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From Indias largest newsroom, 
I'm Arun George and this is the 

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Times of India podcast. 
The Supreme Court today upheld 

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the Centers move to scrap 
special status to Jammu and 

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Kashmir under Article 370 of the
Constitution. 

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And all of them said yes, 
abrogating Article 370 was 

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constitutional. 
It did not violate Indian laws. 

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The judgment has argued that 
Article 370 is a temporary and 

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transitory provision of the 
Constitution. 

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A little over four years after 
the decision was approved by 

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Parliament, the Supreme Court 
cleared the abrogation of 

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Article 370, which took away the
special status granted to the 

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state of Jammu and Kashmir. 
In parts of Jammu, Ladakh, Delhi

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and Mumbai and other parts of 
India, there were celebrations 

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by BJP workers and other groups.
But Shakir Meer, who's in 

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Srinagar, says there was a calm 
in Kashmir that was in keeping 

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with people's expectations of 
the verdict. 

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On the December 7th, when it was
announced that Supreme Court 

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will deliver its verdict on 
Article 370, people were already

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kind of apprehending that 
something like this would 

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happen. 
You know, I spoke to people a 

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couple of days ago and they say 
we already know what is going to

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happen and we have resigned to 
the circumstances. 

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There was already a concern that
something like this would 

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happen. 
People were already resigned to 

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this verdict. 
So that's why we see no 

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protests. 
We see no Section 144. 

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We saw nothing like that. 
There was just a small, a 

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smattering of deployment here at
some of the very sensitive parts

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of Srinagar. 
That's it. 

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Even the police was sure that 
nothing like that would happen. 

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And also because prior to the 
verdict, there was a sweeping 

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clampdown in which police 
arrested a lot of people who it 

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suspected would be kind of 
potential troublemakers. 

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They also made sure that no 
trouble or no law, no 

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disturbances there. 
Kashmiri newspapers since 2019 

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are already not publishing 
critical stuff. 

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They're already sort of muted in
that sense. 

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They haven't really commented, 
applauded or even sort of 

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expressed any kind of discontent
or anger about this. 

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They have just reported what has
simply happened without standing

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on judgment of whether it was 
right or wrong. 

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The Supreme Court bench led by 
Chief Justice of India DY 

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Chandra Chud said the abrogation
of Article 370 was just another 

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step in a series of 
constitutional orders aimed at 

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the deeper integration of Jammu 
and Kashmir into the Union of 

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India. 
It noted that the legislation 

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wasn't an exceptional step. 
The bench also refused to get 

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into the events that led to the 
imposition of President's Rule 

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in Jammu and Kashmir, which was 
one of the main points raised by

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the petitioners opposed to the 
abrogation of Article 370. 

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Shakir Mir, who you heard 
earlier, writes on Kashmir for 

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Times of India Plus and has 
written over the years on the 

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situation in Kashmir since 
Article 370 cease to exist. 

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In today's episode, he's in 
conversation with my colleague 

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Jayaraj Singh and me about the 
situation in Kashmir 4 years 

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since the state lost its special
status and where things are at 

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presently. 
Shakur says that in the run up 

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to the constitutional provision 
being nullified, the state's 

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residents were completely in the
dark, at least when it came to 

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communications. 
When the questions were put to 

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the governor at the times, at 
the Palmalik as to what was 

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going to happen, he would say 
no. 

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I can assure you that Article 
370 won't be repealed. 

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So he those assurances are there
on the record How do? 

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You see the present situation of
human. 

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Management. 
It's normal. 

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Only rumor mongering is going 
on. 

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It's a very routine thing here. 
If you sneeze at Lal Chowk, it 

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becomes an explosion when it 
comes here. 

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So unnecessary panic is being 
created by some wasted interest 

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and especially some political 
parties. 

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Otherwise there is nothing new. 
But of course, people were in a 

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sense, not expecting something 
like that would happen. 

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There were different kind of 
rumors going around. 

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Some would say that Kashmir will
be reduced to a Union territory,

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but Article 370 would be 
preserved. 

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Others would say that capital 
would be permanently shifted to 

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Jammu and Senegal would be 
deprived of that Individual 

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Kashmiris were believing 
individual theories about what 

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was going to happen. 
You were unsure what was going 

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to happen and then suddenly we 
see the mobile connectivity 

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going out, landline phones were 
not working, Internet stopped 

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working and you had paramilitary
forces deployed everywhere 

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outside every house in in 
Kashmir. 

