It's all going to zero against Bitcoin.
It's going up forever. You're against Bitcoin.
You're against freedom. You're not going to say that
Bitcoin conference in Nashville over the weekend.
It feels like one of those Seminole moments that people are
going to be talking about years from now.
My next guest actually played a major role at the conference and
continues to be a passionate advocate dedicated to spreading
the word and educating the masses.
Joining me now, Coin Stories podcast host Natalie Brunel.
Natalie, you know, it's so weird because it wasn't long ago
Bitcoin was tumbling, right? It was under 20,000.
Even people who love to said it may go to 10,000.
Could you imagine now, I mean, just not long after that, you're
getting shout outs on X from US senators, sitting US senators
for discussing Bitcoin. It's come a long way in a short
period of time. Yes, it has.
We missed you in Nashville, Charles, because this conference
was truly historic. You had a former U.S.
President telling people not to sell their Bitcoin and people
are really ready for change and a pro Bitcoin administration.
Some of our current leaders have been leading a war on digital
assets. So they need to go because
remember, Bitcoin was created by the people for the people.
It wasn't delivered by Wall Street or Washington DC.
It wasn't promoted by big tech. It emerged from the market to
become the 8th or 9th largest asset in the world.
And now two of the three candidates are lobbying this
community because it's grown into a massive voting bloc and
they're seriously proposing to adopt Bitcoin as a strategic
reserve asset for the US. So this is historic and shows
that Bitcoin is winning. Yo everybody welcome to the
Bitcoin live you're number one source for the peaceful Bitcoin
evolution recovery can use culture magic warfare will be
your guide through the separation of money and say
leisures amount sip sit back relax enjoy the ride.
Welcome to the most watched daily Bitcoin live show on
YouTube, Rumble Annex, simply Bitcoin live.
Natalie Burnell coming in hot. But the reason I want to play
you guys that clip this morning is that I gotta say it, guys,
the Bitcoin conference, when you had Donald Trump making his
speech, a lot of Bitcoiners very uncomfortable.
He's kept saying crypto. He wasn't exactly dialed in
compared to RFK. RFK definitely went up to him
with his speech, but we definitely broke into the
mainstream. You had Michael Knowles from The
Daily Wire making appearance. You had all of the legacy
corporate media, financial media, and just corporate media
there. They they literally had cameras
to bring to this event because the potential future president
was making a speech there. That is absolutely historic.
Talk about the Overton window shifting, the Overton window
breaking. And even if Donald Trump doesn't
get elected, these ideas are now introduced, right?
The, the, the, and I think the key thing that Donald Trump said
was basically the introduction that they were that the United
States government, if he is to get elected, was going to look
at Bitcoin as a strategic reserve stockpile.
They were right before reserve asset.
So stockpile to be specific, but that is definitely a step in the
right direction. I think RFK as a member of, you
know, as someone who's running as an independent is able to say
things a little bit more radical in terms of the Overton window
for us Bitcoiners is not radical at all.
But remember, RFK doesn't really have a chance of winning
according to the latest poll numbers in the betting odds,
Trump does have a chance of winning.
So the fact that we have a mainstream political candidate
that has a high probability of winning the presidency saying
everything he said is a really, really big deal for our
movement. And it's not a coincidence that
literally that Monday, the same yesterday Bitcoin that was, you
know, belong to this Treasury Department, they, you know, they
seized it from various sources. It's not a coincidence that
moved, right? And a lot of people are
speculating that they're they're getting ready to dump it.
And another thing that I got to say is, and then something that
I feel passionate about is that I don't think Bitcoin is a
partisan issue. I think that it was made a
partisan issue as soon as this specific administration started
going after the industry. And that created an opportunity
for their political opponents to capitalize on that.
And it's crazy that they're still not changing tune.
In fact, on Monday, they're just like, you know what the Trump
says, we're going to make it a strategic reserve.
We're, we're going to sell it right, right before Trump
potentially gets into office. Like it's crazy.
I, I don't believe anything the Democratic Party has to say at
this point. It's kind of put up or shut up
in regards to Bitcoin. We're not a political show, but
it's kind of put up or shut up. You know, Biden is currently in
office. He Biden has the ability to free
Ross so he could take that political advantage away from
Trump like they can take a stance and a lot of Senate, I
believe it's seventy members of the Democratic Party was
actually where I actually wrote a letter to the Elizabeth Warren
camp, which they're the camp that's so hostile towards this
industry and they were asking him basically to change tune.
They're like, what are you guys doing?
In fact, we did have a member of the Democratic Party that spoke
at the convention. So I hope that keeps going
because Natalie was absolutely right, like Bitcoin is a money
by the people for the people. And this Bitcoin conference, I
think really represented the first time that our movement and
the ethos of our movement started to penetrate into the
mainstream consciousness. And I think the best is yet to
come. This is just getting started.
One of the things that Trump said, his speech was hilarious,
by the way. I highly recommend watching it.
One of the things you guys are going to have so much energy.
You guys are going to say no much no more energy.
Like it's so funny. But one of the things he said
was that the industry was still in its infancy.
And that's something that I completely agree.
And I think that's something that gets lost on everybody,
right? In other news as well, Michael
Saylor's keynote was absolutely phenomenal.
The way that he broke it down into various sections about how
he described that. Look, if you want to maintain
your purchasing power, Bitcoin is the superior asset, real
estate is inferior, bonds are inferior, equities are inferior.
He broke out, he broke down the reasons as to why that was, But
one of the things that I want to talk about today was he was
doing some price predictions, which is very interesting.
And he laid out three cases, The bear case, which about roughly
$3,000,000 per Bitcoin by 2045. The base case, which is about
$13 million Bitcoin by 2045 and the bull case, which is $49
million Bitcoin by 2045. And again, this isn't just, you
know, some average Joe or some just random Bitcoin Twitter.
And on this is, you know, the, you know, the chairman of a
publicly traded Bitcoin publicly traded company, you know, saying
those things. And I think his logic is sound.
And for anyone that finds those ideas radical, I think it's a
good idea to look into the past, right?
If I would have told you back in 2014 that Bitcoin was going to
be sitting pretty at $66,254 today, on July 30th, 2024, you
would have laughed me out of the room.
But if you knew that information, I think you would
have done everything in your power just to go all in Bitcoin
in 2014. You would have just worked.
You would have just done everything in your power to
accumulate as much Bitcoin as possible.
So I think if Bitcoin continues in that trend, even if it does a
10th of what it did in the past, you're still gonna be extremely
happy with your decision to save in Bitcoin versus saving in Fiat
versus saving in other traditional kind of investment
options, really. So anyways, it's gonna be a
great show. And also we have a very special
guest, also someone I consider a friend as well.
We have the CEO of Thunder Funder.
The funder did an amazing presentation at the Bitcoin
conference. And Thunder Funder essentially
gives the ability for the everyday person, right, to
invest in Bitcoin companies, which is extremely exciting.
Anyways, Mike, thank you so much for coming on the show.
All right, let's have some fun. It's an honor to be hanging with
you. I consider you a friend as well,
even if you've taken many of my stats and many poker games, but
I don't hold it against you. You are definitely a friend.
Thanks for for hanging with me and letting me share the big
news about Thunder Funder. Absolutely.
