Welcome to Between Three Witches, where we talk about
witchcraft in plain sight. Everyday magic lived honestly,
and it's hosted by three witches.
Me, GAIL, the witch next door. Me, the weedy green witch.
And me and on the anonymous witch.
We all walk different paths with different levels of experience,
but we share a deep respect for the craft as it is actually
practiced and not the dramatized version people expect.
Today's episode dives into a topic that people love to
mystify, misunderstand, or even gatekeep.
It's all things divination. What it is, what it isn't, and
how which is actually use it. Before we get into all that, how
have we been since the last series?
Can you believe this is the first time we're speaking?
I know we had our guests on last time, but how are we all?
What have we been up to? Yeah, the week's been really,
really good. Loads of stuff doing, loads of
personal projects going on. Crazy, crazy busy and a bit of a
mishap with some stinging nettles and some strawberries
that I'm highly allergic to. So all fun and games.
For goodness sake, did you know you were allergic to them or is
it a new thing you found out? No, I've been allergic for a
really long time. So you're now sticking your face
in strawberries and go no, I'm not allergic anymore?
What? Happened.
In theory, I shouldn't actually grow them.
They're my husband's all right. He keeps them away from me.
Attributing Blaine to the husband at this.
Point he likes his strawberries. They are a bit of a dodge moment
for me and at the moment they're in full flower.
And I didn't take into the poem aspect of it.
That's all I can really say. So yeah, exciting times,
exciting times, but we're all good.
And I'd like to say that, you know, grabbing the nettles from
the wrong, I should know better as a green witch.
I should know better than to grab a nettle the wrong way.
Can't you just blame your husband for that as well?
No, sadly, I didn't see it. It was hidden and I grabbed a
big handful of it and actually really cut my hand up on it.
It was, it was a doozy. And yeah, so that was that's
that's summed my week up. Actually, that's what I.
Spent I spent. You're really busy though, like
this time of year, not just with like normal everyday life but
planting, you know, I think people underestimate if you're
not into gardening it can take up a lot of time and you're like
I'd say semi professional at this point with the amount of
stuff you grow. Yes.
So I've kind of got it all pretty, pretty well paced
actually. But it is a busy time of year,
it is lots of things going out, lots of things being manoeuvred
around into cold frames just because of the frost and stuff.
And in the which area it's left more natural.
So I don't do sort of any cutting or anything within that
area. Certainly during May Obviously
you've heard of no MO May Hopefully it's good.
It's good for the insects and stuff.
So so but but it does need sort of containing to the point on
the edges, hence the nettle issue.
Because yes, I grow nettles and on purpose I do grow them on
purpose. It was in the wrong place.
Well. They're amazing and tea, aren't
they? So you know why was?
It yeah, they are. They are really, really good and
I had a fight with 1 so great. Well, I've had an amazing
weekend, as you will very well be aware of.
We went to the Festival of Pagan and Witches, which was
absolutely beautiful, magical, wonderful.
I'm still recovering because I went to as many workshops as I
could. And of course, it does drain you
a bit as well, doesn't it? You know?
And everybody I met was just so welcoming, so friendly, and I
just felt incredibly safe there. I felt held by everybody there
other than you go and see you over there.
That's the anonymous switch. Yeah, but because I kept getting
people coming up to me, which is incredible, right?
I had a fabulous time. And when you said you're still
recovering, I thought, is it because of all the wine?
But, but jokes aside, like for those of you that I've never
been to this festival, they put on workshops every hour from
10:00 in the morning till 10:00 at night, Saturday, Sunday and
Monday. So you can join as many or as
little as you like. But the educational value is
beyond. It's just incredible.
The speakers they have there, the activities, the location,
there's like this Woodlands where you can go and drum and
they do different talks. I mean, I can go on about this
all day. You know how much I love that
festival, which is why it was incredible to meet everybody.
But you're right, you feel so safe and so held and just I seen
a post today from Amanda Mack. She's an incredible witch that
helps organize it along with the Coven of Gaia.
But she was saying how much of A thump back into normality it is
when you come away from the festival and you stop being with
all like minded people and you suddenly realize you've got to
just go back to work and all the normal stuff.
And like how it can be relieved, sort of.
Yeah. A bit of a a bit of a whack
around the head, but yeah, it was a fabulous weekend, wasn't
it? And on.
And it was lovely to meet you. But I also want everybody to.
And I thought, well, this is safe space.
I can go. This is the anonymous witch.
Because these are all witches. Are they going to see you with
me? So if anybody sees me around,
you'll go, Is that the anonymous witch?
I'll go No, but I'll roll my eyes, so I'll go.
No, it isn't. That's not the anonymous witch.
You know I am. So gutted I couldn't make it
that I had other things going on.
I'm so gutted. But next year, we'll be good.
Yeah, next year for sure, we'll arrange it again because we did.
We met up as as a group of people who hadn't met before as
well, which was incredible. And it was a really good time.
It's just so much fun. I, yeah, it really fills my cup
up as well. Plan on.
I know exactly what you mean. You come away with so much
insight and new friendships and all sorts of stuff.
It's an incredible event. So now I just need to find
several other events throughout the year to make sure I continue
to fill my cup up in the same way.
So yeah, that's what I've been up to as well.
Went to the festival, met lots of people, felt like I was
famous for 5 minutes, you know, people, people running up to me
saying little quotes from the podcast going oh, let it go.
Like this guy just grabbed me and he did it running past.
And I said, oh, you've been listening to the podcast.
But a lot of people also came up.
And I know some people didn't want to because I was chatting
to people, but my goodness, if I'm chatting to people just come
up anyway. It's even better because then I
can show off and go yes, and they go, you Gayle the witch.
Like, yes, I love, I love all of the silliness.
No, but jokes aside, it's amazing to meet people and
because I'm just a person too. Well, as.
You say The thing is, you're human.
Aren't you? I'm just a person.
And everybody was saying, oh, you're just like you are on
socials. I'm like, well, I bloody well
hope so. I promise.
You know what I mean? Wouldn't it be disappointing
though, if I was suddenly not like as real as I am on socials?
I don't get to meet a lot of people off of social, social
media that I meet. But yeah, it'd be really
disappointing if you were something that you weren't,
because I guess you can all put on a facade, but hopefully I
don't do that. Not at all, although I would say
you're a lot shorter in real life.
Or or you're taller. I know you.
Said That was the first thing I said to you.
I didn't go hi. Oh my God, I can't believe I'm
like, you're really tall. You're taller than I thought
you'd pick. 12 year old child. She's seen me from far away and
was like, oh, there's a Hobbit over there.
Well, you're the same height as me, aren't you?
So. Are you 52?
I'm 5 two, yeah. I see.
I would have me thought you were
tall. I thought I was tall.
I thought Anon would have been short.
And I thought you would have been tall.
Yeah. Oh.
I'd love to have long legs and be really tall.
Now I'm really short. Well, I mean, even more so
because you're sat in a wheelchair and.
Then I'm sat down as well so it doesn't help.
No, you're ultra short. Yeah, it's.
On the plus side, I can wear killer heels.
Amazing. All night.
I can wear killer heels all night.
It's great. Oh my God.
Brilliant. OK, so shall we get into today's
topic then? Divination.
