What's up everybody, Mid Journey fast hours podcast episode 64
back from a long vacation and did we get something?
Did we finally get mid journey V8?
Yes, we did, although maybe not the full extent of what we
originally thought, right? I mean, I leading up to this
there was a lot of hype with V8, right?
We thought we were going to get this.
There was maybe the chance in December, then it was January,
then it was February, then it was halfway through March and
boom, here it is. So we got it.
And, you know, like we're going to get into this.
I think like that's where we start, Rory.
We'll we're going to share sort of like our first impressions
with it. I know a lot of people have been
sort of like knocking on our door.
Like where are you guys going to do a pot on this or what?
Really. Yeah, we are.
We are. We are.
There's a lot of first impressions.
I think you and I both have a lot of observations and, and
kind of sentiment with where things currently stand.
So we'll, we'll jump into that. I mean, I guess it looks like
let's kick it off with, well, let's kick it off with the fact
that you were traveling when this drug, first of all, which
never fails one of us always. But when you finally got into
it, give me what did you do first?
What did you do 1st and what were your observations?
I just reran the last prompt that I had in there and just was
like, all right, let's see the difference.
And it was. You know.
I was traveling, so I apologize to everyone who's been asking if
we're, you know, like if we stopped this thing.
I was just in a run of three weeks of absolute psychotic
travel, not to mention the TSA and.
You got trapped in that I. Got trapped in that.
I got trapped in the LaGuardia plane crash situation.
I wasn't. Did you really?
But I was traveling within 12 hours of that plane crash.
Oh my God, man, come on. It was.
Come on. Sidebar before we get into this,
just a just a laugh a little bit right?
So got back from Miami on Sunday, was had to go basically
back and drive my daughter to my parents on Monday so that she
could my wife. And it was like my wife was in
one place, I was in one place, the dog was in one place, the
baby's in the other place, right?
So I had to drive to New Jersey and back like 3 hour round trip
on Monday to then take my flight on Tuesday, which was right
after the plane crash at the same airport.
But my flight was at 6:00 AM so I had to get there early.
So I had to wake up at 3:30 in the morning and then had to
drive to the airport and park there because I was going to
need my car on the way. Back.
Come on. Baby, right?
So get there at 4 AM, 800 people in line at TSA.
I'm like, you got to be kidding me.
I got on the plane no problem. Like, I mean, it took forever,
but it's 4:00 AM and I'm just sitting there like, I can't
believe this is a reality. Go to, you know, go to Boston
for the two days that I'm with with Shark Ninja there.
And then like on the second day I'm like, all right, cool.
Like, you know, I'm supposed to just like leave at 8:00 at
night, get home, get my car, drive to my parents, go to
sleep. They cancel the flight.
So I'm like, oh, great, here we go.
They booked me on the next day. I'm like, no, no, no, it's not
going to happen. I need to get home tonight and
like I can't be away for this long.
I need to go home. So I re I like go through hoops
to get on a flight to to JFK, which is the other airport in
New York for anyone who doesn't know.
And it's like it's way further away.
LaGuardia is 15 minutes away from me.
JFK is like 50 minutes away, right?
So I fly there to 1 airport, then I have to Uber to another
to the other airport to get my car to then drive to get my
daughter in New Jersey, all in one shot.
So I got there like 12:30 at night, woke up, drove back here,
sat in 2 1/2 hours of traffic to get back yesterday.
Like gridlock alert, insane to go.
My parents live 15 miles away, takes.
I don't know what the equivalent of that is in kilometers, maybe
like 35 or something like that. It'd say 2 1/2 hours to get
here. So.
I have just been wasting time in TSA and airports and cars and
traffic. Long story short, it's just like
we're back. We're.
Back. Yeah, right.
Like just all over the place. But that being said, first shot
I got was on the plane and I don't know if it was my Internet
connection on the plane, but Delta's Wi-Fi is normally pretty
good with that. But like nothing worked.
It's like, oh, let me try. Awesome, didn't work.
Let me try my my profile didn't work.
I was just getting like generation failed generation
failed generate. So then I waited and then when I
got to the hotel I started playing with it a little bit and
I think it was probably the day of or the second day that it was
out and it just wasn't working. So I just gave up for a few days
until I was like, this will iron itself out.
Yeah, yeah, I. Don't know did you have that
first that first two 2-3 day issue, it was just generation
failed after generation failed. I didn't run into that
specifically, but I think where I where I was at with it, and I
think maybe, you know, a lot of our audience is with it is I
didn't rush to try it out immediately like I have with
every other one release in the past.
You know, usually it's like a you're opening a Christmas
present. Like, you know, something just
like Amazon package just kicked, you know, came to your door
they've been waiting for. But you know, I think that
speaks to like the fact that like a lot of us have kind of
like, you know, the workflows change.
You know, we've got these other tools now that have made their
way into workflows and yeah, we've been waiting for this for
so long. So like we've kind of, you know,
moved, right. And, you know, I think by the
time I did get in there, I think first, First things first, I'm
disappointed and I and I think it's OK to say this.
I love mid journey, always will, no matter what.
I mean, it's given both of us just so many things.
Obviously we've even got this podcast, you know, we started
just for it, right? But I think like just as it got
closer to launch, it just the excitement really started to, to
just sort of like dissipate a little bit, you know, because
it's just like, hell, we're, we're probably not going to have
this ready for, for the launch. And, you know, you could just
kind of sense it with David and when they were talking about it,
just like the excitement that they had one month prior wasn't
that excitement that they had days, weeks leading up to the,
the, the release. And that really just kind of
like said it for me. And, you know, just kind of
subconsciously of OK, like they're not that excited that I
can't be that excited because I've kind of, you know, we've,
we've, we've gone through this so many times, right?
I think like we can kind of get this barometer of what they say
and how that's actually going to translate now.
But I was just disappointed that it's on an alpha site.
I know we're still working through it, right?
But ultimately it's just like this model, we, you know, last
time we got a, a model was V7 that came out in April 2025.
You know, we're, we're in March 2026, you know what I mean?
And we're getting an alpha version of this.
You know, it's just like, damn, you know, and and so of of
course, right, like in this competing environment as well,
you're getting a bunch of people that'll go in, especially the
non power users, but like they use it and then they're
disappointed immediately because it's not fully functioning the
way that they expected or would expect from the standpoint of,
oh, it's a new model should be better, will be better, right.
And that's just the reality, right.
I don't think I'm saying anything that's that's shocking
or jarring in any way here. But I think that was the first
thing. It's just like us on now site.
So now I got, you know, like got to play with this on alpha and
then you've got sort of like, you know, what's maybe let's
let's open up kind of like what we're looking at here.
I'll kind of get into maybe some of the nitty gritty of what
we're talking about with, you know, kind of like what we're
seeing too. You know, this whole UI set up
this navigation. I, I don't know, I was, we were
just talking about this before we, we hit record, but it's
like, is this the UI that they've been talking about?
Is it just like shifting things over kind of I, I would hope not
because I don't really feel this doesn't feel better to me in any
way. And in fact, like the one thing
that that really is killing me, which I know is an easy fix, but
it's just like, how can I quickly adjust my profile?
Where, where is that I got to go?
Like here, it's on. So I got to go all the way here
and then go and select. Right next to the where your
settings button is, that's highlighting red top right click
the thing to the to the left of it, whatever that is.
Yeah, and now you can select profiles mood.
Boards. Got it.
Style reference I. Mean.
I liked this piece like this was better to me than having the
drop down the the like profile drop down and then always having
to like oh wait is it clicked? On I don't think that was the I
don't think that was the right answer either.
To be fair. I just this, it doesn't, I don't
know, just doesn't do anything for me.
Like maybe that speaks to it. You know, I've been in here a
few times. I, I didn't see it in here.
Didn't see it here. I did click this, but maybe I
just didn't browse long enough. And then it's just like, oh, OK,
I guess I'm just using this right now.
And this, yeah, it's just, I like that you have this here,
but I don't know. That was one thing that stuck
out to me immediately. There's, you know, I think the
model itself feels very volatile, right?
So like I went through and ranked, you know, a bunch of
these two like right when they did the ranking party, that was
kind of this one here that I started, you know, kind of like
curating and then I kind of even went back to to this once I saw
that this was sort of like they're combining this global
into the V8. I was thinking we were going to
get a new global. Maybe we will once it's out of
alpha. But then I started kind of like
going through here and ranking things again, and I did notice
that it was able to kind of like eliminate some of that bluish
pink hue that I was getting. So this is actually usable again
now. But I'm noticing, right, like
with the new personalization that I created once the ranking
party came out with like that final version where you're
starting to see real V8 images, When I use this, the images are
a little bit sharper. They look like V8 compared to,
you know, maybe something like what I was using before, like
with this one. So just just an observation.
I think that was like one of the things that I noticed.
Let's just kind of take it, you know, they talked about, you
know, maybe doing a new explore page.
I don't know if that's still in the works.
You've got this, you know, I'm randomized, which is cool.
OK, and same. I mean, everything else is
pretty much the same. So right, V8 new coherence.
I think that's the thing we're we're really trying to figure
out here is, you know, sort of the coherence of it all.
