1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:03,120 Coming up today on Mini Tech Scrolls, a Sydney based musician 2 00:00:03,120 --> 00:00:07,080 calls out an AI performer and who booked them, how Calci and 3 00:00:07,080 --> 00:00:10,720 Spotify are rigging the charts and a gay dating app using AI 4 00:00:10,720 --> 00:00:14,320 men to lure in users. Hey everyone and welcome to Mini 5 00:00:14,320 --> 00:00:16,200 Scroll. The daily Internet culture 6 00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:19,000 podcast bring you the biggest stories from social media, the 7 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:22,040 creator economy and the digital space every Monday through 8 00:00:22,040 --> 00:00:25,120 Thursday and sometimes Fridays. My name is Annabelle and I'm 9 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:28,480 your Wednesday Mini Tech Scroll host and also the deputy editor 10 00:00:28,480 --> 00:00:32,080 of Australian Youth Digital media brand Centennial World. 11 00:00:32,320 --> 00:00:35,160 Welcome back to Minitex Girl for another Wednesday. 12 00:00:35,320 --> 00:00:38,480 Before we get into the stories this week, I feel like I have to 13 00:00:38,480 --> 00:00:41,360 note, I don't know if it sounds like it, but to me it sounds 14 00:00:41,360 --> 00:00:44,800 like I'm losing my voice. So I'm really sorry if I sound a 15 00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:46,720 little bit croaky throughout this episode. 16 00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:50,160 I do have some tea sitting next to me and I'm not even a tea 17 00:00:50,160 --> 00:00:52,200 drinker, but we do what we got to do. 18 00:00:52,480 --> 00:00:55,120 And to be honest, it probably didn't help that on my way in 19 00:00:55,120 --> 00:01:00,080 today, I was singing along to Ariana Grande's probably loudest 20 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:03,440 album, Dangerous Woman. So I may have made things worse. 21 00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:06,360 But yes, other than that, Please remember to rate, review, and 22 00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:09,840 subscribe all of the things. It's all super helpful, 23 00:01:09,840 --> 00:01:12,880 especially as we're testing a new thumbnail and title 24 00:01:12,880 --> 00:01:15,360 structure. So also feel free to let us know 25 00:01:15,360 --> 00:01:18,440 what you think of that. OK, let's get into the content 26 00:01:18,440 --> 00:01:20,560 for this week. So the first story I have today 27 00:01:20,560 --> 00:01:24,720 is actually a Local 1 and I do really enjoy covering more local 28 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:27,400 stories every once in a while because I don't know if it's 29 00:01:27,400 --> 00:01:30,120 something that you guys who are not based in Sydney may have 30 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:33,000 heard of. So for our first story today, a 31 00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:35,880 Sydney artist has taken to social media to reveal that 32 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:39,800 their band was booked to play alongside an AI artist. 33 00:01:39,840 --> 00:01:43,080 Like I said, this is a little bit of a niche one, but I do 34 00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:45,440 also think it's quite important to cover these stories, 35 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:49,560 especially when it comes to AI because it's showing how AI is 36 00:01:49,560 --> 00:01:53,960 changing slash impacting industries at the local level 37 00:01:54,160 --> 00:01:58,240 and obviously in this instance, it is the creative space. 38 00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:02,120 Anyway, Last week, a musician named Aiden took to Instagram to 39 00:02:02,120 --> 00:02:04,760 share a recent experience he had playing a gig. 40 00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:09,000 So he performed alongside his band at a local venue in Newtown 41 00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:12,160 called Bootleggers for an event called Mixed Bag. 42 00:02:12,160 --> 00:02:16,320 The purpose of the Mixed Bag event series is to platform and 43 00:02:16,320 --> 00:02:19,320 highlight emerging local artists which which is obviously very 44 00:02:19,320 --> 00:02:23,160 important and this event is booked by a Marrickville based 45 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:26,320 music Services Agency. Good Intent and for a little bit 46 00:02:26,320 --> 00:02:29,680 more context on Mixed Bag, attendees do have to pay and it 47 00:02:29,680 --> 00:02:34,040 costs about 20 AUD each. So the key players in this story 48 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:38,240 are Aiden Bootleggers, which is the venue, and Good Intent which 49 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:40,720 did the booking ahead of this episode. 50 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:44,320 I did contact Aiden and Good Intent for comment. 51 00:02:44,320 --> 00:02:47,240 Aiden did get back to us in time for our deadline, but Good 52 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:50,280 Intent did not. So in Aiden's Instagram video, 53 00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:53,880 he alleged that the artist that played before him was AI 54 00:02:53,880 --> 00:02:57,000 generated or was producing AI generated music. 55 00:02:57,280 --> 00:02:59,920 He said he was only aware of this when a member of another 56 00:02:59,920 --> 00:03:03,240 band on the lineup had actually looked through the Instagram of 57 00:03:03,240 --> 00:03:05,560 this artist and then informed them about it. 58 00:03:05,760 --> 00:03:09,040 As for how Aiden felt when he realized that there was an AI 59 00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:12,160 artist on line up, he says that he was quote shocked and 60 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:15,360 confused at first, not only at how that was allowed to happen, 61 00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:18,200 but also at how that would actually work in a live setting. 