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None. 
It's been a while. 

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Mike Eden, thank you for joining
me in the trenches. 

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German. 
It's, it's great to see your 

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face and to be speaking to you. 
My wife and I, we watched pretty

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much all your interviews. 
So you're, you're a really key 

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guy for us. 
Well, Mike, you have been a key 

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guy for me, ironically. 
Let's just quickly go back just 

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a little bit of history. 
I think you and I were 

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introduced around late 2020 by 
our mutual friend Rana. 

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Filmish. 
Shame lot's happened to him 

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also, but what's happened since 
then? 

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Oh my word, we've been through 
the washing machine and you 

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know, several psyop campaigns 
and jabs and whatever, but but 

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it's good to see that you're, 
you're still smiling. 

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One of the reasons we like to 
listen to you is that your voice

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is, is a good voice to listen 
to. 

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And you can't help but smile 
very often, which is it's rare 

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enough. 
So it's infectious too, as you 

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can see. 
Mike, I get that from Bob Moran,

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he said Once Upon a time that 
you must treat everything as if 

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it's satire. 
Yeah, it's, it's there is 

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something I'm not, I'm not any 
good at that kind of stuff. 

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But I think I try to treat 
what's going on as lightly as I 

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can whilst not hiding from the 
seriousness. 

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Because otherwise you just 
become Doctor Doom, you know, a 

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depressed person. 
Somebody said to me the other 

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day, if you, you know, if you 
hold strong negative feelings 

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inside you without any, any 
release for them, it will 

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corrode you. 
And I, I think that's probably 

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true. 
And I, I've managed to not let 

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that happen because I basically 
I focus as much as I can on 

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objective things. 
I, I don't, doesn't bother me 

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which, which particular actor is
doing what particular thing. 

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I, I don't get excited about 
individuals very much. 

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You know, who cares whether Bill
Gates is Bill Gates or somebody 

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else's? 
They'll be replaced periodically

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by other marionettes dangled in 
front of us. 

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So yeah, it's the I try to stay 
focused on what's happening, to 

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be clear about the biggest 
risks, occasionally delving into

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detail to try and bolster the 
idea that I'm not completely mad

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because a lot of people think 
I'm completely mad. 

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Yeah. 
And, you know, my wife keeps me 

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saying as well. 
And we, we, we're good at 

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laughing. 
So, you know, let's follow your 

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lead on that too. 
You know, life, life's a mixture

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of some horrible seriousness and
absurdity at the same time. 

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So I'm I'm with Bob and it's 
absurd. 

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I remember when when, when Rana 
introduced us and, and he said 

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in his email to me, there's a 
scientist. 

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I really, really want to 
introduce you to him. 

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And it got me thinking. 
Mike, is science dead? 

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No, it's a very good, it's a 
very good question. 

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No, I wouldn't say it's, it 
isn't dead because doing science

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or, or looking at things 
scientifically is, is a process 

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anyone can learn to do. 
And a friend of mine describes 

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it as never pretending to know 
something that you don't, you 

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know, in a recent interview, I 
pointed out that that we've got 

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at least two kinds of knowledge,
maybe more. 

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But these two are very clear to 
me. 

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Things you know because you've 
done them yourself. 

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You've put your hands on them, 
you you've wrestled with 

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whatever The thing is. 
You may fire a gun or planted A 

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crop or whatever it is, cut some
wood up. 

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You know those things from 
experience. 

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And then there's all the rest 
someone told you and you chose 

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to believe them. 
And I've challenged people and 

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I've said that I've had to be 
honest with myself and accept 

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that probably like 95%, maybe 
more of what I think I know 

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belongs to that second category.
And I can't, I haven't got 

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enough processing power to go 
and examine everything that's in

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there that I think is knowledge.
But when I Draw Something that I

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didn't, you know, out of the 
library of Mike's memory and I'm

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trying to apply it to some 
problem, I think, do you know 

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that? 
Or was that a story which you've

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accepted uncritically? 
And that's one of our biggest 

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problems. 
I recently came across the 

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phrase preferred. 
Is it preferred reality? 

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Some, I think it's preferred 
reality. 

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It's a NATO phrase. 
And I saw it in the context of 

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some disclosures that NATO had 
essentially been running in the 

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EU or large numbers of countries
we would think of as in in 

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Europe. 
And they were given instructions

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to say this is a public health 
emergency, but it's going to be 

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run as if it was a military op. 
It requires these kind of 

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capabilities and we're going to 
tell you what you need to tell 

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the people. 
And we've all got to do the same

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kind of thing just to keep the, 
the, the story straight. 

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And they said it's for good 
reasons, but they use the phrase

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repeatedly that when we tell you
these things and you're to tell 

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your population these things, 
it's to impose our preferred 

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reality. 
And I thought, God, that's, 

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that's the, that's the 
difficulty I face when I speak 

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to somebody who believes the 
narrative. 

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They're, they're living in a, in
a, a different plane somehow 

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because they, they, they may 
know 50 or 250 things that I 

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know are lies or I've examined 
many of them and discovered that

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they're false and but they don't
know that. 

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And so when I pop in and say, 
you know, things like there, 

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there wasn't a pandemic, just a 
lie about it and a deliberately 

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inappropriate diagnostic test to
to give the numbers. 

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And then unfortunately, people 
died in care homes and hospitals

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and they, their deaths were 
attributed to this disease. 

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And there's your pandemic and 
they go nonsense. 

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I know lots of people who 
whatever, you know, I have 

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people who worked in hospitals. 
They'd have told me if that was 

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happening. 
But The thing is, the people in 

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hospitals, I've heard from other
people who are, who worked in 

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intensive care, who were not 
trained intensivists. 

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They were, they were like 
General Medical staff, but they 

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got assigned to these newly 
opened intensive care beds and 

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they came in as plastic sheets 
hanging from the ceiling. 

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Everybody's gowned up with 
gloves and CBRN suits. 

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They look at each other and they
can see terror in the other 

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staff's eyes and they're 
signalling what to do next on 

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the protocol and then nipping 
out of the room again. 

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So I'm sure when they came home,
it was eerie. 

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There were 12 people in the 
room, all silent because they'd 

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all been sedated, intubated and 
ventilated. 

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All I could hear was the history
of the machines and one by one 

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the heart traces went off. 
Just imagine how terrifying that

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would be. 
We were doing all we could, we 

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followed all the instructions 
and they were just dying. 

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When that person comes out and 
tells their partner or their 

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friends, they're reinforcing the
preferred, preferred reality. 

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But in practise, none of those 
people should have been on 

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ventilators. 
It's I don't know if I explained

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this last time. 
So I'm a, I'm a research 

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scientist, not a doctor, but 
I've worked in the field of 

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respiratory for pretty much 40 
years, just under 40 years. 

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Yeah, 40 years. 
This year my PhD was in 

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respiratory depression and 
opiates. 

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So I just classified. 
So when we breathe in, we draw, 

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our diaphragm is contracted and 
so it falls downwards towards 

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your abdomen and we swing our 
chest muscles forward and 

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upwards. 
And those two things together 

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make your chest into a bellows. 
There's negative pressure 

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between the inner wall of your 
chest and the outside of your 

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lungs. 
So and so as a result of that 

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reduced pressure, air flies into
your airway, through your open 

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airway all the way down. 
So here is my contention. 

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Germans for the listeners, no 
patient with an intact 

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unobstructed airway. 
So a hole all the way from the 

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mouth down to the bottom of the 
lungs and with an intact chest 

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wall. 
They've not been crushed, shot 

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or stabbed, paralysed or hit on 
the head, so they're able to 

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produce rhythmic respiratory 
movements and the air will go in

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and out. 
No person like that should ever 

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be sedated, intubated and 
ventilated. 

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Why? 
Because when you ventilate, you 

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do it naturally. 
You produce that negative 

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00:09:01,280 --> 00:09:05,040
pressure and the air flows in 
nicely and inflates your lungs 

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gently, and then the reverse 
happens on exhalation. 

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It's not true with a ventilator.
With a ventilator you're being 

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blown up like a balloon. 
Now it's not as gross as you 

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heaving away on a birthday 
balloon, but that's what you 

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have to do. 
You have to mount a considerable

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intra tracheal pressure, the 
opening pressure to begin to 

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inflate your chest and lift your
chest up against its weight and 

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keep pumping the air in until 
you've got whatever the required

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tidal volume is, which is 
usually half a litre or so. 

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And then when that machine goes 
off, then your, your chest 

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collapses and outcomes the air. 
Well, when you do that, it's an 

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incredibly aggressive act on the
human body. 

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You're pumping it up, letting it
collapse, pumping it up, letting

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it collapse. 
That's the reverse of your 

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00:09:54,040 --> 00:09:56,120
normal Physiology for your 
entire life. 

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That process of pressure and 
then collapse tends to produce 

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00:10:02,800 --> 00:10:05,680
lung injury. 
Eventually water starts leaking 

169
00:10:05,680 --> 00:10:09,440
out of damaged blood vessels and
you get an edemitus lung. 

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It's called AC lactase. 
It's gradually the most 

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00:10:12,080 --> 00:10:15,320
peripheral areas of your lungs 
start to fill with water and 

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what happens is the pressure 
required to ventilate you 

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steadily rises and rises and 
it's you're on, you are on a one

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00:10:22,800 --> 00:10:27,200
way tickets to death. 
So and you need very skilled 

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00:10:27,720 --> 00:10:30,480
internists. 
They call it flying the patient 

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because they're measuring 
they're monitoring the volume, 

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00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:37,000
the rate at which they inflate 
you, the pressure at end 

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00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:39,520
expiration. 
When you breathe out, you don't 

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breathe out fully, right? 
If I breathe out, I can breathe 

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out another litre easily. 
So you don't go to the bottom. 

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00:10:47,240 --> 00:10:49,880
But if you're lying on your back
unconscious and the machine just

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00:10:49,880 --> 00:10:54,200
goes off, your chest collapses. 
So you need to apply a positive 

183
00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:58,200
end expiratory pressure, it's 
called PEEP, and that's adjusted

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00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:03,080
by the internist in whatever 
intensivist. 

185
00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:06,160
So there's multiple dials you're
playing with. 

186
00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:10,000
It's a very complicated machine 
that they cost, I don't know, 

187
00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:12,680
10s of thousands of dollars, 
maybe hundreds of thousands. 

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00:11:12,920 --> 00:11:15,320
They're built by hand at the 
race of a few a week and a 

189
00:11:15,320 --> 00:11:17,280
couple of factories in Germany, 
in Switzerland. 

190
00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:19,880
So you could never have ordered 
30,000. 

191
00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:22,000
That's a joke. 
I knew that. 

192
00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:25,120
I knew there weren't that many 
in there weren't that many in 

193
00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:28,080
inventory anywhere in the world,
nor could they be provided this 

194
00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:31,080
side of the following year. 
I know this, I've seen these, 

195
00:11:31,080 --> 00:11:36,120
I've used them. 
So if you take a person who 

196
00:11:36,120 --> 00:11:40,640
might be having a panic attack, 
maybe they have got a cough and 

197
00:11:40,640 --> 00:11:43,840
they're hyperventilating, their 
eyes are rolling in their heads,

198
00:11:43,840 --> 00:11:48,560
their heart rate's ready and 200
or 150 and their blood gases are

199
00:11:48,560 --> 00:11:51,880
all over the place. 
You don't sedate, intubate and 

200
00:11:51,880 --> 00:11:53,840
ventilate because they'll 
probably die, which is what 

201
00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:58,560
happens in 95% of them. 
What you should do is calm them 

202
00:11:58,560 --> 00:12:02,880
down, take a proper examination,
you know, tapping their chest, 

203
00:12:02,880 --> 00:12:06,080
listening to their chest. 
You know, it's auscultation, I 

204
00:12:06,080 --> 00:12:08,800
think. 
And they use a stethoscope and 

205
00:12:08,800 --> 00:12:11,520
they, after a while they'll 
conclude this person is not 

206
00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:14,800
injured, but they're clearly in 
a state of heightened anxiety. 

207
00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:18,800
You might prescribe the lowest 
dose of an anxiolytic one time. 

208
00:12:19,240 --> 00:12:21,120
It's amazing. 
If you've ever had a panic 

209
00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:24,720
attack, which I did as a 30 year
old, the tiniest dose of an 

210
00:12:24,720 --> 00:12:27,480
anxiolytic just dissolves your 
anxiety. 

211
00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:29,760
And 20 minutes later, you're 
looking at the ceiling and 

212
00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:32,160
everybody looking at you and you
go, what? 

213
00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:33,600
It's like, what? 
And they're going, are you all 

214
00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:35,560
right? 
It's like, yeah, what's going 

215
00:12:35,560 --> 00:12:37,160
on? 
It's like, well, you were off 

216
00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:39,880
your head, Mike, you, you were 
crying. 

217
00:12:39,880 --> 00:12:41,200
You're rolling around on the 
floor. 

218
00:12:41,480 --> 00:12:43,720
He said you couldn't breathe 
anyway. 

