1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:02,440 Tell me what you think being there is about Peter. 2 00:00:02,520 --> 00:00:05,920 Oh, God, no. I know. 3 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:08,000 I've been asked that question. You know you have. 4 00:00:08,280 --> 00:00:11,000 Yes, I have. You know, I haven't heard a guy. 5 00:00:11,960 --> 00:00:14,560 I think it's all about. I have to get serious here. 6 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:15,920 Yes, please. Yeah, very serious. 7 00:00:15,920 --> 00:00:20,240 I think it's about the. I think it's Jezzy Kaczynski's 8 00:00:20,240 --> 00:00:26,000 comment on power and corruption and the triumph of the innocent 9 00:00:26,000 --> 00:00:29,080 man. As Jesus Christ said, you know, 10 00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:36,120 the, the, the, the, the, the triumph of the, the simple man 11 00:00:36,840 --> 00:00:40,000 over over power, over wealth, over corruption. 12 00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:44,280 And it's probably a comment on that because you can't get any 13 00:00:44,280 --> 00:00:46,840 more a person more simple than chance. 14 00:00:47,040 --> 00:00:50,120 You consider it a comedy in a way. 15 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:52,920 I never sort of. It's not one of those Goffle 16 00:00:52,920 --> 00:00:53,760 comedies. No. 17 00:00:53,760 --> 00:00:56,560 Is it the most satisfying job of acting you've done on on the 18 00:00:56,560 --> 00:00:57,720 screen? The most difficult. 19 00:00:57,720 --> 00:01:00,080 The most difficult, Yes. Except for working with that 20 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:05,560 incredible actor Melvin Douglas, and who I've admired for years, 21 00:01:05,680 --> 00:01:08,120 absolute years. So you're both Academy Award 22 00:01:08,120 --> 00:01:09,400 nominees? Yes. 23 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:12,640 Have you your speech prepared? And the winner is Peter Sellers. 24 00:01:12,640 --> 00:01:13,600 What are you going to say? Yeah. 25 00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:14,600 Yeah. I'm not going there. 26 00:01:15,200 --> 00:01:16,880 Oh, you're not. No, no, no. 27 00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:52,680 The. Hello and welcome to Goon Pod. 28 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:59,480 So with 2025 being the centenary of Peter Sellers, he was born 29 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:03,120 100 years ago this year. We will be obviously marking the 30 00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:05,720 occasion with a a bunch of special shows. 31 00:02:06,360 --> 00:02:09,680 And this week we're going to be talking about a film which which 32 00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:14,160 many consider to be his best. Although Doctor Strangelove may 33 00:02:14,160 --> 00:02:17,920 well be entitled to say hold my beer, it is being there from 34 00:02:17,920 --> 00:02:21,200 1979. And joining me this week to talk 35 00:02:21,200 --> 00:02:25,160 about it is podcaster Anthony Rotunno. 36 00:02:26,040 --> 00:02:26,920 Hello. Hello. 37 00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:28,840 Very good pronunciation. Excellent. 38 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:31,560 Rotunno. Rotunno. 39 00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:34,560 If you really want to get Italian with it. 40 00:02:34,560 --> 00:02:35,640 Absolutely. It's nice to be here. 41 00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:37,080 Thank you. Thank you. 42 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:41,600 I said podcaster. So I I'm aware of you primarily 43 00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:46,760 from Glass Onion, which is a, a John Lennon dedicated podcaster 44 00:02:48,320 --> 00:02:51,600 and film Gold, which is just your films that you like 45 00:02:52,280 --> 00:02:54,600 essentially, yeah. Yeah, sort of veering towards 46 00:02:54,600 --> 00:02:56,520 classics. I like the 70s period of 47 00:02:56,560 --> 00:02:59,400 Hollywood and Hitchcock in the 50s so. 48 00:02:59,720 --> 00:03:05,440 But I do do newer stuff as well. I absolutely love 70s films. 49 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:07,960 That's probably my favorite decade for films. 50 00:03:08,240 --> 00:03:11,080 And I love Hitchcock as well. So if you combine them both, I 51 00:03:11,120 --> 00:03:16,200 mean frenzy, what a film and. I remember the seam of the 52 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:17,240 potatoes. Do you remember that? 53 00:03:17,920 --> 00:03:19,960 The potatoes, yes. And the leg is a leg hanging 54 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:21,360 out. Yeah, yeah. 55 00:03:22,720 --> 00:03:25,960 And you got, you got, you got Bernard Cribbins with a potty 56 00:03:25,960 --> 00:03:27,040 mouth as well. Yeah, absolutely. 57 00:03:27,400 --> 00:03:31,960 Seem to remember OK, but we're not talking about frenzy, we're 58 00:03:31,960 --> 00:03:37,120 talking about being there. And I'd like to to set us off 59 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:40,480 with just a sort of a summary. A short pithy was not that pithy 60 00:03:40,520 --> 00:03:44,440 actually, but I'll make it as quick as I can, Anthony, sort of 61 00:03:44,440 --> 00:03:47,200 a summary of the film and then you and I can dive in and start 62 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:52,000 just talking about it. OK, OK, so Chance is a 63 00:03:52,160 --> 00:03:54,920 middle-aged man with the mental age of a child. 64 00:03:55,560 --> 00:03:59,680 He was a foundling taken in by a wealthy man, presumably some 50 65 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:03,280 plus years ago, and has never ventured outside of Mr. Jennings 66 00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:07,400 Washington DC townhouse. He's content to spend his days 67 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:09,720 gardening and watching television indiscriminately. 68 00:04:10,200 --> 00:04:13,680 He's pale as a mushroom as well as being emotionally colourless, 69 00:04:14,120 --> 00:04:16,440 and he looks like he just stepped out of a trunk wearing a 70 00:04:16,440 --> 00:04:20,959 beautifully cut 1928 suit. When his benefactor dies and 71 00:04:20,959 --> 00:04:24,360 Louise, the maid who effectively bought Chance up, leaves the 72 00:04:24,360 --> 00:04:26,880 house for good, it's not long before Chance is forced to do 73 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:30,200 the same. And this new Adam, soon to meet 74 00:04:30,200 --> 00:04:34,200 his Eve, steps out into the unforgiving and totally alien 75 00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:36,600 landscape of the Washington DC projects. 76 00:04:37,320 --> 00:04:40,080 Had fate not intervened, Chance's life would barely have 77 00:04:40,080 --> 00:04:43,760 been worth an hour's purchase as he encounters a violent St. gang 78 00:04:44,080 --> 00:04:46,800 and has no means to buy food or find shelter. 79 00:04:47,320 --> 00:04:51,560 But just by Chance, he happens to be mildly injured by a 80 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:54,960 limousine containing the wife of Ben Rand, the richest man in 81 00:04:54,960 --> 00:04:58,280 America. So that was handy and and she 82 00:04:58,280 --> 00:05:02,440 insists that Chance accompany her back to her home, which is a 83 00:05:02,440 --> 00:05:04,480 mansion roughly the size of Cuba. 84 00:05:04,840 --> 00:05:08,560 Her elderly husband is dying from a rare form of anemia, but 85 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:12,120 he meets Chance, who's now designated Chauncey Gardener 86 00:05:12,120 --> 00:05:17,000 after a misunderstanding at the first of dozens, and takes to 87 00:05:17,000 --> 00:05:21,080 him immediately. Rand, his wife and seemingly 88 00:05:21,080 --> 00:05:23,440 everyone else in the house believe Chance to be some sort 89 00:05:23,440 --> 00:05:26,560 of Oracle, interpreting his every banal utterance as 90 00:05:26,560 --> 00:05:29,680 something deep and profound. But we the audience know that 91 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:32,120 Chance, far from being gifted with intellectual and 92 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:35,080 philosophical heft, doesn't really have a clue what anyone 93 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:37,720 is talking about most of the time, and when pressed to 94 00:05:37,720 --> 00:05:40,640 comment on something, reaches for the comforting certainty of 95 00:05:40,640 --> 00:05:44,120 amateur horticulture. Despite all this, by the end of 96 00:05:44,120 --> 00:05:47,320 the film he's being talked up as a possible presidential 97 00:05:47,320 --> 00:05:50,400 candidate. Being there is a satire on a 98 00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:54,120 society in which mindlessness can be an asset as long as the 99 00:05:54,120 --> 00:05:58,600 possessor of this virtue appears to be honest and sincere, which 100 00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:02,760 is quite a quaint concept now, coupled coupled with an American 101 00:06:02,760 --> 00:06:06,520 hunger for a symbol of innocence in the wake of Watergate and 102 00:06:06,520 --> 00:06:08,960 Vietnam. So there we go. 103 00:06:08,960 --> 00:06:12,720 So thank you for listening and I'll be back in next week We've. 104 00:06:13,280 --> 00:06:14,440 Got nothing else to say? Now that's. 105 00:06:14,840 --> 00:06:17,600 Fine, No, thank you. Thank you for for your patience 106 00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:20,880 there, Anthony. But yeah, that that that sort of 107 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:22,680 sets sets us up if you like. So. 108 00:06:23,000 --> 00:06:24,400 So what's your history with this film? 109 00:06:24,400 --> 00:06:25,520 Why? Why did you want to talk about 110 00:06:25,520 --> 00:06:28,880 this film? I saw this probably about 2000 111 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:33,480 and eight, 2009. And at that time I was quite 112 00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:37,800 involved in activist circles in London, a sort of activist slash 113 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:39,640 conspiracy crowd, I suppose you'd call it. 114 00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:44,040 And the I was told you got to watch this film, especially the 115 00:06:44,040 --> 00:06:47,280 end. We won't go straight to the end 116 00:06:47,280 --> 00:06:50,680 now, but the not, not actually the incident with the water. 117 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:53,240 There's something else at the end that the conspiracy crowd 118 00:06:53,240 --> 00:06:54,280 really like. Oh. 119 00:06:54,320 --> 00:06:55,160 I know what you're talking about. 120 00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:59,360 Yeah, we'll come to that. So I've probably seen it maybe 121 00:06:59,880 --> 00:07:03,400 four times I think. And I think the last couple of 122 00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:05,880 times I've seen it, I I just kind of thought that the concept 123 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:07,600 was more enjoyable than the film. 124 00:07:08,680 --> 00:07:12,000 But funnily enough, you know, when you sit down and you're 125 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:14,560 preparing for a podcast, you prepare and you watch it in a 126 00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:17,240 slightly different way. And I thought, is this going to 127 00:07:17,240 --> 00:07:20,120 be better or worse than normal if I watch it relax with a real 128 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:22,720 analytical eye? And I actually found it was 129 00:07:22,720 --> 00:07:25,160 better. And then I'll be honest, I've 130 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:27,680 watched a couple of analysis videos because this is so right 131 00:07:27,680 --> 00:07:30,000 for analysis that it's interesting to see what other 132 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:32,640 people say. So probably seen it four times I 133 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:36,320 think now. OK, I probably, I'm probably 134 00:07:36,320 --> 00:07:38,440 more or less the same. I think probably seen it four 135 00:07:38,440 --> 00:07:39,520 times. I saw it first. 136 00:07:40,800 --> 00:07:44,560 So when I got into the games, I was devouring and buying up 137 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:47,720 everything I could that had a game connection in the late 80s, 138 00:07:47,720 --> 00:07:51,200 early 90s and I got avhs of being there. 139 00:07:52,040 --> 00:07:56,360 And I was whatever age it would have been 15 or whatever, 16 and 140 00:07:56,360 --> 00:08:00,640 it and and it was it just it left me flat when I first 141 00:08:00,640 --> 00:08:03,520 watched it because I'm thinking, come on, where's where's the 142 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:05,200 buffer laughs? This is Peter Sellers. 143 00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:06,440 Come on, you know, come on, come on. 144 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:09,280 You know, it's not that sort of film. 145 00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:11,200 I don't. I wouldn't really say it was a 146 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:14,960 comedy. It's a it's a satirical drama. 147 00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:16,120 There you go. It's a new genre. 148 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:20,560 But but no. So I saw, I saw it when I was 149 00:08:20,920 --> 00:08:26,760 teenager kid and then I probably didn't see it again till maybe 150 00:08:26,760 --> 00:08:28,880 10 years ago. And then it came out on Blu-ray 151 00:08:29,960 --> 00:08:32,240 about five years ago. I bought that, watched it again 152 00:08:32,600 --> 00:08:34,400 and then obviously watched it for this. 153 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:38,240 And you're right though, watching it with a more 154 00:08:38,240 --> 00:08:41,720 analytical eye as I, as I did this time around it actually, I 155 00:08:41,720 --> 00:08:43,320 actually got more out of it, I think. 156 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:46,880 Do you know do you know much about how this came to be made? 157 00:08:47,280 --> 00:08:50,080 I just know that it was a pet project of his for years. 158 00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:53,360 Was it up to even 10 years or is that too long? 159 00:08:54,920 --> 00:08:59,400 I think I think I'm right in saying now I should have checked 160 00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:01,560 this. Double check this it's either 71 161 00:09:01,560 --> 00:09:07,720 or 73 that the The novel was published by Josie Kaczynski. 162 00:09:07,840 --> 00:09:10,280 Yeah, somewhere in my vast notes, but I can't find it. 163 00:09:10,280 --> 00:09:12,680 It's 1970, maybe 71, something like that. 164 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:16,240 Something like that. Salas reads it and it's not 165 00:09:16,240 --> 00:09:17,760 really a novel, it's more of a novella. 166 00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:20,920 It's like 80 pages, something like that. 167 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:28,600 And Salas was always banging on about about himself being a bit 168 00:09:28,600 --> 00:09:32,560 of a cipher, being a bit of an not that he described himself as 169 00:09:32,560 --> 00:09:37,200 this, but kind of being an empty vessel, having having having no 170 00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:40,200 real self. OK means he famously said on the 171 00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:42,640 Muppet Show to Kermit the Frog, what was it? 172 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:46,800 He said? There is no real me. 173 00:09:46,800 --> 00:09:50,920 I had it surgically removed. And he was always going on about 174 00:09:50,920 --> 00:09:52,640 that. And, and I think he identified 175 00:09:52,640 --> 00:09:56,360 immediately with the character in, in, in being there. 176 00:09:56,760 --> 00:10:01,680 He contacts Kaczynski and basically says I am chance. 177 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:05,000 I think he writes, I think he writes some letters signing 178 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:06,880 himself as Chauncey Gardner and stuff like that. 179 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:11,560 But but, but by the in the in the early 70s, he can't get 180 00:10:11,560 --> 00:10:15,480 arrested really. So as he makes a string of of of 181 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:19,720 commercially disastrous films, some of some of which don't even 182 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:23,440 get released officially, you know, so he can't get the he 183 00:10:23,440 --> 00:10:28,240 can't get it this bankrolled. He contacts Hal Ashby, but but 184 00:10:28,240 --> 00:10:31,280 even at that point, Ashby himself wasn't that bankable 185 00:10:31,400 --> 00:10:32,360 yet. OK. 186 00:10:32,960 --> 00:10:40,160 But by by 78, Sellers had become a big mega star again because of 187 00:10:40,160 --> 00:10:45,520 the the Pink Panther films, OK. And Ashby had made Coming Home 188 00:10:46,720 --> 00:10:48,920 that that's a Vietnam film, wasn't it? 189 00:10:48,920 --> 00:10:52,040 It's about yeah, post Vietnam. Jane Fonda and Jon Voight. 