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From India's largest Newsroom. 
I'm are enjoyed, and this is the

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times of India podcast. 
Maddie of Eid Brush movie 

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decade. 
The film are the poorest which 

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is based on the ramen has been 
facing brickbat since its 

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release on the 16th of June one 
aspect of the film that's been 

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targeted. 
Incessantly, is the dialogue 

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writing. 
Then dialogue from the character

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Hanuman and many others have 
been changed to try and end the 

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outrage. 
However the criticism has 

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continued with even the 
allahabad high court weighing in

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actor, Arun, Google who 
portrayed Lord Ram in the ramen 

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and Swagger TV show in the 
1980s. 

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Hadn't seen the film when he was
interviewed but was a little 

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less scathing in his opinion. 
A Chinese lunar management. 

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A shield who's the dialogue 
writer of the film attempted to 

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explain the use of mooc 
colloquial. 

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Turns of phrase 
might have an explanation for 

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why the dialogues was so badly 
received. 

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He says an epic like the 
ramayana is expected to evoke 

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certain emotions and if the 
portrayal fails to achieve that,

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it's not going to be spread by 
an audience. 

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In today's episode they've got 
is in conversation with Gerard 

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sing and me about what went 
wrong with the latest retelling 

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of the Timeless. 
Remind we talk about why Indian 

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epics don't make for very good 
superhero films and the problem 

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with trying to retell our epics 
to fit certain templates. 

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These are they seeing a lot of 
criticism for new films that 

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have been coming out about our 
myths, and our gods and recent 

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film recently, really caught it 
over the way how God speak in 

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it. 
What is it about? 

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God speaking in a familiar way 
almost like you and I talk in 

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regular conversations that turns
us off so much about it. 

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You see it's about the notion of
Epic story telling you know 

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around the world. 
Every culture has Epic story 

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telling and look what is an 
epic. 

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It is a story about 
larger-than-life characters. 

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None of them are ordinary. 
They're not you and me even if 

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there is a minor character in 
the film, he's Larger than Life 

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and especially in India when you
talk about ramayana and 

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Mahabharata because of the 
popular ones, but they're Fork 

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narratives. 
For example, if you were to 

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present a Legend of Zelda boddah
shivaji Maharaj in Maharashtra, 

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or if you're going to tell the 
story of Krishna Deva Raya Any 

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of these characters, you know 
you want this larger-than-life 

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image. 
And that's what happens when 

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they walk into the room, the way
they speak the diction and there

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is this thing about in India but
language real value language a 

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lot God speak Sanskrit. 
It's a very big thing that the 

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language of the Gods is sanskrit
and it's Aria Basha the language

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of the noble people. 
And therefore even when you 

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know, you have television 
serials in the About it. 

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They use words like Peta shitty 
and Martha. 

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SRI, are you create new words 
which sort of elevate the 

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conversation to a different 
plane? 

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And I think that is what you 
expect from epic characters. 

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Even if I'm doing a film say, on
Jesus Christ or some, you know, 

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this is this film called, Jesus 
Christ Superstar, somebody 

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didn't people founded 
disrespectful, but the aim was 

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to be disrespectful. 
They were not trying to be a 

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respectful story, but if you are
making a Film. 

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Like if you're seeing Passion of
the crash was Aramaic is used in

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the just by using Aramaic or 
Hebrew. 

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You make the sound so different 
that it look Grand, everything 

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sounds Grant. 
And I think that is what you 

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expect. 
There is something called High 

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language that is expected in 
epic characters. 

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Epic stories even with the Jesus
Christ Superstar or even a more 

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sort of popular retelling of 
Apex. 

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The reason you use the Mucca, 
local language is also to sort 

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of get the message to Connect 
with an audience that may not be

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familiar with it, right? 
Cheese's, I am Overjoyed to meet

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you face to face. 
You've been getting quite a name

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all around the place, it just 
connects better with audiences. 

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That may not know. 
The sun's criticized words that 

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they are expected to in some 
ways and therefore you spread 

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the message while sticking to 
their language. 

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So it's not just language, is 
also content, how will you speak

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in any A language, the something
called a graceful language. 

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There is a civilized language is
the refined language. 

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There is a barbaric language. 
There is a pedestrian language 

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if epic character starts talking
pedestrian language, this top 

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being epic, you strip them of 
their epic Aura. 

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It's also the words that you use
the words when you are referring

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to your parents. 
So it's the way we talk. 

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Like, when I'm talking to my 
father and mother, I'll talk 

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very differently when I talked 
to my friend, I'll talk very 

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different. 
When I'm on stage, the 

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conversations are so different. 
Nobody talks the way 

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Shakespeare. 
But we need that dialogue 

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because it's a performance. 
And in the, we are not 

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pretending the documentary, we 
know very well. 

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You know, when you see a lot of 
the Rings, when you see the 

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grand epic, you know, the even 
when you seeing some of the 

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shows on TV, the way the 
dialogues are told it's all 

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done, you know, theatrical 
dramatic, and you want to evoke 

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those emotions. 
It's not just the dialogue will 

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see, that's writes the RAM and 
he knows that he's not writing 

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in Sanskrit. 
He was criticized for it. 

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How dare you write it in his 
body? 

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But he language the local 
language but he did not 

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compromise on the quality of the
meter. 

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The quality of the words, the 
his poetry is considered to be a

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it - poetry is considered to be 
sophisticated when you talk 

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about combines drama and again 
it's considered very good 

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thermal the way it is presented 
with a bar Our armor is very 

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focused, every Caesar salad has 
Mahabharat. 

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Is also very folk but there's a 
reverence when he talks about 

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the Divine. 
There is a kind of a, although 

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it's folksy to connect to the 
people. 