219
00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:47,800
So this is what happens when you
if you're if you lose it and 

220
00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:50,400
you're whatever, you get 
overwhelmed by events. 

221
00:12:50,400 --> 00:12:55,320
Sometimes it can be fear or 
grief or, or the television's 

222
00:12:55,320 --> 00:12:57,440
told you you could catch this 
virus and die. 

223
00:12:58,120 --> 00:13:01,600
And people were rolling up at 
hospitals and I think a lot of 

224
00:13:01,600 --> 00:13:06,160
them were in a state of panic 
that the people assessing them 

225
00:13:06,200 --> 00:13:07,680
thought, Oh my God, they've got 
COVID. 

226
00:13:07,680 --> 00:13:09,240
Look at this. 
Their heart rates, heart's 

227
00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:11,720
racing, can't calm. 
They're breathing down. 

228
00:13:11,880 --> 00:13:14,120
They're telling me they can't 
breathe, they're short of air. 

229
00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:16,960
Get them on the ventilator. 
What they should have done is 

230
00:13:17,560 --> 00:13:19,920
take a proper history, if 
appropriate, the lowest dose of 

231
00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:23,320
an anxiolytic cup of tea. 
Kindly hand on the arm or come 

232
00:13:23,320 --> 00:13:26,720
and see you later in 20 minutes,
dear, you know, and then, oh, 

233
00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:28,440
I'm feeling. 
And then if, if you need, if 

234
00:13:28,440 --> 00:13:30,400
you're feeling a bit breath, 
just take a breath of this 

235
00:13:30,400 --> 00:13:32,840
little mask. 
It's got like a little extra 

236
00:13:32,840 --> 00:13:35,200
oxygen for you and we'll come 
and check you again. 

237
00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:38,520
I reckon 95% of the patients, 
90% would have just gone home. 

238
00:13:39,360 --> 00:13:43,640
But these people were recruited 
into a preferred reality. 

239
00:13:43,920 --> 00:13:47,880
And I think initially, and I 
always thought this, I think 

240
00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:52,120
initially most of the medical 
staff were also induced into 

241
00:13:52,120 --> 00:13:56,000
this preferred reality and and 
therefore went on unknowingly to

242
00:13:56,000 --> 00:13:59,800
kill their patients. 
I'm sure the senior 

243
00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:04,120
pulmonologist damn well knew 
because I knew as a non doctor 

244
00:14:04,760 --> 00:14:07,560
that this is wrong. 
You know, I knew as a non doctor

245
00:14:07,560 --> 00:14:11,120
this is wrong. 
People might say this is crazy. 

246
00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:13,040
It doesn't. 
Might know that these 

247
00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:15,720
ventilators are life saving. 
Yeah, of course they are. 

248
00:14:15,800 --> 00:14:19,000
You know, if you've had head 
injury or drug overdose. 

249
00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:20,760
So you're not breathing properly
on your own. 

250
00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:23,400
Your normal respiratory rhythm 
is gone or threaded. 

251
00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:25,040
You don't get them on a 
ventilator. 

252
00:14:25,040 --> 00:14:27,960
They're gonna die. 
If they've had a chest injury, 

253
00:14:27,960 --> 00:14:30,840
Pneumothorax, it's called, where
you've got a RIP in that chest 

254
00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:32,880
wall. 
So you try and breathe in and 

255
00:14:32,960 --> 00:14:35,560
air just goes into the through 
the slit in your chest. 

256
00:14:36,280 --> 00:14:38,920
So if you've been stabbed, you 
know, you've got to cover that. 

257
00:14:38,920 --> 00:14:41,360
You won't be able to breathe in.
If you just leave it uncovered, 

258
00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:44,840
you'll get this air whizzing in 
and out your chest and you'll 

259
00:14:44,840 --> 00:14:46,640
just die. 
So yeah. 

260
00:14:46,640 --> 00:14:51,480
And then if you want planned 
surgery, you know, I think most 

261
00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:54,840
people who have complex coronary
bypass probably go on a 

262
00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:58,760
ventilator, or at least it's 
available for them during the 24

263
00:14:58,760 --> 00:15:01,680
hours of recovery. 
Major surgery anywhere in the 

264
00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:03,400
body, that's going to take 8 
hours. 

265
00:15:03,440 --> 00:15:06,240
You're going to be so deeply 
sedated, you're probably going 

266
00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:08,560
to be ventilating you. 
And then the last category I 

267
00:15:08,560 --> 00:15:13,080
think of is people who've come 
in with such appalling injuries,

268
00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:17,320
like all four long bones broken,
you know, after a fall, a 

269
00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:20,400
parachute accident or they've 
been burned, you know, a third 

270
00:15:20,400 --> 00:15:22,880
of their bodies burns second or 
third degree. 

271
00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:28,240
And the only thing you can do is
sort of to try and relieve them 

272
00:15:28,240 --> 00:15:30,000
of pain if you deeply sedate 
them. 

273
00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:33,680
And then you might put them on a
ventilator until they can be 

274
00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:36,680
assessed and so on. 
Other than that, yeah. 

275
00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:40,720
And don't take walk in patients 
who've got an unblocked airway 

276
00:15:40,720 --> 00:15:42,800
and then attack chest or you 
don't sedate. 

277
00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:47,160
Incubate ventilator, ladies and 
gentlemen, in every hospital, 

278
00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:49,480
every major hospital in every 
country in the West. 

279
00:15:49,800 --> 00:15:51,760
That's what happened to your 
relatives when they went in. 

280
00:15:52,760 --> 00:15:55,840
So that's part of the fraud. 
And I, I only referred to 

281
00:15:55,880 --> 00:16:00,040
because, Jim, we were talking 
about a new phrase for me that I

282
00:16:00,040 --> 00:16:04,600
learned from someone who'd been 
reading the NATO Population 

283
00:16:04,600 --> 00:16:08,080
Control Handbook or whatever. 
It wasn't called that, but they 

284
00:16:08,080 --> 00:16:12,400
were describing instructions 
given to ministers of all of the

285
00:16:12,560 --> 00:16:17,720
like the major countries. 
You may find a video of I think 

286
00:16:17,720 --> 00:16:20,680
it's the defence minister or the
home secretary of the Dutch 

287
00:16:20,680 --> 00:16:22,200
government. 
And the lady is at the 

288
00:16:22,200 --> 00:16:27,080
microphone saying I didn't want 
to have to do the things I have 

289
00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:30,240
to do. 
But yeah, but it was for the 

290
00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:32,400
best and and I didn't feel good 
about it. 

291
00:16:32,400 --> 00:16:37,840
So what the NATO people had said
was this is a major emergency. 

292
00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:39,520
We need to run it like a 
military op. 

293
00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:43,920
We need to impose on the 
population our preferred reality

294
00:16:44,680 --> 00:16:47,920
and the reason I stuck in my 
mind, I think I only read it a 

295
00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:52,960
day or so ago is my God, that's 
where your friends and family 

296
00:16:52,960 --> 00:16:56,520
and relatives that you can't 
reach there in this preferred 

297
00:16:56,520 --> 00:17:00,920
reality that was imposed on them
by through the media and through

298
00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:03,200
governments and and these 
screens and everything. 

299
00:17:04,040 --> 00:17:08,920
I escaped it because by at most 
late spring 2020, I just 

300
00:17:08,920 --> 00:17:10,720
thought, hello, pops and all 
your houses. 

301
00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:14,480
And I turned off all, all news 
media, including alternative 

302
00:17:14,480 --> 00:17:18,440
news media, because I concluded 
quite quickly that a lot of 

303
00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:22,359
those, voluntarily or not, 
weren't really on our side. 

304
00:17:22,359 --> 00:17:26,520
They were, they were revealing 
some information that was true. 

305
00:17:26,520 --> 00:17:30,080
They generally didn't lie, but 
they would hang back on, for 

306
00:17:30,080 --> 00:17:32,880
example, no one would have told 
you what I just did, you know, 

307
00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:34,960
no one medical would tell you 
that. 

308
00:17:36,720 --> 00:17:40,240
And yeah, so that people ended 
up in a reinforced preferred 

309
00:17:40,240 --> 00:17:44,760
reality if they escaped the A 
grade, which is watching the BBC

310
00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:47,360
or Reuters, if they escaped from
that because they were 

311
00:17:47,360 --> 00:17:52,360
suspicious, they fell into the 
net of the Level 1 alternatives 

312
00:17:52,360 --> 00:17:54,600
who were not lying to them 
mostly, but they were not 

313
00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:57,240
telling the whole truth. 
And only the few people, 

314
00:17:57,240 --> 00:18:00,120
difficult people like you and 
me, just thought this doesn't 

315
00:18:00,120 --> 00:18:02,240
make any sense. 
You know, I'm going to go and 

316
00:18:02,240 --> 00:18:05,240
explore. 
We've jumped out of the basket 

317
00:18:05,240 --> 00:18:08,800
and I don't know how far you 
fall, but there's another level,

318
00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:14,280
which is what's his name, David 
A Hughes, who's a international 

319
00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:18,480
relations scholar or was before 
he left university, professor 

320
00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:20,320
position. 
He was interviewed by James 

321
00:18:20,640 --> 00:18:23,760
Tellingpole recently and he was 
describing the the rather 

322
00:18:23,760 --> 00:18:27,400
depressing third category. 
And I think James at this point 

323
00:18:27,400 --> 00:18:30,720
quipped it's a small club and 
there's hardly anybody in it. 

324
00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:33,840
It made me. 
Made me laugh. 

325
00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:37,240
It was a typical telling Polism.
Because that's the point you get

326
00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:40,520
to the point where you realise 
you can't trust, you can't trust

327
00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:44,920
any kind of large scale media 
organisation, whether it's one 

328
00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:46,440
that was established before or 
what. 

329
00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:49,040
Basically, once it's got money 
swirling through it and lots of 

330
00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:52,080
stuff. 
I, I, I struggle to think how 

331
00:18:52,080 --> 00:18:55,840
you would avoid being 
infiltrated and controlled. 

332
00:18:55,840 --> 00:19:00,440
At some point, you know, people 
would just come in and say it's 

333
00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:02,680
a nice studio you've got here. 
It'd be ashamed if anything 

334
00:19:02,680 --> 00:19:05,240
would have happened to it. 
Or the same about your family or

335
00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:08,400
your, your job. 
And quite quickly, I think 

336
00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:09,760
people will just do what they're
told. 

337
00:19:09,760 --> 00:19:13,720
And the only ones who won't, 
they're in this third category. 

338
00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:15,760
That's it's not a very big 
category. 

339
00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:18,800
But good thing is, I think it 
includes whatever percentage of 

340
00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:22,840
the world population knows 
they've been lied to, that we're

341
00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:26,680
fellow men and women with them. 
I don't know if you remember a 

342
00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:31,000
few years ago, you and Matthias 
Desmond both appeared alongside 

343
00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:36,760
each other on my on my show. 
And Matthias has spoken about 

344
00:19:37,880 --> 00:19:41,280
the number he generally refers 
to about 30% or around about a 

345
00:19:41,280 --> 00:19:44,560
third of all people at any given
time can see through it. 

346
00:19:45,240 --> 00:19:48,960
And I've, I've often wondered, 
Mike, why us? 

347
00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:57,560
Why are we part of that third? 
My bet is it'll be something 

348
00:19:57,560 --> 00:20:02,120
about your your nature and 
nurture and upbringing, you 

349
00:20:02,120 --> 00:20:04,600
know, it'll be something 
inherent in each of us. 

350
00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:07,720
And then something about 
upbringing. 

351
00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:13,840
So my, my by nature and people 
often got me wrong on this in my

352
00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:15,400
career. 
And when it happens, I always 

353
00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:19,040
used to smile because they see 
me as mild mannered, pretty 

354
00:20:19,040 --> 00:20:22,440
gentle, easy going, cooperative 
and so on. 

355
00:20:22,440 --> 00:20:25,440
And they, they thought, well, we
don't need to pay any attention 

356
00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:27,760
to what he thinks, you know, 
when they're working on whatever

357
00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:31,920
their Machiavellian plan was. 
But later on when basically 

358
00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:34,760
they've trod over one of my red 
lines and I just literally would

359
00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:37,640
not move, you know, to the point
that this project ends here. 

360
00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:40,360
If you're going to insist on 
that, you know, or this is the 

361
00:20:40,360 --> 00:20:43,080
end of this company, I'm not 
going to raise money if these 

362
00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:45,600
are the terms, you know. 
Oh, crikey. 

363
00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:49,200
And I, when I get to one of 
those points, I, I, I am 

364
00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:52,640
incredibly stubborn. 
Just a tiny family story. 

365
00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:55,440
It must have been, I must have 
been like this when I was tiny 

366
00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:59,080
because my my two sisters are 
both older than me. 

367
00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:02,280
So when I was like 6 or 8, they 
would be much more powerful than

368
00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:04,200
me. 
And I remember at the weekends, 

369
00:21:04,200 --> 00:21:07,120
quite often we'd be wrestling in
front of the TV or whatever. 

