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Welcome to the News Navigators 
with me, Jeremy Deacon. 

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And me, Jonathan Starling. 
We've been both been looking at 

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the budget today, the 202627 
budget. 

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Our heads are spinning, our eyes
are a bit glazed it. 

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Was a big budget 2 hour long 
speech. 

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It was one of the biggest, 
longest budgets that I can ever 

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remember in Bermuda. 2 hours. 2 
hours and lots and lots and lots

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in it. 
And it's, it's about 58 pages 

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long to read for, for readers 
who do want to read it, it's 

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it's doable, but it is a lot to 
read. 

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I've only skimmed through it 
once. 

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I would like to read it again 
with more more detail, but I've 

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got some, I've got some good 
thoughts on it so far. 

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And I will say, Jeremy, I when I
read these things like the 

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throne speech or the budget, I 
do try to read it with like a 

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critical eye to be like, why do 
they do this? 

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This is terrible. 
But to be honest, I've struggled

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to do that with this budget. 
I think overall it's a really 

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good budget. 
There's a few smaller things I 

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would have done slightly 
differently. 

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But overall, I think it's a 
budget that while I'm sure 

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there's still going to be people
who are going to be critical of 

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it, I mean, you can't please 
everyone all the time. 

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I think this one does a very 
good job of being a good budget.

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Overall, there's not much that I
can find to criticize in it. 

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The things I would change would 
be very small, minor things, you

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know? 
It's, it's an interesting 

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budget. 
I mean, I think one of the take 

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outs to me was David Burt, the 
Premier and finance minister, 

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categorically saying this was 
his last budget. 

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Well, let me qualify that, he 
said. 

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It's my last budget as the 
Premier and Minister of Finance 

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doesn't mean it won't be his 
last budget ever. 

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Right, so there's wiggle room 
there, you reckon? 

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Yes, he could still be a 
Minister of Finance giving a 

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budget, but he won't be the 
premier and Minister of Finance.

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The other thing is that is of 
great note the for the very 

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first time in the history of 
Bermuda government revenue will 

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be over $2 billion. 
Yeah. 

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I mean, a good chunk of that is 
the CIT of course. 

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It is. 
Well, it was about 250 million, 

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isn't it? 
Because the biggest chunk of CIT

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750,000,000 will actually come 
next year the way the, the way 

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the collection cycle seems to 
work. 

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So even given that, you know, 
that was a pretty big surplus, 

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pretty big revenue anyway. 
And there's a projected budget 

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surplus of 472 million, which 
again is must be unheard of. 

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And I think he said it's the 
first budget surplus that 

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Bermuda's had in the last 2021 
years. 

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Which doesn't say a lot about 
his predecessors, although of 

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course there were there were 
some mitigating factors in the 

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last five years or so. 
Well, even in the last 20, I 

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mean, 2008 was the worst 
economic crisis, even worse than

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the Great Depression. 
Yeah. 

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I'm going to come on to that 
because one, one of the things I

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wanted to talk about that 
looking at this, I think it's a 

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big stimulus budget. 
You know, there's a lot of money

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potentially going into people's 
pockets, into household pockets.

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When you look at the payroll tax
relief, there's a lot of cost of

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living relief, a lot of duty 
relief there. 

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And there's tax cuts for energy.
They're really, he's really hit 

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the mark obviously because at 
the moment the cost of living is

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a big ticket item and there's 
going to be a lot of extra 

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government spending. 
I think they talk about capital 

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expenditure 182,000,000 and he 
said that's the largest since 

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2008 nine. 
And I mean. 

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We were talking in our pre 
budget talk that I was hoping to

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see a lot, a lot of 
infrastructure investment and 

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that's what we're seeing. 
Well, you specifically mentioned

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things like the agricultural 
centre and that was noted in the

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budget today. 
I had no advance notice people I

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I was just saying that what I 
thought would be in. 

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You're my PLP insider. 
Come on. 

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But also the swing bridge. 
There's 9.8 million towards 

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replacing the swing bridge. 
There's going to be a lot of 

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infrastructure. 
Now. 

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I kind of two things struck me. 
The first of all, the capital 

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expenditure 180 a 182,000,000, 
the largest since 28 nine. 

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That was actually when the 
opposition warned of an 

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overheating economy. 
And I found a quote from Glenn 

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Blakeney, a former PRPMP, who 
said I would rather have one 

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that's overheating, the one 
that's lukewarm or not heated at

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all. 
Now, I don't think we're going 

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to end up with an overheated 
economy, but the stimulus is 

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going to have a very significant
effect on the on the economy, 

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isn't it? 
I mean, it's going to support 

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demand, lowering the debt, 
future interest burdens, it's 

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going to help with healthcare, 
it's going to help with 

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investment, it's going to help 
households. 

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And it's geared to supporting 
the working class as well. 

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Largely, yes. 
I mean, it's not going to be 

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massive savings for anyone that 
we're talking like a couple $100

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a year. 
But in terms of real wages for 

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the working class, that's that's
amazing. 

