1 00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:08,240 My colleague Blake was like, oh, my God, she's so fit. 2 00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:12,040 And I said, I heard myself say to him, yeah, And her perfume 3 00:00:12,040 --> 00:00:16,160 smells divine. And I remember thinking, it's 4 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:20,000 probably time to come out. If you think about something 5 00:00:20,000 --> 00:00:23,240 like stand up comedy, going out into a room full of like 200 6 00:00:24,040 --> 00:00:27,360 drunk, rowdy people on a Saturday night at the Comedy 7 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,800 Store and I'm there as like a little 23 year old going, you 8 00:00:30,800 --> 00:00:34,960 need to listen to my story. Oh, I've actually got a little 9 00:00:34,960 --> 00:00:36,720 bone to pick with Mark Bittlestone. 10 00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:40,560 Yes. And you, because I thought how 11 00:00:40,600 --> 00:00:43,080 lovely, how lovely that he's nominated me. 12 00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:47,640 I might go and have a watch of his episode, see what he says 13 00:00:47,640 --> 00:00:52,680 about me. Well, Oh my, I know you're going 14 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:54,480 to click that up. That's the cliffhanger at the 15 00:00:54,480 --> 00:00:56,520 end of the trailer. God's sake. 16 00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:02,560 Hello and welcome back to the Queerest podcast telling the 17 00:01:02,560 --> 00:01:05,400 fiercest stories. This is queer talker and I'm Ben 18 00:01:05,440 --> 00:01:07,400 Cechetti. Before we get to my conversation 19 00:01:07,400 --> 00:01:10,800 with the incredible and the hilarious leap hit, I've got a 20 00:01:10,800 --> 00:01:13,040 very quick favour to ask. Wherever you're watching or 21 00:01:13,040 --> 00:01:15,640 listening to this episode, hit that subscribe button. 22 00:01:15,720 --> 00:01:18,080 It's one click and it's going to make a massive difference. 23 00:01:18,080 --> 00:01:20,440 It's going to let me to grow this podcast and it's going to 24 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:23,600 bring you the best and the queerest episodes every single 25 00:01:23,600 --> 00:01:26,120 time. So in advance, thank you. 26 00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:31,360 Now to my conversation with Lee Lee, as always, we are starting 27 00:01:31,360 --> 00:01:33,840 with our queer panic rapid fire questions. 28 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:36,840 You just respond with the first thing that comes to mind 29 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:39,600 starting OK. What was the first album you 30 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:43,160 ever owned? You're not going to believe me, 31 00:01:43,160 --> 00:01:46,120 but I'm pretty sure it was The Offspring. 32 00:01:47,960 --> 00:01:50,520 I was, yeah, I was going through some hours. 33 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:53,600 I'm going to be like an e-mail. I'm going to be like. 34 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:55,920 And so it was. It's not my brand at all, but 35 00:01:55,920 --> 00:01:59,000 I'm pretty sure I bought that album from HMV. 36 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:01,520 Nice the pretty fly for a white guy era. 37 00:02:01,760 --> 00:02:06,320 Yeah, original prankster. What's the other one? 38 00:02:06,520 --> 00:02:08,960 There's one that I really like. I might go listen to it after 39 00:02:08,960 --> 00:02:11,240 this actually. There we go, reignite. 40 00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:14,080 That yeah, you would never have guessed the offspring, but that 41 00:02:14,080 --> 00:02:16,240 was that was it. It's the first thing they've the 42 00:02:16,280 --> 00:02:17,160 first time they've come up on this. 43 00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:19,080 It's normally like Spice Girls or something like that. 44 00:02:19,080 --> 00:02:20,680 The offspring. Is well, what can I say, I'm 45 00:02:20,680 --> 00:02:25,680 mad. If you had to lip sync for your 46 00:02:25,680 --> 00:02:27,520 life, what song would you choose? 47 00:02:28,280 --> 00:02:33,720 I will say this, I, I, my friends think I'm very odd 48 00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:37,880 because I have this weird thing where I can remember lyrics like 49 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:41,760 it's, yeah, it's probably a form of something. 50 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:46,120 But I, I, so I can lip sync to a lot of things. 51 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:50,600 But if I had to choose, I'd probably, I would be definitely, 52 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:53,240 probably an Adele song. It would probably be like 53 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:59,280 rolling in the D or Someone Like You or Skyfall or melt my heart 54 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:04,520 to stone or when we were young or take it all or Easy on me, 55 00:03:04,520 --> 00:03:07,760 you know, the list goes on. It would be epic. 56 00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:11,400 It would be epic, yeah. Or I would, yeah. 57 00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:14,760 Maybe something like if it was a bit more musical theatre, maybe 58 00:03:14,760 --> 00:03:17,600 something like She Used to Be Mine from Waitress. 59 00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:20,120 Love that song. Great choice, great choice. 60 00:03:20,120 --> 00:03:23,240 OK well I have a playlist on Spotify so I get to add those. 61 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:25,440 I'm going to pick my favourite of your Adele choices and then 62 00:03:25,520 --> 00:03:29,520 I'll waitress them as well. What is your favourite queer 63 00:03:29,520 --> 00:03:33,880 movie or TV show? Well, I was thinking about this 64 00:03:33,880 --> 00:03:40,720 and I, I don't know if it's kind of classed as a queer show, 65 00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:44,040 although I personally think it is now because it was embraced 66 00:03:44,040 --> 00:03:47,200 by a lot of the gays. I'm going to say the comeback 67 00:03:47,680 --> 00:03:51,800 with Lisa Kudrow and it's become a kind of cult classic. 68 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:55,720 And I actually feel like I because I watched the comeback 69 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:59,200 when it first came out, which I think was in like 2005. 70 00:03:59,400 --> 00:04:01,800 I want to say it's just after friends had finished. 71 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:05,640 And I remember being like 15 at the time, absolutely loving the 72 00:04:05,640 --> 00:04:06,920 show. I thought it was the funniest 73 00:04:06,920 --> 00:04:09,240 thing I'd ever seen. And no one really understood it 74 00:04:09,240 --> 00:04:12,360 and got it at the time. And then years later, it became 75 00:04:12,360 --> 00:04:16,120 a bit of a cult. And I remember being like, I was 76 00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:20,440 there from the start. So the comeback, I think that 77 00:04:20,440 --> 00:04:24,480 also would be my mastermind question if I was ever going to 78 00:04:24,480 --> 00:04:27,320 go on Mastermind, Yeah. I wish I had known that because 79 00:04:27,320 --> 00:04:29,720 I would like throw out a bunch of questions on it. 80 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:32,040 Oh gosh, I'm glad that you didn't. 81 00:04:33,720 --> 00:04:40,800 Who is your ultimate queer icon? Probably Icon's a bit of a weird 82 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:44,440 word for him, but probably someone like Matthew Shepard. 83 00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:49,400 And you know, the play like the Laramie Project was all inspired 84 00:04:49,400 --> 00:04:54,440 and he would tragically murdered years ago. 85 00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:57,560 And he was the guy for people who don't know, they tied him to 86 00:04:57,560 --> 00:05:04,120 a fence in Wyoming and he's kind of his, his, his murder 87 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:10,400 basically sparked a, a kind of ripple effect across the world 88 00:05:10,400 --> 00:05:13,800 and people started to and it, you know, it really helped push 89 00:05:13,800 --> 00:05:17,880 I think gay rights and the way people just treat and see gay 90 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:21,560 people. So Matthew Shepard or even his 91 00:05:21,680 --> 00:05:26,240 mum who's got odd name, name escapes me now, but Judy, I 92 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:29,160 think Judy Shepard and he, she set up the Matthew Shepard 93 00:05:29,160 --> 00:05:31,880 Foundation. So someone like him, I would 94 00:05:31,880 --> 00:05:33,480 say. I love that. 95 00:05:33,480 --> 00:05:36,200 That's a great choice. You are obviously also a 96 00:05:36,200 --> 00:05:38,640 podcaster. You host a podcast to demystify 97 00:05:38,840 --> 00:05:41,320 wine slash give us all an excuse to drink more wine. 98 00:05:41,560 --> 00:05:43,880 So what is your go to? White, red or rose? 99 00:05:45,320 --> 00:05:49,440 I just think that's such an impossible question because I 100 00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:53,800 need to know where I am, the setting, the scenario. 101 00:05:54,200 --> 00:05:57,760 You know, if it's a scorching hot day, I'm probably not going 102 00:05:57,760 --> 00:05:59,680 to have a like a glass of Malbec. 103 00:06:00,880 --> 00:06:04,040 So but I will try and answer it. And if I have to whittle one 104 00:06:04,040 --> 00:06:08,840 down, I I've at the minute I'm feeling a red. 105 00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:13,640 I'm really feeling a red. So I'd probably go for yeah, a 106 00:06:13,640 --> 00:06:16,680 Malbec or a Pinot noir. But like, again, if it's nice 107 00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:18,800 and sunny, we're talking a nice pale rose. 108 00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:23,640 If I'm out with friends having dinner, probably a white. 