The Hello welcome to the extra credits of the pit season 2 I'm
Trey and. I'm Kelsey.
We've never actually covered the pit, but it feels like we have
in spirit. Like I feel like we've always
feel like we're always talking about the pit, but though we've
never talked about it on the podcast.
Did we not cover it when? No, I think the last TV shows
we've covered in between our beloved Succession and now have
have been The Bear and. Strangers.
Oh, I was thinking of the bear. Yeah.
OK, Yeah. This is a bear adjacent show I
would say though the pit is better I think.
I think so too. Yeah, I think.
I love the bear. Yeah, the pit like captures what
everyone loved and kind of the wonder of the last episode of, I
think season 1 of the Bear. I forget which which season it
was, but yeah, I think like that energy is running through the
pit and and, you know, the the pit also like has a cheat code
of being in a a place that is like so high stress and you get
to like have seamless character development while having
something that is like consistently like I I guess just
like intriguing, heartbreaking, shocking, hard to watch.
Yeah. It's comfort TV, but it's also
incredibly stressful and something that I want to come
home to every week, but also something that is putting me,
like making me sit in discomfort for an hour.
And I experienced that like heavy last night in the theater
when we should say we saw the Season 2 finale early last
night. We were one of the 10 theaters
in the country that was able to see it early, which was really
exciting. I didn't know how that was going
to be going into it. But I will say that I think we
should be watching every season finale of all of our favorite
shows in a theater, and I'd be happy to pay for it.
We have been talking about this since Succession days.
We were like, you know, especially covering Succession
since it was such a huge show. There was such a big audience
and it was so cinematic that we were like, why is this not in
theaters? Like why, why, especially for
like the penultimate and and season finale or like even the
openers, right? Like it would be so fun to to
see them in in theaters. Maybe one day like they'll you
know how they rerun anniversary movies.
Maybe they'll do that with something like succession.
I would, I would definitely be there, but I was so yeah,
interested I guess because we don't know that there's this
huge following of the pit or like, yes, we do.
Obviously it's a popular show, but we don't know like
everyone's relationship to it as much as like Succession where
people are so like involved online.
That's a good point though, because we do get a lot of
numbers from streaming servers who are like streaming services
who are like, yeah, 10 million people just watch Stranger
Things and you're like, did 10 million people really watch
Stranger Things or did the same 12 year old watch the same
episode 4 times? And it was interesting last
night to be in theatre that was packed.
I don't think there was an empty seat.
And then everybody collectively laughing, crying, having an
incredible time, stuck in a room for an hour together.
People were vocal like, people were like.
Yeah, it was actively watching it on the couch.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that's a really good pitch
for programmers to bring their shows to theaters.
So stranger. Things in theaters.
They did it as well. We.
Just didn't go. Yeah, yeah.
We didn't really miss out there. That was a disappointing and to
a great show. But yeah, I mean, so you're
ultimately pro watching the pit in the theater.
I guess we had different experiences.
Like I yes, I liked it, I want that to happen, but I also was
unable to watch it in the same way.
Like I think when I watch TVI pause a lot and like I talk to
you and so I I don't know what it was.
I think also a part of the experience was there was like a
a person who was a pro promoter there or like worked for the
studio. Yeah, what was that?
Video taping the crowd. And I was just like, like, I
don't. Interesting.
Like I don't want your flash on me.
I thought he was looking for people to be on their phones
using some kind of like device. So he was like looking at these
binoculars. I thought he was and they had a
red player in them. Interesting, that makes sense.
Well, anyway, so. They were really weird about
phones in this. Screening, which is fair.
Yeah, We put it in like a bag and everything.
We've seen early screenings of movies.
We've never been like, we've seen hundreds of them, but we've
never seen. Do you just take your phone in?
Yeah, for critics screenings, when we go in, it's like mostly,
you know, it's usually like the the same person who like works
for a particular studio who will be at like the, you know, the
certain screening and they'll have you put your phones away,
but they'll just like watch you, you know, it's not like in a bag
or anything. And I think because it's like a
critics screening, like we all know that.
How to act? Yeah, like we're not going to
take our phones out. Like there are some people who
like have pen and paper and and you know what I mean?
Like, but I think that in a maybe a screening with like a
general public audience like that's.
A good point, Yeah. Yeah.
OK, so if you're listening to this, you probably just finished
the season 2 finale. I apologize if it seems like
we're not excited. Like we just came out of
watching that because we just saw it in a theater last night.
So we've had a little bit of time to think about it.
Season 2 finale. What do you think?
Immediate reaction. Well, I did a lot, Yeah.
I thought it was like one of the most emotionally satisfying
episodes of the show. Yeah, I mean, well, you really
like singing in theaters too, right?
But like, I, yeah, I think coming out of it, I was like, I
wasn't able to take it in as much as when I like watch it on
the couch. But I I think that's like kind
of how it's supposed to be, you know what I mean?
Like it's shot in this way where you are consistently like with
the camera before the the like episode.
We saw the kind of like HBO behind the scenes, which I'm
sure is like available on HBO. But they showed us like the set
that they built right to like seamlessly take us throughout
the the like hospital, like ER. And I think I felt like fully
immersed more so than I have been before.
And I, but I, I don't know, I don't cry as much in public.
Like I was emotional, but like, you were definitely crying more
than me. Not to say that I wasn't
emotionally impacted by by the final episode, though I thought
it was. That was really good.
And they left us in a really good in between space of like
feeling resolution for things that were happening that I
didn't know if they'd be able to tie up in the finale.
And then kind of like, you know, also wanting more and being
curious going into Season 3. What about you?
Were you surprised? Yeah.
I mean, I was really immersed. Things that, like usually make
me a little bit sad on the couch and maybe I'll tear up and made
me cry in the theatre because just the sound design is so
different. And just the effect of the sound
in a theatre is just an extraordinarily different than
being at home, even though we have a sound system at home.
It's just, it's not comparable to a theatre and I think we just
forget about this when it comes to shows like The Pit or
Succession or even The Bear. These are very, very cinematic
shows. Like that's the reason that
people like them. It's not just the story, it's
not just the characters, the craftspeople and the film makers
and the crew, the cast and crew, everybody involved in the making
of these shows. The reason why they win so many
Emmys, the reason why they last for so many years and why people
want them to continue being made is because they're so well made.
And I think sometimes we credit television, which is more of a
2000s opinion to me, that television has a really good
plot. It has a really good plot
mechanics. People come back for twists and
turns and character arcs over seasons.
But now I think audiences have gotten so attuned to watching
good things from, you know, the couch of of their home, from the
seat of their home, that I think their expectation for TV shows
is that is that they have to feel like movies.
Stranger Things has been like this for a lot of people for a
long time, too. And so I think this was a
reminder that T VS gotten so good, like prestige TV, that it
should be watched in theaters, which is crazy.
I'm not sure what that says about movies right now.
It's probably not good, but it was, it was a great experience
for me to watch this in a theatre.
And I think I was a little bit surprised about how, because
I've never watched the Pit with anybody besides you.
To your point, I was a little bit surprised about how much
people laugh at The Pit. Yeah, it was.
It was like being, I feel like I was watching Jimmy Fallon live
because every time a joke was said that the, the amount of
laughter, there was a laugh track.
Like truly, like half the theater would laugh at things
that I would just smile at, if that makes sense.
I think I only laughed at like one or two jokes, like out loud,
but people were laughing consistently, like every 5 to 10
minutes. And that really surprised me.
Yeah, it almost threw me off because I I treat this show
pretty seriously, but not in a pretentious way.
I like I just feel like this is like a my TV family and they're
going through a really hard time and maybe because we're teachers
and that is like AI feel like an adjacent profession.
Obviously not a profession quite like nurses and an ER, doctors
and an ER, but people probably get.
What we need under resourced, yeah.
Like under resourced public consistently on your positions.
There's no shortage of things to do like.
Dealing with emotionally traumatic things on a day-to-day
basis, but there's a spectrum of of trauma, obviously.
But like, so maybe that's why I treated so seriously.
But you know, not to say I don't think it is funny, but the humor
in the pit to me is usually the levity post cry.
But I was just hearing a lot of laughter and not as much tears,
but people were obviously very sad moments of this episode.
So I thought it was a great finale.
And I think it also just like understood what, you know, we
love so much about the show, which is it's characters.
Season 1 was such a focus on throwing you into this immersive
environment. It was such a focus on the
patients in Season 2, took a little bit off the gas with both
of those ideas and stuck more on the character arcs, more on how
they knew audiences were sort of obsessed and with this like
fandom parasocial relationship that we have to the characters
of the Pit. I think for good and bad, which
we can get to in terms of criticisms of the season.
But ultimately, I thought this was a really good season.
I think it knew what it was because the way the season ended
was kind of like pandering to that fandom, like Santos and Mel
doing karaoke and the credits. I love that.
That was awesome. But I think it's also very
telling of where the show is going, which it needs that
fandom to exist and to continue getting funded, which I think is
really interesting. Yeah, I mean, I don't want to
like jump into comparing Season 1 and Season 2.
We can right now. Should we?
I think we should. I think yeah, we should.
And then we can kind of go into Season 2 and and last episode.
Because we did the crazy thing, which is we rewatched season 1
while starting season 2 and then doing season 2 episodes when
they came out each week and then basically planning our schedule
around when like season 2 episodes have dropped.
Yeah, and I mean, I think the trick of the pit too is like,
you know, the having a whole season be a single day and us
like seeing an hour feels very like fleeting.
And so we watched season 1 like very close together, but it
didn't feel like I was rewatching something completely.
It felt like I was like kind of able to experience it, even
though I knew it was coming ultimately with like the big,
you know, last episode or last couple episodes.
So anyway, but yeah, I mean, I loved season 1 and I, and I
think that it's like hard to live up to honestly, right.
I, I felt like it was almost a situation where the writers and
like the, the showrunners were like, let's give it all we've
got. Like there are other shows out
there. There are so many different
like, I guess like ways that people are spending their time
and like things that are grabbing their attention.
Like let's make a show that people will really talk about.
And they, they used a lot of like big plot devices in season
1 that you can't really live up to in season 2.
So it's not like totally fair to compare them.
They really shot their shot with.
Season 1, yeah, you can't just do like a mass shooting like
again, for example, I mean, I loved season 1.
Like I think they did such a good job with introducing us to
the the characters, but also like their relationships with
each other. Like I love the Whitaker, Santos
and Giovanni new intern like back and forth relationships.
And then I I just thought it was like very it didn't jump too
quickly into the the characterization.
Like we really got to know everyone and this this season,
to your point, it felt a little bit like I was aware of like how
they were reacting to audiences relationships, to the characters
that they had maybe been seeing online.
Yeah, exactly. The writers are online, yes.
The writers are online. That's the best way to put it.
And so, yeah, I I think there were moments where I was like,
well, that didn't feel like natural for the show or what the
character like might actually do.
