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We don't oppose the state's Wars
because they'll be 

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counterproductive or overextend 
the states forces. 

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We oppose them because mass 
murder based on lies can never 

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be morally. 
Acceptable. 

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Welcome to Keith's night. 
Don't tread on anyone in the 

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libertarian Institute today. 
I'm joined by Stephen D krumbine

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of real progressives dot-org, 
mr. 

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Grumble and thank you so much 
for your time. 

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Okay. 
Thanks for having me on, man. 

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Appreciate it. 
Of course. 

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What does it mean to be a real 
Progressive? 

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Well, like it too. 
Be more of a view of people 

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willing to change when things 
ain't right. 

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When something doesn't smell 
right when it, isn't. 

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We don't just stay stuck. 
We don't just say, well, this is

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what was said, a hundred years 
ago. 

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We look for solutions to real 
rule, real world problems today.

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And, you know, the goal at least
from my perspective. 

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Anyway, is collective 
well-being, not just individual 

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well-being. 
And so I think that there's a 

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lot of understanding about 
Grading what we call the public 

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purpose as opposed to the 
individualist bootstrap minded 

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approach to things. 
And and I just to be fair, you 

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know, we talked a little offline
about this but I come from a 

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Libertarian background. 
I was a republican for a long 

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time and all my journey where I 
am today. 

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I did a drive-through on the 
Democratic party ended up, you 

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know, did a Libertarian tour for
about six years, supported Ron 

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Paul. 
Be heavily and just kept 

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drifting leftward and haven't 
been able to pull back the other

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day. 
It's just it's not intentional. 

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It just it's like where does the
best for people? 

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Keep pulling me to him? 
Wherever it is, it would 

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probably be categorized as left.
So that's that's where I keep 

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going. 
So I think Collective 

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cooperation is really important.
Even if you're doing something 

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alone like playing Solitaire. 
Well, you didn't invent cards, 

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you didn't invent. 
Ink on cards or the computer or 

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your electricity, you're only 
alive because other people made 

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food that you trade with. 
So, I think Collective 

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well-being is vitally important.
Do you think there should be an 

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important emphasis on voluntary 
cooperation versus coercive 

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cooperation? 
When it comes to achieving your 

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ends in life, you know, it's a 
tough call because yes, I mean 

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that is the goal. 
Like there's a huge part of me 

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that has an anarchist streak 
through throughout my my 

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Beliefs, I don't do it on 
purpose. 

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It's not like, I have a rigid. 
I am this. 

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So there for that, but I would 
say that the best is to have 

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Society. 
Put what's best for society 

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first and foremost. 
However, this is where it gets 

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challenging because an 
individual may feel that what's 

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best for them is not in line 
with what's best for society. 

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And so now you've got a conflict
of interest, you've got an 

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intron several interests, going 
one, the question is, Whose 

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interest Trump's whose is that 
the individuals interest, that 

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Trump Societies, or to society's
interest, Trump the individual. 

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And I think there's a balance 
there. 

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I don't know what the right 
answer is and all times. 

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I think the answer to the 
question if you're truly curious

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as it depends, if the answer is 
always, it depends. 

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But my goal would be to always, 
find places where we all can 

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move forward, collectively under
our own voluntary approach. 

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I don't subscribe to the nap. 
I don't subscribe to all that 

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bottom line is at some point in 
time. 

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There's times where I believe 
strongly in a benevolent 

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dictator as well. 
So you would never fight, you 

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know, I would tell you straight 
up. 

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I have huge Bend toward Central 
planning and local 

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Administration. 
So it's a challenge, right? 

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It's a answer. 
That question is always going to

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be, for me. 
It depends. 

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It's not a rigid line. 
What? 

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Is modern monetary Theory. 
So I'm empty. 

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Is an interesting thing and I 
got to tell you, I'm Mt. 

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Is a large part of the reason 
why I left being libertarian, 

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interestingly enough, you know, 
I did a lot of praxeology 

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learning Austrian economics. 
I got my MBA learned basically 

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your standard, you know, the old
classical to neoclassical Adam 

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Smith, you name it on up. 
Type of Economics, hyack Von 

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mises, you know, all the 
standard bearers, if you will. 

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And, you know, I ended up 
pulling back and and, and said 

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something doesn't sound, right? 
Something doesn't sound right? 

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Because every time they say 
they're going to do X or Y. 

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I never see a tax hike to 
coincide with it. 

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Or or if I do see a tax hike, 
it's only seemingly when it 

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might be the benefit people when
it might be some spending 

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towards. 
Birds little guys, all of a 

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sudden they start talking about 
costs and stuff like that. 

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I'm like, doesn't make sense 
this thing over here. 

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This bill that they're trying to
pass. 

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Let's just say it's five hundred
billion dollar bill, but you're 

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going to take me to war for two 
trillion, but we don't even have

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to raise taxes for the two 
trillion dollar War, you're 

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ready to start, but that 500 
billion over there is got your 

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hair in a you know, one end. 
It's something doesn't make 

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sense. 
Right? 

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So, I mean forget with you like 
the villain, I do. 

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It could be anything right? 
It just doesn't make sense. 

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And so, I had a group called 
grumpy finds political Mosh Pit,

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where we had everyone from an 
caps, you know. 

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Solid regular old school 
Libertarians cloth, coat. 

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Republicans, true liberal 
Democrats. 

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Progressives Communists 
socialists, all man, Arcus. 

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You name it hodgepodge. 
Everyone together. 

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Listen, most interesting place 
I've ever been because we all 

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even though we fought like cats 
and dogs. 

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It was a genuine Affinity 
amongst all of us, even though 

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we didn't Agree with pretty much
anything, anybody said but the 

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mmt angle started coming up in 
these discussions and it was in 

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mixed company. 
So I didn't think it could be 

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any illogical and it's not 
ideological write it. 

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What? 
Basically it came down to was 

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Steve. 
Do you know, what a dollar is? 

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I was like, yeah, it's this 
piece of paper right here and 

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there right now. 
No, Steve. 

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You've never seen a dollar. 
I said, what do you mean? 

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He said, dollar is a unit of 
measure like an inch or a pound,

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you've never Seen an inch and 
you've never seen a pound it 

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relative to a unit of measure. 
I said, huh? 

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And they said, that's what the 
dollar is. 

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It's a tax credit and I said hi 
and so little by little I had to

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dig deeper because a lot of what
they're talking about, came from

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things like Abba, Lerner and 
functional finance. 

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And quite frankly. 
It came down to collapse State 

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theory of money and other stuff.
And these are things that are 

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old. 
Old tried-and-true discussion 

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points. 
Many of them are not even really

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controversial. 
I mean, we knew about these 

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things forever. 
I mean even Milton Friedman knew

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about these things forever, you 
know, I mean, they everybody 

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understood these things and 
we've lost a lot of that 

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knowledge, but ultimately money 
is a creature of the state. 

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It's a law, right? 
It's a law. 

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It's forget the piece of paper. 
Forget the gold-backed or not 

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gold-backed or anything else 
backed. 

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It is a tax credit. 
So what? 

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Happens. 
Is that the state when it wants 

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to provision itself? 
Spends this money into the 

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economy. 
Okay, and then the people look 

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at the money and they're like, 
well, I don't need a piece of 

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paper. 
What I'm going to do with this 

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coupon. 
I'm not I don't do anything for 

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me. 
It's to the state says Ah, 

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you're right. 
So we're going to impose the 

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tax, payable only in that 
currency. 

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You can't pay it in Bitcoin. 
It can't pay it. 

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And etherium. 
You can't pay it and chicken 

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necks, sexual favors anything 
else. 

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You can only pay It in that unit
of account and and this goes 

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back centuries, you know to win 
like Caesar and the Gang would 

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say here's this coin, you know, 
and you hear them Render unto 

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Caesar. 
What is Caesar's? 

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Well, the state currency is the 
government's currency and 

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whether they farmed it out to 
the fed or whether they bring it

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back to the treasury, whatever 
you want. 

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It doesn't matter. 
Ultimately. 

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It's a it's a unit of account 
for the federal government to 

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provision itself. 
And so, when you think about it,

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you have Two ways of getting 
money into the economy. 

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One is through Private Bank 
lending or through net Financial

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assets being created by federal 
spending. 

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And so what modern monetary 
Theory does is it takes that 

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thing that happened in 1971? 
When Richard Nixon took us off 

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the Bretton Woods, Accord and 
removed us. 

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From any kind of pegged, 
commodity backed currency to a 

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full free floating Sovereign 
fiat currency, and at that point

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in time, the rules change. 
Aged, but the textbooks didn't 

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change and our understandings of
money didn't change. 

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And so some fundamental thinking
how to take place. 

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Some changes had to take place. 
If you go back to World War 2, 

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we knew this. 
We actually really did know 

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this. 
And what we did was we removed 

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ourselves from the gold standard
so that we could keep up with 

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Germany. 
So we could fight in World War 

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Two and so we could get the 
factories going at 100%. 

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So we could do all these things.
We literally remove the gold 

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standard. 
We could do that. 

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So what happened was every 
Factory in the entire nation was

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running at full capacity. 
I mean, there was nothing else 

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that could be produced but stuff
for the War Machine and I'm very

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anti-war. 
So this is not a sales pitch for

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war. 
This is really more. 

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A statement of this is what 
happened. 

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And so what happened, while 
people still had needs and 

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wants, but there was no 
factories to produce the things 

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that they might need or want 
other than the basics. 

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So the government realizing the 
economy was going to overheat if

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00:10:03,500 --> 00:10:07,300
they didn't do something, 
started selling war bonds. 

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00:10:07,500 --> 00:10:08,900
Well, why do they sell war 
bonds? 

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00:10:08,900 --> 00:10:13,300
Was it to fund the war know 
those bonds merely delayed 

192
00:10:13,300 --> 00:10:15,600
buying power. 
They took money out of the 

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00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:18,400
productive economy. 
Put it into the fire sector, 

194
00:10:18,600 --> 00:10:20,500
pulled it out. 
So you're not making those 

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00:10:20,500 --> 00:10:23,000
spending decisions. 
Now, you're doing it for the old

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00:10:23,000 --> 00:10:25,400
country, doing it, for the red, 
white and blue, all that good 

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00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:27,500
stuff. 
You know, Mom, Bob, apple pie, 

198
00:10:27,700 --> 00:10:31,600
whatever. 
And so this is what they do when

199
00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:35,500
we're trying to fight Wars. 
Imagine what we could do, if we 

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00:10:35,500 --> 00:10:39,600
flip the script and thought 
about rebuilding the nation 

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00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:42,700
rebuilding the infrastructure. 
I mean, think about this DARPA, 

202
00:10:42,700 --> 00:10:45,500
net arpanet, all that stuff 
created the internet that was a 

203
00:10:45,500 --> 00:10:47,900
government plan. 
That was then turned handed over

204
00:10:47,900 --> 00:10:51,700
the private sector and it was 
turned into what it's become 

205
00:10:51,700 --> 00:10:54,600
today. 
But back then, it was done by 

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00:10:54,600 --> 00:10:57,100
public money. 
Not taxpayer dollars, and this 

207
00:10:57,100 --> 00:11:00,400
is what mmt shows. 
Shows us and this is something 

208
00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:03,500
actually as a Libertarian. 
When you know, when I was on the

209
00:11:03,500 --> 00:11:05,800
Ron Paul, you know, ride to 
Freedom. 

210
00:11:05,800 --> 00:11:11,600
So to speak, we knew this we 
understood that taxes were 

211
00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:15,800
basically an inflation hedge. 
We knew that that wasn't really 

212
00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:19,200
paying for anything that the tax
was the problem was that. 

213
00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:21,900
We also thought tax was forced, 
but we didn't realize that the 

214
00:11:21,900 --> 00:11:27,400
money itself derives its value 
if you will, by the price that 

215
00:11:27,400 --> 00:11:31,200
the government sets for Things 
that buys once it buys something

216
00:11:31,200 --> 00:11:34,300
with that first dollar, it 
becomes a monopoly issue or the 

217
00:11:34,300 --> 00:11:36,100
currency becomes the price 
Setter. 

218
00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:39,700
And once it does that, that's 
how the whole economy starts 

219
00:11:39,700 --> 00:11:42,300
from that first dollar spent 
into the economy. 

220
00:11:43,100 --> 00:11:44,800
But what happens when they do 
tax it? 

221
00:11:44,800 --> 00:11:46,900
Well, they've remove money from 
the economy. 

222
00:11:46,900 --> 00:11:50,700
Doesn't go in some piggy bank 
somewhere and get re spent. 

223
00:11:50,700 --> 00:11:53,400
We don't repurpose tax dollars 
or deleted. 

224
00:11:53,400 --> 00:11:55,600
They're functionally deleted 
from the system. 

225
00:11:56,000 --> 00:11:59,000
So if you don't spend money back
into the economy, it's like 

226
00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:01,000
opening up the drain in the 
bathtub. 

227
00:12:01,500 --> 00:12:04,400
You keep tax and all the money's
leaving the economy, but then 

228
00:12:04,400 --> 00:12:06,900
you've got offshoring. 
That's another demand leakage 

229
00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:08,400
that pulls money out of the 
economy. 

230
00:12:08,400 --> 00:12:11,500
And you got the need for savings
that pulls money out of the 

231
00:12:11,500 --> 00:12:15,000
economy and slowly, but surely 
that drain the bath tub of the 

232
00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:18,900
economy is going like this, and 
there's no function in capital 

233
00:12:18,900 --> 00:12:20,800
in the economy. 
So, what ends up happening? 

234
00:12:21,300 --> 00:12:24,100
Remember I said, there's two 
ways you can get money, either 

235
00:12:24,100 --> 00:12:28,400
a, the government spends it into
existence or be you go to a 

236
00:12:28,400 --> 00:12:30,600
private. 
Bankster and you sit there and 

237
00:12:30,600 --> 00:12:35,800
get a loan out for interest. 
And so right now what we've done

238
00:12:35,900 --> 00:12:40,000
as a result of a very successful
Milton Friedman right-wing 

239
00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:44,200
campaign is we have made the 
fear of government spending 

240
00:12:44,500 --> 00:12:46,800
because we're still acting like 
we're on a gold standard where 

241
00:12:46,800 --> 00:12:49,700
it's possible to debase a 
free-floating fiat currency, 

242
00:12:49,700 --> 00:12:52,900
which you can't do by the way, 
but that's the mindset has 

243
00:12:52,900 --> 00:12:56,900
stayed so much that we have 
resisted the federal spending 

244
00:12:57,200 --> 00:12:59,000
and even when we spend a little 
bit, we go. 

245
00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:01,800
Oh my God, they spent money 
reality. 

