1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:03,600 All right, so I'm here with my friend Akshay, who is a very 2 00:00:03,600 --> 00:00:05,920 senior person at the Solana Foundation. 3 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:08,520 As you guys may know, Solana over the last year or so has 4 00:00:08,520 --> 00:00:12,120 sort of risen to become arguably the number three coin in the 5 00:00:12,120 --> 00:00:15,520 world from essentially a standing start launched in 2020 6 00:00:15,760 --> 00:00:18,600 in the depths of COVID, basically right as COVID was 7 00:00:18,600 --> 00:00:20,120 getting locked down with starting. 8 00:00:20,240 --> 00:00:22,840 Thank you for having me, Balaji. Yes, you know, it's funny that 9 00:00:22,960 --> 00:00:26,320 during the March crashes when actually the main net, March 10 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:29,720 2020 crashes when the main net launched in the back of people 11 00:00:29,720 --> 00:00:32,800 basically saying you should wait, wait it out for markets to 12 00:00:33,000 --> 00:00:36,280 get better and things like this. But yeah, it's been quite a 13 00:00:36,280 --> 00:00:37,960 while right since then. Hey, Lily. 14 00:00:38,240 --> 00:00:40,040 What's up guys? Hey. 15 00:00:40,160 --> 00:00:42,560 Hey, Lily. So we're with the network school 16 00:00:42,560 --> 00:00:44,360 audience. She's a hardened veteran of both 17 00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:48,440 the US and Chinese and now European Texians and very senior 18 00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:52,040 at Solana. Last year I think you flipped 19 00:00:52,280 --> 00:00:54,760 Ethereum indexes and your number one indexes. 20 00:00:55,080 --> 00:00:56,560 Yeah, that's right. Depending on what? 21 00:00:56,720 --> 00:00:58,840 Like if you're looking at dex volume, that's right. 22 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:02,440 That's right. And I think on the order of 7500 23 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:05,360 developers in 2024, which actually more than Ethereum, so 24 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:08,480 new dabs are going into Solana rather than Ethereum. 25 00:01:08,760 --> 00:01:12,760 You had the Visa deal, PayPal deal, Google Cloud deal, a few 26 00:01:12,760 --> 00:01:14,960 other deals I think of as fairly significant. 27 00:01:15,400 --> 00:01:17,360 Token extensions are a big thing, right? 28 00:01:17,640 --> 00:01:22,800 Where you went from just normal send and receive to confidential 29 00:01:22,800 --> 00:01:26,640 transfers and like triggers and hooks that you could run on 30 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:28,280 token sends, if I'm not mistaken. 31 00:01:28,280 --> 00:01:30,320 Then there was the fired answer thing. 32 00:01:30,320 --> 00:01:33,000 So you basically rebuilt the validator so you can blast 33 00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:35,120 through more transactions per second. 34 00:01:35,320 --> 00:01:37,760 Now deepen, like I'd like you to talk about this. 35 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:39,920 This is like decentralized physical infrastructure 36 00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:42,280 networks. I've been kind of skeptical 37 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:45,560 about this broadly, but I'd love to hear, let's talk about that 38 00:01:45,560 --> 00:01:47,720 in a bit. Desai, of course, decentralized 39 00:01:47,720 --> 00:01:49,960 science. And then there's some stuff like 40 00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:53,080 AI agents and futures. Is that a roughly good summary 41 00:01:53,080 --> 00:01:55,440 of like the last year or so? Anything else you'd add to that? 42 00:01:55,800 --> 00:01:59,040 Yeah, I think that captures quite a lot of what what is 43 00:01:59,040 --> 00:02:00,680 happening on chain. Essentially it's like a high 44 00:02:00,680 --> 00:02:03,800 performance engine for you to build anything from consumer 45 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:08,759 apps to, you know, trading applications to, as you said, 46 00:02:09,039 --> 00:02:12,960 there's some of some of these more bespoke decentralized 47 00:02:12,960 --> 00:02:14,200 physical infrastructure networks. 48 00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:15,720 We can talk about that if you like. 49 00:02:15,720 --> 00:02:19,480 But basically it's the ability to use crypto incentives to 50 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:23,240 bootstrap physical infrastructure or you know, 51 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:25,000 these sort of networks, if you will. 52 00:02:25,120 --> 00:02:28,440 I think the using crypto incentives to bootstrap sort of 53 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:31,200 physical infrastructure or marketplaces are an alternative 54 00:02:31,200 --> 00:02:33,840 to using venture capital, right? And because venture capital is 55 00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:37,000 abundant in the 20 tens because of low interest rates, you sort 56 00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:39,560 of were able to throw a lot of money at these marketplace style 57 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:41,840 companies. Whereas, you know, in a world 58 00:02:41,840 --> 00:02:44,680 where you don't have infinite venture capital, you may need 59 00:02:44,680 --> 00:02:48,240 the participants of the network that you're building to accept 60 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:50,080 essentially ownership in the network. 