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My talk this evening is going to
be on pilgrimage to India. 

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And the reason for that is 
because I just came back from a 

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pilgrimage to India, so I'm now 
feeling inspired and ready to 

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talk about it. 
I went with a Singaporean group 

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of 57 people, came back on 
Monday from India. 

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So my idea was to share some of 
the, maybe not actually the 

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direct experiences, but maybe 
share some of the thoughts about

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what the purpose of pilgrimage 
is all about, what we can expect

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to get out of this sort of 
pilgrimage. 

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I assume that many of you 
probably have already been on 

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this sort of pilgrimage, and 
those of you who haven't been on

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pilgrimage, maybe an opportunity
to learn something more about 

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it, and maybe it will inspire 
you to do this sort of thing in 

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the future. 
So the first thing I want to 

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talk about, about pilgrimage, is
basically what is the background

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for this sort of pilgrimage? 
What is the reason that we do 

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pilgrimage? 
And the first thing I want to 

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talk about is the background for
this sort of pilgrimage. 

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And the first thing I want to 
talk about is the background for

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this sort of pilgrimage. 
And I know that the beautiful 

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thing about Buddhism is that 
actually there is a very good 

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reason why we do these things. 
And that reason is that it was 

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actually laid down by the Buddha
2,500 years ago, that this is a 

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very good idea to go to those 
places where the Buddha actually

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was staying 2,500 years ago. 
And because it was laid down by 

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the Buddha, because he actually 
recommended this sort of thing, 

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we have a powerful authority 
there to go on this sort of 

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pilgrimage. 
There's a powerful reason why 

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this, is a good idea. 
Presumably, we can assume that 

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the Buddha wouldn't have said so
if it wasn't a good idea. 

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So in Buddhism, there is a very 
kind of authoritative statement 

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behind the reason why we do this
sort of thing. 

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And the Buddha said 
specifically, the four places 

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that we should go to are the 
places where the Buddha was 

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born, where he got enlightened, 
where he preached the first 

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sermon, and where he entered 
Parnibbana, in other words, 

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where he died, passed away, at 
the end of his career. 

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So what is the rationale for the
Buddha to lay down this? 

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Why did he lay down this idea 
that we should go out and go to 

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these places? 
Obviously, there must have been 

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a reason for this. 
The Buddha doesn't do things 

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without reason. 
And the story in the suttas, as 

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we can read them today, 
basically is, this is all found 

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in the Mahaparnibbana Sutta, 
which is basically the sutta 

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about Buddha's last kind of long
walk or trip when he was born. 

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Which eventually led to the 
place where he attained 

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Parnibbana. 
And this walk starts off in 

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Rajagaha. 
Rajagaha is the ancient capital 

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of the Magadhan Republic in 
India. 

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Magadhan was at the time of the 
Buddha's end of his life. 

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This was the strongest kingdom 
in India at that time. 

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So it was a very powerful state.
And after the Buddha passed 

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away, this Magadha actually grew
into a very, very powerful 

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kingdom in India. 
And eventually it became the, it

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became to, basically encompass 
all of what is known as India 

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today, and even more. 
It also included large parts of 

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Pakistan, Afghanistan, Central 
Asia, places which today are 

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part of China, for example. 
And it was an enormous, enormous

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kingdom. 
So this was Magadha. 

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And it was centered in 
Pataliputra, Patna, which is 

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close to Rajagaha. 
But in the days of the Buddha, 

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it was Rajagaha, which was the 
capital of this kingdom, which 

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eventually was going to be the 
most powerful one in all of 

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Indian history. 
Basically. 

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So the Buddha set out from 
there, and he walks north, and 

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he walks through Patna, which 
then became later on the capital

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of this republic, crossed the 
river Ganges, and then came to 

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Vesali. 
Vesali was one of the other very

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large cities in India at that 
time. 

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And it was a very powerful place
as well. 

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Now in Vesali, this is the place
where the Buddha spent his last 

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rains retreat. 
You may have heard about these 

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rains retreats. 
It is basically a place where 

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the monks stay still, don't go 
anywhere for three months, 

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basically just practicing 
meditation and talking about 

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Dhamma and such things. 
So this was the Buddha's last 

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rains retreat in Vesali. 
And of course, he stayed put in 

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this place. 
And one of the things that 

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happened during this rains 
retreat was that the Buddha got 

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extremely ill, really, really 
ill. 

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And of course, the Buddha was 
getting very old at this stage. 

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He was basically 80 years old. 
His body was starting to fall 

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apart. 
There's a famous phrase in the 

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Sutta where the Buddha says that
my body is like an old cart. 

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It's as if it's held together by
straps, in the same way that an 

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old cart is held together by 
straps. 

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I've come to the last stage of 
my life. 

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This is what the Buddha says. 
And of course, it's to be 

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expected that when anybody, 
including the Buddha, comes to 

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the large stage of their life, 
they will get ill, they will get

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sick. 
This is what happens to all of 

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us. 
And so it happens with the 

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Buddha. 
And it's a very, very severe 

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illness. 
And when this happens, his loyal

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lieutenant or attendant, 
Venerable Ananda, gets very 

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upset and he gets very confused 
because he reckons that the 

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Buddha, this shouldn't happen to
the Buddha. 

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At least the Buddha should say 
something to the Sangha and to 

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the people around him before he 
passes away. 

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And Ananda, after the Buddha has
come out of his sickness, he 

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goes to the Buddha and says to 
him, while you were sick, Lord, 

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it was as if my body was 
drugged. 

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I couldn't get, a bearing on the
directions. 

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I was, I couldn't even remember 
the Dhamma. 

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That's how bad I was feeling at 
the time. 

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And the Buddha, of course, he 
says to Venerable Ananda, of 

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course, the ordinary things 
that, of course, why should you 

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be sad? 
Why should you be confused about

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this? 
This is the nature of reality. 

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Whatever has come into being 
must also pass away. 

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The physical body of the Buddha,
of course, death has to happen 

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at some stage, an illness. 
But the powerful thing here, of 

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course, is that the Buddha, is 
that we see that Venerable 

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Ananda, who was a Sotapanna, a 
stream mentor at the time. 

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The Sotapanna is somebody who 
has seen the Dhamma of the 

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Buddha, somebody who has 
understood the teachings, and 

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somebody who understands what 
they're all about. 

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But even such a person, he's not
yet fully enlightened, but on 

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the way to full enlightenment, 
even such a person grieves and 

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gets very sad when the Buddha is
about to pass away. 

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This is very powerful. 
This is amazing that even a 

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person of that sort of level of 
wisdom and insight can actually 

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grieve and be sad about it. 
This shows us how profound this 

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particular thing is when the 
Buddha passes away from the 

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world. 
And indeed, later on, when the 

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Buddha lies down between the 
famous two salt trees in 

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Kusinara, where he eventually 
passes away, then there are lots

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of people grieving. 
You see people coming from 

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everywhere, not only people, 
also devas. 

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Devas are these godly beings in 
Buddhism. 

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They're not actually gods in the
ordinary sense of the word. 

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They're gods. 
They're gods only in the sense 

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that they are very powerful 
beings with lots of happiness 

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and long lives, etc. 
But they don't have the ordinary

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powers of gods that we normally 
associate with other religions. 

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In that sense, they're very 
different. 

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So all these beings come, and 
they cry and they grieve, and 

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the Buddha is passing away. 
What a terrible, terrible thing 

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is happening to the world. 
And you can see, why is this 

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happening? 
Why are people so sad? 

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And if you think about who the 
Buddha actually is, you will 

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understand why. 
This is such a terrible event 

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for people who are not yet 
enlightened, who are seeking to 

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actually find freedom from 
suffering for themselves, 

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finding that peace inside, which
the Buddha promised is available

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to each one of us. 
Because the Buddha was the 

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wisest person around. 
He had full understanding of 

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happiness and suffering in the 
world. 

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He had full understanding how we
can all gain that happiness in 

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the world and free ourselves 
from that suffering. 

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Because he had that full 
understanding of these things, 

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he was able to advise us, in the
absolute best possible way, how 

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to overcome these things. 
Imagine, it's a bit like having 

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a father, or a mother for that 
matter, who has supreme wisdom 

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and can always guide us in the 
right direction, always guide us

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to what is for our own benefit. 
Imagine that. 

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Imagine having that sort of 
person in your life. 

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And not only that, but also 
having supreme compassion and 

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loving kindness for us, always 
giving us advice in the best 

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possible way, in the most 
beautiful kind of way. 

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Always having that kind of love,
always having that kindness, 

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having that coming from a good 
place inside. 

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Never angry, never upset. 
So when you start to imagine 

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such a person in the world, you 
start to see why beings were so 

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attached to the Buddha. 
Why even stream-enters, people 

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who were not fully enlightened, 
why even they actually had that 

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attachment there. 
So this becomes then the 

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powerful reason why this is 
happening. 

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And one of the things that all 
these beings are saying, as 

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they're seeing this, they're 
seeing the Buddha pass away, 

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they're saying, too soon the 
Buddha is passing away from the 

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world. 
Too soon the eye of the world is

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disappearing. 
And this idea of the eye of the 

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world disappearing is actually a
very profound and interesting 

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statement. 
Why is the Buddha the eye of the

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world? 
The Buddha is the eye of the 

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world because he has seen 
reality as it actually is, 

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right? 
He has seen rebirth. 

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He has understood kama. 
He has understood the end of all

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suffering. 
In other words, he has 

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understood all those truths. 
Which really matter for human 

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beings. 
What matters for us is finding 

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happiness and ending of 
suffering. 

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That's what we're all searching 
for. 

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And here is the supreme being 
who has found these to the 

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utmost extent. 
So it means that he has seen 

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these things. 
He has seen things which most of

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us never can see. 
We cannot see these things 

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unless we are guided by somebody
else. 

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And because the Buddha has seen 
these things, and he shows us to

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the rest of us, that is why he 
is called the eye of the world. 

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It's as if he's seeing for us. 
And then telling us what it 

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actually is like on the other 
side. 

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We are all walking around in 
darkness, as if we're dreaming, 

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not really seeing reality as it 
actually is. 