109 00:06:23,760 --> 00:06:27,600 But yeah, at the minute I think if I really had to choose, I'd 110 00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:30,480 have red. Yeah, there's something about 111 00:06:30,480 --> 00:06:32,280 like the winter months is when I tend to drink red. 112 00:06:32,280 --> 00:06:35,200 Like it just comes and suddenly I just switch so. 113 00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:38,360 Yeah, but I have. And one thing that the podcast 114 00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:41,000 has taught me is that I have got, you know, Pinot noir I 115 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:45,000 never really used to have, but because it's so much lighter, I 116 00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:47,360 actually have now been having that more in light. 117 00:06:47,360 --> 00:06:52,160 If it's in the daytime, gosh, I have that in the day. 118 00:06:52,160 --> 00:06:53,560 It's fine. Yeah. 119 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:55,520 Yeah. It's a nice morning beverage 120 00:06:56,880 --> 00:06:59,440 because, you know, I used to be like, oh, red puts me to sleep, 121 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:01,880 but actually it was because I was drinking heavy Reds. 122 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:05,280 So yeah. And that's what the, that's what 123 00:07:05,280 --> 00:07:08,920 the podcast has taught me. I can drink whenever I like. 124 00:07:10,360 --> 00:07:14,880 Please drink responsibly. This is coffee. 125 00:07:14,880 --> 00:07:17,800 This is coffee from the mug. Imagine if you could just see 126 00:07:17,800 --> 00:07:23,200 red wine in this mug. Shout out to Mark Bittlestone 127 00:07:23,200 --> 00:07:25,400 who nominated you to be on this podcast. 128 00:07:25,760 --> 00:07:27,520 So now it's your turn who has won. 129 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:29,920 Well, I've actually got a little bone to pick with Mark 130 00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:34,200 Bittlestone. Yes, and you, because I thought 131 00:07:34,400 --> 00:07:37,120 how lovely, how lovely that he's nominated me. 132 00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:41,680 I might go and have a watch of his episode, see what he says 133 00:07:41,680 --> 00:07:45,280 about me. Well, now I realise it's all a 134 00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:48,600 ruse to get Alan Carr on the podcast. 135 00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:51,960 I'm basically Sunita at this point, aren't I? 136 00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:55,960 Shocking, shocking. I text Mark, I said well thanks 137 00:07:55,960 --> 00:08:00,840 for the nomination, Mark. I said he might get Alan, so I'm 138 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:03,280 not going to nominate Alan out of spite that. 139 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:05,120 Is totally fair. That is totally. 140 00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:10,720 Fair. So I have to nominate a gay 141 00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:14,240 comedian, a queer comedian, queer anything. 142 00:08:16,720 --> 00:08:22,560 I'm queer. Anything I'm going to nominate, 143 00:08:22,560 --> 00:08:23,840 I'm going to know. I'm going to stick to the 144 00:08:23,840 --> 00:08:25,960 comedians. I'm going to nominate Morgan 145 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:27,720 Reese. Have you had him? 146 00:08:27,880 --> 00:08:31,880 On I haven't, no. Really nice guy, very good 147 00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:33,640 comic. Yeah. 148 00:08:33,840 --> 00:08:36,919 Nominate Morgan Reese because he might be able to get you Jade 149 00:08:36,919 --> 00:08:43,960 Adams. This is what This is what I was 150 00:08:43,960 --> 00:08:45,880 like as I was watching it. I was like smiling. 151 00:08:45,880 --> 00:08:50,360 I was like. And then I was like, okay, okay, 152 00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:55,960 I'm getting so many, honestly. Like I get so many like hi Lee, 153 00:08:56,400 --> 00:08:58,920 could you ask Alan if he fancies in this? 154 00:08:58,960 --> 00:09:02,960 I'm like, he does have an agent and it is not me. 155 00:09:04,080 --> 00:09:06,240 I'm like, please just be aware of this. 156 00:09:07,280 --> 00:09:10,200 But yes, no, I'll, I'll nominate and I love Mark Bittlestone. 157 00:09:10,200 --> 00:09:11,400 I'll, I'll nominate Morgan Reese. 158 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:15,920 Great comedian, great guy. OK, and then finally, what is 159 00:09:15,920 --> 00:09:18,800 one word you would use to describe your childhood? 160 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:26,800 Playful. OK, I like playful. 161 00:09:26,800 --> 00:09:28,080 I like that. And we can die. 162 00:09:28,160 --> 00:09:31,400 Vivid imagination. OK, OK. 163 00:09:31,400 --> 00:09:34,400 Because you know, long term listeners know that I have this 164 00:09:34,400 --> 00:09:37,360 theory that to understand an LGBTQ plus person as an adult, 165 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:39,720 you do have to understand them as a young person 1st. 166 00:09:39,720 --> 00:09:42,360 And because you say playful, you say imagination. 167 00:09:42,600 --> 00:09:46,040 What should I know about you as a child or a teenager to 168 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:48,120 understand the lead that sits in front of me today? 169 00:09:48,960 --> 00:09:53,120 Well, I was always obsessed with magic, so I loved anything 170 00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:55,800 magical. I was obsessed with Mary 171 00:09:55,800 --> 00:09:58,920 Poppins. So like people in primary 172 00:09:58,920 --> 00:10:01,800 school, people would be like Lee and I'd be like, please call me 173 00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:05,240 Mary like I would I was obsessed with. 174 00:10:05,560 --> 00:10:09,720 But the reason is I wanted, I think I wanted to fly. 175 00:10:09,720 --> 00:10:13,400 So I always remember like I used to my mum and dad had this like 176 00:10:13,400 --> 00:10:15,800 built in barbecue in the back garden. 177 00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:19,600 I used to jump off that thinking I was like Peter Pan or, or I 178 00:10:19,800 --> 00:10:22,480 like broomsticks. And then I think I just felt 179 00:10:22,480 --> 00:10:27,000 like Mary Poppins was as close to being able to and the 180 00:10:27,240 --> 00:10:28,600 umbrella. So I was obsessed with like 181 00:10:28,600 --> 00:10:32,320 umbrellas. My mum apparently once didn't 182 00:10:32,320 --> 00:10:34,600 let me buy this umbrella at a car boot sale that looked 183 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:36,680 exactly like the Mary Poppins one. 184 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:40,240 And apparently I bawled my eyes out that the woman and the car 185 00:10:40,240 --> 00:10:42,440 boot sale was like, he can have it for free. 186 00:10:43,400 --> 00:10:47,320 She's causing a scene. Really good tip if you're ever 187 00:10:47,320 --> 00:10:49,680 at a car boot sale and you want something for free if you don't 188 00:10:49,680 --> 00:10:55,280 want to spend that 50P. And so, yeah, I was always kind 189 00:10:55,280 --> 00:10:58,800 of into magic. I think I remember my teacher in 190 00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:01,000 primary school making me a magic wand. 191 00:11:01,040 --> 00:11:05,960 I was like, anything magical. Disney loved all that. 192 00:11:07,960 --> 00:11:11,520 Like, you know, Sleeping Beauty, loved the three good fairies, 193 00:11:11,520 --> 00:11:14,520 was obsessed with them. I was just obsessed with magic, 194 00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:19,840 like, and then like as a teenager, I loved Charmed Again 195 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:22,320 magic. I love Sabrina the Teenage Witch 196 00:11:23,560 --> 00:11:26,160 the worst way. Anything to do with magic. 197 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:30,240 I was in, I was totally in. And then as a teenager, I kind 198 00:11:30,240 --> 00:11:35,160 of, you know, I started to get into drama and stuff and then I 199 00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:40,680 started to kind of make people laugh and remember like doing 200 00:11:40,680 --> 00:11:46,560 acting little skits and drama club and and, you know, people 201 00:11:46,560 --> 00:11:48,000 laughing at it at the school thing. 202 00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:50,200 And I started to kind of get get confidence with that. 203 00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:52,120 So that, yeah, that that as a teenager. 204 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:54,080 But I was also head boy at school. 205 00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:56,920 So I had I had different personas. 206 00:11:56,920 --> 00:12:01,880 I used to kind of like probably switch between personas. 207 00:12:01,880 --> 00:12:05,320 So sometimes it will be like the kind of silly class clown and 208 00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:08,240 then other times it will be like, how dare you speak to me 209 00:12:08,240 --> 00:12:12,160 mere mortals like, And I remember as like I was, I've 210 00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:15,080 said this story before, but as head boy, I was, I was corrupt. 211 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:18,320 I was like, I was a totally mad, mad on power. 212 00:12:18,400 --> 00:12:21,440 It's probably the power thing. I couldn't have it with magic. 213 00:12:21,440 --> 00:12:25,160 So I want, it's like power in a different kind of sense. 214 00:12:25,520 --> 00:12:29,080 So, you know, I was, I was like, I used to start calling the 215 00:12:29,080 --> 00:12:32,800 teachers by the first names. You know, I was 15 years old and 216 00:12:32,800 --> 00:12:34,000 I loved you. I know. 217 00:12:34,280 --> 00:12:37,160 Well, do you know what, though, And this isn't delusional. 218 00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:39,760 They kind of did. But it was kind of that like 219 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:44,360 they kind of like did enjoy me because I think I was always in 220 00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:48,480 kind of a character. But then at times were like, 221 00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:50,880 what is going on? Because I just used to saunter 222 00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:53,280 around. I used to like, walk around in 223 00:12:53,280 --> 00:12:57,760 break around the corridors with a mug of hot chocolate and I'd 224 00:12:57,760 --> 00:13:02,280 be like morning Joan and people will be like what it was. 225 00:13:02,960 --> 00:13:05,680 It was weird. I mean, it was weird, but it was 226 00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:10,960 I was kind of liked. I was never really disliked at 227 00:13:10,960 --> 00:13:13,200 school. I was never like massively 228 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:17,480 popular, but I wasn't all I was. You said at the time I wasn't 229 00:13:17,480 --> 00:13:21,880 one of the geeks and so I was kind of in between and then like 230 00:13:21,880 --> 00:13:23,800 the popular kids kind of liked me. 231 00:13:23,800 --> 00:13:26,880 So sometimes I hang out with them if fancied it or the times 232 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:28,680 not. So I was yeah, I was always. 