The original record-breaking shower of comics are back again.
In the sequel to private progress, I am.
Alright. Yeah
they're all here in the first historical motion picture of the
post-war world. Right.
Hey 21st May good. Lord man.
What the Do you think you're doing shut that bleating door?
Go on get off out of it. Will you?
I'm new here. You bet.
Yes, the whole shower is here and now they're joined by Peter
Sellers as kite a man who believes in Striking, while the
iron is hot or cold weather, wind rash.
I'm obliged to put the you and open question, did you or did
you not? In fact, collaborate with the
management me, collaborate use silicic,
Hello and welcome to goon pot. My name is Tyler Adams.
And as far as I know, I'm the only podcast host who stands and
unusually, excessive some might say unseemly amount of time
staring at pictures of irony handle the internet and calling
it research. This week I'm joined by the
comedian and writer Merrill O'Rourke to discuss a film which
came out in the last dying days of the 1950s and which with a
satirical snarl tackled head on some big topics, such as
industrial corruption, pettifogging, bureaucracy and
boardroom machinations taking swipes at both trade unions and
management alike and as Merrill says on the show and many ways,
the 1959 film, I'm all right, jack is still relevant today.
Pressingly I must point out that this was recorded, this podcast
was recorded back in mid-september and a lot has
happened between the actual planning and research for the
episode, The the actual recording of the episode and the
actual episode going out. So when we were planning and
researching, Boris Johnson was prime minister when we recorded
it Liz truss with prime minister.
And as this goes out in late October Rishi soon, act has been
p.m. for all of, A day and a half.
We can only begin to speculate who next month's prime.
Minister will be Shop steward, Fred kite was arguably Peter
Sellers, big breakout role in one of the bafta in 1960 and his
is a mesmerizing performance but there are some terrific British
stars and character actors supporting him such as Margaret
Rutherford. Terry Thomas, Sam kid, victim,
added Liz, Fraser, Dennis Price and Dickie, Attenborough
marijuana. And I chatted about the film for
ages and this episode would be longer than it is except sadly.
I had to cut the chunk out to about 20 minutes in due to a
Technical faults and Gremlins and audio issues, but thankfully
not much was lost and I hope you enjoy the show.
I started off by asking Merrill why she had chosen.
I'm all right, jack to talk about one thing.
I've noticed a lot on podcast recently is I seem to talk about
my mum, almost every podcast I do which shows about I was an
only child and single-parent family and she loved old healing
type comedies that she particularly love this film.
So I grew up watching it. It, but also the interesting
thing about, I'm all right, jack is How Deeply politically is and
how upsetting the relevant assistant is?
I mean, when we're recording this now, we're recording it
just at the end of Quasi cartoon presenting as budget and I was
as you know, because you retweeted it tweeting but
everybody needs to watch the film again because there's a lot
of stuff in it about profiteering and right wing
arms, profiteering and giving money to the wrong people for
the wrong things. Yes.
Well, that's me putting morals on it because I mean, the
interesting thing about the film is that nobody comes off in a
good light and I've always had a bit of a crush on Comedy, which
is damning to every single person in the cast.
I don't know why be interesting for psychologists to look at why
I like comedies, where everyone is an asshole because they only
only time I can find a character to relate to is if all of them
are assholes, well, it's a few. There's a few You have two
characters in the staff redeeming features.
I mean, Stanley Windrush will go on to it, but Stanley Windrush
played by Ian Carmichael, he's more or less.
He's the hero of the film was it, but he ends up losing out
and you've got, you've got, you know, I really handle you.
Got Liz Fraser actually. Yes, that's true.
Well, I wouldn't say everybody, I suppose the main broad
characters are assholes. Stanley is meant to be likeable,
but there's always something that I find in Carmichael quite
interesting. Casting, because He's meant to
be an every man, but he doesn't seem very every man.
Like, he doesn't seem familiar. I don't know if you would have
been more familiar in the late 50s, and but also I was asking
myself, like, when he is the Everyman, so he's meant to be
the person that the audience watched the film through.
So you see the film through his eyes, why I was asking myself
that the point of the strike would I have gone into work?
And I guess the point where he breaks the strike was the point
where I thought, actually, no, I'm not like him, I'm more like
the unionist, the union leaders and the union members, despite
the fact that they are painted as it works, I idiots, but if
I'm being honest about myself, I am so influenced by the ideals
of the Trade union movement that I wouldn't want to break the
strike, because I would believe was morally wrong, even though
in the film, they point out that they kind of have made up their
own morals going along, and none of it is really based on morals.
It's based on fear and selfishness, true.
It's weird to think now that a film made in 1960, that the lead
character is that Posh, I mean, he's from the aristocracy and
yet, he's meant to be the person we relate to.
He's the person who they figure, the film is aimed at and it's
interesting as well. When you think that in the
theater, at that time, was the absolute.
Boom of the Angry Young Man, and Joan, littlewood and working
class theater and comedy. So it is quite Thing that the
films are still perpetuating that everybody in Britain was
very Posh and related to the aristocracy.
Well, if the fact, the pre credits sequence in this film is
and I always figured there's that sellers placed two parts in
this film. Yeah it was the first one is so
small. Hmm, I don't worry.
It's not really a part. It's still qualify as I think
he's playing with his old men that he always played so well.
And, and he's He's called, Sir, John, and he's in this,
Gentleman's Club. The servant comes in and tells
him the war is over. So it's obviously 1910 to 1945
and, and there's some some quite sharp narration basically saying
there. He goes to John on his way out
and then you see footage of Church of doing the V sign and
then cheeky, young, Victor Madden, giving two fingers to
the camera, and then we get this credit the credit sequence kicks
in with this rock and roll. Yes, song.
I'm all right. Which sounds very little rock
and roll song. Yes, it is very it sounds a bit
quaint now I suppose, but at that time it would have been a
kingly modern I guess. And I think that actually to my
ears from what I was expecting. It sounds very brutal.
I think people wouldn't expect a song.
I mean, it's hard because it was 1959.
So it wasn't a quaint time in British history, but it's very
loud and clanging. He and, and not particularly
melodic. Yes.
And so, I think, and also that in contrast with the cell esque
illustrations is quite a big juxtaposition as well.
They've got these quite polite drawings next to it and the type
of sequence does look like it cost twenty p.
I mean, it does look like John bolting literally scribbled some
things on a bit of paper and held it up to the camera.
Yeah, there's a lot of there's a lot of very relevant current
stuff in this field for the time.
Like this, there's those that sequence with the, it's like
beatlemania for Stanley, where there's these people standing
outside his house. Yes, the teenage girls have got
Elvis t-shirts, where they've crossed out the word Elvis and
written Stanley. Exactly, that's it.
And again, it just it dates. It doesn't it.
I suppose all that sort of thing, but it's still like you
say it's still very relevant to the themes.
Politics are so yeah. So I'm all right jack.
It was out in, it gets its London.
Premiere in August 59, okay? Because everything I was reading
was saying, 59 and 60 so well it's proper gets full release in
December 59, right? Which obviously bleeds into into
90/60 interestingly and I'd love to know more about this and I
can't was looked and looked, and looked at can't find anymore.
Now, it's been a crazy, couple of weeks Merrill, hasn't it,
let's face it. Yes, we are recording this the
same week as the Queen's funeral which was Monday, which feels
like a million years ago. Now, it does the Queen Harold
MacMillan. Yes, I love this.
Little fact, oh, you know that said she can see, it goes up to
Balmoral in September, 59 to request the general election and
she gives him a private showing of the film which I find.
So incredibly radical considering what the film is
about. The film is about every strata
of British Society being completely immoral and corrupt
and selfish. Yes.
Yeah. And and and also the film is
suggesting that the old order There is irrelevant as even that
the New Order. I mean if if the person is
representing the future, the youngest characterless Fraser
who's the teenager, she is portrayed as complete idiot.
So they're not, there's nothing in the film which is saying well
we've got hope in the future because the teenage girls are
all crushing. After some bloke, he's in the
newspaper simply because he's a newspaper.
So it offers no hope either. Yeah, it's directed by produced
and directed by the bulging Brothers.
As you mentioned before, I always forget the other ones
named John bolting and Roy Roy, there we go.
Yeah, by the way. What's your favorite cooler
Shaker song? I know this already.
I know that because I okay, short, answer the 303, because I
was a huge cooler Shaker fan and I always isn't, To the 303 on
the a303. But yes, of course.
Crispian Mills is the grandson of one of which one?
No, no, the son of the sun, really bolting really grandson.
Now, this is the time to my solo show.
So here we go. Here's my pitch and I can tie it
into. I'm all right, jack, I actually
can tie my so that show to I'm all right, jack, my solo show is
called vanilla. Yeah, it's mainly about me.
Centering, whether teenage girls are told lies about their
sexuality. Now that their sexuality is
powerful and there's quite a lot in it about Jade from Little
Mix, who wears quite extreme bondage gear.
Now, in videos, despite the fact, their demographic are not
legally allowed to do up their own seat belts, but this is the
kind of stuff likes to sell. Now, Jade from Little Mix.