61 00:02:50,080 --> 00:02:51,480 Take some risk to build those out. 62 00:02:51,760 --> 00:02:54,160 So an example of this would be something like Hive Mapper 63 00:02:54,160 --> 00:02:58,080 where, you know, these are these folks who are driving to work 64 00:02:58,080 --> 00:03:00,960 every day or, you know, they're maybe professionally driving on 65 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:03,400 Uber. They, you know, buy and install 66 00:03:03,400 --> 00:03:07,680 a dashboard camera and that dashboard camera maps the roads 67 00:03:07,680 --> 00:03:11,920 in real time, giving you this sort of crowd sourced map 68 00:03:12,320 --> 00:03:15,040 mapping data that insurance companies can use, real estate 69 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:17,080 companies can use. It's sort of like a lot of these 70 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:20,280 enterprise use cases for real time mapping. 71 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:24,160 And today the yeah, Google Street views as old as sometimes 72 00:03:24,160 --> 00:03:28,320 as old as 10 years old or it's super expensive for folks to 73 00:03:28,320 --> 00:03:30,320 access them. And so it creates this 74 00:03:30,320 --> 00:03:35,360 alternative crowd sourced mapping network that mapping 75 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:37,960 data that companies can use and access. 76 00:03:38,160 --> 00:03:41,360 And in exchange, these folks who are mapping get paid in the 77 00:03:41,360 --> 00:03:44,400 native tokens off the network. And so in some ways, they're 78 00:03:44,520 --> 00:03:46,960 getting paid in the ownership of the network. 79 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:48,760 Yeah. So this is basically, this is a 80 00:03:48,760 --> 00:03:50,480 dream. You were early Uber and one of 81 00:03:50,480 --> 00:03:54,080 the dreams was riders and drivers could get a share of the 82 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:56,520 network and that would help bootstrap it. 83 00:03:56,520 --> 00:03:59,040 And that was like the dream 10 years ago. 84 00:03:59,040 --> 00:04:00,640 And now it's starting to come closer to reality. 85 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:03,320 That's exactly right, yes. Well, Jay, we were talking about 86 00:04:03,320 --> 00:04:04,400 some of these things back in Earn. 87 00:04:04,400 --> 00:04:07,840 Remember we were talking about the many machine market and then 88 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:13,440 IoT and like API marketplace, machine payments. 89 00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:15,600 Yeah, people just use different words for a lot of these things, 90 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:19,279 crypto and AI. AI agents are going to be using 91 00:04:19,279 --> 00:04:21,360 crypto to pay one another, obviously. 92 00:04:22,079 --> 00:04:25,440 Yes, all that is now happening and actually a big part of it 93 00:04:25,440 --> 00:04:30,120 was solving the theoretically or like conceptually simple 94 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:33,080 practically hard problem which is just being able to blast 95 00:04:33,080 --> 00:04:36,400 events on chain. I mean, now I'm going to do my 96 00:04:36,400 --> 00:04:39,440 obligatory plug, which is that you needed something like Solana 97 00:04:39,440 --> 00:04:41,280 for it to work. The thing that's nice about 98 00:04:41,280 --> 00:04:46,240 Solana is of course I love Ethereum, I love Bitcoin, but I 99 00:04:46,240 --> 00:04:48,480 think it's nice about Salon is you can just blast events on 100 00:04:48,480 --> 00:04:49,720 chain. You don't have to have other L 101 00:04:49,720 --> 00:04:51,760 twos. And that means your conceptual 102 00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:54,880 overhead of you don't have to, you know, have bridges and backs 103 00:04:54,880 --> 00:04:56,160 and forths and so on and so forth. 104 00:04:56,320 --> 00:04:58,920 Just hold all the relevant state on chain. 105 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:01,120 Would you agree with that? Is that roughly part of the 106 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:03,320 value prop? I think that's a big part of it. 107 00:05:03,560 --> 00:05:06,600 I think another very simple analogy, No analogy is perfect. 108 00:05:06,600 --> 00:05:09,400 It's kind of like remember when we are all on dial up modems. 109 00:05:09,640 --> 00:05:12,400 I mean, I guess you and I are old enough to remember that. 110 00:05:12,400 --> 00:05:14,720 Like the, the mystique of like Doo Doo, we do do right. 