1
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I remember one time in 
Guatemala, I fall in my lines 

2
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and then I just hardly opened my
rescue and I was on the ground. 

3
00:00:10,800 --> 00:00:15,880
Then we had to spend the whole 
night, I think 2428 hours till 

4
00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:17,760
the chopper come. 
We have to spend there on the 

5
00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:20,720
mountain stream. 
And it was crazy. 

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00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:25,320
It was for him, super painful 
sometimes, but in the end it was

7
00:00:25,640 --> 00:00:29,440
a story I will never forget. 
There was a bear 20 meters next 

8
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to me. 
There was one bear and the bear 

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00:00:32,200 --> 00:00:35,680
also realized me and he turned 
around and then he then there 

10
00:00:35,680 --> 00:00:39,560
was a tree lying and then he 
stand on the tree like this was 

11
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looking me like then I was 
looking him. 

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00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:45,320
I'm like, oh. 
I want to talk a little bit 

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00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:47,080
about your inspirations, 
Philippe. 

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00:00:47,160 --> 00:00:48,960
Have you had mentors in the 
sport? 

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00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:51,880
Have you like how has your 
teachings been or what are the 

16
00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:55,280
pilots that you have looked up 
to and how has that journey been

17
00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:57,280
for you? 
Yeah, actually I had some very 

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good mentors. 
He was flying on all these 

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00:00:59,800 --> 00:01:03,000
competitions, so he was on the 
top in the earlier days. 

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00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:10,280
Philippe Zeliger, thank you so 
much for joining Fanatic 

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00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:12,080
Landing. 
Atlas man, so good to see you 

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00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:14,640
one more time this year. 
How is life treating you these 

23
00:01:14,640 --> 00:01:16,520
days? 
Yeah, it's good. 

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These days I'm back home in 
Austria, just come back in one 

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00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:23,800
month ago from India, so 
everything is good. 

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00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:26,960
Yeah. 
Have you, have you had a lot of 

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00:01:26,960 --> 00:01:29,200
airtime these days? 
I I remember when I met you 

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00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:32,760
there, it was just like a lot of
mixed flying days with a lot of 

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00:01:32,760 --> 00:01:34,160
thunderstorms and everything 
happening. 

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00:01:34,160 --> 00:01:36,800
So how has the season been for 
you this time around? 

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00:01:37,320 --> 00:01:39,280
Yeah, this year was not that 
good. 

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00:01:39,280 --> 00:01:43,480
Then last year, last year I 
think was more fly flyable days 

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00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:46,560
in India. 
But it's OK, there is also other

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00:01:46,560 --> 00:01:49,080
things to do what they like, 
like I can fly. 

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00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:52,400
So if not the whole day you do 
some, I can fly. 

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00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:55,760
So the flight to the Hot Springs
relaxed. 

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00:01:56,760 --> 00:01:58,400
But there is many good things to
do. 

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I think just for the perspective
of our audiences, how long have 

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00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:04,640
you been going to India, man? 
Because it seems like India 

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00:02:04,640 --> 00:02:09,360
better than Indians. 
So it's like, what's with you 

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00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:11,680
and India, man? 
Like how did this come into you 

42
00:02:11,680 --> 00:02:14,400
and how long has the has the 
romance been going so strong? 

43
00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:19,520
I'm pretty much sure it's more 
than 10 years now, maybe even 11

44
00:02:19,520 --> 00:02:23,440
or 12 years. 
All right, yeah. 

45
00:02:23,440 --> 00:02:25,040
And how did this strike your 
mind? 

46
00:02:25,040 --> 00:02:28,960
What curiosity started pushing 
you to India that it it was like

47
00:02:29,240 --> 00:02:33,720
1012 years of pushing? 
When I was flying Dandam for the

48
00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:36,880
company, then a friend of mine, 
he told me, oh, let's go to 

49
00:02:36,880 --> 00:02:39,840
India, it's very nice place for 
flying gross country. 

50
00:02:39,840 --> 00:02:42,320
But then they'll say, oh, but 
they're the accurate and they 

51
00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:43,800
say, oh, you're bringing 
accurate. 

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00:02:44,200 --> 00:02:48,040
Then it's also OK. 
That's how it starts. 

53
00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:51,040
And then they come first time in
India and straight fall in love 

54
00:02:51,280 --> 00:02:55,200
with the place. 
I don't blame you, man. 

55
00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:57,520
It's, it's quite a mystical 
place to be in. 

56
00:02:57,520 --> 00:03:00,080
And of course, the endless 
possibilities of the mighty 

57
00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:02,320
Himalayas offer. 
You are no stranger to that 

58
00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:03,760
because you explored them in and
out. 

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00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:07,480
So yeah, the topic of bringing 
you on board this show today is 

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00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:09,960
to navigate the topic of risk 
versus reward. 

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00:03:10,320 --> 00:03:13,120
And of course, you have 
navigated the risk versus reward

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00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:16,640
spectrum in a very successful 
manner so far in in the big 

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00:03:16,640 --> 00:03:20,120
mountains in the Himalayas. 
Like before we actually delve 

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00:03:20,120 --> 00:03:23,560
into this or dive into the whole
scenario, if you can just tell 

65
00:03:23,560 --> 00:03:26,160
us a little bit about like how 
many hours do you have under 

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00:03:26,160 --> 00:03:28,840
your belt? 
And then Acrobat, just a small, 

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00:03:28,920 --> 00:03:31,600
a little introduction about you 
and your parrot lighting. 

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00:03:31,600 --> 00:03:36,120
Of course the Indians know about
you, but I think the world needs

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00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:38,600
to know as well. 
So just for the audience's 

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00:03:38,600 --> 00:03:41,360
purpose. 
Yeah, actually in the beginning 

71
00:03:41,360 --> 00:03:45,880
I start with acroparrot lighting
and I actually make a very fast 

72
00:03:45,880 --> 00:03:48,600
progress. 
I think I flew one year and then

73
00:03:48,600 --> 00:03:52,120
it make Helico after two years I
flew Infinity. 

74
00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:56,600
This was those years was one of 
the difficulties maneuver. 

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00:03:57,240 --> 00:04:02,200
And yeah, then after a while I 
start to go to India for gross 

76
00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:05,840
country. 
And I think this is makes me, 

77
00:04:06,560 --> 00:04:10,240
yeah, feeling safe under gross 
country gliders because you know

78
00:04:10,240 --> 00:04:13,240
what the glider is doing. 
Got it. 

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00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:16,760
So when when you say that you 
made a decently fast progress 

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00:04:16,760 --> 00:04:20,000
and you've went at it from the 
beginning, what kind of mindset 

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00:04:20,000 --> 00:04:23,120
did you set out with? 
How did you start your art of 

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00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:27,520
life journey basically? 
Yeah, actually I just spent all 

83
00:04:27,520 --> 00:04:30,360
my time. 
What I have, I spent on flying 

84
00:04:30,360 --> 00:04:34,520
when I went every day up, even 
if it was after working and I 

85
00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:36,560
see I can catch the last cable 
car. 

86
00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:40,000
I went up for the last run and 
then I just hit one run. 

87
00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:45,600
But I tried to go every day and 
even I had actually a good job. 

88
00:04:45,600 --> 00:04:49,160
I was working for men, for 
everywhere, for everything. 

89
00:04:49,160 --> 00:04:51,120
And my boss was very nice 
actually. 

90
00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:55,000
And he asked me, hey Philip, you
have time next week you have 

91
00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:57,640
this and this work. 
I say I looked on the weather. 

92
00:04:57,640 --> 00:05:01,440
I say, Oh no, I have no time. 
And then I say OK, I call you on

93
00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:04,800
the weekends. 
So like this I got lots of free 

94
00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:07,640
time for flying. 
So this was very good. 

95
00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:11,600
Do you want to share your 
fascination for flying? 

96
00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:14,240
Like basically what kind of gets
you excited about it? 

97
00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:17,160
Because all of us have that very
intimate feeling that pulls us 

98
00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:20,520
towards the sky and wants, wants
us to keep us there. 

99
00:05:20,520 --> 00:05:23,080
And I've seen the ones who have 
pushed it from the beginning. 

100
00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:25,160
I have quite an interesting 
story to tell. 

101
00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:28,200
So what was your drive that 
eventually got you into the 

102
00:05:28,200 --> 00:05:30,800
sport and eventually made you 
pioneers? 

103
00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:33,680
Yeah, actually, some friends get
me in. 

104
00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:35,560
Before I was lots of 
motorbiking. 

105
00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:39,320
And then I stopped because I got
a little bit too mad. 

106
00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:42,480
So I say, OK, I have to do 
something else. 

107
00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:45,280
And then he told me, oh, my 
uncle have a flying school. 

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00:05:45,280 --> 00:05:48,160
I say, oh, OK, nice. 
And then maybe two weeks later, 

109
00:05:48,160 --> 00:05:53,280
I start the course. 
But yeah, I think if you spend a

110
00:05:53,280 --> 00:05:56,120
lot of time and here's what 
you'll like, and the good thing 

111
00:05:56,120 --> 00:05:59,400
is if you're up in there, you 
forget all the other things 

112
00:05:59,400 --> 00:06:02,840
around you. 
This is some kind of meditation,

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00:06:03,920 --> 00:06:07,200
and I think this is very nice 
because you don't think about 

114
00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:09,560
what's happened tomorrow. 
You're just in your. 

115
00:06:10,520 --> 00:06:12,560
Let's say we're just in your 
element. 

116
00:06:12,560 --> 00:06:16,720
You know, when you like this, 
you're just there and when you 

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00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:17,280
enjoy. 
And. 

118
00:06:18,040 --> 00:06:20,400
Yeah. 
No, I, I think I, I resonate 

119
00:06:20,400 --> 00:06:24,080
with that curiosity of yours 
because flow state as, as a lot 

120
00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:28,280
of people explain, or the 
basically the pure joy of doing 

121
00:06:28,280 --> 00:06:32,720
something that kind of engulfs 
your brain and everything in it 

122
00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:35,600
to, to make it happen is, is 
very rewarding in itself. 

123
00:06:35,960 --> 00:06:38,880
And I was reading some articles 
about you online and it said 

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00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:41,840
you're into slacklining and now,
as you said, motorcycling and 

125
00:06:41,840 --> 00:06:43,960
stuff like that. 
So I believe you have been 

126
00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:47,520
chasing these kind of feelings 
for quite a while, even before 

127
00:06:47,520 --> 00:06:48,960
the aerial sports came into your
life. 

128
00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:51,240
Is it? 
Yeah, it's also nice Snow 

129
00:06:51,240 --> 00:06:52,880
Adrenaline. 
It's more or less. 

130
00:06:52,880 --> 00:06:58,760
It's a good track, you know. 
100% man, 100% agreed. 

131
00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:03,440
But talking about risk versus 
reward and serving the spectrum 

132
00:07:03,440 --> 00:07:06,800
of risk versus reward to 
yourself, as you have changed 

133
00:07:06,800 --> 00:07:09,760
disciplines and as you have 
grown in your mind and in your 

134
00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:13,920
body, have you ever felt the 
need or have you ever felt the 

135
00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:17,680
want to change your perspective 
to risk versus reward? 

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00:07:17,680 --> 00:07:20,440
Be it slacklining, be it 
motorcycling, be it para lining,

137
00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:22,160
or are you still in the same 
zone? 

138
00:07:22,160 --> 00:07:24,280
Like how has that side of the 
aspect been? 

139
00:07:24,440 --> 00:07:26,360
I feel like I'm still in the 
same zone. 

140
00:07:26,360 --> 00:07:30,120
I like to in one opinion, you, 
you have to take some risk if 

141
00:07:30,120 --> 00:07:33,320
you want get better and this 
what you want to do. 

142
00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:37,840
But it's also, let's say back 
for flying. 

143
00:07:37,840 --> 00:07:40,400
If you fly always the same 
Anuma, after a while it's 

144
00:07:40,400 --> 00:07:42,800
getting boring. 
So then you want always more. 

145
00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:46,480
It's always the same. 
Now with the twisted stuff, it's

146
00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:49,160
also it's you try and then it's 
like, wow, it feels good. 

147
00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:52,760
It feels different. 
Then you get more interest 

148
00:07:53,600 --> 00:07:56,520
because if you do always the 
same, then at one point it's 

149
00:07:56,520 --> 00:07:59,880
getting a little bit boring. 
And then it's like, of course 

150
00:07:59,880 --> 00:08:02,880
it's not bad if you do always 
the same. 

