Yes, coughing. The well known sound.
Who invented coughing? Was it invented this evening or
whenever you're playing this record, we have a gentleman who
claims he invented coughing, so we asked him to leave his
deathbed and tell us all about his claim.
Mr. Ernie Front. Well, Sir, originally there was
no coughing in England at all. Do you mean that?
Yes, the Romans introduced it to England, but when they left they
took it with them. With it, the Saxon lung syrup
went off the market and the spittoon industry fell into The
Cave. I was laying in bed one night
and someone bent me round and back at a nap with a groba.
I went and then I started the cough.
I thought, Blimey, that's a good sand.
So I ABS and Rushes ran to the Patent Office.
Hello and welcome to Goonpod. Now with extra String.
My guest this week is a Returner, somebody that has been
on the show last year. Actually, it's Jason Krupa of
producing The Beatles podcast Hello Jason.
Hello thank you for having me. This is great.
This is this is 1 weird album and I'm glad to talk about it.
Well, yeah, Cuz last time you were here, it was to talk about
the Bridge on the River Y LP produced by George Martin,
right? From when was that 6262?
Yeah. And and obviously that featured
Spike Milligan, Peter Sellers, Peter Cook, Jonathan Miller and
uncredited, uncredited Dudley Moore.
Yeah. So this time around, we're
scrolling back a year to talk about the LP Milligan preserved,
again produced by George Martin and still considered a highlight
of Milligan's career. So before we get started on
that, can you just give a bit of an overview of what producing
The Beatles is all about? It's it's looking at the The
Beatles music from George Martin's point of view, from a
producer's point of view, and from a musician's point of view.
So I, you know, I used George Martin's perspective as as a way
of, you know, going into the music and seeing how, how, how
arrangements were put together, how the recordings were, were
built up step by step when I talked to musicians.
But, you know, a big part of this is also looking at his
career before The Beatles and the innovations he made in the
studio and the discoveries he made about how to use the studio
and in, you know, sort of creative ways.
And, you know, the goons are a big part of this.
Not the goons per SE, but Peter Sellers and and Spike Milligan
because he he really did do some very creative work in his
recordings with them. What are you working on it at
the moment in terms of forthcoming episodes?
Yeah, I keep saying, you know, I'm working on Season 2.
That's been sort of a piece meal thing.
I I have several episodes written and I've done interviews
with a number of people. I just need to put them
together. So that's that's coming this
year sometime. I can't, I'm not going to
promise when because they they do take a long time to put
together and I'm just one person and and they're like, you know,
many documentaries. I tried to to cram a lot of
information in but make it coherent and understandable.
You know, for people I think who who understand music, but also
for people who are laymen and don't have any type of either
recording or music background. Before we get started, just a
quick bit of housekeeping. So last week I had the very
great pleasure of talking to Clive Anderson and I hope you've
listened to that that show already, People if not get to
it. And among other things, we
talked about a short lived TV panel game that he hosted with
team captains Graham Garden and Jeremy Hardy and it was called
If I Ruled the World. Now, it didn't occur to me until
I was actually editing the damn show afterwards that obviously
if I ruled the world was Harry Seekins signature tune, by which
time it was, it was too late. But thank you to the to the one
or two or dozen people that messaged me to point out that
glaring oversight on my part. Anyway, I feel chastened.
I wanted to get that off my chest.
I have done so. Thank you for your time.
Thank you for your patience. Now let's talk about Milligan
preserved. So this this LP Milligan
preserved. What's your history with this
open? I think I probably first heard
this about 20 years ago. OK.
When I started doing research on George Martin's career and I,
you know I just realized at the time there was nothing you know
there was the six CD set that EMI put out that Mark Lewis and
curated. And I I forget what year that
came out. But you know I'd I'd begun
collecting 40 fives and LP's and everything I could find and and
reading through old music magazines, music papers like
Melody Maker and and New Musical Express and just digging up
whatever I could find and then just listening carefully to see
what I could you know determine about the recordings.
And then initially I made several trips to EMI archives
and and and dug up all the paperwork on these things So
Peter Sellers and Spike Milligan and you know all the comedy
artists and a lot of the non comedy artists that are sort of
important in that story. So you know Jerry and the
Pacemakers and Billy J Kramer and for you know for obvious
reasons they didn't give me The Beatles paperwork.
But yeah, I think, I think you know we have that pretty well
covered in other. Places, yeah.
It's been quite difficult to find a lot of information about
this LP. You know, I've got a number of
the Milligan biographies and it doesn't get a lot of, it doesn't
really get a mention. It gets passing mentioned in a
couple of them, but there's there's not a lot of data about
the making of this album or indeed really Milligan's
relationship with George Myerson.
But as I know you have managed to bring together a certain
amount of information, background information.
I've also had help in that from people like I just want to give
a shout out to former guest Paul Abbott, who thanks Paul, because
Paul actually supplied me with some newspaper archive material
which was really, really interesting and I just actually
just want to mention Paul. I'd like to give a plug to
Paul's podcast. Paul and his brother Gary do the
Big Beatles Sort Out podcast which is now in its fourth
series and at the moment. So what they're doing at the
moment is a is a what they call the big 60s sort out they're
they're going through they're going they're talking about
every British number one single from 1960 to the end of the
decade. Oh wow.
And kind of ranking it in terms of production, music, lyrics,
the whole shebang and it's really really fascinating.
And I've been I've been just happily listen listening to it
every Monday. I can't get Johnny Remember Me
by John Layton out of my head as a result of that podcast.
Although we've got a bit of a shooing that song unfairly I
think. But but no if you've got any
interest in The Beatles or or in 60s music in general do you seek
out the big Beatles sort out podcast.
So thanks Paul, but yeah so Paul helped me out with some
information and yeah there is information out there, but it's
it's it's not that easy to come by.
We know that the album was released in it was the 3rd of
November 1961 in the UK. Now there's a a newspaper or
what would you call that, a record paper called Disc, which
had a photograph in the October the 8th, 1960 edition photograph
of of Spike with Valentine dial. And it says that Spike Milligan,
seen here with Valentine Dyle, is making an LP for EMI to be
called Milligan Preserved. A&R manager George Martin
expects it to be issued in January.
OK, so that's that's October 1960.
And obviously it comes out over just over a year later.
And before we started recording, you said that.
Yeah, you said it was around. Well, as you call it the fall of
1960 that the recording of the album began.
Right. It's it's and it is.
I mean this may be I I just like to sort of put together dates
and see you know what's happening all around this.
But at the at the same time George Martin was producing this
he was also working on the Peter and Sophia album.
OK. So he, you know he did the
Goodness Gracious Me session in July and then from September to
October off and on he works on on the rest of the album.
