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Welcome to Judaism Demystified, 
a podcast for the perplexed. 

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Join us as we explore some of 
the most fascinating Jewish and 

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Torah related topics with our 
esteemed guests. 

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By tackling some of the biggest 
questions you likely won't find 

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addressed elsewhere, we aim to 
shed light on important issues 

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and inspire a return to the 
fundamentals. 

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Enjoy the show. 
Thank you for rejoining the 

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Judaism Demystified podcast. 
Rabbi Pattaragan, we want to 

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discuss your amazing new book, 
Reclaiming Redemption, which is 

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actually sold out in Israel 
right now and has just made it 

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to bookstores in the US. 
But before we begin, we just 

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want to ask you to tell us a 
little bit about yourself, just 

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for those who don't know you 
from before. 

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So please let us know a little 
bit about yourself. 

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Well, first of all, it's great 
to see you again. 

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Thank you for inviting me back 
so quickly. 

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This is Parsad Vayera. 
So Ashen visits Abraham while 

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he's being Machnis oriak. 
So teachers does that. 

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The way to be Makaveli Srina is 
to be Machnis Orkim. 

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So thank you for having me as 
your guest on the podcast. 

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There's many different ways of 
being Machnis Oriak. 

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So one of the ways hosting 
people on your podcast and you 

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should continue to be Machnis 
oriak. 

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Hopefully, maybe Malachim will 
join you on the next podcast. 

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I hope so, I hope. 
So it's also, before I talk a 

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little bit about myself, 
obviously I don't know where 

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people will be listening to this
podcast. 

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But it's really important, 
especially if people are not in 

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Israel, to continue as best as 
you can to connect and 

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sympathize and realize that as 
much as the news may not cover 

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the wars intensely as it did in 
the past, there are people who 

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are still going through a lot of
hardship and people still 

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recovering from hardship from 
the past couple months, women 

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who are still living without 
their husbands, who are up north

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fighting or down South fighting.
So just to continue, continue to

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sync with the rest of our 
people, hopefully this book will

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help a little bit, but it's 
important to always have that in

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our front load before we start 
speaking, especially someone 

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from Israel speaking with 
people. 

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I guess many of them are 
overseas. 

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My name is Marsha Tarrigan 
again, I, I've lived in Gush for

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about 40 years. 
Bush in Seattle, more or less. 

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I had eight children. 
I raised my family. 

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Now thank God. 
Many grandchildren, they all 

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live in Israel, thank God. 
And I'm a teacher and Hezder 

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yeshiva. 
Hezder yeshiva is a yeshiva that

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combines military service with 
terrorist study. 

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I know that's a hot button issue
today. 

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I'm proud to be one of the first
teachers in 2000 years since 

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Rebe Akiva, who has student 
scholars who are also soldiers. 

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And it's a big support to to 
have that and to try to share 

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that awareness with as many 
people as possible. 

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I'm a columnist for The 
Jerusalem Post who gets 

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syndicated in many different 
Jewish weeklies, I think in 

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several of the United States as 
well as I write off in in 

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lecture. 
So that's who I am, and I'm 

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happy to be here. 
So thank you. 

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Well, it's a pleasure to have 
you, and your new book, 

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Reclaiming Redemption is so 
great. 

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There's so many great chapters 
and so many chapters, so it was 

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hard for us to kind of pick the 
ones we want to get into. 

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We're not going to get into 
specific questions because 

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there's just so much to cover. 
So what we decided to do is just

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ask you about specific chapters 
to give us kind of an overview. 

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So the first one we wanted to 
discuss with you is your chapter

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called Peoplehood and Identity. 
Look, it's, it's, that's 

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probably the main chapter, the 
main part of the book. 

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But I'll take a step back just 
to give a little bit of a broad 

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lens and a broadview. 
What everyone agrees, I think 

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that we're heading towards a 
pivotal moment in Jewish 

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history. 
However you phrase it, whether 

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you cloak it with this 
ideological term or that 

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ideological term, whether you 
believe that the state of Israel

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is divine or you don't feel it's
divine, something's happening to

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our people. 
Millions of Jews are returning 

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to Israel. 
The land of Israel is being 

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repopulated and re fertilized. 
anti-Semitism is on the rise in 

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broader sense over this century.
That's also part of Jewish 

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history. 
It's not incidental to Jewish 

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history and unfortunately we 
don't have a vocabulary or 

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tradition of how to navigate 
redemption for all sorts of 

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reasons maybe, which we'll 
discuss. 

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There's a bias against 
discussing it. 

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There's certain concerns that 
messianism raises. 

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So it's very much an unspoken 
topic. 

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And like anything else, nature 
abhors a vacuum, and so does 

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ideology. 
So that vacuum gets filled with 

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very extreme, sometimes 
simplistic statements. 

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And we talk about redemption. 
We speak about what will mushiya

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look like and how tall will he 
be. 

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Or do you believe little Bob 
Jerebi was or wasn't the 

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mushiya, rather than discussing 
it in the same sophisticated, 

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nuanced terms that we discuss 
anything else, like a Soghi and 

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Gemara or philosophy? 
So there needs to be, before we 

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start reaching conclusions about
when mashiach will come and how 

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will come, a vocabulary about 
discussing how Jewish identity 

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across the board, religion, 
ritual, how we look back at 

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exile, how everything changes 
now that we're starting this 

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process of returning to our land
and completing history in its 

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final stages. 
And that was really the aim of 

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my book, to take a broadview and
to not reach conclusions, but 

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give people food for thought and
give people material and words 

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and issues, and not just when 
he's coming. 

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And how quickly will the Beta 
Macduff be rebuilt? 

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So people Hood is a perfect way 
to start. 

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It's no secret that the question
of Jewish peoplehood, how we see

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ourselves not as individuals, 
but how we see ourselves as a 

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people, is undergoing dramatic, 
dramatic transformation. 

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In part, that transformation has
little to do with the state of 

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Israel. 
That transformation happened 200

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years ago when, for the first 
time in Jewish history, large 

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groups of Jews institutionally 
walked away from classic 

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halachic observance. 
That was never true. 

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There were always people who 
walked out. 

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There was people who 
underperformed halachically. 

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They just didn't keep this 
mizvah or that mitzvah. 

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But in the 1800s, you had, first
of all, Conservative movement 

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Reformed Jews who are altering 
their degree of halachic 

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engagement, and then you have 
secular Jews who walk out of 

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halachic or ritual engagement 
entirely. 

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And for some people, once you 
walk out, you're gone, you're 

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finished. 
There's a very famous statement 

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of of Sajagon that a Jew is 
defined by his Taro mitzvot. 

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And if you don't, if you don't 
hear the term, so you're not a 

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Jew. 
And I think sadly, because I 

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don't agree with that, I think 
sadly, large groups of Jews see 

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that way, see secular Jews that 
way, but I don't see secular 

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Jews that way. 
I see there's the elements of 

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Jewish identity that exist 
independent of commitment to 

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ritual and halacha. 
And now that the state of Israel

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was born, there's an instrument 
or an organ for Jews to express 

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their Jewish identity through 
non halachic means. 

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And though Orthodox Jews don't 
acknowledge that as the ideal 

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package, we certainly want to 
validate, and the war has taught

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us to validate different forms 
of Jewish identity, even if it 

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exists in dependence. 
So I think probably the Hallmark

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article, this is a book of 
articles, the Hallmark articles 

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where I compare Judaism to an 
onion. 

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And just like an onion has 
layers to it, Jewish identity 

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has layers to it. 
And the full identity comprises 

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a lot of commitment, commitment 
to Hashem's authority. 

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I call them biblical Jews. 
Jews who maybe aren't adherent 

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to halacha, but they feel God's 
presence and they believe that 

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the biblical prophecy shaped 
their life in our future. 

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There are millions of those Jews
in Israel by the way more 

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smarter types Jews than 
Ashkenazi got smarter have had 

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the capacity to carve out 
commitment to God, commitment to

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prophecy, even if it doesn't 
coexist with full blown Halafa 

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commitment. 
And then of course there are 

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Jews, many of whom live in the 
United States who don't 

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necessarily believe in God or in
prophecy or they believe in God,

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but they don't believe that 
God's commandments are are are 

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are translated through 
prophecies, but they have a 

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stiff moral commitment. 
They believe that being a Jew is

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to live a moral life and to be a
light on two nations. 

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And that's also part of our 
people hood. 

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So since our Judaism has became 
our identities become refracted,

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how do we build an overarching 
view of our people and identify 

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with our people in a world in 
which Jewish identity doesn't 

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exist in the same monochromatic 
binary, yes or no, that it 

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existed 200 years ago. 
And I think that the war has 

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opened up people's minds to 
start thinking in those matters,

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especially overseas. 
You don't attend funerals of 

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fallen soldiers who may not be 
religious and call them Sadiqam 

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without thinking, well, why are 
they Sadiqam? 

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Why are we celebrating them? 
Obviously for some people, maybe

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for yourselves and your 
listeners is always obvious, but

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I'm trying to articulate that 
for people. 

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That's probably the Hallmark 
article in the section called 

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Peoplehood. 
I don't want to talk extensively

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like this would be more 
interactive, so I'm happy to 

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respond to other issues. 
But to me, if someone asks me 

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which 100 pages of the book you 
should read, it's that first, 

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the first two sections called 
Peoplehood an identity, for 

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example, a very controversial 
topic. 

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How do we relate to nationalism?
Is Jewish nationalism something 

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which secular nationalism, which
meant the religious people see 

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as idolatrous or as a criminal 
or as villainous? 

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But if you believe that I 
interview boys sometimes for 

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acceptance to the yeshiva and I 
asked them the following 

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question. 
I asked them you can answer the 

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question. 
I'll let you guys answer as well

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and say who is the best Jew you 
ever met or read about? 

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And I wait for them to start 
thinking in their minds who 

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wasn't classically observant and
religious. 

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Because to me, a proud Jewish 
identity sits at the foundation 

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of religious experience. 
And if you're not a proud Jew, 

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then you're bringing only part 
of yourself to a religious 

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experience. 
If you're a proud Jew and it 

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occupies your entire essence, 
your entire self, so you're on 

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vote of sashem, your religious 
voice will be that much more 

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profound and resonant. 
So I want them to be able to 

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identify Jewish identity outside
of halafic practice. 

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So what would you say is the 
best view you can imagine that's

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not Orthodox as you met or read 
about? 

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That's a, that's a great 
question. 

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That's a great question. 
That's really a good question. 

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I would probably have to think 
of something like a contemporary

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figure, people who you know now 
after October 7th, you're seeing

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a lot of people, courageous Jews
standing up. 

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Like, I think like Jerry 
Seinfeld, for example, he has it

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all. 
He has it all and he, he makes 

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people laugh. 
You know, there's a famous agada

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about Hashem loves people who, 
you know, who are jesters and 

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make people laugh. 
But I, I think that he didn't 

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have to do what he's doing now, 
which is becoming an advocate 

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for Israel. 
And he, he's something changing 

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him, you know, and you see, you 
see that with a lot of people. 

