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Most of us only think about 
movement when something hurts. 

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But what if that pain is your 
body's way of warning you that 

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something is out of balance? 
We do not feel pain in our body,

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it's our brain that interprets 
and produces what pain mean. 

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For Vinny Crispino, an 8 time 
All American athlete who broke 

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his back and spent years chasing
relief, that realization changed

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everything. 
My brain got so good at 

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rehearsing pain long after the 
herniations healed, long after 

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the fracture healed, even basic 
sensation was triggering a pain 

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alarm. 
He uncovered a connection 

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between pain, movement and 
mindfulness that most people 

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never see. 
You have to heal the nervous 

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system. 
It's the driver. 

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Though it might not have started
the fire, it's what's keeping it

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alive. 
So whether you're rebuilding 

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from injury or just trying to 
future proof your body, this 

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episode will challenge 
everything you thought you knew 

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about how the body heals and 
stays strong. 

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Let's dig in. 
Vinny, welcome. 

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Thanks for having me we're. 
Doing something a little 

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different this episode, as 
anyone who is watching can 

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already tell, we are in a 
squatted position. 

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I heard you say in another 
podcast that you were on that I 

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listened to, that you had been, 
I think it was mentioned like 

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towards towards the end that you
were in a squatted position for 

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the entire time. 
And so I took that as a 

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challenge to be in a squatting 
position the whole time while we

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record. 
We'll see how how far we make 

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it. 
I'm sure you you will make it a 

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lot longer than. 
That so far so good. 

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We're doing great. 
It's a good start. 

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But what people do not know is 
that we've already been 

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squatting for quite some time 
while the crew has set up the 

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lighting and the audio and all 
that. 

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So yeah. 
So this isn't our start, just so

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we're. 
Yeah, exactly. 20 minutes. 

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Yep. 
So why is squatting such a 

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foundational position? 
Squatting is a position of rest,

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so when we're in the bottom of 
the squat, it is this. 

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Perfect reflection of muscle 
balance. 

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So when you've got great ankle 
mobility, knee mobility, hip 

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mobility, the muscles in the 
front of the thigh work just as 

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well. 
With muscles in the back of the 

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thigh, we're allowed to assume a
position of rest when we have 

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imbalance, when there's 
dysfunction, when there's 

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restriction or tension. 
A squat is no longer a capable 

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thing. 
One of the best parts about a 

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squat is the more time we spend 
in this, the more in tune the 

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relationship with our body 
becomes. 

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So you're going to find that the
muscles in the front and the 

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back can better communicate 
together. 

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It is it. 
It's a staple of health. 

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It's a staple of longevity. 
And you're going to hear, you 

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know, the Internet's in no short
supply of people saying that 

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squatting is a part of 
longevity. 

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If we can develop the ability to
get on and off the ground and be

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comfortable at rest in the 
bottom of the squat, we're 

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probably going to have a much 
higher quality of life. 

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So it's definitely something to 
prioritize. 

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And I've heard that a lot of 
other cultures just do this very

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naturally and normally even it 
like instead of sitting, it's 

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not unusual for people to just 
hang out in a squatted position,

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you know, like eating a meal or 
drinking a beverage or 

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something. 
Yeah, Well, I'm sure even what I

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just started off with, which is 
a squat as a position of rest, 

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you're going to have probably 
most of the audience and most 

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people are going to say no, 
that's no, because that's not my

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experience of it. 
It's a position of extreme work 

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and discomfort. 
And that's usually what happens 

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in the West in the modern 
developed countries. 

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But then you start traveling 
abroad and you start seeing 

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people having conversations like
this. 

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They eat meals like this, they 
work like this. 

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And we start finding that 
they're capable of resting in a 

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squat because they're just 
spending more time in it. 

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And it's only the people that 
don't spend time in a squat 

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position struggle with a squat 
position. 

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And it could almost be that 
simple, which is the more you do

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it, the easier it gets. 
So interesting. 

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And there's also a debate on not
necessarily being in a deep 

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squat like this, but when when 
you're squatting, I was taught 

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that you should push your knees 
out. 

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But now I know people are saying
like, no, it's OK for the knees 

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to go forward over the toes. 
What's your opinion on that? 

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The knees over the toes or the 
restriction of knees over toes 

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came in a 1970 study from 
Michigan and these Michigan. 

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These Michigan researchers 
looked at knee pressure, and 

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what they found is that if the 
knees move forward over the 

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toes, pressure on the knees 
increase 28%. 

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So anybody with knee issues 
heard, oh, well, there's more 

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pressure on the knee, 28%. 
We don't want that. 

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And in the 70s, when you don't 
really have a lot of information

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and you you latch on to this 28%
increase knee pressure, you're 

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going to come to the conclusion 
that squatting is bad for your 

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knees. 
Fast forward to 2003, 

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researchers again wanted to take
a look at that. 

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They did the same test and they 
found, Yep, that's still true. 

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When the knees move in front of 
the toes, knee pressure 

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increases 28%. 
But they did not look at the 

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hip, pelvis and the spine. 
And what these researchers 

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showed is that if you allow the 
knees to go in front of the 

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toes, knee pressure increases 
28%, but hip and back pressure 

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reduces 1000 percent, 1000%. 
So when we look at the body and 

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these really narrow views of 
what does this do to 1 joint, we

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try to isolate and we come up 
with all these, like, silly 

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rules. 
The feet should be straight, the

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knee should be out. 
They shouldn't go over the toes.

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But when we take a step back 
from the science and we look at 

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what is natural and what's 
fluid, what we're left with is, 

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yeah, OK, we should be able to 
squat with the feet out. 

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That's great. 
But we should also have the 

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ability to have our feet 
straight and our knees together.

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And this should still be 
comfortable. 

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And it's only when we remove all
of these rules of what movement 

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should and shouldn't be where we
actually get to back to a 

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natural state. 
And you're going to find this 

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all the time. 
You see people and you ask them 

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to squat and it's like knees 
out, chest up, shoulders back, 

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chin down, brace the core. 
Do this. 

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We're trying to like out think 
movement. 

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And what about the people who 
are better squatters than 

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developed countries? 
They're not learned. 

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They don't have personal 
trainers, they're not learning 

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about the science and what's 
happening in the laboratories 

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with the bio mechanics and what 
joint should and should move. 

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They are moving fluidly and 
comfortably and intuitively. 

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So if we want to move more 
fluidly, we actually have to not

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try to out think things and we 
have to put all the logic and 

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the thought to the side, get 
back to our breath and figure 

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out what is the easiest way to 
move. 

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You know, if you and I were in a
dangerous situation, you 

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wouldn't think, OK, I've got to 
get to safety. 

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Shoulders back, glutes engaged, 
ABS fire. 

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Don't rotate the hips move the 
you wouldn't do this whole 

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exhaustive movement checklist. 
You would just move intuitively 

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to safety. 
But somewhere down the road, 

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with modern research and science
and all these rules, we become 

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like really restricted and it's 
almost like disconnected us from

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ourselves and our bodies. 
Yeah, I always think about that 

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phrase. 
I think it might be the title of

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the book, Civilized Beyond 
Common Sense. 

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Like, like you said, we're 
creating all these rules for 

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things based on this research, 
but we're forgetting that 

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intuition that we all have about
like, what feels right and what 

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doesn't. 
I want to dive into your story 

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because it's wild. 
You were a collegiate all 

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American swimmer and you held 
over 30 records in the state of 

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Colorado before you ended up 
breaking your back in a surfing 

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accident. 
And I listened to your first 

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podcast episode where you talk 
about your story. 

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It's really good listen. 
I felt like I was in it right 

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there with you. 
The craziest thing to me, the 

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thing that really stood out was 
that after you broke your back 

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in the ocean, you made it back 
to shore. 

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There was no one on shore. 
You were in excruciating pain 

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and you got in your car and 
drove 40 minutes home. 

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I think you slept that night and
then went to the ER the the next

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day. 
Why? 

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Why did you just not go straight
to the ER? 

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Like things were popping. 
I mean, it sounded absolutely 

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like excruciating. 
Like I just curious like what 

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what personality trait in you do
you think caused you to, to 

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just, Nope, I'm going to go 
home. 

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I'm not going to, I'm not going 
to get help for this. 

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Tell me you had childhood trauma
without telling me you've had 

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childhood trauma. 
You know that. 

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That's what pain does. 
It just amplifies and reveals 

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everything. 
I learned at a young age to deal

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with pain internally and 
silently. 

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I learned that my needs didn't 
really matter and I learned to 

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just keep it to myself. 
And I learned that the way I was

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feeling and thinking was a 
burden in my environment. 

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So when I had this traumatic, 
back breaking, life changing 

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injury, my first gut instinct 
and reaction wasn't let's go be 

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vulnerable and ask people for 
help. 

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It was I need to be alone right 
now because that's how I did 

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everything. 
That's how I process stuff when 

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things got emotionally 
challenging or hard and I was 

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always fearful of like 
expressing things and not them 

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not being met the right way or 
being misinterpreted. 

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When you're shaped like that as 
a child, you learn to just go 

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inward into your cave when 
things get hard and when there's

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stress, pressure and adversity 
or a back breaking pain or an 

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injury, you're probably going to
default to what you know. 

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And what I know was not being 
vulnerable and reaching out and 

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calling for help. 
What I knew was to isolate and I

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knew how to be by myself and so.
It. 

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You know, it's not a far stretch
that in a traumatic situation 

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that was a default mechanism 
that showed up. 

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Yeah, interesting. 
And you're also very driven, I 

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think. 
And so do you think though the 

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flip side of that was also also 
fueled you in your healing 

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journey to like I'm going to get
once you kind of came out of 

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that like this mindset, I'm 
going to get better. 

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Obviously, you're thriving now. 
So do you think there's like a 

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flip side to that of it also 
allowed you once you kind of 

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came out of that slump to go all
into your recovery and to 

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building this business is 
helping so many people recover 

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from pain also? 
Yeah, You know, I'll, I'll 

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00:09:58,200 --> 00:10:05,360
explain it like this. 
If if you hold a cup of hot tea 

201
00:10:05,560 --> 00:10:09,640
and somebody bumps into you and 
that tea spills, why did the tea

202
00:10:09,640 --> 00:10:12,360
spill? 
It over it overflowed, the cup 

203
00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:15,200
was too full and you were off 
balance. 

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00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:17,960
Yeah, and somebody bumped into 
you, right? 

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00:10:18,040 --> 00:10:22,040
Somebody else's fault. 
If you were holding water, the 

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00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:23,240
water would have spelt. 
Yes. 

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00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:25,880
If you were holding nothing, 
nothing would have spelt. 

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00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:29,560
Life is going to bump you, and 
pain does that. 

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00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:32,720
If you've ever experienced 
chronic pain or even an injury 

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00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:36,120
that's been around for a while, 
could just be acute pain, you're

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00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:39,160
going to realize that that's 
life bumping you and it's going 

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00:10:39,160 --> 00:10:42,400
to Rock You because it's 
uncomfortable and it hurts. 

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00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:45,920
And it's really easy to love 
your body when it feels good. 

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00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:49,560
It's really easy to have a good 
relationship with yourself when 

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00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:53,280
you look good. 
It's really easy to be mindful 

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00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:56,920
and present when life is very 
easy and the world is impressing

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00:10:56,920 --> 00:11:00,040
on you. 
But when you have something like

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00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:04,440
a traumatic injury and what's 
actually inside you is like 

219
00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:08,680
anger and frustration and 
resentment and betrayal and all 

220
00:11:08,680 --> 00:11:11,120
the things, you know, I'm 
talking like the shadow stuff, 

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the stuff that we try really not
to show the world when pain 

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00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:17,680
bumps you, which it will. 
It's just a matter of if and 

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00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:21,280
it's a matter of when and how 
it's going to spill over 

224
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whatever's in your cup. 
And this was my journey, though 

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00:11:25,560 --> 00:11:29,560
it started with a back breaking 
injury, the subsequent entire 

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00:11:29,560 --> 00:11:32,880
decade was me coming back to 
myself and understanding what 

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00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:36,080
that even meant. 
And that was really hard for me 

228
00:11:36,080 --> 00:11:39,240
because I remember what it was 
like being in a doctor's office 

229
00:11:39,240 --> 00:11:41,280
and seeing my broken back on an 
X-ray board. 

230
00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:44,520
I remember being able to see the
mess physically. 

231
00:11:44,760 --> 00:11:47,280
I could point to the spot 
physically in my body where it 

232
00:11:47,280 --> 00:11:49,440
hurt. 
And all that's true. 

233
00:11:49,440 --> 00:11:52,400
I had all the physical evidence 
that things were wrong and the 

234
00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:57,000
structure was affected, but why 
it took so long to heal was 

235
00:11:57,000 --> 00:12:01,160
because of how I actually showed
up and the internal dialogue and

236
00:12:01,160 --> 00:12:04,720
the relationship with myself. 
How I sabotage myself when I 

237
00:12:04,720 --> 00:12:07,520
started to feel better and I 
stopped doing my exercises 

238
00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:11,320
because even though I didn't 
want to be in pain, I actually 

239
00:12:11,320 --> 00:12:13,080
didn't feel like I deserve to be
out of it. 

240
00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:18,520
And even if things felt good, 
like when I, when my back 

241
00:12:18,520 --> 00:12:21,760
actually started to feel better 
and I started to understand what

242
00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:24,200
it felt like to have no pain, I 
started becoming an ultra 

243
00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:27,120
marathon runner because I didn't
know what to do without pain in 

244
00:12:27,120 --> 00:12:29,480
my life. 
You know, it's much like we're 

245
00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:31,680
in the countryside right now. 
This place is beautiful. 

246
00:12:32,080 --> 00:12:35,120
But if you're used to being in 
the city and the traffic sounds,

247
00:12:35,120 --> 00:12:39,440
the people screaming, you know, 
chaos, and then you come out 

248
00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:41,120
here and it's quiet and it's 
calm. 

249
00:12:41,600 --> 00:12:44,040
That silence is almost 
uncomfortable, not because it's 

250
00:12:44,040 --> 00:12:46,440
bad, but because it's different 
and it's new. 

251
00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:50,160
And when you normalize 
discomfort and you normalize 

252
00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:54,600
pain and all of these sensations
that you're used to, and then 

253
00:12:54,600 --> 00:12:58,840
all of a sudden you realize you 
can remove them, you start to 

254
00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:01,360
find different ways to recreate 
those. 

255
00:13:01,680 --> 00:13:05,000
At first it was like getting a 
lot of tattoos because I didn't 

256
00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:07,600
know how to navigate feeling 
good. 

257
00:13:08,080 --> 00:13:10,280
And then I ran out of real 
estate and I wasn't going to go 

258
00:13:10,280 --> 00:13:11,760
on the face you. 
Know I had to good choice. 

259
00:13:11,760 --> 00:13:12,760
I knew it. 
Thank you. 

260
00:13:12,760 --> 00:13:13,840
Thank. 
You very much. 

261
00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:16,680
I'm glad you stopped one of my 
better choices as a young man. 

262
00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:20,400
But then, you know, when I ran 
out of real estate, it's like, 

263
00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:23,440
OK, well, what other forms of 
pain can I go find? 

264
00:13:23,440 --> 00:13:26,400
And then I realized, yeah, 
running sucks. 

265
00:13:27,160 --> 00:13:28,160
Found it. 
Let's do that. 

266
00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:29,640
Yeah, let's. 
Just go do that so. 

267
00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:30,960
I'm starting to really feel 
this. 

268
00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:33,400
Yeah, Are you are you're. 
You're probably good. 

269
00:13:33,400 --> 00:13:35,840
It's talking. 
OK, does what does what I'm 

270
00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:38,600
feeling say something about like
with the part of me that I that 

271
00:13:38,600 --> 00:13:43,960
maybe needs work because I feel 
it in my, it's like probably my 

272
00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:47,240
hamstrings and like my calves, 
like the in the backside of my 

273
00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:49,920
leg. 
On both legs, yes. 

274
00:13:50,200 --> 00:13:51,680
OK. 
I feel so tight. 

275
00:13:51,800 --> 00:13:55,320
So this is one of the ways that 
we have to learn how to work 

276
00:13:55,320 --> 00:13:59,560
with sensation. 
So notice how the brain Albert 

277
00:13:59,560 --> 00:14:02,440
Einstein once had this great 
example where he wrote 10 

278
00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:04,800
questions, 10 simple math 
questions on a board. 

