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In his dreams, the river was 
still a flame, and demons danced

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upon the waters with fiery whips
in their hands, while men 

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blackened and burned beneath the
lash. 

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Mother, have mercy, Davos 
prayed. 

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00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:16,840
Save me, gentle Mother, save us 
all. 

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My luck is gone, and my sons. 
He was weeping freely now, salt 

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tears streaming down his cheeks.
The fire took it all. 

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The fire. 
Perhaps it was only wind blowing

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00:00:27,480 --> 00:00:30,760
against the rock, or the sound 
of the sea on the shore, but for

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00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:33,280
instant Davos Seaworth heard her
answer. 

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You called the fire, she 
whispered. 

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Her voice is faint as the sound 
of waves in a seashell, sad and 

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soft. 
You burned us. 

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00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:46,160
Burned us, burned us. 
No, this episode isn't 

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00:00:46,160 --> 00:00:48,360
mistitled. 
That's just another Davos quote 

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00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:50,360
that we'd like as a parallel to 
Summer Hall. 

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00:00:50,560 --> 00:00:54,440
It even refers to Davos's luck 
running out, the same of which 

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could be said for Aegon the 
Fortunate, also known as Aegon 

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the Unlikely, also known as Egg.
At this point he could be called

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00:01:01,720 --> 00:01:04,760
Aegon the Unfortunate. 
This could be how the Ghost of 

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00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:07,640
High Heart feels for example, or
Jenny of Old Stones if she 

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survived. 
It's also a reminder of the salt

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and smoke associated with these 
well known and OFT overlapping 

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prophecies, prints that was 
promised and A's or A high, both

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of which carry significant links
to our topic today. 

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We won't cover those theories in
their entirety, though. 

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Our main focus is, of course, 
the aftermath of Summerhall. 

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Why didn't it work? 
Who tried to capitalize on the 

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instability? 
What impact did the event have 

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on the survivors? 
What impact does it have on the 

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00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:36,280
current storyline? 
I'll answer that one now by 

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saying a lot. 
We'll answer in more detail and 

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00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:41,240
get to the rest of those 
questions as we move forward. 

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Yeah, so hello and welcome to 
another episode of History of 

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Westeros podcast, a podcast 
dedicated to George RR Martin's 

36
00:01:48,680 --> 00:01:51,880
A Song of Ice and Fire, a book 
series, as well as HBO's Game of

37
00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:54,000
Thrones. 
Today's episode is focused on 

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Summer Hall, and thus it has 
spoilers for all of the Duncan 

39
00:01:56,760 --> 00:01:59,280
Egg novellas as well as the 
World of Ice and Fire. 

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00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:01,120
That's. 
Right, and this is Part 2 of our

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00:02:01,120 --> 00:02:04,120
Patreon Voters episode, the 
second such episode. 

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00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:07,800
Well, third such episode, second
such topic, more bang for your 

43
00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:10,199
buck, I suppose you guys got 
more than you expected, more 

44
00:02:10,199 --> 00:02:11,960
than we expected. 
We did not know this topic would

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00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:14,640
get so big. 
Obviously took us longer than we

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00:02:14,640 --> 00:02:16,800
expected, but it's also longer 
than we expected. 

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00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:19,400
So you know, the the, the extra 
time was put to good use. 

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00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:21,840
Now one thing about a quick note
about Patreon. 

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00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:24,400
A lot of you out there have 
subscribed to us on Patreon, 

50
00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:26,800
have supported us on Patreon, 
but some people aren't aware 

51
00:02:26,800 --> 00:02:29,080
that there's an internal 
messaging system on Patreon and 

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00:02:29,080 --> 00:02:31,240
you may not have be aware that 
you've got a message from us. 

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00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:33,520
So just just in case you're not 
aware, check that out. 

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00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:36,600
Respond if you if you want to, 
if not, oh. 

55
00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:37,880
No problem. 
That reminds me of another 

56
00:02:37,880 --> 00:02:39,800
thing. 
If you're commenting on YouTube,

57
00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:43,720
sometimes we get comments from 
people and there's no reply 

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00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:45,440
button. 
We cannot reply to you. 

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00:02:45,440 --> 00:02:48,160
We're not sure why if it's a 
setting you have, but if you're 

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00:02:48,160 --> 00:02:51,280
asking us a direct question, 
please try to check that we'd 

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00:02:51,280 --> 00:02:54,160
like to reply. 
Yeah, that's it's we sometimes 

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00:02:54,160 --> 00:02:57,840
it's a great question and we 
just not much we can do about 

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it. 
Also, before we get started, 

64
00:03:00,800 --> 00:03:04,200
thanks to 1st Sword, Joshua 
Hayes Cutter also called Joshua 

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the Raw. 
Now imagine a family reunion 

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00:03:08,240 --> 00:03:11,520
timed so that it coincides with 
the birth of a new addition to 

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the family. 
Well, that's pretty cool. 

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00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:15,560
It's a good idea actually. 
But to have that experience 

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shared by more members of the 
family could build more unity. 

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Yeah, well, depending on the. 
Family. 

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00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:22,160
Yeah, it could make things worse
in some cases, but instead of 

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the planned entertainment, since
we don't have a real life 

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00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:29,480
parallel for a dragon egg 
hatching ceremony yet, the about

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00:03:29,480 --> 00:03:33,320
to be great granddad burns the 
whole party down and a lot of 

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00:03:33,320 --> 00:03:35,680
people die. 
Though our irreverence doesn't 

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00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:39,240
exactly do it justice, this is, 
understandably the stuff 

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00:03:39,240 --> 00:03:41,160
nightmares and traumas are made 
out of. 

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00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:44,360
Well, I mean, you might expect, 
you know, everyone to lead 

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00:03:44,360 --> 00:03:48,000
normal lives eventually after 
some sort of lengthy grieving 

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00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:51,720
process, but you wouldn't really
be surprised to find that one or

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00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:54,480
more even all of the survivors 
were haunted by the experience 

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00:03:54,480 --> 00:03:57,640
their entire life. 
It can potentially infect all 

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00:03:57,640 --> 00:04:00,560
aspects of life, their 
relationships with each other, 

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00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:02,880
with everyone else, possibly 
their business dealings. 

85
00:04:03,120 --> 00:04:06,280
It might cause nightmares, 
sleeping problems, anxiety, 

86
00:04:06,640 --> 00:04:08,320
other things. 
I'm not really qualified to be 

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00:04:08,320 --> 00:04:11,360
too specific about being as how.
I'm not a psychologist. 

88
00:04:12,160 --> 00:04:14,360
And this is the royal family 
that we're talking about. 

89
00:04:14,360 --> 00:04:17,839
Unity within the royal family is
more important than with other 

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00:04:17,839 --> 00:04:21,720
families because without it the 
chance of civil war is very much

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00:04:21,720 --> 00:04:23,680
increased. 
Right, but obviously that didn't

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00:04:23,680 --> 00:04:26,400
work out. 
Unity or not, nor anything 

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00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:28,960
resembling such was achieved by 
Summer Hall. 

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00:04:28,960 --> 00:04:32,040
And certainly no literal Dragons
were came by House Targaryen 

95
00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:35,080
either. 
Civil war did come, and a mere 

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00:04:35,080 --> 00:04:38,040
24 years after Summer Hall, 
Robert Baratheon was at the 

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00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:40,520
throne. 
And even if Robert had lost, 

98
00:04:40,520 --> 00:04:42,800
evidence shows that Prince 
Rhaegar may have tried to 

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00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:45,440
overthrow his father. 
For good reasons, of course, but

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00:04:45,440 --> 00:04:49,920
still the point is that war and 
or rebellion loomed for many 

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00:04:49,920 --> 00:04:53,280
reasons, and Summerhall's shadow
on the royal family was a 

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00:04:53,280 --> 00:04:55,280
significant contributor. 
It had a lot to do with 

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00:04:55,280 --> 00:04:58,760
Rhaegar's dangerous obsession 
with prophecy and quite possibly

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00:04:58,760 --> 00:05:01,440
his father Aries his obsession 
with wildfire. 

105
00:05:01,720 --> 00:05:03,800
The former may have started 
Robert Rebellion while the 

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00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:05,760
latter almost destroyed King's 
Landing. 

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00:05:06,040 --> 00:05:09,040
Instead, it destroyed the honor 
of Jaime Lannister, who saved 

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00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:11,160
the city by killing the 
pyromancers who intended to 

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00:05:11,160 --> 00:05:14,480
carry out the Mad King's final 
orders to ignite the wildfire 

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00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:16,560
catches. 
He also slew the man who gave 

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00:05:16,560 --> 00:05:19,480
the orders, and Sir Jamie became
the King Slayer. 

112
00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:22,800
Yeah, Jamie believed that he 
would be lauded for this act, 

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00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:25,520
and he was mistaken. 
Aries believed that he would 

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00:05:25,520 --> 00:05:28,720
rise from the ashes of King's 
Landing as a dragon, and, well, 

115
00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:30,320
probably mistaken. 
Yeah, probably. 

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00:05:30,320 --> 00:05:32,280
Jury's out there. 
He might still calm. 

117
00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:34,120
Might have worked, we don't 
know. 

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00:05:35,000 --> 00:05:38,040
Again, I'm no psychologist, but 
I'm pretty sure the technical 

119
00:05:38,040 --> 00:05:41,520
term is TMU, which stands for 
That's Messed Up. 

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00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:45,080
Now, as we've said in this 
episode, we're going to be 

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00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:48,800
dealing with the aftermath and 
fallout, with particular focus 

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00:05:48,800 --> 00:05:51,320
on the characters and how they 
were impacted by Summerhall. 

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00:05:51,640 --> 00:05:55,080
Because the tragedy had many 
indirect and or subtle effects 

124
00:05:55,080 --> 00:05:58,120
on people like Aries and Rhaegar
of course, but also on some of 

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00:05:58,120 --> 00:06:01,240
the lesser known figures who are
still important like Raela, the 

126
00:06:01,240 --> 00:06:03,360
ghost of High Heart and the 
Kingsguard. 

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00:06:03,880 --> 00:06:07,920
This episode endeavors to show 
how one event can impact many 

128
00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:09,840
people across several 
generations. 

129
00:06:09,840 --> 00:06:11,760
The domino effect? 
True karma. 

130
00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:15,240
We'll start with Part 1, the day
after. 

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00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:18,600
The collective expectations from
the Targaryens for Summerhall 

132
00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:20,680
were, well, rather lofty 
actually. 

133
00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:25,320
They expected a dragon or 7A 
newborn son who might be the 

134
00:06:25,320 --> 00:06:27,680
Prince that was promised, and 
that nobody would mess with 

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00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:28,080
them. 
Fail. 

136
00:06:28,600 --> 00:06:30,560
Yeah, fail. 
Instead of fulfilled 

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00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:32,440
expectations, they had 
aftermath. 

138
00:06:32,840 --> 00:06:35,320
Just try to picture the scene 
when the worst had just passed, 

139
00:06:35,880 --> 00:06:37,280
when the survivors have made it 
out. 

140
00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:40,800
Moments later, the castle's 
probably still burning a short 

141
00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:42,600
distance away, while the 
survivors are probably huddled 

142
00:06:42,600 --> 00:06:44,880
close together, maybe in small 
groups. 

143
00:06:45,280 --> 00:06:47,000
Baby Rhaegar is probably 
wailing. 

144
00:06:47,280 --> 00:06:49,080
Depending on how it happened, 
there might be some confusion. 

145
00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:52,480
Blame, anger, fear, surely 
sorrow, a lot of shock. 

146
00:06:52,760 --> 00:06:56,120
Yeah, the the fire would also 
still be burning, probably, as 

147
00:06:56,120 --> 00:06:58,240
we're told by Helene the 
pyromancer. 

148
00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:00,880
Once it takes fire, the 
substance will burn fiercely 

149
00:07:00,880 --> 00:07:04,720
until it is no more. 
Yeah, so I think that most or 

150
00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:07,640
all of the survivors would be 
wondering just what went wrong, 

151
00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:10,280
unless it was clear from having 
seen enough of it. 

152
00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:13,040
Maybe a few others would be 
wondering why it didn't work. 

153
00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:16,240
Yeah, well, we know that George 
RR Martin basically says Danny's

154
00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:19,240
hatching was a miracle of sorts.
But besides the general 

155
00:07:19,240 --> 00:07:23,240
craziness inherent in trying to 
match match hatch magical fire 

156
00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:26,000
breathing creatures from 
fossilized eggs, we know that 

157
00:07:26,000 --> 00:07:29,000
magic wasn't in season back 
then. 

158
00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:32,440
See our episode on the Comet 
Religions and Magic Part 1 for 

159
00:07:32,440 --> 00:07:35,480
more on that. 
So a nice blunt answer for why 

160
00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:38,160
didn't it work? 
Well, there was no miracle this 

161
00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:40,640
time. 
So then that raises the question

162
00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:42,240
of where did everyone go after 
this? 

163
00:07:42,240 --> 00:07:45,320
Well, the Royals probably 
gathered together and found 

164
00:07:45,320 --> 00:07:48,440
somewhere close by to rest. 
Then they'd have likely soon 

165
00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:49,680
made their way to King's 
Landing. 

166
00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:53,920
Because of course, one of the 
biggest immediate effects was 

167
00:07:53,920 --> 00:07:57,400
that Jaharis became the new 
king, so he'd have to get to 

168
00:07:57,400 --> 00:07:59,760
King's Landing to be crowned, to
make it official and all. 

169
00:07:59,880 --> 00:08:02,040
They may have rushed back 
quickly before news of the 

170
00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:04,120
calamities spread too. 
I mean, they may have been a 

171
00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:07,920
little exposed and unguarded. 
And in Part 1, we speculated 

172
00:08:07,920 --> 00:08:10,640
that the Kingsguard was likely 
pared down, and maybe even 

173
00:08:10,640 --> 00:08:13,960
completely. 
Yeah, so so Prince Aries became 

174
00:08:13,960 --> 00:08:17,000
heir to the throne, and no one 
yet knew what they had their 

175
00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:19,520
hands on with him. 
Baby Rhaegar was born very close

176
00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:22,600
to the crown, coming only after 
his father of course, and he had

177
00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:24,560
just become Crown Prince and 
Lord of Dragonstone. 

