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I met Peter, Peter Sellers and I
was in several of his and and he

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was just the person I liked 
acting with most. 

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What do you remember about 
working with him? 

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Everything we didn't have to 
say, well, we did say a word 

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because he never stopped 
giggling and I'm a terrible 

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giggler, but he, he just, I 
don't know. 

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We seem to on that, if on 
nothing else, we thought 

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completely alike of of how to 
how to go about a character. 

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I mean, we seem to fit in. 
Whereas with Tony Hancock, you 

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see who I think was one of the 
funniest men for my mummy. 

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I mean, to begin with, he was a 
washout, which is funny in 

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itself. 
I think it's sad too. 

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But but you see, the minute the 
thing was in the bag, Tony 

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disappeared into his caravan. 
He there was no connection at 

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all between you. 
Whereas Peter, I mean like 

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Missus Kite or anybody, we were 
always together. 

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We lunched together and we sort 
of carried the kite picture 

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forward, which you know, where 
we would live and how and this 

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and this which helped when we 
came to actually do the thing. 

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And of course, that brought him 
right to the forefront. 

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The. 
Hello and welcome to Goon Pod, 

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where we nearly always have a 
second vegetable. 

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My name is Tyler Adams and this 
week I am joined by returning 

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guest Donna Reese. 
Hello Tyler, thank you so much 

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for having me back. 
I'm very honoured. 

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Oh, my pleasure, my pleasure. 
I think the last, well, the last

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time that we spoke was we were 
talking about Bedazzled for for 

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Goon Pod Film Club, yes, which 
which is out there and available

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for anybody who wants to sign up
for a free seven day trial to 

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have a listen to us talk about 
Bedazzled. 

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Most recently, we've been 
talking about not you and I, but

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me and my guest Mark Cousins 
were talking about the film 

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school for Scoundrels. 
Yeah, I know that. 

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Yeah, yeah. 
Have you watched? 

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Have you watched that recently? 
I haven't seen it recently but I

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I do know about it. 
Is is that the one with the with

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the hard cheese? 
Hard cheese, yes. 

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They're they're playing tennis. 
And Ian Carmichael's getting 

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roundly pasted by Terry Thomas, 
and he keeps going. 

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Hard cheese. 
Hard cheese, yes. 

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I I actually got my dad a mug 
with hard cheese written on it 

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because he loved that film. 
Yeah, he loved Terry Thomas. 

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OK, so you've got Terry Thomas, 
Ian Carmichael, you've got, I've

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got Alistair SIM, of course, 
Alistair SIM, Jeanette Scott, 

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who briefly, briefly had a fling
with Peter Sellers in the Oh my.

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God. 60s right? 
She's the daughter of Thora 

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Hood. 
Thora Hood. 

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Yeah, and she said that she she 
was convinced that the only 

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reason that Peter Sellers got 
together with her was because he

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wanted access to Thora. 
I don't mean in AI don't mean in

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a in a sexual way, but I mean 
Isla. 

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I mean, what I meant was he, he 
absolutely loved listening to 

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Thora's stories and things. 
Oh, right on the set of Went the

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Day. 
Well, like macheteing Nazi. 

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Absolutely. 
And who else was in that film? 

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Oh, there was someone else in 
that film school for scoundrels 

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right at the end. 
Little cameo. 

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Only someone called Irene Handel
of. 

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Course. 
Oh my goodness. 

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Yeah. 
She often pops up at the end of 

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films. 
This is like the wrong box and 

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things like that, doesn't she? 
Yes, and we and I have mentioned

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both Peter Sellers and Irene 
Handle in the same breath 

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virtually and how appropriate 
and this this is really 

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tortured. 
This isn't it. 

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How appropriate for what we have
gathered together to talk about 

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today. 
We're going to talk about Peter 

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Sellers and Irene Handle and 
and, and some of the work that 

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they did together and and it's 
they had a really sort of 

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special relationship. 
It's a very platonic 

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relationship on a stress. 
But they had a they were best 

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buds pretty much. 
Weren't they the kids? 

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The kids would say BFFS I guess.
It's very unusual in a way 

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because she's quite a bit older 
than him. 

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She's about 2425 years older 
than him was and but more nearer

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his mother's age than his age. 
But they got on like a house on 

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fire and they were very much 
compatible in their acting 

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styles, weren't they? 
Yeah. 

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And well, I think she was OK. 
She was quite a bit older than 

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she was old to have to be his 
mother. 

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Let's face it. 
Yeah. 

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And I just think there was 
something about him that she 

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latched onto. 
And and we'll, we'll, we'll come

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to that. 
We'll we'll talk about that in 

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more detail. 
But but OK, obviously we on this

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on this podcast every week we 
talk about Peter Sellers in in 

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excruciating detail. 
So we don't need to dwell on him

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too much at this stage in terms 
of his back story. 

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But Irene handle will will 
again, most people listen to 

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this who know who she is. 
But just in case, Donna, how 

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would you, how would you? 
Could you describe her in a sort

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of a pithy couple of sentences? 
Do you think well. 

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I suppose she's like the 
archetypal sort of working class

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duck. 
You know, she was, she sort of 

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cornered the market in that sort
of archetype, didn't she? 

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Very well. 
Yeah. 

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She's like somebody's mum or 
someone's nan or aunt. 

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Somebody's mum or or or a 
domestic servant, or a char lady

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or or a landlady. 
Landlady. 

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Yeah. 
Particularly notably in the The 

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Rebel with Tony Handgill. 
Yeah. 

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Mrs. Cravat. 
Yeah. 

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And, and she had this and 
although, OK, her voice would be

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described, I guess, as shabby, 
genteel. 

105
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Yeah, sometimes she kind of, 
yeah. 

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She had that kind of cockney 
accent that she would do and it 

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wasn't her natural accent, but 
sometimes she would also try and

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put on the the slightly more 
refined voice. 

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And I always think Kathy Burke 
must have been influenced by 

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Irene Handel because 
particularly Waynetta Slob does 

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that when the social worker 
comes round. 

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Do you know what I mean? 
It's. 

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Like a cup of tea, like. 
That sort of voice. 

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Yes, if if you come round to see
about Spagulica, it's spelled it

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in. 
Frog, Mella, or. 

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Frog Mella wasn't spadulica. 
Yes, Spadulica and Keanu. 

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Keanu. 
Slob. 

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Yeah, yeah, I I just think 
there, there's definitely an 

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influence there. 
Oh, absolutely. 

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And I think also Julie Walters 
to a lesser extent, yes. 

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When you watch as seen on TV, 
some of the sketches, you know, 

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they got the bra strap slightly 
hanging down and these little 

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details that Irene would do, I 
think, I wonder if she's picked 

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that up from Irene had. 
I guess she kind of almost 

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colored the market in playing 
those sort of old dames if you 

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like. 
But to a degree, Beryl Reed was,

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was, was one of those and Dora 
Bryan and and and Hilda Baker, 

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of course, although Hilda Baker 
was a bit, a bit a few rungs 

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lower down the glass ladder, I 
think actually. 

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Yeah, or Peggy Mount. 
You know, which is more the 

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battle axe. 
And I think Irene Handel was 

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sort of more nuanced than that. 
You know, can you remember the 

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first time your first memory of 
Irene Handel at all? 

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Yeah, I was thinking this the 
other day and I was thinking it 

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must have been, I was trying to 
think, oh, it must have been an 

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old film like, you know, one of 
the Sellers films possibly on 

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telly. 
But really the one that really 

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sticks out is the recordings 
like Shadows on the Grass with 

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Peter Sellers, because I heard 
those records a lot when I was 

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quite young. 
And the critics? 

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Newton Tweedsdale What effect 
did this film have on you? 

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Well, may I say it once that I 
found it in the very, very time?

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Well, I didn't pretend to be an 
ardent cinema girl, but I did. 

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And they thought that Wazenkov 
in his direction was far too to 

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protect the young, the electric 
images of his own emotional 

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language, instead of allowing 
the intrinsic concepts of the 

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film to to speak for themselves.
I. 

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Think you're reading that? 
I don't think I am, because have

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you ever paused in a tube 
station, for example, and seen a

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hoarding all torn down and the 
girl's face, you know, with all 

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moustaches on it and what it was
a sense great feeling all torn 

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down when I felt so lonely, so 
terribly lonely. 

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This is what I preferred, some 
coffee in his three eyes and 

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find when he gave us the 
biographical trilogy on Lenin 

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that was really like him. 
Is that songs for swinging 

156
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sellers or is that the best of 
sellers? 

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That songs for swingers. 
That was a second LP. 

158
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Yep. 
Second one, yeah, that one got 

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played a lot at home. 
My dad played that a lot. 

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So I mean the critics is like, 
it's like it, it, it hasn't 

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really aged, does it? 
It's like one of those late like

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discussion. 
Programs and you wouldn't know 

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that's. 
Exactly the same if you've. 

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Grown up watching Irene Handel 
in films and television. 

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And you heard that. 
Yeah. 

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The critic. 
Sort of the critics, I should 

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say. 
You wouldn't necessarily know. 

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Well, you wouldn't know it was 
her, would you? 

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Because she's. 
No, no. 

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She's a very clipped accent and 
it's. 

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Very posh in that, isn't she? 
She plays. 

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She's. 
Very versatile, really. 

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Faith Bradshaw. 
Faith. 

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00:09:53,320 --> 00:09:54,600
Bradshaw. 
Bradshaw, Yeah. 

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Well, we're going to talk about 
that. 

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I can definitely tell you that 
my first memory of Irene Handle 

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was was Metal Mickey. 
Metal Mickey. 

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00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:11,320
My God. 
The Mickey Dolan's project. 

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Yeah. 
And I love that. 

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I'm so I, I can't remember what 
year it would have been. 

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00:10:17,400 --> 00:10:19,320
I know, I know. 
It started, I think it started 

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00:10:19,320 --> 00:10:24,040
on LWT in this country around 
8081, maybe something like that.

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00:10:26,120 --> 00:10:30,240
And I'm not sure when we got it 
in down in New Zealand, possibly

184
00:10:30,240 --> 00:10:34,840
a year later or something. 
So I would have been about 7-8 

185
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maybe. 
And it was on a Saturday night 

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00:10:38,240 --> 00:10:42,760
and I absolutely adored it. 
And I, I love Mickey, of course.

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And I probably loved all the, 
all the kids that were in it as 

188
00:10:46,280 --> 00:10:48,800
well. 
And I, I don't remember what I 

189
00:10:48,800 --> 00:10:51,200
thought of Irene handles 
character because she played 

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00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:57,040
the, the granny, believe it or 
not, and playing against type 

191
00:10:57,040 --> 00:11:00,160
there. 
And I don't remember how, but, 

192
00:11:00,160 --> 00:11:03,160
but I've, I've watched bits of 
it over the years, you know, as 

193
00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:06,520
a, as an adult. 
And one thing I picked up was 

194
00:11:06,520 --> 00:11:10,440
how bloody annoying the kid 
actors are in it really, really 

195
00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:13,040
playing it up. 
You know what I mean? 

196
00:11:13,440 --> 00:11:16,400
The point is, I, I watched, I 
watched a full episode of Metal 

197
00:11:16,400 --> 00:11:18,760
Mickey in preparation for this 
just last night. 

198
00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:22,520
OK. 
And I was not blown away. 

199
00:11:22,600 --> 00:11:24,600
That's the wrong word. 
Underwhelmed. 

200
00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:26,520
That's the right word. 
I was underwhelmed. 

201
00:11:27,360 --> 00:11:29,600
It it hasn't aged well. 
It hasn't aged well. 

202
00:11:29,760 --> 00:11:31,040
I can. 
Imagine but. 

203
00:11:32,000 --> 00:11:35,040
But I'll tell you what, I'll 
tell you who has aged well. 

204
00:11:35,120 --> 00:11:38,480
I really handle in that. 
She what? 

205
00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:40,840
A pro. 
Absolutely she elevates it. 

206
00:11:41,080 --> 00:11:43,440
She absolutely elevates it. 
She didn't have a lot to do. 

207
00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:50,480
It was an episode in which Metal
Mickey became a pop star and 

208
00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:54,480
there was like Mickey Mania and 
you know what I mean? 

209
00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:58,880
And at the end of the episode, 
you've got the whole family, 

210
00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:05,320
including, I really handle 
boogying to to Mickey's hip hop 

211
00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:08,160
tune. 
Come here I. 

212
00:12:09,720 --> 00:12:13,480
Know my little. 
It's lovely to see you back. 

213
00:12:14,280 --> 00:12:16,480
But don't you? 
Ever do that? 

214
00:12:22,360 --> 00:12:25,120
That was better than a slap in 
the face with a white fish. 

215
00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:32,240
Oh Mickey. 
Oh, I'm glad you're back. 

216
00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:35,800
Buggy, buggy. 
Buggy, buggy, buggy buggy. 

217
00:12:44,640 --> 00:12:46,160
Buggy. 
All right, all right, that's 

218
00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:47,240
enough. 
Stop it. 

219
00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:48,560
Stop it. 
Stop it. 

220
00:12:49,880 --> 00:12:52,760
Mickey, you may be back, but 
you're not getting me jumping 

221
00:12:52,760 --> 00:12:54,760
for joy. 
I'm not going to. 

222
00:12:55,040 --> 00:13:00,400
Boogie. 
I'm not going to boogie. 

223
00:13:08,280 --> 00:13:15,480
Not quite, not quite, but yeah, 
she was she. 

224
00:13:15,480 --> 00:13:18,280
My first memory of her, as I 
say, was Mitchell Mickey. 

225
00:13:18,280 --> 00:13:23,520
But obviously as I then started 
watching older British films and

226
00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:25,880
I got into the goons and I 
started watching old Peter 

227
00:13:25,880 --> 00:13:29,200
Sellers films particularly I 
kept seeing her and I kept, oh, 

228
00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:30,760
it's that woman from Metal 
Mickey. 

229
00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:32,880
It's it's that, oh, aren't she 
great? 

230
00:13:33,400 --> 00:13:37,840
And and she really was a 
national treasure, wasn't she? 

231
00:13:38,480 --> 00:13:41,360
Completely, I think, yeah, she 
was really loved. 

232
00:13:41,360 --> 00:13:44,240
I mean, people would often come 
up to her in the street saying 

233
00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:47,280
you remind me of my nan or you 
remind me of my aunt. 

234
00:13:47,280 --> 00:13:50,720
So she was like the sort of 
nation's grandma in a way, 

235
00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:51,720
wasn't she? 
She was. 

236
00:13:52,560 --> 00:13:53,680
But. 
Even though she never got 

237
00:13:53,680 --> 00:13:56,640
married or had kids herself or 
anything, you know, she just had

238
00:13:56,640 --> 00:13:59,760
her Chihuahuas, didn't she? 
Well, in in school for 

239
00:13:59,760 --> 00:14:02,720
scoundrels, she has one of her 
Chihuahuas clutched to her 

240
00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:05,920
bosom. 
Yes, yeah, there's not there's. 

241
00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:09,320
Not much out there in terms of 
biographical detail about I 

242
00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:12,080
really handle, but I I did 
wonder about the fact that she 

243
00:14:12,080 --> 00:14:14,000
never married and I wondered 
about that. 

244
00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:18,320
And I think a lot of it came 
down to the fact that she she 

245
00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:22,120
didn't really become an actress 
until quite late. 