370
00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:09,480
Maybe all in wrestling was on 
the TV at the time. 

371
00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:12,880
My dad was a fan and my sister 
would often get me in a 

372
00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:16,560
chokehold and my dad would say, 
you have to, what is it? 

373
00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:18,560
You have to bang the floor or 
give in. 

374
00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:23,840
And my dad said, MM, give in, 
you know, bang the floor and I 

375
00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:25,800
wouldn't. 
And he said there was at least 

376
00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:29,400
one occasion where you went blue
and had to go over take the 

377
00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:31,680
sister off you and more or less 
swing you upside down. 

378
00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:34,280
I would not give in to the point
of unconsciousness. 

379
00:21:34,520 --> 00:21:38,560
I wasn't even in, you know, I 
know it's dumb, but I'm just 

380
00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:40,440
trying to answer the, the 
question. 

381
00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:42,080
So I think that's inherent in 
me. 

382
00:21:42,720 --> 00:21:45,880
And then upbringing. 
I've, I've always been just 

383
00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:48,400
incredibly inquisitive. 
I've been one of those annoying 

384
00:21:48,400 --> 00:21:50,320
kids that would say, well, why 
is that then? 

385
00:21:51,520 --> 00:21:53,320
How does that work? 
Why is that? 

386
00:21:53,320 --> 00:21:57,720
Then how do you know that? 
And I, I think I worked out 

387
00:21:58,120 --> 00:22:01,280
quite early on that we don't 
know that much about anything 

388
00:22:01,720 --> 00:22:04,800
because even people you ask, 
they get to a point of 

389
00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:08,160
irritation and, and they, they 
might snap, but then they would 

390
00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:10,440
say, look, the honest truth is 
this is, this is the best 

391
00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:14,120
explanation I have of this. 
If you want more, you're going 

392
00:22:14,120 --> 00:22:17,560
to have to go and ask an expert.
And I'm like 10 or something. 

393
00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:19,280
It's because it's not because 
I'm clever. 

394
00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:21,080
I just keep saying, oh, that's 
interesting, how do you know 

395
00:22:21,080 --> 00:22:22,920
that? 
And then they realise they don't

396
00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:28,280
know how they know that. 
So that combination of, yeah, 

397
00:22:28,280 --> 00:22:32,360
I'm, I'm very cooperative, but 
not if it goes over my red line.

398
00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:38,280
If I get to Mr Stubborn, there's
no moving me because it's wrong.

399
00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:41,120
You know, I'm not going to 
change until I know why I should

400
00:22:41,120 --> 00:22:43,960
move to action. 
And then, yeah, just a link to 

401
00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:46,280
inquisitiveness. 
Those things let me play. 

402
00:22:46,280 --> 00:22:50,120
Devil's advocate for a moment. 
You spend the greatest the 

403
00:22:50,120 --> 00:22:54,360
greater portion of your career 
in the pharmaceutical sort of 

404
00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:55,800
lanes. 
How did you? 

405
00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:57,840
How did you not see anything 
then? 

406
00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:06,360
I'm, I think I must be naive. 
I'll tell you, I was aware that 

407
00:23:06,360 --> 00:23:11,320
I think maybe there were three 
major, you know, criminal cases 

408
00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:14,880
involving my employer. 
It was two or three anyway, 

409
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:17,240
because I've worked with two or 
three large companies. 

410
00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:19,040
Welcome. 
Then blacks are welcome briefly 

411
00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:21,760
and then Pfizer. 
And so there were a number of 

412
00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:25,120
cases where, you know, Pfizer 
was fined, I think $2.3 billion 

413
00:23:25,120 --> 00:23:26,520
when a billion was a lot of 
money. 

414
00:23:27,040 --> 00:23:31,440
Now we weren't being fired, 
fined in research for anything 

415
00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:34,720
we in research have done wrong. 
The corporation was being fined 

416
00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:37,880
for we didn't quite know what, 
you know, it's like mis selling 

417
00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:42,120
or hiding safety, you know, 
hiding lack of safety 

418
00:23:42,120 --> 00:23:46,000
information. 
And I, I think naively, I never 

419
00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:53,280
attributed it to the company, 
but say over keen sales forces 

420
00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:56,360
because I know, I know there was
one fine for I think it's 

421
00:23:56,360 --> 00:23:58,560
called, is it called off label 
promotion? 

422
00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:02,000
So if you've got a drug and it's
approved for a certain migraine 

423
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:04,560
headache, you can't start 
saying, oh, it's good for all 

424
00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:06,760
headaches. 
If you've no data, you haven't 

425
00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:08,840
got it approved with the FDA for
all headaches. 

426
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:13,240
You are not allowed to imply or 
say that it's not just 

427
00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:15,000
migraines, Dr It's all 
headaches. 

428
00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:16,720
You know, something like tension
headaches as well. 

429
00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:22,640
So it's, but you can imagine 
how, how easily a sales Rep, I 

430
00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:24,800
don't know whether they still 
exist, but they did in the 90s 

431
00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:27,760
and 90s. 
You're visiting 5 doctors a day.

432
00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:29,560
You're trying to pitch this 
drug. 

433
00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:32,520
That's how it worked. 
And you try and persuade they I 

434
00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:34,640
not that I did this. 
This is what I understand. 

435
00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:38,480
They would try and persuade the 
doctor to prescribe your product

436
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:42,080
more often than the competition.
He'd leave little mementos, 

437
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:45,760
little desk ornaments, a 
reminder, and he'd want to hit 

438
00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:50,000
them with the key points. 
But you're only allowed to. 

439
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:52,320
You're not allowed to say things
that aren't true, that were 

440
00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:54,600
beyond what you've negotiated 
with FDA. 

441
00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:57,600
But I bet you people just went a
little bit over. 

442
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:00,200
But all the time. 
It's probably what they did. 

443
00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:03,800
And I imagine there was a team 
leader and then a captain of all

444
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:07,600
the team leaders that said we 
need to push on Viops or Viagra 

445
00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:10,040
this quarter. 
We're short and people wouldn't 

446
00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:12,640
know what that meant. 
So I'd just go a little bit, you

447
00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:17,840
know, don't lie, but just hint. 
And I assumed eventually that it

448
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:21,000
was, you know, basically the 
attorney general said you guys 

449
00:25:21,000 --> 00:25:25,720
have systematically and 
persistently failed to comply 

450
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:28,720
with what you agree with. 
FDA fine, guilty, you know, it's

451
00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:30,160
criminal. 
You're not allowed to do this. 

452
00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:35,320
So you I didn't know. 
Now, I mean, I don't know for 

453
00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:39,640
sure, but looking at what the 
corporation's done, knowing that

454
00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:44,880
the CEO is a respondent in 
various court cases, it's not 

455
00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:46,760
this person isn't. 
I'm not just managing the 

456
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:50,480
corporation. 
They know what's going on. 

457
00:25:50,480 --> 00:25:52,480
They know that what's been 
shipped out of their 

458
00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:58,040
organisation were not vaccines. 
You know, the Albert Baller is, 

459
00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:01,000
is a veterinarian, but he's a 
clever guy. 

460
00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:03,240
You know, he's been in applied 
science for decades. 

461
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:07,480
I would say to people, he knows 
what I know, right? 

462
00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:11,360
I, I've never had to use 
anything more than basic 

463
00:26:11,360 --> 00:26:16,600
knowledge in my field, like the 
ventilation stuff. 

464
00:26:16,600 --> 00:26:18,840
If you, if you had, if you were 
to have lectures on how to 

465
00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:20,960
ventilate a person, it'd 
probably be in the 1st chapter. 

466
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:26,080
All this stuff, how Long's work,
why ventilation is necessary but

467
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:28,320
inherently dangerous. 
So you have to watch out for 

468
00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:30,080
these things and then we'll get 
into the practise. 

469
00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:34,920
So there's no possibility that 
he doesn't know that if these 

470
00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:37,920
injections did what they said on
the tin, that is there were 

471
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:42,680
genetic code that made your body
form a protein according to that

472
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:45,880
code that it wouldn't trigger 
autoimmune attacks in every 

473
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:48,160
cell. 
He knows that he's a clever guy.

474
00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:52,120
So whether that's what went out 
or not, he was the captain of 

475
00:26:52,120 --> 00:26:56,040
the company that shipped 10s of 
well known billions probably of 

476
00:26:56,040 --> 00:27:00,360
doses in this material. 
Also, he knows that you cannot, 

477
00:27:01,360 --> 00:27:03,640
you know, the expression, 
politically incorrect 

478
00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:06,000
expression. 
You can't make a baby in one 

479
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:10,320
month with 9 women. 
My head of chemistry used to use

480
00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:14,200
that expression because it's, 
it's one of the better ones, you

481
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:16,280
see. 
And they said, oh, you can't say

482
00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:17,400
that. 
He says, we'll come up with a 

483
00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:18,760
better analogy then. 
Anyway. 

484
00:27:19,120 --> 00:27:22,000
So The thing is, it doesn't 
matter how much results you 

485
00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:26,440
throw at the process of 
development and manufacturing of

486
00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:29,840
a complex product. 
It can't be done in 10 months. 

487
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:33,200
Whatever it was a friend who 
works his whole life in 

488
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:37,480
manufacturing quality. 
You know the the the tests for 

489
00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:41,520
evaluating whether you've made 
it each step, what you intended 

490
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,400
to make and what the impurities 
are before and after 

491
00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:47,480
purification. 
Each step has to have all of 

492
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:51,720
those tests validated. 
So you have to check that things

493
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:53,680
don't interfere with them, that 
they're very that they're 

494
00:27:53,680 --> 00:27:56,920
precise and reproducible. 
And you negotiate with the 

495
00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:59,640
regulator and you show them what
they're doing and they go, that 

496
00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:03,200
looks a reasonable protocol. 
Or we don't think you should use

497
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:05,960
gas chromatography because of 
their very large molecular 

498
00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:08,600
weight species. 
You should use or in addition 

499
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:11,560
mass spectrometry or something. 
It's a negotiation. 

500
00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:16,600
And he said the manufacturing 
methods of validation and 

501
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:19,480
agreement with regulators would 
take between one and two years. 

502
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:23,400
That's just for the 
measurements, what tests you do 

503
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:26,640
and then how to show that those 
tests are being done properly 

504
00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:29,440
and capable of telling you, 
steering you through the 

505
00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:32,920
manufacturing process so that 
you can believe quality control.

506
00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:34,880
At the end. 
He said one to two years. 

507
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:38,960
Well, they have a few weeks. 
So I know they did not do what 

508
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:41,440
they said. 
You can't do it in 10 months. 

509
00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:45,240
And they didn't do when you, 
when you develop a drug, you 

510
00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:48,840
make a small amount, you do some
initial animal toxicology or 

511
00:28:48,840 --> 00:28:52,400
whatever test you're going to do
in test tubes, if that's OK, you

512
00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:55,480
make a bit more. 
And then maybe you'll dose your 

513
00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:57,640
animals for what's called 
regulatory tox. 

514
00:28:57,640 --> 00:28:59,880
So you might dose them for three
months, something like that. 

515
00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:01,760
You might make various 
measurements. 

516
00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:05,120
That process alone that I've 
just described is way more than 

517
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:08,480
a year's worth of work, even if 
you go to the most professional 

518
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:12,480
contract research outlets. 
I know I did it as recently as 

519
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:16,760
2016 as CEO of a biotech. 
I had to negotiate these with my

520
00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:19,200
colleagues. 
You can't do so. 

521
00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:22,120
That's just the tox. 
And then phase one, you have to,

522
00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:24,600
you have to do single dose dose 
escalation in healthy 

523
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:27,200
volunteers. 
We would reckon that entire 

524
00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:29,960
process of getting ethics 
approval, getting the protocol, 

525
00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:33,200
getting ethics approved 
approval, either recruiting 

526
00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:36,560
centres, they might be hospitals
or if you have an in house unit,

527
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:39,400
you might do it in house. 
And then doing the dosing, 

528
00:29:39,800 --> 00:29:41,680
getting all the measurements 
you're looking at safety, 

529
00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:44,840
toleration, pharmacokinetics and
writing that up. 

530
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:48,640
That alone is about a year in 
big pharma with its pedals in 

531
00:29:48,640 --> 00:29:50,880
the metal, right? 
I know that. 

532
00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:53,640
So you could you shorten it. 
Yeah, you could probably shorten

533
00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:57,040
that even to three months, but 
you haven't got three months. 

534
00:29:57,040 --> 00:29:59,000
I've just told you, you need one
to two years just for the 

535
00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:02,160
manufacturing methods. 
So I knew, ladies and gentlemen,

536
00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:05,560
and I maintain to this day that 
what they've told you they have 

537
00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:08,720
made is not possible in the time
they made it. 

538
00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:14,040
So either A, they made it before
the event, which is not good, is

539
00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:15,160
it? 
If they made it before the 

540
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:18,320
event, then they've simulated 
the event, or they've released 

541
00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:20,000
something at you which we could 
come back to. 