62 00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:20,720 When I thought about it more, the confusion turned into 63 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:24,000 concern at the direction the live music scene is headed in. 64 00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:26,960 I do think Aiden's initial reaction is definitely something 65 00:03:27,040 --> 00:03:30,520 we can all relate to because when I first saw this video, one 66 00:03:30,520 --> 00:03:34,400 of my first questions was how does an AI artist even work in a 67 00:03:34,400 --> 00:03:37,760 live setting? And Aiden does go on to clarify 68 00:03:37,760 --> 00:03:40,240 what he means by an AI generated artist. 69 00:03:40,240 --> 00:03:43,720 In the video, he claims that the social media presence of this 70 00:03:43,720 --> 00:03:47,320 artist seemed to be dominated by AI visuals and what he believed 71 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:50,160 to be AI generated music over top of it. 72 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,280 And it seems that the way this artist performed was that there 73 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:57,280 was indeed a human on the stage and they were singing over the 74 00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:00,040 top of what seems to be AI generated music. 75 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:03,400 But let's listen to Aidan's video from Instagram. 76 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:06,920 Last night I played a gig at Bootleggers in Newtown, Sydney 77 00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:10,200 and the artist that played before us was AI generated. 78 00:04:10,360 --> 00:04:13,240 Our band was playing as part of 1 of Bootleggers mixed bag 79 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:15,920 events, the line UPS of which are put together by the agency. 80 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:18,600 Good intent. The artists do not have control 81 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:21,160 over the line up. At no point was it disclosed to 82 00:04:21,160 --> 00:04:23,200 us that we would be playing with an AI artist. 83 00:04:23,440 --> 00:04:26,840 As a musician it is a complete insult to be put on a line up 84 00:04:26,840 --> 00:04:30,400 with someone who uses technology that can only exist because of 85 00:04:30,400 --> 00:04:34,080 the large scale theft of the work of my other fellow human 86 00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:36,240 musicians. I don't know if Good Intent was 87 00:04:36,240 --> 00:04:38,680 aware that this was an AI generated artist when they 88 00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:41,200 booked them. If they weren't then whoever is 89 00:04:41,240 --> 00:04:44,240 looking for them needs to do a little bit more research as I 90 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:47,240 mean just look at the account. It's fairly obvious what's going 91 00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:49,120 on here. As streaming platforms become 92 00:04:49,120 --> 00:04:52,600 increasingly inundated with AI slop, live music must be 93 00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:55,360 defended as an Ave. for human creative expression. 94 00:04:55,680 --> 00:04:59,320 There is no place for generative AI slop in the live music scene. 95 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:01,680 The appeal of live performance is that it is raw. 96 00:05:01,680 --> 00:05:03,560 It is passionate in that it is human. 97 00:05:03,840 --> 00:05:06,920 AI music delivers none of this, while robbing the opportunity to 98 00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:10,080 do so from genuinely talented human musicians who can. 99 00:05:10,520 --> 00:05:13,160 As this becomes more commonplace, venues are going to 100 00:05:13,160 --> 00:05:16,280 need to work harder to protect the very human artists that have 101 00:05:16,280 --> 00:05:18,880 kept patrons coming through their doors before the scene 102 00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:21,320 that keeps them alive dies off entirely. 103 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:27,320 So this video currently has over 350 K views and over 22 K likes. 104 00:05:27,320 --> 00:05:30,160 The comments are all super, super supportive and I'm sure 105 00:05:30,160 --> 00:05:33,800 that was a really reassuring for Aiden because he told us that 106 00:05:33,800 --> 00:05:37,200 his decision to speak about it publicly was because he felt, 107 00:05:37,200 --> 00:05:40,000 quote, that if it wasn't spoke about, it could easily slip 108 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:42,880 through the cracks again. So he has definitely brought 109 00:05:42,880 --> 00:05:45,240 significant awareness to this issue. 110 00:05:45,280 --> 00:05:48,240 And I did also ask him if this kind of thing is something he is 111 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:52,200 seeing more and more in the live music space as a musician, or 112 00:05:52,200 --> 00:05:54,440 whether this was like an isolated incident. 113 00:05:54,880 --> 00:05:58,080 And in response to that, he said that he hopes it's an isolated 114 00:05:58,080 --> 00:06:00,400 incident quote. But if it's not addressed at an 115 00:06:00,400 --> 00:06:03,480 early age, it could easily become a bigger issue with live 116 00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:05,920 musicians finding it increasingly hard to compete 117 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:09,400 with cheaper AI options. And I think that is definitely a 118 00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:12,360 valid concern. Now, as you probably had in 119 00:06:12,360 --> 00:06:15,600 Aiden's video, he didn't name the AI artist. 