Most of us think that fertility is something that just happens
and if we try hard enough, it'll all work out.
For our guests Ronit and Vida, that belief led to heartbreak
after miscarriages just one week apart.
Both of them were told that it was just bad luck.
Two best friends, 2 losses, the perfect prenatal routine, and 0
satisfying answers. They didn't accept that, and
what they uncovered challenged everything they had been taught
about conception. There's a mismatch between our
environment and our bodies. There's so much that you could
do to support your environment and enhance fertility.
Now, as the founders of Weenatal, they're revealing how
modern lifestyles, stress and overlooked factors are quietly
shaping fertility. When it comes to fertility,
we've been getting it wrong. In this episode, we are finding
out how to get it right. Let's dig in.
Ronit and Vida, welcome to the farm.
I'm so excited that you guys are here.
You have so much knowledge on all things fertility, and I
think our audience is going to walk away with really practical
action items on how to improve their fertility and health
overall. So thanks so much for being
here. Thanks for having us.
Such an honor to be here. I want to talk about the global
fertility crisis. How bad is it really and what's
driving it? Yeah, it's definitely a global
problem. It doesn't discriminate.
First, any socioeconomic status or any country.
We see it across the globe and the real reality is it is a
problem. Most countries nowadays are not
even having enough kids for the replacement rate, which is
considered 2.1. So basically two kids to replace
you and your partner. We look at the US, we're around
1.7. We look at alarming countries
like South Korea .8 so we realize that like for the future
of our mankind and the future of humanity, it is a global issue
we should all care about no matter what stage of life.
If you care about us flourishing, we also need to
care about fertility. And what are the main factors
that are driving this? So when we look at fertility,
we're really and the decline in fertility, we're really looking
at the last 50 years of or so where we see sperm counts
declining, increase in miscarriage rate, increase in
issues like erectile dysfunction, decrease in
testosterone and all of this has been happening in the last 50
years. So when we think about what is
the reason and what is going on, we really think about so much
has changed in the last 50 years.
We're not living like our ancestors.
We're spending 92% of our time indoors.
We're eating ultra processed foods that that is made in a
factory. There is plastic everywhere,
toxins in our environment, toxins in our skin care products
as you know. And so there's basically a
mismatch between how our bodies were made to.
There's a mismatch between our environment and our bodies
essentially, totally. But with that, there's so much
optimism that comes with that because there's so much that you
could do to support your environment and enhance
fertility. And that's really one of our
biggest messages is, yes, the fertility crisis seems like it's
doom and gloom, but there's so much hope because there's so
much that you could do to support your fertility.
I fully agree. And when people blame genetics
for fertility issues or other diseases, I'm not saying
genetics are completely irrelevant, but we have to like
understand that our genetics have not changed this much in
the last 50 years. But everything about our
environment that you just mentioned has changed and some
of it we can't control and some of it we can.
So I agree, I think there's a lot of hope and optimism there
even in the midst of these like staggeringly sad statistics.
Like I've heard you guys say that one in four pregnancies are
ending with miscarriage. Right now, 20% of couples are
not able to to conceive within the first year of trying and
then sperm, right? Like what is going on with men's
sperm right now? So this the stats are staggering
around the fertility crisis and it truly is a crisis.
In the last 50 years, sperm counts have declined by 50%.
So what that means is that men today have 50% less sperm
compared to their grandfathers. And when we look at the
trajectory up until the year 2000, sperm counts has declined
by 1% per year, but since the 2000s is declined by 2.6% per
year. And some researchers are looking
at that data and saying by 2045 sperm counts could be 0 if we
don't do anything about it. Wow.
So what's happening with sperm? I think it's, you know, you'll
have some researchers that like Doctor Shana Swan who talk about
the plastics in our environment and the impact it's making on
sperm. But really, sperm is a barometer
of health. And so when we look at
fertility, we have to look at the big picture of what's
happening with health overall. And we're seeing an increase of
autoimmune disease, we're seeing an increase in mental health
issues and and chronic disease. And so fertility and and health
go hand in hand, but also sperm are very sensitive to our
environment. Sperm essentially is a cell that
is being generated outside of the body.
And when we look at sperm counts and sperm counts decline, we can
see that what's happening in human beings are also happening
in our home pets. And so all of that to say is if
it's happening to your pet and it's happening to you, it has to
be something that's going on inside your household.
Yeah, yeah. And, and I'm sure, I mean,
there's, there's so many factors that can contribute to lowering
men's sperm count, but what are some things that men might be
unknowingly doing that are negatively impacting their sperm
that they might think is like good for them or healthy, but
actually is really bad for their sperm count and quality?
The most obvious sometimes things that are good for us but
during that trying to conceive stage that might not be is heat.
So the testicles live outside of the body because it doesn't like
heat. And so if you're a regular sauna
user or heat anything in the heat and I jacuzzi, you name it.
Oh my. Gosh, do you have this memory of
my Nana when when I was a kid and I was in the hot tub with my
cousins and siblings. And she goes up to my cousin,
who I think was a teenager at the time.
And she was like, you need to get out of the hot tub.
I want, I want great grandchildren someday.
Like, you can't stay in here for too long.
And I was like, whoa, that seems kind of crazy.
But it turns out she wasn't wrong.
She wasn't wrong, the sperm doesn't like the heat and if you
are obsessed with this honor either you could avoid it for
the few months up to conception or they nowadays have ice packs
and certain things you could do to keep it cool down there.
It's OK for women. It is OK for women, it's very
good for us in general, detoxifying, it's so great.
But during that time for men, we recommend maybe avoiding it or
if you have to using the ice pack.
And so that's just interesting, easy one that most people don't
know, and it could be a simple trick outside of that, I think
it's so similar, men and women, there's so many, we like to kind
of bucket them into fertility blockers and fertility boosters.
And to Roni's point about our environment has changed so much,
So what are the easy things within our control that we can
block, like toxins? That's why we only use primarily
pure in skin care that's clean because your organ is your big,
your skin is your biggest organ that's absorbing everything.
But it's the same with the everyday items in your house
mainly, and now you know this, but the kitchen and bathroom
probably being the culprits of the most toxins in your home.