111 00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:18,320 And then we do all we'd all be doing these cool things that 112 00:05:18,320 --> 00:05:20,920 we're like, wow, this is gonna be amazing when we like download 113 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:23,400 videos and chat with our friends and be like, Oh my gosh, you can 114 00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:27,640 see The Mirage on the horizon. But what had to happen is high 115 00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:30,280 bandwidth Internet. So the whole like bridging type 116 00:05:30,280 --> 00:05:31,880 of thing. It's like having a whole stack 117 00:05:31,880 --> 00:05:34,560 of 56 K modems in your closet and be like, that one's gonna be 118 00:05:34,560 --> 00:05:36,640 for chatting, that one's gonna be for watching my videos. 119 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:39,000 That one's gonna be for doing e-mail. 120 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:40,520 And that's just not the way it worked out. 121 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:43,400 Yeah, that's right. I think, I don't know, we may go 122 00:05:43,400 --> 00:05:45,960 back to the future and there might be app chains or what have 123 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:48,080 you, but I think for a while a lot will happen on Solana. 124 00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:52,080 The other thing I was going to ask is with the deep end stuff, 125 00:05:52,120 --> 00:05:54,320 I've always been kind of skeptical about this is this is 126 00:05:54,320 --> 00:05:57,280 like the idea of you have some physical infrastructure offline 127 00:05:57,280 --> 00:05:59,560 and it's like mapped on chain and so on and so forth. 128 00:05:59,960 --> 00:06:02,000 And you know, maybe the canonical example is not 129 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:04,200 infrastructure, but it's like gold, like physical gold bricks, 130 00:06:04,520 --> 00:06:06,520 right? To me, the hard part was never 131 00:06:06,680 --> 00:06:09,440 the on chain part. The hard part was the redemption 132 00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:11,800 of actually mapping it back and forth and actually having 133 00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:14,560 somebody who would take that on chain asset and map it for gold 134 00:06:14,560 --> 00:06:17,320 or vice versa, right? And so like the hard part is 135 00:06:17,320 --> 00:06:20,960 actually the legal interface and custody of those assets in all 136 00:06:20,960 --> 00:06:22,680 these jurisdictions, not the crypto part. 137 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:24,640 That's why I've only been somewhat skeptical about DPN, 138 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:26,560 but maybe I'm wrong about that. Yeah. 139 00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:29,200 Well, I think the, you know, whether it's in Hive Mapper's 140 00:06:29,200 --> 00:06:32,840 case or Helium's case, you expect the person participating 141 00:06:32,840 --> 00:06:35,400 in the network to run all the physical infrastructure. 142 00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:40,480 And it's an if X then Y style sort of network where if you run 143 00:06:40,480 --> 00:06:42,360 the physical infrastructure correctly, whether it's a 144 00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:46,560 dashboard camera or it's a, you know, Helium hotspot that 145 00:06:46,560 --> 00:06:48,880 provides mobile network coverage. 146 00:06:49,480 --> 00:06:53,240 If you run that accurately and you provide resources to the 147 00:06:53,240 --> 00:06:56,800 network that are used on the other side, then you get paid. 148 00:06:56,960 --> 00:06:59,960 So all the all the responsibility of running the 149 00:06:59,960 --> 00:07:01,680 physical infrastructure, just like Uber, right, where the 150 00:07:01,680 --> 00:07:03,480 drivers are required to run their own physical 151 00:07:03,480 --> 00:07:06,640 infrastructure. Uber does not run or maintain 152 00:07:06,640 --> 00:07:08,680 the physical infrastructure, which is the cars in this case. 153 00:07:08,680 --> 00:07:11,840 So the operators or the suppliers are expected to do 154 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:15,720 that in exchange for payment. Yeah, I think apology what 155 00:07:15,720 --> 00:07:18,920 you're also getting at is the long running critique of of the 156 00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:23,040 whole Oracle problem. Why is it that fractionalizing 157 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:27,480 houses on chain might not be a great use of blockchain? 158 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:29,920 Putting houses on chain doesn't make a lot of sense cuz you 159 00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:31,960 could buy the on chain asset, but then who's actually living 160 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:33,680 in the house ultimately is going to prevail, right? 161 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:36,080 I think it's a little bit different with deep in networks 162 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:40,880 because the nodes themselves, meaning the camera, the the 163 00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:43,240 Wi-Fi module, those are not the assets, those are part of the 164 00:07:43,240 --> 00:07:44,760 infrastructure. So I think putting the 165 00:07:44,760 --> 00:07:48,560 infrastructure on chain and using crypto to coordinate the 166 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:51,120 incentives around that infrastructure, that is 167 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:52,440 something I think that makes sense. 