151
00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:05,600
It's also in a good way. 
If you don't push too much, This

152
00:08:05,600 --> 00:08:08,360
is always the borderline, how 
much you push. 

153
00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:10,880
You should also not push too 
much and be stupid. 

154
00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:14,920
Yeah. 
Indeed, I, I think like my, my 

155
00:08:14,920 --> 00:08:18,200
perspective if you start 
thinking from the new beginners 

156
00:08:18,240 --> 00:08:21,160
point of view, because I 
remember when I was starting to 

157
00:08:21,160 --> 00:08:24,880
learn paralleling, I, I started 
doing forward launches and I 

158
00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:28,120
started doing reverse launches 
and somehow forward launches 

159
00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:31,160
were just very risky or they 
seemed very risky to me. 

160
00:08:31,520 --> 00:08:33,760
I was like in reverse, I just 
feel very good. 

161
00:08:34,039 --> 00:08:37,400
And somehow my brain was telling
me to stick to my comfort zone 

162
00:08:37,640 --> 00:08:41,039
and not do forward launches 
anymore and try and stick to 

163
00:08:41,039 --> 00:08:43,880
reverse ones. 
And I see a lot of pilots in in 

164
00:08:43,880 --> 00:08:47,520
our sport sticking to reverse 
launches and not pushing the 

165
00:08:47,520 --> 00:08:51,600
risky spectrum of perfecting a 
forward launch or navigating 

166
00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:54,040
towards it. 
So do you want to touch up on 

167
00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:56,840
the topic? 
The how eventually do you find 

168
00:08:57,360 --> 00:09:01,200
that a person is ready to go 
ahead and try something new, 

169
00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:04,400
even though it is outside your 
comfort zone, Even though it 

170
00:09:04,400 --> 00:09:07,920
might seem a bit tough, but it 
is still a necessity because 

171
00:09:07,960 --> 00:09:10,760
once you know how to do a 
forward launch, it is anyway 

172
00:09:10,760 --> 00:09:12,760
super helpful and makes you a 
safer pilot. 

173
00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:16,640
And I think this can be mapped 
in doing full stalls or in doing

174
00:09:16,640 --> 00:09:19,320
big wing overs or getting into 
acro and all of that. 

175
00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:23,800
Because every time you will have
something which keeps you safe, 

176
00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:27,160
which keeps you happy. 
And the other one is it seems a 

177
00:09:27,160 --> 00:09:29,400
little bit risky, which seems a 
little bit dangerous, but 

178
00:09:29,400 --> 00:09:33,440
eventually is safer in the 
longer run if you do actually 

179
00:09:33,560 --> 00:09:36,560
make to accomplish it. 
The other thing is they don't 

180
00:09:36,560 --> 00:09:40,200
push too much in the beginning 
because if you're, I have many 

181
00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:43,680
friends, they pushed a lot and 
they are very good with mixed 

182
00:09:43,680 --> 00:09:46,400
driving or something like this. 
So they're a little bit hard 

183
00:09:46,400 --> 00:09:50,400
guys and then they push too much
and then the other one fresh in 

184
00:09:50,400 --> 00:09:52,520
the spiral or something like 
this. 

185
00:09:52,520 --> 00:09:57,000
So it's like you should not push
too much, especially in the 

186
00:09:57,000 --> 00:09:58,840
beginning. 
You need a lot of flights. 

187
00:09:58,840 --> 00:10:01,120
This is the most safest thing 
what you can do. 

188
00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:03,440
You go up with the app or you 
make flights. 

189
00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:06,840
So in the beginning you don't 
think too much about pushing 

190
00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:10,480
just to feel comfortable. 
And if you feel comfortable and 

191
00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:14,000
you get the feeling, OK, I can 
try a little bit more. 

192
00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:18,760
OK, go a little step. 
It's better to do not like you 

193
00:10:18,760 --> 00:10:21,520
do a full step. 
You do half step and it's even 

194
00:10:21,520 --> 00:10:24,640
more safe than you do the full 
step I would say. 

195
00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:28,520
Got it. 
So let's say define these half 

196
00:10:28,520 --> 00:10:32,440
or full steps from let's say my 
dilemma was that is it right 

197
00:10:32,440 --> 00:10:36,080
time to push to A2 liner or to 
upgrade to A2 liner from a three

198
00:10:36,080 --> 00:10:39,280
liner. 
And even there are times when 

199
00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:42,360
you're going on full speed bar 
through thermals, you're flown 

200
00:10:42,360 --> 00:10:45,200
in India, you know how the 
thermals are and there are times

201
00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:48,480
when 3 liners can scare you a 
lot in thermals. 

202
00:10:48,680 --> 00:10:52,400
But at the same time, every 
other duration, the whole 

203
00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:55,160
duration of the flight, which is
not being flown in thermal, 

204
00:10:55,160 --> 00:10:57,840
you're very comfortable on your 
wing and you feel like yes, 

205
00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:02,240
you're totally ready to upgrade 
to A2 liner, but then you 

206
00:11:02,240 --> 00:11:05,480
upgrade to A2 liner. 
God forbid something happens and

207
00:11:05,720 --> 00:11:07,280
you feel like you're not ready 
for it. 

208
00:11:07,280 --> 00:11:11,720
So now you're getting your 
confidence along with the too 

209
00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:15,400
soon and too late thing because 
you do have to push, but at the 

210
00:11:15,400 --> 00:11:17,040
same time, you don't have to 
push as well. 

211
00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:21,280
This is a massive Gray area that
I hear a lot of pilots talk 

212
00:11:21,280 --> 00:11:25,360
about, but I don't hear a lot of
answers regarding a clear cut 

213
00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:27,920
answers regarding this. 
Do you have any suggestions on 

214
00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:30,560
how did you navigate this when 
you were growing up in your 

215
00:11:30,560 --> 00:11:34,040
career and how did you 
eventually try to upgrade and do

216
00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:36,000
things that were outside your 
comfort zone? 

217
00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:41,560
Yeah, the thing was I start with
I remember when we make a lot of

218
00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:45,640
collapse in the beginning and we
was a small group and we just 

219
00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:49,160
flew outside and we make so many
of collapse as possible all the 

220
00:11:49,160 --> 00:11:52,520
time. 
And yeah, for sure it was many 

221
00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:55,880
flats like this one. 
And after we start going on a 

222
00:11:55,880 --> 00:11:58,520
lake, then we make our first 
food stall. 

223
00:11:58,520 --> 00:12:01,080
Actually I make a spiral, I make
a front collar up. 

224
00:12:01,160 --> 00:12:04,640
And then my friend was like, oh,
feel a mix full stall I have to 

225
00:12:04,640 --> 00:12:07,560
make also. 
And then the next round I was 

226
00:12:07,560 --> 00:12:09,280
like, oh fuck my friend make 
full stall. 

227
00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:11,120
OK. 
And so you push your with your 

228
00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:13,680
friends a little bit more. 
Can you go in a safe place if my

229
00:12:13,680 --> 00:12:15,880
official rescue land in the 
water? 

230
00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:18,920
And yeah, this is always good to
push like this. 

231
00:12:18,920 --> 00:12:24,240
And this is also a point I see 
many times people, they fly if 

232
00:12:24,480 --> 00:12:30,440
you see glider or a big glider, 
they should not go too fast on 

233
00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:33,120
these gliders because there is 
not really a reason. 

234
00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:39,200
Last year in India I flew 2 
weeks to see and it's also sea 

235
00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:42,360
glider. 
So you don't need to really to 

236
00:12:42,400 --> 00:12:45,560
upgrade too fast because 
actually you can do everything 

237
00:12:45,560 --> 00:12:47,800
with a peak level that you can 
if you want. 

238
00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:51,400
At the beginning, of course, no,
If you fly a long time, you fly 

239
00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:53,080
a lot. 
And then of course you can go 

240
00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:56,680
for a sealer peak level. 
So let's say if we have to make 

241
00:12:56,680 --> 00:13:00,800
this line of upgradation, 
because let's say upgrading to a

242
00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:04,160
newer classification or a higher
classification wing is one of 

243
00:13:04,160 --> 00:13:07,280
the main reasons why your skills
do not match with the 

244
00:13:07,280 --> 00:13:10,280
expectations that eventually 
with the reality that eventually

245
00:13:10,280 --> 00:13:15,040
happens of how the wing behaves.
So let's say to be on a, to be 

246
00:13:15,040 --> 00:13:18,680
on a safer level, do you should 
pilots start putting some number

247
00:13:18,680 --> 00:13:22,480
of hours as the benchmark or 
some number of stalls as the 

248
00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:25,800
benchmark said, hey, until I do 
100 hours, I don't think I 

249
00:13:25,800 --> 00:13:28,640
should be upgrading. 
Or until I do so many stalls, I 

250
00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:31,560
will not upgrade as a minimum 
set because obviously no 

251
00:13:31,560 --> 00:13:36,000
manufacturer or no reseller or 
or retail shop out there will 

252
00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:39,160
try to say that I will only sell
this to a pilot with certain 

253
00:13:39,160 --> 00:13:41,440
number of hours. 
But on a personal note, do you 

254
00:13:41,440 --> 00:13:44,240
think it's a good habit to try 
and have some kind of 

255
00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:47,320
benchmarking which you can 
actually measure rather than 

256
00:13:47,320 --> 00:13:49,360
just the feeling? 
Because feelings can change with

257
00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:51,920
the day and confidence living 
and all of those things. 

258
00:13:52,560 --> 00:13:56,400
Yeah, I would actually say 
before you upgrade to a glider, 

259
00:13:56,400 --> 00:13:58,920
you should stall. 
You should feel confident in the

260
00:13:58,920 --> 00:14:03,320
stall with your. 
It's maybe a little bit higher. 

261
00:14:03,560 --> 00:14:07,160
Many people who sure don't know 
how to do the stall with the 

262
00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:10,360
glider what they're flying. 
But in my opinion, it's like I 

263
00:14:10,360 --> 00:14:15,840
start with stalled with mentor 
and I stalled it so many times 

264
00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:18,560
to feel comfortable and then I 
moved to another glider. 

265
00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:23,480
And then even even if I try one 
new glider, the first thing what

266
00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:26,920
they do, I fly out and I make a 
stall and look how it's behave 

267
00:14:26,920 --> 00:14:29,760
how I feel like under the glider
when I stole the glider. 

268
00:14:30,440 --> 00:14:34,960
This is always like when I try a
new glider except my friend tell

269
00:14:34,960 --> 00:14:37,480
me oh This is why. 
Are you glad I don't make a 

270
00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:45,040
stall? 
Yeah, sounds great. 

271
00:14:45,040 --> 00:14:48,560
But I think while while we're 
talking about stalls and pushing

272
00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:52,640
the limits on all of these 
things, do you think you as a 

273
00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:56,440
pilot yourself have had some 
limiting factors while you were 

274
00:14:56,440 --> 00:14:58,680
progressing? 
Did you have your kind of 

275
00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:02,240
experience level or your goals 
which influenced your decisions 

276
00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:05,080
or anything which influenced 
risk taking abilities like how 

277
00:15:05,080 --> 00:15:07,160
did how has your progression 
been? 

278
00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:09,680
Because obviously everybody has 
their own battles to deal with. 

279
00:15:10,080 --> 00:15:12,760
So what were your challenges 
while you were trying to move 

280
00:15:13,200 --> 00:15:14,920
on? 
Although you do seem like you 

281
00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:16,720
fly, like you're an invisible 
person. 

282
00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:20,040
But as a pilot to pilot, how do 
you navigate all of these 

283
00:15:20,080 --> 00:15:23,320
challenges, if you have any? 
Yeah, the thing was, yeah, I had

284
00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:26,960
some friends, they was very good
in acro, so they teach me a lot.

285
00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:31,000
So this was also what helps me a
lot. 

286
00:15:31,760 --> 00:15:34,960
Sometimes if you have no people 
who can help you, then it's more

287
00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:37,680
difficult to get better. 
It's always good if you have 

288
00:15:37,680 --> 00:15:40,360
some friends, or even if you 
have no friends, you take some 

289
00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:43,600
SAV or you do some other stuff. 
Yeah. 

290
00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:47,760
Have you had decisions, Have you
had to take decisions in your 

291
00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:50,840
flying career where you had 
taken like calculated risk, 

292
00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:53,520
where you had to prioritize 
safety while pushing the 

293
00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:54,760
boundaries or anything like 
that? 