Goes out with Jordan Stevens and Jordan Stevens from Rizzle Kicks
is the grandson of one of the vaulting Brothers.
Yes. Okay, well right well this is
not the only pop star Jordan Stevens as well.
He's amiable Ting sun. Right now, Roy bolting was
married, a couple of times and he married Hayley Mills.
Yes. So Christian is his son even
though he was quite a bit, he was quite significantly older
than Hayley Mills revolting. And so it's the second most
profitable British movie of 59. All right, Jake after carry on
Nurse which Really handle also painted.
So she was busy in 59 old because that she was also, she
was also recording an LP with Peter Sellers as you know, which
I have here. Which next time I come up North,
I'm going to give to you and I thank you.
Yes, that's correct. Thanks for Swingin sellers,
which I pointed out to you as well.
And I found this quite interesting when you were saying
about how much he loved working with ireenie handles.
So, there's actually a track on it called there, is it Shadows
on the grass? Yes.
Which Handel wrote. I Really handle wrote the
sketch. Yes.
And there are a lot of people on here that, right?
You know, Frank newer is name-check Denis Norden but none
of them are mentioned by Peter Sellers and sleeve notes, apart
from ireenie handle, and he calls a that Mistress of comedy
and Pathos, and it's quite a big thing.
I think, for Peter Sellers to have written down this person, I
consider a mistress of comedy and you do wonder whether there
was, I mean, she was 20 years older than him.
So you do wonder, whether there was a kind of mother thing going
on there because I know he's very attached to his mother so
whether he transferred that slightly to Irina, huh?
Quite possibly actually. Yeah, that's a good point.
I don't know what it was. I mean, I know that I said to
you previously that the two of them were very close.
As you said, she could, she could give him criticism, and he
would take it, you know? Yeah.
Which he wouldn't take for many people Spike Milligan maybe but
as well for me, as a female comedy writer that we still have
a bit of an issue that female comedy writers aren't named
checked enough. And I I'm very aware of that
because I keep waiting for it. I spend a lot of years going
with, where's my credit? So I think it really struck me
that he would name, check ireenie handle, and call her a
mistress of Comedy, especially someone, especially someone like
sellers, who was so dismissive of other people's work, who was
quite dismissive of women. And I know that came a bit later
in his career, you know, I know he was a lot happier in the 50s
than he was later. And by the way, you do a lot of
writing for Frankie boy, or don't you, I do.
I, do I write A lot with Frankie and and there's a lot of I mean
he credits us on New World Order.
There is were credited, as writers.
There are still a lot of shows which don't like to use the
word, right? As I think it's getting more,
okay? Now Britain's always been rather
suspicious of people who don't do everything themselves in a
way that America has always accepted, that comedy is
difficult and especially writing a weekly show where things are
changing constantly is difficult so yeah, and when When I started
getting those proper credits, you know when Frankie said his
team we're going to call these people writers.
And so on IMDb I am a writer is massively important for me.
Not even just as a career step, but just psychologically when
you work really hard and you're doing the best you can and then
nobody knows you done, it can be quite depressing.
Absolutely. Yeah.
So yeah. So this film it's a, it's a
sequel to privates progress which I must admit.
I haven't seen. I have a knife.
Almost like it's kind of not a sequel.
It's just got the same cast. It's almost like saying, you
know, it's like it's like if you set the Empire Strikes Back in a
department store, just with the same people.
I know like we'd Chief backer taking up the threading chair or
whatever, it's not a sequel, It's just using the same
characters because it doesn't right, you don't have to watch
the first one, okay? But also I wonder, if that's why
sellers struck people so much in this film because he, he was the
character. That wasn't It in privates
progress. Mmm.
Yeah, possibly. I mean, he he's the, he's the
most real character in this film.
Everyone's playing caricatures, aren't they?
And everyone is overdoing it massively.
Yeah, and sellers is sellers is very subtle.
It's in Carmichael, said that sellers role in.
I'm all right. Jack lifted.
Him from being a comedian to an actor.
Yes. So the Boating Brothers.
They were like, they were twins. They were identical twins and
they were, I think it like, the Coen Brothers, they alternated
directing and producing film by film.
John bolting directed. This Roy bolting produced it and
they were the two of them were. I believe, big Liberal Party
supporters. And so what that meant was that
they dislike both, what they regard as the reactionary
conservatives. And also the what they were
dreaming, Is the militant socialists so they're sort of in
the middle. And that's why I think they're
disdainful of both trade unions and the the manager of the
corrupt management. It's kind of a plague on all
your houses scenario, isn't it? Yes.
And that satirized in the films, Etc sized, the military, and
private progress. The Judiciary in brothers-in-law
big business, like in this film, and the church and heavens
above, which was another Peter, silent film.
Oh, yeah. And, and so, yeah, so this took
this film takes swipes at both as we say, both strident unions
and for up to management. But you've got this character
played by Peter Sellers, who is he doesn't turn up until about
25 minutes into the film. Sorry, I'm afraid.
I haven't quite got this thing. Buttoned up.
Shit. What's your name wind?
Rush. Me and my colleagues are the
works committee. How do you do?
You mentioned. I'm all right.
Jack in the immediate immediately.
Everyone will think of Peter Sellers as Fred.
Kite, they don't immediately think of Dennis price as the
Machiavellian industrialists, or Richard Attenborough, whose is
this kind if you like Richard Attenborough playing cocci, who
is who, who was a in the army with Stanley Windrush, Ian
Carmichael. And we're going to come back to
the to these things. We're going to talk about the
The film. But I just wanted to say some
was famously, was reluctant to sign on for this film and the
Bolton's were Keen to get him on board.
They saw Sellers as red kite, they, you know, they didn't
consider anyone else and because he read the script and he said
there weren't any obvious gags in it and really, okay.
Well, he, he felt, they weren't, he's thinking, you know, he's
doing the goons around this time.
It's gag gag gag. Whereas this film this film is a
lot about the humors and before in the performance, isn't it?
Yes. First spoken gag is a pubic hair
joke and I thought, okay, I can get a board with this film.
I was worried, I was too lowbrow to be to be talking about this
film, but since the first gag is a pube gag.
Yeah. She's not a natural blond, yes.
Right. Right.
What we're going to come onto that mat onto the pubic but
sellers, it wasn't until sellers.
Put on the hair cropped. Back had put on the Little
Hitler mustache put on the ill-fitting suit and started
impersonating. He was impersonating one of the
shop students that work with the Bolton's partly.
I've read that he studied quite a few shop stewards.
And another thing that that is relatively unsaid about sellers
because it wasn't trendy was that he was a method actor.
So he would stay in character for as long as possible.
And before the film, and after the film, Umm, so sellers put on
this suit and the mustache and started playing this character
and some of the crew film crew started applauding because they
recognized this character. If you know what I mean, they
recognize this as being a shop, steward type and that just
imbued and sellers has confidence that.
Yes, actually. This this might work.
One of the things that I find quite fascinating watching it
over and over again. So he was in his 30s.
You made this and he was kind of, it was kind of our awesome
wells in that he would play much older characters.
In Prosthetics, even when he was quite young.
Yeah, though, unlike Orson Welles, he would lose himself in
them, whereas Orson, Welles always just basically was
awesome Wells it with a hat on. But now I don't know if he's, so
he's playing. It doesn't Define his age.
And actually, in reality, the trade unionist after the war
were relatively young, but if he's the same age as I really
handle, he's playing 50s. So Normally you would expect
somebody to wrinkle up their face.
Now his forehead and I like I say, you would know this better
than I do, because I watched a few times that it looks like
he's got a prosthetic forehead. His forehead is completely
smooth and does not move at all, of is linked to the hairpiece,
and that's quite an interesting choice.
When you're playing somebody older, his face doesn't move and
he's lips, almost doesn't. He's Through an almost closed
now. And yet, he conveys, all of the
emotion of the character through his eyes, the eyes of slightly
changed starting and through pauses with the speech, but not
with any kind of full facial expression, and was quite
interesting. I decided to look at some videos
of Mick Lynch. So we're talking about real
Trade, union leaders, and they clinch with a huge forehead
because he's bald he does the same thing.
And there is something in a trade Union Nest where they have
learnt the principles of what they're saying.
So tightly that there's actually no thought process or reaction
process. They just say we are here to say
this, you know, make Lynch will have a completely characterless
space. It'll just say I'm waiting mr.
Sharps to come to the table when he wants to come to the table.
We were discussed the plate. The pay rise in exactly the same
way that Fred kite does. And I find the forehead
decision. Very interesting.
One for a man. Who is so young, who wants to
look older? But he's going.
No, I'm gonna have this clear forehead because he plays him An
innocent really? Yeah, I don't know about the
forehead. I didn't pick up on that, but I
know that sellers has a certain acting style, which is very much
minimal facial expressions often.
I don't know how many sellers films you've seen over the years
but it's a lot of it. Like you say is down to the
eyes. He does a lot of the guys don't
from left to right all the time he doesn't do much with his
mouth, he's quite stiff in his performances in the sense.
That what I mean is he holds himself quite rigidly.