233 00:13:28,880 --> 00:13:31,400 I just I do remember being liked. 234 00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:32,880 I don't like not everyone liked me. 235 00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:34,880 I'm not like delusional. I was like I was the most 236 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:38,240 popular kid in school. But I remember like it not 237 00:13:38,240 --> 00:13:41,400 massively being a hard time really. 238 00:13:42,680 --> 00:13:45,640 And you mentioned kind of switching, almost switching 239 00:13:45,640 --> 00:13:48,240 personas and switching kind of the the character quote unquote 240 00:13:48,240 --> 00:13:51,440 that you were playing. Do you think that was from an 241 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:53,720 entertainment perspective and that was kind of the entertainer 242 00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:55,880 and you or do you think that was a protectiveness and you were 243 00:13:55,880 --> 00:13:58,440 hiding the real lead behind kind of those those? 244 00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:01,440 Personas I think it's probably more the laughter, but yeah, I 245 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:05,560 think it was a bit of both. But yeah, there was definitely 246 00:14:05,560 --> 00:14:07,840 weird person like there was yeah. 247 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:11,640 I, I, it took me a while to realise like which kind of 248 00:14:11,640 --> 00:14:15,920 persona I was and it would change depending on the 249 00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:18,920 environment. But I still think I do that to a 250 00:14:18,920 --> 00:14:23,160 weird way, like not change who I am, but you adapt. 251 00:14:23,520 --> 00:14:27,160 I always remember from an early age I used to be able to tell 252 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:31,440 very quickly what made different people laugh. 253 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:37,840 So like, you know, for example, Annabelle might like silly 254 00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:43,360 humour, but Holly might like dry humour or like, and I, I still 255 00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:46,480 think I do that with new people where I'm like, the minute I 256 00:14:46,480 --> 00:14:49,560 kind of know what makes them laugh or what kind of style of 257 00:14:49,560 --> 00:14:51,720 comedy they have, I'll, I'll adapt it to them. 258 00:14:51,720 --> 00:14:56,480 So maybe it was just that form of where it was like, you know, 259 00:14:56,480 --> 00:14:58,920 who, who am I talking to in this situation? 260 00:14:59,240 --> 00:15:04,520 And yeah, a bit of a bit of like a bit like a chameleon type 261 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:06,960 thing, I guess. Yeah. 262 00:15:07,000 --> 00:15:10,400 But yeah, it was definitely some sort of like I was at one point 263 00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:12,760 as a head boy, I felt like a dictator. 264 00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:17,200 And I've always said, you know, for dictators, it's probably 265 00:15:17,200 --> 00:15:20,560 quite fun for them. You know, it's the people around 266 00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:22,960 them that suffer. But I was having a great time. 267 00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:27,120 I look at these. I know. 268 00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:28,800 Well, I know. No, this is the thing. 269 00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:33,680 I now don't volunteer for power because it can very quickly 270 00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:35,840 consume me. I'm quite, I'm quite aware of 271 00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:37,360 it. I think it's a healthy thing to 272 00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:40,480 be like, you know, but I sometimes look at these 273 00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:43,000 dictators and I think I get it. I get it. 274 00:15:46,680 --> 00:15:48,400 Oh my, I know you're going to click that up. 275 00:15:49,200 --> 00:15:54,320 I look at these dictators and I just think, yes, I I understand. 276 00:15:54,520 --> 00:15:56,080 That's the class that's got the trailer. 277 00:15:56,680 --> 00:16:02,000 God's sake. But I mean, if you take yourself 278 00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:06,960 back to that time, do you remember the first like, LGBTQ 279 00:16:06,960 --> 00:16:10,520 plus person you became aware of either in real life or through 280 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:13,560 media and how that kind of made you feel in yourself? 281 00:16:16,080 --> 00:16:19,840 I remember he there weren't an LGBTQ plus person, but I 282 00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:23,280 remember a bit of a gay awakening I think was Seth Cohen 283 00:16:23,280 --> 00:16:26,120 from the OC played by Adam Brody. 284 00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:28,800 I remember like really fancying him and really loving his 285 00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:32,000 clothes. I think probably the main one I 286 00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:37,280 remember distinctly like late as a teenager, staying up late 287 00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:40,680 watching Graham Norton, like so Graham Norton. 288 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:44,560 When do you remember when Graham Norton was the most audacious, 289 00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:48,840 filthy, like, gay man? And now he's, like, quite 290 00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:49,760 mainstream. And. 291 00:16:50,160 --> 00:16:52,200 But I remember seeing an interview with him recently 292 00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:54,960 where he was like, I have to stop being that because when you 293 00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:59,320 are in your 50s, you know, bringing out dildos and stuff, 294 00:16:59,320 --> 00:17:01,200 it is a bit like. And I thought, oh, yeah, that's 295 00:17:01,200 --> 00:17:03,840 actually a really good point. But I remember back in the day 296 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:07,960 when, you know, Graham must have been my age and, you know, he 297 00:17:07,960 --> 00:17:13,200 had that audacious, like, filthy but brilliant chat show on 298 00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:15,599 Channel 4. I think that was probably the 299 00:17:15,599 --> 00:17:18,560 first time where I was like, oh, OK, interesting. 300 00:17:19,400 --> 00:17:21,079 Yeah, it will. I think it would be Graham 301 00:17:21,079 --> 00:17:23,160 Norton. And then, like, Will and Grace 302 00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:26,800 was a massive, massive thing. Like, I absolutely adore Will 303 00:17:26,800 --> 00:17:29,280 and Grace. And I think that was a huge 304 00:17:29,280 --> 00:17:31,320 thing. I remember actually, like, my 305 00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:34,640 mum laughing a lot at Jack from Will and Grace. 306 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:38,240 And I was thinking, oh, maybe it's not so bad. 307 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:40,040 Do you know what I mean? Like maybe it's OK. 308 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:42,280 That is important. Those sorts of shows that kind 309 00:17:42,280 --> 00:17:45,240 of give people that Ave to have people around you. 310 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:46,440 I think they talk about that a lot, right? 311 00:17:46,440 --> 00:17:48,040 I remember when Heartstopper came out, there was a lot of 312 00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:50,240 people who watched it with their parents to see how their parents 313 00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:52,400 might react to certain components of it. 314 00:17:52,400 --> 00:17:56,320 So I do get that totally. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 315 00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:59,240 I remember I didn't see the really other series of heart 316 00:17:59,240 --> 00:18:01,440 stoppers because there's been like four or five now, hasn't 317 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:03,600 there? But yeah, I remember the first 318 00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:06,720 one, but I kind of watched it as a bit of a bitter man where I 319 00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:10,920 was like, of course they're having a lovely time, of course 320 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:14,720 they're not getting beaten up. It was a thing. 321 00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:18,160 There was a lot of people like I'm approaching 40 this year. 322 00:18:18,600 --> 00:18:20,440 A lot of people like my generation where it was like 323 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:22,440 there was that slight bitterness to it. 324 00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:25,360 There was that feeling of loss of like, oh, we didn't get to 325 00:18:25,360 --> 00:18:26,720 experience that. Like we. 326 00:18:26,760 --> 00:18:28,120 Yeah, like jealousy. Get that? 327 00:18:28,120 --> 00:18:31,200 Teenage love. Well, I couldn't. 328 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:36,880 I was too busy being a dictator. I was two people making busy, 329 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:40,480 making the lives of the Humberston School students 330 00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:43,400 miserable. I mean, one of my decrees, and I 331 00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:47,040 called them decrees, was that prefects didn't have to queue 332 00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:50,200 for lunch. That was one of my first thing. 