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Welcome to Keith Knight. 
Don't tread on anyone in the 

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Libertarian Institute. 
Today I am joined by Jank Ugar, 

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author of Justice Is Coming, How
Progressives Are Going to Take 

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Over the Country and America Is 
Going To Love It. 

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He's the founder of The Young 
Turks and cofounder of Justice 

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Democrats. 
Mr. Ugar, where is the best 

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place to purchase the book? 
Thank you, Keith. 

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It's at tyt.com/justice, 
tyt.com/justice. 

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Awesome. 
Links for that will be in the 

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description below. 
Here is an article from The 

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Intercept. 
It says according to estimates 

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provided by the report, at least
86 civilians were killed in 

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airstrikes and raids carried out
in Yemen on Trump's watch. 

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Most of these killings occurred 
during the years 2017 and 2018. 

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Would you be in agreement with 
me that Donald Trump should be 

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in jail, not for this documents 
thing, but for killing 86 

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civilians in an undeclared war? 
Yeah, So look, there's an 

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argument to be made that all the
presidents who have done those 

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drone strikes have broken the 
law in one way or another. 

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I would argue that Obama had one
of the most egregious violations

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because they said that 
extrajudicial killings were OK, 

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which they are not. 
They're unconstitutional. 

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They killed Anwar Avlaki. 
They called him a terrorist. 

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And. 
Maybe he was, but we don't know.

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We never adjudicated it. 
And he was an American citizen. 

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And then they killed his two 
kids and two different bombings.

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So I think the drone strikes 
that we do are deeply 

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problematic. 
Are the American people going to

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be okay with putting Trump and 
Obama and and all Biden and 

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Bush, all of them, in prison? 
Probably not. 

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They're probably going to say 
that that was in the regular 

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course of their, you know, job 
of being president. 

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I might disagree. 
I don't know how you feel about 

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it, but unfortunately the 
American people have gotten used

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to it. 
What if we embraced the 

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progressive idea of equality and
just stop having double 

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standards for presidents and 
politicians? 

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If the Catholic Church, Amazon 
or I, or you killed 86 civilians

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in an attempt to decrease 
terrorism in the future, we'd be

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going to jail. 
Look, can we just embrace 

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equality and not have double 
standards? 

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Well, I would love that. 
So Keith, you also then agree, 

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right, when the Israeli military
kills civilians at about 100 to 

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one rate of the Palestinians and
say, Oh well, golly Gee, I was 

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just trying to stop terrorism. 
I wound up killing 100 times 

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your civilians. 
So while I was doing it. 

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Oh, but I'm innocent that that, 
that we should apply the same 

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standard to them. 
Unequivocally, yes. 

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OK, God bless. 
Yes, I agree with being 

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principled and disciplined. 
And and being fair to everyone, 

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yeah, when it comes to property 
taxes, that's how schools are 

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funded in Arizona, where I live.
I'm not really sure about other 

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states. 
If people are unhappy with the 

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results of the schooling system,
would you support their right to

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opt out of chipping in for 
schools? 

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No, but that's a complicated one
because. 

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Just the other day on on The 
Young Turks, the show that I 

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host the flagship show the TYT 
network, we were talking about 

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school boards and how 
progressives should run for 

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school boards and and somebody 
wrote in about being angry at 

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conservatives taking over school
boards and I said, look I don't 

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agree with their policies. 
I think that what they're trying

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to teach the kids is deeply 
problematic and and. 

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Pretty much proper conservative 
propaganda, but they have every 

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right to run for a school board.
It's called democracy. 

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So why don't you run and beat 
them? 

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And if you don't, it is what it 
is, right? 

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But it in terms of how they 
agree to, you know, what they 

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teach the kids. 
Yeah, that's tough because 

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you've got to balance the 
parents interest with facts. 

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So if the parents wanted to 
teach 2 + 2 = 13. 

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We can't. 
I'm sorry. 

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I know you think it equals 13, 
but it doesn't. 

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And so no matter how emotional 
you are about the fact that it 

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equals 13, it still doesn't. 
So that's why it's a really 

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interesting, tough balancing act
as to what we decide to teach 

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our kids, Yes. 
And when it comes to something 

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like that, as far as having a 
discipline mechanism of keeping 

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people honest, I think allowing 
people to vote with their 

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dollars and opt out of funding 
them, just as if any private 

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organization was doing a poor 
job, we'd be able to 

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disassociate with them. 
Why not be able to opt out of 

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funding schools? 
So Keith, the reason for that is

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because if if we allow people to
start opting out of taxes based 

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on their personal proclivities. 
Then everybody would opt out of 

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taxes for everything. 
So, and for example, I think the

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Pentagon's a joke. 
I think it's a that of 

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corruption. 
They can't never haven't passed 

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an audit in five years. 
They can't account for half the 

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money we send them. 
I think it's organized robbery. 

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Do I want to pay taxes to have 
my money stolen by a bunch of 

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defense contractors? 
No, I don't. 

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But I can't opt out of it, 
because if I opt out of it, my 

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neighbor opts out of it. 
And he opts out of it for a 

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different reason than the guy 
that on the street OPS out for a

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different and then nobody pays 
their taxes and we don't have a 

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government and we have Anarch, 
OK, in the case of the Pentagon,

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when they actually have a number
of things provoking a World War 

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on 2 fronts against Russia and 
China, all the civilians they 

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killed. 
Even in that case, people should

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be forced to chip into an 
organization which is in the 

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process of killing civilians and
provoking a World War on 2 

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fronts. 
Yeah, that's how democracy 

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works. 
And I know when you frame it 

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that way, it sounds super 
uncomfortable and awkward, and 

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that can't be right, can it? 
Yeah, well, that's the thing you

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That's why we if you're a 
libertarian on the right or 

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you're progressive on the left, 
that is why it's imperative to 

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get involved in democracy and to
win. 

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Because by definition, democracy
is communal. 

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We all are voting for a certain 
set of leaders and those leaders

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are going to do a certain set of
actions and we cannot 

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micromanage them and so. 
The in in a way, you might want 

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to say, hey, but we should. 
Well, OK, then you have to talk 

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about tradeoffs, right? 
So for example, in California, 

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there's an enormous number of 
ballot measures. 

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And so there's a great upside to
that because it allows us to say

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no, no, this is what I want you 
to spend my money on, and I'm 

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going to vote yes or no. 
And it's a little bit more 

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direct democracy. 
Now the giant downside of that 

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is that it leads to endless 
ballot measures that are 

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purposely confusing. 
And half, half the time they're 

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phrased to get you to do the 
opposite of what it sounds like.

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And then giant corporations come
in with millions, sometimes 

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hundreds of millions of dollars 
in advertising to trick people. 

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And then and then they ask you 
to vote on judges. 

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How the hell does anybody know 
all the experience of all the 

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different judges, right? 
And then So what happens then 

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big companies come in and buy 
off all the judges. 

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So these issues are complicated.
And there's not an easy answer 

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of like, well, I don't want to 
pay for that, so I'm not going 

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to pay for it. 
Yeah, I hear your brother. 

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But then nobody will pay for 
anything, and we'll have 

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anarchy. 
But well, as far as whether it 

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would be chaotic, governments 
have caused a great deal of 

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chaos with the First World War, 
the Second World War, the proxy 

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wars during the Cold War. 
So it's not like anarchy is 

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unique to chaos. 
But when it comes to really 

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empowering the workers, if these
corporations who can't take a 

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penny out of my pocket unless I 
voluntarily give it to him, 

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versus a state which claims the 
right to jail me if I don't chip

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in for their programs whether 
they work or not, isn't the 

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state a much bigger exploiter 
than the corporation? 

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No, And I'll explain why. 
This is a core part of the book.

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Justice coming so, so, the 
state. 

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In a The way that the Founding 
Fathers set it up is supposed to

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represent the people. 
And for a long time it actually 

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did. 
And I also explained that in the

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book. 
And when the state does its job 

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and it's a real democracy and it
represents people, it is a 

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beautiful thing. 
And so I know that the 

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government is maligned and 
attacked and attacked, and 

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sometimes by libertarians for 
good principled reasons, but 

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oftentimes like by corporations 
for their own purposes, which 

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I'll get to in a second. 
But for example, and a lot of 

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examples of this in American 
industry, but in that between 

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1938 and 1978, on social issues 
we were a mess. 

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But on economic issues, we had 
real democracy. 

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And our representatives actually
represented us. 

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And they set up some of the most
popular programs the world has 

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ever seen. 
And they built the greatest 

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middle class the world has ever 
seen. 

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OK, so now on the other hand, 
corporations. 

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The Founding Fathers warned us 
greatly about they said watch 

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out, these guys will take over 
and they are not representative.

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They are not built to be 
representative. 

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They are not meant to help you. 
They're meant to help 

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themselves, and there's still a 
need for them. 

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But as James Madison said, 
they're at best and necessary 

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evil. 
And remember that the American 

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Revolution was just as much 
against the British East India 

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Tea Company as it was about. 
Against the British Empire 

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because at that point the 
British companies had taken over

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the British Empire and it was 
the their tea that they had 

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thrown in the harbor at the 
Boston Tea Party. 

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So what wound up happening is 
the founding father said be 

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super careful, do not let these 
corporations form unless they 

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promised to deliver, not just 
for their customers and their 

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shareholders, but for the entire
community, right. 

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And eventually we lost track of 
that and and in 1978, the 

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Supreme Court. 
Killed off our democracy by 

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allowing bribery, they said. 
Corporations can give unlimited 

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money to politicians. 
There's nuance there in the 

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decisions of 7678 and then 
eventually Citizens United, but 

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that was the thrust of it. 
You could tell from the 

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dissenting opinions. 
So one of the justices wrote in 

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and said. 
This is a mortal danger to our 

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democracy because companies do 
not care about the general 

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welfare. 
They only care about their own 

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welfare and they will crush 
everything in their path to 

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maximize profit because that's 
what we built them to do. 

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He was 100% right. 
That's exactly what happened. 

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And brother, the number one 
problem with government today is

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that corporations are allowed to
bribe our representatives and 

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turn them into their 
representatives. 

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That's why the government has 
become organized robbery in a 

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lot of ways. 
So when I say you got to pay 

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your taxes so that we can have 
an efficient, logical 

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infrastructure, I'm not saying 
that I love what the 

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government's doing now. 
I mean, as a progressive, 

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there's. 
Tons and tons and tons of things

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that the government's doing that
I can't stand. 

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But what is the core of the 
problem is the core of the 

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problem. 
The politicians woke up and 

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they're like, like there's some 
on the right think, oh, I have a

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lust for power and I want to 
control people's lives. 

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I could make an argument for 
that for some right wingers, but

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and by the way, some extreme 
left wingers too, OK, but that's

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not the thrust of the problem. 
The thrust of the problem is 

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they're getting millions of 
dollars in checks. 

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That, and they're doing exactly 
what they're paid for. 

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They are servants of the 
corporate class. 

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And the corporate class says let
us committed unadulterated 

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bribery, unadulterated robbery 
of the American people. 

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For example, right now we give 
about $20 billion in subsidies 

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to the oil companies. 
Why They're the most. 

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They're the. 
Most profitable companies the 

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world has ever seen and they 
dump all of their costs on us. 

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Pollution, climate change, you 
name it. 

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And they increase prices 
massively the minute that they 

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can. 
But we're giving them our hard 

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earned dollars. 
I loathe that the problem isn't 

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that the government officials 
just love oil companies by 

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nature, or want to give away 
your sovereignty to oil 

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companies. 
No, they're getting bribed by 

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the oil companies. 
The core of the problem is the 

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00:12:06,700 --> 00:12:10,100
bribery and the corruption and 
the corporate class that has 

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00:12:10,100 --> 00:12:13,580
taken over this country, not the
servants they have in 

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00:12:13,580 --> 00:12:18,700
government, Is offering free 
college to everyone at taxpayer 

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00:12:18,700 --> 00:12:19,620
expense. 
A bribe. 

231
00:12:21,300 --> 00:12:23,420
No, because you're serving the 
people. 

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00:12:23,660 --> 00:12:29,120
So for example if you say hey. 
Keith gave or Jake me, I gave 

233
00:12:29,400 --> 00:12:32,160
1,000,000 bucks to a whole bunch
of senators and then they gave 

234
00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:35,040
me a subsidy for a couple of 
billion dollars for the couple 

235
00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:37,600
of $1,000,000 that I bribed 
them, which by the way is very, 

236
00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:39,880
very common. 
So I can in the book I explain 

237
00:12:39,880 --> 00:12:42,320
how Sheldon Adelson did that a 
couple of times with Donald 

238
00:12:42,320 --> 00:12:44,840
Trump. 
But by the way, yeah, Soros does

239
00:12:44,840 --> 00:12:47,520
it with Democrats and Koch 
brothers, does it do it with 

240
00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:50,080
Republicans, etcetera, that 
there's something deeply wrong 

241
00:12:50,080 --> 00:12:52,080
with that because they're saying
do not serve the general 

242
00:12:52,080 --> 00:12:54,480
welfare, only serve my interest,
right? 

243
00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:57,360
But if you're serving the 
general welfare, that's exactly 

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00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:02,040
what the government supposed to 
do when it comes to the minimum 

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00:13:02,040 --> 00:13:05,400
wage issue. 
I worked at Walmart previously 

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00:13:05,400 --> 00:13:09,720
and both our previous and 
current CEOH Lee Scott and Doug 

247
00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:13,120
McMullen came out in support of 
increasing the federal minimum 

248
00:13:13,120 --> 00:13:15,600
wage. 
Amazon has voluntarily embraced 

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00:13:15,600 --> 00:13:20,370
a $15.00 an hour minimum wage 
and recommends that the federal 

250
00:13:20,370 --> 00:13:22,010
government embraced the same 
thing. 

251
00:13:22,130 --> 00:13:25,410
Why are these big corporations 
advocating for the same thing? 

252
00:13:25,410 --> 00:13:27,290
The Justice Democrats and the 
DSAR. 

253
00:13:27,650 --> 00:13:31,010
Yeah, so Amazon's a great 
example. 

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00:13:31,010 --> 00:13:34,330
That's why I did voluntarily. 
So I'm really glad you brought 

255
00:13:34,330 --> 00:13:37,170
that up. 
So Amazon of course, did not 

256
00:13:37,170 --> 00:13:39,650
want to pay 59 minimum wage. 
Why, if you just think about it,

257
00:13:39,650 --> 00:13:41,650
if you're an average American 
worker and you're listening to 

258
00:13:41,650 --> 00:13:43,930
this. 
Do you think that corporations 

259
00:13:43,970 --> 00:13:46,530
have your best interests in mind
and they voluntarily want to pay

260
00:13:46,530 --> 00:13:48,370
you as high a wage as they 
possibly can? 

261
00:13:49,170 --> 00:13:51,170
Everyone listening knows no, 
they don't. 

262
00:13:51,290 --> 00:13:53,770
They have their best interests 
in mind and they want to pay you

263
00:13:53,770 --> 00:13:56,970
as low a wage as they possibly 
can because it keep their keeps 

264
00:13:56,970 --> 00:13:58,850
their costs low. 
We all get it. 

265
00:13:58,930 --> 00:14:00,890
We all get it. 
They want costs low. 

266
00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:03,400
Profits. 
Revenues high, so you can 

267
00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:05,280
maximize profit, right? 
So. 

268
00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:09,080
And you are their cost. 
So Amazon fought that tooth and 

269
00:14:09,080 --> 00:14:10,560
nail. 
They didn't want $15 minimum 

270
00:14:10,560 --> 00:14:13,720
wage at all. 
And Bernie Sanders and and Ro 

271
00:14:13,720 --> 00:14:16,880
Khanna in the House 2. 
Progressives started building 

272
00:14:17,120 --> 00:14:20,960
tremendous pressure on Amazon. 
They introduced a bill called 

273
00:14:20,960 --> 00:14:25,000
Stop Bezos Act, and they started
pounding away at Jeff Bezos and 

274
00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:29,830
Amazon to try to get a quality. 
And to deliver for their workers

275
00:14:30,110 --> 00:14:33,910
and everyone in mainstream media
or corporate media which 

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00:14:33,910 --> 00:14:38,150
despises both the right wing and
the left wing, They love the 

277
00:14:38,150 --> 00:14:40,390
corporate middle. 
It's not actually the middle of 

278
00:14:40,390 --> 00:14:42,670
the country, It's the middle of 
corporations. 

279
00:14:42,950 --> 00:14:45,750
They have nothing but scorn for 
Bernie and Roe, and they're 

280
00:14:45,750 --> 00:14:48,540
like. 
That's not how things work. 

281
00:14:48,740 --> 00:14:51,940
You can't pressure that poor, 
poor company to deliver for 

282
00:14:51,940 --> 00:14:55,020
their lowly wages. 
Who cares about their employees?

283
00:14:55,140 --> 00:14:57,620
How dare you do this? 
And this is not practical. 

284
00:14:57,820 --> 00:14:59,140
Progressives can't get anything 
done. 

285
00:14:59,220 --> 00:15:00,300
You know what happened? 
No. 

286
00:15:00,820 --> 00:15:05,220
Ro Khanna and Bernie Sanders 
kicked Amazon's ass until they 

287
00:15:05,220 --> 00:15:08,140
surrendered. 
And there's this famous video 

288
00:15:08,140 --> 00:15:12,460
now when Amazon manager has to 
go out into the plant and say we

289
00:15:12,460 --> 00:15:16,180
are now raising all of the wages
to $15.00 an hour. 

290
00:15:16,570 --> 00:15:19,450
And the plant goes nuts and 
everybody celebrates. 

291
00:15:19,690 --> 00:15:22,210
That's what progressives can do 
when they're fighting for the 

292
00:15:22,410 --> 00:15:26,210
average man, right? 
So now the genius of that move 

293
00:15:26,210 --> 00:15:29,690
is not just to put pressure on 
Amazon and to get them to move. 

294
00:15:30,130 --> 00:15:33,530
But they knew, and this is smart
and this is how you get things 

295
00:15:33,530 --> 00:15:38,330
done, that as soon as Amazon 
moved to $15 minimum wage, they 

296
00:15:38,330 --> 00:15:41,490
were going to try to get 
everyone else to move to $15 

297
00:15:41,490 --> 00:15:43,530
minimum wage because they didn't
want to be at a competitive 

298
00:15:43,810 --> 00:15:46,590
disadvantage. 
So they turn Amazon from their 

299
00:15:46,590 --> 00:15:50,030
enemy to their ally by getting 
them to move first. 

300
00:15:50,470 --> 00:15:53,230
So that's how you deliver for 
Americans, by pushing 

301
00:15:53,230 --> 00:15:57,070
corporations to do the right 
thing and not just hoping that 

302
00:15:57,070 --> 00:15:59,350
they do it voluntarily, which is
never going to happen. 

303
00:16:00,030 --> 00:16:03,830
It's not just hoping if there's 
a union who goes on strike and 

304
00:16:03,830 --> 00:16:07,030
says we refuse to spend one more
second of our time working, 

305
00:16:07,230 --> 00:16:10,750
that's a totally legitimate way 
of using the leverage that you 

306
00:16:10,750 --> 00:16:15,030
have in the marketplace. 
So are there any legal 

307
00:16:15,030 --> 00:16:18,070
sanctions, or does anyone at 
Amazon go to jail if they don't 

308
00:16:18,070 --> 00:16:20,350
pay 15? 
It just sounds like a ton of 

309
00:16:20,350 --> 00:16:22,430
voluntary pressure, which is 
totally legitimate. 

310
00:16:23,030 --> 00:16:24,870
Yeah. 
No, I think that there's. 

311
00:16:24,870 --> 00:16:27,150
So first of all, things don't 
have to be binary. 

312
00:16:27,150 --> 00:16:28,990
They don't have to be 0 or one, 
right. 

313
00:16:28,990 --> 00:16:30,470
We either do nothing or we do 
something. 

314
00:16:30,470 --> 00:16:33,470
There's a wide spectrum. 
So if someone's not following a 

315
00:16:33,470 --> 00:16:35,390
government regulation, there's a
lot of different things you 

316
00:16:35,390 --> 00:16:38,270
could do before you get to. 
Prison, which is pretty extreme,

317
00:16:38,310 --> 00:16:41,110
right? 
But should some corporate 

318
00:16:41,110 --> 00:16:43,990
executives go to prison for some
of their transgressions? 