And so clean cleaning products, clean, you know, glass
containers, clean pans that are stainless steel in the bathroom,
better deodorants, better beauty products, anything that you
might be using. When you run out of one thing,
try to search for cleaner option.
There's so many options these days.
And so it could feel overwhelming if we're saying
like ditch your whole lifestyle and start over.
But if you start slowly, it's about always doing a little
better. And it's the world you want to
live in anyway. For your health, for longevity,
absolutely. It's a worthwhile thing to
pursue. And these toxins, they are
impacting our cells, our mitochondria.
Talk a little bit about that and why are mitochondria are so
important for reproductive health?
Oh my gosh, we talked about mitochondria all the time and
Women's Health and women's fertility.
A lot of people think that as you age, your eggs age with you.
And so as a result, there's this myth out there that if you're
older, your eggs are old, or if you're over 35, you're
geriatric. But I want to talk about that.
Later we could get into that all, all day long, but really
your mitochondria ages with you. And so as a result, if you want
to improve your egg quality or your sperm quality, you can
focus on enhancing your mitochondria.
And then as a result, you will improve your egg quality because
the mitochondria are essentially the battery of the cells.
Your eggs have the most amount of mitochondria compared to any
other cell in the body. So it's really important to
focus on mitochondrial health and that will in turn improve
your fertility. But real quick, circling back to
sperm, the reason why we like talking about sperm so much is
because sperm are dynamic. Men are making 1500 sperm every
second of the day. That is wild.
It's wild. It's a superpower, really.
We really feel like they are the superheroes of the fertility
equation because they're constantly regenerating.
Sperm, And that's a pretty new idea.
Like traditionally it's always been very focused on the women,
the fertility conversation. But you guys are bringing the
guy into the conversation, which is, you know, it just makes
sense when you think about it. But for so long, I feel like
that's kind of just been forgotten and left out.
It's been forgotten and even in our journeys which we can get
into, we completely took the burden of of fertility on our
shoulders. But once we started to think
about the other half, we started to bring in our partner into the
mix. Really miracles happened in our
lives and so many miracles have happened in our communities
lives. We've helped over 30,000
families have healthy babies and it's really incredible and, and
it makes sense, right? It takes 2 to tango.
It takes 2 to make a baby. But up until now, we've been so
focused on our self. Society has put it on us and so
we talk about sperm a lot. But real quick, so men have this
ability to regenerate sperm called sperm metagenesis and
they can really transform their sperm quality in three months
because a complete cycle of sperm is essentially 3 months.
And so when we started weenatal, we put we did a beta with a few
men and we put them on weenatal and did a sperm test before and
after three months of weenatal. And we have one of our beta
testers, his name is John. He didn't change anything except
for taking in these high dose antioxidants and his sperm
parameters, all of them morphology, motility count have
all doubled to quadrupled. And now he has two very young
kids that have only one year difference between them.
And he says we need to put a warning label on the naval for
him. So that's how well it works.
And that is why we're so passionate about kind of like
the power that you have over your own fertility and over this
incredible journey of growing your family.
That is wild. OK, I didn't realize that men
completely regenerate their sperm in a three month span.
Yes. So yeah, what you do in those
three months before conception is so important for men.
Is it true that men don't have a fertility clock?
And that it's easy for them to impregnate a woman at any age.
I know it appears like that. So I'm going to say no, it's not
true. Yes, they probably could
impregnate because at any age because they are making sperm
every second well into their, you know, later in life.
And we see celebrities like Mick Jagger and Robert De Niro having
kids such later in life. So I think media sensationalizes
that men don't, but the reality is they do.
And men having kids later in life have a higher chance of
passing off, you know, genetics to their offspring.
That could be not good and not optimal.
And so while they could probably produce a child, they have to
still make sure to be taking care of themselves and the
antioxidants to make sure that the DNA damage their sperm isn't
passed along to their child, which could happen at a higher
rate later in life. I just love that you guys are
bringing men into the fertility conversation and taking it from
me to we, as you guys say. How did you even come to make
that realization in the first place?
I think the biggest AHA we had in our own personal journey is
was that we thought we were doing everything right and yet
completely ignoring the other half of the equation.
And once Roni uncovered the research around men's health
being 50% of pregnancy health and men being such a huge
contributor to not only a healthy pregnancy but a healthy
child, it was the moment that stopped everything for us.
I remember where I was when she called me with that research.
It was chilled. And it was mind blowing to me
that we're so advanced in so many ways, but yet society has
still placed the burden of fertility as a woman's health
issue. And if you think about it in the
most common way, fertility is a team sport.
It's intuitive that it takes 2 to tango in this situation.
If you My favorite analogy is like, we all love football.
It's the American pastime. And if you literally have the
best quarterback in the world, but the rest of your team is
untrained and not guarding your quarterback, you're not making
it to the end zone. And how is it that we were
literally just scrutinizing everything about women their
age, what they ate, their work? I remember after my miscarriage
so going down such a deep rabbit hole of everything I did, trying
to trace back what I did wrong. Meanwhile, my husband was living
his best life doing things he shouldn't have been, and I
didn't even dawn on me that he could even be part of the
conversation. And so we're here to change the
narrative for me to we because in society we say we're trying,
we're having a baby and I'm like, where, where's the we?
Where is it? So let's put that back into the
conversation and and we can get into like our story and how we
started, but. We had a Google doc when we
first came up with the idea of weenatal and we called the IT
was like best deco that Google doc.
We didn't know what the company was going to be, but we
literally wrote that on the top of the Google doc.
We are trying. We are having a baby, but
where's the we from me to we And that was the concept.
But really like what kind of gave us the biggest AHA to start
weenatal is when we learned that men who take high dose
antioxidants like Coq 10 and AC vitamin C have a 4X chances of
getting their partner pregnant and having a live birth.
And we thought we don't know any men who are taking prenatals,
any men who are going into this fertility journey in a conscious
way together with their partner. And we wanted to change that.
Let's talk a little bit about your stories.
So take us back to 2020. Both of you experienced
miscarriages a week apart, correct?
What was that period like for you guys?
It was worth shattering to if we're honest.
So I we met in our Nike corporate career and we became
best friends. And when I actually before that
had my first miscarriage, I was told all the things that most of
us are told. It just happens.