542
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:22,520
But neither of those are good, 
right? 

543
00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:25,440
Or what? 
They didn't make what they said,

544
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:28,000
but they've jabbed 6 billion 
people. 

545
00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:31,360
I'm not sure whether you should 
like either of those two things.

546
00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:35,360
You don't need to be highly 
sophisticated to know that what 

547
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:38,160
I just tell you told you is 
true. 

548
00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:41,000
It's verifiable. 
You could, if you've made some 

549
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:43,840
notes, you could go and even ask
Grok or something and it will 

550
00:30:43,840 --> 00:30:46,560
tell you the same thing. 
What's the typical time to do XY

551
00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:51,200
and Z? 
So I, I, I've told people I'm, 

552
00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:52,960
I'm kind of almost bored with 
talking. 

553
00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:55,640
Not, not that you can tell from 
this, but giving these 

554
00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:59,760
interviews, I have nothing new 
to say, but it's obvious 

555
00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:03,080
thoughts as a pandemic. 
I always refer to Dennis 

556
00:31:03,080 --> 00:31:05,200
Rancour, who I think you've 
spoken to. 

557
00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:08,800
Yeah. 
And he's, he is one of the more 

558
00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:11,560
scientific people. 
I'm capable of being a 

559
00:31:11,560 --> 00:31:14,040
scientist, but I always say I'm 
trying to investigate a damn 

560
00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:16,160
crime scene, not trying to write
a paper. 

561
00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:18,720
You know, I'm just like an 
ordinary person. 

562
00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:20,800
I'm just using what the skills 
and knowledge I've got. 

563
00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:24,560
But then this is in addition to 
that is working with colleagues 

564
00:31:24,560 --> 00:31:28,120
and painstakingly writing 
hundred page monographs, you 

565
00:31:28,120 --> 00:31:30,360
know, And so there was no 
pandemic. 

566
00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:34,040
There's no hints of 1. 
And the, the, the recent thing I

567
00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:37,800
say is that you can't declare a 
crisis unless there's a sign of 

568
00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:40,480
a crisis somewhere beforehand, 
which you might not be able to 

569
00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:42,920
see, but someone level up might 
be able to see. 

570
00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:46,160
So if someone's saying there's a
forest fires coming towards your

571
00:31:46,160 --> 00:31:49,800
city, someone's got to smell 
smoke, smoke or sea flames. 

572
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:52,720
If there's an imminent shark 
attack on a beach, someone's 

573
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:56,000
seen the fin. 
If there's if there's a supposed

574
00:31:56,000 --> 00:31:59,960
pandemic coming, some people 
somewhere have got to have been 

575
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:04,120
ill in greater numbers and died.
And when they didn't anywhere 

576
00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:07,960
and then they said there was a 
crisis and then they started 

577
00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:11,640
dying so that no vaccines, no 
pandemic. 

578
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:13,600
And then it just gets worse from
there. 

579
00:32:14,360 --> 00:32:17,120
Yeah, I'm with you. 
I mean, I I was pretty much red 

580
00:32:17,120 --> 00:32:20,560
pulled after after chatting to 
Denis. 

581
00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:24,200
By the way, it's Denis with a 
silent S because he's Canadian 

582
00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:27,680
and French. 
So you must you must sound 

583
00:32:27,680 --> 00:32:29,720
fancied Mike. 
Well. 

584
00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:33,000
I yes, I usually do both so that
people can spell phonetically. 

585
00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:37,160
But yeah, Denis Ancour. 
But it's it's I'm also bored of 

586
00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:38,960
talking about COVID and the 
mechanics of it. 

587
00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:41,680
I mean, I agree with you 
completely, but it does create 

588
00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:45,120
the framework for something that
a previous guest of mine, 

589
00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:47,960
Jessica Hockett, very funnily 
said. 

590
00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:52,200
She said, I started looking at 
the, the the New York hospital 

591
00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:56,080
data in 2020 and I found myself 
asking if man actually landed on

592
00:32:56,080 --> 00:33:04,000
the moon. 
That's precisely, yes, that's 

593
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:06,040
precisely my journey also. 
Quite. 

594
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:09,000
Quickly you realise that, well, 
I'm not being told the truth 

595
00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:11,160
here, I'm not being told the 
truth there. 

596
00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:13,360
And I've listened to somebody 
else who sounds like he knows 

597
00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:16,840
what he's doing and he's 
revealed two other dirty great 

598
00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:19,240
lies. 
So it's like what is true? 

599
00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:23,840
My general rule of thumb now, 
which has nearly got me into 

600
00:33:23,840 --> 00:33:25,400
trouble. 
I'll try it with you. 

601
00:33:26,640 --> 00:33:30,840
Anything that is of at least 
moderate importance, I know 

602
00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:33,840
that's a bit of a fluffy one, 
but we know anything that's of 

603
00:33:33,840 --> 00:33:37,720
least moderate importance in 
that everyone's been told is a 

604
00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:42,160
lie, yes. 
Yeah, so my, my in inversion. 

605
00:33:43,360 --> 00:33:47,440
Yeah, my good friend Nick 
Hudson, he he he said something 

606
00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:51,320
very similar. 
He said anything that's big is a

607
00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:54,160
lie. 
Yeah, I remember him saying 

608
00:33:54,160 --> 00:33:54,440
that. 
Yeah. 

609
00:33:54,440 --> 00:33:57,760
The Hudson conjecture, I think 
it was that anything that's 

610
00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:03,200
declared as a global emergency 
that's only susceptible to 

611
00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:08,239
global solutions and census 
competing voices is a scam. 

612
00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:11,880
I think that that may have been 
roughly his first use. 

613
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:15,080
And it's just so beautiful 
because when you point it out to

614
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:19,440
people, you know, they would 
say, oh, well, you know, surely 

615
00:34:19,440 --> 00:34:21,920
there must have been alternative
voices. 

616
00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:24,040
No, there weren't. 
You know, you weren't allowed to

617
00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:27,840
have an alternative voice. 
And just immediately you either 

618
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:30,480
complying or what are you a 
conspiracy theorist? 

619
00:34:30,639 --> 00:34:33,560
I'm a proud conspiracy realist 
now. 

620
00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:37,280
But yeah, you get, I get bored 
even when spotting them. 

621
00:34:37,600 --> 00:34:39,639
I don't care what the shape of 
the world is either. 

622
00:34:39,639 --> 00:34:42,600
I mean, you know, let's see that
one is 1. 

623
00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:46,239
Where, ah, does does that mean 
Mike believes in Flat Earth? 

624
00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:49,520
Because we say that. 
Well, because the shape of the 

625
00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:52,159
world, I think is apparent. 
Well, what they want you to 

626
00:34:52,159 --> 00:34:55,320
believe is apparent. 
BBC even has a spinning globe as

627
00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:57,160
a logo. 
They used to anyway. 

628
00:34:57,160 --> 00:35:00,560
BBC at the bottom, so it's of 
moderate importance at least, 

629
00:35:00,840 --> 00:35:05,120
and everyone's been told so by 
my own definition, it's a lie. 

630
00:35:05,400 --> 00:35:08,680
But The thing is, the opposite 
of a sphere is not a flat plain,

631
00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:10,320
so I don't know what shape it 
is. 

632
00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:14,320
Could be a moatless strip, I 
don't know. 

633
00:35:14,680 --> 00:35:15,800
It's not. 
Just give me. 

634
00:35:17,400 --> 00:35:20,280
Before we go any further, Mike, 
there's a strange humming or 

635
00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:22,440
buzzing sound. 
Is it coming from your side? 

636
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:24,040
I think it. 
Might be the fan. 

637
00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:28,160
Yeah, it's the fan. 
Oh, OK. 

638
00:35:28,160 --> 00:35:28,920
All right. 
That's fine. 

639
00:35:29,120 --> 00:35:31,280
I wonder whether it's because 
I've got it sitting on a hard 

640
00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:36,600
surface and if I put it on two 
blocks to allow it to, it may be

641
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:38,680
I'm suffocating. 
It's killing capacity. 

642
00:35:38,680 --> 00:35:42,320
Hold on, I've got it sitting on 
a box. 

643
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:43,680
I don't. 
I haven't got anything as 

644
00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:45,520
sophisticated as a computer 
stand. 

645
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:52,040
What the COVID era showed me, 
Mike, is the ability to question

646
00:35:52,040 --> 00:35:53,400
everything that we think we 
know. 

647
00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:56,200
But it's an extremely 
uncomfortable process. 

648
00:35:56,400 --> 00:36:01,600
Yeah. 
Yeah, it's, I find it less 

649
00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:05,640
uncomfortable now because I've 
had years to be aware that the 

650
00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:08,360
world isn't the way up. 
I thought it was, you know, on 

651
00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:13,800
all the, all the things in it. 
But I'm no longer frightened by 

652
00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:16,800
it in any way. 
I think I was very, yeah, I was 

653
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:21,360
very upset by the end of 2020. 
And then I had my religious 

654
00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:26,560
encounter in the middle of 2021,
which was, I don't know, a 

655
00:36:26,560 --> 00:36:29,440
belief that I, what I was doing 
was looking into the face of 

656
00:36:29,440 --> 00:36:32,600
evil when I was speaking out. 
And that's why I was doing it. 

657
00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:37,840
But on the other hand, it was 
important to do it. 

658
00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:41,280
And really I was getting the 
spiritual equivalence of a kick 

659
00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:44,200
up the backside. 
Really it was, you know, here's 

660
00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:47,280
a, here's a gift of courage and 
resilience. 

661
00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:49,440
Get on with it. 
So, and then since then, I've 

662
00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:52,920
been, I haven't been, I wouldn't
say I found it particularly 

663
00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:54,680
disturbing. 
Mostly. 

664
00:36:54,800 --> 00:36:58,200
A lot of people do though. 
Yeah, yeah, because I was about.

665
00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:02,800
To ask you, knowing what you 
know now and and using the idiom

666
00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:06,480
ignorance is bliss, would you go
back to 2019? 

667
00:37:07,480 --> 00:37:11,600
Not if not if the situation that
we are discussing was as it is, 

668
00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:16,000
I no, I wouldn't want to go back
and be ignorant of it. 

669
00:37:17,120 --> 00:37:19,320
I wouldn't mind going. 
If I could be in a time machine 

670
00:37:19,320 --> 00:37:22,640
and go back to the time where 
this wasn't happening, yeah, 

671
00:37:22,640 --> 00:37:26,800
that would be great. 
But The thing is, I think what 

672
00:37:26,800 --> 00:37:34,880
has gone forever probably for me
is the sort of belief that, you 

673
00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:38,640
know, my faith is my own and to 
be what it'll be, which is quite

674
00:37:38,640 --> 00:37:42,320
a nice feeling in early 
retirement if you're, you know, 

675
00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:45,800
in reasonable health and 
comfortably or financially. 

676
00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:48,880
It's not. 
It was a nice feeling to, it's 

677
00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:51,320
almost like I've made it to the 
end of the race now. 

678
00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:54,200
I can run if I want but I'm not 
required to. 

679
00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:57,960
And then I'll just sort of like 
meander on through and then be 

680
00:37:57,960 --> 00:38:00,840
found one day in the workshop or
something, you know, with a 

681
00:38:00,840 --> 00:38:02,600
bunch of carburetors half 
assembled. 

682
00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:08,120
But then it's like now I realise
they really are after us and I 

683
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:11,920
don't know whether we've got 
three months, 33 years. 

684
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:16,160
That's not nice. 
And, and also, I don't know 

685
00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:19,000
whether you feel this, but 
living where I do in southern 

686
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:23,280
England and criticising the 
people I do, it does cross my 

687
00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:27,000
mind occasionally that if I was 
in their shoes, I think I would 

688
00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:29,320
have got rid of me quite a long 
time ago. 

689
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:34,360
And, and, and I did hear from, I
did hear, I did hear from 

690
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:37,960
someone who gets about 
Parliament, should we say that 

691
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:42,480
they were definitely discussing 
my name in the summer of 2020? 

692
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:44,520
Oh, they know who you are, 
right, Mike? 

693
00:38:44,520 --> 00:38:46,080
You know, that's sort of said 
like that. 

694
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:50,960
And they presumably discussed 
what to do and and there might 

695
00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:54,160
have been some that were like 
keen to, they'd be adding, I'll 

696
00:38:54,160 --> 00:38:57,520
take him out, you know, knock 
him off the road in my, you 

697
00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:00,600
know, large car. 
They could follow me out next 

698
00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:02,600
time I'm riding a motorbike, 
just run me off the road. 

699
00:39:02,720 --> 00:39:05,840
Nobody would know. 
They could have they didn't have

700
00:39:05,840 --> 00:39:09,520
to pick me up in a black 
windowed suburban and do 

701
00:39:09,520 --> 00:39:11,480
horrible things to me, although 
they could do that if they 

702
00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:13,560
wanted to. 
But I just wonder. 