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But whenever the Divine comes, 
there's a kind of a description 

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of grandeur that accompanies, 
what is called at the boutrous 

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the other motorist is about a 
feeling of, oh and you should 

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feel this awesomeness when you 
feel these characters and I 

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think these are things that play
a very important role, 

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especially when Italy epic Tale.
Where's now seeing in, in this 

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so-called New India, this 
attempt to redo the epics to, to

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take fresh inspiration from our 
epics. 

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We've seen this in this new 
film, and we've also seen it in 

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films like rrr where we're 
seeing ramayana being adopted. 

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Where do you feel is this fine 
line between what is acceptable 

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and then not unacceptable? 
I think ultimately is the 

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audience that he decides. 
What is acceptable? 

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Bill because we should be 
careful sensor. 

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Boards are deciding what is 
acceptable? 

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There are spiritual leaders and 
Muhammad's were deciding. 

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What is acceptable. 
Please understand our sense of 

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what is perfectly fine. 
If a man slaps a woman, they 

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think it's perfectly fine, but 
make it very disturbed if a 

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woman is pleasuring herself. 
So that tells you a lot about 

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these kind of a various. 
What is acceptable? 

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But is not acceptable if you are
doing a Rumba and and urvashi 

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who is a up, Sarah a damsel who 
is meant to seduce you an inch 

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onto their all. 
All Epic magical characters. 

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What kind of conversation would 
be speak? 

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Would they be like talk like a 
bar dancer? 

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Will that be acceptable? 
Because just because they are 

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courtesans and Celestial 
courtesans, ultimately the 

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audience decides whether they 
feel it's elevating them. 

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There is kalu Kurama and you can
do Mahabharat Gourmet those kind

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of things people have played 
with these re-imagining, but 

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what is happening with the 
current generation of Filmmakers

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and storytellers. 
It's too eager to be famous and 

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they are, there is no homework 
done, they actually do not know 

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the epochs. 
They are. 

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They are telling Rama and story 
in a it's almost like a Revenge 

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drama because that's what gets 
you the ratings right. 

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And I know because I've worked 
with film people, I mean I know 

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in corporate setups. 
People think krishna's Vita is 

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basically a motivational speech 
to make more money, you know, go

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and kill your enemy and whatever
it's like a brave heart. 

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Stelling you go and kill your 
enemy and I'm like, that's not 

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what the Gita is about. 
Or if ROM is fighting revered, 

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it's not that you really, you 
know, you have stick in my wife 

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of a and I want back. 
The conversations are larger 

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than just the simple Act of 
attacking lunker to recover 

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Sita. 
It's not a Hindi film Revenge 

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drama. 
Remember these are called 

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traditionally punch invade the 
fifth graders. 

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They trying to communicate 
Vedic, ideas through RAM and 

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Mahabharata. 
What are these? 

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Medical Ideas. 
Can we make a list of those? 

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I don't see these filmmakers 
even interested in those ideas. 

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The the they use the right words
but they don't understand these 

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words notches the talks about 
it. 

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Does it come from the soul? 
Do you know what you're saying? 

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Or are you just performing the 
quality of dialogues catches all

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those things? 
What is a Shakespearean actor? 

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Bring to the table. 
The intonation is the kind of a 

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in depth. 
I mean, otherwise you wouldn't 

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have this to such subjects like 
Dramatics and not a shastra. 

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How do you become RAM on stage? 
How do you become Krishna on 

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stage? 
I remember somebody was telling 

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me re Jetta you or Robert car, 
chase scene, brother, Chao 

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satire, nobody talk that 
language. 

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Then you are like okay 
interesting, this is you know 

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because I said what are you 
trying to evoke through that and

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he doesn't get it when I'm 
asking this question because 

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when valmiki in is trying to 
evoke something, they want you 

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to feel what it means to be 
abducted, a Jedi uses. 

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Does not interested. 
He is knowing that she does not 

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know relation of his, but the 
fact that he is spreading his 

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wings and tried to block reward,
why would you do that the 

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ability to help someone whom you
don't know? 

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And that has to be elevated know
these ideas. 

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If you tell this, I can see the 
Bollywood guy, looking at you, 

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the very strange and peculiar 
way, because it's like okay, how

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will this get any more seats in 
the auditorium because he's 

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focused on box office, right? 
He's not focused on. 

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Elevating the soul and the 
spirit. 

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Spirit when to see the cinema, 
adulteress is ready grandma and 

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he's not talking about box 
office. 

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He's not talking about Roi, he's
talking about how do I Elevate 

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the soul of my audience then 
valmiki's writing it, you know, 

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it says sjokz the shloka Claire,
that's the original line. 

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How Rama and was came to be 
written from sorrow. 

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Came poetry for pain came 
poetry. 

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He is not saying when I say this
500 people become and I'll get a

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super hit show and I'll get an 
Oscar, the intention of the 

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remind us to communicate the 
fifth graders. 

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Right? 
He betrays not interested in the

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fifth graders. 
They interested in Hindu 

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rashtra. 
It's a political agenda. 

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It has nothing to do with the 
elevation of the Soul. 

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It's nothing to do with jeeve, 
Atma paramatma, the elevation of

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humanity being kind generous 
Noble, aristocratic August. 

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These are not the agendas either
of the politician or their 

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sponsored filmmakers or dialogue
writers, or directors. 

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What does Hanuman represent has 
a robber shift? 

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Bhakta something like that. 
I said, what does it mean? 

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And for them shift Buck is 
wearing a, she and sitting in 

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front and doing some poses, and 
I'm like, that's performance. 

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What does it mean? 
What are you trying to 

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communicate? 
Why is valmiki making his 

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villain a shiv birth? 
Why is she insisting that? 

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My villain shall be a Brahmin. 
Those are questions to be asked,

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why is a golden deer important 
for valmiki? 

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Why does he not use a Golden 
Goose? 

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What is special about the And 
the, that is a lot of thought 

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gone into it now. 
It's not random, but if you tell

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this, then this audio 
intellectualizing it, but it is 

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intellectual. 
It is philosophical. 

