People at the top, you know, know the game, they understand
what's coming, they understand how to play it and they can make
inflation work for them. I mean, they actually can get,
you know, inflation. You know, the, the working
person or the average citizen has has trouble with inflation.
Their, their salary is fixed and things cost more.
Their lifestyle gets worse, you know, people at the top, they
can actually root for inflation because they can borrow cheap
and the inflation pushes up the value of their assets.
And that's why the wealth inequality is is as it is.
I mean, that's the whole contillion effect.
So it's, it's a bad, bad scene. And I hate to sit here and
complain about it, though, because again, I mean, I think
this is going to come out on Christmas.
I want to be, I want to be positive.
I mean, the good, good scene is that man, they're losing and
we're winning and, and everyone's figuring this out.
And that's the point of this book.
I mean, I want an orange pill. We got 330 million Americans out
there. You know, how many people are in
the Federal Reserve, like 50 that make the decisions?
Well, you know, we, I mean, we outnumber these folks and, and
if we make enough noise, we can fix this stuff.
And, and, and even if we don't make enough noise, you know,
intrinsically, even in the marketplace, it's, it's arguable
that Bitcoin alone is going to fix this stuff because, you
know, Bitcoin continues to go up in value.
It's just going to suck all the value out of the Fiat.
The Fiat people aren't going to have power anymore.
The Bitcoiners are going to have a lot of power.
And I got to tell you, I would much rather have Bitcoiners
running this country than have all the Fiat Lords running this
country. I know that from the bitcoins
that I've met. We'll do a lot better under that
regime. Hey, Larry, last time we spoke
about you writing the book was in Nashville.
We were we were speaking on the floor and I think it was right
before the Trump speech and you were you were you were telling
me you were working on something and you're very passionate about
it. You did that very quickly.
Or was this something that you've been working on for
months now? Well, let's see, Nashville was
July. I started this in May, June.
It just and I'll tell, I'll tell you what kind of triggered it.
I, I think I was dragged forced into sitting with my wife to
watch something on one of the news channels that was
politically oriented and it was just so horrible, you know, and
I, I was, I had such disdain for both sides of the aisle.
And I thought to myself, God, this is just, is this what our
country has come become because all these people are arguing
about all these issues that just don't matter.
And the, the, the biggest, glaring, most fundamental
underlying issue that you understand and probably a lot of
the listeners understand is that the money's broken.
And I thought, you know, somebody's got to do something
about this. And, and to, to a degree, people
have, I mean, Safe wrote a great book and and Lynn wrote a
fabulous book, but they're, they tend to be a little bit more on
the textbooky side. And so I thought to myself,
well, you know, you've been in the financial world, you've seen
a lot, you know, where the bones are buried in terms of the, you
know, misdeeds of the Fed. I bet, you know, I was talking
to myself Now, I bet you could write a book that would be
unique and that might help people to understand what's
broken and how it got broken and how obviously broken it is with
a few of the anecdotes, which are pretty outrageous.
And then as a result of that, you know, what we got to do to
fix it. And of course, that leads you
right to Bitcoin. So.
So yeah. And then once I started into it,
I became, I became kind of possessed.
And I've, I've really been possessed.
And I don't know how long it takes the most people to write
books, but I probably, like I said, I think I started in May
or June and I'm done. So it's.
That is crazy. It's 250.
Well, I don't know. It's yeah, but it's, it just
flowed very easily. I felt like I was getting it
from a higher power. It's kind of ironic, but but
yeah, it it, it flowed easily. And you know, I just, I got, I
mean, once you're in it, just get into it.
I just wanted to finish it and it is finished now.
It's being kind of edited and cleaned up and I'm actually
dealing with what's a little bit of a high quality problem, but
it is a problem. I mean, I thought it 100 pages
and then it kind of got to 200 pages and now it's slightly over
200 in the text. But there's some, you know, a
lot of charts and other things. And I don't know, there's some
sections I got to decide if I'm going to leave them in or out.
But anyway, it could go into almost close to 300 pages.
And you know, I want to, again, I, I want to make them very
accessible. What I'm hoping for is
ultimately I'll get out of just Amazon publishing.
I'll get to a bigger publisher. I want it to be on the, you
know, on the countertop of a, of an airport, you know, bookstore.
And somebody just walking through says, huh, what's that
all about? Picks it up, gets on a flight
and can read it in five hours. And, you know, and then and kind
of gets orange peeled in the process.
So that's that's kind of the goal.
Absolutely. I mean, you know, Larry, like,
first of all, it's impressive that you wrote it so, so quickly
because the when you, when you, when you, when you may.
Not be any good, *** When you when you told me about it, it
was just like, I think I'm going to write a book and I'm like,
you should go for it, Larry. You shouldn't go for it.
So and you know now it's ready now.
But what you just said was very powerful.
And the reason that that I believe it's very powerful is
because I think we live in this world where people inherently
know the system is broken, but they continue to seek a
political solution to it where that's not the solution to the
problem. The solution to the problem is
the fact that there is a group of people that get to create
money for free that everyone else has to work for.
And that completely effects every facet of society.
And I think this is something that you dive into in your book.
You talk about the healthcare system, you talk about the
wealth inequality. You talk about, you know, all
these secondary effects that is caused by this broken system,
this broken money, you know, and, and and you and you let you
map it out. He's in the 1960s.
This is where, you know, the majority of the American people
believed in the in government. They believed in what the
government was saying. And then that has just
collapsed, right? A coincidentally around 19.
Why 1971, right. Yeah.
So what? Happened.
Isn't it so? You know what, what, what, and,
and to me, you know, the reason that's so powerful that that
mental image in my head. And I've been traveling so much
this year. So you go, you, you walk past
those airport, you know, bookstores is because the answer
is right there. The answer is right in front of
you. All you have to do is you pick
up the book. It's not voting for the blue
party or the red party. It's really opting out and
voting with your wallet for the orange party if that makes.
Sense correct. And, and I think I think the
other reason why I was suited to write it is, you know, I've been
in the financial world. I've been doing this my whole
career. I've been a sound money advocate
my whole career. And I remember, you know, I
mean, I have the benefit that you and some of the younger
Bitcoiners don't. I remember what this country
used to be like and it was better.
It was much, much better growing up in the 70s and even the early
80s. And it's, it's kind of
continually devolved in, in a bad direction to the point now
where, you know, things are really broken.
I mean, when you've got, you know, vigilantes shooting CEOs
and, you know, in Manhattan, you know, there's, I mean, and, and
that's just a tip of the iceberg.
There are all kinds of problems everywhere.
It's just, it's very obvious to any, any observer who does any
work that there's a real problem here.
