03,760 --> 01:48:09,160
In the book of Joshua, the end 
of the Book of Joshua, we hear 

1916
01:48:09,160 --> 01:48:14,040
that Pinchas was still alive. 
And even in the book of Judges, 

1917
01:48:14,480 --> 01:48:18,360
this is a long time after 
Pinchas's career in the Book of 

1918
01:48:18,360 --> 01:48:20,200
Numbers. 
Even in the Book of Judges 

1919
01:48:21,440 --> 01:48:25,720
Elijah is serving at the Mishkan
in Shiloh in Shiloh. 

1920
01:48:26,120 --> 01:48:28,720
So he had a long life even 
according to biblical 

1921
01:48:28,720 --> 01:48:30,720
chronology. 
If you if you stretch that a 

1922
01:48:30,720 --> 01:48:34,520
little some people came to 
believe that Pinchas lived long 

1923
01:48:34,520 --> 01:48:37,720
enough to turn into Elijah. 
It's not that he would died and 

1924
01:48:37,720 --> 01:48:40,480
was reborn, not that he's 
reincarnated, just he changed 

1925
01:48:40,480 --> 01:48:43,080
his name. 
Pinchas actually is Elijah. 

1926
01:48:43,440 --> 01:48:46,120
Now this makes no sense. 
Historically even Ezra says 

1927
01:48:46,120 --> 01:48:49,720
Pinchas was not Elijah, it was 
even Ezra is aware of people are

1928
01:48:49,720 --> 01:48:52,440
saying that he denies it but I 
think even though it's 

1929
01:48:52,440 --> 01:48:56,680
historically ridiculous it's 
psychologically very revealing. 

1930
01:48:57,120 --> 01:49:02,600
So that they they they shared 
this zealotry and and you could 

1931
01:49:02,600 --> 01:49:07,680
say too that what it shows you 
is the the timelessness of 

1932
01:49:07,680 --> 01:49:11,120
Eliyahu, right? 
If he's immortal, not only did 

1933
01:49:11,120 --> 01:49:15,160
he live longer than he than he 
lived in the Bible, he lived 

1934
01:49:15,160 --> 01:49:16,640
earlier than he lived in the 
Bible. 

1935
01:49:16,640 --> 01:49:21,480
He somehow is is elastic enough 
that he stretches from pirhas to

1936
01:49:22,280 --> 01:49:25,880
to Biblical later times. 
He's from another era you know 

1937
01:49:25,880 --> 01:49:29,280
like yeah it's it reminds me of 
kind of like Ogmel Kabashan that

1938
01:49:29,280 --> 01:49:34,760
he's put in the the time of Noah
and and Avraham and Moshe really

1939
01:49:34,760 --> 01:49:37,360
because he's a he was hanging on
to the boat of Noah. 

1940
01:49:37,440 --> 01:49:41,000
He he's a remnant of that time 
he's he is the character that 

1941
01:49:41,000 --> 01:49:44,360
would fit in that generation and
he that that mentality survived 

1942
01:49:45,200 --> 01:49:47,680
but. 
Yeah, so some some of that 

1943
01:49:47,680 --> 01:49:49,960
applies to Eliao. 
We hear, we hear so many stories

1944
01:49:49,960 --> 01:49:52,280
about what happened after his 
career. 

1945
01:49:52,280 --> 01:49:54,120
So Pilchas is what happened 
before. 

1946
01:49:54,640 --> 01:49:56,200
And in fact, you know, I 
mentioned, we mentioned that 

1947
01:49:56,200 --> 01:49:59,640
Midrash about the circumcision. 
Why does Eliahu show up in a 

1948
01:49:59,640 --> 01:50:01,760
circumcision? 
Because God said to Eliahu, 

1949
01:50:02,240 --> 01:50:04,640
you're always zealous. 
And in fact in that Midrash it 

1950
01:50:04,640 --> 01:50:09,320
says you were zealous when you 
when you were Pinhas and you're 

1951
01:50:09,320 --> 01:50:11,680
zealous now that you're Eliahu 
it. 