It isn't about predicting a future like a scripted movie.
It's about interpreting patterns, symbols, intuition and
energy to gain clarity. So what is divination then?
Because we all do it right? I know it's a big part of my
practice. I think it's not just that we
all do it. I think that actually humans
have been doing it for a really, really long time, like since the
year dot. And everybody likes to read
patterns, right? So let's take it right down to
basics. It's recognizing patterns, lots
of different ways of doing that. That's what that means to me.
I will do that in so many different ways, but you pick
what works for you. Lots of it is literally just
pattern reading and it's not necessarily so I as far as I'm
concerned it's not really as mystical as people try and make
out. Oh I I completely agree.
This is a subject that I try and walk people through in a myriad
of ways. Obviously I do tarot reading,
but when I do one to ones especially, I'm like, really,
it's the the basis of divination is your intuition.
And I did a video quite recently about pendulum dowsing and it it
went viral because I started the video.
We're going, your pendulum isn't magical.
You are because that's the fact. I think people think you've got
spirit coming in poking the hell out of you or flipping over the
cards or feeding in energy. And absolutely that is part of
our spiritual practice where we can call in those energies.
But that's not where the messaging is coming from.
It's coming from part of us. It's coming from part spirit as
well, obviously, but it isn't all spirit.
There is a a big element of like subconscious and intuition mixed
in with our spiritual divination as well.
But it's not just about spiritual or spirits connection.
What about you Anna? What do you think divination is?
Well, number one, I do agree with what you just said then
about the intuition. Because if I had say 6 tarot
cards in front of me and I had six different tarot readers each
and everyone would give me a different message because I
don't want to go to a reader where they tell me exactly what
that card means within the book itself.
I want them to tune into their intuition, what they seeing.
And I love that about divination, especially with
cards because you will get different readings.
Like what Victoria was saying, it stretches through many
cultures and it goes back thousands of years.
And I think some of the earliest methods were, you know, reading
weather patterns, you know, they win animal behaviour, celestial
movements. And I think deep down this shows
some form of need on a human level, that we need to find some
form of answer or to have some form of communication to the
other world and a desire to understand.
Yeah. Do you know what?
And I also think divination, for me reflects a lot on what we're
trying to move when we're actually stuck.
You know that stuck feeling and you can do divination yourself,
but what you're actually, well, if you're like me, OK, because
I'm human, I have a question and I'm stuck.
So what I'm actually going to do is I'm going to ask the same
question 100 different ways using different divination
patterns still remain stark. So what I actually do, because I
know I do this, is I'll ask somebody else to do that for me
and then I use their interpretation of it.
Yeah. And you're more like, well, if
it, if you're me, you're more likely to listen to somebody
else's interpretation than your own.
Because it can, it can muddy the waters, can't it?
Our own intuition. If we're too close to a
situation, we've got our human emotions involved as well.
Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. And I think, I think it's
important to know. I mean, don't get me wrong,
obviously I do use divination and I use it within my working
and I actually use divination before I'll do a work in to work
out what divination method I'm going to use so that there's
there's layered up for you. You doing divination to figure
out your divination to ask the divination what the divination
was. Yeah, yeah, because different
things need different things. I just.
Know diet. Yeah, I know I made fun of it,
but I know what you mean. It's like doing divination to
make sure you're taking the right path and what you're going
to do next. Absolutely.
And even just sort of am I asking the right questions?
So I quite often I'll use a pendulum to make sure that I'm
asking the right questions when I'm actually doing the
divination using a different method.
Does that actually make sense? No.
It does, it does, it does, it does.
But divination I, I guess for me is also it's not a decision
maker. And I'm again, I'm great at
telling people this, but let's be honest, how many times have
we all gone right? What the fuck do I do now?
I'm just going to pull a couple of tarot cards.
Although saying that I will pull for direction, but I won't take
it as verbatim. That's what I need to do, but it
will often clarify to me what I should have done in the 1st
place that I was ignoring. So you know, it is important to
note it isn't your decision making practice using
divination. You know it does.
It's not like fortune telling or fate define.
It's not. This isn't going to happen just
because the cards have said it and it doesn't replace the
decision making, but it can help with those decisions or help
bring out the things in us that make those decisions for sure.
Yeah, I like to call it unsticking the stuck.
Unsticking the stuck. I like coming out with all of
these little little words. Lately it's.
Still. Got janky?
Jinky, jinky, Everything's jinky.
Types of divination then I feel like this might be a keep all
cut moment. We should have.
We should have put that in because I guess for all three of
us, I know a little bit about the type of divination that we
all work with. We all know I do tarot readings
and I love my Oracle cards as well.
Do you guys work with tarot? Yes, yeah, I work with Tarot,
but to be honest here, I think I prefer Oracle.
I always like to kind of finalise some form of tarot
reading with an Oracle, just that kind of and to surmise the
reading, you know, the kind of. And it also helps me close the
reading as well as part of that closing aspect.
But yeah, I do. I've got too much, I got too
many cards, honestly. I've got about 100 in total.
Wow, why am I not knocking on your door?
I need readings. I need readings from people that
I I value and trust. Because, you know, not to go off
on too much of A tangent because we're talking about divination,
but social media doesn't do a great job of highlighting the
good and the bad readers. And especially on some apps
where you can just flick through, you see all types of
people with their tarot and Oracle cards given all types of
random readings. And I don't think it does an
awful lot of justice to people who have trained, practice, use,
working with their guides to divine messages as well.
It doesn't help. It doesn't help the cause to
give us a lot of. No, but I.
Think. I think as well, they're like,
I've been a victim of it and I use the word victim very loosely
is that I have gone to other readers and they've been awful.
You know, they, you, you can clearly see they don't know what
they're talking about. They're they're going down a
very muddy path. They're trying to ask me
questions to get an answer, to put into the cards.
Like they want someone to be very open with them.
I think some of those people need to be quite ashamed of
themselves actually, because this is a sacred practice.
And as you quite rightly said, people will take years, They
will take decades learning this craft and building up a
relationship if that's their pathway, with their spirit
guides, with their ancestors to help them in this process.
So shame on you, you charlatans. How dare you.
And Non has done me some readings.
Well, I was absolutely stuck and I couldn't see the wood for the
trees. There's another saying for you
this time. And Non did a reading for me and
it was perfect and it was absolutely spot on.
Exactly what I needed to do wasn't what I wanted to, what I
wanted to hear, but it was absolutely spot on.
Gave me a big To Do List, which is exactly what I needed to
happen. But with regard to readers who
maybe be charging for their readings, let me put it that
way. If I say to you, you are going
to see lots of red cars within the next three days, you
subconsciously are going to see lots of red cars on the road.
You are. Going to notice it.
Yeah, yeah. But but on a psychological
basis, the way your brain works, you're going to find those
patterns and then you're going to say it was a prediction.
I was going to see lots of red cards.
So you do have to be aware of those things can happen and
people will take advantage of the fact that psychologically
that happens. Yeah, they really do.
And I had a reading when I was out in Australia in January.
I got excited because I found a tarot reader, but he was so
obsessed with telling me that there's a man, there's a man
every card. Well, there's a man.