246
00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:04,500
Is that what we end up doing? 
If we don't do that, is we end 

247
00:13:04,500 --> 00:13:07,000
up pushing everyone to private 
credit and the whole freaking 

248
00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:09,500
economy is blown up by that and 
what happens? 

249
00:13:09,900 --> 00:13:13,700
They start loosening credit 
because you and I only have a 

250
00:13:13,700 --> 00:13:16,400
finite amount of credit that we 
can absorb. 

251
00:13:16,900 --> 00:13:18,600
And then the economy starts 
tapping out. 

252
00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:21,900
When you've maxed out everyone, 
you've overextended them and 

253
00:13:21,900 --> 00:13:25,300
then you start making credit 
even easier to come by and you 

254
00:13:25,300 --> 00:13:28,300
really overextend people that 
are not currency issuers. 

255
00:13:28,700 --> 00:13:32,200
Wolves that really are in a 
state of scarcity. 

256
00:13:32,500 --> 00:13:34,100
And then that's when the economy
goes. 

257
00:13:34,100 --> 00:13:35,800
Boom. 
That's when it really goes 

258
00:13:35,800 --> 00:13:40,400
crashing to the ground. 
And so mmt basically shows us 

259
00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:43,900
the cause and effect. 
We have a lot of examples of the

260
00:13:43,900 --> 00:13:48,000
government doing all the wrong 
things progressives using this 

261
00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:53,300
understanding would seek to 
expand citizen rights citizen 

262
00:13:53,300 --> 00:13:56,300
benefits. 
Not I'm not a neoliberal, so I 

263
00:13:56,300 --> 00:13:58,600
don't look at like identity 
politics. 

264
00:13:58,700 --> 00:14:02,700
Oops, I'm not looking at some 
way of Balkan izing spent. 

265
00:14:02,700 --> 00:14:06,800
I'm talking about even people. 
I hate should get what I think 

266
00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:08,400
everyone should get. 
If you know what I'm saying. 

267
00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:10,800
Like this is not a exclusionary 
thing. 

268
00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:13,400
Not not from my vantage point. 
I look at it as a series of 

269
00:14:13,400 --> 00:14:18,000
rights as opposed to a series of
handouts and rights for all. 

270
00:14:18,300 --> 00:14:22,200
And I think when you operate 
from a rights-based position 

271
00:14:23,100 --> 00:14:26,700
that you allow all to 
participate in the benefits of 

272
00:14:26,700 --> 00:14:28,600
society, and I think that's 
something that you can. 

273
00:14:28,700 --> 00:14:30,800
Lean from an understanding of 
mmt. 

274
00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:32,600
Even though LM T is just 
accounting. 

275
00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:36,200
Basically, once you understand 
that you realize that, hey, it's

276
00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:37,500
not like we're running out of 
money. 

277
00:14:37,500 --> 00:14:41,100
We have as much money as we need
to do what we need to do there. 

278
00:14:41,100 --> 00:14:42,800
It's not coming from your tax 
dollars. 

279
00:14:42,800 --> 00:14:44,200
You don't have to worry about 
that. 

280
00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:47,200
It's really what it is. 
Is a fundamental understanding 

281
00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:50,900
of how a fiat currency works. 
So that's mmt in a nutshell. 

282
00:14:50,900 --> 00:14:53,800
There's a lot more to it. 
But, you know, for just to jump 

283
00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:58,200
in the pool, that's what it is. 
It's commonly understood that if

284
00:14:58,200 --> 00:15:00,800
you Have a monopoly in a certain
sector. 

285
00:15:00,800 --> 00:15:04,200
You'd get higher prices and 
worse quality than you. 

286
00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:06,000
Otherwise, what under free 
competition. 

287
00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:08,600
Why should the state monopolize 
the money supply? 

288
00:15:09,400 --> 00:15:11,500
Well, the state doesn't 
monopolize the money supply. 

289
00:15:11,500 --> 00:15:15,200
It is the money supply. 
Okay, and ultimately, what 

290
00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:17,600
should happen. 
This is, this is, you know, 

291
00:15:17,600 --> 00:15:22,200
fundamentally the way I operate,
the way I view it, the state 

292
00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:26,800
creates the currency, the state,
creates the economy and Essence,

293
00:15:26,900 --> 00:15:29,600
but this is just the US, this is
Everywhere, right? 

294
00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:35,500
This isn't like a phenomenon 
only in the United States and by

295
00:15:35,500 --> 00:15:41,900
having law by having force of 
law, to enforce contracts to 

296
00:15:41,900 --> 00:15:47,900
enforce credit relationships and
such that provides a certain 

297
00:15:47,900 --> 00:15:55,000
amount of security if you will, 
in terms of those exchanges, so 

298
00:15:55,700 --> 00:15:58,500
with the state provisioning 
itself through the public, 

299
00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:02,100
Purse. 
I mean, anybody can create 

300
00:16:02,100 --> 00:16:03,900
money. 
I mean, you see it right now. 

301
00:16:03,900 --> 00:16:06,500
You can create alternative 
currency. 

302
00:16:06,500 --> 00:16:08,300
You can create complementary 
currencies. 

303
00:16:08,300 --> 00:16:11,800
You can, the issue is never a 
question of whether you can do 

304
00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:13,600
it. 
The question is, is anybody 

305
00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:15,600
going to accept it? 
Right? 

306
00:16:15,900 --> 00:16:21,800
So, the imposition of the tax is
what really genuinely forces you

307
00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:24,600
to accept the currency. 
Like if you got to get a 

308
00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:27,800
paycheck. 
They gave you Bitcoin and nobody

309
00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:30,700
would accept Bitcoin. 
You probably wouldn't be too 

310
00:16:30,700 --> 00:16:33,800
keen on accepting Bitcoin. 
Same thing with the dollar. 

311
00:16:33,800 --> 00:16:36,600
If nobody was taking dollars for
payments, anywhere. 

312
00:16:36,900 --> 00:16:39,800
You probably wouldn't be too 
Keen to work a job for dollars 

313
00:16:39,800 --> 00:16:44,000
to get paid in dollars. 
But because that is the currency

314
00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:46,600
and that is what is accepted in 
payment of taxes. 

315
00:16:47,300 --> 00:16:49,900
That's what we take. 
And so even as a Bitcoin, or 

316
00:16:49,900 --> 00:16:54,900
even somebody that would invest 
in some sort of a cryptocurrency

317
00:16:54,900 --> 00:16:58,600
or something, like That 
ultimately stuck at a convert 

318
00:16:58,600 --> 00:17:01,600
that crypto back to dollars to 
pay your taxes. 

319
00:17:01,600 --> 00:17:05,099
It's not like because the point 
of the tax is not to fund the 

320
00:17:05,099 --> 00:17:07,099
government. 
The point of the tax is, to 

321
00:17:07,400 --> 00:17:11,400
maintain that circuit, that 
circuit spend it into existence 

322
00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:14,300
tax it, out of existence. 
Spend it into existence tax and 

323
00:17:14,300 --> 00:17:19,200
out of existence. 
And honestly, I think the where 

324
00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:21,599
we are with the state today and 
this is an important point, and 

325
00:17:21,599 --> 00:17:23,700
I think that Libertarians can 
relate to this. 

326
00:17:24,500 --> 00:17:28,700
The state has been The state is 
no longer representative of 

327
00:17:28,700 --> 00:17:31,100
quote-unquote. 
We, the people it has been 

328
00:17:31,100 --> 00:17:34,900
captured by very, very special 
interests by extremely wealthy 

329
00:17:34,900 --> 00:17:38,900
people by people that maybe 
don't have our best interests at

330
00:17:38,900 --> 00:17:42,100
heart, you know, multinational 
conglomerates. 

331
00:17:42,100 --> 00:17:47,500
You name it far and actors even.
And when we think about, you 

332
00:17:47,508 --> 00:17:50,500
know, freedom and you think 
about the fact that you're being

333
00:17:51,200 --> 00:17:53,600
all the laws and rules and 
everything else that are 

334
00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:58,300
constructed around this? 
Are being tainted By the Light. 

335
00:17:58,300 --> 00:18:02,500
If you will of the special 
interests that over way, almost 

336
00:18:02,500 --> 00:18:05,400
all popular opinion. 
I'm just everything regular 

337
00:18:06,200 --> 00:18:09,100
everyday, Joe's say they want. 
When they raise your hand say, 

338
00:18:09,100 --> 00:18:11,900
yes, I'd like to have that 
doesn't happen. 

339
00:18:12,300 --> 00:18:14,600
But suddenly you'll find. 
Hey, let's go ahead and make it 

340
00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:17,600
harder to file bankruptcy for 
student debt. 

341
00:18:18,100 --> 00:18:21,100
Okay, that sounds like something
everybody voted for, right? 

342
00:18:21,100 --> 00:18:24,600
I mean, that's, it's just insane
the way that this works. 

343
00:18:24,600 --> 00:18:29,900
So, I think that from a, from a 
perspective of a Libertarian, 

344
00:18:29,900 --> 00:18:33,600
You Could See Clearly that the 
state has slipped the plot. 

345
00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:39,500
It's not doing its job. 
It's acting in the interests of 

346
00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:42,000
someone other than the 
individual, someone other than 

347
00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:43,700
the citizen other than the 
voter. 

348
00:18:44,700 --> 00:18:48,300
And I think that that renders it
pretty useless right now. 

349
00:18:48,300 --> 00:18:51,600
And many ways, that that's not a
god breathed. 

350
00:18:51,700 --> 00:18:53,600
It has to be. 
That way though, right? 

351
00:18:53,600 --> 00:18:56,900
That's the thing and I think 
that's where Libertarians and 

352
00:18:56,900 --> 00:19:01,700
guys, like myself would part 
ways because I think that we the

353
00:19:01,700 --> 00:19:05,600
people can create governance 
that works for I think that we 

354
00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:07,800
can come together. 
I think that the government 

355
00:19:07,800 --> 00:19:12,900
should be by the people for the 
people etcetera, but it's 

356
00:19:12,900 --> 00:19:17,800
clearly not. 
So what it should be versus what

357
00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:20,500
it is. 
I think that's, that's the real 

358
00:19:20,500 --> 00:19:23,500
Chasm. 
I think that we all want similar

359
00:19:23,500 --> 00:19:25,300
things. 
I think the one challenge 

360
00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:30,400
probably They would be the role 
of private property and the role

361
00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:37,000
of individuals being able to. 
Do something that would be seen 

362
00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:40,400
deleterious to Society for their
own gain. 

363
00:19:40,900 --> 00:19:45,200
And I think that that is a 
challenge that, you know, as a 

364
00:19:45,208 --> 00:19:47,800
Libertarian. 
Even I said, how does that work?

365
00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:52,400
You know, if I'm at the top of 
the river and my neighbor down 

366
00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:56,000
stream of the river, depends on 
the water that runs through that

367
00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:58,300
River, but that river runs 
through my property and my 

368
00:19:58,300 --> 00:20:02,400
create a dam. 
I've just harm them that they 

369
00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:04,700
bought their house with the 
expectation that that River 

370
00:20:04,700 --> 00:20:07,100
would be there. 
Well, I bought my house with the

371
00:20:07,100 --> 00:20:10,000
expectation do with what my 
property, whatever I want to do.

372
00:20:10,300 --> 00:20:13,500
And so now all of a sudden 
you've got this real serious 

373
00:20:13,700 --> 00:20:17,800
property rights natural 
resources, type debate and 

374
00:20:17,800 --> 00:20:20,000
discussion. 
And I think these are 

375
00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:23,100
fundamental differences that 
progressives and Libertarians 

376
00:20:23,100 --> 00:20:28,100
would probably not agree on. 
Yeah, I think that those 

377
00:20:28,100 --> 00:20:32,200
interests that conflict of it 
can be relatively harmonized, 

378
00:20:32,500 --> 00:20:35,300
and I also think it's a 
shortcoming with the state. 

379
00:20:35,300 --> 00:20:36,700
I want to vote for a certain 
thing. 

380
00:20:36,700 --> 00:20:38,500
You want to vote for the 
opposite. 

381
00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:42,600
Those also have conflicting 
interest here is Thomas soul in 

382
00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:43,900
his book. 
Basic economics. 

383
00:20:43,900 --> 00:20:47,400
He says, in reality, most of the
great Fortunes in American 

384
00:20:47,400 --> 00:20:50,300
history, have resulted from 
someone's figuring out, how to 

385
00:20:50,300 --> 00:20:53,000
reduce costs. 
So as to be able to charge lower

386
00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:56,600
prices and therefore, gain a 
mass market for the product 

387
00:20:56,600 --> 00:20:58,900
Henry, Ford did this with 
automobiles Rockefeller with 

388
00:20:58,900 --> 00:21:02,200
oil? 
With steel and Sears Penny 

389
00:21:02,300 --> 00:21:05,200
Walton and other department. 
Store chain founders, with a 

390
00:21:05,208 --> 00:21:08,100
variety of products. 
He also uses the example of 

391
00:21:08,100 --> 00:21:11,700
Amazon, drastically lowering, 
the cost of books to give people

392
00:21:11,900 --> 00:21:15,800
access to great wisdom. 
They otherwise wouldn't have had

393
00:21:15,800 --> 00:21:19,100
access to. 
So is this approach to making 

394
00:21:19,100 --> 00:21:22,300
poor people wealthier and using 
income Mobility? 

395
00:21:22,500 --> 00:21:25,400
Is this just totally wrong? 
Is there something I'm missing? 

396
00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:32,100
Well in theory, I like the idea 
of of class Mobility being able 

397
00:21:32,100 --> 00:21:35,800
to not be born into a class at 
the bottom would be stuck at the

398
00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:38,500
bottom forever. 
And never be, you know, they 

399
00:21:38,500 --> 00:21:40,200
what was it back in the Middle 
Ages. 

400
00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:44,900
They had those who pray those 
who fight, and those who work, 

401
00:21:45,100 --> 00:21:46,700
you know, that was the three 
classes. 

402
00:21:46,700 --> 00:21:50,300
Really, at the time before the 
merchants became in that fourth 

403
00:21:50,300 --> 00:21:53,700
class. 
I think that, you know, when you

404
00:21:53,708 --> 00:21:57,200
were born into a feudal society 
back in the day, you knew that 

405
00:21:57,200 --> 00:21:59,600
you were not going to suddenly 
become a warrior. 

406
00:22:00,300 --> 00:22:05,600
From being a peasant and that 
kind of never even crept into 

407
00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:08,400
their brains. 
It was odd Farhan for them to 

408
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:10,800
think about being anything but 
what they were. 

409
00:22:11,600 --> 00:22:14,800
So the part of me that still 
holds onto that libertarian 

410
00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:18,000
streak, if you will says hey, I 
would really, you know, it's 

411
00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:20,600
great. 
The problem here is class in 

412
00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:25,900
general, right? 
And so to me at the level of the

413
00:22:25,900 --> 00:22:29,600
way we position this there are a
way to walk and chew gum. 

