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Welcome to Judaism demystified a
podcast for the perplexed. 

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We are joined by Rabbi dr. 
Eugene corn, we are grateful to 

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Professor Menachem Kellner for 
setting us up with dr. 

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Eugene corn, who's his friend 
and he highly recommended that. 

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We speak to him dr. 
Corn sent us his book and we 

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were blown away. 
And we feel like one podcast 

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will not be enough. 
So we're definitely hoping to 

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have him on again, but I just 
want to tell you a little bit 

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about him. 
Dr. Corn is a scholar in the 

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areas of Jewish, ethics 
jewish-christian relations and 

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Israel. 
He earned a doctorate in 

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Philosophy from Columbia 
University and was ordained by 

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the Israeli rabbit dr. 
Corn is presently, National 

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director of Jewish Affairs at 
the American Jewish Congress. 

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Adjunct, professor of Jewish 
thought in the department of 

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Christian Jewish studies, at 
seat, Hall University and editor

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of the Atlanta Journal a forum. 
For modern Orthodox discourse, 

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he has taught at Columbia and 
Yeshiva universities and 

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previously was judaic scholar at
the Jewish Federation at Metro 

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West, and director of 
leadership, education and 

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development. 
At the Shah aalam Hartman 

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Institute of Jerusalem at AJ 
Congress, Rabbi corn is 

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responsible for programs and 
Interfaith relations and Jewish 

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identity. 
He has been a member of the Give

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Committee of the international 
Jewish committee on 

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inter-religious consultations. 
The highest Jewish body 

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responsible for Jewish Vatican 
relations in the diaspora in the

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past. 
Five years, he lectured widely 

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on jewish-christian relations. 
He has been quoted extensively 

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regarding jewish-christian 
Affairs in the National and 

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Jewish media and appeared on 
numerous national television 

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news programs. 
He also directed the publication

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of a number of monographs 
regarding Israel. 

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As in the Middle East and 
anti-Semitism as director of 

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leadership, Education and 
Training at the Hartman 

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Institute dr. 
Corner was responsible for 

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educational programs, for 
visiting rabbis academics. 

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Christian clerics American 
Jewish Community leaders and 

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students. 
He has designed courses in 

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Jewish thought, ethics and 
Jewish law, and taught Wexner 

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fellows and Jewish communal 
leaders. 

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Without further Ado, dr. 
Eugene corn. 

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Thank you for joining the 
Judaism demystified podcast. 

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Could you tell us a little bit 
about your book to be a holy 

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people? 
Jewish tradition, and ethical 

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values? 
Yes. 

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First of all, it's wonderful to 
be on on the cast with Ben. 

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Ben tzion, thank you very much. 
The book is called to be a holy 

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people, Jewish tradition and 
ethical values. 

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And I wrote the book because 
there's a certain crisis and 

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this is a division in the Jewish
people they have And as a result

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of historical development, and 
modern culture and that is that 

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the after the Emancipation in 
the Enlightenment and the 18th 

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and 19th century, they would be,
there was a certain split in the

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Jewish people that liberal Jews.
Self that they didn't have to 

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keep Jewish tradition in Jewish 
law. 

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The only thing that was 
important was ethics. 

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So Mickey that's a lot of Jewish
law. 

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For instance, like kashrut lack 
of dietary laws and they said, 

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the only thing is important is 
we have to be good to our 

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neighbors ethical values. 
And as a response to that 

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traditional is Jews. 
Are Orthodox. 

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Jews began to emphasize do wish 
Lon and ha. 

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You know, at the expense of 
Ethics, they so X is some kind 

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of you. 
Versatile, maybe Gentile import 

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into Judaism and they stress, 
haha. 

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So, in their education at Lok 
and in your sermons. 

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And in their writings, it was 
all about Jewish law and ethics 

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kind of fell into the into the 
deep background. 

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So, as a result, you have these 
two groups that I think are 

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still present. 
Today, they have the 

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traditionalist who Focus almost 
exclusively on Jewish law and 

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you have liberal Judaism, Deism 
which sometimes talks about 

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Jerusalem up in the most part. 
It's all about, but Universal 

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ethics. 
Now, my book was an attempt to 

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show that in fact, Jewish ethics
of our sexual and critical and 

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internal to Jewish tradition and
that Holiness, or could you shop

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which is a prime objective of 
the Torah. 

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And we're supposed to be the 
only people, you cannot be a 

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holy people without a 
dedication. 

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To ethics and moral values. 
And this is not a new idea, this

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was actually the discussed at 
Great length by the famous 

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rabbinic Authority run Bonner 
not Commodities. 

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You know who said in his 
commentary on the Torah, that 

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there's a Mitzvah good notion to
you striving to be, holy you 

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shall be a holy people. 
God tells the Jewish people 

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right before the Ten 
Commandments I'm in Leviticus 

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and it's not not in the book of 
Exodus and Leviticus of it's 

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part of the Torah. 
It's part of Jewish law and the 

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Run Bond says there. 
That Holiness and Tails 

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something going Beyond formal 
law. 

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Before you can actually keep the
law and still be a scoundrel. 

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Still be a despicable person. 
Therefore, you need ethical 

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values to come in to make you 
holy. 

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So the Holiness and ethics going
hand in hand with each other. 

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And in fact, I could have been 
entitled. 

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The book Jewish law in an 
ethical mode for Helicon and 

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ethical mode, but that wouldn't 
have sold as many copies as 

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different titles. 
So we look at it that way, it's 

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an, it's an attempt to 
demonstrate from traditional 

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sources and from Jewish 
tradition that ethics and Jewish

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law in Jewish tradition, really 
happened to hand in glove with 

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each other. 
So that's really the, you know, 

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the essential argument of the 
book. 

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Excellent, interesting. 
Okay, so Our ethics. 

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Something that is imposed on 
Jews from Gentile culture, or is

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it an internal part of Jewish 
texts in Tradition? 

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Right. 
So, I mean there's a lot of 

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traditional dish. 
Now, to say that will ethics is 

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something projectiles, you know,
if this is some people through 

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the answer will be traditional 
Jews. 

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Keep Jewish law and keep Jewish 
leadership, don't have to be 

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concerned with ethics. 
All we need to do is to follow 

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every prescription right in the 
codes of Jewish law like this. 

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Look on Earth. 
I'm a professor. 

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So interestingly you know, 
traditional Jews say that. 

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That's a very modern notion. 
You know, that's a result of 

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this. 
Development in modernity that I 

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mentioned earlier, that that's a
response to kind of the 

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liberalization of Judaism. 
No, Rabbi in the talmud that I 

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know of ever held that position 
the Torah itself in the talmud. 

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It's understands that ethics are
essential right? 

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To the Covenant, that God made 
with the Jewish people and you 

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find that all over the Torah. 
In other words, there are 

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essential components Suffuse 
ethics, right? 

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Like said they said that is 
usually translated as Justice 

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and mishpokhe Miss. 
Bai means that you have to live 

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in accordance with law and tell 
him. 

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Hello, Kim that every human 
being was created in the image 

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of God and listen and Rock'em 
that is compassion and empathy 

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with other human beings and the 
verse and Authority Octillery 

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Africa. 
Mocha the Remy atiba said was 

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the was asleep. 
Greatest principle of the talk. 

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All these things are foundations
of Jewish ethics that are part 

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of the tour itself. 
They don't come from outside 

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Gentile, culture their part and 
parcel of of the tower itself 

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and the Torah itself says about 
Sita, Sharma had talked. 

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You have to do what is good and 
what is right? 

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So this notion that somehow the 
ethics come from check tiles 

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because the universal and we're 
particular ristic, you know 

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ironically that's a very Turn 
notion, that's not what the 

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Torah says it all and it's 
certainly not what huzzah or the

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or the Tommy rabbis believed in 
my. 

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And I talked about this in the 
book and I give examples and 

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eyesight text that show that in 
fact, ethics is internal to 

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Judaism. 
We shouldn't see it as something

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foreign and we should see it as 
something secondary to Jewish 

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ritual. 
Let me give you just one 

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example, you know, at the 
beginning of the Jewish people 

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in in the Book of Genesis and 
safe, appreciate this is a story

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about stoma no more room at the 
con tells Abraham. 

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That he wants to destroy stomach
tomorrow because there's many 

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Wicked people in the cities. 
So Abraham begins to argue with 

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God. 
You know and at the end he says 

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hello God forbid that you should
treat righteous people. 

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The way you treat Sinners, the 
way you treat people and then he

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says to God. 
People are, it's no use. 

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Will the Creator, will the judge
of all the Earth, but not act. 

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In accordance with the laws of 
Justice. 

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In other words God is a just 
God. 

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God has to has to behave in 
accordance with the laws of 

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justice. 
So God has to behave in 

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accordance with the laws of 
Justice. 

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Certainly, we were created in 
the image of God, have to have 

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to adhere to the standards of 
Justice. 

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This is in the torrid Zone 
doesn't come. 

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Just this doesn't come from the 
outside Gentile work. 

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It's part of the tower is part 
of Are very conception of not of

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aberration mine, borates of the 
guy who created the universe and

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it's about Jewish tradition. 
God is seen as about has that is

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as a compassionate empathetic 
entity. 

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Who treats human beings treats, 
his creatures, Jason and the 

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camera says and many places, but
most obvious places in the 

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Camaro and Sota which says that 
uses God does acts of gets and 

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we have to do acts of person 
Sokka. 

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Compassion for other people and 
Justice. 

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And just to means, treating 
people fairly, these are 

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attributes of God, but they 
don't, when we're supposed to 

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imitate God and never work. 
We, as children of God, we has 

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Partners including who God made 
a covenant with also have to act

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that way. 
So there's no question that 

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according to Jewish tradition 
ethics are internal to the 

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Torah. 
It's essential to the Torah and 

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that's again, what not 
Commodities said that you If you

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really want to be a holy people,
you know you have to be ethical.

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You think of it this way? 
Think of it this way. 

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You know, he had a person who 
ate block potion would never eat

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anything that was not Kosher and
he would never violate the 

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Sabbath but yet it was an 
unethical person like he stole 

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from other people or he cheated 
other people. 

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Could you ever imagine that such
a person you know, would be a 

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holy person would be impossible 
or for instance you know, we had

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when we can talk a little bit 
about this later. 

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You have instances of violence 
and extremism, done by so-called

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religious Jew. 
Jews. 

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Who wouldn't think about? 
What would never eat? 

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Non-kosher food the Sabbath, but
they go and they harm other 

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people because such people be 
holy people, there's a 

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contradiction there so you need 
ethics in order, you know, to to

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realize the great dream of the 
Torah and the great dream of God

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to make us a holy people. 
I would actually say, you know 

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like if your brick like you 
don't have to mention like 

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stealing as an example. 
As that's clearly a Breaking Up 

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Haha, someone could actually be 
adhering to halakha fully and 

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completely and still be for 
example. 

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Like, you know, you're rushing 
to get to Minyan, but you're 

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pushing people out of the way to
get there. 

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You're being rude, right? 
Exactly. 

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So, so the right not Commodities
has a famous phrase that he says

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in his commentary that Tory says
you can get involved to shoot 

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the Torah. 
That is a scoundrel. 

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You can be a despicable person 
and still not great, Jewish 

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lawyer. 
You can be within the bounds of 

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Jewish law. 
Whoa, but even so you're a 

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loathsome person your scoundrel.
And that's why you need the, the

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imperative that our imperative 
to try to be a holy people to 

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teach you. 
Then law is not enough. 

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You have to go this evening 
Monsieur that then you could be 

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humble, look, the camera itself.
I'm in very interesting, the 

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Thomas says in tractate problem 
with see that it says, why was 

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the second temple destroyed 
since no one, the first temple 

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was destroyed. 
Romero says that was destroyed 

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because Jews committed these 
terrible. 

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Violations of Jewish law. 
They committed idolatry, they 

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murder and they then committed 
incest and they were sexually 

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undisciplined. 
So we understand. 

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It was a fit part of their 
punishment for these people 

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because they violated to 
optional. 

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But in the second temple, period
and that the second temple 

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period, the gemara says, they 
kept all the laws of the Torah. 

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You know, they've, they've 
behaved according to the D name 

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of the tower. 
That's what the commercial says,

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and yet God punished them. 
Why because they kept the name 

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in a strict legal sense. 
Right. 

235
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But they were they were unfair 
to their neighbors, right? 

236
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They did the kind of thing that 
just right, they may have been 

237
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rushing to show, okay, but they 
were rude to other people or 

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they would be neglected other 
people, and they hated, they 

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hated their fellow neighbor, and
they did all these things. 

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Even though they kept the Torah,
so they come with mercies God, 

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couldn't tolerate the midst of 
this great head of the church 

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even volusion. 
At the end of the 19th century. 

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He said these people were 
intolerant toward each other, 

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they hated each other, and God 
couldn't tolerate these 

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intolerance righteous people. 
Just so they were intolerant 

246
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with their neighbors. 
So God was intolerant when with 

247
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them and, and destroyed the 
second temple. 

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So so the Judge there is you 
have to go beyond the strict 

249
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letter of the law. 
You have to go look Numa 

250
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shuriken and that's the tell 
Munich race you have to have 

251
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basic decency toward your 
fellow, man. 

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I remember a few times actually 
not once but multiple times 

253
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where I remember back in 
Yeshiva, when they would say 

254
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that the highest level person 
can reach is, let's say, take 

255
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look to ignore of don't steal so
the highest Could reach is when 

256
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you don't steal not because it's
unethical but because God told 

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you not to steal in a sense, 
taking out all the ethics from 

258
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the actual commandment. 
If you get what I'm saying. 

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00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:41,300
Absolutely, that's, that's 
whatever that was. 

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00:15:42,300 --> 00:15:45,900
That's very good. 
Example of this mindset is 

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00:15:45,900 --> 00:15:48,800
modern, monitor is not a 
traditional - it's a modern 

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00:15:48,800 --> 00:15:53,000
ninths of my said that all you 
have to do, you know, is listen 

263
00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:55,900
to the commands of God. 
And you don't have to be 

264
00:15:55,900 --> 00:15:59,300
concerned with any think that 
this is exclusive focus on the 

265
00:15:59,300 --> 00:16:02,400
law. 
And don't do worry that it sent 

266
00:16:02,400 --> 00:16:04,500
its read the fucking ceiling 
issue. 

267
00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:06,800
But there are passages in the 
mirror. 

268
00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:09,700
With says, you're allowed to 
steal from Jan kaas, okay. 

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00:16:10,700 --> 00:16:16,100
As so, I mean, think about that 
if that in fact is this is the 

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00:16:16,100 --> 00:16:20,700
strict formal law. 
Could a person be a holy person,

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00:16:20,700 --> 00:16:23,300
right? 
If he eats Glatt Kosher and, and

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00:16:23,300 --> 00:16:26,600
still some Gentiles and Known 
that he still some can cause, 

273
00:16:26,800 --> 00:16:28,800
you know, could such a person, 
be a holy person. 

274
00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:32,100
It's hard to consider conceive 
of such a thing. 

275
00:16:32,500 --> 00:16:35,000
So we can talk about these 
examples where a homophone 

276
00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:39,000
appears to be unethical, but the
parameters of that helicopter 

277
00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:41,300
would be that you don't get 
punished maybe, but that doesn't

278
00:16:41,300 --> 00:16:43,500
make it ethical. 
Am I wrong? 

279
00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:45,000
Correct? 
No, I'm not the ones. 

280
00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:47,500
You don't get punished because 
you haven't violated the law. 

281
00:16:47,800 --> 00:16:49,700
Yeah, but that doesn't make it 
necessarily. 

282
00:16:49,700 --> 00:16:51,700
Ethical. 
Is it correct? 

283
00:16:51,800 --> 00:16:53,900
Absolutely. 
That's exactly my point. 

284
00:16:54,300 --> 00:16:56,400
Yes. 
Fencing arm could do something 

285
00:16:56,400 --> 00:17:00,300
that might not be punishable, 
but that you're not. 

286
00:17:00,700 --> 00:17:02,500
That doesn't make you any better
per se. 

287
00:17:02,500 --> 00:17:05,500
It's just, it's just, you know, 
by the letter of the law, your 

288
00:17:07,599 --> 00:17:11,099
Not punishable, right, right. 
And says, okay with that, that's

289
00:17:11,099 --> 00:17:14,200
exactly why the talmud in the 
government seizes. 

290
00:17:14,500 --> 00:17:17,800
Yeah. 
You know, my father was in the 

291
00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:20,700
tower but they were still guilty
of terrible, terrible things. 

292
00:17:20,700 --> 00:17:23,000
And that's why the second temple
was destroyed. 

293
00:17:23,099 --> 00:17:25,300
So can you contextualize for our
audience? 

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00:17:25,300 --> 00:17:27,300
You know who hear these things? 
There are. 

295
00:17:27,300 --> 00:17:31,100
If you like kind of cherry pick 
certain verses and Tom would, it

296
00:17:31,100 --> 00:17:35,500
comes off as extremely unethical
in a way where you know, there's

297
00:17:35,700 --> 00:17:38,200
in terms of let's say, for 
example, saving a Have a go, a 

298
00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:42,500
on Shabbat and all these things.
Like you just mentioned, it 

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00:17:42,500 --> 00:17:46,000
seems almost like if you're 
looking at it today, you're 

300
00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:50,200
almost cringing. 
So what what do you, what do you

301
00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:52,100
say to that? 
Because I actually wanted to 

302
00:17:52,300 --> 00:17:54,100
give you my own perspective of 
things. 

303
00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:58,900
Obviously, if you want, I'm 
somebody who, you know, I'm very

304
00:17:58,900 --> 00:18:03,200
much tapped into pop culture, 
and I was watching Game of 

305
00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:06,200
Thrones recently, and I was just
thinking to myself, I said, you 

306
00:18:06,208 --> 00:18:09,500
know, anytime, If someone walks 
into a field or walks down the 

307
00:18:09,500 --> 00:18:12,400
block, they get, you know, 
they're getting ambushed or 

308
00:18:12,408 --> 00:18:15,500
attacked or there's, there's, 
you know, attacked by Bandits. 

309
00:18:15,500 --> 00:18:19,400
And this was the ancient world 
in a way because when they said 

310
00:18:19,400 --> 00:18:22,000
to lot to Derek, it wasn't like 
today where you would, you read 

311
00:18:22,000 --> 00:18:25,400
a verse because you're, you 
know, you're driving, you know, 

312
00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:29,100
few miles down the road. 
You're actually always in 

313
00:18:29,100 --> 00:18:32,600
Crittenden immediate danger. 
So, that's the world that they 

314
00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:35,300
lived and they lived in a world 
where they were brutalized by 

315
00:18:35,300 --> 00:18:39,700
the gooey and I saw them in a 
specific way, which is different

316
00:18:39,700 --> 00:18:41,900
than today, obviously. 
So is it something along those 

317
00:18:41,900 --> 00:18:43,600
lines like the way you would 
answer that? 

318
00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:47,200
Yes, yes. 
And it's not only me, you know, 

319
00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:51,600
then who would answer. 
I think there's a whole host of 

320
00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:56,900
modern Orthodox. 
Rabbis lived in modernity of who

321
00:18:56,900 --> 00:18:59,400
understood that exactly the 
difference that you're talking 

322
00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:01,000
about. 
Then other words, when the 

323
00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:06,100
gemara talked about about these 
things, they say not returning, 

324
00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:11,600
the Lost object of the Gentile. 
There's a moral and ethical 

325
00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:14,900
legal obligation to return, the 
Lost object of the Jew. 

326
00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:19,400
But not, there's no such 
obligation to return a lost 

327
00:19:19,400 --> 00:19:23,100
object of the Gentile. 
So today, that's that would seem

328
00:19:23,100 --> 00:19:25,700
to be the unjust or 
discriminatory. 

329
00:19:26,900 --> 00:19:31,000
So, how host of modern very, 
very traditional Orthodox. 

330
00:19:31,100 --> 00:19:33,600
Rabbi said, well, you know that 
that original Law. 

331
00:19:33,700 --> 00:19:37,200
Oh, that's in the Torah. 
Only applied in the culture of 

332
00:19:38,500 --> 00:19:40,700
the. 
When the tourer was written 

333
00:19:40,700 --> 00:19:43,700
itself, or if you're even in Tom
unit times, when the Assumption 

334
00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:47,500
was the Gentiles were 
uncivilized people, they they 

335
00:19:47,500 --> 00:19:51,200
felt no social or moral 
obligations toward us. 

336
00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:55,200
So therefore, we don't have any 
social moral obligations toward 

337
00:19:55,200 --> 00:19:56,000
them. 
Okay? 

338
00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:59,500
However, now when we live in a 
civilized in a pluralistic 

339
00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:03,600
civilized society with 
Christians and with Muslims 

340
00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:06,300
Okay. 
None of those laws of and of 

341
00:20:06,300 --> 00:20:12,000
course if if Christians would 
consider it an obligation to 

342
00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:17,100
return the Lost object of a Jew,
then we have an obligation to 

343
00:20:17,900 --> 00:20:21,400
return, the Lost object, such as
Jim, Tom, that's only fair. 

344
00:20:21,400 --> 00:20:23,900
That's what said that gives. 
That's just the service of 

345
00:20:23,900 --> 00:20:27,800
prostate or equality. 
So many of these laws that we 

346
00:20:27,800 --> 00:20:31,000
have problems with today. 
And we rightfully, we have 

347
00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:33,500
rightfully, you know, we cringe 
at them to use. 

348
00:20:33,700 --> 00:20:38,100
Your turn ever it was because 
they were from a different 

349
00:20:38,100 --> 00:20:41,700
context that were from the 
ancient world and non-jews were 

350
00:20:41,700 --> 00:20:45,100
uncivilized people go home when 
we live with, civilized people 

351
00:20:45,500 --> 00:20:50,600
who understand more of morality 
and moral limits than there's a 

352
00:20:50,608 --> 00:20:54,100
certain element that said it and
equality and reciprocity that 

353
00:20:54,100 --> 00:20:55,900
kicks in. 
Yes, been seeing him. 