703
00:39:14,520 --> 00:39:16,560
I don't know. 
It makes me think they just 

704
00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:18,560
don't care. 
I just, I don't want to be 

705
00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:22,560
murdered or arrested, but the 
fact that I'm allowed to move 

706
00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:26,520
around freely means I think TM 
honestly, they believe they've, 

707
00:39:26,600 --> 00:39:30,360
they've got me sufficiently 
circled that I'm not a problem 

708
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:34,440
because if I was, and if I was 
them, I would, I would have done

709
00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:37,120
something. 
So that I think is a reasonably 

710
00:39:37,120 --> 00:39:40,640
logical conclusion that they're 
not worried what I'm doing is 

711
00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:42,560
not bothering them, which is a 
bit depressing. 

712
00:39:43,640 --> 00:39:47,800
Mike, I'm sorry for this 
interruption, but that sound is 

713
00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:50,160
is coming through like a 
motorbike in my in my earphone. 

714
00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:52,840
I know I. 
Can hear it do you want to 

715
00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:57,840
should we take a break and. 
Why do you think it's so 

716
00:39:57,840 --> 00:40:03,000
difficult for scientists to to 
rethink what they think they 

717
00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:08,200
know? 
Yeah, I think that's not too 

718
00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:11,960
difficult to answer. 
It's if you're honest, you're 

719
00:40:12,040 --> 00:40:15,320
when you do your as it were your
best work, you know, as when I 

720
00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:18,120
was ACEO of a biotech. 
And what do you think, Doctor 

721
00:40:18,120 --> 00:40:22,080
Eaton, when I'm pontificating, 
I'm I'm saying only a few 

722
00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:25,400
sentences, but it rests on like 
30 years of thinking and 

723
00:40:25,400 --> 00:40:30,920
experimental work and reading. 
Yes, it's so if you, if a 

724
00:40:30,920 --> 00:40:34,800
scientist is then challenged 
say, excuse me, I think quite a 

725
00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:37,920
few of those foundational pieces
like that one there and those 

726
00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:40,920
right at the bottom, I don't 
think they're correct. 

727
00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:45,000
I think people are well aware 
that if they go fussing around 

728
00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:47,840
down there with a crowbar and a 
pneumatic drill, the whole 

729
00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:51,240
thing's going to go over. 
It's like they're aware that if 

730
00:40:51,240 --> 00:40:55,480
it is true what you've said that
these foundational pieces are 

731
00:40:56,000 --> 00:40:59,560
are wrong, then it doesn't take 
them long to realise that 

732
00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:02,240
everything that rests on top of 
that is potentially null and 

733
00:41:02,240 --> 00:41:04,040
void. 
And I think a lot of people are 

734
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:07,360
not willing to not willing to do
the work. 

735
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:10,440
So it's like this guy can't 
could be right, but it's just 

736
00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:13,360
that far too inconvenient. 
So in just in case he's right, 

737
00:41:13,360 --> 00:41:16,800
I'm going to ignore it, I think.
I think it's because of the way 

738
00:41:17,360 --> 00:41:20,960
you operate. 
It would be like being told as a

739
00:41:20,960 --> 00:41:23,880
sportsman that your training 
regime has always been wrong and

740
00:41:23,880 --> 00:41:26,000
you've been doing it for like 10
years. 

741
00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:30,800
You wouldn't you'd know that you
would not be able to undo the 

742
00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:33,720
effects of that training that 
you've adhered to for 10 years. 

743
00:41:33,720 --> 00:41:35,600
So you don't want to know. 
You don't want to be told at 

744
00:41:35,600 --> 00:41:39,280
this point you are where you are
in terms of physique and and 

745
00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:43,040
fitness and so on. 
But there was another one. 

746
00:41:43,120 --> 00:41:48,280
What was the other one? 
Yeah, there's, I saw, I saw a 

747
00:41:48,400 --> 00:41:50,520
YouTube video maybe four years 
ago. 

748
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:53,400
I've not been back to it. 
And it was called, I think it 

749
00:41:53,400 --> 00:41:56,640
was called the staircase of 
disbelief or it described 

750
00:41:56,640 --> 00:41:59,520
something called the staircase 
of disbelief. 

751
00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:05,000
And the ground floor that we we 
stand on initially is the the 

752
00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:07,760
preferred reality as to what the
imposed reality. 

753
00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:14,880
The first step is something you 
you're sure in your mind is, is 

754
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:16,800
a deviation from what you've 
been told. 

755
00:42:16,800 --> 00:42:21,440
So in our case, you could speak 
to many English people and say, 

756
00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:25,600
do you remember when we went to 
war with the Americans and 

757
00:42:25,600 --> 00:42:28,200
invaded Iraq? 
And they go, yes, I'll say if 

758
00:42:28,200 --> 00:42:32,080
you remember in the weeks before
that, we had various politicians

759
00:42:32,080 --> 00:42:34,800
coming on the television telling
us that Saddam Hussein has 

760
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:38,680
weapons of mass destruction that
he could unleash in 45 minutes. 

761
00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:41,120
Do you remember folks, the 45 
minutes claim? 

762
00:42:41,120 --> 00:42:46,120
And then then I think a couple 
of days before Parliament was 

763
00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:50,400
due to have a free vote and 
dossier was submitted. 

764
00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:53,640
I, I don't know that we saw this
dossier, but apparently it had 

765
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:56,800
been put together by, by 
advisers to the politicians. 

766
00:42:56,800 --> 00:43:01,120
So they're not military people. 
And it contains numerous claims 

767
00:43:01,120 --> 00:43:04,040
that people said were just 
simply not true, including the, 

768
00:43:04,240 --> 00:43:07,640
the 45 minutes claim. 
And so you when you take people 

769
00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:12,520
through that history, I'll say, 
so would you accept that our 

770
00:43:12,520 --> 00:43:16,440
government lied to us, lied to 
us through the television so 

771
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:21,840
that it could send, you know, 
many material to Iran, Iraq, 

772
00:43:22,480 --> 00:43:25,720
after which they killed them and
that a million innocent men and 

773
00:43:25,720 --> 00:43:28,280
women and children and they, 
they don't know what to say at 

774
00:43:28,280 --> 00:43:30,880
that point. 
It's like that is what happens. 

775
00:43:31,040 --> 00:43:35,480
You know, it wasn't a mistake. 
It wasn't justified in, in the 

776
00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:38,000
in the terms they gave us. 
They lied. 

777
00:43:38,000 --> 00:43:41,720
Our government lied to the 
House, lied to the public. 

778
00:43:42,240 --> 00:43:44,960
The Prime Minister lied, the BBC
lied every day. 

779
00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:50,280
So I'll say all I'm telling you 
is the journalist again, that's 

780
00:43:50,280 --> 00:43:52,160
all I'm telling you. 
They're doing that again. 

781
00:43:52,960 --> 00:43:57,360
And but people don't don't want 
to take people they know they 

782
00:43:57,360 --> 00:43:59,840
could take that first step 
because they already know. 

783
00:44:00,200 --> 00:44:02,560
They disbelieve. 
They know that narrative with 

784
00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:04,880
people's jokes about it. 
There's Auntie Dossier, they 

785
00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:07,840
called it so, but they won't put
their damn foot on it. 

786
00:44:08,520 --> 00:44:11,880
That's the strange thing. 
And it's also like JFK obviously

787
00:44:11,880 --> 00:44:14,280
happened when I was 3. 
So I don't really know anything 

788
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:16,880
about it. 
But the idea that this one, 

789
00:44:16,880 --> 00:44:22,080
whatever 1 gunman with, with one
manual loading rifles did all of

790
00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:25,560
that, everybody knows. 
That's just nuts, isn't it? 

791
00:44:25,920 --> 00:44:29,320
I don't know what happens, but I
do know we we were lied to 

792
00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:32,360
because that was the official 
conclusion and anybody who said 

793
00:44:32,360 --> 00:44:36,320
otherwise was a conspiracy 
theorist. 9/11 too. 

794
00:44:36,320 --> 00:44:38,880
That was a big one. 
And yet, yeah yeah 9. 11 I. 

795
00:44:38,880 --> 00:44:39,840
Didn't I? 
Didn't. 

796
00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:43,120
I didn't question it until like 
2016 or something. 

797
00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:44,200
Oh God. 
I didn't. 

798
00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:47,240
I didn't. 
I only questioned it in the same

799
00:44:47,240 --> 00:44:49,880
way that Jessica Hockett said 
she started asking about numbers

800
00:44:49,880 --> 00:44:52,720
of people in New York Hospital 
and then started asking if we'd 

801
00:44:52,720 --> 00:44:57,560
gone to the moon. 
I, I, I realised that 911 must 

802
00:44:57,560 --> 00:45:01,600
have been an inside job during 
early parts of 2020 because I 

803
00:45:01,680 --> 00:45:04,960
rapidly realised that almost 
everything I looked at that was 

804
00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:08,760
important wasn't, wasn't true. 
Yeah. 

805
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:13,840
So when you get a whole, a whole
line of things just not true, 

806
00:45:15,040 --> 00:45:17,200
yeah, then it makes you think, 
well, what else are they lying 

807
00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:18,800
about? 
And it's like, well, pretty much

808
00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:20,360
everything. 
So. 

809
00:45:20,440 --> 00:45:23,240
Well, I'll tell you what, it's 
only recently I've. 

810
00:45:23,320 --> 00:45:26,200
I've never spent any time on on 
9/11. 

811
00:45:26,200 --> 00:45:29,280
Why? 
Because I concluded that they 

812
00:45:29,280 --> 00:45:31,320
must have destroyed them in some
way. 

813
00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:33,400
What does it matter to me how 
they did it? 

814
00:45:33,920 --> 00:45:37,720
And then somebody said you 
should watch Judy Woods. 

815
00:45:37,720 --> 00:45:40,920
Where did the towers go? 
And I watched a bit of it. 

816
00:45:40,920 --> 00:45:44,120
And I thought, oh, shit. 
Because what she did very 

817
00:45:44,120 --> 00:45:48,200
elegantly is show you pictures, 
show you wreckage. 

818
00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:50,640
Just keep asking where do the 
towers go? 

819
00:45:50,920 --> 00:45:55,960
So you, you know, you ask any 
person for the 110 Storey steel 

820
00:45:55,960 --> 00:45:58,920
frame building clad with masonry
and so on. 

821
00:45:59,320 --> 00:46:02,320
If you managed to allow it all. 
So let's say you could soar up 

822
00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:04,360
all of the structural members 
and allow it to fall in the 

823
00:46:04,360 --> 00:46:06,920
heat, right? 
You maybe you could hit the bits

824
00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:09,200
of masonry, really big 
sledgehammers. 

825
00:46:09,280 --> 00:46:11,560
How big would the pile be on the
floor at the bottom? 

826
00:46:12,360 --> 00:46:15,720
And they, they reason for a bit 
and they go 10 floors. 

827
00:46:16,160 --> 00:46:19,560
I'll say I don't know, but yeah,
maybe a pile, you know, a 10th. 

828
00:46:19,840 --> 00:46:21,480
How big was the pile? 
And they go, I don't know. 

829
00:46:21,480 --> 00:46:24,040
I'll say it was about a floor 
high, about a floor and a high 

830
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:26,640
floor and a half high. 
And then they, they go, where 

831
00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:28,840
did it go? 
And I go exactly. 

832
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:33,120
So the the only conclusion I 
drew from that scientifically, 

833
00:46:33,120 --> 00:46:35,600
because they don't know how they
did it, but I know they didn't 

834
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:40,560
do it using methods I understand
because all methods I understand

835
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:44,840
would have produced a socking 
great pile of of waste and it 

836
00:46:44,840 --> 00:46:48,120
wasn't there. 
So that's and then here's the 

837
00:46:48,120 --> 00:46:51,080
next thing. 
So something was used that we 

838
00:46:51,080 --> 00:46:54,480
don't know about. 
I think you would be unwise to 

839
00:46:54,480 --> 00:46:58,320
assume they ain't going to use 
that again or have not already 

840
00:46:58,320 --> 00:47:01,600
used it again. 
For example, as a child. 

841
00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:04,760
I like reading, sorry. 
Hawaii. 

842
00:47:05,560 --> 00:47:07,120
Yes, yes. 
I don't. 

843
00:47:07,120 --> 00:47:09,120
Yeah, Could be. 
Could be the same technology, a 

844
00:47:09,120 --> 00:47:11,480
different manifestation. 
But when I was a kid, I used to 

845
00:47:11,480 --> 00:47:14,440
read like, strange tales, you 
know, things that have happened 

846
00:47:14,440 --> 00:47:16,520
in the world that are all 
grouped together in a book that 

847
00:47:16,520 --> 00:47:18,400
makes you go. 
Isn't that interesting? 

