1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:03,360 Everybody is just scrambling for every last dollar and people 2 00:00:03,360 --> 00:00:05,520 can't retire because they don't know if their savings are going, 3 00:00:05,520 --> 00:00:07,360 how long their savings will last because they're going to be 4 00:00:07,360 --> 00:00:09,800 debased. What should be the appropriate 5 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:12,880 Bitcoin allocation? The Bitcoin price is roughly at 6 00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:14,800 100K. I think a lot of people were 7 00:00:14,800 --> 00:00:17,360 anticipating it for it to be a lot higher by now. 8 00:00:18,240 --> 00:00:20,840 People are talking about diminishing returns. 9 00:00:20,840 --> 00:00:23,040 They're saying the cycles. What are your thoughts on that? 10 00:00:23,120 --> 00:00:25,320 Yeah. So look, it's doing just what it 11 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:27,520 should be doing. The next stop is at 140. 12 00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:29,800 People ask me, what do you think the best thing about Bitcoin is? 13 00:00:29,920 --> 00:00:32,080 I'd say the best thing about Bitcoin is that it might end 14 00:00:32,080 --> 00:00:33,640 wars. That's very powerful. 15 00:00:33,640 --> 00:00:35,360 What do you could you elaborate a little bit on that? 16 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:41,600 Hello. We're here in Miami Beach with 17 00:00:41,600 --> 00:00:46,040 the one the only legendary Larry Leopard's Larry congratulations 18 00:00:46,040 --> 00:00:48,320 on her new book the big print. Thank you. 19 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:52,080 What happened to America and how sound money will fix it. 20 00:00:52,200 --> 00:00:54,920 What I said last time we were speaking about this is what 21 00:00:54,920 --> 00:00:57,680 impressed me is how fast you wrote this book. 22 00:00:57,800 --> 00:01:02,520 We ran into each other Nashville conference and we were just 23 00:01:02,520 --> 00:01:04,680 having a conversation. So Nico, I'm thinking about 24 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:07,960 writing a book and three or four months later, here we go. 25 00:01:08,320 --> 00:01:10,360 What inspired you? What motivated you to do? 26 00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:13,960 A little more than that. So the, the, the genesis of this 27 00:01:13,960 --> 00:01:18,200 was looking at a TV program with my wife in the spring and 28 00:01:18,200 --> 00:01:20,640 watching the blue team argue with the red team and getting 29 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:23,600 incredibly mad and frustrated that nobody was talking about 30 00:01:23,600 --> 00:01:24,760 the core issue. Right. 31 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:27,560 And I hate all politicians except a few libertarians like 32 00:01:27,560 --> 00:01:30,200 Ron Paul. And, and what I thought was, you 33 00:01:30,200 --> 00:01:32,080 know, they're just not talking about how to really drain the 34 00:01:32,080 --> 00:01:33,760 swamp. And the problems the country 35 00:01:33,760 --> 00:01:37,040 faces, in my opinion, are all driven by the unsound money, not 36 00:01:37,040 --> 00:01:38,560 all the other stuff. The other stuff is their 37 00:01:38,560 --> 00:01:40,760 problems for sure. But that's not the core issue. 38 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:42,760 And I thought, you know, nobody's really explained it 39 00:01:42,760 --> 00:01:44,040 well. And then I thought, well, no, 40 00:01:44,040 --> 00:01:46,600 people have. I mean, book is fantastic, Lynn 41 00:01:46,600 --> 00:01:47,640 book is fantastic. Just books. 42 00:01:47,800 --> 00:01:49,480 But you know what? I give those to people and 43 00:01:49,480 --> 00:01:51,520 people bog down. They seem to be a little 44 00:01:51,520 --> 00:01:54,720 textbookie and unless you're really deep into Bitcoin and 45 00:01:54,720 --> 00:01:56,520 this stuff, you can get lost in them. 46 00:01:57,120 --> 00:02:00,000 And so I thought somebody ought to try and write a book that's 47 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:03,680 really easily understandable by any person with no financial 48 00:02:03,680 --> 00:02:06,520 background, you know, just a common American And they know 49 00:02:06,520 --> 00:02:08,199 one thing for sure. They know they're getting 50 00:02:08,199 --> 00:02:10,440 screwed by inflation. Everyone in the world 51 00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:12,560 understands that today. They go to the grocery store and 52 00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:14,880 they say what's wrong, but they don't really understand why. 53 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:16,960 And a lot of times they're being gas lit by these people who are 54 00:02:16,960 --> 00:02:19,000 saying, well, it's a greedy corporations and it's not the 55 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:20,400 greedy corporations, it's the Fed. 56 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:23,560 And so I thought, you know, I've been in this area a long time 57 00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:25,600 pre Bitcoin was a sound money guy with gold. 58 00:02:25,800 --> 00:02:28,720 And I'm probably kind of uniquely suited to maybe tell 59 00:02:28,720 --> 00:02:30,560 the whole story from the beginning. 60 00:02:31,040 --> 00:02:35,000 And so I wrote a book that I hope, I mean, my my fondest wish 61 00:02:35,000 --> 00:02:37,480 for this book, Nico, is I want to orange build the world. 62 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:40,680 So I just decided I'm going to try and write a book that's easy 63 00:02:40,680 --> 00:02:43,840 to understand, but lays it out so that a common person will go, 64 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:47,120 Oh my goodness, I now understand why I'm getting screwed. 65 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:49,080 And that's the bad news. The good news is I now 66 00:02:49,080 --> 00:02:50,480 understand what I can do about it. 67 00:02:50,520 --> 00:02:52,840 And so, as you know from the book, it's in two parts. 68 00:02:52,840 --> 00:02:55,760 Part 1 is the problem, Part 2 is the solution. 69 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:58,480 Absolutely. And one of the things to layer 70 00:02:58,480 --> 00:03:02,880 that that really, really impacted me is most of society 71 00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:07,120 is still asleep, Yes, to the idea or to the problem that 72 00:03:07,120 --> 00:03:10,920 they, they don't understand that money can exist without 73 00:03:10,920 --> 00:03:12,240 inflation. Yes. 74 00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:15,240 And they continue to seek a political solution. 75 00:03:15,240 --> 00:03:19,000 Yes, where the solution is not a political one, it's fixing the 76 00:03:19,000 --> 00:03:21,040 money itself. It's and it's related to 77 00:03:21,040 --> 00:03:23,240 politics because the Fed controls the money and we've got 78 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:24,680 to end the Fed. But you're correct. 79 00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:27,960 I mean, and I noticed that in a lot of younger people, you know, 80 00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:30,240 they people just think, well, inflation, we always have had 81 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:31,760 inflation. We'll always have inflation. 82 00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:33,400 It's a bad thing. We've just got to learn to live 83 00:03:33,400 --> 00:03:34,880 with it. And I'm here to say, no, you 84 00:03:34,880 --> 00:03:36,960 don't. I was around in the Sixties, 70s 85 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:38,640 and 80s. We had a lot of inflation, 70s. 86 00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:41,520 But but I remember what the country was like before we got 87 00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:44,400 as financialized and as broken as we are today. 88 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:46,520 And so again, you asked me what motivated me. 89 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:49,440 Part of what motivated me was somebody's got to explain to 90 00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:51,960 everybody who's young now that it wasn't always this messed up, 91 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:55,440 you know, that there was actually a time when America had 92 00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:57,360 other problems, but this wasn't one of them. 93 00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:00,760 If you think about the America that existed post World War 2, 94 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:03,440 we were a great country. We had won the war. 95 00:04:03,440 --> 00:04:05,800 We were, you know, widely admired. 96 00:04:05,880 --> 00:04:08,960 You know, we didn't enter into any new wars for a while or mess 97 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:11,320 around in Korea. And then Vietnam came later, but 98 00:04:11,320 --> 00:04:13,520 for quite so. And inflation wasn't a problem 99 00:04:13,520 --> 00:04:16,480 in the 50s and 60s and 70s, early 70s. 100 00:04:16,480 --> 00:04:19,000 And then, of course, the big event that started the whole 101 00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:22,160 downhill roll in terms of this problem was Nixon going off the 102 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:24,880 gold standard in 71. One of my favorite charts in the 103 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:28,000 book is on page 22, where I show the history of inflation since 104 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:30,760 the founding of the country and then what happened in 71. 105 00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:33,120 And of course, it's just a hockey stick, right? 106 00:04:33,120 --> 00:04:35,480 I mean, we went off the gold standard and inflation suddenly 107 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:38,440 became a serious problem, and we really haven't solved it since 108 00:04:38,440 --> 00:04:39,560 that time. Absolutely. 109 00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:43,160 One of the things too in the book that that that really stuck 110 00:04:43,160 --> 00:04:45,240 out to me. You sent me APDF version early 111 00:04:45,240 --> 00:04:48,520 on, said that the founders themselves, the founders of the 112 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:51,480 US, they saw it as a form of counterfeiting. 113 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:52,080 Is that? Correct. 114 00:04:52,080 --> 00:04:53,960 Yeah, Yeah. I mean, in fact, there was even 115 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:55,840 a law, and it's in the book, it talks about this. 116 00:04:56,120 --> 00:04:58,360 There was a law that said anybody who debased and 117 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:00,720 counterfeited the currency would be punishable by death. 118 00:05:00,840 --> 00:05:03,760 And Edwin Griffin, in his book The Creature from Jugger Hinde, 119 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:07,560 said, well, if we apply that law today, the Senate, the Congress, 120 00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:10,640 the Treasury Department and the president would all have to be 121 00:05:10,640 --> 00:05:12,680 executed. And I just thought that was a 122 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:14,880 great quote. But yes, I mean, they, they, 123 00:05:14,920 --> 00:05:18,000 they put it in the Constitution, Article 1, Section 8, where they 124 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:20,840 said only gold and silver sound money can be currency. 125 00:05:20,840 --> 00:05:24,040 And of course, you know, that's based on, they did that based on 126 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:26,800 what happened when the first monetary default occurred, when 127 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:28,800 we fought the Revolutionary War, they printed something called 128 00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:30,200 the Continental. And of course the Continental 129 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:32,520 hyperinflated. So they were very much aware of 130 00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:34,360 this problem. And the book talks about that 131 00:05:34,360 --> 00:05:36,040 entire history. And it's interesting our 132 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:39,560 forefathers understood this. And to be frank with you, you 133 00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:41,760 know, the authors of the Bible understood this. 134 00:05:41,760 --> 00:05:44,160 I mean, they talk about honest weights and measures, and 135 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:46,760 dishonest weights and measures are an abomination to God. 136 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:50,200 I mean, monetary tomfoolery, It's been going on for a long 137 00:05:50,200 --> 00:05:52,120 time. And the people who can control 138 00:05:52,120 --> 00:05:55,440 the monetary system, they can make themselves fabulously rich, 139 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:59,080 and that's what's happened. And I think that mechanism is 140 00:05:59,080 --> 00:06:01,360 poorly misunderstood. Yes, totally. 141 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:03,960 There was a there was a quote you were you're quoting a 142 00:06:04,160 --> 00:06:07,760 Rothschild, I believe it says give me control of the nation's 143 00:06:07,760 --> 00:06:10,320 money supply and I care not who makes the law exactly. 144 00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:13,760 Could you explain, Larry? And let's make this an 145 00:06:13,760 --> 00:06:16,920 educational thing, right? And people are, I'm assuming a 146 00:06:16,920 --> 00:06:18,320 lot of people are going to watch this one. 147 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:20,760 What is the Federal Reserve? Yeah, sure. 148 00:06:20,840 --> 00:06:24,280 So the Federal Reserve got created in 1913, and it is the 149 00:06:24,280 --> 00:06:27,080 body in the United States that controls the supply of money. 150 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:29,520 It's our Monetary Authority. It's a private corporation. 151 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:31,480 It's actually owned by the member banks. 152 00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:34,400 But it's it's a funny beast. It's kind of private and public 153 00:06:34,400 --> 00:06:37,400 because it was created by Congress and Congress 154 00:06:37,400 --> 00:06:39,760 theoretically overseas it. I mean, if Congress decided 155 00:06:39,760 --> 00:06:41,960 tomorrow to vote to end the Federal Reserve, they could. 156 00:06:41,960 --> 00:06:44,960 But of course, you know, the Congress has wined and dined by 157 00:06:44,960 --> 00:06:47,680 the Fed and the, and the Fed has convinced Congress that they're 158 00:06:47,680 --> 00:06:49,960 absolutely essential to the well-being of the country, which 159 00:06:49,960 --> 00:06:52,320 I would argue they're not. But the Federal Reserve controls 160 00:06:52,320 --> 00:06:54,320 the money supply through the issuance of currency. 161 00:06:54,760 --> 00:06:58,840 And they were theoretically formed in order to balance out, 162 00:06:58,840 --> 00:07:01,960 you know, swings in in inflation and deflation and so on and so 163 00:07:01,960 --> 00:07:03,240 forth. And those were occurring pre 164 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:06,400 Federal Reserve, but frankly, they weren't as severe or as big 165 00:07:06,880 --> 00:07:08,680 as what happened after the Fed got created. 166 00:07:08,680 --> 00:07:11,960 So the Fed got created in 1913. We immediately went into World 167 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:13,920 War One. They immediately violated their 168 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:16,440 charter and they started printing money to finance World 169 00:07:16,440 --> 00:07:19,160 War One. And between 1916 and 1920, the 170 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:20,720 price level in the country doubled. 171 00:07:20,840 --> 00:07:23,760 OK, so huge inflation based on paying for the war. 172 00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:26,600 And, you know, that created a lot of societal problems. 173 00:07:26,600 --> 00:07:29,720 We had, you know, the Ku Klux Klan came back big time. 174 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:32,880 We had all kinds of race riots in a number of major cities. 175 00:07:33,120 --> 00:07:35,480 We had enormous labor strikes, etcetera. 176 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:38,160 I mean, imagine, you know, you're a worker in 1916 and 177 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:41,160 you're making a certain wage. And then, you know, basically 178 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:44,320 six years later, everything cost twice as much and your wages 179 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:46,720 haven't kept up with it, which is kind of what's going on now, 180 00:07:47,120 --> 00:07:50,440 right? And so, so the Fed is this body 181 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:52,640 that controls the issuance of the money supply. 182 00:07:52,760 --> 00:07:55,280 And as Milton Friedman said, money is always a monetary 183 00:07:55,280 --> 00:07:58,080 phenomenon. So a society, you know, produces 184 00:07:58,080 --> 00:08:00,080 goods and services. You know, doctors provide a 185 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:01,840 service. People make widgets. 186 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:05,600 Those are goods and the dollars that we have are those they are 187 00:08:05,600 --> 00:08:08,520 claims against the goods and services and the price we pay 188 00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:11,440 for them balances the claims against what's provided. 189 00:08:11,480 --> 00:08:13,680 If you suddenly decide you're going to double the amount of 190 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:16,240 dollars in existence, which is what happened in World War 2, 191 00:08:16,520 --> 00:08:18,640 the price of everything double S because the same number of 192 00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:20,320 people, same number. You didn't double the number of 193 00:08:20,320 --> 00:08:22,560 goods and services, you just double the number of dollars. 194 00:08:22,560 --> 00:08:25,200 And so the price goes up. And this has been the continual 195 00:08:25,200 --> 00:08:28,840 and recurring pattern, Nico, that basically the federal 196 00:08:28,840 --> 00:08:32,120 government has caused American, average American people to 197 00:08:32,120 --> 00:08:35,600 suffer because anytime the banks get in trouble, and the Fed was 198 00:08:35,600 --> 00:08:38,600 created to backstop the banks. It was a cartel of the banks, 199 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:40,640 really. Anytime the banks got in 200 00:08:40,640 --> 00:08:43,240 trouble, the Fed prints the money to bail them out. 201 00:08:43,320 --> 00:08:45,320 And it looks like, you know, that's what they should do and 202 00:08:45,320 --> 00:08:47,280 what they must do. Although I talk about the 203 00:08:47,280 --> 00:08:51,400 alternatives and, and in fact, what it does is it increases the 204 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:53,800 cost of gasoline and it increases the cost of food. 205 00:08:53,920 --> 00:08:57,320 So more or less we all pay for the Fed's mistakes and for the 206 00:08:57,320 --> 00:08:59,840 bank's mistakes. And it's just, it's terribly 207 00:08:59,840 --> 00:09:03,280 inefficient and it's terribly unfair because the bankers and 208 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:05,880 the, the wealthy people, there are wealthy people in this 209 00:09:05,880 --> 00:09:08,160 country and you know, who are smart and they actually know how 210 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:10,560 to make inflation work for them. We call them quintillionaires. 211 00:09:10,560 --> 00:09:12,360 And that's another whole other thing we could define. 212 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:15,240 But the bottom line is smart people know how to borrow money 213 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:16,920 cheap and buy assets that pay more. 214 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:19,760 And so they, and with inflation, they actually get richer, 215 00:09:20,200 --> 00:09:23,040 whereas people who are working for a fixed wage, their wages 216 00:09:23,040 --> 00:09:25,360 don't go up as fast and they actually get poorer. 217 00:09:25,720 --> 00:09:29,560 And, and it's very, very unfair. And America was built on the, on 218 00:09:29,560 --> 00:09:31,760 the concept and the promise of fairness. 