1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:03,240 Hey everyone, and welcome to Mini Scroll, the daily Internet 2 00:00:03,240 --> 00:00:05,800 culture podcast bringing you the biggest stories from social 3 00:00:05,800 --> 00:00:09,000 media, the creator economy and the digital space every Monday 4 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:11,360 through Thursday. My name is Annabelle, and I'm 5 00:00:11,360 --> 00:00:14,360 the deputy editor of youth digital media brand Centennial 6 00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:18,240 World, and I am now your Mini Scroll host every Wednesday. 7 00:00:18,640 --> 00:00:22,560 So as you can obviously hear or see, I am not Lauren. 8 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:25,600 This year Lauren has decided to take a step back from Mini 9 00:00:25,600 --> 00:00:29,040 Scroll just one day a week to kind of lessen her workload and 10 00:00:29,040 --> 00:00:30,720 also manage her work flow better. 11 00:00:30,720 --> 00:00:34,240 Because as much as we all love Mini Scroll, Lauren pretty much 12 00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:37,480 does everything herself and it is a lot of work to find 13 00:00:37,480 --> 00:00:40,880 stories, record, edit, and upload an episode each day. 14 00:00:40,920 --> 00:00:43,520 With that being said, I am now jumping on the pod every 15 00:00:43,520 --> 00:00:47,240 Wednesday to keep the daily content coming but also keep 16 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:50,720 Lauren's mental health in check. If I sound familiar, I have been 17 00:00:50,720 --> 00:00:52,840 on the podcast before. If you listen to the final 18 00:00:52,840 --> 00:00:55,400 Infinite Scroll deep dive of 2024, you would have heard from 19 00:00:55,400 --> 00:00:56,920 me. But if you didn't get around to 20 00:00:56,920 --> 00:00:58,960 listening to it, you definitely should. 21 00:00:59,120 --> 00:01:01,400 But I also thought I would introduce myself a little bit 22 00:01:01,400 --> 00:01:03,680 here. For context, I was brought on to 23 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:07,720 Centennial as an intern in 2021 while I was still in uni, and 24 00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:11,160 Lauren has been kind enough to keep me around since then. 25 00:01:11,360 --> 00:01:14,280 A lot of the work that I do now is around the infinite scroll 26 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:18,120 deep dive episodes that come out every week, so I spend most of 27 00:01:18,120 --> 00:01:21,320 my time preparing, researching, and scripting those episodes. 28 00:01:21,320 --> 00:01:25,240 So if you like those, please send your support because we 29 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:26,880 just need the reassurance sometimes. 30 00:01:26,960 --> 00:01:29,840 Aside from that, I also write Centennial's weekly Sub Stack 31 00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:32,280 new newsletter, which is also called Infinite Scroll. 32 00:01:32,280 --> 00:01:34,960 It covers the five biggest think pieces on the Internet each 33 00:01:34,960 --> 00:01:36,560 week. And I know a lot of you aren't 34 00:01:36,560 --> 00:01:39,360 subscribed, so if that sounds like you would be up your alley, 35 00:01:39,360 --> 00:01:42,960 please go subscribe. It would be much appreciated by 36 00:01:42,960 --> 00:01:44,400 me. Thank you in advance. 37 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:48,080 As far as Internet culture goes, I have always been seriously 38 00:01:48,080 --> 00:01:50,360 invested in pop culture and the digital space. 39 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:53,160 I think it's a really important area to take seriously because I 40 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:55,200 feel like you can tell a lot about the general mood of 41 00:01:55,200 --> 00:01:57,920 society based on the content that is trending and the content 42 00:01:57,920 --> 00:02:00,560 that's popular. Even though this area is kind of 43 00:02:00,560 --> 00:02:03,800 seen stereotypically as an unimportant and frivolous 44 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:06,280 interest, I think we need to treat it and analyze it with the 45 00:02:06,280 --> 00:02:08,639 gravity it deserves. So I'm definitely happy to be 46 00:02:08,639 --> 00:02:11,480 contributing to this through many every week on my episodes. 47 00:02:11,480 --> 00:02:13,400 We did think we would mix things up a bit. 48 00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:15,920 We will be keeping the structure that you guys have all come to 49 00:02:15,920 --> 00:02:18,600 love over the past year. But since we got such positive 50 00:02:18,600 --> 00:02:21,400 feedback last year, whenever we covered specific trends, we 51 00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:23,840 thought that my episode would focus a little bit more on the 52 00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:26,920 techie side of things and maybe a bit more industry and trend 53 00:02:26,920 --> 00:02:28,880 based stuff. I'm not opposed to venturing 54 00:02:28,880 --> 00:02:31,520 into political territory, Tory, if that is interesting to you 55 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:34,080 guys, definitely let us know because the crossover between 56 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:36,640 politics and pop culture is probably one of my favorite 57 00:02:36,640 --> 00:02:38,280 things. So I would definitely be down. 58 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:41,600 Now that that is all out of the way, I am super excited to be 59 00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:44,840 here, but please bear with me as I'm getting used to the front of 60 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:46,840 camera and on the mic experience. 