Who is that? The ha who is it?
Who is it out of that? Only a lunatic would be out on
such a storm. Yes.
I rambled to gain pot this week, I'm joined by Willie McDade and
at this rate, if my guests keep getting younger and younger, by
this time next year, I'll be interviewing dopplers.
I just obviously no money was great and we talked about
particular gunshot but before we get into that discussion, just
wanted to mention about the response to the recent Which I
interviewed dirt makes it was extremely well received and I
got lots of what we both got. Lots and lots of lovely messages
on Twitter and on Facebook. And I just wanted to read out
one in particular just because it just its messages like this
if it's support like this that makes doing this podcast.
So worthwhile it's actually from the goodies podcast which were
account now I think I'm assuming that that it is the gentleman
known as Jeffers and Jeffers is is the chap behind the new
Filthy Rich and can flap podcast podcast.
Oh, cat flap. Oh, so check that out.
But yeah, so he sent this lovely message on Twitter.
The Goon pods are consistently great, but this chat with Dirk,
maggs is genuinely. One of the most enjoyable
podcast interviews I've ever listened to which might number
over 1,000 by now. Meaning informative heartwarming
funny, bloody hell. Take a Bow while I am on.
I'm recording this from the Bowing position.
So thank you for that. And thank you to everyone who
sent us a lovely messages of support for that episode and for
others. So yes, many more to come.
Anyway, let's get into the conversation with with Molly and
I hope you enjoy it. What's the youngest person you
had on this podcast? Okay. 35.
Okay. I am officially the youngest
person. Who's been on this podcast, I am
24. While say Okay.
First question obviously. So you've joined me today to
talk about a particular goon show.
So how did you come to discover the game show?
Well, I've always kind of, I'm not sure whether it's because
I'm a child of slightly older parents or whether I don't know,
just happened. I've always been kind of a fan
of old media anywhere. Like, shown various like old
sitcoms. As often I'm wearing a lot of on
how to share right now, I am a bit of a comedian But the gun
show happened because weirdly my mum's car had a cassette tape
player in it. It was, you know, and
occasionally, we just go through some charity shops.
And like to let you know when I was a teenager, kind of just and
just fine. And while she was, like, faroese
to, and from school, just find like, tapes and stuff to play on
drive up. And I can't remember whether she
found it or whether I can't remember anyone.
It somehow ended up in the car, this the to To the set of like
the double episode sets. Yeah, I think it had you know
that he's fallen in the water. I think it was at that specific
one and string of robberies was I'm pretty sure it was the first
I listen to okay. Then I listen to a load of them
got you know good really love them and then after a couple of
years kind of discover The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
radio series fell in love with it.
Massively. Yeah and I mean that's the
entire reason we had that mags on couple episodes ago because
that's a radio series is kind of the reason why I pursued writing
as a career because it was like, discovering the radio show and
then the books. And then I kind of didn't listen
to the green chair for a while. It's kind of in the back of my
head. And then about six months ago, I
came across, Dune pod, and thought, and because I was
listening looking for podcast and stuff to Into because, you
know, he's working from home self-employed and then I just
listened to it and I thought I need to listen to the Goon show
again and so being re catching up on old episodes that you've
covered and I you know like once I remember listening to having
string of robberies with the latest one of listen to in terms
of timeline because sure yes I'm a big Laurel and Hardy fan but I
don't have a single reason I haven't missed.
I haven't watched all of their films because I think I'm 25
now. If I Watch them all.
Now, listen to the wall. Now I'm going to not have
anything new, which is problem with being an old media fan is
that there is a finite amount. There is, I want to just take my
time with them when you reach the age of 48.
I mean, God knows what it's gonna be like in 20 plus years
for you. But God, I'm at the age now,
where I have so much stuff, both physical media, and digital
media, that I don't think I could physically watch.
Listen to it all in my life, the rest of my lifetime.
Oh my God. Yeah not a mean it's impossible.
But I look, I'm really touched it in some small way, perform
the service and reintroduce, you to the goons, I know that's like
completely forgotten about them, but I just kind of just not
listen to it in a while and like, basically rediscovering
this because I was like, 13 14 when I first listened to them.
And like, I haven't really known about like the history of Gucci.
So recently, I've kind of stumbled across the gordian knot
Which is a Peter Sellers and Spike Milligan that barrel all
their stuff. Yeah.
Obviously you heard the screen
Shake tape in your mom's car that was your first exposure to
the goons but and you ever had any sort of exposure to an
allergen or salads or seek a more even Banting before that
not been T. I haven't actually used to any
bed team. Should they even exist?
Any do any exist? This is about Two or three.
Yeah, they're pretty atrocious quality.
But now been teams complete complete, only committed.
And they've not only that but the others I kind of come across
in a way. I didn't really know who they
were before. Like Peter Sellers, it's like, I
think I saw him first when I watch the ladykillers, but
again, he was just like a person in the movie, I didn't really
think. Oh, that's Peter said, I didn't
know who he was, and I obviously knew about Pink Panther bit in
that way that all kids are seeing, Pink Panther's a
cartoon. And then after the opening they
go, why is this man Spike? I first saw in that scene, in
Life of Brian or he just Ends up Rambles and walks off.
And my mom was like that Spike Milligan of that.
I don't know who that is. Oh, I read the Ning Nang Nong in
school. Yeah.
But again that really they and Harry cecum.
I'm really only person who has not seen Highway.
Oh okay, I didn't know anything about Hollywood until you start
talking about it and what highways?
But I saw him first and older as, as the man who says more,
you know yesterday Mr. Bumble. Yeah.
Hmm. Yeah I think it does
internationally. I think that's what he's known
for. Yeah it is to be fair.
I mean I mean everybody with a lot probably wouldn't like that.
Yeah. I mean he's the one off the if
we exclude benteen he's certainly the he has less of an
international profile. I mean Milligan doesn't have
that huge International footprint although he's very
popular to this day. In Australia, New Zealand, South
Africa, he kind of He didn't really really and he's obviously
in that episode of The Muppet Show, but that was filmed in the
UK. Yeah.
