1 00:00:00,520 --> 00:00:04,520 On August 8th, 2021, Emma Chamberlain posted an update to 2 00:00:04,520 --> 00:00:09,200 the Community tab on YouTube, written to her then 10.4 million 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:11,560 subscribers. Emma announced that she was 4 00:00:11,560 --> 00:00:15,800 taking a hiatus from her channel quote, taking a few more weeks 5 00:00:15,800 --> 00:00:18,640 off to think. I need to take my own advice on 6 00:00:18,640 --> 00:00:21,600 taking a break when it's needed. This isn't a negative thing 7 00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:23,440 though. I'm thinking a lot about how I 8 00:00:23,440 --> 00:00:26,080 can evolve and make things that truly excite me. 9 00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:29,800 I haven't taken a step back in a long time to ask myself what 10 00:00:29,800 --> 00:00:32,560 that means. I love and appreciate you and I 11 00:00:32,560 --> 00:00:35,760 will see you soon. Those few more weeks off soon 12 00:00:35,760 --> 00:00:39,040 turned into half a year of radio silence from Emma on YouTube. 13 00:00:39,320 --> 00:00:42,200 The creator was only 20 years old at the time and had already 14 00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:45,400 achieved fame and fortune from her online career, which she 15 00:00:45,400 --> 00:00:48,120 started in 2016 While still at high school. 16 00:00:48,240 --> 00:00:51,320 Though Emma's success was built off sharing bits of her personal 17 00:00:51,320 --> 00:00:55,280 life through her vlogs and podcast, this hiatus marked a 18 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:57,200 noticeable change in her content. 19 00:00:57,720 --> 00:01:01,640 Her videos featured more visual storytelling, less personal 20 00:01:01,640 --> 00:01:05,040 updates, and she felt more guarded than throughout her 21 00:01:05,040 --> 00:01:07,400 earlier career. Emma had made the conscious 22 00:01:07,400 --> 00:01:11,560 decision to become more private online, a choice that many other 23 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:15,960 young people, creators or not, have opted for in recent years 24 00:01:16,520 --> 00:01:19,120 because unlike their millennial counterparts, Gen. 25 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:22,400 Z has experienced the perils of oversharing on social media 26 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:24,320 since before they were teenagers. 27 00:01:25,120 --> 00:01:28,320 They understand the risks associated with being constantly 28 00:01:28,320 --> 00:01:31,800 surveilled online, and they find the constant attention seeking 29 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:35,880 behavior required to build an online following quite frankly, 30 00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:38,520 embarrassing. After growing up in a media 31 00:01:38,520 --> 00:01:44,040 space plagued by cancel culture, misinformation, and virtually no 32 00:01:44,040 --> 00:01:49,080 opportunity for anonymity, Gen. Z is replacing performance for 33 00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:52,880 privacy. But what, if anything, does Gen. 34 00:01:52,880 --> 00:01:56,360 Z's pursuit of privacy mean, then for the future of the 35 00:01:56,360 --> 00:02:00,320 creator economy? From Centennial World, I'm 36 00:02:00,320 --> 00:02:05,080 Lauren Meisner, and this is Infinite Scroll, a podcast about 37 00:02:05,080 --> 00:02:09,120 Internet culture, the creator economy, and how social media is 38 00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:10,320 shaping Gen. Z. 39 00:02:10,560 --> 00:02:13,640 Welcome back to Infinite Scroll, everyone. 40 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:16,240 All right, so I have a little update. 41 00:02:16,280 --> 00:02:18,840 I am feeling quite I'll this week. 42 00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:22,840 I'm very under the weather. So this is actually an updated 43 00:02:22,920 --> 00:02:28,000 encore episode from season three where Jordy and I explored why 44 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:29,800 Gen. Z is more private online than 45 00:02:29,800 --> 00:02:33,120 other generations and what this means for the future of social 46 00:02:33,120 --> 00:02:36,040 media. So we've never done an encore or 47 00:02:36,040 --> 00:02:38,720 like a rerun before. I know a lot of podcasts that I 48 00:02:38,720 --> 00:02:42,280 listen to do this quite often, I guess when they have a week off 49 00:02:42,280 --> 00:02:44,240 or if they just need some extra time to prep. 50 00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:46,880 We've never done it. So I hope that those of you, 51 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:49,800 especially the ones that found us last year and maybe haven't 52 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:53,160 listened to our back catalog yet, hopefully you enjoy it. 53 00:02:53,160 --> 00:02:56,720 Hopefully you learn something and you enjoy kind of the OG 54 00:02:56,720 --> 00:02:59,920 vibes with Jordy. Now, this episode was also 55 00:02:59,920 --> 00:03:02,640 recorded prior to us filming everything for YouTube. 56 00:03:02,640 --> 00:03:04,880 So if you're listening to this or watching this on YouTube, 57 00:03:05,120 --> 00:03:07,920 you'll still be able to listen to the full episode, but you 58 00:03:07,920 --> 00:03:10,320 just won't see myself or Jordy talking. 59 00:03:10,480 --> 00:03:13,760 And in terms of some updates, I wanted to share a couple little 60 00:03:13,760 --> 00:03:17,200 things for you this week. So the first big thing that's 61 00:03:17,200 --> 00:03:21,680 happening is Centennial World, the media brand that the podcast 62 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:25,240 it's under. We have made the decision to 63 00:03:26,080 --> 00:03:31,440 cease publishing on Instagram, which is a really wild decision 64 00:03:31,440 --> 00:03:34,160 as a publisher. It feels almost like a legal to 65 00:03:34,280 --> 00:03:37,680 do as a publisher, but there was a few reasons for that. 66 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:40,200 The 1st is that meta? I'm sure if you guys are in the 67 00:03:40,200 --> 00:03:43,440 social space you would have, you know, seen this or heard about 68 00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:45,320 this. But meta has made the decision 69 00:03:45,320 --> 00:03:50,120 to stop or I guess start deprioritizing news and like 70 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:51,920 political content. Quote, UN quote. 71 00:03:51,920 --> 00:03:57,240 But what qualifies as political content is very murky and it's 72 00:03:57,240 --> 00:04:00,280 quite unclear and a lot of the stuff that we cover when it 73 00:04:00,280 --> 00:04:03,640 comes to creators like even you know our topic last week on Trad 74 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:06,720 Wives that could be considered quote UN quote, political. 75 00:04:06,720 --> 00:04:11,480 So you know that was kind of part of the decision for sure. 76 00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:14,280 That was a recent development that Meta decided to make. 77 00:04:14,840 --> 00:04:18,279 But I would say the bigger reason why we decided to do this 78 00:04:18,279 --> 00:04:22,000 is just because the Instagram like the Centennial World 79 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:24,800 Instagram not the infinite scroll podcast Instagram but the 80 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:28,120 Centennial World Instagram. It has been like my cross to 81 00:04:28,120 --> 00:04:30,320 bear for the last four years since we launched. 82 00:04:30,520 --> 00:04:36,520 Content is kind of my job and I just could not figure it out. 83 00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:39,560 I tried so many different things, you know, the things 84 00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:42,440 that I would post on there, if I posted on any other platform, 85 00:04:42,440 --> 00:04:46,240 Pinterest or TikTok or whatever, they would do so well on those 86 00:04:46,240 --> 00:04:48,880 other platforms. It never did well on Instagram 87 00:04:48,880 --> 00:04:51,080 at all. Growing the Instagram was so 88 00:04:51,080 --> 00:04:52,600 difficult, it felt like impossible. 89 00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:55,800 And I think I just had to come to terms with the fact that the 90 00:04:55,800 --> 00:04:59,800 content that we're creating is not super conducive to 91 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:02,160 Instagram. Now maybe if we had launched the 92 00:05:02,160 --> 00:05:06,120 business in Instagram's heyday like 2015, 2016, you know, we 93 00:05:06,120 --> 00:05:09,240 would have a lots of followers naturally because of that. 94 00:05:09,240 --> 00:05:14,440 But when it comes to analyzing the creator economy and Internet 95 00:05:14,440 --> 00:05:17,880 culture topics and things like that, people like to absorb that 96 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:20,080 or like to consume that on TikTok. 97 00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:23,320 They like to consume it on YouTube and in podcast format 98 00:05:23,320 --> 00:05:26,120 and even newsletter like every other platform including our 99 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:29,760 site like every platform that we have have is consistently 100 00:05:29,760 --> 00:05:34,120 growing and quite successful and the Instagram just was not so. 101 00:05:34,120 --> 00:05:36,200 I actually worked with a business consultant at the 102 00:05:36,200 --> 00:05:40,200 beginning of the year. And that was one of his first 103 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:44,760 pieces of advice to me was, you know, identify the places in the 104 00:05:44,760 --> 00:05:48,840 business that you are spending time and energy and thus money 105 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:52,600 that are not working. And he literally said to me, if 106 00:05:52,600 --> 00:05:54,560 you have been working on the Instagram account for four 107 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:57,080 years, it's not growing. It has never grown. 108 00:05:57,280 --> 00:06:00,240 You've never monetized it. And it's not like you're just 109 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:02,360 seeing no results. They're like, why are you 110 00:06:02,480 --> 00:06:04,800 beating a dead horse? Like, why are you still trying 111 00:06:04,800 --> 00:06:07,080 this? And that was in January. 112 00:06:07,080 --> 00:06:09,840 So it took me a few months to really grapple with the fact 113 00:06:09,840 --> 00:06:13,400 that, like, as a publisher, maybe we shouldn't necessarily 114 00:06:13,400 --> 00:06:16,640 focus on Instagram. But that was our decision. 