354
00:20:56,200 --> 00:20:58,900
Yeah, I push back on what both 
of you are saying, but we 

355
00:20:58,900 --> 00:21:00,900
actually would end up in the 
same place, just taking a 

356
00:21:00,908 --> 00:21:05,200
different direction. 
I think, although I could be 

357
00:21:05,200 --> 00:21:09,500
wrong that another way to look 
at it and I believe that the 

358
00:21:09,500 --> 00:21:11,900
rambam mentions this but I could
be wrong. 

359
00:21:12,700 --> 00:21:16,900
Would be that the sumption also 
with the non-jews, in talmudic 

360
00:21:16,900 --> 00:21:20,700
times, would be that most non 
Jews were Idol. 

361
00:21:20,700 --> 00:21:24,600
Worshippers something that 
doesn't ask ye we would get to 

362
00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:27,000
the same place but just I'm 
going a little bit of a 

363
00:21:27,008 --> 00:21:30,500
different route. 
May be less practical like meant

364
00:21:30,500 --> 00:21:35,400
like Benji was suggesting but 
Um, the standpoint that the that

365
00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:39,000
you know, most Gentiles were 
considered to be Idol 

366
00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:45,100
worshippers and there was a 
necessary distance that we had 

367
00:21:45,100 --> 00:21:47,800
to have the right civilized, 
basically. 

368
00:21:47,800 --> 00:21:50,600
Let's the same at this point 
because idolatry comes with a 

369
00:21:50,608 --> 00:21:53,900
whole host of ethical issues 
with it, so, I guess maybe it's 

370
00:21:53,900 --> 00:21:57,400
not so different, but yeah, 
there's also that issue of, you 

371
00:21:57,408 --> 00:21:59,700
know, back then there was idol 
worship and there's a lot of 

372
00:21:59,708 --> 00:22:03,500
strange type of idol worship. 
Whereas today, especially in 

373
00:22:03,500 --> 00:22:07,200
the, And world I would say that,
you know, these problems don't 

374
00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:08,600
exist as much. 
Maybe. 

375
00:22:08,700 --> 00:22:11,200
Yes, Yes, actually. 
That's a very good point. 

376
00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:14,000
Vince Young because you know 
what is idol worship? 

377
00:22:14,500 --> 00:22:18,200
If you look in the Torah is two 
different ideas for idol 

378
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:20,700
worship. 
One is that people were bowing 

379
00:22:20,700 --> 00:22:25,100
down to the stars or it's the 
trees or today to that's one 

380
00:22:25,100 --> 00:22:28,400
form of idol worship. 
They consider trees and stars to

381
00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:31,400
be cogs around. 
So, they're worshipping these 

382
00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:35,100
finite objects to really not Not
God, or really not Divine. 

383
00:22:35,100 --> 00:22:37,600
That's one conception. 
Then you have another conception

384
00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:42,100
of idol worship, and that is 
people who are not civilized for

385
00:22:42,100 --> 00:22:45,900
instance, what's the Paradigm of
idol worship? 

386
00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:51,500
He said, who the room is mola, 
you know, where people's so, 

387
00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:56,000
and, and the Paradigm for the 
Canaanite tribes that that Jews 

388
00:22:56,000 --> 00:23:01,200
had to eliminate when they, when
yahshua came into the hurts to 

389
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:05,700
not a paradigm where these were 
Wild uncivilized people, right? 

390
00:23:05,700 --> 00:23:08,100
Where no moral values, no 
central banks. 

391
00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:11,900
And the one who stressed Rabbi 
who stressed this notion of 

392
00:23:11,900 --> 00:23:15,400
Idols who was an idol worshiper,
is somebody who has a religion, 

393
00:23:15,700 --> 00:23:18,000
that doesn't demand that they 
act. 

394
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:21,200
Civilly and world. 
The one of the rabbi who 

395
00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:26,700
stressed, this was a familiarity
lived in the in the 13th 

396
00:23:26,700 --> 00:23:28,500
century. 
And that's the way he defined 

397
00:23:28,500 --> 00:23:32,100
idol worship and there. 
And and and he understood that 

398
00:23:32,100 --> 00:23:35,300
Muslims and Christians. 
Christians were civilized 

399
00:23:35,300 --> 00:23:39,900
people, most of them, so they 
shouldn't be considered Idol 

400
00:23:39,900 --> 00:23:43,400
worshippers they were there. 
He had this famous phrase, 

401
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:48,400
people who are constrained by by
their religion. 

402
00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:50,600
Okay. 
So people people who have a 

403
00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:53,900
religion, which demands that 
they don't kill and that they 

404
00:23:53,900 --> 00:23:56,600
don't steal that they don't rape
and pillage. 

405
00:23:56,900 --> 00:23:59,700
So if people are not Idol 
worshipers, okay? 

406
00:23:59,900 --> 00:24:01,700
And that certainly would include
Christians. 

407
00:24:02,300 --> 00:24:05,800
He would say that they have full
Notions, but not necessarily in 

408
00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:09,200
the category of Iowa's, right? 
Right for him. 

409
00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:12,500
I don't, you know, I don't 
worship was a function of how 

410
00:24:12,500 --> 00:24:17,100
they behave in the in society 
and toward other people. 

411
00:24:17,100 --> 00:24:20,800
It wasn't some theological 
conception of, how did they 

412
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,700
conceive of God who was about, 
you know, but the Practical 

413
00:24:23,700 --> 00:24:26,300
attack was, you know, very 
pragmatic tests. 

414
00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:28,900
Are they moral people? 
Are they do have a sense of 

415
00:24:28,900 --> 00:24:32,100
social responsibility. 
If so, then they're not at all, 

416
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:35,700
like the idol worshippers. 
Is that of describing Tanakh or 

417
00:24:35,700 --> 00:24:38,200
in the tumbler? 
This is a famous position of the

418
00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:42,900
new URI and furthermore I think 
it is speaks to our day. 

419
00:24:42,900 --> 00:24:46,200
This is really how we have to 
understand about Hazard. 

420
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:49,800
I'll Worship in modern terms 
that, you know, I have another 

421
00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:54,500
book that is actually coming out
at the end of this month about 

422
00:24:54,500 --> 00:24:57,200
Jewish Gentile relations. 
And there's a whole chapter 

423
00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:02,400
there about what is idolatry 
today, following the position of

424
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:06,700
The year was a very underrated 
another. 

425
00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:10,700
Yeah, here's another example of 
the kinds of things were talking

426
00:25:10,700 --> 00:25:15,500
about, you mentioned maimonides 
rambam where I'm not a thought 

427
00:25:15,500 --> 00:25:21,600
that Christians were Idol 
worshippers and because of the 

428
00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:24,100
Trinity and because of the 
Incarnation, I don't want to get

429
00:25:24,100 --> 00:25:27,500
into Christian theology, but 
rambam believes you had to be a 

430
00:25:27,500 --> 00:25:32,900
pure monotheists and if you're 
not a monotheists, then then you

431
00:25:32,908 --> 00:25:35,600
were an idol. 
Worship is Christianity was idol

432
00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:39,200
worship, according to the Roma. 
So that was the position of Rob 

433
00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:41,500
on the consent for you. 
Interestingly, never lived with 

434
00:25:41,500 --> 00:25:43,900
Christians. 
You know, he lived in Muslim 

435
00:25:43,900 --> 00:25:46,000
societies and he could talk 
about Christians as a 

436
00:25:46,008 --> 00:25:49,700
theoretical population. 
You never met or talked to 

437
00:25:49,700 --> 00:25:52,600
Christians, you know, unlike the
mirror who lived in Christian 

438
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:58,500
Provence, in the southern France
but meeting inside, that's a 

439
00:25:58,508 --> 00:26:00,100
yes. 
Okay, never confess. 

440
00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:03,500
So what that says is that our 
experience with other people 

441
00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:07,000
People are experienced really 
affects the way, you know, we 

442
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:11,300
understand Jewish law and Jewish
ethics, you know, it's not some 

443
00:26:11,300 --> 00:26:15,700
theoretical discipline out 
there, but it has to do with how

444
00:26:15,700 --> 00:26:19,000
we live and what our 
experiences, many events among 

445
00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:20,700
the point. 
I wanted to make here was that 

446
00:26:21,200 --> 00:26:25,200
this could, this could was 
unacceptable for the rabbis. 

447
00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:30,800
Lived with Christians in 
ashkenaz in the Middle Ages, for

448
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:34,600
the late Middle Ages, you know, 
in France, and in Germany and 

449
00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:37,900
Italy, they lived with 
Christians, they understood the 

450
00:26:37,900 --> 00:26:41,100
Christians who could be 
sophisticated, you know, people 

451
00:26:41,100 --> 00:26:46,000
religiously morally and 
therefore they rejected that the

452
00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:50,000
majority of the later rabbinic 
authorities in Austin has 

453
00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:54,300
rejected the rambam because they
just couldn't be that Christians

454
00:26:54,500 --> 00:26:57,100
could be Idol. 
A maybe, you know, they had will

455
00:26:57,100 --> 00:26:59,900
Notions of God because they 
believe in the Trinity, but they

456
00:26:59,900 --> 00:27:03,000
weren't Idol worshippers. 
So, they said that the 

457
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:06,300
Christians are not the same 
kinds of people that the 

458
00:27:06,300 --> 00:27:09,100
commemorative development and 
referred to, I don't worship 

459
00:27:09,100 --> 00:27:12,400
mascara. 
So, another topic that we don't 

460
00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:24,200
want to get into human 
experiences with I'm a big 

461
00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:28,200
believer and you can A religion 
based on the behavior of its 

462
00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:33,600
adherence and in Judaism, even 
if there are texts and verses 

463
00:27:33,900 --> 00:27:38,900
that seem to be very very, you 
know, Unbecoming. 

464
00:27:38,900 --> 00:27:42,300
Let's just say, it doesn't 
usually reflect our actions. 

465
00:27:42,300 --> 00:27:46,800
Like we have, you know, for 
example, these user not really 

466
00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:49,100
people who went around ever 
killing people and forcing them 

467
00:27:49,100 --> 00:27:52,000
to convert to Judaism. 
And we don't have that kind of 

468
00:27:52,008 --> 00:27:53,900
history is no tyranny. 
There's no tyranny. 

469
00:27:53,900 --> 00:27:55,500
There's no none of that abuse of
power. 

470
00:27:55,600 --> 00:28:00,600
Our so that that's something 
that I feel like is a great 

471
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:03,000
example for another perfect. 
Example, actually would be the 

472
00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,800
good morrow which talks about a 
bit Dean that would that would 

473
00:28:06,500 --> 00:28:10,100
give the death penalty was 
considered a very brutal and 

474
00:28:10,100 --> 00:28:11,900
evil Corps kind of. 
Yeah and evil Court like 

475
00:28:12,100 --> 00:28:26,700
bloodthirsty bloody Cord Blood 
If you argue that the Torah 

476
00:28:26,700 --> 00:28:31,600
adopted that, that idea, the 
fact is use never really took 

477
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:34,300
that literally, or at least 
tried their best, not to take 

478
00:28:34,300 --> 00:28:36,300
that literally right. 
Yes. 

479
00:28:36,300 --> 00:28:40,400
I mean, we just read it 
yesterday something earlier in 

480
00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:45,600
the day, you know, it says I am 
talking high and so and by the 

481
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:51,700
way, Christians, who were 
anti-jewish, you know, held this

482
00:28:51,900 --> 00:28:55,000
against us, that we have this 
bloody look, you know, and I've 

483
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:59,300
heard enough You know, this is 
primitive, that's the way. 

484
00:28:59,500 --> 00:29:02,800
But of course, as you said 
correctly, Bim, you know, we 

485
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:06,500
never did that literally. 
And it's interesting that we 

486
00:29:06,500 --> 00:29:10,600
never took that literally by the
Jewish law, is you compensate. 

487
00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:14,800
The person who who lost the eye 
with money, right? 

488
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:18,600
With the value another, you pay 
him the value of the I not the 

489
00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:21,000
eye itself. 
Now, now here's an interesting 

490
00:29:21,000 --> 00:29:23,600
point, why do we do that? 
Why don't we interpreted 

491
00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:28,300
literally Zion talk about, you 
know, Shmuel. 

492
00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:33,500
Yeah, just got the eye of 
Shamone, so why we got a gouge 

493
00:29:33,500 --> 00:29:36,200
out the Irishman? 
Well, so the governor explains 

494
00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:41,500
why it says, and the argument of
the gemara is a moral ethical 

495
00:29:41,500 --> 00:29:44,400
argument. 
It says we don't do that. 

496
00:29:44,400 --> 00:29:48,600
Literally, we don't apply the 
verse literally because the 

497
00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:52,900
other value of schmules I might 
be different from the value of 

498
00:29:53,500 --> 00:29:55,400
might be dead. 
The other party. 

499
00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:56,900
Right. 
So what is that? 

500
00:29:56,900 --> 00:29:59,400
That's a moral argument. 
That says, look, this the 

501
00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:06,400
punishment has to fit the crime.
So for the loss, the loss and 

502
00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:09,900
the punishment has to fit the 
the extent of the loss. 

503
00:30:09,900 --> 00:30:12,500
And one person's eye is not the 
same as another person. 

504
00:30:12,500 --> 00:30:17,200
So, here's an example. 
Let's say an artist gouged out 

505
00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:22,400
the gouges out of a 
mathematician, so mathematician 

506
00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:27,300
really doesn't need his eyes. 
To do his mathematics. 

507
00:30:27,300 --> 00:30:31,700
The way an artist needs is 
highest to pay heart, but it 

508
00:30:31,700 --> 00:30:36,300
would if the artist gouges out 
the eye of the methods issue and

509
00:30:36,300 --> 00:30:39,100
you say, well you know the laws 
I am talking to Ian and I for 

510
00:30:39,100 --> 00:30:44,100
not and you get out you have to 
the eye of the artist. 

511
00:30:44,100 --> 00:30:46,600
You were taking away from the 
artist something much more 

512
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:49,600
important than what he did to 
the mathematician. 

513
00:30:49,700 --> 00:30:54,900
That's okay. 
Why does it matter? 

514
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:59,100
Has to be equal. 
The answer is because it's an 

515
00:30:59,100 --> 00:31:02,900
ethical value of Justice, right?
It's something. 

516
00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:07,700
So, the rabbi's, understood the 
nature of justice and the 

517
00:31:07,708 --> 00:31:12,300
importance of ethical values so 
much that they were willing not 

518
00:31:12,500 --> 00:31:16,200
to ignore the literal 
interpretation of what the Torah

519
00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:20,000
says, and go toward the ethical 
interpretation. 

520
00:31:20,300 --> 00:31:24,200
So that's a very powerful 
example of how ethical values in

521
00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:29,000
this case notion of This year 
was fundamental in how we 

522
00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:35,000
interpret and live Jewish law. 
I would, I would say that 

523
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:40,100
there's a very interesting 
chapter in Nahum sarna has 

524
00:31:40,500 --> 00:31:44,700
exploring Exodus book where he 
actually tries to show that it 

525
00:31:44,700 --> 00:31:47,800
could very well be that the tour
never meant it literally based 

526
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:51,300
on Ancient near East. 
I don't remember exact. 

527
00:31:51,300 --> 00:31:53,800
Maybe you remember member you do
remember but he actually makes a

528
00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:55,400
case for the tour. 
Not meaning it. 

529
00:31:55,500 --> 00:31:58,600
Literally all together. 
That's just an interesting side 

530
00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:03,400
note, but regardless, it's a 
certain sense. 

531
00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:07,900
I mean, you know, the ancient 
law was in the non-jewish 

532
00:32:07,900 --> 00:32:10,900
cultures. 
Was that the person the victim? 

533
00:32:10,900 --> 00:32:12,700
The person whose I was couched 
in? 

534
00:32:13,200 --> 00:32:15,900
Had the option of telling the 
judges? 

535
00:32:16,300 --> 00:32:20,200
I want you to gouge out the 
other, the, the eye of the 

536
00:32:20,300 --> 00:32:24,300
perpetrator, right? 
Or you can give me compensation.

537
00:32:24,300 --> 00:32:29,100
He had the option of the But 
Jewish law was much more moral 

538
00:32:29,100 --> 00:32:31,100
and it sends it said, no. 
You don't have that option. 

539
00:32:31,100 --> 00:32:36,000
Any longer, you know, we only, 
we only settle this case through

540
00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:39,200
monetary compensation. 
So, here is an instance and I 

541
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:43,000
think not from sarna talks a lot
about this and people who Calvin

542
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:46,700
people, who investigated, you 
know, what was Jewish law around

543
00:32:46,700 --> 00:32:51,800
the time of when the Torah was 
given or the time of the talmud,

544
00:32:51,900 --> 00:32:56,400
he saw the how how the rabbi's 
implemented visualize a great 

545
00:32:56,400 --> 00:33:00,000
moral advancement over the 
surrounding cultures of the 

546
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:01,700
Time. 
Princess like the Code of 

547
00:33:01,700 --> 00:33:06,200
Hammurabi was is priming soon. 
So, yes, that's exactly true. 

548
00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:10,700
Now let's go back to the case 
that you talked about about not 

549
00:33:10,700 --> 00:33:14,600
as saving a gentile on the 
Sabbath. 

550
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:18,900
So the Boomer says that, by the 
way, that we don't have to say 

551
00:33:18,900 --> 00:33:23,200
that that's how did in Tino's 
violating his so to us, you 

552
00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:26,800
know, we were to use Ben's term.
We Cringe at that kind of 

553
00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:32,200
emotion. 
So in fact that the gemara does 

554
00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:38,600
say that there is a there is a 
way to reason that that gives 

555
00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:42,400
you a license or permission to 
save the life of a gentile and 

556
00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:45,900
that is because you don't want 
to engender hatred amongst the 

557
00:33:45,900 --> 00:33:48,400
Gentiles because if you don't 
save them on Shabbat, they will 

558
00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:50,700
hate you and they will come back
and kill you, okay? 

559
00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:54,500
So that's called me Shoemaker 
that you're allowed to say the 

560
00:33:54,500 --> 00:33:57,100
Gentile because you To avoid 
their hatred. 

561
00:33:58,100 --> 00:34:00,300
That's not a moral argument. 
That's an argument from 

562
00:34:00,300 --> 00:34:07,100
self-interest, so, so many 
modern Orthodox. 

563
00:34:07,100 --> 00:34:12,400
Modern authorities, for 
instance, Rabbi nachman 

564
00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:14,300
Rabinowitz. 
She was a great great post 

565
00:34:14,300 --> 00:34:19,199
secure Israel, who died 
recently, unfortunately and 

566
00:34:19,500 --> 00:34:21,900
rough salivation. 
And many other round. 

567
00:34:21,900 --> 00:34:26,500
They said, no the reason that 
you Save the life of the 

568
00:34:26,500 --> 00:34:29,500
Gentile, right? 
It's not because you want to 

569
00:34:29,500 --> 00:34:33,699
avoid them from retaliating 
against us you do it because of 

570
00:34:33,699 --> 00:34:36,699
the intrinsic value of the life 
of the Gentile. 

571
00:34:37,300 --> 00:34:41,000
And if civilized if the Gentiles
you talking about our civilized 

572
00:34:41,100 --> 00:34:45,500
non idol-worshipping people, 
then you save them, not me Zoom 

573
00:34:45,500 --> 00:34:49,199
Ava but you say them because 
their life is a value and just 

574
00:34:49,199 --> 00:34:54,400
as a Jewish life supersedes the 
observance of Shabbat one 

575
00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:56,699
Shabbat. 
So it I think I like also 

576
00:34:56,699 --> 00:35:01,200
supersedes it now that in that. 
So this was a kind of modern 

577
00:35:01,900 --> 00:35:06,900
realization or development of 
Jews ethics that that filtered 

578
00:35:06,900 --> 00:35:09,800
into Jewish law itself. 
And not from rabinovich, you 

579
00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:14,700
know, wrote an entire article 
showing that this was in fact, 

580
00:35:14,700 --> 00:35:17,700
not a modern notion but it's in 
the tower itself. 

581
00:35:17,700 --> 00:35:20,900
It comes from a verse in 
Leviticus and it also was the 

582
00:35:20,900 --> 00:35:24,800
major position of not 
Commodities himself, right? 

583
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:31,000
So, So here's an instance where 
a kind of a new awareness of the

584
00:35:32,700 --> 00:35:37,800
lives of Gentiles. 
Let two different moral 

585
00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:42,100
understanding of how we live 
Jewish law suppose. 

586
00:35:42,100 --> 00:35:45,300
So all of these are so the law 
about not saving the life of 

587
00:35:45,300 --> 00:35:48,200
ejecta only applies, really? 
When you're dealing with 

588
00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:52,600
primitive Pagan Gentiles, it 
doesn't apply to the Gentiles 

589
00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:57,100
who you and I live with. 
Amazing, love it really nice. 

590
00:35:57,100 --> 00:36:01,300
And, you know, the question I 
have which is what are the basic

591
00:36:01,300 --> 00:36:03,800
ideas and values of Jewish, 
ethics, actually have a 

592
00:36:03,808 --> 00:36:06,000
question. 
That's even more, maybe 

593
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:09,900
philosophical. 
And it's kind of a might have a 

594
00:36:09,900 --> 00:36:15,000
Chicken, and the Egg kind of 
answer, but I was wondering if 

595
00:36:15,700 --> 00:36:20,800
the F if ethics and morality 
shaped Jewish law, or did the 

596
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:24,600
law, allow the ethics develop. 
You understand what I'm asking? 

597
00:36:24,900 --> 00:36:26,300
Yes. 
Yes, happiness. 