178
00:08:24,560 --> 00:08:28,600
So baby Rhaegar 2 steps away 
from the throne right away. 

179
00:08:29,360 --> 00:08:32,320
Yeah, Barristan perceived the 
Ghost of High Heart is dead from

180
00:08:32,320 --> 00:08:35,080
Summerall, but obviously he's 
wrong on that count. 

181
00:08:35,280 --> 00:08:39,000
So this may mean that she ran 
off immediately after, you know,

182
00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:41,360
the tragedy. 
And that seems pretty likely, 

183
00:08:41,360 --> 00:08:45,080
especially if Jenny died there. 
Ghost of High Heart seems to 

184
00:08:45,080 --> 00:08:48,320
feel overwhelming grief over the
event, but the greater portion 

185
00:08:48,320 --> 00:08:50,160
of it is for Jenny. 
Yeah. 

186
00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:54,680
So is this level of pain what 
caused such universal silence on

187
00:08:54,680 --> 00:08:57,240
the topic? 
Davos's memories of wildfire 

188
00:08:57,240 --> 00:08:59,680
give us a glimpse into the mind 
of a witness. 

189
00:08:59,840 --> 00:09:02,920
This may explain why some of the
survivors had a hard time 

190
00:09:02,920 --> 00:09:05,200
speaking about it. 
It was just too awful. 

191
00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:08,000
But could there be more to it? 
Definitely possible. 

192
00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:11,320
Maester Gill Dane wrote about it
eventually, but it appears he 

193
00:09:11,320 --> 00:09:13,760
had no interest in making it 
well known to anyone. 

194
00:09:13,760 --> 00:09:16,440
His work was discovered after 
his death. 

195
00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:19,480
We speculated that he might have
waited to put his account to 

196
00:09:19,480 --> 00:09:21,360
paper until all the other 
witnesses were dead. 

197
00:09:21,880 --> 00:09:24,400
Still relevant here. 
Perhaps the truth was 

198
00:09:24,400 --> 00:09:27,480
embarrassing, right? 
Or would it be perceived as 

199
00:09:27,480 --> 00:09:30,400
damaging to the perception of 
the new king or his heir, the 

200
00:09:30,400 --> 00:09:33,520
future mad king, which we talked
about the possibility that he 

201
00:09:33,520 --> 00:09:36,280
somehow started the fire. 
No evidence of that, but it's 

202
00:09:36,280 --> 00:09:36,880
certainly. 
Possible. 

203
00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:41,440
If Aries somehow had something 
to do with the fire breaking 

204
00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:43,600
out, that would be something to 
keep quiet from the royal 

205
00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:45,360
family. 
Wouldn't want that nose getting 

206
00:09:45,360 --> 00:09:47,640
out because, well, that is 
embarrassing. 

207
00:09:48,400 --> 00:09:50,240
Whatever the case, the 
possibility that Jerry's had a 

208
00:09:50,240 --> 00:09:52,920
motive for enforcing a silence 
is definitely intriguing. 

209
00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:55,840
But of course, the basic details
would get out soon. 

210
00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:58,720
It can't keep that secret. 
Yeah, the king was dead, along 

211
00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:00,880
with many others, and some are 
always just gone. 

212
00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:04,640
King Daron, the second Symbol of
Peace, would become a curse. 

213
00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:06,680
And the clock began to wind 
down. 

214
00:10:06,680 --> 00:10:09,440
For House Targaryen. 
This is terrible news for the 

215
00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:12,000
commoners who suffer the most 
when peace is disturbed. 

216
00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:14,880
But it's worse than that. 
It was also clear that Aegon the

217
00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:18,720
Unlikely's dreams of reform, of 
greater rights for the commoners

218
00:10:18,720 --> 00:10:21,520
and fewer for the Lords, were as
dead as he was. 

219
00:10:21,600 --> 00:10:26,360
His son Joharis was intelligent,
clever and capable, but he was 

220
00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:28,680
also said to lack his father's 
strength of will. 

221
00:10:29,040 --> 00:10:31,320
And he was a bit of of a 
conservative to boot. 

222
00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:34,840
So even if he had been capable 
of pushing his father's reforms,

223
00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:36,360
he probably didn't even want to.
Yeah. 

224
00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:38,040
That wasn't in his. 
That wasn't something he wanted 

225
00:10:38,040 --> 00:10:39,920
to, probably. 
Besides, who has time for reform

226
00:10:39,920 --> 00:10:42,960
when an invasion looms? 
Meili's the Monstrous, backed by

227
00:10:42,960 --> 00:10:45,920
the rest of the Band of Nine, 
was coming, and the War of 9 

228
00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:50,440
Penny Kings was about to begin. 
Part 2. 

229
00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:53,560
Jaharius ascends. 
Black fires descend. 

230
00:10:54,080 --> 00:10:56,320
Sometimes it's the little things
that matter most. 

231
00:10:56,880 --> 00:10:59,600
Jaharius's coronation, which 
would have happened later, if 

232
00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:02,760
perhaps much later if or never 
without the tragedy of Summer 

233
00:11:02,760 --> 00:11:05,000
Hall, saw many important guests 
attempt. 

234
00:11:05,440 --> 00:11:08,200
Here comes the domino effect. 
One in particular either started

235
00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:10,880
a relationship or at least left 
a deep impression on the new 

236
00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:14,440
Crown Prince. 
That night the Aries or Jarius 

237
00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:18,520
became king is rumored to be the
same night Aries Targaryen had 

238
00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:22,120
his first affair. 
Maybe only affair with Joanna 

239
00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:25,040
Lannister who came to court for 
the coronation and stayed to be 

240
00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:30,240
1 of Rayela's ladies in waiting.
Now, Aries developed a deserved 

241
00:11:30,240 --> 00:11:33,600
reputation as a womanizer, so 
it's pretty easy and probably 

242
00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:35,800
correct. 
Chalk this up is nothing more 

243
00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:39,720
complicated than that. 
But considering how soon after 

244
00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:44,160
Summerhall this was, possibly it
was lust or maybe seeking solace

245
00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:45,720
and. 
We know his marriage wasn't 

246
00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:47,680
happy. 
I suppose a handsome Prince with

247
00:11:47,680 --> 00:11:49,400
a legit sobstroke can charm most
maidens. 

248
00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:51,880
There's that. 
Yeah, yeah. 

249
00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:54,200
I mean, I have to say my whole 
family died. 

250
00:11:54,520 --> 00:11:57,040
Yeah, he's got to take me, sleep
with me tonight. 

251
00:11:57,040 --> 00:12:00,800
My whole family was just killed.
And plus I'm the Crown Prince. 

252
00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:03,320
Yeah. 
Whatever the truth though, the 

253
00:12:03,320 --> 00:12:06,240
bottom line is well known. 
Arias is lust for Joanna. 

254
00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:09,560
His crude comments and his 
liberties during the betting 

255
00:12:09,800 --> 00:12:13,600
were collectively a major part 
of the eventual decline and 

256
00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:17,040
fallout between Tywin and Aries,
who had been great friends for a

257
00:12:17,040 --> 00:12:18,760
long time. 
Indeed, Tywin and Aries got to 

258
00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:20,720
know each other at a very young 
age, and apparently this 

259
00:12:20,720 --> 00:12:23,520
friendship developed quickly. 
The two were also tight with 

260
00:12:23,520 --> 00:12:27,520
young Stefan Baratheon at the 
time, Air to Storm's End and a 

261
00:12:27,520 --> 00:12:29,560
page at King's Landing. 
Like Tywin? 

262
00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:33,040
Eventually they all became 
Squires and at some point Aries 

263
00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:35,240
would have gone off with his 
family to Summer Hall and come 

264
00:12:35,240 --> 00:12:37,480
back. 
Well, was he different? 

265
00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:41,040
Did he tell Tywin and Stefon 
Stefan was half Targaryen 

266
00:12:41,040 --> 00:12:43,240
himself? 
It's even possible he was there,

267
00:12:43,400 --> 00:12:46,720
but either way, it's interesting
to consider the Tywin of all 

268
00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:49,520
people might be one of the few 
to know what happened at Summer.

269
00:12:49,520 --> 00:12:51,920
Hall yeah, it's easy to forget 
how close they were as kids and 

270
00:12:52,760 --> 00:12:55,520
1516 year olds they don't keep a
lot of secrets when they're. 

271
00:12:55,520 --> 00:12:57,600
From their best perhaps being 
Tywin and Aries whispering 

272
00:12:57,600 --> 00:13:01,080
secret saying about girl. 
It's a weird picture. 

273
00:13:01,080 --> 00:13:02,680
Very weird. 
I don't know which one. 

274
00:13:02,680 --> 00:13:05,120
It's weirder to picture Aries to
her Tywin. 

275
00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:10,560
Passing notes in class. 
Meanwhile though, news of the 

276
00:13:10,560 --> 00:13:13,680
coronation would have spread as 
he and as he was 34 years old 

277
00:13:13,680 --> 00:13:15,280
when crowned. 
Surely it would be well known 

278
00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:17,720
that Jaharius the Second was a 
sickly and unmartial king. 

279
00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:19,480
That was common knowledge by 
then. 

280
00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:22,480
To focus on this too much would 
be to underestimate him. 

281
00:13:22,720 --> 00:13:25,600
But to the Savage Mele's the 
monstrous who took control of 

282
00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:28,320
the Golden Company through 
force, it may have seemed the 

283
00:13:28,320 --> 00:13:31,280
perfect opportunity. 
He really seems like a man who 

284
00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:34,720
emphasized strength over mud. 
Though males likely would have 

285
00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:37,000
invaded anyway. 
Still, this may have given him 

286
00:13:37,000 --> 00:13:39,560
and his allies more confident. 
And when when your allies have 

287
00:13:39,560 --> 00:13:41,680
more confidence, they give you 
more support, which may be more 

288
00:13:41,680 --> 00:13:44,760
money, more troops, more new 
allies that are invested in the 

289
00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:45,560
war effort. 
Yeah. 

290
00:13:45,600 --> 00:13:47,560
Thanks Summerhall, he may have 
said. 

291
00:13:48,160 --> 00:13:50,560
The 9 Penny Kings had landed in 
the step stones and were heading

292
00:13:50,560 --> 00:13:53,040
towards Westeros quickly and the
new king responded. 

293
00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:56,920
Drawing on his father's plans, 
His Grace put aside his grief, 

294
00:13:56,920 --> 00:14:00,280
called his Lords bannerman, and 
resolved to meet the 9 Penny 

295
00:14:00,280 --> 00:14:03,920
Kings upon the Stepstones, 
choosing to take the war to them

296
00:14:04,080 --> 00:14:06,520
rather than awaiting their 
landing on the shores of the 

297
00:14:06,520 --> 00:14:09,840
Seven Kingdom. 
Now along the way a part of the 

298
00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:12,880
war efforts, I suppose he would 
have replaced those whatever 

299
00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:16,040
members of the Kingsguard killed
at Summerhall though surely one 

300
00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:19,320
or two would have remained to 
guard the few new surviving 

301
00:14:19,320 --> 00:14:22,320
members of House Targaryen. 
Except Prince Aries who was with

302
00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:25,840
Tywin and Stefan and they fought
in the war specifically. 

303
00:14:26,840 --> 00:14:29,520
Again, though, given how 
dangerous the war was, we're 

304
00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:31,520
going to guess that the 
Kingsguard stayed close to Aries

305
00:14:31,520 --> 00:14:33,840
because they're so few. 
Targaryens, yeah. 

306
00:14:33,840 --> 00:14:36,840
So the commander of the 
Westerosi armies was Hand of the

307
00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:40,600
King, Lord Orman Baratheon, who 
is young Stefan's father and 

308
00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:44,680
brother-in-law of the King, but 
he was killed by males himself 

309
00:14:44,680 --> 00:14:47,680
early in the war. 
The new Lord, the new young Lord

310
00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:50,480
Commander of the Kingsguard was 
Sarah Gerald Hightower who we 

311
00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:53,600
all know and he took over 
command of the Westerosi armies.

312
00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:57,840
So one would expect that had he 
not died at Summerhall and Meili

313
00:14:57,840 --> 00:15:00,000
still invaded. 
But this would have been Sarah 

314
00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:02,760
Duncan the Tall in command. 
Dunk could have had a shot at 

315
00:15:02,760 --> 00:15:05,160
taking down yet another Black 
Fire rebellion. 

316
00:15:05,160 --> 00:15:10,520
Yeah, he would be like the guy 
who like beat 3 at least three 

317
00:15:10,520 --> 00:15:13,560
of the Black Fire instead of 
only, you know, 1 1/2 or two 

318
00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:16,640
depending on how you count it. 
But instead it would be another 

319
00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:19,520
future Lord Commander, Sir 
Baraston, who slew Meilis the 

320
00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:22,120
Monstrous and ended the threat 
of the 9 Penny King's ambitions 

321
00:15:22,120 --> 00:15:24,560
towards Westeros. 
Nice of Dunk to share the glory 

322
00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:28,960
by dying. 
Yeah, and making way. 

323
00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:33,880
Yeah, now this urn Barristan a 
spot in the King Guard as well 

324
00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:36,520
as in the history books. 
We suppose he replaced some 

325
00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:39,760
other Kingsguard killed on the 
Stepstones, but it's possible 

326
00:15:39,760 --> 00:15:43,400
that Aries had just not finished
naming new Kingsguard when war 

327
00:15:43,400 --> 00:15:45,560
broke out. 
Yeah, we have this notion 

328
00:15:45,560 --> 00:15:48,040
because it seems like Barristan 
would have already been in the 

329
00:15:48,040 --> 00:15:50,600
Kingsguard by it was a little 
puzzling to me when I noticed 

330
00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:53,400
this. 
He was knighted at age 16 by 

331
00:15:53,400 --> 00:15:57,160
King Egon the 5th himself 
immediately after Barristan. 

