It's all alone. Yeah, Ringo and the Beatles.
Make well, where's the bezel? Give me M8.
U, double he's medium. No, I don't like it either, but
I'll let you in and then, right, right?
Ready? He Loves Me.
He Loves Me.
Hello and welcome to game pod. Very special episode.
This week, I am joined by Stephen cockroft.
Co-presenter of the fabulous podcast.
Nothing is real now. Steve, and I know that he was
quite keen on the goons. Otherwise, why would he be on
this guesting on this podcast? You know, but I wasn't 100% sure
he was there into the Beatles. I soon found out, he was okay.
And yeah, we conversation ensued in which the Of his talked about
the goons and the Beatles, and the many connections there of,
if that's the right way of putting it.
So we had a lengthy conversation and enjoyable conversation.
We enjoyed it. I hope you do too.
Here it is in my teens. I was a huge goons fan and I was
the only person I knew sort of. Among my peer group, I was the
only person that listen to the guns, and I think I came to the
guns, because my mother had been A fan.
She can't huge fan back in the day and it's, that's one of the
things that she and my father do not have in common, my father
loathes, the guns could not could not abide the Gordon's
this kind of surreal sense of humor.
And I just remember, you know, Sellers and Milligan and seek
him. They would appear on talk shows
and Parkinson. And if I think it was through
that that my mother said, you know, they were doing the voices
and they were talking about the goons.
And then my mother would explain to me what the guns We're or had
been, and I don't know what, what year was that sort of the
final or the last gun show of all 72.
So I really remember my mother. I would read maybe 90 years old
at that point, I vaguely remember, my mother passing
comment on the fact that, you know, these These Old Man were
getting back together to do that.
And the first gun show, actually heard all the way through was
Napoleon's. No now yes, from a library, you
know, vinyl LP. Mmm, I borrowed from the library
and I was so taken with the Poland's piano that I couldn't
even tell you what was on the other side of that record.
The Following episode was on the other.
But I just that whatever it was, it was not as good as Napoleon's
plan. Oh, it was the flea, flea, flea,
which I think is slightly better.
Well, and I just, I suppose I was maybe 12 or 13 and The idea
that someone would be saying, you know, would you like it if
you like a gorilla to which the response is?
No, I don't think you have just put one out and that was that
became a kind of sort of thing that, you know, and I would do
the catchphrases and you know, I'm not going to do the voices.
I know there's a strict prohibition on people doing the
voices but and I think it was just from there and then I
discovered that we had a great BBC Shop in Belfast.
Yeah. Yeah, because I like I lived in
Belfast in the 90s that is yes and because I saw you on Twitter
with you were saying. I think it was in Belfast,
actually. I'm sorry.
Yes, it was and I bought. I bought those double cassette
episodes empty. So I just I just I still have a
collection of there was nothing to play them on, but I can't
bring myself to throw them out. Mmm, and it was, it was through
me, listening to nothing is real, and I'm particularly the,
the episode you did on, you know, the name.
Look up. The number, look at the number,
I Yes, I mean, I always sort of thought that was slightly
greenish, but it was only when I had we sort of placed it in the
context of what was happening around them.
And I, you know, Paul made some comment and in the late 80s at
that was his favorite session. Mmm.
And I thought that was just him being contrary where everyone,
say, old lady Madonna or Hey, Jude or something.
What I can see that in the midst of all of those business
wrangles where they had literally almost come to blows
he and John, mmm, they're standing around a microphone
basically. Doing, you know, the krunk's
basically, doing gun voices to each other, trying to kind of
recapture or connect in some way when they were, the Newark
Twins, when they were listening to the goons.
And that, that sort of Teenage friendship and it's just Out Of
Reach, but that's where they went.
When they felt, they needed to connect and that, that session
comes completely out of the blue, it wasn't being done for
any purpose. It was an old tape that backing
tape that had been sitting on a shelf for 43 years and yet.
That's and I just think there is something more that I thought
about it. The more as we were doing that
episode, I just thought that is such a poignant.
Image. These two guys are just have
drifted apart. Their friendship is to here to
personal relationship is deteriorating.
And this is where they go to try and reconnect and it just for
whatever reason it just doesn't work but the goons are that sort
of shared communal emotional connection for the two of them
wasn't. Am I right in saying from memory
that it was the B-side to let it be.
Yeah single was that that was the last Beetle single wasn't
it? It was the last Beetle single in
the UK in America. They put out long and winding
road, which is also. Yeah.
But but yes it was it's a and again, I think the juxtaposition
of Let It Be and you listen to that and then you sort of flip
the single over on. You think what what is this?
Yeah, I think particularly if you were in America or if you
are outside the UK who would make no sense at all, but I
think anyone in the UK would immediately know that, that was
the central section, they're just doing During the goods.
Yeah, I mean the put the purpose of this conversation is to look
at the connections and there's so many connections.
So many are, I just wanted to run through some of the
better-known connections and some of the more, some of the
more sort of obscure trivia, I suppose, if you want to call it
that, how did you want to kick off in terms of what, what's the
first thing that you want to throw into the woods?
The ring, what's the entry point?
While I think I think The fact that everyone sort of, sort of
Beatles fans know this, this, you know, Paul and John were the
narc Twins, and that, they took that from a gun show script.
Yeah, I mean, the redneck was tended to be played by Harry
seek him and it was, and often played as a occasionally, a
cockney, but usually a Yokai. Sort of a bluff York shipment.
Yeah. Lennon was very much a good show
fan and there's a fire. Imagine, this is an apocryphal
tale where he comes running down the stairs in his aunt's house.
And sort of says, did you hear that?
Did you hear that on the radio? And then he seeds to reenact the
entire gun show for his aunt and his uncle.
And that's a rather sort of charming thought but I can't
imagine his Aunt Mimi was the sort of person that would have
put up with a reenactment of the gun show, you know?
Yeah. So I think that's probably
apocryphal. And the other story that, you
know, I read on the internet so it must be true.
You should for his 16th birthday.
He bought an Elvis Presley single and a goons single unit
Ang song. Yeah.
And whether that's true or not, I think it should be true
because you've got that sort of rock and roll, and sort of
humor, wordplay, and ultimately would come out in his lyrics.
And I think it's just to put the Beatles in the context of those
guys, as teenagers growing up and that was The thing that
everybody listened to was the gun show and it starts to
permeate out through the music and become a more visible.
Or I was more audible influence in the second half of their
career. But I think it's hard to
overstate hyper base of the influence of the goons.
We're on that generation. It's interesting because he
famously. He wrote for the New York Times
Review of Books. He wrote a book review.
Yes. The only one he ever did.
Yes. In when was a September 73 for
the Goon show scripts and he says it now, he says I was 12
and gun shows first hit 16 when they finish with me.
Which is an interesting. Yes, turn of phrase and I took
that to mean so that would have been 56.
Wouldn't it when he was 16? Yeah, the goons had another four
years to go. So I'm assuming he took that to
mean. He discovered rock and roll and
put away childish things. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I think I think that's probably that's probably it and I think
it's alright it's a I suppose an acknowledgement that the goons
were as important. To him as rock and roll.
You know, that there were a couple of important
fundamentally important things in his life, and in his
childhood, it was the guns. And in his later years, it was
rock and roll. Mmm, and if we look at 56, yeah,
it's interesting because I would imagine, right?
Tell me, he grew up with Aunt Mimi and what was his Uncle?
George Uncle George? Okay, I'm assuming it was, it
was a nice middle. Class household.
I'm assuming they had a television.
Yes, I think they would have had a talent.
Yes, they did have a television. Okay, well, was me me that sort
of slightly starchy matriarch, that she wouldn't allow ITV
that's to. Yes.
That's yes. Exactly.
And I think it was a very
middle-class upbringing and he may have presented it
differently but it was a very starchy as you say middle class.