598
00:36:26,300 --> 00:36:31,400
A little of both, you know, it's
a kind of reciprocal or cross 

599
00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:37,100
influence, but the main argument
of my book is that we have to We

600
00:36:37,100 --> 00:36:41,600
have to allow our ethical 
conceptions right to influence 

601
00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:44,300
Jewish. 
Look, here's a, here's another 

602
00:36:44,300 --> 00:36:48,900
modern notion that you hear 
frequently from very traditional

603
00:36:48,900 --> 00:36:52,700
is choose. 
And that is that, you know, 

604
00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:56,300
what, our ethics, ethics are 
simply what Jewish look refined,

605
00:36:56,400 --> 00:36:58,000
you know, type of what. 
I, what does it mean? 

606
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:00,200
What it said? 
That mean what a specified mean,

607
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:02,200
they're Jewish, law tells us 
that grow. 

608
00:37:02,200 --> 00:37:05,200
So, ethics are nothing more than
an extension. 

609
00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:09,600
So that all Is a very modern 
notion that comes from the 

610
00:37:09,700 --> 00:37:14,700
reaction against liberal Judaism
was secular Judaism, which going

611
00:37:14,700 --> 00:37:17,600
to be emphasized used, you know,
there's a famous story in the 

612
00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:20,300
talmud which proves that this is
absolute nonsense. 

613
00:37:21,600 --> 00:37:26,900
This is 3 in the, in the Tom of 
you Rochelle me about a great 

614
00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:30,800
leader of his generation of big 
leaders generation Shimon, Ben 

615
00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:33,200
schachter. 
So, the story is, as follows 

616
00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:36,500
should have been shocked. 
I was a great teacher of Torah. 

617
00:37:37,400 --> 00:37:40,300
And many students but he also 
worked for a living. 

618
00:37:40,300 --> 00:37:46,200
You know he wasn't a cold Little
Nick, sadly the in the base 

619
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:48,900
metal shield, a he work for a 
living and he was in the Flag 

620
00:37:48,900 --> 00:37:53,700
straight, he was a black 
Spurgeon and his students. 

621
00:37:53,700 --> 00:37:56,100
So he worked very hard so they 
came to him one day and they 

622
00:37:56,100 --> 00:37:58,200
said Rabbi you know you work so 
hard. 

623
00:37:58,400 --> 00:38:00,000
We're going to make life easier 
for you. 

624
00:38:00,300 --> 00:38:02,800
We're going to buy you a donkey 
so you don't have to carry the 

625
00:38:02,800 --> 00:38:06,200
flex yourself to the prior the 
acquitted on the donkey and the 

626
00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:08,500
Donkey We'll look a little 
temporary. 

627
00:38:08,500 --> 00:38:13,600
They need living for you so the 
only bought a donkey from an 

628
00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:17,400
idol worshiper but I don't 
worship and on the way back and 

629
00:38:17,400 --> 00:38:19,600
they're bringing you donkey back
to their around. 

630
00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:23,200
But and they discovered that 
there's a jewel right? 

631
00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:25,100
That's under the saddle of the 
company. 

632
00:38:26,100 --> 00:38:29,000
So they bought a donkey but they
got the donkey and this Jewel, 

633
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:34,800
also said they come to Chemeketa
and they say Rabbi revi, you 

634
00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:38,500
know, not only what? 
Will work be easier for you. 

635
00:38:38,500 --> 00:38:41,100
You don't even have to work at 
all anymore, right? 

636
00:38:41,100 --> 00:38:44,800
Because we found this very 
valuable jewel and you can sell 

637
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:47,500
control and you'll be set for 
life, you'll never have to work 

638
00:38:47,500 --> 00:38:51,500
with the rest of you soshim 
invention access to his students

639
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:56,700
City and Did the Gentile know 
that there was a jewel under the

640
00:38:56,700 --> 00:38:59,700
saddle and they say? 
No no no he didn't know but we 

641
00:38:59,700 --> 00:39:05,100
found that there so he sent to 
go return it to me, you didn't 

642
00:39:05,100 --> 00:39:08,100
do the right thing here, go 
return it and they protested. 

643
00:39:08,100 --> 00:39:11,400
They said wherever you taught us
the Jewish law that you don't 

644
00:39:11,400 --> 00:39:13,600
have to return a lost object of 
it checked out. 

645
00:39:14,300 --> 00:39:16,500
So she murmured check 
assessment. 

646
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:18,600
What do you think? 
I'm a barbarian. 

647
00:39:19,200 --> 00:39:19,800
Yeah. 
I know what? 

648
00:39:19,800 --> 00:39:21,200
The Lord's. 
I caught you the law. 

649
00:39:21,200 --> 00:39:23,400
I caught you. 
That is in strict formal. 

650
00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:25,800
Legal terms. 
You don't have to return this to

651
00:39:26,400 --> 00:39:28,600
its barbaric. 
Not to do that, right? 

652
00:39:28,600 --> 00:39:30,300
So there's something the rump on
would have seen. 

653
00:39:30,300 --> 00:39:32,700
This is the new measure that. 
Then you have to go beyond with 

654
00:39:32,700 --> 00:39:36,100
the lawyers and if you don't go 
beyond with the lawyers, you're 

655
00:39:36,100 --> 00:39:38,600
a barbarian and I'm not a 
Barbarian. 

656
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:43,600
So there's an instance in which 
the unwritten rules the laws of 

657
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:46,400
the law says one thing and 
Sherman bunch at that says, yeah

658
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:49,100
but if you follow the law 
strictly, you're a Barbarian. 

659
00:39:49,500 --> 00:39:53,200
So from this notion that all you
need to do is to follow Jewish 

660
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:55,700
law. 
Look is very untell Munich in 

661
00:39:55,700 --> 00:39:57,700
that sense. 
It's a very, it's a kind of 

662
00:39:58,100 --> 00:40:01,600
false. 
And I think very harmful, modern

663
00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:05,400
notion that many traditional 
excuse me. 

664
00:40:05,700 --> 00:40:08,900
So first. 
And so, to answer a question, 

665
00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:14,200
you know, I think what you see 
in the instance, of returning 

666
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:17,800
lost objects and what you see in
the instance of saving the life 

667
00:40:17,800 --> 00:40:21,200
of Gentile, on Shabbat, because 
of the life of the Gentile, not 

668
00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:25,900
for your kind of Pragmatic 
reasons, no matter what you see,

669
00:40:25,900 --> 00:40:30,900
there is an attempt to influence
that our Notions of equality, 

670
00:40:31,200 --> 00:40:34,500
our Notions of the value of 
human life, selim are looking 

671
00:40:34,700 --> 00:40:39,500
for have influence the way, we 
interpret Jewish law and Jewish 

672
00:40:39,500 --> 00:40:43,500
tradition. 
Here's another example. 

673
00:40:43,500 --> 00:40:46,900
Famous example, bad actually has
a lot of contemporary 

674
00:40:46,900 --> 00:40:52,400
application. 
According to the Torah, we're 

675
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:57,500
supposed to exterminate them 
commit genocide against a 

676
00:40:57,500 --> 00:41:02,500
Mullick amalekite, people, and 
all the Canaanite mentions mean,

677
00:41:02,500 --> 00:41:06,000
it's very is the Torah says with
regard to the canine, you should

678
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:07,900
look to how you are going to 
show emotion. 

679
00:41:07,900 --> 00:41:11,800
Let any any life, you know, 
remain. 

680
00:41:12,300 --> 00:41:14,500
We shouldn't allow any life 
through me. 

681
00:41:14,700 --> 00:41:18,400
And so, it sort of makes a lot 
of sense to us that you Should 

682
00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:24,300
you should kill a know. 
The people who are in the enemy 

683
00:41:24,300 --> 00:41:25,900
Army, who are coming to kill 
you. 

684
00:41:26,100 --> 00:41:28,600
It's Justified to kill in 
self-defense. 

685
00:41:29,100 --> 00:41:33,900
What about women and children 
and 80 year old grandparents, 

686
00:41:33,900 --> 00:41:36,100
you know, according to the Torah
itself, right? 

687
00:41:36,100 --> 00:41:40,400
We have to destroy all of these 
people, that's the strict in. 

688
00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:43,600
But what about the rabbi's were 
very uncomfortable with this 

689
00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:46,900
understood that there's 
something wrong with killing an 

690
00:41:46,900 --> 00:41:50,300
infant whose Harmless engine 
doesn't pose a threat to you. 

691
00:41:50,500 --> 00:41:55,100
We're killing a 90 year old 
grandmother and this is good 

692
00:41:55,100 --> 00:41:58,600
that the this just you can't do 
things like this is unethical, 

693
00:41:58,600 --> 00:42:01,400
it's barbaric to do that, the 
used to momentum. 

694
00:42:01,700 --> 00:42:04,600
So what did the mother says, you
know, how did they solve the 

695
00:42:04,600 --> 00:42:07,000
problem? 
You solved the problem by saying

696
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:11,200
if there's some favorite poses 
Mesopotamia conquer, you know, 

697
00:42:11,200 --> 00:42:14,300
conquered the Middle East. 
He mixed all the people up 

698
00:42:14,500 --> 00:42:16,000
already. 
Intermarried all of the 

699
00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:19,300
conquered people and therefore, 
we Don't know who am I like, is 

700
00:42:19,500 --> 00:42:22,300
you know, who the Canaanite 
nations are and all of these 

701
00:42:22,300 --> 00:42:25,500
things? 
All traces of these people were 

702
00:42:25,500 --> 00:42:27,500
there. 
The yukos, their genealogy has 

703
00:42:27,500 --> 00:42:32,100
been Boston, differ, you never 
ever implement this law of 

704
00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:37,500
genocide of killing. 
Every, every human being even 

705
00:42:37,500 --> 00:42:40,300
the innocent civilians who are 
non combatants. 

706
00:42:41,900 --> 00:42:45,300
And why did they make this move?
I mean, this is a very dramatic 

707
00:42:45,500 --> 00:42:51,300
hermeneutical or interpretive 
Everybody come because they are 

708
00:42:51,300 --> 00:42:55,300
more oh now now. 
Well I live in Jerusalem this is

709
00:42:55,300 --> 00:42:59,100
a very important issue because 
you know, the Israelis, thank 

710
00:42:59,100 --> 00:43:02,300
God, we have an army that 
defends us and sometimes we have

711
00:43:02,300 --> 00:43:05,200
to go to war and sometimes you 
have to kill the enemies. 

712
00:43:05,300 --> 00:43:09,400
Who are we allowed to kill you? 
Are we allowed to intentionally 

713
00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:14,100
kill to Target civilians from? 
Let's say, Gaza because there 

714
00:43:14,100 --> 00:43:16,900
are terrorists and vows of won't
kill us and we have to kill them

715
00:43:16,900 --> 00:43:19,600
before they kill us. 
But what about the grandmothers 

716
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:21,900
in Gaza? 
And what about the infants in 

717
00:43:21,900 --> 00:43:24,300
Gossip? 
Are we allowed you know to fight

718
00:43:24,300 --> 00:43:28,300
these wars the way the Torah 
says Yoshua should point it had 

719
00:43:28,300 --> 00:43:30,400
to happen. 
It was supposed to fight the war

720
00:43:30,700 --> 00:43:33,500
so Robert goren. 
This is great. 

721
00:43:33,500 --> 00:43:38,500
He was the chief Rabbi of the 
Israeli Army and later became 

722
00:43:38,500 --> 00:43:42,100
the chief Rabbi of Cusco, very 
Orthodox, very traditional, very

723
00:43:42,100 --> 00:43:45,900
committed to Jewish people, he 
said, God forbid, that we should

724
00:43:45,900 --> 00:43:50,000
fight the laws today, fight. 
Was today according to the laws 

725
00:43:50,000 --> 00:43:54,200
that were set down in the Tobar 
because it can't those laws were

726
00:43:54,200 --> 00:43:58,300
in different contexts but today 
we can change can only, you 

727
00:43:58,300 --> 00:44:02,300
know, Target or intentionally 
kill people who come to kill us 

728
00:44:02,600 --> 00:44:03,700
forever. 
But we're not allowed to 

729
00:44:03,700 --> 00:44:07,700
intentionally kill people who 
pose no threat to us and this 

730
00:44:07,700 --> 00:44:09,800
was robbed Gorman. 
So, this is an instance, where, 

731
00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:14,900
you know, in the era of human 
rights of the best war Theory, 

732
00:44:14,900 --> 00:44:18,100
though, some notion of just War 
Theory, you know, field, The 

733
00:44:18,100 --> 00:44:23,000
just War theory in modern times 
only emerged after the second 

734
00:44:23,000 --> 00:44:26,000
world war because in the second 
world war, Nazis were killing 

735
00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:31,400
civilian Jews and there were 
tremendous when they would what 

736
00:44:31,500 --> 00:44:34,700
something like 15 million 
civilians were killed in the 

737
00:44:34,700 --> 00:44:37,300
second world war. 
You're talking about people who 

738
00:44:37,300 --> 00:44:39,200
are in the Army were talking 
about civilians right? 

739
00:44:39,200 --> 00:44:48,000
And after the war People are 
nations got together and judges 

740
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:51,300
got together and they said no. 
So now on you're not allowed to 

741
00:44:51,300 --> 00:44:54,200
intentionally kill civilians and
this is the world in which we 

742
00:44:54,200 --> 00:44:56,300
live. 
So what do you do with these old

743
00:44:56,800 --> 00:45:01,700
old laws or of the Torah? 
But look to Hayek ownership mom.

744
00:45:02,100 --> 00:45:07,400
So, today we said, you can't do 
this, but the gemara said it Way

745
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:09,800
Way. 
Back 2,000, not 2,000 years ago,

746
00:45:09,800 --> 00:45:12,900
maybe, 1,500 years ago. 
They said that, you know, we 

747
00:45:12,900 --> 00:45:16,600
don't know the genealogy of 
these people, so all bets are 

748
00:45:16,600 --> 00:45:18,300
off. 
Yes, it's written in the Torah 

749
00:45:18,300 --> 00:45:21,100
but that is room for instead 
classically with dr. 

750
00:45:21,100 --> 00:45:22,500
B. 
Then we should do something like

751
00:45:22,500 --> 00:45:25,200
this. 
Now here you have a development 

752
00:45:25,400 --> 00:45:30,100
of how we lived you with that's 
influenced by our ethics and 

753
00:45:30,100 --> 00:45:32,300
thank God. 
It's influenced by our ethics. 

754
00:45:33,800 --> 00:45:41,800
How would you understand Shoal? 
Because he actually, yeah, it's 

755
00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:42,600
interesting that you brought 
that up. 

756
00:45:42,600 --> 00:45:47,200
As I was about to bring him up, 
he obviously refrains and we 

757
00:45:47,200 --> 00:45:49,700
never really act on this command
of wiping. 

758
00:45:49,700 --> 00:45:52,500
I'm out, like we always failed 
to act on it, meaning even the 

759
00:45:52,500 --> 00:45:53,300
Jews. 
You don't have to go to the 

760
00:45:53,300 --> 00:45:57,500
rabbi's, the Jews themselves 
were kind of hesitant punished, 

761
00:45:57,500 --> 00:46:00,800
right, but by question about 
him, was his kingship. 

762
00:46:00,800 --> 00:46:02,600
Yes. 
But at the same time he from his

763
00:46:02,600 --> 00:46:05,700
perspective, he was giving. 
I mean, she had been, I mean was

764
00:46:05,700 --> 00:46:10,000
almost wiped out in the pale, 
ales give big evil. 

765
00:46:10,100 --> 00:46:13,300
Episode. 
And in a way from his point of 

766
00:46:13,300 --> 00:46:15,200
view, you can understand. 
Like he almost saw the 

767
00:46:15,207 --> 00:46:18,700
destruction of his own tribe and
now he's being commanded to 

768
00:46:18,700 --> 00:46:22,500
destroy another people, right? 
So and and that's a good that's 

769
00:46:22,500 --> 00:46:27,100
a wonderful example, right? 
And by the way, the traditional 

770
00:46:27,100 --> 00:46:29,900
rabbis in the medieval rabbis 
all talk about this case because

771
00:46:30,300 --> 00:46:35,000
the shovel is kind of the Prime 
case in the tower over him being

772
00:46:35,000 --> 00:46:39,500
punished for not killing a god. 
Who's the who's that? 

773
00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:42,900
King, you know, his counterpart.
He, you know, he has murdered. 

774
00:46:42,900 --> 00:46:46,100
He has compassion over. 
I bet he doesn't feel he loses. 

775
00:46:46,100 --> 00:46:51,600
His kingdom was a. 
He's punished because it is so. 

776
00:46:52,600 --> 00:46:57,100
So, it's interesting. 
So, who kills who kills our back

777
00:46:57,100 --> 00:47:01,200
would, after shovel refuses to 
do it, she more. 

778
00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:05,700
All right, before he kills a 
guy, he says, just as you have 

779
00:47:05,700 --> 00:47:09,900
killed you just as you have made
many mothers childless because 

780
00:47:09,900 --> 00:47:11,300
you You killed their children. 
Right? 

781
00:47:11,300 --> 00:47:15,000
I'm gonna kill you and make your
mother gave an ethical reason 

782
00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:16,500
before doing. 
There you go. 

783
00:47:16,500 --> 00:47:18,100
That's right. 
It wasn't because well, you 

784
00:47:18,100 --> 00:47:21,500
know, God said it in some 
arbitrary fashion, right? 

785
00:47:21,500 --> 00:47:25,600
It's because you deserve to die 
deserve to die because you 

786
00:47:25,600 --> 00:47:28,900
killed others and therefore you 
deserve to give it to give it 

787
00:47:28,900 --> 00:47:31,800
context also for our listeners. 
Who may not know what my like 

788
00:47:31,800 --> 00:47:34,800
was. 
I'm a lick were didn't like you 

789
00:47:34,800 --> 00:47:36,700
said they didn't fight with the 
rules of War they would attack 

790
00:47:36,700 --> 00:47:41,900
women children, you know, old 
people People, who are sickly 

791
00:47:42,000 --> 00:47:44,800
from behind, you know, like 
today we would call them 

792
00:47:44,800 --> 00:47:48,600
terrorists, right? 
And happiness is not clear what 

793
00:47:48,600 --> 00:47:50,600
they were doing work. 
There were tears are ruthless 

794
00:47:51,100 --> 00:47:54,500
and, you know, and the juice 
still had a hard time with that,

795
00:47:54,500 --> 00:47:58,000
but I wanted to say something 
else about cheol. 

796
00:47:58,500 --> 00:48:03,800
I think also the reason why he 
loses his kingship is because he

797
00:48:04,100 --> 00:48:05,800
it ends up. 
What happens is, if your 

798
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:11,000
merciful to the merciless, you 
end up becoming it kind of you 

799
00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:15,400
could potentially become that. 
That Carolyn, oh, yeah, yes, 

800
00:48:15,400 --> 00:48:20,200
happens with who later on. 
He he goes and wipes out a whole

801
00:48:20,200 --> 00:48:23,300
city of 440 kohanim, because 
they were protecting David. 

802
00:48:23,600 --> 00:48:27,200
And it's like, oh, you're going 
to save a dog's life who's an 

803
00:48:27,200 --> 00:48:30,600
evil person and you're going to 
wipe out these innocent kohanim.

804
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:34,400
So it's kind of like when he 
loses it, he loses it because 

805
00:48:34,400 --> 00:48:38,800
she wanna be understands this or
he understands work, which in 

806
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:42,000
itself is a kind of Reasoning 
right. 

807
00:48:42,200 --> 00:48:45,200
Again, it's not because well you
have this verse in Deuteronomy. 

808
00:48:45,200 --> 00:48:49,400
That says, you need to do. 
It is a cut that argument. 

809
00:48:49,400 --> 00:48:52,700
Is, you know, if your merciful 
to the cruel will wind up, being

810
00:48:52,700 --> 00:48:55,900
cruel to the merciful for this. 
Those are the Coalinga. 

811
00:48:56,100 --> 00:48:58,300
So, that's a, that's a kind of 
utilitarian argument. 

812
00:48:58,300 --> 00:49:00,700
This is look. 
If you go off on your own, you 

813
00:49:00,700 --> 00:49:02,800
know what you, you're going to 
wind up being a murderer 

814
00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:07,500
yourself, which it, which is a 
moral argument that again, it's 

815
00:49:07,500 --> 00:49:09,900
not a kind of fundamentalist, 
aren't you? 

816
00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:15,400
And again, it's it's motivated 
by this notion said to confess 

817
00:49:15,400 --> 00:49:17,400
it which, you know, to answer 
your question. 

818
00:49:17,400 --> 00:49:21,800
Buzz are the fundamental values 
of Jewish Edwards said, heck, 

819
00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:27,200
meaning Justice and fairness? 
And kind of said, meaning 

820
00:49:27,200 --> 00:49:32,300
treating understanding the pain,
the situation of other human 

821
00:49:32,300 --> 00:49:35,800
beings and not treating other 
human beings objects, you know, 

822
00:49:35,800 --> 00:49:39,400
it's interesting in parshat 
mishpatim which I read 

823
00:49:39,400 --> 00:49:41,700
yesterday. 
Read against well, it's Sunday 

824
00:49:41,700 --> 00:49:46,500
for you guys to now is that 
there's a verse that says, big 

825
00:49:46,500 --> 00:49:49,300
are those who cannot see should 
not oppress The Stranger. 

826
00:49:49,500 --> 00:49:54,800
We Were Strangers. 
The Antalya doctor nephew Shaggy

827
00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:57,900
rug because you know the 
experience of the gear because 

828
00:49:57,900 --> 00:50:01,300
you were gay, reviewer strangers
in Egypt. 