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It is spiritual. 
That's why the knot and key and 

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Natasha's. 
They're always separated one 

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appeals to the audience and one 
appeals to the soul. 

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What do you want to appeal to? 
Is the question you seeing a 

226
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very Marvel ization of of, of 
ram right now, you know, with 

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with CGI withdraw. 
Even looking like a, you know, 

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modern day, you know, kg in a 
sense and this is seems to be 

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like an extension of the ROM 
that we suddenly started seeing 

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in the late 80s, early 90s in 
India, when he suddenly started 

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sporting a threshold, a sword 
and axe. 

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He was looking angry and yet 
Tone, but I wanted to ask you is

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00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:43,900
has, you know, has this 
reinterpretation of ramp in 

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00:13:43,900 --> 00:13:48,500
constant Through the Ages. 
No, this is a new phenomenon. 

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You see the irony of the Hindu 
through movement, is this a? 

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We want to decolonize India but 
it's a project of colonization. 

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The Western mind says, the world
is made of you use the word 

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evil, right? 
Can translate the word evil in 

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00:14:02,600 --> 00:14:05,500
any Indian language. 
You cannot translate it. 

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00:14:05,900 --> 00:14:12,500
This whole idea of vampires, 
zombies bats being evil, these 

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00:14:12,500 --> 00:14:14,500
are not Indian ideas is a 
western ideas. 

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00:14:14,700 --> 00:14:18,800
The fact that you make push Fuck
women as a bat because the West 

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00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:22,700
says bat is equal to zombies 
equal to evil and black color is

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evil. 
You are using Western troops. 

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00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:31,100
You have created this binary 
word of God and the devil, or 

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00:14:31,100 --> 00:14:35,400
good and bad angels and demons. 
And that's a very Western troop.

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00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:38,700
Which you are now putting into 
Rama and Rama and Rama has never

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00:14:38,700 --> 00:14:41,200
considered evil. 
He's considered to be an 

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egomaniac but egomaniac is not 
evil ego. 

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00:14:44,300 --> 00:14:47,800
Maniac is an egomaniac. 
The Of evil doesn't exist in 

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Hinduism, it doesn't exist in 
Buddhism. 

252
00:14:50,500 --> 00:14:53,600
How do you explain this to the 
filmmakers of Bollywood and they

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00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:55,900
do it. 
So it's complex idea for that 

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00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:57,700
Ramadan. 
Soccer is very clear. 

255
00:14:57,700 --> 00:15:01,400
He said I will not mess with 
tool sees ramcharitmanas. 

256
00:15:01,700 --> 00:15:04,600
He had seen the Ram Leela. 
He noodles here, I'm Seth Meyers

257
00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:08,400
and if you look carefully at 
Rommel Sagar, he is his presence

258
00:15:08,400 --> 00:15:10,200
in. 
The story is minimal in the 

259
00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:13,400
sense of he selected, the actors
and all that, but he's very 

260
00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:15,900
sensitive to the Ram Leela 
traditions of North India. 

261
00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:18,600
He is very familiar with 
ramcharitmanas and he doesn't 

262
00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:21,400
really mess with that. 
And he's familiar with the 

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00:15:21,700 --> 00:15:25,100
vocabulary on stage. 
That's why it evokes that, you 

264
00:15:25,108 --> 00:15:29,100
know, mongolab Havana and all 
these lines immediately. 

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00:15:29,100 --> 00:15:31,200
What is mangala, bhavana? 
What does it mean? 

266
00:15:31,700 --> 00:15:33,600
I mean I asked people, what does
it mean? 

267
00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:35,900
Please ask tell me, what does it
mean that they don't know what 

268
00:15:35,900 --> 00:15:39,700
they mean is and italic to her? 
It's suspicious imagination, 

269
00:15:39,900 --> 00:15:43,600
auspicious, creation of space 
and now creating an auspicious 

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00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:45,900
Space by narrating. 
The remind these are very 

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00:15:45,900 --> 00:15:47,200
complex. 
Say ideas. 

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00:15:47,400 --> 00:15:50,100
I think the great respect I have
for rubber on sagas because he 

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00:15:50,108 --> 00:15:52,800
said this is traditional I will 
not play with it. 

274
00:15:53,100 --> 00:15:56,100
These guys don't understand 
tradition and they are now 

275
00:15:56,100 --> 00:15:59,700
taking Marvel this. 
So enamored by the white skin 

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00:15:59,900 --> 00:16:04,300
and Hollywood that they have so 
much less respect for India. 

277
00:16:04,400 --> 00:16:07,200
They think that if I become like
the white man, I will get 

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00:16:07,200 --> 00:16:09,600
respect and that's where it 
comes from. 

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00:16:09,600 --> 00:16:11,600
The fact that you have put a bat
in pushpaka. 

280
00:16:11,600 --> 00:16:15,700
Vimana when in most art forms, 
it's a swan or some bird or, you

281
00:16:15,700 --> 00:16:17,900
know, you have You can look at 
the giant art which shows the 

282
00:16:17,900 --> 00:16:21,000
man has all the time and these 
are swans and parrots and 

283
00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:25,600
peacocks and Indian Birds. 
It's never a bad golden Lanka 

284
00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:29,900
becomes black charcoal black. 
It shows the Western idea that 

285
00:16:29,900 --> 00:16:34,600
God the force of Bordeaux, it's 
a lot of the Rings which is 

286
00:16:34,600 --> 00:16:36,200
tolki and which is based on 
Viking. 

287
00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:38,500
Mythology Channel, click 
mythology. 

288
00:16:38,700 --> 00:16:43,200
You're showing one of has it 
looks like a picnic spot it like

289
00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:46,800
a romantic. 
So one of us is Terror of the 

290
00:16:46,808 --> 00:16:50,000
forest but nobody loves you. 
Nobody cares for you that is 

291
00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:54,400
what revolving is try to evoke. 
Zombie Evil. 