61 00:02:46,840 --> 00:02:49,240 This isn't something that I've done before, but I'm really 62 00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:52,520 excited and I know I have big shoes to fill, so I hope I can 63 00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:56,240 do Lauren justice with all that. I do have a couple of stories to 64 00:02:56,240 --> 00:02:59,360 share, some of which that happened over our break, so 65 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:02,200 let's just get in into it. The first story is that Mehta is 66 00:03:02,200 --> 00:03:04,280 making changes to its moderation process. 67 00:03:04,320 --> 00:03:07,320 So last week, Mark Zuckerberg took to social media to share 68 00:03:07,320 --> 00:03:09,640 some updates to Mehta's moderation policies. 69 00:03:09,640 --> 00:03:12,560 In a video posted to Instagram, Zuckerberg shared why he got 70 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:15,400 into social media, what it means to him, and how he plans to move 71 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:17,840 forward in a new political environment in the US. 72 00:03:17,840 --> 00:03:20,480 He began the video by saying that he started building social 73 00:03:20,480 --> 00:03:23,080 media platforms in order to give people a voice. 74 00:03:23,080 --> 00:03:25,600 But with the increasingly complex systems that have been 75 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:28,240 put into place to moderate dangerous content, Zuckerberg 76 00:03:28,240 --> 00:03:29,960 claims that things have been taken too far. 77 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:33,120 There's been widespread debate about potential harms from 78 00:03:33,120 --> 00:03:36,000 online content. Governments and legacy media 79 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:37,960 have pushed to censor more and more. 80 00:03:38,600 --> 00:03:41,160 A lot of this is clearly political, but there's also a 81 00:03:41,160 --> 00:03:43,200 lot of legitimately bad stuff out there. 82 00:03:43,480 --> 00:03:45,960 Drugs, terrorism, Child Exploitation. 83 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:48,880 These are things that we take very seriously, and I want to 84 00:03:48,880 --> 00:03:50,320 make sure that we handle responsibly. 85 00:03:50,840 --> 00:03:53,800 So we built a lot of complex systems to moderate content. 86 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:57,240 But the problem with complex systems is they make mistakes. 87 00:03:57,920 --> 00:04:01,560 Even if they accidentally censor just 1% of posts, that's 88 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:04,360 millions of people. And we've reached a point where 89 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:07,080 it's just too many mistakes and too much censorship. 90 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:10,720 So he did share a couple of the changes that Meta is 91 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:13,400 introducing. I took this from a threads post 92 00:04:13,400 --> 00:04:16,320 so I'll just read it to you now. The first change is that Meta 93 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:19,440 will be replacing fact checkers with community notes starting in 94 00:04:19,519 --> 00:04:22,400 the US, and this is obviously following the approach of X. 95 00:04:22,400 --> 00:04:25,280 The next change is that Meta will be simplifying content 96 00:04:25,280 --> 00:04:28,280 policies and remove restrictions on topics like immigration and 97 00:04:28,280 --> 00:04:31,520 gender that are quote out of touch with mainstream discourse. 98 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:34,160 The next change is that the company will be changing how 99 00:04:34,160 --> 00:04:37,320 they enforce policies to remove the vast majority of censorship 100 00:04:37,320 --> 00:04:40,440 mistakes by focusing filters on tackling illegal and high 101 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:43,720 severity violations. Next Meta will be bringing back 102 00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:45,960 civic content. Over the past few years, there's 103 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:49,200 been a lot of discourse around Meta scaling back its political 104 00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:51,080 content, specifically around Threads. 105 00:04:51,080 --> 00:04:54,840 The next one is that Meta will be moving their trust and safety 106 00:04:54,840 --> 00:04:58,280 and content moderation teams out of California and our US Content 107 00:04:58,280 --> 00:05:00,680 review to Texas quote. This will help remove the 108 00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:03,680 concern that biased employees are overly censoring content. 