829
00:50:01,500 --> 00:50:07,500
Now this is actually a very 
beautiful way of illustrating 

830
00:50:07,500 --> 00:50:11,400
what moral reasoning is over 
that way The total really saying

831
00:50:11,400 --> 00:50:15,100
here, it says you of all people 
you understood, you understand 

832
00:50:15,100 --> 00:50:17,700
what it meant. 
You experience being a stranger,

833
00:50:17,700 --> 00:50:21,900
you were vulnerable minority, 
who was defenseless and the 

834
00:50:21,900 --> 00:50:25,600
Egyptians oppress you through 
slavery. 

835
00:50:25,700 --> 00:50:29,800
So you understand how bad it is 
to be oppressed and therefore 

836
00:50:30,300 --> 00:50:35,100
you have when you are the 
majority opinion in society and 

837
00:50:35,100 --> 00:50:39,200
you have a vulnerable minority 
of day reading strangers of 

838
00:50:39,200 --> 00:50:42,900
nonhumans You understand, you 
have to put yourself in their 

839
00:50:42,900 --> 00:50:45,600
place. 
That's beyond hop delivery of 

840
00:50:45,607 --> 00:50:47,800
her to come over. 
You have to put yourself in 

841
00:50:47,800 --> 00:50:51,100
their place, you have to 
understand their experience and 

842
00:50:51,100 --> 00:50:54,700
their pain, and you should 
understand their pain because 

843
00:50:54,700 --> 00:50:58,200
you, you experience that pain 
when you were slaves in Egypt. 

844
00:50:58,300 --> 00:51:01,100
So, this is a form of moral 
reasoning, philosophers. 

845
00:51:01,100 --> 00:51:04,600
Call it moral imagination. 
You have to imagine yourself in 

846
00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:09,900
the place of the other and 
behave toward them as if you. 

847
00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:11,700
Would want them to behave 
towards you. 

848
00:51:11,700 --> 00:51:14,300
That's the principle of the 
Kiba, that's the principle of 

849
00:51:14,300 --> 00:51:15,600
deadly. 
Oh, you know, this is a 

850
00:51:15,600 --> 00:51:18,800
principle of Justice. 
Now, interestingly, rep, I 

851
00:51:18,800 --> 00:51:24,900
seldom, Venture when he was used
to give classes on Saturday 

852
00:51:24,900 --> 00:51:27,500
night in Brookline, 
Massachusetts and used to give 

853
00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:37,700
lectures on Marcia to Shibuya. 
So in the Book of Genesis, God 

854
00:51:37,700 --> 00:51:44,500
tells Abraham and In the future,
your people, you know, will be 

855
00:51:46,000 --> 00:51:49,700
oppressed and subjected by other
people and he's looking that 

856
00:51:49,700 --> 00:51:52,800
slavery in Egypt. 
So Rabbi some vintage is why did

857
00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:56,000
the Jews have to go through the 
experience of slavery in Egypt? 

858
00:51:56,600 --> 00:51:58,400
They weren't they didn't send it
that point. 

859
00:51:58,400 --> 00:52:00,400
They didn't say it was kind of 
miss. 

860
00:52:00,600 --> 00:52:03,400
It was determined that they had 
to go through this slave 

861
00:52:03,400 --> 00:52:07,100
experience. 
Why ceramic something she says, 

862
00:52:07,700 --> 00:52:09,900
they had to experience the pain 
of being slaves. 

863
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:13,800
Waves to make them a 
compassionate people, make them 

864
00:52:13,800 --> 00:52:17,100
immoral people, so they wouldn't
do the same thing to other to 

865
00:52:17,100 --> 00:52:20,200
others, right? 
So that's again, this kind of 

866
00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:26,400
moral view of Jewish life of 
Torah life that we had to endure

867
00:52:26,400 --> 00:52:29,700
slavery to teach us that we 
can't behave. 

868
00:52:29,700 --> 00:52:34,200
Similarly, to other people. 
And this is the been extended. 

869
00:52:34,500 --> 00:52:38,700
And I think Roberts Elevate, 
chicks interpretation is very 

870
00:52:38,700 --> 00:52:42,200
valid because of the The verse 
that we just read yesterday that

871
00:52:42,200 --> 00:52:44,800
you shouldn't have pressed, the 
drain is a stranger because we 

872
00:52:44,800 --> 00:52:48,600
ourselves Were Strangers or 
slaves in heat, right? 

873
00:52:48,600 --> 00:52:57,800
That it's a beautiful way of 
moralizing or using moral values

874
00:52:57,800 --> 00:53:01,600
of aggressive, and Rock'em news,
you know, to diner Behavior as 

875
00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:07,400
religious Jews, or in-store just
as ethical views, It's a clear 

876
00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:12,200
usage of moral reasoning in 
relation to one of The 

877
00:53:12,200 --> 00:53:16,800
Commandments, which is actually 
why I can't understand what I 

878
00:53:16,808 --> 00:53:19,400
was saying. 
Go back to earlier when I said 

879
00:53:19,400 --> 00:53:23,200
that there was multiple times, I
heard where, you know, rabbis 

880
00:53:23,200 --> 00:53:25,300
would say oh Robbie would say 
like, you know that the highest 

881
00:53:25,300 --> 00:53:28,700
level of Mitzvah would be to do 
it because God said it and not 

882
00:53:28,700 --> 00:53:30,600
even because of the ethical 
reason attached. 

883
00:53:30,600 --> 00:53:35,000
But here you have like you 
mentioned in the text in the 

884
00:53:35,000 --> 00:53:38,400
Torah itself. 
Clear defined moral reasoning, 

885
00:53:39,500 --> 00:53:43,200
literally being attached to the 
commandant so it doesn't get any

886
00:53:43,200 --> 00:53:47,500
clearer than that. 
And yes, Marcia is really one 

887
00:53:47,500 --> 00:53:54,400
huge, you know. 
The whole Parsha is basically a 

888
00:53:54,400 --> 00:53:57,800
tutorial in moral reasoning. 
I was going through this partial

889
00:53:57,800 --> 00:54:00,500
with my daughter. 
My daughter is really, really 

890
00:54:00,500 --> 00:54:02,600
responsive. 
I'm talking about, she's very 

891
00:54:02,600 --> 00:54:05,700
into ethics in general. 
She's she's very connected to 

892
00:54:05,700 --> 00:54:08,700
that concept of Ethics. 
So she really enjoyed this 

893
00:54:08,700 --> 00:54:11,900
partnership because every single
Commandment that we're going, 

894
00:54:11,900 --> 00:54:16,000
almost every single one was so 
clearly related to ethics it's 

895
00:54:16,000 --> 00:54:21,000
undeniable and and it helped her
feel very connected. 

896
00:54:21,200 --> 00:54:23,300
Know what I mean? 
Yes, yes. 

897
00:54:23,700 --> 00:54:27,500
That's true. 
So now that you brought up the 

898
00:54:27,500 --> 00:54:32,500
topic of slavery, I wanted to 
bring up in the Torah. 

899
00:54:32,700 --> 00:54:36,800
It mentions slavery, but 
actually read the finds it in a 

900
00:54:36,800 --> 00:54:38,600
way. 
It's in Israel. 

901
00:54:38,600 --> 00:54:43,100
It's indentured servitude. 
The Torah is really making a 

902
00:54:43,100 --> 00:54:47,000
polemic against, you know, the 
ancient way of doing things in 

903
00:54:47,200 --> 00:54:50,900
the Pagan world. 
How would you describe this too?

904
00:54:51,000 --> 00:54:55,600
To somebody today who will open 
a homage and will read and say, 

905
00:54:55,600 --> 00:54:58,300
oh my gosh, the Torah, how can 
the the tour? 

906
00:54:58,300 --> 00:55:03,400
Condone such an activity, right?
So this is a really good 

907
00:55:03,400 --> 00:55:06,600
questions. 
A really important question and 

908
00:55:06,600 --> 00:55:10,800
exposes a whole host of moral 
issues. 

909
00:55:11,600 --> 00:55:17,200
So it's true that the 
institution first of all, let me

910
00:55:17,200 --> 00:55:20,300
just give you an Insight here. 
You just talked about or 

911
00:55:20,300 --> 00:55:26,700
submission tune of you to read 
yesterday and what is the first 

912
00:55:26,700 --> 00:55:31,100
laws of how Israel should govern
itself after it, leaves the 

913
00:55:31,100 --> 00:55:33,300
Egypt in the slave experience 
and youth group. 

914
00:55:33,300 --> 00:55:36,100
And what kind what laws should 
be used to set up a Jewish 

915
00:55:36,100 --> 00:55:41,100
Society, orator has Society, the
very first laws and parshat 

916
00:55:41,100 --> 00:55:45,000
mishpatim are about slavery, 
right? 

917
00:55:45,000 --> 00:55:51,200
How you What are you hungry 
fashion or reshape this whole 

918
00:55:51,200 --> 00:55:55,900
institution of slavery and it 
humanizes slavery, you know, to 

919
00:55:55,900 --> 00:55:59,700
a great degree if you knock out 
of slaves, to the slave post 

920
00:55:59,700 --> 00:56:03,800
free in all of these. 
So didn't eliminate this whole 

921
00:56:03,800 --> 00:56:07,100
notion of slavery because maybe 
that was impossible in the 

922
00:56:07,100 --> 00:56:12,800
ancient world to try to humanize
or ameliorate the institution of

923
00:56:12,800 --> 00:56:16,000
slavery, protect some certain 
rights of the Synod and later on

924
00:56:16,000 --> 00:56:16,800
in the day. 
Dora. 

925
00:56:16,900 --> 00:56:20,900
But it says that you can't 
enslave somebody forever, a 

926
00:56:20,908 --> 00:56:25,500
slave can only be over servant 
can only be a servant to six 

927
00:56:25,500 --> 00:56:26,900
years. 
In the seventh year, he goes 

928
00:56:26,900 --> 00:56:34,300
free, unlike agents lately. 
I remember seeing films in 

929
00:56:34,300 --> 00:56:39,500
America about what slavery was 
like in the South American Staff

930
00:56:39,900 --> 00:56:43,000
and which the slavery that the 
mastered, the plantation owner 

931
00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:46,200
of the master own the slave you 
can thank you. 

932
00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:50,100
Wanted with the sleep, you could
beat the slave to death, he 

933
00:56:50,100 --> 00:56:52,400
could rape those, the women's 
literature. 

934
00:56:52,400 --> 00:56:55,700
He be separate the families of 
his face, you know, the slave 

935
00:56:55,700 --> 00:56:58,600
was nothing other than a 
property of the nest. 

936
00:56:58,600 --> 00:57:00,800
It was a horrible. 
Horrible Tiffany. 

937
00:57:02,300 --> 00:57:05,800
So, what did power did 2000 
years ago? 

938
00:57:05,900 --> 00:57:13,400
Actually, let's say we couldn't 
eliminate slavery, didn't 

939
00:57:13,400 --> 00:57:15,000
eliminate the threat to human 
eyes. 

940
00:57:16,500 --> 00:57:21,300
Somebody forever, you can abuse 
the slave physically, Salinas 

941
00:57:21,300 --> 00:57:26,300
certain rights, you can't break 
up the slaves family to pay for 

942
00:57:26,300 --> 00:57:31,300
the slave came with family, has 
to it has to leave working with 

943
00:57:31,300 --> 00:57:37,600
his sons employees, unlike 
slavery in the South so the 

944
00:57:37,600 --> 00:57:41,300
Torah kind of gradually tried to
humanize slavery. 

945
00:57:41,300 --> 00:57:45,200
So as you said, it's really more
of indentured servitude than the

946
00:57:45,200 --> 00:57:49,100
in practices. 
However, there's a complication 

947
00:57:49,100 --> 00:57:54,400
here, it's not so, not so easy 
to say that because all of these

948
00:57:55,000 --> 00:57:58,200
limitations on what you can do 
with the select, you couldn't 

949
00:57:58,200 --> 00:58:00,400
work the slave to harder. 
The talmud says you're not 

950
00:58:00,400 --> 00:58:02,800
allowed to work just like you're
not to come this way. 

951
00:58:03,100 --> 00:58:06,500
You know you go you dig up my 
backyard and keep digging until 

952
00:58:06,500 --> 00:58:10,000
when I completely have to say if
they only pick up until this 

953
00:58:10,000 --> 00:58:13,400
point or you only can do it for 
two hours of three hours because

954
00:58:13,400 --> 00:58:16,700
it's cruelty to tell the slave 
to work and not telling When he 

955
00:58:17,300 --> 00:58:21,800
finish, but all of these 
limitations on slavery, only 

956
00:58:21,800 --> 00:58:25,400
apply to a Jewish serving crew, 
jewishly agree. 

957
00:58:25,400 --> 00:58:31,000
They don't apply to a Gentiles. 
So so so Gentile servant or 

958
00:58:31,008 --> 00:58:35,100
slave you couldn't slave forever
in the tote is very clear about 

959
00:58:35,100 --> 00:58:37,100
this. 
So let me just quote, you a 

960
00:58:37,107 --> 00:58:40,700
passage from maimonides to lived
in the 12th century. 

961
00:58:41,000 --> 00:58:47,300
He said yes it's true. 
You can you can mistreat Kanani 

962
00:58:47,500 --> 00:58:51,800
Gentile slave according to the 
strict lawyer allowed to do that

963
00:58:52,200 --> 00:58:59,100
seven even though that's the law
only idolatrous cruel people 

964
00:58:59,100 --> 00:59:01,200
will do that, and you should 
never do that. 

965
00:59:01,800 --> 00:59:04,500
So here again, you have this 
critical passage and it's not in

966
00:59:04,500 --> 00:59:06,900
some Phillips. 
In my mind, these philosophical 

967
00:59:06,900 --> 00:59:10,600
work, it's in maimonides code of
Jewish law in his mission. 

968
00:59:11,300 --> 00:59:16,000
He says, even though the law is 
that you can mistreat You can be

969
00:59:16,000 --> 00:59:19,200
cruel to a gentile slave or 
Penthouse, serving. 

970
00:59:19,500 --> 00:59:22,600
You should not do it. 
God forbid that you do it. 

971
00:59:22,600 --> 00:59:26,600
You have to, you have to treat 
this tent on serving as a human 

972
00:59:26,600 --> 00:59:29,400
being. 
And he quotes Pursuit came from 

973
00:59:29,400 --> 00:59:33,800
from The Book of Job about it, 
that everybody is created in the

974
00:59:33,800 --> 00:59:36,100
image of God. 
And you have to treat people 

975
00:59:36,200 --> 00:59:41,400
with hessen and rocker and and 
only pagans only Pagan Idol. 

976
00:59:41,400 --> 00:59:43,700
Worshippers are cruel to other 
people. 

977
00:59:44,400 --> 00:59:48,900
So the It's one thing, but but 
religious Jews are faithful. 

978
00:59:48,900 --> 00:59:51,000
Jews are good Jews or authentic 
shoes. 

979
00:59:51,100 --> 00:59:53,400
Might have to be compassionate 
to everybody. 

980
00:59:54,700 --> 00:59:58,900
So, so here you have an instance
where the Torah, when this far 

981
00:59:59,300 --> 01:00:02,100
regarding slavery. 
If you need not be cruel to a 

982
01:00:02,107 --> 01:00:03,900
Jewish slave. 
If you can be cruel to the 

983
01:00:03,900 --> 01:00:07,800
Gentiles layer and then rabbinic
Judaism, right? 

984
01:00:07,800 --> 01:00:10,900
When even further it, took it 
further and say, you're not 

985
01:00:10,900 --> 01:00:15,600
allowed to be cruel or you're 
not allowed to mistreat, even No

986
01:00:15,800 --> 01:00:18,000
service. 
So you have any is another 

987
01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:25,000
instance in which, in which 
ethics kind of overrode the 

988
01:00:25,000 --> 01:00:29,500
formal law and when was New 
measure cadmium and, and 

989
01:00:29,600 --> 01:00:33,900
intellect Jews to be ethical and
compassionate and two exercises 

990
01:00:33,900 --> 01:00:38,000
notion of said, toward all human
beings because all human beings 

991
01:00:38,000 --> 01:00:41,600
are created in terms of my 
money's quotes disbursed from 

992
01:00:41,600 --> 01:00:45,000
General. 
And job says, you know, haven't 

993
01:00:45,100 --> 01:00:49,200
I and my Gentile servant where 
we all created in the same room.

994
01:00:49,400 --> 01:00:52,300
In other words, God, created all
of us the same way we're all 

995
01:00:52,300 --> 01:00:54,900
equal, you know? 
And God forbid, that you should 

996
01:00:54,900 --> 01:00:58,800
say that, he and that were lack 
of not to be cruel. 

997
01:00:58,800 --> 01:01:01,700
To Jews were allowed to be cruel
to Jenkins. 

998
01:01:02,100 --> 01:01:05,800
So this is another kind of 
beautiful, ethical formulation 

999
01:01:06,000 --> 01:01:10,000
of how Jude should live a moral 
life in a religious life. 

1000
01:01:10,400 --> 01:01:13,900
Yeah, and again just for you 
know, those who are not 

1001
01:01:13,900 --> 01:01:19,300
understanding fully The context,
the idolaters of the ancient 

1002
01:01:19,300 --> 01:01:22,600
world were sacrificing their 
children to their gods, and 

1003
01:01:22,600 --> 01:01:26,300
that, really, that's the kind 
of, you know, people that they 

1004
01:01:26,300 --> 01:01:28,800
were up against the Jews. 
So they have to keep that in 

1005
01:01:28,800 --> 01:01:30,600
mind when they have to 
everything has to be put into 

1006
01:01:30,600 --> 01:01:33,100
context. 
You can't look at, you know, the

1007
01:01:33,100 --> 01:01:36,300
tour or anything else from the 
past, in it from a 21st century 

1008
01:01:36,300 --> 01:01:39,000
lens, it just doesn't, it's not 
right? 

1009
01:01:39,300 --> 01:01:43,000
Also, I mean, I would say, you 
know, then it's much more 

1010
01:01:43,000 --> 01:01:46,100
contemporary than than The 
ancient world. 

1011
01:01:46,100 --> 01:01:50,400
I mean I cited the case of what 
slavery was like in America to 

1012
01:01:50,400 --> 01:01:53,900
go to when you're 50 years ago a
more Progressive famous book. 

1013
01:01:53,900 --> 01:01:57,100
It was this book in America 
called the help you know. 

1014
01:01:57,100 --> 01:01:58,600
And it was important. 
Yeah. 

1015
01:01:59,000 --> 01:02:01,000
You're right. 
And it showed you that even 

1016
01:02:01,000 --> 01:02:05,300
those there was no longer any 
form of slavery in America in 

1017
01:02:05,300 --> 01:02:07,300
the 1950s. 
I think it took place in the 

1018
01:02:07,300 --> 01:02:10,100
1950s. 
This is that you know how 

1019
01:02:10,300 --> 01:02:13,400
Negroes are blacks were treated 
by white people in the South. 

1020
01:02:13,400 --> 01:02:16,200
It's horrible. 
It's just Terrible, there was no

1021
01:02:16,200 --> 01:02:19,400
form of slavery, but there was 
so much Injustice and cruelty. 

1022
01:02:19,800 --> 01:02:22,900
And, you know, so logical 
breakdown work. 

1023
01:02:23,000 --> 01:02:26,200
It's not just the ancient world.
So, you know, I would say, if 

1024
01:02:26,200 --> 01:02:29,800
you read this book, the helper, 
see the movie became a movie and

1025
01:02:29,800 --> 01:02:33,200
you get real depressed because 
of how people were treating each

1026
01:02:33,200 --> 01:02:36,800
other with just Karma, then read
this passage in maimonides which

1027
01:02:36,800 --> 01:02:40,000
is the 12th century text and 
tells you that, you know, you 

1028
01:02:40,000 --> 01:02:42,800
can't be cruel to anybody who 
all created in the same room. 

1029
01:02:42,800 --> 01:02:47,100
The same way by God. 
And so, and I also discussed 

1030
01:02:47,400 --> 01:02:52,000
that famous passage in 
maimonides in my book, it's so 

1031
01:02:52,000 --> 01:02:55,300
brutal, you know, what happened 
to the black people. 

1032
01:02:55,300 --> 01:02:59,300
And it's, it's what's crazy. 
Is that the cognitive dissonance

1033
01:02:59,300 --> 01:03:02,600
of there were religious 
Christian owners of slaves, and 

1034
01:03:02,600 --> 01:03:05,900
say who were, you know, 
practicing their religion. 

1035
01:03:05,900 --> 01:03:08,200
And then reading these verses 
that all men are created equal, 

1036
01:03:08,200 --> 01:03:10,500
and then, you know, doing what 
they do. 

1037
01:03:10,600 --> 01:03:12,500
So that's crazy. 
Treating them as subhuman. 

1038
01:03:12,500 --> 01:03:15,000
It's really horrible, but I'm 
gonna need is a book. 

1039
01:03:15,200 --> 01:03:17,000
No, dad. 
I don't know if you know, Darryl

1040
01:03:17,000 --> 01:03:19,300
horn, she's a very talented 
heard. 

1041
01:03:19,300 --> 01:03:26,900
The name was Jewish, by the way,
really Rising superstar in 

1042
01:03:26,900 --> 01:03:29,600
America. 
She's listening and she wrote a 

1043
01:03:29,607 --> 01:03:32,400
book called the other night. 
It's about Jews in the South 

1044
01:03:32,400 --> 01:03:36,200
during the Civil War period. 
And she, and there's a scene 

1045
01:03:36,200 --> 01:03:39,700
there in which they're doing the
satyr and I and it's fucking 

1046
01:03:39,700 --> 01:03:45,500
about freedom and these and it's
a wealthy Jews in the South and 

1047
01:03:45,500 --> 01:03:49,500
there mumbling, they're reading 
the hug and down and talking 

1048
01:03:49,500 --> 01:03:52,800
about Freedom, how to Jews 
became free and around them. 

1049
01:03:52,800 --> 01:03:56,400
They have Jewish life, they have
black slaves, you consider their

1050
01:03:56,400 --> 01:03:58,100
that is real cognitive 
dissidence. 