So. And could, could you, could you
walk us through that, Larry? Like, you know, some experiences
in your life that you know, you, you say you, the, the analogy
that you says like, you know, where the, the, and this is an
analogy, right? You say you just know where the
bodies are buried, right? Your, your, your, your financial
background. What did you see?
What What has changed since the 1970s and the 1980s until now?
Well, probably the biggest one, Nico, was, was the wealth
inequality. I mean, when I was growing up,
you know, there were the guy who ran Ford Motor, you know, looked
in the same neighborhood as us and he probably made four times
what my dad made, you know, I mean, today, you know, he'd be
making $20 million. And, you know, my dad was just
a, a retailer who did fine. But, you know, so the, the
wealth inequality is a big part of it, the financialization and
the, the, the rewards to people who knew how to game the system.
I mean, I think, you know, the book is called the Big Print.
And it, it actually, by the time this comes out, it might be for
sale on on Amazon in Kindle book format pre-order.
They don't allow you to pre-order hardcover and and
paperback. But, and just so everyone knows,
the book will probably be out in February.
That's the goal. It's written when I'm in that
process of kind of getting it laid out and put together.
And I want it to be high quality.
So I'm not sure how long it could take.
It could take a couple weeks, could take a month.
But anyway, so, but back to the, the fundamental premise of the
book, it goes that that inflation is really what's
ruined this country, that, you know, that, that when we, you
know, at, at the end of World War 2, we were, we were at the
peak, we'd won a war, we were leading country, we had all the
gold. We were on the gold standard.
You know, it was truth, justice, the American way.
And, and we really believed it. And we weren't perfect.
Don't get me wrong, we did a lot of bad things, but but boy, we
were a lot better than we are today.
And, and what happened is, you know, we let some of that go to
our head and started making mistakes, the biggest of which I
think, well, Vietnam was an enormous mistake, which then led
to big deficits, which then led to a gold drain, which then led
to abandoning the gold standard. And the gold standard wasn't
perfect. And that's all Bitcoiners know.
It's, it's centralized and, you know, hard to verify and hard
to, you know, hard to transact in.
But having said that, the problem got measurably worse
when we abandoned the gold standard in 1971.
And, and that started the trend towards financialization.
And, you know, we've now kind of hit peak financialization.
I mean, when you have 0% interest rates for seven years
in a row and you know, when you have quantitative easing, which
is massive money printing, when you, you know, when, when your
money supply grows 42% in two years like it did in COVID, you
know, your financial system broken.
And you know, the really the notion that we can just kind of
put a Band-Aid on and fix it. That's just not right.
I mean, it's like, you know, we've got an alcohol, we got a
drinking problem and we got to go cold Turkey.
And so, and that means we got to stop creating debt.
We've got to return to sound money and and the book talks
about how to do that. Now we've got policy
recommendations and you know, and, and that, you know, some
people say, well, hang on a second, this, you know, you're
saying the system is broken, Larry, that's all doom and
gloom. I I don't want to read doom and
gloom, but but it's really not because I also talk about how
all the positive things that are happening and the counter
revolution that's taking place. I mean, you know, we did this
big centralization thing up until World War 2, figure out
how to kill a lot of people quickly.
But the microprocessor has saved us and it's going to completely
save us, in my opinion, because we've got the Internet and we've
got podcasts and the, you know, all these huge sclerotic,
corrupt institutions, you know, like the the mainstream media
and the federal government, these big centralized things,
they're all failing horribly. And everyone knows it and can
see it. And they're going to get
they're, they're going to fail. And, you know, I mean, Joe Rogan
and Tucker Carlson outdraw the major networks.
And so people realize these big broken systems are screwing them
and, you know, we're free people and somewhat and lost some of
it, but we're still basically a free people.
And, you know, we're going to vote with our feet and, and push
things in the right direction. So as decentralization
continues, it's going to be, it's a very positive thing.
And, and networks are are, you know, really making the world a
much better place. And of course, we, you know, we
had the Internet and that network, we had all the
information networks, and now we've got a decentralized
monetary network, which is just going to completely, you know,
rewire the world in a very positive way.
And what I try to do in the book is to take, you know, a newbie
because I, I literally, you know, there's a chapter just
describing what Bitcoin is, which probably everyone
listening to this podcast knows. But I want to sell this book to
somebody who, you know, knows nothing about it, who's just a
regular American wandering around trying to pay their bills
and wonders why the hell they feel like they're getting
screwed. You know, And so the book is,
you know, here's why you're getting screwed.
Here's what you can do about it. So, Larry, why, why don't people
see it? You know, because this is
something that has, you know, like I, I spent a third of my
life in this industry. I've built my career on this, in
this industry. And to me, it's, it's incredibly
obvious, right, that inflation is the problem, Like inflation
is the issue. Why can't you know?
And, and you know, what's funny to me is when you hear the
politicians that go on TV and they talk about inflation as if
it's like a law of nature. It is gravity, you know, And
then, oh. It's greedy corporations.
Right, yeah. And that that's another one.
That's another one. They they essentially blame
everything and anyone but themselves, even though it's
government spending which is the sole cause of inflation, right.
So has the world been psyopped because they controlled the
media for so long now that they've lost control of the
media with the rise of X and Elon acquiring it, and you
really see the truth seeping through and you and you see them
seize. Well, I think so it it was a
multifaceted answer to that question, in my opinion.
I mean, one, they've been gasoline a lot. 2 a lot of
people aren't critical thinkers. Three, you know, the level of
pain wasn't as large, you know, let, let's go back to pre 2008,
you know, I mean, the, the 80s and 90s, I mean, all these
things were bubbling and happening, but in general, you
know, the world was a pretty good place.
The economy was doing pretty well.
I, I, I kind of marked the beginning of the end as, as kind
of 9/11. Well, the the.com bubble and
then the bursting of that and 9:11, which sent us on a spree
to spend $8 trillion in the Middle East on stupid stuff, you
know, and, and so that I think is where the lies really
intensified. I mean, there were lies in the
Nixon administration, obviously, but, but they, but it got
progressively worse. And, you know, I just, with
every step, you know, people have been hurting.
I mean, you know, Obamacare was supposed to make our healthcare
system better. It's made it worse and more
expensive. I mean, you know, there's just
absolutely nothing the government touches works because
the people who are in there are corrupt and they're doing things
in their own best interests or in the interests of the big
corporations that they're in, in, you know, in Hock to.
And so, you know, the rest of us suffer as a result of that.
