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Kindly allow me to announce the 
highly esteem. 

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You come in too quick then, Mr. 
Conductor, close your eyes. 

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Get up, man, Get up. 
Stop soaking about that silly 

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little hole in your head. 
Hello and welcome to Goon Pod. 

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My name is Tyler Adams and I 
freely admit I have no musical 

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ability whatsoever. 
Not a musical bone in my body. 

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I did play seem to remember 
playing the recorder when I was 

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about 11. 
I think my peak might have been 

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London Bridge, but that was 
still pretty appalling. 

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You'd get a better tune out of a
rattlesnake in a bread bin. 

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However, I wanted to talk to 
somebody who who knows their 

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musical onions as it were, 
because I wanted to talk about 

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some of the music from the Goon 
Show, some of the fabulous, 

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fabulous music from the Goon 
Show. 

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So who better than the fabulous 
Gavin Sutherland? 

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He's a fairly big wheel in music
lads, such a career. 

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And he makes podcasts too, on 
the side. 

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So Gavin and I had a wonderful 
90 minutes or so chat and I 

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began by asking him how he 
discovered the Goon Show. 

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It was actually through one of 
my key people in my musical 

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career, a music teacher by the 
name of Jack Stobbs. 

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In my day and age, you could 
choose which high school you 

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went to and you know you it was 
based on reputation and but I 

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knew that the school I wanted to
go to had a very fine musical 

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reputation because of this man 
Jack Stobbs. 

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But Jack was a true eccentric. 
I mean back in the day he would 

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smoke his pipe during music 
lessons and he was very 

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enamoured of the music of Wally 
Stott. 

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But then I discovered that he 
was a massive Milligan fan and 

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an even bigger Goon Show fan. 
And I think it was around that 

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time that Radio Four were 
putting out the occasional two 

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or three stuck together as a as 
a series of inverted commas. 

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But Jack and I would always 
record them and pour over them 

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and quote them at each other the
next day. 

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And I'm sure the rest of the 
kids in my class had a bloody 

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clue what was going on. 
But it was magic. 

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And it was magic times because 
for me as a musician or or a 

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learning musician, the quality 
of the music in the shows was 

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amazing. 
Actually for initially it was 

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the quality of the recordings, 
thinking that these recordings 

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were by that .35 years old and 
and roundabout. 

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And yet they still came up 
really paint fresh. 

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And the quality of the recording
of the music was fantastic as 

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well and just led me to to 
follow my career and and see 

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where it turned out. 
So yeah, so I, as I said before,

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I'm not a musician in any way, 
shape or form. 

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And I don't really have a 
musical bone in my body and I 

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don't have the the the musical 
vocab, if you like. 

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You don't need it. 
You don't need it. 

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If you can appreciate music, 
that's all that matters. 

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Because the sizeable amount of 
musicians that don't. 

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This is a podcast now. 
You are not a stranger to 

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podcasts yourself. 
This is true. 

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I mean I've contributed to a 
fair few largely on TV related 

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subjects or in fact broadcast 
music related subjects. 

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The the more straight side of my
job as a a conductor and a 

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ballet conductor and orchestral 
conductor that tends to see me 

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head towards things like a Radio
4 to a Radio 3 and occasionally 

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many years ago Radio 2 when it 
used to have large orchestras 

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for shows. 
But so essentially podcast wise.

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The other thing is I, I do 
contribute anonymously. 

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Ha. 
You can leave this in if you 

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want to a podcast entitled the 
Peggy Mount Calamity Hour, which

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three men drink a lot and talk 
about old television. 

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And it's sort of the real flip 
side to just letting go, which, 

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of course, these wonderful 
podcasts can allow you to do. 

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But equally, I love the fact 
that there's people such as 

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yourself making historical, you 
know, things stick and, you 

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know, reintroducing them to new 
audiences and, you know, making 

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old duffers like me just enjoy, 
you know, a bit of a wallow in 

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nostalgia. 
But this stuff's not nostalgia. 

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The good Show never was. 
It was always right at the 

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forefront and for decades it 
still was. 

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It's a new there's new 
generations discovering this 

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stuff. 
The podcast savvy then will go 

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and ask dad or go and ask 
whoever. 

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So what was this thing the goon 
show and dad will just sit back 

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in the chair and go, oh, well, 
where do I start? 

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It was a mad program and it 
wasn't obviously to everybody's 

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taste, but those that know, and 
I think, and maybe if you took 

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a, a straw poll of say, well, 
you say 70s or 6070 year old 

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people, they all be able to 
quote something back. 

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And that's that's a legacy that 
you don't see with every show 

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put out by the BBC over the 
years. 

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I mean, even if it's just a Blue
Bottle quote or Little Jim or 

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Eccles, even just the, the 
quality of the voice, but it, 

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there's always something. 
The fact is for me, I'm always 

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quoting to people lines from 
Goon shows and specific ones. 

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Obviously the ones that still in
my psyche from those sessions 

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with Jack Stobs or having the 
tapes at home or listening to 

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them on the radio and just 
thinking, why do I, I mean, for 

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example, this morning. 
Oh, literally, because obviously

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I knew we were going to record 
this. 

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And yet in my breakfast, I was 
literally pouring the tea and I 

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said this is where the story 
really starts. 

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And I thought, yeah, well, 
that's the was who? 

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Never man, part of the pain. 
Thank you music queue. 

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But I did. 
I never listened to it, just as 

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the words and the laughter and 
the stuff that just made me cry 

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with laughter. 
Just listening to these guys 

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enjoying doing it. 
And obviously having worked with

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some of the players many years 
ago who played in the orchestra 

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for the show, said it was 
madness. 

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We had one band call in which 
they didn't give anything away 

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and then come to the record, The
laughter you hear, there's more 

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coming from the band than there 
is from the audience sometimes 

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because we knew that you know 
where we were in on the jokes 

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and things and it's. 
Yeah, Spike. 

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Spike used to say that the band 
was often they got a better 

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response from the band than the 
audience. 

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And they were also noises off, 
like all these BBC shows. 

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They all required to have live 
music. 

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And it was nearly always a big 
band. 

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It was nearly always 5 
saxophones, 3 or 4 trumpets, 3 

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or 4 trombones, a rhythm section
which is piano, bass, drums, 

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guitar, percussion and in the 
case of Wally Stotts, orchestra 

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for the Goon show, that quite 
often be a harp. 

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And yet some shows it would just
be a big band, like a big band 

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that we know, you know, Glenn 
Miller, Stan Kenton, all those 

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kind of great progressive sounds
of their relative eras. 

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But Wally Stark used the 
orchestra like a Hollywood 

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cinema score and was able to get
colours and sounds and moods in 

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a few seconds and just be able 
to make it stick and turn a 

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corner in the plot. 
I mean, it doesn't get any 

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better than that for me. 
No, absolutely, and much more so

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than and I'm not a huge fan of 
Hancock's half Hour. 

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No exactly. 
Wally Start did arrangements for

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for that as well on the radio 
didn't. 

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Didn't indeed. 
And the other thing is I think 

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with Hancock, he was bound by 
that would always feature and it

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would have to be there. 
And, and Angela did say to me, 

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I, I got to know Angela in the 
last sort of 1015 years of her 

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life. 
And we talked a lot right 

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through her career. 
And she said I was, it was like 

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a millstone because the producer
would expect it, the writers 

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would expect it, but more than 
anything else, the audience 

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would expect it. 
So it was always in there 

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somewhere. 
There'd be a seascape theme and 

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you'd hear it come through the 
middle of it. 

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Like Korngold or Rickard Strauss
horns playing baa baa, baa baa 

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baa. 
And those last two notes are 

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what makes it funny. 
Whereas in the Goon Show, he was

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allowed absolutely free rein and
gosh, you can tell. 

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I mean, he was out film scoring 
some of the great writers at the

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time. 
You can hear elements of people 

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like Dimitri Chunkin, Miklos, 
Rosa Korngold, all of whom would

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of course go on to influence 
people like John Williams. 

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But even John Williams you can 
hear elements of the Colours. 

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And this is a big band sitting 
in the Camden Theatre having had

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one band called. 
But the guys used to say playing

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the music was a delight because 
it wasn't what we were usually 

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having to play for BBC orchestra
based radio shows. 

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And you know that I equally, 
that's fantastic for me because 

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that was a big draw for me 
alongside obviously the scripts 

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and and the performances. 
OK, well, for we dive in. 

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I'd I'd like to to I always like
to know a little bit more about 

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my I'll learn a little bit more 
about my, my guests and and 

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you're quite a an an eminence in
your field, Gavin. 

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And by the way, you sent me 
recently a wonderful CD called 

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The Next Program Follow Shortly,
which you've put together with 

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the help and assistance of 
Martin Fenton and the The Fast 

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Tunes Orchestra. 
And it's basic. 

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Well, how would you describe it?
How would you pithily describe 

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this CDA? 
Broadcast themes disc for people

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who like the Goon show. 
I'd like to say it's it's a real

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niche collection and it was 
going to be even far more niche.

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It started out life as a 
lockdown project and a pipe 

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dream really. 
And Martin and I knew as telly 

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00:11:07,880 --> 00:11:11,240
enthusiasts and indeed as radio 
enthusiasts, and Martin's just 

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as much of a good show fan as I 
am, just to make that that 

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clear. 
And we examined lists and 

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thought, well, of course, you 
just have to get the funding 

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because of course that's how it 
works nowadays. 

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There's no such thing as 
contract orchestras. 

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And certainly the three or four 
companies that I had tried to 

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interest in projects like this 
had said too parochial. 

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00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:37,040
It won't sell, and we're not 
really interested on selling it.

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We're just interested on 
capturing a lot of these pieces 

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because, you know, some people 
will know, some people won't 

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know, some people will have 
never heard it in stereo, you 

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know, and then it starts getting
more detailed and niche as we go

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on. 
But then two very sad things 

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happened. 
Martin had a couple of serious 

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00:11:57,640 --> 00:12:03,280
family circumstances which led 
to him being able to fund the 

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00:12:03,280 --> 00:12:06,960
recording himself. 
And it was his, his late 

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00:12:06,960 --> 00:12:09,760
father's wish that he should do 
this disc. 

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And Martin said, well, I'm not 
going to really, I'm, I'm going 

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to do it. 
I'm going to do it all myself. 

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We'll have it on vinyl, we'll 
have it on CD, we'll have it on 

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digital. 
But we need to really nail down 

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what we're actually going to 
record. 

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00:12:26,440 --> 00:12:29,960
So that was the difficult bit 
because I knew what I wanted to 

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record and Martin knew what he 
wanted to record. 

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00:12:31,960 --> 00:12:34,640
And then we thought, well, we've
also got to put some things on 

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that the public might want to 
hear. 

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00:12:36,960 --> 00:12:42,000
So amidst all of the odd adverts
and television idents from ITV 

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00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:46,720
companies which many will 
remember, there are things like 

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00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:50,880
Grandstand, Parkinson, the Two 
Ronnies, bit of Morecambe and 

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00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:52,560
Wise. 
Are you being served? 

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00:12:52,960 --> 00:13:44,370
Absolutely. 
Ground floor perfumery. 

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00:13:44,370 --> 00:13:47,290
Stationary and leather. 
Goods, wigs and tappadashery. 

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00:13:47,290 --> 00:14:09,370
Kitchenware and food going up. 
Then amidst all of it we totted 

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00:14:09,370 --> 00:14:15,370
up the fact we have 52 tracks 
and it was less than an hour and

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00:14:15,370 --> 00:14:18,930
I said look, we've got the time.
We've got this hand picked 

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00:14:18,930 --> 00:14:21,530
session orchestra book to play 
in Abbey Road 2. 

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00:14:22,760 --> 00:14:25,920
Lots of guys that I work with a 
lot on other discs and projects 

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00:14:25,920 --> 00:14:29,640
and concerts. 
I said what else would you like?

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00:14:29,640 --> 00:14:33,960
He said, what else have you got?
And over the years this is 

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00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:36,080
something else that came in very
young. 

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00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:39,360
Very early on in my life I was 
very keen on reconstructing 

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00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:41,600
music. 
Music that you either couldn't 

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00:14:41,640 --> 00:14:45,280
trace because manuscripts were 
lost, or that they were 

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00:14:45,280 --> 00:14:48,680
destroyed, or that they simply 
vanished into the ether, like 

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00:14:48,680 --> 00:14:50,800
many things do. 
We obviously know things like 

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00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:54,360
good show recordings. 
It's not the full list. 

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00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:58,680
But you know, God bless people 
like Dirt Magazine and Ted, of 

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00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:02,680
course, who are finding ways of 
getting that, getting everything

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00:15:02,680 --> 00:15:04,760
out there for the completists 
like me. 

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00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:08,320
Probably like you too. 
Let's not forget that before 

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00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:12,960
this disc, the the disc that 
made the most impact along these

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00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:16,040
lines was Matt Berry's disc of 
of TV themes. 

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00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:19,600
And he clearly had a massive 
choice, but he also did 

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00:15:19,600 --> 00:15:24,520
absolutely everything himself 
and it was very faithful and was

224
00:15:24,520 --> 00:15:28,960
very clever. 
But it wasn't live music. 

225
00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:33,720
It wasn't live sort of it. 
It was more pop based stuff and 

226
00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:37,880
mine was more the era before all
light entertainment based stuff.

227
00:15:38,560 --> 00:15:42,400
And just to bring the ellipse 
round a little bit to what else 

228
00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:46,920
have we got? 
I was leaving for London with a,

229
00:15:47,120 --> 00:15:50,040
you know, with my scores and 
with everything and my laptop 

230
00:15:50,040 --> 00:15:52,880
and a hard drive with everything
I've ever written on it. 

231
00:15:54,360 --> 00:15:59,200
And my reconstructions go back, 
I think, I mean before I had 

232
00:15:59,200 --> 00:16:02,440
Sibelius and the music 
publishing engraving programmes.

233
00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:05,600
I had hand copied stuff for 
years and years and years which 

234
00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:09,800
I had just amassed for no reason
thinking, well, it might come in

235
00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:11,640
useful sometime. 
It's come in very useful. 

236
00:16:11,640 --> 00:16:15,560
Lots of orchestras regularly 
hire it if they want to have a 

237
00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:19,040
bit of a, a wallow in nostalgia.
But the one thing I was just 

238
00:16:19,160 --> 00:16:22,720
tickling through the the hard 
drive and I saw Lucky Strike and

239
00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:25,640
I thought, we have to record 
this. 

240
00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:30,000
And the moment I said it to 
Martin, he said if you don't 

241
00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:31,840
bring it, we're not making the 
disc. 

242
00:16:33,800 --> 00:16:35,840
And it was literally done. 
It was the last track we 

243
00:16:35,840 --> 00:16:43,320
recorded on the last day. 
And that was one that I knew I 

244
00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:46,640
had to capture because I 
definitely want to do the 

245
00:16:46,640 --> 00:16:49,120
others, the other good show 
themes. 