1051
01:03:58,100 --> 01:04:01,600
There's, and they don't even 
realize, you know, that they're 

1052
01:04:01,600 --> 01:04:05,900
enslaving people around them. 
So so we I've decided, you know,

1053
01:04:05,900 --> 01:04:12,500
we have to behave, according to 
what our views are not mouth 

1054
01:04:12,500 --> 01:04:14,200
ideals and then Behavior, 
notably? 

1055
01:04:14,700 --> 01:04:16,800
Yes. 
But it's a very, very 

1056
01:04:16,800 --> 01:04:19,200
contemporary issue. 
I mean unfortunately, 

1057
01:04:19,200 --> 01:04:22,300
discrimination and racial 
inequality, you know, are still 

1058
01:04:22,300 --> 01:04:24,000
with us. 
Of course. 

1059
01:04:24,000 --> 01:04:28,800
And now that we're kind of segue
into a similar topic religious 

1060
01:04:28,800 --> 01:04:33,600
violence, so lucky here at you 
live in Jerusalem. 

1061
01:04:33,800 --> 01:04:36,700
That's kind of like Hot bed in a
way for. 

1062
01:04:37,500 --> 01:04:43,100
You see from lots of jihadists 
or you even see it from Jews and

1063
01:04:43,100 --> 01:04:46,300
non-jews? 
What is your opinion on this? 

1064
01:04:46,300 --> 01:04:50,600
Yeah, so I mean this is really a
Scourge, this is in my 

1065
01:04:50,600 --> 01:04:52,400
neighborhood. 
It's not that uncommon to see 

1066
01:04:52,400 --> 01:04:54,600
that. 
You don't see that in Great Neck

1067
01:04:55,100 --> 01:04:59,600
or in Five Towns or in Peoria, 
Illinois. 

1068
01:04:59,700 --> 01:05:02,800
But you know, we see a lot in 
the Middle East and most of the 

1069
01:05:02,800 --> 01:05:09,700
time we see it from Islam as or 
radical Muslims. 

1070
01:05:10,300 --> 01:05:13,700
But I'm very sad to say that we 
see in amongst Jews here to, 

1071
01:05:14,500 --> 01:05:18,500
and, and particularly say that 
is that sometimes it's religious

1072
01:05:18,500 --> 01:05:23,700
Jews and I was here in Jerusalem
in 1995 but a religious Jew 

1073
01:05:23,700 --> 01:05:26,800
assassinated. 
It's got Corbin for supposedly 

1074
01:05:26,800 --> 01:05:30,900
religious motives, you know 
many, rabbis were counseling to 

1075
01:05:30,900 --> 01:05:38,900
that behaving this way and I 
think In 2000 and maybe 2015, 

1076
01:05:39,100 --> 01:05:43,700
there was a Gatorade in 
Jerusalem and a religious June, 

1077
01:05:43,900 --> 01:05:49,100
you know, kill Shira banki. 
Was there a teenager who was at 

1078
01:05:49,100 --> 01:05:53,800
this parade? 
She was one of The Observers in 

1079
01:05:53,800 --> 01:05:57,700
the parade and he was so 
incensed that about that's 

1080
01:05:57,700 --> 01:05:59,500
escaped. 
Her agent who was sufficiently 

1081
01:05:59,500 --> 01:06:02,900
that he killed, he killed for 
their sensibly, work for 

1082
01:06:02,900 --> 01:06:09,400
religious reasons, and And also 
very recently, some religious 

1083
01:06:09,400 --> 01:06:15,300
Jews firebombed the church in 
the Gully of the this because 

1084
01:06:15,300 --> 01:06:18,000
they felt here again. 
You know this come chickens come

1085
01:06:18,000 --> 01:06:21,800
home to roost because they felt 
that that Christians were 

1086
01:06:21,800 --> 01:06:25,700
idolaters and we're supposed to 
kill a doctor's orders or 

1087
01:06:25,700 --> 01:06:28,600
minimally destroy their places 
of idolatry. 

1088
01:06:28,600 --> 01:06:34,300
So they firebombed this church 
in the Galilee so also religious

1089
01:06:34,300 --> 01:06:37,100
violence. 
This is a real problem today and

1090
01:06:37,100 --> 01:06:39,200
it was a book that was written a
horrible book. 

1091
01:06:39,200 --> 01:06:40,800
Just a horrible. 
Good book to write him. 

1092
01:06:40,800 --> 01:06:44,900
A letter that said, you could 
kill Palestinians innocent 

1093
01:06:44,900 --> 01:06:48,700
Palestinians because after all, 
they have no rights in the land.

1094
01:06:48,700 --> 01:06:51,500
Anyway, only do separates of 
movement and these are written 

1095
01:06:51,500 --> 01:06:57,100
by rabbis, by rabbis. 
Now all of this to me is, is the

1096
01:06:57,100 --> 01:07:00,300
antithesis of what the Torah 
teaches us about send their 

1097
01:07:00,300 --> 01:07:04,400
confession. 
But you find extremists go often

1098
01:07:04,400 --> 01:07:07,900
to Directions religion and so 
every religion has its fair 

1099
01:07:07,900 --> 01:07:10,300
share of really that's crap 
solutely correct. 

1100
01:07:10,300 --> 01:07:14,500
Every religion has it. 
And we were spared, and for many

1101
01:07:14,500 --> 01:07:18,300
years because we were a week 
community that lived in 

1102
01:07:18,300 --> 01:07:21,000
Christian Society and we didn't 
have power. 

1103
01:07:21,000 --> 01:07:22,700
We didn't have, we couldn't own 
gun. 

1104
01:07:22,700 --> 01:07:25,800
So we certainly couldn't go 
around killing Christians 

1105
01:07:26,000 --> 01:07:28,800
because it was politically 
impossible to do silks. 

1106
01:07:29,200 --> 01:07:32,700
This famous passage in a book 
called The Goose to be written 

1107
01:07:32,700 --> 01:07:35,300
by you who the Hologram, which 
is, if it's a He was booked, 

1108
01:07:35,300 --> 01:07:42,200
it's on every every educated 
Jews bookshelf, and it says it's

1109
01:07:42,200 --> 01:07:45,900
a dialogue between this Rabbi. 
And the king of the cars are so 

1110
01:07:45,900 --> 01:07:49,300
it's called the kuzuri. 
And the rabbi is making this 

1111
01:07:49,300 --> 01:07:52,600
case to the king of the 
password, then we're not like 

1112
01:07:52,600 --> 01:07:55,000
the Muslims, and we're not like 
the Christians because we never 

1113
01:07:55,000 --> 01:07:58,600
went on jihadists and we never 
went on crusades to kill people.

1114
01:07:59,400 --> 01:08:02,700
And then the Rabbi says to the, 
they the king of the concert 

1115
01:08:02,700 --> 01:08:04,500
says that the rabbit says you 
haven't, you never had. 

1116
01:08:04,600 --> 01:08:08,400
A chance to never have the 
opportunity to because you asked

1117
01:08:08,400 --> 01:08:13,200
for the real test about whether 
your moral is when you have the 

1118
01:08:13,200 --> 01:08:17,399
power and you don't kill people,
you don't kill innocent people. 

1119
01:08:17,399 --> 01:08:20,600
When you had that's the real 
test and that's where we are in 

1120
01:08:20,600 --> 01:08:22,100
Israel today. 
Lee thank God. 

1121
01:08:22,100 --> 01:08:25,000
We have an army that can defend 
the Jewish people. 

1122
01:08:25,200 --> 01:08:29,100
It's not like the Jews of Europe
in the 40s during the show. 

1123
01:08:29,100 --> 01:08:30,000
Robin. 
Thank God. 

1124
01:08:30,000 --> 01:08:34,100
We have an army that is strong 
and capable within defend us. 

1125
01:08:34,200 --> 01:08:37,800
And People from killing this, 
but we have power and we have 

1126
01:08:37,800 --> 01:08:40,800
guns and we have been the 
majority. 

1127
01:08:40,800 --> 01:08:44,899
So the real test is, when we 
have this power, how do we 

1128
01:08:44,899 --> 01:08:47,899
behave toward the stranger for 
the other? 

1129
01:08:48,500 --> 01:08:52,300
And you find these extremists of
go often University, they kill 

1130
01:08:52,300 --> 01:08:55,399
people who they don't mind, 
sometimes the Jews like it's 

1131
01:08:55,399 --> 01:08:57,700
covered in and Shira banki or 
Scout. 

1132
01:08:57,700 --> 01:09:01,000
And but more often than not, 
they're innocent Palestinians. 

1133
01:09:01,000 --> 01:09:03,600
I'm not talking about 
Palestinian terrorists or Arab 

1134
01:09:03,600 --> 01:09:05,600
terrorists, who come to kill. 
Louis, of course we have to 

1135
01:09:05,600 --> 01:09:08,000
defend ourselves in coming, but 
I'm talking about innocent 

1136
01:09:08,000 --> 01:09:09,500
people. 
There's been incidents. 

1137
01:09:09,500 --> 01:09:11,000
Yeah, yeah. 
So high. 

1138
01:09:11,000 --> 01:09:14,000
So, what's the antidote for this
disease? 

1139
01:09:14,300 --> 01:09:17,700
You know, how can we argue, how 
can we convince people from 

1140
01:09:17,700 --> 01:09:19,600
religious texts and Jewish 
tradition? 

1141
01:09:19,600 --> 01:09:22,500
That this is wrong with this is 
completely unacceptable. 

1142
01:09:23,000 --> 01:09:26,500
So I think the key notion here 
is this notion of Salem are 

1143
01:09:26,500 --> 01:09:29,200
looking that all of us who paid 
in the image of God, what does 

1144
01:09:29,200 --> 01:09:32,500
that mean? 
And by the way, Jews and 

1145
01:09:32,500 --> 01:09:38,700
Gentiles ruined when God creates
This is juice is talking about 

1146
01:09:38,899 --> 01:09:42,399
only only Jews were created in 
the image of God, the gym house.

1147
01:09:42,399 --> 01:09:47,899
I mean that's it. 
That's completely Jewish notion 

1148
01:09:49,200 --> 01:09:51,899
that does not in scripture at 
all anywhere. 

1149
01:09:53,500 --> 01:09:55,000
So everybody has. 
So what does it mean to be 

1150
01:09:55,000 --> 01:09:58,000
created in the image of God? 
It means that each of us each 

1151
01:09:58,000 --> 01:10:03,500
life is Holy and that each of us
is owed respect and dignity and 

1152
01:10:03,500 --> 01:10:05,700
security. 
What we were Cause human rights 

1153
01:10:05,700 --> 01:10:08,000
today, okay? 
So human rights is modern 

1154
01:10:08,000 --> 01:10:09,900
language but that's really 
what's Illinois. 

1155
01:10:09,900 --> 01:10:14,800
Theme is all about the each of 
us our lives our sacred or holy 

1156
01:10:14,900 --> 01:10:17,400
and therefore no one has the 
right to take that like the only

1157
01:10:17,900 --> 01:10:21,300
justification for taking the 
lung is self-defense 

1158
01:10:21,700 --> 01:10:23,400
self-defense. 
You're allowed to kill someone 

1159
01:10:23,400 --> 01:10:25,800
who comes to kill you. 
First heard that you now have to

1160
01:10:25,800 --> 01:10:28,000
kill an innocent person who 
stormed the seems not. 

1161
01:10:28,200 --> 01:10:32,300
So, so we have to teach this 
notion of selling milk, even 

1162
01:10:33,300 --> 01:10:36,800
more and more in the Solution. 
Now, interestingly don't see it 

1163
01:10:36,800 --> 01:10:40,900
that much in a locket literature
or Jewish legal literature. 

1164
01:10:40,900 --> 01:10:47,100
Unfortunately, it's not invoked,
but Lee and legal and Jewish 

1165
01:10:47,100 --> 01:10:50,100
people were very discussion, but
I'll give you a case. 

1166
01:10:50,200 --> 01:10:53,100
Where wasn't both very 
interested in 1917. 

1167
01:10:56,600 --> 01:11:00,500
The only five countries in the 
world that gave women the right 

1168
01:11:00,500 --> 01:11:03,500
to vote. 
And they weren't the ivy league.

1169
01:11:06,100 --> 01:11:09,300
International diplomacy. 
It was a very small countries 

1170
01:11:09,500 --> 01:11:12,100
like Switzerland Russia because 
it had just undergone a 

1171
01:11:12,100 --> 01:11:16,000
revolution Finland, you know, 
sort of a small countries. 

1172
01:11:16,200 --> 01:11:19,200
That was a 1917 and then the 
issue of the right to vote 

1173
01:11:20,100 --> 01:11:23,500
became a huge controversy in 
Europe. 

1174
01:11:24,000 --> 01:11:28,000
Now, in 1917, something very 
critical happened. 

1175
01:11:28,000 --> 01:11:31,900
There was a Balfour Declaration 
which said which England said 

1176
01:11:31,900 --> 01:11:37,500
that they're kind of Jews 
homeland in Palestine. 

1177
01:11:38,200 --> 01:11:40,600
So once you choose understood, 
they were going to have some 

1178
01:11:40,600 --> 01:11:43,100
degree of political 
Independence. 

1179
01:11:43,100 --> 01:11:46,800
They understood they were going 
to need a body to, you know, a 

1180
01:11:46,800 --> 01:11:51,300
government or quasi government 
to determine how what the law 

1181
01:11:51,300 --> 01:11:53,300
should be. 
And then the question came up in

1182
01:11:53,300 --> 01:11:57,600
the religious community should 
women, could women have the vote

1183
01:11:57,900 --> 01:12:00,100
right to vote? 
Should they involve be involved 

1184
01:12:00,100 --> 01:12:03,600
in politics? 
And even could they even be 

1185
01:12:03,600 --> 01:12:06,100
voted into office? 
Has, this is a huge. 

1186
01:12:08,000 --> 01:12:10,900
Question. 
Because in the past, women never

1187
01:12:11,000 --> 01:12:14,000
Jewish women and in Jewish 
victims, never involved in 

1188
01:12:14,000 --> 01:12:15,600
politics. 
If you read the Torah is read 

1189
01:12:15,600 --> 01:12:17,700
the Tanakh. 
Women are never included in the 

1190
01:12:17,700 --> 01:12:19,400
census, right? 
It's only adult. 

1191
01:12:19,400 --> 01:12:22,900
Males were considered and women 
were not except for tube over 

1192
01:12:22,900 --> 01:12:25,700
women whenever leaders of the 
Jewish community. 

1193
01:12:26,200 --> 01:12:30,200
So many of the traditional most 
said women, this is a women 

1194
01:12:30,200 --> 01:12:32,400
should be at home. 
They should not be involved in 

1195
01:12:32,400 --> 01:12:34,600
politics, which is the public 
sphere. 

1196
01:12:35,200 --> 01:12:36,700
And then, who is he? 
L wrote. 

1197
01:12:37,600 --> 01:12:40,400
Who was the chief Rabbi of the 
holds this party to grab a table

1198
01:12:40,400 --> 01:12:43,600
City made an argument and said, 
listen, it's true that women 

1199
01:12:43,600 --> 01:12:45,600
were not in the census isn't 
ruins. 

1200
01:12:45,600 --> 01:12:49,500
Not women were not political 
uses, but aren't women created 

1201
01:12:49,500 --> 01:12:52,200
in the image of God? 
And what does that mean? 

1202
01:12:52,200 --> 01:12:54,700
That means they have the right 
to speak up for their own 

1203
01:12:54,900 --> 01:12:57,000
interests, right? 
And therefore, they have the 

1204
01:12:57,000 --> 01:13:02,300
right to elect representatives, 
who will defend their interests,

1205
01:13:02,500 --> 01:13:05,200
and they even have the right to 
be representatives in the 

1206
01:13:05,200 --> 01:13:07,700
government. 
So for this, Notion of selling, 

1207
01:13:07,700 --> 01:13:11,800
my leukemia, understood the 
implications then women, you 

1208
01:13:11,800 --> 01:13:14,900
know, haven't you have equal 
rights in defending their own, 

1209
01:13:15,200 --> 01:13:18,600
their own interests. 
And this is, this is an 

1210
01:13:18,600 --> 01:13:20,900
expansion of the notion of 
selling the looking. 

1211
01:13:21,100 --> 01:13:23,400
And certainly, if they have the 
right to speak up for their own 

1212
01:13:23,400 --> 01:13:28,900
interest, they have the right to
tell him. 

1213
01:13:28,900 --> 01:13:32,700
LT means that that we have to 
consider all human life. 

1214
01:13:32,700 --> 01:13:38,900
Holy and therefore, we have to 
Avoid that all courses extreme, 

1215
01:13:38,900 --> 01:13:42,100
violent religious violence and 
reduce extremism. 

1216
01:13:42,300 --> 01:13:44,600
As long as we don't teach so 
many theme. 

1217
01:13:44,600 --> 01:13:47,700
I think we'll always have this 
idea of religious violence. 

1218
01:13:48,000 --> 01:13:54,200
What would you say about the 
Harsh punishments in the Torah. 

1219
01:13:55,700 --> 01:14:00,800
I think that some people justify
or create a certain mindset 

1220
01:14:00,800 --> 01:14:04,600
because of the harsh punishments
that they see the tour meets out

1221
01:14:04,600 --> 01:14:08,200
for sometimes what would be 
perceived as you know. 

1222
01:14:10,100 --> 01:14:13,100
Thins that Commandments that 
don't even have moral reasons, 

1223
01:14:13,100 --> 01:14:15,300
or something like that. 
And you'll have a penalty and 

1224
01:14:15,308 --> 01:14:17,700
stuff like that. 
How do you understand that? 

1225
01:14:18,200 --> 01:14:19,400
Right? 
Right. 

1226
01:14:19,500 --> 01:14:22,400
So first of all, understand what
our opponents are. 

1227
01:14:24,100 --> 01:14:26,400
The punishments for crimes of 
her sins. 

1228
01:14:27,100 --> 01:14:30,500
So, they're not step that you 
take toward innocent people. 

1229
01:14:31,100 --> 01:14:34,200
If this problem of religious 
extremism in many ways, is that 

1230
01:14:34,600 --> 01:14:38,400
is that it's not only much 
punishment but it's balanced 

1231
01:14:38,400 --> 01:14:41,700
Recon. 
Innocent people for racial 

1232
01:14:41,700 --> 01:14:43,500
reasons or nationalistic 
reasons. 

1233
01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:46,500
So it's interesting again. 
Here you have a situation with 

1234
01:14:46,500 --> 01:14:48,900
the Torah. 
The written Torah says one thing

1235
01:14:49,200 --> 01:14:55,200
36 crimes for sins in the Torah 
for which His capital punishment

1236
01:14:55,700 --> 01:14:59,400
that the punishment is death. 
So, what did the rabbis do with 

1237
01:14:59,400 --> 01:15:02,200
that? 
So that's you quoted earlier 

1238
01:15:02,200 --> 01:15:04,500
right? 
They very rarely implemented 

1239
01:15:04,500 --> 01:15:09,000
this because they made the legal
procedures of the legal 

1240
01:15:09,700 --> 01:15:14,500
prerequisites for the death 
penalty to be so extreme that it

1241
01:15:14,500 --> 01:15:16,800
was included almost never be 
implemented. 

1242
01:15:16,800 --> 01:15:21,900
So the Torah says, the talmud 
says that a court that executed 

1243
01:15:21,900 --> 01:15:23,700
somebody once in seven years and
years. 

1244
01:15:24,200 --> 01:15:29,000
As a variant of the, the 
leadership of the text that says

1245
01:15:29,000 --> 01:15:32,600
once in 17 years in federal 
court that executed, somebody, 

1246
01:15:32,600 --> 01:15:35,900
once in seven years was 
considered a bloody court and 

1247
01:15:35,900 --> 01:15:38,200
that's not a compliment to the 
court, okay? 

1248
01:15:38,300 --> 01:15:40,800
And then rebbi Akiva came along 
and he said that if it were up 

1249
01:15:40,800 --> 01:15:44,900
to me, we would never do it. 
You know, so yes there's harsh 

1250
01:15:44,900 --> 01:15:48,300
punishments. 
That that the Torah says, should

1251
01:15:48,300 --> 01:15:53,100
be implemented but rabbinic 
Judaism interpreted in a way. 

1252
01:15:54,100 --> 01:15:57,500
To protect human life and not xq
people. 

1253
01:15:57,500 --> 01:16:01,700
Because even to execute a 
criminal, you know, is something

1254
01:16:01,700 --> 01:16:04,900
that is is repugnant in some 
ways. 

1255
01:16:04,900 --> 01:16:06,800
Yes. 
Sometimes we have to do it 

1256
01:16:07,200 --> 01:16:12,200
because to protect Society, but 
don't do it but what if you have

1257
01:16:12,200 --> 01:16:16,400
to do it, understand that it's 
morally repugnant to do it and 

1258
01:16:16,400 --> 01:16:19,400
it's not something you're 
supposed to Israel today is a we

1259
01:16:19,400 --> 01:16:22,500
don't execute people in Israel. 
Don't act cute errors. 

1260
01:16:22,600 --> 01:16:25,900
Terrible terrible people You 
know, who do horrible, horrible 

1261
01:16:25,900 --> 01:16:28,700
things, we don't actually the 
only person who was executing 

1262
01:16:28,700 --> 01:16:33,200
Israel was Adolf, Eichmann, but 
other, but but we don't do it 

1263
01:16:33,200 --> 01:16:37,900
because there's something in in 
Jewish ethics and Jewish values 

1264
01:16:37,900 --> 01:16:40,600
that says, you know, you can't 
take a human life. 

1265
01:16:40,600 --> 01:16:42,900
There's something wrong with it,
okay? 

1266
01:16:42,900 --> 01:16:45,600
You can only do it, an issue of 
self-defense. 