And and so that took me out of it a little bit.
And I was kind of like worried in the first couple episodes
because we were like, nothing's happening.
That feels I guess like because we were watching it also like
not we binge to the first season.
So like I think it is a show to be kind of binged, but when we
were watching it like week after week I was getting a little
worried there but it picked up like mid season.
I would say it picked up like second.
I'm like, I don't know, I guess you're right. second-half of
season 2. I would say the first 7 or 8
episodes of season 2 were like genuinely were worrying.
Like I was like, where's this show going?
Like I can't actually tell. It feels like it's lost.
It's it's, I don't know, the energy that made Season 1 so
special. And I guess I'll just say my
perspective on it. Like Season 1 was special not
only because of what Kelsey said about 15 straight hours of
pressure and exhaustion and loss and compromise with different
personalities stuck in this, you know, ER room led by people who
were also fragile and broken by this institution.
It didn't really care about a resolving plot.
It cared about its patients. And so all those things are
true. But the patient centered focus
of Season 1 was so interesting. I liked how the cases were the
emotional core. It reminded me the best seasons
of House, the TV show that takes place in a hospital.
It remind me the best show, the best episodes of Friday Night
Lights where it's like a a player dilemma focus or you
know, Gilmore Girls when I've watched that with you, it's.
So funny that like you didn't say Grey's Anatomy because you
haven't seen Grey's Anatomy. I haven't.
That's like the the I think the biggest like medical show in
people's lives. But but some of the best
episodes of that I think is, is to your point like focused on
the the patients as characters. Exactly.
And the show teaches us like how the ER is and how it functions
by making the patients the anchor of every episode.
And I felt so connected to not only the characters that I was
being introduced to as sort of a surrogate for myself.
Like watching Whitaker be sort of surprised by all these
patients or accidentally, you know, not misreading or
misdiagnosing that man who passes in Season 1 and how that
affects him and you as an audience member because he's
sort of a surrogate. And that performer, so great
with those like innocent puppy eyes, this farm boy eyes that he
has. I thought Season 1 was so smart
about doing that, like letting us meet people that felt real,
learning the stakes in the hospital through them.
Season 2 ultimately flips that, where it's far more about how
you said, like the characters were.
It does feel like the writers are entirely online where they
want us to be connected to the staff as the anchor of the show,
which I think is like less compelling personally, because
then it becomes about like interpersonal dynamics in a
workplace That I thought was like a fun subtext of Season 1,
or I guess that's not the right word, but maybe a subplot of
Season 1, which is the dynamic between the employees, sort of
like a workplace dramedy. But I came first of all for the
tension of what it would be like to work in a broken healthcare
system in America through the lens of this Pittsburgh ER and
how patients were treated or not treated or treated unfairly in
certain cases. And so, yeah, I, I guess I was a
little disappointed at the beginning of Season 2.
That was so much about the characters.
Yeah, I agree. And I think like, for example,
in season 1, we had like the kid who I don't think he overdosed,
but he like took a drug that was laced.
I I think and his like his parents were, you know, in.
He was like Adderall or something.
Yeah, his parents were in. No, I think it was something
else. But anyway, but his parents were
in the episodes for like a couple episodes.
And then we also got introduced to the the woman that he was
like studying with in college. And then like the the friends
came in. And so there was this like
tension there. And then also there was a lot of
like learning in terms of the, the interns with like Doctor
McKay, for example, of the there, there was one patient
where you're like wondering, is there like a trafficking
situation going on and, and seeing like Mckay's like
reaction to that. And then also the woman who came
in with like a burn ray and she was unhoused.
And then basically like McKay teaching Javadi like to
basically like see a situation out and not just like jump to
conclusions. Like they were like different
things. You're right that were centered
around patients that felt seamless and natural because
they were dilemmas presented in these like medical cases.
Yeah, character development through the patients.
Exactly. Yeah.
So it felt less like forced than like what you're saying in
Season 2 of like, what, what is this, you know, doctor going to
do next? It was more in Season 1.
It felt like we saw a lot of like learning similar to what
they were doing with Ogilvy's character.
I think I'm saying his name right in Season 2.
And shout out Joy. We'll talk about Joy in a
second, Lovejoy. Joy haters hate to see me coming
because I am such a fucking. I'm sure they exist.
I know that there were Joy critics when she first was
introduced on the scene. Her sort of like off putting
self interested attitude of like work is work.
As soon as I saw her I was like I want to work with that person.
I think honestly, the way my relationship to Joy and who I
think Joy is as a character is how a lot of people see Santos
until Season 2, where it was a little bit revealed that Santos
has some other things, some other demons that are, you know,
affecting her in a negative way. But Joy really is like, you
know, I'm here to help, I'm here to do my job.
But this is I I have boundaries which I appreciate.
Yeah, yeah, which is certainly a thing to do on your first day,
but yeah, no. OK.
So like, yeah, I think that's the biggest difference right,
between season 1 and 2 and I and I also think there was like a
lot of things in season 1 that were, I think they were like
characters dealing with their own medical things.
What it what is the name of the Doctor Who Robbie and her were
like? Oh yeah.
Together and Heather Collins. Yes, Doctor Collins and I loved
her and her like, you know, going through figuring out that
she's like pregnant to trying to navigate that in the workplace.
And then I think that she has a miscarriage.
Right, Right. So I, but I, I just, yeah.
Anyway, I thought season 1 was like like almost perfect season.
Right. And I do have criticisms of both
seasons, to be clear, that we'll talk about a little bit later.
But yeah. But so then that's why it's hard
to compare Season 2, but we can talk about Season 2.
And then I think we should also, like you said, like we should
talk about who we would like to work with in terms of the
characters and who our favorite characters are 'cause I think
those are two different conversations.
I do have a top ten favorite characters for me already made
for a TikTok I'm doing later this week.
So maybe we can end the pod with those those thoughts.
But yeah, I guess season 2 also just kind of like there was a
lot of obsession over like picking sides, like doctors
picking what side they're on between like all Ashimi and like
no Wiley's character Robbie. Like different characters
switching different sides or pivoting or obsessing over like
dynamics between one another or. Is that also like yelling in the
middle of the workplace, which is super unrealistic and I
wonder if that. Is like, is what's happening to
the pit or television in like shows like the Stranger Things
that like dynamic with like what fans are expecting out of that
show? Is what's happening is that
fandom is influencing TV or is TV so plugged in as to continue
making television and and profit needs to be plugged in and
manufacture A fandom to exist? If that makes sense.
So like, is The Pit Season 2 doing what it's doing and other
television shows like it because they're responding to a
parasocial obsession that audiences have with television
and characters because of the way the digital era has ruined
our minds when it comes to like relationships to reality versus
like fiction, which is the Internet.
So is that like an organic thing that's emerged out of the
digital era or is it TV shows manufacturing that fandom, if
that makes sense. Does that question make sense?
Yeah, it makes sense. I think I it's like a little bit
of both, you know? Because the fandoms for the pit
is fucking insane. Like I don't know if people have
been logged in taking a look at what people who are fans of.
I mean, we're fans, we're doing an episode, but the fandom and
like the theorizing of this show and who's being shipped with who
and what twist is happening. Who's really going to die of
suicide if it's not Robbie? It's like fucking crazy.
Like if you just go on any Reddit page for the Pit, I don't
recommend it, but there's a there's a huge cohort of people.
A lot of the crew in cast and crew have been asked questions
about this, about how intense the fandom is to the Pit.
Interesting, I didn't know there were like so many theories just
flying around. Yeah, OK.
Anyways, I think that's really hurt this show and I hope they
pivot away from that and kind of stay offline a little bit.
Yeah, OK. So I thought it would be
interesting to it's hard to talk about television when they're
there this many episodes. So I first I was like, let's
just go through every episode. There's 15 episodes, 15 hours in
a day. That's the whole conceit of the
pit is that you're spending 15 hours with these people or like
a double shift. But I thought it would be more
interesting to go through some of the characters.
I think that's how we do it. I think we go through the
character arcs. Yeah, it might be a little like
tedious to go through, like every case essentially.
But I thought it would be fun, before we even do that, to ask a
general question about The Pit that I've seen discussed online
that I think is actually really interesting way to approach a
good TV show like this that doesn't really have a
protagonist. Because I think Robbie is a
central character, but I actually don't know if he is the
if there is a protagonist in The Pit.
Is there an antagonist in The Pit?
Is there a villain? Is there is there some somebody
that people like to come back to the show to watch to see how
they create tension or suspense in this show?
Because I think it's season 1, they try to create a few
different antagonist like figures.
I think so too. The woman who is the admin
figure of season 1 was often getting yelled at a lot and then
used as sort of like a symbolic, almost like symbolic of an
institution rather than an individual who is just like
probably doing their job the best of their ability and was
really stressed the fuck out. Like everybody else who was
getting blamed for like nurse strikes and everything that
obviously it's not this one individual's fault.
But or like even to a certain point, Langdon was sort of
viewed as a a villain like figure to the end of season 1.
Or he sort of, I know that's it's not that binary.
Like you could just say they're flawed figures, but usually TV
shows like this need a quote UN quote.
Well, yeah, You're like, who are.
Yeah. Who are like the audience
members, like rallying around, doing like, something that that
they like, disagree with essentially.
Yeah. Yeah.
I mean, I, I, I agree. Like, I don't think it has a
protagonist, but antagonist is interesting.
Yeah. To your point, like, I think,
you know, we've talked about this before about the reason we
also love the pit also like as public workers is looking at the
like institutional factors, right, that are constraining,
like these workers that are, you know, they went into it more
this season, which we'll talk about with Orlando's character
of not being able to like afford healthcare.
And then also like the the really like tough spot that a
lot of the healthcare workers are put in because they have to
like adhere to this place that they're working in, but they
still want to help people and like legally, like what can they
do? So there there's a little bit
more of that in season 2, but to your point, like season 1, those
were like some of the criticisms that that we had.
Besides, I know I said it's like basically a perfect, you know,
season of television. I meant more so like
emotionally, I think in Season 1, making like the villain
character where Robbie's like yelling at a woman, like who is
in this admin position, who by the way, he like he's a white
man, she's a black woman. Like it just was just a strange
I think. Intentional optics, though.
I think they're trying to express something with Robbie
that they've doubled down on in Season 2.
Yes, but but in season 1 he was like seen as this kind of like
heroic figure of the, you know, the pit of the ER and that he
was like real for calling it the pit.
And and she was like, can we not call it the pit?
Because we, you know, like don't like the the kind of like, I
guess things that that that calls to calls to mind and like
whatever. And he anyway, so like that
whole aspect of of for the first season and kind of making her
like the villainous character, which I mean, like you already
said it, but like it made it more seemingly individualistic
when the show was trying to have a institutional perspective.
And I think it ultimately like does get at that.
But it was just a strange rating, I think.