1952
01:50:11,720 --> 01:50:15,200
It it hints at saying you were 
zealous when you were Pinhas 

1953
01:50:15,200 --> 01:50:18,560
already. 
The the last thing on we, we 

1954
01:50:18,720 --> 01:50:20,800
skipped this part, but I think 
it was very interesting and only

1955
01:50:20,800 --> 01:50:25,040
if you have a few minutes, but 
who he is in Christianity and 

1956
01:50:25,040 --> 01:50:28,080
Islam. 
That's, yeah, that that's quite 

1957
01:50:28,080 --> 01:50:30,960
a story, but I'll just try to to
give a one or two highlights. 

1958
01:50:31,960 --> 01:50:36,320
So Eliyahua's central, you could
say he's really central to to 

1959
01:50:36,320 --> 01:50:40,240
Judaism in, in many ways. 
He's also really significant in 

1960
01:50:40,240 --> 01:50:42,520
the New Testament. 
Why is that? 

1961
01:50:43,480 --> 01:50:46,600
Well, let's go back to Malachi, 
right. 

1962
01:50:46,600 --> 01:50:48,360
Or as Christians would say, 
Malachi. 

1963
01:50:48,920 --> 01:50:52,360
Malachi is the last of the minor
prophets, right? 

1964
01:50:52,360 --> 01:50:56,240
So he's the very end of Niveum. 
We have Torah, Niveum, Kituvim, 

1965
01:50:56,240 --> 01:51:00,040
Torah, prophets, writings. 
The very end of prophet is 

1966
01:51:00,040 --> 01:51:01,560
Malachi. 
But if you look, if you ever 

1967
01:51:01,560 --> 01:51:04,960
open a Christian Bible, if you 
ever stuck in a hotel room and 

1968
01:51:04,960 --> 01:51:09,840
you open a Gideon's Bible there,
of course the Gideon's Bible has

1969
01:51:09,840 --> 01:51:11,920
the Old Testament and the New 
Testament, right? 

1970
01:51:12,200 --> 01:51:14,480
The Old Testament is basically 
the Hebrew Tanakh. 

1971
01:51:14,840 --> 01:51:17,560
But the books are in a little 
different order, right? 

1972
01:51:17,560 --> 01:51:19,040
None of none of the books are 
different. 

1973
01:51:19,040 --> 01:51:22,360
Some books are added in the 
Apocrypha, but every book of the

1974
01:51:22,360 --> 01:51:24,880
Hebrew Tanakh is in the 
Christian Old Testament. 

1975
01:51:24,880 --> 01:51:26,080
But they're in a different 
order. 

1976
01:51:26,400 --> 01:51:27,680
The Torah. 
You have the five books of 

1977
01:51:27,680 --> 01:51:30,440
Moses, but then things start 
getting in different order. 

1978
01:51:30,440 --> 01:51:35,480
And where does Malachi come? 
Malachi comes at the very end of

1979
01:51:35,480 --> 01:51:39,800
the entire Old Testament, and 
the Tanakh is kind of in the 

1980
01:51:39,800 --> 01:51:42,760
middle of the Bible, the end of,
you know, 2/3 of the way 

1981
01:51:42,760 --> 01:51:45,440
through. 
In a Christian Bible, Malachi 

1982
01:51:45,440 --> 01:51:49,320
ends the Old Testament, which 
means what that the Christian 

1983
01:51:49,320 --> 01:51:54,640
Hebrew Bible ends with the 
prediction of Elijah coming 

1984
01:51:54,920 --> 01:51:59,280
before the day of the Lord. 
That's the last page of a 

1985
01:51:59,280 --> 01:52:02,240
Christian Old Testament. 
I'm sending to you Elijah, the 

1986
01:52:02,240 --> 01:52:03,800
prophet before the day of the 
Lord. 

1987
01:52:04,000 --> 01:52:05,720
What happens when you turn the 
page? 

1988
01:52:06,680 --> 01:52:10,960
The Gospel of Matthew. 
So a Christian Bible connects 

1989
01:52:10,960 --> 01:52:13,360
Elijah with Matthew, Elijah with
the New Testament. 

1990
01:52:13,680 --> 01:52:15,520
So does Elijah appear in the New
Testament? 

1991
01:52:15,520 --> 01:52:20,360
He does. 
Who is he who would announce the

1992
01:52:20,360 --> 01:52:21,120
Messiah? 
Now? 

