1
00:00:36,740 --> 00:00:41,780
Please, Sir, I want some more. 
What? 

2
00:00:44,060 --> 00:00:51,960
Please Sir, I want some more. 
More. 

3
00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:31,120
Hello and welcome to Goompod. 
This is the podcast where my 

4
00:01:31,120 --> 00:01:33,480
listeners tend not to shout 
more. 

5
00:01:33,480 --> 00:01:37,800
They shout less, but tough 
cheese listeners because it's 

6
00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:43,080
every week. 
But anyway, this week I'm joined

7
00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:44,840
again. 
I think this is turning into 

8
00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:47,920
sort of like an annual thing. 
I think chaps, this is this is 

9
00:01:47,920 --> 00:01:49,640
your third appearance on the 
show. 

10
00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:53,680
It's it's Chris and Rob from the
still any good podcast. 

11
00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:55,200
Hello. 
How are you? 

12
00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:58,440
Hello. 
It is the third visit, isn't it?

13
00:01:58,480 --> 00:02:00,040
I think. 
It is. 

14
00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:03,240
Yeah. 
We did 3 Musketeers about a year

15
00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:04,800
ago because we did. 
It was recorded on November the 

16
00:02:04,800 --> 00:02:06,640
5th because there were fireworks
in the background. 

17
00:02:06,640 --> 00:02:07,440
Around. 
Yeah, that's right. 

18
00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:10,039
We're talking it well. 
We did the frighteningly similar

19
00:02:10,039 --> 00:02:11,720
History of the World Part 1 
before that. 

20
00:02:13,120 --> 00:02:16,120
Yeah, and then I've come on your
show and done 4 Musketeers. 

21
00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:20,040
Yes, yes. 
And Tales of the Unexpected, 

22
00:02:20,040 --> 00:02:23,480
which I had COVID for so and the
Jerk and the Jerk. 

23
00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:25,720
It was excellent. 
Oh, and the jerk, of course. 

24
00:02:25,720 --> 00:02:28,040
So we must stop meeting like 
this. 

25
00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:31,920
I think we're we're officially 
friends of each other's pods. 

26
00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:33,120
We are. 
I think we are. 

27
00:02:33,120 --> 00:02:36,840
I think we are. 
So how's the podcast going? 

28
00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:40,320
How's the show going? 
It's enjoyable. 

29
00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:46,680
That's about it. 
It is going very well. 

30
00:02:46,680 --> 00:02:48,440
Thank you. 
Yeah, we're still enjoying it. 

31
00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:51,200
We're in the eighth year of 
doing it now. 

32
00:02:51,320 --> 00:02:53,680
So wow, one. 
Year we're old hands at it now 

33
00:02:54,280 --> 00:02:57,280
and it's good as as if anyone 
out there has has listened to 

34
00:02:57,280 --> 00:02:59,560
it. 
Sometimes we have a guest like 

35
00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:01,240
your good self. 
Sometimes it's just the two of 

36
00:03:01,240 --> 00:03:03,440
us, but we always have good fun 
doing it. 

37
00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:06,800
We always have lots of fun and 
Tyler, this will mean something 

38
00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:11,160
to you as a ex pet New 
Zealander, but we were. 

39
00:03:11,280 --> 00:03:14,080
We were on Radio New Zealand a 
few weeks ago. 

40
00:03:14,880 --> 00:03:16,480
Well, what? 
What for? 

41
00:03:17,720 --> 00:03:19,600
They just interviewed us. 
Yeah, we weren't on the news or 

42
00:03:19,600 --> 00:03:25,680
anything. 
Yeah, podcasters cause damage in

43
00:03:25,960 --> 00:03:30,320
Central Town. 
There's no hostage situation 

44
00:03:30,320 --> 00:03:32,560
going on, no. 
It wasn't, it wasn't an AP 

45
00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:40,080
situation, but no, we one of our
guests is a sports journalist. 

46
00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:41,760
One of our. 
Frequent guests. 

47
00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:44,200
And yeah, he he sort of said, 
oh, he should interview these 

48
00:03:44,200 --> 00:03:47,280
guys. 
Brilliant it was. 

49
00:03:47,280 --> 00:03:48,920
It was live radio. 
It was. 

50
00:03:48,920 --> 00:03:53,280
Nerve racking, Yeah, yeah. 
Did you get a noticeable upturn 

51
00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:55,120
in listeners as a result of 
that? 

52
00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:57,120
Do you know? 
We did. 

53
00:03:57,160 --> 00:04:00,280
I think two days later we were 
something like #2 in the New 

54
00:04:00,280 --> 00:04:02,320
Zealand download chart. 
So brilliant. 

55
00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:03,840
It served its purpose. 
It was great. 

56
00:04:04,320 --> 00:04:07,840
Which was strange because it was
a live interview at 10:10 PM at 

57
00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:08,480
night. 
Yeah. 

58
00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:11,800
Alcoholics. 
The unemployable. 

59
00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:14,200
They're all listening in here. 
Podcast fans. 

60
00:04:15,400 --> 00:04:19,240
Single women? 
Yeah, Doubtful. 

61
00:04:20,600 --> 00:04:25,920
No noticeable ups in there, no. 
Well, I I don't know if I've 

62
00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:29,400
said this before, but I 
discovered you guys years ago 

63
00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:32,680
because I was. 
This is just what this says 

64
00:04:32,680 --> 00:04:35,600
about me. 
I don't know, but I was idly 

65
00:04:35,600 --> 00:04:41,960
searching, searching on iTunes 
for podcasts about Spike 

66
00:04:41,960 --> 00:04:46,200
Milligan. 
God knows why. 

67
00:04:46,200 --> 00:04:49,120
I must have searched for Digby, 
the biggest dog in the world, 

68
00:04:49,880 --> 00:04:52,600
and there was only one podcast 
in the world that had covered 

69
00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:55,480
that film. 
We should have caught that 

70
00:04:55,480 --> 00:04:57,920
episode. 
Digby the only podcast in the 

71
00:04:57,920 --> 00:05:01,000
world. 
Yeah. 

72
00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:02,880
So you haven't covered Digby on 
yours, have you? 

73
00:05:02,880 --> 00:05:05,000
I'm not offering. 
No, you. 

74
00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:06,520
Want to sit and watch it again? 
But. 

75
00:05:06,520 --> 00:05:07,680
You've not got it for. 
This have you? 

76
00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:12,480
No, it is on the list. 
Someone has said they want to do

77
00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:16,680
that, but that will probably be 
next year I would imagine at 

78
00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:20,040
some point. 
I did feel a pang of something 

79
00:05:20,040 --> 00:05:23,760
when I listen to your yellow 
beard episode, because of course

80
00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:27,360
Chris and I covered that. 
Oh yes. 

81
00:05:27,360 --> 00:05:32,360
God, 65 or six years ago on a 
notoriously rainy evening. 

82
00:05:32,760 --> 00:05:36,000
Yeah. 
But but I was listening to he 

83
00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:38,200
was going. 
I wish we had said that, yes. 

84
00:05:39,360 --> 00:05:41,280
Although they said on it they 
quite enjoyed it. 

85
00:05:41,280 --> 00:05:44,320
I'm glad we didn't say. 
That it made me want to go watch

86
00:05:44,320 --> 00:05:44,720
it again. 
Oh. 

87
00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:47,600
My God, it was that good an 
episode. 

88
00:05:48,480 --> 00:05:52,280
Well, I know that, I know that 
you two, yeah, you 2 are pretty 

89
00:05:52,280 --> 00:05:55,320
sniffy about it. 
But we we we quite enjoyed it. 

90
00:05:55,720 --> 00:05:59,320
Yeah. 
More or less it made for a good 

91
00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:01,960
good topic. 
Yeah, I think you would probably

92
00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:05,120
rob a little bit more positive 
about it than I was. 

93
00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:08,240
I just couldn't take it to it at
all. 

94
00:06:08,680 --> 00:06:12,720
I I was sort of hurt because I 
cherished it and treasured it so

95
00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:15,600
much as a child and, and. 
I was hurt because you chose. 

96
00:06:19,120 --> 00:06:23,920
It was the brakes, Chris. 
There's two fundamental errors 

97
00:06:23,960 --> 00:06:29,120
in that film. 
One is Tommy Chong, Oh yeah, who

98
00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:31,640
shouldn't be in it, and the 
other is Madeleine Kahn's 

99
00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:33,400
accent. 
Oh yeah. 

100
00:06:33,640 --> 00:06:36,920
Yeah, yeah. 
Anyway. 

101
00:06:36,920 --> 00:06:41,400
And the fact that they got like 
a sports director to make, yeah,

102
00:06:42,200 --> 00:06:44,000
Mel Adamski or whatever he was 
called. 

103
00:06:44,760 --> 00:06:47,160
Melodansky. 
Melodansky. 

104
00:06:47,160 --> 00:06:48,840
That's right. 
That's it. 

105
00:06:48,840 --> 00:06:50,360
Yeah, that's right. 
I think it might have been 

106
00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:52,280
better if Keith Moon had 
appeared in it, you know? 

107
00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:56,120
But who knows? 
Or if Peking power had made it. 

108
00:06:56,120 --> 00:06:56,920
Yeah. 
Yeah, would. 

109
00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:02,160
Have been a little glorious it. 
Would have been like salad days.

110
00:07:08,760 --> 00:07:14,680
OK, So I asked you guys to come 
back and I said is there a 

111
00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:19,680
particular topic that we haven't
covered so far on Goon Pod that 

112
00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:23,760
has some even tenuous relevance 
with the goons? 

113
00:07:23,760 --> 00:07:27,400
And for some reason, I don't 
know if it was you or Rob, one 

114
00:07:27,400 --> 00:07:32,880
of you suggested Oliver. 
I think it was me and I 

115
00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:35,400
suggested it was Rob, and I 
think your reply was if we must.

116
00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:41,200
But I chose Oliver for a couple 
of reasons. 

117
00:07:41,200 --> 00:07:43,720
Partly, I think Harry Secom gets
a bit of short shrift on your 

118
00:07:43,720 --> 00:07:46,320
show, and that's nobody's fault 
other than the fact that he 

119
00:07:46,320 --> 00:07:50,280
hasn't appeared in as many films
as the others, as as many as as 

120
00:07:50,320 --> 00:07:57,480
Spike Milligan or Peter Sellers.
But also Oliver does kind of 

121
00:07:57,880 --> 00:08:02,280
hold a place in my heart. 
It's one of those things that, 

122
00:08:03,400 --> 00:08:08,000
you know, In that classic film 
Sliding Doors, John Hannah says 

123
00:08:08,000 --> 00:08:10,400
that The Beatles should be 
called the Fetals because 

124
00:08:10,400 --> 00:08:12,600
everybody is born knowing the 
lyrics. 

125
00:08:12,840 --> 00:08:15,200
That's how the songs in Oliver 
are to me. 

126
00:08:15,360 --> 00:08:18,000
There hasn't been a time where I
didn't know the songs. 

127
00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:21,480
I can't remember the first time 
I saw Oliver, but I've always 

128
00:08:21,480 --> 00:08:23,520
known the songs. 
We sang them at school. 

129
00:08:23,600 --> 00:08:25,880
Yeah, we did as well. 
Yeah, we sang food, glorious 

130
00:08:25,880 --> 00:08:27,800
food at school and consider 
yourself at. 

131
00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:29,200
School. 
I remember in Junior School 

132
00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:32,080
singing Umm Papa, which is just 
a song about debauchery. 

133
00:08:32,280 --> 00:08:34,240
Yeah and almost like 7 and 8 
year olds all singing. 

134
00:08:34,240 --> 00:08:41,760
It was great fun, but, but also,
as with with all of it, like 

135
00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:46,080
most people in school, I was in 
a school production of it, which

136
00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:48,960
was which was grateful. 
I didn't have a a major role. 

137
00:08:48,960 --> 00:08:54,360
I was just male chorus, which I 
think is the best because you 

138
00:08:54,360 --> 00:08:57,240
get to hang around backstage. 
You get to mess around at the 

139
00:08:57,240 --> 00:08:58,840
back of the stage and have a 
laugh. 

140
00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:00,880
Yeah. 
And it was brilliant fun. 

141
00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:02,840
It was really, really good fun 
being in that. 

142
00:09:02,880 --> 00:09:04,840
Yeah, much better than being one
of the leads. 

143
00:09:04,920 --> 00:09:05,200
Yeah. 
Oh. 

144
00:09:05,320 --> 00:09:09,680
Totally, totally. 
I was an extra in grease as well

145
00:09:09,680 --> 00:09:13,280
and that was great fun. 
Right. 

146
00:09:13,280 --> 00:09:15,480
Well I cuz here's the thing, 
I've never seen this film 

147
00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:16,600
before. 
What? 

148
00:09:18,720 --> 00:09:22,880
Not, I think, because I I yeah, 
I did watch it for this. 

149
00:09:23,200 --> 00:09:26,200
I thought I felt better. 
Yeah, yeah, slightly awkward 

150
00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:29,720
conversation. 
Because I have got. 

151
00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:31,640
We're just. 
Going to recap it for you, yeah.

152
00:09:33,120 --> 00:09:38,800
I've got a thing about musicals 
in general and it was never, I 

153
00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:40,800
don't know, growing. 
I'm a bit older than you Rob, 

154
00:09:40,800 --> 00:09:44,800
but when I was growing up in 
NZI, don't seem to remember it 

155
00:09:44,800 --> 00:09:48,880
being one of those Christmas 
fixtures on TV. 

156
00:09:50,320 --> 00:09:54,360
When did you depart our shores? 
Early 90s. 

157
00:09:56,000 --> 00:09:59,520
Oh, yeah, no, this. 
I was definitely on the telly a 

158
00:09:59,560 --> 00:10:02,600
couple of times because I much 
like Chris. 

159
00:10:04,120 --> 00:10:08,040
This is just one of those films 
that seems to sort of be baked 

160
00:10:08,040 --> 00:10:12,280
into me. 
Yeah, it's a terrible analogy, 

161
00:10:12,560 --> 00:10:17,880
but I do remember it being sort 
of an event musical. 

162
00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:21,720
You know, probably it's a 2 1/2 
hour film, so they probably 

163
00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:26,600
stretched it out to kind of 3 
1/2, three hours on on network 

164
00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:31,320
television. 
And I do remember being like The

165
00:10:31,320 --> 00:10:35,600
Sound of Music or you know, 
others of the ilk, the whole 

166
00:10:35,600 --> 00:10:39,680
family gathering around the 
telly and and joyously watching 

167
00:10:39,880 --> 00:10:46,840
the first half of this film. 
When I saw it was 2 1/2 hours, I

168
00:10:46,840 --> 00:10:50,400
thought and it and it began and 
we'll get into the film. 

169
00:10:50,400 --> 00:10:54,160
But it began pretty much with a 
song right, right at the outset,

170
00:10:54,720 --> 00:10:58,680
right out of the trap. 
And I thought, oh geez, is it 

171
00:10:58,680 --> 00:11:01,680
just going to be all music, all 
songs all the way through? 

172
00:11:01,760 --> 00:11:05,080
Is there not going to be any 
that natural dialogue or 

173
00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:08,440
anything already plot, You know,
and I thought 2 1/2 hours of 

174
00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:10,760
this. 
Did you start with 3 1/2 minutes

175
00:11:10,760 --> 00:11:13,480
of yes, of overture of a 
blackness? 

176
00:11:14,120 --> 00:11:16,880
Yes. 
Because I I thought there's 

177
00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:19,120
something wrong with. 
Yeah, I did too. 

178
00:11:20,160 --> 00:11:22,840
The the version of the film I 
was watching, I sort of fast 

179
00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:24,000
forwarded it. 
I was like, oh shit. 

180
00:11:25,640 --> 00:11:27,400
And there's like, Oh no, it's 
just three and a half, 3 1/2 

181
00:11:27,400 --> 00:11:28,480
minutes of music. 
Absolutely. 

182
00:11:29,120 --> 00:11:30,880
Yeah. 
And then there's still like 

183
00:11:30,880 --> 00:11:33,520
another 4 minutes of credits 
after that. 

184
00:11:33,560 --> 00:11:35,360
Yeah. 
And all the sketches by balls. 

185
00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:38,080
Going which are great. 
But you're right, it does. 

186
00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:40,600
For the 1st 10 minutes of this, 
it does feel like it's one of 

187
00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:44,720
those musicals like Evita where 
there's no dialogue, it is all 

188
00:11:44,720 --> 00:11:47,720
just singing because it goes 
from food, glorious food, into 

189
00:11:48,160 --> 00:11:51,000
Mr. Bumble saying what we're 
about to receive, and then it 

190
00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:53,400
goes straight into the Oliver 
song. 

191
00:11:53,800 --> 00:12:00,480
Oliver, Oliver never before as a
boy wanted more Oliver Oliver 

192
00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:02,680
and just for more when he knows 
what's in store. 

193
00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:07,200
There's a dark, thin winding 
stairway without any barrister, 

194
00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:14,640
which we throw him down. 
Oliver, Oliver. 

195
00:12:15,200 --> 00:12:17,200
What will he do when he's turned
black and blue? 

196
00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:20,120
He will rule the day. 
Somebody named him. 

197
00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:25,360
Oliver, Oliver, Oliver, Yeah. 
So it does feel that way and, 

198
00:12:25,400 --> 00:12:27,520
and thankfully it's not because 
I'm a little bit different. 

199
00:12:27,520 --> 00:12:29,240
I do and I think you're the same
robbery. 

200
00:12:29,240 --> 00:12:31,720
I've talked about this. 
I do really like musicals. 

201
00:12:31,760 --> 00:12:32,520
I love them. 
Yeah, I. 

202
00:12:32,520 --> 00:12:34,520
Don't have a problem at all with
that. 

203
00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:38,640
Spontaneously breaking into 
song, if you I mean a couple of 

204
00:12:38,640 --> 00:12:40,720
weeks ago. 
The last episode that we do, 

205
00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:43,680
which is coming out soon, is for
critters where we happily watch 

206
00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:46,200
little puppy aliens landing on 
Earth and causing havoc. 

207
00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:49,400
If I can stretch my imagination 
to that, I can certainly stretch

208
00:12:49,400 --> 00:12:50,800
it to a musical. 
Yeah. 

209
00:12:51,760 --> 00:12:54,200
That's the way I see it, so I 
don't have a problem with it at 

210
00:12:54,200 --> 00:12:57,160
all, and if the songs are good 
then I'm fine with it and I 

211
00:12:57,160 --> 00:12:58,760
consider these to be really good
songs. 

212
00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:01,240
It's like watching Cold 
Mountain. 