And like not really helpful for what the show is trying to do
ultimately. And then the second thing that
we continuously talked about, like during Season 1 and the
first time we watched it and the rewatch, so I felt like the same
about it both ways or both times I watched, it was Robbie and
Mckay's conversations about the kid who they thought was like
the shooter. Oh yes.
They totally mishandled that and yes and so.
But Robbie was like, he's on incel.
Yeah, if you remember, Yeah, he's.
Just a kid trying to figure it out.
Yeah. We all wanted to kill a bunch of
people. Just wild.
So, so in in Season 1, for people who didn't rewatch it,
remember, there was like a kid who came in and the mom
actually, like, came in, made herself sick because she was
worried about her kid because he wrote a list of girls that he
wanted to harm at his school. Runs away.
He's 18, you know, by the way. And Robbie's like, well, you
know what, Like, maybe he'll come back.
Yeah, I'm worried about him. But it was like, focused on him.
And McKay was like, well #1 like, this is actually like a
problem that we need to address. It's not just like, let's wait
and see, but also she wasn't like she wasn't like
immediately, like let's get the the police involved.
She was, but she was like, yes, like we need to like this is
kind of an urgent thing, right? Where he was kind of treating it
more as like, well. Like you said, it seems like
you're profiling him. Yeah, it was wild.
And so I think. It's exactly what's happening.
And then when and then later on, Robbie at one point in in season
1 is like, you know, you're right.
This actually is an urgent issue and they make her use like the
the kind of reasoning of like, well, when you've been at the
hands of like domestic violence or like violence, like gender
based violence, basically right that then like you would maybe
like think this is more urgent. So they like use that.
And then he's like, you know what, you're right.
But then at the end of season 1, they flip it again.
They have another sort sort of like weird, yeah, weird writers
room thing where you can tell there was maybe just like
different thoughts on this because he he says like, you're
right. And then at the the very end,
he's like, this is your problem. You created this mess to to
McKay, like go in and talk to this child and you make it
right. And then they kind of make her
almost like apologize to the kid.
Like, ultimately, yeah, he didn't.
He didn't, you know, commit like mass violence.
It also perpetuates this idea that woman or falsely accusing
men of crimes that didn't commit, which is just a strange
thing to perpetuate. Yeah, I thought that was.
Very so politically weird. Yeah, this is your
responsibility now. So anyway, so that, that whole,
I guess like dilemma, it's like one of my least favorite parts
of season 1. But yeah, I, I, I think that in
season 1 there was also Langdon, which we, which I, I'm glad they
cleared up in season 2 because a lot of people were like, yeah,
this huge divide, which I did see online between like Santos
and Langdon and. It wasn't just clearing it up.
They were just like Santos, take a seat, Langdon, you are back
and we are redeeming your character.
That's basically what happened for all of Season 2.
Yeah. And it was weird because it's
like, I like that Santos is an imperfect character who was
still like, you know, reporting like something that she felt
like could harm patients but ultimately also was kind of an
asshole, too. And Langdon was also an asshole
like. I would like to have a Langdon
versus Santos conversation later on.
OK, yeah but like with Langdon in season 2, they were also
addressing the fact that like he is dealing with his shit and
like Robbie isn't. So I like that they finally like
addressed that in the last episode of season 2.
That might be one of the best moments of the season.
Yeah, I think so. LinkedIn and Robbie's face, like
telling him like it is like you're also suffering from
something that is weighing down the staff.
You've become the machinery that you're so critical of.
With that backpack ad, did you see the backpack ad?
No, I did not. I did.
I did clock how clear they tried to make that.
He was holding the hat that he walked in with and also wearing
a backpack. That he, oh, I didn't see the
hat, but he had AI forgot. I don't know how to pronounce
the company's name, but it starts with AD and it's like a
very popular backpack because I was looking for different
camping and hiking backpacks. But that was yeah.
So season 2 villain, I guess we could just say it's the
machinery it is like I. Think it's Robbie though.
So that's what I was going to say.
Robbie is the tension of Season 2 and I think it becomes more
clear that he was also the tension of Season 1 after
watching Season 2, even though I think this system itself, as you
said with the Orlando Diaz character who is the clearest
example of this. This inability to afford care
while you're still a functioning person should not lead you to
your death or potentially even like causing harm to yourself as
to get out of medical debts. And what that does in terms of
imposing a responsibility on medical, medical or healthcare
professionals to do something that they're probably not even
trained to do, which is like offer financial advice, except,
you know, when they get their obviously their financial
advisors or, you know, whoever lawyers to come talk to
patients. But I think it was this season
did a really good job for me being critical of it when it
when I said it was about the characters.
It does a really good job of being like, we're going to shift
inward this season and make it more about the staff and the
patients in terms of what they're experiencing when it
comes to the exposure to this healthcare environment.
And I think they do a good job of, of stamping this thesis,
even if sometimes a thesis in the pit needs to say it out loud
and, and shout it to like the camera.
I think they do a good job of being like, the system punishes
stability and it rewards collapse.
I think that was like really effective and to do things like
even seeing like ICE come in and turn treatment into like this
secondary concern where the ICE agents care more about this like
state sanctioned violence and incarceration or even this cyber
attack that you know, exposes the fragility of this
institution and its infrastructure.
There's so many examples outside of just the insurance gaps or
the lack of insurance that is forcing these worst outcomes
that kind of underline this show's thesis that the American
healthcare industry is a fucking monster and it's killing people,
It's not saving people. So they do a really good job of
basically making the antagonist that, which feels, I like that
it's a little bit more political and concrete and something like
the bear, where the bear is like the antagonist is like the
inability to grieve and like trauma, which is a little bit
too abstract for me. And so the bear sort of loses me
through all the seasons because it's so repetitive about those
ideas where this show, I feel like it could literally go on
for 35 years or like forever until the American healthcare
industry until it's basically like free healthcare for all
like that. That's how long this show could
go on for, which is wild. Yeah, And I think, you know,
while they could focus on it like even more with like
Orlando's character, I think that in season 2, like Samira's
kind of dilemma of trying to keep Orlando in the hospital to
receive care, but also like understanding that he can't
afford it. And then again, it's like
paradox that like when he comes back in and essentially is going
to have a long term disability and possibly be paralyzed.
Now Healthcare is becoming more affordable like that.
You know, that whole like just tragic situation that they look
at in in season 2, kind of like makes I think probably broader
audiences think about or like it just highlights the all the
other bills that people are paying for just like coming in
for like a burn or anyone who's being rushed up to surgery.
Like what is that bill going to look like?
Like of course, I think they could like double down on it
even more. And how we shame people truly in
the United States for like, taking help or support the way
that he was like rejecting the GoFundMe from his daughter as to
what that that might suggest. Because America is supposed to
be a country of hard working people who who get money and
they buy whatever they can to try to live a life in America.
And that's how our system works here.
It's based on meritocracy and how hard you actually put out
effort into the world when reality we see how corrupt it
is. Yeah, I thought that was really
well done too, in a subtle way. Yeah, definitely.
And I think, you know, we always, even since season 1,
we're like, what is this Bill going to be?
You know, like for people who are just being rushed up to
surgery. So yeah, I'm glad that they
addressed that in in Season 2. And they do a good job of like
subtextually, people have so much hostility toward the pit,
like the ER, the hospital in general.
And people are so afraid. I, I use this when we go through
like we talk about healthcare as an industry and some of my
classes I often talk about like how like I prompt my students to
think about, OK, you're an adult.
You get into a car accident. The first thing you know, you
think about is insurance. You think about like, what's
what it's going to cost to fix your car.
Now imagine that was your body. It's insane that the first thing
you think about if you break an arm is like, what is this going
to cost me? And it's just like an
interesting way that we have normalized the commodification
of healthcare in America and the commercialization of it.
Anyways, the show does a good job of like gently kind of
exploring that without being too weirdly, without being too
explicit about it because the show is so didactic and it's
politics. It's like screaming it at you
and polemic about it verse this commentary.
I think it does a very good job of people who are like waiting
in the ER. They're so angry, not at these
doctors or these nurses or these healthcare professionals, but
they're angry at this fucking machinery that they have to like
sit in this bureaucracy and how much it's going to fucking cost
them and change their life possibly.
And I think at one point during this season, because we got so
many of the, the people who are like on the ground, who are like
driving the ambulance and and doing like on site care that you
were like, oh, like, I wonder what their storyline is, right?
Or people like flying people in through the helicopter.
And I, and I think like there, you know, is so much more to be
done. Like the season will go on.
The seasons will go on, I'm sure, for a long time, Like it's
our new Grey's Anatomy or new whatever medical show where they
could do things like, you know, when they're coming to a scene,
someone like denies an ambulance, right?
Like, because of the cost and like there are people who you
know. I think they did do that once.
Oh, did they do that? Yeah, I think somebody said we
did drive him here like something like that, one of the
patients. Oh, OK, because they didn't want
to do an. Ambulance Well, yeah, I, I guess
like, I was just thinking like, especially at like sporting
events, you know, if you're in like, especially with like
public schools, if you're in an area of like a, or you're like
playing a team who has like wealthier like parents or, or
county, it's like people are like, oh, let's get an
ambulance. And there I, I just think there
could be like tensions between people not understanding like
what an ambulance even costs. I would like literally take a
moneyball season of the pit where we were just in the
accounting office of the hospital just to see how because
I imagine that the people are stressed the fuck out trying to
lower the bills of patients. Like I genuinely think they're
probably very good people working in those spaces and
hospitals who are trying their best, when in reality who were
all angry out is the insurance companies, not necessarily those
who are working in the hospital, which is like for profit, but
also has a lot of government subsidies.
So it is like heavily state funded.
So sometimes I think we can like this show isn't done a good
enough job with that yet, which is like how patients are really
angry at what insurance has done to our bills when it comes to
hospital. So I literally think there be a
moneyball season of the show. I don't think they'll do that
because I don't think it would be like cinematic, as we've
talked. About Take an episode 2.
Seasons, yeah, I think they could definitely go into that A.
Night Shift season where they do a spinoff episode.
The last thing I want to say about like kind of the the real
world quote UN quote like aspects of the pet is that I
appreciate they like, you know, kind of address a lot of like
different issues that like intersect with the their
patients lives like in that that they're treating like the
trafficking right, or like they they did a case with like a
sexual assault this season. But in like season 1, I would
say like broadly like the mass shooting is like something that
they were trying to tackle and do that extended with the McKay
Robbie conversations about the the kid right.
And then the in season 2, like it felt like it was, yeah, what
we've been talking about in terms of the exploitative like
system of like just the healthcare system.
And then also, you know, with the the episode with ice, like
it just felt that one felt weird and not well done though,
because Robbie takes a moral stance on so many other issues
in the pit. And when that happened, he was
like, can you just leave? So I can like, so we can like
have this, ER, operating like, can it just, it felt like a very
strange kind of like speech for him to give like posturing.
Kind of speech, because he does it.
He does it with the paramedics. Is that the right word?
The people who were driving the ambulance.