190 00:10:52,120 --> 00:10:53,160 Yeah, it's not bad. That's right. 191 00:10:53,160 --> 00:10:55,360 It's not one of my favorite Vietnam War films, but it's 192 00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:58,240 good. Yeah, so so he was, you know, he 193 00:10:58,240 --> 00:11:01,920 was hot property. So they both were able to come 194 00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:06,040 together and get the financing to make this film. 195 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:11,760 And it began filming on the 15th of January 1979 and wrapped on 196 00:11:11,760 --> 00:11:15,840 the 18th of April. And so and so there we go. 197 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:19,160 So they said so the film was made, it comes out and it is a a 198 00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:22,840 commercial and a critical success. 199 00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:29,320 It's it's Oscar nominated Melvin Douglas who plays Rand, wins 200 00:11:29,320 --> 00:11:32,880 best supporting actor. Sellers is up for best actor, 201 00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:37,160 but he loses to Dustin Hoffman for Kramer versus Kramer. 202 00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:40,440 And it is that that's a great performance actually in, I don't 203 00:11:40,440 --> 00:11:41,800 know if you've seen Kramer versus Kramer. 204 00:11:41,800 --> 00:11:43,560 Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's one I saw actually when I 205 00:11:43,560 --> 00:11:46,400 was quite young, so probably, I'd probably appreciate it more 206 00:11:46,400 --> 00:11:49,040 if I watched it again. Too many films, you know. 207 00:11:50,240 --> 00:11:55,080 I refuse to believe that I beat Jack Lemmon, that I beat Al 208 00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:57,720 Pacino, that I beat Peter Sellers. 209 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:01,320 I refuse to believe that Robert Duvall lost. 210 00:12:03,520 --> 00:12:05,760 We are a part of an artistic family. 211 00:12:08,160 --> 00:12:12,320 There are 60,000 actors in this Academy, pardon me, in the 212 00:12:12,320 --> 00:12:15,520 Screen Actors Guild, and probably 100,000 in Equity. 213 00:12:16,120 --> 00:12:19,920 And most actors don't work, and a few of us are so lucky to have 214 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:23,400 a chance. Talking of Hoffman, I might want 215 00:12:23,400 --> 00:12:27,320 to talk about Rain Man in passing later on because there's 216 00:12:27,800 --> 00:12:31,880 definitely a few similarities. I thought you when you said 217 00:12:31,880 --> 00:12:33,880 Hoffman, I thought, you know, Sellers made a film called 218 00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:35,120 Hoffman. Oh, does he? 219 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:38,360 Oh yeah. Yeah, haven't seen him. 19701970 220 00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:44,880 in which he plays a a sociopath. It's an interesting film with an 221 00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:47,960 interesting ending that they wouldn't make today, Let's put 222 00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:54,880 it that way. OK, so, so I I have issues with 223 00:12:54,880 --> 00:12:58,640 it and I know. And my problem is that I 224 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:02,800 overthink things and I just seemed and I know it's a satire 225 00:13:02,800 --> 00:13:08,040 and it's not real life, but the the credulity of everybody who 226 00:13:08,040 --> 00:13:11,720 meets chance. Nobody says nobody. 227 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:15,760 Nobody says hang on. Yeah, I I can see why you would 228 00:13:15,760 --> 00:13:18,040 be put off by it. I can see why someone would be 229 00:13:18,040 --> 00:13:19,920 put off by it because it's ridiculous. 230 00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:23,880 But I think that's where the comedy comes in. 231 00:13:24,360 --> 00:13:27,640 But it's not gag. There's not really gags in this 232 00:13:27,640 --> 00:13:30,520 film except all for all his unintentional comedy about the 233 00:13:30,520 --> 00:13:32,240 elevator being a small room and stuff. 234 00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:35,800 Yeah. But yeah, there's a there's a 235 00:13:35,800 --> 00:13:40,320 satirical aspect. It's it's a heightened truth, if 236 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:42,280 you like, I would say. Do you? 237 00:13:42,320 --> 00:13:47,680 Do you get any hints of Forrest Gump about the character? 238 00:13:47,680 --> 00:13:50,080 Yeah, I've written down Rain Man and Forrest Gump because I 239 00:13:50,080 --> 00:13:53,520 thought, yeah, I was thinking, yeah, I don't really like 240 00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:54,920 Forrest. I've only seen it once. 241 00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:58,120 I was so gutted that year that Pulp Fiction, I'm sure 242 00:13:58,160 --> 00:14:00,560 Redemption didn't get all the main awards. 243 00:14:00,640 --> 00:14:02,880 Yeah, yeah, No, definitely. There's a little bit. 244 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:06,680 Yeah, Yeah. I think the voice is really 245 00:14:06,680 --> 00:14:09,920 interesting because he he based the voice on Stan Laurel, didn't 246 00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:12,000 he? Yes. 247 00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:14,560 And it's that kind of quite monotone. 248 00:14:14,920 --> 00:14:17,840 Yeah, the the bit of the film where I found it dragged a bit 249 00:14:17,840 --> 00:14:19,840 was around the middle where they're just gardening. 250 00:14:19,840 --> 00:14:24,720 Stuff just kept going on and on. I think later on when he starts 251 00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:27,920 to be to rise to prominence. But I think it's funny, like 252 00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:30,400 when someone says there's a rumour, that rumour that he 253 00:14:30,400 --> 00:14:33,400 speaks 8 languages. And I mean, that's just come out 254 00:14:33,400 --> 00:14:36,640 of nothing, but it's just sort of showing you what people are 255 00:14:36,640 --> 00:14:37,760 like. If loads of people get 256 00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:40,560 interested in someone, everyone else kind of feels like they 257 00:14:40,560 --> 00:14:42,800 want to go along with it and they go, oh, I've heard he's got 258 00:14:42,800 --> 00:14:45,440 2° or I've heard he speaks 8 languages. 259 00:14:46,160 --> 00:14:47,360 It's it's interesting. Yeah. 260 00:14:47,560 --> 00:14:49,200 It's not, no, it's not realistic. 261 00:14:49,200 --> 00:14:53,480 But maybe that's part of kind of part of the joke, almost part 262 00:14:53,520 --> 00:14:55,600 of. The yeah, that's nobody. 263 00:14:55,600 --> 00:15:00,760 Nobody asks the question. Everyone's too invested to ask 264 00:15:00,760 --> 00:15:04,840 the question. I I wrote in my notes here is 265 00:15:04,840 --> 00:15:06,760 everyone in this film as dumb as rocks? 266 00:15:07,560 --> 00:15:11,880 Why do they not realize? Why do they put up with him that 267 00:15:11,880 --> 00:15:18,280 they misinterpret his his every, every word, every platitude, and 268 00:15:19,040 --> 00:15:21,920 they think everything he says. They think everything he says is 269 00:15:21,920 --> 00:15:23,640 a is a deep and meaningful metaphor. 270 00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:29,720 And Eve, who's Shirley MacLaine, describes him at various times 271 00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:33,800 as intense, cool and detached, which is far more than he 272 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:39,080 deserves. And it's that it's kind of like 273 00:15:39,080 --> 00:15:43,000 I, I ascribe to this, it's kind of like I, me and friends have 274 00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:49,240 this phrase for, for situations like in this film, the, the 275 00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:52,920 Fawlty Towers problem, specifically the, the wedding 276 00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:56,400 party episode of Fawlty Towers where if Basil had just 277 00:15:56,800 --> 00:16:01,560 explained calmly to his wedding guests what had happened, then 278 00:16:01,560 --> 00:16:04,960 none of that the subsequent disasters would occur. 279 00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:08,720 You know, OK, we wouldn't have 1/2 hour sitcom, but still, you 280 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:12,120 know, and if it, all it took in this film was for one person, 281 00:16:12,120 --> 00:16:15,320 the chauffeur who backed into him to have a quiet word with 282 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:18,120 Shirley MacLaine and say, listen, this man's a simpleton. 283 00:16:18,120 --> 00:16:21,360 This man's got the mental age of a 5 year old. 284 00:16:21,760 --> 00:16:24,080 Did you, did you, did you know that that's all, that's all it 285 00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:25,520 would take. We wouldn't have a film. 286 00:16:25,800 --> 00:16:29,880 It just annoyed me the way that nobody questioned him at all. 287 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:33,880 There's no real villain. The the only kind of villain in 288 00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:38,000 the film, I suppose, is that Thomas, whatever his name is the 289 00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:41,680 the the attorney who turfs him out of the house in the 1st 290 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:43,920 place. But even he doesn't really do 291 00:16:43,920 --> 00:16:46,440 anything, does he? No, I think Doctor Allenby is 292 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:51,200 set up as a kind of antagonist, but in the end he just realises 293 00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:54,880 that the number one thing is that Ben is cheered up by being 294 00:16:54,880 --> 00:16:58,160 around this guy as he, as even is the president. 295 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:00,960 I don't know why the president was impotent. 296 00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:03,000 I just, I don't know what that had to do with anything. 297 00:17:03,280 --> 00:17:05,640 I thought Chance was going to give him some advice that would 298 00:17:05,640 --> 00:17:08,880 be interpreted as sexual advice, and then the president would 299 00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:10,440 suddenly be really Randy and like. 300 00:17:11,240 --> 00:17:12,680 Satisfying. Something to do with? 301 00:17:12,760 --> 00:17:16,200 Something to the. Yeah, some advice, like planting 302 00:17:16,200 --> 00:17:19,480 a sapling. Yeah, because everything is to 303 00:17:19,480 --> 00:17:23,319 do with gardening. That's all he knows other than 304 00:17:23,319 --> 00:17:25,880 what he sees on TV. And it's interesting. 305 00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:27,599 He. I said he watches TV 306 00:17:27,599 --> 00:17:31,440 indiscriminately. He'll just watch, you know, 5 307 00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:35,560 minutes of this and then turn it over on to the next channel 308 00:17:35,640 --> 00:17:38,800 along. He's got no, he'll just watch 309 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:41,960 whatever is on just channel surfing. 310 00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:46,360 And he and he mimics what he sees on TV as well. 311 00:17:46,360 --> 00:17:51,000 There's a there's a, an old black and white film with that 312 00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:54,080 that he watches a little bit of with a really terrible racial 313 00:17:54,080 --> 00:18:01,280 stereotype raising his hat. And Chance is pretending to 314 00:18:01,280 --> 00:18:04,640 raise a hat, copying what he sees on TV. 315 00:18:05,480 --> 00:18:07,920 And obviously Sellers as a younger man, you know, he, he, 316 00:18:08,760 --> 00:18:11,000 he was known as a voices man when he when he started out on 317 00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:14,320 the radio and and you know, he was mimicking the sounds of 318 00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:18,920 people, whereas Chance here is, is mimicking the way that people 319 00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:21,760 shake hands and people, as I say, people raise their hat the 320 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:26,320 way people walk. But he doesn't seem to be taking 321 00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:30,240 in taking in anything other than that from the television. 322 00:18:30,520 --> 00:18:31,920 Yeah. Well, can I ask you that because 323 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:34,440 I'm wondering, has he accumulated any wisdom from the 324 00:18:34,440 --> 00:18:35,200 TV? Cos I I. 325 00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:37,240 Don't think so I. Suspect like you, he hasn't, 326 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:40,600 he's not taking anything in. He's just, he's, it's just this 327 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:43,800 kind of, and that's the thing. He's a comment on society 328 00:18:43,800 --> 00:18:48,040 because when I was growing up, we just had the TV on all the 329 00:18:48,040 --> 00:18:51,320 time. And in a way, we're kind of 330 00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:54,160 doing what Charles is doing in some ways, in that when I used 331 00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:55,760 to come home from, I had two sisters. 332 00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:58,400 And when we were all living at home, the TV is just on. 333 00:18:58,680 --> 00:19:00,600 Whoever gets home first puts the TV on. 334 00:19:00,680 --> 00:19:02,040 Yeah. And we're not even necessarily 335 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:04,680 watching it, but we are. It's, it's just that thing in 336 00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:06,960 the corner of the room. So I suppose it's like a friend 337 00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:08,560 to some people. But. 338 00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:11,360 But I don't think, no, I don't think he's, I don't think he's 339 00:19:11,360 --> 00:19:14,920 picking up anything intellectual from the TV at all. 340 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:17,800 No. Well, when he right at the 341 00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:23,080 beginning of the film, he's told by Louise, the housekeeper or 342 00:19:23,080 --> 00:19:27,680 the maid, yeah, who's who's who's brought him up? 343 00:19:29,120 --> 00:19:31,880 We don't really, we don't really we don't know anything about him 344 00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:34,240 prior to what we see in the film. 345 00:19:34,360 --> 00:19:36,360 We don't we don't know anything if we don't know his back story 346 00:19:36,360 --> 00:19:39,520 in the in the novel, there's a little bit of back story. 347 00:19:39,520 --> 00:19:41,480 So he's, and I mentioned I alluded to it before, he's a 348 00:19:41,480 --> 00:19:43,920 foundling. So he must have been he must 349 00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:46,080 have been in this. He's about if I mean Sellers was 350 00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:55,080 what, 535253 when he was making this chance looks older, but 351 00:19:55,080 --> 00:19:59,440 let's say he's a man in his 50s. So he's he's all he's known for 352 00:19:59,440 --> 00:20:04,720 50 plus years is what's in that house and and he's never 353 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:06,840 ventured outside. He's never been in a car. 354 00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:13,440 But when he's told by Louise that Old Man Jennings has passed 355 00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:16,080 through this veil of tears, he doesn't. 356 00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:21,280 He reacts as if he's been told that there's cats fighting 357 00:20:21,280 --> 00:20:23,200 outside. Mild interest. 