332
00:15:57,160 --> 00:16:00,440
One attorney that saw him defeat
Duncan the Small and Duncan the 

333
00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:02,280
Tall. 
And it was Duncan the Small who 

334
00:16:02,280 --> 00:16:05,320
had given Barristan his nickname
the Bold six years prior. 

335
00:16:05,320 --> 00:16:09,000
So the point is that King Jairus
knew who this guy was. 

336
00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:13,240
He was a very high profile up 
and coming knight who had ties 

337
00:16:13,240 --> 00:16:16,080
to the royal family through his 
deeds, so it was a little odd to

338
00:16:16,080 --> 00:16:18,240
me that he wasn't already in in 
the Kingsguard. 

339
00:16:18,240 --> 00:16:19,400
There might be some reason for 
that. 

340
00:16:19,400 --> 00:16:21,680
A conspicuous figure Barristan 
was. 

341
00:16:22,960 --> 00:16:26,040
Yeah, Barristan plays a 
surprisingly important role in 

342
00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:28,760
this episode as well, despite 
not having been at Summer. 

343
00:16:28,760 --> 00:16:32,200
However, he was a witness to a 
lot of what came shortly after 

344
00:16:32,320 --> 00:16:35,160
and a few things that came 
before, such as the Marys. 

345
00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:38,680
The Marys, the marriage I made 
that mistake when practicing to 

346
00:16:38,680 --> 00:16:42,280
Marius of Aried, the marriage of
Aries and Raela, which he 

347
00:16:42,280 --> 00:16:45,240
described to Danny as suck. 
I saw your father and your 

348
00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:47,840
mother wed as well. 
Forgive me, but there was no 

349
00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:50,800
fondness there, and the realm 
paid dearly for that, my Queen. 

350
00:16:51,120 --> 00:16:53,200
Why did they wed if they did not
love each other? 

351
00:16:53,280 --> 00:16:56,280
Your grand sire commanded it. 
A woodswitch had told him that 

352
00:16:56,280 --> 00:16:58,960
the Prince was that was promised
would be born of their line. 

353
00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:01,600
A woodswitch. 
Danny was astonished. 

354
00:17:02,120 --> 00:17:04,960
Yeah, why wouldn't you be? 
I was astonished when I read 

355
00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:08,200
that a major part of this our 
summer hall coverage is 

356
00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:10,040
prophecy. 
And given that quote, it's 

357
00:17:10,040 --> 00:17:12,839
pretty clear that Jaharis was a 
believer in such things. 

358
00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:14,720
If not a big believer in such 
things. 

359
00:17:14,920 --> 00:17:17,760
He may have also been a believer
in the rebirth of dragon. 

360
00:17:18,079 --> 00:17:20,680
Sounds a little optimistic or 
even crazy, but to be fair, the 

361
00:17:20,680 --> 00:17:23,640
prophecies were right. 
The Dragons did come back 

362
00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:27,560
eventually. 
Eventually now, we said Jaharis 

363
00:17:27,560 --> 00:17:31,040
probably wasn't interested in 
his father's reforms, but as an 

364
00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:34,400
intelligent man, he surely would
have seen the value of Dragons 

365
00:17:34,560 --> 00:17:36,880
like many of his predecessors 
faced by war. 

366
00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:39,760
They would know that many of 
these wars would never have been

367
00:17:39,760 --> 00:17:42,280
attempted had the Targaryens had
dragon. 

368
00:17:42,680 --> 00:17:47,280
Thus, it should be asked, was 
Jaharis overly traumatized or 

369
00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:50,400
convinced by Summerhall to the 
point that the idea of hatching 

370
00:17:50,400 --> 00:17:54,240
Dragons was a lost cause to him,
or was it his belief in prophecy

371
00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:56,200
strong enough that he continued 
to believe? 

372
00:17:56,800 --> 00:17:59,720
Now, his wife's influence would 
surely matter, is the true merit

373
00:17:59,720 --> 00:18:02,600
for love. 
But we know all too little about

374
00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:05,640
Queen Shara. 
Daenerys's only grandmother. 

375
00:18:06,840 --> 00:18:09,120
Yeah, other than that, she 
survived Summer Hall, you know, 

376
00:18:09,120 --> 00:18:11,600
So we didn't even know her name 
until the world wise. 

377
00:18:11,760 --> 00:18:14,520
That's true. 
It's it's so weird thinking 

378
00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:17,160
about these incest families 
having one grandma, you have one

379
00:18:17,160 --> 00:18:18,880
grandmother and 1:00 they have 
the exact. 

380
00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:20,920
Same. 
Exact same bloodline. 

381
00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:22,520
You know, there's no, it's so 
weird. 

382
00:18:22,920 --> 00:18:25,480
Anyway, it's quite possible the 
Jairus would have continued with

383
00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:29,880
the hatching attempts, so maybe 
without so much wildfire, but 

384
00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:32,600
we'll never know. 
He died after a short reign of 

385
00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:35,480
only about 3 years. 
And you know who took over next 

386
00:18:37,320 --> 00:18:39,880
Part 3? 
Aries ascends. 

387
00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:43,080
Madness descends. 
In terms of Summerhall, a lot of

388
00:18:43,080 --> 00:18:45,600
characters get talked about in 
the fandom, mostly Rhaegar and 

389
00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:48,400
of course Duncan Egg. 
But the character who may have 

390
00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:51,040
been the most impacted is 
perhaps the least talked about 

391
00:18:51,040 --> 00:18:52,680
in this regard, at least in this
light. 

392
00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:54,560
Right? 
Because in general, he's been 

393
00:18:54,560 --> 00:18:56,640
discussed quite a bit. 
Actually, now we're talking 

394
00:18:56,640 --> 00:18:58,960
about the Mad King. 
Obviously we're going to contend

395
00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:02,240
that Aries was deeply affected 
by Summerhall and then it may 

396
00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:05,920
have a lot to do with the man he
became, particularly how much it

397
00:19:05,920 --> 00:19:08,760
had to do with his madness. 
First off we're going to take a 

398
00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:10,920
high level look at PTSD and 
trauma. 

399
00:19:11,280 --> 00:19:13,880
I I never know where researching
a topic is going to take us and 

400
00:19:13,880 --> 00:19:16,880
this is pretty special. 
Going in this direction, I 

401
00:19:16,880 --> 00:19:19,520
usually don't have to research 
outside of a swing license fire.

402
00:19:19,920 --> 00:19:23,080
Without getting too complicated 
though, brain damage can occur 

403
00:19:23,080 --> 00:19:26,440
when someone's stress levels 
exceed the brain and or bodies 

404
00:19:26,440 --> 00:19:28,040
thresholds to handle such 
things. 

405
00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:32,040
This can cause extreme stress 
reactions long after the actual 

406
00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:34,880
event and well after the literal
danger has passed. 

407
00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:37,600
The greater the amount the 
threshold is exceeded, the 

408
00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:39,960
greater the potential for 
lasting harm and more severe 

409
00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:41,000
damage. 
It's actually kind of 

410
00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:42,240
straightforward, and you think 
about it. 

411
00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:45,520
Put it other way, the bigger the
trauma, the more likely there 

412
00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:47,720
will be lasting harm. 
Same goes for having a weak mind

413
00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:50,360
in the 1st place. 
And by the end, Eris was like 

414
00:19:50,360 --> 00:19:52,840
this. 
Many of the accounts written of 

415
00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:56,000
Harrenhal speak of his 
hysterical laughter, long 

416
00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:59,240
silences, bouts of weeping and 
sudden rages. 

417
00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:02,360
Now let's put that in context. 
The following is a list of PTSD 

418
00:20:02,360 --> 00:20:05,160
symptoms taken directly from the
Mayo Clinic's website. 

419
00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:06,800
Doesn't sound like a very 
healthy clinic. 

420
00:20:07,120 --> 00:20:10,680
Too much mayonnaise. 
That's how they heal everything 

421
00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:15,480
now. 
Irritability, angry outbursts or

422
00:20:15,480 --> 00:20:18,080
aggressive behavior. 
There's the sudden rages, and 

423
00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:20,400
you needn't recount his actual 
violent aggressive. 

424
00:20:20,520 --> 00:20:22,920
And we have always being on 
guard for danger. 

425
00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:24,680
Well, we all know how paranoid 
he was. 

426
00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:27,640
Now we have overwhelming guilt 
or shame, and there's the bouts 

427
00:20:27,640 --> 00:20:30,880
of weeping we just described, so
it all fits quite nicely. 

428
00:20:31,120 --> 00:20:34,480
Now on to other characters. 
Jenny of Old Stones may have 

429
00:20:34,480 --> 00:20:36,760
survived and possibly gone that 
herself. 

430
00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:40,320
We don't know much about her and
probably won't until very late 

431
00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:43,480
in the Dunkin egg tails, but 
she's a decent enough example as

432
00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:45,920
a parallel. 
Now a line from Denny's song 

433
00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:48,360
tells us that. 
High in the halls of the Kings 

434
00:20:48,360 --> 00:20:50,600
who are gone, Jenny would dance 
with her ghosts. 

435
00:20:50,600 --> 00:20:51,720
We should have had you sing that
as. 

436
00:20:52,920 --> 00:20:55,160
The first line refers to old 
stones itself. 

437
00:20:55,160 --> 00:20:56,760
That's the halls of kings that 
are gone. 

438
00:20:56,960 --> 00:20:59,720
It's a ruined former seat of 
house mud, which is a first men 

439
00:20:59,720 --> 00:21:01,320
line of kings. 
That that part's easy to 

440
00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:03,200
interpret. 
I see 4 distinct ways to 

441
00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:05,680
interpret the second line, 
however not so easy. 

442
00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:08,560
Yeah, could be that the ghosts 
specifically refer to Prince 

443
00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:11,360
Duncan and the others who died 
at Summer Hall, perhaps children

444
00:21:11,360 --> 00:21:14,120
that they may have had as you 
speculated in the first episode.

445
00:21:14,120 --> 00:21:15,760
That's right. 
Or the ghost is a reference to 

446
00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:19,040
the ghost of high heart, 
pluralized and stylized because 

447
00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:20,920
hey, this is a song. 
And singers, you know, that's 

448
00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:23,120
what they do. 
The ghosts referred to here are 

449
00:21:23,120 --> 00:21:25,520
something from before summer 
halls, another possibility, 

450
00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:27,560
which may mean she died there 
after all. 

451
00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:30,560
And finally, the 4th possibility
is the same, but instead of 

452
00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:33,800
dying there, she made it out was
but was driven mad by these 

453
00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:36,440
nebulous past events combined 
with the tragedy. 

454
00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:40,560
What we mean there is that a 
prior history of mental illness 

455
00:21:40,560 --> 00:21:43,920
or earlier separate traumas can 
significantly increase 

456
00:21:43,920 --> 00:21:47,320
susceptibility to new traumas. 
So let's relate this to Aries 

457
00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:50,360
again. 
Yes, so to account for why 

458
00:21:50,360 --> 00:21:53,560
Aries's problems got worse as he
got older, PTSD can have a late 

459
00:21:53,560 --> 00:21:55,560
onset. 
The realm did quite well during 

460
00:21:55,560 --> 00:21:58,080
this first decade plus of rule 
after all. 

461
00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:01,640
Aries went gradually mad, but it
wasn't merely the passage of 

462
00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:04,200
time. 
Rather, it was a few key events 

463
00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:06,000
that really pushed in. 
Right there were there were 

464
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,880
these milestones along his life 
that that just chipped away at 

465
00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:10,240
his sanity. 
Let's go through a few of those 

466
00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:15,600
things, but first from the JAMA 
in 2013, the researchers 

467
00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:19,080
concluded that people diagnosed 
with delayed PTSD tend to 

468
00:22:19,080 --> 00:22:22,120
experience some form of mild 
traumatic brain injury during 

469
00:22:22,120 --> 00:22:24,160
the events that trigger their 
post traumatic stress. 

470
00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:26,880
They also concluded that the 
experience of additional high 

471
00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:29,800
stress situations in the 
aftermath of a traumatic event 

472
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:33,640
can increase the impact of post 
traumatic stress enough to push 

473
00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:37,520
a person over the line into 
diagnosable delayed PTSD. 

474
00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:41,640
So consider that as you consider
how Aries suffered other traumas

475
00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:45,240
too, notably his wife's numerous
stillbirths and miscarriages. 

476
00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:47,640
Surely these tripped away his 
sanity as well. 

477
00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:50,160
But the big one that we've known
about for a while. 

478
00:22:50,160 --> 00:22:53,440
Right captivity at Dusk and Dale
had shattered whatever sanity 

479
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:55,480
had remained to Aries, the 
Second Targaryen. 

480
00:22:55,720 --> 00:22:58,480
From that day forth, the King's 
madness reigned unchecked, 

481
00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:00,560
growing worse with every passing
year. 

482
00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:02,320
That just sounds so funny, I'm 
sorry Aries. 

483
00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:05,400
The second Targaryen second one 
ever. 

484
00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:09,360
But Aries had shown sides of 
losing it, so to speak, and was 

485
00:23:09,360 --> 00:23:12,160
a terrible king, husband, father
and well, person. 

486
00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:16,200
But of the cruelties and vile 
acts he committed, the worst 

487
00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:19,080
came in these later years. 
The same goes for his obsession 

488
00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:21,240
with fire. 
In the wake of Duskindale, the 

489
00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:24,760
king also began to display signs
of an ever increasing obsession 

490
00:23:24,760 --> 00:23:27,480
with dragon fire, similar to 
that which had haunted several 

491
00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:30,120
of his forebears. 
His attitude was similar to his 

492
00:23:30,120 --> 00:23:32,080
grandfather. 
Lord Darkland would never have 

493
00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:34,960
dared defy him if he had been a 
dragon writer, Aries reasoned. 