Do you have any thoughts on that coherence specifically?
Because I've found it to be. It's more coherent, I mean.
It is it is more more more coherent.
I don't to be to be fair, I don't know that I fully stress
tested it enough as I have in the past, but I think like to me
so far, it's not worse than it was.
I I can't say it's objectively better though either at this
point. I just I'm kind of in the middle
on it right now. But yeah, I mean, so this this
point right here, right? V8 prompts differently to V7.
Short and vibey no longer gets you there.
That was basically, I didn't even see that in the in the
notes, but that's sort of what my first like thought was.
Yeah. When I was trying the short and
vibey stuff, like it wasn't doing what it normally does,
which is weird because that's why I came to like it over the
last, you know, for for like the the the difference from the
other models being like, oh, I can still do short and vibe, but
I can also do control. Like if I just want to like, you
know, type in the work is dark and the work is mysterious and
important and I get something like banger.
That's that's good. But then I.
Also want to. Be able to do you.
Know and and and maybe that's still possible.
From like Jason prompting. Yeah, like, and, and maybe like
that vibe, you know, less is more exploratory prompting still
really works well from like a mood board perspective, right?
Where it's just like you've got sort of almost like a container
of an aesthetic or style that you're aiming for to already
operate within. And so the vibeiness of that
kind of creates a little bit of room for the creativity that is
constrained through the through the mood board.
So it's like OK if if that's still the case then that could
be cool. This one was interesting too.
SRAF and mood Mood boards have a new version SV7.
So SV6 still works, but SV 7. Is SV7 the default?
I don't know if it's the default, I don't know.
I wonder if we could get that information, like if we just ran
something, if it would tell us. Probably not.
I don't think it ever did before.
We had to like kind of put it in there.
Let's just do it. Just do 1 real quick with a mood
board. Do SV7 and do the bracketed
SV7SV6. See how different it is?
Yeah, let's just do, do, do, do. Nuns with guns.
Yeah, that's an older one. Let's do something newer.
Let's do. Let's do this one and.
See what we used to do is stills archive hit enter banger.
Yeah, yeah. I love that.
That was, man, that was one of the best things ever.
So let's just put like unsettling character.
This is sort of like the vibe of this we can do.
Can I run parameters with this piece?
I don't know. I don't think we could before.
It's worth a try. Let's see what the difference
is. I can't type.
That's cool. Yeah, let's do this.
Let's run this three times. Let's get a good sense of what's
going on here. So let's see, we have SV7SV6.
It is running them. That's cool.
OK, there does look to be a difference here.
One looks SV 7 looks a little sharper.
I mean, look at that. That's interesting.
Try a different try a different mood board real quick.
Try something with color. I'm curious about the colors.
Yeah, let's do it. Let's take this off.
Let's do. Because that was one thing I
noticed that the coherence thing right?
Like that was like just a sidebar while you're while
you're typing this out was I was using a mood board that's
predominantly green and black. And typically it's such a strong
mood board that it overrides everything I put in my prompt
and I kept hitting it. I'm like, why is this coming out
blue? Because I'm just using an old
prompt. I'm like, it should not be blue.
And then I looked in there like I mentioned something.
I mentioned blue as like a because it was an old prompt and
it was defaulting like the aesthetic to blue.
I'm like, that's crazy. Like that never used to happen
where it would just like actually like really listen like
that and the mood board wouldn't override it.
But that was one thing I didn't know.
So I'm like, oh, it's, it's way more like then I started playing
with stuff like that, with like little intricate things.
And it was definitely listening to the little intricate things,
but in a way that I hadn't really noticed before, if that
makes sense. Give me, give me, give me some,
give me some, give me some stuff.
Try the work is try the work is mysterious and important.
That should give us that should give us something.
The other thing I noticed while we're here is that this the
stylize. I haven't been seeing a massive
jump from like 100 to 1000 like the the difference to me between
200 and 800 isn't as extreme as it used to be.
But. So what do we got here?
Yeah, I can see it. So this these three would be
SV6, these three would be SV7. There's.
Definitely more depth. There's more depth, there's more
contrast. Dark like the there's the blacks
are darker. Is it mirror?
Is it a little bit more unstable though, like the other ones
look? Yeah, a little bit cleaner.
Yeah, let's see. So like that one for example.
Yeah, bareback too. One more, go back, one more.
Or maybe that wasn't that one. Like the stairs, like.
This thing, What is this? Yeah, it looks like AV 34.
That's what I've been noticing with with mood boards
specifically, I should say that is that the mood board seemed a
little bit unstable. That might be something that
they're ironing out. Yeah.
Like those are SV6, right? Like.
That these are SV6. To me, that's looking a little
bit more like composed less, less weird hallucination in that
I mean, we're asking, you know, this is a lot, but regardless.
This is an this is an older mood board.
I want to maybe let's try one more.
Let's try one more. I think it'd be good
experiments. Try one more here.
So let's go here. Let's try something that feels
newer, not this. All right, so let's just put,
let's do the same thing. And then I think let's also do
something that is less ambiguous and dreamy and more matter of
fact, let's do. What do you got like?
War criminal. All right.
Yeah, let's just do it. Just don't do Homesteader.
Jeez, I mean, I think we're safe because we're on mine, but, you
know, here we go. So let's do this.
Let's run. Let's run this twice.
What else? Am I missing Anything here
before we run it? No.
Let's do. I don't think so.
Do we do? Were we trying to test SV there?
Why is this? Oh yes, there we go.
See. All right, here we go, SV67.
Rock'n'roll. All right, let's see.
So that's SV 7. Now, these are all kind of like
a little bit of motion, right? Like a little bit more lo fi
anyway, so just take that into consideration.
All right, so let's see here. Just doesn't look super usable,
right? Like most of this, these have
issues that might be the best and and frankly, that might be
the best one. Like that one actually is solid.
Mid journey making. Go right in on it, huh?
But some of these do lack, right?
And then SV6 still doesn't it doesn't look much better.
I mean, so the mood boards thing, this is real.
I mean, this was really working well, not on V8.
So let's let's take that back. Let's run the same thing.
Why does this keep kind of adding these?
And I wondered if it'll let me run 7, might not.
V7 There you go. OK.
What has your pro if it has your profile attached to it?
See this is the weird stuff that I that I'm noticing.
Also is like the the repetitive adding of.
Pro Yeah. Why is it doing that?
I get rid of them all right, so this will run.
We'll do SV7 because it doesn't. We'll do SV7, we'll get the SV6.
But you just like to compare what these look like.
I mean, these are going to be much better.
These will these will be 10 times better.
Yeah, and you'll see it right away.
I mean usable, usable, yeah, not bad usable, usable, usable, you
know, like so the, yeah, the, the, the mood board degradation
here. I, I think I heard something
about that on office hours, to be fair.
And I do have office hours notes up.
Problem is they're like, it's, it's deep.
We didn't go through it completely ahead of time, but I
do know there's a lot going on internally about I think they're
hearing it. VAI think there's some
disappointment from from people, you know, their users obviously
also PII think probably some of the team is probably a little
disappointed kind of the way that things were released now,
but so it sounds like. Try try adding another move
board. I want to see if it's just me.
On top. Yeah, try doing multiple move
boards. Oh, OK.
And I don't know if they said this in office hours or not, but
I was getting it. This is where I was failing
every single time was adding two mood boards or more, or adding a
mood board and a style reference or like all the fun things that
I like to. Do I mean I could I could mix in
this black and white version it this is kind of like a similar
one to this except black and white.
So we could kind of mix that if we want.
What are you wanting to see here?
I just want to see if it if it generates for you because I get
failed failed creation for everything.
In this, I'm going to run this on V7 so we can kind of get a
baseline again just like we did. So let's run that.
Then I'm going to do this with what we were doing before with
Six and seven on V8, so that way we get the full comparison here.
OK, yeah, see, I mean like annoying, annoying, annoying and
it's not actually running with it.
Oh, it is all. Right.
Why are you And this is what? Like why can't I do anything
sometimes? And see now I just, I, I clicked
out of them, submitted it, it ran without them, but now they
were added back here again. Well, they're probably in like
the I don't know, I mean it, it's just confusing to me.
But like again, I can't use multiple mood boards and I don't
know why. What?
That oh, you can't. No, like everything else, yeah.
When's the last time you tried that?
Today, no, that's. A good handle.
Look interesting. Let's let's just pull it up.
I'll just do mine real quick. Just so before we get into that,
just to just show you that I'm not crazy here.
Yeah, yeah. It'll probably work because I,
you know, we're doing this now. Here, let let me let me show
this real quick and we let's pivot to yours.
So this we ran the same experiment again.
So again, at the top here, we're going to work our way down from
the top here. This is V7 of these two mood
boards combined. So let's go through these really
quickly, right? Solid, Really.
Like it like we're we're getting really good stuff here, OK.
And then let's just kind of like Fast forward a little bit ahead.
Now we're getting into the V8. This is SV7.
It's not. Usable it's like a totally
different vibe like it's not Wow 911 huh Did you see that go back
jeez that's a. New World Trade Center war
criminal. Jeez, yeah, like, you know, just
not usable right now, like. The thing is like some like the
skull one, like if you go back a couple.