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So and the next day you realize 
we watch televisions and and we 

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see what was happening. 
Article 370 was being completely

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revoked and every provision of 
the Indian Constitution was now 

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applicable to the Jammu and 
Kashmir. 

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Anuchek timso sattar ke. 
Sabi Khan Lagunahi Honge Siva 

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Khan ke. 
Since Article 370 was struck 

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down, one argument that has been
made is that there's been 

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normalcy in the Kashmir Valley. 
Shakur admits that there have 

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been visible changes in the 
Union territory since 2019, but 

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says it has come at a cost. 
Definitely. 

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I would definitely call it 
normal. 

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It's relatively good. 
We have increasing tourism. 

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We have more and more private 
players coming up and setting up

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hotels. 
Acres of land have been given to

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the industrial estates so that 
new industries could be set up, 

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although they haven't yet 
materialized. 

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But the land acquisition has 
happened. 

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The Smart Steep project has 
given a sort of a new lease of 

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life to the state, especially 
the main state areas that were 

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previously the hotbeds of pro 
freedom separatist sentiments 

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like Mysuma. 
You wouldn't really recognize 

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that Mysuma is the same mysuma 
where JKLF would take 

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processions. 
It's absolutely different place 

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today, but my point is that this
normalcy is also happening at 

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the cost of not giving political
freedoms to the people. 

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There have been questions raised
about the freedom of speech and 

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media freedom in Kashmir since 
2019. 

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Take for instance the case of 
Kashmiri journalist Fahad Shah, 

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who was arrested in February 
2022. 

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Shah was arrested and booked 
under the stringent Unlawful 

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Activities Prevention Act, or 
UAPA and Public Safety Act or 

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PSA, allegedly for an article he
wrote well before 2019. 

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He was granted bail by the Jammu
and Kashmir High Court in 

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November with a court 
criticizing the order for his 

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arrest. 
Shakey says that this has been a

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pattern since 2019, and like he 
said earlier, there is little 

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commentary about the decision to
nullify the region's special 

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status or the Supreme Court's 
endorsement. 

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Post 2019, we have seen the 
sustained clampdown. 

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The manner in which the 
government is preventing this 

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sentiment from emerging is only 
through tough laws like UAP and 

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PSA. 
These are being used to stifle 

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any argument about Article 370. 
Like Shakir said earlier, there 

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is greater normalcy in parts of 
Kashmir, which is perhaps 

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exemplified by tourism in the 
state. 

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Lieutenant Governor Manoj Sinha 
had said earlier this year that 

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there was a 350% rise in tourist
footfall compared to 2022. 

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In 2022, the number of tourists 
visiting the state was said to 

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be 1.22 crore, which itself was 
a new record. 

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Shakir says that while Kashmir 
is featuring in a lot more 

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pictures and reels, the spike in
tourism doesn't mean a booming 

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regional economy. 
There are deals on Instagram, on

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Twitter that Kashmir is 
recovering. 

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Its normal army conditions are 
calling celebrities, inviting 

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them and touring them around 
Kashmir to portray a sense of 

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normalcy. 
When it comes to optics, it's 

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going really well. 
There's an impression that 

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everything is going really well.
But overall, tourism contributes

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to only 6% of Kashmir's GDP, J&K
GDP. 

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Even if tourism is exceedingly 
doing well, it won't still 

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change the economy radically. 
Shakir says what drives the 

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economy of the Union territory 
is agriculture and some very 

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specific crops, but those have 
been hit by a variety of 

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factors. 
What contributes to the economy 

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of Kashmir is is agriculture, 
particularly the horticulture 

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sector, the apple, the beer 
walnut almonds. 

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Kashmir is lurching from crisis 
to crisis in this case because 

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firstly, there's a climate 
change, early rainfall, early 

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snowfall is devastating the 
crops, which has happened since 

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2014 consistently. 
Secondly, we have seen that the 

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Union government has taken 2 
specific measures. 

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This year. 
They waived the surcharges over 

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apple imports from Iran and US. 
So that makes those apples which

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are higher quality of course 
relatively cheaper when they 

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come to the Indian markets which
makes Kashmiri apple very 

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expensive and that discourages 
the buyer from purchasing the 

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Kashmiri apple. 
We are not in a position to say 

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what will happen, but over the 
last 2-3 years, we have seen 

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Kashmiri economy has received 
one blow after another. 

