1 00:00:01,320 --> 00:00:05,120 They had these things that they loved, particularly espionage, 2 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:09,760 the idea of Englishness, corporate England. 3 00:00:09,760 --> 00:00:13,800 They absolutely loved taking the piss out of that whole new ages 4 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:17,320 generation of of red brace wearing if that's your right 5 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:19,160 people and I think they were ahead of their time in that. 6 00:00:19,440 --> 00:00:22,480 Get a fax over the Cliff at Harrington's EGM 3:00 tomorrow. 7 00:00:22,840 --> 00:00:25,040 Find out where Janet is and pull Martin in. 8 00:00:25,040 --> 00:00:29,240 From Where the hell is Martin? I wake up right and get Sarah in 9 00:00:29,240 --> 00:00:32,159 here. Now we've got an agenda to work 10 00:00:32,159 --> 00:01:07,280 out. Hello and welcome to Goompod. 11 00:01:08,120 --> 00:01:12,800 If this is your first time listening, this is probably the 12 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:15,240 world's only podcast to have covered such. 13 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:19,200 Diverse touchstones of popular culture as The Phantom, 14 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:22,840 Raspberry Blower, Ned's Atomic Dustbin, and Renterdick. 15 00:01:23,960 --> 00:01:26,400 My name is Tyler Adams. And on this show we look at the 16 00:01:26,400 --> 00:01:29,920 universe of the goons both collectively and individually, 17 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:35,200 and also broaden things out to look at comedy of a certain 18 00:01:35,280 --> 00:01:38,400 kidney and the people who made it. 19 00:01:39,040 --> 00:01:42,360 So pretty much anything which makes me and my guests laugh. 20 00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:46,000 And very occasionally stuffed with Hilda Baker in as well. 21 00:01:46,920 --> 00:01:49,120 Hilda Baker creeps into this podcast quite a bit. 22 00:01:49,160 --> 00:01:53,600 John, sorry, my guest this week. I should, I should bring him in 23 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:57,560 formally. My guest this week is a comedy 24 00:01:57,560 --> 00:02:01,200 writer, playwright, screenwriter, novelist, script 25 00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:04,400 editor, John Cantor. Hello. 26 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:07,000 Did I cover everything with with that list? 27 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:09,840 Yes. Screenwriter is maybe an 28 00:02:09,840 --> 00:02:14,040 overstatement, though. I did write Full Monty 2, the 29 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:18,240 sequel, which never ever got made because a new head of the 30 00:02:18,240 --> 00:02:21,720 studio said it didn't want to follow up to the Full Monty. 31 00:02:22,240 --> 00:02:26,520 But if there's a new new head of studio, maybe they will, and 32 00:02:26,520 --> 00:02:29,840 I'll dust it down because it was, you know, probably and 33 00:02:29,840 --> 00:02:33,760 written on on paper in Quink. It was that long ago so. 34 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:35,720 Hang on, though. Hang on, yeah. 35 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:39,120 Correct me if I'm wrong, wasn't there a Full Monty Two recently 36 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:41,320 on net? Yes, I'm afraid to Damn you 37 00:02:41,320 --> 00:02:43,360 noticed. Yes, that wasn't anything to do 38 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:46,720 with me, I must say. I think it was a, well, I think 39 00:02:46,720 --> 00:02:50,920 it was a Netflix TV series or anyway it was an expanded 40 00:02:51,640 --> 00:02:54,120 version and I haven't you've seen it. 41 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:56,760 No, no, no, no. I've not even seen. 42 00:02:56,800 --> 00:02:58,520 I've not even seen the the first one. 43 00:02:58,520 --> 00:03:01,800 You've seen the original. No, that's not my sort of thing. 44 00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:04,040 Yeah. Oh, that's oh, oh, OK. 45 00:03:04,160 --> 00:03:06,240 Hey, listen, I know you're meant to be interviewing me, but what 46 00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:08,840 is it about the Full Monty that puts you off seeing it? 47 00:03:09,640 --> 00:03:10,320 Right. Do you know what it is? 48 00:03:10,320 --> 00:03:12,800 And it's not the, it's not the fact that it's men stripping at 49 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:14,280 all, right. Do you know what it is? 50 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:19,680 Yeah, tell me. Do you remember all the Hoo ha, 51 00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:22,520 all the publicity surrounding it when it came out in whatever, 52 00:03:22,520 --> 00:03:24,040 97? Was it 97? 53 00:03:24,040 --> 00:03:24,760 Exactly right. Yeah. 54 00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:31,120 And then our present king. Was filmed doing a parody of 55 00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:34,440 them in the gyro line. Do you remember that? 56 00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:38,080 Was that for presumably for Comic Relief thing or? 57 00:03:38,200 --> 00:03:40,040 I don't know, but he, I can't remember. 58 00:03:40,040 --> 00:03:43,200 But he was there, and he he'd obviously expressed an interest 59 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:47,480 in the Full Monty and someone, one of his equeries, or someone 60 00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:50,720 you know who hopefully got fired soon after, suggested that he 61 00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:54,040 and his flunkies might like to recreate that scene of them. 62 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:57,440 Doing sort of like a hip swinging dance while they're 63 00:03:57,440 --> 00:04:02,120 waiting for oh oh this is exquisitely painful, but it 64 00:04:02,120 --> 00:04:03,880 brings us onto a very big subject. 65 00:04:03,960 --> 00:04:06,760 I don't know whether we want to talk about at all, but that's 66 00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:10,080 the way the comedy is an instrument for people in 67 00:04:10,160 --> 00:04:15,560 political life or or to be. Margaret Thatcher in the Yes 68 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:17,399 Minister sketch. Oh, I didn't. 69 00:04:17,399 --> 00:04:18,480 No, I didn't. Oh, no. 70 00:04:18,480 --> 00:04:20,320 I might have to vote for her retrospectively. 71 00:04:20,440 --> 00:04:21,720 What? I didn't know about this. 72 00:04:21,720 --> 00:04:22,720 What? Tell me more. 73 00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:26,600 She did she well because she famously didn't have a sense of 74 00:04:26,600 --> 00:04:28,200 humour. No, no, she was. 75 00:04:28,200 --> 00:04:29,600 Proud of the fact, I think, wasn't she? 76 00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:31,640 I think so, yeah. It was a guarantee of 77 00:04:31,640 --> 00:04:36,200 seriousness, though. But she did enjoy Yes Minister 78 00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:39,960 or Yes Prime Minister or both. And she probably didn't get the 79 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:42,120 joke. But anyway. 80 00:04:42,320 --> 00:04:47,440 But there was some people listening to this will know much 81 00:04:47,440 --> 00:04:49,520 more than me. But from memory, what happened 82 00:04:49,520 --> 00:04:52,920 was. She she was asked, or she asked, 83 00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:56,720 if she could appear in a short sketch with Nigel Hawthorne and 84 00:04:57,120 --> 00:05:00,800 Paul Eddington as as their characters in Yes, Prime 85 00:05:00,800 --> 00:05:04,160 Minister or Yes Minister. And they agreed. 86 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:08,880 And I I haven't seen the footage, but I gather it's 87 00:05:08,880 --> 00:05:12,800 excruciatingly bad. Yes, it's all very simple. 88 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:16,200 I want you to abolish economists. 89 00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:21,800 Abolish economists, Prime Minister. 90 00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:24,200 Yes, abolish economists and quickly. 91 00:05:24,720 --> 00:05:28,960 All of them, Brandon. Here's all of them. 92 00:05:29,720 --> 00:05:32,520 I look forward to receiving your plan for abolition soon. 93 00:05:33,360 --> 00:05:37,880 Tomorrow, shall we say. I'd like you to announce it 94 00:05:37,880 --> 00:05:40,000 before it all leaks. Yes, it is tomorrow. 95 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:49,160 Tomorrow, Prime Minister, Yes, yes. 96 00:05:49,280 --> 00:05:53,360 Well, just sort it out. That's so interesting because a 97 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:55,520 recent Prime Minister, I'm not, I'm not going to name him 98 00:05:55,520 --> 00:05:59,000 because every time you say his name you increase his earning 99 00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:01,720 potential. But anyway, this, this recent 100 00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:05,120 Prime Minister was of course essentially, and I know what I'm 101 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:07,840 talking about here, essentially a comedy writer. 102 00:06:08,280 --> 00:06:11,880 And when he was foreign secretary, he went on a 103 00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:17,680 diplomatic mission to the Yemen. And some diplomats who were 104 00:06:17,680 --> 00:06:21,440 talking to him were amazed that he said the following thing. 105 00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:24,720 He said. And I quote, with friends like 106 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:30,040 these, who needs Yemenis? Now I know because I'm a comedy 107 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:33,840 writer that he went, he flew all that way to the Yemen for the 108 00:06:33,840 --> 00:06:38,680 diplomatic mission, knowing that the one thing he had to do was 109 00:06:38,920 --> 00:06:42,720 say that gag, you know, So it was, it was a comedic mission 110 00:06:42,720 --> 00:06:46,080 rather than diplomatic mission. And here are my, you know, six 111 00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:51,200 years on broadcast to the world or such members of the world are 112 00:06:51,200 --> 00:06:53,840 listening to the pod. And I just think that that's 113 00:06:53,840 --> 00:06:55,880 extraordinary. Is that do you think that's why 114 00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:58,160 he accepted the gig? Foreign Secretary thought. 115 00:06:58,160 --> 00:06:59,880 Hey, I've got my Yemeni joke. I could one day. 116 00:06:59,880 --> 00:07:03,320 I could use that. Wow, that's advanced comedy 117 00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:05,360 writing. But yes, I do. 118 00:07:05,560 --> 00:07:08,400 I, you know, I know what it's like to have a line. 119 00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:10,920 You want to say. And I'm going to, I'm going to. 120 00:07:11,400 --> 00:07:13,200 You're often a tangent, but it's absolutely it's not. 121 00:07:13,640 --> 00:07:16,760 It's not a tangent. I use one of my my main claim to 122 00:07:16,760 --> 00:07:19,360 fame, and I know whatever I write I can never beat. 123 00:07:19,360 --> 00:07:24,400 This is I was Douglas Adams flatmate for a couple of years 124 00:07:24,400 --> 00:07:26,200 when he was writing Hitchhiker's Guide. 125 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:30,440 And one of the things about Douglas was he had a telephone 126 00:07:30,440 --> 00:07:34,480 habit and he had a writing habit, and he combined the two 127 00:07:34,960 --> 00:07:38,120 by ringing all his friends, of whom there were many, from the 128 00:07:38,120 --> 00:07:41,600 flat on the landline. Obviously I shared the expense 129 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:44,360 of that. The day after, say, he'd been to 130 00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:47,400 a gig by, I don't know, Elvis Costello, he had a funny Elvis 131 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:51,320 Costello game. Watching Elvis Costello, it's 132 00:07:51,320 --> 00:07:52,440 like blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. 133 00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:55,640 So he would call his friends the following day and say, how are 134 00:07:55,640 --> 00:07:57,360 you, Jerry? How are you, Anita? 135 00:07:57,720 --> 00:08:00,800 How are you, Mark? But I knew that as soon as he 136 00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:03,840 could, he would get to the Elvis Costello gig joke. 137 00:08:03,840 --> 00:08:06,640 So I would hear it maybe 10 or 12 times. 138 00:08:07,280 --> 00:08:09,640 And I don't want to sound bitter, but I do want to sound 139 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:13,680 tired of that particular gag. Or did he use the same gag and 140 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:17,320 just, Oh yes, I mean, Douglas was he was a talent, very 141 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:20,960 talented writer, so he would have honed that gag to in an 142 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:22,760 inch of its life. So it didn't need adapting, 143 00:08:22,760 --> 00:08:25,320 adopting, or improving. It just need heating. 144 00:08:26,600 --> 00:08:30,280 I want to talk about a bit about Douglas Adams later, but but 145 00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:33,640 while we're on that right, I'll, I'll bring this up now, Yeah, 146 00:08:34,919 --> 00:08:39,320 because. You came up with the line life. 147 00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:41,840 Don't talk to me about life. It's true, yes. 148 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:47,440 Which is Marvin the Android. Marvin, the Paranoid Android. 149 00:08:47,720 --> 00:08:49,720 OK, now the reason I'm bringing that up now. 150 00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:56,680 Couple of shows ago, Yeah, I played host to comedy writer 151 00:08:56,680 --> 00:08:58,600 Andrew Marshall. Oh, yes. 152 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:01,840 And Andrew Marshall had been a friend of. 153 00:09:02,240 --> 00:09:06,080 Douglas And so the story goes, he was the He was the 154 00:09:06,080 --> 00:09:08,200 inspiration for Marvin the Paranoid Android. 155 00:09:08,280 --> 00:09:10,080 I did, you know, I didn't know that. 156 00:09:10,760 --> 00:09:13,840 I'd always thought it was David Renwick rather than Andrew 157 00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:14,560 Marshall. How did you. 158 00:09:14,560 --> 00:09:16,600 Oh. Well, apparently originally 159 00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:21,040 Douglas had called him Marshall the Paranoid Android. 160 00:09:21,080 --> 00:09:22,520 Oh, great. Well, there you are. 161 00:09:22,920 --> 00:09:24,560 There you. Are but Andrew Marshall was a 162 00:09:24,560 --> 00:09:26,360 little bit. Not hurt by it, but he was a 163 00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:28,320 little bit. To this day, he's a bit 164 00:09:28,320 --> 00:09:30,560 bewildered by why he was the inspiration. 165 00:09:30,560 --> 00:09:32,640 Because he said I'm not a. I'm not. 166 00:09:32,680 --> 00:09:35,640 I'm not a morose man. No, that's so interesting. 167 00:09:35,640 --> 00:09:41,440 Whereas David Renwick is proudly sparing his presence, sparing 168 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:44,720 his absence, proud proudly what I would say morose. 169 00:09:44,720 --> 00:09:47,520 He's he's a, you know, he's a melancholic man, as as many 170 00:09:47,520 --> 00:09:49,640 comedy writers are. That is intriguing. 171 00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:51,480 He's been, he's been on this as well. 172 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:53,040 He was quite upbeat on this. Yeah. 173 00:09:53,400 --> 00:09:54,760 Oh, I hope you. Yeah. 174 00:09:54,880 --> 00:09:57,640 That's So what a cure. What a little curio, right? 175 00:09:57,760 --> 00:10:01,000 Yeah, while we're on previous guests. 