219 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:34,880 And, and it's being violated. And it's, it's been violated for 220 00:09:34,880 --> 00:09:37,840 a long time. And, and I think what's coming, 221 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:40,680 what we're coming to a head is it's now getting to be so bad 222 00:09:40,720 --> 00:09:43,920 and so obvious that I think the book is timely, that you know 223 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,160 what I mean, that I think a lot of people are going to read it 224 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:48,880 and go, Oh my God, you're right. We got to fix this. 225 00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:51,800 And that's the goal. And we're on the verge of what I 226 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:54,680 would call the great awakening. I think we're on the verge of 227 00:09:54,680 --> 00:09:57,640 people really waking up. And I think, you know, some 228 00:09:57,640 --> 00:09:59,880 signs of that. Was this recent election with 229 00:09:59,880 --> 00:10:02,080 Trump what just happened? Can you hear me now? 230 00:10:02,120 --> 00:10:05,200 Yeah. Exactly the complete rebuttal of 231 00:10:05,200 --> 00:10:07,640 the legacy media. And then now we're finding out 232 00:10:07,640 --> 00:10:12,120 that it was USAID that was funding that whole apparatus. 233 00:10:12,120 --> 00:10:15,000 It's unbelievable. We've been gas lit and lied to 234 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:17,520 consistently. And the book talks about what a 235 00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:20,480 beautiful thing the Internet is because the Internet, it's what 236 00:10:20,480 --> 00:10:23,760 has allowed you and me to speak like this and communicate with 237 00:10:23,760 --> 00:10:25,400 thousands and millions of people around the world. 238 00:10:25,640 --> 00:10:28,360 It's what's allowed Tucker Carlson and Joe Rogan to become 239 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:31,720 more important than CNN and people that the scales are 240 00:10:31,720 --> 00:10:34,880 falling away from their eyes and they're coming to realize, hey, 241 00:10:34,880 --> 00:10:37,000 you know what? I've been lied to and I've been 242 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:39,520 screwed. And the good news is we 243 00:10:39,560 --> 00:10:41,880 outnumber, you know, the people who control this system, the 244 00:10:41,880 --> 00:10:44,480 elites in the media, the elites in the government, you know, all 245 00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:46,640 the people who run the system the way they run it. 246 00:10:46,640 --> 00:10:48,560 That takes advantage of the average man. 247 00:10:48,640 --> 00:10:52,040 We outnumber them vastly where they they've had the advantage 248 00:10:52,040 --> 00:10:54,280 of having all the information and control of all these 249 00:10:54,280 --> 00:10:57,560 systems, But guess what? We're taking that advantage 250 00:10:57,560 --> 00:11:00,880 away. 100% you know the the systems are are falling apart. 251 00:11:00,920 --> 00:11:02,720 I call it the great disintermediation. 252 00:11:02,720 --> 00:11:05,080 Exactly. And the Internet really allowed 253 00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:08,880 mass scale, mass scale peer to. Peer communication saved by 254 00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:10,800 technology. Yes, as Jeff Booth says, it's 255 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:12,680 wonderful. It's absolutely wonderful. 256 00:11:12,680 --> 00:11:16,440 My view is it'll happen without Larry or without Nico. 257 00:11:16,520 --> 00:11:18,400 But I've got a limited window here. 258 00:11:18,400 --> 00:11:22,560 You know, at age 67, I want it to happen faster, right? 259 00:11:22,920 --> 00:11:25,440 I want to see it happen. Therefore, I wrote the book. 260 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:26,680 Yeah. I mean we, I mean it's. 261 00:11:26,680 --> 00:11:27,960 Like let's accelerate this, right? 262 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:31,640 We all contribute and what I saw this narrative trench warfare on 263 00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:32,960 the battlegrounds and the Internet. 264 00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:34,760 That's exactly right. I want to ask you something, 265 00:11:34,760 --> 00:11:36,800 Larry, because this goes down a deeper rabbit hole. 266 00:11:36,840 --> 00:11:39,920 Sure, the Federal Reserve was established in 1913. 267 00:11:39,920 --> 00:11:44,280 Yes, the income tax was also established in 1913. 268 00:11:44,440 --> 00:11:46,440 Is that a coincidence? I don't think so. 269 00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:48,440 I don't think so. I mean, and the federal 270 00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:50,800 government exists to protect itself. 271 00:11:50,920 --> 00:11:53,480 And there's some great charts and I'm it's fabulous to see 272 00:11:53,480 --> 00:11:57,640 Trump and Bescent saying 18, 70 to 1913 was a really prosperous 273 00:11:57,640 --> 00:11:58,800 period. And they're right because we 274 00:11:58,800 --> 00:12:01,360 were on a sound money standard. The sound is money at that time, 275 00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:03,280 which was gold. And if you go back and you look 276 00:12:03,280 --> 00:12:05,880 at the revenues, this country didn't have an income tax pre 277 00:12:05,880 --> 00:12:08,040 1930. This wasn't a bad country from 278 00:12:08,040 --> 00:12:11,040 1789 to 1913. It was a pretty good country. 279 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:13,080 Where did all the revenue come from the federal government 280 00:12:13,080 --> 00:12:15,320 from, from tariffs. So, you know, people say, hey, 281 00:12:15,400 --> 00:12:17,920 you know, Trump is tariff man. Well, it might actually make a 282 00:12:17,920 --> 00:12:19,920 lot of sense. Let me ask you something, Larry, 283 00:12:20,160 --> 00:12:22,720 and you were alluding this to to this earlier. 284 00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:27,000 Did the establishment of the Federal Reserve in the United 285 00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:29,640 States enable World War One and World War 2? 286 00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:31,160 I think so. I think so. 287 00:12:31,160 --> 00:12:33,360 I mean, I look, World War 2 is a different case, a little more 288 00:12:33,360 --> 00:12:35,760 existential, you know, some bad stuff going on. 289 00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:39,600 But yes, I think that these printing money has been used and 290 00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:42,000 the book shows this printing money has been used to pay for 291 00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:45,000 war since the War of 1812. I mean, this suspended species 292 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:47,200 redemption in 1812 to pay for that war. 293 00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:49,760 The bottom line is war is incredibly expensive. 294 00:12:49,760 --> 00:12:51,440 Nobody wants to pay for it. So what are you going to do? 295 00:12:51,440 --> 00:12:53,080 If you're a government, you're going to come to your citizens, 296 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:55,400 say, hey, we're going to tax 100% to pay for this war. 297 00:12:55,440 --> 00:12:57,720 Citizens are going to go, yeah, like, like hell you are. 298 00:12:57,720 --> 00:12:59,960 We're going to revolt. So they know they can't do that. 299 00:12:59,960 --> 00:13:03,080 But if they have a sneaky mechanism to tax you indirectly, 300 00:13:03,080 --> 00:13:05,320 which is basically what inflation is, well, then they 301 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:07,360 can pay for the war, right? And that's what they've done. 302 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:09,880 And that, in my view, that's actually one of the most 303 00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:11,920 positive things. People ask me, what do you think 304 00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:14,320 the best thing about Bitcoin is? I'd say the best thing about 305 00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:15,880 Bitcoin is that it might end wars. 306 00:13:15,960 --> 00:13:17,800 I mean, yeah. And that's really, that would be 307 00:13:17,800 --> 00:13:19,600 wonderful, right? The reason I answered that 308 00:13:19,600 --> 00:13:22,480 question is it's such a powerful statement. 309 00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:25,200 And I believe it was Ron Paul who originally said, you know, 310 00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:27,040 it's not a coincidence. It's simple century. 311 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:27,880 Of course it is. Yeah. 312 00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:30,920 It's not a coincidence of the century of central banking. 313 00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:33,400 Is the century the the bloodiest century in human history? 314 00:13:33,400 --> 00:13:35,520 That's it's in the book. Yeah, that's exactly right. 315 00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:37,600 Yeah. So let me ask you something. 316 00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:42,200 What is your take on because I, I think from a historical 317 00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:44,520 context, right? Initially you had Trump going 318 00:13:44,520 --> 00:13:47,960 in, in, in 2016 and he was the outsider candidate. 319 00:13:48,280 --> 00:13:51,640 And then they did everything in their power to stop this guy. 320 00:13:51,800 --> 00:13:56,320 You know, the law fair, the assassination, the the some that 321 00:13:56,320 --> 00:13:59,520 election was quite interesting in 2020 to put it nicely. 322 00:14:00,320 --> 00:14:03,320 Where are we in a historical perspective? 323 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:06,640 Because I know that you are a big fan in the fourth turning 324 00:14:06,640 --> 00:14:08,120 theory us. So where are we? 325 00:14:08,240 --> 00:14:09,720 Well, I think we're deep into it now. 326 00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:11,680 I mean, if you if the 4th turning theory, for those who 327 00:14:11,680 --> 00:14:14,760 don't know, is the theory that every 80 years you have a crisis 328 00:14:14,880 --> 00:14:16,840 that gets resolved with a change of the rules. 329 00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:19,960 The last one before this was the Depression, World War 2. 330 00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:22,960 Before that it was 1865. The Civil War before that was 331 00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:25,120 1776. Those were all 4th turnings. 332 00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:27,240 We're in another one. It's 80 years, 80 plus years 333 00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:29,680 from World War 2 right now. And I think what's going to get 334 00:14:29,680 --> 00:14:32,280 resolved here is what Robert Breedlove says, which is we're 335 00:14:32,280 --> 00:14:33,720 going to determine what money is. 336 00:14:33,840 --> 00:14:36,080 If you, if you look at these 4th earnings, they tend to last 337 00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:38,520 between 10 and 30 years. And if you look at this one, I 338 00:14:38,520 --> 00:14:40,360 mark the start of this one as 2008. 339 00:14:40,360 --> 00:14:42,080 So we're more than 10 years into it. 340 00:14:42,080 --> 00:14:45,200 We're coming up on at 2028. We'll be 20 years into it. 341 00:14:45,200 --> 00:14:47,520 So we're going to resolve this money issue, in my opinion, in 342 00:14:47,520 --> 00:14:49,480 the next 10 or 15 years, maybe sooner. 343 00:14:49,560 --> 00:14:52,240 And where do you think Trump fits in all this? 344 00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:56,080 Oh, he's, you know, he's a godsend in terms of being a 345 00:14:56,080 --> 00:14:58,200 disruptor, right? I mean, he's had the courage. 346 00:14:58,200 --> 00:14:59,440 I mean, thank God he wasn't killed. 347 00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:01,760 I mean, it was almost divine. That bullet didn't hit his head. 348 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:03,000 He turned his head at the right time. 349 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:06,120 And he's a disruptor of the system. 350 00:15:06,120 --> 00:15:09,080 And honestly, he's not perfect, but he's learning and growing. 351 00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:11,960 I mean, I sure like Trump two more than I like Trump 10. 352 00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:14,280 He's getting more intelligent people around him. 353 00:15:14,280 --> 00:15:16,600 I mean, some of the people on his team I love, I love Tulsi 354 00:15:16,600 --> 00:15:18,160 Gabbard. I love RFK junior. 355 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:20,640 You know, he threw out Pompeo, who was a neo con. 356 00:15:20,760 --> 00:15:23,920 You know, I, I think Trump, Trump won O he didn't really 357 00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:25,560 fully understand what he was up against. 358 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:28,120 And, you know, although he might have won the 2020 election, in a 359 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:31,160 certain sense, it's it's poetic that he didn't the other side 360 00:15:31,160 --> 00:15:33,240 did. They totally misplayed their 361 00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:35,840 hand and made things much, much worse. 362 00:15:35,960 --> 00:15:40,120 And as a result, he was able to regroup his forces and get a 363 00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:42,960 better team around him. And I'm extremely hopeful for 364 00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:45,280 what he can do here. Now, you know, having said that, 365 00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:49,240 nobody's perfect, right? I mean, when I saw, and I just 366 00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:51,600 have to say this because for the wreck, when I saw Melania coin 367 00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:56,720 and Trump Coin, I was like, oh man, come on, dude, you're not 368 00:15:56,720 --> 00:15:59,280 selling steak knives with the Trump with the Trump name on 369 00:15:59,280 --> 00:15:59,800 them. Are you you? 370 00:16:00,960 --> 00:16:03,960 Know the the timing of it could have been better three days 371 00:16:03,960 --> 00:16:05,960 before the inauguration, but I think. 372 00:16:06,040 --> 00:16:08,560 A lot of look, I forgive him that, but it just wasn't great 373 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:10,480 in my view. No, it definitely wasn't. 374 00:16:10,680 --> 00:16:13,280 And I think a lot of Bitcoiners are getting their first taste in 375 00:16:13,280 --> 00:16:16,000 politics. Yeah, which is like politics is 376 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:17,960 the definition of the organization of power. 377 00:16:18,120 --> 00:16:19,680 And there's a lot of. Concessions and there's 378 00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:21,600 compromise. I mean, look, we've dragged 379 00:16:21,600 --> 00:16:23,320 along all these crypto guys, right? 380 00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:25,480 I mean, we've got some crypto guys hanging out in the 381 00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:27,440 strategic reserve. It should be a strategic Bitcoin 382 00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:29,560 reserve, but the crypto guys want a seat at the table. 383 00:16:29,560 --> 00:16:32,320 And I'm not wild about that. But hey, they provided a lot of 384 00:16:32,320 --> 00:16:35,360 votes and a lot of support and they helped get him elected. 385 00:16:35,360 --> 00:16:37,880 And so, OK, you know, if they're going to get a seat at the 386 00:16:37,880 --> 00:16:39,320 table, fine. I mean, I think most of the 387 00:16:39,320 --> 00:16:41,120 other crypto is going to fail and go away. 388 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:43,840 So it doesn't really matter what what I think is most important 389 00:16:43,840 --> 00:16:45,840 here is that Bitcoin is in the game. 390 00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:48,560 They understand what it is. We got the Loomis bill that 391 00:16:48,560 --> 00:16:51,040 might have a chance of passing. They're clearly going to hang on 392 00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:53,400 to the 200,000 coins they have and hopefully they're going to 393 00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:54,920 stack more. Absolutely. 394 00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:59,040 And one of the things also that that stuck out to me through 395 00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:03,720 this whole very historical occurrence is that if they just, 396 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:07,240 and you were saying it earlier, if they just let Trump take a 397 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:11,240 second term, right, I don't think that would have created 398 00:17:11,240 --> 00:17:14,920 this mobilization of our industry to throw our hat in the 399 00:17:14,920 --> 00:17:17,119 ring into politics. That might be true. 400 00:17:17,280 --> 00:17:19,599 Bit pointers didn't want to get into this. 401 00:17:19,599 --> 00:17:23,079 We were forced into this because of Operation Choke Point 2.0. 402 00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:24,599 Yeah. And all the hostility because of 403 00:17:24,599 --> 00:17:27,079 the bite administration. I think Trump and the Republican 404 00:17:27,079 --> 00:17:30,880 Party saw that as an opportunity to get votes, and they jumped on 405 00:17:30,880 --> 00:17:31,760 it. And it was great. 406 00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:32,960 It worked. Hey, you know, I will. 407 00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:34,440 Look, we'll ride that. It's good. 408 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:35,200 It works. Yeah. 409 00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:37,760 But it's almost as if it was divine, the whole thing. 410 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:39,920 Well, it really is. You're looking at this and then 411 00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:42,680 and then the way he moved his head, like you said, like. 412 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:45,560 You know, yeah, yeah, No, I mean, I'm a little spiritual and 413 00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:47,360 I, I mean, I gotta tell you, when I, when I thought about 414 00:17:47,360 --> 00:17:49,440 writing this book, I feel like I got tapped on the shoulder and 415 00:17:49,720 --> 00:17:51,880 it was kinda like, hey, you know what, you should write this. 416 00:17:52,120 --> 00:17:54,720 Look, this is probably gonna be my 15 minutes of fame, right? 417 00:17:54,880 --> 00:17:56,440 I think, cuz I think this book might go viral. 418 00:17:56,440 --> 00:17:59,640 And if it does, you know, I'm gonna thank my lucky stars and, 419 00:17:59,640 --> 00:18:02,400 and more importantly, thank you know what it'll do what I think 420 00:18:02,520 --> 00:18:05,120 it could do for the country. And I, you know, I was just very 421 00:18:05,120 --> 00:18:07,040 well positioned. I mean, I've been suffering with 422 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:09,080 the sound money thing for a long damn time. 423 00:18:09,080 --> 00:18:11,680 I think you and I've had this conversation before where, you 424 00:18:11,680 --> 00:18:14,120 know, being a gold bug was no fun for the last 30 years. 425 00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:15,920 Yeah. And then all you guys came along 426 00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:18,120 and it's like, holy shit, the reinforcements right here. 427 00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:22,520 I'm fired up. This this movement is alive and 428 00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:23,480 well. Alive and well. 429 00:18:23,480 --> 00:18:25,840 I mean, when I had 30 year olds quoting von Mises to me and they 430 00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:28,800 read the Bitcoin stand and I was like, all right, this is good. 431 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:30,840 I mean, we, you know, we might actually end up winning here, 432 00:18:30,840 --> 00:18:32,400 right? You know, I got Marty telling me 433 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:33,920 we're going to win, and I'm like, oh, we're going to win, 434 00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:35,200 right? Yeah, exactly. 435 00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:37,120 I mean, it's obvious we are gonna win, right? 436 00:18:37,120 --> 00:18:38,400 Yeah. So it's good. 437 00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:39,880 It's good stuff. What do you think about the 438 00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:42,160 strategic Bitcoin Reserve and the implications of? 439 00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:44,680 It, it's huge. I mean it's nation state cuz it 440 00:18:44,680 --> 00:18:48,520 could lead to nation state FOMO. I mean, as an example, I was at 441 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:54,640 Nina, I saw Eric speak, I saw Manafort speak and I heard from, 442 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:58,160 you know, the Bitcoin Policy Institute guys that basically 443 00:18:58,440 --> 00:19:00,960 other states are watching what we're doing that sought the 444 00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:04,120 Saudis, Oman and the UAE are all stacking. 