168 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:56,440 Whereas I agree with you a lot of the things around tokenizing 169 00:07:56,440 --> 00:08:00,320 gold bars and tokenizing luxury handbags and tokenizing, you 170 00:08:00,320 --> 00:08:02,800 know, fractionalizing the the houses on this block or 171 00:08:02,800 --> 00:08:06,520 something like that, taking real world like physical assets and 172 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:08,160 tokenizing them. That one I agree with you is a 173 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:11,280 little bit more skeptical, but depends more about incentivizing 174 00:08:11,360 --> 00:08:13,320 the hardware network, the infrastructure. 175 00:08:13,760 --> 00:08:17,240 So the smarter the devices, maybe the more network E type 176 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:19,720 stuff it can do to kind of validate that it's actually 177 00:08:19,720 --> 00:08:22,200 being used in a proper like a it's got an image or it's got 178 00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:23,720 AGPS signal or it's something like that. 179 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:25,160 So you can track these assets, yeah. 180 00:08:25,560 --> 00:08:28,040 Yeah, it's compute resource. Slightly switching gears for a 181 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:30,880 second. So we have actually a bunch of 182 00:08:30,880 --> 00:08:36,520 people coming on campus in a few weeks for the Ignition month at 183 00:08:36,520 --> 00:08:40,240 Network School. So do you want to talk about 184 00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:44,960 this and like the Super Team Network School in May, so all 185 00:08:44,960 --> 00:08:46,480 these builders and hackathon winners? 186 00:08:46,760 --> 00:08:48,400 OK. So Super Team is a community 187 00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:54,360 that is a group of developers, you know, engineers, marketers, 188 00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:58,080 founders around the world that are building something on 189 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:00,200 Solana. And so they're typically 190 00:09:00,200 --> 00:09:05,600 regional communities, India, the UK, Germany, Nigeria, pretty 191 00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:08,680 much any country that has a technical bench strength and has 192 00:09:08,680 --> 00:09:11,640 a crypto community will have a, you know, regional super Dean. 193 00:09:11,640 --> 00:09:15,800 It's a way for people to learn how how to, you know, build 194 00:09:15,800 --> 00:09:19,360 stuff on chain and eventually earn money right through it 195 00:09:19,360 --> 00:09:22,920 could be through bounties, through jobs, through grants, 196 00:09:23,520 --> 00:09:26,440 you know, funding projects. One of the awesome things about 197 00:09:26,440 --> 00:09:30,120 crypto is it allows for a multiplicity of participants as 198 00:09:30,120 --> 00:09:33,800 opposed to just you don't need to join the company to work on 199 00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:36,160 the network. And so there are many ways to 200 00:09:36,160 --> 00:09:38,960 contribute to the building the network out, whether you're an 201 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:40,640 individual or small project team. 202 00:09:41,360 --> 00:09:45,080 And you can get funded through various means, all from bounties 203 00:09:45,080 --> 00:09:46,800 to grants. So we really think that people 204 00:09:46,800 --> 00:09:48,600 should earn their first script or not buy it. 205 00:09:48,600 --> 00:09:52,480 Like that's the foundational philosophy of this and to earn 206 00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:55,640 your first crypto, you actually need to learn quite a bit about 207 00:09:55,640 --> 00:09:58,960 how this stuff works. And we think that that best 208 00:09:58,960 --> 00:10:02,800 positions people to be long term contributors to the network 209 00:10:02,800 --> 00:10:05,120 versus buying something, trading money and losing it, right? 210 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:09,840 So, yeah, so the the very excited to finally make this 211 00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:13,280 collaboration happen between the network school and the Solana 212 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:17,000 community and super team. So we we host the largest 213 00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:22,120 hackathons in crypto by numbers and every year the number of 214 00:10:22,120 --> 00:10:24,000 participants has only been going up and to the right. 215 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:28,160 And so this upcoming hackathon will be 1, which also has a 216 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:31,840 physical node I guess where people can congregate and and 217 00:10:31,840 --> 00:10:33,080 build. OK, awesome. 