109 00:05:03,720 --> 00:05:07,000 Interestingly, Mehta's choice to relocate its content moderation 110 00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:10,200 team to Texas actually comes off the heel of Elon Musk moving X's 111 00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:12,640 team to the state. It is worth noting that his move 112 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:16,280 was partially due to laws passed by California, in particular one 113 00:05:16,280 --> 00:05:19,040 that prevented schools from forcing staff to tell anyone, 114 00:05:19,040 --> 00:05:22,080 including parents, information about a child's gender identity. 115 00:05:22,080 --> 00:05:25,400 These changes are quite interesting because obviously 116 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:28,040 freedom of expression is definitely a huge issue on 117 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:30,040 social media. I'm sure we've all seen cases 118 00:05:30,040 --> 00:05:32,600 where certain topics tend to get suppressed online. 119 00:05:32,720 --> 00:05:35,440 Even though that might be the case, moderation is really 120 00:05:35,440 --> 00:05:38,240 important, especially when you have adults sharing spaces with 121 00:05:38,240 --> 00:05:40,760 children. Honestly, this tends to fall on 122 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:43,640 the platform because the legal system is super behind the 123 00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:47,160 digital space and government agencies often move slowly, so 124 00:05:47,160 --> 00:05:49,800 it makes sense that the platform themselves have to institute 125 00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:52,480 these moderation policies. These changes are obviously 126 00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:55,840 super timely given that the US is about to enter a second Trump 127 00:05:55,840 --> 00:05:57,760 presidency. During his first term, there was 128 00:05:57,920 --> 00:06:00,840 quite a big focus on censorship and free speech in the digital 129 00:06:00,840 --> 00:06:03,480 world, even if that did mean protecting hate speech. 130 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:06,840 I mean, Trump even made his own social media platform and I 131 00:06:06,840 --> 00:06:09,520 think signed an executive order about preventing online 132 00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:12,680 censorship from memory. But it feels like Meta's changes 133 00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:15,480 are all about aligning with the current political zeitgeist in 134 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:18,360 the US, Whether they're opportunistic or the genuine 135 00:06:18,360 --> 00:06:21,440 beliefs of the company, I think it's too early to tell. 136 00:06:21,560 --> 00:06:24,960 But either way, with Meta following in the footsteps of X 137 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:27,760 in terms of moderation, which has become a bit of a haven for 138 00:06:27,920 --> 00:06:31,040 discriminatory rhetoric, I'm not sure these changes are a good 139 00:06:31,040 --> 00:06:33,480 sign for where things are heading, to be honest. 140 00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:36,480 In other news coming out of Meta this week, news broke that the 141 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:39,640 company is scaling back its DEI, which is diversity, equity, 142 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:42,120 inclusion policies from what I could find. 143 00:06:42,160 --> 00:06:46,000 This story was first reported by Axios after they obtained a memo 144 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:48,680 written by Janelle GAIL, the vice president of human 145 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:50,800 resources. The memo noted the changing 146 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:53,360 legal and policy landscape in the United States around 147 00:06:53,360 --> 00:06:56,560 diversity, equity and inclusion, essentially noting that Meta is 148 00:06:56,560 --> 00:06:59,320 following suit. Over the past few years, DEI has 149 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:01,960 really become a hot button issue, especially in the US. 150 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:04,440 What has typically been used as schemes to ensure that 151 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:07,360 minorities and marginalised groups have the same 152 00:07:07,360 --> 00:07:10,840 opportunities as others has kind of become perceived by many as 153 00:07:10,840 --> 00:07:13,920 favouring certain groups over others in the hiring process and 154 00:07:13,920 --> 00:07:16,040 also in the workplace more generally. 155 00:07:16,080 --> 00:07:19,920 Now, every DEI initiative is run differently, but the overall 156 00:07:19,920 --> 00:07:23,120 goal is to make companies and leaders examine the way their 157 00:07:23,120 --> 00:07:25,560 company treats or serves marginalised groups. 