445 00:19:04,120 --> 00:19:06,400 And they were literally saying, are you guys OK with us 446 00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:09,240 announcing this and response from the Trump administration is 447 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:12,880 sure after we do, we just, we just want to go 1st. 448 00:19:12,920 --> 00:19:17,200 And so if the US is stacking coins, that becomes a strategic 449 00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:19,160 imperative for all the countries to consider. 450 00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:22,120 I mean, you now know that China has to think about it for sure. 451 00:19:22,120 --> 00:19:24,560 Russia has to think about it. China's pretty averse to it. 452 00:19:24,640 --> 00:19:26,960 I think Russia's smart enough. I mean, I think Putin gets it. 453 00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:28,360 I think they're probably stacking coins. 454 00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:31,520 It is the most as it's what Sailor says is the most pristine 455 00:19:31,560 --> 00:19:35,720 form of capital in the world. And it's destined to become the 456 00:19:35,720 --> 00:19:37,960 base layer of money in my opinion, because that it's 457 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:41,120 technical superiority. And as a result of that, it's a 458 00:19:41,120 --> 00:19:44,240 complete first mover game. I mean, you, you know, you get 459 00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:46,600 it at the price you deserve. And so the sooner you figure it 460 00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:48,640 out and get it, the better off you are. 461 00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:51,080 And Max is better off than I am because he figured it out at a 462 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:53,280 dollar. Trace is better off than he is 463 00:19:53,280 --> 00:19:55,360 because Trace figured it out at $0.50. 464 00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:57,160 Like take a guy like Larry Fink, right? 465 00:19:57,160 --> 00:20:00,680 I mean a Fiat guy, but smart enough to study it and realize, 466 00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:02,920 you know what, I either got to get on board this and figure out 467 00:20:02,920 --> 00:20:06,000 a way to make money doing it, you know, sponsoring an ETF, or 468 00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:08,160 I'm going to end up like the Vanguard guy and lose my job. 469 00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:10,080 Yep. And so, and that's kind of how 470 00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:12,400 it is for everybody. A lot of people I deal with now 471 00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:14,400 kind of come back and they say, well, yeah, that's great, Larry, 472 00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:16,880 but you bought a lot cheaper and how can I pay something? 473 00:20:17,120 --> 00:20:19,720 How can I pay this amount of money, 100,000 a coin for 474 00:20:19,720 --> 00:20:22,160 something you bought for 400 or 10,000? 475 00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:24,800 You know, I bought a lot of 50. But my response is. 476 00:20:25,120 --> 00:20:27,280 Here's the paradigm. It's a critical state problem. 477 00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:31,800 The monetary system is the Titanic and I got a lifeboat. 478 00:20:31,800 --> 00:20:36,080 I'm on the I paid 405,010 thousand, 50,000 for my lifeboat 479 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:37,200 seats. Here it is to you. 480 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:38,920 You got to pay 100,000. You want to see it or not? 481 00:20:39,040 --> 00:20:42,000 And you know, if I'm right, and if the system does fail, which I 482 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:44,560 think it might, you're going to be damn glad you bought a seat, 483 00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:46,160 even if you have to pay 100,000 for it. 484 00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:49,640 Of course I mean. It's, I remember Jack Mahler's 485 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:52,440 the way that he said it's, it's like, it's like basically saying 486 00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:55,760 the year is 2025 and you refuse to use the Internet, right? 487 00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:59,880 It's it's it's the the. Or or Manhattan real estate you 488 00:20:59,880 --> 00:21:03,120 know as as sailor uses and. The whole, the whole concept of, 489 00:21:03,360 --> 00:21:05,760 you know, I'm not going to buy because this person bought 490 00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:08,120 earlier than me. That's more so that's an ego 491 00:21:08,120 --> 00:21:10,360 test more than anything. Correct, Correct. 492 00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:12,640 Well, and also, as I say, the critical state thing is 493 00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:15,520 important because once there's some good charts in here that 494 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:18,720 show adoption curves and cell phones, all kinds of things. 495 00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:20,640 So this is a new technology, it's being adopted. 496 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:22,200 We're entering a steep part of the curve. 497 00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:24,480 And so do you want to be an early adopter or do you want to 498 00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:26,040 wait? Because the difference is going 499 00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:27,640 to cost you a lot in terms of price. 500 00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:31,520 It's a critical state issue because, you know, another 501 00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:34,280 analogy I like to use is the avalanche analogy. 502 00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:37,280 You know, at some point Fiat currency is going to fail in my 503 00:21:37,280 --> 00:21:40,600 belief, in my opinion. So which snowflake is going to 504 00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:43,280 cause the avalanche to break loose and have it fail? 505 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:45,560 I don't know. But there's no, there's no do 506 00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:47,840 over, you know what I mean? You don't get to say, oh, you 507 00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:49,600 know, I'm sorry. I kind of wish I'd, you know, I 508 00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:52,080 wish I'd gotten out of the way before that avalanche, you know, 509 00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:53,800 broke loose and came down and smothered me. 510 00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:56,440 What does that look like, Larry? Like when Fiat fails? 511 00:21:56,440 --> 00:21:58,560 Cuz I feel like that that is ugly. 512 00:21:58,600 --> 00:22:00,080 It is ugly. It is ugly. 513 00:22:00,840 --> 00:22:03,280 I'm assuming you've you've heard of of the book Mandibles. 514 00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:05,040 It's it's in the book, right? There we go. 515 00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:06,880 Yeah. What does that look? 516 00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:09,760 Like, I hope so. It it looks a lot of different 517 00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:11,120 ways, Nico and it. Doesn't. 518 00:22:11,120 --> 00:22:12,880 And what makes you so confident is going to happen? 519 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:15,560 Well, I'm confident it's going to happen because of the math 520 00:22:15,560 --> 00:22:17,960 and because this is a superior technology and because more and 521 00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:20,720 more humans are adopting it and people always gravitate towards 522 00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:22,840 the best solution. And we've now got 15 years of 523 00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:25,080 evidence that it's the best, 16 years of evidence that it's the 524 00:22:25,080 --> 00:22:27,080 best solution. But but in terms of the how it 525 00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:28,640 happens, it doesn't have to be mandibles. 526 00:22:28,640 --> 00:22:31,440 I don't think it will be. It can, one, it'll take a bit 527 00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:32,920 longer. It can be more gradual, which 528 00:22:32,920 --> 00:22:35,040 isn't a funny way. We want it to go up faster, but 529 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:37,040 in a funny way, it's a good thing if we get more people on 530 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:38,640 board, get more people time to adapt. 531 00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:41,560 The second thing is, as I talk about in the book, this doesn't 532 00:22:41,560 --> 00:22:43,640 have to be a brutal total collapse. 533 00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:45,680 We can do a currency reset. OK? 534 00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:48,400 This has been done before. Roosevelt did it in 33. 535 00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:51,680 I mean, we can basically transition back to a sound money 536 00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:54,360 currency. The problem with America today 537 00:22:54,360 --> 00:22:56,920 is that the money is unsound and the money is broken. 538 00:22:57,000 --> 00:23:00,720 You know, title of Lynn's book. And therefore the solution is to 539 00:23:00,720 --> 00:23:02,440 just go back to a sound money system. 540 00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:04,880 And there have been lots and lots of societies throughout the 541 00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:06,280 world that have had broken money. 542 00:23:06,360 --> 00:23:08,960 And what happens, what you see when you study them and read 543 00:23:08,960 --> 00:23:11,680 about them is when they go back to sound money, they get better. 544 00:23:11,720 --> 00:23:14,040 Everything gets fixed, especially if you don't have a 545 00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:16,560 major war, You know, if we can avoid having a major war. 546 00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:18,560 I mean, all that's broken here is the money. 547 00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:21,400 And so, you know, now now, don't get me wrong it when when I'm 548 00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:23,600 describing a curse, there will be winners and losers. 549 00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:26,440 The people who don't have sound money will lose on a relative 550 00:23:26,440 --> 00:23:28,360 basis. The people have a lot of unsound 551 00:23:28,360 --> 00:23:30,360 money stored in bonds. They're going to get creamed, 552 00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:33,360 but that's unavoidable. I mean, that's just the way that 553 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:36,360 because, you know, the bonds and the the commitments that have 554 00:23:36,360 --> 00:23:38,200 been made, they're not money good. 555 00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:40,720 They're not it's, you know, the values are fake. 556 00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:42,920 I mean, just like in real estate right now, I think some of these 557 00:23:42,920 --> 00:23:44,920 very high end real estate price, they're just fake. 558 00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:46,160 Yeah. I mean, people are hiding in 559 00:23:46,160 --> 00:23:48,520 real estate thinking that'll protect them from inflation. 560 00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:51,080 But, you know, do you really need a $20 million house or a 561 00:23:51,080 --> 00:23:53,040 $10 million or a $5,000,000 house? 562 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:56,200 It's, it's ridiculous shelter, it's ridiculous and it's and 563 00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:58,920 it's really stolen my generation's ability to. 564 00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:02,240 Well, that's right. It's, it's been just complete 565 00:24:02,240 --> 00:24:04,120 flat out theft. Yes. 566 00:24:04,360 --> 00:24:07,840 And the frustration. I have friends who are extremely 567 00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:10,000 successful and they're renting. Right. 568 00:24:10,120 --> 00:24:12,280 My kids are all in their 20s and they're like, Dad, how am I ever 569 00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:13,440 gonna buy a house? Yeah. 570 00:24:14,680 --> 00:24:17,160 And it's absurd. And then that leads me to the 571 00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:21,360 premise of your book, which is money printing breaks 572 00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:22,400 everything. Yes. 573 00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:24,680 How does it? Well, it, it, it creates 574 00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:28,080 inflation and creation and inflation creates winners and 575 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:30,920 losers and it makes wealth inequality really large. 576 00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:33,760 One of the early charts in the book shows how just out of 577 00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:35,400 balance the wealth inequality has gotten. 578 00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:38,000 And again, when I wrote the book, I thought to myself, I, I 579 00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:41,200 got to write this because I remember America in the Sixties, 580 00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:43,000 70s and 80s when I was growing up. 581 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:45,560 And it had, we had problems. I mean, the Vietnam War was a 582 00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:47,760 big one, but, but it was a better America. 583 00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:49,400 There was a vibrant middle class. 584 00:24:49,400 --> 00:24:52,560 I mean, and one guy could work his, his, his wife could be a 585 00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:55,760 housewife, he could have a car, they could take vacations. 586 00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:57,640 I mean, it was just, it was just better. 587 00:24:57,680 --> 00:25:00,840 And, and now, you know, everybody is just scrambling for 588 00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:03,640 every last dollar And people can't retire because they don't 589 00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:05,560 know if their savings are going to how long their savings will 590 00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:07,080 last because they're going to be debased. 591 00:25:07,120 --> 00:25:09,360 You know, I mean, think of all the people who work their entire 592 00:25:09,360 --> 00:25:12,160 life up until 2020, saved up all their money. 593 00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:15,360 And then in two years, 40% of the money supply got printed. 594 00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:19,520 We just took away 40% of their labor that they'd saved for 595 00:25:19,520 --> 00:25:21,720 their whole life. You know, it's criminal. 596 00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:24,040 I mean, you think of all the people who worked for companies 597 00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:27,000 who had pensions, you know, and, and now and the pensions got 598 00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:29,960 taken over by PE firms. And then the PE firms, you know, 599 00:25:29,960 --> 00:25:32,600 paid out big dividends or the companies got taken over PE 600 00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:33,800 firms. I talk about this in the book. 601 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:36,960 PE firms paid out big dividends and the people's pensions got 602 00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:39,960 cut. I mean, America has become an 603 00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:44,800 enormous criminal money grab by the people who were at the top, 604 00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:47,840 the rich, and the laws are written to favor them and 605 00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:49,800 protect them. And so when anything goes wrong, 606 00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:51,840 they get bailed out. Silicon Valley Bank, I mean, 607 00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:55,120 Bill Ackman cries like a baby. You know, that the banking 608 00:25:55,120 --> 00:25:57,520 system will fail because he probably had deposits at Silicon 609 00:25:57,520 --> 00:25:59,600 Valley Bank. And so we bail it out, which is 610 00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:02,080 in direct contravention of the Dodd Frank law. 611 00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:04,480 And that happens over and over and over again. 612 00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:06,240 And I document the cases in the book. 613 00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:09,120 I mean, it's just unfair. I mean, we used to have usury 614 00:26:09,120 --> 00:26:11,000 laws when I was young. My parents would get credit 615 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:12,480 cards. The maximum interest rate on a 616 00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:14,920 credit card was 10 or 20%. The average interest rate on a 617 00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:17,360 credit card is 25%. I mean, the mob would blush. 618 00:26:17,360 --> 00:26:20,120 So if you're rich, you can borrow money at the Fed funds 619 00:26:20,120 --> 00:26:22,560 rate or sometimes below, but close to the Fed funds rate. 620 00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:24,400 If you're average. If you're a normal American, 621 00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:26,920 you've got to pay 25% to borrow money from the credit cards. 622 00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:29,520 I'm like, come on. No, it's just, you know, come 623 00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:31,000 on. I mean, it's just right. 624 00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:34,920 No, I mean no, I mean of course I mean I I feel my generation 625 00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:36,200 feels it. We feel it. 626 00:26:36,360 --> 00:26:39,600 We all feel it. My question though, is like, why 627 00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:43,280 don't people see the problem? Because you see a lot of 628 00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:46,240 politicians and I, I don't want to name which side and I think 629 00:26:46,240 --> 00:26:48,920 it's obvious, but a lot of politicians are saying it's the 630 00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:51,600 corporation, corporation, they're, they're price gouging. 631 00:26:52,240 --> 00:26:54,920 You know, they're taking advantage of the situation, this 632 00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:59,720 and this and that. Why isn't the average Joe aware 633 00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:01,720 of this? And I know writing this book and 634 00:27:01,720 --> 00:27:04,840 what we do every single day on on Bitcoin X. 635 00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:07,200 And I think they kind of are, I mean, I think they're getting 636 00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:09,880 closer and they're more average Joes that are becoming like us. 637 00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:13,320 So, you know, the Overton window is moving and it's absolutely 638 00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:15,240 it's shifting. And there are more average Joes 639 00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:17,440 in our camp. But, you know, it's 640 00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:20,120 sophisticated, right? I mean, it's and, and a lot of 641 00:27:20,120 --> 00:27:22,720 people, they think, well, Gee, maybe I'm doing something wrong. 642 00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:25,080 Maybe it's my fault. You know, This is why you have 643 00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:27,640 all these deaths of despair, why you have drug overdoses and 644 00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:30,840 alcoholism and suicides. I mean, because the game is 645 00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:33,440 unfair. People know it's unfair and they 646 00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:35,400 just, they give up. You're poor and you're working 647 00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:38,520 three jobs just to kind of stay, keep your head above water and, 648 00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:40,880 you know, keep food on the table and, you know, right. 