319
00:16:44,070 --> 00:16:46,790
Absolutely. 
Do they ever know? 

320
00:16:47,070 --> 00:16:48,950
I'll give you a great example, 
Rick Scott. 

321
00:16:49,230 --> 00:16:51,870
He's the current senator from 
Florida, and he's one of the 

322
00:16:51,870 --> 00:16:53,590
biggest crooks in American 
history. 

323
00:16:53,830 --> 00:16:57,070
He committed the largest 
Medicare fraud and they had to 

324
00:16:57,070 --> 00:16:58,510
pay. 
And by the way, his company 

325
00:16:58,710 --> 00:17:02,350
admitted it and they confessed. 
They were found guilty. 

326
00:17:02,940 --> 00:17:06,260
They had two different sets of 
books and they had to pay a $1.7

327
00:17:06,260 --> 00:17:10,380
billion fine, which was just a 
fraction of the money that they 

328
00:17:10,380 --> 00:17:13,819
stole from your grandmother and 
your grandfather when they 

329
00:17:13,819 --> 00:17:15,740
stole, purposely stole from 
Medicare. 

330
00:17:15,980 --> 00:17:18,740
The guy who ran the company was 
the CEO was Rick Scott. 

331
00:17:19,420 --> 00:17:23,819
So the company was guilty, but 
nobody went to jail. 

332
00:17:24,180 --> 00:17:26,740
So they stole a couple of 
billion dollars at a minimum, 

333
00:17:27,260 --> 00:17:29,820
but only the company was guilty.
But you can't put the company in

334
00:17:29,820 --> 00:17:33,680
jail and the company. 
It still exists. 

335
00:17:33,960 --> 00:17:35,840
And Rick Scott, you know what he
got for that? 

336
00:17:36,120 --> 00:17:40,240
He didn't get prison time. 
The company paid him $300 

337
00:17:40,360 --> 00:17:43,320
million on the way out for a 
robbery. 

338
00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:46,960
Well done. 
And so this is the absurd system

339
00:17:46,960 --> 00:17:51,720
that we have now where these 
corporate machines rule us all. 

340
00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:55,480
And then they could rob you and 
then laugh in your face and 

341
00:17:55,480 --> 00:17:57,240
reward the guy who did the 
robbery. 

342
00:17:57,360 --> 00:17:59,160
And then he became governor and 
senator. 

343
00:17:59,720 --> 00:18:02,240
So yes, there are some 
situations where corporate 

344
00:18:02,240 --> 00:18:06,080
executives should go to jail. 
But if you don't start with that

345
00:18:06,120 --> 00:18:09,800
sanction that you move up to 
that for egregious actions like 

346
00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:13,280
the one Rick Scott did exactly. 
There are certainly evil 

347
00:18:13,280 --> 00:18:17,360
corporations, Boeing, Northrop 
Grumman, Raytheon and I. 

348
00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:20,640
My whole thing is we got to be 
able to disassociate with them 

349
00:18:20,640 --> 00:18:24,160
in our time and money. 
So if I take that minimum wage 

350
00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:29,450
example that all work, it would 
be mandatory payment of $15.00 

351
00:18:29,450 --> 00:18:31,170
an hour. 
Is that what you're advocating? 

352
00:18:32,810 --> 00:18:34,610
Yeah. 
If you have a federal minimum 

353
00:18:34,610 --> 00:18:38,130
wage or state minimum wage of 
$15, yeah, you have to pay $15. 

354
00:18:38,130 --> 00:18:41,930
That's right. 
So if I go to college and spend 

355
00:18:41,930 --> 00:18:45,810
4 years of time working there, I
did, and I got paid $0.00 an 

356
00:18:45,810 --> 00:18:48,170
hour. 
That was me choosing to labor 

357
00:18:48,570 --> 00:18:52,450
very difficult conditions, even 
homework for $0.00 an hour while

358
00:18:52,450 --> 00:18:54,970
the college raked in millions of
dollars a year. 

359
00:18:55,290 --> 00:18:57,730
Is that a violation of the 
minimum wage principal? 

360
00:18:58,490 --> 00:19:00,370
No, because you're volunteering 
for it. 

361
00:19:00,370 --> 00:19:03,210
So let me explain. 
First of all, I did the same 

362
00:19:03,210 --> 00:19:06,690
thing and of course I wish I 
could get paid for the college, 

363
00:19:06,690 --> 00:19:08,850
for law school, etc. 
We all wish it right. 

364
00:19:08,850 --> 00:19:13,730
But that is just a wish and so 
I'll give you an example from 

365
00:19:13,930 --> 00:19:16,890
the left wing criticism that I 
don't agree with so. 

366
00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:22,360
If you remember, HuffPost back 
in the day used to have a ton of

367
00:19:22,360 --> 00:19:25,520
bloggers including me and a 
bunch of celebrities, Bill 

368
00:19:25,520 --> 00:19:29,400
Maher, John Cusack, etc. 
And and they all and that was a 

369
00:19:29,400 --> 00:19:31,280
huge part of the website and a 
huge part of what made it 

370
00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:36,680
popular and and profitable etc. 
And then they wound up selling 

371
00:19:36,680 --> 00:19:40,700
it to AOL for $315 million. 
And all those bloggers who had 

372
00:19:40,700 --> 00:19:42,460
done it for free? 
Not all, but a lot. 

373
00:19:42,500 --> 00:19:45,740
A lot of them came forward and 
said Ariana Huffington owes us 

374
00:19:45,740 --> 00:19:50,100
money because we blog for her. 
That was our labor and she 

375
00:19:50,100 --> 00:19:51,780
didn't pay us. 
And now she got rich. 

376
00:19:52,540 --> 00:19:54,140
Nope. 
Wrong. 

377
00:19:54,580 --> 00:19:56,260
I was one of the biggest 
bloggers. 

378
00:19:56,260 --> 00:19:58,020
There was actually top three on 
the site. 

379
00:19:58,300 --> 00:20:02,100
I blogged probably more than 
almost anyone on the site. 

380
00:20:02,100 --> 00:20:04,620
I put in a ton of hours there. 
I did it all for free. 

381
00:20:04,620 --> 00:20:06,980
Why? 
Because it wasn't actually free.

382
00:20:07,470 --> 00:20:09,310
I was getting something else in 
return. 

383
00:20:09,390 --> 00:20:11,710
We weren't all suckers. 
We were doing it for a reason. 

384
00:20:11,870 --> 00:20:15,950
And what I was getting in return
was publicity and promotion. 

385
00:20:16,270 --> 00:20:20,030
And my blog kept popping up on 
the front page of one of the 

386
00:20:20,030 --> 00:20:21,710
most popular websites in the 
country. 

387
00:20:22,030 --> 00:20:25,350
So you can't squelch on the deal
afterwards and go, Well, I 

388
00:20:25,350 --> 00:20:27,950
wanted the free publicity and 
that's why I was writing. 

389
00:20:28,070 --> 00:20:30,590
But now that you got money, I 
want it. 

390
00:20:30,590 --> 00:20:31,790
I want it. 
No, give it to me. 

391
00:20:31,790 --> 00:20:34,510
No, that was not the deal. 
And the same with colleges. 

392
00:20:34,980 --> 00:20:39,460
So you went there voluntarily to
get an education and that's the 

393
00:20:39,460 --> 00:20:41,540
deal. 
And and that education both 

394
00:20:41,820 --> 00:20:44,900
enriches your life and allows 
you to get a better paying job. 

395
00:20:45,180 --> 00:20:48,620
That was the deal. 
Now these colleges turn into 

396
00:20:48,620 --> 00:20:50,940
highway robbery too. 
But as long as you're 

397
00:20:50,940 --> 00:20:54,140
volunteering to go, and probably
we will with our kids, then 

398
00:20:54,140 --> 00:20:56,460
that's our problem and that's 
the choice we made. 

399
00:20:57,500 --> 00:21:01,260
So if I voluntarily agree with 
an employer to work for $0.00 an

400
00:21:01,260 --> 00:21:04,740
hour at an internship or one or 
two, or $3.00 an hour. 

401
00:21:05,090 --> 00:21:06,970
That would mean that we 
shouldn't have a minimum wage 

402
00:21:06,970 --> 00:21:09,610
because I'm doing it voluntarily
and that's the upfront agreement

403
00:21:09,730 --> 00:21:12,210
and I'm doing it to get on the 
job experience so I can be a 

404
00:21:12,210 --> 00:21:14,690
better, more skillful employee 
in the future and demand a 

405
00:21:14,690 --> 00:21:17,520
higher wage. 
So yeah. 

406
00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:20,480
So yes and no. 
So once the government lays down

407
00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:22,080
some rules, you have to follow 
them. 

408
00:21:22,320 --> 00:21:24,640
So the colleges aren't violating
any rules. 

409
00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:26,760
HuffPost didn't violate any 
government rules. 

410
00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:30,840
But if you allow for voluntary 
$2.00 an hour, then there's 

411
00:21:30,840 --> 00:21:33,760
going to be economic pressure 
for $2.00 an hour and then it 

412
00:21:33,760 --> 00:21:35,320
destroys the point of the 
regulation. 

413
00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:37,880
So the regulations that I know 
the libertarians viewed as a 

414
00:21:37,880 --> 00:21:40,880
super dirty word. 
It's just a another word for law

415
00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:44,040
and we need laws, otherwise we 
can't function together. 

416
00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:47,160
But on the other hand, if you 
say, hey, I would like to or 

417
00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:49,480
about something in the 
regulations or the law that 

418
00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:53,040
allows for internships where you
work for $0.00 voluntarily, 

419
00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:56,680
because what you're getting back
is experience, Yeah, that's 

420
00:21:56,680 --> 00:21:58,440
fair. 
That's a perfectly fair point. 

421
00:21:58,560 --> 00:21:59,920
And in fact I agree with that 
point. 

422
00:21:59,920 --> 00:22:01,920
I think that their internship 
should be allowed. 

423
00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:04,600
I think the internship rules now
are a little too strict. 

424
00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:07,760
But by the way, if I find that 
the rules are not exactly right,

425
00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:10,120
I lobby against them. 
You know, just verbally. 

426
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:14,800
I don't have a lot of money, but
but I still follow them and 

427
00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:18,740
that's the way things should be.
But if $0.00 an hour is okay for

428
00:22:18,980 --> 00:22:22,140
my work as an intern, what's 
wrong with one or two or three 

429
00:22:22,140 --> 00:22:24,660
or five? 
Yeah, Why can't I get some 

430
00:22:24,660 --> 00:22:27,740
compensation? 
Because of the economic leverage

431
00:22:27,740 --> 00:22:32,780
that you talked about earlier. 
So when we the government in in 

432
00:22:32,780 --> 00:22:35,260
the book, justice is coming, I 
argue for. 

433
00:22:35,980 --> 00:22:38,060
So Bernie calls the democratic 
socialism. 

434
00:22:38,380 --> 00:22:40,140
I'm not a socialist, I'm a 
capitalist. 

435
00:22:40,300 --> 00:22:43,610
And so there's A and we we 
believe in very similar rules, 

436
00:22:43,610 --> 00:22:46,570
but there is an important 
difference and and the way that 

437
00:22:46,570 --> 00:22:50,410
I frame it is I believe the 
democracy should check 

438
00:22:50,770 --> 00:22:53,570
capitalism. 
So the capitalism means the 

439
00:22:53,570 --> 00:22:55,730
companies are out for 
themselves, okay, no problem, 

440
00:22:55,810 --> 00:22:57,930
right. 
But they need to be somebody out

441
00:22:57,930 --> 00:23:00,010
there, out for you, to protect 
you. 

442
00:23:00,410 --> 00:23:05,410
And so before the government did
that, capitalism ran wild. 

443
00:23:05,570 --> 00:23:10,650
And so we had a seven day work 
week or at least a six day work 

444
00:23:10,650 --> 00:23:12,890
week for sure. 
And often times people were 

445
00:23:12,890 --> 00:23:14,770
pressured into seven days a 
week. 

446
00:23:15,010 --> 00:23:19,210
We had child labor, we didn't 
have 40 hour week, we didn't 

447
00:23:19,210 --> 00:23:21,210
have the concept of overtime 
etcetera. 

448
00:23:21,690 --> 00:23:26,290
And the economic leverage and 
power of the companies created a

449
00:23:26,290 --> 00:23:30,250
situation where people had to 
volunteer for seven days a week,

450
00:23:30,250 --> 00:23:33,250
otherwise they'd be fired. 
They had to volunteer to have 

451
00:23:33,250 --> 00:23:35,850
their 12 year olds go down a 
coal mine, otherwise they 

452
00:23:35,850 --> 00:23:39,010
weren't going to be able to eat.
It's too much power and leverage

453
00:23:39,010 --> 00:23:42,170
and you need the government to 
equal that out to some degree by

454
00:23:42,290 --> 00:23:46,530
allowing for unions, by passing 
some reasonable regulations so 

455
00:23:46,530 --> 00:23:49,410
we could have weekends, etc, and
protect the American people. 

456
00:23:49,610 --> 00:23:52,090
So it's a balancing act. 
It's a balancing act between 

457
00:23:52,330 --> 00:23:56,030
regulation and and and leverage 
and power and all of these 

458
00:23:56,030 --> 00:23:59,390
things to create a situation. 
And in that balancing act, if 

459
00:23:59,390 --> 00:24:03,110
you don't set a floor for wages,
corporations will have too much 

460
00:24:03,110 --> 00:24:06,950
power and be able to drive 
prices down and then pretend 

461
00:24:06,950 --> 00:24:09,710
that it's all voluntary. 
When in reality the worker 

462
00:24:09,710 --> 00:24:12,230
doesn't want to volunteer for 
$2.00 or $7.00. 

463
00:24:12,510 --> 00:24:16,070
That they're only forced into 
those market conditions when the

464
00:24:16,070 --> 00:24:17,710
government doesn't work to 
protect them. 

465
00:24:19,710 --> 00:24:22,910
When it comes to things like 
child labor, is that unique to 

466
00:24:22,910 --> 00:24:24,710
capitalism? 
My understanding is kids have 

467
00:24:24,710 --> 00:24:27,830
been working since ancient 
Mesopotamia and it's not it 

468
00:24:27,830 --> 00:24:30,990
applied to capitalism, but it's 
not unique in any way. 

469
00:24:30,990 --> 00:24:32,550
Is that your understanding of 
history? 

470
00:24:33,750 --> 00:24:38,630
Oh, definitely. 
Look, humans are beautiful, 

471
00:24:38,630 --> 00:24:40,470
wonderful, cooperative 
creatures. 

472
00:24:40,470 --> 00:24:45,430
And we're also ugly, 
competitive, dangerous 

473
00:24:45,430 --> 00:24:46,950
creatures. 
We are both. 

474
00:24:47,070 --> 00:24:48,870
And we live in that balance. 
OK. 

475
00:24:49,190 --> 00:24:53,430
And if you allow people to do 
whatever they want, not 

476
00:24:53,430 --> 00:24:57,910
everyone, but some group of 
people will rise up that will do

477
00:24:57,990 --> 00:25:01,750
anything to get power, wealth, 
privilege, status, etcetera. 

478
00:25:02,110 --> 00:25:04,710
And so will they use child 
labor? 

479
00:25:04,710 --> 00:25:06,790
Of course they will. 
Will they do slavery? 

480
00:25:06,790 --> 00:25:09,470
Of course they will. 
Will they destroy the planet to 

481
00:25:09,510 --> 00:25:11,710
just make an extra nickel? 
Of course they will. 

482
00:25:12,150 --> 00:25:14,670
So not everyone will. 
In fact, most people won't, but 

483
00:25:14,670 --> 00:25:16,950
some will. 
And if you let them run amok, 

484
00:25:17,190 --> 00:25:18,790
they will do those terrible 
things. 

485
00:25:18,990 --> 00:25:20,590
It is not at all unique to 
America. 

486
00:25:20,590 --> 00:25:24,190
The whole world is done in and 
and it's been done historically.

487
00:25:24,190 --> 00:25:27,430
That is why it's important to 
have a democracy where we all 

488
00:25:27,430 --> 00:25:28,670
get together and go, you know 
what? 

489
00:25:28,990 --> 00:25:32,310
We're not comfortable with that 
and we're going to use our power

490
00:25:32,510 --> 00:25:36,470
as a combined community to say, 
get your hands off our kids, 

491
00:25:36,750 --> 00:25:39,990
then you cannot send them down a
coal mine when they're 12. 

492
00:25:40,190 --> 00:25:41,830
We're going to set some 
boundaries here. 

493
00:25:41,830 --> 00:25:44,630
We're going to set some laws 
that you have to abide by. 

494
00:25:46,390 --> 00:25:51,310
When it comes to empowering the 
workers, the thing that stood 

495
00:25:51,310 --> 00:25:54,710
out to me was research from the 
Cato Institute saying jobs 

496
00:25:54,710 --> 00:25:58,310
requiring an occupational 
license increased from 5% in the

497
00:25:58,310 --> 00:26:03,630
1950s to 22% in 2021. 
So if we know that needing a 

498
00:26:03,630 --> 00:26:07,990
license to vote hurts the poor, 
needing many licenses to get 

499
00:26:07,990 --> 00:26:12,270
your job and years of schooling 
hurts the poor even more and 

500
00:26:12,270 --> 00:26:14,670
actually stops them from getting
the job in their dreams. 

501
00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:17,280
The job of their dream stops 
them from getting their foot in 

502
00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:19,080
the door. 
Would you support 

503
00:26:19,120 --> 00:26:23,000
decriminalizing all economic 
activity between consenting 

504
00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:25,640
adults and abolishing 
occupational licensing to 

505
00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:28,280
empower workers? 
No, absolutely not. 

506
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:30,880
So again, we have a balancing 
act here. 

507
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:33,640
If you say, hey, it's gotten a 
little too much, 22 percent's a 

508
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:35,840
lot. 
And I'm not sure that we need 

509
00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:40,360
incredibly stringent board 
certification for hairdressers. 

510
00:26:41,270 --> 00:26:43,510
I said, maybe you're right. 
I mean, I there's a lot of 

511
00:26:43,830 --> 00:26:46,790
barbers in Turkey with my, the 
country I originally came from. 

512
00:26:47,110 --> 00:26:48,910
And I don't think they're board 
certified by anyone. 

513
00:26:48,910 --> 00:26:50,710
They do a perfectly good job. 
OK. 

514
00:26:50,710 --> 00:26:52,430
And. 
And the market decides which 

515
00:26:52,430 --> 00:26:54,310
hairdresser or Barber you'd like
to go to. 

516
00:26:54,670 --> 00:26:57,350
But if you're saying we don't 
need board certification or any 

517
00:26:57,350 --> 00:27:01,190
kind of licensing for doctors. 
Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. 

518
00:27:01,190 --> 00:27:03,830
I don't agree. 
So because then the doctor comes

519
00:27:03,830 --> 00:27:06,150
up and goes, oh, yeah, I got 
this ivermectin. 

520
00:27:06,150 --> 00:27:06,830
Sure. 
Yeah. 

521
00:27:07,070 --> 00:27:10,920
I know it's for worms inside 
your stomach, but I'm going to 

522
00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:14,160
pretend that it's for COVID and 
it doesn't help at all. 

523
00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:16,080
But haha, the government can't 
do anything about it. 

524
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:18,520
I can lie to you all day long. 
Oh, cancer. 

525
00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:19,480
Yeah. 
You know what? 

526
00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:22,080
I'm going to pray over it or I'm
going to give you this snake oil

527
00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:24,440
and that's going to solve it. 
No, we're not going to let you 

528
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:28,080
harm people's health or cost 
them their lives. 

529
00:27:29,120 --> 00:27:32,640
If you're in an important 
position like that by saying, 

530
00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:35,080
oh, it's a free for all, and 
you'll figure out if you were at

531
00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:39,670
the right doctor after you died.
But that is an actual example of

532
00:27:39,670 --> 00:27:42,630
my body, my choice. 
I can take any medicine from any

533
00:27:42,630 --> 00:27:44,950
doctor because I'm like 
consenting adult kids. 