213
00:13:01,240 --> 00:13:04,600
You know, if Nicole Kidman's 
face can exist, then Civil War 

214
00:13:04,600 --> 00:13:09,360
era United States my suspension.
Will only go. 

215
00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:13,640
So far, yeah. 
I tend to, I tend to shy away 

216
00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:16,960
from anything fantastical 
particularly so I do. 

217
00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:20,320
I do find musicals I mean, I'd 
rather sit through. 

218
00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:22,960
I would show a realistic goon 
Nelu that, yeah. 

219
00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:29,240
Absolutely, absolutely. 
Every week I'm I'm watching my 

220
00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:33,360
Dinner with Andre. 
Or if there's that realism of 

221
00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:36,320
the biggest dog in the world, 
you're fine with that. 

222
00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:40,640
Yeah, you and Spike. 
Kitchen sink realism the whole 

223
00:13:40,640 --> 00:13:45,960
way. 
Yeah, well, listen, I think we 

224
00:13:45,960 --> 00:13:48,200
should do a little warm up. 
OK now. 

225
00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:51,120
Oh, hello. 
I've got a little, I've prepared

226
00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:54,000
a little little game that we can
play. 

227
00:13:54,160 --> 00:13:56,840
OK, Now it requires a pencil and
paper. 

228
00:13:56,840 --> 00:14:00,960
Have you got a pencil and paper?
No, but you've got a word 

229
00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:01,920
processor. 
Yeah. 

230
00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:05,720
OK, So what I've done, I've 
prepared, I've prepared a little

231
00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:11,560
overview of my week, OK? 
And I and I've included in this 

232
00:14:11,560 --> 00:14:17,800
little overview some very subtly
inserted songs from Oliver and 

233
00:14:17,800 --> 00:14:22,880
characters from Oliver, OK? 
I want you to see how many you 

234
00:14:22,880 --> 00:14:25,720
can spot, OK? 
This is going to be. 

235
00:14:26,080 --> 00:14:29,160
Challenging. 
All right, so, so here's pinned 

236
00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:31,720
back. 
All right, and here we go. 

237
00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:36,400
I'll tell you what, I'm on a 
diet, and I mean I consider 

238
00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:40,160
myself pretty strong willed, but
all I can think about is food. 

239
00:14:40,480 --> 00:14:45,800
Glorious food. 
I'd do anything for some pizza, 

240
00:14:46,400 --> 00:14:49,000
but my wife told me to go to the
green grocers and pick a rocket 

241
00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:51,480
or two for a salad to go with my
lunchtime sandwich. 

242
00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:56,800
I said I'd be back soon. 
A lot of people don't believe 

243
00:14:56,800 --> 00:14:58,400
me. 
There's nobody who will buy my 

244
00:14:58,400 --> 00:15:01,400
story that it's driving me nuts.
They think I'm fagging it, but 

245
00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:03,800
it's true. 
I may be getting old and 

246
00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:07,160
bumbling, but I'm I'm sincere. 
I'm a heartful codger. 

247
00:15:08,080 --> 00:15:10,640
On my way to the green grocer, I
walked past the Curry house and 

248
00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:14,080
normally I'd go in and say 
Oliver Chicken Madras, but 

249
00:15:14,080 --> 00:15:17,080
instead I just stood staring in 
as one of the cooks was 

250
00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:19,360
preparing clarified butter the 
traditional way. 

251
00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:22,720
As long as he needs ghee, he's 
doing it properly. 

252
00:15:26,560 --> 00:15:28,920
I popped into the Owl and 
Bullseye and saw they'd got a 

253
00:15:28,920 --> 00:15:33,400
guest ale, Starving Boy for sale
and I was tempted, but reviewing

254
00:15:33,400 --> 00:15:36,680
the situation I decided it was 
best not to, even if the other 

255
00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:41,200
regulars called me a Nancy. 
I got home and my wife had made 

256
00:15:41,200 --> 00:15:44,400
me the sandwich out of a healthy
brown loaf. 

257
00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:51,880
She said it's a fine loaf. 
Too good for me, Tyler, no. 

258
00:15:52,680 --> 00:15:54,680
Way too subtle. 
You could at least put in a 

259
00:15:54,680 --> 00:15:56,760
reference to masturbates, 
couldn't you? 

260
00:15:59,280 --> 00:16:02,280
All right, Master Bates. 
Well, I'm sorry, I've gone back 

261
00:16:02,280 --> 00:16:05,120
to the original source material 
of the Charlie Bates is called 

262
00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:10,720
Masturbates 100 Times. 
Oh God, I have written the twist

263
00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:11,920
as well. 
Yeah. 

264
00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:14,200
Chris is referring to the 
original text. 

265
00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:16,400
Yeah, the book of the film. 
None of the songs in there but a

266
00:16:16,400 --> 00:16:20,080
cracking ring. 
I read it about 20 years ago, I 

267
00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:25,160
can't remember much about it. 
Have you both read Oliver Twist?

268
00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:29,520
I about the same probably. 
I read it probably about 20, 

269
00:16:29,520 --> 00:16:33,080
maybe 25 years ago. 
Yeah, so I've read it in school,

270
00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:36,520
which is obviously more than 20 
years ago, but I did read it, 

271
00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:38,320
yeah, like about 10-15 years 
ago. 

272
00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:42,120
Something like that, yeah. 
I went through a period pre kids

273
00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:47,600
where I was, I challenged myself
that I'd read all of Dickens 

274
00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:51,360
works and I more or less did. 
Wow. 

275
00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:55,360
I read all apart from the the 
the last one, the the unfinished

276
00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:55,880
one. 
What's that? 

277
00:16:55,880 --> 00:16:57,600
Edwin Drood. 
Edwin Drood. 

278
00:16:59,320 --> 00:17:00,400
Yeah, but I read everything 
else. 

279
00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:03,160
Which has also been turned into 
a musical. 

280
00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:05,280
Did you know the mystery? 
Of Edwin Drood. 

281
00:17:05,319 --> 00:17:08,839
Yeah, here's a fun fact for you.
The music, the lyrics and the 

282
00:17:08,839 --> 00:17:13,920
book for the the musical drood 
exclamation mark were by Rupert 

283
00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:17,680
Holmes, who sang the pina colada
song Pina colada song Escape. 

284
00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:22,520
Yeah, you want a Tony for it? 
What is this thing with with 

285
00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:25,400
musicals with one word titles 
and an exclamation mark? 

286
00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:28,680
Was that Lionel Bart that began 
that or what? 

287
00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:31,760
Might well have been I I assume 
you're calling this week's 

288
00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:33,320
episode good part exclamation 
mark. 

289
00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:37,480
Yes. 
Yeah, it became sort of a his 

290
00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:40,040
takey kind of trope. 
Didn't it? 

291
00:17:40,080 --> 00:17:43,040
Oh, like elephant. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Elephant. 

292
00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:45,800
That's right, yeah. 
But there is a little bit of 

293
00:17:45,800 --> 00:17:51,880
overkill because one of Lionel 
Bart's less successful musicals.

294
00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:56,400
People said it was unsuccessful 
because it wasn't very good, but

295
00:17:56,400 --> 00:18:00,120
I think it's because he used 2 
exclamation Marks and that is 

296
00:18:00,120 --> 00:18:02,040
the infamous twang. 
Oh. 

297
00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:03,480
Yes, Twang. 
Yes. 

298
00:18:04,120 --> 00:18:09,080
Which, if you haven't read about
Twang exclamation mark, you 

299
00:18:09,080 --> 00:18:11,280
really should. 
It's his Robin Hood musical. 

300
00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:14,120
Oh yeah. 
Now how could it fail it? 

301
00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:17,400
Was Jack Wild in it? 
No, because he was in the other 

302
00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:19,080
Robin Hood. 
I'll tell you who he was in it 

303
00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:22,640
as Little John doing a Breslow. 
Fantastic. 

304
00:18:22,640 --> 00:18:24,680
Yep. 
Sheriff of Nottingham, I think 

305
00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:26,480
it was Bob Grant from On the 
Buses. 

306
00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:28,760
You know, Haunted teeth. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

307
00:18:29,120 --> 00:18:31,560
Will Scarlett. 
Ronnie Corbett. 

308
00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:33,720
Ronnie Corbett, yeah. 
Yeah, I think Barbara Windsor 

309
00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:36,160
was in it as well. 
It was like a Carry On film. 

310
00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:39,480
Yeah, I mean, I've listened to 
the cast recording soundtrack 

311
00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:43,080
and it sounds like they got the 
Carry On team to make a musical 

312
00:18:43,080 --> 00:18:45,360
about Robin Hood, but not in the
good Carry On era. 

313
00:18:45,360 --> 00:18:47,960
We're talking sort of like Carry
On Behind or Carry On England. 

314
00:18:48,240 --> 00:18:53,760
It's not strong. 
We, we, we have talked about 

315
00:18:53,760 --> 00:18:57,680
that previously on the show. 
I think, I can't remember in 

316
00:18:57,680 --> 00:19:02,880
what context, but was it James 
the actor, James Booth? 

317
00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:05,440
Was he the lead in it? 
He was James Booth played Robin 

318
00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:08,440
Hood, yeah. 
Yeah, because he he could have 

319
00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:11,520
been a much bigger star. 
I think because he turned down 

320
00:19:11,520 --> 00:19:15,320
something to to be in twang and 
whatever it was he turned down, 

321
00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:17,240
it could have been a real boost 
for his career. 

322
00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:19,080
But anyway, he decided to know 
he's going to do twang and 

323
00:19:19,080 --> 00:19:21,160
whatever it was. 
Maybe he turned down James Bond.

324
00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:22,120
I don't know. 
But you know. 

325
00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:24,440
Well, they would have needed to 
change a couple of letters in 

326
00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:25,960
the opening credits, so that 
would have been OK. 

327
00:19:26,440 --> 00:19:31,600
Yeah. 
Talking about twang reminds me 

328
00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:36,720
of the fact that the next movie 
that Carol Reed directed after 

329
00:19:36,720 --> 00:19:39,360
this, after getting the best 
director and best picture for 

330
00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:44,760
Oliver, was called Flap. 
What flap? 

331
00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:53,480
Flap. 
Yeah, I think Anthony Quinn's in

332
00:19:53,480 --> 00:19:53,880
it. 
I don't know. 

333
00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:55,360
I just got, I've got a Anthony 
Quinn. 

334
00:19:56,120 --> 00:20:07,400
Yeah, Anthony Quinn in flap. 
And yeah, it seems to be a dip 

335
00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:11,760
in quality from Oh, my pressure 
retired after Oliver, but oh. 

336
00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:16,560
My God, do you know? 
Do you know what it's about? 

337
00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:19,560
No, I just got to flat and saw a
picture of Anthony Quinn. 

338
00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:20,480
That's. 
All you need really. 

339
00:20:20,480 --> 00:20:25,600
And just, yeah, I was like, wow,
yeah, I'm not sure if it was 

340
00:20:25,600 --> 00:20:27,240
that. 
Lame. 

341
00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:28,640
Yeah, let's. 
Hope so. 

342
00:20:30,960 --> 00:20:34,160
Very, very specific part of a 
plane, yeah. 

343
00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:40,960
Anyway, now we're talking about 
Oliver, because, as any fuel 

344
00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:44,760
know, Harry Secom's in it, 
although he's not he's he's 

345
00:20:44,880 --> 00:20:47,760
well, he he's quite high up in 
the cast list, but he's not in a

346
00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:48,800
huge very. 
Prominent. 

347
00:20:49,600 --> 00:20:50,720
Yeah. 
He's, he's like third on the 

348
00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:51,200
bill. 
Yeah. 

349
00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:55,800
Yeah, but he's only, he's only 
got about, well, 10 minute 

350
00:20:55,800 --> 00:21:02,720
screen time in total maybe. 
Well, I think he arguably sees 

351
00:21:02,720 --> 00:21:08,080
the most iconic, well, second 
most iconic response to the most

352
00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:13,960
iconic line in in the film. 
I always remembered that as a 

353
00:21:13,960 --> 00:21:16,480
child. 
Yes. 

354
00:21:17,560 --> 00:21:19,240
Yeah. 
It was always a bit of a joke in

355
00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:22,320
my in my family as well, that 
after after you had dinner and 

356
00:21:22,320 --> 00:21:24,240
he went out for seconds, you 
know, someone would always go 

357
00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:28,440
please, Sir, I want some more. 
You lived in like a Dickens 

358
00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:33,920
funhouse. 
Yeah, sooty faced urchins we 

359
00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:40,080
were, and I was really, you 
know, I'm not, I'm not hugely au

360
00:21:40,120 --> 00:21:43,320
fait with the work of Harry 
Secom, but I couldn't believe 

361
00:21:43,320 --> 00:21:47,360
his beautiful tenor voice. 
It was like Pavarotti. 

362
00:21:47,360 --> 00:21:55,280
Yeah, he was amazing. 
And he's also really great in 

363
00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:56,760
this. 
You just watch him on the screen

364
00:21:56,960 --> 00:21:59,600
and he's always got a little bit
of business in the best bit 

365
00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:01,720
where he's checking the dust on 
his finger and nobody's looking 

366
00:22:01,720 --> 00:22:03,120
and he's kind of looks all 
embarrassed. 

367
00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:05,920
All the bit where he's haggling 
in Boy for Sale. 

368
00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:07,880
It's just. 
It's just hilariously, yeah, 

369
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:10,800
yeah, he keeps dropping the 
price and yeah, yeah, yeah. 

370
00:22:10,960 --> 00:22:23,120
It's really good. 
He's going cheap. 

371
00:22:23,120 --> 00:22:26,320
How much then? 
Only 7 giddies? 

372
00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:35,480
How much that all there about? 
Yeah, it's nice. 

373
00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:38,560
It's nice to see him working 
briefly with Leonard Rossiter as

374
00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:41,040
well. 
Oh yeah, absolutely. 

375
00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:43,440
Because that was a that was a 
surprise. 

376
00:22:43,840 --> 00:22:48,160
Was the rivalry sort of, you 
know, from piece of Sellers and 

377
00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:50,280
and the like? 
I mean, I just imagine Peter 

378
00:22:50,280 --> 00:22:54,200
Sellers looking at looking at 
Harry's performance and thus the

379
00:22:54,200 --> 00:23:01,200
best picture when a really 
amazing singing performance and 

380
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:02,920
just kind of. 
Peter Sellers offered the role 

381
00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:06,800
of Fagin in this. 
Yeah, which I don't know if he 

382
00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:08,440
was pleased he. 
Didn't get it. 

383
00:23:08,440 --> 00:23:09,480
Oh, I'm thrilled. 
Yeah, because. 

384
00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:12,920
He's always very sensitive with 
the sort of racial stereotypes. 

385
00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:15,880
Yes. 
Yeah, yeah, I'm sure he would 

386
00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:17,520
have asked for the extra hooky 
nose. 

387
00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:20,800
Yeah, prosthetic, yeah, if you'd
done it, but. 

388
00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:23,240
Because it was Peter Sellers was
was. 

389
00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:25,560
And if it if it had been Peter 
Sellers, that would have been an

390
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:28,360
interesting film. 
You know, obviously, although 

391
00:23:28,360 --> 00:23:30,640
Fagin and Mr. Bumble don't 
actually meet, do they? 

392
00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:33,720
So, so they wouldn't have shared
the screen together. 

393
00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:39,160
But Peter O'till was also 
offered it Again, I don't think 

394
00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:42,000
he would have made much of a 
fist of it really. 

395
00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:48,520
However, this is interesting. 
I thought Lionel Bart had wanted

396
00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:50,200
Bruce Forsythe as Fagin. 
Oh. 

397
00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:58,320
God, you got pick. 
A pocket or 2A pocket or two, 

398
00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:02,520
you got pick. 
Nice to rub you to rub you nice.

399
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:06,520
I'm reviewing the situation 
higher or lower. 

400
00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:15,360
Yeah, I mean, Ron Moody though 
is phenomenal. 

401
00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:18,520
Yeah. 
It's just incredible. 

402
00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:25,240
I remember as a kid, Fagan was 
my favorite part and I just, I 

403
00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:28,560
thought of him as a goodie when 
I was a kid and probably because

404
00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:31,480
I faded away by after the 
intermission when I was when I 

405
00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:35,400
was a child watching this. 
But he's just incredible. 

406
00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:41,440
The movement, everything. 
He is just, I think all the 

407
00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:44,440
performances, nearly all the 
performances, we'll talk about 

408
00:24:44,440 --> 00:24:51,840
Mark Mr. But you know, I just I 
was so, so captivated by his 

409
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:53,640
performance and this I thought 
it was wonderful. 

410
00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:58,280
I was, I was worried about some 
anti-Semitic tropes kind of 

411
00:24:58,920 --> 00:25:05,120
coming through. 
But obviously Ron Moody was 

412
00:25:05,120 --> 00:25:10,200
Jewish and he deliberately 
worked to to subvert those kind 

413
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:15,000
of tropes. 
And we don't have the 1948 Alec 

414
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:19,160
Guinness who sort of decked out 
like. 

415
00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:22,360
Like the sketches in the 
original? 

416
00:25:22,360 --> 00:25:25,680
Book like the sketches in the 
original book yeah but but 

417
00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:32,880
pretty much looking almost like 
an orc or something and yeah I 

418
00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:36,240
was just couldn't believe that 
good he was I can't believe it 

419
00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:37,960
when the the Oscar was nominated
but. 

420
00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:41,160
You won the Golden Globe. 
You did win the golden but. 

421
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:44,800
People always talk about actors 
creating the role. 

422
00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:46,240
You always see that a lot in 
theatre. 

423
00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:48,720
They create all just basically 
they acted what they were told 

424
00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:50,560
to do. 
But with this, he literally did 

425
00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:52,840
create the role. 
He worked with Lionel Bart on 

426
00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:59,360
changing the Fagin character 
from this awful evil trope into 

427
00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:02,560
a clown like figure, something 
much more entertaining. 

428
00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:04,680
And so that's all on him. 
He did that. 

429
00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:06,400
He wasn't told to do that. 
He actually created that 

430
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:08,360
himself. 
Because the Fagin in the book is

431
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:12,800
as much less ambiguously, evil 
isn't. 

432
00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:14,480
He, oh, he's completely and 
utterly evil. 

433
00:26:14,760 --> 00:26:19,080
He's controlling it because as 
we probably know, there's about 

434
00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:22,000
2/3 of the book that doesn't 
make it to either the stage play

435
00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:23,600
or the musical. 
All the stuff to do with all of 

436
00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:27,040
his half brother, his cousin 
Rose Wiley or whatever she's 

437
00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:29,720
called, none of that is in this.
And all of that is kind of 

438
00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:31,800
orchestrated behind the scenes 
by Fagan. 