115 00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:20,200 So I pulled the plug on our Instagram account earlier this 116 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:23,360 week. I still like it still exists and 117 00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:26,800 we've posted a few tiles to explain why our Instagram is 118 00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:28,880 bare who we are, where you can actually find us, that kind of 119 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:30,880 stuff. I'm not sure if it will stay 120 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:33,640 like that forever. You know, I have thought maybe I 121 00:06:33,640 --> 00:06:37,280 should make it like a brand portfolio almost kind of like a 122 00:06:37,280 --> 00:06:40,640 LinkedIn, almost like, you know, like share snippets from the 123 00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:44,040 Coach event for example, that you guys came to share examples 124 00:06:44,040 --> 00:06:45,600 of different campaigns we're working on. 125 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:48,720 When I speak on panels on behalf of the brand share that like 126 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:51,920 just those kinds of things, I thought maybe we could do that 127 00:06:52,120 --> 00:06:55,840 as like a snapshot of the brand. But for now with the limited 128 00:06:55,840 --> 00:06:59,480 time and resources that I have at the moment, I'm just going to 129 00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:01,160 keep it as is. So that was a pretty big 130 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:02,800 decision. I know some of you guys like the 131 00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:05,680 business updates, some of you don't really care, but for those 132 00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:09,880 that do, but this ties in to my next update. 133 00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:16,320 I don't want to necessarily give it away, but in the tiles that I 134 00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:19,240 posted on Instagram, sharing that we're no longer publishing 135 00:07:19,240 --> 00:07:23,200 on Instagram and kind of explaining who we are, I left a 136 00:07:23,200 --> 00:07:28,960 little Easter egg and only so far one of you has at least 137 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:31,560 maybe more of you have seen it. But one of you has reached out 138 00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:34,800 to say I found the Easter egg. I cannot believe it. 139 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:37,680 So go take a look. That's a little hint for you 140 00:07:37,680 --> 00:07:41,560 guys on what's to come next for this podcast. 141 00:07:41,960 --> 00:07:44,640 OK, so as always, Please remember to rate, review and 142 00:07:44,640 --> 00:07:47,080 subscribe. It means so much to me. 143 00:07:47,080 --> 00:07:49,560 It helps me grow. It keeps me going. 144 00:07:49,720 --> 00:07:51,600 Please sign up to our newsletter, which is called 145 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:54,240 Infinite Scroll. On Wednesdays we send out a 146 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:57,920 commentary article about a trend, creator, drama or news. 147 00:07:58,040 --> 00:08:01,960 And on Fridays we round up the five biggest thing pieces about 148 00:08:01,960 --> 00:08:04,440 Internet culture on the Internet that week. 149 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:07,640 And also join our Geneva group called Infinite Scroll, where 150 00:08:07,640 --> 00:08:10,240 you can chat with other people who are also obsessed with 151 00:08:10,240 --> 00:08:13,240 Internet culture and drama and tea and all of that. 152 00:08:13,560 --> 00:08:15,960 And you can talk to me. All right, Here are some reviews 153 00:08:15,960 --> 00:08:18,200 that we got this week. I love reading these out. 154 00:08:18,200 --> 00:08:22,680 So Hottie XOX Rach said. I absolutely loved this episode. 155 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:26,640 So informative but in a fun way. About the Trad Wife episode. 156 00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:28,720 So thank you so much. Rach means so much. 157 00:08:28,720 --> 00:08:31,720 She said that on Spotify. Big boy Becky on YouTube says, I 158 00:08:31,720 --> 00:08:34,480 particularly love this episode because it's a very informative 159 00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:36,280 video, both politically and socially. 160 00:08:36,520 --> 00:08:39,000 I personally find making food from scratch, especially for 161 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:41,760 your kids, such an obviously performative and unrealistic 162 00:08:41,960 --> 00:08:46,040 act, but so many are eating it up it's just not feasible. 163 00:08:46,280 --> 00:08:48,800 But then again, they are sellers of an unattainable and 164 00:08:48,800 --> 00:08:51,760 inherently racist lifestyle, so it makes sense that it appears 165 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:54,640 comical from the outside. Thank you for continuing 166 00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:56,800 Infinite Scroll. Looking forward to your future 167 00:08:56,800 --> 00:08:59,080 plans. Thank you. 168 00:08:59,720 --> 00:09:04,320 And then Hannah said in my DMS OG listener Hannah, she's with 169 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:08,160 Lauren Dash and I absolutely loved this week's podcast. 170 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:11,320 Such a fascinating topic and so well presented as always. 171 00:09:11,320 --> 00:09:14,040 I audibly gasped and scared the dog a few times. 172 00:09:14,040 --> 00:09:16,040 Can't wait for more. Dash is her dog. 173 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:19,200 Thank you Hannah. So as I said, this is a rerun 174 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:23,760 that has been re edited for you guys from season three while I'm 175 00:09:23,760 --> 00:09:28,240 kind of recovering from being you know, under the weather, 176 00:09:28,240 --> 00:09:32,200 overwhelmed, exhausted, needing a bit of a break this week but I 177 00:09:32,200 --> 00:09:35,680 will be back next week with a brand new topic, a brand new 178 00:09:35,720 --> 00:09:37,440 episode. Can't wait to chat with you guys 179 00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:39,920 then. So without further ado, I hope 180 00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:41,640 you liked the episode. So we are going to. 181 00:09:41,640 --> 00:09:46,160 Be talking about the concept of like privacy online and why 182 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:50,840 we're seeing this shift in Gen. Z away from being super public 183 00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:56,560 and open online to seeking privacy and anonymity. 184 00:09:56,560 --> 00:09:58,680 I'm sorry, I I've struggled with that word online. 185 00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:02,440 It's it gives me and then an enemy like that. 186 00:10:04,080 --> 00:10:06,360 What was that word that I couldn't say when we did the 187 00:10:06,360 --> 00:10:08,520 lebrance? Evangelical. 188 00:10:08,520 --> 00:10:10,240 Yeah. Yeah, you got it first time. 189 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:11,400 Yeah, I got it bad. It's. 190 00:10:12,720 --> 00:10:14,880 Because it because it wasn't like over and over and over 191 00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:16,240 again like you get in your head about it. 192 00:10:16,520 --> 00:10:19,040 Yes, 100%. So this week we're going to be 193 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:21,840 pulling from two different articles that we think really 194 00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:24,280 facilitate an interesting conversation around this. 195 00:10:24,280 --> 00:10:26,640 And you know, there's obviously a lot of discussion that's 196 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:29,640 starting about this. So the first one is written by 197 00:10:29,640 --> 00:10:32,400 Caitlin Tiffany at The Atlantic. The piece that's called the 198 00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:36,560 Personal brand is dead. So the piece explores how for 199 00:10:36,560 --> 00:10:39,720 millennials, being famous online was really cool. 200 00:10:39,920 --> 00:10:42,960 So millennials are the first generation of people to become 201 00:10:42,960 --> 00:10:45,840 like genuine influencers and make enough money to turn it 202 00:10:45,840 --> 00:10:48,440 into a full time job. So they were essentially seen 203 00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:50,920 like the early days of influencers were seen as Trail 204 00:10:50,920 --> 00:10:54,400 Blazers, Like they basically carved out this entire new 205 00:10:54,680 --> 00:10:57,600 career for themselves. Hello, As people have become 206 00:10:57,600 --> 00:11:00,960 more accustomed to the concept of an influencer and we've seen 207 00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:03,040 the process and expectations evolve. 208 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:05,440 Like often for the worst. Gen. 209 00:11:05,440 --> 00:11:08,480 Z are rebelling against this idea and instead almost find 210 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:11,800 having a large social media presence embarrassing. 211 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:15,120 I find that so. Like, I find that in general 212 00:11:15,120 --> 00:11:19,080 embarrassing because interesting because I was saying to 213 00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:22,240 Courtney, I think that she didn't want to watch the summary 214 00:11:22,240 --> 00:11:25,760 turned pretty on Amazon Prime because her friend told her that 215 00:11:25,760 --> 00:11:27,880 it was like, cringy. I haven't seen it. 216 00:11:28,360 --> 00:11:31,280 But, like, that's real life, you know, like I said this the other 217 00:11:31,280 --> 00:11:33,800 week, like, I just think it's so funny that we're just so used to 218 00:11:33,800 --> 00:11:38,760 everything being so scripted. And that's not how real life 219 00:11:38,760 --> 00:11:40,680 actually is. Like, when you're 16, which is 220 00:11:40,680 --> 00:11:42,600 what, the age of the people in the summer, I turn pretty. 221 00:11:42,600 --> 00:11:45,160 Like that is real life, that everything feels a little bit 222 00:11:45,160 --> 00:11:48,680 awkward and uncomfortable and you don't actually know, like 223 00:11:48,680 --> 00:11:50,840 what you're doing and just, like, fumbling around. 224 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:52,920 So I feel like Gen. Z thinks so much is 225 00:11:52,920 --> 00:11:54,760 embarrassing, which I think is hilarious. 226 00:11:55,560 --> 00:11:58,160 Did you ever watch the show Love? 227 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:00,640 No. Jillian Flynn, Is that her? 228 00:12:00,640 --> 00:12:02,400 Jillian. No, that's an author. 229 00:12:02,680 --> 00:12:04,120 Jillian. Oh, something. 