Bringing out, I suppose the goons or sort of round very much
counter to that they were anarchic.
They were irreverent. You know, spike is trying to
cram as many innuendos and off-color jokes in to the
scripts as he possibly could. I can't imagine that.
That Aunt Mimi was a fan at all. Yeah, well I mentioned ITV
specifically, because I guess when John was still 15 but you
know in the early early 56 we get first of all we get idiot
weekly president. Yes ITV and then swiftly
followed by show called Fred and then son of Fred all directed by
Richard. Lester, yes, I'd like to think
that, you know, the young Lennon in between skiving off, doing
his homework, or whatever, it was surreptitiously, turning the
television to I to visit itvs To watch Sellers and Milligan and
dustbins. You know, it's interesting
because I've never, I've never read, I've never read any
comment where he's talked about that.
You know, he talked about the guns a little bit and you know,
he wrote the book review, but I UND the the running jumping
sounding still the glasses involvement there, but I've
never, that's an interesting point.
Yes, it's a nice image. Yeah, by the way, I just want to
give credit where it's due of you are.
The you are the The Beatles expert of the two of us for
sure. But I, you know, I know quite a
bit and I wrote down a list of of what occurred to me is goon
and Beatles connections and then I went to a couple of friends of
mine. One is Mike Haskins.
Who I'll come back to towards the end of the show and Mike,
it's actually written. A book is due out very soon The
Beatles Liverpool and I'll talk more about that later.
But I asked Mike, if he could throw some He's also a big goons
fan and he supplied me with some rather Arcane facts and trivia.
And and also Andrew, Andrew hickey friend of mine.
He has the podcast very popular podcast, history of rock music
and 500 songs. Yes.
Yes, I'm a big fan. Okay, well, I was talking to him
last night and I said, look, can you say anything?
And we I sort of ran through the obvious stuff that I had, you
know. Yeah.
And I said, and he came up with a couple of really good.
Little little things for me to to include hopefully in our
conversation. One thing that Mike mentioned to
me was that the running jumping and Stanley still film.
Apparently was was played repeatedly out the Tattler
Cinema in Liverpool in the late 50s.
When was it 59? I think 15 and apparently the
Beatles would go and watch it regularly in between.
Insert the cavern, which was a few minutes walk away.
Yes, yes. And John does mention it as well
in in the review of the Goon show.
Scripture says that he says there's a rare and Beautiful
film without Harry S called The Running jumping and standing
still film. Ask your local Art House to run
it. It's a masterpiece of captures.
The Goon Spirit very well, and he specifically mentions dick,
Lester in that context as well. So George, I know was also a
huge fan of that film, you know, I Vibe.
He has talked about that as well, so I think if you look at
listening looking at the Beatles you sort of would imagine that.
It's John and George are the most likely suspects to be guns
fans, but it's interesting to think that they were just sort
of sitting watching and we watching that film.
And then what? Years later.
The cluster is, yeah, it's working with them but it says,
it's amazing. It's amazing.
Series of circumstances that bring them together with George
Martin. Yes.
And I don't want to race too far ahead here but you have the fact
that George Martin obviously is involved with recording.
I think it's Peter Sellers first, actual record which is
Jack and the flying saucers and then he obviously would go on.
And rate and reduce bestsellers and songs for Swingin Sellers
and yes, patrons of fear. And but he also he got involved
with Spike and he produced you got to go owl for Spike which
was again that was 56 and he inspired hit it off and became
very good friends and Spike, of course, would release purple
aeroplane Produced by George Martin?
Yes. Yes, I'm somehow.
We only need your Submarine, Yellow Submarine, I think the
Beatles do this, I could do it. Better trouble.
Is they outnumber me? There must be an answer from the
middle age group. I've got it, if you can't beat
them, join them. We don't let me be her Yellow
Submarine, Yellow, Submarine, Yellow Submarine.
We don't really know your dream. We live in a purple, in a plane
applying upon the holy. We live in a plane up applying
Fab Fab and it's those records, which are you parlophone was
primarily known as a comedy record label.
You know, is known for that type of song, but it's the fact that
working with sellers who's doing multi voices and singing with
himself and doing Duets, and things aren't the sort of
editing skills and the tape skills and they overdubbing in
the multi-tracking and all of those things that George Martin
was doing with Sellers and Over the River.
Kwai, that record, that type of thing.
It would all sort of feed into what the Beatles would do later
in their career with sort of multi-tracking and using using
the studio. Yes.
And George Martin, as I say, it's if you he starts working
with Spike in the, in the mid 50's, they become firm friends.
And then what 6, April late April 62 Spike Getting married
again second. Second wedding, second marriage,
and he surprisingly, I thought he said he asked George Martin
to be his best man which which the the trip up North for the
actual wedding I believe was a bit of a Fred karno by all
accounts, but if you look at the Timeline.
So George Martin's spikes. Best man, in late, April, 62 and
about five weeks later, Martin meets The Beatles for the first
time y'all. Yeah.
And I haven't, I must admit. I haven't realized it was quite
that close. I hadn't.
I had read somewhere that the George Martin was the best man,
but I hadn't realized it was doubt that was the timeline.
Yeah. And also I was trying to find
out today and I'm sure there is you know, for tried a bit harder
could have found out but obviously George Martin produced
Bridge, on the River, Wye in 62 yes yes yeah famously having to
clip out the K from Kauai for is rigid.
I was it would they use the word choir and then they were facing
legal action so he had legal actually, I don't do so that was
62 as well. I'd love to know when that was
actually in 62. When that was when there was
actually produced. I'm assuming it was before the
before they started, the answer was here.
That was he and wants to deal with the Beatles and another
studio with her razor blade. Slicing the chaos Yeah, you'd
love to think of, you know, cuz it was Sally's.
It was Milligan. It was Jonathan, Miller Peter:.
You'd love to think they're sort of passing, the Beatles, are the
corridor, or something like that, you know?
Yes, yes, yes. So I've got, I've got, I've
jotted down 10, but I would classes 10 things that anyone
with more than a passing interest in the Beatles and the
goons would know if you like, okay, and then these are
connections. So this is either Direct Didn't
show stroke Beetle connections or more more.
Obviously, it's, you know, it tends to be sellers or Milligan
and their connections with. Yeah, the boys.
So what, number one, obviously, the magic Christian for yes,
reasons. So we've got Ringo, we've got
Peter got spiked as well. We've got someone who looks like
John it-it-it's. Not actually John though, is it
all? You're not actually not actually
drawn or your coat? Can I ask you, dude?
Dude, like that, Phil, I love that film.
I love that film and I said that are we did it?
We did an episode on Ringo's films and I said, you know how
much I liked that film on. I was virtually getting hit
Mill, but people say this is the worst thing I've ever seen.
I think it's just such a fantastic collection of English.
Sort of call Mike and character actors and actresses sort of
gathered together. And I there's always sort of
business going on in the back of scenes where you said it got
Hattie Jake's reading a sort of Nazi novel in the background,
just very unobtrusively and it that day.
I think it's a wonderful film. I remember saying if the first
time there was a season of sort of odd late 60s films on bbc2
and saying when I was about 13 or 14 and Becoming slightly
obsessed with who was in it and trying to spot people but good.
I'm glad I find someone that that loves it too.
Oh well I love it and it's not his best film by a pile.
Long chalk. Let's face it.
I'm talking stammers here. It possibly was Ringo's best
film. I was going to say, I think it's
possibly well, I think maybe maybe that'll be the day but
it's certainly, it's early. It's his second, that's better
than. What is it?
Son of Dracula. Yes, it's all that.
That's, that's quite new, you know.
I still, I still. Like to see that come out on
DVD. But hey, I watch that with the
lads relatively recently. He was well tough going, no, but
the magic Christian is, it's well since well late, last year,
it's sort of come back into public Consciousness.