158 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:28,640 Even though Meta is scaling back on these practices, The memo 159 00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:31,760 also said that they will quote continue to source candidates 160 00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:34,280 from different background. But with that, obviously the 161 00:07:34,280 --> 00:07:37,280 process is changing where the company will focus on quote, 162 00:07:37,280 --> 00:07:40,280 fair and consistent practices that mitigate bias for all. 163 00:07:40,280 --> 00:07:41,760 And I really hope that is the case. 164 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:44,800 Now what we have all been waiting for, we can't talk about 165 00:07:44,800 --> 00:07:47,880 anything tech without talking about the TikTok ban in the US 166 00:07:47,880 --> 00:07:49,160 first. I'll start with a little bit of 167 00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:51,240 context in case you have missed it. 168 00:07:51,440 --> 00:07:54,480 TikTok is facing a nationwide ban in the United States after a 169 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:57,200 bill was signed into law in April last year, which 170 00:07:57,200 --> 00:07:59,960 essentially requires fired Byte Dance, Tik Tok's Chinese owned 171 00:07:59,960 --> 00:08:03,240 parent company, to divest from the platform or face a ban. 172 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:05,520 The deadline for the sale is January 19. 173 00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:07,320 So we are really getting close to that. 174 00:08:07,360 --> 00:08:10,480 And it is also just one day before President Biden's term 175 00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:12,400 ends. We did touch on this in our 176 00:08:12,400 --> 00:08:14,720 final Infinite Scroll episode last year. 177 00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:17,600 But since then, there have been a couple of updates, one of 178 00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:20,560 which is that the Supreme Court heard oral arguments about the 179 00:08:20,560 --> 00:08:23,360 case on January 10. And much of the reporting around 180 00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:26,160 it has characterized the Supreme Court's reception to TikTok as 181 00:08:26,160 --> 00:08:29,040 quote, UN, quote, Frosty. We definitely don't need to get 182 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:32,039 into the nitty gritty of the hearing, but the Supreme Court 183 00:08:32,039 --> 00:08:34,480 justices heard from representatives from TikTok 184 00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:37,080 creators and, of course, the federal Justice Department. 185 00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:39,360 But I'll give you a little bit of a summary of each side's 186 00:08:39,480 --> 00:08:41,760 arguments. The company and TikTok users and 187 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:44,840 creators are essentially arguing that the ban violates Americans 188 00:08:44,840 --> 00:08:47,040 First Amendment rights and free speech. 189 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:49,560 Meanwhile, the Biden administration contends that the 190 00:08:49,560 --> 00:08:52,520 law is essential for national security due to bite dances 191 00:08:52,520 --> 00:08:55,840 Chinese ownership. Trump has also jumped in on the 192 00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:59,360 situation, as he so often does, and he filed a brief at the end 193 00:08:59,360 --> 00:09:01,520 of last year saying that the court should hold off on the 194 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:04,080 decision, claiming that he could maybe broker a deal once he's in 195 00:09:04,080 --> 00:09:06,000 office. As for where it's going to go, 196 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:08,600 many experts and journalists seem to be heading in the 197 00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:11,520 direction that the Supreme Court justices will side with the ban. 198 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:15,000 But obviously this is all super unprecedented and no one really 199 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:17,560 knows what's going to happen. I wouldn't be surprised if the 200 00:09:17,560 --> 00:09:20,600 Supreme Court kind of holds off from issuing an opinion on the 201 00:09:20,600 --> 00:09:23,280 ban itself and maybe just prolongs the whole process. 202 00:09:23,280 --> 00:09:25,840 It is kind of insane that this is all happening right before a 203 00:09:25,840 --> 00:09:28,960 new presidential administration enters the White House, but who 204 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:31,120 knows. I am definitely keeping tabs on 205 00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:34,160 this and we will keep you updated as Mini Scroll does. 206 00:09:34,160 --> 00:09:37,440 Obviously with the concern around the ban that has left 207 00:09:37,480 --> 00:09:40,800 users and creators on TikTok spiralling, including many of 208 00:09:40,800 --> 00:09:43,080 whom aren't even based in the United States. 