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So someone like him, I always 
grew up loving his show and 

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loving his comedy. 
And now he has a new identity in

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my mind. 
He's not he's he's in a way, 

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somewhat of a protector of his 
people. 

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You know, he stands up for us in
the public. 

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Speaker So I think that to me is
somebody who I would, let's say,

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admire. 
What would you say it's? 

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A good question. 
I, I don't want to just say 

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something for the sake of 
something. 

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So I, I want to, instead of 
answering, I'm going to tell you

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that I'm actually going to think
about this and really try to No,

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no, seriously, I, I think it's 
an important question. 

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I everything you just said 
actually has, it's a, it's a 

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topic that whether we like it or
not, it's actually it's kind of 

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enthroned. 
Like he said, like you said, 

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since the war, Judaism has has 
kind of broadened. 

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There's, there's more to more to
Judaism. 

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Not that not none. 
We're not putting importance 

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here or, or we're not trying to 
grade here, but Judaism is more 

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than just observance. 
Judaism is who we are. 

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It's a nation, it's a people, 
it's a conviction, it's an 

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identity. 
It's everything that comes along

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with it. 
And I think that, I think that 

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it's going to take time, but I 
do think that this is something 

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which is going to, I hope this 
conversation is going to grow in

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all types of, in the Orthodox 
world, in the non Orthodox 

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world. 
You know, I, I think that also 

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secular people sometimes maybe 
hold on only or too much to 

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nationhood. 
And, and, and they don't give 

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the, the religious side much 
thought. 

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And the religious side doesn't 
give the nationhood side much 

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thought. 
It, it, it's, it's a, it goes 

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both ways. 
And it's, I think it's, it's a 

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very important conversation to 
have and, and in terms of 

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putting it out as a book, 
extremely important. 

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Well, we want to ask you. 
We want to flip that around and 

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ask you who do? 
Who's. 

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00:12:28,760 --> 00:12:29,040
Oh. 
Yeah, yeah. 

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OK, fine. 
I don't know I do that. 

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OK, that's that's an easy one, 
Menachem Begin. 

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OK. 
I don't know how classically 

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observant he was, what he did 
and what he didn't keep, but I 

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wish I could be half the Jew he 
was. 

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And he spoke with such prophetic
courage and such Jewish 

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identification. 
And I, I model myself after him.

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And people who I've heard that 
voice in someone like Menachem 

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Begin, but they're getting back 
to what you said before, what I 

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00:12:52,320 --> 00:12:55,280
was saying before I there's a 
lot of experimentation in 

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Israel. 
And it's not just abstract how I

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view myself as a person. 
But Jews in Israel is starting 

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00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:04,160
to experiment with Jewish art 
and Jewish music and Jewish 

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00:13:04,160 --> 00:13:07,760
poetry and Jewish literature and
Jewish language and using this 

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00:13:07,760 --> 00:13:11,360
as an expression of religion. 
So your religion now starts to 

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stream, not just through the 
Lulav and it's villain and how 

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00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:17,400
many Black Kumar you learn, but 
finding new voices. 

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Because we have an organic 
identity. 

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We have an organic national 
identity. 

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When you're back in your land, 
first of all, there's the 

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confidence in overseas. 
Klutzlawitz Galut is very much 

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preserving the past and 
fortressing ourselves against 

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the encroachment of the foreign 
culture. 

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What happens in, however you 
slice it, everyone builds a wall

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between US and them. 
The question is how many windows

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and how many doors are in the 
wall. 

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But everyone has to build a wall
to create some degree of 

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cultural insularity and 
protection. 

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In Israel, you don't. 
You're not protecting yourself. 

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00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:50,280
As I suddenly joke with people 
that in Hutzlar it's sometimes a

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small keeper is indicative of 
less commitment to religion. 

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You're trying to hide your 
Jewish identity. 

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You're trying to mute it. 
And, and sometimes, not always, 

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00:13:58,040 --> 00:14:00,320
but for some people it is. 
In artificial, it isn't. 

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00:14:00,320 --> 00:14:01,920
You're not hiding for everyone. 
It's a Jew. 

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00:14:02,360 --> 00:14:03,680
It's just the stylistic 
decision. 

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You want to wear a big one, you 
want a small one. 

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00:14:05,600 --> 00:14:07,560
It's not indicative in many 
cases. 

285
00:14:07,680 --> 00:14:10,320
I know many tell me they have to
tell me that we're a kippah that

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00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:13,400
let's say in America wouldn't 
pass the, the, the, the 

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00:14:13,400 --> 00:14:15,080
yardstick or whatever people 
measure. 

288
00:14:15,280 --> 00:14:17,600
And it's not because it's just, 
it's a stylistic issue here. 

289
00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:22,160
So how does, how does these 
broader expressions play into 

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00:14:22,160 --> 00:14:24,280
religious identity? 
How do nationalist expressions? 

291
00:14:24,280 --> 00:14:27,760
And we've been to, sadly enough,
many, many funerals. 

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00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:31,880
And the funerals are a mixture 
of the classic Kaddish Gil Malhi

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00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:36,720
Rahimi and Tering Korea. 
But they're also army salutes 

294
00:14:36,960 --> 00:14:40,720
and flowers on graves, which is 
a national experience which no 

295
00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:42,360
one includes ours. 
To put a flower on a Jewish 

296
00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:44,680
grave, it's not a Jewish, it's a
Christian associated with 

297
00:14:44,680 --> 00:14:48,920
Christian customs and standing 
silently during a siren on 

298
00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:54,040
Yomatzmut or Yom Haziqaron or 
lighting torches. 

299
00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:56,480
And none of these have basics, 
basics. 

300
00:14:56,480 --> 00:14:58,960
In halacha, you can't find the 
Shokhin Arath that says when 

301
00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:01,200
someone dies, you light a torch,
you put a flower in their grave.

302
00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:05,080
But if we are investing in 
national identity and creating a

303
00:15:05,080 --> 00:15:08,200
movement called nationalism to 
capture the hearts and minds of 

304
00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:11,240
Jews, even though those hearts 
and minds may not be attuned to 

305
00:15:11,240 --> 00:15:14,480
ritual and religion right now, 
then those are going to become 

306
00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:16,920
sacred moments. 
And that's pretty much a divide 

307
00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:19,560
between those who are part of 
the nation and let's say sectors

308
00:15:19,560 --> 00:15:21,920
in Israel that are not part of 
the nation that frown on these 

309
00:15:21,920 --> 00:15:24,720
and understand their position. 
Because everything has to be 

310
00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:27,320
streamed only through halacha 
and it doesn't have halacha 

311
00:15:27,320 --> 00:15:29,000
basis. 
It is no validity. 

312
00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:30,840
But now that they were creating 
more organic. 

313
00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:34,600
We have to acknowledge like 
there's also Drusim and there's 

314
00:15:34,600 --> 00:15:37,680
also Arab Israelis and there's, 
there's other people living in 

315
00:15:37,680 --> 00:15:40,360
our land, fighting in, in the 
country who, who are falling. 

316
00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:43,400
And they're all part of that 
story as well. 

317
00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:48,160
I think what makes what makes 
Israel so like the, the, the 

318
00:15:48,160 --> 00:15:51,440
issue with the culture is that 
we're such a young nation right 

319
00:15:51,440 --> 00:15:55,680
now is the new modern Israel, 
whereas halacha, you know, that 

320
00:15:55,680 --> 00:15:58,040
that has always been around. 
But when you talk about Jewish 

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00:15:58,040 --> 00:16:00,320
culture, we've been spread 
throughout the world. 

322
00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:03,320
So we've kind of just been a 
melting pot of different 

323
00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:05,120
cultures coming back into one 
place. 

324
00:16:05,760 --> 00:16:08,400
And, and you kind of have to 
figure out what are we, you 

325
00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:11,880
know, now or are we Polish? 
Are we Persian, Are we, are we 

326
00:16:11,880 --> 00:16:14,040
Syrian? 
What are we, you know, And I 

327
00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:17,320
think that's a big part of it. 
That's a very unique situation 

328
00:16:17,320 --> 00:16:18,880
that you don't see anywhere else
in the world. 

329
00:16:19,960 --> 00:16:23,360
I like to say Herzl was the 
first person in 2000 years 

330
00:16:23,360 --> 00:16:25,680
Theodore Herzl to say the 
following 4 words. 

331
00:16:27,200 --> 00:16:29,480
He got up in the congresses and 
parliaments of Europe and the 

332
00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:31,840
palaces and and diplomatic 
attaches. 

333
00:16:31,840 --> 00:16:36,680
And he was the first Jew in 2000
years to say I am a Jew because 

334
00:16:36,680 --> 00:16:40,160
for 2000 years, as you implied, 
Jews introduce themselves. 

335
00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:42,040
I'm an Iraqi Jew, I'm an 
Egyptian Jew. 

336
00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:44,160
I'm a Polish Jew, I'm a Czech 
Jew. 

337
00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:46,440
I'm a smart. 
And he said the word Jew doesn't

338
00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:48,960
need a modifier. 
The word Jew is a standalone 

339
00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:51,440
ethnic, ethnic marker. 
And if it doesn't need a 

340
00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:53,080
modifier, then it deserves its 
own land. 

341
00:16:53,560 --> 00:16:56,680
And so the the implication of 
having your own land is how can 

342
00:16:56,680 --> 00:16:59,920
you build your own culture with 
all the wealth and the richness 

343
00:16:59,920 --> 00:17:02,920
of our accumulated culture, 
Svarti Ashkenazi But how do we 

344
00:17:02,920 --> 00:17:06,240
build a, a latent organic, 
innate Israeli culture? 

345
00:17:06,240 --> 00:17:09,359
How do we build ourselves from 
ground up, not just by 

346
00:17:09,359 --> 00:17:12,200
clustering, cobbling together 
what we picked up from the 

347
00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:15,640
countries we've been hosted by. 
So there's a lot to parse here. 

348
00:17:15,640 --> 00:17:17,560
There's a lot. 
This is really the core of this 

349
00:17:17,560 --> 00:17:19,800
of the book. 
How does our view of Jewish 

350
00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:23,359
peoplehood and of Jewish 
identity change now that we're 

351
00:17:23,359 --> 00:17:26,240
returning home? 
Very thought provoking and these

352
00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:27,920
are important questions that 
have to be asked. 

353
00:17:27,920 --> 00:17:30,960
Fantastic. 
And we also wanted to to ask you

354
00:17:30,960 --> 00:17:34,040
if you could expound on the 
chapter of land, the Land of 

355
00:17:34,040 --> 00:17:38,760
Israel, Illusion or illusion. 
Look, it's it's a. 

356
00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:41,000
It's a key Turner phrase. 
Obviously. 

357
00:17:41,680 --> 00:17:45,200
Keep in mind these articles were
written initially based on the 

358
00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:48,640
Parsa for various weekly. 
As I write for the Jerusalem 

359
00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:51,760
Post, I write for an Orthodox 
weekly in Israel called Torah 

360
00:17:51,760 --> 00:17:55,440
Tidbits put out by the OU. 
Obviously the dosage of Torah is

361
00:17:55,440 --> 00:17:57,440
different when I write for the 
post, when I write for an 

362
00:17:57,440 --> 00:18:01,800
Orthodox crowd solely, but I did
reorganize these articles into 

363
00:18:01,800 --> 00:18:03,720
topics. 
So this was a Schlach article 

364
00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:06,880
and for Parsha Schlach and I 
tried to assess like the spies 

365
00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:10,960
weren't foolish, the spies 
weren't weren't liars, they 

366
00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:13,320
weren't inaccurate. 
They reported what they saw. 