176 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:03,720 I just want, if you don't mind, John, I just want to mention 177 00:10:04,280 --> 00:10:11,120 something about my A couple of weeks ago on this show, I 178 00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:14,360 interviewed Katie Secum. Oh, right. 179 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:17,600 Who was the daughter of the late Harry, right? 180 00:10:18,160 --> 00:10:22,400 OK and and you know it was a great conversation we had and I 181 00:10:22,400 --> 00:10:25,200 thought, oh, this will go down well with the with the massive 182 00:10:26,200 --> 00:10:30,120 as I call them. It has gone massive. 183 00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:34,640 Yeah, it has gone down. It has gone down phenomenally 184 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:37,880 well and I can, I can't say that word properly, but it's the 185 00:10:37,880 --> 00:10:41,680 second most downloaded episode in a 24 hour period ever in the 186 00:10:41,680 --> 00:10:46,120 history of this podcast. We had so many people on social 187 00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:50,000 media responding and so many such lovely feedback and 188 00:10:50,560 --> 00:10:53,800 people's memories of Harry and it just sparked off a lot of 189 00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:56,600 really nice, you know, the times that we're living in at the 190 00:10:56,600 --> 00:10:59,920 moment. Lots of nice memories and 191 00:10:59,920 --> 00:11:05,120 reminiscences of how nice a man Harry Seekin was right now. 192 00:11:05,120 --> 00:11:09,360 He mentioned that because there was one thing that I did find 193 00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:13,760 out after I spoke to Katie and it's too late to ask her. 194 00:11:14,120 --> 00:11:16,880 OK, I'm kicking myself. Because what I didn't realize 195 00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:19,720 until the other day was that her godfather? 196 00:11:20,120 --> 00:11:22,800 Yes. Was the actor Stanley Baker? 197 00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:26,720 Oh, right, Stanley Baker. Yes, fine actor, very good 198 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:28,240 actor. Great acting, one of my 199 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:30,000 favorites. And in fact I mentioned him or 200 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:32,480 we mentioned him last week on the show we we discussed a Peter 201 00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:35,600 Sellers film and for various reasons Stanley Baker came up 202 00:11:35,600 --> 00:11:38,680 twice in the conversation talking about a couple of his 203 00:11:38,680 --> 00:11:41,520 films and. And yeah, and as I say, when I 204 00:11:41,520 --> 00:11:43,920 when I heard or when I was told that she that Stanley was 205 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:46,160 Katie's godfather, I thought that's eye wash you know I 206 00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:48,840 thought that's rubbish. But I did check with her and she 207 00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:52,080 said yes, I am. So Harry and Stanley were very 208 00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:55,960 good friends, obviously both Welsh entertainers in their own 209 00:11:55,960 --> 00:11:59,000 way. They liked to play cricket. 210 00:11:59,600 --> 00:12:01,080 They. They played cricket together in 211 00:12:01,080 --> 00:12:02,000 the young. What did Harry do? 212 00:12:02,560 --> 00:12:08,600 Was he was I I see Stanley Baker as a fast bowler but I know 213 00:12:08,600 --> 00:12:11,400 about seek him. I I know this is my son like a 214 00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:14,080 physical thing but I see him as a wicked keeper. 215 00:12:14,120 --> 00:12:16,080 Do you know? Yeah, what he did. 216 00:12:16,560 --> 00:12:19,160 I don't know much about cricket. It's either is the is the wicket 217 00:12:19,240 --> 00:12:21,320 keeper the guy that stands behind and doesn't do much. 218 00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:23,760 Look, you're from New Zealand. You grew up with this stuff. 219 00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:27,360 I yeah. Hey, listen, why don't you get 220 00:12:27,360 --> 00:12:32,440 Katie Seekin back for a Part 2? You know, like Graham Norton 221 00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:34,320 does with, with, say, Miriam Margulies. 222 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:36,000 He has her on almost every week. Because. 223 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:38,400 I'd have her on. I'd have her on Miriam Jesus. 224 00:12:38,640 --> 00:12:45,800 I'd have the explicit rating for this podcast I wanted to quick. 225 00:12:45,800 --> 00:12:47,400 Miriam Margulies? Yes please. 226 00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:52,560 In the 80s, Miriam I think, was at her absolute height as a as a 227 00:12:52,560 --> 00:12:57,080 voice over artist. And I think she had more than 228 00:12:57,080 --> 00:13:00,760 two houses just from voice over fees. 229 00:13:01,080 --> 00:13:04,200 Anyway, I was at that time, along with everything else 230 00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:07,640 because I'm a freelance writer and I have a broader repertoire. 231 00:13:07,640 --> 00:13:11,600 Things I was producing radio commercials at at a place in 232 00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:16,280 Soho called Silk Sound And I was, you know, I was earnest and 233 00:13:16,280 --> 00:13:19,600 I tried to be polite and Miriam came in. 234 00:13:19,600 --> 00:13:24,600 I'd never met her before and I said hello Miriam, I'm John. 235 00:13:24,960 --> 00:13:26,960 Here's your script for today's session. 236 00:13:27,240 --> 00:13:31,960 And she looked at me and said, oh, what Cambridge College were 237 00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:36,520 you at? Obviously you can't see me, but 238 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:41,320 I still wonder whether that was a compliment or an insult. 239 00:13:41,320 --> 00:13:44,800 Was it a deadly assault on the fact that Oxbridge males 240 00:13:44,800 --> 00:13:46,680 dominated the entertainment industry? 241 00:13:48,560 --> 00:13:52,760 Or was it just us going, oh, you look like you got good A levels. 242 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:54,240 I will never know because I didn't. 243 00:13:54,240 --> 00:13:57,320 I was so taken aback, but I I didn't ask her. 244 00:13:58,960 --> 00:14:02,080 Well, we know she had a bit of an issue with with with males. 245 00:14:03,040 --> 00:14:04,960 God, yes, she had bloody hates her. 246 00:14:04,960 --> 00:14:07,320 Yeah, please and so on. Although she loves Great Idol 247 00:14:07,320 --> 00:14:11,080 and Michael Palin. So I think, yeah, but now we're 248 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:13,880 talking about it. I am, I'm 70 years old. 249 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:18,080 I've just outed myself as two things, an old white guy and an 250 00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:19,960 Oxbridge guy. So there's no going back from 251 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:23,400 this point? Now I've I've had, I've had a 252 00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:28,440 number of people of your yeah. Well, I mean get us now before 253 00:14:28,440 --> 00:14:30,840 they put us in museums or shoot us. 254 00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:35,000 And I say that without bitterness because I think we've 255 00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:37,640 we've had a bloody good time. We're like 5000 years of it. 256 00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:42,720 Anyway, I'm so old and white and the guy, an Oxbridge guy that I 257 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:45,520 can remember when I was in the cage, Footlights, we would sit 258 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:48,360 around us men. There's no other way word for 259 00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:50,720 it. And say what can we give the 260 00:14:50,720 --> 00:14:54,520 girl to do you know, the girl meaning the girl who was going 261 00:14:54,520 --> 00:15:00,120 to be in the review cast. And I I feel, you know the 262 00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:02,440 reason I'm saying it, it's, let's face it, it's guilt. 263 00:15:02,600 --> 00:15:06,000 There's no other word for it. I just feel bad that that's the 264 00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:10,880 way we spoke between 1972 and 1974 and maybe afterwards. 265 00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:13,600 You know, it's it's a strange thing. 266 00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:16,200 But you wouldn't have thought that at the time, no. 267 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:17,720 You didn't consciously think I'll? 268 00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:21,280 No, absolutely not. You know we're being and indeed 269 00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:26,360 they Radio 4 extra kindly repeated a sketch show I was in 270 00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:28,760 1974 called. I think it's called, It's 271 00:15:28,760 --> 00:15:29,920 called. Oh, no it isn't. 272 00:15:30,880 --> 00:15:33,560 Along with Griffiths Jones and John Lloyd and various other 273 00:15:33,560 --> 00:15:36,520 luminaries. I thought, my God, I hope they 274 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:40,520 get rid of those sketches in which we do Pakistani accents, 275 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:44,080 because of course that's just what we did, because everybody 276 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:47,160 did. Well, don't come on this podcast 277 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:53,000 talking about people doing Indian accents, Pakistani 278 00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:54,680 accents, Welsh, Pakistani accent. 279 00:15:55,960 --> 00:16:04,160 Well, Sellers and Milligan, OK, I just mentioned we'll start, I 280 00:16:04,160 --> 00:16:05,680 want to talk to you about because obviously this is a 281 00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:07,920 podcast, this tends to be about the goons and we're going to 282 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:10,120 touch on talk about that in your. 283 00:16:11,520 --> 00:16:14,200 Whatever sort of history or inspiration you have derived 284 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:17,680 from them, by the way, Miriam, The Office is is open. 285 00:16:17,760 --> 00:16:20,120 I'd love to have if you want. Because she is. 286 00:16:20,160 --> 00:16:23,040 She's getting involved with. I noticed Jane Jane Milligan, 287 00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:27,760 who I'm in contact with guests of the show, who's Spike's 288 00:16:27,760 --> 00:16:31,240 daughter. She posted something on Twitter. 289 00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:36,360 Still Twitter. Not X Twitter about a new IT 290 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:39,360 looked like an animated version of Spike's Bad Jelly the Witch 291 00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:41,600 story. I don't know if you're aware of 292 00:16:41,600 --> 00:16:43,040 Bad Jelly the Witch. No, I. 293 00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:48,640 Don't know, but but there looks to be some new version coming 294 00:16:48,640 --> 00:16:52,040 out and Miriam Margulies is going to be part of the voice 295 00:16:52,040 --> 00:16:54,440 cast, it would appear. So that's very exciting. 296 00:16:54,440 --> 00:16:59,400 So yeah, perfect excuse for Miriam to come on if you 297 00:16:59,640 --> 00:17:02,200 Absolutely, yeah. But I mentioned, obviously she's 298 00:17:02,360 --> 00:17:05,520 she's, let's face it, she's got a bit of a potty mouth, that's 299 00:17:05,680 --> 00:17:06,920 why. That's her. 300 00:17:07,400 --> 00:17:11,480 She's a filter is a filter. It's just it's down the plug 301 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:14,720 hole. The glory of Miriam is she 302 00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:18,200 never, ever had a filter, so she never had one to lose. 303 00:17:18,800 --> 00:17:23,240 So I went to the head of the of the Footlights club and said I 304 00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:25,680 haven't had an invitation and he said, oh, it's an oversight. 305 00:17:25,960 --> 00:17:33,440 I said, is it? Oh, I have to watch myself. 306 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:35,600 You're doing really well. It's such a shame because we 307 00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:36,480 love it when you. Just. 308 00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:39,760 Let I know, but it upsets some people and I don't want to upset 309 00:17:39,760 --> 00:17:42,840 people because the whole thing is life is shit at the moment. 310 00:17:42,840 --> 00:17:46,720 It really is. It's terrible and we've Oh no. 311 00:17:48,800 --> 00:17:52,440 So, so, yeah, so obviously thank you very much for for coming on 312 00:17:52,440 --> 00:17:56,200 now you've written extensively you've you've, you've. 313 00:17:56,680 --> 00:18:00,120 I've gone on record to say that you're you're happy. 314 00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:02,680 How do I put this? Happy not to be in the limelight 315 00:18:02,680 --> 00:18:05,000 yourself, but you surround yourself with comedy performers 316 00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:09,400 who interpret your work and you don't have a sort of a desire to 317 00:18:10,080 --> 00:18:12,920 be front and centre and you're no, I don't. 318 00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:16,120 I don't have a desire to be front and centre, but damn, when 319 00:18:16,120 --> 00:18:17,920 I am, I enjoy it. Oh, right. 320 00:18:18,160 --> 00:18:24,080 OK, it it goes both ways. But a friend of mine once said, 321 00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:27,560 he said you're a bit of a, you're a sort of comedy Butler. 322 00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:33,080 And you know I'll take that. I have served the great and I've 323 00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:34,720 worked with some of the greats, I've worked with some of the 324 00:18:34,720 --> 00:18:37,880 smalls and mediums, I've got to say. 325 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:41,160 And yes, it's it's been interesting from that point of 326 00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:43,280 view. Always. 327 00:18:43,360 --> 00:18:47,040 You have a voice in your head when you start to write and that 328 00:18:47,120 --> 00:18:49,880 I think for any writer, look, let's be straightforward about 329 00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:51,640 it. If you're asked if you, if Lenny 330 00:18:51,640 --> 00:18:55,160 Henry, for example, says you're going to write my next stage 331 00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:58,840 show with me my next touring show, you have two great 332 00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:01,080 advantages. You have Lenny's voice in your 333 00:19:01,080 --> 00:19:05,360 head and you have a guaranteed audience, you know, Yeah, that's 334 00:19:05,360 --> 00:19:08,000 a glorious thing. Given how often a freelance 335 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:11,400 writer will will, as it were, write blind, not knowing if 336 00:19:11,400 --> 00:19:14,200 anybody is going to care, not knowing if any producer is going 337 00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:17,560 to take it up. So that's one of the best, best 338 00:19:17,560 --> 00:19:23,040 aspects of of writing forum for well known people I must say. 339 00:19:23,520 --> 00:19:27,240 Yeah and and you've written extensively for Lenny, I gather 340 00:19:27,440 --> 00:19:32,720 over the years but you've you've done you've contributed things 341 00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:36,720 like not the 9:00 news who dares wins Les Smith and Jones. 