No, no, there isn't a man. Actually, no, no, there isn't a
man. And I went, oh, and then he
pulled over another card. Oh, it's a man.
I said, is it my son? Oh, yeah, it's your son.
OK, because I'm fed into it a little bit.
But I wasn't really looking for any answers about my son or
there was nothing prevalent that wasn't the reason that we were
doing. But anyway, I know what you
mean. I know what you mean.
You can say things and then find something to to add to it.
And it's not great. It doesn't do justice to tarot
or Oracle. And I like both.
And like you said, Annan, I like I do.
If I had to choose, I might choose Oracle cards just because
of the diversity and because they're so individual and the
witches that or the people, not all witches.
I'll rephrase that because not everybody's a witch who works
with Oracle cards. But when they're put together,
the energy that goes into them and the thought and the
descriptions and all of that, yeah, I really love it.
I. Really correct form of
divination then. My pendulum.
Is it? It is, but I use that for my
personal use. I won't.
I've never really used that in readings.
Maybe once or twice, very specifically.
Yeah, I'm a, I'm a big pendulum person, but I tend to use my
pendulum to qualify which questions and which definition
I'm going to use. So I'm a big fire scryer, an
Incan water person. I like the visual movement of
it, Yeah. So shall we talk about, I'm just
thinking, shall we talk about pendulums a little bit?
What they are, how they work? Yeah.
And we can talk about scrying as well, just in case people don't
know all of the, I mean, there's, there's a number of
ways, but pendulums. Do you work with a pendulum man
on? I do, but I don't think it likes
me that's. Like my divining rods that I've
never really. But do you know what that's I
love that because I keep so again, you know what bloody post
I did and everybody goes on my pendulum doesn't work for me or
it just keeps wobbling. And I'm like, even though I can
tell you how pendulums work and how to use them, not every
single divination type is for everyone.
Absolutely. We've got a love hate
relationship, let's put it that way.
So you throw your pendulum at the wall and then you wonder why
it hates you. Is that, is that the basis of
the relationship? Again, that might not be your
preferred divination method. And I've seen some of your
divination methods and we'll come on to that in a second.
But yeah, so you've got love, hate with your pendulum.
And Vicki, I think I don't use it necessarily to figure out
which way I'm going to do divination.
I will use it about spell work and I will use it to check
energies. So this is going to make you
twitch because I know you don't like crystals, but I will.
I won't just run out on a full moon or a moon phase to charge
my crystals. I will use my pendulum to check
the energy as to whether they need charging and I do that with
my cards too that. Makes a lot of sense.
Yeah, to do my cards and I sometimes use it before I've got
an intense set of tarot readings booked.
If I've got back to backs I will check with my pendulum which
cards to use for those readings. So do you do what I do and use
it more of a confirmation clarification tool?
Yes. Of what you're going to be
doing, yeah. That's but, and I'll caveat
this, so I've got, I've got them all hanging up here.
You can't see them. They're not usually on screen,
but they've all got different personalities.
Yes. So I've got like a beginner
friendly 1. So if I'm going online teaching
pendulums, I will use that. Then I've got one who's an
asshole. We don't have a love hate
relationship, but it's more brutal and I guess I picked that
up when I want a different answer than I'm going to get.
So I know, but I know because I've got that relationship with
it. So, so yeah, I, I've definitely
connected to my pendulums in quite a significant way.
They're really important that they are my preferred method.
Yeah. So I have one that would be more
of a confirmation tool for relationships or emotional
things, and I have one that is an absolute asshole.
It is so brutal and it will give you the answers that you really
don't want to hear. Yeah.
So you're saying you've got one? Yep.
You've got the asshole one and oh, I like you.
Yeah. You're going to be ready for the
asshole one. And I do.
You know what? Whereas I'll buy tarot cards and
Oracle cards like they're going out of fashion.
I have not brought a new pendulum for a very, very long
time. Oh wow.
Like that, I feel like they are such a sacred part of my
practice. So can I ask a question and you
can say no to the to you can say you can say no to answering it?
No. Great.
I won't ask you that again, but how do you connect with your
pendulums? How do you get that
relationship? Because I think this is
something that the listeners actually would probably really
like to hear because again, I think we do.
It's probably similar, but again, within our own practice,
a little bit different, you know?
So mine now live in my shed and they've got I'm not going to
turn the camera around because everything will fall.
But they are held up by there's a so it's really different.
So when when you first get a pendulum, if you want to start
the practice, I recommend keeping it on your person,
wearing it around your neck, keeping it under your pillow,
any actually divination. You could do that with your
tarot cards, anything, just because then you are attaching
your energy to that item. But mine now are charged up.
There's a very specific crystal necklace that I've got charging
them which lives there. I'll have to show it at some
point. Maybe I should do a video on
this. And then they hang up.
But they are on my skull wall, my my bones wall.
So they have guardians. So it's very much so.
If you ever look at my videos and you see where I keep all of
my skulls, I've got something hanging there and that's all my
pendulums there. OK, so I didn't know that you
did this. Guess where mine are?
Well, skulls. Yes.
Are they? Yes.
Oh, look at that. I know.
I keep mine with my skulls, yeah.
Me too. There was my like, I've
literally got a bone section and it's like, that's my yeah.
But Anonymous doesn't keep hers anywhere special, which is why
she's got a really terrible relationship with her pendulum.
I know. Well, I do.
I do keep them. It was my grandfather's old
bookcase, which I've redecorated, painted it and
sanded it down. And pretty much all my
divination tools are on this bookcase.
So I've got like a Ouija board. I've got my Taro and oracles.
My bones are actually on my altar and my ruins are on my
altar, but I don't know what it is like.
I've done all that. I've I've Right.
I'm pausing now because the bloody chain on the pendulum is
moving. But yeah.
You're kidding. I I got goosebumps.
I got chicken skin. I'm telling you now.
Well, because you're the anonymous, which we can't even
bloody see it. How brilliant is that?
This pendulum. Live Supernatural podcast here
we come. It is append.
This was my mother. She gave it to me and I did, you
know, clear it and charge it. But it's one for the chakras, so
it's got lots of different coloured crystals.
Oh beautiful. Well can you?
Can you do a video on it and on and post it to your socials?
What of me working with that? No, or just just of it.
Just say that when when we come to release this podcast, people
can go onto your socials and they can see it.
Because if it was me, I'd be like, I wonder what it looks
like. See, Anon likes to say that she
doesn't work with pend pendulums.
Yes, but I have seen pendulums working even when they're not
pendulums within her space. Oh yeah, the fan.
Literally. Literally.
You were talking to them, weren't they?
Both of us were asking it questions because I said to you,
you're not going to believe this, but look at this.
And you were like, wow. And it was such a weird thing.
It was such a weird thing because have I ever had a fan
pull work as a pendulum ever before?
But we both of us checked the clarification questions with it
and it was absolutely going. It was absolutely going.
But it wasn't just, oh, there's a bit of a breeze and I'm just
going to move. It was swinging like nobody's
business. So that wasn't coming through
anybody's. It wasn't coming through either
of us holding it at all. It was literally going for it.
It was, it was mad. It was mad.
So Annon, if you don't work with your pendulum as much, what is
your preferred method of divination?