Keep trying. I was given 0 satisfying
answers. I took it as a truth, but thank
God Roni was working with Doctor Mark Hyman and in the functional
medicine space and she pushed me to look beyond the normal labs,
right? They're normal, but they're not
optimal. Found out I have Hashimoto's.
I changed my diet, my lifestyle, I took supplementation, and I
went on to have my healthy baby girl.
Ironically, I was also leading Nike Global events for some of
the best athletes in the world with impeccable precision,
literally scrutinizing every detail of the events, what
they're putting in their body, every inch of like, you know,
weights on their clothes to make them the best at their sport.
And when it came to my own pregnancy journey, I just
thought I'm young, I'm healthy, I should just go for it.
So Fast forward to early 2020, I thought the nightmare was over.
I go to try for my second kid. I go in for a routine
ultrasound. The room drops again.
It was my second time of seeing my OBGYN's face drop, saying the
words that no parent to be ever wants to hear, which there's no
heartbeat. And it was.
There's no words in that moment except the pain you feel from
crying, your jaw ache, and really just being told try again
when you're ready and being sent through a waiting room of
glowing bellies with no advice, no guidance, no answers,
nothing. The only difference this time is
a week later, Roni called me with the same devastating loss.
And so there we were, two best friends, two losses, the perfect
prenatal routine, and 0 satisfying answers.
And we realize something's up and.
So when I asked my doctor what can I do to optimize for a
healthy pregnancy next time around, she said there's nothing
you could do, it's your age, just keep trying.
And how old were you at the time?
I was 41, so I guess I was old, but I I didn't feel old.
And honestly, I was working in functional medicine alongside
the best doctors. I had access to the best
nutritionist, naturopathic doctors, fertility doctors.
And I decided not to listen to my OB and actually started to
research and and talk to all of the incredible practitioners in
my network. And that's where I learned that
men are 50% of the equation. But nobody is talking about
that. And So what we decided to do is
myself, my husband Vita and her husband is take three months to
focus on trimester 0. And we put together ADIY stack
of nutrients for our husbands, which we put together from
different multivitamins. And we committed to three months
of really leveling up our eating, our movement.
I took on acupuncture 3 * a week.
Our husbands kind of committed to three months of no bad
behavior, which for them is like no smoking, no drinking.
A lot of things that are so common and even legal are just
horrible for fertility. Was it hard to get them on board
or were they like all in? You know, I think after loss,
men are committed to doing, committed to doing anything they
can. It's so painful for a couple to
experience that and they're part of the pain.
You know, it's, it's hard for them and it's hard for us.
And three months later, after committing to going into this
consciously and doing all the right things, I got pregnant
with Emma, who was born four days after my 42nd birthday, my
first try. And Vita, three months
afterwards, gave birth to her daughter Davina.
So our experiment worked and that experiment really propelled
us to launch the brand because we wanted everybody who was
going through such painful times to have the blessings that we
had and have access to the information and access to just
like the education and all of the people that we had in our
network, we wanted everybody else to have.
That's so incredible. And I think so when we do think
about how men factor into the equation, it's often thought of
in terms of just like getting pregnant, you know, and, and I
think like sperm count maybe is talked about.
But but I know that you guys have said that the quality of
the sperm matters. And that's why even if a woman
does get pregnant, sperm can factor into the miscarriage as
well and can even be responsible for 50% of miscarriages.
It's incredible. Like it's such a small thing
that men can do to just like radically transform the health
of their sperm. There's and you guys are living
proof. There's also so much data, not
just unlike the miscarriage itself, but the lifelong health
of the child. There's some research that shows
that men who have like kind of binge eating episodes will have
children that have blood sugar dysregulation.
There is so much more research being done on sperm, sperm.
Now sperm can impact the health of the pregnancy and like
placenta and can even cause things like preeclampsia.
And so we want to know that we're passing along.
You know, when you think about your children, a lot of times
you're like, oh, does your son have like blonde hair like you?
You know, you're, you think about the traits that you're
passing along that are like, you know, the physical traits, but
you don't realize you're also passing along your, you know,
the epigenetics, you're turning on and off genes that can, you
know, be passed on to your child.
And so it's not just about having that baby and the 2 pink
lines that you see on your pregnancy test.
It's really about investing in the future of your child for
their entire life. And so to us, it's a no brainer
when you ask about men and were they able like, you know, if if
men understand this, of course they're going to commit to no
drinking, of course they're going to commit to no smoking
and at the very least commit to taking a prenatal for three
months before trying to conceive.
The fertility industry has become a multi billion dollar
industry. Do you feel like they are
praying on women's fears? Because as you're saying all
this I'm thinking why is this not a part of the conversation
immediately? Why?
Why do IVF clinics not factor this in and not try this as the
first option? That is a great question.
The fertility industry is a $20 billion industry, 20 billion.
That is a huge industry. And I think part of it is that
these are businesses with quotas.
But, but a big part of it is really the lack of education
that doctors don't have. They don't have exposed exposure
to nutrition classes. They actually don't know a lot
of this information. And so I think it's the system
as a whole, like the medical system.
And a lot of times people go straight from trying to
conceive, working with their OBGYN for six months to a year,
straight to IVF. And there's just so much that
you could do before you get into that, get to that step.
And even if you go go to that step, your outcomes will be so
much better if you are focusing on the basics.
And I think, you know, when it comes to IVF, it's this
technology is incredible and it helps so many people and so many
couples. And ultimately there will be
some people that need to resort to that.
You have to be smart about how you're going into things.
And that shouldn't be the first approach.
Yeah. Let's talk a little bit about
nutrients and how certain nutrients can impact fertility
and a growing baby in the womb as well.
Can you give us a breakdown on that?
Definitely so nutrients are a big deal when it comes to
fertility. Health of mom, health of baby,
your outcomes in postpartum nutrient depletion can cause
postpartum depression and anxiety.
So it's actually a big deal. And that's why even though our
big AHA to create weenatal came from the men's aspect and the
men's prenatal, why we even got into women's prenatal was
because a product like weenatal didn't exist.
We were taking a prenatal that was, I would say, like solid, a
solid brand, but we had to add vitamin D, we had to add
choline, we had to add iron, we had to add folate.
So we were basically taking, I don't know, like 13 pills a day
because we had to add so many things.