294
00:15:55,520 --> 00:15:59,120
Yeah, sometimes, of course, 
there is some reason, especially

295
00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:01,360
when I did this Himalaya 
crossing. 

296
00:16:01,840 --> 00:16:05,440
Sometimes you get in places 
there is windy and maybe you 

297
00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:09,440
expect, but then there is windy 
and there is no place to land. 

298
00:16:09,440 --> 00:16:12,240
But yeah, there is some bad 
moments for sure. 

299
00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:16,360
Some thanks. 
But you always have to find an 

300
00:16:16,360 --> 00:16:19,920
opinion on what you can do in 
the worst case. 

301
00:16:19,920 --> 00:16:23,160
When I go flying, I'm always 
looking for one opinion and 

302
00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:24,920
there is always something 
possible. 

303
00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:27,880
If you're in the worst place, 
maybe then you can soar up 

304
00:16:27,880 --> 00:16:30,440
somewhere. 
Or yeah, I'm sure it's also 

305
00:16:30,440 --> 00:16:33,160
sometimes a little bit luck, but
luck is also good. 

306
00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:36,240
We need also luck in our life, 
for sure. 

307
00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:41,320
I have also a lot of that, but 
a. 100% you know, and while 

308
00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:43,720
you're talking about the 
Himalayan crossing, I remember 

309
00:16:43,720 --> 00:16:46,280
about the harness rescue that 
you did. 

310
00:16:46,760 --> 00:16:49,160
Let's, let's talk a little bit 
about that one when you were 

311
00:16:49,160 --> 00:16:53,920
flying at 6500 plus or something
and you picked up A harness of 

312
00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:56,480
another pilot and brought it 
back to the main landing in 

313
00:16:56,480 --> 00:16:59,800
Saudi. 
Yeah, let's let's bring that one

314
00:16:59,800 --> 00:17:01,960
into the show, man, because I 
think that will cover up a lot 

315
00:17:01,960 --> 00:17:04,079
of topics. 
How did that flight pan out? 

316
00:17:04,079 --> 00:17:06,880
And if you can just talk to our 
audiences a little bit about it 

317
00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:08,280
and then we'll pick it up from 
there on. 

318
00:17:08,960 --> 00:17:14,160
Yeah, 11, friend of mine, he 
landed there and then he fall in

319
00:17:14,160 --> 00:17:17,240
the river. 
Then they pick him up with the 

320
00:17:17,280 --> 00:17:21,280
chopper and then he was back in 
Manali. 

321
00:17:21,280 --> 00:17:24,000
And then I went to Manali to 
speak with him. 

322
00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:30,160
And luckily in Manali I got some
ropes and some rescue kits. 

323
00:17:30,600 --> 00:17:32,800
And he told me he let all the 
gear there. 

324
00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:36,040
And I say, oh, interesting, what
do you do with this stuff there?

325
00:17:36,040 --> 00:17:38,760
And then he'll say, aye, aye, if
you take it, you can have it. 

326
00:17:38,760 --> 00:17:41,080
And we're like, OK, this sounds 
like a deal. 

327
00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:50,000
So I got 100 meter rope and lots
of other things for safety and I

328
00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:54,840
had my good choose with me and 
then I hiked up on Manali like 

329
00:17:54,840 --> 00:17:57,840
maybe 1000 meter with round 
circle kilos. 

330
00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:02,920
Then from this point I took off 
and then I flew to direction 

331
00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:07,720
Parapengal because I was behind 
the glacier on on the river 

332
00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:11,840
direction to Parapengal and he 
give me the coordinates and he 

333
00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:16,400
told me the chopper pilot said, 
oh, I at least you put the 

334
00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:18,680
glider very well. 
I can see very well the red 

335
00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:21,720
color in the what just I 
remember. 

336
00:18:21,720 --> 00:18:24,720
So I flew above on 4000 and I 
looked down. 

337
00:18:24,720 --> 00:18:26,960
I'm like, OK, this looks like a 
red point. 

338
00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:32,040
This looks good. 
So I land on 4000. 

339
00:18:32,040 --> 00:18:36,880
Then after I hack down and on up
on the air, I saw already one 

340
00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:39,680
place where it was flat where I 
can put my tent. 

341
00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:42,520
So I went into the to prepare 
everything. 

342
00:18:42,520 --> 00:18:46,280
And then I see also where I want
to or where I was sleeping. 

343
00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:48,400
There was everywhere, holes 
around. 

344
00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:52,520
And for sure you see the even 
the pull from the bear. 

345
00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:55,520
So I know there is some bears 
around. 

346
00:18:56,240 --> 00:18:59,560
But yeah, like what to do? 
They're not used to humans so 

347
00:18:59,560 --> 00:19:03,120
much there because there is I 
think there is not much people 

348
00:19:03,120 --> 00:19:06,240
there. 
So I was like OK, if something 

349
00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:09,320
will happen and make some noise.
So that put some sound on my 

350
00:19:09,320 --> 00:19:11,560
speakers because I always fly 
with speakers. 

351
00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:15,240
So I was like OK, if that is 
something happened, I put some 

352
00:19:15,240 --> 00:19:20,040
noise even I went to sleep. 
Then I even looked some YouTube,

353
00:19:20,040 --> 00:19:23,320
some videos. 
I download some videos just to 

354
00:19:23,320 --> 00:19:27,360
remind me how how to make the 
knots proper again, because if 

355
00:19:27,360 --> 00:19:29,640
you don't use long time, 
sometimes you forget. 

356
00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:31,400
Yeah. 
Then I checked everything again 

357
00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:34,160
and then I went to sleep. 
Even I had some noise. 

358
00:19:34,160 --> 00:19:38,120
I put some music full on and 
then after half an hour turn it 

359
00:19:38,120 --> 00:19:43,400
off and I start to sleep again. 
Yeah, the day after I just left 

360
00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:47,160
my tent there. 
Then I hiked down and then I 

361
00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:50,840
found the place where it was and
it was like quite steep. 

362
00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:53,960
It was actually very steep. 
So I found one tree on the top. 

363
00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:58,480
I put the rope on the top and 
then I went down to the water. 

364
00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:02,440
The river. 
Yeah, actually it was very funny

365
00:20:02,440 --> 00:20:05,720
because it was like on the front
and on the backside there was 

366
00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:10,320
full of ice and more or less 
like full ice and glacier. 

367
00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:14,200
And in the middle there was a 
hole where the guy fall in too. 

368
00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:20,200
Luckily he got stuck before the 
river goes again under the water

369
00:20:20,200 --> 00:20:24,920
or under the ice. 
I was hiking on these places. 

370
00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:27,040
It was a little bit scary 
because it was everywhere 

371
00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:30,320
cracks. 
But I hiked with my safety line 

372
00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:34,360
and I was like OK in worst case 
get stuck on the rope. 

373
00:20:34,840 --> 00:20:39,600
Then I hiked on the other side 
of the river and then I see it's

374
00:20:39,600 --> 00:20:42,040
not so deep. 
So I put all my clothes off and 

375
00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:46,480
then I went in naked on this 
place to keep my stuff dry 

376
00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:49,080
because if you go out of the 
water, of course it's super 

377
00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:51,080
cold. 
It's a glacier water, you know, 

378
00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:55,120
it's super freezing. 
So I jumped there on the rock 

379
00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:59,600
and then I see this harness and 
then I put see, OK, it looks not

380
00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:01,480
bad. 
OK, I put it on the side of 

381
00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:05,320
course was full water and stuff.
Then I try, I think it was 

382
00:21:05,320 --> 00:21:07,760
Albania. 
I, I tried to get this glider 

383
00:21:07,760 --> 00:21:12,000
out, but because it was already 
three or four days in the water 

384
00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:16,440
because of bad weather, I tried 
to put it a little bit and it 

385
00:21:16,440 --> 00:21:20,280
was like, so I say, OK, the 
glider I can forget because it's

386
00:21:20,280 --> 00:21:24,680
super stuck in the rock. 
And so I put the harness out. 

387
00:21:24,840 --> 00:21:28,520
I tried it a little bit. 
I put even the rest to no, I let

388
00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:30,760
everything together and I put it
in my back. 

389
00:21:31,040 --> 00:21:35,040
And then I climb up again on 
this place with my rope. 

390
00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:38,760
And when I was in the top again,
I keep going in the forest a 

391
00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:42,000
little bit more. 
And then suddenly I heard some 

392
00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:44,640
noise when I was hiking there. 
And then I look on the right 

393
00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:46,840
side. 
I'm like, oh, oh, there was a 

394
00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:50,560
bear 20 meters next to me. 
There was one bear. 

395
00:21:50,560 --> 00:21:54,120
And the bear also realized me 
and he turned around and then he

396
00:21:54,120 --> 00:21:57,760
stand there was a tree line and 
then he stand on the tree like 

397
00:21:57,760 --> 00:22:01,360
this was looking me like then I 
was looking him. 

398
00:22:01,360 --> 00:22:05,320
I'm like, oh, oh, then I make 
some noise and then make me a 

399
00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:08,680
little bit bigger. 
And then suddenly he watched me 

400
00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:11,320
two, three seconds. 
And then he turned around and 

401
00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:14,720
there was very sleep. 
And then he started to run up 

402
00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:17,600
there. 
I really hear how he was 

403
00:22:17,600 --> 00:22:20,320
breathing. 
It was like just like, because 

404
00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:24,360
he was full running up and this 
was a scary moment. 

405
00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:29,120
But also, yeah, I always wanted 
to see a bear, so I hit up my 

406
00:22:29,160 --> 00:22:36,040
pocket. 
No way, man. 

407
00:22:38,360 --> 00:22:43,000
Then after I hiked back to my 
tent and then I opened all the 

408
00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:48,080
stuff and I tried the harness 
and I opened the reserve and 

409
00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:51,520
tried everything. 
At this point I put everything 

410
00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:54,320
my tent. 
Then I packed everything again 

411
00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:59,240
and I think I slipped on three 
fives, so it was 500 meters to 

412
00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:01,560
hike up again with all the 
stuff. 

413
00:23:02,640 --> 00:23:06,520
So then I packed my stuff and I 
looked on the other side of I 

414
00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:09,560
looked on the other side of the 
other Ridge and then I'm like 

415
00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:13,200
something is moving there and 
I'm like Philip, now you're so 

416
00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:15,240
on there, you're getting crazy, 
you know. 

417
00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:18,200
So I stopped again in the back 
and I looked again. 

418
00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:22,160
I'm like, for sure it's moving. 
There is another bear bear, but 

419
00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:24,560
was far away. 
It was not closed, but I was 

420
00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:28,840
like a little bit scared because
I had all my stuff. 

421
00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:34,680
I led some stuff from 4000 
meter, my glider, my harness and

422
00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:37,760
I remember there were some 
almonds inside and was like oh 

423
00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:41,000
hopefully the bear the other 
bear is not there and looking 

424
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:44,440
for my almonds so I can. 
Would be very shitty if they 

425
00:23:44,440 --> 00:23:46,720
destroy your glider and then 
you're stuck there. 

426
00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:51,200
There was also all the time 
sinking when I was hiking up to 

427
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:52,960
my glider. 
Wow. 

428
00:23:53,360 --> 00:23:55,240
I mean, I don't know where to 
start. 

429
00:23:55,240 --> 00:23:56,640
Yeah, but keep going. 
Keep going. 

430
00:23:57,120 --> 00:23:58,760
Yeah. 
And then up there, when I was up

431
00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:04,320
there, there was like 35 case 
wind, side wind because there 

432
00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:07,440
was the glacier and I think 
there was the glacier down wind 

433
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:11,160
was pushing outside. 
So, so it was quite tricky, 

434
00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:13,360
especially with two harness to 
take off. 

435
00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:17,280
I had some rope. 
I put the other harness under my

436
00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:21,360
ass. 
And yeah, so it took me two or 

437
00:24:21,360 --> 00:24:25,200
three takes off take offs 
because one time I got up and 

438
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:29,560
the glider was shooting and then
I got the collapse and I was 

439
00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:32,800
again on the ground. 
And then on the third time or 

440
00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:36,720
the second time I managed. 
But yeah, you cannot really 

441
00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:40,240
proper move before this harness.
The other one is behind your 

442
00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:42,720
under you. 
So you're a little bit, I don't 

443
00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:47,600
know how to say you'll feel very
like you have another 50 

444
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:50,400
kilomore or something like 
because you cannot move really 

445
00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:52,440
proper. 
But somehow I managed. 