And he's been in like say Life of Brian, which obviously would
have had us audiences but he's never been.
He never really crossed over into the u.s. or as sellers.
I wish I wish heresy could be on The Muppet Show because so we
could have had that Trio of episodes.
Oh, that would be lovely. It would have been great.
He would have thought he would have sung a bit will kids say
they had Bruce Forsyth on. Yeah, so Harry would have been
great just blowing raspberries and he would have, he would have
loved it. I'm just sad that we can get
that in the alternative universe.
That would be nice. Well, I think sellers would our
zombie because just by virtue because they're, he was such a
big star at the time, late 70s, Milligan Milligan.
I think kind of pulled some strings because he was very keen
to to be on. Yeah.
So so we'll by the time you would have been five The all
three of them would be sadly, no more.
Yeah, that was, before I even knew who they were.
Yeah, yeah. So another question, I tend to
ask new guests. When we talk about gun shows, I
know you don't, you don't listen to them all, but when you do
listen to the do, skip the geldray and the Ellington
numbers or do you. I was like the special It
depends when I first listened to the episode, I do, I sit there
and listen to them because sometimes the Gilda is really
quite. I like them and sometimes
they're a bit some but I'm grayling's in ones that I
usually enjoy because they're nice.
But then when I'm really listening just like, I'm just
listening casually and it as an episode of heard before and I'm
not particularly fast about that particular music a kind of skip
over mmm but it depends on the mood sometimes, you know, like
Sometimes I, yeah, I'll just listen some, just let it play.
Just enjoy enjoy music but no, I don't go over this again, skip
over? Yeah, yeah, okay.
Okay. So let's let's start talking
about the string robberies because, right, so is this, I
guess this is your favorite show by virtue of.
That was what the first one you heard more or less.
Weirdly like, I have a real soft spot for it because it was the
first one. And I remember some of the
things I was thinking, when I first heard it, I have other
favorites. Like, I have ones, I just
listened to on repeat because I just really love them.
Like, I'm weirdly the sinking of the Westminster peer.
I really like well. Okay, okay.
Yes, that's the debut of the Fred, the oyster sound effect,
which yeah, but I also love being very bad, putting hurler.
Yeah, obviously, that's the one I usually give people, when they
say, oh well, this is a game show.
Like, try this one. Yes, it just has that element to
it, but it's like, you don't. It's not like Stringer always is
a little bit more like under know.
It's like I suppose it's all right to listen to as the first
one. But yeah, I mean it's got its
got that sequence and we'll come to it in a bit in more details
about the sequence, where, see goon and the two Scottish
policeman, looking at the string, with the Gap in the
middle. And again, at the ends and the
bits of and that is a nice little bit of business that I
can remember and apologies to whoever it was just come to me
now somebody But a former guest I think mentioned that that you
know, that sequence could actually rival the dreaded, what
time is it are called sequence that I find.
So tiresome, that's very resurfaced.
A memory. I was in secondary school around
the same time I discovered the Goon show and for some reason, I
think it was discussing some kind of literary element.
Something they might English you to play, what times Echoes like
the animated six segments, with the bizarre we go.
Goldberg machine that they did. This animated thing, I'm not
sure where it's from its from the heroes of Comedy documentary
from the late 90s. Really like the animation?
There's those like that's how I picture I can remove a whole.
Yes I like that and all the rest of that you could tell the rest
of class and going hell is this. Because obviously you know it
requires you come, it's funny. But also you kind of the
reaction of the audience you kind of need to know who the
characters are before. Why that overreacting to a
little boy saying what time is it goes because you know but
then I was sat in the front you know us outside the classroom
doing? Oh my God I know exactly what
this is anyway. Yeah no you were right it must
be incomprehensible not completely incomprehensible if
you know it's funny but like the openings a bit like why is the
audience applauding? Yes.
Yes indeed, what fresh hell is this?
So Okay, so the string robberies is it's one of my is one of my
favorites. I it's really good regularly,
it's an interesting one to talk about just in terms of the
background to it and and what was done to it actually.
So it's from its from series 8, we've not covered a lot of
series 8 episodes, like to think we've only covered The Man Who
Never Was. That's anyone at series. 8, is
generally considered to be one of the weaker possibly the
weakest series that exists if you know what I mean.
Yeah. And it mean there's some real
solid gold episodes in it, but it went through producers and it
chopped and change. Could you producers which I'll
come to in a minute. And every second week there were
recording an episode an old episode Audrey revised for the
Vintage goons series which I don't think this is such a
bizarre title, some in the 50s making something called vintage
when, yes, a couple of years just to get a couple of years
ago. By when, technically I would
say, things is vintage now, they were never intended to be
broadcast in the UK. Those episodes they were for
overseas stations, right? Overseas sales.
However, a bunch of them were actually The broadcast prior to
the beginning of season of series 9.
And there was a few that remained on broadcast up until I
think the latest one late 80s, early 90s, I think, oh wow, the
mustard and Cress shortage was the same night as the string of
robberies. Oh, was it?
Yeah. And that's interesting guy, like
that upset as well. My favorite, my favorite jacket
is you know, the virus. Hey I say, do you want to pass
such as row? No.
Well, stop banging on the cancer that if you want a sausage roll,
stop and get gas. Yes, I think that one was
actually broadcast in the UK for the first time in around.
I want to say 94 because I remember taping it, but I might
be wrong. I haven't got the episode
details to hand at the moment but anyway, but yeah, so sad
because of the fact that you No Spike wasn't really in a
particularly happy place during series 8, because tactics.
And who'd been there producer for most of Series 7, the last
sort of few of Series 6 series, seven, Pat Dixon Spike really,
really got on with and really respected essentially.
Okay? That was Ill.
Basically, he wasn't, he wasn't. It just wasn't really up to
producing at that time. Yeah.