Be off the back of ya, get back, of course, yes.
However, I have a friend who says, Peter Sellers was directly
responsible for the breakup of The Beatles Because Ringo had to
leave this the get back sections to go and start filming the
magic Christian. And, you know, if they'd had
more time and had been under less pressure, you know, we'd
still have the Beatles today, and they be headlining Hyde
Park. That's it's all because I was
just mentioning, get back there. Is that scene where Peter
Sellers appear? Yes, and it's excruciating.
Lee embarrassing. Mmm II had read the dialogue.
Without ever having seen the sort of the video footage, and
it seemed funny on the page, but it was excreted sellers look so
uncomfortable, beginning from beginning to end, you know, he
sort of you think, given sellers personality and his ability to
improvise and just just find the comedy in any situation.
He just seems completely derailed by what is going on
around him. Well, I also wonder if that's
because he had to be himself. He wasn't playing a character.
Yeah, yeah. Could be could be I read.
I'm not sure whether it was in a seller's biography were.
That's a comment from his son where he was saying, you know,
he's his father was slightly obsessed with Fame that the
Beatles had into the lab at the level of fair and that he was
sort of intrigued by that and curious about that and And you
wanted to be in that Circle, and certainly sort of he and Ringo
were hanging out around that time and sort of it in advance
of the film. But you would think that Lenin
and he would get on, and would be able to kind of spark off
each other. I mean, Lennon is clearly strong
out in that, and I just think sellers realizes.
Something's not right? This is unpredictable well going
to be you know the power Dynamic has shifted because if you think
obviously though it made its later on in one of my other list
my mini list, I have a there's that footage of sellers in 65
presenting The Beatles with Grammys.
Yeah, during the film, their onset, it Twickenham filming.
Is tweaking a note, it is. Cuz they're sitting there
sitting in the bar if you if you know, help whether it's a sort
of yes, and somebody pulls a lever and they fall down and
there's a tiger and they're sitting it in front of that bar.
Yeah, and sellers is presenting them on camera with the Grammys
and they seem quite not ordered by him, but quite respectful,
the little bit of leg pulling that a bit of joshing.
He is the star at that point. So so for all that they've had
all their success and they're filming their second movie.
Clearly he is still someone that they look up to and Lenin in
particular the camera. I know that clip and the camera
kind of pounds along. I think it's heard of Paul Ringo
and then it gets a job and John just had the biggest grin on his
face, sort of a real genuine smile.
And then you get to George he's being quite kind of looking the
other way and a little bit being like George.
But John, it seems genuinely thrilled.
Yeah, just to be there and to get the grandma award, I think.
Think some does here and they always thought it was ironic,
that he sort of says it's the grandma award and then hands it
all, you know, John's later. Comment great amazing music.
Yeah, that's true. Yeah, yeah.
And welcome to the great working on Studios where the boys, the
vehicle making their new film help.
And I am actually with the beetle now present them with
their Grandma Awards. Which they have one from America
and they're delighted to be here this afternoon to receive them.
And I had the singular honor, and I think we've been asked to
present them right there. Yes, you may great.
Thank you very much, Peter. It's a great pleasure for us to.
I'm sure I'm more in here. Perhaps, you'd like to take one
also off. Thank you, allows you can see,
folks. These blocks is not empty,
Tanana to say the least, and it's nice to have a chance
really, isn't it? Sir, long.
Wha Longwell Dwight. What are they?
Back, I say I'm on my list Hills of sort of more obvious, things,
goons Beatles connections. I've got down here again
sticking with the theme, the Peter Sellers, White Album tape.
Yes yes, thank heavens for that. That, that was, that was the
source of most of the bootlegs that I own in the mid eighties
when suddenly suddenly CD bugs came along.
And so this is something that you know Ringo had given You
just tell us because they say he's hanging out with Ringo in a
run 1968, which is sort of, maybe if not quite a full year
ahead of the magic Christian. And I say, is this sense at that
time, that, that sellers is interested in the fame aspect of
the Beatles and is sort of, I don't know what he was doing at
that time. In terms of his own career, his
movie career, but he seemed to just have an interest in the
beat Well, he was, he was he'd had his heart attacks, two or
three years before the quality of the films that he was
choosing was deteriorating slightly.
But by 67 68 in 269. I mean, he made Casino Royale
didn't in 67. Yes.
The perhaps the most 60s of old
60s for yeah? Yeah.
I'm not necessarily in a good way.
So yeah. He say he was hanging out with
with Ringo and whenever Ringo famously walked off the sessions
of the for The White Album and went off on holiday.
He went I think in stayed on Peter Sellers yacht, in the
Mediterranean learned about octopuses making Gardens wrote a
song, Mmm came back. So there's that sort of
connection as well. He, you know, he Ringo runs off
with Peter Sellers if you like to get away A from from the
Beatles. Mhm.
And you said before, you said earlier, you thought that it
would be John and George. Who would be more in thrall to
sellers where as it turned out, it was Ringo really wasn't.
It was. Yeah.
It was Ringo that that seemed to sort of pursue the friendship
with Peter Sellers and 1968 is an interesting sort of In the
Beatles / goons relationship because it's the beginning of 68
is when Spike Milligan is in the studio, while they're recording
a song and says, you know, can I have that song for my for my
charity album? So you've got that.
And then by the end of the year, Peter Sellers is hanging out in
the studio and Ringo is sort of quitting this actions to go on
holiday with, you know, with Peter.
So suddenly 68, you've got spiked And Peter Sellers in that
very much in their orbit at that point.
And yet, early 68 is when The Beetles are hanging out with the
Maharishi and sort of you would not necessarily put, you know,
the goons and the Maharishi the other one.
That's a it's a strange thing. And I do sometimes sort of think
well by the time they got to recording The White Album they
were sort of on the rebound from the Maharishi and again sellers
Maybe the music gets simpler, it gets less psychedelic, it gets
out and more like the rock and roll into basics of this.
Yeah, yeah. Back to Basics and who is in
their orbit at that point in 68 when they're doing that.
Well, that would be Peter Sellers from the goons who was
sort of fundamental to their teenage teenage influences as
well. So maybe that's just it, maybe
that's just a coincidence but know that.
It's correct me if I'm wrong here.
But On was of all of them. John was the one who was prone
to looking back. Yeah.
John would be writing songs about his mother and well,
that's yeah, that's, that's a good point as well.
Because, yes, John is looking back to that kind of teenage
traumatic. Yeah, he needs about.
And but, but yeah, it's as you say it's Ringo was the one that
really strikes up the friendship with Peter Sellers and then the
part in Ringo's part in the magic, question is specifically
written. That's right for him.
So I think it's not, it's not in the book, it sort of and I mean
really I suppose what Ringo does he moves through that film, just
watch out, he's basically at The Observer, you know, he's he's
he's not quite a straight man, but he's the person who's
watching as sellers does his comic business in each of the
law scenes and sketches Ringo is his sort of a foil for him.
I mean, Ringo did say at the time they work, there were times
when he simply couldn't complete I take because he was laughing
so much that he find it, you know, he just trying to be a
serious actor and take this very seriously, but he just kept
corpsing, because he couldn't keep straight face.
And then, of course, once that happened, sellers laid up to it,
and it just got worse and worse. And I had to do, you know, take
after take, because Ringo Rango was laughing.
It's I think if you know the scene with Spike or spike is
required required to eat the parking ticket and the parking
ticket and Ringo is in the Our during that Satan frantically,
kind of marking and making faces.
And and he said he was doing that because he was laughing so
much and it's all happening in the background.
And you think this is a great comic performance Ringo.
He's not the center of attention, but he just there in
the background, but apparently he was like, literally.
He was just trying not to laugh. So, whatever.