414
00:22:29,700 --> 00:22:34,300
Gum, okay, and this is where I 
think that the state fails, but 

415
00:22:34,300 --> 00:22:38,400
I think Libertarians have such a
ideological Bend to the 

416
00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:41,400
individual. 
The Ain ran the objectivist 

417
00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:44,700
view, all, that's two, I owe, 
you know, almost got my PhD in 

418
00:22:44,700 --> 00:22:47,900
this stuff and I, as I went 
through it, I just kept thinking

419
00:22:47,900 --> 00:22:52,000
of myself objectivism, really 
fails to understand that. 

420
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:56,000
Just because you did not win the
lottery of genetics, just 

421
00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:59,300
because you did not win the 
lottery of birth doesn't make 

422
00:22:59,300 --> 00:23:04,600
you a Acre and the idea of, you 
know, somebody being born on 

423
00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:08,800
third base and tending, they hit
a triple is a little 

424
00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:12,400
Preposterous. 
So for me, there are ways of 

425
00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:16,300
doing this, especially when you 
understand that the state is, 

426
00:23:16,300 --> 00:23:18,800
whether you like it or not. 
This is like a get it. 

427
00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:21,200
You don't like the state having 
a monopoly on the currency. 

428
00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:22,400
It does. 
Right? 

429
00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:24,300
Okay, I get it. 
Ideologically. 

430
00:23:24,300 --> 00:23:27,900
You don't like that fine. 
But in the real world, it does 

431
00:23:27,900 --> 00:23:32,000
have that Monopoly. 
So with That in mind, the state 

432
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:36,200
allowing us to wait like Tiny, 
Tim tear sir, please sir. 

433
00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:39,200
Please give me some porridge 
sir, you know, oh here are let 

434
00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:42,700
me trickle that down for you. 
That doesn't seem like a very 

435
00:23:43,000 --> 00:23:45,600
good way of distribution in my 
mind. 

436
00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:48,700
Okay, especially when you know 
that the spending comes from the

437
00:23:48,700 --> 00:23:52,100
federal government. 
Now the real resources, the 

438
00:23:52,100 --> 00:23:54,900
natural resources under the 
ground and stuff like that. 

439
00:23:55,300 --> 00:23:59,200
I really believe fundamentally 
that those real resources. 

440
00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:05,500
All of ours, they shouldn't be 
these, This is My Little Rock. 

441
00:24:05,500 --> 00:24:08,700
This is my little pool of water.
This is it that you can't have 

442
00:24:08,700 --> 00:24:11,800
any, right? 
And so fundamentally the 

443
00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:15,800
resources of the nation should 
belong to the nation. 

444
00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:20,200
And when I say that I'm not, I 
don't have time. 

445
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:23,000
I guess to really give you some 
long-winded explanation when I 

446
00:24:23,008 --> 00:24:26,800
mean there other than to say, I 
believe in public land, I 

447
00:24:26,808 --> 00:24:31,700
believe in shared. 
Prosperity, I believe in 

448
00:24:31,700 --> 00:24:36,000
Collective approaches, I 
understand the voluntarist and 

449
00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:40,100
that's the anarchist view as 
well, and Anarchy, and communism

450
00:24:40,500 --> 00:24:42,900
very, very close to one another.
In many ways. 

451
00:24:43,900 --> 00:24:46,000
I would believe that the 
anarchists would want to 

452
00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:48,100
completely do away with the 
state. 

453
00:24:50,300 --> 00:24:54,100
But ultimately, I don't see 
capitalism lifting. 

454
00:24:54,100 --> 00:24:56,300
I think it always lifts a 
certain amount of people, 

455
00:24:56,300 --> 00:24:59,200
depending upon how the ruling 
class. 

456
00:24:59,700 --> 00:25:03,500
Wants to keep the pitchforks at 
Bay so they will release just 

457
00:25:03,500 --> 00:25:05,700
enough money. 
Just enough Services, just 

458
00:25:05,700 --> 00:25:11,300
enough whatever to keep enough. 
People calm that there's never 

459
00:25:11,300 --> 00:25:14,500
enough people hurting but 
there's always enough people 

460
00:25:14,500 --> 00:25:16,800
hurting that we can point to 
them. 

461
00:25:16,800 --> 00:25:19,500
The seats. 
I'm doing pretty good, you know,

462
00:25:19,500 --> 00:25:21,400
and feel good and smug about 
ourselves. 

463
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:24,000
But the truth of the matter is 
is that it's a political 

464
00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:26,700
decision. 
When you know that the state is 

465
00:25:26,700 --> 00:25:29,400
the currency issue and you know 
that the money gets into the 

466
00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:31,500
economy. 
Nanami when the state spends and

467
00:25:31,500 --> 00:25:33,400
we should know, we got to 
tighten, our budgets. 

468
00:25:33,800 --> 00:25:36,500
Does that even mean we're not 
borrowing money when they talk 

469
00:25:36,500 --> 00:25:39,100
about borrowing money to talk 
about the national debt stuff 

470
00:25:39,100 --> 00:25:41,900
like that. 
All the national debt is, is the

471
00:25:41,900 --> 00:25:46,600
sum total of every untaxed 
dollar in the economy. 

472
00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:49,300
And when you understand that 
you're like, wait a minute, hold

473
00:25:49,300 --> 00:25:51,300
on. 
So so we're doing, why are they 

474
00:25:51,300 --> 00:25:53,500
talking about? 
We have to pay all that back. 

475
00:25:54,200 --> 00:25:57,500
That's not how it works at all. 
When China sells goods and 

476
00:25:57,500 --> 00:26:00,300
services into the United States.
They get In u.s. 

477
00:26:00,300 --> 00:26:04,600
Dollars, China has a choice. 
They can take that money and 

478
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:08,500
they can go ahead and just let 
it sit there and do nothing or 

479
00:26:08,900 --> 00:26:12,400
they can go ahead and take that 
money and invest it in US. 

480
00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:17,500
Treasuries, its US dollars that 
they earned in trade and they're

481
00:26:17,500 --> 00:26:19,400
simply handing their own US 
dollars. 

482
00:26:19,400 --> 00:26:22,800
They earned in trade. 
They're buying a savings account

483
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:24,500
with interest on it. 
That's it. 

484
00:26:24,500 --> 00:26:27,100
That's all it is. 
And where does the money come 

485
00:26:27,100 --> 00:26:29,900
from for the interest? 
Well, it comes from Folks from 

486
00:26:29,900 --> 00:26:35,600
us we do this. 
So so much of what Saul talks 

487
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:38,000
about and stuff. 
He's written, is this false 

488
00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:42,200
scarcity narrative and the false
scarcity narrative that he 

489
00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:46,200
Trump's always makes Finance 
always make money, which is the 

490
00:26:46,208 --> 00:26:49,000
one thing that's irrelevant 
really in the grand scheme of 

491
00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:50,800
things. 
It's the easiest thing. 

492
00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:54,900
The hardest thing is the 
resource real resources to put 

493
00:26:54,900 --> 00:26:56,500
against a bill. 
Do we have enough? 

494
00:26:56,500 --> 00:26:57,900
Doctors? 
Do we have enough lawyers? 

495
00:26:57,900 --> 00:27:00,600
Do we have enough teachers? 
Have enough roads. 

496
00:27:00,600 --> 00:27:03,400
Do we have enough? 
Whatever these are the things 

497
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:05,800
like you look at this. 
Pandemic that we just went 

498
00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:08,200
through. 
None of the problems were facing

499
00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:11,900
right now, our monetary 
phenomenon, everything that 

500
00:27:11,900 --> 00:27:14,300
we're facing starts with Supply 
chains. 

501
00:27:14,500 --> 00:27:18,200
Number one, number two, and 
think about the supply, chains 

502
00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:20,800
are all over the world to make 
one iPhone. 

503
00:27:20,900 --> 00:27:25,300
I believe it's like 37 different
countries have different parts 

504
00:27:25,300 --> 00:27:28,800
to that. 
So naturally, if you've got one 

505
00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:31,900
country, that's Shut down 
because of covid or whatever. 

506
00:27:31,900 --> 00:27:35,500
The hell reason, they're 
shutting them down, right at one

507
00:27:35,500 --> 00:27:39,000
part that you were, make it in 
whatever country and now you 

508
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:42,000
can't make your iPhone. 
Look at the semiconductor 

509
00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:45,300
shortage over the entire time. 
I mean, sorry. 

510
00:27:45,300 --> 00:27:48,000
Kids that like PlayStation five.
The reason your PlayStation 

511
00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:50,600
fives aren't out there because 
there's a huge semiconductor 

512
00:27:50,600 --> 00:27:52,300
shortage. 
You think that was because there

513
00:27:52,300 --> 00:27:55,600
wasn't enough money in the 
economy, know, the supply chains

514
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:58,500
broke down, had nothing to do it
money, you know what I mean? 

515
00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:04,200
And so What happens when you're 
a good smart Savvy, rich guy at 

516
00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:08,400
the top that runs, one of these 
Mega corporations is, when you 

517
00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:12,800
have an opportunity to behave 
monopolistic, you can gouge. 

518
00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:14,600
And that's what you're seeing 
with the Saudis with the 

519
00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:16,700
gasoline. 
That's what you're seeing with a

520
00:28:16,708 --> 00:28:19,000
lot of folks out there. 
They've got a moment, they're 

521
00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:22,200
going to gouge and so you see a 
little bit of inflation right 

522
00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:25,500
now, as a result of the supply 
chains breaking down and the 

523
00:28:25,500 --> 00:28:28,900
gouging, but the average person 
get a lot of money. 

524
00:28:28,900 --> 00:28:30,900
In fact, I'm Mean, you couldn't 
even get the Biden 

525
00:28:30,900 --> 00:28:34,100
Administration to give, pandemic
relief checks. 

526
00:28:34,100 --> 00:28:38,300
And we forget anything idiot 
logical for just a second. 

527
00:28:38,700 --> 00:28:41,700
For all the talk of the Biden 
Administration, being left the 

528
00:28:41,700 --> 00:28:44,000
organization, which is not at 
all. 

529
00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:47,600
By the way. 
They didn't give a shit. 

530
00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:49,500
They didn't give people shit. 
They didn't give them hardly 

531
00:28:49,500 --> 00:28:52,200
anything to survive under the 
conditions they were in. 

532
00:28:52,800 --> 00:28:56,000
And so, when you think about 
that, it's like well, so it 

533
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:59,300
couldn't have been that people 
themselves are buying so much 

534
00:28:59,300 --> 00:29:01,400
stuff. 
It's causing inflation. 

535
00:29:02,300 --> 00:29:05,100
That doesn't make sense. 
I mean, you go to Walmart of all

536
00:29:05,100 --> 00:29:07,300
places. 
Got one of the best just-in-time

537
00:29:07,300 --> 00:29:11,300
inventory systems in the world. 
Okay, these guys have, I mean, 

538
00:29:11,300 --> 00:29:15,200
this is so airtight there, a 
case study in Harvard, you know,

539
00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:16,700
you go to Harvard Business 
School. 

540
00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:19,900
You're going to get a Walmart 
Supply Chain management. 

541
00:29:19,900 --> 00:29:22,000
Course, you're going to have a 
white paper on there. 

542
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:24,300
Just in time inventory. 
It's that good. 

543
00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:28,100
But yet during this time, you go
into Walmart and the shelves are

544
00:29:28,100 --> 00:29:29,500
empty. 
Why are they in? 

545
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:31,400
Empty, it's not because people 
are just buying. 

546
00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:35,100
Everything is because the supply
chains broke down because people

547
00:29:35,100 --> 00:29:38,000
are locked down etcetera. 
Well, takes a lot to get an 

548
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:41,800
economy back on its feet. 
You got to put air in that tire 

549
00:29:41,900 --> 00:29:44,400
and it's one of those tires that
the beads slip. 

550
00:29:44,400 --> 00:29:47,400
So you've got to trap it down, 
to keep the air in the tire 

551
00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:50,000
while you're pumping. 
Okay, and that's that's what's 

552
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:53,200
happening here. 
So between gouging and stuff 

553
00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:54,500
like that, but instead, what do 
you hear? 

554
00:29:54,500 --> 00:29:56,600
Every paper? 
You read every paper. 

555
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:01,000
Oh, we printed too much money. 
We debase the currency. 

556
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:05,400
So, therefore inflation. 
It's that kind of stupid kind of

557
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:09,000
commentary that like, like, 
again, take away any of the 

558
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:12,000
illogical Bend at all. 
It's just empirical. 

559
00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:14,900
It's really not the printing of 
money that did anything. 

560
00:30:14,900 --> 00:30:18,800
Because most of that money got 
spent at the top, most that 

561
00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:19,900
might end. 
What do people at the top? 

562
00:30:19,900 --> 00:30:22,900
Do with money when they get the 
kind of money he invested. 

563
00:30:22,900 --> 00:30:24,100
And what do they do in 
investment? 

564
00:30:24,100 --> 00:30:27,000
Just swirls around and Wall 
Street, maybe it goes out in The

565
00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:30,700
crypto space Etc. 
Sometimes you have an Elon Musk 

566
00:30:30,700 --> 00:30:32,100
that will go out there and do 
something. 

567
00:30:32,100 --> 00:30:35,500
But I don't know if you noticed 
this or not Elon Musk got four 

568
00:30:35,500 --> 00:30:39,800
point nine billion dollars in 
federal subsidies for point, 

569
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:43,300
nine billion dollars from the 
government for subsidies to do 

570
00:30:43,300 --> 00:30:44,000
this. 
You know. 

571
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:46,700
Hey, that's a public-private 
partnership. 

572
00:30:46,700 --> 00:30:49,700
That's a Libertarian wet dream. 
That's a, you know, that's the 

573
00:30:49,700 --> 00:30:54,600
whole, you know, great man 
Theory, right? 

574
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:59,500
So I think ultimately, Only if 
you want to see like 

575
00:30:59,500 --> 00:31:03,400
demand-driven, money-driven 
inflation, you have to spend it 

576
00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:05,800
on everybody. 
And all of a sudden, the 

577
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:09,300
aggregate demand of all those 
people that have pent up demand 

578
00:31:09,300 --> 00:31:11,600
that were not able to execute 
that demand. 

579
00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:14,700
Now, all of a sudden they have 
means to execute that demand. 

580
00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:19,100
If the supply chains didn't keep
up with that new demand and the 

581
00:31:19,100 --> 00:31:22,600
access to new demand, then 
you're going to have inflation 

582
00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:26,300
and this is what happened in 
places like by Marv, Germany. 