But he'd always been packed with the padded always been a
champion of the Goon show and he'd helped him really been
instrumental in helping to get it, you know, off the ground in
the first place and and yeah, Grease, the wheels of the BBC.
Hmm. So for series 8, they had Roy
spear as producer for a while and then he he became ill Roy,
spear, quite severely. He was hospitalized Royce beer.
These days is probably chiefly remembered as being key to an
anecdote that Peter Sellers told on an episode of Parkinson.
Peter Sellers famously got his first job of the BBC by phone.
Call wasn't it? Yeah, by ringing Roy spear, who
was a radio producer? That was him.
Oh God, yes. So that was back in.
And 47 48. So so yes.
Oh Roy spear. You know, he produced a few of
the series 8 shows and then Charles Chilton.
But there was a lot of chopping and changing when Riley was
unable to do anymore. They bought the BBC appointed, a
producer called Tom Ronald. Yes, the guy, I heard his name
for me in the credits, just listening to it recently going,
that's a new one look here. To two or three at the most.
And he, he was quite hostile to the gun show.
Yeah, he didn't like the games at all.
Okay. And I think that kind of comes
across. Now, if you listen to this
episode of the string robberies, you know, I'd heard the
transcription Services edited version for the longest time,
that was the one that I had and and there's some to my ear.
This very clear edit points. Oh, very much.
Is there, is there only one kind of?
There are various audio versions of various episodes.
Is there only one for this one? Or is there a couple?
There's the, the version that was restored which was the
original broadcast version for a pitch, which I have listened to
now. Okay.
And there was the edited version or versions which went out
mostly to overseas radio stations in the late 50s into
the 60s. And Brian so on.
So I was that. So I'm used to these edited
versions and the yeah. As I listened to them through
BBC sounds and I don't know. What do they use?
I'm not sure. I haven't listened to the BBC
sounds version but I'm assuming it's probably the the edited
version but there's as I said there's some there's some very
clear and it points that you can hear very much.
So yeah. And I'm thinking I'm and I was
thinking, you know, I've got the broadcast, I've got the restored
version, that is on the Goon show compendium, which was
Restored by Ted Kendall and and I was thinking, okay?
So this is going to be great because there's so, there's
those clear edit points that I'm so used to, I'm sure that, you
know, the bits that were cut out, will be put back in and I'm
listening to this restored version and know most of the
edit points are still there. It's still sounds.
It still sounds these very clunky edits you know.
Yeah I could think of to particular ones.
Yeah. Well I'm very Me, what he says,
we need to find two pieces of string, you know, stand on your
head. That just before that there's a
big. Yeah, Gap.
And then there's a bit where they're talking with me and
million Henry and then suddenly minion had me run away.
That's right. They go off in the in the house,
don't they the house? Yes.
And it seems to be no reason for it more so than normal.
Will you get the feeling? So Tom Tom Ronald is obviously
put these shows together and in fact, Before I go into that,
let's just give a little bit of background string robberies
series AIDS. As I say episode 16 broadcast
13th of January, 1958 and Spike has spiked his soul scriptwriter
on this and he submitted the script a couple of days before
he was due to be recorded and on the script that he submitted
someone has written, really? This is too much despite think
we could possibly pass, this has not the time arrived for
straight. Talk, okay.
Now we're not sure. It's not clear who wrote that
but presumably, it was the producer, Tom Ronald.
I should be. Like, the, the tag life is going
by really, this is too much. Yes.
Yep. By all accounts, when they came
to record the show. There were lots of, Tom
Ronald's, insist on lots of alterations, or cuts to the
script. And if you actually, if you read
the original, The original script.
As Spike submitted it, there are still out.
Yeah, there's a few, there's quite a few, what I would call
borderline, slutty or innuendo Laden gags.
Okay, possibly possibly, not more than in any other goon show
of the period. There were a few lines that
possibly, you know, the blue pencil rightfully would have
gone through terms of getting rid of that from the script.
But It would appear that he just ripped out so much from the
script and made a lot of edits from what was actually recorded
and and Spike Milligan when he actually heard the show
broadcast. So it was recorded on the
Sunday, the order being the 12th and it was broadcast the
following evening and Spike heard at the fucking on that,
you know, on the Monday night he was he was outraged.
Because he and he wrote to the BBC wrote to Jim Davidson, not,
not that one. Jim Davidson who was a guy, who
was the assistant head of, right, entertainment?
Yeah, for radio and, and spite wrote this letter saying,
despite an agreement on what was to be in and what was to be out.
When the Goon show came out, nearly all of what was agreed to
leave in, had been cut out. Now, of course they had and he
and he specifically mentioned the gag about when William, I
tell seeking that there's a house outside to see him as
recorded Siegen, it says house, male or female to which William
replies. I couldn't tell what had the
blinds drawn mate. Okay, so they recorded that and
it would seem that spike. It argued with Tom Ronald, that
it should be that line should be left in.
It should be kept and presumably Tom agreed.
But then obviously cut it out and And yeah, so it was not a
happy episode and the actual transcription Services disks
that were sent out to radio stations all over the world.
Each show would have its own little synopsis.
Okay and I'll just read this one and I'll explain why.
So it says, the string of robberies only a detective of
the highest caliber could deduce that a piece of string holding
up Moriarty's. Sock is the missing link in the
notoriously. During robberies, Nettie sigurd.
The arch criminal investigator is assisted in his inquiries by
among others to new arrivals, from the Far East mr.
Banerjee and mr. Lau caca.
Now one of the reasons why they would have these synopses for
these, you know, for these discs that they sent out was that I
mentioned are two characters. Mr. Banerjee and mr.
Lau caca. Are you aware of who they are?
Oh yeah. Are they?
With a new for this episode, not quite they they appeared or very
versions of them appeared in the episode.
The Red Fort. All right slightly different
names. But this was the first episode
that they were actually identified as mr.
Banerjee and mr. Lau Kaka.
