1 00:00:00,440 --> 00:00:04,560 Microstrategy's $91 billion infinite money glitch is 2 00:00:04,560 --> 00:00:09,000 beginning to go global. A company in Asia has stolen 3 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:13,120 Michael Saylor's Bitcoin playbook to buy over 1700 4 00:00:13,120 --> 00:00:20,200 Bitcoin and has sent its stock soaring 4800% in the last 12 5 00:00:20,200 --> 00:00:22,360 months. However, this company in Asia is 6 00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:24,840 not the only one employing this tactic. 7 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:27,880 There are now hundreds of companies buying Bitcoin for 8 00:00:27,880 --> 00:00:30,920 their corporate treasuries all around around the world. 9 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:36,520 This global Bitcoin speculative attack movement is accelerating 10 00:00:36,720 --> 00:00:42,280 and man 4800% that's a 48X in 12 months. 11 00:00:42,280 --> 00:00:45,800 That's absolutely crazy. Today, joining us on the show we 12 00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:49,640 have Nick Newman. Nick Newman is the CEO of Casa 13 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:53,400 and of course, my boy Opti, my legendary Co host in the Co host 14 00:00:53,480 --> 00:00:56,440 seat Opti. I mean this is absolutely crazy. 15 00:00:56,760 --> 00:01:00,400 Before we continue the conversation, let's let's some 16 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:03,600 of what we're talking about. Let's check out the Yahoo the 17 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:10,080 Yahoo finance article Bitcoin hoarders stock source 4800% in 18 00:01:10,080 --> 00:01:13,920 Japan on crypto rally and of course, what company am I 19 00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:17,080 talking about Shout out to our boy Dylan Leclair. 20 00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:21,560 It is metaplanet absolutely slaying the ripple effects of 21 00:01:21,680 --> 00:01:23,480 U.S. President Donald Trump's pro 22 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:28,440 crypto agenda are fueling a surge in Bitcoin demand in Japan 23 00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:33,360 where one what hot dealers pivot to stockpiling the 24 00:01:33,360 --> 00:01:36,800 cryptocurrency is delivering eye watering returns for 25 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:39,400 shareholders. I mean, you never see this. 26 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:43,080 This is unheard of and it's crazy because I think when 27 00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:46,240 Michael Saylor started his Bitcoin accumulation strategy, 28 00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:49,760 the the total market cap of MicroStrategy was sitting at 1 29 00:01:49,760 --> 00:01:53,120 billion and currently when it reaches all time high, it was at 30 00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:55,640 100 billion. It's like 100 X the market cap. 31 00:01:56,000 --> 00:01:59,520 Seems like every company that's adopting Bitcoin is starting to 32 00:01:59,680 --> 00:02:02,760 yield the benefits of it. Anyways, the article continues 33 00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:08,000 to say shares of Metaplanet Inc are up around 4800% over the 34 00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:12,360 past 12 months, the largest gain among all Japanese equities in 35 00:02:12,360 --> 00:02:13,880 that period. I mean, that sounds very 36 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:15,520 familiar, right? What was the bet? 37 00:02:15,520 --> 00:02:18,640 What was one of the best performing stocks of 2024? 38 00:02:18,640 --> 00:02:22,200 It was micro strategy and one of the highest globally according 39 00:02:22,200 --> 00:02:26,200 to data compiled by Bloomberg. Bitcoin itself hit a record of 1 40 00:02:26,400 --> 00:02:32,680 of $109,241.00 on January twenty 20th as Trump was sworn in for 41 00:02:32,680 --> 00:02:35,360 his second term. Although it's sense erased some 42 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:38,080 of these gains as his trade policies fanned global 43 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:41,280 instability. Metaplanet is one of a number of 44 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:44,920 outfits around the world that aim to emulate the success of 45 00:02:44,920 --> 00:02:48,080 Michael Saylor's strategy formerly known as MicroStrategy. 46 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:51,480 The Tyson Corners, Virginia based company has morphed into a 47 00:02:51,480 --> 00:02:55,640 leveraged Bitcoin proxy and a behemoth after accumulating more 48 00:02:55,640 --> 00:03:01,200 than 45 billion of the token. Metaplanet's CEO, Goldman Sachs 49 00:03:01,200 --> 00:03:05,320 equity derivatives trader Simon Gertrovich, said he was drawn to 50 00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:08,880 the idea after hearing about sailors strategy on a podcast. 51 00:03:09,080 --> 00:03:12,600 He'd been running Metaplanet, formerly Red Planet Japan Inc, 52 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:17,520 as a hotel developer since 2013, but shifted to a quote Bitcoin 53 00:03:17,520 --> 00:03:22,120 first strategy in early 2024 after a pandemic slowed down for 54 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:25,280 slow down forced the company to shutter all but one of its 55 00:03:25,280 --> 00:03:27,760 hotels. Since then, Metaplanet 56 00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:32,600 shareholders have increased to almost 50,000, growing by 500% 57 00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:34,880 in 2024, according to the company. 58 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:38,000 Shareholders include Capital Group, which also invest in 59 00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:42,200 strategy, but the vast majority are retail investors, many of 60 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:45,840 whom have limited experience with volatile crypto assets. 61 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:50,640 Quote Metaplanet has such high exposure to the volatile retail 62 00:03:50,640 --> 00:03:53,400 base, it goes on to say quotes. They need to make sure 63 00:03:53,400 --> 00:03:56,600 shareholders understand exactly what their strategy is. 64 00:03:56,600 --> 00:03:59,320 I think. Just just my personal opinion 65 00:03:59,320 --> 00:04:01,680 here. I think they know exactly what 66 00:04:01,680 --> 00:04:05,160 they're getting into. And I mean, this is absolutely 67 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:09,160 crazy for a company you can make a very strong argument for was 68 00:04:09,160 --> 00:04:12,320 essentially a zombie company. Essentially, the pandemic was 69 00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:14,000 really, really rough to this company. 70 00:04:14,160 --> 00:04:16,560 They pivoted. They followed the MicroStrategy 71 00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:19,040 playbook. And just like MicroStrategy, 72 00:04:19,160 --> 00:04:22,200 Metaplanet really isn't a hotel company anymore. 73 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:25,800 It's like a Bitcoin holding company and it seems like they 74 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:29,200 have first mover advantage in Japan and anyone who bought the 75 00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:33,400 share is up 4800% if you bought it at the bottom. 76 00:04:33,400 --> 00:04:36,000 Absolutely crazy. Here's another article by 77 00:04:36,000 --> 00:04:39,000 Coindesk. Metaplanet follows MSTR's lead 78 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:45,160 announces a $11.3 million debt sale for additional Bitcoin 79 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:47,840 purchases. So it seems like this infinite 80 00:04:47,840 --> 00:04:51,640 money glitch phenomenon is happening worldwide. 81 00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:54,160 People are looking at what Michael Saylor is doing with 82 00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:57,080 strategy. They're copying Michael Saylor's 83 00:04:57,080 --> 00:05:00,960 strategy and it seems like their stocks are benefiting from it. 84 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:04,040 And it's not only in Japan. Saylor actually tweeted this 85 00:05:04,040 --> 00:05:06,520 this morning. Jet King is India's first 86 00:05:06,520 --> 00:05:09,800 publicly traded company to adopt the Bitcoin standard. 87 00:05:10,280 --> 00:05:14,520 He mentions the CFO explains why in the interview below. 88 00:05:14,520 --> 00:05:18,800 And it's about a 42 minutes, a podcast or interview where the 89 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:21,960 CEO of Jet King explains why they're adopting a Bitcoin 90 00:05:21,960 --> 00:05:24,400 strategy. I would not be surprised 91 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:29,280 whatsoever if their stock started going parabolic as well. 92 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:31,720 And it seems like all these companies like they're 93 00:05:31,720 --> 00:05:34,320 forgetting their core businesses and they're just, they're just, 94 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:36,640 they're just becoming Bitcoin holding companies. 95 00:05:37,000 --> 00:05:40,920 But I think the the question that is on everyone's mind is 96 00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:46,360 how long until companies like Google, companies like Amazon, 97 00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:49,200 companies like Facebook or better said, Meta? 98 00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:52,840 Take a look at. You know, these crazy 99 00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:57,560 performances by these companies like Strategy and Metaplanet and 100 00:05:57,560 --> 00:06:00,440 they say, you know what, it's probably a good idea to get some 101 00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:02,880 just in case this thing catches on. 102 00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:07,480 I think there's, I think they can only resist for so long 103 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:10,640 until their shareholders revolt, in my personal opinion. 104 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:14,360 I mean, we already had news coming out of Amazon, coming out 105 00:06:14,360 --> 00:06:17,440 of Meta that specific shareholders were basically 106 00:06:17,440 --> 00:06:20,720 saying, hey, you guys should take a look at this Bitcoin 107 00:06:20,720 --> 00:06:22,880 thing. And of course, we had the famous 108 00:06:22,880 --> 00:06:25,920 video from Michael Saylor where he had three minutes to make a 109 00:06:25,920 --> 00:06:29,720 presentation to Microsoft, basically making the case as to 110 00:06:29,720 --> 00:06:33,640 why they should adopt Bitcoin. And the TLDR of that video is 111 00:06:33,640 --> 00:06:36,120 Microsoft, you should have topped, you should adopt Bitcoin 112 00:06:36,120 --> 00:06:37,880 and you're going to have fun staying poor, which I thought 113 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:40,400 was absolutely hilarious. But it was a master class by 114 00:06:40,400 --> 00:06:44,400 Saylor because what he was able to condense in 3 minutes, he 115 00:06:44,400 --> 00:06:46,200 just packed so much information there. 116 00:06:46,440 --> 00:06:47,840 Anyways, I'm going to pass it on to Nick. 117 00:06:48,040 --> 00:06:52,600 Nick, I mean, you're the CEO of a, of a, of a Bitcoin company, 118 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:55,080 man. So we are here at simply so I 119 00:06:55,080 --> 00:06:59,000 think you know the benefits of having Bitcoin on your treasury. 120 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:03,280 It is a literal cheat code that I think most of the world hasn't 121 00:07:03,280 --> 00:07:06,560 awakened to yet, but it seems like the public markets are 122 00:07:06,760 --> 00:07:10,680 starting to get a taste of it, and it seems like their stocks 123 00:07:10,680 --> 00:07:12,360 are performing because of it. Nick. 124 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:14,920 Yeah, totally. I mean, and it's kind of funny, 125 00:07:14,920 --> 00:07:18,760 I didn't realize that Metaplanet was a a hotel company before. 126 00:07:18,760 --> 00:07:22,720 It's like they they pivoted from being a hotel company to being 127 00:07:22,960 --> 00:07:26,960 Hotel California for Bitcoin. You know, they, they want 128 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:28,640 Bitcoin to come in and never leave. 129 00:07:29,680 --> 00:07:34,480 So I think that it's interesting to see these different types of 130 00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:36,800 companies. You know, I think Jack King is a 131 00:07:37,480 --> 00:07:42,280 education company, Metaplanet, the, the hotel company, 132 00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:45,960 Microstrategies, the, they've got all the business analytics 133 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:50,440 and, and so it's these different types of core businesses, but 134 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:54,920 from, for one reason or another, they, they maybe were stalled 135 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:59,280 out on the business growth. And so they decided to pivot to 136 00:07:59,280 --> 00:08:02,840 take advantage of the growing Bitcoin standard, right? 137 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:08,880 And that is something that gives you more treasury access and 138 00:08:08,880 --> 00:08:13,200 more treasury strength to then go build the rest of your 139 00:08:13,200 --> 00:08:16,480 business in a way that you have a a core advantage because 140 00:08:16,480 --> 00:08:19,760 you're using this better money asset on your balance sheet. 141 00:08:19,760 --> 00:08:21,840 And we've seen that for our business, you know, we hold a 142 00:08:21,840 --> 00:08:26,120 ton of our balance sheet at Casa in Bitcoin and and that's been a 143 00:08:26,120 --> 00:08:28,800 huge benefit to us over the years. 144 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:32,600 And so all that comes, we don't have access to the public 145 00:08:32,600 --> 00:08:35,159 markets, right. So we're not going out and doing 146 00:08:35,440 --> 00:08:39,159 the financial engineering that sailors doing, but we accept 147 00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:41,400 customer payments in Bitcoin, right. 148 00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:44,640 And so we just don't sell the Bitcoin that we get from 149 00:08:44,640 --> 00:08:47,080 customer payments. And over the last five years 150 00:08:47,080 --> 00:08:51,560 that's built up into a pretty big stash of Bitcoin that has 151 00:08:51,560 --> 00:08:54,200 been really beneficial for us from a treasury perspective. 152 00:08:54,200 --> 00:08:59,120 So I think it's a huge benefit to companies, whether they're a 153 00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:03,840 Bitcoin startup or a large public company transitioning 154 00:09:03,840 --> 00:09:07,560 into Bitcoin, huge benefits from having Bitcoin on your balance 155 00:09:07,560 --> 00:09:08,960 sheet. Absolutely. 156 00:09:08,960 --> 00:09:12,640 And and especially to like, you know, Nick, I wouldn't consider 157 00:09:12,640 --> 00:09:14,400 you guys a start up at the at this point. 158 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:18,240 But if you're a start up and like, you know, if you're just, 159 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:22,640 you're just getting going like it's crazy having you know, 160 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:26,560 20-30, forty, 50% of your treasury in Bitcoin and your 161 00:09:26,560 --> 00:09:31,080 runway gets bigger. That that is a very surreal type 162 00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:34,760 of you're looking at that you're like, no way, this is real. 163 00:09:34,760 --> 00:09:37,200 This, this can't be real. This is, this is fake. 164 00:09:37,760 --> 00:09:40,920 Because so many startups are used to, to burning the runway, 165 00:09:40,920 --> 00:09:42,600 right? And you're like, you're managing 166 00:09:42,600 --> 00:09:46,920 that going down. And with Bitcoin, it can expand 167 00:09:46,920 --> 00:09:49,240 and it can act if you do it right. 168 00:09:49,240 --> 00:09:52,160 You know, you, you didn't, you ideally didn't want to buy all 169 00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:56,040 your startups Bitcoin at 69 K before it crashed down to 20, 170 00:09:56,040 --> 00:09:58,160 right? But if you are doing it right, 171 00:09:58,520 --> 00:10:03,000 then it can provide significant runway expansion to the point 172 00:10:03,000 --> 00:10:06,080 where it's like you did another fundraise as a startup. 173 00:10:06,840 --> 00:10:08,840 Absolutely. Yeah, it's, it's it's an 174 00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:11,440 absolute cheat code. And I think the public markets 175 00:10:11,440 --> 00:10:12,880 are starting to get a taste of it. 176 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:16,680 But it's it's interesting which companies are doing this right. 