246
00:14:22,120 --> 00:14:27,560
She was about 3839 when she. 
Yeah, I think she was 36 and I 

247
00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:32,480
think she was about 35 when she 
trained at the Embassy School of

248
00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:37,560
Acting in Swiss Cottage, which 
is my strange connection with 

249
00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:42,440
her is I went to the Central 
School of Speech and Drama, or 

250
00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:44,560
the Central School of Screech 
and Trauma, as we call it. 

251
00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:48,960
And it used to be based at the 
Royal Albert Hall and then it 

252
00:14:48,960 --> 00:14:52,120
moved to the Embassy Theatre and
that's where it is to this day. 

253
00:14:52,120 --> 00:14:55,800
And Irene would have trodden the
same boards I did when I was a 

254
00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:57,200
student. 
God. 

255
00:14:58,200 --> 00:15:02,760
So she was there for about a 
year, and she was quite a very 

256
00:15:02,760 --> 00:15:07,160
late starter. 
Yeah, she was about 35 and then 

257
00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:10,880
got a role in the West End and 
stole the show, unsurprisingly. 

258
00:15:11,760 --> 00:15:15,280
Well it I think it was mainly 
the the fact she left it so late

259
00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:17,880
was because she was looking 
after her elderly father. 

260
00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:22,520
Until, until it died. 
Her mother died quite young, at 

261
00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:26,800
the age of about 40. 
So she stayed home and looked 

262
00:15:26,800 --> 00:15:29,560
after her dad. 
They were quite comfortably off,

263
00:15:29,560 --> 00:15:33,960
weren't they, as a family? 
He was a stockbroker or and they

264
00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:37,040
had servants. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

265
00:15:37,080 --> 00:15:41,520
So obviously young artistic 
Irene was, she loved hanging 

266
00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:45,800
around the the servants so much,
you know, they almost had to 

267
00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:49,440
shoo her away at times. 
But all those characters she was

268
00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:52,840
absorbing and used them later on
in life. 

269
00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:58,880
We watched a 30 minute interview
with Irene Handel, didn't we? 

270
00:15:58,880 --> 00:16:04,400
Called Comic Roots, which was 
filmed in the early 80s and it 

271
00:16:04,400 --> 00:16:07,360
was, it was just a sort of a 
retrospective about her career. 

272
00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:11,000
And it's very useful for filling
in a lot of blanks if you like. 

273
00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:14,360
And, and I think, and I watched 
it a couple of weeks ago, you 

274
00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:18,600
only watched it today. 
But I think she's she said 

275
00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:21,760
something along the lines of 
people always assume that she's 

276
00:16:21,760 --> 00:16:27,240
cockney, whereas her proper 
speaking voice is quite is quite

277
00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:30,320
refined, isn't it? 
Yeah, she is quite, Yeah, very 

278
00:16:30,320 --> 00:16:35,760
middle class, posh, born in 
Maida Vale, grew up in that part

279
00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:38,920
of London, not not in the East 
End of London or anything like 

280
00:16:38,920 --> 00:16:41,240
that. 
She was quite comfortably off 

281
00:16:41,760 --> 00:16:45,040
and shows what a great actress 
she was, that she fooled a lot 

282
00:16:45,040 --> 00:16:47,160
of people and they, she was very
convincing. 

283
00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:51,680
Even though her performances 
seem quite large, they're rooted

284
00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:55,560
in reality, aren't they? 
Yeah, absolutely. 

285
00:16:55,560 --> 00:16:57,680
Particularly, have you seen her 
in Heavens Above? 

286
00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:01,320
Yes, yes. 
I haven't seen that in a while, 

287
00:17:01,320 --> 00:17:03,320
but I have seen that film. 
Yeah, she's quite. 

288
00:17:03,320 --> 00:17:04,960
A bit. 
She's a bit rougher around the 

289
00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:07,560
edges than she normally is. 
Good. 

290
00:17:07,599 --> 00:17:08,640
Afternoon. 
What's going on? 

291
00:17:09,119 --> 00:17:11,000
What do you want? 
I'm the new vicar. 

292
00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:12,440
I'll just come round to 
introduce myself. 

293
00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:13,920
Well, you. 
From the council too then, 

294
00:17:13,960 --> 00:17:16,119
ma'am. 
Ma'am, will you shut? 

295
00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:17,040
Up. 
No, I've. 

296
00:17:17,040 --> 00:17:19,560
Just come to early Trinity. 
You're in my palace, you see? 

297
00:17:19,599 --> 00:17:21,160
And what do you want then? 
Well, I'll. 

298
00:17:21,160 --> 00:17:23,480
Just go round and say hello, see
if there's anything you wanted, 

299
00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:25,960
anything I could do for oh. 
Let's see. 

300
00:17:31,080 --> 00:17:32,480
Well, you come at the right 
time. 

301
00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:34,400
You have Vicar do. 
You mind if? 

302
00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:36,520
I sit down only I'm still a 
casualty. 

303
00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:39,280
You see, I only get 18 bub a 
week from the Army. 

304
00:17:39,480 --> 00:17:41,280
Not a very great deal, is it? 
I'm not. 

305
00:17:41,280 --> 00:17:43,800
Complaining win. 
Go and get the. 

306
00:17:43,800 --> 00:17:47,440
Vicar a nice cup of tea win. 
While you're making it pop baby 

307
00:17:47,440 --> 00:17:50,640
for me, will you? 
Sydney, go and get the. 

308
00:17:50,640 --> 00:17:53,600
Vicar, a chair to sit on. 
Oh, don't you worry about me. 

309
00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:57,480
I'll sit here. 
You take that fag out of your 

310
00:17:57,720 --> 00:18:00,880
face, that's all that is is. 
She more about got a hard edge 

311
00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:02,080
to her, yeah. 
Yeah. 

312
00:18:02,080 --> 00:18:03,280
That's, that's fair. 
Yeah. 

313
00:18:03,760 --> 00:18:06,000
Mind you, in two way stretch 
she's got half her teeth are 

314
00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:07,600
missing. 
That's quite rough as well, 

315
00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:09,520
isn't it? 
And I love. 

316
00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:12,600
The way she speaks in that, it's
like she's sort of talking like 

317
00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:14,240
that, ain't she? 
Because she's got a lot of her 

318
00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:16,360
teeth are gone. 
She. 

319
00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:20,560
She obviously kind of gravitated
or, or graviated as she would 

320
00:18:20,560 --> 00:18:24,640
say. 
She gravitated into playing 

321
00:18:24,640 --> 00:18:26,600
these. 
She was, she was never A star. 

322
00:18:26,600 --> 00:18:29,760
She was never topping the bill. 
She was, you know, she never 

323
00:18:29,760 --> 00:18:31,920
carried a film on her own. 
She was. 

324
00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:36,200
She was always one of the 
supporting cast, often stole the

325
00:18:36,200 --> 00:18:39,520
show if you like. 
But yeah, she definitely did. 

326
00:18:39,520 --> 00:18:40,920
But she. 
Always tended to she was a 

327
00:18:40,920 --> 00:18:46,040
character actress, wasn't she? 
And, and, and she, she said in 

328
00:18:46,040 --> 00:18:51,200
an interview that she gave in 
the early 80s, so by that time 

329
00:18:51,200 --> 00:18:53,000
she would have been in her 80s, 
I think. 

330
00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:58,400
And she, she said that she hated
being old, right. 

331
00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:01,120
She said, she said it's 
absolutely foul. 

332
00:19:02,640 --> 00:19:05,560
And she regretted that she 
didn't get into acting earlier 

333
00:19:05,560 --> 00:19:08,840
when, as she described it, she 
said, she said she was a pretty 

334
00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:12,720
girl when she was younger. 
And, and she felt that if she 

335
00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:15,320
got into acting early when she 
was prettier, her career would 

336
00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:17,320
have been a lot different. 
She'd have got the more romantic

337
00:19:17,320 --> 00:19:21,200
roles, whereas because she 
didn't start acting really until

338
00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:26,200
she was in her late 30s into her
early 40s that she was giving, 

339
00:19:26,200 --> 00:19:29,200
she was giving the mum roles and
the child lady roles and the and

340
00:19:29,200 --> 00:19:32,120
the like, but. 
Her career probably lasted 

341
00:19:32,120 --> 00:19:34,720
longer because of that, because 
when you're young and pretty, 

342
00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:38,880
that fades and then, you know, 
another load of actresses come 

343
00:19:38,880 --> 00:19:41,440
out of drama school that are 
younger than prettier than you. 

344
00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:45,400
And and it prolonged her career 
probably going down that role. 

345
00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:48,800
I mean, she certainly cornered 
the market in that sort of type 

346
00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:54,840
of East End lady landlord types.
And yeah, you're right, you're 

347
00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:56,200
right. 
Long to career? 

348
00:19:56,280 --> 00:19:57,720
Maybe not. 
So much these days, but 

349
00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:00,720
certainly back in the day, if 
you were a glamorous film star, 

350
00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:04,920
very often your career would 
stall after a certain number of 

351
00:20:04,920 --> 00:20:07,800
years. 
Oh, yeah, people like more 

352
00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:10,720
recent people like Helen Mirren 
and and the like have have, you 

353
00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:12,200
know, bucked that trend, of 
course. 

354
00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:15,720
But. 
But I'm just trying to think 

355
00:20:15,720 --> 00:20:19,800
someone around Irene Handel's 
period who? 

356
00:20:20,280 --> 00:20:22,720
I mean, you've got someone like 
Diana Doors who was obviously 

357
00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:25,840
the glamour puss in the 50s, and
then she carried on having a 

358
00:20:25,840 --> 00:20:27,960
decent career up until, yeah, I 
mean. 

359
00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:31,200
She was fantastic in Amazing Mr.
Blunden. 

360
00:20:31,760 --> 00:20:35,400
Oh, as the what? 
Was she the cook? 

361
00:20:35,600 --> 00:20:38,400
Yeah, she was. 
The yeah, she was like, like the

362
00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:43,520
the really nasty housekeeper. 
Wasn't she trying to marry her 

363
00:20:43,520 --> 00:20:47,680
daughter off to? 
Oh, to to Villiers. 

364
00:20:47,680 --> 00:20:49,720
James Villiers, Yeah. 
James Villiers. 

365
00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:53,160
Yeah, that's right. 
And she was fantastic in that. 

366
00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:56,000
She's just like, no vanity at 
all. 

367
00:20:56,000 --> 00:20:58,440
Just make me look as gross as 
you can. 

368
00:20:58,440 --> 00:21:01,720
Yes. 
And of course, that was Lionel 

369
00:21:01,720 --> 00:21:02,840
Jeffries, wasn't it? 
It was. 

370
00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:05,760
It was Lionel Jeffries directed 
and who played her husband. 

371
00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:08,280
Can you remember? 
David Lodge. 

372
00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:11,520
He was in Cockle Show Heroes. 
Yeah, Yeah, that's right. 

373
00:21:11,880 --> 00:21:12,440
Yeah. 
So. 

374
00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:15,000
This is often like particularly 
with Sellers, isn't there? 

375
00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:16,960
There's a sort of coterie 
there's it's almost like a 

376
00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:18,960
repertory company he has around 
him. 

377
00:21:19,080 --> 00:21:24,280
Well, like Mario Fabrizzi, David
Lodge, Graham Stark, Irene 

378
00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:25,960
Handel. 
She was very much part of that 

379
00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:30,160
company of actors that he he was
comfortable with, familiar with,

380
00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:33,800
and they got him but by. 
The way, yeah, I'll just come 

381
00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:37,520
back to that in a second. 
One of the children in Amazing 

382
00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:42,920
Mr. Blunden that Dinah doors her
character terrorised, I think 

383
00:21:42,920 --> 00:21:46,640
it's fair to say, was the future
Mrs. Peter Sellers. 

384
00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:50,560
Lynn, Frederick. 
Yeah, see how it's all linked is

385
00:21:50,560 --> 00:21:53,200
crazy, isn't it? 
But yeah, you're right. 

386
00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:57,320
She she was kind of almost in 
that sellers Rep company. 

387
00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:03,880
So she's she's in as far as I'm 
and I and I did check and double

388
00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:07,760
check and triple check. 
She she appeared in five films. 

389
00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:12,400
I won't say 5 films with Peter 
Sellers because I include the 

390
00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:17,560
wrong box, which is kind of it's
it's not a Peter Sellers film as

391
00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:19,600
such. 
He's it's, it's an ensemble 

392
00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:22,080
piece, isn't it? 
And she's she's not in any 

393
00:22:22,080 --> 00:22:25,680
scenes with Sellers, but so but 
I think. 

394
00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:27,400
Peter does steal that film. 
Oh. 

395
00:22:27,400 --> 00:22:29,560
Doesn't he underneath? 
Everybody's nose. 

396
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:32,240
He is so good as Doctor Pratt, 
isn't he? 

397
00:22:32,560 --> 00:22:36,080
I love it when he plots the ink 
with the kitten because that was

398
00:22:36,080 --> 00:22:39,400
just completely improvised, 
wasn't it it? 

399
00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:41,280
Was it was. 
And you've got everyone in that 

400
00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:42,400
film. 
We've got Cook and more, of 

401
00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:45,400
course. 
Tony Hancock, Yeah. 

402
00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:47,160
Michael Caine. 
Nanette Newman. 

403
00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:50,720
Michael Caine. 
Michael Caine, John Mills and 

404
00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:52,800
yeah, Ralph. 
Richardson. 

405
00:22:53,120 --> 00:22:54,480
We could just name names, 
couldn't we? 

406
00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:56,520
For the rest of them, OK. 
On all night. 

407
00:22:57,160 --> 00:23:01,840
She was in, I think the first 
film that she was in the Peter 

408
00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:05,080
Sellers film that she was in or 
a film with Peter Sellers was 

409
00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:09,240
Carlton Brown of the FFO as Mrs.
Carter. 

410
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:11,440
Now, I haven't watched that for 
a number of years because it's a

411
00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:14,800
bit of a chore that one. 
I'm not that keen on that film 

412
00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:17,200
to be honest. 
So I have seen it, but not for a

413
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:20,880
while. 
I, I had the, the good intention

414
00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:24,960
of watching it ahead of this. 
And you know how you put things 

415
00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:26,560
off and put things off and put 
things off. 

416
00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:28,920
And in the end I didn't, I 
thought, now let's just focus 

417
00:23:28,920 --> 00:23:32,600
on, let's just focus on the 
three or more specifically the 2

418
00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:36,400
Sellers films that she's in that
are right up there. 

419
00:23:36,680 --> 00:23:40,880
OK, because yes, she's in 
heavens above, as I said before 

420
00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:50,520
in 63, but in 1959 she is Missus
Kite married to Peter Sellers. 

421
00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:56,160
Mr. Kite in I'm All right Jack. 
And then the year later she is 

422
00:23:56,160 --> 00:23:59,920
in two way stretch as Missus 
Price. 

423
00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:02,000
Yeah. 
Bernard Crippen's mum. 

424
00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:04,840
Bernard Crippen's mum, yeah, 
with a. 

425
00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:06,360
Mouth like a ripped out 
fireplace. 

426
00:24:10,120 --> 00:24:11,920
So it's I love the. 
Lack of vanity. 

427
00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:14,080
It's great. 
I I really love it when it's 

428
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:17,840
particularly actresses go there 
and they don't mind being 

429
00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:21,240
looking a bit shabby or a bit 
grotesque. 

430
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:24,480
Yeah, she's a bit, she's a bit 
more in I'm a right Jack. 