Later in the film, the doctors are working on the ambulance
but. Oh yeah, that was so like, I
understand because he was talking to two men.
Is it a pseudo feminist speech to them?
Yeah, he was, you know, bringing up probably like something that,
you know, well, it is like a statistic, right, of like women
are misdiagnosed because like the the equipment isn't being
placed correctly, like under her like breast, right.
But the yelling, that's what I was kind of talking about at the
beginning of this. There's so much yelling in this
season that was like. Really felt like in that case
felt forced, at least were and there was like, I don't know, it
just was like Robbie's character was like very weirdly used.
I liked that they made him kind of like a little bit like the
the villain in in this part of the the show.
But yeah, there. Yeah, I I just felt like a weird
writing. There was other weird writing
too, like the trying to force in AI in the workplace commentary
in. The show and about that whole
stuff. For like 3 episodes with Doctor
Aloshimi and sort of. Like let's like change this.
It's sort of a misdirect because with that, you know, performer,
they're trying to present her as like cold clinical Terminator at
ask at the beginning of the show.
And from day one, I was like, hell yeah, I love this actress
and I love this character and I definitely have a work wife
crush on this person. I love her.
And she is literally like a top three favorite character for me
immediately. I didn't even need any time.
I was in all the all the glances.
By the way, Speaking of, yeah. What were they?
They were doing all these like glances.
That was real, right? That was I wasn't making.
That up Robbie and all Ashimi, but between the Abbott Abbott, I
was like, what's his name? The military, dude.
Yeah, Abbott and Samira too. Oh yeah, I forgot about that.
They were trying to do a lot of. People are people are fucking in
the ER 100% I. I think Robbie even has multiple
people he's hooking up with. Well, yeah, there's the the
woman who comes. Legal.
Counsel, yeah, like I'm, well, I'm not exactly sure what she
does. I think she like talks to people
about their insurance options essentially.
But yes, like she is a part of like the legal adjacent team.
I don't know. But but yeah, there there were
some interesting glances. A lot of it was funny, though,
like Abbott clocking that he was talking to that woman, the legal
counsel lady, and he was just like, OK, and he's like shut up
or whatever, OK. Some things that the show does
well, and then we can get to the characters or I guess this is
getting to the characters right now.
I want to talk a little bit about the patients this season
outside of just Orlando, which I think we explored pretty well.
But Louis, a character who was in Season 1 and in Season 2,
died about halfway through Season 2.
I think that's where the show really started taking off for me
this season, where I was like, OK, this is good.
This is emotionally compelling. Doctor Robbie revealed when they
were saying goodbye to Louis and they were doing, I forget what
you call that, but they were just saying goodbye to him with
all the medical professionals in the room after he had died.
He reveals that Louis's wife Rhonda, his high school
sweetheart, and their unborn child were killed in a car crash
a month before the baby was due. And Louis never recovered from
that loss and essentially drank himself to death to drown his
grief almost openly and quote UN quote happily doing that and
digging his own grave. And Robbie knew this, chose to
withhold that because of how personal that was.
And I thought that was that would really got me.
That was really impactful, mostly because they joke, they
jokingly called him like a frequent flyer and stuff like
that throughout both seasons as sort of a main character from a
patient side of this. And Langdon apologized to him as
a part of his his treatment, his rehab, but also like, seem to
deeply feel bad and like, wanted to like, apologize as a human
being, not just a partisan program.
That was really, you know, interesting.
And like, I, I really love that character a lot.
And I thought that was like an interesting way to say goodbye
to a character to also teach a moral lesson to some of the
younger characters like Olga B about judgement.
I thought that was really well done.
That felt like a Season 1. Pay off, I agree.
And I and I thought about it and I was like, oh, that's probably
something they planned on doing in Season 1.
Like whoever the writers were who dealt with the patience, the
patient writing in Season 1, I felt like they did not.
They didn't have the pen as much in Season 2, but that's why I
loved this part of Season 2 so. Yeah, I think it was like
probably the one of the most emotional episodes and of that
is because we knew the character from both seasons and then we
had, you know, Olga V like had this kind of he he's had this
arc throughout the whole season 1 of kind of being seemingly
like sheltered, I guess, and judging patients.
So yeah, I think it was when they viewed his or when they had
his face behind Robbie's while he was like telling that to the
staff. Like that was also a really
like, emotionally impactful. Yes, it was really well handled.
Another character, Roxy, who's a new character this season, who I
think was a good representation of why the patient writing was
just worse this season. I was less connected to her.
She was the woman who I think died from cancer.
Oh, yeah. OK, Yeah.
Yeah, and her family was with her.
Her though, whoever her son was, was a really good actor, a child
actor. He made me feel things that the
husband certainly did not the guy who plays the.
Husband also because that's Oliver.
That's. Taylor Hanley is the actor,
yeah, plays Oliver on The OC, which is a show that I just
watched this past year. Kelsey had already seen it.
Love the OC, No notes for like bad but good television of the
early 2000s to mid 2000s. And as soon as he showed up as
the woman who's dying's husband, I was like, he's fucking
poisoning her. Yeah, we're like, what's
happening? Well, the The funny thing is,
like when we saw him, we had just watched the OC, but we both
were like, wait, who is that? Like, where do we know his face
from? Because he's like so young on
the OC And then it just like clicked.
And but even before that, I think we were like, oh, what is
he doing? Because we didn't like put it
together, but we obviously like our minds recognized it more
unconsciously first. He's got the face of a
sociopath. He's yeah, and even until her
death, like I, I didn't pick up on.
I still think he did it. Yeah, I, I didn't pick up on the
plot that she didn't want to die in their home because then it
would like kind of be a space where the children remember,
like here's the room where mom died.
She didn't want to like, you know, have any negative emotions
or or whatever, like the the kids processing that like
attached to a room in the home or like I didn't understand that
plot because I was so focused on Oliver.
Well, I connected them. I was like, oh, she doesn't want
to go home because he's doing something.
He's killing her. I was like I over read into.
It I was like he he's presenting as this like like husband who
will do anything for her. And then when the woman who is
kind of like they presented as her like death doula or like her
person who's like helping her die, essentially when when she's
like, I've got it like go. That was supposed to be like
giving him a break because he's just like dedicated husband in
that moment. I was like Oliver.
He like there's he's we're going to get a reveal right now while
he's gone. I yeah, I just couldn't stop
thinking about Marissa. Bro I fucking hate Oliver.
So yeah, any OC fans in the comments, let us know if you
also had I guess negative assumptions if.
You're under the age of 27. You probably don't know what
we're talking about. That's OK.
So the point I was trying to make there with Roxy is that I
don't think that was that emotional of an arc, but it
lasted like 4 episodes. And I think that's a point to
Mike or criticism of the season that there are other patients we
meet too, that at one point there's AI think it's a water
park, something that happens at a water park.
That slide breaks down. Yeah.
Which is why I'll never go to a water park again.
That's the only reason. That's one of the.
Reasons. Yeah, there's several that I
won't. The reason I won't go, but what
was I saying? OK, so there was a there was a
hospital that had to shut down. Yeah, there's many reasons there
was a hospital that had to shut down because of the cyber
attack, right? Oh yeah.
And so they had to send the patients or the the injured over
from the water park. And one of the dads of a son was
like, I lost my son. He fell somewhere.
And like that was like a good arc that was like never fully.
That's so true. Developed.
Yeah, there was a lot of examples.
With that, yeah, there are so many characters who we didn't
get a full arc on the the mom, right, and the kid left in the
car. The woman who's deaf, right?
Yes. That wasn't that that developed
or it took a long time or too long.
It was so frustrating where I was like, get a pen and paper.
Like, I understand the commentary here and the ableism
that exists in our institutions, but I could not believe the
writing there where I was like, it seems like not only did you
need somebody of the deaf community to be involved in
writing, but it also maybe they did, but it seemed like they
needed somebody just who had some kind of sense to be like,
well, they would just write it down on paper if they they truly
couldn't get somebody for 10 hours.
Yeah. Right.
Well, also the, the, this is a good example of like what we're
talking about of like forcing different, like plot lines.
It, it felt like, yes, the doctors are like busy and
whatever, but like it, it just seemed like the characters that
we know, like someone would step in and like try to like figure
this out instead of leaving a woman who that we don't have
like the resources of this, you know, like interpreter on the
screen like that. That's not working right.
Like it just felt like weird writing for the the doctors to
continuous be like, continuously be like, Oh well, we'll just
wait until this happens. And it didn't make sense for
them to make Santos unlikeable in that way for her to be so
apathetic or indifferent toward that woman.
Like, I understand we're we're going to get to Santos in a
second. But like, yeah, that was off
putting anyways. OK, characters of the show.
I think we start off with Dana, Dana, Dana.
Dana, I think. The center of the show, I'm
going to let you talk about your relationship to Dana Baby.
Jane Doe. I like this character, but I
have more complicated feelings toward the performance.
OK, yeah, so, well, let's just put it out there.
Trey thinks it's a bad performance.
But I think it's OK that it is like I, I think everybody is
dialed to an 8 in the show. And Robbie's probably no Wiley
gets to be like a nine to 12 at times, but everybody's basically
at an 8, which I enjoy. It makes it a comfort TV show
feeling, even though there's a lot of tense things that are
high stakes happening and human lives are at play.
The woman playing Dana is is at like a 15.
I think you. I think you also think it's like
the accent. Right.
It's a lot of the things. Yeah, it's it's a lot.
And I do think it works because the show needs a certain height,
heightenedness or cartoonishness in order to sort of destake the
show. But but also she's a part of so
many pivotal emotional moments in the season where she has to
be caring or soft spoken. But it always felt a little bit
false to me. Like when she's dealing with the
the survivor of sexual assault and she's like doing the test
kit and she's doing the kind of softer voice and tone I like.
Never. It never just sat right to me
because the the character is so. Elevated, yeah, I mean the
accent in the in those times too, like you're aware that
she's like. Putting it on exactly.
So it's hard to like disconnect from watching like the mechanics
of the performance. But at the same time I've met a
lot of teachers like that, so maybe I'm just in the minority
I'm probably wrong about. This, but I I like the
overacting. I I think especially like the
the kind of like. I don't know if maybe this is
not the same in I'm, I'm sure they're like characters like
this in a lot of workplaces, but especially in public works of
like a sort of like maternal figure, almost like watching out
for everyone, but still like getting a little bit of tough
love. Like she's running the ship,
right. And so I, I think the elevated
aspect of her performance, while I do agree with you, it is like
elevated, it always works for me.
And I always think it's like kind of like this weird tone
that they're not actually going for.
But it's like funny, not in the not in the more serious
situations. No, I know you're talking about,
but when she's just like running the room, you know, or, or doing
the charts and like, Hey, you know, like that's for good.
Thank you yelling at people. It just works for me.
The show needs it. It needs somebody like that.
And so I understand why, but I do like this character.
She is the center of the hospital.