333 00:18:50,200 --> 00:18:53,840 It's so elitist. I was like, we we shouldn't have 334 00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:56,480 to queue. We're so busy we skip the queue. 335 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:00,960 No wonder I wasn't having a love story. 336 00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:04,160 I was too busy, like ruining people's lives. 337 00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:06,480 Another clip. There we go. 338 00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:12,360 Oh God, yeah, great. I guess taking yourself back to 339 00:19:12,360 --> 00:19:15,240 that time, do you remember when you then first felt that first 340 00:19:15,240 --> 00:19:18,880 spark inside yourself and for you know that first mean feeling 341 00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:22,720 of kind of your inner queerness and then how that felt within 342 00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:28,840 yourself? I don't really remember a 343 00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:33,560 specific time. I kind of, I came out late, I 344 00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:36,520 tell this story on stage, but I I remember and this isn't like a 345 00:19:36,520 --> 00:19:37,840 joke or anything. It is true. 346 00:19:37,840 --> 00:19:43,760 I remember being I used to work at Tesco and again, the power 347 00:19:43,760 --> 00:19:46,920 into my head there I became customer service and I had like 348 00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:50,120 supervisor rights and I just was a nightmare. 349 00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:53,560 I would go like down the tills and be like be careful of your 350 00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:56,800 double scanning Jane. And it'd be like Jane would be 351 00:19:56,800 --> 00:19:59,560 like this 6 year old woman who's worked there for years and she's 352 00:19:59,560 --> 00:20:02,960 got this 18 year old boy in a blazer who thinks he's it. 353 00:20:03,360 --> 00:20:09,120 But I, I remember then it was in Manchester and I saw this woman 354 00:20:09,120 --> 00:20:13,640 come into Tesco and she like objectively was gorgeous. 355 00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:16,280 She had like big boobs. She's like smelt amazing. 356 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:19,200 She her hair was like, she just was stunning. 357 00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:24,800 And the only thing I thought was no, my, my colleague Blake was 358 00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:28,720 like, oh, my God, she's so fit. And I said, I heard myself say 359 00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:31,440 to him, yeah, And her perfume smells divine. 360 00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:36,640 And I remember thinking, it's probably time to come out, you 361 00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:38,640 know, if that's the only thing you pick up on. 362 00:20:39,320 --> 00:20:42,960 So that was like the main one. And then the next day, I came 363 00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:48,000 out to my parents. But but yeah, I don't remember. 364 00:20:48,040 --> 00:20:50,960 It was kind of a gradual process because I sometimes think when 365 00:20:50,960 --> 00:20:55,080 you repress it, which I think I did for, I mean, I used to say I 366 00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:58,920 was asexual, but I was like, I'm asexual. 367 00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:01,360 But then I just realised like no one wanted to fuck me. 368 00:21:01,920 --> 00:21:05,160 So it's just like, I just wasn't having sex. 369 00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:09,000 It's like you're not asexual. Like asexual is not wanting it. 370 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:10,760 And I was like, oh, I was just not getting it. 371 00:21:10,760 --> 00:21:16,920 It's different. So yeah, I, yeah, I think it 372 00:21:16,920 --> 00:21:20,760 was, I think it was like a gradual process. 373 00:21:20,760 --> 00:21:22,520 It was. But that was the light bulb 374 00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:24,800 moment where it's like, oh, that's time to come out. 375 00:21:25,440 --> 00:21:28,360 I'd already come out to a few people, but like to my parents 376 00:21:28,360 --> 00:21:30,360 properly. And I also remember thinking 377 00:21:30,360 --> 00:21:33,280 when when I did comedy, I remember thinking, I need to 378 00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:35,560 come out because I'm going to start talking about this on 379 00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:39,200 stage and I can't not be like, I can't go. 380 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:43,640 I'm a character act and play in a gay man like I had to because 381 00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:45,400 people used to. People still do come up to me 382 00:21:45,400 --> 00:21:48,440 and go, so are you really gay? Are you really gay? 383 00:21:48,600 --> 00:21:53,560 And I'm like, do you think I just weird? 384 00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:57,360 So when you obviously mentioned and we kind of touched on it a 385 00:21:57,360 --> 00:21:59,920 few times, kind of humour has clearly been such a huge part of 386 00:21:59,920 --> 00:22:03,440 your experience. Meaning it feels like you found 387 00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:05,960 comedy at school and you used comedy. 388 00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:09,440 When did it first feel like it was going to be such a big part 389 00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:12,640 of kind of who you are in your what you do in your identity? 390 00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:16,200 And was it something you kind of tapped into as you kind of 391 00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:19,600 navigated the world as, you know, a young gay man? 392 00:22:21,520 --> 00:22:23,800 Yeah, I think comedy, definitely. 393 00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:27,280 And I, I went through a bit of AI used to dress in like shirts 394 00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:30,720 and cravats and that, but I was like 2324. 395 00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:33,880 So I used to really dress up on stage. 396 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:36,160 And I think that was part of the kind of armour. 397 00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:42,640 And it was part of like exploring the guys to put my 20s 398 00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:49,840 was definitely like when I was, you know, exploring what it 399 00:22:49,840 --> 00:22:52,440 meant to be gay. And, you know, I, I was living 400 00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:55,400 in Manchester. So like there was no better city 401 00:22:55,880 --> 00:23:00,200 than or no better place than Canal Street on Manchester where 402 00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:03,920 I just just had the wildest of times. 403 00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:06,800 But like, yeah, started to. And comedy definitely shaped 404 00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:08,680 stand up. Comedy definitely shaped the 405 00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:12,800 identity as a gay man. But it probably wasn't until 406 00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:16,320 maybe like 2526 when I started to go, oh, this is who I am. 407 00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:19,680 You can start to settle into. And you know, it sounds stupid, 408 00:23:19,680 --> 00:23:26,120 but I always remember back in the day, I used to get furious, 409 00:23:26,120 --> 00:23:31,320 like seething with rage if like a strand of hair happened to not 410 00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:35,120 be in place. And I used to go out craft 411 00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:39,360 crafford like completely pristine. 412 00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:43,640 And if anything went wrong, like if someone went to me like oh I 413 00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:45,880 mean I still don't like it when someone like messes my hair up 414 00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:49,640 now, but I would easily just run my fingers through my hair now 415 00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:51,760 and be like whatever and just move it back. 416 00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:56,520 But if someone did that to me back in the day, I honestly it 417 00:23:56,520 --> 00:24:00,000 would like ruin my night. And I, I always think that that 418 00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:03,840 probably was because I still wasn't 100% comfortable in 419 00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:06,840 myself. Whereas now, like the other day, 420 00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:10,280 I turned up to a bloody press night and I was, I was, I 421 00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:13,920 decided to cycle there and I got lined by it was pissing it down 422 00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:15,360 with rain. And halfway through I was just 423 00:24:15,360 --> 00:24:19,360 like, oh, fuck it, I'm going to carry on sod and wet turn up at 424 00:24:19,360 --> 00:24:23,160 this press night soaking. They're like, could we, could we 425 00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:25,320 do a quick interview with you? Because sometimes you get 426 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:27,800 invited and then you have to like, you know, you have to say, 427 00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:31,080 I'm so excited to show what? And I was like, oh, I'm dripping 428 00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:33,280 wet, but yeah, whatever. So and I look back at the 429 00:24:33,640 --> 00:24:37,280 footage and I'm like, well, that would never have happened. 430 00:24:37,360 --> 00:24:39,160 That would never have happened back in the day. 431 00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:41,760 Whereas now I'm like, yeah, I'm dripping wet, but yeah, 432 00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:43,840 whatever. And I think that's just 433 00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:46,440 basically being more secure in yourself. 