246
00:16:49,440 --> 00:16:53,240
But interestingly, many years 
ago I had a contact with the BBC

247
00:16:53,240 --> 00:16:55,480
Music Library who had dug me 
out. 

248
00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:58,320
Goon's Gallop by Arthur 
Wilkinson. 

249
00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:00,640
Oh yeah. 
Which is a dreadful piece of 

250
00:17:00,640 --> 00:17:01,800
music. 
It's sort of. 

251
00:17:02,080 --> 00:17:04,480
How do you think I don't like 
it? 

252
00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:06,160
I'll tell you why I don't like 
it. 

253
00:17:06,440 --> 00:17:11,359
It's a very vanilla piece. 
Whereas the music that closes 

254
00:17:11,560 --> 00:17:15,240
the classic Ear Lagoon shows as 
I as I deem them, which I 

255
00:17:15,319 --> 00:17:18,680
realise I'm now sitting on a 
razor blade at this point. 

256
00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:23,640
They, they, they ping, they 
really sparkle and fizz at me. 

257
00:17:23,839 --> 00:17:25,440
It's like we've had an enjoyable
show. 

258
00:17:25,599 --> 00:17:29,320
This is not comedy music, it's 
actually just music that gives 

259
00:17:29,320 --> 00:17:32,520
you a big burst of adrenaline 
whilst Wales Greenslade or 

260
00:17:32,520 --> 00:17:35,120
Timothy or or or or these guys 
make their announcements at the 

261
00:17:35,120 --> 00:17:37,440
end. 
But Goons Gallop just felt like 

262
00:17:37,680 --> 00:17:41,080
a piece of light music that 
could be could belong anywhere. 

263
00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:47,400
And as a big fan of Arthur 
Wilkinson, I was very sad about 

264
00:17:47,400 --> 00:17:50,560
that because you know, the man 
had a great sense of how to 

265
00:17:50,560 --> 00:17:54,040
write and how to capture moods 
in very short spaces of time. 

266
00:17:54,400 --> 00:18:00,040
Which of course with all of the 
radio comedy and speech based 

267
00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:03,960
shows, these people had to write
these cues and they had to 

268
00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:08,120
register a mood or a change of 
scene or whatever very quickly. 

269
00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:12,240
And it's interesting that none 
of Wally's starts for the Goon 

270
00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:15,360
Show ever seemed to make me 
think it could be any other 

271
00:18:15,360 --> 00:18:19,760
music, whereas in the earlier 
days it felt like this is 

272
00:18:19,760 --> 00:18:21,280
variety. 
Link #2. 

273
00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:24,000
Well, yeah. 
Well, in the game show, of 

274
00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:27,720
course, it was Stanley Black. 
In the first couple of years, I 

275
00:18:27,720 --> 00:18:30,240
used to prefer Goon's Gallop to 
Lucky Strike. 

276
00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:32,960
Oh, interesting. 
When I first got into the goons,

277
00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:37,120
maybe it was because I heard a 
lot of the sort of series 5 and 

278
00:18:37,120 --> 00:18:40,040
series 6 shows before I had the 
later ones. 

279
00:18:40,360 --> 00:18:41,680
So maybe it was just for that 
reason. 

280
00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:44,760
But there's unaccountably and I 
still haven't quite got to the 

281
00:18:44,760 --> 00:18:47,160
bottom of it, and I'm sure I 
will during the the course of 

282
00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:53,080
this podcast. 
There's the the theme change is 

283
00:18:53,080 --> 00:18:54,960
more or less halfway through a 
series. 

284
00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:58,320
It goes, it goes. 
I think I want to say I didn't 

285
00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:01,880
check. 
I want to say from the jet 

286
00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:05,720
propelled guided NAFI. 
I think that's when Lucky Strike

287
00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:07,240
debuted. 
That's right. 

288
00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:10,000
That's right. 
Which is, which is sort of 2/3 

289
00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:13,280
of the way through series 6. 
I don't quite know what what the

290
00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:16,600
reason was for that, but well. 
I mean, given, given the credit,

291
00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:20,480
the writing credit for it, which
was Joe Denise, the guitarist 

292
00:19:20,480 --> 00:19:25,520
and and Ellington and Stock did 
the the heavy lifting on on 

293
00:19:25,520 --> 00:19:30,120
writing the piece down it. 
I guess it was something that 

294
00:19:30,120 --> 00:19:32,640
came in and said we need to 
judge this a bit. 

295
00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:36,440
And how about this? 
My lasting memory of and I wish 

296
00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:40,360
I could remember the show when 
Bruce Campbell was depping for 

297
00:19:40,360 --> 00:19:45,640
Wally start and at the end, 
clearly he was expecting da ba 

298
00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:47,960
ba ba ba ba ba ba. 
And it wasn't. 

299
00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:50,880
It was Lucky Strike. 
So he conducted so fast that the

300
00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:53,880
band can't keep up. 
And then eventually, under the 

301
00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:57,360
announcement, it all settles 
back into the tempo we all know 

302
00:19:57,360 --> 00:19:59,720
and love. 
Would that be, would that be, 

303
00:19:59,840 --> 00:20:01,200
would that be treasure in the 
lake? 

304
00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:08,520
It was Treasure in the Lake, 
You're absolutely right, that 

305
00:20:08,560 --> 00:20:11,360
was the good show, BBC reported.
Programme featuring Peter 

306
00:20:11,360 --> 00:20:13,920
Sellers, Harry Secam, Spike 
Milligan with the railing of. 

307
00:20:14,520 --> 00:20:18,440
Water, as I knew you'd know. 
But I just think that reminds us

308
00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:23,520
that this is a BBC recorded 
programme, but done as live, you

309
00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:24,480
know? 
No edits. 

310
00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:28,880
No, you know, and somehow the 
music was always perfect. 

311
00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:32,320
So you noticed when it wasn't. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 

312
00:20:33,120 --> 00:20:36,000
You, you mentioned you obviously
recreated Lucky Strike. 

313
00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:41,440
You also did the ATV ident which
Angela Morley had and what? 

314
00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:47,280
Angela had told me it was a they
had just decided that colour was

315
00:20:47,280 --> 00:20:51,400
coming in and Lou Grey had said 
he wanted something that was 

316
00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:55,960
like the old ATVI den, so based 
around 3 notes. 

317
00:20:56,280 --> 00:20:59,160
But the graphic was going to be 
this wonderful kaleidoscope 

318
00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:01,320
around the the actual ATV 
symbol. 

319
00:21:01,840 --> 00:21:06,920
And Jack Parnell went away and 
basically wrote down 3 chords on

320
00:21:06,960 --> 00:21:10,480
a piece of paper. 
And at that time Wally Stock was

321
00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:14,720
one of the staff arrangers. 
I mean ATV in its pomp had like 

322
00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:17,880
12 orchestrators and 24 
rehearsal pianists. 

323
00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:22,000
It really was the showbiz 
company and while he stopped was

324
00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:25,840
a contract arranger and Jack 
Parnell said here, do something 

325
00:21:25,840 --> 00:21:27,880
with this and he wrote this 
iconic thing. 

326
00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:43,600
But I have the score written 
many years after it was long 

327
00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:48,840
lost, signed by Angela and she 
said it was fantastic that in 

328
00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:51,600
all when I was rediscovered, you
know, when they said what 

329
00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:55,880
happened to all of a sudden, 
they said, oh, and you created 

330
00:21:55,880 --> 00:21:58,640
the ATV identity. 
He said really, I don't remember

331
00:21:59,880 --> 00:22:02,560
extraordinary, really 
extraordinary, but an amazing 

332
00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:05,520
writer. 
I mean, you know, the the the 

333
00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:10,160
arrangements for Geldre. 
I know that he sort of adapted 

334
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:13,480
those for some of the albums 
with his own orchestra that he 

335
00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:14,840
did. 
Certainly Nightingale sang in 

336
00:22:14,840 --> 00:22:18,160
Berkeley Square. 
He took that arrangement and 

337
00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:21,680
made it a trombone solo, which 
was on the album London Pride, 

338
00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:26,160
which has been released re 
released on on on CD. 

339
00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:28,960
And that was an album I 
discovered in a fire sale in 

340
00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:30,920
Huddersfield. 
I mean, it's very Alan Bennett. 

341
00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:35,040
But when I was at university, 
this record shop in this arcade,

342
00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:38,520
they had a fire and so much of 
the stock was damaged. 

343
00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:42,360
They were selling it for like 10
P And everybody's going for what

344
00:22:42,360 --> 00:22:45,960
you'd expect, the pop albums. 
And I found, I mean, alongside 

345
00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:49,960
the 28 copies of The World of 
the Bachelor's Volume 6, there 

346
00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:51,680
was this record. 
And I thought, Wally, stop, I 

347
00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:54,760
have to have it. 
And you know, that rekindled my 

348
00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:58,800
interest. 
And then I knew that she was at 

349
00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:04,360
that point in Arizona and I got 
her address from the Robert 

350
00:23:04,360 --> 00:23:08,320
Farming Society at last, no 
defund, and wrote to her and she

351
00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:10,200
said, well, I'm coming over 
because I'm going to see my 

352
00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:12,080
relations in Castleford near 
Leeds. 

353
00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:15,440
Do you want to meet up? 
Oh God, that was 2 days of my 

354
00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:19,280
life that I'll never forget. 
The first meeting, she came to 

355
00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:22,960
my dreadful house in Halifax and
had tea and cakes and sat and 

356
00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:24,600
played the piano for me. 
I mean, it's like having 

357
00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:25,680
Beethoven. 
City. 

358
00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:27,800
Wow, what year we're talking 
here roughly? 

359
00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:37,760
This would be about 90, 495. 
Maybe OK, for the uninitiated, 

360
00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:41,000
well, what's your day job Gavin?
And what How would you describe 

361
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:44,080
your day job? 
My day job is an orchestral 

362
00:23:44,080 --> 00:23:49,120
conductor, a Ranger 
orchestrator, and one of my main

363
00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:53,200
stock in trades along those 
lines is actually as a conductor

364
00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:55,760
for dance. 
For 15 years I was music 

365
00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:59,960
director of English National 
Ballet and I've also on the 

366
00:23:59,960 --> 00:24:03,160
concert platform side and worked
with all the major orchestras in

367
00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:07,560
this country. 
One of my main working trades in

368
00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:10,480
this country is to do Friday 
night is music night with the 

369
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:13,520
BBC Concert Orchestra, right? 
So that for me was something I 

370
00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:17,000
grew up with just as much as the
Goon Show and then to be 

371
00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:23,800
actually doing it became quite a
substantial source of delight 

372
00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:26,760
for me. 
Of course that's changed in it's

373
00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:30,040
own way as everything has to 
evolve, nothing lasts forever. 

374
00:24:30,360 --> 00:24:33,920
But I came in on the very end, 
the tail end of the classic 

375
00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:37,760
Friday night years, where we 
would quite happily just put 

376
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:41,800
music of Peter Knight or Wally 
Stark on the stands and play 

377
00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:43,400
this stuff and the orchestra 
knew it. 

378
00:24:43,400 --> 00:24:46,400
You didn't have to do anything 
and the audience were always 

379
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:50,040
delighted. 
But, you know, now it has a 

380
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:54,360
little bit more of a classical 
tape, which is equally good, but

381
00:24:54,360 --> 00:24:58,600
the players change and the 
attitude of the audience changes

382
00:24:58,600 --> 00:25:01,040
somewhat. 
So we'll never get that back. 

383
00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:04,520
But you know, thankfully there 
are people who've preserved them

384
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:07,760
on cassettes over the years, 
listening to it on the radio 

385
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:11,640
like I did with the Goon Show. 
And you know, it'll always be 

386
00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:15,320
there to enjoy well, for as long
as the tapes last. 

387
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:21,200
So my and then on the arranging 
side, obviously reconstructions 

388
00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:25,880
is something I've done a lot of 
both for theatre and for film 

389
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:29,920
and also off neglected film and 
television scores and ballet 

390
00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:34,000
scores for companies and, and 
recordings and concerts. 

391
00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:39,040
And in terms of orchestrations, 
I've done stuff for films. 

392
00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:45,840
No big films because they get 
quite tied up, but my work 

393
00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:50,880
allows me a big diet of diverse 
stuff and it beats working for a

394
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:52,280
living. 
It's certainly not a job. 

395
00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:54,240
If it ever became a job, I'd 
have to go and do something 

396
00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:56,560
else, I think. 
Very good. 

397
00:25:56,840 --> 00:25:58,400
Wow, that's been living the 
dream. 

398
00:25:59,960 --> 00:26:02,000
And the long side, sorry. 
And I was just going to say, and

399
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:07,960
alongside the TV stuff, one of 
the things that pricked people's

400
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:14,600
attention was as a child, I had 
been a big fan of the Carry On 

401
00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:17,080
films, and not just because of 
the films, but because of the 

402
00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:20,880
music also. 
And not long out of university, 

403
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:25,080
I managed to get in touch with 
Peter Rogers, who in turn put me

404
00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:28,480
on to Eric Rogers widow Betty. 
And she said, it's all here, 

405
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:30,280
come and have a look if you want
to. 

406
00:26:30,360 --> 00:26:34,320
And I ended up being custodian 
of the entire Eric Rogers 

407
00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:36,960
library. 
And that in turn, led to two 

408
00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:40,000
successful CDs of music from the
Carry On films. 

409
00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:44,480
So that my ballet friends say, 
well, how on earth can you do 

410
00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:46,680
something like that? 
Because I was interested in it. 

411
00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:50,600
And then my jazz friends say, 
but you do a long hair 

412
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:52,280
conducting job for a living. 
Yeah. 

413
00:26:52,360 --> 00:26:55,280
But you know, because you do it 
doesn't mean you have to be 

414
00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:59,720
surrounded by it all the time. 
So you you enjoy the if you 

415
00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:01,840
like. 
They don't want to denigrate it 

416
00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:04,720
the the lowbrow as much as the 
highbrow and the midbrow. 

417
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:07,480
The populist as much as the 
classical, I think. 

418
00:27:08,280 --> 00:27:10,840
Yeah, but I love brown. 
High Brown works equally well I 

419
00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:12,120
think. 
Yeah, OK. 

420
00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:16,760
You mentioned Peter Knight, then
he, he obviously he, he, he was 

421
00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:20,880
conducting the orchestra for the
Last Green Shovel. 

422
00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:24,840
Indeed. 
And then I mentioned this, this 

423
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:27,680
is where this, this all ties. 
There's so many connections and 

424
00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:31,160
connecting threads. 
You know, I talked to to Dirk 

425
00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:37,040
and to Ted very recently and 
Dirk told me that full goon 

426
00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:39,920
again, which was the, the 50th 
anniversary of the Goon show 

427
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:43,840
special that was staged where 
they reconstructed to put 

428
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:49,520
together a, a, a, a new goon 
show using bits of old scripts. 