And so, you know, and, and, and like I say, if, I mean, if you
weren't hurting too badly and you're, you know, raising your
family and, you know, focusing on putting money on the OR
putting food on the table and watching the football game,
people weren't paying attention. But I think one thing that's
happening that's pushed in our favor, Nico, is that the
problems have gotten worse and people, you know, when people
start to hurt, they start to say, well, OK, damn it, what am
I going to do about this? I mean, I, I, you know, let's
solve this. And so again, that, that that's
the point of the book. I'm trying to, I'm trying to
educate and trying to, you know, I mean, you know, yes, you
understand it 'cause you've been in this industry.
But imagine, you know, imagine you have a job that's not at all
related to this industry. I mean, imagine, you know, I
don't know what, what job you might have, but if you're a
secretary or, and wherever you work and, but you're not deep
into this business, you wouldn't really understand it.
You and you would, you know, you, you turn on the TV and you
listen to what people tell you and they lie to you, but you
wouldn't know they were lying to you.
So, you know, so that's, that's been the problem.
But but you know, like, you know, the, the trend is good,
right? I mean, more and more people are
waking up. I mean, you know, that chart
that's in the book that you referred to, which shows how the
trust in government, I mean, in the 60s, post World War 2, I
mean, the trust of the government was like 70 or 80% of
the people trusted the government most of all the time.
Right now it's less than 20%. So you know that that obviously
shows you that they're not doing the government's failing.
And and that's because it was built for a different time.
You know, it was built for a growing nation and, you know,
when the economies of scale mattered.
And so it was, it made sense to have big government.
But, you know, we don't need that anymore.
And so it's going to go away. And that's the very positive
part of the book. You know, it's the things I see
coming are really fantastic. But, but the other thing is
it's, it's, it's a little bit of just a of a how to instruction
manual because, you know, the average person buying a book in
an airport, you know, I mean, I, I on the back of the book, which
I think maybe by the time the show comes out, you can put the,
you'll have the book cover in the book back that you can put
in the show notes. But the back of the book
basically says bluntly, you know, they're going to be
winners and losers, you know, and, and you know, and
everyone's responsible for their own situation.
So, hey, read the book and, you know, you got a better chance of
being a winner and and you know, that's something you should want
to do. And, you know, so hopefully,
hopefully people will read the book.
I mean, I, you know, I want to sell a lot of them, not not to
make money, but because I want to, I want to see the world get
changed sooner rather than later.
Because, you know, I want my kids to have a better world, my
grandkids someday, to have a better world than than what
we're in right now, you know? Absolutely.
And, and I think, you know, in the, the the what the, what I've
coined it is like we're it's, it's information narrative,
trench warfare. And it's really about winning
over that's. Right.
That's a good way to put it, yeah.
Winning over the hearts and minds of individuals and really
getting them to wake up about the it's not left versus right,
the divide and conquer method to distract you from what's
actually going on. But one of the chapters names
really, really when I, when I saw it really impacted me, which
is, you know, let's talk about the solution to this.
So inflation is the problem. Inflation is causing all these
consequences, some of them unintended consequences and it's
severely affecting society. But one of the things that you
mentioned is that the solution to that is sound money.
But the thing, that thing that really stuck out to me is that
you make the case that sound money is a moral issue.
Could you elaborate a little bit on that?
Yeah, sure. Happy to.
I mean, look, I mean, if, if you know, if if I said I was going
to give you 10 gallons of beer and I gave you 9 gallons of
beer, you know, and you gave me some money for that.
I mean, you would say, hey, you cheated me, you know, you
promised me 10 and gave me 9. And so, you know, money is, is a
representation of time, work, value, energy, whatever you want
to call it. But it's what we all use to make
our economy work. And when it's continually being
diluted by a system that requires it to be diluted,
that's built in to be, you know, credit based system, then that's
effectively the government's stealing money from everybody
who works. And it's stealing your time and
stealing your labor and it at least all kinds of perverse
incentives. And so, you know, it's this is a
man. This is not new the the book.
I don't go in deeply into this 'cause you know, the book's
about a lot of things, but I talk about how, you know, this
goes back, it's in the Bible, right?
I mean, you know, the Lord says you will use honest weights and
measures. I mean, so, you know, obviously
way back when somebody, when they were doing exchange and
they were, they were weighing things and, you know, say, OK,
I'll, I'll give you X amount of this for Y, I'm out of that.
And some people were saying, Oh yeah, look at this.
They, they were using dishonest weights.
You know, I'm saying, I gave you the full weight, but they really
didn't. And so, you know, this cheating
concept has been around for a long time.
It's as old as the hills. And it's just something that
government does. And, you know, we shouldn't
permit it. But sadly, we, you know, we
haven't had a collective group of people.
You know, there's just been a few lonely voices who understand
this issue. I mean, Ron Paul has always been
one of them, or recently Judy Shelton has been another one.
And there, you know, there are many others.
But my point is that, you know, we are very much in the, you
know, I've, I've made a lot of noise over the years, but we,
you know, we are very much in the minority of, of economic
thought because the Keynesian model, which empowers
governments is, is really been, you know, been dominant.
And, you know, it also empowers economists and makes them very
rich. You know, empowers.
I mean, you know, there's, I mean, there's a lot of data in
there. Most, most people listening will
know this. But I mean, you know, it's
bothersome to me that Janet Yellen got paid $7,000,000 in
speaking fees from the financial industry, right?
I mean. Including 800,000 plus from
Citadel. Well, you know, I got to tell
you, there's no, there's no free market that would suggest to me
that Janet Yellen's wisdom for A1 or A2 hour speech is worth a
couple $100,000. I mean, that's to me just a, a
covert, a covert bribe where, you know, a big bank is paying
her to come speak, knowing that she's in a position of power to
regulate them or will be in the future or is influencing policy.
And they want her to influence policy in a way that will
benefit them at the expense of everybody else.
That's exactly the way the system works.
And so, so there's a lot of immorality and corruption that
comes out of having this broken money.
And, you know, the people who control the money.
I mean, it's just it's patently absurd that we have 12 people
that can set the price of money. I mean, the price of money is
the most important price in any economy because it drives
capital allocation decisions, which then drive the correct
productivity, you know, and outputs as a result of, you
know, you want to invest in the right things.
And so if you distort the price of money, you make
malinvestments and you're wasting money on things that
don't make any sense and and that that's a cost to society.
If we had not had all of the distortions that we've had, we
would all be living so much better.
If you look at if you look at all the technological innovation
that's taken place in my lifetime and in your lifetime, I
mean, we all should be working 20 hours a week.
I mean, it's, it's unbelievable how, how much technology has
improved everyone's. And yet, because the money's
broken, we're all still working like slaves because, you know,
we're trying to keep, we're on this hamster mill, you know,
hamster track of trying to stay ahead of inflation, which is
always eating us, eating us up. It's a real problem.