434 00:24:47,080 --> 00:24:48,480 Yeah. When did that happen do you 435 00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:50,240 think? When did you did, did you think 436 00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:53,280 you felt that kind of a, you know, that kind of, oh, this is 437 00:24:53,280 --> 00:24:55,280 authentically me now. I'm not putting any kind of 438 00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:58,720 persona on and then confident enough to just bring it and just 439 00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:04,840 be it every single day. I don't know. 440 00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:10,360 I don't know. I it was, it must be late 20s. 441 00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:13,840 It was definitely before like my 30s and stuff. 442 00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:19,080 I remember as well, I used to walk down the street and like 443 00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:21,160 people would kind of shout things at me. 444 00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:23,360 And they don't really do that anymore. 445 00:25:23,360 --> 00:25:28,480 And if they do, it's quite rare. And I think for two reasons. 446 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:31,920 One, because I do still think we have advanced. 447 00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:34,320 I sometimes I do think, oh God, it's getting worse. 448 00:25:34,360 --> 00:25:40,840 But I also think that I just probably exude this I am who I 449 00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:43,800 am type vibe, whereas before I was probably a little bit 450 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:48,480 skinnier, I was a little bit kind of meek and mild. 451 00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:52,960 So I think the stand up, I mean, you know, if you think about 452 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:55,320 something like stand up comedy, going out into a room full of 453 00:25:55,320 --> 00:26:00,560 like 200 drunk, rowdy people on a Saturday night at the Comedy 454 00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:04,000 Store and I'm there as like a little 23 year old going, you 455 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:08,080 need to listen to my story. You know, that really does kind 456 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:13,840 of set you up for, you know, you build your armour in that. 457 00:26:13,840 --> 00:26:18,280 But so I I yeah, I think I probably exude it more like I do 458 00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:21,760 people say I give off this kind of like don't fuck with me 459 00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:25,400 energy. Not in like a bad way, not in 460 00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:32,760 like a dictator prefect way, but, and I think it's because 461 00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:36,200 I'm just like so comfortable. And I mean, when you meet 462 00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:40,360 someone who's so comfortable in themselves, it can if you're not 463 00:26:40,360 --> 00:26:42,160 be quite intimidating, I imagine. 464 00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:47,320 But I just think stand up comedy is maybe do that because you are 465 00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:49,720 just yourself on stage. Again, unless you're playing a 466 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:52,280 character, you're you're actually a heightened version of 467 00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:53,760 yourself. Yeah. 468 00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:55,960 How did you get started in comedy then? 469 00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:58,400 I'm so curious as to like, how do you know? 470 00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:00,920 Because it's such a, you know, I talked to Mark a little bit 471 00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:03,200 about this, like, how did you kind of get started and how did 472 00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:05,640 you find that kind of confidence to to your point, you're 473 00:27:05,640 --> 00:27:08,480 standing up on stage and you don't know how people are going 474 00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:09,960 to react. Like, I can't imagine just 475 00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:11,800 standing up on stage and not knowing people may just not 476 00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:14,200 laugh at all. Like how did you get started and 477 00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:16,320 navigate that world to where you are today? 478 00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:20,440 Well, I joined, I was at the University of Salford and I 479 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:25,040 joined A, I went to like freshers fair. 480 00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:29,680 So the society and I joined a stand up society. 481 00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:31,880 But that, that never ended up happening. 482 00:27:31,880 --> 00:27:38,200 But I'd written like 5 minutes of material and the first time I 483 00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:42,520 ever did a gig, it went well. And I always say if it like if 484 00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:45,920 it didn't go well, I would have probably quit. 485 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:49,880 I'm such a quitter. Like I am like if something is 486 00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:53,800 mildly discomforting or, you know, discomforting, 487 00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:58,160 uncomfortable, if it's a little bit, oh, no, not for me. 488 00:27:58,160 --> 00:28:05,080 Like I am done with it. And so the first few went well, 489 00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:09,160 which meant that when it didn't go well, I had the evidence to 490 00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:12,360 go, I'm not terrible. Do you know what I mean? 491 00:28:12,360 --> 00:28:16,480 Like my biggest fear was thinking, you know, I imagine if 492 00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:20,400 I'd found out everyone's like, when is he going to quit? 493 00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:25,200 Like I just, I would be horrified because I'm quite, I'm 494 00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:27,800 quite aware, I'm quite self aware of things. 495 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:30,960 Like I know when things go bad and when things go good. 496 00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:35,160 So I kind of fell into it that way. 497 00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:38,800 And then I just like the stand up circuit in Manchester was 498 00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:42,160 just brilliant. Northwest stand up circuit. 499 00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:46,960 So you know, started with a load of and when you start out, 500 00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:49,200 you're like you have all the comic friends who has started 501 00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:52,200 out, which you all do open spot gigs together. 502 00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:55,960 I remember doing AI remember doing a gig for a guy called 503 00:28:55,960 --> 00:29:00,080 Brian Malcolm and it was like in somewhere in Bursco in the 504 00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:03,160 North. And it was like everyone was 505 00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:06,360 doing 5 minutes. We were all new and then someone 506 00:29:06,360 --> 00:29:08,400 at the end was still new, but he did 10. 507 00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:11,120 It was oh God, could have did 10 minutes. 508 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:15,480 Wow. And I remember mine going well. 509 00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:19,560 And I saw a post on Facebook like a few days later and 510 00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:23,000 someone had like said how like kind of done a review and 511 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:25,160 pointed me out. And I remember being like, this 512 00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:31,200 is it stardom awaits. And so those kind of things 513 00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:35,000 allowed me to kind of keep going with it. 514 00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:36,920 And then like, you just start getting paid. 515 00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:39,120 And it was just such a simple thing where it was like, I'm not 516 00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:41,840 getting acting work, I'm getting comedy work. 517 00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:46,400 So I was alongside working at Tesco, I was, I was, you know, 518 00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:49,400 going and doing gigs and, and that's where people go. 519 00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:54,640 Like I was chatting to Tom Allen actually the other day and we 520 00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:56,480 were talking about like work ethic and stuff. 521 00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:58,120 And we were like, we've put the work in. 522 00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:02,800 Like I've sat at Burnley train station at 1:00 AM in the 523 00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:06,280 morning, like waiting for the last train home after I've been 524 00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:10,720 paid £10 expenses for a gig of doing 5 minutes in front of 12 525 00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:13,440 people. I've put those kind of work that 526 00:30:13,440 --> 00:30:15,720 that work in where you've grafted so long. 527 00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:20,000 So so yeah, it kind of went from there. 528 00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:22,160 But then I had a bit like a bit of a break from it. 529 00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:25,520 And I think coming, I remember specifically that there's a 530 00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:28,240 there's a comedy club called them Hot Water Comedy. 