429
00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:54,720
He said Angela had actually put 
him onto the the John Wilson 

430
00:27:55,080 --> 00:27:59,240
Orchestra. 
And am I right in thinking from 

431
00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:01,440
something you mentioned earlier 
before we started recording 

432
00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:04,280
that, that you were involved 
with that to some extent? 

433
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:06,720
Yes, indeed. 
I mean John and I have known 

434
00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:10,400
each other since we were little 
nerds knocking around the NE age

435
00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:12,840
15. 
That's when we first met and we 

436
00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:17,600
always had an interest in music 
that maybe others didn't. 

437
00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:19,400
And light music was a big 
favorite. 

438
00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:22,520
You know, Eric, Coach, Robert 
Farnan and of course Angela 

439
00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:24,400
Morley. 
And we always kept in touch in 

440
00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:27,440
anything we discovered, we share
and we talk about. 

441
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:31,800
And then John rang me whilst he 
was in London. 

442
00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:35,760
He said I've got this the Goon 
show to do. 

443
00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:38,640
And I said, oh, tell me you've 
crowned all the music. 

444
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:43,000
He said it's all it was all 
destroyed, none of it exists. 

445
00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:45,120
And I thought, but that's crazy,
you know. 

446
00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:49,120
But of course the BBC Music 
Library had suffered flooding, 

447
00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:53,360
Never a fire, but I think there 
was flooding and also some 

448
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:58,720
parishes, of course. 
And he said I'd like you because

449
00:28:58,720 --> 00:28:59,960
I know, you know, the Goon 
shows. 

450
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:04,600
Would you reconstruct Ding Dong,
which is dead and Lucky Strike? 

451
00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:07,080
And I said by all means, 
absolutely. 

452
00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:10,040
I said what about all the queues
in between? 

453
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,680
He said I'll get somebody else 
to deal with those, but would 

454
00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:15,600
you like to to do this? 
I said absolutely. 

455
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:21,800
And because of my interest or 
because of my fervor, in three 

456
00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:24,320
hours I've done both 
arrangements and sent them to 

457
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:26,120
him. 
That's how much it mattered to 

458
00:29:26,120 --> 00:29:30,960
me to make these the best they 
could be and the most authentic 

459
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:33,400
they could be. 
And hearing them on the radio 

460
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:37,400
was a delight. 
But of course, back in the day 

461
00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:41,680
Angela Morley wrote a lot of the
cues for the shows. 

462
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:47,520
But sometimes staff arranges at 
the BBC would be drafted in to 

463
00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:50,760
do maybe one of the Gildre 
arrangements or the chords at 

464
00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:53,880
the end of the Ray Ellington 
numbers and occasionally even a 

465
00:29:53,880 --> 00:30:00,320
couple of scene change cues. 
For example, before you invited 

466
00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:03,720
me very kindly on to this 
podcast, you mentioned the sea 

467
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:07,520
shanties medley, Join the Navy 
and off it goes. 

468
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:11,200
That wasn't by Angela Morley, 
that was by Bruce Campbell. 

469
00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:16,400
But it was probably, as all 
these things were in the day, it

470
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:23,400
was probably a A1 line plan, 
like a, a lead sheet plan driven

471
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:26,840
by Angela and Bruce Campbell did
the work to write the score out.

472
00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:30,840
So maybe it's it's right that it
was credited to Angela Morley. 

473
00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:34,120
But Bruce Campbell actually did 
the work of orchestrating it. 

474
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:37,880
And that was not unheard of in 
those days because the amount of

475
00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:41,560
volume, the sheer volume of 
music that was needed for live 

476
00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:45,040
broadcasts on radio and 
television from the BBC 40s, 

477
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:48,520
fifties, 60s, and then started 
dropping off in the 70s. 

478
00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:51,120
There was a massive 
orchestrations department. 

479
00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:53,520
And there was actually a 
specific light entertainment 

480
00:30:53,520 --> 00:30:56,960
orchestrations department which 
had Peter and I, Bruce Campbell,

481
00:30:56,960 --> 00:31:01,480
Angela Morley, Dennis Wilson, 
not of The Beach Boys as we 

482
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:04,040
know. 
Or May Wilson. 

483
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:07,320
Oh, and Oh yes, or or Dave May 
witty. 

484
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:11,280
Yes and then or what's the other
one? 

485
00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:13,280
They call it Dennis. 
Dennis Main Draining. 

486
00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:15,080
Main drain, yeah. 
That's classic. 

487
00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:21,520
I was just listening to his 
Bektu Project interview the 

488
00:31:21,520 --> 00:31:24,920
other week. 
Extraordinary life. 

489
00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:29,440
I mean, a madman, but of the 
very best kind and the most 

490
00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:36,800
respectful of talent in his 
genre and another catalyst who 

491
00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:41,960
was, you know, in a large part 
responsible for getting the 

492
00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:45,240
goods to step up and continue to
step up. 

493
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:49,440
I just love that that these 
people, the recognition of 

494
00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:52,480
talent as well as actually being
talented themselves. 

495
00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:56,840
I think I think he was the 
perfect initial producer for the

496
00:31:56,840 --> 00:31:59,000
goons. 
In the right place at the right 

497
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:00,960
time. 
Yeah, he himself said he 

498
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:03,040
couldn't sustain being the the 
producer. 

499
00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:06,280
He needed to get them off the 
ground, help them get a footing.

500
00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:09,000
And then Peter Easton came along
and instilled some real 

501
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:11,520
discipline. 
Indeed, and I mean, he really 

502
00:32:11,520 --> 00:32:12,120
did. 
What was it? 

503
00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:14,640
Milliken said. 
He had a military background. 

504
00:32:14,640 --> 00:32:16,440
I think it was the song. 
The song. 

505
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:22,360
Yeah, that's right. 
There's an interview. 

506
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:26,520
Well, there's been Angela Morley
over the years has spoken about 

507
00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:30,480
her time on the Goon Show, and I
tried to find. 

508
00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:34,560
I remember talking about a 
typical week while working on 

509
00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:38,520
the Goon Show and I and I've not
been able to find an actual nail

510
00:32:38,520 --> 00:32:41,120
down an actual interview where 
she set it out, but my memory of

511
00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:45,800
reading various interviews with 
her is something like this. 

512
00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:51,800
That so she was obviously so in 
demand during the week that, 

513
00:32:53,040 --> 00:32:55,560
well, let's be fair, she 
wouldn't get the the green show 

514
00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:59,000
script generally until the 
Friday, Absolutely. 

515
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:03,240
So the so the recording would be
on the Sunday, but she more 

516
00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:06,800
often than not she wouldn't 
actually write anything until 

517
00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:08,800
the Sunday morning the the day 
of the recording. 

518
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:13,480
And that goes back to her skill 
in the days when she played Alto

519
00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:16,760
saxophone for the Geraldo 
Orchestra, when Geraldo was 

520
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:20,400
rehearsing stuff in one corner 
of this CD wherever they were 

521
00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:23,080
rehearsing. 
And Angela is sitting in another

522
00:33:23,080 --> 00:33:26,480
corner. 
And I cannot stress for the 

523
00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:31,000
uninitiated, this is genius. 
She would write arrangements 

524
00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:33,640
straight into the parts. 
Now, normally you'd write a 

525
00:33:33,640 --> 00:33:37,920
score like a map where you'd see
every instrument playing where 

526
00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:41,600
it plays, and then you would 
copy the parts out from the 

527
00:33:41,640 --> 00:33:44,760
individual lines on the score. 
She didn't bother with the 

528
00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:47,480
score, but she didn't have time 
to bother with the score, so she

529
00:33:47,480 --> 00:33:50,640
wrote it straight into parts. 
So it was coming out of her head

530
00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:55,000
onto paper. 
And if you think about it, you 

531
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:57,880
haven't got them all lined up 
side by side. 

532
00:33:57,880 --> 00:34:01,400
So she's got, she's surrounded 
by paper writing these parts. 

533
00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:05,320
I still can't believe that she 
did that. 

534
00:34:05,320 --> 00:34:06,920
But she said yes. 
Well, it was just part of my 

535
00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:09,320
job. 
And as you say, she was very in 

536
00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:12,719
demand and she was a contract 
conductor at Philips. 

537
00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:17,760
She was also heavily involved in
the television side of light 

538
00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:21,320
entertainment, certainly across 
the 50s and and very much more 

539
00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:28,080
so in the 60s. 
And it was a massive, massive 

540
00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:31,920
amount of work and it was a 
glorious golden time. 

541
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:35,679
But as you say, I mean, and I'd 
imagine it's like most shows, 

542
00:34:35,679 --> 00:34:38,000
like take it from here and all 
these shows, the script would 

543
00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:41,159
arrive very late because also it
would have to have been approved

544
00:34:41,159 --> 00:34:45,760
by the producer and or, you 
know, head of LE or whoever it 

545
00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:49,679
was at that time just to scan 
it, make sure there's nothing 

546
00:34:49,679 --> 00:34:51,800
they're trying to slide under 
the radar, which of course they 

547
00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:56,080
always did. 
And then and you would just sit 

548
00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:59,440
there and write the write these 
amazing charts and you know, 

549
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:07,280
from a A3 bar thing to signify 
the sea or China or and there's 

550
00:35:07,280 --> 00:35:09,800
quite a lot of military ones 
that are very epic. 

551
00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:17,240
Dum dum, dum, dum, dum dum. 
These cues are magnificent, but 

552
00:35:17,240 --> 00:35:21,160
they are very, very avant-garde 
in how they're written, which is

553
00:35:21,160 --> 00:35:25,440
why they are easily matchable to
the big Hollywood writers of the

554
00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:29,160
50s and 60s as well. 
Just extraordinary and a tiny 

555
00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:32,040
band and a tiny time frame as 
well. 

556
00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:34,640
It was a lot of fun, a lot of 
fun. 

557
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:38,480
I'm glad I did it, but it was 
totally different from anything 

558
00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:41,600
else I did. 
You know, it was a sort of a mad

559
00:35:42,520 --> 00:35:44,240
dash. 
It's sort of a panic on a 

560
00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:46,080
Sunday, a Sunday panic. 
That's what it was. 

561
00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:48,880
You know, get up, scribble these
arrangements, get to the studio,

562
00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:52,080
do the show. 
She complained. 

563
00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:56,080
Well, maybe complain's too 
strong a word, but she observed 

564
00:35:56,960 --> 00:35:59,680
that the orchestra got smaller 
on the Goon show as time went 

565
00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:01,080
on. 
Because it'll just do it 

566
00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:04,880
accommodate the goons demands 
for more money basically. 

567
00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:09,600
Really, I never knew that. 
I knew that orchestras got 

568
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:13,200
smaller and smaller because a 
bit of research that I was doing

569
00:36:13,840 --> 00:36:17,520
to look at variety, the BBC 
Variety Orchestra, the BBC 

570
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:21,120
Review Orchestra, the augmented 
BBC Review Orchestra, which 

571
00:36:21,160 --> 00:36:24,800
meant it had four violins and a 
cello, some augmentation. 

572
00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:31,640
So I I found in one of the old 
Goonshire Preservation Society 

573
00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:33,800
use letters from about 30 years 
ago. 

574
00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:39,680
She describes a smaller 
orchestra as being as containing

575
00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:43,400
3 trumpets, 3 trombones, 4 
saxophones and drums with the 

576
00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:46,920
railings and quartet as the 
rhythm section, adding bass, 

577
00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:49,520
piano and guitar. 
Does that Does that sound about 

578
00:36:49,520 --> 00:36:51,680
right that? 
Sounds absolutely right, and 

579
00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:56,880
certainly by the time we got to 
the very tail end of the last 

580
00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:59,000
series, I think it was even 3 
saxes. 

581
00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:02,280
But the saxophones played flute,
piccolo, clarinet, bass 

582
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:07,240
clarinet, contrabass clarinet. 
Obviously Poggy Pogson, who was 

583
00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:12,840
legendary in the industry for 
having the longest list of 

584
00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:16,440
instruments to play in the 
Musicians Union directory. 

585
00:37:16,440 --> 00:37:20,120
And I remember seeing it, you 
know, old copies of that 

586
00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:22,600
directory and his. 
There were two people. 

587
00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:27,120
There was Poggy Pogson and there
was Derek Bell, who played in 

588
00:37:27,120 --> 00:37:31,840
The Dubliners, who again, he had
a massive list of instruments he

589
00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:36,320
played, never played on, you 
know, knew his niche. 

590
00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:40,520
But Poggy Poggson could turn his
hand to anything and did and 

591
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:43,520
played a creditable bad violin 
occasionally as well. 

592
00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:49,000
It was just, but it was like the
guys would get together and do 

593
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:52,000
the band call. 
But as time went on, as you 

594
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:55,240
said, the orchestras would get 
smaller and smaller to the time 

595
00:37:55,240 --> 00:37:59,240
when you've after the Goon show 
finished where you've got the 

596
00:37:59,240 --> 00:38:04,360
horn blowers for for round the 
horn, that was about 10 people. 

597
00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:08,440
But it still sounds huge and 
brash because they had to find 

598
00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:12,200
ways of being economical with 
orchestration to make it sound 

599
00:38:12,320 --> 00:38:15,160
like it's a full orchestra, 
because it was quite clear the 

600
00:38:15,160 --> 00:38:20,560
money wasn't going to be there 
for whatever reason to, to 

601
00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:23,480
augment the orchestras anymore. 
And then they started putting 

602
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:25,760
orchestras together. 
So out of the war years where we

603
00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:27,880
had the variety orchestra, the 
opera orchestra, the review 

604
00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:31,360
orchestra, and some of those got
put together to make the concert

605
00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:34,680
orchestra, which had nothing to 
do with variety shows at all. 

606
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:38,600
And then they invented this 
thing called The Unit, which was

607
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:42,720
a pool of players that then 
became the BBC Radio Orchestra 

608
00:38:42,720 --> 00:38:45,280
later on. 
But up till this point it was a 

609
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:49,080
pool of players and they were 
booked regularly through 3 or 4 

610
00:38:49,080 --> 00:38:53,360
fixes for all of these shows but
the Goon Show. 

611
00:38:53,360 --> 00:38:58,440
I think Angela told me that the 
one thing she always tried to 

612
00:38:58,440 --> 00:39:02,240
get was loyalty is not the right
word. 

613
00:39:02,240 --> 00:39:05,400
But she would always have people
who would always play. 

614
00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:09,520
And it will be a very rare 
occasion when, say, George 

615
00:39:09,520 --> 00:39:11,640
Chisholm wouldn't turn up even 
if he wasn't. 