He walks, he's got a, he's got a walk which is quite stiff and
precise if you like and and with this character as well, he's
obviously, yeah he's rehearsed, he's rehearsed things, he's
going to say the character kite has rehearsed and he's like an
autodidact. I guess he's self-taught and he
doesn't quite. There's all the malapropisms
like he's the management is willfully.
Drop advising the safety of its employees.
Yeah things like that. You know, he's read that word
but he's never said I've read, I've written so many notes.
I can't even find the good night because there's another one
later as well, but I can't find it now to.
It will come to it. And but let's just start running
through what happens in the film.
And I'm not going to go into huge detail about each scene or
anything. But I just want to sort of run
through the the plot of the film and after the credits that we
mentioned, we were you expecting this.
When you first saw the film, we were expecting to see the act of
Miles mellough some naked. All be it with a big bowl of
peas on his lap so you don't see his taters but I have I first
saw this film when I was a little girl so I don't know.
They lie, the film has just been with me for the whole of my
life. Yeah but it's opens.
Look at this sunny Glades nature camp where Stanley Windrush who
is played by Ian Carmichael. Who was a hero?
If you like if you were to call them that he's talking to his
father miles medicine, who is happily Shelly.
He's naked and there's some washing mushrooms, I was at what
he's doing because because when I analyze something I look far
too deeply into it. So I went to the mushrooms Were
Meant To Be symbolic of nuclear war.
But yes, wow. Okay.
To say when I'm analyzing something, I will actually
analyze it by the way. Just on naturism or nakedness in
general. Where's this going?
You thinking one of the stars of this film Was very partial to a
spot of skinny dipping in lakes and rivers.
Well that doesn't surprise me. They were all very decadent.
Decadent Posh British actors. Would it surprise you?
If I told you it was Margaret Rutherford.
Only in that. I have not heard that before,
and I would like to have heard that before we've heard it now.
She said, her husband, who was called Stringer Davis.
I think his name was, who's he pops up in this film in an
uncredited role? Although, I'm not sure which one
he is. I know he's an older man, but
apparently, they would, they would both of them would often
go go for Drive in the countryside.
And if they went past the a nice-looking River, or whatever,
they've done pull up. Strip naked jump in.
And yeah, it seems like the sort of woman.
He'd do whatever the hell she wants.
Yes. Yes.
She's fantastic, isn't she? Yeah, we'll come to her, but
female cast of this film is particularly fantastic.
And like, I wrote something but they're like a meal and
therefore particular women that stick out, you know, well as
McCannon a his criminally under used because she's a wonderful
comic actress. And you do wonder if there were
cut, so you've got every mechanic.
He's like a little amuse-bouche and then, you've got Margaret
Rutherford. He's like a roast.
Dinner and then, I really handle arrives is like a spotted dick
pudding and then you've got this appraiser, who's your, you know,
flaming shot of sambuca. And and for absolute icons,
female, comedy acting totally. Absolutely.
I don't want to talk about them all, but standees, I don't quite
understand that. Stan Lee wants to Stan Lee wants
to work. I've written down wants to work
with The Virtuous. Lower classes.
Is how he would probably see it if you know what I mean.
That's, that's, he wants to go. In just get a job in Industry,
who doesn't? I think he specifically angles
to work with the lower classes because of course, the first job
he goes for is in marketing and they're very clearly not working
class. It seems to be more that he
wants to stand on his own two feet, true.
Yes. Yeah, you.
Yeah. That's right.
Yeah, because he goes for a job
at the debt, olfactory, which is detergent powder.
Yes, that's another thing that students film take swipes at
unions and management, but it also takes swipes at
Consumerism. Yes.
Troy say that your teeth and consumerism as I said marketing.
Yeah. And and there's some, there's a
couple of Jingles advertising Jingles because obviously, this
film is made what only less than five years after ITV began,
where the British public for the first time, really sore adverts
and angles like this, but he goes for a job at the debt
olfactory, which doesn't work out.
Then he goes to the Num-num Factory.
My daughter is one of her little you know how teenagers have
catchphrases so nom nom nom nom is one of her things that she
says all the time and she was very upset to find out that
already existed in 1959. Well and I couldn't work out
what a num num. Num is like a kid.
Some sort of confectionery looks like a new gar thing it's made
out of sugar and it's white. Almost like it's it looks like
it's got a Cheerios. It's got like a goat's.
I it just looks disgusting. Well it's meant to he vomits in
the Nami on Factory to do is meant to be disgusting Stanley.
Just vomits in the larger mixing vat and it's kind of like these
these met this Machinery. In this num num Factory It's
hideous, looking Machinery. That's kind of like something
out of Fritz Lang's Metropolis. By the way, you know the so
stand is gone to the university appointments board and he gets
all these interviews of different companies.
You know, the guy that organizes his interviews.
Did you recognize that actor? I do.
And I'm terrible with names. So I wrote down some of the
names, but he was the first point where I went to an IMDb
because I was like, oh, hang on that him and he was in
everything. Right.
Do you know what I mean? His name is Brian Alton.
Well, I literally some appointments for you and send
you a list of people who can go and see.
I hope you have some luck. Thank you very much.
Unrest attempt to gather intelligence enthusiasm, and an
air of confidence. The have all an air of
confidence. Do you know what I always
associated with? I'm sure you probably are the
same. Well, I'm gonna tell you that
episode of The Young Ones. When, when Vivian goes mad,
wintry were Neil's parents. Visit, he's, he's Neil's dead,
right? And that's the, that's the scene
where the talk about, the good life.
And Vivian goes mad and has this rant about the good life.
That's ripping up the screen. Yes.
Yeah. And and Neal's, dad tells them
off. And you can you picture in you
your mind's eye just like I agree with the spot a trips on
that. One Felicity Kendal is sweetly
pretty, just bought a real girl should be.
I'm speaking as a feminist myself, I can safely say this.
But for this, which I can go is a wonderful one and I want to
protect her. I shall first time I've ever
heard it called that saying something Shut up moving.
That's my dad. We at Stanley, we see Stanley
next at home and this is where as McCannon turns up very
briefly and then servant to his aunt.
So I'm not sure if it's got, I mean, I don't know, privates
progress as well, but that's his Aunt Dolly.
So it's not his home and his father is I think the I got the
feeling that because his father's moved into the nudist
colony. He Now does not actually have
somewhere to live, so there's also that as well.
My father, sold the family home to go and live in a nudist
colony. So, Stanley kind of has to find
a flat and find somewhere to live and find a job or become a
nudist which by its horrific. Yeah, it does.
And again spoilers, I find it quite amusing that he finds the
naked women at the end, he finds them as terrifying as the
corrupt missile industry. You know, equally terrifying.
Yeah but I also was quite puzzled by how they were really
Ali, really Keen to get him to play tennis so much so that they
actually chased them. But Margaret Rutherford is his,
Aunt Dolly, and I was brought to mind because obviously Ian
Carmichael goes on to play Bertie Wooster in the 60s on
television? Yes.
With with a prize. Yes.
And it's kind of reverse or you got Dennis Price as his uncle,
uncle Bertie. And, and they have this plan,
obviously, they, he offers Bet he's a director of this
engineering firm in the officers.
Nephew a job and and and Margaret Rutherford's, not sure
about this issue. She's yeah.
So that was one thing I was going to mention earlier when
you were saying about how Fred kites character stuck in the
Consciousness, more than the other characters is one thing
we've got to remember at the time, is that Dennis Price was
known for playing bad? Guys?
That was what he did. Yes.
Like every time you see Dennis Price in the film, You know,
someone's going to die. Yeah.
In fact Jeeves was a real departure for him when he
started playing Jeeves. So some of it also would have
been that there was no surprise, there was no surprise when
Dennis prices murderous for that contemporary audience, the same
with Richard Attenborough, who I think is interesting now,
because now, we look at Richard, Attenborough has been this very
Posh loving, but we think of Richard Abruzzo, Dickie
Attenborough, which at the time, of course he was Pinky from
Brighton Rock. He was a spiv.
He was a nice. D little Thug.
He wasn't thought of as Posh as this Posh sort of.
Well, we think of as an elderly man, he clearly wasn't going to
personality much. But I supposed to meet
contemporary audience to see these bad guys being played by
Dickie Attenborough and Dennis Price wouldn't have been a
surprise. Whereas Peter Sellers character
was new and it wasn't somebody bed scene portrayed in film as
much. That's true.
Yeah, and Richard Attenborough
the following year, he turns up in the film The leakage in The
league of gentlemen. And if you have seen that,
that's a, I have and I can't remember who he plays cracking.
Philly. Plays one of the gentlemen.
Ha ha, yeah, but I meant I couldn't remember me.
Place Spivey Badger or Posh bloke.
There's no, no, he's a spiv. He's a spiv.
But in it cause he goes on. It makes for the 10 rillington
place of children. My favorite food?
Yeah. When he's a serial killer.
Yeah. And he's turned up in about,
he's worked with sellers, he was in the major christian, he was a
couple of other sellers field but Dennis Price.
He's the he's not a load of films with sellers.
Okay, naked truth, which was at which before this magic
Christian again, the millionaire a strong arm of the law.
He even turned up at a gun show as a guest star.