This one or this? One that one like is it is it
monumental? No.
Is it is it kind of cool and vibe?
Yeah, but like like the other ones you were doing, I was
seeing like every other one. I'm like, yeah, like that.
Like, yeah, like that exactly. And and you know, we spent a lot
of time with with those mood boards, you and me, you know,
like so you know, if I'm going to use mood boards right now,
I'm not going to be using V8, you know, until further notice,
right. That's got to be fixed.
So all right, I think that that wraps that piece up.
Let's let's shift over to you. Let's show me if you're able to
do this now all. Right, let's just say.
Let's just kind of test it out. So let's just say I have my.
I'll turn my profile off. Oh, these are cool, by the way.
Yeah, these are, this is just the the work has missed that I
ran this just base like I wanted to see the new model.
I will give it credit. Like the one thing I'm noticing
is that the V8 standard model with no personalization attached
is definitely better aesthetically.
Oh yeah, OK. I haven't really tried much
without the personalization. But like, it's, it's got way
more what's the word I'm looking for here?
It it's sort of got a lot more like character to it and a lot
more sort of it's just it's just more powerful.
I mean, granted, but like the whole thing is billed as using
your like here here's all my failed generations like this is
what I'm talking about like there's a million I start going
down. You just keep getting where is
the when I start getting into the everything was failed, But
like again, going back to some of that stuff like V is this V8?
Yeah, these are V8, but I was running some like V7 like this
mood board, right? Like this looks.
Yeah, I remember that mood board.
Like I love this one with the intricate details and then V
eights like this. Like it's not, yeah, it's not
picking up the same way as everything is sort of like
funky, but. Try your try your double mood
board real quick while you're here.
All right, let's see. And then, you know, like war.
Criminal. You, you know what Roy too like.
OK, so so far, right? We've been talking about sort of
like the downside of V8 so far. Now there are good pieces of
this too, right? Like, I mean, we, we can show
some of the things that we've created so far with the 8.
And when it does get it right, it's noticeably better.
It is noticeably better. I mean, there are just, you
know, we'll, we'll kind of scroll through those things
between you and me. I think there's a lot that we
can kind of like pull out from an insightful standpoint of what
we're seeing. I think the problem right now is
the volatility with the model, you know, you get a banger and
then the next one's complete shit, right.
And so we've we've got to sort of close that gap and then
obviously like patch up these things like mood boards, right?
Like where they're not only back at the level of what they were
before, but I I'd expect better, right.
So how long it is, is that going to take, you know?
So why can't I use two mood boards like VA?
OK, so it's not letting you. Yeah, and now V7 runs like it
does that, right. Like I don't get it.
I don't understand why. And it's been this has been, I
don't think these mood boards are that crazy.
Like, I don't know why they are they are they hitting, you know,
content moderation? Like, I don't know, let's try
this. I'm wondering if this is like
one of those scenarios you remember last time right with
when mood boards dropped I was able to use to for whatever
reason and other people weren't. Yeah, let's.
Maybe it's one of those situations because I don't I
don't know what else it could be.
Let's see, is it just some mood boards that are not working?
Is it like, see this is these are like the mental gymnastics,
like it looks like this is going to work now.
It does does look like it's going to work now stinking.
Does it want to do it? Should I do it?
Should I do it because we're
live? Should I do it?
I think at this point now it's it's making me think it's not
because it's taking, oh, there we go.
Because of course what? Happened then so.
What's the, but look at the difference in these, in these
mood boards here, right? Like this is the mood boards
here. 1 is all like crazy intricate faces.
The other one's all wabi sabi. This is what it should look like
with mood boards. This is what is coming out of
VA. Like if I went into here and
showed you what's in the data set of this, this is what's in
the data set. It's not that it's not that
different, right? Like it's all like these crazy
faces. And then the wabi sabi is just
like basically exactly what you thought, like just intricate
looking people, right? That's all that's in there.
And now, like, why is this coming up?
Yeah, there's a lot of like maximalist things coming on here
for for whatever reason. I think it's like interpreting
maybe the maximalism on the face and it's applying it elsewhere
instead of just the face. Yeah, right.
To me is like exactly what it should be, right?
This is. Click on that one right there.
Like from a thumbnail perspective that looks super
cool. That one that is down one and to
the left. Down with this one.
Yeah, little, little Adolph. It feels like it.
It's it's that one's actually pretty sick.
This is cool. Like this is cool, but like it's
not what I had envisioned. You know what I mean?
If I was trying to go for that. Like that one?
I I really like that. Yeah.
That that I, I mean, I don't even want to say Hitler one, but
but it's it's a it's a good shot that that introduces like some
some really cool elements into it.
That's probably the best of the bunch.
I think like, look, it's it, this is creative and I like it,
you know, like I like, I like this.
But The thing is, what I what I was going for was not this.
Yeah, exactly. This is what I was looking for.
You know, like a little bit more like this.
Exactly what I was thinking in my head when I'm doing this
right or this or this right, like this is like something like
that is what I'm looking for. But I guess you just have to
figure out how to use mood boards again, like I don't know
if that's if that's something that let's see if I have to do
like, you know, Southwest, Southwest you can do.
No, it's s s like 900. Yeah, run a, Yeah, run a test on
that too. Yeah, I mean, I just, I, I just
think they're, I just think mood boards are I, I don't think
they're broken, but they're, they, they've got to be, they've
got to be fixed or patched here. I, I, I, they know that.
I, I think, like I said, I think that came up on office hours.
But so the so it's just some of your, some of your mood boards
aren't working when combined. This is so weird.
Then. I don't.
Move word it's adding a ones
that I don't want in there let's try this one more time where all
right so it's working here, which is this is weird man.
I don't get it. Like, this is actually really
cool, right? Like I like this.
Like I like some of this stuff that's pumping out.
It's just not sort of functioning the way that, yeah,
probably probably just have to be.
It probably comes down to text prompting.
Yeah, I was going to say maybe this is like, and I think this
is definitely the case outside of mood boards which kind of
goes back to where this all started with us is you probably
need to have some sort of prompt structure here.
I think this has gotten it if if this models coherence is even
slightly less vibey, which I think we we all agree it is.
I think you're going to have to structure it right.
And and that may be an interesting test for us.
We could either do it here or just for folks that are
listening is try prompting with mood boards with more of the
simple prompt like we were doing versus something that has your,
you know, camera shot your photography style, right?
Like almost kind of like that real structured, you know,
specific approach, right? We're including the the medium,
the lighting, the environment, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Seeing if that changes things. But I think in general that's
the case. I also, I also need to do more
of the testing between standard and raw on this one.
That could be. I mean, that change hasn't been
really that drastic lately with the models, but perhaps with
this one it could be that's something worth testing.
Yeah, like that's the one thing that I'm, the other thing that
I'm interested in here is that let me take this one off.
I'm just curious now the like see how this is just like
overriding all of the like, this is what the design looks like,
right? It's like a little bit extreme
maximalist, whatever, because I'm writing 85 millimeter close
up portrait of a war criminal. Like it's it's definitely
overriding the mood boards. They're like this is way less
extremely visually. Than these.
Are. And what are What is your
stylize on those two? 900.
I mean, so that technically what we have been told, right,
Stylize effects mood board strength, yeah, when you're when
you're using a mood board. So yeah, that's the case.
That's that's interesting. The only the my one other
problem here is that like that was actually legit.
But also Rory with with 85 mil. These should be super tacky
sharp for from a. That's what I'm saying.
Yeah. Yeah.
And like this one, this one a little bit better.
Right, feels like a big drop off.
Yeah. So the the other thing that I'm
noticing a lot of is that like when I do this with, I know this
isn't going to run for V7. So let me just do V8 HDQ 4.
Let's see if it does it that way.
Like I've been running stuff on Q4 because it's getting like way
sharper. Let's do this.
They got to get these. There you go, that's the biggest
pain in the ass there is right now.
So this one, I would say I've been getting better stuff with
Q4. But yeah.
Like I still kind of oddly enough as much as everyone
complained about the V7 like upscalers like I I miss having
it to clean up some of the stuff.
I know right it. Was like a retouch.
It also made me change my system because, you know, I was, I was
upscaling the ones that I sort of like, like the most as that,
that was more sort of my way to filter down, right?
So if I go to organize, I can just go to upscale.
Those are the images that I like the most.
Now with that not being an option, I've had to go.
I had to go back to like, favoriting and liking as I guess
the the filter, you know? Like the other thing I was
saying was basically like, but while this is rendering, I was
saying like this is stylized 900.
And then if we go back to 150, like is there that big of a
difference here? It's not that I mean like
there's, it's not that crazy. I mean, it doesn't feel that
crazy, doesn't. Jump doesn't feel there.
There's a difference, but it doesn't feel like a 150 to 900
difference, which then, you know, that could also, you know,
like if I'm thinking about if I'm putting myself in mid
journey shoes too, I think at this point, like they could make
a lot of things. You could eliminate some
decisions or make them a little bit more consolidated.