531 00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:30,640 People will know in Liverpool. Huge comedy club. 532 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:34,360 Now back in the day, back in my day, it used to be a pull up 533 00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:37,880 banner at the Holiday Inn and then they moved to another 534 00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:39,880 venue. Now they're like taking over the 535 00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:45,800 world practically or the world of Liverpool online and not in a 536 00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:47,760 dictator way. I wish. 537 00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:54,520 And I remember doing some new material because I used to get 538 00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:57,680 really nervous and I remember doing new material and I 539 00:30:58,760 --> 00:31:01,400 remember specifically going on to do this new material. 540 00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:05,040 And I thought to myself, and I know I said to the audience, I 541 00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:08,080 said, oh, just to let you know, like this could be shit. 542 00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:12,360 I said this could be shit. And they all relax. 543 00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:14,920 I saw them all relax. It was the weirdest thing I was 544 00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:16,440 telling them that it could be terrible. 545 00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:22,400 But I realised afterwards I was like, I was, I was in charge. 546 00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:27,120 It's like being in a car with someone who's nervous driver, 547 00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:30,760 like you are then nervous. Or if if you're watching a 548 00:31:31,080 --> 00:31:35,000 singing competition and the girls start singing, I will 549 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:37,840 always love you. But she's wobbling at the notes 550 00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:40,800 before you're thinking, how is she going to be at the 551 00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:42,640 crescendo? You know you. 552 00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:44,680 So you sat there like, oh God, it's coming. 553 00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:49,320 So I remember distinctly going, oh God, it actually doesn't 554 00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:51,240 matter. And then the minute you let that 555 00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:55,600 go, that's when I just relaxed into myself and became a better 556 00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:58,000 comedian. Because we all can still have 557 00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:00,680 bad gigs. I mean, it's quite, it's rare 558 00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:02,960 now in the sense you have, you don't die. 559 00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:05,560 You don't die a death. But like back in the day, it 560 00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:07,440 could just be, it could just be awful. 561 00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:10,600 And I used to get worked up and now I'm just like going, OK, 562 00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:13,480 this could be bad. Who gives a shit, you know? 563 00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:19,920 Yeah, and also I can see the the, the logic behind if you sit 564 00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:22,320 down, if I sit down in a crowd and it's very obvious the 565 00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:25,400 comedian is nervous or they say they're nervous or there's 566 00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:27,760 anything you're kind of like, well, if they're nervous, then 567 00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:30,280 how should I feel about it? Whereas that kind of immediately 568 00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:32,640 kind of putting people at ease and saying, you know, but trying 569 00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:34,560 something different, this could be good, this could be terrible. 570 00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:37,280 I can see how that would all instantly relax people. 571 00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:40,480 Yeah, totally. And I've seen, you know, I love 572 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:43,920 comedians where you watch them and that because I'm high status 573 00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:46,720 on stage. So I'm a bit like I'm here, I'm 574 00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:50,000 owning the stage. But there are some low status 575 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:51,760 comedians. But even then I love the ones 576 00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:53,560 that kind of go like, alright, yeah. 577 00:32:53,560 --> 00:32:56,440 And you like, and then they go, don't worry, I am good. 578 00:32:56,440 --> 00:33:01,640 And like even saying that people go like this man, like he knows 579 00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:04,120 what he's doing or she knows what that she's doing. 580 00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:06,000 So. Yeah. 581 00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:08,760 I can't even remember. What the question was, I'm so 582 00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:12,000 sorry I baffle on them. But I'm guessing that a lot of 583 00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:15,400 those early experiences, those 5 minute gigs that you know, 584 00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:17,680 because it's one thing to sit down and know you've got, you 585 00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:20,600 know, as a viewer, I sit down, I know I've got an hour and a half 586 00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:22,440 of this comedian who's going to entertain me. 587 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:26,640 But to have to be funny in 5 minutes, that must be a very 588 00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:30,160 different skill than a hour and a half or an hour set where you 589 00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:33,480 know you've got time to build. No, no, no. 590 00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:34,840 It's probably the other way around. 591 00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:38,560 Like the longer is often harder because that hour and a half is, 592 00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:44,640 is sustaining the audience. 5 minutes now, I mean, 5 minutes, 593 00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:49,160 you just put out five minutes. But 5 minutes back in the day 594 00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:52,120 was your best stuff, your most strongest stuff. 595 00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:57,360 And yeah, now it would be like actually holding on to an 596 00:33:57,360 --> 00:34:00,680 audience for that long is it can be quite difficult. 597 00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:06,080 But the difficulty is when you're new, you don't know 598 00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:09,840 what's good. So you might have 5 minutes, but 599 00:34:10,960 --> 00:34:13,639 two of them might be two. Two of those minutes might be 600 00:34:13,639 --> 00:34:17,600 great material, but then that's the same with an hour and a 601 00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:18,920 half. You might have an hour and a 602 00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:21,639 half an hour and 20 is strong and then you've got 10 minutes 603 00:34:21,639 --> 00:34:24,040 of. But you soon come to realise 604 00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:26,360 that and you you evolve. You go from 5:00, then you do a 605 00:34:26,360 --> 00:34:30,840 10, then you do 15, then you do 20s opening, 20s closing, blah, 606 00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:32,480 blah, blah. And then you work up to an hour 607 00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:36,719 show and and and seeing as well because IMC all the time now, 608 00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:41,040 like I'm I I do a lot. I get booked quite often as an 609 00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:43,880 MC and I love it. Some acts like hate it, but back 610 00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:46,920 in the day I used to be terrified because I'm seeing was 611 00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:49,800 like bouncing off the crowd. Like I just used to come on. 612 00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:52,280 I'd do my set stuff. It was like reading off a script 613 00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:57,280 essentially. Whereas now that I just love it 614 00:34:57,280 --> 00:34:59,440 because you go there'll always be something quite funny and 615 00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:01,760 happening. But back back when I was new, if 616 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:05,640 someone even shouted something out, I'd be like, oh God, what's 617 00:35:05,720 --> 00:35:09,160 this going to be like? It's just I hadn't planned for 618 00:35:09,160 --> 00:35:12,880 anyone interrupting. And do you feel the kind of any 619 00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:16,080 kind of pressure to be, you know, as a gay comedian, I 620 00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:18,680 guess, do you feel any pressure to be the right kind of gay 621 00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:22,880 comic or fit a certain mould? Or are you just able to just be 622 00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:24,040 you? You know what's going to make 623 00:35:24,040 --> 00:35:25,800 people laugh, and therefore you're just going to be 624 00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:31,280 yourself. I get annoyed because I get you 625 00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:35,080 sound like Tom Allen. You you're, you're you remind me 626 00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:37,680 of Alan Carr. You've got a bit of a Julian 627 00:35:37,680 --> 00:35:41,320 cleariness about you. You've got and it really annoys 628 00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:46,400 me because they're like straight men who will go on and I'm like, 629 00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:49,920 well, they're just like Peter Kay, but no one's saying that to 630 00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:52,520 them. Like so you often get like lazy 631 00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:55,200 comparisons. So sometimes I get like a bit, I 632 00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:57,440 don't feel pressure, but sometimes like I feel pressure 633 00:35:57,440 --> 00:36:01,240 not to talk about gay stuff because that really annoys me 634 00:36:01,240 --> 00:36:04,200 because I'm like, but I always talk about being gay and I'm 635 00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:08,560 like, actually that material I just spoke about was dating. 