279
00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:08,400
Nine of them were right. 
The 10th 1 was wrong and the 

280
00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:10,560
entire class only focused on the
wrong thing. 

281
00:14:11,480 --> 00:14:15,880
We tend to hyper fixate on the 
discomfort so yes that's true. 

282
00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:17,120
I can see it. 
Yep. 

283
00:14:17,240 --> 00:14:19,440
Yes, you're fixated. 
It becomes loud. 

284
00:14:19,680 --> 00:14:22,080
It becomes a loop. 
Tell me something that feels 

285
00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:29,000
good right now. 
My my upper body feels pretty 

286
00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:33,760
good, yeah. 
My butt feels fine, yeah. 

287
00:14:34,560 --> 00:14:37,160
So when you're working with your
body like this, all of those 

288
00:14:37,160 --> 00:14:40,440
things are true for me, too. 
The legs are talking, and that's

289
00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:43,200
not the whole story. 
And understanding that you can 

290
00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:47,000
hold many stories at once that 
yeah, joints are talking, nerves

291
00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:48,680
are waking up, things are 
getting tired. 

292
00:14:49,080 --> 00:14:52,120
And I'm so thankful that I can 
actually do this with everything

293
00:14:52,120 --> 00:14:54,800
my body's been through. 
Thank you, ankles, for holding 

294
00:14:54,800 --> 00:14:57,040
up right now. 
Thank you lower back for being 

295
00:14:57,040 --> 00:15:00,520
able to sit through this. 
Smile all right, let's let's 

296
00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:04,120
change some things let's get my.
Thanks. 

297
00:15:04,120 --> 00:15:06,200
I don't know if I would have let
myself do that. 

298
00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,800
We'll get back into it, 
straightening out my leg right 

299
00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:11,800
now. 
Look, you just had a very real 

300
00:15:11,800 --> 00:15:15,000
experience. 
Now, the cool thing is, is you 

301
00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:16,320
just immediately got out of 
that. 

302
00:15:16,840 --> 00:15:20,120
When you're somebody who's in a 
body where that is the 

303
00:15:20,320 --> 00:15:24,720
background noise all day long, 
almost every day, anytime you 

304
00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:28,120
bend forward to pick up your 
kids or clean something up or 

305
00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:31,560
sit and work, when that noise is
in the background. 

306
00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:35,520
Imagine how loud it gets and how
the brain just starts hyper 

307
00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:36,640
fixating on it. 
Yeah. 

308
00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:38,840
And we almost become like tunnel
vision. 

309
00:15:38,840 --> 00:15:41,160
I call it like hawk mode. 
You know, the way like a hawk 

310
00:15:41,160 --> 00:15:43,000
looks at something. 
It's so like, fierce and 

311
00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:45,240
intense. 
That's most people's 

312
00:15:45,240 --> 00:15:48,480
relationship with pain. 
Is to like resist it hyper 

313
00:15:48,480 --> 00:15:49,280
fixate. 
On it, yeah. 

314
00:15:49,640 --> 00:15:51,880
Of course. 
Yeah, and so begins the 

315
00:15:51,880 --> 00:15:55,440
formation of becoming chronic. 
Yeah, OK, so let's get into that

316
00:15:55,520 --> 00:15:59,360
in regards to your story. 
So give us a glimpse into what 

317
00:15:59,360 --> 00:16:02,920
the next 5-10 years looked like 
for you after the accident. 

318
00:16:03,920 --> 00:16:07,800
It looked much like everybody 
else's journey who's struggling 

319
00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:09,520
with their body. 
What do you do? 

320
00:16:09,520 --> 00:16:11,120
You first start off with the 
doctors. 

321
00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:13,520
You get the drugs and the 
prescriptions. 

322
00:16:13,520 --> 00:16:16,760
You get the pain pills. 
You get the anti inflammatories,

323
00:16:16,760 --> 00:16:20,240
the muscle relaxers, the whole 
chemical western concoction of 

324
00:16:20,240 --> 00:16:22,440
like how to manage pain and try 
to suppress it. 

325
00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:24,960
Yeah, that's, that's an 
interesting piece. 

326
00:16:25,160 --> 00:16:29,320
So you would you were seeing a 
like pain management expert tell

327
00:16:29,320 --> 00:16:31,000
us what that experience was 
actually like. 

328
00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:33,400
So annoying. 
I thought pain management meant 

329
00:16:34,280 --> 00:16:36,160
we were going to like. 
Getting free from pain. 

330
00:16:36,480 --> 00:16:38,120
Like what? 
What are you going to show me to

331
00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:39,920
go fix it? 
And it was just what 

332
00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:42,040
prescription makes sense for the
pain. 

333
00:16:42,760 --> 00:16:44,760
And that's what it was. 
And I think that was my 

334
00:16:44,760 --> 00:16:47,560
breakdown. 
So for the first five years 

335
00:16:47,560 --> 00:16:50,960
after breaking my back, it was 
bouncing around from doctor to 

336
00:16:50,960 --> 00:16:57,000
doctor, PT, yoga, Cairo massage,
like whatever anybody else has 

337
00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:59,240
access to. 
And I was even desperate enough 

338
00:16:59,240 --> 00:17:02,120
to go look online for like the 
gurus, what are like the people 

339
00:17:02,120 --> 00:17:05,400
doing the unconventional things.
I met this guy in line who 

340
00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:07,960
swears, you know, he did like 
the hammer on the spine. 

341
00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:09,640
That's what it needed to be 
fixed, not. 

342
00:17:09,720 --> 00:17:10,839
Heard of that? 
Don't do it. 

343
00:17:10,839 --> 00:17:13,480
Literally hammering. 
Yeah, it's literally a chisel 

344
00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:17,520
and doing 1 vertebrae at a time 
to put them back in place, which

345
00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:20,359
makes no sense. 
But I wasn't here for sense, I 

346
00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:23,599
was here for pain relief. 
Yeah, and pain hijacks your 

347
00:17:23,599 --> 00:17:26,240
senses really fast. 
So you start doing really 

348
00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:33,040
rational things like I did. 
And it wasn't until year 6 where

349
00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:36,360
IA brand new pain management 
clinic opened up in Calabasas. 

350
00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:40,880
And I went to it and I was 
feeling hopeful. 6 years of this

351
00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:42,560
thing, what's going on with my 
body? 

352
00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:45,560
Why aren't I getting better? 
And I remember leaving that 

353
00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:50,040
doctor's office with just a 
brand new prescription, more 

354
00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:52,280
drugs than anybody should be 
prescribed. 

355
00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:54,960
And like, that was it. 
That was their grand genius 

356
00:17:54,960 --> 00:17:57,480
plan, nothing else. 
There was no. 

357
00:17:57,480 --> 00:17:59,360
Switching up the prescription. 
Yeah, it was switching up. 

358
00:17:59,840 --> 00:18:01,040
It actually wasn't even 
switching it. 

359
00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:05,480
It was giving more increasing. 
It was just more narcotics and 

360
00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:10,920
I, I had this breakdown that, 
and it was a great breakdown. 

361
00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:13,840
It was a realization that 
nobody's going to care about 

362
00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:16,880
this more than I do. 
Nobody is going to come save me.

363
00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:19,960
Like I've got to do it myself. 
And that's why I put myself back

364
00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:25,360
through school and I, I just 
became a sponge of what the hell

365
00:18:25,360 --> 00:18:27,960
is the body? 
How does it work and how do you 

366
00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:30,400
put it together and come back 
after a life changing entry like

367
00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:31,800
this? 
And what did you discover? 

368
00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:36,760
Some really uncomfortable truths
and it's a hard conversation to 

369
00:18:36,760 --> 00:18:40,000
have because if we don't have 
this conversation the right way,

370
00:18:40,120 --> 00:18:43,080
it could be very invalidating 
for people. 

371
00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:48,920
By the time I got to throwing 
myself into modern education, 

372
00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:56,720
everything was about the body. 
The so as muscle, you have to 

373
00:18:56,720 --> 00:19:00,280
release this muscle. 
If you saw a foot person, all of

374
00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:01,800
your back pain was coming from 
your feet. 

375
00:19:02,200 --> 00:19:04,320
If you saw a neurologist, 
everything's coming from your 

376
00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:06,600
nerves. 
If you saw a roll for hope, 

377
00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:08,680
Nope, it's your fascia. 
Everything else is fine, but 

378
00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:11,440
it's your fascia. 
Everybody was trying to pick 

379
00:19:11,440 --> 00:19:15,160
apart the body piece by piece 
and system by system, and 

380
00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:19,520
specialize in that system. 
Not in any wrong or malicious 

381
00:19:19,520 --> 00:19:21,760
way, but because that's how 
we're taught about the body. 

382
00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:24,080
Go back to like young elementary
school. 

383
00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:27,080
We have the skeletal system, 
we've got the respiratory 

384
00:19:27,080 --> 00:19:29,680
system. 
We learn about things and parts 

385
00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:32,960
and pieces, but if you think 
about it, we all formed in the 

386
00:19:32,960 --> 00:19:36,400
womb as one complete system. 
Sounds about right for western 

387
00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:39,000
medicine. 
Something's going on with your 

388
00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:41,720
skin, you see a dermatologist. 
If it's your hormones, you see 

389
00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:44,640
an endocrinologist. 
And yeah, I think Western 

390
00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:48,640
medicine is just so quick to 
segment every part of the body 

391
00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:52,200
and not see it as a whole. 
Yeah, we've got a problem here 

392
00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:54,400
on our face. 
So let's go look for the expert 

393
00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:58,320
who's working on the face. 
And your knee jerk reaction 

394
00:19:58,320 --> 00:20:00,880
isn't? 
Well, let me look at the person 

395
00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:02,800
who's having the problem with 
the face. 

396
00:20:03,200 --> 00:20:05,680
What are their habits? 
What is their lifestyle? 

397
00:20:05,880 --> 00:20:08,320
What does their food look like? 
What does their sleep look like?

398
00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:10,800
What environment are they 
putting themselves into? 

399
00:20:11,360 --> 00:20:13,880
And Western medicine's great. 
And this isn't a dog against 

400
00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:17,720
that, because if I get into a 
traumatic accident, I'm not 

401
00:20:17,720 --> 00:20:19,200
going to go to a holistic 
specialist. 

402
00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:22,520
I'm going to go to a triage 
specialist maybe. 

403
00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:24,600
Maybe not. 
Maybe I'll go on there. 

404
00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:25,640
Maybe you'll wait a week and 
then. 

405
00:20:25,680 --> 00:20:27,440
Go. 
Yeah, I'll probably right. 

406
00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:31,200
That's exactly what will happen.
No, that's exactly what would 

407
00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:32,720
happen. 
I know better. 

408
00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:34,640
I know what I'm doing here. 
Let me put the pieces back 

409
00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:38,600
together. 
And so I started to see that I 

410
00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:42,000
had all the exercises or as much
as I thought one could have. 

411
00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:46,760
I scoured the Internet and these
educational companies and these 

412
00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:48,800
resources. 
I acquired credentials. 

413
00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:52,200
What are the physical tools to 
solve this problem? 

414
00:20:53,640 --> 00:20:58,800
And the reality was my fracture 
healed, was healed, spent six 

415
00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:01,240
years. 
What we know is tissue reliably 

416
00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:03,160
heals. 
If you cut your skin at heals. 

417
00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:06,040
If you break a bone at heals. 
I didn't realize that a broken 

418
00:21:06,040 --> 00:21:09,840
back could heal like that 
because initially you were. 

419
00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:12,360
The recommendation was that you 
should have surgery, which you 

420
00:21:12,360 --> 00:21:15,320
declined, but it ended up 
healing on its own. 

421
00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:19,520
Yeah, I guess I've always 
thought that like a broken back 

422
00:21:19,520 --> 00:21:22,120
is something that maybe you 
would need a back brace for or 

423
00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:24,320
yeah, surgery or something. 
But. 

424
00:21:24,320 --> 00:21:27,280
That's the treatment right now 
for it and some cases that's 

425
00:21:27,280 --> 00:21:29,440
rightfully so, especially if 
there's like a spinal cord. 

426
00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:31,520
And that's the whole that's to 
jump into. 

427
00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:34,520
Let's go fuse the area. 
Let's not put the spinal cord at

428
00:21:34,520 --> 00:21:36,280
risk. 
Let's go give this person a 

429
00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:38,920
brace. 
Let's not have them be subjected

430
00:21:38,920 --> 00:21:41,520
to anything that's unstable that
could cause severe central 

431
00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:43,240
nervous system damage to the 
spinal cord. 

432
00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:50,640
So all of that makes sense and 
your body can heal, and it's 

433
00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:55,200
actually quite good at healing 
the problem, even if it started 

434
00:21:55,200 --> 00:21:58,600
off with structural like what 
mine did, I can point to the day

435
00:21:58,600 --> 00:22:01,880
and the time that my back broke.
I had all the physical evidence 

436
00:22:01,880 --> 00:22:04,160
in the world this was a physical
problem. 

437
00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:07,320
Why the hell weren't the 
exercises working? 

438
00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:11,400
Why were the back pain 
specialists who are brilliant 

439
00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:14,280
people in this field, why was 
that not helping? 

440
00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:20,440
And where my education led me is
what doesn't show up on Mr. is 

441
00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:26,760
which is your nervous system and
how you think and how you feel, 

442
00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:29,400
how your brain interprets 
sensation. 

443
00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:33,400
What I didn't understand at the 
time and, and I want to be 

444
00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:35,440
really mindful here. 
If you would have told me 

445
00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:38,520
halfway through my journey here,
hey, then the reason why you're 

446
00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:41,840
not healing is because of your 
relationship with yourself, I 

447
00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:44,360
would have flipped you off and I
would said that's not true, 

448
00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:47,920
you're wrong. 
I remember being that defensive 

449
00:22:47,920 --> 00:22:52,440
guy because I had the evidence 
that that's what was true for me

450
00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:54,360
and I couldn't have been more 
wrong. 

451
00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:58,160
And that's the hard pill that 
needed to be swallowed. 

452
00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:04,440
My brain got so good at 
rehearsing pain long after the 

453
00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:07,520
herniations healed, long after 
the fracture healed. 

454
00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:12,160
Even basic sensation was 
triggering a pain alarm. 

455
00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:14,400
And that's the case for a lot of
people, right? 

456
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:18,240
I mean, I think I've heard you 
say that for 25% of people, the 

457
00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:22,160
pain still remains even after 
the body structurally has 

458
00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:24,000
healed. 
So what's going on with that? 

459
00:23:27,360 --> 00:23:33,400
Here's what's objectively true. 
Everybody has a brain. 

460
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:40,320
We do not feel pain in our body.
It's our brain that interprets 

461
00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:44,480
and produces what pain means. 
So for example, like we don't 

462
00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:46,440
see with our eyes, we see with 
our brain. 

463
00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:48,880
You can have perfect functioning
eyes, but if you have brain 

464
00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:52,360
damage, it affects your vision. 
We don't hear with our ears, we 

465
00:23:52,360 --> 00:23:54,320
hear with our brain. 
Again, same thing if we have 

466
00:23:54,320 --> 00:23:57,560
brain damage or if a brain 
misinterprets auditory signals. 

467
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:03,640
We get really confused here. 
When you have a dysregulated 

468
00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:07,960
nervous system and you have an 
injurious event, like I did a 

469
00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:12,680
traumatic accident, you get 
really good at producing pain 

470
00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:15,280
responses in the brain. 
Here's what that means. 

471
00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:19,880
There was a study done in 2012, 
so we're talking like 1313 years

472
00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:22,000
ago now. 
That's 15 years ago. 

473
00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:27,000
This study looked at people who 
just experienced back pain and 

474
00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:32,440
with an 85% accuracy they were 
able to determine not by looking

475
00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:36,560
at the structure or the damage 
or the injury, who was going to 

476
00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:38,760
be in pain a year later. 
How? 

477
00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:42,400
By looking at the brain 
specifically 2 regions of the 

478
00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:45,720
brain, the medial prefrontal 
cortex and the nucleus 

479
00:24:45,720 --> 00:24:48,320
accumbens. 
These are areas of the brain 

480
00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:51,960
that deal with meaning, 
storytelling, threat, and 

481
00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:54,040
reward. 
So I'm talking about fear based 

482
00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:57,000
systems here. 
Is there a reward for pain? 