534
00:27:44,950 --> 00:27:46,710
Different story. 
You're correct on that issue. 

535
00:27:47,030 --> 00:27:50,790
But this is an actual my body, 
my choice issue where if I want 

536
00:27:50,790 --> 00:27:54,590
to make an exchange with a 
doctor of who was certified, 

537
00:27:54,590 --> 00:27:56,830
maybe in another country, maybe 
in another state, maybe they're 

538
00:27:56,830 --> 00:27:59,190
going through medical school. 
Why can't I do that? 

539
00:27:59,190 --> 00:28:02,030
Why should the state forcibly 
stop us from achieving something

540
00:28:02,030 --> 00:28:04,990
we want to achieve? 
So there's two parts of that. 

541
00:28:05,150 --> 00:28:08,130
So number one, as long as 
they're clearly labeled, let 

542
00:28:08,130 --> 00:28:12,850
let's say they're a doctor from 
Trinidad, Okay, perfectly great 

543
00:28:12,850 --> 00:28:16,450
country and and their medical 
schools are fine. 

544
00:28:16,450 --> 00:28:18,730
But on the other hand, you know,
I don't know which of their 

545
00:28:18,730 --> 00:28:20,690
medical school school you went 
to, right? 

546
00:28:20,930 --> 00:28:22,130
So I don't know if it was a good
one. 

547
00:28:22,130 --> 00:28:24,050
It was a terrible one. 
It's a sham. 

548
00:28:24,050 --> 00:28:25,490
It's not. 
I have no idea, right. 

549
00:28:25,810 --> 00:28:29,410
But they put up a diploma and it
says it's from Trinidad and you 

550
00:28:29,410 --> 00:28:31,610
decide that you wanted to go to 
that doctor. 

551
00:28:33,300 --> 00:28:36,180
Okay, I can see it. 
But if they say they're a doctor

552
00:28:36,180 --> 00:28:39,900
and they're not a doctor, no, 
that's that's lying to you, 

553
00:28:40,420 --> 00:28:42,220
right. 
And so we're not going to allow 

554
00:28:42,220 --> 00:28:45,140
that. 
And so then if they say hey, or 

555
00:28:45,140 --> 00:28:48,220
they're licensed Dr. They went 
to American Medical school, 

556
00:28:48,220 --> 00:28:49,860
etcetera. 
And they go, hey, listen 

557
00:28:49,860 --> 00:28:53,940
brother, my opinion is that 
ivermectin works and then you go

558
00:28:53,940 --> 00:28:55,820
okay. 
I like it and I want to take it.

559
00:28:55,860 --> 00:28:59,460
I'm not going to stop you. 
Like everybody was high on 

560
00:28:59,700 --> 00:29:04,560
ivermectin during COVID, and I 
wanted people to take the right 

561
00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:07,000
medicine, so it saved their 
lives and we lost a million 

562
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:08,400
people. 
We can get into that debate, 

563
00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:11,000
etc. 
But if someone took ivermectin, 

564
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:14,240
I was like, don't let them. 
No, you could take it all day 

565
00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:17,000
long if you want, right? 
I'm just trying to help your 

566
00:29:17,000 --> 00:29:19,840
brother and so. 
And then there has to be rules 

567
00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:23,150
about how doctors can't lie to 
you because they could tell you,

568
00:29:23,150 --> 00:29:26,270
Oh my God, this bubble gum is 
gonna save you from cancer. 

569
00:29:26,550 --> 00:29:29,470
Oh my. 
Don't don't do proper treatment 

570
00:29:29,470 --> 00:29:32,630
that the other doctors tell you.
Take this magic bubble gum for 

571
00:29:32,630 --> 00:29:34,790
$1,000,000 and it'll save you of
your cancer. 

572
00:29:35,030 --> 00:29:37,390
No, we're not gonna let you lie 
to people and cost them their 

573
00:29:37,390 --> 00:29:39,470
lives. 
Excellent point. 

574
00:29:39,630 --> 00:29:42,190
I'm totally against fraud. 
Fraud should certainly be 

575
00:29:42,190 --> 00:29:44,310
prosecuted. 
The reason this is such an 

576
00:29:44,310 --> 00:29:48,350
intimate issue with me is I had 
a brachial plexus injury when I 

577
00:29:48,350 --> 00:29:50,470
was born. 
My arm is indefinitely broken 

578
00:29:50,470 --> 00:29:55,110
for 27 years. 
As a result of medical issues, I

579
00:29:55,230 --> 00:29:59,590
recent I go about a year ago. 
I was 290 pounds. 

580
00:29:59,590 --> 00:30:03,150
I was in very terrible shape and
I was just miserable. 

581
00:30:03,430 --> 00:30:06,750
Both of those things I went to 
doctors for a very long time and

582
00:30:06,750 --> 00:30:11,190
got no solutions, went to an 
unlicensed massage therapist and

583
00:30:11,190 --> 00:30:12,790
my arm is in better condition 
than ever. 

584
00:30:13,070 --> 00:30:17,030
And I heard about a lowcarb diet
and had to exercise from an 

585
00:30:17,310 --> 00:30:21,070
YouTube channel called Gravity 
Transformation Fat Loss Experts.

586
00:30:21,430 --> 00:30:25,030
And those two did more for my 
health than anything and I've 

587
00:30:25,030 --> 00:30:27,150
experienced in the medical 
industry, that's why it's 

588
00:30:27,150 --> 00:30:28,950
important. 
Is there anything else I'm 

589
00:30:28,950 --> 00:30:31,470
missing on this medical 
licensing issue? 

590
00:30:32,390 --> 00:30:34,870
Well, I mean first of all, on 
the massage therapist. 

591
00:30:35,030 --> 00:30:36,790
I don't know why she's 
unlicensed. 

592
00:30:36,790 --> 00:30:38,910
She seems like she's perfectly 
good at her job. 

593
00:30:39,590 --> 00:30:43,270
Wish she would get a license. 
I don't know the intricacies of 

594
00:30:43,270 --> 00:30:46,630
the massage laws. 
I can't say if it's dangerous or

595
00:30:46,630 --> 00:30:49,330
not dangerous for them to be 
licensed or unlicensed. 

596
00:30:49,330 --> 00:30:54,690
So, you know, maybe it is in. 
In a way I could envision why 

597
00:30:54,690 --> 00:30:57,170
massage therapists could need to
be licensed. 

598
00:30:57,170 --> 00:30:59,730
On the other hand, I could also 
envision a scenario where you 

599
00:30:59,730 --> 00:31:01,930
say, no, you don't need a 
license for a massage. 

600
00:31:02,330 --> 00:31:04,850
And I'm open to that. 
I'm totally open to that. 

601
00:31:04,890 --> 00:31:06,170
Right. 
It's just a discussion of where 

602
00:31:06,170 --> 00:31:09,730
we draw the line in terms of the
listening to the guy on YouTube.

603
00:31:10,090 --> 00:31:11,650
Oh yeah, that's your choice, 
brother. 

604
00:31:11,690 --> 00:31:14,600
Right. 
And so and and and it worked for

605
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:15,960
you. 
I'm super happy about it. 

606
00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:18,720
What's wrong with that? 
I mean, I if it turns out that 

607
00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:22,320
it works for you, but you're the
exception and 9 out of 10 people

608
00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:25,640
wind up getting really hurt from
their advice and that they know 

609
00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:27,920
that it's fraudulent advice, OK,
then the government can do 

610
00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:30,520
something because it's 
fraudulent and it's hurting the 

611
00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:32,240
majority of people, even if it 
helped you. 

612
00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:34,160
But it doesn't sound like that's
the scenario. 

613
00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:36,680
It sounds like they were just 
giving you advice that you could

614
00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:38,600
take relieve you took it and it 
worked for you. 

615
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:40,600
That's called the hashtag 
freedom. 

616
00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:44,640
Got it. 
The book is Justice Is Coming, 

617
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:47,360
How Progressives Are Going to 
Take Over the Country and 

618
00:31:47,360 --> 00:31:51,520
America is going to love it. 
Links are in the description. 

619
00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:55,760
I want to ask you about this 
just because there are wars 

620
00:31:55,760 --> 00:31:58,240
being provoked with Russia and 
China. 

621
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:03,320
Here at sss.gov it says federal 
law requires nearly all male 

622
00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:06,720
U.S. citizens and male 
immigrants 18 through 25 

623
00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:11,040
register with Selective Service.
Do you support military 

624
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:14,650
conscription? 
That also depends. 

625
00:32:15,610 --> 00:32:21,930
So for example, in Israel they 
had they and they still do have 

626
00:32:21,930 --> 00:32:24,650
military conscription. 
Did Israel need military 

627
00:32:24,650 --> 00:32:26,810
conscription in the beginning? 
Absolutely. 

628
00:32:27,130 --> 00:32:30,250
So they were being attacked 
fairly regularly. 

629
00:32:31,010 --> 00:32:34,610
And if you go to the country, 
which the ultra orthodox do, and

630
00:32:34,610 --> 00:32:36,970
they go, OK, I want everybody 
else to protect me, but I'm 

631
00:32:36,970 --> 00:32:39,650
going to sit on my ass over here
and and not get involved. 

632
00:32:40,530 --> 00:32:43,770
You guys go risk your lives. 
But I'm not going to do it and 

633
00:32:43,770 --> 00:32:45,170
I'm not going to have my son do 
it. 

634
00:32:46,490 --> 00:32:49,010
Well, that's not fair. 
We're either in this together 

635
00:32:49,010 --> 00:32:51,170
and we're going to survive 
together or we're not. 

636
00:32:51,490 --> 00:32:55,130
So on the other hand, you have a
perfectly, you know, large, 

637
00:32:55,130 --> 00:32:57,330
developed, mature country like 
America. 

638
00:32:58,210 --> 00:33:00,170
Do you then need conscription in
a draft? 

639
00:33:00,810 --> 00:33:02,850
Well, it seems less clear, 
right? 

640
00:33:03,170 --> 00:33:06,910
And so, and then we haven't done
a defensive war since what, the 

641
00:33:06,910 --> 00:33:10,590
War of 1812, right? 
Almost all of our wars have been

642
00:33:10,590 --> 00:33:13,790
offensive. 
So if you say, hey, I need to do

643
00:33:13,790 --> 00:33:18,550
conscription for your kids to go
send them to go die in Iraq so 

644
00:33:18,550 --> 00:33:24,190
we could drive up oil prices and
defense contractor profits, my 

645
00:33:24,190 --> 00:33:26,350
answer is, hell no, you're not 
going to take my kid. 

646
00:33:26,670 --> 00:33:30,670
So it depends on the situation. 
I think that right now, the 

647
00:33:30,670 --> 00:33:32,430
mill. 
But by the way, there's also a 

648
00:33:32,430 --> 00:33:35,540
downside of not having a draft. 
So we just have to be open 

649
00:33:35,540 --> 00:33:37,780
minded about all of the factors,
right? 

650
00:33:38,060 --> 00:33:41,460
The downside of not having a 
draft is that in the old days in

651
00:33:41,460 --> 00:33:44,940
America, the kid from Kansas and
the kid from the Bronx got 

652
00:33:44,940 --> 00:33:47,420
together in a trench. 
Whether there was a war, there 

653
00:33:47,420 --> 00:33:49,340
wasn't a war. 
And at least they trained 

654
00:33:49,340 --> 00:33:51,740
together, they lived together, 
and they learned to empathize 

655
00:33:51,740 --> 00:33:54,260
with one another and realize 
that they're way more similar 

656
00:33:54,420 --> 00:33:57,510
than they realized. 
Without that, we have a country 

657
00:33:57,510 --> 00:34:00,710
that's greatly divided. 
So all these are complicated 

658
00:34:00,710 --> 00:34:02,430
issues. 
But if you said to me right now,

659
00:34:02,430 --> 00:34:05,790
conscription in America, I 
understand them registering us. 

660
00:34:06,110 --> 00:34:08,150
I do not agree with them 
drafting us. 

661
00:34:09,389 --> 00:34:13,270
With the case of Israel, you 
also had a lack of safety 

662
00:34:13,270 --> 00:34:17,750
because Ergon, Stern and Hagana 
were bombing Israel into 

663
00:34:17,750 --> 00:34:20,590
existence with the Zionist 
terrorist organizations. 

664
00:34:20,909 --> 00:34:25,070
So it's not like, well, we're 
just here sitting defenseless, 

665
00:34:25,070 --> 00:34:27,710
so we need someone to help us. 
There's so often, every time you

666
00:34:27,710 --> 00:34:30,469
look under this sort of like, 
you know how we got attacked out

667
00:34:30,469 --> 00:34:33,590
of nowhere on 9/11, except for 
the fact that it was the result 

668
00:34:33,590 --> 00:34:37,310
of Iraqi sanctions and support 
for Israel atrocities in Lebanon

669
00:34:37,469 --> 00:34:39,469
and occupying the land of the 
two sanctuaries. 

670
00:34:39,630 --> 00:34:42,389
So even when we're in this 
situation where a draft might be

671
00:34:42,389 --> 00:34:45,949
quote needed, it's so often is 
the result of provoking a 

672
00:34:45,949 --> 00:34:50,199
situation where one wouldn't be.
Are there really any examples of

673
00:34:50,199 --> 00:34:53,159
when there should be military 
conscriptions, either throughout

674
00:34:53,159 --> 00:34:55,639
history or today? 
Vladimir Zielinski on February 

675
00:34:55,639 --> 00:35:01,200
24th of 2022 instituted military
conscription and as is Vladimir 

676
00:35:01,200 --> 00:35:03,520
Putin. 
Is there ever a justified time 

677
00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:06,480
to force someone to perform 
labor against their will in 

678
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:09,480
these terrible conditions? 
Yeah, there is. 

679
00:35:09,600 --> 00:35:14,850
So let me take it one at a time.
So on the issue of Israel, yeah,

680
00:35:14,850 --> 00:35:16,490
it's complicated and it's 
nuanced. 

681
00:35:16,490 --> 00:35:20,170
Were there some Zionist 
organizations that did terrorism

682
00:35:20,170 --> 00:35:22,690
before the formation of Israel 
to drive out the British from 

683
00:35:22,690 --> 00:35:24,650
the British Mandate? 
Yes. 

684
00:35:24,650 --> 00:35:27,530
Were they actually critical to 
that goal? 

685
00:35:27,890 --> 00:35:30,210
The answer is probably. 
And did some of their leaders 

686
00:35:30,210 --> 00:35:32,010
become prime ministers of Israel
later? 

687
00:35:32,010 --> 00:35:34,850
Yes. 
These are just undeniable facts.

688
00:35:35,050 --> 00:35:38,380
So there's the, you know, double
standard that we have here. 

689
00:35:38,380 --> 00:35:42,780
When a Muslim does fights for 
their rights in healthy ways and

690
00:35:42,780 --> 00:35:45,780
in unhealthy ways through 
terrorism, which I don't support

691
00:35:45,780 --> 00:35:48,460
at all, we say they're all 
monsters, right. 

692
00:35:48,740 --> 00:35:51,460
But when Israel did it, we say 
they're angels. 

693
00:35:52,020 --> 00:35:54,820
Well, let's make up our minds. 
OK. 

694
00:35:55,140 --> 00:35:58,820
And so I so I think Israel has 
the right to exist. 

695
00:35:58,820 --> 00:36:00,980
I think there should be a two 
state solution. 

696
00:36:00,980 --> 00:36:04,260
I'm in favor of Iron Dome to 
protect the Israeli civilians. 

697
00:36:04,850 --> 00:36:07,250
But I have radical ideas, which 
are not at all radical that the 

698
00:36:07,250 --> 00:36:09,770
great majority of Americans 
probably would agree with, but 

699
00:36:09,770 --> 00:36:12,050
no one in Washington agrees 
with, which is, if we're going 

700
00:36:12,050 --> 00:36:13,810
to give Iron Dome to Israel, why
don't we give it to the 

701
00:36:13,810 --> 00:36:16,130
Palestinians? 
Why can't we also save their 

702
00:36:16,130 --> 00:36:19,210
lives? 
Right, So, but so that's the 

703
00:36:19,210 --> 00:36:21,370
Israel issue. 
Back to military conscription, 

704
00:36:23,170 --> 00:36:26,210
War of 1812. 
They, the British invade. 

705
00:36:26,250 --> 00:36:27,570
They burned down the White 
House. 

706
00:36:27,850 --> 00:36:29,890
There's an excellent chance that
we lose the country. 

707
00:36:30,690 --> 00:36:33,410
Everybody's got a rally. 
Sorry, but we all got to go 

708
00:36:33,410 --> 00:36:37,510
fight and and save the country. 
So yes, there are scenarios 

709
00:36:37,510 --> 00:36:40,470
where it is necessary. 
Are there a lot of scenarios 

710
00:36:40,470 --> 00:36:43,190
where it's necessary, especially
modern day world and especially 

711
00:36:43,190 --> 00:36:45,110
in America. 
No, there are not a lot of 

712
00:36:45,110 --> 00:36:50,080
scenarios where it's necessary. 
But when it comes to the the 

713
00:36:50,080 --> 00:36:53,720
reason that I originally 
embraced progressivism was this 

714
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:58,200
unapologetic love of justice 
imperialism inherently bad. 

715
00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:00,360
I don't give a damn what the 
economic benefits are. 

716
00:37:00,360 --> 00:37:02,720
Racism, inherently bad. 
Sexism, inherently bad. 

717
00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:05,560
Slavery and forced cotton 
picking is inherently bad. 

718
00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:07,920
But then when it comes to forced
military conscription, where 

719
00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:10,800
you're more likely to die, more 
likely to get PTSD and get your 

720
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:13,960
limbs blown off than if you were
forced to pick cotton, well then

721
00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:16,040
all of a sudden these issues are
really complex. 

722
00:37:16,350 --> 00:37:18,950
Can't we just say that forced 
labor is immoral and if the 

723
00:37:18,950 --> 00:37:22,670
government wants to get people 
to be troops, they got to pay 

724
00:37:22,670 --> 00:37:23,790
more. 
They got to provide better 

725
00:37:23,790 --> 00:37:26,110
conditions. 
You can't just exploit us 

726
00:37:26,310 --> 00:37:28,630
against our will. 
No, we can't. 

727
00:37:28,630 --> 00:37:31,230
We have to use nuance. 
I'm sorry, but it's true. 

728
00:37:31,230 --> 00:37:33,270
It's it's the spectrum that we 
talked about before. 

729
00:37:33,270 --> 00:37:36,310
It's not binary. 
So it depends on the situation. 

730
00:37:36,310 --> 00:37:40,640
So if you say the government 
forcing your labor or 

731
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:43,920
conscripting you should be 
incredibly rare, I totally agree

732
00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:44,840
with you. 
Okay. 

733
00:37:45,080 --> 00:37:47,840
If you say there is no situation
where that's necessary, I don't 

734
00:37:47,840 --> 00:37:50,880
agree because you have a problem
with the comments. 

735
00:37:51,240 --> 00:37:54,160
So in a situation where you 
really need the whole community 

736
00:37:54,160 --> 00:37:58,480
to chip in for whatever reason, 
whether it's taxes, it's a war, 

737
00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:01,880
etcetera, and some people go, 
Nope, I'm not going to do it. 

738
00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:04,280
I'm going to sit on my ass and 
I'm going to make you risk your 

739
00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:07,000
life and I'm going to send your 
son, but I'm going to keep my 

740
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:11,480
son, come perfectly cushy and 
and comfortable over here and 

741
00:38:11,480 --> 00:38:14,040
you go die for me. 
And it's a situation where 

742
00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:16,080
really are all of our lives are 
on the line. 

743
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:17,760
No, you don't get to do that, 
brother. 

744
00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:20,040
You got to chip in. 
That's why it's a community. 

745
00:38:20,240 --> 00:38:23,320
So look, you know, my issue with
libertarianism, and I considered

746
00:38:23,320 --> 00:38:26,800
it when I was younger, is that 
it's too utopian. 

747
00:38:27,340 --> 00:38:32,620
It expects human beings to be 
perfectly lovely, and we aren't.

748
00:38:32,860 --> 00:38:35,100
Sometimes we need to be forced 
to do things. 