Some of it's just backing tracks and some of it is Peter Sellers
coming in and you know, recording things.
And then interspersed with that are sessions with Spike.
OK, I wonder if they rub shoulders at the corridor.
Yeah, it's, I mean it's it's close.
It's not you know, the next day or the same day or anything like
that. But yeah, you know there's
session for sellers on September 20th and there's this, you know,
a week later, September 27th. Spike is in the studio, so.
Because we speculated when we when we did bridge on the river.
Why where the? Milligan Sellers and Cook and
more and Miller might have right walked past The Beatles at any
point. Bit too early I think, wasn't
it? Yeah, it's much, but it's much
closer. It's within days.
Yeah, yeah, couple of days. So a lot of lot of things
happening close together in in that year.
But you know, again it's like they're all sort of they all
sort of know each other here, you know, Spike and George and
Peter Sellers. So you know, there may have been
some interaction, but who knows? Is this usual for there to be
like a 12 month delay in getting an LP released?
The seller's album I Have a have a memo in EMI that was
circulated October 27th and it says the album will be released
November 25th and the the final tape to tape copy was done
November 2nd. So it was done, you know, within
a month. Right, OK.
So right. So it is unusual for for there
to be such a. Gap.
Very unusual. Yeah.
OK, I wonder why. And there, and there are two
more recordings done. There's more work done in 1961
just before the album is released.
The brand Windsor was cold but the the the plates were hot and
we're not long out of that that Lord George turned it in and he
he the voice you are hearing Is that a retired redundant Mr.
Aaron Quark. Mr. Quark.
Yes. I believe you have a very
interesting hobby. I believe I have say yes.
I studied the pronunciation of words I I learned how to
pronounce them. What words do you take most
interest in? Oh, the large grafter.
The family size. You know, I if I'd measure some
with a little slider, first one's about two and a quarter is
the right size for Deborah. Do you know they're sort of the
epitome of learning. So it must be it is, yes.
Could you demonstrate one of these words for us?
Yes, I'll OV posida OV posida. I didn't get some Irish ones.
The O apostrophe. Yes.
Oh, was it? What does it mean?
Oh, I don't know what it means. So I takes me all my time to
learn. So if we talk, if we're looking
at N61 as the album's release, just leading up to that release
date, what was Spike? I looked at what Spike was doing
in the sort of summer in autumn of 61 and he starred in ABBC
television one off sketch show on the 5th of September 1961
which was called rather cumbersome title.
Spike Milligan offers a series of unrelated incidents at
current market value and it was it was a 30 minute sketch show
which he wrote and it had unbelievably it had people like
Graham Stark, Valentine, Dial, Mario Fabrizzi, the Alberts.
So that's who did Tony and Dougie Gray.
Yeah, Bruce Lacey, Bruce Lacey, Bob Todd.
People that Spike was very comfortable working with.
And the Radio Times actually reported from the set of the
show. Corner Spike and ask how he
would describe the show? He answers.
Crisply chaotic, obviously. As one would hope.
Yeah, and also around this time Spike was invited by Bernard
Miles to play the part of Ben Gunn in Treasure Island at the
Mermaid Theatre at Christmas 1961.
And Spike was a bit hesitant about that because it was gonna
require proper acting and he was a little bit unsure of himself
but but it you know it was a barnstorming performance by all
accounts and and around again around this time with John
Anthropus he was putting together the play The Bed
Sitting Room and that would open in February 62.
And there's an interview that Spike gives in March 62 which I
have quoted from on previous goon pods and I'm not I'm not
gonna go into too much detail again but it's an interview we
did for the Daily Express with Herbert Kretzmer and Herbert
Kretzmer was a friend of seller's as well and Herbert
Kretzmer I think he wrote the did he write.
I think he wrote the lyrics for the theme tune for the Spikes
film Postman's Knock. I think I'm really saying that.
OK. But anyway, well, he.
He certainly worked on. Didn't he work on some?
He's worked on some Sellers tunes too.
Yes, yeah, but he interviews Milligan and it's a long form
interview for the Daily Express. And I just mention it now
because Spike, well, Spike was in a foul mood, OK?
And he, he made sure that Herbert Kretzman knew, knew
about it. At one point he says I'd like to
drop a bomb on the whole world. So, wow, that's a measure of
his, his, his worldview at that time.
But he was, he was in a really, he was in a real bad place, I
suppose, and he was complaining that he couldn't get any work.
And this is March 62, by the way, OK, But I just want to read
this little bit out here, Kretzmer writes in any other
terms than his own. Spike Milligan is a success.
Last year he starred in two MGM films, Invasion Quartet and
Postman's Knock. He bought out a long playing
record called Milligan Preserved and a book, a Dustbin of
Milligan, which became one of the country's best sellers.
His tenure as Radio Compare on Children's Choice was a runaway
triumph. Milligan appeared in the Mermaid
Theater production of Treasure Island.
He also found time to write a novel, which was Pecoon, and a
play which was The Bed Sitting Room.
Yet Milligan insists on seeing 1961 as a disastrous year which
saw him tottering on the edge of bankruptcy.
So so. Wow.
Spikes really got the the Black Dog around this point, and he
hadn't stopped working. Really.
He was. He was fingers in so many pies.
Yeah, tell me about So N61 the album comes out.
What was George Martin doing around the lead up to that?
What was, what was he working and what sort of projects was he
involved with? Well his year is, I mean he's
still he's still trying to get a foothold you know in the in the
pop market and he's still producing He's you know comedy
is obviously the most successful thing And he finally has his
first UK #1 which you're driving me crazy with the Temperance 7
in April and there's a huge, you know trad boom around this
period 606162. It sort of Peters out, you know
right around the time The Beatles come in obviously.
But he, you know he capitalizes on this and this.
I, you know I have said the Temperance seven are
anachronisms amongst anachronisms because they are
you know the other. You get a sense reading the
papers and looking at the footage and and listening to the
music that a lot of these people, you know, maybe we're
dedicated to the music, but there was this almost sense of
cosplay about it. Like they all have their, you
know, particular outfits and they kind of kind of look the
same. But the Temperate Seven were
just, you know, Edwardian frock coats and just all dedicated
eccentrics which perfect for George Martin, right.
And so he, you know he has that a little bit before that he in
6/19/60 he gets in trouble because of he he does a cover of
polka dot bikini and he copies the American arrangement a
little too closely and he gets he gets some Flack for it
publicly and is on jukebox jury basically having to defend
himself And and you know that opens up sort of this how the
how the British record industry was trying to copy American hits
because that was really the only way to stay stay current and
make money and they there there's this sort of building
tension of why don't we have more British artists in the in
the hit parade and it finally you know breaks in 6263
obviously with the The Beatles it's huge but there is this
growing change So you know he still he is still sort of having
to copy American hits to a certain degree but he is you
know he is finding greater success.