230 00:12:04,120 --> 00:12:06,680 But she's in community. But it's like that. 231 00:12:06,680 --> 00:12:09,760 It's like, you watch it and it's about like, yeah, like a couple 232 00:12:09,760 --> 00:12:13,840 that kind of finds love. But it's like, it's so awkward, 233 00:12:13,840 --> 00:12:16,400 but it's so real. Like, it's so raw and like, 234 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:19,160 that's what it's like when you first kind of meet someone and 235 00:12:19,160 --> 00:12:22,160 start dating them or start kind of 1 views into each other and 236 00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:24,240 the others not like. And it's like all those cringey 237 00:12:24,240 --> 00:12:26,720 moments that you want to die. And then you think of the flip 238 00:12:26,720 --> 00:12:30,240 side like Gossip Girl, which is like the complete opposite. 239 00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:32,840 It's like they're supposed to be what, like 1516? 240 00:12:32,840 --> 00:12:37,360 And they're like, so witty, so mature, so polished. 241 00:12:37,360 --> 00:12:40,760 And you're just like This is so unrealistic, but it's also so 242 00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:43,200 good, yeah. But you don't know that if 243 00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:46,680 that's all the media you're consuming is that same kind of 244 00:12:46,680 --> 00:12:51,720 really polished scripted content that it seems like really 245 00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:54,880 jarring to see the awkward real life version, but that's it's 246 00:12:54,880 --> 00:12:56,680 more, it's more realistic, you know. 247 00:12:56,920 --> 00:13:01,520 So Caitlin Tiffany explains that this like, move away from having 248 00:13:01,520 --> 00:13:05,520 large social media followings is evident in like a resurgence of 249 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:09,920 apps like Tumblr and Discord, which obviously allows for like 250 00:13:09,920 --> 00:13:12,200 anonymous voice and text conversations. 251 00:13:12,200 --> 00:13:15,320 And like crafting like how Tumblr works, you're like 252 00:13:15,320 --> 00:13:18,120 crafting your personal brand, but in a way that, like, nobody 253 00:13:18,120 --> 00:13:21,040 knows who you are. So she explains that like 254 00:13:21,040 --> 00:13:24,520 crafting A cohesive, persistent personal brand, which is 255 00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:26,760 something millennials were really excited to do. 256 00:13:26,760 --> 00:13:29,960 And I feel like part of the appeal was like competing to who 257 00:13:29,960 --> 00:13:33,520 could create the best personal brand, who could show, like who 258 00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:36,400 could have the best life and like represent that in the best 259 00:13:36,400 --> 00:13:38,480 way. So now that seems like something 260 00:13:38,480 --> 00:13:41,280 that's been, it seems like exhausting to Gen. 261 00:13:41,280 --> 00:13:42,920 Z. As a result, it seems like 262 00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:45,080 something they're like not willing to participate in. 263 00:13:45,080 --> 00:13:47,720 They don't wanna curate this image of their life. 264 00:13:47,720 --> 00:13:49,520 They're like I'm tired. Well, yeah. 265 00:13:49,520 --> 00:13:53,840 Like, it's literally so much work to try and have a personal 266 00:13:53,840 --> 00:13:56,320 brand, especially if you're just a regular person. 267 00:13:56,640 --> 00:13:59,880 Like, I feel like the concept of a personal brand and how like 268 00:13:59,920 --> 00:14:02,880 everybody has to have a personal brand online because obviously 269 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:04,160 we all have social media and whatever. 270 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:08,160 Like that was a concept that I feel like was fed to us by these 271 00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:13,440 like productivity gurus and like coaches and this is like fed to 272 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:15,920 millennials. And I mean, we were again, like 273 00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:17,720 we've talked about this so many times, but like the first 274 00:14:17,720 --> 00:14:20,200 generation obviously that grew up with like social media, the 275 00:14:20,200 --> 00:14:23,640 first generation on social media really like as a generation. 276 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:27,120 So we did think like it was important to have this kind of 277 00:14:27,120 --> 00:14:29,520 really polished, cohesive personal brand. 278 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:32,120 But I just think for Gen. Zed, they see that they don't 279 00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:35,000 necessarily need that there's already been some kind of trial 280 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:37,560 and error. It's exhausting the idea of like 281 00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:38,960 Gen. Zed like ditching the personal 282 00:14:38,960 --> 00:14:40,440 brand. Like it totally tracks with how 283 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:44,400 they see work in general, right. Like they don't subscribe to 284 00:14:44,400 --> 00:14:48,640 like this romanticization of Labor the way that millennials 285 00:14:48,640 --> 00:14:50,160 do. They don't subscribe to like, 286 00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:52,800 Hustle culture. So to them, they're like, why 287 00:14:52,800 --> 00:14:55,600 would I turn my personal social media that I use to like, 288 00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:58,360 connect with my friends and like, follow the things that I 289 00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:02,240 like into work if I don't even work in this space, Like, if I'm 290 00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:04,200 not trying to be, that's. So true. 291 00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:07,520 It's so interesting how we were told that and I still very much 292 00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:13,520 subscribe to this mentality that my like Instagram is a resume 293 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:15,280 almost. And I know it's different in 294 00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:17,520 creative industries. It's like exacerbated a little 295 00:15:17,520 --> 00:15:19,440 bit as well. But that is like what you're 296 00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:22,040 putting out to the world. And because we're so like 297 00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:24,880 interconnected now, you know, like we're doing work trips to 298 00:15:24,880 --> 00:15:27,640 the US and between Canada and Australia and all this stuff, 299 00:15:27,640 --> 00:15:32,000 it's like this is potentially how you get new business because 300 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:35,240 people find you like intriguing or put together or like 301 00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:37,760 intelligent like these. All the kind of things that 302 00:15:37,760 --> 00:15:41,000 we're trying to put out, like through our tiny, like little 303 00:15:41,000 --> 00:15:43,560 grid on an app on our phone, like, are we OK? 304 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:46,720 But then I think about like, when I think about, yeah, that 305 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:50,760 concept of like us using social, social media as a resume, it is 306 00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:53,720 different as like a business owner, but still it's very much 307 00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:56,200 like something that our, our generation does. 308 00:15:56,320 --> 00:16:01,760 But then I think about when we're hiring people and where we 309 00:16:01,760 --> 00:16:04,000 hired Gen. Zed, like we have never hired 310 00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:06,040 anybody that wasn't Gen. Zed so far. 311 00:16:06,200 --> 00:16:09,000 If I look them up on Instagram and they're private, like I 312 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:10,760 don't even think about them like, OK, what? 313 00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:13,280 Like, you know what I mean? Like it doesn't like impact my 314 00:16:13,280 --> 00:16:15,960 decision. Like sometimes I don't even look 315 00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:18,600 at somebody's Instagram because I'm just looking at their resume 316 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:20,000 and their writing samples or whatever. 317 00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:23,720 Like, I just, I do think that we put a lot of pressure on 318 00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:26,840 ourselves with this and it's not as big of a deal as, like our 319 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:30,400 parents told us it would be. Well, that's the thing. 320 00:16:30,400 --> 00:16:32,880 At the beginning I was going through high school and I've 321 00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:34,320 mentioned this on the podcast before. 322 00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:37,920 We were having training courses by Internet experts to not put 323 00:16:37,920 --> 00:16:42,000 like drunk photos of ourselves on Myspace or Facebook. 324 00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:44,680 Because then by the time you want to get a job like however 325 00:16:44,680 --> 00:16:48,000 many years later, like, they could easily resurface and the 326 00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:50,520 police can only do. We will literally get scared 327 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:54,240 half to death by people coming in and saying the police can't 328 00:16:54,240 --> 00:16:57,040 remove those images because once you've put it there, they've 329 00:16:57,040 --> 00:16:59,840 probably been circulated like thousands of times that will 330 00:16:59,840 --> 00:17:02,160 live online forever. Like the police can only do so 331 00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:04,400 much. Like obviously there's a sliding 332 00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:06,720 scale of what's embarrassing enough that you would like go to 333 00:17:06,720 --> 00:17:10,319 the police and have removed and the whole revenge porn aspect is 334 00:17:10,319 --> 00:17:14,520 like a whole other part of it. But I do think that we were 335 00:17:14,520 --> 00:17:19,440 scared so much into like the way that we present online that it's 336 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:22,240 like affected and become a thread through like every single 337 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:25,200 thing we do now. So Kaitlyn Tiffany says in her 338 00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:27,000 Atlantic piece, it seems like Gen. 339 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:29,720 Z is getting really tired of presentation culture, as you 340 00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:33,040 might call it. So Zeke, a 21 year old biologist 341 00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:36,080 and frequent Discord chatter told her the idea that 342 00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:38,600 everything you do has to be a represent, has to be a 343 00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:42,560 representation of your personal identity is just like crazy to 344 00:17:42,560 --> 00:17:44,280 them. And I agree with what you said 345 00:17:44,280 --> 00:17:46,240 as far as the gap they have, Gen. 346 00:17:46,240 --> 00:17:49,600 Z have a better separation between work and home life. 347 00:17:49,600 --> 00:17:53,160 Like they're not looking for them to be connected. 