Once I think he just seemed to work constantly, generally,
Dennis Price, he did, he did, and he had a bit of a sad life,
really? I think because he had she
showed such promise in kind hearts and coronets and it
never, I don't think he ever quite recaptured.
That That he never quite had that six, maybe even he was
never out of work, but he was never a star really was.
He was always too cold. I think his characters were
always very cold and very dispassionate and relatively
Psychopathic. Yes, you couldn't warm to him.
You know, you warm to Richard, Attenborough is a spiv.
But there's so much character there and you feel like you
would like to have a drink with him.
And then you know the calling cock sea and all that in a way
that Dennis Price you feel if you had a drink with him.
Wouldn't speak, you know, he would sit there staring at the
table waiting for it to be over. I think that's probably why you
didn't get a feeling of Dennis Price.
What he would be like, off camera.
That's a very good point. Yeah, he's always playing the
same sort of character more or less, so you're so they offered,
they offered him this job, but Stanley accepts the job.
We don't quite, we don't know at this point what's going on?
But Stanley turns up it missiles limited and we have Terry Scott
turning up. Yes.
Very young Terry Scott and a tiny little part.
Yes, but this turned out to be horribly right wing as well as
only talking of people who turned out to be right wing.
Think he was a huge fan of Radicchio Ian Smith, you know,
in Rhodesia and his policies of the 70s 60s and 70s.
Yeah. Terry Scott, by all accounts was
a difficult man in many ways. And, and we have nulls who's
played by Victor Madden. Yes.
He's wonderful. He's very likeable invest and
he's another person. I was thinking this, why wasn't
fixed imagine bigger? And maybe it was a time when
working class actors didn't really make it as big.
And one thing that I find quite interesting at the very end is
that when when Stanley has his breakdown, will not his break
down. Exactly.
But when he's on television and he's decided to tell it how it
is. He starts off by saying it's
what my old mate. Nosy would have said yes and
Through the hot even though Stanley is meant to be the one
person we hold on to all the way through the film.
You realize that with all of these crooked people he's met
and Knowles is just as crooked as everybody else like Knowles
is the one who completely justifies, poor guys playing
cards whilst they're still being paid for whack but Stanley
clings onto him and it's I find that quite striking at the end
when he says, it's like my old McDonald's.
He told me he realizes that Knowles is actually one of the
People in the film that he's met, even though he's a skydiver
and a shirker and he lets people get full pay for no work.
Yeah, but I think I think nose is one of the few in the film
that even though he thinks he's a bit of a burke Stanley.
Yeah. He's essentially decent to him,
isn't? He's not, he tells him what to
do. Like when he forgets to plug,
his plug is a forklift truck and he goes well, you haven't
plugged you, bulky of tracking you idiot but of course it's not
going to work and he goes can't. Somebody else do that?
He had? No, that's somebody else's job.
Yeah. Demarcation mate demarcation.
Which does make sense when you look into it.
That, if if, Stop. I mean we've all had jobs like
that. We've all had jobs, where one of
us is doing slightly more than the other person and Petty
things like I have to plug your book Lift Truck in every morning
for you and yet, I'm getting paid the same amount as you.
It does great. Even though that sounds Petty.
If it's every day, it does great.
You do then understand why each person has to have a different
delineator job. Otherwise, you start going.
Well, I'm not getting paid as much as you.
And, yes, I'm doing your work. Oh yeah, Terry Thomas.
Thomas, turns up whose major Hitchcock, The Personnel
officer. Yes.
And and he's called major Hitchcock.
And wondering, I've written here.
Is he really a major? Is he one of those like Captain
peacock? For me being served?
He's at Major and privates progress.
I was a oh, well, that's why he's introduced as major
Hitchcock and I do get the feeling is what you get do.
Get the feeling that Terry Thomas is just improvising all
the way through, because He does all of the turkey cook.
You know, what absolute stinkers, all of his
catchphrases all the way through and you're going.
Did the bull Tings, right? This right in.
But did they just say to Terry Thomas?
Just do your thing. They just, just do what you do.
There's that scene, where he's talking to you, because John le
mesurier turns up as the time and motion study man, and he's
taking us to press this. John le mesurier always days and
Terry Thomas. This is he mentions he was out
the previous night with a little red heading.
Just does that eye-rolling thing?
That is yeah it's just delicious that and none of it goes with
the character of he's meant. I mean, he's not even
management, he's middle management.
So he answers to the bosses and the answers to the Union's.
He has very little power of his own.
So Terry Thomas being Sarah like Mariah time a major.
It doesn't actually make sense in that role so you do get the
feeling he's completely improvising.
Yeah. We got Jabs here who can break
out into a Max width, anybody standing still while the they
can't stand is being stopped watching the sole purpose of
time and motion studies to enable the men to work
efficiently well within their natural capacity capacity.
My dear fellow bearing capacity. That sort of these thinkers in
the capacities of the column. They are steam, like their
little punishing night. Last night didn't spot a time
and motion study of my own being head.
Well, Leslie, cick quite terry-thomas, by the way, he
worked a lot with sellers, like, recently in the sense that it in
the last, in the 12 months, 24 months leading up to this film.
He'd worked with sellers three times already.
Yes, and they were in a very early settlers film together
when I was doing a little bit of research on this other than they
were in Tom Thumb. Got the plane, the bad guys.
And that's actually one of his quotes.
Is that sellers was criminally under used?
So Terry Thomas was a big seller sign and actually I think
probably my favorite scene in. I'm.
All right, jack is the scene. They have together where he
visits Fred kiter home after Fred's wife left him.
That's right. And they have a drink and they
get sort of melancholy together. Well, that's another, that's
another sign. It's another interesting
comparison because uh, they both drinking Sherry and it's clear
that their men Touching each other.
Drink for drink. Yeah, but kite is sloshed
because he's obviously not a big drinker.
Where is Terry? Thomas seems to be handling, it
quite well. You know, it's just yeah.
Well, also I very much got the feeling that Peter Sellers plays
Fred kite as a child really. He's, he's more red, learn about
like a 12 year old girl. How he plays Fred kite at home.
Anyway, I mean the bit where he's talking about Russian
culture and you expect him to talk about politics.
And he goes well in the ballet and he's, he's clearly, you
know, he's got that crush on stand because again, I'm aware
I'm talking about this out of order out of chronological order
that the scene where they are talking about their wives.
I mean, I think Terry Thomas is talking about a woman leaving
him because that they're both talking about.
Fred's wife leaving him and Peter Sellers.
Maybe Fred. Kite says, do you think he'll
come back? Which is so unnoticed in the
script. I wonder if Peter Sellers put
that in because Peter Sellers, absolutely Place.
Red kite is having as much of a crush on Stanley has his
daughter has hmm. In fact, more his daughter, just
likes the fact that there's a single man in the house.
Whereas Fred genuinely adores. Everything.
Every single thing about Stanley Windrush, he wants to be Stanley
Windra. She wants to have been to
Oxford. He's so Jealous.
But Stanley went to Oxford. He thinks he's at he thinks he's
an intellectual. Where is he's not crazy.
He's not an intellectual Pony made just cause he's, he's not
no, he's been to Oxford and that's quite sad as well in that
with the class structure Stanley's been to Oxford about,
it's not intelligent is not using.
It is not using his degree to get a job.
Whereas, Fred actually has read a huge amount of books.
He went to a summer school at Oxford.
He, he he wants to be an intellectual but his role The
class structure doesn't allow him to be?
No. No.
And as we say anything, I relate to Fred in that way.
So I'm always somebody, even though I've got a posh accent,
I'm I was raising the state and I'm from a working class family.
And the reason I have a posh voice is both.
My parents had done, my dad, had an Irish accent and my mom had a
German accent. So they raised me to speak
properly and so there's I think that's one of the reasons.
I'm a bit of a spread collar topologist, because I'm also,
somebody who feels I could have done so much.
Better and I should have been encouraged to go to Oxford, but
it wasn't even mentioned at my school like not even mentioned.
They brought me up to speak like this.
So I will get a job. And then what they forgot is
that speaking like this at school meant, I was so miserable
and bullied, I didn't get any of my own levels.
Yeah, which women mention John, the measurer just while I'm on
people appearing, with Sellers and other films.
I was just, I just made a note of possess so many character
actors in This film is. So they're all And that's why
they couldn't afford. The title sequence, is my money
on the cars. I had it in my head that Dennis
price of all the cars that I didn't know, I had the dentist
price, it appeared him in the most films with sellers or films
that sellers was in, if you know what I mean.
But actually it's John the measure, the measure area.
He appeared in 11 films, that Peter Sellers was also in.
Okay, so not necessarily starring vehicles for sellers,
but they both appeared in the Pink Panther Casino Royale which
was a disaster. The magic christian.a only two,
can play the wrong box. Never let go mr.
Topaz wrong arm of the law, Waltz of the toreadors council
Brown of the fo and sells last film The Dreadful fiendish.
Plot of dr. Fu-manchu, I remember Carlton
Brown, I don't remember, John le mesurier John le mesurier being
in any of the others. Yeah, I mean, it's only
sometimes just like it once seen, you know, but believe me,
Well, if I sorry you mentioned about the guys playing cards by
the way, just wanted to mention that because that's, that's a
really funny scene, where stem, he's driving his forklift.