And it, and it's, it's, it's an incredible opportunity for you
guys as well in the audience. Like imagine if you're able to
get into like the equivalent would be like an Amazon or
Facebook and you were actually able to invest in those
companies in the early stage, right?
Mike's platform that he's building.
I've been watching it closely, even though I might not
understand a lot of those things because I'm a media minded
person. He's I know he's been putting
his heart and soul into really building this.
And it gives you an opportunity for you guys to invest in early
stage startups, early stage Bitcoin startups, which could
potentially become an incredible opportunity.
So I'm really excited to hear more about that during the
culture segment. You want to bring up my
legendary Co host Boo filled in for me yesterday Opti man Opti
is an absolute workhorse and I do wanna give a shout out for
him filling in for me yesterday. And Opti bro, that news desk, I
don't know if you guys saw it. I think we uploaded it over the
weekend, but shout out to the Bitcoin Magazine crew, David
Bailey, Mike Germano, Shane McShane and Pete Russo for
allowing a simply Bitcoin takeover 2 days in a row at the
Bitcoin conference, which was, you know, absolutely incredible.
So shout out to you guys and shout out to Opti.
I mean Opti bro, like, how'd it feel, dude?
I mean, I think, I think you gave a shout out to.
I think you, you gave a shout out to your mom.
Hey, you know, I'm a mother's boy.
I I'm unashamedly a mama's boy. And of course I had to give a
shout out to my mom. She's the only reason why I'm
here, man. But yeah, hey, Nika, I think the
funny, the nice part about this is you tried to give me the week
off this week and then you're like, wait, actually I need you
to come on the show. Yeah, I need you to host.
So good thing I told you. No, guys, I do this for you
guys. I'm like, no, I got to make the
show. We got to make the show.
And then Nico hits me up in the morning.
He's like, oh, actually sorry, bro, I'm not going to make the
show. So we got to make it happen.
But yeah, man, it was great. I I love the Bitcoin mag team.
It was an honor to take over the news desk.
You and I had a blast. It felt like a live simply
Bitcoin show on the news desk. So that was great, man.
Yeah, it was, it was incredibly, it was incredibly a fun time and
and it's such a historic conference and actually I'll,
I'll, I'll throw a little tidbit for you guys.
Simply Bitcoins 4th 4th anniversary was July 27th, the
day of Donald Trump's speech at the Bitcoin conference.
So that was simply his 4th anniversary.
It was just, it's just crazy how all the timing of all that stuff
works. Anyways, before we jump into the
show, I do want to give a shout out to our sponsor.
Of course, our sponsors make this show possible.
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All right everybody, we have lots to talk about.
Let's get to numbers. Here we go.
The Bitcoin numbers. I just want to give a shout out
to our sponsor, Stamp Seed. All right, everybody, so don't
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anything on their website. At the time of recording the
Bitcoin price is 66,303 $66,300 sats per dollar 1508 Block
height 854,683 blocks to having 195,317 having estimate March
20th, 2028 Total Lightning Network capacity 5061 BTC
Capacity value 335 million U.S. dollars realized monetary
inflation 1.49% market capitalization 1.34 trillion
Bitcoin versus gold market cap 7.89%.
In the grand scheme of things, we are just getting started.
I truly believe that. I think it was actually Donald
Trump that during his speech he want talk about the Overton
window shifting. Talk about the Overton window
breaking. Donald Trump even said he's like
this is going to take the this is going to take the market cap
of gold. You know how crazy that is for,
you know, an ex president, potential future president,
we'll find out in November say that Bitcoin is going to
overtake the market cap of gold. Like that is absolutely freaking
insane. Anyways, the thing that I wanted
to talk about today, we'll play this video and then we'll
discuss it with the panel is Michael Saylor making his bowl
case for a $49 million Bitcoin by 2045.
I got to say, holy cow, that is, I feel like every Bitcoin
conference it's, you know, it's more bullish.
Now, of course, Michael Saylor, his company, they hold over
250,000 Bitcoin. So it kind of makes sense, you
know, as to why he would say this and you know, the
incentives. I gotta say it's hyper bullish.
But if you pay attention to his logic, his thought process, it
almost feels like a YouTube clickbait title, bro.
But it's not like he actually said this.
He actually said that this is one of his, you know, his bull
cases. Now 2045 is, you know, it's,
it's about 21 years from now, right?
So it's, you know, it's, it's not around the corner.
But at the same time, I mean $49 million Bitcoin, you get
1,000,000 bit you get one Bitcoin right now at 66,000.
You could potentially be worth $49 million in 21 years.
I mean, that's not a bad deal at all.
Most people don't even make close to that amount of money.
Anyways, I'm going to play this video.
We'll talk about it. But what's happening?
Here's my macro Bitcoin forecast.
It's 21 years, goes out to the year 2045.
What do I think will happen? Well, I've got a bear case and a
bull case. But what I think will happen is
that 55% ARR goes to 50 percent, 454035302520.
It's between 50 and 20. It'll gradually decelerate till
it's growing about twice as fast as the S&P index.
And at that rate, Bitcoins $13 million a coin in the year 2045.
Thirteen million. It could be.
It could be a 3 million bear case.
It could be a 49 million bull case.
But what is Bitcoin? 7% of the world's assets.
Then what about the rest of the assets?
Well, I actually think that AIS and technology are going to
revolutionize tech. We had no companies worth a
trillion. Then we had a bunch of trillion
dollar companies. You're going to see more because
you're going to see companies with 100,000 AIS and no
employees and they're going to do the work of companies that
used to have 100,000 employees. You're going to see mega corps
develop, you know, shipping robots and self driving cars and
a company that gives a personal physician to a billion people
without any doctors on the payroll.
So clearly equity is going to grow fast, gold's going to get
demonetized, land will be less monetized.
But look, here's the future in 2045 doesn't look that
revolutionary. It looks like today it's just.
I mean, 7% of the global reserve global assets for, you know,
those, those crazy that I would say what we perceive as those
crazy predictions today. I don't think that's so absurd.
And, and the reason that I say that is because I think, you
know, and this is what Saylor said in in the beginning of his
presentation, he did an excellent job describing it.
Like Bitcoin is a superior asset compared to real estate.
Real estate, you have to pay property taxes, you have to pay
maintenance. You know, it, it kind of, you
know, chews into it, right? You know bond and he was making
the case of like what's the lifespan of this, right?
The, the, the example that he gave for real estate was
basically a property in Miami Beach, a $10 million property in
Miami Beach. And over 10 years you're going
to have to pull up just in property taxes the equivalent of
that property, right? Or in maintenance fees and all
that stuff. Bonds, he gave it a lifespan
about 30 years. Equities, I think he gave it a
lifespan. So he was giving lifespans to
these specific assets. But, but essentially, if you put
Bitcoin to self custody, I think the, the number that he gave it
was like 10,000 years, which is just absurd.
Even custody Bitcoin was like 1000 years or so.
So yes, I think it's, I think it's inevitable as people start
to realize like, especially like if you're like a Chinese citizen
or you know, these citizens where you live in a country that
has like tight capital controls and they, they don't just, they
just don't want you to leave with the money.
Like what a lot of what a lot of those people do is that they'll
go overseas and they'll start buying properties in like
Manhattan and Miami and those apartments will just like remain
empty. And they're doing that just to
maintain their purchasing power and just to take their money
out. But now that you have a
technology, now that you have a tool where you can literally
write down a 12 or 24 word seed phrase and you can take all of
that wealth with you and you don't have to pay taxes on it.