It's not Robbie, it's Dana. And I think she's also, she's
the head. I forget her exact job.
I think she's the head of all nurses, but also the cases.
Yeah, I forget the exact position.
She's the attending of the nurses though I think.
Well, whatever. Yeah, you already explained it.
She she's the the person like running the show.
Yes, exactly. Yeah, I I like this character
and the performance is needed, but I always feel like I I feel
crazy for never seeing any sort of like, not criticism, but just
like an acceptance that she is over playing it.
Like where it feels like a theatre performance in this TV
show that doesn't really have a lot of those except for some of
the patients were acting out of pocket sometimes.
But to have Dana like that every episode is like a lot sometimes
anyways. I will also say since she's like
the head of the nurses, I feel like we got less of the nurses
during like this part of the show.
Like Jesse was arrested and then was the plot line, but we didn't
really get to know Jesse and then.
Perla and Princess. Yeah, like I felt maybe at the
beginning of the season we got more of like their interactions,
but it felt like in season 1 they were just like more so
focused on like making a point that like the nurses are making
like the ER run like they and and in season 2 they just had a
Whitaker kind of like say it to the one of the new interns.
Yeah. Well, yes, exactly.
I don't know if they're technical, I don't know if
they're interns, but whatever you.
Know well this show, I think Joy and Ogilvy famously at this
point is expert at tell, don't show.
It just tells you what it's what's on its mind.
But with the nurses in particular, they did a really
good job of show don't tell in season 1.
But this this season, you're right, Whitaker.
And there are a few other moments of people just being
like, nurses are more important than like anybody else in the
ER, which obviously, like, I appreciate it as a commentary.
I'm sure if you're a nurse, you do too.
But yeah, I felt like it was less, it was less thoughtfully
handled this season with actual screen time of nurses.
Nurse Emma, though, a good addition.
Yeah. To the crew.
I liked her, loved her and loved that Dana punched that one guy
in the face off camera. Oh, yeah.
It was choking Emma out. Yeah, that's awesome for Dana.
So shout out. OK.
So let's talk about Robbie Verse Ashimi and what the writers were
trying to do with introducing a new attending to this season.
Like, what do you think the point was there outside of just
the plot? Yeah.
The tension of like Robbie's going on vacation and he needs
some sort of like, you know, thing to worry about if the ER
is going to like run smoothly without him.
I I feel like, you know, she kind of was in an equal
professional position as him. That were it.
It didn't feel the same as like Abbott calling him on his shit.
Like she felt like really emotionally intelligent.
Not that Abbott, I guess like wasn't, but I think she was like
brought in to to show like the cracks of of Robbie.
Yeah, but I just think it's interesting that from a
teacher's perspective, people who've worked in like public
works, like I think you've been around Robbie's and Alfashimi's
where? And what I mean by that is like
Robbie's who have been so conditioned by a broken
institution that they work on improv.
They work on like gut instincts and the Alshimi's of the world
who believe in systems and data and who are more like structure
driven and focus on focusing on like a liability reduction and
like not being sued and things like that.
And I thought that was an interesting way to frame this
season to show the different ways that institutions are
changing where like an education of people don't know.
I didn't even. Think about it like that.
But I think you're right. This duality really exists.
There are data-driven leadership positions and teachers, and then
there are charisma, improv leadership and teachers.
Kelsey's a good mix of both. I think you're like, you're a
good example of both. I'm unfortunately the latter,
which is a closer to a Robbie, which is like going off of
instinct, which is an objectively more stressful side
to be on than it is to be data-driven where you rely on
like your own willpower or your your stand up comedy version of
doctoring or teaching, if that makes sense.
But it's also more emotionally fulfilling because you get to be
more present and you're not as distanced because you're
data-driven. Anyways, this is a huge debate
in education between like educators and teachers and admin
roles of like how to handle classroom logistics and also
school logistics. And so I thought that was
interesting. They brought that in to a
hospital in the ER, or at least that's how I viewed it.
No, I mean that that's interesting.
I think though, there's like a, you know, aspect of both Al
Ashimi and Robbie. Like you can kind of like almost
like go back to their beginnings and and view them as like, oh,
they were like passionate about medicine, like wanted to go into
it to help people, but now have like different approaches to
navigating the system, which like I think the show is like
making it more of a binary to make a point about that.
Like where you could see Al Ashimi like working under like a
hospital administration of that that basically like is grading
her on or her career is like riding on this idea of like
being effective getting a certain amount of like charts,
like, you know, whatever it is that's.
A good point, yeah. Data-driven stuff, which you can
like compare to something like standardized testing, right?
And education where it's like, well, like, I know this is
bullshit, but at the same time, like my job is, is dependent on
the fact that like the kids need to pass this test in order to
graduate. And also like if I have a bunch
of kids who fail this test, I just ignore it.
You know it Then like my job's also on the line.
And so like, I think there's like.
And then this curriculum. Is bullshit, yeah.
And then if you're like doing a disservice to the kids by not
focusing on it. So like there's that whole
dilemma that I think that she is kind of like representing like a
it's like a weird. I mean, it's obviously a way
more complicated conversation because she's like representing
this like necessary evil within like an institution of like
being efficient. But you know, obviously like we
don't whatever. Like, but versus like Robbie
Yahoo is I think it's it's also like an interesting like gender,
right, like commentary there of like Robbie not only being able
to be the person who I think was like more and more annoyingly
like unexamined in season 1 of like, well, that's all bullshit.
And like, you know, like you can just do whatever.
But he ultimately, like he was able to have like a this like
charismatic approach to like, I'm going to keep my job because
I know I and the only one who can like do it, but really like
the hospital needs me and stuff like and like so very toxic,
Yeah. And I think.
That unknowingly, which is the worst kind of toxic.
Yeah. And I think that kind of like
uncovered that in season 2 more so that he's not just this like
charismatic guy who like only cares about people and like who
care like we have. We have to work around the
system as an obstacle. And that's just like a realistic
part of the job, which is what he kind of like approach things
with. And that got messy, too, because
like, then he, you know, was like criticizing Dana And when?
Instead of being like, well, how can we like work this out with
you protecting it, protecting yourself, but also like then
him. He could have just been like,
I'm actually just concerned about you because you seem like
you're in. Oh, after she punches that guy.
Well, because she's carrying around the shot that like,
sedated. Him because she got hit in the
face in season. One right, So but instead of him
saying like, hey, I think you're living in fear, like is this
something that like you haven't, you know, understandably like
dealt with he was like, well rules, you're not supposed to do
this and like legally blah, blah, blah like so yeah, like I
think that got messy anyway. And the way he forgives somebody
like linged in by letting him come back.
So yeah, like punishing him. They are definitely exploring
his selective. Morality in the.
Show and him as a martyr figure. I do think it's a little
different in in education. Although I think you're right to
point out that it's like an interesting conversation about
how people like address institutions or like think about
that. But I, yeah, it's not a perfect
comp, yeah, but I do. But I do think that that's.
Interesting though, because I think in.
Education it's a little less like because it's curriculum and
it's like you're looking at like history and ideas, especially
like, I mean, we're in the humanities.
Like it's not as like like it's OK to be like fuck the data.
Do you know what I mean? It's OK to be like, here's why
standardized testing, like shouldn't matter.
And talk about that verse like here it's, I don't know what
it's a little, it's just a different conversation.
But I understand what you're saying.
You don't got to say it's a perfect comparison.
I'm just noting it. As interesting as being teachers
and watching something like this, because there's no show
about schools that is this in depth or this nuanced.
The closest thing we have is like Abbott Elementary, but
that's a comedy. And as much as I love Abbott,
it's like, well, that's like The Office, silly.
Yeah. Yeah.
Exactly. OK, Robbie, do we still trust
Robbie or do we ever trust Robbie?
Never trusted a Robbie. Never.
I mean I I. Liked.
Aspect of his aspects of his character in season 1 and
there's still things that I think like, you know, I feel for
Robbie in season 2. He just like continuously, like
they were trying to make a point obviously with like him thinking
about suicide and him possibly like lashing out at people,
slash trying to make amends. Like it was just a messy
character arc that wasn't really a good look of like, I'm
hurting, so let me lash out on other people, especially him
being like this, like white guy who's the boss, you know, like I
but that was intentional now. Yeah, a part of the commentary.
Yeah, I feel like it is. They're showing they.
They want you to be both. Sympathetic and critical of the
character. You're sympathetic to him on
this like self destruction journey as a product of being
stuck in this machinery where all he wanted to do was help
people and what he lost along the way, it was what he explains
to Samira outside. He lost the lake, he lost the
kids, he lost the partner. He's by himself.
The only place he can feel sort of needed or seen or alive is
when he's helping people. It's his purpose inside the ER
and I feel like a a lot of public facing professions feel
that tension that are under resourced.
And I thought that was a really well explored this season.
I think we're now coming to amends with this like idea that,
oh, Robbie is the which is why I asked at the beginning of the
episode. He is the antagonist of the pit.
Like if you're going to pick 1 outside of the the more abstract
system of healthcare. And I think he's also realizing
that. And Langdon has to be the
person. You know, we haven't really
talked about race when it comes to the show, but it is very race
aware. Langdon has to be the white guy
to tell the the older white guy, the younger white guy tells the
older white guy, hey dude, you're the problem.
And I felt that was very intentional too.
For like the. Audience to for the audience and
also I think, you know for the audience to get fanatically, but
also for the show to kind of be able to keep it's it's what's a
major player and Robbie afloat and keep him in the show while
also being a critical of him by having like the younger Robbie
criticize him, which is supposed to be Langdon, even though I
think Langdon Santos are more similar as characters like
Langdon is certainly supposed to be a quote UN quote to younger
Robbie. I think, yeah.
I mean, like they set it up as like he's this mentor figure,
like the. Reason he is kind of like
punishing him is because, like, he had these high hopes for him.
Like, he's almost like a paternal figure or something.
I mean, that's how, like, the show is positioning it, right?
You talk about them as brothers, but it's really dad, son.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I've.
Robbie's character is interesting.
I appreciate that he's like complex but very easy to hate
this this season. What do you think about Noah
Wiley as performer? I was just going to say.
The pit needs his eyes. You.
Know he's got very sad eyes. Yeah, he's got very sad.
Eyes. And oh and also I sorry
everyone, because I haven't seen ER for listeners, I guess who
like had, but I also didn't realize how how beautiful he was
in his youth and he's still beautiful now.
But we were watching a few good men.
I was just going to say. Tom Cruise hops.
In the car, right? To go.
See Jack Nicholson and you're you pause it, you said.
Who is that? Respectfully, Demi Moore jump
jumps in the car and Tom Cruise gets by.
Yeah. He jumps in 2nd and you said who
is that? And I said I don't know.
And you said you're going to be so.
Upset. Yeah, you could not get that
possible on the screen. You're like, let's just like.
Wait till you realize I don't know who.
He is. I'm like, that's Noah Wiley.