And by the way, we were also paying about $150.00 a month
because we had to piece together all of these nutrients to make
our prenatal a good prenatal. So choline is a critical
nutrient for baby brain development.
And even some research shows that choline can impact your
child's IQ. And so when Vita and I were
taking our prenatal, our prenatal didn't have choline.
So we had to add that. And so many prenatals on the
market either don't contain choline or have very minimal
dosages. But we know that the dose makes
a difference, especially with prenatals.
And so choline is a big one. And so if anybody's looking at
their nutrition label, the first thing they should look at is
choline. Make sure it has at least 400
milligrams. And if not, that prenatal is not
for you. The next one is folate and not
folic acid. So that's a big kind of debate
out there, folic acid versus folate and we needle has
methylfolate, which is a bioavailable form of folic acid,
which is critical for neural tube development, which is
essentially what ends up becoming your spinal cord and
your brain and kind of a big deal, kind of a big deal.
And the reason why we use methylfolate is because 40% of
the population have a genetic mutation called MTHFR and they
cannot convert the synthetic form of folic acid, folic acid
to the bioavailable form methylfolate.
And so it's very important to make sure that your prenatal has
the bioavailable form. And I think other than that,
from a high level, our our prenatal includes 24 key
ingredients and every single one of them, there is a reason why
they're in there and there's a reason why they're in there in
that specific dose. And we share all of the research
on our website. But from a high level, it's
important to know that your prenatal should be comprehensive
and should have at least those 24 key ingredients.
Like a lot of prenatals on the market, like the ones that you
would find that like a Target or Acvs only have 12 ingredients.
And for us, we wouldn't leave 1 nutrient out of the prenatal.
So that's one big thing that people should look at.
You know, labels are very confusing, but at the very least
count and make sure that it has 24 key ingredients and then make
sure it has methylfolate. Make sure it has choline at the
right dose. Another big one is vitamin D.
We know that vitamin D is responsible for your hormones
and low vitamin D can actually impact things like preeclampsia,
gestational diabetes, or low, low birth weight.
It makes a big difference on pregnancy outcomes.
And so we Natal has 4000 I us of vitamin D and it's really
important to, you know, check your vitamin D levels and make
sure that they're optimal. And then last one, because I
can, I can we could talk about. The.
And the dosages and get really get in the weeds is iron.
Iron is critical for pregnancy because your iron needs double
when you're pregnant. And so that was one in our
formula, we have 18 milligrams of iron.
And when we were formulating we Natal, we were going back and
forth with our formulation team for about 3 months on should we
put iron in it or should we put calcium because both of those
things cannot exist in one capsule because they compete for
absorption. And we really went back and
forth for a long time. But ultimately we realized that
it's harder to get iron from diet when and especially when
you're pregnant. When you're nauseous, it's a.
Lot and have meat aversion. Yeah, exactly.
It's a lot easier to get calcium from diet.
And so we went with iron and we hear from so many of our we
Natal customers that were on a different prenatal and then they
took we Natal for their second or third pregnancy and all of a
sudden for postpartum, they felt better, they had more energy.
Kelly Levesque, our mutual friend, talks a lot about how
the iron and renatal really helped her with her third
pregnancy. And so that's a, that's a big
one too, just making sure that you're getting the iron.
Yeah. And I think what we learned when
we were incepting this brand is that first of all, very similar
to primarily pure, it was our own deed.
We knew we needed it. We knew women and men deserved
better and better options and optimism in this ever
increasingly stressful and slightly negative world of
fertility. And so similarly, when we saw
all these store brands, we thought, of course, they must be
regulated. Of course there must be
integrity in this world, and there's not.
There's no FDA regulation. Anyone who thinks up a vitamin
could put it on the shelf. And if you're not versed to look
for those nutrients and also what's equally important is
what's not in it. So we were finding prenatals
with a whole paragraph of other additives, fillers, colors,
binders, you name it, Things you never want to ingest, much less
when you're trying to conceive a baby.
And so once you learn all this stuff, you can not, you can't
look back. It's like, have you ever seen
the movie The 6th Sense? Once you find out Bruce Willis
was that, I remember like that moment, you will go back on
every scene and like replay. And so once we found out about
men's health, about the lack of integrity in the supplement
world, the rock of regulation, we literally wanted to make
something so much better for us and everyone who came behind us.
OK. That's wild that the prenatals
are not FDA regulated because we launched A sunscreen last year
and it was the longest, most tedious process because even
that is regulated by the FDA, but a prenatal isn't.
That's wild. Can you guys just go off on one
a days? I would love to hear your
breakdown of the popular prenatal 1A day.
Yeah. Well, it's funny, I once send
our nutrition director the label and I didn't tell her what it
was. She's like, what is that?
I wouldn't touch that with a 10 foot pole.
And I think 1A day is in theory a good idea, like one per day.
But like, can you get all of your nutrients for the day and
just one meal? No, you can't.
So like at the end of the day, they're selling you on the
market of like on the idea of convenience.
But ultimately, if you look at their label, it's not
comprehensive. It has low dosages, horrible
forms and also the paragraph of what they have in there is just
like you would never ingest like what Vita said and so.
The. Junk.
Yeah, the junk. It shouldn't be there.
Why did they use it? Maybe companies put that stuff
in there. I mean, it's like, why does
Wonder Bread use what they use in it?
Because they have a shelf life that's essentially forever and
so. Our to produce.
Our shelf life is 2 years and you know, from an operational
perspective and I'm sure you, you see the same thing with your
products. You have to manufacture things
more often and in smaller batches and it's harder to
manufacture. But that's our commitment to the
consumer. We want to make sure that
whatever they take in is, you know what we wish on us.
And it's just like it's so important.
And the the other thing just to add on it is third party testing
and regulating because prenatals are not regulated by the FDA.
We actually use a third party to make sure that the potency, what
we say is on our label is actually in our product.
They look at heavy metals to make sure that our product
doesn't contain heavy metals that are harmful when you're
pregnant. And they look at third party
testing ensures purity and potency.
And so that's also very important.
And a lot of products will say that they're third party tested
tested, but when you ask them for the documentation, they
don't send it to you. So we share our third party
testing documents for every single batch on our website as
APDF, so anybody can look and see it the results.