367
00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:16,040
They saw giants robbing the 
land, outsized food, people 

368
00:18:16,040 --> 00:18:18,040
diving are all around them, 
fortress cities. 

369
00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:21,680
They saw a very, very imposing 
and fearsome country. 

370
00:18:22,360 --> 00:18:25,360
And the failure was not even 
what they saw, but how they 

371
00:18:25,360 --> 00:18:27,960
interpreted it. 
And there was an illusion rather

372
00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:30,080
than an illusion. 
An illusion made them 

373
00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:32,680
frightened. 
And allusion refers to with an A

374
00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:36,400
refers to the fact that this is 
the land of Hashem and the land 

375
00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:39,920
of Hashem is supernatural and 
everything about this land will 

376
00:18:39,920 --> 00:18:41,840
be supernatural. 
The agriculture will be 

377
00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:45,240
supernatural, the fruits will be
supernatural, the fluctuations 

378
00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:47,640
will be supernatural. 
In the days of ghazal, the 

379
00:18:47,640 --> 00:18:51,160
reports about the agriculture in
Israel were phenomenal, were 

380
00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:53,920
incredulous. 
Entire fruits the size of 

381
00:18:54,080 --> 00:18:56,160
countries, of the size of 
cities, the size of homes. 

382
00:18:56,640 --> 00:18:59,400
And then when we left the land, 
Israel became a cursed land that

383
00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:02,840
couldn't be tilled and couldn't 
be, couldn't be planted for two,

384
00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:04,800
could be colonized. 
For 2000 years all the great 

385
00:19:04,800 --> 00:19:08,440
empires tried to retain colonies
in Israel and one after another 

386
00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:11,600
they failed because this is the 
land of a Kurdish barfu and 

387
00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:14,720
there's a subliminal awareness. 
Even people who don't come to 

388
00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:18,440
your podcast and the people who 
didn't learn to, yes Eva, people

389
00:19:18,560 --> 00:19:20,800
are subliminally aware this is 
the land of Hashem. 

390
00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:24,640
Kyen and Hevel the Kuiserie says
their bone of contention. 

391
00:19:24,640 --> 00:19:26,760
What are they arguing about? 
Why did Kyen murder Hevel? 

392
00:19:27,120 --> 00:19:28,920
Plenty of land to go around. 
You could have taken home. 

393
00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:30,880
New York could have taken the 
United States. 

394
00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:33,120
You take the United States, I'll
take Russia and Europe. 

395
00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:35,440
They were fighting over our 
bite. 

396
00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:38,480
They wanted Israel. 
Everyone knew that the rest of 

397
00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:41,960
the land made no difference but 
the land where life began and 

398
00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:44,640
where life will end, where 
history began and history will 

399
00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:47,400
end, that was prime real estate,
and it was worth the kind to 

400
00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:49,720
murder his brother over that 
prime real estate. 

401
00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:53,120
The spy saw giants, as I'll tell
us. 

402
00:19:53,120 --> 00:19:56,480
Those were the giants from 
partial that met children of God

403
00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:58,920
who came from heaven. 
Somehow these children of God 

404
00:19:58,920 --> 00:20:01,080
who fell from heaven in the end 
of the partial separation 

405
00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:03,560
migrated their way to Eretz 
Israel and lived in Eretz 

406
00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:05,240
Israel. 
Those are the giants that they 

407
00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:08,280
saw in the land. 
And this should have alerted 

408
00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:09,680
them that this is the land of 
Hashem. 

409
00:20:10,280 --> 00:20:12,440
So now that you face that 
prospect, living the land of 

410
00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:14,320
Hashem, it's going to come with 
a price tag. 

411
00:20:14,320 --> 00:20:16,400
It's going to be more 
challenging to live in Israel 

412
00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:18,040
than to live in Brooklyn. 
It's going to be more 

413
00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:20,720
challenging to live not just 
because of the giants and 

414
00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:22,880
because of the fortresses and 
because of the agricultural 

415
00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:24,160
fluctuations. 
Because you're living in the 

416
00:20:24,160 --> 00:20:27,400
presence of Hashem. 
That land won't admit evil or 

417
00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:29,920
moral failure. 
It's parshad Vieira. 

418
00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:32,960
So I promise you the sins of 
stone, we're not as severe as 

419
00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:35,520
the sins of the Mobil. 
Since the Mobil were Molarz, 

420
00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:38,320
Hamas, since the stone, we're 
right in the Qatar. 

421
00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:40,520
What does the Ramban say? 
Yeah, But if you're living in 

422
00:20:40,520 --> 00:20:43,400
Israel, the margin of error is 
much less that you're living in 

423
00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:46,160
Israel. 
So that land can't tolerate. 

424
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:49,200
As we see, the land will spit 
out those who And slowly but 

425
00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:51,800
surely the land is in our days 
spitting out murderers and 

426
00:20:51,800 --> 00:20:54,600
spitting out rapists and 
spitting out people to fall. 

427
00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:56,480
I think the land is spitting out
from us. 

428
00:20:56,720 --> 00:20:59,720
We're helping the land spit them
out, but the land is spitting 

429
00:20:59,720 --> 00:21:02,880
out people who abuse its moral 
code and its moral sensitivity. 

430
00:21:03,360 --> 00:21:06,760
So facing this prospect, you 
could either shrink and shrivel 

431
00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:10,040
and say I can't, or you can say,
oh, this is the land of Hashem. 

432
00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:12,560
Where's your courage? 
Where's your backbone? 

433
00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:15,040
Where's your strength? 
How can you rise to the 

434
00:21:15,040 --> 00:21:17,480
challenge which is not just 
defeating giants and fortress 

435
00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:19,520
cities, but there's moral 
challenges to living in Israel. 

436
00:21:19,520 --> 00:21:23,000
It's not easy to live in Israel.
I think the fact that Israelis 

437
00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:24,880
are so what's what I'm looking 
for? 

438
00:21:24,880 --> 00:21:29,880
Brass and self confident and 
stubborn and hosmedic. 

439
00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:32,760
Because you live in the presence
of Hashem, it's going to affect 

440
00:21:32,760 --> 00:21:34,640
you. 
Living underneath Hashem is 

441
00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:37,240
going to affect your person. 
That's going to make you into a 

442
00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:39,560
stronger person. 
And that strength can either be 

443
00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:41,880
used in a pious way, it could be
used in a brush way. 

444
00:21:42,280 --> 00:21:45,040
But they they reached the wrong 
conclusion. 

445
00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:47,520
And I'm trying to give people a 
sense not to back away from the 

446
00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:49,480
challenge of Israel. 
I want I want to be an honest 

447
00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:51,920
book. 
Life in Israel has its redeeming

448
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:55,360
qualities, goes with meaning. 
But let's face it, the economy 

449
00:21:55,360 --> 00:21:57,520
is tough, security situation is 
tough. 

450
00:21:57,880 --> 00:22:00,600
Living with other Jews is tough.
There are a lot of challenges to

451
00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:05,160
living in Israel and God wants 
tough people to live in his land

452
00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:08,200
and to face the metaphoric 
giants who roam the land. 

453
00:22:08,560 --> 00:22:12,760
So I try to create a a space for
people to acknowledge what life 

454
00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:15,520
in Israel is about. 
But some encourage and and 

455
00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:18,600
vision to be able to to to rise 
to that challenge. 

456
00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:24,640
Beautifully said. 
Moving on to another chapter 

457
00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:29,680
that we really enjoyed is the 
blood libels and the Perversion 

458
00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:32,680
of Jewish values. 
So if you could tell us about 

459
00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:35,280
about that? 
Well, I actually looked at your 

460
00:22:35,280 --> 00:22:37,000
website. 
It's a beautifully done website,

461
00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:39,240
nice design. 
And I saw that you featured 

462
00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:41,080
Revised Axe right on the front 
cover. 

463
00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:44,080
Yes, on the front cover, yeah. 
So he's obviously someone who 

464
00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:45,800
I'm sad that I didn't have much 
content. 

465
00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:50,840
I think I shake his hand once, 
but I list him actually in my 

466
00:22:50,840 --> 00:22:54,800
introduction as one of my 
inspirations because I think he 

467
00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:59,480
did a a very elegant job in 
restoring our universalist voice

468
00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,480
through a people that had been 
very parochial and inward for 

469
00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:04,360
2000 years. 
For 2000 years, Jewish 

470
00:23:04,360 --> 00:23:06,240
universalism was a was a bad 
joke. 

471
00:23:06,560 --> 00:23:09,240
We're being murdered and haunted
and discriminated against and 

472
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:10,560
hated. 
What does it mean for us to have

473
00:23:10,560 --> 00:23:11,920
the message for those that hated
us? 

474
00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:14,800
We tried to survive now that 
we've returned to people and to 

475
00:23:14,800 --> 00:23:17,840
identity and we sacks tried to 
remind us that our story is 

476
00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:20,920
their story and that we have a 
message for humanity and it's 

477
00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:22,960
intertwined with our destiny and
our mission. 

478
00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:28,360
And I say this because one of 
the areas that he both battled 

479
00:23:28,360 --> 00:23:31,520
against and articulated with 
anti-Semitism, he battled 

480
00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:34,080
courageously against that this 
semitism and he wrote 

481
00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:37,680
extensively and helped us 
because knowledge is power. 

482
00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:40,520
When I write, I don't try to 
introduce new ideas. 

483
00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:43,360
I try to organize and clarify 
ideas that are latent. 

484
00:23:43,360 --> 00:23:46,960
That info hate because when we 
know what's happening, then 

485
00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:48,840
sometimes it gives, it makes us 
feel empowered. 

486
00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:51,720
When we feel overwhelmed and 
confused, then we feel 

487
00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:54,280
powerless. 
So I don't have solutions, I 

488
00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:57,120
just have. 
I try to provide clarity and 

489
00:23:57,120 --> 00:23:59,800
organization, and I think Rebel 
Sacks did that by articulating 

490
00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:03,280
anti-Semitism and he referred to
it as a virus, compared it to a 

491
00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:06,240
virus, and a virus mutates. 
A mutating virus, right? 

492
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:08,720
Is that what he called it? 
Mutating virus? 

493
00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:11,200
Yeah. 
And his point was that in each 

494
00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:13,920
generation it takes a different 
form as viruses do. 

495
00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:16,480
So it started as the hatred 
towards monothea. 

496
00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:18,640
So that was very low lying 
anti-Semitism. 

497
00:24:18,640 --> 00:24:21,880
The paganus didn't really 
despise us as monotheists 

498
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:25,120
because we just represented 
another God and heaven was a 

499
00:24:25,120 --> 00:24:29,200
carnival of many gods, so we 
didn't upend their system. 