431
00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:30,320
She's she's very much sort of a 
a proud working class matriarch,

432
00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:34,520
isn't she? 
Yeah, you remember that scene 

433
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:37,320
when Margaret Rutherford 
arrives? 

434
00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:41,320
Oh yeah, and sit down, you know,
Yes. 

435
00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:46,160
Yes, whereas she's she's sort of
downgrades that character for 

436
00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:51,640
two way stretch missus price is 
is is part of the well, she's 

437
00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:53,920
not she's not a criminal, but 
she's a member of the criminal 

438
00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:56,560
class really, isn't she? 
So funny. 

439
00:24:56,560 --> 00:24:59,800
That scene when she's she's 
visiting Bernie Cribbins in 

440
00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:02,800
prison. 
It just kills me every time. 

441
00:25:02,800 --> 00:25:04,960
It's so funny. 
She is hilarious. 

442
00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:08,960
I think all the best actors 
always seem to bring something a

443
00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:11,320
little bit extra that's not in 
the script. 

444
00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:14,720
And she is so funny in her 
delivery. 

445
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:16,800
And of course with the missing 
teeth and her voice and 

446
00:25:16,800 --> 00:25:20,400
everything and being so ashamed,
you know you've never once tried

447
00:25:20,400 --> 00:25:25,000
to escape. 
I can't understand you at all. 

448
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:28,280
Me and your daddy's always 
trying to bring you upright but 

449
00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:30,320
I don't know. 
The family owner don't seem to 

450
00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:32,360
mean nothing to you. 
Anyone don't? 

451
00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:35,320
Think you love it doing time? 
Three years you've been in here 

452
00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:38,080
now and never once have you even
tried to escape. 

453
00:25:38,080 --> 00:25:41,360
And don't believe your head 
against them was you marked 

454
00:25:41,360 --> 00:25:42,680
yourself for love. 
Your mom will. 

455
00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:45,880
Be out anyway soon. 
Anyway, soon that's not quite 

456
00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:49,400
the point. 
Look at your daddy's record 4 

457
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:54,200
times over the wall at the mall 
alone and Auntie Emmy's bad leg 

458
00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:56,760
never prevented her from 
shinning down the drying pulp. 

459
00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:59,720
And although I did it. 
Well, I'll try and do better 

460
00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:01,240
next time I'm on his job. 
Well, yeah, it's. 

461
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:02,880
How you better? 
I should think so. 

462
00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:04,760
Shall be enthusiasm. 
Yeah, with. 

463
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:06,840
All the. 
Files drop out of her bag. 

464
00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:09,800
Have you not seen a home perm 
kit before that? 

465
00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:15,320
Isn't it crazy because Sellers 
filmed them both in the same 

466
00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:19,400
year? 
Wow, yes he did. 

467
00:26:19,440 --> 00:26:23,720
Early 59 he filmed I'm All right
Jack and then I think I'm right 

468
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:26,800
in saying possibly the film 
after this was two way straights

469
00:26:26,800 --> 00:26:28,680
that he filmed. 
I'm not sure, but anyway, let's 

470
00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:31,840
just say within the same 12 
month period, OK and he's gone 

471
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:35,400
he's gone from convincingly 
playing the husband of already 

472
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:39,360
handle to playing someone who's 
her could her son's age. 

473
00:26:39,360 --> 00:26:41,360
Basically yeah, he's. 
Got. 

474
00:26:41,360 --> 00:26:44,160
Yeah, really. 
Convincing with both, yeah. 

475
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:46,400
I mean, it's amazing. 
It's absolutely miraculous that 

476
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:49,800
how he just. 
It's not over the top. 

477
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:53,640
His makeup in I'm alright 
Jackie's, so he's just aged up a

478
00:26:53,640 --> 00:26:57,840
little bit and he they just look
like the same age, him and Irene

479
00:26:57,840 --> 00:27:01,600
Handel and they obviously did a 
lot of discussions about their 

480
00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:04,160
relationship. 
It was almost like not exactly 

481
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:07,280
method acting but apparently 
they there was a lot of 

482
00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:11,240
discussion about their married 
life and stuff and I love their 

483
00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:14,800
wedding photograph on them. 
Mantelpiece is great. 

484
00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:22,160
It makes me laugh, but. 
She yeah, you say about not 

485
00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:24,640
method like, but doing a lot of 
preparation. 

486
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:26,440
The two of them sitting sit. 
Down and just. 

487
00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:30,200
Scoping out, creating a back 
story for the characters almost,

488
00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:33,040
I suppose, yeah. 
And bring that brings so much 

489
00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:34,640
sort of richness to the 
characters. 

490
00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:39,280
It helps the actors bring so 
many sort of levels and and 

491
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:41,720
makes it much more interesting. 
Yeah. 

492
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:46,920
She said in an interview in 1976
she was asked about working with

493
00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:49,920
sellers. 
And she said I had to. 

494
00:27:50,360 --> 00:27:53,320
When I read this, I had to read 
it twice to try and make sure I 

495
00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:56,720
wasn't, you know, inferring 
anything else. 

496
00:27:57,120 --> 00:27:58,880
She said she was talking about 
Sellers. 

497
00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:02,760
She said without measuring his 
length off the floor and and 

498
00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:07,120
going on method, he zips, he 
zips himself into a character in

499
00:28:07,120 --> 00:28:09,400
the same way as I do. 
Right. 

500
00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:11,760
And he did. 
And she said, and he does not 

501
00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:14,200
disappear after the tape, 
meaning after the, you know, 

502
00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:16,520
after the take, I suppose. 
Yeah. 

503
00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:18,360
Yeah. 
As Tony Hancock used to do. 

504
00:28:18,360 --> 00:28:22,400
Poor dear, but that's it. 
But sellers will talk and take 

505
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:25,400
suggestions, which is strange 
for a man of His Eminence. 

506
00:28:26,360 --> 00:28:27,680
Yeah. 
He. 

507
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:33,000
Obviously respected her greatly 
to work with her in that way. 

508
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:36,200
Sellers must have really adored 
working with her because they 

509
00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:38,120
were very much In Sync with each
other. 

510
00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:42,320
And yeah, there was a thing, you
know, she, she was Mrs. Cravat 

511
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:46,320
in The Rebel and she really 
admired Tony Hancock as a 

512
00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:49,720
comedian, but he, he didn't 
really want to know. 

513
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:51,840
I think that's the difference 
between actors and comics. 

514
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:55,560
I think comedians can be quite 
the sort of lone wolves. 

515
00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:57,800
They're not really 
collaborators. 

516
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:01,120
They're used to taking all the 
glory for themselves, you know, 

517
00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:05,320
whereas actors, it is more like 
a family and it's a, you know, 

518
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:07,720
we work together, you know, we 
enhance each other's 

519
00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:10,040
performances. 
And I don't think Tony Hancock 

520
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:13,640
had that sort of mentality. 
So he would shoot the scene and 

521
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:14,800
then go off to his dressing 
room. 

522
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:19,760
He didn't really socialise or 
want to be pally with any of his

523
00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:22,120
fellow actors in a way, whereas 
Peter did. 

524
00:29:22,360 --> 00:29:25,200
And also the recorded stuff. 
I mean, she wrote Shadows on the

525
00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:27,720
Grass, didn't she? 
Yes, and that. 

526
00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:31,720
Generosity of spirit to share 
that with somebody you admire 

527
00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:34,720
and let her. 
Because it's not even that 

528
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:37,000
funny. 
It's like a slice of life kind 

529
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:40,440
of observation, isn't it? 
More than a skit, but. 

530
00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:43,520
The the different thing, they 
have a key thing, of course, 

531
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:46,600
about that sketch. 
So it's it's as we said before, 

532
00:29:46,600 --> 00:29:50,560
it's it's on songs for Swinging 
sellers, which was his second LP

533
00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:56,840
and was a huge best seller 
coming out in 59, of course, 

534
00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:03,200
produced by George Martin. 
And and I'm going to do a a name

535
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:04,160
job here. 
Clang. 

536
00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:09,560
Mike McCartney himself told me 
that he and Paul used to play 

537
00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:13,000
songs for swinging sellers over 
and over and over again when 

538
00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:15,720
they were growing. 
But no. 

539
00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:19,000
But the point I'm making is yes,
you've got this 6 minute sketch,

540
00:30:19,320 --> 00:30:23,920
Shadows on the Grass, as you 
say, written by Ari Handel and 

541
00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:28,440
Sellers is in it playing a 
Frenchman, but he's very much 

542
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:29,440
second fiddle. 
He's. 

543
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:31,920
Second fiddle. 
Yeah, yeah, definitely. 

544
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:33,960
Yeah. 
She dominates it, really. 

545
00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:36,160
And it's quite flirty, isn't it,
it? 

546
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:40,760
Is and she doesn't she take him?
Back to her hotel room at the 

547
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:42,120
end or something. 
Yeah, so. 

548
00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:44,680
She's playing this, you know, 
wealthy widow. 

549
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:48,000
Yeah. 
Who's who's living in a in a in 

550
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:50,400
a hotel. 
But Sellers for some reason is 

551
00:30:50,400 --> 00:30:53,560
playing a Frenchman. 
You kind of wonder whether he is

552
00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:56,440
actually a Frenchman or if it's 
just there's some dirty old man 

553
00:30:57,120 --> 00:31:00,920
pretending to be a Frenchman to 
kind of try and you know what I 

554
00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:03,680
mean? 
Yeah, maybe. 

555
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:05,640
Who knows? 
It's weird, isn't it? 

556
00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:09,360
Because they are, you know, as 
you said, he's she's old enough 

557
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:12,240
to be his mum. 
In reality, yes. 

558
00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:14,280
And they're. 
Playing out this scene together.

559
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:18,520
She told an Australian 
journalist that she originally 

560
00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:22,600
wrote The Shadows on the Grass 
as a more as it for a television

561
00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:23,600
sketch. 
Right. 

562
00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:26,680
And and it was, and it was a lot
more sinister. 

563
00:31:27,880 --> 00:31:32,720
And she wrote it for herself, 
but also for Dennis Price. 

564
00:31:32,720 --> 00:31:37,040
All right. 
And she, she said, yeah, So she 

565
00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:38,960
said, I really wrote it for 
myself and Dennis Price. 

566
00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:41,840
That's why I called it Shadows 
on the Grass, because I wanted 

567
00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:45,680
his shadow travelling over the 
grass as he feeds the birds to 

568
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:49,240
swallow my shadow. 
And as it was written, it wasn't

569
00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:52,400
all comedy. 
One got the feeling he was going

570
00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:55,000
to murder her or something 
because the silly geezer told 

571
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:59,160
everything about her money. 
It's Oh my God. 

572
00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:02,120
Yeah, that's really. 
Intriguing, isn't it? 

573
00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:05,200
Yep, that it. 
It could have been, Yeah, like 

574
00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:09,120
what's that guy that used to 
date date old ladies and the 

575
00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:11,040
acid bath murderer? 
Oh, Hague. 

576
00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:14,560
Yeah, Hague. 
Maybe it's that sort of thing 

577
00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:15,640
then that's. 
True. 

578
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:17,920
If you think about the shadows 
of the girls that we know from 

579
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:21,680
the LP, where you've got. 
It's almost like she picks him 

580
00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:23,120
up in the in the part, doesn't 
she? 

581
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:25,800
Her character. 
Yeah, Yeah, she's and. 

582
00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:28,160
And then. 
But he's this supposed Frenchman

583
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:31,520
and then they they end up going 
back to her hotel. 

584
00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:33,200
You don't know what happens 
after that, do you? 

585
00:32:33,840 --> 00:32:35,680
She's made it clear that she's 
got a few Bob. 

586
00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:39,400
Yeah. 
He's latched onto her. 

587
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:43,400
Yeah, like a. 
Laser in the park It's. 

588
00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:46,680
Almost like it's almost like 
it's almost, and I know, look, 

589
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:49,040
we're over analysing this. 
It's it's a comedy sketch from 

590
00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:51,480
1959. 
But it's almost, it's almost 

591
00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:54,760
like he's latched onto her too 
easily picked. 

592
00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:56,400
Up on her vulnerabilities. 
Yeah. 

593
00:32:56,880 --> 00:32:58,480
Money. 
Yeah, I'm. 

594
00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:00,640
Afraid I'm a bit of a naughty 
girl like that. 

595
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:04,600
I love to lay in my Betty bar 
dreaming my dreams. 

596
00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:08,920
I wish that I could share your 
dreams with you now. 

597
00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:13,680
That I did not hear. 
That I have decided completely 

598
00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:15,640
to ignore. 
You're not nice to know, you 

599
00:33:15,640 --> 00:33:19,320
know? 
I am so full of enthusiasm to 

600
00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:22,800
have your friendship, to receive
great pleasure from knowing you,

601
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:24,760
that I said a stupid thing like 
that. 

602
00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:28,760
Forgive me, I'm so very sorry. 
Oh well. 

603
00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:30,960
You're forgiven now. 
I was just going to ask you back

604
00:33:30,960 --> 00:33:33,040
to Ding Dings. 
When they well, I would. 

605
00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:34,600
Love to come please ask me they 
keep. 

606
00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:37,440
A smashing table at the Royals 
and you know, we nearly always 

607
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:40,760
have a second vegetable and 
always croutons with a soup. 

608
00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:44,880
And if you ever feel out having 
half a bottle of Borgiale, they 

609
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:48,280
practically fall over themselves
backwards bringing it in for 

610
00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:51,080
you. 
I always say as long as there's 

611
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:54,000
enough to see me out, what 
happens afterwards? 

612
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:56,960
It's sand fair again. 
They revisited that, didn't 

613
00:33:56,960 --> 00:33:58,560
they? 
Later in 17, 9? 

614
00:33:58,560 --> 00:34:01,200
It's that whispering. 
Giant whispering. 

615
00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:04,040
Giant sketch, yeah. 
It's very similar, but it's 

616
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:08,080
there's a sort of air of sadness
around that I feel when I listen

617
00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:12,920
to it because it's almost like 
Sellers trying to recapture it's

618
00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:16,280
kind of joy, the happiness he 
probably felt, yes, back then in

619
00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:17,280
the 50s. 
Well, he was. 

620
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:19,679
He was. 
He was by this point, by that 

621
00:34:19,679 --> 00:34:22,560
point in his life, he only 
really had a year or so to live,

622
00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:27,239
if that. 
And he was parking back to the 

623
00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:29,960
happier days. 
So he was wanting to get back 

624
00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:32,440
with the goons. 
He was talking even about doing 

625
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:34,840
some more goon show material 
with the goons. 

626
00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:37,360
And he was, well, he was due to 
meet them for a meal that the, 

627
00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:38,719
the day he died. 
That's right. 

628
00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:41,600
Yeah. 
He, he was, he was towards the 

629
00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:44,080
end of his life, he was 
revisiting old homes and things 

630
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:45,360
like that, you know? 
Yeah. 

631
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:48,239
And, well, he'd. 
Take his first wife out, 

632
00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:50,280
wouldn't he call her up and say,
oh, can we go round? 

633
00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:52,600
Right, Yes, he's Finchley, can 
we go round Highgate? 

634
00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:55,480
He was so nostalgic for the 
past. 

635
00:34:55,679 --> 00:34:56,679
Absolutely. 
And she'd sort of. 

636
00:34:56,679 --> 00:34:59,960
Go around with him because his 
mother obviously was no longer 

637
00:34:59,960 --> 00:35:04,040
alive and he, like, you know, in
that arena documentary, sort of 

638
00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:06,080
treated his first wife like his 
mother. 