So that's very important. And I love that it's just three
capsules because it is so pure, it is so concentrated and
bioavailable. And Grace don't use all of the
synthetic fillers that other companies do.
So probably helps a lot with buy in from from men and also from
women that are having trouble, you know, taking pills while
they're pregnant. Having it as just those 3 is
like huge. Yeah.
And science is also ever changing and so I can't speak to
one a day, but I'm pretty sure it's been on the shelf forever
without it evolving. And the science and our
ingredients have based on the latest clinical research to
support fertility and so much so that it was already the best
prenatal on the market. And then six months into
launching, new research came out and our whole medical board got
together and made it even better.
And we completely changed our formula and made small tweaks to
go to the latest science. And that's our also commitment
and why other brands don't do it.
It's costly, it takes time, even finding a manufacturer that will
work in small dosage and clean. And also it's not easy because
they're so pure. If water touches it, if heat
like it's not shelf stable, it's very sensitive to the elements.
And so, but we would not do it any differently.
And we want to give the best for ourselves and for our community.
In the summer we have to pack and ship with an ice pack.
You know, if it's logistical things that just make it harder
on like the company and the business, but to the consumer,
they deserve the best. I love that and I feel like your
heart comes across so much and and everything that you guys do,
it's very evident how much you care.
I've also heard that some of the worst prenatals are the ones
prescribed by the doctors in fertility clinics.
Is that true? It's true from what we've seen.
And I will say though that in the last three years we have
seen a shift in how fertility doctors talk about nutrients.
And there are some fertility doctors back in the day when we
first started that would literally just say your age is
the number one factor when it comes to your fertility.
And now fertility doctors are talking about inflammation,
they're talking about Coq 10, they're talking about
acupuncture. So slowly this message is
getting out there. But yes, I've seen some of the
prescribed prenatals out there and they're scary.
For women who are eating a really nutrient dense diet
already, maybe they're having a lot of red meat for iron and
eggs for choline, sunshine for vitamin D.
Is a prenatal still necessary? Yes, I'd say, I mean, even if it
was our full time job to eat for fertility and I look at someone
who I look up to, like Kelly Levesque, who's one of our
medical advisors and on our board, she probably eats like
the rainbow. She's home cooking every day
with the best oils and the best meat.
And she still found the need to take our prenatal for her
pregnancies. And so you realize that no
matter how good you can eat, it's always a good idea to build
those nutrient reserves. And like, it's a small insurance
policy to me to make sure whatever our food sources, even
the best quality could be lacking because of the depletion
in our soils and all the things which you know.
And so I'd say absolutely, and it's like the lowest hanging
fruit to make sure you're doing everything you can.
Aside from getting the right nutrients, what else can women
and men be doing? Lifestyle stuff, you know,
sleep, all of that to optimize their fertility.
Yeah, there. There's so much that couples
could do together and anything that we talked about in regards
to like women apply to men as well.
But I would say the first thing is your diet, essentially, you
know, you can't really supplement yourself out of a bad
diet. So the diet, what you put into
your body every single day makes a big difference.
And there's a ton of data showing that the Mediterranean
diet, a high protein diet with colorful vegetables and fruits,
which provide you with the antioxidants, the high protein
diets that balance your blood sugar make a big difference on
male and female fertility. So starting with diet.
Is that kind of how you 2 eat? Yes.
So getting in your protein is obviously critical and just
making sure to eat the rainbow. The next one is kind of the
toxins in your environment. Let's put that into like one big
bucket. It's what you're putting on your
body, around your body. And we talk a lot about how the
two most toxic places in your house is essentially your
kitchen and your bathroom. I'm sure you talk about this all
day long. And so your listeners know that
what you put on your body is critical.
And nowadays it's so easy to get clean products.
I think when you started primarily pure, you were
probably like the first one. It wasn't the case that people
would have to make their own products, but it's not the case
anymore. And so just making sure to look
at your labels and in the kitchen kind of ditching the
plastics, ditching the Teflon to being more mindful about the
products, your cleaning supplies.
I think anything with fragrance people need to avoid like the
plague. I mean, fragrance is full of
phthalates that are endocrine disrupting chemicals that can
lead to estrogen dominance in the body and then that has a
negative impact on fertility. That's just an easy one that if
something that you're using, whether it's a cleaning product
or a skin care product to beauty product, if it says fragrance on
the label, just avoid it completely.
Yeah. And it's so funny.
Yesterday on our way to school, my daughter was asking me, why
do people have that, like that tree hanging on their car?
And she was like, and I said, you know, they just don't know
that fragrance is bad for you. And she's like, she goes, oh, is
that why when we were at Target, you told me not like, that you
couldn't get me that candle. And I said yeah, you can only
get candles from specific. Places, but the ones at Target,
they're definitely not good for you because they have these
fragrances and. Walk down that aisle and you
just get away. All of it, right?
Away and a migraine, Yeah. To go with it.
And and then I would say like the last one, like the last big
bucket is really stress and sleep and they go hand in hand.
And so our bodies were just not made to reproduce in these like
stressful days. So finding ways that ground you
and finding ways to navigate that stress and then really like
investing in good quality sleep. I think sleep is so underrated
and it's something that can really help kind of like reset
your nervous system and help with detox.
And so focusing on good quality sleep, sleep hygiene, ditching
the screens late at night, or at least getting blue blocking
glasses. Do you guys wear blue blockers?
Yeah, at night, yeah, at least so I could watch a show or my
phone and not. You don't just do it at night,
you do it. Oh I do during the day too.
I have the yellow ones. I do the.
Day yellow. And the red one for night.
Once you start doing it. Yeah, it makes the.
Big difference. It's very noticeable and it's
hard to go back. I agree.
Yeah, it's like assaulting to the system.
It's like the information, once you know it, you can't go back.
And so all these like little micro acts make a big
difference. And we prep for so many things.
We prep for our wedding day. We prep nurseries for months or
baby showers. But like the most important time
is prepping for the lifelong health of your kids.
And so these little micro acts before will only make you a
healthier person to bring welcome that baby into your
home. Absolutely.