120 00:06:15,600 --> 00:06:18,400 And I'm going to follow his lead here because I don't really want 121 00:06:18,400 --> 00:06:21,600 to give traction to this artist necessarily. 122 00:06:21,880 --> 00:06:25,800 But I did go have a look at this artist Instagram profile because 123 00:06:25,800 --> 00:06:29,200 obviously I was curious and it definitely does seem to 124 00:06:29,200 --> 00:06:32,840 incorporate some kind of AI to promote the performance at 125 00:06:32,840 --> 00:06:35,480 bootleggers. The artist said a promotional 126 00:06:35,480 --> 00:06:40,040 poster which read quote one human 2 robots pop music. 127 00:06:40,040 --> 00:06:44,040 So with that it's very clear that the music is generated with 128 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:48,120 AI to some degree. In fact this was confirmed by 129 00:06:48,120 --> 00:06:50,960 the Sydney Morning Herald and I'm going to presume that this 130 00:06:50,960 --> 00:06:55,280 person is most likely making this AI generated music through 131 00:06:55,360 --> 00:06:58,720 SUNO, but there is no confirmation of that on the 132 00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:02,560 artist profile. According to the bio of this 133 00:07:02,560 --> 00:07:07,360 artist, they are a Sydney based Afro pop band made-up of 3/2 of 134 00:07:07,480 --> 00:07:12,160 which are avatars and one is the lyricist and producer and it 135 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:16,040 said in live performances the lyricist is the one who performs 136 00:07:16,040 --> 00:07:21,280 the band's songs on stage and he adds his vocals to the avatars 137 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:23,880 voices. They say that down the line they 138 00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:27,400 will have more performers added to this rotation and it's 139 00:07:27,400 --> 00:07:31,440 unclear if that means AI quote UN quote performers or human 140 00:07:31,440 --> 00:07:34,120 performers. So from my description of this 141 00:07:34,120 --> 00:07:37,400 artist's Instagram profile, I think I can say that it's fairly 142 00:07:37,480 --> 00:07:41,880 obvious that this artist is AI. So with that in mind, I think a 143 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:44,680 lot of people were worried about the fact that the booking agency 144 00:07:44,680 --> 00:07:48,120 didn't seem to care or they were just unaware of it. 145 00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:51,560 And this, of course, along with Aiden's video gaining traction, 146 00:07:51,840 --> 00:07:54,760 prompted bootleggers and Good Intent to post a shared 147 00:07:54,760 --> 00:07:57,200 statement to Instagram. The statement was written from 148 00:07:57,200 --> 00:08:00,480 the perspective of Rob Carroll, who is the founder and director 149 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:02,360 at Good Intent. And I'll read you part of the 150 00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:05,240 statement now quote, I'll take full responsibility. 151 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:07,880 I didn't look at this particular artist's social and their 152 00:08:07,880 --> 00:08:10,280 representatives. Communications used word 153 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:12,280 inconsistent with genuine artists. 154 00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:15,640 Their representative described them to us as a producer who 155 00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:19,080 used live vocals in their sets. This person was booked through 156 00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:21,680 an agency who presented themselves as professional. 157 00:08:21,800 --> 00:08:24,680 I hadn't seen them live, but now looking at their socials, their 158 00:08:24,680 --> 00:08:27,080 content is clearly and blatantly AI. 159 00:08:27,160 --> 00:08:30,840 Good Intent and bootleggers have never knowingly and will never 160 00:08:30,840 --> 00:08:33,559 book people who use AI to generate music. 161 00:08:33,559 --> 00:08:36,799 For those who don't know us. Good Intent is passionate about 162 00:08:36,799 --> 00:08:39,760 supporting and doing the right thing by real artists. 163 00:08:40,039 --> 00:08:42,559 We'll ensure we review our vetting processes moving 164 00:08:42,559 --> 00:08:44,680 forward. We'd never want to be placed in 165 00:08:44,680 --> 00:08:47,480 this position where we're encouraging the use of AI and 166 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:50,960 financially supporting the theft from artists on which AI is 167 00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:53,160 trained to put our money where our mouth is. 168 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:56,240 Bootleggers and Good Intent will also make a donation to Support 169 00:08:56,240 --> 00:08:58,040 ACT. So the response to this 170 00:08:58,040 --> 00:09:01,240 statement has been quite positive, with many social media 171 00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:04,560 users and Sydneysiders appreciative that Good Intent 172 00:09:04,560 --> 00:09:07,320 took accountability. And honestly, this statement 173 00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:10,600 could be used as a blueprint for brands slash companies to 174 00:09:10,680 --> 00:09:14,800 address AI usage or I guess platforming AI when it's not 175 00:09:14,800 --> 00:09:16,560 something that they intended to do. 176 00:09:16,760 --> 00:09:19,760 It felt quite honest in that they like readily took 177 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:21,960 responsibility for what went down. 178 00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:25,240 When I read this statement, my first thought was actually how 179 