348 00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:55,600 They want to go to work and then come home. 349 00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:58,760 Like I think growing up in a pandemic, their formative years 350 00:17:58,760 --> 00:18:01,120 have really shifted their expectation of what's worth 351 00:18:01,120 --> 00:18:03,800 their energy because of the strain on their mental health 352 00:18:03,800 --> 00:18:06,440 over the last few years between like world events and social 353 00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:08,280 media. They do really want this 354 00:18:08,600 --> 00:18:11,240 separation. And I think if you treat social 355 00:18:11,320 --> 00:18:14,440 media as an extension of work, then it feels like work. 356 00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:18,080 The writer credits the trend of like anonymity and this move 357 00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:21,960 away from personal brand as a response to a few things. 358 00:18:22,160 --> 00:18:25,160 So the first being security concerns, which we kind of 359 00:18:25,160 --> 00:18:27,880 touched on. So this was really exacerbated 360 00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:29,600 during the Black Lives Matter protest. 361 00:18:29,600 --> 00:18:32,680 Like lots of young people downloaded Signal and encrypted 362 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:34,880 messaging app, which I understand to be like WhatsApp. 363 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:36,640 I don't really know the difference between Signal and 364 00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:40,240 WhatsApp, but it is encrypted, so it's downloaded, they 365 00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:43,200 downloaded it and communicated via Signal to avoid 366 00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:47,120 surveillance. And then K Pop fans derailing 367 00:18:47,120 --> 00:18:50,600 the Trump rally was another example of anonymous users 368 00:18:50,600 --> 00:18:53,160 banding together to, like, instigate social change. 369 00:18:53,160 --> 00:18:56,720 But that did feel like something extremely that felt like a 370 00:18:56,720 --> 00:19:00,440 moment that was really heated and potentially dangerous. 371 00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:03,160 So the anonymity for something like that was really important. 372 00:19:03,520 --> 00:19:07,760 And then other activists were sharing tools to blur protesters 373 00:19:07,760 --> 00:19:11,160 faces and Instagram stories. So I think we saw this with the 374 00:19:11,400 --> 00:19:15,480 January 6th Capital riots, how social media was utilized like 375 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:17,760 in a negative way. It was utilized as a planning 376 00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:20,880 and organizational tool for people with a shared ethos to 377 00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:24,160 connect and then like organize to be in the same place in the 378 00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:26,040 same time. And it really kind of like riled 379 00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:28,840 people up together and help them organize the rights in the 1st 380 00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:30,840 place. But then it became a tool for 381 00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:34,080 people, for police to track down the people who were involved. 382 00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:36,480 So heaps of people bragged about it on social media. 383 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:39,920 They got found, lots of people were identified from like social 384 00:19:39,920 --> 00:19:43,880 media stories, like Instagram stories and Facebook stories and 385 00:19:43,880 --> 00:19:45,920 then the police were able to track them down through that. 386 00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:51,160 So we saw like kind of both sides of the security issues in 387 00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:53,760 like a hated political circumstance like that. 388 00:19:54,120 --> 00:19:57,880 Another reason she credits is the rise of Web 3 and crypto 389 00:19:57,880 --> 00:19:59,560 culture. So the premise of crypto, 390 00:19:59,560 --> 00:20:03,000 obviously is that transactions can be made online without the 391 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:06,280 exchange of personally identifying information and then 392 00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:08,800 the rise of. NFTS to have seen people like 393 00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:12,840 replacing their profile pictures with cartoons and like images 394 00:20:12,840 --> 00:20:16,240 that aren't themselves, This personally feels really jarring 395 00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:18,640 to me and I feel like it's not sustainable because like to buy 396 00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:21,760 a house or get a loan or buy a car like you need to show your 397 00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:25,360 identity and payslips and proof of funds and it has to be tied 398 00:20:25,360 --> 00:20:29,000 to your like actual in real life personal identity. 399 00:20:29,000 --> 00:20:32,680 So I feel like this reason for anonymity can't coexist with 400 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:34,920 real life. Like it feels like very Gen. 401 00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:37,880 Z and futuristic. But I don't know, maybe I don't 402 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:39,560 see the vision. I feel like I'm talking like a 403 00:20:39,560 --> 00:20:43,160 boomer, but like it almost has to exist in isolation. 404 00:20:43,160 --> 00:20:46,400 Like you can't have grown up things and live a grown up life 405 00:20:46,400 --> 00:20:49,480 and exist anonymously and live through crypto, you know? 406 00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:51,880 I know. I really wish Sean was here. 407 00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:55,440 So he could just like have a point, 'cause I just know he 408 00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:57,240 would be like, well, This is why. 409 00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:01,120 Or like or he would agree with you and have an explanation but 410 00:21:01,120 --> 00:21:03,360 because I don't understand it well enough either. 411 00:21:03,880 --> 00:21:07,080 But like Christine Quinn has that company where she you can 412 00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:09,960 buy houses with crypto, you can't take out a mortgage with 413 00:21:09,960 --> 00:21:12,240 crypto. So she is selling houses I'm 414 00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:17,120 assuming outright. Or what I was thinking is would 415 00:21:17,120 --> 00:21:22,960 it be her company buying houses like with real money and then 416 00:21:22,960 --> 00:21:26,640 she is selling them for crypto? Possibly. 417 00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:31,040 My understanding of Web three and the concept of crypto and 418 00:21:31,040 --> 00:21:34,280 stuff is so that it's like decentralized, right? 419 00:21:34,280 --> 00:21:38,840 So that it's like we take the power out of like the hands of 420 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:42,840 like the few elite in the world, like the banks and the 421 00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:45,360 government and whatever, regulating how we spend our 422 00:21:45,360 --> 00:21:47,520 money and how much things cost and whatever. 423 00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:50,320 And it's like the power is back in your hands because everything 424 00:21:50,320 --> 00:21:52,400 is anonymous and there's no way to trace it. 425 00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:55,920 So maybe at the end of the day, like, you'll be buying, like 426 00:21:55,960 --> 00:21:59,320 Christine will be brokering between me wanting to sell my 427 00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:02,280 house and get paid in crypto to somebody that wants to pay in 428 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:04,240 crypto. So she's finding those two 429 00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:07,000 people and is connecting them. And then I guess you just have a 430 00:22:07,000 --> 00:22:09,760 contract drawn up that specifies that. 431 00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:12,600 So it is like possible, I suppose It's just like kind of 432 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:16,440 finding a new God that like, understands it and is willing to 433 00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:18,880 engage in a contract of like that kind. 434 00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:22,040 I guess the concept is that in like, you know, whatever, 20 435 00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:25,800 years you'll just have your wallet, like your crypto wallet 436 00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:29,040 and that'll be like another bank account and you'll be able to 437 00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:33,480 buy lots of things online for crypto and it might be possibly 438 00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:37,080 way cheaper than, you know, real money or whatever, because it's 439 00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:40,000 all decentralized. I don't know, we're very not 440 00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:43,000 well versed in this guy, so I'm sorry if this is bothering you. 441 00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:44,520 I. Actually try quite hard. 442 00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:47,200 I just I I really struggle. I do feel like we need to do 443 00:22:47,200 --> 00:22:49,160 like a training session in Web 3. 444 00:22:49,240 --> 00:22:52,880 I yes, I need somebody to conduct a training session in 445 00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:54,560 web three. Like what the fuck? 446 00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:58,200 Like I consume so much content about like Internet culture and 447 00:22:58,200 --> 00:22:59,920 same with you, like tech developments and everything. 