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And then somebody comes along 
and says, This is the way it is.

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And that gives you opportunity 
for you also to see the reality 

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of things. 
So the Buddha is the eye of the 

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world. 
So that is why we have all this 

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grieving and all this sadness at
the Buddha's enlightenment. 

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Of course, not enlightenment, 
sorry, at the Buddha's passing 

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away. 
At the Buddha's passing away, at

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the Buddha's passing away, at 
the Buddha's passing away, at 

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the Buddha's passing away, at 
the Buddha's passing away, at 

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the Buddha's passing away, The 
Enlightenment, of course, is the

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opposite. 
Of course, the only person who 

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probably is quite happy is the 
Buddha because the Buddha has 

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had to carry around this body 
and these five senses, which is 

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the body is still painful, the 
five senses are still a nuisance

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because it stops you often from 
attaining deep samadhi and is a 

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disturbance. 
So the Buddha himself is 

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probably quite pleased that 
finally being able to attain 

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parinirvana. 
It's just everybody else who is 

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sad. 
Of course, the fully enlightened

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beings, the Arahats also, are 
not sad because they have 

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understood how these things are.
So then the Buddha realizes, of 

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course, that this is a problem 
and the Venerable Ananda goes to

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the Buddha and says, well, what 
shall we do now in the future 

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when we want to pay our respects
to the Buddha? 

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You have all these monks who 
always want to come and nuns who

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want to come, their respects to 
the Buddha. 

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How shall we go about doing 
this? 

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You're about to pass away. 
And the Buddha says, what you 

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should do is that instead of 
seeing me, you should go to 

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00:11:20,936 --> 00:11:24,039
these four places in the world, 
the place where the Tathagata, 

226
00:11:24,039 --> 00:11:27,772
in other words, the Buddha was 
born, where he was enlightened, 

227
00:11:27,772 --> 00:11:32,035
where he preached his first 
sermon and where he is passing 

228
00:11:32,035 --> 00:11:35,466
away in final nirvana. 
These are the four places you 

229
00:11:35,466 --> 00:11:38,019
should go. 
And when you go to these four 

230
00:11:38,019 --> 00:11:41,764
places, you will feel people who
have faith in the Buddha, they 

231
00:11:41,764 --> 00:11:43,960
will feel emotions when they go 
to these places. 

232
00:11:44,060 --> 00:11:48,278
Something will happen inside of 
you which makes this trip, this 

233
00:11:48,278 --> 00:11:50,340
going to these places something 
special for you. 

234
00:11:50,340 --> 00:11:52,420
It will be as if, in a sense, 
you are seeing the Buddha. 

235
00:11:52,420 --> 00:11:52,520
You are seeing the Buddha. 
You are seeing the Buddha. 

236
00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:55,127
You are seeing the Buddha, even 
though he is not actually 

237
00:11:55,127 --> 00:11:57,620
physically present. 
And not only that, the Buddha 

238
00:11:57,620 --> 00:12:01,129
also said that if you do this, 
what will happen is that if you 

239
00:12:01,129 --> 00:12:04,635
are a person of faith and you go
on this sort of tour and you 

240
00:12:04,635 --> 00:12:07,825
actually die while doing it, he 
said that you are secured a 

241
00:12:07,825 --> 00:12:11,320
rebirth in a heavenly realm 
because of all those good 

242
00:12:11,320 --> 00:12:15,023
qualities which arise in you 
when you go on this kind of 

243
00:12:15,023 --> 00:12:17,916
tour. 
So this thing we can see now the

244
00:12:17,916 --> 00:12:20,180
rationale for why the Buddha 
laid down this thing. 

245
00:12:20,180 --> 00:12:23,930
The world was crying. 
The world was feeling that there

246
00:12:23,930 --> 00:12:25,400
is an emptiness, something left 
behind. 

247
00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:28,710
And he was trying to put 
something in place which could 

248
00:12:28,710 --> 00:12:30,420
be like a replacement for the 
Buddha. 

249
00:12:31,020 --> 00:12:33,567
Of course, there is something 
else also which is a replacement

250
00:12:33,567 --> 00:12:35,380
for the Buddha, which is much 
more important. 

251
00:12:35,920 --> 00:12:38,914
That, of course, is the Dhamma. 
Because the Buddha himself is 

252
00:12:38,914 --> 00:12:41,280
nothing really more than 
actually the Dhamma. 

253
00:12:41,380 --> 00:12:43,500
The Dhamma and the Buddha are 
basically equivalent. 

254
00:12:44,260 --> 00:12:47,709
The Buddha's enlightenment is 
the understanding of his 

255
00:12:47,709 --> 00:12:50,317
teachings and his teachings are 
nothing more than the expression

256
00:12:50,317 --> 00:12:51,963
of that enlightenment. 
And he has taught us that the 

257
00:12:51,963 --> 00:12:52,440
Buddha is the enlightenment of 
the Buddha. 

258
00:12:52,440 --> 00:12:53,680
He taught that openly and 
freely. 

259
00:12:53,980 --> 00:12:57,060
So when you read the Dhamma, you
are also in a sense seeing who 

260
00:12:57,060 --> 00:12:59,682
the Buddha was. 
These two are like two sides of 

261
00:12:59,682 --> 00:13:02,164
the same coin. 
And because the Buddha has 

262
00:13:02,164 --> 00:13:05,116
expressed that Dhamma fully and 
completely, it was available to 

263
00:13:05,116 --> 00:13:08,048
people, there wasn't really any 
more need for the Buddha to 

264
00:13:08,048 --> 00:13:10,120
remain in the world. 
The Dhamma was there already. 

265
00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:13,420
This is the other thing the 
Buddha said, of course, to make 

266
00:13:13,420 --> 00:13:16,940
people feel at ease and not so 
sad about his departure. 

267
00:13:17,980 --> 00:13:21,660
So this, then, is the rationale 
that the Buddha laid down. 

268
00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:25,290
Just before he passed away, he 
said, this is what we should all

269
00:13:25,290 --> 00:13:27,140
be doing. 
And of course, again, the 

270
00:13:27,140 --> 00:13:28,640
authority there is very 
powerful. 

271
00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:32,459
And it becomes something that we
all should consider seriously if

272
00:13:32,459 --> 00:13:34,832
we are Buddhists. 
This might be something that we 

273
00:13:34,832 --> 00:13:39,815
should do in our lives. 
So the Buddha having laid this 

274
00:13:39,815 --> 00:13:42,466
down, then of course the next 
thing which happened was that 

275
00:13:42,466 --> 00:13:46,132
people, after the Buddha died, 
people started doing these kind 

276
00:13:46,132 --> 00:13:48,880
of pilgrimages, going to these 
holy sites. 

277
00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:52,292
And I want to talk a little bit 
about now about those people who

278
00:13:52,292 --> 00:13:55,580
actually have historically done 
this kind of pilgrimage. 

279
00:13:55,580 --> 00:13:58,580
Because it's quite inspiring to 
see the kind of personalities 

280
00:13:58,580 --> 00:14:02,180
and how they went about doing 
these kind of pilgrimages. 

281
00:14:02,180 --> 00:14:06,580
And the first historical person 
that we all know about 

282
00:14:06,580 --> 00:14:09,910
definitely did this kind of 
pilgrimage was the Emperor 

283
00:14:09,910 --> 00:14:12,156
Ashoka. 
Many of you have probably heard 

284
00:14:12,156 --> 00:14:15,224
about Ashoka. 
Ashoka was the, as I said 

285
00:14:15,224 --> 00:14:18,480
before, the greatest emperor 
probably in Indian history. 

286
00:14:18,480 --> 00:14:21,209
He was ruling this massive 
Indian empire, which is larger 

287
00:14:21,209 --> 00:14:23,080
than the Indian Empire. 
Even India is today. 

288
00:14:23,080 --> 00:14:27,580
Extremely powerful man. 
And he was a Buddhist. 

289
00:14:28,180 --> 00:14:30,968
So he's probably the most 
powerful Buddhist that has ever 

290
00:14:30,968 --> 00:14:34,282
existed in our universe. 
And he lived about 150 years 

291
00:14:34,282 --> 00:14:37,780
after the Buddha. 
And after he became a Buddhist, 

292
00:14:37,780 --> 00:14:41,048
he of course did precisely this 
kind of pilgrimage, which we're 

293
00:14:41,048 --> 00:14:44,016
all supposed to do. 
And one of the nice things that 

294
00:14:44,016 --> 00:14:47,191
he did when he went on this 
pilgrimage, he erected these 

295
00:14:47,191 --> 00:14:50,680
famous Ashokan pillars in many 
of these places. 

296
00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:54,430
These Ashokan pillars. 
Ashokan pillars are like stone 

297
00:14:54,430 --> 00:14:56,230
columns. 
And these stone columns have 

298
00:14:56,230 --> 00:14:58,680
carvings on them. 
All kinds of carvings. 

299
00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:02,859
But the ones that were done on 
the four holy sites, if you 

300
00:15:02,859 --> 00:15:05,642
like, they often had carvings 
about like this is the 

301
00:15:05,642 --> 00:15:07,280
birthplace of the Buddha, for 
example. 

302
00:15:07,280 --> 00:15:10,419
The Buddha was born here. 
And then something more in 

303
00:15:10,419 --> 00:15:13,469
addition to that. 
And this is one of the ways that

304
00:15:13,469 --> 00:15:16,580
we can actually find these 
Buddhist sites because of these 

305
00:15:16,580 --> 00:15:20,980
Ashokan pillars that were placed
in those places 2,300 years ago.

306
00:15:20,980 --> 00:15:24,280
Not long after the Buddha, 150 
years after the Buddha. 

307
00:15:24,280 --> 00:15:28,060
It's still quite recent. 
So Ashoka did this pilgrimage, 

308
00:15:28,060 --> 00:15:32,358
went around the places. 
And lots of the very earliest 

309
00:15:32,358 --> 00:15:35,126
archaeological evidence which 
exists to this day is 

310
00:15:35,126 --> 00:15:38,580
particularly from the time of 
Ashoka when he went around. 