342 00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:40,800 Big fan of a Les Smith and Jones and Smith and Jones in general. 343 00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:44,160 And also also you a script editor on. 344 00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:46,360 One of my all time favourites, A Bitter Fry and lorry. 345 00:19:46,360 --> 00:19:50,160 Oh man, I mean what is the what is the easiest job you've ever 346 00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:53,160 had? I mean the boys as we call them, 347 00:19:53,160 --> 00:19:55,240 the boys Stephen Fry and Hugh Laurie wrote. 348 00:19:55,240 --> 00:19:59,600 I think for the first series I worked on they wrote 173 349 00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:05,160 scripts, you know, together, collectively as it were, and my 350 00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:10,240 job was to read them. Obviously pick my favourites and 351 00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:13,440 work on those which. I thought needed improvement. 352 00:20:13,720 --> 00:20:17,800 An extraordinary thing about that job was every time I 353 00:20:17,800 --> 00:20:21,000 thought a script needed improvement, we'd work on it, 354 00:20:21,280 --> 00:20:26,920 improve it, and then it wouldn't make the final cut because the 355 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:31,720 boys were just so naturally adroit at writing material. 356 00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:34,240 Yeah, really. I mean, this is this is your 357 00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:35,760 money. This is taxpayers money. 358 00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:37,880 Really. I was just being paid to read 359 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:42,200 those scripts and pick my favorites because if you have to 360 00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:46,120 work on it, generally speaking it it it wasn't right. 361 00:20:46,120 --> 00:20:49,720 It just it just wasn't working. But their their hit rate was was 362 00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:55,080 phenomenal and they they were also fascinating people to work 363 00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:57,800 with because and I think this is, this is an interesting thing 364 00:20:57,800 --> 00:21:01,400 to explore with the goons and indeed with any collective, any 365 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:04,800 comedy collective. You had one who was very 366 00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:10,120 positive and sure of himself and the other who was an agoniser. 367 00:21:10,880 --> 00:21:12,480 Do you Do you want to guess which was which? 368 00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:18,640 The Agonizer was, oh, of Fry and Laurie, Yeah. 369 00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:24,400 My instinct would to be to say the Agonizer was Stephen Fry, 370 00:21:24,680 --> 00:21:27,880 but that is so interesting because you are, it's listen, 371 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:29,600 it's a one and two shot there. Tyler. 372 00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:33,120 Yeah, you had a 50% chance and you blew it because it was Hugh. 373 00:21:33,120 --> 00:21:38,640 In fact, he was desperately anxious about everything he was. 374 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:43,280 He was a phenomenal warrior and Stephen just sort of knew it 375 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:47,640 would be OK. And similarly with Mel Smith and 376 00:21:47,640 --> 00:21:50,920 Griff Reese Jones. Griff won't mind my saying 377 00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:52,280 because I've known him a very long time. 378 00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:57,160 He was feverish with anxiety. Just, I'll tell you a quick 379 00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:00,240 story about that, you know. I mean, when you do ATV show, 380 00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:05,160 you rehearse all week for it, and then on the Friday you 381 00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:07,440 record it. Now when you rehearse it, of 382 00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:10,080 course the scripts go through myriad changes. 383 00:22:10,360 --> 00:22:14,240 So there's a there's a famous story about Griff and Mel about 384 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:16,320 to go in front of the cameras on the Friday night. 385 00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:20,520 The audience is about to come in and Griff suddenly says Jeffrey. 386 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:25,040 Jeffrey Perkins, he's talking to you, a brilliant, much missed of 387 00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:29,000 the show, said Jeffrey. What happened to the line about 388 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:32,600 the pineapple and Griffin preferring to a line in a let's 389 00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:35,800 say it's a dentist sketch because you know 97% of sketches 390 00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:38,760 in the in the 70s and 80s were saying dentists waiting room 391 00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:43,960 what happened to the pineapple line and and Jeffrey said Griff 392 00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:49,800 if you remember we took that line out on draft 11:00, we put 393 00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:52,880 it back in draft 12 then we decided against it. 394 00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:56,680 So this this version which you're about to do in front of 395 00:22:56,680 --> 00:22:59,560 the audience is draft 13. So that's where the pineapple, 396 00:22:59,880 --> 00:23:01,480 the line is gone. It's gone forever. 397 00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:04,640 Now, the only point in the story is that Griff is about to go in 398 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:07,960 front of the cameras, in front of the people with all this, all 399 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:11,200 these drafts fizzing or feverishly fizzing in his mind, 400 00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:14,560 you know, like a sort of brain, a brain overdose. 401 00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:18,760 Whereas Mel Smith has not been there for all these changes to 402 00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:20,480 the script. He's not been part of that 403 00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:23,960 process. He comes in, he's relaxed, and 404 00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:28,120 he just does the lines and he does it with I I suppose some. 405 00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:30,800 I wouldn't want to say he doesn't care, that would be 406 00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:33,040 quite wrong. But he he has a natural 407 00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:35,600 relaxation about it, which made him wonderful to write for 408 00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:40,000 instantly. And he realized that he'd be 409 00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:41,440 fine. You see, he said none. 410 00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:44,680 Unlike Steven, he knew he'd be fine in front of the cameras. 411 00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:48,720 He had a natural gift. He had a very naturalistic style 412 00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:51,520 of acting. That's the reason why he was 413 00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:55,200 ever cast in not the 9:00 news, I remember John Lloyd saying. 414 00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:58,160 Not to me. I think to the world before 415 00:23:58,160 --> 00:24:00,640 that. If you had a sketch set in a, 416 00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:06,800 say, AI don't know record shop, the guy playing, because it 417 00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:09,960 tended to be a guy playing the man behind the counter would 418 00:24:09,960 --> 00:24:13,800 sort of put on a voice to say, oh hello, what would you like to 419 00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:16,240 get, you know? And but John Lloyd said the 420 00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:18,600 great thing about Mel was he'd just say, right, I'm playing a 421 00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:22,000 guy who works in a record shop. I'll just be a guy who works in 422 00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:24,160 a record shop and I'll anchor it in reality. 423 00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:27,200 And as a consequence, he was an absolute natural. 424 00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:30,280 Yeah, say the famous Gerald sketch. 425 00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:32,600 Yeah, yeah. Well, you know he's playing the 426 00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:35,680 the anthropologist. You watch that and you think 427 00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:39,640 this is, this is delightful. Just how how real this is and 428 00:24:39,640 --> 00:24:44,000 how you know it's a it's a natural comedy under player you 429 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:46,520 know and that. Yeah, it's those the home 430 00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:49,920 videos, the homemade video strand of sketches that they 431 00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:52,720 used to do when I don't know if you remember those, but. 432 00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:56,520 I don't know. Third, fourth series of 433 00:24:56,520 --> 00:24:58,760 Elizabeth and Jones. There would always be a there's 434 00:24:58,760 --> 00:25:02,920 a recurring gag of this, this dysfunctional family of which 435 00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:06,040 Griff was the father and there was a mother, and there was this 436 00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:10,280 teenage son who played by Nigel Harman, who went on to play 437 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:15,720 dirty, dense son in EastEnders. You know what is the buried, 438 00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:16,680 don't you? This is great. 439 00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:20,640 Yeah, but but it was a dysfunctional family, Terrible 440 00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:23,000 family. Just terrible, you know, Awful 441 00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:27,280 family. But you had also Mel playing Len 442 00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:30,840 the Lodger, right? And it was just a slob. 443 00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:35,320 It just a just a slob. And he was so the the 444 00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:37,040 insuchants, I think that's the only word. 445 00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:39,080 The Insucians, yeah. Yeah. 446 00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:44,680 And also can I just, I just want to point out for any lady 447 00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:49,320 listeners who didn't know him that his reputation as a slob 448 00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:53,120 was overstated. By which I mean he was very, he 449 00:25:53,120 --> 00:25:57,480 was a very attractive man, had a lovely voice and a lovely way of 450 00:25:57,680 --> 00:26:00,360 a lovely relaxed way of being in the room and and looking at 451 00:26:00,360 --> 00:26:03,880 people as they spoke. So I think he's been unfairly 452 00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:07,200 maligned as a sort of, you know, yeah, but he was happy. 453 00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:10,960 He was happy enough to play on that stereotype, wasn't he? 454 00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:15,120 Of the the, the wino. Clive, this is Roger. 455 00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:40,160 Hello Roger. Come on in, help yourself to a 456 00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:42,640 drink, I expect. You know where it is. 457 00:26:57,200 --> 00:27:01,360 Because Griff was on the show many, many months ago, and he he 458 00:27:01,360 --> 00:27:03,520 pretty much. He didn't tell me the pineapple 459 00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:08,360 story, he told me, he told me similar ones where, yeah, he's. 460 00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:11,240 He's there. He was quite open about the fact 461 00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:15,400 that he was very anal and very, yes, across everything. 462 00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:18,440 Yes, that's right. And then Mel had been out, I 463 00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:22,680 don't know, maybe at the the bookmakers and he turned up and 464 00:27:23,360 --> 00:27:26,280 hit every mark basically, yes, absolutely. 465 00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:30,760 He he just at whatever state he was in, he could deliver. 466 00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:35,400 Well, it reminded me of the of the story they say about Laurel 467 00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:42,560 and Hardy, where Stan Laurel was in charge of overseeing scripts 468 00:27:42,560 --> 00:27:44,720 and yes, and and the production and. 469 00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:48,600 He'd be checking the the, the stage and the scenery the, you 470 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,560 know, he'd be before filming. He'd be there like hours before 471 00:27:51,560 --> 00:27:54,560 making sure that everything was set up and and then Oliver Hardy 472 00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:57,680 would turn up, having been on the golf course and he'd just 473 00:27:57,680 --> 00:27:59,440 turn up at the last minute and do his bit. 474 00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:03,280 And then it's amazing and you can't, you can't kind of change 475 00:28:03,280 --> 00:28:06,320 your nature in that in that way. You'd think after a while that 476 00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:09,200 the head of worry would go. Now I'm going to delegate some 477 00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:12,040 of this worry. But no, no, It happened when you 478 00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:16,360 were probably a little child, that urge to control and to 479 00:28:16,360 --> 00:28:20,680 worry and to be anxious. And it cannot be. 480 00:28:21,360 --> 00:28:23,560 It can't be. You can't delete it. 481 00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:25,160 Yeah. No, no. 482 00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:28,800 And I want to come back to certainly want to come back to 483 00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:31,440 Fry and Laurie a little bit later, if not Mel and Griff as 484 00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:35,320 well. But I'll let's just talk about 485 00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:38,840 your early life. I suppose you're his. 486 00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:41,680 You see, you've you've openly admitted to being 70. 487 00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:47,760 So how do you you would have kind of maybe heard the last 488 00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:49,400 couple of series of The Goon Show on radio. 