649 00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:43,760 Do you have time to read books like this or to go live? 650 00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:45,640 You know, and, and, and even if you read it, you know, what's 651 00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:46,880 the problem? And do you really have time to 652 00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:49,000 write your congressman or go lobby the Fed? 653 00:27:49,280 --> 00:27:52,120 No, I mean, you're just, you're just trying to stay alive, 654 00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:55,960 right? But you know, you vote and you 655 00:27:55,960 --> 00:27:58,360 know, we get more politicians that understand this is the 656 00:27:58,360 --> 00:28:00,000 issue. You know, we get a Bitcoin or 657 00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:01,360 politician running for president. 658 00:28:01,360 --> 00:28:03,520 I mean, we kind of had one. I mean, Trump got pretty close 659 00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:05,760 to being full Bitcoiner, a libertarian, but we get it. 660 00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:08,240 So that there's a lot more of that fighting against the people 661 00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:09,480 who want to see it the other way. 662 00:28:09,560 --> 00:28:11,800 And guess what we're going to, we're going to gravitate and 663 00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:14,440 move towards a sound money standard and hopefully do it in 664 00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:17,840 a controlled and intelligent way so that people don't suffer, so 665 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:20,120 that we don't have a mandibles kind of outcome. 666 00:28:20,120 --> 00:28:21,960 Yeah, and. I love how you brought up the 667 00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:24,560 Overton window. The Overton window has shifted 668 00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:28,600 in the last six months more than it has in the last decade. 669 00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:30,200 Right. It's amazing, isn't it? 670 00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:33,360 Yeah. I mean, pre January in the ETFs, 671 00:28:33,360 --> 00:28:35,520 I had everybody in the brother telling me, oh, yeah, that's a 672 00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:36,920 great dream, Larry. And I understand it. 673 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:38,960 And you're, you know, you may be right about all this, but the 674 00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:40,400 government's never going to allow that. 675 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:42,160 Well, then they allow the ETFI was blown away. 676 00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:43,840 I didn't think the ETF was going to get through. 677 00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:44,480 Yeah. Right. 678 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:46,320 Larry Fink has a lot of influence. 679 00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:49,040 Well, that's the point, right? See, some people with money got 680 00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:51,600 involved and, you know, I mean, this is what's going on in the 681 00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:53,480 gold market right now. I mean, I think the smart people 682 00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:56,160 are buying gold now. They know, look, anybody with a 683 00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:58,960 brain that analyzes the macroeconomics of the federal 684 00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:02,440 government and realizes what a debt doom loop we're in must 685 00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:05,680 come to the conclusion that you have to have sound money or real 686 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:07,120 assets or you're going to get hurt. 687 00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:09,480 I mean, Ray Dalio, one of the great investors of our time, 688 00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:11,640 runs Bridgewater. You know, he understands it. 689 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:13,640 He's been talking about gold for years and he's finally becoming 690 00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:15,240 a bitcoiner. He's it's kind of coming to get 691 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:18,080 it and everybody will come to get it eventually because it's 692 00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,200 obvious, obvious and it's compelling. 693 00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:23,480 I noticed that about Ray I saw I saw the I saw the news on next 694 00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:24,560 guys. I want to tell you about our 695 00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:28,040 sponsor bitcoinwell.com. It's the best place to build 696 00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:30,440 your automatic self custody Bitcoin stack. 697 00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:32,800 What makes Bitcoin well different is that it's a 698 00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:36,440 completely non custodial platform, which means as soon as 699 00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:39,880 you buy Bitcoin on Bitcoin well and the funds clear, they go 700 00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:42,640 straight to yourself. Custody Bitcoin wallet address 701 00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:46,480 enable your independence today with the fastest and safest way 702 00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:49,600 to buy Bitcoin in Canada and the United States. 703 00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:52,880 Head over to bitcoinwell.com to get started. 704 00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:54,880 I do want to ask you about the debt doom loop. 705 00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:56,320 I want to, I want to double back to that. 706 00:29:56,320 --> 00:29:58,880 But before I get to that, I want to get your thoughts on the 707 00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:04,360 recent news of Elon supposedly tapping on Ron Paul to audit the 708 00:30:04,360 --> 00:30:05,040 federal. Reserve. 709 00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:06,080 God, I love that. I love. 710 00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:08,480 Yeah, I mean, Elon's nuts, but I but I like some of what he's 711 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:10,160 doing. And wouldn't that be great? 712 00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:13,400 But here's the problem, you know, Elon doesn't control the 713 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:16,120 Congress and the Congress. Only the Congress can audit the 714 00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:17,760 Federal Reserve. And I'd love to have Ron Paul 715 00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:18,760 look at the Federal Reserve. You can. 716 00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:21,640 You can bet your bottom dollar, Nico, that there is no way in 717 00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:24,440 hell the Fed is going to let them look at anything without a 718 00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:26,840 congressional act forcing it to occur. 719 00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:29,400 I mean, you know, you can say, hey, Ron, come on in and look at 720 00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:30,960 the Fed. The feds going to say F you. 721 00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:35,840 Did he see Jay Powell's response when when Trump was when they 722 00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:38,160 asked him, like, do you think Trump's going to fire you? 723 00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:40,160 And he says he can't fire me. Did he see his? 724 00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:41,520 Response. I didn't see that, but I heard 725 00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:42,520 that. Yeah, I heard about it. 726 00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:44,160 Arrogance. What? 727 00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:47,760 What blatant? Is this not a government agency? 728 00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:49,440 It is. Well, what he's what he's 729 00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:52,720 relying as the law, and the law says that only the Congress can 730 00:30:52,720 --> 00:30:55,440 fire him. And yeah, it is that is the law. 731 00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:58,840 That's technically the law. So so, you know, and and I mean, 732 00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:00,920 here's the thing, it's going to be really hard to get a Congress 733 00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:03,000 to vote to fire him. I mean, you know, Loomis and 734 00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:05,120 some, you know, there are people in Congress who would fire him, 735 00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:06,680 but there aren't enough of them. You know, when? 736 00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:08,920 I mean, just to give you an example, a good anecdote from 737 00:31:08,920 --> 00:31:10,960 the book, Judy Shelton is a gold person. 738 00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:12,120 And she's been around for a long time. 739 00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:15,080 She's got a pH D, She's very well known, and she advocates 740 00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:16,320 for going back to a gold standard. 741 00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:18,560 Ron Paul knows, we all know her. She's a lovely lady. 742 00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:20,480 And in the first Trump administration, Trump 743 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:23,040 recommended that she become a member of the Federal Reserve. 744 00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:25,080 You should have seen the reaction. 745 00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:27,880 Oh my God. There was a letter with like 130 746 00:31:27,880 --> 00:31:31,520 signatories from the Congress, the Senate and major economists 747 00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:35,040 saying, you know, that her views were I'll timed, dangerous and 748 00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:37,160 I'll. Consider to democracy is my 749 00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:38,480 favorite. Yes, right. 750 00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:41,040 Exactly. And I mean, this is a woman who 751 00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:43,240 just said nothing more than I want the money to be sound. 752 00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:45,680 I want savers not to get ripped off, and she's dangerous. 753 00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:49,120 So we got a ways to go before Congress is going to let anyone 754 00:31:49,120 --> 00:31:51,320 audit the Federal Reserve. I believe it was a Breitbart 755 00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:54,880 quote, but it was basically along the lines of politics is 756 00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:58,960 downstream from culture. So the way that we really shift 757 00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:01,360 the Overton window, the really the way that we really get 758 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:04,800 Congress on our side is to win over the culture. 759 00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:07,520 And how do we do that? One book at a time, right? 760 00:32:07,520 --> 00:32:11,840 1X post at a time, one video at a time, really winning over the 761 00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:14,160 hearts and minds of individuals. Exactly. 762 00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:17,160 But one of the things to Larry that I found in your book that I 763 00:32:17,160 --> 00:32:20,080 found quite interesting that perhaps people are not aware of. 764 00:32:20,600 --> 00:32:24,160 I I, I would say that money printing in this Fiat system 765 00:32:24,160 --> 00:32:27,320 that we have today gives capitalism a bad name. 766 00:32:27,320 --> 00:32:29,440 Oh, absolutely. And what you describe is that we 767 00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:31,200 don't live in a free market society. 768 00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:32,840 We don't live in a capitalistic society. 769 00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:37,240 We live in a Keynesian state capitalistic society, also known 770 00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:39,720 as crony capitalism. Could you describe what that is? 771 00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:42,880 Yeah, sure. So the insiders in the system 772 00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:48,360 have an enormous advantage in two respects. 1, we get, we 773 00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:51,560 grant them cheap access to capital from the Fed. 774 00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:54,400 And two, we backstop their mistakes. 775 00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:57,480 It's just that simple. So that a Ken Griffin, you know, 776 00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:00,280 can put on the the basis trade on the S&P 500. 777 00:33:00,400 --> 00:33:03,600 And when his trade is tits up in March of 2020, which it probably 778 00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:07,040 was Ben Bernanke, who is corrupt and is an advisor to Ken 779 00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:09,640 Griffin, The rumor is he gets paid $20 million a year, can 780 00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:12,440 make a call to Jay Powell and say you got to give a swap line 781 00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:15,080 to Citadel or else Citadel's going to go BK. 782 00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:17,680 And if Citadel goes BK, the whole system will come down. 783 00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:20,240 And that's always been their defense. 784 00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:23,360 OK, I mean, Silicon Valley Bank. Too big to fail, Too big to 785 00:33:23,360 --> 00:33:24,920 fail. Therefore we have to print the 786 00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:27,880 money. And printing the money bails out 787 00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:31,680 the bad actors. So the banks, the backstopping 788 00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:34,960 the banks, which is what we originally did in 1913, 789 00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:38,120 basically said you guys don't have to play by the rules. 790 00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:41,000 You can have tails, you know, heads, heads you win, tails, 791 00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:44,720 tails we lose. And and so in whatever event 792 00:33:44,720 --> 00:33:46,920 they they do, they're going to get bailed out. 793 00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:50,440 And so that's crony capitalism. I mean, you know, Warren Buffett 794 00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:56,320 backed Salomon Brothers and Goldman Sachs in the GFC when he 795 00:33:56,320 --> 00:33:59,000 knew it was bankrupt. Everybody knew it was bankrupt, 796 00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:01,480 but he put in preferred stock with, you know, great conversion 797 00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:03,920 terms and everything else at the same time, knowing the 798 00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:05,800 government would bail it out. And then it got bailed out. 799 00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:07,120 And of course, he made a killing on it. 800 00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:09,120 You know, there's a story in the book that's one of my favorite 801 00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:10,320 stories. And people are amazed when they 802 00:34:10,320 --> 00:34:11,760 read this. And that's, again, something I 803 00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:14,159 bring because I've been around for a long time and I watched 804 00:34:14,159 --> 00:34:17,520 all this go down. The chairman of Morgan Stanley's 805 00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:20,639 wife was able to borrow during the GFC. 806 00:34:20,679 --> 00:34:23,239 And this is and Matt Taibbi. It's not just me saying this. 807 00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:27,040 Google Matt Taibbi, Real Housewives of Wall Street. 808 00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,880 OK Rolling Stone. It used to be under a behind a 809 00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:31,080 firewall or a paywall. It's not. 810 00:34:31,080 --> 00:34:32,760 You can get it for free now. It's amazing story. 811 00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:38,159 John Mack's wife borrowed $220 million from the Fed non 812 00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:42,800 recourse, non recourse at 0% interest rates to buy troubled 813 00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:44,159 assets. So what does that mean? 814 00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:47,960 That means they gave her $220 million of purchasing power 815 00:34:48,159 --> 00:34:51,120 where she could buy distressed assets in early 2009. 816 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:54,159 And if they went up in value, she would get to keep the 817 00:34:54,159 --> 00:34:56,280 profits. And if they went down in value 818 00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:58,280 and the loan defaulted, the Fed would eat it. 819 00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:01,000 So, I mean, that's crony capitalism. 820 00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:03,360 It's nice to be John Mack's wife, OK? 821 00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:06,120 It's nice to be the chairman of Morgan Stanley and get that kind 822 00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:07,880 of a deal. You can't get that deal. 823 00:35:07,960 --> 00:35:10,560 I can't get that deal. But the people at the top can 824 00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:12,880 get that deal. I mean, this is incredibly, 825 00:35:12,960 --> 00:35:15,680 incredibly broken. It's financial criminal 826 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:18,320 behavior. And it makes sense why it may 827 00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:21,880 you're telling me this and just having all these stocks going 828 00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:23,120 ahead. Right, it's. 829 00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:26,160 No, it would be. It makes sense why they resisted 830 00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:28,440 Trump as much as they did OF. Course they did. 831 00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:30,240 He's a he's a threat to their system. 832 00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:32,600 He knows all this. He knows all this and he wants 833 00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:34,440 to shut it down. I know all this. 834 00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:35,840 Lots of people. Ron Paul knows this. 835 00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:38,120 So, so lots of people know this and and what they've what 836 00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:39,880 they've done to date. And I'll let you finish ask a 837 00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:41,240 question. What they've done to date is 838 00:35:41,240 --> 00:35:43,560 they've thrown us into the conspiracy nut basket. 839 00:35:43,560 --> 00:35:45,360 You know it's not. Working so much anymore. 840 00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:47,920 Oh, no, it's not. Yeah, 'cause the conspiracy 841 00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:49,440 shit's coming true. But you know, they've, I mean, 842 00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:52,080 I've been called a tinfoil Hatter, all that stuff, you 843 00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:53,200 know? But guess what? 844 00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:54,560 It's turning out that we're right. 845 00:35:54,680 --> 00:35:57,080 Yeah, absolutely. Larry, I just want everyone to 846 00:35:57,080 --> 00:36:01,160 understand what is the unintended consequences of 847 00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:05,040 specific people getting specific deals like you just mentioned? 