209 00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:45,840 I don't know about you, but over the past few days, my whole 210 00:09:45,840 --> 00:09:48,560 TikTok for you page has been filled with creators making 211 00:09:48,560 --> 00:09:51,880 videos, almost issuing eulogies for the platform and of course, 212 00:09:51,880 --> 00:09:54,840 encouraging their viewers to follow them to other platforms 213 00:09:54,840 --> 00:09:57,080 like Instagram. I think this is all super 214 00:09:57,080 --> 00:10:00,160 interesting because like we've said before, if the ban does end 215 00:10:00,160 --> 00:10:03,520 up happening, it's unlikely to affect Internet culture and how 216 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:06,000 information is circulated online immediately. 217 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:09,880 It will probably impact creators quicker because brands are not 218 00:10:09,880 --> 00:10:12,240 going to be willing to sink money into a platform that has 219 00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:14,000 been banned. That all being said, users are 220 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:17,640 now talking about which app to migrate to and a few popular 221 00:10:17,640 --> 00:10:20,440 ones have started circulating. The most frequent one I have 222 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:23,640 seen on my For You page is Red Note, which is ironically also a 223 00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:25,640 Chinese owned app. I kind of think this is 224 00:10:25,640 --> 00:10:28,960 intentional because users seem to be joining in spite of the US 225 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:31,680 government's decisions. I've been seeing it like into 226 00:10:31,680 --> 00:10:34,480 Instagram given that it was reportedly made with a lifestyle 227 00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:36,760 focus. And honestly, every video I've 228 00:10:36,760 --> 00:10:39,920 seen of people using Red Note, they seem to be having a great 229 00:10:39,920 --> 00:10:42,000 time. Apart from Red Note, Neptune 230 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:43,840 seems to be another popular suggestion. 231 00:10:43,880 --> 00:10:46,640 It's currently in beta, but according to videos on TikTok, 232 00:10:46,640 --> 00:10:49,680 it does seem to have a similar function to the For You page 233 00:10:49,680 --> 00:10:52,040 where there are options to toggle the algorithm that you 234 00:10:52,040 --> 00:10:53,880 see. As far as whether people will 235 00:10:53,880 --> 00:10:57,440 actually move to these apps, I'm kind of expecting users to stay 236 00:10:57,440 --> 00:11:00,120 on TikTok as long as they can, much like what we have seen with 237 00:11:00,120 --> 00:11:02,080 X and the push to move to Blue Sky. 238 00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:06,200 While there may be bursts of users moving across, it is so 239 00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:09,040 hard to cultivate the same feeling on another app. 240 00:11:09,080 --> 00:11:12,640 As for what we can expect in a post TikTok era, I think India 241 00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:15,880 is a really interesting example to look to here because they ban 242 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:19,000 the app in 2020. Now obviously India and the US 243 00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:21,000 are completely different political and cultural 244 00:11:21,000 --> 00:11:23,520 environments, but I did see a creator on TikTok. 245 00:11:23,520 --> 00:11:26,520 I didn't write down her name, but I will insert the video talk 246 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:29,480 about how Internet culture operates in India ever since the 247 00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:32,360 ban was instituted. And she said that YouTube and 248 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:35,280 podcasts have become the major source of discourse and 249 00:11:35,280 --> 00:11:37,760 discussion. Nobody is making videos longer 250 00:11:37,760 --> 00:11:41,320 than like a minute, 30 seconds or two minutes Max in India. 251 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:44,000 People aren't really even on Instagram here either. 252 00:11:44,080 --> 00:11:48,040 Everyone spends all their time on YouTube with Amazon India's 253 00:11:48,320 --> 00:11:51,640 content creator lead, and she said that they pour most of 254 00:11:51,640 --> 00:11:55,560 their money into Youtubers and podcasters. 255 00:11:55,560 --> 00:11:58,200 I wouldn't be surprised if that's what we'll see because of 256 00:11:58,200 --> 00:12:00,880 course that isn't exactly new, but that might be what makes it 257 00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:03,320 successful because it isn't foreign to us and we're used to 258 00:12:03,320 --> 00:12:05,280 it. Anyway, that is everything from 259 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:07,880 me today. I really hope you enjoyed this 260 00:12:07,880 --> 00:12:10,680 weeks episode and you don't miss Lauren too much. 261 00:12:10,680 --> 00:12:13,680 She will be back tomorrow. I am sure I will get better at 262 00:12:13,680 --> 00:12:16,600 this, but I will see you next Wednesday. 263 00:12:16,640 --> 00:12:17,560 Thanks. Bye.