439
00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:34,760
He arranges for Oliver to do 
that break in because his 

440
00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:37,520
brother is working with Fagan. 
So it's all Fagan. 

441
00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:40,760
Fagan is the one who gets Nancy 
killed by getting the bill to go

442
00:26:40,760 --> 00:26:41,120
and. 
Get it? 

443
00:26:41,120 --> 00:26:41,760
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
So. 

444
00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:44,200
He's an outright. 
And he's executed at the end of 

445
00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:48,920
his hand, yeah. 
Yeah, but in this, he obviously 

446
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:50,280
he's still a baddie. 
He's still a thief. 

447
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:54,800
Yeah, he's exploiting children. 
Yeah, but he's a he's a fun one.

448
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:56,240
But he's got a heart. 
He does have a. 

449
00:26:56,320 --> 00:26:59,920
Heart, he's like a he's like a 
sort of like a disreputable 

450
00:26:59,920 --> 00:27:01,880
uncle figure. 
Isn't he? 

451
00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:04,080
Yeah, Yeah. 
I mean, there are there are some

452
00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:10,160
moments where like particularly 
when Oliver sort of spies on him

453
00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:15,000
and his little secret stash of 
treasures and he asks him if if 

454
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:17,680
he saw where he put it. 
And you get the impression that 

455
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:21,040
obviously, yes, I saw he was he 
was going to do a man. 

456
00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:27,200
But yeah, he just falls on the 
on the right side of sort of 

457
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:28,640
lovable rogue. 
Yeah. 

458
00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:30,640
And there's one bit in 
particular where he protects 

459
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:34,960
Nancy with Bill is fighting with
Nancy and she's fighting back 

460
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:36,880
and, and Fagin obviously knows 
that if that happens, she's 

461
00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:39,240
going to get seriously hurt. 
So he kind of gets in the middle

462
00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:41,560
and sort of goes, oh, Nancy, 
you're so funny, you're so funny

463
00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:43,440
and really breaks down the 
situation. 

464
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:44,840
It's really, really nice and 
done. 

465
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:49,600
It's just amazing, yeah. 
The the the I'd do Anything 

466
00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:54,400
dance where he his character 
starts off by sort of grudgingly

467
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:58,800
allowing them to perform the 
number and then he just can't 

468
00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:00,960
help himself from joining in. 
I could just. 

469
00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:05,360
Believe it when I speak out loud
where he just bursts in with 

470
00:28:05,360 --> 00:28:07,320
umbrella and feathers in his 
hair just like yeah. 

471
00:28:07,360 --> 00:28:09,480
About the place. 
It's yeah, I just loved. 

472
00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:12,800
It and he sort of corrupts the 
song from being this kind of 

473
00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:14,480
nice, sweet. 
I would do anything for you to 

474
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:19,120
reminding the the pickpockets 
that don't do anything for him, 

475
00:28:19,120 --> 00:28:20,160
really. 
Yeah. 

476
00:28:20,560 --> 00:28:25,400
Would you rub a sharp anything? 
Would you risk the drop 

477
00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:27,280
anything? 
No. 

478
00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:31,480
Your eyes go pop anything and 
you come down. 

479
00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:44,240
Yes, we. 
Do anything. 

480
00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:51,120
Anything. 
We'll get to work then. 

481
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:53,200
No argument. 
When there's fine pickings in 

482
00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:54,600
the street, get out and on your 
feet you. 

483
00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:56,160
Promised we'd go and see the 
hanging. 

484
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:01,000
I was thinking about how many 
boys are with Fagin there. 

485
00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:04,080
How many boys are? 
There's got to be two dozen, 

486
00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:06,280
maybe. 
Yeah. 

487
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:07,040
Really. 
About that? 

488
00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:08,000
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

489
00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:10,680
Does he have to? 
Does Fagin do they have to 

490
00:29:10,680 --> 00:29:14,000
perform that dance to show how 
they pick pockets every time a 

491
00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:20,120
new boy joins? 
God, yeah, it's a lot of 

492
00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:22,200
investment, isn't it? 
And they're so good at it. 

493
00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:24,480
Very tired. 
That's why they're so tight. 

494
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:26,320
Yeah. 
What was it, 10,000 hours? 

495
00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:27,280
What was it? 
Malcolm Gladwell. 

496
00:29:28,080 --> 00:29:32,560
Yes, that's right, 2000 hours 
the. 

497
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:36,960
Beatles and in Germany. 
The thing about Fagin as well, 

498
00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:40,600
he's he's quite vulnerable. 
He shows he's got a vulnerable 

499
00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:45,440
side and he's obviously 
subservient to Bill Sykes, 

500
00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:51,360
Oliver Reed's character. 
And I love that bit where we 

501
00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:56,640
first see Sykes and he's been on
the Rob and he's handing over 

502
00:29:56,640 --> 00:30:02,120
his ill gotten gains to to to 
Fagin. 

503
00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:06,400
He's got sack and he's pulling 
out these endless, you know, 

504
00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:10,320
trinkets and silverware and 
jewelry from from his jacket and

505
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:11,520
it's. 
Almost like. 

506
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:12,400
A. 
It just seemed to be endless. 

507
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:13,560
There's. 
A naked Gun where they take 

508
00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:14,640
their guns off. 
Isn't it? 

509
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:15,960
Yeah. 
Well, I was. 

510
00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:18,720
I was watching to bend down and 
unscrew a false leg. 

511
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:27,600
Yeah, a full grown woman hops 
out of the sack and. 

512
00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:35,040
Just going back to the stage 
version because the I don't know

513
00:30:35,040 --> 00:30:41,000
what it was, but the The Artful 
Dodger on stage was has been 

514
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:44,720
played by the likes of Steve 
Marriott, Phil Collins and Davy 

515
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:48,680
Jones from The Monkees. 
Tony Robinson. 

516
00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:52,000
Tony Robinson, who? 
He understudied Steve Marriott. 

517
00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:55,400
Well, he was good friends with 
Steve Marriott and I think, I 

518
00:30:55,400 --> 00:31:01,160
think Ichiku Park is, is 
inspired by his Marriott's 

519
00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:02,880
friendship with Tony Robinson to
some degree. 

520
00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:06,920
Oh, OK. 
Yeah, because they used to knock

521
00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:14,400
it out together for the film. 
Jim Davidson auditioned for The 

522
00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:15,120
Artful Dodger. 
Jesus. 

523
00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:21,240
Christ. 
Well, well, you know that. 

524
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:25,480
You know that he's a bit Brexit.
He the Artful Dodger. 

525
00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:29,520
He always says he leaves the 
country and then we'll see what 

526
00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:31,760
happens. 
In the book he gets transported 

527
00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:36,280
to Australia. 
It would have been nice to have 

528
00:31:36,280 --> 00:31:40,160
It's Only a Game. 
So bad to believe I'm right in 

529
00:31:40,160 --> 00:31:40,920
this. 
That would have been. 

530
00:31:43,560 --> 00:31:45,960
Good. 
It had been giving Ron Moody 

531
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:49,280
notes on, you know, come on, 
make it a bit more racially 

532
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:50,040
insensitive. 
Come on. 

533
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:58,000
Stop being so woke, Ron. 
Next you tell me Robin Esquith 

534
00:31:58,440 --> 00:31:59,880
went first at the role of 
Oliver. 

535
00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:04,640
Oh, God. 
Or Malcolm McDowell. 

536
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:09,280
Mark Lester. 
Mark Lester, who plays Oliver is

537
00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:11,080
a bit of a cipher in the film, 
really, isn't he? 

538
00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:16,000
He's he's the title character, 
but he's kind of, he's the least

539
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:18,200
interesting. 
He's sort of us in the book as 

540
00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:20,320
well, from memory. 
He's quite passive in the book 

541
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:21,040
as well. 
He's. 

542
00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:25,400
Hardly in the book at all. 
He just hangs around with his 

543
00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:28,000
new family while all this other 
stuff goes on. 

544
00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:30,320
All the stuff that happens in 
the film, it happened in David 

545
00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:31,720
Lean's film. 
I think it's where it started, 

546
00:32:31,720 --> 00:32:34,680
when Bill Sykes takes him and 
holds him hostage and all of 

547
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:35,960
that. 
All of that happens to Bill 

548
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:38,720
Sykes alone. 
There's no snatching back of 

549
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:42,680
Oliver or anything like that. 
He is incredibly dormant 

550
00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:44,120
throughout the majority of the 
film. 

551
00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:46,480
And I, I can't remember, I did 
read a review and I can't 

552
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:50,680
remember if it was Leonard 
Maltin or Roger Ebert when the 

553
00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:52,800
film first came out. 
It probably is Roger Ebert and 

554
00:32:52,800 --> 00:32:58,160
he said that the film makers 
have quite rightly recognized 

555
00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:00,800
that Oliver is the least 
interesting character in his own

556
00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:03,800
film. 
And so we've put him on in 2nd 

557
00:33:03,800 --> 00:33:05,680
place. 
Everyone else is is much more 

558
00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:08,560
interesting and so they've 
really put them ahead of him and

559
00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:09,760
absolutely right, quite right 
too. 

560
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:14,400
Yeah, And I, as I was watching 
this, I was thinking, oh, God, 

561
00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:17,320
Mike Lister's performances. 
But. 

562
00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:20,680
But for all I know, for all we 
know, I guess he's just doing 

563
00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:22,840
what the director wanted him to 
do. 

564
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:27,320
He's got that kind of angelic, 
cherubic sort of face. 

565
00:33:27,320 --> 00:33:28,880
He. 
Just looks innocent. 

566
00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:29,520
Yeah. 
And that's the. 

567
00:33:29,520 --> 00:33:34,200
Point and my heart you know the 
the scene where Bumble is 

568
00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:37,880
they're walking through the snow
and Bumble's trying to sell them

569
00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:44,400
my heart really did go out some 
and when he's in the 

570
00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:47,320
undertaker's sort of cellar and 
he sings his little. 

571
00:33:52,640 --> 00:33:55,320
Richie Rich there. 
His, his singing voice, every 

572
00:33:55,320 --> 00:34:01,880
time he sang it made me giggle 
because just thinking I wanted 

573
00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:06,240
him to do oh God, what's that? 
Nothing compares to you. 

574
00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:07,440
But she had a Connor or 
something. 

575
00:34:07,440 --> 00:34:08,920
And that's just what he sounded 
like to me. 

576
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:16,600
It's been 7 hours. 
But yeah, my heart went out to 

577
00:34:16,600 --> 00:34:17,400
him. 
He's an innocent. 

578
00:34:17,639 --> 00:34:21,920
He's an innocent child. 
Well, I'll tell you what, 

579
00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:22,800
though. 
I'll tell you what. 

580
00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:24,360
Mark Lester. 
Yeah. 

581
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:27,120
Later on, Yeah. 
You know what you did later on, 

582
00:34:27,120 --> 00:34:28,199
don't you? 
I do, yeah. 

583
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:30,239
He reckons he fathered Michael 
Jackson's children. 

584
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:31,560
Absolutely. 
Yeah. 

585
00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:34,560
And he told Damon Holmes that, 
so it must be true. 

586
00:34:34,639 --> 00:34:38,920
Yeah, yeah, he was. 
He was besties with Jacko, 

587
00:34:38,920 --> 00:34:39,320
wasn't he? 
He? 

588
00:34:39,679 --> 00:34:43,040
Was yeah, he's godfather to the 
children and potentially. 

589
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:44,679
Actually, biological father, 
yeah. 

590
00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:48,199
Which did make me think, there's
the scene towards the end where 

591
00:34:48,199 --> 00:34:50,880
Bill Sites is hanging Marc 
Lester over this balcony and I 

592
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:53,080
just thought, well, that's going
to happen to his children. 

593
00:34:56,880 --> 00:35:00,640
Yeah, I mean, either way, he 
does claim that he gave Michael 

594
00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:08,480
Jackson a sperm donation prior 
to the kids being born, probably

595
00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:11,440
most of his house guests at one 
stage or the other. 

596
00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:17,360
And he's an osteopath now. 
Mark Lester, yes. 

597
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:21,040
Yes. 
Which seems about right I think.

598
00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:24,440
Yeah, and acupuncture, I think. 
He's. 

599
00:35:25,320 --> 00:35:28,000
Yeah, you've. 
Got a pickpocket? 

600
00:35:28,160 --> 00:35:31,720
Or two. 
You've got a pricker. 

601
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:36,680
Got a pricker, Robert or too? 
Yeah, I was watching this film 

602
00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:40,120
and the name Oliver just kept 
being repeated and repeated and 

603
00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:42,120
repeated. 
And I had to go. 

604
00:35:42,120 --> 00:35:44,000
I had to get up and go and call 
the cat in. 

605
00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:49,600
And I went outside and bellowed 
Oliver, because his name's Milo.

606
00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:54,880
Yeah, because seek him. 
Seek him really does that 

607
00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:58,360
Oliver. 
And then his wife, I noticed, 

608
00:35:58,360 --> 00:36:00,880
went Oliver and I was like, 
yeah, I'm more with you, lady. 

609
00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:03,680
We don't need to. 
His name's not Oliver is. 

610
00:36:05,320 --> 00:36:07,320
That Peggy man to his wife. 
Yes. 

611
00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:13,520
I'm sure he has. 
No, there are some good roles in

612
00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:17,920
here for the the older women and
they're played by some amazing 

613
00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:20,280
character actors like. 
Hilda Baker. 

614
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:25,440
Hilda Baker, Absolutely. 
Who's who's Leonard Ross at his 

615
00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:27,560
wife and that so Leonard Ross 
that plays the undertaker 

616
00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:30,240
Sowerby. 
Sowerberry isn't. 

617
00:36:30,720 --> 00:36:31,560
It celebrity. 
Yeah. 

618
00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:35,120
And and does a nice he's he's 
obviously a bit of a drunk. 

619
00:36:35,120 --> 00:36:38,360
I love that bit where he comes 
in pissed and takes advantage of

620
00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:40,720
Oliver vacating the coffin and 
he climbs in some. 

621
00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:45,240
Friends at the cemetery. 
It's quite comfortable. 

622
00:36:45,240 --> 00:36:47,600
I I love how he calls his wife 
my love. 

623
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:51,360
My love. 
That's quite comfortable in 

624
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:54,480
there. 
Well, well, well. 

625
00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:57,160
Having a rest, Mr. Bumble. 
He's sitting on Oliver. 

626
00:36:57,320 --> 00:36:59,320
Quite right. 
We must all sit on Oliver. 

627
00:36:59,480 --> 00:37:03,440
You've been drinking again. 
I miss a friend in the cemetery.

628
00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:09,320
Who's in there? 
Yeah. 

629
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:11,760
Coffin should not have been 
occupied until tomorrow. 

630
00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:14,240
It's reserved for a very 
important client. 

631
00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:19,040
Stand back. 
Now. 

632
00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:20,440
Then what's an explanation? 
You're young. 

633
00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:21,800
Scary wag. 
He called my. 

634
00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:23,480
Mayonnaise. 
And what if he did, you 

635
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:26,200
ungrateful little Wretch? 
She deserved what he said, and 

636
00:37:26,200 --> 00:37:28,120
worse, she. 
Didn't she did. 

637
00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:30,840
It's alone. 
Put him down in the cellar, Mr. 

638
00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:31,920
Bumble. 
That'll teach him my. 

639
00:37:32,720 --> 00:37:40,680
Love really quite comfortable. 
Are you disappointed that they 

640
00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:43,920
didn't include the Sowerberry 
song in the film? 

641
00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:46,440
Because there is a song that 
they sing in the stage 

642
00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:49,760
production, which is That's Your
Funeral, which is a really good 

643
00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:52,720
song. 
They sing it with Bobby and for 

644
00:37:52,720 --> 00:37:56,440
whatever reason, this is one of 
the I think 3 songs that were 

645
00:37:56,440 --> 00:37:59,360
cut from the film. 
It was a shame because I think 

646
00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:02,440
it would have been great to see 
Leonard Rosser and Hilda Baker 

647
00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:04,920
singing. 
Didn't we see Hilda Baker and 

648
00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:06,880
Arthur Mullard singing? 
Sing, you're the one that I 

649
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:08,520
want. 
About 10 years later. 

650
00:38:09,360 --> 00:38:12,080
If you're filled with infection,
yeah. 

651
00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:21,600
Well, I am, I have to confess, I
was after, you know, Chris and I

652
00:38:21,600 --> 00:38:25,760
sort of agreed to do this. 
I was slightly dreading watching

653
00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:27,400
myself. 
Oh God, it's going to be a 

654
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:31,280
really stodgy, you know, 4 hour 
long. 

655
00:38:31,560 --> 00:38:34,160
It's like watching Chitty Chitty
Bang Bang or Hello Dolly or 

656
00:38:34,160 --> 00:38:40,640
something, you know? 
And I was like really pleasantly

657
00:38:40,640 --> 00:38:45,280
surprised with how much I 
enjoyed this and just how 

658
00:38:45,640 --> 00:38:53,840
brilliant every aspect of it is.
Almost like the sets are fucking

659
00:38:53,880 --> 00:38:56,920
phenomenal. 
It's incredible that everything 

660
00:38:56,920 --> 00:38:58,920
is a set, everything on 
Shepperton. 

661
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:00,800
Oh my God. 
So like right after the 

662
00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:03,720
intermission, when he wakes up 
and Brownlow's sort of terraced 

663
00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:07,120
white, you know, and he looks 
out the the window. 

664
00:39:07,720 --> 00:39:09,760
I couldn't believe that that was
this. 

665
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:11,480
Amazing. 
Studio backlog or whatever. 

666
00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:12,680
Yeah, that's amazing. 
That is amazing. 

667
00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:17,280
You know, and that first set. 
So when you when it starts with 

668
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:20,720
food, glorious food, it almost 
looks like Tim Burtonesque. 

669
00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:24,960
Yeah, it's almost this kind of 
slight, slightly 

670
00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:27,720
expressionistic. 
Everything's in a funny angle, 

671
00:39:27,720 --> 00:39:30,600
something's really too long or 
too wide, so it's all stretched.

672
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:34,240
Yeah, but it's got almost kind 
of like Ken Adam Bond, kind of 

673
00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:37,800
like the vastness of it and the 
way that the camera sort of 

674
00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:41,160
sweeps around and Bumble sort of
descends the stairs and it's 

675
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:46,560
just everything looks big and 
real and layered and with lots 

676
00:39:46,560 --> 00:39:48,800
of depth. 
And I just visually I was, I was

677
00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:53,520
surprised how just the textured 
visually it was. 