292
00:16:54,400 --> 00:16:57,700
So it's not that I mind anymore.
It's a some magical thing and 

293
00:16:58,200 --> 00:16:59,600
hindutva project is Hindu 
rashtra. 

294
00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:01,600
It's very strongly based on 
islamophobia. 

295
00:17:01,600 --> 00:17:04,300
We know that they have no bones 
about it. 

296
00:17:04,700 --> 00:17:08,000
So you have to show your villain
eating meat because somehow meat

297
00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:11,000
eating is evil. 
And therefore, Robert has to eat

298
00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:13,500
meat and people get upset that 
how can a Brahmin eat meat. 

299
00:17:13,500 --> 00:17:15,200
I saw one of them beams going 
around that. 

300
00:17:15,200 --> 00:17:17,300
How can the Brandon eat meat 
with Brandon's eat? 

301
00:17:17,300 --> 00:17:20,800
Meat all the time around India, 
in many parts of India, 

302
00:17:20,800 --> 00:17:23,900
Northern, you know, fishes, 
Zoomed by the coastal 

303
00:17:23,900 --> 00:17:26,500
brandman's, especially fish is 
consumed. 

304
00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:29,200
You have these things but you 
can't talk about these things. 

305
00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:31,800
Right? 
Nowadays, this imaginary 

306
00:17:31,900 --> 00:17:35,800
vegetarian brahmanism, Hinduism 
is being proposed. 

307
00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:38,700
It's a valid political agenda 
and you want to use it as a 

308
00:17:38,700 --> 00:17:41,600
political strategy, and a 
propaganda film, make it and 

309
00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:45,700
therefore the appropriating 
ramen Ramen, everybody, and the 

310
00:17:45,700 --> 00:17:48,400
trying to create some mishmash 
of the world view, but it's not 

311
00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:50,800
reminded ago, it's not 
valmiki's, ramayana and it's not

312
00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:52,500
too serious, as an armored car 
company. 

313
00:17:52,700 --> 00:17:56,000
It's not cooked about ceramic, 
all of whom were very clear that

314
00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:59,000
telling the story of The Vedas, 
the telling the story of Vishnu,

315
00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:01,100
they're telling the story of an 
avatar on Earth. 

316
00:18:01,100 --> 00:18:04,400
It's about, put the har, it's 
about the soul, it's about ego. 

317
00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:08,500
It's about Pride arrogance, 
those, none of those things 

318
00:18:08,500 --> 00:18:12,600
matter in these modern 
retellings, I don't think 

319
00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:14,400
they're interested in their 
mind, at all. 

320
00:18:15,100 --> 00:18:19,200
Sita's, dialogues are silly. 
And, you know, Hanuman is like 

321
00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:21,800
this. 
There is this kind of a series 

322
00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:23,000
of phrenic. 
Behavior. 

323
00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:26,500
They talk funny, Lee and we'll 
see, but he's very educated 

324
00:18:26,500 --> 00:18:28,400
educated people talk in a 
particular way. 

325
00:18:28,400 --> 00:18:30,900
That's what it means. 
When you say, you are educated. 

326
00:18:31,300 --> 00:18:35,500
So there has to be a correlation
between description Behavior 

327
00:18:36,100 --> 00:18:39,100
projection. 
But I somehow feel this has 

328
00:18:39,100 --> 00:18:40,900
become complex ideas because 
he's too eager. 

329
00:18:40,900 --> 00:18:44,000
As I said to be successful, 
unfortunately, Robin doesn't 

330
00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:47,000
allow for islamophobia, that's 
not part of the story at all. 

331
00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:49,200
I remember somebody saying that 
I want to come Eternal, people 

332
00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:51,800
will start hating him and I'm 
like, but that's sort of a long 

333
00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:54,700
week is trying to do it. 
At all, he's just showing a man 

334
00:18:54,700 --> 00:18:57,500
whose self-obsessed is 
narcissistic that he's 

335
00:18:57,500 --> 00:19:00,600
destroying his own family in his
Pursuit. 

336
00:19:00,700 --> 00:19:04,700
It's almost Shakespearean ideas.
You know, these very complex 

337
00:19:04,700 --> 00:19:06,900
emotions and it's not 
Shakespeare, Shakespeare doesn't

338
00:19:06,900 --> 00:19:08,900
deal with divinity doesn't even 
God. 

339
00:19:08,900 --> 00:19:10,800
So it's not even. 
She experienced another level 

340
00:19:10,900 --> 00:19:13,400
above that because the idea of 
God doesn't exist in 

341
00:19:13,400 --> 00:19:16,100
Shakespeare, what is Divinity, 
what is Avatar? 

342
00:19:16,100 --> 00:19:19,100
What is Vishnu? 
What does it mean to be Sita? 

343
00:19:19,100 --> 00:19:25,400
What does it mean to be Hanuman?
It's are not easy ideas. 

344
00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:29,200
You've been writing on mythology
for years now they've that but 

345
00:19:29,200 --> 00:19:33,000
there seems to be this sudden 
new interest in remind the epics

346
00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:36,800
it is as if they need to be now.
Freshly explained. 

347
00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:40,800
But do you who do you think 
these creatives are sort of 

348
00:19:40,800 --> 00:19:44,400
pandering to is it to this new 
interest in the epics? 

349
00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:48,100
Or this is pandering to the 
general political framework that

350
00:19:48,100 --> 00:19:51,300
India is in today. 
There are two things At one 

351
00:19:51,300 --> 00:19:55,500
level globally around the world 
and it started roughly with the 

352
00:19:55,500 --> 00:19:58,600
writings of JK Rowling's and the
rise of Harry Potter. 

353
00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:01,200
There was a general interest in 
the fantasy genre. 

