1 00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:08,680 Hello and welcome to our London History Podcast, where we share 2 00:00:08,680 --> 00:00:12,280 our love of London people, places and history. 3 00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:15,640 This podcast is designed for you to learn things about London 4 00:00:15,640 --> 00:00:17,800 that most Londoners don't even know. 5 00:00:18,560 --> 00:00:22,560 I am Hazel Baker, a qualified London tour guide and CEO of 6 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:27,000 London guidedwalks.co.uk. Our walking tours are designed 7 00:00:27,000 --> 00:00:30,120 for those who love London and want to make the most of their 8 00:00:30,120 --> 00:00:32,320 time here. No matter whether it's for a 9 00:00:32,320 --> 00:00:36,920 weekend or a lifetime, we aim to deliver well prepared and 10 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:40,400 insightful guided walks and private tours to make it an 11 00:00:40,400 --> 00:00:44,840 experience worth remembering. It's been a busy time here at 12 00:00:44,840 --> 00:00:48,840 London Guided Walks HQ, but don't forget our London History 13 00:00:48,840 --> 00:00:52,880 Podcast section on our website now includes full transcripts, 14 00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:56,160 photos, videos and recommended reading. 15 00:00:56,520 --> 00:00:59,240 And you can find this section on our website 16 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:04,920 londonguidedwalks.co.uk/podcast or simply go to our website, 17 00:01:05,200 --> 00:01:08,680 click on the section that says London History in the menu and 18 00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:12,200 then select Podcast. We've got lots of new images and 19 00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:15,800 also we've linked to related blog posts and other podcast 20 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:21,320 episodes where appropriate. Don't forget, if you enjoy what 21 00:01:21,320 --> 00:01:23,600 we do then please rate and review. 22 00:01:23,880 --> 00:01:28,000 It warms the cockles of my heart to read your appreciation of 23 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:32,640 this labour of love. Get that cup of tea, put your 24 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:38,840 feet up and enjoy. In today's episode, we are 25 00:01:38,840 --> 00:01:43,640 stepping back into the 18th century to meet a man whose name 26 00:01:43,640 --> 00:01:47,760 is both prominent and controversial, William Beckford. 27 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:52,160 Born in Jamaica in 17 O 9, Beckford became one of the 28 00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:56,280 wealthiest commoners in Britain through the profits of sugar 29 00:01:56,280 --> 00:02:01,400 plantations and enslaved labour. Twice Lord Mayor of London, he 30 00:02:01,400 --> 00:02:05,520 built his legacy in Guildhall, on grand estates and also in 31 00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:08,800 Parliament. But at what cost? 32 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:14,720 With me today is Ian Mcdermid, the City of London guide who 33 00:02:14,720 --> 00:02:17,080 doesn't shy away from the tough subjects. 34 00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:20,840 And he's here to help us unpick the many threads of Beckford's 35 00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:24,720 life, from his influence in city politics to the uncomfortable 36 00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:33,400 truths behind his wealth. If we're talking about his early 37 00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:38,360 life and the wealth with William Beckford, what do we know about 38 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:42,680 his early life in Jamaica and how did he come to inherit all 39 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:44,520 of it? Well, the the simple fact is 40 00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:50,360 that his father was the largest plantation owner in Jamaica and 41 00:02:50,360 --> 00:02:53,360 also the speaker of the Jamaica Parliament. 42 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:56,800 And Beckford's inheritance is a little bit complicated. 43 00:02:57,320 --> 00:03:01,480 He's not the eldest son, he's the second son, but is the his 44 00:03:01,480 --> 00:03:03,280 elder brother dies before he does. 45 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:08,120 But actually he has to engage in very long litigation with his 46 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:09,960 mother. But eventually he does get the 47 00:03:09,960 --> 00:03:14,360 majority of the estates. And in addition to his 48 00:03:14,360 --> 00:03:20,280 inheritance, he has a reputation amongst other plantation owners 49 00:03:20,280 --> 00:03:24,920 of being very sharp. There were economies of scale 50 00:03:24,920 --> 00:03:28,680 within running plantations and. There is a process whereby. 51 00:03:28,680 --> 00:03:33,120 The plantations in the Caribbean gradually get bigger and. 52 00:03:33,320 --> 00:03:35,960 One of the ways that. Beckford took advantage of this 53 00:03:35,960 --> 00:03:40,360 was that he would lend other plantation owners money through 54 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:44,360 a mortgage secured on their property and then when they 55 00:03:44,920 --> 00:03:48,360 failed to make the payments, he had the reputation for being 56 00:03:48,520 --> 00:03:52,120 rather too quick in foreclosing on those mortgages. 57 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:55,720 So he was able to build up his position largely through his 58 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:59,560 inheritance by a servo carried out in 1754. 59 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:04,080 He is shown as owning some 22,000 acres on Jamaica, making 60 00:04:04,080 --> 00:04:08,120 him the largest landowner and 3000 slaves. 61 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:13,640 Wow, that's a huge amount. There is a very good book on 62 00:04:13,640 --> 00:04:16,880 William Beckford by Perry Gauche, an Oxford historian. 63 00:04:17,079 --> 00:04:22,320 It is the book on on the subject, and Gauchy estimates 64 00:04:22,320 --> 00:04:30,640 that Beckford's average income was 14 one 4000 lbs, though he 65 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:33,960 Gauchy cautions that the figures were very volatile. 66 00:04:33,960 --> 00:04:38,600 To give some perspective on to what 14,000 lbs. 67 00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:42,880 Meant, about this time a junior clerk at the Bank of England 68 00:04:42,880 --> 00:04:46,120 would be earning around 50 lbs. So we can think of 50 lbs as 69 00:04:46,120 --> 00:04:52,120 being the very bottom of the kind of respectable ladder in 70 00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:54,920 Georgian England. So you can just about survive on 71 00:04:54,920 --> 00:04:58,280 £50 a year. 14,000 is a huge amount. 72 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:02,560 But in addition to this, Beckford's wealth was legendary. 73 00:05:02,560 --> 00:05:06,240 There was a famous quote about him from Horace Walpole which 74 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:11,160 was endlessly repeated in at the time in newspapers and the rest 75 00:05:11,160 --> 00:05:15,600 of it. And while Fontil, which becomes 76 00:05:15,600 --> 00:05:22,600 Beckford's English estate in Wiltshire, burns down and after 77 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:28,400 this disaster, Walpo quotes him saying, oh, I have an odd 50,000 78 00:05:28,400 --> 00:05:29,320 lbs in the. Drawer. 79 00:05:29,520 --> 00:05:33,880 I will build this up again so Walpole isn't always the most 80 00:05:33,880 --> 00:05:36,840 accurate, but this is the kind of jokey thing that rich people 81 00:05:36,840 --> 00:05:40,600 say about their wealth in boasting and I think the point. 82 00:05:40,600 --> 00:05:42,920 About the story is we we can't necessarily rely on the. 83 00:05:42,920 --> 00:05:45,320 Statistics, but it was repeated, it was given. 84 00:05:45,320 --> 00:05:48,920 Great credence at the time. So he's there. 85 00:05:48,920 --> 00:05:53,640 He he's, he's born in Jamaica. He is sent to England. 86 00:05:53,640 --> 00:05:56,440 For his education. So firstly he goes to 87 00:05:56,440 --> 00:06:00,240 Westminster School and then he goes to Balliol College, Oxford. 88 00:06:00,560 --> 00:06:05,600 And I think that sending your son to Westminster and then to 89 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:08,920 Oxford is partly about getting an. 90 00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:12,320 Education, but it's also partly or in large measure about. 91 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:16,040 Networking and the English universities, certainly in the 92 00:06:16,040 --> 00:06:17,440 18th century. Had a rather. 93 00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:21,640 Poor reputation as being rather backwards and after he's been to 94 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:27,120 Oxford, he's he then goes off to Leiden and studies under the 95 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:32,200 physician Borjava. And we might say that in, in in 96 00:06:32,200 --> 00:06:36,440 the Dutch Republic, he, he got a, a proper education and he 97 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:42,000 returns to Jamaica afterwards. He then makes a couple of trips 98 00:06:42,680 --> 00:06:46,720 to London and then he makes, goes back to Jamaica. 99 00:06:46,720 --> 00:06:49,920 But the final trip to Jamaica is in 1750. 100 00:06:49,920 --> 00:06:51,960 And this is one of the important things about Bedford's. 101 00:06:52,040 --> 00:06:54,760 You said that he, he was born in 17 O 9. 102 00:06:55,080 --> 00:06:58,800 After 1750, he does not go back to Jamaica. 103 00:06:58,800 --> 00:07:03,120 He spends the rest of his life in England, and this is one of 104 00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:06,040 the important things about him. He is part of the plant. 105 00:07:06,040 --> 00:07:11,360 Up proceed the absentee planters who make their way in England. 106 00:07:11,640 --> 00:07:16,120 And these planters are well known for their wealth, and they 107 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:20,720 are resented for their wealth, and they are criticized for 108 00:07:20,720 --> 00:07:25,880 their wealth and for trying to forward the interests of the 109 00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:30,240 sugar columnies. They do not attract a particular 110 00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:33,000 degree of criticism for the slave owning, however. 