There's no maintenance fees. I mean, you might have to
upgrade a hardware wallet a couple times, but that that's
miniscule in the grand scheme of things.
Like technically, if you die and you don't tell anyone where your
private keys are like those that that money isn't moving till the
end of time. Like what else could you say
that with? You really can't say that with.
So is it too, is it that absurd to think that a superior asset
like Bitcoin with absolute scarcity, nothing else has
absolute scarcity. Is it really absurd to think
that it might be worth 7% of the total global assets?
Like is that really, is that really that absurd?
I don't think that that's absurd.
And if that's not absurd, then just the base case is $13
million. I mean, and what, what are we
sitting at 66,000 right now? Like you'll be worth more than
10 million if you're able to get your hands on one Bitcoin right
now. I mean, like that's a pretty
good effing deal. I don't know.
What do you think, Moz? Yeah, I mean, to be a whole
coiner, that's the goal, right? It's the goal of a lot of
people. But you know, I think my biggest
regret and I've been in Bitcoin for quite a while is not turning
on just a daily, even just a silly buy at any point in time
and just never turning it off. You know, $1010.00 a day even at
recently, whatever it went down to, was it 3000 or $45110 a day
with a $3000 Bitcoin, which is not that long ago.
You look like a genius right now.
And just to go back in time and actually know what was going to
happen and what will continue to happen and think that for every
$10 you were putting in then was pretty much a day's wage or more
than a day's wage for more most people when you look at where
we're at now. So, you know, the DCA is the way
to go. I know you, you preach, preach
on that and saving in Bitcoin and all we can do is the best we
can do. And you know, if that, if those
numbers come true, it's going to be insane.
I mean, Can you imagine somebody with two Bitcoin right now
that's maybe in the middle class or upper middle class?
And that's a lot of their savings and they took a risk and
all of a sudden they're sitting on $20 million.
If this thing does what we all think it's going to do, I mean,
it's just super exciting. Absolutely.
I mean, it's power back to the people.
It's incredibly exciting and I think it's incredible
opportunity for everybody. And I think it's important to
look at the past if you want to have an idea of where the future
is going. And what's the line Opti?
What can be unburdened by what has been?
Yeah, don't be burdened by what has.
I don't even know how to apply to that, but you guys get the
general gist of it. Opti, what's your take on this?
Is this hyper bullish? Is I mean, bro, this is like
this is when I heard that I was like, holy shit, like holy cow,
like that is extremely bullish. But I mean, the way that he
explains it in the logic that he's using is very sound.
So it's not like, you know, like click bait YouTube videos, duck
face, like, you know, crazy shit.
Like he actually, you know, he's making these three cases.
And even if it's the bear case, like let's just say it's the
bear case, right? Let's just say doesn't get to 13
million. Let's just say it gets to 3
million, right? Personally, it'd be a little bit
disappointed, but let's just say that's the case, right?
Let's take the ultra conservative route.
That's still an excellent, that's still an excellent
return. I mean $3,000,000 for 66,000
like that's, that's an amazing return.
You have more experience than me and, and you know, like the
investment side of things. Where else could you get that
type of return? Other than investing in Bitcoin
startups, of course. Well, it's true, there aren't
really any places where you can get that kind of appreciation,
which was one of the things that got me interested in Angel
investing in the 1st place is once you start seeing some of
the returns that have happened over time, you know, and not a
meme stock or a shit coin for lack of a better words.
Investing in early stage companies is definitely
something that you know where you can get a tremendous crazy
return. But.
You can also lose all your money, which we know we're not
going to do in Bitcoin, right? So it's not a substitute for it,
it's just a way to complement it.
Of course, like and it's all about risk, right?
Like, you know, if if you're, it's all about like, look, if
you're willing to risk, you know, a certain percentage, a
certain small percentage of your portfolio, knowing that there is
potential upside, you know, it might be worthwhile to you.
Opti what? What's your take on this?
Yeah, so when I heard this speech, I literally, I literally
have to like double take. I'm like, wait, you know, 3
million. I'm like, that's kind of
bearish. Like 13 million in 21 years.
You're like, yeah, that seems about right.
And then he just drops like 49 million bomb on us and you're
just like, wait, really? Like I know, I know we get
stupidly bullish and I always tell you guys like stable
tarded, this is how we win is is by being hopeful about the
future. But even for us Bitcoiners that
are extremely bullish, 49,000,000 by 21 years from now,
it it still seems absurd. But again, if you were in
Bitcoin a long time ago, you're buying Bitcoin at $1000, you
probably would have said that 66,000 seems absurd.
I remember when I got into Bitcoin, everyone was saying
like $10,000 was like the moon case.
And now we're just constantly moving the price up higher.
But yeah, like Muzz was saying, you know, for average people of
average means, like all of us that hang out on the show, if
you can get your hands on a coin and hold that for the long term,
like it's going to be life changing money.
And this is what we always say here on the show.
It's like none of us are bullish enough because we're, you know,
I, I know as much as I always say, we're playing hungry Hippo
with Bitcoin and we want to acquire as much Bitcoin as
possible. But I think we underestimate how
much our purchasing power will increase in the next decade or
two decades or three decades. And it really reminds me of that
one quote where it's like you overestimate what you can do in
two years, but you underestimate what you can do in 10 years.
And I think that's what we're all kind of doing here with
Bitcoin. Remember the the law of big
numbers, like humans can't understand big numbers.
And I think where we're going is going to be, you know, what's
what can be is going to be unburdened by what has been.
And so this. Is a good line for Bitcoin bro
it. Really is we're stealing that
one, but I know a lot of us Bitcoiners are looking at the
past previous cycles in Bitcoin and being like, oh, diminishing
returns. Oh, Bitcoin's not going to go as
far and as high as we think it will be like you guys are being
over bullish. What can be exactly?
That's the point. That's the point of this is that
like, I still fundamentally believe unburdened by what has
been, yes, I fundamentally believe that we have still seen
a very small percentage on the adoption scale.
And if people are bearish out there, they really just don't
understand how many people aren't on planet Earth and how
much capital can actually get into Bitcoin.
So as much as $49 million in 21 years sounds like a ludicrous
prediction. At least we got 1A price
prediction and a time prediction.
So only time will tell whether this is correct or whether this
is just some opium clickbait here.
But hey, it's going up forever, Laura.
So, you know, Infinity divided by 21 million.
Now we're seeing the game theory kick in and everyone is starting
to realize they need some Bitcoin.
So hey, what can be unburdened by what has been Nico?
Exactly, exactly. All right, everybody looks at
the news. Lots to talk about.
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Anyways, talk about the Overton window absolutely breaking.
It absolutely happened during the Bitcoin conference.
I mean, this is insane. I was talking a little bit about
it during the opening monologue. You know, not only did Trump
promise to, you know, not only did Trump promise to free Ross
again, he doubled down on that promise, you know, promised to
fire Gary Genser, which the crowd went wild.
It like, surprised him a little bit.
He's like, whoa, I'm going to say that again.
I'm going to fire Gary Genser. Everyone's like, you know, he
obviously promised to, you know, leave the industry alone.