354
00:20:01,500 --> 00:20:04,800
Indians obviously came up saying
that if we have our own epics, 

355
00:20:04,800 --> 00:20:08,600
and let's tell it. 
But those are heroic narratives 

356
00:20:08,600 --> 00:20:11,900
told with a particular different
style of the storytelling Indian

357
00:20:11,900 --> 00:20:15,600
storytelling is not heroic. 
Now, in this situation, the 

358
00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:20,800
politicians come in with a very 
clear agenda of creating a Hindu

359
00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:24,700
Extra and they want any means. 
So this confusion at one level 

360
00:20:24,700 --> 00:20:27,300
that they want to cook. 
They have an agenda and a vision

361
00:20:27,300 --> 00:20:28,300
statement. 
See? 

362
00:20:28,300 --> 00:20:32,000
They have to now, take the ROM 
ahead and reframe the Rama, and 

363
00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:36,300
in such a way, that Sita becomes
Maharaj, Ki beti, and therefore,

364
00:20:36,300 --> 00:20:39,300
now becomes a patriotic 
narrative, where Ram is going to

365
00:20:39,300 --> 00:20:43,200
fight for India and ravan 
becomes e, The Foreigner, the 

366
00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:45,300
other, The Outsider. 
So that's one agenda. 

367
00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:48,200
The second is, the world is full
of Marvel Comics. 

368
00:20:48,200 --> 00:20:52,600
So now after also add another 
layer of Marvel, Marvel ization 

369
00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:55,000
disneyfication of the 
storytelling, right? 

370
00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:59,300
Wrong black white narrative. 
At one level, there is the 

371
00:20:59,300 --> 00:21:05,000
political ideological agenda. 
Then there is this commercial 

372
00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:09,200
disneyfication, which the market
wants the children, want to your

373
00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:12,400
the Marvel part. 
So that's the audience desire. 

374
00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:15,600
There is a politician's desired.
Poor, valmiki is sitting down 

375
00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:18,500
there wondering but neither of 
these is my agenda. 

376
00:21:19,500 --> 00:21:23,100
Right, value, which is not 
doesn't care about Marvel and 

377
00:21:23,100 --> 00:21:25,600
Disney. 
These epics were not decided, 

378
00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:26,700
what? 
They don't care for it. 

379
00:21:27,000 --> 00:21:29,700
It was not a hero myth because I
know that Western Scholars have 

380
00:21:29,700 --> 00:21:32,000
tried to make Ramada, hero myth.
It is not a little bit. 

381
00:21:33,700 --> 00:21:36,200
A hero myth is where our hero 
goes through transformation. 

382
00:21:36,500 --> 00:21:40,800
He goes from crisis to catharsis
and the all these things happen 

383
00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:43,900
around my head. 
While there is a crisis, there 

384
00:21:43,900 --> 00:21:46,700
is no catharsis ROM is always 
shown. 

385
00:21:46,700 --> 00:21:51,300
As having very common, Is he 
breaks down that is separated 

386
00:21:51,300 --> 00:21:55,100
from Sita, but his demeanor and 
mannerisms of someone who's 

387
00:21:55,100 --> 00:22:01,900
super confident, who is not 
going through some dramatic 

388
00:22:01,900 --> 00:22:04,300
change. 
In of the, the Japanese Drama 

389
00:22:04,300 --> 00:22:06,300
and which is the famous film 
animation. 

390
00:22:06,300 --> 00:22:09,100
Bound dust turned Ram into a 
hero. 

391
00:22:21,200 --> 00:22:24,200
And you can see the Japanese 
have Rewritten to make it sound 

392
00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:27,500
like he is going through a 
transformation, but that's not 

393
00:22:27,500 --> 00:22:31,400
what Nayak is supposed to do in.
Not a shastra, he's Vishnu on 

394
00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:35,400
Earth, he knows who is dealing 
with, he knows what he's dealing

395
00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:36,600
with. 
He's dealing with people who are

396
00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:39,600
egomaniacs and he's working with
these people. 

397
00:22:39,800 --> 00:22:44,000
He's working with monkeys and 
bears and birds. 

398
00:22:44,900 --> 00:22:48,400
He's dealing with jealous 
mother's ambitious mother's, 

399
00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:52,200
he's dealing with faithful 
wives. he's dealing with gossipy

400
00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:57,700
people, he's dealing with 
Sage's, he's dealing with women 

401
00:22:57,700 --> 00:23:00,900
with lust and he's surrounded by
all these strange things. 

402
00:23:00,900 --> 00:23:03,900
So that the structure of the 
narrative is very different. 

403
00:23:04,100 --> 00:23:08,000
The whole idea that I can get 
monkeys to build a bridge, I can

404
00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:13,600
get animals to be selfless, I 
can demand contractual 

405
00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:16,500
obligations have to be fulfilled
when so grieve does not fulfill 

406
00:23:16,500 --> 00:23:19,400
contractual obligations. 
Why is he not choosing the 

407
00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:22,400
strong Valley? 
There is a dialogue in this 

408
00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:23,400
film. 
You can actually see the 

409
00:23:23,408 --> 00:23:24,900
filmmakers do not understand 
why. 

410
00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:31,300
The ram is choosing to grieve 
over Valley because what does 

411
00:23:31,300 --> 00:23:33,900
Valley rep? 
It's not about might is right. 

412
00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:36,600
Please understand the politician
believes in might and right but 

413
00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:39,300
remind is the opposite of Might 
and right? 

414
00:23:39,500 --> 00:23:43,500
So the politicians agenda and 
remains agenda opposites of each

415
00:23:43,500 --> 00:23:45,800
other, most politicians want to 
be revered. 

416
00:23:46,100 --> 00:23:49,400
They aspire to hear about the 
rule breaker, the one who gets 

417
00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:52,000
away with anything who lives in 
a Golden Palace, who has a 

418
00:23:52,008 --> 00:23:54,900
private jet who can force other 
men's wives. 

419
00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:58,800
Wives to be his own. 
This is a politician's dream. 