311
00:15:38,580 --> 00:15:42,954
So there already is one powerful
example for us of what sort of 

312
00:15:42,954 --> 00:15:45,180
people actually did these kind 
of pilgrimages. 

313
00:15:45,180 --> 00:15:48,780
In the early days, most of the 
people who went on these 

314
00:15:48,780 --> 00:15:50,280
pilgrimages were obviously 
Indian people. 

315
00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:53,816
From around India because that 
was the only part of the world 

316
00:15:53,816 --> 00:15:57,260
which was Buddhist at this time.
But slowly, of course, it 

317
00:15:57,260 --> 00:16:00,280
started to expand and other 
countries also became Buddhist. 

318
00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:03,080
The first Buddhist country after
India was Sri Lanka. 

319
00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:06,884
And there's lots of inscriptions
found to this day of Sri Lankans

320
00:16:06,884 --> 00:16:10,980
who went to the holy sites and 
saying, you know, I came here. 

321
00:16:10,980 --> 00:16:15,199
I did such and such an offering 
in the name of such and such a 

322
00:16:15,199 --> 00:16:17,010
relative. 
And you find these kind of 

323
00:16:17,010 --> 00:16:19,547
inscriptions all over the place.
So obviously there was lots and 

324
00:16:19,547 --> 00:16:22,497
lots of people. 
There was lots and lots of 

325
00:16:22,497 --> 00:16:25,080
pilgrims which came to these 
holy sites. 

326
00:16:25,080 --> 00:16:30,870
The next part of the history of 
pilgrimages is the history of 

327
00:16:30,870 --> 00:16:35,140
Chinese monks coming to India. 
And there are some very, very 

328
00:16:35,140 --> 00:16:38,853
famous Chinese monks that came 
all the way from China all the 

329
00:16:38,853 --> 00:16:41,624
way to India. 
And it was an incredibly arduous

330
00:16:41,624 --> 00:16:44,080
journey in those days to travel 
from China. 

331
00:16:44,080 --> 00:16:47,773
They traveled from what was the 
capital of China in those days, 

332
00:16:47,773 --> 00:16:49,109
Xi'an. 
I think that's how you pronounce

333
00:16:49,109 --> 00:16:50,052
it. 
But I may have gotten that 

334
00:16:50,052 --> 00:16:52,948
wrong. 
And they traveled then westwards

335
00:16:52,948 --> 00:16:56,914
along the Silk Road. 
And if any of you have studied 

336
00:16:56,914 --> 00:17:00,319
the map of what it looks like in
those areas, it is extremely 

337
00:17:00,319 --> 00:17:02,812
isolated. 
And of course much, much worse 

338
00:17:02,812 --> 00:17:05,780
1,500, 2,000 years ago than it 
is today. 

339
00:17:05,780 --> 00:17:10,627
It's all very high altitude, 
deserts, snow, cold winds and 

340
00:17:10,627 --> 00:17:13,579
all these things. 
And then having traversed all 

341
00:17:13,579 --> 00:17:16,579
those deserts, then you have to 
cross these enormous mountains 

342
00:17:16,579 --> 00:17:19,792
at the other end, either the 
Himalaya Mountains or the Hindu 

343
00:17:19,792 --> 00:17:21,948
Kush. 
But depending a bit on which 

344
00:17:21,948 --> 00:17:24,567
route you take. 
And then after only having 

345
00:17:24,567 --> 00:17:27,780
crossed those mountains, do you 
actually enter India proper. 

346
00:17:27,780 --> 00:17:29,780
There's about 2,000 kilometers 
of travel there. 

347
00:17:29,780 --> 00:17:34,780
And the landscape is incredibly 
barren and very difficult to 

348
00:17:34,780 --> 00:17:36,780
cross. 
And lots of these Chinese monks 

349
00:17:36,780 --> 00:17:38,780
died on the way. 
They died. 

350
00:17:38,780 --> 00:17:41,280
That's how keen they were to go 
on this pilgrimage. 

351
00:17:41,280 --> 00:17:43,872
They couldn't handle it. 
They died of altitude sickness, 

352
00:17:43,872 --> 00:17:47,280
of cold, all kinds of things. 
And never, of course, made it 

353
00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:51,780
back again to China. 
The first one, when they went, 

354
00:17:51,780 --> 00:17:54,614
of course, because the journey 
was so arduous, they went for 

355
00:17:54,614 --> 00:17:56,280
usually very long periods of 
time. 

356
00:17:56,280 --> 00:18:02,316
The most famous Chinese monk to 
go to India is a monk called 

357
00:18:02,316 --> 00:18:04,969
Xuanzang. 
He stayed, his journey lasted 

358
00:18:04,969 --> 00:18:08,872
for 17 years. 17 years. 
So imagine what sort of 

359
00:18:08,872 --> 00:18:10,780
pilgrimage that was 17 years 
away. 

360
00:18:10,780 --> 00:18:14,607
It's quite staggering. 
And he went with the blessing of

361
00:18:14,607 --> 00:18:17,739
the emperor of China because the
emperor of China in those days 

362
00:18:17,739 --> 00:18:21,309
was also a Buddhist. 
So again, you can see that these

363
00:18:21,309 --> 00:18:24,919
were very high-level kind of 
pilgrimages going on in those 

364
00:18:24,919 --> 00:18:27,280
days. 
And Xuanzang went to China. 

365
00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:30,280
The reason why many of these 
monks went to China in those 

366
00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:33,030
days was twofold, basically. 
First of all, they wanted to go 

367
00:18:33,030 --> 00:18:36,532
to the holy sites to pay their 
respects there, to get a feeling

368
00:18:36,532 --> 00:18:39,968
for Buddhism in its original 
land, just like most pilgrims do

369
00:18:39,968 --> 00:18:42,424
today. 
That was obviously one very 

370
00:18:42,424 --> 00:18:45,080
important reason. 
And the other reason why they 

371
00:18:45,080 --> 00:18:47,780
went, and that was to actually 
collect Buddhist scriptures. 

372
00:18:47,780 --> 00:18:52,280
Because in those days, India was
still the Buddhist homeland. 

373
00:18:52,280 --> 00:18:54,782
And if you wanted to find 
original Buddhist scriptures, 

374
00:18:54,782 --> 00:18:57,280
you had to travel to India in 
those days. 

375
00:18:57,280 --> 00:19:00,780
In China, there were already 
many translations into Chinese. 

376
00:19:00,780 --> 00:19:03,722
But often, just like today, 
those translations may not have 

377
00:19:03,722 --> 00:19:05,780
been so good, maybe not so 
accurate. 

378
00:19:05,780 --> 00:19:09,680
So people wanted to go back to 
the homeland of Buddhism to find

379
00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:12,872
the original, the real teachings
of Buddhism, just in the same 

380
00:19:12,872 --> 00:19:14,780
way as we are today, always 
searching. 

381
00:19:14,780 --> 00:19:16,780
But what actually did the Buddha
teach? 

382
00:19:16,780 --> 00:19:21,055
What are the original teachings?
So these Chinese monks collected

383
00:19:21,055 --> 00:19:25,210
enormous amounts of rolls of 
scriptures and then brought them

384
00:19:25,210 --> 00:19:28,780
back to China and spent decades 
translating all these Chinese, 

385
00:19:28,780 --> 00:19:32,780
Indian Sanskrit languages into 
Chinese. 

386
00:19:32,780 --> 00:19:37,068
And it's interesting because 
it's a precedent we can see 

387
00:19:37,068 --> 00:19:40,898
today, in today's world. 
You will find that many monks, 

388
00:19:40,898 --> 00:19:43,369
particularly monks but also 
academics, are extremely 

389
00:19:43,369 --> 00:19:46,030
interested in this question. 
What actually did the Buddha 

390
00:19:46,030 --> 00:19:47,280
teach? 
Who was the Buddha? 

391
00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:49,780
What are his truths? 
What are his true teachings? 

392
00:19:49,780 --> 00:19:51,780
Because obviously this is very 
important. 

393
00:19:51,780 --> 00:19:55,449
If we know what the Buddha 
taught, well that is the 

394
00:19:55,449 --> 00:19:57,780
teaching which has real 
authority in Buddhism. 

395
00:19:57,780 --> 00:19:59,900
What anybody else says, okay 
that's fine, maybe they're 

396
00:19:59,900 --> 00:20:01,780
right, maybe they're wrong, we 
can't really tell. 

397
00:20:01,780 --> 00:20:04,530
But the Buddha, we have to 
assume that his teachings were 

398
00:20:04,530 --> 00:20:06,924
right. 
So these are the real 

399
00:20:06,924 --> 00:20:10,118
authoritative teachings. 
And that is why it is so 

400
00:20:10,118 --> 00:20:14,114
important to try to base our 
practice on the authority of the

401
00:20:14,114 --> 00:20:16,054
Buddha himself. 
And you can see how this search 

402
00:20:16,054 --> 00:20:18,210
has been going on. 
Basically ever since the Buddha 

403
00:20:18,210 --> 00:20:20,782
passed away. 
It's always been the search for 

404
00:20:20,782 --> 00:20:22,780
what did the Buddha actually 
teach. 

405
00:20:22,780 --> 00:20:27,730
So these Chinese monks went to 
India and there are some 

406
00:20:27,730 --> 00:20:31,780
beautiful descriptions of these 
Chinese monks going to India. 

407
00:20:31,780 --> 00:20:35,280
There is one famous monk called 
Fa Xian and he was one of the 

408
00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:38,936
first ones to go to India. 
And he went to Sabati where the 

409
00:20:38,936 --> 00:20:42,375
Buddha spent most of his time. 
And they wrote books so we know 

410
00:20:42,375 --> 00:20:45,099
exactly what they felt and what 
happened to them when they went 

411
00:20:45,099 --> 00:20:48,649
to these places. 
And when he went to Sabati he 

412
00:20:48,649 --> 00:20:50,780
was the first Chinese monk to go
there. 