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And you know, the working class 
is going to spend that more, 

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that money more likely in the 
local economy, whereas savings 

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from an upper class individual 
that's probably going to go into

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their account and not actually 
be used, whereas working class 

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persons more likely to use that 
money to stimulate the local 

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economy. 
Yeah, which is good as long as 

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it's not too much, I suppose. 
Well, it's just a thought. 

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I mean, looking back to the 
22,000 and eight nine, I just 

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want to put it out there. 
I don't think it'll happen, but 

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I want to put it out there. 
I think. 

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I think there is a a real 
problem though that the 

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government could encounter and 
that's with supply. 

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And we know that we don't have a
supply of labour that we need. 

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Unemployment is 1.4%, that is 
full employment. 

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So the only people who don't 
have jobs are those moving 

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between jobs or who cannot work.
So we have a real problem with 

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this stimulus. 
I mean, from a worker 

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perspective, at least in the 
short term, it's beneficial 

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because you can command a higher
wage at the moment because the 

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capitalists, the business owners
are going to be competing for 

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labor. 
So you can argue for a higher 

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wage. 
At the same time, as you said, 

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we don't have enough workers to 
do all the work that he's done. 

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Look at Southampton Princess, 
which is coming online later 

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this year. 
And that's going to need, I 

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think, I think I write about 500
jobs are going to be required 

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for that. 
We don't have that at the 

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moment. 
So there is going to be a 

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requirement to import workers 
that's going to mitigate the the

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wage demands that the workers 
can say because it's going to 

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increase the overall total 
amount of labour force. 

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And it is something that David 
Burke did flag in the budget 

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when he said a tight labour 
market can generate inflationary

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wage pressures. 
And, and this is the one thing 

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that really caught my eye 
because we knew about the 

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spending, we knew it was going 
to be gazillions with the 

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corporate income tax and stuff 
like that. 

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It's all pretty much, you know, 
flagged up in advance. 

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But I just want to, I just want 
to read this extract from the 

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budget about labour market 
reforms. 

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And this is quoting David Burt 
and the the budget speech. 

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Mr. Speaker, economic growth 
does not sustain itself. 

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It requires steady management 
and policies that are sound. 

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One of the clearest signs that 
our economic policies are 

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working is what we see in the 
labour market, with unemployment

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at record lows. 
But Mr. Speaker, we also have to

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be honest about what comes with 
success. 

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A growing economy creates demand
for more jobs and one constraint

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in our continued growth is a 
lack of available labour. 

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No surprises there. 
If we were to keep this economic

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momentum going, this government 
must take a balanced approach to

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the labour market, one that 
protects Bermudian workers while

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ensuring that businesses can 
access the talent they need to 

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grow and invest now. 
To me, this is the next 

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paragraph is a kicker. 
To address this, the Ministry of

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the Economy and Labour will 
further modernise our work 

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permit processes. 
We know that they want to do 

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them electronically, but also by
reviewing and making adjustments

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to closed and restricted job 
categories to assist with 

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closing the gap between the 
supply and demand for labour Now

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closed and restricted. 
It's been something that's been 

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ongoing for a very long time. 
And I think it's designed to 

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protect Bermudians perhaps in, 
in lower paid jobs. 

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And if you look about it, I, I 
looked at the last list of 

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closed and restricted. 
These are everything from like 

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administrative assistant, 
airline ground agent, bank 

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teller, carpet installer, 
cashier, childcare assistant, 

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entertainer, musician, 
fisherman, general bartender. 

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I could go on and on and on, but
you get the point, you know, do 

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restricted jobs category is dish
pot, dish pot washer, 

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electrician, landscape gardener,
waiter, server. 

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Now, I kind of put emphasis on 
that because this signals to me 

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a fairly significant immigration
policy, you know, and we're 

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going to have to accept that 
these jobs won't be restricted 

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and that we're going to have to 
bring more people in. 

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I, I, I don't know, am I, am I 
getting this wrong? 

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It just struck me that that was 
quite an admission that was 

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rather buried in the in the 
budget report, I thought. 

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No, I think that's AI. 
Think that's a good assessment 

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on your part. 
Yeah, we are going to need more 

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workers. 
I mean, the government has been 

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clear about the need to increase
the overall population anyway. 

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It's just being a matter of how 
like what kind of conditions for

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expat guest workers are going to
be there and, you know, the, the

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pathways to status, third rail 
of Bermuda politics, you know? 

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But this is the first time I've 
seen them treading on the toes, 

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as it were, of restricted, 
enclosed job markets, which has 

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been in place for a long time, 
haven't they? 

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For years, I think. 
And Bermudians aren't going to 

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get first dibs at these jobs. 
And I just wonder. 

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You know, I think the way I 
would read it is more like once 

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every Bermudian that is 
qualified for those jobs is 

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hired, then they can go to 
expatriates, guest workers. 

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It doesn't make that plain. 
No, I'm just saying that's how I

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would interpret it. 
Whether that is the case or not,

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that's going to. 
Well, as the devil's in the 

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detail, don't we? 
Yeah. 