483
00:24:57,160 --> 00:25:00,680
What is your meaning with pain? 
And they found the more these 

484
00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:04,280
two regions of the brain talk 
together, the significantly the 

485
00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:08,080
higher the chance somebody was 
going to be in chronic pain and 

486
00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:10,960
not heal. 
Even if the injury healed, they 

487
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:13,800
were still going to experience 
the injury the same. 

488
00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:17,400
Because we have to understand 
that our body is riddled with 

489
00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:19,400
nerves. 
Nerves that tell us if something

490
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:21,680
touches us. 
Nerves that tell us if there's 

491
00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:26,200
pressure, heat, cold, warmth, 
whatever it is right now, the 

492
00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:29,000
nerves are giving us a sensation
that we're sitting on, on our 

493
00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:31,720
hips. 
These are all normal neutral 

494
00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:34,680
signals. 
But what happens when your brain

495
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:39,120
misinterprets those signals as 
bad and as harmful, as 

496
00:25:39,120 --> 00:25:42,040
dangerous? 
What happens when you feel 

497
00:25:42,040 --> 00:25:45,080
unsafe as a person? 
And remember that little teacup 

498
00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:48,400
analogy? 
You have fear, anger, and a lack

499
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:51,440
of safety just living inside of 
you because of what you've been 

500
00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:53,880
through. 
And now all of a sudden your 

501
00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:57,080
brain latches onto fear or it 
latches onto pain. 

502
00:25:57,360 --> 00:26:01,600
You are going to replicate that 
pain signal again and again and 

503
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:04,280
rehearse it. 
And the more you rehearse it, 

504
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:07,560
the more it happens. 
Now let me make that real for 

505
00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:12,800
somebody. 
If it hurts to bend forward, you

506
00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:17,120
bend forward and it hurts. 
How many times do you think your

507
00:26:17,120 --> 00:26:20,960
brain needs to experience that 
before it predicts bending 

508
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:23,840
forward is going to hurt? 
Without you even bending 

509
00:26:23,840 --> 00:26:27,480
forward, your brain thinking 
about it is already producing 

510
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:30,600
attention and a lack of safety, 
a fear response. 

511
00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:34,320
This is no different than Pavlov
and his dogs when he was trying 

512
00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:36,600
to figure out what is a 
conditioned response. 

513
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:40,600
And he'd ring a bell, he'd feed 
dogs food, and then the dogs 

514
00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:43,000
would salivate. 
He stopped feeding the dogs 

515
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:46,440
food, kept ringing the bell, and
the dogs would keep salivating. 

516
00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:51,600
So we know conditioned responses
happen, and when you condition 

517
00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:55,120
and rehearse pain, it doesn't 
matter what the injury is. 

518
00:26:55,360 --> 00:26:58,440
It's actually not even about 
structural problems. 

519
00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:03,160
The brain rehearses fear, 
therefore it rehearses pain. 

520
00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:05,880
So you have to heal the nervous 
system essentially. 

521
00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:07,320
You have to heal the nervous 
system. 

522
00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:10,840
It's the driver, though it might
not have started the fire. 

523
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:13,080
It's what's keeping it alive, 
though. 

524
00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:15,000
Maybe there's an autoimmune 
issue. 

525
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:17,840
Maybe there is an actual 
traumatic structural injury or 

526
00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:19,720
an accident. 
Maybe there was something 

527
00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:21,160
congenital that you're born 
with. 

528
00:27:21,520 --> 00:27:26,480
That all could be true. 
But the driver of the pain is 

529
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:31,120
and will always be the nervous 
system and what we now know with

530
00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:33,440
modern science. 
There was a brilliant study done

531
00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:39,640
in 2015. 
They did Mr. IS on 3110 people, 

532
00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:42,160
which I think is a pretty 
significant control group. 

533
00:27:43,120 --> 00:27:49,600
They found that 64% of these 
people without pain had the same

534
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:52,920
Mr. is as the people who have 
pain. 

535
00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:58,960
This disease, herniations, 
stenosis, spondee, all of these 

536
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:01,480
things that we're told this is, 
Yep, This is why your back 

537
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:03,320
hurts. 
You've got spondee, you've got 

538
00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:05,920
degenerative disc disease, 
you've got this going on with 

539
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:08,960
the discs. 
All of that is present in people

540
00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:12,800
without pain. 
So objectively, we know 

541
00:28:12,920 --> 00:28:16,520
structure alone is not the 
driving cause of pain. 

542
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:20,200
It's the nervous system, and 
it's the brain's meaning that it

543
00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:22,960
puts on pain. 
So once you discovered that, 

544
00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:26,000
what did you do to to heal your 
nervous system? 

545
00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:27,520
Well, I first denied the hell 
out of me. 

546
00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:33,440
I resisted every bit of that 
truth because my entire formal 

547
00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:36,400
education was, you know, 
exercise Physiology from 

548
00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:39,240
Stanford School Medicine. 
It was posture alignment therapy

549
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:42,800
through Augusta University. 
Everything in my world was bio 

550
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:45,360
mechanics. 
And I just had to break down 

551
00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:48,720
that entire model and ditch it 
and move into the nervous 

552
00:28:48,720 --> 00:28:50,960
system. 
Yeah, because you were faced 

553
00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:55,120
with this reality of like, 
seeing that, OK, structurally 

554
00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:58,440
everything's good, but but I 
still have this pain. 

555
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:01,720
So it's like wrestling with that
and probably. 

556
00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:04,120
Yeah, just having to be 
confronted with the fact that 

557
00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:08,200
there's more to the story here. 
Yeah, and there I resisted the 

558
00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:10,360
hell out of it. 
And there were two moments, and 

559
00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:14,360
I'll never forget these moments 
where that actually became a 

560
00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:17,400
truth for me and I actually 
experienced what they're talking

561
00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:19,960
about South. 
One of my rehab exercises, which

562
00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:22,640
is probably most people's, is 
doing bridges right. 

563
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:24,640
Laying on the ground, lifting 
your hips up and down. 

564
00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:27,760
For a guy with my history and 
back story, they were a 

565
00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:30,080
nightmare. 
It literally passed all those 

566
00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:32,000
muscles. 
I felt this tug of war. 

567
00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:34,680
Bridges hurt every time I did 
them. 

568
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:37,960
And I'll never forget it. 
It was a Saturday morning early 

569
00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:40,440
in the morning, Try to get my PT
done so I can try and be like a 

570
00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:44,800
present available father find 
these these dreaded bridges came

571
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:48,280
up and I'm doing them and like 
I'm pain wincing. 

572
00:29:48,320 --> 00:29:52,040
This movement sucked. 
And then my son comes in the 

573
00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:54,120
room. 
He was probably like four or 

574
00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:58,120
five at the time. 
And he tells me this little joke

575
00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:02,200
that wasn't even like funny, but
the way he said it, it was so 

576
00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:06,120
hilarious to me in the moment. 
And I just started cracking up 

577
00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:10,760
while doing these bridges. 
And after laughing with him, 

578
00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:12,600
he's giggling. 
He's got those like little kid 

579
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:14,800
belly laughs that just it makes 
me laugh harder. 

580
00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:17,720
And so we were caught in this 
like laughter, hysterical loop. 

581
00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:22,600
And then all of a sudden, like, 
wait a second, I'm doing my 

582
00:30:22,600 --> 00:30:24,280
bridges and like, they don't 
hurt. 

583
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:27,800
What is going on here? 
And I panicked and I thought it 

584
00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:29,360
was a breakthrough. 
What's happening? 

585
00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:34,080
And then the moment my attention
shifted back to my movement, the

586
00:30:34,080 --> 00:30:37,280
pain came right back. 
And so is this weird like little

587
00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:42,840
blip of why did what I was 
focusing on entirely change my 

588
00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:46,080
relationship with something that
was very predictable? 

589
00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:49,000
This movement sucked for me. 
I'm thinking of childbirth as 

590
00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:50,720
you're saying this. 
Tell me more because there was a

591
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:56,960
moment with my, my, my middle 
child, I was in labor and our 

592
00:30:56,960 --> 00:30:59,240
midwife is like trying to figure
out how to make coffee. 

593
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:01,600
OK? 
So that was her biggest concern.

594
00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:04,720
I was literally like, I was 
almost ready to push, OK. 

595
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:05,960
And pushing takes a while for 
me. 

596
00:31:05,960 --> 00:31:09,840
So but I was there, you know, 
and she's like wanting her cup 

597
00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:11,520
of coffee. 
We're at we're at home. 

598
00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:14,320
I've done home births. 
And so she's like, I'm in the 

599
00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:17,080
tub almost ready to push. 
My husband's there. 

600
00:31:17,320 --> 00:31:18,560
She's like going up to my 
husband. 

601
00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:20,960
Like, hey, like, the coffee 
maker is not working. 

602
00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:23,080
I'm doing this and this and it's
not making coffee. 

603
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:24,480
And he's like trying to explain 
it to her. 

604
00:31:25,120 --> 00:31:27,520
And so she goes downstairs, 
comes back up, like, yeah, it 

605
00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:30,520
didn't work. 
And I'm like, it, it sounds like

606
00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:32,760
a nightmare maybe to some 
people, but honestly, it like 

607
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:36,120
took me out of the moment. 
And I'm like, this is great. 

608
00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:37,640
We're. 
This is so casual. 

609
00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:39,000
Like everyone's just hanging 
out. 

610
00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:41,840
She's worried about her coffee. 
This is no big deal. 

611
00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:44,360
I can do this. 
It totally, like, took me out of

612
00:31:44,360 --> 00:31:46,560
the pain that I was feeling in 
that moment. 

613
00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:49,320
So I just thought of that when 
you said that, like I, yeah, 

614
00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:52,720
having having like an outside 
experience that kind of mentally

615
00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:56,960
causes you to feel removed from 
that source of pain for a 

616
00:31:56,960 --> 00:31:58,560
moment. 
It can be really powerful. 

617
00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:02,040
And you just did, maybe not at 
the time with the clinical 

618
00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:04,080
definition of it. 
You did a somatic tracking 

619
00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:07,080
experience. 
You showed your brain that there

620
00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:11,600
is more to the story of what 
you're physically feeling then 

621
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:15,480
you're paying attention to. 
And by shifting your field of 

622
00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:19,240
vision, by shifting your 
attention, you're able to place 

623
00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:22,640
attention differently in your 
brain and body, which then 

624
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:25,560
allows you to come back to it a 
little different. 

625
00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:28,680
How do you do that if you're not
forced to do that like you, like

626
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:31,000
your son came up to you, You 
know, my midwife was making the 

627
00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:32,880
coffee. 
It's like, how do you, how does 

628
00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:36,360
one just muster? 
I mean, I'm sure it's not like 

629
00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:40,240
mustering up the, you know, the 
effort to take yourself out of 

630
00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:42,160
it. 
Like how does that work if you 

631
00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:44,160
aren't met with that 
distraction? 

632
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:46,760
Yeah. 
So the distraction can show you 

633
00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:50,360
that it's possible, but there is
an actual process that you can 

634
00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:52,720
do to actually create that every
single time. 

635
00:32:53,840 --> 00:32:58,560
And that's the gift of pain. 
The sensation being there is the

636
00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:03,120
reminder to do a somatic 
experience, not in the force 

637
00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:04,440
way. 
Every time I feel pain, I've got

638
00:33:04,440 --> 00:33:06,120
to go do this. 
That puts more pressure and 

639
00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:11,320
judgement on the brain. 
But it's in a way of #1 when you

640
00:33:11,320 --> 00:33:16,360
feel a sensation come in is 
actually just observing that, 

641
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:20,480
not reacting to it, not going 
with it, but taking this deep 

642
00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:22,200
breath. 
Oh yeah, there's sensation. 

643
00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:24,240
Oh yeah, the back is talking to 
me. 

644
00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:28,280
That's what's showing up for me.
Almost seeing it as information,

645
00:33:28,280 --> 00:33:31,320
collecting the information and 
taking inventory of it rather 

646
00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:34,440
than letting yourself be 
immersed in it. 

647
00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:39,840
Yeah, because most people are 
going to find that there is no 

648
00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:43,560
observation of the sensation. 
It's a sensation that is 

649
00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:47,000
followed by an immediate 
reaction, and that reaction 

650
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:50,520
amplifies the sensation. 
Oh God, this means I'm broken, 

651
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:52,520
I'm ruined. 
I knew I was doing something 

652
00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:54,120
wrong. 
I'll never get better. 

653
00:33:54,320 --> 00:33:57,720
I'm getting old, I'm failing, I 
hate my body. 

654
00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:01,040
The list goes on. 
And this goes back to that 

655
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:04,240
study, right? 
How we attach meaning to pain 

656
00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:07,040
determines who's going to be 
stuck in this loop. 

657
00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:13,320
So step one is being able to 
actually identify the loop. 

658
00:34:14,159 --> 00:34:18,840
There's that sensation again. 
What is the story that shows up?

659
00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:24,199
For me, it was my back's broken.
Bridges were proof that I was 

660
00:34:24,199 --> 00:34:28,000
broken. 
My son showed me that there is 

661
00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:31,239
possibility that maybe I'm not 
broken because I could do this. 

662
00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:36,199
So step one is identify the 
sensation, identify the loop. 

663
00:34:36,400 --> 00:34:39,000
What do I feel and what is the 
story that shows up? 

664
00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:43,199
Step 2 is being able to 
interpret that sensation. 

665
00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:45,520
Is that story true? 
Is that real? 

666
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:50,960
For me, my interpreting the 
signal? 

667
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:53,840
Remember when your brain 
misinterprets things, that's 

668
00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:56,159
where chronic pain can really 
have its breeding ground. 

669
00:34:56,920 --> 00:35:00,200
It's well, my back isn't broken.
It's no longer broken. 

670
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:02,080
It once was, but it now it's 
not. 

671
00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:06,680
I'm not in any danger here. 
I've got a roof over my head. 

672
00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:09,480
I've got food in my fridge. 
I've got a loving son next to 

673
00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:11,680
me. 
I am safe right now in this 

674
00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:16,240
moment. 
And then Step 3, which is invite

675
00:35:16,240 --> 00:35:18,880
safety back in. 
And maybe it's with a breath, 

676
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:23,600
maybe it's with calm reassurance
that I'm allowed to feel this. 

677
00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:26,000
And that doesn't mean I'm not 
OK. 

678
00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:29,440
I'm allowed to feel this and I 
allow it here. 

679
00:35:29,720 --> 00:35:32,400
There are all of these ways in 
working with sensation. 

680
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:35,280
The problem is, is nobody's born
with these. 

681
00:35:35,680 --> 00:35:38,920
It is a very human thing to feel
something uncomfortable and 

682
00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:42,360
resist it. 
And the challenge is, is we 

683
00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:46,280
treat pain like how we would 
treat nobody. 

684
00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:50,680
We feel bad, We meet ourselves 
with criticism, judgement, a lot

685
00:35:50,680 --> 00:35:53,800
of force, a lot of resistance, a
lot of negativity. 

686
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:56,360
But we wouldn't meet like a 
loved one who's in pain like 

687
00:35:56,360 --> 00:35:58,280
that. 
And that's where the 

688
00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:01,920
interrelationship shows up. 
How you meet sensation 

689
00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:04,600
determines what experience 
you're going to have with it. 

690
00:36:05,280 --> 00:36:11,200
And I like most people had 0 
framework other than a big 

691
00:36:11,200 --> 00:36:14,520
middle finger. 
And other than I hate this it 

692
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:18,240
pain felt like betrayal. 
Every time I felt pain I thought

693
00:36:18,240 --> 00:36:21,680
about this like young strapping 
athlete and now I can't even 

694
00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:27,040
like put shoes on. 
I made pain mean so much that I 

695
00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:31,560
was not just feeling sensation, 
I was feeling my whole identity 

696
00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:33,800
being changed. 
No wonder why it wasn't 

697
00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:36,360
changing. 
No wonder why there was no 

698
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:39,480
exercise in the world that was 
going to change that for me. 

699
00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:46,800
But I learned how to use 
exercise as the stimulus to 

700
00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:49,520
retrain safety and to provide 
reassurance. 

701
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:56,680
And from that moment on, the the
next 13 something years were 

702
00:36:56,680 --> 00:37:01,040
about how do you work with 
sensation when it shows up? 