He moves a load of crates and he interrupts this card school
that's going on. You've got you've got and I
wanted to mention it because listen to this podcast will know
that I have a I'm a big fan of the actor.
David Lodge, right? Yes.
Because David Lodge appeared in a lot of films with Peter
Sellers because they were best friends.
Ends. Okay.
And they Dave large fact, David. This is what I said about, John
le mesurier can be devraj. Has been in the most films with
Peter Sellers. Let's put it that way, but Dave
Lodge probably the best-known sellers film that he was in is
two-way stretch, which is a terrific film occasion that.
But yeah, we have the scene where kite arrives to see major
Eric Hitchcock flanked by other members of The Works committee,
including The actor, John coma, who did you recognize him?
Yes. And and one thing that I found
very, very interesting about the working class actors.
There are actors that represent working class accents of almost
every British area. So you've got John coma, who's
Northern, you've got John kid, who's Cockney?
You've got same kid, same kids and kids.
Sorry. It's because I know John kids is
son who I used to know but I really I always end up call.
Them that. Yeah, I know my mum, my mum was
still alive. She saw John kid at party when
you have to make friends with him because he sank His Son,
Well, Done, Hector Madden, of course, being Cockney.
But you've got Kenneth Griffith, his Welsh none writing down the
names. Where should I put the rest of
the names? All?
This is the trouble. My notes, they're all over the
magic card. You Robinson Kaji Robinson and
there's an Irish actor Donnell. Where have I written it?
Oh, Donald Donnelly Donald Donnelly.
Yeah. So and I do And how purposeful
that is that they have encompassed?
Like so many working-class accents and so many
working-class people together, even though they're all working
in one Factory in. Do we ever know where it is?
London, is London somewhere. I don't think there's a Scotsman
and all ages, as well. So one of the boys on the one of
the guys in the works committee whose name.
I've got it. It's Billy somebody.
I forgot his surname. He's really young.
He's clearly only about 18 or 19, and then you've got quite
old. The guy Towers over them.
So they've encompassed all peoples all men in the works
committee, which I find very interesting.
That's absolutely. Yeah, it's I never thought of
that. But yeah, it take it like step
out from the Scots. They taking off every part of
the British Isles, aren't they? Yeah, and send kids, same kids,
sole purpose of this film is to almost sound like he's going to
swear. Then what do you doing on a
forklift truck? I do like to point this stuff
out when I, because I'm a comedy teacher to the younger people
listening, that he also does a cocoon.
He's a KKK, I can't remember what, the what word he says in
the end, but that is a lot of thought that says, and they
stare at him. And in 1959, they did call
people, the c word and it's very clear that they're all expecting
him to say the thing. But from the way that, I mean, I
think it's the widest, Peter Sellers eyes getting the entire
film. Yeah, what is mentioned by the
way? Mr. Muhammad.
Yeah, he's my Maitland. One of the things, one of The
Tick's we can give this film in terms of not being lazy and they
could have just what Peter Sellers himself, very often
would Brown up and play Indian characters.
I'm surprised that they didn't have a character in Brown face,
but, you know, if we're being very pure, Rest now, mon
Maitland was of Indian Heritage and he is playing.
Some museum, is Turkish of Muslim Heritage know, the thing
is, we're still quite behind on that one.
He is the 1950s, onward jalili. So, you know, now if there's
somebody beige, it's played by homage a living, okay, that's
fair enough and I'm but no, it's my in-laws are Turkish, my
husband's Turkish so that I think that's why I get quite
attached to mr. Muhammad being Turkish because I
Is representation even though he's Horrible character, but
they're all horrible characters and I suppose we should say, as
well for anybody watching the film content warning, there is a
lot of racialized language, but it's very specifically used to
point out the gulf between Fred kites political intentions, and
how he actually feels about his own career.
So it is the only time where he does chase money.
So when he's taught, when Fred kite is talking to Windrush
about his political, Suppose, one of the things he mentions is
that the denigration of the colored man has led them to
being undervalued as workers. Hmm.
And it's quite a big Point that he's making that into the point
that I actually had a row with my husband about very recently
about whether the the white working class in this country
kind of take their roles likely for granted.
And and this film very much looks at our the white working
class slightly over It's do they think that they don't actually
have to put a bit of elbow grease in to do some work and,
and listeners to the podcast? Be very pleased, that not to
hear that, my husband told me off for denigrating the white
working class. But this is a very interesting
political point, but Fred kite makes that when you constantly
insult and you constantly stereotype black people, they
then won't be given good jobs. Yes, they thought of a stupid.
And then, the reason that that language is used, is that Later
on when they start, panicking after Windrush messes up there
and time and motion study, so they're all going to have to
work harder. John coma does say they're going
to have us working like blacks, which we wouldn't accept now.
But that is used for to Fred kite, then panics, but and he
specifically says that they're going to replace all of the
workers here. With black workers like they did
on the buses and Birmingham and so The reason that that this
language is used and it's not my place to say it's okay.
So that would be up to somebody black or brown but it is
specifically to show that Fred quite believes that colored
people should be working. Sorry, that's the term he uses
not until he's faced to the fact that he might be sacked and
replaced by somebody. Yes.
And also it's to point out that at the time, black people were
used very much to replace other workers.
Hours and to be cheap labor, rather than to be brought in to
work alongside the white working class and get equal wages.
I'm equal respect for them, which is still an issue.
Now, we still see the black working class and the white
working class being played off each other by being told,
they're going to replace each other rather than being told
well, we've got room in the factory but both and you can
work alongside each other. So to see these principles being
dragged into a very commercial. A very big hit film in 1959.
I think is very interesting now. Absolutely, it's interesting.
Just on the fact we're talking about racial tensions in 1950s,
Britain. It's interesting.
I'm sure it's a coincidence, but it's interesting that Stanley
surname is Windrush. Yes.
And I did when I was watching, I'm all right, jack before you
and me, we're going to talk about it.
Like, a few months ago, I did say on Twitter, to people know
if this is on purpose and it doesn't seem to be on purpose
because it was his name and privates.
Programs as well. But yeah, since the Windrush
generation had just arrived to do work and since Stanley's role
in this film, is to be the innocent person who just has
arrived in this. British cultural MLA who just
wants to do some work, make some money, get a flat and has to go
through the stupid bureaucratic rigmarole and keep getting used
by every other side. It does seem very on.
The knows that his name is Windrush.
Yes, it does. Anyway, let's talk about, let's
talk about Liz phrase. I think I told you.
I'm not very funny but I'm talking about things.
I might these two interesting. Again, she deep with stuff.
It's a political. No, no.
I like, I like, I like to overanalyze things.
I really dig people, do this. So, yeah.
So let's phrase. It's okay.
Fred kite. He's very impressed by steadily.
Stanley's thinking about getting a local local boarding somewhere
and kite offers him to come and stay with him and his family.
And Stanley's a bit reluctant, I guess because he just he's a bit
snobbish, really isn't? He stem, he's looking down his
nose at right here. Well, there's also the scene
where his aunt meets ireenie handle and decides immediately
she's not going to like her like refuses T, until I really
handle, says something she agrees with.
And then there's a very clear reassessment Margaret,
Rutherford space, like contorts for quite a while.
Until she says, I will have that cup of tea, actually.
Yeah. So he has come from Family, who
would not associate with those types.
Yeah, you probably hate me for saying this, but then let's
phrases breasts walk in the room because Liz phrases breasts are
iconic and Stanley. Certainly something that's a
change of heart. For some reason they don't know
quite what we're talking about. Liz phrases breasts.
Al is phrases. Breasts are actually one of the
reasons that my mom idolized Liz Brazier.
So if you follow her through her whole career, My mum that, how
old is my mom have been? My mom was born in 35, so should
have been their late 20s when this film came out, mid twenties
and so miss Fraser was a sex symbol and an idol of beauty and
then later on she was in films, like the confessions films where
she always played, extremely Alpha sexually aggressive women
who very much Miss Frazer, pretty much a whole career
played women who chose her men and That's right.
I'm having you and was never passive.
And then after being this very Alpha sex symbol, for all of her
career, got breast cancer and for many women, losing a breast
when you are known for your breasts, you know, as you said,
this is her first film and her breasts walking in front of her,
she could have been somebody who just decides to hide away and
she didn't choose very public about her breast cancer and she
still appeared in. With her prosthetic breast.
And my mom had breast cancer and watching Liz Fraser going
through it very much. Helped my mom go through it.
Lovely. So no I don't mind.
You talkin about her breasts at all because her breasts are very
important in our household. Yeah.
And I think I'd love to think this is an eye blink.
My sellers. He refers to.
So she is his daughter Cynthia and she works there spindle
publishing. I just think that's lovely.
It's just there's my god. I've never Got the double
entendre from that. Yeah.
Hi Dad. Tell Mama being late tonight
with very well Cynthia. You want over time.
Are you don't be Daft going up with dancing?
My daughter Cynthia works here spindle polishing.
Oh no. I mean, you know, they're not
subtle with her either. There's a bit later.