616
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:14,880
He didn't have a speaking room. 
He'd be playing in the orchestra

617
00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:18,440
and there'd be Wally Smith and 
Jackie Armstrong. 

618
00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:21,480
So it was essentially either the
Heath band, the Geraldo band, 

619
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:24,320
Jack Parnell's orchestra. 
It would be these guys would get

620
00:39:24,320 --> 00:39:28,400
together as a sort of social 
club and then they'd do the show

621
00:39:28,920 --> 00:39:32,280
on one rehearsal. 
I mean, nowadays in BBC shows 

622
00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:35,160
you get a full day before you 
even get near a dress run. 

623
00:39:36,480 --> 00:39:38,640
And that's not because standards
have gone down, it's just 

624
00:39:38,640 --> 00:39:41,760
because I guess listening 
standards have gone up. 

625
00:39:42,080 --> 00:39:45,840
But actually if you listen to 
the quality of the play and how 

626
00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:49,640
they play together and how they 
play together, if you know what 

627
00:39:49,640 --> 00:39:54,480
I mean, it's extraordinary. 
But that's typical of the 

628
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:57,920
musicians and the calibre of 
musicians at that time. 

629
00:39:57,920 --> 00:40:01,400
Always busy, so always able to, 
always able to. 

630
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:05,760
Sight read this crazy stuff. 
Quickly. 

631
00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:07,840
Yeah, and adapt exactly, 
exactly. 

632
00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:10,920
And enjoy it at the same time. 
You know, because it was the hot

633
00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:15,120
show to be on. 
Yeah, and, and Max would, she 

634
00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:19,560
was very close to Max Galdrec 
and Max would, would, would 

635
00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:24,160
often come over to the to the 
flat to decide what he was going

636
00:40:24,160 --> 00:40:27,920
to do for his, his number. 
And, and I think he touched on 

637
00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:31,960
it and you've also sometimes 
right the ending for Ray's 

638
00:40:31,960 --> 00:40:33,200
number. 
That's right. 

639
00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:35,840
And so I think there are two or 
three where there's actually a 

640
00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:39,760
full chart done. 
A man is a woman and you better 

641
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:43,040
know it that that that song 
cropped up quite a lot, I think 

642
00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:45,280
over over the run of the Goon 
show. 

643
00:40:47,560 --> 00:40:49,360
But that's a full, full 
arrangement. 

644
00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:51,160
But there weren't that many of 
them. 

645
00:40:51,320 --> 00:40:53,560
But it was nearly always the 
quartet. 

646
00:40:53,560 --> 00:40:56,240
And then at the end. 
Which? 

647
00:40:57,800 --> 00:41:02,200
It's funny bringing back talking
about round the horn when the 

648
00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:05,160
Fraser Hayes four, another group
of whom I was extremely 

649
00:41:05,160 --> 00:41:08,800
enamoured as I developed 
listening to the Goon show 

650
00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:12,120
through I'm sorry, I'll read 
that again and round the horn 

651
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:15,560
and so on. 
And the Fraser Hayes 4 was just 

652
00:41:15,560 --> 00:41:19,880
a tiny little group, piano, 
guitar and and the singers and 

653
00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:23,040
the band would always come in 
just for the last 16 bars. 

654
00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:25,840
And I thought that's just so 
BBC. 

655
00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:27,960
In fact, we've got them sitting 
there. 

656
00:41:27,960 --> 00:41:31,080
Give them something to do, you 
know, and I can hear Angela, I 

657
00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:37,160
can hear the, the, the American 
English Leeds voice go no, no, 

658
00:41:37,160 --> 00:41:39,040
no, no, no. 
Give them something to do. 

659
00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:42,600
We're paying for them, you know,
and that would all that would 

660
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:45,200
never change. 
And then I don't think it still 

661
00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:48,200
has. 
So, OK, so who who you've 

662
00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:51,960
mentioned George Chisholm there.
Who have you met who've been in 

663
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:54,880
within the the Goon Show orbit 
if you like. 

664
00:41:54,880 --> 00:41:58,440
And these guys probably came in 
towards the end of the series 

665
00:41:58,440 --> 00:42:01,080
because by the time I was 
working with them, they were 

666
00:42:01,080 --> 00:42:03,080
they were already in their 70s, 
maybe 80s. 

667
00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:10,720
Eddie Mordu, Roy Willox, 
Victoria Ash, Kenny Baker who 

668
00:42:10,720 --> 00:42:16,960
played regularly, as did Ron 
Simmons, Derek Healy and the 

669
00:42:16,960 --> 00:42:20,040
trumpets, Wally Smith and the 
trombones I didn't meet Johnny 

670
00:42:20,040 --> 00:42:25,560
Edwards I met who was a very, 
very close friend of of Wally 

671
00:42:25,560 --> 00:42:26,920
Stott. 
Indeed. 

672
00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:30,920
There's a wonderful album called
Castle Wise, which she did with 

673
00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:35,240
Roy Castle, with a tiny group 
along the lines of Mel Tormey's 

674
00:42:35,240 --> 00:42:39,200
group, the Marty Page Decktech, 
same sort of sound. 

675
00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:42,680
It sounds full and interesting 
and colourful, but a very small 

676
00:42:42,680 --> 00:42:45,520
group of people. 
And those players were, you 

677
00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:48,040
know, Laddie Busby from the 
Heath band. 

678
00:42:48,040 --> 00:42:51,640
I never met him, but Johnny 
Edwards I met and talked to a 

679
00:42:51,640 --> 00:42:58,120
lot, especially and Roy and Oh 
yeah, and Joe Proctor who I met 

680
00:42:58,120 --> 00:42:59,240
was. 
Going to say yeah. 

681
00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:04,840
Judd. 
Judd was Judd was a typical 

682
00:43:04,840 --> 00:43:08,760
sessioner in the fact that 
everything he played, because he

683
00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:11,080
was a number one call, 
everything he played was 

684
00:43:11,080 --> 00:43:15,600
extraordinary. 
And he couldn't remember any of 

685
00:43:15,600 --> 00:43:17,880
it by the time I was talking. 
Oh yeah, I did the Goon show. 

686
00:43:17,880 --> 00:43:20,480
Yeah. 
And that's all he would have 

687
00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:23,560
ever needed, except he 
encountered people who said, So 

688
00:43:23,560 --> 00:43:24,400
what was it like? 
What? 

689
00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:26,280
What were the working conditions
like? 

690
00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:28,120
And how were the Camden in 
there? 

691
00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:30,760
What was it like working with? 
And he said too many questions. 

692
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:34,200
I played the Goon show. 
You turned up, you did the work,

693
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:39,080
you got paid, you left. 
And a lovely man and a very, 

694
00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:42,320
very talented guitarist. 
But you tend to find that the 

695
00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:47,800
ones I interviewed, the ones who
were were very loyal to to 

696
00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:53,080
Angela and were very loyal to 
the show, had lots more to talk 

697
00:43:53,080 --> 00:43:56,000
about. 
But again, I think as time goes 

698
00:43:56,000 --> 00:44:01,120
on, I won't say they recreate 
history, but their history gets 

699
00:44:01,120 --> 00:44:03,840
narrowed somewhat and they 
remember four or five things 

700
00:44:03,840 --> 00:44:06,520
from that because of course 
they've done millions of things.

701
00:44:06,520 --> 00:44:09,720
Yeah, yeah. 
Like, play for Gavin Sutherland,

702
00:44:09,720 --> 00:44:12,160
brackets who he you know, but 
that's the sort of thing. 

703
00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:15,640
Did you? 
Was was Dick Katz still around? 

704
00:44:16,200 --> 00:44:21,000
I never, I never met Dick, but 
he was certainly around because 

705
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:24,960
I used to get Dick Cats and Dill
Cats confused, being very 

706
00:44:24,960 --> 00:44:31,000
different people, because Dill 
played on playaway, of course, 

707
00:44:31,000 --> 00:44:32,480
for many years. 
Oh, right. 

708
00:44:33,920 --> 00:44:38,320
Again, Jonathan Cohen was 
somebody semi colon. 

709
00:44:38,440 --> 00:44:40,880
This thing's got more tangents 
than a dead dankahedron. 

710
00:44:40,880 --> 00:44:46,360
I think Jonathan Cohen I've met 
and worked with quite a lot and 

711
00:44:46,360 --> 00:44:49,880
his insights into working for 
BBC Children's Telly in the 

712
00:44:49,880 --> 00:44:53,280
Sixties, 70s and 80s was 
fascinating. 

713
00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:56,400
And there's basically four books
waiting to be written. 

714
00:44:56,640 --> 00:44:58,840
But I think he's waiting for 
quite a lot of people to die 

715
00:44:58,840 --> 00:45:02,320
first so you can tell the real 
story. 

716
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:05,240
But there isn't. 
I mean, I think he's just, you 

717
00:45:05,240 --> 00:45:08,520
know, he it was with a very wry 
smile because he loved it. 

718
00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:11,720
And anybody, I think, and I'm 
sure you'll have found this with

719
00:45:11,720 --> 00:45:14,320
the people you've interviewed, 
anybody who's worked with the 

720
00:45:14,320 --> 00:45:20,920
BBC, it's an enchantment and it 
never leaves you. 

721
00:45:21,080 --> 00:45:25,040
I will always be ABBC person, 
whatever happens. 

722
00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:29,120
I will always be ABBC person 
before an ITV or any of the 

723
00:45:29,120 --> 00:45:32,560
others. 
And that's because it's a part 

724
00:45:32,560 --> 00:45:37,520
of life and it was a part of, it
has been a part of everybody's 

725
00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:41,440
life for over 100 years now. 
And, you know, lots of 

726
00:45:41,440 --> 00:45:44,360
broadcasting organizations 
around the world take their lead

727
00:45:44,880 --> 00:45:50,200
from programs and and setups 
that the BBC initiated. 

728
00:45:50,560 --> 00:45:54,600
You know, so you listen to 
Australian radio and television 

729
00:45:54,600 --> 00:45:58,600
shows from the 50s and 60s. 
It all started with Milligan and

730
00:45:58,600 --> 00:46:00,720
also further back with people 
like Tommy Handley. 

731
00:46:00,720 --> 00:46:04,160
You know, a little seam of 
craziness, but essentially a lot

732
00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:07,480
of Tivoli or vaudeville style 
jokes and routines. 

733
00:46:07,960 --> 00:46:13,360
But it all stems from the beam 
and long may the archives be 

734
00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:17,000
there for us to enjoy, and long 
may podcasts like yours be there

735
00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:22,440
to allow people who do enjoy it 
to delve a bit deeper and and 

736
00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:25,440
and discover even more. 
Damn straight. 

737
00:46:25,480 --> 00:46:31,040
Yeah, absolutely. 
OK, so I want to talk about some

738
00:46:31,040 --> 00:46:33,480
of the specific music in the 
Goon show. 

739
00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:38,560
We were in contact, obviously, 
and we we loosely, not sure how 

740
00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:42,840
loosely, but we loosely agreed, 
I think that we would both come 

741
00:46:42,840 --> 00:46:47,560
to this with four or five 
examples of bits of music from 

742
00:46:47,560 --> 00:46:50,360
the Goon show that is 
particularly notable. 

743
00:46:50,840 --> 00:46:53,320
Absolutely, absolutely. 
You first. 

744
00:46:54,000 --> 00:46:57,440
OK, well, and I want to talk a 
little bit later about the the 

745
00:46:57,480 --> 00:47:00,560
the actual theme tunes. 
Yes, indeed, in more detail, but

746
00:47:01,040 --> 00:47:04,560
so so there's some obvious 
there's a well, OK, I'm going to

747
00:47:04,560 --> 00:47:07,680
say there's some obvious pieces 
of music which were highlighted 

748
00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:12,560
in at last the go on show, which
which obviously I discussed with

749
00:47:12,560 --> 00:47:17,520
Ted and Dirk recently. 
So what I've tried to do, I've 

750
00:47:17,560 --> 00:47:24,440
I've got four or five pieces of 
Goon Show music here that maybe 

751
00:47:24,440 --> 00:47:27,680
isn't that people don't really 
think about or talk about. 

752
00:47:28,280 --> 00:47:31,160
And then it's done it's job. 
You see that's that's it's like 

753
00:47:31,160 --> 00:47:34,200
films, film, music. 
I didn't know there was a film. 

754
00:47:34,200 --> 00:47:35,720
I didn't know there was music in
this film. 

755
00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:37,360
Then it's done it's job. 
Yeah. 

756
00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:41,200
But again, in the in that 
documentary I just mentioned, I 

757
00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:45,560
think it was Angela Morley who 
said that the music could also 

758
00:47:45,560 --> 00:47:48,880
be funny. 
And, and the first example I 

759
00:47:48,880 --> 00:47:51,960
want to give is just that. 
And it's and it's, it's almost 

760
00:47:51,960 --> 00:47:55,440
nothing, but it's just 
incredibly amusing. 

761
00:47:56,120 --> 00:47:59,480
Now, are you aware of the Series
7 episode The Great Bank 

762
00:47:59,480 --> 00:48:02,680
Robbery? 
I've I've listened to it for 

763
00:48:02,680 --> 00:48:05,240
sure, but not with not in any 
detail. 

764
00:48:05,280 --> 00:48:10,440
OK, well, it, it begins with a 
little bit of frippery, of 

765
00:48:10,440 --> 00:48:12,800
course, Green Slate announces 
this is the BBC. 

766
00:48:13,440 --> 00:48:17,120
And then he solemnly announces 
the name of this week's show, 

767
00:48:17,120 --> 00:48:22,320
which is The Great Bank Robbery.
And then you get, and I and I 

768
00:48:22,320 --> 00:48:25,880
looked in the actual script, 
Spike's script, to see how he 

769
00:48:25,880 --> 00:48:28,600
described this because my, as I 
say, my musical vocabulary is 

770
00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:32,800
very limited. 
And the script says slow 

771
00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:39,320
building roll on timpani. 
It stops at the highest point of

772
00:48:39,320 --> 00:48:44,320
crescendo, followed by short, 
thin cord on trumpet, trombone 

773
00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:56,320
and clarinet. 
Next ask please. 

774
00:48:58,400 --> 00:49:01,240
It's it's the it's the musical 
equivalent of a major 

775
00:49:01,240 --> 00:49:03,200
anticlimax. 
Absolutely. 

776
00:49:03,440 --> 00:49:07,560
I mean they always use that 
chord played with very loose on 

777
00:49:07,560 --> 00:49:11,200
brochure. 
But the fact that Milligan is so

778
00:49:11,200 --> 00:49:14,160
detailed as he always was, of 
course, with all the scripts, 

779
00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:19,800
trumpet, trombone and clarinet, 
that's a very, you know, back in

780
00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:23,520
the days when, you know, bands 
would be touring and during the 

781
00:49:23,520 --> 00:49:27,600
war and of course Milligan play 
did one, there would be a small 

782
00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:30,200
band and that would provide, you
know, play for the dancers. 