703
00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:05,240
I give people exercises and 
they're going to feel a lot like

704
00:37:05,240 --> 00:37:07,320
we would have, like we just felt
a lot in a squat. 

705
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:11,200
And then what is the story and 
how do we work with that to 

706
00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:14,040
change the nervous system and 
the capacity of the body to 

707
00:37:14,040 --> 00:37:16,400
heal? 
So it's, it's bringing the mind 

708
00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:19,800
and the body together in the 
exercises, but doing them with 

709
00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:22,840
the right mindset and kind of 
the process that you mentioned. 

710
00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:25,640
And and that's the key to 
getting better. 

711
00:37:25,720 --> 00:37:28,760
Yeah, it's, it's always been the
key because the body can heal. 

712
00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:31,040
There's no like healer out 
there. 

713
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:33,200
We can biohack certain ways and 
inject. 

714
00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:36,600
We can do things to maybe 
facilitate healing, but your 

715
00:37:36,600 --> 00:37:40,040
body's phenomenal at healing. 
The question is, is are you 

716
00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:43,640
going to get in your own way and
make this 10 times harder and 

717
00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:45,360
more intense than it needs to 
be? 

718
00:37:46,160 --> 00:37:49,960
And what if pain was really the 
calling to form a better 

719
00:37:49,960 --> 00:37:53,840
relationship with our self? 
And if we can start to reframe 

720
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:57,560
pain and start to question it, 
maybe with a little bit of 

721
00:37:57,560 --> 00:38:01,600
curiosity, it doesn't become 
this thing that makes us hard 

722
00:38:01,600 --> 00:38:05,080
and tense and that we fight. 
It becomes a sting that we 

723
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:06,760
almost like, what are you here 
to show me? 

724
00:38:06,760 --> 00:38:09,600
What am I missing? 
You're really smart body. 

725
00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:11,760
You are brilliant. 
Like, what? 

726
00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:13,080
Do you know that? 
I don't know. 

727
00:38:13,160 --> 00:38:14,320
Teach me. 
Yeah. 

728
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:16,880
And that's good instinct we can 
feel around with people who 

729
00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:18,480
maybe aren't the right people to
be around. 

730
00:38:18,480 --> 00:38:22,480
Like it's our body talking to 
us, but we vilify. 

731
00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:25,080
Pain is the bad guy. 
It's just a messenger. 

732
00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:26,920
Yeah, it's information. 
That's all it is. 

733
00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:31,600
You also talk about focusing on 
the basics over specifics, which

734
00:38:31,600 --> 00:38:36,200
I think is very counterintuitive
and also probably goes a lot 

735
00:38:36,240 --> 00:38:38,920
against what a lot of 
traditional physical therapy 

736
00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:42,200
would have us believe, that if 
our knee hurts, we need to do 

737
00:38:42,680 --> 00:38:47,480
exercises that read to 
rehabilitate the knee versus it 

738
00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:51,480
may be another part of the body 
that's broken, but it's showing 

739
00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:54,840
up in a totally different area. 
Yeah, all the time. 

740
00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:58,720
And you know, I always say 
people to train the basics 

741
00:38:58,720 --> 00:39:00,760
before specifics for that exact 
reason. 

742
00:39:01,160 --> 00:39:03,360
Yeah, I know your knee hurts. 
I know your back hurts. 

743
00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:06,840
I know you have a specific thing
that you're working through, and

744
00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:10,320
that specific thing naturally 
makes you look for a specific 

745
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:14,040
solution. 
And so begins a looking for the 

746
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:17,720
proverbial needle in a haystack.
If we can take a step back and 

747
00:39:17,720 --> 00:39:20,560
ask basic questions. 
How do both ankles work? 

748
00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:23,920
Do both knees bend? 
How did the hips rotate and flex

749
00:39:23,920 --> 00:39:25,840
and extend? 
What kind of motion does the 

750
00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:28,560
pelvis have have? 
How does the spine move? 

751
00:39:28,640 --> 00:39:30,400
We're talking basic movement 
patterns. 

752
00:39:30,680 --> 00:39:34,760
Can you bend, squat, twist. 
Let's restore the basics of 

753
00:39:34,760 --> 00:39:38,560
human movement. 
And in so many cases, let's 

754
00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:41,760
watch how those little specific 
problems actually clear 

755
00:39:41,760 --> 00:39:46,240
themselves up because a specific
problem you're needing just wake

756
00:39:46,240 --> 00:39:48,800
up one day and say, hey, I'm 
just going to stop working. 

757
00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:51,880
Let's go bone on bone now. 
It's the consequence. 

758
00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:55,440
It's the outcome of all of the 
basics for days, weeks, months 

759
00:39:55,440 --> 00:39:57,920
and years not stacking up to 
work together. 

760
00:39:57,920 --> 00:39:59,640
Yeah, that makes total sense. 
Yeah. 

761
00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:03,640
Why is REST not necessarily the 
best prescription for pain? 

762
00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:05,720
It depends on where you're at in
the injury stage. 

763
00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:08,440
When I just broke my back and 
crushed it against the rock, 

764
00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:10,960
rest was pretty important. 
That's really useful. 

765
00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:16,680
Rest can be a ally in calming 
down your system, but that's 

766
00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:20,640
such a short period of rest 
actually being useful. 

767
00:40:21,600 --> 00:40:23,560
What does movement do? 
Movements medicine. 

768
00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:27,440
And when I say that, I mean 
every time we move, we are 

769
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:31,120
calling in blood, oxygen and 
nutrients into the areas that 

770
00:40:31,120 --> 00:40:33,720
we're moving. 
Every time we move, we are 

771
00:40:33,720 --> 00:40:37,640
flushing out metabolic waste 
products like lactic acid and 

772
00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:40,240
other things that just happen 
when the cells naturally turn 

773
00:40:40,240 --> 00:40:42,920
over. 
Movement is this beautiful 

774
00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:47,200
flushing mechanism. 
And when we choose to not move, 

775
00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:51,360
we never actually get to get the
areas, the nutrients and the 

776
00:40:51,360 --> 00:40:52,760
oxygen in the blood that they 
need. 

777
00:40:53,840 --> 00:40:56,600
And so all of a sudden, and even
the doctor that came out with 

778
00:40:56,600 --> 00:41:00,640
the rice method, which was rest,
ice compress and elevate has 

779
00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:02,800
since recanted. 
This is not really good 

780
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:04,160
information. 
Wow, I was going to ask you 

781
00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:07,520
about icing next. 
It actually slows down the 

782
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:10,000
healing process. 
Is there any circumstance in 

783
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:12,000
which someone should ice an 
injury? 

784
00:41:12,160 --> 00:41:15,160
It can be great for pain relief,
you know, it can be soothing. 

785
00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:18,760
And we're not vilifying ice. 
It shouldn't be the strategy. 

786
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:22,360
Sometimes after I go on my long 
runs, ice just feels great on my

787
00:41:22,360 --> 00:41:25,800
feet and ankles to revitalize 
sensation with so much pavement 

788
00:41:25,800 --> 00:41:28,760
pounding. 
But at the end of the day, rest 

789
00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:31,160
and ice should not be the 
strategy. 

790
00:41:31,360 --> 00:41:34,040
They can be little friends that 
you make along the road. 

791
00:41:34,680 --> 00:41:38,400
Most people will rest their way 
into the next injury because of 

792
00:41:38,400 --> 00:41:41,760
the moment and and this is where
we could open up a whole 

793
00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:45,720
different can of worms. 
If you feel pain and you meet it

794
00:41:45,720 --> 00:41:49,600
with rest, you're showing your 
body that pain is bad and 

795
00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:51,800
therefore we should no longer 
move. 

796
00:41:52,040 --> 00:41:53,400
You're letting it boss you 
around. 

797
00:41:53,400 --> 00:41:56,240
You're letting it boss you 
around and the moment your brain

798
00:41:56,240 --> 00:42:01,400
figures out pain equals rest, 
that becomes the underlying 

799
00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:04,720
strategy. 
And just like our body can adapt

800
00:42:04,720 --> 00:42:06,360
and get stronger when we work 
out. 

801
00:42:06,720 --> 00:42:09,000
If you've ever been in shape and
then have taken a week or two 

802
00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:11,000
off, you know the opposite is 
also true. 

803
00:42:11,240 --> 00:42:15,080
We lose it quickly. 
That deconditioning happens when

804
00:42:15,080 --> 00:42:17,640
we rest. 
So if we've got this injured 

805
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:21,200
body, it's weak, it's got muscle
balances, it already has a hard 

806
00:42:21,200 --> 00:42:24,240
time moving, and we are now 
taking movement out of the 

807
00:42:24,240 --> 00:42:27,360
picture. 
What is happening to the tissue?

808
00:42:27,840 --> 00:42:31,800
And this is how a short term 
acute issue can become long term

809
00:42:31,800 --> 00:42:34,160
chronic. 
Because we're literally resting 

810
00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:36,960
our way into chronic pain. 
We get weaker. 

811
00:42:37,160 --> 00:42:40,200
The weaker we get, the more we 
fear movement. 

812
00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:44,040
And rightfully so, because the 
more load and stress movement 

813
00:42:44,040 --> 00:42:46,360
creates in our body, the more 
pain we feel. 

814
00:42:46,760 --> 00:42:50,760
And so we all start to hop on 
this hamster wheel of rest is 

815
00:42:50,760 --> 00:42:53,920
the only thing I can do now, and
movement is scary as hell. 

816
00:42:54,080 --> 00:42:58,280
I've noticed that I've never had
thankfully a serious injury, but

817
00:42:58,520 --> 00:43:01,000
I've twisted my ankle plenty of 
times and I've noticed that when

818
00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:04,440
I've rested afterwards it 
doesn't seem to heal as well. 

819
00:43:04,440 --> 00:43:07,160
Like if I, if I do it and then 
I'm like resting and then go to 

820
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:09,480
sleep and then I wake up the 
next morning and it's, it's 

821
00:43:09,480 --> 00:43:11,600
killing me. 
Whereas if I just kind of do 

822
00:43:11,600 --> 00:43:15,080
gentle walking after I like 
twist my ankle, it kind of just 

823
00:43:15,080 --> 00:43:17,720
goes away. 
Yeah, The new model is how can 

824
00:43:17,720 --> 00:43:21,080
we get movement as quick as 
possible, not to be negligent or

825
00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:24,760
rush into it, but how do we get 
these tissues to actually become

826
00:43:24,760 --> 00:43:27,520
alive again? 
And that is always about force 

827
00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:30,000
and putting load into them. 
That's what heals the body. 

828
00:43:31,200 --> 00:43:35,680
I'm curious as someone who is so
well versed in Physiology and 

829
00:43:35,920 --> 00:43:39,120
anatomy and just physically like
physical structure stuff. 

830
00:43:39,560 --> 00:43:41,400
So like I said, I've never had a
serious injury. 

831
00:43:41,400 --> 00:43:44,040
The most pain I've experienced 
has been during childbirth. 

832
00:43:44,240 --> 00:43:46,560
Nobody in my audience is going 
to relate to that at all, and I 

833
00:43:46,560 --> 00:43:47,720
love that for you. 
That's great. 

834
00:43:47,720 --> 00:43:48,960
I'm very proud. 
I don't know why. 

835
00:43:48,960 --> 00:43:51,560
I mean, I have other issues, but
like I've, I feel like I've 

836
00:43:51,560 --> 00:43:54,400
always been pretty agile, but 
I'm curious if you were to 

837
00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:57,120
assess me, are you noticing 
anything that's like, I don't 

838
00:43:57,120 --> 00:43:59,000
know, is my are my shoulders 
imbalanced? 

839
00:43:59,000 --> 00:44:01,480
There's like when I was 
squatting, Did you notice 

840
00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:04,320
anything of like, oh, that's, 
that's not quite right, What do 

841
00:44:04,320 --> 00:44:07,600
you see? 
We, I could go pull up a 

842
00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:11,320
textbook right now and we could 
go find 100 things to go change,

843
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:14,240
but that doesn't mean they need 
to change. 

844
00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:18,280
Because what I notice above 
Physiology, above form and 

845
00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:21,320
function is you seem to have a 
very healthy, well balanced 

846
00:44:21,320 --> 00:44:24,520
relationship with yourself. 
You seem to be very grounded and

847
00:44:24,520 --> 00:44:28,720
very present, which means 
anything that's slightly off is 

848
00:44:28,720 --> 00:44:32,240
not going to get amplified into 
a full blown cataclysmic, you 

849
00:44:32,240 --> 00:44:33,960
know, problem that's going to 
sideline you. 

850
00:44:34,520 --> 00:44:37,120
Even you hearing you talk 
earlier before podcast started 

851
00:44:37,120 --> 00:44:40,280
about your experience of 
childbirth and I asked you like,

852
00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:43,720
were you the outlier in that? 
Because it sounds like healthy, 

853
00:44:44,120 --> 00:44:46,320
like it sounds normal and you 
were surrounded by a really good

854
00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:49,040
community. 
All of these things so little 

855
00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:52,320
people are experiencing. 
So the moment the body shifts 

856
00:44:52,520 --> 00:44:55,520
and the weight moves over to the
right side, it becomes like 

857
00:44:55,600 --> 00:44:58,640
amplified and problematic. 
And all of a sudden all of these

858
00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:02,000
like weird stories, my right 
side's the bad side, left side's

859
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:04,440
a good one. 
These stories just like take 

860
00:45:04,440 --> 00:45:06,720
off. 
And that's more of the problem 

861
00:45:06,720 --> 00:45:09,280
to fix than the bio mechanics 
themselves. 

862
00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:11,920
You know, the other thing I want
to add to that is when people 

863
00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:15,320
first come to me for help, it's 
they, the MRI's on the table, 

864
00:45:15,320 --> 00:45:18,480
assess this, assess that. 
First thing I'm assessing is how

865
00:45:18,480 --> 00:45:19,960
comfortable you are in your 
body. 

866
00:45:20,080 --> 00:45:22,600
Can you make eye contact? 
Is it hard to find you? 

867
00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:25,800
Are you here with me right now 
or are we really shifting, 

868
00:45:25,800 --> 00:45:27,920
having a very difficult time, 
like connecting? 

869
00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:31,680
That's one of the biggest things
that reveals what your fit, what

870
00:45:31,680 --> 00:45:33,600
is actually happening underneath
the hood right now? 

871
00:45:33,920 --> 00:45:36,800
What is going on in your 
Physiology aside from hip 

872
00:45:36,800 --> 00:45:40,520
mechanics or pelvic tilt in 
motion, aside from lower back 

873
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:43,160
rhythm? 
Yeah, that stuff's important. 

874
00:45:43,840 --> 00:45:47,720
But if you're very shifty and 
scattered, again, I could give 

875
00:45:47,720 --> 00:45:51,640
you the most precise mobility 
drill to address your core 

876
00:45:51,640 --> 00:45:55,200
compensation or dysfunction. 
And none of it matters if you're

877
00:45:55,200 --> 00:45:57,680
not here with me. 
And if all you're doing is 

878
00:45:57,680 --> 00:46:00,800
trying to numb, escape, 
suppress, and avoid sensation. 

879
00:46:01,080 --> 00:46:04,280
You suppress emotions. 
I don't, I don't know what 

880
00:46:04,280 --> 00:46:08,120
exercise I can give you. 
I can try to meet you physically

881
00:46:08,120 --> 00:46:11,640
and then over time bring you 
back to like the real center of 

882
00:46:11,640 --> 00:46:14,640
the problem. 
But that's why it's more than 

883
00:46:14,640 --> 00:46:17,120
just objective mechanics. 
And that's the biggest thing 

884
00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:19,840
that's changed my practice. 
If you would have met me 10 

885
00:46:19,840 --> 00:46:22,720
years ago, I wouldn't have 
gotten to know you as a person. 

886
00:46:22,920 --> 00:46:24,960
Didn't matter. 
Just send me your posture 

887
00:46:24,960 --> 00:46:28,080
photos, send me your squat. 
I'll tell you exactly what to go

888
00:46:28,080 --> 00:46:30,480
do. 
And for about half of the 

889
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:32,840
people, it was great. 
For the other half of the 

890
00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:35,640
people, it didn't work. 
And for years I didn't 

891
00:46:35,640 --> 00:46:39,920
understand why are only half of 
humans dealing with the laws of 

892
00:46:39,920 --> 00:46:42,880
physics, but the other ones are 
like, what it what is the 

893
00:46:42,880 --> 00:46:46,480
variable that makes somebody 
come here and have profound 

894
00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:50,320
change and somebody with the 
same injury come here and see no

895
00:46:50,320 --> 00:46:53,240
change? 
And it's this, and it's what's 

896
00:46:53,240 --> 00:46:54,920
going on up here. 
That's everything. 