448 00:22:59,920 --> 00:23:03,120 And I still just like cannot. So if any of our listeners are 449 00:23:03,120 --> 00:23:07,160 experts in Web Three hit us up, we need some explainers. 450 00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:11,080 OK, so the third reason that Kaitlyn Tiffany references in 451 00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:14,840 the Atlantic piece for this move towards anonymity is nostalgia. 452 00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:19,280 So she explains Discord is an example of this and Suggests had 453 00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:22,640 nostalgia amongst Gen. Z for the like foreign culture 454 00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:24,760 that existed mostly before they were born. 455 00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:28,120 So Tumblr is the same, she says. Tumblr was at its peak just 456 00:23:28,120 --> 00:23:31,640 before the era of the Influencer and that's the feeling that Gen. 457 00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:33,720 Z are chasing. They're chasing this time like 458 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:37,600 before the influencer existed. And these platforms let people 459 00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:40,560 be known for their like point of view or what they can bring to, 460 00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:44,520 say, a round table discussion, rather than like their face or 461 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:47,680 even their personality, which is what Instagram and Tiktok 462 00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:50,800 function around. Yeah, like that makes sense. 463 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:54,040 I mean, my favorite corner of the Internet, like my favorite 464 00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:58,120 place to be on the Internet is this is gonna like straight up 465 00:23:58,120 --> 00:24:00,160 make me sound like a boomer. Speaking of sounding like a 466 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:05,480 boomer is being in my Facebook groups because they are like 467 00:24:05,480 --> 00:24:08,760 Discord servers basically for like the podcast that I listen 468 00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:10,240 to. And that's like the only I'm in 469 00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:12,760 like dog spotting, which like everybody is in dog spotting. 470 00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:15,560 And then I'm in, like, all the different Facebook groups for my 471 00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:18,520 favorite podcasts. And like, I can't help if 472 00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:21,040 they're on Facebook, OK, It's like, if you're in our Facebook 473 00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:22,680 group, you can't help that we chose Facebook instead of 474 00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:24,320 Discord. OK, so, like, don't shame me, 475 00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:28,200 but it's like the best place to be because it's just this, like, 476 00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:31,320 collective of people that have this, like, shared interests. 477 00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:33,520 And I know in the article when she was interviewing Gen. 478 00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:36,160 Z who are like, really into Discord service, it's the same 479 00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:37,320 thing. It's like, it's so chill. 480 00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:40,120 It's like people will post like something about pop culture and 481 00:24:40,120 --> 00:24:41,480 be like, what's your opinion on this? 482 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:44,360 Or like, let's talk about this. And I just love to read 483 00:24:44,360 --> 00:24:47,560 everybody's opinions. And it's just so calm and chill. 484 00:24:47,560 --> 00:24:50,880 And there's not all these like weird assumptions and things 485 00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:53,720 taken out of context the same way, if you had posted that on 486 00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:56,360 Twitter, for example. So the second piece that we're 487 00:24:56,360 --> 00:24:58,960 going to talk about is written by our writer Annabelle, and 488 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:00,880 it's called the pursuit for privacy. 489 00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:03,760 What does anonymity mean online mean for Gen. 490 00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:06,320 Z? So Annabelle justification is 491 00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:10,320 slightly different for why Gen. Z prioritizes anonymity so 492 00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:12,640 highly. She says it partly comes down to 493 00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:15,280 the fact that Gen. Z content creators are acting as 494 00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:18,200 role models, and they're taking a step back from their social 495 00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:20,920 media presences and careers and influencing their young 496 00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:25,480 audiences to do the same. So Annabelle's examples are best 497 00:25:25,480 --> 00:25:29,320 dressed Joanna, Cedia, and even Emma Chamberlain. 498 00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:33,120 Until recently, they've all left their social media platforms, 499 00:25:33,120 --> 00:25:35,800 taking a step back at what seems to be the height of their 500 00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:38,760 careers so a YouTube creator, Nicole Raffy. 501 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,500 She explains how influences that have risen from being, quote, UN 502 00:25:42,500 --> 00:25:45,360 quote authentic are now seeing this conflict with their 503 00:25:45,360 --> 00:25:48,120 privacy. So every part of the viral space 504 00:25:48,120 --> 00:25:50,760 becomes commodified. And because of this, something 505 00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:54,480 as simple as giving creators a video view or using their 506 00:25:54,480 --> 00:25:58,440 discount code breeds a sense of entitlement among viewers. 507 00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:02,840 So Nicole says that we detach creators, especially women, from 508 00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:05,280 being human beings. They owe us something, 509 00:26:05,280 --> 00:26:07,520 especially if we have helped them build their success. 510 00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:10,320 If we gave them that, they owe us something in return. 511 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:13,880 So people, as a result, expect this unfiltered access to the 512 00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:15,680 personal lives of these creators. 513 00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:18,040 But because young people have grown up from the beginning, 514 00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:20,360 watching people build their personal brand, it's like 515 00:26:20,360 --> 00:26:23,680 they're only just discovering how good it feels to be no one 516 00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:26,720 in particular or to try on different identities, Caitlin 517 00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:29,560 writes for The Atlantic. So huge viral creators like Emma 518 00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:31,440 Chamberlain are included in this. 519 00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:34,640 Like she's been building a personal brand for so long that 520 00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:38,800 she actually doesn't know what it's like not to be tied to the 521 00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:41,360 version of herself that she's created on the Internet. 522 00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:46,680 What's interesting about this, about what Nicole said about 523 00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:51,200 how, like, we detach creators from being human beings and we 524 00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:53,480 feel like they owe us something because we've given them their 525 00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:56,000 careers. Like, I was listening to a 526 00:26:56,000 --> 00:27:01,200 podcast a couple days ago and it was 2 pretty big influencers 527 00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:05,240 talking about a cancellation. They didn't name the name, but 528 00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:08,520 like, I would bet so much money that they were talking about 529 00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:09,800 tanks. They were talking about how they 530 00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:12,800 were messaging her to say, like, you know, you'll get through 531 00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:16,120 this, whatever. They said that this person, I 532 00:27:16,120 --> 00:27:18,440 think it's tanks, but it was definitely not confirmed. 533 00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:22,920 But whoever it was responded to one of them and said, like, I'm 534 00:27:22,920 --> 00:27:25,920 having a really hard time because I I've given these 535 00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:28,920 people everything and look what they've done to me. 536 00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:31,400 And I thought and they just said this in like a throwaway like 537 00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:34,440 amongst their conversation. But it was so interesting to me 538 00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:39,240 that this influencer like sees it that way, that they see it as 539 00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:42,960 the reverse. Like I have given you all of me 540 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:47,640 and now you've turned on me. And it's like we feel the same. 541 00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:50,760 We feel like we have given us viewers, like we have given you 542 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:53,560 everything. We've given you our time, our 543 00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:57,640 energy, our support, our money, like all of these things. 