489 00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:53,360 Well, I was thinking about that and there isn't Listen to 490 00:28:53,360 --> 00:28:57,920 comedian or comedy writer of my vintage who goes on a pod or 491 00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:00,880 goes to a dinner party or even chats to someone in the Co-op 492 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:06,320 without saying what they listen to under the bedclothes as their 493 00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:09,480 first kind of excavation for comedy gold. 494 00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:12,480 And with me it was, I'm sorry, I'll read that again. 495 00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:16,640 I was born in 1953, so that would have been I think early 496 00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:23,440 60s, maybe 1962, three 60s. So I'm just kind of post post 497 00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:27,200 goons, but I hope it's OK to talk about it. 498 00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:29,040 Now. We're on the subject of the 499 00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:34,480 goons, but my absolute favorite. I never met Milligan, Salas or 500 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:39,720 Sikkim, but I did go to a venue in the West of London. 501 00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:43,080 I think it was a Commonwealth institute actually in the 70s. 502 00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:47,160 To see Spike Milligan reading from his children's books. 503 00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:50,520 And what I remember from that occasion, there must have been 504 00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:53,680 maybe 70 of us just sitting in a small room listening to him 505 00:29:53,680 --> 00:29:57,160 reading. At the end we we applauded so 506 00:29:57,160 --> 00:30:00,920 loudly that he said thank you, he said. 507 00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:04,920 I like loving people and I like people to love me. 508 00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,760 And when I said out loud, it sounds like the cheesiest thing 509 00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:12,080 that anybody could say before they broke into my way or 510 00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:14,160 something. But it's completely 511 00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:17,160 unselfconscious and completely earned, if that's the word. 512 00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:18,640 You know what I mean? We really did. 513 00:30:19,080 --> 00:30:22,240 We really did love the man, so I can never quite think of him 514 00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:25,720 without remembering that. And also my father-in-law, whom 515 00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:28,800 I, whom I really adored, Peter Nappa. 516 00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:32,400 He was a head teacher and a very benevolent man. 517 00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:36,800 And he's absolute favorite poem was nothing by Keats or 518 00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:38,720 Wordsworth. But it was one of spikes and 519 00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:41,800 you'll all know it. So maybe you like to say it 520 00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:45,400 along with me at home. There are holes in the sky where 521 00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:48,280 the rain gets in, but they're ever so small. 522 00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:54,800 That's why rain is thin, you know, Just imagine that with the 523 00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:58,800 put your in with us at Glasgow with the arms aloft, waving them 524 00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:01,560 slow, just like no girlfriends sitting on our shoulders. 525 00:31:01,560 --> 00:31:04,200 I don't have a girlfriend. I I just want my wife to know 526 00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:06,080 that. Yeah, you know what I mean, It's 527 00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:10,520 just so it's just so touching. Also other references to Spike, 528 00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:14,600 my friend Roy McGrath, whom you may remember from. 529 00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:18,440 They certainly do, yeah. Roy is absolute. 530 00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:22,280 Roy is a very, very Milligan influenced writer. 531 00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:27,120 When I first met him as a radio writer, he he was, he was very, 532 00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:32,560 very gifted as a kind of word play man and it's absolute 533 00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:36,200 favorite joke again said along with me and maybe maybe Tyler, 534 00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:37,320 you'll know where this comes from. 535 00:31:37,320 --> 00:31:39,680 It's definitely one of spikes and it goes like this. 536 00:31:40,840 --> 00:31:43,840 The curtains were drawn, but the furniture was real. 537 00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:49,480 Do you know where that's from? It sounds Milligan Esque. 538 00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:51,200 I can't play. It's definitely Milligan 539 00:31:51,280 --> 00:31:54,040 because, Rory said sober. But it's so beautiful. 540 00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:57,800 I just, I just love it. It's just sort of the perfect. 541 00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:00,880 It's it's typical Milligan, isn't it? 542 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:04,480 But the the shift, it's the fewest words in the most effect. 543 00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:06,600 I absolutely, absolutely love it. 544 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:09,720 And the other thing I want to say about Spike, in retrospect, 545 00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:13,160 I was thinking back on the comedians that I used to watch 546 00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:18,600 on television in the 60s, and I'm thinking particularly Les 547 00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:22,960 Dawson, Frankie Howard, Tommy Cooper. 548 00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:26,480 I mean all great comedians. But I'm thinking that that 549 00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:28,960 they're of their time for a particular reason. 550 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:32,920 First of all, none of those comedians amazingly wrote a 551 00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:36,640 single children's book, which now everybody does. 552 00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:39,200 If you're a comedian, you write children's books. 553 00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:42,080 And as we know, David Williams has made an extraordinary 554 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:45,240 success of it. Well, of course Lenny's just 555 00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:49,160 written written more than one, so he kind of spike kind of 556 00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:51,920 changed the template to what a comedian might be. 557 00:32:51,920 --> 00:32:54,880 Because the other thing that I keep thinking about when I think 558 00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:58,840 of Spike Milligan is his extraordinary espousal of green 559 00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:01,560 courses. And we're talking in the 1960s. 560 00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:03,280 It's way ahead of the curve, sure. 561 00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:05,000 Yeah. And the. 562 00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:07,000 But there's I suppose it's for good. 563 00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:12,000 And I'll you know, we expect our comedians now to not just to be 564 00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:16,960 funny, but to contribute their, contribute their ideas, their 565 00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:20,440 political ideas, that certainly their charity, they must do 566 00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:22,400 charity work, which is of course great. 567 00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:26,400 But I sometimes sort of get a little bit confused when I see a 568 00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:29,280 comedian doing charity work because I think, well, I've met 569 00:33:29,280 --> 00:33:32,920 you and I know you're not even not charitable. 570 00:33:32,920 --> 00:33:37,120 But do you know what I mean? It's a complicated matter, isn't 571 00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:38,320 it? Because they're doing good for 572 00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:40,840 the world and the people for whom they're doing good are not 573 00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:44,520 going to say, well, actually that guy's what Miriam Margulies 574 00:33:44,520 --> 00:33:48,600 would call a beep. You know, what do you want? 575 00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:50,440 This is? It's difficult, isn't it? 576 00:33:50,440 --> 00:33:53,240 It's unconfidence. Absolutely. 577 00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:55,080 I mean, Spike was a pioneer in so many. 578 00:33:55,240 --> 00:34:00,200 Absolutely, Yeah. Also, the other thing I think 579 00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:03,640 about when I think about him and this is going to sound weird, 580 00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:08,159 but I don't care, is he was a very, very, he was kind of a 581 00:34:08,159 --> 00:34:10,679 beautiful man. And there's not, there aren't 582 00:34:10,679 --> 00:34:17,159 many British comedians who I think are lovely to look at for 583 00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:20,080 an extended period of time. I don't know whether you can 584 00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:24,560 think of any Rick mail. Steve. 585 00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:26,120 Steve Coogan, I suppose in his post. 586 00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:29,000 Oh, wow, that's so interesting. Steve. 587 00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:31,520 Yes. I don't. 588 00:34:31,719 --> 00:34:36,239 Yeah, I don't think he's a patch on, but I love how gay this is 589 00:34:36,239 --> 00:34:37,800 getting. I don't think he's a patch on. 590 00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:40,440 I mean, I wouldn't kick him out of bed, but then I wouldn't 591 00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:43,280 invite him into bed and he wouldn't be interested and that 592 00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:44,800 would be disaster because neither of us would be 593 00:34:44,800 --> 00:34:45,320 interested. They. 594 00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:47,679 'D just be an embarrassing silence, wouldn't they? 595 00:34:47,679 --> 00:34:49,199 It would be terrible. How do we get here? 596 00:34:49,199 --> 00:34:51,600 How do we get to this bedroom, Steve? 597 00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:55,560 I don't even know you man. Yeah, but I do think, yes, Rick, 598 00:34:56,960 --> 00:35:00,960 Rick and Spike had a kind of a real they they're really 599 00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:05,880 wonderful looking people. And it occurs to me, I recently, 600 00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:09,000 I went to the Edinburgh Festival last year and I'm not talking 601 00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:10,880 about beauty now, but I'm talking about something else. 602 00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:14,160 If you go and see a stand up comic, you're you're there for 603 00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:16,680 an hour. And I I'll probably get 604 00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:19,720 cancelled for saying this, but it actually matters quite a lot 605 00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:22,400 what they look like because you know, that's what you're going 606 00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:24,560 to have to look at for the next hour. 607 00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:25,880 You can have a look at their faces. 608 00:35:25,880 --> 00:35:28,000 So you must be, you must be drawn. 609 00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:31,480 You know you must be happy to watch that face for an hour. 610 00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:34,160 Yeah, I. I know what you say. 611 00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:37,280 I mean Spike, people listening to this might be scratching 612 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:39,960 their head saying, well, that white haired bearded man. 613 00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:44,200 Oh no, he used to wear Hitler moustache in the Q series was 614 00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:48,240 but Spike in his youth, or certainly during the war and 615 00:35:48,240 --> 00:35:51,120 into the early days of the Goon Show, he was. 616 00:35:52,040 --> 00:35:54,640 Like matinee idol. Absolutely right. 617 00:35:54,840 --> 00:35:57,000 Absolutely right. And I think women loved him. 618 00:35:57,040 --> 00:36:02,480 And putting on my Miriam Margulies hat, What a, that's a 619 00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:04,360 terrible image. Miriam Margulies hat. 620 00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:08,080 One of the things I think is extraordinary, just just just 621 00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:11,520 about times being different. I saw Spike on a talk show. 622 00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:16,640 I can't remember what it was. And he was asked about his first 623 00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:18,520 wife. And I think the question was 624 00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:20,680 tell us about your first wife. It was. 625 00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:24,240 And he said, well, I married my first wife because I wanted to 626 00:36:24,240 --> 00:36:26,400 see her breasts. And I thought, what an 627 00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:30,040 extraordinary thing to say. Firstly because it's true. 628 00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:34,360 And secondly, what a, what a, what a kind of how, how lucky 629 00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:38,040 are we of different later generations that we can see 630 00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:41,440 people's breasts without marrying them, You know, that's 631 00:36:41,720 --> 00:36:44,200 saved a lot of human misery. I put it to you. 632 00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:46,640 He said. He said variations of that over 633 00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:48,120 the years. Oh good, he oh good. 634 00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:50,560 I'm glad it wasn't just a sort of bizarre one or. 635 00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:54,360 Yeah, but no. But he spike was definitely a a 636 00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:58,960 boob man. We we know that you don't have 637 00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:05,920 to choose, Spike. No, he he. 638 00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:08,440 Yeah, I'm sure. He was interviewed by Doctor 639 00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:10,840 Anthony Clare. Oh yes, I love that show. 640 00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:13,600 In the psychiatrist's chair many, many years ago, obviously 641 00:37:13,600 --> 00:37:17,600 the early 80s or mid 80s, yeah, and I'm sure on that, Sure, he 642 00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:18,840 said. On that something about. 