That's wild. When you see it, it's so
obvious. But but yeah, his sad eyes and I
think he does a lot for this show, like emotionally of him
just looking across the room. No Wiley very special to my
childhood. He was.
An Indiana Jones figure on TNT as a librarian.
If you've ever heard of the librarians.
He had some movies there for a bit, some TV only movies.
He was an ER, but I didn't watch it.
He was in the show called Falling Skies, a sci-fi show on
TNT. He was a TNT darling for a
minute there in my childhood when I was watching a lot of bad
TV. So I've always had a good
relationship to him. So the fact that he is like in
the pit now is very exciting. We even shout out any actor, but
I want to shout at him first because he is.
I think he's one of the writers of this show now and maybe even
one of the show runners. And he's been very vocal
politically about the needs of resources in hospitals,
especially for nurses, which I really appreciate.
So no, Wiley seems cool, but it is a really, it's a very complex
character. Speaking of complex characters,
Langdon plus Santos. Yeah, let's talk about them.
Complicated. Yeah, well, I think in whose?
Side Are you on whose side? In.
Season 1, it was like a. Messy situation where it felt
like again, there was like a rewrite in the middle because
like Langdon, while he was like being overly harsh to Santos and
like unaware to have like hit the power dynamic of him as like
a man and her as like a young woman coming into this like
brand new role there. There were aspects of her
character, though, that were like, let me like, you know, I
don't know what it, what the kind of like term is, but like,
you know how everyone kind of like describes doctors as like
they just want to like cut or whatever, you know what I mean?
Like they just want to which is more associated with like
getting money for like a surgery versus like actually cutting.
But but she, you know, was written as a character who was
like, I just want to do whatever it is when they put the tube
down someone's throat, right. That's like all she wanted to do
or like she wanted to like kind of like get into the the higher
level things and she treated patients as practice.
Yes. As resume building, yeah.
And so like there was. Like a tension.
That I thought was. Interesting there and and also
the tension of her being a Filipino queer.
Character and being at odds with this like more Ken looking white
guy very intentional call him like Doctor Ken at 1:00.
Point right. Yeah.
So, yeah. So I think like there there were
some interesting things that were like going on there.
But then all of a sudden, like when the the kind of reveal
happened and then Santos like told Robbie and Robbie yelled at
Langdon and was like get out of here.
The the whole like flip of I don't know of like making it too
neat, right? Like that's what I think the the
writing flip felt like, or it was like Langdon bad character
and kind of like taking away some of the nuance.
And then they try to like bring it back here where they have
the, the woman who I love, who Santos is, who she's having like
the surgeon, Yeah, a relationship with, but it's
really just like a situation ship and the and basically it's
kind of like sad when Santos finds that out.
But anyway, when when, when the surgeon is like, hey, like we
should like remember to be. I don't know, like I, I forget
what she says to Santos. There's protocols of how to act
and how to speak in this room, but it.
Was, I don't know, I just feel like the writing has been kind
of messy with LinkedIn and. Santos yeah, I think it starts
in Season 1 when they decide to. Make them kind of fight one
another emotionally and psychologically.
I found that to be very strange. I think this season was sort of
trying to reckon with how they are two sides of the same coin,
how they are both. Maybe this isn't the better
word, best word considering Langdon.
But addicted to the adrenaline of the job.
And they're both using medicine as a way to to stay alive, like
as a practice. And they're both very ambitious,
but they're also emotionally compromised and shaped by their
environment so easily. And so Langdon is sort of is so
is so raw in Season 1 and and so outwardly empathetic.
He wants to be seen as good. He wants to do good.
As a result, he's easier to sympathize with because the show
and frankly, TV in general, know how to write the archetype of a
tortured, sensitive white man. And the show is certainly
playing with that. And Patrick Ball, the performer
is doing a good job with that. But in season 1 didn't totally
know. I think season 1 didn't totally
know what to do with him halfway through.
And then I think his writing became inconsistent because in
the addiction arc I felt was like planted about halfway
through the season. I know people have said earlier
on music very sweaty, but season 2 is pretty sweaty too.
I think that's just the actor in my opinion.
But like season 2 kind of course corrects how volatile they make
him in season 1, and I think his redemption then feels a little
bit forced in season 2. Like too much like Santos is
almost has become so apathetic. I know she's depressed.
I know that there's a lot of illusions to self harm and that
she'll continue to self harm when she steals the the knife or
the whatever it is. And I think him trying to be
like, you know, I've. Lost a lot.
My wife almost. Divorced me, I'm sober now.
I'm trying my best. And she's like, no, you haven't
suffered enough consequences. The moralism is kind of extreme.
And the fact that Doctor Al Ashimi also sort of agrees is
kind of extreme, especially because the show is reckoning
with something that is like true in like public workers spaces
that there are there substance abuse because of people being
overworked or burnout in these positions.
And so you would think that there would be more
understanding in those spaces. Yeah.
It's not like forgiving like what happened necessarily, but
it's. Strange that the characters who
like wouldn't have more empathy is really what it is, right?
And then with Santos, I think what's hard for me as a fan of.
Both of them because I love these characters.
With Santos in particular, a lot of people have been defending
this character over the last two or three years because they have
said, well, you just don't like a complex, you know, queer woman
if you don't like this character.
And I do think there is a little bit of like the writers had a
little bit of a responsibility to kind of fix that in the
fandom. Then I think they did this
season, but a little bit too much where they're like, let's
not confuse complexity with like abrasiveness.
There is something about Santos that is off putting because
there is something that's like her arc is about is learning
about how to be a good person. And I think that's interesting.
And there's they sort of doing something similar with Ogilvy,
even though I don't think a lot of people are comparing those
two characters because high key Santos is sort of an asshole and
most people would not want to work with her yet.
And this is a credit to the performance.
And let me get the actresses name here because I just forgot
it. MIT talking Issa Briones.
Briones. I apologize if I mispronounced
her name. She's wonderful, but you care
about her as much as she's an asshole or off putting or
distancing. There's something about the
performance that is like layered where you really care about her
and the show gives you a good amount of context subtextually
and sometimes sexually about why she's so hardened.
Like a likely abuse of or likely a history of abuse.
The way she connects with children in particular,
especially young girls, or the way that she softens around
woman who maybe have been directly impacted by a man from
gendered violence. The self harm part that I
already talked about the the queer loneliness with the
surgeon. There's a lot of sympathetic
readings of her character. The reason why you see you seem
to care about her. But the reason why I think this
dynamic between her and Langdon needs to be resolved very
quickly is because I don't think people are going to be ready,
prepared for ultimately what they're doing with her
character, which is they're saying she's learning to be a
good person, which I do think is unnecessary.
I don't think queer, the queer community needs somebody as a
representative. I mean, I'm not in the queer
community, but I feel like it, it doesn't make a lot of sense
to me to make a character who is a part of an identity that is
usually othered in television or in this medium, in cinema at
large, to make that person be sort of like have a lot of
unexamined ego and pain and survival.
Like I find those to be a lot of contradicting feelings that
don't make somebody complex. They make them sort of
overwrought and sort of confusing.
So I hope people get what I'm what I'm trying to say.
I think like the the flip side of of like you know you.
Just can't handle this like complex character is like, no,
like she was like like mean to Javadi and Javadi, right, is
like kind of a privileged character.
And that her both her parents are surgeons working in the
hospital, but still is like calling her crash and she like
asked her to stop or, and you know, the, the like in this
season, like they really make it clear or whatever that she's
like, no, people are just like dumb.
Like, thank God we can profit off of like people being dumb.
We'll never be out of like work. And McKay is like, OK, wow, you
know, so but those things are like supposed to be like, it's
not. We're not supposed to be like,
Oh yeah, like she just sees it how it is or whatever.
Like those things are, you know, we often I, I think think about
the show in terms of like who would we want to work with?
And those are like, you know, just, I guess behaviors of like
taking out stress or like competition or something like on
other people or, or just like, you know, things you wouldn't
want to be around. So it's not like her being
complex when she's being like an asshole, you know what I mean?
So I, I think people are like, weirdly like, yeah, I guess like
kind of claiming her as a queer character instead of being like
the writing is actually bad for her, for the aspects of her
character, which is I think more so the point or maybe which I
agree with. It's not that they're running.
It's not. Maybe it's not that it's bad.
Or it's just questionable. It's questionable because she
only. Seems to care.
About the patients that she can relate to.
And I think that there's a little bit of self-interest
there that the show is trying to explore with her character that
I don't understand why they need to do that.
Because then it then it tries to complete this sort of like I was
saying this abrasiveness or apathy with complexity.
And I guess that goes back to your point.
Maybe it is just bad writing. Like I just don't understand why
they do that. Like there are so many patients
that she's dealing with in the show that she seems to not give
a shit about if it doesn't directly have to do it for past
the. The deaf patient is like the.
The biggest? Example like why did they?
Write. Yeah, I don't.
I think that there's an intention there, I just don't
know why. They're doing that.
So I like to see her and Mel doing karaoke because that
suggests we could be pivoting somewhere else or her opening up
to Whitaker, someone she seems to love as a friend, which is
nice. I, I love the Whitaker.
Yeah. And Santos like.
Whole plot line. Yes, Mel, the best character.
Is Mel the best character? One of the best?
Yeah. I mean, she has like we've been.
Talking about the the kind of like it's almost unfair because
she's the moral, you know, like side character of the show where
like every decision she makes is like she's thinking about a, you
know, a patient or about her Co workers.
So it's kind of like a cheat, you know, to be like, is she the
best character just because she's not written to be like
super complex besides like dealing with, you know,
different emotions of reflecting on like her sister's life or her
life outside of work. She's the loneliest person at
work though. I feel like it's a pretty
complex. Character I, I think maybe
because we're thinking about it and she's used a lot for levity,
like musically in the show, but in terms of her being like
incredibly competent, also deeply empathetic, but also
socially othered by everybody at work, likely because she's
neurodivergent, is like an interesting arc in the middle of
the show that isn't about that subject.
They're able to squeeze in like, a theme there.
And then her relationship to her sister is really interesting and
the parental relationship she feels she has over her.
And that's complicated because of her life together without
parents as children before now that they're adults.
But yeah, I love this character. I love the performance from
Taylor Dearden, I believe her last name is, who's the daughter
of Breaking Bad guy Bryan Cranston.
We have a movie podcast, Bryan Cranston and I also love how Mel
is, so she brings a lot of like quiet time to the show.
There's so many moments where we're just watching Mel absorb
her reality, like her present and there's.
A moment where Langdon and. Mel are sitting outside in this
finale where they're just watching the fireworks and the
camera pauses on their backs. And I just love that shit.
I I love, I love their relationship.
First off, when Langdon's taking care of her sister and he turns
off the lights and and he remembers all these quirks
about, like, Mel in particular. That, and he remembers them from
a year ago. He only met her once.
That's true. And it's wild that Mel even told
her sister all these things about Langdon.