494
00:23:35,120 --> 00:23:37,520
His attempts to bring forth 
Dragons from eggs found in the 

495
00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:40,000
depths of dragon stones, some so
old that they had turned to 

496
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:43,680
stone, yielded not, however. 
Of course, that didn't work 

497
00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:46,280
either. 
Shocking, but at least the red 

498
00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:49,200
key didn't burn to the ground. 
It's very interesting to see 

499
00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:51,120
that Aries still kept the dream 
of Dragons going. 

500
00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:54,080
Shows how stubborn the Targs 
were in the face of failure 

501
00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:56,600
there, or how much they believed
in the prophecies, or a little 

502
00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:59,080
combination of both. 
We don't know anything of of 

503
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:02,160
these attempts by Aries though. 
As an aside, that passage almost

504
00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:05,720
certainly reveals where Illyrio 
got the eggs he gave to Danny. 

505
00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:07,040
You know, through Varis of 
course. 

506
00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:11,200
Frustrated, Aries turned to the 
wisdoms of the Ancient Guild of 

507
00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:15,040
Alchemists, who knew the secret 
of producing the volatile jade 

508
00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:18,840
green substance known as 
wildfire, said to be a close 

509
00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:21,880
cousin to Dragonflank. 
So Aries was either either so 

510
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:25,920
far gone that it didn't matter, 
or he didn't blame them for what

511
00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:28,080
happened at Summer Hall either 
way. 

512
00:24:28,240 --> 00:24:31,720
The pyromancers became a regular
fixture at his court as the 

513
00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:33,720
King's fascination with fire 
grew. 

514
00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:38,760
So Duskindale triggered or 
enhanced his PTSD, and soon 

515
00:24:38,760 --> 00:24:41,960
after he turned to Wildfire, 
becoming obsessed with it and 

516
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:44,240
eventually with using it on 
people. 

517
00:24:44,360 --> 00:24:47,680
That fits perfectly, George, you
devious bastard. 

518
00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:50,080
It was right there all along. 
These things about Aries, it's 

519
00:24:50,080 --> 00:24:51,800
really cool. 
I mean, this is this goes to 

520
00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:54,000
show the value of rereading. 
There's just always more to 

521
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:56,160
find. 
I just really just never ending 

522
00:24:56,360 --> 00:24:58,200
and and this has been in front 
of us the whole time. 

523
00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:02,280
Aries also like to have them 
make wildfire jars in the shape 

524
00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:04,640
of fruit, but I'm not really 
sure how to interpret that one. 

525
00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:08,160
Sounds pretty sexual, you. 
Should not be. 

526
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:12,000
We are not the first to note 
that Aries or even Rhaegar 

527
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:16,200
showed PTSD symptoms such as 
Rhaegar's depression, nor is 

528
00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:18,680
this limited to those two. 
Yeah, astute members of the 

529
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:21,240
Phantom have pointed to such 
symptoms in a wide variety of 

530
00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:22,920
characters in A Song of Ice and 
Fire. 

531
00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:26,240
We take this to mean that it is 
intentional and something George

532
00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:28,720
is specifically aiming to be 
humanly realistic about. 

533
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:30,720
Some of these are obvious, like 
Thea. 

534
00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:33,320
I mean, in fact, he might be the
most obvious, probably. 

535
00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:37,880
But Cersei, Arya, Sandor, 
Tyrion, even Aaron Damper is 

536
00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:41,200
troubled by a recurring dream. 
The sound came softly, the 

537
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:44,240
scream of a rusted hinge. 
Hurry, he muttered, and woke, 

538
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:46,760
fearful. 
There is no hinge here, no door,

539
00:25:46,800 --> 00:25:49,320
no worry. 
Though he has only a few 

540
00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:53,080
chapters, he thinks of the 
screaming hinge five times and 

541
00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:55,360
Aries POV would be frightening 
to behold. 

542
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:59,840
Such crazy much cruel. 
Now to be clear, PTSD doesn't 

543
00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:01,880
make people insane. 
It doesn't make people cruel 

544
00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:03,840
either. 
Aries had these proclivities to 

545
00:26:03,840 --> 00:26:06,560
begin with. 
It's at least to some degree as 

546
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:08,720
well as a weak mind. 
On top of that, trauma didn't 

547
00:26:08,720 --> 00:26:10,640
create the worst of his 
personality traits. 

548
00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:12,520
It may not have created any of 
them, but it's certainly 

549
00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:15,000
contributed to his loss of 
empathy, his loss of 

550
00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:18,240
self-control, probably his grip 
on reality, something you never 

551
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:19,920
had a strong sense of in the 
first place. 

552
00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:23,280
Yeah, I think of someone with 
addiction problems that relapses

553
00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:25,040
after, say, the death of someone
close. 

554
00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:28,400
It's a common enough anecdote 
that death didn't create the 

555
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:32,400
addiction, for example, person, 
but it did crush their willpower

556
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:35,000
that they were relying on to 
avoid temptation and 

557
00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:37,320
backsliding. 
So it's like a double whammy. 

558
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:40,880
He was born with issues and then
had more inflicted on him during

559
00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:44,160
his life, and then the effect is
even greater because of his 

560
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:46,400
youth at the time. 
I mean, we all know that the 

561
00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:49,000
younger we are, the more 
impressionable we tend to be. 

562
00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:51,040
So Aries was a father and a 
Prince. 

563
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:54,240
Yeah, but only around 15. 
Yeah, so Summerhall is the key 

564
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:56,800
to understanding why areas 
gradually went mad. 

565
00:26:57,040 --> 00:26:59,400
All the traumas he suffered 
later in life as an adult 

566
00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:01,640
reopened the mental wounds he 
suffered at Summerhall as a 

567
00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:04,040
young man. 
Much of this manifested in the 

568
00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:07,120
form of paranoia. 
He trusted almost no one, 

569
00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:10,160
excepting the pyromancers and 
the Kingsguard. 

570
00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:12,760
His trust for them stands in 
such stark contrast to his 

571
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:15,320
general paranoia that I suspect 
there's more to it. 

572
00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:18,040
I mean, the guy wouldn't even 
let a Barber near him. 

573
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:20,480
His hair and nails grew out of 
control, yet the sword to the 

574
00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:22,880
Kingsguard didn't bother him. 
Yeah, I mean, how does a 

575
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:25,120
paranoid guy forget the danger 
to himself? 

576
00:27:25,120 --> 00:27:28,400
Like in the case of Jamie's 
addition to the Kingsguard, even

577
00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:31,760
after realizing the danger after
the fact, he still wound up 

578
00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:34,760
keeping Jamie by his side 
constantly, even during the 

579
00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:36,720
rebellion. 
From a storytelling point of 

580
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:38,360
view, this worked out nicely 
since. 

581
00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:41,040
A king has no secrets from his 
Kingsguard. 

582
00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:45,480
Plus he tells us Aries liked to 
keep me close, I was my father's

583
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:48,760
son so he did not trust me. 
He wanted me where Varis could 

584
00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:51,320
watch me day and night. 
So I heard it all. 

585
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:54,600
So Jamie gives us lots of great 
insight into Aries and so does 

586
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:56,920
Barristan. 
And by the end of the episode, 

587
00:27:57,080 --> 00:27:59,280
Jamie will get some attention of
his own, too. 

588
00:27:59,960 --> 00:28:03,160
So even after the Mad King got 
into his head that people were 

589
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:06,680
poisoning his babies and or 
sleeping with his wife, causing 

590
00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:10,320
all of his stillbirths and 
miscarriages, he still trusted 

591
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:12,360
the Kingsguard with young 
Viserys. 

592
00:28:12,360 --> 00:28:14,480
There was this quote. 
Kingsguard Knights were 

593
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:17,200
commanded to stand over him 
night and day to see that no one

594
00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:18,800
touched the boy without the 
King's leave. 

595
00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:22,280
Now you might be thinking Sarah 
Bariston was a major player in 

596
00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:25,760
Aries's trust, but this was 
prior to the defiance of Dusk 

597
00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:26,680
and Dale. 
Right. 

598
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:30,400
My favorite way to explain why 
Aries's paranoia seems blind to 

599
00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:33,840
the Kingsguard is also related 
surprise to Summerhall. 

600
00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:36,920
Instead of heroism of Barristan 
the Bold, it may have been the 

601
00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:39,920
heroism of Sir Duncan the Tall 
and his general closeness to 

602
00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:42,520
Agon the Unlikely. 
Yeah, Eric's would have grown up

603
00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:45,880
knowing about his grandfather's 
days as Egg, wandering the Seven

604
00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:48,720
Kingdoms with Dunk. 
Sir Duncan saved Agon's life 

605
00:28:48,720 --> 00:28:51,920
many times and put down at least
two different rebellions by 

606
00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:54,200
defeating somewhat important in 
single combat. 

607
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:58,440
In general, Dunk was ultra loyal
to his king and former Squire. 

608
00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:02,120
He also died at Summerhall, and 
the fragment from Archmaester 

609
00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:05,280
Gil Dane reveals that Sarah 
Duncan showed conspicuous 

610
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:07,560
bravery in the face of the 
conflagration. 

611
00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:10,360
Surely Aries would have heard 
this, and he probably saw some 

612
00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:12,640
of it himself. 
Possibly he saw other Kingsguard

613
00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:14,960
die apart from Dunk during the 
event as well. 

614
00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:17,760
This could easily be something 
that left a deep impression of 

615
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:20,080
its own. 
Whatever the reasons though, he 

616
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:22,560
seemed to trust the King's Guard
more than his own family. 

617
00:29:22,560 --> 00:29:25,560
Even Aries eventually grew to 
mistrust Ragar. 

618
00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:28,720
Which brings us to this. 
There's an aspect of Summerhall 

619
00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:31,920
that is unique to him and his 
sister wife which makes the 

620
00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:35,960
whole thing well conflicted. 
The vast majority of us can't 

621
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:39,040
comprehend the loss Aries and 
the other survivors must have 

622
00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:41,520
felt. 
That's hard enough to grasp, but

623
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:44,440
only he and his sister wife felt
what must have been the ultimate

624
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:47,880
pinnacle of mixed feelings. 
Right, this is really heavy here

625
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:50,840
to to most everyone, Summer Hall
was a tragedy, a disaster, or 

626
00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:52,600
whatever other negative 
adjectives you want to come up 

627
00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:54,200
with. 
There are a wide variety to 

628
00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:56,760
choose from of course, but 
through Aries and Rayella it was

629
00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:59,320
also what is typically and 
understandably, a once in a 

630
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:03,120
lifetime moment of joy for the 
vast majority of humanity for 

631
00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:06,920
all time the birth of their 
first born child, in this case a

632
00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:09,920
son, which in patriarchal 
Westeros is greatly preferred, 

633
00:30:10,000 --> 00:30:12,440
especially for a royal family 
short on airs. 

634
00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:16,800
Simply put, Rhaegar's birth 
creates a strange, positive 

635
00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:20,320
association with what would 
otherwise be pure horror. 

636
00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:24,560
Is there any connection to this?
Relations between Aries and his 

637
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:27,640
queen had been strained during 
the last years of his reign. 

638
00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:30,880
They slept apart and did their 
best to avoid each other during 

639
00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:33,960
the waking hours. 
But whenever Aries gave a man to

640
00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:36,920
the flames, Queen Rael would 
have a visitor in the night. 

641
00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:40,240
So he sees someone die screaming
from wildfire and it reminds him

642
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:42,920
of making babies or something. 
It's an interesting possibility.

643
00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:45,240
By interesting you mean 
disturbing. 

644
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:47,280
And it gets worse. 
It does get worse. 

645
00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:50,720
The day he burned his Mason 
dagger hand, Jamie and John 

646
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:54,040
Derry had stood a guard outside 
her bedchamber whilst the King 

647
00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:56,000
took his pleasure. 
You're hurting me, they had 

648
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:57,720
heard Raeela cry through the 
oaken door. 

649
00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:00,040
You're hurting me. 
In some queer way, that had been

650
00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:01,880
worse than Lord Chelstead's 
screaming. 

651
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:04,480
We are sworn to protect her as 
well, Jamie had finally been 

652
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:08,040
driven to say. 
We are Derry aloud, but not from

653
00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:10,600
him. 
Jamie had only seen Raeela once 

654
00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:13,520
after that, the morning of the 
day she left for Dragonstone. 

655
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:16,280
The Queen had been cloaked and 
hooded as she climbed inside the

656
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:19,320
royal wheelhouse that would take
her down Egon's high hill to the

657
00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:22,720
waiting ship, but he heard her 
maids whispering after she was 

658
00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:25,080
gone. 
They said the queen looked as if

659
00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:28,480
some beast had savaged her, 
clawing at her thighs and 

660
00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:31,640
chewing on her breasts. 
A crown beast, Jamie knew. 

661
00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:34,760
Yeah. 
So as an aside, this is the last

662
00:31:34,760 --> 00:31:38,520
time that Aries and Riella saw 
each other, and given Aries 

663
00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:42,480
regularly slept with her those 
days, this incident was likely 

664
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:44,200
the night Daenerys was 
conceived. 

665
00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:48,920
Not so great. 
Not so great, soon Jamie would 

666
00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:52,800
be the only one guarding the 
King as Sir John Derry left with

667
00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:55,960
Sir Barristan, Prince Louis and 
Martel and Prince Rhaegar for 

668
00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:58,400
the Battle of the Trident. 
And you know most of them didn't

669
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:03,520
come back. 
OK, real quick, a shout out for 

670
00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:07,120
Lady Guinavar's Queens Guard, 
commanded by Maester David once 

671
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:10,920
and future Queen. 
He is our latest addition to our

672
00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:13,080
Patreon sells for captains who 
has gone in a little slightly 

673
00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:15,560
different direction, which is 
certainly OK. 