111 00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:38,840 So I've had a little play around with the National Archives 112 00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:40,360 Currency calculator. Oh. 113 00:07:40,480 --> 00:07:47,480 God. Now this has the often you say, 114 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:49,760 you know when you're over dealing with any of this deal 115 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:54,040 with a pinch of salt, but a skip worth of salt would be more 116 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:57,080 realistic. So if we're looking about what 117 00:07:57,080 --> 00:08:00,160 1770 are we saying? Sorry that that figure is for 118 00:08:00,160 --> 00:08:02,480 the 1760s. So actually you, you, you're not 119 00:08:02,480 --> 00:08:03,560 far out. OK. 120 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:08,000 So if we do for the spending power, so this is not about 121 00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:15,240 wealth, this is spending power for 1760s compared to a say now 122 00:08:15,240 --> 00:08:17,320 issue. It's like 2017 was the last 123 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:27,040 update. Then it was worth £1,434,472.20 124 00:08:27,240 --> 00:08:36,440 which meant in 1760 you could buy with 14,000 pounds, 2043 125 00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:44,480 horses, 2997 cows. If you're wanting to get a few 126 00:08:44,480 --> 00:08:51,840 woolly jumpers then you could get 29,787 stones of of wool. 127 00:08:52,400 --> 00:08:59,960 You could also get 8588 quarts of wheat and you could pay a 128 00:08:59,960 --> 00:09:08,040 skilled tradesman for 140,000 days, which is just amazing if 129 00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:11,680 you think of that kind of of of that wealth that yes, I mean to 130 00:09:11,680 --> 00:09:13,200 have that kind of spending power. 131 00:09:13,280 --> 00:09:15,240 Yes, yeah. I mean, the problem with all 132 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:19,480 that is that the one and a half million just doesn't sound 133 00:09:19,560 --> 00:09:22,520 significant in today's terms. And I think we we'd need to 134 00:09:22,520 --> 00:09:24,960 compare them with with sort of billionaires today. 135 00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:29,880 Yes, I'd agree with that. I mean when also you're playing 136 00:09:29,880 --> 00:09:33,520 around the Bank of England has also got a conversion calculator 137 00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:39,200 has a measuring wealth and they come up with a few other little 138 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:45,720 values as well. So from a value from 1760 to now 139 00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:51,160 14,000 then when you're talking the the monetary value, we've 140 00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:57,160 got about 28 million and that's the reflective of goods and 141 00:09:57,160 --> 00:10:00,640 services. However, if we thinking of 142 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:04,280 economic power and influence, then this is where you're coming 143 00:10:04,280 --> 00:10:07,680 in in with the talking in the realms of billionaires, roughly 144 00:10:07,680 --> 00:10:12,520 about two to £3 billion, which is significant. 145 00:10:13,400 --> 00:10:17,360 Was it typical for men like Bedford to move between colonies 146 00:10:17,360 --> 00:10:21,120 and London so freely? I mean, what does that say about 147 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:24,160 social mobility and also the empire at large? 148 00:10:24,560 --> 00:10:29,600 Well, I think this plantocracy is a fairly new phenomenon and 149 00:10:29,920 --> 00:10:33,360 it causes a certain amount, as already mentioned, resentment. 150 00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:37,440 So it's a very much a phenomenon which contemporaries are aware 151 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:40,200 of. And in terms of social mobility, 152 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:43,120 he does use. His wealth to. 153 00:10:43,720 --> 00:10:46,160 Integrate into the. British. 154 00:10:46,360 --> 00:10:50,160 Landed classes and I think he does this fairly successfully, 155 00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:56,240 but I think we also have to bear in mind that the as Tocrats as 156 00:10:56,240 --> 00:10:59,440 they would define themselves would slightly look down their 157 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:04,160 noses at him as being new money. Not particularly worried about 158 00:11:04,160 --> 00:11:08,080 the origins of this new money, but the fact that it's not old 159 00:11:08,080 --> 00:11:11,840 money and the fact that he is like other members of the plant 160 00:11:11,840 --> 00:11:17,360 operacy so wealthy. So he comes to England and what 161 00:11:17,360 --> 00:11:20,080 he does is he does a couple of things. 162 00:11:20,080 --> 00:11:25,080 One is buy property and as already mentioned, he buys this 163 00:11:25,080 --> 00:11:29,800 property Fonthill, which at the time of its purchase is a 164 00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:35,200 renovated Elizabethan mansion. It burns down, as we've said, 165 00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:39,720 and then he rebuilds it in the latest Palladian style and he 166 00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:43,360 buys a couple of other landed estates as well. 167 00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:47,200 What's interesting, particularly for us concerned with London 168 00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:53,320 history, is following Beckford around London, and his first 169 00:11:53,320 --> 00:11:57,280 London home is #12 Upper Brook Street. 170 00:11:57,320 --> 00:12:02,920 And Brook Street is very near Grovesland Square, which was 171 00:12:02,920 --> 00:12:06,360 perhaps the most fashionable square at this time. 172 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:11,520 And as with these other places that we're going to mention, in 173 00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:15,480 terms of London, there isn't much remaining from Beckford's 174 00:12:15,480 --> 00:12:19,280 time, but it's quite interesting to walk in his footsteps and to 175 00:12:19,280 --> 00:12:24,880 try and imagine the world which he inhabited. 12 Brook Street 176 00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:29,240 was largely remodeled after the Second World War as the high 177 00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:31,440 House of the Canadian High Commissioner. 178 00:12:31,960 --> 00:12:35,720 I've never been inside it. From the outside, it looks one 179 00:12:35,720 --> 00:12:39,800 of those, to my mind, very ugly post Second World War 180 00:12:39,880 --> 00:12:44,080 historicizing buildings. But I've read that inside, some 181 00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:48,040 of the original features remain, so it'd be interesting at some 182 00:12:48,040 --> 00:12:50,440 stage to to go around and have a look at it. 183 00:12:50,440 --> 00:12:52,800 Though having described it as ugly, I don't suppose anyone's 184 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:54,640 going to invite me particularly soon. 185 00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:56,640 But anyway, the key thing. Is that he he's. 186 00:12:57,520 --> 00:13:00,720 In the most fashionable part of London, this is where a lot of 187 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:04,080 the plantation owners live so he can go and chat with them. 188 00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:10,680 But then in 1751 he moves to 22 Soho Square. 189 00:13:10,680 --> 00:13:14,120 So for those people who don't know London, Soho Square is to 190 00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:18,880 the east of where we're talking about and it's just to the South 191 00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:22,760 of Oxford Street. And even today it has a rather 192 00:13:22,760 --> 00:13:24,600 mixed feel about it. Do you agree, Hazel? 193 00:13:24,680 --> 00:13:28,400 Do you agree with that? Yeah, it's got a, a story of its 194 00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:30,560 own, doesn't it? It's from different eras, but it 195 00:13:30,560 --> 00:13:34,440 would have been a, a, a good address to reach into 196 00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:37,520 Westminster though, if you think about it. 197 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:39,480 This. Move to the East is is somewhat 198 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:44,240 significant because although Soho Square was grand, it wasn't 199 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:49,880 nearly as grand at this stage as a square was, and we can see a 200 00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:54,360 process by the more easterly of the squares which had developed 201 00:13:54,360 --> 00:13:58,600 first go downhill as the aristocratic people who had 202 00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:02,000 patronized them and really got them going, then progressed 203 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:05,560 further out to the West. Hence the development of square 204 00:14:05,560 --> 00:14:08,880 to the West and. Just a just A2 column from say 205 00:14:08,920 --> 00:14:14,760 who lived in Grosvenor Square as well compared to Soho Square in 206 00:14:14,760 --> 00:14:19,480 the 1760s. If you think of the biggest 207 00:14:19,480 --> 00:14:23,960 names that you could. So the Duke of Portland, who 208 00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:27,560 later became PM Lord Harcourt, who was a diplomat and 209 00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:31,520 politician and several members of the perigee Irish, Scottish 210 00:14:31,520 --> 00:14:35,640 and also English titles as well. They're all in Grosvenor Square 211 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:37,560 at this time. And it would have been a 212 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:39,560 uniform. There would have been 5 Bay 213 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:43,960 brick houses, absolutely gorgeous, top notch 214 00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:47,880 architecture, none of which exists anymore. 215 00:14:48,760 --> 00:14:51,360 And these town bit townhouses would have had the basements, 216 00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:53,200 the three or four storeys above ground. 217 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:57,080 They weren't very high, very grand staircases, drawing rooms 218 00:14:57,080 --> 00:14:59,280 on the piano. Nobiley, which is a 1st floor. 219 00:14:59,280 --> 00:15:01,960 If you're in America, that's the second floor and then the 220 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:06,440 bedrooms above that. Real restrained Georgian 221 00:15:06,440 --> 00:15:08,600 classicism. So that was what Grosvenor 222 00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:11,400 Square was. It was synonymous with wealth 223 00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:14,480 and refinement and elite society. 224 00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:20,800 However, with Soho Square, this is at the same time associated 225 00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:24,960 with medical man publishers, tradespeople and even 226 00:15:25,760 --> 00:15:28,360 institutions. William Chambers, the architect, 227 00:15:28,360 --> 00:15:32,760 he was around at that time, also Doctor William Hunter. 