Yeah. And I love that one.
This is really. I see why you love him.
And that was like, stop. Yeah, yes.
And. Obviously some people are a lot
of people are shipping them and I'm not going to lie, at first I
was a little bit, but we need more platonic relationships in
television movies. So I thought this was a very
special dynamic, as was Whitaker and Santos.
OK, so there are other characters we've not talked a
lot about, but we've sort of talked a little bit about McKay,
one of my favorite characters who is probably low key maybe
the second or third best character on the show.
And she sits somewhere in between that kind of like Dana
and Robbie spot. I feel like actually McKay
should be a attending. She should be doing Robbie's job
well. I mean, I think emotionally.
Like her emotional intelligence. Of being able to not I think
there's very few times where she's like, there was one time
in season 2 where it felt her writing was like kind of too
direct in telling. I think it was body maybe of
like, don't make you know this about like you kind of thing.
Oh, the crime with the woman who who had cancer, like dying.
And then Javadi like cried in the room.
I thought that was strange too. Yeah.
And I was like, what? Like.
But I think overall. With her writing.
I agree. She is able to to be like,
here's how we can like work around the system or like just,
you know, she really cares about the patients.
Like she's like, I want to leave this pen so someone can like if
they change their mind, like reach out for help or she's
like, I don't know, she just gets upset like when they are
unable to, to do that in a way that doesn't feel forced.
And it's interesting because she seems to have been like kind of
like pushed into, which is like often, you know, for like
comparing this to like public education, like the, the
educators who are essentially like good at doing the emotional
side of things are often then like overworked or, or kind of
like put into like, well, we'll just give them like the most
difficult classes, right? The social emotional teachers
versus the academic ones, yes. And and like so for example.
Like in the first season where like she's kind of put on like,
I guess like the the duties of like she's alone and then going
to like case to case to case instead of like being on the
team. Does that make sense?
So like I anyway, I but I I really like love her character.
I think she's like one of my favorite characters.
I think she's like one of the like most subtly complex
characters. I just, I'm always shocked by
this performance in terms of how it.
Blends like this blue collar sort of relatability, but also
maternal feeling where she feels like kind of like Dana, like the
mother of the ER, the parent of the meet the ER, but also as
these like sharp clinical instincts where she's been
working the job long enough that she sees things that other
people identify as small and she sees sees them quickly as big
issues. I love that.
And she also has like really warm bedside manner that she
does teach other characters to have that I think is really
important. I'm going back to your social
emotional point, other characters, Whitaker, we've
already talked a little bit about him.
He got more screen time this season, was more confident, got
new hair right. He became more of a short king
this season. Like there's a little bit more
confidence. There's a little yeah in his
step, yes. Maybe it was the hair.
Maybe it was the whole farm girl situation.
Whoever he's with right now, like the woman who he whose
husband died under his care the year prior, which is a little
complicated. Seems like he's got a baby now.
Oh yeah. He was like hey, yeah, he said
hi to the baby at the end. Yeah, but but.
The way that they were talking was like, they're like a little
family so that. Was cute, but he's also going to
be watching Robbie's stuff. We probably haven't identified
enough that Robbie this whole season has basically been saying
he's going to drive off a Cliff. Yeah, figuratively and
literally. There's a Thelma Louise
reference, The Thelma and Louise reference.
Maybe look over to you. And kind of laugh for a second,
but it was a dead. Silent in theaters.
So clearly nobody has seen that movie in 30 years.
But yeah, I wish Whitaker got a little bit more to do
emotionally. There's a moment where he yells
at Langdon in the office where Langdon makes a joke to him
about something like a very small joke.
And Whitaker's like, you know, it's not funny to, like, say,
continue saying these things about me.
Oh, yeah. And then and then Whitaker was
or Langdon was like, I'm glad. You're sticking up for yourself.
That's an. Important quality to have and I
was like, this is the kind of horse right writing where I'm
like the show is suffering from. What about Samira?
We haven't talked really about her at all.
She's not going to be back for season 3.
This was just announced recently.
Her character is really important in season 2 out of all
the younger characters next to. Langdon, I think she probably.
Has the most screen time and and script time, Yeah.
And I think like Doctor McKay, she's also a really like.
Important moral character of the ER right?
Like in the the first season, right, she is called like slow,
like I forgot what Robbie like calls her, but essentially
saying that she is slow in turning over like beds or
turning over like patients because she's like taking too
long to get their history and talking to them and like
connecting with them. And so she ultimately it is
someone who kind of like calls out not only like systemic, you
know, institutional, I guess, like issues with the healthcare
system, but she's also talking about like, bias and treatment,
right? Like her a big kind of subplot
of her character in Season 1 is talking about like racism in the
ER. And I think it's season 2.
She is more so like focused on the Orlando case.
And I think, like her emotional performance is something that
like, brings a lot to the to the show because she's not doing a
lot of like, I guess what a lot of other characters are doing,
which is like speechifying her, like emotional connection to a
patient is often like doing a lot of that work and then
letting the, like, case speak for itself.
Yeah. So I, I'm sad to, like, see her
go. I do think, though, that
sometimes, like with her writing in season 1, like something's
felt weirdly like it was it was like the literal like, line for
line readings that are not her fault.
But I think like, we're awkwardly phrased in ways that
like they didn't give Mckay's character, for example, but I
think that her and McKay serve a similar purpose.
I think McKay gets better writing.
So this goes to maybe the last thing we can talk about on this.
Deep dive and my ultimately my main criticism with this show is
that sometimes the pit feels like APSA, feels like a school
ad, like one of those, like a dare.
Exactly. I was going to say a dare ad
like an anti drug or anti texting and driving video.
Yeah. And it's weakest writing moments
for sure. Like people?
Know these videos, you've seen them in school probably or
we've. Seen them in health class or
you've seen them in like advertisements on YouTube,
whatever where a character says exactly the point of a scene
instead of behaving like a person and the messaging can
feel so heavy-handed. And yes, the politics of the
show are amazing considering it's a show about an ER, what
they bring into the show is so is so kind of provocative and
borderline transgressive for mainstream prestige television.
Or at least you. I think you could actually say
it is, but sometimes it just feels like there there's a.
Character going like. Are you going to come out with
the boys tonight? And then they're like, I don't
think so. I got a test in the morning,
like are you kidding me? Like by 1:00 AM we're going to
be home by 1. You'll get 7 hours of sleep like
all right, I'll do it. Cuts like jump cuts to the
person like drooling on their test the next morning Like
that's kind of the energy of some of these scenes.
Yeah or or my got a pocket. No, no, I think that's true.
That's what I'm saying. Like I think Samira got like.
Writing she's a big part of that in the first season where
instead of like with the the patient like it was well done
when and then the patient like comes into the ER and she's
like, you know stop like basically like violently
handling like this person and there is like racial profiling
going on. But then like then she like kind
of spells out multiple times like what's happening.
And then there's just moments where like she's like talking to
Whitaker, for example, and she's like, here are the statistics or
something. And it just feels like that's
not something that someone would say.
Like it's a definitely like APSA, yeah.
Like writing somebody explaining what microaggressions is to
somebody. And like I think there are.
Other ways to make the same exact?
Point that would feel more like someone was saying that to
someone they had a like relationship with.
And yeah, so I I think that's like in a lot of different
characters too. It's also tough because I
teaching Gen. Z for the past 10 years.
There are. Like that does like the moral
policing and language policing from kid to kid because they're
because it's such an awkward thing to do.
It doesn't feel like a human beings talking to another human
being. So I have seen it a lot in
person and it does sort of come off as whatever they're trying
to explore with Samira's character in the show.
So maybe that's intentional, but not really like it shows up
being critical of it. So I guess that's kind of the
unexamined part of it. In fact, the reason she's
leaving is because there's like family problems that she's
having and now she wants to work in like a different profession
or an adjacent profession, which another one of the doctors,
who's the other doctors? Who's the ultrasound like plot?
Or whatever where she's like, I am not submitting my application
for ultrasound. But yeah, I mean, I think like
ultimately, you know, that we like, I think we need messaging
like that in these like shows that are made for broader
audiences, I guess. So, yeah.
So like that it's ultimately fine.
It just feels a lot of the. Times like yeah, like.
Some writing feels a little clunky, like it could just be
smoother. Yeah, Whitaker has those
moments, too, sometimes. Yeah.
So reportedly, Ellis, Doctor Ellis who?
I'm very excited to. See, more of is going to be
taking a lot of the screen time from Samira Season 3 and Doctor
Ellis has been kind of in and out.
I think she's a part of the night shift in season 1 and 2,
which is exciting. I think we'll probably get more
of Abbott. Yeah, I like her too.
Javadi seems like she's finished switched.
Careers. Abbott's OK.
Really. Yeah, he really.
Got me choked up last. Night when he was telling Robbie
that he's basically killing himself at that ER, but he also
needs that place. So he needs to basically go on a
sabbatical to find some time and some peace.
I, I like his whole like Marine routine in the ER Like I've
worked with teachers like that. And it is a very effective
strategy to get like to try to do a job with a lot of people
that you're responsible for as if you're on a team together,
like a sports team or just like a military.
I also think him and Aloshimi relating about what happened to
her, and I think Afghanistan was like pretty powerful too.
And her PTSD that she kind of suffers throughout the the film
when she sees the child and has her seizures too, and isn't
totally able to locate maybe a connection there, which I think
they're going to explore in Season 3.
When she started crying in her car in the finale, that really
got me, too. Yeah, you said film.
And I guess it did feel like a movie last year in the.
Theater, but no, yeah, I mean, I, I just think Abbott's OK in
terms of like, I like his character, but there are certain
things I I think about like maybe I'm just connecting it and
like projecting like other masculinity that feels like this
like military like vibe of like I when I step into the room, I
command respect kind of like thing that I'm just like
connecting to men who I've met with his similar kind of like
personality outside of things. He wears it better than most of
them He does of that mold, I would say yeah.
And so, yeah. So he's fine.
And I, I like his character. Is there anyone else?
Javadi. Javadi.
Yeah. I thought that there are like,
parts of each season where I, I'm really interested in her
character. And then there's parts where
they just, like, totally leave her in the dust.
I would even say they have no idea what to do with this
character. Yeah, because I like the.
Performer, she got to be more of like, I've seen her on press and
like red carpets and she's like a pretty like bubbly person and
they let her do a little bit of that this season.
Season 1, they made her like so robotic and sterile and like a
kid who's been sheltered, who's very privileged, yeah, who's
been stuck in a position because she's like a genius at 20 years
old that probably she's too young to enter into.
It's so traumatizing. It's also like hard to.
I mean, maybe this is a situation in like the.
Medical field where you have like the child geniuses, so like
people who are like going into a profession young or something.