1267
01:16:46,000 --> 01:16:51,500
So again, you know, you can you 
can take the literal list 

1268
01:16:51,500 --> 01:16:56,800
meeting but then you remain, Of 
Judaism very, very frequently 

1269
01:16:57,000 --> 01:17:01,700
try to humanize these texts and 
moralize these texts and 

1270
01:17:01,700 --> 01:17:04,800
Implement Jewish law in a moral 
way. 

1271
01:17:05,000 --> 01:17:09,200
But there are instances where it
Jewish law today. 

1272
01:17:09,500 --> 01:17:14,200
You know, Falls below with our 
conception of Ethics is with 

1273
01:17:14,200 --> 01:17:19,900
respect to women, with respect 
to Gentiles and that's the kind 

1274
01:17:19,900 --> 01:17:23,600
of ongoing development of Jewish
law or 10.we in the face. 

1275
01:17:23,800 --> 01:17:26,700
All way in a way that's 
consistent with Jewish law 

1276
01:17:27,600 --> 01:17:32,600
somehow bring this notion of 
equality and compassion, you 

1277
01:17:32,600 --> 01:17:37,700
know, into new areas and apply 
it to women and to Gentiles into

1278
01:17:38,000 --> 01:17:41,800
same-sex Jews or same sex 
people, you know, that that's 

1279
01:17:41,800 --> 01:17:44,000
the ongoing development of 
Jewish law. 

1280
01:17:44,000 --> 01:17:47,900
Anything about douche ethics. 
And also juice or and just as 

1281
01:17:48,300 --> 01:17:52,300
modern Rabbi said, well, you 
know, we can say Gentiles on the

1282
01:17:52,300 --> 01:17:53,600
Sabbath because of the 
intrinsic. 

1283
01:17:53,700 --> 01:17:57,700
Zeke value of the like magenta. 
That's a relatively new 

1284
01:17:57,700 --> 01:18:01,000
development, but it's authentic.
And it's traditional, it's 

1285
01:18:01,000 --> 01:18:03,900
authentic and it's legitimate, 
you know, can we do the same 

1286
01:18:03,900 --> 01:18:07,000
thing to women, the whole issue 
of Authority for women and equal

1287
01:18:07,000 --> 01:18:10,100
status of women is a huge, huge 
issue today that we have to 

1288
01:18:10,100 --> 01:18:13,100
Grapple with and if we and a 
traditional Jews don't grapple 

1289
01:18:13,100 --> 01:18:17,900
with it, you know, Judaism will 
just seem more Antiquated in a 

1290
01:18:17,907 --> 01:18:23,100
relative and immoral and God 
forbid that that we see the 

1291
01:18:23,100 --> 01:18:28,100
Torah. 
As as less moral than the 

1292
01:18:28,100 --> 01:18:31,700
standards that the moral 
standards of the Gentile world, 

1293
01:18:31,700 --> 01:18:35,900
where the secular world, and I'm
going program of Jewish ethics, 

1294
01:18:35,900 --> 01:18:37,300
and I cannot believe we can do 
it. 

1295
01:18:37,300 --> 01:18:42,200
That ultimately, you know, good 
what God wants of us is to be to

1296
01:18:42,200 --> 01:18:45,300
do the good meseta, he sharbat 
of to do the good to do, what is

1297
01:18:45,300 --> 01:18:48,900
good to do, it is right to do, 
it is just to do what is 

1298
01:18:49,200 --> 01:18:53,200
compassionate, you know, and we 
have to move in these directions

1299
01:18:53,200 --> 01:18:56,600
and that's Is the ongoing 
project of through sanitation? 

1300
01:18:56,600 --> 01:19:00,600
The development of Ava. 
So I actually want to touch on 

1301
01:19:00,600 --> 01:19:06,400
something related in the ancient
Judaism that we had the Torah 

1302
01:19:06,400 --> 01:19:09,700
that existed there. 
There's this idea that it was a 

1303
01:19:09,708 --> 01:19:14,900
constitution and it became a 
religion out of necessity host 

1304
01:19:14,900 --> 01:19:16,400
Exile. 
But really it was a constitution

1305
01:19:16,400 --> 01:19:19,500
for the people who lived in the 
land of that time and these are 

1306
01:19:19,500 --> 01:19:22,100
the laws that they live by. 
They had to adhere to these laws

1307
01:19:22,500 --> 01:19:26,000
but now As youth, who returned 
to the land of Israel in a 

1308
01:19:26,008 --> 01:19:31,700
secular Israel, don't have a 
constitution that would or even 

1309
01:19:31,800 --> 01:19:34,600
like America has the 
Constitution which is somewhat 

1310
01:19:34,700 --> 01:19:37,600
based on the Torah. 
Israel doesn't seem to have 

1311
01:19:37,600 --> 01:19:41,000
something like that in place. 
Is there something that actually

1312
01:19:41,000 --> 01:19:44,200
could be done to kind of solve 
this issue? 

1313
01:19:44,700 --> 01:19:47,700
Or is it there right now? 
I don't think it's run things. 

1314
01:19:47,700 --> 01:19:51,000
Very, very current actually been
you know this is huge 

1315
01:19:51,000 --> 01:19:53,500
controversy going on. 
Now is show day. 

1316
01:19:53,700 --> 01:19:57,100
Demonstrations That official 
reform, it's called judicial 

1317
01:19:57,100 --> 01:20:01,100
reform to what extent, you know,
should judges be able to cancel 

1318
01:20:01,100 --> 01:20:03,000
laws that were made by the 
knesset there? 

1319
01:20:03,100 --> 01:20:05,900
Even though Israel doesn't have 
a constitution as a certain very

1320
01:20:05,900 --> 01:20:08,500
kind of mini constitution of 
school basically us. 

1321
01:20:10,000 --> 01:20:13,000
And so part of the judicial 
reform is to say that when the 

1322
01:20:13,000 --> 01:20:16,200
politicians can cancel with the 
judges, say, you know, the law 

1323
01:20:16,200 --> 01:20:20,800
may be one thing, but if the 
knesset passes new law, you 

1324
01:20:20,808 --> 01:20:23,600
know, that violates the 
fundamental basic rules. 

1325
01:20:24,400 --> 01:20:28,000
And then the courts can can 
intervene in any way. 

1326
01:20:28,700 --> 01:20:31,900
So, there's an interesting part 
of the, the part of the tower 

1327
01:20:31,900 --> 01:20:33,900
that deals with, this is really 
safe environment. 

1328
01:20:33,900 --> 01:20:36,700
The book of Deuteronomy America,
but about a king. 

1329
01:20:36,900 --> 01:20:39,900
You should appoint a king, but 
there's a side. 

1330
01:20:39,900 --> 01:20:44,200
There's a requirement for it. 
Being the Savior Towers supposed

1331
01:20:44,200 --> 01:20:46,600
to go with the King, where the 
king nor should be the concert, 

1332
01:20:46,600 --> 01:20:48,300
you're supposed to write us a 
photographer. 

1333
01:20:49,600 --> 01:20:53,000
What's that all about is that 
just kind of ancient, you know, 

1334
01:20:53,100 --> 01:20:55,400
ritual that that has no meaning 
for us today. 

1335
01:20:55,400 --> 01:20:58,400
I don't think so. 
What that means is that the King

1336
01:20:59,100 --> 01:21:03,500
Hamlet, who's the politician of 
his day, he runs the politics 

1337
01:21:03,500 --> 01:21:07,300
of, you know. 
He has to have a secret Aura 

1338
01:21:07,300 --> 01:21:10,000
around him. 
A little time to remind him that

1339
01:21:10,000 --> 01:21:14,100
he's subject to the law, right? 
That he is not the ultimate 

1340
01:21:14,100 --> 01:21:18,300
Arbiter, he is subject to the 
commish pot in the laws of the 

1341
01:21:18,300 --> 01:21:21,700
Torah. 
Now you can make an analogy 

1342
01:21:21,700 --> 01:21:23,800
today to what's going on in 
here. 

1343
01:21:23,900 --> 01:21:27,600
You know, some of this judicial 
reform is to say well you know, 

1344
01:21:27,600 --> 01:21:30,300
the government can decide 
anything it wants and you have 

1345
01:21:30,300 --> 01:21:34,000
the judges, the Supreme Court 
and they really have no say 

1346
01:21:34,000 --> 01:21:38,100
because they may say that that 
you know what what what the 

1347
01:21:38,100 --> 01:21:41,400
government the prime minister 
and it's not just this prime 

1348
01:21:41,400 --> 01:21:44,200
minister, it's any prime 
minister, it's the executive 

1349
01:21:44,200 --> 01:21:48,500
branch of the Israeli government
that they can override the law. 

1350
01:21:48,500 --> 01:21:53,500
The law is the law and that they
have to in a certain sense. 

1351
01:21:53,900 --> 01:21:57,900
For Cle carried around to say, 
for Tower with them, hey, can 

1352
01:21:57,900 --> 01:22:00,900
override the law. 
So if the judges in the Supreme 

1353
01:22:00,900 --> 01:22:03,800
Court say no, this is illegal, 
or this is against the basic 

1354
01:22:03,800 --> 01:22:09,200
law, then then the judges should
carry the day, not the 

1355
01:22:09,200 --> 01:22:12,500
politicians and that's the big 
debate that's going on in 

1356
01:22:12,500 --> 01:22:14,700
Israel. 
Today, should the politicians be

1357
01:22:14,700 --> 01:22:18,300
able to do whatever they want 
without the constraints of law 

1358
01:22:18,900 --> 01:22:24,400
without the protection of 
individual rights, or Will the 

1359
01:22:24,400 --> 01:22:28,900
law override the politicians. 
So I think the tower has 

1360
01:22:28,900 --> 01:22:32,600
something to say about this. 
That's exactly why we can always

1361
01:22:32,600 --> 01:22:35,700
has to have a safe encoder 
American because he also has a 

1362
01:22:36,000 --> 01:22:39,400
business famous statement by the
French King of one of the 

1363
01:22:39,400 --> 01:22:41,000
Louise. 
I'm not sure what, he's just 

1364
01:22:41,300 --> 01:22:43,200
l'état C'est Moi, right? 
In the eye. 

1365
01:22:43,300 --> 01:22:49,200
I am a mistake, right? 
The king does the Louis are 

1366
01:22:49,200 --> 01:22:52,400
whatever I say they are and 
tutors is, no, that's not the 

1367
01:22:52,400 --> 01:22:54,000
case. 
There's certain things you Did 

1368
01:22:54,000 --> 01:22:56,700
not do no matter how much power 
you have. 

1369
01:22:56,800 --> 01:23:01,300
And, and the Torah in the sacred
Department, says the king can 

1370
01:23:01,300 --> 01:23:03,500
accumulate too many horses, 
right? 

1371
01:23:03,500 --> 01:23:06,300
Which means you can't have such 
a great arm. 

1372
01:23:06,300 --> 01:23:08,600
You have to be limited in your 
political power. 

1373
01:23:08,800 --> 01:23:13,400
You can have too much. 
Well, in other words, the game 

1374
01:23:13,500 --> 01:23:17,200
is always constrained and what 
he can do. 

1375
01:23:17,400 --> 01:23:20,900
You can't your syrup the power 
don't fall in the priesthood, 

1376
01:23:20,900 --> 01:23:22,200
right? 
And the priest can't become 

1377
01:23:22,200 --> 01:23:23,700
Kings and all these things are 
here. 

1378
01:23:24,000 --> 01:23:26,600
There's about there's a checks 
and balance system, where the, 

1379
01:23:26,600 --> 01:23:31,200
three tiers of leadership cannot
usurp one another. 

1380
01:23:31,200 --> 01:23:34,100
And, you know, do you have the 
prophets who are kind of in 

1381
01:23:34,100 --> 01:23:37,800
between the people and the 
leaders who they're kind of? 

1382
01:23:37,800 --> 01:23:40,400
Like, in a way they serve as the
meteor with the media should be 

1383
01:23:40,500 --> 01:23:43,000
in a way, where is there? 
Keeping everyone in check making

1384
01:23:43,000 --> 01:23:46,300
sure that people a moral falling
out. 

1385
01:24:10,800 --> 01:24:22,600
It would be great, but we have 
to protect the independence of 

1386
01:24:22,600 --> 01:24:26,100
the Judiciary. 
Design of democracy. 

1387
01:24:26,100 --> 01:24:30,300
That's the design of sign of the
free society, and we have to 

1388
01:24:30,308 --> 01:24:34,000
have a system of checks and 
balances, we can get allow any 

1389
01:24:34,100 --> 01:24:40,000
branch of government to rule 
without certain limitations. 

1390
01:24:40,400 --> 01:24:42,700
That's true. 
And that's, that's a huge issue 

1391
01:24:42,700 --> 01:24:49,000
today, but I think those advice 
that no matter how much power he

1392
01:24:49,000 --> 01:24:51,700
has, you know, has to have a 
sacred toe around him. 

1393
01:24:51,700 --> 01:24:53,500
He need to has to be subject to 
the law. 

1394
01:24:54,800 --> 01:24:58,300
How you do in modern times is a 
difficult issue, that's it. 

1395
01:24:58,300 --> 01:25:00,500
It's in Israel's the new 
country. 

1396
01:25:00,500 --> 01:25:05,000
It's a, their learning, you 
know, they were socialists 20 

1397
01:25:05,000 --> 01:25:07,600
years ago. 
Now it's capitalist country 

1398
01:25:08,200 --> 01:25:11,400
things change and we're going to
learn from our mistakes. 

1399
01:25:11,400 --> 01:25:15,200
And, you know, it's a very young
Asian, but frankly I think it's 

1400
01:25:15,400 --> 01:25:19,400
overall, you know, positive 
development in human history 

1401
01:25:19,400 --> 01:25:22,400
because arguably you could say 
that Israel today is the 

1402
01:25:22,400 --> 01:25:25,300
greatest version. 
Israel that ever existed. 

1403
01:25:26,200 --> 01:25:31,300
So in terms of success and I 
actually want to get back to a 

1404
01:25:31,300 --> 01:25:34,600
topic that we because I don't 
want to lose track of what we 

1405
01:25:34,600 --> 01:25:36,800
mentioned before, which is 
women's rights. 

1406
01:25:37,000 --> 01:25:41,200
Today, we find that even in the 
21st century, there's a lot of 

1407
01:25:41,500 --> 01:25:44,000
you know, women who are chained,
right? 

1408
01:25:44,000 --> 01:25:49,500
The uh Guna crisis. 
It seems like a very Arcane kind

1409
01:25:49,500 --> 01:25:53,500
of law. 
What do you make of this whole 

1410
01:25:53,800 --> 01:25:57,600
Isis today. 
Yeah, well I think well first of

1411
01:25:57,608 --> 01:26:04,400
all just to some background yet 
but the crisis is caused by the 

1412
01:26:04,500 --> 01:26:08,800
stipulation in Jewish law that 
the only way a woman can obtain 

1413
01:26:08,800 --> 01:26:13,300
a bill of divorce again, as if 
her husband makes it to her. 

1414
01:26:13,800 --> 01:26:18,400
So her husband has that's the 
full power over. 

1415
01:26:18,400 --> 01:26:20,400
Whether the woman is divorced or
not divorce. 

1416
01:26:20,400 --> 01:26:23,700
It's not an equal Pacifico 
relationship here. 

1417
01:26:25,100 --> 01:26:28,100
Because sometimes you have 
husbands who sometimes the 

1418
01:26:28,100 --> 01:26:31,900
voices are or predictive 
submitters a very bitter and the

1419
01:26:31,900 --> 01:26:35,200
parties don't want to be 
sympathetic to the other party. 

1420
01:26:35,200 --> 01:26:37,500
This is a lot of acrimony and 
hatred. 

1421
01:26:37,600 --> 01:26:40,800
So you have situations where 
husband very cruelly you know. 

1422
01:26:40,800 --> 01:26:46,200
Deny a woman a divorce and in 
Jewish War I the husband refuses

1423
01:26:46,200 --> 01:26:49,300
is relying on like they can be 
done at least that's the basic 

1424
01:26:49,300 --> 01:26:53,700
World they were rabbinic 
enactments that try to constrain

1425
01:26:53,800 --> 01:26:56,500
Ain't a husband, but they're not
employed today. 

1426
01:26:56,500 --> 01:27:00,900
So, as a result, you have made 
many women who are suffering, 

1427
01:27:02,300 --> 01:27:05,300
not get divorced, because their 
husband refuses to divorce them,

1428
01:27:06,400 --> 01:27:09,900
and they live a life of 
loneliness and suffering and its

1429
01:27:09,900 --> 01:27:12,300
really cruelty. 
It's that it's real cool to you 

1430
01:27:12,300 --> 01:27:15,600
and miss it. 
This is a legal problem and it's

1431
01:27:15,600 --> 01:27:20,600
an insufferable more crumb and 
it was against the grain of this

1432
01:27:20,600 --> 01:27:23,700
notion of equality. 
Because there is no equality in 

1433
01:27:23,900 --> 01:27:27,400
Terms of of the power to divorce
her to be divorced. 

1434
01:27:28,600 --> 01:27:30,400
So it's a very, very big 
problem. 

1435
01:27:30,400 --> 01:27:33,900
I personally feel that that 
Jewish law will never have the 

1436
01:27:33,900 --> 01:27:35,900
moral High Ground that it was 
with. 

1437
01:27:35,900 --> 01:27:37,800
You. 
Never say that Jewish law is 

1438
01:27:37,800 --> 01:27:44,200
morally Superior and manifests 
the highest ideals of ethics and

1439
01:27:44,200 --> 01:27:47,400
morality. 
And so we solve this problem and

1440
01:27:47,400 --> 01:27:51,200
it's the same sudden, it's been 
ameliorated to some degree by 

1441
01:27:51,200 --> 01:27:53,400
this notion of a prenuptial 
agreement. 

1442
01:27:53,800 --> 01:27:57,100
Just before the marriage, you 
know met him signing agreement, 

1443
01:27:57,100 --> 01:28:00,900
that's legally binding, that's 
electrically binding that in the

1444
01:28:00,900 --> 01:28:05,200
instance, let's say where the 
marriage is irretrievably, land 

1445
01:28:05,200 --> 01:28:09,100
that the parties have separated 
for certain amount of times that

1446
01:28:09,100 --> 01:28:13,100
the husband has to pay x amount 
of money and that is very 

1447
01:28:13,100 --> 01:28:15,800
onerous and inevitably an 
incentive. 

1448
01:28:15,800 --> 01:28:18,600
But I was going to give the 
wiping divorce, but these are 

1449
01:28:18,600 --> 01:28:22,500
kind of workaround so to speak. 
Do you really have to solve this

1450
01:28:22,500 --> 01:28:24,700
problem? 
It's a very, very deep problem 

1451
01:28:25,100 --> 01:28:27,600
of any court and it's not a 
theoretical problem, you know, 

1452
01:28:27,600 --> 01:28:31,400
it's not a severe. 
I'm like a mulling because we 

1453
01:28:31,400 --> 01:28:32,800
don't know we're more like it is
today. 

1454
01:28:32,800 --> 01:28:35,200
So, you know, we can live with 
the idea that you should kill 

1455
01:28:35,200 --> 01:28:37,900
him only because because we 
never actually do it here. 

1456
01:28:37,900 --> 01:28:42,200
This is a real human problem 
with the human suffering and 

1457
01:28:42,200 --> 01:28:46,300
Injustice that takes place each,
and every day, particularly in 

1458
01:28:46,300 --> 01:28:51,500
Israel and also in America We 
have to stop this problem. 

1459
01:28:51,500 --> 01:28:52,600
How we do it? 
We don't know. 

1460
01:28:52,600 --> 01:28:56,700
But there are prolific remedies 
that tragedy is that much of the

1461
01:28:56,708 --> 01:29:02,300
rabbinic establishment is not 
want to employ these these 

1462
01:29:02,300 --> 01:29:06,900
collected remedies. 
I mean, the Meritor and medieval

1463
01:29:06,900 --> 01:29:09,600
commentaries talked about this 
notion that their advice can 

1464
01:29:09,800 --> 01:29:13,600
basically a known the marriage. 
If you can situation with her 

1465
01:29:13,600 --> 01:29:16,900
husband, refuses, the divorce, 
the ram has a mechanism of 

1466
01:29:16,900 --> 01:29:19,000
annulling the marriage and say 
no, the woman doesn't need a 

1467
01:29:19,008 --> 01:29:22,900
divorce because They were really
never married, but the rabbi's 

1468
01:29:22,900 --> 01:29:27,500
are not doing this today, 
because because of a reluctance 

1469
01:29:27,500 --> 01:29:31,700
to liberalize service deeper to 
get women, hold equality. 

1470
01:29:31,700 --> 01:29:34,800
And to take the power out of the
hands of the husband, you know, 

1471
01:29:34,800 --> 01:29:38,100
and kind of balance out the 
powers. 

1472
01:29:39,000 --> 01:29:41,800
This is a tragedy. 
And I think this is a, this is 

1473
01:29:41,800 --> 01:29:47,500
also part of the issue of how do
we kind of re-appropriate or 

1474
01:29:47,500 --> 01:29:54,800
read Understand this notion of 
equality between the Sexes. 

1475
01:29:54,800 --> 01:29:58,300
You can't get around the fact 
that that traditional Judaism 

1476
01:29:58,800 --> 01:30:03,100
gives men more power than women 
issue. 

1477
01:30:03,100 --> 01:30:04,900
I mean, there's a big issue 
today about Dino. 