228 00:15:32,760 --> 00:15:38,800 We've done an episode on him. He was at #28 and also I can 229 00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:42,360 never pronounce his name. Isaac Sakura, the physician for 230 00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:46,200 the Portuguese embassy. He he lived on the square at the 231 00:15:46,200 --> 00:15:49,360 same time, as well as opera singers, French engravers, 232 00:15:49,920 --> 00:15:54,920 publishers, bookbinders, useful people, I suppose, that do 233 00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:59,800 things they were in in Soho Square rather than titled 234 00:15:59,800 --> 00:16:03,560 genteel folk and. Perhaps it might be worth adding 235 00:16:03,560 --> 00:16:06,640 in parentheses now that Grosvenor Square is a huge 236 00:16:06,680 --> 00:16:07,880 disappointment. Just now. 237 00:16:07,880 --> 00:16:10,880 I mean it's whereas. Soho Square is interesting to 238 00:16:10,880 --> 00:16:13,280 be. Similarly with with with Brook 239 00:16:13,280 --> 00:16:14,640 Street. As I was saying, although the 240 00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:18,520 the original is there, it's interesting to to walk along 241 00:16:19,560 --> 00:16:22,240 Upper Brook. Yeah, it's interesting to walk 242 00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:24,760 along and let your imagination run with it. 243 00:16:24,840 --> 00:16:27,440 I. Had a little look at prices of 244 00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:31,000 Upper Brook Street and did you know that number 12 was sold in 245 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:33,040 2003? No do. 246 00:16:35,680 --> 00:16:37,360 You want to know how much for? Well. 247 00:16:38,040 --> 00:16:41,640 I guess that gives some light, some idea of the kind of wealth 248 00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:46,080 that somebody like Beckford had Where? 249 00:16:46,080 --> 00:16:49,240 He moves to in Soho square #22 is no longer. 250 00:16:49,240 --> 00:16:50,760 There. There's a rather strange modern 251 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:54,600 building there, but what's quite nice about Soho Square is that 252 00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:57,400 part of it. Is genuinely 18th century if 253 00:16:57,400 --> 00:17:02,280 only a small. Part of it and #1 number one 254 00:17:02,280 --> 00:17:09,319 Greek St. which is the House of Saint Barnabas, is still 255 00:17:09,319 --> 00:17:10,760 standing. And although it's number one 256 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:14,359 Greek St. it's actually on the South side of Soho Square. 257 00:17:14,359 --> 00:17:17,640 So Greek St. runs to the South, directly to the South leading 258 00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:19,720 out of leading out of the square. 259 00:17:20,319 --> 00:17:26,520 And this is a really grand house to stand outside. 260 00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:29,960 And I remember you saying, Hazel, that you've actually been 261 00:17:29,960 --> 00:17:33,160 inside. I never have, but it sounds a 262 00:17:33,160 --> 00:17:38,280 really interesting building and the importance for us is that it 263 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:43,520 was leased and remodeled done up for our Beckford's younger 264 00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:48,360 brother. This is Richard Beckford and he 265 00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:54,160 My understanding is that the finest 18th century interiors in 266 00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:59,000 Soho are within that building. But it's also very interesting 267 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:03,560 for it's later history. So it becomes the headquarters 268 00:18:03,640 --> 00:18:06,600 of the Metropolitan Board of Works in the 19th century. 269 00:18:06,840 --> 00:18:09,800 And this is Basil Jets headquarters, the man who 270 00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:12,480 rebuilt sewers. And then it gets its modern name 271 00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:17,760 because since 1862, until a couple of years ago, it was the 272 00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:21,800 home of the Saint Barnabas Charity, which was a club and a 273 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:24,320 charity and which worked with London's homeless. 274 00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:27,720 So a very diverse and interesting history. 275 00:18:28,360 --> 00:18:31,440 But as I say, Hazel, can you say anything about visiting it and 276 00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:34,320 seeing, did you see 18th century interiors when you were in 277 00:18:34,320 --> 00:18:37,920 there? I don't remember seeing very 278 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:41,880 much of the interiors. It was, it was the membership 279 00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:44,200 club was for those who worked in media, in the arts. 280 00:18:44,200 --> 00:18:48,960 So there were a lot of modern art, sculptures and pieces of 281 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:51,640 art on the wall, which, you know, and my particular favorite 282 00:18:51,640 --> 00:18:54,280 of mine. So I was a bit dazzled by all of 283 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:57,600 that. I do remember some plaster work 284 00:18:57,960 --> 00:19:01,120 on the ceiling and of course that you've got the very nice 285 00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:04,160 Georgian windows on the on the ground floor. 286 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:06,800 But now I don't remember very much of that. 287 00:19:06,800 --> 00:19:09,400 But that might have been we just didn't have access to those 288 00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:11,320 rooms or I just. That. 289 00:19:11,320 --> 00:19:14,360 Wasn't just something that I remember at the time focusing 290 00:19:14,360 --> 00:19:15,960 on. So then the opportunity arises. 291 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:17,880 I mean, at the moment it's closed. 292 00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:23,320 London's changing all the time, as any modern city does. 293 00:19:23,320 --> 00:19:25,880 So keep an eye on it. And it's worth reminding the 294 00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:28,440 listeners that the transcript is also on a website. 295 00:19:28,440 --> 00:19:32,880 But also we add in photos. So of these buildings that we're 296 00:19:32,880 --> 00:19:35,880 talking about, there'll be photos on the show notes for you 297 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:37,360 to have a little look at as well. 298 00:19:37,360 --> 00:19:39,880 And London guardedwalks.co.uk, yes, so. 299 00:19:39,880 --> 00:19:43,600 Standing outside this house, looking at it from Soho Square, 300 00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:46,200 it really is, is, is grand and beautiful. 301 00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:49,000 So I've never been inside, but it really is interesting from 302 00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:54,440 the from the outside and I think it gives some idea of the the 303 00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:56,360 the the kind. Of luxury that these these 304 00:19:56,440 --> 00:19:59,240 people were were used to living in. 305 00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:05,560 He moves to the East, which is kind of going in the against the 306 00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:08,760 flow of the fashionable and the extremely wealthy going the 307 00:20:08,760 --> 00:20:11,480 other way. But you're saying it's still 308 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:14,040 respectable. And the reason for going there 309 00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:16,640 is that it's a lot easier for him to get into the city from 310 00:20:16,640 --> 00:20:20,520 the city is his other kind of place where he operates. 311 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:24,480 And in the city is where a lot of the. 312 00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:26,920 Merchants are so it's important for him to to. 313 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:31,360 Have contact with them. And he has He opens an office. 314 00:20:32,280 --> 00:20:33,880 In. Nicholas Lane. 315 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:40,120 Nicholas Lane is now bland modern office blocks, but also 316 00:20:40,120 --> 00:20:45,200 he was along with the other a lot of other so-called W India 317 00:20:45,200 --> 00:20:51,000 men, somebody who frequented the Jamaica Coffee House and the 318 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:53,440 Jamaica Coffee House was just off Cornhill. 319 00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:56,200 And this is a very important historical site. 320 00:20:57,120 --> 00:21:01,280 It's now occupied by the Jamaica Wine Bar, which I should 321 00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:06,000 emphasize has nothing to do with the earlier coffee house bar 322 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:08,800 sharing the same name. So the the wine bar is built in 323 00:21:08,800 --> 00:21:11,320 the 1860s, but it's built on the the coffee house. 324 00:21:11,560 --> 00:21:14,480 And the coffee house is important because it was the 325 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:17,160 place where the West Indian merchantmen met. 326 00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:20,280 So these are very, very wealthy merchants. 327 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:25,600 And it's important in the context of London's burgeoning 328 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:30,280 financial markets because these are one small section of the 329 00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:33,480 mercantile elite who play a very important part in the 330 00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:37,080 development of London's markets. And it's also historically 331 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:41,240 important because in 1652, this is the first place where coffee 332 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:45,960 is sold as a beverage in London, definitely probably the first 333 00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:50,880 place in England as well. So, and it's in these little 334 00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:55,080 narrow alleyways which quite evocative I think. 335 00:21:55,080 --> 00:21:58,160 And it's reasonably easy to imagine yourself back in the 336 00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:01,600 18th century when you're walking around them. 337 00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:06,480 This is the kind of London media in which he operated. 338 00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:11,240 For me, it's interesting to walk around these places and have a 339 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:13,680 look where where Beckford would have walked. 