783
00:49:30,200 --> 00:49:34,520
But occasionally you'd get the 
musicians that weren't as good 

784
00:49:34,520 --> 00:49:37,360
as him and you'd and they were 
terrible. 

785
00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:42,600
And that sort of sound that he's
describing I can picture. 

786
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:46,160
And goodness me, I've heard 
enough of it in my lifetime to 

787
00:49:46,160 --> 00:49:48,880
know that that chord is just 
beble. 

788
00:49:52,080 --> 00:49:56,880
And Jock Cummings was also, as 
well as being a very fine 

789
00:49:56,880 --> 00:50:00,800
drummer, he was a drummer for 
Jack Hilton and for Billy 

790
00:50:00,800 --> 00:50:04,080
Turnance Orchestra. 
He was also a major contract 

791
00:50:04,080 --> 00:50:08,040
player in a lot of the bands in 
BBC live entertainment, radio 

792
00:50:08,040 --> 00:50:12,840
and television in the 50s and 
was very versatile. 

793
00:50:13,040 --> 00:50:15,280
He hated playing timpani 
apparently. 

794
00:50:17,080 --> 00:50:19,640
That's why quite often, and 
here's the detail for you. 

795
00:50:19,920 --> 00:50:24,120
If you listen to the timpani, 
they are tuned to low and low. 

796
00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:27,600
He's got them tuned, but he's 
not tuned them to anything. 

797
00:50:27,600 --> 00:50:33,720
So they're just a low sound. 
But it works because it it's it 

798
00:50:33,720 --> 00:50:37,760
gives this epic scale to things.
And Milligan knew because he 

799
00:50:37,760 --> 00:50:40,320
used timpani and Angela used it 
a lot in these. 

800
00:50:40,560 --> 00:50:45,160
You know, those building pyramid
chords where an instrument comes

801
00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:48,440
in one after the other and 
builds this huge chord that's 

802
00:50:48,440 --> 00:50:50,920
real epic. 
Then it all moves together, like

803
00:50:50,920 --> 00:51:04,240
in parallel. 
In terms of things being funny, 

804
00:51:04,400 --> 00:51:08,560
my first choice is the infamous 
national anthem of the country 

805
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:11,760
whose name I cannot remember. 
Yak Baku. 

806
00:51:12,560 --> 00:51:17,840
Yes, that Angela discussed on 
the that documentary when she'd 

807
00:51:17,840 --> 00:51:21,760
written this very nice flying 
melody, which I believed she 

808
00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:25,280
used in a film in its 
conventional form many years 

809
00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:26,240
later. 
Oh, right. 

810
00:51:27,160 --> 00:51:31,400
I must try and find it. 
But it's, it's, I mean, if you 

811
00:51:31,400 --> 00:51:39,440
listen to it, it could be a 
national anthem. 

812
00:51:40,160 --> 00:51:44,280
But I love the fact that Spike 
said it sounds far too good. 

813
00:51:44,680 --> 00:51:48,160
I just love that I want it to 
sound bad. 

814
00:51:48,360 --> 00:51:54,760
And so he gives 3 or 4 notes to 
everybody, but played like one 

815
00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:56,640
of these terrible military 
bands. 

816
00:51:57,920 --> 00:52:02,840
And you know, the, the the loose
on brochure and it's almost in 

817
00:52:02,840 --> 00:52:06,360
tune, but it's absolutely 
pinpoint accurate because it has

818
00:52:06,360 --> 00:52:09,960
to be to pass the melody between
everything from a contrabass 

819
00:52:09,960 --> 00:52:12,480
clarinet to a piccolo and a 
triangle. 

820
00:52:12,960 --> 00:52:16,160
And at the end of it, just two 
bass drums, which is this sub 

821
00:52:16,160 --> 00:52:20,720
very sad third door door. 
And you can hear the laughter in

822
00:52:20,720 --> 00:52:22,480
the background from the rest of 
the band. 

823
00:52:22,800 --> 00:52:27,320
It's it's a magic moment. 
And that's probably the nearest 

824
00:52:27,320 --> 00:52:31,000
it gets to being a proper funny 
sound. 

825
00:52:31,800 --> 00:52:36,280
I've got, again, from Spike's 
original script, his what's the,

826
00:52:36,320 --> 00:52:38,960
what's the word notation, his 
directions. 

827
00:52:39,080 --> 00:52:40,800
Yeah. 
And I'm not sure whether this, 

828
00:52:41,040 --> 00:52:44,360
because I'm not a musician, I'm 
not sure if this is exactly how 

829
00:52:44,360 --> 00:52:46,520
it turned out, but this is what 
was in the script. 

830
00:52:47,000 --> 00:52:51,680
OK, so he writes series of 
disconnected notes played in 

831
00:52:51,680 --> 00:52:56,360
tempo. 
Then he lists these high trumpet

832
00:52:57,640 --> 00:52:59,600
deep trombone. 
Yeah. 

833
00:52:59,840 --> 00:53:01,360
Triangle. 
Yes. 

834
00:53:02,400 --> 00:53:07,520
Now Tremulo chord on piano. 
Yes, which is, you know, and you

835
00:53:07,520 --> 00:53:13,920
quite often, if you've ever 
heard he used it a lot because 

836
00:53:13,920 --> 00:53:16,560
that was what they used in the 
old answer bills when there was 

837
00:53:16,560 --> 00:53:18,920
just a pianist and that was the 
whole orchestra. 

838
00:53:19,400 --> 00:53:20,840
And, you know, it was a play on 
the comedian. 

839
00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:24,760
Just be you know, and I can see,
you know, you sit back in the 

840
00:53:24,760 --> 00:53:28,440
chair as you let your hands 
wobble to play this chord to 

841
00:53:28,440 --> 00:53:31,840
give it a full sound. 
Yes, OK. 

842
00:53:31,840 --> 00:53:35,560
And then, then Chinese gong. 
Yes, baritone sax. 

843
00:53:35,760 --> 00:53:37,040
Yes, indeed. 
Which was with. 

844
00:53:39,160 --> 00:53:42,840
It's that magical sound. 
It sounds like Lester Young, who

845
00:53:42,840 --> 00:53:46,120
of course Milligan was a big fan
of a great jazz tenor sax 

846
00:53:46,120 --> 00:53:47,760
player. 
But it's just that sort of 

847
00:53:47,840 --> 00:53:49,840
metallic honk. 
Yes. 

848
00:53:50,880 --> 00:53:54,480
Flute trill. 
Yeah, three slap tongue notes on

849
00:53:54,520 --> 00:53:56,720
Alto. 
I think he put the slap tongue 

850
00:53:56,720 --> 00:54:05,560
notes on the baritone sax. 
I don't the Ultra Sax does play.

851
00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:09,720
It plays at the end. 
That's Oh yeah. 

852
00:54:10,040 --> 00:54:12,600
That's ultra sax. 
OK, then the next one's glacento

853
00:54:12,720 --> 00:54:15,240
on harp. 
Maybe they couldn't afford the 

854
00:54:15,240 --> 00:54:17,320
harp that time. 
It's also impossible. 

855
00:54:18,440 --> 00:54:21,280
Long, thin shivery note on 
clarinet. 

856
00:54:22,840 --> 00:54:25,760
I think that's the dad. 
I think it's the trumpet and 

857
00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:30,520
clarinet in the middle after 
Bong bong bong. 

858
00:54:33,160 --> 00:54:36,120
Yeah, yeah, Then gliss on 
xylophone don't. 

859
00:54:37,040 --> 00:54:39,760
Think there was a xylophone? 
And then lastly, which is 

860
00:54:39,760 --> 00:54:43,400
something you referred to 
earlier, 3 beats on undamped 

861
00:54:43,400 --> 00:55:09,280
bass drum, Yeah. 
I mean, Milliken, there's no 

862
00:55:09,280 --> 00:55:11,560
doubt about it. 
He'd already said it. 

863
00:55:11,560 --> 00:55:15,320
He'd said in regular interviews 
he wants to be a musician, but 

864
00:55:15,440 --> 00:55:18,240
comedy was what he ended up 
doing. 

865
00:55:18,720 --> 00:55:21,440
But he did write some beautiful 
pieces of music. 

866
00:55:21,880 --> 00:55:24,280
And I've heard them and, you 
know, and I've seen scores of 

867
00:55:24,280 --> 00:55:27,440
them. 
Magnificent, you know, And he 

868
00:55:27,440 --> 00:55:29,880
writes his beautiful 
handwriting. 

869
00:55:29,880 --> 00:55:35,720
His musical handwriting was like
print for the pieces he actually

870
00:55:35,720 --> 00:55:38,720
composed. 
But in time, in terms like this,

871
00:55:39,040 --> 00:55:42,040
he knew exactly what he wanted. 
It was completely in his head. 

872
00:55:42,280 --> 00:55:45,560
He probably roared with laughter
or cried with laughter writing 

873
00:55:45,560 --> 00:55:48,920
down those directions and gave 
it to Andrew and said right 

874
00:55:48,960 --> 00:55:51,360
there you go make that's what I 
want. 

875
00:55:52,840 --> 00:55:58,000
And what came out was just the 
funniest sound I've ever heard. 

876
00:55:58,840 --> 00:56:03,040
Yes, I can still remember when I
first heard The Sleeping Prince 

877
00:56:03,040 --> 00:56:07,440
and heard that Yes, and thinking
this is completely redefined 

878
00:56:07,440 --> 00:56:09,840
comedy for me. 
Yeah, indeed. 

879
00:56:10,120 --> 00:56:14,040
And of course it was a because 
the music was allowed to be 

880
00:56:14,040 --> 00:56:19,440
anarchic, just like the script. 
That was something that was 

881
00:56:19,520 --> 00:56:22,920
unheard of in radio shows up 
until that point. 

882
00:56:24,360 --> 00:56:27,360
The orchestra played, or they 
played the end of a sketch and 

883
00:56:27,360 --> 00:56:29,960
the musical numbers and the 
theme tune and that was it. 

884
00:56:30,560 --> 00:56:35,280
Whereas now it was an integral 
part in any way, shape or form 

885
00:56:35,280 --> 00:56:36,840
that came out of Milligan's 
head. 

886
00:56:37,400 --> 00:56:40,240
And it's interesting when the 
when Larry Stevens and Eric 

887
00:56:40,240 --> 00:56:44,560
Sykes were involved in scripts, 
it felt a little bit more 

888
00:56:44,560 --> 00:56:47,200
conventional. 
Or certainly there was less 

889
00:56:47,200 --> 00:56:50,360
orchestra used because there 
were more words. 

890
00:56:52,200 --> 00:56:55,920
That's interesting. 
And that that very neatly brings

891
00:56:55,920 --> 00:56:58,600
me on to my next piece of music,
actually. 

892
00:56:58,600 --> 00:57:00,760
And I didn't, it didn't occur. 
You mentioned Eric's site, he 

893
00:57:00,760 --> 00:57:03,640
said when Eric, Larry and Eric 
were involved. 

894
00:57:04,960 --> 00:57:09,600
So the first script that Eric 
was involved with writing was 

895
00:57:09,600 --> 00:57:11,720
Lurgy Strikes Britain. 
Oh yes, indeed. 

896
00:57:12,920 --> 00:57:17,120
And there's a, there's a 
particular link, musical link in

897
00:57:17,720 --> 00:57:22,320
Lurgy Strikes Britain that I 
think I'm right in saying I've 

898
00:57:22,320 --> 00:57:25,280
never heard it used again in any
of the goon shows. 

899
00:57:25,600 --> 00:57:29,280
And to me, it sounds out of 
place in the goon show. 

900
00:57:29,280 --> 00:57:33,320
It sounds too orthodox a piece 
of light radio light 

901
00:57:33,320 --> 00:57:35,840
entertainment. 
Yes, I think I know the. 

902
00:57:36,000 --> 00:57:38,880
I think I know the Q you mean. 
Yes, and it's it's and I looked 

903
00:57:38,880 --> 00:57:40,600
in the script and it just says 
link. 

904
00:57:40,600 --> 00:57:43,480
I think it doesn't really even 
describe it, but it's when 

905
00:57:43,480 --> 00:57:47,520
Moriarty orders C going to go to
the, what does it call it, the 

906
00:57:47,520 --> 00:57:58,410
council medical? 
Yes, that's right. 

907
00:57:58,410 --> 00:58:00,490
Now I I've often wondered about 
that. 

908
00:58:00,490 --> 00:58:05,730
Was that Angela or was that a 
buy in? 

909
00:58:06,010 --> 00:58:09,210
Because that can also happen too
sometimes if it just says link, 

910
00:58:10,530 --> 00:58:13,170
there's a because that'll come 
to my next queue in a minute. 

911
00:58:13,170 --> 00:58:15,970
But yeah, so interesting. 
But I know what you mean. 

912
00:58:15,970 --> 00:58:20,920
It's much more conventional. 
It's much more vanilla than than

913
00:58:21,000 --> 00:58:24,320
what we're used to because we're
used, and it's also very total. 

914
00:58:24,320 --> 00:58:30,400
It's very understandable music. 
Well, I wondered, probably 

915
00:58:30,400 --> 00:58:33,720
wrongly, I'm sure wrongly, 
because the week before Logie 

916
00:58:33,720 --> 00:58:37,040
strikes Britain, the first 
episode of Hancock's Half Hour 

917
00:58:37,120 --> 00:58:41,200
went out and obviously Angie was
involved with with that and I 

918
00:58:41,200 --> 00:58:44,160
just wondered whether that was 
some sort of hangover from a 

919
00:58:44,160 --> 00:58:46,920
piece of music for Hancock's 
Half Hour or something could be.

920
00:58:46,920 --> 00:58:50,680
Could be. 
Oh, interesting. 

921
00:58:50,920 --> 00:58:52,680
But OK, we'll see. 
What's your next piece? 

922
00:58:52,680 --> 00:58:56,640
My next piece, it's just as 
conventional and unusual for 

923
00:58:56,640 --> 00:59:02,880
that. 
The clarinetal fluids go and the

924
00:59:02,880 --> 00:59:06,440
trombones go bop, bop, bop, bop,
bop, bop, bop, bop, bop, bop. 

925
00:59:07,280 --> 00:59:11,160
And that again, is quite 
conventional compared to some of

926
00:59:11,160 --> 00:59:19,720
the stuff and the fact that it 
end with on the on the symbol 

927
00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:23,240
held what they call choke it. 
So you hit it and you grab it 

928
00:59:23,240 --> 00:59:25,280
very quickly. 
So it has that sort of, you 

929
00:59:25,280 --> 00:59:30,080
know, it's it's a very light 
entertainment comedy sound. 