218 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:35,240 Yeah. So that's going to be May 20th, 219 00:10:35,920 --> 00:10:37,720 then let's talk about Forma. Yeah. 220 00:10:37,720 --> 00:10:40,240 I mean, Forma is the, it's a salon economic zone or it's 221 00:10:40,240 --> 00:10:44,200 essentially a pop up, which it's like a pop up village, but it's, 222 00:10:44,200 --> 00:10:48,600 it's specifically geared towards integrating crypto within the 223 00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:51,720 local economy. And that involves, you know, 224 00:10:51,720 --> 00:10:56,200 typical involves going to a crypto friendly jurisdiction and 225 00:10:56,200 --> 00:10:58,600 working with local regulators, the local community, local 226 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:02,880 businesses, local developers to integrate crypto into their 227 00:11:02,960 --> 00:11:05,480 existing infrastructure. And so the first one was in 228 00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:07,640 Argentina, The second one is in Sri Lanka. 229 00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:12,960 And and you know, we'll probably do two more this year with that 230 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:14,400 team. It's a very talented team. 231 00:11:14,480 --> 00:11:18,880 And so we think that the best way to engage with progressive 232 00:11:19,000 --> 00:11:22,520 countries that are pro technology, pro crypto is to 233 00:11:22,520 --> 00:11:26,000 bootstrap a local sort of economy with them 234 00:11:26,480 --> 00:11:29,600 entrepreneurials. So Salon is last year, it's now 235 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:32,880 number one in D5, it's now number one in devs. 236 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:35,720 It's done the form of pop up city. 237 00:11:35,720 --> 00:11:37,360 It's got all these token extensions. 238 00:11:37,520 --> 00:11:40,960 It's got very significant GDP, came all the way up from nothing 239 00:11:40,960 --> 00:11:43,480 in COVID Lily and actually have built it out. 240 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:44,960 And in fact it's been very international. 241 00:11:44,960 --> 00:11:47,760 It's been actually Internet first more than quote America 242 00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:50,800 first, because it's been building out all around the 243 00:11:50,800 --> 00:11:54,600 world as opposed to mainly only the US is actually the last kind 244 00:11:54,600 --> 00:11:56,960 of spot for it in some ways, even though it was found in the 245 00:11:57,040 --> 00:11:59,080 US. So I want to take some questions 246 00:11:59,080 --> 00:12:02,560 from the audience, you know, questions on Solana, you know, 247 00:12:02,560 --> 00:12:05,800 questions on Solana ecosystem. On crypto equities, because I 248 00:12:05,880 --> 00:12:07,800 agree with you, it makes a ton of sense. 249 00:12:07,960 --> 00:12:12,240 I'm curious for Lillian Akshay, do you guys have a strategy to 250 00:12:12,280 --> 00:12:14,160 talk about internally for how you're going to actually 251 00:12:14,160 --> 00:12:16,960 encourage companies to make that transition? 252 00:12:17,360 --> 00:12:19,560 No, I mean, if you think about what Internet capital markets 253 00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:22,960 are, right, it is the ability to do 2 things. 254 00:12:22,960 --> 00:12:26,640 Well, it is to reduce the barrier to launch assets on the 255 00:12:26,640 --> 00:12:29,520 Internet. So in five years from now, if 256 00:12:29,520 --> 00:12:31,320 you're taking your company public, you're just going to 257 00:12:31,320 --> 00:12:33,840 say, I'm going, I'm going public online. 258 00:12:34,160 --> 00:12:37,400 Like where are you listing on the Internet? 259 00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:38,360 What do you mean? Right? 260 00:12:38,360 --> 00:12:40,160 Like that's sort of what it's going to be. 261 00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:43,320 And so it's reduced the barrier for issuers. 262 00:12:43,680 --> 00:12:45,920 And on the other side, it is to reduce the barrier for 263 00:12:45,920 --> 00:12:49,000 investors. A great example of this is if 264 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:51,600 you wanted access to U.S. dollars outside the US, you 265 00:12:51,600 --> 00:12:54,640 either needed to have cash or you needed to have an offshore 266 00:12:54,640 --> 00:12:58,040 bank account for which you had to fill like the reams of forms 267 00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:00,760 and eventually get approved. But today you download a browser 268 00:13:00,760 --> 00:13:03,880 extension or a mobile wallet and you get a USD, right? 269 00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:07,240 So that when you scale access to something, it fundamentally 270 00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:11,160 changes the nature of that thing, which is, you know, you 271 00:13:11,160 --> 00:13:13,200 don't need KYC anymore. You can just download a mobile 272 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:15,400 app and get U.S. dollars because you put it on the Internet. 