He kept saying how everyone's going to get rich, which was
nice. And I think he took credit for
the price going up at one point, which I found that interesting
as well. But yeah, I think a lot of
people were just a bit surprised just because they've never been
to, they've never seen a Trump speech before.
I think also a lot of people were a bit a bit like they were
they wanted more. And I think the reason they
wanted more is because JFK just went absolutely hard in the
paint. Like what JFK did was insane.
And compared to RF KS speech, Trump's speech was a bit
underwhelming. Like RFK set the bar extremely
high and Trump did not match it. But it's important like for
everyone to understand. Like, it's a lot easier for RFK
to promise policies outside the Overton window as an independent
candidate. And Trump's obviously tied to a
major political party. I still think that Trump's
speech was definitely a step in the right direction.
It was absolutely historic. And it's going to be a major win
for Bitcoiners and the Bitcoin industry in the United States if
he gets elected. But I think really the huge news
out of that entire speech and he really like left this tidbit
towards the end was announcing that his administration wouldn't
see, wouldn't sell any more Bitcoin and they would see
Bitcoin as a one step short of strategic asset, basically a
strategic stockpile. Now, here's the difference
between RFK and Trump is that RFK could, and you know, he, he
did, our administrator is going to buy 4 million Bitcoin, we're
going to put Bitcoin strategic reserve asset, we're going to
acquire all this Bitcoin, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.
But everyone has to remember that would be an executive
order, right? Which means that once RFK were
to leave office, any administration after him would
be able to walk that back. So actually that needs to be
codified into law. And that's why shortly after
Trump made his speech, Senator Cynthia Lemus, the Bitcoin
senator, went on stage and he said, here's the bill that would
make Bitcoin a strategic reserve asset into law so that you
couldn't walk it back as an administration.
Also, she also introduced a Bitcoin acquisition strategy up
to $1 million to pay off the country's debt.
So I love the way that they did it politically, was very savvy.
It was it was very interesting. And it's the way that things
should be done, right? Because if you actually want to
effectuate change, you have to do it through the legislative
process rather than through the executive branch, because the
executive branch only has so much power, right?
So I think it was historic and I think initially I was a bit
disappointed like a lot of other Bitcoiners because clearly RFK
one up Trump. But we have to be realistic and
we have to remember RFK is running as an as an independent
and Trump is running as a mainstream Republican.
Also, a lot of the things that RFK said were just completely
radical, like they would be viewed as completely right and
the media would just, they already hate Trump.
They would just run with this, right.
So very, very interesting. But I don't want to talk about
that because I believe Opti talked about that yesterday.
What I do want to talk about is something that really, really is
important for me, which is this idea that Bitcoin is for
everyone. It should not be a partisan
issue and I truly believe that the current Democratic Party
does not represent the will of their constituents.
Now, it's not black and white. Obviously there was members of
the of the Democratic Party, one of them being ROH Khanna that
you know that he's he spoke some some pretty good things about
the industry. I have a clip right here.
But if we don't have Bitcoin, if we don't have crypto currencies,
we're going to seed leadership in the financial innovation of
the 21st century. Why would we do that?
Why? We need to be the leaders.
This is a payment that's going to be cheaper.
It's going to be faster. It's going to have the ability
to move a few cents across the world without the fees.
It's going to make us more connected in a global society.
I mean, all the Democrats who preach that we don't want to be
isolationist. Well, isn't rejecting crypto
currencies and Bitcoin being isolationist because the rest of
the world is using it? So this is actually connecting
to the rest of the world. So the conference was saying,
you know, let's be let America lead when it comes to the
instruments of financial innovation.
And you have the Fed payment now, Fed now, and you have Zelda
with the banks. I don't want a monopoly of the
Fed and the banks deciding how to have instantaneous payments.
Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies are competitive alternatives so that
we don't have monopoly power. I thought the Democrats were
opposed to monopoly power. So I mean, I think he's spot on,
right? And I think that's just common
sense and that, again, he's not a Republican like it's a
Democrat. So this is what I've been
saying, like this should not be a partisan issue.
The current administrative administration made it as such.
And they should really be paying attention because like even with
their own live stream numbers, like here is Vice President
Harris delivering a keynote and mind you, is Vice President
Harris is going to be running for president.
About 822 people are watching that.
We currently have more people watching simply Bitcoin right
now and compare that to the Bitcoin Magazine live stream had
56,171 people watching live and that's just on YouTube, by the
way, on Twitter was much higher than that.
So just to kind of give you an idea between the two and by the
way, Ro Connor, I hope I'm pronouncing that correctly,
wasn't the only one to feel that way. 27 other Democratic
politicians signed a letter to the DNC and to the and to
Elizabeth Warren to end the anti Bitcoin policy.
So I don't know if I'll have time to read this entire thing,
but I'll get to some of it. Chair Harrison and prospective
presidential candidates, we representing a range of
Democratic officials, candidates for the House and members of
Congress right to urge you to take a forward-looking approach
to digital assets and blockchain technology.
The area holds immense potential for American innovation,
economic growth and financial inclusion.
Representing the emerging stance of the Democratic Party in the
United States, leaders such as the Senate Majority Leader Chuck
Schumer, Speaker Amerita Nancy, Nancy Pelosi and majority of
House Democratic leadership have recently supported pro digital
asset legislation. However, there is a public
perception that the party holds a negative viewpoint on digital
assets largely due to the current SC CS approach to these
transformative technologies. We believe that the previous
hostility does not reflect our party's progressive,
forward-looking and inclusive values.
A refresh leader of the ticket represents an opportunity to
change that perception. I completely agree.
Such a great opportunity for them to step in and say, you
know what, like we're going to end this.
And you know what they did everybody.
Here's Mike Germano, president of Bitcoin magazine.
Well, now the game begins. Already working on FOIA requests
will take months to get to the truth.
This is a direct reaction to the Bitcoin conference and they want
us to send a message. What did they send?
What did they say? U.S. government split the $2
billion worth of Bitcoin into two separate addresses, 10,000
BTC and 19 thousand 19,800 BTC. And this happened Monday, the
day after the Bitcoin conference, the day after or a
couple days after Donald Trump promised that if you were to get
elected president, he wouldn't sell any of the Bitcoin that the
US government currently has in custody.
So what I got to say is very simple, like it's very easy to
talk. Actions are expensive and you
know, I I appreciate Congressman Ro Khanna I I appreciate those
members of the Democratic Party that wrote that letter.
But currently I see operation choke point 2.0.
I say I see the proposed Bitcoin mining ban.
I see Bitcoin wallets just exiting the country Phoenix
wallet wallet of satoshi. Why because of the regulatory
environment. I see the a samurai wallet guys
get arrested. I saw Roger Verg get arrested.
So like, forgive me if I don't believe you.
Like I don't believe what they're saying.
I think it's very easy to, you know, go through Mark Cuban and
say, hey, you know, Democratic members are meeting with the
Bitcoin industry representatives, blah, blah,
blah. It's very easy to say that what,
when push comes to shove, time after time they've shown
hostility towards the industry. So anyways, here's Francis
Pulio, CEO of Bowl Bitcoin. He says we may be witnessing the
first instance of a power struggle with an incumbent
government leveraging its control over a national private
keys as a measure to harm the incoming new government.
I'm here for it. That's a really good take.