639
00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:09,920
I'm not, I don't want to be a 
COD psychiatrist here or 

640
00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:14,040
anything but or whatever you 
want to call it quack. 

641
00:35:14,080 --> 00:35:17,280
But did he perhaps? 
And of course, Peg was alive 

642
00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:20,440
when he I was working with Irene
Handel. 

643
00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:23,160
But you wonder, wonder if there 
was any, if she reminded him a 

644
00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:26,000
little bit of his. 
Mother maybe that's sort of, you

645
00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:31,400
know, yeah, I mean, yeah, maybe 
it's just very comfortable with 

646
00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:36,400
her because maybe in a way she 
was this similar age to his mum 

647
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:38,880
because they were ridiculously 
close. 

648
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:44,280
Isn't it like it was like toxic 
close mother as we know maybe 

649
00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:49,680
she was Irene Handel was like a 
a nice mother figure, you know a

650
00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:53,000
more benign 1 and obviously not 
controlling. 

651
00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:55,160
I also get. 
The feeling that she wouldn't 

652
00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:58,560
take any nonsense, she would 
give as good as she got from 

653
00:35:58,560 --> 00:35:59,320
him. 
Yeah. 

654
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:02,400
They just seem like, when 
they're working together, very 

655
00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:05,080
much equals. 
And apparently I watched an 

656
00:36:05,360 --> 00:36:09,480
interview with Liz Fraser and 
Irene Handle was very much a 

657
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:14,640
practical joker on set. 
She would do sort of silly jokes

658
00:36:14,640 --> 00:36:16,200
and break the tension or 
whatever. 

659
00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:19,200
But obviously in those days, 
Peter Sellers was behaving 

660
00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:25,240
himself and learning his craft. 
And you know, she's proper old 

661
00:36:25,240 --> 00:36:28,040
pro, so he probably learnt a lot
from her watching her too. 

662
00:36:28,040 --> 00:36:31,080
He probably. 
Did Yeah, I want to talk about 

663
00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:34,240
the Whispering Giant a little 
bit later, but while we're on 

664
00:36:34,240 --> 00:36:37,600
Shadows on the Grass, it was, it
was originally 12 minutes long, 

665
00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:42,640
that sketch. 
And yeah, George Martin and the 

666
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:45,040
engineer Stuart Elton edited it 
down. 

667
00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:47,920
So it's interesting. 
I wonder what was what was taken

668
00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:50,120
out. 
Maybe there was, I mean, maybe 

669
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:54,280
the sound of him murdering her 
in her hotel room, who knows? 

670
00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:56,120
A blood. 
Curdling screams. 

671
00:36:57,200 --> 00:37:00,200
Or maybe this isn't appropriate,
Peter, for this album at this 

672
00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:02,800
juncture in your career, You 
know, slashing her throat. 

673
00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:04,360
Well, you. 
Say that, but think about what 

674
00:37:04,360 --> 00:37:06,960
the album cover depicts. 
It's someone. 

675
00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:08,400
Oh, that's. 
True actually. 

676
00:37:08,600 --> 00:37:10,520
And and Auntie Rotter as well, 
yes. 

677
00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:12,120
That's right. 
Yeah, I. 

678
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:14,280
Listened to that far too young 
Tyler. 

679
00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:17,200
It's like too Auntie Rotter. 
I think that's what warped my. 

680
00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:20,600
Brain, do you know what I grew 
up I, I probably listened to 

681
00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:26,760
this album when I was for the 
first time when I was no younger

682
00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:30,920
than 1415, right when I got into
the goons and I got into sellers

683
00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:33,080
and started buying up sellers 
and listening to sellers stuff, 

684
00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:34,840
right? 
So I, I wouldn't have heard 

685
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:36,200
Auntie Rotter till I was that 
age. 

686
00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:42,560
But my, my earliest memory of my
Auntie Shirley, my mum's sister,

687
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:47,000
who's still with us by the way, 
was that she was known in the 

688
00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:53,240
family as Auntie Rotter, right? 
A A name bestowed upon her by my

689
00:37:53,240 --> 00:37:55,560
father, who, Oh my God, didn't. 
Particularly. 

690
00:37:55,560 --> 00:37:57,120
Get on with her. 
Let's face it, did she? 

691
00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:58,680
Have an orphanage in the Bulls. 
Bon Roy. 

692
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:03,680
Hello, children. 
Yeah, my dad. 

693
00:38:03,960 --> 00:38:06,320
My dad used to play this when I 
was about 5 or 6. 

694
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:09,400
But yeah, it was it was 
completely nuts. 

695
00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:11,880
Yeah. 
And the really seedy piano 

696
00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:13,960
player. 
Yes. 

697
00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:17,080
Oh, and the the and the seedy 
voice that Sellers puts on for 

698
00:38:17,080 --> 00:38:19,320
that. 
Yeah, is that? 

699
00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:21,720
Uncle Uncle Rotter inappropriate
in the. 

700
00:38:21,720 --> 00:38:23,880
List of years, doesn't he? 
But I see. 

701
00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:28,280
I never knew, I never associated
that with with Peter Sellers, 

702
00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:30,360
that nickname. 
I just knew her as a child. 

703
00:38:30,360 --> 00:38:32,320
That was what we called her in 
the Fed, not to a face. 

704
00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:33,920
We didn't call her anti rotter 
to a face. 

705
00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:36,040
Good God. 
I think that would invite. 

706
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:37,600
Yeah. 
You get a hatchet in your back 

707
00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:39,800
A. 
Tanned ass, as my dad would say,

708
00:38:41,240 --> 00:38:44,440
but but no so much of my 
childhood. 

709
00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:47,560
I grew up with these references 
to the goons or sellers or 

710
00:38:47,560 --> 00:38:50,600
whatever from my dad, you know? 
Yeah. 

711
00:38:51,200 --> 00:38:52,840
Oh, same here. 
My dad was yeah. 

712
00:38:52,840 --> 00:38:57,520
Had all the goon show on vinyl. 
Play them loads as you know. 

713
00:38:57,520 --> 00:38:59,160
Well, my dad. 
Didn't my dad didn't have them 

714
00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:02,640
on vinyl, but he would quote 
lines from Gucci, LP's and that 

715
00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:04,400
that he'd listen to when he was 
young man, you know? 

716
00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:10,920
Also Shadows on the Grass. 
She talks about her late husband

717
00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:15,800
Tofnell, and she said he his 
nickname for her was Squidgy. 

718
00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:17,120
Yeah. 
Squidgy. 

719
00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:17,440
Yeah. 
No. 

720
00:39:18,360 --> 00:39:21,120
Was it blue? 
He liked me wearing blue. 

721
00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:22,240
Wasn't it blue? 
Toast. 

722
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:24,880
The colour was blue toast. 
Colour was described as. 

723
00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:28,000
Blue toast that wasn't wasn't, 
correct me if I'm wrong, wasn't 

724
00:39:28,600 --> 00:39:33,040
didn't Prince Charles call 
Camilla squidgy God? 

725
00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:35,080
Yeah, he was a massive fan of 
the goons. 

726
00:39:35,080 --> 00:39:38,080
Yeah. 
There you go, I've blown. 

727
00:39:38,080 --> 00:39:43,240
I've blown it wide open. 
You have we need some sort of 

728
00:39:43,240 --> 00:39:46,600
white board here with like lines
going off everywhere push. 

729
00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:49,080
Pins and things, yeah, yeah. 
Exactly. 

730
00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:51,600
Yeah, exactly. 
But yeah, I wouldn't be 

731
00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:53,360
surprised if that was the 
connection. 

732
00:39:54,720 --> 00:39:56,880
God. 
And they had Nick, Burt and 

733
00:39:56,880 --> 00:39:59,600
Gladys or something, the 
nicknames for each other. 

734
00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:03,280
And. 
Brenda and Oh, I can't remember.

735
00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:04,800
Prince Charles, I'm not going 
to. 

736
00:40:04,880 --> 00:40:06,880
No, I'm not going to go there. 
He he, you're not. 

737
00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:08,440
Going to go there. 
We don't need we. 

738
00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:10,920
I've just had me dinner. 
I don't need to go there. 

739
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:15,360
Yes. 
Do you know what as well, in 

740
00:40:15,360 --> 00:40:19,720
July 1960, Peter Sellers and 
Irene Handel actually performed 

741
00:40:19,720 --> 00:40:22,560
Shadows on the Grass on stage at
the London Palladium. 

742
00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:25,920
Wow. 
They had an event called the 

743
00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:29,640
Night of 100 Stars. 
Right, I've heard of that, but I

744
00:40:29,640 --> 00:40:31,160
didn't know they appeared on 
that. 

745
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:33,200
Yeah, they. 
So they they appeared and 

746
00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:36,080
performed the I mean, it 
doesn't, there's no recording of

747
00:40:36,080 --> 00:40:39,960
it or anything. 
But also on the bill, Laurence, 

748
00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:45,400
Olivia, Cliff, Richard, Russ 
Conway, Miriam Carlin, who'd 

749
00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:50,000
worked with Sellers as well. 
Apparently Sellers also did a 

750
00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:54,520
sketch, or at least impersonated
Noël Coward for a for a sketch 

751
00:40:54,520 --> 00:40:58,440
or a song, right? 
And of course, Irene. 

752
00:40:58,440 --> 00:41:02,120
Handel first film role, I think 
it was her first role was in in 

753
00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:04,360
Brief Encounter. 
Right. 

754
00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:07,360
Yes, she's. 
She's she plays the Wurlitz in 

755
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:09,200
the cinema. 
She comes out of the ground. 

756
00:41:10,640 --> 00:41:13,080
The scene in that that's 
obviously written by Noël 

757
00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:15,000
Coward, Of course it. 
Is yes, so we can need. 

758
00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:17,560
The whiteboard. 
Others the connections are just 

759
00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:21,920
yeah and also. 
George Martin with the whole 

760
00:41:21,920 --> 00:41:24,680
producing those sketches on 
record. 

761
00:41:25,800 --> 00:41:27,480
There's also a Beatles 
connection, isn't there? 

762
00:41:27,480 --> 00:41:29,360
Because she was in Wonderwall, 
She. 

763
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:31,720
You're well ahead of me there. 
That was when I was going to 

764
00:41:31,720 --> 00:41:33,360
throw that fact. 
Oh. 

765
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:36,200
OK, sorry Scatter. 
That into the conversation but 

766
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:40,000
but absolutely cut that. 
Out and oh God, no, they call 

767
00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:40,840
the glory. 
No, no. 

768
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:44,120
Later, I've never seen 
Wonderwall, but no, I've seen. 

769
00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:46,600
Bits of it. 
I gather it's not very good, 

770
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:49,800
yeah. 
It's yeah, proper kind of 

771
00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:53,440
swinging 60s in not in not very 
good way. 

772
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:58,360
Yeah, yeah. 
I didn't actually copy out or 

773
00:41:58,360 --> 00:42:03,440
take a copy of the the newspaper
article that told me about this 

774
00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:09,160
night of 100 stars, but I'm 
sure, I'm sure that it mentioned

775
00:42:09,160 --> 00:42:17,120
that Dora Dora Brian did a song 
and it was and it was dancing on

776
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:20,480
the ceiling. 
And I'm thinking, you know what 

777
00:42:20,480 --> 00:42:22,040
the. 
Lionel Richie song Can't it Be 

778
00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:23,560
There? 
Must have been an earlier song 

779
00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:26,840
called Dancing on the Ceiling 
again. 

780
00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:30,280
A time machine or something? 
Maybe the listeners can help me 

781
00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:32,360
out with that. 
So. 

782
00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:36,000
So yeah, so they performed it in
1960, but hold on to your hat, 

783
00:42:36,160 --> 00:42:40,520
right? 
A year earlier, June 1959. 

784
00:42:40,520 --> 00:42:44,240
I'm not even sure if that 
predates the I think it actually

785
00:42:44,240 --> 00:42:52,680
predates the LP coming out. 
But June 1959 on Sunday night at

786
00:42:52,680 --> 00:43:00,120
the Palladium on television, 
Peter Sellers, Irene Handel and 

787
00:43:00,120 --> 00:43:07,240
Harold Behrens perform a sketch.
OK, and it doesn't actually 

788
00:43:07,240 --> 00:43:10,680
indicate that it was Shadows on 
the Grass, so it may well have 

789
00:43:10,680 --> 00:43:13,560
not been, but I'm just wondering
whether it was. 

790
00:43:14,320 --> 00:43:18,400
But then what Harold Baron's You
couldn't have a third character,

791
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:19,240
could you? 
I suppose. 

792
00:43:20,840 --> 00:43:23,920
No, or he played the Shadow. 
Or perhaps he played the ghost 

793
00:43:23,920 --> 00:43:25,680
of Toughenal, her late husband. 
Oh. 

794
00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:30,280
Yeah. 
So what? 

795
00:43:30,360 --> 00:43:32,560
The point I'm making is that, 
you know, the two of them had 

796
00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:36,040
appeared on, on television, on 
stage together, performing 

797
00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:38,480
together. 
So it's not just the films, it's

798
00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:41,320
not just the LP's, but it's 
also, you know, live, live stage

799
00:43:41,320 --> 00:43:43,160
performances and television. 
There's a lot. 

800
00:43:43,160 --> 00:43:46,800
Together then yeah, definitely 
they they obviously, you know, 

801
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:48,200
really trusted each other and 
had that. 

802
00:43:48,200 --> 00:43:50,840
Obviously we know about the sort
of rapport they had. 

803
00:43:50,840 --> 00:43:53,200
That's that's really interesting
to know they did that. 

804
00:43:53,200 --> 00:43:56,480
I knew about this, that Laurence
Olivier had appeared and all 

805
00:43:56,480 --> 00:43:58,760
this, but I had no idea they 
they were on the bill as well. 

806
00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:03,680
That's really interesting and. 
The the critics, the other 

807
00:44:04,200 --> 00:44:11,160
sketch that that she's in on the
LP, she's she's apparently doing

808
00:44:11,160 --> 00:44:13,520
a parody of of Dyllis Powell and
I don't really know Dyllis 

809
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:16,040
Powell. 
I've heard the name, but I 

810
00:44:16,040 --> 00:44:19,240
couldn't, yeah. 
Yeah, they're talking about an 

811
00:44:19,240 --> 00:44:21,400
art exhibition. 
They talk about a film. 

812
00:44:21,400 --> 00:44:23,640
They've all seen the wrong film.
That's right, isn't it? 

813
00:44:24,040 --> 00:44:27,000
And using this this sort of 
flowery, excessive, 

814
00:44:28,400 --> 00:44:31,400
indecipherable jargon. 
Yes. 

815
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:33,600
Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. 
I know, I know. 

816
00:44:33,720 --> 00:44:36,840
It's a book, not a film. 
We got it wrong. 

817
00:44:36,840 --> 00:44:40,160
We got it wrong. 
Nobody's perfect, not even, not 

818
00:44:40,200 --> 00:44:43,840
look, not even me. 
But anyway, on with the show. 

819
00:44:44,400 --> 00:44:48,680
So now the book that we've all 
been reading is the new novel 

820
00:44:48,680 --> 00:44:52,360
The Seeds of Distress by Luigi 
Salami, published by Birdley 

821
00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:55,920
Hamilton at 15 shillings. 
Jay Wallace Larwood Well. 

822
00:44:56,640 --> 00:45:00,800
I've been reading Harmonium in 
the Dust Bay, Eustis Grimes, OH.