Whatever thing about the magic Christian film, we haven't
mentioned bad figure. Yes.
Big fan of that.
That's all. Yeah.
Which, Which pull pull? Basically just gave away to
them, didn't it? Yes.
So come and get it to Paul goes
into the studio, recording a demo complete, you know, are
strums piano. Everything gives Badfinger the
demo and they start working up their arrangement of and Paul
says, no no, you just play it exactly the way I have recorded
it and So, you know, becomes a becomes a hit single and that's
a song that all know. He could have brought that into
the into the sessions for for the Beatles, at any point, but I
often think, you know, was Paul just kind of saying, well, you
know, guys, this is what you could have had, you know, it was
good enough and I think what would Abbey Road have sounded?
Like if they drop Maxwell's, Silver Hammer and put come and
get it all of it. Yeah that's that's that's a
whole other. Other counterfactual, you have
the, the maximum fans issuing fatwas against you.
I'm already, I'm already, I'm already top of their head, like,
so it can get the worse, it can get no worse.
I mean, we're the other thing with Ringo and sellers is the
ring. A seller Soul Ringo his house
Brookfield. Yeah.
In 1968, but George did you know that John tried to get some
Rango? No, so in 1968, Silence agreed
to sell Brookfield, is Heist to Ringo for 70,000 pounds,
although I think sellers had probably spent something similar
to that renovating it. And I don't really know the
house but I gather it's, you know, it's sort of 15th century
it's, you know, pretty impressive and John Lennon is in
in the market for an impressive house because he's kind of
taking up with Yoko and white and he offered sellers 150,000
It's for it. But sellers honored his
commitment to Ringo and sold it to him for 70,000, which is,
which is uncharacteristically admirable cell as well.
I right? Yes, it's not, it's not.
I would have expected from what I know about Peter Sellers on
his, from my own that, I Ringo then sold it to Stephen Stills
in later on any two years later, wasn't it?
Yeah. Yeah, so I wasn't able to find
out how much weather Ringo. Kind of turned a handsome profit
on that and I think I'm right in saying, the only other story I
know about Brooke fatals is, I think in the early 70s, Stephen
Stills made the mistake of letting Ronnie would stay in the
house while he was. He went back to America and
Ronnie drank everything that was in the cellar which was very,
very expensive vintage wine that stills.
Collected by think, you know, if you're foolish enough to let
Ronnie would have the key to your wine cellar, and only
yourself to blame, isn't that later the basis of an episode of
black books? Yes, I think, that's right.
I think you're right. That's right, I'd forgotten
that. Yeah, I've gotten that.
Yeah. The flexi discs, the Christmas
flexi discs. Yes, that's what to talk about
that are about very, very yeah. The flaxseed is, are very good
nourish. I mean particularly I think the
one in 1967 use the sort of Chris Christmas pantomime.
Yeah matches matches that they you know what Jasper and That
is, that is there is no plot, there are just multiple
characters coming in and out with strange voices and
completely non sequiturs. And I mean, that could be a gun
show script, I think. Yeah, it was around.
It was, of course, it was a 67 that they made Magical Mystery
Tour. Yes.
Now, there's a line in that. Spoken by John which Echoes a
line from a gun show. And so in the Magical Mystery
Tour of this, the bit where John says Come With Me Now into that
secret place where the eyes of man have never set foot.
Yes, and there's a gun show called The Last Emperor from
1955 when the line is the tomb of Genghis Khan with its Untold
Treasures remains undiscovered. He lies buried in some Mongol
Hillside where no human eye has ever set foot.
That's a direct lift more or less.
Yeah, yeah. So around this time Lennon
obviously he's had his books published as well and you know,
things like the daily howl. And yeah, the the daily Hall is
a I'm Barry. I'm not a fan of the daily Heil.
And I sort of think there must have been a million teenagers
writing, that kind of stuff, and it's not particularly funny.
And if he hadn't gone on to be John Lennon, That's not
something, anybody would be interested in reading or would
have kept. Or, you know, if you find out in
a junk shop that some child had written in the 50s, you know,
you wouldn't give it a second glance and I think it's more a
record of the fact that the goons were influencing him.
But I don't think it has much intrinsic worth but it's sort of
become elevated and and John elevates it, you know, he and he
links it very specifically, he talks about It.
One of my earliest sort of things that I wrote was very
influenced by by the goons, and I think the books that come out
are, you know, so we say it's a homage to the guns rather than
saying he's just lifted Spike Milligan's stick wholesale, you
know, I'm not a big fan, I've saved all of the books II kind
of think. Well, Spike Milligan, does it so
much better? And, you know, John is always, I
think very self-conscious about those books that well, he gets
it gets. What does it is?
It, and one of the flexi discs, he gets the gentle ribbing, from
the the others about. Yes, they, yes, they were George
in particular area. And I mean, and there's that
there's a sort of a clip where George actually tears up the
book, you know, so I think, I think they do, you know, no I do
think the other Beatles don't take it very seriously, but it's
very much, you know, 999 long and it's very Spike and I don't
Really think it deserves to be put on the same level as Spike
because it's quite derivative. You know, I think Spike spike to
me Spike Milligan and his writing sort of just emerges out
of nowhere. Really mean, you've got Leo and
you've got that kind of nonsense first, but bike, just elevates
it to a completely different. I can see it's very dated and I
could see the people like the match Christian, you know, that
people these days, look at it and don't really connect with
it. But I think if it hit, I think
if Spike. Writings at you at a particular
point, you know, when your kind of 13 or you that's going to
slightly pretentious teenager and sort of slightly angsty.
And I think if it hits you there and it gets you, it will it will
stick with you. Well, then obviously, then
brings us on to Milligan claiming that the lyrics of Lucy
in the Sky, with Diamonds was inspired by The goons.
Yeah. Do you know about this?
I'll show you know, about this. So not LSD and no, no based on
this is the thing, right? He says Billy Milligan had a
tendency to exaggerate the resident but he he said that he
said we used to talk about plasticine ties in the Goon show
and this crept up and Lucy as plasticine Porter's with Looking
Glass ties. Yeah.
There's no mention of plasticine ties at all in any goon show.
Well, I say that not in any that exist that have survived, you
know, I'm not sure about the early delicious, there is a gun
show called The plasticine Man. Without any doubt, these body
lateral, Man of the better team period who and beautifully
preserved, considering his six thousand years old.
So well-preserved, he's still alive.
What's this? What's this ancient weapon?
He's holding? That's my saxophone.
Mm, I'm a rock and roll. Six of the real dumb guy in
Iraq, salmon, and he is handled over here.
I'm crazy, man, crazy. I'm cool.
Only we understood his strange, prehistoric language a whole
Right? So this is this is this, right?
This is Robin Milligan was sitting in on some of the
sergeant pepper, sessions know, I don't know.
I have to say, I have I've never I've never heard that that's
possible because that was a, that was a period.
When people were just coming and going constantly during those
sessions, I mean, the one that I'm aware of is across the
universe, but that was early 68. So I don't know that he was
They're at the time. I'd love to because it's the
story that David Crosby was therefore, they are the life.
Yes, I'd love it to need spike. It out.
Spike was there are sitting in a corner helping John finish off
the lyrics to. I'm sure we observed by could
have mentioned that if that adhere the plasticine borders
thing, seems a little tenuous. But I mean, I think certainly,
you know, if you're looking for a You can ask there are kits,
probably, I Am, The Walrus is probably where you would go
where it just kind of tumbles out and it is this sort of
nonsense. Yes, nonsensical freeform verse,
that's kind of pouring out of Lenin and that's probably I
think as close as you get and it's close as land and gets to
transferring, what he's written in the books into it into kind
of, it's more Lewis Carroll's in it.
Yeah but even then yes, it kind of reaches back.
Back even further. I think to Lewis Carroll.