177 00:10:16,920 --> 00:10:19,880 Like Michael Saylor has said himself in previous interviews, 178 00:10:20,200 --> 00:10:23,400 like, I would have retired. I don't think MicroStrategy 179 00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:25,880 would have been competitive. Like this thing wouldn't have 180 00:10:25,880 --> 00:10:27,760 existed. And it's very similar. 181 00:10:27,760 --> 00:10:30,200 When you hear about this meta plan, it's like no one really 182 00:10:30,200 --> 00:10:32,640 knew what this company was. It was a hotel chain. 183 00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:34,760 The hotel chain was about to go out of business. 184 00:10:34,760 --> 00:10:37,080 And they look at Bitcoin. They're like, hey, you know what 185 00:10:37,280 --> 00:10:39,560 like this is, this is a good opportunity. 186 00:10:40,120 --> 00:10:44,560 It's, it's fascinating to see what Bitcoin has done to these 187 00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:47,160 companies that, you know, potentially you can make an 188 00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:50,600 argument wouldn't have existed 2-3 years from now if they 189 00:10:50,600 --> 00:10:54,080 remained on a Fiat standard. Not only has Bitcoin given them 190 00:10:54,080 --> 00:10:58,840 new life, they've made them the best performing stocks of the 191 00:10:58,840 --> 00:11:01,240 year. And these companies don't really 192 00:11:01,240 --> 00:11:06,080 like, look, I love Sailor. I, I like, I like strategy. 193 00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:09,000 I still don't really know what strategy does, right? 194 00:11:09,000 --> 00:11:11,920 I, I know that he buys a lot of Bitcoin with strategy and I know 195 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:14,960 he, I know there is a software behind it. 196 00:11:15,080 --> 00:11:17,720 I, I know that. But I don't think a lot of 197 00:11:17,720 --> 00:11:20,200 people know what his core business is. 198 00:11:20,200 --> 00:11:22,280 And his core business makes revenue and makes money. 199 00:11:22,280 --> 00:11:24,240 It's real. It's not that it's, you know, 200 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:27,720 it's fake or anything, but people don't really kind of buy 201 00:11:27,720 --> 00:11:29,400 MicroStrategy because of the core business. 202 00:11:29,400 --> 00:11:32,320 People buy MicroStrategy because of the Bitcoin that. 203 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:35,080 He's especially now that he's doing the, the more financial 204 00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:37,760 like really leaning into financial engineering, right? 205 00:11:37,760 --> 00:11:42,440 So when he first started, he was buying Bitcoin mostly with his 206 00:11:42,440 --> 00:11:46,120 business's profits, right? And so that he had smaller buys 207 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:49,280 on a regular basis. But then he figured out the the 208 00:11:49,280 --> 00:11:52,120 cheat code where he figured out he could go to market with 209 00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:56,200 either the at the market sales of his stock or putting out 210 00:11:56,200 --> 00:11:59,320 converts and just buy huge amounts of Bitcoin in the market 211 00:11:59,320 --> 00:12:03,240 just keeps eating it up. And so he's really, it doesn't 212 00:12:03,240 --> 00:12:06,520 even matter what micro strategies core or strategies 213 00:12:06,520 --> 00:12:10,640 core businesses like now, he's just a Bitcoin treasury company 214 00:12:10,640 --> 00:12:14,040 basically. Absolutely 100% and I think I 215 00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:16,600 think companies worldwide are are figuring that out too. 216 00:12:16,960 --> 00:12:18,440 Opti, what's your take on this bro? 217 00:12:18,440 --> 00:12:21,520 How was your weekend dude? My weekend was great. 218 00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:26,800 Thank you for asking. Well, first of all, I I want to 219 00:12:27,560 --> 00:12:29,320 I want to comment on the the Yahoo. 220 00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:31,640 Well, really it's a Bloomberg article that was reposted on 221 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:34,760 Yahoo, but I really like the framing that they have there. 222 00:12:34,760 --> 00:12:37,160 What was it? Bitcoin hoarder stock goes 223 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:41,800 absolutely nuclear like just as Bitcoin hoarder stock that I 224 00:12:41,800 --> 00:12:44,960 think that sums up perfectly kind of the mainstream 225 00:12:44,960 --> 00:12:47,520 perspective on Bitcoin. You know, we call it hodling. 226 00:12:47,760 --> 00:12:50,360 You know what, however framing you want to call it, but they're 227 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:53,120 they're calling us hoarders and it really has a negative 228 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:55,480 connotation. Obviously they'll probably be 229 00:12:55,480 --> 00:12:58,480 talking about the same flood lines we get all the time. 230 00:12:58,480 --> 00:13:00,240 You know what, what do they always say about Bitcoin? 231 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:03,280 Like there's no yields, there's no cash flows to it, there's no 232 00:13:03,280 --> 00:13:05,520 intrinsic values. Why would you be holding this? 233 00:13:05,840 --> 00:13:08,640 And and they're kind of making us seem like we're just like, 234 00:13:08,680 --> 00:13:11,800 you know, collecting some Chuck E Cheese token over here, even 235 00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:15,560 how they framed it in in the article, but you know, millions 236 00:13:15,560 --> 00:13:19,360 of this token and it's really interesting to see them kind of 237 00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:22,160 wrap their heads around it. I would say it's most likely 238 00:13:22,160 --> 00:13:25,720 because they want to frame this in a negative direction, but I 239 00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:28,040 absolutely love this title. Bitcoin hoarder stock soars 240 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:31,000 4800% like it. The cognitive dissonance that 241 00:13:31,000 --> 00:13:33,800 I'm seeing in this title is absolutely, and it's incredible 242 00:13:33,800 --> 00:13:37,040 here because you can tell they either know their audience 243 00:13:37,040 --> 00:13:40,000 doesn't understand Bitcoin and they don't really understand the 244 00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:42,760 strategy, but they're also kind of downplaying the fact that 245 00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:45,800 bitcoins, you know, going nuclear and making companies 246 00:13:45,800 --> 00:13:48,920 become even more profitable. But like Nick was saying, I 247 00:13:48,920 --> 00:13:52,240 think the interesting part about this is this idea that so many 248 00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:55,720 of these companies on every actually global corporations 249 00:13:55,720 --> 00:13:58,280 right now, a lot of them are essentially like zombie 250 00:13:58,280 --> 00:14:00,040 companies. And and you, Nico, you were 251 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:02,360 bringing up the idea of sailor even said it himself. 252 00:14:02,360 --> 00:14:06,040 He's like, I was going to retire micro strategy or now strategy. 253 00:14:06,040 --> 00:14:09,880 It wasn't really doing anything, you know, I was on my basically 254 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:13,600 my, my last nerve here wondering what I should do, scratching my 255 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:15,800 head. And then I found Bitcoin. 256 00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:20,640 And I think this is also just a, a perfect summary of what it 257 00:14:20,640 --> 00:14:23,840 means to become a bitcoiner. You, you know, you learn about 258 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:26,400 Bitcoin, you kind of come in and it's a speculative thing. 259 00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:27,920 You kind of get interested about it. 260 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:31,600 And then once it finally clicks, you change everything about your 261 00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:33,360 company, everything about your life. 262 00:14:33,360 --> 00:14:36,440 And you're like, Oh my goodness, this Bitcoin thing is absolutely 263 00:14:36,960 --> 00:14:39,560 the best thing ever. I need to get as much of it as 264 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:42,200 possible. So it is very interesting to see 265 00:14:42,200 --> 00:14:46,560 these you, you could argue maybe smaller corporations that are a 266 00:14:46,560 --> 00:14:49,480 little more nimble, that do have founders that have control of 267 00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:51,960 their company being able to pivot and just be like, look, 268 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:56,240 yes, I was a hotel business. Yes, I was a business analytics 269 00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:59,040 company. But now I am turning my company 270 00:14:59,040 --> 00:15:03,440 into basically a Bitcoin bank like I just acquired Bitcoin and 271 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:06,400 and it's going to make my stock go absolutely insane and my 272 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:08,280 shareholders are going to be super happy about it. 273 00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:11,320 So I find it very interesting. One, of course, the Yahoo title 274 00:15:11,320 --> 00:15:14,640 will rather Bloomberg title here and this idea that once you 275 00:15:14,640 --> 00:15:18,400 start to understand Bitcoin, you kind of have to reevaluate 276 00:15:18,400 --> 00:15:21,480 everything about your core business and if you're capable 277 00:15:21,480 --> 00:15:23,920 of obviously just turn it into a Bitcoin business. 278 00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:26,960 But it's also kind of a testament to what a lot of 279 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:28,680 Bitcoiners in our chat always talk about. 280 00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:32,800 It's like, look, I, I just, you know, I mine Fiat and I save it 281 00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:35,560 in Bitcoin and my life gets that much better. 282 00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:39,200 If, if we all were corporations, you know, like Sailor, like the 283 00:15:39,200 --> 00:15:42,440 metaplanet CEOs, you just fundamentally change your whole 284 00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:46,520 core business to acquire as much Bitcoin as possible and your 285 00:15:46,520 --> 00:15:47,960 shareholder value is going to go crazy. 286 00:15:47,960 --> 00:15:52,680 So hey, will we see, will we see Tim, Tim Cook do the same thing, 287 00:15:52,680 --> 00:15:55,400 not making any more iPhones and he's just going to stack as much 288 00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:56,360 Bitcoin? Ever, ever. 289 00:15:56,920 --> 00:15:59,520 All companies worldwide, they just stopped producing products. 290 00:15:59,960 --> 00:16:01,680 We're just going to pivot to buying Bitcoin. 291 00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:03,120 Well, I wouldn't want to see that. 292 00:16:03,120 --> 00:16:06,200 I I like Apple products, but you know, it's kind of interesting. 293 00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:10,640 I mean, I think what's it's interesting like is, is that 294 00:16:10,640 --> 00:16:12,880 sustainable, right? Is it sustainable for more 295 00:16:12,880 --> 00:16:17,280 companies to just become these Bitcoin acquisition vehicles? 296 00:16:17,720 --> 00:16:22,640 And I think probably no, I think that realistically you'll get 297 00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:28,160 one to two Bitcoin acquisition vehicles per public market 298 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:30,760 region that really gains the mind share. 299 00:16:30,760 --> 00:16:33,080 So it's, it's kind of a jurisdictional or like 300 00:16:33,080 --> 00:16:37,680 geographical play, right? Like strategies done this in the 301 00:16:37,920 --> 00:16:41,960 US and then similar scientific is maybe like the next biggest 302 00:16:41,960 --> 00:16:45,160 one in the US, but it's a huge gap between the two. 303 00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:49,160 And then Metaplan, it's gone and done this in Japan, Jet King's 304 00:16:49,160 --> 00:16:52,960 doing this in India. And I think that you like, once 305 00:16:52,960 --> 00:16:55,880 you've got that vehicle, once the public market investors have 306 00:16:55,880 --> 00:16:59,560 that vehicle, that's the one where most of the money is going 307 00:16:59,560 --> 00:17:02,640 to flow towards. And then it's unlikely that 308 00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:06,040 you'll just see a bunch of other public companies purely pivot to 309 00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:09,760 this Bitcoin treasury company strategy because I don't think 310 00:17:10,079 --> 00:17:12,599 the market dynamics will work in the same way. 311 00:17:12,839 --> 00:17:14,880 And so then the rest of the companies, what they're going to 312 00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:17,520 be doing is they're actually going to be using Bitcoin more 313 00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:20,599 strategically to accomplish the goal of their underlying my 314 00:17:20,599 --> 00:17:22,760 business. And so then it's like, how can I 315 00:17:22,760 --> 00:17:27,079 use Bitcoin as a treasury asset to keep building the product 316 00:17:27,079 --> 00:17:30,120 that I want to build, but do it in a more advantageous way? 317 00:17:30,360 --> 00:17:34,680 And I think that's where the real like widespread adoption of 318 00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:38,280 Bitcoin as a treasury asset will come from is those types of 319 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:41,240 companies. Less so everybody trying to copy 320 00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:44,800 Sailor because eventually that runs out and after you tap all 321 00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:47,960 the different geographies. I, I know, 100% agree, because 322 00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:51,120 if you do like the a little bit of math, right, like the amount 323 00:17:51,120 --> 00:17:55,040 of cash that Apple or Google is sitting on and the amount of 324 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:58,280 purchasing power they're losing on a yearly basis is a 325 00:17:58,280 --> 00:18:01,480 ridiculous amount. That money could be, you know, 326 00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:05,920 allocated to R&D or marketing or like all, you know, all these 327 00:18:05,920 --> 00:18:08,920 things like that. It's like a melting ice cube. 328 00:18:08,920 --> 00:18:10,560 I mean, Sailor has said it himself, right? 329 00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:13,840 And with that additional capital, think about it's, it's 330 00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:16,920 not only additional capital, that capital is actually 331 00:18:17,160 --> 00:18:19,640 increasing and purchasing power every single year. 332 00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:23,920 It obviously allows you to, I think as, as we felt as as 333 00:18:23,920 --> 00:18:27,120 Bitcoin, you know, company entrepreneurs and stuff, It 334 00:18:27,120 --> 00:18:29,840 allows you to invest some of that capital back into your 335 00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:33,080 company to make your company better rather than the existing 336 00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:35,440 Fiat system where it's, it's, it's terrible. 337 00:18:35,440 --> 00:18:36,960 It's like, it's like an additional tax. 338 00:18:36,960 --> 00:18:39,080 So the taxes that you're already paying, right? 339 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:41,840 So, yeah, I, I think that this phenomenon, I think what's 340 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:45,640 happening with strategy and Metaplanet, I think it, it's 341 00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:48,560 essentially taking advantage of the system. 342 00:18:49,000 --> 00:18:53,360 And I I, and that's why the, the stocks have exploded as, as as 343 00:18:53,360 --> 00:18:55,800 much as they have. But like you, like you said, 344 00:18:55,800 --> 00:18:59,880 Nick, I don't think the long term, I don't think the party is 345 00:18:59,880 --> 00:19:02,200 going to continue forever. I think they're, they're 346 00:19:02,200 --> 00:19:04,080 obviously fulfilling a market need. 347 00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:08,080 There's a lot of companies that can't legally get exposure to 348 00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:12,080 Bitcoin ETFs or spot Bitcoin. So they obviously buy strategy 349 00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:13,840 instead. And I think a very similar 350 00:19:13,840 --> 00:19:16,480 phenomenon is happening in in in Japan as well. 351 00:19:16,840 --> 00:19:19,360 So anyways, guys, before we start the show, we have tons to 352 00:19:19,360 --> 00:19:22,480 talk about today. Specifically, there's some 353 00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:26,000 interesting things that were happening and Coinbase, the 354 00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:31,160 amount of money that has been lost to social engineering scan, 355 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:35,720 it's an absurd amount, over $300 million. 