358 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:24,640 Mild interest, but that's about it. 359 00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:28,360 Well, yeah, funnily enough that you don't think of the 360 00:20:28,400 --> 00:20:30,680 characters having character development. 361 00:20:31,160 --> 00:20:33,080 And I'm sorry to keep going about Rainman, but I just 362 00:20:33,080 --> 00:20:35,600 watched it recently and I listened to an audio commentary 363 00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:37,760 and there were so many interesting things in that. 364 00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:41,760 That's why I keep mentioning it. But in Rainman there's a tiny 365 00:20:41,760 --> 00:20:46,120 bit of progression. There's a scene where him and 366 00:20:46,120 --> 00:20:48,320 his brother, played by Tom Cruise, he puts they put their 367 00:20:48,320 --> 00:20:51,120 heads together and like he wouldn't be able to hug but he 368 00:20:51,120 --> 00:20:54,760 can put their heads together. And funnily enough, Chance does 369 00:20:54,760 --> 00:20:58,280 actually look sad. I mean when I was reading the 370 00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:02,120 synopsis, it says Chance looks genuinely sad at the funeral at 371 00:21:02,120 --> 00:21:04,640 the end and he does kind of look sad. 372 00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:06,680 So I don't know whether that would count as character 373 00:21:06,680 --> 00:21:09,760 development. The reaction to his second death 374 00:21:09,760 --> 00:21:11,280 is different to the first, I think. 375 00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:12,880 Absolutely. Yeah, He's when? 376 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:18,800 When Rand Ben Rand dies, Chance is is kind of tearing up his his 377 00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:21,280 eyes are red rimmed. You've become quite a close 378 00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:25,360 friend of Eves, haven't you? Chance? 379 00:21:27,360 --> 00:21:34,240 Yes. Yes, I I love Eve very much, 380 00:21:36,120 --> 00:21:40,960 Robin. And you really are a gardener, 381 00:21:40,960 --> 00:21:46,720 aren't you? I am God. 382 00:21:56,000 --> 00:22:01,560 Well, I'll go and tell Eve about Ben. 383 00:22:14,180 --> 00:22:17,540 I understand. But when he's told at the 384 00:22:17,540 --> 00:22:20,180 beginning of the film that the man who he's known all his life, 385 00:22:20,180 --> 00:22:22,460 he's the probably the only man he's ever known all his life, 386 00:22:22,900 --> 00:22:27,620 has died, he doesn't say he's there's just kind of mild 387 00:22:27,620 --> 00:22:29,940 indifference, I suppose. And he goes back to watching 388 00:22:29,940 --> 00:22:31,960 Sesame Street. Yeah. 389 00:22:32,360 --> 00:22:34,880 Perhaps it? Seems a bit unrealistic to think 390 00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:37,480 that he would have that and now I'm overthinking it. 391 00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:39,440 But do you think it's a bit unrealistic that he would? 392 00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:42,680 Why would he feel sad? I guess because he because he 393 00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:46,160 hasn't spent half as much time with Ben Rand as with the old 394 00:22:46,160 --> 00:22:47,200 man. I don't know. 395 00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:51,440 Now Speaking of Ben Rand, so it's it's Melvin Douglas. 396 00:22:54,120 --> 00:23:00,200 Sellers met Melvin Douglas in 1945 during the war because 397 00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:06,080 Sellers was was part of the gang show forces entertainment shows 398 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:14,360 in Burma and he was in Calcutta at one point and met Melvin 399 00:23:14,360 --> 00:23:17,640 Douglas and he would Douglas was a major in the Special services 400 00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:20,520 entertainment production unit, which was I guess is kind of 401 00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:23,280 like a almost like an American equivalent to the gang shows 402 00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:26,000 perhaps. Anyway, he met Sellers met. 403 00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:29,160 He was a young man, obviously met Melvin Douglas, they had a 404 00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:32,560 meal together, got them very well apparently and then 405 00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:36,880 obviously well, some 30 plus years later they meet again. 406 00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:43,760 With regards to Douglas, I don't know, did he deserve the best 407 00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:46,480 sporting actor Oscar? I don't know who he's up 408 00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:52,200 against, but it wasn't to me. It wasn't a stand out 409 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:54,560 performance. No, I think, I think if I hadn't 410 00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:57,520 found out that he, well, I think I found out after I watched the 411 00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:01,200 film, I wouldn't have said, oh, wow, I bet that was a bet. 412 00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:04,440 That was a, you know, an Oscar worthy performance because 413 00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:06,960 didn't really have too much to do. 414 00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:11,720 I mean, he he's fairly, I mean, obviously he's he's he's playing 415 00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:15,320 somebody who's terminally ill, but his whole thing towards 416 00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:17,280 chance is pretty much the same all the time. 417 00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:19,560 You know, he just likes him. He says, oh, I really admire 418 00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:21,640 you, Chauncey. You know, it's that kind of 419 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:23,240 thing. It's not a great deal to do, I 420 00:24:23,360 --> 00:24:26,320 think. Well, I wonder if if it was one 421 00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:29,240 of those where, I don't know, maybe he'd never been honoured 422 00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:32,480 by the Academy previously and he's obviously an old man. 423 00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:35,280 They're thinking, come on, let's, let's give him a give him 424 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:37,480 a nod now before it's too late. So do they. 425 00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:42,480 Yeah. Are you generally a Sellers fan 426 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:44,680 or is it just this film? I mean, I know you said Doctor 427 00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:48,640 Strangelove, but when it comes to Peter Sellers, when it comes, 428 00:24:48,640 --> 00:24:50,280 I mean, have you listened to the Goon Show ever? 429 00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:52,680 Have you? Are you interested in Spike 430 00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:53,480 Milligan? Do you have? 431 00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:55,440 Is it? Is it does? 432 00:24:55,440 --> 00:24:57,160 Does you know any of that chime with you? 433 00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:01,080 I mean, I, I would have started with the Pink Panther films for 434 00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:05,240 sure as a kid, but I remember the party doctor Strangelove. 435 00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:08,960 I just think he's, I mean, 'cause he's giving 33 brilliant 436 00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:10,480 performances. You get 3 in one. 437 00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:12,880 So that counts as three films in my book. 438 00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:17,600 Now the the goons, I, I, I became aware of the goons 439 00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:21,120 because every Beatles documentary you ever watch or 440 00:25:21,120 --> 00:25:25,240 listen to, they always say, oh, John Lennon say, oh, we love the 441 00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:28,600 goons and every Monty Python. I love Monty Python as well. 442 00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:32,680 I'm doing doing a review of Life of Brian next week and there is 443 00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:36,200 a strange little connection in that Brian and Chauncey Gardner 444 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:38,400 both get credited for things that they haven't done. 445 00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:40,120 That's true. It's weird, isn't it? 446 00:25:40,120 --> 00:25:42,320 I'll be preparing those two films at the same time. 447 00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:45,400 That's very true. Yeah, yeah. 448 00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:49,760 And yeah. So the goons, yeah. 449 00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:51,680 I'm not sure I need to listen to more. 450 00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:56,400 The only reason I ask is because there's the, there's the bit 451 00:25:56,400 --> 00:26:00,360 where Louise is leaving the house and it's a bit off. 452 00:26:00,360 --> 00:26:03,200 I think she because she, she knows what he what chance is 453 00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:04,560 like. She knows his condition. 454 00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:07,480 If you want to call it a condition, she just, she just 455 00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:11,640 upped and leaves. Do you not think that's rather 456 00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:13,840 callous? It is a bit weird, isn't? 457 00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:17,360 It so she did she. Live in the house as well or she 458 00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:19,240 she would just come in as a maid I suppose didn't. 459 00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:21,600 She actually, I don't know, I assumed she was living, but 460 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:22,960 maybe she wasn't. I don't know. 461 00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:26,080 I don't know. But as as she's leaving, she 462 00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:29,360 tells him, well, she basically says he hasn't got the equipment 463 00:26:29,360 --> 00:26:34,360 to satisfy a woman kind of well, not words to that effect. 464 00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:37,360 And then she says he'll always be a little boy. 465 00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:42,040 And and it made me think, actually, this film would have 466 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:47,720 been better for me if Sellers had done chance as Blue Bottle, 467 00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:49,000 the character from the Goon Show. 468 00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:54,320 Yeah, it would take you out of the film, I'm sure. 469 00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:55,880 But it would it would make me happy. 470 00:26:57,040 --> 00:27:01,080 What happened in the autumn when deadly back and I fall? 471 00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:05,960 Let's say that the old man Jennings bought this house back 472 00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:09,680 in the 10s or the 20s. Where in it? 473 00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:13,000 I'm assuming the neighborhood that it's situated and must have 474 00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:18,280 been more at market than it became because it's basically 475 00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:20,840 it's gone to hell, this neighborhood. 476 00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:24,200 In fact, I didn't realise at first that it was Washington. 477 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:28,880 DCI thought it was some New York borough or something. 478 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,680 Well, that's the thing. Washington DC is rather 479 00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:36,560 ironically, has got lots of deprived areas, has got a lot of 480 00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:38,760 that fairly near the White House. 481 00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:40,920 I've never been there but just what I heard. 482 00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:43,880 Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's weird, isn't it? 483 00:27:43,880 --> 00:27:48,320 He just goes out into, I don't know, it's almost like a slum 484 00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:51,160 really. Yeah, and there's that scene 485 00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:56,640 where he gets he's not mugged, but he's confronted by that 486 00:27:56,640 --> 00:28:00,320 street gang. Yeah, and he gets the TV remote 487 00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:03,200 out and tries to turn the channel over. 488 00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:06,000 Erase this guy you know, from his life by turning the channel 489 00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:08,120 over. Yeah, it's pretty weird. 490 00:28:08,360 --> 00:28:10,480 That's the only that's the only I was thinking that's the only 491 00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:17,120 scene you see where Chance looks stern or annoyed or irritated 492 00:28:17,120 --> 00:28:18,600 does. He look scared though, do you 493 00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:20,840 think? Well, he's he's kind of isn't, 494 00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:24,360 isn't he? Frowning and trying to turn the 495 00:28:24,360 --> 00:28:27,960 guy over with remote control. Well, first he says, do you know 496 00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:29,720 where I can find a garden? Doesn't he? 497 00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:32,480 Well, first he just stops a woman in the street and asks if 498 00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:37,040 she can make him some lunch. And yeah, then he asks if 499 00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:39,520 there's a garden somewhere. He asks the street gang. 500 00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:43,480 Well, yeah, and you know why he asked the woman in the street? 501 00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,200 It's because she's black and. And Louise was black. 502 00:28:46,200 --> 00:28:51,160 So he associates black women with someone that's going to 503 00:28:51,160 --> 00:28:53,640 make them their lunch. I guess. 504 00:28:55,560 --> 00:29:00,000 I wanted to talk about the TV that he watches as well. 505 00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:04,360 From what I understand, they, they had they, there was 506 00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:09,560 somebody credited who, whose job specifically was to select the 507 00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:11,440 television that he would be watching. 508 00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:18,040 So it wasn't just random stuff. It was all carefully selected. 509 00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:22,880 Did you, did you ascribe any importance to the clips that we 510 00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:25,840 see, the television clips or did you just say to just think it 511 00:29:25,840 --> 00:29:28,720 was just whatever happened to be on when the camera was rolling? 512 00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:33,720 I don't think it really made much difference to the plot. 513 00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:36,560 Oh, actually, there's just just that one bit because he he 514 00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:42,480 imitates the kissing scene from Thomas Crown affair and and it's 515 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:45,320 actually quite significant because just that he obviously 516 00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:49,760 he he grabs Eve in a kind of dramatic way like they are in 517 00:29:49,760 --> 00:29:53,160 the film, gives her a kiss. And from that alone, I mean, 518 00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:57,440 she's going to interpret all kinds of things, you know, just 519 00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:01,960 from that one act. So significant then but I can't 520 00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:04,320 remember what was on. Wasn't there dancing and there 521 00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:06,080 was yoga at some? Point Yoga. 522 00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:10,040 I think it's kind of reflecting because I think the 70s in 523 00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:12,960 America was a big kind of self helpy time. 524 00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:16,160 So I can't remember what else was on though. 