413
00:20:50,780 --> 00:20:54,114
And all these Indian monks were 
marveling at this foreigner 

414
00:20:54,114 --> 00:20:56,580
among them. 
This strange person who had come

415
00:20:56,580 --> 00:21:00,180
2000 kilometers away just to 
come to Sabati, just to come to 

416
00:21:00,180 --> 00:21:03,780
India to experience what it's 
like to be in the Buddhist land.

417
00:21:03,780 --> 00:21:07,532
And the Chinese monk of course 
was also marveling at all the 

418
00:21:07,532 --> 00:21:10,545
strange customs around them. 
And these Chinese monks were 

419
00:21:10,545 --> 00:21:14,075
saying and they were getting 
very emotional and crying that, 

420
00:21:14,075 --> 00:21:15,704
you know, why is it that we were
born so far away from the 

421
00:21:15,704 --> 00:21:16,396
Buddha? 
Why is it that we were born so 

422
00:21:16,396 --> 00:21:17,849
far away from the Buddha? 
Why is it that we were born so 

423
00:21:17,849 --> 00:21:18,780
far away from the Buddha's 
Buddhist land? 

424
00:21:18,780 --> 00:21:21,428
Why is it that we were born in a
different time from the time of 

425
00:21:21,428 --> 00:21:23,374
the Buddha? 
And they were obviously very 

426
00:21:23,374 --> 00:21:26,872
emotional about being able to 
come to the places where the 

427
00:21:26,872 --> 00:21:29,780
Buddha had been in those days. 
So very beautiful descriptions 

428
00:21:29,780 --> 00:21:31,780
you can find in some of these 
books. 

429
00:21:31,780 --> 00:21:33,780
And some of these books are 
still available today. 

430
00:21:33,780 --> 00:21:35,780
They are translated into 
English. 

431
00:21:35,780 --> 00:21:40,780
And you can read them yourself, 
these descriptions of these 

432
00:21:40,780 --> 00:21:43,780
Chinese monks 1500, 1600 years 
ago. 

433
00:21:43,780 --> 00:21:48,282
So after this, sorry, after 
these Chinese monks went to 

434
00:21:48,282 --> 00:21:52,115
India, as many of them died, 
that's how arduous those 

435
00:21:52,115 --> 00:21:55,145
pilgrims were in those days. 
Some of those Chinese pilgrims 

436
00:21:55,145 --> 00:21:59,354
also went by the sea route. 
The sea route from China going 

437
00:21:59,354 --> 00:22:03,352
through the Malacca Straits and 
across the ocean, very, very 

438
00:22:03,352 --> 00:22:06,498
dangerous in those days, just as
it can be dangerous today, 

439
00:22:06,498 --> 00:22:08,780
infested by pirates and all 
kinds of things. 

440
00:22:08,780 --> 00:22:12,780
And again, many of them never 
actually made it to India. 

441
00:22:12,780 --> 00:22:16,658
They perished on the way. 
Some of the other pilgrims that 

442
00:22:16,658 --> 00:22:19,780
have gone to India are from all 
over the world. 

443
00:22:19,780 --> 00:22:23,780
You find pilgrims from Vietnam, 
from Japan, from Korea, later 

444
00:22:23,780 --> 00:22:28,475
on, or not later on, but also 
early on from Burma, from 

445
00:22:28,475 --> 00:22:30,780
Thailand, from Cambodia, from 
everywhere basically. 

446
00:22:30,780 --> 00:22:34,488
The whole Buddhist world did 
pilgrimages from the ancient 

447
00:22:34,488 --> 00:22:37,780
times to the present day coming 
to India. 

448
00:22:37,780 --> 00:22:40,530
In the present day, you find, 
for example, there's a famous 

449
00:22:40,530 --> 00:22:43,495
story of a Thai monk, who's 
supposedly very, very good at 

450
00:22:43,495 --> 00:22:46,780
this. 
He's a very good meditator. 

451
00:22:46,780 --> 00:22:50,382
Excuse me here. 
Who walked, it's only about 100 

452
00:22:50,382 --> 00:22:53,664
years ago, who walked all the 
way from Thailand, all the way 

453
00:22:53,664 --> 00:22:57,486
to India, just so that he could 
visit those four holy places in 

454
00:22:57,486 --> 00:22:59,780
India. 
Walked all that way. 

455
00:22:59,780 --> 00:23:01,780
It's about 2,000 kilometers 
walk. 

456
00:23:01,780 --> 00:23:03,780
You've got to be really, really 
keen. 

457
00:23:03,780 --> 00:23:05,980
There's got to be something 
inside of you which tells you 

458
00:23:05,980 --> 00:23:09,580
this is really important, to be 
able to walk for 2,000 

459
00:23:09,580 --> 00:23:12,780
kilometers just to see these 
historical Buddhist sites. 

460
00:23:12,780 --> 00:23:13,780
So you can see here the power of
the Buddha. 

461
00:23:13,780 --> 00:23:14,780
So you can see here the power of
the Buddha. 

462
00:23:14,780 --> 00:23:17,115
Which draws people. 
And often these people are 

463
00:23:17,115 --> 00:23:19,514
people who are very, very 
serious about their spiritual 

464
00:23:19,514 --> 00:23:22,780
path, very serious about 
learning about Buddhism. 

465
00:23:22,780 --> 00:23:27,180
People who are really, find this
extremely important to go all 

466
00:23:27,180 --> 00:23:31,480
this way to India, to seek the 
roots of their religion, so to 

467
00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:33,430
speak. 
And if you go to India today, 

468
00:23:33,430 --> 00:23:36,924
it's one of the things which I 
found so inspiring when I go to 

469
00:23:36,924 --> 00:23:40,282
these holy places, that you find
that you find people of all, 

470
00:23:40,282 --> 00:23:42,780
coming from all over the world, 
seeing these places. 

471
00:23:42,780 --> 00:23:47,180
You find people coming from 
Taiwan, doing their chants in 

472
00:23:47,180 --> 00:23:48,892
Mandarin. 
And it's actually quite, it's 

473
00:23:48,892 --> 00:23:50,935
nice to listen to. 
I don't understand anything of 

474
00:23:50,935 --> 00:23:52,780
it, but it's quite nice to 
listen to. 

475
00:23:52,780 --> 00:23:54,780
And you find people coming from 
China. 

476
00:23:54,780 --> 00:23:58,780
You find people coming from 
Vietnam, from Korea, from lots 

477
00:23:58,780 --> 00:24:02,495
of people from Thailand. 
Thailand is very big on these 

478
00:24:02,495 --> 00:24:04,495
pilgrimages. 
You find lots of Sri Lankan 

479
00:24:04,495 --> 00:24:06,780
people. 
You find Cambodians. 

480
00:24:06,780 --> 00:24:09,566
And these days, of course, you 
also find for the first time in 

481
00:24:09,566 --> 00:24:12,450
history, lots of people from the
Western world going to these 

482
00:24:12,450 --> 00:24:15,676
places, holy places in India. 
So when you go there, it's 

483
00:24:15,676 --> 00:24:19,150
almost like it's a gathering of 
Buddhist people from all over 

484
00:24:19,150 --> 00:24:21,580
the world. 
And that in itself is actually 

485
00:24:21,580 --> 00:24:24,114
quite a beautiful experience. 
Of course, lots of Tibetans as 

486
00:24:24,114 --> 00:24:26,236
well go there, because the 
Tibetans are very keen on going 

487
00:24:26,236 --> 00:24:29,352
to Bodh Gaya. 
Many of them already live in 

488
00:24:29,352 --> 00:24:31,880
India. 
So there's a coming together and

489
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:35,380
a sense of basically meeting 
lots of Buddhist people from 

490
00:24:35,380 --> 00:24:37,780
everywhere in the world. 
And it's quite fascinating. 

491
00:24:37,780 --> 00:24:41,447
Suddenly you feel as if you're 
part of this enormous Buddhist 

492
00:24:41,447 --> 00:24:43,780
family which spreads now across 
the globe. 

493
00:24:43,780 --> 00:24:47,780
Basically to every nook and 
cranny of this globe. 

494
00:24:47,780 --> 00:24:50,780
Today you find monks, for 
example, even in Africa. 

495
00:24:50,780 --> 00:24:55,204
There are black African monks 
who take part in some of these 

496
00:24:55,204 --> 00:24:57,780
ceremonies and things that we 
sometimes meet. 

497
00:24:57,780 --> 00:25:00,780
So they are everywhere. 
Everybody is getting inspired by

498
00:25:00,780 --> 00:25:05,449
the Dhamma of the Buddha. 
So this is just to give you some

499
00:25:05,449 --> 00:25:08,580
idea about the history of this 
pilgrimage and some of the 

500
00:25:08,580 --> 00:25:10,780
people who have done these sort 
of pilgrimages in the past. 

501
00:25:10,780 --> 00:25:15,380
Now the last thing I want to 
talk about is what can we expect

502
00:25:15,380 --> 00:25:19,780
to get out of a pilgrimage? 
Why should we do it? 

503
00:25:19,780 --> 00:25:23,244
What is the purpose? 
What can it do for us in a 

504
00:25:23,244 --> 00:25:24,780
sense, these kind of 
pilgrimages? 

505
00:25:24,780 --> 00:25:28,116
And the first thing and the very
powerful thing that I've always 

506
00:25:28,116 --> 00:25:32,282
found with going on a pilgrimage
is that it gives the whole 

507
00:25:32,282 --> 00:25:37,180
Buddhist teachings, the whole of
Buddhism, a very powerful 

508
00:25:37,180 --> 00:25:40,580
historical reality. 
Sometimes I found when I was 

509
00:25:40,580 --> 00:25:42,530
reading the Buddhist discourses,
you read about the Buddha was 

510
00:25:42,530 --> 00:25:45,180
staying here, Buddha was staying
in Rajagal, Buddha was staying 

511
00:25:45,180 --> 00:25:46,780
in Savatthi, this and that 
happened. 

512
00:25:46,780 --> 00:25:50,248
And sometimes you're not really 
sure, is it a fairy tale or is 

513
00:25:50,248 --> 00:25:53,114
it real? 
Sometimes it seems a bit like a 

514
00:25:53,114 --> 00:25:55,030
fairy tale. 
It's almost hard sometimes to 

515
00:25:55,030 --> 00:25:57,865
relate to it. 
It's a foreign culture 2,500 

516
00:25:57,865 --> 00:26:00,780
years ago in a far, faraway 
land. 