And, and everyone feels it, you know, from the top to the bottom
that the one difference though, that I'll point out and you and
I discussed before the show is the people at the top, you know,
know the game, they understand what's coming.
They understand how to play it and they can make inflation work
for them. I mean, they actually can get,
you know, inflation, you know, the, the working person or the
average citizen has, has trouble with inflation.
Their, their salary is fixed and things cost more.
Their lifestyle gets worse, you know, people at the top, they
can actually root for inflation because they can borrow cheap
and, and the inflation pushes up the value of their assets.
And that's why the wealth inequality is, is as it is.
I mean, that's the whole contillion effect.
So it's, it's a bad, bad scene and, and you know it, it, but
the, I mean, you know, so I hate to sit here and complain about
it though, because again, I mean, I think this is going to
come out on Christmas. I want to be, I want to be
positive. I mean, the good, good scene is
that man, they're losing and we're winning and, and
everyone's figuring this out. And that's the point of this
book. I mean, I want an orange pill.
We got 330 million Americans out there.
You know, how many people are there in the Federal Reserve,
like 50 that make the decisions? Well, you know, we, I mean, we,
we outnumber these folks. And, and if we make enough
noise, we can fix this stuff. And, and, and even, and even if
we don't make enough noise, you know, intrinsically, even in the
marketplace, it's, it's arguable that Bitcoin alone is going to
fix this stuff. Because, you know, if Bitcoin
continues to go up in value, it's just going to stack all the
value out of the Fiat. The Fiat people aren't going to
have power anymore and the Bitcoin is going to have a lot
of power. And I got to tell you, I would
much rather have Bitcoiners running this country than have
all the Fiat Lords running this country, you know?
One of the one of the things and I and I completely agree, Larry,
and it's interesting. One of the things about Bitcoin
is that like the, it's even if you live within the United
States and you, you know, you have the traditional like, you
know, the, the, it's protect, it's like this orange force
field that's protecting you against all these things that
are happening on in in the sidelines.
But there's this very powerful thing that you said in the book.
I'm not gonna directly quote it. I'm gonna put it in my own word
so that everyone's surprised when they initially read it.
But you basically make the case that, you know, America's broken
and that there, but there is an honest and integral group of
people within the country that you expect are going to say, you
know, enough is enough and they're going to make things
right. So I, I, I read that and it, it
reminded me of something that you told me that many years ago
when, you know, I was still in my, I was in my, my late 20s.
I don't know how you agreed to come on my podcast, but you
know, you told me and you said, you know, Nico, your generation
is is is is the is the hero generation, which comes from the
4th turning kind of theory and and stuff like that.
And you know, the way that I see Larry, and you were talking
about it like earlier on in on the in the show, which was, you
know, we're the millennials and the Gen.
Z ers. This is like the first
generations with all the productivity increases, all the
technological increases, where our quality of life is lower
than our parents. You know, the well, the, the,
the world has gotten wealthier. The world has got it.
And you know you have the same phone as a billionaire, right?
Yeah, no, that's the Boomers have been incredibly greedy, you
know, and incredibly irresponsible with respect to
your generation. I see it, I see it in my own
kids. I have 3 kids, all in their
20's. The oldest is 29, the youngest
is 23. And yeah, they, you know,
they're, and they're all doing fine.
They all have good jobs, they're smart, they're going to be very
successful. And yet they come to me and they
say, Dad, I, you have to be out to me buying a house, you know,
given what I make and what I can save and what houses cost.
I mean, it's like it's like 0, you know, and, and they just,
they, they have no idea how they're ever going to quote, UN
quote, get ahead in the world because of the way the system is
set up. And but you know, what needs to
happen is Fiat needs to get Mark to market.
I mean, all the boomers grabbed all the Fiat.
Well, the fiat's worthless. The boomers don't know that yet,
but we're going to find out. So, So what what?
So who do you mean by who? Who?
What is this group of people that is going to rise up, Larry?
Is this is this going to be very similar to what happened with
social media and the legacy media where, you know, we saw
this slow transition from we all believed what they're I mean,
some of us, not all of us believed what they were saying,
you know, really like since the election of Trump in 2016.
And then slowly but surely you're at you, you start saying
things and you're like, wait a second, like, is that guy on TV
really telling me like, you know, like it is?
And then slowly but surely people start to wake up and the
pandemic exacerbated things, right?
I think they really got a lot of things wrong, right?
And a lot of people woke up and then eventually, before you know
it, and I think it happened this year, there was a, there was the
majority of people are actually critically thinking because
they're doing their own research by following the people they
want to follow on X. And I think it's a combination
of people are sick and tired of being lied to, so they seek
alternative information sources, whether that's Joe Rogan,
Russell Brand, Tucker Carlson, or following your favorite
accounts on. On X.
Simply a coin. Exactly right.
Sorry I go for my information so.
The Who? Who is this group of people?
Like who is this group of people that's going to rise up and say
enough is enough? Well, I think it's your
generation and I think it's anybody who is been mistreated
by the system. And that's where you know,
hopefully you know that. And that's where we've got to
open up their eyes to it and, and offer them hope and, you
know, offer them the positivity. I mean, you said something
earlier that really resonated with me, which is, you know,
when you're in Bitcoin, it's like you have this orange force
field around you. I mean, I can't tell you how
peaceful and happy I've been since I've gotten fully into
Bitcoin because, you know, I was kind of fighting this battle on
this. I've been fighting the battle on
sound money for quite some time. And I was fighting it with a
golden shield, which didn't really work.
And because they figured out how to manipulate gold and
centralized all the things we know are wrong with it.
And suddenly all along, you know, here comes safe and he
writes his book. And then I got a bunch of guys
like you quoting Von Mises and, you know, it's like, holy crap,
you know, we got an army now that's that's going to that's
going to come out here and, and fight to make this world a
better place. And look, you guys have the most
at stake. I mean, I'm at the other end of,
you know, the generational spectrum where, you know, I can
see the end point. You got a whole life in front of
you. So you want to get it right and
you want the world to be a good place.
And and you know, The thing is good ideas spread naturally.
I mean, people, you know, a lot of people do the wrong things
and there are a lot of things that are bad and there are a lot
of times that are bad. But, you know, if you study
history carefully, you read it carefully, I mean, there's been,
you know, the history we the human race marches forward.
We really do. You know, we get more, I think
we get more ethical. I think we get more intelligent.
I think we've got more technology, we get more tools,
we get more efficient. I mean, you know, and, and
things that, you know, I mean, even even today, you know, there
are things that we enjoy that our grandparents are great
grandparents couldn't have even imagined.
I mean, I can hop on an airplane and be halfway around the world
in 12 hours. I mean, you know, that that's,
that was just unimaginable to my grandparents, right?