897
00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:59,560
Makes so much sense, but it's 
wild like 50%, those are not 

898
00:46:59,560 --> 00:47:02,560
very good odds. 
But I'm just thinking most 

899
00:47:02,560 --> 00:47:05,560
people who are in pain seeing, 
you know, whatever physical 

900
00:47:05,560 --> 00:47:07,920
therapist is covered by 
insurance, like they're not 

901
00:47:07,920 --> 00:47:11,760
factoring all of that in. 
What about for those for those 

902
00:47:11,760 --> 00:47:14,800
the few of us who are not like 
living in any sort of chronic 

903
00:47:14,800 --> 00:47:19,040
pain, but also just want to 
optimize mobility for longevity 

904
00:47:19,040 --> 00:47:22,040
and to hopefully avoid dealing 
with that in the future. 

905
00:47:22,440 --> 00:47:26,120
Why is this important to put 
into practice or, or is it 

906
00:47:26,120 --> 00:47:29,320
important to put all of this 
stuff into practice now so that 

907
00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:32,320
we don't have to deal with any 
kind of pain in the future or 

908
00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:35,080
minimize pain in the future? 
What we're talking about here is

909
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:37,640
quality of life. 
Just because there isn't a 

910
00:47:37,640 --> 00:47:40,080
problem, that doesn't mean one 
can show up. 

911
00:47:40,520 --> 00:47:45,880
So This is why pain should not 
be the end all be all compass 

912
00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:48,160
that people use. 
If I'm in pain, I've got a 

913
00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:50,280
problem. 
If I'm not in pain, that means I

914
00:47:50,280 --> 00:47:54,400
don't have a problem. 
Flies are everywhere right now. 

915
00:47:56,560 --> 00:47:59,560
If you're pain free, if you've 
got this great relationship with

916
00:47:59,560 --> 00:48:02,120
your body, great. 
Let's go figure out how to use 

917
00:48:02,120 --> 00:48:04,160
this vessel. 
Let's figure out how to train it

918
00:48:04,160 --> 00:48:07,240
in a sustainable way so you can 
be this person in your 30s, 

919
00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:09,960
forties, fifties, 60s and 
beyond. 

920
00:48:10,360 --> 00:48:13,240
It's really a matter of how do 
we want to age, what kind of 

921
00:48:13,240 --> 00:48:15,760
level of activity that we want 
to hold on to, and more 

922
00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:18,040
importantly, what is the quality
of life that we want to 

923
00:48:18,040 --> 00:48:20,240
experience? 
How many things do we want to be

924
00:48:20,240 --> 00:48:23,400
capable of saying yes to? 
And the challenges is you're the

925
00:48:23,400 --> 00:48:24,920
only person who can make that 
decision. 

926
00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:27,120
Nobody can try to scare you into
that. 

927
00:48:27,120 --> 00:48:29,120
If you don't do this, then this 
is going to happen. 

928
00:48:29,400 --> 00:48:32,440
Fear mongering doesn't work. 
This is really about like you 

929
00:48:32,440 --> 00:48:35,360
getting honest with yourself and
understanding you've got one 

930
00:48:35,360 --> 00:48:37,640
experience of life. 
What do you want that experience

931
00:48:37,640 --> 00:48:39,360
to be? 
How long do you want to 

932
00:48:39,360 --> 00:48:42,120
experience being in this like 
physical vibrant body? 

933
00:48:42,400 --> 00:48:45,840
And then can we start to say yes
preemptively to make that 

934
00:48:45,840 --> 00:48:47,720
happen? 
Yeah, I I want that. 

935
00:48:47,720 --> 00:48:50,240
I want to be playing with my 
great grandkids one day. 

936
00:48:50,520 --> 00:48:54,040
And that's certainly not the 
case for most people in America.

937
00:48:54,040 --> 00:48:56,800
But I know in a lot of other 
cultures, people age and they 

938
00:48:56,800 --> 00:49:01,240
continue to be, they continue to
add value to society rather than

939
00:49:02,320 --> 00:49:04,080
kind of being a burden. 
And I think that's also about 

940
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:07,440
how we treat our elders and, and
all of that factors in. 

941
00:49:07,680 --> 00:49:13,320
But yeah, I know that hip 
injuries from falls, like once 

942
00:49:13,480 --> 00:49:18,440
someone once that happens to 
someone there, it impacts their 

943
00:49:18,440 --> 00:49:20,680
lifespan significantly. 
I mean, a lot of people just 

944
00:49:20,680 --> 00:49:22,480
really go downhill after. 
That yeah. 

945
00:49:22,960 --> 00:49:26,240
And you know, the, the sometimes
hard conversation. 

946
00:49:26,240 --> 00:49:27,880
And again, this isn't out of of 
fear. 

947
00:49:27,880 --> 00:49:30,200
This is like, let's just get 
really practical about it. 

948
00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:33,720
An arthritic hip in your 50s 
starts when you're 30. 

949
00:49:34,120 --> 00:49:36,320
You know, these things don't 
just all of a sudden you have 

950
00:49:36,320 --> 00:49:38,080
it. 
It's all about the habits and 

951
00:49:38,080 --> 00:49:41,480
the behaviors and how you take 
care of yourself now determines 

952
00:49:41,600 --> 00:49:44,160
what kind of vessel you're going
to have as you age. 

953
00:49:44,520 --> 00:49:47,360
And so if your goal is to be 
present for your grandkids, not 

954
00:49:47,360 --> 00:49:50,480
just sitting in a chair rocking 
back and forth, but outrunning 

955
00:49:50,480 --> 00:49:53,120
your kids as parents and showing
them how to do it, and you're 

956
00:49:53,120 --> 00:49:57,240
like literally handing them the 
baton, then the question is how 

957
00:49:57,240 --> 00:50:01,000
can we start taking care of the 
self now to be able to do that 

958
00:50:01,000 --> 00:50:03,840
long term? 
And that means we probably make 

959
00:50:03,840 --> 00:50:06,520
a couple shifts. 
It's less about maybe what 

960
00:50:06,520 --> 00:50:10,520
fitness was in our younger 
athletic days of proving and 

961
00:50:10,520 --> 00:50:13,880
it's more about sustainability. 
How can I do what I'm doing 

962
00:50:13,880 --> 00:50:17,160
today to make sure I can do it 
again tomorrow and the next 

963
00:50:17,160 --> 00:50:19,760
week, so on and so forth. 
And we're really logical. 

964
00:50:19,760 --> 00:50:22,120
There's no finish line. 
We're trying to rush to. 

965
00:50:22,320 --> 00:50:25,360
We're not trying to hit the £300
squat club anytime soon. 

966
00:50:25,560 --> 00:50:28,480
We're just trying to take care 
of this body as we age 

967
00:50:28,480 --> 00:50:31,160
gracefully. 
Are there certain movements or 

968
00:50:31,160 --> 00:50:34,760
positions that people should 
really start to hone in on and 

969
00:50:34,760 --> 00:50:38,840
get comfortable in if they want 
to optimize their Physiology for

970
00:50:38,840 --> 00:50:40,560
longevity? 
Yeah. 

971
00:50:40,560 --> 00:50:45,760
And it's actually, if we want to
talk about optimizing Physiology

972
00:50:45,760 --> 00:50:49,600
and longevity, we actually and 
movement, we've got to have a 

973
00:50:49,600 --> 00:50:53,200
conversation on the flip side of
that coin, which is no movement.

974
00:50:53,680 --> 00:50:56,320
How can we put the body into a 
position of rest? 

975
00:50:56,760 --> 00:51:00,240
So what I mean specifically is 
laying on your back with both 

976
00:51:00,240 --> 00:51:03,480
legs over a couch or a chair. 
Hips and knees are a 90°. 

977
00:51:03,480 --> 00:51:05,640
Probably could have had the 
whole podcast like that would 

978
00:51:05,640 --> 00:51:07,120
have been a way more comfortable
squat. 

979
00:51:07,120 --> 00:51:08,880
I'm. 
Going to get back into it, Squat

980
00:51:08,880 --> 00:51:13,040
I'll. 
Join you. 

981
00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:16,200
Can we bring ourselves down to a
position of rest? 

982
00:51:16,360 --> 00:51:17,960
And can we tap back into our 
breath? 

983
00:51:18,120 --> 00:51:21,360
I'm talking about the downstate,
that parasympathetic nervous 

984
00:51:21,360 --> 00:51:24,640
system, the part of you that is 
responsible for releasing 

985
00:51:24,640 --> 00:51:29,040
tension and relaxing your body, 
reducing muscle imbalances. 

986
00:51:29,480 --> 00:51:32,560
The part of you that you can get
into after a fight with a loved 

987
00:51:32,560 --> 00:51:35,960
one or a really hard work day, 
or when you feel like you're 

988
00:51:35,960 --> 00:51:39,480
entering survival mode. 
How can we actually let go of 

989
00:51:39,480 --> 00:51:42,440
that tension? 
And if we want to move better, 

990
00:51:42,760 --> 00:51:46,600
it starts by actually getting 
good at a lack of movement, and 

991
00:51:46,600 --> 00:51:48,680
we actually find ourselves in 
stillness. 

992
00:51:49,520 --> 00:51:55,600
So then you can do any number of
exercises burpees for seniors, 

993
00:51:55,600 --> 00:51:58,960
which is literally lying in a 
face down position, pushing 

994
00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:02,000
yourself up to the knees and 
standing back up then getting 

995
00:52:02,000 --> 00:52:04,760
back down. 
Doing simple movements like that

996
00:52:05,120 --> 00:52:08,200
are more available because we're
entering it from a relaxed 

997
00:52:08,200 --> 00:52:10,760
state. 
Not this had a bad day at work 

998
00:52:10,760 --> 00:52:13,080
how to fight with a partner. 
Let me go take this out on my 

999
00:52:13,080 --> 00:52:14,920
body. 
That's not longevity. 

1000
00:52:15,760 --> 00:52:19,320
It's less about the exercise 
itself, and I think that's what 

1001
00:52:19,320 --> 00:52:22,240
most people expect from me. 
Go do this and go do this and go

1002
00:52:22,240 --> 00:52:26,760
do that. 
It's not what we do, it's how we

1003
00:52:26,760 --> 00:52:29,280
do it. 
That's what determines if we're 

1004
00:52:29,280 --> 00:52:30,680
going to be doing it for long at
all. 

1005
00:52:31,040 --> 00:52:37,040
So that position of of being on 
your back and legs up bent over 

1006
00:52:37,040 --> 00:52:39,320
like a a couch? 
Or what about legs straight up 

1007
00:52:39,320 --> 00:52:40,560
on the wall? 
I hear a lot about that. 

1008
00:52:40,600 --> 00:52:43,160
You can do legs straight up the 
wall, so that definitely has 

1009
00:52:43,160 --> 00:52:46,440
sensation and stimulus to it. 
If you've got tight hips, that's

1010
00:52:46,440 --> 00:52:48,080
a great one. 
If your hamstrings were a little

1011
00:52:48,080 --> 00:52:50,840
overactive in the squat, you 
probably spending time with your

1012
00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:52,400
legs up the wall. 
It's great. 

1013
00:52:52,400 --> 00:52:54,720
It's inversion. 
It puts your blood flowing 

1014
00:52:54,720 --> 00:52:57,880
downstream, which is great. 
A lot of benefits. 

1015
00:52:57,880 --> 00:53:04,080
I teach that exercise in my 
program and not all time spent 

1016
00:53:04,080 --> 00:53:08,400
with your body is about going 
and doing and changing. 

1017
00:53:08,720 --> 00:53:12,040
It's also about what's checking 
in and what's currently going 

1018
00:53:12,040 --> 00:53:14,160
on. 
And we're missing that piece. 

1019
00:53:14,560 --> 00:53:17,600
And that's why regardless of 
your sex and your age or 

1020
00:53:17,600 --> 00:53:21,360
whatever condition you have, the
very first step in my program is

1021
00:53:21,360 --> 00:53:24,800
can we bring this very 
overactive, high stressed out 

1022
00:53:24,800 --> 00:53:30,080
body into a, into a downstate? 
Can we actually down regulate 

1023
00:53:30,080 --> 00:53:33,120
the nervous system? 
Because if I start throwing 

1024
00:53:33,120 --> 00:53:37,120
exercises at you, you're going 
to do all of the exercises with 

1025
00:53:37,120 --> 00:53:39,320
the problems that you're wanting
to change. 

1026
00:53:39,800 --> 00:53:43,720
If you've got a hip disparity, 
one hip stronger than the other,

1027
00:53:44,000 --> 00:53:47,240
I could give you a longevity 
exercise and you go crank the 

1028
00:53:47,240 --> 00:53:50,200
hell out of squats. 
Are you not just continuing to 

1029
00:53:50,200 --> 00:53:53,560
use that overactive hip while 
the other hip just atrophies and

1030
00:53:53,560 --> 00:53:56,760
gets weaker? 
This is why it all comes down to

1031
00:53:56,760 --> 00:53:59,440
can we first regulate the 
nervous system? 

1032
00:54:00,080 --> 00:54:03,120
Let's do the work on the ground 
so when it comes time for a 

1033
00:54:03,120 --> 00:54:05,800
squat, you've got both sides of 
your body showing up. 

1034
00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:10,200
That's longevity work. 
It's not what you do, it's how 

1035
00:54:10,200 --> 00:54:10,880
you're. 
Doing it? 

1036
00:54:11,360 --> 00:54:19,840
How bad is sitting for humans? 
I think it's fantastic, really. 

1037
00:54:19,840 --> 00:54:23,160
I'm going to take a different 
approach now, the approach I 

1038
00:54:23,160 --> 00:54:26,160
wish I was the pioneer in this. 
I'm going to take a page from 

1039
00:54:26,360 --> 00:54:29,560
Professor Daniel Lieberman. 
He is a Harvard professor in 

1040
00:54:29,560 --> 00:54:33,720
evolutionary biology and 
paleoanthropology and he has a 

1041
00:54:33,720 --> 00:54:37,600
brilliant stance on this. 
Sitting is the new smoking. 

1042
00:54:38,160 --> 00:54:42,200
If you are a Westerner and you 
go off of Western information, 

1043
00:54:42,680 --> 00:54:47,440
most of our understanding about 
the body comes from a very small

1044
00:54:47,440 --> 00:54:49,560
percentage of the actual world 
population. 

1045
00:54:49,760 --> 00:54:54,240
We're talking 1 to 3% is 
actually a civilized modern 

1046
00:54:54,240 --> 00:54:56,240
culture. 
And that's what we're basing all

1047
00:54:56,240 --> 00:54:58,160
of our information. 
That's where all of our studies 

1048
00:54:58,160 --> 00:55:01,240
come from. 
If you want to understand the 

1049
00:55:01,280 --> 00:55:05,040
human body, we have to take a 
step outside of Western culture 

1050
00:55:05,360 --> 00:55:08,840
and look worldwide. 
How have all of these different 

1051
00:55:08,840 --> 00:55:12,040
cultures and civilizations 
evolved to move? 

1052
00:55:12,560 --> 00:55:16,200
And what we're going to find is 
that even in the most primitive 

1053
00:55:16,200 --> 00:55:21,200
hunter and gatherer tribes, they
have significant periods of rest

1054
00:55:21,680 --> 00:55:25,080
to conserve caloric expenditure.
It is. 

1055
00:55:25,840 --> 00:55:29,000
It's evolutionary to be able to 
rest for long periods of time. 

1056
00:55:29,920 --> 00:55:34,000
Where we get in hot water is the
difference between some of these

1057
00:55:34,000 --> 00:55:37,200
hunter and gatherer tribes. 
They have more vigorous spurts 

1058
00:55:37,200 --> 00:55:40,920
of activity, which makes them 
much healthier, whereas we tend 

1059
00:55:40,920 --> 00:55:43,200
to not really throttle our heart
rate, right? 

1060
00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:44,480
They might have to go into 
sprints. 