356 00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:40,520 Zach XPT wrote a great thread about it and our friends over at 357 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:42,200 Casa, we're talking about it as well. 358 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:46,280 And then during the news segment, I find this very 359 00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:47,880 interesting. We're going to be talking about 360 00:19:48,360 --> 00:19:50,800 where Bitcoin belongs in your retirement plan. 361 00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:55,000 And again, just as we've been talking about how Bitcoin is a 362 00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:58,800 cheat code, if you put it on your treasury, that applies to 363 00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:01,840 your personal finances as well, like Bitcoin is a cheat code. 364 00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:06,080 It's pretty crazy. So we have all that content left 365 00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:08,240 for you guys. We have a hell of a show, but 366 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:11,000 before we jump into it, I do want to give a very special 367 00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:14,520 shout out to simply Bitcoins lead sponsorbitcoinwell.com. 368 00:20:14,520 --> 00:20:17,320 bitcoinwell.com is the best place to build your automatic 369 00:20:17,320 --> 00:20:20,080 self custody Bitcoin stack. 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I mean, here is the plate that 411 00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:48,280 they crushed, they put in water, they put a blowtorch to it and 412 00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:51,120 as you can see, the words have survived. 413 00:22:51,320 --> 00:22:56,040 Stamp your seed on stamp seed and you can use promo code 414 00:22:56,040 --> 00:22:59,800 simply to get 15% off anything on their store. 415 00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:05,720 All right, everybody scan the QR code on your screen and take you 416 00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:07,800 directly to stampse-ed.com website. 417 00:23:07,800 --> 00:23:10,800 Use promo code simply to get 15% off. 418 00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:14,640 I also want to give a shout out to the 1700 of you guys watching 419 00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:18,720 live between YouTube and X and the 100 or so of you guys 420 00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:21,240 watching live on rumble. If you guys are enjoying the 421 00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:25,000 show so far, smash the like button on YouTube. 422 00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:28,640 We just broke 100 likes. Help us break 150 likes within 423 00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:32,000 the 1st 30 minutes of the show. So there's almost 500 of you 424 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:33,800 guys watching live on YouTube alone. 425 00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:37,160 Smash that like button. At the time of recording the 426 00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:43,800 Bitcoin price is 97,280, Block height 800, 83,197 sats per 427 00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:48,560 dollar 1028 market cap 1.93 trillion Bitcoin versus gold 428 00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:55,320 market cap 9.5% Percentage issued 94.39% Decline from all 429 00:23:55,320 --> 00:24:02,080 time high -10.9% Realize monetary inflation 1.01%. 430 00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:05,720 In the grand scheme of things, we are just getting started 431 00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:08,960 Anyways. Nick pointed this out to us in 432 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:10,480 the beginning of the show. We were originally going to 433 00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:12,760 cover something different, but then Nick pointed this out to 434 00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:14,200 us. I'm like, we have to cover this 435 00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:16,880 because this is absolutely crazy. 436 00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:20,960 And remember guys, we are huge advocates of self custody. 437 00:24:21,280 --> 00:24:25,560 The entire show is essentially telling you to take self 438 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:27,360 custody. The partners who we choose to 439 00:24:27,360 --> 00:24:31,480 partner with enable you to take self custody of your Bitcoin. 440 00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:36,120 And again, one of the one of the easiest and fastest way to get 441 00:24:36,120 --> 00:24:39,120 your essentially your, your Bitcoin rugged by leaving it on 442 00:24:39,120 --> 00:24:41,080 an exchange. And the exchange doesn't even 443 00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:44,560 need to be hacked, right? You could just be social 444 00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:48,560 engineered or your e-mail address is hacked and then 445 00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:52,680 hackers get access to your exchange and then they just take 446 00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:55,920 out all your Bitcoin. This is why cold storage is so 447 00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:58,160 important. But it's not just cold storage 448 00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:01,160 you got to you got to take cold storage properly. 449 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:02,840 And there's many different ways to do that. 450 00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:05,640 And we're going to talk a lot about that during the culture 451 00:25:05,640 --> 00:25:07,760 segment today. But anyways, let's get into the 452 00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:12,960 thread by Zach X BT Over the past few months, I'm I imagine 453 00:25:13,120 --> 00:25:16,880 you have seen many coin base users complain on X about their 454 00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:18,840 accounts suddenly being restricted. 455 00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:22,920 This is the result of an aggressive risk of aggressive 456 00:25:22,920 --> 00:25:26,920 risk models and Coinbase's failure to stop its loser, its 457 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:32,400 users from losing 300 million per year to social engineering 458 00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:38,600 scan that is, that is absurd. That is a crazy, crazy, crazy 459 00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:40,200 crazy that that's a lot of money. 460 00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:45,000 ANYWAYS, myself and another person by the name of Tang Kui 461 00:25:45,360 --> 00:25:49,960 42 spent time reviewing Coinbase withdraws and gathering data 462 00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:53,800 from my DMS for high confidence thefts on various chains. 463 00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:58,320 Below is a table we created which shows 65,000,000 stolen 464 00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:03,440 from Coinbase users in December 2024 through January 2025. 465 00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:07,920 Our number is likely much lower than the actual amount stolen as 466 00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:11,880 our data was limited to my DMS and dense we discovered on 467 00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:15,400 chain, which does not account for Coinbase support tickets and 468 00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:17,800 police reports we do not have access to. 469 00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:21,040 He goes on to say. Let's walk through how these 470 00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:23,440 Coinbase social engineering scams work. 471 00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:28,640 A victim reached out to me last month after losing 850,000. 472 00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:32,840 That's Oh my God. Graphing out this theft led to a 473 00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:37,840 consolidation address with 25 other victims tied to Coinbase. 474 00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:42,160 Huddle dot ETH goes on to say the scammer called the victim 475 00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:45,320 from a spoofed phone number and use personal information 476 00:26:45,320 --> 00:26:48,400 obtained from private DBS to gain their trust. 477 00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:51,640 After they told the victim their account had multiple 478 00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:54,320 unauthorized login attempts, they sent. 479 00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:58,000 They then sent a spoofed e-mail which appeared to be from 480 00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:01,800 Coinbase with a fake case ID for their gaining trust. 481 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:05,120 They instructed the victim to transfer funds to a Coinbase 482 00:27:05,120 --> 00:27:08,840 wallet and whitelist an address while support verified their 483 00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:11,320 account. Security scammers clone the 484 00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:15,080 Coinbase site nearly one to one. Allow the scammers to send 485 00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:18,680 different prompts to the target via spoofed emails using panels. 486 00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:23,280 There are many Telegram channels where scammers advertise them. 487 00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:26,680 See examples of various panels used by scammers below. 488 00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:30,600 Last year I posted multiple examples of Coinbase user 489 00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:32,960 thefts, all for millions of dollars. 490 00:27:33,080 --> 00:27:36,600 The two main groups conducting these scams are Skids from the 491 00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:40,280 COM and the Threat Actors located in India, both primarily 492 00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:43,840 targeting US customers. The other month, a Coinbase 493 00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:48,000 employee told people on X to stop using VPMS to avoid being 494 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:51,320 flagged as suspicious. Meanwhile, threat actors will 495 00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:55,080 explicitly block VPNs from phishing sites and not use them. 496 00:27:55,360 --> 00:28:00,200 This shows Coinbase's failure to diagnose the actual problem, and 497 00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:02,520 it continues. Now I know Nick, you guys 498 00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:06,720 reacted to this over over you, you reacted to this personally 499 00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:11,120 and I know lap reacted to this. This is your this is one of your 500 00:28:11,120 --> 00:28:13,120 posts and you made a video about it as well. 501 00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:17,600 Today, Zach XPT shared research showing that at least 65 million 502 00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:20,760 in crypto has been stolen in Coinbase social engineering 503 00:28:20,760 --> 00:28:22,840 scams in just the last two months. 504 00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:26,760 The main point in in your security is you. 505 00:28:27,040 --> 00:28:30,480 What do you mean by that? And what can people do to 506 00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,520 protect themselves from these types of attacks, Nick? 507 00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:36,760 Yeah. So the first of all, this was 508 00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:40,960 crazy to me that so much money had been stolen from people on 509 00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:44,520 Coinbase and that they still haven't really done something 510 00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:48,400 about it. And so this is like Coinbase has 511 00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:52,080 a a very trusted position in our industry just due to the number 512 00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:55,000 of people that use it. And so this that makes them a 513 00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:57,680 huge honeypot. And this is a a huge problem for 514 00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:02,240 them if if they're losing $300 million plus per year, right. 515 00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:05,480 And and that's just an estimate of probably the lower end of the 516 00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:08,480 range. So Coinbase needs to be doing a 517 00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:12,560 better job about this. But self custody is one of the 518 00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:14,320 best ways you can protect yourself against this. 519 00:29:14,320 --> 00:29:15,720 And we'll go in, we'll go into that. 520 00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:19,800 But when I say that the in my tweet that the main weak point 521 00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:24,440 in your security is you, what I mean is that a lot of times 522 00:29:24,440 --> 00:29:29,280 these people are giving access to their Coinbase account to the 523 00:29:29,280 --> 00:29:32,560 social engineers, right? And so they've got somebody 524 00:29:32,560 --> 00:29:36,880 calling them who who has some information on them that the 525 00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:40,600 victim thinks, Oh, it would have to be Coinbase if they know this 526 00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:42,120 about me. That's not true. 527 00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:46,760 Like somebody, your addresses, your phone numbers, your e-mail, 528 00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:50,000 all that stuff is out there for people to find. 529 00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:55,160 And from one of the many hacks, right, like AT and TS been 530 00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:56,680 hacked how many times? I don't know. 531 00:29:57,040 --> 00:30:00,600 So all that stuff is out there. So somebody calls you and they 532 00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:02,760 say, hey, I'm with Coinbase. There's a problem with your 533 00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:04,840 account. Let me give you some information 534 00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:06,800 that I've stolen from somewhere else on the web. 535 00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:10,320 And this is going to trick you into thinking that I'm from 536 00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:14,800 Coinbase and here to help you. And they really rely on scaring 537 00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:19,920 you like they get you into this state of, of anxiety and fear. 538 00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:23,400 Oh, is there actually something wrong with my, the funds in my 539 00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:26,080 Coinbase account when there there isn't anything wrong with 540 00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:28,360 it. And then they, they'd walk you 541 00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:31,760 through this whole script where they eventually trick you into 542 00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:33,760 basically sending them the Bitcoin. 