So the night that he finds out he has his first number one he
is recording beyond the fringe and that becomes a very you know
obviously very popular and iconic recording in his personal
life. He's sort of he's he's edging
toward leaving his first wife, and by the end of the year we'll
have moved into the end of the year.
Beginning of 1962, we'll have moved into an apartment in
London. And I don't know, I forget
exactly when their divorce is final.
But you know, he's he's already taken up with his secretary.
And of course, you failed to mention that all through this
period, I imagine George Martin was sticking pins into a voodoo
doll of Nori Paramore. Yes, yes.
And that that's a big, you know, big part of, you know, his his
envy of of wanting to have that success.
And you know, Nori was doing a lot of the same things.
You know, I think George was trying to do and wasn't able to
do success quite as successfully.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And, you know, like putting, you
know, getting half of a composer credit or putting your own
compositions on the on the B side or record so you get half
the royalties, you know, things like that.
George was trying those things too.
And but he, you know, he just didn't have that, as he called
it, a fireproof artist like Cliff Richard, that he felt like
he could just, you know, release a record and print money.
Yeah, I think it's fair to say that he had the last laugh,
really. Yes, I think so, yeah.
Wiping Nori Paramour's memory from the face of the Earth,
practically. So the LP Milligan preserved the
album itself. It includes 3 tunes which were
originally featured in Goon Show episodes.
And interestingly, I don't know, I don't know if this was just
coincidence, but all were shows from Series 8 and they were all
broadcast between January and February 1958.
So what I'm saying is, you know, he didn't just choose a song
from, you know, a series six episode and then a series nine
episode. They all, they were all from a
very sort of concentrated little period of time.
Yeah. And obviously we'll talk about
those as we go through the album now.
It's got a very distinctive cover and and and and a direct.
Front and back cover. Front and back, yeah, and A and
a direct Beetles connection, of course.
Right. And when I was at EM, I I found
the transparencies for the cover and and not just that photo but
several other shots from that session and uncropped.
So you can see Spike with his shirt off underneath the table
just just slightly just, you know, just just just cut off,
obviously, you know, cut off completely on the album cover.
Yeah. And the story was that, you
know, Spike nearly suffocated underneath the the glass Dome
because there's no air holes. It's a, it's a, it's a it's a
very distinctive picture photograph of Spike, sort of
grinning inanely. And it's a it's a bell jar.
Yes. Inside his head's inside.
Yeah. Yeah, Yeah.
And. And the photograph was by Angus
Mcbean. Yes.
Now, who's Angus Mcbean? Jason.
Well, he was a very well known photographer and and you know,
Beatles fans will know that he took the cover he shot the cover
of of Please Please Me. Did he do the the one that they
did it, the the one that turns up in the Blue Album as well of
the older Beatles in the same location?
That's a really good question and I should know the answer to
that and I don't. OK, I I don't think he did.
But I should look that up. Yes, I'm ashamed to say I don't
know that at the top of my head. During the process of
researching for this show, I went to social media and asked
if people have any fond memories or comments about this
particular album. And so during the course of our
conversation, I'm going to pepper the conversation with
them where relevant comments from listeners to the to the
show. OK, now Graham Lindsay Foote,
who's a previous guest. In fact he was a guest couple of
shows ago. He he talks about the the actual
album cover. He says I have a perfect copy of
this replacing a tatty one I sold in a week read skint,
moment some years earlier. I love that George Martin's
profile image on the back is a camel.
And just to explain, everyone on the back of the album sleeve is
addressed as Arabs. Or in in Paddy Milligan's case,
a veiled lady and George Martin. Yeah, is a camel is represented
as a camel and all the text is in Arabic, isn't it?
Yes, and it wasn't until yesterday that I actually
decided I'd I'd get a translation of that.
So I downloaded a a translation app where you can just point at
something that's written in another language and it
translates it for you. And each of the the little
blurbs is structured. It's structured as as you know
sort of surreal direction. So it says first enter Windsor
Castle, then enter the 1st St. on the right.
Smell the street on the left which leads to Spike Milligan.
Cross the street and take the 1st St. on the left.
Smell right, smell left and you will come to Valentine.
Dial and and so that's, that's the structure.
Each of them sort of does the same thing.
They have a different location and then it's specific to the
people who were on that sketch. And it's but it's all in Arabic.
It's hardly the seven pillars of wisdom, is it?
No, I was expecting something a little more, You know, I don't
know what I was expecting, but it seems fitting now that I've
now that we've got a translation.
Oh, absolutely. Apparently 3 tracks from the
album were banned by the BBC. I don't know if they still are
banned, but they they certainly were at that time.
The Sewers of the Strand because it was considered to be in bad
taste. I guess it's because sewers have
connotations. Sure.
And Coffer Royal again on grounds of taste, which I could
kind of get, I suppose. And Word Power was banned
because of advertising and I was trying to work out what what
specifically it could be advertising and the only thing I
can think is, is Webster's dictionary, would that be?
Yeah, I guess that makes sense. Yeah, I that that seems strange
to me. And yet the the sketch about
hitting people was not banned. Oh no.
Interesting. But with them, the with the the
gentleman who likes hitting people, he's got like, a
predilection for casual domestic violence.
That's OK That's OK. Hit parade, right?
Yeah, Hit Parade. Yeah, that's it.
John Antribus. Do you train for this hitting?
Oh, yes, Sir, 3 hours a day. Obviously I've got a little boy.
What? What about the little boy?
Well said. It's another story, isn't it?
What? What apparatus do you use?
Training. What do you hit?
Well, the missus when the boys at school.
I see. Well Mr. Screws as a layman I I
find this hobby horrifying and I I fail to see how anybody can
bring themselves to do it. So it's quite a nice I'll be
really you're look look look. And it's three points to me.
I said oh I I know I look. There you are, Sir.
Oh, just just on in terms of the album cover again it was voted,
said the LP cover for Milligan. Preserved was voted #25 on the
Enemy's 50 genuinely disturbing record sleeves poll from 2009.
Just thinks a little unfair. I don't.
I I I think it's hilarious. I know.
Yeah, it's disturbing. Now, in a column in record mail
from November 1961, Richard Attenborough of all people is
listening to the latest LP's. So he's got like this whole page
dedicated to his review of various new releases, including
Stan Freeberg, Bing Crosby, the International Pops Orchestra,
Peggy Lee, and of course, in this case, otherwise we'll be
talking about it. Spike Milligan's Milligan
Preserved and Ashenburst says This one I've been waiting for
almost too long. It would be quite impossible to
go into detail about all the crazy humor, but if you enjoy
Goonery, then here it is. Having heard it once, you want
to hear it all over again, particularly as you can't absorb
every shred of humor the first time around.