But ultimately it was like it's just like hard to sympathize
with her character in terms of like the plot line that they
give her. The the story arc of like mom
and dad both work here. And like, I'm rejecting this or
like the idea of like, I wish mom would have told me I love
she loved me more kind of thing. Like there what there were
interesting moments where like when the mom came in and was
like, why don't you know this in front of everyone?
And Whitaker was like, oh, I got to like leave or McKay, you
know, it was like we're getting a call from a patient and like
got her out of there kind of thing.
So there were like interesting, like family, I guess, like
moments that emotionally, you know, made you like empathize
with her character. But ultimately, like, it's kind
of like it was just a interesting play plot line that
her, yeah, her character just. Felt like more.
Sheltered and her whole kind of like a lot of her lines were
like, I am like older than I seem or like I I deserve to be
here and everyone was like we weren't saying you weren't the
kind of thing. So it was like a very strange
thing. Also like, by the way, I don't
know how this works with like the whole like student doctor
situation, but like there are moments in the show where it's
like there and someone's like, I actually don't want someone
who's doing this for the first time to like cut me open.
And then the attendees are like, well, you came to a hospital
like where it's a, it's a teaching hospital.
And so like, go ahead, like go for it.
And like, is that public knowledge?
Because I I. You know, until I.
Really had to get like major surgeries.
Didn't really, I didn't understand the difference
between like teaching hospitals and I was like, I don't can I
ask? So like, I I don't actually want
this. The first time someone's doing
this. It's insane.
Yeah, those those were always like so jarring.
I was like, wait, they can say no, Yeah.
Or they can't say no. Anyway, yeah, so but I.
Liked I liked at least the like I liked your body's the angle on
her character to like kind of be someone who is a proponent of
like public knowledge through her TikTok.
But it still wasn't like totally a little cringe.
It's like let's take the one Gen.
Z slash output kit like. A doll and make them a TikTok
influencer. I was like, all right.
And I think Whitaker convinces her to go into psychiatry.
Unclear. Oh, yeah, Right.
Yeah. So that was sweet, I guess.
So she might not be bad. The the scene at the end where
in the last episode where she's like to Robbie, like I think I
want to go into psychiatry and she's like, is do you think I
can do it? And he's like, I think you do
anything you want to like anything you put your mind to.
And she was like, OK, like, I don't know, I but you weren't
into that. No, no, I was saying I liked it.
Emotionally, but I'm just I. I was.
Laughing at myself because I just repeated the scene.
Yeah. And you did the same response
the actress did, which was sort of confused.
Anyway, I thought it was a sweet moment, OK?
Anything else about the show that you want to talk about?
From the season or that finale. Sad ending for Al Shimi's
character. Very sad.
Very sad, yeah. Especially because I was falling
in love with her every episode. Yeah.
I was like, Oh no, my. Queen, don't cry.
Yeah, yeah, I really like her. Let me I didn't get to shout
some of these actors just very quickly as we end today's
episode. We've seen a lot of character
names. Noah Wiley, Taylor Dearden,
Catherine, Lanasa, Lanasa. I'm going to butcher these
names, so I apologize. Who plays Dana?
Issa Browns? Who plays Santos?
Santos? Supriya Ganesh?
Who plays Samira Mohan? Patrick Ball, Langdon Shot Sean.
OK, I can't read today. You know what?
We're not going to do this. Yeah.
Wait. Why are you doing this?
I just felt bad we kept saying their character names and not.
Saying they're actors names but you.
Can look them up guys, there's can it say Sean, everyone's
great, I think across the board. Across the board, like the.
Performances that are all. So strong, and it's what makes
some of the writing that isn't as successful, like it makes the
show really strong. Yeah.
OK, my final thoughts are. Well, actually, fuck.
Final thoughts, I want to get out of here.
Let's just do a quick top ten. I want to do with my top 10
characters. My top ten favorite characters.
No explanation Mateo though. OK, like got cut out of the
season for? What?
I wonder? I don't know.
Mateo. Mateo.
Night shift. I think we should get, you know,
predictions for Season 3. I think we deserve a night
shift, six months of the pit, and then a day shift six months
of the pit. If the pit was always on TV,
we'll be all be happier. All the time, that is.
Interesting. I feel like they.
Yeah, as this country falls apart, we can just slowly all
join the. Pit Fandom.
Oh yeah, yeah. The predictions?
Oh, we didn't. Even talk about Robbie like
holding the. Baby the baby does he adopt the
baby seems like it I know they were trying to say he was giving
the baby like that he's. Giving he's doing self talk
through baby right right Mel the lawsuit.
Or poor Mel. Or poor Mel.
I I don't think anything's going to happen from that.
I think it was just. A She couldn't take the
courtroom. Yeah.
Langdon divorce I was. That even a plot of this season,
I think. It's a question, OK, He brought
it up to. Santos, which feels.
Like something, if it's on top of your mind, you'd bring it up,
I guess. So Al Ashimi returning as a
different kind of. Role.
Maybe not. Intending maybe like a floater
like Dana, maybe one of her roles.
Samira is not returning. Who will Mateo hook up with?
Javadi or who's the other woman? McKay.
In the first season we were like there was something.
That it was like an unclear storyline, right?
Like they were hanging out, but then Mckay's husband was like,
jealous of Mateo and like, talking about him as he was
going under her anesthesia and all that was really funny with
all the, like, everyone around him and all the women being
like, oh, there's like something we didn't realize.
Yeah, it was weird that he was cut out because I liked his
character so much. I guess Whitaker taking over
Robbie's place. Oh, Robbie was helping out one
of his. Biker guys the whole season,
that actor was really good. He was, he was a good actor, but
I was just like, it was a big. Subplop.
It was too much. Like I didn't need it.
Yeah, yeah, Took. Too much time.
His biker friend fixed his bike and he fixed.
His soul. OK, I'm going to do my top 10
characters very quickly. No explanation #10 Whitaker
Abbott tie #9 joy #8 samira #7 Robbie #6 Dana.
It's a little high for me, actually.
Let me think of this. I'll leave it whatever. 5 McKay
Dana over Robbie, what you're saying?
Because she's the, she's really the heart.
Well, I mean, Robbie is pissing me off this season.
Yeah. I mean, it's not, it's not
performances. Yeah, yeah.
Four Santos 3. Langdon I did it.
I put Langdon over Santos. What do you want from me #2 All
Ashimi and #1 I thought Joy was going to be higher for you.
Joy's going to be a top five character for me by the.
End of season 3 if they don't bring joy.
Back. I riot.
I love joy. I love Joy.
Yeah. Yeah.
I'm in some honorable mentions, Obviously.
Javadi Perla, Princess Ellis, Mateo Shen.
We've not talked about Shen. Nothing bothers that man.
Nonchalant king. The one coming in with his
Dunkin' Donuts. Yes.
Yeah. What do you think about that?
List. I think it's interesting.
I don't even know who your. Favorite character is.
I'm interested to see who. It moves on to this list once.
We, like, have people from the night shift come into our lives.
Yeah, there's a few new characters who are working
toward the end of the season who had who I.
Don't even have their names here.
Yeah, I don't think, Mel. Is my favorite.
Yeah, all Shimi will be. My favorite, probably by the
time we start next season. If we had only like I think Al
Ashimi is like one of my. Favorite characters at the end
of the season? But in the first part of the
season I was like, what is all this AI mess like that's
happening? I To be honest, she's fucking
gorgeous. And I was like, you could
generate AI right in front of me.
I'd be. Like whatever generate.
AII don't give a shit. I.
Think McKay. Is my favorite character.
I think so. OK, that makes sense.
Yeah, she's she's my 5th, but. I could easily see her at #1 And
do you have a least favorite or do you?
Have a Samira wasn't on your. List.
Yeah, she. Was she was like #8 I think.
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Sorry. Yeah.
You went fast. Yeah.
Whitaker, Abbott, Joy Mohan. Robbie, Dana.
McKay, Santos. Langdon.
Ahoshimi, Mel. I think it's probably.
In no particular. Order.
McKay, Dana. Mel Santos, Whitaker, Samira
Joy. Wow.
No particular order. All the characters.
In no particular order, I'm going to give you all the
characters of The Pit. Were those all women or did you
say Langdon? No, I didn't think I said a guy.
I don't know. Oh, wait, no, I said Whitaker.
Interesting. No, I don't even know what I.
Know Langdon, but Whitaker, well, I.
Like Langdon? OK, interesting.
I don't know. Who do you most relate to?
Probably McKay. I was going.
To say McKay for me as well. Yeah, that's interesting.
All right, let us know who you love from the show.
Give us your top five in the comments if you're listening on
Spotify or shoot us an e-mail. Don't forget to follow our
TikTok, all the socials in the description of this episode.
Patreon for free members for free episodes $5 a month and you
get access to 100 bonus episodes on the Patreon.
What else do we want to plug? What else are we doing this?
We're doing the notebook and. Romantic blockbusters, action
blockbusters, sort of. Yeah, Patreon, we're doing The
notebook. Like I just said, that is an
action blockbuster. The Notebook speed.
I can't wait to talk. About Sandra Bullock and Keanu
Reeves, My 2 loves and we're going to rewatch Miss
Congeniality. It's happening.
And then which I just recently got a shout out on Las
Culturistas, which I will talk about on that episode and The
Mummy. We also just covered for our
kind of romantic action blockbuster on the main feed,
the drama with Zendaya and Rob Pat, you're totally pitching
this the horribly. No, the pitch was we were doing.
Romantic blockbuster month. For the drama which is we picked
3 sub genres of romantic movies which are like the timeless kind
of like archetypal is the word archetypal level outlive us
archetypical archetypal. Tell us in the comments the
notebook, which is the kind of. Basic conventional romance, but
also great, great film, great performances.
And then we have an action movie and Speed, and then we have an
adventure movie and The Mummy, which are all centered by their
romances because of the drama. Because of the drama, you know
what? I didn't pitch.
It well, either I think it's then of the of the extra credits
today. We'll be back soon with an
episode on Lee Cronin's The Mummy, which is really
pretentious title for a movie. Your name is a director and then
the Mummy. I literally actually the dead
ass I think it is. Hold on, no way, Lee Cronin's I
watched the trailer in a theatre when I went to.
Steelberg's disclosure. Day.
Lee Cronin's The Mummy or. Simply the mummy.
That's what it says in the Wikipedia.
Page. That's wild.
It is called Lee Cronin's The Mummy.
That is the official title of the film.
That's fast. It's on the poster.
This is evil dead guy. It's so I watched the trailer
and went. That looks like Evil Dead, and I
was kind of excited. I'm like.
Oh, someone did an Evil Dead meets Exorcist meets Conjuring
the Mummy. I'm this sounds awesome.
It's going to be a great 3 1/2 star movie.
And then I saw the guy made the most recent Evil Dead movie and
I was like, that makes a lot of sense.
I didn't see that. Yeah, it'll be very similar.
It's going to be gross. Can't wait.
We're. Going to do.
We're going to cover that on. Friday probably.
So I'll see you all then. Peace.
Bye.