Then what do you work with? Preferred 1.
I don't know the name of it because I think they've all got
specific names, but for me it's weather where the divination.
I adore watching the raindrops on the windows.
I love looking at how the the branches of the trees are
moving, looking at the imagery within the clouds on a really
stormy day, even, you know, even when the, the the sky is grey,
you can see movement, you can see shifts and patterns.
And I adore that and and even how the sunlight comes through
the clouds that I I've always done it and that's one of my to
go to ones. And it's a really good one to do
as well on the go. We are to hear the birds then
confirming that. Thank you, crows.
But yeah, it's, it's something that you can do on the go.
It's something that you're out in nature and if you've got a
question, you know, make it clear, make it concise and use
the environment around you, you know, use what's already there.
You don't have to go out and buy things.
Now I am a bit of a magpie. I've got loads, but there's
something so ancient and natural about working in nature with
divination. I was just going to say it's
such an ancient practice because, you know, there was no
tarot cards before the 1500s. There was definitely no bloody
Oracle cards. They're much more of a new
thing. Pendulums, I guess, maybe I
don't know the history around them, but you know, you can
swing anything on a on the end of something and have it connect
to your energy. But yeah, so you did say that
you've got runes as well. Do you work with runes at all?
Not much, not much. I, I honestly, I'm, I'm not the
person to ask about it. I've, I've been gifted them by a
couple of different people. I've got about three sets and
they call to me. I am intrigued by them but I
feel that I won't give them enough justice because I don't
know enough about them yet. I feel like I need to work with
them but I haven't researched them enough if that makes sense.
Like I love working with bones and charms and I feel the need
to work with rooms. They're always charging but I
don't feel like I know them enough yet.
Like I haven't built up that relationship yet with them.
Yeah, I've got some rooms and I found in a charity shop actually
a book rooms for beginners. They've just never, I've read
the book, I've gone through the rooms a couple of times.
I've thrown them because you cast rooms, don't you?
And there's different ways from what I know, you cast them and
then certain ones are turned over so you can, and then you
turn them, you take those away if they're facing down and then
you're left with the message basically after you cast them.
But I guess there's a number of ways that you can work with
rooms. But it's not something that's
ever really called to me either. You know, They are, they are a
divination method. Victoria, have you ever worked
with them? Yeah, so I was gifted some
around about you all time because I've always fancied
some, couldn't ever really get my head around them.
Then I was gifted some connected with them and I'm just stepping
into using them with with and alongside other divination
methods that I'm that I'm really good at.
That's not true to my own horn. I'm really used to doing those
divination methods and then I'll cast the rooms and see how they
sit with it so I can kind of work my way around it.
Does that make sense? No, it does.
But I think because rooms are so specifically knowledge based and
like Anna was saying before, you like a reading where there's a
lot of intuition into that reading of what that person is
saying. And you can't do that with a
room. You know what the meaning is,
you may know the question, so then you can tailor that rune
meaning to the answer, but it's not necessarily intuitive.
I mean, I may be upsetting people here, but there's less.
You can't look at the image of a rune.
It is what it is. It's that meaning and that
meaning alone. I think you can create a story
with runes. I've heard of people when
they're reading the runes, connect the pathways of the
ruins and how they fall and where they've fallen.
So you you can create a potential pathway with it or or
like a storyline. But again, I don't know enough
about it to feel like I'm the right person to discuss it, if
that. Yeah, so maybe then we need to
find a N Pagan, get them on the podcast, give them an interview
and ask specifically about rooms because you know, there will be,
I think really interested in it. Yeah, I think that would be a
really good idea because I'm only just dipping my toe into
runes and I'm finding the journey really interesting.
I'm enjoying it, I'm enjoying working with them, but I'm no
expert in it. Oh, there we go.
That's what we're going to do next.
Then we're going to find somebody to teach us all the
runes. And if they're a fit Viking,
even better for Anon. That's my mission.
OK, so scrying, scrying, you can do this in a number of ways,
right? We can describe with water
again, this is really ancient because you don't need tools.
I mean, a mirror is another way of scrying.
Smoke ancient, flames ancient. I use ink and I heard you
mention that before Victoria, I purchased this.
So this is magically charged ink, so it's got some magical
correspondences in there and then you dip into it.
But I love it. It's such a cool way to
divinate. Absolutely adore it.
Does it because it moves and it tells the stories it's moving
and you can see, you know, is it making a tentacle for an
octopus? Is it got flame things going on?
Is it moving in an emotional way?
I love love ink reading and I actually make my own inks for it
as well so. You didn't mention that to me
before, so I will. So I need some vent from you.
Some magical ink. Yeah, exactly.
Do you use scrying? I've got a feeling Anon.
You're probably an Obsidian scryer.
Yes. See, I'm acting like that.
I guess that like I'm so magic. But maybe you've shown me that
you had a. Yeah, but.
I didn't. I thought I guessed it.
Then obviously I already knew it secretly in my head.
I, I do love mirror work. It's really important to know
what you're doing with with mirror work though.
Knowing how to protect the mirror, to charge it, to lock
it, when to open it, and a specific mirror for scrying.
Not your kind of everyday mirror that you walk past every day or
something that your children would lock in either.
It's a very, very specific mirror, like every reflective
surface. And I know this sounds quite
over the top, but genuinely I have locked in this house and
that includes TV screens. But I adore it because it really
takes me to a meditative state when I'm scrying with an
Obsidian mirror or even with my normal specific handheld mirror.
And when you start, I think I did a video on this ages ago,
you, you do sometimes meet what people describe as the hag.
And it's not a very nice terminology, but essentially it,
the image that you see in the mirror is what would be classed
as an older woman, your typical image of what witches were
betrayed to be then, you know, hundreds of years ago.
And at first when when you see this, you, you are going to be
scared, you know, you are going to be a bit fearful of it.
But it's about getting past that.
It's about understanding the images that you see.
And now when I do certain scrying, I do meet her as a
friend, as a companion, as a guardian, and I do view her now
as the guardian for when I'm doing my scrying work.
Yeah, and it's really important and it's not about fear based,
but you're right, because when we're using these reflective
mirrors and scrying tools, we are using them as portals to
divinate with spirit. So it leaves them open.
So again, it isn't fear based, but it's a really good practice
to look around protection and locking mirrors.
You can do this symbolically with a key.
You can stand and use your intuition to lock, which is what
I do. I've got a key that locks
reflective mirrors in my home that I keep specifically for
that purpose. But you can do protective
symbols like a pentacle in each corner or something that you
know and use saliva as well as a really good one.
It's not about fear based, but if you're going to use these
tools to connect with Spirit, then you should be making sure
that it's protected as well, just like yourself when you're
working with Spirit too, right? Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah. Do you know what?
I think it brings up a really important point, doesn't it?
Because not every divination method is going to suit
everybody. So do I use mirrors?
Yes. Do I use them for divination?
No. I just, it is not something I
do. I have tried, didn't have the
best of experiences, didn't push through it for it was a definite
I'm not doing that. Keep them locked.
I do use mirrors. I use them in workings as and
when I need to, but I'm very, very careful with reflections
and portals and stuff as I'm doing that.