Delightful ballads like the sewers of The Strand will
certainly ensure that you're never alone when played to your
friends. A stirring song like Australia
will stir the blood and encourage you to emigrate
somewhere, and there's a lot to be learned from.
Fun, fun, fun. Ignore this one if you can.
Which you can, if you can. Which was music journalism back
in those days was very. I mean, I'm not saying that
Attenborough was a professional music journalist, because he
wasn't, but I think it's fair to say music journalism in that pre
Rolling Stone magazine period, the journalism was quite dry and
quite literal, wasn't it? Like record reviews as written
by your uncle kind of thing. Yeah, and and they would never
really give a complete pan. They would, you know, generally
damn, with faint praise. Kind of a That's a review.
Yeah, that's it. So I want to talk.
I mean another someone else on Facebook, another list there.
Martin Fenton, he talked about, he said that Milligan preserved
was a was a beautifully recorded early stereo job by Stuart
Elton. Mm hmm, yeah, he said Like it's
sister album, he said. He describes Milligan preserved
as sister album 2 songs for Sweeney Sellers.
He says like it's sister album. It sounds as if it could have
been recorded yesterday, bearing in mind it was done on nothing
more advanced than two stereo tape recorders.
The multiple spikes in stereo are remarkable feat for the
time, and he says Alton Light to record in mid sized stereo as an
unexpected consequence. Those albums and the stereo at
the drop of a hat decode very nicely into into surround sound.
Now that's a bit too technical for me.
Can you can you unpick all that please?
Well, I. I actually think this is
recorded on four track. All right.
I I again, I would have to dig out the paperwork from EMI.
But in in a number of cases George's George Barton has
written up the you know the paperwork for what what the
session is going to be and he'll request four track and he'll
request Stewart Eltham as the engineer.
OK, Which, you know, we had talked about this I think on the
River Wye album, but Eltham was was his preferred engineer for
this. And I think Stewart Eltham, you
know, again to give him credit, I think he showed George what
was possible in the studio. I think he was very innovative
and I think he taught not just George but a lot of people at
EMI thinks about how to use the studio.
And I don't remember when he began there, but he he was a,
you know senior engineer and you know he he see he he's the sort
of secret weapon of a lot of these comedy recordings.
Do you know I think it does sound fantastic.
The I always say that the stereo mixes of these comedy albums
this and the Sellers albums, the River Y and the Michael Bentin
album are really great examples of early stereo that you know
when when they're more complex recordings, they have this real
they have this great sense of a sound stage.
You know not not just sort of discreet left middle right but
how do you how to spread the sound across the sound stage in
an interesting way. So and and EMI did release A2 CD
set on Spike. What's the copyright date on
this? Maybe it was the late 90s, early
2000s, but the IT it it has the, among other things, it has the
entire album in stereo. Yeah, So if anybody's
interested, you know, seek that out.
Sounds great, Lots of detail and a real tribute to what George
Martin and Stewart Elton were getting up to at the time.
Sure. And OK.
And in terms of tracks on the album, it's a mixture of songs
and sketches, right? And and little, yeah, a couple
of little to throw away quickies.
So what? What tracks stand out to you in
particular? Well, I listened yesterday again
for the first time in a long time.
So it was, it was a nice refresher.
I've always liked good King Eccles, Sloss.
I guess that's how you pronounce that.
Yeah, with the overdubbed Eccles and the sound effects and you
know, the very familiar gunshot sound sound effect that shows
up. Another lots of other things.
Probably not just George Martin productions, but yeah, I like
that. But that's that's interesting
that because that track it's it's the penultimate track on
the the LP and I've got down here, I don't know where I got
this from. I've got that that track was
actually recorded 10th of August 1961.
I'm not sure where I picked up that information, but it's on my
notes. Yeah, it's well OK.
I think the I think sound effects were added to that.
The the whatever basic recording was done was 24th October 1960
along with something called approaching trends.
Is that on the album? There are few.
There are actually a few outtakes from this right that
are not on the album and radio salon, which I think neither of
those I think are, no. No, no.
Yeah, but so this good king echoes Las first appeared in a
Goonja in the string robberies from Series 8, and then it was
repeated, well, that the gag, if you like.
Well, the song was repeated in Series 9 in Ned's Atomic
Dustbin. So obviously Spike was very
taken with it and then proceeds to put it on this LP and it's
it's a group of it's Spike as a group of echoes bickering
between themselves and then Carol singing and and Spike also
doing a miserly Scottish as sort of John Laurie type Scottish
voice and as you say shoots at them.
What I what I picked up on this realism though was that at one
point the all the echoes are sort of talking amongst each
other and someone asks where Dan is and they start shouting Dan
and now are you familiar at all with Alan Partridge?
A little, yes. Well, I don't have to explain to
people very familiar with Alan Partridge that somebody shouting
Dan repeatedly is very, very funny.
Just. A minute.
Just a minute. No, you don't.
Damn. Damn, damn.
Damn. Damn.
Damn, damn, damn, damn, damn, damn.
You're not. Seeing me, OK Elisa.
Dan, what what other tracks do you do you see as highlights?
It's not. I can't say it's fun to listen
to, but I think it's it's interesting as as a sort of a
window into things that George Martin will be getting into very
soon. And that's how I'm going out
with a mountain or as it's listed in the session paperwork.
I'm in love with a mountain because he intercuts sound
effects with specific timing and they're very absurd.
You know it's like a like a circular saw and and who knows
you know what else but he's you know he's cutting these in in
time. It's not just random thrown in
they it's it's sort of meant to shock you and be unexpected.
But you know the next year he would do this with hole in the
ground and Wright, said Fred. Wright said Fred.
Yep. So he's cutting these effects
in, you know, comic effects in specific, you know, specific in
time to the music. Yeah.
And then if you jump ahead a few years, he's essentially doing
the same thing with Yellow Submarine.
Although those are performed live, those aren't cut in, he's
he actually has, you know, they have a session where they do
this and they they perform these in time with the music.
So this it's like it's not music specifically but it's it's timed
in such a way that it it sort of has AII lack the technical
language to be able to describe this but it it's sort of
functions in tempo with the music it it's sort of extra
musical I guess is is a good phrase for it and so and you
know this is and he and he does you know a similar thing with my
boomerang won't come back which is also in 1961 he's he cuts
effects into that So you know this is part of a larger thing
that he's you know he's experimenting with in these
comedy recordings. And and and so was this from
what you're saying, is this the first time that cutting in
effects was done by Martin? I would have to check to be
certain of that, but if it's not the first time, it's one of the
first time. Yeah, very early.