930
00:59:30,520 --> 00:59:34,680
Yes, it was here to there as of 
course many of these cues had to

931
00:59:34,680 --> 00:59:37,280
be, but it just felt so 
conventional. 

932
00:59:37,320 --> 00:59:40,720
So it's interesting that we, you
know, we drew along the same 

933
00:59:40,720 --> 00:59:42,480
lines. 
There, absolutely. 

934
00:59:42,520 --> 00:59:49,080
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
OK, so so I've chosen next I was

935
00:59:49,080 --> 00:59:52,120
going to choose The Lost 
Emperor, the dramatic theme from

936
00:59:52,120 --> 00:59:56,640
The Lost Emperor, which again 
gets talked about extensively in

937
00:59:57,320 --> 00:59:58,880
At Last to go on show. 
Yes. 

938
00:59:59,440 --> 01:00:03,400
And and whatnot because it's a 
very it's and when Dirk was on 

939
01:00:03,400 --> 01:00:07,720
the show recently, he described 
it as as proper Powell and Press

940
01:00:07,720 --> 01:00:09,760
Burger. 
Very much so very. 

941
01:00:11,280 --> 01:00:15,320
Much so dramatic theme. 
I looked at the script and and 

942
01:00:15,320 --> 01:00:17,560
this isn't my choice, by the 
way, I just want to touch on it 

943
01:00:17,560 --> 01:00:21,720
because, yeah, in the script 
it's described as dramatic theme

944
01:00:21,720 --> 01:00:24,600
leaving harp and background, 
then large, vibrant Chinese 

945
01:00:24,600 --> 01:00:27,200
gong. 
And I feel there's a sort of a 

946
01:00:27,200 --> 01:00:29,640
dynastic feel to it. 
And that's when you have Peter 

947
01:00:29,640 --> 01:00:32,280
over, over say as as the 
emperor, when I die, take all 

948
01:00:32,280 --> 01:00:34,640
the choices of my Kingdom, 
etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. 

949
01:00:34,640 --> 01:00:36,800
And it's it's it's very, very 
epic. 

950
01:00:37,040 --> 01:00:38,600
Epic is, is the way. 
Now. 

951
01:00:39,120 --> 01:00:44,720
Similarly, I felt a few shows 
later, there's the episode 

952
01:00:44,720 --> 01:00:46,000
Shangri-La again. 
Oh. 

953
01:00:46,560 --> 01:00:51,440
Yes. 
And it it's right at the 

954
01:00:51,440 --> 01:00:54,680
beginning where Peter again is 
setting the scene. 

955
01:00:56,120 --> 01:00:59,400
He says the story of Shangri-La 
is adopted from Fred hiltons 

956
01:00:59,400 --> 01:01:02,960
book lost Horizontally based on 
the legend of Shangri Lou the. 

957
01:01:03,240 --> 01:01:05,480
Powder. 
Yeah, lost. 

958
01:01:05,480 --> 01:01:07,320
Horizontally is something. 
Again. 

959
01:01:07,320 --> 01:01:09,400
It's one of those quotes that 
keeps coming past you. 

960
01:01:09,880 --> 01:01:13,040
Yeah, there's also. 
There's a terrible edit point in

961
01:01:13,040 --> 01:01:18,040
this that I think the because he
he says it's based on the legend

962
01:01:18,040 --> 01:01:21,520
of Shangri loo from the play 
across Ava garden with 

963
01:01:21,520 --> 01:01:25,480
stethoscope Geiger counter and 
then it cuts and he just says 

964
01:01:25,480 --> 01:01:28,160
Shangri-La and right. 
Interesting. 

965
01:01:28,800 --> 01:01:31,200
But the bit that was cut and I 
presume it was cut from the 

966
01:01:31,880 --> 01:01:34,880
original broadcast and and the 
bit doesn't exist anymore. 

967
01:01:35,920 --> 01:01:38,760
It was going to be stethoscope, 
Geiger counter and cheque book. 

968
01:01:39,680 --> 01:01:44,480
Oh, interesting. 
Yeah, but Spike describes the 

969
01:01:45,200 --> 01:01:48,760
the the music for this. 
He describes it in the script as

970
01:01:49,080 --> 01:01:54,480
soaring Shangri-La theme. 
This is good Roof of World type 

971
01:01:54,480 --> 01:01:55,600
stuff. 
Yeah. 

972
01:01:56,600 --> 01:02:00,440
Mix in choir singing ethereal 
song, mix in wind, then Peter. 

973
01:02:00,840 --> 01:02:02,800
OK. 
And then it's got the sort of 

974
01:02:03,600 --> 01:02:07,360
unsettling music, the sort of 
woozy, dreamlike yeah yeah music

975
01:02:08,080 --> 01:02:34,460
in Into Segun, basically. 
The story of Shangri-La is 

976
01:02:34,460 --> 01:02:39,680
adopted from Fred Hilton's book 
Lost Horizontally based on the 

977
01:02:39,680 --> 01:02:43,360
legend of Shangra Loo from the 
play across. 

978
01:02:43,360 --> 01:02:46,080
Ava Gardner with stethoscope 
Geiger counter. 

979
01:02:47,400 --> 01:02:59,370
Shangri-La, Shangri-La, you 
know, Roof of the World is a 

980
01:02:59,370 --> 01:03:01,170
great description. 
Yes. 

981
01:03:01,290 --> 01:03:04,970
Because there's quite a few. 
I mean, you know, the sea 

982
01:03:05,490 --> 01:03:08,250
interlude that is very much roof
of the world. 

983
01:03:08,250 --> 01:03:10,050
You can feel the lurch of a 
ship. 

984
01:03:10,560 --> 01:03:14,320
You can feel the seagulls. 
It's it's magnificent. 

985
01:03:14,320 --> 01:03:18,440
Now, that's not what I'm I've 
mentioned, but but exactly that.

986
01:03:19,000 --> 01:03:23,800
And I just like that. 
It's almost like because the 

987
01:03:23,800 --> 01:03:28,440
other thing that Angela was very
interested in and very prolific 

988
01:03:28,440 --> 01:03:33,800
at was library music. 
And of course, there were many 

989
01:03:33,800 --> 01:03:38,320
of these cues that she wrote, 
which were three and four 

990
01:03:38,320 --> 01:03:42,400
seconds long, which got put out 
in the Chapel music library. 

991
01:03:42,400 --> 01:03:47,920
I think it was comic cuts, 
curtain up, I think was one. 

992
01:03:48,680 --> 01:03:51,000
There were a few other light 
music society ones that were all

993
01:03:51,040 --> 01:03:55,840
light music ones that were all 
released on, you know, single 

994
01:03:55,840 --> 01:03:58,760
side, 78 play disc. 
And there were 10 cues on there.

995
01:03:59,240 --> 01:04:03,080
So, you know, it was a great 
skill and a great gift, but they

996
01:04:03,080 --> 01:04:06,760
weren't like any music cues 
you'd heard before. 

997
01:04:07,880 --> 01:04:13,520
And as you coming back to the 
previous one, if you if it was 

998
01:04:13,520 --> 01:04:17,080
conventional, it stood out. 
And I guess that's also the same

999
01:04:17,080 --> 01:04:19,840
with the writing too. 
If there was something in there 

1000
01:04:19,840 --> 01:04:25,640
that was very emotional, it 
really leapt out at you because 

1001
01:04:25,880 --> 01:04:29,760
normally it was, you know, the 
whole script was never 100% 

1002
01:04:29,760 --> 01:04:32,760
anarchic, laughing funny. 
There were moments where you 

1003
01:04:32,760 --> 01:04:37,160
just thought, I see what he's 
trying to say here, and I think 

1004
01:04:37,360 --> 01:04:40,240
Angela's music did the same. 
Very much so. 

1005
01:04:40,760 --> 01:04:46,720
Which brings me to the cue that 
ask anybody and everybody will 

1006
01:04:46,720 --> 01:04:56,440
say, ah well, of course. 
Why does that signify this 

1007
01:04:56,440 --> 01:05:00,320
crusty old kernel who's always 
on the make, always got flies? 

1008
01:05:00,640 --> 01:05:03,800
Why does it do that? 
It sounds like a variety play 

1009
01:05:03,800 --> 01:05:08,640
on, but it's not. 
It's like a it's a militaristic 

1010
01:05:08,640 --> 01:05:14,520
sort of bumbling old sound. 
And yet somehow it has such a 

1011
01:05:14,720 --> 01:05:19,680
high energy and then so, well, 
I'd never be free of them or 

1012
01:05:19,680 --> 01:05:21,320
whatever. 
No more curried eggs for me. 

1013
01:05:21,320 --> 01:05:25,040
Or so you know, all the rest. 
There's one where, if I remember

1014
01:05:25,040 --> 01:05:29,320
rightly, it escapes into a sort 
of March that fades out. 

1015
01:05:29,680 --> 01:05:34,440
Yes, and then the marching fades
up. 

1016
01:05:34,440 --> 01:05:37,120
That's right, yes. 
And that took me completely by 

1017
01:05:37,160 --> 01:05:39,360
surprise because I thought, 
what's this going to be? 

1018
01:05:39,360 --> 01:05:42,480
And it fades out, you know? 
He's the only character in the 

1019
01:05:42,480 --> 01:05:43,800
game show that has his own theme
tune. 

1020
01:05:44,080 --> 01:05:45,360
That's right. 
That's right. 

1021
01:05:45,480 --> 01:05:48,960
And, and I'm guessing that's a 
hangover from the very early 

1022
01:05:48,960 --> 01:05:51,960
shows where he was one of the 
earliest characters. 

1023
01:05:52,400 --> 01:05:56,480
Indeed, but it is it is true. 
It's the only. 

1024
01:05:57,040 --> 01:06:03,520
I mean, you know, it is probably
my favorite cue because it could

1025
01:06:03,520 --> 01:06:09,000
be so vanilla in how it's 
written, but actually there are 

1026
01:06:09,000 --> 01:06:15,840
notes in the chords which make 
it very Angela, you know, it's a

1027
01:06:15,840 --> 01:06:19,920
very simple cadence, so a very 
set of chords. 

1028
01:06:20,080 --> 01:06:23,240
It's a very simple chord 
progression to get to the end. 

1029
01:06:23,640 --> 01:06:30,960
And yet somehow he encapsulated 
6 bars, something that all of a 

1030
01:06:30,960 --> 01:06:33,520
sudden makes you go all right, 
at last here he comes. 

1031
01:06:34,720 --> 01:06:38,440
I love that. 
And that for me, I think that 

1032
01:06:38,440 --> 01:06:40,800
was one of the cues that first 
stuck with me. 

1033
01:06:41,400 --> 01:06:47,960
And I remember sitting at the 
piano because before I trained 

1034
01:06:48,040 --> 01:06:51,960
well, I didn't train as a people
self-taught, but I played a lot 

1035
01:06:51,960 --> 01:06:55,760
by ear, still do. 
And I remember vividly sitting 

1036
01:06:55,760 --> 01:07:01,600
in the music room at our school 
and Mr. Stops came in with his 

1037
01:07:01,840 --> 01:07:04,960
Piper light and he said, Oh no, 
Gavin, we've got to talk about 

1038
01:07:06,120 --> 01:07:09,280
out of cadences today. 
I said, what's this cadence? 

1039
01:07:09,280 --> 01:07:13,600
And I played Dude. 
Yeah, yeah, Papa, He said, how'd

1040
01:07:13,600 --> 01:07:16,160
you know that? 
I said, well, you gave me the 

1041
01:07:16,160 --> 01:07:22,480
record with it on. 
OK, so I I was going to suggest 

1042
01:07:22,480 --> 01:07:24,520
the call of the West. 
Oh yes. 

1043
01:07:27,360 --> 01:07:31,080
Yeah, there's some sweeping 
stuff in that. 

1044
01:07:31,400 --> 01:07:34,040
But then I thought, actually, 
no, I might, I was intrigued to 

1045
01:07:34,040 --> 01:07:37,760
go back and listen to an earlier
goon show that sort of pre 

1046
01:07:37,760 --> 01:07:42,280
series 5 that exists. 
And I just thought, OK, I knew 

1047
01:07:42,280 --> 01:07:45,080
that obviously Call of the West 
is set in the Wild West. 

1048
01:07:45,080 --> 01:07:48,000
And I there's, there's a goon 
show called Western Story. 

1049
01:07:48,400 --> 01:07:52,600
From I don't know that one. 
It is available on the Goon Show

1050
01:07:52,600 --> 01:07:57,640
Compendium, and it's a Shane 
parody. 

1051
01:07:58,280 --> 01:08:01,840
OK. 
Called getting back to Dennis 

1052
01:08:01,840 --> 01:08:09,640
Maine Wilson here called drain 
and there's some really good 

1053
01:08:09,720 --> 01:08:15,280
western what I'm what I've 
described as as stirring Western

1054
01:08:15,320 --> 01:08:17,399
link music. 
OK, absolutely. 

1055
01:08:23,560 --> 01:08:27,840
As you say, the there are 
country specific geographical 

1056
01:08:27,840 --> 01:08:31,880
references that he can pull and 
make stick so quickly. 

1057
01:08:31,880 --> 01:08:34,080
And the Western ones, I mean, 
obviously I know the ones from 

1058
01:08:34,080 --> 01:08:39,680
Call of the West, but you know, 
these these sounds, it's based 

1059
01:08:39,720 --> 01:08:45,319
on that era of Western, you 
know, just going into colour on 

1060
01:08:45,319 --> 01:08:50,080
the on the big screen, yes, and 
big Vista photographs and of 

1061
01:08:50,080 --> 01:08:54,240
course Vista Vision and and 
Cinemascope all the rest to give

1062
01:08:54,240 --> 01:08:56,840
you the feeling of the vast 
expanse of the place. 

1063
01:08:57,200 --> 01:08:59,359
And Angela just captured that, 
you know? 

1064
01:09:00,319 --> 01:09:03,520
Yes, totally stuff. 
Have you got any more? 

1065
01:09:04,040 --> 01:09:07,840
I have one that's not actually 
an orchestral one, but it always

1066
01:09:07,840 --> 01:09:11,960
makes me laugh. 
It is the piano and I think it's

1067
01:09:11,960 --> 01:09:15,399
insurance, the white man's 
burden, and I think it's sellers

1068
01:09:15,399 --> 01:09:19,479
playing it. 
Yeah, yeah, TomTom the piano 

1069
01:09:19,600 --> 01:09:21,960
playing Penguin. 
That's right, Yeah. 

1070
01:09:23,560 --> 01:09:29,479
Go on. 
Play Lovely. 

1071
01:09:29,479 --> 01:09:50,200
Lovely. 
Good heavens, and he sings as 

1072
01:09:50,200 --> 01:09:54,040
well and names all his own words
to you. 