643 00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:22,520 I married my first wife. That's where I got it from. 644 00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:23,880 Yeah. Yeah, I married my first wife 645 00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:25,760 because she had big boobs and I didn't. 646 00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:28,240 Or something like that. Something like, yeah, you have 647 00:37:28,240 --> 00:37:29,840 to make a joke out of it, Spider. 648 00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:32,800 We can see through that. We know you're using it using 649 00:37:32,960 --> 00:37:34,520 humor to distances from the truth. 650 00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:36,360 You got married around this time? 651 00:37:37,120 --> 00:37:39,200 Yes, I did, actually. The girl. 652 00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:41,360 I was mad. Girl proposed to me. 653 00:37:41,880 --> 00:37:43,720 So will you marry me? And I thought, I don't want to 654 00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:45,800 disappoint it, so I said yes. Had you known her long? 655 00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:48,480 Oh, I'd known her about a year. I think it was physical love, 656 00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:50,960 though. She had big boobs and I didn't. 657 00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:53,920 Can I just say one final spike thing, which I used to this day? 658 00:37:55,240 --> 00:37:58,840 I don't know how people are on the Q series. 659 00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:01,600 I mean the BBC, as far as I know. 660 00:38:01,600 --> 00:38:03,880 You'll know better, Tyler. I don't, I don't think. 661 00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:06,400 I don't think they've repeated them, have they? 662 00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:10,160 Yeah, that it has. BBC Four did like a clip show or 663 00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:14,680 a compilation and and it's, I mean we've covered it recently 664 00:38:14,680 --> 00:38:18,120 on this show, two parts episode we talked about. 665 00:38:19,640 --> 00:38:23,640 Myself and guest watched 5 episodes of Q, Didn't watch at 666 00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:26,600 all, but it is available. All of it, or most of it's 667 00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:30,200 available on DVD. How did it hold up? 668 00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:34,640 Like, a bit like Monty Python's Flying Circus. 669 00:38:34,720 --> 00:38:36,960 Oh, right. A big, a big chunk of it doesn't 670 00:38:36,960 --> 00:38:39,400 hold up and it's kind of a lot of dress in there. 671 00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:41,720 Yeah, it's and it's not. I'm not just talking. 672 00:38:41,720 --> 00:38:44,160 I mean, there's a there's quite a bit of blackface and stuff 673 00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:44,920 like that. Yeah, sure. 674 00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:48,360 But there's also just stuff that just goes on too long. 675 00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:52,760 Yeah, you know, in, as I think I said at the time, I think in 676 00:38:52,760 --> 00:38:56,480 amongst the the Dreck, there's a lot of beauty and there's some 677 00:38:56,480 --> 00:39:01,280 great, great sketches. There's some hilarious stuff in 678 00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:03,720 queue, Yes. Well, but you're going to say 679 00:39:03,720 --> 00:39:05,400 something about queue. No, it's only there's just a 680 00:39:05,680 --> 00:39:08,960 single line that I've remembered from about 1969. 681 00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:12,160 I still use it to this day. The doorbell rings. 682 00:39:12,440 --> 00:39:16,640 Spike goes to the door, opens the door, welcomes the guests 683 00:39:16,680 --> 00:39:21,280 into his hall and says excuse the mess, we've got the 684 00:39:21,280 --> 00:39:24,280 conservatives in. That's it. 685 00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:26,960 And it just try it. Let's try it. 686 00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:30,640 You may not have more than a year to to use that gag, but 687 00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:33,720 it's it is a beautiful gag. I I don't know whether you've 688 00:39:33,720 --> 00:39:36,400 talked on the part about Son of Oblomov. 689 00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:38,440 You know that about? That I do know of. 690 00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:39,480 We haven't talked about it though. 691 00:39:39,480 --> 00:39:40,920 No. Oh well, I saw it. 692 00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:46,720 It ran in the late 60s at the what's now called the Harold 693 00:39:46,720 --> 00:39:48,640 Pinter Theatre. That was then called the Comedy 694 00:39:48,640 --> 00:39:53,440 Theatre, which was a stage version of the Goncharov story 695 00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:56,840 about a man who refuses to get out of bed. 696 00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:01,400 It's, I mean, it's a great, fascinating story. 697 00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:04,360 I'm kind of perfect for a comedian because obviously he's 698 00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:07,880 bed bound and that means all the attention he's drawn to him. 699 00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:13,560 Anyway, the show was renamed Son of Oblomov for the simple reason 700 00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:18,480 that Spike refused. Either refused or couldn't stick 701 00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:22,440 to the script. So basically it was over the 702 00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:27,520 course of the performances, there was maybe 15% Gunter off 703 00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:32,960 an 85% spike, and it was a fantastic night out in the 704 00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:36,240 theatre for everyone. Except I thought even at 16, you 705 00:40:36,240 --> 00:40:40,880 know, except for his fellow actors, because it's not easy 706 00:40:40,880 --> 00:40:45,240 being on stage with someone who could and would do anything. 707 00:40:45,240 --> 00:40:47,520 You know, you're not, you obviously have to go with the 708 00:40:47,520 --> 00:40:51,560 flow, but it's it, it was testing, you know, it was 709 00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:54,480 difficult, yeah, there to be stooges. 710 00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:57,520 And you know, you got to feel for actors because that's 711 00:40:58,320 --> 00:41:00,680 they're, you know, they're trained to inhabit a character 712 00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:06,360 And they went on and of course they were just mercifully had 713 00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:12,840 the piss taken over them. I can't remember who were his Co 714 00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:16,160 stars in that, but I think he would. 715 00:41:16,720 --> 00:41:19,520 John Bluthor would usually be one of his. 716 00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:22,320 He surrounded himself with people who were very good at 717 00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:26,400 bouncing off his shifts. So John Bluthor was one. 718 00:41:27,080 --> 00:41:32,640 People like David Lodge. People like even Valentine Dyle, 719 00:41:32,640 --> 00:41:33,720 would you believe? Oh, right. 720 00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:37,040 Yeah. But you, because you were 721 00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:41,280 president of Footlights. Yeah, the early 70s at 722 00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:42,920 Cambridge. Now you know, Spike. 723 00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:48,520 Famously, well, famously, Around In Our Circles, In My circles, 724 00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:54,560 he recorded or he appeared in a two man show at Cambridge, 725 00:41:56,080 --> 00:42:01,880 performed, performed a couple of hours worth of stories, songs, 726 00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:05,720 poems, jokes. He and a South African musician 727 00:42:05,720 --> 00:42:07,720 called Jeremy Taylor. Yes, I've heard. 728 00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:10,960 Yes, I've heard. That was 73. 729 00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:13,280 Well, that's when. Damn, I missed it. 730 00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:14,960 I wish you'd get in the TARDIS and go back. 731 00:42:14,960 --> 00:42:16,240 I was. That was a student there. 732 00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:19,760 Oh damn. Yeah, but I would have, I would 733 00:42:19,760 --> 00:42:22,400 have put money on the put, put me house on the fact you'd have 734 00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:25,120 been there. But yeah, I'm so disappointed. 735 00:42:25,760 --> 00:42:29,640 Maybe you're off squaring or something in the Oh no, I want 736 00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:31,960 to go back to 73. I want to speak Tamsin. 737 00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:33,600 Hail again. Tamsin. 738 00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:36,120 I don't know what happened with us, but if you listen to this, 739 00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:41,320 don't get in touch because too much water is flown flown under 740 00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:44,080 too many. 50 years, 50 years, 50 years, 50 years, man. 741 00:42:44,160 --> 00:42:47,320 Yeah. And what about, OK, I know you 742 00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:50,160 never, obviously, you've seen, you've seen Spike, you haven't 743 00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:51,200 met him, but you've seen him. Yeah. 744 00:42:52,680 --> 00:42:55,280 Were you a fan of of of the work of Peter Sellers? 745 00:42:56,320 --> 00:42:59,200 That's such a good question. The answer is yes or no. 746 00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:04,120 Clearly there's some astonishing achievements. 747 00:43:04,240 --> 00:43:08,200 And never mind the goods. I'm thinking particularly of 748 00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:10,880 Doctor Strangelove. I mean one of the things I 749 00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:16,600 admire so much about Sellers is there is so few British, there's 750 00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:20,760 so little British comic talent that's been able to conquer 751 00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:24,680 America and the world to make movies. 752 00:43:25,280 --> 00:43:28,680 And I really, I mean, you know let's let's, let's, let's talk 753 00:43:28,680 --> 00:43:30,440 about them. I mean from from the later 754 00:43:30,440 --> 00:43:33,720 generations, yours and mine. I can really, I I. 755 00:43:33,960 --> 00:43:36,680 You take your hat off to Sacha Baron Coe. 756 00:43:37,520 --> 00:43:39,840 Yeah. Made movies that have been 757 00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:43,440 global. I I also take my hat off to to 758 00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:47,480 Steve Coogan he's an extraordinary film career. 759 00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:51,720 And to Armando Yanucci for doing Death of Stalin and so on. 760 00:43:52,440 --> 00:43:55,160 And also to Edgar Wright, because I I think Simon. 761 00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:58,760 Simon Pegg, of course. And Simon Pegg. 762 00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:01,680 Simon Pegg, absolutely. He's hanging out with Tom Cruise 763 00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:04,520 as we speak. Doesn't like to talk about it, 764 00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:06,880 though. Doesn't like to talk about it. 765 00:44:07,560 --> 00:44:11,920 Oh, not even to Tom. No, Simon Simon Pegg famously, 766 00:44:11,920 --> 00:44:14,120 is very reticent when it comes to talking about his friendship 767 00:44:14,120 --> 00:44:17,040 with Tom Cruise. Yes, I'm saying that with a wry 768 00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:19,320 smile on my face. Yes, quite. 769 00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:25,000 I think future generations will probably find out why. 770 00:44:25,320 --> 00:44:29,760 But listen, we move on to say, yeah, that that Sellers film 771 00:44:29,760 --> 00:44:34,280 career has the most phenomenal heights, never mind the early 772 00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:36,080 British. I'm All right Jack Films. 773 00:44:36,680 --> 00:44:41,000 To have made both Strangelove and and being there is is a 774 00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:45,120 fantastic achievement. But then I don't know whether 775 00:44:45,120 --> 00:44:47,840 you ever saw Do you know the actor Simon Williams? 776 00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:49,400 I certainly do. Yeah. 777 00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:51,680 Fine actor. He, I saw him on television 778 00:44:52,000 --> 00:44:53,320 talking about. I think he was in one of the 779 00:44:53,320 --> 00:44:58,640 final tube. The fiendish plot of Doctor Fu 780 00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:03,400 Manchu Sellers, I knew you'd know well, he was in it. 781 00:45:03,400 --> 00:45:06,400 And he, I remember seeing him talking on television about it 782 00:45:06,400 --> 00:45:09,320 and he said, you know, I was in my trailer. 783 00:45:09,320 --> 00:45:12,320 He probably shared his trailer. Actually, he said I was in my 784 00:45:12,320 --> 00:45:15,280 trailer. We had a scene scheduled for the 785 00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:17,360 afternoon. I'm ready to, I'm ready to go 786 00:45:17,360 --> 00:45:18,160 on. You know, I'm ready. 787 00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:22,720 And then the word comes to my trailer, you know, from the SEC, 788 00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:24,720 you know, from the second assistant director, third 789 00:45:24,720 --> 00:45:28,200 assistant director. Peter can't do the scene this 790 00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:32,480 afternoon because he is. I think it was his astrologer or 791 00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:34,920 astrologist don't even know the word. 792 00:45:35,200 --> 00:45:38,720 Anyway, the person who reads, yeah, sees the stars, reads the 793 00:45:38,720 --> 00:45:43,960 stars, has decreed that this is not a good afternoon for Peter 794 00:45:45,040 --> 00:45:47,960 to do a scene. And if you think about that just 795 00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:51,760 on a person, on a kind of what I might call a humane level, and 796 00:45:51,760 --> 00:45:54,000 I'm speaking as one of the, you know, I'm speaking as a kind of 797 00:45:54,000 --> 00:45:58,000 supporting act backroom boy. I mean, it's kind of 798 00:45:58,000 --> 00:46:00,560 intolerable, isn't it? And it just makes me sad to 799 00:46:00,560 --> 00:46:05,120 think about his greatness at the same time as having to think 800 00:46:05,120 --> 00:46:08,960 about stuff like that. The little, the tiniest things 801 00:46:08,960 --> 00:46:12,000 would trigger Sellers and and it could have been something as 802 00:46:12,000 --> 00:46:13,680 simple. It could have been that somebody 803 00:46:13,680 --> 00:46:17,440 in the somebody was in the vicinity of the film set, you 804 00:46:17,440 --> 00:46:20,640 know, maybe within 5 miles who was wearing a purple raincoat. 805 00:46:20,720 --> 00:46:24,640 Oh yes, yeah, I just read that. Perhaps it was on X Twitter X 806 00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:28,200 Goldie Hawn talking about that very thing appearing. 