Yeah and and yeah I'm Walking Out with a Mountain was again
taken from a goon show in this case the White Nettie trade from
Series 8. And and in in that show it was
Henry Crown and mini Bannister singing I'm going Out with a
mountain and I'm only four foot three lengths play a big part in
Milligan's comedy don't they? Do you pick up on that and?
String in this album and just in general.
Oh, and Brown. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And on this track for the LP, Alan Clare is on the piano and
again listening to the show. And guest on the show, John
Dredge said that he thinks I'm going out with a mount of the
total classic and he seems to remember Michael Palin
specifically talking about the track.
And yeah, I think from I haven't actually got it to hand.
I hadn't I didn't have a chance to re watch it.
But I I know Michael Palin was on that George Martin
documentary, that BBC documentary from about 10 years
ago maybe 15 years ago. And he yeah, I remember Palin
talking about listening to Milligan preserved and and
having been very taken by it. An album that I remember very
well was Milligan preserved. I remember playing that at
Oxford and about a year later I started doing Cabaret.
It was the first time I'd ever done any comic performing of any
kind, and and that was a little inspirational album because it
was so free and different. And I don't know what it felt
like to make it or whether it was a complicated business with
spikes, good or bad days. But had some wonderful things in
very different from sellers I mean.
Well, it was. It was really your kind of
stuff. Oh, a song divine, sung by a
beautiful, tall, willowy creature called Miss Patricia
Ridgway. Despite her fair face, fair
figure and fair voice, she only had one small piece of toast for
breakfast. But when you consider what this
young girl has eaten in her lifetime, 43 whole bullocks, 81
prime Hereford cows, 1000 acres of potatoes, 207 sacks of
Spanish onions, 8 warehouses of brown bread.
I don't know if you've ever looked at the back of that LP.
All of the sleeveless were in Arabic I.
Don't remember that. That's right.
You couldn't get a very. Python.
Very Python. Let me put the microphone to a
tum tum so you can hear. As I was listening again
yesterday, and I've, you know, this registered before, there is
an absurdity to this that does, you know, obviously prefigures
Monty Python and it also strikes me as as very Marx Brothers in
some ways. There's some sort of surreal
humor and just word play that seems very Marx Brothers to me.
Yeah, absolutely. I I think and I've always said
this, I have gone on record on a number of occasions that I think
word power from this album is one of the funniest sketches
that millions ever been involved in.
It's certainly for me it's the stand out track on this LP and
it's it's Spike as Aaron Kwok which is the Spike doing his
kind of working class old man voice right and it's and he's
being interviewed by the mellifuous tones of Valentine
dial and Mr. Kwok is he's into he studies the the the what he
says he studies the the pronation of words.
He learns. He learns how to pronounce.
Right. We know from the very beginning
we're in trouble. And it's a hobby that started
during the Kaiser Wilhelm World War.
One War. Yeah.
And he discovered during a looting spree of bombed houses
and Webster's Dictionary. And it's just, I mean, I'm not
going to go through the whole sketch, but it's just to me it's
it's beautiful. It's up.
It means it's surreal. It's got the usual milliken
tropes, You know, he's got he, he always, he's also got a thing
for talking about legs and bad legs.
He's talking about Mrs. Kwok, his wife.
She's got bad legs. They're in awful shape.
They're thin and she's up every morning at dawn polishing the
dictionary with brass so and he has to beat her as it's made of
another example of domestic violence.
He has to beat her as it's made of crab broad and and as with
Spike Spike's got a real problem with finishing sketches, ending
sketches and and as in this one he he manages to end the sketch
by Valentine dial asking is there any record you'd like to
hear. And he chooses Jesse Owens at
the Berlin Olympics in 1933 which obviously has the wrong
year. Yeah, as well.
But no, I think. I actually think that's a great
way to end the sketch. It's just, it's just there are a
number of these where it just takes a weird left turn.
You think it's, you know, it's sort of go.
And again, that's a Monty, you know, I associate that with
Monty Python too. Like you know, a sketch will
just end or will just go in a completely unexpected direction.
Yeah. Well, they got that, of course,
from. Well, partly they got that from
Spike's Q5 series. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And and to a degree from benting from it's a square, square world
I think they've never really gone on record I don't think and
said that but having watched it's a square world, there's
some clear Python influences there.
Yeah, I've only seen a few of those.
I I think at the time when I was, I was at the British Film
Institute and I was watching things in their basement with
their permission, they there were a few episodes and they did
have that feel just like anything could happen.
Very absurd. Very over the top.
Yep, the mention of puns and word play.
I had made a note about Sewers of the Strand because it has
that whole section that's very, you know, very rapid fire.
And my favorite, the one I actually had to stop the
recording so I could laugh, was when he says.
Let me take you out of the squalor you live in, to be in
the squalor that I live in. To be That's pure Groucho Marx.
Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah.
I know he's used spikes, used
variations of that before instance I think Ah.
My darling little bride. We met by accident, folks.
She ran over me in a triumph. Her name was Beulah.
Mine was Jim. I was glad they call me Jim,
folks, because that was my name. I found out that she'd been
going out with an Irish dentist called Fuel My Cavity.
He walked with a pronounced limp.
LIMP. Pronounced limp, folks.
Oh, the worry, Tommy Gray. This gave me a strange
appearance as I was bald at the time.
The first time I met her was late early one morning in
spring. There was a heavy dew on the
grass. He'd just been thrown out of a
synagogue for eating during the sermon.
I told her, Darling, let me take you away from the squally living
and live in the squad I living. So we were married in the
spring, folks. We had the reception in the
pond. There was plenty to drink,
folks, and then off we went for sideways through those naughty
sores of the naughty strand will be a paradise for two, not one,
but two folks. Who cares if the atmosphere is
blue? Who said that 'cause there's
nothing wrong, is there? With a good old British boom
sideways, the song was on the strand with you.
I don't mean maybe. Sue was of the strands.
Interesting again. It's a it's a it's a song that
was debuted in a goon show. In this case, the the episode 10
Snowballs That Shook the World. I'm setting you up brilliantly
every time you look at this. Oh, absolutely.
Plan this any better? Well, it's the interesting thing
as well. So in that show, Blue Bottle
sings series of The Strand and interesting about this track and
there's there's an early mention of it.
So I say that you know the the sewers of The Strand, the The
Goon Show episode is from February 58, but there's a
there's an article in Picture Goer magazine from September 56
where it gets a mention. Hmm.
So it's been percolating, if you know what I mean, because it's
basically that the art. I'm not going to read the whole
article, of course, but it's it's talking about the fact, the
articles talking about I'm walking backwards for Christmas
being a hit. And it's also talking about
Milligan's contempt for the for the music industry, basically.
Something to do with George Martin and EMI and well, the EMI
cancelling Unchained Melody. Yeah, he he says.