583
00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:29,600
We're, which is one of the 
favorite ones that gets thrown 

584
00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:32,100
out there. 
I mean, you had the Treaty of 

585
00:31:32,100 --> 00:31:35,000
Versailles where you had a 
cruel. 

586
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:38,800
Very, very cruel sanctions. 
Put on the Germans, at the time.

587
00:31:39,400 --> 00:31:42,700
They had foreign debt 
denominated in French francs. 

588
00:31:43,300 --> 00:31:47,400
Their entire industrial sector 
was shut down because the guys 

589
00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:49,600
went on strike as a way of 
saying, hey, we're not, we're 

590
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:52,600
not doing this. 
So all of a sudden, Supply 

591
00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:57,500
chains, foreign debt payable, 
only in You know, the other 

592
00:31:57,500 --> 00:32:03,300
currency and then add into the 
fact that the depression from 

593
00:32:03,300 --> 00:32:05,700
the war and everything else. 
All the destruction from the 

594
00:32:05,700 --> 00:32:08,900
war. 
The printing of money happened. 

595
00:32:09,400 --> 00:32:13,000
Way after the hyperinflation 
occurred, get to the next 

596
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:14,800
favorite one, which is symbolic 
of way. 

597
00:32:15,100 --> 00:32:17,100
Everybody loves to talk about in
Zimbabwe. 

598
00:32:17,100 --> 00:32:19,800
Right? 
So Zimbabwe what happened there?

599
00:32:20,100 --> 00:32:24,800
Well mcgaubey, he went ahead and
took all of the Farmland away 

600
00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:28,400
from the white colonizers gave 
it to his indigenous. 

601
00:32:28,400 --> 00:32:33,500
People, the white colonizers for
all the, you know, complaints 

602
00:32:33,500 --> 00:32:36,900
actually knew how to farm. 
Susan, Bob way had food. 

603
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:40,500
Sovereignty at the time even 
though that people had been 

604
00:32:40,500 --> 00:32:42,600
colonized and didn't have their 
land. 

605
00:32:43,100 --> 00:32:48,100
We had two problems there. 
Well, when the white Farmers 

606
00:32:48,100 --> 00:32:53,400
left, they set the fields of 
fire and the black Farmers, the 

607
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:55,200
indigenous. 
They did not know how to farm as

608
00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:56,600
well. 
They did not have years of 

609
00:32:56,600 --> 00:32:59,200
experience doing this. 
So they lost their food 

610
00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:03,100
sovereignty. 
Now, all of a sudden to get a 

611
00:33:03,300 --> 00:33:06,000
era corn, you had to pay through
the nose. 

612
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:07,900
No money was printed. 
This wouldn't have anything to 

613
00:33:07,900 --> 00:33:11,900
do with printing money. 
It was 100% a supply chain 

614
00:33:11,900 --> 00:33:15,400
driven thing, could end of 
Venezuela, same thing. 

615
00:33:15,900 --> 00:33:19,100
You have a situation where 
you've got a single export and 

616
00:33:19,100 --> 00:33:23,400
oil and it's only crude. 
We're not talking about refined.

617
00:33:23,700 --> 00:33:26,800
So they would have to sell their
crude on a market where the 

618
00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:29,600
Saudis can cut the bottom out of
the market, really? 

619
00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:31,800
Really screw them up. 
Drop the price out of 

620
00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:34,100
everything. 
Cripple them, because again, 

621
00:33:34,100 --> 00:33:37,500
single export commodity driven 
economy. 

622
00:33:38,300 --> 00:33:42,100
And then worse, the Knuckleheads
had their currency pegged to the

623
00:33:42,108 --> 00:33:44,600
u.s. 
Dollar as soon a chole that 

624
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:46,900
leaves them. 
Some Aspect with US Dollars 

625
00:33:46,900 --> 00:33:50,000
where the US government can do, 
what it does, the CIA and all 

626
00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:53,500
the other and say nose over. 
There are go ahead and do what 

627
00:33:53,500 --> 00:33:58,300
they do, which is of course pull
a coup mess with their finances 

628
00:33:58,500 --> 00:34:01,000
screw around with their access 
to their own currency. 

629
00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:04,800
You name it and Corruption CIA 
meddling. 

630
00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:08,300
And the fact that they only 
created crude, which got the 

631
00:34:08,308 --> 00:34:12,500
bottom dropped, out of it, left 
them in a very, very, very bad 

632
00:34:12,500 --> 00:34:15,100
place. 
None of which had anything to do

633
00:34:15,199 --> 00:34:20,500
once again, With printing money,
so, mmt exposes these things. 

634
00:34:20,500 --> 00:34:23,800
But they're also very big 
questions about understanding 

635
00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:28,100
how State currencies work, and 
why your description from Seoul 

636
00:34:28,300 --> 00:34:32,400
and the whole idea of capitalism
raises the poor up and so forth.

637
00:34:32,900 --> 00:34:34,500
It depends, right? 
It does. 

638
00:34:34,900 --> 00:34:37,300
There was a time when we were 
first starting out when 

639
00:34:37,300 --> 00:34:41,000
Innovation was King and we were 
wild wild west. 

640
00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:42,800
Well, we aren't Wild, Wild West 
anymore. 

641
00:34:43,100 --> 00:34:45,400
You can't just walk down the 
street and plant. 

642
00:34:45,699 --> 00:34:47,000
A garden in the woods. 
Why? 

643
00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:48,600
Because somebody's private 
property. 

644
00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:50,300
They'll shoot, you get off my 
land. 

645
00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:52,699
Here's my castle doctrine, get 
off my land. 

646
00:34:53,300 --> 00:34:57,600
So now we're in a situation 
where the lands are either a 

647
00:34:57,700 --> 00:35:02,400
protected or be owned and the 
ability to just go out there and

648
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:05,600
strike out like, you know, the 
old days the settlers and all 

649
00:35:05,600 --> 00:35:07,300
the problems that came with that
too. 

650
00:35:07,900 --> 00:35:09,800
It just doesn't exist like that 
anymore. 

651
00:35:10,500 --> 00:35:14,900
So I think ultimately soul is 
living in a theory land. 

652
00:35:14,900 --> 00:35:18,700
That doesn't Exist anymore. 
I appreciate the thought because

653
00:35:18,900 --> 00:35:20,900
that's where I came from. 
To my entire life. 

654
00:35:20,900 --> 00:35:23,800
I spend on the right and as a 
Libertarian for like 6 years, 

655
00:35:23,800 --> 00:35:26,900
like I said, but it just doesn't
pass muster. 

656
00:35:26,900 --> 00:35:30,300
Once you understand how the the 
economy really truly works. 

657
00:35:30,300 --> 00:35:34,800
It's still only benefits that 
very small amount and one final 

658
00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:37,100
thing. 
You look at the United States 

659
00:35:37,100 --> 00:35:38,900
government. 
You look at the World Trade 

660
00:35:38,900 --> 00:35:42,600
Organization in a, look at the 
IMF and what they do is they 

661
00:35:42,600 --> 00:35:48,100
impose Insane rules and 
restrictions on the global 

662
00:35:48,100 --> 00:35:51,300
South. 
So if Global South Country needs

663
00:35:51,300 --> 00:35:55,200
to borrow money, they have to 
agree to a whole series of 

664
00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:58,900
structural adjustments. 
They have to allow full access 

665
00:35:58,900 --> 00:36:01,100
to everything. 
They can't protect any of their 

666
00:36:01,100 --> 00:36:03,500
own products. 
They can't subsidize their 

667
00:36:03,500 --> 00:36:05,500
products. 
In the mind you, these countries

668
00:36:05,500 --> 00:36:11,300
are been hijacked and literally 
that just vacuumed, you know, 

669
00:36:11,300 --> 00:36:16,200
freaking vampire by. 
North kind of Corporations, 

670
00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:20,300
literally taking and seizing 
their real resources in their 

671
00:36:20,300 --> 00:36:24,600
country X, you know, extracting 
that and then trying to sell it 

672
00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:28,700
back to them refined and and the
rules and conditions for that 

673
00:36:28,700 --> 00:36:32,800
are so oppressive that these 
countries have to make a choice.

674
00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:35,400
Do we say screw paying our debts
back? 

675
00:36:36,500 --> 00:36:39,100
And they had to sign off that. 
There's no chance of bankruptcy.

676
00:36:39,100 --> 00:36:41,200
By the way. 
There's only extract say, send 

677
00:36:41,200 --> 00:36:44,500
the vultures in to pick apart 
these countries down south now. 

678
00:36:45,500 --> 00:36:48,400
So, when you think about that 
and understand that that extract

679
00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:51,400
of behavior, is how the, you 
know, the high price of low 

680
00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:55,100
costs, you know, the high cost 
of low prices or something like 

681
00:36:55,100 --> 00:36:57,200
that. 
That's how that happens. 

682
00:36:57,400 --> 00:37:00,200
And that's why that 
export-import, you know, 

683
00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:05,200
Paradigm these companies, get 
down there, you know, and they 

684
00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:09,800
extract for pennies on the 
dollar and then they come up 

685
00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:12,300
here and then they sell it for 
five hundred percent, six 

686
00:37:12,300 --> 00:37:14,700
hundred a thousand, ten thousand
percent. 

687
00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:19,100
Prophet and yeah, I don't know 
that that really helps the poor 

688
00:37:19,100 --> 00:37:21,300
I guess in this country. 
But if you look weather down 

689
00:37:21,300 --> 00:37:27,200
south, didn't help them. 
And we're literally destroying 

690
00:37:27,300 --> 00:37:29,900
half of the world. 
Three quarters of the world for 

691
00:37:29,900 --> 00:37:32,900
the benefit of a very, very 
small amount of people. 

692
00:37:33,300 --> 00:37:35,700
So, I would disagree with Thomas
soul on that. 

693
00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:41,100
The main issue I see, with this 
considering, I would totally 

694
00:37:41,100 --> 00:37:44,300
agree. 
Mmt is basically an accounting 

695
00:37:44,300 --> 00:37:46,200
Theory. 
I think it's really brought us 

696
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:50,300
some insight to the table of how
money works and operates. 

697
00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:53,400
But my whole concept is for the 
same reason. 

698
00:37:53,400 --> 00:37:57,100
I could see you opposing the 
Catholic Church having a 

699
00:37:57,100 --> 00:38:00,600
monopoly on taxation within a 
large geographical area. 

700
00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:03,300
If you can see how private 
property, empowers a few people.

701
00:38:03,500 --> 00:38:08,300
Well, a few people having a say 
on how governments run things 

702
00:38:08,300 --> 00:38:11,400
that certainly gives that 
creates a power imbalance. 

703
00:38:11,500 --> 00:38:16,700
So just as now you can say well,
That is something ideological 

704
00:38:16,700 --> 00:38:19,200
the state exists. 
I have my problems, but I need 

705
00:38:19,200 --> 00:38:22,500
to live in reality. 
I do admire how the left will 

706
00:38:22,500 --> 00:38:23,600
say. 
Yeah. 

707
00:38:23,700 --> 00:38:27,500
God is something that a lot of 
people believe in, but I still 

708
00:38:27,500 --> 00:38:31,000
think atheism is correct, or 
they'll say yeah, racism's out 

709
00:38:31,000 --> 00:38:32,900
there and I don't care how 
popular it is. 

710
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:36,200
Racism is a moral. 
Sexism is a moral homophobia, is

711
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:40,200
a moral colonialism is immoral. 
I don't care how many people say

712
00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:42,100
it. 
I don't care how powerful they 

713
00:38:42,100 --> 00:38:44,100
are. 
I will stand up against Henry 

714
00:38:44,100 --> 00:38:47,100
Kissinger. 
And Richard Nixon and protest, 

715
00:38:47,100 --> 00:38:52,400
this goddamn War if it kills me.
So by that same token, all I'm 

716
00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:55,600
really saying is my standards 
for the Catholic church and 

717
00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:59,100
Amazon and the Koch brothers and
real Progressive dot org and the

718
00:38:59,100 --> 00:39:00,200
Red Cross. 
And the government. 

719
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:02,300
I just don't have any double 
standard. 

720
00:39:02,300 --> 00:39:06,800
At the point of disagreement is 
saying this group can rack up 23

721
00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:11,000
trillion dollars in tax credits 
by issuing them out and no other

722
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:13,900
group has that right? 
Do you at least see where I'm 

723
00:39:13,900 --> 00:39:19,000
coming from? 
Oh, I'm okay, so I'm not here to

724
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:22,200
tell you. 
That reform is not possible and 

725
00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:24,800
I'm not here to tell you that, I
don't support reform. 

726
00:39:24,900 --> 00:39:29,000
Okay, what I'm here to tell you 
is that, I do believe that we 

727
00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:34,400
need to democratize the way that
money gets into the economy. 

728
00:39:34,500 --> 00:39:38,600
I see democratize not purse, 
privatized but democratize. 

729
00:39:39,900 --> 00:39:42,900
And, you know, I think what are 
the things I think is really 

730
00:39:42,900 --> 00:39:47,300
interesting right now. 
I understand your take I do and 

731
00:39:47,300 --> 00:39:53,200
I That's there are people in 
left spaces that have those same

732
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:56,500
beliefs as well. 
Okay, so it's not like a 

733
00:39:56,500 --> 00:40:01,500
uniquely libertarian position. 
It is a Libertarian position 

734
00:40:01,500 --> 00:40:05,900
though, right? 
And so with that in mind, I 

735
00:40:05,908 --> 00:40:10,400
think it really comes down to 
Simply participating. 

736
00:40:11,600 --> 00:40:14,000
I'm gonna I'm sorry. 
I hate to rewind myself here. 

737
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:16,800
But I want to make a point. 
The left does this just as much 

738
00:40:16,800 --> 00:40:20,700
as the Libertarians do where 
they check out basically of the 

739
00:40:20,700 --> 00:40:24,000
productive system and say I'm 
not going to participate in 

740
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:26,000
this. 
I'm only going to focus on this 

741
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:30,000
thing that I'd like it to be 
instead, right? 

742
00:40:30,000 --> 00:40:34,400
And it becomes kind of a I'm not
that's too icky. 

743
00:40:34,500 --> 00:40:37,700
For me, I'm not willing to even 
talk about it. 

744
00:40:37,700 --> 00:40:41,100
I'm not willing to even 
acknowledge it and, and the 

745
00:40:41,100 --> 00:40:45,900
left, we have a lot of marxist 
and socialists, and I consider 

746
00:40:45,900 --> 00:40:49,000
myself a socialist, of some 
variety. 

747
00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:50,900
Whatever. 
That means to others. 

748
00:40:50,900 --> 00:40:54,700
I don't know. 
I I consider myself to be a mmt,

749
00:40:54,700 --> 00:40:58,600
informed leftist. 
I don't know what that means. 