1993
01:52:21,120 --> 01:52:25,520
The Christian Messiah of course 
is Jesus, who announces Jesus, 

1994
01:52:27,280 --> 01:52:32,320
John the Baptist. 
And in the New Testament, Jesus 

1995
01:52:32,320 --> 01:52:36,760
says that Elijah. 
That John the Baptist is Elijah.

1996
01:52:37,640 --> 01:52:40,400
Jesus identifies John the 
Baptist with Elijah. 

1997
01:52:40,400 --> 01:52:44,920
That does not that Elijah died 
is that Elijah is still alive 

1998
01:52:44,920 --> 01:52:46,920
and now he's appearing as John 
the Baptist. 

1999
01:52:47,240 --> 01:52:50,920
So it fits for Christianity that
that Elijah will announce the 

2000
01:52:50,920 --> 01:52:54,240
Christian Messiah. 
But it's more interesting than 

2001
01:52:54,240 --> 01:53:00,680
that because Jesus himself seems
to identify with Elijah. 

2002
01:53:01,880 --> 01:53:04,000
Why is that? 
How could it be the Messiah and 

2003
01:53:04,000 --> 01:53:06,760
Elijah that shows you something 
about the history of 

2004
01:53:06,760 --> 01:53:08,440
Christianity? 
This is something it's hard for 

2005
01:53:08,440 --> 01:53:11,280
a Christian to understand, but I
think it's easier for a Jew to 

2006
01:53:11,280 --> 01:53:14,440
understand. 
Jesus did not originally think 

2007
01:53:14,440 --> 01:53:18,240
of himself as the Messiah. 
Very likely he thought of 

2008
01:53:18,240 --> 01:53:23,400
himself as a prophet, and he 
very likely thought of himself 

2009
01:53:23,400 --> 01:53:26,360
as Elijah. 
He may have thought that he was 

2010
01:53:26,360 --> 01:53:29,360
Elijah. 
He actually gives a sermon in 

2011
01:53:29,360 --> 01:53:33,520
his Shoal in Nazareth, right? 
Not Serret. 

2012
01:53:33,520 --> 01:53:36,800
And he he he he refers to Elijah
and Alicia. 

2013
01:53:37,160 --> 01:53:38,720
How? 
Why does he refer to them 'cause

2014
01:53:38,720 --> 01:53:43,200
he says no prophet is accepted 
in his own hometown. 

2015
01:53:46,240 --> 01:53:49,360
He why? 
So he refers to a Elijah who 

2016
01:53:49,360 --> 01:53:50,640
wasn't accepted by the 
Israelites. 

2017
01:53:50,640 --> 01:53:53,640
And he feels that he isn't being
accepted by many of the Jews in 

2018
01:53:53,640 --> 01:53:57,000
Nazareth, right? 
Everyone in there is Jewish, 

2019
01:53:57,000 --> 01:53:59,880
he's Jewish and other Jews. 
He has a high opinion of 

2020
01:53:59,880 --> 01:54:01,800
himself. 
He's not sure the Jews accept 

2021
01:54:01,800 --> 01:54:08,160
that he's a prophet so a lot. 
So Jesus may have identified 

2022
01:54:08,160 --> 01:54:12,320
with a. 
Then eventually Jesus comes to 

2023
01:54:12,320 --> 01:54:19,400
think of himself as A after his 
death Messiah. 

2024
01:54:19,400 --> 01:54:24,840
That's later in his career, in 
his short career. 

2025
01:54:25,840 --> 01:54:30,560
So if he's the Messiah, he can't
be Elijah, who has to be Elijah.

2026
01:54:30,880 --> 01:54:33,400
John the Baptist. 
So John the Baptist is Elijah. 

2027
01:54:33,480 --> 01:54:35,720
Jesus probably was first 
thinking of himself as Elijah, 

2028
01:54:35,720 --> 01:54:38,120
then as the Mashiach. 
So in that sense he's very 

2029
01:54:38,120 --> 01:54:39,120
significant. 
In testament. 

2030
01:54:39,520 --> 01:54:41,400
What happens at the end? 
The end, of course. 