I mean, and, and so, and certainly to their parents, it
was completely unimaginable. They would have to take a
steamship for three weeks. So you know, the, the, the
trends are in the right direction and, and you know,
really all, you know, all we have to do.
And I think the reason you do the podcast, the reason I'm
writing the book, the reason the Bitcoiners that do it make a lot
of noise, is we just want to accelerate the trend.
And in my view, I want to have a legacy of having fought for what
I think was the right side of things.
I mean, I, you know, like as an example, when America separated
from Britain, a fourth turning 2, fourth turnings ago because
like, yeah, three 4th turnings ago because there was actually
4th turning World War 2. Then there was a civil war.
The third one was, you know, there were a third of the
country. They were actually loyalists.
They were like, no, no, no, we want to stick with the crown.
You know, a third were like, no, no, that's bullshit.
I mean, these people would tell us what to do.
They're taxing us. They're living in their houses,
you know, they make us Garrison these soldiers, you know, F
that, you know, tell them to to pound sand, you know, you know,
you have to decide you're if you and then a third didn't really
know what they wanted to do. They were just kind of living on
their farms, not paying attention, from what I
understand. And you know, it's kind of like
you had to stand up and decide, well, what am I going to fight
for? Do I want to, you know, do I
want to fight for, you know, self government or do I want to
live under this crowd? And, you know, I mean, I, there
are people who believe in the state, believe in the federal
government, believe in, you know, Fiat money and, and
benefit from that system. And that's fine.
They're entitled to do that. But, you know, the outcomes that
they're producing aren't very good, are they, for most people.
And in fact, they're they're quite bad.
You know, if you, and if you dig down a little bit below the
level of those of us who are doing OK, you know, my sister
lives in a rural community in Utah.
You know, she tells me some stories that are just
heartbreaking in terms of how hard it is for the average
person. So, you know that, that to me
means that, you know, it's, it's incumbent upon those of us who
are aware to try and push for a better, a better world, you
know, better system, fairer system.
And, and, and then to help those that we, we know and care about,
you know, in terms of telling the story of Bitcoin and telling
why, you know, helping them to protect themselves.
I mean, you know, I, I, I have stories of investors that I've
orange peeled who, you know, are now very thankful that, you
know, they bought it at 10,000 when I was pounding the table,
you know what I mean? So, and that's satisfying.
And, and by the way, that's not, it's, that's not over yet.
I mean, it's, you know, when it's $1,000,000, people are
going to say, holy crap, you're buying it at, at 100,000.
Oh my God, you're, so you have a whole coin.
Oh my God, nobody I know has a whole coin, you know, so, so
right. I mean, it's just it, it's all,
you know, it it, I really do believe Sailor's right.
It is going up forever, Laura. So absolutely.
Well, you just kind of got to get you just kind of got to get
in there. I mean, I was counselling one of
my investors the other day. It's like, well, you know, I, I
put an X amount, it has a big number.
He said maybe I hold the rest back and tell us it goes down.
I said, you know, I wouldn't do that.
I would just buy it, you know, because I you may not go back
down and if you're time unless you need it in the next six
months or year or even you know, or two years really, you know,
you know, it'll be higher in 10 years.
So just buy it. You know, that's kind of how I
see it. It's, it's the, it's the final
trade. One of the, one of the things
Larry, that you talked about in your book is a kind of Keynesian
economics, right? And of course, as Bitcoiners,
you know, we were big fans of the Austrian School.
And, you know, for the first time in world history, we what
we saw in Argentina was we saw, you know, an Austrian economist
elected, He won, he won the election.
And within less than a year, you know, inflation was under
control. You know, he's talking about
lowering the tax rate to 10%. Like everything that they, that
the, the, the, the mainstream economist said was impossible
happened in a very short period of time.
And it actually reminded me it, it, this part, this phrase in
your book. I'm not going to read the entire
thing 'cause you guys have to go out and buy the book.
But it reminded me of this phrase where you said the
Austrian school isn't ignored because it's wrong, is It's
ignored because it's dangerous. It's dangerous to the Fed's
power. I'm gonna end it there.
You guys are gonna have to buy the book to read the rest.
But what do you mean by that? Could you elaborate?
So the, so the, so the really the, the Keynesian economics
school and the Federal Reserve and the federal government, I
mean, they're all, they're all thick as thieves.
I mean, they're all, they're all in the same, you know, in the
same camp. And so, you know, if, if you're
a Fed economist, you get paid, you know, you get paid by the
Fed, you get big consulting contracts and gigs.
You know, you're, you're part of quote UN quote, the system and
you know, you, you get rich appointments afterwards.
You can, you know, you sit on board seats, etcetera, etcetera.
I mean, Larry Summers, who was the president of Harvard
University as a economics professor there, you know, he
made $20 million in consulting fees consulting to Wall Street,
you know, when he was secretary of the Treasury, I mean, before
he was or after he was secretary of the Treasury.
So I mean, the, the point is that there's a, there's a kind
of a, a system of bribes and corruption, you know, I mean,
how do these people go to Congress making 200 grand a year
and end up worth millions? You know, I mean, it's, it's
because they get things from other parties that are self
interested and pay them to bend the policies and the rules in
their favor. And so, you know, the Fed has
just totally dominated the economics discussion and they've
tried to make anyone, I mean, the Austrian model perfectly
explains and predicts what's happened to our economy since
the founding of this country. And the book takes you through
that. If you're willing to wade
through, there are two chapters that I've, some people have told
me they're kind of they're rough sledding because I really dig
into the history. I started 1789.
I take you through all the financial developments up to the
present day. And if you look at it, you know,
the, the, the, the Austrian model could have predicted it
and explains all of it. And the Keynesian model is wrong
and doesn't predict any of it and doesn't explain all of it or
any of it. And, and it's, it's kind of,
it's almost laughable how bad they are.
And I've got tons and tons of examples in the book.
And, and yet they, they, you know, they continue in power.
And the reason they do is because the government supports
them, because that Keynesian model allows the government to
overspend and, and, and have the goodies to hand out so that when
you go in as a representative making couple 100 grand a year,
you end up worth millions. And so it's just a big corrupt.
It's like, it's like we're dealing with the mob, you know,
except it's called the government.
And, and, and you know what? We, we, you know, we don't have
to put up with it. We just don't have to put up
with it. But we can't be stupid about
this because, you know, I mean, the mob promises certain people
certain things and that buys a vote.
And the vote might be, you know, that, that, you know, it's
amazing how little people can get bought off with, right?