So for anybody who is newer or looking into this or a bit which
curious and you're looking into divination, no, whether it's
pendulums, whether it's mirrors, whether it's anything that
you're doing, if it doesn't sit with you, you don't need to push
through it. It's not I have to do this
because I want to do witchcraft. That's absolutely fine.
You're going to find your comfort with it.
I have a crystal ball. Sorry I took the I cover it and
it just fell. It just fell as I was taking the
cover off of it. But this isn't so I have it.
The way I would use this is I would put a candle behind it.
I'd lower my gaze and I love it because it feels super witchy,
but I don't work with it very often because it just doesn't
really connect with me. It's not part of my divination
toolbox, but it's still super cool and witchy.
But I give it a go and now I keep it and I'm smashing.
You ready? Yeah.
Oh, I'm sure mine's bigger than yours.
Oh, is it bigger? Oh, I don't know.
Mine's not on his stand at the moment.
I've just taken it off. Really love it.
I I love it. Do I use it much for divination?
No. I.
Don't understand. Yeah, same.
I don't use it much for divination either, but I will I
will on occasion. Back underneath its cover.
And that's the other thing as well.
If you've got crystal balls, cover them.
Nice soft black velvet cloth. So Anon, you did talk about bone
throwing and charm cast and see this.
This is something that definitely calls to me.
I have on my desk. I think I was just showing
YouTube before I come live. I've got lots of little bones so
I keep collecting with the view to create my own casting set,
but then I never have the bloody time.
I'd love to, I'd love to. I think one day I will, but it's
going to be a while off. So I I don't think I'd work with
charms per SE, but definitely a bone throwing set.
But have you got 1? Yeah, So the bones I've
collected over a while have all been like ethically sourced,
treated with care, respect, love.
I mean, even if I bought like a big, you know, piece of chicken
to cup for a Sunday dinner, I will find a little bit of bone
from that. And obviously you clean and then
you place them somewhere to charge.
And the charms I use, so I say charms.
I don't mean like little silver charms you would have on your
bracelet, but absolutely, you can use them.
But it can be things like shells I might find on the beach,
little pebbles, feathers, I've got little twigs, I've got a
leaf. And so essentially each bone to
me is uniquely different. Now to somebody else they might
all look the same. Every object, every bone has
been given a specific meaning and has a specific symbology
around it. So 1 might be to do with luck, 1
might be connected to money, finances, etcetera.
So the list goes on. And then you decipher if it's in
this direction facing north or if it's sideways on.
What does that mean to you? Does that represent a blockage?
Does that represent a yes and no?
What is the maybe, what would that look like if I cast it?
Where you cast it? The symbology that you place on
the the wooden surface or I use a slate like like a, what would
you call those like plate caster things you put your plate on.
I just put one of them in sleep and then you can say then you
can either direct it as a circle and anything outside of the
circle means something. Where it lands in the circle,
whether it's more towards you might represent the immediate.
Now further north in the circle might represent the feature to
the left and to the right of the main centre point might mean a
variety of different things. Essentially how you throw in
what meaning you put into it is uniquely yours.
Does that make sense? Yeah.
Yeah, it does. It does.
And and I like that because what you've done is broken down
something that, again, has got a lot of mysticism around it.
You see people throwing bones, but what does that mean?
And ultimately, that set is unique to the Divinator, to the
person using it. They've all got their energetic
imprints. That bone means this.
This bone means that how I throw and cast the bones means that
specifically for me. Yeah, it's interesting.
So I've been charm casting for a while and then I slowly moved
over to adding more bones into my set.
So now I'm sort of more bone throwing as such, but I still
charm cast. I still have charms.
Again, I'm not using this sort of the, once you get on
bracelets and stuff, they're little bits and bobs that I
found over the years that have spoken to me and they mean a
specific thing. And I think a lot of it is it, a
lot of it is about the movement without within, within where you
are. So you might have a movement
from a bone that comes round and down, but it suddenly gets
blocked off by another piece that means something.
And it's that flow through and you can really read it.
It's great. Yeah, it is.
I absolutely adore it. But at the rate I'm collecting
my bits, it's going to be, I'm going to be 75.
You've got, oh, girls bone throwing.
Do you remember when she talked about that 30 years ago?
And then, yeah. But that's.
Yeah, I will. I've, I've got lots of bits, but
I just need to take the time to really connect.
And you're right, you collect things and maybe that's that.
Maybe that's the path for me. Actually.
It's about collecting them over time and not trying to rush and
create a set that's just I'm going to write.
That means they're assessed means that it's more about what
it means because I've collected them at the time.
I picked up some, some bits when I was in Australia as well.
And I'm like, right, that will be part of my set.
And you know, six months has passed and, and we're, we're
still collecting and I can, I'm sure I will be forever.
OK. And on I did want to say to you,
you haven't mentioned it, but I know that you do palm reading.
I, I won't go into it in too much detail.
I've always been fascinated with it.
I've never actually had my palm read.
I didn't on the weekend because we may or may not have had too
much wine and it wasn't appropriate to get me palm out.
But is this something you've been doing for years?
Do you, how have you learnt it? I'd love to know more about it.
So yeah, there are methods that you can research, you can look
at. So basically with palmistry,
it's the hand in its entirety. You can look at the back of the
hand, the nail structures, the length of the fingers, where you
have puffiness on the hand, me looking mean, separate things,
how deep the lines are, how faint the lines are, are they
straight? Are they curved?
Do they fork at the end? Sorry to interrupt you.
So I always wondered because obviously as I'm aging, my hands
are getting wrinkler and the lines are becoming more
crinkled. So does does that mean, well I
guess it changes over time, but some of the the fated
information that you can get from Palmistry, does that also
change over time as well? Well, so they say if if you are
right-handed, they class that. So the hand that you write with
is your dominant hand, right? So they say that is quote UN
quote your future path, your left hand, then the one that you
is non dominant is your past, what you've already come from,
what you've come through. And if you look at each palm,
there is going to be differences there.
I'm now looking at my hands. I don't do palm reading.
I find this. Fascinating.
So do I, but can you tell me where do I need to look to see
if I'm going to be rich and famous?
You already are very famous. Well, we knew that we no, but it
is it's it's another fascinating subject.
I've mentioned this to Victoria before.
For me, a lot of the tools we use is a tool.
I already know a lot of the answers before I touch the
tarot, before I touch the pendulum.
And what I'm also doing by touching someone's hand is that
I'm reading your energy. Yeah.
So I'm, I'm one of these people that can hold a piece of
someone's jewellery. I can read the back of a picture
frame or a picture. So when I I'm not only looking
at the line structure and the mounds and the puffiness on the
hand and how the fingers lie, but I'm also picking up if, if
I'm able to, if I've had consent to, is to connect to any
ancestors as well and your spirit guide.
And I'm also reading and picking up on your energies.
And again, this is all consensual.
This is all, and it's not guaranteed every time either.
I think when people say that they're going to a medium or
psychic, it's like instantly you're going to be able to read.
For me, that's not always the case.
You know, sometimes there isn't always a message that needs to
be passed on right here, right now.
It might be that everything is OK and there's nothing but love
that I can give you right now, but essentially that's what I'm
doing. So not only am I actually
reading the lines and the mean end, but I'm picking up on your
energy and maybe potentially connecting to spirits.