749
00:38:35,420 --> 00:38:38,940
So when someone, you know, takes
another human being as a slave, 

750
00:38:39,380 --> 00:38:41,700
you're saying, oh, well, they're
forcing that person's labor. 

751
00:38:41,700 --> 00:38:42,980
That's terrible. 
Good, good. 

752
00:38:43,220 --> 00:38:45,820
Couldn't agree more. 
But then when the government 

753
00:38:45,820 --> 00:38:49,740
says I'm going to force you to 
not have slaves, well, I don't 

754
00:38:49,740 --> 00:38:50,700
know about that. 
No, no, no. 

755
00:38:50,700 --> 00:38:52,980
I do know about that, though. 
Sometimes the government needs 

756
00:38:52,980 --> 00:38:57,700
to force you to do something. 
And so it's should be relatively

757
00:38:57,700 --> 00:38:59,660
rare. 
And we if you say, by the way, 

758
00:38:59,660 --> 00:39:01,980
if you make the argument as a 
libertarian today that we've 

759
00:39:01,980 --> 00:39:05,340
gone too far and we've got to 
dial it back, I probably agree 

760
00:39:05,340 --> 00:39:07,580
with you, right. 
But I do not agree with the 

761
00:39:07,580 --> 00:39:10,180
extreme scenario where the 
government can never do it. 

762
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:14,200
So it's not everyone would be 
drafted. 

763
00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:16,640
According to sss.org, it's men 
only. 

764
00:39:16,640 --> 00:39:21,520
So it's a sexist policy. 
Would you allow women to just 

765
00:39:21,520 --> 00:39:25,480
sit back like you feared would 
happen up from the rich? 

766
00:39:25,480 --> 00:39:27,400
Or should women be conscripted 
too? 

767
00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:33,800
I would leave it up to 
democracy, but if I was voting 

768
00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:37,240
and without having studied the 
issues, I would say no. 

769
00:39:37,240 --> 00:39:39,200
I would conscript conscript 
women as well. 

770
00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:44,070
Okay. 
Men are 50% of the population, 

771
00:39:44,110 --> 00:39:47,230
yet 95% of those killed by 
police, according to the 

772
00:39:47,230 --> 00:39:49,830
Washington Post. 
Is this proof of discrimination 

773
00:39:49,830 --> 00:39:51,870
against men? 
No. 

774
00:39:51,870 --> 00:39:55,070
Men are definitely more violent 
and more prone to criminality. 

775
00:39:55,390 --> 00:39:59,230
You know, there's all of these 
biases that we have. 

776
00:39:59,230 --> 00:40:03,450
Oh, you got a. 
You know, you got to surveil 

777
00:40:03,890 --> 00:40:05,890
Muslims. 
They're inherently dangerous. 

778
00:40:05,970 --> 00:40:08,130
Ridiculous. 
There's 1.6 billion Muslims in 

779
00:40:08,130 --> 00:40:09,970
the world. 
They're human beings just like 

780
00:40:09,970 --> 00:40:12,850
you are right, we got to 
surveil. 

781
00:40:13,010 --> 00:40:15,810
Now the right wing right And 
some of their groups are 

782
00:40:16,050 --> 00:40:18,530
dangerous militias that are 
looking to kill people, etc. 

783
00:40:18,690 --> 00:40:20,530
Yeah, that's where the 
government has to surveil you. 

784
00:40:20,530 --> 00:40:23,730
Sorry, that's not you don't have
the rights or the freedom to 

785
00:40:23,730 --> 00:40:26,570
kill people. 
So if you have a specific plot, 

786
00:40:26,570 --> 00:40:28,490
that is the job of the 
government to protect us, right.

787
00:40:28,730 --> 00:40:31,410
But should they be surveilling 
right wing groups in general? 

788
00:40:31,730 --> 00:40:35,970
No, no, that's ridiculous. 
Stop and Frisk in New York 

789
00:40:35,970 --> 00:40:41,690
targeted blacks and Latinos at a
rate of 96%. 

790
00:40:42,130 --> 00:40:43,650
It's absurd. 
It's crazy. 

791
00:40:43,770 --> 00:40:46,330
We want you to stop the 
criminals, not random black 

792
00:40:46,330 --> 00:40:50,290
people and Latino people. 
So on the other hand, if we were

793
00:40:50,290 --> 00:40:57,010
going to pick one group to be 
careful with, tell cops the you 

794
00:40:57,010 --> 00:41:01,330
know a TSA at the airport etc. 
Keep a little bit more of a wary

795
00:41:01,330 --> 00:41:03,370
eye. 
It would be young men cuz young 

796
00:41:03,370 --> 00:41:05,530
men commit to overwhelming 
majority of crimes. 

797
00:41:06,410 --> 00:41:09,370
And do you think that's mostly 
biological as the result of 

798
00:41:09,370 --> 00:41:11,730
higher testosterone levels, 
since it's young men 

799
00:41:11,730 --> 00:41:14,130
specifically? 
Yeah, I I do. 

800
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:17,840
I mean, look, I'm not a 
scientist, so I can't or by, you

801
00:41:17,840 --> 00:41:20,480
know, trained biologists. 
So I can't tell you with great 

802
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:24,280
certainty if it's testosterone, 
other hormones, the way that our

803
00:41:24,280 --> 00:41:27,160
brains develop, etcetera. 
But the proofs in the pudding 

804
00:41:27,160 --> 00:41:32,040
there's it's not America, it's 
the whole world over is we've 

805
00:41:32,040 --> 00:41:33,680
got prisons filled with young 
men. 

806
00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:36,600
And so is it biological? 
Very, very likely. 

807
00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:41,680
Yeah, and the reason that I 
bring that up is if I didn't 

808
00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:45,720
know about the male, the men who
are committing violence, I would

809
00:41:45,720 --> 00:41:48,480
just think that the world is 
sexist against men and for no 

810
00:41:48,480 --> 00:41:52,240
reason were disproportionately 
represented when it comes to. 

811
00:41:52,890 --> 00:41:56,530
This issue in racial terms 
Doctor Roland G Fryer of Harvard

812
00:41:56,530 --> 00:41:59,370
University published an 
empirical analysis of racial 

813
00:41:59,370 --> 00:42:04,330
differences in police use of 
force, and he allegedly came to 

814
00:42:04,330 --> 00:42:07,450
the conclusion after studying 18
cities, that there is no 

815
00:42:07,570 --> 00:42:10,730
difference when it comes to 
blacks and whites getting killed

816
00:42:10,730 --> 00:42:13,290
by police. 
When you take into account the 

817
00:42:13,290 --> 00:42:17,890
circumstances of the event, do 
you think race is a really big 

818
00:42:17,890 --> 00:42:21,160
issue with police in general? 
I do. 

819
00:42:21,160 --> 00:42:23,400
But I think that it's 
complicated because it's got 

820
00:42:23,600 --> 00:42:27,800
race is an issue and class is an
issue and those intermingle and 

821
00:42:27,800 --> 00:42:30,000
that intermingling is where it 
gets really interesting. 

822
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:32,600
So I'll give you a bunch of 
examples to explain what I mean.

823
00:42:33,080 --> 00:42:37,360
So if you said to me, and by the
way, I don't just trust that one

824
00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:40,760
professor, a lot of other people
have done studies that show that

825
00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:44,000
race is a factor, but it also 
depends on the situation. 

826
00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:47,980
So does poverty create more 
crime? 

827
00:42:48,100 --> 00:42:49,780
Yes. 
Is it because poor people are 

828
00:42:49,780 --> 00:42:51,700
more immoral? 
Of course not. 

829
00:42:52,020 --> 00:42:57,060
It's just that when folks have 
limited resources, just the 

830
00:42:57,060 --> 00:42:59,940
nature of human beings, and it 
again applies all across the 

831
00:42:59,940 --> 00:43:03,380
world, across all races and 
ethnicities, people get more 

832
00:43:03,380 --> 00:43:06,620
desperate and are willing to do 
more things to try to provide 

833
00:43:06,620 --> 00:43:10,100
for their family. 
So a good example is my home, my

834
00:43:10,100 --> 00:43:13,260
parents hometown in southeastern
Turkey. 

835
00:43:13,700 --> 00:43:15,300
It happened to be near the 
Syrian border. 

836
00:43:15,300 --> 00:43:18,140
And back then in the 1950s and 
60s, they had these absurd 

837
00:43:18,140 --> 00:43:20,780
tariffs. 
So everything was a lot less 

838
00:43:20,780 --> 00:43:24,260
expensive in Syria. 
And folks, the great majority of

839
00:43:24,260 --> 00:43:27,300
folks down there were very poor.
So a lot of people in my dad's 

840
00:43:27,300 --> 00:43:31,420
hometown became smugglers. 
Did they become smugglers 

841
00:43:31,420 --> 00:43:34,500
because they're naturally evil? 
Of course not. 

842
00:43:34,780 --> 00:43:36,380
No. 
They became smugglers because it

843
00:43:36,380 --> 00:43:41,630
was a rare way to make money and
actually eventually a decent 

844
00:43:41,630 --> 00:43:44,070
amount of money which they 
didn't have any access to. 

845
00:43:44,390 --> 00:43:46,630
Otherwise, the laws made no 
sense. 

846
00:43:46,630 --> 00:43:51,350
No one got hurt. 
And so they, a disproportionate 

847
00:43:51,350 --> 00:43:54,510
number of them became smugglers.
And that had nothing to do with 

848
00:43:54,510 --> 00:43:56,470
the fact that they were Turkish.
It had everything to do with 

849
00:43:56,470 --> 00:44:00,430
their circumstance. 
So is it oftentimes about class?

850
00:44:00,470 --> 00:44:01,550
Of course it is. 
Right. 

851
00:44:01,870 --> 00:44:06,150
So. 
So for example, if you said, 

852
00:44:06,150 --> 00:44:09,470
look, unfortunately because of 
the way history has gone down in

853
00:44:09,470 --> 00:44:12,950
America, they're blacks and 
Latinos are disproportionately 

854
00:44:12,950 --> 00:44:16,390
poor and that leads to more 
crime because of their class, 

855
00:44:16,390 --> 00:44:19,270
not because of their race. 
And so we have to control that, 

856
00:44:19,270 --> 00:44:20,550
etcetera. 
Yeah, there's definitely 

857
00:44:20,550 --> 00:44:22,990
validity to that. 
On the other hand, there are 

858
00:44:22,990 --> 00:44:27,830
also factors that are just 
racial that also affect the 

859
00:44:27,830 --> 00:44:31,550
issues. 
So for example, marijuana smoked

860
00:44:31,550 --> 00:44:34,980
at the same rate by white people
and black people in America, and

861
00:44:34,980 --> 00:44:37,780
black people are arrested at 
nearly four times rate. 

862
00:44:37,780 --> 00:44:40,540
It's actually 3.7. 
Another way to look at that is 

863
00:44:40,540 --> 00:44:43,780
370% greater rate than white 
people. 

864
00:44:44,580 --> 00:44:47,980
Is that because all cops decided
we hate black people and we're 

865
00:44:47,980 --> 00:44:49,940
only going to arrest them? 
No, not exactly. 

866
00:44:50,180 --> 00:44:52,860
Is that just because of class? 
No, not exactly. 

867
00:44:53,260 --> 00:44:56,140
No. 
And a pretty decent explanation 

868
00:44:56,140 --> 00:44:59,180
of it was given to me by a 
former Baltimore cop on when I 

869
00:44:59,180 --> 00:45:00,460
interviewed him on The Young 
Turks. 

870
00:45:01,040 --> 00:45:02,880
They said, look, Jane, we had a 
quota. 

871
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:05,680
We weren't supposed to have a 
quota, but we all do, Okay. 

872
00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:09,160
That's that's what happens for 
police departments across the 

873
00:45:09,160 --> 00:45:11,280
country. 
And we had arrest a certain 

874
00:45:11,280 --> 00:45:13,240
number of people. 
And even if you were assigned to

875
00:45:13,240 --> 00:45:17,360
a rich suburb of Baltimore, you 
didn't arrest anybody there. 

876
00:45:17,600 --> 00:45:19,760
I said why? 
He said because if you arrested 

877
00:45:19,760 --> 00:45:22,480
someone there, it could be a 
judge's kid and then you're 

878
00:45:22,480 --> 00:45:23,960
going to be in a lot of trouble,
right? 

879
00:45:24,420 --> 00:45:27,140
You go arrest black people in 
the inner city Baltimore, and 

880
00:45:27,140 --> 00:45:28,420
you're going to have no trouble 
at all. 

881
00:45:28,420 --> 00:45:30,940
They have no power. 
You just put them away, put them

882
00:45:30,940 --> 00:45:33,700
away and make your quota Right. 
So. 

883
00:45:34,980 --> 00:45:38,220
And and then I said, well, did 
some cops enjoy that? 

884
00:45:38,220 --> 00:45:39,900
He's like, oh, yeah, they did. 
They did. 

885
00:45:39,900 --> 00:45:42,780
They enjoyed arresting black 
people as opposed to white 

886
00:45:42,780 --> 00:45:45,060
people. 
So you see how it combines. 

887
00:45:45,500 --> 00:45:49,180
And so and it's hard to take 
those factors and and divide 

888
00:45:49,180 --> 00:45:51,420
them out. 
And so for if somebody tells you

889
00:45:51,420 --> 00:45:54,450
it's only racial and it has 
nothing to do with class, that 

890
00:45:54,450 --> 00:45:58,250
is not remotely true, cuz you 
could take race out of it in so 

891
00:45:58,250 --> 00:46:01,410
many different contexts. 
And class matters a lot, right? 

892
00:46:02,050 --> 00:46:05,370
But if you say no in America, it
has nothing to do with race. 

893
00:46:05,810 --> 00:46:09,290
That is also not true, and you 
could show different strands, 

894
00:46:09,290 --> 00:46:11,970
different theories, different 
studies that show that race is 

895
00:46:11,970 --> 00:46:16,650
also a factor. 
When it comes to disparities and

896
00:46:16,650 --> 00:46:20,610
income, so let's accept that 
it's has a great deal to do with

897
00:46:20,610 --> 00:46:24,540
class when it comes to. 
Different incomes According to 

898
00:46:24,660 --> 00:46:28,580
the 2018 US Census, median 
household by income, ethnic 

899
00:46:28,580 --> 00:46:31,380
groups, Indian Americans are at 
the top. 

900
00:46:31,420 --> 00:46:34,380
Then Taiwanese, Chinese, 
Japanese, Pakistani, Filipino, 

901
00:46:34,380 --> 00:46:38,460
Korean, Cambodian, Vietnamese 
and then whites are 11th. 

902
00:46:38,740 --> 00:46:40,740
What is it about these other 
groups? 

903
00:46:40,740 --> 00:46:44,420
What are they doing that whites,
blacks and Hispanics can embrace

904
00:46:44,420 --> 00:46:45,980
so they could increase their 
skills? 

905
00:46:46,290 --> 00:46:48,970
And have higher wages in the 
future. 

906
00:46:49,050 --> 00:46:52,490
We also see a disparity between 
black immigrants to America at a

907
00:46:52,490 --> 00:46:56,330
rate of 30% according to Black 
Enterprise as opposed to native 

908
00:46:56,330 --> 00:46:58,730
blacks. 
What can people do outside of 

909
00:46:58,730 --> 00:47:01,050
using the state if we could just
take a break from that to 

910
00:47:01,130 --> 00:47:04,290
increase their income and be 
able to compete with Taiwanese, 

911
00:47:04,290 --> 00:47:09,730
Indian and Chinese Americans. 
Yeah, so again, I'm in the in 

912
00:47:09,730 --> 00:47:12,530
the group and this is a tiny 
group these days, unfortunately,

913
00:47:12,530 --> 00:47:17,420
where I think both culture and 
class matter, right. 

914
00:47:17,620 --> 00:47:21,580
So if you start out poor, your 
chance of becoming rich is much 

915
00:47:21,580 --> 00:47:23,100
lower. 
It's not impossible. 

916
00:47:23,460 --> 00:47:26,140
And my dad did it. 
He was a dirt poor farmer and 

917
00:47:26,420 --> 00:47:29,180
and by the way, one of the ways 
that the principal way that he 

918
00:47:29,180 --> 00:47:32,540
did it was in Turkey in the 
1960s, they offered a free 

919
00:47:32,540 --> 00:47:36,300
college education and we had to 
score high on your test to get 

920
00:47:36,300 --> 00:47:38,300
it. 
And my dad worked his ass off to

921
00:47:38,300 --> 00:47:42,790
score high, but that gave people
and opportunity they would not 

922
00:47:42,790 --> 00:47:44,670
have otherwise had. 
So my dad didn't have to become 

923
00:47:44,670 --> 00:47:46,750
a smuggler. 
He became a mechanical engineer 

924
00:47:46,750 --> 00:47:48,710
instead. 
My uncle became a doctor 

925
00:47:48,710 --> 00:47:50,470
instead. 
We have to provide people with 

926
00:47:50,550 --> 00:47:52,950
opportunity, and I think that's 
the right way to do it. 

927
00:47:53,310 --> 00:47:56,470
Now, when you look at the 
immigrants that you're talking 

928
00:47:56,470 --> 00:48:00,630
about, culture also matters, and
that is where it gets really 

929
00:48:00,630 --> 00:48:02,510
sensitive. 
And a lot of, I lose a lot of 

930
00:48:02,510 --> 00:48:05,790
people on the left and they get 
very uncomfortable about saying 

931
00:48:05,790 --> 00:48:09,350
some cultures are more correct 
and more incorrect. 

932
00:48:11,630 --> 00:48:16,190
You know, not overall, not in 
general, but about specific 

933
00:48:16,190 --> 00:48:19,270
strands of the culture. 
That's where they get very 

934
00:48:19,270 --> 00:48:21,990
uncomfortable. 
And and now I lose the right 

935
00:48:21,990 --> 00:48:23,630
wing. 
I'm not saying libertarians, but

936
00:48:23,630 --> 00:48:26,750
I'm saying the the Trump 
acolytes, mega etcetera, in my 

937
00:48:26,750 --> 00:48:29,350
opinion, because they go, no, my
culture is better than your 

938
00:48:29,350 --> 00:48:30,630
culture. 
Well, dude, you haven't even 

939
00:48:30,630 --> 00:48:33,270
looked into it, first of all. 
I mean, look at the stats that 

940
00:48:33,270 --> 00:48:35,630
you just gave. 
Apparently your culture, if 

941
00:48:35,630 --> 00:48:38,710
you're, you know, in that class 
of white Americans or right 

942
00:48:38,710 --> 00:48:41,510
wingers who are sure that your 
culture is better, apparently 

943
00:48:41,510 --> 00:48:44,710
congratulations, you're #12. 
Is it 11 or 12? 

944
00:48:45,110 --> 00:48:48,310
It's 11 according to 2018 US 
Census median. 

945
00:48:48,710 --> 00:48:50,070
Apparently you're not number 
one. 

946
00:48:50,070 --> 00:48:53,230
Apparently your culture is 11th 
best even in America. 

947
00:48:53,590 --> 00:48:56,870
So so OK, So what is the quote 
UN quote right? 

948
00:48:56,870 --> 00:49:01,030
Culture. 
Well, valuing education and 

949
00:49:01,030 --> 00:49:04,400
valuing hard work, so sorry to 
everyone who doesn't agree, 

950
00:49:04,400 --> 00:49:07,200
whether you're on the left or 
the right, it's just true. 

951
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:10,520
So you can get super mad at me 
and it ain't going to make any 

952
00:49:10,520 --> 00:49:13,080
difference at all. 
And those Taiwanese kids are all

953
00:49:13,080 --> 00:49:15,600
going to do better than you 
because they believe in 

954
00:49:15,600 --> 00:49:17,880
education and they believe in 
hard work. 

955
00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:20,840
So I'm an immigrant. 
When I came to the country, I 

956
00:49:20,840 --> 00:49:24,560
actually found a list just like 
that Keith in my local library. 

957
00:49:24,560 --> 00:49:26,120
We didn't even have the Internet
back then. 

958
00:49:26,440 --> 00:49:28,160
And I was actually kind of 
stunned to find it in a 

959
00:49:28,160 --> 00:49:32,200
magazine. 
And it actually had back then 

960
00:49:32,320 --> 00:49:35,120
because there wasn't as many 
Asian immigrants. 