1061
00:55:44,480 --> 00:55:47,440
They might have to do very heavy
vigorous work, whereas that 

1062
00:55:47,440 --> 00:55:51,000
tends to be missing from most 
modern developed countries, 

1063
00:55:51,120 --> 00:55:52,760
right? 
We DoorDash to get our food. 

1064
00:55:52,920 --> 00:55:56,440
We have people grocery shop for 
us, whatever it is we drive to 

1065
00:55:56,440 --> 00:55:59,680
the grocery store. 
We don't really move that much 

1066
00:56:00,080 --> 00:56:04,360
outside of our sedentary life. 
So it's not that sitting is 

1067
00:56:04,360 --> 00:56:07,320
dangerous. 
It's actually we're hardwired to

1068
00:56:07,320 --> 00:56:08,760
sit. 
That's where our body can 

1069
00:56:08,760 --> 00:56:11,000
actually repair and rest and 
heal tissues. 

1070
00:56:11,480 --> 00:56:14,760
If we're always on the go, that 
creates other metabolic issues. 

1071
00:56:15,240 --> 00:56:18,560
So sitting is crucial. 
The topic that we've got to talk

1072
00:56:18,560 --> 00:56:22,400
about is are there different 
ways to sit that are better? 

1073
00:56:22,560 --> 00:56:23,640
That's what I was going to ask 
you. 

1074
00:56:23,680 --> 00:56:25,960
OK, great. 
So this is a this is a fantastic

1075
00:56:25,960 --> 00:56:30,520
conversation. 
Jonathan Gordon, who is another 

1076
00:56:30,520 --> 00:56:33,960
famous paleoanthropologist, he 
studies cultures and 

1077
00:56:33,960 --> 00:56:37,720
civilizations all over the world
and he studied and found over 

1078
00:56:37,720 --> 00:56:43,600
100 different sitting postures 
in Cultures without chairs. 100.

1079
00:56:44,120 --> 00:56:46,200
I study movement for a living. 
I don't think I could tell you 

1080
00:56:46,240 --> 00:56:50,040
100 different ways to sit 
because when you remove the 

1081
00:56:50,040 --> 00:56:53,560
chair like we've done, not only 
are we sitting in a squat, but 

1082
00:56:53,560 --> 00:56:58,080
we might shift a little bit or 
we might move to this now, 1 

1083
00:56:58,080 --> 00:57:01,160
hips inflection, 1 knees in a 
little bit more flexion as well.

1084
00:57:01,400 --> 00:57:05,520
We're shifting the work around 
and that's what these tribes 

1085
00:57:05,520 --> 00:57:09,920
have that beats our chairs is by
not having a chair to sit in, 

1086
00:57:10,440 --> 00:57:14,280
those people are being exposed 
to more variations of movement. 

1087
00:57:14,840 --> 00:57:19,840
Therefore, the more shapes you 
can make when you're moving or 

1088
00:57:19,840 --> 00:57:22,760
when you're sitting when you're 
at rest, the more the easier it 

1089
00:57:22,760 --> 00:57:25,160
is to get in and out of shapes 
when it comes time to move. 

1090
00:57:25,240 --> 00:57:28,240
Yeah, and even if they are 
sitting on like a rock or a log,

1091
00:57:28,240 --> 00:57:30,280
it's like they're not all 
totally uniform. 

1092
00:57:30,320 --> 00:57:32,360
So there's still some shifting 
that's taking place. 

1093
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:34,960
Everything's different. 
Every log, every rock might be a

1094
00:57:34,960 --> 00:57:37,800
little different, and it might 
be sit here for a couple 

1095
00:57:37,800 --> 00:57:39,920
minutes, stand up and go sit 
somewhere else. 

1096
00:57:40,320 --> 00:57:42,960
So the total. 
Time spent sitting and resting 

1097
00:57:42,960 --> 00:57:46,080
is almost the same as Western 
civilizations. 

1098
00:57:46,360 --> 00:57:49,320
It's the vigorous activity 
that's different and it's the 

1099
00:57:49,320 --> 00:57:51,280
amount of movement when we sit 
it's. 

1100
00:57:51,640 --> 00:57:53,320
How we're sitting. 
It's how we're sitting. 

1101
00:57:53,480 --> 00:57:55,200
So that's a fascinating 
distinction. 

1102
00:57:55,720 --> 00:57:59,800
I'm just thinking about our, our
world and how our culture, our 

1103
00:57:59,800 --> 00:58:03,160
civilization is built on 
traditional chair sitting like 

1104
00:58:03,600 --> 00:58:06,600
in cars, in flights, in the 
office. 

1105
00:58:06,600 --> 00:58:10,560
What can people do for those 
unavoidable times where we are, 

1106
00:58:10,720 --> 00:58:12,160
where we have to sit for a long 
time? 

1107
00:58:12,160 --> 00:58:15,200
You've told me you drove 3 1/2 
hours here this morning sitting 

1108
00:58:15,200 --> 00:58:17,480
in a car. 
So is there anything we can do 

1109
00:58:17,480 --> 00:58:22,040
to optimize our movement for for
those times where we have to sit

1110
00:58:22,320 --> 00:58:25,440
in like a traditional chair 
seated type of position? 

1111
00:58:25,920 --> 00:58:27,760
There's a. 
There's two main ways to look at

1112
00:58:27,760 --> 00:58:30,360
this. 
It might sound like a little bit

1113
00:58:30,360 --> 00:58:33,920
of an offshoot, but if you think
about it like therapy, the point

1114
00:58:33,920 --> 00:58:36,200
of therapy isn't to remove 
stress from your life. 

1115
00:58:36,440 --> 00:58:38,240
The point of therapy is to get 
better. 

1116
00:58:38,240 --> 00:58:41,080
Dealing with whatever stress is 
in your life, make you more 

1117
00:58:41,080 --> 00:58:43,080
competent and equipped, and give
you tools. 

1118
00:58:43,960 --> 00:58:45,320
It's the same thing with 
sitting. 

1119
00:58:46,600 --> 00:58:50,600
Your fitness routines, your 
mobility work, the strength, all

1120
00:58:50,600 --> 00:58:54,320
of the stuff you're doing 
outside of sitting should better

1121
00:58:54,320 --> 00:58:57,120
prepare you to be able to sit 
because sitting is unavoidable. 

1122
00:58:57,120 --> 00:59:00,720
It's a modern world and there's 
nobody that's going to be able 

1123
00:59:00,720 --> 00:59:03,760
to just get up every 5 minutes 
at their desk and do exercises 

1124
00:59:03,880 --> 00:59:06,080
when you're in a corporate 
environment or you've got to 

1125
00:59:06,080 --> 00:59:08,720
like make money for a living, 
you know, So we have to get 

1126
00:59:08,720 --> 00:59:12,440
really practical that sitting is
unavoidable, just much like, 

1127
00:59:13,320 --> 00:59:17,720
much like stress is unavoidable.
It's about can we prepare a body

1128
00:59:17,720 --> 00:59:19,760
to deal with the stress of 
sitting? 

1129
00:59:20,400 --> 00:59:22,760
And when I say shut, you want to
know he's coming in. 

1130
00:59:22,760 --> 00:59:26,280
You want to sit with us, buddy? 
You're still checking me out. 

1131
00:59:28,240 --> 00:59:31,320
This is our guard dog Dog. 
Yeah, he deserves to be here. 

1132
00:59:31,320 --> 00:59:33,000
You want to have a seat? 
He really likes you. 

1133
00:59:33,120 --> 00:59:35,560
He doesn't usually come around 
this much during podcast. 

1134
00:59:36,160 --> 00:59:39,320
So what I was saying is, you 
know, if you cannot get out of 

1135
00:59:39,320 --> 00:59:43,280
sitting, then it's about how can
we prepare a body better outside

1136
00:59:43,280 --> 00:59:44,600
of sitting? 
That just comes with strength 

1137
00:59:44,600 --> 00:59:46,480
work. 
It comes with mobility work, so 

1138
00:59:46,480 --> 00:59:49,880
that way work and force and load
is evenly distributed with the 

1139
00:59:49,880 --> 00:59:52,760
body, so it's not just lower 
back that's holding you upright.

1140
00:59:52,760 --> 00:59:55,200
You feel a little bit more 
general support as you're 

1141
00:59:55,200 --> 00:59:58,000
sitting. 
If you do have the option, then 

1142
00:59:58,000 --> 01:00:00,360
it's just about injecting some 
motion into your day. 

1143
01:00:01,120 --> 01:00:05,120
When I started this work, I used
to dedicate one hour of mobility

1144
01:00:05,120 --> 01:00:10,080
a day to my body and that was a 
really big commitment and that 

1145
01:00:10,280 --> 01:00:15,920
was a great step one as I've. 
Mastered movement and learned 

1146
01:00:15,920 --> 01:00:19,840
what really needs to happen. 
I now don't have an hour of 

1147
01:00:19,840 --> 01:00:22,320
dedicated motion. 
It's like micro dosing motion 

1148
01:00:22,320 --> 01:00:24,520
all day long. 
It's maybe getting up and doing 

1149
01:00:24,520 --> 01:00:27,160
this simple movement here. 
Maybe sitting down. 

1150
01:00:27,160 --> 01:00:30,680
It's doing some hip exercises. 
Maybe I'll grab a yoga block and

1151
01:00:30,680 --> 01:00:33,520
put it between my knees and just
squeeze both knees together to 

1152
01:00:33,520 --> 01:00:36,560
get the hip muscles active. 
Maybe I'll put a strap around my

1153
01:00:36,560 --> 01:00:39,520
legs in the middle of a long 
work meeting and press outward 

1154
01:00:39,520 --> 01:00:42,760
against the strap to remind my 
back that I also have my hips 

1155
01:00:42,760 --> 01:00:46,600
here to support me. 
So there's these little micro 

1156
01:00:46,600 --> 01:00:47,960
things. 
You can even see me cooking in 

1157
01:00:47,960 --> 01:00:50,640
the kitchen and I'll cook and 
I'll stir something and then 

1158
01:00:50,640 --> 01:00:53,200
I'll go into like a simple 
little hold or a stretch, 

1159
01:00:53,440 --> 01:00:56,280
something to remind my body 
that's capable of moving. 

1160
01:00:56,800 --> 01:00:59,960
And I noticed when I shifted 
from this one hour of dedicated 

1161
01:00:59,960 --> 01:01:02,520
motion and they're just trying 
to trickle it more throughout 

1162
01:01:02,520 --> 01:01:05,800
the day, my body felt more 
capable and better. 

1163
01:01:05,920 --> 01:01:08,880
I love that approach and it's 
like what kids do naturally, you

1164
01:01:08,880 --> 01:01:11,680
know, they're always fidgeting, 
like always, always moving 

1165
01:01:11,680 --> 01:01:12,760
around. 
And I think that's so much 

1166
01:01:12,760 --> 01:01:16,480
healthier than just living a 
sedentary lifestyle, but getting

1167
01:01:16,480 --> 01:01:21,000
in like 1/2 hour, hour of a 
heavy workout in and then going 

1168
01:01:21,000 --> 01:01:24,240
back to being sedentary. 
Yeah, it's it's heroic bursts 

1169
01:01:24,240 --> 01:01:27,840
and one of the big frontiers 
that I've got across with 

1170
01:01:27,840 --> 01:01:29,560
everybody who comes to me for 
help. 

1171
01:01:29,880 --> 01:01:31,720
Step one is learning the 
exercises. 

1172
01:01:31,800 --> 01:01:35,040
That's great. 
It's helpful, but what about the

1173
01:01:35,080 --> 01:01:38,720
other 23 hours of the day? 
What are we doing in those other

1174
01:01:38,720 --> 01:01:41,520
23 hours that's winding up the 
problem that we're here to 

1175
01:01:41,520 --> 01:01:43,960
change. 
And when you look at a kid and 

1176
01:01:43,960 --> 01:01:46,400
you see they don't have 
expensive coaches, they don't 

1177
01:01:46,400 --> 01:01:49,240
have really intensive training, 
They just are. 

1178
01:01:49,240 --> 01:01:51,040
They're intuitive. 
They're intuitive. 

1179
01:01:51,040 --> 01:01:53,520
They're constantly just figuring
out what works and what doesn't 

1180
01:01:53,520 --> 01:01:56,320
work. 
There's a sense of play that 

1181
01:01:56,320 --> 01:01:59,120
comes with movement, which is 
why it doesn't feel like a chore

1182
01:01:59,120 --> 01:02:00,880
for them. 
Yeah, and they stretch. 

1183
01:02:01,120 --> 01:02:04,080
I remember like I would wake up 
and just like, naturally, just 

1184
01:02:04,080 --> 01:02:06,720
like, like stretch. 
Like we don't even do that 

1185
01:02:06,720 --> 01:02:08,360
anymore. 
I try to remind myself to do 

1186
01:02:08,360 --> 01:02:10,520
that. 
When my dog does it, I'm like, 

1187
01:02:10,520 --> 01:02:11,960
OK, you're right, I probably 
should. 

1188
01:02:12,040 --> 01:02:14,760
She stretches all the time. 
It's so natural. 

1189
01:02:14,760 --> 01:02:18,040
And that's what we we've got to 
get back to this, this natural 

1190
01:02:18,040 --> 01:02:20,440
sense. 
But maybe at the start, yeah, 

1191
01:02:20,440 --> 01:02:22,360
let's put some some guardrails 
on it. 

1192
01:02:22,560 --> 01:02:25,920
Let's come up with a dedicated 
routine, let's get you in the 

1193
01:02:25,920 --> 01:02:28,960
habit, and then let's start to 
expand and just start to move 

1194
01:02:28,960 --> 01:02:31,800
our bodies more. 
I've become really averse to 

1195
01:02:31,800 --> 01:02:34,280
traditional sitting. 
So when I'm driving, like people

1196
01:02:34,280 --> 01:02:36,640
always make fun of me. 
But like I had this legs like up

1197
01:02:36,720 --> 01:02:39,800
like this legs on the gas and 
one legs like either I'm sitting

1198
01:02:39,800 --> 01:02:43,400
like it's across my knee or it's
like up and kind of positioned 

1199
01:02:43,560 --> 01:02:48,640
with my foot on on the seat. 
But I just feel like getting my 

1200
01:02:48,640 --> 01:02:51,600
legs up and putting them in 
different positions as much as I

1201
01:02:51,600 --> 01:02:54,880
can when I'm either driving or 
on a flight seems to help a lot 

1202
01:02:54,880 --> 01:02:56,320
too. 
It's just movement, That's all 

1203
01:02:56,320 --> 01:02:59,360
it is. 
And I think we want movement to 

1204
01:02:59,360 --> 01:03:03,360
be complicated, like some golden
answer of this guy's going to 

1205
01:03:03,360 --> 01:03:05,320
tell me this one. 
Yeah, OK. 

1206
01:03:06,720 --> 01:03:08,800
Doug. 
Doug the dog's back man. 

1207
01:03:08,800 --> 01:03:11,000
He really likes you. 
This doesn't ever happen. 

1208
01:03:11,920 --> 01:03:13,360
Maybe because we're on his 
level? 

1209
01:03:13,560 --> 01:03:18,800
We understand each other. 
Rich, our producer, is over 

1210
01:03:18,800 --> 01:03:23,680
there with some treats. 
Some steak seems to be working. 

1211
01:03:23,800 --> 01:03:24,920
There we go. 
Yeah. 

1212
01:03:24,920 --> 01:03:27,920
And you know, I think people are
expecting, like a really 

1213
01:03:27,920 --> 01:03:33,800
complicated answer for me, and 
just moving more is the answer. 

1214
01:03:33,960 --> 01:03:37,520
Like we if you want to get 
better at squats, it's not about

1215
01:03:37,520 --> 01:03:40,520
finding some random weird 
exercise that you've never done,

1216
01:03:40,520 --> 01:03:42,120
which is then going to love the 
squat. 

1217
01:03:42,120 --> 01:03:45,880
It's let's practice squats, 
let's check a few emails in a 

1218
01:03:45,880 --> 01:03:49,800
squat, let's go grab a really 
low stool and spend time 

1219
01:03:49,800 --> 01:03:51,800
watching our favorite show on 
that stool. 

1220
01:03:52,200 --> 01:03:54,760
And the more exposure that we 
can get in these positions, 

1221
01:03:54,760 --> 01:03:56,320
we're going to find the easier 
it gets. 