Yeah. And that's really, that's a
really great message actually, because intuition shows up
differently for everybody as well, like every single witch
and every single person, even if you don't call yourself a witch,
it does show up in a different way.
And, and we have to remember that that also comes through
then as a reader too. The energy that I will read on
Vicky is different to what Anon will read on Vicky.
So we've all got our individual ways of working and and you've
honed in on a palm reading, which I really want to do now
I'm looking at my palms. I'm thinking like we meet.
We will, well, hopefully in the future we'll do a podcast all
face to face because we're going to go down and invade Vicky's
house, basically. That's great.
Totally looking forward to it, I know.
But we'd look like real podcasters as well, wouldn't we?
We'd sit like, I'd have to say. With a sack on my face.
We'll put a big. Cabbage leaf in front of you.
It'll be. Oh my God no.
We have to find the most funny mask there's, I forget his name
on. He's a huge, huge creator, but
he gets absolutely obsessed with wearing like Spider Man masks.
Have. You seen them?
The guy does the huge, oh, I can't remember his bloody name.
He's so funny. And he goes wow, wow.
And he's got this spider man. He said.
I'm just going to go to work like this.
So you're going to wear like we'll find, we'll find best
mask, Yeah. Cabbage leaf, though, isn't a
bad show. We could.
Just do little eye holes, you know, it'd be great.
So ethics in divination then? It goes without saying, consent
is a big one. It's a huge one.
And do you know what, it's a really, there is some grey areas
here because I do do personal readings and I'm guessing you
guys do them for friends and family.
And sometimes people do want to ask about other people.
And you have to kind of manoeuvre that in a really
structured way. Because yes, if you're asking
about something that's going to impact you from another person,
that's a really valid thing to do.
But if we're asking to read on someone else's behalf, that's
really questionable, right? It's tapping into somebody
else's energy without their consent.
And I would always veer away from that.
I mean, how are you guys aligned to that kind of viewpoint?
Because if you remember in the last podcast that we did, we
were talking about is there a line?
And Vicky went, no, there's no line.
And then we. Yeah, there are lines.
Oh, there we go. Oh, there's the line.
Oh, there are. There are ethical lines.
There are there. Are ethical lines and I think I
was more talking about with what regard to what work in you might
do. I don't have lines.
Do I have ethical lines and moral lines as well?
Yeah, very much so. So I am a person who naturally
will pick up on people. Everybody does OK, so before I
are going to preface this, everybody picks up on people's
body language, the way they're talking and all of this.
I happen to be particularly honed in on that.
I can end up with, if you like, readings for someone, a message
for someone, but they haven't asked for it.
That has to be put to the side because it's not my place to
necessarily say they haven't asked for it with regard to
let's should we, should we do the elephant in the room love
readings? Yeah, yeah, OK.
Love readings. I won't do them.
OK #1 the person. Yeah, I won't do love readings.
So when you say love readings, is this about my?
Does my crush love me? Right.
Is my husband? Is my husband cheating?
Right. Is my husband cheating?
Now? There's an ethics value on this
because you're reading somebody else's energy.
Number two, look, if you're asking the question, you
probably already know the answer.
You don't need me to tell you. Yeah.
OK, So the husband, you're not going to like it, and I'm going
to say it really, really gently. The husband cheating thing, if
your heckles are already up, there is something already wrong
within your dynamic, whether that's cheating or not.
I will say that you have to have a conversation and read how they
react to those questions that you're asking them because
everybody has body language tells, OK, because like I say to
you, Oh yes, well, read your own partner.
You already know what their patterns are.
If something is raising a Heckle, then you need to ask
yourself what is it? And ask somebody direct with
regard to crushes. I know it's really embarrassing
to go up to your crush, but you know what?
Go up and talk to them. You're going to find out if they
like you. It's, and I know it's so awful,
isn't it? But you think, oh, I want to
know, should I approach them and should I do this?
Look, somebody who really likes you is probably going to make it
known they're going to, you know, the old school way of
dating and looking across the pub and, and all this.
Bring it back. Yeah, it makes a lot of sense.
So I say so I'll, I'll, I'll jump in here because obviously I
do a lot of readings. Not all of them actually
surprisingly, are about love, but I have had quite a few.
I would say it's probably about 20% of my readings.
And the way that I approach it is very, very similar to the way
that you've just done it. So I'm happy to read the energy
of the cards. I always explain this is the
direction. This is the energy, Sorry that
we can give you. It can give you direction, but
it's not giving you the answer. And then I will also give my
human perspective and I will separate the 2.
So if we're talking about a cheating scenario or is somebody
not in love with me anymore and that kind of stuff, I go on a
personal level. I can read.
I know if you're asking me that question, why are you, why are
you questioning it in the first place?
What does that feel like that Then it becomes a bit more of a
coaching on your own intuition type conversation before we go
to the energy of what the cards are saying.
Because yes, I can say, oh, OK, this situation's we've got some
turmoil, some conflict. We've got the five of bloody
ones coming out. Absolutely there's some
challenge coming up. But you know that because you're
asking the question, you know there is because there's
something going wrong. So it's also, yeah, I think.
And that's, that's the way I like to approach readings.
And I make that evidently clear at the beginning that I'm also
not because sometimes people will come and ask for a reading
and they're expecting a loved one to come back from spirit.
So it's really, it's really key. Sorry, I've digressed slightly,
but it's also really key at the beginning of any reading to
explain exactly what the reading is for.
So you know, the ethics around making sure that people
understand what they're, they're there for.
If you've had a reading before, yes.
What's your expectation of the reading?
Well, I'm, I'm kind of seeing if my granddad's going to come
through, I'll go. Well, that's actually mediumship
and they go, oh, I want to know what's going to happen in the
future. Well, that's psychic ability.
What I do is read energy of cards.
I sometimes get intuitive messages from spirit, but it's
not part of the way that I operate.
But some people do. So again, if you are going down
that road of making sure the right reader is for you
ethically, then you need to make sure you're picking the right
person to do a reading as well. Because I wouldn't be it.
If you're looking to speak to your granddad, that's not who I
am. If you're looking for me to tell
you what's happening in the next three months, again, I can't do
that. I can only energetically have a
look where the cards are showing things could happen, but it's
not fated or determined by that anyway.
Just went on a bit of a ramp, but it but it is a very
important conversation to have because some people will just
read and they don't ask those type of questions at the start
of a reading and they're telling you all sorts of things that
maybe you didn't even want to know.
And I just want to say, and it's, it's to protect our
listeners as well. You know, there are people who
don't read but make a lot of money out of reading.
There are people who will tell you what you want to hear.
I'm not saying every reading should be what you don't want to
hear. It's just you need the ethics
conversation first. Yeah.
And that that does lead on actually to the point about fear
based readings. And I'm really interested to
know Vicky and Juan, because you 2 are particularly connected to
spiritual messaging. And if you're reading somebody
and something comes through or you get an inkling of something
that wouldn't be great to tell someone, you know, you know that
I'm going to get run over by a bus next week.