525 00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:17,800 To be on talk shows I guess as well. 526 00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:21,120 Sellers. Sellers was deeply into 527 00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:24,960 spiritualism and clairvoyancy and all that sort of thing, as 528 00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:27,080 was, I believe, Shirley MacLaine. 529 00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:30,840 I suppose that's why he likes Chance, isn't it, Because he he 530 00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:32,760 is a bit positive. You can imagine him being quite 531 00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:35,000 peaceful company. I think that's what a lot of 532 00:30:35,000 --> 00:30:36,400 people like about him in the film. 533 00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:38,760 You know, he doesn't talk too much. 534 00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:40,200 Yeah. Yeah. 535 00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:42,240 He could be capable of being quite quiet, I think. 536 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:47,320 Well, yeah, that that that scene where you say where he embraces 537 00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:50,880 Eve and then completely loses interest because something else 538 00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:52,840 has come on the television. I think it is yoga on that 539 00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:56,000 occasion, I can't remember. Yeah, well, he's, how do we put 540 00:30:56,000 --> 00:31:00,480 this delicately. You know, I've got some older 541 00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:02,280 listeners, Anthony. I don't, I don't want to be too 542 00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:06,840 crude, but let's let's say that Eve, there's a there's a pivotal 543 00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:12,080 scene where Eve is pleasuring herself and kind of getting a 544 00:31:12,080 --> 00:31:14,040 lot out of it. And, and and Chance is 545 00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:16,840 completely switched off from this. 546 00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:18,960 He's standing on his head on the bed doing yoga. 547 00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:22,680 But, but, but she's happy, isn't she? 548 00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:25,000 Yeah, Yeah, she's happy. And he's that's the thing. 549 00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:28,240 He is genuinely making her happy just by being there. 550 00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:30,200 Oh being there. Sorry, I didn't mean that. 551 00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:33,600 Sorry for the part I've just discovered by accident. 552 00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:35,080 The why the why it's called that. 553 00:31:35,640 --> 00:31:37,840 I've been trying to work out why is it called being there that 554 00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:39,960 you've answered it. Yeah, sorry, that was completely 555 00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:41,240 by accident. I didn't mean to say it, 556 00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:43,080 obviously. But yeah, I suppose the 557 00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:46,640 spiritual thing is it's all the Eckhart Tolle stuff being in the 558 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:52,440 moment, and he is quite. I did write down Zen not not 559 00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:55,000 meaning like a Zen Buddhist, but in the way we use the adjective 560 00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:58,200 Zen you. He's very Zen, meaning he's 561 00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:01,320 quite still, and he seems at peace because presumably he 562 00:32:01,320 --> 00:32:07,920 doesn't really have hang ups. No, it's also it's such a 563 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:12,320 contrast for for Sellers from Cluso. 564 00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:15,160 So the films, I mean, he made a few other films around this 565 00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:18,200 time, but but you had returned the Pink Panther and then 566 00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:23,480 subsequent sequels to that which we're getting more increasingly 567 00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:29,080 cartoonish and absurd. OK, where by the end it was just 568 00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:33,240 silly voices and pratfalls and slapstick and over the top 569 00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:34,960 performances and things like that. 570 00:32:35,320 --> 00:32:37,960 Whereas this is the this is the antithesis of this is the 571 00:32:37,960 --> 00:32:39,960 complete opposite in terms of seller's performance. 572 00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:46,720 It's right so rained in and and he's so like you say Zen do. 573 00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:49,480 You think the appeal as well was just that he wanted to play 574 00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:54,080 somebody quiet himself. You know, it must have been 575 00:32:54,080 --> 00:32:57,000 quite hard to get in the character in one sense. 576 00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:02,360 But like physic, there's not a lot of exertion, let's say, you 577 00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:03,720 know, everything's delivered straight. 578 00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:04,760 There's not. He doesn't. 579 00:33:04,960 --> 00:33:08,120 There's no call for emotion so. No. 580 00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:13,040 Well, Sellas, I don't know. Sellas famously would take his 581 00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:17,120 characters home with him at the end of the days filming, so I 582 00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:19,720 imagine because he was with Lynn Frederick at this time. 583 00:33:19,720 --> 00:33:25,240 So I imagine it was quite nice having Peter Chauncey Gardner 584 00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:29,200 Sellers coming home after filming and I'm I'm sure it was 585 00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:34,240 quite peaceful and watching TV kept switching over while 586 00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:37,360 they're trying to watch a film. There were other characters he 587 00:33:37,360 --> 00:33:40,600 played earlier in his career, one in particular where he was a 588 00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:44,400 real bastard and that was not nice to be, he was not nice to 589 00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:47,080 be around when he when he took those characters home. 590 00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:52,080 Laurence Olivier just getting back to that scene, that scene 591 00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:55,960 with the, with the yoga and the, the, the carry on with them. 592 00:33:56,120 --> 00:33:58,360 Shirley MacLaine. Laurence Olivier had been asked 593 00:33:58,360 --> 00:34:03,520 to play Ben Rand, I believe, and turned it down because he didn't 594 00:34:03,520 --> 00:34:07,600 want to be in a film where Shirley MacLaine masturbates. 595 00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:14,920 No, I'm laughing because I was. I was about to say Shirley 596 00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:16,679 Bassey masturbates, which would be. 597 00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:19,280 It's a whole other image. Yeah. 598 00:34:20,520 --> 00:34:24,480 I think he would have been. I can imagine him delivering an 599 00:34:24,520 --> 00:34:26,440 Oscar winning performance somehow. 600 00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:29,400 Oh, yes, I think, well, he was he he was ill. 601 00:34:29,480 --> 00:34:31,239 He was ill around this time. Yeah. 602 00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:33,960 For real. So was Sellers, though Sellers 603 00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:38,000 was slowly dying. It's maybe a little bit dramatic 604 00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:42,360 to say slowly dying, but he knew he only had what, two years left 605 00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:46,400 really. And he was always, I think he'd 606 00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:49,320 been living on borrowed time since it had the series of heart 607 00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:54,159 attacks in the 60s. So it's quite interesting seeing 608 00:34:54,159 --> 00:34:59,000 him looking very old or looking a lot older than we've seen him 609 00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:02,960 prior to this. It's quite interesting, quite 610 00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:07,200 odd to see him in scenes where you have another character who's 611 00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:10,600 very ill and dying. You know, Sellers was, too. 612 00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:13,400 And I'm sure Sellers. I'm sure that point wasn't lost 613 00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:17,000 on Sellers because he, because he was really aware of his own 614 00:35:17,000 --> 00:35:20,320 mortality at this time. I think he was just counting, 615 00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:23,160 counting down the days. Yeah. 616 00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:26,520 He hadn't been diagnosed as having like six months left to 617 00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:29,960 liver or anything like that. It was more he knew that he 618 00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:32,680 would not make old bones, as they say, you know? 619 00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:37,320 Yeah, just with regards to that, that scene with Chilly, Chilly 620 00:35:37,320 --> 00:35:40,320 MacLean, You, you touched on the fact that the prime, the Prime 621 00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:42,280 Minister, the Prime Minister is impotent. 622 00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:43,760 The president is impotent. And. 623 00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:50,200 And we don't really know why. Yeah. 624 00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:56,360 Or whether it was fixed. Otherwise, why have why have it 625 00:35:56,360 --> 00:35:57,800 there? It just would have been perfect. 626 00:35:57,800 --> 00:36:00,520 If Chance had cured him inadvertently, that would have 627 00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:03,920 been. Well, there's there is this 628 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:06,560 underlying current of sexual frustration in the film. 629 00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:12,240 So you've got Eve Rand and you've got President, President 630 00:36:12,240 --> 00:36:13,840 Bobby. That's all we know as I think. 631 00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:16,360 Jack Ward and I love Jack Ward and I've seen a few of his 632 00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:19,120 films. Well I was watching so I watched 633 00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:25,600 this on last Friday again for this and happy to be my 634 00:36:25,600 --> 00:36:27,360 birthday. So I had a few birthday drinks 635 00:36:27,360 --> 00:36:34,000 and I thought, wow, I thought, I love Jack Warden. 636 00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:38,920 I'm going to watch my second favorite film of all time, even 637 00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:40,680 though I've seen it trillions of times. 638 00:36:41,120 --> 00:36:43,800 And so I watched 12 Angry Men. Oh yeah, yeah. 639 00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:47,000 And loved every minute of it, as always. 640 00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:49,120 Yeah, he's the one who had tickets for the ball game, 641 00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:51,080 wasn't he? Tickets for the ball game and he 642 00:36:51,080 --> 00:36:56,720 just wants to, he wants the kid to fry in the chair because he 643 00:36:56,720 --> 00:36:58,640 wants to get to the ball game basically. 644 00:36:58,640 --> 00:37:02,080 And then he changes his mind because he thinks I, I, that's 645 00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:04,440 the best way to get a get out of there, basically. 646 00:37:05,040 --> 00:37:07,200 Yeah, he just. Was winning everyone over, so 647 00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:09,280 I'll go along with it. Absolutely. 648 00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:10,760 Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 649 00:37:14,720 --> 00:37:18,400 I think the last scene. I don't know if you ought to 650 00:37:18,400 --> 00:37:20,400 talk about it now or later. On we'll talk about it now 651 00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:24,400 because you know people, it's a, it's a 45 year old film. 652 00:37:24,520 --> 00:37:25,720 People should have seen it by now. 653 00:37:25,720 --> 00:37:28,160 But listen to this. Yes, yes, well, obviously 654 00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:32,800 there's a walking on water and there's various, there are 655 00:37:32,800 --> 00:37:36,120 obviously biblical things like Eve and the garden and the film 656 00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:38,640 takes place over 7 days, apparently. 657 00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:42,160 But I was quite blown away when I watched this. 658 00:37:42,320 --> 00:37:48,040 And like I say, if you remember when Obama first got in and 659 00:37:48,040 --> 00:37:50,600 there was all that birth certificate stuff, Yeah, yeah. 660 00:37:50,680 --> 00:37:53,440 Now, I'm not saying there was anything to that, but that I 661 00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:55,400 just remember seeing interviews with people who said, Oh yeah, 662 00:37:55,400 --> 00:37:58,000 he's supposed to be at so and so school and nobody remembers him 663 00:37:58,000 --> 00:38:01,160 being there, but being there. Keep doing that. 664 00:38:02,240 --> 00:38:05,120 But anyway, it just seemed weird that I, I happened to see this 665 00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:10,480 film at that exact time where you had a guy that no one quite 666 00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:12,440 knows his background possibly anyway. 667 00:38:12,760 --> 00:38:17,640 But I think the more pertinent 1 was George W Bush because it it. 668 00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:21,760 I think I'd be on safe ground and say George, but W Bush was a 669 00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:24,240 bit of an idiot. Whatever that word means. 670 00:38:24,240 --> 00:38:25,720 You know, however you take. That just a bit. 671 00:38:26,040 --> 00:38:27,880 Just a bit. Yeah, but I was just blown away 672 00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:29,880 to see the end of this film where they said, you know, they 673 00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:32,480 got these, the pallbearers saying, oh, you know, we need to 674 00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:34,880 pick somebody. And of course that doesn't mean 675 00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:37,480 that that happens that blatantly in real life. 676 00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:41,120 But it was interesting because it was around the time when I 677 00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:43,400 was more politically active was sort of the end of Bush and the 678 00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:45,840 beginning of Obama, that period. Yeah. 679 00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:49,840 Just having that, just thinking, well, maybe they kind of do 680 00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:54,160 select people because I love Yes Minister as well. 681 00:38:54,240 --> 00:38:57,480 Absolutely obsessed with Yes Minister and I probably know all 682 00:38:57,480 --> 00:38:59,080 the most of the words of all of those. 