Okay. Yes, know, I know, I know, I
know. I know about them.
Yeah. And yeah, kind of have a yeah,
my kind of a love-hate kind of its poorly aged but You know,
it's like saying, oh no, you should cut them out, and baby
before ever consigned to his design, you know, you can listen
to her and just go, okay. Yeah.
It is that it's, you know, Spike was raised in India and it was
the 50s and exactly. Yeah, absolutely.
And and they do have quite an extensive sequence in the string
Library. Yeah, it's quite a good
sequence. Funny, a lot of their stuff.
Is funny. It's just the accents.
I think it's a fact that Indian the make it a problem, but if it
was another character doing it, the guy can still land like a
lot of the other end of guns, I've heard.
At least they, they like this whole dark room.
Sequence is really good. Yeah.
And there's that fluff, isn't there?
Yeah. It's quite loves Love's Love's.
Look like there's a couple of there's a couple of flips in
this episode which oh yeah. And the thing is okay.
We've seen with the Simpsons that arpu up until what five
years ago. I was portrayed by.
Okay, little Latino American Latino actor.
Yeah. But, you know, ostensibly though
he was not being, he was an Indian character, not being
voiced by an Indian. Yeah, they took Indian.
So you know, it's only recently really that?
Oh yeah, it's been, it's been quite a shock.
No one has been colored with if you know like backlash from
older Generations because it's been relatively recently that
we've kind of gone. All right?
Yeah Lily. I don't like lame old who, you
know, likes of people certain generation from going old for
God's sake. Yeah, that is really very, very
recent. I can understand both sides in a
way. Yes arguments, but I think it
just comes down to judgment just comes down to Common Sense.
And I read that synopsis that I'm But I read it before.
So it clearly highlights two characters, the two Indian
characters in it and that was partly done, so that if there
were any radio stations bear in mind, this was going all over
the world, any radio stations who felt that Their audience
might be a little bit hostile or a bit.
Sensitive about hearing those characters.
They wouldn't necessarily need to play that episode because
those characters for. Yeah, you know, and that was
very Progressive thinking, oh my God, like I'm constantly Just
like amazed because I was out like, I'll make yourself asleep.
You know, when you watch old movies, you kind of have to
take, you know, the badly age and just kind of just accept it.
But then you study research and you realize that, yeah, this is
the 50s and they had a, you know, the one black cast member
read those particular Carriage of rods and just get a white guy
to do ya like an offensive accent and also the conductor
was a closeted trans woman like, you know, you read and go all
out. Like yep.
Oh wow. The you know, like like he's
badly age, but not as badly as it could be like in terms of
certain things and other times it is aged amazing.
Yeah. That's first very, very, that's
a very good point. Yes.
And the string of these, by the way, one thing I meant to
mention was that the script was in published in the book of the
goons from 1974. I don't tend to necessarily when
we're talking about going to episode today, tend to go
through them seem See now don't need to do that here
necessarily, but I think for because of this because of the
nature of what happened with this show, in terms of the cuts
and whatnot, I just think it'd be interesting just to go
through it and see what? Yeah, that's okay.
We start with Peter Sellers doing an Australian accent which
I don't know why. Yeah, it's very bizarre.
Have those like there's no name for that character.
It's not like Sony. This turns up occasionally He
just decided to do it. Yeah, well I know that
Milligan's family or parents and his brother I think at the same
time that we went to Australia immigrated around this time, I'd
like to say I'll be 50 late fifties 57 something like that.
I'm not sure at that point is spiking actually being out there
to visit. I know he certainly went over
there after series 8, but we have the We have the we have the
sequence where the sellers as great.
Pipe thin says the string robbery started very simply with
a man saying, right? And then it in the script.
It's Moriarty who says my socks, keep coming down, but it's not
my reality. Is it?
No, it's actual. No reason.
You just turns up and then just goes away.
And the thing is right, it is meant to be my reality.
Yeah. It doesn't make any sense for
the seat. Now this is where we assume that
they must have recorded the next the next bit because there's
this there's this little dialogue between grip pipe and
Moriarty. Where grip pipe says gags.
You've got hoar frost on the ankle and and Moriarty's is it
dangerous Grapevine says if it kills you.
Yes blah blah blah. Okay I mean the script is out
there if you wanted to look it up But Tom Ronald has just cut
all that bit out. So we get the bit with Echols
saying my substitute for us. Maybe it was the wolf.
The word whore, maybe. Yeah.
Sounds like the BBC in the 50. So we get.
We get Echo saying my socks, keep coming down.
Next thing, we hear very clunky, jump, to grip pipe saying we
must try and obtain a certain amount of cheap string the
string of robberies started. Very simply with a man saying
why shock keep coming back home. Trying to obtain a certain
amount of cheap string. What do I do?
Till then I'm being so, yeah, I just don't really know why that
bit was cut for kickoff strange. Here's the thing as well,
there's no consistency because we then gets siguen introduced
and he's at Edinburgh station and there's a loud, fast jet of
steam and you get flour. Do screeching that the Your
lower constrains league of steam and people are wearing Kilts
which to me is more suggestive. Oh my God.
Yeah. Isn't that what it's not really
suggesting that it's like more so than what they just cut the
last gun pod where we've discussed an actual goon show,
episode was Wings over dagenham and that's featured quite
prominently. The trombonist George Chisholm
in a guest role. As right, I haven't listened to
either that episode all your episode on.
I don't know. Any, I was when I heard a green
side doing the outro to the sure they called it announcer, but
his butt and he said George is. Now that I've done a who that
is, I'm trying to think if I heard any voices random quite
hard at anything different. Like, you know, like I forgot
the name. Charlotte Charlotte Mitchell,
Charlotte Mitchell. Why ever she was on the show?
Since I've been random room is, anyway, I was trying to think
they already guessed. Was that?
I didn't recognize. I couldn't think of anyone.
I don't know who he was so George.