What's something that quietly wrecks fertility but almost no
one suspects? You know, anytime we talk about
a checklist for preconception will oftentimes add taking care
of your oral health as part of that checklist and people are
shocked. But we learned from so many of
our friends that improving your oral microbiome and reducing,
you know, things like gingivitis and inflammation in the gums can
actually improve your fertility. And research shows that women
who have inflammation in their gums, it takes them two to three
months longer to get pregnant. So we always say if you want to
get pregnant in 2026, go to the teeth cleaning and when you're
pregnant, making sure to take care of your teeth.
Because a lot of times we'll hear from people like, oh, I
gave birth and now I have cavities and, you know, they
have a lot of oral issues. Because the baby I had a my
first ever root canal with my first this as well before we
Nadal and she basically drained every nutrient down to my teeth
and I that was when I also couldn't stomach all the pills
and I was like not taking care of myself with supplements and
all that. But yes, they say the baby is
the perfect parasite because they will it'll take from mom.
So if mom's not repleting herself she'll be left
unfortunately slightly damaged like I was.
I. Remember having a teeth cleaning
after my first I was still breastfeeding and my gums were
just bleeding like the most simplest, like touches and and
flossing and yeah, it was terrible.
I think some women are especially vulnerable there too.
And then I started incorporating more like liver into my diet
going forward, and that kind of wasn't as bad for the next two.
One other thing that I learned, which was like taking care of my
mental health, it's not something you often talk about.
And for me, type A corporate person, I was checking the box.
OK, Roni taught me about supplement.
I fixed my thyroid and I was doing the the physical things,
but I was a stress basket and I was literally in my head about
everything. And like that's essentially
putting your body in fight or flight mode.
It's prioritizing sending blood to the limbs to run as if you're
being chased by a bear. It's not helping you prioritize
conception. And so once I found gratitude,
once I like learn to slow down a bit and actually prioritize my
nutrition and slowing down, I was able to have my first
daughter Dolly up. But it's often sometimes we
don't think of when we're checking the boxes and the
mental health around the stressful world we're all living
in. And so whatever works for you,
I'd say stress isn't going away, but how you befriend it, whether
it's getting out in nature like this beautiful setting or taking
more walks in the day or meditating or whatever works for
you. There isn't one-size-fits-all,
but combating the stress with some things is so important in
this journey. That's a good one, especially
because we all have the everyday stressors like you mentioned,
but then also the fertility journey in itself can be really
stressful for people, especially if you you're in a place where
you feel like you've been trying everything and nothing's
working. Exactly.
I mean, and even if it's easier, there will always be something
stressful that you encounter in, you know, pregnancy all of a
sudden, like you don't feel the baby moving or you know,
whatever it may be, it's just like overall could be a very
stressful journey. And now research shows that
gratitude, even in the hardest times can really impact your
Physiology. And so we always tell our
community, even if it's hard, you know, are you grateful for
like the sun that's shining? Like you can always find
something to be grateful for and that will change your journey.
And we actually created a gratitude journal that we send
to all of our subscribers when they subscribe to our Together
kit because we just felt like, OK, we're going to arm you with
the nutrients that will help your Physiology, but we want to
empower you with ways to kind of like improve your mind because
there's that mind body connection as well.
Yeah, it's so important both of you have had babies over the age
of 35, which is considered geriatric in modern medicine.
What does that term even mean and what are some misconceptions
surrounding geriatric pregnancies?
I don't know if your audience could see my eye roll around
that term, but it is infuriating.
It's such a like poisonous term. And for me, I remember the nurse
even saying we have to do this actual word blood work because
you're considered geriatric. And like there's nothing worse
than the mental burden of something that doesn't serve
you, but it only hurts you. I didn't understand at the time,
but it was definitely something that I went into that pregnancy
with more panic because I was termed that.
So to me, it's not any anything other than we need to change the
narrative. More women are actually having
kids in their 40s than their 20s.
So we're at a time where we're all having kids later in life
for great reasons. We've entered the workforce, we
have education, we have so many things for women that wasn't
accessible generations ago. And so that's probably why it's
incoming increasingly stressful and these terms don't serve us.
And I think they need to be obsolete.
I mean, even advanced maternal age isn't that much more kind.
So to me also being your own advocate and not getting in your
head with like the stuff you hear around you and doing your
own research, you can feel empowered in your pregnancy and
not defeated with something I wish to pass on.
And I think there's the idea of your biological age versus your
chronological age. You could be 41 years old the
way I was and live a completely healthy lifestyle.
And at the time when I looked at my biological age, I was in my
early 30s. And so if you take care of your
body, your cells actually age slower.
And so that is more important than your actual age.
Now, like we said going back to earlier in the conversation,
your mitochondria matters. And as you age, if you improve
your mitochondria, the battery of the cell, you can essentially
slow down the aging of your eggs.
And so we always say that it's about egg quality versus egg
quantity. Yes, later in life you do have
less eggs, but you just need that one healthy egg to make
that healthy baby. And we can influence that with
our day-to-day choices and and activities and lifestyle.
Yes, our day-to-day choices because the 100 days leading to
your ovulation when the egg is maturing, you really make an
impact on that egg quality and what makes the impact is the
mitochondria. So taking in nutrients that
improve your mitochondria like Coq 10, NAC, we have a product
called Egg Quality Plus, which takes five of the nutrients that
improve egg quality all in one product.
And, you know, doing all the things we talked about because
it makes a big difference. I think that's another thing
that isn't talked about often. I think eggs are often thought
of as being set and stagnant. And you know, you get what you
get, what you're born with, and then there's no changing it.
There's no impacting it. But you're saying that we
actually can make an impact in just what did you say, 100 days?
And 100 days. And make a difference.
A big difference in the egg quality.
And you know, we hear it from so many of our customers where, you
know, they were on Weenadal, they weren't on Weenadal.
We were just telling you a story of somebody that Vita spoke to
who had no viable embryos. Then her and her husband took
Weenadal and they have 7 viable embryos.
So it makes a big difference and there's so much you could do.
And I think like, you know, back when I started talking to, you
know, when we started working on weenatal and I would tell my
fertility Dr. friends, you know, I had my first when I was 38 and
my second when I was 42. They said, well, you're just
lucky. And it's like, no, yes, I think
luck has to do a little bit with it, you know?
You're like I worked so hard to do there.
There's God, but also there's the hard work.
You have to put in the the work. Is it absolutely true that women
are born with all of the eggs we will ever have?