683 00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:04,400 And yes, Prime Minister. And Jim Hacker of course becomes 684 00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:08,440 Prime Minister because he's a safe pair of hands, because the 685 00:39:08,480 --> 00:39:10,840 other two have got dodgy MI 5 files. 686 00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:13,160 Yeah. The other thing about Chauncey, 687 00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:15,960 of course he's got the power in a way of having no pass because 688 00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:17,200 there's nothing they can get him on. 689 00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:20,440 He doesn't seem to have a sexual appetite, so they can't get him 690 00:39:20,440 --> 00:39:22,600 on that. So yes, in the yes Minister, the 691 00:39:22,600 --> 00:39:25,640 comedy is of is they suddenly realise, oh, it's going to be 692 00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:27,800 Jim Hacker, who's the Paul Addington. 693 00:39:28,040 --> 00:39:30,120 And they both start laughing and they're going really, could we 694 00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:31,120 do this? Really. 695 00:39:31,440 --> 00:39:34,000 They go, yeah, we can just get him a victory. 696 00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:37,200 You know, sometimes when they're trying to get the candidate out, 697 00:39:37,200 --> 00:39:38,720 they'll they'll organise a victory. 698 00:39:38,720 --> 00:39:41,840 You know something they do well and they get to make a speech 699 00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:43,920 and everything. I have no use for those on 700 00:39:43,920 --> 00:39:50,320 welfare, no patience whatsoever. But if I had to be honest with 701 00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:54,800 myself, I must admit that they have no use for me either. 702 00:39:59,040 --> 00:40:01,960 I do not regret having political differences with men that I 703 00:40:01,960 --> 00:40:10,760 respect. I do regret, however, that our 704 00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:21,000 philosophies kept us apart. Yes, I agree, except he's so 705 00:40:21,040 --> 00:40:23,000 boring. What about Max where he could 706 00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:24,560 never take an election? Correct. 707 00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:27,560 People of this country need to be awakened. 708 00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:32,400 What about Lawson? He's charismatic, exciting. 709 00:40:33,080 --> 00:40:34,720 He's a bit too exciting, I'm afraid. 710 00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:36,600 If they start bringing up things about. 711 00:40:36,840 --> 00:40:39,560 Time is running out. We must come to a decision. 712 00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:43,200 I don't think there's really any other classic scenes. 713 00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:45,680 I just think it's very. Well, that The thing is, though, 714 00:40:46,520 --> 00:40:51,560 this film, just when it was being made, it just predated 715 00:40:52,160 --> 00:40:53,560 Reagan throwing his hat in the ring. 716 00:40:53,560 --> 00:40:54,160 That's right. Yeah. 717 00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:56,720 For the presidency. But I remember, I think I'm 718 00:40:57,880 --> 00:40:58,880 roughly. What age are you? 719 00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:03,240 I'm. 49 So I was born in 75. OK, we're virtually, we're 720 00:41:03,240 --> 00:41:05,240 virtually the same age then. OK, I was going to say you'll 721 00:41:05,240 --> 00:41:09,400 remember the jokes about Reagan being dumb as a mule and, you 722 00:41:09,400 --> 00:41:12,800 know, just this washed up old Hollywood B movie actor and all 723 00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:15,400 the rest of it. And it was countless, You know, 724 00:41:15,400 --> 00:41:18,000 he's always being pissed, was always being taken out of him 725 00:41:18,000 --> 00:41:21,520 on, you know, British comedies. I can think of that. 726 00:41:22,200 --> 00:41:26,400 Not 9:00 news sketch. In fact, what was it in Spitting 727 00:41:26,400 --> 00:41:27,440 Image? There was a running. 728 00:41:28,520 --> 00:41:30,880 There was a running gag about the president's brain is 729 00:41:30,880 --> 00:41:33,680 missing. I think something like that. 730 00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:38,440 Yeah, but you look back now Reagan, OK, yes, I know he was 731 00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:41,320 suffering from early onset Alzheimer's, I think by the mid 732 00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:44,480 80s or something. But and he did many bad things 733 00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:45,720 and he was not a great president. 734 00:41:45,720 --> 00:41:48,120 But you look back now and you think, jeez, you had to have him 735 00:41:48,120 --> 00:41:51,440 back in a heartbeat if it was. But what? 736 00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:55,360 I guess, yeah. But I mean, I suppose then the 737 00:41:55,480 --> 00:41:57,960 the president at the time this was being filmed was Jimmy 738 00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:02,200 Carter, who was probably not very well. 739 00:42:02,200 --> 00:42:06,000 He was not very popular, regarded as a bit of a joke I 740 00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:08,360 think. Yeah, I don't remember that 741 00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:11,480 time, but I I think he he was much loved after him. 742 00:42:11,480 --> 00:42:12,880 And of course, he just died, didn't he? 743 00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:13,840 Fairly. Recently he did. 744 00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:16,680 He did, yeah. I think he's the poster boy for 745 00:42:16,680 --> 00:42:19,040 the American dream because he was a peanut farmer, wasn't he? 746 00:42:19,880 --> 00:42:21,840 He's one of the few you can point to and say, well, that 747 00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:23,680 guy's come from being a peanut farmer. 748 00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:25,640 Might find out he's got rich friends. 749 00:42:25,880 --> 00:42:28,160 I don't know, honestly don't know much of his story, but 750 00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:30,960 yeah, yeah, yeah. He was there, Yeah. 751 00:42:32,040 --> 00:42:35,240 What did you think of the and I, I don't know the significance, 752 00:42:35,240 --> 00:42:39,800 I'm sure you do, but the family vault, the Rand family vault 753 00:42:40,320 --> 00:42:44,160 where they were going to enter the casket had that. 754 00:42:44,200 --> 00:42:48,400 It was like a pyramid with an all the all seeing eye going. 755 00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:50,040 On Oh yeah, I even forgot to mention that. 756 00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:53,240 Yeah, I'm saying that that really appeals to the sort of 757 00:42:53,240 --> 00:42:55,320 truth slash conspiracy community. 758 00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:58,120 They love it. And notice as well that there it 759 00:42:58,120 --> 00:43:00,560 looks like there's a tear coming down from the eye as well. 760 00:43:01,280 --> 00:43:03,760 So that's more possible symbolism. 761 00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:07,520 Yeah, Yeah, that's the thing. It's a bit of a sort of triple 762 00:43:07,520 --> 00:43:09,000 whammy. You've got these guys talking 763 00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:12,040 about choosing the president, then you get the pyramid and the 764 00:43:12,040 --> 00:43:14,000 all seeing eye. It's like a three in one. 765 00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:18,680 You think, is that how it works? Maybe, maybe not, I don't know. 766 00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:23,960 The film obviously ends with the scene the famous scene of 767 00:43:25,200 --> 00:43:27,120 Chauncey Chance walking on water. 768 00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:31,920 What did we meant to take away from that that that? 769 00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:35,080 You. Know, I don't know if that he's 770 00:43:35,160 --> 00:43:36,960 secretly Jesus or something, I don't know. 771 00:43:37,440 --> 00:43:39,520 Yeah, we'll say that quietly. Yeah. 772 00:43:39,720 --> 00:43:43,640 Yeah. Well, struck down my my slight 773 00:43:43,640 --> 00:43:46,360 problem with that scene is that because it's so obvious that 774 00:43:46,360 --> 00:43:49,960 Peter Sellers, they've done some trick where Peter Sellers 775 00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:52,280 obviously isn't walking a water. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it just. 776 00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:55,360 Looks too obvious that he's. I was in a funny way. 777 00:43:55,360 --> 00:43:58,520 I was too focused on the fact that sellers didn't look like he 778 00:43:58,520 --> 00:44:00,760 was walking a water. And that's silly. 779 00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:04,240 But in terms of the actual idea of it, yeah, there's obviously 780 00:44:04,240 --> 00:44:07,720 the Jesus thing. I I can't take credit for this. 781 00:44:07,720 --> 00:44:09,000 I was watching a video they kept. 782 00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:10,960 I didn't. Maybe it was a Roger Ebert 783 00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:14,440 review or something else. You know, in cartoons when 784 00:44:14,440 --> 00:44:18,360 someone falls off a mountain or something or off a Cliff, but 785 00:44:18,360 --> 00:44:22,600 they don't fall until they can see that they're yes, not on. 786 00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:25,360 To me, somebody said I can't remember if it was ebook or 787 00:44:25,360 --> 00:44:27,920 somebody else. They said chance is a bit like 788 00:44:27,920 --> 00:44:30,000 that. He doesn't know any. 789 00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:32,480 His power comes to the fact he doesn't really know any 790 00:44:32,480 --> 00:44:34,560 limitations. Yeah. 791 00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:37,160 He doesn't seem to have an ego so. 792 00:44:37,800 --> 00:44:39,000 He doesn't know it can't be done. 793 00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:40,760 Yeah, exactly. He doesn't know it can't be 794 00:44:40,760 --> 00:44:43,360 done. And funnily enough, I've just, I 795 00:44:43,360 --> 00:44:45,760 just did a special on Orson Welles for Film Gold and I'm 796 00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:48,800 currently in the middle of A5 part of a Citizen Kane. 797 00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:52,160 And Orson Welles said when he made Citizen Kane, his power was 798 00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:56,960 he didn't know what can be done. So the limitation, obviously 799 00:44:56,960 --> 00:45:00,280 it's not supposed to be realistic, but the limitation of 800 00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:04,480 gravity, let's say, doesn't apply to him just because he 801 00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:08,760 doesn't know certain limitations, because he does 802 00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:10,960 have a kind of power over people, doesn't he? 803 00:45:11,800 --> 00:45:13,800 He doesn't. He doesn't recognize the law of 804 00:45:13,800 --> 00:45:15,200 physics. Exactly. 805 00:45:16,480 --> 00:45:21,960 He does have a sort of this passive power because the, the, 806 00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:25,520 the clip they always play when they talk about this film tends 807 00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:28,080 to be the one where he's sat talking to the president and, 808 00:45:28,120 --> 00:45:30,720 and gives that speech about as long as the roots are not 809 00:45:30,720 --> 00:45:34,040 severed, there will be, you know, all will be well, 810 00:45:35,080 --> 00:45:38,400 etcetera. As long as the roots are not 811 00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:45,680 severed, all is well and all will be well in the garden. 812 00:45:51,990 --> 00:46:04,470 In the garden, yes, in a garden, growth has its season. 813 00:46:07,350 --> 00:46:14,430 First comes spring and summer, but then we have fall and 814 00:46:14,430 --> 00:46:19,230 winter, and then we get spring and summer again. 815 00:46:25,200 --> 00:46:31,920 Spring and summer, yes. Then fall and winter, yes. 816 00:46:38,770 --> 00:46:45,530 I think what our insightful young friend is saying is that 817 00:46:45,530 --> 00:46:52,650 we welcome the inevitable seasons of nature, but we're 818 00:46:52,650 --> 00:46:55,130 upset by the seasons of our economy. 819 00:46:55,610 --> 00:46:59,200 Yes, there will be growth in the spring. 820 00:47:05,360 --> 00:47:07,400 Well, Mr. Garner, I must admit that is one of the most 821 00:47:07,400 --> 00:47:10,000 refreshing and optimistic statements I've heard in a very, 822 00:47:10,000 --> 00:47:16,800 very long time. He then gets invited on to chat 823 00:47:16,800 --> 00:47:20,440 shows, things like that, off the back of being mentioned in the 824 00:47:20,440 --> 00:47:23,480 presidential press conference. Everyone wants to find out who 825 00:47:23,480 --> 00:47:26,200 he is, what his back story is, what his background is, who his 826 00:47:26,200 --> 00:47:30,800 parents were, much to the chagrin of Louise, who's who's 827 00:47:30,800 --> 00:47:33,760 watching him being interviewed on television. 828 00:47:33,920 --> 00:47:37,640 She says something like that boys got rice pudding in between 829 00:47:37,640 --> 00:47:40,200 his ears. All you got to be is white in 830 00:47:40,200 --> 00:47:42,160 America. That was a that was a bit of 831 00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:43,920 good. That was a comedic scene that 832 00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:45,080 really worked. Yeah. 833 00:47:45,360 --> 00:47:49,680 Yeah, yeah, she was great. I wonder if also, I don't know 834 00:47:49,680 --> 00:47:52,640 how to say this, but there's something in films where they 835 00:47:52,640 --> 00:47:57,120 try and imply that lower state, I don't want to say lower class, 836 00:47:57,120 --> 00:48:02,000 but lower status people have more wisdom than kind of rich 837 00:48:02,280 --> 00:48:05,120 out of touch people. I think there's a bit of that as 838 00:48:05,120 --> 00:48:07,640 well. I think maybe the the rich 839 00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:11,440 people, they're just how do I say this? 840 00:48:11,680 --> 00:48:15,320 They're almost like so confident that they know what's what that 841 00:48:15,320 --> 00:48:16,840 they almost let their guard down. 842 00:48:16,840 --> 00:48:20,320 I don't know, you know, And she, she can just see the bigger 843 00:48:20,320 --> 00:48:23,160 picture and say what's going on here, you know, and obviously 844 00:48:23,160 --> 00:48:26,960 the doctor twigs it as well, but like we said, just decides not 845 00:48:26,960 --> 00:48:30,680 to say anything because you can see that Ben's happier because 846 00:48:30,680 --> 00:48:32,880 Chance and Eve's happier because chance is around. 847 00:48:33,640 --> 00:48:35,000 Yeah, yeah. But I think. 848 00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:38,000 Louise is is the the voice of reason, basically. 849 00:48:39,760 --> 00:48:42,960 I want to talk about this is this is where I tend, I tend to 850 00:48:42,960 --> 00:48:46,920 go off topic often on this podcast sentencing. 851 00:48:46,920 --> 00:48:52,360 Oh, no problem. I'm with and and I had AI 852 00:48:52,400 --> 00:48:55,240 watched this film again and I got an earworm from it. 853 00:48:55,280 --> 00:48:56,480 I'm sure you know what an earworm is. 854 00:48:58,000 --> 00:49:02,320 Case listeners don't. It's when you hear a song that 855 00:49:03,040 --> 00:49:06,000 sticks in your head for the rest of the day pretty much. 856 00:49:06,640 --> 00:49:12,120 And I mentioned earlier on the film chances watching Sesame 857 00:49:12,120 --> 00:49:21,800 Street and it's a scene with Big Bird and a human. 858 00:49:22,680 --> 00:49:26,680 It's actually, it's actually the the actress and singer Buffy St. 859 00:49:26,680 --> 00:49:29,880 Marie. Have you heard of her at all? 860 00:49:30,640 --> 00:49:32,080 I've heard the name but I wouldn't know anything. 