00:09:25,240 --> 00:09:29,040 different this was to huff his response to their alleged AI 180 00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:30,960 use. Granted, this is a different 181 00:09:30,960 --> 00:09:34,000 situation, but I thought it was an interesting comparison of how 182 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:37,640 one company immediately admitted to wrongdoing and the other did 183 00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:42,240 not and how that impacted how social media users approached 184 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:45,040 the quote UN quote scandal. In case you missed it, I did 185 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:48,200 report on the Hoffa situation a couple of weeks ago. 186 00:09:48,200 --> 00:09:52,520 But as a reminder, a New Zealand based model named Elijah accused 187 00:09:52,520 --> 00:09:56,120 Hoffa, which is a New Zealand St. wear brand of using AI 188 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:59,720 generated models in campaigns. And if you want more detail I 189 00:09:59,720 --> 00:10:02,880 will link the episode where I covered it in the description. 190 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:06,840 But to make a Long story short, Hoffa really doubled down on the 191 00:10:06,840 --> 00:10:11,040 fact that they did not use AI in the way Elijah was alleging. 192 00:10:11,440 --> 00:10:15,600 And that may be true, but the way they did so was honestly 193 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:18,280 quite distasteful. Representatives from the brand 194 00:10:18,280 --> 00:10:22,440 went on TV and also ended up insulting slash intimidating 195 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:25,840 Elijah in the process. It was honestly crazy. 196 00:10:26,080 --> 00:10:29,240 Many people felt like Hoffa was truly ruining their reputation 197 00:10:29,240 --> 00:10:32,320 and it was just kind of like an overall PR disaster for them. 198 00:10:32,320 --> 00:10:35,040 And obviously this was quite a different approach to good 199 00:10:35,040 --> 00:10:36,720 intent. But before I speak about that a 200 00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:40,080 little bit more, there are some updates on the Hoffa situation 201 00:10:40,080 --> 00:10:42,720 that I wanted to quickly note. The most recent update is that 202 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:45,240 Hoffa commissioned an independent forensic 203 00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:47,840 investigation into the AI allegations. 204 00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:51,160 There is a limited detail about who conducted it though, and I 205 00:10:51,160 --> 00:10:55,480 did go to the link in their bio to try and learn more about this 206 00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:59,840 investigation and AI policy, but the 404 error came up, so I 207 00:10:59,840 --> 00:11:03,360 wasn't able to access that page. But according to the statement 208 00:11:03,360 --> 00:11:06,760 they recently issued, they found quote, no evidence that Hoffa or 209 00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:10,400 the agency acting on our behalf used facial image material to 210 00:11:10,400 --> 00:11:12,560 generate the AI images in question. 211 00:11:12,760 --> 00:11:15,360 It also found no evidence supporting allegations that 212 00:11:15,360 --> 00:11:19,160 Hoffa copied or recreated the likeness of any model using AI. 213 00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:22,480 And at the same time, they also admitted that, quote, aspects of 214 00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:25,440 our public response fell short of the standard we expect of 215 00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:27,600 ourselves. For that we are genuinely sorry 216 00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:29,280 and we've learnt from this experience. 217 00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:32,320 This investigation slash statement came off the back of 218 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:35,920 another statement that they had made that was posted on June 219 00:11:36,160 --> 00:11:38,120 11th. And it basically said that the 220 00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:41,840 specific imagery in question did quote, generate a new image 221 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:45,280 using an AI design tool, but the image was not engineered to 222 00:11:45,280 --> 00:11:49,680 resemble any specific person. So they did admit to some level 223 00:11:49,680 --> 00:11:51,760 of AI usage. And now they're kind of going 224 00:11:51,760 --> 00:11:55,600 back on that. And honestly, it has left a lot 225 00:11:55,600 --> 00:11:58,240 of people, including Elijah confused. 226 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:02,000 Elijah is continuing to call out what seems to be contradictory 227 00:12:02,000 --> 00:12:05,000 messaging in his content. So if anything else significant 228 00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:07,520 drops from that, I will include it in an episode. 229 00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:11,360 But All in all, comparing these two situations from a brand 230 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:15,320 perspective, it's clear why good intent statement was well 231 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:18,640 received compared to Hoffa. Like I said, I do think the 232 00:12:18,640 --> 00:12:22,800 Hoffa situation is a little bit harder to prove, but it all just 233 00:12:22,800 --> 00:12:25,560 kind of comes down to consistency and messaging. 