848
00:47:18,400 --> 00:47:23,960
And I remember reading one about
what was thought to have been a 

849
00:47:23,960 --> 00:47:28,560
meteorite, which in 19 O 8 
exploded over northern tundra of

850
00:47:28,560 --> 00:47:32,360
Russia, I think over a place 
called Tungusta Tunguska in 

851
00:47:32,360 --> 00:47:38,240
1908, Tunguska meteorite. 
And until a week ago, I thought 

852
00:47:38,240 --> 00:47:40,560
that's what it was. 
Some sort of dirty snowball came

853
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:43,960
in obliquely, blew up and 
flattened, I think 8 million 

854
00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:47,240
trees or 80 million trees. 
Even decades later, you can 

855
00:47:47,240 --> 00:47:50,720
still see all these matchsticks,
all these trees flattened over a

856
00:47:50,720 --> 00:47:53,920
decade, many miles. 
But then I was reading something

857
00:47:53,920 --> 00:48:00,640
else that said that it may be 
possible to use scalar waves in 

858
00:48:00,640 --> 00:48:04,320
combination using more than one 
projector and create something 

859
00:48:04,320 --> 00:48:06,520
that was described as an energy 
bottle. 

860
00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:10,720
If you have if you have three 
sets of scalar waves, you can 

861
00:48:10,720 --> 00:48:15,240
form A3 dimensional shape that 
could contain energy of some 

862
00:48:15,240 --> 00:48:18,640
kind. 
Most of us know that waves, if 

863
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:22,000
they impinge one on another, 
they can either amplify each 

864
00:48:22,000 --> 00:48:25,960
other if they're in phase and 
they can cancel each other if 

865
00:48:25,960 --> 00:48:28,320
they're out of phase. 
Most people have seen that when 

866
00:48:28,320 --> 00:48:30,400
they've been swimming, even you 
see it in water. 

867
00:48:30,640 --> 00:48:33,640
It certainly happens with sound 
and it will certainly happen 

868
00:48:33,640 --> 00:48:36,640
with radio frequency and all 
sorts of other electromagnetic 

869
00:48:36,640 --> 00:48:39,360
phenomena. 
And so the idea I think you 

870
00:48:39,360 --> 00:48:42,800
know, I have an Ola Bado level 
in physics 40 years ago, but I 

871
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:47,160
think the idea was you have 
multiple machines that are 

872
00:48:47,160 --> 00:48:51,800
producing these waves and the 
point where they all insect is a

873
00:48:51,800 --> 00:48:55,640
potentially controllable 3 
dimensional structure. 

874
00:48:55,640 --> 00:49:00,040
And the idea was perhaps they 
were experimenting with this 

875
00:49:00,040 --> 00:49:04,040
technology in the Northern 
hemisphere in 19-8 and that's 

876
00:49:04,040 --> 00:49:07,800
that was the result of it seems 
possible, but we'll see. 

877
00:49:08,080 --> 00:49:10,920
But that's. 
That's the beauty of the last 

878
00:49:10,920 --> 00:49:15,320
few years, Mike, that it's it's 
opened up a whole world of 

879
00:49:15,320 --> 00:49:19,720
thinking, of critical thinking 
that we previously didn't 

880
00:49:19,720 --> 00:49:22,040
experience. 
Of course many around us will 

881
00:49:22,040 --> 00:49:25,720
will just call us clowns and 
they carry on believing 

882
00:49:25,720 --> 00:49:29,600
everything that they are told. 
But I quite like the idea of of 

883
00:49:29,680 --> 00:49:34,160
thinking about stuff you. 
Probably saw me enjoying that. 

884
00:49:34,480 --> 00:49:39,360
That move from it was probably a
meteorite to it could have been 

885
00:49:39,360 --> 00:49:41,360
something that humans did on 
Earth. 

886
00:49:41,720 --> 00:49:44,640
Wow, It could, you know, it 
could be either of those and it 

887
00:49:44,640 --> 00:49:47,960
could be 1/3 phenomenon. 
I, I'm not, I don't know, but I,

888
00:49:48,400 --> 00:49:52,640
I, I basically widen the 
solution set by quite a lot. 

889
00:49:53,880 --> 00:49:58,960
So I think that Judy Wood's work
is is terrific and it's it's an 

890
00:49:58,960 --> 00:50:01,520
awesome as well for us all. 
Just adding. 

891
00:50:01,880 --> 00:50:04,560
Adding to what you're saying 
earlier about that third camp, 

892
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:08,240
so Nov, Chomsky Once Upon a time
said something along the lines 

893
00:50:08,240 --> 00:50:13,200
of the one of the most powerful 
ways to control people is to 

894
00:50:13,200 --> 00:50:17,680
create the set of parameters 
within which you will encourage 

895
00:50:17,760 --> 00:50:20,160
fiery debate. 
And even within those 

896
00:50:20,160 --> 00:50:22,440
parameters, people are arguing 
and disagreeing. 

897
00:50:22,840 --> 00:50:26,080
But it's outside of those 
parameters where the greater 

898
00:50:26,080 --> 00:50:29,120
truth lies. 
Yes, and and that's that's 

899
00:50:29,120 --> 00:50:30,640
effectively what you're talking 
about. 

900
00:50:30,640 --> 00:50:32,840
It is. 
Exactly, that is exactly right, 

901
00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:35,560
yes. 
It's to create a, a controlled 

902
00:50:35,560 --> 00:50:38,600
dichotomy and encourage vigorous
debates inside that so that the 

903
00:50:39,240 --> 00:50:42,880
the additional solutions, one of
which is the truth is not even 

904
00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:44,840
touched on. 
And if it's raised, it's 

905
00:50:44,840 --> 00:50:46,440
censored. 
And that's, that is where we 

906
00:50:46,440 --> 00:50:48,960
are. 
But there's a, there's a slow 

907
00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:53,440
trickling, I think there's a, 
it's just quite, quite 

908
00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:57,560
reassuring that even if I'm 
watching, you know, videos about

909
00:50:57,560 --> 00:51:00,720
my hobby or motorbikes, that 
quite often people are now 

910
00:51:00,720 --> 00:51:04,880
putting comments which sarcastic
comments like whatever, and you 

911
00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:07,320
know, it's this that's, you 
know, whatever they, they 

912
00:51:07,320 --> 00:51:10,400
realise we were lied to over the
last five years and they're not 

913
00:51:10,400 --> 00:51:13,040
being censored now. 
They're, they're not very 

914
00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:16,640
precise comments. 
But whereas in the first year 

915
00:51:17,880 --> 00:51:20,880
people were very very twitchy, 
or at least the the algorithm, 

916
00:51:20,880 --> 00:51:23,440
the the platforms and the 
algorithms are very twitchy. 

917
00:51:23,440 --> 00:51:26,600
You literally couldn't deviate 
from the received proper 

918
00:51:26,600 --> 00:51:28,960
narrative and now it seems sort 
of softened. 

919
00:51:30,200 --> 00:51:36,240
My concern is that if people 
only after 5 or 6 years start to

920
00:51:36,240 --> 00:51:40,480
realise that one thing might 
have been told to them 

921
00:51:40,480 --> 00:51:44,720
incorrectly, they haven't got 
very far right just because. 

922
00:51:44,720 --> 00:51:50,400
Because we were told about a 
bombing Iraq in when it may have

923
00:51:50,400 --> 00:51:52,720
been 2001 or something. 
I don't know. 

924
00:51:53,280 --> 00:51:54,560
I don't know. 
Japan. 

925
00:51:55,640 --> 00:51:57,880
Yeah, Japan, absolutely, that's 
fascinating. 

926
00:51:58,160 --> 00:51:59,960
So yeah, I. 
So there you go. 

927
00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:03,560
You can you can be 
intellectually fairly sure that 

928
00:52:03,560 --> 00:52:06,080
you've been lied to, but it 
doesn't change anything because 

929
00:52:06,520 --> 00:52:10,240
the imposed preferred reality 
dominates. 

930
00:52:10,560 --> 00:52:16,080
And so I fear that not very many
people have got to the point of 

931
00:52:16,080 --> 00:52:20,920
realising that it's, it's all an
inversion, that it's not good 

932
00:52:20,920 --> 00:52:23,160
enough just to say, oh, I'm 
going to refuse the next kind of

933
00:52:23,160 --> 00:52:25,320
jabs. 
And it's like, you know, at that

934
00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:28,600
point there might be nothing in 
the shops and only digital 

935
00:52:28,600 --> 00:52:31,840
money. 
So have you thought about that? 

936
00:52:31,840 --> 00:52:34,960
And have you planned for that? 
Because if not, you'll either 

937
00:52:34,960 --> 00:52:39,720
starve or get jacked so people 
don't don't think very far down 

938
00:52:39,720 --> 00:52:41,320
the road. 
No. 

939
00:52:41,560 --> 00:52:42,800
Well, that's what I wanted to 
ask you. 

940
00:52:42,800 --> 00:52:46,480
So let's just say you have woken
up, so to speak. 

941
00:52:46,960 --> 00:52:49,200
What now? 
Yeah. 

942
00:52:50,120 --> 00:52:53,680
Yeah, Well, I won't give, I 
won't give away the details of 

943
00:52:53,680 --> 00:52:57,160
my planning because it's not 
very sophisticated, but I've 

944
00:52:57,160 --> 00:53:00,680
taken certain steps. 
That means that unless they come

945
00:53:00,680 --> 00:53:04,600
out and arrest us on mass, it 
won't matter what they do next 

946
00:53:04,600 --> 00:53:07,760
because I've got I've got 
certain provisions and means 

947
00:53:07,760 --> 00:53:10,920
that means I'm not dependent on 
them for a for a decent period 

948
00:53:10,920 --> 00:53:13,520
of time. 
But, yeah, if they say you're 

949
00:53:13,520 --> 00:53:16,720
not allowed to travel and if 
you're seen outside, well, it'll

950
00:53:16,720 --> 00:53:22,880
be considered a, a breach of 
quarantine or whatever, then 

951
00:53:22,920 --> 00:53:26,440
yeah, that would be very bad. 
But we're not going to starve or

952
00:53:26,440 --> 00:53:29,120
be immediately poor. 
I've taken steps to make sure 

953
00:53:29,120 --> 00:53:35,960
that's very, very unlikely. 
But I, I don't think I'm hoping 

954
00:53:35,960 --> 00:53:39,320
more people wake up, that 
there'll be more people woken up

955
00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:42,480
by the time. 
Yeah, but I do think more people

956
00:53:42,480 --> 00:53:44,480
are waking up. 
And I don't think it needs to be

957
00:53:44,480 --> 00:53:48,240
very many. 
If you imagine them wanting to 

958
00:53:48,240 --> 00:53:55,720
impose a digital ID on 
everybody, and even if 5% 

959
00:53:55,720 --> 00:54:00,560
wouldn't go along with it in 
Britain, that would be three and

960
00:54:00,560 --> 00:54:03,840
a half million people. 
And that's, yeah, 70 million 

961
00:54:03,840 --> 00:54:06,280
odd. 
So 5% is 3 and a half million 

962
00:54:06,280 --> 00:54:08,400
people. 
I don't know whether 5% would 

963
00:54:08,400 --> 00:54:15,040
decline it, but we are already 
quite, we're quite primed to 

964
00:54:15,040 --> 00:54:19,640
reject it because Tony Blair 
early in his prime ministership 

965
00:54:19,640 --> 00:54:22,720
in the 90s tried really hard to 
impose it. 

966
00:54:22,720 --> 00:54:25,960
And I think people realise that 
the very least we'll be going 

967
00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:30,240
to, we're going to be asked to 
account for our whereabouts and 

968
00:54:30,240 --> 00:54:32,760
who we were when walking about 
peacefully. 

969
00:54:33,120 --> 00:54:34,920
And we've never had that culture
in Britain. 

970
00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:38,960
It's not a papers pleased 
society and I think so people 

971
00:54:38,960 --> 00:54:42,560
have been and we managed to 
fight him off whatever 

972
00:54:42,560 --> 00:54:45,560
politically journalists. 
So I think if they come at us 

973
00:54:45,560 --> 00:54:47,440
again, I think it'd be quite 
difficult. 

974
00:54:47,960 --> 00:54:53,120
And so if 5% rejected it, it 
doesn't really work. 

975
00:54:53,920 --> 00:54:57,800
You know, if 5% rejects it, some
people then are going to be 

976
00:54:57,800 --> 00:54:59,240
selling food on the black 
market. 

977
00:54:59,320 --> 00:55:02,640
I'm going to be buying, you 
know, that's so that's the 

978
00:55:02,640 --> 00:55:05,760
answer to the question. 
If it's so few that there's no 

979
00:55:05,760 --> 00:55:09,360
black market, then the answer is
I'm going to, I'm going to pray 

980
00:55:09,760 --> 00:55:13,960
and then I'm not taking it. 
I'd rather starve than I'm not 

981
00:55:13,960 --> 00:55:18,080
going to use digital ID. 
I've said to people, well, why 

982
00:55:18,080 --> 00:55:19,480
don't you do that? 
You just don't have to be 

983
00:55:19,480 --> 00:55:21,080
jabbed. 
It's like, I think that's the 

984
00:55:21,080 --> 00:55:24,520
first step inside. 
I call it the human abattoir, or

985
00:55:24,560 --> 00:55:28,840
it's a digital panopticon, 
digital gulag, whatever it is 

986
00:55:30,800 --> 00:55:34,080
that you don't need a digital 
ID, you can already identify 

987
00:55:34,080 --> 00:55:36,760
yourself in multiple ways to 
whomsoever needs it. 