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I mean, no, Yeah. 
I mean, it's a massive stimulus.

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I think it's as big a stimulus 
packages a government the size 

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of Bermuda could do. 
Yeah. 

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And they introduced a couple of 
fiscal rules as well in relation

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with the corporate income tax. 
I need to pull it up on the 

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thing. 
Well, one of them was at least 

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70% of net corporate income tax 
over three years go to goes to 

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debt interest. 
Net debt reduction and building 

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00:11:27,360 --> 00:11:30,480
net financial assets is quite 
difficult to read. 

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Yeah. 
And the idea is to kind of not 

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totally wipe out our debt in the
next three years, but to take a 

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huge chunk of it out, as I 
understand it. 

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And I agree and I that's why the
David Burt announced today they 

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were planning I think to spend 
500 million to offset the 

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605,000,000 that was due next 
January. 

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But he's actually announced 
they're going to pay off that 

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full 605 and that actually will 
save around about 25,000,000 a 

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year in interest savings alone. 
I mean, it had become the 

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ministry of debt, It's the 
fourth largest ministry, the 

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debt repayment. 
And I think that's going to be a

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challenge for the Opposition, 
the 1 Bermuda Alliance, because 

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that's something they've been 
kind of drumming. 

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I, I mean, in terms of their 
reply to the budget, because 

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they've been trying to push for 
a greater focus on wiping out 

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our debt. 
And that's exactly what the 

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government is doing, while also 
seeing a budget surplus beyond 

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corporate income tax itself and 
putting all this investment into

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capital, infrastructure and a 
few other priorities. 

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So that's why I, I'm thinking 
it's going to be very difficult 

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for the opposition to launch a 
reply. 

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They're still going to do it. 
They have to, but I think it's 

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going to be more challenging for
them. 

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I, I think it's an impossible 
job for them. 

225
00:12:50,200 --> 00:12:53,000
What, what are they going to do?
Are they going to go up against 

226
00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:56,200
the electorate who've just seen 
more money put in their pockets 

227
00:12:56,200 --> 00:12:57,920
and say that's the wrong thing 
to do? 

228
00:12:59,520 --> 00:13:02,280
I think they will have to focus 
on questioning whether the 

229
00:13:02,280 --> 00:13:05,680
budget is actually a surplus or 
not type thing and they're going

230
00:13:05,680 --> 00:13:07,240
to say, oh, it's a sleight of 
hand with the count. 

231
00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:09,880
That's just my guess. 
That's what I would expect the 

232
00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:13,760
Oba to to do. 
They they did that before last 

233
00:13:13,760 --> 00:13:16,360
year if you remember, I think. 
Which is why I'm thinking that's

234
00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:19,520
and with the debt being 
addressed in this, I feel that 

235
00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:22,920
that's kind of the only option 
they have is an attack line. 

236
00:13:23,320 --> 00:13:27,680
Whether they are correct in that
argument or not, I don't know. 

237
00:13:27,680 --> 00:13:30,640
I'll listen to what they have to
say and consider it, but I'm 

238
00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:32,760
just saying I think that's going
to be their line of attack. 

239
00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:36,080
I think you might be quite a 
weak on it because if I remember

240
00:13:36,080 --> 00:13:40,680
rightly, last year, Doctor Kuto,
the shadow finance minister, 

241
00:13:40,680 --> 00:13:45,040
accused David Burt of a sleight 
of hand by using money from the 

242
00:13:45,040 --> 00:13:51,840
sinking fund to to pay for or 
subsidise some of the things in 

243
00:13:51,840 --> 00:13:54,560
the budget. 
And if you remember the the law 

244
00:13:54,560 --> 00:13:57,520
was changed about the sinking 
fund, which was originally set 

245
00:13:57,520 --> 00:14:00,960
up to pay down the debt. 
And the law was changed so it 

246
00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:03,880
could go into the capital 
account, the current, the 

247
00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:05,680
government's current account, if
you like. 

248
00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:10,000
And he was saying government 
then use a sleight of hand using

249
00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:13,000
this, the sinking fund. 
I'm not sure he's got the same 

250
00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:15,800
argument this time. 
Not sure at all. 

251
00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:19,120
No, but I think that's probably 
what they're going to try to do.

252
00:14:20,320 --> 00:14:22,040
You know, old wine and new 
bottles. 

253
00:14:22,640 --> 00:14:24,240
I think you'll probably sell all
the money. 

254
00:14:24,240 --> 00:14:27,080
Should have gone off to paying 
down the debt immediately. 

255
00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:32,200
See, if I was, I probably would 
have put it as 50% instead of 

256
00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:35,560
70% and use the rest of the 
money to fund other things. 

257
00:14:35,560 --> 00:14:39,520
But as I said, it's a good 
budget, I'm just quibbling over 

258
00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:43,200
smaller things. 
No, I agree. 