678
00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:58,560
Well, I, I didn't realize it was
a set, the Bloomsbury Square who

679
00:39:58,560 --> 00:40:02,160
will buy bit. 
So I was really, really 

680
00:40:02,160 --> 00:40:04,480
impressed by that. 
I mean, that goes on and on and 

681
00:40:04,480 --> 00:40:05,960
on and on. 
But it took about six weeks to 

682
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:08,920
film, I gather. 
And it begins with that. 

683
00:40:09,440 --> 00:40:11,520
What would you call it? 
So you know, the sort of flower 

684
00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:13,240
seller. 
Yeah, yes. 

685
00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:16,640
Like violets, lovely violets. 
Oh, you've got a kind face, 

686
00:40:16,640 --> 00:40:19,240
Governor, and no mistake that 
that sort of woman if. 

687
00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:21,480
It was, yeah. 
If it was Yellow Beard, it would

688
00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:23,360
be the little girl going. 
Do you like to buy a lump of 

689
00:40:23,360 --> 00:40:23,920
shit? 
Yes. 

690
00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:28,320
Yeah, that's it, That's it. 
But I love the way that it 

691
00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:29,840
builds up. 
So you've got you've got the 

692
00:40:29,840 --> 00:40:31,680
flour seller, then you've got 
milk maids, then you've got 

693
00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:35,240
various other buffeters of goods
like the knife grinder, and then

694
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:37,080
it just builds up and up and up 
and up. 

695
00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:40,600
And it's just so there's not, 
there's nothing out of place. 

696
00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:43,040
Everybody is on their mark, 
aren't they? 

697
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:47,000
Must have been. 
Oh, the choreography. 

698
00:40:47,000 --> 00:40:47,720
It's. 
Incredible. 

699
00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:50,280
Yeah. 
Because as well, something I did

700
00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:52,920
notice having listened to the 
soundtrack a couple of times, is

701
00:40:52,920 --> 00:40:56,360
that the the opening melody 
starts with exactly the same 

702
00:40:56,880 --> 00:41:02,000
notes as Boy For Sale. 
OK, so it's got that same 

703
00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:06,400
introduction, but the way it 
turns from complete despair to 

704
00:41:06,400 --> 00:41:09,880
this absolute joy is a really 
good way of showing how his life

705
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:12,120
has changed just using that same
little piece of music. 

706
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:16,080
It's great. 
I was quite surprised to see 

707
00:41:16,080 --> 00:41:19,520
that this was made in 68. 
I always kind of thought of it 

708
00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:24,800
as a bit earlier. 
It must really be right on that 

709
00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:29,440
cusp of sort of the the, the, 
the death of these really 

710
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:33,000
sweeping, epic kind of musicals.
This was the last musical to win

711
00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:35,240
Best Picture until Chicago, I 
think. 

712
00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:38,160
Yeah, and the following year's 
best picture when I was Midnight

713
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:40,160
Cowboy. 
I mean you can get Wow. 

714
00:41:40,240 --> 00:41:43,040
Yeah. 
You know, in terms of like 

715
00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:51,120
epochal shifts, yeah. 
I mean, even at Shepperton, I 

716
00:41:51,120 --> 00:41:53,760
think this the same year at 
Shepperton that this was made, 

717
00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:56,640
2001 was made. 
Yeah, Yeah, there's. 

718
00:41:57,000 --> 00:41:58,440
The Linda Rossiter. 
Yeah, yeah. 

719
00:41:59,920 --> 00:42:02,040
You're talking about the set as 
well. 

720
00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:06,760
I'm I'm listening to The Michael
Palin Diaries, the first volume,

721
00:42:07,120 --> 00:42:13,320
the audio book that Palin reads 
himself and he talks about 

722
00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:23,760
making Jabberwocky in 77 and the
Oliver set was still there and 

723
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:26,240
they repurposed parts of it for 
Jabberwocky. 

724
00:42:26,240 --> 00:42:29,680
Apparently they were. 
Still dismantling it. 

725
00:42:30,120 --> 00:42:32,880
Yeah. 
And then and then, and that was 

726
00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:37,480
77. 
Two years later, having filmed 

727
00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:46,360
in Tunisia, Palin had to refilm 
a small sequence of the ex leper

728
00:42:46,480 --> 00:42:49,480
scene, Right. 
He was, yeah. 

729
00:42:49,760 --> 00:42:53,640
He, he writes to his diary that 
he he was on the Oliver set to 

730
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:55,920
film that bit. 
And that's 79. 

731
00:42:58,120 --> 00:43:00,640
Yeah. 
What do we think about the G 

732
00:43:00,640 --> 00:43:05,000
rating? 
So for British people, what does

733
00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:07,240
G rating mean? 
Is that like a like a used 

734
00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:09,280
certificate? 
Or like general like just? 

735
00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:13,120
The PG basically. 
Well, no, it's anyone can see 

736
00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:14,400
it. 
You don't even need parental 

737
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:19,200
guidance. 
General admission, I mean. 

738
00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:20,480
I saw it when I was. 
Little. 

739
00:43:20,720 --> 00:43:26,800
Well, so did I, but watching it 
with these old wizard eyes, that

740
00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:30,360
is fucking bleak subject matter,
isn't it? 

741
00:43:30,360 --> 00:43:31,520
Oh. 
Absolutely I. 

742
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:37,400
Mean there's psychological abuse
domestic violence you know a 

743
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:42,400
woman is bludgeoned to death by 
her partner there's the poverty 

744
00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:45,440
that these children and, you 
know the the terrors that are 

745
00:43:45,440 --> 00:43:49,200
visited upon these children yeah
the. 

746
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:51,600
Kids love stuff like that. 
Yeah, I know. 

747
00:43:51,600 --> 00:43:54,760
But it's not kind of like, it's 
not like a Roald Dahl story 

748
00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:58,520
where it is clearly slightly, 
you know, fantastical. 

749
00:43:58,520 --> 00:44:01,480
It is a fairy tale though. 
Yeah, but it's, it's really 

750
00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:07,160
rooted in reality, isn't it? 
I mean, it's why Seconds wrote 

751
00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:08,640
it. 
He sort of wrote it as a. 

752
00:44:08,880 --> 00:44:12,920
Oh, it's a satire of of the 
class system and of poverty, but

753
00:44:13,400 --> 00:44:14,880
I think it is clearly a fairy 
tale. 

754
00:44:14,880 --> 00:44:18,960
It is the young man who finally 
gets his, realizes who he is, 

755
00:44:18,960 --> 00:44:22,120
and he's related to someone very
rich, and he manages to escape 

756
00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:23,560
it all after going through those
hardships. 

757
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:27,680
So it's very Cinderella. 
Oh, it is, but it's not set in a

758
00:44:27,680 --> 00:44:30,080
land far, far away. 
It's set in a workhouse and 

759
00:44:30,080 --> 00:44:35,760
Dunstable and, you know, and 
yeah, it just, it just feels 

760
00:44:35,760 --> 00:44:37,120
pretty kind of grim. 
Come on. 

761
00:44:37,480 --> 00:44:56,640
Come on. 
But I tell you, who is in this 

762
00:44:56,840 --> 00:44:59,880
Gale platform? 
Coronation Street Helen Worth It

763
00:44:59,880 --> 00:45:02,760
is apparently an urchin in the 
Consider Yourself sequence. 

764
00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:04,000
Really. 
Oh, really? 

765
00:45:04,400 --> 00:45:06,240
Yeah, GAIL. 
GAIL, Oh, GAIL. 

766
00:45:06,280 --> 00:45:08,560
GAIL. 
I'm going to have to go through 

767
00:45:08,560 --> 00:45:12,040
and look for all the little 
urchins that don't have chins. 

768
00:45:16,480 --> 00:45:18,000
That are making terrible life 
choices. 

769
00:45:20,200 --> 00:45:21,960
The murderer chasing after? 
Yeah. 

770
00:45:24,880 --> 00:45:26,680
It's quite it would be better. 
If it was Norris. 

771
00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:35,880
It was Norris as Bill Sykes. 
Emily Bishop is Nancy. 

772
00:45:37,680 --> 00:45:40,160
Ashley is Oliver. 
Oh God. 

773
00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:43,400
They're dancing on the red 
wreck. 

774
00:45:45,280 --> 00:45:47,520
Well, I think Fred Elliott is 
Fagan to be brilliant you've. 

775
00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:50,080
Got to. 
Assay, you've got to pick a 

776
00:45:50,120 --> 00:45:51,800
bucket or two. 
That'd be great. 

777
00:45:53,160 --> 00:45:55,560
Yeah. 
Oh God, we're just sending into 

778
00:45:55,560 --> 00:45:56,880
courage again. 
No, we'd be voting. 

779
00:45:57,400 --> 00:45:58,280
Oliver. 
Oliver. 

780
00:46:01,040 --> 00:46:02,280
Mike Baldwin would be brown, 
though. 

781
00:46:02,280 --> 00:46:07,200
It'd be great. 
It'd. 

782
00:46:07,400 --> 00:46:07,720
Be good. 
Yeah. 

783
00:46:07,720 --> 00:46:10,360
Who'd be the outful Dodger? 
Probably David Platt. 

784
00:46:10,640 --> 00:46:11,800
David Platt. 
Yeah, David. 

785
00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:13,720
Yeah. 
Or Steve maybe? 

786
00:46:14,040 --> 00:46:15,320
Chesney. 
Is he still in it? 

787
00:46:15,400 --> 00:46:16,880
I don't know. 
Chesney. 

788
00:46:17,480 --> 00:46:20,960
Yeah, Schmeichel as dog 
Schmeichel could be. 

789
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:27,080
Bullseye. 
There we go. 

790
00:46:27,560 --> 00:46:31,240
Yeah, done. 
I I I was sad to read that 

791
00:46:32,920 --> 00:46:36,360
because obviously this Oliver 
made Lionel bar didn't it really

792
00:46:36,480 --> 00:46:41,120
and all did it and well, it did,
I believe. 

793
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:45,320
But then he, he, he kind of, he 
was a bit of a boozer and he had

794
00:46:45,320 --> 00:46:50,760
all sorts of expensive habits 
and, and obviously a series of 

795
00:46:50,760 --> 00:46:54,840
flops. 
And due to a a a serious decline

796
00:46:54,840 --> 00:46:59,840
in his fortunes, he sold the 
rights to Oliver to, of all 

797
00:46:59,840 --> 00:47:05,160
people, Max Bygraves for £350. 
So not big money. 

798
00:47:06,520 --> 00:47:10,520
It's just incredible because I 
think he was friends with Max 

799
00:47:10,520 --> 00:47:14,160
Bygraves from because I didn't 
line about did things ain't what

800
00:47:14,160 --> 00:47:15,880
they used to be. 
And I think Max Bygraves was 

801
00:47:15,880 --> 00:47:17,280
involved in that at. 
Some time they've. 

802
00:47:17,440 --> 00:47:20,960
Known each other for a long time
and I couldn't work out when 

803
00:47:21,200 --> 00:47:23,400
he'd sold it because I read 
something somewhere that he sold

804
00:47:23,400 --> 00:47:25,840
the rights to Oliver in like 
1959. 

805
00:47:26,080 --> 00:47:28,480
But all the things I've read 
that it was done afterwards when

806
00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:31,040
he was on his yeah yeah Yeah 
binge in the. 

807
00:47:31,240 --> 00:47:34,120
Early 70s, yes, that's what I 
think it was, yeah. 

808
00:47:34,320 --> 00:47:37,920
So was this sort of playing on 
the West End or Broadway or? 

809
00:47:38,120 --> 00:47:39,960
It depends when he sold it to 
yeah. 

810
00:47:40,080 --> 00:47:43,240
Bygroves. 
But as we know, there's been so 

811
00:47:43,240 --> 00:47:47,400
many West End revivals, yeah, 
which I think for about the last

812
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:49,640
30 years, Cameron Macintosh is 
on the right. 

813
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:54,400
So he just had no inkling of the
success that was in store for 

814
00:47:54,400 --> 00:47:58,080
him with us before he sold it. 
It depends. 

815
00:47:58,360 --> 00:48:01,440
Like I said, I've seen I've seen
some articles where he said he 

816
00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:03,840
sold it before and some that 
said he sold it after. 

817
00:48:04,160 --> 00:48:07,160
So I'm not entirely sure when he
sold it to Max Bygraves. 

818
00:48:07,680 --> 00:48:10,040
Yeah. 
Well, Bygraves. 

819
00:48:10,600 --> 00:48:14,280
But Bygraves sold them on for 
quarter of £1,000,000. 

820
00:48:15,040 --> 00:48:17,240
Imagine going home that night 
and being love, I've just bought

821
00:48:17,240 --> 00:48:22,600
the rights to Oliver. 
But love, I've just bought the 

822
00:48:22,600 --> 00:48:27,000
New Testament. 
All the rights to Oliver. 

823
00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:28,240
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

824
00:48:29,080 --> 00:48:30,600
I did the hands as well, you can
see that. 

825
00:48:35,080 --> 00:48:36,960
What's that used to say? 
I want to tell you a story. 

826
00:48:37,000 --> 00:48:38,640
I want to tell you a story. 
I. 

827
00:48:38,720 --> 00:48:41,000
Want to tell you a story? 
I've just just bought the first 

828
00:48:41,160 --> 00:48:49,240
issue of Action Comics. £30 got 
the Mona Lisa down at the 

829
00:48:53,320 --> 00:48:55,200
market. 
His family fortunes, wouldn't 

830
00:48:55,200 --> 00:48:58,680
it? 
So, OK, have either of you, 

831
00:48:58,960 --> 00:49:03,520
because I have either of you, 
sold something cheaply out of 

832
00:49:03,520 --> 00:49:11,200
desperation? 
Yeah, we used to have, there was

833
00:49:11,200 --> 00:49:15,600
a company here called Cash 
Converters basically like it was

834
00:49:15,600 --> 00:49:18,600
a porn shop, but it was like a 
porn shop chain. 

835
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:26,480
And I do remember, you know, 
taking in like CDs and things 

836
00:49:26,480 --> 00:49:30,440
when I was at uni and just 
desperate to probably buy a 

837
00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:37,640
baggie of weed, if I'm honest. 
But you know, it was that phase 

838
00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:40,200
of my life where I deep fried 
breed at one point, just there 

839
00:49:40,320 --> 00:49:42,360
just to get by. 
So. 

840
00:49:42,520 --> 00:49:45,320
But yeah, nothing very pretty, 
nothing precious to me, nothing 

841
00:49:45,320 --> 00:49:50,480
really dear to me. 
I think for me, I had quite a 

842
00:49:50,480 --> 00:49:55,800
good vinyl collection when I 
lived in the UK and when it came

843
00:49:55,800 --> 00:50:00,280
to moving out here it was kind 
of impractical to bring them all

844
00:50:00,280 --> 00:50:03,360
out here and just needed a bit 
of money for the journey. 

845
00:50:03,360 --> 00:50:06,960
So I sold them all for not very 
much money at all. 

846
00:50:07,200 --> 00:50:09,640
And it's a bit, it's a bit like 
Shaun of the Dead. 

847
00:50:09,640 --> 00:50:11,160
It was original pressing Blue 
Monday. 

848
00:50:11,160 --> 00:50:12,840
It was all that kind of thing, 
you know, needing. 

849
00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:15,240
Some money for the journey. 
I'm, I'm, I'm picturing like an 

850
00:50:15,240 --> 00:50:16,720
American tail or something with 
you. 

851
00:50:18,360 --> 00:50:21,440
I know some of the time I hanky.
On the back of your bindle on 

852
00:50:21,440 --> 00:50:26,520
your cinema voyage. 
Literally had no cash, not even 

853
00:50:26,520 --> 00:50:29,520
for like the airport hotel or 
fuck am I going to do so. 

854
00:50:29,520 --> 00:50:33,720
I just sold all my vinyl to one 
of my friend's boyfriends and he

855
00:50:33,800 --> 00:50:35,640
said I'll look after it and I 
thought I bet he did. 

856
00:50:36,360 --> 00:50:37,840
I bet he did. 
Because there was a bit of it. 

857
00:50:37,840 --> 00:50:39,280
Was there any wedding present in
there? 

858
00:50:39,360 --> 00:50:43,040
There was, oh, 10 inch of 
dalliance, which was like only 

859
00:50:43,040 --> 00:50:44,760
about 500 of them were ever 
made. 

860
00:50:45,440 --> 00:50:46,960
He's now living in a solid gold 
house. 

861
00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:49,720
He is. 
Yeah, he shits gold. 

862
00:50:49,760 --> 00:50:53,760
Yeah, he really did. 
So here's the thing, right? 

863
00:50:55,120 --> 00:50:58,880
Late 90s no, probably mid 90s. 
I was thinking I was living in 

864
00:50:58,880 --> 00:51:03,400
Burnage in Manchester and I had 
AI was working in a record shop,

865
00:51:03,400 --> 00:51:09,320
didn't have a lot of money and 
I'm not proud of it. 

866
00:51:09,320 --> 00:51:12,640
I had an item of great value, 
shall we say? 

867
00:51:13,200 --> 00:51:20,240
OK, shall we say I was, I was at
that time, I was a little bit 

868
00:51:20,480 --> 00:51:27,920
off the rails and I needed some 
food and cigarettes and I guess 

869
00:51:27,920 --> 00:51:30,880
booze as well. 
And I went to the local shop 

870
00:51:30,880 --> 00:51:34,720
that I would always frequent, 
which was owned by a bit of a 

871
00:51:34,720 --> 00:51:38,920
wide boy, let's face it. 
And I didn't actually have any 

872
00:51:38,920 --> 00:51:41,360
actual money. 
So I took this item of great 

873
00:51:41,360 --> 00:51:46,720
value and I said, if I give you 
this, can I take some stuff from

874
00:51:46,720 --> 00:51:50,240
your shop, please? 
And he said yes. 

875
00:51:51,240 --> 00:51:57,320
And I got things like, I don't 
know, maybe A4 pack of lager, a 

876
00:51:57,320 --> 00:52:02,800
Pot noodle or two, some ciggies,
probably, probably worth nothing

877
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:07,720
more than £1015.00 in total. 
And, and then I woke up the next

878
00:52:07,720 --> 00:52:09,360
morning and thought, what have I
done? 

879
00:52:09,720 --> 00:52:11,680
What have I done? 
And I went back into the shop 

880
00:52:12,120 --> 00:52:14,520
and tried to, you know, say, 
look, I'll pay for the, I'll 

881
00:52:14,520 --> 00:52:16,560
give you the proper money, but 
can I have that back, you know? 