Another take as well. No, I think that's the last take
anyways. But the point is, is that look,
they have they have an opportunity.
The Democratic Party right now, currently they hold the
executive office. Joe Biden has the privilege, has
the ability, has the power to free Ross right now.
They have the power to just do a 180 show everyone.
They had the power to go to the conference and, you know, take
that political advantage away from Donald Trump.
It's 50 million voters. And by the way, these voters
don't lean left or they don't lean right.
I Dan saying in the chat, big mistake for the US government
selling. It's Bitcoin.
I said this to Sailor. I think it's absolutely crazy
that they're selling. They're selling something that
is absolutely scarce for something that they can just
create out of thin air. That is absolutely insane.
That is insanity. That is crazy.
I think that's what happens when your your brain is on Fiat.
So anyways, I don't want this to become a partisan issue.
It worries me a little bit what happens if Donald Trump doesn't
win the election? I think that let me Donald Trump
warned it like he said that during the speech.
He's like, they're going to go after the industry if I don't
win the election and they're not showing me otherwise.
They're walking back their words a little bit, but their actions
are not being walked back at all.
Muzz, as a Bitcoin entrepreneur that is based in the US, does
you know the political environment?
Like what are your take? What are your what's your take
on the Bitcoin conference? What happened And what's your
take on this? Looks like it's becoming a
partisan issue. What's your take?
OK, so I mean take on the conference, I mean, it was
amazing, right? I mean, we can talk about all
that. You know, we had a Satoshi
Rakamoto Sophie saying it was so much fun as far as the the
political effect on the industry.
You know, the scene at the end of the movie where there's just
the dead bodies everywhere and some have survived, you know,
and it's like your camp is just is just a fiery blaze.
That's pretty much where it's at now after.
What we've just gone through here with the current
administration, it's just been nearly impossible.
Every roadblock and just not wanting to see you succeed has
been really the strategy with Operation Choke .2 Point OA.
Lot of our companies with Lightning Ventures, you know,
they're trying to get live here, they're trying to get MTLS,
they're trying to launch innovative card products,
lending products, wallets, and just at every turn, they're just
trying to stop you and be unsupportive.
It's holding back innovation, it's holding back the industry.
And quite frankly, it's a bunch of horseshit, really.
But but everyone's looking forward to a change, right?
A change in the guard. The whole thing about the, you
know, moving the coins to spite Trump, I mean, how stupid can
they be? You guys beat this to the horse
already. But oh, my gosh.
I mean, are they just trying to lose votes?
Are they trying to alienate themselves from this entire
group? You know, it was a packed room.
They wouldn't let another person in there.
A lot of enthusiasm and energy. They have to have seen this.
You know, supposedly David Bailey had that tweet.
You know, he invited Kamala or whatever.
That would have quite frankly, been terrible.
But, you know, and then they go and pull a move like this.
It's like, are they trying? I mean, are they trying to upset
this group of people, which I think is a lot larger than they
estimate? 100% like it.
It's, it's incredibly short sighted.
And again, it's, it's like, look, you had the Democratic
representative saying it there like, it's like this is
inclusive, right? Which is, you know, progressive,
a progressive cause. And it's like Bitcoin is money
by the people for the people, like Natalie said.
And I would say Bitcoin is money for the lower middle classes
that get the most affected by the ravages of inflation, you
know, which are supposedly the people that, you know, the
Democratic Party is supposed to be representing.
And I'm, again, I'm not saying it's a monolith, but like, you
know, the RNC, the Republican, the, the Republican Party has
taken a public stance on the, on the industry.
They said they're protect the right to self custody, the
protect the right to mind the Democratic Party.
Clearly there's divisions internally, but the leadership
of the Democratic has taken a very public stance.
They might be saying stuff, but their actions are showing
otherwise. And again, like you were saying
was like moving the Bitcoin to spite Trump.
And it's just like it's just to spite him.
Like it's just to like, you know, it's just absolutely
insane, absolutely short sighted.
They had the pieces to finish the wall.
It's no, it's in, it's, it's, it's absurd.
It's it's pretty crazy. But anyways, Bitcoin fixes all
this. Opti, what's your take on all
this, brother? Yeah.
Well, look, Nico, you and I have done our best throughout the
last year or so to give the Democrat Party the the benefit
of the doubt in regards to their takes on Bitcoin.
But as we've seen the last year and obviously longer, they've
been doing everything to try to handicap the Bitcoin movement,
the Bitcoin industry and Bitcoiners at large.
And I don't think it's a coincidence that the first
business day after the Trump speech at the Bitcoin
conference, they start to move their Bitcoin around one.
I think, though we don't fully know yet if they're selling it,
which is not fully clear. But I mean, why else would they
be moving their Bitcoin after Trump said like we want a
strategic stockpile of Bitcoin? Though very interesting point of
the fact that they moved that much Bitcoin.
I'm pretty sure the fee cost was like $0.66, which like you
couldn't do in traditional financial world, which obviously
shows the use case of Bitcoin to anyone that is paying attention
to the technicals here. But as ROH Khanna was saying,
and you know, we've been saying this for a long time on the
show, we, we get a lot of Flack for it, but Bitcoin is the money
of the people. It is the most inclusive,
equitable. What else are the means that
they use fair money in the world like Bitcoin is for anyone,
anyone that understands the problems of the world, which is
the broken money should be saving in Bitcoin.
And I've gotten a lot of Flack on the show and Nico's got gave
me some pushback on it because I, I started to go really hard
on the Democrat Party when they started to fight Bitcoiners.
But it's it, it really blows my mind that supposedly the party
of progressives is the party that is actively fighting
Bitcoin and paying cover for, you know, the, the corporate
lobbyist and big business and all the stuff that they
supposedly claim to fight against.
And now I think, as we say all the time, Bitcoin has a way of
exposing incentives and, and the emperor has no clothes.
It's becoming very clear that the people in power at the
Democrat Party, we do not care what their constituents think in
regards to Bitcoin. There's a huge untapped market
of Bitcoin. There's a voting population that
are seeing the writing on the wall.
And they're like, all right, so I may be a Democrat.
And now that party is actively fighting against my best
interests. And as we saw yesterday, the
fact they're moving that Bitcoin will probably cover this by the
end of the week. We'll see what actually happened
with that Bitcoin, whether it hits an exchange or not.
I don't think it's a coincidence that we heard the speech from
Tom and now that bitcoins moving and it really is what you guys
just said. You know, it seems like the
Democrat Party is doing whatever they can despite anything Trump
is doing. And it also kind of reminds me
of what we've been saying for a while on the show of late stage
Fiat that the the people in power are literally just robbing
the empire of everything that they can before they realize
that they are going to lose their positions in power.
And again, you know, standard meme of man thinking of the
Roman Empire. We've seen this happened before
in the past. This is not a new scenario
playing out. If you're a student of history,
you know that this happens once the empire starts to crumble and
hopefully we can write this ship, which is what a lot of
bitcoiners want to do. I'm I'm not really in the camp
of a being an acceleration as it's burning it all down because
I think that would be worse for all of us.
I think there's still time to fix and and rewrite the course
of of humanity, of planet Earth, of America in general, but it's
going to take a lot of work. And the party that is in power
right right now seems to be actively doing everything they
can to stop Bitcoin, which is obviously horrible for
Bitcoiners, but horrible for everyone at large. 100%, I think
that's a really, really good point, man.