340 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:17,680 Do you even know where we get Nicholas Lane name from? 341 00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:18,480 No. Go on. 342 00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:20,280 Well, it. Was originally Saint Nicholas 343 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:25,160 Lane which might give a little clue, and this is a street 344 00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:29,200 running North and South from Lombard St. to Candle Wick St. 345 00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:32,320 and it comes from the medieval Saint Nicholas Akon church. 346 00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:38,160 So earliest recordings is 1084. However that church got 347 00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:41,960 destroyed in the Great Flower of London in 1666 and it was never 348 00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:46,320 rebuilt. So even when Beckford is walking 349 00:22:46,320 --> 00:22:51,760 around, that church has been gone for 100 years and we still 350 00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:56,560 have the name now. We've spoken a bit about his 351 00:22:56,560 --> 00:23:03,360 property in in London and the the estates more than the London 352 00:23:03,360 --> 00:23:08,400 house are about assimilating with the English landed classes. 353 00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:12,920 And he invites well to do people to visit him in Fontail. 354 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:15,880 And obviously being very, very rich, they're quite keen to go 355 00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:18,880 because you're going to get really splendid entertainment if 356 00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:23,040 you if you go there. The other thing that he is using 357 00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:30,880 his money for is to buy his way into politics and he first of 358 00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:35,160 all gains a seat as a Member of Parliament in Shaftesbury in 359 00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:38,400 1747. And his younger brothers, 360 00:23:38,760 --> 00:23:41,320 Richard, who we've already mentioned becomes MP for 361 00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:43,600 Bristol. And I'm never quite sure how you 362 00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:49,200 pronounce his brother's name. Juline's possibly becomes MP for 363 00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:52,600 Salisbury, but what's significant is that Beckford 364 00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:56,280 then shifts his political attention towards the City of 365 00:23:56,280 --> 00:24:01,560 London and in the 1754 election he's elected as an MP for the 366 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:03,880 City. And he repeats this feat in the 367 00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:09,040 remaining elections in his life, which say 1761 and 1768. 368 00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:13,280 Now, the City is important because it's full of merchants 369 00:24:13,360 --> 00:24:17,760 like him, but it's also important because it is one of 370 00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:21,320 the most open constituencies in England. 371 00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:26,400 So there are estimated to be around 6000 voters in the City 372 00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:29,240 of London. The other old thing about the 373 00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:32,280 City of London is that it returns four members of 374 00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:37,840 Parliament and the electorate of 6000 is only really surpassed by 375 00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:43,080 Westminster where there are 9000 voters. 376 00:24:43,360 --> 00:24:46,680 So Westminster, it's no coincidence that's the place 377 00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:52,280 where Wilkes the the, the the radical wins the elections and 378 00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:55,280 then then is denied his seat, but nevertheless standing for 379 00:24:55,280 --> 00:25:01,840 the city. It's about winning over a lot of 380 00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:05,280 men who would be seen as relatively independent. 381 00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:09,080 This is a seat in which the traditional ties. 382 00:25:09,120 --> 00:25:12,600 Of. Aristocratic patronage are a lot 383 00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:17,200 weaker, and this is important. And when we're talking about 384 00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:20,480 aristocratic patronage in the 18th century, it might be worth 385 00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:26,080 mentioning that the only other seat that returns four members 386 00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:31,480 of Parliament is none other than Weymouth come Malcolm Regis. 387 00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:36,160 And that reflects it rather dramatically, the fact that the 388 00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:39,720 representation of the House of Commons is very much based on 389 00:25:39,840 --> 00:25:42,680 how it was established in the Middle Ages, and the places that 390 00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:47,360 were wealthy and important in the Middle Ages still have 391 00:25:47,360 --> 00:25:50,160 outsize influence in the 18th century. 392 00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:52,240 But. This business about winning the 393 00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:57,560 polls in the in the cities is important for Beckford and there 394 00:25:57,560 --> 00:25:59,960 are four MPs. He comes fourth in 1754 but 395 00:25:59,960 --> 00:26:02,040 that's fine. And then he comes third in the 396 00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:09,120 next two elections and he is also pursues a political career 397 00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:12,640 within the city itself. So he becomes an Alderman in 398 00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:17,280 1752 for Billingsgate. London is divided into the City 399 00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:21,600 of London is divided into wards, and each of the ward returns a 400 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:26,120 varying number of councillors, common Councilman, depending on 401 00:26:26,120 --> 00:26:28,920 the population there, but. Each of the wards returns. 402 00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:30,800 One Alderman. So the Alderman is kind of like 403 00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:33,080 the most senior post within a ward. 404 00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:36,280 In 1755, he becomes a sheriff of London. 405 00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:39,920 This is largely A ceremonial role by this stage, but it is a 406 00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:43,080 crucial stepping stone because once you have become sheriff, 407 00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:45,600 you are then eligible to become Lord Mayor. 408 00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:50,080 And Beckford serves as Lord Mayor twice, once in 1762 and 409 00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:53,080 once in 1769. And it's this latter time of 410 00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:55,760 serving as Lord Mayor that's going to lead to his kind of 411 00:26:56,080 --> 00:27:01,280 apotheosis as a champion of. English Liberties. 412 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:04,360 He. Mentioned that Beckford was Lord 413 00:27:04,360 --> 00:27:08,920 Mayor of London twice. First term 1762 to 63, second 414 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:16,600 term 1769 to 1770. But it is in 1770 that he makes 415 00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:20,160 a famous speech. Yeah, well part of the reason 416 00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:22,600 the speech is famous is is that he shouldn't have made it in the 417 00:27:22,600 --> 00:27:24,360 first place. So what happens? 418 00:27:24,360 --> 00:27:28,160 Is he as Lord Mayor? He presents 2 addresses to 419 00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:32,200 George the Third, and the first of these is in March. 420 00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:36,920 And in this address he calls for dissolution of Parliament and 421 00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:42,480 the removal of ministers. And this is kind of fairly 422 00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:45,000 sailing, although, although it sounds to us very innocuous, 423 00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:47,920 this is kind of sailing fairly close to the wind. 424 00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:50,960 It's fairly controversial because he's using the language 425 00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:56,560 of 17th century parliamentary grievances against the King, 426 00:27:56,560 --> 00:28:02,000 against George the Third. And he is basically comparing 427 00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:10,000 George the third to the Stuarts. And the king believes that the 428 00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:12,880 address is extremely disrespectful. 429 00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:16,480 And then political news is ratcheted up a little bit 430 00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:19,480 because in April there is news of the Boston Massacre. 431 00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:22,280 And we'll come onto a bit in the a little bit later, I'm sure the 432 00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:25,120 fact that one of the things that Beckford is. 433 00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:28,000 In. Opposition to the king about is 434 00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:30,160 the policy on the American colonies. 435 00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:36,800 He is a defender of the American colonies and doesn't want a kind 436 00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:40,360 of strict imperial policy imposed on them. 437 00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:44,120 And in May 1770, he makes another address to the king, and 438 00:28:44,120 --> 00:28:49,160 this address is described as a formal remonstrance of the 439 00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:52,600 liberal as Lord Mayor. So again, sort of very 17th 440 00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:55,960 century language. And again he calls the 441 00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,880 dissolution of parliament and the removal of evil ministers. 