234 00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:29,600 Hafiz messaging has not been the same across the board and also 235 00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:32,160 the tone has differed significantly depending on the 236 00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:34,840 medium. And on top of this, they seem to 237 00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:37,640 be quite combative slash defensive when it came to 238 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:41,800 Elijah's content, whereas good intent welcomed Aiden's video. 239 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:45,200 And I think that went a long way for how the audience perceived 240 00:12:45,200 --> 00:12:46,720 them. But yeah, I do think there was 241 00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:49,240 just some key differences between the two situations. 242 00:12:49,240 --> 00:12:51,840 But I'd definitely be curious to hear what you guys thought of 243 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:54,560 these two and whether you think this comparison is even valid. 244 00:12:54,600 --> 00:12:56,800 OK, let's move on to the next story. 245 00:12:56,800 --> 00:13:00,720 And we have more news related to prediction markets, which is, 246 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:03,120 like I said last week, my special interest at this point. 247 00:13:03,200 --> 00:13:07,480 But honestly, in the way that Lauren had Simone scroll for 248 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:11,600 every time that she spoke about Club Chalamet on mini scroll, we 249 00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:14,200 need an equivalent for prediction markets. 250 00:13:14,200 --> 00:13:16,760 Like at this point, it's mini prediction market scroll. 251 00:13:17,360 --> 00:13:19,720 But anyway, I wanted to talk about everything that's 252 00:13:19,720 --> 00:13:22,040 happening between Cal, she and Spotify. 253 00:13:22,040 --> 00:13:26,000 So I guess this is quite a music heavy episode now with a Spotify 254 00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:28,840 focus story, but we lean in SoCal. 255 00:13:28,840 --> 00:13:32,400 She and Spotify have come under fire for allegedly altering 256 00:13:32,400 --> 00:13:35,280 music chart. Kaushi basically has these 257 00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:38,680 monthly betting markets on Spotify's top song chart. 258 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:42,440 And a man named Caleb Davies, who's actually 1 of Kaushi's top 259 00:13:42,440 --> 00:13:46,440 traders, has basically been sounding the alarm that there is 260 00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:50,640 bot powered manipulation going on with Spotify's charts which 261 00:13:50,680 --> 00:13:53,840 ultimately messes with the betting market that's tied to 262 00:13:53,840 --> 00:13:56,040 them. He's been posting all of his 263 00:13:56,040 --> 00:13:59,400 like data slash receipts under a pseudonym on X. 264 00:13:59,560 --> 00:14:01,880 If you want to check that out, I will also link it in the 265 00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:04,920 description, but obviously I will give you a summary because 266 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:07,640 this story I feel like can be a little bit complicated. 267 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:11,080 So at the end of June, Caleb was making couple tweets flagging 268 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:13,760 that there was some weird activity around streaming 269 00:14:13,760 --> 00:14:16,400 numbers in that month's chart market. 270 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:19,320 He basically claimed that there were weird spikes in streaming 271 00:14:19,320 --> 00:14:23,480 numbers that didn't make sense and seemed manufactured. 272 00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:27,280 But these allegations really ramped up with Malcolm Todd. 273 00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:30,080 If you aren't familiar with Malcolm Todd, he is kind of just 274 00:14:30,080 --> 00:14:32,880 like indie pop alternative R&B guy. 275 00:14:33,680 --> 00:14:37,280 He's also brothers with Audrey Hobart, who has definitely been 276 00:14:37,280 --> 00:14:40,320 gaining traction on TikTok for quite a while now, especially 277 00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:43,600 after Co writing with Gracie Abrams I think it was, and then 278 00:14:43,600 --> 00:14:47,240 also releasing her song Sue Me. But when it comes to Malcolm 279 00:14:47,240 --> 00:14:50,600 Todd, there seemed to be an inauthentic surge with his 280 00:14:50,600 --> 00:14:55,080 streams on his song Earrings. As Caleb explained in a tweet 281 00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:58,800 quote, Malcolm Todd got fast in what also appears to be blatant 282 00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:02,400 fraud with a 70% increase in US streams in a day. 283 00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:06,280 And then he attached a screenshot of Spotify charts 284 00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:10,720 that showed that Earrings had hit a new peak of #1 where it 285 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:13,360 was previously at #4 on the charts. 286 00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:17,080 In other tweets, he also shared screenshots of charts monitoring 287 00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:19,040 streams. And there definitely did seem to 288 00:15:19,040 --> 00:15:23,040 be some quite dramatic spikes. Fans noted that it could have 289 00:15:23,040 --> 00:15:26,480 been a result of listening parties, but Caleb did push back 290 00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:30,720 on that, showing what the shape of a legit streaming bump would 291 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:32,840 look like. Say, when there are events like 292 00:15:32,840 --> 00:15:35,720 the Grammys or Coachella where the streams will kind of 293 00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:39,400 gradually build up and then taper off kind of naturally. 