544 00:27:57,640 --> 00:28:00,920 It's so interesting how at the end of the day, both people feel 545 00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:03,160 the exact same way. And it's such a transaction, but 546 00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:07,160 there's still so much emotion involved in it. 100% It's like 547 00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:10,120 neither can quite conflate how the other side feels, but they 548 00:28:10,120 --> 00:28:14,120 think that they understand. So it it does make complete 549 00:28:14,120 --> 00:28:17,520 sense that like influencers or creators like Emma Chamberlain 550 00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:21,560 that have been doing this for literally her whole adult life, 551 00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:23,680 for a lot of her teenage life too. 552 00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:26,640 So at this point, people wanting to be anonymous or take a step 553 00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:30,200 back from social media is merely mimicking whether they realize 554 00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:32,080 it or not. They're just like reacting to 555 00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:34,240 what their favorite creators are doing in this shift that they've 556 00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:38,280 seen their creators like this realization moment for them and 557 00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:40,800 then this step down moment. And we don't get to see if 558 00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:42,200 they're happy or not. But you like, assume that 559 00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:44,320 they're happy once they've left the Internet, like that was the 560 00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:45,680 point. Otherwise they'd come back, 561 00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:47,720 right? I mean that's so true with 562 00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:50,720 everything, like look at how trends go on, even like 563 00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:52,720 aesthetics. With Instagram it used to be 564 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:57,160 like having overly like Lightroom preset grids were like 565 00:28:57,160 --> 00:29:00,280 super in and then it was like having no presets, normal grids 566 00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:02,160 and now it's like having dark grids. 567 00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:05,280 I am so tired of the dark aesthetic. 568 00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:08,120 I don't want to see a practically pitch black photo of 569 00:29:08,120 --> 00:29:10,840 you in Tuscany. I want to see the colors if you 570 00:29:10,840 --> 00:29:13,280 are in Tuscany. I want to see the yellows and 571 00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:16,480 the Blues and the greens. Like what is with this like, dim 572 00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:18,640 light shit? 100 percent, 100%. 573 00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:22,600 So what Annabelle brings up that's really important to look 574 00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:26,120 at is the dark side of anonymity on social media. 575 00:29:26,120 --> 00:29:28,640 So we've spoken about kind of like all the reasons that Gen. 576 00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:31,960 Z want to be anonymous and why, that they feel like it's an 577 00:29:31,960 --> 00:29:33,440 issue that they've had to do this. 578 00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:36,840 But she also explains that while privacy comes with, you know, 579 00:29:36,840 --> 00:29:40,400 freedom, flexibility and anonymity, it also encourages 580 00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:42,600 trolls and misinformation to spread. 581 00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:46,200 Users who hide behind faceless profiles feel a disconnect 582 00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:49,040 between them as people and their online persona. 583 00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:52,280 And because of this, a sense of anarchy has come to dominate 584 00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:54,960 social media platforms and as a result it creates a really 585 00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:57,920 dangerous environment. So the fact that we have become 586 00:29:57,920 --> 00:30:01,560 so accustomed to seeing an onslaught of hate in any 587 00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:05,360 particular comment section is like a really fucked up 588 00:30:05,360 --> 00:30:07,440 adjustment that we're just like, what's that? 589 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:10,560 You know, that tick tock that's going around being like, what is 590 00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:13,680 something that's a scam? It's been ingrained in you that 591 00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:16,200 like it's not a scam. This is one of them. 592 00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:19,200 The fact that anytime we go online, we can expect to see 593 00:30:19,200 --> 00:30:22,240 like probably 50% love but 50% hate. 594 00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:24,760 It's not even. A custom it's like expected. 595 00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:27,240 Yeah, completely. So this is obviously 596 00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:29,880 particularly prevalent with TikTok because as TikTok has 597 00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:34,000 democratized viral stardom. Like anyone can go viral when it 598 00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:37,320 happens accidentally, but Gen. Z wanna stay anonymous, it can 599 00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:41,000 lead to situations like Couch Guy that end up really harmful 600 00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:44,480 to those on the receiving end. And it also really plays into 601 00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:47,920 like a mob mentality. And that's what we've spoken 602 00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:55,440 about quite often is that when a faceless Nameless user makes a 603 00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:58,240 point, it then like validates everyone else. 604 00:30:58,240 --> 00:31:02,040 It has same like harmful commentary to then like speak up 605 00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:03,840 or get behind like that point of view. 606 00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:05,920 And I thought it was really interesting when you brought up 607 00:31:05,920 --> 00:31:08,320 the Facebook group thing that you said everyone's pop culture 608 00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:10,760 commentary was really interesting and everyone was 609 00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:13,520 like engaged, but it was like a pleasant environment. 610 00:31:13,520 --> 00:31:16,120 That's because people have their names and their profiles 611 00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:17,800 attached. And I obviously that's not 612 00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:21,440 always the case with Facebook, but I feel like that is where 613 00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:23,880 there's a massive gap between the way people engage on 614 00:31:23,880 --> 00:31:25,920 Facebook and the way that people engage on TikTok. 615 00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:30,760 And there is consequences in these communities like if you 616 00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:34,480 are being like bullying or sending hate or being even just 617 00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:38,480 like, you know, communicating in like a really not civil way, 618 00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:40,840 like you'll just be kicked out. And so it's like if you really 619 00:31:40,840 --> 00:31:43,360 value being part of this group and in this community and 620 00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:45,320 whatever, like you're going to be respectful and have like 621 00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:47,160 respectful debate. The same way that, like you 622 00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:49,480 know, you would hope if you were standing in front of somebody 623 00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:51,440 who had a difference of opinion to you, you wouldn't be 624 00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:54,640 screaming in their face telling them that they should go kill 625 00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:56,680 themselves. I think it is good for Gen. 626 00:31:56,680 --> 00:32:02,040 Zed to take as much of their personal information offline as 627 00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:02,640 possible. I think. 628 00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:04,840 I just think right now the Internet is like, not a very 629 00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:07,040 safe place. I think there's like a lot of 630 00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:09,480 doxing going on. There's like so much cyber 631 00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:12,240 bullying. And I don't know if you've seen 632 00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:16,200 that meme. That's like, how do mofos get 633 00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:18,240 cyber bullied? Like, just log off, bro. 634 00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:22,360 But like, you also can't really get cyber bullied if people 635 00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:24,760 don't know who you are 'cause they're not actually bullying 636 00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:26,480 you. Yes, but. 637 00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:30,160 I think that's also kind of where the problem is, is that 638 00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:34,240 because people don't actually have to like stand behind their, 639 00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:38,120 the messaging that they're putting out, they like, say all 640 00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:41,440 this outrageous stuff that would never fly in real life like you. 641 00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:42,600 It's the same, it's the same point. 