And it's interesting that that's really the point at which light
on stops that. Hmm.
You know, he does, I Am, The Walrus was a little bit, I
suppose of that in Across the Universe of the beginning of 68.
And then he sort of abandons, those sort of dance, dance,
Leeward images, stop stop appearing in the song.
So it's almost as if he's taken it as far as he can go, and then
just walks away from it and it says, Something about him and
Yoko and Shoal and then it Garden.
Then yeah, then it all becomes It.
All becomes white him. The artist is the art and the is
the artist and I mean it's interesting, that's probably a
theory. I would have thought that Spike
might have subscribed to that. You know, it's the life of the
artist is worth examining and you sort of you're living your
art, you know, Spike strikes me I don't pretend to know a lot
about spikes. Demons and and sort of his
approach to things, but it does strike me that perhaps he was
sort of similarly minded that certainly took.
Lennon took what he was doing very seriously, and I think
Spike probably did as well, but he, you know, this idea that
Leonard has that, you know, I can't decide if I'm a genius or
an idiot. Yeah, yeah.
And you kind of think you could see with spiked with his kind of
mood swings and he's sort of mental health issues, that
that's the kind of toing and froing.
You know, one day you think you're the genius and the next
you're sort of consumed by self died and Landon was quite open
about that. But particularly sort of late
60s, early, 70s. And one of the things after stop
Spike died and there was an estate sale, one of the things
that went up on sale was a book that Lenin had given Spike and
it was a copy of Arthur Jan Ops Primal scream.
Mmm. So, So Lennon sort of obviously
got this book was he was sent a copy of the book and here at it,
obviously meant a lot to him, he embarked on and he sent a copy
to spike. It's interesting because that
would have been with other women.
The Primal scream, would being 69, 70, 68, 69, 70 are only 7K
because I want to just mention that Spike.
When we talk about spike in general, you could say that he's
quite him big. Quite thin skinned quite said
very sensitive. Very sensitive.
Going in many ways, fiercely outspoken, but also very
insecure in a lot of ways I think up.
And yeah, and he was quoted as saying of Lenin and that he and
Lennon used to talk a lot about comedy.
He said he was a gun show freak, it all stopped.
When he married Yoko Ono, everything stopped.
You never asked for me again. Kind of like lies that soon as
John. Mary yoga that was it.
He never spoke to spark again but the book gives the lie to
that, doesn't it? Well, certainly he certainly
sounds from the book so it would be interesting to know if they
spoke about that, but I think that that is something that
other people comment on that when Yoko arrived sort of by 68,
69 her sort of arrival, basically, excluded everything
else. So everything else that went
before, Was sort of pre Yoko and there's a post your coat and but
interestingly, you say Lennon wrote the wrote a book review of
the Goon show scripts and in 1977, I think for his birthday.
So he'd been 37 Yoko, gave him a set of good and choke.
That's right tapes and I think, by that stage, he had started to
Reconnect. You know, he writes to his Aunt.
Mimi and says sent me my school tie that I had when I was a
teenager when you can see pictures of him wearing this,
and he gets all of her biscuits sent to him from England and
he's watching Fawlty Towers and he's watching Monty Python and
he sort of reconnecting with that.
But I think certainly that initial let's say five year
period, when he and Yoko get together, is a kind of scorched
Earth. Mmm-hmm policy with everything.
Everything that went Aunt and before.
But that's interesting. I it would be fascinating to
find out. I must try and find out.
If he in Spike actually actually spoke Ryan 1970.
I mean, you know if you were Spike Milligan and somebody sent
you a book about how to correct her mental health problems you
know throughout not the most tactful it's probably meant well
yeah I'd probably suggest everybody knew.
You don't be a disaster address book out and just sending it to
our Nene as well. Imagine you have, yes.
But it is that thing where they the goons are we were talking
about the guns, but essentially it's Milligan and seller course
it is. Yeah.
And they sort of spiral in and out of the lives and the orbit
of individual Beatles. So, you know, you got Ringo and
sellers in 68, 69, and but, and you got Spike Milligan and 68
and he and land on are connecting.
And then what by By the early 70s.
It's George Harrison, and Peter Sellers and Spike Milligan and
there are sort of all hanging out of George's.
I said far apart and Joe, you know, Peter Sellers is taken to
wearing caftans ordinary jackets and is gone quite quite Indian
in his, his approach to things and he seems to be sort of
taking that up from from George. Was he little late to that
party. The cells, when he starts.
Mean, I've seen pictures of sellers in those sort of long,
Indian jackets, and things in the early 70s.
And he was, he was hanging out with George and with Ravi
Shankar, mmm, and sort of meditating and doing what my
understanding is. He had a falling out with Ravi
Shankar that he asks Ravi Shankar, would he come?
And, you know, give a recital. For sellers at a party.
He was hoping for some friends and Ravi Shankar said, yes, that
will cost you and quoted him. Some Au 3, where I sellers was
hoping just obviously that Ivy would turn up, you know, give
them a few tunes and that would be that.
But Ravi much like, Peter Sellers.
I think, was the man that knew the value of a dollar.
Oh, you know, he and I might mention, sorry, am I imagining
it? My imagining this completely.
She works in a photograph of George, Harrison Peter Sellers
and Ravi Shankar at Disneyland. Is that is that is that ringing
a bell with me? Or did we have the same fever
dream? Perhaps you would like to it?
Perhaps it wasn't perhaps. It was George as high as George
Soros was a bit like this deal and I think we just sorry I will
quickly just look it up because otherwise you're gonna have to
yeah otherwise it will bug me. I'd really like to see that
photograph. Disney.
I'm just going to send this to you.
You can just send that to you. Yeah, that's, that's a
photograph taken. That's a photograph taken in
1974. That is Georges 1974.
U.s. trip at the foot of the steps, but I'm looking at all.
Right? Yeah, it's not that's not my
line is it that's not, that's not Disneyland.
But I'm looking something else up here and I just typed enjoy.
Charleston. And it's a George at the
happiest place on Earth. This is a photograph of George.
Eric idle Derek, Taylor's wife and kids in this Zealand.
And then it says, from what? I understand George, Peter
Sellers, Ravi Shankar and Eric idle all went to Disneyland in
1977, what a sight that must have been So well, it's insane.
Mmm. But that, yeah, that would be,
yeah, you'd like to be queuing up behind them or not, maybe, or
not, or not, for the concert. What became the concert for
Bangladesh. Oh, right.
So the original idea was Ravi Shankar went to George and said
look you know, We organize something and I'm thinking of
giving a concert and, you know, could you come along do
something? It could be a compound.
Peter Sellers has agreed to come along and be the compound.
I'm not quite sure what happened to Peter Sellers, why he didn't
sort of make it onto the stage, but the original idea had been
that he would sort of compare something.
He had a habit, even eat. Sorry, he had a habit, certainly
in a glass of decade of his life of Agreeing to do things.
And then pulling out at the last minute, right changing his mind,
just on concert for Bangladesh. Yeah.
Is there any truth that could Spike and George were good?
Friends, is there any truth that George gave Spike?
The Stratocaster that he played, he cares, what he did, right?
And that he did, and that guitar has disappeared.
No one, no one there knows where it is.
So, apparently I've seen a photograph and I would say this
is probably late 73 or early Sunday for judging by George's
harm. The state of Georgia's parameter
is always a good, a good metric spike is at Friar Park.
In it, in a sort of, in the studio, is sort of jam session
that's going on. In George's on guitar spike is
on piano, and Peter Sellers is on drums.
Wow, because am I right? In saying, that, Peter Sellers
sort of started as a drum? No.
Yes, he was summer early. He was a good drummer.
Yeah, yeah. So so he is there in the
student. So it's like a one Beetle to
guns and they're kind of playing and I kind of think is that was
not recorded is Somewhere in the house and estate archive.