807 00:46:28,560 --> 00:46:32,040 There's there's a girl in my suit saying, wearing purple, 808 00:46:32,040 --> 00:46:35,840 wearing a purple trouser suit, being told that it was the 809 00:46:35,840 --> 00:46:38,920 colour that Sellers hated. If Sellers got wind of someone 810 00:46:38,920 --> 00:46:42,560 wearing purple even, you know, just the one of the catering 811 00:46:42,560 --> 00:46:44,880 staff, that was it. But no, there's a nice twist to 812 00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:49,480 that story because according to the story Goldie Hall tells, he 813 00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:53,040 arrived, saw in the purple suit and said, my God, but you look 814 00:46:53,040 --> 00:46:57,840 lovely, which is a quote from the script so good on him. 815 00:46:57,840 --> 00:47:02,400 He covered it up. Nevertheless, it's it's painful 816 00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:06,240 to think. It's painful to think about him 817 00:47:06,240 --> 00:47:10,520 in the context of stories like that because I know actors are 818 00:47:10,520 --> 00:47:14,760 insecure and but you know there's still there are what You 819 00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:19,240 know there might be 150 people depended on you for doing that 820 00:47:19,240 --> 00:47:21,400 scene and it's just such a shame. 821 00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:24,480 You know it's so. I think there were little. 822 00:47:24,880 --> 00:47:28,000 Indications of him A being not well physically and B being 823 00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:30,640 pretty off the wall inside his head. 824 00:47:30,640 --> 00:47:34,600 Pretty flaky. A good day was great, but a bad 825 00:47:34,600 --> 00:47:38,800 day was just horrible. I knew he. 826 00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:40,360 He stopped us all. We all had to go and have a 827 00:47:40,360 --> 00:47:42,720 vitamin B12 injection, he said. There's no energy in the seal, 828 00:47:42,760 --> 00:47:44,880 it's just not working. We all had to go and have this 829 00:47:44,920 --> 00:47:49,240 wretched vitamin injection. He was as mad as a snake. 830 00:47:50,200 --> 00:47:54,200 Yeah, I tried to. What's the word? 831 00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:57,440 Divorce the band from the from the art, as they say. 832 00:47:57,520 --> 00:48:00,640 Yes, I know that's got harder in recent times, but. 833 00:48:00,760 --> 00:48:01,800 It it has. It has. 834 00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:05,320 And look, you know we're all fans I'm sure you are of The 835 00:48:05,320 --> 00:48:08,440 Beatles and but you've we've heard the stories about John 836 00:48:08,440 --> 00:48:12,200 Lennon's behavior sometimes. Have you had a chance to listen? 837 00:48:12,360 --> 00:48:14,080 Because the day that we're recording this, it's the day 838 00:48:14,080 --> 00:48:16,840 after Now and then, Now and then I have listened. 839 00:48:17,240 --> 00:48:21,200 And it did make me well up for, for a curious reason, actually. 840 00:48:21,480 --> 00:48:25,520 It made me well up when I heard the guitar and I thought, oh, 841 00:48:25,520 --> 00:48:27,960 that's George. And then I read that it wasn't, 842 00:48:28,200 --> 00:48:32,680 it was Paul Paul playing in the in the style of George and that 843 00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:35,520 that tone, that that, that George tone. 844 00:48:35,960 --> 00:48:38,040 And then of course I loved it. But it's not. 845 00:48:38,920 --> 00:48:42,920 I can't pretend it's not. Perhaps it's the I wish that the 846 00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:45,280 verbal hook was stronger, you know, I don't think now and 847 00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:48,920 then. It's sort of gets you like like 848 00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:53,520 a great hook does, you know? But I know it's wonderful to 849 00:48:53,520 --> 00:48:54,520 hear. Yes. 850 00:48:54,720 --> 00:48:56,680 Yeah. Very, very emotionally moving. 851 00:48:58,040 --> 00:49:02,280 And yeah, I I like it. I I I certainly prefer it to 852 00:49:03,520 --> 00:49:06,920 real love from Yes. Or free free. 853 00:49:07,000 --> 00:49:08,640 Free is a bird I like that you like. 854 00:49:08,760 --> 00:49:10,280 Free is a bird. That's OK That's OK. 855 00:49:10,280 --> 00:49:15,360 Yeah. But OK, well, I've got, yeah, I 856 00:49:15,360 --> 00:49:18,480 do want to talk about, as I say, want to talk about some of the 857 00:49:18,480 --> 00:49:20,640 people, some of the work I've been with. 858 00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:24,600 You, as you sort of said at the beginning, you know, your 859 00:49:24,600 --> 00:49:29,320 friendship with with Douglas Adams is yeah, as well as well 860 00:49:29,320 --> 00:49:31,240 known. You lived with him for a number 861 00:49:31,240 --> 00:49:33,200 of years and then did and then did. 862 00:49:33,200 --> 00:49:36,400 Was it just a case that he got married and you had to vacate? 863 00:49:36,400 --> 00:49:39,960 Was that what happened? You know, I lived with him in 864 00:49:40,320 --> 00:49:44,480 just off the Holloway Road and then we moved to Highbury New 865 00:49:44,480 --> 00:49:49,560 Park and then I think it just, you know, I'm struggling to 866 00:49:49,560 --> 00:49:51,320 remember. I think I'd simply moved out 867 00:49:51,320 --> 00:49:55,400 because I felt we'd been together, you know? 868 00:49:55,640 --> 00:50:03,200 40 years and it didn't feel a day too long oh so hilarious. 869 00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:10,480 The the story I remember was such affection is one day in 870 00:50:10,480 --> 00:50:14,320 about, I suppose about 1981 or two, Douglas said. 871 00:50:14,720 --> 00:50:16,720 I'm just going to the off license to buy. 872 00:50:17,600 --> 00:50:20,360 I just want to get a can of Coca-Cola said OK, see you in a 873 00:50:20,360 --> 00:50:23,640 minute, you know, And he came back. 874 00:50:23,640 --> 00:50:28,200 He was a very big man, 6 foot five, and he was holding, I kid 875 00:50:28,200 --> 00:50:33,160 you not, 144 cans of coke and these, you know, these giant, 876 00:50:33,480 --> 00:50:36,680 Giant, yeah. And he said to me, look, I went 877 00:50:36,680 --> 00:50:38,640 to he was. So he was childlike and 878 00:50:38,640 --> 00:50:40,520 excitable in a very endearing way. 879 00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:42,960 Sometimes, he said. Look, I've just been to the off 880 00:50:42,960 --> 00:50:48,480 licence and I realized I've made enough money now I can buy. 881 00:50:49,000 --> 00:50:50,320 I don't have to buy a can of Coke. 882 00:50:50,320 --> 00:50:53,360 I can buy 12 dozen. That's what he did. 883 00:50:53,720 --> 00:50:56,920 And lazy time. I don't even drink Coke, so he 884 00:50:56,920 --> 00:51:00,320 must have drunk more. It's good going, carrying, 885 00:51:00,320 --> 00:51:02,240 lugging that from the yeah, yeah it was. 886 00:51:02,240 --> 00:51:06,440 It was an impressive sight. Almost as impressive as I went 887 00:51:06,440 --> 00:51:14,000 on holiday with him in 1978 to Corfu and two we used to oh God, 888 00:51:14,000 --> 00:51:15,400 it's so embarrassing. But why? 889 00:51:15,440 --> 00:51:18,520 Why does why do you feel later in life obliged to tell 890 00:51:18,520 --> 00:51:22,120 embarrassing stories? We used to sit outside Taverna's 891 00:51:22,600 --> 00:51:25,920 and play. He'd play Simon and Garfunkel's 892 00:51:26,160 --> 00:51:28,360 the Boxer. He was a huge Paul Simon fan on 893 00:51:28,800 --> 00:51:31,920 the guitar. And we would, we would sing the 894 00:51:31,920 --> 00:51:37,760 boxer with me supplying, you know, 57% accurate harmonies in 895 00:51:37,760 --> 00:51:39,320 the hope of, you know, meeting girls. 896 00:51:39,920 --> 00:51:43,800 And we didn't meet one girl and she liked us both and sort of by 897 00:51:43,800 --> 00:51:45,320 the same token, like neither of us. 898 00:51:46,520 --> 00:51:50,280 But on that holiday I saw what no one else in history has ever 899 00:51:50,280 --> 00:51:54,320 seen, which is I was with Douglas on a on a nudist beach 900 00:51:54,640 --> 00:51:58,960 and I watched him coming out of the water, just clad, just clad 901 00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:02,120 only in snorkel and flippers. And it was. 902 00:52:02,160 --> 00:52:05,160 I tell you ladies, it was quite a sight. 903 00:52:05,640 --> 00:52:10,520 The correlation between height and and male girth or male 904 00:52:10,520 --> 00:52:13,800 length is but damn, it was confounding. 905 00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:17,000 It was one of those times when you feel glad you're not a lady. 906 00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:20,400 I have to say, OK. Didn't you? 907 00:52:20,400 --> 00:52:22,040 Speaking of ladies, I read something. 908 00:52:22,600 --> 00:52:26,200 Oh, yeah, you wrote something I read when you said that your 909 00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:27,600 mother used when you were living with Douglas. 910 00:52:27,600 --> 00:52:30,080 Your mother would often phone, but not to talk to you. 911 00:52:30,120 --> 00:52:32,640 Or she'd She'd talk to you, but she'd only want to find out what 912 00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:35,160 Douglas had been up to. Oh man, thanks. 913 00:52:35,480 --> 00:52:37,080 Thanks for bringing that up. I love. 914 00:52:37,080 --> 00:52:40,880 I love free therapy. Yeah, that was a feature. 915 00:52:40,880 --> 00:52:42,720 I mean, that was a feature of my mother. 916 00:52:42,720 --> 00:52:47,160 She was very excited when I worked with people who she, she 917 00:52:47,160 --> 00:52:49,480 could see on the telly. But it did have that corollary 918 00:52:49,480 --> 00:52:54,360 that she would ring up and say, hello, Jonathan, how are you? 919 00:52:54,360 --> 00:52:57,120 And then she, when I gave the answers, it's like, well, she 920 00:52:57,120 --> 00:53:01,080 had to listen to that obviously, because that was a primary duty. 921 00:53:01,360 --> 00:53:03,600 But then she would always say, how's Griff, You know, how's 922 00:53:03,640 --> 00:53:08,120 Griff? How's And I know that when 923 00:53:08,120 --> 00:53:11,320 Griff's mother rang Griff up, she didn't say Griff. 924 00:53:11,640 --> 00:53:14,120 How's John Canter? Is he still tall? 925 00:53:14,560 --> 00:53:19,160 You know, so it did get to me. Yeah, but, you know, fame is the 926 00:53:19,160 --> 00:53:20,320 spare. What can I say? 927 00:53:20,320 --> 00:53:24,840 It's even kind of 1 removed. Yeah. 928 00:53:24,960 --> 00:53:26,640 And you mentioned Griff. Yeah. 929 00:53:27,320 --> 00:53:29,720 So you you were both in Footlights together? 930 00:53:29,920 --> 00:53:31,280 We were, yeah. Yeah. 931 00:53:31,960 --> 00:53:36,160 And then he cuz I know he became a radio producer first, right 932 00:53:36,160 --> 00:53:40,640 And then graduate and then he got sort of he was a minor part 933 00:53:40,640 --> 00:53:44,560 of the first series of Not the 9:00 news and then graduated to. 934 00:53:44,840 --> 00:53:46,920 That's right. Chris Langham, left and and. 935 00:53:47,960 --> 00:53:49,400 Griffin Yeah. Did you. 936 00:53:49,400 --> 00:53:51,720 I mean, did you ever did you get, did you have the 937 00:53:51,720 --> 00:53:56,280 opportunity potentially to, you know to follow that path 938 00:53:56,280 --> 00:53:57,360 yourself, if you know what I mean. 939 00:53:58,200 --> 00:54:04,440 I've had a flashback to the Edinburgh Festival 1973. 940 00:54:05,360 --> 00:54:08,000 Yeah. The producer of this show called 941 00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:12,440 up Sunday, saw the show and asked me whether I wanted to be 942 00:54:12,440 --> 00:54:16,800 on it and that that's when I yeah said no, I didn't. 943 00:54:16,840 --> 00:54:20,120 I didn't. I didn't feel it was for me. 944 00:54:20,400 --> 00:54:24,160 So that's yeah that that is that is a genuine opportunity that I 945 00:54:24,160 --> 00:54:30,760 missed the performer but I still happier to be a writer. 946 00:54:30,760 --> 00:54:32,440 It's odd. I got every so often I do a 947 00:54:32,440 --> 00:54:34,920 public appearance like I'm interview interviewing. 948 00:54:35,040 --> 00:54:39,720 I'm introducing a series of screwball comedies at the cinema 949 00:54:39,720 --> 00:54:41,800 in Aubre in Suffolk where I live. 950 00:54:41,800 --> 00:54:46,600 I just do a 5 minute intro this this Sunday we got his girl 951 00:54:46,600 --> 00:54:49,800 Friday 1940. A great film. 952 00:54:50,280 --> 00:54:53,840 I might be simply to write 5 minutes of intro and you know 953 00:54:53,840 --> 00:54:57,200 it's it's not a big deal but it preys on my mind. 954 00:54:57,520 --> 00:55:02,200 I just even at that age, I thought, wow, my question. 955 00:55:02,520 --> 00:55:04,520 It's an odd question, but it's very simple. 956 00:55:04,880 --> 00:55:07,160 Supposing you're doing a show in the evening, what are you meant 957 00:55:07,160 --> 00:55:10,920 to do in the day? And still kind of wonder that 958 00:55:12,160 --> 00:55:15,640 just to tell you my most recent public appearances, in 2019, 959 00:55:15,840 --> 00:55:22,400 Lenny Henry went on a nationwide tour to promote his first volume 960 00:55:22,400 --> 00:55:24,760 of autobiography. It's called Who Am I Anyway? 961 00:55:25,720 --> 00:55:31,200 And as his long term cohort and he said to me take this book and 962 00:55:31,200 --> 00:55:34,200 out of it construct an hour's stand up material. 963 00:55:34,800 --> 00:55:36,960 So I duly did. I mean it was a pleasure. 964 00:55:36,960 --> 00:55:39,560 It's always, it was always a pleasure working with Lenny. 965 00:55:39,960 --> 00:55:43,880 And then he said for the second-half, I'm damned if I 966 00:55:43,880 --> 00:55:46,640 want to learn anything more. So you're going to come on tour 967 00:55:46,640 --> 00:55:49,600 with me and the second-half of the show every night is going to 968 00:55:49,600 --> 00:55:53,800 be you interviewing me in a kind of, you know, Michael Parkinson, 969 00:55:53,800 --> 00:55:56,840 Graham, Nortony kind of way. That's what I did. 970 00:55:56,840 --> 00:56:00,840 I went on a 42 day tour of of the United Kingdom with Lenny 971 00:56:00,840 --> 00:56:04,240 Henry every night asking the same question. 972 00:56:04,240 --> 00:56:07,760 So Lenny, I'm very interested in how you went from doing sketches 973 00:56:07,760 --> 00:56:10,880 and comedy to Shakespeare. That's an extraordinary leap. 974 00:56:10,960 --> 00:56:15,280 How did it happen? And whether you like it or not, 975 00:56:15,680 --> 00:56:19,360 and I didn't, I didn't. That is a kind of an acting job. 976 00:56:19,360 --> 00:56:22,240 In other words, not only do you have to ask the question, you've 977 00:56:22,240 --> 00:56:23,840 got to look interested in the answer. 978 00:56:23,840 --> 00:56:26,280 And not only do you have to look interested in the answer, you 979 00:56:26,280 --> 00:56:29,480 have to look surprised by the answer like you didn't hear it 980 00:56:29,480 --> 00:56:32,920 last night in Bradford on the previous night in Stoke. 981 00:56:33,360 --> 00:56:37,080 Yeah, once it came on stage and then he said Jack. 982 00:56:37,080 --> 00:56:38,520 For some reason he always calls me Jack. 983 00:56:38,680 --> 00:56:42,520 Jack, you nodded too quickly. You nodded before I'd given the 984 00:56:44,080 --> 00:56:45,040 answer. So there you are. 985 00:56:45,560 --> 00:56:46,960 But he. But of course he he would have 986 00:56:46,960 --> 00:56:49,200 to give the impression that it was the first time he'd heard 987 00:56:49,200 --> 00:56:50,800 the question. Exactly. 988 00:56:50,960 --> 00:56:54,800 So in that sense, in that sense, we're equal. 989 00:56:55,240 --> 00:56:59,760 But you know what I did? I made sure I had 4 gags in that 990 00:57:00,360 --> 00:57:03,960 interview segment. So I always knew if nothing else 991 00:57:04,640 --> 00:57:06,280 and I Rd. tested them. That's what you do. 992 00:57:06,400 --> 00:57:09,240 As you know, any touring comedian or touring interviewer 993 00:57:09,480 --> 00:57:12,560 does the same thing, which is to Rd. test the material. 994 00:57:13,720 --> 00:57:17,480 Did did you ever, did you think, did you ever attempt to or dare 995 00:57:17,480 --> 00:57:21,000 to try and throw him with like, you know, OK, I think question 996 00:57:21,000 --> 00:57:22,720 he wasn't prepared for, like what's your inside leg 997 00:57:22,720 --> 00:57:25,240 measurement or something? Absolutely not. 998 00:57:25,280 --> 00:57:27,320 No. Because as I say, I've given 999 00:57:27,320 --> 00:57:31,160 myself these little Bonbons Littles and I remember. 