1073
01:09:55,240 --> 01:09:59,560
It must be Sellers because it's 
the same 2 chords that he plays 

1074
01:09:59,560 --> 01:10:02,000
in the dustbin song. 
I'm walking backwards for 

1075
01:10:02,000 --> 01:10:04,680
Christmas so. 
But I just love that sound. 

1076
01:10:04,680 --> 01:10:07,840
And it's clearly not the 
orchestra piano. 

1077
01:10:07,840 --> 01:10:13,440
It's clearly one of those old 
boxy upright pianos which 

1078
01:10:13,440 --> 01:10:17,680
clearly they had shipped into 
the Camden, or probably, well, 

1079
01:10:17,960 --> 01:10:22,200
the BBC had a surfeit of 
keyboard instruments for many, 

1080
01:10:22,200 --> 01:10:25,000
many years, although it very 
nearly didn't, Famously 

1081
01:10:25,000 --> 01:10:30,920
recording a story I remember 
reading in Oh, Whose book was 

1082
01:10:30,920 --> 01:10:31,800
it? 
It'll come back to me. 

1083
01:10:32,520 --> 01:10:34,120
Don't get out. 
Don't ever get out Tyler. 

1084
01:10:34,960 --> 01:10:39,760
And these this lorry turned up 
at Broadcasting House in the 50s

1085
01:10:39,920 --> 01:10:45,440
and and these brown coats got 
out and said we've come to 

1086
01:10:45,440 --> 01:10:47,400
collect the piano. 
Well, which one? 

1087
01:10:47,400 --> 01:10:50,160
Well, we've got to get the 
ground from the concert hall 

1088
01:10:50,160 --> 01:10:52,920
because it's got a gig at 
Aeolian Hall next week. 

1089
01:10:53,320 --> 01:10:55,720
But what's wrong with the piano?
It's a piano duet concert. 

1090
01:10:56,160 --> 01:10:59,280
All was the quick answer. 
So they let them in, they 

1091
01:10:59,280 --> 01:11:02,360
shipped the piano out and it was
never seen again. 

1092
01:11:04,880 --> 01:11:08,680
And in my time, I remember going
into or being locked, shown into

1093
01:11:08,680 --> 01:11:12,760
a locked room at Maida Vale. 
And they said, Gavin, you're 

1094
01:11:12,760 --> 01:11:16,280
very lucky to see this and open 
the door and said, this is the 

1095
01:11:16,280 --> 01:11:19,360
Celeste suite. 
And there were the Celeste, you 

1096
01:11:19,360 --> 01:11:23,280
know, Sugar Plum Fairy that that
tinkly little box of, of 

1097
01:11:23,280 --> 01:11:26,480
hammers. 
There were 25 Celeste in this 

1098
01:11:26,480 --> 01:11:29,520
room and I said what are they 
going to do with them all? 

1099
01:11:29,520 --> 01:11:31,840
I said but Chuck them out, we 
have no use for them. 

1100
01:11:31,840 --> 01:11:35,080
We've got 3 and these are all I 
said I'll have one. 

1101
01:11:35,080 --> 01:11:37,240
And they said will you come and 
get us? 

1102
01:11:37,240 --> 01:11:40,040
And I don't drive. 
Then if you can find a way of 

1103
01:11:40,040 --> 01:11:42,280
collecting it you can have as 
many as you like. 

1104
01:11:43,240 --> 01:11:48,640
And I never took them up on it. 
But the BBC had lots of toys and

1105
01:11:48,640 --> 01:11:52,160
of course somebody's 
contribution that we mustn't 

1106
01:11:52,160 --> 01:11:56,560
ever forget is Dick Mills, 
because he provided a very 

1107
01:11:56,560 --> 01:11:59,320
different kind of soundscape, if
you will. 

1108
01:11:59,680 --> 01:12:03,080
For of course, Blood knocks 
stomach, which got used in many 

1109
01:12:03,080 --> 01:12:07,560
things and I think it got used 
in other shows. 

1110
01:12:08,320 --> 01:12:12,800
But every time I hear that 
explosion and then obviously 

1111
01:12:12,800 --> 01:12:17,520
what follows it, I love that the
mind draws pictures on radio in 

1112
01:12:17,520 --> 01:12:19,560
a way it could never do on 
television. 

1113
01:12:19,840 --> 01:12:23,120
I mean, Michael Benteen got 
close with It's a Square World 

1114
01:12:23,120 --> 01:12:28,320
and all those things, but nobody
did challenging your imagination

1115
01:12:28,320 --> 01:12:31,240
like Milligan did, and he 
managed to make it funny. 

1116
01:12:31,840 --> 01:12:34,280
Yeah. 
But you know again. 

1117
01:12:35,160 --> 01:12:37,120
Rather than just baffling, he 
made it. 

1118
01:12:37,240 --> 01:12:38,160
Funny. 
Absolutely. 

1119
01:12:38,640 --> 01:12:41,920
And I mean, you know, people 
like Bobby J, Terry Wogan's 

1120
01:12:41,920 --> 01:12:46,120
great friend, not yeah, 
operating the console and, you 

1121
01:12:46,120 --> 01:12:49,480
know, standing there with disc 
after disc after disc and also 

1122
01:12:49,480 --> 01:12:51,680
live effects, spot effects as 
well. 

1123
01:12:53,160 --> 01:12:56,840
But they weren't the old door 
opening, door closing that 

1124
01:12:56,840 --> 01:12:59,440
featured. 
But it wasn't, it was something 

1125
01:12:59,440 --> 01:13:03,760
that was just there. 
It was the rest of them and the 

1126
01:13:03,760 --> 01:13:07,280
soundscapes that he got, for 
example. 

1127
01:13:08,280 --> 01:13:12,200
I mean the one that he that they
mentioned on the Parkinson's 

1128
01:13:12,200 --> 01:13:17,240
show 2 was it 2 hippos walking 
away, bouncing into one another.

1129
01:13:17,640 --> 01:13:20,200
And if you can't get 2 hippos, 2
lions will. 

1130
01:13:20,200 --> 01:13:23,400
Do Yeah, Yeah, that's right from
Napoleon's piano. 

1131
01:13:23,400 --> 01:13:25,240
Napoleon's piano indeed. 
Yeah. 

1132
01:13:26,240 --> 01:13:32,760
Yeah, there was one other piece 
of music I, I chose which 

1133
01:13:32,760 --> 01:13:35,880
probably won't spring to to 
anyone's mind necessarily, but 

1134
01:13:36,160 --> 01:13:43,720
just as an example of just 
reliable dramatic music, which 

1135
01:13:43,720 --> 01:13:47,280
is from the the Vintage Goons 
version of the Internal 

1136
01:13:47,280 --> 01:13:53,640
mountain. 
From. 57 was it 5758 and it's 

1137
01:13:53,640 --> 01:13:56,720
it's in the script it's just 
described as dramatic theme 

1138
01:13:56,720 --> 01:13:59,040
suggesting man's spirit of 
adventure. 

1139
01:14:00,040 --> 01:14:02,160
Gosh. 
But if you listen to the actual 

1140
01:14:02,160 --> 01:14:04,520
recording of it, when it's it's 
right near the beginning of the 

1141
01:14:04,520 --> 01:14:11,400
show, it it kind of it goes on 
just tad too long deliberately, 

1142
01:14:11,480 --> 01:14:12,000
I'm sure. 
Yeah. 

1143
01:14:12,360 --> 01:14:17,040
And there's just the merest 
suggestion of a bum note here or

1144
01:14:17,040 --> 01:14:19,640
there as well. 
Interesting sight reading, 

1145
01:14:19,640 --> 01:14:21,080
probably. 
That's probably one that he was 

1146
01:14:21,080 --> 01:14:24,880
writing in the break between the
rehearsal and the and the gig. 

1147
01:14:24,880 --> 01:14:26,880
It's like, OK, we need something
here. 

1148
01:14:26,920 --> 01:14:29,000
I haven't done anything. 
Oh well, just copy something out

1149
01:14:29,040 --> 01:14:31,200
and you'll give it to them and 
they just play it. 

1150
01:14:31,920 --> 01:14:37,720
Yeah, well, and right at the as 
the music fades, Spike AD libs 

1151
01:14:37,720 --> 01:14:40,200
as as echoes he ad libs because 
it's not in the script. 

1152
01:14:40,880 --> 01:14:42,560
We got our money's worth this 
time, didn't we? 

1153
01:14:42,560 --> 01:15:02,060
We got. 
Our money's worth this time, 

1154
01:15:02,060 --> 01:15:02,500
don't we? 
I just. 

1155
01:15:02,500 --> 01:15:05,660
And occasionally, the little dig
at the band is always wonderful.

1156
01:15:06,700 --> 01:15:09,100
And they're very rare, few and 
far between. 

1157
01:15:09,100 --> 01:15:13,120
Because of course, you never, 
you know, the orchestra were, if

1158
01:15:13,120 --> 01:15:16,880
they were involved, it was da da
or they would be omners. 

1159
01:15:16,880 --> 01:15:20,360
They'd be voices off. 
But you would never make a joke 

1160
01:15:20,360 --> 01:15:24,000
at the band's expense because 
you know, they, the unions would

1161
01:15:24,000 --> 01:15:27,760
say, oh, it's, you know, even in
those days, Harley, Harley 

1162
01:15:27,760 --> 01:15:30,800
Radcliffe and all the guys that 
ran the union used to say, no, 

1163
01:15:30,800 --> 01:15:32,760
no, no, you have to treat the 
musicians with respect or 

1164
01:15:32,760 --> 01:15:35,000
they'll come out and strike. 
And it was that bad. 

1165
01:15:35,520 --> 01:15:38,480
But even though these guys were 
there and having the best time 

1166
01:15:39,000 --> 01:15:43,440
in this red hot successful show,
there was still there was still 

1167
01:15:43,440 --> 01:15:45,440
bound by rules. 
So it's fascinating. 

1168
01:15:45,520 --> 01:15:50,320
I mean, I just love that. 
Oh, there's also this big 

1169
01:15:50,320 --> 01:15:56,880
dramatic introduction that he 
uses a couple of times to a 

1170
01:15:56,880 --> 01:16:00,520
vocal. 
And the one that I want to say, 

1171
01:16:00,520 --> 01:16:03,800
and you'll know which one it is,
they introduced the singer. 

1172
01:16:04,240 --> 01:16:13,960
And this big introduction. 
My God, Segan, I've got it. 

1173
01:16:14,720 --> 01:16:17,240
It's from the whistling spy 
enigma The Whistling. 

1174
01:16:17,240 --> 01:16:43,600
Spy Enigma. 
Is it Webster smog pure? 

1175
01:16:43,720 --> 01:16:47,360
Webster smog pure and it's and 
he uses it again in something. 

1176
01:16:47,560 --> 01:16:51,480
Else, yeah, possibly Lurgy 
strikes Britain. 

1177
01:16:51,480 --> 01:16:55,040
I'm not sure. 
OK, also I just want to quickly 

1178
01:16:55,120 --> 01:16:59,960
touch on the goons Get up it. 
It would begin the shows as well

1179
01:17:00,200 --> 01:17:04,000
as end up until series 5, pretty
much. 

1180
01:17:06,160 --> 01:17:11,840
Lucky Strike, of course, is 
Evergreen, but also, and I don't

1181
01:17:11,840 --> 01:17:15,960
really know why, they've 
certainly within Series 8, they 

1182
01:17:15,960 --> 01:17:18,440
were changing it around the the 
theme tune there. 

1183
01:17:18,480 --> 01:17:22,920
There was old Comrades March. 
Some weeks there was Ding Dong, 

1184
01:17:22,920 --> 01:17:25,200
which is dead some. 
Great arrangement. 

1185
01:17:25,280 --> 01:17:32,560
I mean, yeah, that and when the 
the tapes and CDs started coming

1186
01:17:32,560 --> 01:17:38,080
out, repeating it in full, I was
in heaven because I always 

1187
01:17:38,080 --> 01:17:39,520
wanted to know what happened 
after the Fate. 

1188
01:17:39,560 --> 01:17:43,080
Of course, there's a a truncated
version on Last Goon Show of 

1189
01:17:43,080 --> 01:17:44,720
All, which is all I knew up to 
that point. 

1190
01:17:45,680 --> 01:17:48,760
So hearing it full with the 
choruses, the jazz courses in it

1191
01:17:48,760 --> 01:17:53,960
as well, that's a band rocking, 
you know, really rocking out. 

1192
01:18:30,560 --> 01:18:54,840
The. 
The. 

1193
01:19:06,480 --> 01:19:10,640
And what on earth has it got to 
do with anything that's gone 

1194
01:19:10,640 --> 01:19:13,160
before Nothing. 
Nothing. 

1195
01:19:13,360 --> 01:19:16,520
And yet it's magic, you know? 
And then quite often, straight 

1196
01:19:16,520 --> 01:19:22,720
after that, the piano would just
segue straight into crazy 

1197
01:19:22,720 --> 01:19:26,120
rhythm. 
And that would be, you'd get the

1198
01:19:26,120 --> 01:19:28,400
transcription services 
announcement over that and then 

1199
01:19:28,400 --> 01:19:31,240
down it would go, yes, that 
would just sit there forever. 

1200
01:19:32,520 --> 01:19:38,160
I I really enjoyed there's, 
there's a few shows where you'd,

1201
01:19:38,240 --> 01:19:42,120
you could clearly hear the cast 
or perhaps just, I don't know, 

1202
01:19:42,120 --> 01:19:45,920
Milligan and Sellers maybe 
interacting with the orchestra 

1203
01:19:45,920 --> 01:19:49,960
as they're playing Lucky Strike.
Yeah, Oh, you. 

1204
01:19:50,000 --> 01:19:55,000
I mean, the Milligan was a 
frustrated jazzer and was right 

1205
01:19:55,000 --> 01:19:58,880
till his death. 
So to stand, and there's that 

1206
01:19:58,920 --> 01:20:03,600
wonderful tiny film clip of them
in rehearsal and you see him 

1207
01:20:03,600 --> 01:20:08,000
just sitting or standing at the 
on the floor next to the 

1208
01:20:08,000 --> 01:20:09,600
platform, the orchestra 
rehearsing. 

1209
01:20:09,880 --> 01:20:14,320
And he's just lost in the midst 
of really fine jazz and I think.

1210
01:20:14,680 --> 01:20:17,480
You also see him do the same at 
the end of Alaska and Cheval. 

1211
01:20:17,480 --> 01:20:20,600
He sort of looks pensively to 
the heavens and I think he's 

1212
01:20:20,600 --> 01:20:23,200
just enjoying the band. 
Yeah, I know exactly. 

1213
01:20:23,200 --> 01:20:25,720
What you mean? 
Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. 

1214
01:20:27,480 --> 01:20:32,080
And it's I, I, I was concerned 
before we started recording that

1215
01:20:32,080 --> 01:20:35,880
we, we might, I don't know it, 
it'd be difficult to, to 

1216
01:20:37,120 --> 01:20:39,280
encompass everything. 
You can't encompass everything. 