That there's, there's a tape. I mean, it's probably like all
these things. It's much better on the page
than to actually. Wow, listen to it.
Because salads salad, famously was into his gadgets and he used
to film everything and record everything he could and well, it
take. But but but then we do know that
in towards the end of his life, he he threw a lot of his
personal stuff onto a large bonfire and it has lost
unfortunately. So sadly.
All I would, I would, I would love to see George Spike and
Peter Sellers jamming in Friar Park in the studio.
So despite the story is that Spike and said he would like to
play move from keyboards to the guitar.
So he and George kind of swap places and George has talked
about this and he said, I don't have a lot of straps.
There was one I gave to spike Milligan.
He was at my house one day with Peter Sellers, he do was play.
Draw, the spike was playing the piano and I was playing guitar
Spike. Good off the piano and wanted to
play the guitar. I plugged him into this
Stratford a little champ amplifier and he said I haven't
played for 30 years, he just picked it up and it sounded like
Django Reinhardt or something, and I thought, well, that's
good. So when he left, I put it in the
case, put it and the champ in Peter Sellers Boot and told him,
when you drop Spike off, give him this.
That was the guitar that I played it the concert for
Bangladesh, so it's a sort of stripped back.
The paint work has been stripped back and the, the guitar just
disappeared. It didn't turn up in the estate
sale. They didn't turn up as part of
spikes, M&M's actions and that not guitar would be worth a
fortune. And you think, did that did
Spike, just give it away, did it just end up in the local charity
shop? Did Peter keep it in the boot of
the car? You know, that's was Peter
thinking, probably worth Over to I'll, I'll hang onto that.
So yeah, this is when I wouldn't put it past that, as I wouldn't
put it past sellers to be a little bit resentful.
Maybe. Well, yeah, I haven't that.
And I think it's, it's, it's such, it's it's so telling of
Georgia's character as well, you know, because, you know, George
is the one that everybody says, you know, he was, you know,
like, like the dollar as well, you know, he was, but yet he's
just, you know, on a complete with him.
There you go. There's a, there's a fan of Even
without the George Harrison connection, that's a valuable
piece of equipment, with the George Harrison connection and
with it being played at such a high profile event.
Yes, it would be, it would be worth hundreds of thousands of
pounds if you if you could find it.
So you should you should put out a request on your podcast to see
if you can track down what happened to so that that that
guitar answers on a postcard George and Spike, sort of
famously. You know, we're very tight at
that point and then they sort of drifted apart and if you seen
it, you know, the letter that Spike wrote to George, I do
yesterday in the eighties. Sort of say, you know, if you're
about how to use a phone, it's a bit.
Of course, if you're extremely rich, you don't have to use the
phone, but the funeral's at golders Green, you'll recognize
me I'm dead. Don't don't send them are sent
money, so he was a little bit. Mmm.
I was gonna say spiky but that would be a terrible terrible
pun, but my other George Harris. So that's that's another example
of Spike being quite thin skin. Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah yeah.
Yeah yeah. Am I old my Lord Spike goons
connection is the liner notes for the Traveling Wilburys album
which were written by huge abdomen.
Ah, mmm. And the first time I ever heard
that joke, I think was on a good show.
I'm Sure. Yes, that's a good.
That's it is is and you think how did that get past the
sensor? But my name is Jim didn't
Captain huge Anton sticking with Milligan?
Yeah, it could we haven't really talked too much about Paul
wanted to talk a little bit about poll now.
Nelligan partly inspired Ebony and Ivory.
I did this. I have not heard.
This is new to me. So okay.
All right. So apparently, So spikes.
Doing a sketch on television. I'm not sure.
It must probably was not sure, Q8 Q 9 not sure which show it
was, where he's playing a segregated piano in which the
White and The Black Keys were kept apart, okay?
And and his character spike is character says or sings like
notes, white notes and you need to play the two to make Harmony
folks. Okay.
And apparently look at me, was at least partly inspired to
write Ebony and Ivory off the back of that.
I think that's very credible. Mmm.
Yeah, II think that is credible. Well, apparently he makes it
apparently. McCartney's gone on record to
say that, but, okay, I do not not, not inspired by, you know,
some of some of the slightly less Politically correct things
that spike said and did on Q8. No that's true.
This is the two sides of the Milligan coin.
But well I had not heard that. That's that's a new.
It's a new Beatles related fact for me I'm going to write that
time. It might be complete.
Poppycock. I'd like I'd like to.
I'd like to think it's true well to think it's.
I also like the fact that George Martin produced A banana, a
penny and I are very yeah we're back to that.
Yeah, can actually yeah. Also with regards to Paul he at.
So do you know do you know about the Goon?
The Goon recording all the the spike and Peter in the 50s did a
version of Unchained Melody. Yes, I've heard that I've heard
that and with dance with me, Henry as the B-side, but it was
never released because the writers of Unchained Melody or
wouldn't give them a clearance. They certainly thought it was it
was very and disrespectful. Hmm.
But then fast forward about what 40 years.
Who owns the rights to Unchained Melody, mr.
Paul McCartney. And I and here, Allows it to
finally be released in the mid nineties.
I think, right? Yeah, because I have, I have
heard that but again, I didn't that there's the stump me with
to Beatles facts that I did not know.
The self is another obvious goons Beatles connection, which
we haven't touched on yet Peter Sellers Doing Hard, Day's Night.
Yes, big fan, big fan of that. So again, you got that.
Connection back, you know, George Martin has been working
with Peter Sellers. Then he's working with the
Beatles and then sellers, I don't know.
He's, he satirizing The Beatles. I don't think it's anything
could have directed at the Beatles, but that is very funny.
I mean, I do remember seeing that somewhere in the early 70s
stop. That must have been on
television that clip, not the whole thing.
The whole that's from the sort of sort of this, the music of
land on Umi car. Another Granada show the Granada
show. But I mean I certainly didn't
see that I think until channel for I think put that on some
point. Hmm, not long after it started
but I definitely had sort of saw the clip of sellers, Richard.
The Third And I remember buying a CD, which Had A Hard Day's
Night, she loves you and Can't Buy Me, Love by Sellers, and she
loves you as doing the characters.
Dr. Strangelove your think, said to, you have lost your love.
Well, I saw her yesterday. It is you that you're seeking
of, and she is Tara to me, ever to see.
She says she loves you Yeah. Yeah, she loves you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. She loves you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes.
That's what I thought. Yeah.
And I put this CD on, I remember bring it home because I'm a huge
fan of dr. Strangelove and it's a different
version. It's called The twits version.
Oh yeah. And yeah, just to upper-class
20-year. Yeah, you know, sort of In the
voices and so, it's a dialogue. So you think you've lost your
love, you know, while I saw her yesterday, and I've never heard
that before that, that must have been sort of late 80s.
Yeah, well, he did a couple of versions of she loves you as
with. Yeah, Strangelove and the upper
class twit voice that he did on the Peter and Sophia LP as well.
I am not, I had not heard that. I had not heard that.
But again, the beat you think the Beatles must have been very
happy to have, you know, you're listening to the goons suddenly
you're working with the guns. Producer, you're being directed
by the guns, you know, by dick glass or days doing your film
and then suddenly one of the guns is covering covering your
material. You know, that's that's that's
incredible. Sort of position to be at yes
and one of your Heroes is suddenly you know I can
understand why Lennon is sort of grinning as Peter Sellers as
handing in the granny granny granny.
Well that's another thing actually just on that because
that was on the set of help. Now there was a rumor.
Wasn't there was talk with Peter Sellers actually appearing in
help one point. And yes, I'm not I'm not clear
whether he was going to appear on the Beatles version of help
or whether he had In sort of offered with the offered the
script or was he was the offered a part in the film, I'm a bit
hazy on that because I think the help script was pulled together
pretty quickly. You know, it went through
various sort of iterations and then in the sort of was pulled
together pretty quickly in the end, but that would be, that
would have been would have been an interesting.