294 00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:42,600 According to his daughter, Malcolm Todd's streams did not 295 00:15:42,600 --> 00:15:44,880 look like that at all. It literally just spiked out of 296 00:15:44,880 --> 00:15:46,840 nowhere and then dropped her right back down. 297 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:49,360 On July 1, he shared a tweet trying to figure out the 298 00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:52,480 likelihood of something like that even happening as he wrote 299 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:54,480 quote. As we await the final June 300 00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:58,200 Spotify update, one last look at how unlikely yesterday's earring 301 00:15:58,200 --> 00:16:00,440 surge was to have occurred by chance. 302 00:16:00,800 --> 00:16:04,080 Looking at the data set of Sunday to Monday changes, it was 303 00:16:04,080 --> 00:16:08,720 a roughly 1 and 77 octillion chance of happening randomly. 304 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:12,040 So as you can gather from that, it is pretty unlikely. 305 00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:15,320 Over the course of him tweeting about this, he also said that he 306 00:16:15,320 --> 00:16:19,120 had informed Calci and Spotify about the potential manipulation 307 00:16:19,400 --> 00:16:23,480 and publicly called on Calci to hold trading on the market and 308 00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:26,520 hold off and paying out until someone actually investigated 309 00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:29,440 what was going on. In one tweet, he was theorizing 310 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:32,520 that there was a Poly market trader inciting songs into 311 00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:36,280 playlist to farm streams. As far as how Cal she initially 312 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:38,800 responded to Caleb's claims, Cal. 313 00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:41,920 She did end up paying out the winners and Caleb shared that 314 00:16:41,920 --> 00:16:45,320 they actually emailed him about it as well as he wrote in 315 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:47,600 another tweet. Quote Cal, she did pay out the 316 00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:51,000 market based on fraudulent results right after sending me 317 00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:54,000 an e-mail stating that there are many plausible reasons that 318 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:57,960 Malcolm Todd's timely surge was not due to artificial boosting 319 00:16:58,000 --> 00:17:00,400 and obviously he pushes back against that. 320 00:17:00,520 --> 00:17:04,079 But here is I guess the twist. Spotify later confirmed to why 321 00:17:04,119 --> 00:17:08,440 that yes, they did find evidence of artificial streaming and this 322 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:10,440 was the statement that was given to the publication. 323 00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:13,400 Quote, all streaming services face ever changing stream 324 00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:16,119 manipulation. Spotify has best in class 325 00:17:16,119 --> 00:17:18,640 detection and mitigation practices for manipulated 326 00:17:18,640 --> 00:17:22,079 streams, and we don't pay out associated royalties. 327 00:17:22,319 --> 00:17:25,640 A spokesperson for Calci did also say that they're in contact 328 00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:28,640 with Spotify to investigate this issue. 329 00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:32,960 Spotify has since asked Calci to remove the company's logo from 330 00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:36,960 its platform and website, and Calci has ultimately added a 331 00:17:37,080 --> 00:17:40,040 disclaimer ascending that its products quote have not been 332 00:17:40,040 --> 00:17:43,640 endorsed by Spotify. From Spotify's end, they have 333 00:17:43,640 --> 00:17:47,680 ultimately adjusted the charts to account for the discrepancy, 334 00:17:47,920 --> 00:17:52,560 culling over 500 1000 artificial streams which ultimately would 335 00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:55,960 have taken Malcolm Todd's song down to 4th. 336 00:17:56,520 --> 00:17:59,240 In saying that though, many publications have been knowing 337 00:17:59,240 --> 00:18:02,720 that there is no suggestion that Malcolm Todd or his team were 338 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:07,160 involved in any attempt to boost streams and numbers on Spotify. 339 00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:11,240 It seems like the going theory is that potentially someone who 340 00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:16,560 was betting on Malcolm Todd's song to be #1 paid for, but to 341 00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:19,480 string the song where they would probably get a bigger payout 342 00:18:19,880 --> 00:18:23,760 from their winds on prediction markets as opposed to the cost 343 00:18:23,760 --> 00:18:26,120 they would have to pay for these bots. 344 00:18:26,200 --> 00:18:29,960 And of course, this all comes at a time of rising concern around 345 00:18:29,960 --> 00:18:33,800 the growth of prediction markets like calcium Poly market and the 346 00:18:33,800 --> 00:18:37,400 potential for insider trading, which is something that these 347 00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:41,760 platforms are trying to limit. But of course, when we look at 348 00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:45,680 this from a musician's perspective, it is another layer 349 00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:48,320 of upsetting slash concerning because it's just going to make 350 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:51,800 it harder and harder for smaller artist to actually chart when 351 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:55,280 foul play like this is in the mix and is an option. 