420
00:23:59,700 --> 00:24:04,800
ROM is not a Polynesian dream. 
He is a totem to be used to 

421
00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:09,800
become Exactly what the time and
say you should not become. 

422
00:24:10,500 --> 00:24:12,700
How do you explain this to 
politicians? 

423
00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:15,800
I mean, if you speak to them, 
they will just sort of rebuff 

424
00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:18,300
you ordered. 
Maybe send their agents behind 

425
00:24:18,300 --> 00:24:20,600
you. 
So you keep quiet one thing. 

426
00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:24,300
That's common to again on super,
although American superheroes. 

427
00:24:24,300 --> 00:24:27,100
And it sort of superhero idea 
like you said one is that you 

428
00:24:27,100 --> 00:24:30,300
sort of go through this Arc of 
redemption crisis and things. 

429
00:24:30,300 --> 00:24:33,500
The other is the fact that the 
villain old man is almost always

430
00:24:33,500 --> 00:24:35,900
wants to take over the world. 
There is nothing. 

431
00:24:36,100 --> 00:24:38,200
Short of that. 
There is always that or destroy 

432
00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:41,800
the world. 
Why don't our myths of why don't

433
00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:43,700
myths? 
Typically have villains who seem

434
00:24:43,700 --> 00:24:45,000
to want to do that? 
Why don't? 

435
00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:48,600
Why do they limit their sort of 
Ambitions at a very practical 

436
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:51,000
level. 
See, that's an American thing, 

437
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:52,600
right? 
It's an American story telling, 

438
00:24:53,500 --> 00:24:56,300
these are based on biblical 
narratives whether it's Harry 

439
00:24:56,300 --> 00:24:58,600
Potter with this Lord of the 
Rings with its marble, but it's 

440
00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:01,400
Disney all of them, follow a 
Biblical line. 

441
00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:04,300
And what is the last chapter of 
the New Testament? 

442
00:25:04,300 --> 00:25:09,200
It is the book of The apocalypse
where Satan is going to conquer 

443
00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:13,800
destroy the creation of God. 
It's the last and final Jihad, 

444
00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:15,200
right? 
That's where the devil is 

445
00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:17,500
coming. 
And that's the story template, 

446
00:25:17,500 --> 00:25:21,600
which is working in Middle East 
Europe, America on which is 

447
00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:23,900
built the Lord of the Rings 
franchise. 

448
00:25:23,900 --> 00:25:26,400
I mean, JK, Rowling split talk 
anything, but at the end of the 

449
00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:29,800
day Harry Potter, he's a chosen 
one. 

450
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:32,900
Who is going to fight the devil 
Star Wars. 

451
00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:35,300
You have Darth Vader and Luke 
Skywalker fighting. 

452
00:25:35,300 --> 00:25:37,600
It's like the All the white he's
dressed in white and black, it 

453
00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:40,500
can't be more Stark. 
Other than that, it's always 

454
00:25:40,500 --> 00:25:43,900
white and black fighting of the 
devil and it's, I want to 

455
00:25:43,900 --> 00:25:46,900
destroy the world as far as 
Americans are concerned, that's 

456
00:25:46,900 --> 00:25:49,900
the ultimate devil, right? 
So every story they have to now 

457
00:25:49,900 --> 00:25:51,400
up the ante. 
Now, you can see what's 

458
00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:53,800
happening in the mobile world. 
This is sense of exhaustion. 

459
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:56,000
People are like tired, you know,
what's to go to happen? 

460
00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:58,200
You they started making films 
where they make fun of 

461
00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:01,000
themselves because they're only 
going to do the same thing, 

462
00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:04,400
they'll come together and 
they'll kill a degree will come 

463
00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:07,200
together and kill a demon in 
Hindu Ecology The Rock. 

464
00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:07,700
Sure. 
Sir. 

465
00:26:07,900 --> 00:26:09,500
And then the guard comes and 
kills the demon. 

466
00:26:09,500 --> 00:26:14,100
Do the that story is because 
those are part of a spiritual 

467
00:26:14,100 --> 00:26:20,800
narrative to try and make 
ramakrishnan step one that step 

468
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:25,100
to try to align with the Western
narrative this apocalypse, which

469
00:26:25,100 --> 00:26:26,700
is how Hindu rashtra is 
projected, right? 

470
00:26:26,700 --> 00:26:30,000
If you do not fight the other, 
you will be destroyed. 

471
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:34,500
So it's an apocalyptic call that
the politician is using. 

472
00:26:34,500 --> 00:26:37,500
So, as I said, I Ernie is the 
people who say that we are 

473
00:26:37,508 --> 00:26:39,500
preventing. 
We want to save ourselves from 

474
00:26:39,500 --> 00:26:41,800
colonization and it keeps 
hearing all their intellectual 

475
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:44,500
Stockman civilization. 
You are as waste your more 

476
00:26:44,500 --> 00:26:47,300
westernized. 
Then I mean, it does nothing to 

477
00:26:47,300 --> 00:26:48,900
do with valmiki. 
There's nothing to do with your 

478
00:26:48,900 --> 00:26:51,500
assets or little bit under 
there. 

479
00:26:51,500 --> 00:26:54,600
Everything is about other ring 
and creating Thanos, and 

480
00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:58,800
creating Beelzebub, been 
creating Satan and trying to 

481
00:26:59,100 --> 00:27:03,700
force Robert into that. 
Template is so tragic, that you 

482
00:27:03,700 --> 00:27:07,800
have turned golden Lanka. 
Into a charcoal pile. 

483
00:27:08,900 --> 00:27:12,500
That's the tragedy. 
And you have made Robert the 

484
00:27:12,500 --> 00:27:16,700
great musician and the great 
scholar of ayurveda, and 

485
00:27:16,700 --> 00:27:22,800
astrology, a very do and you're 
calling this, it harmik project.