1222
01:03:56,880 --> 01:04:01,400
Now, if you're being told, hey, 
just move more, the very first 

1223
01:04:01,400 --> 01:04:03,560
thought most people have is I 
don't know how. 

1224
01:04:04,120 --> 01:04:06,640
And that's the work. 
That's that gap we need to 

1225
01:04:06,640 --> 01:04:10,000
cross, because what we're really
talking about here is a 

1226
01:04:10,000 --> 01:04:13,280
disconnection event of intuitive
movement. 

1227
01:04:13,720 --> 01:04:17,120
We no longer trust what we feel.
We're being told. 

1228
01:04:17,280 --> 01:04:19,320
Sit like this. 
Nope, Sit like that. 

1229
01:04:19,320 --> 01:04:21,240
Squat like this. 
No, this is bad for you. 

1230
01:04:21,240 --> 01:04:24,000
Don't do. 
There's so much fear and so much

1231
01:04:24,000 --> 01:04:27,560
chaos when it comes to movement 
that we've almost locked herself

1232
01:04:27,560 --> 01:04:30,520
out of our body because we don't
understand pain. 

1233
01:04:30,760 --> 01:04:32,760
Western medicine makes pain the 
bad guy. 

1234
01:04:33,000 --> 01:04:36,280
So if you fear it, I cannot tell
you how many people who have 

1235
01:04:36,280 --> 01:04:40,960
thrown significant numbers at me
to have me watch them move 

1236
01:04:41,320 --> 01:04:44,080
because they don't trust their 
body. 

1237
01:04:44,720 --> 01:04:47,800
And that, at the heart of it, is
what we need to address. 

1238
01:04:48,120 --> 01:04:50,600
Why do you no longer trust 
sensation? 

1239
01:04:51,040 --> 01:04:52,840
Because it doesn't feel safe in 
your body. 

1240
01:04:53,040 --> 01:04:57,040
It no longer feels like home. 
So no matter what movement we 

1241
01:04:57,040 --> 01:04:58,880
do, that's what we have to 
address. 

1242
01:04:59,280 --> 01:05:02,440
And what I love giving people is
movements that start to feel 

1243
01:05:02,440 --> 01:05:05,200
like home again, so they can 
start to tap this intuitive 

1244
01:05:05,200 --> 01:05:07,920
playfulness. 
That's what's missing, yeah. 

1245
01:05:08,000 --> 01:05:09,240
Do you own furniture in your 
home? 

1246
01:05:09,880 --> 01:05:12,360
Yeah, I do, and I use it often, 
yeah. 

1247
01:05:12,880 --> 01:05:15,160
There's some people that are 
even anti furniture. 

1248
01:05:18,440 --> 01:05:21,080
Yeah, some people are anti 
furniture and I'm not one of 

1249
01:05:21,080 --> 01:05:22,800
those. 
I enjoy a good chair, you know, 

1250
01:05:22,800 --> 01:05:27,840
It doesn't need to be dogmatic, 
no pun intended, but practicing 

1251
01:05:27,840 --> 01:05:29,880
and playful. 
Sometimes I don't want to sit on

1252
01:05:29,880 --> 01:05:32,440
the ground, sometimes I don't 
want to sit in a squat. 

1253
01:05:32,680 --> 01:05:34,960
Sometimes I want to lay on my 
bed with my girlfriend and watch

1254
01:05:34,960 --> 01:05:36,920
a show or connect whatever it is
we're doing. 

1255
01:05:37,560 --> 01:05:41,040
You should be allowed that. 
And I think, you know, again, 

1256
01:05:41,040 --> 01:05:43,480
and maybe we don't have to go 
down this road, but it's it's 

1257
01:05:43,480 --> 01:05:45,000
all about like how it's being 
preached. 

1258
01:05:45,200 --> 01:05:47,040
You're allowed to sit for hours 
a day. 

1259
01:05:47,400 --> 01:05:52,200
Oh, we got two guys. 
Thanks for coming today. 

1260
01:05:52,200 --> 01:05:52,840
Oh my. 
Gosh. 

1261
01:05:53,640 --> 01:05:56,080
Thanks. 
You know, like you're, you're 

1262
01:05:56,080 --> 01:05:58,360
allowed to sit for 12 hours and 
that doesn't mean you have to be

1263
01:05:58,360 --> 01:06:00,360
in pain. 
That doesn't mean you should be 

1264
01:06:00,360 --> 01:06:01,840
in pain. 
You're allowed to go for long 

1265
01:06:01,840 --> 01:06:05,680
car drives, You're allowed to 
take days off of your movement. 

1266
01:06:05,760 --> 01:06:08,840
You know, your mobility routine.
All of these things are allowed.

1267
01:06:09,160 --> 01:06:12,640
But if your relationship with 
the stuff is sitting is bad, 

1268
01:06:12,800 --> 01:06:14,640
what kind of experience do you 
think you're going to have at 

1269
01:06:14,640 --> 01:06:17,800
the office if you're being told 
sitting is the cause of your 

1270
01:06:17,800 --> 01:06:21,480
problems? 
Whether that's true or not, 

1271
01:06:21,480 --> 01:06:25,080
which we can't objectively say, 
what is your experience that 

1272
01:06:25,080 --> 01:06:26,120
you're going to have with 
sitting? 

1273
01:06:26,240 --> 01:06:29,600
It's not going to be great and 
it's going to further put you in

1274
01:06:29,600 --> 01:06:31,840
stress when you're already 
stressed out for work. 

1275
01:06:32,640 --> 01:06:35,280
Weighted vest walking is all the
rage right now. 

1276
01:06:35,800 --> 01:06:37,520
What's your take on that? 
I love it. 

1277
01:06:37,560 --> 01:06:39,600
I love it too. 
I was hoping you would say that 

1278
01:06:39,600 --> 01:06:42,520
because I'm such a fan and I 
have noticed such a big 

1279
01:06:42,520 --> 01:06:46,960
difference personally doing it. 
I had AI had a buddy Thomas de 

1280
01:06:46,960 --> 01:06:49,560
Lauer. 
He, he sent me a message 

1281
01:06:50,240 --> 01:06:55,120
probably 3 or 4 weeks before 
this event. 

1282
01:06:56,000 --> 01:06:59,600
He won the lottery in getting 
tickets to go Summit, Mount 

1283
01:06:59,600 --> 01:07:01,800
Whitney and so. 
Fun. 

1284
01:07:01,920 --> 01:07:03,880
I did that in college. 
It was incredible. 

1285
01:07:03,880 --> 01:07:06,880
I've never done that before and 
he hits me up a couple weeks 

1286
01:07:06,880 --> 01:07:09,000
before. 
I wasn't originally invited to 

1287
01:07:09,000 --> 01:07:12,480
go, but somebody dropped out, so
I was a great backup and I 

1288
01:07:12,480 --> 01:07:14,880
realized, am I in Whitney shape?
Yeah. 

1289
01:07:15,320 --> 01:07:18,480
And also not only Whitney shape,
but like Thomas Lauer Whitney 

1290
01:07:18,480 --> 01:07:20,880
shape, he's probably going to 
want to run up this and run down

1291
01:07:20,880 --> 01:07:22,720
it. 
So how do I get in shape really 

1292
01:07:22,720 --> 01:07:25,840
fast for it? 
They got a weighted vest, put 60

1293
01:07:25,840 --> 01:07:26,680
lbs in it. 
Wow. 

1294
01:07:27,040 --> 01:07:31,200
And that made it neck. 
I had to do a lot of neck stuff 

1295
01:07:31,200 --> 01:07:33,680
that was way too much load, way 
too fast, too quick. 

1296
01:07:34,400 --> 01:07:37,640
But what I learned is that a 
three hour hike felt like 6 to 

1297
01:07:37,640 --> 01:07:41,120
10 hours and it rapidly 
increased the intensity, which 

1298
01:07:41,120 --> 01:07:44,080
meant that I got ready in like 3
weeks for something that 

1299
01:07:44,080 --> 01:07:46,160
probably should have taken a few
months to get ready for. 

1300
01:07:46,160 --> 01:07:47,880
Wow, did. 
You do it in one day. 

1301
01:07:48,040 --> 01:07:51,120
We did it in one day. 
We literally powered up it and 

1302
01:07:51,120 --> 01:07:53,600
tried to run down it. 
It was a phenomenal experience. 

1303
01:07:53,640 --> 01:07:54,560
You. 
Ran down. 

1304
01:07:54,560 --> 01:07:56,840
Yeah, well. 
We tried to, so as soon as we 

1305
01:07:56,840 --> 01:07:59,760
got to the top, we summited. 
We took our photos as proof we 

1306
01:07:59,760 --> 01:08:03,480
made it and then we're feeling 
like spriteful and youthful and 

1307
01:08:03,480 --> 01:08:06,560
like, let's just send this down.
Then we were basically fasted. 

1308
01:08:06,560 --> 01:08:07,920
He had a couple beef patties on 
him. 

1309
01:08:07,920 --> 01:08:12,840
Hey, guys. 
Oh my gosh, this is amazing. 

1310
01:08:12,840 --> 01:08:17,000
Thanks for joining us today. 
And then we literally were like,

1311
01:08:17,000 --> 01:08:19,439
you know what, let's do it. 
Let's bomb down and. 

1312
01:08:19,439 --> 01:08:21,960
Did it hurt your knees? 
It didn't hurt my knees, but 

1313
01:08:21,960 --> 01:08:25,960
probably about half a mile into 
it we forgot we were at 

1314
01:08:25,960 --> 01:08:28,359
altitude. 
Some like 14 I think it's. 

1315
01:08:28,399 --> 01:08:33,960
Like 14,000 something, yeah. 
14,500 feet and mistakes were 

1316
01:08:33,960 --> 01:08:35,800
made. 
So we're like, all right, we 

1317
01:08:35,800 --> 01:08:37,399
don't have to be heroes here. 
We did it. 

1318
01:08:37,399 --> 01:08:39,080
Now it should actually enjoy the
downhill. 

1319
01:08:39,520 --> 01:08:42,279
So it was a great experience, 
but rocking was a huge, powerful

1320
01:08:42,279 --> 01:08:45,439
thing. 
I felt it got me in better shape

1321
01:08:45,439 --> 01:08:49,479
than running did because it was 
more work, more strength with 

1322
01:08:49,479 --> 01:08:52,319
less impact. 
So I'm I'm a huge fan of it. 

1323
01:08:52,319 --> 01:08:53,880
I have nothing but great things 
to say about it. 

1324
01:08:53,960 --> 01:08:54,840
Cool. 
OK. 

1325
01:08:55,000 --> 01:08:59,640
I'm so glad I asked you about 
the knees because yeah, like I 

1326
01:08:59,640 --> 01:09:01,960
said, I did Mount Whitney in 
college and also Mount 

1327
01:09:01,960 --> 01:09:05,760
Kilimanjaro. 
And climbing or, you know, going

1328
01:09:05,760 --> 01:09:08,160
up the mountain was never the 
hardest part for me. 

1329
01:09:08,160 --> 01:09:10,720
It was coming down because I'm 
not a, I'm not someone that 

1330
01:09:10,720 --> 01:09:14,520
deals with knee pain, but in the
both of those cases, my knees 

1331
01:09:14,520 --> 01:09:16,920
were were killing me by the end 
of it. 

1332
01:09:17,240 --> 01:09:18,760
And I don't know if that would 
be different now. 

1333
01:09:18,760 --> 01:09:20,560
I wasn't eating a clean diet. 
There was probably more 

1334
01:09:20,560 --> 01:09:25,279
inflammation, but what do you 
think was to blame for that? 

1335
01:09:25,600 --> 01:09:28,560
You know, it's funny, when I 
first started becoming an ultra 

1336
01:09:28,560 --> 01:09:31,479
marathon runner, I chose a hell 
of a course to do it. 

1337
01:09:31,760 --> 01:09:35,000
It was a 50 mile route in the 
old Cascadia mountain range. 

1338
01:09:35,640 --> 01:09:39,479
It was 16,000 vertical feet. 
So this wasn't just 50 miles. 

1339
01:09:39,479 --> 01:09:42,640
This was 50 miles up and down 
some serious mountains. 

1340
01:09:43,240 --> 01:09:46,880
And so my concern was like the 
getting up front because I did 

1341
01:09:46,880 --> 01:09:48,279
not have the strength and 
endurance. 

1342
01:09:48,560 --> 01:09:51,080
I hadn't even ran a marathon at 
that point. 

1343
01:09:51,080 --> 01:09:56,040
I just decided to go for 50. 
I ended up hiring a a coach. 6 

1344
01:09:56,080 --> 01:09:57,960
Stream podcasting right here. 
Yeah, yeah. 

1345
01:09:57,960 --> 01:10:01,040
We're just getting into it. 
I hired a coach, Zach better, 

1346
01:10:01,040 --> 01:10:03,480
who's the world record holder in
the 100 mile race. 

1347
01:10:03,760 --> 01:10:06,840
Like, who better to teach me how
to solve an endurance issue than

1348
01:10:06,840 --> 01:10:09,680
literally the world's fastest 
man over 100 miles? 

1349
01:10:10,520 --> 01:10:13,240
And I remember the very first 
call I had with him, I'm like, 

1350
01:10:13,240 --> 01:10:14,440
all right, man, what's the 
strategy? 

1351
01:10:14,440 --> 01:10:16,520
How do we do this? 
And he said, your problem's not 

1352
01:10:16,520 --> 01:10:18,080
going to be the uphill, it's the
downhill. 

1353
01:10:18,600 --> 01:10:20,760
I'm like, no, I just float 
downhill. 

1354
01:10:20,760 --> 01:10:22,200
That's like gravity working with
me. 

1355
01:10:22,200 --> 01:10:26,520
He's like, no, the amount of 
control it takes to decelerate 

1356
01:10:26,520 --> 01:10:31,080
your mass moving down will burn 
your quads in a way no uphill 

1357
01:10:31,080 --> 01:10:34,040
ever will. 
And so his main goal with 

1358
01:10:34,040 --> 01:10:37,640
training was for me to walk 
uphill and run downhill. 

1359
01:10:37,880 --> 01:10:40,760
So I had to find the highest 
mountains I could and just train

1360
01:10:40,760 --> 01:10:43,040
the downhill part because that 
was going to be. 

1361
01:10:43,240 --> 01:10:45,760
He was convinced the determining
factor of if I was going to 

1362
01:10:45,760 --> 01:10:48,400
finish or not was if I had 
downhill mechanics. 

1363
01:10:49,040 --> 01:10:50,320
Yeah. 
That's what makes people tap. 

1364
01:10:50,440 --> 01:10:52,360
Yeah. 
Very underrated. 

1365
01:10:52,440 --> 01:10:55,440
Yeah, if you're lacking the 
control and the stability to 

1366
01:10:55,440 --> 01:10:58,920
slowly move down, it's it's 
going to be challenge for sure. 

1367
01:10:59,240 --> 01:11:02,320
What's the most overrated fix 
for chronic pain? 

1368
01:11:02,800 --> 01:11:06,880
I'm I'm cycling through every 
hack that has ever come across. 

1369
01:11:06,880 --> 01:11:10,040
Probably a lot. 
I teach stretching so and be 

1370
01:11:10,040 --> 01:11:15,120
really mindful how I say this. 
There is a use for stretching, 

1371
01:11:15,360 --> 01:11:17,080
but it should not be the 
strategy. 

1372
01:11:18,160 --> 01:11:21,160
Stretching out tissue is great, 
it feels good. 

1373
01:11:21,200 --> 01:11:25,000
It has very measurable down 
regulatory effects. 

1374
01:11:25,000 --> 01:11:28,720
So if tissues tight, intense, 
overactive, you stretching it 

1375
01:11:28,720 --> 01:11:32,760
can help relax. 
But everybody's being told to 

1376
01:11:32,760 --> 01:11:36,800
stretch what's tight. 
We have to understand that 

1377
01:11:36,800 --> 01:11:39,160
what's tight is coming from the 
brain. 

1378
01:11:39,960 --> 01:11:42,960
If you were to knock somebody 
out with general anesthesia, you

1379
01:11:42,960 --> 01:11:45,320
would find a super stiff person 
all of a sudden becomes 

1380
01:11:45,320 --> 01:11:48,480
hypermobile because their 
consciousness isn't putting the 

1381
01:11:48,480 --> 01:11:52,480
limiter on their movement. 
Stretching what's tight can be 

1382
01:11:52,480 --> 01:11:56,800
helpful, but moving what's tight
will always be more infinitely 

1383
01:11:56,800 --> 01:11:59,200
helpful. 
The only time your brain will 

1384
01:11:59,200 --> 01:12:03,040
let go of tension is if it feels
safe in that range of motion. 