We're and Dennis prices, talking about doing foreign business
deals and he calls it intercourse with foreign
partners. And Liz phrases says, the
Stanley. I'm not following this at all.
What's he talking about? And he says you saying we should
have intercourse with foreign partners and she goes.
Oh and suddenly she's interested, she gives Stony, the
Glad eye doesn't she. She said she's going at West
dancing and then we see the scene back Stanley arrived.
Frank tights house and tight given some books to read on a
dialectic materialism and it's this really rose-tinted ideal of
of a worker's paradise. And yeah, goes on about Russia,
the cornfields and ballet in the evening.
And there's a photo on the we see a photo and the mental peace
later of Sellers and handle dressed up in wedding.
Garb it's obviously meant to be their wedding.
Photograph. Oh, I didn't see that.
Have to look for that love to know where that photograph is
now. It's Bleah long gone.
And it's heart that made us so much goes on in this film.
It's hard to kind of go through it all.
But essentially the time in motion man, John le mesurier a
basically times Stanley on his forklift and basic Stanley Falls
for because he's just trying to be friendly.
Yeah, and that's also quite, it's almost quite a sad, but in
the film, in that, when Stanley arrives at the plant, Victor
Madden, take some understand. So this is what you do, and What
you do in this is what you do. And so when John le mesurier a
arrives and Stanley thinks he's a new worker, he almost feels
like he's doing the same thing. That knows he did.
He's showing him how to work a forklift truck.
Hmm. He doesn't for one second think
that this person is tricking him into doing as much work as he
can as fast as he can, so they can start paying the staff less.
Yeah and of course it just basically results in everybody
out. Out results in a strike because,
yeah, which is based on the fact that Fred kite doesn't want
everybody to be replaced by black workers.
That's right. That's the moment that it that
it snaps, which I guess is the point, the point for me, where
Fred kite becomes a bad guy. Yes.
But this, that, but this thing I think is the most interesting
part of the film is, is when, when kite, he arrives, home from
a branch meeting and he gives Stanley a letter telling him,
he's been sent to Coventry nobody's going to speak to him
for a month. This is when the Press arrived
because coxy has suggested tipping off the papers to try
and accelerate things, essentially and listeners, who
haven't seen this film? Might be confused by others but
the Press arrived. Fred kite has a fork loaded with
something revolting. I don't know what he's eating,
he's eating. It looks like a steak pie and
and tight assumes that they want to speak the press one to speak
to him, and he's going to issue a statement.
And but they're actually, they're actually there to see
Stanley. Gonna have his Mets clinched
moment. Yeah, I'm gonna become a hero of
the people and go viral. Yeah, cut.
Yeah, kite is really these wrong-footed and when Stanley
walks into the room, the pressed send on him and they confirm
with Stanley that the strike is because he worked faster and
more efficiently, and then, Stanley sort of innocently
reveals that they've sent him to Coventry.
And this makes, if you look at Sellers, his eyes are just like,
go all over the shop. He's looked so ill at ease and
nervous, but it is also its, I think that is As well as is an
interesting Pastiche on the commercialism of the time
especially because they make a lot of references to the war.
And for us, you go what? It was 10 years later, why they
still banging on about the war. But it seems to be very
culturally influenced by it. Is that you would presume a
newspaper would want to talk to the head of the Trade union or
the head of the business. Yes, the fact that they want to
talk to a bloke and they're interested in his romances and
his backstory Him being ordinary possibly was quite a new thing
because we still think about is quite new, no white.
Why do they want to interview people in the queue rather than
the quicker rather than, you know, a member of the
government? Yes.
That's so it also introduces that kind of pop culture aspect,
that's threaded through the film of not wanting to actually deal
with the important it that. So, even the Press at this
point, don't want to deal with the important issues and don't
want to deal with the politics budget.
They're playing as much as buddy else's.
That's a, that's a great Point. Yeah.
Because the 50s was the real rise of the Sunday newspapers as
well. Where there's salacious stories
about sex, Maniacs roaming the streets.
And well the way that she has forgotten his name, you're
better than names. The actor who plays the the
rather salacious newspaper reporter.
So you've got a few of them are just going.
You know, is your name Sally Windrush, we believe you worked
really hard and then they have the guy who's very similar to
the person who played the child catcher, but he isn't him.
So do you have a young lady and at the point where Cynthia gets
mentioned it all becomes very own.
There's a young lady in your life is she here and the
salaciousness of it is very pointed up.
Yeah. They wanted the looking for the
human angle. Yeah and then and then we see a
montage of the next morning papers front pages which are
unanimously supporting Stanley, the bloody Daily Express has
Salute Stanley Windrush for example and I guess we should
point out to people who don't know the film is that when they
all walk out. Yeah this is this is relatively
important when Aunt Dolly comes to see him and remember Aunt
Dolly when our dolly is speaking to him they are interviewing
aren't dollies chauffeur who is telling them that she doesn't
pay him enough. Yes, it's given them the skinny.
She tells Stanley that Yeah, she basically says look, I'm funding
your lifestyle. Now because you said you wanted
to get a job and yet you haven't got a job, you decided not to do
your job, whilst sitting at home and this, this isn't how we do
things. And he he decides that he needs
to go back to work. So the reason that this becomes
a big issue in the papers is that he is still working through
the strike. He's the only person in the arms
Factory. That's actually doing any work.
Yeah and they fight that the The Works committee find out that
he's related to. His uncle is, his Bertram is
Dennis Price and they accuse him of being like a traitor, a fifth
columnist, you Judas. And that's where I think Judas
is very telling as well of how, how sellers have red.
Kite feels about Stanley. Yes.
So that he feels that close to
Stanley that he is a Judas etcetera personally.
Yeah yeah, yeah. And obviously kite has got it.
Well, as far as Concerned. He's got no choice, but to spend
a packing and boot him out the house, mrs.
Kite, and soon he arrived home from I think the been to visit
their round or something and then.
Yeah. And then I really hadn't had to
strip off him and tells him that the strike is spread again, very
strong woman, very strong, matriarchal figure and kite is
quivering, isn't he? In the face of her Onslaught?
She's basically says, yeah, if you're gonna go on strike, we
are to and her and Cynthia basically bugger off.
Off to the aunt's house. Again, I hope you're satisfied.
Frank cart It was democratically arrived at I mean I am chairman
of the works coming. Yes your 10-minute The Works
committee. All right?
Don't we all know it. Sick to death of kill your Works
committee Union. This Union that and yep blasted
Soviet Union. There is a strike on mother.
You telling me there's a star Kang.
I'll tell you something else. The strike spread to this house
from now on Since I get our bags packed, we're going back to
Aunt, Edie's, these two can play at this game.
You know, you wanted a strike, you got one pets.
When you feel about going back to work, I will.
And here's something else. I'm going to tell you.
He is another strike. That's 100% solid.
It's probably the only time in the whole film.
Somebody makes a logical point because the entire film is run
by not being logical but nobody making a logical point to
anybody anytime. Until I really Will says, well,
why am I still cooking and cleaning for you if you've gone
on strike because her pay is a housewife, is his pain.
Yes. Yes, he walks out and lets them
do all the cleaning. I think it's another reason I
relate to Fred kite is he has the domestic abilities.
I have he's left alone for about three days and he has not
thought to wash up a plate before he uses the next plate
for him to be on his own in the house.
There's so much washing up like a ridiculous like it's but just
one person. It's verging on the with now and
I kitchen. Is it?
Is it is? Yeah, it's a lovely, a lovely,
snapshot of life within the house within the kite house.
Without without I really handle, be the Fred Chi is dejectedly
walking around this really untidy kitchen.
He's with a penny on. Yeah and pretty on this is
mournful kind of trumpet playing in the background.
He steps steps Barefoot onto a piece of toast peels off.
His foot despondently. This is so me, somebody would
try principles Like practicality.
That's me all over. And by the way, the strike is
now gone. National there's now two and a
half million or something like that to have minions trains.
Go on. Strike, everybody goes on
strike. Yeah.
And we have all these montages of empty shipyards and Railway
sidings and things like that and so it messes up the plan.
So the original plan was that missiles limited would go on
strike so that the missile contract could be transferred to
Cox's Factory. Yeah.
But coxey's Factory then goes on strike as well.
Yeah. So the two bad guys, Dennis
Price. And Richard Attenborough, it's
now gone wrong for them because they can't get the money for the
missiles because the missiles aren't being made.
So they both asked Terry Thomas, the major to go and try and
negotiate with kind of trying some Salvage something, and they
don't quite know what to do. And I love the fact that Terry
Thomas refers to Fred kite as absolute shocker.
And this is the same way. We get Terry Thomas turning up
to Fred clients house. Yes, which is lovely.
And I love you even though he's just said, he's the sort of guy
who sleeps as bad as they seem to really well once upon a few
cherries. Mmm, they seem to really get on,
but Terry Thomas is characters. Well, he insults the management
to kite and insults kite to the management.
So he's also being being on genuine at the whole time.
He's one of those people and I've worked with people like
this. I'm sure.
You have, who will tell you will tell you what?
They know you want to hear. Yes.
Now here's my favorite. Terry-thomas facts that I just
found out. Yeah, Terry Thomas is real.