1478
01:30:04,900 --> 01:30:07,600
Can women, hold religious 
Authority, can women be 

1479
01:30:07,600 --> 01:30:11,300
realized? 
So the home existence of the 

1480
01:30:11,300 --> 01:30:15,700
problem, testifies to the fact 
that women did not have equal 

1481
01:30:15,700 --> 01:30:21,100
power however you want to in Sir
that question about whether 

1482
01:30:21,100 --> 01:30:24,600
women can hold Authority near 
the very fact that there is a 

1483
01:30:24,608 --> 01:30:29,400
question indicates that there's 
an imbalance of power, and it's 

1484
01:30:29,400 --> 01:30:32,500
also true in marriage, lawfully,
married, Martin sto going to 

1485
01:30:32,500 --> 01:30:35,000
problem. 
So how we solved, I don't know, 

1486
01:30:35,000 --> 01:30:38,800
but we must solve it and we must
alleviate the suffering and the 

1487
01:30:38,800 --> 01:30:42,600
loneliness of, I don't know. 
In a woman. 

1488
01:30:42,600 --> 01:30:45,400
No human being should be allowed
to suffer. 

1489
01:30:45,500 --> 01:30:48,900
We can avoid it, and no human 
being, should should be 

1490
01:30:48,900 --> 01:30:51,400
condemned to live. 
Own and are not on married. 

1491
01:30:51,400 --> 01:30:54,300
Life Community Services. 
Little video down below but it 

1492
01:30:54,300 --> 01:30:58,200
was a good for the human being 
to live alone psychologically 

1493
01:30:58,200 --> 01:31:01,500
and spiritually destructive. 
So we have to solve this 

1494
01:31:01,500 --> 01:31:03,800
problem. 
I don't have any silver bullets 

1495
01:31:04,800 --> 01:31:08,400
that can do it, but I am but but
it's an urgent urgent problem 

1496
01:31:08,400 --> 01:31:12,700
that needs great attention. 
Well you're an orthodox Rabbi 

1497
01:31:12,700 --> 01:31:14,200
and you're having a conversation
about it. 

1498
01:31:14,200 --> 01:31:17,500
So in this generation that 
that's the best thing you can do

1499
01:31:17,500 --> 01:31:21,700
to kind of get you know. 
Just have the conversation this?

1500
01:31:22,100 --> 01:31:24,500
Yeah discussing. 
It's all about Judaism is about 

1501
01:31:24,500 --> 01:31:28,500
discussing ideas. 
So before I would say, I would 

1502
01:31:28,500 --> 01:31:32,400
say that, you know, there's one 
fundamental Act of Faith that we

1503
01:31:32,400 --> 01:31:37,100
have to function on and that is 
that ultimately, you know, you 

1504
01:31:37,100 --> 01:31:40,000
can find a solution. 
It's not enough to say well 

1505
01:31:40,000 --> 01:31:42,700
there's no solution here, this 
is just a problem. 

1506
01:31:43,000 --> 01:31:47,200
Ultimately the towers that are 
offensive and in the center and 

1507
01:31:47,200 --> 01:31:49,700
that means that there must be 
some there is a solution. 

1508
01:31:49,900 --> 01:31:53,600
We must find it, you're not 
allowed to be lazy and say, well

1509
01:31:53,600 --> 01:31:55,100
it's just the problem. 
We have to move. 

1510
01:31:56,000 --> 01:31:58,800
Now, that's an immoral position 
as far as I'm concerned. 

1511
01:31:59,200 --> 01:32:04,100
So we will need to do a lot of 
work to find the solution and to

1512
01:32:04,100 --> 01:32:07,000
implement the solution and for 
and for those who are listening.

1513
01:32:07,800 --> 01:32:11,300
Now, the first episode we ever 
go with our Rabbi Rabbi Joshua, 

1514
01:32:11,300 --> 01:32:14,100
my roof, we actually talked 
about the issue of the Iguana 

1515
01:32:14,100 --> 01:32:19,100
crisis and he actually had some 
ideas which are interesting but 

1516
01:32:19,100 --> 01:32:21,600
that's four. 
For you guys to check out and 

1517
01:32:21,600 --> 01:32:23,400
was for the last question, been 
seized, right? 

1518
01:32:23,400 --> 01:32:26,600
So we wanted to ask you about 
the phenomenon of cover-ups, 

1519
01:32:27,100 --> 01:32:31,000
particularly in the religious 
World, your thoughtful. 

1520
01:32:31,100 --> 01:32:33,000
It's how do we, what do we do 
about that? 

1521
01:32:33,600 --> 01:32:36,900
Yeah, there's a cultural like, 
you know, it's kind of like in 

1522
01:32:36,900 --> 01:32:40,300
Mafia culture where you know, 
the rats are not. 

1523
01:32:40,300 --> 01:32:43,900
You're not a rat on each other 
and there's this strange culture

1524
01:32:44,200 --> 01:32:45,700
over there. 
Yes, yes. 

1525
01:32:45,700 --> 01:32:49,600
And by the way, it's, it's not 
confined to the mafia been. 

1526
01:32:50,000 --> 01:32:54,900
Unfortunately, it seeped into 
every institution with power in 

1527
01:32:55,300 --> 01:32:58,900
life. 
I mean, it was obvious cases the

1528
01:32:58,900 --> 01:33:02,900
Catholic Church. 
The Catholic Church covered up 

1529
01:33:02,900 --> 01:33:06,300
the sexual abuse by priests from
very very, very long time. 

1530
01:33:06,300 --> 01:33:09,900
I don't know who the PeopleSoft,
there's a movie called Scott 

1531
01:33:09,900 --> 01:33:14,800
wagon, chili dramatizes, the 
whole whole problem there and 

1532
01:33:14,800 --> 01:33:18,200
the exposure of the problem that
was Michael Keaton had Lisa. 

1533
01:33:18,200 --> 01:33:19,700
And we see we see how 
unexpected. 

1534
01:33:19,800 --> 01:33:23,300
Acceptable and harmful it is in 
others, right? 

1535
01:33:23,300 --> 01:33:25,500
When you see what juicy the 
Catholic Church? 

1536
01:33:25,800 --> 01:33:28,700
Oh, this is a terrible ones and 
we have the same phenomenon, 

1537
01:33:28,700 --> 01:33:31,300
maybe not to the same extent, 
but we have the same compartment

1538
01:33:31,300 --> 01:33:36,700
as well in both Crazy Life in or
even in modern Orthodox, like, 

1539
01:33:36,700 --> 01:33:39,600
you know, protecting the rabbi's
because somehow, if you don't 

1540
01:33:39,600 --> 01:33:42,800
forget the brothers, the system 
will break or the institution 

1541
01:33:42,800 --> 01:33:44,600
will grow. 
So we have a greater Fidelity to

1542
01:33:44,600 --> 01:33:48,900
the institution than 2 then to 
protecting the victims. 

1543
01:33:49,300 --> 01:33:50,300
So we do. 
I have this. 

1544
01:33:50,300 --> 01:33:55,800
I mean unfortunately I think We 
done a good job or at least 

1545
01:33:55,800 --> 01:33:57,700
things are improving and 
cover-ups. 

1546
01:33:57,700 --> 01:34:00,100
Are Woodson less acceptable 
today. 

1547
01:34:02,000 --> 01:34:06,900
I have a daughter who lives in 
Brooklyn and we go shopping in a

1548
01:34:06,900 --> 01:34:09,900
very ultra-orthodox neighborhood
in in. 

1549
01:34:10,300 --> 01:34:14,100
I see posters on buildings in 
this ultra-orthodox neighborhood

1550
01:34:14,100 --> 01:34:16,600
saying, you know, if you've been
sexually abused call the 

1551
01:34:16,600 --> 01:34:21,300
following number, so the net 
community and thank God, it's 

1552
01:34:21,300 --> 01:34:24,900
become more public and more 
acceptable and cover-ups are 

1553
01:34:24,900 --> 01:34:29,100
less acceptable and there's some
of the people but it plays all 

1554
01:34:29,100 --> 01:34:31,300
of us. 
And ultimately it's About kind 

1555
01:34:31,300 --> 01:34:34,500
of a power relation and 
ultimately it's coming down to 

1556
01:34:34,500 --> 01:34:39,300
the fundamental values of Jewish
ethics, which is of that person,

1557
01:34:40,400 --> 01:34:44,500
it's about compassion for people
and people are being abused or 

1558
01:34:44,500 --> 01:34:47,600
people's rights are being 
undermined, you know, Crescent 

1559
01:34:47,600 --> 01:34:50,900
demands that we've come to their
defense, not a defense of the 

1560
01:34:50,900 --> 01:34:54,100
institution but the instant 
offense of the individual who's 

1561
01:34:54,100 --> 01:34:57,500
created in the image of God. 
And it's about said, you know, 

1562
01:34:57,500 --> 01:35:03,600
the victim the victim about 
Sexual abuse is entitled to just

1563
01:35:03,600 --> 01:35:07,100
as much protection just as much 
power as the greatest Rabbi 

1564
01:35:07,400 --> 01:35:10,300
because that's what static is is
fairness and equality. 

1565
01:35:10,800 --> 01:35:17,300
And we have a ways to go to 
realize that that that aren't 

1566
01:35:17,300 --> 01:35:20,300
over ideal. 
We're not there yet but we need 

1567
01:35:20,300 --> 01:35:24,300
to keep moving along line toward
that, I knew and I would just 

1568
01:35:24,300 --> 01:35:28,600
say, you know, as a kind of 
summary of Jewish ethics that is

1569
01:35:28,800 --> 01:35:32,900
that really So all of these 
cases that we talk about in the 

1570
01:35:32,900 --> 01:35:36,100
book, by the way, I talked about
a number of cases in which 

1571
01:35:37,200 --> 01:35:43,700
courts addition life has not 
stepped up to the full ideals of

1572
01:35:43,700 --> 01:35:47,600
ethics of classic and certainly 
put the best. 

1573
01:35:47,900 --> 01:35:50,100
The best course. 
Summary of all of this I found 

1574
01:35:50,100 --> 01:35:53,700
again it's in the Torah. 
It's a verse in me forever in 

1575
01:35:53,700 --> 01:35:56,600
the prophet Micah and he says, 
as follows. 

1576
01:35:57,000 --> 01:35:59,500
It says, God has told you. 
We're going to begin to know 

1577
01:35:59,500 --> 01:36:02,400
what is good. 
Michael Wright and what God 

1578
01:36:02,400 --> 01:36:07,500
demands of us. 
And here's what he says, It's a 

1579
01:36:07,500 --> 01:36:13,700
certain spot to do justice 
certain but I thought you should

1580
01:36:13,700 --> 01:36:17,100
love this and you should you 
should love the compassion for 

1581
01:36:17,100 --> 01:36:19,500
other people. 
That's what it's all about and 

1582
01:36:19,500 --> 01:36:22,300
that's what Jewish law tries to 
do in Jerusalem. 

1583
01:36:22,300 --> 01:36:26,000
And its best person to Jewish 
tradition as best price to do. 

1584
01:36:26,300 --> 01:36:32,600
It's tries to enact Justice and 
fairness and equality and to 

1585
01:36:32,600 --> 01:36:36,200
love and to be compassionate 
toward Understand that's the 

1586
01:36:36,200 --> 01:36:39,400
basis of Jewish and ethics, and 
Lasting ideal toward, which 

1587
01:36:39,500 --> 01:36:43,100
Jewish life should go and God 
forbid that we should see these 

1588
01:36:43,100 --> 01:36:45,500
things as a kind of Gentile 
import. 

1589
01:36:45,500 --> 01:36:47,300
That's got nothing to do with 
traditional. 

1590
01:36:47,300 --> 01:36:51,100
Like this is really the 
foundation for what God wants of

1591
01:36:51,100 --> 01:36:56,500
us is Memphis in, this is what 
God asks of us to use and in are

1592
01:36:56,500 --> 01:37:01,300
challenges to is to behave that 
way and to move toward these 

1593
01:37:01,300 --> 01:37:04,600
moral arguments. 
That's what being Godly is all 

1594
01:37:04,600 --> 01:37:08,000
about. 
Beautiful, really. 

1595
01:37:08,000 --> 01:37:11,400
We want to thank you so much. 
This is an amazing episode 

1596
01:37:11,400 --> 01:37:14,700
because we really never touched 
on the issue of Jewish ethics. 

1597
01:37:14,700 --> 01:37:17,100
And it's such an important 
topic. 

1598
01:37:17,100 --> 01:37:21,200
It's often misunderstood. 
So to all of you, you should 

1599
01:37:21,200 --> 01:37:25,300
really check out Rabbi corns 
book to be a holy people, Jewish

1600
01:37:25,300 --> 01:37:29,800
tradition and ethical values and
we hope to do this again. 

1601
01:37:29,900 --> 01:37:33,200
Hopefully, this is great. 
It's be my honor. 

1602
01:37:33,500 --> 01:37:36,700
I mean, you know, we kind of 
fluid Here you know, we took two

1603
01:37:37,300 --> 01:37:43,400
things without a fully resolving
them without his tail. 

1604
01:37:43,600 --> 01:37:50,000
So we talked about some of these
things and that's why people 

1605
01:37:50,000 --> 01:37:55,200
need to buy the book so they 
just wetting the appetite. 

1606
01:37:55,200 --> 01:38:09,000
Thank you. 
This part of the cheapest price 

1607
01:38:09,000 --> 01:38:10,700
on the book is probably from 
Amazon. 

1608
01:38:12,800 --> 01:38:17,500
So for anyone who is wondering 
why we're all wearing different 

1609
01:38:17,500 --> 01:38:21,200
clothes. 
For this part of the podcast is 

1610
01:38:21,200 --> 01:38:25,900
because we recorded this on two 
separate occasions, been see, 

1611
01:38:25,900 --> 01:38:29,900
and I once we kind of got off 
the podcast, we were like we 

1612
01:38:29,900 --> 01:38:34,000
totally missed an opportunity to
bring up the following question.

1613
01:38:34,600 --> 01:38:40,000
So So how can we say that the 
Torah has all these Troublesome 

1614
01:38:40,000 --> 01:38:44,200
statements quote-unquote that 
the rabbi's had to sanitize or 

1615
01:38:44,200 --> 01:38:47,000
reinterpret in order to soften 
the blow yet? 

1616
01:38:47,000 --> 01:38:53,600
Maintain that the laws are the 
Divine word of God Yes. 

1617
01:38:53,600 --> 01:38:59,900
Well I wouldn't I wouldn't put 
it in the way of saying that 

1618
01:39:00,400 --> 01:39:04,100
they have to sanitize it. 
I think that there's always, 

1619
01:39:04,100 --> 01:39:08,100
this is an old question that 
you're asking the rambam, 

1620
01:39:08,100 --> 01:39:13,000
maimonides in the morning, 
Buchan addresses this question, 

1621
01:39:13,100 --> 01:39:16,000
essentially, what it what this 
question is when he talks about 

1622
01:39:16,000 --> 01:39:21,500
animal sacrifices, his question 
is, how could God command animal

1623
01:39:21,500 --> 01:39:25,000
sacrifices? 
After the Jews left Egypt, 

1624
01:39:25,000 --> 01:39:29,400
because after all animal 
sacrifices Are pagan very Pagan 

1625
01:39:30,200 --> 01:39:33,500
institution. 
You know, so help me God command

1626
01:39:33,500 --> 01:39:38,100
in the Torah that we're 
obligated to bring em sacrifices

1627
01:39:38,700 --> 01:39:41,700
and maimonides gives the 
following answer. 

1628
01:39:42,300 --> 01:39:46,300
He says that God was well, in 
effect dog was a very good 

1629
01:39:46,300 --> 01:39:50,300
teacher, because he understood 
what his students could 

1630
01:39:50,300 --> 01:39:52,000
understand. 
And what his students do not 

1631
01:39:52,000 --> 01:39:56,800
understand. 
And the mentality of Nace realm,

1632
01:39:56,800 --> 01:40:00,500
when they left and drying, they 
left Egypt was that he couldn't 

1633
01:40:00,500 --> 01:40:04,600
conceive of a religion that 
point in history, that didn't 

1634
01:40:04,600 --> 01:40:09,800
include animal sacrifices and 
therefore, God, as a concession 

1635
01:40:10,100 --> 01:40:17,000
to their kind of theological 
understanding he allowed animal 

1636
01:40:17,000 --> 01:40:19,400
sacrifices, not because it was 
an ideal book. 

1637
01:40:19,500 --> 01:40:23,100
Because people simply couldn't 
understand the religion, it That

1638
01:40:23,100 --> 01:40:27,200
time without animal sacrifices 
and therefore, he made a 

1639
01:40:27,208 --> 01:40:32,500
concession to the, to the 
theological or religious level 

1640
01:40:32,500 --> 01:40:35,800
of Jewish people when they left 
Egypt. 

1641
01:40:35,900 --> 01:40:39,100
Now, this first of all, what it 
does is introduce history and 

1642
01:40:39,100 --> 01:40:43,400
context into its vote into the 
Commandments and into the 

1643
01:40:43,400 --> 01:40:46,200
tourist. 
So this is the answer of my 

1644
01:40:46,200 --> 01:40:48,600
Maris is enormously 
controversial. 

1645
01:40:49,900 --> 01:40:53,500
Because there's an implication, 
maimonides doesn't say it, but 

1646
01:40:53,500 --> 01:40:59,900
the implication is that now that
we have advanced beyond the 

1647
01:40:59,900 --> 01:41:05,000
level of the Jews ulla Egypt, 
and we know we can understand 

1648
01:41:05,000 --> 01:41:08,600
religion that includes prayer, 
not animal, sacrifices, but 

1649
01:41:08,600 --> 01:41:15,300
prayer, you know, the time you 
place that in essence, replaced 

1650
01:41:15,500 --> 01:41:17,900
the institution of animal 
sacrifices with prayer. 

1651
01:41:18,200 --> 01:41:21,000
So what about us? 
Today, you know, that we no 

1652
01:41:21,000 --> 01:41:24,600
longer need animal sacrifices, 
prayer is a higher level. 

1653
01:41:25,500 --> 01:41:28,800
And therefore, the implication 
is, you know, now that we don't 

1654
01:41:28,800 --> 01:41:32,700
need animal sacrifices, the 
homeless with goes away and 

1655
01:41:32,700 --> 01:41:38,700
maybe when remote the machine, 
and the Messianic age, there's 

1656
01:41:38,700 --> 01:41:40,500
another Temple. 
We wouldn't have animal 

1657
01:41:40,500 --> 01:41:42,200
sacrifices. 
We would only have prayer. 

1658
01:41:42,200 --> 01:41:44,800
That's the implication of what 
my monitor says. 

1659
01:41:44,800 --> 01:41:49,600
So became very controversial 
because in effect would Moses is

1660
01:41:49,600 --> 01:41:53,600
saying, is that the tower 
evolves and some it's vote, were

1661
01:41:53,900 --> 01:41:57,500
were good for some points and 
some time in history, but later 

1662
01:41:57,500 --> 01:41:59,800
in history, we may not need 
these bits with any move 

1663
01:41:59,800 --> 01:42:03,400
anymore, which opens up a whole 
Pandora's Box about, which 

1664
01:42:03,400 --> 01:42:08,700
Mitzvah that the eternity of 
Mitzvah, that's what my mommy 

1665
01:42:08,700 --> 01:42:12,600
says. 
And, and I would say, the same 

1666
01:42:12,600 --> 01:42:15,800
thing is true with many of them,
it's folks that are written in 

1667
01:42:15,800 --> 01:42:18,900
the Torah that we feel 
uncomfortable with today. 

1668
01:42:19,000 --> 01:42:24,100
So for instance slavery or 
indentured servitude writing 

1669
01:42:24,100 --> 01:42:27,700
mean the tour allows death, but 
I'm very few of us would be 

1670
01:42:27,700 --> 01:42:31,200
comfortable with the notion of 
objects or slavery today for 

1671
01:42:31,200 --> 01:42:39,200
polygamy or or executing 
Sabbath, violators McConnell a 

1672
01:42:39,200 --> 01:42:42,700
Shabbat you know all of these 
things are in the Torah and yet 

1673
01:42:42,700 --> 01:42:45,800
today we would prefer not to do 
them so it. 

1674
01:42:46,200 --> 01:42:50,300
So here we have a situation and 
if you With the rabbis, did the 

1675
01:42:50,300 --> 01:42:51,300
time. 
You'd agree a place in the 

1676
01:42:51,300 --> 01:42:55,200
post-communist because they, in 
many ways in most of these 

1677
01:42:55,200 --> 01:43:01,600
cases, they managed to either 
render the mitzvot inoperable, 

1678
01:43:02,300 --> 01:43:06,200
for instance, here's an example.
The the bends over the mitzvot 

1679
01:43:06,200 --> 01:43:10,000
been so are more of the Torah 
and if you have a rebellious 

1680
01:43:10,000 --> 01:43:17,100
child then the parents can bring
him out to the court. 

1681
01:43:17,300 --> 01:43:22,500
And if the Child is convicted, 
then there's a parent Stone him 

1682
01:43:22,500 --> 01:43:26,000
to death, you know. 
Now that's he's very barbaric to

1683
01:43:26,000 --> 01:43:28,800
us and it was barbaric. 
I think the talmudic rabbis 

1684
01:43:28,800 --> 01:43:31,300
because in effect what they did 
is they put all kinds of 

1685
01:43:31,300 --> 01:43:36,300
conditions around this case so 
that it would never happen. 

1686
01:43:36,800 --> 01:43:41,500
Would never happen. 
So the rabbi's in effect, they 

1687
01:43:41,500 --> 01:43:45,300
couldn't erase the mitzvot 
because it's alright, as Divine.

1688
01:43:46,100 --> 01:43:49,600
So they just put all kinds of 
conditions around And so that we

1689
01:43:49,600 --> 01:43:54,300
would never implemented it sir 
and similarly with polygamy, you

1690
01:43:54,300 --> 01:43:57,800
know, that went out and at least
in ashkenaz in the Middle Ages. 