And I don't without thinking about that for an extended
period of time. I don't know if there's a pure
like if the, if the pros outweigh the cons because some
people really like having all this spectrum to work with.
But if the reality is the spectrum isn't that wide, if, if
the spectrum doesn't really feel like a zero to 1000 difference,
you know, like that feels in theory like a big difference.
But when we're running this, it's not much of a difference,
you know, can we just, can you just pair that down to, you
know, three different stop points, right?
Instead of like this whole slider and just pretending like
there's this big difference, you know?
Yeah. Like I think there's, you know,
you can definitely tell the difference between Q2 and Q4.
Like there's, there's definitely a lot more going on here.
Yeah, click, click into those Q4 ones and and because you ran HD
with these two. Yeah.
Q4. And this will give us some good
insight here of like, if you're really pushing the maximum
value, does it work like we would expect it to work right
now? I don't think so, even though
that looks better compared to 1 of some of these other V8 images
that you and I have created without mood boards.
I would say like I've seen way sharper way, you know, more
realistic blah blah blah, but. Because like, it's not, it's
sort of like unpredictable, right?
Now, and it's all because. We, we like the mood boards,
right? Like I really liked the mood
boards that I created. I use them for a lot of
different things, but you know, we can get in.
We can probably get into this a lot, a lot deeper.
I would say that to me, my overall, like my overall
reaction to it is cool, happy it's there.
I mean, once it stabilizes, I'll have a better opinion on it.
But to me it's just sort of like, OK.
Needs, need. We need to get the
stabilization, we need to get all of the the features
introduced and and working at not only a stable level, but an
ideal quality level. And then I think just the
reality is where it's like when you give me the edit model, then
I'll tell you how bullish I am about kind of like what's going
on here too, you know, because again, that really is one of the
main deciding factors for any of us probably listening to this
with things that we're doing that that require multiple steps
or project related work is you kind of need an edit model for
most of this stuff. I mean, and and that's just the
reality right now. So until I have that, you know,
and then, you know, the stabilization here, it's really
hard to say, you know, how bullish I am just in general
with, with everything here on the journey side, but I'm still
optimistic. I just again, I worry about how
fast these things are going to drip out.
You know, we, we got this in March.
Now how long are we going to have to wait for the edit model?
Because I remember there was talk of oh, like the edit model
will will drop, you know, within a couple weeks or a month after.
V8 well, now if you guys are still putting V8 together, are
you working on the edit model right now?
Like, like what is the timeline there?
And I think if I were them to, I would be really focused on
communicating transparently about the edit model and how
much progress is being made there because that's really
what's going to bring people back into the fold here.
Stabilization obviously is is key, but you know what I mean.
Yeah. I mean, look, it's like you have
free pic and Luma agents now that you can just one Click to
like here's one image and then like it's going to go do 8 more
images in like sequence and like here's the story.
Like using the same character. Like there's, I can tell you
this right now, I'm not going to like spend my time trying to
hack around an edit model that doesn't work.
Like that's, you know, that was two years ago when we try to get
consistency and like hack around like I won't, I won't if it
doesn't work with one simple click.
I sound like a diva right now, but.
It's like high waste time. Nope.
That's that's the, that's where we're at.
Go somewhere else and do it real quick.
Rory, that's where we're at. I'm so glad you said that.
That's like such a great point, though.
That is the reality. I mean, and again, I, I think
that's kind of the reality with this space being so crowded.
And when I say space, I'm going beyond just like static images.
I'm talking about like sort of like the whole visual AI.
But it's just like these tools, these updates, they drop so
often. You got to make a great first
impression. I mean, you can't really at this
point be, be dropping something, having somebody try and be
disappointed and expect them to come back.
I mean, especially something that they've been waiting for
and anticipating. And that's why I think like with
that edit mile, dude, that's such a great point.
Like you need to nail that out the gate.
Don't don't do it like this alpha version.
Yeah, we're, you know, we want to get it out, play with it and
then get your feedback and we're going to keep improving it.
Like I don't think that's the playbook to run there.
I I just my opinion but I I would not do that.
Well, the other thing is like, I, I hate to, I hate to say
this, but like I saw like a post of someone on X the other day
that was like, you know, this is like the, this is like how it's
always been new model drops with mid journey.
And we all like don't like it. And then we all have to spend
time and the people who really spend time will figure it out
and like they'll figure out the prompting style.
It's totally different. I'm like, yeah, but that's when
there was nothing else. That's when there wasn't another
option. And it was like, yeah, and I was
that same person. Like you're probably just not
prompting it, right, because you haven't figured out the new
architecture. I'm like, look at this point,
like I don't have the free time to learn how to control mid
journey when I know I can't do some of the things that I, that
I needed to do. So like I have to spend my time
elsewhere. But that's, that's the point of
all this is that it's it, if it's creative and it's going to
be visual. And if it's the, if the goal is
to just make beautiful things, then like let me control making
beautiful things and not have me figure out how to like hack
around the system to make the beautiful things.
You know what I'm saying? Like that I concur.
Not much else I can add to that. Yeah, I don't want to.
I don't want to have to do like the amount of time we spend with
this three years ago figuring out how to do things.
Rory, you'll never, you'll never in a million years make me
forget the loop around work like work around you you created for
the multiple character consistency.
Yes. For V6, you know, like what's
that V6? I think it's V6 that like that
was just, you know, 'cause it's just like that.
That to me captures so much of where we were at at the time and
how things were for a while. It's just like you and you and I
and people that were using these things, like, we knew how far
they could go. And then we also knew you could
still do things, but it's just such a pain in the ass to get
there, you know? But it was kind of cool and
worth figuring out at the time. And then, yeah, it's just the
reality is like, time's compressing.
You got all these tools now, you know, it's just the workflows
are changing and people, people are exhausted.
I mean, you don't want to have to figure that stuff out at this
at this point in the game. I don't want to.
I also don't want to like when I'm going there to vibe, which
is what I do now is just like, let me go vibe again and like
let me just type some random stuff in, get some cool stuff.
Take that like make directions with it.
Like half the stuff I do on mid journey now is like, let me just
throw in a random idea. Oh, that's cool.
Let me bash it with something else.
All right, cool. Let me have like 17 style
references. See what that does.
Like that's what I want to do. But if that doesn't.
Produce. It's a more simplified.
Yeah, yeah, it's a more simplified.
You're not. You're not expanding yourself to
all the possibilities anymore. You're just trying to get to
where you need to go in a rather easy or efficient way.
And that's that's kind of where I'm at with two.
Like I'm not going to go out of my way to try to figure
something out in mid journey now probably if I can't get it in
the first couple of tries or guesses of what I'm going for.
I just again, yeah, to your point.
But also, if I can't vibe, like if I can't just go in there and
like vibe, create and get stuff the way that I want it to look,
then it's like, what's the point anymore?
You know what I mean? It's like a.
That's what I was doing. Like I would go in there and I
would be like, oh, I just want to create these absolutely
insane, you know, face, you know, face portraits that I can
look at and just be like, this is cool.
I can use these for presentations.
Like this is awesome. Like there's awesome looking
stuff. Like here's like, I'll show you
what, you know, some of this stuff.
Take my mood boards, bash them together.
I don't even know what I'm saying half the time.
I'm like just like take it, run it, remix it, you know, just
hope to get something that's, you know, something a little bit
cooler, like, yeah, cool. Like I can throw that in a
presentation that looks bomb like on screen on a 30 foot
screen, right? Or if I'm going and just like,
where's the rabbit hole of of, you know, the Wabi Sabi guys,
I'm like, oh, I can take these into to nano and then just like
turn this whole character into like something really awesome.
But you know, that's, you know, doing this stuff.
I'm like, I'm just hitting the button.
Go, go, go smash this mood board, change the parameters.
Like I know what it's going to give me.
And like, I want, you know, I want to get something that looks
like that. And it's like awesome.
Like I want to get something that looks like this.
That's awesome. Is that that last one not not
the last, the one before that? This one.
Yeah, that V8 or V7? V7 These are all V7 yeah so like
that, you know I'm like oh let me test the new let me test the
new Niji on some of these things that I like also let me just
throw Niji in there, see how that performs right and it's
like oh that's cool it works. It gives me something super
unique and awesome like this is just one session of me like
vibing. But if I can't control it like
this, like and not control me like if I can't predict somewhat
of the outcome to get it there, then you know, kind of like,
well, if this is what I wanted to do, I just wanted to go and
create like explosion. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Explosion of stuff and tested a million different ways, but if
I'm trying to figure out how to get to that point now where it's
like all right, this isn't working these two mood boards
don't work. I can't use two mood boards.
Why can't I use a style reference with that?
Do I have to use SV6 or SV7? Like there's so many like
barriers to me going to actually do it.
Then it's like, all right, well, you know, I hope this hope this
works. That's that's sort of where I'm
at. It was just like.
There's, there's one other thing on VA right now anyway that I'm
noticed and I'm sure you have two and then we can kind of
pivot from here. But like going through some of
these things, you'll like, you'll see, you'll get some that
feel like perfectly focused and then others that aren't.