674
00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:18,040
You guys, when you choose a 
Patreon title, you're welcome to

675
00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:20,240
be very creative with it, do 
what you want and change 

676
00:32:20,680 --> 00:32:22,040
basically whatever we've said 
there. 

677
00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:24,640
Those are mostly just guidelines
also. 

678
00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:27,120
So yeah, he so he. 
He certainly did. 

679
00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:29,440
Certainly. 
Did and that's Lady Guin of our 

680
00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:31,760
of, of radio esteros, of course.
So there you go. 

681
00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:35,920
There's an ad for radio Esteros 
embedded in that that that ad 

682
00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:39,640
there ADD and within an ad 
within an ad no. 

683
00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:43,480
Also folks remember to shop at 
Amazon through history of 

684
00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:45,920
westeros.com. 
Right now pre ordering the night

685
00:32:45,920 --> 00:32:48,400
of the seven kingdoms seems 
particularly appropriate. 

686
00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:50,160
We're talking. 
About a lot if you don't. 

687
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:53,480
If you weren't aware, that's an 
illustrated edition with all 

688
00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:57,160
three of the Duncan Egg stories 
illustrated by Gary Gianni, and 

689
00:32:57,160 --> 00:32:58,480
some of the art has been 
released already. 

690
00:32:58,480 --> 00:32:59,480
It looks really good. 
Really. 

691
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:01,240
Yeah. 
So highly recommend that. 

692
00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:03,840
You're going to want to get your
hands on it, especially because 

693
00:33:03,840 --> 00:33:05,800
I know some people out there 
said it's kind of hard to find 

694
00:33:05,800 --> 00:33:07,360
some of the early Dunkin eggs 
these days, so little. 

695
00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:09,040
Hassle. 
You have to like get them all 

696
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:10,800
separate. 
Yeah, a lot of times you buy 

697
00:33:10,800 --> 00:33:13,120
them use or second hand and a 
lot of those get snapped up and 

698
00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:14,880
some people sell them for 
ridiculous prices. 

699
00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:19,120
So this is I'm glad that they're
fixing that problem for the 

700
00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:20,760
fandom. 
So that'll be out in October. 

701
00:33:20,760 --> 00:33:22,360
You got plenty of time. 
Exactly. 

702
00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:23,960
All right. 
You can also get someone 

703
00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:25,200
started. 
That's one of our favorite 

704
00:33:25,200 --> 00:33:27,640
things to do. 
My recommendation, you've got a 

705
00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:30,920
friend that you know who who's 
talking about reading the books.

706
00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:32,680
They've maybe they've watched 
the show. 

707
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,040
Go go on our site, go through 
Amazon and just send them the 

708
00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:37,480
book. 
Send them the first book to send

709
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:39,240
them Game of Thrones. 
Have it arrive at their at their

710
00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:41,040
door. 
That's 5 or $6. 

711
00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:42,880
That's about it, right? 
Yeah. 

712
00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:43,920
Anyway. 
All right, let's move on. 

713
00:33:43,920 --> 00:33:46,600
Let's go to. 
Part 4 Dragons in the Shadow. 

714
00:33:46,720 --> 00:33:49,360
No, not a shy. 
I wish we had info on that. 

715
00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:54,080
These are figurative Dragons, as
in the ones outside the 

716
00:33:54,080 --> 00:33:56,520
spotlight. 
Now, after all that airy stuff, 

717
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:58,240
I actually do feel some pity for
him. 

718
00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:01,800
Not much, especially after the 
rail a bit and quote we just 

719
00:34:01,800 --> 00:34:04,960
went through, but as a character
he's at least a little grey now.

720
00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:07,320
Which is, you know, the essence 
of A Song of Ice and Fire. 

721
00:34:07,520 --> 00:34:09,800
Characters are rarely black and 
white. 

722
00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:13,320
Even the vile characters like 
Aries and Joffrey and Ramsay 

723
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:17,480
have some something in them 
that's just they have real 

724
00:34:17,480 --> 00:34:19,000
issues. 
Yeah, there's something that 

725
00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:21,239
made them the way they are. 
It's not just random. 

726
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:23,320
Not just random evil. 
Titans, And those are like the 

727
00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:24,920
darkest characters I can think 
of. 

728
00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:27,159
Even Greg Orr has like these 
splitting migraines, you know, 

729
00:34:27,159 --> 00:34:30,679
just a regular thing. 
So the insane, cruel, tyrannical

730
00:34:30,679 --> 00:34:33,920
king is just too much of A trope
for George to overuse. 

731
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:37,679
And I think, and as I think 
we've shown, Eris is indeed way 

732
00:34:37,679 --> 00:34:39,400
more complicated than he first 
appeared. 

733
00:34:39,440 --> 00:34:41,440
Yeah, his madness. 
It's like it has its own origin 

734
00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:43,560
story and it checks out as 
believable, at least from from 

735
00:34:43,560 --> 00:34:45,760
where we're sitting. 
I love it even though, I mean, I

736
00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:49,920
wouldn't love it if it was real,
but I I love how realistic it 

737
00:34:49,920 --> 00:34:50,719
is. 
Realistic. 

738
00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:54,199
So let's look at the other 
Targaryens impacted by 

739
00:34:54,199 --> 00:34:56,480
Summerhawk. 
We're saving Rhaegar for last, 

740
00:34:56,639 --> 00:34:59,600
so now we turn to two people who
are very important in his life 

741
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:02,400
and on their own. 
His mother, Rae Ella is 1st, and

742
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:04,320
hers was an incredibly tragic 
life. 

743
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:08,600
It's easy to drive this point 
home by noting that she suffered

744
00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:12,480
through everything Aries did, 
plus having to be married to 

745
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:12,960
him. 
Yeah, right. 

746
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:16,920
On top of it. 
But oh, there's more. 

747
00:35:17,800 --> 00:35:20,280
This particular fictional 
character really got the short 

748
00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:23,760
end of the proverbial stick from
the all powerful George RR 

749
00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:26,760
Martin. 
Let's enumerate and or reiterate

750
00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:29,520
some of these items, which some 
of which we've gone through 

751
00:35:29,520 --> 00:35:31,520
already 'cause we went through 
them with Aries and they backed 

752
00:35:31,520 --> 00:35:34,200
her the same way. 
Analyzing her requires a 

753
00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:36,440
different approach than what we 
did with Aries and what we'll do

754
00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:39,960
with Rhaegar, because we just 
don't know as much about her. 

755
00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:42,240
We know these details, but we 
don't know as much about how 

756
00:35:42,240 --> 00:35:43,920
they hacked her 'cause she's 
hardly ever on screen. 

757
00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:48,240
She doesn't have many lines. 
So being married to Aries at the

758
00:35:48,240 --> 00:35:51,200
time, it wasn't the worst thing 
for a Princess slash queen given

759
00:35:51,200 --> 00:35:54,000
how common it was, and also 
because he wasn't such a bad guy

760
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:56,440
back then. 
A loveless political marriage is

761
00:35:56,440 --> 00:35:59,400
is not a great thing, but it's 
certainly not unusual either. 

762
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:03,080
But obviously, while Loveless 
might describe the early stages 

763
00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:05,680
of their marriage, the latter 
stages not so much. 

764
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:10,080
The adjectives would become more
negative and severe over time, 

765
00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:12,600
like Marius's madness. 
Yeah, there was the issue of 

766
00:36:12,600 --> 00:36:14,920
that sexual violence, of course,
and there was the absurd 

767
00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:17,840
hypocrisy over the issue of the 
many stillbirths and 

768
00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:19,080
miscarriages. 
Check this out. 

769
00:36:19,440 --> 00:36:23,240
Relations between the king and 
queen grew even more strained 

770
00:36:23,240 --> 00:36:26,680
when Raela proved unable to give
Aries any further children. 

771
00:36:26,720 --> 00:36:31,680
Miscarriages in 263 and 264 were
followed by a stillborn daughter

772
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:35,600
born in 267. 
Prince Daron, born in 269, 

773
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:39,120
survived for only half a year. 
Then came another still birth in

774
00:36:39,120 --> 00:36:44,600
270, another miscarriage in 271.
And Prince Agon, born two turns 

775
00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:49,320
premature in 272, dead in 273. 
Now that's a lot of death. 

776
00:36:49,320 --> 00:36:51,600
That is a lot of death. 
Even for a medieval setting 

777
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:54,800
where you know a lot of babes 
die in the cradle, that is still

778
00:36:54,800 --> 00:36:56,520
way above that. 
I could have stopped like 

779
00:36:56,520 --> 00:36:58,280
halfway through there and you 
would have been like, that's a 

780
00:36:58,280 --> 00:37:00,160
lot of death. 
Yeah, so that's already a reason

781
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:02,240
to, like, mess with someone's 
head and to cause, like, 

782
00:37:02,240 --> 00:37:05,840
permanent trauma damage. 
But this comes after greater 

783
00:37:05,840 --> 00:37:07,480
traumas have already happened. 
So sure. 

784
00:37:07,480 --> 00:37:10,680
But surely Rayella was just as 
saddened, if not more saddened 

785
00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:13,520
than he was. 
Yeah, we're told Aries was kind 

786
00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:16,720
and comforting with the first 
few, but eventually he began to 

787
00:37:16,720 --> 00:37:20,120
blame her and accused her of 
infidelity, basically locking 

788
00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:22,160
her in a queen vault. 
So we're going to. 

789
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:25,000
Call it Queen Vault. 
Yeah, but of course Aries was 

790
00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:26,480
the cheater in that 
relationship. 

791
00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:28,520
It's really incredible, this 
hypocrisy. 

792
00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:30,240
Yeah. 
Are you sure you feel pity for 

793
00:37:30,240 --> 00:37:31,520
him? 
Challenge I win. 

794
00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:33,600
But yeah, I do too, a little 
bit. 

795
00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:37,600
Is it possible that the events 
of Summer Hall, elements of the 

796
00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:40,040
ritual itself, did some kind of 
damage to her? 

797
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:42,520
It's possible. 
The picture is strange when you 

798
00:37:42,520 --> 00:37:45,040
look at it closely, which is 
kind of why exploring 

799
00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:46,720
out-of-the-box ideas is 
appropriate. 

800
00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:50,560
Here's what we mean. 
Royella got pregnant many times.

801
00:37:50,720 --> 00:37:53,800
Harry slept around a lot. 
See where we're going with this?

802
00:37:53,800 --> 00:37:56,200
Shouldn't he have some bastard's
bum? 

803
00:37:56,520 --> 00:37:59,880
We know of none, nor of any 
plots to wipe them out if they 

804
00:37:59,880 --> 00:38:01,440
did exist. 
I mean, the only one we know of,

805
00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:03,760
like, just like, maybe Tyrion 
is. 

806
00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:06,080
And that's, like, maybe that's 
one. 

807
00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:06,880
Maybe. 
Yeah. 

808
00:38:07,320 --> 00:38:09,440
You know, you think that's a 
maybe, and you think there'd be 

809
00:38:09,440 --> 00:38:12,040
at least a few for sure. 
Yeah, and you can't really think

810
00:38:12,040 --> 00:38:14,440
that someone like Virus was 
going on wiping them out because

811
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:16,760
he didn't, he clearly didn't do,
He did the opposite with 

812
00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:19,880
Robert's back if he like, took 
care of them and gave them gifts

813
00:38:19,880 --> 00:38:21,320
and you. 
Know Yeah, well, I, I he didn't 

814
00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:22,760
care too much about the 
Baratheon threat. 

815
00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:24,800
Made that's true. 
So you're right, it's possible 

816
00:38:24,800 --> 00:38:27,040
he it's possible virus is the 
reason why there were no 

817
00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:30,920
Targaryen bastards from Aries. 
But still, not even not even a 

818
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:31,640
peep. 
A hint. 

819
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:35,200
So maybe Rayella wasn't harmed 
after all by Summerhall. 

820
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:37,880
In other words, it's possible 
that the the wildfire, the magic

821
00:38:37,880 --> 00:38:39,240
ritual mess with her womb 
somehow. 

822
00:38:39,240 --> 00:38:41,760
But I think actually the 
evidence might more point to 

823
00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:44,960
Aries being the one that was 
messed up, or both of them. 

824
00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:47,760
Yeah or yeah, they both were 
impacted because their child's 

825
00:38:47,760 --> 00:38:49,640
of incest and they just got the 
bad of the short. 

826
00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:49,960
End. 
Yeah. 

827
00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:52,840
So there's too much, there's too
much confounding data to be 

828
00:38:52,840 --> 00:38:55,680
sure, but. 
I I think it points to me more 

829
00:38:55,680 --> 00:38:59,160
towards yeah, Aries having some 
sort of issue, Yeah. 

830
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:04,240
But anyways, Next up, as with 
Aries, Raela witnessed 

831
00:39:04,240 --> 00:39:06,840
Summerhall and the death of many
loved ones and family. 

832
00:39:07,000 --> 00:39:10,600
And also like him, she probably 
has really conflicted feelings 

833
00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:13,000
about the event. 
As in the mixed feelings of 

834
00:39:13,000 --> 00:39:16,640
tragedy and her first born son's
birth coming together. 

835
00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:20,880
And then to chop it off, she had
to witness her husband cease to 

836
00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:24,600
get along with her son and 
reject baby Rainey's and Elia 

837
00:39:24,600 --> 00:39:26,640
both. 
And Raela loved Rainey's, we 

838
00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:28,720
know that much. 
Yeah, We wonder if her mother 

839
00:39:28,720 --> 00:39:31,920
Shara was around. 
She almost certainly lived past 

840
00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:33,760
Jaharis. 
I mean, he died young, and we 

841
00:39:33,760 --> 00:39:35,240
know she lived through Summer 
Hall, so. 

842
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:39,520
But how deep into Aries's range 
she lived is completely unknown 

843
00:39:39,520 --> 00:39:42,480
and without even small hints. 
So we, we, if there's a hint out

844
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:44,160
there for her being around, we 
haven't found it. 