So yeah, anyways, I hope this changes and I can't iterate the
point enough. And that I said in the
beginning, Bitcoin is not a left to right thing.
It's not a liberal versus conservative.
It's really the party of Fiat versus the party of Bitcoin, the
party of green versus the party of orange.
And hopefully we have more Democrats like Ro Khanna, you
know, coming to their senses and realizing you can't stop
Bitcoin, right? But what's the Kamala Harris
thing again? Opti.
What can be unburdened by what has been?
We should just keep meming that into it.
We just make that a meme. We should just make that a bad.
Meme. But it's a good meme.
We should. Just make that a Bitcoin meme
anyways guys, if you're enjoying the show right now, the 1220 of
you guys that are watching live just between YouTube and and X
and also the 50 or so of you guys watching live on rumble,
make sure to smash that like button really really helps with
the algos all right everybody. Hey, wait, wait, Nico, before
you go, Muzz wanted to chime in real quick.
I was just going to say we really don't know what was
behind that move. And we may end up congratulating
the US government on implementing some very advanced
UTXO management. This is true.
I mean, let's be real, we don't know.
This is true 100% it's true. Maybe.
Somebody wants to play with a Sparrow wallet at the
government. They need some tests, you know
they're. Yeah, bro, they, they just
watched ABTC sessions video and they're just like, all right,
let's do a test transaction. But it was with 10,000 Bitcoin.
That could be it. That could be it.
Set up coming soon for the US government.
Let's get to the culture. Lots to talk about.
The daily culture. I want to give a shout out to
our sponsor, the Orange Pull Up stock friends who stacks apps
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It's a great resource playing you're going to a new city, you
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Pull up the orange pull up. It literally tells you
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It gives you the ability to send them directly.
It's also a great resource for Bitcoin only events and it's the
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So download the orange pull up today, scan the QR code, check
the link in the video description stack friends who
stacks hats all right, passing it on to Opti and Muz.
I'm so excited for this conversation cuz guys like this
is I don't think this is I don't think this is something that
I've heard a lot of people ask. I've heard a lot of people talk
about, but I'll pass pass that on.
I'll pass that question on to Muz First.
It it, it's almost as if the game is skewed for individuals
who want to invest in companies. Like it's like, and it's a
little bit unfair, like, you know, imagine being able to get
into Amazon, imagine being able to get into Facebook and how
current, how things currently function.
It's pretty difficult to get into those early, early stage
startups as an investor, especially if you don't have a
lot of money. Yeah, and there's a there's a
big learning curve too, and it's completely unfair.
And it's just a part of the system, right?
It's just another way, you know that the government hates you.
That's pretty much. It's true.
That's pretty much what it comes down to.
And I remember when I started investing in private companies
are wanting to learn more, right?
You start reading a few books and you see what type of returns
you can make and then you start to learn and then you start to
where can I do this? OK, if you are an accredited
investor, even if you are an accredited investor, OK.
And that's a certain level of income and net worth
requirements. Even then, it's still hard to
find deals. Even then, it's still hard to
learn and go right, especially with small minimums as you're as
you're learning because it is a, it is a long journey.
And then there's these crowdfunding portals where
anyone can invest. So if you're an unaccredited
investor or what, no matter what, you can invest something,
OK and something is better than nothing.
And some of that's dynamic after a certain point, but it's all
you fill it out, you putting it in there and you know they'll
they will allow you to invest. So that's fairly new.
It started in 2012 with the regulation crowdfunding as a
part of the JOBS Act under Obama.
And that allows for private companies to actually raise
capital directly from people, right?
Whether it's their biggest fans or aspiring investors, it
provides some access to this area.
So it's fairly new and there was a lot of, there was a lot of big
companies that came out and started doing this.
Whether you had 15 juice bars in the, in the, in Texas or you
were working on an AR headset or you had a, a startup or a SAS
company or whatever. You could actually put a little
bar on your website, raise money from some of your your biggest
fans and your users and deal directly with and allow people
to participate in these funding opportunities, which are
otherwise like really hard to get into.
So that's really what Thunder Funder is.
It's a new regulated portal where anyone can invest in open
source startups, projects and Bitcoin projects.
So that's what we're doing. It's an extension.
It's a new evolution from Lightning Ventures, which we
invested in pretty much. I mean, most of the outstanding
awesome Bitcoin startups here. And we're able to offer those
opportunities to people, but they had to be accredited.
They had to be an accredited investor.
And you know, I like to often joke, everyone's an accredited
investor if you click the right button.
And that's actually true because that's how it works.
But we're removing that whole hurdle, getting a, a regulated
portal. Now we can talk about the deals
live, we can have fun, we can do more things in a, in a public
space that we can't do with what we were doing with, with
Lightning ventures. So I'm super excited about it
and I'm just glad that you had me on, man Thanks.
Man, and and that's incredibly so.
And the walk, like, let's walk through the process, right?
Let's just say, and I kind of went through this muz and you
were basically my first experience investing into
startups. And you're right, the learning
curve is quite high. Kind of don't know what you're
doing. I'm just throwing a couple
thousand there, a couple thousand there, a couple
thousand there. I have no idea.
So what would be like? It seems like it's.
Thank you Opti for answering the question, but I'll pass it on to
MAS like we. Got audio listed if.
Someone wants to get started. What are the steps?
So they head over to thunderfunder.com.
What should they expect? What do they need to do?
What is the process like for someone that has absolutely no
experience doing this? So let's just start with, you
know, we just got this license Monday of last week.
So really cutting it down to the wire in terms of, you know,
doing what we did in Nashville. You know, we had two, two booths
and the pitch contest and the mainstage announcement.
Definitely down to the wire. And the process for getting our
application completed included really scrutinizing every word
on our website. OK, so this will become more
robust, right? Building out a community
education, OK, hackathons, tournaments, other sort of
resources. We want to help a lot of
founders too. We want to do a lot of good.
This is not just about join this platform and invest OK, that's
great. We need those people, OK, But
it's also about like, are you a builder?
Are you looking for a job? Do you work in HR?
Just building a community of people to get around to come
into the open source and Bitcoin startup investing world.
You know, we invested in pleb lab.
I love car. They're going to be a very early
partnership. OK, working with them on on on
the grass roots of it. You know, John's from Bolt Fun
Bolt fun is on a little bit of a hiatus, but that style.
OK, so we need to put a lot in the community.
And we also had to pass a, a very rigorous initial test for
this website. So I look forward to a changing.
But what do you do? You basically just click sign
up. OK.
And when we, we have our first live deal, which looks like it's
going to be lane bits here in about 3 weeks, you'll just get
an e-mail. You'll get an e-mail or you'll
see that day. Hey, the you have an opportunity
to invest in lane bits and you can read about the deal.
You can view the pitch deck and you can ask questions, OK, with
a message board and all that stuff.
You can read the form C filing, which is actually what we had to
file with the SEC to get the deal live.
And then you can choose to invest.
And right now in the beginning, we are, it's just a Fiat
investment for now. We're working on implementing
Bitcoin payments ASAP. That is something that we are
working on very soon. And that was the number one
request that we got at Lightning Ventures.
How can I invest with Bitcoin? How can I invest using Bitcoin?
You know, we were locked into the Angelus platform.