636 00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:12,360 It just so happens that I'm dating a guy. 637 00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:16,080 So therefore you're like, it's being about being gay. 638 00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:20,400 But no one who's talks about dating as a straight man, people 639 00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:21,720 go like, do you know what I mean? 640 00:36:21,720 --> 00:36:22,640 It's like. Yeah. 641 00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:25,440 It annoys me. Like I talked about going to the 642 00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:28,000 gym. Oh, all that gay stuff. 643 00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:29,600 It's like, no, I just saying it there. 644 00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:31,000 There was a guy in the gym I fancy. 645 00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:34,120 I'm not talking about being gay. Like I do talk about being gay 646 00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:36,600 and then coming out. But so sometimes I get annoyed 647 00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:41,680 at that where it's like, yeah, it that that annoys me because I 648 00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:44,360 was like, actually, I'm not talking about that. 649 00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:47,760 You're just taking from that and. 650 00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:50,920 Then obviously you move between so many different spaces, right? 651 00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:55,920 You move from being on stage as I'm an MC or a stand up comic to 652 00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:59,680 and queer spaces to mainstream TV to podcasting. 653 00:36:59,960 --> 00:37:02,720 Do you ever feel like you're having to kind of code switch 654 00:37:02,720 --> 00:37:06,240 between them or have you reached a point where it's just, I'm 655 00:37:06,240 --> 00:37:08,160 just me and I'm just going to come and give you me? 656 00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:12,840 Well, mostly the latter, but you you always kind of get the 657 00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:17,840 energy of for what a thing is. So when I'm warming up for Loose 658 00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:21,160 Women or Strictly Come Dancing, it's very different to doing a 659 00:37:21,160 --> 00:37:24,520 nighttime comedy club on a Saturday night, you know? 660 00:37:24,520 --> 00:37:31,160 So, yeah, you switch in terms of that, but you're still, you're 661 00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:32,920 still the same. But yeah, you might just be a 662 00:37:32,920 --> 00:37:35,680 little bit more corporate or you might be a little bit more, you 663 00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:40,760 might swear a bit more. You might when I did radio, for 664 00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,800 example, there are things that you probably wouldn't say that 665 00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:49,960 you would say on a podcast. So, but that I think, but isn't 666 00:37:49,960 --> 00:37:52,440 that life? Isn't that like, you know, I was 667 00:37:52,440 --> 00:37:55,120 in, I was in a church the day for christening and all of a 668 00:37:55,120 --> 00:38:03,280 sudden you a little bit more, you know, professional as 669 00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:06,160 opposed to if I was in a restaurant. 670 00:38:06,760 --> 00:38:08,520 Yeah, yeah, I think we all do it right. 671 00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:12,760 I think about how I am in my day life to be how I am being on 672 00:38:12,760 --> 00:38:14,040 this to how I am in the office, right. 673 00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:15,960 We all kind of switch to the environments we're in, but at 674 00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:19,280 the centre of it we're always still kind of our core self. 675 00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:23,200 What I used to do as well back in the day is because a lot of 676 00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:25,680 people will hide themselves at the workplace, like be a bit 677 00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:29,120 more like straighter. I used to get more gay. 678 00:38:29,120 --> 00:38:32,160 I used to get camper because often when I had managers, they 679 00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:33,480 just didn't know how to deal with it. 680 00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:36,320 So it was like, it was like the other way where it would be 681 00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:39,200 like, and you'd go, Oh yeah, yeah, do it like, it was 682 00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:42,840 terrible, really. But I used to be like, how dare 683 00:38:42,880 --> 00:38:44,280 you? Like what? 684 00:38:44,280 --> 00:38:46,960 And they'd be like, oh, it's fine, it's fine, It's fine 685 00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:50,360 because they just did not know how to deal with with that. 686 00:38:50,360 --> 00:38:53,840 So I was the other way. Sometimes I would go like really 687 00:38:53,840 --> 00:38:58,560 like, hi everyone. And it would almost be like, I 688 00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:03,040 don't know, this wasn't like the the motivation. 689 00:39:03,040 --> 00:39:05,920 But I sometimes wonder whether the subconscious of it was if 690 00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:10,360 I'm, if I'm so gay, they'd have to just deal with me because it 691 00:39:10,360 --> 00:39:12,960 would almost look homophobic if they didn't. 692 00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:15,480 Do you know what I mean? It's like, yeah, take me as I 693 00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:16,240 am. Yeah, sure. 694 00:39:16,240 --> 00:39:19,240 I remember getting taken off a job actually years ago. 695 00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:24,040 I used to like promo work. And it actually happened to be a 696 00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:27,200 Russian client. And looking back, I was saying, 697 00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:31,760 oh, OK, and and she said something like we want, we don't 698 00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:33,200 want Leon the job we really want. 699 00:39:33,680 --> 00:39:36,240 What we were looking for is someone for because it was like 700 00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:40,360 for Google and I was working like doing this like Google 701 00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:44,800 master class me and the girl and with like young people. 702 00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:47,520 And she said we really want someone that the young people 703 00:39:47,520 --> 00:39:50,840 can aspire to and look up to. And they got rid of me. 704 00:39:50,840 --> 00:39:54,120 And that was basically code. See you later. 705 00:39:54,800 --> 00:39:58,000 But yeah, not everyone like that, but yeah. 706 00:39:58,360 --> 00:39:59,800 And we've touched on it a couple of times. 707 00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:03,440 You do host a fabulous podcast with He Who Must Not Be Now 708 00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:05,680 named. No, he can. 709 00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:10,320 I'm super curious as a fellow podcast to kind of how that came 710 00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:12,920 together and kind of if there's been like, you know, we've 711 00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:15,480 touched on wine and coming, if there's been a big wine epiphany 712 00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:18,520 or just kind of how it all came together and why it was kind of 713 00:40:18,520 --> 00:40:19,880 the right time to do that podcast. 714 00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:24,960 So yeah, me and Alan Carr, we host Bottoms Up with Alan Carr 715 00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:29,680 and Leap Year and it is a wine tasting kind of odyssey, 716 00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:35,400 journey, gossip, wine. And we, we're really good 717 00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:37,040 friends. Everyone thinks we're in a 718 00:40:37,040 --> 00:40:40,120 relationship, We're not, but we're really good friends. 719 00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:45,280 And last year we went to Cape Town together and we went to do 720 00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:47,920 some wine tasting, had the best time. 721 00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:51,880 And while we were set wine tasting, we were like this, this 722 00:40:52,080 --> 00:40:54,400 should be a podcast, like it's good, like blah, blah, blah. 723 00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:57,360 Nothing really came up there. But we kind of kept going back 724 00:40:57,360 --> 00:41:00,000 to it. And then he was like, I want to 725 00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:04,240 do this, I want to do this. So he kind of spoke to his agent 726 00:41:04,240 --> 00:41:07,200 and whatever and whatnot. I spoke to a production company. 