I mean, do you think sellers would have been happy to sort of
take second Bill owner in 1965, you know?
Well, I'm just thinking of when it is heart attacks were around
that time. So so maybe yeah but who knows?
It's a few other, quite tenuous, not tenuous.
But that, as I said at the beginning to you, little sort of
bits of trivia that have a goon goon Beatles connection which
stretching it a bit. So, just wanted to run through
those quick shock. You don't mind obviously.
Dick Amory. So, take a memory is quite front
and center as a voice artist on Yellow Submarine Force.
Yeah, and he did appear in a number of game shows and also
the Goon film case of the mekinese battle home.
Right, I did, I didn't know he was on, I knew that, but I
didn't know he had appeared in sort of the episodes.
Was he had recurring character, think he?
No, no, I think he should have checked.
I think he's in he's in at least two maybe three.
In fact, I think there was some earlier shows that don't exist
anymore. When Spike was Ill that he
appeared in as well. So he's in a handful there is
there is a couple that certainly do exist, that he's a guest, a
guest on, okay, now in January 63 jukebox jury.
You know about this. No.
Okay. Jukebox Jerry, January 63 and
Dick. James had been told that please.
Please me would be played and it wasn't okay, but more
significantly. Who's on the panel that week.
We've got Eric Sykes and Spike Milligan, okay?
Right. And Eric Sykes wore a hearing
aid the first time in public or untick TV at least because
obviously I have to listen, listen to the music being
played. Now this this one is for Real
sort of Hardcore goon fans. This little bit of trivia here.
Mike Haskins shared this with me.
Okay? Now you're probably not aware
that very, very, very occasionally.
In fact, there's probably only about five instances in the in
the whole of the Goon shows run, that they actually had a real
female guest on the show, okay? And they actually had a lady, an
actress A lady that is an actress who was working with
Peter Sellers on a television program at the time in the mid
50's guest on the Goon show twice.
Okay. In the episode, you Bandit of
Sherwood Forest and in a later episode called Tales of
Montmartre, which we've covered on this as partners and that
that actress was called Charlotte Mitchell and she was
very friendly with the goons. And there is a rumor that
there's As rumors about her at Sellers, as well, if you know
what I mean. Now, her husband At the time was
an actor called Philip guard. Okay.
Not not really well known bit, but Philip guard played.
Edgar in a third program, recording of King Lear in the
60s. Okay, all right, and so he
appears in the run out of I Am the Walrus That is a good fact.
I did not know that. That is a very good fact, very
tenuous, but very tenuous. Yeah, that's exactly the kind of
information. I like to squirrel away.
And that's that's a, that's going to be a tie-break question
in a Beatles quiz or a good physically someday.
And I'm not going to forget that.
That's a that's a great piece of trivia.
That's excellent. Well done.
Well thank you Mike for Mike. Yeah, like you Mike That's very
good. I know they will a serviceable
villain has Duty us to the vices of.
I mistress as Badness will desire.
What is he dead since you down? Father, bless you.
Service. One other thing as well.
There's this famous photograph of the goons holding leaks in
1956. Then, if you've seen that photo,
I have I'd I know that photograph.
Yeah. Now in 72, they recreated more
or less that photo with the, the much older goons holding leaks.
And I like to think that that's the goons version of the red and
blue help me gasps. That's very tenuous, that's very
case. But I see what you did there.
I see what you did there. That's very good.
I see what you did there. I see what you did there.
I let your way with thank you for all that you're with us.
That's not looking not. That is not going to win me a
Beatles quiz someday. That's That's Mike.
Drop territory. That's Mike.
That's mic drop. I think I'm just going to say I
am not sure whether we I mentioned this on my car off mic
but that the Stuart Sutcliffe Link in 1957.
Spike did a TV show, whether use the Britain got to sort of put
questions to Leading Lights of the day and liberal arts college
sent some people along to the audience and one of them with
Stuart Sutcliffe and he who, of course for people that don't
know, he was in the original lineup of The Beatles, he was
the fifth Beatle if you like, and he appeared on camera and
got to put two questions to spike.
But of course, in the way of things that TV show, Show no
longer exists and it's particularly frustrating because
there is no recording of Stewart's are Cliffs voice.
The closest is there's a sort of a tape of them.
The Beatles were harassing, and you can hear somebody speaking
very faintly in the background. And well, maybe that was Stuart
Sutcliffe, but you think he was on camera?
Yeah, we ate my leg and we don't know when the question is, where
do we know? We don't don't know anything
about it and That's just another one of those terrible terrible
situations, where you know, there was no foresight
whatsoever but keeping these things, no I suppose, you know,
but very, very kind of frustrating when I read that.
So the other, the only other two things that that I thought I
would mention. Hmm was the It's all in the
mind. Praise from the gun show.
Yeah, that appears in yellow submarine in the film.
Yes. All in the mind.
You know. And that that was a sort of
recurring phrase, I think of the green shows.
I mean it was it was it was it was written.
Well it's attributed to Larry Stevens who wrote a lot of
scripts with Spike. Hmm Larry sadly died in the late
50s but yeah, he I think Came up with that, that was used as a
recurring catchphrase. It was often used just to
abruptly end an episode that they run out of plot.
And so the announcer want to screen your leg would chip in
with it's all in the mind. You know, Kim use the earliest
prevalence of. What are we going to do now?
What are we gonna do now? I just yeah, what's it?
Like I've written down. I've written down.
It crops up in the Beatles. Cartoon episode Strawberry
Fields, Forever. That line as well, right?
Could be, that's interesting because they had so little to do
with that with that, that production was, I think the the
Yellow Submarine script, Roger, mcgough had a lot of input into
that and you kind of think he you know same generation
listening to the guns. That's see him that kind of same
sense of humor. I enjoyed that video so most
enjoyable. Yeah.
How did we do it? John?
How it's all in the mind, you know?
And the other thing is just that talk about Paul McCartney and
Spike Milligan, deserving, a co-write credit for a Ebony and
Ivory but they lived quite close together, Paul, and spike in
the, in the eighties. So sort of in Rye, and he
Sussex. So there's very close Depaul's,
Hog Hill studio, and supposedly, they all would kind of go and
visit Spike on a fairly regular basis, and I think it's I always
think is sort of kind of ironic that we started off or I started
off by saying John George. They would be the ones that
would be most tuned, and you think of, Paul as being a little
bit more straight last and not really sort of of that mind.
But yet he and Spike, Fast friends when they lived together
in the eighties, they call, right?
Paul supposedly would they live together?
And I'd love to deliver think maybe a sitcom.
So that would be a Cisco. I can pull that would lead to be
a sitcom. We should get something we
should we should copyright that idea, let's get writing that,
that would be a fantastic. It would be like a more surreal
version of Stella street, that would be true with music as are
all. That would be very good, I
think. Yeah, we could write that in an
envelope and send it to yourself.
The cost to copyright that idea, Serafina, which is, oh, yeah.
And who would he? Please don't think.
Who would be Spike? That's probably on cast.
David David? Threlfall, yes, yes, that would
be good. None would be good, and I would
be good at least to go 40 and Paul would come run Spike Sighs
and Spike would be in bed. So Paul we just sit and play the
piano and have you. Are you aware of the poem that
Paul wrote for Spike? No, no.
He wrote a poem. I don't know when this was
written, but this poem turns up in 2008 whenever all of spikes,
sort of a state possessions are being auctioned off and it's
called The Poet of films woman lay in and it comes complete
with the cartoon called The Nutters of starve Crow Lane.
And it's just that it's just a little poem and you want me to
read you the poem without the that be Going up too much time.