352 00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:58,680 If the numbers keep being inflated to this degree, it will 353 00:18:58,680 --> 00:19:01,960 become a lot harder for anyone to actually breakthrough in a 354 00:19:01,960 --> 00:19:05,320 meaningful way with limited financial resources and backing 355 00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:07,920 behind them. OK, let's get into our final 356 00:19:07,920 --> 00:19:10,440 story for today. And this was actually a request 357 00:19:10,640 --> 00:19:14,960 from a Spotify comment to cover this new dating app Goose. 358 00:19:14,960 --> 00:19:18,520 I actually did see this on X as well, so thank you very much for 359 00:19:18,520 --> 00:19:20,280 the reminder. There has been a lot of 360 00:19:20,280 --> 00:19:23,880 discussion around this app online thanks to a piece by 361 00:19:23,880 --> 00:19:28,400 Wired that claimed it was a si up meaning psychological 362 00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:30,520 operation. This is typically used in media 363 00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:33,640 or like commentary to describe a phenomenon where there's 364 00:19:33,640 --> 00:19:37,520 manipulation of information or like media or anything like that 365 00:19:37,760 --> 00:19:41,040 to implement emotion or public opinion, that kind of thing. 366 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:45,120 So right now Goose is an invite only dating slash quote UN quote 367 00:19:45,120 --> 00:19:48,560 lifestyle app for gay men. As the website reads, quote 368 00:19:48,560 --> 00:19:51,960 Goose is the gay app not just for dating me guys through the 369 00:19:51,960 --> 00:19:53,840 life. You already have places, 370 00:19:53,840 --> 00:19:56,720 friends, interest stories and what's happening nearby. 371 00:19:56,800 --> 00:20:00,000 In the piece Why it does go into detail about the marketing 372 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:04,160 strategy of this app Which? The journalist EJ Dixon claims 373 00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:08,440 involved using AI generated men to get people to join the 374 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:11,320 platform. In a thread on X, EJ Dixon does 375 00:20:11,320 --> 00:20:15,080 share quite a succinct summary of what she found in her 376 00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:17,560 investigation, so I will definitely link that below. 377 00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:21,520 But she explains that she first found out about Goose through 378 00:20:21,520 --> 00:20:23,880 some friends that had told her that they'd received messages 379 00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:26,480 from quote UN quote random hot guy accounts. 380 00:20:26,760 --> 00:20:29,640 And she notes that these accounts were all new and 381 00:20:29,640 --> 00:20:32,920 conventionally attractive. Quote all the messages used 382 00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:36,320 approximately the same verbiage and all the guys look similar. 383 00:20:36,560 --> 00:20:38,600 They featured similarly aesthetic post. 384 00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:41,280 They also all followed each other and commented on each 385 00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:42,920 other's accounts. Weird. 386 00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:46,720 So I started running guys photos through Google Gemini and other 387 00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:49,920 AI detection software. Most or all of the photos were 388 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:52,360 apparently generated using Google AI. 389 00:20:52,360 --> 00:20:56,400 So essentially you have these AI generated profiles messaging men 390 00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:58,680 to join the app. It's literally giving those hey 391 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:01,480 girlie pyramid scheme messages to me. 392 00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:04,800 Anyway, EJ continues by noting that she found more than 20 393 00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:07,880 accounts that followed the same kind of pattern, adding that 394 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:11,520 they also followed the Goose Co founder, which is another level 395 00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:14,560 of SAS. And to add even more fuel to the 396 00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:18,080 fire, she found that Goose was actually looking to hire quote 397 00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:22,280 UN quote ambassadors who would be able to run Instagram 398 00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:25,920 accounts, seemingly as a part of its marketing. 399 00:21:25,920 --> 00:21:28,880 Using what seems to be fake accounts like this to drive 400 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:32,120 people to a product is obviously unethical and it's also just not 401 00:21:32,160 --> 00:21:36,400 allowed, but it has left a lot of the gay community upset, 402 00:21:36,400 --> 00:21:40,400 which is totally understandable as EJ continues quote. 403 00:21:40,760 --> 00:21:44,080 It's also pissed off a lot of members of the gay community who 404 00:21:44,080 --> 00:21:47,040 have already criticized the app for a lack of diversity in its 405 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:49,960 marketing and promoting toxic body image standards. 