727 00:41:07,560 --> 00:41:10,520 And then it all came about literally just after Traitors 728 00:41:10,520 --> 00:41:13,000 had finished. We started it, we launched it 729 00:41:13,640 --> 00:41:15,640 and it's, yeah, it's going really well. 730 00:41:15,640 --> 00:41:20,160 So we, we, we claim the premises, we drink so much wine 731 00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:24,200 and we know so little about it. And so we're kind of trying to 732 00:41:24,200 --> 00:41:25,760 culture ourselves a little bit more. 733 00:41:25,760 --> 00:41:28,880 And he's brilliant. He's like, I think one of the 734 00:41:28,880 --> 00:41:33,080 funniest men alive. And so we just sit and we have 735 00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:38,200 an absolute laugh, like to mates gossip in and we bring in wine 736 00:41:38,200 --> 00:41:42,080 experts who can try along the way to give us a bit of take 737 00:41:42,080 --> 00:41:46,520 home information. But yeah, the so that kind of 738 00:41:46,520 --> 00:41:49,120 came about just through an idea that sparked. 739 00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:52,480 And then the thing about Alan is the great thing about Alan is, 740 00:41:52,840 --> 00:41:57,200 you know, he he is Alan Carr. So if he says I want to do this, 741 00:41:57,200 --> 00:42:01,880 most production companies will go, OK, You know, if it was me 742 00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:04,400 and I was approaching someone might have been like, oh, we're 743 00:42:04,400 --> 00:42:07,400 not sure about this. I mean, look at me, for God's 744 00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:09,200 sake. I can't even get the sun out of 745 00:42:09,200 --> 00:42:13,040 my top. I'm just going whiter and 746 00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:15,520 whiter. People who are listening to this 747 00:42:15,520 --> 00:42:18,680 podcast will have now switched to audio just to see the top. 748 00:42:19,600 --> 00:42:23,200 And it's like, I'm glowing. Do you know, in light? 749 00:42:23,200 --> 00:42:26,200 And at the end of Hercules, when he becomes a God, That's how I 750 00:42:26,200 --> 00:42:28,520 feel. Slowly, like building, by the 751 00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:31,760 time we get the finish it'll be fully fully in glow. 752 00:42:32,240 --> 00:42:37,120 Yeah. So yeah, so it they made it 753 00:42:37,120 --> 00:42:41,400 happen in that way. I think it's great because I 754 00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:43,840 think you said, I think it was on one of the episodes you 755 00:42:43,840 --> 00:42:46,960 talked about this kind of weird snobbery around wine in that 756 00:42:46,960 --> 00:42:48,920 when you're you go into a restaurant, you would have no 757 00:42:48,920 --> 00:42:51,600 issues with kind of asking about a certain food or a certain 758 00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:54,040 meal, whereas you may feel uncomfortable talking about 759 00:42:54,040 --> 00:42:56,480 certain wines. I actually loved that style of 760 00:42:56,480 --> 00:43:00,640 podcast where it's kind of a, it's super entertaining, but 761 00:43:00,640 --> 00:43:03,920 also there is something about it you are unlocking something for 762 00:43:03,920 --> 00:43:06,360 other people and you know, demystifying something that can 763 00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:09,720 feel quite protected. Yeah, and we didn't want it to 764 00:43:09,720 --> 00:43:12,360 just turn into and sometimes it does. 765 00:43:12,360 --> 00:43:16,600 We didn't want it though to turn into like just two mates having 766 00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:20,440 a chat and happening happening to have wine as well. 767 00:43:20,800 --> 00:43:25,840 So I'm very conscious and as is Alan of at least giving a bit of 768 00:43:25,840 --> 00:43:30,600 take home information, you know, and so that's what we kind of 769 00:43:30,600 --> 00:43:34,560 wanted to do in terms of we don't we don't just want to sit 770 00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:37,560 there and basically just drink wine all the time. 771 00:43:37,560 --> 00:43:40,240 We want to at least go, oh, here's a little hack that you 772 00:43:40,240 --> 00:43:43,080 can take home with you or here's a little fact and things like 773 00:43:43,080 --> 00:43:47,280 that, you know. So, so yeah, that was that that 774 00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:49,160 is something that we want to kind of keep along the way. 775 00:43:49,440 --> 00:43:54,120 And then we've got like guests that are coming on and, you 776 00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:59,320 know, they might have their own wine or they just like, love 777 00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:01,880 wine. Like Tom Allen's coming on this 778 00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:03,160 week. Actually, I don't know when this 779 00:44:03,160 --> 00:44:05,000 podcast drops, but he might have already been on. 780 00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:08,240 But. And so we, but he, you know, we 781 00:44:08,240 --> 00:44:09,880 always like he's a wine connoisseur. 782 00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:13,720 But we've, we have, yeah, we have like Olivia Atwood, she's a 783 00:44:13,720 --> 00:44:15,960 bit of a party girl. So we had her for our New Year's 784 00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:18,160 thing. But mostly we have like wine 785 00:44:18,160 --> 00:44:22,320 experts. So people from the world of wine 786 00:44:22,320 --> 00:44:26,560 who basically are our teachers. I love it, I love it. 787 00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:28,400 I think it's a great podcast. Everyone should check it out. 788 00:44:29,400 --> 00:44:32,920 And as we approach the the full glow up moment for those who are 789 00:44:32,920 --> 00:44:36,520 watching, our final question. This is almost like a timer for 790 00:44:36,520 --> 00:44:38,360 me, isn't it? It's like I've I've done it like 791 00:44:38,520 --> 00:44:41,080 once the sun hits, I'm gone full done, Yeah. 792 00:44:43,040 --> 00:44:45,320 Well, we started this conversation obviously talking 793 00:44:45,320 --> 00:44:48,000 about young Lee, so let's revisit him. 794 00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:51,760 If you could give your younger self one piece of advice, what 795 00:44:51,760 --> 00:44:54,040 would it be? And would it be different if I 796 00:44:54,040 --> 00:44:57,480 just said, what advice would you give to a young LGBTQ plus 797 00:44:57,480 --> 00:45:03,440 person today in 2026? If I was going to give a young 798 00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:09,440 Lee a piece of advice, I would say invest in paper straws and 799 00:45:09,440 --> 00:45:12,040 they're really going to become quite a big thing. 800 00:45:14,360 --> 00:45:16,240 I would say put your money in that. 801 00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:20,040 No, I would say a piece of advice for young lady. 802 00:45:20,400 --> 00:45:22,560 I would, I actually would say be better with money. 803 00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:24,400 I was terrible in my 20s with money. 804 00:45:25,480 --> 00:45:29,920 Don't just be frivolous with it. What was the other question 805 00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:33,640 about LGBTQ? Just advice to young LGBTQ plus 806 00:45:33,640 --> 00:45:36,840 people today and they navigate the kind of the world we live 807 00:45:36,840 --> 00:45:41,720 in. You often feel like it's you and 808 00:45:41,720 --> 00:45:43,800 you're the first one that's had this journey. 809 00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:50,040 And I would say I as when I was younger, I met older gay men who 810 00:45:50,040 --> 00:45:53,160 like mentored me. There's a wonderful man called 811 00:45:53,160 --> 00:45:59,440 Adam Zane who is a director and then who's in Queer as Folk, but 812 00:45:59,440 --> 00:46:03,920 he directs and writes a lot of his his stuff now and a lot of 813 00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:06,760 theatre is amazing. And I worked with him on quite a 814 00:46:06,760 --> 00:46:09,160 few plays back in the day. He was one of the people that 815 00:46:09,160 --> 00:46:11,240 introduced me to it, like Matthew Shepard and stuff like 816 00:46:11,240 --> 00:46:14,560 that. So I would say listen to stories 817 00:46:14,560 --> 00:46:16,160 of people who have come before you. 818 00:46:16,360 --> 00:46:20,880 That's that's the advice I would give and understand the the 819 00:46:20,880 --> 00:46:23,840 journey it took. I love that. 820 00:46:24,120 --> 00:46:26,520 That's great advice. Well we have reached full glow 821 00:46:26,600 --> 00:46:28,120 up moment guys that are watching. 822 00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:32,120 And now the sun is actually, I could actually just sit. 823 00:46:32,560 --> 00:46:35,640 Yeah, I am being blinded. I could have done this actually. 824 00:46:35,640 --> 00:46:42,240 But now it's really in my face. I know, imagine if I turn the 825 00:46:42,240 --> 00:46:44,560 camera around and it's just a massive ring light that I've 826 00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:46,680 just been moving slowly. Lifting up behind you. 827 00:46:46,960 --> 00:46:50,360 It's because my in my kitchen I've got these massive windows 828 00:46:50,680 --> 00:46:53,280 and it just beams through. But actually, and it's quite 829 00:46:53,280 --> 00:46:55,640 nice in the summer. It's horrific. 830 00:46:55,640 --> 00:46:57,360 It's like a greenhouse. Well, we've. 831 00:46:58,240 --> 00:46:59,840 All appreciated. We've all got problems. 832 00:46:59,960 --> 00:47:02,360 We've all got problems with my massive windows. 833 00:47:03,720 --> 00:47:06,360 God, don't you hate it when your windows are massive? 834 00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:11,600 This has been brilliant. I've really appreciate this. 835 00:47:11,600 --> 00:47:13,680 It's been so interesting to get to know you more. 836 00:47:13,680 --> 00:47:16,480 I'm always fascinated by people's kind of journeys. 837 00:47:16,480 --> 00:47:18,600 I'm fascinated by comedy. You will never catch me to even 838 00:47:18,600 --> 00:47:21,200 trying to do a 5 minute comedy set, but I'm fascinated by it. 839 00:47:22,040 --> 00:47:24,280 So I really appreciate you coming on the podcast and I 840 00:47:24,280 --> 00:47:26,920 really appreciate you putting up with the glow up as it kind of 841 00:47:27,160 --> 00:47:30,480 lifted itself up through you. And yeah, just thank you for 842 00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:32,080 being on Quit Talk. What can I say? 843 00:47:32,080 --> 00:47:32,640 I glow.