823
00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:03,000
I was. 
To read tomorrow was new 

824
00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:05,200
yesterday. 
You know the translation from 

825
00:45:05,200 --> 00:45:07,080
the Japanese by Lafar? 
I ever said. 

826
00:45:07,080 --> 00:45:09,800
That nobody told me to read 
anything at all. 

827
00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:15,520
The point of talking about it 
seems to be a bit damn stupid, I

828
00:45:15,520 --> 00:45:21,040
must say. 
Now correct me here Parkinson 

829
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:23,240
when he's interviewed by 
Parkinson and he's doing the 

830
00:45:23,240 --> 00:45:25,160
Warrington the. 
Minions. 

831
00:45:25,840 --> 00:45:27,880
Yeah, the play is called that, 
isn't it? 

832
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:30,960
Tomorrow's new play Say yes. 
I think it was yeah, the. 

833
00:45:30,960 --> 00:45:34,360
Play that he's in, I Met the 
Alhambra, you know, Tomorrow's 

834
00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:36,400
new yesterday, isn't it? 
Yeah. 

835
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:39,200
So it's, it's something he used 
again and again. 

836
00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:42,720
He goes into the pub and he says
to the landlord, he said good 

837
00:45:42,720 --> 00:45:45,800
morning, landlord. 
My name is Warrington Minge. 

838
00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:50,080
I am appearing in the new play 
at the Hippodrome, Tomorrow's 

839
00:45:50,080 --> 00:45:53,080
New Yesterday, and I was 
wondering if you could oblige 

840
00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:54,840
me. 
I'll have a large R.E.M. in 

841
00:45:54,840 --> 00:45:59,160
Martin, please, by cashing this 
small check. 

842
00:45:59,920 --> 00:46:03,200
But the whole critics thing, I 
mean, it's, it's timeless, that 

843
00:46:03,200 --> 00:46:07,960
whole, you know, pretentious 
cultural Chad. 

844
00:46:07,960 --> 00:46:11,360
It actually, I used to watch. 
It's so funny. 

845
00:46:12,040 --> 00:46:17,480
I used to watch in the late 90s.
Late review was it with Mark 

846
00:46:17,480 --> 00:46:20,200
Lawson and yeah. 
Yeah, and. 

847
00:46:20,520 --> 00:46:25,640
Bloody God awful Tony Parsons 
and bloody worse Allison person.

848
00:46:26,240 --> 00:46:27,760
But Tom Poland used to fascinate
me. 

849
00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:31,560
Christ, he no, he fascinated me 
because every he would read 

850
00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:35,240
Joycean influences into every 
single thing, you know, he'd be 

851
00:46:35,240 --> 00:46:36,440
talking about. 
I don't know. 

852
00:46:36,440 --> 00:46:38,720
Yeah. 
The the Power Rangers movie. 

853
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:42,880
I can see the the hand of James 
Joyce at work here, you know? 

854
00:46:44,720 --> 00:46:45,640
Yes. 
I'd. 

855
00:46:45,640 --> 00:46:48,960
Like to meet Tom Poland, I would
not like to meet Tony Powersons,

856
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:50,720
I would not be responsible for 
my actions and. 

857
00:46:50,720 --> 00:46:54,240
Definitely not Allison Pearson 
neither gloss over her but but 

858
00:46:54,240 --> 00:46:59,840
the the bit that really get 
kills me is the the mustache 

859
00:46:59,840 --> 00:47:02,480
drawn on the post and he gets 
really animated and emotional 

860
00:47:02,480 --> 00:47:05,360
about this poster. 
Have you ever, for example, 

861
00:47:05,400 --> 00:47:08,880
stood in a tube station and seen
a poster with a mustache? 

862
00:47:14,280 --> 00:47:15,360
It's. 
Brilliant. 

863
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:19,480
It's so good. 
It just it just cracks me up 

864
00:47:19,480 --> 00:47:22,400
every time. 
It's so funny. 

865
00:47:22,920 --> 00:47:25,280
It's. 
And it's it's like you say, it's

866
00:47:25,280 --> 00:47:26,880
timeless. 
The show is on the grass. 

867
00:47:27,360 --> 00:47:30,000
It's timeless. 
There's there's a few sketches 

868
00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:35,280
on the album that are dated, you
know, skiffle song and things 

869
00:47:35,280 --> 00:47:35,800
like that. 
Yeah, the. 

870
00:47:35,800 --> 00:47:38,040
Rock'n'roll one. 
Yeah, yeah. 

871
00:47:38,040 --> 00:47:41,240
I mean, going back to Irene 
Handel, she loved Rock'n'roll, 

872
00:47:41,240 --> 00:47:44,040
didn't she? 
She was president of the 

873
00:47:44,040 --> 00:47:46,880
Lewisham branch of the Elvis 
Presley Fan Club. 

874
00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:52,360
Can't believe that. 
She was she was a purist in a 

875
00:47:52,360 --> 00:47:56,120
way because she only liked pre 
army Elvis and she loved 

876
00:47:56,120 --> 00:47:58,160
rock'n'roll. 
She genuinely loved it. 

877
00:47:58,640 --> 00:48:01,240
As we know, a lot of comedy 
people are really either 

878
00:48:01,240 --> 00:48:04,920
musicians are really into music 
and it is like great comedy is 

879
00:48:04,920 --> 00:48:07,400
like music. 
And you have that connection 

880
00:48:07,400 --> 00:48:11,120
with Peter and Irene as well, 
maybe that they're very, you 

881
00:48:11,120 --> 00:48:14,040
know, they love music and him 
being a drummer and all of that 

882
00:48:14,040 --> 00:48:17,640
stuff and. 
That's. 

883
00:48:17,640 --> 00:48:20,160
A big part of of comedy, it's 
the rhythm, isn't it? 

884
00:48:20,160 --> 00:48:22,400
And she loved rock'n'roll. 
She loved Elvis. 

885
00:48:23,920 --> 00:48:26,520
She was quite, yeah, she was 
into Rock'n'roll. 

886
00:48:27,000 --> 00:48:32,600
She also bear in mind she was 
what, born in 1901, I think 

887
00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:33,040
that's. 
Right. 

888
00:48:33,040 --> 00:48:36,200
Yeah. 
So by the late 60s, early 70s, 

889
00:48:36,200 --> 00:48:40,400
when the so-called permissive 
society was happening, she was 

890
00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:43,200
all for it? 
Yeah, actually, yeah, Although 

891
00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:45,280
she admitted she was too old to 
to join in. 

892
00:48:46,600 --> 00:48:49,440
She actually said I, I she she 
said. 

893
00:48:49,440 --> 00:48:51,400
I don't think pornography 
corrupts. 

894
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:53,480
I quite like it. 
Oh, did. 

895
00:48:53,520 --> 00:48:55,800
She say that the. 
Mind boggles, yeah. 

896
00:48:56,680 --> 00:49:00,440
She was in a few kind of dodgy 
films in the 70s, wasn't she? 

897
00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:05,400
She was in my friend Gary's 
favorite film of all time, Come 

898
00:49:05,640 --> 00:49:13,520
Come Play with Me, which he'll 
hate me saying that I think it's

899
00:49:13,520 --> 00:49:18,400
Mary Millington. 
Yes, she had a, she had a 

900
00:49:18,400 --> 00:49:21,240
pornography. 
Shop in Newbury in South London 

901
00:49:21,240 --> 00:49:25,360
and she quite often would be 
topless behind the counter and 

902
00:49:25,360 --> 00:49:26,160
stuff. 
Really. 

903
00:49:26,280 --> 00:49:27,280
Really. 
Yeah, in. 

904
00:49:27,320 --> 00:49:30,240
In in sedate Newbury of all 
places. 

905
00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:37,080
Beside me I. 
Read about that because my 

906
00:49:37,080 --> 00:49:39,840
partner's parents lived in 
Norbury for time and I said did 

907
00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:43,840
you know that Mary Millington 
had a pawn shop in Norbury? 

908
00:49:45,200 --> 00:49:46,520
Did your partner's father used 
to? 

909
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:49,080
Frequently. 
Oh no, he no, he wouldn't have 

910
00:49:49,080 --> 00:49:50,120
done. 
But he he's Irish. 

911
00:49:50,120 --> 00:49:53,640
He wouldn't have been around in 
that part of London back back in

912
00:49:53,640 --> 00:49:55,440
the day in the 70s. 
But no. 

913
00:49:56,640 --> 00:50:01,320
But yeah, I just, I just assume,
you know, she just was like 

914
00:50:01,320 --> 00:50:04,440
somebody that wanted just keep 
working and wasn't particularly 

915
00:50:04,440 --> 00:50:07,720
moral about it or judgmental and
just thought I need to pay the 

916
00:50:07,720 --> 00:50:09,080
bills. 
She wasn't married, she didn't 

917
00:50:09,080 --> 00:50:11,320
have a family. 
She just are. 

918
00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:12,600
We talking about sorry, you're 
talking about Irene? 

919
00:50:12,640 --> 00:50:17,600
Yeah, I'm not. 
Talking about merry minutes, I'm

920
00:50:17,600 --> 00:50:20,520
talking about Irene taking these
kind of slightly, sort of, you 

921
00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:22,520
know. 
I don't think she wasn't, I 

922
00:50:22,520 --> 00:50:24,320
don't think she was no way 
prudish. 

923
00:50:24,360 --> 00:50:25,960
I just think it was just a job 
of work. 

924
00:50:25,960 --> 00:50:28,120
Exactly. 
Turn up, she'd do the lines and 

925
00:50:28,120 --> 00:50:31,760
go home, take the paycheck 
because she's single woman, you 

926
00:50:31,760 --> 00:50:34,480
know, she didn't have a husband 
to fall back on financially. 

927
00:50:34,480 --> 00:50:38,080
So just take the work, you know,
keep working and you know, she 

928
00:50:38,080 --> 00:50:41,440
was just. 
She, yeah, she never married 

929
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:45,840
with said that earlier, but she,
she did say that in her, in her 

930
00:50:45,840 --> 00:50:50,160
20s, she did a lot of travelling
abroad, including America during

931
00:50:50,760 --> 00:50:54,240
Prohibition era. 
And, and, and remember she said 

932
00:50:54,240 --> 00:50:56,400
that she was, and I've seen a 
photo of, of her. 

933
00:50:56,400 --> 00:51:00,280
She, she was very attractive. 
And she says that she received 

934
00:51:00,280 --> 00:51:04,520
many marriage proposals, some by
some, some by very wealthy 

935
00:51:05,520 --> 00:51:08,240
suitors, but but she turned them
all down. 

936
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:12,120
Yeah, it really strikes me that 
she was probably, it's a bit of 

937
00:51:12,120 --> 00:51:14,720
a cliche, but she was probably 
married to her profession. 

938
00:51:15,560 --> 00:51:20,040
You could really tell she really
loved acting and having kids and

939
00:51:20,040 --> 00:51:22,800
everything it would have. 
That would have been the kibosh 

940
00:51:22,800 --> 00:51:26,360
on the acting career. 
But I think when she was in 

941
00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:30,680
Paris when she was about 19, she
started writing her first novel 

942
00:51:30,680 --> 00:51:35,560
called The Sioux, and then did 
pick it up until a few years 

943
00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:38,600
later and developed it more. 
And apparently it was a really 

944
00:51:38,600 --> 00:51:42,360
big hit and really highly rated 
by critics. 

945
00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:46,800
And apparently Paramount 
Pictures optioned it was there 

946
00:51:46,800 --> 00:51:48,800
was a possibility of it turning 
into a film. 

947
00:51:50,480 --> 00:51:52,920
And what? 
If if I'd been a proper 

948
00:51:52,920 --> 00:51:57,840
podcaster and and done my 
research, I'd have got a copy of

949
00:51:57,840 --> 00:52:00,440
that and read that in 
preparation for this, but it it 

950
00:52:00,440 --> 00:52:02,360
probably could. 
Have and she did a sequel like 

951
00:52:02,360 --> 00:52:05,200
many years later she did a 
sequel to it. 

952
00:52:05,760 --> 00:52:06,640
What a weird. 
Name. 

953
00:52:07,080 --> 00:52:08,920
Yeah. 
It's it's some sort of I wish 

954
00:52:08,920 --> 00:52:12,800
I'd jotted it down, but it's, 
it's like the gold tipped Pfizer

955
00:52:12,800 --> 00:52:14,960
or some Fitzer Fitzer or 
something. 

956
00:52:15,360 --> 00:52:18,400
But yeah, she did a a sort of 
follow up because the first one 

957
00:52:18,400 --> 00:52:24,160
was so popular and yeah, 
probably those critics from the 

958
00:52:24,720 --> 00:52:26,280
Sellers album would have loved 
it. 

959
00:52:29,320 --> 00:52:32,440
Yes, let's talk. 
About Whispering Giant because 

960
00:52:33,600 --> 00:52:37,520
so yes, sellers market we 
covered last year on Goon Pod. 

961
00:52:37,600 --> 00:52:39,880
So we've talked about this, the 
sketch. 

962
00:52:41,400 --> 00:52:43,400
But yeah, like you say, it is, 
it's a little bit sad. 

963
00:52:43,400 --> 00:52:48,920
It's it's the same, same or 
similar characters, but 20 years

964
00:52:48,920 --> 00:52:53,920
later, pretty much, isn't it? 
Yeah, well, no, it's it's it's 

965
00:52:53,920 --> 00:52:57,680
Peter Sellers as himself, but 
playing a Frenchman. 

966
00:52:58,560 --> 00:52:59,760
Yeah, it's. 
Really strange because it's 

967
00:52:59,760 --> 00:53:01,560
like, oh, you're Peter Sellers, 
aren't you? 

968
00:53:01,560 --> 00:53:03,760
And it's it doesn't really sound
like him, but. 

969
00:53:05,000 --> 00:53:07,560
Well, he's kind of doing an 
accent, which is kind of French,

970
00:53:07,560 --> 00:53:09,720
I think. 
Or it's certainly an accent 

971
00:53:10,360 --> 00:53:13,800
because he's trying to remain 
anonymous. 

972
00:53:13,840 --> 00:53:15,840
I suppose that's the conceit, 
yeah. 

973
00:53:15,840 --> 00:53:18,600
They're on a plane to and 
sitting next to each other and 

974
00:53:18,600 --> 00:53:21,320
she's trying to spark up a 
conversation with him and he's 

975
00:53:21,320 --> 00:53:23,000
not really that interested, is 
he? 

976
00:53:24,320 --> 00:53:31,840
He's he's kind of humouring her,
but it's he's also very self 

977
00:53:31,840 --> 00:53:34,440
deprecating on seller's part 
because you know, towards the 

978
00:53:34,440 --> 00:53:39,680
end she she recognises him or 
she thinks she thinks she thinks

979
00:53:39,680 --> 00:53:44,240
she does and she gets him to 
side her arm and and then she 

980
00:53:44,240 --> 00:53:47,000
says, oh, Peter Sellers, Oh, 
thanks, thanks all the same. 

981
00:53:47,000 --> 00:53:51,280
My. 
Two husbands chalk from cheese 

982
00:53:51,680 --> 00:53:53,200
Tafnell. 
He was my first. 

983
00:53:53,200 --> 00:53:56,680
I used to call him daddy. 
He used to love to see me 

984
00:53:56,680 --> 00:54:00,320
kneeling up to the window with 
my thumb in my mouth. 

985
00:54:00,800 --> 00:54:01,480
We. 
Only had a. 

986
00:54:01,480 --> 00:54:04,800
Morris Minor in those days. 
But we was happy well. 