882
00:52:17,880 --> 00:52:23,080
And he just just laughed in my 
face and all that is such a 

883
00:52:23,080 --> 00:52:25,080
painful memory for me. 
What was his name? 

884
00:52:25,080 --> 00:52:30,520
Fagan. 
Well, the Banton of me, Banton 

885
00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:32,840
of me waking up the next morning
and rushing around to the shop, 

886
00:52:32,840 --> 00:52:34,320
but it's it's closed up. 
He's left. 

887
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:38,880
He's got there's a sign saying 
gone to the Bahamas. 

888
00:52:39,200 --> 00:52:41,160
Free shop for anyone who wants 
Yeah, yeah. 

889
00:52:43,800 --> 00:52:47,920
I always remember my dad telling
me that when he was young, when 

890
00:52:47,920 --> 00:52:52,160
he was little, his granddad 
showed him this book and said, 

891
00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:55,760
01 day, this book will be yours.
And then a few years later, my 

892
00:52:55,760 --> 00:52:59,600
dad sort of asked his 
grandmother where it was, and 

893
00:52:59,600 --> 00:53:02,400
she said that she'd sold it 
because they needed it to pay 

894
00:53:02,440 --> 00:53:03,920
the rent or whatever it was. 
Yeah. 

895
00:53:04,600 --> 00:53:07,920
And it was a first edition of 
Origin of the Species. 

896
00:53:08,240 --> 00:53:09,880
Oh my God. 
Signed. 

897
00:53:10,840 --> 00:53:12,160
No. 
Yeah. 

898
00:53:12,960 --> 00:53:15,840
What by? 
By no, by my grand, not by his 

899
00:53:15,840 --> 00:53:18,680
granddad, no by Mr. Darwin 
himself. 

900
00:53:19,880 --> 00:53:21,520
The origin of the origin of, I 
think. 

901
00:53:21,520 --> 00:53:24,320
We sold for a couple of 
shillings just to get some bread

902
00:53:24,320 --> 00:53:25,720
in the corner. 
Wow. 

903
00:53:25,720 --> 00:53:28,720
Yeah, I wouldn't be sitting in a
garage talking to you now if he 

904
00:53:28,760 --> 00:53:30,400
still had that, obviously. 
No. 

905
00:53:31,040 --> 00:53:34,840
Is there a sort of a form of 
Darwinism and and losing that? 

906
00:53:34,920 --> 00:53:35,680
Very. 
Ironic. 

907
00:53:35,680 --> 00:53:37,520
Yes, it is actually. 
Yeah. 

908
00:53:40,320 --> 00:53:43,000
Wow, yeah. 
Holy shit. 

909
00:53:43,000 --> 00:53:46,960
Yeah, yeah. 
So, OK, back to the film, back 

910
00:53:46,960 --> 00:53:47,320
to. 
The film. 

911
00:53:47,320 --> 00:53:47,960
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
Sorry. 

912
00:53:48,280 --> 00:53:54,720
Yeah, so Mr. Brownlow, Mr. 
Brownlow, who's this kindly old 

913
00:53:54,720 --> 00:53:58,760
gentleman or older gentleman who
takes all of that under his 

914
00:53:58,760 --> 00:54:01,000
wing, and it's such a 
coincidence that Oliver should 

915
00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:02,960
be related to him? 
To find out. 

916
00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:09,800
Well, it's all of A twist that 
took me ages to realize that. 

917
00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:12,720
Is that? 
What is that? 

918
00:54:12,800 --> 00:54:14,760
Very, very soapy? 
And the joke is, it's all of A 

919
00:54:14,760 --> 00:54:17,880
twist. 
Yes, because that because that 

920
00:54:17,880 --> 00:54:19,800
was Oliver Twist was his second 
novel. 

921
00:54:19,800 --> 00:54:21,160
I think I have to pick with. 
Papers. 

922
00:54:21,800 --> 00:54:24,200
Yeah, and the early Dickens 
works. 

923
00:54:24,200 --> 00:54:25,920
Serialized. 
Yeah. 

924
00:54:26,520 --> 00:54:28,840
Well, yeah, it was serial 
because it's not Victorian. 

925
00:54:28,840 --> 00:54:32,360
It's technically it's pre 
Victorian because when it was 

926
00:54:32,360 --> 00:54:34,640
serialized, William the 4th was 
still on the throne and then he 

927
00:54:34,640 --> 00:54:39,200
died a few months later. 
Yes, so technically it's pre 

928
00:54:39,200 --> 00:54:41,800
Victorian. 
Williams, Ian. 

929
00:54:43,320 --> 00:54:49,200
Yes, but no Dickens, I know in 
his earlier, earlier works he he

930
00:54:49,200 --> 00:54:52,200
would often have these very 
characters with very punning 

931
00:54:52,680 --> 00:54:54,240
names or. 
Yeah. 

932
00:54:54,840 --> 00:54:57,800
Sort of on the nose kind of 
names, like is it Nicholas 

933
00:54:57,800 --> 00:54:59,720
Nickleby? 
There's a character called Count

934
00:55:00,040 --> 00:55:04,400
Very Soft who's a bit of a milk 
toast character. 

935
00:55:05,600 --> 00:55:08,160
Do the boys whole? 
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, 

936
00:55:08,160 --> 00:55:09,400
yeah, yeah, yeah, he doesn't. 
Need Dickens? 

937
00:55:09,400 --> 00:55:15,200
He had some wonderful names. 
He had a talent that I've got to

938
00:55:15,200 --> 00:55:19,360
say, JK Rowling does not have. 
Did he? 

939
00:55:19,520 --> 00:55:21,120
Did he have a character called 
Mr. Flap? 

940
00:55:21,640 --> 00:55:25,120
I don't. 
Misses twang, yeah. 

941
00:55:26,760 --> 00:55:29,120
We know Twang Carol. 
Carol Carol Reed saw that. 

942
00:55:29,120 --> 00:55:35,800
It's a film on that. 
I think it was David Baddiel 

943
00:55:35,800 --> 00:55:39,840
said that, that that's the thing
with with Dickens is he always 

944
00:55:39,840 --> 00:55:41,760
named his character things like 
Miss Lovely and things like 

945
00:55:41,760 --> 00:55:43,720
that. 
And all the baddies are called 

946
00:55:43,720 --> 00:55:46,720
like Mr. Complete Bastard. 
So he does the good job that he 

947
00:55:46,720 --> 00:55:51,160
didn't invent Pluto, I suspect 
Mr. Murderer. 

948
00:55:54,320 --> 00:55:57,480
But apparently he did that 
because in his early days of, of

949
00:55:57,480 --> 00:55:59,600
trying to be a writer, when he 
was, I think, a political 

950
00:55:59,600 --> 00:56:04,400
journalist, somebody made fun of
his name and said his name was 

951
00:56:04,400 --> 00:56:07,000
very dull and very boring or 
very queer, as they called it. 

952
00:56:07,120 --> 00:56:09,360
Yeah. 
And so he was then determined to

953
00:56:09,360 --> 00:56:13,760
give all his characters very 
imaginative names just to summon

954
00:56:13,760 --> 00:56:15,960
up the character. 
Charles Dickens isn't a boring 

955
00:56:15,960 --> 00:56:16,520
name. 
Dick. 

956
00:56:18,240 --> 00:56:22,000
Edens. 
Yeah, through high school with a

957
00:56:22,000 --> 00:56:24,160
name Surname like Dickens? 
Exactly. 

958
00:56:26,560 --> 00:56:27,880
Actually, he never went to 
school. 

959
00:56:27,920 --> 00:56:30,000
Yeah, I would. 
I would work out at the age of 

960
00:56:30,000 --> 00:56:30,720
12. 
Wasn't he? 

961
00:56:30,720 --> 00:56:31,400
Yeah. 
Didn't he work? 

962
00:56:31,440 --> 00:56:33,160
He work in a boot blacking 
factory. 

963
00:56:33,160 --> 00:56:34,880
He did. 
Yes, yeah, because his father 

964
00:56:34,880 --> 00:56:37,400
went to the debtors jail. 
Oh. 

965
00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:40,960
And so he was forced into work. 
Was it Marshall C Prison? 

966
00:56:41,080 --> 00:56:43,160
Was that what it was called? 
I think so. 

967
00:56:43,200 --> 00:56:47,400
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 
And so as was the, as was the 

968
00:56:47,400 --> 00:56:50,880
style at the time, he was then 
forced into work. 

969
00:56:51,560 --> 00:56:53,200
And yeah, it was it was blacking
boots. 

970
00:56:54,360 --> 00:56:56,840
I suppose you want some place to
sleep tonight? 

971
00:56:56,880 --> 00:56:59,480
Aye. 
Do you know of anywhere? 

972
00:57:05,440 --> 00:57:09,960
As it so happens, I know a 
respectable old gentleman what 

973
00:57:09,960 --> 00:57:12,120
will give you lodgings for 
nothing, really. 

974
00:57:12,480 --> 00:57:16,160
I never asked for the change. 
That is, if any other gentleman 

975
00:57:16,160 --> 00:57:18,400
emails, introduces you and down 
in our name. 

976
00:57:19,200 --> 00:57:21,160
He must be a very kind old 
gentleman. 

977
00:57:22,560 --> 00:57:24,880
Oh. 
Oh, yes, yes, yes, she's very 

978
00:57:24,920 --> 00:57:27,800
kind. 
And I'm a particular favorite of

979
00:57:27,800 --> 00:57:31,320
this. 
Well, now, if you're coming 

980
00:57:31,320 --> 00:57:33,000
along, I better know who you 
are. 

981
00:57:33,440 --> 00:57:35,640
My name is Oliver. 
Oliver Twist. 

982
00:57:35,960 --> 00:57:39,120
And mine's Jack Dawkins. 
Better known among me, more 

983
00:57:39,240 --> 00:57:41,160
intimate friends, is the artful 
Dodge. 

984
00:57:41,240 --> 00:57:44,080
Pleased to meet you, Mr. Dodger.
We've not really touched on, 

985
00:57:44,080 --> 00:57:46,280
we've talked about, we've talked
about most of the cast, but 

986
00:57:46,280 --> 00:57:48,560
we've not really talked about 
the Artful Dodger, Jack Wilde. 

987
00:57:49,360 --> 00:57:51,560
It's a sad tale. 
It's very good. 

988
00:57:51,560 --> 00:57:53,160
A sad tale. 
Why so? 

989
00:57:54,040 --> 00:57:57,000
Oh, he had a very had a very 
difficult life. 

990
00:57:57,000 --> 00:58:03,160
So he he was 16, yes. 
He played Charlie Bates in the 

991
00:58:03,160 --> 00:58:05,880
West End for a few years. 
And his brother was Oliver. 

992
00:58:06,160 --> 00:58:08,200
Yeah, I think apparently he was 
discovered by Phil Collins, his 

993
00:58:08,200 --> 00:58:11,000
mum, who was a theatrical agent.
It was that typical thing. 

994
00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:12,920
She saw him playing football and
thought there's a cheeky chap. 

995
00:58:12,960 --> 00:58:14,280
Yeah. 
And signed him up when he went 

996
00:58:14,280 --> 00:58:18,000
to stage school. 
But yeah, he was, it was 16 when

997
00:58:18,000 --> 00:58:19,880
it came out and I think he was 
like 15 when it was being 

998
00:58:19,880 --> 00:58:22,000
filmed. 
And he was actually wearing 

999
00:58:22,000 --> 00:58:25,680
lifts because he was even 
shorter than Mark Lester. 

1000
00:58:25,760 --> 00:58:30,520
I I love one, one of my favorite
films as a child was Puffin 

1001
00:58:30,520 --> 00:58:34,880
stuff, the Puffin stuff film and
Jack was the lead and that as 

1002
00:58:34,880 --> 00:58:36,640
well. 
And he doesn't, he doesn't look 

1003
00:58:36,640 --> 00:58:42,280
particularly, I don't remember 
him being like a real Midget and

1004
00:58:42,280 --> 00:58:43,840
puff and stuff. 
He looked like a normal size, 

1005
00:58:43,840 --> 00:58:47,760
but he looks tiny in this. 
Maybe it's sort of the oversized

1006
00:58:47,760 --> 00:58:49,560
coat and top hat and things like
this. 

1007
00:58:49,920 --> 00:58:52,480
But he was basically an 
alcoholic. 

1008
00:58:52,480 --> 00:58:54,080
So he was 16 when he made 
Oliver. 

1009
00:58:54,080 --> 00:58:59,720
He was an alcoholic by the age 
of 21, squandered all his riches

1010
00:59:01,640 --> 00:59:05,440
and just had a really just a 
terribly hard life. 

1011
00:59:05,880 --> 00:59:08,040
I think. 
I don't think it was until 1989 

1012
00:59:08,040 --> 00:59:10,920
that he sort of beat his 
alcoholism. 

1013
00:59:11,880 --> 00:59:15,040
He ended up dying of oral 
cancer. 

1014
00:59:15,040 --> 00:59:18,200
I think he had his tongue and 
part of his jaw removed. 

1015
00:59:18,200 --> 00:59:19,520
Or he has got 2. 
Voice box removed. 

1016
00:59:19,760 --> 00:59:24,840
Yeah, and you only have to watch
his little cameo appearance and 

1017
00:59:25,360 --> 00:59:28,240
Robin Hood, Prince of Thieves, 
which is what, 1991? 

1018
00:59:29,520 --> 00:59:33,360
And he just looks like God. 
He looks like Scarecrow. 

1019
00:59:33,360 --> 00:59:35,120
Sounds awful, but he looks like 
Golem. 

1020
00:59:35,400 --> 00:59:37,760
Yeah, he does. 
Yeah, he does. 

1021
00:59:38,520 --> 00:59:44,840
And I think as a kid watching 
this, you immediately are drawn 

1022
00:59:44,840 --> 00:59:49,640
to the Artful Dodger. 
He's so charismatic and such a 

1023
00:59:49,640 --> 00:59:53,560
great performance. 
And yeah, it's just really sad. 

1024
00:59:53,560 --> 00:59:58,200
What happened to Jack Wild? 
Well, he, he and the Dodger and 

1025
00:59:58,200 --> 01:00:00,320
Fagin make a great double act. 
I mean, they're not. 

1026
01:00:00,800 --> 01:00:04,840
They don't do a lot together, 
but right at the end when you 

1027
01:00:04,840 --> 01:00:09,000
realize that Fagin is kind of 
one of the good guys. 

1028
01:00:09,360 --> 01:00:11,840
I suppose in a in a way one of 
the. 

1029
01:00:12,240 --> 01:00:13,480
Yeah, least bad. 
Well. 

1030
01:00:13,520 --> 01:00:15,400
He turns his back on the worst 
thing. 

1031
01:00:15,400 --> 01:00:17,360
Yeah, and he didn't want. 
Any more of it? 

1032
01:00:17,400 --> 01:00:19,920
Yeah. 
Reviewing the situation. 

1033
01:00:19,920 --> 01:00:23,080
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
Because the, the the climax of 

1034
01:00:23,080 --> 01:00:24,640
the film, of course, were Oliver
Reed. 

1035
01:00:25,480 --> 01:00:26,600
Who doesn't have a song, Does 
he? 

1036
01:00:26,600 --> 01:00:28,200
Oliver Reed? 
No. 

1037
01:00:28,200 --> 01:00:30,200
Thankfully. 
He he does in the stage 

1038
01:00:30,200 --> 01:00:33,880
production, there's a song 
called My Name, which is just 

1039
01:00:33,880 --> 01:00:37,240
his introduction, which is 
everyone trembles at the thought

1040
01:00:37,240 --> 01:00:42,680
of my name, but it was it was 
removed from the film. 

1041
01:00:43,480 --> 01:00:48,360
Opinions are divided upon why 
some say that a character that 

1042
01:00:48,360 --> 01:00:52,440
scary shouldn't have a song. 
He shouldn't be singing and 

1043
01:00:52,440 --> 01:00:55,320
dancing because he's a murderer.
Other people have said it's a 

1044
01:00:55,320 --> 01:00:57,480
time factor because it's already
quite a long film. 

1045
01:00:58,160 --> 01:01:02,080
But I think if anyone who's seen
Do You Think It's All Right in 

1046
01:01:02,080 --> 01:01:05,960
Tommy might work out the real 
reason why Oliver Reed isn't 

1047
01:01:05,960 --> 01:01:09,040
singing in this film. 
So there's no opportunity for 

1048
01:01:09,040 --> 01:01:10,560
like a little spoken word, kind 
of. 

1049
01:01:11,160 --> 01:01:14,240
Thing no, it was just removed 
completely yeah they use the 

1050
01:01:14,280 --> 01:01:16,560
theme when he's dangling all 
over over you can hear the doom 

1051
01:01:16,720 --> 01:01:20,000
doom doom doom do do do which is
the verses from my name but 

1052
01:01:20,000 --> 01:01:21,640
that's the only. 
Sort of thing you can. 

1053
01:01:21,680 --> 01:01:25,040
Use it because he's really good 
in this, isn't he all all very. 

1054
01:01:25,040 --> 01:01:27,960
That's terrifying. 
That first scene that you talked

1055
01:01:27,960 --> 01:01:30,760
about earlier, Tyler, I mean, 
you just see his sort of 

1056
01:01:30,760 --> 01:01:34,320
silhouette approaching. 
A Shadow in a Tunnel, directed 

1057
01:01:34,320 --> 01:01:35,400
by Carol Reed. 
Yeah. 

1058
01:01:36,040 --> 01:01:38,480
Yeah. 
At a slight angle. 

1059
01:01:38,480 --> 01:01:44,080
Yeah, cookie clocks. 
And he just sees nothing through

1060
01:01:44,080 --> 01:01:46,680
that whole scene where he's 
like, you know, taking out the 

1061
01:01:46,960 --> 01:01:52,960
stolen goods from their sack. 
And it's just exudes sinister 

1062
01:01:53,880 --> 01:01:55,760
evil. 
When I was a kid, I was 

1063
01:01:55,760 --> 01:01:57,440
terrified. 
Yeah, I was scared of him too. 

1064
01:01:57,440 --> 01:01:57,840
I was a. 
Kid. 

1065
01:01:57,880 --> 01:02:00,800
I can still understand why 
because he plays it like a 

1066
01:02:00,800 --> 01:02:02,400
serial killer in a horror. 
Movie. 

1067
01:02:02,440 --> 01:02:05,960
Yeah, when I was a kid. 
There's this in Gisbane. 