861 00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:37,440 About her she's well, she was a she was a regular on on gonna 862 00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:40,400 say Coronation Street on Sesame Street around this time and 863 00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:43,400 she's singing a song to cheer up big Bird because big bird. 864 00:49:43,400 --> 00:49:46,520 I looked into this big bird was jealous because she'd just had a 865 00:49:46,640 --> 00:49:49,160 new baby, right. And he was he was getting 866 00:49:49,160 --> 00:49:52,600 jealous because of that, even though he clearly wasn't her 867 00:49:52,600 --> 00:49:56,600 child anyway, you know, and she sings the song called different 868 00:49:56,600 --> 00:49:59,360 people different ways. And I'll tell you what, I, I 869 00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:02,720 watched the clip of it, you know, on YouTube and it just, I 870 00:50:02,720 --> 00:50:05,360 think it's delightful stuck, stuck in my head. 871 00:50:05,680 --> 00:50:09,640 But it caused me to go off on a done a bloody rabbit hole. 872 00:50:11,280 --> 00:50:16,840 Now she Buffy Sant Marie, she was a big advocate for Native 873 00:50:16,840 --> 00:50:20,000 American rights and for the longest time, for years and 874 00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:21,720 years and years, I think, I think I've got this right. 875 00:50:21,720 --> 00:50:22,840 I asked my friend Andrew about this. 876 00:50:23,440 --> 00:50:27,120 She was, she claimed to, to, to be, I think she was Canadian. 877 00:50:27,880 --> 00:50:31,960 Well, she was American and she, she gained Canadian citizenship, 878 00:50:31,960 --> 00:50:37,040 but she, she claimed to be from a, a Native American tribe, or 879 00:50:37,040 --> 00:50:40,160 at least you know, her, her ancestry was OK. 880 00:50:40,840 --> 00:50:44,160 Turned out she was Italian, funny enough. 881 00:50:45,240 --> 00:50:47,240 And it was, it was and it was, it was Hokin. 882 00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:50,800 It was all a it was all a story about she'd, she'd coasted on 883 00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:52,800 that, on that for years and years and years. 884 00:50:53,280 --> 00:50:56,840 So she kind of got exposed, but she caused the stir on US 885 00:50:56,840 --> 00:51:00,280 television because she was the first person to breastfeed a 886 00:51:00,280 --> 00:51:05,600 baby on US television, OK, on Sesame Street during this, you 887 00:51:05,600 --> 00:51:07,480 know, this storyline about her having a new baby. 888 00:51:08,200 --> 00:51:12,720 And she she'd probably be best known now in terms of a song 889 00:51:12,720 --> 00:51:17,640 that she Co wrote, which was up where we belong from an officer 890 00:51:17,640 --> 00:51:20,440 and a gentleman. Yeah, of course. 891 00:51:20,600 --> 00:51:21,960 Yeah, yeah. And yeah. 892 00:51:21,960 --> 00:51:25,920 So I just spent, I honest to God, I spent about an hour on 893 00:51:25,920 --> 00:51:30,240 Saturday morning just reading up about her and listening to that 894 00:51:30,240 --> 00:51:33,760 song. And also Fran Brill, who's the 895 00:51:33,760 --> 00:51:37,040 lady who plays the, you know, when Thomas, the attorney and 896 00:51:37,040 --> 00:51:39,760 that woman who we presume as another attorney come into the 897 00:51:39,760 --> 00:51:42,200 house, the woman who was the actress Fran Brill. 898 00:51:42,400 --> 00:51:44,960 And she was also on Sesame Street as a regular at the same 899 00:51:44,960 --> 00:51:46,840 time, so. She's the one who says, oh, he's 900 00:51:46,840 --> 00:51:49,560 brilliant, she's watching him on the chat show. 901 00:51:50,360 --> 00:51:52,120 Yes, yeah, yes. That's it. 902 00:51:52,120 --> 00:51:52,800 That's it. Yeah. 903 00:51:53,200 --> 00:51:56,240 So anyway, I just wanted to throw that in because I just it 904 00:51:56,240 --> 00:51:59,680 it it something I took from the film, which was was very 905 00:51:59,680 --> 00:52:01,680 pleasing. I love that song, even though 906 00:52:01,680 --> 00:52:03,440 it's a kids song and you can't buy it commercially. 907 00:52:03,440 --> 00:52:06,880 It's not on Spotify. But you know, anyway, I just 908 00:52:06,880 --> 00:52:08,160 wanted to to throw that in there. 909 00:52:08,760 --> 00:52:11,800 I did note down when he's trying to seduce him. 910 00:52:11,800 --> 00:52:14,920 I've got a song on the TV says you're special to me. 911 00:52:14,920 --> 00:52:18,320 Every time is the right time. So if you want your back again, 912 00:52:18,320 --> 00:52:21,080 you can hear those lyrics coming from the TV being sung. 913 00:52:22,440 --> 00:52:25,760 Yeah, yeah. They're also they've got very 914 00:52:25,760 --> 00:52:30,520 prominently as he arrives in the car at the Rand mansion for the 915 00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:34,640 first time, basketball Jones. Oh yeah, yeah, my friend was 916 00:52:34,640 --> 00:52:36,320 telling me about that. Yeah. 917 00:52:36,320 --> 00:52:39,520 Which is Cheech and Chong which I used to listen to when I was a 918 00:52:39,520 --> 00:52:42,880 kid because my my sister's boyfriend had all the Cheech and 919 00:52:42,880 --> 00:52:45,920 Chong records. When they unwrapped the 920 00:52:45,960 --> 00:52:49,200 chopsticks to be used by the Chinese guests, the packages 921 00:52:49,200 --> 00:52:51,560 were clearly stamped made in Taiwan. 922 00:52:52,920 --> 00:52:55,560 I know it's important to stay informed of all the latest. 923 00:52:55,560 --> 00:52:59,520 Events, but well, I find there's so much to assimilate, it can 924 00:52:59,520 --> 00:53:04,280 become quite muddling at times. If the Chinese were. 925 00:53:10,000 --> 00:53:15,600 Upset. Maybe that's why I can't sleep 926 00:53:15,600 --> 00:53:16,120 tonight. I need help. 927 00:53:16,240 --> 00:53:18,760 I need someone to stand beside me. 928 00:53:18,760 --> 00:53:32,120 I need. I don't know the significance. 929 00:53:32,120 --> 00:53:33,840 There's got to be some significance because it was very 930 00:53:33,840 --> 00:53:36,520 prominently shown in the film that he's watching it on 931 00:53:36,520 --> 00:53:38,920 television. Did you did you read anything to 932 00:53:39,480 --> 00:53:41,880 Internet? No, I didn't notice it until 933 00:53:41,880 --> 00:53:44,240 somebody pointed it out. I don't know. 934 00:53:44,240 --> 00:53:47,400 Not specifically. The one that I really did think 935 00:53:47,680 --> 00:53:51,600 was there for a reason was the also Sprite Zarathustra. 936 00:53:52,520 --> 00:53:54,320 Yes, because he comes out of the door. 937 00:53:54,760 --> 00:53:58,400 He comes out of the door and this is his odyssey because he's 938 00:53:58,400 --> 00:54:02,600 never been outside, so he may as well be going to space, you 939 00:54:02,600 --> 00:54:03,880 know? Yes, yes. 940 00:54:04,200 --> 00:54:06,680 It's almost even a bit on the nose when you notice it. 941 00:54:07,320 --> 00:54:10,440 But I had because I love that. That jazz funk arrangement of 942 00:54:10,440 --> 00:54:13,680 that was brilliant. I loved that it was really like 943 00:54:13,680 --> 00:54:16,280 quite funky and it felt quite 70s actually. 944 00:54:17,520 --> 00:54:22,960 It would have been achingly. Arch and you when you first when 945 00:54:22,960 --> 00:54:26,840 you saw this at the time, I guess it has a, it has a kind of 946 00:54:26,840 --> 00:54:29,960 a datedness to it now, but it's still very effective I think. 947 00:54:59,050 --> 00:55:01,330 It made me think of Blaxploitation, to be honest. 948 00:55:01,330 --> 00:55:05,010 It had that funky, you know, someone kind of going around to 949 00:55:05,010 --> 00:55:07,370 town, walking around with that music on. 950 00:55:08,330 --> 00:55:09,850 Yeah, has a certain notion about it. 951 00:55:09,850 --> 00:55:11,890 But I, I, I thought that was really awful. 952 00:55:11,970 --> 00:55:15,530 I think even when he sees himself on the TV, which is 953 00:55:15,530 --> 00:55:18,290 actually the reason the the limo kind of knocks him over isn't. 954 00:55:18,410 --> 00:55:19,410 It, Oh yeah, knocks. Him over. 955 00:55:19,970 --> 00:55:22,210 I think it's like isn't there like a fake moon in the 956 00:55:22,210 --> 00:55:26,000 background? 2001 possibly. 957 00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:29,040 OK, could be I can't. Remember there was some fake 958 00:55:29,040 --> 00:55:32,120 background with murdered stars and yeah. 959 00:55:32,360 --> 00:55:36,920 And and of course, Zella's linked to Kubrick, of course, 960 00:55:36,920 --> 00:55:39,400 with Strangelove and and Lolita. Oh. 961 00:55:39,840 --> 00:55:42,960 I forgot about Lolita. Yeah, he played more, played two 962 00:55:42,960 --> 00:55:44,200 roles I think in that one as well. 963 00:55:46,560 --> 00:55:50,280 He well he played one character, but who who took on different 964 00:55:50,760 --> 00:55:52,880 personas. Oh, it was actually Claire 965 00:55:52,880 --> 00:55:56,360 Quilty who was different people. Claire Quilty dressing up as 966 00:55:56,360 --> 00:56:00,640 different characters, putting on voices the the German professor 967 00:56:00,640 --> 00:56:05,960 and and and a police photographer. 968 00:56:05,960 --> 00:56:08,600 I think something like that. We covered it relatively 969 00:56:08,600 --> 00:56:14,520 recently. I've completely forgotten the 970 00:56:14,520 --> 00:56:21,800 bit where he goes to that soiree with Eve where he meets the Is 971 00:56:21,800 --> 00:56:25,400 it like the Russian cultural attache? 972 00:56:25,400 --> 00:56:26,760 Yeah, I wrote down. Russian. 973 00:56:26,760 --> 00:56:28,680 Ambassador. Somebody like that, A diplomat. 974 00:56:28,720 --> 00:56:31,760 Yeah, played by Richard Basehardt. 975 00:56:32,000 --> 00:56:34,560 So you've got Richard Basehardt. You've also got Richard Dysart 976 00:56:34,560 --> 00:56:36,600 in this film. Oh, right. 977 00:56:36,600 --> 00:56:38,160 OK. Richard Dysart is the doctor. 978 00:56:38,400 --> 00:56:40,840 Richard Basehard is. Oh, yes, He's sorry. 979 00:56:40,840 --> 00:56:44,120 He's a Soviet ambassador, Vladimir scraping off. 980 00:56:44,280 --> 00:56:47,400 Right. He's the one who projects that 981 00:56:47,840 --> 00:56:50,440 or. Or assumes that chance can speak 982 00:56:50,440 --> 00:56:51,400 Russian. Yeah, because. 983 00:56:51,520 --> 00:56:53,480 Because he nods to something he says, basically. 984 00:56:54,800 --> 00:56:56,680 Yeah, yeah. And and then that's like that 985 00:56:56,680 --> 00:56:58,320 bit with the gay man who propositions him. 986 00:56:58,320 --> 00:56:59,920 Oh. I think it's so funny that twice 987 00:56:59,920 --> 00:57:02,200 he says. I like to watch that was really 988 00:57:02,200 --> 00:57:04,520 clever to two different people and they. 989 00:57:04,560 --> 00:57:08,840 Let me go get Warren, yeah? That was fantastic. 990 00:57:09,000 --> 00:57:10,480 I did a little bit of research actually. 991 00:57:10,480 --> 00:57:14,200 You know the ambassador calls him Krillovian then, if you 992 00:57:14,200 --> 00:57:15,440 cook. Yes he does. 993 00:57:15,720 --> 00:57:17,280 Yes, I. Didn't know about Krylov so I 994 00:57:17,280 --> 00:57:20,240 just researched it. A Russian writer of innocent 995 00:57:20,240 --> 00:57:22,960 sounding fables. Which really? 996 00:57:22,960 --> 00:57:25,320 So the Russian ambassadors kind of picked up on the fact that 997 00:57:25,320 --> 00:57:27,600 chance is simple, but in a good way. 998 00:57:28,600 --> 00:57:30,480 That's sort of childlike, isn't he really? 999 00:57:31,720 --> 00:57:34,680 You know, yeah. Why interrupt your enemies when 1000 00:57:34,680 --> 00:57:36,320 they're making mistakes? Is that the proverb? 1001 00:57:37,960 --> 00:57:41,080 So if he, if he's if, if. Because obviously Russia and 1002 00:57:41,480 --> 00:57:44,760 America were, you know, in the middle of the Cold War at this 1003 00:57:44,760 --> 00:57:46,880 time. If the if the ambassador has 1004 00:57:46,880 --> 00:57:50,160 picked up the chances as as simpleton and that he's taken in 1005 00:57:50,160 --> 00:57:54,680 all these rich, influential Yankees, then who is he? 1006 00:57:54,720 --> 00:57:57,640 Who's he to blow the gaffe and tell people that it's the 1007 00:57:57,640 --> 00:57:59,560 Emperor has no clothes or whatever, you know? 1008 00:58:00,000 --> 00:58:01,920 That's a very. That's a very good comparison, 1009 00:58:01,920 --> 00:58:03,360 isn't it? The emperor's got no clothes. 1010 00:58:03,360 --> 00:58:04,560 Yeah. Yeah. 1011 00:58:04,720 --> 00:58:06,560 No one wants to say it. They want to keep the party 1012 00:58:06,560 --> 00:58:07,040 going. Yeah. 1013 00:58:07,720 --> 00:58:10,720 Yes, that's it. I want just just talking about 1014 00:58:10,720 --> 00:58:13,120 Sellers, He said. It's quite interesting because 1015 00:58:13,120 --> 00:58:17,440 he told his friend Max Geldreau, who was from the Goon Show days, 1016 00:58:18,160 --> 00:58:22,760 he told him that he looks quite plump. 1017 00:58:22,760 --> 00:58:25,320 He said I look plump, which was deliberate. 1018 00:58:25,320 --> 00:58:27,240 I wanted the character looks to look stocky. 1019 00:58:28,200 --> 00:58:31,200 However, now I've now I've lost almost 30 lbs. 1020 00:58:31,200 --> 00:58:32,960 I've made myself rather weak in the process. 1021 00:58:33,480 --> 00:58:36,560 But it was necessary for Fu Manchu or for me maybe. 1022 00:58:37,040 --> 00:58:40,880 And and that's because the film after this was his last film 1023 00:58:41,360 --> 00:58:43,800 released posthumously, which was the fetus plot of Doctor Feu 1024 00:58:43,800 --> 00:58:47,760 Manchu, which he plays a very, very slender, almost skeletal 1025 00:58:48,280 --> 00:58:48,760 man. Oh, wow. 1026 00:58:48,760 --> 00:58:50,880 So he did that. Straight. 1027 00:58:51,040 --> 00:58:52,320 After. Yeah, Yeah. 1028 00:58:52,320 --> 00:58:53,680 So he had to lose all that weight. 1029 00:58:55,120 --> 00:58:56,480 You've never seen that film, I take it? 1030 00:58:56,480 --> 00:58:59,200 No, no, I haven't. No, no. 1031 00:58:59,200 --> 00:59:03,120 It's it's worth it's worth a watch it it. 1032 00:59:03,120 --> 00:59:05,560 I was going to say, if it ever turns up on TV, it won't. 1033 00:59:05,800 --> 00:59:08,120 It won't turn up on TV nowadays, I don't think. 1034 00:59:08,200 --> 00:59:12,000 But if it turns up for free on Prime, give it a go because it's 1035 00:59:12,000 --> 00:59:13,800 not bad. It is bad, but it's not. 1036 00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:15,880 It's, it's got interesting stuff in it. 1037 00:59:17,080 --> 00:59:24,320 Also, Sellers had a thing where he would, he'd make a film and 1038 00:59:24,320 --> 00:59:26,560 then immediately, I mean halfway through making a film, often 1039 00:59:26,560 --> 00:59:29,520 he'd hate, he'd say he hates it, but very often he'd complete a 1040 00:59:29,520 --> 00:59:32,200 film and say he hates it. Always critical of his 1041 00:59:32,200 --> 00:59:33,720 performance and always critical of the films. 1042 00:59:33,920 --> 00:59:38,120 Not all of them, but a lot of them, in some cases justifiably. 1043 00:59:39,520 --> 00:59:43,280 But, but this was one of the rare films there was a hand. 1044 00:59:43,280 --> 00:59:46,200 I mean, he loved Strangelove. He loved I'm all right, Jack. 1045 00:59:46,400 --> 00:59:50,280 And he absolutely loved. Yeah, He he really was. 1046 00:59:50,280 --> 00:59:53,960 He was delighted with the way this film with with one 1047 00:59:53,960 --> 00:59:55,800 exception, and I'll come to that in a second. 1048 00:59:56,160 --> 01:00:02,120 He loved the finished film, OK, but apparently he was watching 1049 01:00:02,120 --> 01:00:04,240 it. He he was he had a private 1050 01:00:04,240 --> 01:00:10,400 showing and some some cinema. With his daughter Victoria, who 1051 01:00:10,400 --> 01:00:16,160 would have been why she'd have been what, maybe only 1314, if 1052 01:00:16,160 --> 01:00:19,640 that, at this time. And she and she was, she was 1053 01:00:19,640 --> 01:00:23,000 rather lukewarm about the film. And he was. 1054 01:00:23,000 --> 01:00:25,320 So he was so annoyed. He poured his drink over her 1055 01:00:25,320 --> 01:00:27,000 head. What drink was it? 1056 01:00:28,040 --> 01:00:31,120 Well, I hope it wasn't hot coffee, but it's an alcoholic 1057 01:00:31,120 --> 01:00:31,480 drink. Maybe. 1058 01:00:33,400 --> 01:00:34,360 Who knows? Who knows? 1059 01:00:34,360 --> 01:00:38,080 But but the, the, yeah, he, he liked the film. 1060 01:00:38,080 --> 01:00:40,840 He loved the film, I should say. He didn't like the one thing he 1061 01:00:40,840 --> 01:00:43,480 didn't like. And there's two different 1062 01:00:43,840 --> 01:00:47,880 versions of this where you get a straight sort of end, you know, 1063 01:00:47,880 --> 01:00:52,280 the, the, the end credits. And then you there's the, the 1064 01:00:52,280 --> 01:00:57,320 Raphael, what they call the Raphael blooper reel end 1065 01:00:57,320 --> 01:00:59,160 credits. Yeah, yeah. 1066 01:00:59,160 --> 01:01:01,080 That went out with the film originally, did it? 1067 01:01:02,680 --> 01:01:04,080 Yes. He was upset, wasn't he? 1068 01:01:04,680 --> 01:01:06,960 He was upset and he thought, he thought that's what that had 1069 01:01:06,960 --> 01:01:11,040 cost him the Oscar. It's so funny though, I loved it 1070 01:01:11,040 --> 01:01:14,480 when that came. Up well, he's he's a he's a 1071 01:01:15,040 --> 01:01:20,440 habitual giggler on film sets. And they had the scene where 1072 01:01:21,000 --> 01:01:25,720 people haven't seen it, where he's telling the doctor. 