1385
01:12:03,480 --> 01:12:07,720
So you cranking on stretches. 
It's why you feel tight doing 

1386
01:12:07,720 --> 01:12:11,000
stretches one day and that same 
stretch, same tensions the next 

1387
01:12:11,000 --> 01:12:13,080
day. 
Maybe it's 5% better and that's 

1388
01:12:13,080 --> 01:12:16,160
great. 
Maybe 30 days later it's 10% 

1389
01:12:16,160 --> 01:12:19,720
better, but it just kind of 
never really goes away and never

1390
01:12:19,720 --> 01:12:22,600
fully leaves you. 
And my God, take a couple days 

1391
01:12:22,600 --> 01:12:24,720
off and you're right back to 
where you were day one with the 

1392
01:12:24,720 --> 01:12:27,920
tightness. 
Stretching doesn't take change. 

1393
01:12:27,920 --> 01:12:32,480
Tissue tension movement does. 
So if we can bring a level of 

1394
01:12:32,480 --> 01:12:36,280
dynamic movement to your body, 
that is going to be the fastest 

1395
01:12:36,280 --> 01:12:38,920
way to resolve pain and 
mechanical issues. 

1396
01:12:39,640 --> 01:12:43,960
The only time stretching is 
prescribed usefully is when 

1397
01:12:43,960 --> 01:12:46,840
movement is so problematic, it 
hurts like hell. 

1398
01:12:47,200 --> 01:12:51,200
So great, let's try positions 
where there is no movement and 

1399
01:12:51,200 --> 01:12:53,280
let's learn to breathe. 
Let's learn to relax into your 

1400
01:12:53,280 --> 01:12:56,080
body. 
But once we're past that phase, 

1401
01:12:56,280 --> 01:12:58,960
it's we got to get things moving
because if we don't, nothing's 

1402
01:12:58,960 --> 01:13:01,640
going to change. 
And I wish I learned that years 

1403
01:13:01,640 --> 01:13:05,160
earlier. 
I would have saved so many hours

1404
01:13:05,160 --> 01:13:07,880
tugging on what was tight hoping
it was just going to like 

1405
01:13:07,960 --> 01:13:11,600
release and that wasn't my 
experience and it's not most. 

1406
01:13:12,040 --> 01:13:15,600
What is 1 daily movement that 
you will never skip again for 

1407
01:13:15,600 --> 01:13:17,560
the rest of your life? 
I'm going to share some hard 

1408
01:13:17,560 --> 01:13:20,840
earned wisdom with you. 
And this is coming after having 

1409
01:13:20,840 --> 01:13:24,040
been given so many exercises, 
these hour long routines. 

1410
01:13:24,480 --> 01:13:27,880
And when you have all this work 
that you have to do physically 

1411
01:13:27,880 --> 01:13:30,880
with your body, it feels like 
you're just piling more on top 

1412
01:13:30,880 --> 01:13:34,240
of an already full life. 
And when movement and taking 

1413
01:13:34,240 --> 01:13:37,400
care of your body starts to feel
like a chore, we stop becoming 

1414
01:13:37,400 --> 01:13:40,280
consistent. 
And then in order to try and 

1415
01:13:40,280 --> 01:13:42,520
move again, it doesn't feel like
just movement. 

1416
01:13:42,520 --> 01:13:45,440
It feels like we're now having 
to work through the shame of 

1417
01:13:45,440 --> 01:13:48,320
failing again or the pressure 
that we put on ourself that we 

1418
01:13:48,320 --> 01:13:50,640
missed more days. 
So the advice I have for 

1419
01:13:50,640 --> 01:13:55,200
everybody and what I'm going to 
share with you is do one 

1420
01:13:55,200 --> 01:13:58,040
movement, come up with your 
minimum standard, non 

1421
01:13:58,040 --> 01:14:00,040
negotiable. 
It does not have to be the 

1422
01:14:00,040 --> 01:14:03,080
hardest exercise, nor does it 
have to be the most effective 

1423
01:14:03,080 --> 01:14:08,000
exercise, nor the most valuable.
The most enjoyable exercise for 

1424
01:14:08,000 --> 01:14:12,400
you come your hardest days, your
most hectic days, that is the 

1425
01:14:12,400 --> 01:14:15,920
one thing that you do and you 
feel good that you did it and 

1426
01:14:15,920 --> 01:14:19,520
showed up for yourself. 
Mine, very simple kneeling hip 

1427
01:14:19,520 --> 01:14:21,560
flexor stretch. 
I run a lot. 

1428
01:14:21,680 --> 01:14:24,120
I said a lot to teach people to 
move more. 

1429
01:14:24,360 --> 01:14:27,680
That's what I do. 
My hips historically are tight, 

1430
01:14:27,680 --> 01:14:31,320
so the most enjoyable thing is 
just getting a kneeling dynamic 

1431
01:14:31,320 --> 01:14:34,000
hip flexor stretch in. 
I feel like emotionally that's 

1432
01:14:34,000 --> 01:14:37,320
where I store a lot of tension. 
It's the one that is the easiest

1433
01:14:37,320 --> 01:14:39,240
for me to say yes to so I don't 
miss it. 

1434
01:14:39,320 --> 01:14:42,120
It's non negotiable. 
It is what pulls me into my 

1435
01:14:42,120 --> 01:14:45,560
movement practice. 
And on the days where I do it, 

1436
01:14:46,360 --> 01:14:49,760
sometimes it's I'm already down 
on the ground and doing it, let 

1437
01:14:49,760 --> 01:14:52,960
me do another one. 
And it always balloons into a 

1438
01:14:52,960 --> 01:14:54,840
more advanced movement practice 
that day. 

1439
01:14:55,160 --> 01:14:57,000
But it doesn't have to, and 
that's the point. 

1440
01:14:57,520 --> 01:14:59,600
Such good advice. 
Can you show me what that looks 

1441
01:14:59,600 --> 01:15:00,840
like real quick? 
I'll show you one thing. 

1442
01:15:01,240 --> 01:15:02,960
It's my favorite. 
Am I still in frame? 

1443
01:15:03,840 --> 01:15:07,360
All right, so here's my favorite
movement in a kneeling position.

1444
01:15:07,360 --> 01:15:08,920
And if it doesn't feel 
comfortable in your knees, you 

1445
01:15:08,920 --> 01:15:12,280
put like a pillow, something 
soft, both hands on your leg, 

1446
01:15:12,520 --> 01:15:15,440
and you're just going to lean 
forward into it, right? 

1447
01:15:15,440 --> 01:15:17,800
We're not like trying to throw 
our upper body forward, feel 

1448
01:15:17,800 --> 01:15:21,320
that back hip stretch and then 
come out of it and we're going 

1449
01:15:21,320 --> 01:15:23,360
to do this for one minute on 
your side. 

1450
01:15:23,600 --> 01:15:26,080
Feels really good. 
Yeah, just rock back and forth. 

1451
01:15:26,320 --> 01:15:30,440
The further that front foot is 
out, the more the stretches 

1452
01:15:30,440 --> 01:15:33,280
we're going to get in the hip. 
Do you want to get your knee 

1453
01:15:33,280 --> 01:15:35,360
like a perfect? 
OK, that was great. 

1454
01:15:35,720 --> 01:15:39,560
So get your like the front knee 
over the toe even like as far as

1455
01:15:39,560 --> 01:15:40,080
you can go. 
We're. 

1456
01:15:40,080 --> 01:15:42,360
Practicing exactly what happens 
in a squat. 

1457
01:15:42,720 --> 01:15:44,880
We're practicing exactly what 
happens when we go down the 

1458
01:15:44,880 --> 01:15:46,280
stairs. 
That the knee moves over the 

1459
01:15:46,280 --> 01:15:48,840
toe. 
So this is my favorite because 

1460
01:15:48,840 --> 01:15:51,360
two things are happening. 
Number one, we're stretching the

1461
01:15:51,360 --> 01:15:55,680
back hip and #2 it's just like a
mini little strength signal into

1462
01:15:55,680 --> 01:15:58,480
the front leg. 
So a minute of forward, backward

1463
01:15:58,480 --> 01:16:01,320
motion on this side and then 
we're just going to switch. 

1464
01:16:01,760 --> 01:16:04,680
I like that it's a stretch, but 
that you're moving through it. 

1465
01:16:04,840 --> 01:16:07,240
That and that's all you're doing
is you're just touching it and 

1466
01:16:07,240 --> 01:16:08,840
then coming out of it. 
We'll bounce. 

1467
01:16:08,880 --> 01:16:12,520
And over time we can get lower 
and it's just going to feel more

1468
01:16:12,520 --> 01:16:16,240
and more open and we get a 
little bit of strength, we get a

1469
01:16:16,240 --> 01:16:20,680
little bit of flexibility and 
mobility and stability. 

1470
01:16:20,680 --> 01:16:22,680
So this is one of those 
exercises where we get a 

1471
01:16:23,560 --> 01:16:26,120
well-rounded stimulus and a 
well-rounded outcome. 

1472
01:16:26,560 --> 01:16:28,600
So this is my minimum standard 
of motion. 

1473
01:16:28,680 --> 01:16:31,000
It feels the best. 
It's the easiest to say yes to. 

1474
01:16:31,280 --> 01:16:33,040
I can do it when I'm typing out 
an e-mail. 

1475
01:16:33,040 --> 01:16:35,480
I can do it when we're watching 
Love Island, whatever. 

1476
01:16:36,520 --> 01:16:38,320
Not that we watch Love Island in
this house. 

1477
01:16:38,320 --> 01:16:39,240
I. 
Don't even know what that is. 

1478
01:16:39,240 --> 01:16:41,200
Oh, great. 
Amazing. 

1479
01:16:41,280 --> 01:16:42,520
You guys know? 
Nobody knows. 

1480
01:16:44,600 --> 01:16:47,680
Yeah, we, yeah. 
I'll have to look it up. 

1481
01:16:47,880 --> 01:16:50,040
OK, so that's for my hips. 
I'm going to show you one for 

1482
01:16:50,040 --> 01:16:51,640
yours. 
So what I'd like you to do is 

1483
01:16:51,640 --> 01:16:54,920
stand up and you can face me. 
All right, Both feet pointing 

1484
01:16:54,920 --> 01:16:57,480
forwards and you can bend your 
knees. 

1485
01:16:57,480 --> 01:16:59,960
I want just a really casual bend
forward towards the ground. 

1486
01:17:00,240 --> 01:17:04,040
So bend forward and reach 
towards the ground, OK, Kind of 

1487
01:17:04,040 --> 01:17:05,920
like a gorilla. 
Keep your knuckles on the 

1488
01:17:05,920 --> 01:17:07,960
ground. 
Good, just like that. 

1489
01:17:08,200 --> 01:17:11,760
Bend your knees, lower your hips
a little bit more, relax your 

1490
01:17:11,760 --> 01:17:16,600
head and then now raise your 
hips up towards the ceiling 

1491
01:17:16,600 --> 01:17:18,040
here. 
So higher hips. 

1492
01:17:18,480 --> 01:17:20,520
Yep. 
Take a second and then come back

1493
01:17:20,520 --> 01:17:22,560
down. 
Lift your hips up, press your 

1494
01:17:22,560 --> 01:17:24,400
knees back and then come back 
down. 

1495
01:17:24,920 --> 01:17:27,760
We're not trying to rush in and 
out of each position. 

1496
01:17:28,080 --> 01:17:29,840
I want you to take some big deep
breaths. 

1497
01:17:30,240 --> 01:17:33,760
Send the knees back. 
The neck relaxes there you. 

1498
01:17:33,760 --> 01:17:36,200
Go yeah, I feel this. 
Yeah, see how we're trying to 

1499
01:17:36,240 --> 01:17:38,640
almost use the shoulders and the
neck to do this? 

1500
01:17:39,160 --> 01:17:43,080
This is your one minute a day 
where you send work and tension 

1501
01:17:43,080 --> 01:17:46,720
into the back of the legs. 
You're going to find it maybe 

1502
01:17:46,720 --> 01:17:48,960
burns a little bit. 
There's a little bit of 

1503
01:17:48,960 --> 01:17:53,400
strength, there's a little bit 
of stretch, big deep breaths. 

1504
01:17:53,920 --> 01:17:55,920
Send the hips up and the knees 
back. 

1505
01:17:55,920 --> 01:17:58,720
Hold for a second. 
Feel that benefit and come. 

1506
01:17:58,720 --> 01:18:01,320
Out of it I'm like. 
Shaking as I'm doing. 

1507
01:18:01,600 --> 01:18:08,600
That it's just one minute a day.
And maybe for you it's a little,

1508
01:18:08,600 --> 01:18:11,320
another little hack is put the 
remote on the ground. 

1509
01:18:11,320 --> 01:18:13,960
So maybe you and your husband 
like TV time, whatever it is, 

1510
01:18:14,360 --> 01:18:18,200
maybe you like, you know, 
spending those last couple 

1511
01:18:18,200 --> 01:18:20,560
minutes with your kids, put like
the bottle on the ground. 

1512
01:18:20,560 --> 01:18:22,520
Whatever you do, that's your 
signal. 

1513
01:18:22,520 --> 01:18:25,040
If I'm going to bend forward, I 
might as well just get my minute

1514
01:18:25,040 --> 01:18:29,400
of exercise in If the remote is 
on the ground or if I got to get

1515
01:18:29,400 --> 01:18:31,600
down on the ground or bend 
forward to pick it up, I might 

1516
01:18:31,600 --> 01:18:33,240
as well just do that minute of 
movement. 

1517
01:18:33,560 --> 01:18:36,760
And it's these little 
environmental hacks that help 

1518
01:18:36,760 --> 01:18:41,280
take care of you. 
You know, most people will get 

1519
01:18:41,320 --> 01:18:44,160
way bigger of a house. 
It's more house than they need. 

1520
01:18:44,360 --> 01:18:46,960
And they're running around like 
crazy taking care of their 

1521
01:18:46,960 --> 01:18:49,200
house. 
A home should take care of you. 

1522
01:18:49,560 --> 01:18:51,120
Your environment should take 
care of you. 

1523
01:18:51,440 --> 01:18:54,840
So if you can start to hack your
environment a little bit by 

1524
01:18:54,840 --> 01:18:57,880
maybe putting the remote on the 
ground, a bottled water on the 

1525
01:18:57,880 --> 01:19:01,480
ground, your laptop on the 
ground, your environment is 

1526
01:19:01,480 --> 01:19:04,880
going to start to influence your
movement as that's the signal 

1527
01:19:04,880 --> 01:19:07,560
before I go get it, let me just 
get it done and out of the way 

1528
01:19:07,560 --> 01:19:09,520
with. 
And now your environment is 

1529
01:19:09,520 --> 01:19:13,000
taking care of you instead of 
you trying to force and always 

1530
01:19:13,000 --> 01:19:15,920
like consciously have to say yes
into things that you don't want 

1531
01:19:15,920 --> 01:19:18,120
to do. 
And you can make it really easy.

1532
01:19:18,440 --> 01:19:22,560
Man thank you so much, this has 
been so helpful for me and I've 

1533
01:19:22,560 --> 01:19:25,280
learned a ton from you and I 
know everyone listening well as 

1534
01:19:25,280 --> 01:19:27,360
well. 
Where can people find you and 

1535
01:19:27,360 --> 01:19:29,240
learn more about you and your 
program? 

1536
01:19:29,320 --> 01:19:31,280
Yeah, so you can learn more 
about my program, 

1537
01:19:31,280 --> 01:19:35,680
www.panacademy.net and any of 
the social handles at Pan 

1538
01:19:35,680 --> 01:19:38,480
Academy. 
There's so much free information

1539
01:19:38,480 --> 01:19:40,640
out there. 
Check it out, give it a little 

1540
01:19:40,640 --> 01:19:41,920
bit of time and watch what 
happens. 

1541
01:19:42,440 --> 01:19:43,560
Awesome. 
Thank you so much. 

1542
01:19:43,560 --> 01:19:44,400
Yeah, thanks for having me.