848 00:36:05,040 --> 00:36:08,040 Like what is the unintended consequence of her essentially 849 00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:10,040 receiving free money? Because that's the way I'm 850 00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:12,240 interpreting. It right it is well that that 851 00:36:12,240 --> 00:36:16,040 free money one adds to inflation 2 makes her rich versus 852 00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:20,680 everybody else and and and that inflation is why we all pay more 853 00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:23,680 for food and gasoline. OK, that's that's really, but 854 00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:26,000 it's subtle because it's, you know, it's spread out over 855 00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:27,320 1,000,000 of people. Yeah. 856 00:36:27,400 --> 00:36:30,080 So it's hard to say. Well, you know, Jilly Mac's deal 857 00:36:30,240 --> 00:36:32,200 cost Nico this amount of dollars. 858 00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:34,480 Yeah, but, but, but the pattern is there. 859 00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:36,800 And this is the, you know, the book lays that pattern out. 860 00:36:37,120 --> 00:36:39,680 It's. Insidious because the the, the 861 00:36:39,720 --> 00:36:43,400 number on that $100 bill does not change, right? 862 00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:46,640 The and you're looking at your account, the the count, the 863 00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:48,760 number is not changing. No, it's the. 864 00:36:48,920 --> 00:36:51,360 What it'll buy, Yes, it's, I mean very. 865 00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:53,120 Sinister. That's why eggs are 11 bucks. 866 00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:54,360 You know, it doesn't now or something. 867 00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:56,680 I mean, there are other issues with that with Berkeley, but it 868 00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:58,800 is very sinister. And it's gotten worse. 869 00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:00,640 Yeah. I mean, there's a great chart in 870 00:37:00,640 --> 00:37:02,640 the book that shows the wealth inequality. 871 00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:06,200 I mean, 1% of the country owns 92% of the wealth, right? 872 00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:09,800 That's crazy, 1%. So it's nice to be the rich in 873 00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:11,440 this country. And they, you know, they live 874 00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:13,040 like kings. But guess what? 875 00:37:13,040 --> 00:37:15,200 They've done that at the expense of everybody else. 876 00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:18,560 So, you know, sadly, I mean, I understand the complaints of a 877 00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:20,520 Bernie Sanders. I understand them there. 878 00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:22,760 It is an unfair system. He's right. 879 00:37:22,800 --> 00:37:25,720 His solution is just wrong. The solution is not to tax these 880 00:37:25,720 --> 00:37:27,160 people. The solution is to make the 881 00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:28,920 playing field level. Yeah, right. 882 00:37:29,240 --> 00:37:30,720 And let's talk about that, right? 883 00:37:30,720 --> 00:37:33,880 So it's massive wealth redistribution. 884 00:37:33,880 --> 00:37:35,840 Yeah, via currency debasement, Yeah. 885 00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:38,240 So lower middle classes get impacted the most. 886 00:37:38,240 --> 00:37:40,560 Yeah, because they don't have the means to save in assets, 887 00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:41,400 right. And the wealth? 888 00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:44,360 Or borrow cheaply. Or borrow cheaply and the wealth 889 00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:47,240 is redistributed back to the government and back to the very 890 00:37:47,240 --> 00:37:49,640 wealthy that do have the means to save an asset. 891 00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:51,360 Correct. And that's what's causing the 892 00:37:51,360 --> 00:37:55,200 wealth inequality now. From a historical standpoint, 893 00:37:55,280 --> 00:37:58,240 every time that wealth inequality reaches a certain 894 00:37:58,240 --> 00:38:01,320 point, something breaks. I think it's 1789. 895 00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:05,080 I mean, so we have two, we have to. 896 00:38:05,440 --> 00:38:07,560 Bring out the guillotine. Well, we had the French 897 00:38:07,560 --> 00:38:10,120 Revolution, which is, I believe a little bit more of a left wing 898 00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:12,560 revolution and then we had the American Revolution, which is a 899 00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:14,280 little bit more of a right wing revolution. 900 00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:16,000 Now the question is which way do we go? 901 00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:17,880 Yeah. Well, that's a lot of questions 902 00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:19,800 there. But but yeah, the fact, the fact 903 00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:21,520 is that, yeah. And yeah, the Russian Revolution 904 00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:24,080 as well, same, similar thing. I mean, the fact is that, yeah, 905 00:38:24,080 --> 00:38:26,960 when a society gets this broken, you know, bad things can happen 906 00:38:26,960 --> 00:38:29,360 and it could go the wrong way. Look, I mean, the left would 907 00:38:29,360 --> 00:38:32,720 love to, you know, just tax the hell out of everybody and issue 908 00:38:32,720 --> 00:38:35,640 universal basic income and make us all live at the same level. 909 00:38:35,640 --> 00:38:37,560 And that's not right either, because it doesn't provide the 910 00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:40,280 right incentives for people to work hard and to reward, you 911 00:38:40,280 --> 00:38:43,560 know, good behavior. The thing that I find so sad is 912 00:38:43,560 --> 00:38:48,280 that capitalism is a system for bestowing great prosperity on 913 00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:50,960 mankind. And if you study capitalism from 914 00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:56,320 1789 to 1913, you look at my grandparents life from 1913 even 915 00:38:56,320 --> 00:39:01,400 to 1970, look at how much living standards and health. 916 00:39:01,400 --> 00:39:05,720 And I mean, it was just so fantastic in a solid capitalist 917 00:39:05,720 --> 00:39:08,160 system. I mean, you know, and and I talk 918 00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:09,920 about everyone says, well, deflation is a bad thing. 919 00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:12,480 I mean, we had deflation all throughout the 19th century. 920 00:39:12,480 --> 00:39:15,080 And yet people got richer and people got wealthier, lives got 921 00:39:15,080 --> 00:39:17,760 better and the average man could afford a much better life. 922 00:39:17,760 --> 00:39:19,840 And and now it's the other way around. 923 00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:22,160 I mean, we're seeing, you know, for the first time in a long 924 00:39:22,160 --> 00:39:24,720 time, you know, lifespans in America are starting to short. 925 00:39:24,720 --> 00:39:27,000 Yep, you know, which is a sign that the size something's not 926 00:39:27,000 --> 00:39:27,600 right. Yeah. 927 00:39:27,600 --> 00:39:29,480 And that's also something that you mentioned in the book as 928 00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:31,440 well. There is that you mentioned that 929 00:39:31,520 --> 00:39:33,600 it summarizes itself. Money printing breaks 930 00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:35,520 everything, everything. And one of the things that you 931 00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:37,280 mentioned was health. Absolutely. 932 00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:40,040 Did you explain why that is? Well, yeah, I mean, because 933 00:39:40,080 --> 00:39:42,920 because poor people can't buy good food and because poor 934 00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:45,200 people are working three jobs, you know, and not getting a good 935 00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:47,360 night's sleep to try and put money on the table. 936 00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:50,240 And because, you know, we've got big Agra and big you know. 937 00:39:50,240 --> 00:39:51,840 I mean, you know, why do we have Roundup here? 938 00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:53,960 I mean, Roundup is a is a herbicide that makes all our 939 00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:56,600 bread somewhat poisoned. You know, Roundup is banned in 940 00:39:56,600 --> 00:39:59,480 Europe, but Monsanto's got so much power in the United States 941 00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:01,200 that Roundup has not been banned here. 942 00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:02,600 I mean This is why I have so much help for. 943 00:40:02,760 --> 00:40:06,440 For RFK Junior and his ability to, I mean, we were 944 00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:08,080 propagandized. I mean, we were told we should 945 00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:09,720 eat margarine, not butter. That's wrong. 946 00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:13,000 I mean, Ansel Keys was a person at Harvard that basically was 947 00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:14,440 paid by the food companies to lie. 948 00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:16,560 We had this whole food pyramid. Just eat a bunch of carbs. 949 00:40:16,560 --> 00:40:18,160 No, you're not supposed to eat a bunch of meat. 950 00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:21,520 I mean, read anything about the Read the Carnivore Code, which I 951 00:40:21,520 --> 00:40:24,040 just read. I mean, humankinds, we evolved 952 00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:26,520 to be who we are because millions of years ago, one of 953 00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:28,760 our ancestors started figuring out how to cook and eat meat, 954 00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:31,440 and our brains got a lot bigger than chimpanzee brains. 955 00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:33,800 Yeah. And so we became humans and the 956 00:40:33,800 --> 00:40:36,320 human machine was meant to be fed meat, period. 957 00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:38,560 Absolutely. And but, you know, most people 958 00:40:38,560 --> 00:40:41,400 don't know that. And it's just been a lot of a 959 00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:44,760 lot of bad, bad behavior and bad thought patterns. 960 00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:47,960 I mean, you know, the healthcare system is just horribly broken. 961 00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:50,440 And when Obamacare tripled everyone's, you know, just 962 00:40:50,480 --> 00:40:53,200 everything in America has become, you know, a money grab 963 00:40:53,200 --> 00:40:55,920 and grift. Everything I had, my dog was 964 00:40:55,920 --> 00:40:58,160 sick recently. I took him to a vet clinic. 965 00:40:58,440 --> 00:41:01,240 The vet clinic was owned by a PE firm, you know, the PE firm. 966 00:41:01,240 --> 00:41:03,800 They, they convinced me that by doing a bunch of expensive shit, 967 00:41:03,800 --> 00:41:05,320 they could save the dog. The dog was toast. 968 00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:06,640 I mean, it was sad, but the dog was dead. 969 00:41:06,760 --> 00:41:08,440 He was going to die no matter what. 970 00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:10,480 I found that out later. But you know what, they managed 971 00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:12,400 to extract thousands and thousands of dollars out of me 972 00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:15,120 trying to keep the dog alive because we love the dog, right? 973 00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:17,800 I mean, I, you know, Susie Buddz is a big bitcoiner. 974 00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:19,680 She was in the medical or in the dental business. 975 00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:22,320 She said these dental practices are, they're getting bought up 976 00:41:22,320 --> 00:41:26,120 by PE firms and the PE firms are saying, hey, it's pretty easy to 977 00:41:26,120 --> 00:41:28,600 just nick that cavity a little bit and suddenly a cavity 978 00:41:28,600 --> 00:41:30,960 becomes a root canal and you make 3 times as much money. 979 00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:33,400 Why don't you guys do that? So, you know, advice to 980 00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:36,920 everybody listening, make sure your dentist is an independent, 981 00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:41,040 honest practitioner, not part of APE firm owned dental practice 982 00:41:41,240 --> 00:41:44,160 where they have an incentive to actually make you sicker so they 983 00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:45,920 can charge you more money. I mean, that's the kind of sick 984 00:41:45,920 --> 00:41:47,760 shit that's happening. Yeah, it's horrible. 985 00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:51,240 Yeah, it's absolutely horrible. It it, you know, and it reminds 986 00:41:51,240 --> 00:41:53,800 me of the, the whole architecture of Fiat. 987 00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:56,400 And something that I really appreciate about Bitcoin is 988 00:41:56,400 --> 00:41:59,480 Bitcoin is an aligned incentive structure system. 989 00:41:59,720 --> 00:42:02,840 So yes, you're holding Bitcoin. Michael Saylor's holding 990 00:42:02,840 --> 00:42:06,840 Bitcoin, I'm holding Bitcoin and we're all talking about, but 991 00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:09,000 we're all benefiting from Bitcoin going up. 992 00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:10,560 We're all. On the same team. 993 00:42:10,560 --> 00:42:15,680 And the pleb that's holding .01 BTC from a percentage basis? 994 00:42:15,680 --> 00:42:17,800 He's benefiting just as much as all. 995 00:42:17,800 --> 00:42:20,160 Of, you know, you're working for me, Michael Saylor's working for 996 00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:22,880 me, Jeff Booth and Lynn, they're all everybody, everybody in 997 00:42:22,880 --> 00:42:25,920 Bitcoin is working for everybody else in Bitcoin and there's and 998 00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:28,920 nobody has an unfair advantage because it's a mathematical 999 00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:31,640 protocol and it's fair. That's important. 1000 00:42:31,640 --> 00:42:34,160 It's fair. Nobody has an unfair advantage, 1001 00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:37,760 and it took a mathematical protocol and technology to 1002 00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:40,480 create a monetary system that was fair, and that's why it's 1003 00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:43,560 such a revolution. And that's why it's sound money, 1004 00:42:43,560 --> 00:42:45,080 exactly because it's. Fair. 1005 00:42:45,240 --> 00:42:47,680 Because it's fair, yes. And it doesn't matter if you're 1006 00:42:47,680 --> 00:42:51,680 the king, president ever. You cannot create more of it. 1007 00:42:51,720 --> 00:42:54,160 If you want to create more of it, you have to get in line. 1008 00:42:54,360 --> 00:42:57,000 Pay for the cost, mine it like everybody. 1009 00:42:57,000 --> 00:43:00,040 Else or provide a good or service that costs to somebody 1010 00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:02,480 else to sell you their Bitcoin for that good or service. 1011 00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:03,360 Yes. Gotcha. 1012 00:43:03,440 --> 00:43:05,160 OK. I have a bit of a rabbit hole 1013 00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:09,160 question for you, but I've I've spent a lot of time thinking 1014 00:43:09,160 --> 00:43:13,640 about this and a lot of modern day politics are based on this 1015 00:43:13,640 --> 00:43:16,800 idea of equality. Yes, I think in Mother Nature, 1016 00:43:16,800 --> 00:43:19,280 equality is just people are not equal, right? 1017 00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:21,400 There's things, there's things that you're good at. 1018 00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:22,640 There's things that I'm good at, right? 1019 00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:24,280 And. Well, we all have God-given 1020 00:43:24,280 --> 00:43:26,280 gifts and and and limitations, yes, correct. 1021 00:43:26,440 --> 00:43:28,440 Right, Some people could play basketball, some people can't 1022 00:43:28,440 --> 00:43:33,400 play basketball. But the A lot of modern politics 1023 00:43:33,400 --> 00:43:36,880 is based on this idea of equality and the the way that 1024 00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:40,480 they reach equality is via wealth redistribution, right? 1025 00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:43,240 There's two mechanisms. There's direct taxation, there's 1026 00:43:43,240 --> 00:43:46,200 only so much you could do there. And then there is taxation via 1027 00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:48,560 currency debasement. Right now the rabbit hole 1028 00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:52,000 question that I have for you is does the modern left need the 1029 00:43:52,000 --> 00:43:54,840 money printer to be a viable political philosophy? 1030 00:43:54,920 --> 00:43:56,640 I think they do. I think they absolutely do 1031 00:43:56,640 --> 00:43:59,760 because they buy votes effectively, they buy votes and 1032 00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:02,640 and I think it's very important that that there are people who 1033 00:44:02,640 --> 00:44:06,120 strive for economic equality and there will never be total 1034 00:44:06,240 --> 00:44:08,440 economic equality. As you point out, some people 1035 00:44:08,440 --> 00:44:10,520 are more gifted. They they earn, they, they 1036 00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:13,480 contribute more, they earn more. But what you can, what you can 1037 00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:16,600 get in my belief in an economic system is you can get economic 1038 00:44:16,600 --> 00:44:19,880 fairness where the, the playing field is level. 1039 00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:23,040 The referee is fair. The referee is not saying, Oh 1040 00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:25,120 yeah, you're Bill Ackman. When your bank fails, we'll bail 1041 00:44:25,120 --> 00:44:27,760 you out and cover your ass. Oh yeah, you're, you know, 1042 00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:30,120 you're Joe, you know, lunch bucket, you know, working, 1043 00:44:30,280 --> 00:44:32,880 working, average American. Sorry, tough shit for you. 1044 00:44:33,080 --> 00:44:35,040 You know, you get over leveraged in the housing bubble that we 1045 00:44:35,040 --> 00:44:36,480 blew. You can't make the payments. 1046 00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:38,040 We're taking your house. You know we're going to 1047 00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:39,360 Blackrock's going to own it, right. 1048 00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:42,800 So, you know, it's a fair system that we're going after. 1049 00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:44,680 Not an equal system. Not an equal system. 1050 00:44:44,680 --> 00:44:47,200 But I think I think most people understand that because they 1051 00:44:47,280 --> 00:44:49,040 they recognize it. Give me a fair game. 1052 00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:50,960 I'll play. I'll play as hard as I can. 1053 00:44:51,040 --> 00:44:53,800 If somebody wants, if somebody wants something for nothing, 1054 00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:55,040 that's like saying they want to steal. 1055 00:44:55,040 --> 00:44:56,440 Yeah, they want somebody else's labor. 1056 00:44:56,440 --> 00:44:58,520 And that's not fair. Yeah, by definition. 1057 00:44:58,600 --> 00:45:01,720 And, and I think also when you say fairness, that includes 1058 00:45:01,720 --> 00:45:03,320 social mobility, what they think. 1059 00:45:03,600 --> 00:45:04,880 Absolutely. Absolutely. 1060 00:45:04,880 --> 00:45:06,120 All the way across. Yeah. 1061 00:45:06,200 --> 00:45:08,280 There's no, there's no. I mean, that was that was what 1062 00:45:08,280 --> 00:45:09,720 the American Revolution was thought about. 1063 00:45:09,720 --> 00:45:11,080 That there is no royalty. Yeah. 1064 00:45:11,080 --> 00:45:14,320 You know that we're all, you know, we are created equal, 1065 00:45:14,320 --> 00:45:17,000 endowed with, you know, unable rights, a life, liberty and our 1066 00:45:17,000 --> 00:45:18,960 pursuit of happiness. I mean, that's some of the 1067 00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:20,960 greatest words ever written. And that's the that's the 1068 00:45:20,960 --> 00:45:22,880 premise of Americans. What made America great. 1069 00:45:22,880 --> 00:45:25,280 And America still is great. But we've slipped from that. 1070 00:45:25,320 --> 00:45:26,800 Yeah. We've let this, we've let this 1071 00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:29,040 disease get into our monetary system. 