961
00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:40,600
The top two ethnic groups in the
country based on income were 

962
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:43,880
Turks and Greeks. 
How's that for funny? 

963
00:49:43,880 --> 00:49:47,720
OK, By the way, in Germany, 
Turks come at the bottom. 

964
00:49:48,000 --> 00:49:49,480
Here in American, Turks come at 
the top. 

965
00:49:49,480 --> 00:49:51,760
I could explain why later. 
But you can see that it has 

966
00:49:51,760 --> 00:49:54,520
nothing to do with race. 
It has to do with circumstance. 

967
00:49:54,720 --> 00:50:00,500
OK, so now in terms of that 
immigrant mentality, I'm an 

968
00:50:00,500 --> 00:50:01,900
immigrant that had that 
mentality. 

969
00:50:02,140 --> 00:50:05,420
My wife is from Taiwan. 
Our kids are mixed race Chinese 

970
00:50:05,420 --> 00:50:08,900
and Turkish and and we and she's
an immigrant. 

971
00:50:08,900 --> 00:50:11,260
I'm an immigrant and we brought 
that mentality here. 

972
00:50:11,540 --> 00:50:14,020
So why do they do better in 
school? 

973
00:50:14,540 --> 00:50:20,020
Because A, we believe in them. 
B we expect greatness from them.

974
00:50:20,060 --> 00:50:25,500
If my kids get B's I am very 
dissatisfied and and and they go

975
00:50:25,500 --> 00:50:29,980
to a public school and I went to
parent teacher conference just 

976
00:50:29,980 --> 00:50:33,940
the other day and the teachers 
are wonderful and and my God 

977
00:50:33,940 --> 00:50:36,300
there's some brilliant teachers 
in that school. 

978
00:50:36,540 --> 00:50:38,580
But there was one teacher in 
particular who started talking 

979
00:50:38,580 --> 00:50:42,260
about hey don't be satisfied if 
your kids get C's because the 

980
00:50:42,260 --> 00:50:46,180
D's could also get them in 
trouble and I was like what what

981
00:50:46,180 --> 00:50:48,980
is this conversation? 
I do not want my kids involved 

982
00:50:48,980 --> 00:50:51,740
in this conversation at all. 
This is the wrong cultural 

983
00:50:51,740 --> 00:50:53,780
mindset. 
We get A's. 

984
00:50:53,900 --> 00:50:56,260
We don't get. 
We don't even think about C's. 

985
00:50:56,740 --> 00:50:59,460
No, A/B is not good enough. 
You got to give me A's because I

986
00:50:59,460 --> 00:51:02,100
know you're capable of it. 
My parents did that for me. 

987
00:51:02,340 --> 00:51:05,180
I would bring home a 98 and my 
dad would say where. 

988
00:51:05,180 --> 00:51:07,820
Where'd the other two points go?
You know what that got into my 

989
00:51:07,820 --> 00:51:09,300
head, Keith? 
I get it. 

990
00:51:09,300 --> 00:51:11,740
That creates stress, and it's 
got its downsize, right? 

991
00:51:12,140 --> 00:51:15,340
But what it burrowed into my 
head subconsciously was you're 

992
00:51:15,340 --> 00:51:19,860
capable of 100 every time. 
And that's what you got to teach

993
00:51:19,860 --> 00:51:21,540
your kids. 
And that's great culture. 

994
00:51:23,060 --> 00:51:27,580
One final thing on the race 
issue, according to doctor 

995
00:51:27,580 --> 00:51:30,940
Wilfred Riley at Kentucky State 
University, He said there is no 

996
00:51:31,140 --> 00:51:34,700
race war going on in the USA and
currently there is no epidemic 

997
00:51:34,700 --> 00:51:37,820
of white on black crime. 
In fact, interracial crime on an

998
00:51:37,820 --> 00:51:42,420
annual basis have been 
consistently 75 to 85% black on 

999
00:51:42,420 --> 00:51:46,620
white for the past 30 years. 
So if you and I are not 

1000
00:51:46,620 --> 00:51:49,620
addressing this issue, David 
Duke and Jared Taylor are going 

1001
00:51:49,620 --> 00:51:52,710
to have a monopoly on this 
issue. 80% of violence between 

1002
00:51:52,710 --> 00:51:54,430
the races. 
The black is the aggressor, the 

1003
00:51:54,430 --> 00:51:57,310
white tends to be the victim. 
What is it about these stats? 

1004
00:51:57,310 --> 00:51:59,590
Are they untrue? 
Have you heard about this? 

1005
00:51:59,830 --> 00:52:03,470
And what is the proper 
progressive way to analyze 

1006
00:52:03,470 --> 00:52:08,230
something like this? 
OK, so first of all, yeah, I 

1007
00:52:08,230 --> 00:52:10,110
have not seen that study and I 
don't accept it. 

1008
00:52:10,230 --> 00:52:13,110
And I don't mean I don't accept 
it, as in, I don't accept facts.

1009
00:52:13,270 --> 00:52:15,710
I mean, I just haven't had a 
chance to study it. 

1010
00:52:15,750 --> 00:52:19,240
And and I've seen studies that 
show very different numbers. 

1011
00:52:19,240 --> 00:52:21,840
So I I can't stipulate to a 
study I didn't see. 

1012
00:52:22,720 --> 00:52:26,760
So now having said that, what is
it believable that blacks could 

1013
00:52:27,120 --> 00:52:30,840
commit a little bit more crime 
or midsize more crime? 

1014
00:52:30,840 --> 00:52:35,200
Whatever the the numbers wind up
being against white people than 

1015
00:52:35,200 --> 00:52:37,480
white against black? 
Yes, that is definitely 

1016
00:52:37,480 --> 00:52:40,280
possible. 
Is it because blacks are more 

1017
00:52:40,280 --> 00:52:41,800
racist against whites? 
Of course not. 

1018
00:52:41,800 --> 00:52:44,680
No. 
The there's two factors here, 

1019
00:52:44,680 --> 00:52:47,400
Keith. 
One is again, we have class. 

1020
00:52:47,400 --> 00:52:50,960
And since the average black 
person is born into a family 

1021
00:52:50,960 --> 00:52:56,320
with 1/8 of the household wealth
of the average white person, 

1022
00:52:56,640 --> 00:52:59,280
they start in a hole. 
And I know, you know, we were 

1023
00:52:59,280 --> 00:53:00,880
poor, we were middle class, my 
family. 

1024
00:53:01,520 --> 00:53:04,320
And then people say to me, I run
a company, it's, you know, TYT 

1025
00:53:04,320 --> 00:53:07,160
network and they I often get 
pressure. 

1026
00:53:07,160 --> 00:53:08,800
Why aren't you guys bigger? 
Why, why? 

1027
00:53:08,960 --> 00:53:12,250
Why haven't you beat CNN yet? 
Well, brother, I started in a 

1028
00:53:12,250 --> 00:53:15,370
hole and I did. 
I spent a lot of years, decades 

1029
00:53:15,570 --> 00:53:17,450
climbing out of that hole. 
Right? 

1030
00:53:17,650 --> 00:53:21,610
So give me a minute. 
So class does affect people. 

1031
00:53:21,610 --> 00:53:24,570
It affects the amount of crime 
that's committed. 

1032
00:53:24,730 --> 00:53:26,890
Not, again, not because they're 
bad people, but because of their

1033
00:53:26,890 --> 00:53:29,850
circumstance. 
And by the way, sometimes people

1034
00:53:29,890 --> 00:53:31,810
who commit crimes are terrible 
people. 

1035
00:53:31,970 --> 00:53:33,250
And I'll get back to that in a 
second. 

1036
00:53:34,130 --> 00:53:38,860
But there's a second thing to 
Keith, which is like Israel and 

1037
00:53:38,860 --> 00:53:42,260
Palestine, when Palestinians 
have no state power, they're 

1038
00:53:42,260 --> 00:53:44,620
called terrorists. 
When they do violence, when 

1039
00:53:44,620 --> 00:53:47,260
Israel does state violence, they
go, That doesn't count. 

1040
00:53:47,260 --> 00:53:49,820
That's not terrorism. 
So, but wait a minute, one side 

1041
00:53:49,820 --> 00:53:52,100
is killing 100 times the 
civilians and the other side, 

1042
00:53:52,300 --> 00:53:53,780
why doesn't their violence 
count? 

1043
00:53:53,940 --> 00:53:57,740
No, because by definition we 
said state violence is OK and 

1044
00:53:57,740 --> 00:54:00,660
individual violence is not OK 
Well, that doesn't make any 

1045
00:54:00,660 --> 00:54:03,910
sense. 
And so here in America you have 

1046
00:54:03,910 --> 00:54:06,270
white people are generally more 
in charge. 

1047
00:54:06,270 --> 00:54:09,110
That doesn't mean like, oh, it's
like a white supremacist state 

1048
00:54:09,110 --> 00:54:11,190
and the leaders are secretly 
KKK. 

1049
00:54:11,190 --> 00:54:15,630
No, I just mean that because of 
the institutional power that 

1050
00:54:15,670 --> 00:54:19,030
that extra wealth brings, they 
are more likely to be educated, 

1051
00:54:19,030 --> 00:54:21,790
they're more likely to get 
higher jobs, etcetera, and 

1052
00:54:21,790 --> 00:54:24,470
they're more likely to be in the
in the ruling class, if you 

1053
00:54:24,470 --> 00:54:27,030
will, right. 
And so they set the laws that 

1054
00:54:27,030 --> 00:54:29,540
help them and don't hurt them, 
right. 

1055
00:54:29,740 --> 00:54:32,700
So white people, while they're 
not necessarily committing as 

1056
00:54:32,700 --> 00:54:35,460
many crimes against black 
people, have a massive 

1057
00:54:35,460 --> 00:54:38,500
institutional advantage. 
So for example, they're locking 

1058
00:54:38,620 --> 00:54:42,020
black people up at four times 
the rate for the same crime of 

1059
00:54:42,420 --> 00:54:46,460
possessing marijuana. 
So you can't just discount the 

1060
00:54:46,460 --> 00:54:49,820
state power that white people 
have in this country. 

1061
00:54:49,820 --> 00:54:51,780
And I don't say that is against 
white people. 

1062
00:54:51,900 --> 00:54:55,620
I'm just the stating the fact of
the reality of this country and 

1063
00:54:55,860 --> 00:54:59,320
and any race that had that 
advantage would have the same 

1064
00:54:59,320 --> 00:55:01,040
would use it in the same way, 
right. 

1065
00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:06,200
So that's why that situation is,
is not at all apples and it's a 

1066
00:55:06,200 --> 00:55:09,480
little apples and oranges based 
on what you just said there. 

1067
00:55:09,480 --> 00:55:11,880
OK, now. 
But I will say one extra thing 

1068
00:55:12,200 --> 00:55:18,000
where now we've gotten into some
fights with the extreme left on 

1069
00:55:18,000 --> 00:55:23,680
our on our flank there, which is
I think progressives stand for 

1070
00:55:23,680 --> 00:55:26,160
justice for all. 
And I talk about that injustice 

1071
00:55:26,160 --> 00:55:29,720
is coming and it doesn't mean 
justice for us. 

1072
00:55:29,880 --> 00:55:33,120
It doesn't mean justice for some
and it doesn't mean justice for 

1073
00:55:33,120 --> 00:55:36,800
just people accused of crimes. 
No, it means justice for all, 

1074
00:55:36,920 --> 00:55:39,520
including the people who are 
victims of crime. 

1075
00:55:39,960 --> 00:55:45,080
And so now there's this crazy 
line of thought in in the 

1076
00:55:45,080 --> 00:55:49,040
extreme left where they think, 
no, because they're 

1077
00:55:49,040 --> 00:55:52,990
underprivileged, they should be 
allowed to. 

1078
00:55:53,190 --> 00:55:55,390
Like, I mean, look, sometimes it
gets so extreme. 

1079
00:55:55,390 --> 00:55:57,990
Some are in favor of abolishing 
prisons. 

1080
00:55:59,590 --> 00:56:03,270
No, you don't have a right to to
smash somebody's face in with a 

1081
00:56:03,270 --> 00:56:04,710
brick. 
That's not a right that you 

1082
00:56:04,710 --> 00:56:07,190
have. 
And so some folks got to go to 

1083
00:56:07,190 --> 00:56:09,430
jail. 
Well, they were underprivileged,

1084
00:56:09,510 --> 00:56:11,430
OK, Yeah. 
But they still got to go to 

1085
00:56:11,430 --> 00:56:12,470
jail. 
I don't. 

1086
00:56:12,990 --> 00:56:16,670
And like we'll discuss how to 
fix those issues on a macro 

1087
00:56:16,670 --> 00:56:19,510
scale, big picture scale, and 
we'll talk about how to get to 

1088
00:56:19,510 --> 00:56:21,630
justice for everyone to the best
we can. 

1089
00:56:21,750 --> 00:56:23,350
We'll talk about getting to the 
right balance. 

1090
00:56:23,630 --> 00:56:26,950
But that brother who just hit 
that Lady in the face with a 

1091
00:56:26,950 --> 00:56:30,150
brick is going to go to jail. 
And if you don't agree with 

1092
00:56:30,150 --> 00:56:33,750
that, sorry, but 99% of the 
country doesn't agree with you 

1093
00:56:34,270 --> 00:56:36,470
and you're way more extreme than
you realize. 

1094
00:56:36,670 --> 00:56:38,150
So you have to draw the line 
somewhere. 

1095
00:56:38,150 --> 00:56:40,750
And I draw with my own side as 
well as the other side. 

1096
00:56:42,680 --> 00:56:46,440
Currently in America, the 
government generally runs the 

1097
00:56:46,480 --> 00:56:50,080
police, the military, the courts
and compulsory education. 

1098
00:56:50,080 --> 00:56:52,480
Not all education, but they are 
the only ones who have 

1099
00:56:52,480 --> 00:56:56,200
compulsory education rights. 
Is it fair to describe these 

1100
00:56:56,200 --> 00:57:01,760
things like police, military and
schools as free, universal and 

1101
00:57:01,760 --> 00:57:06,200
guaranteed services? 
Well, you know, again, you're 

1102
00:57:06,200 --> 00:57:08,480
going to get into definitions, 
but should the government 

1103
00:57:08,520 --> 00:57:11,120
provide those things? 
Yes, those are core functions of

1104
00:57:11,120 --> 00:57:13,970
the government and should they 
be quote UN quote free? 

1105
00:57:13,970 --> 00:57:15,450
Absolutely. 
In fact, I can give you an 

1106
00:57:15,450 --> 00:57:18,450
example that's in in the book 
again and again. 

1107
00:57:18,450 --> 00:57:22,330
You could order the book at 
tyt.com/justice in in in this 

1108
00:57:22,330 --> 00:57:27,170
country, Keith, we used to have 
a private fire departments and 

1109
00:57:27,170 --> 00:57:30,770
that turned into a disaster. 
We tried it so Bob wouldn't pay 

1110
00:57:30,770 --> 00:57:34,610
his fire insurance and they 
would literally let his house 

1111
00:57:34,610 --> 00:57:36,330
burn down. 
But they found out pretty 

1112
00:57:36,330 --> 00:57:39,840
quickly, if you let Bob's house 
burn down, the house next to him

1113
00:57:39,840 --> 00:57:41,760
is also going to burn down. 
And the one after that and the 

1114
00:57:41,760 --> 00:57:44,440
one after that, and it doesn't 
matter that those guys pay their

1115
00:57:44,440 --> 00:57:47,360
insurance. 
And we quickly realized, no, the

1116
00:57:47,360 --> 00:57:50,440
fire departments have to be 
public, otherwise we all burn 

1117
00:57:50,440 --> 00:57:53,000
together. 
So that's my take on it. 

1118
00:57:53,080 --> 00:57:54,880
But go ahead ask. 
You can ask specifics. 

1119
00:57:55,160 --> 00:57:58,680
The reason is because the 
military, it's something like 

1120
00:57:58,680 --> 00:58:02,520
800, nine, $100 billion a year. 
So it certainly is not free. 

1121
00:58:02,800 --> 00:58:07,080
However, when it comes to things
like healthcare or college. 

1122
00:58:07,790 --> 00:58:11,190
It's sort of described as the 
state can make this free if 

1123
00:58:11,190 --> 00:58:14,590
government controls it, but that
would mean that nurses and 

1124
00:58:14,590 --> 00:58:16,870
doctors don't get paid, they're 
all just volunteers. 

1125
00:58:17,070 --> 00:58:19,550
So it it seems like you're 
dividing things whether they 

1126
00:58:19,550 --> 00:58:21,110
should cost money or they should
be free. 

1127
00:58:21,310 --> 00:58:24,110
They both cost money, They both 
cost resources and face 

1128
00:58:24,110 --> 00:58:27,910
incentives and constraints. 
So do you think it's honest to 

1129
00:58:27,910 --> 00:58:30,910
say that we can make healthcare 
free if the state controls it? 

1130
00:58:31,950 --> 00:58:34,600
Yeah. 
So they're saying free in the 

1131
00:58:34,600 --> 00:58:37,000
context of government. 
And so if you want further 

1132
00:58:37,000 --> 00:58:38,360
clarification on that, no 
problem. 

1133
00:58:38,400 --> 00:58:40,280
And in fact, I'll give you that 
clarification right now. 

1134
00:58:40,720 --> 00:58:44,800
So when they say free, what 
they're saying is that it's not,

1135
00:58:44,840 --> 00:58:47,480
they're not saying that it's 
magic and it's magically free 

1136
00:58:47,480 --> 00:58:49,280
and falls out of the trees, 
right. 

1137
00:58:49,640 --> 00:58:53,760
What they mean is that they're 
it's communal, so and hence free

1138
00:58:53,760 --> 00:58:57,720
to you on a specific level. 
Whereas having to pay for that 

1139
00:58:57,720 --> 00:59:02,070
sandwich or that tank of gas is 
specifically not free. 

1140
00:59:02,070 --> 00:59:04,510
You have to pay for it on an 
individual level. 

1141
00:59:04,750 --> 00:59:08,550
But cops are free in the sense 
not that we don't pay for them, 

1142
00:59:08,910 --> 00:59:11,630
but that they we don't have to 
pay for them on an individual 

1143
00:59:11,630 --> 00:59:13,070
level. 
So when someone busts into my 

1144
00:59:13,070 --> 00:59:16,150
house, I don't have to pay the 
cops 100 bucks for them to show 

1145
00:59:16,150 --> 00:59:19,190
up because we're all 
contributing to our communal 

1146
00:59:20,290 --> 00:59:22,810
treasury, and out of that 
treasury we're paying for the 

1147
00:59:22,810 --> 00:59:26,530
things like cops, fire 
department, schools, etc. 

1148
00:59:26,970 --> 00:59:30,050
And hence they're free. 
In that sense, you don't have to

1149
00:59:30,050 --> 00:59:35,290
go and pay for 3rd grade history
class, but it's not free as and 

1150
00:59:35,290 --> 00:59:40,330
it doesn't cost money. 
OK, I'm all four sense of 

1151
00:59:40,330 --> 00:59:41,810
community. 
One of the great things I 

1152
00:59:41,810 --> 00:59:45,250
learned in economics is that 
even if you are just reading a 

1153
00:59:45,250 --> 00:59:47,590
book by yourself. 
You didn't write the book. 

1154
00:59:47,590 --> 00:59:49,430
You didn't cut down the tree to 
make the pages. 

1155
00:59:49,430 --> 00:59:51,310
You didn't invent the words. 
You didn't make the ink. 

1156
00:59:51,470 --> 00:59:54,310
We're always cooperating, and we
need to look at the world in a 

1157
00:59:54,350 --> 00:59:57,510
very cooperative lens. 
Even people who happen to be 

1158
00:59:57,750 --> 01:00:01,510
born on the other side of the 
world who are evil immigrants. 

1159
01:00:01,550 --> 01:00:03,790
Yes, you still have to treat 
them with justice. 

1160
01:00:03,790 --> 01:00:07,030
You're constantly engaged in 
this complex web of social 

1161
01:00:07,150 --> 01:00:09,750
cooperation. 
I'm all for communities coming 

1162
01:00:09,750 --> 01:00:11,870
together. 
My entire criticism of 

1163
01:00:11,870 --> 01:00:14,030
progressivism is they don't let 
me out. 

