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First of all, I think one of the
most valuable Soul books is not,

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you know, there are some sold 
books that everybody sort of 

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knows the titles up, but one of 
the Forgotten Soul books is his 

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little book from the mid-1980s 
called civil rights rhetoric or 

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reality. 
And if you go to Amazon, you 

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will actually see that I have a 
review of that book from many 

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years ago that I'm very happy 
with the proud of that book. 

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What I love about it is that 
every single, Single page is 

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smashing some myth. 
And so for example, people think

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well, discrimination causes 
poverty, or the differences in 

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income or educational outcomes 
or whatever. 

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Between all kinds of groups, not
just racial ones are caused are 

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explainable by discrimination 
and he just he says that is just

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such a easy convenient comic 
book style argument, but it just

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doesn't hold when you hold all 
the different groups constant. 

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And you look at people, The same
geographical area, you know, you

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look at people in the same age 
range with the same level of 

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work experience, and on, and on,
then all these these, these 

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variations actually disappear 
which is very interesting or if 

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you see some people will say, 
oh, there must be discrimination

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because White phds earn more 
than black phds. 

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He says, well let's disaggregate
the data and see what are they 

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have? 
The phds in because it turns out

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that Asian phds, Au turn white 
phds because they have phds 

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generally in things like 
engineering. 

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Whereas at least half of black 
phds are in education and we all

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know that education is not a 
highly remunerative field. 

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So in other words, he would look
at the conventional wisdom but 

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under the microscope of data, he
would look at these big 

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Aggregates and he would say the 
answer to whether this is true 

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or not comes from breaking it 
down and disaggregating it so 

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things like that. 
But what I also learned frankly 

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it was a moral lesson and that 
is about his courage in And 

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saying the things he did because
that meant academic isolation, 

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it meant being called names. 
But honestly what is impressive 

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about him is that none of that 
seemed to matter? 

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Honestly, you would see him on 
television and he just would be 

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like a hot knife through butter.
He didn't care what he said. 

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Could you briefly explain the 
difference between the 

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constrained and unconstrained 
worldview? 

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Is that? 
Yes, this is a, this is in his 

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book, a conflict of visions. 
And the the unconstrained vision

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is a way of looking at the world
is the because I guess what he 

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was trying to explain, although 
I don't think he quite put it 

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this way is, why is it that 
people who think the economy can

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be Planned and who think, you 
know, the minimum wage should be

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X dollars an hour and who think 
we should be locked in our 

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homes. 
Because of covid, and who, like,

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all these sorts of disparate 
different things, all seem to 

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reside in the same mind. 
And people who disagree all had.

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It's very rare for people to 
have one of those opinions and 

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not every single one of the 
others. 

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Now, why should that be? 
And what he, what he decided was

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there are certain there are two 
primary visions of people. 

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I have the world. 
The unconstrained vision is one 

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in which and I don't mean a 
character, but if we can think 

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it, we can create, if we could 
dream it, it can be made to 

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happen that there's no sense of 
the tragic. 

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Fallen aspect of human nature 
that we can remake ourselves. 

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If we need to to create the 
world that we want, we can use 

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our, our brains to plan and 
create an economy of abundance 

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and so on. 
And on, whereas the constrained 

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vision is more pessimistic. 
Mystic about what can be 

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accomplished through reason, and
through planning, and through 

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human effort. 
That in fact, it's actually not 

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possible to plan an economy for 
a variety of reasons. 

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And our temptation is to think 
that because I plan my life, I 

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can plan an economy, but these 
things that these are entirely 

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different. 
So he's saying that the 

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constrained vision is one that 
understands that human nature is

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what it is. 
And isn't going to be changed. 

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And so we shouldn't Try to talat
Aryan programs to change it in 

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order to bring about our amazing
vision of what the world can be.

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Because what instead will wind 
up doing is creating some 

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horrific totalitarian Nightmare 
and not exactly have a wonderful

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Society to show for it will 
break a lot of eggs, but we'll 

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never get the omelette.