517
00:26:00,780 --> 00:26:03,780
How can we really relate to that
in an easy way? 

518
00:26:03,780 --> 00:26:07,780
Sometimes it seems very foreign 
and hard to relate to. 

519
00:26:07,780 --> 00:26:11,530
So the beautiful thing about 
going to India is that instead 

520
00:26:11,530 --> 00:26:14,114
of having that sense of, you 
know, that foreignness which you

521
00:26:14,114 --> 00:26:16,964
can get sometimes when you read 
the discourses of the Buddha, 

522
00:26:16,964 --> 00:26:19,780
what he said, it brings 
everything alive. 

523
00:26:19,780 --> 00:26:24,924
It's like you are going to those
places which are described in 

524
00:26:24,924 --> 00:26:27,780
those suttas, in those 
discourses by the Buddha. 

525
00:26:27,780 --> 00:26:30,781
And it's very powerful because 
you read the suttas and you read

526
00:26:30,781 --> 00:26:33,780
place names, right? 
You read Rajagal, you read 

527
00:26:33,780 --> 00:26:35,780
Savatthi, you read about 
Benares. 

528
00:26:35,780 --> 00:26:38,566
And then you go to India and you
see exactly the same place 

529
00:26:38,566 --> 00:26:40,780
names. 
You see they're there. 

530
00:26:40,780 --> 00:26:43,780
They still have the same names. 
They're 2,500 years later. 

531
00:26:43,780 --> 00:26:48,380
And suddenly the inescapable 
conclusion for you is that these

532
00:26:48,380 --> 00:26:52,280
must be historical places. 
Suddenly it becomes incredibly 

533
00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:56,328
powerful that these things which
you read about in the suttas 

534
00:26:56,328 --> 00:26:57,780
definitely are historical 
places. 

535
00:26:57,780 --> 00:27:01,280
It drives home the point in a 
way which you can never do by 

536
00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:04,780
just reading the suttas alone. 
And it's very, very powerful. 

537
00:27:04,780 --> 00:27:09,280
Rajagaha, for example, is called
today Rajagira and it's a direct

538
00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:14,947
derivation from that original, 
that original name 2,500 years 

539
00:27:14,947 --> 00:27:17,924
ago. 
Benares is called Baranasi or 

540
00:27:17,924 --> 00:27:21,780
even Benares called the Baranasi
in the suttas. 

541
00:27:21,780 --> 00:27:25,780
It's obviously exactly the same 
place as it was 2,500 years ago.

542
00:27:25,780 --> 00:27:30,280
You go to a place in Rajagaha 
called, it's called the hot 

543
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:34,116
springs in the suttas. 
And the story is in the suttas 

544
00:27:34,116 --> 00:27:37,670
that when the monks were staying
in Rajagaha, they would go and 

545
00:27:37,670 --> 00:27:40,781
bathe in these hot springs and 
there was natural heating in 

546
00:27:40,781 --> 00:27:43,495
these hot springs. 
It was very pleasant to bathe 

547
00:27:43,495 --> 00:27:46,780
there, particularly in the 
winter time of course. 

548
00:27:46,780 --> 00:27:50,780
And you go to the exact same 
spot today and what do you find?

549
00:27:50,780 --> 00:27:55,114
You find people bathing in these
springs even today, 2,500 years 

550
00:27:55,114 --> 00:27:57,880
later. 
And this is one of the amazing 

551
00:27:57,880 --> 00:28:00,600
things about India. 
Sometimes you think that India 

552
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:03,892
has stood still for 2,500 years 
and many things in India 

553
00:28:03,892 --> 00:28:06,447
obviously have stood still. 
There hasn't been that much 

554
00:28:06,447 --> 00:28:08,209
change. 
And that is why, you know, that 

555
00:28:08,209 --> 00:28:13,780
you can actually recognize these
things even after 2,500 years. 

556
00:28:13,780 --> 00:28:18,905
Some years ago some Japanese 
investigator, they wanted to 

557
00:28:18,905 --> 00:28:20,780
investigate these particular hot
springs. 

558
00:28:20,780 --> 00:28:24,780
Why is it that there were hot 
springs here 2,500 years ago? 

559
00:28:24,780 --> 00:28:28,380
And they found traces of 
radioactive elements in the 

560
00:28:28,380 --> 00:28:32,180
ground, of sulfur in the ground.
And of course this was so they 

561
00:28:32,180 --> 00:28:34,916
could actually prove that these 
hot springs had existed here for

562
00:28:34,916 --> 00:28:40,552
a long, long time in the past. 
One of my favorite stories about

563
00:28:40,552 --> 00:28:46,448
making the history of India come
true and make it really, make it

564
00:28:46,448 --> 00:28:50,780
seem very vivid as if it 
actually is a historical reality

565
00:28:50,780 --> 00:28:53,219
is when I read in the suttas 
that one of the places the 

566
00:28:53,219 --> 00:28:56,280
Buddha says that well before I 
become enlightenment, where I 

567
00:28:56,280 --> 00:28:59,280
was still living the household 
life and the Buddha lived a very

568
00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:02,599
privileged life, he had a very 
pleasant upbringing and he had 

569
00:29:02,599 --> 00:29:05,924
all kinds, always the best food 
around him and everything of the

570
00:29:05,924 --> 00:29:08,284
best around him. 
And one of the things he had, he

571
00:29:08,284 --> 00:29:09,780
had of course the best kind of 
clothes. 

572
00:29:09,780 --> 00:29:12,780
Clothes which were made by the 
best kind of cloth. 

573
00:29:12,780 --> 00:29:15,780
Now where did that best kind of 
cloth come from? 

574
00:29:15,780 --> 00:29:17,780
It came from a place called 
Kasi. 

575
00:29:17,780 --> 00:29:20,780
Kasi is an alternative name for 
Benares. 

576
00:29:20,780 --> 00:29:23,780
So he was wearing Kasi cloth, 
Benares cloth. 

577
00:29:23,780 --> 00:29:25,780
That was the best cloth in India
at the time. 

578
00:29:25,780 --> 00:29:30,280
Now if you go to Benares today, 
the amazing thing is that the 

579
00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:34,380
best cloth, the most famous 
cloth in India still comes from 

580
00:29:34,380 --> 00:29:36,780
Benares. 
One of those amazing things, 

581
00:29:36,780 --> 00:29:39,924
this tiny little detail in the 
suttas, which is almost like 

582
00:29:39,924 --> 00:29:42,496
mentioned in passing, it could 
mean anything, it could be a 

583
00:29:42,496 --> 00:29:45,655
legend, it could be a myth, but 
it isn't, it's obviously 

584
00:29:45,655 --> 00:29:48,068
historical reality here. 
Because it still is the case 

585
00:29:48,068 --> 00:29:49,780
today after two and a half 
thousand years. 

586
00:29:49,780 --> 00:29:53,655
I find it remarkable, I find it 
like, it's just like you get 

587
00:29:53,655 --> 00:29:58,212
this feeling that even the minor
details in the suttas are 

588
00:29:58,212 --> 00:30:00,780
actually very true to their 
word. 

589
00:30:00,780 --> 00:30:04,780
And this becomes very kind of, 
very remarkable. 

590
00:30:04,780 --> 00:30:07,780
And when you travel around all 
these places, you see it again 

591
00:30:07,780 --> 00:30:10,530
and again and again, in all 
these places you see place 

592
00:30:10,530 --> 00:30:13,580
names, you see things that you 
recognize, things that go back 

593
00:30:13,580 --> 00:30:16,114
two and a half thousand years. 
And again and again it drives 

594
00:30:16,114 --> 00:30:18,780
home the point, these are 
historical realities. 

595
00:30:18,780 --> 00:30:21,780
The Buddha was a historical 
personality. 

596
00:30:21,780 --> 00:30:26,210
He was a man that walked this 
earth, very much like the rest 

597
00:30:26,210 --> 00:30:28,780
of us, two and a half thousand 
years ago. 

598
00:30:28,780 --> 00:30:32,114
There cannot be any doubt 
anymore that these things are 

599
00:30:32,114 --> 00:30:34,280
historical realities. 
And that of course makes your 

600
00:30:34,280 --> 00:30:37,280
faith become so much more 
powerful, when you realize that 

601
00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:41,280
these things are true, something
inside of you happens, which 

602
00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:45,780
grows that faith, makes it more 
powerful, makes it really work. 

603
00:30:45,780 --> 00:30:50,114
So you can now see why this kind
of trip can be so inspiring, why

604
00:30:50,114 --> 00:30:54,328
it can lift you up, and give you
a different understanding of 

605
00:30:54,328 --> 00:30:57,780
what Buddhism actually is, give 
you an uplift in your practice, 

606
00:30:57,780 --> 00:31:01,114
do something for you. 
So that is the first thing, it's

607
00:31:01,114 --> 00:31:03,780
just bringing home the 
historical reality of Buddhism, 

608
00:31:03,780 --> 00:31:07,183
and the Dhamma, and all those 
places where the Buddha was two 

609
00:31:07,183 --> 00:31:11,448
and a half thousand years ago. 
And the second thing, which is a

610
00:31:11,448 --> 00:31:14,448
powerful thing of going to 
India, is simply that when you 

611
00:31:14,448 --> 00:31:18,691
go to these places, you can 
often feel something when you go

612
00:31:18,691 --> 00:31:21,336
to these places. 
And this is what the Buddha was 

613
00:31:21,336 --> 00:31:24,508
talking about when he laid down 
that we should go to these 

614
00:31:24,508 --> 00:31:26,495
places. 
He said that people who have 

615
00:31:26,495 --> 00:31:30,448
faith, people who are Buddhist, 
will have emotions when they go 

616
00:31:30,448 --> 00:31:33,495
to these places. 
And you can see that often 

617
00:31:33,495 --> 00:31:36,550
today, it happens that people go
there and they feel a sense of 

618
00:31:36,550 --> 00:31:39,780
joy, or they start crying again 
out of joy often. 