And it it's kind of an interesting mix because like the
ones that aren't do do also kind of feel very amateur ish or
realistic in that sense. Like so so this one tacky,
right? Like you tell the focus here,
then there's a little bit of a, a, you know, a fall off here,
right? So this kind of looks like, I
don't know, like an F3 or something like that 2.8 maybe
right where you're getting this in focus, then this and then
there's a big drop off behind. OK, and then you get like
something like this run stills archive, by the way, did that
test. So but like this is a great
shot. But you could tell like this
isn't completely in focus either.
Kind of like that kind of like that.
Like there's, there's parts of that that make me feel like, oh,
this is kind of neat, right? Because you get something like
this and then this, this isn't tacky, you know, super tack
sharp on the focus here, but this feels more believable tack,
you know, not a little bit of blood, right?
Like, so like there's like this mix of some that are super sharp
and others that aren't. And, and I kind of like both of
them in some ways, right? Like this one?
Super sharp. Like that?
Not sharp also feels super kind of like realistic, believable,
same, right? Like, there's there's, there's
our boy, Geez. It's but like that, like I love
that one because that's not, that's not familiar.
Like, that's not a familiar composition that you would get
out of any other tool. Yeah.
You'd never get that that close up crop at the at the shoulders
down in the bottom left corner unless you like engineered a
prompt. Very true, very true.
Yeah, You were factoring in the negative space rule thirds,
which we didn't prompt for, you know, but somebody's turned out
really good. Yeah, like love that.
Like to me, don't think you get that in V7.
That that to me is such a great shot for a lot of different
reasons. I don't know if other people
will see it the same way I do, but just kind of like having
been somebody that has had a camera that will go on the
street and maybe shoot a 16 knot.
You know, just the landscape of somebody that feels like I took
it, took it in the Lightroom or Photoshop, maybe threw a lot on
it. You know, did my sort of post
edits and this is what I got that that looks pretty good.
This looks real. You know, maybe, you know, you
could say it like if we zoom in here, maybe there's some
problems. But I mean, just like from this
standpoint, like very believable.
So I, I like there are some really interesting things about
what I see here with some of this stuff that that make me
feel like there are some good parts of this under the hood.
I think there is. I mean like that, like I love
that. That's.
Yeah. That's all.
The contrast with the with the single point light and some
foreground. Nice little split right here
too, like. They they definitely nail
composition and body because like you'd never get a shot like
this. Even even this, right, like
you're not going to just get that on any model unless you
were saying, you know, you were prompting the type of the shot,
the angle of the shot, the body positioning.
You're right, you're right. You can never like for all.
I love nano right, the amount of effort I have to put into a
prompt to get like someone like even this just like because the
the spacing is non symmetrical, meaning like he's off centered a
little bit to the left. He's very there's not a lot of
negative space on the top. It's cropping out his beard on
the bottom. The guy doesn't want to do that
and his head is angled at the right direction right like to
look real, not like posed. His eyes aren't focused right at
the camera like the hood coming off the back is.
Like, partially. It understands that.
It's a great call out. So like until you've tried to
like really engineer some of the stuff in other platforms, you
realize how hard it is to get this stuff in other platforms,
but. Like this feels this feels this
feels very realistic and different from the realistic of
Nano. And Reeve, Reeve does this well.
Higgs field does this well. Over saturated most of the time,
but like again, like some of this stuff, even from like, I
can't tell you how many times I had like that like a body
positioning like even if her face is screwed up, like to like
you have to describe every little piece of the yeah, the
body. No facial expression prompt in
here. Yeah, you know nothing about
looking away from the camera eye.
Direction somewhere new mouth. We didn't just get the the, you
know, the neutral face that we, you know, yeah, you know, this
feels like. So much and This is why it's so
hard to be like, can you just do what I want?
Yeah. I thought this was kind of a
cool angle too, like close-ups profile, you know, three
quarter, you know, like just hadn't seen that in another
model. Minimal negative space.
It also gets like that, that sort of like chest like mid.
There's not a lot of the other tools that get the like the
chest high, low angle like well, I don't even know what that
shots called like when you're when you're in tight wide angle
lens, but close probably like right up at the chest looking
upward with like a very like. Maybe like a hero shot or like
cowboy shot maybe or something, Yeah.
But it's but it's from like the chest high like it's it's a
close up, just like if you're tilting the camera down because
it's it's something you see in a lot of movies, but you never
really see it. Like I don't really get it in so
hard to get in nano or sea dream or you know, any of the other
ones that I use. But it's tough.
It's tough, like it's some of this stuff is so good, but you
just like want it to work the way you want it to work.
Yeah, something else with it. But yeah, we drew and I were
like, yeah, we'll go. We'll do this stuff for like
we'll do mid journey for like 20 minutes and here we are an hour
and just complain. Yeah, yeah.
I think the other thing is like we've got and maybe maybe we
just split into another episode, but I mean, we've got we've got
some interesting Claude stuff we've been doing too.
I know people listening to this have been probably going deep on
some of the stuff as well. I think even without you know,
me and you, we've both been busy.
You've been traveling, you know, I haven't even caught up with
you on on the clawed stuff that you're doing.
I know you've probably got some interesting things.
I know I do. It could be cool to share that
and and kind of show you guys some of that stuff to kind of
get that ball rolling too. And I mean, there's just so
we're in such an interesting time, you know, there, you know,
because it's just like Rory, I mean, like, I didn't know
anything about building a Chrome extension or, you know, you
know, yeah. Or, you know, building a website
where I didn't have to like, you know, save every change I made
and, you know, the back of ACMS, you know, yeah.
Just like, it's crazy. It's crazy.
And it definitely deserves some time to shine.
It's The thing is like it's the Claude code is the best and
worst thing that's ever happened to me.
Like the best thing that's ever happened from like getting stuff
done. The worst thing that's happened
in terms of like I just. I'm.
Go touch grass, brother. Exactly like consumed with like
what I can do now. It's bad, yeah.
It kind of feels like early days of mid journey.
We just can't put it down, just can't put it down, you know,
and, and then, you know, like I, I don't know about you, but it's
like I'm on the $200 Claude plant.
I mean, I, yeah, I tried the one.
I, you know, I'm like maxing out at 11:00.
I'm just like, I have no choice. But even with the two, it's like
I still would pay, I would probably pay $1000 a month for
this based on the current return.
Like it I would strongly consider like how would you
operate with. I'm glad they haven't done that,
but it's like I'll even the two, I'll bite on that.
I mean, it's just like this is everything that I'm doing now, I
mean. Well, it's insane.
And then I run everything that I build in clawed to a GitHub
repost so that I can do the same thing on codec simultaneously.
So I can do double the work and then probably open up a clawed
browser and work in there also and then open up a ChatGPT
browser and work in there also. It's like, you know, because you
start to see what it can. ADHD is it's just going to kill
us. It's going to be the end of us,
yes. It's a total dumb one that for
the presentation last week, something that you you probably
don't need, but just knowing that it's used that you can do
this stuff like I never even thought to do it was I designed
all my slides in Figma. Why don't do you want to do you
want to show one? Why don't we just both show one
or, you know, one thing, since we're kind of like getting close
to time and then we can do a deeper dive on it.
But I think it like we should show it.
I mean, I I would like to see what you have been doing as well
and you want. To see the chaos.
Yeah, I mean, it's all chaos at this point, brother.
I mean, even even just the clawed desktop app where you've
got just three different windows with chat Co working code like
I, I forget which which one I've got that conversation in, you
know, and it's like I'm in the same tool.
I'm not even in a different LM. I can't even remember where I'm
at. Hold on, let me stop sharing for
a second because I totally forgot where I'm at.
Also, where is my hold on? Is this it?
Yes. All right.
So funny enough, I had Claude just spin up a little like like
a little central hub for me to just like have all my things so
I can see it of what I've built and like, it's all this stuff.
It's all useful. Like that's The thing is that
like I have I've just been building in a different way
maybe than, you know, thought about it in the past, Like I've
been building all these individual, like every time I
run something and I know I'm going to do it again.
Skill. Right into a.
Skill, How's it? But then I then I strip it and
abstract it so it make everything sort of generic so
that like I just keep putting these skills in a pool.
And then I have a little orchestrator agent that like
takes my ideas of what I need to do for something like here's the
project that I'm working on. It's like, OK, let's deploy this
skill, this skill, this skill, this skill.
And because I've built, I've done like a sort of like a agent
builder constitution. Like this is how I like to build
them. This is how things like
typically run. This is how I like stuff to
flow. This is what's worked in the
past. So it like in reference that and
then go to like pull all of my skills and then be like, Oh,
this is the ones that I need. It's like a, you know, like
you're, you're like a general contractor on like a
construction job and it's like, oh, we need to go get the
carpenters and, you know, the cement guys and right to do this
job. But you know, then once this,
once we start like doing stuff, like once I, I started building
more and more and more than it was like, Oh, I've created these
sort of pipelines where it's for one thing, but a reviews it
reviews everything we do after it's done.
Like can this be like a replicable pipeline?
And then we just stash it. So it becomes like a workflow,
like one there, one there, one there, right.