Every fiber of my being please, the voice of the port of them
woman's lay. In can be heard Across The
Valleys of sugar, burnt cayenne and nostrils that sleep through
the wildest of nights will be twitching to gain aromatic
insights. The wife of the farmer of
popping wholly in can be seen from the cab of the Roberts
Bridge, train and passengers comments will frequently turn to
the wages. The wife of a farmer can earn
the port of dumbs woman's lay in sallies Forth.
He's hoping for Want to see and it's signed with love from Paul
yesterday's man. And then he drew a little
cartoon of a man and a woman, giving a maca.
Thumbs up, of course. Yeah, Wonder force and you could
have, you could have had that for your very own 46 thousand
pints in 2008. Mmm.
And you could have bought for that.
You could have bought 12 pianos you You could as I was saying to
you, the piano went up for sale and it went for 480 pounds.
I cannot believe something. That's that's that's in 2022.
That's the price price of a loaf of bread.
Yeah, even if even if he just played, I don't know chopsticks
on it. Just needs to be in a museum and
and then I have one completely unreliable anecdotal, go on.
So this is when the Beatles get back together.
In 1994 to record free as a bird.
And, you know, George has arrived in his nice motor and
they're all hanging out, fog Hill studio and it's so there's
Paul George and Ringo and I imagined those sessions have
moments of tension between between them.
So at one point a certainty. Yeah, yeah they decide.
They're going to take a break. And Paul says, I have an Idea,
let's go and see Spike. He's only 10 minutes up the road
and of course, George is a big fan and his, you know, kept in
touch with Spike and Paul is a fan.
And I don't know when Ringo laughs.
Um, but anyway, they kind of get in a car.
I imagine they're all in the back of June Old Land Rover and
they drive to spikes house, and they ring the bell and Spike
opens the door and says, it's not convenient, I'm busy and
close the door. Sends them on their way.
And you think that's Spike? Yeah.
Is there anything more Spike than that?
You know, the Beatles, the surviving Beatles all through
these people who are never in a room together, turn up and
they're all standing on your front door and say, no, I'm
sorry, I not convenient. Come back another day, you know.
So I don't know whether that is true or not.
I want that to be true and I so want that.
Yes, right. So want that to be true and and,
and again, I like the notion that 1994 there, The Beatles are
in the studio. It is a tense situation, you
know. John obviously isn't there.
They're working to his tape. George is sort of their under
sufferings it. It will be tense and what do
they do to kind of break the tension?
What do they turn to thing? Turn back to the goons?
Yeah. To the thing that in their
teenage years, that United them all and it's back to that Point
that we talked about on our podcast About, You Know, My Name
Look up the number. We're in the midst of the kind
of chaos and the almost physical altercation between John and
Paul. They suddenly one of them
decides to pull out this tape and they get together and John
and Paul standing around a microphone.
Doing funny voices like the guns trying to reach back to their
their kind of that connection. They had to find some common
ground and it just seems to me. This is why I so wanted to be
true is, is not only because it's the most spike thing I've
ever heard. But also the fact that the
Beatles, the three Beatles when they wanted to take a break from
the tension or from from the work that they were doing, They
turned to spike they turned to the good.
Yeah, you know. They're they're reaching back to
that same thing. Yeah.
And ends I again I like to think that the three wheels just
didn't laughed and the doorstep, you know, because what else
could you do? That's the love.
I think that's a perfect point to end on.
Really you got anything else? Steven?
And I don't think so. I think you've I think you
stumped me with a couple of beetle beetle points of trivia
there and I'll be writing those dine as a Sam.
Yeah. And did the tank is dry.
Tigers dry. I think we've ideas.
It's but, but you know, it's all in the mind, you know, it all
very good. I tried, by the way, I I tried
desperately to find a hairy cecum.
I know. I know.
There is one okay. It's not really just that I
really want you. I really want you to tell me
that he tried to get George Harrison ought to sing My Sweet
Lord on Highway. He introduced Paul to acid, no
heat. Well, he appeared on the bill
wisdom on the 63 Royal Variety performance.
That's also really that's it. I always feel slightly sorry for
Harry. Yeah, you know, but it's his own
fault, you know, because you know, Q8 Highway Pink Panther
Highway. He was always on this podcast.
He is often referred to as the Gringo of the goons and I think
that's I think that's perfect because He's kind of the
uniforms that these, the Diplomat.
He's the one that they all like, you know, yes, he's the
mediator. Yeah, I suppose that's a good
analogy. We should, we should have done
15 minutes on that, you know. But, but the clock is against
us, they say, Stephen, listen. Thank you so much.
I'm sure that everyone listen to, this is our already
subscribed to nothing is real. So, what if you got coming up,
what have we got coming on? Well, we just finished our
Allen, Klein marathon in season 6.
So I think we probably alienated half our listeners.
Why I was trying to argue that Allen Klein was actually the
good guy but so we're still I think we had quite an ambitious
season 6 where we tried to do an arc of sort of a narrative.
I think that exhausted us so much that we're going to revert
back to a series of sort of individual episodes.
So we might do an Allen Klein part 5, but we're going to look
at some individual characters in The Beatles.
And who knows? We might do a beetles in the
goons episode. There's no need to we've already
covered. That was not.
Of course not. No, we just put Europe.
We just, we just, I just top and tail this podcast and put it
right now. That'd be fine.
Are I'll be fine. All right, try and try and, you
know, Jason's a bit resistant to the goods.
As Nice adjacent Pearson is a bit DS, is a bit look warm on
the guns, but he puts that down to being so much younger.
He's const constantly throwing that up and but he did say, you
know, it's very much of its time You know, it was a wartime
situation. There was rationing you know,
and I'm thinking I think it probably resonates.
I think we're time for the gardens to make a comeback.
I think we're living through times when very similar to the
times, that produce the golden fourth, what?
Yeah, fantastic. By the way, I just want to do a
quick plug before we finish. I mentioned before, thanks to
Mike Haskins and Andrew hickey for Supply me with some of the
more esoteric trivia for this. But Mike has got this book
coming out in early, September called The Beatles Liverpool.
And it's going to be a it's a brand new.
Colorful guide to Historic Beetle Associated locations
across Liverpool and merseyside these range from the Beatles
homeschools the clubs with Plays and even the shops where they
bought their first instruments and The Barbers where they got
the haircut. Spoiler alert was a Penny Lane
all of described in Fab, Four fact packed detail.
You tell. I'm reading this.
Yeah, and Illustrated with what the Beatles old pal Cilla Black
would surely have described as a Lara, Lara pictures.
Yeah. Well, I'm very glad you got a
silver reference in. We've been doing that and our
podcast. So that's great, Oleg salenko
and Spike ridden that I'm not similar similar episodes when I
ended it was yes in the 60s anyway as and there's also an
exciting map showing how all these places are spread across
the Magnificent, city of Liverpool in the wonderful were
all Peninsula next to it. So yeah, so that will be out in
September published by Pitkin and available for all good hook
Emporia. So, I just wanted to put that
plug in for Mike. And if you know, if you two guys
Ever decide to hotfoot it to Liverpool and do a bit of a
roving report on beetles locations.
I'm sure Mike would make a first-class tour guide, well I
will definitely take him up on that.
I saw I follow Mike on Twitter and I saw he had put up a
picture of a big carton of the books that had arrived and I
think. Yeah, absolutely.
Because we do plan, we've been planning this and then covid got
in the way that we were going to go to Liverpool and do a tour
and I said suggest you do this book is coming out.
We should get Mike, on the podcast, talk about his book and
I said, we should to take the book as a guide, but it would be
even better if Mike would like to come along and he can guide
us, Winder sites. Okay.
Well, Stephen, thank you very much for having me.
It's I get to talk about two of my favorite, my favorite
subjects and syllable by syllable.
Thanks again, Stephen take care of yourselves.
See you soon? Bye.