It's Milligan's belief that a pop song is just gibberish with
a melody. It says that I'm Walking
Backwards for Christmas has sold over 150,000 copies.
It reached 4th place in the top 20 and is indeed still selling.
And Milligan's 4 minutes composing stint has earned him
more than 1000 lbs in royalties and has elevated Lunacy to a new
high in the music world. OK, And then he says.
Later on the article, he says talks about Spike working with
the likes of Eric Sykes and Goldman Simpson at Associated
London Scripts, and he's writing scripts for The Goon Show for
the Fred series. And also he's writing pop tunes.
And here are some song titles that Spike Milligan has in
preparation. I'm walking sideways through the
sewers of the Strand. OK, jump into a dustbin and
dance. Which was which was used in the
French. Dust and dance, yeah.
Yeah, the yellow rose of East Acton and a new novelty song
doing the Blin. That's BLI Double N, Which, No
idea about that. Yeah, OK, but there you go.
So there's a very early reference to the series of the
Strand there from 56. Wow.
Yeah. But yeah, it's a it's a great
tune. It's not a great tune is it?
But it's it's it's amusing. Particularly like you say the
middle the the the the middle sort of corny gag section if you
like, where at one point Spike struggles not to corpse, as is
his won't. There's also the track called
Another Lot Which. I was gonna mention that one
too. Yeah, go ahead.
Sorry. Yeah.
Well it's it's, I mean Spike. Spike loves lists listing
ridiculous things. He's done it in the goon shows
he's doing it here and it's an auctioneer.
Yeah. And he's just reading out a lot
for an auction and and I've got. I actually have the every item
here list them. I'm going to read them all out
of course, but there's just there's just a couple of
highlights. One anti burglar, self
preservator, hand bludgeon, sand filled and hand sewn in brown
leather. 2 bottles of imitation wax fruit.
One banana ruefully chipped. I love that.
That ruefully chipped once, once the property of the late Lord
Frederick Crepton Lee of Monmouth.
One cut glass Dove claret decanter with extra string.
There's the extra string. Yes, that's a string. 2 volumes
on how to wean vultures. One volume on how to leave
vultures alone. The 14 man mounted ivory monkeys
cut from single wrought iron elephant.
Tuscan signed Jin Yakamoto of Leeds.
One small brown pot containing another small brown pot and one
iron bound uncle frightener in three foot lengths, so there's
another length reference and so on and so on.
One Anti Burglar Self Preservated Head Bludgeon sand
field in hand sewn brown leather. 2 Cleverly and
Chondrick hand operated brown oak candle holders With
additional stirring. One stuffed Galapagos giant
turtle on wheels with clockwork revolving eye.
Poor bottles of imitation wax fruit.
One banana ruefully chipped. Once the property of the late
Lord Frederick Crapton Lee of Monmouth.
One Brown with extra string, one brown
leather and maquette fireside chair, One engraved Capac Field
Arctic tea cozy with additional string and computer. 1 brass
iron bound bedstead with spring head manipulator and foot
operated mallet. A Shimla lot.
Several and a half pairs of brown damaged curtains with foam
rubber lining. Well known in Belgravia.
One cut glass delve clarity canter with extra studying.
It's interesting as well because there's a there's an article
from the Daily Mail from July 1961.
I'm sorry to keep reading from newspaper articles.
Go. For it.
But I love that stuff. But this is this is really
interesting and the the headline is so no deal with Delias.
It starts one Ironbound Uncle Frightener in three foot
lengths. dot dot dot, some brown leather boxes filled with brown
leather boxes, dot dot .1 child's Hangman's kit brackets
Once used. These are some of the lots
offered in one of the zaniest auctions you're ever likely to
hear. And you will be able to hear it
in the autumn when Parlophone releases the Spike Milligan long
player Milligan Preserved. What you won't hear in the
auction room track is the background of Delius Music,
which Spike and recording manager George Martin wanted to
use. The Delius estate was approached
for the use of some of the composer's material, says
Martin, but they objected to it being used with Spike's voice
over it. Instead, some other ethereal
music has had to be specially written.
Milligan has written most of the material for the album himself,
and it promises to be as gooney as any of the goon shows ever
were. And then actually, the article
goes on to talk about, just talk about mentions, mountains, work
with Peter Sellers and then Martin's collaboration with
Bentin and the LP, So that's quite And and then Houston Off
and Bernard Braden later on as well in the article.
But it's interesting that I mean that music that plays behind
Spike as the auctioneer is beautiful and they wanted it to
be delious. Yeah.
And George Martin composed that,
that, that piece, which I I think this is the earliest thing
he he composed himself rather than farming it out to somebody
else. OK.
Which he he does that on the bentine LP and he, you know he
sort of scattered throughout these he'll do these these
arrangements. Yeah.
Which, you know, again says to me how close he is to a lot of
this material and and how you know how deeply involved he is
in in these projects. Former guest of the show Louis
Bath. He he said that he said another
lot might be my favorite thing that Spike.
If it did, I find myself adding with extra string to the end of
sentences on an almost daily basis.
And he says, and this is interesting, I also wish that
the background music by George Martin was available in its own
right. It's beautiful.
Yeah. And it's, yeah, it's a pity.
It can't be, I think, he said. He said later on on Facebook.
This is Louis, he said something along the lines of, you know,
with AI. Could it be separated from the,
from the dialogue that music now, perhaps?
I'll I'll give that a try. I've used that with varying
success on different things before.
I'll I'll see if that that works.
The other thing I was going to mention, which is completely
personal, is that as a photographer, one of the I do a,
you know, as a freelancer I do many types of photography.
And one of those is photographing pieces for auction
houses, contract work. And nothing nearly as absurd as
as what Spike is describing here, but it gets the tone of
that very well. Just just, you know, sometimes I
walk through the warehouse and I just like what is, what is this
like what we're selling this what?
So yeah, it it fits in perfectly.
I was going to say from the for fun, fun, fun.
And the listing spike interrupts.
Patricia Ridgeway's, you know, his his new girlfriend's singing
to talk about how much she's eaten and and he, you know.
In addition, 81 Hereford cows, 1000 acres of potatoes, 207
sacks of Spanish onions. The 1700 square foot of red
Jelly. I think 1200 weights of fish and
chips, yeah. Right.
Yeah. And then, but then, you know,
puts the microphone to her stomach and it's it's blood
knocks. It is.
Stomach yeah. And and I believe I, I again, I
I I have my notes, but I don't have the I the paperwork has
packed away for all this stuff. But I believe they're you know
they had to pay a certain amount to use that sound effect.
To the because it was a radio BBC Radio Phonic Workshop sound
effect, wasn't it? Right.