750
00:40:58,600 --> 00:41:00,100
I mean, there's no book out 
there. 

751
00:41:00,100 --> 00:41:04,400
That describes it, it probably 
strays. 

752
00:41:04,600 --> 00:41:11,300
Into a more Collective theories 
of power dynamics, and more 

753
00:41:11,300 --> 00:41:17,200
understanding of Labor and 
owning the means of your own 

754
00:41:17,300 --> 00:41:20,500
labor, to the extent that that 
is true. 

755
00:41:20,500 --> 00:41:23,600
I would imagine Libertarians 
would support some of that as 

756
00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:25,300
well. 
You know, I mean, it seems like 

757
00:41:25,300 --> 00:41:29,400
there's a there is a individual 
Dynamic there through the 

758
00:41:29,400 --> 00:41:34,600
collective. 
But as far as the state Ate 

759
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:37,100
itself having that Monopoly 
power. 

760
00:41:38,100 --> 00:41:40,800
We had we used to have competing
currencies. 

761
00:41:41,100 --> 00:41:45,500
There was lots of them and the 
Federal Reserve for all its 

762
00:41:45,500 --> 00:41:47,100
warts. 
And everybody's, you know, the 

763
00:41:47,100 --> 00:41:50,200
conspiracy theories from 
Creature, From Jekyll Island, 

764
00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:52,500
the Rothschilds, and all the 
other stuff. 

765
00:41:52,500 --> 00:41:57,300
You know, I used to be, you go 
to bank a and to be like, hey, 

766
00:41:57,300 --> 00:41:59,900
give you a billy bucks. 
You got a bank, be the give you 

767
00:41:59,900 --> 00:42:03,900
Joey bucks and you sit there and
go to excuse, like, almost like 

768
00:42:03,900 --> 00:42:06,800
a foreign exchange. 
Change in the US and you go in 

769
00:42:06,800 --> 00:42:09,300
there and somebody's thumb 
sitting there on the, on the 

770
00:42:09,300 --> 00:42:11,600
scale. 
Yeah, I'll just kind of crazy 

771
00:42:11,600 --> 00:42:14,100
nonsense. 
It was very, very wild. 

772
00:42:14,100 --> 00:42:18,400
Wild Westy. 
And what the Federal Reserve did

773
00:42:18,700 --> 00:42:22,400
was provide a common framework 
for clearing payments. 

774
00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:25,600
The Federal Reserve is really a 
boring place. 

775
00:42:25,700 --> 00:42:29,600
It's not as exciting as we've 
made it out to be and so the 

776
00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:31,500
farm. 
I don't know if you're familiar 

777
00:42:31,500 --> 00:42:35,600
with like telephony or anything 
like that, but In data networks 

778
00:42:35,600 --> 00:42:36,900
and telephony and stuff like 
that. 

779
00:42:36,900 --> 00:42:40,000
There is what we call a DeMark. 
There's an Ingress, and there's 

780
00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:44,300
an egress and and the Federal 
Reserve kind of represents that 

781
00:42:44,300 --> 00:42:48,300
Ingress and the egress between 
the public and the private, the 

782
00:42:48,300 --> 00:42:51,600
public doesn't need money. 
Because the public itself 

783
00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:53,700
creates money. 
It's the Wellspring for, which 

784
00:42:53,700 --> 00:42:57,600
money is generated from the 
private sectors, where that 

785
00:42:57,600 --> 00:43:00,700
money works and if there's not 
enough money in the economy than

786
00:43:00,700 --> 00:43:03,200
it'll go belly-up and that's 
when you end up with all the 

787
00:43:03,200 --> 00:43:06,600
private debt. 
And when I went through that, so

788
00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:10,400
I think at the end of the day, 
just recognizing that there is 

789
00:43:10,400 --> 00:43:17,200
room to democratize currency to 
spread that out to the edges to 

790
00:43:17,200 --> 00:43:19,900
provide some room to the States.
Because right now, Article 1 

791
00:43:19,900 --> 00:43:24,300
Section 8 gives the power of the
purse to Congress and if you 

792
00:43:24,300 --> 00:43:28,800
look people talk about public 
Banks and creating public Banks 

793
00:43:28,800 --> 00:43:32,200
and so forth. 
Well, Banks themselves regular 

794
00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:36,100
Banks today, all had to get A 
charter from the federal 

795
00:43:36,100 --> 00:43:41,500
government to operate however, 
because of deregulation, private

796
00:43:41,500 --> 00:43:44,100
interests have taken over in the
banking industry. 

797
00:43:44,300 --> 00:43:48,000
Now you got used to re happening
in insane ways. 

798
00:43:48,900 --> 00:43:53,800
This is one of the real painful 
factors of a guy like me, who 

799
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:59,200
talks mmt because you watch and 
you say, I see this in practice.

800
00:43:59,700 --> 00:44:01,600
This is what it looks like in 
practice. 

801
00:44:02,200 --> 00:44:05,100
It looks like that in practice 
because fundamentally Lee Banks 

802
00:44:05,100 --> 00:44:08,200
have been deregulated to the 
point where they can do a lot of

803
00:44:08,207 --> 00:44:10,000
things. 
They used to not be able to do 

804
00:44:10,600 --> 00:44:14,000
you go back to Ferdinand pakora 
when he took on Wall Street in 

805
00:44:14,000 --> 00:44:18,600
the Great Depression and fern a 
Cora routed out, all those 

806
00:44:18,600 --> 00:44:21,700
private interests, all those 
backdoor deals, all that 

807
00:44:21,700 --> 00:44:25,400
nefarious behavior. 
And that's how we got some of 

808
00:44:25,400 --> 00:44:30,200
the most calming Bank moments in
history, this security exchange 

809
00:44:30,200 --> 00:44:35,000
act and also having the Oh my 
goodness. 

810
00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:39,800
How am I going to screw this up?
Our favorite glass-steagall Act,

811
00:44:39,900 --> 00:44:41,700
Right? 
The kind of divided investment 

812
00:44:41,700 --> 00:44:48,500
Banks from Savings and Loans. 
And so, when Bill Clinton signed

813
00:44:48,500 --> 00:44:53,300
the paper that allowed us to get
rid of glass-steagall and 

814
00:44:53,300 --> 00:44:57,200
append, the Sandy, while the 
Wall Street goon that right 

815
00:44:57,200 --> 00:45:02,100
there, functionally created that
the conditions that set forth 

816
00:45:02,100 --> 00:45:07,200
the great financial crisis of 89
that right there set the stage 

817
00:45:07,200 --> 00:45:10,200
for all the cdos and all the bad
Investments. 

818
00:45:10,200 --> 00:45:15,800
All those synthetic, you know, 
bundles those bonds is D rated 

819
00:45:15,800 --> 00:45:19,200
bonds that they would go out 
there and say a rated, right? 

820
00:45:19,200 --> 00:45:23,300
I mean that is the kind of stuff
that creates that space that 

821
00:45:23,300 --> 00:45:26,400
you're worried about that you 
we're both talking. 

822
00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:28,900
We're talking about the same 
problem story, but we're not 

823
00:45:28,900 --> 00:45:31,900
coming up with the same solution
and I think part of the problem 

824
00:45:31,900 --> 00:45:36,100
here, is that when you look, 
Ivett interest profit motives, 

825
00:45:36,500 --> 00:45:40,200
create these perverse 
incentives, all these 

826
00:45:40,400 --> 00:45:43,000
deregulation high-speed 
transactions. 

827
00:45:43,100 --> 00:45:47,100
These are three recipes for 
fraud for Elite control fraud 

828
00:45:47,300 --> 00:45:51,100
and Bill black one of the 
leading Minds in banking and 

829
00:45:51,100 --> 00:45:55,000
auditing and criminology wrote a
book called. 

830
00:45:55,000 --> 00:45:57,800
The best way to rob a bank is to
own one. 

831
00:45:58,800 --> 00:46:02,600
And he goes to great detail to 
show how this happened. 

832
00:46:03,100 --> 00:46:07,300
So when you think about 
privatization of money, you 

833
00:46:07,300 --> 00:46:11,800
think about all this kind of 
spreading it out to the edges. 

834
00:46:11,800 --> 00:46:16,200
You got to have an apparatus 
that can enforce regulation 

835
00:46:16,700 --> 00:46:19,600
without regulation. 
And and I know this is a another

836
00:46:19,600 --> 00:46:22,900
bone of contention between 
Libertarians and and left this, 

837
00:46:23,200 --> 00:46:26,300
but if you think about it 
regulations, provide a 

838
00:46:26,300 --> 00:46:28,000
framework, they provide the 
rules. 

839
00:46:28,100 --> 00:46:32,800
Is that people can predict and 
can can count on and when those 

840
00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:36,000
rules are not upheld and when 
those enforcement's are not made

841
00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:40,200
and there is no real meaningful 
teeth to the regulation. 

842
00:46:40,800 --> 00:46:43,400
You have a law that says X. 
And you have an execution that 

843
00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:47,000
says, why you end up with these 
bubbles, you end up with these 

844
00:46:47,000 --> 00:46:51,300
bursts and you end up with these
rich guys, who already pocketed 

845
00:46:51,300 --> 00:46:54,900
off of the stuff riding off into
the sunset while they leave all 

846
00:46:54,900 --> 00:46:57,100
the other folks there to suffer 
and die. 

847
00:46:57,600 --> 00:47:01,400
And I That that's what you saw 
in the great financial crisis. 

848
00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:05,700
And I think you could see that 
happen again here soon to, with 

849
00:47:05,700 --> 00:47:09,000
BlackRock buying up so many 
properties in the United States 

850
00:47:09,400 --> 00:47:11,600
and us becoming the renter 
Nation. 

851
00:47:12,100 --> 00:47:17,500
I think that we have real 
serious Crisis, coming up here, 

852
00:47:17,500 --> 00:47:21,700
very, very soon. 
Slight, segue. 

853
00:47:21,700 --> 00:47:26,600
Let me ask you. 
Do you have any Appetite for 

854
00:47:26,600 --> 00:47:27,500
Georgia's. 
Mmm. 

855
00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:32,600
No, that that again has the same
problem that? 

856
00:47:32,800 --> 00:47:35,800
Well, you know what, the land 
itself. 

857
00:47:35,800 --> 00:47:37,100
You don't own. 
Therefore. 

858
00:47:37,100 --> 00:47:40,500
It's Justified to tax that. 
Does anyone have the right to 

859
00:47:40,500 --> 00:47:42,000
justify. 
It can real progressives 

860
00:47:42,000 --> 00:47:44,500
dot-org, do it. 
Well, if they can't do it, how 

861
00:47:44,500 --> 00:47:47,300
can they elect? 
Kyrsten Sinema, or Joe manchin 

862
00:47:47,400 --> 00:47:50,300
to do it on their behalf of 
again, George's and has a double

863
00:47:50,300 --> 00:47:52,600
standard for one group of 
people. 

864
00:47:53,200 --> 00:47:55,700
So that is why I have no such 
appetite. 

865
00:47:56,300 --> 00:47:58,200
Well, I look at the land value 
tax. 

866
00:47:58,600 --> 00:48:02,200
Single tax as a potential way of
providing. 

867
00:48:02,600 --> 00:48:07,800
So when money, when money pulls 
and it kind of has that natural 

868
00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:10,900
helium effect, where it just 
pulls up here, and then never 

869
00:48:10,900 --> 00:48:14,400
makes it back down to the 
productive economy by putting a 

870
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:16,900
land value tax in there. 
It stops the squatting. 

871
00:48:17,500 --> 00:48:22,300
It stops the allowing businesses
and buildings to be run down and

872
00:48:22,300 --> 00:48:26,300
it stops. 
The Ron ta, you know, kind of 

873
00:48:26,300 --> 00:48:29,100
gouging and usury. 
Type Behavior. 

874
00:48:29,500 --> 00:48:35,300
So the idea of a land value tax 
is somewhat appealing to me. 

875
00:48:35,300 --> 00:48:40,800
Although you won't see many mm 
tears saying, this but George 

876
00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:43,200
is. 
MM, comes from a Libertarian 

877
00:48:43,300 --> 00:48:46,900
kind of background, you know, 
it's a strain of libertarianism 

878
00:48:47,700 --> 00:48:49,600
that I think has some Merit 
here. 

879
00:48:50,500 --> 00:48:54,000
I think that's it. 
I think it's a pathway to 

880
00:48:54,000 --> 00:48:58,200
Bringing people together people 
that are otherwise very 

881
00:48:58,300 --> 00:49:01,100
Connected. 
And so in the grand scheme of 

882
00:49:01,100 --> 00:49:05,100
things knowing that you are, I 
mean, I know your type and I 

883
00:49:05,100 --> 00:49:06,100
don't mean this in a negative 
way. 

884
00:49:06,100 --> 00:49:08,900
I mean, I have a lot of friends 
that have that very similar, 

885
00:49:09,400 --> 00:49:12,200
kind of like the nap is, is God 
in. 

886
00:49:12,200 --> 00:49:15,800
This is this is I can't D. 
This is very important to me. 

887
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:19,300
This is do not pass, go do not 
collect 200, if you violate this

888
00:49:19,300 --> 00:49:25,400
principle and I get it, but in 
terms of finding a way to live 

889
00:49:25,400 --> 00:49:29,000
in a pluralistic society, where 
people have different Aunt views

890
00:49:29,000 --> 00:49:31,800
and opinions and stuff as hard 
as that is for me to manage 

891
00:49:31,800 --> 00:49:36,100
sometimes, as well. 
I look at a land value tax, as 

892
00:49:36,100 --> 00:49:42,700
a, as a way of bridging two, 
disparate communities and its 

893
00:49:42,700 --> 00:49:45,000
really to private versus public,
right? 

894
00:49:45,400 --> 00:49:50,300
It's a way of bridging two 
groups and allow us to do things

895
00:49:50,300 --> 00:49:53,000
collectively. 
While simultaneously, giving 

896
00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:56,500
people the ability to still, it 
maintain private property, and 

897
00:49:56,600 --> 00:50:00,100
still maintain that. 
So there's Again, you're not 

898
00:50:00,400 --> 00:50:03,900
short of living in your own 
isolated, this as my 

899
00:50:03,900 --> 00:50:07,800
libertarian, hellscape or my 
libertarian Paradise, depending 

900
00:50:07,800 --> 00:50:11,600
on your perspective. 
We are in a pluralistic 

901
00:50:11,600 --> 00:50:14,600
environment. 
And so, knowing that there are 

902
00:50:14,600 --> 00:50:18,500
people out there who would 
outright completely do away with

903
00:50:18,500 --> 00:50:22,200
public property or private 
property and vice versa do away 

904
00:50:22,200 --> 00:50:25,000
with public property. 
I think that there's an 

905
00:50:25,000 --> 00:50:30,000
opportunity there to find a less
than perfect, but do not let 

906
00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:34,400
perfect become the enemy. 
A good kind of symbiotic 

907
00:50:34,400 --> 00:50:35,800
relationship. 
I don't know. 