845
00:39:44,160 --> 00:39:45,480
So we'd really just have no 
idea. 

846
00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:48,960
Ultimately, we know a lot that a
lot of bad things happened to 

847
00:39:48,960 --> 00:39:51,640
Riella, but we don't hear 
anything about her breaking or 

848
00:39:51,640 --> 00:39:52,920
going mad like her brother, 
husband. 

849
00:39:52,920 --> 00:39:54,880
So I guess you just say she was 
tougher the tougher the two. 

850
00:39:54,880 --> 00:39:56,040
Like, that's pretty 
straightforward. 

851
00:39:56,040 --> 00:39:57,920
Yeah, Yeah. 
I think that is straightforward.

852
00:39:57,960 --> 00:40:00,880
She was tougher, yeah, but 
that's that her personality is 

853
00:40:00,880 --> 00:40:03,800
still just not even just large 
in mystery, Mostly in mystery. 

854
00:40:03,840 --> 00:40:05,400
Yeah. 
Yeah, it's almost entirely. 

855
00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:07,960
One safe bet as far as the 
length of her life though, is 

856
00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:10,760
that it she didn't live as long 
as Maester Aim, and that's 

857
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:13,360
pretty clear. 
He fits the description of a 

858
00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:17,480
dragon in the shadow quite well,
with his black robes and oath to

859
00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:20,880
abandon the family name. 
Yeah, but his relationship with 

860
00:40:20,880 --> 00:40:23,600
his family didn't vanish, and he
clearly corresponded with 

861
00:40:23,600 --> 00:40:26,520
Rhaegar and Shirley, his 
brother, the king as well. 

862
00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:29,920
Aegon's kids knew him. 
They had all been born before he

863
00:40:29,920 --> 00:40:33,000
went to the walk and eggs 
daughter Rael called him Uncle 

864
00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:33,680
Maester. 
Uncle. 

865
00:40:33,680 --> 00:40:37,200
'S real cute, but we have no 
idea of his reaction to 

866
00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:38,520
Summerhall other than the 
predictable. 

867
00:40:38,520 --> 00:40:41,400
Obviously he wasn't happy. 
About it, yeah, that's so funny 

868
00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:42,880
to think about. 
That was little. 

869
00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:46,560
That was Stannis's grandma. 
Grandma calling it, calling him 

870
00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:47,200
that. 
It's just. 

871
00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:51,240
And then Stannis shows up at the
wall, like I remember your 

872
00:40:51,240 --> 00:40:54,120
mother calling me Uncle Maester.
Yeah, your. 

873
00:40:54,720 --> 00:40:56,280
Before you think about 
grandmother. 

874
00:40:56,280 --> 00:40:57,920
Your grandmother. 
That's what He's just what? 

875
00:40:58,200 --> 00:40:58,880
Yeah. 
Your grandmother, right? 

876
00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:01,760
That's what. 
When John sent him off, he's 

877
00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:03,560
been like, look, this guy's not 
going to burn me. 

878
00:41:05,160 --> 00:41:08,240
I knew his grandmother. 
Yeah, I was like, OK, but I 

879
00:41:08,240 --> 00:41:09,560
don't think you know Stannis 
very well. 

880
00:41:09,560 --> 00:41:11,560
He doesn't care. 
Yeah. 

881
00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:13,760
Yeah, we have. 
Like I said, we have no idea of 

882
00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:15,920
his reaction to Summer Hall 
other than the predictable. 

883
00:41:16,040 --> 00:41:19,720
And to be clear, when Amon says 
to John that three times his 

884
00:41:19,720 --> 00:41:22,600
vows were tested, this 
apparently was not one of them. 

885
00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:24,840
After all, what would the test 
be? 

886
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:27,920
No one was going to offer him 
the crown again and there was 

887
00:41:27,920 --> 00:41:30,440
nothing Amon could do about the 
tragedy after the fact. 

888
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:34,600
Yeah, the first and second tests
Amon relates to John have him as

889
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:37,480
a boy and then as a grown man. 
And he was old when Summerhall 

890
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:40,720
burned, like in his early 60s. 
I mean Egg was 59 and Eamon was 

891
00:41:40,720 --> 00:41:43,960
older than Aegon I think by I 
forget how many years but a few 

892
00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:48,240
years. 
So but whatever he he clearly 

893
00:41:48,240 --> 00:41:51,200
still believed in some of the 
ancient prophecies like many of 

894
00:41:51,200 --> 00:41:53,080
his kin despite what happened at
Summerhall. 

895
00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:56,520
So whatever the role Prophecy 
played in the event didn't turn 

896
00:41:56,520 --> 00:41:58,240
him off from the other ones 
either. 

897
00:41:58,240 --> 00:42:00,280
Just like it didn't turn off 
Aries and soon to turn off 

898
00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:01,680
Jaharis. 
Wow. 

899
00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:03,600
There was an egg in his cradle 
too, you know. 

900
00:42:03,600 --> 00:42:06,760
So he kind of grew up with this 
idea of Dragons and everything. 

901
00:42:07,120 --> 00:42:10,960
So Prophecy again, showing 
itself to be the proverbial 

902
00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:13,720
sword with no hilt. 
Yeah, here's the maester 

903
00:42:13,720 --> 00:42:17,360
himself, revealing how he and 
Rhaegar cut their hands, so to 

904
00:42:17,360 --> 00:42:20,040
speak, not once, but multiple 
times. 

905
00:42:20,440 --> 00:42:22,720
It was a Prince that was 
promised, not a Princess 

906
00:42:22,720 --> 00:42:23,880
Rhaegar. 
I thought. 

907
00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:26,680
The smoke was from the fire that
devoured Summerhall the day of 

908
00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:29,520
his birth, the salt from the 
tears shed for those who died. 

909
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:33,200
He shared my belief when he was 
young, but later he became 

910
00:42:33,200 --> 00:42:36,160
persuaded that it was his own 
son who fulfilled the prophecy, 

911
00:42:36,160 --> 00:42:39,280
for a comet had been seen above 
King's Landing on the night 

912
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:42,200
Aegon was conceived, and Rhaegar
was certain the bleeding star 

913
00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:44,960
had to be a comet. 
What fools we were who thought 

914
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:48,840
ourselves so wise. 
As usual with prophecies, he was

915
00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:52,200
part right, but you can't really
afford to mess with these 

916
00:42:52,200 --> 00:42:55,160
things, right? 
You cannot afford to mess with 

917
00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:58,200
these things at all. 
So let's move on to Part 5. 

918
00:42:58,480 --> 00:43:01,360
Rhaegar, who thought himself so 
wise. 

919
00:43:02,680 --> 00:43:05,160
There was a melancholy to Prince
Rhaegar, a sense. 

920
00:43:05,440 --> 00:43:10,480
The old man hesitated again. 
Say it, she urged a sense. 

921
00:43:11,160 --> 00:43:13,680
Of doom. 
He was born in grief, my queen, 

922
00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:16,280
and that shadow hungover him all
his days. 

923
00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:20,000
The series had spoken of 
Rhaegar's birth only once. 

924
00:43:20,240 --> 00:43:22,480
Perhaps the tale saddened him 
too much. 

925
00:43:22,760 --> 00:43:25,600
It was the shadow of Summerhall 
that haunted him, was it not? 

926
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:29,160
Yes, and yet Summerhall was the 
place the Prince loved best. 

927
00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:32,680
Now it's not nearly as severe, 
but having a mixed view of 

928
00:43:32,680 --> 00:43:35,680
Summerhall is similar to how his
father and mother felt. 

929
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:38,840
Rhaegar probably knew that, and 
it may have added to his own 

930
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:40,160
melancholy. 
Yeah, or at least to his 

931
00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:43,720
confusion or just his general, 
you know, feeling about the 

932
00:43:43,720 --> 00:43:46,680
whole situation. 
More severe however, than 

933
00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:49,760
perhaps any of his ancestors. 
Rhaegar was ruled by prophecy. 

934
00:43:49,760 --> 00:43:52,160
Yeah, except for Danis, that's 
true. 

935
00:43:52,160 --> 00:43:55,200
But she was right. 
Rhaegar had seriously had the 

936
00:43:55,200 --> 00:43:59,320
prophecy bug and the more we 
look at it the more he just went

937
00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:03,200
with it without much evidence or
data to back it up. 

938
00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:05,080
He just really jumped to some 
conclusions. 

939
00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:07,800
Now we can't possibly cover 
Rhaegar or The Prince That Was 

940
00:44:07,800 --> 00:44:10,800
Promised without stand alone 
episodes, but we can very much 

941
00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:12,360
take a look at how Summerhall 
played a role. 

942
00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:15,480
Yeah, Rhaegar was clearly a 
somewhat depressed guy, though 

943
00:44:15,480 --> 00:44:18,720
we hear words like melancholy 
here, which softens it. 

944
00:44:18,880 --> 00:44:21,480
I think, a little unfairly. 
He may have been seriously 

945
00:44:21,480 --> 00:44:24,560
depressed the way I see. 
It yeah, he seems passionate but

946
00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:26,680
joyless. 
There's no I can't think of any 

947
00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:28,640
of the times we hear about 
Rhaegar where he was like 

948
00:44:28,640 --> 00:44:31,520
smiling or happy, nothing like 
that. 

949
00:44:31,520 --> 00:44:37,000
He was just a really just like, 
seriously gothy type dude. 

950
00:44:37,880 --> 00:44:41,920
But he seems he he yeah, he was 
determined but illogical. 

951
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:44,280
Also, he needed some kind of 
mentor, I think. 

952
00:44:44,560 --> 00:44:47,280
But I guess Arthur Dayne and 
company either bought into his 

953
00:44:47,280 --> 00:44:50,000
beliefs or saw challenging them 
as disloyal. 

954
00:44:50,760 --> 00:44:53,600
Either way, he did believe he 
was trying to save the world and

955
00:44:53,600 --> 00:44:55,600
he was very charismatic. 
So a lot of people went along 

956
00:44:55,600 --> 00:44:57,680
with him. 
And and this there's irony, 

957
00:44:57,720 --> 00:45:00,320
because in a lot of ways, Summer
Hall is a microcosm for how 

958
00:45:00,320 --> 00:45:04,560
Rhaegar with plenty of help from
dead with the realm on fire. 

959
00:45:04,920 --> 00:45:07,320
Will you make a song for him? 
The woman asked. 

960
00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:10,480
He has a song, the man replied. 
He is the Prince that was 

961
00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:13,160
promised, and his is the song of
ice and fire. 

962
00:45:13,520 --> 00:45:16,520
So I know this is a vision seen 
by Danny, but come on man, it's 

963
00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:20,760
some serious assuming, right? 
The prophecy said the Prince 

964
00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:22,720
would be born of the line of 
Jahari Sincher. 

965
00:45:22,720 --> 00:45:24,960
Why this particular kid, 
Rhaegar? 

966
00:45:24,960 --> 00:45:26,800
Why are you so sure it's that 
one? 

967
00:45:27,320 --> 00:45:29,600
But this is a guy who thought he
himself was the Prince that was 

968
00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:32,040
promised at first. 
So he's made a bit of a pattern 

969
00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:35,920
of these jumps of logic here. 
But there's also a larger 

970
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:37,520
mystery here that I want to 
point out as well. 

971
00:45:38,040 --> 00:45:40,400
Of all the references to the 
Prince that was promised in the 

972
00:45:40,400 --> 00:45:44,360
books, this is the only time ice
and Fire is connected to it. 

973
00:45:44,720 --> 00:45:47,960
Yeah, we're not really sure 
where Rhaegar got the idea, or 

974
00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:51,560
if his ancestors or say, Maester
Eamon saw it that way. 

975
00:45:51,560 --> 00:45:53,360
So without thinking too much 
about the timeline, it's 

976
00:45:53,360 --> 00:45:56,920
tempting to see Rhaegar's choice
of Liana as having something to 

977
00:45:56,920 --> 00:45:58,720
do with this whole aspect of the
prophecy. 

978
00:45:58,720 --> 00:46:01,800
But remember that he named his 
own Egon, the Prince that was 

979
00:46:01,800 --> 00:46:05,600
promised, as shown in this 
vision after meeting Liana. 

980
00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:09,280
So that's right, the attorney of
Harrenhal had already happened. 

981
00:46:09,600 --> 00:46:12,600
So to be clear, he meets her 
names were Queen of Love and 

982
00:46:12,600 --> 00:46:15,440
Beauty, then goes back to King's
Landing for the birth of his son

983
00:46:15,440 --> 00:46:18,520
Aegon, who he calls immediately.
The Prince that was promised, 

984
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:21,760
who somehow represents Ice and 
fire in the same regard. 

985
00:46:21,760 --> 00:46:24,000
I don't know how that is. 
So that calls into question 

986
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:26,720
somewhat the idea that Rhaegar 
specifically needed Liana 

987
00:46:26,720 --> 00:46:29,840
because of who she was, IE by 
having a Stark slash Northern 

988
00:46:29,840 --> 00:46:32,240
blood as part of the prophecy. 
Because he already named this 

989
00:46:32,280 --> 00:46:34,680
Aegon as the Prince that was 
promised. 

990
00:46:34,680 --> 00:46:36,080
That's weird. 
I don't get it. 

991
00:46:36,080 --> 00:46:37,880
Doesn't check. 
It out, you know it's very 

992
00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:39,880
weird. 
Other than Daenerys division is 

993
00:46:40,160 --> 00:46:41,480
wrong. 
Yeah, yeah, that's another 

994
00:46:41,480 --> 00:46:42,680
question. 
Remember, that view comes from 

995
00:46:42,680 --> 00:46:44,960
the House of the Undine. 
House of Undine Wrong. 

996
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:48,720
And he's talking about John and 
not Egon and that I don't know 

997
00:46:48,720 --> 00:46:49,520
that's weird. 
It's. 