543 00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:38,160 It's not even, but often times they aren't even like taking 544 00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:40,320 over your account. Sometimes they figure out how to 545 00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:44,080 take over your account directly, but a lot of times they are 546 00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:48,000 actively tricking you into just sending your Bitcoin to them. 547 00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:51,640 And so this is where I get to like the main weak point is your 548 00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:55,800 in your security is you, right? If you let yourself get into 549 00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:59,440 this state where you're worried about losing money, you give up 550 00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:04,560 all of your logical kind of processing power and suddenly 551 00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:08,800 they have full control over you. And so the best thing you can do 552 00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:12,200 in these scenarios is one, don't answer the phone to an unknown 553 00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:16,720 number to start with, But two, if you think that this, there 554 00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:20,040 might be something fishy here or Coinbase is calling you or 555 00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:23,520 whoever it is, Casa is calling you, whoever it is like, just 556 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:26,760 take a step back and say, whoa, hang on a second, is this real? 557 00:31:26,760 --> 00:31:30,240 Maybe I should take a breather here and let your your logical 558 00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:33,120 mind come back a little bit. Yeah. 559 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:37,720 And I think I think they also prey a lot on on people that 560 00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:40,800 perhaps are a little bit older and they're used to getting 561 00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:43,400 those types of calls from their banks, right. 562 00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:45,840 And, you know, they sound super legit. 563 00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:47,840 And it was it was it was actually really interesting. 564 00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:50,520 Nick, I was going to say funny, but interesting is the better 565 00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:53,440 word. You actually answered one of 566 00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:58,600 these calls yourself and you recorded it, which I thought was 567 00:31:59,600 --> 00:32:02,320 hilarious is a terrible word because it's all this money is 568 00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:04,960 being stolen. But I think it was, it was, it 569 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:09,000 was, it was interesting that, you know, one of the leading, 570 00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:12,800 you know, Bitcoin security company CEOs picks up one of 571 00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:15,160 these scam calls. What, what, what was one of the 572 00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:18,840 things that you experienced is that you noted from, you know, 573 00:32:18,840 --> 00:32:23,440 from, from the scammer. I mean, I highly recommend 574 00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:26,760 people go in and watch that because it gives you so much 575 00:32:26,840 --> 00:32:31,480 insider info as to how they pull off these scams and how they 576 00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:34,200 trick people, right? It's on my Twitter profile and 577 00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:37,720 it's the pinned tweet and it's a 14 minute video and it's 578 00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:42,640 entertaining and kind of a sick way, honestly. 579 00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:45,200 But it's also very educational so you know what to look out 580 00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:47,920 for. The one of the things that I 581 00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:53,000 took away from it though is they are looking for very easy 582 00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,880 targets. The name of the game for them is 583 00:32:56,000 --> 00:33:01,560 cold call hundreds of people a day, find the easiest possible 584 00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:05,920 target for them to to hook fast and then move on to the next 585 00:33:05,920 --> 00:33:08,360 one. And so it's all a volume game. 586 00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:12,800 So if you are just slightly more difficult than the next person, 587 00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:15,320 they will hang up and move on, right? 588 00:33:15,760 --> 00:33:20,160 And so if you just take that breather, you can get them to to 589 00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:23,640 move on and, and not mess with you in that instance. 590 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:28,080 And so that's one of the many things that I, I think I took 591 00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:30,640 away from it. But it's we're actually, I've 592 00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:33,720 attempted this a couple of times, right, to record these 593 00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:37,920 guys when they call me. And the first time it, I was 594 00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:42,280 following along with them as they were sending me the spoofed 595 00:33:42,280 --> 00:33:46,680 e-mail from Coinbase. The the text confirming that, 596 00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:50,480 you know, they were a Coinbase representative and I saved all 597 00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:52,400 this stuff. And we're actually, we're going 598 00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:57,800 to publish a second video soon. That is well, that first one was 599 00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:00,920 more about like this guy kind of bragging about how they do all 600 00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:03,960 this stuff. The second one is actually me 601 00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:09,280 going through the steps to get social engineered and then 602 00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:12,239 stopping at the point where I thought, oh, this is where they 603 00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:15,360 could actually steal anything that's in my account, right? 604 00:34:15,960 --> 00:34:18,280 And then calling him out and trying to get him to talk about 605 00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:19,440 it. And that's when he hung up. 606 00:34:19,719 --> 00:34:22,600 But up to that point, you know, I've got all the things like 607 00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:24,760 they sent me this e-mail, they sent me this text message. 608 00:34:24,760 --> 00:34:28,159 Here's what the guy's saying. And so we'll have more of that 609 00:34:28,159 --> 00:34:30,600 stuff coming to help people just educate themselves because 610 00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:31,800 that's what you got to do, right? 611 00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:36,560 You got to educate yourself to know how to protect yourself. 612 00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:42,280 And like you said, this isn't just a problem for for Bitcoin, 613 00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:45,360 right? Like this happens with older 614 00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:48,400 people with their normal bank accounts all the time. 615 00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:51,880 I was talking to a friend of mine who works at a bank and he 616 00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:55,159 said that they have problems with us where you know, some 617 00:34:55,560 --> 00:34:58,440 elderly person will get social engineered with their bank 618 00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:02,600 account and then they've got maybe a day to try and reverse 619 00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:06,680 that payment or it's just gone. So it's a big problem and and 620 00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:09,600 honestly, this is one of the things that self cost that the 621 00:35:09,600 --> 00:35:12,400 right type of self custody helps to solve. 622 00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:16,640 Yeah, absolutely. And again, self custody comes 623 00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:20,520 with a lot of responsibility. And I think that there is like 624 00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:26,600 a, there is a, a mental shift that people I think are going to 625 00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:33,000 have to go through, you know, over the next decade or so as, 626 00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:37,040 as, because it's not just self custody of, of, of, of your 627 00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:40,000 money. It's, it's, it's your identity. 628 00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:42,160 Also, it's your digital identity. 629 00:35:42,640 --> 00:35:46,080 And I think, you know, as we transition from the analog era 630 00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:49,560 to the information era, it becomes even more important. 631 00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:54,200 Like people don't really understand the significant 632 00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:57,640 because it comes with the pros are freedom, the pros are 633 00:35:57,640 --> 00:35:59,840 autonomy, the pros are sovereignty. 634 00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:04,560 The cons is there is no one 800 number to call if you get 635 00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:06,920 hacked. There is no one 800 number to 636 00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:10,920 call if your seed phrase gets exposed for whatever reason, 637 00:36:11,200 --> 00:36:14,680 there is no 1800 and then not. And I, I want to save this 638 00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:16,960 conversation for the, the culture segment. 639 00:36:17,200 --> 00:36:23,440 But if like for whatever reason, people know that you're taking 640 00:36:23,440 --> 00:36:26,680 self custody of your Bitcoin, how do you protect yourself from 641 00:36:26,680 --> 00:36:29,920 $5 wrench attacks, right? How do you take advantage of, 642 00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:37,520 of, of playing, of keeping your seeds in different locations, 643 00:36:37,520 --> 00:36:41,160 pretend potentially different jurisdictions, right, to kind of 644 00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:45,600 play into your security setup. And these are very important 645 00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:48,600 questions that people are not asking because they're they've 646 00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:52,520 been conditioned to outsource that responsibility to a 647 00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:55,240 financial institution. Now that we're heading into the 648 00:36:55,240 --> 00:36:58,840 era of self custody of people reclaiming back their financial 649 00:36:58,840 --> 00:37:02,480 sovereignty using Bitcoin. You got to look into multi sig, 650 00:37:02,600 --> 00:37:05,360 you got to look into how to take, you know, the different 651 00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:07,960 hardware wallets that exist. You got to look into the 652 00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:10,600 different solutions like Casa. We're going to talk about that 653 00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:12,480 during the culture segment. You got it. 654 00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:14,680 You got to do that. If you want to become a 655 00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:18,160 sovereign individual, you got to put in the work to become a 656 00:37:18,160 --> 00:37:20,920 sovereign individual and you got to you got to put in the 657 00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:23,240 research. So I think I'm really looking 658 00:37:23,240 --> 00:37:25,960 forward to that second in video, Nick, that you guys are going to 659 00:37:25,960 --> 00:37:28,720 come out with. I know June Seth has done a 660 00:37:28,720 --> 00:37:32,680 great job exposing some of these scammers as well. 661 00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:35,000 Do you want to chime in before we move on to the new side? 662 00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:37,000 Yeah, well, I was just going to really comment. 663 00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:40,160 I didn't watch Nick's video, but now I'm going to because the 664 00:37:40,160 --> 00:37:44,920 June Seth series was like incredible to listen and kind of 665 00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:48,840 get into the mind frame and, and the amount of bragging that that 666 00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:52,600 you heard on those and you know, they were just very cold blooded 667 00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:57,000 to say like put it lightly. And there is like a lot to learn 668 00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:59,280 from this. Obviously maybe you think that 669 00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:03,040 you are a super bitcoiner here and that it this could never 670 00:38:03,040 --> 00:38:06,120 happen to you, but they even get people that have been doing it 671 00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:08,280 for a while. And so it is very interesting to 672 00:38:08,280 --> 00:38:10,360 just hear how the social engineering happens. 673 00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:13,760 Obviously protecting yourself, but also kind of knowing how to 674 00:38:13,760 --> 00:38:15,480 protect your, your friends and your family. 675 00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:17,320 And I'm, I'm glad that Nick said that. 676 00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:20,120 You know that one thing that I know I do is I just literally 677 00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:21,480 don't pick up random phone number. 678 00:38:21,720 --> 00:38:23,560 I don't respond to random emails. 679 00:38:23,560 --> 00:38:27,280 It's like if it's there and even personally like knowing that I 680 00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:30,680 have a good self custody set up, you even start to feel like you, 681 00:38:30,720 --> 00:38:33,760 if you see those emails, you're like, oh, wait, did I leave 682 00:38:33,760 --> 00:38:36,120 something on there? Did you know, am I actually 683 00:38:36,120 --> 00:38:38,720 being at risk here? So even someone that does it 684 00:38:38,720 --> 00:38:41,920 correctly, you still feel that. And then imagine if you don't 685 00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:43,160 really understand what you're doing. 686 00:38:43,160 --> 00:38:47,320 So it's very easily to be socially engineered here, but it 687 00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:50,840 it's always, it's always very eye opening to see these or hear 688 00:38:50,840 --> 00:38:52,720 these recordings and see how they do it. 689 00:38:53,120 --> 00:38:55,360 And it's just incredible how much money people lose. 690 00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:58,760 And that's why we constantly try to tell you guys to take things 691 00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:02,280 slow, take things into self custody and really prepare 692 00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:03,880 yourself. So I'm super glad we brought 693 00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:08,320 this up, but that that thread by Zach XBT is crazy. 300 million 694 00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:10,760 plus like. That's crazy. 300 million a 695 00:39:10,840 --> 00:39:14,120 year, bro, a year, which is minimum, absolutely gnarly, 696 00:39:14,120 --> 00:39:16,720 gnarly and 65,000,000 the last two months alone. 697 00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:18,840 Anyways, guys, we're going to hit the news segment. 698 00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:22,480 We're going to talk about Bitcoin, your retirement, how 699 00:39:22,480 --> 00:39:25,160 you should custody that Bitcoin. We'll be right back. 700 00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:28,440 I want to give a. Shout out to our sponsor Casa. 701 00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:31,640 Bitcoin security matters, but managing private keys can 702 00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:34,000 sometimes be complicated, especially multi sig. 703 00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:37,280 What if you can secure your Bitcoin without worrying about 704 00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:39,800 losing a seed phrase or giving up custody? 