1072 00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:31,120 And man, oh, man. I mean, it's really, it's like 1073 00:45:31,120 --> 00:45:33,240 cancer. I mean, as as Ron Paul says, you 1074 00:45:33,240 --> 00:45:35,160 know, what do you. I mean, if we if we end the Fed, 1075 00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:36,360 what are you going to replace it with? 1076 00:45:36,360 --> 00:45:38,920 And he says, well, if you cut on a cancer, what do you replace it 1077 00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:39,920 with? The answer is nothing. 1078 00:45:39,920 --> 00:45:44,080 You know, sound money. Need liquidity without having to 1079 00:45:44,080 --> 00:45:47,200 sell your Bitcoin? For more than six years now, 1080 00:45:47,200 --> 00:45:51,200 Leaden has been the trusted choice for Bitcoin backed 1081 00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:55,720 lending with transparency, security and trust at their 1082 00:45:55,720 --> 00:45:58,400 core. I absolutely love these guys and 1083 00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:01,840 I personally have not only an account with them but also 1084 00:46:01,840 --> 00:46:03,680 alone. And some of the key features 1085 00:46:03,680 --> 00:46:06,760 that I love about Leaden is the fact that there are no monthly 1086 00:46:06,760 --> 00:46:09,800 payments. You pay at the end of the term. 1087 00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:14,720 You also have the ability to roll over the loan as well and 1088 00:46:14,720 --> 00:46:17,640 you can pay it back whenever you want. 1089 00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:21,320 Essentially what they do is that they help their clients unlock 1090 00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:24,880 the liquidity of their BTC, allowing you to huddle while 1091 00:46:24,880 --> 00:46:27,640 still accessing the wealth of your Bitcoin. 1092 00:46:27,680 --> 00:46:31,680 They've been battle tested with their focus on transparency, 1093 00:46:31,680 --> 00:46:35,640 security and trust, allowing them to build a proven track 1094 00:46:35,640 --> 00:46:39,960 record of client success and security, helping 10s of 1095 00:46:39,960 --> 00:46:43,480 thousands of clients harness the value of their digital assets 1096 00:46:43,600 --> 00:46:45,880 with confidence and Peace of Mind. 1097 00:46:46,120 --> 00:46:50,000 Learn more about what your BTC can do for you. 1098 00:46:50,320 --> 00:46:54,240 Check out leaden dot IO today. Larry, you're a very successful 1099 00:46:54,240 --> 00:46:56,800 guy. You've I've got ups and downs. 1100 00:46:56,840 --> 00:46:59,880 You've, you have very impressive, you know, 1101 00:46:59,880 --> 00:47:01,360 credentials. Well, I went to you. 1102 00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:02,640 I went to good school. She went. 1103 00:47:02,640 --> 00:47:04,120 To Harvard, I believe. Yeah, Harvard. 1104 00:47:04,120 --> 00:47:07,120 Good school. What motivates you to write this 1105 00:47:07,120 --> 00:47:09,360 book? At 67 years old? 1106 00:47:09,560 --> 00:47:11,880 You know you've you've succeeded in life. 1107 00:47:11,920 --> 00:47:14,680 You've travelled the world. You're going to the biggest 1108 00:47:14,680 --> 00:47:18,360 Bitcoin conferences, you're going to Michael Saylor's 100K 1109 00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:20,120 party. You know you're talking to the 1110 00:47:20,360 --> 00:47:23,120 brightest minds in the world. What motivates you? 1111 00:47:23,760 --> 00:47:26,040 My grandmother's voice in the back of my head. 1112 00:47:26,280 --> 00:47:28,440 That's very powerful. What do you could you elaborate 1113 00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:30,680 a little bit on that? Just say and do what's right. 1114 00:47:31,000 --> 00:47:35,120 OK. You know, just the, the just 1115 00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:36,520 saying give back and do what's right. 1116 00:47:38,640 --> 00:47:40,080 You know, she was deeply religious. 1117 00:47:40,120 --> 00:47:45,800 And, you know, I've been given these gifts, you know, the 1118 00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:48,400 education, the intelligence, growing up in a middle class, 1119 00:47:48,400 --> 00:47:52,440 upper middle class family. And, you know, I've seen how 1120 00:47:52,440 --> 00:47:54,720 broken this is, and I've seen people hurting from it. 1121 00:47:55,320 --> 00:47:58,400 And I thought, you know, someday I'll be dead. 1122 00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:01,960 I want my kids and my grandkids to say, hey, that guy did it 1123 00:48:01,960 --> 00:48:04,680 right. That's very powerful. 1124 00:48:06,480 --> 00:48:10,800 Wow. Take a moment here. 1125 00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:13,520 Sorry about that. Generally get emotional, but you 1126 00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:14,720 kind of you kind of hit a hot button. 1127 00:48:14,720 --> 00:48:21,520 For me, yeah, it's wow. So let's let's talk a little bit 1128 00:48:21,520 --> 00:48:24,120 about the middle class upbringing because I think 1129 00:48:24,160 --> 00:48:26,840 that's something that has completely been gutted because 1130 00:48:27,200 --> 00:48:30,160 of of this of essentially the Fiat system. 1131 00:48:30,680 --> 00:48:32,720 How will Bitcoin bring that back? 1132 00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:36,760 Well, you know, it provides, it'll create fairness across the 1133 00:48:36,760 --> 00:48:38,680 board. People won't have to worry about 1134 00:48:38,680 --> 00:48:40,400 money. People will be able to retire 1135 00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:42,360 again. People, it's just going to be a 1136 00:48:42,360 --> 00:48:44,360 fair world. It's going to be a better world. 1137 00:48:44,360 --> 00:48:46,320 We're all going to benefit from this technology. 1138 00:48:46,320 --> 00:48:48,360 There's so many great things happening in the world, Nico. 1139 00:48:48,440 --> 00:48:50,040 I mean, think about what technology has done. 1140 00:48:50,040 --> 00:48:52,520 I mean, imagine, think about all the benefits we've had. 1141 00:48:52,520 --> 00:48:54,680 Think about how TV's and you know, I was saying earlier 1142 00:48:54,680 --> 00:48:57,280 today, I remember being in college as a freshman and long 1143 00:48:57,280 --> 00:48:59,760 distance calls were expensive. So I got to talk to my parents 1144 00:48:59,760 --> 00:49:02,840 once every week for 5 minutes because, you know, that was all 1145 00:49:02,840 --> 00:49:04,800 I wanted to spend on long distance phone calls. 1146 00:49:04,840 --> 00:49:07,080 Local phone calls are effectively free anywhere in the 1147 00:49:07,080 --> 00:49:08,480 world, right? This is the benefit of 1148 00:49:08,480 --> 00:49:10,640 technology that's coming to all of us. 1149 00:49:10,680 --> 00:49:13,840 So all of our lives are going to get much better as a result of 1150 00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:16,280 the technical innovations that we're seeing right now. 1151 00:49:16,280 --> 00:49:19,720 OK, but to make sure they're fairly distributed, we got to 1152 00:49:19,720 --> 00:49:22,000 have a fair system or else the guys at the top are going to 1153 00:49:22,000 --> 00:49:25,240 keep raking off. Yeah, you know, all, all all of 1154 00:49:25,240 --> 00:49:28,920 their peace and benefiting at the expense of the rest of us. 1155 00:49:28,920 --> 00:49:30,440 And that's what's going on. Absolutely. 1156 00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:32,640 So I mean, I know, and I think you feel this way too. 1157 00:49:32,640 --> 00:49:34,800 And if we talk, if you talk to Bitcoiners, I mean, I'm so 1158 00:49:34,800 --> 00:49:37,280 hopeful and so optimistic and and so positive. 1159 00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:39,680 I mean, I, you know, like I watched my dad retire with some 1160 00:49:39,680 --> 00:49:42,480 money, not a lot, some money. By the time he passed, he was 1161 00:49:42,480 --> 00:49:45,720 down, you know, in a little, it's purchasing power was gone. 1162 00:49:45,720 --> 00:49:48,120 I mean, I have 80 year old friends, 70 and 80, three-year 1163 00:49:48,120 --> 00:49:49,560 old friends who are still doing work. 1164 00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:51,360 They have money. They have their houses paid for 1165 00:49:51,360 --> 00:49:53,160 and they have savings. And they're like, well, I don't 1166 00:49:53,160 --> 00:49:55,280 know how long I'm going to live and I might run out of money 1167 00:49:55,320 --> 00:49:58,680 given how, you know, inflation is eating me up, right. 1168 00:49:58,760 --> 00:50:01,680 So you can't really retire in this system safely, you know 1169 00:50:01,680 --> 00:50:02,560 what I mean? Yeah. 1170 00:50:02,560 --> 00:50:05,640 I mean, just having that, just knowing that your purchasing 1171 00:50:05,640 --> 00:50:08,960 power was going to be preserved, it's a very powerful thing. 1172 00:50:08,960 --> 00:50:12,720 Do you think, Larry, did you think that because you've 1173 00:50:12,720 --> 00:50:15,400 identified one of the things that I appreciate about the gold 1174 00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:18,600 bugs, right and the whole gold movement is that you guys really 1175 00:50:18,600 --> 00:50:21,120 started this the whole. Idea sound pretty? 1176 00:50:21,200 --> 00:50:23,360 Yeah. And you guys really identified 1177 00:50:23,360 --> 00:50:27,560 the problems very accurately. Where do you think gold came up 1178 00:50:27,560 --> 00:50:30,000 short? So politically, they figured out 1179 00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:34,360 how to neuter it, I mean. How did they do that exactly? 1180 00:50:34,360 --> 00:50:38,760 Well, paper gold going off the gold standard fractional reserve 1181 00:50:38,760 --> 00:50:40,960 banking. I mean, it's, it's a long litany 1182 00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:42,240 of tales. A lot of it's laid out in the 1183 00:50:42,240 --> 00:50:44,480 book, though, so you'll get a picture of how they did it, but 1184 00:50:44,480 --> 00:50:46,040 gold failed. I mean, it was, it's hard to 1185 00:50:46,040 --> 00:50:48,680 verify, it's hard to transfer. It's heavy. 1186 00:50:48,720 --> 00:50:51,840 You can, you know, you can, you can cover tungsten and gold. 1187 00:50:51,840 --> 00:50:53,600 I mean, they've been fake out, fake gold bars. 1188 00:50:53,720 --> 00:50:56,600 It just, it just didn't work. And we moved to a system of 1189 00:50:56,600 --> 00:50:59,920 ledgers and credits and we moved to a, you know, a fractional 1190 00:50:59,920 --> 00:51:02,400 reserve banking system that basically allowed the banks to 1191 00:51:02,400 --> 00:51:05,360 create money at will. And So what happened is they got 1192 00:51:05,360 --> 00:51:09,640 way ahead of the gold supply, and the money effectively became 1193 00:51:09,640 --> 00:51:11,520 unsound. Now, Lynn would argue that had 1194 00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:14,200 to happen at an engineering level no matter what, and she 1195 00:51:14,200 --> 00:51:16,040 may be right. I would argue that there were 1196 00:51:16,040 --> 00:51:19,520 places where politics intervened and shoved it ahead, the biggest 1197 00:51:19,520 --> 00:51:21,600 one being 71. I mean, Nixon had it. 1198 00:51:21,600 --> 00:51:23,480 I mean, a lot of people say, well, Nixon had to do what he 1199 00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:26,400 did, and that's not true. Nixon could have let the gold 1200 00:51:26,400 --> 00:51:27,960 price float. We would have had gold as a 1201 00:51:27,960 --> 00:51:30,800 neutral reserve currency and we would not have had the inflation 1202 00:51:30,800 --> 00:51:33,360 that we've now had. We would not, you know, things 1203 00:51:33,440 --> 00:51:35,880 we could have maintained glass Steagall as an example. 1204 00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:38,320 And the and the banks wouldn't have been able to pull off 2008 1205 00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:39,280 the way they did. Yeah. 1206 00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:41,200 I mean, so there were there was there were two pieces to it. 1207 00:51:41,200 --> 00:51:43,840 There was politics and then there was some of this, the tech 1208 00:51:43,840 --> 00:51:46,640 development of technology that kind of left gold in the dust. 1209 00:51:46,680 --> 00:51:48,800 I mean, you know, once the Telegraph got developed, I mean, 1210 00:51:48,800 --> 00:51:50,800 before that gold was shipped overseas. 1211 00:51:50,800 --> 00:51:52,880 I mean, the the Pony Express originally, you know, I mean, 1212 00:51:53,120 --> 00:51:55,120 you know, watch Porch Cassidy. I mean, they were blowing up the 1213 00:51:55,120 --> 00:51:57,200 trains that carried the gold with the payroll, you know what 1214 00:51:57,200 --> 00:51:58,880 I mean? I mean, gold was money and you 1215 00:51:58,880 --> 00:52:01,120 had to move it around to make for final settlement. 1216 00:52:01,120 --> 00:52:03,040 Well, you had a Telegraph and suddenly you could start keeping 1217 00:52:03,040 --> 00:52:05,520 a Ledger. So a lot of reasons gold failed, 1218 00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:09,400 but but it did fail and it the failure accelerated a lot with 1219 00:52:09,400 --> 00:52:13,320 the futures and with actually with Bill Clinton and Ruben and 1220 00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:15,400 and Larry Summers. There was an article called 1221 00:52:15,720 --> 00:52:19,240 paper that Summers Povis called something's paradox, Gibson's 1222 00:52:19,240 --> 00:52:21,360 paradox. So in order to get reelected, 1223 00:52:21,360 --> 00:52:24,720 Clinton figured out that if they could mask the price of gold 1224 00:52:24,720 --> 00:52:27,640 going up, they could create inflation and not have it look 1225 00:52:27,640 --> 00:52:29,720 inflationary. The bond vigilantes wouldn't 1226 00:52:29,720 --> 00:52:32,240 know what was going on. And so Ruben, who was an gold 1227 00:52:32,240 --> 00:52:35,600 trader at Goldman Sachs, figured out how to create a lot of paper 1228 00:52:35,600 --> 00:52:38,520 gold. And so, you know, right now and 1229 00:52:38,520 --> 00:52:41,000 what's going on as we speak is that the LBMA is having trouble 1230 00:52:41,000 --> 00:52:43,960 making deliveries, which would maybe argue that we're close to 1231 00:52:43,960 --> 00:52:46,200 the point at which the LBMA blows up. 1232 00:52:46,200 --> 00:52:49,240 And and that's because those of us in the gold camp know this 1233 00:52:49,280 --> 00:52:52,960 there we believe there are as many as 100 claims, paper claims 1234 00:52:52,960 --> 00:52:55,440 for an ounce of gold for every oz that will exist, right? 1235 00:52:55,800 --> 00:52:57,760 So think about that. That's a game of musical chairs 1236 00:52:57,760 --> 00:53:00,120 where if everyone with a paper claim came and said, hey, I'll, 1237 00:53:00,360 --> 00:53:01,960 I'll take it. Give me the I'll take. 1238 00:53:02,040 --> 00:53:03,480 Take the oz, please. Thank you very much. 1239 00:53:03,480 --> 00:53:06,280 The Oz wouldn't be there. It's not a division but a bank 1240 00:53:06,280 --> 00:53:06,920 run. It's a gold. 1241 00:53:06,920 --> 00:53:07,680 Run. It's a gold run. 1242 00:53:07,800 --> 00:53:09,760 Yeah. And, and, and, and just to give 1243 00:53:09,760 --> 00:53:11,800 you a sense of how much Fiat we've created, there's another 1244 00:53:11,800 --> 00:53:13,920 good chart in the book done by my friend Brent Santiago. 1245 00:53:13,920 --> 00:53:16,520 Really great chart. So there's a time in the 70s 1246 00:53:16,680 --> 00:53:18,360 when you could actually take the US money supply and you could 1247 00:53:18,360 --> 00:53:20,800 divide it by the 261 million ounces of gold that we 1248 00:53:20,800 --> 00:53:23,000 theoretically own. And you came up with a $35 1249 00:53:23,000 --> 00:53:24,600 reference price. That was true back then. 1250 00:53:24,800 --> 00:53:26,800 If you did that same calculation, I've said this many 1251 00:53:26,800 --> 00:53:29,080 times, you did that same calculation today, took all of 1252 00:53:29,080 --> 00:53:31,480 the the money supply outstanding that they divide it by those 1253 00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:33,880 200, it would need to be at $89,000 an ounce. 1254 00:53:33,920 --> 00:53:37,160 OK, gold's at 2900 right now. So it's a long ways away. 1255 00:53:37,520 --> 00:53:40,120 The point there is we've created a lot of paper gold. 1256 00:53:40,120 --> 00:53:42,000 Absolutely. And it's also it's physical 1257 00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:45,120 characteristics make it very difficult for you to withdraw. 1258 00:53:45,280 --> 00:53:46,760 It's hard. I mean, yeah, you and I don't 1259 00:53:46,760 --> 00:53:48,760 trade in gold anymore. I mean, it's, you know, it's 1260 00:53:48,760 --> 00:53:51,120 pretty and it'll I do, I do. I have to. 1261 00:53:51,120 --> 00:53:54,080 I have to admit though, and I'm a millennial, I do own gold 1262 00:53:54,080 --> 00:53:55,160 bars. Good for you. 1263 00:53:55,160 --> 00:53:56,840 And they feel really good in your way. 1264 00:53:57,080 --> 00:53:59,200 Attavoy, you know, I got a bunch of coins and I got a bunch of 1265 00:53:59,200 --> 00:54:00,920 silver coins. Silver has a lot of utility. 1266 00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:03,200 It's, it's, it's stock to flow sucks and it hasn't gone up as 1267 00:54:03,200 --> 00:54:04,680 much as gold and it's being demonetized. 1268 00:54:04,680 --> 00:54:07,720 But I tell you, we're silver in a, in a mandible scenario, 1269 00:54:07,840 --> 00:54:10,360 silver would be very valuable because most people know what a 1270 00:54:10,360 --> 00:54:12,840 wild silver coin is worth. It's 30 bucks. 1271 00:54:12,840 --> 00:54:15,840 And so, you know, there's a couple of chickens or some eggs 1272 00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:18,240 or maybe a, maybe a tank of gasoline or whatever. 1273 00:54:18,240 --> 00:54:20,160 I mean, if the credit cards aren't working, I'm guessing 1274 00:54:20,160 --> 00:54:22,400 they'll be people who, you know, farmers and others who will say, 1275 00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:25,760 yeah, you can pay me in silver. Absolutely, 100%. 1276 00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:29,200 Does Bitcoin replace gold? Do you see it reaching the 1277 00:54:29,200 --> 00:54:31,080 market cap of gold? Do you see it reaching the 1278 00:54:31,080 --> 00:54:32,680 market cap of gold? Very, very quickly. 1279 00:54:32,800 --> 00:54:34,480 Yeah, I do. I mean, it's, it's actually 1280 00:54:34,480 --> 00:54:36,000 arguably a lot closer than people think. 1281 00:54:36,000 --> 00:54:38,520 So the market cap of gold right now is about $18 billion. 1282 00:54:38,520 --> 00:54:40,880 The market cap of bitcoins about two, I'm sorry, trillion 1283 00:54:40,880 --> 00:54:42,080 dollars. My my market cap. 1284 00:54:42,080 --> 00:54:43,960 Bitcoin, as we know is about 2 trillion round numbers. 1285 00:54:43,960 --> 00:54:47,400 But if you think about 18 trillion of gold, really only 1286 00:54:47,400 --> 00:54:51,560 about 1/4 to 1/3 of it is in bars and coins that you and I 1287 00:54:51,560 --> 00:54:54,280 can buy. So about 1/4 of it's in antiques 1288 00:54:54,280 --> 00:54:56,960 and in museums and antiquities. So you know, we're not going to 1289 00:54:56,960 --> 00:54:58,920 go meltdown the gold in the British Museum, right? 1290 00:54:58,920 --> 00:55:01,960 It's staying there, about 1/4 of it sitting in central bank. 1291 00:55:02,040 --> 00:55:03,720 Thanks. Actually a little less than 1/4. 1292 00:55:03,760 --> 00:55:07,400 And then the balance is around women's necks in really well in 1293 00:55:07,400 --> 00:55:09,120 India and China. And here it's jewelry. 1294 00:55:09,120 --> 00:55:10,960 And by the way, if it gets high enough, I mean, you're going to 1295 00:55:10,960 --> 00:55:13,280 see women, you know, turning, selling their gold jewelry, I 1296 00:55:13,280 --> 00:55:15,440 mean, $89,000 an ounce. So I'm guessing there's some 1297 00:55:15,440 --> 00:55:16,720 bracelets that will get turned in. 1298 00:55:18,520 --> 00:55:20,440 Absolutely. But but so my point is that to 1299 00:55:20,440 --> 00:55:24,080 flip gold, you know, let's say the investable gold is 4 to 6 1300 00:55:24,080 --> 00:55:26,600 trillion and the investable Bitcoin right now is, you know, 1301 00:55:26,600 --> 00:55:29,640 2 trillion, maybe 3X from here. And Bitcoin is kind of flipping 1302 00:55:29,640 --> 00:55:31,960 the investable gold, right? Interesting numbers. 1303 00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:33,920 Absolutely. At the time of recording, the 1304 00:55:33,920 --> 00:55:37,040 Bitcoin price is roughly 100. Ki think a lot of people were 1305 00:55:37,040 --> 00:55:39,600 anticipating it for it to be a lot higher by now. 1306 00:55:40,440 --> 00:55:43,280 People are talking about diminishing returns, they're 1307 00:55:43,280 --> 00:55:45,240 saying the cycles. What are your thoughts on that? 1308 00:55:45,320 --> 00:55:48,200 Yeah, so look, it's doing just what it should be doing. 1309 00:55:48,200 --> 00:55:50,240 It's just marching up relentlessly. 1310 00:55:50,240 --> 00:55:54,040 The the drawbacks are slow. You know, we were at the 58 K 1311 00:55:54,040 --> 00:55:55,720 club for a while. We went to 100. 1312 00:55:55,840 --> 00:55:58,240 It's a nice move of, you know, 42 grand. 