500
00:24:29,360 --> 00:24:32,320
So there's the Jewish God, and 
the Jewish God can coexist with 

501
00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:34,600
all the other gods. 
But once the world turned 

502
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:38,360
monotheistic with Christianity 
in the 4th century, Rome becomes

503
00:24:38,360 --> 00:24:40,840
Christian, 7th century Islam 
emerges. 

504
00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:44,280
So then because we are the 
people of the Bible, 

505
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:47,120
Christianity has its approach. 
They can see there were the 

506
00:24:47,120 --> 00:24:49,160
people the Bible, but we're 
condemned because we didn't 

507
00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:52,760
accept Jesus Islam and it's a 
very different form of rejecting

508
00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:54,680
the Bible. 
Islam reinterprets the Bible. 

509
00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:57,800
Remember, in Islam it's not 
Yitzhak, but you smile who's 

510
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:00,240
only al Qaeda. 
That's a very, very different. 

511
00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:02,600
I write about this a lot in the 
second volume, not in this book 

512
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:06,600
about how the attack of 
Christianity is different from 

513
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,960
the attack where the denial of 
Islam because they're working on

514
00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:11,800
the very, very different 
systems. 

515
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:15,920
And you look at the parting 
between Ishmael and Yitzhak in 

516
00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:19,240
Parshad Vayara and the parting 
between Yaakov and ESAV in 

517
00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:21,240
Parshad Vayashlaf. 
It's very different. 

518
00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:24,360
And those are the intersections 
between Judaism and Islam, 

519
00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:27,520
Vayara and Judaism and 
Christianity in Parshad 

520
00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:29,120
Vayashlaf. 
But that's that's for a 

521
00:25:29,120 --> 00:25:32,320
different conversation. 
Now, what happened was around 

522
00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:36,560
the 11th century, 10th century, 
Christianity finally got its sea

523
00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:38,160
legs. 
Remember Christianity, it's not 

524
00:25:38,160 --> 00:25:40,360
like someone blew the whistle 
and said now we're Christian. 

525
00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:43,440
It took a while for them to 
articulate their ideas, to 

526
00:25:43,440 --> 00:25:46,200
develop their theology, to 
develop what their belief system

527
00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:51,000
around not 9th, 10th century 
Christianity becomes very stable

528
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:52,880
and solid. 
Then they go on the attack 

529
00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:56,360
against Judaism and that's the 
manifestation of which is the 

530
00:25:56,360 --> 00:25:59,000
Crusades in the end of the 11th 
century, 10th 96. 

531
00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:02,640
That's the opening bell of 
institutionalized Christian 

532
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,520
anti-Semitism over the next 1000
years. 

533
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:08,640
That's when it really begins, 
which is why we adopt Sphere to 

534
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:10,320
Omer. 
If not for the Crusades, we 

535
00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:12,800
wouldn't have Sphere to Omer. 
Sphere to Omer is not just 

536
00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:15,000
because we became a law 24,000 
to meet him. 

537
00:26:15,200 --> 00:26:18,760
Sphere to Omer is because 1000 
years later we suffered at the 

538
00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:20,600
hands of the Crusades, and 
that's why it became such a 

539
00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:26,840
powerful and forceful minute. 
Now there their mutation was 

540
00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:29,560
that we were the killers of 
Jesus, which is a baseless lie. 

541
00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:31,360
It's been debunked and 
disproved. 

542
00:26:31,360 --> 00:26:34,360
In 1965, even the Catholic 
Church admitted that we didn't 

543
00:26:34,360 --> 00:26:37,320
kill Jesus. 
Then there was a sub narrative 

544
00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:39,600
to the narrative. 
The sub narrative to the 

545
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:43,040
narrative were the bloodlines. 
We didn't just kill Jesus 1000 

546
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:45,920
years beforehand, but we 
reenacted that and called the 

547
00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:48,800
Eucharist and we drank Christian
blood and we enacted the 

548
00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:50,560
crucifixion again on Christian 
children. 

549
00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:54,160
And that became, of course, the 
baseline for so many programs 

550
00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:56,360
and blood libels and baseless 
murders and hatred and 

551
00:26:56,360 --> 00:26:59,880
discrimination. 
Now, I don't believe anything in

552
00:26:59,880 --> 00:27:03,880
Jewish history is incidental. 
And as I implied earlier, if I 

553
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:06,960
can attach it to sources and 
attach it to Torah and attach it

554
00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:10,120
to a Madrid and attach it, then 
people realize Jewish history is

555
00:27:10,120 --> 00:27:12,280
not incidental. 
We're living through prophecies.

556
00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:14,200
And of course, once we know 
we're living through prophecy, 

557
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:16,240
we know it's going to end 
because we know how prophecies 

558
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:19,560
end. 
To me, this is an inversion of 

559
00:27:19,560 --> 00:27:21,440
what we stand for. 
We're not allowed to drink 

560
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:24,320
blood. 
Jews, how how many efforts do we

561
00:27:24,320 --> 00:27:26,240
take just to clean the liver to 
catch your liver? 

562
00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:28,000
So we're going to have to have 
liver on job list. 

563
00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:30,080
How hard do we work to salt the 
chickens? 

564
00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:31,760
How hard did your grandmother 
work in Egypt? 

565
00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:34,160
Where is she from to salt the 
chicken because she couldn't 

566
00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:37,280
process it in a, in a butcher? 
And not only we don't drink 

567
00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:39,600
blood, but we have such respect 
for the dignity of the human 

568
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:41,400
body. 
Judaism doesn't. 

569
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:44,440
I know this is more of a 
philosophical podcast. 

570
00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:46,160
So Judaism doesn't believe in 
dualism. 

571
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:49,520
There's no body cells split when
I perform a midst of my whole 

572
00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:51,160
body's immerse, not just my 
spirit. 

573
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:53,640
When I sin, it's my spirit that 
also sins. 

574
00:27:54,120 --> 00:27:57,000
Dualism is the death knell of 
religion because once you split 

575
00:27:57,160 --> 00:27:59,720
religion, you split God. 
You split forces in heaven. 

576
00:27:59,840 --> 00:28:02,400
It's Satan, it's God, it's good,
it's evil, it's dark and light, 

577
00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:04,040
and the whole religion becomes a
comic book. 

578
00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:07,480
There's one God, He made me one 
like him. 

579
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:12,320
I'm monistic, I'm one person. 
I'm at fault when I failed, and 

580
00:28:12,320 --> 00:28:16,280
I'm credit when I succeed. 
And because of that, Salaam 

581
00:28:16,280 --> 00:28:19,520
Elokim is not just my spirit, my
intelligence, my creativity, my 

582
00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:21,400
emotions, my dreams, my 
consciousness. 

583
00:28:21,720 --> 00:28:24,320
So like, it was also my fingers,
my nose, my eyes, my head. 

584
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:28,000
And that's why we're so careful 
and delicate about the dignity 

585
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:30,280
we show human bodies, especially
after they die. 

586
00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:33,320
And as a subplot, that's what's 
part of this battle after 

587
00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:35,520
October 7th with the culture 
that defiled bodies and 

588
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:37,760
desecrated bodies. 
That's not our conversation 

589
00:28:37,760 --> 00:28:40,760
right now. 
So I always imagine the Jews 

590
00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:44,520
returning home from shul in 
Europe, not your ancestors, but 

591
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:48,600
the Ashkenazic ancestors, and 
they just read Akharimo, 

592
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:50,960
Kidoshim and Emor. 
You know how many times the 

593
00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:53,240
prohibition to drink blood 
appears in those three partios? 

594
00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:56,000
That's such an interesting ad 
nauseam. 

595
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:57,400
I was not ad nauseam, Pastor 
Schoen. 

596
00:28:57,400 --> 00:28:58,960
But it's just it repeats again 
and again. 

597
00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:01,440
And as they're walking home, 
they're being accused of 

598
00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:06,080
drinking blood. 
Now that's the Pasok in Parshad 

599
00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:09,720
Quitobo that you'll be a mashal 
and Mashina Vitan, the Mashala 

600
00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:11,800
volitionina been there. 
You become a stigma. 

601
00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:14,040
You become a you become a what's
what I'm looking about 

602
00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:15,720
caricature. 
You'll be meme. 

603
00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:18,760
They. 
Call it today. 

604
00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:22,040
Yeah, meme. 
Yeah, you become a scapegoat. 

605
00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:25,520
So this is exactly what Hashem 
promised us if we failed Him, 

606
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:28,800
and this is coming true. 
So the ability to see 

607
00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:32,320
prophecies, not just the glowing
radiant ones, but the dark ones 

608
00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:35,160
coming true reminds us that 
every step we take is through 

609
00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:37,600
the lines of the Tanakh, that 
we're not working. 

610
00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:39,600
As much as you may feel you're 
living in a modern world of 

611
00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:42,840
Internet and podcasts and iced 
coffee and Mets and Yankees 

612
00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:46,920
beneath the shell of it. 
This is part of Hashem's 

613
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:50,280
prophetic world. 
And every step you take, a 

614
00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:53,120
decision you make, has prophetic
implications and ramifications. 

615
00:29:53,520 --> 00:29:56,960
So it's not just that the irony 
of history, but the irony of 

616
00:29:56,960 --> 00:30:00,160
history is already predicted in 
the Tohra pashad Ki Tavo. 

617
00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:03,080
And that gives us a comfort 
level that we're in the pocket 

618
00:30:03,080 --> 00:30:05,160
of Tanak. 
Sometimes those pockets are 

619
00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:08,280
harsh and authority, but we're 
always in that pocket. 

620
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:15,360
Very interesting that that 
edition of the the comic book, 

621
00:30:15,640 --> 00:30:20,560
the the comic book and the the 
fact that the par shield where 

622
00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:24,640
it it would have to take place 
having to talk about not not the

623
00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:26,960
drinking blood. 
It's just, it's amazing. 

624
00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:28,920
No, I got me wrong. 
I like comic books. 

625
00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:33,360
Also, I'm an expert in Archie. 
These are important things to 

626
00:30:33,360 --> 00:30:36,080
mention. 
We have to we have to mature our

627
00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:39,880
perspective on Judaism. 
It's very important and 

628
00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:43,480
something which that that's part
of what we're trying to do in 

629
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:46,280
the podcast, you know, make it 
less of more, less of a comic 

630
00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:49,360
book and more mature 
understanding of Judaism. 

631
00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:50,720
That's that's what it's really 
about. 

632
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:55,800
And if you can discuss the 
chapter Muted Messianicism and 

633
00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:58,120
Messianic Sabotage. 
Yeah, those are two chapters. 

634
00:30:58,120 --> 00:30:59,440
Two chapters. 
My apologies. 

635
00:30:59,600 --> 00:31:01,520
Yeah. 
Treat them in chapters again, 

636
00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:02,760
just so. 
No one should be frightened. 

637
00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:05,040
These chapters are about a page 
and a half long and one of the 

638
00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:08,120
articles that be accessible. 
And I think that part, hopefully

639
00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:11,800
part of the allure of the book 
is that it condenses meaningful 

640
00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:15,160
ideas, sophisticated ideas, but 
in accessible fashion. 