1164
01:00:14,110 --> 01:00:17,700
Opt out of fun and conservatism.
They don't let me opt out of 

1165
01:00:17,700 --> 01:00:20,300
things that I think are non 
communal versus things that are 

1166
01:00:20,300 --> 01:00:22,740
actually communal because it's 
not like, well, if you don't 

1167
01:00:22,740 --> 01:00:25,140
chip in, well then the 
government just says, hey, can 

1168
01:00:25,140 --> 01:00:27,900
we do better next year? 
The government will put you in a

1169
01:00:27,900 --> 01:00:30,460
cage, shoot you if you resist, 
confiscate your house for 

1170
01:00:30,460 --> 01:00:32,460
property taxes. 
So it's not like there's just 

1171
01:00:32,460 --> 01:00:34,220
greed on one side of the 
equation. 

1172
01:00:34,610 --> 01:00:36,930
The government seems to be far 
more great, at least with that 

1173
01:00:36,930 --> 01:00:40,010
fire fire department example. 
They at least let you opt out 

1174
01:00:40,010 --> 01:00:41,450
without trying to put you in 
jail. 

1175
01:00:41,610 --> 01:00:44,450
Government will put you in jail 
and take away the house that 

1176
01:00:44,450 --> 01:00:46,610
might have burnt down if you 
don't chip in for their fire 

1177
01:00:46,610 --> 01:00:48,290
department. 
How is that any better? 

1178
01:00:49,850 --> 01:00:53,130
No. 
So Keith, you you have to have 

1179
01:00:53,130 --> 01:00:56,690
the government be able to 
enforce rules. 

1180
01:00:56,730 --> 01:00:59,610
Otherwise we have no communal 
experience at all. 

1181
01:00:59,610 --> 01:01:01,810
We have no community and it's a 
free for all. 

1182
01:01:02,510 --> 01:01:05,910
What you're saying is that you 
don't like some of the places 

1183
01:01:05,910 --> 01:01:09,870
where they've drawn the lines. 
And by the way, on at least half

1184
01:01:09,870 --> 01:01:11,310
of your examples, I agree with 
you. 

1185
01:01:11,750 --> 01:01:15,710
And that's why I fight to have 
us draw lines in different 

1186
01:01:15,710 --> 01:01:20,190
places and pass different laws. 
But yes, the government has the 

1187
01:01:20,190 --> 01:01:24,510
power of the community. 
The community disapproves of you

1188
01:01:24,510 --> 01:01:26,750
hitting that old lady with a 
brick in the face. 

1189
01:01:27,220 --> 01:01:30,540
So we have the power to arrest 
you, take away your freedom, and

1190
01:01:30,540 --> 01:01:33,700
stuff you into a little cell. 
Now that is an awesome power. 

1191
01:01:33,700 --> 01:01:38,540
I don't mean awesome as in good,
I mean as in amazing, gigantic, 

1192
01:01:38,540 --> 01:01:43,300
enormous power, right? 
And but the government needs it.

1193
01:01:43,300 --> 01:01:45,820
Otherwise people are just going 
to take whatever the hell they 

1194
01:01:45,820 --> 01:01:47,900
want, and we're going to have 
complete anarchy. 

1195
01:01:48,060 --> 01:01:50,700
And by the way, we will also try
that throughout history. 

1196
01:01:50,700 --> 01:01:55,020
And it never, ever, ever works. 
And so and by the way when we 

1197
01:01:55,020 --> 01:01:58,060
tried it from the left. 
And extreme communism. 

1198
01:01:58,220 --> 01:02:01,780
What what happened? 
Dictators happened instantly cuz

1199
01:02:01,780 --> 01:02:05,660
there is no utopia. 
I remember being in freshman 

1200
01:02:05,660 --> 01:02:09,940
year management 101 class and 
they start teaching us alternate

1201
01:02:10,740 --> 01:02:13,780
alternative forms of management,
right? 

1202
01:02:13,980 --> 01:02:16,100
They go well we're in the 
capitalist system but we're also

1203
01:02:16,100 --> 01:02:19,700
gonna teach you about Marxism. 
This then the other thing and 

1204
01:02:19,700 --> 01:02:21,620
and we get to Marxism and at 
that point I haven't read 

1205
01:02:21,620 --> 01:02:24,220
anything about it. 
And the first thing they teach 

1206
01:02:24,220 --> 01:02:26,660
us is, and I know this is for 
the Marxists out there, sorry 

1207
01:02:26,660 --> 01:02:28,620
brothers and sisters, I know 
it's a little bit of a 

1208
01:02:28,620 --> 01:02:30,940
generalization, but you know 
that it's generally the 

1209
01:02:30,940 --> 01:02:34,820
direction that Marks went in and
what he wanted, which is take as

1210
01:02:34,820 --> 01:02:37,740
little as you need and give as 
much as you can. 

1211
01:02:38,420 --> 01:02:40,900
I'm like, yes, but on which 
planet? 

1212
01:02:41,550 --> 01:02:45,430
Because that doesn't happen on 
this planet at all, OK, people 

1213
01:02:45,430 --> 01:02:48,150
work as little as they can and 
take as much as they possibly 

1214
01:02:48,150 --> 01:02:50,990
can in the in the verse. 
It's just human nature. 

1215
01:02:51,310 --> 01:02:53,950
So I literally asked the 
management professor, can we 

1216
01:02:53,950 --> 01:02:57,030
skip this part because this is 
nonsense. 

1217
01:02:57,590 --> 01:03:01,830
No human being acts like this, 
so and I I look, I'm sorry if 

1218
01:03:01,830 --> 01:03:05,590
I'm going to offend, but I think
the libertarians are sometimes 

1219
01:03:05,710 --> 01:03:08,670
go all the way around the bend 
and get close to Marxism. 

1220
01:03:09,050 --> 01:03:10,650
Where they think, oh, it's 
utopia. 

1221
01:03:10,650 --> 01:03:12,730
Everybody will act perfectly 
lovely. 

1222
01:03:12,930 --> 01:03:16,250
No, they will not. 
We need government power to some

1223
01:03:16,250 --> 01:03:17,890
degree. 
But if you're worried about 

1224
01:03:17,890 --> 01:03:20,810
government power overreaching, I
hear your brothers and sisters 

1225
01:03:20,810 --> 01:03:22,810
and a lot of the time I totally 
agree with you. 

1226
01:03:23,050 --> 01:03:25,690
So we have to be careful with 
that awesome power that the 

1227
01:03:25,690 --> 01:03:29,770
government has, but it needs it.
Otherwise we can't have any 

1228
01:03:29,770 --> 01:03:31,530
rules. 
We can't have anything that's 

1229
01:03:31,530 --> 01:03:32,930
communal. 
We can't ever. 

1230
01:03:33,010 --> 01:03:35,450
Like the whole point of 
insurance, by the way, is. 

1231
01:03:36,530 --> 01:03:39,050
If you by the time you have 
cancer, it's too late. 

1232
01:03:39,170 --> 01:03:42,450
The costs are too high. 
You all have to pitch in when 

1233
01:03:42,450 --> 01:03:45,450
you're healthy and when you're 
sick, all of us pitch into a 

1234
01:03:45,450 --> 01:03:48,810
communal pod and then you take 
out of it when you need it, 

1235
01:03:48,930 --> 01:03:50,610
right? 
That's health insurance, whether

1236
01:03:50,610 --> 01:03:54,330
it's private or it's public. 
So there are some things that 

1237
01:03:54,330 --> 01:03:57,530
need to be communal and some 
power that the government has to

1238
01:03:57,530 --> 01:03:59,930
have. 
The the better conversation, 

1239
01:03:59,930 --> 01:04:03,210
Keith, in my opinion is where 
you draw those lines instead of 

1240
01:04:03,210 --> 01:04:06,310
saying that those lines should 
not exist, Okay. 

1241
01:04:06,750 --> 01:04:10,670
So when it comes to, let's take 
the example of healthcare. 

1242
01:04:10,750 --> 01:04:14,030
Since we've agreed that there's 
no such thing as truly free, 

1243
01:04:14,030 --> 01:04:17,150
what you mean is free at the 
point of access to that 

1244
01:04:17,150 --> 01:04:19,430
individual. 
On the specific circumstance. 

1245
01:04:19,830 --> 01:04:23,710
When it comes to some things 
having decreased in price and 

1246
01:04:23,710 --> 01:04:27,530
increase, it looks like from the
research I've done, things like 

1247
01:04:27,770 --> 01:04:31,490
hospital services, colleges, 
medical cares and child care 

1248
01:04:31,650 --> 01:04:34,770
have drastically increased in 
price where things like TV's, 

1249
01:04:34,770 --> 01:04:37,930
toys, computer software, 
clothing and cell phones have 

1250
01:04:37,930 --> 01:04:41,850
drastically decreased in price. 
Do you have a general theory as 

1251
01:04:41,850 --> 01:04:45,130
to why some privately owned 
things decrease in price 

1252
01:04:45,130 --> 01:04:46,930
overtime while increasing in 
quality? 

1253
01:04:47,090 --> 01:04:49,370
And then maybe we can apply this
to the healthcare industry? 

1254
01:04:50,040 --> 01:04:51,920
Yeah. 
So there's a whole host of 

1255
01:04:51,920 --> 01:04:55,480
factors involved there. 
One is, is a domestic or is it a

1256
01:04:55,480 --> 01:04:58,040
world market? 
If it's a domestic market, there

1257
01:04:58,040 --> 01:05:01,600
is by definition less options, 
right? 

1258
01:05:01,840 --> 01:05:03,840
And so that affects the supply 
and demand curves. 

1259
01:05:04,000 --> 01:05:07,600
Whereas if it's a global market 
for TV's, then their global 

1260
01:05:07,600 --> 01:05:09,480
competition is going to drive 
prices down. 

1261
01:05:09,840 --> 01:05:13,400
And so, for example, in China, 
this doesn't apply to TV's as 

1262
01:05:13,400 --> 01:05:16,160
much, but it did for Korea and 
Japan for a long time. 

1263
01:05:16,160 --> 01:05:18,920
When they were poorer, they're 
not anymore, but when they were 

1264
01:05:18,920 --> 01:05:22,720
poor. 
They could pay us lower costs to

1265
01:05:22,720 --> 01:05:27,880
their employees that allow them 
to produce lower price TV's. 

1266
01:05:28,240 --> 01:05:30,760
And so in a world market, 
there's a lot of factors that 

1267
01:05:30,760 --> 01:05:34,240
drive prices down, OK. 
So a lot of the things that you 

1268
01:05:34,240 --> 01:05:37,640
show their medical care etcetera
are domestic market and where we

1269
01:05:37,640 --> 01:05:40,960
have less choices now in a 
domestic market, we have an 

1270
01:05:41,000 --> 01:05:43,480
extra layer of complexity which 
is. 

1271
01:05:44,110 --> 01:05:48,030
The corruption that we talked 
about earlier, so we allow all 

1272
01:05:48,030 --> 01:05:50,710
of our politicians to be 
purchased by different 

1273
01:05:50,710 --> 01:05:53,710
industries. 
And in fact, a very conservative

1274
01:05:53,710 --> 01:05:56,430
Republican, Mo Brooks, who was 
in the House for a long time, 

1275
01:05:56,430 --> 01:05:59,350
who I disagree with on almost 
every policy issue, had a 

1276
01:05:59,350 --> 01:06:03,030
brilliant and incredibly honest 
speech when he was running for 

1277
01:06:03,030 --> 01:06:06,510
the Senate a couple years ago. 
I put that in the book as well 

1278
01:06:06,510 --> 01:06:08,910
because it was stunning his 
admissions, he said. 

1279
01:06:08,910 --> 01:06:12,830
If you want to be the chairman 
of a committee. 

1280
01:06:13,150 --> 01:06:16,830
In the house, you have to 
purchase it and you can't And 

1281
01:06:16,830 --> 01:06:18,790
you it's about $1,000,000 that 
it costs. 

1282
01:06:18,790 --> 01:06:22,190
Now they don't ever say this in 
the press and the press knows 

1283
01:06:22,190 --> 01:06:24,790
it, but they never cover it. 
I'll tell you why. 

1284
01:06:24,790 --> 01:06:28,310
They never covered in a second, 
but he said, but where you going

1285
01:06:28,310 --> 01:06:30,950
to get $1,000,000? 
You can't get it from average 

1286
01:06:31,390 --> 01:06:33,950
Jane and Joe and Jane Citizen. 
They don't have that kind of 

1287
01:06:33,950 --> 01:06:35,750
money. 
So you have to go to industry. 

1288
01:06:35,750 --> 01:06:38,470
Which industry do you go to? 
Well, whichever one the 

1289
01:06:38,670 --> 01:06:41,150
committee is regulating. 
They want to purchase you more 

1290
01:06:41,150 --> 01:06:43,680
than anyone else does. 
So you get $1,000,000 from the 

1291
01:06:43,680 --> 01:06:46,240
guys you're supposed to be 
regulating, then you get this 

1292
01:06:46,240 --> 01:06:48,760
committee chairmanship and you 
don't lot that money to other 

1293
01:06:48,760 --> 01:06:50,640
people, other politicians in 
your party. 

1294
01:06:50,920 --> 01:06:53,560
So you just disperse the bribes.
I mean, look at how criminal 

1295
01:06:53,560 --> 01:06:55,480
this is, right? 
And he explained it's not me, 

1296
01:06:55,760 --> 01:06:57,440
it's Republican Mo Brooks 
explaining it. 

1297
01:06:57,440 --> 01:06:59,680
Okay. 
So and then he says at that 

1298
01:06:59,680 --> 01:07:02,800
point that when you get into the
chairmanship, it's a quid pro 

1299
01:07:02,800 --> 01:07:05,960
quo. 
You have to do what the industry

1300
01:07:05,960 --> 01:07:09,680
told you to do. 
Now if you do that with TV's. 

1301
01:07:10,760 --> 01:07:13,320
Yeah, Sony can buy American 
politicians too. 

1302
01:07:13,320 --> 01:07:15,400
But it gets, it gets harder, 
right? 

1303
01:07:15,800 --> 01:07:18,400
But when you have a domestic 
market, oh, that's beautiful. 

1304
01:07:18,680 --> 01:07:21,320
The smaller the market, the 
easier it is to bribe government

1305
01:07:21,320 --> 01:07:24,680
officials and drive up prices. 
I'll give you a specific example

1306
01:07:24,680 --> 01:07:28,760
of that, too. 
This is also in the book in New 

1307
01:07:28,760 --> 01:07:31,520
Jersey, and then later also in 
Texas, Virginia and other 

1308
01:07:31,520 --> 01:07:35,680
states. 
Some of the industry groups that

1309
01:07:35,680 --> 01:07:38,480
give the most amount of money 
campaign contributions. 

1310
01:07:38,830 --> 01:07:44,350
Is how the New York Times CNN 
politely call bribes give most 

1311
01:07:44,350 --> 01:07:47,830
to state politicians. 
So they have a lot of power. 

1312
01:07:47,830 --> 01:07:52,990
By the way teachers unions, 
police unions, real estate, 

1313
01:07:53,070 --> 01:07:57,550
these are very powerful at the 
state level and at the local 

1314
01:07:57,550 --> 01:08:00,150
level and so. 
But in the case of the auto 

1315
01:08:00,150 --> 01:08:04,190
dealerships, Tesla was not using
auto dealerships, so franchise 

1316
01:08:04,190 --> 01:08:07,990
auto dealerships, so they made 
it illegal to sell without. 

1317
01:08:08,420 --> 01:08:12,220
Going through a dealership, 
that's the most anti capitalist,

1318
01:08:12,260 --> 01:08:14,860
anti free market thing I have 
ever seen. 

1319
01:08:15,180 --> 01:08:17,020
I'm a million percent against 
that law. 

1320
01:08:17,020 --> 01:08:18,620
That law is nothing but 
criminality. 

1321
01:08:18,779 --> 01:08:21,819
OK. 
And luckily in that case and a 

1322
01:08:21,819 --> 01:08:25,380
guy I don't love Elon Musk, but 
he had enough power to be able 

1323
01:08:25,380 --> 01:08:28,140
to fight back and he bought a 
bunch of politicians and then 

1324
01:08:28,140 --> 01:08:31,620
they got to a level of parody on
the bribes and then they changed

1325
01:08:31,620 --> 01:08:33,819
the law back that you could sell
cars any way you like. 

1326
01:08:34,180 --> 01:08:36,979
But the reason I gave you that 
example is because. 

1327
01:08:37,370 --> 01:08:40,490
The smaller the market, the 
better the bribes work. 

1328
01:08:40,930 --> 01:08:43,649
So a lot of those industries 
that you showed with that have 

1329
01:08:43,649 --> 01:08:46,970
higher prices, They got there 
just by purchasing our 

1330
01:08:46,970 --> 01:08:50,410
politicians and getting rid of 
the free market and limiting 

1331
01:08:50,410 --> 01:08:52,729
your options so that they could 
drive prices up. 

1332
01:08:53,010 --> 01:08:55,010
Drug companies are the best 
example. 

1333
01:08:55,880 --> 01:08:58,760
So in response to that, should 
we increase the amount of 

1334
01:08:58,760 --> 01:09:01,720
trading partners we have by 
declaring universal free trade? 

1335
01:09:01,720 --> 01:09:04,240
Just as we have trade between 
the states, we should trade 

1336
01:09:04,240 --> 01:09:08,000
voluntarily with other countries
to decrease the monopolistic 

1337
01:09:08,000 --> 01:09:11,200
powers of domestic industry and 
increase consumer choice. 

1338
01:09:11,880 --> 01:09:15,240
No. 
So this one's also complicated. 

1339
01:09:15,279 --> 01:09:18,319
Why? 
If you did completely free trade

1340
01:09:18,319 --> 01:09:23,680
right now, 10s of millions of 
jobs would be gone almost 

1341
01:09:23,680 --> 01:09:26,939
overnight. 
It, it would create an economic 

1342
01:09:26,939 --> 01:09:29,899
situation where you'd be crazy 
not to outs. 

1343
01:09:29,899 --> 01:09:34,460
If you're a company and it and 
it cost you, you know, eight 

1344
01:09:34,460 --> 01:09:38,500
cents or let's go crazy and say 
$0.80 an hour in Vietnam to pay 

1345
01:09:38,500 --> 01:09:42,140
someone as opposed to paying 
them 15 bucks here, 25 bucks, 

1346
01:09:42,140 --> 01:09:45,620
etcetera, you're going to go to 
Vietnam, OK. 

1347
01:09:45,620 --> 01:09:47,740
So you're going to put your 
factories there, etcetera. 

1348
01:09:48,020 --> 01:09:51,020
So if we don't set some 
boundaries, the level of 

1349
01:09:51,020 --> 01:09:54,140
unemployment in this country 
would be monstrous. 

1350
01:09:54,540 --> 01:09:57,220
So you've got to be careful with
the laws that that you're you're

1351
01:09:57,220 --> 01:10:00,540
passing. 
On the other hand, if you do the

1352
01:10:00,540 --> 01:10:04,060
kind of tariffs that Donald 
Trump is suggesting, it's going 

1353
01:10:04,060 --> 01:10:07,340
to go in the opposite direction,
create a different problem, also

1354
01:10:07,340 --> 01:10:09,940
a giant problem in the opposite 
direction, because both of those

1355
01:10:09,940 --> 01:10:12,420
are extreme. 
You have to achieve balance 

1356
01:10:12,420 --> 01:10:14,980
where you protect the American 
worker, but you still have 

1357
01:10:14,980 --> 01:10:17,780
enough free trade to drive 
prices down for consumers. 

1358
01:10:19,260 --> 01:10:24,800
When it comes to education, 
according to the National Center

1359
01:10:24,800 --> 01:10:28,160
for Educational Statistics, 
there has been an inflation 

1360
01:10:28,160 --> 01:10:34,440
adjusted increase of 287% when 
it comes to per student spending

1361
01:10:34,440 --> 01:10:38,920
from 1960 to the year 2010. 
Do you think the education 

1362
01:10:38,920 --> 01:10:43,080
system in general has a spending
problem or a management problem 

1363
01:10:43,080 --> 01:10:45,720
or an incentives problem? 
What's the progressive take on 

1364
01:10:45,720 --> 01:10:48,680
education? 
So it has a lot of those 

1365
01:10:48,680 --> 01:10:52,120
problems, and education is so 
fascinating. 