1313 00:55:59,080 --> 00:56:01,960 We're now building up what in technical, technical investing 1314 00:56:01,960 --> 00:56:05,600 analysis, they call a flag between kind of 90 and 106, you 1315 00:56:05,600 --> 00:56:07,600 know, OK, let's add another 42 to that. 1316 00:56:07,600 --> 00:56:10,760 I think the next stop is at 140. I mean, to me, these these, you 1317 00:56:10,760 --> 00:56:14,400 know, these flags with moves, this is very good, healthy 1318 00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:17,920 constructive development. When we go from, let's call it 1319 00:56:17,920 --> 00:56:21,440 1:40 to 2:50 really fast, which might happen. 1320 00:56:21,600 --> 00:56:23,520 My sense is it's going to be ahead of itself. 1321 00:56:23,680 --> 00:56:26,920 And that's when you might you know, I mean, I and I look, I 1322 00:56:26,920 --> 00:56:28,480 don't know what the top of the cycle is. 1323 00:56:28,480 --> 00:56:30,520 I mean, I look at a a lot of things, including the power law 1324 00:56:30,520 --> 00:56:33,960 and historical cycles and how far it comes off the base feels 1325 00:56:33,960 --> 00:56:36,640 to me like the top of the cycles between 2 and 300 and then we'll 1326 00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:38,640 have a pullback. But I think the pullbacks are 1327 00:56:38,640 --> 00:56:40,600 getting smaller. And I think at some point this 1328 00:56:40,600 --> 00:56:42,720 power law models going to break to the upside. 1329 00:56:42,720 --> 00:56:44,800 And we're just going to, we're not going to have pullbacks 1330 00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:47,800 because at that point, this is Parker Lewis's, you know, the 1331 00:56:47,800 --> 00:56:50,920 gradually and then suddenly, I mean, the suddenly phase sailor 1332 00:56:50,920 --> 00:56:53,280 made this point when I was on stage with him in Madeira and he 1333 00:56:53,280 --> 00:56:54,560 said, look, I can see what's going to happen. 1334 00:56:54,560 --> 00:56:55,960 You know, we're going to go to 300. 1335 00:56:55,960 --> 00:56:58,360 A lot of people think, holy shit, this has been amazing. 1336 00:56:58,480 --> 00:57:00,440 I'm selling now, I'm getting that's going to be a mistake. 1337 00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:02,080 You know, it's going to go to 700 and a million. 1338 00:57:02,080 --> 00:57:03,680 They're going to be and they're not going to get back, be able 1339 00:57:03,680 --> 00:57:04,440 to get back in. Yeah. 1340 00:57:04,440 --> 00:57:06,400 So they're not going to be. Able to get the same amount of 1341 00:57:06,400 --> 00:57:08,800 coins. No, I mean, I think in general, 1342 00:57:08,800 --> 00:57:11,120 generally speaking, my view is you sell coins, don't count on 1343 00:57:11,120 --> 00:57:14,120 getting them back. Yeah, this cycle hasn't really 1344 00:57:14,120 --> 00:57:16,440 start. The bull part of this cycle has 1345 00:57:16,440 --> 00:57:19,880 started, but the euphoria phase of this cycle hasn't started 1346 00:57:19,880 --> 00:57:20,080 yet. I. 1347 00:57:20,120 --> 00:57:21,720 Completely agree. I completely agree. 1348 00:57:21,720 --> 00:57:24,240 And I think it comes, frankly, I think it comes in the next year. 1349 00:57:24,240 --> 00:57:26,960 I think between what are we talking now, it's February. 1350 00:57:26,960 --> 00:57:29,280 I think between now and February, March and next, next 1351 00:57:29,280 --> 00:57:30,520 year, they're gonna be fireworks. 1352 00:57:30,520 --> 00:57:33,200 Yeah, real fireworks. I completely agree. 1353 00:57:33,400 --> 00:57:36,480 Now I have a question from you and I'm gonna pose as a Henzian 1354 00:57:36,480 --> 00:57:39,960 economist. If there isn't inflation, won't 1355 00:57:39,960 --> 00:57:43,000 people just hoard money? Yeah, that's bullshit and I deal 1356 00:57:43,000 --> 00:57:45,120 with it in the book. I mean, I mean, do you not eat? 1357 00:57:45,120 --> 00:57:47,880 Because there's. I mean, if you think steak's 1358 00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:50,320 gonna be future cheaper in the future, you can stop eating 1359 00:57:50,320 --> 00:57:52,760 waiting for, you know. OK, We all know your TV. 1360 00:57:52,760 --> 00:57:54,840 Five years when I'll be cheaper than TV today you're gonna stop 1361 00:57:54,840 --> 00:57:56,240 buying TV's. No, You wanna watch football 1362 00:57:56,240 --> 00:57:58,200 today you're gonna buy one. It's all just horse shit. 1363 00:57:58,320 --> 00:58:02,720 I mean, you might stop buying frivolous shit, you might stop 1364 00:58:02,720 --> 00:58:05,080 wasting your money on gambling and doing other things to try 1365 00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:08,120 and beat inflation, but humans have needs and you're going to 1366 00:58:08,120 --> 00:58:10,040 pay good value for things you need. 1367 00:58:10,120 --> 00:58:13,200 And so the notion, you know, this, this idea of a savings 1368 00:58:13,200 --> 00:58:15,920 glut and this is all just Keynes, this is all just to 1369 00:58:15,920 --> 00:58:17,320 support. There's just, it's a lie. 1370 00:58:17,480 --> 00:58:20,000 It's just a total lie. Deflation is good. 1371 00:58:20,160 --> 00:58:23,680 Deflation means that you can buy more with less dollars. 1372 00:58:23,760 --> 00:58:27,440 I mean, look at the people from 1870 to 1913. 1373 00:58:27,520 --> 00:58:31,000 Their lives improved in incredibly, incredibly. 1374 00:58:31,000 --> 00:58:34,240 I mean, they went from, you know outhouses to indoor plumbing. 1375 00:58:34,240 --> 00:58:36,440 They had no electricity. A lot of them by, you know, the 1376 00:58:36,440 --> 00:58:38,280 20s and 30s, they had electricity. 1377 00:58:38,360 --> 00:58:39,760 You know, they were eating better food. 1378 00:58:39,760 --> 00:58:41,840 They, you know, Sears Roebuck came out with a catalogue. 1379 00:58:41,840 --> 00:58:43,320 They could buy high quality goods. 1380 00:58:43,320 --> 00:58:45,120 I mean all of it. And during that time frame, 1381 00:58:45,120 --> 00:58:48,400 prices were falling and, and, but GDP and output, I mean, the 1382 00:58:48,400 --> 00:58:51,960 whole idea of measuring output by GDP growth and then, you 1383 00:58:51,960 --> 00:58:53,920 know, and then having that somehow we've got to get to a 1384 00:58:53,920 --> 00:58:56,520 measure of output that's based on units, not on dollars. 1385 00:58:56,520 --> 00:58:58,600 Because you know, if you're understating inflation and you 1386 00:58:58,600 --> 00:59:02,440 say you got three 3% GDP growth, but you've got 5%, you really 1387 00:59:02,440 --> 00:59:04,960 have 5% inflation. Well, in fact, you're actually 1388 00:59:04,960 --> 00:59:07,680 in a recession. It's not like the, the dollar 1389 00:59:07,680 --> 00:59:09,000 value of cars that we're selling. 1390 00:59:09,000 --> 00:59:10,520 It's how many cars are we selling? 1391 00:59:10,640 --> 00:59:12,000 You know, it's the number of units. 1392 00:59:12,160 --> 00:59:15,240 So unit growth is what suggests that an economy is is 1393 00:59:15,240 --> 00:59:17,320 benefiting, not not dollar value growth. 1394 00:59:17,800 --> 00:59:20,920 Do you think, do you? And then my next question which 1395 00:59:20,920 --> 00:59:23,560 you partly answered, which is can money exist without 1396 00:59:23,560 --> 00:59:25,320 inflation? Of course it can. 1397 00:59:25,400 --> 00:59:26,960 Of course, of course, again, it has. 1398 00:59:27,080 --> 00:59:29,360 I mean to a degree, I mean gold always had a certain amount of 1399 00:59:29,360 --> 00:59:31,680 inflation, but absolutely abso frigging lutely. 1400 00:59:31,680 --> 00:59:33,560 Anyone who says it can't is just is wrong. 1401 00:59:33,560 --> 00:59:35,960 How will how will people deal with wages, for example? 1402 00:59:36,120 --> 00:59:39,320 Well, I mean, wages will get set in the marketplace. 1403 00:59:39,480 --> 00:59:42,880 The fact that your wage doesn't go up will be OK because you'll 1404 00:59:42,880 --> 00:59:45,480 have the same wage, but it'll buy more in the future and, and 1405 00:59:45,480 --> 00:59:47,520 you'll look forward to that. And it will, it will, it will 1406 00:59:47,520 --> 00:59:49,160 shift everyone's time preference. 1407 00:59:49,160 --> 00:59:50,920 You know you will. You will start thinking about 1408 00:59:51,120 --> 00:59:54,320 how do I buy things that last and how do I save for the 1409 00:59:54,320 --> 00:59:57,000 future, and how you know you'll know that you have an 1410 00:59:57,000 --> 01:00:01,040 alternative and a reward for being patient and for not for 1411 01:00:01,040 --> 01:00:03,280 not wasting money on stupid shit. 1412 01:00:03,560 --> 01:00:05,080 Yeah, I mean, you know what I mean. 1413 01:00:05,560 --> 01:00:06,480 It's. A total mind. 1414 01:00:06,480 --> 01:00:07,560 Shift. It's a total mind shift. 1415 01:00:07,560 --> 01:00:10,520 I mean, I mean, Kane has a nice quote in the book where he says, 1416 01:00:10,640 --> 01:00:14,680 you know, somewhere we shifted from valuing honesty and hard 1417 01:00:14,680 --> 01:00:17,600 work to valuing consumption and consumerism. 1418 01:00:17,920 --> 01:00:21,640 You know, I mean, I can see if I can foresee a time where owning 1419 01:00:21,640 --> 01:00:26,000 a really snazzy car would just become, you know, viewed as 1420 01:00:26,000 --> 01:00:27,560 being. It's just like a person's 1421 01:00:27,560 --> 01:00:29,440 stupid. Why would they ever do that? 1422 01:00:29,440 --> 01:00:31,800 You don't need that. It doesn't benefit them. 1423 01:00:31,800 --> 01:00:33,440 Do you know what I mean? Yeah, absolutely. 1424 01:00:33,480 --> 01:00:36,160 I mean, I think, I think you know, and you'll want to buy 1425 01:00:36,160 --> 01:00:38,560 things that last. You know, I mean, you see this 1426 01:00:38,560 --> 01:00:41,160 in Bitcoin culture. Yeah, we all live below our 1427 01:00:41,160 --> 01:00:42,840 means exactly. We spend. 1428 01:00:42,880 --> 01:00:45,320 We try to spend this. Little it affects everything. 1429 01:00:45,320 --> 01:00:47,240 It affects art. I mean look at the buildings 1430 01:00:47,240 --> 01:00:49,600 that were built pre war in America. 1431 01:00:49,640 --> 01:00:51,520 Yeah, it's still standing and they're beautiful. 1432 01:00:51,520 --> 01:00:53,000 Some of the architecture is beautiful. 1433 01:00:53,080 --> 01:00:54,960 Look at the buildings we're building today. 1434 01:00:55,040 --> 01:00:57,680 Yeah, they're deep, they're sloppy, they fall down. 1435 01:00:57,680 --> 01:00:59,000 They don't last. Yeah. 1436 01:00:59,040 --> 01:01:01,480 Do you know what I mean? Yeah, I mean it's just it just 1437 01:01:01,480 --> 01:01:05,320 change it'll change everything. It'll change the mindset to one 1438 01:01:05,320 --> 01:01:08,120 of thinking about the long term. I mean, one of the one of the 1439 01:01:08,120 --> 01:01:11,120 terrible things that Cain said was in the long term we're all 1440 01:01:11,120 --> 01:01:13,480 dead, which is kind of like a party on Garth. 1441 01:01:13,480 --> 01:01:16,200 What's you know Yeah, screw screw the seed corn, screw your 1442 01:01:16,200 --> 01:01:17,280 relatives. Yeah. 1443 01:01:17,280 --> 01:01:21,320 And, and in fact, you know, the right way society should work is 1444 01:01:21,560 --> 01:01:25,160 for parents and and families to want their relatives to be 1445 01:01:25,160 --> 01:01:29,000 better off them to want to save, to invest in their education, to 1446 01:01:29,000 --> 01:01:31,560 invest in giving them a legacy, to invest in giving them a 1447 01:01:31,560 --> 01:01:34,200 future. That's what's good, not not 1448 01:01:34,200 --> 01:01:36,160 partying and leaving them nothing but debt. 1449 01:01:36,160 --> 01:01:37,840 And you know what? We've left people now. 1450 01:01:37,840 --> 01:01:39,880 Of course, fast times, right? Yeah. 1451 01:01:40,320 --> 01:01:43,040 Let me ask you something. Another part where another part 1452 01:01:43,040 --> 01:01:45,840 of your book, right where you brought up America's moral 1453 01:01:45,840 --> 01:01:46,800 decline. Yes. 1454 01:01:46,800 --> 01:01:50,560 What came first? Was it the money experiment that 1455 01:01:50,560 --> 01:01:53,120 led to the moral? Because if you look at history 1456 01:01:53,120 --> 01:01:55,920 and you look at the I'm an Empire, there's a lot of 1457 01:01:55,920 --> 01:01:57,840 similarity. Track, they act really 1458 01:01:57,840 --> 01:01:59,320 perfectly, don't they? Yeah, so. 1459 01:01:59,320 --> 01:02:01,480 What came? 1st that's a chicken and egg 1460 01:02:01,480 --> 01:02:05,000 question what I'm saying. Was it the degradation of of the 1461 01:02:05,000 --> 01:02:07,000 money? Because I think like, what a lot 1462 01:02:07,000 --> 01:02:09,440 of people forget to understand is that money plays such an 1463 01:02:09,440 --> 01:02:12,720 integral part in the human. Absolutely everyone touches it. 1464 01:02:12,760 --> 01:02:14,760 What happens when that money is broken? 1465 01:02:14,880 --> 01:02:18,320 When that money is corrupt, you can make a very good argument 1466 01:02:18,320 --> 01:02:22,480 that it breaks something spiritually about you as a. 1467 01:02:22,840 --> 01:02:26,280 That's what I believe. But I think the money breaks and 1468 01:02:26,280 --> 01:02:28,680 then the spirit breaks. But that that leads to, you 1469 01:02:28,680 --> 01:02:32,040 know, there's each incremental step and the steps just got 1470 01:02:32,040 --> 01:02:34,880 worse and worse and worse. And, you know, like as an 1471 01:02:34,880 --> 01:02:37,080 example, when we're on the gold standard, I mean, they, they, 1472 01:02:37,240 --> 01:02:39,440 they, you know, suspended the specie payment in 1812. 1473 01:02:39,440 --> 01:02:42,480 The money broke, but they fixed it and they got back on the gold 1474 01:02:42,480 --> 01:02:44,480 standard and, you know, things were OK again. 1475 01:02:44,680 --> 01:02:47,280 And so, and we had a lot of experiences like that, including 1476 01:02:47,280 --> 01:02:49,120 the Civil War where they printed greenbacks. 1477 01:02:49,120 --> 01:02:51,520 But, you know, we kept going back to what we knew, which was 1478 01:02:51,520 --> 01:02:53,600 sound money. And, and, you know, in the the 1479 01:02:53,600 --> 01:02:55,280 bimetalism wars were fought over that. 1480 01:02:55,280 --> 01:02:57,160 All the free silver guys wanted less sound money. 1481 01:02:57,160 --> 01:02:58,560 All the gold guys wanted sound money. 1482 01:02:58,640 --> 01:03:01,120 And we stayed with sound money. But then, you know, the Fed came 1483 01:03:01,120 --> 01:03:04,200 along and it backs up the banks. And then, you know, and it just, 1484 01:03:04,680 --> 01:03:07,840 you know, the the snowball got really, really rolling, You 1485 01:03:07,840 --> 01:03:09,480 know, later on. I mean, if you look at the 1486 01:03:09,480 --> 01:03:12,040 history of America, I mean, the monetary system was never 1487 01:03:12,040 --> 01:03:15,880 perfect, but it was better than it is now by definition. 1488 01:03:16,000 --> 01:03:16,400 Yeah. Yeah. 1489 01:03:16,840 --> 01:03:20,520 No, it's, it's a, it's a very kind of interesting phenomenon. 1490 01:03:20,520 --> 01:03:22,800 Like yeah you can. They go, they go hand in. 1491 01:03:22,800 --> 01:03:24,760 Hand they go hand in hand. Yeah, I mean, it is, it is 1492 01:03:24,760 --> 01:03:25,920 chicken and egg. I mean, is it good? 1493 01:03:26,080 --> 01:03:28,560 And and it's kind of like each one of them is a top this. 1494 01:03:28,600 --> 01:03:30,400 Do you know what I mean? I mean, you know, derivatives, 1495 01:03:30,440 --> 01:03:32,240 right? For example, I mean, Phil Graham 1496 01:03:32,240 --> 01:03:34,360 lobbied to change all the derivatives law, which allowed 1497 01:03:34,360 --> 01:03:37,840 Enron to vaporize $78 billion worth of assets. 1498 01:03:37,840 --> 01:03:39,560 Do you know what I mean? And and she was getting, she was 1499 01:03:39,560 --> 01:03:41,440 on the Enron board and she was getting paid, you know, 1500 01:03:41,440 --> 01:03:42,960 1,000,000 bucks a year to sit on that board. 1501 01:03:42,960 --> 01:03:45,760 I mean, you know, it's just, again, insiders changing the 1502 01:03:45,760 --> 01:03:48,800 rules, doing stuff to benefit themselves, breaking the money, 1503 01:03:48,840 --> 01:03:49,560 right? Yeah. 1504 01:03:49,760 --> 01:03:52,600 So Larry, early on in the conversation, I want to double 1505 01:03:52,600 --> 01:03:54,920 back to this. You, you talked about the dead 1506 01:03:55,080 --> 01:03:56,640 Doom loot. What is that? 1507 01:03:56,720 --> 01:03:59,200 Yeah. OK, so let's talk about the 1508 01:03:59,200 --> 01:04:00,920 federal government's finances, right? 1509 01:04:01,040 --> 01:04:03,880 The federal government collects taxes and the federal government 1510 01:04:03,880 --> 01:04:05,960 has expenses. And some of those expenses are 1511 01:04:05,960 --> 01:04:08,120 very much locked in. You know, Social Security and 1512 01:04:08,120 --> 01:04:11,000 Medicare are kind of set on autopilot and they adjust upward 1513 01:04:11,000 --> 01:04:13,200 with CPI. Some of the are are more 1514 01:04:13,200 --> 01:04:15,640 discretionary, like defense, but frankly, it's pretty locked in 1515 01:04:15,640 --> 01:04:18,120 as well because all the defense contractors have the Washington 1516 01:04:18,120 --> 01:04:20,480 by the throat. Basically, these things are, are 1517 01:04:20,480 --> 01:04:23,200 costs that we endure. And by the way, one of the 1518 01:04:23,200 --> 01:04:25,800 biggest wastes of, of federal spending, in my opinion, in the 1519 01:04:25,800 --> 01:04:28,520 last, you know, 20 years was all the were all the wars post 911. 1520 01:04:28,520 --> 01:04:31,200 I mean, we spent away 8. We wasted $8 trillion in the 1521 01:04:31,200 --> 01:04:34,680 Middle East fighting, securing oil, you know, for other people 1522 01:04:34,680 --> 01:04:37,240 and ourselves and, you know, grabbing Afghanistan and giving 1523 01:04:37,240 --> 01:04:38,520 it back. I mean, we just wasted $8 1524 01:04:38,520 --> 01:04:39,520 trillion. It's terrible. 1525 01:04:39,600 --> 01:04:41,560 But Dick Cheney's rich. I mean, he's, you know, he made 1526 01:04:41,560 --> 01:04:43,320 $100 million, you know, in Halliburton. 1527 01:04:43,320 --> 01:04:46,360 So set all that aside. The federal government balances 1528 01:04:46,360 --> 01:04:48,000 these two. And when COVID came along, the 1529 01:04:48,000 --> 01:04:50,560 expenses went up a great deal and revenue didn't. 1530 01:04:51,000 --> 01:04:53,360 And so the deficits really widened out. 1531 01:04:53,480 --> 01:04:55,200 And one would have thought the crisis was over. 1532 01:04:55,200 --> 01:04:56,840 They've cut back the expenses, but they didn't. 1533 01:04:57,000 --> 01:04:59,000 And so we started running bigger deficits. 1534 01:04:59,000 --> 01:05:01,480 Well, as you know, when you run a deficit, it has to be 1535 01:05:01,480 --> 01:05:03,000 financed. The government has to figure out 1536 01:05:03,000 --> 01:05:04,800 a way to pay for the deficit. So what do they do? 1537 01:05:04,800 --> 01:05:08,640 They issue debt in order to have the cash to to make the expense 1538 01:05:08,640 --> 01:05:11,800 payments that they're making. So that debt gets added on to 1539 01:05:11,800 --> 01:05:14,200 the national debt, which has been growing incredibly quickly, 1540 01:05:14,200 --> 01:05:16,320 as we all know. And that debt needs to be 1541 01:05:16,320 --> 01:05:18,440 serviced. There's an interest cost to that 1542 01:05:18,440 --> 01:05:20,760 debt. And so the bond market, which 1543 01:05:20,760 --> 01:05:23,120 buys that debt, pays that interest. 1544 01:05:23,120 --> 01:05:26,240 And there's only in the bond market is comprised of savers 1545 01:05:26,240 --> 01:05:28,240 who want to buy debt to get an interest rate. 1546 01:05:28,240 --> 01:05:30,880 You know, they're trying to conservatively save money and 1547 01:05:30,880 --> 01:05:33,440 get interest on it. And So what happens is as the 1548 01:05:33,440 --> 01:05:36,800 debt gets bigger and interest rates go up, the interest cost 1549 01:05:36,800 --> 01:05:38,920 of the government goes up a lot. So the interest cost of the 1550 01:05:38,920 --> 01:05:42,000 government five years ago was 3, $400 billion a year. 1551 01:05:42,000 --> 01:05:44,680 Right now we're running at $1.4 trillion a year. 1552 01:05:44,800 --> 01:05:47,800 Well, last year the deficit was $1.8 trillion. 1553 01:05:47,920 --> 01:05:51,440 So a big part of the deficit is the interest cost on the debt. 1554 01:05:51,560 --> 01:05:53,760 If the deficit gets bigger, what do you do? 1555 01:05:53,760 --> 01:05:56,720 You sell more debt, OK, You sell the debt into a fixed size 1556 01:05:56,720 --> 01:05:57,960 market. What happens? 1557 01:05:57,960 --> 01:06:00,320 There are only so many buyers, they need a higher price 1558 01:06:00,320 --> 01:06:02,480 interest cost in order to buy. Want to buy it. 1559 01:06:02,680 --> 01:06:04,200 So the interest rate goes higher. 1560 01:06:04,280 --> 01:06:07,400 So now you got 36 billion. That's not just paying $1.4 1561 01:06:07,480 --> 01:06:09,280 trillion that maybe they're paying 1.8. 1562 01:06:09,320 --> 01:06:11,560 Well, that's going to get added to the deficit. 1563 01:06:11,600 --> 01:06:12,840 Well, how are you going to finance the deficit? 1564 01:06:12,840 --> 01:06:15,240 You're going to issue more debt. Well, the issue, the more debt 1565 01:06:15,240 --> 01:06:17,880 gets you see, and it becomes a doom loop, right? 1566 01:06:17,960 --> 01:06:21,280 Bigger deficit, more debt issuance, more debt issuance, 1567 01:06:21,280 --> 01:06:24,600 higher interest rates, higher interest rates, bigger deficit. 1568 01:06:24,600 --> 01:06:27,320 Can't stop this train. Nothing stops this train. 1569 01:06:27,320 --> 01:06:29,600 And I got permission from Lynn to use that as a chapter. 1570 01:06:29,600 --> 01:06:32,000 I mean, there's a chapter called Nothing Stops This train, which 1571 01:06:32,440 --> 01:06:36,000 a brilliant meme, you know, by Lynn Alden that that describes 1572 01:06:36,000 --> 01:06:38,400 that process. And, and, and so Doge comes 1573 01:06:38,400 --> 01:06:41,640 along and, you know, rightly so. And, and I applaud all of their 1574 01:06:41,640 --> 01:06:43,040 efforts. They are going to try and they 1575 01:06:43,040 --> 01:06:44,600 found some really stupid expenses. 