1068
01:02:06,880 --> 01:02:10,960
There was a local magician 
called Barry Sykes, and I 

1069
01:02:10,960 --> 01:02:15,240
remember being sort of like, Oh 
no, no, sounds too close to Bill

1070
01:02:15,240 --> 01:02:17,040
Sykes. 
All on account of his no. 

1071
01:02:17,360 --> 01:02:19,840
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
What about Eric Sykes? 

1072
01:02:22,280 --> 01:02:26,360
He didn't come to school so. 
Eric never came to kids, but. 

1073
01:02:26,840 --> 01:02:32,000
No, Barry Sykes. 
However, I'm not taking your 

1074
01:02:32,000 --> 01:02:33,680
card. 
I don't want your card, Barry. 

1075
01:02:39,600 --> 01:02:42,800
Again, and of course, he was 
Carol Reed, the director's 

1076
01:02:42,840 --> 01:02:45,480
nephew, and he was suggested for
the role, wasn't he? 

1077
01:02:45,480 --> 01:02:48,360
And that was in the family. 
Connection, the producer, John 

1078
01:02:48,360 --> 01:02:51,440
Wolf said he didn't know which. 
I mean, Oliver Reed wasn't a 

1079
01:02:51,920 --> 01:02:53,800
huge star at the time, so 
that's. 

1080
01:02:54,560 --> 01:02:57,040
Plausible. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

1081
01:02:57,640 --> 01:03:00,320
Carol Reed was already in pre 
production on flat so. 

1082
01:03:05,400 --> 01:03:07,520
The actress that plays Nancy 
Shani Wallace. 

1083
01:03:07,640 --> 01:03:10,000
Shani Wallace, yeah. 
Yeah, she's very good. 

1084
01:03:10,640 --> 01:03:13,120
She's done a lot of stage stuff,
a lot of Broadway and a lot of 

1085
01:03:13,120 --> 01:03:15,600
West End productions, and that's
what she went back to after 

1086
01:03:15,600 --> 01:03:18,120
this. 
I felt she was slightly miscast.

1087
01:03:19,360 --> 01:03:23,080
I mean, she's absolutely fine at
the singing and the actual 

1088
01:03:23,080 --> 01:03:27,600
performance herself, but I just 
didn't get AI wanted something 

1089
01:03:27,600 --> 01:03:31,200
slightly bit of a six year kind 
of vibe. 

1090
01:03:32,800 --> 01:03:36,360
But like Rita Webb. 
Yeah. 

1091
01:03:37,720 --> 01:03:39,960
Well, Marty, I was going to, I 
was going to say Marty. 

1092
01:03:40,240 --> 01:03:41,360
Was Marty was played Nancy? 
1st. 

1093
01:03:41,960 --> 01:03:43,640
She has played Nancy. 
Actually in one. 

1094
01:03:43,680 --> 01:03:45,560
Of the world, Well, Harry Webb. 
Was he go? 

1095
01:03:46,760 --> 01:03:49,000
He was busy doing Heathcliff. 
Harry Webb. 

1096
01:03:51,000 --> 01:03:52,160
Who, you ask? 
I have never. 

1097
01:03:52,160 --> 01:03:54,440
Marty Feldman. 
I have never done a Nancy before

1098
01:03:54,440 --> 01:04:03,680
you went but they did want 
Shirley Bassey to be honest. 

1099
01:04:04,840 --> 01:04:08,360
But the it's said that she 
didn't get it because she was 

1100
01:04:09,120 --> 01:04:12,040
too Welsh. 
I'm sure, yeah. 

1101
01:04:12,480 --> 01:04:15,720
But also, you know, I'll do 
anything as long as we're like, 

1102
01:04:15,720 --> 01:04:17,440
I mean, just yeah. 
Yeah. 

1103
01:04:18,160 --> 01:04:22,800
It's a fun life. 
Joe Longthorne, that's great. 

1104
01:04:24,720 --> 01:04:27,160
But yeah, I mean, she's, she's 
absolutely, it's absolutely 

1105
01:04:27,160 --> 01:04:29,200
good. 
Apparently, wasn't there a bit 

1106
01:04:29,200 --> 01:04:32,440
of a feeling that the person who
created the role and we seemed 

1107
01:04:32,440 --> 01:04:34,120
should have? 
There was. 

1108
01:04:34,400 --> 01:04:37,120
Georgia Brown didn't. 
Get because she she done at the 

1109
01:04:37,120 --> 01:04:40,360
West End on Broadway for about 6
years and she claimed she didn't

1110
01:04:40,360 --> 01:04:42,840
get it because Ron Moody didn't 
like her. 

1111
01:04:44,840 --> 01:04:45,960
Moody by name. 
Moody by name. 

1112
01:04:46,560 --> 01:04:50,520
But he's got denied that because
I think I I was, I looked on 

1113
01:04:50,520 --> 01:04:52,720
YouTube and there was, I'm not 
really caught an interview, a 

1114
01:04:52,720 --> 01:04:55,320
conversation with Shanie Wallace
and Harry Secombe, which is 

1115
01:04:55,320 --> 01:04:58,400
actually on set. 
OK, while while the film was 

1116
01:04:58,400 --> 01:05:00,880
being made and she was saying 
she got offered the role very, 

1117
01:05:00,880 --> 01:05:05,120
very early. 
She was in in Broadway doing a 

1118
01:05:05,120 --> 01:05:07,040
musical version of How Green Was
My Valley. 

1119
01:05:07,600 --> 01:05:09,240
OK. 
Which sounds a bit Spinal Tap, 

1120
01:05:09,240 --> 01:05:10,880
isn't it? 
Musical version of Somebody Up 

1121
01:05:10,880 --> 01:05:14,600
There Likes Me and Ed Sullivan 
happened to be in there and saw 

1122
01:05:14,640 --> 01:05:17,360
it and invite invited her on the
show to do a couple of the 

1123
01:05:17,360 --> 01:05:20,480
songs. 
John Wolfe saw her on the show 

1124
01:05:20,680 --> 01:05:23,040
and the next day phoned her and 
said would you like to be in the

1125
01:05:23,040 --> 01:05:24,000
film production? 
OK. 

1126
01:05:24,120 --> 01:05:26,280
And it was, it was made about 
two years later, something like 

1127
01:05:26,280 --> 01:05:27,000
that. 
OK. 

1128
01:05:27,040 --> 01:05:30,720
So she got it very, very early. 
Yeah, I just, I didn't, I didn't

1129
01:05:30,720 --> 01:05:33,800
really believe her. 
And Bill Sykes as a couple, for 

1130
01:05:34,640 --> 01:05:36,680
some reason, I don't know, she 
just, there's something too 

1131
01:05:36,680 --> 01:05:42,480
wholesome about her. 
Yeah, not not slatternly enough.

1132
01:05:42,880 --> 01:05:49,120
No, I mean, she did look, she 
had a fine heaving bosom, but a 

1133
01:05:49,160 --> 01:05:50,680
really terrible haircut. 
Not her fault. 

1134
01:05:52,120 --> 01:05:54,720
Strange fringe thing. 
But yeah, no, it's just, I don't

1135
01:05:54,760 --> 01:05:57,960
know someone. 
But at least hang on, at least 

1136
01:05:58,680 --> 01:06:02,440
at least she she was a cockney, 
unlike Madeline Khan in yellow 

1137
01:06:02,440 --> 01:06:07,560
beard. 
Yeah, Now, Madeline Khan, she 

1138
01:06:07,560 --> 01:06:10,720
would have been. 
She would have been a good 

1139
01:06:10,720 --> 01:06:11,760
Nancy. 
She would have been a good 

1140
01:06:12,960 --> 01:06:16,000
Nancy, accent aside. 
Aside because the whole thing, 

1141
01:06:16,040 --> 01:06:17,800
like Boo, would be tough for a 
cuddle. 

1142
01:06:19,680 --> 01:06:24,280
Sugar draws. 
Because the thing about Nancy 

1143
01:06:24,280 --> 01:06:27,720
is, as, as we all know, it's the
ability to belt out a song, 

1144
01:06:28,000 --> 01:06:29,440
which is what Nancy does. 
Yeah. 

1145
01:06:29,440 --> 01:06:31,120
And she does that very well. 
She does that. 

1146
01:06:31,120 --> 01:06:32,280
She. 
Absolutely hammers it. 

1147
01:06:32,360 --> 01:06:37,160
Up she does a a great job of 
fine life and as long as he 

1148
01:06:37,160 --> 01:06:39,360
needs me God, it's a dude it's 
the. 

1149
01:06:39,360 --> 01:06:42,080
Stand by your man of the 1960s, 
though, isn't. 

1150
01:06:42,080 --> 01:06:42,960
It really? 
Oh yes. 

1151
01:06:42,960 --> 01:06:46,520
That that was the you know, I 
was worried about the sort of 

1152
01:06:46,520 --> 01:06:52,600
anti-Semitism, which was sort of
ungrounded kind of worry for me.

1153
01:06:52,600 --> 01:06:57,120
But yeah, all that song about 
the oh, we'll give you a black 

1154
01:06:57,120 --> 01:06:58,640
eye and. 
It's a fine life. 

1155
01:06:59,400 --> 01:07:02,560
It's a Fine Life was meant to be
a sort of a satirical song or 

1156
01:07:02,560 --> 01:07:04,880
being sarcastic, but it's not, 
though they perform it like they

1157
01:07:04,880 --> 01:07:08,080
really enjoy the lifestyle. 
I said you'd always cover one 

1158
01:07:08,080 --> 01:07:09,800
while he blacks the other. 
One, yeah. 

1159
01:07:10,920 --> 01:07:13,280
And then, you know, that would 
have been unsavory enough, but 

1160
01:07:13,280 --> 01:07:17,560
particularly the way that what 
ends up with the same character.

1161
01:07:19,440 --> 01:07:24,240
Bullseye, the dog, I believe had
to undergo six hours and make up

1162
01:07:24,240 --> 01:07:30,200
every day or something. 
Basically Tim Curry and legend. 

1163
01:07:31,560 --> 01:07:33,120
Was actually played by Andy 
Serkis. 

1164
01:07:37,640 --> 01:07:40,600
Yep. 
Well, I know that they had to. 

1165
01:07:41,000 --> 01:07:43,280
They had to tie his tail down 
because he was enjoying himself 

1166
01:07:43,280 --> 01:07:44,520
so much. 
His tail kept wagging. 

1167
01:07:44,800 --> 01:07:46,040
Oh well. 
Which I think is delightful. 

1168
01:07:46,200 --> 01:07:48,680
Well, you know, it's his first 
featured featured role. 

1169
01:07:48,720 --> 01:07:52,520
Yeah, it's been an extra before.
What did amuse me because 

1170
01:07:52,520 --> 01:07:55,280
there's there's quite a 
difference between the Act one 

1171
01:07:55,280 --> 01:07:59,360
and Act two. 
Act 1 is a lot more upbeat and 

1172
01:08:00,000 --> 01:08:03,040
sort of breezy and bright, and 
then you get into some of the 

1173
01:08:03,040 --> 01:08:06,120
grim stuff and Act 2. 
But it did amuse me that all of 

1174
01:08:06,120 --> 01:08:09,240
a sudden at one point the movie 
becomes almost like a Binji 

1175
01:08:09,480 --> 01:08:12,080
slash Lassie kind of. 
What is it? 

1176
01:08:12,080 --> 01:08:13,720
Bullseye. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

1177
01:08:13,720 --> 01:08:14,600
Come with me. 
Bullseye. 

1178
01:08:15,000 --> 01:08:18,319
Oh, wait, you can. 
Bullseye holding his ground. 

1179
01:08:18,319 --> 01:08:20,560
No, Bill just took it too far. 
You're a. 

1180
01:08:20,680 --> 01:08:21,439
Bullseye. 
I didn't know. 

1181
01:08:21,439 --> 01:08:24,600
Yeah, yeah. 
You know, there needed to be a 

1182
01:08:24,600 --> 01:08:29,880
monologue or something like so 
Michael Horton as the interior 

1183
01:08:29,880 --> 01:08:36,359
monologue of Bullseye. 
We've taken it too far, Bill. 

1184
01:08:36,399 --> 01:08:46,399
I finally had Johnny Deal good. 
But yeah, that really amused me 

1185
01:08:46,399 --> 01:08:48,160
that all of a sudden it became 
like Bull's eyes. 

1186
01:08:48,160 --> 01:08:50,720
Little. 
We just tried to kill Bull's. 

1187
01:08:51,200 --> 01:08:52,439
Eyes. 
Yeah, yeah. 

1188
01:08:54,359 --> 01:08:57,359
You know, ever since I've paid 
your wife in that film, I've 

1189
01:08:57,760 --> 01:09:09,040
felt more sort of you needn't, I
assure you about your singing 

1190
01:09:09,439 --> 01:09:12,120
now, Surely it shouldn't have 
bothered you. 

1191
01:09:12,120 --> 01:09:14,880
After all, you're in great 
demand to star in comedies on 

1192
01:09:15,479 --> 01:09:19,000
stage, screen, television. 
Oh yes, Harry, but those parts 

1193
01:09:19,000 --> 01:09:20,960
are all sort of aggressive 
women. 

1194
01:09:21,160 --> 01:09:24,319
And I'm not like that, Harry, 
honestly, you know, underneath 

1195
01:09:24,920 --> 01:09:30,479
I'm all soft and sweet and 
feminine, gentle, cuddly and 

1196
01:09:30,479 --> 01:09:36,800
warm like a like a, like a giant
panda. 

1197
01:09:39,800 --> 01:09:42,279
You are so right, honey. 
But I'll tell you one thing. 

1198
01:09:42,640 --> 01:09:45,240
If I'd have been chichi, they'd 
never have had any trouble with 

1199
01:09:45,240 --> 01:09:48,080
Anne. 
Anne romantic. 

1200
01:09:48,520 --> 01:09:51,359
That's me. 
I've got all my notes here. 

1201
01:09:53,720 --> 01:09:55,600
This could have applied for any 
scene that she was in. 

1202
01:09:55,920 --> 01:09:58,520
Peggy Mount with a face like a 
bulldog licking piss off a 

1203
01:09:58,520 --> 01:10:01,480
nettle. 
That's great. 

1204
01:10:04,920 --> 01:10:07,320
I think so. 
She's fantastic in this. 

1205
01:10:09,120 --> 01:10:10,960
Right. 
Is she Mr. Bumble's wife or she 

1206
01:10:10,960 --> 01:10:14,720
just his? 
To begin with, in in the first 

1207
01:10:14,720 --> 01:10:17,240
scene with her together, she is 
the widow Corny. 

1208
01:10:17,400 --> 01:10:18,600
Yeah. 
All right. 

1209
01:10:18,600 --> 01:10:20,040
Now now in this. 
You're married in the book. 

1210
01:10:20,200 --> 01:10:24,280
Though, well, eventually, OK, in
the stage play and in stage 

1211
01:10:24,280 --> 01:10:27,520
production and also in the book,
there's a there's a courtship 

1212
01:10:27,520 --> 01:10:30,240
scene which leads to the song, 
which again isn't in the film, 

1213
01:10:30,240 --> 01:10:34,840
which is I Shall Scream Wow, 
which is Mr. Bumble being all 

1214
01:10:34,840 --> 01:10:37,360
flirty and her kind of going I 
shall scream, I shall scream I. 

1215
01:10:37,800 --> 01:10:39,760
Wish we'd seen that. 
Yeah, I wish we'd seen. 

1216
01:10:39,800 --> 01:10:44,160
That again, it's a good song and
I do remember she does she say I

1217
01:10:44,160 --> 01:10:46,960
shall scream and flirts back 
with him in the book. 

1218
01:10:47,920 --> 01:10:50,640
And then later when we see them 
married, she's turned into this 

1219
01:10:50,640 --> 01:10:52,160
right old battle. 
Acts, who makes? 

1220
01:10:52,160 --> 01:10:53,360
His life a misery. 
Yeah. 

1221
01:10:53,360 --> 01:10:55,160
And they've just missed that 
middle bit out the little 

1222
01:10:55,160 --> 01:10:57,600
flirtatious period, Right. 
It is a little bit confusing. 

1223
01:10:57,680 --> 01:10:58,680
Yeah. 
First of all, they're not. 

1224
01:10:58,680 --> 01:10:59,960
They're just colleagues. 
If you like. 

1225
01:11:00,040 --> 01:11:01,160
Yeah. 
And then when we see them second

1226
01:11:01,160 --> 01:11:03,360
time, she is Mrs. Bumble. 
OK, OK. 

1227
01:11:04,480 --> 01:11:07,000
Yeah, because that's right. 
Because the the second scene is 

1228
01:11:07,000 --> 01:11:10,160
that we see them when when 
they're married, we see them at 

1229
01:11:10,160 --> 01:11:13,200
Mr. Brownlow's house. 
The behaviour, Madam, was 

1230
01:11:13,200 --> 01:11:15,280
shameful. 
How dare you speak to me? 

1231
01:11:15,280 --> 01:11:17,480
So I only came here to help you.
You. 

1232
01:11:18,560 --> 01:11:20,920
Came here to profit from your 
own greed and dishonesty. 

1233
01:11:21,240 --> 01:11:23,200
As to that, Sir, if you think 
the Locket don't probably belong

1234
01:11:23,200 --> 01:11:24,960
to my dear wife, be quiet. 
You are full. 

1235
01:11:24,960 --> 01:11:26,400
Yeah, your reward and something 
for the Locket. 

1236
01:11:26,400 --> 01:11:27,240
Take it. 
Be yourself. 

1237
01:11:27,240 --> 01:11:28,480
Lucky you're not in the hands of
the law, Missus. 

1238
01:11:28,480 --> 01:11:29,440
Better. 
And show these people out. 

1239
01:11:29,680 --> 01:11:35,880
There's gratitude for you. 
I hope this unfortunate little 

1240
01:11:35,880 --> 01:11:38,320
circumstance won't deprive me of
my parochial office. 

1241
01:11:38,480 --> 01:11:41,760
My hope, Sir, is that it will. 
But it was all Mrs. Bumble, Sir,

1242
01:11:42,160 --> 01:11:43,520
I did nothing of we can do 
yesterday. 

1243
01:11:43,520 --> 01:11:45,360
There's no excuse in the eyes of
the law. 

1244
01:11:45,400 --> 01:11:48,360
You are the more guilty of the 
two, for the law supposes that 

1245
01:11:48,360 --> 01:11:49,880
your wife acts under your 
direction. 

1246
01:11:50,400 --> 01:11:52,920
If that's what the law supposes,
Sir, then the law is a Hass. 