1366
01:10:52,620 --> 01:10:55,460
So, you know, unfortunately this
reflex in this country of 

1367
01:10:55,460 --> 01:10:58,780
America's #1. 
And so, you know, it might not 

1368
01:10:58,780 --> 01:11:00,780
be a great system, but it's the 
best system in the world. 

1369
01:11:02,100 --> 01:11:05,220
No, it depends. 
We are #1 in a number of 

1370
01:11:05,220 --> 01:11:08,860
factors, like the military. 
I don't know if that's something

1371
01:11:08,860 --> 01:11:12,300
to brag about, but what we are 
not, number one, is in 

1372
01:11:12,300 --> 01:11:14,980
education. 
The South Koreans kick our ass, 

1373
01:11:14,980 --> 01:11:17,340
for example. 
There's many examples, but 

1374
01:11:17,340 --> 01:11:18,660
they're usually in the top 
three. 

1375
01:11:18,780 --> 01:11:22,150
But so is Finland. 
And they have taken very 

1376
01:11:22,190 --> 01:11:24,670
different approaches. 
They're usually the top two 

1377
01:11:24,670 --> 01:11:29,070
countries these days in both 
math and in other aptitudes that

1378
01:11:29,070 --> 01:11:32,350
we test across the world. 
And South Korea works their 

1379
01:11:32,350 --> 01:11:35,870
students to oblivion. 
I mean, my God, I think that 

1380
01:11:35,870 --> 01:11:40,070
culture way over does it on on 
how hard they work their kids. 

1381
01:11:40,710 --> 01:11:42,190
They've also got to have a 
childhood. 

1382
01:11:42,190 --> 01:11:43,910
I don't agree with that balance.
OK. 

1383
01:11:44,430 --> 01:11:47,270
Finland, on the other hand, 
eliminated homework. 

1384
01:11:49,410 --> 01:11:54,650
Eliminated private schools and 
pay their teachers as high as 

1385
01:11:54,650 --> 01:12:00,930
they pay lawyers and doctors and
magically they became number one

1386
01:12:00,930 --> 01:12:03,530
and they weren't #1 until they 
made those changes. 

1387
01:12:03,770 --> 01:12:08,090
So it's definitely the changes. 
So that's why sometimes 

1388
01:12:08,090 --> 01:12:10,530
different methods work in 
different places and for 

1389
01:12:10,530 --> 01:12:14,730
different reasons. 
So in terms of education in 

1390
01:12:14,730 --> 01:12:18,180
California? 
We took away tons of money from 

1391
01:12:18,180 --> 01:12:22,500
public education proportionately
to what we used to spend per 

1392
01:12:22,500 --> 01:12:27,140
capita per GDP. 
Back in the 90s, sixties and 

1393
01:12:27,140 --> 01:12:32,220
70s, California had one of the 
top education public education 

1394
01:12:32,220 --> 01:12:36,300
systems in the country. 
Now we're near the bottom. 

1395
01:12:36,540 --> 01:12:39,500
That's because we passed the law
saying we can't increase 

1396
01:12:39,500 --> 01:12:42,620
property taxes. 
And so it got its store. 

1397
01:12:42,620 --> 01:12:44,880
And then? 
We allowed for private schools 

1398
01:12:45,040 --> 01:12:47,520
where every rich person in 
California took their kids out 

1399
01:12:47,520 --> 01:12:50,280
of the public school system and 
now pay some exorbitant, 

1400
01:12:50,280 --> 01:12:54,680
ridiculous 40,000 a year for a 
second grader. 50,000 a year, 

1401
01:12:54,680 --> 01:12:57,920
60,000 a year for 3rd graders, 
4th graders. 

1402
01:12:57,920 --> 01:13:00,280
It is unbelievable how much it 
costs. 

1403
01:13:00,800 --> 01:13:02,960
And then since they're already 
paying that much, they don't 

1404
01:13:02,960 --> 01:13:04,440
want to pay in the public school
system. 

1405
01:13:04,560 --> 01:13:07,520
Their kids don't even go there. 
So they steal and steal and 

1406
01:13:07,520 --> 01:13:09,920
steal from that public school 
system until it becomes a 

1407
01:13:09,920 --> 01:13:14,260
disaster. 
Alabama and Mississippi spend 

1408
01:13:15,220 --> 01:13:18,660
the lowest amount of education 
and they get the worst education

1409
01:13:18,660 --> 01:13:20,900
result results. 
Now, is it possible that you 

1410
01:13:20,900 --> 01:13:22,780
still spend a lot and get bad 
results? 

1411
01:13:22,780 --> 01:13:24,780
Of course. 
Could it be partly because of 

1412
01:13:24,780 --> 01:13:26,380
mismanagement? 
Of course. 

1413
01:13:26,700 --> 01:13:30,060
So you have to work towards what
is the right balance and how you

1414
01:13:30,060 --> 01:13:32,860
fund it and what is the right 
balance in the rules that you 

1415
01:13:32,860 --> 01:13:37,620
have for those kids so they can 
get the best possible results. 

1416
01:13:38,530 --> 01:13:41,930
With all the free PDF's online 
and all the abilities for 

1417
01:13:42,130 --> 01:13:47,530
private organizations to share 
their work in the form of things

1418
01:13:47,530 --> 01:13:51,570
like PDFI would think, can't you
just copy the curriculum of 

1419
01:13:51,570 --> 01:13:54,250
schools that are doing much 
better and start teaching that? 

1420
01:13:54,650 --> 01:13:57,530
I don't know what the whole 
holdup is like. 

1421
01:13:57,650 --> 01:14:00,650
Students are really expected to 
work hard and do what it takes, 

1422
01:14:01,040 --> 01:14:04,680
but on the teachers side it's 
like, well, we just we need more

1423
01:14:04,680 --> 01:14:07,160
money and until we get more 
money we're going to try and 

1424
01:14:07,440 --> 01:14:10,480
close the schools during COVID 
and we can't expect to have 

1425
01:14:10,480 --> 01:14:12,520
better results. 
They have very high standards 

1426
01:14:12,520 --> 01:14:15,400
for the students and very low 
standards for themselves. 

1427
01:14:15,400 --> 01:14:17,480
Why can't they copy the 
curriculum of schools that are 

1428
01:14:17,480 --> 01:14:20,930
doing very well? 
So look, I don't believe in 

1429
01:14:20,930 --> 01:14:24,610
creating the private charter 
schools that then SAP money more

1430
01:14:24,610 --> 01:14:27,050
money out of the public school 
system and create another 

1431
01:14:27,050 --> 01:14:30,330
hierarchy where so the public 
school systems are left with 

1432
01:14:30,410 --> 01:14:35,010
only folks who are poor and in 
lower middle class etcetera and 

1433
01:14:35,010 --> 01:14:39,850
they have no resources at all. 
On the other hand, look, I'm as 

1434
01:14:39,850 --> 01:14:42,130
you could probably tell through 
this interview. 

1435
01:14:42,680 --> 01:14:45,480
I don't believe in rigid 
ideology and oh, the left says 

1436
01:14:45,480 --> 01:14:47,400
this. 
So I must agree with whatever 

1437
01:14:47,600 --> 01:14:51,680
some dude on Twitter came up 
with as the leftist ideology, or

1438
01:14:51,680 --> 01:14:55,000
some dude came up with leftist 
ideology 80 years ago or 200 

1439
01:14:55,000 --> 01:14:55,840
years ago. 
No. 

1440
01:14:56,160 --> 01:14:58,360
Or use independent judgment. 
So it when it comes to the 

1441
01:14:58,360 --> 01:15:01,400
teachers unions, they are right 
that they don't get paid nearly 

1442
01:15:01,400 --> 01:15:04,080
enough and if we paid them more,
I think we would get better 

1443
01:15:04,080 --> 01:15:10,330
results on the other hand. 
Yeah, Sometimes unions have a 

1444
01:15:10,330 --> 01:15:14,090
downside of they make very rigid
rules and they don't want to 

1445
01:15:14,090 --> 01:15:16,610
change things. 
So they'll say, no, I'm not 

1446
01:15:16,610 --> 01:15:19,010
going to the teacher. 
We don't want new curriculum. 

1447
01:15:19,210 --> 01:15:20,450
We don't. 
That's change. 

1448
01:15:20,450 --> 01:15:23,650
And we're opposed to change. 
Well, look, brother, I got your 

1449
01:15:23,650 --> 01:15:26,130
back when you want more 
healthcare, when you want higher

1450
01:15:26,130 --> 01:15:31,490
wages, but I don't have your 
back when you say I don't want 

1451
01:15:31,490 --> 01:15:35,170
to try anything new. 
I don't want to do something 

1452
01:15:35,290 --> 01:15:37,090
different that might help the 
students. 

1453
01:15:37,740 --> 01:15:44,180
No, that I don't agree, Doctor. 
Chris Freeman, a professor, said

1454
01:15:44,180 --> 01:15:47,700
that the government could seize 
all of American billionaires 

1455
01:15:47,700 --> 01:15:50,660
wealth and it wouldn't be enough
to fund its spending for a 

1456
01:15:50,660 --> 01:15:53,860
single year. 
When it comes to how much more 

1457
01:15:53,860 --> 01:15:56,900
should taxes be raised? 
In 2022 the government spent 

1458
01:15:56,900 --> 01:16:00,860
$6.27 trillion. 
How much more money does this 

1459
01:16:00,860 --> 01:16:03,380
organization need? 
Why do you advocate increasing 

1460
01:16:03,380 --> 01:16:06,020
taxes? 
So there's two different issues 

1461
01:16:06,020 --> 01:16:09,830
here, Keith. 
One is how much should taxes be 

1462
01:16:09,830 --> 01:16:13,030
and two is what are you doing 
with them? 

1463
01:16:13,430 --> 01:16:15,830
OK, so first, let's tackle the 
first one. 

1464
01:16:15,830 --> 01:16:17,910
I'm not saying that I'm in favor
of these rates. 

1465
01:16:17,990 --> 01:16:19,990
I'm just giving you historical 
facts. 

1466
01:16:20,510 --> 01:16:24,110
So and these are marginal taxes.
So this does not apply to 

1467
01:16:24,110 --> 01:16:25,830
everyone. 
In fact, it does not apply to 

1468
01:16:25,830 --> 01:16:28,070
the overwhelming majority of the
American people. 

1469
01:16:28,350 --> 01:16:30,790
And when they did it, it did not
apply to the overwhelming 

1470
01:16:30,790 --> 01:16:33,870
majority of American people. 
But in that golden period that I

1471
01:16:33,870 --> 01:16:36,150
talked about, the period that a 
lot of times when. 

1472
01:16:36,770 --> 01:16:38,970
And Aga says Make America great 
again. 

1473
01:16:39,010 --> 01:16:41,890
They are referring to that same 
period, the 50s, sixties, 

1474
01:16:41,890 --> 01:16:43,610
etcetera, when everything was 
booming. 

1475
01:16:44,090 --> 01:16:46,730
In that time period, we had the 
most progressive presidents the 

1476
01:16:46,730 --> 01:16:48,530
world this country has ever 
seen. 

1477
01:16:48,530 --> 01:16:51,090
They were super strong and they 
passed laws that made a 

1478
01:16:51,090 --> 01:16:54,210
difference. 
And at that point, the tax rate 

1479
01:16:54,210 --> 01:16:59,970
for the highest bracket was 91%.
So I'm not saying you should be 

1480
01:16:59,970 --> 01:17:02,050
91% now even for the highest 
bracket. 

1481
01:17:02,050 --> 01:17:06,630
I'm definitely not saying that. 
But apparently that worked 

1482
01:17:06,750 --> 01:17:10,510
because that is when our economy
was at its best, and that is 

1483
01:17:10,510 --> 01:17:13,630
when we created the biggest 
middle class the world has ever 

1484
01:17:13,630 --> 01:17:16,830
seen. 
So if you think at the very 

1485
01:17:16,830 --> 01:17:20,150
highest brackets, incredibly 
high taxes can't work. 

1486
01:17:20,430 --> 01:17:24,470
It is factually incorrect. 
It can work and it did work, and

1487
01:17:24,470 --> 01:17:27,150
in fact it works spectacularly 
even now. 

1488
01:17:27,150 --> 01:17:29,790
I wouldn't agree with it, but it
may be I'm wrong. 

1489
01:17:30,310 --> 01:17:32,350
Right. 
So because those are, those are 

1490
01:17:32,350 --> 01:17:36,070
things that actually happen now.
But Keith, today the problem 

1491
01:17:36,110 --> 01:17:40,790
isn't whether the highest 
marginal tax rate should be 35% 

1492
01:17:40,790 --> 01:17:45,590
or 39% or even 70 or 90, right. 
No, the problem is where they 

1493
01:17:45,590 --> 01:17:48,990
spending the money. 
And so that's where bribery has 

1494
01:17:48,990 --> 01:17:52,510
made all of the difference. 
Once this and I call those 

1495
01:17:52,510 --> 01:17:56,070
Supreme Court decisions the Four
Horsemen of our apocalypse, 

1496
01:17:56,590 --> 01:17:59,470
because once they said 
corporations are human beings. 

1497
01:18:00,120 --> 01:18:04,280
Absurd, with unalienable rights 
given to them by their creator. 

1498
01:18:04,320 --> 01:18:06,320
Absurd. 
God didn't create corporations. 

1499
01:18:06,320 --> 01:18:07,760
We did. 
And they don't have 

1500
01:18:07,760 --> 01:18:09,600
constitutional rights. 
They don't have natural rights. 

1501
01:18:09,600 --> 01:18:11,360
They don't have human rights. 
That's insane. 

1502
01:18:11,800 --> 01:18:14,040
But once they did that and they 
said they have the freedom of 

1503
01:18:14,040 --> 01:18:18,560
speech, and money is speech. 
You just flat out legalized 

1504
01:18:18,560 --> 01:18:22,040
bribery in America, and you made
America the most corrupt country

1505
01:18:22,040 --> 01:18:25,040
in the world, The most corrupt. 
And that breaks my heart, 

1506
01:18:25,400 --> 01:18:28,360
because in other countries it's 
still illegal to bribe people. 

1507
01:18:28,760 --> 01:18:30,320
You still have to risk getting 
caught. 

1508
01:18:30,520 --> 01:18:32,760
You still have to bring in like 
a suitcase full of money. 

1509
01:18:33,120 --> 01:18:34,560
No, here. 
It's perfectly legal. 

1510
01:18:34,560 --> 01:18:37,200
You just give it to them. 
And yeah, they theoretically 

1511
01:18:37,200 --> 01:18:39,480
spend it on their campaigns, but
it gives them power or fame. 

1512
01:18:39,720 --> 01:18:42,800
It allows them to give paid 
speeches, write books, etcetera.

1513
01:18:42,800 --> 01:18:45,520
And half the time they funnel 
the money to themselves Anyway, 

1514
01:18:45,640 --> 01:18:47,880
that's how the Clintons get into
office broke. 

1515
01:18:48,080 --> 01:18:50,400
They come out having $150 
million. 

1516
01:18:51,090 --> 01:18:54,250
And when I tell that to 
Democrats, they they they, oh, 

1517
01:18:54,250 --> 01:18:55,730
my God, you must be a right 
winger. 

1518
01:18:56,010 --> 01:18:57,970
No, brother. 
They're also stealing from you, 

1519
01:18:59,090 --> 01:19:01,250
right? 
Pelosi and McConnell, 

1520
01:19:01,290 --> 01:19:05,290
Republican, Democrat, they both 
took a billion dollars in 

1521
01:19:05,370 --> 01:19:09,210
legalized bribes. 
And NPR and New York Times would

1522
01:19:09,210 --> 01:19:11,730
have you believe that when 
McConnell did it, he was the 

1523
01:19:11,730 --> 01:19:14,050
devil. 
And when Pelosi does it, she's 

1524
01:19:14,050 --> 01:19:17,660
an Angel, no? 
They're both taking bribes. 

1525
01:19:17,820 --> 01:19:20,900
They're both servants of the 
ruling class, and they both do 

1526
01:19:20,900 --> 01:19:24,300
exactly as they are ordered. 
So the problem isn't the rate of

1527
01:19:24,300 --> 01:19:27,180
taxes at this point. 
The much larger problem at this 

1528
01:19:27,180 --> 01:19:29,780
point in American history is 
what they do with them. 

1529
01:19:30,060 --> 01:19:32,620
And right now, what they do with
them is hand it right over to 

1530
01:19:32,620 --> 01:19:36,580
their donors. 
And we see this even in the 

1531
01:19:36,580 --> 01:19:39,820
golden age of forties, 50s and 
60s. 

1532
01:19:39,860 --> 01:19:44,740
In the 40s we had like 200,000 
Japanese civilians murdered by 

1533
01:19:44,860 --> 01:19:47,580
the government with Operation 
Meeting House, Hiroshima and 

1534
01:19:47,580 --> 01:19:50,860
Nagasaki. 
We had the Vietnam, Laos and 

1535
01:19:50,860 --> 01:19:54,580
Cambodia mass murder of 
civilians, £260 million of bombs

1536
01:19:54,780 --> 01:19:56,460
dropped in Operation Barrel 
Roll. 

1537
01:19:56,620 --> 01:19:59,860
So whenever I mentioned the 
benefits of Walmart, Amazon and 

1538
01:19:59,860 --> 01:20:02,740
Apple, I'm always told to look 
at well, there's also downsides.

1539
01:20:03,070 --> 01:20:06,310
When it comes to government, 
even at its best years, they're 

1540
01:20:06,310 --> 01:20:08,990
still committing large scale 
atrocities the likes of which 

1541
01:20:09,150 --> 01:20:11,790
the Ku Klux Klan couldn't even 
imagine committing. 

1542
01:20:11,990 --> 01:20:14,870
Is there ever a point at which 
you would concede that 

1543
01:20:14,910 --> 01:20:18,310
government is the problem in and
of itself because of the 

1544
01:20:18,310 --> 01:20:20,830
incentives that it has, and 
everything should be moved to 

1545
01:20:20,830 --> 01:20:23,190
the voluntary sector? 
What would you need to hear to 

1546
01:20:23,230 --> 01:20:26,060
give up progressivism? 
You know, that's such an extreme

1547
01:20:26,060 --> 01:20:27,780
position. 
No, I would never agree to that 

1548
01:20:27,780 --> 01:20:29,420
extreme position where we have 
no government. 

1549
01:20:30,140 --> 01:20:32,220
Keep the very first thing that 
would happen if somebody would 

1550
01:20:32,220 --> 01:20:35,260
come to your house and take all 
of your stuff and they go, hey, 

1551
01:20:35,340 --> 01:20:37,100
I did it voluntarily. 
Good luck to your brother. 

1552
01:20:37,420 --> 01:20:39,620
And then you'd have to arm up 
and he'd have to arm up. 

1553
01:20:39,620 --> 01:20:43,020
Next thing you know, we're all 
killing each other and to no 

1554
01:20:43,020 --> 01:20:44,900
end. 
So now I'll go to your specific 

1555
01:20:44,900 --> 01:20:47,740
examples, though you're not 
wrong that the number of 

1556
01:20:47,820 --> 01:20:51,940
civilians we killed in World War
2 and and the atrocities that 

1557
01:20:51,940 --> 01:20:55,540
we. 
Partaken before we even bombed 

1558
01:20:55,580 --> 01:20:59,180
Hiroshima and Nagasaki, we 
killed more people in the fire 

1559
01:20:59,180 --> 01:21:02,340
bombings of Tokyo. 
The houses were built of wood in

1560
01:21:02,340 --> 01:21:04,260
Japan. 
We knew when we dropped those 

1561
01:21:04,260 --> 01:21:06,620
fire bombs into the middle of 
Tokyo, it was going to kill 

1562
01:21:06,620 --> 01:21:09,220
hundreds of thousands of 
civilians, little babies, 

1563
01:21:09,220 --> 01:21:11,500
grandmothers, everyone. 
It was indiscriminate. 

1564
01:21:11,500 --> 01:21:14,180
The nuclear bomb was, and so was
the fire bombing. 