1073 01:01:25,720 --> 01:01:31,800 I think about these St. Punks and and and this guy 1074 01:01:31,800 --> 01:01:35,440 Raphael that they think he's connected with anyway, and 1075 01:01:35,440 --> 01:01:41,640 sellers is well, sellers as chance is trying to repeat what 1076 01:01:41,640 --> 01:01:44,680 they said to him and he just keeps bursting into giggles. 1077 01:01:46,160 --> 01:01:51,080 It's it's it's it's very funny, but completely I think it is 1078 01:01:51,080 --> 01:01:55,280 completely wrong to I, I personally feel it shouldn't 1079 01:01:55,280 --> 01:01:58,720 have been stuck on at the end. It is a bit weird because it 1080 01:01:58,720 --> 01:02:02,280 just, OK, the film's technically finished, although some people 1081 01:02:02,280 --> 01:02:04,560 would say that it's not finished until the credits are rolled, 1082 01:02:04,600 --> 01:02:08,240 you know, and suddenly you're just totally out of the film. 1083 01:02:09,000 --> 01:02:10,760 Yeah. Yeah, it's a bit, Yeah. 1084 01:02:11,560 --> 01:02:14,400 I think it's a good thing to have on a DVD, isn't it really? 1085 01:02:14,840 --> 01:02:15,320 It's one of. Those. 1086 01:02:15,320 --> 01:02:16,680 That's an extra. Yeah, that's an extra, 1087 01:02:18,160 --> 01:02:21,080 especially after the end being him walking on water. 1088 01:02:21,080 --> 01:02:24,840 And, and whether you like it or not, it give, you know, you, you 1089 01:02:24,840 --> 01:02:26,520 watch that scene. If you're of a certain mindset, 1090 01:02:26,520 --> 01:02:29,240 you might watch that scene and and you might want, you know, a 1091 01:02:29,280 --> 01:02:31,080 few minutes to sort of contemplate what you've just 1092 01:02:31,080 --> 01:02:33,600 seen and then suddenly you've got these outtakes. 1093 01:02:34,320 --> 01:02:44,200 Now get this, hunky, you go tell Raphael that I ain't taking no 1094 01:02:44,200 --> 01:03:02,720 jive. Sorry that I ain't taking no 1095 01:03:02,720 --> 01:03:08,040 jive from no Western Union messenger. 1096 01:03:08,800 --> 01:03:22,520 You tell that asshole if he. I haven't actually read the book 1097 01:03:22,880 --> 01:03:26,120 I really want to, but I think the original title of the book 1098 01:03:26,120 --> 01:03:28,560 was something like The Blank Page or The Blank Slate. 1099 01:03:29,200 --> 01:03:35,280 So chance is, chance is, is an empty vessel as we've said, and 1100 01:03:35,280 --> 01:03:39,280 he's a person that people can project onto constantly. 1101 01:03:40,120 --> 01:03:42,400 Yeah. And so they're just reflecting 1102 01:03:43,080 --> 01:03:45,480 themselves. And I think the reason people 1103 01:03:45,480 --> 01:03:49,920 like him, obviously it's not realistic, but people like him 1104 01:03:49,920 --> 01:03:53,560 because he hasn't got any of those things that we always 1105 01:03:53,560 --> 01:03:56,120 associate with people, such as egos. 1106 01:03:56,760 --> 01:03:58,480 That's not all people are about, obviously. 1107 01:03:58,480 --> 01:04:02,640 But when you're negotiating with people, the lawyers at the 1108 01:04:02,640 --> 01:04:05,760 beginning, they're absolutely amazes guys and contesting what 1109 01:04:05,760 --> 01:04:08,240 they're saying. Yeah, Yeah, I think Ben Rand 1110 01:04:08,240 --> 01:04:11,640 obviously is at the top of business and Bobby's at the top 1111 01:04:11,640 --> 01:04:16,240 of politics, and it's probably just so refreshing for them to 1112 01:04:16,240 --> 01:04:19,960 have just a person. I think he just makes everyone 1113 01:04:19,960 --> 01:04:22,760 feel peaceful. Like I said, he's a bit like, I 1114 01:04:22,760 --> 01:04:27,600 actually think of him almost like a house cat, because I love 1115 01:04:27,600 --> 01:04:30,000 cats. And what I find funny about cats 1116 01:04:30,000 --> 01:04:34,720 is that you're never quite sure whether they consider you part 1117 01:04:34,720 --> 01:04:38,280 of their family or they just really like this home. 1118 01:04:38,840 --> 01:04:42,200 They, they, you know, obviously they're very good at, at self 1119 01:04:42,200 --> 01:04:44,840 preservation and getting the best for themselves. 1120 01:04:44,840 --> 01:04:48,280 So they'll find the warmest, they'll find a place near the 1121 01:04:48,280 --> 01:04:51,480 radiator to have a nap. And he's a bit like that. 1122 01:04:51,920 --> 01:04:55,160 You know, you wonder what he would have done had the limo not 1123 01:04:55,160 --> 01:04:59,480 bumped into him, but it did. And he's just kind of got a 1124 01:04:59,480 --> 01:05:02,360 cushy number, but he doesn't seem to even realise it. 1125 01:05:02,920 --> 01:05:05,280 Well, yeah, because there's a bit where he's. 1126 01:05:05,320 --> 01:05:11,680 He wanders outside and one of the butlers or one of the guys, 1127 01:05:11,680 --> 01:05:16,800 one of the employees of the of the of Ben Rand says, would you 1128 01:05:16,800 --> 01:05:19,800 like a car, Sir? Meaning would you like me to get 1129 01:05:19,800 --> 01:05:23,240 you a car to take you somewhere? And Chancellor says, yeah, oh, 1130 01:05:23,240 --> 01:05:29,360 yes, I would like a car. But I imagine if he'd actually 1131 01:05:29,360 --> 01:05:32,400 got in the car and be driven off, he'd just go where it took 1132 01:05:32,400 --> 01:05:34,280 him. He wouldn't be bothered, He 1133 01:05:34,280 --> 01:05:37,400 says. He says to Ben during dinner, he 1134 01:05:37,400 --> 01:05:41,280 he, he touches on the fact that the he says the old man died. 1135 01:05:41,480 --> 01:05:45,640 I think he says they had to close up the house, which I 1136 01:05:45,640 --> 01:05:49,360 think Ben interprets as he means he was a businessman and he had 1137 01:05:49,360 --> 01:05:51,360 to close his business. That's right, Yeah. 1138 01:05:51,360 --> 01:05:53,280 And then? Maybe he lost his business so 1139 01:05:53,280 --> 01:05:54,920 he's a bit of a victim he feels sorry for. 1140 01:05:55,240 --> 01:05:58,320 Him, that's it, that's it. And then and then and then 1141 01:05:58,320 --> 01:06:00,160 chances, all I've got is the room upstairs. 1142 01:06:00,440 --> 01:06:02,760 All I've got left is the room upstairs, meaning the room that 1143 01:06:02,760 --> 01:06:04,640 he's been staying in UPS literally upstairs. 1144 01:06:04,640 --> 01:06:07,720 But Ben interprets that as he's oh God. 1145 01:06:08,480 --> 01:06:09,560 Oh, it's really the room upstairs. 1146 01:06:09,720 --> 01:06:11,640 Yeah, of course. He's talking about heaven. 1147 01:06:11,880 --> 01:06:15,720 Oh no, you know, there's more. There's more to live for man. 1148 01:06:15,720 --> 01:06:23,600 Kind of that's that's the there was a a review of the film in 1149 01:06:24,040 --> 01:06:28,240 Time magazine when it came out, which I just highlighted because 1150 01:06:28,240 --> 01:06:31,120 I thought it was just a little bit from that review because it 1151 01:06:31,120 --> 01:06:36,280 was really insightful. I felt it says the the audience 1152 01:06:36,280 --> 01:06:39,160 must believe that chance is so completely blank as as you were 1153 01:06:39,160 --> 01:06:42,880 saying just before that he could indeed seem to be all things to 1154 01:06:42,880 --> 01:06:46,280 all people. Peter Sellers meticulously 1155 01:06:46,280 --> 01:06:48,920 controlled performance brings off this seemingly impossible 1156 01:06:48,920 --> 01:06:51,920 task. As he proved in Lolita, he is 1157 01:06:51,920 --> 01:06:55,200 master at adapting the surreal characters of modern fiction to 1158 01:06:55,200 --> 01:06:56,800 the naturalistic demands of movies. 1159 01:06:57,280 --> 01:07:01,400 His chance is sexless, effectless and guileless to a 1160 01:07:01,400 --> 01:07:04,240 fault. His face shows no emotion except 1161 01:07:04,240 --> 01:07:06,280 the beatific, innocent smile of a moron. 1162 01:07:06,720 --> 01:07:09,800 Seller's gestures are so specific and consistent that 1163 01:07:09,800 --> 01:07:12,240 chance never becomes clownish or arch. 1164 01:07:12,560 --> 01:07:15,200 He is convincing enough to make the film's fantastic premise 1165 01:07:15,200 --> 01:07:18,080 credible, yet he manages to get every laugh. 1166 01:07:20,520 --> 01:07:22,840 And yeah, I think that's that's spot on. 1167 01:07:23,640 --> 01:07:24,960 There's not. But like you said, there's not a 1168 01:07:24,960 --> 01:07:25,760 lot of laughs. It is. 1169 01:07:26,520 --> 01:07:28,280 No, not really. There's not really gags. 1170 01:07:28,360 --> 01:07:33,440 It's I suppose if you buy into the absurdity of it, you know, 1171 01:07:33,440 --> 01:07:36,200 you could laugh at a few bits, but it's not really gag lines. 1172 01:07:36,680 --> 01:07:39,800 No, no. Can I, can I tell you my Peter 1173 01:07:39,800 --> 01:07:42,920 Sellers story? That not my personal experience 1174 01:07:42,920 --> 01:07:44,320 obviously. Please do. 1175 01:07:45,280 --> 01:07:47,480 You knew I was going to mention John Lennon, The Beatles at one 1176 01:07:47,480 --> 01:07:50,400 point. But yes, I've got a great story. 1177 01:07:50,440 --> 01:07:54,040 I think I heard it directly from Ringo Starr in the sense of 1178 01:07:54,320 --> 01:07:55,920 actually saw him on a video saying it. 1179 01:07:56,000 --> 01:08:00,880 I think on a radio show when they made Magic Christian in 69. 1180 01:08:01,560 --> 01:08:02,800 Yes, I actually think it's quite. 1181 01:08:03,520 --> 01:08:05,000 That's great, I love it. Yeah, I think. 1182 01:08:05,000 --> 01:08:06,960 Have you reviewed that? Oh yes. 1183 01:08:06,960 --> 01:08:08,760 Yeah, yeah, that's what you would have done. 1184 01:08:08,840 --> 01:08:12,040 Now Ringostar said that something, I can't remember 1185 01:08:12,040 --> 01:08:14,400 exactly what he said, but he said through the day him and 1186 01:08:14,400 --> 01:08:17,479 Peter would build up a rapport. They'd go out and have a few 1187 01:08:17,479 --> 01:08:21,640 drinks in the evening and you'd think, oh, oh, he's mates. 1188 01:08:21,640 --> 01:08:23,359 He's he's my mate now. We're mates. 1189 01:08:24,080 --> 01:08:28,439 The next morning sellers might have a hangover or whatever, but 1190 01:08:28,600 --> 01:08:31,200 it was almost if the next morning, sellers had forgotten 1191 01:08:31,439 --> 01:08:33,960 all the camaraderie that built up, Ringo started. 1192 01:08:34,240 --> 01:08:37,120 You almost had to start afresh every day. 1193 01:08:37,720 --> 01:08:39,000 Yeah, that's right. That's really. 1194 01:08:39,000 --> 01:08:42,279 Interesting, isn't it? And I, I definitely think I've 1195 01:08:42,319 --> 01:08:44,880 always seen similarities between John Lennon and Peter Sellers, 1196 01:08:46,200 --> 01:08:51,160 partly because I skew more to the, the darker version of what 1197 01:08:51,160 --> 01:08:54,160 John Lennon was actually like towards the end of his life, 1198 01:08:54,240 --> 01:08:56,520 let's say the last five years. You know, you know, this is 1199 01:08:56,560 --> 01:09:01,040 these two kind of polar opposite books that were written and I 1200 01:09:01,040 --> 01:09:04,120 see a little bit, I see Lennon Sellers and they actually died 1201 01:09:04,120 --> 01:09:07,520 within six months of each other, of course, through very 1202 01:09:07,520 --> 01:09:11,040 different means, obviously. But yeah, this this idea of 1203 01:09:11,520 --> 01:09:17,319 someone who they have an almost a power in the fact they don't 1204 01:09:17,319 --> 01:09:19,439 seem to have a personality. I'm not saying John Lennon was 1205 01:09:19,439 --> 01:09:23,040 like this, but John Lennon was definitely a chameleon in some 1206 01:09:23,040 --> 01:09:25,560 way or another. You know, he the changes that he 1207 01:09:25,560 --> 01:09:28,520 went through, you're never quite sure. 1208 01:09:28,800 --> 01:09:31,960 That's why, you know, I think the biopic on John Lennon that's 1209 01:09:31,960 --> 01:09:35,080 never been made that should have done is the is the Lennon 1210 01:09:35,080 --> 01:09:37,560 version of the Bob Dylan I'm not there film. 1211 01:09:37,560 --> 01:09:40,200 Have you seen that? I haven't, but I've heard about 1212 01:09:40,200 --> 01:09:41,120 it, which is. Fantastic. 1213 01:09:41,120 --> 01:09:45,359 So what he did very cleverly, he took 6 characters, none of which 1214 01:09:45,359 --> 01:09:47,720 are called Bob Dylan, but they're all aspects of Bob 1215 01:09:47,720 --> 01:09:52,240 Dylan. And Southern seems to be quite 1216 01:09:52,240 --> 01:09:54,880 multifaceted. But are all these kind of things 1217 01:09:54,880 --> 01:09:57,440 about him as a parent broadly true? 1218 01:09:58,080 --> 01:10:04,360 Yeah, they are right. He, I think he liked the idea of 1219 01:10:04,360 --> 01:10:09,320 being a parent, but putting it into practice sometimes or often 1220 01:10:09,320 --> 01:10:13,040 times was a was a pain in the ass as far as he was concerned. 1221 01:10:15,360 --> 01:10:18,880 Sellers could be incredibly generous, incredibly generous 1222 01:10:18,880 --> 01:10:22,200 with with friends and family and family, but friends 1223 01:10:22,200 --> 01:10:26,880 particularly. But then like for the next day, 1224 01:10:26,880 --> 01:10:30,680 like say like with Ringo, the next day it it it could be the 1225 01:10:30,680 --> 01:10:32,640 complete he completely be the complete opposite change his 1226 01:10:32,640 --> 01:10:36,320 mind. Or he gave he gave Spike 1227 01:10:36,320 --> 01:10:38,400 Milligan a car, an old vintage car. 1228 01:10:39,560 --> 01:10:43,880 And then I think I'm right saying as a couple of days 1229 01:10:43,880 --> 01:10:51,560 later, this this truck arrived at Milligan's and tow truck and 1230 01:10:51,720 --> 01:10:54,600 towed the towed the car away because sellers had decided to 1231 01:10:54,600 --> 01:10:57,800 give it to someone else, changed his mind giving it, giving it to 1232 01:10:57,800 --> 01:11:00,440 someone else. I think, I think Prince, I think 1233 01:11:00,600 --> 01:11:02,480 I want to say Princess Margaret. I might be wrong do. 1234 01:11:04,320 --> 01:11:06,800 You think there's a do you think there's nothing malicious in it? 1235 01:11:06,800 --> 01:11:11,720 Do you think he's just like I just don't literally forgotten 1236 01:11:11,720 --> 01:11:13,680 or? I don't think he'd forget. 1237 01:11:13,680 --> 01:11:16,000 I don't think he'd forgotten. I think he knew full well, but I 1238 01:11:16,000 --> 01:11:16,920 just don't. I think he was. 1239 01:11:16,920 --> 01:11:21,920 He was just differently wired. I don't think he was a malicious 1240 01:11:21,920 --> 01:11:27,760 man as far as it goes. He could be nasty, but I don't 1241 01:11:27,760 --> 01:11:31,320 think he'd like to deliberately hurt people, really. 1242 01:11:32,080 --> 01:11:34,160 Yeah, just go, just go back to John Lennon again. 1243 01:11:34,160 --> 01:11:37,360 What he had was an amazing ability to sort of 1244 01:11:37,360 --> 01:11:41,680 compartmentalise and go through massive changes and seeming 1245 01:11:41,720 --> 01:11:45,920 seemingly to fit into the next role. 1246 01:11:45,920 --> 01:11:49,320 I mean, we actually did a show about John Lennon as an actor. 1247 01:11:49,720 --> 01:11:52,200 There's not really that much to go on, but we said potentially 1248 01:11:53,040 --> 01:11:55,000 for some of the same reasons as Sellers. 1249 01:11:55,800 --> 01:11:59,480 That personality almost made him perfect for an actor. 1250 01:11:59,480 --> 01:12:01,280 And just give me a little example. 1251 01:12:02,360 --> 01:12:03,920 I know you know about The Beatles and stuff. 1252 01:12:05,160 --> 01:12:07,040 John Lennon had this last weekend period. 1253 01:12:08,280 --> 01:12:11,920 And as as with a lot of things, there's two camps now. 1254 01:12:11,920 --> 01:12:16,480 One's more premier Co camp. The other camp, which I slant 1255 01:12:16,480 --> 01:12:19,120 more towards, is that he was quite happy with Mei Pang and 1256 01:12:19,880 --> 01:12:22,480 she was making him behave a bit more like a man. 1257 01:12:22,640 --> 01:12:24,400 They were like a boyfriend and girlfriend. 1258 01:12:25,560 --> 01:12:29,800 And there's an amazing interview where John Lennon has just moved 1259 01:12:29,800 --> 01:12:35,000 back into the Dakota. And obviously the official story 1260 01:12:35,000 --> 01:12:36,760 of it, you know, she allowed him to come home. 1261 01:12:36,760 --> 01:12:38,440 He'd slayed all his demons, etcetera. 1262 01:12:39,640 --> 01:12:43,960 And they do an interview and Mei Pang is brought up. 1263 01:12:44,560 --> 01:12:45,960 Someone just said, what about Mei Pang? 1264 01:12:45,960 --> 01:12:49,800 And John Lennon said, oh, yeah, yeah, she was a nice girl, you 1265 01:12:49,800 --> 01:12:53,040 know, something like that. And just three or four months 1266 01:12:53,080 --> 01:12:56,400 earlier, three or four months earlier, he told May that he was 1267 01:12:56,400 --> 01:12:59,320 going to divorce Yoko and him and May were actually looking 1268 01:12:59,320 --> 01:13:04,080 for a place to live together. And, and within a few months, 1269 01:13:04,320 --> 01:13:07,520 you know, John Yoko in my eyes have kind of got their shtick 1270 01:13:07,520 --> 01:13:09,480 together. And it's like, oh, May was a 1271 01:13:09,480 --> 01:13:11,160 nice girl. It's like he's just completely 1272 01:13:11,160 --> 01:13:13,800 changed. So I think I, I see a bit of 1273 01:13:13,800 --> 01:13:15,400 that. I see a bit of celebrity there, 1274 01:13:15,520 --> 01:13:18,800 you know. Seller's seller's all over that. 1275 01:13:18,920 --> 01:13:20,800 Absolutely. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, 1276 01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:23,240 yeah. If he'd throw himself into 1277 01:13:23,240 --> 01:13:30,280 something and then, you know, turn on a dime and suddenly move 1278 01:13:30,280 --> 01:13:32,040 on to something else. It's amazing. 1279 01:13:32,120 --> 01:13:34,440 Sure. He had a couple of meet ups with 1280 01:13:34,440 --> 01:13:37,360 The Beatles. I know he was presenting them 1281 01:13:37,360 --> 01:13:39,600 with an award in 65 and then obviously. 1282 01:13:39,640 --> 01:13:41,800 Oh, a grandma award, as he called it. 1283 01:13:42,200 --> 01:13:45,080 Yeah, I don't remember much about that, but and then 1284 01:13:45,080 --> 01:13:47,920 obviously he's in Get Back and there's a bit of spike. 1285 01:13:47,920 --> 01:13:51,200 In this, yeah, it's. What's your interpretation of 1286 01:13:51,200 --> 01:13:53,920 that? What's the Sellers camp say? 1287 01:13:54,600 --> 01:13:57,080 How do how do Peter Sellers fans look at it from that 1288 01:13:57,080 --> 01:14:00,160 perspective? I it's been a while since I 1289 01:14:00,160 --> 01:14:04,040 watched, I watched it, I bought the Blu-ray obviously, and it's 1290 01:14:04,040 --> 01:14:07,280 due another watch actually over, over a long bank holiday 1291 01:14:07,280 --> 01:14:14,600 weekend. So, yeah, I, I think he, again, 1292 01:14:14,600 --> 01:14:16,960 he was just, he was just not on form sellers. 1293 01:14:17,880 --> 01:14:22,680 I think he sensed that they'd used to sort of look to a degree 1294 01:14:22,680 --> 01:14:25,880 that kind of used to look up to him, right? 1295 01:14:26,480 --> 01:14:28,760 Certainly, obviously in the early days when he was 1296 01:14:28,760 --> 01:14:31,560 presenting them even with the Grammy Award on the set of help, 1297 01:14:31,960 --> 01:14:35,880 he was, he'd, he'd been a hero to all of them pretty much, 1298 01:14:36,040 --> 01:14:39,200 right. And, and, and I guess to to a 1299 01:14:39,200 --> 01:14:44,880 certain degree, they sort of paid court to him in the past. 1300 01:14:45,600 --> 01:14:51,400 But by this point, by 69, the power dynamic has totally 1301 01:14:51,400 --> 01:14:53,560 shifted. Obviously you know it almost. 1302 01:14:54,360 --> 01:14:57,320 I think I'm right in saying that Lennon was slightly contemptuous 1303 01:14:57,680 --> 01:15:01,720 to him or towards him. Well, and do you have the bit 1304 01:15:01,720 --> 01:15:04,240 where John Yoko being interviewed by a Canadian film 1305 01:15:04,240 --> 01:15:07,000 crew and he has to go, He has to stop it because he has to go and 1306 01:15:07,000 --> 01:15:09,760 be sick. He was coming off some sort of 1307 01:15:11,320 --> 01:15:14,400 druggie night because he even says to them, you know, that's 1308 01:15:14,400 --> 01:15:17,000 why that's what I love about it. They're almost like any, any 1309 01:15:17,000 --> 01:15:20,320 four guys in the bad, he says. I was got really high last night 1310 01:15:20,320 --> 01:15:22,480 and I was up till about 4:00 watching films. 1311 01:15:23,080 --> 01:15:25,040 You know, it sounds like something a student would say. 1312 01:15:25,600 --> 01:15:26,640 Yeah. The next day. 1313 01:15:26,840 --> 01:15:30,040 I think he's obviously, there's actually a bit in the Nagra 1314 01:15:30,040 --> 01:15:32,600 tapes where you hear him calling out for pet pills, which is what 1315 01:15:32,600 --> 01:15:35,280 they stake in Hamburg. So you still do doctors and 1316 01:15:35,280 --> 01:15:39,720 stuff. He he's quite, he's a kind of 1317 01:15:39,720 --> 01:15:41,360 guy. Like, you know, you had people 1318 01:15:41,360 --> 01:15:45,120 at school who have a sharp tongue and if they turn on you, 1319 01:15:45,120 --> 01:15:47,240 they can really mess you up emotionally. 1320 01:15:47,640 --> 01:15:50,520 He's a bit like that. I think he's decided to almost 1321 01:15:50,520 --> 01:15:53,360 turn on Sellers a little bit. And even Paul says something 1322 01:15:53,360 --> 01:15:56,440 quite sarcastic. And what happens actually is as 1323 01:15:56,440 --> 01:15:59,480 Peter Sellers is walking out, if you remember, he walks out the 1324 01:15:59,480 --> 01:16:02,520 wrong door. He's kind of showing that he's a 1325 01:16:02,520 --> 01:16:04,240 bit nervous. And they all laugh at him. 1326 01:16:04,240 --> 01:16:08,640 So it's a bit of a shame really. But but ironically enough, when 1327 01:16:08,800 --> 01:16:11,120 when John Lennon met Elvis Presley, he's obviously another 1328 01:16:11,120 --> 01:16:15,240 massive hero who he felt perhaps had let him down somehow. 1329 01:16:16,160 --> 01:16:20,040 He actually affected a Cluso voice when he was at his house. 1330 01:16:20,720 --> 01:16:23,200 Thanks fuzzy memories as he was walking off. 1331 01:16:23,200 --> 01:16:24,520 That sounded more German, didn't it? 1332 01:16:24,520 --> 01:16:26,760 But you. Know it'll take, yeah. 1333 01:16:27,520 --> 01:16:30,960 Yeah, Cluso accent, Yeah. So he was sort of taking the 1334 01:16:30,960 --> 01:16:32,800 piss as we take out of Elvis as well. 1335 01:16:32,840 --> 01:16:36,520 So I think John Lennon always had that thing of, you know, 1336 01:16:36,520 --> 01:16:39,160 about that stuff about disappointed father, 1337 01:16:39,280 --> 01:16:41,200 disappointing father figures, you know, oh, of. 1338 01:16:41,200 --> 01:16:42,040 Course. So oh, of course. 1339 01:16:43,320 --> 01:16:45,480 Probably a bit of that as well, you know, everyone was a 1340 01:16:45,480 --> 01:16:48,200 disappointment to him, it seems. Bye bye. 1341 01:16:48,720 --> 01:16:53,760 Too much people. Way out, way out. 1342 01:17:00,360 --> 01:17:03,240 Just don't leave the needle. There's one thing from the book, 1343 01:17:03,240 --> 01:17:06,560 actually, from the very first page Chance, like ATV image 1344 01:17:06,560 --> 01:17:10,360 floated into the world buoyed up by a force he did not see and 1345 01:17:10,360 --> 01:17:14,000 could not name. So that sounds a little bit 1346 01:17:14,000 --> 01:17:17,560 spiritual or mystical. You know, he floated into the 1347 01:17:17,560 --> 01:17:21,280 world like he's got No, it is curious, isn't it, having no 1348 01:17:21,280 --> 01:17:22,200 identity. It's. 1349 01:17:22,200 --> 01:17:23,640 Weird. It's a bit like, oh, you know, 1350 01:17:24,160 --> 01:17:26,120 it's a good. We probably think you're the 1351 01:17:26,120 --> 01:17:27,000 same. Thing I think. 1352 01:17:27,720 --> 01:17:29,200 It's a little bit like John Merrick. 1353 01:17:29,200 --> 01:17:30,560 Well, at least the film of the elephant. 1354 01:17:30,880 --> 01:17:34,920 Yeah, yeah. I mean, well, I'm sure you've 1355 01:17:34,920 --> 01:17:35,760 seen that. I love that. 1356 01:17:35,760 --> 01:17:39,600 I love that film. And he's an innocent who's 1357 01:17:39,600 --> 01:17:42,160 thrust into the public eye and becomes a media darling. 1358 01:17:43,600 --> 01:17:49,040 The shades of Kasper Hauser, the shades you've said about Rayman, 1359 01:17:49,040 --> 01:17:53,200 we've said about Forrest Gump. Dostoevsky's Prince Michigan 1360 01:17:53,200 --> 01:17:57,560 from the Idiot. I think so there's lots, I think 1361 01:17:57,560 --> 01:18:02,520 there's there's there's lots of literary echoes for Chance and 1362 01:18:03,640 --> 01:18:06,560 I've kind of alluded to it already, but it's not my 1363 01:18:06,560 --> 01:18:08,360 favorite Sellers film by a long chalk. 1364 01:18:08,800 --> 01:18:11,480 OK. I've always struggled to warm to 1365 01:18:11,480 --> 01:18:14,320 it. And I'm sorry to say that 1366 01:18:14,320 --> 01:18:17,320 because I know a lot of people absolutely adore it. 1367 01:18:17,400 --> 01:18:20,320 And the the tends to be, you know, those that say that it's 1368 01:18:20,320 --> 01:18:23,480 Doctor Strangelove that's his greatest film, or it's this film 1369 01:18:23,840 --> 01:18:26,960 that's his greatest film. I mean, yeah, for me, I'd say 1370 01:18:26,960 --> 01:18:29,600 Doctor Strangelove for sure. Absolutely. 1371 01:18:29,600 --> 01:18:33,560 Yeah, absolutely. I'm kind of in a similar camp. 1372 01:18:33,560 --> 01:18:38,040 I don't absolutely love it, but it's been so interesting 1373 01:18:38,400 --> 01:18:40,960 preparing it for this and then obviously talking to you about 1374 01:18:40,960 --> 01:18:43,560 it. It's one of those I've I'm just 1375 01:18:43,560 --> 01:18:47,200 doing a series on Citizen Kane and I do love Citizen Kane, but 1376 01:18:47,200 --> 01:18:50,840 it's amazing how much more you can get out of something when 1377 01:18:50,840 --> 01:18:53,920 someone points stuff out to you or you watch it. 1378 01:18:54,480 --> 01:18:56,440 You know, I sat down with Citizen Kane and I tried to work 1379 01:18:56,440 --> 01:18:59,680 out the timeline because, you know, if you think Pulp Fiction 1380 01:18:59,680 --> 01:19:03,000 was confusing, I mean, sits NK is really confusing 50 years 1381 01:19:03,000 --> 01:19:05,680 earlier. So it's been great, but I don't, 1382 01:19:06,680 --> 01:19:08,800 I think having made all these notes on this film, I probably 1383 01:19:08,800 --> 01:19:11,600 don't need to ever watch it again actually, because I 1384 01:19:11,600 --> 01:19:14,320 watched it, I sort of watched it once, but I kind of watched it 1385 01:19:14,360 --> 01:19:17,400 almost twice really. I I went back and watched a few 1386 01:19:17,400 --> 01:19:20,360 more scenes because I watched it a few weeks ago and then just 1387 01:19:20,360 --> 01:19:23,880 recently. So I think I admire it and the 1388 01:19:23,880 --> 01:19:27,160 number of ideas in the script. And there's lots of very subtle 1389 01:19:27,160 --> 01:19:29,640 stuff that we haven't really. I don't know. 1390 01:19:29,640 --> 01:19:31,840 I just ended up with so many notes, I had to stop. 1391 01:19:31,840 --> 01:19:36,440 But there are other subtle things that I can't bring to 1392 01:19:36,440 --> 01:19:38,200 mind. But there's, there's a lot in 1393 01:19:38,200 --> 01:19:41,160 the script. I think I I think maybe I admire 1394 01:19:41,160 --> 01:19:44,720 the film. I admire the script more than I 1395 01:19:44,960 --> 01:19:47,600 admire the ideas. Maybe the more than I enjoy. 1396 01:19:47,840 --> 01:19:48,760 Quote, UN quote. Yeah. 1397 01:19:49,080 --> 01:19:53,600 You know, and I'm glad that we both more or less aligned on 1398 01:19:53,840 --> 01:19:57,520 this film, but I would welcome feedback from listeners. 1399 01:19:58,400 --> 01:20:03,600 Please feel free to comment in the usual places and tell me 1400 01:20:03,600 --> 01:20:05,840 why. Tell me why we're wrong about 1401 01:20:05,840 --> 01:20:08,920 this film or why I'm wrong about this film and, and why I should 1402 01:20:08,920 --> 01:20:12,160 love it unconditionally. I'm not prepared to be 1403 01:20:12,160 --> 01:20:18,920 convinced, but try your best. And Anthony, obviously John 1404 01:20:18,920 --> 01:20:23,640 Lennon the the podcast is Glass Onion and it focuses very much 1405 01:20:23,640 --> 01:20:26,560 on John Lennon the man not. I guess it can't avoid talking 1406 01:20:26,560 --> 01:20:29,720 about The Beatles sometimes, but it's very much about John Lennon 1407 01:20:29,720 --> 01:20:31,240 as opposed to The Beatles, isn't it? 1408 01:20:31,760 --> 01:20:35,000 Yeah, Glass Onion on John Lennon and it's amazing, really. 1409 01:20:35,000 --> 01:20:38,600 I've done 108 episodes now and I've. 1410 01:20:39,080 --> 01:20:41,320 I think he only made six or seven albums because some of 1411 01:20:41,320 --> 01:20:45,160 them are half albums with Yoko and I've only really reviewed 3 1412 01:20:45,160 --> 01:20:47,000 or 4 of them. There's loads of his films that 1413 01:20:47,000 --> 01:20:50,640 I haven't reviewed as in documentaries and stuff, so it 1414 01:20:50,640 --> 01:20:53,200 just keeps on going. Yeah, but I, I use John Lennon 1415 01:20:53,200 --> 01:20:57,080 as a launch point. I mean, we've we've done shows. 1416 01:20:58,280 --> 01:21:02,640 I did a series like John Lennon in 19676569. 1417 01:21:02,800 --> 01:21:04,400 It wasn't done nor do it's quite random. 1418 01:21:04,720 --> 01:21:09,760 We actually spent the first part of the podcast probably got 1419 01:21:09,760 --> 01:21:11,240 almost like an hour and a half episode. 1420 01:21:11,240 --> 01:21:12,840 I'm just looking at the actual year. 1421 01:21:12,840 --> 01:21:16,360 And then we looked at the John Lennon stuff after. 1422 01:21:16,360 --> 01:21:18,960 Yeah. So I have quite a wide interest 1423 01:21:18,960 --> 01:21:24,360 in lots of different things in terms of politics and the world 1424 01:21:24,360 --> 01:21:26,920 and everything. So we used to learn in that way. 1425 01:21:26,920 --> 01:21:30,720 And yeah, I, I wrote down a few more ideas at the, the end of 1426 01:21:30,720 --> 01:21:33,440 last year. And yeah, there's still loads of 1427 01:21:33,440 --> 01:21:35,040 biopics and stuff I haven't done. 1428 01:21:35,040 --> 01:21:36,840 So I guess it'll keep on rolling. 1429 01:21:36,840 --> 01:21:40,280 And I don't really feel like I repeat myself too much. 1430 01:21:40,720 --> 01:21:42,880 Obviously you repeat yourself to some extent. 1431 01:21:43,160 --> 01:21:44,920 Oh, I know I, I do on this as well. 1432 01:21:44,920 --> 01:21:46,200 I know we do. I know. 1433 01:21:46,200 --> 01:21:48,920 I think I'm making some original observation and then I think oh 1434 01:21:48,920 --> 01:21:51,160 shit Dang, I said that 10 shows ago. 1435 01:21:51,680 --> 01:21:54,520 But people don't mind it because you don't, I don't, you know, me 1436 01:21:54,520 --> 01:21:56,800 as a, I'm a basically a podcast addict. 1437 01:21:56,800 --> 01:22:00,320 As a consumer, I don't mind if people repeat themselves because 1438 01:22:00,320 --> 01:22:03,280 it's sometimes things are worth saying more than once, you know, 1439 01:22:03,480 --> 01:22:06,360 So such as I find myself saying something on a show. 1440 01:22:06,840 --> 01:22:09,760 And I think, yeah, I probably said that about six months ago. 1441 01:22:09,760 --> 01:22:11,520 So most people probably have forgotten. 1442 01:22:12,280 --> 01:22:18,160 OK, and and one one film goal we mentioned of course, but I 1443 01:22:18,160 --> 01:22:19,920 forgot to mention life and life only. 1444 01:22:19,920 --> 01:22:24,920 Yes, that's the podcast that I was sort of envisage would take 1445 01:22:24,920 --> 01:22:27,840 over from Glass Onion because I felt Glass Onion had a shelf 1446 01:22:27,840 --> 01:22:30,920 life and I thought I'll do a podcast about life and then 1447 01:22:30,920 --> 01:22:33,160 you're probably never going to run out of material. 1448 01:22:34,440 --> 01:22:37,440 Life and life Only is actually a line from a Bob Dylan song 1449 01:22:37,880 --> 01:22:39,600 called It's All Right bar I'm Only Bleeding. 1450 01:22:39,600 --> 01:22:40,920 But the podcast has nothing to do with that. 1451 01:22:40,920 --> 01:22:45,120 It's my psychology. It's a bit of a alternative 1452 01:22:45,120 --> 01:22:47,720 media podcasts as well, and sometimes I go into true crime. 1453 01:22:47,720 --> 01:22:50,560 I did a couple of shows on 10 Rillington Place which I'm 1454 01:22:50,560 --> 01:22:53,240 absolutely obsessed by. Love the film. 1455 01:22:53,400 --> 01:22:56,040 Absolutely adore the film. Yeah, well, the the real case is 1456 01:22:56,080 --> 01:23:00,120 absolutely incredible because it's part of it is basically 1457 01:23:00,120 --> 01:23:03,480 unsolved. No one we know Christie did some 1458 01:23:03,480 --> 01:23:05,200 of the murders, but some of the others aren't. 1459 01:23:05,200 --> 01:23:09,760 So occasionally I even did a podcast about the Southport Axel 1460 01:23:09,760 --> 01:23:12,440 Riddick, Abada and and Lucy Lepi as well recently. 1461 01:23:12,480 --> 01:23:13,880 So he'll blind me. Yeah. 1462 01:23:13,880 --> 01:23:17,440 So if it's if it's about life, I'll give myself a license to do 1463 01:23:17,440 --> 01:23:22,520 anything really blind me, OK. You're a very, a very thoughtful 1464 01:23:22,840 --> 01:23:26,680 individual clearly and and I've, I've really enjoyed having you 1465 01:23:26,680 --> 01:23:30,480 on and look forward to speaking to you again at some point. 1466 01:23:30,480 --> 01:23:34,800 So, so Anthony, thanks and we will speak again. 1467 01:23:34,800 --> 01:23:36,280 Yeah, thanks very much. I enjoyed it. 1468 01:23:36,280 --> 01:23:42,400 I'm not sure I. Understand I love him 'cause 1469 01:23:42,400 --> 01:23:46,920 he's tiny and small. I love you 'cause you're yellow 1470 01:23:46,960 --> 01:23:51,000 and tall. Tiny and small love, Yellow and 1471 01:23:51,000 --> 01:23:54,840 tall love. Everyone loves through all their 1472 01:23:54,840 --> 01:23:58,680 days. Different people, different 1473 01:23:58,680 --> 01:24:10,120 ways. I love him 'cause he has to be 1474 01:24:10,240 --> 01:24:13,920 fed. I love you 'cause you make your 1475 01:24:13,920 --> 01:24:17,560 own bed. He has to be fed, love, make 1476 01:24:17,560 --> 01:24:21,880 your own bed, love. Everyone loves through all their 1477 01:24:22,000 --> 01:24:22,200 days.