705 00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:43,880 With Casa, you can completely control your Bitcoin with multi 706 00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:46,600 key security. So even if one key is lost or 707 00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:50,600 stolen, your funds stay safe. No single point of failure 708 00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:53,800 failure, no stress. That's what I absolutely love 709 00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:56,240 about these guys. They make taking Bitcoin into 710 00:39:56,240 --> 00:40:00,640 self custody incredibly easy with their best in industry user 711 00:40:00,640 --> 00:40:02,880 experience through their app. I've been personally 712 00:40:02,880 --> 00:40:06,360 recommending Casa for years now to my friends and family because 713 00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:09,800 they will get all the benefits of multi key self custody 714 00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:13,840 security without the hassle of having to learn complicated UI. 715 00:40:14,120 --> 00:40:16,920 And if you're thinking of one day passing on your Bitcoin to 716 00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:20,200 the next generation, their inheritance plan has you covered 717 00:40:20,240 --> 00:40:22,400 also. If you're a business looking to 718 00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:26,280 add Bitcoin to your treasury, do it the secure way with Casa. 719 00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:31,280 For business to get started, go to Casa dot IO today and get 5% 720 00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:35,560 off Casa Standard or Casa Premium with promo code simply. 721 00:40:43,520 --> 00:40:46,080 I want to give a shout out to our sponsor foundation. 722 00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:49,920 It's self custody done right. They built a premium grade 723 00:40:49,920 --> 00:40:53,560 hardware wallet called Passport right here in the US and it 724 00:40:53,560 --> 00:40:57,120 integrates seamlessly with their free app called Envoy. 725 00:40:57,600 --> 00:41:00,560 Passport is fully open source and verifiable. 726 00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:03,920 It's the most intuitive Bitcoin wallet designed with a UX 727 00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:07,400 reminiscent of a classic feature phone, so you'll know how to 728 00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:09,960 navigate it and use it the moment you pick it up. 729 00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:14,040 It's also air gaps, meaning Bitcoin stays offline, never 730 00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:17,640 touching an Internet connection. It's Bitcoin only open source, 731 00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:21,560 verifiable air gap security model, gorgeous design craft, 732 00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:25,320 premium grade materials. Get your Bitcoin off exchanges 733 00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:28,880 and into your own hands in just a few minutes with Passport at 734 00:41:28,880 --> 00:41:33,120 foundation dot XYZ slash. Simply get Peace of Mind for 735 00:41:33,120 --> 00:41:43,680 your piece of Bitcoin. All right, guys and FY yes, Casa 736 00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:48,280 is a partner and your passport is compatible with Casa because 737 00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:49,440 I know I'm going to get that question. 738 00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:51,360 So yeah, definitely check it out. 739 00:41:51,360 --> 00:41:55,480 I think the topic not I think the topic of today's news 740 00:41:55,480 --> 00:42:00,560 segment is why Bitcoin belongs in your retirement plan. 741 00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:04,560 There's a clip from legacy media and then I'm going to take a 742 00:42:04,560 --> 00:42:10,040 look or share the the website priced in Bitcoin 21 and of of 743 00:42:10,040 --> 00:42:13,960 course, Jimbo's calculator. When Moon given my Bitcoin 744 00:42:13,960 --> 00:42:17,400 stack, when can I retire anyway? So check out the clip 30. 5% of 745 00:42:17,400 --> 00:42:18,480 Americans felt like they were, that is. 746 00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:20,120 Way too fast. It comes to saving for 747 00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:21,800 retirement. Let's try that one more time. 748 00:42:22,200 --> 00:42:25,680 35% of Americans felt like they were significantly behind when 749 00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:27,720 it comes to saving for retirement. 750 00:42:27,920 --> 00:42:29,800 That's according to Bank Rates Retirement Survey. 751 00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:33,040 Now, one asset that you may not have considered adding to your 752 00:42:33,040 --> 00:42:37,000 retirement portfolio? Cryptocurrency joining me now in 753 00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:40,600 studio with more we've got Chris Klein who is the COO and Co 754 00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:43,920 founder of Bitcoin IRA. Chris, great to have you here in 755 00:42:43,920 --> 00:42:47,240 studio with us. Now you say that there are three 756 00:42:47,240 --> 00:42:50,040 things that typically draw investors to crypto. 757 00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:53,120 So let's start with asymmetry. Why is that appealing? 758 00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:56,960 So just getting yourself as a potential hedge against other 759 00:42:56,960 --> 00:43:00,080 problems in the marketplace. Also just getting off a zero and 760 00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:02,800 having an opportunity. This is a big shift in monetary 761 00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:05,280 policy that's happening. And for the first time in about 762 00:43:05,280 --> 00:43:07,760 100 years from the White House, we're getting an executive 763 00:43:07,760 --> 00:43:09,120 orders. They're saying, hey, this is 764 00:43:09,120 --> 00:43:11,680 time for national sovereignty and for individuals like 765 00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:13,840 yourself, individual sovereignty with your portfolio. 766 00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:16,800 You're also looking at this as an inflation hedge. 767 00:43:16,800 --> 00:43:19,680 That's part of the top three things that you're looking for 768 00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:22,560 and reasons why investors tend to turn to Bitcoin for 769 00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:24,880 retirement saving. Just break that down for us in 770 00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:27,440 the inflation hedge that Bitcoin could be for retirement. 771 00:43:27,440 --> 00:43:28,840 Savings. So it comes down to scarcity. 772 00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:31,680 There's only 21 million Bitcoin that'll ever exist. 19 and a 773 00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:33,360 half million of them are accounted for. 774 00:43:34,160 --> 00:43:36,600 We haven't seen this kind of scarcity since the 1920s, 775 00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:39,520 nineteen 30s. So to get there'll be a day 776 00:43:39,520 --> 00:43:42,200 where they'll say, wow, you're A1 Bitcoiner and it'll be a life 777 00:43:42,200 --> 00:43:44,000 changing experience for those folks. 778 00:43:44,680 --> 00:43:48,560 Interesting and said and lastly within that volatility and 779 00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:52,280 hedging against volatility, I mean Bitcoin and crypto more 780 00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:56,240 broadly initially and continue to be known as a more volatile 781 00:43:56,240 --> 00:43:59,200 asset. So how does having and gauging 782 00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:01,920 that volatility, how does that work within a retirement 783 00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:03,920 strategy? Well, you're more of a long term 784 00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:06,360 thinker or as we call a long term huddlers in the crypto 785 00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:08,240 space. So when you're in your 786 00:44:08,240 --> 00:44:11,000 retirement setting, you're thinking 35, maybe even 7 to 10 787 00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:13,240 years out. But volatility is a reality 788 00:44:13,240 --> 00:44:15,640 walking in and especially this year we're going to have price 789 00:44:15,640 --> 00:44:17,800 discovery. Tom Lee and others are calling 790 00:44:17,800 --> 00:44:20,320 for maybe 2 hundred $250,000 for a Bitcoin. 791 00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:25,280 We're sitting just around 102. So it's very interesting the way 792 00:44:25,280 --> 00:44:30,200 that the the anchor freight, the the anchor kind of phrased it in 793 00:44:30,200 --> 00:44:33,040 terms of, yeah, volatility, like volatility is a bad thing. 794 00:44:33,040 --> 00:44:36,400 Volatility is dangerous, volatility is negative. 795 00:44:37,040 --> 00:44:40,360 But if if you take a look at the data, that's why I love this 796 00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:47,080 website priced in Bitcoin 21, everything, the S&P 500, you 797 00:44:47,080 --> 00:44:50,120 know, even with housing prices doubling in the United States, 798 00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:55,680 gold, oil, everything is down against Bitcoin, especially the 799 00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:59,280 longer, the longer term view you look, you look at it like it, 800 00:44:59,320 --> 00:45:03,800 it's pretty crazy. Like even the S&P is down 77% 801 00:45:04,400 --> 00:45:10,400 compared to Bitcoin gold 94% a house 90% cheaper compared to 802 00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:13,520 Bitcoin oil, 94% cheaper. The dollar. 803 00:45:13,520 --> 00:45:15,840 I mean, we all know this. It's obvious. 804 00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:19,920 And I think that leads me to my, to my next question is Nick, 805 00:45:20,080 --> 00:45:23,480 what is, what is the role of Bitcoin in, in people's 806 00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:25,160 retirement? What, what, how should people 807 00:45:25,160 --> 00:45:29,760 look at Bitcoin and see in and see Bitcoin potentially as a 808 00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:33,320 tool to, you know, live the life they want to live in the future? 809 00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:38,280 And then my second question to that is how should they be 810 00:45:38,280 --> 00:45:43,160 storing that Bitcoin and how, how, what type of tools are 811 00:45:43,160 --> 00:45:47,400 there for them to potentially pass it on to the next 812 00:45:47,400 --> 00:45:49,080 generation in terms of inheritance? 813 00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:53,680 Yeah. So I think the the interest in 814 00:45:53,680 --> 00:45:57,000 the the guy in the video kind of eluded or said this. 815 00:45:57,000 --> 00:45:59,240 But the interesting thing about putting Bitcoin in a retirement 816 00:45:59,240 --> 00:46:02,920 account is you are necessarily just taking a very long term 817 00:46:02,920 --> 00:46:05,280 view on the assets in your retirement account. 818 00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:09,440 And most people just have kind of an auto buy going in their 819 00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:12,320 retirement account, right? Especially when you're a little 820 00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:15,920 bit younger, you're not planning to retire for maybe 30 years or 821 00:46:15,920 --> 00:46:18,840 so. So you just had, you're buying 822 00:46:20,280 --> 00:46:22,360 indexes, right? That's, that's what people 823 00:46:22,360 --> 00:46:24,840 historically have done. You just are always putting your 824 00:46:24,840 --> 00:46:27,000 money into Vanguard or whatever the index is. 825 00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:30,720 And what's interesting about it is like a lot of times when 826 00:46:30,720 --> 00:46:33,600 you're young, you're, you're starting out, you want you, 827 00:46:33,600 --> 00:46:35,240 you're taking this long term view. 828 00:46:35,240 --> 00:46:39,920 And so the, the Vanguard, you know, tools will suggest, Oh, 829 00:46:39,920 --> 00:46:46,200 you should have maybe 90% or more of your portfolio in 830 00:46:46,240 --> 00:46:50,840 equities and that's going to provide kind of the, the best, 831 00:46:51,080 --> 00:46:55,400 best return over a long period of time, as long as you're 832 00:46:55,400 --> 00:46:59,000 willing to weather some of these ups and downs where equity is 833 00:46:59,000 --> 00:47:00,960 more volatile. And then as you get older, it 834 00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:03,720 starts to suggest, oh, maybe you should have some bonds in here 835 00:47:03,720 --> 00:47:05,560 and stuff so you have less volatility. 836 00:47:05,560 --> 00:47:10,280 Well, Bitcoin is, is incredibly volatile as well or has been 837 00:47:10,280 --> 00:47:12,680 historically and we'll see what happens going forward. 838 00:47:12,680 --> 00:47:15,400 But it's been incredibly volatile. 839 00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:19,880 But for the people who have held over a long period of time, 840 00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:23,560 they've had immense long term gains, right. 841 00:47:23,920 --> 00:47:28,680 And so that mindset matches up very well for retirement 842 00:47:28,680 --> 00:47:31,000 accounts. And then you add on the fact 843 00:47:31,000 --> 00:47:33,480 that for certain types of retirement accounts, when you 844 00:47:33,800 --> 00:47:36,680 actually pull the money out, it can be tax free. 845 00:47:37,200 --> 00:47:39,760 All the gains, capital gains are tax free. 846 00:47:40,240 --> 00:47:45,160 And so this is a huge benefit for owning Bitcoin in a 847 00:47:45,160 --> 00:47:48,080 retirement account. So that's the first to answer 848 00:47:48,080 --> 00:47:50,440 the first question there, like why would you, why would you 849 00:47:50,440 --> 00:47:52,400 think about owning Bitcoin in a retirement account? 850 00:47:52,400 --> 00:47:55,640 And then the second one is how would you, how can you hold 851 00:47:55,640 --> 00:47:57,160 Bitcoin in your retirement account? 852 00:47:57,160 --> 00:48:01,200 I think the most basic way is if you're, if you've got kind of a 853 00:48:01,200 --> 00:48:06,840 classic 4O1K or something like that right now, your main option 854 00:48:06,840 --> 00:48:10,040 is the ETF for having Bitcoin in that account. 855 00:48:10,720 --> 00:48:15,040 There is also a less known type of account called a 856 00:48:15,040 --> 00:48:18,600 self-directed IRA. And with this you can actually 857 00:48:18,600 --> 00:48:21,720 self custody the Bitcoin that's in your IRA. 858 00:48:22,200 --> 00:48:25,360 And so there's certain limits on, you know, whether you can 859 00:48:25,360 --> 00:48:28,640 have that type of IRA or not, how much money you can put into 860 00:48:28,640 --> 00:48:32,320 it on an ongoing basis. But for people with that type of 861 00:48:32,320 --> 00:48:35,240 IRA, they can self custody their Bitcoin, which is great from a 862 00:48:35,240 --> 00:48:37,880 security perspective. And for the people who maybe 863 00:48:37,880 --> 00:48:41,040 have a four O 1K and don't have access to that, that 864 00:48:41,040 --> 00:48:44,720 self-directed IRA or have a really large balance sitting in 865 00:48:44,720 --> 00:48:47,480 a four O 1K already, and they want to move some of it into 866 00:48:47,480 --> 00:48:50,920 Bitcoin, generally the ETF is going to be the best vehicle for 867 00:48:50,920 --> 00:48:53,720 that, which I think is one of the the huge benefits of the 868 00:48:53,760 --> 00:48:57,160 ETFs coming to market. Like whereas overall I'm a big 869 00:48:57,160 --> 00:49:00,480 self custody advocate, right? That's where what we've built 870 00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:03,480 our whole company around. The ETF is great for some of 871 00:49:03,480 --> 00:49:06,200 these more restricted accounts like retirement accounts where 872 00:49:06,200 --> 00:49:10,600 you want the long term tax benefits but you weren't able to 873 00:49:10,600 --> 00:49:12,480 access Bitcoin through that before. 874 00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:15,520 Yeah. And and I I agree. 875 00:49:15,520 --> 00:49:19,560 And and I think the IT, it, it kind of the, it depends on, on 876 00:49:19,560 --> 00:49:22,200 the situation, right. Like if, if you're an older, if 877 00:49:22,200 --> 00:49:25,800 you're an older person, right, the ETF things look very, very 878 00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:28,280 appealing to you. You just go log into your 879 00:49:28,280 --> 00:49:31,360 Charles Schwab account, Bom, Bing bom boom, you know, you're 880 00:49:31,360 --> 00:49:34,120 buying Bitcoin. I think if, if, if you're 881 00:49:34,120 --> 00:49:37,520 younger, right, the, the whole self custody thing. 