273 00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:19,600 So taking on chain equities on to the on on like taking 274 00:13:19,600 --> 00:13:23,280 equities on chain is not merely tokenizing it, It is changing 275 00:13:23,280 --> 00:13:26,640 the very fundamental nature of what it is, which is 276 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:29,680 democratizing access to ownership and creating a cap 277 00:13:29,680 --> 00:13:32,720 table that you can scale infinitely effectively and trade 278 00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:36,400 effortlessly and on on on the global Internet, right, like 279 00:13:36,400 --> 00:13:40,360 changing hands and leaving titles effective effortlessly on 280 00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:44,240 online. And so I think that's sort of 281 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:47,520 how we think about this class and in so far as to organizing 282 00:13:47,520 --> 00:13:52,200 equities is concerned, I know there I mean Lily has a team 283 00:13:52,200 --> 00:13:54,760 that works on this and so maybe she can talk to the more 284 00:13:54,760 --> 00:13:57,800 specifics of it. But I but the most exciting part 285 00:13:57,800 --> 00:14:01,920 about that is reducing barriers to issuance for for me 286 00:14:01,920 --> 00:14:04,400 personally. Yeah, on the supply side, also 287 00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:07,960 on the demand side, if you can even take 100 million people and 288 00:14:08,040 --> 00:14:10,720 the liquidity that comes from that 100 million people and 289 00:14:10,720 --> 00:14:13,080 pointed at this thing, it's going to go nuts. 290 00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:17,360 In the same way that taking all the eyeballs of humans across 291 00:14:17,360 --> 00:14:19,960 the world and pointing at various content made that go 292 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:23,920 nuts as well. And so now maybe we can get some 293 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:26,920 more quality things in there that are more deserving of that 294 00:14:26,920 --> 00:14:29,920 time and tension capital. You know, another observation 295 00:14:29,960 --> 00:14:33,400 that we encryptive made for a long time is in order to have 296 00:14:33,400 --> 00:14:37,120 access to the better investment assets, you already have to be 297 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:40,920 rich. And it's those gating, those 298 00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:43,360 gating factors, right? You're an accredited investor. 299 00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:46,200 That means you either have a million of net worth and or 300 00:14:46,400 --> 00:14:49,320 you've made $200,000 a year for the last two years and you've 301 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:51,040 got to like sign all the stuff and you want the really good 302 00:14:51,040 --> 00:14:52,240 stuff. You got to be qualified 303 00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:54,040 purchasers. You've got a 5 million of net 304 00:14:54,040 --> 00:14:56,600 worth. How many people in America, much 305 00:14:56,600 --> 00:15:00,040 less the world have access to those levels of wealth and 306 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:03,320 therefore the really cool bespoke unique investment 307 00:15:03,320 --> 00:15:04,640 opportunities? Very few. 308 00:15:05,880 --> 00:15:09,760 And so part of this is broadening, enabling the supply 309 00:15:09,760 --> 00:15:13,280 of these things to come on in certainly and also broadening 310 00:15:13,280 --> 00:15:16,920 just capital markets access not just for retail investors but 311 00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:20,440 also for smaller companies. So you know, there are quite a 312 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:23,800 number of of high quality companies around the world where 313 00:15:23,800 --> 00:15:27,360 you could say, let's say the best company in Brazil is 314 00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:31,200 probably a better in terms of just a company asset market 315 00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:34,920 position, so on and so forth, probably a better asset than 316 00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:38,720 your mid tier US small business, right. 317 00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:42,080 But because they're in Brazil, they don't have access to the 318 00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:45,840 capital markets of America. And so therefore that asset gets 319 00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:52,160 priced at a much lower multiple than your Heartland America 320 00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:55,000 small business. Is that an efficient market? 321 00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:58,400 I'm not sure about that. So part of this is getting non 322 00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:02,200 accredited investors access to stuff, okay, in the US context. 323 00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:05,440 But then there's also a big part of it which is you could call it 324 00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:08,680 non accredited that small businesses around the world that 325 00:16:08,680 --> 00:16:12,400 want global liquidity. And that's a whole other part of 326 00:16:12,400 --> 00:16:14,800 the supply side that every time you talk about this 327 00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:17,800 internationally, people are like, I am listening. 