642 00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:45,080 It's like you wouldn't go up to somebody and say you should 643 00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:47,840 drink bleach to cure COVID, you know, something like that. 644 00:32:47,840 --> 00:32:50,920 But then when you're online and you don't have a name attached, 645 00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:54,040 like if you believe that you can spread that message without 646 00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:56,120 actually having it like attached to you. 647 00:32:56,760 --> 00:32:59,160 Also, I feel like people are more likely to say that like 648 00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:01,760 darkest things that they really mean. 649 00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:05,040 Yes, I guess. So I guess how I'm like 650 00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:08,880 approaching it in my thoughts is like in terms of Gen. 651 00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:12,680 Zed's like mental health. If more people become anonymous, 652 00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:14,680 like if Gen. Zed becomes more and more 653 00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:17,480 anonymous and like future generations start becoming more 654 00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:19,680 and more private because they see how millennials just we 655 00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:21,760 absolutely just fucked everything up for ourselves. 656 00:33:22,440 --> 00:33:26,680 There will be less people to attack and and I think people 657 00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:30,440 will start to lead their lives more and more offline, which is 658 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:33,560 like just good in general. I actually, I think you're 659 00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:35,520 right. I think that the point that you 660 00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:38,320 made about the Facebook groups and how it's it's a privilege to 661 00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:42,440 be a part of that community. So you have to abide by the 662 00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:46,000 rules and regulations and moderation that's in place. 663 00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:49,320 And I think apps like Geneva that I just wrote about, so it's 664 00:33:49,320 --> 00:33:51,400 like a chat. It's basically combined the chat 665 00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:55,200 functions of every other app and put it in one place. 666 00:33:55,240 --> 00:33:59,280 And then you can join like Facebook group, esque groups. 667 00:33:59,280 --> 00:34:01,480 So there were all these groups like I joined like Gen. 668 00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:04,840 Z, girl gang and you can join like female founder group. 669 00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:08,239 So it's kind of taking the premise of Facebook groups and 670 00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:10,639 like kind of building a community around like a shared 671 00:34:10,639 --> 00:34:13,360 interest. And that's the priority more so 672 00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:15,760 even than like connecting with your friends because you're 673 00:34:15,760 --> 00:34:17,520 friends, you would just like text. 674 00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:20,960 So you have that Direct Line to your friends and then you have 675 00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:25,120 like a moderated community that you're you feel like it's a 676 00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:29,239 privilege to be a part of and is really like closely monitored as 677 00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:30,560 far as the kind of things you say. 678 00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:33,040 So maybe, like that's the direction of social media, that 679 00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:36,440 there will be nothing in the middle where people this kind of 680 00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:39,440 like trolling and misinformation and like horrible hate speech 681 00:34:39,440 --> 00:34:44,000 actually like, comes to exist. Well, I was telling Sean about 682 00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:46,480 be real because obviously I was doing it like, I only just got 683 00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:52,040 it when we started the vacation. And then he was like, so how do 684 00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:54,239 you grow a following? And I was like, you don't. 685 00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:56,120 That's the point. Like, it's just your friends. 686 00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:58,640 Like it's all about like connecting with people and like 687 00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:02,320 maybe they will eventually roll out different like features for 688 00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:03,800 that and stuff, but it reminds. Me more of like. 689 00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:07,360 Snapchat where it's just like about connecting with the people 690 00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:10,320 that you know or the things that you care about and whatever. 691 00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:13,120 And like I do think that is 100% the future of social media. 692 00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:17,120 I think it is tough because like the influencer industry is just 693 00:35:17,120 --> 00:35:19,640 so big now. Like, I don't think we can ever 694 00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:24,040 go backwards, but it'll be interesting to see if future 695 00:35:24,040 --> 00:35:28,200 generations even download Instagram, for example, you 696 00:35:28,240 --> 00:35:30,520 know, or if they just do things like be real. 697 00:35:30,680 --> 00:35:32,400 It is. It does feel like a hot take, 698 00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:36,120 but the all the existing influences will continue to 699 00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:41,280 exist and they will like they'll live out and grow their careers 700 00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:45,560 as they would as they age. But we might not be seeing many 701 00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:49,800 new influences from Instagram are kind of coming through. 702 00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:52,640 Like there will be kind of an age cut off of people that 703 00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:56,280 decided they weren't interested in building a following on that 704 00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:58,960 platform. But I think it will manifest in 705 00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:00,840 different ways because it's interesting that everyone 706 00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:04,960 they're doing social media or like content creator courses now 707 00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:06,760 at universities and stuff like that. 708 00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:09,920 And there was this mentality for a really long time that everyone 709 00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:12,960 wants to be an influencer. And I think that kind of premise 710 00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:15,720 has existed for long enough that they're that we're realizing 711 00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:18,680 that isn't actually the case. No, I agree. 712 00:36:18,680 --> 00:36:20,720 And I think Gen. Zed is too smart and just future 713 00:36:20,720 --> 00:36:22,440 generations will just be too smart. 714 00:36:22,440 --> 00:36:26,240 They'll see the downsides to it. I think one of the biggest 715 00:36:26,240 --> 00:36:30,240 reasons why Gen. Zed is pursuing privacy is 716 00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:34,480 because of the way that online culture functions at the moment. 717 00:36:34,720 --> 00:36:38,560 I think that plays a much bigger role in why they are pursuing 718 00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:42,640 privacy rather than to them, it's just like trying to be cool 719 00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:45,040 or it's like the new trendy thing that their favorite 720 00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:47,440 influencers are doing. Because if you think about it, 721 00:36:47,640 --> 00:36:51,800 this kind of shift in social media and influencer culture 722 00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:57,000 started happening around like 2020 and 2020 was like literally 723 00:36:57,040 --> 00:37:00,000 such an influential year. And like, I know that people 724 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:04,560 talk about it, but I think it's a much like in terms of how the 725 00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:07,840 online world functions and the viral space functions. 726 00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:12,680 I don't think we give this one year enough credit, if that 727 00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:15,680 makes sense. Like it completely changed life 728 00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:20,720 online, like and it changed how regular Internet users showed up 729 00:37:20,720 --> 00:37:22,920 online. It changed how we expect 730 00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:25,520 influencers and celebrities to show up online because like 731 00:37:25,720 --> 00:37:28,000 before 2020, like obviously cancel culture and 732 00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:30,640 accountability culture and all of that existed. 733 00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:33,920 But it wasn't even close to the magnitude that it is now. 734 00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:37,480 And I just think that year in particular was this like perfect 735 00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:42,600 storm between what happened to George Floyd and BLM, the Trump 736 00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:46,760 election, obviously COVID and then TikTok blowing up at the 737 00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:49,080 same time. It was like this perfect storm, 738 00:37:49,080 --> 00:37:52,000 and it felt like this pressure cooker of a time where, like, 739 00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:55,800 people all around the world felt like life was literally the 740 00:37:55,800 --> 00:37:58,760 worst that had ever been. And then like two years later, 741 00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,360 now we sit here and it's like things haven't gotten really any 742 00:38:01,360 --> 00:38:03,400 better. Like a lot of people feel like 743 00:38:03,400 --> 00:38:06,840 things have actually just kept getting worse, especially if you 744 00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:09,960 live in America. So I think 2020 was like this 745 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:14,040 pivotal year where like everyone felt so completely out of 746 00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:17,560 control in their lives. And we haven't really regained 747 00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:22,800 like any of that control since. And like I would theorize that 748 00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:27,320 this majorly seeped into how people showed up online and it 749 00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:30,680 forever changed the Internet. Because if you are somebody and 750 00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:33,600 like you're able to call someone out for something that you think 751 00:38:33,600 --> 00:38:36,960 is wrong and you're getting like tangible results from it, where 752 00:38:36,960 --> 00:38:40,880 people like, jump on board, they validate your anger, they help 753 00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:44,280 you create change, whether that's like someone deleting a 754 00:38:44,280 --> 00:38:47,840 video, making an apology or like ending their career. 