619
00:31:39,780 --> 00:31:43,114
This happens all the time. 
Certainly on my trip, there was 

620
00:31:43,114 --> 00:31:45,614
one man who said, why is it that
I'm crying when I go to these 

621
00:31:45,614 --> 00:31:47,114
places? 
And I said, it's obvious, it's 

622
00:31:47,114 --> 00:31:50,003
because you are a Buddhist, and 
suddenly for the first time, you

623
00:31:50,003 --> 00:31:51,780
are basically face to face with 
the Buddha. 

624
00:31:51,780 --> 00:31:55,447
You're going in his footsteps. 
You've always been removed from 

625
00:31:55,447 --> 00:31:56,780
him, and suddenly you are in his
place. 

626
00:31:56,780 --> 00:32:00,780
That's why you're crying. 
It's an emotional reaction. 

627
00:32:00,780 --> 00:32:02,780
It's to be expected that these 
things will happen. 

628
00:32:02,780 --> 00:32:05,780
And this is the second thing 
which becomes very beautiful, 

629
00:32:05,780 --> 00:32:09,560
this emotional reaction that we 
can have, because these kinds of

630
00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:12,580
emotional reactions leave an 
impact, leave something in the 

631
00:32:12,580 --> 00:32:15,780
mind, which we later on can 
recollect that there was some 

632
00:32:15,780 --> 00:32:19,352
power to these places, something
about these places which are 

633
00:32:19,352 --> 00:32:21,495
special. 
The reason that they are special

634
00:32:21,495 --> 00:32:25,114
is, first of all, if you have a 
sense of faith in Buddhism, then

635
00:32:25,114 --> 00:32:29,780
by going to these places, 
suddenly you are in a place 

636
00:32:29,780 --> 00:32:32,780
where you are close to the 
Buddha, as close as possible. 

637
00:32:32,780 --> 00:32:35,780
As close as you can get in this 
present age. 

638
00:32:35,780 --> 00:32:38,924
So if you have that faith, of 
course, that gives sense to 

639
00:32:38,924 --> 00:32:41,180
something inside you. 
You are close to that which you 

640
00:32:41,180 --> 00:32:44,580
have faith in. 
That in itself gives rise to an 

641
00:32:44,580 --> 00:32:47,114
emotional reaction often. 
The other thing which can give 

642
00:32:47,114 --> 00:32:51,280
rise to joy is simply the fact 
that in these places there may 

643
00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:54,280
also sometimes be powerful 
beings around, like Devas, for 

644
00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:56,780
example. 
And sometimes it's a bit like, 

645
00:32:56,780 --> 00:32:59,704
you know, sometimes you can go 
into a room, and you can feel 

646
00:32:59,704 --> 00:33:01,780
sometimes the emotion of the 
person in that room. 

647
00:33:01,780 --> 00:33:04,580
Maybe somebody is angry or 
something, or somebody is very 

648
00:33:04,580 --> 00:33:07,550
peaceful, and you can feel that 
the whole room has a sense of 

649
00:33:07,550 --> 00:33:11,780
peace, or a sense of non-peace 
if the person is upset. 

650
00:33:11,780 --> 00:33:15,405
In the same way, if powerful 
beings exist in a particular 

651
00:33:15,405 --> 00:33:19,447
place, it's almost as if you can
tune in sometimes to that 

652
00:33:19,447 --> 00:33:21,780
effect. 
When you sit down peacefully, 

653
00:33:21,780 --> 00:33:24,780
close your eyes and try to 
meditate, sometimes you can feel

654
00:33:24,780 --> 00:33:27,780
a kind of energy in these 
particular places. 

655
00:33:27,780 --> 00:33:31,780
Nothing supernatural, it's just 
the effect of presence of these 

656
00:33:31,780 --> 00:33:34,780
particular beings. 
So these are the kind of things 

657
00:33:34,780 --> 00:33:37,780
that we can hope to experience 
on these trips. 

658
00:33:39,780 --> 00:33:42,780
So, then what? 
Is that all there is to it? 

659
00:33:42,780 --> 00:33:44,780
Is that what pilgrimage is all 
about? 

660
00:33:44,780 --> 00:33:48,226
Is it all about just getting 
some hold of history and getting

661
00:33:48,226 --> 00:33:51,380
a feeling for the reality of 
this, and getting some emotional

662
00:33:51,380 --> 00:33:53,780
reaction? 
Is that what it's all about? 

663
00:33:53,780 --> 00:33:55,780
No, this is not what it's all 
about. 

664
00:33:55,780 --> 00:33:59,210
This is only like the thing that
we do when we go on the 

665
00:33:59,210 --> 00:34:01,924
pilgrimage itself. 
The real significance of going 

666
00:34:01,924 --> 00:34:05,066
on pilgrimage is not these 
reactions or these things that 

667
00:34:05,066 --> 00:34:08,380
we feel when we go there. 
The real significance of 

668
00:34:08,380 --> 00:34:12,280
pilgrimage is how it affects our
general spiritual practice, our 

669
00:34:12,280 --> 00:34:16,179
general spiritual journey. 
You may of course say that to go

670
00:34:16,179 --> 00:34:20,447
to India is a spiritual journey 
in its own right, but of course 

671
00:34:20,447 --> 00:34:21,780
that's not the real spiritual 
journey. 

672
00:34:21,780 --> 00:34:25,114
The real spiritual journey that 
we're all on is this journey of 

673
00:34:25,114 --> 00:34:27,781
the heart. 
The journey of the heart which 

674
00:34:27,781 --> 00:34:31,780
moves towards peace, 
tranquility, kindness, goodness,

675
00:34:31,780 --> 00:34:35,655
loving kindness, compassion, all
these beautiful qualities that 

676
00:34:35,655 --> 00:34:38,780
we're all trying to develop in 
our lives. 

677
00:34:38,780 --> 00:34:40,780
That is the real spiritual 
journey. 

678
00:34:40,780 --> 00:34:43,781
It's an inner journey which 
every one of us has to undertake

679
00:34:43,781 --> 00:34:46,418
on their own. 
And this is a journey which 

680
00:34:46,418 --> 00:34:50,235
happens in our daily life, every
day, as we try to practice in a 

681
00:34:50,235 --> 00:34:53,780
correct way, do what is right, 
avoid doing what is wrong. 

682
00:34:53,780 --> 00:34:57,380
This is the daily struggles that
we go through in practicing our 

683
00:34:57,380 --> 00:34:59,781
spiritual path. 
And slowly but surely it is 

684
00:34:59,781 --> 00:35:04,280
lifting us up, lifting up our 
minds, and imbuing ourselves 

685
00:35:04,280 --> 00:35:07,780
with those qualities as we 
practice. 

686
00:35:07,780 --> 00:35:09,780
So this is a real spiritual 
journey. 

687
00:35:09,780 --> 00:35:14,447
The thing about going to India 
is just a kind of help on that 

688
00:35:14,447 --> 00:35:16,780
journey. 
And that is how we should view, 

689
00:35:16,780 --> 00:35:20,210
ultimately that's how we should 
view a pilgrimage to India, as 

690
00:35:20,210 --> 00:35:24,580
an aid, as something which helps
us on our real spiritual journey

691
00:35:24,580 --> 00:35:26,780
in daily life. 
How does it work? 

692
00:35:26,780 --> 00:35:30,780
How does it help us in our real 
spiritual journey in daily life?

693
00:35:30,780 --> 00:35:34,067
Well, just the very fact that 
these things have become more 

694
00:35:34,067 --> 00:35:38,114
historical, real for you, just 
the fact that maybe you have 

695
00:35:38,114 --> 00:35:41,067
felt something when you go to 
these places, that already will,

696
00:35:41,067 --> 00:35:44,180
when you come back, will have a 
kind of background, subconscious

697
00:35:44,180 --> 00:35:47,780
effect on your life, and already
do something for you. 

698
00:35:47,780 --> 00:35:50,780
Sometimes you may not even be 
aware of it, but I would say 

699
00:35:50,780 --> 00:35:54,980
that this always has some sort 
of background effect, at least 

700
00:35:54,980 --> 00:35:55,780
for a while after you have come 
back. 

701
00:35:56,780 --> 00:36:00,580
After you have been on this 
pilgrimage, probably for your 

702
00:36:00,580 --> 00:36:03,530
whole lifetime. 
That's one way that this has an 

703
00:36:03,530 --> 00:36:04,638
effect. 
Another way that this has an 

704
00:36:04,638 --> 00:36:08,003
effect is simply that sometimes,
if you feel a bit uninspired, if

705
00:36:08,003 --> 00:36:10,448
you feel that your practice is 
going difficult, you're not 

706
00:36:10,448 --> 00:36:13,530
really going so well, you can 
sometimes just reflect on that 

707
00:36:13,530 --> 00:36:16,448
pilgrimage, and think about 
those highs and those emotions 

708
00:36:16,448 --> 00:36:20,114
you had when you went there, and
then inspire yourself again, to 

709
00:36:20,114 --> 00:36:23,447
remember that this is real, this
is important, this is 

710
00:36:23,447 --> 00:36:25,880
historical, these teachings 
actually do what they are 

711
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:29,780
supposed to do, and then by 
inspiring yourself in this way, 

712
00:36:29,780 --> 00:36:33,030
you can lift yourself up, and 
you can again improve that 

713
00:36:33,030 --> 00:36:37,380
spiritual practice which you are
trying to uphold in your daily 

714
00:36:37,380 --> 00:36:39,495
life. 
And this way, this sort of 

715
00:36:39,495 --> 00:36:42,780
pilgrimage can actually boost 
your practice of Buddhism. 

716
00:36:42,780 --> 00:36:46,115
It can give you that extra kind 
of energy, that extra kind of 

717
00:36:46,115 --> 00:36:49,781
thing which helps you going. 
These are some of the important 

718
00:36:49,781 --> 00:36:52,447
things in Buddhism, always 
finding these little skillful 

719
00:36:52,447 --> 00:36:55,114
means, these little extra 
things, which give you that 

720
00:36:55,114 --> 00:36:59,380
extra ability, to practice, to 
do what is right, to do what is 

721
00:36:59,380 --> 00:37:02,780
good, to make it easier to 
practice this spiritual path. 