641
00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:19,440
So even though I organize the 
chapters based on topic, there's

642
00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:21,120
an index in the back based on 
parsha. 

643
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:23,400
So you can sell it's parsha 
vaira. 

644
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:25,880
What two or three, three page 
chapters can I read that will 

645
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:29,520
enhance or live, lend historical
framing to my Shabbat? 

646
00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:31,640
And by the way, also, I don't 
know how many listeners you 

647
00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:35,040
have, because I believe I wrote 
the book initially to develop a 

648
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:37,880
vocabulary and to develop a 
sophisticated conversation about

649
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:39,120
issues we have no tradition 
about. 

650
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:44,880
As I alluded to earlier, as the 
process went on, it dawned on 

651
00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:49,320
me, I think that 80% of the 
Jewish people believe in 80% of 

652
00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:53,000
the same ideas about redemption.
And instead of honing in on the 

653
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:56,840
80% that unifies us, we argue 
about the 20% that divides us. 

654
00:31:57,360 --> 00:31:59,720
Namely, as I said earlier, we 
all believe that the return of 

655
00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:02,320
the Jewish people is meaningful.
We all believe that the 

656
00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:04,760
repopulation and the 
refertilization of Israel is 

657
00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:06,320
meaningful. 
We all believe the Holocaust is 

658
00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:09,120
a major shift in history. 
We all, well, we disagree 

659
00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:11,880
whether we call it Rishabhi 
khagulatane or not, we disagree 

660
00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:14,600
whether secular government is an
agent and instrument of Hashem. 

661
00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:19,760
So I really wanted this book to 
be a Commonwealth for all Jews 

662
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:22,880
of all different opinions, even 
Orthodox. 

663
00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:25,160
I don't like the word ultra. 
I'm an ultra Orthodox Jew, 

664
00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:27,280
Kharadi. 
Every Jew has to be ultra 

665
00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:29,880
Orthodox, Kharidi, reform 
conservative. 

666
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:32,920
I really want people to gather 
around this campfire of ideas. 

667
00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:36,880
And for that reason, I wrote the
book in Ashkenazis, not 

668
00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:39,080
Savarddate. 
Even though I'm Israeli, I come 

669
00:32:39,080 --> 00:32:40,680
from Brooklyn, I speak 
Ashkenazis. 

670
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:43,320
So it wasn't pandering or 
misrepresenting myself. 

671
00:32:43,720 --> 00:32:46,240
But I know there's a large group
of people, I don't know if they,

672
00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:49,240
those who listen to your 
podcast, large group of people 

673
00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:52,880
who are in the world that speaks
Ashkenazis and don't define 

674
00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:56,040
themselves in in, let's say, a 
Zionist, but absent of those 

675
00:32:56,040 --> 00:32:57,560
labels. 
I think you mentioned before 

676
00:32:57,560 --> 00:32:58,920
that you're a Seinfeld fan, 
right? 

677
00:33:00,520 --> 00:33:03,760
So I'm not such a bit, actually.
I've seen many Seinfelds for all

678
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:05,160
sorts of reasons. 
If you think about some other 

679
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:08,680
time, I think it's a, it's a 
show that it's had a lot of 

680
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:11,240
humor, but subliminal messages 
that could be sometimes 

681
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:13,360
destructive and disruptive to 
moral conduct. 

682
00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:15,800
But we could talk about that 
some other time. 

683
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:19,640
But someone once mentioned to me
that there was a episode, I 

684
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:22,480
think I then looked it up on 
YouTube, where one of the 

685
00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:26,160
characters attended a rally and 
you wanted to rally, I think on 

686
00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:28,840
behalf of AIDS, on behalf of, 
and they wanted to wear the 

687
00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:31,880
ribbon or to wear the button. 
And there was a whole fight in 

688
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:33,760
Fracas that broke out 'cause 
they didn't want to wear the 

689
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:36,200
ribbon and yes, wear the ribbon.
And then it's stupidity of 

690
00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:37,400
Steinfeld. 
They started arguing about a 

691
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:41,200
stuck in a ribbon anyway. 
But it's very metaphoric 'cause 

692
00:33:41,200 --> 00:33:44,760
I think many people believe in 
value systems and movements, but

693
00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:46,800
they don't want to be identified
with the movement. 

694
00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:49,800
Cause the identification with 
the movement creates all sorts 

695
00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:52,520
of peripheral issues that they 
may agree or disagree with. 

696
00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:55,240
And I think this book, I would 
call it, if not reclaiming 

697
00:33:55,240 --> 00:33:57,200
redemption, I would call it Take
Off the Ribbon. 

698
00:33:57,640 --> 00:34:00,960
You don't have to identify 
yourself as a Zionist or as a 

699
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:03,280
religious Zionist. 
Stop identification. 

700
00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:05,920
There are deep values, their 
historic values, they're larger 

701
00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:07,560
than life. 
They're larger than any moment 

702
00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:09,320
in history. 
And then how can you tap into 

703
00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:12,159
eternity rather than chasing 
transients? 

704
00:34:12,159 --> 00:34:14,400
Sometimes we trace transients 
rather than tapping into 

705
00:34:14,400 --> 00:34:16,639
eternity. 
So that's just a long winded 

706
00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:20,280
introduction for the second 
agenda of my book. 

707
00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:23,440
I would like people to read it 
beyond the normal community that

708
00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:26,560
I live in. 
You mentioned muted messianism 

709
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:30,120
and sabotage messianism. 
This is almost self critique. 

710
00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:32,679
This is why aren't there more 
spirem like this? 

711
00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:35,520
Why am I writing this? 
Chapter by the way, this is like

712
00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:38,719
a so interesting, but go on. 
Well, what did? 

713
00:34:38,920 --> 00:34:40,920
Well, what did you financing? 
I've done most of the talking, 

714
00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:43,440
so why don't you? 
No, I just, I just found, I just

715
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:48,000
found it refreshing to hear, you
know, critiques of the way we've

716
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:52,080
gone about our mess, you know, 
like messianic fervor and how 

717
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:54,800
you know it's misplaced and it's
often misguided. 

718
00:34:54,800 --> 00:34:57,320
So I, I, I can't articulate it 
the way you did. 

719
00:34:57,320 --> 00:34:59,800
So, and I know there's short 
chapters, but you know, I, I 

720
00:34:59,800 --> 00:35:01,960
would, we love to hear, you 
know, your take. 

721
00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:05,200
Oh look, I don't have to tell 
you that intellectual honesty is

722
00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:07,600
a baseline of identity. 
And if you're not able to 

723
00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:10,320
critique yourself, you're not 
able to be honest with yourself.

724
00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:11,880
And if you're not honest, you 
can't acquire. 

725
00:35:12,240 --> 00:35:15,480
This is a podcast that's geared 
towards acquiring information 

726
00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:17,200
and internalizing ideas and 
belief. 

727
00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:20,400
You can't internalize unless you
have a baseline of what you 

728
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:21,920
believe. 
You see something new, a new 

729
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:23,200
paradigm. 
You question whether it makes 

730
00:35:23,200 --> 00:35:26,040
sense, it doesn't make sense, 
and you try to reconcile it with

731
00:35:26,040 --> 00:35:28,600
your with your. 
If that probing doesn't take 

732
00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:31,400
place and there's no 
questioning, then information 

733
00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:33,760
hovers above identity rather 
than being latched onto 

734
00:35:33,760 --> 00:35:36,120
identity. 
So part of intellectual honesty 

735
00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:38,800
is self critique and self 
critique in every area of life. 

736
00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:43,440
It's a doubt for the for the 
regular person is integrity for 

737
00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:45,120
the layman. 
Doubt for the layman is 

738
00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:47,240
integrity for the scholar. 
Excuse me, If you're a layman, 

739
00:35:47,240 --> 00:35:49,040
you're afraid of doubt. 
If you're a scholar, you embrace

740
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:53,000
doubt because doubt is what is 
what checks your accuracy. 

741
00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:57,120
So part of the reason that our 
tradition has been so 

742
00:35:58,600 --> 00:36:02,440
predisposed against it. 
Yaakov wanted to provide a road 

743
00:36:02,440 --> 00:36:06,480
map of Mashiach, and as I'll say
that his prophetic vision was 

744
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:09,360
taken from him, impartial by 
Yafi and Daniel. 

745
00:36:09,640 --> 00:36:10,800
The prophet will live to the 
next scene. 

746
00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:13,160
Remember, these are two seams of
history, SE AM. 

747
00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:15,640
They're not just indiscriminate 
moments in history. 

748
00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:19,080
Yaakov is about to descend into 
the first exile impartial by 

749
00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:22,640
Yafi, and he wants to tell 
people how history will end to 

750
00:36:23,960 --> 00:36:27,520
to improve their spirit because 
they're facing a dark exile. 

751
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:31,120
Danielle is standing in Bevel 
and he also wants to give people

752
00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:33,600
a road map to the end. 
He has these dreams that are 

753
00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:36,000
almost begging him to provide 
that road map. 

754
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:39,080
And then an Angel comes, says, 
no, keep it, keep it at a 

755
00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:42,200
distance, keep it concealed, 
keep it cryptic. 

756
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:45,560
And the irony is the person, at 
least in the Hamas, probably 

757
00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:49,080
even in Tanakh, that provides 
the most concrete set of details

758
00:36:49,080 --> 00:36:52,200
is Billa Billa Marasa. 
In Prasad Bullock, we actually 

759
00:36:52,200 --> 00:36:55,080
mentioned Zakrita Yamim as 
Yaakov does, but then he gives 

760
00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:57,360
the detail. 
Yaakov says Akritaya mimin, then

761
00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:01,760
retreats Bilim says Akritaya 
mimin, Miyakov, Kamchev and 

762
00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:04,640
Misrael, Many of the famous 
verses of Akritaya mimin. 

763
00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:06,720
Why were we so predisposed 
again? 

764
00:37:06,720 --> 00:37:12,760
So basically 3 reasons #1 the 
primary one, because a messianic

765
00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:15,880
intoxication can boomerang 
because it raises expectations 

766
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:18,120
of utopia. 
And while his expectations are 

767
00:37:18,120 --> 00:37:22,760
dashed, people become 
demoralized and dispirited and 

768
00:37:22,760 --> 00:37:27,080
fall Into Darkness and despair. 
And that's, that's a quick loss 

769
00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:30,600
of the 17th and 18th century in 
Ashkenazic Europe, where close 

770
00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:37,280
to 1/3 or 1/2 of jury fell prey 
to the Shabtai's promises of a 

771
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:39,480
better world than he was the 
Mashiach. 

772
00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:42,480
And, and it wasn't just the 
immediate fallout that people 

773
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:44,800
lost their possessions and 
traveled to Israel to join the 

774
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:49,160
Shabtai. 
I mean, Ashkenazic jury in the 

775
00:37:49,160 --> 00:37:51,640
18th century was torn apart by 
Sabathianism. 