And there's all these other little tools that I've built
like, oh dude, sick one. If anyone wants to, you know,
have you ever had to use like the sketchy, the sketchy
downloaders on like for like Instagram videos or YouTube or
whatever, things like that. No, more like you can just drop
like dump a URL quad do that. It's insane.
But you know, I have I have all these things that then are
working for for client stuff like, you know, taking client
briefs and, you know, basically unwinding them into code so that
they can be spit into the rest of the pipelines output.
Same stuff. They're like a hat that they
keep building all these things that I use like everyday.
But the one thing that I will say that's super damn cool is I
started at like, have you have you ever asked Claude how it how
it likes information? Oh yeah, dude.
I, I, I think if you're not using the LLM to give its
recommendations, preferences, optimization, you know, like if
you're not asking those questions, you're missing
probably 90% of the value. Like I mean.
Any any skill that I even consider adding Now I have a
comb through audit all my existing skills.
Does this overlap contradict or is it objectively better than
the current skill that I have for this?
Rate them on a scale of zero to 10 based on quality optimization
of the you know of the skill blah blah blah.
On a scale of 1 to 10, which is better objectively?
I love using objectively. Yeah, I'm, I'm not looking for
opinions here. I wanted to use, you know, data,
hard facts, you know, so, so then it's like, OK.
And then, you know, like there's also a nice little strategy I
have where it's like if I'm building anything that is useful
and, and maybe it, let's just say it's a skill and I download
it and it, I run it through an audit.
It's like this skill is like a six.
It's like, Oh, well, what would bring this to A10, right?
And then like, let's just build that, right?
And then I'm just going to build my own skill, you know, because
you, you know, because obviously like you can give it all the
information on GitHub of what's in the file so it, so it can go
and do that. I'm actually surprised that
there are so many bad skills out there.
And I, I, I just, I did a post on this on LinkedIn this week
where it's just like you're, you need to audit the skills that
you have. Because like my first, one of my
first things that I did when I was getting started with is I
was just like adding skills. I'm just like, oh, OK, Like the
more skills like these specific things I add, probably the
better. I'll just kind of figure it out.
But then, you know, you get to a point where it's like, I should
probably check on this. And, you know, that's where you
really get into this, this interesting, you know, thing
there. I mean, and then the other like
just, I use that whole LLM asking thing like to your point,
and I know you're doing this, I'm not preaching to you, but I
would say if you're not doing this, you're missing a bunch,
right? Because it's even like I had all
my user preferences or the custom instructions built out
really deep. And it's like, Nah, man, you've
already got all of that in your, your clawed MD.
It's better there. This is what you should actually
have. And you know, and you've got
duplicates. This one actually isn't even
doing anything. You should delete that, right?
Because you only have so many characters that fit in.
So I mean, it's just like that whole, that whole quality check
with anything I'm doing is happening with, with the LLM
directly. I know you're using it that way.
I'm just saying like, if you're not, that is one of the biggest
piece of advice that I, that I could give you, you know, like
when it, when it comes to that and I don't know, man, it's just
fascinating. I, I think like probably the
coolest thing I'm, I'm creating right now that feels like it's
getting close to being done is probably like I'm calling it the
ghost system. So it's basically like a writing
operating system because I'm tired of the AI writing and
people don't even know, but they're still publishing stuff.
I can, I can tell I'm I've, I've been in content my entire
marketing life. I love to write.
My original major was journalism.
I read, right. I just see patterns.
I see patterns. And so it got me thinking I was.
Like it's this. Right, so that was like one of
the first patterns and then I was, you know, then I just kept
digging. I was like, one of the things am
I noticing here? I start collecting all these
these ideas, right? And it's just like, yeah, it's
instead of like, like I need to be thinking about these as
patterns to weigh against, right?
And then if I can basically, you know, codify or, or call these
patterns by name and provide examples and I've got those
things. And then like that's one part of
this ghost system is essentially what it does is allows me to
write with my voice or any other voice profile that I've built.
And so that's a whole nother layer of this because the voice
profile that takes a lot of optimization.
You can feed it posts and stuff, but that's like one part that
will do something. It's not going to fix the AI
writing. So it's like, you know, I I went
through I created like this 22. It's 22 layers of a voice
profile that I've created for myself and then also other
people that I like to write. So I can also call on these
other voice profiles ways against the patterns.
You know, it basically has its own self loop and audit, you
know, that it goes through checking against I've, I've, you
know, I've got hooks, I've got templated architecture of posts.
It runs this pre front flight checklist, right?
Like it goes through all this and basically just allows me to
basically copy and paste, you know, at this point.
And that's where I'm trying to get, because that's such a big
problem for anybody. And I'm just, I'm interested
enough to kind of pursue it. And I've almost, I've almost got
it there. So that's like the one I'm
excited about the most because like even all the things that
I've done, I've seen other people start to like, I've seen
other people try to do this. And again, I'll run that same
experiment with the LLMO, say, here's everything they're,
they've got. Here's their file.
You got mine without bias, right?
Go through grade each. Why is why is 1 better than the
other? What are the strengths or the
weaknesses? Is there anything I could steal
from this that would objectively make mine better?
Is there anything I should add, subtract, change based off like
blah blah blah. So I'm using all this
information to weigh against each other.
So that one's really cool. I think like if I were to show
something that's probably more finished, like I just spun up a
basically like a calendly replacement in a day.
I pay 12 bucks a month, you know, tired of doing that.
So basically created this in a day, you know, so I've got all
this and I've got like, I created this really cool.
You know, I just call it perch. Got this bird that flies down
right? Like goes to, goes to wherever I
want, like, and then I can just click this, you know, it's got
my calendar in there, you know, and boom, fill this out.
Done checked it, you know, went, went through the APIs, the
authorization works, saving 144 bucks a year just from that,
right? Like, so it's like this mindset
of which again, I know you're thinking this way, but like, why
do I need to pay for some of these simpler tools when I can
spin them up in a day? And if I'm using them a lot,
it's even more important that I try to do this not only from the
replacement side to see if it's possible, but to also like level
up and put in reps in this stuff, right?
Because we're learning this stuff as we do these projects.
And for me, this is like a fun one.
I was like, I wonder if I could do that.
Yep, you know, and then you get down to the perfectionist of it
and you're like, I want to do this and do that.
But this is, this is really cool stuff because it's like, I'm
canceling Calendly today. I don't need it.
And somebody's like, well, what if you you know, you run into,
you know, you got an error and it's like, well I don't have to
submit a ticket then this is running the same APII can just
fix it in two seconds, right? Like yes, this is the worst AI
is going to be right now. I mean, I can just feed this to
to Claude and say something's not working.
It fixes it in 2 minutes. What are we talking about?
So. It's interesting because people
were like, why aren't you building like a UXUI around what
you're doing? And I'm like, I don't have time
to, to screw with the visual design.
I just want everything running on folders and it runs exactly
the what it should. Like that's that's I'm just like
some of the some of these tools and pipelines and agents and
like like workflow automations that have built for Claws.
It's like, yeah, it'd be so cool to see that in a like a website
wrapper. I'm like, I don't, I don't need
it in a website wrapper. I just need it to just go.
I don't want to deal with the with the bugs of I mean, I
should change the color. Like I just, it's too much time
now. It's just like it all runs on
text files, everything. And I feel like a psychopath,
but it's like I have this whole infrastructure built out and
it's all in the living ecosystem, which I love.
It's just like. That's that's the fun.
We're like all creating our own ecosystems, our own operating
systems that are customizable, personalized to us.
And it do for like all these jobs, like for the work that I'm
doing. And it just keeps like self
optimizing and getting better to where I don't have to do the one
thing that's super important to me with the skills and like the
markdown files and you know, the architecture files and roster
files, all that thing, all those things that Claude will build is
that you can go into and just start another project and it has
context already. Like it already knows what
you're trying to do. You don't have to re explain the
project. Yes, that's that's also been a
nice like thing that I've learned along the way is just
like the valuable nature of these markdown files because
it's like you can also just create all this information like
even for your clients, the contacts that you have at that
client, the emails you've exchanged, right, all those
comms, right, You've got connections to Slack and Notion
now. I mean, so you you really have
this person that understands some of the relationships that
you have as well. So that's been really
interesting. I was just going to show this
one other thing. Created these like Chrome
extensions too. Again like an hour each that I
thought was just like super interesting.
So if I go on Pinterest like if you upload a pin.
Yeah. It's going to ask you for alt
text. And I'm just thinking, OK, if
I'm Pinterest, like how good of quality are we getting from
users who don't know what alt text is right to to put in this
information versus like, why don't I package that into
something that can just create this?
So I bet I did all all this is is I have this here, I can click
this, it's going to create the alt text copy paste.
And this is for accessibility SEO, right?
Like boom, copy done. I could take that in, right.
So it's just like a little concept idea.
And then, you know, I was thinking like also, I can't
currently download anything that's in a board.
So if I go into anything now, just call this, right, they just
don't download board option. But like, what if we want these
images for style references or a mood board, right?
Like that'd be nice if we didn't have to click through each one.
I can just click this downloads the whole board instantly,
right? Same quality.
Then it's going to put it in a zip file right on my computer
and like we're done. That's you know.