486
00:27:23,300 --> 00:27:27,600
I mean, I the irony is like 
unbelievable, but they genuinely

487
00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:30,100
believe it because that's the 
level of the intellectual 

488
00:27:30,100 --> 00:27:33,400
discourse. 
I've been actually, I was 

489
00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:36,700
surprised the young people's 
outrage for the first time. 

490
00:27:36,700 --> 00:27:39,200
You had marxists getting 
outraged with proper. 

491
00:27:42,100 --> 00:27:47,300
How does that I grew up with 
this and how can I get to watch 

492
00:27:47,300 --> 00:27:47,800
this? 
No, no. 

493
00:27:48,100 --> 00:27:52,100
Most atheists. 
Secular boxes people in State of

494
00:27:52,100 --> 00:27:57,000
Shock because an artistic level,
forget about the spiritual 

495
00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:02,600
level, and an artistic level is 
a travesty But I still want to 

496
00:28:02,600 --> 00:28:05,500
go into this, but why don't? 
I will and seem to want more. 

497
00:28:05,600 --> 00:28:08,700
Why do they end at this? 
Why don't they ever seem to own 

498
00:28:08,700 --> 00:28:13,100
more than silicon Robin's? 
Ambitions didn't extend beyond 

499
00:28:13,100 --> 00:28:17,600
say acquiring Sita in a sense? 
Indian mythology is not based on

500
00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:21,300
the external world, but always, 
the internal world, the Western 

501
00:28:21,300 --> 00:28:23,200
narrative. 
Remember him saying God, created

502
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:25,300
the world? 
So what is God's enemy going to 

503
00:28:25,300 --> 00:28:26,900
do? 
Wanting to destroy the world? 

504
00:28:27,100 --> 00:28:30,300
Greek mythology does not have 
villains who want to conquer the

505
00:28:30,300 --> 00:28:31,900
world. 
And you have this strange 

506
00:28:31,900 --> 00:28:37,300
monsters like Medusa and Chimera
who are destroyed because they 

507
00:28:37,308 --> 00:28:41,900
don't fit into the neat, Greek 
template of fitting in to a 

508
00:28:41,908 --> 00:28:43,700
system. 
So Greek stories are very 

509
00:28:43,700 --> 00:28:46,500
different from Biblical stories.
In Greek mythology, the hero is 

510
00:28:46,500 --> 00:28:49,000
a tragic figure. 
He succeeds, he becomes great, 

511
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:52,200
and he falls a complex thing, 
but is never about conquering 

512
00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:55,200
the world, the great fights 
between the Giants and the gods 

513
00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:58,500
is not about. 
It's about becoming the the 

514
00:28:58,500 --> 00:29:03,300
mightiest of them all. 
This is a Peculiar both 

515
00:29:03,300 --> 00:29:06,200
biblical, as well as American 
ambition, it's an imperial 

516
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:09,400
ambition of America Britain, 
where it's coming from India's 

517
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:12,300
never had these stories. 
We never, none of our valence 

518
00:29:12,300 --> 00:29:15,300
wanted to conquer the world 
ramayana and Mahabharata Robert 

519
00:29:15,300 --> 00:29:18,000
property disputes. 
It's about what is mine and what

520
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:20,400
should it be mind and what 
should be yours and it's about 

521
00:29:20,400 --> 00:29:22,500
distribution of wealth and 
property. 

522
00:29:23,500 --> 00:29:26,400
How is your wife? 
My wife and I you know, this 

523
00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:31,300
remind is about that. 
It's Lanka belongs to Kabir And 

524
00:29:31,300 --> 00:29:33,400
Robert has taken it from his 
brother. 

525
00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:35,400
It's not his kingdom. 
It's something that he's taken 

526
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:38,000
from his brother. 
While the opposite is with Raam 

527
00:29:38,500 --> 00:29:41,400
Raam Raam gives his kingdom to 
Barrett and says, I don't want 

528
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:42,900
it in butter, gives it back to 
him. 

529
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:45,800
So you see in our your they are 
the conversation with the things

530
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:47,800
are not part of ramen 
conversations of Bollywood 

531
00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:51,100
right, the property disputes 
that Ram is saying till Bharat 

532
00:29:51,100 --> 00:29:54,400
Kina, you keep it in. 
Balance is no but it's yours or 

533
00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:57,000
for that matter. 
While on the other side you have

534
00:29:57,000 --> 00:29:59,900
a villain called Robert who 
steals the property of his 

535
00:29:59,900 --> 00:30:01,500
brother. 
Audio valiance. 

536
00:30:01,500 --> 00:30:04,900
Agree fighting over kishkinda. 
So it's a property dispute very 

537
00:30:04,900 --> 00:30:07,800
clearly and we don't need to be 
very smart to refigure out. 

538
00:30:07,900 --> 00:30:10,400
Three kingdoms with Three 
Brothers are fighting, and one 

539
00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:12,400
brother is RAM is refusing to 
fight. 

540
00:30:12,700 --> 00:30:14,500
S Ram is not an ambitious 
person. 

541
00:30:14,500 --> 00:30:16,800
He is a king because he is the 
eldest son. 

542
00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:19,000
It's his duty. 
He doesn't want to be king. 

543
00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:21,800
He has to be king because he's 
the eldest son. 

544
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:24,100
How do you explain this to 
ambitious? 

545
00:30:24,100 --> 00:30:27,300
Politicians? 
Ambitious, dialogue, writers, 

546
00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:31,100
ambitious filmmakers, they don't
Stand. 

547
00:30:31,100 --> 00:30:34,000
The idea that Rahm is not 
ambitious. 

548
00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:37,600
He's doing, is Burma his 
obligation to be the eldest son,

549
00:30:38,500 --> 00:30:40,400
right? 
He's saving Sita. 

550
00:30:40,400 --> 00:30:43,800
Not because my wife has been 
taken away. 

551
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:48,200
I want my wife back. 
That's very property. 