1576 01:06:44,600 --> 01:06:47,000 They're going to try and they will, they will cut expenses. 1577 01:06:47,000 --> 01:06:49,400 But here's the thing, Nico, they've got a really, really 1578 01:06:49,400 --> 01:06:54,040 hard task, Okay, The deficit is 1/8 last year and it's now 1579 01:06:54,040 --> 01:06:56,360 running closer to like 2-4. If you annualized the last 1580 01:06:56,520 --> 01:06:59,080 couple of months, what we're seeing is that's going to be 1581 01:06:59,080 --> 01:07:02,560 really, really hard to cut because 80%, if you take Social 1582 01:07:02,560 --> 01:07:05,600 Security, Medicare, defense and interest, you've accounted for 1583 01:07:05,600 --> 01:07:08,160 80% of the budget. So even if you caught cut, you 1584 01:07:08,160 --> 01:07:11,640 know, if you cut the less, you know, 20% to 0, which you can't, 1585 01:07:11,960 --> 01:07:14,360 you wouldn't balance it. So you've got to go after and, 1586 01:07:14,360 --> 01:07:16,040 and you try and cut Social Security, Medicare, that's the 1587 01:07:16,040 --> 01:07:17,600 third rail. No politicians going to go for 1588 01:07:17,600 --> 01:07:19,720 that defense guys, they're pretty powerful and the interest 1589 01:07:19,720 --> 01:07:21,400 rates are really high. Now what they could do is they 1590 01:07:21,400 --> 01:07:23,400 could do financial repression and I think that's what they're 1591 01:07:23,400 --> 01:07:25,240 going to force to do. They're going to be forced to do 1592 01:07:25,240 --> 01:07:27,240 yield curve control. They're going to the Fed in 1593 01:07:27,240 --> 01:07:29,360 spite of inflation not coming back to 2%. 1594 01:07:29,360 --> 01:07:31,280 You've seen them already calling for the some people saying, 1595 01:07:31,280 --> 01:07:32,480 well, that's in the book as well. 1596 01:07:32,520 --> 01:07:34,880 Well, maybe we should have an inflation target of 3 or 4%. 1597 01:07:35,400 --> 01:07:38,240 They're going to be forced to keep issuing the debt and hold 1598 01:07:38,240 --> 01:07:40,440 the interest rate below the net, the neutral rate. 1599 01:07:40,560 --> 01:07:43,320 And that that interest rate will at least bring that 1.4 of 1600 01:07:43,320 --> 01:07:45,440 interest expense down. And that'll help a little bit. 1601 01:07:45,440 --> 01:07:48,480 But the point is yield curve control, How do they do that? 1602 01:07:48,480 --> 01:07:51,440 That means they are buying the debt themselves, which then 1603 01:07:51,440 --> 01:07:53,760 means their balance sheet is getting bigger, which then means 1604 01:07:53,760 --> 01:07:55,880 the supply of money in the system is getting bigger. 1605 01:07:55,880 --> 01:07:58,560 And what's that? That's inflation, OK. 1606 01:07:58,880 --> 01:08:01,240 As inflation gets bigger, the bond market, you know, the bond 1607 01:08:01,240 --> 01:08:04,080 market is devised to give a return over and above inflation, 1608 01:08:04,400 --> 01:08:06,720 higher inflation. The bond market says, I'm sorry, 1609 01:08:06,720 --> 01:08:08,600 you know, I'm not buying that unless you give me this rate. 1610 01:08:08,720 --> 01:08:11,280 Eventually the Fed could be sitting there with with their 1611 01:08:11,280 --> 01:08:13,040 their balance sheet saying, well, we're going to cap the 1612 01:08:13,040 --> 01:08:15,000 yields at 4%. The entire bond market could 1613 01:08:15,000 --> 01:08:18,279 look at it and go 4%. I don't like that. 1614 01:08:18,399 --> 01:08:22,240 Sold to you, Right. And $36 trillion. 1615 01:08:22,439 --> 01:08:25,040 Yeah, they could sell to the Fed, which has got a $7 trillion 1616 01:08:25,040 --> 01:08:27,640 balance sheet, right? So suddenly you've just grown 1617 01:08:27,640 --> 01:08:30,200 the money supply by that amount. That's hyperinflation. 1618 01:08:30,200 --> 01:08:32,080 But something's got to give, Something's got to give. 1619 01:08:32,080 --> 01:08:33,479 Something's got to give, Something's got to. 1620 01:08:33,479 --> 01:08:34,800 But you just can't put a timeline. 1621 01:08:34,800 --> 01:08:36,560 On No, you can't. You don't know how it's going to 1622 01:08:36,560 --> 01:08:37,720 give. You don't know form it's going 1623 01:08:37,720 --> 01:08:39,640 to take. But what we do know, Nico, is 1624 01:08:39,640 --> 01:08:44,479 it's leading to the big print. There's no other way out. 1625 01:08:44,560 --> 01:08:46,800 And that's why I wrote the book, because I want to get up on a 1626 01:08:46,800 --> 01:08:49,279 soapbox and scream at the entire goddamn world. 1627 01:08:49,279 --> 01:08:51,279 Wake up, guys. Wake up. 1628 01:08:51,279 --> 01:08:52,800 This is going to happen. Yeah. 1629 01:08:52,880 --> 01:08:55,560 Protect yourself now. Yeah, because there's not going 1630 01:08:55,560 --> 01:08:57,479 to be a dual over. Yeah, right, if you're in. 1631 01:08:57,479 --> 01:08:59,960 Bitcoin, the big print is gonna make. 1632 01:08:59,960 --> 01:09:01,760 Gold to 1,000,000 bucks a coin. Yeah. 1633 01:09:01,920 --> 01:09:04,080 Gold's going to 10,000. Yeah, right. 1634 01:09:04,279 --> 01:09:05,720 Yeah. I mean, it's it's nuts. 1635 01:09:06,000 --> 01:09:09,200 Yeah, it's absolutely nuts. What do you think about Lummis? 1636 01:09:09,200 --> 01:09:11,760 I was talking to her, yeah. She's talking to Senator Lummis 1637 01:09:11,760 --> 01:09:14,680 about two weeks ago in DC. What do you think about her plan 1638 01:09:14,840 --> 01:09:16,720 in the Bitcoin Act? The the bill? 1639 01:09:17,000 --> 01:09:19,520 And I love the way that Senator Lummis approached it. 1640 01:09:19,520 --> 01:09:23,720 She's like, look, my generation kind of really screwed you guys 1641 01:09:23,720 --> 01:09:23,880 though. I. 1642 01:09:23,880 --> 01:09:25,040 Fucked it up. Oh, there's no doubt. 1643 01:09:25,040 --> 01:09:26,840 I agree with that totally. And I'm not saying her 1644 01:09:26,840 --> 01:09:28,120 specifically. But she didn't do it. 1645 01:09:28,120 --> 01:09:30,040 I didn't do it either. But but yeah, she was like. 1646 01:09:30,080 --> 01:09:34,439 I want it like this Bill is a way to rectify that and she was 1647 01:09:34,439 --> 01:09:35,880 making. This book is my way, right? 1648 01:09:36,040 --> 01:09:37,399 Very well, perfect. Right. 1649 01:09:37,399 --> 01:09:38,359 And it's like, I want to, you know? 1650 01:09:38,680 --> 01:09:42,279 And the, the case that she was making is that if the Bitcoin 1651 01:09:42,279 --> 01:09:45,000 Act gets passed in the United States, it's going to be kind of 1652 01:09:45,000 --> 01:09:48,760 hard because the the Republicans don't have a filibuster majority 1653 01:09:48,760 --> 01:09:51,520 proof in the Senate. They have 53 votes, right? 1654 01:09:51,560 --> 01:09:53,720 Right. She's making the case that by 1655 01:09:53,720 --> 01:09:57,400 the United States buying I think up to 1,000,000 Bitcoin, you're 1656 01:09:57,400 --> 01:09:59,400 like 5%. Yeah, it was. 200,000 a year for 1657 01:09:59,400 --> 01:10:02,600 five years as I remember. She can use, or better said the 1658 01:10:02,680 --> 01:10:06,480 US government could use that to pay off some of the debt. 1659 01:10:06,640 --> 01:10:08,960 You think that's feasible? Yes, I do. 1660 01:10:08,960 --> 01:10:11,840 It's, it's it's complicated, but I do think it's feasible. 1661 01:10:11,840 --> 01:10:15,600 I mean, I think we need a monetary reset, full stop, OK? 1662 01:10:15,600 --> 01:10:16,920 We are in a sovereign debt crisis. 1663 01:10:16,920 --> 01:10:19,200 There's too much debt, there's not enough GDP. 1664 01:10:19,200 --> 01:10:23,160 We need a we need a monetary reset, OK, How that takes form. 1665 01:10:23,640 --> 01:10:25,960 This is brain surgery. This is complicated, OK? 1666 01:10:25,960 --> 01:10:29,080 And we don't, I don't have the answer and I don't think anybody 1667 01:10:29,080 --> 01:10:31,160 has the answer. But what it does mean is it 1668 01:10:31,160 --> 01:10:34,400 means you've got to go back to some form of sound money as the 1669 01:10:34,400 --> 01:10:36,440 base layer. Bitcoin is the right choice. 1670 01:10:36,440 --> 01:10:40,000 Gold is inferior, but it's a better choice than Fiat, OK. 1671 01:10:40,160 --> 01:10:44,080 And yes, if we start buying Bitcoin, that's going to shove 1672 01:10:44,080 --> 01:10:46,680 the dollar down, OK, which we need. 1673 01:10:46,680 --> 01:10:49,160 That would create more exports for us and it would make our 1674 01:10:49,360 --> 01:10:51,760 imports more expensive. It would harm China, but that's 1675 01:10:51,760 --> 01:10:53,400 a good thing. China's taking advantage of our 1676 01:10:53,400 --> 01:10:56,720 industrial Midwest. And yes, I mean, what she's 1677 01:10:56,720 --> 01:10:59,320 talking about is brilliant. I think Trump and Bescent kind 1678 01:10:59,320 --> 01:11:02,160 of understand this. OK, Now in the paths, there are 1679 01:11:02,160 --> 01:11:04,080 1,000,000 paths as to how we get there. 1680 01:11:04,480 --> 01:11:05,840 OK. And I don't know. 1681 01:11:06,000 --> 01:11:08,880 And I can't foresee, but I when I invest, I don't, I don't 1682 01:11:08,880 --> 01:11:10,160 invest. I'm not a trader. 1683 01:11:10,160 --> 01:11:12,840 I don't invest month by month. I invest year by year. 1684 01:11:12,840 --> 01:11:15,480 And I really invest, you know, five years by five years and 1685 01:11:15,480 --> 01:11:18,040 decade by decade. And so I'm looking to protect my 1686 01:11:18,040 --> 01:11:21,440 savings, you know, for when I'm 80 or 90 or, you know, or for my 1687 01:11:21,440 --> 01:11:24,200 kids and stuff. And I just know that all roads 1688 01:11:24,200 --> 01:11:26,640 lead to inflation. Yeah, they just, they all leave 1689 01:11:26,720 --> 01:11:28,040 and. So they have to print. 1690 01:11:28,040 --> 01:11:29,680 Nothing stops this train. Right. 1691 01:11:29,680 --> 01:11:32,920 And so, so you know in what, in what form or manner I don't 1692 01:11:32,920 --> 01:11:34,600 know. And by the way, by the way, it's 1693 01:11:34,600 --> 01:11:36,160 going to be volatile. I mean, there's a chart in here. 1694 01:11:36,160 --> 01:11:38,120 There's there's Dan Oliver's brilliant, you know, Weimar 1695 01:11:38,120 --> 01:11:40,360 chart that shows the price of gold monthly during the Weimar 1696 01:11:40,360 --> 01:11:42,240 hyperinflation. I mean, example, we could have 1697 01:11:42,240 --> 01:11:44,600 an enormous stock market crash. OK, Let's, I mean, there's some 1698 01:11:44,600 --> 01:11:46,720 people think that they're going to engineer that to hurt Trump, 1699 01:11:46,720 --> 01:11:48,120 OK? We could have an enormous stock 1700 01:11:48,120 --> 01:11:50,120 market crash. And you know, in 2020 when the 1701 01:11:50,120 --> 01:11:52,440 stock market crash, Bitcoin got hit hard, gold got hit hard, 1702 01:11:52,640 --> 01:11:53,920 right? Powell came in on a Monday 1703 01:11:53,920 --> 01:11:55,800 morning, said we're going to print until our eyes bleed, 1704 01:11:55,880 --> 01:11:58,160 basically. And gold took off like a rocket. 1705 01:11:58,200 --> 01:12:01,080 Bitcoin took off like a rocket. But you know, if you panicked on 1706 01:12:01,080 --> 01:12:03,320 that downturn, you know, you got blown out. 1707 01:12:03,320 --> 01:12:06,160 So one needs, and I try in the book to explain that one needs 1708 01:12:06,160 --> 01:12:08,960 to understand the nature of these assets and understand 1709 01:12:08,960 --> 01:12:10,960 that, you know, and you've been in this long enough, you know, 1710 01:12:10,960 --> 01:12:13,240 I've been in a long enough. I'm, I know this stuff can go 1711 01:12:13,240 --> 01:12:14,240 against you. Yeah. 1712 01:12:14,240 --> 01:12:16,120 You know, I mean, I, I own a bunch of these things. 1713 01:12:16,120 --> 01:12:20,080 I bought them at 17,000 in 2017. And I watch them go to 10 and I 1714 01:12:20,080 --> 01:12:23,200 watch them go to four. Yep and I and I bought 1 and I 1715 01:12:23,200 --> 01:12:27,480 bought one at 69 K at 21 and 21. I did too. 1716 01:12:27,800 --> 01:12:29,120 I did too. And it was terrible. 1717 01:12:29,120 --> 01:12:30,440 I did too. I did too. 1718 01:12:30,600 --> 01:12:32,600 But but you know what? I bought more at 15. 1719 01:12:32,840 --> 01:12:36,400 You know in 22 when after SPF, so you got to take a long term 1720 01:12:36,400 --> 01:12:38,560 perspective. I mean, the changing of a 1721 01:12:38,560 --> 01:12:40,840 monetary system, which is what we're in, it's going to be a 1722 01:12:40,840 --> 01:12:42,560 volatile event. Yeah, absolutely. 1723 01:12:42,560 --> 01:12:46,680 But I do want to give massive kudos to Senator Lum is 1724 01:12:46,960 --> 01:12:49,880 absolutely. She is like absolutely. 1725 01:12:50,160 --> 01:12:52,480 She gave me hope. Absolutely gave me hope. 1726 01:12:52,480 --> 01:12:53,920 And you know, running is incredible. 1727 01:12:53,920 --> 01:12:56,560 Yeah, and Thomas Massie, I mean, these are forerunners and there 1728 01:12:56,560 --> 01:12:58,920 will be more, you know. There will be more, I love that. 1729 01:12:58,920 --> 01:13:00,640 There will be. It's like we're coming. 1730 01:13:00,800 --> 01:13:02,400 I love that they're going to be more right. 1731 01:13:02,560 --> 01:13:05,200 You know you're talking about investing testing earlier, 1732 01:13:05,400 --> 01:13:08,160 Larry, and I think, you know the world is waking up to Bitcoin 1733 01:13:08,400 --> 01:13:11,680 Strat Fi's here, right? You know that just the world is 1734 01:13:11,680 --> 01:13:13,680 woken up to this nation states are here. 1735 01:13:13,840 --> 01:13:17,600 If you were to give advice to your client in terms of what 1736 01:13:17,600 --> 01:13:21,160 should be the appropriate Bitcoin allocation, the 1737 01:13:21,160 --> 01:13:24,200 percentage terms. Depends on your age and depends 1738 01:13:24,200 --> 01:13:26,400 on your risk tolerance. I said in the book, I thought if 1739 01:13:26,400 --> 01:13:29,000 you didn't have at least 25% of your assets and sound money, you 1740 01:13:29,000 --> 01:13:31,320 were going to experience regret. I obviously have a lot more than 1741 01:13:31,320 --> 01:13:33,280 that and I think a lot of people should have more than that. 1742 01:13:33,360 --> 01:13:35,720 If you're older and and you can't handle a drawdown, you 1743 01:13:35,720 --> 01:13:37,440 might need the money within a five year window. 1744 01:13:37,440 --> 01:13:39,800 Having 100% in Bitcoin, that doesn't make any sense. 1745 01:13:39,800 --> 01:13:41,840 You could have a big drawdown and you'd have to pull it out at 1746 01:13:41,840 --> 01:13:43,240 a low value. You want to do that. 1747 01:13:43,240 --> 01:13:45,040 So it kind of depends on when you're going to need the money, 1748 01:13:45,040 --> 01:13:46,400 right? So I think everybody has to 1749 01:13:46,480 --> 01:13:49,080 figure that out for themselves. But let me make another point 1750 01:13:49,080 --> 01:13:50,480 about the whole thing. And I think it's a very 1751 01:13:50,480 --> 01:13:52,680 important point to make and the book makes it, but I want to 1752 01:13:52,680 --> 01:13:54,360 make it here because I think it's very important people 1753 01:13:54,360 --> 01:13:55,560 understand. It was funny. 1754 01:13:55,560 --> 01:13:57,360 You know, when you write one of these books, you do research and 1755 01:13:57,360 --> 01:13:59,480 you learn things and things pop into your head that you hadn't 1756 01:13:59,480 --> 01:14:02,480 thought of before investing, you know, and, and so there are a 1757 01:14:02,480 --> 01:14:04,200 lot of rules investing. They're tried and true. 1758 01:14:04,200 --> 01:14:06,280 They've been around a long time. A lot of great books written in 1759 01:14:06,280 --> 01:14:08,080 Graham and Dodd, you know, they're brilliant. 1760 01:14:08,080 --> 01:14:09,480 There are thousands of brilliant investors. 1761 01:14:09,480 --> 01:14:11,560 Millions of brilliant investors have done well over the years. 1762 01:14:12,000 --> 01:14:14,120 And it's very seldom that the rules change. 1763 01:14:14,160 --> 01:14:16,240 But the rules have changed. And let me describe that the 1764 01:14:16,240 --> 01:14:17,960 rules have changed in the following way, Nico. 1765 01:14:18,160 --> 01:14:21,680 We now have investments dominated by Metcalf's Law. 1766 01:14:22,000 --> 01:14:25,800 Metcalf's Law says that the network grows in value at the 1767 01:14:25,800 --> 01:14:28,080 square of the underlying number of users. 1768 01:14:28,320 --> 01:14:31,360 So I was trained, you know, at Business School to invest in 1769 01:14:31,360 --> 01:14:33,800 things based on multiples of cash flow and growth and PEG 1770 01:14:33,800 --> 01:14:36,160 ratios and all the standard stuff, sharp ratios, all that 1771 01:14:36,160 --> 01:14:37,960 stuff. And therefore, when, you know, 1772 01:14:37,960 --> 01:14:40,280 when the Internet came along and I invested in the Internet and 1773 01:14:40,280 --> 01:14:42,520 I, I benefited from the growth of that, But like, I was looking 1774 01:14:42,520 --> 01:14:44,920 at Amazon and I was looking at Facebook and I was looking at 1775 01:14:44,920 --> 01:14:47,720 Google and I could never get her past the valuations. 1776 01:14:47,720 --> 01:14:50,360 I, I put valuation tests on these network businesses. 1777 01:14:50,360 --> 01:14:52,400 I said they're too expensive for what they are. 1778 01:14:52,400 --> 01:14:54,760 They don't have any profits to justify this valuation. 1779 01:14:54,960 --> 01:14:57,320 I missed it. OK, here's what happened. 1780 01:14:57,440 --> 01:15:00,880 Amazon, since its IPO, is up 218,000%. 1781 01:15:01,480 --> 01:15:03,280 Yeah. Google, since its IPO, is up 1782 01:15:03,320 --> 01:15:06,480 9000%. Facebook, since its IPO is up 1783 01:15:06,480 --> 01:15:09,320 like 2000%. General Motors, since its IPO in 1784 01:15:09,320 --> 01:15:12,880 1916, is up like 400 times. OK, It's great. 1785 01:15:12,880 --> 01:15:14,000 It was a great investment. OK. 1786 01:15:14,000 --> 01:15:15,640 If you held GM through all those years, you did fine. 1787 01:15:15,800 --> 01:15:18,320 My point is, it's only 20 years. The Internet's really been 1788 01:15:18,320 --> 01:15:21,880 active since, right in in 20 years from because I consider 1789 01:15:22,320 --> 01:15:25,480 broad Internet usage was 2000, started in 95 broadly it was 1790 01:15:25,480 --> 01:15:27,600 2000. So we're 24 years into the 1791 01:15:27,600 --> 01:15:30,160 Internet and you've got network businesses that have gone up 1792 01:15:30,280 --> 01:15:33,560 thousands of percent. Yeah, this is different. 1793 01:15:33,560 --> 01:15:35,040 Yeah. This is AI mean. 1794 01:15:35,040 --> 01:15:37,440 This is a really different set of rules. 1795 01:15:37,440 --> 01:15:39,320 OK. That trend isn't going to stop. 1796 01:15:39,440 --> 01:15:42,000 No, Yeah. So what does that tell me? 1797 01:15:42,120 --> 01:15:44,320 I want to invest in network businesses. 1798 01:15:44,640 --> 01:15:46,960 Well, what you know, or network things, right? 1799 01:15:47,240 --> 01:15:49,520 What's the biggest network thing right now? 1800 01:15:49,880 --> 01:15:52,680 Jesus Christ. Yeah, yeah. 1801 01:15:52,760 --> 01:15:55,880 It's just so obvious, right? I mean, it really, I think it's 1802 01:15:55,880 --> 01:15:58,760 very important for people to get out of that traditional 1803 01:15:58,760 --> 01:16:00,960 investing mindset and think in those terms. 1804 01:16:01,000 --> 01:16:03,000 Absolutely. Final question for you. 1805 01:16:03,000 --> 01:16:03,600 Yeah, Yeah. What's that? 1806 01:16:03,680 --> 01:16:07,640 What are you the most excited about for the next five years in 1807 01:16:07,640 --> 01:16:10,840 terms of Bitcoin? Well, I'm really excited to see 1808 01:16:11,040 --> 01:16:16,040 all of us winning and I'm excited to see Bitcoiners 1809 01:16:16,040 --> 01:16:19,800 winning and I'm excited to see new people coming into the fold. 1810 01:16:19,920 --> 01:16:22,400 And, you know, I, I told, told some stories. 1811 01:16:22,400 --> 01:16:25,400 I mean, I was in a Whole Foods in Framingham, Mass in December. 1812 01:16:25,520 --> 01:16:27,400 I was walking around. There was a guy in, in 1813 01:16:27,400 --> 01:16:30,520 northeastern Massachusetts, there's a office supply store 1814 01:16:30,520 --> 01:16:32,320 called WB Mason. They deliver and they have 1815 01:16:32,320 --> 01:16:33,600 trucks. There's a guy in there walking 1816 01:16:33,600 --> 01:16:36,640 around with WB Mason uniform on. So he's a delivery man, walks up 1817 01:16:36,640 --> 01:16:37,920 to me. He says, are you Larry? 1818 01:16:37,920 --> 01:16:40,680 And I'm like, yeah. He says, dude, I've been 1819 01:16:40,680 --> 01:16:41,960 watching your videos for five years. 1820 01:16:42,960 --> 01:16:44,800 I started stacking five years ago. 1821 01:16:45,200 --> 01:16:47,320 I got a pretty good stack. He gives me a big hug. 1822 01:16:47,320 --> 01:16:49,600 Because you changed my life. You saved my. 1823 01:16:49,880 --> 01:16:51,400 It's a guy who drives a truck. Yeah. 1824 01:16:51,400 --> 01:16:54,200 And I'm kind of like, oh, man, we need more stories than yeah, 1825 01:16:54,400 --> 01:16:56,600 right. I want, I want that story 1826 01:16:56,640 --> 01:16:59,280 repeated 1000 times. I love that. 1827 01:16:59,320 --> 01:17:01,400 You know what I mean? That's that's what I'm held for. 1828 01:17:01,600 --> 01:17:04,400 The other thing I would say that my biggest and longer term, my 1829 01:17:04,400 --> 01:17:06,520 biggest hope for Bitcoin is that it ends the wars. 1830 01:17:06,760 --> 01:17:09,280 Yes. It's just people, and innocent 1831 01:17:09,280 --> 01:17:12,960 people in faraway countries have gotten killed for no good 1832 01:17:12,960 --> 01:17:15,280 reason. Fix the money, fix the world the 1833 01:17:15,280 --> 01:17:19,360 world guys, go get larry's book, the big print what happened to 1834 01:17:19,360 --> 01:17:22,920 America and how sound money will fix it Larry there's been an 1835 01:17:23,000 --> 01:17:23,760 actual. Honor. 1836 01:17:23,880 --> 01:17:25,560 Well, no, thank you so much. Sit with you. 1837 01:17:25,560 --> 01:17:27,000 I really enjoyed it. Great questions.