776
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:53,840
You couldn't breathe without 
being accused of being a 

777
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:55,520
Sabathianist. 
You couldn't enter a show if you

778
00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:57,640
were a Sabathianist. 
Certain shows you couldn't enter

779
00:37:57,640 --> 00:38:00,120
unless you were a Sabathianist. 
You couldn't get a rabbinic 

780
00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:02,640
position unless you were. 
It was horrible. 

781
00:38:02,640 --> 00:38:05,520
It was a worse period, 17 
hundreds, 18th century. 

782
00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:09,600
And that's how Hasidut tried to 
recover in part, Jewish pride, 

783
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:11,960
Jewish joy, Jewish happiness, 
Jewish optimism. 

784
00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:15,680
So, so much of messianic 
expectations can boomerang when 

785
00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:19,320
they're not met. 
The second reason is that 

786
00:38:19,560 --> 00:38:23,520
Judaism is always perched on a 
very tenuous balance between the

787
00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:26,800
here and the other. 
Now the here is we embrace this 

788
00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:28,120
world. 
We embrace the challenges. 

789
00:38:28,120 --> 00:38:32,000
We don't flee or or or or 
retreat from responsibility, 

790
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:35,400
from our community, from voting,
from building a better world and

791
00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:38,520
serving on a podcast and being a
doctor for whatever we feel the 

792
00:38:38,520 --> 00:38:41,280
world needs. 
But we try not to become too 

793
00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:44,160
entangled in this world. 
We try to almost split our 

794
00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:47,000
minds, split view. 
We live in this world, but we be

795
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:49,280
stride in other world. 
Now that other world is 

796
00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:52,080
sometimes the afterlife. 
We always think about how our 

797
00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:54,480
actions in this world will 
affect our afterlife. 

798
00:38:54,760 --> 00:38:56,760
This is just an entranceway or a
veranda. 

799
00:38:56,760 --> 00:38:59,720
However you interpret Prosdar, 
the next World is the palace, is

800
00:38:59,720 --> 00:39:02,080
the tracklin. 
So everyone has to accept that 

801
00:39:02,080 --> 00:39:03,880
hierarchy. 
This is not the eternal world. 

802
00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:06,560
This is just a pregame. 
How invested are you in the 

803
00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:08,680
pregame? 
Some people ignore the pregame. 

804
00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:11,360
Some people invest in the 
pregame so that others can enjoy

805
00:39:11,360 --> 00:39:15,480
it after we've left this track, 
this passageway, but we never 

806
00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:19,360
one of the I tell my students 
all the time, one of the basic, 

807
00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:22,680
basic contrast that you have to 
live your life by is the 

808
00:39:22,680 --> 00:39:25,360
contrast between, as I said 
before, eternity and transients.

809
00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:27,280
What's eternal? 
What's transient? 

810
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:30,560
What's Netsah, What's now? 
I'm not going to tell you how 

811
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:33,560
much to invest in SHA and how 
much you invest in Netsah, but 

812
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:35,000
at least you need those 
coordinates. 

813
00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:38,600
You need to know what is long 
term, what a short term, even in

814
00:39:38,600 --> 00:39:41,400
this world, short term, long 
term allocation is crucial. 

815
00:39:41,640 --> 00:39:43,640
But certainly when it comes to 
the world we'll inhabit for 

816
00:39:43,640 --> 00:39:46,840
millions of years, as opposed to
the world we'll inhabit for 120 

817
00:39:46,840 --> 00:39:50,960
years at most, that sectioning 
and partitioning is crucial. 

818
00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:54,160
But the other other we live in, 
not just we live in this world 

819
00:39:54,160 --> 00:39:56,520
and all I'm about, we also live 
in this world and the next World

820
00:39:56,520 --> 00:39:58,640
that we dream of. 
The world the Machaaf, the world

821
00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:01,840
of Utopia, the world of the 
world we're trying to we believe

822
00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:04,240
we'll be born into. 
Mashiach is not the same as 

823
00:40:04,240 --> 00:40:05,600
Allahabad. 
There's a period called the 

824
00:40:05,600 --> 00:40:08,880
Messianic Era that will all be 
resuscitated and lived through 

825
00:40:08,880 --> 00:40:11,160
Jewish sovereignty, the golden 
era of Jewish history. 

826
00:40:11,880 --> 00:40:14,520
So too much messianism can 
become escapism. 

827
00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:19,080
You're so attuned to the next, 
to the other world, to the next 

828
00:40:19,080 --> 00:40:21,960
World, whether that's Mashiach 
or Allahabad, that you escape 

829
00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:23,560
from responsibilities in this 
world. 

830
00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:26,280
A lot of the Near Eastern 
religions are escapist 

831
00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:29,480
religions. 
Nirvana, just to slowly 

832
00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:31,480
extinguish yourself and flee 
from. 

833
00:40:31,880 --> 00:40:35,240
And you see, those are 
backwards, regressive, static 

834
00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:38,160
cultures because there's no 
movement, there's no dynamism, 

835
00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:40,600
there's no growth, there's no 
Jews are always at the forefront

836
00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:43,920
of science and progress and 
innovation and technology 

837
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:46,240
because we embrace this world. 
We want to improve it. 

838
00:40:46,280 --> 00:40:47,560
She wants us to live in this 
world. 

839
00:40:47,560 --> 00:40:50,400
And Shem cares about whether I 
have indoor plumbing or not. 

840
00:40:50,840 --> 00:40:53,160
Even though you may not think 
that a transcendent God would 

841
00:40:53,160 --> 00:40:54,920
care about indoor pluffing, He 
does. 

842
00:40:55,040 --> 00:40:57,800
He wants me to enjoy my life. 
And if I'm a plumber, that's the

843
00:40:57,800 --> 00:40:59,360
will of a sham. 
And if I'm a surgeon, that's the

844
00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:01,400
will of a sham. 
And if I'm a scientist, that's 

845
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:03,720
the will of a sham. 
So that's the second reason. 

846
00:41:03,720 --> 00:41:06,480
Because I didn't want to direct 
their attention to the other 

847
00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:09,400
away from the here and now. 
There's a very powerful phrase. 

848
00:41:09,400 --> 00:41:12,560
It's based on the last word in 
parshat aekev Sharon rosheim. 

849
00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:14,320
It's a prahayom. 
It's the end. 

850
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:19,440
Hayom la sotam mahalaka belsara.
You focus on today, 1 foot ahead

851
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:21,560
of the other. 
Whatever happens in the future, 

852
00:41:22,120 --> 00:41:23,880
let leave that for their Bono 
show, The One. 

853
00:41:25,200 --> 00:41:29,160
A perfect, if I may, a perfect 
balance of what you're saying. 

854
00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:33,040
I'm reminded of the, of the 
story with Honey and Miguel when

855
00:41:33,040 --> 00:41:37,160
he meets the old man and the old
man is planting a carrot tree 

856
00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:43,840
and honey because honey is a 
very, he's described as, you 

857
00:41:43,840 --> 00:41:47,880
know, immediate gratification 
type of character within the 

858
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:50,120
Hazel's world. 
So he goes, he's like, why are 

859
00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:51,640
you planning? 
Like it's going to take so many.

860
00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:52,960
You're never, you're never going
to see the tree. 

861
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:55,400
And he goes, I'm, I'm not 
planting the tree for, for 

862
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:57,160
myself. 
I'm planting it for my children 

863
00:41:57,560 --> 00:42:00,640
and for my grandchildren and 
their grandchildren after me. 

864
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:05,120
You just see a beautiful balance
between taking responsibility in

865
00:42:05,120 --> 00:42:08,280
the now, right? 
But but also within that 

866
00:42:08,280 --> 00:42:10,520
responsibility of the now 
planting for the future. 

867
00:42:11,200 --> 00:42:13,560
So I just thought it was a 
beautiful balance described in 

868
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:16,840
in that story with how you're 
you're trying to portray it. 

869
00:42:17,360 --> 00:42:21,000
And also if, if I would like our
listeners to, if they haven't 

870
00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:23,440
tuned into this episode, we did 
an episode with the Professor 

871
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:27,160
Kent Seeskin on messianism and 
the age of despair. 

872
00:42:27,160 --> 00:42:30,000
Is that what the in in the age 
of despair? 

873
00:42:30,080 --> 00:42:31,880
It's basically exactly what 
you're talking about. 

874
00:42:31,880 --> 00:42:33,600
Just he expands on on those 
ideas. 

875
00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:36,480
How throughout history, Hazal, 
the rabbi's have been very 

876
00:42:36,680 --> 00:42:40,480
careful about even in the 
Talmud, like kind of toning down

877
00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:43,960
the the fervor when it when when
sometimes it gets too far. 

878
00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:47,320
So, and I appreciate that 
because we live in a time now, I

879
00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:49,360
think there's a lot of generally
there's a lot of confusion. 

880
00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:51,200
We're going to be doing an 
episode on this with, with 

881
00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:54,800
another guest. 
But people conflate Ulan Haba 

882
00:42:54,800 --> 00:42:59,960
with with, you know, Zaman 
Mashiach and and, and becomes 

883
00:42:59,960 --> 00:43:00,840
one. 
Yeah, exactly. 

884
00:43:00,880 --> 00:43:05,800
Like, so so you hear just things
like innocently, but like, oh, 

885
00:43:05,800 --> 00:43:08,600
someone who loses a family 
member will say, you know, I 

886
00:43:08,600 --> 00:43:11,400
want, I can't wait for Mashiach 
to come so I can be reunited 

887
00:43:11,400 --> 00:43:13,120
with them. 
And you're just like, you don't 

888
00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:16,440
want to say anything, you know, 
it's a sad thing, but that's not

889
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:19,360
what, what it is. 
So, you know, I think a lot of 

890
00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:24,360
people will, will be very, very 
pleased when they read your 

891
00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:28,320
chapters because I feel like it,
it's just a very sobering and 

892
00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:31,080
eye opening way of expressing 
it. 

893
00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:36,480
So we, we thank you for that. 
And regarding the final topic we

894
00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:42,040
wanted to get into, which comes 
first is a related redemption or

895
00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:47,080
teshuva? 
I really enjoy the Funny Imago 

896
00:43:47,080 --> 00:43:48,920
Association, so thank you for 
that. 

897
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:51,920
Welcome. 
I was just going to backtrack 

898
00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:54,760
for a second because the third 
reason that we're so cautious 

899
00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:57,200
about messianism is actually the
most ideological. 

900
00:43:57,200 --> 00:43:59,640
It's the most subtle, but it 
sits at the heart of some of the

901
00:43:59,680 --> 00:44:01,680
ideological debates in the 
orthodox world. 

902
00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:04,760
Is not just that it boomerangs, 
and it's not just that it raises

903
00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:10,000
expectations, and it's not just 
that it encourages escapism. 

904
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:12,400
And by the way, not just 
escapism, but it's called 

905
00:44:12,400 --> 00:44:14,960
halafic escapism and moral 
escapism. 