442 00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:00,920 And that really should have been it. 443 00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:05,360 The the king gives a very cool reception and that should have 444 00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:08,360 been at the end of it. But then Beckford, to the 445 00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:12,400 amazement of everybody present, answers the king. 446 00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:17,800 And his words became venerated by generations of radicals. 447 00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,920 And what he does is he assures the king of the loyalty of the 448 00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:25,040 city and declared that any minister who sought to drive a 449 00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:28,320 wedge between a wedge between the crown and the city was an 450 00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:32,600 enemy of the people. And then he refers to our happy 451 00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:36,120 constitution as it was established at the Glorious 452 00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:40,000 Revolution. So this is, you know, revolution 453 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:43,760 principles of 1688. And by implication that George 454 00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:48,400 is acting in some ways tyrannically because he is not 455 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:51,320 observing those principles. Now, George I. 456 00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:55,360 Mean the 1760s, they were a turbulent decade in in British 457 00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:58,960 politics anyway. So I mean, Beckford knew what he 458 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:03,120 was doing. Yes, he's being deliberately 459 00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:06,120 provocative. And George the Third, I mean, 460 00:30:06,120 --> 00:30:09,600 there've been some very sympathetic biographies recently 461 00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:12,720 of George the Third, but he strikes me as being sort of very 462 00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:17,120 well-intentioned, but a bit out of touch and possibly out of his 463 00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:19,760 depth a bit. George the Third. 464 00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:25,200 He is so angered by what Beckford has just said that he 465 00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:27,960 can't even find the words to utter reply. 466 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:34,280 And the opposition press immediately circulates for some 467 00:30:34,280 --> 00:30:38,320 accounts of Beckford's exchange. And he's encouraged to commit 468 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:40,640 his words to papers. So he's speaking extemporary 469 00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:44,800 before the king. But in two days, a text of what 470 00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:49,760 was this spontaneous speech appears in the press and the 471 00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:52,880 corporation that is the Council of the City of London, that they 472 00:30:52,880 --> 00:30:55,240 love all this because they're they're against tyranny. 473 00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:59,320 They rely heavily on the American colonies for trade. 474 00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:02,240 And they meet to vote thanks to the mayor. 475 00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:07,920 And then the following month, Beckford dies and he is 476 00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:12,560 immediately acclaimed by radical papers as a martyr to their 477 00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:15,080 cause. So medals are struck 478 00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:18,040 commemorating him. And already there's the sort of 479 00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:22,960 fairly brisk market in spoons and tankards celebrating him. 480 00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:26,840 And Common Council, which is the the Council of the City of 481 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:31,800 London, they vote for a statue of Beckford to be placed in 482 00:31:31,840 --> 00:31:36,280 Guildhall. And this is Julie, executed by 483 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:40,480 John Francis Moore, who has already done a statue of 484 00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:42,880 Beckford. And the one he makes for 485 00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:47,080 Guildhall shows Beckford, and he's standing and he's 486 00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:52,040 surrounded by two figures. One of these female figures 487 00:31:52,040 --> 00:31:55,520 represents the City of London. She's in mourning. 488 00:31:56,040 --> 00:32:00,240 She's got her Mace, her sword of state and her cap of maintenance 489 00:32:00,240 --> 00:32:02,240 on her head. These are all symbols of the 490 00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:06,120 City of London. And on the other side is a 491 00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:10,120 figure representing trade and navigation, who is in this 492 00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:14,120 drooping posture with a cornucopia representing the 493 00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:18,760 benefits of trade, and with a compass and an anchor. 494 00:32:19,200 --> 00:32:24,240 And in the on the in the middle of the pedestal, there is 495 00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:28,440 engraved the the speech that Beckford had made. 496 00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:35,480 So here we have this funerary monument to this champion of 497 00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:38,880 English liberty standing in Guildhall. 498 00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:43,480 And of course he was the largest slave owner of the time. 499 00:32:44,120 --> 00:32:53,040 And what I think is very interesting is using this statue 500 00:32:53,040 --> 00:32:58,280 as a kind of example of the way contemporaries regarded slavery. 501 00:32:58,280 --> 00:33:03,680 And we earlier on did a, a podcast on slave London and, and 502 00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:05,880 the slave trade. And one of the themes of that 503 00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:10,000 was how there's this sort of big move in the 18th, late 18th 504 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:12,920 century when the anti slavery movement gets going. 505 00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:16,440 But before then, people aren't really exercised by slavery. 506 00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:18,040 They're not really bothered by it. 507 00:33:18,040 --> 00:33:20,360 And it's kind of like a quiet assumption. 508 00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:24,360 And the slave owners, like Beckford, don't need to, don't 509 00:33:24,360 --> 00:33:27,320 really feel the need to justify why they're earning slaves. 510 00:33:27,320 --> 00:33:30,480 They don't write about it, it's just property to them. 511 00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:34,680 And it's only when the anti slavery movement really gets 512 00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:38,160 going. That they come out of the 513 00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:41,480 woodwork and then start talking about property rights and why 514 00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:44,240 it's quite right that they should own slaves. 515 00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:47,880 And this, this sort of absence of commentary, I think fits in 516 00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:50,120 with Beckford's life. So he dies in 1770. 517 00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:53,960 This is when the anti slavery movement is just about to get 518 00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:57,480 going really. And it's two years after his 519 00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:01,920 death that in 1772 you have the famous Somerset case, which is a 520 00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:10,520 case which is taken as saying that slavery is antithetical to 521 00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:14,520 English common law. We're not quite sure what the, 522 00:34:14,719 --> 00:34:17,280 the ruling actually said. But the important thing is that 523 00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:22,679 people took it as meaning that. And that has two big important 524 00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:25,920 implications. The, the, the 1st is a practical 525 00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:29,120 one that you can't really have slaves in England. 526 00:34:29,159 --> 00:34:31,600 And the really important practical part of that is. 527 00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:35,040 That if you. Are an owner of slaves in 528 00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:38,360 England, or black servants as you might like to call them. 529 00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:42,880 You cannot legally threaten them with sending them back to the 530 00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:49,040 sugar colonies, which was a major sort of force of coercion, 531 00:34:49,199 --> 00:34:50,960 a major power that you had over them. 532 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:54,360 And people still did this on the after the case. 533 00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:57,840 You could not do it openly. It says that in English law, 534 00:34:58,200 --> 00:35:03,200 slavery is is is completely foreign to the rights of people 535 00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:07,000 under English common law. Well, why can you not then 536 00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:10,400 extend those rights to parts of the British Empire? 537 00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:16,240 So it becomes a kind of great rallying cry for the anti 538 00:35:16,240 --> 00:35:18,800 slavery cause. But this this happens after his 539 00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:22,080 death and he he's just before then and. 540 00:35:23,240 --> 00:35:26,120 There. Aren't many references, as I 541 00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:29,200 say, from Beckford about slavery. 542 00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:32,600 So occasionally he makes comments about people with dark 543 00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:38,200 skin being well able to bear the heat and therefore serve as 544 00:35:38,680 --> 00:35:44,080 soldiers in the Caribbean. Sort of fairly typical racist 545 00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:47,720 view of people of a different skin. 546 00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:52,720 We mentioned Fontil, he has black servants there and a 547 00:35:52,720 --> 00:35:56,520 couple of the servants are called Wilkes and Liberty. 