722
00:37:02,780 --> 00:37:06,580
It's difficult enough, we need 
all the help we can to practice 

723
00:37:06,580 --> 00:37:08,780
this spiritual path. 
It is not easy. 

724
00:37:08,780 --> 00:37:12,030
I've never met anybody who says 
it's really, really easy to 

725
00:37:12,030 --> 00:37:14,780
practice this path, moving 
forward at tremendous speed. 

726
00:37:14,780 --> 00:37:17,780
This is incredibly rare. 
Most people find it difficult, 

727
00:37:17,780 --> 00:37:21,447
and it is difficult, because we 
are going against the stream of 

728
00:37:21,447 --> 00:37:24,980
things, always going, practicing
against what our natural 

729
00:37:24,980 --> 00:37:27,780
inclination is, natural 
inclination often is craving. 

730
00:37:27,780 --> 00:37:31,780
And of course we have to go 
against that, and that's why the

731
00:37:31,780 --> 00:37:36,980
practice often is difficult. 
Now I heard of one girl who went

732
00:37:36,980 --> 00:37:40,405
to India. 
This is an example of maybe of 

733
00:37:40,405 --> 00:37:44,638
how we should be careful about 
going to India, maybe what we 

734
00:37:44,638 --> 00:37:47,780
should not be doing when we do 
this kind of trip. 

735
00:37:47,780 --> 00:37:50,530
This girl went to India, and she
had some very nice experience 

736
00:37:50,530 --> 00:37:52,495
there. 
Her meditation was very nice and

737
00:37:52,495 --> 00:37:54,780
peaceful, a lot of joy and 
happiness when she went. 

738
00:37:54,780 --> 00:37:57,780
But then when she came back, of 
course, that disappeared, 

739
00:37:57,780 --> 00:37:59,780
because it was a function of 
going to India. 

740
00:37:59,780 --> 00:38:03,280
That's why she felt this 
happiness and this uplift 

741
00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:06,405
inside. 
She came back again to her home 

742
00:38:06,405 --> 00:38:08,780
country, and she lost that 
feeling. 

743
00:38:08,780 --> 00:38:11,892
And then she went on a trip to 
Thailand, and she met some of 

744
00:38:11,892 --> 00:38:14,780
these famous Thai monks, and she
asked one of these Thai monks, 

745
00:38:14,780 --> 00:38:17,530
well, when I went to India, I 
was feeling so happy and so 

746
00:38:17,530 --> 00:38:21,352
elated, and everything was so 
good, but now I don't feel it 

747
00:38:21,352 --> 00:38:23,114
anymore. 
And this Thai monk said, so what

748
00:38:23,114 --> 00:38:25,210
do you feel now? 
And this Thai monk said 

749
00:38:25,210 --> 00:38:27,780
something like, well, you know, 
what do you expect? 

750
00:38:27,780 --> 00:38:30,780
Happiness comes and goes. 
This is the way life is. 

751
00:38:30,780 --> 00:38:33,780
You cannot expect that happiness
to be there all the time. 

752
00:38:33,780 --> 00:38:36,280
And there's no point in just 
going back to India again and 

753
00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:39,780
experiencing it again, because 
if you were to go back to India,

754
00:38:39,780 --> 00:38:42,780
and you were maybe to stay at 
Bodh Gaya for three months, 

755
00:38:42,780 --> 00:38:45,380
well, soon enough, that 
happiness would disappear 

756
00:38:45,380 --> 00:38:47,780
completely, and you would 
probably get really negative 

757
00:38:47,780 --> 00:38:50,210
about Bodh Gaya. 
You would get completely angry 

758
00:38:50,210 --> 00:38:52,352
and upset because of all the 
suffering, all the problems of 

759
00:38:52,352 --> 00:38:54,447
being in India, all the problems
of being in India, all the 

760
00:38:54,447 --> 00:38:55,780
beggars, and all the problems 
around you. 

761
00:38:55,780 --> 00:38:58,780
The inspiration would fade, and 
all the problems would remain, 

762
00:38:58,780 --> 00:39:01,210
and it would just be terrible. 
You would get really negative 

763
00:39:01,210 --> 00:39:02,780
about it. 
Life is like this. 

764
00:39:02,780 --> 00:39:04,780
It goes up and down. 
Happiness comes. 

765
00:39:04,780 --> 00:39:07,336
Happiness disappears. 
We all know how these things are

766
00:39:07,336 --> 00:39:09,495
in life. 
So don't hold on to that 

767
00:39:09,495 --> 00:39:11,780
happiness. 
Don't try to grasp the happiness

768
00:39:11,780 --> 00:39:16,066
you attained in India. 
Allow it to go, and instead, the

769
00:39:16,066 --> 00:39:19,380
right way of using it is, allow 
it to be a background thing in 

770
00:39:19,380 --> 00:39:21,780
your mind which pushes you 
forward, and now and again, 

771
00:39:21,780 --> 00:39:24,670
reflect on it to really 
understand and allow a little 

772
00:39:24,670 --> 00:39:26,780
bit of happiness and peace to 
come up in you. 

773
00:39:26,780 --> 00:39:29,580
Don't cling to it. 
Don't think that if you were 

774
00:39:29,580 --> 00:39:33,405
just staying in India, you could
have this happiness like always 

775
00:39:33,405 --> 00:39:35,336
there. 
That is the wrong way of looking

776
00:39:35,336 --> 00:39:37,780
at it. 
It's very understandable, but it

777
00:39:37,780 --> 00:39:40,336
doesn't work. 
We cannot hold on to these kind 

778
00:39:40,336 --> 00:39:46,405
of things. 
So that is just some of the 

779
00:39:46,405 --> 00:39:48,418
experiences. 
I didn't actually say much about

780
00:39:48,418 --> 00:39:52,405
my own travel to India because 
it might not be maybe that 

781
00:39:52,405 --> 00:39:56,114
relevant to the exact things I 
saw when I was there and what 

782
00:39:56,114 --> 00:39:58,180
happened. 
But these are some of the things

783
00:39:58,180 --> 00:40:00,780
to reflect on about the 
pilgrimage to India. 

784
00:40:00,780 --> 00:40:03,530
And if you haven't been on a 
pilgrimage, but you consider 

785
00:40:03,530 --> 00:40:06,180
yourself that this might be 
inspiring and interesting, I 

786
00:40:06,180 --> 00:40:09,580
would recommend very much trying
to do it at one stage in your 

787
00:40:09,580 --> 00:40:12,030
life. 
There are lots of groups from 

788
00:40:12,030 --> 00:40:13,892
everywhere going. 
There's always a possibility if 

789
00:40:13,892 --> 00:40:17,114
you want to go. 
If you feel that you're not yet 

790
00:40:17,114 --> 00:40:20,495
committed enough as a Buddhist, 
then wait maybe till you feel 

791
00:40:20,495 --> 00:40:22,655
ready for this sort of thing. 
But it can have a very positive 

792
00:40:22,655 --> 00:40:26,780
impact. 
Okay. 

793
00:40:26,780 --> 00:40:33,280
Any questions or comments? 
Anything any people want to say 

794
00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:37,780
about this? 
That is all I have to say here. 

795
00:40:52,780 --> 00:40:56,780
How many people here have 
actually been to India? 

796
00:40:56,780 --> 00:41:02,780
Wow, it's quite a few actually. 
Okay, good. 

797
00:41:02,780 --> 00:41:04,780
There's still potential for more
though. 

798
00:41:04,780 --> 00:41:08,780
I just have a question. 
Yeah. 

799
00:41:08,780 --> 00:41:11,780
Is there a certain sequence of 
places you may want to visit? 

800
00:41:11,780 --> 00:41:16,352
There is no sequence. 
You can do whatever sequence you

801
00:41:16,352 --> 00:41:17,780
like. 
It doesn't really matter. 

802
00:41:17,780 --> 00:41:20,780
And not only that, not only 
isn't there a certain sequence, 

803
00:41:20,780 --> 00:41:21,780
but very often people actually 
go to more places. 

804
00:41:21,780 --> 00:41:26,418
And just the four holy places. 
Often people also go to the 

805
00:41:26,418 --> 00:41:28,780
places where the Buddha stayed. 
There are some places actually 

806
00:41:28,780 --> 00:41:31,114
which are very, very beautiful. 
One of my favorite places, a 

807
00:41:31,114 --> 00:41:34,780
place called, I mentioned this 
before in my talk, Rajgir, 

808
00:41:34,780 --> 00:41:37,447
Rajagaha. 
It's a place called Vulture's 

809
00:41:37,447 --> 00:41:39,030
Peak. 
It's a very, very beautiful 

810
00:41:39,030 --> 00:41:40,780
place in India. 
It's very quiet. 

811
00:41:40,780 --> 00:41:43,638
It's very secluded. 
There is, if you go at the right

812
00:41:43,638 --> 00:41:45,780
time, there's not many people 
there either. 

813
00:41:45,780 --> 00:41:47,780
And there's a sense of 
aloofness. 

814
00:41:47,780 --> 00:41:50,114
There's no city. 
There's just bush and things all

815
00:41:50,114 --> 00:41:52,280
over the place. 
There's no things all the way 

816
00:41:52,280 --> 00:41:54,166
around you. 
And this is very difficult to 

817
00:41:54,166 --> 00:41:57,067
find at the other Buddhist holy 
places because there's always 

818
00:41:57,067 --> 00:42:01,780
lots of people around. 
So, not only is it nice to go to

819
00:42:01,780 --> 00:42:04,530
the four holy places, but I 
would recommend also going to 

820
00:42:04,530 --> 00:42:08,780
some of those other places which
can also be very inspiring. 