259
00:14:43,520 --> 00:14:46,120
I think, you know, just 
quibbling over smaller things, 

260
00:14:47,480 --> 00:14:53,160
there is one smaller thing that 
I didn't see any mention in the 

261
00:14:53,160 --> 00:14:58,520
budget about ensuring that these
cost savings, the reduction in 

262
00:14:58,520 --> 00:15:03,160
energy, etcetera, etcetera, were
actually had to be passed on to 

263
00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:05,960
the consumer. 
There is a risk, isn't there, 

264
00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:10,440
that they could be used for 
businesses to have higher profit

265
00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:14,040
margins. 
I didn't see that written in 

266
00:15:14,040 --> 00:15:17,000
there at all. 
And it'd be interesting to see 

267
00:15:17,000 --> 00:15:20,920
if that is addressed during the 
budget debate. 

268
00:15:20,920 --> 00:15:24,440
For those who don't know, after 
the the opposition will have 

269
00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:28,280
their reply next Friday and 
after that there'll be two 

270
00:15:28,280 --> 00:15:35,560
weeks, three days a week, very, 
very long days where individual 

271
00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:41,080
ministries will be put on under 
focus on the spotlight to talk 

272
00:15:41,080 --> 00:15:44,120
about the detail of the budget 
as it affects them. 

273
00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:46,960
And it'd be interesting to see 
if there's any any mention of 

274
00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:52,400
this. 
One, no, no, one thing that that

275
00:15:52,400 --> 00:15:55,480
I noted, it's a small thing. 
I don't think it's even covered 

276
00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:58,760
in any of the other news yet. 
So it's a kind of small thing, 

277
00:15:58,760 --> 00:16:02,360
but to me it's a pretty big is 
they're committing a quite a bit

278
00:16:02,360 --> 00:16:07,880
of money to capital investment 
into the corrections facility. 

279
00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:10,080
Yes, long overdue. 
Yeah. 

280
00:16:10,080 --> 00:16:13,160
I mean, it's almost every year 
you hear about, oh, the hot 

281
00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:16,520
water boiler system is not 
working or other things like 

282
00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:20,120
that. 
And so I am grateful that that 

283
00:16:20,120 --> 00:16:22,160
is happening now. 
I mean, and also they're 

284
00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:26,480
introducing more, I forget the 
exact line they used in the 

285
00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:29,280
budget, but it was talking about
more investment into like the 

286
00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:32,720
mental health and psychological 
welfare of prisoners and all of 

287
00:16:32,720 --> 00:16:34,360
that. 
Which is something we talked 

288
00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:38,280
about on the podcast when 
Justice Wolf talked about the, 

289
00:16:38,280 --> 00:16:40,120
like, a psychiatrist in the 
prison. 

290
00:16:40,440 --> 00:16:43,240
So yeah. 
So I was very happy to see that 

291
00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:47,120
and another thing that they have
in it and we talked about it in 

292
00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:51,760
our pre budget talk as well, 
installing and while increasing 

293
00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:55,200
the amount of solar panels on 
government owned buildings to 

294
00:16:55,200 --> 00:16:56,600
reduce government. 
Installed. 

295
00:16:56,960 --> 00:16:57,960
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

296
00:16:58,080 --> 00:17:01,000
But I think, I think it's only, 
it's not much, it's like 1.3 

297
00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:03,480
million or something that is in 
the budget for that. 

298
00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:05,880
But that's good. 
That saves government overall 

299
00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:07,760
costs in the long term. 
It's a good return on 

300
00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:13,119
investment. 20 additional buses.
Yeah, I'm focusing on that 

301
00:17:13,119 --> 00:17:15,599
because I rely on the buses. 
You rely on buses, yeah. 

302
00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:19,480
And so, you know, having more, I
actually don't know if there's 

303
00:17:19,480 --> 00:17:23,359
any actual report to see how the
new electric buses compare with 

304
00:17:23,359 --> 00:17:26,800
the diesel ones in terms of, you
know, repairs and quality and 

305
00:17:26,800 --> 00:17:29,640
all that. 
I assume it reduces government's

306
00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:33,320
cost on fuel. 
I like the electric buses. 

307
00:17:33,360 --> 00:17:36,360
I don't have to drive them or 
repair them so I don't know the 

308
00:17:36,360 --> 00:17:40,280
actual cost benefit, but I like 
them and having additional buses

309
00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:46,640
going to be really beneficial 
not having to wait for for buses

310
00:17:46,960 --> 00:17:48,600
as much. 
And of course, a lot of 

311
00:17:48,600 --> 00:17:53,040
investment into health as well. 
Yeah, They really focused a lot 

312
00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:56,720
on trying to get people out of 
the acute care ring. 

313
00:17:56,880 --> 00:17:59,400
So they're going to increase 
like I think they caught it a 

314
00:17:59,400 --> 00:18:02,440
step down type thing. 
So to have a place for people to

315
00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:04,720
leave the hospital so they're 
not blocking beds. 

316
00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:07,280
And that's something we've 
talked about quite a few quite 

317
00:18:07,280 --> 00:18:10,520
often on this podcast. 
I mean, it's not going to happen

318
00:18:10,520 --> 00:18:14,520
overnight, but it is good to see
that movement is happening 

319
00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:17,800
there. 
Yeah, more money for future 

320
00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:19,840
care, which was telegraphed as 
well. 