548 00:35:56,800 --> 00:36:00,040 So this sounds very much like the kind of jokey names you 549 00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:05,560 might give to pet animals, which I think sort of expresses a lot 550 00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:08,520 of his his attitude. But another really interesting 551 00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:11,680 thing happens shortly before he dies, and that is that Granville 552 00:36:11,680 --> 00:36:16,000 Sharp, who is the the great campaigner who is behind a lot 553 00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:18,240 of the cases, including the Somerset case. 554 00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:24,600 And Granville Sharp had produced this great book arguing that 555 00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:29,840 slavery was not compatible with with English common law. 556 00:36:30,040 --> 00:36:34,120 And obviously he he wins to some extent this argument, the 557 00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:35,680 Somerset case. But prior to that, this has been 558 00:36:35,680 --> 00:36:38,320 a very contested point. And he's not a lawyer, but he he 559 00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:39,960 trains himself and he writes this book. 560 00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:43,520 And what he does is throughout he champions the causes of 561 00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:46,920 runaway slaves. And he sees an advert put for 562 00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:50,360 Beck put up by Beckford for one of his servants or slaves who's 563 00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:53,440 run away. And Granville Sharp writes to 564 00:36:53,440 --> 00:36:58,520 him, say, asking him to reconsider his attitude to 565 00:36:58,720 --> 00:37:01,000 slaves and. Also sends him a copy. 566 00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:05,040 Of his, his, his, his, his book. And all we get from Beckford is 567 00:37:05,040 --> 00:37:08,240 a brusque reply and the return of the manuscript. 568 00:37:08,240 --> 00:37:12,320 So I think that sort of sums up Beckford's attitude towards 569 00:37:12,320 --> 00:37:14,280 slavery. And then? 570 00:37:15,240 --> 00:37:18,640 We're thinking about Sharp and what he was doing, really not 571 00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:22,960 just the legal but also the moral arguments framing slavery 572 00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:26,800 as incompatible not only to British law but also to 573 00:37:26,800 --> 00:37:29,560 Christian ethics, He argues. There's a particular line. 574 00:37:29,560 --> 00:37:34,360 He says the enslaved of fellow subjects under the king and the 575 00:37:34,360 --> 00:37:37,240 law must protect them. What? 576 00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:40,920 Yes, I think there are a lot of things coming together at the 577 00:37:40,920 --> 00:37:44,200 end of the 18th century, which you just mentioned, which is the 578 00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:47,280 most important, which is evangelical Christianity. 579 00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:50,880 And it's the spread of evangelical Protestantism. 580 00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:53,600 And these people are absolutely up in arms. 581 00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:56,160 And in particular, they're they're worried about the 582 00:37:56,160 --> 00:37:59,200 spiritual conditions of people who are enslaved. 583 00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:02,080 But also you've got the Enlightenment in the background, 584 00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:05,160 the idea that the relationships between people should be based 585 00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:09,240 on reason, difficult to reconcile with this terrible 586 00:38:09,240 --> 00:38:12,440 system of slavery. You've got the increasing 587 00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:16,960 importance of polite society, and it the the. 588 00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:19,160 Spread of tea. Drinking, which is ironic in a 589 00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:22,760 way because they're with their tea they're they're, they're 590 00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:26,000 consuming sugar. But that again is quite awkward 591 00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:28,800 because if you've got this kind of genteel society and yet your 592 00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:32,320 sugar is made by these people living these, these, these 593 00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:35,440 absolutely appalling conditions. And one of the aspects of anti 594 00:38:35,440 --> 00:38:38,600 slavery is that they, they, they champion the cause of sugar that 595 00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:42,640 is not produced by slaves. And then finally also at the end 596 00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:46,360 of the 18th century, and this is kind of like the really radical 597 00:38:46,360 --> 00:38:50,080 and minority wing of it. You also have the growing idea 598 00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:58,200 of rights that men in men and women to some extent implicitly 599 00:38:58,200 --> 00:39:02,040 have rights just by being humans and that they should not be 600 00:39:02,040 --> 00:39:05,840 treated in degrading way. So all of these things come 601 00:39:05,840 --> 00:39:10,080 together. But Beckford is kind of on the 602 00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:14,720 hinge of that development. And he is able to live his life. 603 00:39:15,080 --> 00:39:20,560 And to our eyes, it's it's it's an immense irony that he is seen 604 00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:22,080 as a champion of English liberty. 605 00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:29,600 It wasn't totally an irony free zone for him because at the time 606 00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:32,840 when he becomes Lord Mayor, in 1769, when you become Lord 607 00:39:32,840 --> 00:39:35,560 Mayor, you throw a big dinner, it costs a huge amount of money. 608 00:39:35,680 --> 00:39:39,040 If you're Beckford, it costs a really big amount. 609 00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:45,400 And somebody wrote an anonymous little verse that circulated and 610 00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:50,280 circulated in large numbers and the verse went for Beckford. 611 00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:56,400 He was chosen mayor, a white of high renown to see a slave he 612 00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:58,960 could not bear unless it were his own. 613 00:39:59,920 --> 00:40:04,960 So some people at least were alive to the contradictions in 614 00:40:04,960 --> 00:40:08,240 appearing as this kind of great champion who has this funerary 615 00:40:08,240 --> 00:40:14,280 statue erected to him and yet was a big slave owner. 616 00:40:14,640 --> 00:40:18,560 And of course, that irony goes down to the present time, 617 00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:22,920 because. The City of London has been left 618 00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:25,560 with this rather awkward inheritance in Guild hall of 619 00:40:25,560 --> 00:40:27,800 this statue to this big slaveholder. 620 00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:31,440 Not not only his statue, but kind of heralding him as a a 621 00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:34,200 champion of English liberty. And a couple of years ago they 622 00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:37,360 had a debate about what to do with it and one of the council's 623 00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:40,440 wanted it removed. In the end, they decided to keep 624 00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:44,280 it in situ and to put a plaque up explaining. 625 00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:47,280 That he was. A slave owner. 626 00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:52,200 One is that unfortunately since COVID, Guildhall has no longer 627 00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:54,920 been open to the public, which is a big shame because it it's, 628 00:40:55,200 --> 00:40:59,480 it's a fascinating building. The other thing is people must 629 00:40:59,480 --> 00:41:02,080 make up their own minds on this. It was his statue that 630 00:41:02,080 --> 00:41:04,640 originally got me interested in Beckford because I was wondering 631 00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:08,080 around Guildhall and I actually saw this statue and I, I think 632 00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:11,680 it's sort of described by people in the know as being a, a fine 633 00:41:11,680 --> 00:41:14,760 piece of 18th century carving. But I don't think anybody would 634 00:41:14,760 --> 00:41:18,480 say it's a kind of work of art. It's just it's just one of these 635 00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:23,440 sort of funeral monuments to another 18th century grandy, 636 00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:26,280 but. You. 637 00:41:26,280 --> 00:41:29,960 Read it and I thought, hang on, didn't wasn't this guy the the 638 00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:32,000 big slave owner? And of course, it just makes the 639 00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:35,240 statue immensely interesting once you once you sort of 640 00:41:35,240 --> 00:41:38,880 realise that here is this man who's being celebrated as a 641 00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:43,040 champion of English liberty and yet he was the biggest slave 642 00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:48,280 owner of of the day. You think there's only thing in 643 00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:55,280 it about him dying in 1770 is that he he died before the big 644 00:41:55,280 --> 00:42:00,320 change where he could have said something that was not of the 645 00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:03,880 time, you know, not going with the flow of the abolition of 646 00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:06,120 slavery. And then he would have like 647 00:42:06,320 --> 00:42:08,280 inevitably kind of been cancelled. 648 00:42:08,280 --> 00:42:12,120 Do you think he died early enough to, to stop him putting 649 00:42:12,120 --> 00:42:13,280 his his foot in it? Yeah, I. 650 00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:19,280 Think that had he died 10 years later, the erection of a statue 651 00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:21,480 to him might well have been a lot more controversial. 