2031
01:54:41,400 --> 01:54:46,000
Jesus is crucified and he's 
dying on the cross. 

2032
01:54:46,000 --> 01:54:48,040
What's the last thing that he 
says? 

2033
01:54:48,600 --> 01:54:53,040
He quotes a verse from Psalms. 
He quotes it in Aramaic. 

2034
01:54:53,640 --> 01:54:57,440
A Li a Li. 
Lama Shavaktani. 

2035
01:54:58,280 --> 01:55:01,440
My God, my God, why have you 
forsaken me? 

2036
01:55:02,040 --> 01:55:04,600
It's amazing that that's the 
last words of Jesus. 

2037
01:55:04,800 --> 01:55:07,600
It's very authentic because 
nobody would make that up, 

2038
01:55:08,280 --> 01:55:09,840
right? 
A Christian wouldn't say that 

2039
01:55:10,000 --> 01:55:14,360
Jesus feels that he's abandoned.
So it's very possible Jesus 

2040
01:55:14,360 --> 01:55:17,920
really did say that He felt that
he was doing holy work. 

2041
01:55:17,920 --> 01:55:20,760
He felt that he understood what 
Torah meant, right? 

2042
01:55:20,760 --> 01:55:23,640
He'd never thought of anything, 
of inventing a new religion. 

2043
01:55:24,000 --> 01:55:27,520
He just wanted to be a Jew. 
He could say he was an early 

2044
01:55:27,520 --> 01:55:30,640
Jewish Mystic. 
He felt he had an an intimacy 

2045
01:55:30,640 --> 01:55:34,080
with God and then he's killed. 
He's he's being executed. 

2046
01:55:34,080 --> 01:55:35,760
He says God, why have you 
forsaken me? 

2047
01:55:35,760 --> 01:55:38,800
So He says, a Lee, a Lee 
Lamashevaktani. 

2048
01:55:39,000 --> 01:55:43,600
Some people in the crowd thought
what that he was calling out to 

2049
01:55:44,160 --> 01:55:49,200
Eili Yahoo. 
The New Testament says that some

2050
01:55:49,200 --> 01:55:51,160
people think that he was calling
out to Eliyahu. 

2051
01:55:51,160 --> 01:55:53,000
Now he wasn't. 
He was calling out to God. 

2052
01:55:53,320 --> 01:55:57,640
But that shows you how important
Eliyahu was in the the mentality

2053
01:55:57,640 --> 01:56:00,000
of the time. 
That's fascinating. 

2054
01:56:00,880 --> 01:56:03,840
Amazing stuff. 
And and the last one on Islam 

2055
01:56:03,840 --> 01:56:05,400
and then? 
We'll so that that very briefly 

2056
01:56:05,400 --> 01:56:08,520
on Christianity, on Islam 
there's an Elijah figure in 

2057
01:56:08,520 --> 01:56:11,400
Islam. 
Elijah actually is alive and 

2058
01:56:11,400 --> 01:56:13,280
well in Islam. 
He's not called Eliyahu, 

2059
01:56:13,280 --> 01:56:18,160
although sometimes he is Iliyah 
Ilias, he's called Al Khidir, 

2060
01:56:18,680 --> 01:56:20,760
which in Arabic means of the 
green one. 

2061
01:56:21,480 --> 01:56:25,840
So this is this this this 
mysterious figure very important

2062
01:56:25,840 --> 01:56:29,360
in Islam and he has many of the 
characteristics of Elijah. 

2063
01:56:29,360 --> 01:56:33,120
He's immortal, he can appear in 
various guises. 

2064
01:56:33,560 --> 01:56:37,520
He helps people in need and he 
inspires the Mystics. 

2065
01:56:38,160 --> 01:56:41,440
The great Sufis felt that they 
were visited by Al Khidir. 

2066
01:56:42,040 --> 01:56:43,840
Now why do I say Al Khidir is 
Elijah? 

2067
01:56:43,840 --> 01:56:48,360
Not only does he share qualities
with Elijah, when when Muslims 

2068
01:56:48,360 --> 01:56:51,880
speak about Elijah, they refer 
to him as Al Khidir. 