446
00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:56,000
Then it takes me in the 
beginning a little bit of while 

447
00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:58,840
to get some nice hike. 
But then at one point I got the 

448
00:24:58,840 --> 00:25:03,120
Super nice journey and then went
up to 6550 I think. 

449
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:07,640
And then I start to fly to 
Parabang to the break in 

450
00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:10,280
chamber. 
And then after I jump out, I get

451
00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:13,880
another good hike and then I 
jump out and jump charge you bus

452
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:17,280
and come back to Peru. 
You know what? 

453
00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:21,480
Let me start with this question.
Was it worth it? 

454
00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:24,160
Well, of course was nice 
adventure man. 

455
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:31,240
No, I like these things to do. 
If I have one idea in my mind 

456
00:25:31,880 --> 00:25:33,840
what I want to do, I will try, 
you know? 

457
00:25:36,120 --> 00:25:39,400
You're kidding me, man. 
You had a beer 20 meters from 

458
00:25:39,400 --> 00:25:42,240
you and you knew that was 
possible and you were going 

459
00:25:42,240 --> 00:25:44,360
naked in glacier water and stuff
like that. 

460
00:25:44,360 --> 00:25:48,120
That's like, that's brutal, man.
Like what kind of adventure are 

461
00:25:48,120 --> 00:25:49,920
you chasing? 
What's your curiosity? 

462
00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:53,040
Tell us about it. 
Let us into your mind a little 

463
00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:55,120
bit. 
How do you approach these 

464
00:25:55,120 --> 00:25:56,600
things? 
What? 

465
00:25:56,640 --> 00:26:00,600
What makes you do them? 
Yeah, in the end you just have 

466
00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:03,560
to be safe on the landings. 
No, if you're good in the 

467
00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:06,440
landings, then everything is 
good. 

468
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:08,680
No, you don't have to push so 
far. 

469
00:26:09,080 --> 00:26:14,320
So you can even I had put for me
like for 3-4 days if if I say, 

470
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:17,680
OK, I don't manage. 
I just make a bebop there and 

471
00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:19,320
then try my time. 
But on the other side, I'm 

472
00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:21,680
interesting, OK. 
I want to see the place where he

473
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:24,840
land and this and that. 
And then I'm like, I'll get like

474
00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:27,200
more interesting. 
And then you get motivated. 

475
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:28,320
I like down there. 
Oh yeah. 

476
00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:29,280
OK. 
Oh yeah. 

477
00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:30,240
Rope. 
OK. 

478
00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:31,600
Yeah. 
Put down the rope on ice. 

479
00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:36,040
Go down there with the rope. 
So this is a very nice thing 

480
00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:38,080
what you can do. 
Yeah. 

481
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:41,480
Yeah. 
So basically, if I have to sum 

482
00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:45,640
it up, it's like curiosity plus 
the confidence in your skills 

483
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:49,920
because you've worked for it, 
and the sense of adventure all 

484
00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:53,920
basically come together when you
design an adventure or when you 

485
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:57,840
design to go out there and chase
our lighting, if I understand it

486
00:26:57,840 --> 00:26:59,880
correctly. 
Yeah, this is right. 

487
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:03,880
I don't have to prove anything. 
Somebody like can do what they 

488
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:07,440
want and but this was for me a 
good mission. 

489
00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:11,000
This sounds nice to pick up the 
harness so that it is to look 

490
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:13,920
very stuffed, very land. 
Let's talk a little bit about 

491
00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:17,000
those days, man, because 
obviously you're flying for the 

492
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:19,800
majority of the day and you're 
making a lot of decision making 

493
00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:22,280
and I believe para lighting does
take a lot of energy. 

494
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:23,680
You know, it does make you 
tired. 

495
00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:26,240
So sleeping at the end at the 
night is not a problem. 

496
00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:29,880
But then how do you spend your 
how did you spend your time when

497
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:32,360
you were actually on the ground 
and when you were just, it was 

498
00:27:32,360 --> 00:27:36,080
just you and absolute wilderness
and not a human insight? 

499
00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:38,440
What was what? 
What were you doing then? 

500
00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:40,200
What what was your thought 
process and everything during 

501
00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:43,000
that time? 
While you're in China, it can be

502
00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:46,960
not beautiful or not more 
beautiful than you alone in a 

503
00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:51,040
mountain somewhere. 
I like it very much, so I I also

504
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:54,720
like it very much with friends. 
But if you're alone, it's also a

505
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:57,520
special feeling and there is 
always something to do. 

506
00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:00,960
Otherwise you hike up, sit on a 
rock and just watch a little 

507
00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:04,160
bit. 
And yeah, I always never get 

508
00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:07,200
boring there. 
Otherwise you'll make some nice 

509
00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:08,840
music. 
You Can Dance a little bit. 

510
00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:16,000
You should get a GoPro to record
all of this plan. 

511
00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:18,800
I think the world needs to know 
about what all you do. 

512
00:28:21,360 --> 00:28:28,680
Sometimes could be funny, yeah. 
100% I think the the inside life

513
00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:33,160
of Philip Zelenor is is going to
be even better than what what 

514
00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:36,160
the world knows from the outside
of over the Instagram or 

515
00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:39,640
Internet as we know. 
Probably people will get mad. 

516
00:28:44,120 --> 00:28:47,000
Interesting, interesting. 
Let let, let let's say when you 

517
00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:50,360
are are are, are you into 
teaching or are you mostly into 

518
00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:53,040
tandem or what's? 
How you tandem? 

519
00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:56,880
But I'm thinking to do some 
guiding also. 

520
00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:01,240
But yeah, I don't have to. 
So it's OK if some people say, 

521
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:05,120
OK, they have they want really 
to do it with me and then they 

522
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:09,600
have a certain amount of money 
that I will do otherwise I also 

523
00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:12,320
enjoy to fly by myself. 
This is for me also more 

524
00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:17,520
important because I will work 
there a half year and that I 

525
00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:21,760
don't fly much solo because of 
course you keep you busy, you 

526
00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:24,800
have to make advertisement, you 
have to speak with people and 

527
00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:26,680
sometimes speak with them that 
they fly with. 

528
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:31,520
So even for the big days here in
Australia, don't fly so much in 

529
00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:34,400
Australia. 
And on the big days, actually I 

530
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:36,120
should. 
But yeah, you cannot do 

531
00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:38,440
everything either. 
You decide that you make you 

532
00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:42,240
take your holiday in the winter.
You say, OK, I take my best days

533
00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:44,480
off here, but then you have to 
look. 

534
00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:47,080
And maybe then I should do more 
guiding. 

535
00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:48,800
But I like this is also a good 
one. 

536
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:53,160
I think just to be your student,
like that was the curiosity when

537
00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:55,600
I asked you that question. 
You have to be a special breed 

538
00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:58,920
to be able to follow your 
instructions or whether where 

539
00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:02,600
you take your guide as your 
clients land because you're 

540
00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:05,680
pushing the limit as far as it 
stretches, I think. 

541
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,000
Yeah. 
But of course with the clients, 

542
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:11,000
I would not push that much 
because that's why this is the 

543
00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:15,600
also the big thing where I like 
to fly by myself because then I 

544
00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:18,240
can push my limits. 
And this feel like in 

545
00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:22,640
competitions, most of the 
people, they are like pushing 

546
00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:25,840
not their limits. 
They pushing the limits because 

547
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:29,200
other people push. 
This is actually not the really 

548
00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:32,040
good thing. 
If let's say you don't fly for a

549
00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:35,960
long time and then you go to 
competition and then they push 

550
00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:39,360
because the other push, then 
it's getting there is more risk.

551
00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:43,320
Like for me, I only push when I 
feel confident. 

552
00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:45,960
Sometimes I I feel not like 
pushing. 

553
00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:48,720
It's always like, how is your 
feeling? 

554
00:30:48,720 --> 00:30:50,920
How is your day? 
You're a little bit tired or 

555
00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:54,600
maybe sometimes you sleep not 
good, sometimes you sleep good. 

556
00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:56,600
You feel like full power, then 
you try. 

557
00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:59,160
But that's why for me it's 
always important when I go for 

558
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:03,240
fever, something I don't look so
much about weight people. 

559
00:31:03,240 --> 00:31:06,280
I know many people that come 
with sleeping mattress, sort of 

560
00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:09,640
with very thin sleeping bag, you
sleep not very near. 

561
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:12,440
I don't care. 
I have my sleeping mattress, 

562
00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:17,160
it's 1K1 KG. 
And also my sleeping bag is 

563
00:31:17,160 --> 00:31:19,560
heavy, but it's a really good 
one. 

564
00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:22,680
And this is for me more 
important that I don't freeze in

565
00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:24,320
the night. 
So I sleep very well. 

566
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:28,280
So then the next days you're 
like 1000% and then you can 

567
00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:32,040
start again this. 
But I think if you do lots of 

568
00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:36,040
feedback and we want to cross 
something, I think this is very 

569
00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:40,680
important to do. 
No, I think what you're saying 

570
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:43,440
is that make sure you're well 
prepared for the adventure. 

571
00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:46,240
You don't sacrifice on that one 
and then you can chase the 

572
00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:49,960
adventure as hard as you want to
without being scared while the 

573
00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:55,040
adventure is going on. 
Exactly because no, I would not 

574
00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:58,440
always say I'm well prepared to 
have very good tear with me. 

575
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:02,640
But if I see other people, let's
see like Francois Radovski, when

576
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:06,040
he did this crossing, he had all
my waypoints. 

577
00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:09,000
He had some other waypoints 
where people were sleeping even.

578
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:12,680
He told me I shall look there is
what I look, there is this and 

579
00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:15,240
that. 
I'm like, OK, yeah, I did in a 

580
00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:16,880
different way. 
Everyone can. 

581
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:19,600
This is very professional how he
did for me. 

582
00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:24,600
I was flying, I took, I take off
at 10:00 or 11:00 me. 

583
00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:29,120
I don't care to fly 100 
kilometers or 150 or even 200. 

584
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:32,120
I was just like, I don't want to
land down in the valley beyond 

585
00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:33,960
hike. 
I just want to keep going with 

586
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:37,280
flying at 4:00. 
I always look for a place where 

587
00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:41,640
I can land and even where I can 
some find some water or 

588
00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:44,040
something. 
So mainly I was on the snow 

589
00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:48,040
line, close to the snow line. 
So there is always water, Yeah. 

590
00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:51,480
Oh, sounds exciting. 
And I think I would like to 

591
00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:53,960
touch upon the point that you 
said that when competition 

592
00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:57,640
pilots are all of those ones, 
they try to fly not for 

593
00:32:57,640 --> 00:32:59,960
themselves and they get 
influenced by the ones 

594
00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:03,360
surrounding them. 
I think this is a very human 

595
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:08,680
thing that when you are trying 
to be better like competition as

596
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:12,080
let's see who's the best. 
So everybody out there is trying

597
00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:15,880
to be the best of the rest. 
And when that happens, it's it's

598
00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:18,160
subconsciously plays with your 
mind. 

599
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:20,320
And this happens even in the new
beginner's course. 

600
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:23,680
I completely see that it 
happened with me, it happened 

601
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:26,400
with other students that I have 
seen, and it happened also in 

602
00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:29,960
the intermediate pilot syndrome 
that you want to be better than 

603
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:32,600
the other crowd. 
You seem to be navigating that 

604
00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:34,440
pretty successfully. 
The first thing is that you 

605
00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:37,680
don't fly with the crowd. 
You make your own lines and you 

606
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:41,600
make your own glory. 
But how do you is to not letting

607
00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:44,600
the others influence you, even 
though it is a very natural 

608
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:46,960
tendency for humans to get 
influenced by others? 

609
00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:50,480
Is it difficult to say because 
even in the beginning I told you

610
00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:53,240
when my friend make the first 
full stall, I went also up to 

611
00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:55,760
make the full stall. 
So I was also in this game. 

612
00:33:55,760 --> 00:34:01,920
But yeah, it's also not bad 
sometimes, but it's always you 

613
00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:05,920
have to think about how much you
spend time in the air. 

614
00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:09,560
If you don't spend much time in 
the air, you don't push too 

615
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:11,560
much. 
It's very difficult to say. 

616
00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:16,560
So I think we should let our 
listeners answer this question 

617
00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:20,639
for themselves, pretty much. 
Yeah, you have to find by 

618
00:34:20,639 --> 00:34:24,520
yourself the way how much you 
push, and I'm not here to tell 

619
00:34:24,520 --> 00:34:26,480
people you are. 
You're not pushing. 