906
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:17,000
The fancy word for that I don't 
have to tell you is 

907
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:21,080
antinomianism, where where it's 
a new order, it's a new world 

908
00:44:21,480 --> 00:44:24,680
and the conditions and 
guidelines of the previous world

909
00:44:24,680 --> 00:44:27,240
no longer applicable. 
And that could be a halafic 

910
00:44:27,240 --> 00:44:30,040
antinomianism shop. 
That's we gathered his followers

911
00:44:30,040 --> 00:44:33,320
around the campfire and ate pork
and altered the bracha from mati

912
00:44:33,440 --> 00:44:36,000
asuran to mati isuran. 
Because it's a whole new world 

913
00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:37,640
and Halafa is out the window, 
God forbid. 

914
00:44:38,240 --> 00:44:41,960
And it could also lead to 
rational antinomianism, where 

915
00:44:42,120 --> 00:44:43,760
this is the period of 
redemption. 

916
00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:46,320
We know how it ends. 
We have God on our side. 

917
00:44:46,600 --> 00:44:48,600
Let's, I'm saying this in a very
radical form. 

918
00:44:48,720 --> 00:44:51,640
Let's blow up the Temple Mount 
because let's invite 300 million

919
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:53,960
Muslims to attack us because we 
know that God will be forced to 

920
00:44:53,960 --> 00:44:56,880
save us. 
So it's not just the abdication 

921
00:44:56,880 --> 00:45:00,360
of Halafa, but the abdication of
rationality and practicality, 

922
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:02,760
which is something that I 
struggle with because I'm a 

923
00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:04,720
settler. 
I feel I'm living prophecy. 

924
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:07,440
Remember about 20 years ago I 
was interviewed by the New York 

925
00:45:07,440 --> 00:45:10,840
Times and they were trying to 
bait me into bad mouthing 

926
00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:12,640
settlers. 
So they said, what do you think 

927
00:45:12,640 --> 00:45:14,560
about those settlers? 
They said I'm a settler. 

928
00:45:15,120 --> 00:45:18,680
They said, no, those settlers 
who carry guns, those days I 

929
00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:20,120
carried a Newsday showed her my 
Uzi. 

930
00:45:20,440 --> 00:45:23,640
I said no, those settlers who 
carry guns and believe that 

931
00:45:23,640 --> 00:45:26,080
every ounce of this land is 
promised to the Jewish people, I

932
00:45:26,080 --> 00:45:30,480
say put me down for that also. 
So she said you don't look like 

933
00:45:30,480 --> 00:45:32,560
a settler. 
So tell us the difference 

934
00:45:32,560 --> 00:45:34,000
between yourself and the people 
of Sarran. 

935
00:45:34,040 --> 00:45:36,440
After I refuse to be baited, 
which by the way is important to

936
00:45:36,440 --> 00:45:37,680
life, not to be baited by 
people. 

937
00:45:37,920 --> 00:45:41,400
So after I refuse to be baited, 
I said, put it this way, I'm a 

938
00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:44,400
messianist just as they are. 
But I think that messianism has 

939
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:47,680
to be sprinkled with 
practicality, pragmatism and 

940
00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:50,320
ration and rational decisions. 
Where I think some of my other 

941
00:45:50,320 --> 00:45:54,200
settlers, they believe that 
prophecy is the only value or 

942
00:45:54,200 --> 00:45:56,720
the only guideline for messianic
activity. 

943
00:45:56,720 --> 00:45:59,560
So they like that statement, 
messianism sprinkled with the 

944
00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:03,880
practicality, pragmatism. 
But the larger issue is Ghoul is

945
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:07,400
not just historical event. 
Ghoul is a reunification or, or 

946
00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:10,040
reuniting between ourselves and 
a Kurdish parcel. 

947
00:46:10,360 --> 00:46:11,760
Our relationship has been 
fractured. 

948
00:46:12,000 --> 00:46:14,720
We broke the relationship. 
Ghoul is the restoration of that

949
00:46:14,720 --> 00:46:18,320
relationship. 
And like every relationship, you

950
00:46:18,320 --> 00:46:19,880
have to know there's a as you 
know, right? 

951
00:46:20,080 --> 00:46:21,160
Assuming you're both married, 
right? 

952
00:46:21,480 --> 00:46:23,960
Yes. 
So everything in romance is 

953
00:46:23,960 --> 00:46:27,720
timing and you can want your 
wife to be in a certain state of

954
00:46:27,720 --> 00:46:29,800
mind and to have a certain 
feeling and to take your 

955
00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:31,840
relations to a certain place and
if she's not ready or vice 

956
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:34,160
versa, you're not ready. 
It's timing and relationship is 

957
00:46:34,160 --> 00:46:37,560
bilateral. 
And just because we're ready and

958
00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:40,280
we believe we're living through 
Gula, we especially since this 

959
00:46:40,280 --> 00:46:42,880
is the relation with the Kurish 
bar who we have to advance in 

960
00:46:42,880 --> 00:46:45,520
very measured stages or else is 
disrespectful to Hashem. 

961
00:46:45,960 --> 00:46:47,440
That's at the heart of Shira 
Shirin. 

962
00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:51,440
Shira Shirin every time the 
relationship starts to fire on 

963
00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:53,720
all cylinders, Hashem cools it 
down. 

964
00:46:53,720 --> 00:46:56,640
What's the cooling Pasakash 
bhatiya trembinotti ishalayim 

965
00:46:56,960 --> 00:47:01,280
intaero the inta arweta of Aja 
tekpats don't advance it, don't 

966
00:47:01,280 --> 00:47:02,720
undermine it, just let it 
happen. 

967
00:47:02,720 --> 00:47:06,200
Normally Aja tekpats and there's
a rhythm to our relationship 

968
00:47:06,200 --> 00:47:08,600
with Hashem. 
And I think that the SAT Merebi 

969
00:47:08,760 --> 00:47:11,440
quite strongly disagree with 
felt that the rhythm was off and

970
00:47:11,440 --> 00:47:14,400
this was not the time to advance
for all sorts of ideological 

971
00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:16,120
conclusions that he reached in 
his safer. 

972
00:47:16,440 --> 00:47:19,840
But his basic prospect was basic
concern was correct. 

973
00:47:20,240 --> 00:47:23,440
And I live in a community in 
Israel in which messianic fever 

974
00:47:23,440 --> 00:47:26,760
runs way high. 
And it creates a certain 

975
00:47:26,880 --> 00:47:29,120
confidence in our relationship 
with Hashem, which I think is a 

976
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:32,520
little bit disproportionate. 
And we feel so confident that 

977
00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:34,520
we're partners with Hashem, 
we're settling the land, and 

978
00:47:34,520 --> 00:47:37,040
we're serving the army. 
And it comes across in many, 

979
00:47:37,040 --> 00:47:39,040
many different ways. 
I would like there to be more. 

980
00:47:39,040 --> 00:47:41,440
You're at Shamayan in my 
community, which you say we 

981
00:47:41,440 --> 00:47:43,720
don't know the ways of God. 
The ways of God are still 

982
00:47:43,720 --> 00:47:45,720
perplexing. 
We have to approach God with 

983
00:47:45,720 --> 00:47:48,360
more humble, muted, 
intellectually honest and humble

984
00:47:48,360 --> 00:47:49,880
ways. 
I think October 7th 

985
00:47:49,880 --> 00:47:52,320
unfortunately corrected that a 
little bit. 

986
00:47:52,320 --> 00:47:57,400
I think people are not as 
brashly and unqualified and 

987
00:47:57,400 --> 00:47:59,800
audaciously messianic as they 
used to be. 

988
00:47:59,800 --> 00:48:02,480
Because we realized that though 
the process may have begun, 

989
00:48:02,720 --> 00:48:07,680
there is a lot of pain and agony
that can occur between 1948 and 

990
00:48:07,680 --> 00:48:10,920
whatever this process ends. 
So the third issue is not just 

991
00:48:10,920 --> 00:48:14,080
the boomerang effect of Dash 
expectations and not just the 

992
00:48:14,080 --> 00:48:17,880
escapism of the anti Naomi 
anism, but it's, it's a 

993
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:19,600
marriage. 
We're we're marrying a sham 

994
00:48:19,600 --> 00:48:21,640
again. 
We've been away for 2000 years. 

995
00:48:21,640 --> 00:48:24,480
We have to learn each other and 
we have to take our steps very 

996
00:48:24,480 --> 00:48:26,440
gradually. 
It's a subtle point, but it's 

997
00:48:26,440 --> 00:48:32,560
probably the most central point.
So so just to tie a bow on this,

998
00:48:32,560 --> 00:48:36,520
because I think it's really does
tie in regarding what comes 

999
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:40,440
first redemption or teshuva, 
because you know, obviously what

1000
00:48:40,440 --> 00:48:43,080
you just said, you know, I think
that that's kind of a perfect 

1001
00:48:43,080 --> 00:48:48,600
lead in to to this answer. 
Right, look, the the article 

1002
00:48:48,600 --> 00:48:50,400
itself that you, I don't know if
you read the article, just 

1003
00:48:50,400 --> 00:48:52,720
looked at the title. 
The the the article itself is 

1004
00:48:52,720 --> 00:48:56,120
basically of Cook's version of 
Teshuva, which is is is an 

1005
00:48:56,120 --> 00:49:00,360
amazing, amazing transformation 
of Teshuva in the safer wrote 

1006
00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:03,000
that Chuva, which to me again, 
it's very hard for people to 

1007
00:49:03,000 --> 00:49:04,760
read with Cook. 
Even if you know Hebrew, if you 

1008
00:49:04,760 --> 00:49:06,840
don't know Hebrew, it's almost 
impossible. 

1009
00:49:06,840 --> 00:49:08,920
It's done a good job translating
it though. 

1010
00:49:09,520 --> 00:49:11,880
They've done a pretty good job 
translating Ortho Chuva in many 

1011
00:49:11,880 --> 00:49:14,840
different editions. 
It's. 

1012
00:49:14,880 --> 00:49:17,080
Hard. 
It still doesn't capture exactly

1013
00:49:17,080 --> 00:49:18,280
like the Hebrew, of course I 
know. 

1014
00:49:19,160 --> 00:49:20,080
It's Hebrew. 
It's Tanakh. 

1015
00:49:20,240 --> 00:49:23,480
It's yeah, basically he 
generalized to Shuva from 

1016
00:49:23,480 --> 00:49:27,760
personal absolution and personal
vindication and personal 

1017
00:49:27,880 --> 00:49:31,640
penitence into not just a global
but a cosmic reality that 

1018
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:34,720
there's a inner will of this 
world that wants to be aligned 

1019
00:49:34,720 --> 00:49:39,040
with Hashem Ratzona Panini. 
And fate is just one of the 

1020
00:49:39,040 --> 00:49:42,640
aspects in the cosmos that 
disaligns or misaligns the 

1021
00:49:42,640 --> 00:49:45,760
entire world. 
And and Shuva's not personal 

1022
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:47,520
vindication, but it's 
realignment and 

1023
00:49:47,520 --> 00:49:50,280
resynchronization and 
recalibration and becoming more 

1024
00:49:50,280 --> 00:49:53,600
at one with the universe. 
It's very mystical and it's also

1025
00:49:53,600 --> 00:49:55,320
radiant. 
I mean, when I think of Chubo, 

1026
00:49:55,600 --> 00:49:59,000
believe me, I call it a Mahloka 
between David Hamelich and and 

1027
00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:01,440
Rif Cook. 
Governor Malik describes to 

1028
00:50:01,440 --> 00:50:04,960
Shubin very dark torrents. 
You look at Paraklavitz and 

1029
00:50:04,960 --> 00:50:07,240
Parikh Nanalif. 
It's not just dark. 