Yeah, BBC, Dick Mills. Yeah, had come up with that
sound effect. Yeah, yeah, just on that.
So fun fun fun is is yeah. Like you say it's Spike's then
girlfriend Patty Ridgeway Patricia Ridgeway singing and
and then Spike interrupts. I think the track was written.
I think I'm right saying the track was, or at least partly
written by Spike's wartime friend Harry Edgington, I
believe. And the the orchestra is the Ken
Jones Orchestra. Yes.
And Spike and Paddy. So they.
So he met her. She was an extra in the film
invasion quartet, which he'd appeared in, and that's how he
spotted her. And and they got married in as,
as we've discussed, they got married in April 62.
And the best man was George Martin, of course.
Right. Yeah, yeah.
And Paddy, she sings. And she's got quite a good
voice, Got quite good pipes really, I think.
And and George, the the EMI compilation that I mentioned a
few minutes ago, George Martin wrote the sleeve note for it.
And just a little bit of about that, he says.
Spike and his first wife eventually separated in a due
time. Spike fell for another lady who
was appearing in the musical Sound of Music.
Paddy was singing every night and the chorus is a nun and I
think Spike was dying to get her out of the habit.
Yeah, yeah, little. George.
Absolutely. Now there's a there's a track on
this album that's very personal to me as well in in as much as
so when my son was born, which is nearly 18 years ago.
Oh wow. In.
Fact by the time this goes out it will be 18 years ago.
You know, sitting around in the hospital after he was born and
and somebody had given us a like a a book to jot down thoughts,
hopes, you know for the for the newborn.
Just sort of like a really nice little sort of notebook.
And I picked up a pen and I just.
I don't know why. I just wrote My Darling Little
Baby. You know, sat there in the.
Hospital and it just entered my head and I just thought, I'd
like to write this down because it's it's kind of fitting now
he's now he, as I say, he's 18. He's not yet the Prime Minister
of England or the King of Italy and I'm hoping he's not.
He's not going to become a dustman in Chiswick Down, but
let's see. But you'll love him anyway.
Yes, of course, of course. And we mentioned Hit Parade
earlier, so that's written Co written by John Entropus, who
was a a keen Spike collaborator and he plays Mr. Screws, who
retired at 48 and his hobby now is to hit people.
Yeah, which it's fine. It's not.
There's no great shakes, particularly.
No, I mean, I I think, I think at the time it was probably, you
know, we raised, we raised more than an eyebrow now.
But yeah, it it's, you know, it's a tribute to sort of how
violence was so much more accepted.
Yes, at that time as it is now. The second track in the old
match, we haven't, we haven't talked about Coffer Royal with
Valentine Dyle again interviewing.
And this is another goon reference because Spike doing
the entire sketch using the voice that's known as the
throat. Voice right.
Which which always I mean it's I know it's him and I know he's
doing it and I've heard it you know multiple times.
But it's still, it's still like, wow, he's actually, he does
some, you know, such a variety of voice.
But that one is just so sort of where did that come from, you
know, well it. 'Cause you think you know, like,
we talk about the recording of Please Please Me the the album
and the last track recorded was Twist and Shout, wasn't it, when
Lennon's voice was completely shot?
And I imagine it wouldn't surprise me if he came out of
that whole recording session talking like Spike as throat.
Well, I'm never going to forget that.
No, yeah but he the, the, the, the sketch.
Basically it's about Spike, whose character is called Ernie
Flunt I think, and talks about how the Romans introduced coffin
to England and then it sort of fell out of use.
And then he, Ernie Flaunt patented it in the Victorian
period and he was appointed coffer royal.
And then there's lots of sort of mic flopping as he as he coughs
into the mic and there's also coughing right at the start,
which reminded me of the Goon Show episode The Last Smoking
Seagoon. So just throughout this album,
there's just goon vibes. Oh yeah, absolutely.
Yeah. And I think with, I mean all
this, there's this we haven't mentioned underneath it all,
which is the You Just Colony sketch, which is also very
funny, right? Right.
Yeah, I mean it's tempting to quote from all of these, but it
it really doesn't do it justice. You have to, you really have to
hear it all in context and hear the not just the voices but the
way he's and you know similar to sellers, he's, he's sort of, you
know, it's puncturing this sort of pomposity in this, these
pretenses. Yeah, and and in underneath it
all the the interviewer in this case is Graham Stark and he's
interviewing again Mr. Frederick Length, who's the founder member
of this nudist colony, but he's wearing a suit due to the
inclement weather and certain structural alterations.
Yes, I saw this nudist colony man, boy and a woman for many of
the years. Mr. Lengths, I noticed that you
claim to be the founding member. You are nevertheless wearing a
suit. I'm, I'm glad you noticed that I
I have in the last few years, due to the inclement weather and
certain structural alterations taken to wearing the garments.
But I must remind you that underneath the suit I have all
the necessary equipment for the the nudism.
Mr. Length What was the driving impulse behind this instinct to
revert to the pattern of nature? My suit was in bad nick.
I couldn't afford a new one. But as my body was in good
condition, I saw a way of economizing.
I said to my fiance, Green. I said, how about me and you
forming ourselves into a nudist colony?
And she took off her clothes and agreed.
How many members did you get? Oh, we didn't go for members at
first. There's just me and Reen getting
the hang of it, you know. I see, I see.
We used to go for the midnight runs.
How it was quite a belt, you know, on the heath, avoiding the
police and that. Oh, there's there's the song
Australia, which is fine. Yeah, that's got Bill Kerr from
famous for for being one of the cast members of Hancock's Half
Hour, who was also in Peter Sellers film Wrong Arm of The
Law. Spike's got a lot of connections
with Australia. His family moved to Australia.
He spent a lot of time in Australia throughout his life
and at one point he he he adopts the Echo's voice and refers to
Neddy. In this case, it's Ned Kelly,
though. And this?
And do you have the the recording George Martin did at
Royal Festival Hall of Spike June 11th 1961?
No. It's a reading of of, you know,
various bits of poetry and one of them is is Australia or part
of Australia, the lyrics. As this is Commonwealth
Technical Training Week by our different Prince Philip, I've
what I've dedicated a little unaccompanied song here.
It's called Australia, Australia Land of the Free.
I should sing it unaccompanied, except for myself.
Australia, Australia. We think of you each day.
Australia, Australia. At work.
We think of you in the morning and in the evening.
We even wake up at midnight so that we can think of you,
Australia. Australia, though, we're
thousands of miles apart, remember, if ever we chase you,
you've got already good a start. I think, yeah, I think that's
more or less, that's more or less all the tracks on the album
and we've kind of just we've not, we've not gone through them
in a linear fashion. But hey, doesn't matter.
It it holds together very well on the whole.
It's still very funny and yeah, highly recommended.