I mean, it's OK, send me a $2000 STEMI check and I'll vote for
you. Meanwhile, you know, out the
back door they're robbing you. But you know, many, many times
that $2000 in terms of inflation and other stuff, and yet you'll
be bought off by that check. It's ridiculous, right?
Absolutely. People need to understand what's
really happening. That's the problem.
I think that that the average person, I mean, you know, I
mean, just, I don't know, take an average.
I mean, I, I have my teeth cleaned.
Take, take my dental hygienist, right?
I mean, she, you know, she does fine.
She's really good at cleaning teeth, right?
She doesn't, I mean she does. She was bitching about how every
everything is very, very expensive.
I get it. I could completely relate.
I tried the orange pillar. But the point is, you know, she,
she her view was she didn't, she just she doesn't think about
these things. I mean, this just isn't, it's
not her area of expertise. She's not interested in it.
She's interested in her kids and her family and, you know, she,
she goes to work and she does her job and she comes home, but
she knows her groceries cost more and she doesn't know why.
And, and so maybe she turns on the TV and somebody, you know,
Bernie Sanders says it's greed corporations.
Well, no, I mean, that's not really what it is.
There's a there's a bigger issue And and it's a little complex
because these people who've done this to us, they're
sophisticated. You know, they wear nice
clothes. They I was just watching Jay
Paul this afternoon, you know, and you know, I mean, if if you
didn't know better, he would think, gosh, look at this
thoughtful, intelligent man describing to me what he's doing
with monetary policy. That makes a ton of sense.
OK, That's what if if I were a dental Igenis looking at it, I
that's the image that he would be projecting, right?
If you're Larry looking at that, you're going you're a fucking
idiot. You know, you don't know what
you're doing. I mean, you've lied to us here
and you've lied to us for years and we know it.
So you know it. It's but but I know that because
I understand where the bones are buried and because I've been
watching the system and studying it for years.
And so I'm trying to give that knowledge to that dental
hygienist so that she will say the next time some sound money
candidate comes around and says, you know, we need to cut, we
need to shut down the Federal Reserve because we do.
I'm going to vote for that person because I think the
Federal Reserve is causing a lot of my problems, you know, and,
and I, I think the odds, I mean, the number of people in the
United States who understand that today, it's very low,
sadly. But if they, if they, if they
read my book, if they, if they just critically read my book and
think about it, I think they're going to come to the conclusion
which I've come to, which is, Oh my God, this thing is horrible.
I mean, this, this is causing enormous pain for, for millions
of people and has for years. And we're ignoring it.
You know, we got to fix this, right?
Absolutely. I mean, Ron Paul tried to do it
and he got, he got a little bit of momentum.
But but I, I'm, I'm talking about real momentum.
I mean, I'm talking about a national organization to end the
Fed, you know, which, which by the way, I'd be happy to be
president of, you know, I'm seriously, I mean, I'm, I'm
talking about a real movement to return to sound money.
I mean, you know, a crusade, so to speak.
I, I think we're, I think we'll get there, Larry.
And, and you know, as, as bitcoiners become more
influential this year, we became part of the donor class, right?
As, as we know, Washington is run by the donors, right?
We became part of the donor class.
As we get wealthier, I think we're gonna have more and more
influence on American politics. And I and I tweaked this out
semi jokingly, but semi serious. And I said, look, the job's not
over until the Bitcoin flag is on top of the Federal Reserve,
right? And we turn it into a museum for
crimes against humanity. But you know, we're, we're
talking about, you know, we're talking about like these issues
and whatever. But there's also opportunity.
You know, and of course that opportunity is because the
beauty of Bitcoin is, you know, just by you opting out of the
system, you're defunding their system and you're now joining
the sound money team, right? And it's and it's so
simultaneously while you fight it, you can also benefit from
switching over to the system. And it actually reminds me of,
you know, a page in your book where you say something very
powerful that's also resonated with me.
You say having a form of money that is fixed in supply is, is
literally a once in a inhumanity type of a vet, which in my mind
I'm thinking that's a once in a lifetime, once in a humanity
type of opportunity. So could you elaborate a little
bit? Yeah.
So it really this is Saylor has said this recently and then Luke
Roman said it the other day on on Twitter.
You know, this is the most inelastic commodity in the
world. And let me explain what I mean
by that. Some people don't know the term
inelastic means when when the price of any commodity goes up,
the suppliers of that commodity will change their behavior and
make more of it in order to bring the price down and balance
supply and demand. And so, as an example, if the
price of gold doubled tomorrow, we would drill for find and
produce more gold. If the price of oil goes up,
then it makes marginal oil fields profitable.
And so oil, oil drillers will drill them and produce more oil.
So think about that. The supply, price goes up,
supply goes up. That's the law of most
commodities, OK. With Bitcoin, because you have
21 million fixed supply, it's very unique commodity.
Doesn't matter what the price does, the supply can't go up.
The supply just is the supply period.
It's fixed. It's algorithmic.
You know, it's decreasing every four years in terms of its new
issuance. So we've never seen something
like this before ever. There's never been any form of
money that could not be diluted. I mean, even gold, which we used
to be the form, soundest form of money grows, the supply grows at
1.7% a year. Multiply that times 55 years and
you've doubled the amount of gold on the Earth's surface.
OK, so but Bitcoin, there'll only be 21 million.
So as a result of that, this is just, it is, it's a, it's a,
it's a once in humanity. It's a paradigm shift.
I mean it, I don't know how you know, I mean, you know, sailors
says it's like fire with Prometheus.
I don't know, it's like air flight.
I mean, you know, there I mean people couldn't fly and then
suddenly people could fly. Do you know what I mean?
Or, I mean, or people rode horses and then suddenly there
were cars and, you know, top speed on a horse was maybe 1520
miles an hour for a few few minutes.
And you know, cars are going 150 miles an hour now.
So you know, it it it's just, it's that kind of a shift.
And I think that what people are missing and, and I talk about
this in the book too, all the crypto noise, sadly, it's just,
I hate it. It's just, I mean, Dogecoin,
SBFI mean all that crap. It's just so annoying and
distracting because it's just total horseshit.
And it detracts from the one pure signal technological
innovation here that these guys figured out or this person, I
think, I tend to think it's guys.
I think Adam's one of them, by the way.
But but you probably do too. It, it, it, they, they created
immutable digital scarcity. And guess what?
You know, it at first blast, you know, I said, oh, So what?
Who cares? Well, when it comes to money,
that's a big deal. That's a really, really big
deal. And you know, I don't know.
I mean, you know, I mean, before Google existed, did anyone even
know what the concept of a search engine was?
I mean that, you know, the Internet didn't exist.
Google didn't exist, but now, you know, it's, it's, it's a,
it's part of everybody's daily life.