821
00:42:08,780 --> 00:42:10,780
There's another thing about 
actually going on pilgrimage 

822
00:42:10,780 --> 00:42:13,530
which maybe I should mention, 
which I forgot to say in my 

823
00:42:13,530 --> 00:42:15,114
talk. 
One of the nice things about 

824
00:42:15,114 --> 00:42:19,447
going on pilgrimage is that you,
if you go, you often go with a 

825
00:42:19,447 --> 00:42:20,780
monk and hopefully a senior 
monk. 

826
00:42:20,780 --> 00:42:23,066
Somebody who has a good 
understanding of the places and 

827
00:42:23,066 --> 00:42:26,495
the Dhamma and all these things.
And usually you get like Dhamma 

828
00:42:26,495 --> 00:42:29,530
discourses, like every day. 
You know, whenever you go 

829
00:42:29,530 --> 00:42:31,892
somewhere, we talk about Dhamma 
and we have Dhamma discussions 

830
00:42:31,892 --> 00:42:34,580
basically the whole trip. 
It's a great way of immersing 

831
00:42:34,580 --> 00:42:36,780
yourself in the Dhamma much more
deeply. 

832
00:42:36,780 --> 00:42:39,209
Not only do you get the 
inspiration of the places, but 

833
00:42:39,209 --> 00:42:41,780
you get that continuous Dhamma 
input. 

834
00:42:41,780 --> 00:42:44,209
And it's really marvelous. 
On my trip, we were talking 

835
00:42:44,209 --> 00:42:46,780
Dhamma all the time. 
There was no end to it. 

836
00:42:46,780 --> 00:42:48,780
I think I was talking five or 
six hours a day. 

837
00:42:48,780 --> 00:42:49,780
I had a sore throat at the end 
of the day. 

838
00:42:49,780 --> 00:42:52,655
After all that talking, people 
were giving me dollars all the 

839
00:42:52,655 --> 00:42:56,114
time to keep my throat going. 
Which was very kind of them, by 

840
00:42:56,114 --> 00:42:58,495
the way. 
They really looked after me very

841
00:42:58,495 --> 00:43:01,114
well. 
So, and this is great because 

842
00:43:01,114 --> 00:43:05,115
when you have that continuous 
impact on Dhamma, you have a lot

843
00:43:05,115 --> 00:43:07,780
of possibilities of asking 
questions, getting answers. 

844
00:43:07,780 --> 00:43:11,638
And you can always, when you ask
one question, very often another

845
00:43:11,638 --> 00:43:14,114
question comes up, right? 
It's like you always have to 

846
00:43:14,114 --> 00:43:17,780
sort of keep threading this ball
of thread. 

847
00:43:17,780 --> 00:43:20,114
It's almost like if you, if 
you're sitting in a room and you

848
00:43:20,114 --> 00:43:21,780
start to run out, something more
happens. 

849
00:43:21,780 --> 00:43:24,352
There's never an end. 
There is an end maybe, but there

850
00:43:24,352 --> 00:43:27,780
is a lot of questions that 
people often have in Buddhism. 

851
00:43:27,780 --> 00:43:31,781
And this is an incredible chance
to like ask questions, a lot of 

852
00:43:31,781 --> 00:43:34,780
them good questions, and get a 
much more profound understanding

853
00:43:34,780 --> 00:43:36,614
of Buddhism as well. 
That's one of the beautiful 

854
00:43:36,614 --> 00:43:39,380
things about going on 
pilgrimage, is intensity of the 

855
00:43:39,380 --> 00:43:42,780
Dhamma, which normally very, 
very few people have in their 

856
00:43:42,780 --> 00:43:45,280
daily lives. 
It's a great opportunity to get 

857
00:43:45,280 --> 00:43:48,780
much deeper into the Dhamma and 
understand it. 

858
00:43:48,780 --> 00:43:51,780
Does that answer your question? 
Tony, is that right? 

859
00:43:51,780 --> 00:43:57,780
Yes, okay, yeah, yeah. 
Yes, yes. 

860
00:43:57,780 --> 00:44:06,670
I'd like to mention the in the 
place where I was very 

861
00:44:06,670 --> 00:44:11,280
emotionally affected was in an 
unusual place, which was a 

862
00:44:11,280 --> 00:44:13,780
museum. 
Yeah. 

863
00:44:13,780 --> 00:44:15,780
But it's very acceptable to be 
okay. 

864
00:44:15,780 --> 00:44:17,780
Okay. 
That's a very good point. 

865
00:44:17,780 --> 00:44:20,336
I think that's important, and a 
very important thing to point 

866
00:44:20,336 --> 00:44:24,780
out actually, that in India now,
there is in the Delhi Museum, 

867
00:44:24,780 --> 00:44:28,496
it's probably the only place in 
the world where there are relics

868
00:44:28,496 --> 00:44:33,067
of the Buddha, which almost with
absolute certainty are the real 

869
00:44:33,067 --> 00:44:36,280
relics of the Buddha. 
We often hear about relics of 

870
00:44:36,280 --> 00:44:38,180
the Buddha. 
We can see relics of the Buddha 

871
00:44:38,180 --> 00:44:40,780
on shrines everywhere. 
But very often we have no idea 

872
00:44:40,780 --> 00:44:44,495
where those relics come from, 
whether they are real relics or 

873
00:44:44,495 --> 00:44:46,114
not. 
Some of them may be, some of 

874
00:44:46,114 --> 00:44:48,447
them may not be. 
Basically, we haven't, to be 

875
00:44:48,447 --> 00:44:51,780
honest, we haven't got a clue 
basically where they came from. 

876
00:44:51,780 --> 00:44:55,352
But the relics which are in the 
museum in Delhi and possibly 

877
00:44:55,352 --> 00:44:59,114
also some which are found in the
museum in Patna in India, these 

878
00:44:59,114 --> 00:45:02,380
were discovered very quite 
recently, only about 100 years 

879
00:45:02,380 --> 00:45:04,447
ago. 
And the way the discovery 

880
00:45:04,447 --> 00:45:08,280
happened is such that it seems 
extremely likely that these are 

881
00:45:08,280 --> 00:45:11,780
real bone fragments from the 
Buddha himself. 

882
00:45:11,780 --> 00:45:15,030
And that is remarkable because 
there's a lot of historical 

883
00:45:15,030 --> 00:45:17,530
certainty there. 
And the reason why this is so 

884
00:45:17,530 --> 00:45:20,530
important and so certain, I can 
maybe tell you the story 

885
00:45:20,530 --> 00:45:23,226
briefly, is because after the 
Buddha passed away, the relics 

886
00:45:23,226 --> 00:45:26,780
of the Buddha from the funeral 
pyre were divided into eight. 

887
00:45:26,780 --> 00:45:28,780
This is what it said 
historically. 

888
00:45:28,780 --> 00:45:31,780
Ashoka later on also confirms 
that. 

889
00:45:31,780 --> 00:45:33,780
He actually dug up those 
particular stupas. 

890
00:45:33,780 --> 00:45:37,380
A stupa is like a burial mound 
which also often contains 

891
00:45:37,380 --> 00:45:41,209
bricks. 
It's one of these big Buddhist 

892
00:45:41,209 --> 00:45:44,780
structures which you find all 
over the world, these stupas. 

893
00:45:44,780 --> 00:45:49,003
And after these stupas had been 
divided into eight parts, all 

894
00:45:49,003 --> 00:45:52,210
the main tribes of India at the 
time who were Buddhist got one 

895
00:45:52,210 --> 00:45:55,405
part each. 
And each of these tribes built a

896
00:45:55,405 --> 00:45:57,780
stupa to put those relics 
inside. 

897
00:45:57,780 --> 00:46:01,447
And one particular of those 
stupas, those kingdoms, were the

898
00:46:01,447 --> 00:46:03,530
Sakyans. 
This was a clan of the Buddha 

899
00:46:03,530 --> 00:46:06,180
himself. 
Soon after the Buddha died, that

900
00:46:06,180 --> 00:46:11,210
Sakyan kingdom was sacked by the
Kosalans, and it went back to 

901
00:46:11,210 --> 00:46:13,280
the jungle. 
And it was basically just a 

902
00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:19,030
jungle place for 2,300 years 
until it was discovered by a 

903
00:46:19,030 --> 00:46:23,780
British archaeologist about 110 
years ago, roughly. 

904
00:46:23,780 --> 00:46:25,780
And they were dug out of the 
ground. 

905
00:46:25,780 --> 00:46:29,030
He found this stupa, a small, 
very simple stupa, because 

906
00:46:29,030 --> 00:46:30,780
that's what they were in those 
days. 

907
00:46:30,780 --> 00:46:34,447
He dug it out, dug out this 
little casket or whatever it 

908
00:46:34,447 --> 00:46:37,780
was, and on that casket it says,
the remains of the Buddha. 

909
00:46:37,780 --> 00:46:40,780
I mean, you know, it's 
absolutely remarkable. 

910
00:46:40,780 --> 00:46:43,447
And he dug them out on the 
ground, and then of course after

911
00:46:43,447 --> 00:46:46,780
that, these became very, very 
famous relics because of that. 

912
00:46:46,780 --> 00:46:49,780
And they are now kept in the 
museum in Delhi. 

913
00:46:49,780 --> 00:46:52,448
The king of Thailand, who was a 
very devout Buddhist, made a 

914
00:46:52,448 --> 00:46:56,280
special kind of casement for 
these things because they are 

915
00:46:56,280 --> 00:47:00,280
obviously so precious. 
And there's even now an 

916
00:47:00,280 --> 00:47:01,780
exhibition, I went to an 
exhibition in Singapore as well,

917
00:47:01,780 --> 00:47:06,030
called the Nalanda Trail, which 
basically was an exhibition of 

918
00:47:06,030 --> 00:47:08,180
Buddhist statues. 
And they had also obtained some 

919
00:47:08,180 --> 00:47:12,380
of those bone fragments from the
museum in Delhi to show on 

920
00:47:12,380 --> 00:47:13,780
display there. 
So this is very powerful. 

921
00:47:13,780 --> 00:47:16,780
Here you're actually seeing the 
real remains of the Buddha. 

922
00:47:16,780 --> 00:47:19,030
That's a very good point. 
Yeah, thank you for pointing 

923
00:47:19,030 --> 00:47:19,780
that out, Ainsley.