988
00:55:37,000 --> 00:55:40,120
So I keep saying to people, why 
do they want you to have it? 

989
00:55:40,560 --> 00:55:43,760
And the answer is it's not for 
you, it's for them. 

990
00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:45,200
It's controlling everything 
about you. 

991
00:55:45,200 --> 00:55:48,360
And they go, well, it isn't. 
We've got loads of digital IDs. 

992
00:55:48,360 --> 00:55:53,280
I said you haven't got any that 
are updated in real time, which 

993
00:55:53,280 --> 00:55:58,080
contains rich information about 
who you are, where you are, what

994
00:55:58,080 --> 00:56:02,280
you're trying to buy, what else 
you've bought recently, where 

995
00:56:02,280 --> 00:56:05,560
you are geographically in 
relation to some 15 minute 

996
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:10,440
community boundary with you've 
said hearty words on the 

997
00:56:10,440 --> 00:56:12,960
Internet. 
All of these things can be 

998
00:56:12,960 --> 00:56:18,400
instantly modified in your 
political ID and I think will do

999
00:56:19,960 --> 00:56:22,200
that's what I always do. 
If I was the I always think if I

1000
00:56:22,200 --> 00:56:25,920
was the evils, what would I do? 
And that's what I would do. 

1001
00:56:26,000 --> 00:56:28,680
And they have told they have 
wounds, that you will be eating 

1002
00:56:28,680 --> 00:56:33,000
less meat, you know, but they've
warned us that you won't be 

1003
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:38,680
travelling by budget airline on 
holiday and that ladies, you 

1004
00:56:38,680 --> 00:56:41,880
won't be able to buy more than 
three items of clothing a year. 

1005
00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:45,280
My wife and daughter get that 
money through the through the 

1006
00:56:45,280 --> 00:56:48,440
door every day. 
They mostly take them back. 

1007
00:56:48,440 --> 00:56:50,240
But this is part of their 
living. 

1008
00:56:50,240 --> 00:56:53,560
They both of them like buying. 
They compare notes, take things 

1009
00:56:53,560 --> 00:56:56,160
back. 
If you buy quite a lot, use them

1010
00:56:56,160 --> 00:56:59,920
for a bit more. 
On the comment of meat, I go 

1011
00:56:59,920 --> 00:57:01,400
hunting, so they're not going to
stop me. 

1012
00:57:02,760 --> 00:57:04,520
They're not going to stop 
somebody with guns. 

1013
00:57:05,000 --> 00:57:07,480
Yeah, exactly. 
So if you you've got access to 

1014
00:57:07,960 --> 00:57:12,360
the wild places where where you 
may be able to secure something 

1015
00:57:12,360 --> 00:57:14,920
that you could cook and the 
means to take it down. 

1016
00:57:14,920 --> 00:57:19,280
Well, yeah, I don't probably, 
but I have, I have started 

1017
00:57:19,280 --> 00:57:23,080
making friends with with people 
who are who are in the butcher 

1018
00:57:23,080 --> 00:57:26,520
trade and in the farming trade. 
Have a really lovely, that 

1019
00:57:26,520 --> 00:57:28,720
meeting last weekend to go and 
meet. 

1020
00:57:28,760 --> 00:57:32,360
There's about 40 people that 
it's like an informal farmers 

1021
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:34,360
market and they do a lot of it 
by barter. 

1022
00:57:34,560 --> 00:57:38,160
There's not, it's, if there's 
any money, it's cash and a lot 

1023
00:57:38,160 --> 00:57:41,520
of it is just pure barter. 
And also trust, you know, I 

1024
00:57:41,520 --> 00:57:43,160
bought you 7 lbs of beef last 
week. 

1025
00:57:43,160 --> 00:57:46,680
You brought me all those, these 
cherries this week, whatever. 

1026
00:57:47,080 --> 00:57:49,800
So they're, and they're all 
awake and they knew who I was. 

1027
00:57:50,480 --> 00:57:53,640
So it's quite embarrassing and 
just going into like a village 

1028
00:57:53,640 --> 00:57:56,640
hall and there's all these 
people looking at you, pointing 

1029
00:57:56,640 --> 00:57:58,200
at you. 
I just go, hello. 

1030
00:57:59,440 --> 00:58:02,280
So that was quite fun. 
So we, we started because we 

1031
00:58:02,280 --> 00:58:05,480
didn't do any of that. 
We were too busy buzzing around 

1032
00:58:05,480 --> 00:58:07,360
the world. 
We went to Spain and Costa Rica 

1033
00:58:07,360 --> 00:58:10,080
and America and France. 
And so I didn't really. 

1034
00:58:10,080 --> 00:58:13,360
And then we moved house. 
So we don't, we don't know that 

1035
00:58:13,360 --> 00:58:15,760
many people. 
And so it it occurred to me 

1036
00:58:15,760 --> 00:58:19,040
recently, I thought we better 
start making some connections 

1037
00:58:19,600 --> 00:58:23,520
because if they do impose some 
event, we won't know anybody and

1038
00:58:23,520 --> 00:58:26,000
we'll be eating baked beans 
until we run out of baked beans.

1039
00:58:26,880 --> 00:58:28,680
Hang on, Mike, you just 
mentioned a whole bunch of 

1040
00:58:28,680 --> 00:58:30,400
countries that you were 
travelling to. 

1041
00:58:30,560 --> 00:58:32,400
Have you been to my neck of the 
woods? 

1042
00:58:32,640 --> 00:58:34,960
No. 
We, no, we didn't. 

1043
00:58:36,200 --> 00:58:38,280
My wife just said. 
My wife is very keen on the 

1044
00:58:38,280 --> 00:58:40,920
idea. 
She does like the idea. 

1045
00:58:41,960 --> 00:58:45,760
One of our, the main impediment 
I have and we both have really 

1046
00:58:45,760 --> 00:58:50,440
is that both of our adults, 
children, I think they're like 

1047
00:58:50,440 --> 00:58:53,960
late 20s, early 30s, 
intellectually they know quite 

1048
00:58:53,960 --> 00:58:58,000
well what's going on, but their 
lives are busy and day to day 

1049
00:58:58,000 --> 00:59:00,560
they just get on with their 
normal lives. 

1050
00:59:02,440 --> 00:59:05,400
One is raising two small 
children, the other's just 

1051
00:59:05,400 --> 00:59:07,120
bought a house and is going to 
be remodelling it. 

1052
00:59:07,120 --> 00:59:08,440
What else are you supposed to 
do? 

1053
00:59:08,440 --> 00:59:09,760
They're getting on with their 
lives. 

1054
00:59:10,040 --> 00:59:13,920
So they have not, They haven't 
given any thoughts really down 

1055
00:59:13,920 --> 00:59:17,920
the road. 
And when I've said, I think the 

1056
00:59:17,920 --> 00:59:20,640
only kind of places in which we 
would have a reasonable shot, 

1057
00:59:21,120 --> 00:59:24,840
not a guarantee, a reasonable 
shot for continuing free life 

1058
00:59:24,840 --> 00:59:28,800
would be either a place that we 
used to call Third World. 

1059
00:59:29,080 --> 00:59:31,240
And you'd have to be in the 
rural end of that. 

1060
00:59:32,720 --> 00:59:35,200
And they they roll, they just 
wrinkle their noses. 

1061
00:59:35,200 --> 00:59:39,600
It's like what, no warm water 
and, you know, no mod cons. 

1062
00:59:39,600 --> 00:59:42,800
I said pretty much, yeah, that's
where you that would be pretty 

1063
00:59:42,800 --> 00:59:44,560
safe. 
I mean, it's not. 

1064
00:59:44,840 --> 00:59:46,040
That bad? 
No, I. 

1065
00:59:46,200 --> 00:59:48,880
Know, but I haven't considered 
South Africa because I think. 

1066
00:59:49,840 --> 00:59:53,040
I don't I don't shower in Mike. 
I don't shower in cold water. 

1067
00:59:53,040 --> 00:59:55,760
The. 
Point is, I think of it as first

1068
00:59:55,760 --> 00:59:59,280
world. 
And so I think why aren't you as

1069
00:59:59,280 --> 01:00:03,040
almost as vulnerable as Paris 
and London and New York? 

1070
01:00:03,040 --> 01:00:07,600
I mean, why aren't you? 
I mean, I think you told me or 

1071
01:00:07,600 --> 01:00:10,800
you sent by email and you said 
that we do not have guaranteed 

1072
01:00:10,800 --> 01:00:13,800
electricity all the time. 
Which was, I think that was, or 

1073
01:00:13,800 --> 01:00:15,720
at least it's in the city or in 
the suburbs. 

1074
01:00:17,200 --> 01:00:18,880
It's everywhere, the entire 
country. 

1075
01:00:19,200 --> 01:00:20,480
That's polite. 
That's amazing. 

1076
01:00:20,480 --> 01:00:24,240
So that is important that you 
can't really run a full on 

1077
01:00:24,240 --> 01:00:26,600
techno control grid if you 
don't. 

1078
01:00:26,600 --> 01:00:30,360
No, you can't. 
No, in South Africa they, we, we

1079
01:00:30,360 --> 01:00:34,240
will never get onto that 15 
minute city control grid anytime

1080
01:00:34,240 --> 01:00:36,040
soon because it's just too 
chaotic. 

1081
01:00:36,080 --> 01:00:39,480
Yeah, right here, right here 
underneath my desk. 

1082
01:00:39,480 --> 01:00:42,560
I've got backup power just in 
case the main power goes out 

1083
01:00:42,560 --> 01:00:44,960
right. 
Yeah, No, that's OK. 

1084
01:00:44,960 --> 01:00:47,760
That's important. 
So you've got there are, there 

1085
01:00:47,760 --> 01:00:50,800
are very, there are, there are 
some attractions, many 

1086
01:00:50,800 --> 01:00:51,760
attractions. 
Well, that's. 

1087
01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:54,200
But that's exactly right. 
So when you have, when you have 

1088
01:00:54,200 --> 01:00:57,800
an inept government, a 
completely useless state, it 

1089
01:00:57,800 --> 01:01:01,400
forces you into a mindset of 
prep, into a mindset of self 

1090
01:01:01,400 --> 01:01:03,720
reliance, Yes. 
No, I really like that. 

1091
01:01:04,080 --> 01:01:08,000
I I'm going to mention it to 
both the girls again because I 

1092
01:01:08,040 --> 01:01:10,560
said, look, you don't you, 
you're here because you, you 

1093
01:01:10,560 --> 01:01:12,040
were born here and that's our 
fault. 

1094
01:01:12,040 --> 01:01:14,720
You know, you don't really love 
it here and it's awful, isn't 

1095
01:01:14,720 --> 01:01:17,120
it? 
And it's getting worse, so. 

1096
01:01:17,440 --> 01:01:19,800
But I mean, to be fair, I'm not 
suggesting you move here. 

1097
01:01:19,800 --> 01:01:21,880
I'm simply asking when you come 
in to visit and more 

1098
01:01:21,880 --> 01:01:24,360
specifically, come to the Kruger
National Park and I'll go with 

1099
01:01:24,360 --> 01:01:25,360
you. 
I Yeah. 

1100
01:01:25,400 --> 01:01:29,640
I'm not, I'm, yeah, I, I don't 
think that as it were, running 

1101
01:01:29,640 --> 01:01:33,880
safety is, it's not really for 
me, I don't think, I don't know.

1102
01:01:33,880 --> 01:01:38,840
I, I also think the end comes at
some point. 

1103
01:01:38,960 --> 01:01:43,240
I'm, I wouldn't say I'm, I don't
really mind, you know, if it 

1104
01:01:43,240 --> 01:01:46,880
happens to happen tomorrow or if
it happened in 25 years, it's, 

1105
01:01:47,200 --> 01:01:49,520
it's not that important. 
I've had a lovely life. 

1106
01:01:49,520 --> 01:01:52,520
I'm still enjoying it. 
If it ended tomorrow, it would 

1107
01:01:52,520 --> 01:01:54,960
be all right. 
So you know well. 

1108
01:01:55,280 --> 01:01:58,520
Just just so that we're clear, 
you say you have a lovely life, 

1109
01:01:58,520 --> 01:02:02,840
but the last few years you are 
one of the pivotal people, at 

1110
01:02:02,840 --> 01:02:06,160
least in my life, who had 
positive impact. 

1111
01:02:06,520 --> 01:02:09,480
Yeah. 
My child who was born, my child 

1112
01:02:09,480 --> 01:02:12,120
who was born a year ago, just 
under a year ago. 

1113
01:02:12,120 --> 01:02:13,560
Wow. 
Is not vaccinated. 