2069
01:56:52,760 --> 01:56:56,880
And more interesting than that, 
Jews living in Muslim lands, 

2070
01:56:57,240 --> 01:57:01,880
Jews who speak Arabic sometimes 
refer to Eliyahu as Al Khidir. 

2071
01:57:03,320 --> 01:57:05,520
They are really, they are really
one in the same. 

2072
01:57:05,520 --> 01:57:08,560
He's not mentioned in the Quran,
but he's identified with a very 

2073
01:57:08,560 --> 01:57:13,280
important figure in the Quran, a
messenger, a messenger of of 

2074
01:57:13,280 --> 01:57:16,200
Allah. 
And there's a story in the Quran

2075
01:57:16,200 --> 01:57:19,360
that appears in a different 
version in in medieval Midrash. 

2076
01:57:19,800 --> 01:57:21,760
So there's there's definitely a 
sharing there. 

2077
01:57:21,760 --> 01:57:25,680
So in Christianity and in Islam,
both of them inheriting it of 

2078
01:57:25,680 --> 01:57:29,880
course from the Tanakh Eliao 
becomes very significant. 

2079
01:57:30,560 --> 01:57:34,240
Thank you for spending all this 
time you went overtime and we 

2080
01:57:34,240 --> 01:57:38,200
really thank you for for that. 
Now if you go, just if you'd 

2081
01:57:38,200 --> 01:57:41,080
like to plug your course. 
Yes, it is. 

2082
01:57:41,080 --> 01:57:45,840
Very briefly, I teach a course 
online in Zohar, actually one in

2083
01:57:45,840 --> 01:57:49,000
English, where we look at my 
English translation, and another

2084
01:57:49,000 --> 01:57:51,120
course where we study the 
original Aramaic. 

2085
01:57:51,680 --> 01:57:54,800
That doesn't require Aramaic 
fluency, but it does require 

2086
01:57:54,800 --> 01:57:57,760
Hebrew fluency. 
If you can read a Midrashic 

2087
01:57:57,760 --> 01:58:00,800
text, or if you can read the 
Tanakh and make some sense of 

2088
01:58:00,800 --> 01:58:03,760
it, or if you can read Modern 
Hebrew, you're welcome to try 

2089
01:58:03,760 --> 01:58:05,600
the the one we do the original 
Aramaic. 

2090
01:58:06,160 --> 01:58:09,240
The English course is weekly, 
The Aramaic course is biweekly 

2091
01:58:09,600 --> 01:58:12,800
and we basically study a few 
pages of the Zohar and discuss 

2092
01:58:12,800 --> 01:58:15,440
it. 
I teach for about an hour and 

2093
01:58:15,440 --> 01:58:18,760
the Aramaic group, it's smaller.
We have discussion as we go in 

2094
01:58:18,760 --> 01:58:20,800
English course. 
I teach for a straight hour and 

2095
01:58:20,800 --> 01:58:22,800
then we have questions and 
answers. 

2096
01:58:23,520 --> 01:58:26,240
You can find out about it. 
I don't need to say much more 

2097
01:58:26,240 --> 01:58:27,760
about it. 
You can find out about it on my 

2098
01:58:27,760 --> 01:58:33,000
website, which is simply Daniel 
C Matt, my middle initial C for 

2099
01:58:33,080 --> 01:58:37,640
Hanan, Daniel C matt.com. 
If you Google Daniel Matt you'll

2100
01:58:37,720 --> 01:58:39,640
you'll probably find it 
certainly Daniel, Matt and 

2101
01:58:39,640 --> 01:58:42,600
Zohar. 
The Stanford site has as I say 

2102
01:58:42,600 --> 01:58:46,280
the Aramaic text you can find 
that Zohar, Stanford. 

2103
01:58:46,600 --> 01:58:48,800
But for the course just on my 
website. 

2104
01:58:48,800 --> 01:58:50,880
You're welcome, welcome to join 
it. 

2105
01:58:50,880 --> 01:58:55,000
We have we study basically from 
after the Haghim through May and

2106
01:58:55,000 --> 01:58:57,840
then take a long summer break. 
Very nice. 

2107
01:58:57,840 --> 01:59:01,440
I'm gonna put, I'm gonna put the
link in the YouTube description 

2108
01:59:01,880 --> 01:59:05,160
and I really, really want to 
thank you so much. 