They're great. Angelus is awesome, but they
just have no desire to implement Bitcoin payments that and it's
just never going to happen. So I'm really looking forward to
that. I'm looking forward to all the
boundaries that we can push. Like what about if you're a
founder and you do a raise with with Thunder Funder and at the
end when we're getting ready to close that maybe you had the
option of accepting those funds in Bitcoin instead of just
having to take a wire to your account, right?
Or maybe there's a little slider that we can kind of do that.
These things don't exist and we're going to do, I'm going to
do my best to to try and bring all these exciting things out
there. But so basically, Nico, you wake
up in the morning, you get that e-mail from Thunder funder.
It says, Hey, you can invest in any company today, right?
Whatever the company is that we're going live with.
And you say, yeah, must man, I'm in.
Here's $200.00. And you click the button and
maybe you want to use your American Express card and get
some rewards there, or you want to do the ACH transfer, or maybe
you want to send a $200.00 wire, which I would not recommend.
But you're going to fund that deal.
We're going to do our campaign with everything that we we do
interviews, etcetera. And if we close that deal, let's
just say that it's $100,000, OK? So not a huge deal because we're
allowed to raise up to five million with this license, OK?
So then what do we do? All those little investors are
basically consolidated into one line item on that company's cap
table and it'll say Thunder, Thunder Lane, Bits 001, whatever
it is, OK, And we're going to ship that money and that's
closed, OK. And in your dashboard, in your
portfolio there, you'll see that you have one investment.
Now this is completely illiquid, right?
With all the disclosures and disclaimers and every darn thing
that FINRA makes this do. That is the reality of it.
There is no trading here. There are those things.
Other platforms have those things, right?
But we're not doing that, OK? So you know, you're just waiting
at that point in time. There could be some liquidity
opportunities down the road, but you need to assume that that
$200.00 that you just invested in lane bits or strike or bring
in or a mining company or whatever you're doing, you're
building that portfolio. This is low time preference.
It plays right into the same mindset that a lot of bitcoiners
have, OK, it is very low time preference.
So that's basically it. And.
And, and, and that's something also like to, to keep in mind,
right, Which is, it's not liquid, but it, it's you are
essentially, you know, you are investing in a company that you
believe has a, you know, you believe has a future and that
company eventually either goes public or gets acquired.
And that's where you potentially can make a tremendous amount of
money. Now you know the probability of
that. You know what?
What's the statistic Muzz? Like one in every 10 start?
It's like 9 out of 10 startups fail or something like that.
So look, there's a lot of different numbers and some will
say it's in the 70% and some will say it's 90% and some will
just exclude the really big winners, right?
You know, what's that Jeff Bezos quote?
You know, give me a 10% probability of having something
that'll do 100X and I'll take that bet, you know, every time.
So look, your, your, your big wins, the big outliers, they
call it return the fund will, will, will return the whole
fund. Even for the ones that don't,
because there's a lot of deals where maybe you just get your
money back or maybe you get half your money back or maybe you get
three times your money. OK, but they're not going to be
those big returns. But those big returns are
certainly out there. And if you use an example like
pick any company, right? I don't want to pick one, but
pick your favorite early stage Bitcoin startup and if they're
raising on a $10 million safe note, right?
And we're going to go into all kinds of education, we're going
to have a bunch of cool info to really breakdown how these
things work. What are these instruments?
Are they really as complicated? Do you need to have Harvard MBA
to invest in these startups? You do not.
So it's a $10 million valuation and just back of the envelope,
they become a. Half a billion dollar company
OK, so that's a 50 Xer, right? That's fifty times your money.
Now if you say all day long, well, why would I ever do this
instead of buying Bitcoin? Why would I ever do this instead
of something else? Right?
It's not an either or and there are a lot of time periods where
it will over perform and there are other short time periods
where Bitcoin will over perform, right.
So it's all about complementing it, right?
It's, it's another asset class that you can invest in.
Like when we raised our first fund in 2021, the Bitcoin price
was like 6568 thousand, right? People invested, you know maybe
they sold that amount of Bitcoin right .4 whatever it was and
they invested 25,000 bucks into our first fund.
Well, here we are later. That fund that I have has a
small IRR markup, right? We have a small market it's
single digits, OK. We just went through a
bloodbath, OK? Everything else came after it.
Block Fi and everything else went through a bloodbath.
Here we are are on the other side.
That fund's fully deployed and I get to to send the LP updates
that there is actually a markup, right?
It's performed positively and at that point in time during those
updates, Bitcoin 53,000, you know, in the 40s, etcetera,
right. So it all depends on the time
horizon and what happens and kind of where you get in.
And that can go the other way too, right?
But I, I'm a big, I'm a big fan of diversifying and having
investments in these startups because the odds of Bitcoin
doing a 50X from here, you know, some new cool company, whether
it's foundation devices, I'm picking up your other sponsors
or the orange pill app, OK, which are both lightning
ventures portfolio companies, by the way.
You know, the odds of them doing a 10X or in a shorter amount of
time than Bitcoin 10X in from here is a lot sooner.
And it can happen very fast. And just in my own personal
portfolio, you know, something, something that's up 70X in less
than 24 months. I've seen it like a habit.
I know it happens And I just, I'm not sure if bitcoins going
to do that. Conversely, you know, throwing,
throwing some Bitcoin into a secure storage and not doing
anything with it. We all know it's not going, it's
not going to zero. And there is actually an opera a
chance that these other investments could, you know, So
all of those disclosures, right? But the fact that the government
last thing I'll say on this, the fact that the government doesn't
want you to participate, OK, that you have to meet some
nonsense hurdle, OK, They want you poor.
They didn't want you buying Bitcoin.
Half of them still don't want you buying Bitcoin.
They don't want you investing in this stuff because these early
stage technology investments, it's it's massive.
When you look at the winds, it's massive.
I mean, $10,000.25 grand in Uber's seed round was like 100
million at the IPO. Like, I don't even know how you
get that anywhere else. You know, 25 grand in Airbnb
seed round was like 2 billion. Like with AB at the IPO, Like
where? How do you do that?
Yeah, that takes 11 years. OK, Eleven years.
You had to wait. I think it was worth the wait.
And those are two outlier examples, right?
But there are there are many of those type of examples.
But yet the government will let you walk into any casino.
You don't have to meet any income requirement.
I can ruin my life. I can ruin my life.
And that's actually their business model.
The casino relies on that, that they they need that to exist.
And yet that's totally fine. But you know what if I want to
put 1000 bucks and start nine? Oh no, no, no.
The government needs to protect me from doing anything like
that. So it's complete nonsense and
I'm just excited that we finally have something that that's open
to everyone. Absolutely, 100%.
And and I can't, can't emphasize this enough to everybody.
Like you're investing in the Bitcoin industry and you're
investing in the Bitcoin ecosystem.
So you're supporting Bitcoin entrepreneurs build Bitcoin
products of which you are going to use, right?
This is what you, this is exactly what Thunder Funder
focuses on. You guys are focusing on
essentially supporting and building out the Bitcoin
industry and a lot of things that what I, what I've noticed
with a lot and Opti and I are both in this vote, as you know,
as you know, building in Bitcoin, even though it's it's a
media company, it's a little bit different of a business model,
but it's still a business nonetheless, you know?