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First it was shut down due to 
abrogation of Article 370, then 

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it was the COVID. 
After that it was the early 

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snowfall and now it is Indian 
government waiving surcharges 

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over the imported apples. 
And this is this is not good 

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news for the Kashmiri economy 
overall. 

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Since the abrogation of Article 
370, the government has also 

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pointed out that the number of 
terror attacks in Kashmir have 

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fallen and that is borne out by 
the numbers as well. 

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But Shakir, who has been 
documenting the changing face of

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militancy in the region, says 
the way militancy operates in 

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Kashmir is quite different even 
from last decade. 

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Now, militants are no longer 
announcing that they will join 

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this organization. 
What happens is that teenagers 

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from 14 to 18, they're recruited
through shadowy social Media 

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Group groups on WhatsApp, 
Telegram. 

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They identify these young boys 
and they recruit them, and then 

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they give them activities. 
First, they are assessed based 

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on on the extent that they are 
willing to participate, followed

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by the handler giving them the 
pistols and then then telling 

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them to assassinate a particular
person. 

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It could be a policeman, It 
could be a person from the 

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minority community, a pundit or 
a Sikh. 

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That person assassinates his 
victim and then drops the weapon

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where he had picked it from. 
And when the police investigates

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it, it finds that neither that 
person has any record of adverse

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activities. 
That person does not even know 

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who he was talking to. 
He has a mobile device. 

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But the person is somebody based
in Pakistan, he's not in 

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Kashmir. 
They can't arrest him, so this 

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is a shadowy militancy. 
Shaker says the worry for 

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security forces is that the 
shadowy nature of militancy 

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makes it harder to track, which 
in turn also makes it difficult 

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for them to assess how much it 
has spread. 

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The young boys were supposed to 
be over ground workers, which is

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the motivators and sympathizers 
of of militants are now directly

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taking part in the militant 
operations. 

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So this is something that had 
changed over the years and this 

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shadowy militancy board is more 
dangerous because we're not able

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to by certain what number of 
people are involved. 

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You don't know what the 
recruitment is, how many people 

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potentially could join such a 
program. 

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It could be vast number. 
While I was working on a story 

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for Times of India Plus on 
hybrid militants, one cop in the

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downtown area told me when they 
killed a very dreaded militant 

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named Abbas Sheikh who was 
responsible for a lot of 

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attacks. 
They found in his device that he

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he was connected to at least 25 
to 40 over ground workers in a 

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small two square kilometer area 
in in state of. 

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So that gives you an idea of how
secretive as well as very 

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complex and dangerous the 
situation could be. 

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We can't really say it with 
certainty, but we get these 

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these hints, these impressions 
that something is going on at 

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the ground and it's very 
disturbing article. 370, which 

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granted special status to 
Kashmir, has always been 

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portrayed outside Kashmir as an 
unnecessary agreement between 

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the Indian state and the region.
1 which had long outlived its 

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utility. 
But within Kashmir, Shakir says 

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the provision in the 
constitution was viewed as an 

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endorsement of Kashmir's 
politics for self governance 

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that has existed since before 
independence. 

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He says Kashmir's politics 
before 2019 always centered 

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around whether it was affecting 
Kashmir's special status. 

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It has been the political 
minister for the last 7 decades.

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Every big or small developments 
that has happened in Kashmir 

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throughout all these decades is 
linked to the political process 

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of emboldening Article 370 or 
diluting it. 

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00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:10,840
Every big political process 
whether it's deposition of 

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Sheikh Abdullah, installation of
Bakshibullah Muhammad, another 

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00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:18,240
chief Minister, his removal from
power and then installation of 

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00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:21,680
Khajiasham, Sudan as a Chief 
Minister, every Chief Minister 

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00:12:21,680 --> 00:12:25,240
being evolved and removed has 
actually been about Article 370,

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00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:29,520
either diluting it or expanding 
its scope or completely revoking

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00:12:29,520 --> 00:12:31,280
it. 
So you can understand what it 

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00:12:31,280 --> 00:12:34,000
means for Kashmiris. 
Even votes are being sought to 

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00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:36,120
make sure that Kashmiris has 
maximum autonomy. 

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00:12:36,920 --> 00:12:39,560
Top leaders of the state, like 
former chief ministers Omar 

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00:12:39,560 --> 00:12:42,800
Abdullah and Mehbooba Mufti, 
were kept in detention for weeks

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00:12:42,800 --> 00:12:44,960
after the abrogation of Article 
370. 