1000 00:57:31,160 --> 00:57:33,640 Can I just tell you? Because it gives me pleasure of 1001 00:57:33,800 --> 00:57:38,120 nobody else. I used to say to him, you know, 1002 00:57:38,560 --> 00:57:40,720 Lenny, are you kind of addicted to technology? 1003 00:57:40,720 --> 00:57:43,160 And he'd go, no, I don't, not particularly, no. 1004 00:57:43,160 --> 00:57:46,000 And I'd go, oh, that's so Man, that is so untrue. 1005 00:57:46,000 --> 00:57:51,480 Yesterday we drove all the way from Stoke to Nottingham. 1006 00:57:51,480 --> 00:57:55,360 That's like a, you know, it's a 90 minute journey and I swear to 1007 00:57:55,360 --> 00:57:58,200 God, you never took your eyes off your phone. 1008 00:57:59,120 --> 00:58:02,840 I mean, OK, you drove safely so that that was the gag and it 1009 00:58:03,640 --> 00:58:05,640 gave me joy, you know, every night that got a good, good 1010 00:58:05,640 --> 00:58:08,000 laugh. And I thought, obviously I like, 1011 00:58:08,120 --> 00:58:10,960 I like this work because I'm going to get a lot tomorrow 1012 00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:14,480 night in Middlesbrough on that. And that's that's the tiny joy 1013 00:58:15,160 --> 00:58:17,560 of being a travelling interviewer. 1014 00:58:18,640 --> 00:58:22,320 Wow, brilliant Lenny Henry. You've obviously worked with him 1015 00:58:22,320 --> 00:58:24,920 extensively. And also Dawn, I believe. 1016 00:58:24,920 --> 00:58:27,320 Yes, I Wrote Murder. Yes, I did write an episode of 1017 00:58:27,320 --> 00:58:30,320 Murder most horrid for Dawn back in the 80s. 1018 00:58:30,400 --> 00:58:34,440 It was acceptable in the 80s as Calvin Harris memorably sang 1019 00:58:34,440 --> 00:58:39,800 Yeah, Yeah, Let me tell me that And I'm sure he told the world 1020 00:58:40,320 --> 00:58:46,440 that he invited Dawn to see his stand up show and after the show 1021 00:58:46,440 --> 00:58:49,440 she came back and she had 73 notes for him. 1022 00:58:50,640 --> 00:58:53,760 Now that's remarkable in many ways, not not not least because 1023 00:58:53,760 --> 00:58:58,160 it it speaks to her ability to write legibly in the dark. 1024 00:58:59,760 --> 00:59:04,960 It also, I've always loved that story because I think performers 1025 00:59:05,440 --> 00:59:11,520 like to be a friend of mine once said being edited is like being 1026 00:59:11,520 --> 00:59:13,400 loved. And I thought that's a very cute 1027 00:59:13,400 --> 00:59:18,040 observation because obviously a lot of what you say will be in 1028 00:59:18,040 --> 00:59:22,440 quotes negative. But you can say in such a way 1029 00:59:22,440 --> 00:59:25,320 that you're saying, look, I believe in you, I support you, I 1030 00:59:25,320 --> 00:59:29,080 think you could do this better. And I think that really, that 1031 00:59:29,080 --> 00:59:31,120 really chimed with him, you know? 1032 00:59:31,320 --> 00:59:33,800 Yeah, that brings us nicely onto. 1033 00:59:34,320 --> 00:59:38,120 Back to a bit of Fry and Laurie. Yeah, like you say, you had the 1034 00:59:38,120 --> 00:59:40,400 best job in the world. You were there reading these 1035 00:59:40,400 --> 00:59:45,040 sketches, these bits and and sifting through and deciding 1036 00:59:45,040 --> 00:59:48,040 what you felt worked, what needed work and etcetera, 1037 00:59:48,040 --> 00:59:50,000 etcetera. Did you actually contribute 1038 00:59:50,040 --> 00:59:53,200 anything in terms of writing? Do you know? 1039 00:59:53,200 --> 00:59:56,920 I, I did, I I I contributed my. My great contribution to British 1040 00:59:56,920 --> 01:00:00,840 television comedy, I maintain, is this tiny thing. 1041 01:00:02,160 --> 01:00:05,640 So I used to do a series of spoof vox pops. 1042 01:00:05,800 --> 01:00:07,480 Maybe. You know, Yep, over there. 1043 01:00:07,480 --> 01:00:11,000 Beautifully done. And one of them had Stephen in a 1044 01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:17,160 sort of 1950s housewife hat. Yes, I can picture it. 1045 01:00:17,200 --> 01:00:19,320 Yep, yes. And he would just say, he would 1046 01:00:19,320 --> 01:00:21,640 start to say something and he'd put his hand over his mouth and 1047 01:00:21,640 --> 01:00:24,600 go, I think I've left the iron on. 1048 01:00:24,600 --> 01:00:28,640 And then he'd come out of flame. And I said, and this is where I 1049 01:00:28,640 --> 01:00:31,600 changed the face of comedy. I said we should just play that 1050 01:00:31,600 --> 01:00:34,720 every week. There's no need to write another 1051 01:00:34,720 --> 01:00:36,200 one for the character. It's nice. 1052 01:00:36,560 --> 01:00:43,400 I mean, come on, I've listened to Help by The Beatles 710 times 1053 01:00:43,400 --> 01:00:47,160 and it's great every time. In fact, the the pleasure is, is 1054 01:00:47,640 --> 01:00:49,320 partly in knowing what's going to happen. 1055 01:00:49,720 --> 01:00:50,920 Yeah. Well, that's what they did. 1056 01:00:50,920 --> 01:00:54,520 And then I used to think later. Well, like with The Fast Show, 1057 01:00:54,640 --> 01:00:57,880 you know, I'm not saying they got it from me, although I kind 1058 01:00:57,880 --> 01:00:59,680 of AM. So you so you kind of inspired 1059 01:00:59,680 --> 01:01:02,600 those Vox pop bits. No, I didn't inspire the Vox 1060 01:01:02,600 --> 01:01:04,960 Pops. I just thought there's, you 1061 01:01:04,960 --> 01:01:07,880 know, the agony of creating comedy is such that why don't 1062 01:01:07,880 --> 01:01:12,560 you have 14 seconds of the show, which is, which is the same 1063 01:01:12,920 --> 01:01:15,360 every week. So that will save us 14 seconds 1064 01:01:15,880 --> 01:01:17,240 of agony. Those. 1065 01:01:17,560 --> 01:01:19,960 Yeah, because you'd have. You'd have, you'd often have, 1066 01:01:20,520 --> 01:01:24,720 like you say you'd have Steven dressed as that 1950s lady you'd 1067 01:01:24,720 --> 01:01:27,960 have. Hugh dressed as a policeman. 1068 01:01:28,160 --> 01:01:30,680 Yes, that's right. And you'd have Steven dressed. 1069 01:01:30,840 --> 01:01:34,480 My favorite one of those is Steven dressed as this kind of. 1070 01:01:35,720 --> 01:01:38,760 He's like wearing a tank top. His hair's slipped right back. 1071 01:01:39,720 --> 01:01:42,200 Slipped Glasses I. Went around to a primary school 1072 01:01:42,200 --> 01:01:44,200 because he had that end of term thing and they shove all their 1073 01:01:44,240 --> 01:01:46,320 paintings, all the paintings they've done in her class, so 1074 01:01:46,320 --> 01:01:51,040 shown them all around the wall. Oh crap, yeah. 1075 01:01:51,040 --> 01:01:55,600 It's just I just honestly, YouTube is the great, great 1076 01:01:56,400 --> 01:02:00,240 fountain of of joy in anybody's life who loves comedy. 1077 01:02:00,240 --> 01:02:04,360 You know just go to the YouTube and watch a bit of stuff and it 1078 01:02:04,720 --> 01:02:08,160 unfailing me. It unfailing me makes me, makes 1079 01:02:08,160 --> 01:02:10,240 me raw. And and the the thing I 1080 01:02:10,560 --> 01:02:16,080 treasured about them was I don't think it's sentimental to say 1081 01:02:16,080 --> 01:02:21,080 that great great comedy can or does come out of friendship. 1082 01:02:21,080 --> 01:02:22,280 You know, there's been many great. 1083 01:02:22,400 --> 01:02:25,920 I mean look at Dawn and Jennifer, you can't fake it. 1084 01:02:27,160 --> 01:02:29,920 But the the shared way of feeling about something. 1085 01:02:30,120 --> 01:02:34,000 So Hugh would come in one morning to rehearsal and say, oh 1086 01:02:34,000 --> 01:02:37,320 God, I can't believe it, I I took my car to be serviced. 1087 01:02:37,360 --> 01:02:41,360 And the man said, yeah, Oh yeah, I'm busy with another car, but 1088 01:02:41,960 --> 01:02:43,880 my colleague will be along in a minute. 1089 01:02:44,240 --> 01:02:48,720 And here we go, my colleague, my colleague, and this with a face 1090 01:02:48,720 --> 01:02:51,680 that said, this is the worst thing that's ever that's ever 1091 01:02:51,680 --> 01:02:53,600 happened to a person in the world. 1092 01:02:53,800 --> 01:02:56,600 And Stephen would understand the rest of us were, you know, 1093 01:02:56,840 --> 01:02:58,640 what's wrong with that? But the rest, you know, it was 1094 01:02:58,680 --> 01:03:04,240 astonishing that that kind of telepathy and shared love and 1095 01:03:04,440 --> 01:03:09,760 hatred stuff. Absolutely, I I think. 1096 01:03:10,440 --> 01:03:12,880 I was trying to think of knowing that I was going to talk to you 1097 01:03:12,880 --> 01:03:15,480 and and we're going to talk about the show. 1098 01:03:16,240 --> 01:03:18,840 I was trying to think of my fate if I could single out my 1099 01:03:18,840 --> 01:03:22,240 favorite bit of Fry and Laurie sketch or bit ever. 1100 01:03:23,280 --> 01:03:27,440 And I don't know if it's one you remember particularly, but it's 1101 01:03:27,480 --> 01:03:33,080 it's the Mr. Sibnock sketch, Hugh playing a very old man with 1102 01:03:33,080 --> 01:03:38,240 very long white hair in a brown dressing gown, and Stevens 1103 01:03:38,240 --> 01:03:42,560 playing his. Carer for want of a better word. 1104 01:03:42,560 --> 01:03:44,560 You know that one. No, I don't. 1105 01:03:44,560 --> 01:03:46,000 This is. I'm excited to know what's going 1106 01:03:46,000 --> 01:03:49,600 to be. And and and Steven's very 1107 01:03:49,720 --> 01:03:55,400 playing a very effeminate character and it's a very funny 1108 01:03:55,400 --> 01:03:59,280 sketch in general. Him wanting his Coco Steven sort 1109 01:03:59,280 --> 01:04:03,760 of fussing around him and then the the crux of the sketch is is 1110 01:04:03,760 --> 01:04:08,000 Mr. Simnock. Wistfully ruing the fact that 1111 01:04:08,000 --> 01:04:11,040 he's not done so many things in his life that he wished he'd 1112 01:04:11,040 --> 01:04:18,040 done, such as watching a woman urinate riding a camel. 1113 01:04:20,480 --> 01:04:24,080 And there was a few others but but but not. 1114 01:04:24,200 --> 01:04:25,840 It wasn't just the the lines and the comedy. 1115 01:04:25,840 --> 01:04:28,080 It was the character that Hugh played. 1116 01:04:28,080 --> 01:04:30,480 It was perfect. And the character that Stephen 1117 01:04:30,480 --> 01:04:34,840 played was perfect. And I I will take that sketch to 1118 01:04:34,840 --> 01:04:36,760 my grave. I want to drink milk from the 1119 01:04:36,760 --> 01:04:43,280 breasts of a Burmese maiden. I don't know what's got into you 1120 01:04:43,280 --> 01:04:45,480 today, Mr. Simnock. I don't really. 1121 01:04:45,800 --> 01:04:48,600 I think we're going to have to give you some extra Vitamin E 1122 01:04:49,320 --> 01:04:54,440 Burmese maidens in Todmorden. We've got bug breath. 1123 01:04:54,480 --> 01:04:57,760 You up? Well, there's no call to be 1124 01:04:57,760 --> 01:04:59,960 getting personal. I hope like rotten. 1125 01:04:59,960 --> 01:05:02,800 Cabbages. I'm very angry with you today, 1126 01:05:02,800 --> 01:05:05,640 Mr. Simnock. You're a great Nancy. 1127 01:05:06,400 --> 01:05:08,200 I'm not a great Nancy, Mr. Simnock. 1128 01:05:08,200 --> 01:05:09,520 And you're wicked to say so. You're. 1129 01:05:09,680 --> 01:05:12,480 Great Mary. I'm Boom Boy Nancy, But you've 1130 01:05:12,480 --> 01:05:14,680 never even done it. I'm not going to take any more 1131 01:05:14,680 --> 01:05:16,320 of this from you, Mr. Simnock. I'm not really. 1132 01:05:16,680 --> 01:05:18,880 You should be in a place like this at your time of life. 1133 01:05:19,240 --> 01:05:21,320 Well, someone's got to do it. Dedication. 1134 01:05:21,320 --> 01:05:22,880 The way I bother, I do not know you. 1135 01:05:23,600 --> 01:05:28,840 Should be out there having oral sex and killing people and 1136 01:05:28,840 --> 01:05:33,680 watching women urinate in opera. Eating hamburgers in opera 1137 01:05:33,680 --> 01:05:37,040 houses and drinking milk from the breasts of Nepalese maidens 1138 01:05:37,040 --> 01:05:39,040 it. Was Burmese last time? 1139 01:05:39,960 --> 01:05:41,440 Nepalese. I've changed my mind. 1140 01:05:42,360 --> 01:05:44,720 Instead, you're stuck here taking rude talk from an old 1141 01:05:44,720 --> 01:05:46,400 man. You're a great bog breath, 1142 01:05:46,400 --> 01:05:50,520 Nancy. You've really upset me today, 1143 01:05:50,520 --> 01:05:51,560 Mr. SIM. No, you have. 1144 01:05:51,560 --> 01:05:54,000 Really Now I'm going out to hurry along your Coco. 1145 01:05:54,000 --> 01:05:57,200 When I get back, I don't want any more nonsense, honestly. 1146 01:05:58,320 --> 01:06:05,120 With a screaming great Bertie in your pong. 92 years old and I've 1147 01:06:05,120 --> 01:06:10,160 never watched a woman urinate. Tragic waste that oh man, and I 1148 01:06:10,160 --> 01:06:13,120 want to congratulate you on in your introduction. 1149 01:06:13,320 --> 01:06:18,080 Using the phrase wist wistfully ruin, which is a delightful 1150 01:06:18,080 --> 01:06:21,280 phrase and it can something that they, and I mean this is the 1151 01:06:21,280 --> 01:06:24,920 nice nicest possible something that either of them could have 1152 01:06:24,960 --> 01:06:29,160 said. It's incredibly gifted, their 1153 01:06:29,160 --> 01:06:32,960 advanced education because English was definitely there. 1154 01:06:33,160 --> 01:06:35,360 Oh, there's so many sketches. There's so many sketches. 1155 01:06:35,360 --> 01:06:37,800 Like the language sketch where he talks about language. 1156 01:06:38,000 --> 01:06:40,800 Yes, I mean they they were, I mean, people talk about 1157 01:06:40,840 --> 01:06:44,160 undergraduate humour. But I I think they graduated. 1158 01:06:44,240 --> 01:06:46,560 I think they were glorious, available to all. 1159 01:06:46,840 --> 01:06:50,240 And I just remembered, I want to bring it back to Spike, the 1160 01:06:50,280 --> 01:06:54,680 described Hugh Laurie joke. But I think Spike could have 1161 01:06:54,680 --> 01:06:59,080 written he just, he's playing himself effectively. 1162 01:06:59,320 --> 01:07:02,200 He holds up. I think it was a pair of socks. 1163 01:07:02,440 --> 01:07:03,840 It might have been a pair of pants. 1164 01:07:04,720 --> 01:07:06,160 Let's say it was a pair of underpants. 1165 01:07:06,160 --> 01:07:08,520 He holds up a pair of underpants to the camera. 1166 01:07:08,520 --> 01:07:12,560 And he says, you know, there's a funny story attached to these 1167 01:07:12,560 --> 01:07:15,240 underpants, but I'm afraid it's fallen off. 1168 01:07:17,880 --> 01:07:20,720 Yeah, I think Spike would have been proud of that, I think. 1169 01:07:21,040 --> 01:07:23,960 It's, yeah, yeah. Once again, it's it's it's 1170 01:07:24,000 --> 01:07:26,200 wonderfully visual. Absolutely. 1171 01:07:28,280 --> 01:07:30,040 There's a few other people that you've worked with. 1172 01:07:30,360 --> 01:07:32,720 I want to just touch on that I that I admire. 1173 01:07:33,720 --> 01:07:37,200 And again, circling back to Douglas Adams, you, you and John 1174 01:07:37,200 --> 01:07:41,600 Lloyd collaborated on Afterlife On Afterlife, Yeah. 1175 01:07:42,120 --> 01:07:44,000 Yes. Which which was, Which was 1176 01:07:44,160 --> 01:07:48,040 basically what the the, the, the the follow up to John Lloyd and 1177 01:07:48,040 --> 01:07:49,640 John and Douglas's meeting of Lyft. 1178 01:07:50,280 --> 01:07:51,920 That's absolutely right. Yes. 1179 01:07:53,080 --> 01:07:57,480 Douglas and John's friendship was incredibly strong, I think. 1180 01:07:57,880 --> 01:08:01,800 I think John thinks about him every day of his life actually. 1181 01:08:03,200 --> 01:08:09,120 So I was kind of very glad to be invited onto that small team to 1182 01:08:09,120 --> 01:08:15,080 to to to take that format and revisit it and it was a joy. 1183 01:08:16,240 --> 01:08:19,200 It was very, very interesting to me though because we we went to 1184 01:08:19,359 --> 01:08:23,840 in typical bloody this is so Douglas Adams and Douglas Adams, 1185 01:08:25,279 --> 01:08:30,880 what he used to do was hire a villa in I don't know Tuscany, 1186 01:08:30,880 --> 01:08:34,359 even Australia. I was in Sydney one time and he 1187 01:08:34,359 --> 01:08:39,439 was he hired a villa to write. Which is in a way good, in a way 1188 01:08:39,439 --> 01:08:43,640 completely daft, because writing it is an introvert activity. 1189 01:08:43,680 --> 01:08:46,680 And there's yeah, frankly you might as well be in the looking 1190 01:08:46,680 --> 01:08:49,720 out on the Holloway Rd. is looking out on on Tuscan 1191 01:08:49,720 --> 01:08:52,439 mountains because do you know what I mean? 1192 01:08:52,439 --> 01:08:54,520 You're you're not really going to partake of them? 1193 01:08:54,760 --> 01:08:56,680 Yes. And it doesn't make sense. 1194 01:08:56,680 --> 01:08:58,520 Yes, doesn't really make a lot of sense. 