987
00:54:06,160 --> 00:54:09,160
After all, that's all that 
matters, you know, Happiness. 

988
00:54:09,520 --> 00:54:12,160
Happiness. 
I saw your look. 

989
00:54:12,240 --> 00:54:14,840
He did. 
Everyone looks when I hear. 

990
00:54:14,880 --> 00:54:17,480
I've been twice married. 
Of course I'm married. 

991
00:54:17,480 --> 00:54:19,640
Tafnell straight from the 
schoolroom, you know. 

992
00:54:19,920 --> 00:54:25,480
I've got no more idea of 
marrying than flying that man. 

993
00:54:25,480 --> 00:54:28,800
He treated me like I was rolled 
in gold. 

994
00:54:29,240 --> 00:54:33,280
I was his sacred trust. 
He even kept a special name for 

995
00:54:33,280 --> 00:54:35,640
me. 
What was it? 

996
00:54:37,320 --> 00:54:38,960
I don't think I want to tell you
ah, but. 

997
00:54:40,000 --> 00:54:41,600
I want to know. 
I want to know. 

998
00:54:42,120 --> 00:54:44,640
Come on. 
He come he call me Squidgy. 

999
00:54:45,360 --> 00:54:48,960
Squidgy. 
But that's very nice. 

1000
00:54:48,960 --> 00:54:49,840
Could you? 
Oh. 

1001
00:54:49,960 --> 00:54:54,960
Yes, so honestly, when he passed
over, I thought my bottom had 

1002
00:54:54,960 --> 00:54:56,160
fallen out. 
There's. 

1003
00:54:56,160 --> 00:54:58,160
Something sort of really 
poignant about it though, 

1004
00:54:58,160 --> 00:55:00,920
because we know that's nearing 
the end of Seller's life. 

1005
00:55:00,920 --> 00:55:05,640
And him probably looking back to
his more happier times in the 

1006
00:55:05,640 --> 00:55:09,000
50s when he was starting out and
you know, his flourishing movie 

1007
00:55:09,000 --> 00:55:12,280
career and all of this and being
around people like Irene Handel 

1008
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:16,800
and the goons and and all those 
people and wanting to recapture 

1009
00:55:16,800 --> 00:55:18,960
that. 
I think he was obviously not in 

1010
00:55:18,960 --> 00:55:23,680
a very happy pet place with Lynn
Frederick and she had alienated 

1011
00:55:23,680 --> 00:55:29,400
his kids from him and controlled
his life And and, you know, he 

1012
00:55:29,400 --> 00:55:31,640
just wanted a bit of happiness 
in his life, I think. 

1013
00:55:31,640 --> 00:55:34,840
And reconnecting with those old 
colleagues obviously meant a lot

1014
00:55:34,840 --> 00:55:37,480
to him. 
But there is sort of tinged with

1015
00:55:37,520 --> 00:55:40,680
sadness, I think, that sketch. 
Yes. 

1016
00:55:41,720 --> 00:55:43,880
I never thought about it until 
you mentioned it. 

1017
00:55:43,880 --> 00:55:47,160
And then it makes absolute sense
that yeah, it does. 

1018
00:55:47,480 --> 00:55:49,440
It's like. 
A circle completing isn't it in 

1019
00:55:49,440 --> 00:55:52,760
a weird way. 
I don't think I will ever get 

1020
00:55:52,880 --> 00:55:57,440
over Peter's death. 
It I don't know what it is. 

1021
00:55:57,440 --> 00:55:59,520
It's something I can't pass the 
door. 

1022
00:55:59,520 --> 00:56:04,880
Just about an awful It's a 
terrible loss. 

1023
00:56:05,520 --> 00:56:09,280
She was interviewed about making
that sketch and she said, she 

1024
00:56:09,280 --> 00:56:13,000
said the other day I made the 
head of United Artists laugh and

1025
00:56:13,000 --> 00:56:17,640
he and he's a man reputed Devoto
of laughter's life because he 

1026
00:56:17,640 --> 00:56:22,160
was listening to that sketch 
because it was it was a United 

1027
00:56:22,160 --> 00:56:24,360
Artist album, I guess, or 
release or whatever. 

1028
00:56:26,080 --> 00:56:28,400
And she said about she said, I'm
really chuffed about it, about 

1029
00:56:28,400 --> 00:56:31,200
the the sketch. 
She said it's come out ever so 

1030
00:56:31,200 --> 00:56:32,360
well. 
Oh dear. 

1031
00:56:32,360 --> 00:56:34,240
I hope you won't think I'm being
conceited. 

1032
00:56:36,320 --> 00:56:37,880
But she wrote that, of course, 
didn't she? 

1033
00:56:37,880 --> 00:56:39,920
That again, she wrote The 
Whispering Giant. 

1034
00:56:39,960 --> 00:56:41,000
Yeah. 
She did. 

1035
00:56:41,520 --> 00:56:44,880
She's a very talented writer. 
She obviously the acting career 

1036
00:56:44,880 --> 00:56:50,560
took precedence, but she was a 
really, really brilliant writer.

1037
00:56:50,720 --> 00:56:53,160
Really had a great way with 
words. 

1038
00:56:53,160 --> 00:56:57,840
Obviously, I can imagine her 
loving people watching like 

1039
00:56:57,840 --> 00:57:00,480
stemming from her childhood and 
watching the the kind of 

1040
00:57:00,600 --> 00:57:03,680
servants in the house and stuff 
and just, you know, sitting 

1041
00:57:03,680 --> 00:57:07,320
there watching the world go by, 
watching people and how they 

1042
00:57:07,320 --> 00:57:09,520
behave and the things they say 
you say. 

1043
00:57:09,520 --> 00:57:13,200
She had a way with words more 
than I have, she said. 

1044
00:57:13,200 --> 00:57:16,080
She had a way with words. 
She'd gone to see a particular 

1045
00:57:16,080 --> 00:57:18,160
film and she came out and she 
said it looks like a Hoover 

1046
00:57:18,160 --> 00:57:19,280
attachment. 
Can you? 

1047
00:57:19,280 --> 00:57:21,120
Can you guess what it was that 
she was? 

1048
00:57:22,120 --> 00:57:25,480
Mind boggles. 
What is she talking about? 

1049
00:57:25,480 --> 00:57:28,000
She. 
She was very unimpressed by the 

1050
00:57:28,000 --> 00:57:30,480
film all together. 
ET. 

1051
00:57:31,200 --> 00:57:32,800
Really. 
Yes. 

1052
00:57:33,240 --> 00:57:36,200
She she came out, she said, Oh 
well, I'm going to go and watch 

1053
00:57:36,200 --> 00:57:38,040
a film with a Hoover attachment 
in it. 

1054
00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:46,240
Oh dear, is that how ET is a 
Hoover attachment? 

1055
00:57:46,560 --> 00:57:49,080
Yeah. 
Pretty much, but she wasn't 

1056
00:57:49,680 --> 00:57:51,200
another film she was unimpressed
by. 

1057
00:57:51,600 --> 00:57:55,840
God, this is a good segue. 
I didn't mean this, but it fits.

1058
00:57:57,280 --> 00:57:59,320
She wasn't impressed by the 
magic Christian. 

1059
00:58:00,880 --> 00:58:05,560
That. 
The Peter said well, but no she 

1060
00:58:05,560 --> 00:58:07,680
There was a particular scene in 
the Magic Christian that she 

1061
00:58:07,680 --> 00:58:11,480
wasn't impressed by I. 
Must tell you I phoned up Irene 

1062
00:58:11,480 --> 00:58:15,480
Handle recently to congratulate 
her on something she was doing 

1063
00:58:15,480 --> 00:58:19,640
on television, she said. 
She said, you know, she was an 

1064
00:58:20,240 --> 00:58:24,840
overall mate of mine. 
She said, you know, Peter, you 

1065
00:58:24,840 --> 00:58:27,320
know, I love you. 
She said, oh, not, I mean, you 

1066
00:58:27,320 --> 00:58:29,240
know, not like that or anything,
you know. 

1067
00:58:29,240 --> 00:58:33,240
But she said, you know, the 
other day I saw that film the 

1068
00:58:33,240 --> 00:58:39,160
Magic Christians or something. 
And you know, when that scene 

1069
00:58:39,160 --> 00:58:44,560
with all the excreta come on at 
the end, a lot of us OAPs went 

1070
00:58:44,560 --> 00:58:47,880
out. 
And I didn't know what she meant

1071
00:58:47,880 --> 00:58:50,960
by OAPs at that time, you know, 
So I said, what? 

1072
00:58:51,240 --> 00:58:52,680
What do you mean? 
I appease love? 

1073
00:58:52,680 --> 00:58:55,320
She said, well, I mean, you 
know, quite a lot of the old age

1074
00:58:55,320 --> 00:59:01,920
pensioners left when the excreta
come on, she said, except there 

1075
00:59:01,920 --> 00:59:05,840
was an Irishman sleeping there. 
I noticed him, but he didn't, 

1076
00:59:05,840 --> 00:59:10,320
you know, because he was asleep,
She said, but I don't honestly 

1077
00:59:10,320 --> 00:59:13,200
think, you know, that people 
want to see excreta on a scene 

1078
00:59:13,200 --> 00:59:15,800
like, you know, in the films. 
You know, I said yes, but the 

1079
00:59:15,800 --> 00:59:19,640
point was love I and I said I 
know it was a very hard hitting 

1080
00:59:19,640 --> 00:59:23,440
particular that scene, you know,
from the book, but it really 

1081
00:59:23,440 --> 00:59:28,400
meant that people will swim 
through shit for money and which

1082
00:59:28,400 --> 00:59:29,560
is absolutely true. 
I did it. 

1083
00:59:32,120 --> 00:59:35,600
She said oh, but I don't know if
the OAPs would do that. 

1084
00:59:38,880 --> 00:59:41,840
You know, it takes someone takes
balls for someone to phone up 

1085
00:59:41,920 --> 00:59:45,960
Peter Sellers in the late 60s 
and and tell him that his film 

1086
00:59:45,960 --> 00:59:47,240
was rubbish. 
Yeah. 

1087
00:59:47,240 --> 00:59:50,880
That it really, I mean, at that 
point he was quite mad, wasn't 

1088
00:59:50,880 --> 00:59:51,760
he? 
With power. 

1089
00:59:51,760 --> 00:59:53,920
His ego was enormous at this 
point. 

1090
00:59:54,720 --> 00:59:57,920
Absolutely it was. 
You know this slide had started,

1091
00:59:57,920 --> 00:59:59,040
hasn't it? 
Because he just seemed 

1092
00:59:59,040 --> 01:00:02,320
impossible to work with. 
Yes. 

1093
01:00:02,760 --> 01:00:06,200
So yes, she, she died in the 
late 80s. 

1094
01:00:06,200 --> 01:00:11,000
She died I think 87. 
Yeah, one of the last things she

1095
01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:14,400
ever appeared in, which I've 
talked about on this podcast 

1096
01:00:14,400 --> 01:00:15,600
before. 
And I think I think I've 

1097
01:00:16,080 --> 01:00:19,440
possibly even played a clip. 
And because it's it's quite, 

1098
01:00:19,440 --> 01:00:24,760
it's always stayed with me. 
She played she played the sister

1099
01:00:24,760 --> 01:00:31,560
of Min, not Minnie Bannister, 
but Min who was Elf Garnett's an

1100
01:00:31,560 --> 01:00:35,760
old next door neighbor in it's 
in to death or two-part. 

1101
01:00:35,760 --> 01:00:38,360
But when they they made in 
sickness and in health in the 

1102
01:00:38,360 --> 01:00:44,240
late 80s or mid to late 80s men 
played by Patricia Hayes. 

1103
01:00:44,240 --> 01:00:48,720
The the peerless Patricia Hayes 
comes to visit Mr. Garnett and 

1104
01:00:48,720 --> 01:00:52,400
brings her dotty old sister, 
which is I really handle. 

1105
01:00:52,400 --> 01:00:56,480
Yeah, I'll. 
Say you haven't introduced us. 

1106
01:00:56,480 --> 01:01:00,680
This is Mr. Garney. 
No, no, I'm not him. 

1107
01:01:00,680 --> 01:01:03,720
Not Mr. Darn, The gentleman who 
lives here. 

1108
01:01:03,800 --> 01:01:06,680
What's his name? 
It's Mr. Darn. 

1109
01:01:06,760 --> 01:01:09,080
He told you to make me cross. 
Come here. 

1110
01:01:09,080 --> 01:01:11,600
Is that thing switched? 
On Well, now she darn. 

1111
01:01:11,600 --> 01:01:17,840
Now let's have a see. 
Testing, testing. 

1112
01:01:19,480 --> 01:01:21,640
Yes. 
It's OK, I'll switch it on 

1113
01:01:21,640 --> 01:01:23,000
there. 
It was switched on. 

1114
01:01:26,960 --> 01:01:29,400
What did you want to say? 
She wanders a. 

1115
01:01:29,400 --> 01:01:34,600
Bit anyway, it's ever so nice to
see you again, Mr. Garnet, and 

1116
01:01:34,600 --> 01:01:36,360
you haven't changed a bit. 
Oh. 

1117
01:01:36,360 --> 01:01:38,640
Neither of you. 
I'm talking to him, not you. 

1118
01:01:38,680 --> 01:01:42,440
You can't sit down there. 
Rest your feet a bit. 

1119
01:01:43,520 --> 01:01:45,880
God. 
I wish she'd give a tongue a 

1120
01:01:45,880 --> 01:01:48,560
rest I've seen. 
Clips recently of her in that 

1121
01:01:48,560 --> 01:01:52,040
and she's very, very funny I. 
Don't know what she she doesn't.

1122
01:01:52,320 --> 01:01:55,800
She's playing a character who's 
clearly got dementia or, or 

1123
01:01:56,240 --> 01:01:59,960
mental frailty, shall we say, 
and she plays it very 

1124
01:01:59,960 --> 01:02:02,560
realistically that there's one 
point when she actually loses it

1125
01:02:02,560 --> 01:02:05,120
and starts almost screaming. 
Oh my. 

1126
01:02:05,200 --> 01:02:08,640
God. 
In frustration, yeah, right. 

1127
01:02:09,440 --> 01:02:12,960
And so it's not all laughs. 
No. 

1128
01:02:13,520 --> 01:02:19,080
But then Johnny Spate didn't 
always write gags that he he, he

1129
01:02:19,080 --> 01:02:21,920
often would. 
There'd be a lot of sort of 

1130
01:02:21,920 --> 01:02:24,840
darker stuff, yeah. 
More like a sort of play for 

1131
01:02:24,840 --> 01:02:27,640
today than a sitcom. 
Yeah, yeah. 

1132
01:02:27,880 --> 01:02:30,600
And and of course, getting back 
to the Sellers connection, 

1133
01:02:31,120 --> 01:02:34,520
Sellers was his first choice to 
play off Garnet was. 

1134
01:02:34,800 --> 01:02:37,600
Oh yeah. 
Yeah, I forgot about that. 

1135
01:02:38,640 --> 01:02:41,640
But by that point Sellers was 
making the movies, so yeah. 

1136
01:02:42,720 --> 01:02:46,880
But the point I'm making is that
she turns out, I think it's, it 

1137
01:02:46,880 --> 01:02:50,120
might be two episodes of in 
sickness and health. 