620
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:30,199
You should not push because 
everyone can do what they want 

621
00:34:30,199 --> 00:34:34,600
and this is everyone's own SO. 
I see. 

622
00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:37,440
Let's talk about the Nepal to 
India crossing, which I think 

623
00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:40,800
you did in record time. 
Was it was seven days or how 

624
00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:45,239
long did you take? 
To completely India and Nepal 

625
00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:48,719
was like 13 days, 1300 
kilometers. 

626
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:51,840
And the previous record was, how
many days was that? 

627
00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:56,320
I don't know, I even don't 
didn't look before because this 

628
00:34:56,960 --> 00:35:00,200
to me it's just happened because
of the Corona thing. 

629
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:04,200
I say, OK, I will now go back to
Austria as well, to Nepal. 

630
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:08,720
And then there are one guy or 
the one friend, he text me, he 

631
00:35:08,720 --> 00:35:11,520
will also come to Nepal. 
I say, OK, if you have a house, 

632
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:13,560
you can come. 
That is a nice room. 

633
00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:15,400
You can spend there also your 
time. 

634
00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:19,160
And then they actually they come
up with the plan to fly to 

635
00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:23,160
Kathmandu or close to Kathmandu.
And I say, OK, this would be a 

636
00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:26,120
nice mission. 
And even if I like it, they keep

637
00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:28,320
going further. 
So I flew from Pokhara to 

638
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:32,400
Director Kathmandu and yeah, 
first there was two other 

639
00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:35,000
friends and he was flying 
together because they have the 

640
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:36,920
tent. 
One guy was not so fast. 

641
00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:40,160
So they stay together. 
And me, I keep going because I 

642
00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:42,040
say, OK, I don't know if they 
come in. 

643
00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:45,520
We said actually after 60 
kilometres we meet there. 

644
00:35:46,040 --> 00:35:49,520
But then I was not sure. 
And I say, OK, I keep going, I 

645
00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:53,080
will see what's going to happen.
And then I liked it so much that

646
00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:59,120
I crossed from Bokora into the 
east side, east side in four 

647
00:35:59,120 --> 00:36:02,720
days. 
And then I was in Dharan in the 

648
00:36:02,720 --> 00:36:04,680
city. 
I was flying there one day 

649
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:06,360
because it was a new spot for 
me. 

650
00:36:07,560 --> 00:36:11,520
And then the day after I went 
back with the bus to Bokara. 

651
00:36:12,360 --> 00:36:14,680
And then I think I make one or 
two days break. 

652
00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:18,160
Then I flew close to Anaborn. 
Now this was on my break day. 

653
00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:20,200
Yeah, I make, I want to make. 
I can fly. 

654
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:25,680
And then I went to 5200 on close
to Anaborn or two. 

655
00:36:26,360 --> 00:36:28,920
And this was also very nice, 
beautiful flight. 

656
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:32,720
And the day after I make a rest 
and then I saw OK, and now I 

657
00:36:32,720 --> 00:36:38,560
have again 4 good days, OK, I go
to the West side of Nepal and 

658
00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:41,920
then you have almost everyday 
100 kilometers or even more. 

659
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:45,240
So you're telling me they're 
just going with the flow and 

660
00:36:45,240 --> 00:36:47,960
things just happen for you? 
Is, is that how your flying is? 

661
00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:50,080
And it is that how it has been 
all your life? 

662
00:36:51,120 --> 00:36:55,120
Not all my life but then I 
always say it's same with work 

663
00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:57,760
or does something or do you get 
kicked out somewhere or I don't 

664
00:36:57,760 --> 00:37:00,200
know but are you quit with the 
girlfriend? 

665
00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:04,800
I always say one one door closed
and the other one opened. 

666
00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:09,560
This is my way of thinking. 
I love it man, but you must have

667
00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:13,400
done some a lot of things right 
to be in that position because 

668
00:37:13,600 --> 00:37:17,880
as you're trying like Annapurna 
or the handling the beer 

669
00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:21,200
encounter in a calm manner or 
planning the whole harness 

670
00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:25,360
rescue and smashing the records 
in the Himalayas with brand new 

671
00:37:25,360 --> 00:37:28,200
lines and all of that. 
So what, what, what I'm curious 

672
00:37:28,200 --> 00:37:30,600
is like, how did your hard work 
look like? 

673
00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:33,000
What all things like? 
There must have been times when 

674
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:34,560
you're like, Oh my God, this is 
so tiring. 

675
00:37:34,560 --> 00:37:37,480
But I know I have to do this to 
get better at flying. 

676
00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:40,760
So can you talk to our audiences
a little bit about like, how did

677
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,320
you reach this place in your 
flying career? 

678
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:44,840
Like where did you put in the 
effort? 

679
00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:48,520
Yeah, actually I don't push 
that. 

680
00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:50,560
I have to do. 
It's always OK. 

681
00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:54,640
I feel good too. 
I fly around even sometimes, if 

682
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:57,560
not the biggest flight, this 
means not like this is the best 

683
00:37:57,560 --> 00:38:00,040
flight. 
So if just you fly, I don't 

684
00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:03,120
know, half an hour and they're 
even much more beautiful than 

685
00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:05,560
the other big flights. 
What I have done all the time, 

686
00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:08,760
it's very difficult to say 
because you make a record. 

687
00:38:08,760 --> 00:38:11,240
This is the best flight. 
It's just a number. 

688
00:38:11,240 --> 00:38:14,520
And the other thing is more like
just enjoy what you do and then 

689
00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:19,120
it will come by themselves. 
I feel like, but also when I 

690
00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:25,280
make this, when I make the beer 
record at this 272 flying to 

691
00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:29,520
Kashmir on the border towards my
end of the crossing, actually, I

692
00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:32,640
will say, OK, I want to go to 
this end of the border of 

693
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:37,000
Himachal. 
So I started to fly there and 

694
00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:40,960
because of other friends he he 
left earlier, I said, OK, maybe 

695
00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:44,360
it would be nice to come back. 
And then I come back and then I 

696
00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:49,480
jump above Charles to pass. 
I see 240 kilometers. 

697
00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:52,680
What was the record? 
So actually I decided in the 

698
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:55,600
last maybe 2-3 hours to make the
record. 

699
00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:59,520
This was not didn't plan it. 
Sometimes I do, but this time I 

700
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:02,000
was not planning it. 
And then I was like the last 

701
00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:05,360
three hours. 
OK, OK, go after 360. 

702
00:39:06,040 --> 00:39:08,360
OK, turn around, fly back. 
You see? 

703
00:39:11,240 --> 00:39:14,000
The smile on your face tells me 
they want to find your lad 

704
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:17,200
chasing all these adventures. 
Man, that's super nice. 

705
00:39:17,240 --> 00:39:21,480
But I think you are the 
definition of keeping it fun and

706
00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:24,520
then doing it because a lot of 
times I've had my guests say, 

707
00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:27,280
and I've heard a lot of senior 
finals say that as long as it's 

708
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:28,680
fun, you should keep on doing 
it. 

709
00:39:29,120 --> 00:39:31,960
From you it it seems like you 
you pretty much do have a lot 

710
00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:33,040
of. 
Fun. 

711
00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:36,760
If you try to chase it too much,
it will not come. 

712
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:39,240
It will only come when you take 
it easy. 

713
00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:43,360
But for me also when I went to 
Colombia, I had also I should 

714
00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:46,560
try to break the record, but 
there was like was trying too 

715
00:39:46,560 --> 00:39:51,240
much I feel like. 
So then I realized also why to 

716
00:39:51,240 --> 00:39:55,680
fly the same route every day. 
I'm like OK, fuck that cheap man

717
00:39:55,680 --> 00:40:00,160
or not, I'm here to enjoy. 
So I do what I want. 

718
00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:04,600
Then I make a also a very nice 
speed work and I also then I 

719
00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:08,880
realized that's why I'm here for
it to do this what I like to do.

720
00:40:09,600 --> 00:40:13,840
Not to chase this record. 
So it's just, there are just 

721
00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:17,200
numbers or even if you make a 
short flight there, you fly 100 

722
00:40:17,200 --> 00:40:21,400
kilometre in One Direction, it 
can be much, it gives you more 

723
00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:24,440
back. 
I feel like when you fly 100 to 

724
00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:29,320
the not 100 time, but maybe you 
fly 1015 times, always the same 

725
00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:32,720
route and try to push a little 
bit more there, push a little 

726
00:40:32,720 --> 00:40:36,320
bit more there, then you look 
always off your average speed. 

727
00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:38,840
You're not fast, so you push 
more and then you end up 

728
00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:42,920
somewhere down there because he 
was like, fuck, I have to keep 

729
00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:46,200
the speed. 
And yeah, so it's better you 

730
00:40:46,200 --> 00:40:48,800
are. 
Just take it easy and go with 

731
00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:51,320
the flow and then things can 
happen as you. 

732
00:40:54,280 --> 00:40:57,120
Let me ask you this, Philippe. 
Do you have your flaws? 

733
00:40:57,360 --> 00:40:59,920
Do you, Are there times when 
you're angry with yourself at 

734
00:40:59,920 --> 00:41:01,360
all? 
Why did I do this? 

735
00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:03,080
Or I could have done better or 
something. 

736
00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:05,320
Like, do you do you face those 
challenges as well in your 

737
00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:08,520
flying? 
Well, of course you can, but on 

738
00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:12,560
the other hand you can be also 
why why you can be always worse.

739
00:41:12,600 --> 00:41:21,720
I could be already land there, 
so I'm already still in there 

740
00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:26,120
positive things. 
So life now if your focus always

741
00:41:26,120 --> 00:41:32,880
more positive Yeah, it's better.
No, even when I remember 1 

742
00:41:32,880 --> 00:41:36,000
friend of mine he was quite down
because of something happened 

743
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:39,480
and some bad stories. 
And then I told him yeah, but 

744
00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:42,640
good now no, even you cannot go 
more deeper now. 

745
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:46,520
It can be only going more after 
he was laughing and he said 

746
00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:52,960
actually you're true now I love 
the point of view. 

747
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:55,920
Man, it's and it's, it's so much
easier said than done, but the 

748
00:41:55,920 --> 00:41:59,360
moment you're able to make peace
with that, that it could have 

749
00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:01,400
been worse. 
And I'm so glad for that it was 

750
00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:03,000
there. 
That's I think that is a way to 

751
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:06,960
unlocking a lot of good things 
in life. 100% yeah, I think so 

752
00:42:06,960 --> 00:42:09,720
too. 
This is you think too much 

753
00:42:09,720 --> 00:42:13,280
negative is not good, No is 
there always positive and you 

754
00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:16,760
will always find some positive 
things in your life and 

755
00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:20,120
premature. 
I want to talk a little bit 

756
00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:22,280
about your. 
Inspirations Philippe have you 

757
00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:26,000
had mentors in the sport have 
you like how has your teachings 

758
00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:28,640
been or what are the pilots that
you have looked up to and how 

759
00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:31,880
how has that journey been for 
you in in your flying career? 

760
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:35,680
Yeah, actually I had some very. 
Good mentors, they was flying on

761
00:42:35,680 --> 00:42:38,720
all these competitions. 
So they was on the top in the 

762
00:42:38,720 --> 00:42:41,840
earlier days. 
And this was quite helping me a 

763
00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:45,720
lot because I remember when we 
were sitting together and we 

764
00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:49,680
there was all the old computers,
you know, and there was just 

765
00:42:49,880 --> 00:42:53,960
YouTube, I think was almost new.
And then you look videos with 

766
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:57,040
them and then you're like, ah, 
you see this guy makes a 

767
00:42:57,040 --> 00:42:59,000
collapse. 
You see he crashed. 

768
00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:03,040
And because of that and because 
he don't react, you see, then 

769
00:43:03,040 --> 00:43:05,600
they explain you how to make 
collapse and stuff. 

770
00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:08,560
And then the day after they fly 
next to you and say, Ah, no, 

771
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:11,200
it's your turn. 
Then he make next to you the 

772
00:43:11,200 --> 00:43:13,240
collapse. 
Ah, you can fly straight with 

773
00:43:13,280 --> 00:43:16,120
the collapse. 
And then you try and then in the

774
00:43:16,360 --> 00:43:20,280
beginning, of course you're 
scary, but and you're OK, OK, 

775
00:43:20,280 --> 00:43:23,840
what he told me yesterday, I 
have to pull the right side and 

776
00:43:23,840 --> 00:43:26,720
make a little bit way. 
Chief told you not too much and 

777
00:43:26,720 --> 00:43:30,160
this and that. 
And then you see actually it's 

778
00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:31,680
true. 
And then it's also the good 

779
00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:34,800
thing if you believe on them. 
I see also another friend. 