328 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:19,200 Yeah. And one of the things Belgium 329 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:21,520 would say is I think you've talked about this, this IPO 330 00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:23,320 crisis, right? Like the number of public 331 00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:25,280 companies have actually gone down over time. 332 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:30,600 And today the, you know, the reason like this wealth gap 333 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:34,200 exists in the US is because the average retail investor doesn't 334 00:16:34,200 --> 00:16:38,400 have the ability to own the growth in public companies 335 00:16:38,400 --> 00:16:40,800 anymore because these companies are staying private longer. 336 00:16:41,040 --> 00:16:44,120 You know, Bill Gurney has talked about the sort of like the tech 337 00:16:44,920 --> 00:16:49,440 IPO crisis as just a lack of, you know, like some of the best 338 00:16:49,440 --> 00:16:51,360 tech companies just prefer staying private as long as 339 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:54,040 possible because private markets are infinitely liquid, right? 340 00:16:54,320 --> 00:16:57,720 So, and as a result, what you're ending up with is people 341 00:16:57,720 --> 00:17:00,360 suggesting things like Ubi, right, Universal basic income, 342 00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:04,280 whereas actually the solution should be something where it's 343 00:17:04,280 --> 00:17:07,960 universal basic ownership versus income where you can have the 344 00:17:07,960 --> 00:17:11,240 ability for people to own assets with the push of a button. 345 00:17:11,680 --> 00:17:15,319 And I think that is the fundamental sort of outcome that 346 00:17:15,319 --> 00:17:17,200 that putting capital markets online will achieve. 347 00:17:17,200 --> 00:17:25,800 I'm curious. Oh, sure. 348 00:17:25,800 --> 00:17:29,720 I mean, I think this is the third AI in crypto kind of like 349 00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:34,560 trend that we've seen now. And I feel like for a while it 350 00:17:34,560 --> 00:17:38,560 was render and it was GPU compute networks. 351 00:17:38,880 --> 00:17:41,640 What do I think about these? I think that with all of these 352 00:17:41,640 --> 00:17:44,800 like kind of trends that last for three or four months, 353 00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:46,840 there's always this heat of truth in there that is going to 354 00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:49,000 play out at some point, whether it's in three years, six years, 355 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:53,640 nine years, whatever. And so I think this is probably 356 00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:56,600 one of those AI agents who are going to automatically pay for 357 00:17:57,920 --> 00:18:02,800 your help, you figure your bills, pay your bills online, do 358 00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:04,160 your e-commerce for you, whatever. 359 00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:09,160 That's cool. And I think it's I think it's 360 00:18:09,160 --> 00:18:11,440 yet another one of those times where there's a seat of truth. 361 00:18:11,560 --> 00:18:15,560 You're gonna have a huge amount of focus as an industry and a 362 00:18:15,560 --> 00:18:19,040 lot of companies start in this period of time and then and then 363 00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:21,320 they will get winded out and there's gonna be a crash at some 364 00:18:21,320 --> 00:18:23,080 point as well, right? This is the same thing with 365 00:18:23,080 --> 00:18:26,720 render and IO net in 2324. We're gonna see that now with AI 366 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:28,520 chat bots. It's interesting. 367 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:31,560 Do I think but now forever it's going to be like straight line 368 00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:35,560 up of adoption interests? No, because we've seen that so 369 00:18:35,560 --> 00:18:40,920 many times in crypto now still. The majority of the applications 370 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:43,640 even the Solana ecosystem made for a desktop when if it was for 371 00:18:43,640 --> 00:18:47,680 a mobile phone, phone first application, maybe the detail 372 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:49,360 wouldn't be that much interested. 373 00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:53,360 In So basically her question is, if I had to paraphrase, why are 374 00:18:53,360 --> 00:18:58,920 there not more good mobile phone apps for the Solani system, 375 00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:00,200 specifically in crypto in general? 376 00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:02,160 Yeah. I mean, I think the the apps do 377 00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:05,800 exist like the, you know, like I think Solana by far has the best 378 00:19:06,640 --> 00:19:12,480 sort of product community in crypto and and you know, whether 379 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:16,040 it's Phantom or these other apps that were held back on the App 380 00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:20,160 Store because of some of the App Store sort of regulation. 