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They have since formed the Gupta
alliance but have had no state 

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00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:50,760
polls to contest. 
Shakir Meer says the biggest 

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00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:53,160
political leaders of the state 
have expressed their 

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00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:55,400
disappointment with the Supreme 
Court's verdict. 

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00:12:56,360 --> 00:12:58,600
The majority of political 
parties have actually expressed 

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00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:00,720
their disapproval of the 
judgement. 

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00:13:00,920 --> 00:13:03,840
Some have done it very 
implicitly. 

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00:13:04,040 --> 00:13:07,400
Some are very overt and explicit
in articulating their 

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00:13:07,400 --> 00:13:09,120
disapprovals, Omar Abdullah 
said. 

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00:13:09,120 --> 00:13:12,320
A very significant thing. 
He said it took decades to BJP 

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00:13:12,320 --> 00:13:15,920
to arrive at the stage where it 
could actually abrogate Article 

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00:13:15,920 --> 00:13:17,600
317. 
Even if Supreme Court 

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00:13:17,600 --> 00:13:21,640
disappointed us, they would 
still mobilize and keep working 

255
00:13:21,640 --> 00:13:25,880
and arrive at a time which is 
conducive enough when Article 

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00:13:25,880 --> 00:13:46,520
370 could be restored again. 
She posted a pre recorded 

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00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:50,040
message of herself saying that 
this is assassination of the 

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00:13:50,040 --> 00:13:53,760
country's soul. 
While the Gupta alliance has had

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00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:57,200
little to do since 2019, the 
Supreme Court has set a deadline

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00:13:57,200 --> 00:14:00,040
to conduct elections in the 
state by the end of September 

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00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:03,800
2024. 
Shakir says that since 2019, 

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00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:07,320
multiple new political parties 
and leaders have emerged in the 

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00:14:07,320 --> 00:14:10,120
state. 
New political formations are 

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00:14:10,120 --> 00:14:12,520
coming up, but these are the 
political formations who have 

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00:14:12,520 --> 00:14:14,800
set of sort of predetermined 
agenda. 

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00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:16,160
We would know what they they 
will say. 

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00:14:16,160 --> 00:14:18,720
They won't come up with 
something that is really 

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00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:21,840
unexpected. 
This is something that that is 

269
00:14:21,840 --> 00:14:25,120
very conducive to what union 
government expects of people, 

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00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:28,280
political parties here. 1 
Abdullah has pledged to boycott 

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00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:30,760
elections because he wouldn't 
want to be a chief minister of a

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00:14:31,040 --> 00:14:33,560
union territory. 
You know, we have seen new faces

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00:14:33,560 --> 00:14:36,320
coming up like Mehboob, his 
daughter Umar Abdullah. 

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00:14:36,440 --> 00:14:39,120
He introduced his two sons to 
the politics recently and 

275
00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:41,240
yesterday one of his sons 
actually tweeted about the 

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00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:43,560
article 370. 
So these are the new small 

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00:14:43,560 --> 00:14:45,960
developments that are taking 
place as far as the politics is 

278
00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:48,480
concerned. 
But given there's been 

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00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:50,760
widespread disappointment about 
the manner in which the 

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00:14:50,760 --> 00:14:54,400
abrogation of Article 370 was 
carried out in Kashmir, Shakur 

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00:14:54,400 --> 00:14:58,120
says it only makes the political
decisions of people and their 

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00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:02,160
leaders harder to predict. 
The simmering discontent was 

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00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:04,480
already there. 
People were already apprehending

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00:15:04,480 --> 00:15:07,880
that this will happen, but 
somewhere they felt that maybe 

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00:15:08,560 --> 00:15:10,240
it still has a final round to 
pass. 

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00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:14,000
It still has this last hurdle to
cross and let's see what will 

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00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:16,160
happen. 
But Supreme Court put a stamp of

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00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:19,720
approval and now what I see is 
that the simmering discontent 

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00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:23,280
with acquire a new centrality, 
slowly stream rolling these 

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00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:25,960
decisions over Kashmir without 
taking somebody on board, 

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00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:29,840
without having a conversation 
with the local politicians in 

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00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:32,440
the longer and only generate 
more and more political 

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00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:40,840
resentment. 
Today's episode was produced by 

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00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:44,800
Jayaraj Singh and Anuja Singh. 
For a daily spotlight on people,

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00:15:44,800 --> 00:15:47,600
ideas and stories that matter, 
subscribe to us. 

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00:15:47,920 --> 00:15:52,960
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00:15:52,960 --> 00:15:57,120
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