998
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:51,920
Rhaegar wasn't there for the 
birth of John either. 

999
00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:53,960
So yeah, you're right. 
And it's like weird. 

1000
00:46:54,200 --> 00:46:57,120
It's yes, it would be a weird, 
it would be a weird mind trick 

1001
00:46:57,120 --> 00:46:58,840
for them to play on her. 
It doesn't. 

1002
00:46:59,160 --> 00:47:00,880
It's a mind trick on the reader.
It's not. 

1003
00:47:00,880 --> 00:47:03,080
An errors, the fact that it's a 
vision is the one thing that 

1004
00:47:03,080 --> 00:47:04,760
keeps us from being really 
confused. 

1005
00:47:04,760 --> 00:47:07,440
But that is definitely when 
you're thinking about the whole 

1006
00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:09,960
Rhaegar Liana business, that's a
big thing to keep in mind that I

1007
00:47:09,960 --> 00:47:11,840
think a a lot of time slips 
through the cracks, yeah. 

1008
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:16,320
So whatever the truth of his 
relationship with Liana, the PR 

1009
00:47:16,320 --> 00:47:20,400
was, everyone agrees. 
Pretty terrible, Horrible, 

1010
00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:23,720
nonexistent. 
And though it may be fair to say

1011
00:47:23,720 --> 00:47:26,320
that war wasn't a reasonable 
expectation, after them 

1012
00:47:26,320 --> 00:47:29,080
despairing, maybe not. 
I think it was very. 

1013
00:47:29,080 --> 00:47:31,280
I think it was unreasonable to 
not expect war. 

1014
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:34,840
He knew what kind of man his 
father was for sure, and he knew

1015
00:47:34,840 --> 00:47:37,600
at least a little about the hot 
headed Brandon Stark. 

1016
00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:40,880
Yeah, he saw Brandon's reaction 
when he named Liana do something

1017
00:47:40,880 --> 00:47:42,680
queen of love and beauty at the 
at Harrenhal. 

1018
00:47:42,680 --> 00:47:44,680
So Liana doesn't say anything. 
It's. 

1019
00:47:45,200 --> 00:47:47,680
Anyway, but the best you can say
is Rhaegar may have had good 

1020
00:47:47,680 --> 00:47:50,760
intentions and was entirely 
willing to take on risk, while 

1021
00:47:50,760 --> 00:47:53,160
his father was a coward who 
thought mostly of himself and 

1022
00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:54,680
how his Barber was planning to 
kill him. 

1023
00:47:55,760 --> 00:47:58,000
Also Rhaegar himself, he thought
Rhaegar was planning to 

1024
00:47:58,000 --> 00:47:59,880
overthrow him and he wasn't 
wrong. 

1025
00:47:59,880 --> 00:48:02,480
Probably now Aries feared his 
own son. 

1026
00:48:02,480 --> 00:48:05,120
Eventually some. 
We're not exactly sure when that

1027
00:48:05,120 --> 00:48:07,160
developed, but it certainly 
developed at some point. 

1028
00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:09,400
Something we didn't. 
This is something we didn't know

1029
00:48:09,400 --> 00:48:11,760
a whole lot about before the 
World of Ice and Fire. 

1030
00:48:11,760 --> 00:48:13,960
It was something that was kind 
of hinted at, but in the World 

1031
00:48:13,960 --> 00:48:17,160
of Ice and Fire, it's outright 
stated what we did know was 

1032
00:48:17,160 --> 00:48:20,000
expanded on majorly and has now 
become quite compelling. 

1033
00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:23,000
Yeah, this is true for many of 
Rhaegar's relationships. 

1034
00:48:23,000 --> 00:48:26,920
He won people over in a variety 
of ways, with charm, blood, his 

1035
00:48:26,920 --> 00:48:29,480
noble bearing, you know, often 
his music. 

1036
00:48:29,960 --> 00:48:32,920
Rhaegar's musical talent was 
channeled towards sad songs, 

1037
00:48:32,920 --> 00:48:35,280
reflection of his personality 
and history. 

1038
00:48:35,720 --> 00:48:38,760
He would go there from time to 
time with only his harp for 

1039
00:48:38,760 --> 00:48:40,200
company. 
Even the Knights of the 

1040
00:48:40,200 --> 00:48:41,760
Kingsguard did not attend him 
there. 

1041
00:48:41,880 --> 00:48:44,840
He liked to sleep in the ruined 
hall beneath the moon and stars,

1042
00:48:44,840 --> 00:48:46,760
and whenever he came back he 
would bring a song. 

1043
00:48:47,200 --> 00:48:49,280
When you heard him play his high
harp with the silver strings, 

1044
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:52,720
and sing of twilight and tears 
and the death of kings, you 

1045
00:48:52,720 --> 00:48:55,560
could not but feel that he was 
singing of himself and those he 

1046
00:48:55,560 --> 00:48:57,720
loved. 
So you have to wonder if it's 

1047
00:48:57,720 --> 00:49:00,960
possible that Rhaegar met the 
ghost of High Heart in the ruins

1048
00:49:00,960 --> 00:49:03,640
of Summer Hall. 
She might shun the place, to be 

1049
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:07,520
sure, but perhaps she would want
to go and pay homage to the 

1050
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:10,800
dead, expecting to be alone, 
only to hear a High Heart 

1051
00:49:10,800 --> 00:49:13,880
playing sad songs. 
The dwarf prophet does have a 

1052
00:49:14,080 --> 00:49:16,680
strong love of sad music, as 
we've seen. 

1053
00:49:16,760 --> 00:49:19,120
It's also possible that they 
might not have met at Summer 

1054
00:49:19,120 --> 00:49:20,800
Hall somewhere else. 
Yeah, it's. 

1055
00:49:20,800 --> 00:49:23,280
Truly possible too that he was 
in the Riverlands or something 

1056
00:49:23,280 --> 00:49:25,360
like that. 
That's a good point, but Summer 

1057
00:49:25,360 --> 00:49:27,840
Hall is much more of an 
evocative image. 

1058
00:49:27,960 --> 00:49:31,560
Yeah, it's very true. 
Now Rhaegar's friends in the 

1059
00:49:31,560 --> 00:49:34,400
Kingsguard were clearly altered,
devoted to him, and perhaps to 

1060
00:49:34,400 --> 00:49:36,360
the prophecy of the Prince that 
was promised as well. 

1061
00:49:36,360 --> 00:49:39,960
At least Rhaegar's version of 
it, seeing as how they were at 

1062
00:49:39,960 --> 00:49:42,960
the Tower of Joy guarding a 
child of Rhaegar and not seeking

1063
00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:46,080
out the saris who would have 
been Erius heir. 

1064
00:49:46,720 --> 00:49:48,040
We've no hint that they told him
that. 

1065
00:49:48,040 --> 00:49:50,680
Hey, maybe you're going a bit 
too far with this Rhaegar. 

1066
00:49:50,680 --> 00:49:54,480
Alternatively, did those 
wildfire fumes mess with your 

1067
00:49:54,480 --> 00:49:58,000
fragile infant brain? 
Is that why you have no sense of

1068
00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:01,240
humor whatsoever, Mr. Rhaegar? 
Now it's it's actually kind of 

1069
00:50:01,240 --> 00:50:04,280
amusing that one of the few guys
with clout who would not have 

1070
00:50:04,280 --> 00:50:08,360
been a fan of Rhaegar's prophecy
beliefs is the Grand Maester. 

1071
00:50:08,640 --> 00:50:11,440
But this is a relationship that 
is a bit unclear to us, Prince 

1072
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:13,160
Rhaegar and Paisel. 
That is. 

1073
00:50:13,600 --> 00:50:16,480
We know Rhaegar corresponded 
with Maester Raymond who was 

1074
00:50:16,600 --> 00:50:20,200
open minded about the 
supernatural, but Pisel does not

1075
00:50:20,200 --> 00:50:22,760
seem to be so open minded about 
about the. 

1076
00:50:22,800 --> 00:50:24,640
Supernatural. 
He did seem to know a lot about 

1077
00:50:24,640 --> 00:50:26,920
Aries though, and that gives us 
some of the detail we've used 

1078
00:50:26,920 --> 00:50:29,040
today. 
Aries was actually good for 

1079
00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:31,320
Picelle career. 
As odd as that sounds in 

1080
00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:33,600
retrospect, it actually looks 
kind of good for him to have 

1081
00:50:33,600 --> 00:50:36,520
survived the Mad King's reign. 
I mean Aries had so many 

1082
00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:39,040
counselors and Lords put to 
death at whim. 

1083
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:41,000
I. 
Think it looks bad for him to 

1084
00:50:41,040 --> 00:50:44,360
survive, but you know, I mean, 
seeing how he seeing how he 

1085
00:50:44,360 --> 00:50:47,440
handled Joffrey, we can guess. 
So he was one of those, you 

1086
00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:49,480
know, flatterer lickspittle 
types. 

1087
00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:53,240
You know, he's like, Oh yes, a 
great fire King Aries. 

1088
00:50:53,880 --> 00:50:56,000
Well, well lit. 
Yeah, well lit. 

1089
00:50:56,280 --> 00:50:59,520
And so, you know, that's not 
likely the kind of man that Arie

1090
00:50:59,560 --> 00:51:01,760
that Rhaegar would call friend 
or ally. 

1091
00:51:01,800 --> 00:51:04,920
It's true, Arie. 
He did call Joffrey the noblest 

1092
00:51:04,960 --> 00:51:07,880
king, whoever lived. 
I would love whatever sometimes 

1093
00:51:07,880 --> 00:51:11,320
Cell had to say about Aries. 
What would he call him? 

1094
00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:14,680
Such a he his. 
His glory burns bright. 

1095
00:51:14,680 --> 00:51:17,600
He's. 
The handsomest, I say, just like

1096
00:51:19,480 --> 00:51:27,360
those well groomed king. 
Now, yeah, so again, with the 

1097
00:51:27,360 --> 00:51:29,840
whole thing about Ragar, even 
though he may have not thought 

1098
00:51:29,840 --> 00:51:33,840
so highly of this whole prophecy
thing, with that lickspittleish 

1099
00:51:33,840 --> 00:51:36,560
personality, he wasn't likely to
say bad things about the Prince 

1100
00:51:36,560 --> 00:51:38,480
who he would have expected to 
become king at some point. 

1101
00:51:38,480 --> 00:51:39,480
Yeah, Yeah. 
So. 

1102
00:51:39,800 --> 00:51:41,480
He's not going to shoot himself 
in the foot, you know. 

1103
00:51:42,200 --> 00:51:44,920
So Paisel is good as a witness 
in a few spots. 

1104
00:51:44,920 --> 00:51:47,200
Yeah, and he also kind of maybe 
exaggerates his own involvement.

1105
00:51:47,200 --> 00:51:49,040
Here's a good quote. 
In a letter to the Citadel, 

1106
00:51:49,040 --> 00:51:51,840
Paisel wrote that the divisions 
within the Red Keeper minded him

1107
00:51:51,840 --> 00:51:54,760
uncomfortably of the situation 
before the Dance of Dragons a 

1108
00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:57,840
century before, when the enmity 
between Queen Allison and 

1109
00:51:57,840 --> 00:52:01,080
Princess Rainier had split the 
realm in two to grieve his cost.

1110
00:52:01,360 --> 00:52:04,440
A similarly bloody conflict 
might await the Seven Kingdoms 

1111
00:52:04,440 --> 00:52:07,680
once again, he warned, unless 
some accord could be reached 

1112
00:52:07,680 --> 00:52:11,520
that would satisfy both Prince 
Rhaegar's supporters and the 

1113
00:52:11,520 --> 00:52:13,920
kings. 
But of course, this civil war 

1114
00:52:13,920 --> 00:52:16,440
never happened. 
Instead, a different one did, 

1115
00:52:16,440 --> 00:52:18,520
one that Pricell didn't see 
coming. 

1116
00:52:18,720 --> 00:52:21,440
I mean, not as far. 
It came on quickly and spread 

1117
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:23,200
unpredictably. 
Like wildfire. 

1118
00:52:23,840 --> 00:52:26,800
Now, one day we will cover 
Robert's Rebellion. 

1119
00:52:27,120 --> 00:52:29,000
But you know all the high points
already. 

1120
00:52:29,480 --> 00:52:33,040
What you might not know or what 
you may have forgotten or not 

1121
00:52:33,040 --> 00:52:35,680
realized how important it was, 
comes next. 

1122
00:52:37,120 --> 00:52:41,680
Now the World of Ice and Fire 
Again is available on audiobook.

1123
00:52:42,200 --> 00:52:46,080
This is a great time to get it 
because you can get it for free 

1124
00:52:46,080 --> 00:52:48,720
through Audible. 
Audible trial on 

1125
00:52:48,720 --> 00:52:53,400
historyofwesteros.com allows you
30 days with one free download 

1126
00:52:53,400 --> 00:52:55,280
without having to pay. 
If you don't like it, you can 

1127
00:52:55,280 --> 00:52:57,000
cancel it and keep the free 
book. 

1128
00:52:57,120 --> 00:53:00,080
If you do like it, it's a lot 
more than audiobooks. 

1129
00:53:00,400 --> 00:53:02,800
There's lots of different 
entertainment. 

1130
00:53:02,800 --> 00:53:05,120
There's educational material, 
language learning. 

1131
00:53:05,560 --> 00:53:08,480
It's really becoming a big 
thing. 

1132
00:53:08,480 --> 00:53:12,520
In general, the the the rise of 
audio entertainment is a great 

1133
00:53:12,520 --> 00:53:14,400
thing. 
Obviously if you're listening to

1134
00:53:14,400 --> 00:53:18,600
podcasts, you kind of know what 
we're talking about and you can 

1135
00:53:18,600 --> 00:53:21,360
lay back with your arm on a 
dragon egg while listening. 

1136
00:53:21,400 --> 00:53:24,320
To. 
Roy Doe Tris talk about the 

1137
00:53:24,320 --> 00:53:27,320
history of Westeros and it's a 
great time. 