Yeah. So sometimes you have to invest
in yourself. You do, you know, and we're
taking the the masochist route of bootstrapping.
But you know, not everyone, not everyone could do that, right?
Let's have some fun right here. Let's have some fun right here.
So you got this awesome Daily Show, right?
Simply Bitcoin. You've been doing it forever.
You guys grind like nobody's business, right?
OK, you're here. You got this simply Bitcoin and
you say to me, must damn it, if I just had 800 grand and we
could do like you know, we could have like we could take it to
the next level. We could do so much more and you
have a plan, right, So you can bootstrap and you can grind it
out and you can go that way. But you could come to Thunder
funder and say, you know what, we're going to come up with
something very creative and we work with you on Rs us, right,
Some revenue sharing unit, OK, type of a deal for your media
company that allows you to leverage that to all of your all
your fans and all these people out there.
And you know, if they invest 100 bucks or 200 bucks or 12 grand,
whatever they decide to invest in you, it aligns them with your
success. They're your biggest fans, you
know, and it's really cool to be able to offer that to the people
that, that are there to support you, right?
You get to leverage them and you get to to to give them a return,
right? You get to do the right thing
and you get to involve them. So it's, it's something that I I
really hope that creatively people like yourself, even, you
know, creative mining deals, right, where you can invest Fiat
and receive a dividend type of a payment in Bitcoin.
OK, We can do a lot with this Reg CF license.
A lot of the things that are out there in Normieland, you know,
they do things like they'll, they'll buy Michael Jordan's
first pair of tennis shoes and you know, you can invest in
that, right? Yeah.
The the government says it's OK without qualifying.
All right, you want to invest 200 bucks into a share of
Michael Jordan's shoes that they acquired from this auction.
Now this is not, I'm not talking like crypto and now it's trick.
No, I don't mean like that, but like that's that's the deal is
you have that, that piece and then when they sell that OK or
however that happens, you can earn a return.
They do it with Picasso paintings, they do it with with
other Fine Arts and they've gotten really creative on ways
that they can utilize this license and sort of new ways
straight debt deals at interest rates, right?
Maybe there's somebody who's building the Bitcoin citadel,
right? And he's got, you know, 700
acres somewhere and there's a model and there's a whole plan
for that, right? Or the private cities and those
type of things, right? Really cool out there ideas and
I I want to be creative in the things that we get on the
platform. So I hope maybe we even do a a
simply Bitcoin deal. Hey, Mas.
You mentioned investing 100 or
$200.00. Is there a minimum investment
for the audience out there or like what's the requirement
here? So that actually comes down to
what the, what you guys want or what the founders want.
OK, We'll be able to once we have a little bit more
experience because we haven't closed a deal on there yet.
I mean, we have experience from the accredited syndicate and
Lightning Ventures. But once we figure out what
people want, we can tell the founders what works best.
But ultimately it's your decision and someone might have
a, you know, I, I don't, I only, I want to have a $500 minimum.
If that's what you guys want or if that's what the founder wants
or whoever, then that's what we'll do.
We're there to work with them if they say, you know, whatever
works best for the platform and if the minimum is 100 or 250 or
whatever it is, there's just ultimate flexibility.
There isn't a set number. We want to do what the
entrepreneurs and the founders want and what's best for them.
So we're just here to work with them.
Absolutely. I mean, that's beautiful.
It's extremely exciting. Guys.
Head over to thunderfunder.com today.
Check it out, support invest into the Bitcoin ecosystem.
What Mike was saying, this is alternative, right?
And you know, it kind of gives you and it gives you an amazing
opportunity. Like now it's it's easy to say,
it's easy to say this in hindsight, but imagine if you
had the opportunity to invest in something like strike in the
very early days, right? I imagine if you had the
opportunity to invest in some of your favorite Bitcoin companies
that now are very well known. But you know, back then, you
know, you had the opportunity to invest in them.
You know, you already would have made and and you know, a great
investment, right? So this is the type of
opportunities. Trump said it in his speech.
This industry is just in his infancy.
I truly believe that. So yeah, it's, it's, you know,
it's, it's extremely exciting. So I do want to thank Muzz for
for coming on the show. Wait, let's give.
Let's give Muzz. What is the last two sets?
The final message you want to leave with the audience?
It could be about Thunder Thunder.
It could be about Bitcoin. It could be about life.
What's the final message you want to leave with the audience?
If you have any interest in learning about Angel investing,
learning about early stage companies, being on the
forefront of the coolest stuff out there, I I would urge you to
join our group. Get in the full, check out
thunderfunder.com, check out LTNG, dot Ventures, just get in
the fold. And that was one of my greatest
joys when I psychotically invested in over 1500 companies
in all sorts of industries is you're really on the tip of this
fear for everything that's going on.
The people that are doing flying cars, the people that are doing
drugs that make your dog live longer and VR headsets and all
of these kind of things, right? You get to see it all, you get
to, you get to see it all. And the, the, the innovation
that you see from these companies, it's inspiring.
It's inspiring to see what's going on.
So, you know, as much as I am, you know, I'm tasked with
shillingthunderthunder.com as much as I can.
It's really to start building the community.
We need a community of people that are not just investors.
So if you're thinking, Oh, well, you know, I don't, I would never
invest into into a startup. I would suggest just joining and
getting in the fold and seeing what's out there.
And we just went through like the craziest bear blow up.
I mean, Silicon Valley Bank. I don't know if your audience
was following that. There was a lot of of a lot of
scared people. That was a pretty wild weekend.
And I can tell you after being through the other side of it,
you know, when the IPO market is robust and there's a lot of
mergers and acquisitions, there's going to be so much
consolidation in this Bitcoin world.
What what they're going to buy a lot of these companies.
And if we all know that this is going to work, just like in the
late 90s and early 2000s, you know, you had a chance to, to
Cisco Systems, you know, Microsoft, AOL, there was just
so much that you could invest in at the time.
So it wasn't just about the Internet.
It was about all these things being built around the Internet.
And that's what I'm all about is as if we know bitcoins going to
win. What about everything else
around it? And how do you do that?
And you know what, not even that.
Like it's fun. It's fun to own a piece of some
of your favorite companies and startups.
So that's, that's pretty much it for my show of the day guys.
Well, dude, thank you so much for coming on the show, Mike.
I've seen Mike. You know, I've seen Mike, I
think about this, work on this for many, many years, and I've
just seen kind of just this evolve into what it is today.
I'm incredibly proud, might not understand fully because like I
said, I'm a media guy, but I know his heart is 100% behind
this and I'm incredibly excited to see how this ends up being
built out. And I also think it's an, it's
an opportunity. I've, I've, I've partaken in in
when, when Mike was with lightning ventures of partaking
put putting, you know, a couple $1000 behind some companies that
I know the name of and just to, you know, kind of diversify and
just, you know, cuz it's, it's always fascinated me.
So happy to have Mike on the show today and hopefully you
guys find it interesting as well.
So head over to funderthunder.com today.
This was your show for July 30th, 2024.
This is simply Bitcoin live. I'm your host, Nico.
This is my Co host, Optimus Fields and our special day.
A special guest for today is Muzman from Thunder funder.
All right, everybody, love you all.
We'll be back tomorrow for a brand new episode of Simply
Bitcoin Live. So it was brought to you by
bitcoinwell.com on a mission to enable independence.