381 00:19:20,160 --> 00:19:21,880 So I think we're just going to see more of that. 382 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:25,040 And the other thing that'll end up happening is like a lot of 383 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:29,200 fintech companies that already have really slick user 384 00:19:29,200 --> 00:19:32,240 experiences and, and apps will start to integrate stablecoin, 385 00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:33,600 you'll start to see more of that. 386 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:35,880 It really depends on sort of what your, what kind of apps 387 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:37,960 you're talking about. But on either end of that 388 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:41,600 spectrum, you're sort of seeing a mobile app first experience on 389 00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:43,920 the, you know, sort of like the functional fintech side of it as 390 00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:47,680 well as the more crypto native crypto economy type apps. 391 00:19:48,160 --> 00:19:52,080 I can give some color on that as well, which is Apple is very 392 00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:56,560 small C conservative, right? And so they have never been a 393 00:19:56,560 --> 00:19:58,520 big fan. Their culture is not a crypto 394 00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:01,240 culture, right? Their culture, well, first of 395 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:04,120 all, even with other technologies, they're often the 396 00:20:04,120 --> 00:20:07,320 last mover on it. They adopt it last years after 397 00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:10,760 everybody else. And the App Store is a very 398 00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:15,480 hermetically sealed environment and a lot of Web 2 and tech 399 00:20:15,480 --> 00:20:19,360 people just didn't get crypto and still kind of don't get, 400 00:20:19,840 --> 00:20:23,600 roughly speaking. Web 3 is to Web 2 is Web 2 was 401 00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:28,880 to Microsoft and Redmond, right? Like the whole PC ecosystem, 402 00:20:29,400 --> 00:20:33,600 only some of the people made the leap conceptually to the 403 00:20:33,600 --> 00:20:36,640 Internet, right? And only some of the people 404 00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:39,880 conceptually from the Internet companies made the leap to Web 3 405 00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:42,600 because it's a mind shift shift. It's a first. 406 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:45,440 It's a geographical shift, for example, from Redmond to Silicon 407 00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:48,520 Valley and then to the Internet. It's a back end shift from like 408 00:20:48,520 --> 00:20:51,960 a local PC to a database to a blockchain. 409 00:20:52,280 --> 00:20:56,360 It's a like revenue model shift from like selling like, you 410 00:20:56,360 --> 00:20:59,000 know, disks to selling SAS to selling an asset. 411 00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:01,920 It's like so many different shifts at once that most people 412 00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:04,600 can't flip that many parts of their experience, right? 413 00:21:05,120 --> 00:21:08,720 And so Apple was small. I mean, there's some funny 414 00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:11,400 story, lots of funny stories and lots of unfunny stories, but 415 00:21:11,800 --> 00:21:14,760 they would just use their guidelines in a very peremptory 416 00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:16,680 way. And so bit by bit, the things 417 00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:18,760 that got through were the exchanges where there were 418 00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:21,040 enough exchanges, they had enough collective so you can buy 419 00:21:21,120 --> 00:21:22,800 and sell an asset and so on and so forth. 420 00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:26,920 And now you have Farcaster and you have a rainbow wallet, you 421 00:21:26,920 --> 00:21:28,880 have a bunch of wallets and stuff, a lot of exchanges and 422 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:30,360 wallets. This is great. 423 00:21:30,360 --> 00:21:37,600 Any parting words besides go to solanaandandcheckoutsolana@solana.com. 424 00:21:38,440 --> 00:21:41,080 Well, you can you just send, can you just tweak the word Solana 425 00:21:41,120 --> 00:21:44,920 Let's. That would unfortunately that 426 00:21:44,920 --> 00:21:46,640 would get a lot of engagement of the wrong kind. 427 00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:47,760 But yeah. Go ahead. 428 00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:50,200 All right. Great guys. 429 00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:52,240 Thanks very much. Thanks.