Chisholm was in the band was part of the orchestra and he
played, right? He's very, very celebrated
trombonist, okay? But he was also a good friend of
the cast good friend of the goons, and he would occasionally
be drafted in to do the odd line or whatever.
And he's very Scottish, okay? And he would play on the
Scottish nurse. Yeah, and it Wings Over Dagon
and he played a character called mr.
Chisholm. Who was an assistant to see him?
Okay. Now he turns up in this episode
as sergeant. I think he's Sergeant mixtures.
Mmm. And he's the, he's the one who
says you? See him a ventriloquist.
I throw my voice sometimes from Annie, don't you miss that one?
Yeah, I didn't. Honestly I could not tell if
that was spiked or maybe Peter but didn't really sound like you
deserve. The, I thought it's a bit too.
Not like, to be spanked. I didn't really think about it.
That makes a lot of sense that, that Sinister different person.
Yeah. Was, it will sellars as a seller
pays a Scotsman very shortly. And yeah, you have this
three-way conversation between mixtures.
Mm, see goon and the Scottish inspector that some plays, and
we and then we get to the sequence which touched on
before, where they talking about, Piece of string on the
table and the bits that are missing is quite convoluted.
I'll put the clip in here at Fisher string on the table.
Yes. What's that space in the middle
touch? The piece that's missing.
So that's what a piece of missing string.
Looks like a was it gone. Can't, you see, you boss got his
fool. It's all a practical joke.
Someone's cut that string in the center.
Pull the two pieces in opposite directions.
Giving the impression that the Peace of being removed from the
middle, Harry Gringo has, he's right?
Oh, for sure, if you put these two pieces together, the Gap
disappears. Hi.
But did you notice when you did that the two votes, Hayden's got
your card card chisholm's right now, I see what happened, what
killing the criminal cut a piece of each him and then cut across
the middle and pull them apart, making the string.
Look, the original length idea. Let's mix it up.
Baffling case. Hey yes, instead of one piece we
looking for two separate. Jeans.
It's a good job. I can count.
We must start investigation to 1 then we get to Henry mini and
there's a lot of looking at what was in the script and what we
actually was recorded or at least went out.
There's a lot of ad-libbing because I'm sure of course this
does. The line that Tom Ronald cut
where well there's the bit where Henry we first hear Henry, he's
calling for men is calling many. You hear many sort of off say
you calling me Henry and Henry says, yes, hurry up.
I'm next now. Did you understand what that
meant? I could mean various.
I don't know for sure I'm not sure.
It wasn't a attempt to do with The bathroom was it was like
yeah he's waiting to use the toilet.
Yeah, so I thought so but I was thinking or it could be I don't
know. Yeah, well she's a bit.
So he says, hurry up, I'm next. And then in the script Minnie
says I haven't finished yet. Okay?
And Tom old, Tom obviously, don't know, that's two.
That's far to suggest a fun happy for using the toilet
already. Cut that out, but and then they
have a whole sort of routine, talking about cigarettes and
Herbal tobacco, which kind of has its the way she was
Milligan, was sort of inhaling. This cigarette is it was almost
like, you know, he was rolling a reefer or something.
It means got a new frock, which turns out to be a sec dress and
she said she got off the call man.
And in the script Henry says you mean he's walking around naked
and Minnie says yes, that's why his prices are so high.
That got cat. I mean, the joke is funny.
Even without that, just makes it funny.
Yes. Yeah.
It says it from like a bit of a cheek come to like a more
expanded. Yeah.
And then we get the bit that I think is fantastic that a great
bit of thinking on his feet by Milligan.
When running, many are just add living, basically they just
wittering on to each other and then crank and then cram
remembers of sellers members the script The fire station to the
police station. Makes the same Henry because the
police stations on fire. I remember that hearing that
like for the first time in the car with my mom and going.
Oh, right and going, oh wow, they messed up.
Like, I don't know. I think I'm sure that it's just
I mean it's the endless novelty of hearing a mistake.
It's like you know, just so so fun that always here and that I
suppose also maybe modern radios more slick and they wouldn't,
you know, but like you just hearing Just hearing, obviously
Peter Sellers go. Oh, I guarantee that would have
been. That would have been cut.
If Milligan hadn't come back with such a strong.
Oh my God. Yeah.
Apply such a good such a good comeback and be audience,
doesn't just go away, I half expected because I did.
I've got no copy of the original script and I half expected when
I checked the script to see that that was actually scripted.
Yeah, expect to that cause you never know.
I used to like I still do. I mean I just wonder if topic
slightly big fan of the TV show? Bottom Rik, Mayall.
Oh yes, I did mention. And yeah, I used to love the
young ones as well. Spy will be rolling as Grodin
white Rik Mayall, but no but yeah, it's a shame.
I know, I know but now I just need to borrow used to watch The
Young Ones on repeat, I don't know why, but yeah, bottom as
well, so good. Oh yeah, and I back in the day
when it was videos, I've used to get the videos of the live stage
shows that they did. And now, yeah, it is.
And I used to think they were under still do this till I mean
there, you wouldn't watch them with you grin.
But you know, they are rollicking good fun and, you
know, full of the filthy and funny and all the rest of it and
just yeah, totally absurd but very often They'd be at least
one in each stage show. They'd be at least one sequence
where Rick would would flood a line.
So they would come out of character as rich in Eddie and
they would be Rick and Aid. Yeah, talking at each other and
the audit absolutely love it because our look you know you
know Rick's forgot the line and AIDS pulled him up on.
I wasn't that funny and then you'd find out hearing sort of
people that had seen them in different scenes.
A show in and yeah, town that they did that every single
performer. Oh yeah, I remember seeing one
particular, I remember this because it was my hometown that
system aide says, as a, however, it was himself or as Eddie with
her case, it's like I was born in Southampton, I thought
because I don't buy that one of those lives and so, yes, we have
that that yeah, great recovery by Milligan and then we go into
the house that I In the house, them driving the house to see
going. And that's a such as good,
mental image. Yeah, absolutely.