1195 01:08:58,520 --> 01:09:00,720 But. And the whole joy of going away 1196 01:09:00,720 --> 01:09:03,040 I think is, is getting away from what you do all day. 1197 01:09:03,080 --> 01:09:09,319 But, But anyway, so John and I naturally hired a villa in a 1198 01:09:09,319 --> 01:09:12,080 villa. We hired a little house in Foye 1199 01:09:12,080 --> 01:09:15,479 in Cornwall, you know, near to Daphne de Moray country. 1200 01:09:15,479 --> 01:09:18,399 Yeah and first day write Co writing. 1201 01:09:18,920 --> 01:09:22,800 We sat opposite each other and you could tell we got what do we 1202 01:09:22,800 --> 01:09:25,720 do now? In other words do we properly Co 1203 01:09:25,720 --> 01:09:29,920 write and OfferUp things for the other person to comment on and 1204 01:09:29,920 --> 01:09:32,560 then rewrite. And the answer was no. 1205 01:09:32,560 --> 01:09:35,920 We sat within a few inches of each other, like like you did. 1206 01:09:35,960 --> 01:09:38,960 Like you did in in the fifth form when you kind of hid your 1207 01:09:38,960 --> 01:09:42,640 work from the person at the next desk because he didn't want, he 1208 01:09:43,279 --> 01:09:46,560 didn't want to have it seen or Nick do, do you do your own 1209 01:09:46,560 --> 01:09:50,600 geography at O level homework? So it's the most odd thing. 1210 01:09:50,800 --> 01:09:52,800 But then of course we read them out and it was fine. 1211 01:09:52,800 --> 01:09:57,040 But I'm always very interested in how writing partnerships work 1212 01:09:57,480 --> 01:10:01,480 and ours didn't really, but it was fine. 1213 01:10:01,480 --> 01:10:05,240 Normally there's a person who sits at the laptop and somebody 1214 01:10:05,240 --> 01:10:08,520 who wanders around. So we said OK, so if if for 1215 01:10:08,520 --> 01:10:11,880 example. So you were sat there together. 1216 01:10:12,160 --> 01:10:15,200 Yeah. And you were, you were coming up 1217 01:10:15,200 --> 01:10:17,240 with definitions. Yes, basically. 1218 01:10:17,400 --> 01:10:20,600 So like the the, I'm just thinking so you know the 1219 01:10:20,600 --> 01:10:24,080 frustration that you feel when you can't get the cellophane off 1220 01:10:24,120 --> 01:10:27,280 a CD or a DVD, that sense of frustration. 1221 01:10:27,600 --> 01:10:29,160 Would you have, Would you have said try? 1222 01:10:29,160 --> 01:10:32,600 Try to think of a word for that, for that's interesting. 1223 01:10:32,600 --> 01:10:36,360 No, that's a good question. And no, we would rather. 1224 01:10:36,960 --> 01:10:40,240 Certainly I would rather be there with the cassetteer or the 1225 01:10:40,240 --> 01:10:43,840 Google Maps and go Foy Teddington. 1226 01:10:44,360 --> 01:10:46,240 Yeah. So can you know? 1227 01:10:46,240 --> 01:10:48,920 Yeah. Look for the inspiration in in 1228 01:10:48,920 --> 01:10:51,600 the word rather than what? Backwards for the meaning, yeah. 1229 01:10:51,920 --> 01:10:52,840 Got you. OK. 1230 01:10:53,120 --> 01:10:54,760 OK. So you'd find the, you'd find 1231 01:10:54,760 --> 01:10:58,400 the location, and then you'd spend an hour thinking of the 1232 01:10:58,480 --> 01:11:02,160 definition. Yeah, preferably a minute, but 1233 01:11:02,160 --> 01:11:03,480 possibly an hour. Yeah. 1234 01:11:04,400 --> 01:11:06,800 Yes. And. 1235 01:11:07,880 --> 01:11:09,800 And you've recently or relatively recently been 1236 01:11:09,800 --> 01:11:13,920 involved you, you write a lot for radio. 1237 01:11:14,440 --> 01:11:18,200 Yeah. And I'm trying to think what 1238 01:11:18,200 --> 01:11:19,640 it's called. I'm so, so believe it. 1239 01:11:19,920 --> 01:11:21,080 Believe it. With Richard Wilson. 1240 01:11:21,080 --> 01:11:22,960 Yeah, I wrote. I wrote six series of that. 1241 01:11:23,600 --> 01:11:25,720 For has that finished now? Yes, it has right. 1242 01:11:27,040 --> 01:11:32,400 Ages got to us, Tyler particularly, yeah, so we did 24 1243 01:11:32,400 --> 01:11:35,720 and it was great, but yeah. Now I'm a huge. 1244 01:11:36,720 --> 01:11:39,160 Richard Wilson fan I Was before 1 Foot in the Grave. 1245 01:11:39,240 --> 01:11:41,840 Even though that's good, that mocks you out if you. 1246 01:11:41,840 --> 01:11:43,520 Will Well, I enjoyed him very much. 1247 01:11:43,520 --> 01:11:46,240 I was a big fan of Only When I laugh, right? 1248 01:11:46,240 --> 01:11:49,640 Yes. With the perpetually ill, or at 1249 01:11:49,640 --> 01:11:53,920 least hospital bound, James Bolum and Peter Bowles and 1250 01:11:54,280 --> 01:11:56,400 Christopher Strowley. And of course, Richard Wilson 1251 01:11:56,400 --> 01:11:59,600 was was one of the was was like the head doctor that would 1252 01:11:59,600 --> 01:12:03,480 always, you know, look through his Half Moon spectacles at the 1253 01:12:04,120 --> 01:12:06,120 wither with that withering glare. 1254 01:12:06,120 --> 01:12:11,080 Withering glare, yes, But now I'm a a big I mean, 1 Foot in 1255 01:12:11,080 --> 01:12:14,800 the Grave is is certainly one of my favorite favorite sitcoms. 1256 01:12:14,800 --> 01:12:16,520 And what was it like working with with Richard? 1257 01:12:16,520 --> 01:12:17,880 It was. I mean, it's very interesting. 1258 01:12:17,880 --> 01:12:22,400 It was meant to be sort of pseudo autobiographical. 1259 01:12:22,880 --> 01:12:24,160 Yeah. And actually he said to me 1260 01:12:24,160 --> 01:12:26,400 earlier, no you do you do it, John, you write it. 1261 01:12:26,400 --> 01:12:29,920 I'll I'll be fine with that. So he, he's a, he's a very 1262 01:12:29,920 --> 01:12:32,680 private man but he he sort of rather liked. 1263 01:12:32,720 --> 01:12:37,520 I would kind of tease him in a way and and I take as much as I 1264 01:12:37,520 --> 01:12:40,800 could from what I knew of his real life. 1265 01:12:40,800 --> 01:12:44,840 So I knew save his friendship with them Ian McKellen. 1266 01:12:45,240 --> 01:12:47,920 And I thought we've got to have as much Ian McKellen as we can. 1267 01:12:47,920 --> 01:12:50,480 So I I created a character for Ian McKellen. 1268 01:12:50,480 --> 01:12:55,080 We called him head of Gay and that was rather that, you know, 1269 01:12:55,080 --> 01:12:57,240 that was the kind of thing I think he enjoyed because he, you 1270 01:12:57,240 --> 01:13:01,040 know, he wasn't a sort of, as you probably know, he didn't 1271 01:13:01,040 --> 01:13:07,480 come out till the 90s actually. And so it wasn't a great public 1272 01:13:07,480 --> 01:13:11,280 figure in that way. But he, he liked the fact that 1273 01:13:11,960 --> 01:13:15,040 that I went for that. And the other thing to say about 1274 01:13:15,040 --> 01:13:18,600 Richard is and Sean, Ed William who was running Radio Light 1275 01:13:18,600 --> 01:13:22,800 Entertainment made the point. My goodness, he's such a he was 1276 01:13:23,080 --> 01:13:26,960 such a natural for radio. Nobody sounds like Richard. 1277 01:13:27,320 --> 01:13:30,240 I mean it's extraordinary. And of course when he went to 1278 01:13:30,240 --> 01:13:34,280 drama school in the early 60s in in London, they they sort of 1279 01:13:34,280 --> 01:13:37,800 thought, well you'll never work in this town again with with an 1280 01:13:37,800 --> 01:13:40,200 accent like that. But it used to be hilarious. 1281 01:13:40,200 --> 01:13:41,840 If Richard, you can't ask Richard. 1282 01:13:42,000 --> 01:13:44,640 Don't ask Richard to do an accent because that's an 1283 01:13:44,640 --> 01:13:49,520 absolute waste of obvious, extraordinary talent for being 1284 01:13:49,520 --> 01:13:52,680 himself. And he and he, the other thing I 1285 01:13:52,680 --> 01:13:56,320 loved, let's face it, he's very, very popular with him. 1286 01:13:56,960 --> 01:13:58,560 He's done a lot of work in theatre. 1287 01:13:59,640 --> 01:14:01,640 People love him. So, you know, if you want to get 1288 01:14:01,640 --> 01:14:05,560 David Tennant to do Richard Wilson's radio show, of course 1289 01:14:05,560 --> 01:14:09,280 he'll do it. When 1 Foot In The Grave ended, 1290 01:14:09,480 --> 01:14:13,520 very soon after, Richard appeared in another sitcom 1291 01:14:14,160 --> 01:14:16,440 called Duck Patrol. Oh, that's right. 1292 01:14:16,480 --> 01:14:17,760 That's right, with. Him. 1293 01:14:18,640 --> 01:14:21,480 With the David Tennant, the young David Tennant and Jason 1294 01:14:21,480 --> 01:14:24,600 Watkins, I think, yes, I think that's right that again you can, 1295 01:14:24,640 --> 01:14:26,360 you can find little bits of it on YouTube. 1296 01:14:26,640 --> 01:14:30,280 Yeah, but no and and wonderful, man. 1297 01:14:30,360 --> 01:14:32,400 I mean, I'd love to have him on this because I know he's a fan 1298 01:14:32,400 --> 01:14:35,840 of the Goons, but he's probably got better things to do. 1299 01:14:37,200 --> 01:14:40,400 What was happening? Richard was sounding more and 1300 01:14:40,400 --> 01:14:43,120 more like an old pal Ian Mckellan, playing Gandalf and 1301 01:14:43,120 --> 01:14:47,040 Lord of the Rings, all portentous and momentous and 1302 01:14:47,400 --> 01:14:51,360 pretentious. Anyway, he cancelled the hotel 1303 01:14:51,360 --> 01:14:56,840 and we set off for London and I drove and I drove. 1304 01:14:57,440 --> 01:15:02,360 I drove through the night at 6:00 in the morning, my head 1305 01:15:02,360 --> 01:15:04,560 lulled forward onto the steering wheel. 1306 01:15:05,360 --> 01:15:08,120 Luckily, I was parked outside Richard's flat at the time. 1307 01:15:11,160 --> 01:15:15,120 David, you fell asleep. Blind me right. 1308 01:15:16,440 --> 01:15:19,720 I'll say goodbye and head home. Thank you so much for 1309 01:15:19,720 --> 01:15:22,000 everything. It was memorable, wouldn't have 1310 01:15:22,000 --> 01:15:23,400 missed it. I'm glad. 1311 01:15:23,760 --> 01:15:29,240 But let's not do it again soon. Listen, you can't drive home in 1312 01:15:29,240 --> 01:15:32,120 your condition. Come up and have a cup of coffee 1313 01:15:33,880 --> 01:15:35,440 strong enough. Absolutely. 1314 01:15:35,440 --> 01:15:36,680 I'm buzzing. Good. 1315 01:15:37,840 --> 01:15:40,720 I want you to listen closely in my will. 1316 01:15:41,040 --> 01:15:44,600 I'm going to leave you my walking stick and my mobile. 1317 01:15:45,120 --> 01:15:46,840 And you're well, you've left me your walking stick and your 1318 01:15:46,840 --> 01:15:48,840 mobile. You don't have to repeat what I 1319 01:15:48,840 --> 01:15:50,240 say. Just listen. 1320 01:15:50,240 --> 01:15:52,920 Sorry, I'm so wired. I I'm feeling incredibly awake 1321 01:15:52,920 --> 01:15:54,640 and totally zonked at the same time. 1322 01:15:55,320 --> 01:15:57,560 OK, well, before we wrap up, I know, I know you've you've, 1323 01:15:57,920 --> 01:16:00,000 you've, you've written plays, you've written novels. 1324 01:16:00,280 --> 01:16:01,640 What are you working on at the moment? 1325 01:16:01,640 --> 01:16:06,920 What I'm working on now is I had a play on in Edinburgh in 2022. 1326 01:16:07,560 --> 01:16:10,440 Yeah. And being a play at Edinburgh 1327 01:16:10,440 --> 01:16:14,440 only lasted an hour. I've so I've extended it into a 1328 01:16:14,440 --> 01:16:17,800 full length piece. It's called 500 Couples and it's 1329 01:16:17,800 --> 01:16:21,320 about a couples counsellor, a woman who's hit her 60s and has 1330 01:16:21,320 --> 01:16:25,640 basically been saying the same things for 32 years in her job 1331 01:16:25,640 --> 01:16:29,200 and has got to the end. So it's a kind of it's I've 1332 01:16:29,200 --> 01:16:33,240 called it a ROM com. It's basically about the central 1333 01:16:33,240 --> 01:16:35,320 character is a couples counsellor who, as I say, has 1334 01:16:35,320 --> 01:16:38,520 been doing the same, doing the job for 32 years and in fact 1335 01:16:38,520 --> 01:16:43,600 does not have a partner herself. So we see her getting to the end 1336 01:16:43,600 --> 01:16:46,640 of her professional career and then we see whether she's going 1337 01:16:46,640 --> 01:16:50,120 to have a man in her life. So I've got a read through of 1338 01:16:50,120 --> 01:16:52,880 that this week. And also I wrote a novel called 1339 01:16:52,880 --> 01:16:57,240 A Short Gentleman about a barrister who commits a crime 1340 01:16:57,240 --> 01:16:59,480 but cannot admit that he's done anything wrong. 1341 01:17:00,080 --> 01:17:04,280 And that's incredibly close to my heart because I studied law 1342 01:17:04,360 --> 01:17:10,440 and my father was a solicitor. And there's something about a 1343 01:17:10,440 --> 01:17:14,680 highly educated person who can't admit they've done anything 1344 01:17:14,680 --> 01:17:17,080 wrong, which really appeals to me. 1345 01:17:17,440 --> 01:17:20,800 So I've done a one man show based on it and that's got a 1346 01:17:20,800 --> 01:17:23,520 read through in January. So basically what I'm doing now 1347 01:17:23,520 --> 01:17:27,160 is, is trying to get back on stage. 1348 01:17:27,160 --> 01:17:31,520 You know, I I really miss working with Lenny Henry on his 1349 01:17:31,520 --> 01:17:33,520 live show. That's come to an end, but I 1350 01:17:33,520 --> 01:17:38,000 just loved being all over the place in front of an audience. 1351 01:17:39,920 --> 01:17:43,160 Yeah, you're on the show and making it better, going back 1352 01:17:43,160 --> 01:17:46,120 into the dressing room and and saying that they didn't work. 1353 01:17:46,120 --> 01:17:47,400 I love the whole process, but there's. 1354 01:17:48,240 --> 01:17:50,200 Bound to be more Lenny Henry. Henry shows? 1355 01:17:50,800 --> 01:17:55,240 I don't think so. I think Len now has probably 1356 01:17:55,240 --> 01:18:00,400 hung up his stand up suit because the most recent stage 1357 01:18:00,400 --> 01:18:02,840 work he did was a play called August in England, which is a 1358 01:18:02,840 --> 01:18:07,800 one man show, a one man show. It's a one man play and put on 1359 01:18:07,800 --> 01:18:09,160 at the Bush Theatre. It was excellent. 1360 01:18:09,640 --> 01:18:13,120 And I think, no, I don't. I think he's what is so 1361 01:18:13,120 --> 01:18:16,160 interesting and I don't say this with any kind of attitude but 1362 01:18:16,400 --> 01:18:20,400 when I met Lenny in the 1990 or something, you know this is a 1363 01:18:20,400 --> 01:18:24,520 guy who'd left school at 15 or 16 and gone to work in a foundry 1364 01:18:25,760 --> 01:18:28,640 since which time, because he's such an incredible got such an 1365 01:18:28,640 --> 01:18:31,440 incredible appetite for everything he's become. 1366 01:18:31,440 --> 01:18:35,040 He's got a PhD, he's got an MA, you know, in. 1367 01:18:35,320 --> 01:18:38,000 And he's now, he's far outstripped me in terms of 1368 01:18:38,240 --> 01:18:42,240 education. So in the beginning, I think he 1369 01:18:42,400 --> 01:18:46,880 3232 years ago, I don't think he he had the confidence to be a 1370 01:18:46,880 --> 01:18:48,800 writer, but he's but he's got that now. 1371 01:18:49,320 --> 01:18:53,160 Yeah, he's got a drama series on ITV as we speak. 1372 01:18:53,160 --> 01:18:55,440 Three little birds, you know, I think he. 1373 01:18:55,480 --> 01:18:59,000 I think he's found himself. Sometimes it, sometimes it can 1374 01:18:59,000 --> 01:19:01,320 take 30 years to reach that. Yeah. 1375 01:19:01,640 --> 01:19:03,840 Yeah. Yeah, OK. 1376 01:19:03,840 --> 01:19:08,600 And and John has been genuinely. Huge amount of fun speaking to 1377 01:19:08,600 --> 01:19:12,520 you because you're very you know you've got a wealth of stuff to 1378 01:19:12,520 --> 01:19:15,960 talk about such a career and and and such enthusiasm that comes 1379 01:19:15,960 --> 01:19:20,400 through as well it's it's infectious so so thank you very 1380 01:19:20,400 --> 01:19:25,040 much for for coming on and I've only told you the stories that 1381 01:19:25,040 --> 01:19:28,360 are broadcastable so. You can tell me the other ones, 1382 01:19:29,400 --> 01:19:32,240 surely? Surely even with a half a pint 1383 01:19:32,240 --> 01:19:35,840 of Stellar inside me? Yes, yes. 1384 01:19:36,400 --> 01:19:38,800 Oh, John. Listen, thank you very much. 1385 01:19:38,800 --> 01:19:41,280 It's been great pleasure. Language is the Creek on a 1386 01:19:41,280 --> 01:19:43,320 stair. It's a spluttering match held to 1387 01:19:43,320 --> 01:19:45,640 a frosted pane. It's it's a half remembered 1388 01:19:45,640 --> 01:19:48,800 childhood birthday party. It's the warm, wet, trusting 1389 01:19:48,800 --> 01:19:52,680 touch of a leaking nappy, the Hulk of a charred Panzer, the 1390 01:19:52,680 --> 01:19:55,400 underside of a granite boulder, the first downy growth on the 1391 01:19:55,400 --> 01:19:59,880 upper lip of the Mediterranean. It's cobwebs long since overrun 1392 01:19:59,880 --> 01:20:03,320 by an old Wellington boot. No, no.