780
00:43:35,400 --> 00:43:37,040
He was always making some 
mistake. 

781
00:43:37,040 --> 00:43:40,280
And then they told him, hey, you
make this and this mistake and 

782
00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:44,080
he didn't get the input. 
So he was always like doing the 

783
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:46,360
same. 
He didn't change what he told 

784
00:43:46,360 --> 00:43:49,160
him. 
This is also when some good 

785
00:43:49,160 --> 00:43:53,200
people or some acro people would
fly very good and they tell you 

786
00:43:53,200 --> 00:43:56,400
something for sure. 
He see what which mistake you 

787
00:43:56,400 --> 00:43:58,040
make. 
If you say, OK, this is the 

788
00:43:58,040 --> 00:44:02,160
mistake, OK, I tried to do this 
a little bit different and I 

789
00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:03,600
know it's working. 
OK. 

790
00:44:03,600 --> 00:44:06,760
Thank you very much. 
You know, now I think sharing. 

791
00:44:06,760 --> 00:44:09,880
Experiences is very important in
our community, definitely when, 

792
00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:13,520
especially when you share risky 
situations and learn from each 

793
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:16,400
other, that goes a very long 
way. 

794
00:44:17,440 --> 00:44:20,720
And, and, and the role of 
mentorship in, in, in developing

795
00:44:20,720 --> 00:44:24,160
sound decision making skills is,
is also, I think pretty 

796
00:44:24,160 --> 00:44:27,800
important in, in navigating the 
spectrum of risk versus reward 

797
00:44:27,800 --> 00:44:30,800
in paragliding. 
What kind of makes me curious is

798
00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:35,560
that how do you place a trust 
factor in someone that you are 

799
00:44:35,560 --> 00:44:38,000
taking knowledge from? 
Of course, first of all, it's 

800
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:40,400
the willingness of sharing the 
knowledge of the person, right? 

801
00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:43,040
He can be one of the best 
pilots, but if he's not willing,

802
00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:46,120
he or she is not willing, then 
of course, it's very difficult 

803
00:44:46,120 --> 00:44:49,920
to place your trust factor. 
But once you have had that, OK, 

804
00:44:49,920 --> 00:44:53,400
this person is willing to share,
how, how did you figure out 

805
00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:56,040
whether the person is 
trustworthy or not or whether 

806
00:44:56,040 --> 00:44:59,160
those informations that are 
coming from him are valuable for

807
00:44:59,160 --> 00:45:01,960
you to intake or not? 
Because that is another Gray 

808
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:05,360
area which I see a lot of pilots
in, but. 

809
00:45:05,360 --> 00:45:08,520
This is also difficult to find 
out you know, some people are 

810
00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:12,320
very good and some people are 
not so very good. 

811
00:45:12,320 --> 00:45:15,600
In explaining meet example, I 
remember my ex-girlfriend, she 

812
00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:19,600
was always asking me how to make
this and this I'm like how it 

813
00:45:19,600 --> 00:45:21,000
works. 
I just do it. 

814
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:24,080
And then you have it was also 
difficult to me. 

815
00:45:24,080 --> 00:45:28,600
I have to remember how I do 
because if you do things, a lot 

816
00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:32,960
of times you get used too and 
you know how to do, but you 

817
00:45:32,960 --> 00:45:35,680
don't think anymore. 
Like with the acro maneuvers you

818
00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:39,440
make Misty and then how to 
explain Misty, OK, you have to 

819
00:45:39,960 --> 00:45:43,120
pull on this side, but the other
side you also stabilize a little

820
00:45:43,120 --> 00:45:47,160
bit, especially in the end. 
And so it's then you're again, 

821
00:45:47,560 --> 00:45:52,840
if you start this maneuver so 
that if you're just doing the 

822
00:45:52,840 --> 00:45:57,000
learning in the beginning, then 
you remember, then you remember 

823
00:45:57,000 --> 00:46:01,560
more, I would say, because then 
you do, you try always something

824
00:46:01,560 --> 00:46:03,560
new and OK, this is because of 
that. 

825
00:46:03,560 --> 00:46:07,400
But then if you fly to this 
maneuver, since I don't know, 

826
00:46:07,400 --> 00:46:10,800
5-10 years and then you don't 
think about too much. 

827
00:46:10,840 --> 00:46:14,520
So for me, sometimes it's also 
difficult to explain some people

828
00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:18,640
how to make this maneuver 
because I do it too many times 

829
00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:22,120
already forget to explain 
actually. 

830
00:46:22,880 --> 00:46:27,280
So it's sometimes even if it's a
good pilot, this can be the same

831
00:46:27,280 --> 00:46:32,200
like me, explain sometimes some 
things is maybe not so good but 

832
00:46:32,200 --> 00:46:34,160
I'll try sometimes to keep my 
best. 

833
00:46:35,720 --> 00:46:38,880
I love your honesty man. 
Love your honesty in this regard

834
00:46:38,880 --> 00:46:44,160
and that's so nice. 
I think what a lot of audiences,

835
00:46:44,160 --> 00:46:47,200
audience members are curious 
about and have been wanting to 

836
00:46:47,200 --> 00:46:50,120
ask you this is that why don't 
you compete bro? 

837
00:46:50,280 --> 00:46:54,760
What's stopping you from 
smashing excels or experience or

838
00:46:54,760 --> 00:46:56,840
any of these? 
I can flies when you live that 

839
00:46:56,840 --> 00:46:58,960
for so long, if you're 
comfortable answering that. 

840
00:46:59,520 --> 00:47:02,640
Yeah, I'm actually. 
The thing is there is many 

841
00:47:02,640 --> 00:47:05,520
things competing is always 
saying why you do that. 

842
00:47:06,320 --> 00:47:08,320
It's more for what I would like 
to do. 

843
00:47:08,320 --> 00:47:12,280
The Trilix helps if I can get in
and stuff like that. 

844
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:15,640
But on the other hand, it's my 
man time where I make my money. 

845
00:47:15,640 --> 00:47:18,520
So it's again then you have to 
find some sponsor. 

846
00:47:18,520 --> 00:47:22,280
It's a lot of work. 
It's not only about physical to 

847
00:47:22,280 --> 00:47:28,200
get feet and to get better and 
flying and experience and going 

848
00:47:28,200 --> 00:47:30,760
the route and looking for the 
places. 

849
00:47:31,240 --> 00:47:32,920
It's also more in the 
background. 

850
00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:38,760
Lots of paperwork and yeah. 
And you look at the outlets 

851
00:47:38,760 --> 00:47:41,640
there taking full power and then
then what they get. 

852
00:47:41,720 --> 00:47:43,320
I know what you mean, right? 
I know what you mean. 

853
00:47:43,320 --> 00:47:44,840
We don't have to go there, don't
worry. 

854
00:47:45,040 --> 00:47:48,080
Let's stay in different way. 
I would like to complete. 

855
00:47:48,080 --> 00:47:51,800
Itself with you for sure. 
Very good adventure I think as 

856
00:47:51,800 --> 00:47:54,080
well. 
Could be very funny as well. 

857
00:47:54,080 --> 00:47:57,720
For sure. 
Suffering as well of course. 

858
00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:00,240
Look at them just running all 
the time. 

859
00:48:00,240 --> 00:48:12,440
If there is bad weather, which 
OK, go, no, but yeah, it's 

860
00:48:12,440 --> 00:48:16,520
always why just that you can say
I compete the six Alps. 

861
00:48:16,520 --> 00:48:20,680
Yeah, it would be nice for the 
adventure for sure. 

862
00:48:21,640 --> 00:48:24,320
But then I have to find some 
people who taking care of my 

863
00:48:24,320 --> 00:48:26,080
company. 
Because now in the moment, my 

864
00:48:26,080 --> 00:48:31,720
company is quite well on my 
Internet seems looks very good. 

865
00:48:31,720 --> 00:48:36,720
And if if I give my company to 
somebody who messed it up, then 

866
00:48:36,720 --> 00:48:40,520
I was working for the last 
couple of years very hard. 

867
00:48:41,160 --> 00:48:43,240
I was working very hard the last
couple of years. 

868
00:48:43,240 --> 00:48:47,440
For that my company is very 
proper and a good level. 

869
00:48:47,440 --> 00:48:50,480
Now I have also very good pilots
in my company. 

870
00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:53,640
Yeah, I don't want to mess this 
up. 

871
00:48:54,360 --> 00:48:58,960
This is lots of degrees. 
Why I'm not competing yet? 

872
00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:04,000
Definitely and passion projects.
Take a lot of effort to reach up

873
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:06,480
to a certain level and I can 
only have respect for the amount

874
00:49:06,480 --> 00:49:08,760
of work that you must have put 
into this passion project of 

875
00:49:08,760 --> 00:49:12,400
yours, the T Roll air. 
So if any of our listeners are 

876
00:49:12,400 --> 00:49:15,760
are interested to fly tandems 
in, in Austria, in the in the 

877
00:49:15,760 --> 00:49:18,720
town of T Roll, I think we're 
going to put your website in the

878
00:49:18,720 --> 00:49:21,600
show notes and they can reach 
out to you and get a little bit 

879
00:49:21,600 --> 00:49:25,800
of a glimpse of the amazing 
flights and all these epic 

880
00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:28,600
adventures that you bring in 
into their lives with you. 

881
00:49:29,240 --> 00:49:34,160
You're most welcome. 
Only I was even thinking to do 

882
00:49:34,200 --> 00:49:38,960
like in India, but just for 
pilots, if somebody say, ah, OK,

883
00:49:38,960 --> 00:49:44,920
I want to fly somewhere in the 
back mountains and guiding or 

884
00:49:44,920 --> 00:49:48,360
like coaching. 
But if the tandem, because then 

885
00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:51,960
you have the people on the front
of you and you can explain them 

886
00:49:52,240 --> 00:49:55,320
straight why you do that, 
because this of that and the 

887
00:49:55,320 --> 00:49:57,400
wind of that. 
And then the German comes up 

888
00:49:57,400 --> 00:50:01,480
there, you can explain much more
because you feel confident 

889
00:50:01,480 --> 00:50:05,320
because they don't have to fly. 
Because if you do coaching 

890
00:50:05,320 --> 00:50:10,120
example, I would say then the 
people already in a place or 

891
00:50:10,120 --> 00:50:12,640
they have to take the terminal, 
they're already stressed. 

892
00:50:12,640 --> 00:50:17,760
So I think it's also a very good
way to do this coaching on the 

893
00:50:17,760 --> 00:50:19,880
tandem. 
So if there is somebody 

894
00:50:19,880 --> 00:50:24,040
interested, you can ask me also 
for that in India to fly in the 

895
00:50:24,040 --> 00:50:25,800
back mountains with me with the 
tandem. 

896
00:50:26,760 --> 00:50:30,200
Wow, are you? 
Offering possible beer 

897
00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:34,720
encounters as well if if 
requested on extra charges or 

898
00:50:34,920 --> 00:50:37,320
beer sightings somewhere during 
the flight. 

899
00:50:37,840 --> 00:50:40,040
Because I think you know a lot 
about Black Mountain and where 

900
00:50:40,040 --> 00:50:42,800
the wildlife is now, considering
how much you've been there so 

901
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:45,120
many times. 
Yeah, if somebody will to do. 

902
00:50:45,120 --> 00:50:48,440
That then they are able to pay 
something then it will be 

903
00:50:48,480 --> 00:50:50,680
possible. 
And I am also happy to fly by 

904
00:50:50,680 --> 00:50:54,840
myself. 
I said all the before, it's like

905
00:50:54,840 --> 00:50:58,120
more my holiday, but I'm really 
some people are really 

906
00:50:58,120 --> 00:51:01,480
interested in it and say, OK, 
why? 