Totally unnecessary. But, you know, yeah, but it's
great. They also introduced for the
first time. The kind of, I don't know what
you'd call. It's not really a catch phrase
but repeated sequence, where minion Henry would go.
Morning morning. So I know I know.
That's right. In the 2010s, you know, yourself
occasionally I would use the odd gag.
Again, show at school at barrel and I'm you know, I was at
school in the 80s and 90s so it was a bit further back, but I
would you there were certain lines.
I can't give you a specific example, but I would use certain
lines. My friends wouldn't know where
the hell, they know. It's not as you're using that.
They would think I was a comic genius, you know, and I wouldn't
attribute it to Milligan but yeah, no.
It wasn't in the script for this this whole morning morning
sequence. It wasn't, it was in the script,
so they just improvise that Was that was that again?
Was that the first? Yeah, I'm it being used.
I'm sorry, I didn't realize, yeah, so I don't know why they
must have just decided, you know, maybe during Del Dre's
number, let's learn. Let's just, let's just do some
improv. Well, maybe I'm wondering
whether and this is just pure speculation.
I'm wondering up because you get because obviously, you know,
they would rehearse that have a read through in the afternoon
and then they'd have rehearsal. And then I think that have
another rehearsal with the with the, with the band.
Thank ya. I'm just wondering.
Gimli. Tom would be Tom, the producer
would be there you know frowning with his arms crossed, deeply
deeply disapproving confident with the sort of thing.
Yeah. That but I'm wondering whether
you know, if he did, he'd already said spite, right.
We're going to cut this bit out and cut that bit out and Spike
may be compensated for those cuts by including these bits,
these extended sort of morning, maybe.
I don't know, could be, I mean, it's made of endless
catchphrase. It's just something to say.
Yeah, we have these this this bit with the, the quite clever
little sound gag about Henry with his fingers in his ears.
Oh my love that. For some reason, I do not can't
think of anywhere else where they kind of bets being because
it's something that you just do something special when you're a
kid. You can't just test, you know
you doing stuff like yeah. Just moving things out here is.
You can just hearing this. Like yeah, yeah, yeah.
But I could, you could picture I The first time I've ever heard
it, I could picture, I could in my address, I had this mental
image of Henry crime or my the image, I have of what Henry
crying looks like in my mind, which I don't think I could
actually describing words, I always find that like I have an
image but I can't fully articulate.
What it is. It's kind of like a vague
approximation of a purse like a like a gas or something.
Yes, for than actual We'd like, yeah, the only one I can picture
is that is that particularly Illustrated version of Moriarty
that's like, has the big hat and going Shadow.
Yeah, that's the only what time, I'm like a part of metals.
The illustration matches how I see them.
But anyway, yeah, I grip pipes in.
I always assumed kind of looked more or less, like he looked in
some of the script drawings that they would do to ya, even the
Telly Goons, Yeah, it's a kind of cheekbone kind of.
Yeah I always imagined him in a three-piece suit and always
relative is lightly tap it and covered in juice.
But yeah, talk tall and almost like Christopher Lee kind of.
Yeah segen. I can see game looks more or
less, you know. I just imagine them to look like
a variation of Harry seek Him always.
So we had that sequence with the, with the the fingers, In
the years and then there's this. There's like you said earlier,
there's a very clear cut has been done. it will be so dear
listeners. This disjointed conversation is
being caused by mr. Krum, moving, his fingers in and
out of his ears, thereby causing an intermittent break inside.
But there is a bit that was in the script that I presume.
They must have recorded and then that's got chopped out.
Where they talk about. They talk about a shape in
henrique runs, trousers. Oh, dear, of course and, and
there's a reference to John Foster.
Dulles, who was a an American Senator?
I think? Right?
No idea. Yeah.
He was, he was, I think his brother was instrumental in
creating the CIA or maybe he was, I'm not quite sure of it.
But anyway, that was cut out and Then we get to rip up Moriarty
at the Cliffs of Dover and again, cut out from the
recording. Was Moriarty saying grip pipe.
They've spotted us grip. Pipe says it'll brush off okay
because obviously there's see girls.
So oh, right? Yeah, so so Tom cut that out as
well. Yeah, so it's all these fun Tom,
there's no finesse to the Cuts is there.
No, it's increase. Really rough.
Yes, and so we've got we got blood, not.
Now, I'm not quite sure again. I think it's blood.
No, it's just here really, because he's not been in the
episode so far and they just feel they need to include him.
I don't know where he is like losing to be in a house.
No, he's just that. He's just there.
It's just, he's just appeared. Yeah, sure.
I'm not sure what his role over. He's he the Coast Guard being
mention. I don't know.
I really do. He's in the boat.
Later. He just turns up for just a fun
fun. See ya.
And again, this is totally unrelated to what we've heard
before, or what is Yet to Come. Really, but we have this, what
must have taken ages for them to record and rerecord, and sort of
overlay and overdub. We've got Echols singing, a Good
King Wenceslas, and it is weird, isn't it?
It's funny, but it's weird. It's funny.
Also, I Like It Hot some of the backing track.
He's actually singing it, rather.
Well, yes, - I don't know, he just had like a little little
little note at the end. Nice are also as I first ever.
Listen, what an entrance for for both blood, milk and Echols.
You never seen you two ever heard.
You depart from like one line. Beginning it was it wasn't meant
to be Echoes, was it? No, at the beginning.
Yeah, there's the distended. The Amusing, interplay with
blood, Mechanicals. Christmas is good on ya.
If we go in a penny for the guy probably gets lost by bike
American and those International listeners because, yeah, why
some obscure thing see we had his a thing, right?
It's a good opportunity for me to talk about myself, which I
never like to do. Okay.
But I grew up in New Zealand as you said.
Sure, you know, and we celebrated Guy Fawkes there.
Oh yeah, we said When I was a kid, I don't know if they still
do, but, but all that all involved, it was really just an
excuse to little fireworks. That was.