1138
01:02:50,120 --> 01:02:52,440
Certainly one where there's a 
there's a seance, they conduct A

1139
01:02:52,440 --> 01:02:56,280
seance and all sorts. 
But I mentioned that because 

1140
01:02:56,280 --> 01:02:59,720
it's, it's a very memorable, you
know, it's pretty much her last 

1141
01:02:59,720 --> 01:03:03,320
role. 
I would have said, well, nearly 

1142
01:03:03,320 --> 01:03:06,520
her last role. 
Irene's had last role, but it's,

1143
01:03:06,520 --> 01:03:08,840
it's so memorable. 
But I, I thought it'd be good 

1144
01:03:08,840 --> 01:03:10,840
opportunity because I mentioned 
Patricia Hayes. 

1145
01:03:10,840 --> 01:03:15,000
I thought it'd be a good 
opportunity for you and I or for

1146
01:03:15,000 --> 01:03:22,320
you to play, to play a fun game 
that I've made-up called Handle 

1147
01:03:22,400 --> 01:03:32,840
or Haze. 
So let me explain that the rules

1148
01:03:32,880 --> 01:03:36,000
are very, very difficult, so 
listen carefully, OK? 

1149
01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:38,600
Is it like? 
Number Wang it's. 

1150
01:03:38,760 --> 01:03:41,280
It's it's a bit more complicated
than Number Wang. 

1151
01:03:42,560 --> 01:03:44,760
So what I'm going to do, I'm 
going to I'm going to name a 

1152
01:03:44,760 --> 01:03:49,320
bunch of films, OK. 
And these are films which have 

1153
01:03:49,800 --> 01:03:51,440
characters. 
I'm going to name the names of 

1154
01:03:51,440 --> 01:03:56,840
the characters and you have to 
tell me whether it's Irene 

1155
01:03:56,840 --> 01:03:59,320
Handel or Patricia Hayes. 
My. 

1156
01:03:59,320 --> 01:04:01,160
Comedy geekdom is on the line 
here. 

1157
01:04:01,480 --> 01:04:02,240
Some of. 
Them you'll know. 

1158
01:04:02,240 --> 01:04:06,560
Some of them you may not. 
OK, I am menopausal so my memory

1159
01:04:06,560 --> 01:04:08,920
is not great but go. 
For it, but I know it's 

1160
01:04:08,920 --> 01:04:12,160
definitely one of them. 
You will know definitely, right?

1161
01:04:12,800 --> 01:04:19,400
OK, so the film Smashing Time 
from 1967, which was that? 

1162
01:04:19,400 --> 01:04:21,560
Have you ever seen that? 
That's that, yes. 

1163
01:04:21,680 --> 01:04:23,160
Film. 
Set in swinging London with a 

1164
01:04:23,160 --> 01:04:27,560
pair of fabulous birds. 
Yeah, Lynn Red. 

1165
01:04:27,560 --> 01:04:29,040
Are Rita touching him? 
Rita. 

1166
01:04:29,040 --> 01:04:31,680
Touching him and Lynn Redgrave 
Lynn. 

1167
01:04:31,680 --> 01:04:32,600
Redgrave. 
That's right. 

1168
01:04:32,960 --> 01:04:34,320
Yeah. 
OK, so smashing time. 

1169
01:04:34,520 --> 01:04:36,640
There's a character called Mrs. 
Gimble. 

1170
01:04:37,440 --> 01:04:39,080
Now, my question to you, Donnie.
Yes. 

1171
01:04:39,080 --> 01:04:41,600
Was that Irene Handle or 
Patricia Hayes? 

1172
01:04:41,600 --> 01:04:44,120
I'm. 
Going to go for handle. 

1173
01:04:46,000 --> 01:04:46,680
Correct. 
Yay. 

1174
01:04:50,000 --> 01:04:51,520
OK, Do you want to double your 
money? 

1175
01:04:54,200 --> 01:04:58,320
The next film, 1942 went to the 
day. 

1176
01:04:58,320 --> 01:05:01,640
Well, and the character is 
Daisy. 

1177
01:05:03,200 --> 01:05:06,160
Now, is that Irene Handle or is 
that Pat Hayes? 

1178
01:05:06,280 --> 01:05:08,320
I'm just. 
I'm going to go with Hayes. 

1179
01:05:08,360 --> 01:05:10,480
I can't really remember. 
I have seen that film, but I 

1180
01:05:10,480 --> 01:05:12,920
can't remember Irene in it. 
But I'm going to go Hayes. 

1181
01:05:13,560 --> 01:05:15,280
You are correct. 
It was Patricia Hayes. 

1182
01:05:15,760 --> 01:05:17,960
Patricia Hayes, who was quite 
young then, but she still 

1183
01:05:17,960 --> 01:05:20,200
looked. 
Yeah, about 18 like Edna. 

1184
01:05:20,200 --> 01:05:23,920
The inebriated woman. 
OK, next one Carry on. 

1185
01:05:23,920 --> 01:05:28,520
Nurse from 1959 and the the 
character is Mrs. Madge Hickson.

1186
01:05:30,120 --> 01:05:33,400
So is that Handel or Hayes? 
No, they've both been Carry On 

1187
01:05:33,400 --> 01:05:36,600
films. 
I'm sure I'm gonna go. 

1188
01:05:36,600 --> 01:05:43,200
I'm gonna go Hayes on this one. 
I'm going to go rogue and say 

1189
01:05:43,200 --> 01:05:44,840
Hayes. 
Oh, dear. 

1190
01:05:45,400 --> 01:05:51,720
No, no, it's not that important.
It's I really handle now. 

1191
01:05:51,880 --> 01:05:53,000
I'm. 
I'm very competitive. 

1192
01:05:54,800 --> 01:05:57,880
It's I really handle as Mrs. 
Mrs. Hicks now. 

1193
01:05:58,600 --> 01:05:59,880
Did you know the connection? 
Yeah. 

1194
01:05:59,880 --> 01:06:02,480
But you said, I think Patricia 
Hayes was in one of the Carry On

1195
01:06:02,480 --> 01:06:04,360
doctors, wasn't she? 
Certainly, Yeah. 

1196
01:06:05,560 --> 01:06:08,400
Do you know she has a another 
connection with Carry On films? 

1197
01:06:10,160 --> 01:06:12,480
Son, Son. 
Yeah, he's in the later ones, 

1198
01:06:12,480 --> 01:06:15,480
isn't he? 
He's the Boggs and Boggs junior 

1199
01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:17,520
and the carry on at your 
convenience, isn't he? 

1200
01:06:18,240 --> 01:06:19,920
He's. 
A young Richard Callaghan. 

1201
01:06:19,920 --> 01:06:21,920
Richard. 
Callaghan or Callaghan? 

1202
01:06:22,080 --> 01:06:25,240
Yes, that's right. 
OK, next film. 

1203
01:06:25,240 --> 01:06:27,840
Oh God, I'm. 
Feeling the pressure now? 

1204
01:06:28,360 --> 01:06:32,920
Absolute beginners from 1986 
character Miss Larkin. 

1205
01:06:33,880 --> 01:06:36,920
Oh my God, was it? 
Handel or Haze? 

1206
01:06:41,640 --> 01:06:44,440
I was the one person in the 
cinema that saw Absolute 

1207
01:06:44,440 --> 01:06:46,080
Beginners. 
I was on my own because I was a 

1208
01:06:46,080 --> 01:06:48,160
massive David Bowie fan. 
I. 

1209
01:06:48,280 --> 01:06:49,760
Why that film do? 
You. 

1210
01:06:49,760 --> 01:06:52,640
Yeah, it's. 
It's got, it's got Ray Davis in 

1211
01:06:52,640 --> 01:06:53,920
it, if I remember. 
Yeah, yeah. 

1212
01:06:56,360 --> 01:06:59,160
Mandy Rice Davis in. 
Oh, wow. 

1213
01:06:59,440 --> 01:07:03,560
Yes. 
Oh God, I'm only going to go 

1214
01:07:03,560 --> 01:07:08,960
haze because by the time that 
absolute beginners came out, I 

1215
01:07:08,960 --> 01:07:11,800
really handled was very, very 
old by this point. 

1216
01:07:11,800 --> 01:07:14,400
It could have been her. 
It was. 

1217
01:07:14,440 --> 01:07:15,360
I really handled. 
It was. 

1218
01:07:15,360 --> 01:07:17,120
Handled. 
Oh my God. 

1219
01:07:17,120 --> 01:07:19,240
I should have remembered that. 
All I could remember at the time

1220
01:07:19,240 --> 01:07:21,080
is David Bowie. 
That's all I could remember. 

1221
01:07:22,000 --> 01:07:24,640
Yeah, OK, there's only a few 
more of these. 

1222
01:07:24,640 --> 01:07:29,240
Don't worry, be over soon. 
Now in 1964 there was a one of 

1223
01:07:29,240 --> 01:07:32,680
those British pop exploitation 
films that they that 

1224
01:07:32,680 --> 01:07:37,080
proliferated where you had 
British pop stars being shoe 

1225
01:07:37,080 --> 01:07:40,720
horned into cheesy comedy films.
Comedy films. 

1226
01:07:41,080 --> 01:07:45,440
There's one called It's All Over
Town with Frankie Vaughan that's

1227
01:07:45,440 --> 01:07:49,280
Personal. 
Willie Rushton, The Hollies and 

1228
01:07:49,280 --> 01:07:52,520
the Springfields. 
Right, that's in her brother. 

1229
01:07:52,800 --> 01:07:54,080
Yeah, that's in her brother. 
Yeah. 

1230
01:07:55,520 --> 01:07:58,320
And and playing the char lady, 
the very memorable role of the 

1231
01:07:58,320 --> 01:08:00,200
char lady. 
Was that handle or haze? 

1232
01:08:00,760 --> 01:08:03,160
Oh. 
God, I'm going to go haze this 

1233
01:08:03,160 --> 01:08:11,320
time. 
Correct now, 1969 Film. 

1234
01:08:11,320 --> 01:08:13,320
Good God, I'm going to have to 
take a run at this. 

1235
01:08:14,000 --> 01:08:17,160
Can Hieronymous Merkin ever 
forget Mercy Hump and Find True 

1236
01:08:17,160 --> 01:08:23,200
Happiness 1969 Enter the newly 
film Jake Collins and Bruce 

1237
01:08:23,200 --> 01:08:25,760
Forsyth playing playing the role
of grandma. 

1238
01:08:25,760 --> 01:08:27,760
Was that Handel or Hayes? 
I'm going to go. 

1239
01:08:27,760 --> 01:08:30,920
With Handel on this one. 
Hayes, I'm. 

1240
01:08:32,720 --> 01:08:39,040
So ashamed. 
OK, this one. 

1241
01:08:39,279 --> 01:08:40,399
I never go with this one. 
This one. 

1242
01:08:40,399 --> 01:08:45,279
This one's tricky. 
OK, A Fish Called Wanda, 1988. 

1243
01:08:46,040 --> 01:08:49,240
Mrs. Cody was that handle, or 
Hayes, that is. 

1244
01:08:49,240 --> 01:08:53,479
Definitely Hayes because Irene 
Handle sadly died at this point.

1245
01:08:54,439 --> 01:08:57,520
It could be really possible. 
She was the she was the lady 

1246
01:08:57,680 --> 01:08:59,200
with the the Yorkshire Terriers,
wasn't she? 

1247
01:08:59,200 --> 01:09:02,479
That kept getting splattered by 
Michael Palin and. 

1248
01:09:02,800 --> 01:09:05,359
Even if, even if they'd offered 
the road to Irene, even if she'd

1249
01:09:05,359 --> 01:09:07,120
been alive, she'd have refused 
because she loved the 

1250
01:09:07,120 --> 01:09:07,920
Chihuahuas. 
She would. 

1251
01:09:08,200 --> 01:09:10,640
She would never have. 
She'd never have been in a film 

1252
01:09:10,640 --> 01:09:14,479
where dogs got yeah. 
Didn't they use the pavement in 

1253
01:09:14,479 --> 01:09:19,160
like test screenings? 
They actually used blood and 

1254
01:09:19,160 --> 01:09:21,240
they objected. 
They objected to that, didn't 

1255
01:09:21,240 --> 01:09:22,840
they? 
They wanted more sort of cartoon

1256
01:09:22,840 --> 01:09:24,800
violence. 
As long as you didn't see the 

1257
01:09:24,800 --> 01:09:28,920
blood splatting Yorkshire, 
Yorkshire Terriers was fine. 

1258
01:09:29,760 --> 01:09:32,439
But it's more like, you know, 
wily coyote type violence. 

1259
01:09:32,640 --> 01:09:33,720
Absolutely. 
Yes, it was. 

1260
01:09:33,840 --> 01:09:35,600
It was too. 
It was too realistic. 

1261
01:09:36,240 --> 01:09:38,120
The first, yeah. 
Yeah, it was a bit. 

1262
01:09:38,120 --> 01:09:40,640
Yeah, too much for the for the 
old test audience. 

1263
01:09:42,120 --> 01:09:45,479
Right Confessions of a Driving 
instructor 1976 miss slender 

1264
01:09:45,479 --> 01:09:50,240
parts handle or haze it's. 
Got to be handle, isn't it? 

1265
01:09:50,240 --> 01:09:54,840
It's handle. 
Yes, 2 Irene. 

1266
01:09:55,000 --> 01:09:56,760
Why 2? 
More, two more, and then I 

1267
01:09:56,760 --> 01:09:57,880
promise it's it's over. 
Oh. 

1268
01:09:59,320 --> 01:10:02,240
God. 
The Great Rock'n'roll Swindle, 

1269
01:10:02,240 --> 01:10:07,360
1979 playing cinema usherette Is
it handle or Haze? 

1270
01:10:08,160 --> 01:10:09,680
I'm going to go with Haze on 
this one. 

1271
01:10:11,360 --> 01:10:12,920
Oh. 
No. 

1272
01:10:13,760 --> 01:10:20,080
And finally and finally, 1973 
Love Thy neighbor, the feature 

1273
01:10:20,560 --> 01:10:24,120
feature film of that comedy 
behemoth. 

1274
01:10:24,120 --> 01:10:26,160
Oh. 
My God. 

1275
01:10:26,320 --> 01:10:28,680
Booth was the character. 
Was that Handel or Hayes? 

1276
01:10:30,600 --> 01:10:35,240
Oh dear God, love thy neighbor. 
I'm going to go with Handel, but

1277
01:10:35,240 --> 01:10:36,800
I'm probably wrong, aren't I? 
You are. 

1278
01:10:36,800 --> 01:10:41,160
Roberts, Hayes. 
Hello, Haze. 

1279
01:10:41,160 --> 01:10:42,600
I can't believe it. 
Yeah. 

1280
01:10:43,560 --> 01:10:48,120
Yeah, because around that time, 
Love the neighbor, Irene was 

1281
01:10:48,120 --> 01:10:51,120
making the sitcom for the love 
of Ada. 

1282
01:10:52,440 --> 01:10:53,640
Did you ever see that? 
Yes. 

1283
01:10:54,840 --> 01:10:57,480
That was a bit before my time, 
but I've seen clips of it. 

1284
01:10:57,480 --> 01:11:00,880
Yeah, yeah, that was. 
Was that Wilfred Pickles? 

1285
01:11:00,960 --> 01:11:03,080
Yes, I think yes, it was and 
they didn't. 

1286
01:11:03,080 --> 01:11:05,840
Really like each other. 
I I was like, I gather they 

1287
01:11:05,840 --> 01:11:09,800
didn't really get on. 
No, well, he didn't. 