Name was Thomas Terry. It was Thomas Terry Stevens but,
you know, he always had, it's like, yeah, it is his first name
like Madonna. He's very like Madonna.
He is like one first name and the big gap in his teeth and the
conical bra. Yes.
So he is our Madonna. And the other thing I was gonna,
I was gonna make some sort of sarcastic comment about he's
being, he's called Terry Thomas with a hyphen in the middle
because it represents the Gap in his teeth.
And that actually is why, if you read, why he put the hyphen, he
said it was because he wanted it to be seen as a first name.
But also because it Has entered the Gap.
Oh wow. Yeah, I know that he was related
to Richard briers. I didn't know that.
Yeah, cousins, I think. Okay.
And that his dad. Well, there's a big thing as
well. That his dad was a butcher.
So the whole kind of upper-class thing is made up, but if you
look at his biography he was seduced by his housekeeper.
So he was a butcher that had a housekeepers.
They weren't exactly fucking class.
No no by Hits on this plan of this idea, the solution that if
Stanley resigns due to ill health or on by overwork that
will work for everybody. Yeah.
And actually, that's interesting, as well in this
scene is that even though quite is drunk, and he's emotional, is
emotional because more that Stanley's left in them, these
wife has left him. He properties.
Probably thinking, you know, when Terry Thomas when Hitchcock
makes a proposal or can we do this?
He has a good moment of thinking going, no, no, no, that wouldn't
work in the way that the union is run.
So, they actually have a quite sensible meeting.
You get the impression to kite, is probably fairly good at his
job, fairly good, but we don't even know what his job is like,
most shop stewards, they work as well.
True, he seems to not actually work on the factory floor, I
know that I believe at this time, I don't know if it's still
the case. All shops to is really a thing
of the past now and they really, but it should, it was an unpaid.
Position. Isn't it?
Okay. Okay.
So it's really it's someone would want to be a shop steward
who just wants a guess a certain degree of power because the
certainly not getting paid for it.
Yeah so and then we have this because then he's basically
become a national hero terms of the media, he's invited onto
this kind of question. Time like a program called
argument posted by The real life Malcolm Malcolm muggeridge.
Yeah, he was a real life TV presenter.
And that's another thing that I meant to mention from earlier.
So there's animation at the beginning of the film and the
narration is done in the path. A newsreel voice.
Hmm. I know this because I'm
currently researching a play which is set in 1940s and
watching a lot of path, a newsreels and that's another
thing we might not notice when we watch the film now is that it
is presented like a documentary. Hmm.
The the voiceover would have made the audience feel They were
watching the news. Yes, very much of docu comedy in
the same vein as the office. Yeah.
As a lot of Echoes of the office actually, Malcolm muggeridge, of
course, probably most remembered now by Our Generation as the guy
that had that argument on television with John Cleese and
Michael Palin about my foot, bro.
Okay. Malcolm muggeridge was
complaining about the film because he saw it as being
Blasphemous from us. Although he'd been late getting
in To the cinema. So he missed the first scene
where we, actually clearly see, Jesus being born somewhere else
and then it pounds across the to Brian, doesn't it?
So it's clearly not meant to be Jesus.
You got that is Malcolm muggeridge.
Yeah, of course. He wants, you know, be the
similar to having Jeremy Paxman. Now suddenly pop up in the film.
Yeah, and I think again, as a comment on society, these
people, the people on this panel are a Because we never know what
nationality mr. Muhammad is.
But if we're going to go with Turkish, a Turkish arms, broker
who seems to be quite high up in the government of some Arabian
country. A man who runs a missile Factory
and a Trade union leader. And these people are ultimately
answerable to the television. There are no politicians in the
whole film, I think. Now, I don't think there are
any, there's this the minister of Labour, who's interviewed on
television, very brief. During and that's a very clever
bit. I remember that bit the minister
of Labour. And also, then they also
interview the head of the Tec. Yes.
And both of them say nothing. Yes.
Minister of Labor says, this is an ongoing issue and the head of
the to. You see says exactly the same
thing which is echoed earlier in the film.
When Dennis Price says, I have written this down then it's
price says what I love about capitalism is we're all in it.
We're all in the same game working together and it
instantly goes to Fred quite saying what I love about.
This is a role in the same game moving forward together.
Hmm. So it constantly has this
balance of their showing. These are both the same.
Yes. They're both.
Just trying to make money and they're both trying to convince
you that you are working for yourself.
It's kind of it's corrosive though because I hate that
argument that you know, people that say lazy people that say
all politicians. They're all as bad as each
other. Yeah.
It's like no they're not.
They're not all as bad as each other.
I blame the want to get politically but I believe We've
been talking about label. Right jackets.
Incredibly political film. Yeah, but I blame the expenses
Scandal. I think that had a really
corrosive effect on both sides were doing similar.
Yeah. But not all of them that they
weren't all expenses. But now it's very easy for
people to to forgive the government or members of
parliament by just saying they're all as bad as each
other. Yeah, obviously obviously we
Forgot to mention. So cocci tries to tries to
bribe, tries to buy him off with a hold or full of £1 notes.
I think, at this point, we don't know if he's trying to.
So this point, he gives them the whole doll and Stanley takes the
whole door of £1 notes, which is thousands of pounds, bit weird.
This is where coxy has revealed the whole plan and Stanley just
is, is reeling from this. He looks like he's in a daze, he
can't. It's kind of the scales have
fallen from his eyes. But Stanley, yes, Stanley takes
the holder. We don't know what he's going to
do with it, and then we cut to the interview itself.
And again, before you get Stanley, there's a lovely Peter
Sellers bit here as well. Lovely piece of calm, Pete.
Kite is the only person who talks, and he has a wonderful
bit of business where he's trying to be really
professional, but he's never been a television studio and the
televisions, the directors trying to get him to wind up,
but he doesn't understand why he's being.
That which makes him completely forget his point.
I'll be your situation is quite straightforward as trade.
Unionists, we have always been concerned, we are poor
efficiency and the poor, the individual worker.
And it is. It is for that reason that we
oppose the attempt of the management to overwork the man
on the job. It is for that reason that we
oppose the introduction of everybody agrees.
The met all of his friends. Go.
Yeah. You said it, you tell him that
he actually didn't say anything. All he says, is the city.
I think he says the situation is quite straightforward and you
got Mom and Cynthia there in the audience.
Everyone seems to be new in the audience.
Well, listen Pia half of the trade unionists are in the
audience and half of them, are watching it at the pub.
Yeah. And Victor Madden is front and
center and the pub, isn't he? And it marvelous, which he said,
he wouldn't little touch one little scene that I forgot to
mention earlier, from earlier with victim Madden, and it kind
of shows the character, the character who plays Knowles is
actually a decent guy. The strike is called everyone's
out. Yeah.
And then you see a little bit later on, Victor Madden's
character on his bike. So I got back to the factory
goes up to the crepe, where the guys are playing cards.
And tells them that there's a strike on, he's remembered them,
you know? And and they say all right,
well, no point us working doing all this work.
We may as well go and I nose is clearly always thinking about
everybody else. Yes, even though he's used at
the beginning, he is the soldier that they show when Churchill
does the V sign for peace, they show a soldier doing the V sign
as in the up yours. Yeah.
And then it goes into the engine so he is shown as the
archetypal. I'm all right?
Jacked person. Hmm, which is somebody saying
I'm fine. So, who cares about you and the
party? The phrase originates from a
sailor who was saved, there was a sailor who was saved from some
conflict and after he got into the boat he pulled the ladder up
after him saying. I'm all right jack but actually
Knowles even though he very much keeps up the system of people
not working, but still getting paid.
He is very much a character that.
Yeah, he checks In on everybody, you can tell in his head.
He's always thinking about other people, hmm.
Yes, actually, yes. So Stanley's on this panel and
he's smoking endless cigarettes. Yes, and he looks really IDs
really agitated and then he starts to speak, he decides
there and then that is going to blow the Gaff.
Yeah. And it gives both.
So he interrupts kite and gives both barrels to Fred kite.
And and then he starts laying into his uncle Bertram much
more. Early as well.
Yes, he just talks him, but Uncle Burton, he goes right up
to his face and starts shouting at his face and the camera, the,
the producer panics and they need to move all the cameras.
He's sort of shelter. Uncle Bertie says you.
He's cheated everyone even his own mother, which is aren't
Dolly. And he says, you're a Bounder as
streamlined chromium-plated old-fashioned.
Bounder. And when the only other time we
see as McCannon, so we watch this only react to the fact that
her son has cheated her and the two servants, the chauffeur and
as McCannon are laughing in the background because they're an
absolutely that Dennis Price being shown up for who he is.
Yes. Yeah.
And it culminates in Stanley upending, the whole doll and all
the money coming out and flying everywhere and the whole
audience, everybody. Yeah, scrambling?
Right? For anybody.
Who's done any kind of film studies.
So, so a couple of really weird things happen in this scene.
They're in, they're in the BBC television.
Yeah, and he throws money everywhere.
So, the audience rushes to get the money, it instantly turns
into Pastiche of Battleship potemkin.