321
00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:23,560
We know about that, although not
as much as the Tax Reform 

322
00:18:23,560 --> 00:18:26,320
Commission had. 
One of the biggest budget 

323
00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:29,320
increases, at least in a 
relative sense, was for housing,

324
00:18:29,680 --> 00:18:32,600
which we kind of expected to be 
there. 

325
00:18:33,280 --> 00:18:37,520
The deputy leader, the Minister 
of Housing, Zane de Silva, has 

326
00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:41,200
been really pushing a housing 
agenda to address the housing 

327
00:18:41,200 --> 00:18:43,960
crisis. 
So it wasn't any big surprise. 

328
00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:48,960
But in terms of a relative 
budget increase, that's 43% for 

329
00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:50,920
that ministry. 
That's the largest budget 

330
00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:55,120
increase relatively that I saw 
of all of the ministries. 

331
00:18:55,120 --> 00:18:57,600
Well, I think that probably 
reflects how important it is and

332
00:18:57,600 --> 00:19:01,320
it comes back to what I'm saying
about labour issues because we 

333
00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:02,960
need to get more people on the 
island. 

334
00:19:02,960 --> 00:19:06,600
But if there's nowhere to live, 
what happens and the prices is 

335
00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:09,440
the rent except to go screaming 
up and then people can't afford 

336
00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:12,200
it. 
I mean, to me those two were 

337
00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:16,520
kind of the biggest issues in 
many way to making sure the 

338
00:19:16,520 --> 00:19:19,080
stimulus can actually work. 
I mean I. 

339
00:19:19,720 --> 00:19:23,640
I am wary about, you know, 
building on green space. 

340
00:19:23,640 --> 00:19:27,240
I would like to see more like 
large apartment type buildings 

341
00:19:27,240 --> 00:19:29,600
rather than I. 
I don't think we can all live in

342
00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:32,400
cottages with gardens anymore. 
I don't think that works in 

343
00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:35,200
Bermuda's economy. 
We need to start transitioning 

344
00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:41,200
to more of an urban system. 
There's only so much land is 

345
00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:42,880
what I'm trying to build up 
instead of. 

346
00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:48,800
I think Zane Deserver has 
pointed out that I believe all 

347
00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:51,920
the projects he's outlined are 
on brownfield lands. 

348
00:19:52,120 --> 00:19:56,160
Brownfield land, isn't it The 
one that's in Davis is, the one 

349
00:19:56,160 --> 00:19:59,560
down at Dockyard is and I think 
a few others. 

350
00:19:59,560 --> 00:20:01,480
And so that is good. 
But I agree it's probably a need

351
00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:05,280
to start building up as much as 
anything as much as building on 

352
00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:09,240
on brownfield. 
And I mean, I think that would 

353
00:20:09,240 --> 00:20:11,680
increase the footfall within the
city as well. 

354
00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:14,800
If you have more people living 
in the city, they don't 

355
00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:19,240
necessarily need cars, so that 
won't impact the roads too much 

356
00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:21,680
and they can just walk around. 
If you live in the city, you're 

357
00:20:21,680 --> 00:20:23,880
more likely to go out for 
dinner, I'll put it that way. 

358
00:20:24,280 --> 00:20:25,520
And a coffee and everything 
else. 

359
00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:27,800
And you know it. 
It leads to a vibrant city. 

360
00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:33,440
Really does. 
But yeah, I mean, yeah, I think.

361
00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:36,880
Another budget increase was on 
education, the physical 

362
00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:40,160
infrastructure of the schools. 
Now that's interesting with the 

363
00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:43,200
pause on education reform, which
was also in the news today. 

364
00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:46,360
Well, I laugh because what 
they're going to build and where

365
00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:50,720
does anybody actually know? 
But at the same time, I mean, my

366
00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:53,480
understanding is one of the 
reasons why the education reform

367
00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:58,720
is paused is because the work to
create the schools to facilitate

368
00:20:58,720 --> 00:21:01,680
the education reform hadn't been
done for whatever reason. 

369
00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:03,640
At least that's what I'm 
understanding. 

370
00:21:03,640 --> 00:21:06,560
They're saying we don't 
physically have the space to do 

371
00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:08,960
to move the students to these 
schools at the moment. 

372
00:21:09,960 --> 00:21:12,400
That was always a question mark 
about how this is going to be 

373
00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:13,640
funded. 
I agree. 

374
00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:16,920
So I see that investment into 
the schools as part of that to 

375
00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:20,240
kind of pause the education 
reform for now so that the 

376
00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:23,640
physical infrastructure can 
catch up to facilitate the 

377
00:21:23,640 --> 00:21:26,320
education reform that has been 
proposed. 

378
00:21:26,840 --> 00:21:30,560
That's what I read is the pause.
You might be right, you might be

379
00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:32,440
right. 
Well, hopefully when this money 

380
00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:35,320
kicks in, the pause will unpause
and people will get a very clear

381
00:21:35,320 --> 00:21:37,960
idea of where their kids are 
going to go to school. 