652 00:42:22,440 --> 00:42:24,400 I mean, we're talking about people in the city who are 653 00:42:24,400 --> 00:42:28,480 fairly are there in commercial, but also the anti slavery 654 00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:32,800 movement certainly had its strong supporters in the City of 655 00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:36,720 London. A lot of the activity occurs in 656 00:42:36,720 --> 00:42:37,760 London. So yes, I think that's 657 00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:41,480 absolutely right that it was. I mean, it's astonishing that 658 00:42:41,480 --> 00:42:44,840 his reputation was what it was. But I think what you're saying 659 00:42:44,840 --> 00:42:47,760 is absolutely right. Had he died a bit later on, it 660 00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:50,560 probably wouldn't have happened. Anybody wanting to learn more 661 00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:56,760 about the transatlantic slave trade and London Episode 126 is 662 00:42:56,760 --> 00:43:00,200 when Ian and I discussed that. So have a little listen to that 663 00:43:00,200 --> 00:43:03,520 to try and, you know, build a bigger picture of what's what's 664 00:43:03,520 --> 00:43:07,880 going on here. So, Ian, you were talking about, 665 00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:14,880 you know, his immense wealth and how he had not so much of an 666 00:43:14,880 --> 00:43:19,320 interest into the, the welfare or even the human element of 667 00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:24,480 slave people. Is there anywhere else other 668 00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:29,080 than Guildhall, can we see anything of of Beckford and his 669 00:43:29,080 --> 00:43:31,440 legacy? Well, I. 670 00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:34,080 Mentioned earlier that the, the, the man who does the statue in 671 00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:37,760 Guildhall does another statue of him that's in one of the London 672 00:43:37,760 --> 00:43:41,480 guildhalls. And I think that this is the 673 00:43:41,480 --> 00:43:44,760 Ironmongers and Beckford was a member of the Ironmongers Guild. 674 00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:47,720 And I think that I've not been there myself, but I think that 675 00:43:47,720 --> 00:43:51,160 they, they put up an explanation again saying who he was. 676 00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:53,520 So that's part of his inheritance. 677 00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:55,920 Otherwise, I don't think there is a great deal. 678 00:43:55,920 --> 00:44:00,080 I mean, Fonthill was famously remodeled by his son and perhaps 679 00:44:00,160 --> 00:44:02,520 people will probably know the Beckford name from the son more 680 00:44:02,520 --> 00:44:06,600 than the father. The son was very famous as well, 681 00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:12,080 the romantic novelist, but also for rebuilding Fonthill in a neo 682 00:44:12,080 --> 00:44:18,200 Gothic style at immense expense with enormous towers, really, 683 00:44:18,200 --> 00:44:23,480 really tall, which was destroyed by wind eventually. 684 00:44:23,840 --> 00:44:30,240 And he's also very famous because he was homosexual and he 685 00:44:31,240 --> 00:44:36,640 I don't think that anybody he sort of championing gay rights 686 00:44:36,720 --> 00:44:40,080 ever mentions him because of the connection with slavery. 687 00:44:40,080 --> 00:44:44,200 But he was forced to live in exile and became marginalized 688 00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:48,640 when Fontil, he entertained people like Horatio Nelson and 689 00:44:48,640 --> 00:44:52,760 Lady Hamilton, who were similarly put aside because of 690 00:44:52,760 --> 00:44:55,440 the scandalous nature of of their relationship. 691 00:44:55,720 --> 00:44:58,440 But nothing survives, unfortunately, of the Font 692 00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:01,680 hills, the Palladium or, or, or or the Neo Gothic. 693 00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:05,880 So it's a question really, as we were saying earlier, of walking 694 00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:08,760 around these places in London and trying to use your 695 00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:12,600 historical imagination to recreate what it was like. 696 00:45:12,760 --> 00:45:17,200 One of the things that follows on from the enormous controversy 697 00:45:17,680 --> 00:45:25,160 over statues to slave owners and the controversy concerning 698 00:45:25,160 --> 00:45:30,520 monuments is that people are very reluctant to admit to 699 00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:35,800 slaving history, which in a way is a shame simply because the 700 00:45:35,800 --> 00:45:39,440 historical roots are so interesting. 701 00:45:39,440 --> 00:45:43,800 I think that it's, it's incumbent upon modern society in 702 00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:48,000 Britain to recognize the importance of the slave trade in 703 00:45:48,520 --> 00:45:52,280 early modern Britain, and we should be remembering the 704 00:45:52,280 --> 00:45:55,480 importance of the slave trade and the places associated with 705 00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:58,400 somebody like Beckford. Is it worth circling back to 706 00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:06,160 what you were mentioning about relationships with key Members 707 00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:10,440 of Parliament, including Wilkes? Yes. 708 00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:12,640 That's, I think, worth connecting it. 709 00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:18,120 So in episode 91, we do an episode about the radical MP 710 00:46:18,120 --> 00:46:22,440 John Wilkes. But they had an interesting 711 00:46:22,520 --> 00:46:24,120 relationship, didn't they? Yeah. 712 00:46:24,120 --> 00:46:26,640 Well, this is one of the interesting things about 713 00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:29,880 Beckford and reflects the fact that we've been talking about 714 00:46:29,880 --> 00:46:32,920 the very end of his career when he undergoes his apotheosis as 715 00:46:32,920 --> 00:46:34,320 this champion of English liberty. 716 00:46:34,400 --> 00:46:38,000 But also the fact that he stands as an MP for the city is that he 717 00:46:38,000 --> 00:46:42,120 is in of radical politics would be too strong a word for it. 718 00:46:42,120 --> 00:46:45,280 But he's he's on the sort of he's on the kind of spectrum 719 00:46:45,280 --> 00:46:47,920 towards radicalism. And one of the things that he 720 00:46:47,920 --> 00:46:51,800 does in Parliament is he stands up and he defends Wilkes. 721 00:46:52,240 --> 00:46:54,600 And we've, we've already mentioned the fact that he has 722 00:46:54,600 --> 00:46:58,960 two slaves on his estate, which he calls Wilkes and Liberty. 723 00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:03,280 Wilkes and Liberty being the rallying call of many radicals 724 00:47:03,280 --> 00:47:06,560 at this period. Yeah, and it's worth pointing 725 00:47:06,560 --> 00:47:11,520 out that Wilkes is imprisoned in 1768, so riots were broken out 726 00:47:11,520 --> 00:47:14,960 in London and they're called the The Wilkes and Liberty protests. 727 00:47:15,840 --> 00:47:21,480 Beckford publicly supports Wilkes's right to free speech 728 00:47:21,480 --> 00:47:26,480 and also to trial. And he also champions of various 729 00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:32,920 other causes which are certainly anti monarchical to some extent. 730 00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:38,600 So he is very much against aristocratic corruption which 731 00:47:38,600 --> 00:47:40,600 feeds into his championship of Wilt. 732 00:47:40,800 --> 00:47:45,760 Wilt wins the election to Westminster 3 or 4 times and is 733 00:47:45,760 --> 00:47:50,320 doesn't denied his seat. And this is what enrages a lot 734 00:47:50,320 --> 00:47:54,680 of people. And he, Beckford is very much 735 00:47:54,680 --> 00:47:57,240 against sort of aristocratic corruption. 736 00:47:57,600 --> 00:48:00,960 And there's a debate in the late 1760s on the civil list, which 737 00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:03,360 is the money granted to George the Third. 738 00:48:03,600 --> 00:48:07,160 And he stands up and makes a speech saying no, we, we need to 739 00:48:07,160 --> 00:48:09,440 have proper scrutiny of where this money is going. 740 00:48:09,560 --> 00:48:13,560 It's far too much money. And he's also. 741 00:48:13,880 --> 00:48:16,040 Key. Thing in his politics is that he 742 00:48:16,040 --> 00:48:24,840 is an ally of Pitt the Elder. So Pitt the Elder in the 1750s 743 00:48:24,840 --> 00:48:27,760 is advocating an imperial policy. 744 00:48:27,960 --> 00:48:30,560 This is important. This is something that the the 745 00:48:30,600 --> 00:48:33,720 the Beckford likes. But Pitt is somebody who is 746 00:48:33,720 --> 00:48:37,200 disliked by the King, and he comes to power and Beckford is a 747 00:48:37,200 --> 00:48:40,640 key ally of him. One other thing that Beckford 748 00:48:40,640 --> 00:48:43,320 champions ever already mentioned is the cause of the American 749 00:48:43,320 --> 00:48:46,680 colonies. Now this is largely, I suspect, 750 00:48:46,680 --> 00:48:53,160 because the people who own plantations in the Caribbean do 751 00:48:53,160 --> 00:48:57,520 not want to be treated like colonialists themselves. 752 00:48:57,520 --> 00:49:00,560 They, they do not want troops billeted on them. 753 00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:04,600 They, they want proper rights and they're frightened to some 754 00:49:04,600 --> 00:49:09,880 extent by the attempts of the British government to impose or 755 00:49:09,880 --> 00:49:12,920 reimpose greater control on on North America. 756 00:49:12,920 --> 00:49:18,680 So he is very much For these reasons a champion of liberty 757 00:49:18,680 --> 00:49:23,520 who might say in quote marks, but he also uses his politics to 758 00:49:23,520 --> 00:49:27,640 argue for policies which he is in favour of partly because of 759 00:49:27,640 --> 00:49:33,560 his plantation interests. So one of the things that Pitt 760 00:49:34,040 --> 00:49:39,280 considers doing is introducing a sugar tax to help pay for the 761 00:49:39,440 --> 00:49:42,760 the war against the French. And then he waters this down and 762 00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:45,200 it was made into a sort of general tax. 763 00:49:45,360 --> 00:49:49,400 And behind this can be seen the influence of of Beckford. 764 00:49:49,960 --> 00:49:53,280 But the key thing about Pitt is advocating a forward imperial 765 00:49:53,280 --> 00:49:56,080 policy of aggression. And this is something that 766 00:49:56,080 --> 00:50:00,880 Beckford supports. And I think as plantation 767 00:50:00,880 --> 00:50:04,240 owners, they're all worried about the French being able to 768 00:50:04,240 --> 00:50:07,280 sail into the the West Indies and simply take their their 769 00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:10,320 islands from them. But their attitude is a bit 770 00:50:10,320 --> 00:50:13,960 ambivalent because they don't really want the British taking 771 00:50:13,960 --> 00:50:16,960 over the French sugar colonies because that would mean more 772 00:50:17,040 --> 00:50:19,960 sugar coming onto the market. So it's a little bit double 773 00:50:19,960 --> 00:50:22,040 edged. Beckford achieves great power in 774 00:50:22,040 --> 00:50:25,440 the second Pitt administration, which is in 1768. 