So have you seen Battleship potemkin?
I've only seen that the pram going down the steps.
I'm afraid I'm going down the steps scene.
Hmm, there is a bit where an intellectual.
He's shown to be an intellectual because he's wearing glasses and
he is trying to prevent what's happening.
I know. I think it's the woman who gets
the gun in. Her face is wearing the glasses
and the glass of her eyeglasses shatters as she's hit in the
face. But what you get in, I'm all
right, jack is as the money flies around, you get very
extreme close-ups of people's faces and the man who is the end
of the world is nigh. Man is shoved to the floor and
his hand is stamped on and you get a very extreme close-up of
his face with his round glasses screaming and it is an absolute
like it's so much like Battleship potemkin going to be
on purpose but Can't work out why whether it's something to do
with a class structure? I don't know.
Well, clearly it's so much the same.
It's clearly meant to be like battle.
I mean, that is that seen as a much parodied seen as an it from
Battleship potemkin. I know that they do it.
It's not a parody but they, there's a nod to it in The
Untouchables film isn't there? Yeah, yeah.
But at this time, back in the 50s, would they have been silly
literate, light? Like I don't know how Balton
brothers would have been. I don't know how big it was
commercially. I know Battleship potemkin.
So I used to work at film museum at the BFI, right?
I worked as a Russian agitprop worker so I would be teaching
how Battleship potemkin Works to people who came into the museum.
This amount. That's why I know that the glass
is this glass is there represents Intelligentsia that
they read and they talk but they do not fight.
And you see the glass has been broken because what she has seen
is so horrific. And I would talk about this all
day, so I remember that each character that's sewn in
close-up and Battleship potemkin represents a different level of
the class structure. Eisenstein was one of the first
people to use symbols to represent political tropes.
Yeah, I feel really stupid now, because point the point I was
going to make about the seniors that it reminded me a bit of
that episode of, filthy rich, you cat flap.
Do you remember filthy rich? She can't fly.
Like I say, I have no memories of my own youth.
There's a there's a there's an episode where there's a
fictional the filming of fictional game.
Show called newer sounds a bit rude.
Oh yeah. And it descends into chaos and
the TV producer at the end played by Chris bury.
This is basically losing his crap and ends up with his head
in his hands because everything's everything's gone
wrong and it just reminded me a bit of that.
But anyway, you for Battleship potemkin I've bought Filthy Rich
cat, flaps this scene in Does from Battleship potemkin to then
sort of Keystone Cops style punching session with, with a
woman, a large woman who's got a lot of money being approached by
cocci, who whacks cocci over the head.
But then I showed it to my daughter.
Earlier, I said, you guess what happens next and she's going to,
I don't know. Vikings arrived.
Mmm. So then it comes Mel Brooks.
It can go Blazing Saddles. Yeah.
Yeah, base of one minute. Yeah.
Looks like Vikings arrived. Which you presume when you're
watching it because it's the BBC Studios.
And clearly next door, they were filming some kind of biking epic
therefore but that's never explained.
It's never explained where the Vikings come from.
Why they're there. How they know there's money.
It's the most surreal moment of the entire film web, give in to
slapstick comedy. Yeah.
Oh. And I forgot to mention this,
this Wednesday, Wednesday night. Buying into his uncle.
He says he says that you're waiving the Union Jack and
nobody can see what you're getting up to behind it.
Yes, I just wrote down plue such a challenge.
Yes it was ever thus, it's very contemporary politics apart from
the fact that I don't like comparing Fred kite to make
Lynch because I love Nick Lynch and Fred kite is a bad guy.
And, you know, and that is one difference when I was looking at
Mike Lynch videos, there was that whole thing the interview
had with K Burly, where she kept saying, What will you do to
people who break the strike? And he just kept laughing and
saying, what do you think I'm going to do K and it was clear
that she was implying that they would get beaten up because that
is a stereotype and a Trope and Mick Lynch made it very clear
that they would be spoken to and have things explained to them.
Whereas on the picket line, Fred kites people are actually being
quite violent to Stanley when he arrives and tries to cross.
Yeah, that's when he calls in Judas, actually.
That's that is a moment where you see Fred kite.
Genuinely emotionally, upset that Stanley is breaking the
strike and being beaten up. He seems to be upset about both
of those things. It does.
Yes. And this this film ends
unexpectedly really is. We see Raymond Huntley as the
magistrate finding against only. Yes, I'm accuses.
Him of slandering. Both Uncle Bertie and Fred kite
who both are in the in the court.
And they both look very smug and satisfying by this, basically,
so they've won really haven't. And it's just it's a weird
ending. It is, as I said, it's a plague
on all your houses really, by the buildings and he's bound
over to keep the peace for a year.
So we see, we end up seeing and back at Sonny blades, with his
dad, who seems to be still watching mushrooms, or whatever
he's doing and like you say all these naked, women want to play
tennis and end up chasing him through the woods.
But the difference is now that he's naked and the first thing,
he's visiting his Harder and he's not naked and he's very
clear that he does not want to be naked, and he finds it weird,
but in the last scene when he goes back, he's not visiting.
He's clearly living there. And I guess there is meant to be
a sense of giving up on society. Yeah.
Society is so trash and so riddled with with stupid people
that you have to literally give up on all of it to make it work.
You can't you have can have no possessions.
You can't even have clothes and and yes but there is that old
thing at the end. The end that he is just as
terrified of the naked women as he was of the nuclear arms race.
But just as just finish off, really sellers himself described
the carriage of red kite as on the surface and infuriating old
Blockhead. And yet somehow moving who did
his best according to his own lights.
And in 1971 sellers said in an interview that the Bolton
brothers were writing a sequel to this film.
Well Fred kite becomes an MP. Yeah, yeah.
But that never happened. And he did say in another
interview in the 70s that and I presume this was before being
there. He was asked what his favorite
film of his was sellers said this film, only two can play and
dr. Strangelove.
So, but it was that's dr. Strangelove in the, you know,
the illogical imaginations of the arms race.
Yeah. Yes.
And and and it was the first Um, that made him really.
Wasn't it this film? Yes where's when he won the
bathtub I hadn't realized how famous he was before.
I think my mom would always giving me the impression that he
hadn't been that famous before this and he actually was very
much so but I think this brought him to the visual arts because
before he was he was more well known as an audio artist.
Yeah, he might hit I think he'd had his trying to think of the
chronology his first starring like name above the title, was
the mouse that roared, which was The same year, but it made it
made that the year before, something like that.
Anyway, my mom, like, I've got, I was trying to find it even
though we can't see it on the podcast, but I can't find it
anywhere by mom's got a very early autograph from Peter
Sellers because she was a big fan of his when he was on razor
law, which is one of the yeah. Yeah.
When he was young, chubby Peter Sellers on the radio, doing all
these different voices for Ted Ray and it's a really
interesting autograph book. Because it's got his home
address on it from his home address.
There's weird to think that like, any any celebrity now
putting their home address on it, autographed.
It is clearly, it was clearly. One of the first autographs have
been asked for because he wasn't, I think it was raised a
laughs pretty good. It was pretty good, wasn't it?
It started 49. And he was on it until 54 but
the game started, 50 12 1960. Okay.
Yeah. So my mom would just write to
everybody and she would say, Everybody that they were her
favorite. And she once said to me she
wants said, that sounds really mean and dishonest but actually
they really were all my favorites because I loved all of
them. Samara, what are you, what have
you got coming up? What are you working on at the
moment. But what's up solo?
Show vanilla? Yep.
Mentioned, which is linked to this, because the bulletins
grandson is going out to, with Jade farewell, from a little mix
who I mention and investigate my solo show, vanilla is streaming
on Netflix. Next up comedy.
So that's next up, comedy.com is a streaming service which costs
only two pounds a month. But it also comes with, I think
it comes with Amazon and various other things.
Okay, I am digging all over the country.
That's just so regular. It's very hard to say exactly
where because I don't know when people are listening to the
podcast. So if you follow me on Twitter
or go, if you follow me on Twitter, I talk a lot.
If you don't want me to talk a lot.
Been like, my Facebook, Hbase book, mellow rock, and they have
my gigs on and generally the big thing I'm doing at the moment as
I'm writing a play, which is probably not going to be that
funny. But of course, I can't help but
be sarcastic. And that is going to be finished
by January because I'm writing it as part of the scheme and
that's going to be showcased at the Young Vic theater in
Waterloo on the 13th of January. Fantastic.
Okay. And this is the play You
referred to earlier in terms of you were doing research.
Empathy use the 1940. It's about the Isle of Man
internment camp where they put all the enemy aliens.
So they put a lot of amateurish refugees, but they also were
living with Nazis because they just Churchill wasn't bothered.
Basically gentle. They had a meeting where they
tried to explain to Churchill, that it's probably not a good
idea to put Jewish refugees and we're Nazis but he found it too
confusing that they're all these different types of Germans.
So he just was like, oh yeah, just the famous phrases,
collared a lot. So am I, my mom and grandmother
were there. So yet again, haunted by my
mother, I'm writing a play about her.
Thanks to Merrill. Thanks for listening.
See you all next week if I've not gone on strike.
Yeah. Cheers.