552
00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:53,900
Oriented Ram is saying as a 
husband, it's my duty to protect

553
00:30:53,900 --> 00:30:56,200
my wife as a king. 
It is my duty to protect my 

554
00:30:56,200 --> 00:30:59,300
subject. 
Therefore I'm fighting this war 

555
00:30:59,400 --> 00:31:00,600
so it's a very clear 
conversation. 

556
00:31:00,700 --> 00:31:03,400
Shit. 
It's not a personal to name a re

557
00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:07,000
but Nikola Mirotic. 
Mrdanga, that's a Bollywood 

558
00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:09,200
dialogue. 
That's not Rams dialogue. 

559
00:31:09,500 --> 00:31:12,800
ROM is saying I'm the king. 
The subjects have to be 

560
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:16,100
protected from someone who 
usurps now, these are ideas 

561
00:31:16,100 --> 00:31:18,500
which are very powerful in 
literature. 

562
00:31:19,300 --> 00:31:21,900
King's duty is to ensure that 
everybody's property is 

563
00:31:21,900 --> 00:31:26,200
protected, and he is both King 
and husband in the story. 

564
00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:30,400
And therefore, he is serving 
himself in the narrative but the

565
00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:33,000
Manatees are far more elevated 
than that. 

566
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:37,000
That is what the conversations 
are and the stories of loyalty 

567
00:31:37,500 --> 00:31:44,200
kumbhakarna is loyal. 
The be assured is chooses that, 

568
00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:45,600
you know, what is, right and 
wrong. 

569
00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:48,300
You cannot take someone else's 
Wi-Fi will not be loyal, a 

570
00:31:48,300 --> 00:31:52,200
politician who loves loyal 
people cannot fathom the idea 

571
00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:54,700
therefore he hates a character 
like the vision because we 

572
00:31:54,700 --> 00:31:59,700
bishan says no this is wrong. 
Think of one Indian politician 

573
00:31:59,700 --> 00:32:04,000
will allow that. 
Not one Indian politician will 

574
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:10,600
understand the Visions character
and that is reflective of the 

575
00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:14,700
writers of the story. 
These new retellings, I always 

576
00:32:14,700 --> 00:32:17,200
tell people by reading the new 
retellings. 

577
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:21,100
You you can understand the 
personality of the storytellers,

578
00:32:21,100 --> 00:32:23,700
they contrarians who want to be 
gravel to the hero. 

579
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:30,000
There are feminists who want to 
make soup Anika a hero there are

580
00:32:30,100 --> 00:32:32,100
politicians. 
Who want to be rewarded 

581
00:32:32,100 --> 00:32:35,700
something like a kin to a Muslim
reader there are seeing. 

582
00:32:35,700 --> 00:32:39,000
What is the al-baqi trying to 
communicate valmiki's. 

583
00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:41,100
Come talking about. 
What is mine? 

584
00:32:41,100 --> 00:32:42,900
What is yours? 
What is property? 

585
00:32:42,900 --> 00:32:45,100
What is boundaries? 
What a hierarchies? 

586
00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:50,000
How will of God behave in a 
situation where he is made the 

587
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:52,200
prince? 
The king of ayodhya. 

588
00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:54,900
How will he behave? 
Will be attached to you there? 

589
00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:57,200
And these are the ideas that 
they're trying to. 

590
00:32:57,500 --> 00:33:00,800
We are talking about this may or
Mira to, or Theta this possess 

591
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:05,500
Pronoun, which does not exist. 
Its cultural words, mind yours. 

592
00:33:06,100 --> 00:33:09,000
This is my, this is yours. 
These are not natural words. 

593
00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:11,600
These are cultural words, I'll 
give you an example. 

594
00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:14,600
The word, bhagavaan we translate
in English is God. 

595
00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:18,500
It doesn't mean God, the word 
bhagawan comes from, you know, 

596
00:33:18,500 --> 00:33:22,800
the root word is Burger, which 
means to cut bog between two 

597
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:28,100
cuts is the portion bog. 
So we all the world's resources 

598
00:33:28,100 --> 00:33:29,400
are divided. 
Amongst us? 

599
00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:32,300
What is my portion? 
What does Your potion, who knows

600
00:33:32,300 --> 00:33:35,200
the correct way to apportion, 
right? 

601
00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:37,500
That's the fight between 
socialist, capitalist and all 

602
00:33:37,500 --> 00:33:41,600
over the world. 
Bhagavad knows all portions. 

603
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:44,600
The one keeper of all the 
portions, the one who knows to a

604
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:46,700
poor? 
Now, this is not the meaning of 

605
00:33:47,100 --> 00:33:50,800
almighty God. 
It's a different meaning is sure

606
00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:53,300
is perhaps more closer to the 
concept of almighty. 

607
00:33:53,300 --> 00:33:58,600
God, the great ishwara the 
master, the Lord but Bhagavad is

608
00:33:58,600 --> 00:34:02,400
more at a material Level of What
is should be your share? 

609
00:34:02,500 --> 00:34:05,900
What is a fair share and that 
gets even more complicated in 

610
00:34:05,900 --> 00:34:08,699
Hinduism because we're talking 
about rebirth because your share

611
00:34:08,699 --> 00:34:11,800
is not just determined by the 
Merit and the action of what you

612
00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:14,000
do now. 
But what have you done before? 

613
00:34:20,600 --> 00:34:23,100
Today's episode was produced by 
Jay Raj, Singh soon. 

614
00:34:23,100 --> 00:34:26,100
I moratti and on Vijay Singh for
a daily Spotlight. 

615
00:34:26,100 --> 00:34:30,100
On people ideas and stories that
matter subscribe to us, we're 

616
00:34:30,100 --> 00:34:34,400
available on T. 
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617
00:34:34,500 --> 00:34:36,300
and all other platforms of your 
choice. 

618
00:34:36,900 --> 00:34:41,300
For any new steps email us at 
DIY podcast at times, internet 

619
00:34:41,300 --> 00:34:41,900
dot in