382
00:21:38,240 --> 00:21:41,400
But that's the subject of 
another long podcast. 

383
00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:46,680
I think so, yeah. 
I mean, I think like you 

384
00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:50,360
potentially, it's all very good.
I think there are a couple of 

385
00:21:50,360 --> 00:21:55,160
issues, like I say, housing, the
labour force and also now it's 

386
00:21:55,160 --> 00:21:57,880
going to be down to execution. 
Isn't it? 

387
00:21:57,880 --> 00:21:59,720
That is all. 
Well, that's the devil in the 

388
00:21:59,720 --> 00:22:02,440
details, isn't it? 
It can have a good policy, but 

389
00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:06,720
if it can be executed badly. 
Can we execute the, the, the 

390
00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:11,240
labour reform properly? 
Can we execute building houses 

391
00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:14,680
quickly? 
Can we make sure that the cost 

392
00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:18,720
reductions outlined in the 
budget are actually passed on to

393
00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:22,440
the consumer? 
You know, and I think can we 

394
00:22:22,440 --> 00:22:24,560
measure that? 
So it's, it's going to be 

395
00:22:24,560 --> 00:22:29,920
interesting to see how this 
Budget will be executed over the

396
00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:36,280
next 12 months, hopefully sooner
than that, because it is, well, 

397
00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:39,920
it's the, it's the biggest, is 
this the biggest? 

398
00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:43,200
It's the biggest giveaway since 
I've been back in Bermuda in 

399
00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:48,120
terms of a budget, I think. 
It's a, it's a sweetheart 

400
00:22:48,120 --> 00:22:51,960
budget, but I don't think if it 
wasn't, if it wasn't for the 

401
00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:54,840
election last year, I would say 
this looks like an election 

402
00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:57,560
budget, you know? 
It looks exactly like an 

403
00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:00,200
election budget, but this one 
doesn't rely on borrowing. 

404
00:23:00,800 --> 00:23:05,080
Yeah, but it does give whoever 
will be the new premier, the new

405
00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:08,760
leader of the PLP post October. 
It gives them the a nice 

406
00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:14,600
opportunity if they wanted to go
for a snap election. 

407
00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:19,040
I'm not sure if it's warranted, 
but a new leader might want to 

408
00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:21,600
get their own, you know, 
mandate. 

409
00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:24,920
Well, we talked about that in 
the past, didn't we? 

410
00:23:25,120 --> 00:23:30,560
That is what happened. 
The other thing Jonathan, I, I 

411
00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:33,120
wanted to look at, there was a 
mention of a sovereign fund, 

412
00:23:33,120 --> 00:23:38,400
wasn't there, although I didn't 
hear any details about that. 

413
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:43,480
And I don't know if that is the 
same thing as a stabilisation 

414
00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:47,760
fund, which was recommended by 
the Tax Reform Commission. 

415
00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:52,600
But I would like to see a bit 
more detail about how much money

416
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:56,400
was going into that because I 
think if, if there's a 

417
00:23:56,400 --> 00:24:01,040
significant amount of money that
could have huge implications 

418
00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:03,800
further down the line. 
If we actually, you know, need 

419
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:07,920
to replace the Causeway, for 
instance, without we could draw 

420
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:09,560
from that. 
It's like Norway's sovereign 

421
00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:11,760
then what's that worth? 
About a trillion dollars now? 

422
00:24:12,120 --> 00:24:15,680
I mean, the budget did speak in 
the first third of it. 

423
00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:21,040
It talked about committing I 
think $100 million a year 

424
00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:25,360
starting in the 2728 or the, you
know, not this year's budget, 

425
00:24:25,360 --> 00:24:28,520
but next year's budget, 
committing $100 million a year 

426
00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:33,760
to an emergency fund 
essentially. 

427
00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:35,720
Was that the stabilization from 
I? 

428
00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:39,120
Think so, yes, to address if 
there's economic problems. 

429
00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:42,920
And then it also talked about 
committing additional funds to 

430
00:24:44,440 --> 00:24:47,960
kind of like a sovereign wealth 
thing, like into investing into 

431
00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:51,440
local businesses to have a good 
return on investment. 

432
00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:56,360
Right, OK. 
It did also mention some funds 

433
00:24:56,360 --> 00:25:00,920
for I read like $5,000,000 I 
think to support like the on 

434
00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:04,640
chain transition and a few other
smaller things like that but 

435
00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:06,280
those are supposed to be like 1 
offs. 

436
00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:09,320
I'll be, I'll be quite honest 
when that, when that kind of 

437
00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:17,560
thing come, when that kind of 
thing is mentioned, my eyes 

438
00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:20,600
glaze over. 
I hate to say it. 

439
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:25,400
So it looks like it looks like 
I'm just called up the Tax 

440
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:28,000
Reform Commission's waterfall 
chart. 

441
00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:30,680
They said stability fund 100 
million. 