1288
01:11:09,840 --> 01:11:13,520
No, I was going to say no. 
I'm thinking of who was the 

1289
01:11:13,520 --> 01:11:15,680
other pair that didn't get on 
around the same time. 

1290
01:11:15,680 --> 01:11:17,600
Oh, Hilda. 
Baker and Jimmy Jimmy Jewel. 

1291
01:11:17,600 --> 01:11:18,440
That's right. 
Yeah. 

1292
01:11:18,640 --> 01:11:20,280
Yeah. 
They hated each other, didn't 

1293
01:11:20,280 --> 01:11:22,400
they? 
They would communicate through, 

1294
01:11:22,400 --> 01:11:24,720
I don't know, through the floor 
manager or something. 

1295
01:11:24,760 --> 01:11:26,800
Absolutely. 
I'm not sure if it's in the film

1296
01:11:26,800 --> 01:11:30,000
version of For the Love of Ada 
or or one of the episodes of the

1297
01:11:30,000 --> 01:11:33,560
TV series. 
On the mantelpiece in the front 

1298
01:11:33,560 --> 01:11:37,480
room, there's the wedding 
photograph of of the two main 

1299
01:11:37,480 --> 01:11:41,680
characters, right? 
But I've seen a photograph where

1300
01:11:41,720 --> 01:11:43,840
they've zoomed in, someone 
zoomed in. 

1301
01:11:44,120 --> 01:11:47,360
It's actually the wedding photo 
of her and Peter Sellers as Mr. 

1302
01:11:47,360 --> 01:11:50,040
and Mrs. Kite. 
Mr. and Mrs. Kite, I love that 

1303
01:11:50,040 --> 01:11:53,600
wedding photo. 
I love that picture. 

1304
01:11:54,600 --> 01:11:57,440
I hope you're satisfied, Fred 
Kite. 

1305
01:11:58,440 --> 01:11:59,960
It was democratically arrived 
at. 

1306
01:12:00,080 --> 01:12:01,760
I mean, I am chairman of the 
Works committee. 

1307
01:12:01,960 --> 01:12:03,400
Oh. 
Yes, you're chairman of the 

1308
01:12:03,400 --> 01:12:05,800
Works Committee, all right. 
Don't we all know it? 

1309
01:12:06,040 --> 01:12:09,120
Sick to death of you and your 
Works Committee Union this, 

1310
01:12:09,120 --> 01:12:12,280
union that, and your blasted 
Soviet Union. 

1311
01:12:12,280 --> 01:12:13,720
There is a. 
Strike on mother, you're 

1312
01:12:13,800 --> 01:12:15,320
telling. 
Me, there's a strike on. 

1313
01:12:15,440 --> 01:12:18,800
I'll tell you something else. 
The strike spread to this House 

1314
01:12:18,920 --> 01:12:23,480
from now on. 
Cynthia. 

1315
01:12:24,120 --> 01:12:27,000
Get our bags packed. 
We're going back to Auntie 

1316
01:12:27,000 --> 01:12:29,280
Edie's. 
There's two can play at this 

1317
01:12:29,320 --> 01:12:31,200
game. 
You know you wanted a strike, 

1318
01:12:31,200 --> 01:12:33,200
You've got one. 
Perhaps when you feel like going

1319
01:12:33,200 --> 01:12:36,080
back to work, I will. 
And here's something else I'm 

1320
01:12:36,080 --> 01:12:38,520
going to tell you. 
Here's another strike that's 

1321
01:12:38,520 --> 01:12:46,360
100% solid. 
One of the last times I ever saw

1322
01:12:46,360 --> 01:12:49,440
her on telly was on, I think it 
was like Good Morning Britain, 

1323
01:12:49,440 --> 01:12:52,760
like breakfast television. 
And it wasn't long before she 

1324
01:12:52,760 --> 01:12:56,560
died and she sort of said 
they're asking her about Peter 

1325
01:12:56,560 --> 01:12:59,480
Sellers and stuff. 
And she said it's so sad. 

1326
01:12:59,480 --> 01:13:02,400
All my friends are gone now. 
And she started crying. 

1327
01:13:02,720 --> 01:13:05,480
No, it was really upsetting. 
It was like, I just wanted to 

1328
01:13:05,480 --> 01:13:08,920
give her a big hug. 
It was like, oh, don't, don't 

1329
01:13:08,920 --> 01:13:12,960
make Irene cry, don't do that. 
But it was very moving, You 

1330
01:13:12,960 --> 01:13:16,160
know, she was, she's very 
affected by his death. 

1331
01:13:16,480 --> 01:13:21,760
And in that interview on that 
comedy roots thing, she does 

1332
01:13:22,200 --> 01:13:26,720
does mention the Dorchester 
Hotel and saying I can't go past

1333
01:13:26,720 --> 01:13:29,120
it. 
She's like almost in a bit of 

1334
01:13:29,120 --> 01:13:32,480
denial that he had gone. 
Yes, I know. 

1335
01:13:32,880 --> 01:13:35,000
Yeah. 
And I guess it's obviously so. 

1336
01:13:35,040 --> 01:13:37,320
Fond of him so fond. 
Of him and also she had no 

1337
01:13:37,320 --> 01:13:40,400
family so she was she's pretty 
quite lonely she had a 

1338
01:13:40,400 --> 01:13:43,560
chihuahuas but. 
But I tell you. 

1339
01:13:43,560 --> 01:13:47,480
What, in that comic roots thing 
she she didn't hold back on 

1340
01:13:47,480 --> 01:13:50,000
David Warner, did she? 
No. 

1341
01:13:50,040 --> 01:13:52,800
Oh my God, she didn't like him 
at all, did she? 

1342
01:13:54,280 --> 01:13:56,720
She mentioned like he had 
terrible acne or something. 

1343
01:13:56,720 --> 01:13:57,960
She. 
Couldn't remember his name. 

1344
01:13:57,960 --> 01:14:02,200
She couldn't remember his name. 
She him with the acne, Yeah. 

1345
01:14:02,240 --> 01:14:05,520
Him with the acne who's that? 
David Warner, yes oh, I didn't 

1346
01:14:05,520 --> 01:14:08,600
like him I could imagine him 
being quite difficult and sort 

1347
01:14:08,600 --> 01:14:11,320
of mellowing out as he got 
older, you know, when the, you 

1348
01:14:11,560 --> 01:14:15,040
know, young actors that fresh 
out of drama school being quite,

1349
01:14:15,600 --> 01:14:18,160
you know, Moody and difficult. 
Maybe I. 

1350
01:14:18,200 --> 01:14:21,240
I mean, I love him in so many 
things, but I watched Straw Dogs

1351
01:14:21,240 --> 01:14:25,160
the the original straw dogs with
Oh yeah, Dustin Hoffman from 

1352
01:14:25,160 --> 01:14:30,520
whatever year 72 and and he's in
that David Warner, but you 

1353
01:14:30,520 --> 01:14:32,120
wouldn't know it. 
He's he's one of the main 

1354
01:14:32,120 --> 01:14:35,760
characters, but he had his name 
taken off the credits. 

1355
01:14:35,880 --> 01:14:37,600
Oh, really? 
Did he ask him for his name to 

1356
01:14:37,600 --> 01:14:39,720
be taken, I presume? 
He must have done, yeah. 

1357
01:14:39,880 --> 01:14:44,160
Wow, Yeah, yeah. 
And also Time Bandits, of 

1358
01:14:44,160 --> 01:14:46,600
course, Of course. 
Didn't that, yes, I'm sure if 

1359
01:14:46,600 --> 01:14:48,880
Irene had seen him in Time 
Bandits, she'd taken it all 

1360
01:14:48,880 --> 01:14:51,960
back. 
She should have been in Time 

1361
01:14:51,960 --> 01:14:53,280
Bandits. 
She should. 

1362
01:14:53,280 --> 01:14:55,720
Have been as a. 
Char lady or lame lady or 

1363
01:14:55,760 --> 01:14:58,200
something? 
Yeah, all these. 

1364
01:14:58,240 --> 01:15:02,400
People, yeah. 
So I think we've, we've pretty 

1365
01:15:02,400 --> 01:15:06,160
much we've, we've leaned very 
heavily on talking about Irene. 

1366
01:15:06,200 --> 01:15:08,480
But look, as I say, we, I've 
said before, we talk about 

1367
01:15:08,480 --> 01:15:11,440
sellers all the time, but I 
think, I think we've, we've made

1368
01:15:11,440 --> 01:15:14,800
a pretty decent fist of we're 
talking about the, the two of 

1369
01:15:14,800 --> 01:15:18,240
them and the, the, the affection
they clearly had for each other 

1370
01:15:18,240 --> 01:15:20,760
and the, the work they did with 
each other. 

1371
01:15:21,960 --> 01:15:24,360
And and if. 
You, I mean, OK, I know she, she

1372
01:15:24,360 --> 01:15:27,280
died in in 87. 
You know, maybe if he'd lived, 

1373
01:15:27,280 --> 01:15:30,080
if he'd lived a few more years, 
they may have they may have even

1374
01:15:30,080 --> 01:15:32,520
made another film together. 
Who knows who? 

1375
01:15:32,640 --> 01:15:33,600
Knows. 
Yeah. 

1376
01:15:34,440 --> 01:15:38,240
And one of those rare people. 
I have her autograph. 

1377
01:15:38,240 --> 01:15:42,040
I bought her autograph, right 
because I admired her so much. 

1378
01:15:42,040 --> 01:15:45,520
It's a it's an old postcard she 
signed for a fan. 

1379
01:15:45,520 --> 01:15:48,160
A photo of her quite young. 
I think she must have sent it 

1380
01:15:48,160 --> 01:15:53,160
out in the sort of late 40s, 
early 50s to a fan. 

1381
01:15:53,160 --> 01:15:55,560
And I've got it in a frame. 
I've moved house so often. 

1382
01:15:55,560 --> 01:15:59,880
It's, it's in a box somewhere. 
I still have it, but I just, I 

1383
01:15:59,880 --> 01:16:02,920
just loved her so much that I, I
thought I really, I would love 

1384
01:16:02,920 --> 01:16:04,680
to have that her autographs. 
I bought it. 

1385
01:16:05,360 --> 01:16:08,440
So yeah, her. 
And I've got Peter Cook and 

1386
01:16:08,440 --> 01:16:11,320
Dudley Moore's autographs as 
well as, you know, I told you in

1387
01:16:11,360 --> 01:16:16,760
a bedazzled 1. 
So yeah, I've got she's yeah, 

1388
01:16:16,960 --> 01:16:20,600
one of the other one, the I've 
got her autograph, which is 

1389
01:16:20,920 --> 01:16:24,080
treasured possession because I 
just think in a in a few years 

1390
01:16:24,080 --> 01:16:25,720
time, she's just going to be 
forgotten. 

1391
01:16:26,080 --> 01:16:30,440
And but I can see her influence 
in in lots of people. 

1392
01:16:30,720 --> 01:16:34,160
And some people probably who are
who are working in comedy now 

1393
01:16:34,160 --> 01:16:38,600
are probably doing stuff that 
she's she did, but I'm not even 

1394
01:16:38,600 --> 01:16:39,800
aware not. 
Even. 

1395
01:16:40,520 --> 01:16:43,160
Aware the the influence has 
filtered down and she was just 

1396
01:16:43,520 --> 01:16:46,640
so great and there's there 
wasn't anything kind of sneery 

1397
01:16:46,640 --> 01:16:50,240
or looking down her nose at 
working class people They were 

1398
01:16:50,360 --> 01:16:52,720
they were always based. 
There was a lot of affection 

1399
01:16:52,720 --> 01:16:57,840
there and you know, you felt it 
came from a good place and it 

1400
01:16:57,840 --> 01:17:01,360
was very well observed and very 
truthful and she was great and 

1401
01:17:01,720 --> 01:17:04,160
and talking about two way 
stretch earlier. 

1402
01:17:04,560 --> 01:17:08,680
I always think her she's in it 
more than she is because she's 

1403
01:17:08,680 --> 01:17:12,880
still so much, you know, she's 
she's only in it for a few 

1404
01:17:12,880 --> 01:17:17,000
scenes really, but her she looms
much larger because she's so 

1405
01:17:17,000 --> 01:17:21,000
good. 
But I love I love her. 

1406
01:17:21,000 --> 01:17:24,000
I love watching her. 
She's infinitely watchable and 

1407
01:17:24,000 --> 01:17:28,400
she always brings a little bit 
extra, you know, a little bra 

1408
01:17:28,400 --> 01:17:31,640
strap hanging down or a little 
swing of her shoulders as she's 

1409
01:17:31,640 --> 01:17:34,040
talking. 
You know, I think, you know, she

1410
01:17:34,040 --> 01:17:38,720
was magic and you know, a lot of
comedians of the time obviously 

1411
01:17:38,720 --> 01:17:41,600
thought so too and absolutely 
loved working with her. 

1412
01:17:41,760 --> 01:17:46,480
She was great. 
I've had a very good life, very 

1413
01:17:46,480 --> 01:17:49,160
good. 
There's nothing to grouse about.

1414
01:17:49,440 --> 01:17:53,760
The only thing is my being my 
own fault that I started too 

1415
01:17:53,760 --> 01:18:00,640
late and I don't see unless I 
back up that I'm ever going to 

1416
01:18:00,640 --> 01:18:22,600
make it. 
Thanks again to Donna. 

1417
01:18:23,160 --> 01:18:26,000
Thank you for listening as 
always, and please rate and 

1418
01:18:26,000 --> 01:18:29,400
review on the usual places. 
And also, if you haven't 

1419
01:18:29,400 --> 01:18:31,080
already, check out Goonpod Film 
Club. 

1420
01:18:31,080 --> 01:18:35,080
That's at patreon.com/goonpod. 
That's where myself and a guest 

1421
01:18:35,080 --> 01:18:40,600
every month discuss talk about 
classic British comedy film in 

1422
01:18:40,600 --> 01:18:42,520
the in the sort of goon pod 
style. 

1423
01:18:43,120 --> 01:18:45,560
But it is any British comedy 
film that doesn't actually 

1424
01:18:45,560 --> 01:18:48,000
feature a member of the goons. 
That is the wrinkle. 

1425
01:18:48,200 --> 01:18:50,320
OK. 
You can also sign up for a 7 day

1426
01:18:50,320 --> 01:18:54,360
free trial to take a listen to 
all of them and don't pay a 

1427
01:18:54,360 --> 01:18:57,760
thing. 
So you can argue with that. 

1428
01:18:58,720 --> 01:19:02,920
Most recently, as I said on the 
show, we covered School for 

1429
01:19:02,920 --> 01:19:05,800
Scoundrels. 
Other shows in the back catalog 

1430
01:19:05,800 --> 01:19:09,600
include Shaun of the Dead, Kind 
of Handsome Coronets, Carry on 

1431
01:19:09,600 --> 01:19:14,080
Screaming, Guest House, Paradiso
with Rick and Aid. 

1432
01:19:14,320 --> 01:19:16,200
So yeah, please, please do check
it out. 

1433
01:19:16,240 --> 01:19:20,360
And and goon part, of course, 
will return next week with I 

1434
01:19:20,360 --> 01:19:22,880
think we're going to be talking 
about an actual goon show. 

1435
01:19:23,120 --> 01:19:26,920
So look forward to that. 
There's also a goon show that no

1436
01:19:26,920 --> 01:19:29,360
one really talks about. 
So so that should be 

1437
01:19:29,360 --> 01:19:31,800
interesting. 
Any who.