Everybody uses it. Everybody needs to use it.
It's a network, you know, same idea.
I mean, it's just, it's, it's, it's a new innovation that, you
know, is, is going to completely change the world.
And you know, I mean, my, my advice to people is ignore it at
your own, at your own peril. I mean, I've been interacting
with some people on Twitter, you know, people I respect, very
smart investors, macro people and I and you know, they think
it's a bubble and I just say, you know, guys, you know, you're
not looking at the don't let the crypto noise distract you.
Think about what this technology really is and then ask yourself,
you know, OK, you're now aware of it.
So you don't have an excuse. I mean, there'll be people who
aren't aware of it today when it's worth $1,000,000 a coin,
they'll say, oh shit, I didn't know about that.
I'm really sorry I didn't. OK, fine.
But these are true legitimate, professional investors who are
aware of it. And I said, you know, how are
you going to feel when it's a million a coin because it's
going there. And then again, how are you
going to feel when it's $10 million a coin because it's
going there too, you know, not over longer time frames because
you're aware of it. And, you know, it's amazing to
me. I was, I was not at the New
Orleans Investment Conference. I met a guy named Jim Grant.
Some of the older listeners will know who he is.
And he's written a number of great books.
He's a monetary economist. He's he's really a brilliant,
charming guy. And and yet he really shout all
over Bitcoin. He said, well, you know, it'll
be money. Give me 1000 years of history
and then maybe I'll consider it money.
And I said, Jim, when people were wandering around and trying
to jump up in the air and then somebody invented a machine that
allowed him to fly, did you have to wait 1000 years to believe
that the flight made sense? I mean, it was kind, you know,
and, and, and he kind of just scoffed at me.
And I was just like, how can somebody who was supposed to be
a monetary expert miss the biggest development in the
monetary field in 1000 years? I mean, like the change from,
you know, from coins to, to ledgers or, or, or banks.
I mean, it just, it blew my mind.
I mean, I went to Harvard Business School.
I go down there and I, there's a guy there who's going to go to
work for sale, a really nice kid, but he's, he runs the, the
Bitcoin Club. He says, oh, they're about 10
members. And he says, most of my
classmates think I'm absolutely, you know, an idiot.
And I'm like, this is Harvard Business School.
This is the West Point of capitalism.
I went there. OK, yeah.
And there. And I've written to the Dean,
I'm like you and you guys aren't thinking about this, talking
about this, understanding this. I mean, you know, I found this
thing and I understand this thing and I grok this thing.
And I started buying it at 400. And, you know, here I am.
I mean, it's it's like, OK, well, whatever I mean, it, it,
it, it doesn't seem that hard to me.
But I, you know, I had an advantage in that I had a
venture background. And so I and I and I invested in
and watched the Internet develop.
So I've kind of seen this movie once before and it's the, and I,
and I, by the way, I kind of blew it a little bit in that
movie. And I talk about this in the
book. You know, I, I looked at Amazon
and Facebook and Google and I, you know, I was using
traditional investment metrics, the kind of things that they
were taught to me at Business School.
I couldn't get there. I was like, how can you pay this
much money for this business, especially in Amazon?
I wasn't making any money in the early days.
I just like, no, I'm not, I'm not buying that, right?
But I didn't understand Metcalf's law and how networks
grow in value and how, you know, you, you, I mean, they grow at
a, they grow exponentially in, in value, a square of the
underlying, you know, users that are added.
And so, you know, and they're so defensible.
I mean, there won't be another Google, right?
It, it just won't because everybody's there.
Why would anyone change? And so, you know, that's kind of
what's going on here. And, you know, I mean, Google,
like, I just checked it this morning because I was putting it
in the book. Google's up like 9000% since its
IPO, right? Yeah, right.
How many investments in the world, in the history of the
world have ever performed that well?
Not many. OK, on a broad scale, I mean,
and and, and so, you know, and I miss Google, right?
I didn't invest in it I because I thought it was too expensive.
OK, well, guess what? You know, here's another chance.
It's the same model. In fact, argument's even better
than Google because it it touches everything.
And Google touches one specific commerce related search
information piece of the economy, you know, money touches
damn near every piece of the economy.
So it's bigger than Google. So I, I, I really do think that
people are going to be shocked what happens here.
And, and as you know, as we've all seen, I mean, some people, I
mean, just the fact that it's over 100,000 has gotten a lot of
people really salty 'cause, you know, they, they just can't get
their heads around it. But I would just advise them to
get rid of their ego and, and bend the knee and understand.
I mean, you know, look, I don't have a lot of love for Larry
Fink 'cause I think he's a kind of a creepy guy and a Fiat
master. But I'll give him credit.
I mean, everyone knows what I'm talking about.
He's the guy who runs BlackRock. He's $11 trillion largest asset
manager in the United States. I'll give him credit.
You know, he looked at it, thought about it, studied it,
obviously had some people teach him about it and said, you know
what, this thing's going to work.
I either got to get on board or I'm going to get left behind
and, and he got on board. And I think that thought pattern
is going to have to literally occur all throughout the world
over and over and over again. And, you know, we're, we're so
early. I mean, we're still considered
fringe, you know, we're still considered psychopaths and all
the other things. There's still a lot of negative
fun, but, but it, but it's starting to shift.
I mean, it's, I remember the early days of the Internet and a
lot of people thought it was just a joke.
But in the, you know, by 7879, when, I mean, I'm sorry, 909798,
you could see, you know, the, the, the connections were
getting faster. You know, the, the Windows
browser was there. It was point and click instead
of green screen. And you could kind of, we're
kind of at that stage, you know, when the ETFs went through, that
was a hugely positive event. Huge, huge.
I mean, I had a lot of people who actually aren't filled right
after that because the rejection prior to that had been well, the
government's going to just kill this thing.
Yeah, you're right. I get it sound money.
I'm I'm all for that. But there's no way the
government's going to let you do that.
And but the ETF got to prove it really, you know, now, now look,
we may have a counter reformation.
I mean, you know, this is it's very favorable to the Trump
administration is going to be positive for Bitcoin.
But if in four years we have a blue wave, you know, they may
come back and try and 61O2 us or do a lot of other things, which
is why, you know, self custody and so forth is important.
But, you know, it's it, to me, it's just, it's obvious.
I mean, the dogs are eating the food and, and there are more
dogs coming every year and you know, so then the food's going,
the food's going up in price, which is what dogs like, you
know, And so it, you know, it's a positive feedback loop that I,
I just can't see ending anytime soon.
Absolutely. And, you know, and, and, and
just to kind of add to it some of your points, right?
Like realistically they have two years.