1217
01:20:39,320 --> 01:20:41,920
We've, we've barely scratched 
the surface and it might be the 

1218
01:20:41,920 --> 01:20:45,080
case of coming back another time
and picking up from where we 

1219
01:20:45,080 --> 01:20:48,600
left off. 
I love to do that, but but time 

1220
01:20:48,600 --> 01:20:51,160
is against us. 
So I just really want to thank 

1221
01:20:51,160 --> 01:20:57,760
you for bringing your wealth of 
of knowledge and expertise to 

1222
01:20:57,760 --> 01:21:00,200
this conversation. 
My absolute pleasure. 

1223
01:21:00,200 --> 01:21:03,360
Thank you so much for asking me 
and please don't ever stop doing

1224
01:21:03,360 --> 01:21:08,040
what you're doing because people
of my vintage and beyond the 

1225
01:21:08,040 --> 01:21:10,200
Good show will always be in 
their lives and everything 

1226
01:21:10,200 --> 01:21:13,200
surrounding it and all of the 
shows and people surrounding it.

1227
01:21:14,360 --> 01:21:18,000
People want to know, but people 
want to just enjoy and you bring

1228
01:21:18,000 --> 01:21:19,200
that. 
So thank you for that. 

1229
01:21:19,680 --> 01:21:21,400
Oh, thank you very much. 
Oh, I'm blushing. 

1230
01:21:22,440 --> 01:21:25,160
And I just really want to 
recommend if you'd like this 

1231
01:21:25,160 --> 01:21:27,840
podcast and if why you're 
listening, if you don't like 

1232
01:21:27,840 --> 01:21:32,000
this podcast, if you like this 
podcast, it the the the CD. 

1233
01:21:32,800 --> 01:21:34,320
The next program follows 
shortly. 

1234
01:21:34,760 --> 01:21:39,360
It will be absolute catnip. 
In fact, not more than catnip 

1235
01:21:39,360 --> 01:21:44,560
crack cocaine because I mean 
just I'm just going to quickly a

1236
01:21:44,560 --> 01:22:18,320
bit picture box. 
And they were done by Len Valve,

1237
01:22:19,680 --> 01:22:24,760
who has has wished his his name 
to his real name to remain 

1238
01:22:24,760 --> 01:22:26,680
anonymous. 
But again, that was a lockdown 

1239
01:22:26,680 --> 01:22:29,600
project. 
And it was all done along 

1240
01:22:29,600 --> 01:22:34,040
radiophonic lines. 
Tapes, tape, loops, found, 

1241
01:22:34,040 --> 01:22:36,520
sounds all processed, no 
computers. 

1242
01:22:37,840 --> 01:22:41,840
Same with Doctor Who. 
It's just it's amazing and it's 

1243
01:22:41,840 --> 01:22:46,400
great to have there. 
Wasn't the story since debunked 

1244
01:22:46,400 --> 01:22:49,880
that the theme music for 
Pitchbox was played on Bones or 

1245
01:22:49,880 --> 01:22:51,320
something? 
That's. 

1246
01:22:51,320 --> 01:22:55,920
Nice, never heard that story. 
I mean, I knew that it was a it 

1247
01:22:55,920 --> 01:22:59,760
was a proper glass harmonica, 
which is a rotating drum of 

1248
01:22:59,760 --> 01:23:04,680
glasses played with the fingers.
But I've known people play it on

1249
01:23:04,680 --> 01:23:08,040
literal wine glasses set out 
like a piano keyboard. 

1250
01:23:08,280 --> 01:23:11,000
Yes, but you've got to move 
quick and you've just not got a 

1251
01:23:11,000 --> 01:23:15,840
sweat. 
OK, no, I think when mobile 

1252
01:23:15,840 --> 01:23:18,520
phones had evolved enough that 
they you could, you could have 

1253
01:23:18,520 --> 01:23:22,320
your own bespoke ringtone. 
I did that yesterday. 

1254
01:23:22,840 --> 01:23:24,760
Well, no. 
My my ringtone for the longest 

1255
01:23:24,760 --> 01:23:34,000
time was Salute to Thames. 
The famous Thames ident which I 

1256
01:23:34,000 --> 01:23:38,080
think is the best ident ever and
you've clued that on this read. 

1257
01:23:38,080 --> 01:23:41,760
A fusion London likely lads 
theme. 

1258
01:23:41,920 --> 01:23:45,440
But not the song, the one that 
was used in the 60s. 

1259
01:23:45,480 --> 01:23:48,440
And it's the 60s you. 
Draw the comparison because 

1260
01:23:48,600 --> 01:23:52,400
that's clearly a Ronnie 
Hazlehurst theme because it 

1261
01:23:52,480 --> 01:23:54,080
goes. 
So it obviously sets the likely 

1262
01:23:54,080 --> 01:23:56,560
lads to music because that's 
what he did with everything. 

1263
01:23:58,520 --> 01:24:02,680
But again, I just found it a far
more jolly. 

1264
01:24:03,680 --> 01:24:05,480
The 70s. 
Oh, what happened to you? 

1265
01:24:05,480 --> 01:24:08,320
I mean, that's important and it 
was important for that version 

1266
01:24:08,320 --> 01:24:12,480
of the series, but the 60s one 
was just a bit more jaunty and a

1267
01:24:12,480 --> 01:24:15,360
bit more establishing, if you 
like, and a bit more light 

1268
01:24:15,360 --> 01:24:17,520
entertainment. 
So I loved, always loved that 

1269
01:24:17,520 --> 01:24:19,400
theme and always wanted to 
record it so. 

1270
01:24:19,920 --> 01:24:23,440
We did and Left Bank 2, of 
course, which I which is from my

1271
01:24:23,440 --> 01:24:26,760
childhood. 
Such a evocative sound. 

1272
01:24:27,560 --> 01:24:30,080
Also, it's nice to record that 
talking about bum notes. 

1273
01:24:30,080 --> 01:24:32,560
It's nice to record that without
the bum notes and the bass and 

1274
01:24:32,560 --> 01:24:34,160
the guitar, which are on the 
original. 

1275
01:24:36,720 --> 01:24:39,400
In our quest for authenticity. 
I was going to write them out 

1276
01:24:39,400 --> 01:24:42,880
wrong and I thought no, because 
I'll get letters and you know 

1277
01:24:42,880 --> 01:25:16,930
what it's like. 
Do you know what the only thing 

1278
01:25:16,930 --> 01:25:21,370
I was disappointed by it or by 
not including which is my 

1279
01:25:21,370 --> 01:25:24,810
favorite, probably my favorite 
theme tune of all time. 

1280
01:25:26,170 --> 01:25:30,640
Man about the house. 
That's on volume to if we sell 

1281
01:25:30,640 --> 01:25:32,160
enough, it's going to be on 
Volume 2. 

1282
01:25:32,680 --> 01:25:35,160
And the reason I want to put 
that on is you mentioned Salute 

1283
01:25:35,160 --> 01:25:37,840
to Ted, Johnny Hawksworth, who 
was bass player in the Ted Heath

1284
01:25:37,840 --> 01:25:39,800
Band. 
And then did I think he quite 

1285
01:25:39,800 --> 01:25:44,680
often played bass when McGurk, 
Pete McGurk wasn't available to 

1286
01:25:44,680 --> 01:25:47,280
play in the Quartet Lagoon show.
He was a regular chord. 

1287
01:25:47,280 --> 01:25:50,600
Based player. 
And I met him not long before 

1288
01:25:50,600 --> 01:25:52,840
the end of his life. 
He'd retired to Sydney. 

1289
01:25:53,400 --> 01:25:57,960
And he used to play in a dive of
a place, businessman's sort of, 

1290
01:25:58,080 --> 01:26:00,440
it was called the soup kitchen. 
And literally it was bowl of 

1291
01:26:00,440 --> 01:26:03,200
soup and a sandwich and all 
these shiny suits. 

1292
01:26:03,200 --> 01:26:07,800
People sitting around in this 
cellar listening to just 

1293
01:26:07,800 --> 01:26:10,520
chatting away and in the 
backgrounds, this decrepitable 

1294
01:26:10,520 --> 01:26:14,240
guy playing the piano. 
And at one point, and I knew he 

1295
01:26:14,240 --> 01:26:18,680
was there and I'd said I wanted 
to meet him and I told him the 

1296
01:26:18,680 --> 01:26:21,080
day I was going I couldn't eat 
the thing. 

1297
01:26:21,080 --> 01:26:24,000
I sat and listened to him. 
And occasionally he would play a

1298
01:26:24,000 --> 01:26:27,960
little Phil on the piano, which 
was man, about the house. 

1299
01:26:28,480 --> 01:26:30,680
And I thought, nobody in this 
room has a clue. 

1300
01:26:31,160 --> 01:26:34,680
Nobody in this room has a clue. 
And then I sat and talked to him

1301
01:26:34,720 --> 01:26:38,880
for 5 1/2 hours after the place 
had closed the lunch service. 

1302
01:26:39,320 --> 01:26:42,800
And it was mesmerizing. 
I didn't talk about the Ted 

1303
01:26:42,800 --> 01:26:46,200
Heath days. 
I talked about his writing and 

1304
01:26:46,200 --> 01:26:49,240
he gave me, and I still have it,
a piece of manuscript with 

1305
01:26:49,280 --> 01:26:53,240
Salute to Terms written on it. 
And the thing that surprised me 

1306
01:26:53,240 --> 01:26:57,120
was it wasn't in 4/4 time. 
It was actually in 3-4 time. 

1307
01:26:58,840 --> 01:27:00,880
And that's another, that's for 
another story. 

1308
01:27:00,880 --> 01:27:03,960
That's for the After Dark 
version of good part. 

1309
01:27:03,960 --> 01:27:07,560
Probably OK. 
But but Johnny was a very nice 

1310
01:27:07,560 --> 01:27:11,800
man and very much of that era. 
And he said we there was just so

1311
01:27:11,800 --> 01:27:16,320
much work and we all knew 
everybody and we all just got on

1312
01:27:16,360 --> 01:27:19,400
and enjoyed life. 
And he said the music was 

1313
01:27:19,400 --> 01:27:22,440
secondary to that. 
And I think somehow that brings 

1314
01:27:22,440 --> 01:27:26,280
it rather neatly to the music 
that I love, which is 

1315
01:27:26,280 --> 01:27:28,640
represented on the on the on the
album. 

1316
01:27:29,000 --> 01:27:32,680
And the music that we talked 
about have been two major 

1317
01:27:33,520 --> 01:27:39,360
signposts in my musical career 
that I've always gone back to. 

1318
01:27:39,360 --> 01:27:42,760
It's always a place of comfort 
and sucker to me. 

1319
01:27:43,520 --> 01:27:45,160
And long may that be the case, 
you know? 

1320
01:27:45,160 --> 01:27:48,760
But man, About the House is on 
volume to, as are blankety blank

1321
01:27:49,040 --> 01:27:52,360
and one or two other things. 
People have written lists with 

1322
01:27:52,360 --> 01:27:56,720
hundreds, and I said, well, why 
do we want to play X? 

1323
01:27:56,720 --> 01:27:59,480
There's 500 recordings of it. 
But man, about the house, 

1324
01:27:59,480 --> 01:28:04,480
there's only two. 
Could I lean on you to try and 

1325
01:28:04,680 --> 01:28:07,400
recreate the Yakubaku national 
anthem? 

1326
01:28:07,840 --> 01:28:09,680
Absolutely, absolutely, 
absolutely. 

1327
01:28:09,760 --> 01:28:13,240
I'll do that. 
We'll have the we'll have the 

1328
01:28:13,240 --> 01:28:17,200
right combination of instruments
for sure, because the the big 

1329
01:28:17,200 --> 01:28:20,720
band that we use is the same 
size as the Goon Show band in 

1330
01:28:20,720 --> 01:28:25,720
its most inflated 5, four and 
four, but a lot more percussion 

1331
01:28:25,720 --> 01:28:27,400
and things. 
So yes, I'll definitely record 

1332
01:28:27,400 --> 01:28:28,120
that for you. 
Sorry. 

1333
01:28:28,120 --> 01:28:31,920
Align me Wonderful. 
So there's if people want to 

1334
01:28:31,920 --> 01:28:33,720
pick up this album. 
I presume it's available in the 

1335
01:28:33,720 --> 01:28:36,280
usual places. 
I think it's 

1336
01:28:36,840 --> 01:28:42,160
fasttunes.bandcamp.com is where 
you can get the stream or you 

1337
01:28:42,160 --> 01:28:46,920
can download the stream or you 
can order it on CD or on double 

1338
01:28:46,920 --> 01:28:49,560
vinyl. 
On multi colored vinyl no less. 

1339
01:28:49,680 --> 01:28:52,880
Oh, Blimey, right. 
And that's as I say again, that 

1340
01:28:52,880 --> 01:28:55,960
the title is the next program 
follow shortly. 

1341
01:28:56,120 --> 01:28:59,200
It's got the the clown from the 
test card, I think, isn't it? 

1342
01:28:59,200 --> 01:29:00,000
And. 
Bubbles. 

1343
01:29:00,040 --> 01:29:01,280
Yes, indeed. 
That's right. 

1344
01:29:01,280 --> 01:29:04,960
And and the the blackboard, 
Gavin, thank you. 

1345
01:29:05,120 --> 01:29:08,960
You're very much in demand 
gentlemen, always busy and 

1346
01:29:08,960 --> 01:29:10,560
travelling a lot I gather as 
well. 

1347
01:29:11,560 --> 01:29:15,560
So thank you so much for for 
sparing me 90 odd minutes of 

1348
01:29:15,560 --> 01:29:17,600
your time. 
And we will. 

1349
01:29:17,600 --> 01:29:20,360
We will definitely speak again. 
Indeed, I hope so. 

1350
01:29:20,360 --> 01:29:22,960
And for anybody who's listening,
go and have a listen to the 

1351
01:29:22,960 --> 01:29:26,440
Peggy Man Calamity Hour, because
I assure you, life will not be 

1352
01:29:26,440 --> 01:29:29,280
the same again afterwards. 
But you know what, we were going

1353
01:29:29,280 --> 01:29:30,880
to talk about that and we got 
completely sidetracked. 

1354
01:29:30,880 --> 01:29:33,720
But yes, it's something to 
behold. 

1355
01:29:33,720 --> 01:29:36,480
It's something it's it's quite 
indescribable. 

1356
01:29:37,120 --> 01:29:40,160
Literally I think in a class of 
its own and long made stay there

1357
01:29:40,160 --> 01:29:41,600
is how I heard it best 
described. 

1358
01:29:41,720 --> 01:29:45,240
There you go. 
Thank you so much indeed.