That's correct. Yeah.
So we probably start off with a couple million eggs and then we
lose them every month. But back to the point, that's
the myth that I that's the thing we hear the most, but no one
talks about the quality. So by about 37 we probably have
10s of thousands. You know, it does reduce every
month, but no one's talking about that 100 day window where
we can improve the quality. And again, all you need is 1
quality good egg. And so let's not again poison
our mind with the numbers. And there's one There's little
put portions of the conversation that matter, but it shouldn't
consume you. Like the terms, you know?
And you guys talk about that three to six month window before
conception as the golden window. What does that mean and why is
that time so powerful? Trimester 0 is so important and
it's not one that most people think about.
We talked about first trimester, second trimester, even 4th
trimester, which we love that people are talking about the
fourth trimester. But trimester 0 is critical for
for a few reasons. So #1 investing in yourself
before you're actually pregnant will allow you to build those
nutrient reserves so that when you're actually, when you
actually become pregnant, if you have a hard time eating and you
can just consume, you know, bread or crackers and like it's
no big deal because you built those nutrient reserves in
advance. And so that's one thing.
The second reason is because of this idea of sperm quality takes
has the 72 day window of the spermatogenesis and then that
maturing egg has that 100 day window.
And so in those two, you know, for men and for women, you can
really impact the quality of the egg and the sperm.
And so going into fertility and making sure that you did
everything possible to improve your egg quality and your sperm
quality will just give you such a greater start.
It's like you wouldn't plant a seed without in, in dirt without
nurturing the dirt. You would, you would really take
care of that. In order to plant like a
beautiful strawberry or whatever it may be, you have to take care
of your body together. And so we, we talk about
preconception trimester 0 all the time to the point where
sometimes customers tell us like, wait, are you like, does
should now I'm pregnant? Like what should I like, should
I take, continue taking your prenatal?
Yes, but we are so passionate about trimester 0 because it can
make or break your entire experience.
And like I said, even postpartum, if you go into
pregnancy depleted, you know, game over for for postpartum,
you're going to be so much more depleted and exhausted in
postpartum. Because you've just grown a baby
and given birth to a baby, and then often times you're nursing
that baby. And so there goes, yeah, not
getting sleep. Absolutely.
And I've heard that term trimester 4A lot.
But this is the first time I've heard trimester zero.
I love that you guys are are talking about that.
Beyond taking a high quality prenatal, what else can women do
once they get pregnant to continue to support their
bodies? I think it's, you know,
continuing to do the things that they did in trimester 0, which
sets the foundation right, but continuing to focus on eating
clean. Movement, you know, I think
movement is one that we didn't really talk about, but also like
not too much and not too little, like finding the sweet spot that
works for you. I think continuing to connect
with your partner, that's another one too, that sometimes
when you're, you have struggles and you're, you know, going down
the, the, the rabbit hole of like treatments or whatever it
may be, you forget to have fun. And it's just like focusing on
those things, joy, community, friends, all of those things can
really like help your journey. For any woman that has
experienced miscarriage or loss and it's just out of place of
feeling hopeless, how would you encourage them?
We've been there, first of all. So we want to open up We Needle
as their community first and foremost.
Our brand is about community over isolation, education over
fear. And So what I'd say is that
gratitude helped me in the darkest days.
And while it's so hard in the moment and it's hard to really
envision the baby's coming, and I have faith in the timing and I
know my body can do this for me. Tony recommended the book Spirit
Babies. And it really talked about the
soul is still there and it's waiting for you.
And so I found a little bit of light.
But I'd say now more than ever, community is so important.
And often times I came from a culture where you don't really
tell anyone you had a miscarriage.
You kind of brush under the rug and you're you're strong.
And I want to go back to my corporate career and not be, you
know, weak Percy. But now more than ever is when
you need to lean in, when the friends do matter and it's a
community you want to create anyway as you go into
parenthood. And they say it takes a village
because it really does. But for me, if you can have
faith in the timing of your baby, if you can have faith in
why it happened and that there will be a light and finding
gratitude, it can be comforting. I know it's hard.
Yeah, I'm going back to the idea of community, talking about your
loss and sharing about it. If people do that, they'll
realize that so many people in their circle have actually had
losses. And for me, my friend Lillian
had multiple losses before having her first child.
And sometimes you have to hear those like positive outcomes of
like other people to believe that it can actually happen to
you. And that's why with We Needle,
we're so passionate about sharing our story and talking
about it and letting people know it's not too late.
There are solutions. There's so much you could do
because we were there. We were at our lowest spot.
And even though for us, it was the most painful time of our
lives, I'm so grateful that we had these miscarriages a week
apart. We're so grateful for those two
souls that came into our lives because it really gave us our
purpose. And now with that, we're able to
help so many people. And we there's not a day that
goes by that I don't open my inbox and people say, you know,
I couldn't have done this without you.
They share their ultrasound pictures.
They stop us on the street and say, this is my we needle baby.
They invite us to their baby showers.
And we are so grateful for, you know, these losses because we
know that I don't know. For us, it gave us our, our
lives, mission and our purpose. And we we couldn't have asked
for anything better. And much easier said than done
right? You can look back and be
grateful, but trying to have that faith in the moment that if
you had lost, perhaps in my case I had multiple and in one case
the baby was not healthy and there was chromosomal errors.
And I had faith that when the time is right, I will have my
healthy baby. And so believing.
What do you want the woman who blames herself for her
miscarriage to know? One, it's not all on her.
I think so much of our brand was because we don't want women to
take the burden of fertility on themselves.
And you do the prep, you put your best foot forward and then
it's back to having a little faith.
But please know that there's so many circumstances, including
her partner's health and the world we live in, that could be
playing into it. And so while I definitely had
the self blame, I'm hoping that by sharing our story and sharing
the education and empowering women and couples still more
look at the science versus go inwards and blame themselves.
And honestly, sometimes you can be doing everything right and
it's just not your time. And so, yeah, it's going back to
what Vita said, letting go and just trusting that you know your
baby will be there with you when the timing is right.
And now when we look back like and we look at our rainbow
babies, we couldn't have imagined life any differently.