907
00:51:02,120 --> 00:51:05,560
And then they would say or that 
they would see that they can 

908
00:51:05,600 --> 00:51:09,080
learn a lot of that because in 
the end, the guiding or coaching

909
00:51:09,080 --> 00:51:12,560
should be just could be that 
they get a little bit better and

910
00:51:12,560 --> 00:51:16,560
feel more confident. 
And I feel like you you can how 

911
00:51:16,560 --> 00:51:19,680
to explain this. 
You can be like more like a 

912
00:51:19,680 --> 00:51:21,960
sponge. 
You get more input or you can 

913
00:51:21,960 --> 00:51:25,680
keep it because on the radio or 
you talk with the other guys 

914
00:51:25,680 --> 00:51:29,560
flying by himself and you just 
try to explain it's we'll go in 

915
00:51:29,560 --> 00:51:32,480
on the other side of the air and
go out on the other side because

916
00:51:32,480 --> 00:51:38,000
already focus on being in the 
air and don't mess it up or 

917
00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:40,560
something like this. 
Sometimes it's bumpy conditions 

918
00:51:40,560 --> 00:51:44,960
then you're a full focused on 
this to stay in this thermal and

919
00:51:44,960 --> 00:51:47,760
on the tandem and behind of 
them. 

920
00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:50,360
And then I can tell them a 
little bit pumpy. 

921
00:51:50,360 --> 00:51:53,520
But yeah, we will manage and 
then we will do that and then we

922
00:51:53,760 --> 00:51:56,080
take the Valley win. 
We go a little bit longer if the

923
00:51:56,080 --> 00:51:58,760
Valley win because we're a 
little bit faster and this and 

924
00:51:58,760 --> 00:52:01,120
that. 
And yeah, I think it's a 

925
00:52:01,120 --> 00:52:03,760
coaching. 
I know I I completely. 

926
00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:07,240
Agree, sharing knowledge is is 
the best way to spread it and I 

927
00:52:07,240 --> 00:52:10,880
think especially at at your 
caliber, one-on-one coaching 

928
00:52:10,880 --> 00:52:14,080
will be really beneficial for 
the ones who are going in for 

929
00:52:14,080 --> 00:52:16,320
it. 
So definitely for our listeners 

930
00:52:16,320 --> 00:52:19,440
who are interested, contact 
Philippe in the show notes and 

931
00:52:19,440 --> 00:52:23,080
we will have all the details 
there on how to reach him when 

932
00:52:23,080 --> 00:52:25,480
he's on the ground. 
When he's in the air, you can 

933
00:52:25,480 --> 00:52:27,960
only look up and try and spot 
him somewhere in the sky. 

934
00:52:32,400 --> 00:52:34,800
Continue you cannot say see on 
Caribbean. 

935
00:52:34,840 --> 00:52:37,160
That's good. 
That's good to have a spot. 

936
00:52:37,360 --> 00:52:43,480
Very agreed that everyone should
fly with a spot but me. 

937
00:52:43,480 --> 00:52:46,840
I did all my stuff, but I did 
all everything about the in 

938
00:52:46,840 --> 00:52:49,400
rich. 
I don't know, I feel like it's 

939
00:52:49,400 --> 00:52:51,320
different. 
You have to more they care about

940
00:52:51,320 --> 00:52:53,040
it anyway. 
You have to take care of it. 

941
00:52:53,560 --> 00:52:55,600
You're not like because I have a
in rich. 

942
00:52:55,600 --> 00:52:57,880
I can be stupid and make stupid 
decisions. 

943
00:52:57,880 --> 00:53:03,520
It's always, yeah. 
But I say also, I know what is 

944
00:53:03,520 --> 00:53:10,880
the risk of doing that, and I'm 
OK with that because, yeah, I 

945
00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:14,000
love to fly like this. 
And I always say if I don't have

946
00:53:14,320 --> 00:53:16,560
it, I don't need it. 
It's always good to have a 

947
00:53:16,560 --> 00:53:18,640
backup. 
I think that is what I'm going 

948
00:53:18,640 --> 00:53:22,200
to endorse to the audiences and 
it's always good to fly over the

949
00:53:22,200 --> 00:53:25,680
spot in GPS. 
So please make sure you choose 

950
00:53:26,080 --> 00:53:29,680
make that decision wisely. 
There is also There is some. 

951
00:53:29,680 --> 00:53:31,600
Climb bars to climb without 
rope. 

952
00:53:31,600 --> 00:53:34,840
There is also like a reason why 
I feel like it's different. 

953
00:53:34,840 --> 00:53:38,000
So if you look at the solo climb
bar without rope, without 

954
00:53:38,000 --> 00:53:40,320
anything might told you lots of 
risk. 

955
00:53:41,640 --> 00:53:44,160
But there is the special 
feeling. 

956
00:53:44,160 --> 00:53:47,280
And then I think we are again 
back in the adrenaline stuff. 

957
00:53:47,280 --> 00:53:52,560
So if it's smarter than not, 
actually not, but no actually I 

958
00:53:52,560 --> 00:53:55,080
can resonate to. 
That and I, let's talk a little 

959
00:53:55,080 --> 00:53:58,040
bit about this, because I was 
doing via ferrata a few days 

960
00:53:58,040 --> 00:54:02,320
back somewhere here in Norway 
and it was a fairly difficult 

961
00:54:02,320 --> 00:54:05,440
climb. 
It was, it required some level 

962
00:54:05,440 --> 00:54:07,360
of skill and some level of 
strength and everything. 

963
00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:12,160
But there was a time in my climb
when I realized that the 

964
00:54:12,160 --> 00:54:14,680
Caribbeaner, the Securian 
Caribbeaner, which was connected

965
00:54:14,680 --> 00:54:18,440
to the rope, was just giving a 
mental piece. 

966
00:54:18,680 --> 00:54:22,200
I wasn't really using it. 
I wasn't really putting my load 

967
00:54:22,200 --> 00:54:24,640
on it. 
And of course, when you look 

968
00:54:24,640 --> 00:54:26,920
down and we look around you, 
you're like, Oh my God, this 

969
00:54:26,920 --> 00:54:29,040
isn't so exposed. 
I'm right on the edge of the 

970
00:54:29,040 --> 00:54:31,680
mountain on the ledge and 
anything could happen. 

971
00:54:31,680 --> 00:54:35,600
But just because you have a 
carabiner, your heart rate isn't

972
00:54:35,600 --> 00:54:38,440
shooting up, your mind isn't 
going very crazy, but because 

973
00:54:38,440 --> 00:54:41,760
there's is is mentally you're 
feeling very secure because you 

974
00:54:41,760 --> 00:54:45,000
have a security. 
So what I do understand is that 

975
00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:47,680
of course it is possible to take
away that security of the 

976
00:54:47,680 --> 00:54:50,400
carabiner and the rope and do 
it. 

977
00:54:51,280 --> 00:54:55,760
But what I don't understand is 
that when will you reach a 

978
00:54:55,760 --> 00:54:59,040
decision that, yes, now it is OK
to remove that carabiner. 

979
00:54:59,040 --> 00:55:03,440
Now I want to go full focus only
on climbing and not on that 

980
00:55:03,440 --> 00:55:05,760
because in reality it is just, 
let's say, reserve. 

981
00:55:05,760 --> 00:55:08,760
It's just a mental piece, right?
Yeah, well, that's a mental 

982
00:55:08,800 --> 00:55:11,760
piece. 
Yeah, so. 

983
00:55:11,880 --> 00:55:15,240
That that is a such a difficult 
question because I'll tell you 

984
00:55:15,240 --> 00:55:16,920
what I don't. 
I would call it stupidity 

985
00:55:16,920 --> 00:55:20,840
because I flew without a reserve
for a few flights when I was a 

986
00:55:20,840 --> 00:55:22,960
90 hour old pilot. 
Although there were some 

987
00:55:22,960 --> 00:55:24,960
logistical reasons for it and 
everything like that. 

988
00:55:25,400 --> 00:55:30,240
But to be honest I did not feel 
I did not feel scared or I did 

989
00:55:30,240 --> 00:55:31,680
not feel that I was doing 
something stupid. 

990
00:55:31,680 --> 00:55:33,360
I just felt normal and this was 
in beef. 

991
00:55:33,840 --> 00:55:37,320
Although just for our listeners 
perspective, as soon as I got a 

992
00:55:37,320 --> 00:55:40,400
reserve in 2-3 days, I deployed 
it as well for the first time in

993
00:55:40,400 --> 00:55:43,960
my life. 
I don't know if was I stupid 

994
00:55:43,960 --> 00:55:46,760
flying without a reserve, but I 
was flying safe. 

995
00:55:46,760 --> 00:55:48,920
And then the moment I got a 
reserve, I was like, all right, 

996
00:55:48,920 --> 00:55:50,680
let me just push the bar. 
Let me just do this. 

997
00:55:51,680 --> 00:55:54,240
Do you have anything to talk 
about this topic, anything to 

998
00:55:54,240 --> 00:55:56,400
say on this? 
This is very difficult line. 

999
00:55:56,400 --> 00:55:58,920
To say, I mean, come on man, we 
are being open to. 

1000
00:55:58,920 --> 00:56:00,320
Each other. 
Let's talk about difficult 

1001
00:56:00,320 --> 00:56:01,680
things. 
There's no better person than 

1002
00:56:01,680 --> 00:56:03,120
you to talk about difficult 
things. 

1003
00:56:03,120 --> 00:56:04,840
No. 
And then it's as you feel, no? 

1004
00:56:04,840 --> 00:56:08,080
I was also with my father one 
time on how you call it. 

1005
00:56:08,200 --> 00:56:10,200
We are. 
We are ATA and very bad. 

1006
00:56:10,720 --> 00:56:12,840
Yeah, yeah. 
And then? 

1007
00:56:12,880 --> 00:56:16,080
He took the rope and I said, OK,
I will, I will make it without 

1008
00:56:16,080 --> 00:56:18,960
because I was hiking just 
already one or two times before 

1009
00:56:18,960 --> 00:56:20,840
and I feel hard. 
It's not so difficult. 

1010
00:56:20,840 --> 00:56:24,400
And I just want to know how you 
feel different. 

1011
00:56:24,400 --> 00:56:27,120
And then I hacked up without and
it was everything was good and 

1012
00:56:27,120 --> 00:56:29,360
was possible and was not too 
difficult. 

1013
00:56:29,360 --> 00:56:33,000
But it's only a mental. 
These things are mostly mental. 

1014
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:37,360
And I think it's also funny to 
play this mental game. 

1015
00:56:39,200 --> 00:56:45,480
Yeah, but this is again, I don't
know, call it stupid, but what 

1016
00:56:45,480 --> 00:56:48,280
is secure in the life? 
This is the other question, 

1017
00:56:48,360 --> 00:56:52,600
right of the street we can have 
anywhere in the accident. 

1018
00:56:52,760 --> 00:56:55,080
Most of the people, they die in 
the bedroom. 

1019
00:56:57,000 --> 00:57:00,440
Would you like to? 
Say that having no security 

1020
00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:04,840
makes us more secure because we 
don't take as many unnecessary 

1021
00:57:04,840 --> 00:57:06,800
risks. 
If we have to sum up this topic.

1022
00:57:08,720 --> 00:57:12,000
Yeah, I don't know. 
I try always never to take risk 

1023
00:57:12,000 --> 00:57:14,240
if I have some safety stuff with
me. 

1024
00:57:14,240 --> 00:57:18,840
So it's yeah, All right. 
I think we can leave it at. 

1025
00:57:18,840 --> 00:57:21,720
That and let let the audiences 
decide for themselves. 

1026
00:57:21,720 --> 00:57:24,680
Although it's a very difficult 
question, but answers are very 

1027
00:57:24,680 --> 00:57:28,160
individualistic and people can 
only answer for themselves. 

1028
00:57:28,480 --> 00:57:31,400
Yeah, I think it's better. 
Let's be politically correct. 

1029
00:57:31,400 --> 00:57:35,440
For for for this one in here. 
But for the we are reaching the 

1030
00:57:35,440 --> 00:57:38,840
end of time and before before I 
try to wrap, before I start to 

1031
00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:42,400
wrap it up, I just want to know 
have you had to deal with any 

1032
00:57:42,400 --> 00:57:45,000
setbacks in in your career? 
Have you had to deal with 

1033
00:57:45,000 --> 00:57:48,800
challenges? 
And if yes, then what was your 

1034
00:57:48,800 --> 00:57:51,800
strategy in overcoming them and 
making sure that they never come

1035
00:57:51,800 --> 00:57:54,160
back again or anything like that
challenge? 

1036
00:57:54,200 --> 00:57:57,280
You mean if you make? 
Some mistakes or something like 

1037
00:57:57,280 --> 00:58:00,120
this, let's say of. 
Course no. 