442
00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:34,560
So it looks like that has 
happened, that sinking fund 200 

443
00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:36,600
million. 
Yep, that's mentioned as well. 

444
00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:39,360
Although all of those are kind 
of put off until next year's 

445
00:25:39,360 --> 00:25:42,040
budget as I read the as I read 
this budget thing. 

446
00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:46,560
They are because the bulk of the
CIT money will come in for next 

447
00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:51,360
year's budget, some 750 million.
I think he got around 22230 

448
00:25:51,360 --> 00:25:55,160
million from the from the 
various tranches of collection 

449
00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:58,320
that in the last financial year.
So one thing in the budget, it 

450
00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:01,880
talked about CIT and it said 
that, you know, one reason why 

451
00:26:01,880 --> 00:26:04,640
we're not budged, why we're 
committing our budget as if 

452
00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:08,880
there is no CIT even going 
forward as a fiscal rule is 

453
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:13,520
because we expect this, this 
year's CIT to be the kind of the

454
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:16,800
high point and we expect it to 
go down from now on. 

455
00:26:17,360 --> 00:26:18,560
And. 
Until stabilized. 

456
00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:22,120
The 7:50 will be the high point.
I think that's what they said. 

457
00:26:22,320 --> 00:26:25,440
So not this year, the collection
for the next budget. 

458
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:27,320
Right. 
But like for years going 

459
00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:29,440
forward, it's never going 
necessarily going to be this 

460
00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:33,160
high ever again. 
So we can't, we can't budget 

461
00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:35,800
from that type thing. 
Which is, you know, great to 

462
00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:37,160
hear. 
It's extraordinarily sensible, 

463
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:38,160
isn't it? 
Yeah. 

464
00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:42,960
I mean, as I said, I try to read
this budget critically and I 

465
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:46,120
only found a few small things to
complain out, complain about. 

466
00:26:46,120 --> 00:26:49,240
Like I would have liked to see 
an increase in funding for legal

467
00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:50,720
aid. 
There's some support for legal 

468
00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:54,120
aid in terms of the relocation 
of their services, but those 

469
00:26:54,120 --> 00:26:56,560
those are tiny things. 
Overall, I like the budget. 

470
00:26:57,160 --> 00:27:00,080
But Jonathan, one, one of the 
big things is, is going through 

471
00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:02,160
the budget. 
We can only work off the budget 

472
00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:04,480
statement. 
There is the blue book. 

473
00:27:04,600 --> 00:27:08,480
Now, those who aren't aware, 
this is a voluminous book. 

474
00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:11,000
Must be a couple of inches 
thick. 

475
00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:12,720
I've got last year's one in the 
other room. 

476
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:14,520
I think it's. 
What you're using is a 

477
00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:19,080
paperweight, but it it is, it 
goes line by line through every 

478
00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:22,560
ministry. 
What was, what was forecast, 

479
00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:25,640
what was actual next year's 
forecast. 

480
00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:27,360
It breaks down what's spent on 
what. 

481
00:27:27,360 --> 00:27:32,280
And they may well be amongst all
these increases, things like 

482
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:34,280
money for legal aid, I don't 
know. 

483
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:37,640
I mean that's double in the 
detail and it is quite a read 

484
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:40,200
that thing. 
Just just going back to the to 

485
00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:43,280
the tax reform Commission, 
senior healthcare support 

486
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:47,000
recommended 30 million didn't 
get that, but it got a good 

487
00:27:47,000 --> 00:27:52,280
slice under insured healthcare, 
12 million TLC recommended it 

488
00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:55,560
got a slice, didn't it? 
We know employer payroll tax 

489
00:27:55,560 --> 00:28:00,480
reduction and employee payroll 
tax reduction both came in the 

490
00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:04,480
TRC was saying 68 mil and 24 mil
respectively. 

491
00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:08,200
Not seeing the figures, but 
probably going to be near that 

492
00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:11,920
low income healthcare subsidy 
18,000,000 that has happened. 

493
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:14,840
I don't know the figures. 
Utility tax relief, 8 million. 

494
00:28:14,840 --> 00:28:16,800
We certainly got utility tax 
relief. 

495
00:28:17,120 --> 00:28:19,760
What I'm saying is it does look 
like he's stuck to the tax 

496
00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:22,080
reform Commission 
recommendations. 

497
00:28:22,080 --> 00:28:25,200
He said he would. 
But what a politician says he's 

498
00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:28,120
going to do and actually doesn't
don't always match, you know 

499
00:28:28,120 --> 00:28:30,360
that. 
But he has pretty much I think, 

500
00:28:30,360 --> 00:28:33,520
and that's, that says a lot 
actually for the whole system. 

501
00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:36,320
You know that it's gone through 
this kind of debate, this kind 

502
00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:38,560
of consultation, and we got a 
good result out of it. 

503
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:42,360
Yep. 
One other thing from the budget 

504
00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:45,200
that I wanted to highlight, it 
doesn't tell me how much money 

505
00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:50,040
is going to be involved, but 
under the ministry of, what's 

506
00:28:50,040 --> 00:28:53,440
his full title, the Ministry of 
Youth, Social Development and 

507
00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:57,400
Seniors, I want to say that's 
under Minister Tinae Ferbert. 