882 00:49:37,760 --> 00:49:39,880 I, I think there, there there's like a, there's like an 883 00:49:39,880 --> 00:49:41,920 ideological component to it as well. 884 00:49:41,920 --> 00:49:44,680 I think a lot of us lived through the 2008 financial 885 00:49:44,680 --> 00:49:47,960 crisis. We're not exactly fans of of the 886 00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:51,680 legacy financial system and I think self custody is our way of 887 00:49:51,680 --> 00:49:54,200 protesting. It's like a it's a very peaceful 888 00:49:54,200 --> 00:49:55,640 protest. It's basically saying like, 889 00:49:55,640 --> 00:49:58,560 look, I'm going to you guys could have fun with that. 890 00:49:58,640 --> 00:50:02,200 I'm going to opt out of the system entirely and I'm going to 891 00:50:02,200 --> 00:50:04,760 take custody of my keys. Opti, what are your thoughts 892 00:50:04,760 --> 00:50:06,160 brother? Yeah. 893 00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:09,080 Well, not to really rehash what Nick was saying because he, I 894 00:50:09,080 --> 00:50:11,360 think he absolutely hit the nail on the head. 895 00:50:11,800 --> 00:50:15,440 My more interesting take on this is the fact this is, this is 896 00:50:15,440 --> 00:50:18,680 even being played on the, you know, the corporate press right 897 00:50:18,680 --> 00:50:19,960 now. The fact that we've gotten to 898 00:50:19,960 --> 00:50:24,480 the point in 2025 where they're talking about Bitcoin being a 899 00:50:24,560 --> 00:50:28,760 form of wealth to retire on just goes to show how far we've kind 900 00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:31,000 of come in this whole Bitcoin journey. 901 00:50:31,160 --> 00:50:34,080 Because for a long time, anytime they talk about Bitcoin on the 902 00:50:34,080 --> 00:50:37,080 television, it was always either a speculative asset or, you 903 00:50:37,080 --> 00:50:39,600 know, it's for criminals, etcetera. 904 00:50:39,800 --> 00:50:41,680 And now we're getting to the point where they're like, hey, 905 00:50:41,960 --> 00:50:45,560 you know, boomers out there, you you might have never heard of 906 00:50:45,560 --> 00:50:48,320 this Bitcoin thing and it's the way for you to retire or 907 00:50:48,560 --> 00:50:51,520 obviously for us younger people and personally, you know, I 908 00:50:51,520 --> 00:50:54,000 don't have an IRA or a four O 1K. 909 00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:57,160 My retirement is Bitcoin. And so I am the living example 910 00:50:57,160 --> 00:50:58,680 of this. But it is interesting that 911 00:50:58,680 --> 00:51:00,680 they're getting this message out for more people where they're 912 00:51:00,680 --> 00:51:03,240 like, hey, maybe here's one thing that you haven't really 913 00:51:03,240 --> 00:51:05,960 considered. It is holding Bitcoin long term, 914 00:51:06,160 --> 00:51:09,720 like we were saying, you know, 7 to 10 years out holding Bitcoin, 915 00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:13,560 it will be your retirement. I, I think that is like the big 916 00:51:13,840 --> 00:51:16,640 silver lining here is that we've gotten to this point now where 917 00:51:16,640 --> 00:51:20,640 it's actually being taken seriously from the suits and 918 00:51:20,640 --> 00:51:22,120 the, you know, the smart money out there. 919 00:51:22,120 --> 00:51:24,880 They're like, hey, maybe this Bitcoin thing is something that 920 00:51:24,880 --> 00:51:26,320 you can retire on for the future. 921 00:51:26,320 --> 00:51:30,080 And I think that's only going to increase and probably by the end 922 00:51:30,080 --> 00:51:33,160 of this year, obviously by the next cycle, I think it's going 923 00:51:33,160 --> 00:51:37,080 to become very common knowledge that, hey, maybe you're going to 924 00:51:37,080 --> 00:51:40,320 get outsize gains by just holding Bitcoin versus putting 925 00:51:40,320 --> 00:51:44,280 money in a four O 1K or, you know, just a standard IRA and 926 00:51:44,280 --> 00:51:47,600 maybe you want to go to these Bitcoin Roth Iras, etcetera. 927 00:51:47,600 --> 00:51:50,760 And I think this is just how far we've come in the last couple 928 00:51:50,760 --> 00:51:53,640 years where Bitcoin is legitimized now, or at least at 929 00:51:53,640 --> 00:51:55,440 the very beginning of being legitimized. 930 00:51:55,440 --> 00:51:58,000 That's something that you want to hold long term that you can 931 00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:00,760 live on for the rest of your life and that will be there for 932 00:52:00,760 --> 00:52:04,000 you when things are uncertain. Especially when you kind of look 933 00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:07,960 at the outsize gains for Bitcoin compared to a standard, you 934 00:52:07,960 --> 00:52:11,120 know, 4 O 1K or just holding stocks, etcetera, and all the 935 00:52:11,120 --> 00:52:13,720 crazy uncertainties in the world right now. 936 00:52:14,520 --> 00:52:16,920 I'm super glad we've got to this point now where they're at least 937 00:52:16,920 --> 00:52:19,360 starting to talk about Bitcoin in the way that we've talked 938 00:52:19,360 --> 00:52:22,440 about it. And now it's seemingly becoming 939 00:52:22,440 --> 00:52:25,640 that every corporate press out there will eventually become a 940 00:52:25,720 --> 00:52:28,880 Bitcoin propaganda machine. So I am super hyped on that. 941 00:52:29,480 --> 00:52:33,000 Absolutely, Absolutely. Before we move on, guys, I, I do 942 00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:36,000 want to show you something that's a fan favorite here at 943 00:52:36,000 --> 00:52:39,960 simply Bitcoin, which is Jimbo's moon calculator. 944 00:52:39,960 --> 00:52:43,240 So we'll pull it up and I'll, I'll, I'll essentially explain 945 00:52:43,240 --> 00:52:45,160 to Nick what it is. Essentially, Nick, this is like 946 00:52:45,160 --> 00:52:48,920 an open source like code that a buddy of ours wrote. 947 00:52:49,160 --> 00:52:54,400 And essentially it's when moon a given my Bitcoin stack, when can 948 00:52:54,400 --> 00:52:57,640 I retire? What what what is a fan favorite 949 00:52:57,640 --> 00:53:01,240 here is people will plug in numbers, so I'll pass it on to 950 00:53:01,240 --> 00:53:05,080 you. Just hypothetically, of course, 951 00:53:05,960 --> 00:53:11,160 you know went what is the just for the sake of the show your 952 00:53:11,160 --> 00:53:15,840 stack size in BTC. Just an example point 5.1. 953 00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:18,480 I never revealed this, so I'm going to leave it at the default 954 00:53:18,480 --> 00:53:21,880 one. I didn't ask you for your actual 955 00:53:21,880 --> 00:53:25,480 stocks, I just just just for the audience as an example. 956 00:53:25,480 --> 00:53:28,720 I don't know, let's, let's see what what's what's the new goals 957 00:53:28,720 --> 00:53:32,840 here in 2025 for Bitcoin? I've been seeing what is it 10 958 00:53:32,840 --> 00:53:36,640 million sets point 1.21. Should we do .1 OK? 959 00:53:37,160 --> 00:53:39,800 Or maybe no, let's do .5 do half a coin. 960 00:53:39,920 --> 00:53:41,760 Have someone new here, do you agree? 961 00:53:41,760 --> 00:53:43,080 Are we going with half a coin that? 962 00:53:43,200 --> 00:53:46,000 Sounds great, yeah. Half a coin, All right, your 963 00:53:46,000 --> 00:53:48,760 desired income in today's dollars. 964 00:53:51,720 --> 00:53:55,360 I mean, I'm assuming when I retire I won't be supporting 965 00:53:55,360 --> 00:54:00,400 kids or anything like that and we'll won't be living like too 966 00:54:00,400 --> 00:54:03,160 crazy of a life. So let's say the desired income 967 00:54:03,160 --> 00:54:07,080 needed necessary income for like me and my wife is probably let's 968 00:54:07,080 --> 00:54:10,320 call it 100K or something. Under K Boom. 969 00:54:10,640 --> 00:54:13,240 Although with inflation by that point, maybe it's got to be a 970 00:54:13,240 --> 00:54:14,920 million. It's in today's dollars. 971 00:54:14,920 --> 00:54:17,560 In today's dollars. As today's dollars and then it 972 00:54:17,560 --> 00:54:21,640 asks you what the annual USD supply increase, So what the 973 00:54:21,640 --> 00:54:23,960 what the inflation? Rate fan favorite part. 974 00:54:24,120 --> 00:54:25,440 Yeah. All right. 975 00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:28,240 So what's What's the annual US inflation? 976 00:54:28,480 --> 00:54:29,960 Yeah. What what do you think it is 977 00:54:29,960 --> 00:54:32,640 that's that's basically the question that we always kind of 978 00:54:32,640 --> 00:54:35,600 pose to the audience. We have what what's the official 979 00:54:35,600 --> 00:54:38,600 numbers is right. Three percent, 3%. 980 00:54:39,200 --> 00:54:41,880 We all. Think it's a little higher. 8. 981 00:54:43,280 --> 00:54:46,760 8% all right. And now I think this is like the 982 00:54:46,840 --> 00:54:49,720 the biggest, the biggest, the biggest factor here. 983 00:54:50,080 --> 00:54:53,480 What do you think is going to be the annual Bitcoin appreciation 984 00:54:53,480 --> 00:54:54,840 rate, Nick? Yeah. 985 00:54:54,840 --> 00:55:01,000 So I think, I think we've got one more set of like pretty big 986 00:55:01,000 --> 00:55:05,600 leg UPS from from like a big burst in adoption like at the 987 00:55:05,600 --> 00:55:07,440 government level and that kind of thing. 988 00:55:07,840 --> 00:55:11,240 And then it's going to become more steady. 989 00:55:11,640 --> 00:55:18,080 So I would say I'd put this how long is this supposed to be? 990 00:55:18,080 --> 00:55:19,880 Or it's calculating the number of days so. 991 00:55:20,280 --> 00:55:24,040 Yeah, it's basically saying like, look, with .5 a hundred, 992 00:55:24,120 --> 00:55:27,680 you want 100,000. The annual The annual inflation 993 00:55:27,680 --> 00:55:34,560 rate is 8 percent 45. OK, that's 35 No 45. 45 Oh, I 994 00:55:34,600 --> 00:55:35,600 like. That on the chat, Nico. 995 00:55:36,000 --> 00:55:40,080 For I like that. OK, So the the personal moon 996 00:55:40,080 --> 00:55:44,600 date for someone who has 505 hundred million, Yeah. 997 00:55:44,600 --> 00:55:49,120 Is it 50 million sacks? Yeah, yeah, yeah, 50 million 998 00:55:49,120 --> 00:55:52,400 sats. Your personal moon date would be 999 00:55:53,240 --> 00:55:56,840 2031. That's when you'd be able to 1000 00:55:56,840 --> 00:55:59,080 start withdrawing from your stack. 1001 00:55:59,400 --> 00:56:01,960 And this is assuming also that you're not going to add to your 1002 00:56:01,960 --> 00:56:07,160 stack as well with it with the desired annual income of 100K 1003 00:56:08,520 --> 00:56:13,160 and you'll be able to essentially retire at 2031, 1004 00:56:13,160 --> 00:56:16,280 you'll be able to start withdrawing from that .5 1005 00:56:16,280 --> 00:56:18,440 Bitcoin. That's why I absolutely love 1006 00:56:18,680 --> 00:56:21,520 this calculator. It's a huge fan favorite. 1007 00:56:21,520 --> 00:56:23,720 It's completely open source. You guys could plug in the 1008 00:56:23,720 --> 00:56:26,520 numbers there are we? Sure this website isn't run by 1009 00:56:26,520 --> 00:56:32,000 the IRS well. This is why we say don't plug in 1010 00:56:32,000 --> 00:56:34,640 your numbers. Yeah, hypothetical numbers. 1011 00:56:34,640 --> 00:56:36,080 Exactly, exactly. This is. 1012 00:56:36,080 --> 00:56:39,520 This is all hypothetical. This is what the chat is asking 1013 00:56:39,520 --> 00:56:42,240 for. You know, this is all just for 1014 00:56:42,240 --> 00:56:46,360 the sake of a example and, you know, having fun and all that. 1015 00:56:46,360 --> 00:56:48,520 So yeah, guys, go check out Wen Moon. 1016 00:56:48,560 --> 00:56:51,600 It's a fan favorite from Simply. You drop the link in the chat, 1017 00:56:51,600 --> 00:56:53,520 people are asking for it. Absolutely. 1018 00:56:53,920 --> 00:56:58,440 And let's also let's get on to the culture and we're going to 1019 00:56:58,440 --> 00:57:04,000 talk about Casa and how you guys could use Casa as a self custody 1020 00:57:04,000 --> 00:57:07,520 solution. They make multi sig incredibly 1021 00:57:07,520 --> 00:57:09,640 easy. I've been recommending them to 1022 00:57:09,640 --> 00:57:13,040 friends and family for a very, very long time now, so we're 1023 00:57:13,040 --> 00:57:14,520 going. To talk about all that during 1024 00:57:14,520 --> 00:57:17,040 the culture segment, we will be right back. 1025 00:57:17,760 --> 00:57:20,880 I want to give a shout out to our sponsor Hive Digital 1026 00:57:20,880 --> 00:57:24,040 Technologies. As the first ever public miner, 1027 00:57:24,160 --> 00:57:27,760 Hive's been battle tested through every possible market 1028 00:57:27,960 --> 00:57:32,680 and as the first with an AI strategy, Hive continues to 1029 00:57:32,680 --> 00:57:35,680 redefine the future of sustainable energy. 1030 00:57:35,800 --> 00:57:38,080 Also got to casually drop this in here. 1031 00:57:38,480 --> 00:57:43,000 Hive consistently tops the industry in Bitcoin mine, per 1032 00:57:43,160 --> 00:57:45,560 Exahash. They're lean and mean, they're 1033 00:57:45,560 --> 00:57:48,480 green and clean, and they're changing the game. 1034 00:57:48,680 --> 00:57:52,440 Learn more by following them at Hive Digital Tech or check out 1035 00:57:52,440 --> 00:57:55,720 their website hivedigitaltech.com. 1036 00:58:03,320 --> 00:58:07,160 I want to give a very special shout out to our sponsor Compass 1037 00:58:07,200 --> 00:58:09,280 Mining. They make Bitcoin mining 1038 00:58:09,320 --> 00:58:13,160 accessible to everyone from beginners to experienced 1039 00:58:13,160 --> 00:58:16,080 investors. Their turn key miners gets you 1040 00:58:16,160 --> 00:58:20,480 online and hashing within 48 hours, making it easier than 1041 00:58:20,480 --> 00:58:22,720 ever to start your mining journey. 1042 00:58:23,280 --> 00:58:26,640 Plus, with their active marketplace, you can resell your 1043 00:58:26,640 --> 00:58:30,560 miner at any time, adding flexibility and value to your 1044 00:58:30,560 --> 00:58:33,400 investment. Visit their website to access a 1045 00:58:33,560 --> 00:58:36,720 wealth of resources, learning everything you need to know 1046 00:58:36,720 --> 00:58:40,160 about Bitcoin mining. Take your first step into the 1047 00:58:40,160 --> 00:58:42,760 world of Bitcoin mining with confidence. 1048 00:58:42,880 --> 00:58:45,840 Discover more at Compass Mining dot IO. 1049 00:58:45,920 --> 00:58:51,040 Again, Compass Mining dot IO and see how Compass Mining can power 1050 00:58:51,120 --> 00:58:57,320 your success. All right, everybody, so let's 1051 00:58:57,960 --> 00:58:59,960 let's talk about Casa. Let's talk about all things 1052 00:58:59,960 --> 00:59:02,920 Casa. Like I said, huge fan of this 1053 00:59:02,920 --> 00:59:04,840 company. You've been been a huge fan of 1054 00:59:04,840 --> 00:59:08,400 this company for a very long time because I am essentially 1055 00:59:08,400 --> 00:59:11,480 the de facto Uncle Jim for my entire family. 1056 00:59:12,440 --> 00:59:16,040 And obviously I want my entire family taking self custody of 1057 00:59:16,040 --> 00:59:19,600 their Bitcoin. And I think Casa allows you to 1058 00:59:19,600 --> 00:59:25,440 do that without all of the I, I would say the UI complexities. 1059 00:59:25,440 --> 00:59:31,320 I think the UI is is I think the UI have a lot of Bitcoin 1060 00:59:31,320 --> 00:59:35,920 software for you know, I don't want to I don't want to specify 1061 00:59:35,920 --> 00:59:38,680 a specific demographic, but let's just say people that 1062 00:59:39,040 --> 00:59:42,280 aren't living and breathing Bitcoin, they aren't on Bitcoin 1063 00:59:42,280 --> 00:59:45,360 Twitter 24/7. They aren't consuming Bitcoin 1064 00:59:45,360 --> 00:59:48,720 podcast 24/7. They're just trying to get by, 1065 00:59:48,760 --> 00:59:53,280 you know, like my parents, like my, like my immediate family. 1066 00:59:53,360 --> 00:59:56,160 You know, this is the app that I recommend for them because 1067 00:59:56,160 --> 01:00:01,320 obviously I want them to have the security of multi sig. 1068 01:00:01,880 --> 01:00:05,880 But I also don't want them to essentially get so in over their 1069 01:00:05,880 --> 01:00:09,920 heads in terms of their setup that they can't access their 1070 01:00:09,920 --> 01:00:11,120 Bitcoin. Because that's another thing 1071 01:00:11,120 --> 01:00:13,880 that people forget about Bitcoin and security. 1072 01:00:14,280 --> 01:00:18,400 It's not how you can make 2 mistakes. 1073 01:00:18,480 --> 01:00:21,800 You can make your security so sophisticated that you yourself 1074 01:00:21,800 --> 01:00:25,240 lose access to your Bitcoin and then you can make your your 1075 01:00:25,240 --> 01:00:28,120 security so weak that you know your Bitcoin gets hacked. 1076 01:00:28,240 --> 01:00:31,720 You want that happy medium right and I think that's what you guys 1077 01:00:31,720 --> 01:00:35,040 do incredibly, incredibly well. Nick over Acosta, especially 1078 01:00:35,040 --> 01:00:38,520 with the UI that you guys have with the app that you guys have, 1079 01:00:39,040 --> 01:00:42,200 it makes it incredibly easy for someone to set up a multi sig 1080 01:00:42,200 --> 01:00:47,200 wallet without them really needing a lot of technical know 1081 01:00:47,200 --> 01:00:49,800 how it's it's it's really straightforward. 1082 01:00:50,480 --> 01:00:55,560 The emails that people get the you know, the the you can you 1083 01:00:55,560 --> 01:00:58,560 connect your Ledger, the with the with the passport. 1084 01:00:58,560 --> 01:01:00,560 It's awesome. Now you don't even have to 1085 01:01:00,560 --> 01:01:03,760 connect it to a computer. You can just do you can just, 1086 01:01:04,000 --> 01:01:08,240 you know, use the camera feature and scan the QR code just from 1087 01:01:08,240 --> 01:01:09,920 the phone. You don't even have to connect 1088 01:01:09,920 --> 01:01:13,400 it to a computer anymore. You guys do a really really good 1089 01:01:13,400 --> 01:01:19,280 job at making multi sig incredibly easy for the everyday 1090 01:01:19,280 --> 01:01:22,720 person that wants to benefit from multi sig security. 