Why is that so funny? Please don't tell me you've seen
that. I mean, no, I'm not worried
about it. But again, it's like, but what
I'm saying is some people might, you know, ethically, where did
we land on that? Telling people that happened to
me be a base stuff but you but you were going to get run over
by a bus. No, no, no, I it happened to me
where genuinely where I was having a reading and I won't go
too much into it, but they basically said that I was going
to become like horrifically unwell, very, very unwell in the
new picture. Now, this isn't recent.
I will add, I was, you know, late 20s, early 30s, something
like that. And I'm telling you now, I left
that reading with so much anxiety, so much stress.
The one thing it did was make me evaluate how I was treating my
life is what I will say to that. Because as a reader myself, I
know that what we get in a reading like what GAIL was
mentioning, is a variety of pathways in the here and now
when we're reading energetically.
And what you do with that information is down to you and
again, dependent on the reader and what they can offer you.
And I decided to be incredibly health conscious.
I probably took it too far really on reflection looking
back, but I was incredibly scared for a long, long time
after that reading. And to be honest with you, I
think there might have been a better way for that person to
have explained something better in regards to just, you know,
maybe decide to be a little bit more healthy, you know, make
healthier choices. I don't know, something along
those lines. Verbalize it in a in a, in a
healthier way, but for months. And this person actually gave me
a timeline of when I was going to be like horrifically unwell.
And it was like counting the minutes down, you know, I was so
anxious and scared and worried. And I've never been back to that
person ever since. And I've actually heard quite a
lot of of fear mongering as well.
Needless to say, that illness never came to fruition, right?
No. But you're right.
But but if there is, if there is such a thing or you ever are
reading for somebody and you feel like there's a message that
should be shared, like you say, just say, oh, actually there
might be something coming up for you in the future.
Maybe you should have a look at you know, your knees might get a
little bit wobbly. Maybe you should look after that
area a little bit more. There's a way of delivering that
stuff if it feels like it's a message you need to share.
But fear based, fear based messaging is just such a fucking
red flag. That sounds horrendous.
I've never had that. I'd be, I'd be really.
Yeah. It's really disappointing that
readers still behave that way because there's no absolutes,
right? There's nothing that is actually
as as psychics, mediums, divinators.
There are no absolutes because we are still layered into a
human existence. And that is what fucks us all
up, unfortunately. But it does add that layer of
realism so when we are divinating, yet some of us are
better than others and shit hot at it, but there are no
absolutes. Yeah.
So the reason I laughed when you said about, you know, people
maybe dying in the future is that is actually one of the
things that I do. I don't mean to, but I do
actually predict within a six. Oh, you're not reading me back.
No, no. No, no.
So. You can piss right off.
We ain't going down there and on.
We're not going down there. You can keep your fruit.
Keep your fruit where the sun don't shine.
It's a horrible thing. It's a horrible thing to to do
is it's a horrible talent to have talent gift, whatever you
want to call it. I'm well known for it within my
friends and family circle and I have a six month prediction
window. Oh, I'm tempted now.
Don't I? I don't.
I don't I block that off. I don't answer people's.
But I don't. Well, it's also like not many
people want to know, is it to be honest?
It's a horrible thing to actually know and I said.
To own as a gift, right? Do you feel that's that's quite
challenging to own as a as a gift?
Yeah, so it, it took a long time for me to get my head round
because what do you do with that information?
No, and #1 very few people are going to ask, am I going to die
within the next six months? So there you are minding your
own business, basically get a download of, oh, there's a
problem with this person. So now what do you do with that
information? Because I don't just go, oh,
they're going to die within six months.
I actually see the circumstances.
Oh see, that's the bit I don't want to know.
I'm not worried about dying. I can get over there, but I know
not all of it's pleasant. It's.
Interesting. So I predicted when my sister
was going to die. It's clarified by the fact that
I'd actually told my husband. I've had a really bad feeling.
I told him exactly what happened and within six months she died
within those exact circumstances.
Did I tell her? Absolutely bloody not.
And it's not just one time this happened.
I've done it throughout the whole of my life.
So ethically, I don't tell people you can't change what's
going to happen. All you're going to do is make
them miserable for six months. What do you do with that
information? And ethically, we stay away from
you, basically. I wouldn't.
Tell you so, if anybody sees the wiggly green witch out and
about, do not go over and shake her hand.
Yeah, just don't. Don't do it.
I mean, it's a gift.
To have. Yeah, I shouldn't make a joke
out of it. I mean, it's, it's an incredible
validation for your spiritual practice.
It's not a fun thing. To do though.
But it's not yet. Yeah.
In terms of owning that kind of information, yeah.
I I don't know how I could. I don't know how I would deal
with that. Although you 2 know me fairly
well now. I don't retain a lot of
information very well. Things fall out of my head.
So if I went, Oh my God, Vicky's going to die in six months, I'd
probably forget by later on. I'd be like which?
Is ideal, which is absolutely ideal.
Yeah, I. Forgot I forgot I would do that
information. But I do.
What I do, though, is my very long-suffering husband.
When I get one of these things, I tell him because I get it out
of my head. And I.
Feel like I've told somebody. Unless it's not him, yeah.
You journal it. I know I don't journal it, but I
but I feel like I have to tell someone.
So as long as it's a safe person, I can tell.
I tell my husband basically, and I say this is going to happen
and and he goes all right, then Beck and then sure enough, sure,
his eggs, his eggs, but at least.
So that's how come we've ended up validating it.
Jaw as eggs as eggs. I'm coming up with.
All the sayings you are, you're going to be, you're going to be
the free the freeze lady as sure as eggs as eggs.
I've never heard that in my life.
Have you not heard that I've? Never heard.
Have you heard that, Anon? No.
Yeah. Oh, I want to say you're as old
as she is, but you're not. So rude.
I know I'm the grandma of the group.
You are, you are so not. What are you, like three years
old at? Five years older than me?
That's nothing. Yeah, that's not.
School by the time you were born.
So there you go. Well, yeah, but still.
But still. OK, so if we want to teach
people or give people advice on how to start a divination
practice, what advice would we give Annon do?
Well, what Annon is going to say is if you don't like your
pendulum, throw it at the fucking mall.
That's not advice. Well, it doesn't, you know,
doesn't it? Well, I like you were saying
before, you know, not all witches use forms of divination.
Not all people that do divination call themselves
witches. You don't have to use forms of
divination. If I would say really connect
with what you are drawn to, what you are intrigued by, what you
are interested in and if that is the tarot, the Oracle, scrying,
etcetera, etcetera. Number one, just for, and I'm
going to use the word safety in a really kind of fluffy way.
Do your research, read about it. Is there anybody that you can
reach out to that you trust or has a good following or has a
good repertoire like good reviews about doing that form of
divination and see if they can perhaps give you any tips or
guidance. But fundamentally, you have to
try it out yourself. You know, this is a practice and
the more you practice and you connect with that form of tool,
even with nature, you know, I wasn't born reading or there we
are. That means this in the cloud.
It's over decades of practice. And sometimes it's understanding
that a lot of this will take time.