1247
01:11:53,400 --> 01:11:55,760
If that's the eye of the law, 
Sir, then the law is a bachelor.

1248
01:11:56,200 --> 01:11:58,320
And the worst I wish the law is 
a designed may be open by 

1249
01:11:58,320 --> 01:12:05,320
experience by experience. 
I had a real giggle at the 

1250
01:12:05,320 --> 01:12:12,280
portrait of Brownlow's niece 
because, you know, it's this 

1251
01:12:12,280 --> 01:12:16,280
very sort of slender necked, 
kind of graceful looking woman 

1252
01:12:16,280 --> 01:12:22,840
with Mark Lester's face. 
Like it's pretty Photoshop. 

1253
01:12:23,240 --> 01:12:31,320
Yeah, but just that that little 
yeah twist there of a, you know,

1254
01:12:31,400 --> 01:12:35,120
that sort of pickpocket orphan 
that you just took in randomly 

1255
01:12:35,120 --> 01:12:38,360
yesterday looks exactly like 
your niece. 

1256
01:12:40,800 --> 01:12:46,400
The other day, the the other day
I recorded an episode for Goon 

1257
01:12:46,400 --> 01:12:51,920
Pod Film Club of the film Guest 
House Paradiso with Rick Mayo 

1258
01:12:51,920 --> 01:12:54,640
and Adrian Edison. 
And there's a portrait on the 

1259
01:12:54,640 --> 01:13:01,760
wall in the guest House of 
Richie's great uncle Gervais. 

1260
01:13:01,760 --> 01:13:05,000
And obviously it's just Rick 
mail in in old timey clothing. 

1261
01:13:05,720 --> 01:13:11,040
And Chris, there is a Rick mail 
connection to Oliver, isn't 

1262
01:13:11,040 --> 01:13:15,720
there? 
Well, sort of because sort of if

1263
01:13:15,720 --> 01:13:18,360
you've got the DVD of Filthy 
Rich and Cat Flap, it's cut out.

1264
01:13:19,480 --> 01:13:21,640
But in the original BBC 
production of the, I think it's 

1265
01:13:21,640 --> 01:13:23,920
the last episode of Filthy Rich 
and Cat Flap where he's not 

1266
01:13:23,920 --> 01:13:25,400
allowed to be in showbiz 
anymore. 

1267
01:13:25,760 --> 01:13:28,840
So they consider being 
pickpockets and there's a whole,

1268
01:13:28,840 --> 01:13:33,800
there's about a probably about a
5 or 10 minutes Oliver rendition

1269
01:13:33,880 --> 01:13:37,000
where Richie sings Where is Love
and. 

1270
01:13:39,400 --> 01:13:41,920
Then. 
Eddie sings you've got to pick a

1271
01:13:41,920 --> 01:13:45,000
pocket or two while he's trying 
to pick his pockets, and there's

1272
01:13:45,000 --> 01:13:47,840
a lot of Consider yourself I. 
Should have been an Oliver. 

1273
01:13:47,840 --> 01:13:50,000
You know, I went to the 
audition. 

1274
01:13:50,000 --> 01:13:52,000
You know what they said? 
Sod off, ugly. 

1275
01:13:53,720 --> 01:13:54,800
That's amazing. 
Were you there anyway? 

1276
01:13:56,440 --> 01:13:59,200
Molly Tristo didn't do so badly 
from his life of crime. 

1277
01:13:59,200 --> 01:14:02,320
No, thank you very much. 
No, Sari Bobby certainly did 

1278
01:14:02,320 --> 01:14:03,640
not. 
After a brief spell of 

1279
01:14:03,640 --> 01:14:06,800
pickpocketing, a rich, kindly 
old gentleman discovered that he

1280
01:14:06,800 --> 01:14:08,920
was the illegitimate child of 
his dead daughter and really a 

1281
01:14:08,920 --> 01:14:11,000
member of the middle class. 
So he saved him. 

1282
01:14:11,600 --> 01:14:13,720
Hey, Eddie, maybe the same thing
will happen to us. 

1283
01:14:14,080 --> 01:14:17,120
Yeah, maybe. 
Well, the chances are sort of 

1284
01:14:17,120 --> 01:14:18,520
vaguely against him, really, 
aren't they? 

1285
01:14:18,960 --> 01:14:20,600
No, no, no, no, it's all in the 
book. 

1286
01:14:21,040 --> 01:14:23,600
Why, doctor? 
Mr. Brownlow will say in his 

1287
01:14:23,600 --> 01:14:26,120
graph. 
But kindly boys, I know you not 

1288
01:14:26,120 --> 01:14:30,240
these two little urchins Eddie 
and Richie study on the portrait

1289
01:14:30,240 --> 01:14:32,680
of my dead daughter. 
Surely your vouch says that 

1290
01:14:32,680 --> 01:14:34,280
their faces are just like 
fannies. 

1291
01:14:34,280 --> 01:14:37,280
It's. 
Made for yourself. 

1292
01:14:38,080 --> 01:14:45,240
Chris, were you were you struck 
by how much of A RIP off slash 

1293
01:14:45,240 --> 01:14:51,560
tribute to Oliver Twist Annies 
after watching this Annie for 

1294
01:14:51,560 --> 01:14:54,240
your listeners, Tyler, another 
film that that we've covered on 

1295
01:14:54,240 --> 01:14:56,280
our podcast. 
Yes, another musical. 

1296
01:14:56,280 --> 01:14:58,840
Of course it has its 
similarities. 

1297
01:14:59,160 --> 01:15:01,800
Very like just the dynamic. 
Like, you know, Miss Hannigan is

1298
01:15:01,800 --> 01:15:04,040
very much a Fagin sort of 
analogue. 

1299
01:15:04,840 --> 01:15:08,640
Her brother Bruce, the played by
Tim Curry, is very much like the

1300
01:15:08,640 --> 01:15:12,680
Bill Psyche sort of character. 
Daddy rulebox is brown. 

1301
01:15:12,800 --> 01:15:15,280
Yeah, of course. 
Even like the Locket business 

1302
01:15:15,280 --> 01:15:17,120
and all that, kind of, you know,
trying to find the. 

1303
01:15:17,520 --> 01:15:20,120
Yeah, I was just like, oh wow. 
Yeah. 

1304
01:15:20,280 --> 01:15:21,440
Absolutely, Andy. 
Really. 

1305
01:15:21,440 --> 01:15:26,160
I I saw Oliver, I saw Annie when
I was a kid. 

1306
01:15:26,160 --> 01:15:27,280
When it came, when did it come 
out? 

1307
01:15:27,280 --> 01:15:30,440
82 Was it me? 
80 I think. 80 really well I saw

1308
01:15:30,440 --> 01:15:31,920
it at the cinema whenever it 
came out. 

1309
01:15:32,560 --> 01:15:35,800
The only thing I remember from 
that is the bald guy who I think

1310
01:15:35,800 --> 01:15:38,360
was is Alan Bates or. 
Albert Finney. 

1311
01:15:38,760 --> 01:15:40,600
Albert Finney. 
Daddy Warbucks. 

1312
01:15:41,240 --> 01:15:43,640
Yes. 
Isn't that where it's a hard 

1313
01:15:43,640 --> 01:15:45,120
knock life came from? 
Yeah. 

1314
01:15:45,480 --> 01:15:46,760
Absolutely. 
And tomorrow? 

1315
01:15:47,440 --> 01:15:48,360
Yeah. 
Oh yeah. 

1316
01:15:48,360 --> 01:15:51,080
Yeah, yeah. 
And the character named Punjab. 

1317
01:15:51,200 --> 01:15:52,760
Punjab and the ASP. 
And the ASP. 

1318
01:15:53,080 --> 01:15:55,520
Yeah, brilliant. 
The spin off show that that 

1319
01:15:55,520 --> 01:15:57,880
never happened. 
Yeah, this week I'm Punjab and 

1320
01:15:57,880 --> 01:16:00,520
the ASP. 
I'd love that. 

1321
01:16:01,080 --> 01:16:02,720
But yeah, you're right, it is 
very similar to Annie. 

1322
01:16:02,760 --> 01:16:07,200
Yeah. 
I, I would, I wouldn't forgive 

1323
01:16:07,200 --> 01:16:09,480
myself if I didn't mention that 
I've talked about the, the 

1324
01:16:09,480 --> 01:16:13,280
Cameron Mackintosh revival that 
he did in the mid to late 90s. 

1325
01:16:13,560 --> 01:16:16,680
And I went to see that and it 
was very, very good. 

1326
01:16:17,640 --> 01:16:21,080
And so I didn't see the Jonathan
Pryce playing Fagan, Instead I 

1327
01:16:21,080 --> 01:16:24,200
saw Jim Dale. 
Playing Fagan? 

1328
01:16:25,040 --> 01:16:26,120
Really. 
Yeah. 

1329
01:16:26,120 --> 01:16:27,680
Can't see that. 
Was he any good? 

1330
01:16:28,080 --> 01:16:30,400
It was disappointing. 
You know, he, he didn't go down 

1331
01:16:30,400 --> 01:16:35,960
a flight of stairs on a trolley 
or examine Nancy with a 

1332
01:16:35,960 --> 01:16:38,240
stethoscope. 
There was none of that in it at 

1333
01:16:38,240 --> 01:16:41,320
all. 
But it was actually a very good 

1334
01:16:41,320 --> 01:16:42,400
show. 
I think it was directed by Sam 

1335
01:16:42,400 --> 01:16:44,120
Mendes. 
Oh. 

1336
01:16:45,000 --> 01:16:47,520
Yeah, in his in his theatrical 
days before he moved on to 

1337
01:16:48,080 --> 01:16:50,520
cabaret. 
But I did make some notes of 

1338
01:16:50,560 --> 01:16:53,600
other people that were in it. 
Yes, because that that's kind of

1339
01:16:53,600 --> 01:16:56,360
interesting. 
Oliver was played by John Lee, 

1340
01:16:56,680 --> 01:16:58,760
who is the little blonde boy 
from S Club 7. 

1341
01:16:59,520 --> 01:17:00,920
Oh. 
Oh, right. 

1342
01:17:00,960 --> 01:17:02,200
OK. 
And he was great. 

1343
01:17:03,640 --> 01:17:07,480
Bill Sykes was one of the 
Mcgans. 

1344
01:17:07,480 --> 01:17:08,480
Joe Mcgahn, I think. 
Oh. 

1345
01:17:09,000 --> 01:17:13,320
The one who has forgets about. 
No, no, the other one, the upper

1346
01:17:13,320 --> 01:17:14,360
hand one. 
Oh, OK. 

1347
01:17:14,480 --> 01:17:15,480
Who's the boss one? 
Yeah. 

1348
01:17:15,600 --> 01:17:24,040
Not, not Renault. 
No, very good, but I think Mrs. 

1349
01:17:24,040 --> 01:17:27,320
Sowerberry was played by Julia 
Deakin. 

1350
01:17:29,000 --> 01:17:32,880
Depending on which TV show you 
prefer, she's Master in Spaced. 

1351
01:17:33,280 --> 01:17:39,160
Or, of course, Jill from Alan 
Attraction, who rubs his face in

1352
01:17:39,160 --> 01:17:44,640
chocolate mousse. 
They go to the they go to the 

1353
01:17:44,640 --> 01:17:46,640
owl sanctuary. 
They go to the owl sanctuary. 

1354
01:17:46,640 --> 01:17:48,600
Yeah, she was Mrs. Salbridge. 
She was great. 

1355
01:17:49,640 --> 01:17:52,120
Yes, it. 
Was very good. 

1356
01:17:52,120 --> 01:17:53,640
That's why I thought I'd mention
that because there was some 

1357
01:17:54,000 --> 01:17:54,960
some. 
I'm trying to think. 

1358
01:17:54,960 --> 01:17:57,520
Rowlands was in it as well. 
Oh, Nursee. 

1359
01:17:57,960 --> 01:17:59,960
Yeah. 
No, no, no, no, no, no, no. 

1360
01:18:00,560 --> 01:18:03,240
Patty Rollins from Carry On. 
From Carry On, Yeah, yeah, 

1361
01:18:03,320 --> 01:18:05,400
right. 
But I think she played the 

1362
01:18:05,400 --> 01:18:07,760
Nursee character in it, which 
was Mr. Brownlow's housekeeper. 

1363
01:18:08,400 --> 01:18:11,520
Right. 
I'm trying to think if they were

1364
01:18:11,520 --> 01:18:18,400
to remake this musical now, who 
would, who would who would they 

1365
01:18:18,400 --> 01:18:19,880
cast as Fagan? 
I'm just trying to think who 

1366
01:18:19,880 --> 01:18:22,600
would be a good Fagan? 
Who, who would be able to match 

1367
01:18:22,600 --> 01:18:25,680
Ron Moody in terms of this the 
the sheer energy God? 

1368
01:18:26,920 --> 01:18:30,080
That because Rowan Atkinson did 
it recently. 

1369
01:18:30,600 --> 01:18:34,040
I don't approve of this because 
I just fucking don't like him, 

1370
01:18:34,040 --> 01:18:36,280
but he's called it. 
No, it'd be Sacha Baron Kellen. 

1371
01:18:37,400 --> 01:18:39,200
Yeah, it probably would be, 
wouldn't it? 

1372
01:18:39,520 --> 01:18:44,360
Yeah, well, that that I feel 
like you'd probably want to give

1373
01:18:44,360 --> 01:18:46,880
it to a Jewish actor. 
Yeah. 

1374
01:18:48,360 --> 01:18:52,200
And I can see him doing it. 
But yeah, it's, it's amazing the

1375
01:18:52,200 --> 01:18:53,600
number of people who've played 
him. 

1376
01:18:54,240 --> 01:18:56,400
I mean at one of your previous 
guests, Griff, Rhys Jones. 

1377
01:18:57,280 --> 01:18:59,040
LON Chaney. 
LON Chaney. 

1378
01:18:59,080 --> 01:19:00,720
Absolutely. 
I don't think he's been a guest 

1379
01:19:00,720 --> 01:19:03,600
on that. 
No, no, Victor Spinetti always 

1380
01:19:03,600 --> 01:19:05,120
pops up. 
He's he's been Fagin. 

1381
01:19:08,640 --> 01:19:12,280
I think Guinness, of course. 
I think David Sulis was the last

1382
01:19:12,280 --> 01:19:14,880
one in that awful Dodger Disney 
Plus series. 

1383
01:19:14,880 --> 01:19:17,760
He played Fagin in that. 
I just read this the premise for

1384
01:19:17,760 --> 01:19:19,960
that and I thought. 
I'm not sure which. 

1385
01:19:20,160 --> 01:19:22,440
Does he move to Australia and 
become a surgeon or something 

1386
01:19:22,440 --> 01:19:25,000
or? 
He apparently he, he is in the 

1387
01:19:25,000 --> 01:19:26,080
Dickens novel. 
Of course he is. 

1388
01:19:26,280 --> 01:19:27,480
He's sent to Australia. 
Yeah. 

1389
01:19:28,120 --> 01:19:29,400
He transported to Australia. 
Yeah. 

1390
01:19:29,520 --> 01:19:31,800
So in this TV series, he's 
played by that nipper from Love 

1391
01:19:31,800 --> 01:19:35,520
Actually, Yeah. 
Thomas Brodie Sangster. 

1392
01:19:35,520 --> 01:19:38,360
Thomas Brodie Sangster, Yeah. 
OK, and so apparently he escapes

1393
01:19:39,000 --> 01:19:42,240
the prison and comes back to 
London and becomes a surgeon, 

1394
01:19:42,800 --> 01:19:45,320
but Fagin is still alive because
he's in it as well. 

1395
01:19:45,320 --> 01:19:47,320
So, but he's executed. 
Him, but yeah, so it doesn't 

1396
01:19:47,320 --> 01:19:50,280
follow the book and doesn't 
follow the musical, doesn't 

1397
01:19:50,280 --> 01:19:52,160
follow the David Lean 1, doesn't
follow any of them. 

1398
01:19:52,160 --> 01:19:56,080
So I don't know, but definitely 
it must be quite. 

1399
01:19:56,080 --> 01:19:56,800
Good. 
Yeah, it'd be good. 

1400
01:19:57,200 --> 01:19:58,520
Yeah, he was. 
Eccleston did it a couple of 

1401
01:19:58,520 --> 01:20:00,400
years ago, didn't he? 
Isn't that prequel? 

1402
01:20:01,280 --> 01:20:03,520
One was taught by Reece Thomas. 
Was it just called Dodger? 

1403
01:20:04,320 --> 01:20:05,960
Oh yeah, wasn't it Sabine 
Kingsley? 

1404
01:20:06,600 --> 01:20:10,000
He was in the Yeah, he'd be 
good, Yeah. 

1405
01:20:10,960 --> 01:20:15,800
What about some Neil Morrissey? 
Michael Caine did one a couple 

1406
01:20:15,800 --> 01:20:16,840
of years ago as well. 
Didn't they? 

1407
01:20:16,840 --> 01:20:18,520
Oh yeah, it was only like 3 
years ago. 

1408
01:20:18,640 --> 01:20:22,680
Twist, yeah. 
Where Rita Ora played the awful.

1409
01:20:22,680 --> 01:20:23,840
Dodge. 
Oh my God. 

1410
01:20:26,360 --> 01:20:29,280
Oh geez. 
Yeah, that's the twist is a 

1411
01:20:29,280 --> 01:20:31,520
clever title, you see. 
Yeah, yeah. 

1412
01:20:33,160 --> 01:20:36,120
Oh, Tucker. 
Tucker White as he would have 

1413
01:20:36,120 --> 01:20:38,200
turned up in it if they've been 
together. 

1414
01:20:43,360 --> 01:20:45,640
There's got to be at some point.
Do you remember? 

1415
01:20:46,280 --> 01:20:47,760
Well, it was, it was on over 
here anyway. 

1416
01:20:47,760 --> 01:20:51,600
They, they did a version of A 
Christmas Carol a few years ago 

1417
01:20:51,600 --> 01:20:56,360
for T, for television with, I 
think Guy Pierce as Scrooge. 

1418
01:20:57,760 --> 01:21:00,320
I like that, really. 
But it was a lot dark. 

1419
01:21:00,320 --> 01:21:04,320
They they they made it dark, OK.
And there was swearing and there

1420
01:21:04,320 --> 01:21:06,200
was, I think there was sex in it
as well. 

1421
01:21:07,160 --> 01:21:08,680
What? 
Yeah. 

1422
01:21:08,760 --> 01:21:11,160
Yeah. 
I don't know who with what. 