They're amazing and they're perfect and they're exactly who
our daughters intended to be. I love how open both of you are
about your stories. And I think that the two of you
are the perfect spokespeople for your brand and the perfect
people to bring this message for the world.
Because you've lived the story that probably a lot of your
customers are dealing with and you've already lived those
struggles and you've come out of the other side.
And I just think your message brings so much hope for for so
many people. So.
I love that. OK, I want to close this out
with some bunch of quick rapid fire questions of it.
What's one thing that you wish every couple would stop doing
when trying to conceive? Doing it alone.
Exactly, it's a team sport, get after it together.
Let's change the narrative. Me to we.
Love it. What is the fertility myth that
frustrates you the most? You're too old.
You're too old to have a baby. Don't let anybody ever tell you
you're too old. And even if you it doesn't
happen exactly the way that you wanted it to happen, we have a
team member that had her son at the age of 57.
She used the donor egg and she carried her son to term.
And so there is always a way. It might not be exactly what you
want your way to be like, or how you planned it, but you know
there's always a way. What is 1 simple daily habit
that quietly supports fertility? I would say for me sleep.
Sleep is the best thing ever, yeah.
You can't really get around that one can't get around.
That one that was a game changer.
That's actually why we launched a magnesium my or ring scores
were insanity. I tried everything weighted
blankets, eye pillows anyways Melton none of it worked and our
new magnesium is epic. If anyone has sleep issues and
also movement, we're sitting way too long and we're indoors way
too long. And so for me, incorporating
some walking, zoom meetings and walking and talking and like
finding ways to incorporate it in your everyday life.
Kelly talks about doing squats between meetings and whatever
works for you. Again, it's it's not
one-size-fits-all, but just trying to incorporate small
micro habits can be a game changer.
I love those. I completely agree.
I'm always you can ask the crew. I'm always doing like, air
squats between podcast recordings.
And yeah, I think it's just realizing like, how backwards
our environment is and our lifestyles are and trying to,
like, find little ways to, like, inch back towards living a more
ancestral lifestyle. Agreed completely.
And sometimes it's just these these small things that if we're
consistent with them, it really adds up. 01 more Back to that
oral health tongue scraping. Our good friend Doctor Lydia,
who's an amazing dentist, told us that's a game changer and I
never stopped doing it ever since she told us.
Oh my gosh. Morning and night tongue.
Scraping. That's one thing.
It's such a quick easy. Thing and it's a game changer.
I do oil pulling. Do you guys oil?
Pull. I haven't she.
Actually swishing around oil in your mouth for I mean tongue is
probably a lot quicker. Like I switch around oil in my
mouth for like 10 minutes. Yeah, most mornings, not every
morning, but I don't know why I haven't gotten into the habit of
tongue scraping. Easy.
So many people talk about it. It's like gratifying.
You see all the junk leaving your tongue and you're like,
really? I'm so happy you have to.
Really like scrape hard. No, no, not really.
And actually for men, it supports Nitric oxide
production, which helps support with erection and all those
things. So, you know, it's all linked.
It's all linked. OK, another thing I have to
start. What is something that anyone
trying to conceive should stay away from or avoid like the
plague? We'll say a couple folic acid,
which we talked about. Yeah, if your prenatal has folic
acid. Stay away.
And then, you know, those toxins, I would say alcohol,
marijuana, smoking, those things that seem to be like culturally
accepted, but they just harm fertility.
And for men especially, those things go straight to their
sperm. There's no filter into the
testicles, so. Yeah, avoiding those, especially
in that like 3 month window probably really important, yeah.
What gives you the most hope about the future of fertility
care? Our customer stories, we hear
from so many people that they were told they had unexplained
infertility or IVF was their only option, or they're too old.
And I can't even tell you. Like sometimes I don't believe
the stories that I hear from people.
And that really gives us hope that the narrative is changing
and that we can really make an impact and help millions of
people around the world. So good, I love how connected
you guys are to your customers. You were telling me earlier that
you actually like regularly take calls with customers.
That's amazing. So grounding it, you don't know
what you don't know. We're stuck in the day-to-day,
but having these customer calls has given us a chance to give
back, learn what we're doing great, learn what they want more
of. And it's been humbling honestly,
hearing these stories and it's like it brings you to tears when
you see that like people had no hope and have now changed.
I mean, just last week was a story with 7 embryos after she
had none and one podcast changed her life.
It was that one with Courtney Swan and she basically said that
changed everything for her. It gave her hope.
She took we Needle for her and her partner and that transformed
their life. And, and as founders, you know,
you have the ups and downs of the business.
They could feel like, I don't know, sometimes we look back and
we think like progress is like you're growing slowly and, and
talking to the consumers and hearing from them that you
actually made a difference. Like you responding to Adm gave
them hope. Or I I'll send voice notes to to
customers sometimes on DMS and, and, and hearing from them what
a big difference it made in their lives really continues to
fuel you as a founder and continue to do what you do and
continue to innovate and create better products for, for the
community. Yeah.
I'm sure it just keeps you guys more connected to your mission
and not easy to do. By the way, like as a founder,
we have so much going on. It's so easy to just get caught
up in our To Do List. And so I'm sure it's not easy to
set time aside to do that. But just again, shows like how
much you guys really do care about the people that you're
supporting and your your mission as a whole.
So I think that's amazing. OK, I'm going to have you guys
finish the following sentence. Healthy fertility starts with
both partners. Trimester 0.
Together, thank you both so much for being here.
I just I love what you do. I I love your products.
I started taking me Natal recently.
It's a beautiful experience. The packaging is amazing.
Love what you both are doing and thanks for making time to come
out to the farm today. The feeling is mutual.
You're amazing. Primarily Pure is amazing and I
feel we feel so connected with you because there's so much
integrity behind what you're doing and we appreciate what
you've done. I feel like you've changed the
game and the clean deodorant space and the clean product
space. So thank you for what you do.
Thank you both. Where can people find you and
where can people find we needle? Our website weneedle.com on
Instagram we're at we under score Natal.
We actually have a free gift for your community.
The magnesium that Vita was talking about, if they go to
weenatal.com/grounded Wellness, they'll get a free magnesium
when they subscribe to Weenatal. You guys will thank me later,
trust me on this one. That's a really good deal.
I didn't know we were doing that.
Thank you. You're.
Well, of course. Amazing.