508
00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:00,960
It talks about introducing. 
What did I write down in my 

509
00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:05,440
notes? 
Yeah, disability unit within the

510
00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:08,840
aging and disability service to 
allow for enhanced care and 

511
00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:10,560
alignment. 
And you know, I think that's 

512
00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:14,000
great. 
A lot of times disabled people 

513
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:16,320
are overlooked. 
Now, I don't know exactly what 

514
00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:18,560
that's going to involve, but 
bringing it in line with the 

515
00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:23,560
United, the UN, the UN 
Convention on the Rights of 

516
00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:26,640
Persons with Disabilities, I'm 
grateful to see that there. 

517
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:30,640
As someone who has a disability 
myself, I'm I'm grateful to see 

518
00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:32,360
that there. 
No, I agree. 

519
00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:35,120
And there was mention as well of
increasing residential care home

520
00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:38,760
places, rebuilding Le Frey 
House, I think and and that's 

521
00:29:38,760 --> 00:29:41,080
critical. 
We know that that ties into the 

522
00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:45,360
extra money going to the Bermuda
Hospitals board, you know, 

523
00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:49,600
because I hate using the frame, 
but bed blockers because and 

524
00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:52,040
it's not their fault. 
There's nowhere to go, these old

525
00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:53,920
people. 
So having used that, see, that's

526
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:58,480
brilliant use of CIT because 
that affects society so much and

527
00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:01,240
it affects the welfare. 
You know, my mother's just gone 

528
00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:04,440
into a residential care home, so
I know what it's like and it's 

529
00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:07,040
really important. 
I guess these elderly people get

530
00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:11,000
settled in a place, really. 
We should address senior issues.

531
00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:14,920
I think we should dedicate a 
series or a closer look to 

532
00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:17,400
senior issues in Bermuda going 
forward. 

533
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:20,120
Well, I'm almost there so I can 
talk about it. 

534
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:25,960
But yeah, overall my first read 
of the budget, my first 

535
00:30:25,960 --> 00:30:28,800
reaction, it's a good budget, I 
like it. 

536
00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:32,120
I'm going to spend the weekend 
listening to critical viewpoints

537
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:35,920
and try to meditate on it and 
see are they good criticisms? 

538
00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:37,520
Do they raise issues I hadn't 
thought of? 

539
00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:40,760
But my first reaction is I like 
the budget. 

540
00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:44,960
It's a good legacy budget for 
the Premier to go out on as his 

541
00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:47,440
last budget as Premier and 
finance minister. 

542
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:50,360
I like it. 
Well done to well done to the 

543
00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:51,960
Premier. 
Yeah, I agree. 

544
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:56,080
Well done to the Premier. 
I think this benefits virtually 

545
00:30:56,080 --> 00:31:00,120
everybody in Bermuda, you know, 
and I think it's great and we'll

546
00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:03,840
get our potholes fixed. 
I am looking forward to see what

547
00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:06,640
the opposition reply is going to
be and what their thoughts are 

548
00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:09,760
that I'm hoping they raise good 
points that I haven't thought 

549
00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:11,560
of, so I'm looking forward to 
that. 

550
00:31:11,560 --> 00:31:14,280
We'll see. 
I think just prior to the 

551
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:17,840
budget, we were trying to get 
some more people in to, to 

552
00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:19,280
comment. 
We left it a bit too late 

553
00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:22,320
unfortunately, but some people 
have subsequently got back to us

554
00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:26,640
and kind of interested in in 
taking part on a, on a panel on 

555
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:28,800
on a round table panel. 
I think we should pursue that, 

556
00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:30,920
Jonathan. 
Yeah, I look forward to it. 

557
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:32,720
I mean that they're all going to
come with their different 

558
00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:35,680
perspectives and they will see 
things we didn't see. 

559
00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:37,640
Absolutely, I'm looking forward 
to that. 

560
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:41,200
It's kind of, it's taken 
everybody by surprise that it's 

561
00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:44,560
a great budget. 
Here we go. 

562
00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:48,400
Well, I hope you enjoyed that. 
If you've got any observations, 

563
00:31:48,680 --> 00:31:53,360
let us know. 
You can WhatsApp 5342205, you 

564
00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:56,720
can e-mail the news 
navs@gmail.com or you can get us

565
00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:01,120
on any of our social media 
sites, the usual suspects there.

566
00:32:02,160 --> 00:32:05,400
Please let us know. 
We will circle back on this. 

567
00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:09,800
We'll listen to the budget reply
from the opposition next Friday 

568
00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:14,920
and maybe take the 2 together 
and go back having had some time

569
00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:16,880
to analyse the budget in more 
detail. 

570
00:32:17,160 --> 00:32:18,960
Go back and have another deep 
dive on it. 

571
00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:21,600
Jonathan, what do you think? 
No, I think that's fantastic. 

572
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:24,080
Until then, take care.