908
00:50:35,800 --> 00:50:39,200
That's that's I believe that 
that's a potential way forward 

909
00:50:39,200 --> 00:50:44,000
to bring groups together when it
comes to voting. 

910
00:50:44,100 --> 00:50:47,700
I think a lot of people have a 
lot of different areas of 

911
00:50:47,700 --> 00:50:49,800
expertise. 
We see the certainly nowadays. 

912
00:50:50,000 --> 00:50:53,300
No one says, well everyone's 
opinion is equal with regard to 

913
00:50:53,308 --> 00:50:55,000
covid-19. 
Vaccines, they say there's some 

914
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:57,000
people who know a lot more than 
others. 

915
00:50:57,100 --> 00:51:00,500
They should be on TV and they 
should have more power than the 

916
00:51:00,500 --> 00:51:03,800
average person. 
I don't see that that is very 

917
00:51:03,800 --> 00:51:07,800
different from who should own 
the factors of production. 

918
00:51:07,800 --> 00:51:10,200
So I have no problem with worker
cooperatives. 

919
00:51:10,300 --> 00:51:14,400
My only issue was to stop people
from engaging in contracts with 

920
00:51:14,400 --> 00:51:17,600
employers if they see that as a 
better option, I did an 

921
00:51:17,600 --> 00:51:19,800
internship for zero dollars and 
zero cents. 

922
00:51:19,800 --> 00:51:24,200
So I mean if that's like the 
ultimate exploitation, but it 

923
00:51:24,200 --> 00:51:26,600
was better for me in the long 
run. 

924
00:51:26,600 --> 00:51:32,400
So my issue with democratizing, 
a lot of things or things to the

925
00:51:32,400 --> 00:51:35,800
point where you're dealing with 
people who haven't gone into 

926
00:51:35,800 --> 00:51:40,200
this agreement, voluntarily is 
you are more likely to get 

927
00:51:40,200 --> 00:51:42,800
people who don't have a lot of 
information people who aren't 

928
00:51:42,800 --> 00:51:47,000
well trained people who are less
ambitious and people who are 

929
00:51:48,100 --> 00:51:52,400
maybe not as kind. 
It just doesn't allow us to 

930
00:51:52,500 --> 00:51:55,600
disassociate. 
Bad actors as easily. 

931
00:51:55,600 --> 00:51:58,200
So for the same reason, I don't 
want us voting on a national 

932
00:51:58,400 --> 00:52:00,000
religion. 
Might sound rugged, 

933
00:52:00,000 --> 00:52:02,000
individualist. 
You're a Protestant and he's a 

934
00:52:02,000 --> 00:52:03,900
Muslim. 
And this guy's a Jew and I know,

935
00:52:03,900 --> 00:52:07,700
Anarchy and Chaos. 
I still think that is superior. 

936
00:52:08,100 --> 00:52:09,900
What are your thoughts on 
Democracy? 

937
00:52:09,900 --> 00:52:15,400
Now, not allowing people like, I
guess that would be me and Adele

938
00:52:15,500 --> 00:52:19,200
have the same listening audience
if we're in a democracy, but in 

939
00:52:19,200 --> 00:52:21,900
a free market, she can sell a 
billion records and no one can 

940
00:52:21,900 --> 00:52:23,700
buy from me. 
What am I missing? 

941
00:52:23,800 --> 00:52:26,500
There. 
I don't think I understand your 

942
00:52:26,500 --> 00:52:28,300
question entirely and I'm 
trying. 

943
00:52:28,300 --> 00:52:31,800
So can you reframe that? 
Yeah, why is democracy 

944
00:52:31,800 --> 00:52:36,200
inherently valuable? 
Well, I don't know that it is 

945
00:52:36,200 --> 00:52:38,700
inherently valuable. 
I do know this. 

946
00:52:38,700 --> 00:52:43,000
This is where the you starting 
to get into micro slicing here. 

947
00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:45,000
Right? 
You've got the universal set. 

948
00:52:45,000 --> 00:52:48,000
Now, we've gotten it down to one
of these small bubbles in the 

949
00:52:48,000 --> 00:52:51,400
Venn diagram. 
Okay, you're talking about 

950
00:52:51,900 --> 00:52:58,400
individuals that have power over
their person power over their 

951
00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:04,600
data power over x y z. 
I am an anti Surveillance, I 

952
00:53:04,607 --> 00:53:07,500
guess you could say at some 
level it's civil libertarian to 

953
00:53:07,500 --> 00:53:12,500
some degree. 
I think we're where it starts 

954
00:53:12,500 --> 00:53:16,900
becoming challenging is when 
you're right or my right? 

955
00:53:16,900 --> 00:53:23,500
Let's put it in my terms and 
when my right to be healthy and 

956
00:53:23,500 --> 00:53:28,300
whole is infringed upon by your 
desire to do something. 

957
00:53:29,600 --> 00:53:32,100
That ultimately leads to my 
demise. 

958
00:53:32,700 --> 00:53:36,500
I think that that is a real 
super duper challenge to cross. 

959
00:53:36,500 --> 00:53:42,000
And like, you know, I am, it's a
tough way of saying, but it's 

960
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:44,500
like, there's a part of me that 
is. 

961
00:53:45,200 --> 00:53:52,000
Hey, I don't tell me what to do.
And at the same time, I'm not a 

962
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:58,100
virologist. 
I always had to show a vaccine 

963
00:53:58,100 --> 00:54:02,200
card when I went to elementary 
school, when I went to middle 

964
00:54:02,200 --> 00:54:03,500
school. 
I had to prove that. 

965
00:54:03,500 --> 00:54:11,200
I got my ex vaccine, my this 
vaccine, my other vaccine, you 

966
00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:18,600
know, I fundamentally if we're 
protecting each other from harm.

967
00:54:20,500 --> 00:54:24,800
Then I believe that there is a 
place for that kind of mandate. 

968
00:54:26,200 --> 00:54:29,400
It hurts to say that because I 
understand what the implication 

969
00:54:29,400 --> 00:54:34,300
is. 
And yet, at the same time, What 

970
00:54:34,300 --> 00:54:39,200
is the, what is the outcome, if 
you don't do that, right? 

971
00:54:39,200 --> 00:54:43,400
And I think a bigger problem 
here. 

972
00:54:44,500 --> 00:54:49,900
Is that Force usually comes when
you don't trust someone, when 

973
00:54:49,900 --> 00:54:53,100
you inherently don't trust 
someone like you know that 

974
00:54:53,100 --> 00:54:57,100
there's this grimy dude. 
That is the guy that's going to 

975
00:54:57,600 --> 00:55:00,400
rub up on a child. 
A pedo kind of thing. 

976
00:55:01,500 --> 00:55:04,700
And that child is saying, I 
don't want to go stay over and 

977
00:55:04,700 --> 00:55:07,900
uncle Larry's. 
But Mom and Dad say, you're 

978
00:55:07,900 --> 00:55:12,000
staying at Uncle Larry's and 
you're going to like it and then

979
00:55:12,000 --> 00:55:14,200
stays with Uncle Larry and she's
right. 

980
00:55:14,300 --> 00:55:18,800
They're whatever we that to me 
is is a horrible outcome of 

981
00:55:18,800 --> 00:55:22,800
somebody having control over you
and mandating what you do and 

982
00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:25,400
don't do. 
That right. 

983
00:55:25,400 --> 00:55:29,400
There is a little hyperbolic. 
Obviously that I don't think 

984
00:55:29,400 --> 00:55:33,000
everything has to be in terms of
rape survival and stuff like 

985
00:55:33,000 --> 00:55:35,200
that. 
I think you can have a much more

986
00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:38,200
micro much more benign and it's 
still be offensive. 

987
00:55:39,300 --> 00:55:43,100
But I think that there's a point
here where you have to look at. 

988
00:55:43,400 --> 00:55:47,600
How do you maintain any 
semblance of order? 

989
00:55:48,200 --> 00:55:52,100
And you look at the fall of the 
Roman Empire, as the Roman 

990
00:55:52,100 --> 00:55:54,600
Empire bled out and kind of just
fizzled out. 

991
00:55:54,600 --> 00:55:57,100
It didn't really die. 
It fizzled out, right? 

992
00:55:57,100 --> 00:56:01,800
He extended himself too far and 
lo and behold it just went away 

993
00:56:01,800 --> 00:56:03,900
and this neck. 
The next people that came and 

994
00:56:03,900 --> 00:56:07,100
power didn't have the power, 
didn't have the Charisma didn't 

995
00:56:07,100 --> 00:56:09,000
have the under whatever it was. 
They didn't. 

996
00:56:09,200 --> 00:56:14,600
The thing that kept the empire 
together and as you saw as the 

997
00:56:14,600 --> 00:56:19,400
Roman Empire ended the Dark Ages
began, and it became a very very

998
00:56:19,400 --> 00:56:23,900
non literate Society. 
Actually, the Dark Ages really 

999
00:56:23,900 --> 00:56:25,900
were dark. 
I mean, they really were dark 

1000
00:56:25,900 --> 00:56:29,600
that it wasn't just the Bubonic 
plague and all the other forms 

1001
00:56:29,600 --> 00:56:32,100
of plague that took place in the
13th century. 

1002
00:56:32,400 --> 00:56:37,700
You're talking about a serious 
situation where people that want

1003
00:56:37,700 --> 00:56:43,200
spoke and and wrote fluently no 
longer were literate, literally 

1004
00:56:43,200 --> 00:56:46,300
literacy died. 
It had to recover some of that 

1005
00:56:46,300 --> 00:56:48,200
literacy and it took years and 
years. 

1006
00:56:48,600 --> 00:56:53,300
I believe that over excuse about
one-third of the population of 

1007
00:56:53,300 --> 00:56:58,400
Europe was wiped out by the 
plague and it wasn't until about

1008
00:56:58,400 --> 00:57:03,000
the French Revolution that they 
got back to pre plague levels of

1009
00:57:03,000 --> 00:57:06,900
population. 
All of that knowledge was lost. 

1010
00:57:07,700 --> 00:57:11,600
And people had to Rican, re 
figure out how life was. 

1011
00:57:12,100 --> 00:57:15,500
And so, you had the dawn of 
capitalism through that period, 

1012
00:57:15,500 --> 00:57:21,200
the merchant class came up, but 
people themselves, you had 

1013
00:57:21,200 --> 00:57:24,600
Warlords. 
You had a lot of Warring 

1014
00:57:24,600 --> 00:57:27,300
factions. 
It was a very brutal time. 

1015
00:57:27,300 --> 00:57:31,200
Very, very brutal time was not a
caring Society. 

1016
00:57:31,700 --> 00:57:34,500
I was not a society where I 
would have wanted a been a 

1017
00:57:34,500 --> 00:57:39,700
seventy-year-old with some sort 
of An illness and hoping to God,

1018
00:57:39,700 --> 00:57:42,700
somebody took care of me. 
And when I'm unable to take care

1019
00:57:42,700 --> 00:57:46,900
of myself, it was a very brutal 
death driven. 

1020
00:57:46,900 --> 00:57:50,000
Killing killing death was all 
around. 

1021
00:57:50,100 --> 00:57:54,100
It was as normal as you name it.
I don't want to go back to that.

1022
00:57:54,300 --> 00:57:55,800
I don't want to be involved in 
that. 

1023
00:57:56,300 --> 00:58:01,200
And so, as they think to myself 
about that kind of play here in 

1024
00:58:01,200 --> 00:58:05,300
society today. 
It terrifies me quite frankly. 

1025
00:58:05,300 --> 00:58:08,100
I mean whether you're a big 
believer in climate change or 

1026
00:58:08,100 --> 00:58:11,800
not. 
There's evidence of coastal 

1027
00:58:12,600 --> 00:58:16,300
erosion. 
There's evidence of mass ice 

1028
00:58:16,300 --> 00:58:20,000
melts, whether it's human made 
or not and of those ice melts, 

1029
00:58:20,000 --> 00:58:23,200
you can rest assured that there 
will be bacteria and viruses 

1030
00:58:23,200 --> 00:58:27,800
that come back from the dead 
that have been frozen away for 

1031
00:58:27,900 --> 00:58:30,500
ever. 
You have algae, blooms coming 

1032
00:58:30,500 --> 00:58:32,800
out. 
How would we collectively? 

1033
00:58:32,900 --> 00:58:35,600
We deal with that. 
How will we collectively deal 

1034
00:58:35,600 --> 00:58:37,500
with ours? 
Every person on their own? 

1035
00:58:37,600 --> 00:58:39,800
And I've got a cure, and I'm 
going to lock myself in this 

1036
00:58:39,800 --> 00:58:43,500
castle and nobody can have it 
like Bill Gates with patents on 

1037
00:58:43,500 --> 00:58:48,000
different life-saving medicines.
So, I think you have to really 

1038
00:58:48,000 --> 00:58:50,500
ask yourself. 
What kind of society you want to

1039
00:58:50,508 --> 00:58:55,100
be in and how precarious, do you
want life to be for the average 

1040
00:58:55,100 --> 00:58:59,100
person? 
And I come from a mindset of, I 

1041
00:58:59,100 --> 00:59:02,200
want to make life as good for 
people as possible. 

1042
00:59:03,100 --> 00:59:08,600
And I want to be able to provide
an environment where we all have

1043
00:59:08,600 --> 00:59:13,600
the chance to thrive without a 
gun, to her head without the 

1044
00:59:13,600 --> 00:59:17,000
fear of death waiting around the
corner constantly. 

1045
00:59:18,300 --> 00:59:20,200
And I don't think 
libertarianism. 

1046
00:59:20,300 --> 00:59:22,300
I don't think that that gives us
that. 

1047
00:59:22,400 --> 00:59:25,400
I think it gives people that 
were born, the lottery of good 

1048
00:59:25,400 --> 00:59:28,700
genes and great health and 
access to things. 

1049
00:59:28,900 --> 00:59:31,900
It gives him a real leg up and 
you could see people really 

1050
00:59:31,900 --> 00:59:36,700
throw So, in other words, the 
sine wave of this signal in the 

1051
00:59:36,700 --> 00:59:39,900
society, I'm looking at is a 
much shorter wave. 

1052
00:59:39,900 --> 00:59:42,900
Whereas the wave, and a 
Libertarian Society seems to be 

1053
00:59:42,900 --> 00:59:47,000
like this, like Bitcoins, you 
know, jumping up and down 

1054
00:59:47,200 --> 00:59:49,800
because the people at the bottom
really haven't got a leg to 

1055
00:59:49,800 --> 00:59:53,400
stand on their done, the people 
at the top, totally different 

1056
00:59:53,400 --> 00:59:56,000
ball of cheese. 
They've got the World by the, 

1057
00:59:56,100 --> 01:00:00,800
you know, by the short hairs. 
So it's a real challenge. 