Historically, what tends to happen is the incumbent party
loses the House. So they got two years of, of the
trifecta of the House, the Senate, the executive branch,
and they have the judicial branch of the Supreme Court.
So let's see, The thing is, you know, the UNI party is strong,
right? So let's see, you know, I, I, I
have confidence with Elon and Vivek in there 'cause they're
very competent and capable entrepreneurs.
But again, how many times have we put faith in, you know,
administration, whatever, just to be let down, right?
It's like we, we've seen this story so many times again.
But I, I want to focus on the positives 'cause we are getting
to the top of the hour. And I do want to be respectful
of your time, Larry. And one of the, the charts that
I'm looking at here, like towards the end of the book and
something that you were just talking about, which is Malcolm
Gladwell's S Curve. And you make the case that
there's the innovator stage, there's the early adopter stage,
there's the early majority stage, there's the late majority
stage, and there's the laggard stage.
Now, I think what most people would think by listening to this
podcast and Bitcoin's currently sitting at $100,000 roughly,
give or take. You'd be like Nico, like I'm,
I'm, it's late, but you actually make the case that we are on the
cusp of, we're still in the early adopter phase and we're on
the cusp of entering the early majority phase.
So what do you mean by that? Well, I think that's exactly
right. It's, it's the point in time.
I mean, Saylor says this, he says he said he thinks the next
10 years are going to be a digital gold rush for Bitcoin.
I think he's right. I mean, we've, we've broken
through. I mean, I remember 17, I, I got
involved in 14. I bought a few of them, not
many. I bought more in 17.
I, I bought on the dip and after that twice doubled down twice.
But you know, 1819 it was still pretty fringe and, and you know,
we'd just come through the block size wars and there'd been forks
earlier and so on and so forth, you know, and, and then 20 it,
it worked, you know, we, we took off with all the money printing
because it responded to that and, and as a, as a sound form
of money. But then, you know, the
tightening brought it all back down and SPF blew us up.
But, you know, it's, it's now there's, there's now almost
nobody that's not aware of its, its existence.
I mean, I, you know, here's a perfect example.
This morning I was reading the Wall Street Journal, Nick
Timiraos was speaking about Fed policy and he talked about how,
you know, whether it was tight or loose was in part determined
by things like this, you know, the screaming price of Bitcoin.
I don't think those were his words, but, you know, I mean,
and for Bitcoin to be mentioned in an article about Fed policy,
I mean, that's kind of an Overton window shift, right?
So, so everyone's becoming aware of this thing.
And so, yeah, I mean, the Gladwell model says as long as
it takes you to go from zero to 15 or 10%, it'll take the same
amount of time to go from 10 to 90.
And so we're 16 years in and, and, and these adoption curves,
they do get steep. And I've seen the same curve for
mobile phones, computers, PC, I mean, you know, almost every
development, I mean, washing machines that, you know,
automobiles, any new invention and, and you know, it, it tends
to get started and, and people start using it, the early
adopters. But then when it becomes pretty
obvious that, oh, this is a good thing and we want this.
And I think that's what's happening now.
I mean, most people now, well, there's nobody in Bitcoin now
that's bought it in the last, you know, 15 years.
It's not in a profit condition. So it's working.
Even if you bought at the peak, you know, pre SPF, you paid 60
or 70 and we're we were as recently as 107.
So you know, it's starting to work and that's just going to
attract more people. So and, and I think, you know,
the, the, the word is spreading and people coming to understand
what it is. The flood around energy and the
flood around Sam Beckman freed. Those are getting explained
away. And I try and deal with those in
the book. I mean, if you look at what this
book is, I want this book to be the perfect book for orange
killing anybody. You know, I mean, Lynn's book is
better, Safe's book is better, Jeff Booth's book is better.
But what this is, and in fact this is I didn't really even
write this book. I just pulled together the
brilliant ideas of a lot of other people and put them into.
And I think what I'm pretty good at doing is kind of explaining
complicated things in a simple way.
And so I just pulled all these different ideas together and put
them into a narrative and then told my own personal story to
make it somewhat funny and interesting such that, you know,
somebody could pick this thing up and go, Oh, I get it.
I think. I think this guy's right.
And, and maybe I should pay attention to this me because I,
you know, I everybody and, you know, most human beings, you
know, they care about their future.
They care about their children's future.
And, you know, they, if they have savings, they know that,
you know, what they do with those savings will determine the
quality of that future. And so this is, this is a book
aimed to write squarely at that subject, you know, and, and
showing how the system is set up to, to rob them of their
savings. And yet they've got a really
great tool that they can fight back with what that will then
allow them to actually conquer and beat the system.
And by the way, as we all conquer and beat it, we can fix
it so that all that theft stops. So it's, it's a good thing.
It's a very good, positive thing.
Well, I'm, I'm, you know, I am super excited for this to to
drop. Well, me, me too.
I got to tell you, I'll tell you, I'll just tell everybody's
listening. Getting getting this thing
formatted and processed and through Amazon.
It's a nightmare. I mean, I mean, you know, the
big book publishers are just, they were, they were going to
take six months to publish it, a year to publish it.
I was like, no, that's not going to work.
I want this thing to get out now.
So as a result of that choice, I had to go to Amazon.
We go to Amazon and it's, you know, it's, it's clunky, but you
know, I'm doing the best I can and it'll hopefully it'll be
graphically appealing. And if it's not, I'll the second
version will be a little, I'll do addition too quickly and give
people a refund if they don't like the first edition.
But I'm I'm trying to get it laid out well and introduced and
and I really have AI have a hard goal of having it out in
February. So.
Love it. Well guys, the name of the book
is the Big print. What happened to America and How
sound money Can fix it, of course, written by Larry
Leppard. The preface is is great.
He has a quote of from one of my favorite movies and I'm I'm not
going to say it because you guys are going to have to buy the
book. Yeah, there you go.
Thanks. You go tease him.
But but yeah, it's it's a great stuff.
And you know, Larry, always an honor to have you on the show.
Always. I'm always loved the.
You're one, you're one of the original podcasts that I got
involved with and I've I've really enjoyed it.
And so, you know, we we share bus rides in El Salvador and,
and you've been a good friend so.
Absolutely, Larry. Well, an honor like always.
I think the best is yet to come. And you know, I'm I'm positive
we're going to cross paths and the many Bitcoin conferences in
2025 and congratulations, you completed this super, super
quick. And of course, guys, this is
going to be dropping our Christmas.
Merry Christmas, everyone. It's a perfect gift to give to
somebody you know that the the uncle or aunt that still doesn't
understand Bitcoin, get him Larry's book.
So thank you guys for watching, Appreciate it, and thank you so
much for coming on, Larry. Yeah.
Thanks, Nico. Good to see you.