1691
01:43:58,900 --> 01:44:02,500
And with so, tired, in the 
institution where her husband 

1692
01:44:02,500 --> 01:44:06,500
suspect, his wife of adultery 
used to the going and they go 

1693
01:44:06,500 --> 01:44:09,600
through the ceremony. 
If she drinks the, the bitter 

1694
01:44:09,600 --> 01:44:13,900
Waters, they the rabbi's 
eliminated these mitts votes 

1695
01:44:14,500 --> 01:44:17,500
actually just on. 
If I can chime in over here with

1696
01:44:17,500 --> 01:44:20,200
the Sota. 
You can make the case that the 

1697
01:44:20,200 --> 01:44:25,700
Torah Itself by creating this 
kind of ritual is, is also 

1698
01:44:25,700 --> 01:44:28,800
protect its protecting women in 
the ancient world because 

1699
01:44:29,200 --> 01:44:30,800
nothing's going to happen right 
there. 

1700
01:44:31,200 --> 01:44:36,000
There's no a miracle had to 
happen according to this hotel, 

1701
01:44:37,200 --> 01:44:40,600
a miracle had to happen in order
to prove her guilt. 

1702
01:44:41,000 --> 01:44:45,500
So the rabbi's in effect loaded 
the dice, you know, would they 

1703
01:44:45,500 --> 01:44:48,000
understand Miracles? 
Don't happen very frequently. 

1704
01:44:48,300 --> 01:44:51,800
So Don't hey, that was their way
and that was the toe display 

1705
01:44:51,800 --> 01:44:56,100
actually, a minimizing minimize 
the harsh punishment to the 

1706
01:44:56,100 --> 01:45:01,100
suspected adulteress, but when 
further than the Torah right and

1707
01:45:01,100 --> 01:45:05,300
they eliminated, the eliminated 
Sota even before the destruction

1708
01:45:05,300 --> 01:45:08,000
of the second temple. 
So, all these Troublesome 

1709
01:45:08,000 --> 01:45:12,900
Mitzvah would swim in Spokane, 
which seemed to be indicators of

1710
01:45:13,000 --> 01:45:16,400
more primitive cultures. 
We could say, earlier, cultures 

1711
01:45:16,800 --> 01:45:21,800
the rabbi's found legal way. 
Ways to make sure that the midst

1712
01:45:21,800 --> 01:45:25,100
look whenever actually 
implemented. 

1713
01:45:25,800 --> 01:45:28,400
And you see this in many, many 
minutes vote. 

1714
01:45:28,700 --> 01:45:35,100
So, so what this shows you is 
that the, the conception of the 

1715
01:45:35,100 --> 01:45:38,300
Torah that we have that the 
right at the time unit 

1716
01:45:38,300 --> 01:45:40,400
Grandma's, it is not simply 
that. 

1717
01:45:40,500 --> 01:45:43,400
I've been even misspoke and 
that's the way they are for 

1718
01:45:43,400 --> 01:45:47,500
whole time but the the the 
system of mitzvoth, the system 

1719
01:45:47,500 --> 01:45:50,900
of Jewish law that we have. 
Is actually a marriage to 

1720
01:45:50,900 --> 01:45:55,700
marriage between God in the form
of the written Torah and 

1721
01:45:55,700 --> 01:45:58,900
rabbinic interpretation and 
rabbinic implementation, right? 

1722
01:45:58,900 --> 01:46:03,000
So it's so, so the life of 
Tourism marriage, between God 

1723
01:46:03,300 --> 01:46:07,500
and the rabbi's, and the rabbi's
have a voice in this and the 

1724
01:46:07,500 --> 01:46:15,000
rabbi's can then in a sense, 
Buying mitts vote that are 

1725
01:46:15,000 --> 01:46:18,400
consistent with the culture of 
the times. 

1726
01:46:18,400 --> 01:46:20,500
And when you think about it, 
seriously, I mean, this is the 

1727
01:46:20,508 --> 01:46:23,800
greatness of maimonides. 
That's the only way that's over 

1728
01:46:23,800 --> 01:46:26,600
can be Eternal. 
Because how could, how could the

1729
01:46:26,600 --> 01:46:29,800
Torah is a document be relevant 
to an ancient culture? 

1730
01:46:29,800 --> 01:46:34,000
In which there was animal 
sacrifices and polygamy and 

1731
01:46:34,000 --> 01:46:36,400
execution of Sabbath violators 
no way. 

1732
01:46:36,400 --> 01:46:39,400
Way back then and still be 
relevant today to us. 

1733
01:46:39,700 --> 01:46:44,800
Only if there's a there, Is a 
continuous legitimate system of 

1734
01:46:44,800 --> 01:46:47,900
interpretation of the Torah. 
So that there really is a 

1735
01:46:47,900 --> 01:46:54,000
marriage between the rabbi's and
the and God and I would say that

1736
01:46:54,000 --> 01:47:00,900
most of the Troublesome, it's 
vote that that we look at today,

1737
01:47:01,100 --> 01:47:04,300
you know, have been kind of 
rooted out in a practical sense.

1738
01:47:04,600 --> 01:47:09,300
I think the one interesting 
aspect of all that hasn't yet 

1739
01:47:09,300 --> 01:47:11,100
been routed out but it's in 
process. 

1740
01:47:11,400 --> 01:47:15,200
Included out is the lack of 
equality between men and women. 

1741
01:47:16,000 --> 01:47:20,000
That that's you mention that you
mentioned that, it's all right. 

1742
01:47:20,200 --> 01:47:27,000
And what you see today is, I 
think not only the lay people in

1743
01:47:27,000 --> 01:47:30,100
a row, but the graphics to are 
really thinking about this. 

1744
01:47:30,100 --> 01:47:35,900
How can we, some raise the 
status of women in the eyes of 

1745
01:47:35,900 --> 01:47:38,200
the Torah and observant Jewish 
life? 

1746
01:47:38,400 --> 01:47:41,600
And we're in the middle of that 
process, where It's going to 

1747
01:47:41,600 --> 01:47:42,800
end. 
I don't know when it's going to 

1748
01:47:42,800 --> 01:47:45,400
end, I don't know. 
But what you see is there's a 

1749
01:47:45,407 --> 01:47:48,600
certain ferment going on and 
they're the people with 

1750
01:47:48,600 --> 01:47:50,800
different opinions and that's 
completely legitimate. 

1751
01:47:50,800 --> 01:47:54,500
But we're in the midst of a 
historical process because it's 

1752
01:47:54,500 --> 01:47:57,700
going to take time. 
If things always happens is 

1753
01:47:57,700 --> 01:48:01,700
things Always by the way, you 
know this sounds like a very 

1754
01:48:01,700 --> 01:48:13,100
radical idea. 
Value to having Thomas of them, 

1755
01:48:13,800 --> 01:48:17,700
ran, by knocking, rabinovich who
passed away long ago. 

1756
01:48:18,000 --> 01:48:20,600
So, rocking a bit of it's all 
over, show them, what an essay 

1757
01:48:20,600 --> 01:48:24,800
called artificial Torah in, 
which he explained that built 

1758
01:48:24,800 --> 01:48:26,700
into the Tower built into Jewish
law. 

1759
01:48:26,700 --> 01:48:29,800
Is this notion of evolution? 
There's an evolution of values 

1760
01:48:29,800 --> 01:48:32,500
that has limits. 
I'm not, you know, we couldn't 

1761
01:48:32,800 --> 01:48:36,400
evolved to the situation where 
we could let's say legitimize 

1762
01:48:36,400 --> 01:48:42,900
murder or legitimize adultery, 
but It's alright, his and 

1763
01:48:42,900 --> 01:48:45,000
helicopters, always have 
undergone this kind of 

1764
01:48:45,000 --> 01:48:48,400
historical Evolution and we're 
in the midst where the middle of

1765
01:48:48,400 --> 01:48:51,400
this evolutionary process. 
So I wouldn't say that the rabbi

1766
01:48:51,400 --> 01:48:56,600
sanitized, I think much more 
constructive way to put. 

1767
01:48:56,600 --> 01:49:01,600
It is to say that the rabbi's in
God are kind of a holy marriage 

1768
01:49:01,600 --> 01:49:04,700
and a partnership in, which we 
also have a say in the Chimera 

1769
01:49:04,700 --> 01:49:07,700
says that, the talmud says that,
you know, that the militia 

1770
01:49:07,700 --> 01:49:12,000
Miami, that's always no longer 
in heaven, but But we have a 

1771
01:49:12,000 --> 01:49:15,000
voice, you know in the 
determination of what the Tobar 

1772
01:49:15,000 --> 01:49:16,700
releases and how we should move 
it. 

1773
01:49:17,700 --> 01:49:22,400
Yeah, and I think also, the fact
that the Torah was meant to be, 

1774
01:49:22,400 --> 01:49:27,300
especially if we follow the 
rabbinic tradition, this Dynamic

1775
01:49:27,600 --> 01:49:30,700
text, right? 
That, that continues to adapt to

1776
01:49:30,700 --> 01:49:35,600
the times and not be some kind 
of static other sects of Judaism

1777
01:49:35,600 --> 01:49:38,600
that have stuck to the more 
static approach are no longer 

1778
01:49:38,600 --> 01:49:42,200
here to tell their story. 
So I find it to be really 

1779
01:49:42,200 --> 01:49:47,200
fascinating and the issue. 
I think the trouble is that even

1780
01:49:47,200 --> 01:49:52,100
though we have this kind of 
system that is a dynamic, you 

1781
01:49:52,100 --> 01:49:53,800
know, approach to law and 
everything. 

1782
01:49:54,400 --> 01:49:57,500
There is no big thing how that 
doll today and there's no, you 

1783
01:49:57,500 --> 01:50:03,300
know, there's no unified body 
that can kind of help us in 

1784
01:50:03,900 --> 01:50:06,000
doing what we wanted at the 
process. 

1785
01:50:06,000 --> 01:50:09,900
That process, we don't have a 
poem, we don't have a pulp on 

1786
01:50:09,900 --> 01:50:18,300
top or, you know, so then the 
question is who America to make 

1787
01:50:18,300 --> 01:50:19,900
these decisions. 
All right. 

1788
01:50:20,000 --> 01:50:24,200
Well, you have to have a baby. 
They do have element or son had 

1789
01:50:24,200 --> 01:50:26,100
drink or smoke at Faking. 
It Don't Ya? 

1790
01:50:26,100 --> 01:50:30,000
Okay, son, a dream. 
Interesting. 

1791
01:50:36,200 --> 01:50:39,400
So there was a very interesting 
historical development when this

1792
01:50:39,400 --> 01:50:44,700
idea of prohibiting, lagoons or 
kidney area grew up, is that 

1793
01:50:44,700 --> 01:50:47,900
it's actually a great custom. 
It's in the Middle Ages when 

1794
01:50:47,900 --> 01:50:50,300
that was introduced into Jewish 
life. 

1795
01:50:50,800 --> 01:50:55,100
So at a certain point, the 
rabbi's wanted to prohibit 

1796
01:50:55,100 --> 01:50:58,700
anything, any product that you 
could make cake Academy or 

1797
01:50:58,700 --> 01:51:00,400
something that looked like the 
comments. 

1798
01:51:01,800 --> 01:51:06,800
So they and some point they said
that potatoes are pretty and it 

1799
01:51:06,808 --> 01:51:08,800
made it has a rod. 
They made some kind of degree 

1800
01:51:08,800 --> 01:51:13,500
that you just as we can't eat 
peas, we can't eat potatoes and 

1801
01:51:13,700 --> 01:51:16,600
the people just simply didn't 
accept it, you know. 

1802
01:51:17,100 --> 01:51:20,100
So they refused to accept it. 
They said it's just too 

1803
01:51:20,100 --> 01:51:23,300
difficult that pace up with that
potatoes, even though you can 

1804
01:51:23,300 --> 01:51:25,600
make, you know, you can make 
wonderful cakes now, out of 

1805
01:51:25,608 --> 01:51:28,000
potato starch, you don't need 
that meets or anything. 

1806
01:51:28,600 --> 01:51:31,200
And so here's the sitch and 
there and therefore, the 

1807
01:51:31,200 --> 01:51:35,700
rabbinic ruling just fine and 
they went away. 

1808
01:51:35,700 --> 01:51:38,200
It wasn't balanced. 
So here we have a situation with

1809
01:51:38,200 --> 01:51:40,800
the people themselves, not even 
rabbinic authorities but the 

1810
01:51:40,800 --> 01:51:43,900
people themselves, you know, 
determine how tell her life 

1811
01:51:44,200 --> 01:51:46,900
should be lived. 
So it's not only a matter. 

1812
01:51:47,000 --> 01:51:51,000
Has between the paralyzed. 
And and God, it's a marriage 

1813
01:51:51,000 --> 01:51:52,800
between the Jewish people as a 
whole. 

1814
01:51:57,200 --> 01:52:02,200
Thank you so much. 
Thank you so much for clearing 

1815
01:52:02,200 --> 01:52:06,100
that up, and for expressing 
those Notions, it's extremely 

1816
01:52:06,100 --> 01:52:09,200
important. 
You do fantastic work. 

1817
01:52:09,600 --> 01:52:14,200
I'm looking forward to reading 
more of your work as time goes 

1818
01:52:14,200 --> 01:52:15,400
by. 
Really, I really, really 

1819
01:52:15,400 --> 01:52:19,900
enjoyed. 
I really, I really enjoyed the 

1820
01:52:19,907 --> 01:52:22,800
material that I've read so far 
and I want to continue reading 

1821
01:52:22,800 --> 01:52:26,600
it and we hope you have a 
chivato By the way, before we go

1822
01:52:26,600 --> 01:52:29,700
I didn't want to just came to my
head now because you brought up 

1823
01:52:30,100 --> 01:52:34,600
the ROM bombs, you know, example
of animal sacrifice. 

1824
01:52:35,400 --> 01:52:39,400
So, you know, people say who we 
like there are people make the 

1825
01:52:39,407 --> 01:52:42,900
case that you know, who's in be 
interested in doing that and 

1826
01:52:43,100 --> 01:52:46,700
we're beyond that we've evolved.
But if you go to goto Crown 

1827
01:52:46,700 --> 01:52:50,100
Heights and you know, when they 
do Kapa wrote that mean, you see

1828
01:52:50,100 --> 01:52:52,800
that? 
There's still this Instinct. 

1829
01:52:52,800 --> 01:52:57,000
And a lot of people to kind of 
Do these kind of practices, 

1830
01:52:57,000 --> 01:53:00,100
right? 
So I actually think that it's 

1831
01:53:00,700 --> 01:53:03,500
the Torah. 
God understands human nature and

1832
01:53:03,500 --> 01:53:06,600
human nature really, doesn't 
change that much. 

1833
01:53:07,300 --> 01:53:10,600
I don't think so, at least. 
Well, if you think about it, if 

1834
01:53:10,600 --> 01:53:14,400
there was a bit of a dash and we
were offering sacrifices, there 

1835
01:53:14,700 --> 01:53:17,300
would be a lot less problems in 
different areas. 

1836
01:53:17,900 --> 01:53:23,300
People would not be looking to 
the, you know, Sadiq figure 

1837
01:53:23,700 --> 01:53:28,200
right to to get Are their 
inspiration or they wouldn't be 

1838
01:53:28,200 --> 01:53:30,400
necessarily going to Graves or 
they wouldn't be. 

1839
01:53:31,000 --> 01:53:34,400
There would be a centralized 
worship from that standpoint. 

1840
01:53:34,400 --> 01:53:40,100
I do think it does and it's in a
very wise Way by having a temple

1841
01:53:41,200 --> 01:53:43,100
and having the sacrifices in the
temple. 

1842
01:53:44,600 --> 01:53:47,700
It would, it would centralized 
worship. 

1843
01:53:47,700 --> 01:53:52,100
And minimize the amount of times
that people would obviously, we 

1844
01:53:52,100 --> 01:53:57,100
had periods, where they would 
the No, they would, they would 

1845
01:53:57,200 --> 01:54:01,000
banish all the back backyard by 
moment, right? 

1846
01:54:01,100 --> 01:54:03,700
They didn't want people doing 
sacrifices in their own homes 

1847
01:54:03,700 --> 01:54:07,100
and everything. 
So there was clearly a way the 

1848
01:54:07,100 --> 01:54:11,300
beit hamikdash serve that 
purpose of kind of minimizing 

1849
01:54:11,300 --> 01:54:15,900
the amount of times people do it
and also, you know, getting 

1850
01:54:15,900 --> 01:54:18,300
letting people get out of their 
system, but it's such a slap, 

1851
01:54:18,300 --> 01:54:22,100
you know, you get tired of it 
and the hope is that over time 

1852
01:54:22,100 --> 01:54:24,600
people just Move on. 
Right? 

1853
01:54:24,600 --> 01:54:26,900
We don't we don't want to dwell 
too much on this stuff. 

1854
01:54:27,500 --> 01:54:31,200
Right. 
There is a lot of psychological 

1855
01:54:31,200 --> 01:54:34,400
and spiritual Advantage having a
central class. 

1856
01:54:34,400 --> 01:54:37,200
I mean, we are still human 
beings question blood and live 

1857
01:54:37,200 --> 01:54:42,500
in the world of space and time 
and we need physical things to 

1858
01:54:43,600 --> 01:54:46,400
inspire us in many ways. 
When you see this at the cartel,

1859
01:54:46,800 --> 01:54:49,400
no woman go. 
Tell is just phone. 

1860
01:54:49,400 --> 01:54:52,500
I mean, it's just that people 
need to be near something 

1861
01:54:52,500 --> 01:54:59,700
physical with it. 
The, the religiously inspired, I

1862
01:54:59,700 --> 01:55:02,500
personally would not do very 
comfortable with the day to make

1863
01:55:02,500 --> 01:55:05,600
that she was doing sacrifices 
animal sacrifices. 

1864
01:55:06,200 --> 01:55:08,700
And, you know, I don't know what
the people in Los Angeles or 

1865
01:55:08,700 --> 01:55:13,800
even in Brooklyn or even in New 
Rochelle, you know, would feel 

1866
01:55:13,800 --> 01:55:19,300
if they had they would be great 
for a LOL, but I'm not so sure 

1867
01:55:19,300 --> 01:55:25,100
it would it would I'm coming 
from the angle that I that there

1868
01:55:25,100 --> 01:55:31,800
is religious fanaticism 
religious extremism and to have 

1869
01:55:31,800 --> 01:55:37,100
that religious fanaticism in a 
sense prescribed and centralized

1870
01:55:37,500 --> 01:55:40,600
and not like gone wild. 
There's something to that to 

1871
01:55:40,600 --> 01:55:44,600
consider maybe wouldn't be for 
everyone maybe but you get what 

1872
01:55:44,600 --> 01:55:46,200
you get where I'm coming from 
though with Yes. 

1873
01:55:46,200 --> 01:55:48,700
Actually you really you know, 
that's very good because you're 

1874
01:55:48,700 --> 01:55:53,500
very close to with the rum bum 
says, you know, he says that You

1875
01:55:53,500 --> 01:55:56,500
think that there was a baton 
exhaust because it's warm only 

1876
01:55:56,700 --> 01:56:00,200
because because animal 
sacrifices are more holding up 

1877
01:56:00,700 --> 01:56:04,000
think again because the truth is
that the base to make doctors 

1878
01:56:04,000 --> 01:56:09,200
away to constrained and to put 
limits on sacrifice where there 

1879
01:56:09,200 --> 01:56:12,700
you go to sacrifice their, you 
can only do when the Cohen was 

1880
01:56:12,700 --> 01:56:15,900
there, right FEMA, which is a 
higher level tool. 

1881
01:56:15,900 --> 01:56:19,700
You can even do in Brooklyn, you
know, you can do anywhere. 

1882
01:56:19,700 --> 01:56:24,000
So so that you know, that's what
you said is very, very Close to 

1883
01:56:24,000 --> 01:56:25,500
what the rambam said. 
That's true. 

1884
01:56:26,700 --> 01:56:28,200
Thank you so much. 
This was awesome. 

1885
01:56:28,200 --> 01:56:30,000
Amazing. 
And thank you for calling back 

1886
01:56:30,000 --> 01:56:32,300
on and doing this for us. 
We hope to do this again. 

1887
01:56:32,300 --> 01:56:35,600
Yes, there's a lot. 
I don't be my pleasure and good 

1888
01:56:35,600 --> 01:56:37,400
luck. 
It's a wonderful book instead of

1889
01:56:37,400 --> 01:56:40,300
being millions millions of 
listeners because it's important

1890
01:56:40,300 --> 01:56:43,600
for people to have a, really, 
serious and honest, 

1891
01:56:44,300 --> 01:56:47,100
understanding of Torah. 
Thank you very much. 

1892
01:56:47,100 --> 01:56:49,900
We really appreciate that. 
Okay, final question, mr. 

1893
01:56:49,900 --> 01:56:52,300
Man, they help you. 
Thank you very much. 

1894
01:56:58,100 --> 01:57:00,300
Hey guys, thanks so much for 
tuning in to the Judy's and 

1895
01:57:00,300 --> 01:57:03,300
demystified podcast. 
Really appreciate all your 

1896
01:57:03,300 --> 01:57:07,200
support and your feedback. 
If you want to help us grow the 

1897
01:57:07,200 --> 01:57:10,200
podcast, keep spreading the 
word, share it with your 

1898
01:57:10,200 --> 01:57:13,800
friends, family, or whoever you 
think would be interested, we 

1899
01:57:13,800 --> 01:57:17,900
also opened a patreon, so you 
can become a patron, contribute 

1900
01:57:17,900 --> 01:57:20,700
any small amount you'd like 
which would really help us grow 

1901
01:57:20,700 --> 01:57:25,300
the show. 
Our patreon is The w dot 

1902
01:57:25,300 --> 01:57:30,200
patreon.com slash Judaism, 
pretty easy to remember. 

1903
01:57:30,600 --> 01:57:33,700
Thank you again and we hope to 
keep putting out Rachel's for 

1904
01:57:33,700 --> 01:57:34,300
you guys.