Oh yeah. Always.
We literally what we use it for setting things on fire.
Yeah, and I didn't you of the whole sort of penny for the guy
and this sort of image of urchins pushing shopping trolley
with a stuffed dummy. Yeah, I haven't seen one in
years. I've already, I only ever knew
that from Reading British comics when I was a A kid like wasn't
chips. I hope I have like it doesn't
die out as a thing because it is rather nice little tradition.
He was building a scarecrow and like asking for a couple of
tents to buy like some stuff from you know, child she opens
up into yes to make but I don't know.
You know that kind of thing. Post pandemic killed I really
carry money. Yeah and then we get so you know
we've got the pumpkin and Echo sequence and then we have
railing tain's song and then and then we get Seager in and And
grip, piping Moriarty, and all the rest of it.
And then bluebottle turns out. Now I like the fact that so blue
bottle is stowaway and he's been hiding in Murray at his
trousers. I love the way he says, I'll
come out and he lowers his, he reads his stage directions, as
he always does. He says he lowers flapping
around his trousers steps out. Waits for audience Applause, and
he gets Applause and then he says not enough.
I say I'm glad he did. Don't get, I mean it was a bit
of a gamble because he could have, you know, he could have
got a huge Standing Ovation by the studio audience which case
that would have that would have put paid to the gag that he's
bought his own record of clapping.
Okay. Here's a good opportunity to ask
because Blue Bottle is often the character of the people site is
their favorite. So who is your favorite
character? I have a, I love them all in
varying ways but I have to say blood knock, which is weird.
I know, I don't think, I'm not sure if you've had anyone say
blood not yet. Yeah, a couple we have.
That's nice. I don't know.
I think even when I first listened to it, for ever knew
who the characters really? Well, I just, I liked, I liked
his voice. I like I like the voice and the
funny sounds and I don't know his weird-ass shit.
I don't think that blood milk is very like he's almost like a
Groucho Marx kind of thing, he'd like someone who is randomly
he's like wondered in Katana hat.
And people have just assumed he's in charge occasionally 10.
Well, depending on what the role is, he just kind of sat.
He's like he's just like, you know, like a guy, he just
wandered into this into a into a major General's office.
Put on put on the hat and souls walked in and gone.
You're in judgment. Am I okay.
Very tween being either a womanizer all obsessed with
money. Depends on what the episode
calls for, but at least it is true.
Love is money but Chancellor, and he's a scoundrel.
Oh yeah, we love them. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, but I
love like, you know, I recover my reality, I love their whole,
I love the whole thing. I love occasion, Yuan group,
pipeline loses. His cool like, I'm in a, the
fireball, Milton Street, we're like at the very end he actively
panics. It's just like it's rare to hear
him. Be flexible and I've just I
love. I just yeah, yeah, you hear
that. At the end of the great bank
robbery when they yes, I'm just like The fire.
Yes it's such a guy just I don't know.
I just love hearing characters occasion just break their role
alike but I love ice. I love them all.
Like there's only I can't think of many characters.
I don't actively enjoy but I will always kind of smile when I
hear the blood milk theme, right.
I don't know why. I just like I just like, you
know, I just like it just got like oh we're not we then want
to get to the bed with so we get mr.
Banerjee. Slow cooker.
Now in the the episode that I'm used to hearing the the show
that would have been sent out, you know, the transcription
Services version. Yeah, more or less everything
involving those two characters was chopped out, but in the
broadcast version there was quite an extended sequence with
the two of them. Just talking to each other.
Yes, I'm not sure. I can't remember exactly how
long. I'm talking as.
But I know that there was a thing to earlier to prepare and
I think Spike messes up a line bear
it, but I kill the joke by saying no light in it but we
mysterious orientals. What?
What is even funnier? I did watch an interview with
some with, with Harry and Spike and I think Harry said that some
point. They he really enjoyed them,
which is nice that I get some love, but okay, I think spike in
that. 72 spike said, blood markers favorite?
Oh yes, I think so. Well Echoes as well.
I think he's, oh yeah, of course.
But nothing actually read somewhere that that they love
Mark was partially based on a very friendly General that they
had in the concert party. Yes.
I quite supportive of them sellers sellers used to
impersonate. Oh yeah the colonels and
Generals and majors and whatnot. So yeah I think he was a
composite character based on characters that real life
characters are dead encountered. Yeah.
Now, we're getting to towards the end of the show and it's, I
mean, there's, there's no, there's no plot really is there.
Now, the string has been forgotten about more or less
along, but there's the there's, there's possibly the most for
this show. Possibly the most infamous
alteration to the script, which is when they're talking about a,
the house number look, the number of the house is 66 fairy
cake Lane. I'm just old houses without a
dress. Wait, 66 fairy cake lady, that's
where he can live and seekin in the script, the original script
is written seeking says, look, the number of the house is 66
menja Lane. Okay, I, right.
And by all accounts, Tom Ronald insisted that, that be changed.
T' and I don't know who decided, but they just, they did change
it to 66 berry cake Lane. I know and you could just hear
the disbelief in like, Peter Sellers voice.
When he says it has blood, lots of 66k claim that's been
changed. I just wonder and that maybe
this is overthinking it, but no, there's no maybe about it.
I'm overthinking about who decided on fairy cake because it
is either comically serious like that.
Who have educate put it in or Spike when You won't the
sanitizers you want. Then I'm going to put the most
sweet. Flowery inoffensive name
possible and it's going to be ridiculous.
It could be either one, you're probably right.
It's just, it's just the reaction.
It's almost like, it's the first time they've read.
Oh, yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if they, if they read
them in July in the rehearsal and then they cook, you just
scribbled over in between and then recording, I know,
obviously Mendoza's one-way room, it was like equal also
being Amina because if that's quite noisy, thick clay, could
be the real. See the route of own is the
funny one. So I'm assuming is the former
rather than the last the real. It's just it's an interesting
model because it's obviously been kept.