That's part of it. Now that's the you did the the
first portion of this. Now what what I've been doing
with that is like, let's just say that was 800 images.
Like the one of the pipelines I run is like these, this like
bulk forensics where it'll take that 800 images, run it through
like 60 points of like image extraction, like what it's doing
like all basically ripping apart every little piece of it to find
like the data. Then it'll take that data, throw
it into like a basically like a clustering sort of mechanism
where it'll be like, OK, now we have this is, you know, dark and
Moody. This is whatever.
This is like creating like little recipes for it.
Then it'll strip like anything that is related to, you know,
brand colors, whatever, like that just like makes it
templatized, which then I've run it to system prompt builder,
which then goes and this is all happening like simultaneously as
it goes to the workflow. And then my nano agent goes and
creates it and fine tunes it, pop it into, you know, whatever
I need to for weavey workflows for brand content for whatever.
And then it's like done. And I just synthesized 800
images real quick and I can set this up for brands, whether that
comes from all right here is it works the same way with if I put
brand guidelines and it takes a brand guideline, strips them
out, then goes to the, you know, system prompt building, then it
goes to the, the sort of like the checker.
And then I go plug it in and it works like I can take anything,
take anything, break it apart, put it back together and use it
for whatever system I'm trying to do.
So it's like whether that's video, whether that's images,
whether that's text, whether that's whatever, it's sick.
Because then that's also redeployable though, like I
don't have to. So I see all these like N8 N
workflows out there and it's all like, it's all like linear, like
everything has to go through every piece of the pipeline,
even if you have information already, but you don't want to
run the whole thing. And if one thing breaks, the
whole thing breaks. Whereas.
The the skills files do the same thing, but they don't all have
to be used the same time and it don't all have to be used in
this one particular sequence. So then it can just like sort of
route and pick up what it needs to to come back.
But this is like, here's a here's a dumb one.
This one was so stupid, but like, I didn't know that it
could do this. Where I designed my presentation
slides in Figma. When I put videos in there, I
round the edges because that fits the rest of my
presentation. Everything else is rounded
edges. Yeah, whenever you go on stage,
they can never use Figma. So I have to put everything in
PowerPoint, right? PowerPoint can't round the
edges. And I was like, I'm gonna kill
somebody. I have like 30.
Degrees in here, of course. I have to reformat everything.
So I was just like dumped in like a bulk file, like a bulk
folder to claw. It was like, can you round the
edges by 30° on each of these? And then like we can output.
It was just like, yeah, sure. Like stupid things like that
where it would have taken me. It's amazing.
Forever. It's amazing.
This was the, this was the one last thing I wanted to show you
before when I was saying something about asking the LLMS
how they like stuff, right? I've just been, I think I've
been neglecting this my entire time using LLMS was like, you
know, when you're like, OK, here's all my context.
Here's like 6 PDFs, whatever this, that, so on, so forth.
And it's like, yeah, take all this and do something with it.
And it's just like, yeah, dude, I got you right.
I keep you asking you like, how do you like to ingest things?
Like what's the easiest way for you to read, retrieve, catalog,
whatever. And it keeps going like, you
know, like, you know, I like it the way that, you know, you do
whatever. No, I'm like, no, optimized for
you. Best like option you're ever
going to use. However you would build
something. So like it told me might tell
someone else something else. It was like, I like notion.
I'm like, interesting, didn't know why that's the case because
like I'm giving it spreadsheets and it's like, I actually like
Notion better. I'm like, that's, that's cool
because this is one of the one of the pipelines I run, which is
ad template extraction. So I can basically like create
like formats and things from ads that I like and I can do in bulk
or I can do it one by one. But regardless, I'm asking to
build it self optimized. So if like if speed was a thing
and understanding was a thing, how would ping back and forth
between Notion and my conversation the quickest?
And it pulled it. It like really went through like
a pretty extensive process building this out with the
tagging and the way that everything's located in here.
But not only that, building sub pages for each with more full
context. Plus like, like, like Jason
templates, things like that, The creative, like giving itself an
easy way to read things, which I would have never, I've never
built this, like I would never build it like this or think to
build it like this. I just give it a spreadsheet,
right. Then it's like, yeah, I spend
more time figuring out like how and why you formatted the
spreadsheet like this than I do actually reading the
information. And I was like, that's a great
point because that's, you know, you get a spreadsheet from
someone you never worked with before.
It's like, well, why is it, why does it look like this?
I probably wouldn't have done it this way.
And so like, we'll just what's the easiest way for you?
And it's like, well, this way, like why?
Definitely never would have created that known how to create
that. But like, that's the interesting
part is that they're probably not asking it well enough how it
likes to receive shit instead of like just giving it like data
prep becomes everything. Then like how do you like a
folder of images? Do you like them with dating
conventions? Do you like them?
You know, in separate folders based on category?
Like and then what? But then also how much do you
like it? Is that a preference or is it
objectively helpful for me to do?
Because that's that's also a difference.
You could you could say I like this, but is there any benefit
of me doing it that way? Well, I don't know, right.
So it's like you got to, you even got to go deeper than that
because it's like, OK, like, yeah, you may like it that way,
but that maybe there's not any meat behind the way that you
like that, right? But I think that's, that's the
that's the good point. Like that's, that's the part of
this. That's really, it's just like
the, the more reps you're putting into this, the more you
sort of really understand, I guess, like what it what it does
prefer in certain certain aspects, right?
And then also certain I would think like trigger words or even
phrases with with how you prompt, right?
Like it still matters. I don't think prompt engineering
is a thing, but like, right, like you can even just give it
your idea. It's as simple as just what you
want to do. And then just hey, like I want
you to take this and I want you to turn this into objectively
the best optimized prompt possible for you, right?
And you can ask me any clarifying questions you want
before we do that and then feed it back to me, right?
And then that like prompt is going to 10X whatever the fuck
you were going to put in, you know?
So it's just, I think that iterative component and kind of
like that's been sort of like the theme that we've been
talking about through here is don't sleep on that.
Don't sleep on that at all. It's it's so like this is where
the craziness goes. It's like, it's like clod
psychosis because it also goes and like once you get there, I
built what I wanted, but we could also do this in your ear.
And I'm like, don't tell me that dude.
I don't want you to tell me that we can do more because I will do
more. Like stop, stop being so
objectively. You like that use of that word
persuasive because I know you're doing it to get me to spend more
tokens. But it is also like addicting
where I'm like, I do just want it.
Yes, I do want to do more. Yes, I could make this better.
Yes, I know that's not the end of the rabbit hole, but it like
it's just like a little whisper. It's like everything you've
built here today was great and then it's like drop at the
bottom. Let me know if you want to
really blow this out like tomorrow or something like that.
Don't do that. Of course I do don't.
Don't tease me. Like me.
Yeah, like I've noticed ChatGPT does that now.
ChatGPT 5.4, it drops like hooks at the end, you know, it'll drop
like hook at the end of your message.
Like it's like that was really cool, but you know, there's two
other things that would be really cool and you're like,
why? Yeah, I was doing car research
on it the other day and it was like, yes, this meets all your
specifications, but there's also two other cars that meet your
specifications. Would you like to continue?
I was like, you're hooking me to spend more tokens right now.
Yeah, like that's I I'm in marketing.
I know what you're doing. Did I push?
Yes, 100%. But did I know what you were
doing? Yes, Also.
So he's they're, they're just manipulating us.
It's. Like they are, they are.
It's just funny. They're like, just watch all
these dumb monkeys, just like, you know, keep pushing the
button and we'll just, you know, act like we're doing something
and we're not right. Yeah.
It's like making it overly complex for them.
Then they'll have to go unwind the the the spider.
Web they're gonna Yep Yep I hate like there there are times where
it's like you like I'm just you know yes this is ready to push
OK, push up Nope getting in there oh OK, push up Nope still
getting this air it's like no just I need you before you do
tell me to push anything there needs to be a self audit loop
that you're doing because I'm not I'm tired of running into
these back and forth with you right like even stuff like that
can be helpful but I would like spend for people that spend time
with these these markdown files like that's that's where all
this stuff is coming from and so if you optimize those and you
can really personalize those and customize those to the way that
you use it like I just think that that is a great starting
point because that is where everything is coming from right
like spend time on that that's going to you know be one of the
biggest things to affect output quality besides what you're
prompting in because at least it has a lens to operate within so.
The other thing I didn't know, it's like you just keep finding
things that are possible. Like I built a custom node for
Weevie the other day with clog, didn't know that was possible,
but it was like backdoor to didn't through replicate where
you can import models into Weevie.
And I was like, wait, if I can build a mod, if I can build a
node for replicate, that means I can bring it into Weevie.
And it was like, it was like, oh, you want to do this?
I'm like, yeah, just do some deep research on how to build
nodes for which. And then we just did that.
Which which, which that that exact thought like gets me right
now is just like, how are product teams adapting to this?
Because you can present visual workable MVPS same day and then
decide if you're going to put them in the product like just
like you did. What's stopping you from like,
hey, weevie, I just did this. Like, can we like, can we get it
here, Take it. Or, you know, if you're working
inside the company, right, like just the workflow has changed
completely, I think from that product, because it's like, is
this like if you have consensus on if an idea is worth exploring
or it's cool or could be functional, like helpful to your
audience, why not explore? You can.