1030
00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:09,800
Those are the two prachin which 
he describes his feeling after 

1031
00:50:09,800 --> 00:50:13,400
the fate of Bacheva, but it's 
called Hayam Koderi Lakdia walk 

1032
00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:16,600
all over the place and it's dark
and it's dark, damp and it's 

1033
00:50:16,920 --> 00:50:18,480
it's very fearsome and 
frightening. 

1034
00:50:18,720 --> 00:50:20,680
And Rivku called this efarotta 
chuva. 

1035
00:50:21,000 --> 00:50:23,800
So when Alamabazi said I would 
love to see a khavruta between 

1036
00:50:23,800 --> 00:50:27,160
David and Rivkuk and how they 
discussed the Chuva because 

1037
00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:28,760
they're very, very different 
views. 

1038
00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:31,040
It's radiant. 
It's reuniting with the world, 

1039
00:50:31,040 --> 00:50:33,720
realigning with this inner force
of Hashem's will. 

1040
00:50:34,120 --> 00:50:37,320
So that's what I dedicated the 
the chapter 2 to introducing 

1041
00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:39,400
people who didn't see the 
English translation or can't 

1042
00:50:39,400 --> 00:50:41,080
read Hebrew. 
Triv cooks the chuva. 

1043
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:44,720
But in a broader sense, I think 
that many people feel that 

1044
00:50:44,720 --> 00:50:47,480
teshuva is a prerequisite for 
gula. 

1045
00:50:47,840 --> 00:50:50,320
And when will gula come? 
When everyone turns their heart 

1046
00:50:50,320 --> 00:51:00,040
towards a Kurdish bar, you know,
Whereas can gula also be an 

1047
00:51:00,040 --> 00:51:01,920
accelerant or a catalyst for 
teshuva? 

1048
00:51:02,320 --> 00:51:05,600
And can there be certain initial
preliminary stages of gulab that

1049
00:51:05,600 --> 00:51:07,840
are imposed even though we don't
deserve it? 

1050
00:51:08,160 --> 00:51:10,000
And then they start to trigger 
teshuva. 

1051
00:51:10,360 --> 00:51:13,960
And of course, given my view of 
of Jewish history, the Shiva is 

1052
00:51:13,960 --> 00:51:19,120
not a immediate 180° turn where 
everyone turns around on Monday 

1053
00:51:19,120 --> 00:51:25,240
and puts on thrilling and says, 
but nationalistic idea, national

1054
00:51:25,240 --> 00:51:28,280
identity, commitment to Judaism,
patriotism to the country, 

1055
00:51:28,360 --> 00:51:30,760
Jewish culture. 
All of these aspects of Jewish 

1056
00:51:30,760 --> 00:51:34,040
identity serve as springboards 
for ultimate spiritual 

1057
00:51:34,040 --> 00:51:35,680
renovation, spiritual 
resuscitation. 

1058
00:51:35,680 --> 00:51:38,160
Is that your way of trying to 
bring together the two different

1059
00:51:38,160 --> 00:51:44,160
opinions in the Gemara? 
If I'm not mistaken, yes, to a 

1060
00:51:44,160 --> 00:51:48,720
degree, to a degree to a degree.
I, I, I forget I wrote some 

1061
00:51:48,720 --> 00:51:50,600
other part, not this article to 
refer to. 

1062
00:51:50,840 --> 00:51:53,280
I think I wrote about in some 
other some other level. 

1063
00:51:53,680 --> 00:51:57,440
And look, the Jews in the 
precedent for this is Egypt. 

1064
00:51:57,600 --> 00:52:00,840
I mean, it's, it's ironic 
because I imagine if you had a 

1065
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:04,480
hardcore Haredi person here, 
they would quote the following 

1066
00:52:04,480 --> 00:52:07,560
Madras about Egypt because it's 
the first Gila and I'm going to 

1067
00:52:07,560 --> 00:52:08,840
quote a different matters about 
Egypt. 

1068
00:52:09,120 --> 00:52:11,000
They would quote, and I've heard
people say this to me, it's 

1069
00:52:11,000 --> 00:52:14,120
horrifying, but I've heard 
people say this, that just like 

1070
00:52:14,120 --> 00:52:19,080
in Egypt, 80% of the Jews were 
killed in McCarthy, they didn't 

1071
00:52:19,080 --> 00:52:21,080
escape. 
Let's take that matters at face 

1072
00:52:21,080 --> 00:52:21,680
value. 
It's the same. 

1073
00:52:21,680 --> 00:52:24,840
It's not metaphoric. 
They believe that that 

1074
00:52:24,880 --> 00:52:26,520
phenomenon. 
I've heard people say this will 

1075
00:52:26,520 --> 00:52:29,720
repeat itself in the final Gila 
and 80% of the Jews won't be 

1076
00:52:29,720 --> 00:52:32,200
redeemed. 
And they're referring basically 

1077
00:52:32,200 --> 00:52:36,920
to any secular Jew. 
Now, I find that very abrasive, 

1078
00:52:36,920 --> 00:52:39,160
as you do as well. 
But they're recording a matters.

1079
00:52:39,160 --> 00:52:41,920
The matters that I quote is that
the Jewish people in Egypt lost 

1080
00:52:41,920 --> 00:52:44,480
everything. 
They fell into abject paganism, 

1081
00:52:44,480 --> 00:52:48,120
which is implicit, not implicit.
It's explicit in Yuskov. 

1082
00:52:48,440 --> 00:52:51,400
Whereas them is very frontal 
with them, as you're a paganist 

1083
00:52:51,400 --> 00:52:53,160
and I need you to make a change.
And they don't, for whatever 

1084
00:52:53,160 --> 00:52:55,600
reason, they're still redeemed. 
But what did they retain? 

1085
00:52:55,920 --> 00:52:58,840
Basically, national identity, 
their dress, their language and 

1086
00:52:58,840 --> 00:53:01,240
their names. 
And that national identity 

1087
00:53:01,240 --> 00:53:04,800
served as a platform upon which 
spiritual resuscitation 

1088
00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:06,440
occurred. 
Without that, Hashem Quintev 

1089
00:53:06,440 --> 00:53:08,920
redeemed us. 
So Teshuva is not just people 

1090
00:53:09,200 --> 00:53:11,920
putting on fill in and reading 
blog Kumar, it's also people 

1091
00:53:11,920 --> 00:53:14,960
feeling Jewish identity more 
deeply on the road to a complete

1092
00:53:14,960 --> 00:53:17,440
Teshuva. 
That is such an incredible idea.

1093
00:53:17,480 --> 00:53:21,560
That is really it's, it's, it's 
really, it's such an astute idea

1094
00:53:22,800 --> 00:53:25,880
in general. 
We, you know, for me, what I 

1095
00:53:25,880 --> 00:53:29,480
appreciate about you so much is 
that I think that the Jewish 

1096
00:53:29,480 --> 00:53:33,960
people, we need people who are 
articulate people who are 

1097
00:53:33,960 --> 00:53:39,760
sensitive people who can, who 
can bring together these 

1098
00:53:39,760 --> 00:53:44,080
different dynamics that go on in
our nation and as a people and, 

1099
00:53:44,080 --> 00:53:47,320
and religiously and culturally 
and nationally. 

1100
00:53:47,720 --> 00:53:52,640
And you know, you, you really 
are the type of voice that we 

1101
00:53:52,640 --> 00:53:56,640
need to hear more of people like
you, people who will try to 

1102
00:53:57,080 --> 00:54:01,120
articulate ideas such as that 
you brought forward throughout 

1103
00:54:01,120 --> 00:54:06,760
this podcast to really, you 
know, elevate our understanding 

1104
00:54:06,760 --> 00:54:10,120
of Judaism and our association 
with the Jewish people. 

1105
00:54:10,680 --> 00:54:12,920
It's really incredible. 
That's very charitable of you 

1106
00:54:12,920 --> 00:54:14,360
when you're describing those 
people, I say. 

1107
00:54:14,360 --> 00:54:17,320
I'll keep my eyes out for this. 
No, no, but it's, I, I mean it. 

1108
00:54:17,480 --> 00:54:19,800
I mean it. 
No, really we, we need, we need 

1109
00:54:19,800 --> 00:54:24,360
exactly voices like yours. 
This is the type of voices we 

1110
00:54:24,360 --> 00:54:27,760
need to bring together and to 
bring a balance into Judaism. 

1111
00:54:27,880 --> 00:54:29,880
Absolutely. 
That's that's what I really 

1112
00:54:29,880 --> 00:54:32,440
think. 
I hope, I hope all you can do is

1113
00:54:32,440 --> 00:54:35,760
your small part and just pray in
our faith so. 

1114
00:54:35,960 --> 00:54:38,400
Well, we want to thank you 
again, and we want to tell the 

1115
00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:40,800
listeners again about reclaiming
redemption. 

1116
00:54:41,760 --> 00:54:43,960
Can you just tell them quickly 
where they could find the book? 

1117
00:54:44,840 --> 00:54:47,200
OK, So the book can be purchased
three different ways. 

1118
00:54:47,520 --> 00:54:49,360
It can be purchased in local 
bookstores. 

1119
00:54:50,000 --> 00:54:51,960
I think it hit the bookstores in
America last week. 

1120
00:54:52,680 --> 00:54:55,360
It could be purchased on the 
Mosaica or Feldheim site. 

1121
00:54:55,360 --> 00:54:58,520
It's it was published by Mosaica
and it was being distributed by 

1122
00:54:58,520 --> 00:55:00,240
Feldheim. 
So I guess I think each of those

1123
00:55:00,240 --> 00:55:03,120
I've seen are featuring it. 
It can be purchased directly 

1124
00:55:03,120 --> 00:55:06,280
from me either in Israel or in 
America or in the UK. 

1125
00:55:06,280 --> 00:55:09,240
If you have listeners in the UK 
at the following website, one 

1126
00:55:09,240 --> 00:55:13,280
word 
www.reclaimingredemption.com, 

1127
00:55:14,120 --> 00:55:18,960
www.reclaimingredemption.com. 
I'll ask you to put into the 

1128
00:55:18,960 --> 00:55:21,080
show notes so people can order 
from there as well. 

1129
00:55:21,680 --> 00:55:25,000
Thank you so much, this is 
really enjoyable and we we hope 

1130
00:55:25,000 --> 00:55:28,200
to when they do it again. 
Please God, thanks God. 

1131
00:55:28,680 --> 00:55:31,280
And have a chavoir tov. 
And we should only get reviewed 

1132
00:55:31,280 --> 00:55:32,800
in the land, God willing. 
Amen. 

1133
00:55:33,120 --> 00:55:36,360
Amen Bisaratova, for all of our 
people, for all of our broken 

1134
00:55:36,360 --> 00:55:36,760
hearts.