775 00:50:25,720 --> 00:50:31,320 Pitt returns to power, and he, perhaps rather hypocritically, 776 00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:33,720 accepts a place in the House of Lords. 777 00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:38,160 And accepting a place in the House of Lords means that he 778 00:50:38,160 --> 00:50:40,280 can't manage the House of Commons himself. 779 00:50:40,680 --> 00:50:45,920 And also Pity's always I'll, so he's not really politically 780 00:50:46,320 --> 00:50:50,400 active and he relies on left tenants to carry out the. 781 00:50:50,400 --> 00:50:53,040 Business in the Commons for him and one of these people is 782 00:50:53,040 --> 00:50:54,920 Beckford. But. 783 00:50:54,920 --> 00:50:57,680 During the really important. Time. 784 00:50:57,680 --> 00:51:02,400 Of Pitt in power, which is in the late 1750s and early 1760s, 785 00:51:02,400 --> 00:51:04,440 Beckford although he doesn't have that degree of influence, 786 00:51:04,440 --> 00:51:08,960 he's always writing letters to Pitt and this is the key period 787 00:51:08,960 --> 00:51:12,840 in which. Pitt champions a more aggressive 788 00:51:12,840 --> 00:51:15,360 war against the French, so the Seven Years War breaks out in 789 00:51:15,360 --> 00:51:18,040 1756. He begins badly. 790 00:51:18,520 --> 00:51:20,600 Pitt comes to power. He loses power. 791 00:51:20,600 --> 00:51:23,280 He then comes power again. The war continues on. 792 00:51:23,880 --> 00:51:28,320 In in a bad way for the British. But then in 1759, under Pitt's 793 00:51:28,320 --> 00:51:31,920 direction, the British win this great series of victories. 794 00:51:31,920 --> 00:51:34,600 So they drive the French out of Canada, they drive the French 795 00:51:34,600 --> 00:51:38,240 out of India, they destroy the French fleet and this is the 796 00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:41,600 Annis Mirabilis. And it's all done under Pitt and 797 00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:46,840 Beckford is there really supporting Pitt in this. 798 00:51:47,400 --> 00:51:53,520 And then the following period, Pitt loses power and. 2. 799 00:51:53,520 --> 00:51:57,280 Things happen. 1 is that the King's favorite boot comes to 800 00:51:57,280 --> 00:51:59,240 power. And a lot of people, including 801 00:51:59,240 --> 00:52:02,160 Beckford, hate this. And he hates it partly because 802 00:52:02,160 --> 00:52:05,600 it's aristocratic influence. It's the king, in his eyes, 803 00:52:06,640 --> 00:52:09,760 acting tyrannically in in appointing his his favorite, the 804 00:52:09,760 --> 00:52:13,080 man who'd been his chooser as his Prime Minister. 805 00:52:13,560 --> 00:52:16,480 But also in 1763, the British signed a peace with the French 806 00:52:16,520 --> 00:52:18,760 pit, who is out of power. Hates. 807 00:52:18,760 --> 00:52:21,680 This treaty as being too soft on the French and and Beckford 808 00:52:21,680 --> 00:52:25,920 joins in with him. So we can see Pitt. 809 00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:31,000 Using his influence as a member of power to forward the 810 00:52:31,200 --> 00:52:37,720 influence of the plantation owners in the West Indies, plus 811 00:52:37,720 --> 00:52:41,800 this kind of agenda of English liberty. 812 00:52:42,080 --> 00:52:45,680 And it's the pursuit of West Indian interests, as mentioned 813 00:52:45,680 --> 00:52:51,120 earlier, that incurs the contempt to some extent of 814 00:52:52,120 --> 00:52:54,560 critics of the time. That's the thing that really 815 00:52:54,560 --> 00:52:59,360 bothers them, not the fact that he is this massive owner of 816 00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:03,760 slaves in Jamaica. Now, if we're talking about 817 00:53:03,760 --> 00:53:09,320 friendships and linking John Wilkes, but also with, with with 818 00:53:09,320 --> 00:53:12,800 Beckford, but also with Horace Walpole as well. 819 00:53:13,240 --> 00:53:19,600 So Horace Walpole describes Backford as a vast, rich, tawdry 820 00:53:19,600 --> 00:53:23,440 man. And for Walt Poulter to say that 821 00:53:23,440 --> 00:53:25,360 Beckford's rich, you know, he really is. 822 00:53:25,680 --> 00:53:30,760 And what I love is in April 1770, so just weeks before 823 00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:35,600 Beckford's death of death, there he is, 22, Soho Square. 824 00:53:35,600 --> 00:53:41,440 And he famously hangs a huge banner across his house in Soho 825 00:53:41,440 --> 00:53:45,400 Square emblazoned with the word liberty. 826 00:53:45,600 --> 00:53:49,560 Yeah, a quick gesture of support for Wilkes, who has just been 827 00:53:49,560 --> 00:53:54,000 recently released. And it is Horace Walpole who 828 00:53:54,120 --> 00:53:58,480 sedonically notes that the banner stayed intact because the 829 00:53:58,480 --> 00:54:01,520 weather was bad and that no one went out. 830 00:54:01,520 --> 00:54:04,680 But the symbolism was, you know, unmistakable. 831 00:54:04,680 --> 00:54:07,840 Do like that. All of these pens, letters that 832 00:54:07,840 --> 00:54:09,800 Beckford's doing and all the money he has. 833 00:54:09,800 --> 00:54:13,920 And really, the only power that he feels that he has is to put 834 00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:16,440 this banner in front of his own house. 835 00:54:17,640 --> 00:54:20,040 Interesting that Walpole describes him as tawdry. 836 00:54:22,400 --> 00:54:25,720 When we're talking about Beckford, we're coming to the 837 00:54:25,720 --> 00:54:29,760 conclusion, really, that his story complicates our 838 00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:32,880 understanding of London. History is not simple. 839 00:54:32,880 --> 00:54:35,560 It's not black and white. There's multiple layers through 840 00:54:35,560 --> 00:54:45,000 multiple lenses, and it's hard to read their acceptance or 841 00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:48,680 knowledge of things. And even when we read a quote, 842 00:54:48,880 --> 00:54:52,240 we don't know exactly if that is their verbatim and also in the 843 00:54:52,240 --> 00:54:55,640 context in which they were spoken or written and who they 844 00:54:55,640 --> 00:55:00,080 were directed to. But I do think it highlights a 845 00:55:00,080 --> 00:55:04,960 really interesting story of how we can't just take down a statue 846 00:55:04,960 --> 00:55:07,320 and pretend that something didn't happen. 847 00:55:07,640 --> 00:55:08,720 Yeah. And. 848 00:55:10,000 --> 00:55:13,800 Just to reiterate, the, the key thing about the slave owners, 849 00:55:13,800 --> 00:55:16,520 including Beckford at this time is their relative silence on 850 00:55:16,520 --> 00:55:18,280 slavery. And it's a, it's a bit of an odd 851 00:55:18,280 --> 00:55:21,040 thing to talk about really, a sort of absence of, of 852 00:55:21,200 --> 00:55:23,880 discourse. But this is a big contrast to, 853 00:55:23,960 --> 00:55:28,800 for example, with the classical period, because the Romans wrote 854 00:55:29,280 --> 00:55:35,400 quite extensively on, on slavery and they would write treatises 855 00:55:35,440 --> 00:55:40,600 on, for example, how you should treat your slaves, IE how you 856 00:55:40,600 --> 00:55:45,400 should treat your slaves well. And the British in the earlier 857 00:55:45,400 --> 00:55:48,280 part of the 18th century are conspicuous for, for not doing 858 00:55:48,280 --> 00:55:51,240 this. And I guess though there, there 859 00:55:51,240 --> 00:55:52,840 are a couple of important things in play there. 860 00:55:53,040 --> 00:55:57,440 One of them is that Roman slavery lacks this later racial 861 00:55:57,440 --> 00:55:59,440 element, which is, is so crucial. 862 00:55:59,720 --> 00:56:05,240 And what you do see in Rome is occasional sympathy for slaves. 863 00:56:05,240 --> 00:56:11,680 So under the Emperor Nero tells us about a senator who is 864 00:56:11,680 --> 00:56:13,960 murdered by one of his household slaves. 865 00:56:14,160 --> 00:56:17,360 And under Roman law, if that happens, all of the household 866 00:56:17,360 --> 00:56:21,120 slaves are to be executed. And there is a huge 867 00:56:22,200 --> 00:56:26,040 demonstration in favour of the slaves so that there's rioting 868 00:56:26,040 --> 00:56:28,600 amongst the pleds. But also there's a debate in the 869 00:56:28,600 --> 00:56:30,320 Senate about the rights and wrongs of this. 870 00:56:30,320 --> 00:56:32,680 And a lot of the senators stand up and say, well, look, you 871 00:56:32,680 --> 00:56:35,760 can't do this. You're going to be murdering a 872 00:56:35,760 --> 00:56:39,320 lot of innocent people. And you could say, well, this 873 00:56:39,320 --> 00:56:42,520 Roman law is incredibly harsh that the Senate in the end 874 00:56:42,520 --> 00:56:46,000 decides that no, we need to keep this law because we we need to 875 00:56:46,000 --> 00:56:49,320 discourage slaves from murdering their their owners. 876 00:56:49,560 --> 00:56:52,760 But nevertheless, it it's hard to imagine that kind of massive. 877 00:56:52,760 --> 00:56:56,080 Degree of popular. Sympathy for slaves who are 878 00:56:56,080 --> 00:57:00,800 going to be executed in 18th century Britain and in addition 879 00:57:00,800 --> 00:57:03,280 to the racial element, I think the fact that it's it's a long 880 00:57:03,280 --> 00:57:07,520 way away that it's it's tucked into the Caribbean also is 881 00:57:07,520 --> 00:57:11,320 important. But there's also, it's a 882 00:57:11,320 --> 00:57:14,720 positive aspect to Roman culture here that there is this kind of 883 00:57:14,920 --> 00:57:22,400 classicizing civilized idea of how a man in particular should 884 00:57:22,400 --> 00:57:25,560 behave in a correct way. And then finally, we begin to 885 00:57:25,560 --> 00:57:30,760 see that coming into the late 18th century discourse in 886 00:57:30,760 --> 00:57:34,720 Britain. So as always, difficult to argue 887 00:57:34,720 --> 00:57:39,800 from an absence of evidence, but the the the the absence of slave 888 00:57:39,800 --> 00:57:46,960 owners justifying what they're doing in a way in itself speaks 889 00:57:46,960 --> 00:57:52,240 volumes. Well, that brings us to the end 890 00:57:52,240 --> 00:57:55,760 of today's journey into the extraordinary life and legacy of 891 00:57:55,760 --> 00:58:00,880 William Backford, a man of immense wealth, bold convictions 892 00:58:00,880 --> 00:58:06,000 and larger than life ambition. From the halls of Parliament to 893 00:58:06,000 --> 00:58:10,600 Soho Square, Beckford left a mark on 18th century London that 894 00:58:10,600 --> 00:58:14,560 still echoes in politics, architecture and the ongoing 895 00:58:14,560 --> 00:58:19,680 conversation about Liberty. Complex, controversial and 896 00:58:19,840 --> 00:58:24,240 undeniably influential, his story reminds us of how power, 897 00:58:24,360 --> 00:58:29,280 principles and public spectacle can collide in the making and 898 00:58:29,280 --> 00:58:33,320 rewriting of history. If you enjoyed this episode, 899 00:58:33,320 --> 00:58:36,360 don't forget to subscribe, leave us a review and share it with 900 00:58:36,360 --> 00:58:39,280 someone who loves and told stories from the past. 901 00:58:39,600 --> 00:58:41,920 As I mentioned. For sources, images, more 902 00:58:41,920 --> 00:58:45,280 context, links to the other episodes that I've mentioned, 903 00:58:45,280 --> 00:58:51,520 then check the show notes on londonguidedwalks.co.uk/podcast 904 00:58:52,640 --> 00:58:53,640 until next time.