It's it's time to that MVP is so flat.
So it was just, it's, it's just doesn't make any sense as to how
easy it is. Like sometimes I run tasks with
Claude or codecs and think it's going to take like 30 minutes
and it's done in like like maybe 90 seconds.
And what in what world should that take 90 seconds?
Like it doesn't make it blows my mind because then it's like, Oh
yeah, I'll go do more. But then you never stop.
Then you never stop doing anymore.
So anyone who's watching this right now and you're starting to
see like Drew and I start to start to drift down a, you know,
a never ending path. And this is like the, this is
like the event horizon before we actually are just like come back
here every week. And it's just like the the bags
and the eyes are bigger. So I feel right now, bloodshot.
Yeah. Also, I got to get AI, got to
give a shout out before we get out of here.
My boys, we're going to the Elite 8.
I'm dude that way. Like I, I was up till 'cause you
know, Illinois played Houston, game started like 1010, game got
over at like 12:30, you know, and then you're, you're so hyped
up on adrenaline, whether you lose or win, that's like, I
can't go to bed right now. Like I got to soak up the post
game. I got to like hear what people
are saying. I think I got to bed.
Yeah, yeah, I think I got to bed at 3:30, you know, and then I
had to wake up at 7:00, you know, I was just like, OK, here
we go, man. I haven't done this in a while,
but you're right though, like this whole thing is, it's very
addicting. I think at the same time though,
just like with the mid journey AI image stuff, AI video, you
know, like there is a window here to capitalize on this from,
you know, it's not only fun and we're curious, but like the
majority of the population is not doing what you, I, our
listeners are doing. Like we got to remember that
we're in a little bit of a bubble and I'm me and you are
not experts when you take into account the top level of people
doing this shit. But in our general circles and
communities, we probably are. We, I mean, we, we are right.
Like, so this is they're like, this is an awesome time to
explore. And we talked about this too
when we were doing your like, when you showed us like,
remember when you're doing like the Google tools and all that,
like it was just like, yeah, this is the time.
Like this is the time to be playing with that stuff.
And yeah, it's just exciting to now I don't have to worry about
running into a an obstacle that I don't feel like I can get
around or is too big of a pain in the ass to get around
anymore. Because now, look, I'm not a
coding terminal guy expert, but anytime I get stuck, I can just
screenshot what I have, what do I do next, what I do next, what
I do now. I mean, that's that's just an
amazing thing. You know, that's just amazing
thing. Dude also wait before we go.
Speaking of, shout out friend of the show Billy Bowman.
Don't know if you saw the PR stunts.
What's going on, Billy Bowman? Viral as hell, Billy.
Hold on. Let's let's pull it up for
everyone who's been here for a long enough time, our friend.
He's been grinding. Our friend Billy Bowman.
He's been grinding. His own Hollywood sign In
Hollywood. They actually put this up in
front of the Hollywood in front of the Hollywood.
Oh, this is a, so this is like a partnership, like brand
collaboration kind of thing, OK. So he's he's now live on, live
on Fiverr doing AI directing. So you can hire him to to do
stuff, but they put a ton of money behind this.
How about that? What a what a guerrilla
marketing publicity's done to put this on the highway right
over the in front of the Hollywood sign.
How? Many followers, have you gained
from that or people at least visiting your profile?
That would be nuts to see the data.
He's on like local. He's on like local LA news and
like. No shit.
OK, cool. That's so cool.
It's. Which begs the question, Rory,
Yeah. Why can't we just create our own
signs and find somebody that is willing to let us put them up?
And that is your own growth strategy right there.
Like how much you gonna pay for the sign?
How much that's you know, it's probably less than 1000 bucks.
Have a good relationship with somebody that's got a prime real
estate, maybe pay them as a daily fee to have it up and
let's see what kind of data you get.
Like I bet you'd get deals. Out of that I mean instant 100%
like everyone who's driving by sitting in traffic.
Just like why is there an ad who is?
Billy Bowman. That's what, you know, that's
what we did. We, we just.
Yeah. That's cool, Super cool.
I made AI made like a picture of a girl holding a sign up in
front of the Hollywood Hills. Like who TF is Billy Bowman?
Send it to him. You need stuff like this.
That's awesome. That's awesome, man.
But figured we had to shout out friend of the friend of the
show, friend of the you know, one of the original might have
been the 1st guest. Was he?
The first he was the first he. Might have been Chris.
Chris was the first one, Billy was the second.
So that's we had to throw that one out there and probably have
to get him back on soon to, to just it's so funny that he's the
one that got it because he's the very, very vocal on on social
media. He's very.
He's, he's really been consistent invisible with his
posting. I remember when he first started
kind of posting on LinkedIn consistently and I was like,
that's good. And he's, he hasn't stopped.
And then he's doing all the stuff he's been doing, working
on, you know, he's got really good projects at clients.
And then he was doing things like some teaching at a school
where he's at like some sort of like cohort in person with the
AI stuff. And I mean, he's, he's, he's
been in it, he's been in a deep and it's cool.
It's like, it's just cool to see like, you know, the people that
have been kind of at this for a while.
And then, you know, just the opportunities that come just
from like being consistent, you know, and.
Yeah. And then our boys, you know,
it's like so weird, the people that have been in this for the
longest, like there was a the X competition for the Super Bowl
where it was like the Super Bowl at 4X and it was like Dave
Clark. Everybody we, everybody we know,
yeah. 22 dudes who we know won $1 million and 500,000.
Dollars, right? Like, right, it's like, OK,
people that we've talked to this entire time taking grenades in
the trenches with like, like everyone hating on us for a
couple years to now it's like, Oh yeah, we just entered a
contest to win 1,000,000 bucks because you know, you know what
to do I'm not. I wish I could do that, but I'm
not a talented filmmaker. I make.
Yeah, I, I like and that's the thing, right?
Like I, I think, like for me, I was thinking, I, I, I've felt
this way for a while where it was like, I, I feel behind on
the video stuff, but I just just genuinely didn't want to spend a
lot more time with it. And that's OK, right?
Like we all have different areas that, that we like.
There are plenty of niches within this, right?
And it's just like I'm a lean into the things I really want to
do. There's just enough space for
that, you know, like I, I don't want to be hired for a project
where I got to create a minute long video using AI like I could
I do it? Yes.
Would I do it for the right price?
Probably, but I'm not going to enjoy it.
I'm not going to enjoy it at all, you know, and, and so I
think it's like again, like going back to your Ikagai,
right, where you're finding the things that you love to do that
are fun but also can get you paid, you know, and.
Speaking of that, if anyone does own any billboard space, now
that you're listening, we'll throw up a journey.
Fast hours billboard. Anyone wants to donate for, you
know, a week or two of visibility just for a social
test just to see if we get any, any, any life from that.
Would love to. I'm, I'm a big fan of like
stickers on like poles and stuff like that and like people who do
that stuff on 'cause I, I. I'm with the boards.
I do, I'm with you. I think that's, I think, I think
it's been coming back, but I think it's going to continue to
be coming back here further. Because now you've got right,
like again, if for as many people are that are going to
pursue the AI side of things, there's going to be the other
crowd that, you know, that where those just in person old school
nostalgic things feel just as valuable, if not more valuable
than they ever have. You know, same with like actual
photography and you know, I, I love the Billboard idea.
I think billboard ideas though. Well, you guys might see us on
a, you know, not going to be on the mountainside in the
Hollywood Hills, but we might be, you know, maybe we'll be.
Billy will cut us. We'll have to get Billy on the
negotiation. Slap a mid journey fast hours
sticker right on that sign. Dude, we're coming.
We're coming for it. But let's let's wrap this.
Wrap it up, man. Just jump on another call here.
Hey, good episode. I mean, like I don't I don't
know that we're like based on how deep we went on mid year, I
don't think we were thinking we were gonna go too deep on the
claw. So I'm glad we got to show you
guys a few things. I think if we obviously can go
deeper on that, we'll see if anything changes between now and
next week with mid journey or any of the other models, like
just game changing stuff. RIP Sora, by the way.
And yeah, we'll go from there, man.
But it's good to be back. Good to good to see you.
And it's just been too long. So glad we we're able to to kind
of sync up and and deliver for this for you guys.
Hopefully it was helpful and continue to let us know what you
think about V8 as well. You know, I know there's a lot
of things that are fluid with it right now, but like, are there
any insights that you've seen that we didn't mention that you
don't think a lot of people know about?
Drop them. Curious, you know.
Drop them and we have to reduce this algorithm because we've
been off for a couple weeks. So we we'll be back on here,
which means also, if you're still here, like subscribe, tell
your mother, tell your friends, tell your dog, tell your we're
we're having a got. TSA agent, if they're still
there, you know TSA. Agent, tell your tell your I
don't know dog Walker. Tell your local coffee shop
owner. I think we, I think we got all
the dog walkers. Now, yeah, I think we got them
all. Hell yeah.
Bye. So well.
Our brother, Yeah. Good to see you, man.
We'll see you guys in the next one.
Thanks for joining us. See you.