755 00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:52,240 Like that type of situation gives people back that sense of 756 00:38:52,240 --> 00:38:55,720 control that we feel like we've completely lost since 2020. 757 00:38:56,120 --> 00:38:59,280 And I feel like that's a sense of control that a lot of people 758 00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:01,680 don't feel like they have in the external world now. 759 00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:05,720 And like obviously this shift in how like regular Internet users 760 00:39:05,720 --> 00:39:10,200 now engage online has had a major impact on influencers and 761 00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:13,000 creators and what they are now willing to share. 762 00:39:13,040 --> 00:39:17,760 Because we genuinely do not give people a lot of grace. 763 00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:20,800 We rarely give anyone like the benefit of the doubt. 764 00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:25,560 And there's this, this snowball effect that like one single 765 00:39:25,560 --> 00:39:29,840 person taking issue with something you said or did and it 766 00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:32,680 will just snowball like you said, like mob mentality in a 767 00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:35,160 way that it just like never used to. 768 00:39:35,240 --> 00:39:37,680 Nobody gives anybody the benefit of the doubt anymore. 769 00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:42,280 Yeah, it truly is like bad for both sides. 770 00:39:42,280 --> 00:39:46,800 I mean, only bad in a sense that it it's it's become so extreme, 771 00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:49,160 like people have gotten meaner because they feel like their 772 00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:51,920 opinion, regardless of what it is, will be validated whether 773 00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:54,480 they're anonymous or not. But it's easier when they're 774 00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:57,800 anonymous and it's bad for influencers because the 775 00:39:57,800 --> 00:40:00,920 expectation has changed and it shifted, like you said, 776 00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:04,480 basically overnight in this pressure cooker over year where 777 00:40:04,480 --> 00:40:07,600 they'd grown their accounts or their followings in a completely 778 00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:09,280 different social and political. Climate. 779 00:40:09,480 --> 00:40:13,640 So it's it's saying that they didn't sign up for this feels 780 00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:17,160 like a bit of a like Band-Aid statement, but I truly feel like 781 00:40:17,160 --> 00:40:21,280 so many influencers and creators didn't sign up for the way like 782 00:40:21,280 --> 00:40:25,000 how volatile the Internet is now and how enraged and exhausted 783 00:40:25,240 --> 00:40:27,040 everyone is. And I think the response to 784 00:40:27,040 --> 00:40:30,040 that, like we said, in most cases, is just for people to log 785 00:40:30,040 --> 00:40:33,640 the fuck off, to not be online for their own mental health, for 786 00:40:33,640 --> 00:40:36,600 the creators themselves, but also for us. 787 00:40:36,600 --> 00:40:39,920 It's like when you as a user, like when you're looking at, you 788 00:40:39,920 --> 00:40:44,080 know, say the Roe V Wade Twitter thread, like that is the most 789 00:40:44,080 --> 00:40:47,560 depressing place to be. But there's also something 790 00:40:47,560 --> 00:40:51,240 drawing you in that you cannot help but to continue to read and 791 00:40:51,240 --> 00:40:54,200 to spiral out of control. And so it's is it not a healthy 792 00:40:54,200 --> 00:40:55,880 option to like, not engage at all? 793 00:40:56,080 --> 00:40:59,600 I think the pendulum is going to have to swing back at some 794 00:40:59,600 --> 00:41:02,200 point. Like we really can't keep going 795 00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:04,960 on with like how angry and volatile things are online. 796 00:41:04,960 --> 00:41:06,840 Like it's always sounds like influencers are complaining 797 00:41:06,840 --> 00:41:07,960 about like cancel culture and stuff. 798 00:41:07,960 --> 00:41:11,400 But like, honestly, if you are online at all, which I'm 799 00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:14,000 assuming most of you guys that listen to this podcast are like, 800 00:41:14,320 --> 00:41:17,000 and if you are on like Twitter and Tiktok, like you know how 801 00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:20,760 bad it is like for people with any type of platform, let alone 802 00:41:20,760 --> 00:41:21,960 people without a platform, you know? 803 00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:24,440 So I don't know. I think things will have to 804 00:41:24,440 --> 00:41:27,400 swing back and they already are starting to like there's already 805 00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:29,840 people starting to have conversations around like you 806 00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:32,480 said, like logging off go touch grass. 807 00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:35,280 This is not like it's real life, but it's also not. 808 00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:39,760 But I think the last few years will have a like a lasting 809 00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:42,200 permanent change on the Internet 100%. 810 00:41:42,200 --> 00:41:44,560 Even though I do think that the pendulum will swing back and 811 00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:47,320 things hopefully will kind of equalize a bit at some point. 812 00:41:47,320 --> 00:41:52,760 Like I think we can't really erase how hyper aware we all are 813 00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:54,840 now. Like when I hear somebody say 814 00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:57,640 something in a conversation like one of my friends or something, 815 00:41:57,800 --> 00:42:01,360 I immediately think about like how Twitter would take that 816 00:42:01,360 --> 00:42:04,160 statement instead of like how I feel about it. 817 00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:05,840 You know, it's like that's not healthy. 818 00:42:05,880 --> 00:42:08,240 Like that's not good. And like a lot of people talk 819 00:42:08,240 --> 00:42:10,880 about how, like they're very online, they like self-centered 820 00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:15,160 or they like over contextualize things before they tweet or 821 00:42:15,160 --> 00:42:18,000 before they make a statement, 'cause they don't want anything 822 00:42:18,000 --> 00:42:19,960 to be taken the wrong way and things like that. 823 00:42:19,960 --> 00:42:22,720 It's like that's not how conversation used to be. 824 00:42:22,720 --> 00:42:25,000 And it it shouldn't. Be how it always is. 825 00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:29,640 Yeah, it's been taken completely out of proportion to what a 826 00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:32,880 normal it was used to be. A way to connect with people 827 00:42:33,000 --> 00:42:38,520 online and like find community. Not having the same conversation 828 00:42:38,520 --> 00:42:40,360 you would have with a friend, but instead you're having it 829 00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:43,320 with a million screaming people. Who are angry at each other? 830 00:42:44,440 --> 00:42:49,120 But no one knows why. And are often on the same side. 831 00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:50,720 Oh. My God, I completely agree. 832 00:42:50,720 --> 00:42:52,120 Do you have any concluding points? 833 00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:57,160 I do think future generations will, as a whole, choose to be 834 00:42:57,240 --> 00:42:59,680 more private for sure. For sure. 835 00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:02,160 I think they've seen the mistakes that millennials made 836 00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:06,640 and it's just not worth it. And that millennials that have 837 00:43:06,640 --> 00:43:09,640 been successful online are embarrassing and they don't want 838 00:43:10,120 --> 00:43:13,000 a bar of that. Also, like, impossible to do 839 00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:15,520 that anymore, You know? It's impossible to just become 840 00:43:15,520 --> 00:43:18,320 like an Instagram influencer. It's so hard to become a 841 00:43:18,320 --> 00:43:20,440 YouTube. Yeah, like the Charlies and 842 00:43:20,440 --> 00:43:24,120 Addison's, this tiny tier of people that did become popular 843 00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:26,800 because they got on Tiktok at the right time, right place, 844 00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:29,600 right time. That will not happen again until 845 00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:31,880 we have the next Tiktok come along. 846 00:43:31,920 --> 00:43:34,760 But even then, like, will it be received the same way? 847 00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:38,920 Because this shift will be five years down the track, and people 848 00:43:38,920 --> 00:43:41,560 might not be, like, ready to engage in the same way anyway. 849 00:43:41,560 --> 00:43:45,840 So maybe Charlie and Addison will be the last real influences 850 00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:49,840 that we've seen grow to this kind of level. 851 00:43:50,360 --> 00:43:53,040 The last real creators we will see grow to this level of 852 00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:55,400 influence like ever again, realistically. 853 00:43:55,760 --> 00:43:57,920 Huge call. That's a huge call. 854 00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:02,800 Infinite Scroll is a podcast written, produced, edited and 855 00:44:02,800 --> 00:44:05,720 presented by me, Lauren Meisner for Centennial World. 856 00:44:06,320 --> 00:44:08,560 Additional research and reporting this week was by 857 00:44:08,560 --> 00:44:11,720 Annabelle and David. Thank you so much for listening. 858 00:44:11,720 --> 00:44:14,400 I love you guys so much and I will talk to you next week. 859 00:44:14,560 --> 00:44:15,280 Bye.