1565
01:21:14,180 --> 01:21:15,980
We also did it of Dresden in 
Germany. 

1566
01:21:16,490 --> 01:21:18,170
And the Germans did it of 
London. 

1567
01:21:18,170 --> 01:21:19,930
It's. 
And it goes on and on and on. 

1568
01:21:20,130 --> 01:21:22,970
So that sounds like, oh, and in 
fact, even Robert McNamara, who 

1569
01:21:22,970 --> 01:21:26,650
at the time was basically a 
glorified accountant. 

1570
01:21:26,770 --> 01:21:32,130
And he kept track of how 
effectively we were killing not 

1571
01:21:32,130 --> 01:21:34,730
only enemy soldiers but enemy 
civilians. 

1572
01:21:35,050 --> 01:21:39,650
And later he would become 
Secretary of Defense when during

1573
01:21:39,650 --> 01:21:41,410
Vietnam. 
And he said, oh, we've lost 

1574
01:21:41,410 --> 01:21:43,130
World War Two. 
Of course we would all been 

1575
01:21:43,130 --> 01:21:46,380
tried as war criminals. 
Like he acknowledged it. 

1576
01:21:46,420 --> 01:21:48,380
Right? 
Okay, Then you said, Well, you 

1577
01:21:48,380 --> 01:21:51,820
see the government is monstrous.
Hold on. 

1578
01:21:52,860 --> 01:21:56,420
Context is super important. 
If our government hadn't fought 

1579
01:21:56,420 --> 01:22:02,900
back against the Axis, so the 
the Germans, the Italians and 

1580
01:22:02,900 --> 01:22:08,230
the Japanese at the time Hitler.
Was doing far, far, far worse. 

1581
01:22:08,230 --> 01:22:11,470
And so were the Japanese by the 
way, Rape of Nanking and and 

1582
01:22:11,470 --> 01:22:13,790
others. 
So imperialism is real. 

1583
01:22:13,790 --> 01:22:16,390
It's not just limited to 
America, it's also other 

1584
01:22:16,390 --> 01:22:20,070
countries also do it. 
And yes, we had to fight back 

1585
01:22:20,070 --> 01:22:22,550
against the Nazis and Imperial 
Japan. 

1586
01:22:22,830 --> 01:22:25,950
You could have a bone to pick 
with how we did it. 

1587
01:22:26,390 --> 01:22:28,750
And I don't know if that's 
Monday morning quarterbacking it

1588
01:22:28,790 --> 01:22:31,190
or that's legitimate criticism 
or probably a combination of 

1589
01:22:31,190 --> 01:22:34,110
both. 
But yes, we need the government 

1590
01:22:34,110 --> 01:22:39,810
to fight back against the Nazis.
When it comes to another thing 

1591
01:22:39,810 --> 01:22:41,730
we agree on. 
By the way, the the name of the 

1592
01:22:41,730 --> 01:22:44,610
book is Justice Is Coming, How 
Progressives are going to take 

1593
01:22:44,810 --> 01:22:46,810
Over the country and America is 
going to Love it. 

1594
01:22:46,810 --> 01:22:48,490
Links will be in the description
below. 

1595
01:22:49,290 --> 01:22:51,410
When it comes to things that we 
agree on, you mentioned in the 

1596
01:22:51,410 --> 01:22:55,410
book that you are opposed to the
drug war, so we both agree on 

1597
01:22:55,410 --> 01:22:57,770
this. 
What is your principled reason 

1598
01:22:57,770 --> 01:23:01,090
for opposing the drug war? 
And let's try to stretch out 

1599
01:23:01,090 --> 01:23:03,570
those implications to see what 
else we can come to an agreement

1600
01:23:03,570 --> 01:23:05,340
on. 
Well, I like this. 

1601
01:23:06,220 --> 01:23:09,780
I like look, I think that the 
that a lot of wings of the of 

1602
01:23:09,780 --> 01:23:12,420
the political spectrum these 
days have more agreements than 

1603
01:23:12,420 --> 01:23:16,180
they realize. 
But corporate media is in a 

1604
01:23:16,180 --> 01:23:19,900
sense paid to drive us apart. 
So they emphasize the culture 

1605
01:23:19,900 --> 01:23:24,540
wars because it gets people very
emotional and very divided and 

1606
01:23:24,540 --> 01:23:28,020
fighting each other to no end. 
So I don't love the culture wars

1607
01:23:28,020 --> 01:23:33,420
from the right or the left and. 
If we unite on economic issues 

1608
01:23:33,420 --> 01:23:36,500
that we care about, people are 
going to be shocked at how much 

1609
01:23:36,500 --> 01:23:40,420
we agree and how effective we 
can be if we can get past the 

1610
01:23:40,700 --> 01:23:43,660
corporate media propaganda that 
divides us. 

1611
01:23:44,020 --> 01:23:46,540
And I'll just do one quick aside
before I get to your drug war 

1612
01:23:46,540 --> 01:23:49,940
question I mentioned earlier, 
where does all the money from 

1613
01:23:49,940 --> 01:23:52,260
the bribes go? 
Well, it goes to the politicians

1614
01:23:52,260 --> 01:23:55,420
in the beginning, but what are 
the politicians do with it? 

1615
01:23:55,900 --> 01:24:02,750
They largely buy ads in media. 
So last midterm cycle they spent

1616
01:24:02,750 --> 01:24:06,750
$17 billion in those elections, 
which is mind boggling. 

1617
01:24:07,190 --> 01:24:09,870
And almost all of it went to 
corporate media. 

1618
01:24:10,430 --> 01:24:14,630
So corporate media has 17 
billion reasons to not see the 

1619
01:24:14,630 --> 01:24:18,550
corruption, not report on the 
corruption and go Oh no, those 

1620
01:24:18,550 --> 01:24:21,950
are honest politicians having 
honest debates about their 

1621
01:24:21,950 --> 01:24:24,630
principles. 
Oh golly Gee, I guess the people

1622
01:24:24,630 --> 01:24:26,710
with most money won again. 
But. 

1623
01:24:27,310 --> 01:24:30,630
They don't tell you no, they got
bribed and that's exactly why 

1624
01:24:30,630 --> 01:24:37,350
they passed that bill. 
So now on the drug wars, so for 

1625
01:24:37,350 --> 01:24:40,630
sure marijuana should be legal. 
There's no question about that. 

1626
01:24:40,710 --> 01:24:42,550
That's crazy. 
It's the equivalent of having a 

1627
01:24:42,550 --> 01:24:44,790
Coors Light and we put people in
prison for that. 

1628
01:24:45,030 --> 01:24:50,270
That's mental. 
So on the harder drugs, there's 

1629
01:24:50,270 --> 01:24:55,470
an argument to make to make them
all legal, and and Portugal's an

1630
01:24:55,470 --> 01:24:58,930
interesting example. 
That doesn't mean that when you 

1631
01:24:58,930 --> 01:25:02,650
make it legal, you then go, oh, 
it's wonderful and you should 

1632
01:25:02,650 --> 01:25:05,530
all try fentanyl. 
No, no. 

1633
01:25:05,890 --> 01:25:08,730
There's a way that you could 
provide those drugs in an 

1634
01:25:08,730 --> 01:25:12,130
environment where people then 
become less likely to take them.

1635
01:25:12,570 --> 01:25:17,290
Go into a cold government, 
sterile, you know, office, and 

1636
01:25:17,290 --> 01:25:21,260
be prescribed your drug drugs. 
Etcetera. 

1637
01:25:21,260 --> 01:25:23,660
And it does. 
It makes it less sexy, less fun,

1638
01:25:23,940 --> 01:25:25,660
etcetera. 
I'm not saying that that's going

1639
01:25:25,660 --> 01:25:28,940
to just solve it magically by 
itself, but we have to think 

1640
01:25:28,940 --> 01:25:33,420
through different solutions. 
And sometimes government can 

1641
01:25:33,420 --> 01:25:36,300
say, hey, that fentanyl is 
almost certainly going to kill 

1642
01:25:36,300 --> 01:25:38,620
you. 
I'm sorry, I can't let you take 

1643
01:25:38,620 --> 01:25:40,860
it right. 
It's but. 

1644
01:25:41,940 --> 01:25:44,180
But maybe the answer is no. 
There's a different way to 

1645
01:25:44,180 --> 01:25:47,700
tackle that problem for the 
Super hardcore drugs where it 

1646
01:25:47,700 --> 01:25:50,860
yes, you can take it, but we're 
gonna try to discourage you from

1647
01:25:50,860 --> 01:25:52,940
taking that in 1000 different 
ways. 

1648
01:25:54,300 --> 01:25:58,460
OK, So what would you invoke the
My Body, my choice principle 

1649
01:25:58,460 --> 01:25:59,900
when it comes to drug use in 
general? 

1650
01:26:01,100 --> 01:26:03,420
On the lower level drugs, for 
sure. 

1651
01:26:03,860 --> 01:26:06,580
On the higher level drugs that 
have an incredibly high 

1652
01:26:06,620 --> 01:26:10,130
percentage chance. 
Of doing massive damage to your 

1653
01:26:10,250 --> 01:26:15,330
body your mind and your life. 
It gets hard and and I'd love to

1654
01:26:15,330 --> 01:26:18,570
hear different proposals what 
some that have no government 

1655
01:26:18,570 --> 01:26:20,890
restrictions. 
Some that have a lot of 

1656
01:26:20,890 --> 01:26:23,450
government restrictions and 
everything in in the middle to 

1657
01:26:23,450 --> 01:26:25,610
see what model worked. 
And I would go to other 

1658
01:26:25,610 --> 01:26:28,810
countries and different states, 
different countries to see what 

1659
01:26:28,810 --> 01:26:30,690
they tried and what was the most
effective. 

1660
01:26:30,690 --> 01:26:35,650
Because our goal is the same 
limited damage to the average 

1661
01:26:35,650 --> 01:26:37,370
American that these drugs 
create. 

1662
01:26:38,070 --> 01:26:42,870
While giving as much freedom as 
we can so that people can make 

1663
01:26:42,870 --> 01:26:45,670
their individual choices. 
Excellent. 

1664
01:26:46,030 --> 01:26:48,270
Final question. 
Thank you so much for your time 

1665
01:26:48,270 --> 01:26:50,390
here. 
Thomas Sole wrote a book titled 

1666
01:26:50,390 --> 01:26:53,270
Basic Economics. 
He says in reality, most of the 

1667
01:26:53,270 --> 01:26:55,990
great fortunes in American 
history have resulted from 

1668
01:26:55,990 --> 01:26:59,300
someone's figuring out how to 
reduce costs, so was to be able 

1669
01:26:59,300 --> 01:27:02,460
to charge lower prices and 
therefore gain a mass market for

1670
01:27:02,460 --> 01:27:04,140
the product. 
Henry Ford did this with 

1671
01:27:04,140 --> 01:27:07,700
automobiles, Rockefeller with 
oil, Carnegie with steel Sears, 

1672
01:27:07,740 --> 01:27:11,100
Penny Walton. 
Jeff Bezos is also in creating 

1673
01:27:11,100 --> 01:27:14,340
Amazon drastically decreased 
prices, increasing the amount of

1674
01:27:14,340 --> 01:27:18,900
options that consumers have and 
also the number of jobs. 

1675
01:27:19,060 --> 01:27:22,660
Steve Jobs as well has done this
with things like iPhones and 

1676
01:27:22,660 --> 01:27:24,740
really empowering the average 
person. 

1677
01:27:24,900 --> 01:27:28,380
When it comes to empowering the 
average person, should we look 

1678
01:27:28,420 --> 01:27:31,620
more so at the free market when 
we have all these empirical 

1679
01:27:31,620 --> 01:27:33,900
examples? 
Or am I still missing something 

1680
01:27:34,060 --> 01:27:36,540
about the free market that only 
the state can provide? 

1681
01:27:37,820 --> 01:27:44,580
So again, nuanced answer here. 
So and why are so many answers 

1682
01:27:44,580 --> 01:27:46,860
nuanced? 
Because you need balance to get 

1683
01:27:46,860 --> 01:27:49,180
to the right solution. 
And so you can't. 

1684
01:27:49,500 --> 01:27:51,980
It's easy to go to an extreme, 
but it doesn't get you the right

1685
01:27:51,980 --> 01:27:55,740
answer. 
So in this case, I look, I told 

1686
01:27:55,740 --> 01:27:58,620
you earlier, I'm a democratic 
capitalist, and so I believe in 

1687
01:27:58,620 --> 01:28:01,740
free markets. 
Let me first quickly say that 

1688
01:28:01,940 --> 01:28:03,780
what we have today is not free 
markets. 

1689
01:28:04,500 --> 01:28:06,980
So what we've created is 
corporatism. 

1690
01:28:07,180 --> 01:28:10,180
And corporatism is the enemy of 
capitalism. 

1691
01:28:10,260 --> 01:28:13,700
It looks for monopoly advantage 
to artificially increase its 

1692
01:28:13,700 --> 01:28:15,950
prices. 
And it tries to destroy 

1693
01:28:15,950 --> 01:28:18,430
competition. 
Adam Smith warned about it. 

1694
01:28:18,590 --> 01:28:21,710
He said you must not allow 
bribery and you must not allow 

1695
01:28:21,870 --> 01:28:25,070
monopolies. 
OK, Because if you do, you won't

1696
01:28:25,070 --> 01:28:28,510
have free markets anymore. 
So for example, you've said a 

1697
01:28:28,510 --> 01:28:31,190
number of things where what we 
call, quote, UN quote, the free 

1698
01:28:31,190 --> 01:28:34,390
market today in America has 
driven down prices. 

1699
01:28:34,630 --> 01:28:37,910
But I could show you many things
where it has driven up prices. 

1700
01:28:38,070 --> 01:28:40,470
In fact, the number one example 
is what I mentioned earlier, 

1701
01:28:40,470 --> 01:28:43,230
drug companies. 
So drug companies are not a free

1702
01:28:43,230 --> 01:28:45,200
market at all. 
They have complete government 

1703
01:28:45,200 --> 01:28:47,920
capture. 
They bribe government officials 

1704
01:28:47,920 --> 01:28:51,680
more than any other industry, 
even more than oil or bankers or

1705
01:28:51,680 --> 01:28:54,920
the defense contractors. 
It's stunning that they bribe at

1706
01:28:54,920 --> 01:28:57,040
a greater volume than defense 
contractors. 

1707
01:28:57,640 --> 01:29:00,520
So those drug companies then go 
in and say you must pass laws 

1708
01:29:00,520 --> 01:29:01,920
where you can't even negotiate 
with us. 

1709
01:29:03,240 --> 01:29:05,700
What? 
That's not the free market. 

1710
01:29:05,900 --> 01:29:09,540
That's insanity, right? 
That's corporatism on steroids, 

1711
01:29:09,740 --> 01:29:13,580
where corporations have won. 
They cut off small businesses, 

1712
01:29:13,580 --> 01:29:18,300
they cut off their competition 
and they charge exorbitant 

1713
01:29:18,300 --> 01:29:21,140
prices so we can't negotiate 
drug prices. 

1714
01:29:21,140 --> 01:29:23,860
They extend their monopolies 
through patents. 

1715
01:29:23,860 --> 01:29:26,220
It is very literal. 
It used to be five years, now 

1716
01:29:26,220 --> 01:29:28,860
it's up to 12 years. 
They have set the rules in so 

1717
01:29:28,860 --> 01:29:32,220
many different ways to drive up 
prices because of corruption 

1718
01:29:32,580 --> 01:29:35,080
now. 
Sometimes prices have driven are

1719
01:29:35,080 --> 01:29:38,160
driven lower by the free market 
and the closer it is to a free 

1720
01:29:38,160 --> 01:29:40,000
market that is. 
And when it's. 

1721
01:29:40,000 --> 01:29:43,120
When I say free, it doesn't mean
there are no regulations. 

1722
01:29:43,320 --> 01:29:46,560
You actually need the 
regulations to ensure that it is

1723
01:29:46,560 --> 01:29:49,480
free, because if you have no 
regulations, it will not be 

1724
01:29:49,480 --> 01:29:51,560
free. 
Whoever gets to the top first 

1725
01:29:52,040 --> 01:29:54,840
will set the rules so that no 
one can compete with them. 

1726
01:29:55,240 --> 01:29:57,680
Read The Wealth of Nations by 
Adam Smith. 

1727
01:29:57,920 --> 01:30:00,760
He explains this. 
Free market does not mean no 

1728
01:30:00,760 --> 01:30:03,040
regulation, It means you must 
have regulation. 

1729
01:30:03,240 --> 01:30:05,160
The question is how much 
regulation. 

1730
01:30:05,360 --> 01:30:08,080
Too much regulation strangles 
the market, Too little 

1731
01:30:08,080 --> 01:30:13,680
regulation strangles the market.
So, so some prices went down 

1732
01:30:13,800 --> 01:30:15,880
because of the phenomenon we 
talked about earlier in the 

1733
01:30:15,880 --> 01:30:18,760
interview with that. 
It's a global market and Vietnam

1734
01:30:18,760 --> 01:30:21,240
and China etcetera are driving 
down the prices by having lower 

1735
01:30:21,240 --> 01:30:23,000
cost. 
Now some of the examples you 

1736
01:30:23,000 --> 01:30:25,560
mentioned about the robber 
barons, I think unfortunately 

1737
01:30:25,560 --> 01:30:27,720
that is very disingenuous on 
Seoul's part. 

1738
01:30:28,240 --> 01:30:30,640
Because some of that stuff is 
true, like the Ford example. 

1739
01:30:31,600 --> 01:30:34,520
But some of it he's leaving out 
massive critical parts. 

1740
01:30:34,520 --> 01:30:35,920
They drove down prices. 
How? 

1741
01:30:36,360 --> 01:30:39,720
By working their employees to 
the ground. 

1742
01:30:39,960 --> 01:30:43,320
No safety regulations. 
People would die at far greater 

1743
01:30:43,320 --> 01:30:46,920
rates. 
No weekends, no overtime, child 

1744
01:30:46,920 --> 01:30:50,360
labor. 
I mean, they mangled their 

1745
01:30:50,360 --> 01:30:52,960
employees to get to those lower 
costs. 

1746
01:30:53,280 --> 01:30:57,120
So just lower cost is not the 
only factor you should look at. 

1747
01:30:57,710 --> 01:31:00,750
And that is why we need 
regulations to protect the 

1748
01:31:00,990 --> 01:31:05,470
average American, both their 
wages and their physical safety.

1749
01:31:05,710 --> 01:31:08,950
But again, if you have too much 
regulation that it's, you're not

1750
01:31:08,950 --> 01:31:11,150
helping the workers. 
The prices will go higher, 

1751
01:31:11,750 --> 01:31:15,470
businesses will get bogged down.
So when I say that, the left 

1752
01:31:15,470 --> 01:31:18,310
gets angry at me. 
But no, the extreme answer is 

1753
01:31:18,310 --> 01:31:20,470
also not on just the extreme 
left. 

1754
01:31:20,710 --> 01:31:22,190
It's not on the extreme right 
either. 

1755
01:31:22,350 --> 01:31:26,190
The answer is how much 
regulation do we need to protect

1756
01:31:26,270 --> 01:31:29,030
all of us? 
And to give us the best possible

1757
01:31:29,030 --> 01:31:32,630
market where we can get low 
prices but still protect the 

1758
01:31:33,110 --> 01:31:37,510
American workers, the book is 
Justice is Coming. 

1759
01:31:37,510 --> 01:31:39,910
How Progressives are going to 
take Over the country and 

1760
01:31:39,910 --> 01:31:43,990
America is going to love it. 
Links will be in the description

1761
01:31:43,990 --> 01:31:45,630
below. 
Thanks to everyone for watching 

1762
01:31:45,670 --> 01:31:48,150
the Libertarian Institute and 
Keith and I don't tread on 

1763
01:31:48,150 --> 01:31:49,990
anyone. 
Janki Ugar, thank you so much 

1764
01:31:49,990 --> 01:31:52,750
for your time. 
Keith, thank you for the smart, 

1765
01:31:52,750 --> 01:31:54,350
interesting, engaging 
conversation. 

1766
01:31:54,350 --> 01:31:55,190
I really appreciate it.