1058
01:00:00,900 --> 01:00:06,400
I understand the thinking, I do,
but I've swung full circle. 

1059
01:00:06,500 --> 01:00:09,600
I'm very much on the, let's 
mitigate. 

1060
01:00:09,600 --> 01:00:13,000
Let's clear the bottom. 
Let's get rid of the edge cases,

1061
01:00:13,000 --> 01:00:15,500
Let's help them out. 
Let's lift them into the middle,

1062
01:00:15,900 --> 01:00:19,400
and at the top, let's pray. 
I don't want my all the real 

1063
01:00:19,400 --> 01:00:22,400
resources gobbled up by an 
individual. 

1064
01:00:23,000 --> 01:00:26,500
I think that we all have to 
survive, oxygen water. 

1065
01:00:26,500 --> 01:00:28,600
You name it. 
There's no way we should be 

1066
01:00:28,600 --> 01:00:32,000
selling water. 
You know, I mean, it's just when

1067
01:00:32,000 --> 01:00:34,800
you think about About the 
natural resources that we have. 

1068
01:00:35,000 --> 01:00:38,200
There's a point where you say. 
Hey, we could get free energy 

1069
01:00:38,200 --> 01:00:41,100
today from the sun. 
We can get free energy from 

1070
01:00:41,100 --> 01:00:46,400
water and wind but the state or 
the public-private Partnerships 

1071
01:00:46,400 --> 01:00:48,400
or whoever says, hey, wait a 
minute. 

1072
01:00:48,408 --> 01:00:52,000
If you get, if you all can get 
free from the Sun, we're going 

1073
01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:53,900
to lose our profit. 
So we're going to do something 

1074
01:00:53,900 --> 01:00:57,200
different. 
So the state intervenes and adds

1075
01:00:57,200 --> 01:01:00,200
taxes and surplus charges and 
all these other things to free 

1076
01:01:00,200 --> 01:01:04,100
stuff to prevent us from I'm 
ever being able to escape. 

1077
01:01:04,100 --> 01:01:08,400
So this is a area where I think 
maybe Libertarians and others 

1078
01:01:08,400 --> 01:01:11,100
could come together and find a 
different solution as well. 

1079
01:01:12,000 --> 01:01:16,200
Because otherwise, I mean, 
really you're, once again, 

1080
01:01:16,200 --> 01:01:18,000
mitigating. 
The one thing that could really 

1081
01:01:18,000 --> 01:01:19,800
make us free. 
Imagine if you didn't have to 

1082
01:01:19,800 --> 01:01:22,100
pay electricity. 
Imagine if you weren't 

1083
01:01:22,100 --> 01:01:25,900
constantly forced to do that. 
I mean, when that be great, I 

1084
01:01:25,900 --> 01:01:28,000
can't imagine anybody would say,
it wouldn't be great except for 

1085
01:01:28,000 --> 01:01:31,300
the guy that owns the electric 
company, you know, so well too. 

1086
01:01:31,300 --> 01:01:33,800
It's just that Tougher, tougher 
him. 

1087
01:01:33,800 --> 01:01:37,400
He can find something else to do
just like, you know, what was 

1088
01:01:37,400 --> 01:01:39,600
really tough for me when my 
girlfriend broke up with me. 

1089
01:01:39,800 --> 01:01:42,800
So, what I need to find? 
I need to find something else. 

1090
01:01:43,600 --> 01:01:47,400
The sun example was actually 
used by The Economist Frederic 

1091
01:01:47,400 --> 01:01:51,300
bastiat in the 1850s. 
He said, you know, well, we 

1092
01:01:51,300 --> 01:01:53,700
candle makers need to come 
together because there's this 

1093
01:01:53,700 --> 01:01:55,300
competitor who's just killing 
us. 

1094
01:01:55,500 --> 01:01:58,100
We got a form, some protection 
this guy. 

1095
01:01:58,300 --> 01:02:00,900
Well, it's actually not a guy, 
it's more of a thing. 

1096
01:02:01,000 --> 01:02:04,100
This thing, the Sun is Really 
putting us out of business or 

1097
01:02:04,100 --> 01:02:07,100
what we need to collectively 
come together and get this SOB. 

1098
01:02:07,300 --> 01:02:12,800
So yeah, the concept of profit 
worship and money Obsession. 

1099
01:02:12,800 --> 01:02:16,800
I couldn't agree with you more. 
My final question for you, just 

1100
01:02:16,800 --> 01:02:21,300
to I'm going to use a specific 
example, but I want your, this 

1101
01:02:21,300 --> 01:02:24,600
will get an overall idea of the 
mmt. 

1102
01:02:24,800 --> 01:02:28,000
Economic view one. 
Do you agree with me? 

1103
01:02:28,000 --> 01:02:31,700
That South Korea's wealthier 
than North Korea to why is South

1104
01:02:31,700 --> 01:02:33,300
Korea wealthier? 
Than North Korea. 

1105
01:02:35,500 --> 01:02:38,200
Define wealth. 
That is what. 

1106
01:02:39,000 --> 01:02:44,400
So, I would say, an increase, 
the a country as wealthy to the 

1107
01:02:44,400 --> 01:02:46,300
degree. 
You can measure the number of 

1108
01:02:46,300 --> 01:02:50,900
hours worked to obtain certain 
goods and services wealth would 

1109
01:02:50,900 --> 01:02:57,000
be the ability to achieve ones 
ends using fewer resources than 

1110
01:02:57,000 --> 01:02:59,800
you otherwise would have to in 
an impoverished scenario. 

1111
01:03:00,100 --> 01:03:02,900
But the reason that it's such a 
tough question is because 

1112
01:03:02,900 --> 01:03:05,900
there's Christian monks. 
So, who live on like 30 cents a 

1113
01:03:05,908 --> 01:03:07,800
day, who are happier than a lot 
of people? 

1114
01:03:07,800 --> 01:03:12,000
I know who are in nice houses. 
So, so the, so I get, I'm 

1115
01:03:12,000 --> 01:03:15,300
intentionally pigeonholing you 
to see where you would take it. 

1116
01:03:15,300 --> 01:03:17,400
You will you will you will. 
You can't pigeonhole me. 

1117
01:03:17,400 --> 01:03:26,100
I get this one, but I know 
you're good though. 

1118
01:03:26,100 --> 01:03:30,000
I'm with you skin, crawls, my 
hair stands on end, whenever I 

1119
01:03:30,000 --> 01:03:35,700
hear the, the headline left, the
the Races of the world and stuff

1120
01:03:35,700 --> 01:03:37,500
like that. 
Say the United States is the 

1121
01:03:37,500 --> 01:03:42,600
richest country in the world and
I say to myself, explain that 

1122
01:03:42,600 --> 01:03:45,500
I'm good with that. 
Maybe I wasn't saying that to 

1123
01:03:45,500 --> 01:03:46,700
me. 
Yeah. 

1124
01:03:46,700 --> 01:03:51,300
It because like if I look at 
China and the massive size of 

1125
01:03:51,300 --> 01:03:55,800
its country and the massive 
amount of real resources under 

1126
01:03:55,800 --> 01:03:59,100
its ground and its soil, its 
capacity. 

1127
01:03:59,100 --> 01:04:06,300
Its in its industrial capacity 
to create its I look at it that 

1128
01:04:06,300 --> 01:04:08,700
the ability to produce real real
similar. 

1129
01:04:08,800 --> 01:04:14,000
What you just said, - not really
worried about the money part of 

1130
01:04:14,000 --> 01:04:15,900
it, right? 
Because the money is, we could 

1131
01:04:15,900 --> 01:04:18,700
do this stuff for free or you 
could trade it for something or 

1132
01:04:18,700 --> 01:04:21,200
whatever, right? 
There's a million ways to handle

1133
01:04:21,200 --> 01:04:24,600
that. 
So, money is not an indicator of

1134
01:04:24,600 --> 01:04:28,000
real resources. 
It's not an indicator of real 

1135
01:04:28,000 --> 01:04:31,500
wealth either, right? 
And so, this is an area where I 

1136
01:04:31,508 --> 01:04:35,000
think that Liberty being that 
I've For that space. 

1137
01:04:35,000 --> 01:04:36,900
I know the gotcha lines, right? 
So. 

1138
01:04:37,100 --> 01:04:39,000
Well, you can't print real 
wealth. 

1139
01:04:39,000 --> 01:04:40,800
Well, no, you can't print real 
wealth. 

1140
01:04:40,800 --> 01:04:44,200
That's right. 
But what does dollars give you 

1141
01:04:44,200 --> 01:04:46,500
dollars? 
Give you access to real 

1142
01:04:46,500 --> 01:04:49,200
resources, right? 
It could give you. 

1143
01:04:49,700 --> 01:04:52,600
This is an interesting thing, 
and I think that you'll find 

1144
01:04:52,600 --> 01:04:58,600
this challenging Milton Friedman
back in the day believes in 

1145
01:04:58,600 --> 01:05:01,400
helicopter, money. 
He believed the only problem 

1146
01:05:01,400 --> 01:05:03,400
with capitalism was we needed 
more. 

1147
01:05:04,100 --> 01:05:05,900
Um, so let's give them more 
money. 

1148
01:05:05,900 --> 01:05:08,000
Let's just give a negative 
income tax. 

1149
01:05:08,000 --> 01:05:12,300
Let's do whatever, and that will
make capitalism Thrive because 

1150
01:05:12,300 --> 01:05:14,900
the only thing wrong with 
capitalism is people don't have 

1151
01:05:14,900 --> 01:05:16,300
enough money. 
So it's giving more money to 

1152
01:05:16,300 --> 01:05:18,700
spend. 
So this is kind of the 

1153
01:05:18,700 --> 01:05:21,200
foundation of many Ubi hours out
there. 

1154
01:05:21,200 --> 01:05:24,200
Many of the people that come 
with the Ubi perspective. 

1155
01:05:24,800 --> 01:05:27,900
Well, the Ubi though assumes 
real resources are there for 

1156
01:05:27,900 --> 01:05:29,800
them, the purchase. 
Well, who created this real 

1157
01:05:29,800 --> 01:05:34,000
resources who created those 
things for them to buy and why 

1158
01:05:34,000 --> 01:05:38,500
are You diminishing the value of
that labor, by giving away the 

1159
01:05:38,500 --> 01:05:41,000
cash to get that real resource 
for free. 

1160
01:05:41,400 --> 01:05:44,700
Because ultimately, at the end 
of the day, it's not really 

1161
01:05:44,700 --> 01:05:47,900
about whether or not I want them
all to have what they have. 

1162
01:05:47,900 --> 01:05:51,300
I do want them to. 
So I I come from a different 

1163
01:05:51,300 --> 01:05:53,500
position because I do know what 
real wealth is. 

1164
01:05:53,800 --> 01:05:59,800
I say, let's give people a 
universal basic Services as 

1165
01:05:59,800 --> 01:06:03,600
opposed to Universal basic 
income because the currency 

1166
01:06:03,600 --> 01:06:06,000
issue. 
Our can absorb any cost 

1167
01:06:06,000 --> 01:06:10,400
increases that are there the 
currency issuer can absorb, 

1168
01:06:10,400 --> 01:06:15,700
whatever spikes, or whatever in 
the economy, but you and I, we 

1169
01:06:15,700 --> 01:06:18,800
can't absorb that. 
And so if we're a family and we 

1170
01:06:18,800 --> 01:06:22,900
have children, or whatever, and 
we have to try to absorb those 

1171
01:06:22,900 --> 01:06:24,700
spikes. 
We're in big trouble. 

1172
01:06:25,600 --> 01:06:27,600
We're we, you, and I are in big 
trouble. 

1173
01:06:27,600 --> 01:06:29,500
There's opportunities out there,
sure. 

1174
01:06:29,800 --> 01:06:33,300
But a lot of this stuff is a 
crapshoot, right? 

1175
01:06:33,600 --> 01:06:36,700
Some of these. 
Don't have to be a crapshoot. 

1176
01:06:36,700 --> 01:06:40,000
You don't have to live in that 
kind of precarity and I don't 

1177
01:06:40,000 --> 01:06:42,100
see any value in creating 
precarity. 

1178
01:06:42,100 --> 01:06:44,200
But I do know why they creep 
precarity. 

1179
01:06:44,300 --> 01:06:46,800
And this dates back to some of 
the Middle Ages stuff that I'm 

1180
01:06:46,800 --> 01:06:50,000
talking about when you're trying
to keep a surf going. 

1181
01:06:50,000 --> 01:06:53,700
When you're trying to keep these
vassals going these servants 

1182
01:06:53,700 --> 01:06:57,400
going. 
Okay, you've got to make it so 

1183
01:06:57,400 --> 01:07:02,400
that the alternative is worse. 
So they're like, okay. 

1184
01:07:02,400 --> 01:07:04,100
Well, what do I do for that 
money then? 

1185
01:07:04,800 --> 01:07:10,200
Okay, you know, I have the 
saying going back to how I 

1186
01:07:10,200 --> 01:07:14,400
present mmt that Kings back in 
the day would print a coin. 

1187
01:07:14,900 --> 01:07:17,800
And they would go up to a 
peasant out in the field or 

1188
01:07:17,800 --> 01:07:19,800
whatever. 
He was farming is field and 

1189
01:07:20,100 --> 01:07:23,000
fishing and bouncing his kid on 
his knee, or doing whatever and 

1190
01:07:23,000 --> 01:07:26,500
say, hey, I'd like you to come 
build an aqueduct for me or I'd 

1191
01:07:26,500 --> 01:07:29,500
like you to come and build a 
castle for me and dudes. 

1192
01:07:29,500 --> 01:07:31,200
Like, yeah, you know, I'm all 
right. 

1193
01:07:31,600 --> 01:07:32,900
I'm good. 
I think I'm going to keep 

1194
01:07:32,900 --> 01:07:35,300
fishing. 
I think I'm gonna keep doing 

1195
01:07:35,300 --> 01:07:37,900
whatever I'm doing right now. 
I guess haha. 

1196
01:07:37,900 --> 01:07:38,800
Yeah. 
Good point goes. 

1197
01:07:38,800 --> 01:07:43,200
Well, what if I give you a coin 
for that guy, looks the coins 

1198
01:07:43,200 --> 01:07:44,900
like what am I gonna do with the
coin? 

1199
01:07:44,900 --> 01:07:48,300
I don't need that coin. 
It's a good point. 

1200
01:07:48,400 --> 01:07:53,800
He says, hey, we're going to put
a 10 coin tax on your house. 