1038
00:58:00,120 --> 00:58:01,960
Sometimes many. 
Times you make mistakes. 

1039
00:58:01,960 --> 00:58:06,480
No, but it's also, I remember 
one time in Guatemala, I fall in

1040
00:58:06,480 --> 00:58:10,320
my lines and then I just hardly 
opened my rescue and I was on 

1041
00:58:10,320 --> 00:58:13,560
the ground. 
But this I was not scared after 

1042
00:58:13,560 --> 00:58:17,200
to fly because I know what I 
make, which mistake I made. 

1043
00:58:17,200 --> 00:58:22,240
No, so it's always depends. 
If you know what was the 

1044
00:58:22,240 --> 00:58:24,000
problem, I think then you're not
too scared. 

1045
00:58:24,000 --> 00:58:27,360
But if you're don't know what's 
going on, what was happening, 

1046
00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:31,080
then I think you have a problem 
because you don't know what's 

1047
00:58:31,760 --> 00:58:34,480
what's the problem. 
So the knowledge gap basically. 

1048
00:58:34,480 --> 00:58:37,720
You're saying as long as you 
have the knowledge then fixing 

1049
00:58:37,720 --> 00:58:41,760
it is easy and if you don't have
then it's a grey area that that 

1050
00:58:41,760 --> 00:58:44,760
might be scary to navigate? 
Yeah, if you make a problem. 

1051
00:58:44,760 --> 00:58:46,920
And you don't know what's going 
to what was happening. 

1052
00:58:46,920 --> 00:58:50,560
If you get the collapse and you 
don't know why because you don't

1053
00:58:51,240 --> 00:58:54,400
react to the something, then you
will be always scared about the 

1054
00:58:54,400 --> 00:58:57,560
collapses. 
You have a collapse and then OK,

1055
00:58:57,560 --> 00:58:59,640
I bumped 2-3 times. 
Now it's open again. 

1056
00:58:59,680 --> 00:59:01,760
Carded. 
Carded while we're talking about

1057
00:59:01,760 --> 00:59:03,680
this. 
One, do you have a certain way 

1058
00:59:03,680 --> 00:59:07,160
of risk assessment while you 
plan out your adventures? 

1059
00:59:07,160 --> 00:59:09,120
What's your thought process? 
Because I know you're very 

1060
00:59:09,120 --> 00:59:11,920
spontaneous and you like going 
out, as you've explained in the 

1061
00:59:11,920 --> 00:59:15,280
past almost an hour in the show,
but what still what? 

1062
00:59:15,440 --> 00:59:17,520
How do you start thinking about 
an adventure? 

1063
00:59:17,520 --> 00:59:20,640
How do you start? 
Like how do you visualize is I 

1064
00:59:20,640 --> 00:59:22,640
think what I was asking 
visualize. 

1065
00:59:23,640 --> 00:59:25,440
I don't think too much is 
something better. 

1066
00:59:25,440 --> 00:59:35,640
No easier way. 
No, I just go with the flu 

1067
00:59:36,680 --> 00:59:38,840
mainly. 
I go with my feeling what I have

1068
00:59:38,840 --> 00:59:43,080
in my stomach even sometimes I 
tried to push and I said oh it's

1069
00:59:43,080 --> 00:59:45,160
a good day I should do 
something. 

1070
00:59:45,920 --> 00:59:51,280
Then if I feel like I know, I 
just turn around and sometimes 

1071
00:59:51,280 --> 00:59:57,120
I've like in beer example, I try
to fly and I see then I try and 

1072
00:59:57,120 --> 00:59:59,440
then I feel like I feel not 
good. 

1073
00:59:59,440 --> 01:00:01,120
So I fly back and land on golf 
course. 

1074
01:00:01,120 --> 01:00:04,000
I play a little bit around and 
say, OK, take it easy, don't 

1075
01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:08,640
worry, everything is good. 
No, it's like even if I miss, 

1076
01:00:08,880 --> 01:00:10,760
it's a good day. 
I say I just enjoy. 

1077
01:00:11,640 --> 01:00:15,280
But I remember last year or at 
this time I was like, it was a 

1078
01:00:15,280 --> 01:00:17,760
good day. 
But then I was like. 

1079
01:00:18,920 --> 01:00:20,640
Somehow feels a little bit 
wrong. 

1080
01:00:21,240 --> 01:00:23,600
So I flew back. 
I land in the Hot Springs. 

1081
01:00:23,600 --> 01:00:26,040
I heck down. 
I was sitting one hour in the 

1082
01:00:26,040 --> 01:00:29,520
hot water, enjoy my time there. 
I heck up again. 

1083
01:00:29,520 --> 01:00:31,920
I fled back out and I'm super 
happy to do that. 

1084
01:00:32,360 --> 01:00:35,200
People come back. 
I did this nice big flight. 

1085
01:00:35,200 --> 01:00:38,960
I'm like, oh, I did this nice 
big mission or the big mission, 

1086
01:00:38,960 --> 01:00:40,520
small mission in the Hot 
Springs. 

1087
01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:44,960
Oh, I love it, man. 
I. 

1088
01:00:45,080 --> 01:00:47,960
Love your outlook at the whole 
adventure, the way you changed 

1089
01:00:47,960 --> 01:00:52,800
it, and it seems like you're at 
peace with the reward and of 

1090
01:00:52,800 --> 01:00:55,720
course the risk versus reward. 
And that's I think the best way 

1091
01:00:55,720 --> 01:00:57,520
to navigate it. 
It's so foolproof. 

1092
01:00:58,160 --> 01:01:01,400
Yeah, I never have time because 
if I go somewhere, I take my 

1093
01:01:01,400 --> 01:01:02,960
time. 
I don't go there for two weeks. 

1094
01:01:03,520 --> 01:01:04,560
People go in there for two 
weeks. 

1095
01:01:04,560 --> 01:01:07,080
Of course they have to push you 
want to more. 

1096
01:01:07,080 --> 01:01:11,160
For me, I say OK, if it's not 
happened, I don't care, you 

1097
01:01:11,160 --> 01:01:13,800
know? 
Got it, Got it, Philippe. 

1098
01:01:14,240 --> 01:01:16,440
I think Philippe, before we wrap
it up, usually there's a 

1099
01:01:16,440 --> 01:01:19,440
tradition on paralleling Atlas 
where I ask my guests to share 

1100
01:01:19,440 --> 01:01:23,760
11 flight that has stood out 
from their lives that that they 

1101
01:01:23,760 --> 01:01:25,920
can remember. 
I'll be very thankful if you can

1102
01:01:25,920 --> 01:01:29,800
share with our audiences one 
such airtime that you've had, 

1103
01:01:29,800 --> 01:01:32,520
which kind of stuck with you and
which you're very thankful, and 

1104
01:01:32,520 --> 01:01:36,520
which you've looked, be it a be 
it a pleasant or unpleasant 1, 

1105
01:01:36,520 --> 01:01:39,920
whatever your choice. 
Yeah, the hacking fly. 

1106
01:01:39,920 --> 01:01:42,080
Was nice. 
It was not really nice for my 

1107
01:01:42,080 --> 01:01:46,200
friend, but it was also a nice 
adventure because I went just 

1108
01:01:46,200 --> 01:01:49,120
for a hacking fly and then I 
went to golf course. 

1109
01:01:49,120 --> 01:01:52,680
I went there and then somebody 
told me my friend crashed on Big

1110
01:01:52,680 --> 01:01:57,360
face. 
And then they say ah, you come 

1111
01:01:57,360 --> 01:01:59,920
down and then you open because 
he was sleeping with me in the 

1112
01:01:59,920 --> 01:02:01,760
same room. 
And then they say ah, we need 

1113
01:02:01,760 --> 01:02:04,600
the passport and blah blah blah.
They say no, I will not go 

1114
01:02:04,600 --> 01:02:05,840
there. 
Like go to Big Face. 

1115
01:02:05,840 --> 01:02:09,280
Where is my friend lying? 
So I took off again and then 

1116
01:02:09,680 --> 01:02:13,000
only with shorts. 
So I land on 3000 meter with 

1117
01:02:13,000 --> 01:02:18,200
shorts and then luckily Debu was
also landing there and Alex, one

1118
01:02:18,200 --> 01:02:21,120
other Austrian guy was already 
before there. 

1119
01:02:21,760 --> 01:02:28,200
And then we had to spend the 
whole night I think 2428 hours 

1120
01:02:28,200 --> 01:02:30,280
till the chopper come. 
We have to spend there on the 

1121
01:02:30,280 --> 01:02:33,520
mountain stream. 
And it was crazy. 

1122
01:02:33,520 --> 01:02:36,480
It was for him, super painful 
sometimes. 

1123
01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:40,440
But in the end, it was a story I
will never forget. 

1124
01:02:40,440 --> 01:02:43,760
I have a good friend, one of the
best friend, and he's lying 

1125
01:02:43,760 --> 01:02:46,960
there and he's suffering. 
But yeah. 

1126
01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:51,480
And then this was managed to 
have as good time as possible. 

1127
01:02:51,480 --> 01:02:54,560
And even when he was laughing, 
sometimes he was like, oh, it's 

1128
01:02:54,560 --> 01:02:56,760
so painful. 
But I'm like, oh, sorry. 

1129
01:03:00,080 --> 01:03:01,720
Yeah. 
But at the end now everything is

1130
01:03:01,720 --> 01:03:04,160
good. 
Now we can laugh about this 

1131
01:03:04,160 --> 01:03:06,440
things now. 
But yeah, at one point I was 

1132
01:03:06,440 --> 01:03:09,280
already very sad. 
But luckily everything went on 

1133
01:03:09,280 --> 01:03:11,560
the good timeline. 
Yeah. 

1134
01:03:12,600 --> 01:03:13,920
Love it, man. 
And I think. 

1135
01:03:14,200 --> 01:03:17,720
Camaraderie and airmanship is 
such an important part of our 

1136
01:03:17,720 --> 01:03:22,160
sport, and the way your actions 
were that they probably helped 

1137
01:03:22,160 --> 01:03:25,640
your friend mentally a lot, 
which was way more important 

1138
01:03:25,640 --> 01:03:29,240
than any anything else. 
So good to hear that, Philippe. 

1139
01:03:29,320 --> 01:03:32,400
I wish they make more pilots 
like you in the air and also on 

1140
01:03:32,400 --> 01:03:34,120
the ground. 
Yeah. 

1141
01:03:34,960 --> 01:03:39,360
Yeah, yeah. 
Yeah, you should. 

1142
01:03:39,360 --> 01:03:42,320
Open up a Philippe Philippe 
Zelander training Academy or 

1143
01:03:42,320 --> 01:03:48,640
something like that for yeah, 
spread the knowledge from that. 

1144
01:03:49,560 --> 01:03:51,680
The podcast can only reach so 
many people. 

1145
01:03:51,840 --> 01:03:53,720
Your teaching has to influence 
more. 

1146
01:03:53,720 --> 01:03:56,480
But yeah, of course, I think 
you're doing whatever you can in

1147
01:03:56,480 --> 01:03:59,480
your own way, yeah. 
All right. 

1148
01:03:59,480 --> 01:04:03,160
Philippe, I think on that note, 
it is a perfect time to call it 

1149
01:04:03,160 --> 01:04:06,160
quits for now. 
Although your adventures and 

1150
01:04:06,160 --> 01:04:10,720
your stories are endless and I 
think we can definitely hope to 

1151
01:04:10,720 --> 01:04:14,240
bring you back whenever next 
possible for you with a new 

1152
01:04:14,240 --> 01:04:18,640
topic so we can share and spread
the word of paragliding and 

1153
01:04:19,040 --> 01:04:22,480
everything around it to our 
audiences and your followers and

1154
01:04:22,480 --> 01:04:25,640
fans. 
So for now, it's been an 

1155
01:04:25,640 --> 01:04:29,000
absolute pleasure and honor, 
Philippe, and I hope you touch 

1156
01:04:29,000 --> 01:04:31,840
the sky with glory and time to 
come, as you have been so far. 

1157
01:04:32,480 --> 01:04:33,520
Yeah. 
Thank you very much. 

1158
01:04:33,520 --> 01:04:38,320
For your time to have you in 
your show and probably see you 

1159
01:04:38,320 --> 01:04:42,800
soon in India or somewhere. 
Sounds like a plan man as. 

1160
01:04:42,800 --> 01:04:44,240
Long as it's your time, I'm in.