2109
01:59:05,160 --> 01:59:10,040
This was so fun. 
Great conversation and hope to 

2110
01:59:10,040 --> 01:59:12,120
have you on again. 
Wonderful. 

2111
01:59:12,120 --> 01:59:14,480
It was great exploring him with 
you. 

2112
01:59:15,400 --> 01:59:17,640
All the best Shalom. 
Thank you. 

2113
01:59:18,040 --> 01:59:19,560
Well done. 
Thank you so much. 

2114
01:59:19,920 --> 01:59:27,840
Raka Shah. 
Hey guys, thanks so much for 

2115
01:59:27,840 --> 01:59:30,200
tuning into the Judas and 
Demystified podcast. 

2116
01:59:30,560 --> 01:59:33,160
We really appreciate all your 
support and your feedback. 

2117
01:59:33,920 --> 01:59:37,280
If you want to help us grow the 
podcast, keep spreading the 

2118
01:59:37,280 --> 01:59:39,760
word. 
Share with your friends, family,

2119
01:59:39,760 --> 01:59:41,320
or whoever you think would be 
interested. 

2120
01:59:42,080 --> 01:59:45,640
We also open to Patreon so you 
can become a patron. 

2121
01:59:45,840 --> 01:59:48,640
Contribute any small amount 
you'd like, which would really 

2122
01:59:48,640 --> 01:59:55,400
help us grow the show. 
Our Patreon is www.patreon.com 

2123
01:59:56,360 --> 02:00:01,000
Judaism Pretty easy to remember.
Thank you again and we hope to 

2124
02:00:01,000 --> 02:00:02,800
keep putting out great shows for
you guys. 

2125
02:00:11,840 --> 02:00:15,440
Before we go, we want to thank 
our Patreon supporters by name. 

2126
02:00:16,280 --> 02:00:18,800
Those are the supporters that 
are helping make this show 

2127
02:00:18,800 --> 02:00:21,960
happen because. 
Frankly, Benzie and I are full 

2128
02:00:21,960 --> 02:00:24,800
time workers who don't really 
have so much time on our hands 

2129
02:00:24,800 --> 02:00:28,760
because we have families, we 
have kids, and it's just a 

2130
02:00:28,760 --> 02:00:31,520
passion project that got way 
bigger than we expected. 

2131
02:00:31,960 --> 02:00:34,600
So we're dedicating more time to
this. 

2132
02:00:34,600 --> 02:00:37,440
And obviously our production 
value up until this point hasn't

2133
02:00:37,440 --> 02:00:41,640
been great considering that we 
filmed this in Benzie's basement

2134
02:00:41,800 --> 02:00:45,600
using a green screen and a 
crappy little microphone and not

2135
02:00:45,600 --> 02:00:48,920
such great equipment to be 
honest, I'm sure you all realize

2136
02:00:48,920 --> 02:00:52,040
that. 
So we are hoping to up our 

2137
02:00:52,040 --> 02:00:57,320
quality and get better equipment
and part of that process is 

2138
02:00:57,320 --> 02:00:59,960
going to be due to you guys, the
listeners and supporters. 

2139
02:01:00,720 --> 02:01:06,320
If you go to our Patreon page, 
patreon.com/judaism, you will 

2140
02:01:06,320 --> 02:01:08,600
see all the different tiers of 
ways you can help us out. 

2141
02:01:08,600 --> 02:01:11,920
So first of all, we want to 
thank our Super Patron Jordan 

2142
02:01:11,920 --> 02:01:16,520
Carmeli, our Platinum Patron 
Craig Gordon, our Gold patrons 

2143
02:01:17,120 --> 02:01:20,840
David Haye, Abram, Khayev, Laser
Cohen, Travis Krueger, Vasily 

2144
02:01:20,840 --> 02:01:27,120
Volkov, Silver patrons, Ellen 
Fleischer, Daniel Maximov, Rabbi

2145
02:01:27,120 --> 02:01:29,360
Penny Rosenthal, and Jeffrey 
Wasserman. 

2146
02:01:29,720 --> 02:01:33,880
Thank you all for supporting the
show and we hope you guys enjoy.