Patience, if anything witchcraft has caught, has taught me
patience. It's understanding that this
isn't a future prediction. It's understanding energy, it's
understanding symbology, colour, numerology and it's
understanding where you sit right here, right now and before
we do any form of divination, it's about having that clear
centred mind. We're not reading when we're in
chaos or some form of energetic turbine, you know, kind of just
like emotionally unstable. We're calm, we're collected, and
we have a very clear idea that this, what we're reading, is a
guide. What we do with that guide, what
we do with that answer, is ultimately up to us.
I love that. I feel like we need to give our
viewpoint, but you've answered it so well.
You know, just starting is about being clear on why you're doing
it, connecting with something. Like we said, we've, we've got a
whole manner of things. And do you know what we didn't
talk about, Vicky? It's your bloody dowsing rods.
You've just. Brought some and I've not got
any and on you haven't got any either, have you?
I have. Oh, have you?
I'm the only one without dowsing rods.
But you're not going to be because when you come and
collect your veg box, you're having mine.
Because mine hate me. Mine hate me, they don't like
me, they're horrible. I've got a terrible relationship
with them and I don't want to pursue that.
Right. So you can have mines.
Annon's pissed off with their pendulum.
You're pissed off with the dowsing rods.
Yes. Do you know what, though?
I've seen people. And to be fair, when people are
really well with their dowsing rods, again, there's a really
famous, or if you say famous, there's a really popular social
media person. I can't remember what she's
called. She uses that, but it makes it
look like really straightforward.
She's obviously got an amazing relationship with her dowsing
rods and with Spirit, but yeah, because.
The answers come very, very quickly.
Right. Again, if it's the same one that
I think you're on about, again, that is about building up a
relationship and it takes time and it's understanding that if
we do try dousing rods as an example, you may not get that
response straight away. You might not get that response
for a Goodyear. It is about an exchange of
energy and it's understanding, like when the rods cross.
For other people that might be a no or for you that might be a
yes. And it's building up that
relationship which takes time in any relationship.
And what you've said and what you said about witchcraft has
taught you patience. Honestly, if I could teach
patience, all of it is patience. And we want it all now.
And that's the other thing for people who have started to
divinate, asking the same question over and over again is
not exercising our patience. It's expecting to get the answer
we want. So we keep asking.
We keep asking. That isn't divination.
That isn't how divination works. We need to be asking questions
when we're clear and we expect the answer and we take it on
board and we do something with that the.
Craft. The craft is like growing a
garden, isn't it? It is that patience.
It's that putting something into it.
It's, you know, sometimes it'll go its own route and you're sort
of like, oh, interesting. And sometimes it'll sting you or
give you a histamine reaction like.
Sometimes it'll, yeah, bite you in the bum.
So, so, but yeah, with, with, you know, I wouldn't, if my, my
advice would be don't race into divination.
I mean, I will say I'm not going to give the divining rods a
year. I can tell you straight away
they are not for me. I do not need patience with
them. I've got other methods and
that's absolutely fine. But some people may absolutely
love them. But to be fair, you brought
those divining rods just so everybody's clear on a drunk
spending. Yeah.
I I did I I bought 2 apple trees right?
Some divining rods and some steampunk sunglasses.
They are really nice though. They're so funny.
They are really actually very nice.
But that that might that might be the message actually,
Victoria, because you want to use them to divine whilst you're
drunk, but they're not for you because you didn't actually
connect. You weren't in a shop, you
weren't holding them and they. Came off Amazon, they came
drunkenly off Amazon and they hate me.
Do you know what I don't know? Where's your honor?
Your pension from your grandfather, isn't it?
I was just about to say, where did you get yours from?
But yeah, because connection's a big thing as well.
Like, we can just buy loads of shit.
But that relationship is, it needs to be built and felt and
connected. And they do with our crystals.
Vic. My mother is in the room.
Don't. Yeah, so, but this is the thing,
isn't it? Don't drunk by divination tools.
Oh, just don't do that. That does not, that's not going
to work particularly well. The biggest thing is when you're
actually going in and you're using divination is don't drink
while you're doing it. I mean, here's here's the
biggest thing. Yeah, maybe be clear minded.
Know what you're going to ask. Be grounded, clear the space,
work out what you actually want to know.
Be specific with that. And yeah, don't, don't keep
asking the same questions. Yeah.
So I've just, you know, I've done this drunk.
I've keep asking the same questions.
I've had to defer to other people who say, actually, what
is this? You know what, what's the
energy? Because I'm too close to the
situation. So now it's time for our come
sit with us listener question. And this week's question comes
from ND Leb on my Patreon. And also, Carol asked another
question around this same topic, but it's how do you know which
witchcraft practice is your strength and your destiny with
all of the information that bombards you and on, I'll let
you take the floor with this one.
How do you know it's your destiny?
I would say, I think I've slightly covered this and your
path, right is usually discovered over time since what
you are intrigued or interested by and read about that more.
Do your research and ultimately try it, try it out, practice it.
You won't know unless you try. It's also important to note
though that not everybody's path is defined by a specific
practice, right? So somewhere into woven A
mixture then, if you will, right?
Like we've discussed earlier, we love a variety of different
divination methods. Not all of us are on one
specific path, not even with our witchcraft practice.
So I would say it's about exploration.
And also it's really important, I think to know about your
emotions or gut instincts. How do you feel when you're
practicing? Do you feel at home?
Do you feel comfortable, harm. Are you settled or do you feel
stressed, chaotic, anxious? Know these emotions and be aware
of how these feelings feel to you because they are personal to
you. What?
My stress is not your stress, GAIL.
Yet we all have different levels of where we feel.
Now I'm stressed. Yeah, now this is too much.
I know ultimately what your response is to those emotions in
advance. Me, I think everybody is a
witch. I think, you know, there is no
destiny calling. It's just about that reclamation
of the word and what that means. And and the question about how
do you know what your witchcraft practice is?
It's never ending. It evolves all of the time.
So don't ever think this is what I'm going to be.
This is the type of witch I'm going to be.
This is how I am. Absolutely live it for now, but
just know that next year you'll be a different witch.
Just know that next week you'll be a different witch.
Just know that in 10 years time you're going to be a different
witch. So your destiny for from my
perspective is the moment you say that you are a witch and
your practice is ever evolving and enjoy the journey, whatever
that looks like because it just evolves over time.
Never ever pigeonhole yourself into any kind of witchcraft
practice because there's so much exciting stuff to do.
So that would be my answer, although if I had my time again,
I'd rather answer the way I'm not answered because it sounded
way better than mine. I'll add much more other than do
you know what? Curiosity and wonder is your
friend. It's not the lesser thing.
This is the thing. So go and try a few things out.
See how it feels. If it sticks, it sticks.
Do you know what your destiny is?
Probably that weird little thing you keep going back to.
That's maybe your path, you know, or I tried that move on to
something else. Oh, I'm going to go back to
that. And that's how I found what I
do. It's that little thing that I
keep going back to that I've become ridiculously obsessed
with. I'm very good at within, I know,
six months or or a year, definitely not divining rods.
So for me. Divining rods.
So, but be curious. Be curious.
Don't worry about pigeon holing yourself.
Thank you for listening to Between 3 Witches Witchcraft in
Plain Sight. If this resonated with you,
please sit with it or share it or let it unfold in your own
time. You can find me, Vicki and Anon
on all the social media platforms.
Until next time, may your practice meet you exactly where
you are.