1201
01:07:53,800 --> 01:07:58,800
Your Hut here. 
It's got to be paid or we're 

1202
01:07:58,800 --> 01:08:00,700
going to take your Hut and the 
guy goes, wait. 

1203
01:08:00,700 --> 01:08:01,900
What? 
What? 

1204
01:08:01,900 --> 01:08:05,100
You can take my heart. 
Well, how do I get those coins? 

1205
01:08:05,100 --> 01:08:08,500
Is that funny? 
You should say that I need an 

1206
01:08:08,500 --> 01:08:11,200
aqueduct built. 
I need a castle built, whatever.

1207
01:08:11,400 --> 01:08:14,900
Okay. 
Now all of a sudden taxes create

1208
01:08:15,000 --> 01:08:19,000
buyers and sellers of goods 
taxes are also what creates the 

1209
01:08:19,000 --> 01:08:22,500
first unemployed person. 
So unemployment is a direct 

1210
01:08:22,500 --> 01:08:25,100
creation of taxes. 
You say. 

1211
01:08:25,100 --> 01:08:26,500
Oh, well, then we should get rid
of taxes. 

1212
01:08:26,500 --> 01:08:28,800
Well then. 
Your currency isn't worth 

1213
01:08:28,800 --> 01:08:30,800
anything. 
Now all of a sudden and this is 

1214
01:08:30,800 --> 01:08:35,600
what happened to the South. 
The Confederacy was that they 

1215
01:08:35,600 --> 01:08:39,399
couldn't Levy a tax. 
They were so ideological against

1216
01:08:39,399 --> 01:08:41,600
the tax that their currency 
didn't hold up. 

1217
01:08:42,100 --> 01:08:46,100
And so they ended up actually 
having a hyperinflation in the 

1218
01:08:46,100 --> 01:08:49,399
South which ended up costing 
them, the Civil War. 

1219
01:08:49,399 --> 01:08:52,800
Quite frankly. 
I mean, it's one of the rarely 

1220
01:08:52,800 --> 01:08:59,600
talked about facts of History, 
so I think that idia logically 

1221
01:08:59,600 --> 01:09:07,200
speaking wealth is a construct 
similar to what you said. 

1222
01:09:08,100 --> 01:09:13,500
And I would say that wealth is 
also should be based on the 

1223
01:09:13,500 --> 01:09:16,899
happiness of the people living 
in that space as well. 

1224
01:09:16,899 --> 01:09:21,200
Not just numbers and acquired 
things. 

1225
01:09:21,200 --> 01:09:24,899
But like, how can you gauge from
with of their health their 

1226
01:09:24,899 --> 01:09:27,700
years? 
They live the, the Whatever 

1227
01:09:27,700 --> 01:09:29,600
rate, you know, I mean, there's 
a whole caste of there's a 

1228
01:09:29,608 --> 01:09:33,500
dashboard of metrics that you 
should be able to evaluate the 

1229
01:09:33,500 --> 01:09:37,100
success and wealth, you know, 
hey, I may not make a lot of 

1230
01:09:37,100 --> 01:09:38,200
money. 
But damn, I'm happy. 

1231
01:09:38,200 --> 01:09:41,500
Every single day. 
I get laid 10 times a day. 

1232
01:09:41,500 --> 01:09:43,899
I get to get high every day. 
I get to do whatever I want. 

1233
01:09:43,899 --> 01:09:45,600
Every that. 
I'm really happy. 

1234
01:09:45,600 --> 01:09:47,399
I wake up every day. 
I'm a thrilled man. 

1235
01:09:47,399 --> 01:09:51,800
I'm loving life, you know, you 
know, happiness has got to be 

1236
01:09:51,800 --> 01:09:56,700
part of that equation. 
And so your the question to your

1237
01:09:57,300 --> 01:10:01,500
The answer to your question is I
think first of all, I don't 

1238
01:10:01,500 --> 01:10:03,300
think that really is a valid 
question. 

1239
01:10:03,300 --> 01:10:06,600
It's a valid question, but it's 
a trick question and it's it 

1240
01:10:06,600 --> 01:10:08,500
really comes down to what do you
measure? 

1241
01:10:08,600 --> 01:10:13,900
How do you quantify wealth? 
And I think your statement there

1242
01:10:13,900 --> 01:10:17,000
was a pretty accurate one. 
I think that wealth is really 

1243
01:10:17,000 --> 01:10:21,400
about the ability to live, a 
good life with the least amount 

1244
01:10:21,400 --> 01:10:25,400
of effort. 
And but it would be nice and I 

1245
01:10:25,407 --> 01:10:30,000
think it's possible that we can 
increase the wealth of all by 

1246
01:10:30,000 --> 01:10:33,500
creating systems that allow 
instead of money to start at the

1247
01:10:33,508 --> 01:10:37,500
top to start at the bottom. 
Because he'll, you know, like I 

1248
01:10:37,500 --> 01:10:40,400
said before, money has a natural
helium effect and it pulls the 

1249
01:10:40,400 --> 01:10:42,300
top. 
If you spend it at the top, you 

1250
01:10:42,300 --> 01:10:44,100
got to pray to God that they 
piss on you. 

1251
01:10:44,100 --> 01:10:46,900
So it makes it to the bottom, 
but it always comes back up 

1252
01:10:46,900 --> 01:10:48,400
because you're buying your stuff
again. 

1253
01:10:48,600 --> 01:10:52,100
And so it always gives back up. 
So if you start the money at the

1254
01:10:52,300 --> 01:10:55,600
atem, provide people with basic 
Services, provide them with 

1255
01:10:55,600 --> 01:10:58,700
good, living, provide them with 
these things that money's going 

1256
01:10:58,700 --> 01:11:00,700
to matriculate through the 
economy and it's going to make 

1257
01:11:00,700 --> 01:11:04,400
it back up anyway, and when it 
makes a backup tax, some of it 

1258
01:11:04,400 --> 01:11:06,600
away so that they still keep 
motivated. 

1259
01:11:06,600 --> 01:11:09,000
They still keep going. 
And at the same time, these 

1260
01:11:09,000 --> 01:11:13,400
people keep going because they 
have to this is the thing, if 

1261
01:11:13,400 --> 01:11:18,800
you and I are millionaires. 
And we're only going to buy X 

1262
01:11:18,800 --> 01:11:21,700
number of loaves of bread. 
We're only going to buy X number

1263
01:11:21,700 --> 01:11:23,900
of cars. 
Maybe we have a car fetish, we 

1264
01:11:23,900 --> 01:11:25,500
buy a bunch. 
But even that wouldn't be enough

1265
01:11:25,500 --> 01:11:30,000
to sustain an economy, 
ultimately where inflation and 

1266
01:11:30,000 --> 01:11:34,000
things like that would kick in 
is if everybody suddenly had 

1267
01:11:34,200 --> 01:11:38,600
20,000 dollars in their pocket. 
It's not the money, but it's the

1268
01:11:38,700 --> 01:11:43,100
ability to exact that demand and
whether or not there is the real

1269
01:11:43,100 --> 01:11:45,000
resources there for them to 
purchase. 

1270
01:11:45,900 --> 01:11:51,000
And if we all want a Lamborghini
and they've only made 20, 

1271
01:11:51,000 --> 01:11:53,800
Lamborghinis. 
Well, there's going to be a 

1272
01:11:53,800 --> 01:11:55,900
bidding war for this, 20, 
Lamborghinis. 

1273
01:11:56,500 --> 01:11:59,100
And that's how you're going to 
end up getting that kind of 

1274
01:11:59,100 --> 01:12:01,800
demand pull inflation. 
Right? 

1275
01:12:01,800 --> 01:12:04,700
You're going to get that kind of
scarcity based on that. 

1276
01:12:05,100 --> 01:12:09,100
That's how these things go, but 
that doesn't have to be, we 

1277
01:12:09,100 --> 01:12:12,400
don't have to create a false 
scarcity for people that want to

1278
01:12:12,407 --> 01:12:16,300
live in a casino world. 
I think life is too precious to 

1279
01:12:16,300 --> 01:12:21,100
make everything a Gamble. 
And and so that's I think that's

1280
01:12:21,400 --> 01:12:26,400
wealth in my Opinion also is the
ability not to worry to not live

1281
01:12:26,400 --> 01:12:30,200
in precarity. 
So sure and just one more thing.

1282
01:12:30,200 --> 01:12:34,800
I need clarified, when it's that
the dollar has value because of 

1283
01:12:34,800 --> 01:12:38,300
the tax. 
I paid for this mouse pad, don't

1284
01:12:38,300 --> 01:12:41,900
tread on anyone in Bitcoin, 
Bitcoin is not taxed. 

1285
01:12:41,900 --> 01:12:44,600
Does that mean Bitcoin does not 
have value? 

1286
01:12:44,600 --> 01:12:48,600
Even though it was used as a 
medium of exchange for a product

1287
01:12:48,600 --> 01:12:50,700
or service? 
So as you go through this 

1288
01:12:50,700 --> 01:12:54,800
process just remember this. 
Coin is an envelope Bitcoin is a

1289
01:12:54,808 --> 01:12:56,400
store of value. 
Okay. 

1290
01:12:56,700 --> 01:12:59,800
And so what happens is this and 
Brett Scott? 

1291
01:12:59,800 --> 01:13:01,500
I don't know if you've ever 
heard of a guy named Brett 

1292
01:13:01,500 --> 01:13:05,500
Scott, but he is one of the most
incredibly brilliant men on the 

1293
01:13:05,500 --> 01:13:12,300
Bitcoin Payment Systems. 
Mutual Credit all kinds of 

1294
01:13:12,300 --> 01:13:15,400
different really, really Next 
Generation. 

1295
01:13:15,400 --> 01:13:17,600
Futuristic views here. 
Check him out. 

1296
01:13:17,600 --> 01:13:21,000
Brett Scott. 
He has a great sub stack as 

1297
01:13:21,000 --> 01:13:22,500
well. 
I wish you could remember I'm 

1298
01:13:22,500 --> 01:13:25,000
subscribe, but just look up. 
Brett Scott. 

1299
01:13:25,000 --> 01:13:27,100
You won't be dissatisfied is 
amazing. 

1300
01:13:28,600 --> 01:13:32,900
But if you think about it, what 
happens is that you have this 

1301
01:13:33,600 --> 01:13:37,200
tunnel this dark tunnel, but how
did you get your Bitcoin to 

1302
01:13:37,200 --> 01:13:39,300
begin with OR how did you get 
whatever you got? 

1303
01:13:39,400 --> 01:13:43,000
You paid US dollars to get 
whatever that first coin was and

1304
01:13:43,000 --> 01:13:46,600
then it's done. 
Its thing, it, you know, people 

1305
01:13:46,600 --> 01:13:49,500
speculating and stuff add pump 
and dump, you know, they're 

1306
01:13:49,500 --> 01:13:51,900
pumping up the value, right? 
Ultimately. 

1307
01:13:51,900 --> 01:13:54,400
It's still U.s. 
Dollars that are paying for that

1308
01:13:54,400 --> 01:13:57,700
and or it's still Iranian, you 
know, money or it's still 

1309
01:13:57,700 --> 01:14:01,000
Australian money. 
The Bitcoin is basic. 

1310
01:14:01,000 --> 01:14:03,600
If you're a packet guy, if 
you're a packet-switched kind of

1311
01:14:03,600 --> 01:14:07,200
guy, you have a header, you have
a trailer, you know, you have a 

1312
01:14:07,200 --> 01:14:08,900
flag bit, you have all these 
bits. 

1313
01:14:08,900 --> 01:14:11,900
But inside, there you have, your
payload and data networking, 

1314
01:14:11,900 --> 01:14:15,600
right inside that little area is
the store of value. 

1315
01:14:15,800 --> 01:14:20,000
So, consider Bitcoin and 
envelope for State currency, and

1316
01:14:20,000 --> 01:14:23,900
I think that the real value of 
Bitcoin stuff like this, not so 

1317
01:14:23,907 --> 01:14:28,000
much the Bitcoin so much as the 
underlying blockchain technology

1318
01:14:28,300 --> 01:14:31,200
that will allow us to do 
tremendous things in the future.

1319
01:14:31,700 --> 01:14:34,400
I think that the Bitcoins and 
stuff like that, are a fun game 

1320
01:14:34,400 --> 01:14:36,400
that people that, like, to 
collect beanie babies. 

1321
01:14:36,400 --> 01:14:40,400
Do I said, but the other side of
that is the functional systems 

1322
01:14:40,400 --> 01:14:43,100
of defy and other stuff. 
I think that there's some real 

1323
01:14:43,100 --> 01:14:48,800
value there in terms of making 
Society a better place and being

1324
01:14:48,800 --> 01:14:52,200
able to get around some of the 
oppression, some of the fascist.

1325
01:14:52,400 --> 01:14:55,400
Russian it occurs throughout 
this nation and around the 

1326
01:14:55,400 --> 01:14:59,400
world. 
Quite frankly, so Back to my 

1327
01:14:59,400 --> 01:15:01,800
first statement. 
Everything it depends. 

1328
01:15:02,000 --> 01:15:05,400
You know, it really is find the 
right tool for the right job. 

1329
01:15:05,400 --> 01:15:07,200
You just because you're a hammer
doesn't mean everything's a 

1330
01:15:07,200 --> 01:15:09,100
nail. 
You got to find the right tool 

1331
01:15:09,100 --> 01:15:11,500
for the right job. 
You got to understand the 

1332
01:15:11,500 --> 01:15:13,400
requirements. 
You got to build the design. 

1333
01:15:13,400 --> 01:15:16,400
You got to test and execute and 
these are some things that I 

1334
01:15:16,407 --> 01:15:19,000
think people don't often times 
do because they're so 

1335
01:15:19,000 --> 01:15:23,600
ideological e locked in to a 
given thing that they don't. 

1336
01:15:23,700 --> 01:15:27,800
I'm a project manager by trade. 
So my job is to analyze. 

1337
01:15:28,000 --> 01:15:31,600
That sort of thing. 
So that's it. 

1338
01:15:31,600 --> 01:15:33,100
That's that's where I'm coming 
from. 

1339
01:15:34,000 --> 01:15:35,600
Thanks to everyone for watching 
Keith Knight. 

1340
01:15:35,600 --> 01:15:38,300
Don't try it on anyone in the 
libertarian Institute, Mr. 

1341
01:15:38,300 --> 01:15:40,000
Graham Bond. 
Thank you so much for your time,

1342
01:15:40,000 --> 01:15:41,300
sir. 
Greatly appreciated. 

1343
01:15:41,400 --> 01:15:43,200
Absolutely meant. 
Thank you for having me on this 

1344
01:15:43,200 --> 01:15:43,900
great time.