If you haven't listened to it, I think you can listen to it on
Spotify, you can listen to it on YouTube.
Now I did find a dissenting opinion from what I've just said
there in terms of a rather negative review of the album,
again from from disc, and this is dated 6th of January 1962.
And it says, says Milligan preserved disappointing in view
of the fact that it stars the arch goon of them all.
Maybe Spike needs Harry Seekum and Peter Sellers around to
inspire him to the heights of his comic lunacy.
Parts of this set are funny, especially the reminiscences of
the nudist Colony founder in Underneath It All and the Eccles
family's Carol singing expedition in Good King Eccles
Less. Others like Word Power and
Another Lot are singularly unfunny.
What? Not even that, and rather
pointless into the bargain? Well, Spike never argued that
his humor had a point I would say.
And Spike's talents for throaty coughing and indigestion effects
should at least have a humorous context and showcase to justify
their vulgarity. So at the rather PO faced review
of the album that is that. Is pretty negative.
I, you know, I'm surprised, yeah, I I don't recall too many,
too many reviews like that back in from the things that I've
seen in the early 60s, but obviously they exist.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So.
Any I mean anything else you want to cover that we've not had
a chance to talk about yet or any any further thoughts,
comments? I I mean, I think we've pretty
much covered it again, you know, I I look at this from the Jordan
Martin perspective and how this fits into his, you know, his
developing production aesthetic and his and and how he's he's
working out these ideas. And I know, I think these are,
these are important proving grounds for moving toward what
will eventually happen with The Beatles.
You know, he's gaining an A mastery of the studio and and
really is, I mean there's a, there's a great sense of play in
all of this, right? Yes.
Where you know it it it's, you know, pointless.
OK, well, who cares? It's it's to make people laugh.
It's to have fun. It's to experiment.
It's it's to, you know, no one else is putting things like this
on record, but. The the other thing, the other
thing is, well, that that review I just mentioned mentions the
word vulgarity and and applies it to the Coffin royal sketch.
But thing about this period, of course, there's only so much
that Spike could get away with, yeah.
And as you know, the years went on and as we get into the 70s
and the Q series and other shows that he was involved with,
vulgarity really crept in and there was a lot of jokes about
boobs and and and the like and just, you know, stuff like that.
And I've got no problem with that sort of stuff.
That's fine. But you know, this is 906061 and
Spike, he's, he's he's restrained by the mores of the
time. So it's much more about the the
silliness than shock value. There's no, there's nothing
really shocking on this album. It's built on a foundation of
silliness. And I and I think absurdity.
You know, absurdity. Yeah, that that's what I take
away from this in particular. I mean I think this is the
Sellers albums have a certain amount of that and I think you
know the the Michael Ben Teen album does too.
But this is really just like pushing the absurdity into the
four that that's just a big part of it.
Yeah. And and anarchic, you know it's
it's it is that sort of thing. The the, the ending, the finale,
really. You know, it sets you up and
then it just does this. Like Oh yeah, because it's rash.
Yeah, yeah. The the finale is an attempt.
Spike attempts to sing AI don't know what would you call a
rousing show Closer if you like. And it's and it's curtailed
immediately by some unseen assailant.
He's. Yeah, shoots him with an arrow.
That's it. That's one of those little
quickies, like Very Little quickies like on Is it Songs or
Swinging Sellers where he does George Gershwin.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.
But no brilliant album and I'm glad that we've had a chance to
do a deep dive into it. There's probably a lot more that
we could have said, but unfortunately there's not a huge
amount of background information on it.
Yeah, but I mean well worth your time.
I did find I don't have a copy of it anymore but the there was
the I said box 51 or 61 is a it was a yes compilation yeah of
spike material and in there is a picture from the sessions.
I forget who's in the photo, but it's it's, you know, it's a
posed photo somewhere in in EMI, in the in the control room, I
think. Yeah, I've seen, I've seen that.
I think I've seen. I've certainly seen a picture of
them sitting, like, listening to a playback.
Yeah, yeah, Milligan's laughing. I think Martin is just out of
shot. I don't recall, but I mean
basically, you know, to anyone hearing this, I think it's, if
you're interested, even broadly, you know tangentially in the
subject, it's worth hearing. And I think you know any any
Beatles fan I think should be digging into this album and the
and the sellers albums. Very important sort of
forerunner stuff, absolutely. And I'll be discussing these
things on the podcast in much less detail than we're doing
here and from some sort of a more, you know, production point
of view. Yeah.
And maybe next year, not this year, but next year, perhaps if
you're up for it, you could come back and talk about the Ben
team. Yes, would love to.
I love that album. I love that album.
Excellent. Well, Jason, this you know.
Thank you so much for bringing all your knowledge and
enthusiasm to this to this show. Thank you for having me.
It's, I mean, you brought a lot to me.
There are a lot of things I had not heard before, so this is
great. Well listen all the best as well
with the with the podcast and you're continuing endeavours and
and your your auction room photographer Thank you and.
And there will be, I will say, a little sort of promotion
beforehand as I'm working on another book with Ken Womack
right now. Oh right.
Solo Beatles in 74 and all the drama and weird activities and
and and projects that they have going on, which is I've learned
a lot, you know, just in researching this that had no
idea about before. Just crazy stuff.
So. Now, I haven't yet read the Mal
Evans book by Ken Wymack. Yeah, what's that like?
It's it's very in depth like it's it's difficult to say.
I mean it's it is about Mao and it I think it's what's the best
way to describe it. I mean, obviously tons of
detail, but you know, it it, it's, it's sort of a study in
the, you know, the dangers of fame and the dangers, you know,
these people who are very close to fame and and and really, you
know, paints a very vivid 3D picture of who Mal Evans was.
Yeah, in a very compassionate way, you know, and you'll, you
know, you'll pick up little things about The Beatles too.
But it's not, it's not specifically a, you know,
Beatles centric book. It's it's his story.
What always amuses me or baffles me?
I'm not quite sure what emotion it elicits, but the fact that
all through the period of The Beatles and post Beatles where
Mal Evans was working with them for them.
You know, both he and Neil Aspinall were on a salary of
something like, what was it, 17 lbs a week or something like
that? It was ridiculous.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no retainer.
No. Anything.
Just no. Yeah, that's that's part of the
story too. It's it's it's, you know, it it
really does pull back the curtain for what was going on
behind the scenes in in The Beatles.
World. Oh, and well, the.
I mean, the 74 book sounds fascinating as well, because
that's my year of birth. Oh, OK.
So that, yeah, I'll be look forward to, look forward to
seeing that when it comes out. But yeah, Jason, again, thank
you. And we'll catch up again next
year perhaps. Absolutely.
I'll talk to you soon all. Right, that's become a marsh.