406 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:53,600 On one hand, I'm flattered that I'm their target audience. 1 407 00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:57,080 user told me but the need to essentially bake gay guys into 408 00:21:57,080 --> 00:22:00,480 signing up feels really sketchy. I did also have a look into the 409 00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:04,760 sentiment online and I did see one Reddit user on VR slash gay 410 00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:08,400 Reddit share how the app essentially made them spiral. 411 00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:11,800 They said quote. I couldn't even tell what was 412 00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:14,600 real and what was fake anymore. Amongst my Instagram friends. 413 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:17,440 I had to go through and remove everyone I never met in real 414 00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:19,200 life. I thought this was a problem 415 00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:22,840 that only happened to boomers. No one is immune in the AI era 416 00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:25,520 clearly. And interestingly on the R 417 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:29,680 technology Reddit I have seen many users also say that other 418 00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:33,560 dating apps do a similar thing. This is not really something 419 00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:35,640 I've ever seen or really heard of online. 420 00:22:35,640 --> 00:22:39,520 I'm definitely curious if this is something that you guys are 421 00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:42,920 familiar with. But as one user recounted quote, 422 00:22:42,920 --> 00:22:45,520 that's basically how dating apps have worked for years. 423 00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:49,480 But before AI, they generated profiles by farming Instagram to 424 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:52,520 send you a bunch of women who weren't actually using the app. 425 00:22:52,520 --> 00:22:54,840 And there were quite a few comments like that. 426 00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:57,760 So I'm gathering that this is something that happens to men 427 00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:00,560 who are trying to date women. In saying that though, I do 428 00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:04,320 think it is a little bit more harmful or I guess egregious 429 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:10,040 when it comes to a queer face slash app using AI or fake 430 00:23:10,040 --> 00:23:13,120 accounts in this way. Because this is an example of 431 00:23:13,120 --> 00:23:17,400 the use of AI to capitalize on a marginalized community that has 432 00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:20,160 historically found it hard to build these kind of 433 00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:23,520 relationships or have a safe space to do so. 434 00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:27,200 And it feels especially hypocritical when it is around 435 00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:30,640 an app that is built on the premise of finding relationships 436 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:33,080 and friendships. Even like I said, the queer 437 00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:37,120 community has historically relied on these spaces out of 438 00:23:37,120 --> 00:23:42,560 necessity, so trust and authenticity really matter here 439 00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:44,760 a lot. And the lack of disclosure that 440 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:48,360 this account is essentially operating as an ad and is fake 441 00:23:48,360 --> 00:23:52,520 is what definitely pushes this into something quite deceptive 442 00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:54,640 because there is a chance that people can believe they're 443 00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:57,440 talking to a real person. Anyway, I'm definitely curious 444 00:23:57,440 --> 00:24:00,480 to hear what you guys think about this story, especially if 445 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:02,840 you are someone who has dabbled in the app. 446 00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:05,760 And I'm also curious if this is something you have noticed with 447 00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:09,840 other apps like AI generated accounts sliding into DMS or 448 00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:12,360 trying to get you to download a product or an app. 449 00:24:12,360 --> 00:24:14,640 I do feel like this is becoming increasingly common. 450 00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:17,080 Well, that is everything for mini tech scroll today. 451 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:20,560 I really hope you guys enjoyed. Lauren will be back for a 452 00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:23,720 regular mini scroll tomorrow and I will be back on the mic next 453 00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:26,440 week, presuming I don't continue to lose my voice. 454 00:24:27,360 --> 00:24:28,800 But thank you so much for listening. 455 00:24:29,000 --> 00:24:31,120 Bye. Centennial World Podcast Network 456 00:24:31,120 --> 00:24:33,960 operates on Gadigal land. We would like to acknowledge the 457 00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:37,200 Gadigal of the Eora Nation, the traditional custodians of this 458 00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:40,760 land, and pay our respects to elders both past and present.