1114
01:02:13,560 --> 01:02:15,200
Thanks to people like you. 
Good. 

1115
01:02:15,480 --> 01:02:17,760
Fantastic. 
And there's no reason ever to 

1116
01:02:18,280 --> 01:02:21,000
and as you know, no reason ever 
to feel any guilt. 

1117
01:02:21,000 --> 01:02:24,240
Did I did I leave them 
unprotected? 

1118
01:02:24,240 --> 01:02:27,960
No, that's that's, that's a, 
it's AI didn't realise until 

1119
01:02:27,960 --> 01:02:31,160
relatively recently that that's 
all just a story. 

1120
01:02:31,560 --> 01:02:33,720
The whole thing is just a story 
contagion. 

1121
01:02:34,600 --> 01:02:38,560
So yeah. 
But yeah, anyway, I think we'll 

1122
01:02:38,720 --> 01:02:41,000
OK so. 
Mike, let's let's come in for a 

1123
01:02:41,000 --> 01:02:43,040
landing. 
Give me the moral of the story. 

1124
01:02:43,920 --> 01:02:45,200
God, the moral of the story? 
What? 

1125
01:02:45,200 --> 01:02:49,120
Which story? 
You might want to provide some, 

1126
01:02:49,760 --> 01:02:51,560
or at least a possible 
structure. 

1127
01:02:52,640 --> 01:02:53,920
Which story? 
Well, OK. 

1128
01:02:53,920 --> 01:02:56,920
What is the moral of your story?
The moral of your story? 

1129
01:02:58,560 --> 01:03:05,600
Yeah, I think it's, for me, 
it's, I feel quite strongly 

1130
01:03:05,600 --> 01:03:07,880
about this. 
If you have an opportunity to do

1131
01:03:07,880 --> 01:03:11,400
something that's that's good for
other people, you should damn 

1132
01:03:11,400 --> 01:03:16,080
well do it. 
Because I see, I, I sense it 

1133
01:03:16,080 --> 01:03:19,840
must be true that a large number
of people could have helped and 

1134
01:03:19,840 --> 01:03:23,600
didn't, and they could help now 
and aren't. 

1135
01:03:23,600 --> 01:03:26,920
And I think we could honestly, 
we could roll them over. 

1136
01:03:27,800 --> 01:03:31,000
People who have information, 
they're not going to hang, draw 

1137
01:03:31,000 --> 01:03:34,760
one call to you. 
If you say I detected this lie, 

1138
01:03:34,960 --> 01:03:36,680
you know, this is unequivocally 
a lie. 

1139
01:03:36,680 --> 01:03:39,000
And I'm going to tell everybody 
I know, even if they laugh at 

1140
01:03:39,000 --> 01:03:43,360
me, do it. 
Plant the seed it it does work. 

1141
01:03:44,640 --> 01:03:50,640
There's a friend of mine who's 
made QR codes of, of the video I

1142
01:03:50,640 --> 01:03:52,480
made before the one that just 
was released. 

1143
01:03:52,480 --> 01:03:56,680
It's called so called silver 
bullet and he'd written it. 

1144
01:03:56,760 --> 01:04:00,920
COVID was a big lie. 
It's in English then the QR code

1145
01:04:00,960 --> 01:04:03,360
and they've they've appeared all
around the world every now and 

1146
01:04:03,360 --> 01:04:06,840
again, I guess a picture from a 
bus bus stop in Bogota or 

1147
01:04:06,840 --> 01:04:11,240
something or someone sent a 
picture from I think it was the 

1148
01:04:11,240 --> 01:04:14,680
highest points in a Swiss 
mountain, Swiss ski resort 

1149
01:04:14,680 --> 01:04:16,480
recently. 
It took a picture and there was 

1150
01:04:16,480 --> 01:04:20,160
one of COVID is a big lie QR 
stickers on the roof of this 

1151
01:04:20,160 --> 01:04:22,320
thing and that that does fill 
me. 

1152
01:04:22,320 --> 01:04:25,760
But I actually get quite a lot 
of joy out of that because it's 

1153
01:04:25,760 --> 01:04:29,120
not just what I did, it's that 
other people saw we can do 

1154
01:04:29,120 --> 01:04:30,880
something. 
We could make a difference here.

1155
01:04:31,080 --> 01:04:32,880
That's all it takes. 
Enough of us. 

1156
01:04:33,120 --> 01:04:35,440
If you can do something good, do
it. 

1157
01:04:37,360 --> 01:04:43,400
Mike, how can I follow you? 
Well, I cannot that I've got 

1158
01:04:43,400 --> 01:04:45,800
I've got 2 locations due to good
friends of mine. 

1159
01:04:45,800 --> 01:04:48,600
I probably would have just 
crumpled in a heap because I'm 

1160
01:04:48,600 --> 01:04:53,240
not very good with social media.
But I use Telegram, TELEGR AM, 

1161
01:04:53,800 --> 01:04:57,040
and you can find me on Telegram.
But you must look out for the 

1162
01:04:57,040 --> 01:04:59,520
channel that says Doctor Mike 
Eden Solo. 

1163
01:05:00,520 --> 01:05:03,280
You'll know it's me because it 
starts with a video saying this 

1164
01:05:03,280 --> 01:05:06,120
is my channel and this is the 
title of the channel Doctor Mike

1165
01:05:06,120 --> 01:05:08,280
Eden Solo. 
All of the others won't have the

1166
01:05:08,280 --> 01:05:10,480
video. 
They may have my picture and my 

1167
01:05:10,480 --> 01:05:12,680
name, but they're fake. 
And there's at least two or 

1168
01:05:12,680 --> 01:05:14,280
three others. 
So that's one. 

1169
01:05:14,600 --> 01:05:17,440
And then the other one is sub 
stack, where as yet there are no

1170
01:05:17,480 --> 01:05:19,480
fakes. 
But if you go to the sub stack, 

1171
01:05:19,480 --> 01:05:23,960
one word, SUB stack Doctor 
Doctor Mike Eden, I don't write 

1172
01:05:23,960 --> 01:05:25,640
very many pieces on the sub 
stack. 

1173
01:05:25,640 --> 01:05:28,200
So I think each of the small 
numbers that are there are quite

1174
01:05:28,200 --> 01:05:32,040
powerful. 
So if you were approaching me or

1175
01:05:32,040 --> 01:05:35,880
recommending someone approaching
me for the first time, probably 

1176
01:05:35,880 --> 01:05:38,120
sub stack first. 
Just sort of read the articles 

1177
01:05:38,400 --> 01:05:41,920
because they're not that long 
and they cover probably all of 

1178
01:05:42,040 --> 01:05:45,040
the all of the material I've 
covered at some point has been 

1179
01:05:45,040 --> 01:05:48,360
covered in words, you know, that
are easy to comprehend with you 

1180
01:05:48,360 --> 01:05:51,040
believe it or not, it's up to 
the reader, but that that's 

1181
01:05:51,040 --> 01:05:54,360
where it is. 
And that's that's where I reside

1182
01:05:54,360 --> 01:05:57,760
mostly because Twitter still 
doesn't like me. 

1183
01:05:57,840 --> 01:06:02,360
You know, YouTube doesn't like 
me even when I'm logged in as a 

1184
01:06:02,360 --> 01:06:04,560
cedar net to do with my bike 
hobby. 

1185
01:06:04,560 --> 01:06:07,560
It knows damn well who I am even
with AVPN on. 

1186
01:06:07,800 --> 01:06:10,600
And so if I write something it 
doesn't like it and I refresh 

1187
01:06:10,600 --> 01:06:13,560
the screen, it's gone. 
So it's still continuing in the 

1188
01:06:13,560 --> 01:06:15,600
year 6, but I don't mind 
anymore. 

1189
01:06:15,840 --> 01:06:18,840
Just, you know, I just go places
where that doesn't happen. 

1190
01:06:19,520 --> 01:06:22,920
But just to remind people that 
the censorship of the people 

1191
01:06:22,920 --> 01:06:25,360
they don't want you to hear from
is just as strong as ever. 

1192
01:06:25,840 --> 01:06:30,440
And as that little meme goes, 
this is A2 frame meme. 

1193
01:06:30,440 --> 01:06:32,000
You know, who is it that's 
telling the truth? 

1194
01:06:32,000 --> 01:06:34,920
And the other one is the people 
that are being censored are 

1195
01:06:34,920 --> 01:06:36,880
telling the truth. 
That's right. 

1196
01:06:37,200 --> 01:06:42,520
So why would people censor me 
early in 2020? 

1197
01:06:42,520 --> 01:06:44,560
It could be because I was 
talking nonsense and could have 

1198
01:06:44,560 --> 01:06:48,240
put people's lives at risk. 
But it's six years on, they're 

1199
01:06:48,240 --> 01:06:51,880
still censoring me because I'm 
telling you things that they 

1200
01:06:51,920 --> 01:06:56,800
don't want you to know. 
I also point out that if you 

1201
01:06:56,800 --> 01:06:59,480
search for me using, I don't 
know what the right terms are. 

1202
01:06:59,480 --> 01:07:02,480
Search engines, browsers, What 
is? 

1203
01:07:02,480 --> 01:07:03,920
What is Google Chrome? 
What? 

1204
01:07:03,920 --> 01:07:08,200
What category of thing is it? 
That would be a browser browser,

1205
01:07:08,280 --> 01:07:12,480
so. 
If you put Optimi even in Google

1206
01:07:12,480 --> 01:07:15,840
Chrome or Apple, is it Safari? 
And then there's Safari, 

1207
01:07:15,960 --> 01:07:19,000
Microsoft Edge is it? 
I don't know, no. 

1208
01:07:19,040 --> 01:07:23,240
Anyway, if you use any of the 
big ones, just click return and 

1209
01:07:23,240 --> 01:07:25,760
just like, Scroll down and have 
a look at a couple of pages, see

1210
01:07:25,760 --> 01:07:27,280
what kind of material it 
returns. 

1211
01:07:27,280 --> 01:07:30,200
Because mostly it's Yeadon's a 
conspiracy theorist. 

1212
01:07:30,200 --> 01:07:32,880
And here are some nasty articles
from Reuters to tell you how 

1213
01:07:32,880 --> 01:07:35,840
wrong he's been. 
If you put the same search term 

1214
01:07:35,840 --> 01:07:39,280
in a small browser, and the one 
I use a lot is Yandex. 

1215
01:07:39,560 --> 01:07:43,360
Yandex gives a completely 
different set of hits. 

1216
01:07:43,360 --> 01:07:47,760
And I put it to people in 
conversation that do you regard 

1217
01:07:47,760 --> 01:07:51,680
search as a sort of generic 
property of the Internet? 

1218
01:07:51,680 --> 01:07:53,840
And they go, what do you mean? 
I say, well, if you put the same

1219
01:07:53,840 --> 01:07:56,640
search term in in any of these 
different windows, it should 

1220
01:07:56,640 --> 01:07:58,800
give you roughly the same 
information. 

1221
01:07:58,800 --> 01:08:01,880
And they go, yeah, I said, well,
that's what I thought too. 

1222
01:08:01,880 --> 01:08:06,280
So if I give you an example that
does not conform to that, what 

1223
01:08:06,280 --> 01:08:08,960
would you make of it? 
And they don't, they often don't

1224
01:08:08,960 --> 01:08:10,240
know. 
And they have to tell them. 

1225
01:08:10,240 --> 01:08:13,800
I'm saying someone's digging 
with the results and they're 

1226
01:08:13,800 --> 01:08:16,640
selectively digging with the 
results because if you put in 

1227
01:08:16,640 --> 01:08:19,160
uncontroversial terms, they all 
return the same thing. 

1228
01:08:19,160 --> 01:08:20,840
I've done the experiment 
basically. 

1229
01:08:21,200 --> 01:08:26,200
So if you put in my name, I get 
very different search results in

1230
01:08:26,200 --> 01:08:30,479
the mainstream browsers from 
what I get in the other ones. 

1231
01:08:30,760 --> 01:08:35,040
And if I use other controversial
terms, they will say so in a way

1232
01:08:35,040 --> 01:08:40,080
that's proof, you know, I think.
But it it that's only any good 

1233
01:08:40,080 --> 01:08:42,880
if someone is willing to be 
persuaded that I am being 

1234
01:08:42,880 --> 01:08:47,359
censored and therefore probably 
has something dangerous to say. 

1235
01:08:48,560 --> 01:08:52,319
So, yeah, there you go. 
But yeah, keep on keeping on, 

1236
01:08:52,319 --> 01:08:54,080
Joe. 
I think that's all I would say, 

1237
01:08:54,200 --> 01:08:57,600
both to you, my friend, and 
anybody who's doing the same. 

1238
01:08:59,080 --> 01:09:02,240
Well, on that note, Mike Eden, 
thank you for joining me in the 

1239
01:09:02,240 --> 01:09:04,920
trenches. 
It's been great fun. 

1240
01:09:04,920 --> 01:09:05,880
Again, thank you.