1091 01:01:23,480 --> 01:01:25,440 Thank you. Yeah, that's the that's the 1092 01:01:25,440 --> 01:01:27,640 goal, right? When we, when we created Casa, 1093 01:01:27,640 --> 01:01:30,440 we realized it was just too hard to hold your own keys. 1094 01:01:30,440 --> 01:01:34,240 People were doing all these crazy things to try and make it 1095 01:01:34,240 --> 01:01:37,080 safer. And we recognize that there is a 1096 01:01:37,080 --> 01:01:43,600 huge need to just give people a basic like balanced, really 1097 01:01:43,600 --> 01:01:47,520 robust security model where we walk them through end to end. 1098 01:01:47,520 --> 01:01:51,360 Here's how you do it in a well designed way and get as many 1099 01:01:51,440 --> 01:01:56,480 Bitcoiners as possible secure. And so it's been a ton of fun to 1100 01:01:56,480 --> 01:02:00,440 build over the last six years. Now we've been around for quite 1101 01:02:00,440 --> 01:02:04,280 a long time and I think really built up a lot of trust and in 1102 01:02:04,280 --> 01:02:08,280 the community for for doing a good job securing a lot of 1103 01:02:08,280 --> 01:02:11,920 Bitcoin. So this is something that like, 1104 01:02:12,360 --> 01:02:15,600 if you think about it, the main goal of what we do is just 1105 01:02:15,600 --> 01:02:19,360 remove single points of failure. So remove the single point of 1106 01:02:19,360 --> 01:02:22,760 failure of your Coinbase account getting social engineered, 1107 01:02:22,760 --> 01:02:27,240 remove the single point of failure of a treasure or a 1108 01:02:27,280 --> 01:02:30,560 mobile wallet or something like that, that could be wrench 1109 01:02:30,560 --> 01:02:33,640 attacked. Remove the single pointed 1110 01:02:33,640 --> 01:02:37,520 failure of the what happens if your house burns down, which 1111 01:02:37,520 --> 01:02:40,360 we've actually had happen. And so there's a lot of these 1112 01:02:40,480 --> 01:02:43,400 different potential things that can happen when you self 1113 01:02:43,400 --> 01:02:45,400 custody. And, and what we do is try to 1114 01:02:45,400 --> 01:02:49,680 build a a system that helps you protect yourself against all 1115 01:02:49,680 --> 01:02:53,840 these different things without having to put in hours and hours 1116 01:02:53,840 --> 01:02:57,200 of work yourself to understand and figure out how to do it. 1117 01:02:59,040 --> 01:03:01,640 Absolutely. And I just kind of want to walk 1118 01:03:01,640 --> 01:03:05,280 through a lot of this, right. So is it cost a standard plan? 1119 01:03:06,040 --> 01:03:10,640 And then if you compare that to like a single sig set up, right, 1120 01:03:11,400 --> 01:03:13,040 it protects you from accidental loss. 1121 01:03:13,040 --> 01:03:15,440 How? Because cost actually holds one 1122 01:03:15,440 --> 01:03:17,360 of the keys in the two of three set up. 1123 01:03:17,520 --> 01:03:20,200 So essentially you're responsible for two of the three 1124 01:03:20,200 --> 01:03:22,800 keys. If you lose one of those keys, 1125 01:03:22,800 --> 01:03:27,000 you can always go to Casa and they'll sign that transaction 1126 01:03:27,000 --> 01:03:28,920 for you. But I think there's a security 1127 01:03:28,920 --> 01:03:32,600 protocol, I think it's seven days, I believe before you guys 1128 01:03:32,680 --> 01:03:35,320 sign off on, on that transaction. 1129 01:03:36,520 --> 01:03:41,920 So again, this is like, and this has happened to me without 1130 01:03:41,920 --> 01:03:45,400 getting into any specifics, but this has happened to me with 1131 01:03:45,400 --> 01:03:50,880 family members where I set them up on Casa on one of the two 1132 01:03:50,880 --> 01:03:54,360 plans and they lose a key and they freak out. 1133 01:03:54,360 --> 01:03:57,800 They're like like I lost the key and I'm like, no, don't worry 1134 01:03:58,080 --> 01:04:01,360 because through the app with that that you guys have, it 1135 01:04:01,360 --> 01:04:04,200 actually makes replacing a key incredibly easy. 1136 01:04:04,200 --> 01:04:05,440 You don't really have to do anything. 1137 01:04:05,440 --> 01:04:10,240 You just plug in the new Ledger and it just replaces the key. 1138 01:04:10,240 --> 01:04:13,200 I don't know some magic is happening in the back end, but 1139 01:04:13,200 --> 01:04:16,400 it essentially this is, I don't want to say idiot proof, but 1140 01:04:16,400 --> 01:04:19,920 like you guys are making it really, really difficult for 1141 01:04:19,920 --> 01:04:23,200 people to lose their Bitcoin the way that the cost app. 1142 01:04:23,200 --> 01:04:26,120 Yeah, you gotta, you gotta mess up multiple times, right? 1143 01:04:26,320 --> 01:04:30,360 And so you have to like stack mistakes on top of each other, 1144 01:04:30,360 --> 01:04:33,720 which is, which is what we're trying to do because security's 1145 01:04:33,720 --> 01:04:35,960 never going to be perfect, right? 1146 01:04:35,960 --> 01:04:40,400 Like there, it's always this dance between the threats and 1147 01:04:40,400 --> 01:04:42,800 the protect and the protection against those threats. 1148 01:04:43,200 --> 01:04:46,720 And So what you're trying to do is just build like layers of 1149 01:04:46,720 --> 01:04:51,680 security and hope that if one of those layers fails, then you've 1150 01:04:51,680 --> 01:04:55,040 got this second layer that can still help you, you know, 1151 01:04:55,040 --> 01:04:56,560 recover funds, that kind of thing. 1152 01:04:56,560 --> 01:05:00,760 And so like AI think a good example of this is we actually 1153 01:05:00,760 --> 01:05:06,520 had a client whose house burned down recently and he had a key 1154 01:05:06,520 --> 01:05:10,200 and a seed phrase backup stored in the part of his house that 1155 01:05:10,200 --> 01:05:11,560 burned down. Luckily it wasn't the whole 1156 01:05:11,560 --> 01:05:13,280 house. It was like a segment of it. 1157 01:05:13,800 --> 01:05:17,440 And normally you'd be freaking out about this, right? 1158 01:05:17,440 --> 01:05:21,080 Because you've lost the seed phrase, you've lost the hardware 1159 01:05:21,080 --> 01:05:23,520 wallet, that's all of your money gone. 1160 01:05:23,960 --> 01:05:28,400 And what actually happened was he just called us and said, hey, 1161 01:05:28,720 --> 01:05:30,760 lost one of my keys, can you send me a new one? 1162 01:05:31,000 --> 01:05:34,000 And we sent him a new one. We replaced the key and then 1163 01:05:34,000 --> 01:05:38,080 he's back to full health. And so whether you're using Casa 1164 01:05:38,080 --> 01:05:42,000 or not, you want to think about ways that you can add these like 1165 01:05:42,000 --> 01:05:45,920 extra layers of redundancy and security into your overall setup 1166 01:05:45,920 --> 01:05:47,880 because that will make you more secure. 1167 01:05:48,200 --> 01:05:50,760 So like on the social engineering side, for example, 1168 01:05:50,760 --> 01:05:55,200 whether you're using Casa or or not, you want to make sure that 1169 01:05:55,400 --> 01:05:58,480 for your main Bitcoin stash that you aren't planning to do 1170 01:05:58,480 --> 01:06:01,360 anything with except for hold for a long period of time. 1171 01:06:01,360 --> 01:06:05,720 You want to make sure you can't access that immediately, right? 1172 01:06:05,720 --> 01:06:09,560 So even if somebody were to call you and try to trick you into 1173 01:06:09,600 --> 01:06:12,240 sending them your Bitcoin, you're like, hey, I got to hang 1174 01:06:12,240 --> 01:06:16,240 up and go drive to this other place or maybe fly to this other 1175 01:06:16,240 --> 01:06:20,280 place in order to get my keys in order to send you this Bitcoin. 1176 01:06:20,600 --> 01:06:24,360 That suddenly puts you above the threshold of like too much 1177 01:06:24,360 --> 01:06:27,200 difficulty. And so then they move on to 1178 01:06:27,200 --> 01:06:29,760 somebody else. So it's all about adding these 1179 01:06:29,760 --> 01:06:33,640 layers of security into your setup, whether you're using Casa 1180 01:06:33,640 --> 01:06:36,680 or not. Absolutely no, I completely 1181 01:06:36,680 --> 01:06:39,800 agree. And again like it's all about 1182 01:06:39,800 --> 01:06:43,040 redundancy, right. And the other plan that you guys 1183 01:06:43,960 --> 01:06:47,720 offer as well is the premium, which is essentially a three of 1184 01:06:47,720 --> 01:06:50,960 five. But essentially it really does 1185 01:06:50,960 --> 01:06:54,600 feel like a two of three just because the mobile key, the 1186 01:06:54,600 --> 01:06:59,000 signing process of it is like pretty seamless in terms of how 1187 01:06:59,000 --> 01:07:02,840 it feels from a user experience. But essentially you have three, 1188 01:07:02,840 --> 01:07:06,600 you have, yeah, you have 3 keys, hardware wallet keys that that 1189 01:07:06,600 --> 01:07:08,720 you want to obviously take care of. 1190 01:07:09,160 --> 01:07:13,480 And you have a mobile key. So one of the keys is on your 1191 01:07:13,520 --> 01:07:17,920 phone and it is backed up to the iCloud or the Google equivalent. 1192 01:07:17,920 --> 01:07:22,840 I don't know what that's called. So you can essentially transfer 1193 01:07:22,840 --> 01:07:25,640 it from 1 phone to the other. And then of course, you have the 1194 01:07:25,640 --> 01:07:29,440 recovery key that Casa holds and it's a three of five. 1195 01:07:29,440 --> 01:07:33,960 So you need 3 signatures out of five in order for you to spend 1196 01:07:33,960 --> 01:07:36,160 that Bitcoin. But what's really awesome about 1197 01:07:36,160 --> 01:07:40,680 this type of setup is the you could do this with the two of 1198 01:07:40,680 --> 01:07:42,920 three as well with the standard plan. 1199 01:07:43,200 --> 01:07:47,280 But you can really get very clever in terms of where you're 1200 01:07:47,280 --> 01:07:50,400 going to put the keys and stuff. And you guys, you know, come up 1201 01:07:50,400 --> 01:07:53,480 with different names in terms of there's one key in the office, 1202 01:07:53,480 --> 01:07:57,080 there's one key at home, there's one key in the safe, right? 1203 01:07:57,800 --> 01:08:00,080 And, and that allows you essentially to spread out your 1204 01:08:00,080 --> 01:08:03,760 keys over various locations. Not only does that protect you 1205 01:08:03,760 --> 01:08:07,200 from a $5 wrench attack, but that also protects you from 1206 01:08:07,200 --> 01:08:09,520 natural disasters. I mean, what happened in Los 1207 01:08:09,520 --> 01:08:15,040 Angeles recently with the fires so, so bad and it, you know, 1208 01:08:15,040 --> 01:08:17,279 terrible. And actually, we, we know 1209 01:08:17,279 --> 01:08:19,680 Bitcoiners that their homes burned down. 1210 01:08:19,680 --> 01:08:22,439 Like we know Bitcoiners whose homes have burned down. 1211 01:08:22,720 --> 01:08:27,479 So having your keys, your seeds in different, different 1212 01:08:27,479 --> 01:08:32,920 locations protects you not only from the like the $5 rent 1213 01:08:32,920 --> 01:08:36,520 attack, but also protects you from from natural disasters as 1214 01:08:36,520 --> 01:08:38,319 well. Like you never know, Like did 1215 01:08:38,319 --> 01:08:41,560 you think that was going to happen in in a very populated 1216 01:08:41,560 --> 01:08:43,720 part of Los Angeles? Like no one knew that was going 1217 01:08:43,720 --> 01:08:47,840 to happen, right. And again, it also gives you the 1218 01:08:47,840 --> 01:08:53,479 flexibility of losing one of those keys and not losing access 1219 01:08:53,479 --> 01:08:55,520 to your Bitcoin, right? So I think that's really 1220 01:08:55,520 --> 01:08:58,080 important as well. Now, I think the question that I 1221 01:08:58,080 --> 01:09:01,840 have for you, Nick, is can you talk to us a little bit about 1222 01:09:02,040 --> 01:09:04,439 like Casas holding one of the keys? 1223 01:09:04,760 --> 01:09:07,319 What can they do? What, what could you guys do 1224 01:09:07,319 --> 01:09:09,760 with one of those keys? I think a lot of people maybe 1225 01:09:09,760 --> 01:09:12,040 they like they just don't understand the technicalities of 1226 01:09:12,040 --> 01:09:16,600 it. And what are you doing to ensure 1227 01:09:16,600 --> 01:09:18,560 the security of those keys as well? 1228 01:09:18,760 --> 01:09:23,200 So in case someone does lose two of those 5 keys and they they 1229 01:09:23,200 --> 01:09:26,399 want to have access to your Bitcoin, how can they know for 1230 01:09:26,399 --> 01:09:28,200 certain that they can rely on you guys? 1231 01:09:28,680 --> 01:09:31,760 Yeah. So the first thing to know is 1232 01:09:31,760 --> 01:09:36,720 that Casa doesn't KYC some of the other multi sig options out 1233 01:09:36,720 --> 01:09:41,080 there, they KYC you as part of the overall solution and we 1234 01:09:41,080 --> 01:09:44,040 don't do that. So you can sign up completely 1235 01:09:44,040 --> 01:09:48,399 anonymously, like you can make a alias for your ProtonMail 1236 01:09:48,399 --> 01:09:51,319 address if you want to, you can pay us in Bitcoin. 1237 01:09:51,319 --> 01:09:54,120 So we don't have any information from credit cards. 1238 01:09:54,120 --> 01:09:58,760 Like you can be as private or as not private with us as you want. 1239 01:09:58,880 --> 01:10:02,080 And that's we're following the law completely by doing this 1240 01:10:02,080 --> 01:10:05,000 right. And so we have really built our 1241 01:10:05,000 --> 01:10:11,400 business in a privacy first way. So you can first know KYC with 1242 01:10:11,400 --> 01:10:13,920 us and then second, how do we use that key? 1243 01:10:13,920 --> 01:10:17,000 Well, one of the the interesting things is like, all right, we 1244 01:10:17,000 --> 01:10:19,400 haven't KYC Ed you. So how do we make sure that it's 1245 01:10:19,400 --> 01:10:21,320 actually you requesting this key? 1246 01:10:21,760 --> 01:10:24,840 And part of the way we do that is we build in time. 1247 01:10:25,240 --> 01:10:28,400 So at our standard plan, if you request that key, you're going 1248 01:10:28,400 --> 01:10:31,760 to answer some security questions and then it's a seven 1249 01:10:31,760 --> 01:10:35,920 day wait before we sign the transaction or approve the 1250 01:10:35,920 --> 01:10:39,880 transaction with our key, which still is just one of the keys 1251 01:10:39,880 --> 01:10:41,360 that you need. You're going to have to bring 1252 01:10:41,360 --> 01:10:45,880 some amount of your keys, right? So at the standard level, it's a 1253 01:10:45,880 --> 01:10:48,600 seven day wait. At the premium or above level, 1254 01:10:48,840 --> 01:10:51,760 it's a 2 day wait. And instead of a, a security 1255 01:10:51,760 --> 01:10:54,680 questions, we actually do a video call with you to make sure 1256 01:10:54,680 --> 01:10:57,680 you're not under duress. You know, everything's OK. 1257 01:10:58,640 --> 01:11:02,760 And you actually did ask us to, to use our key to help you move 1258 01:11:02,760 --> 01:11:05,920 Bitcoin. So this is we built all these 1259 01:11:05,920 --> 01:11:08,480 kind of security procedures around here to, to keep it 1260 01:11:08,480 --> 01:11:11,960 private while also keeping it very secure to use that key. 1261 01:11:12,520 --> 01:11:16,440 And then the second thing you're asking about is just how do 1262 01:11:16,440 --> 01:11:19,120 people know that we've got that key secured? 1263 01:11:19,360 --> 01:11:23,120 And while I don't go into like the specifics of how this key is 1264 01:11:23,120 --> 01:11:27,600 secured, it's backed up in multiple geographies offline, 1265 01:11:27,720 --> 01:11:29,960 you know, and it's never been on the Internet. 1266 01:11:29,960 --> 01:11:33,680 It's not a hot key, it's a total cold key that requires a person 1267 01:11:34,400 --> 01:11:38,520 to actually go and use it. And so we've put all these all 1268 01:11:38,520 --> 01:11:42,320 the best possible protections around this key to make sure 1269 01:11:42,320 --> 01:11:45,640 that you've, you have, you can count on Casa, right? 1270 01:11:46,920 --> 01:11:50,320 That being said, let's say something were to happen to the 1271 01:11:50,320 --> 01:11:53,360 Casa key. We've designed Casa in a way 1272 01:11:53,360 --> 01:11:59,360 that you are not actually reliant on Casa being around or 1273 01:11:59,520 --> 01:12:02,720 being able to sign with our key or anything like that, right, 1274 01:12:02,720 --> 01:12:06,440 Because it's just one key out of your multi sick, you hold the 1275 01:12:06,440 --> 01:12:10,280 majority of your keys. And so we're removing single 1276 01:12:10,280 --> 01:12:14,040 points of failure and that includes Casa ourselves. 1277 01:12:14,520 --> 01:12:16,840 So that that's a bit about the Casa key. 1278 01:12:16,840 --> 01:12:19,480 And I think it's, it's an important part of people set up 1279 01:12:19,480 --> 01:12:22,640 because they know they can count on us, but it's also a really 1280 01:12:22,640 --> 01:12:24,600 critical part of the inheritance set up. 1281 01:12:25,000 --> 01:12:29,040 We use that to help people's beneficiaries actually recover 1282 01:12:29,040 --> 01:12:33,760 Bitcoin in case they pass away. And so that that additional like 1283 01:12:33,760 --> 01:12:37,600 kind of trusted security point with us has been really 1284 01:12:37,600 --> 01:12:39,320 beneficial for people using Casa. 1285 01:12:40,160 --> 01:12:43,400 And let me ask you to let me ask you another question, Nick, that 1286 01:12:43,400 --> 01:12:45,360 perhaps isn't obvious to the audience. 1287 01:12:45,360 --> 01:12:48,960 By the way, shout out to the 2700 of you guys watching live 1288 01:12:48,960 --> 01:12:52,320 right now, 450 of you guys watching live on YouTube, 1289 01:12:52,560 --> 01:12:57,720 roughly 100 of you guys watching live on Rumble and 2256 of you 1290 01:12:57,720 --> 01:12:59,920 guys watching live on X. If you guys are enjoying the 1291 01:12:59,920 --> 01:13:03,000 show so far, smash the like button. 