That little bit of slight departure from the script by
them sort of reacting to it. It's a nice little sort of
artifact of. Oh yeah.
I'll I just love any any time where they mess up as my
subscript or just laugh or just corpse during a thing or like
lose. Lose the page of the script and
one of them says in character this page five.
Yeah. I'm just love all of that.
Definitely. Absolutely.
And then, of course we can we get to the payoff for the end.
And there isn't really a proper end, as the never tends to be
many shows and series 8 ended with variations of the line.
It's all in the mind. All of the lines, you know?
Yeah, which is, which is essentially what Quran says and
we have the the end. So it's a very intimate area
screaming who wrote this script? Yeah.
Yes. Very Enjoyable show despite
everything despite the obstacles.
Yeah, it just makes it more rant.
Like the, the plot gets so chopped and James that it's just
kind of assess various scenes that do kind of run together,
but and just makes it more enjoyable in ways it's just the
cape glorious chaos. Yeah.
You won't be surprised to know that Tom Ronald was swiftly
replaced. Children returned to the fold
to. Yeah, Buhdeuce most of the
remaining episodes. I wonder whether it was a
whether it was Spike and the others putting their foot down,
or whether he just went, I'm not doing this anymore.
Well I can't imagine I can't imagine that.
It would have been a particularly harmonious Sunday
recording session. No, no Milligan and sellers,
particularly can imagine them both being pretty hostile tone.
Yeah, Milligan particularly for sure and if Tom Wasn't the fan
of the show, anyway, then it's kind of been Pleasant.
Why are you here? So money.
Thank you very much. Obviously, we've kind of talked
about the string of robberies. Yeah, it around about way, and
we've looked at all the cuts and whatnot.
Is there anything else about the show of going to show itself
that you want to bring up what looks like?
It's just, it's interesting, being a young, a younger going
fast because I know, Especially when Jane Milligan was, okay?
Mon this podcast and talking about how spikes on been fading
out of Iraq. The consciousness of side,
obviously. Yeah.
You see things just out in the general Zeitgeist, like people
saying the dreaded luggy, or even like calling covid.
The dreaded like, you know, become or just various illnesses
and like how I know there's arguing about whether or not it
existed as a phrase before the goons or whether they're like,
you know, it's like as an army bit of saying.
But the fact is that, I think I have spoken to some people, some
online friends who live in America and Canada, and they
bury their their, their parents say, they got the luggage and
they've never heard of the couch.
I've heard of some people saying, I've heard my parents
say something, you know, it's like it's rather impressive but
also the being a younger thing. I always want to talk to People
about my own age kind of, you know, and it's surprising.
Actually, I have mentioned a couple people, the goons and
they have heard of them or like, you know, the go know.
My granddad used to listen to that, I know who they are, and
it's just funny that like, I don't think it's dying.
Obviously, you know, amongst like the popular use, you know,
like you know the ones. Yeah, except I get off my Lord
but like, but you know, I don't feel that they know but, you
know, there's there are people who still know about it.
And I've ended up introducing some people.
Like, I know some people, some friends online, who live in
America and and I mentioned the games to them and there are
already fans of old Hollywood. Like we, you know, that we just
discuss like more Hardy and, like a Bob Hope.
And, you know, all that kind of, you know, do all those kind of
people and they tell me they'll hate me for saying Bob Hope, but
anyway. Um, but yeah, other than
American, more American Centric, I mentioned the goons and a
couple of them, listen to it and now they're like drawing fan art
of it. They love - And Moriarty
especially like you'd expect them to love blue bottle well
and but the Echols Neddy and Moriarty are their favorites.
They love them and they said they draw found out.
They just kind of we just talked about it and like make up silly
ideas and like it just it's just so I was trying kind of keep the
Legacy going is as smooth as I can.
That's amazing. That's great.
You keeping your fighting the good fight.
Yeah. And I'm also looking forward to
seeing Spike the play. Since I wasn't able to see at
the water mill. And now I'm so I'm gonna go and
see that when it comes to Salisbury because it's the
closest are coming. I'm going to be probably the
youngest person in the audience and the person who's most
enthusiastic. But, yes, and look, I'm really
glad that you are as I say, you know, as you say spreading the
word and introducing it to new generations and your own in your
own way, your own small way, just like this podcast.
And I do think is, is hopefully maybe going to pick up a few new
fans of Yeah, I mean that's my biscuit.
Our reason why I started listening to him again because I
found your book. Oscars is really good.
It's not like you know you know there are some what cut out
there where it's all just u5. No.
You tweeted about it. There's some people who have no
idea what they're talking about just kind of just blathering on
about, you know, having what something for the first time and
going. Oh, I hate, I listen to a lot of
podcasts as I'm sure you do. If I hear one, where it's
generally tends to be a group of men, not, this doesn't have to
be younger men. It can be No, how many men with
beards having AIDS and if they talk about a movie and it will
be an hour of them basically just going and what's you know?
And he said this and and I didn't understand why he said
that and why did he do that? And what's all that about?
What the hell's that mean it looks old?
Yeah and it was so slow and it's off Molly.
It's been really enjoyable really good to have You on the
show, someone who is liked by your own admission.
You know, you certainly didn't grow up listening to the goons
first time around and you haven't heard them all but you
came across the by accident and you are helping to keep them
alive. Yeah.
I just think that that is wonderful, Your Enthusiasm
shines through, and it's been a real pleasure having you on
today. It's been, it's been lovely to
be on the first ever broadcast their focus episodes.
To be, it'll be fun. This is your first podcast that
you've done probably by this time.
Next year, you'll have your own podcast and tell me how it
works. Thanks again to money.
Thank you for listening. Please rate and review on iTunes
or to file the usual places. Please follow our Facebook.
We have a group of their gunpowder podcast about the
goons getting more and more people joining the Facebook
group which is really gratifying as well.
So please move the more the merrier.
I'll be back next week with another episode until then take
it easy. Enjoy the heat.
See you later.