1423
01:21:11,160 --> 01:21:12,840
Was Jake and Marley doing with 
those chains you see? 

1424
01:21:13,520 --> 01:21:14,880
What? 
They call him Tiny Tim. 

1425
01:21:14,920 --> 01:21:19,680
Yeah. 
And it's an enormous crutch. 

1426
01:21:21,240 --> 01:21:23,040
But inevitably they're going to 
do something like that with 

1427
01:21:23,040 --> 01:21:26,840
Oliver Twist, aren't they? 
That's going to be problematic. 

1428
01:21:27,800 --> 01:21:30,480
There was one. 
It was another one called Twist,

1429
01:21:30,480 --> 01:21:35,160
but not the Michael Caine one 
where I think the awful Dodger 

1430
01:21:35,280 --> 01:21:39,600
and Oliver were lovers. 
The awful Dodger. 

1431
01:21:45,760 --> 01:21:49,360
So yeah, it was an American 
version, which was, yeah, a bit 

1432
01:21:49,400 --> 01:21:51,720
out there. 
So yeah, it probably will that. 

1433
01:21:54,000 --> 01:21:59,080
Will happen well, but it's it's 
the 2 1/2 hours flew by for me. 

1434
01:21:59,480 --> 01:22:02,040
It it was after a bit of a shaky
start. 

1435
01:22:02,040 --> 01:22:06,240
Like you say, Robert, if you've 
got, what, 3 minutes of nothing?

1436
01:22:06,400 --> 01:22:08,280
Right at the beginning I was 
really concerned. 

1437
01:22:10,000 --> 01:22:12,680
And then you got you got the 
boys singing in the workhouse. 

1438
01:22:12,680 --> 01:22:16,200
But after that it it it really 
stepped up a gear and I just I 

1439
01:22:16,360 --> 01:22:18,560
thoroughly enjoyed it. 
It just didn't seem it wasn't a 

1440
01:22:18,560 --> 01:22:23,760
slog. 
So, so thank you for for wanting

1441
01:22:23,760 --> 01:22:25,680
to do this because it's, you 
know, it's a film that I 

1442
01:22:25,680 --> 01:22:27,600
probably will watch one day 
again, right? 

1443
01:22:29,400 --> 01:22:33,120
Yeah, I was. 
I really, really enjoyed it. 

1444
01:22:33,960 --> 01:22:39,640
I thought slight dip in that 
second act just because it's not

1445
01:22:39,640 --> 01:22:46,320
as joyous and and fun. 
But the quality of the film 

1446
01:22:46,320 --> 01:22:50,800
making, you know, I can see why 
this one best picture, 

1447
01:22:52,040 --> 01:22:55,560
everything on the screen just 
looks amazing. 

1448
01:22:56,280 --> 01:23:01,800
But just the production values, 
the set design, the staging, the

1449
01:23:01,840 --> 01:23:05,800
choreography, everything was 
just so, so well done. 

1450
01:23:06,320 --> 01:23:08,360
And I was really pleased to 
watch this again. 

1451
01:23:08,360 --> 01:23:09,480
So thank you. 
Yeah. 

1452
01:23:09,640 --> 01:23:10,720
Definitely. 
I absolutely loved it. 

1453
01:23:10,720 --> 01:23:12,160
I thought it was great to watch 
it again. 

1454
01:23:12,840 --> 01:23:18,280
The only small criticisms I'd 
have is some of the songs you go

1455
01:23:18,360 --> 01:23:19,280
on. 
They do stay. 

1456
01:23:19,280 --> 01:23:21,280
They welcome a little. 
Bit oh God, they do, yeah, I 

1457
01:23:21,320 --> 01:23:22,960
mean. 
The Consider Yourself, which is 

1458
01:23:22,960 --> 01:23:26,440
a great song and clearly the 
inspiration for every sperm is 

1459
01:23:26,440 --> 01:23:30,120
sacred. 
It just goes on quite some time 

1460
01:23:30,120 --> 01:23:31,680
where they're at the fish 
market, they're at the 

1461
01:23:31,680 --> 01:23:34,680
fairground. 
But the ending with about 3000 

1462
01:23:34,680 --> 01:23:37,640
people dancing is is quite 
remarkable and the same as Who 

1463
01:23:37,640 --> 01:23:39,120
Will buy. 
Just the whole build up is 

1464
01:23:39,120 --> 01:23:41,120
amazing, but it goes on for 
about 15 minutes. 

1465
01:23:41,120 --> 01:23:44,000
You can actually see Jack Wilde 
go through puberty in real time,

1466
01:23:44,120 --> 01:23:46,840
yeah. 
Taking up smoking. 

1467
01:23:49,120 --> 01:23:51,360
He's got a 5:00 shadow right 
into the. 

1468
01:23:52,960 --> 01:23:55,880
Song. 
And of course the slight problem

1469
01:23:55,880 --> 01:24:02,960
is that Oliver as a character 
and potentially the performance 

1470
01:24:03,080 --> 01:24:07,200
by Mark Lester and the girl who 
did the singing is a little bit 

1471
01:24:07,200 --> 01:24:09,960
weak. 
But that's possibly meant to be 

1472
01:24:09,960 --> 01:24:11,800
the case because, as we said, 
he's nowhere near as 

1473
01:24:11,800 --> 01:24:14,080
interesting, yeah as everybody 
else in it. 

1474
01:24:14,280 --> 01:24:16,840
So he just tones it down and 
everybody else really goes for 

1475
01:24:16,840 --> 01:24:18,800
it. 
You know, I'm always loathed 

1476
01:24:18,840 --> 01:24:22,360
because you just don't know what
a director is saying to these 

1477
01:24:22,560 --> 01:24:23,560
child actors. 
As well. 

1478
01:24:23,560 --> 01:24:25,760
And I also don't want to 
criticize a child actor because 

1479
01:24:25,760 --> 01:24:27,200
I think that's an awful thing to
do. 

1480
01:24:27,360 --> 01:24:31,200
It is even one that some, you 
know, donated spin to Michael 

1481
01:24:31,200 --> 01:24:33,080
Jackson and possibly Father's 
children. 

1482
01:24:33,520 --> 01:24:38,320
Even then, yeah, yeah. 
But other than that, yeah, I 

1483
01:24:38,360 --> 01:24:39,360
absolutely. 
Loved it, I thought it was 

1484
01:24:39,360 --> 01:24:42,240
great. 
Hands, hands down, Ron Moody is.

1485
01:24:42,800 --> 01:24:45,600
The stand out. 
Doing this and just just him, 

1486
01:24:45,840 --> 01:24:48,600
just him with his flute, doing 
an Ian Anderson from Jethro Tull

1487
01:24:48,720 --> 01:24:53,320
on the rooftop, did you? 
Did you see that he was 

1488
01:24:53,320 --> 01:24:58,200
apparently offered the role of 
Doctor Who post Patrick 

1489
01:24:58,200 --> 01:25:00,120
Troughton? 
So he would have been the pit 

1490
01:25:00,120 --> 01:25:02,080
Tweet I. 
Could see that. 

1491
01:25:04,040 --> 01:25:07,800
Apparently it was one of his 
only regrets in his career. 

1492
01:25:08,200 --> 01:25:11,560
But you know, what else is he? 
You know, performance like this,

1493
01:25:11,600 --> 01:25:14,800
you look, you look at it and go,
this guy should be, you know, 

1494
01:25:15,040 --> 01:25:19,520
there should be like several 
Oscars and his bloody cabinet. 

1495
01:25:20,240 --> 01:25:23,040
Tyler as as you know, we we saw 
him in an episode of Tales of 

1496
01:25:23,040 --> 01:25:24,440
the Unexpected, which was very 
good. 

1497
01:25:24,800 --> 01:25:26,840
Oh yes, Oh yes. 
He's a wine chaser. 

1498
01:25:27,280 --> 01:25:28,720
Yes, of course I forgot about 
that. 

1499
01:25:28,800 --> 01:25:32,640
Of course, we talked about him 
on Goonpod recently because he 

1500
01:25:32,640 --> 01:25:37,080
was in the film The Sandwich Man
with starring Michael Benton, 

1501
01:25:37,080 --> 01:25:38,960
who was also offered the role of
Doctor Who, by the way. 

1502
01:25:42,320 --> 01:25:46,560
But he said he wanted to write 
it and so they said no, so he 

1503
01:25:46,560 --> 01:25:50,360
turned it down. 
Bloody idiot gentlemen. 

1504
01:25:50,920 --> 01:25:55,360
As always, it's been a pleasure.
What's coming up in terms of 

1505
01:25:55,640 --> 01:25:57,160
shows? 
And you said critters. 

1506
01:25:57,200 --> 01:25:59,920
Any any other shows coming up? 
Well, if yours comes out on 

1507
01:25:59,920 --> 01:26:03,320
Wednesday, Critters is our 
Halloween special, so that'll be

1508
01:26:03,320 --> 01:26:05,760
coming out Wednesday or Thursday
as well, OK. 

1509
01:26:06,480 --> 01:26:07,760
Yep. 
We're doing. 

1510
01:26:07,760 --> 01:26:11,000
After that, I think we decided 
on a, a, a london-based romantic

1511
01:26:11,000 --> 01:26:13,080
comedy, didn't we? 
So we're going to have a look at

1512
01:26:13,080 --> 01:26:15,040
one that everyone goes, oh, I 
remember that, which is this 

1513
01:26:15,040 --> 01:26:17,480
year's love. 
Oh. 

1514
01:26:17,720 --> 01:26:21,160
Which was a a high concept ROM 
com from the mid 90s with lots 

1515
01:26:21,160 --> 01:26:25,400
of good indie music in it. 
I think I know I've heard of 

1516
01:26:25,400 --> 01:26:26,520
that. 
Who's who's in that? 

1517
01:26:26,720 --> 01:26:28,920
Kathy Burke is in it. 
Ian Hart. 

1518
01:26:29,560 --> 01:26:32,240
Right. 
Thingy. 

1519
01:26:32,240 --> 01:26:33,600
Henshall, Douglas. 
Henshall. 

1520
01:26:34,200 --> 01:26:37,200
Right. 
And de Grey Scott, yeah, which I

1521
01:26:37,200 --> 01:26:39,560
remember enjoying a lot because 
it had swearing in it and good 

1522
01:26:39,560 --> 01:26:41,840
music and stuff. 
All right, cool. 

1523
01:26:41,920 --> 01:26:44,280
Yeah, so. 
And after that, with Fight Club,

1524
01:26:44,360 --> 01:26:46,600
someone's chosen. 
Oh, right. 

1525
01:26:46,920 --> 01:26:49,200
We've got a few, you've got a 
few sort of guests waiting in 

1526
01:26:49,200 --> 01:26:51,520
the wings really for. 
So we just, we've just got a 

1527
01:26:51,520 --> 01:26:52,680
sequence them really, haven't 
we? 

1528
01:26:52,680 --> 01:26:54,000
We've got. 
Yeah. 

1529
01:26:54,000 --> 01:26:58,440
And just in case people haven't 
heard the times you've 

1530
01:26:58,440 --> 01:27:00,840
previously been on Goonpod and 
they're not sure what still any 

1531
01:27:00,840 --> 01:27:04,600
good is. 
The premise is that you you go 

1532
01:27:04,600 --> 01:27:08,840
back and watch films or TV 
programs, but mainly films that 

1533
01:27:08,840 --> 01:27:13,240
you enjoyed when you were 
younger to see if they are, as 

1534
01:27:13,240 --> 01:27:17,360
the title goes, still any good. 
What's the what's the sort of 

1535
01:27:17,360 --> 01:27:20,600
strike rate? 
Is it sort of 5050 good and bad 

1536
01:27:20,600 --> 01:27:23,880
in terms of, you know, when you 
revisit these things? 

1537
01:27:24,320 --> 01:27:26,960
I feel to my sugar and I 
actually think we're sort of 

1538
01:27:26,960 --> 01:27:29,800
probably more 75% good. 
I'd say probably more than no. 

1539
01:27:29,800 --> 01:27:32,800
We haven't had a stinker for a 
long time over we're. 

1540
01:27:32,800 --> 01:27:37,720
Sold out, Tyler, Yeah. 
I think we're just being less 

1541
01:27:37,720 --> 01:27:39,960
critical, maybe. 
And that was shit. 

1542
01:27:40,200 --> 01:27:42,160
Yeah. 
We're, we're actually finding 

1543
01:27:42,320 --> 01:27:44,840
the the fun, the diamond in the 
rough. 

1544
01:27:44,880 --> 01:27:45,480
Yeah. 
Really. 

1545
01:27:45,480 --> 01:27:47,640
Yeah. 
But, you know, we're we're 

1546
01:27:47,640 --> 01:27:51,640
selling out I. 
Mean we've even enjoyed Orca, 

1547
01:27:51,640 --> 01:27:53,280
the killer whale for God. 
'S sake I know. 

1548
01:27:54,440 --> 01:27:56,600
You need to try harder. 
You need to watch more shit 

1549
01:27:57,400 --> 01:27:58,800
come. 
On that's the problem though, is

1550
01:27:58,800 --> 01:28:02,840
that you've got to be, you've 
got to have integrity with it. 

1551
01:28:02,840 --> 01:28:05,800
So you've really got to have 
something we genuinely kind of 

1552
01:28:06,520 --> 01:28:08,760
don't know. 
But there's so many films that 

1553
01:28:08,760 --> 01:28:10,280
you know, are just going to be 
shit. 

1554
01:28:10,840 --> 01:28:13,920
And then with such, you know, 
we've got kids, we've got we've 

1555
01:28:13,920 --> 01:28:17,640
got day jobs. 
It's really hard to go OK, I 

1556
01:28:17,640 --> 01:28:20,640
want to sit down for 90 minutes 
of what I know will be shit. 

1557
01:28:25,920 --> 01:28:28,480
But I think, yeah, we've talked 
about Yellow Beard and for me, 

1558
01:28:28,480 --> 01:28:32,320
Yellow Beard was the absolute 
pits of the film. 

1559
01:28:34,240 --> 01:28:36,760
And I, I, it just wasn't for me.
Yeah. 

1560
01:28:37,760 --> 01:28:40,160
But the the majority are a 
pleasant surprise. 

1561
01:28:40,280 --> 01:28:43,600
I think we've found we, we, 
we've managed to find the good 

1562
01:28:43,600 --> 01:28:46,440
in quite a lot of what we've, 
yeah, we've seen even Hudson 

1563
01:28:46,440 --> 01:28:48,360
Hawk we kind of enjoyed, believe
it or not. 

1564
01:28:49,680 --> 01:28:53,360
Right, OK, OK. 
Well listen, it is, it is 

1565
01:28:53,360 --> 01:28:55,600
getting on now. 
It's we're recording this, it's 

1566
01:28:55,600 --> 01:28:59,640
your Sunday night in in New 
Zealand and it's must be getting

1567
01:28:59,640 --> 01:29:03,560
on for 11:00 in the evening. 
Yeah, so but. 10:45 Time to get 

1568
01:29:03,680 --> 01:29:06,120
some get in. 
We do have a a long weekend. 

1569
01:29:06,120 --> 01:29:08,080
It's Labor Day tomorrow. 
Oh, right. 

1570
01:29:08,560 --> 01:29:09,360
Yeah. 
Oh, right. 

1571
01:29:09,400 --> 01:29:10,560
OK, so you're not working 
tomorrow? 

1572
01:29:10,840 --> 01:29:12,880
Nice. 
It's not a school night, so it's

1573
01:29:12,880 --> 01:29:14,480
all right. 
Yeah, we've got a four day 

1574
01:29:14,480 --> 01:29:15,480
weekend. 
It's really nice. 

1575
01:29:16,920 --> 01:29:18,440
Oh, brilliant. 
OK, well, enjoy. 

1576
01:29:18,440 --> 01:29:22,480
And as always, guys, it's great 
to have you have you on again. 

1577
01:29:22,480 --> 01:29:26,400
And I guess we'll get you back 
more or less this time next year

1578
01:29:26,400 --> 01:29:29,840
to talk about something else. 
And we'll get you back as well. 

1579
01:29:29,840 --> 01:29:31,920
Definitely love to. 
Brilliant. 

1580
01:29:32,200 --> 01:29:35,120
Yeah, I just want to say, Tyler,
you know, I have been so 

1581
01:29:35,120 --> 01:29:38,760
enjoying the podcast lately. 
You've had some amazing guests. 

1582
01:29:39,120 --> 01:29:40,080
Really. 
Thank you very much. 

1583
01:29:40,840 --> 01:29:43,000
Conversations. 
Yeah. 

1584
01:29:43,000 --> 01:29:45,280
Always really looking forward to
the next episode of Goonpod. 

1585
01:29:46,160 --> 01:29:48,600
Thank you very much. 
That's very touching. 

1586
01:29:48,760 --> 01:29:51,480
It's always good to hear. 
In fact, got a mention in The 

1587
01:29:51,480 --> 01:29:53,320
Times yesterday. 
Yes, I saw that. 

1588
01:29:53,360 --> 01:29:55,640
Was that your third or fourth 
mention? 

1589
01:29:57,360 --> 01:29:58,880
4th You've been in the Radio 
Times. 

1590
01:29:58,880 --> 01:29:59,920
Haven't you? 
Oh, it was the Radio Times. 

1591
01:29:59,920 --> 01:30:01,600
Been in the Radio Times? 
Yeah, yeah. 

1592
01:30:02,080 --> 01:30:03,760
Brilligant. 
So it's obviously someone who 

1593
01:30:03,760 --> 01:30:05,800
works for the Times, who's a 
listener, which is good. 

1594
01:30:05,800 --> 01:30:08,080
It's. 
Always nice when you can cross 

1595
01:30:08,080 --> 01:30:11,040
over into the mainstream. 
Yeah, absolutely. 

1596
01:30:11,520 --> 01:30:17,720
Yeah. 
We almost did, but it was live 

1597
01:30:17,720 --> 01:30:22,920
by 10:30. 
OK, guys. 

1598
01:30:22,920 --> 01:30:25,680
Well, thanks again and we will 
catch up again soon. 

1599
01:30:25,920 --> 01:30:26,560
Yeah. 
Thanks a lot. 

1600
01:30:26,600 --> 01:30:31,680
Thanks so much. 
Why should we break our backs 

1601
01:30:31,680 --> 01:30:36,840
stupidly paying tax and to get 
some untaxed income? 

1602
01:30:36,960 --> 01:30:41,760
Better pick a pocket or two. 
You got to pick a pocket or two 

1603
01:30:42,680 --> 01:30:46,120
boys. 
You got to pick a pocket.