1292 01:13:03,280 --> 01:13:08,720 Nick, I think second to final question is what happens if Casa 1293 01:13:08,720 --> 01:13:11,160 disappears? Can people still access their 1294 01:13:11,160 --> 01:13:13,520 Bitcoin wallet? Let's say you guys go out of 1295 01:13:13,520 --> 01:13:16,720 business for whatever reason or you know, there's a regulatory, 1296 01:13:17,280 --> 01:13:22,160 you know, like last year, you know, with operation Choke .2 1297 01:13:22,160 --> 01:13:24,920 point OA lot of us were feeling a certain way about running a 1298 01:13:24,920 --> 01:13:27,920 Bitcoin business in the United States, in the United States, 1299 01:13:27,920 --> 01:13:30,840 right? So can people still sovereign 1300 01:13:30,840 --> 01:13:34,520 recover their Bitcoin wallets? Yeah, of course, this is one of 1301 01:13:34,520 --> 01:13:37,840 the best things about using Casa, right, is, is sovereign 1302 01:13:37,840 --> 01:13:40,480 recovery. They're your keys, you're 1303 01:13:40,480 --> 01:13:43,000 holding the keys. So all you do is take, we give 1304 01:13:43,000 --> 01:13:46,560 you a file that's it's called a wallet descriptor file. 1305 01:13:46,560 --> 01:13:52,040 But you copy paste this bunch of text, you go over to Sparrow or 1306 01:13:52,160 --> 01:13:55,280 or your your multi sig wallet of choice that you want to do 1307 01:13:55,280 --> 01:13:57,680 sovereign recovery with paste it in there. 1308 01:13:57,840 --> 01:14:00,840 Boom, there's your wallet, there's all your Bitcoin. 1309 01:14:01,040 --> 01:14:04,120 And then you use the keys that you have in order to to move the 1310 01:14:04,120 --> 01:14:08,080 Bitcoin out into and into a setup that's not Casa related. 1311 01:14:08,080 --> 01:14:10,680 You know if something happened to Casa overnight. 1312 01:14:11,800 --> 01:14:19,800 And so this is one of the most important parts about not not 1313 01:14:19,800 --> 01:14:22,960 relying on Casa as a single point of failure, right? 1314 01:14:22,960 --> 01:14:27,160 We always want to make sure that you can take your Bitcoin and 1315 01:14:27,160 --> 01:14:31,160 exit Casa without us being in the middle at all. 1316 01:14:31,600 --> 01:14:35,320 And so we've built a lot of pieces of the app around this, 1317 01:14:35,320 --> 01:14:38,000 right? So As for example, you've got 1318 01:14:38,000 --> 01:14:42,200 the mobile key in the Casa app and you need, you need to have 1319 01:14:42,200 --> 01:14:45,400 that seed phrase from that mobile key as part of the 1320 01:14:45,400 --> 01:14:49,600 sovereign recovery setup. But let's say Casa servers go 1321 01:14:49,600 --> 01:14:53,080 down overnight. We've actually built an offline 1322 01:14:53,080 --> 01:14:57,120 mode in the Casa app where you can go in, open up the Casa app, 1323 01:14:57,120 --> 01:14:59,120 it'll know it can't talk to our servers. 1324 01:14:59,120 --> 01:15:02,240 But that key is on your phone. And so you can just hit export 1325 01:15:02,240 --> 01:15:05,720 on that key, get the seed phrase for that key, and then plug that 1326 01:15:05,720 --> 01:15:08,000 into Sparrow as one of the keys in your multi sig. 1327 01:15:08,360 --> 01:15:12,400 So we've done a lot of work to make sure that this is very 1328 01:15:12,400 --> 01:15:15,800 recoverable in case something happens to Casa and that you can 1329 01:15:15,800 --> 01:15:18,800 still always access your Bitcoin without us being in the mix. 1330 01:15:19,680 --> 01:15:21,600 I love that. And I just want to like kind of 1331 01:15:21,600 --> 01:15:24,480 summarize a lot of things that you said, right? 1332 01:15:24,720 --> 01:15:30,400 No KYC very important completely sovereign recover, meaning you 1333 01:15:30,400 --> 01:15:33,160 don't have to go through the Casa app in order to access your 1334 01:15:33,160 --> 01:15:36,520 Bitcoin. And it also also functions as a 1335 01:15:36,520 --> 01:15:39,200 fail safe like God forbid you lose one of your. 1336 01:15:39,320 --> 01:15:41,600 I mean, this is been doing this for nine years. 1337 01:15:41,600 --> 01:15:43,920 I've seen everything that I'm Nick. 1338 01:15:43,920 --> 01:15:45,560 I'm sure you're in the same situation. 1339 01:15:45,840 --> 01:15:48,760 Anything that you think could happen with custody and just 1340 01:15:48,760 --> 01:15:52,040 dealing with individuals, like people lose their seeds all the 1341 01:15:52,040 --> 01:15:54,360 time because they don't put as much significant. 1342 01:15:54,640 --> 01:15:57,000 They think it's just a piece of paper or they think it's just a 1343 01:15:57,000 --> 01:15:59,600 piece of metal. And then they value the, this is 1344 01:15:59,640 --> 01:16:01,320 the most common thing I've noticed. 1345 01:16:01,480 --> 01:16:03,840 They value the hardware more than the paper. 1346 01:16:04,080 --> 01:16:07,000 They don't realize the the the seed words is your money. 1347 01:16:07,960 --> 01:16:11,120 And then they're like, Oh, I still have the hardware, but I 1348 01:16:11,120 --> 01:16:14,400 forgot the pin like, Oh my God. And then it's like, do you have 1349 01:16:14,400 --> 01:16:16,520 the paper? It's like, no, like this. 1350 01:16:16,560 --> 01:16:19,040 This is where you want redundancies. 1351 01:16:19,040 --> 01:16:23,840 You want, but you want you want to give space for people to make 1352 01:16:23,840 --> 01:16:27,800 the mistake because if you're on a single sig setup and you make 1353 01:16:27,800 --> 01:16:31,600 that mistake, it's gone. There is no, it's over. 1354 01:16:31,600 --> 01:16:34,000 And and there's there's horror stories of people basically 1355 01:16:34,000 --> 01:16:36,280 saying like I have one more pin attempt. 1356 01:16:36,480 --> 01:16:39,600 I don't have the seed words and I have one Bitcoin on there. 1357 01:16:39,600 --> 01:16:41,960 I have 10 Bitcoin on there. That's like life changing. 1358 01:16:42,120 --> 01:16:45,720 We, we just, we just did the Wen Moon calculator .5 right? 1359 01:16:46,760 --> 01:16:49,640 So, yeah, it's so many redundancies. 1360 01:16:49,640 --> 01:16:53,200 And I think it's a really, really useful tool for people 1361 01:16:53,200 --> 01:16:57,000 that perhaps feel a little bit intimidated by, you know, the, 1362 01:16:57,480 --> 01:17:00,760 the, the, the UI of a lot of these wallets. 1363 01:17:01,040 --> 01:17:03,600 Or perhaps you're just an OG hodler. 1364 01:17:03,800 --> 01:17:08,200 This is a great redundancy tool to have to add to yourself 1365 01:17:08,200 --> 01:17:12,560 custody set up on the way in becoming a sovereign individual 1366 01:17:12,560 --> 01:17:15,320 man, you got to look at all the tools that Bitcoin has given 1367 01:17:15,320 --> 01:17:17,200 you. And one of the things also to 1368 01:17:17,360 --> 01:17:21,480 Nick, that perhaps people don't understand is you guys built all 1369 01:17:21,480 --> 01:17:24,440 of this on top of the existing Bitcoin protocol. 1370 01:17:24,440 --> 01:17:28,120 This you guys aren't doing anything like, you know, 1371 01:17:28,760 --> 01:17:32,280 anything separately that this is all built on top of Bitcoin. 1372 01:17:32,280 --> 01:17:36,000 And what you guys did is you guys improved the UI 1373 01:17:36,000 --> 01:17:41,000 dramatically to so that people can access it without perhaps 1374 01:17:41,000 --> 01:17:42,440 feeling a little bit intimidated. 1375 01:17:42,480 --> 01:17:44,720 Right, Yeah. And I think it's worth 1376 01:17:45,560 --> 01:17:48,520 mentioning like you don't just have to forget your PIN for the 1377 01:17:48,520 --> 01:17:51,840 single sig to to go wrong, right, Like you can. 1378 01:17:53,000 --> 01:17:56,200 We've seen hardware wallets break more often than you would 1379 01:17:56,200 --> 01:18:00,000 like. And so that's something that is 1380 01:18:00,480 --> 01:18:03,040 like the screen just stops working and maybe you have your 1381 01:18:03,040 --> 01:18:05,560 PIN but you're not able to access the hardware. 1382 01:18:05,560 --> 01:18:07,800 And then if you don't have the seed phrase, then you've lost 1383 01:18:07,800 --> 01:18:10,560 all your money. I think it might be worth it to 1384 01:18:10,640 --> 01:18:13,720 like do a rapid fire. There's been a few questions in 1385 01:18:13,720 --> 01:18:17,680 the chat and I can go through and like rapid fire answer those 1386 01:18:17,800 --> 01:18:19,440 as we wrap up. Go for it. 1387 01:18:20,360 --> 01:18:23,680 OK, so. Yeah, just comment and I'll pull 1388 01:18:23,680 --> 01:18:25,080 them up. Yeah. 1389 01:18:25,080 --> 01:18:29,080 So one guy asked any data breaches on their end? 1390 01:18:29,080 --> 01:18:31,480 No, we haven't had any data breaches. 1391 01:18:32,320 --> 01:18:36,600 And to protect yourself against that kind of thing, we recommend 1392 01:18:36,600 --> 01:18:39,280 like if you're worried about that, use a, use a special 1393 01:18:39,280 --> 01:18:42,240 purpose e-mail that doesn't have your name in it. 1394 01:18:42,240 --> 01:18:46,200 And then, you know, all that shows up is this kind of random 1395 01:18:46,200 --> 01:18:48,320 e-mail and any sort of data breach, right? 1396 01:18:48,320 --> 01:18:52,240 And then the rest of the information we try to get rid of 1397 01:18:52,240 --> 01:18:55,520 as quickly as possible. So for example, if you are 1398 01:18:55,520 --> 01:18:58,040 getting an onboarding package from you, we'll send you the 1399 01:18:58,040 --> 01:19:00,920 onboarding package and then delete your address so that 1400 01:19:00,920 --> 01:19:03,880 we're not holding people's addresses in our database, which 1401 01:19:03,880 --> 01:19:07,160 is was a big thing that we learned from the Ledger breach a 1402 01:19:07,160 --> 01:19:08,280 few years ago. Right. 1403 01:19:09,920 --> 01:19:12,840 So somebody, OK, somebody mentioned my Casa 1404 01:19:12,840 --> 01:19:14,520 representative. Brian is awesome. 1405 01:19:14,520 --> 01:19:19,880 Can confirm, Brian is awesome. One of the somebody said, hey, 1406 01:19:19,880 --> 01:19:24,280 why do I need to use Casa if I could do this myself? 1407 01:19:24,840 --> 01:19:29,680 And I can't find the exact comment here, but the reason to 1408 01:19:29,720 --> 01:19:32,320 yeah, there we go. So if I, if I can do sovereign 1409 01:19:32,320 --> 01:19:34,640 recovery, why do I involve Casa at all? 1410 01:19:35,040 --> 01:19:39,080 And it's because the sovereign recovery is there for when, if 1411 01:19:39,080 --> 01:19:44,640 things go badly at Casa, right? But then we've built all these 1412 01:19:44,640 --> 01:19:48,160 other things that you can really only get through a service 1413 01:19:48,160 --> 01:19:51,720 provider like Casa while Casa is is doing fine. 1414 01:19:52,000 --> 01:19:55,400 So yes, you can go set up a Sparrow wallet with the same 1415 01:19:55,400 --> 01:19:58,640 kind of underlying security of Bitcoin multi sig, right? 1416 01:19:59,080 --> 01:20:02,920 But what Sparrow's not going to give you is an advisory team 1417 01:20:02,920 --> 01:20:04,920 that helps you whenever you need it, like. 1418 01:20:05,040 --> 01:20:08,000 Brian, who will get on a call with you and actually walk you 1419 01:20:08,000 --> 01:20:10,800 through how to set this up. It's not going to give you an 1420 01:20:10,800 --> 01:20:15,320 inheritance feature where you can make sure that your family 1421 01:20:15,320 --> 01:20:18,720 members can actually still access your Bitcoin in case 1422 01:20:18,720 --> 01:20:22,040 something ever happens to you. Asking your family members to 1423 01:20:22,040 --> 01:20:26,040 try and figure out how to use Sparrow is like you know they're 1424 01:20:26,160 --> 01:20:28,760 mind blown, right? And so knowing that they have a 1425 01:20:28,760 --> 01:20:32,880 a really simple way to use it and actually somebody on the 1426 01:20:32,880 --> 01:20:36,880 Casa end to walk them through everything, give some people a 1427 01:20:36,880 --> 01:20:40,280 lot of Peace of Mind and then there. 1428 01:20:40,960 --> 01:20:44,560 There's two late, late the the two latest questions, Nick. 1429 01:20:44,560 --> 01:20:47,760 So Nick, do you have any specific signing device upon 1430 01:20:47,760 --> 01:20:51,680 setup so typically? So it depends on the plan that 1431 01:20:51,680 --> 01:20:53,840 you're at, right? But if you're signing up for a 1432 01:20:53,840 --> 01:20:58,120 standard plan, you can bring any of the major hardware wallets. 1433 01:20:58,120 --> 01:21:03,120 We support Trezor, Ledger cold card Passport, and then we also 1434 01:21:03,120 --> 01:21:07,080 added support for UB keys, which are are really easy to use and 1435 01:21:07,080 --> 01:21:09,160 we're the only place that's doing that right now. 1436 01:21:10,560 --> 01:21:14,640 And so this is you can bring kind of any of these major 1437 01:21:14,640 --> 01:21:18,200 signing devices with you. And then you can also, if you're 1438 01:21:18,200 --> 01:21:21,440 signing up for a premium or a private client plan, we just 1439 01:21:21,440 --> 01:21:24,440 send you a box that has all the hardware that you need. 1440 01:21:24,720 --> 01:21:27,560 And you can talk to our team at the private client level and 1441 01:21:27,560 --> 01:21:30,600 request that we send you custom ones like, oh, I want to make 1442 01:21:30,600 --> 01:21:32,600 sure I have a cold card in here kind of thing. 1443 01:21:35,280 --> 01:21:38,880 This last question from Craig, are all Casa features available 1444 01:21:38,880 --> 01:21:40,320 in the UK? Yes. 1445 01:21:40,360 --> 01:21:45,920 So we're available globally because we don't KYC and because 1446 01:21:45,920 --> 01:21:48,840 it's a self custody wallet, that's one of the benefits of 1447 01:21:48,840 --> 01:21:54,280 self custody, right. So if if you are using Casa, you 1448 01:21:54,280 --> 01:21:56,000 can use it from anywhere in the world. 1449 01:21:56,360 --> 01:22:00,760 There's only really like one thing that's not available 1450 01:22:00,760 --> 01:22:04,600 globally, which is what we call enhanced verification for 1451 01:22:04,600 --> 01:22:06,680 inheritance. And this is just where we'll 1452 01:22:06,680 --> 01:22:11,400 actually have a couple of extra steps to verify that a client 1453 01:22:11,400 --> 01:22:14,160 actually passed away. But that starts to to kind of 1454 01:22:14,160 --> 01:22:17,360 tiptoe into KYC area anyway, where if you want to take 1455 01:22:17,600 --> 01:22:19,920 advantage of that, you got to give us some extra info. 1456 01:22:19,960 --> 01:22:22,960 So we have to go and actually make sure like we've checked 1457 01:22:23,000 --> 01:22:25,200 against the death certificate and all that kind of thing. 1458 01:22:26,000 --> 01:22:29,000 We we have a really good question here from JH, which is 1459 01:22:29,000 --> 01:22:32,080 how can I, how can we feel confident that seed phrases 1460 01:22:32,080 --> 01:22:34,840 aren't leaked from a bad actor doing an update on these apps 1461 01:22:34,840 --> 01:22:37,240 went online. Yeah, good question. 1462 01:22:37,240 --> 01:22:42,560 So we have a very robust internal process for actually 1463 01:22:42,560 --> 01:22:46,360 like pushing updates to the Casa app, right. 1464 01:22:46,400 --> 01:22:51,160 And so the Casa app doesn't have your seed phrase sitting in it. 1465 01:22:51,280 --> 01:22:55,160 The seed phrase is actually stored on your phone, encrypted 1466 01:22:55,160 --> 01:23:00,000 by the secure element. And so the that phrase is never 1467 01:23:00,000 --> 01:23:03,080 getting sent to Casa servers. But let's say something went 1468 01:23:03,080 --> 01:23:08,720 wrong and the Casa app was hacked or whatever and somebody 1469 01:23:08,720 --> 01:23:13,080 got access to that seed phrase. You still have one, maybe up to 1470 01:23:13,080 --> 01:23:17,480 three keys that you're holding that are separate from the Casa 1471 01:23:17,480 --> 01:23:21,360 app on hardware that's completely offline that you need 1472 01:23:21,360 --> 01:23:25,440 in order to move the funds. And so even if the worst case 1473 01:23:25,440 --> 01:23:29,480 scenario happened in the Casa mobile app was hacked, you don't 1474 01:23:29,480 --> 01:23:33,160 lose your money because that Casa mobile app is not a single 1475 01:23:33,160 --> 01:23:36,320 point of failure. So this is when I go back to 1476 01:23:36,320 --> 01:23:39,560 like, what are those layers of security that we've built in? 1477 01:23:39,800 --> 01:23:44,600 This is an important one. Not every private key that you 1478 01:23:44,600 --> 01:23:48,760 are using with Casa should be generated online by Casa, right? 1479 01:23:48,760 --> 01:23:50,560 And that's that's where the hardware wallets come in. 1480 01:23:51,320 --> 01:23:55,440 Gotcha gotcha. Anyways, we are getting to the 1481 01:23:55,440 --> 01:23:59,120 top of the hour of the show. Do you want to give a shout out 1482 01:23:59,160 --> 01:24:04,320 to her 2855 live members watching Shout out to all you 1483 01:24:04,320 --> 01:24:05,560 guys. Shout out to the YouTube 1484 01:24:05,560 --> 01:24:06,800 audience. Shout out to the rumble 1485 01:24:06,800 --> 01:24:08,120 audience. If you guys enjoyed the show, 1486 01:24:08,400 --> 01:24:13,240 smash the like button go check out Casa dot IO slash simply 1487 01:24:13,240 --> 01:24:15,600 today. I do want to thank our guest 1488 01:24:15,600 --> 01:24:20,000 Nick Newman, the CEO of Casa for joining us, a legendary Co host 1489 01:24:20,000 --> 01:24:22,720 Optimus Fields. Guys, we love you all, smash the 1490 01:24:22,720 --> 01:24:25,000 like and consider subscribing and we'll see you tomorrow for a 1491 01:24:25,000 --> 01:24:27,360 brand new episode of Simply Bitcoin Live. 1492 01:24:28,200 --> 01:24:31,560 Today's episode was brought to you by bitcoinwell.com, a 1493 01:24:31,560 --> 01:24:34,680 Bitcoin only platform on a mission to enable financial 1494 01:24:34,680 --> 01:24:35,520 independence.