1138
00:53:27,320 --> 00:53:29,000
I've done that myself. 
I don't know how many times I've

1139
00:53:29,000 --> 00:53:31,360
listened to the book already, 
but many times. 

1140
00:53:33,920 --> 00:53:40,200
Part 6 The Mad King's Revenge. 
Summerhall the word was fraught 

1141
00:53:40,200 --> 00:53:42,360
with doom. 
And that's Danny's perception of

1142
00:53:42,360 --> 00:53:43,920
it. 
Danny thinks that Summerhall is 

1143
00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:46,760
fraught with doom. 
She didn't know her family saved

1144
00:53:46,800 --> 00:53:49,640
Viserys, and he likely knew 
little about Summerhall. 

1145
00:53:49,640 --> 00:53:53,200
He was he. 
He was born, what, 1817 years 

1146
00:53:53,200 --> 00:53:56,360
later after it? 
Still, the perception remains, 

1147
00:53:56,360 --> 00:53:58,960
partly through barrister, but 
not entirely. 

1148
00:53:59,200 --> 00:54:01,520
Yeah, you. 
I have to wonder if Danny's arc 

1149
00:54:01,520 --> 00:54:04,440
will possibly take her there. 
Will she have a chapter in the 

1150
00:54:04,440 --> 00:54:06,720
ruins of Summerhall? 
Will someone else? 

1151
00:54:07,280 --> 00:54:10,160
Young Griff looks to take hold 
of the Stormlands and so it will

1152
00:54:10,160 --> 00:54:12,040
likely be in his possession 
soon. 

1153
00:54:12,040 --> 00:54:14,920
Yeah, imagine the symbology of 
him taming one of Danny's 

1154
00:54:14,920 --> 00:54:17,960
Dragons somehow gone rogue or 
whatever the circumstance is in 

1155
00:54:17,960 --> 00:54:20,240
the ruins of Summerhall. 
That would fulfill the destiny 

1156
00:54:20,240 --> 00:54:22,280
that Young Griff may have 
thought belonged to him. 

1157
00:54:22,280 --> 00:54:24,400
That's pretty cool. 
But it's also probably kind of 

1158
00:54:24,400 --> 00:54:25,720
crackpot, right? 
Yeah, I probably. 

1159
00:54:26,560 --> 00:54:27,560
But it's cool. 
It's cool. 

1160
00:54:27,920 --> 00:54:30,040
Especially if he's actually a 
black fire, right? 

1161
00:54:30,560 --> 00:54:33,800
A black fire taming a dragon in 
a place that once tasted the 

1162
00:54:33,800 --> 00:54:36,160
blood of Targaryens. 
Isn't that all the way to put? 

1163
00:54:36,360 --> 00:54:37,280
It. 
Yeah, yeah, right. 

1164
00:54:39,400 --> 00:54:43,280
As we've said, the sister 
location to Summer Hall is the 

1165
00:54:43,280 --> 00:54:47,120
Water Gardens, so of course I'm 
very worried that the fate of 

1166
00:54:47,120 --> 00:54:49,720
Summerhall foreshadows something
tragic happening there, which is

1167
00:54:49,720 --> 00:54:52,080
really hard to think about. 
Yeah, destroyed by a dragon, 

1168
00:54:52,080 --> 00:54:53,800
perhaps. 
That would be ironic. 

1169
00:54:53,800 --> 00:54:56,920
Built for a Targaryen whose 
marriage to Dorm symbolized 

1170
00:54:56,920 --> 00:54:59,560
peace. 
Destroyed by a Targaryen dragon.

1171
00:55:00,040 --> 00:55:01,720
Yeah. 
Now the last location we're 

1172
00:55:01,720 --> 00:55:04,440
going to deal with is King's 
Landing and the last character, 

1173
00:55:04,440 --> 00:55:06,000
Jamie. 
It's funny. 

1174
00:55:06,000 --> 00:55:10,840
Aries was 15 when the impact of 
Summerhall hit and Jamie was 

1175
00:55:10,840 --> 00:55:13,560
around 15 when the impact of 
Aries hit. 

1176
00:55:14,320 --> 00:55:16,640
Which one was rougher enough? 
I got to guard this guy, Jamie 

1177
00:55:16,640 --> 00:55:18,840
must have been thinking. 
No wonder Jamie was so flippant 

1178
00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:20,880
about his vows. 
I mean, this guy, he was such a 

1179
00:55:20,880 --> 00:55:24,040
terrible like this whole life. 
We brought up Jamie's standing 

1180
00:55:24,040 --> 00:55:27,280
guard over Aries when he raped 
Rayola and how his violent lust 

1181
00:55:27,280 --> 00:55:30,960
was fueled by having burned his 
own hand to the king earlier in 

1182
00:55:30,960 --> 00:55:34,760
the day. 
But we didn't remind you of why 

1183
00:55:35,280 --> 00:55:37,600
Aries burned this Lord 
Chelstead. 

1184
00:55:37,920 --> 00:55:41,240
It was because Lord Chelstead 
objected to this. 

1185
00:55:41,960 --> 00:55:45,760
He remembered how Rossart's eyes
would shine when he unrolled his

1186
00:55:45,760 --> 00:55:48,680
maps to show where the substance
must be placed. 

1187
00:55:48,720 --> 00:55:52,880
Rossart was the head pyromancer 
and Aries hand replacing 

1188
00:55:52,880 --> 00:55:56,840
Chelstad for a very short time. 
Before Jamie killed him, of 

1189
00:55:56,840 --> 00:55:58,680
course. 
And now we have this quote. 

1190
00:55:58,960 --> 00:56:01,680
The traders want my city, I 
heard him tell Rossart. 

1191
00:56:01,680 --> 00:56:03,720
But I'll give them not. 
But ashes. 

1192
00:56:03,880 --> 00:56:07,040
Let Robert be king over charred 
bones and cooked meat. 

1193
00:56:07,320 --> 00:56:09,880
The Targaryens never bury their 
dead, they burn them. 

1194
00:56:10,280 --> 00:56:13,120
Aries meant to have the greatest
funeral pyre of them all. 

1195
00:56:13,360 --> 00:56:16,080
Though if truth be told, I do 
not believe he truly expected to

1196
00:56:16,080 --> 00:56:18,440
die. 
Like Aryan Bright Flame before 

1197
00:56:18,440 --> 00:56:21,560
him, Aries thought the fire 
would transform him, that he 

1198
00:56:21,560 --> 00:56:25,480
would rise again, reborn as a 
dragon, and turn all his enemies

1199
00:56:25,480 --> 00:56:28,160
to ash. 
His Grace commanded his 

1200
00:56:28,160 --> 00:56:31,160
alchemist to place caches of 
wildfire all over King's 

1201
00:56:31,160 --> 00:56:35,240
Landing, beneath Baylor's Sept 
and the hovels of Flea Bottom, 

1202
00:56:35,520 --> 00:56:40,640
under stables and storehouses at
all 7 gates, even in the Cellars

1203
00:56:40,640 --> 00:56:43,640
of the Red Keep itself. 
Everything was done in the 

1204
00:56:43,960 --> 00:56:47,280
utmost secrecy by a handful of 
master pyromancers. 

1205
00:56:47,440 --> 00:56:49,880
They did not even trust their 
own acolytes to help. 

1206
00:56:50,120 --> 00:56:53,320
The Queen's eyes have been 
closed for years and Rhaegar was

1207
00:56:53,320 --> 00:56:57,040
busily marshalling an army. 
Yeah, that's a ominous to say 

1208
00:56:57,040 --> 00:57:00,080
the least. 
So we conclude the main portion 

1209
00:57:00,080 --> 00:57:03,520
of this episode with an eerie 
reminder and the main reason we 

1210
00:57:03,520 --> 00:57:05,720
called this part the Mad King's 
revenge. 

1211
00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:09,800
While one Lannister brother says
he haunted down the pyromancers 

1212
00:57:09,800 --> 00:57:13,320
and forced them to reveal the 
caches of wildfire, we saw 

1213
00:57:13,320 --> 00:57:16,400
through the other Lannister 
brother that his sibling didn't 

1214
00:57:16,400 --> 00:57:19,160
get them all. 
For instance, there's the guy 

1215
00:57:19,160 --> 00:57:22,240
who unwittingly channeled Aryan 
Bright Flame here. 

1216
00:57:22,760 --> 00:57:26,440
Another cache of Lord Ross Arts 
was found more than 300 jars 

1217
00:57:26,640 --> 00:57:29,080
under the Dragon Pit. 
Some horrors have been using the

1218
00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:31,520
ruins to entertain their 
patrons, and one of them fell 

1219
00:57:31,520 --> 00:57:33,760
through a patch of rotted floor 
into a cellar. 

1220
00:57:33,880 --> 00:57:36,480
When he felt the jars, he 
mistook them for wine. 

1221
00:57:36,800 --> 00:57:39,120
He was so drunk he broke the 
seal and drank some. 

1222
00:57:39,160 --> 00:57:41,160
It's crazy. 
But that's not the only case 

1223
00:57:41,160 --> 00:57:45,400
like this, and much of the stock
we made for Aries was lost. 

1224
00:57:45,640 --> 00:57:49,360
Only last year, 200 jars were 
discovered in a storeroom 

1225
00:57:49,360 --> 00:57:51,200
beneath the Great Sept of 
Baylor. 

1226
00:57:51,600 --> 00:57:54,440
No one could recall how they 
came there, but I'm sure I do 

1227
00:57:54,440 --> 00:57:57,400
not need to tell you that the 
High Septon was beside himself 

1228
00:57:57,400 --> 00:58:00,320
with terror. 
No one could recall because 

1229
00:58:00,320 --> 00:58:03,160
Jamie killed the only guy or 
guys who knew. 

1230
00:58:03,440 --> 00:58:05,520
That was Helene talking, telling
us all this. 

1231
00:58:05,720 --> 00:58:08,240
And he wasn't a master back 
then, so he wasn't Privy to 

1232
00:58:08,240 --> 00:58:10,640
those secrets. 
We were just told that only the 

1233
00:58:10,640 --> 00:58:12,640
masters knew where the secret 
caches were. 

1234
00:58:13,200 --> 00:58:15,280
Rossar seems to have been a 
little crazy himself. 

1235
00:58:15,960 --> 00:58:18,240
Two peas in a psychopod. 
He and Aries. 

1236
00:58:18,800 --> 00:58:22,000
He may have taken Rossov, may 
have taken extra steps to ensure

1237
00:58:22,000 --> 00:58:25,120
that the King's orders were 
carried out by being really 

1238
00:58:25,120 --> 00:58:27,920
devious and secretive about 
these wildfire statues. 

1239
00:58:28,080 --> 00:58:29,680
We've just given 2 examples of 
that. 

1240
00:58:30,000 --> 00:58:33,320
Now, what have we told you many 
times in the history of History 

1241
00:58:33,320 --> 00:58:37,480
of Westeros podcast meta? 
When George RR Martin drops the 

1242
00:58:37,480 --> 00:58:41,880
same hint twice, this matters. 
There is still some of Aries's 

1243
00:58:41,880 --> 00:58:43,560
wildfire hidden in King's 
Landing. 

1244
00:58:43,560 --> 00:58:46,280
I am confident it's also more 
dangerous than it sounds. 

1245
00:58:46,680 --> 00:58:49,480
I don't know how the dude in the
in thinking wildfire was wine 

1246
00:58:49,640 --> 00:58:50,880
green. 
I don't know how that worked. 

1247
00:58:51,040 --> 00:58:55,000
But there's one thing they have 
in common, meaning wildfire and 

1248
00:58:55,000 --> 00:58:57,080
wine. 
They get better with age. 

1249
00:58:57,080 --> 00:59:00,800
According to Helene, they are. 
Ripper, now more than ever, if 

1250
00:59:00,800 --> 00:59:04,000
you take my meaning, we have 
sealed them with wax and pumped 

1251
00:59:04,000 --> 00:59:07,640
the lower vault full of water. 
But Even so, by rights they 

1252
00:59:07,640 --> 00:59:11,360
ought to have been destroyed. 
But so many of our masters were 

1253
00:59:11,360 --> 00:59:13,400
murdered during the sack of 
Kings Landing. 

1254
00:59:13,400 --> 00:59:16,200
The few acolytes who remained 
were unequal to the task. 

1255
00:59:16,640 --> 00:59:18,560
Thought. 
Let me tell you, I hear a very 

1256
00:59:18,560 --> 00:59:21,480
silly voice for Helene, like a 
comically villainous voice in my

1257
00:59:21,480 --> 00:59:23,240
head. 
And when I was practicing, I did

1258
00:59:23,240 --> 00:59:26,480
it so well, but I knew that I 
couldn't keep a straight face if

1259
00:59:26,480 --> 00:59:28,400
I ever tried to do a voice in 
this podcast. 

1260
00:59:28,600 --> 00:59:30,520
So. 
Roy Doe Teresa's voice for 

1261
00:59:30,520 --> 00:59:33,160
Helene is pretty funny too. 
Yeah, I bet so. 

1262
00:59:33,160 --> 00:59:36,120
All of his voices are funny. 
I I definitely I picture a Roy 

1263
00:59:36,120 --> 00:59:37,520
Doe Teresa type voice. 
Like. 

1264
00:59:37,880 --> 00:59:40,760
It's like a wise and old man 
saying his gross thing. 

1265
00:59:40,800 --> 00:59:44,320
But anyway, it's pretty pretty, 
yeah, kind of startling to find 

1266
00:59:44,320 --> 00:59:47,280
out that the the longer wildfire
sits there, the more dangerous 

1267
00:59:47,280 --> 00:59:49,000
it becomes. 
And it's already been sitting 

1268
00:59:49,000 --> 00:59:53,160
there for 7 to 18 years and we 
know it's gain and potency 

1269
00:59:53,160 --> 00:59:55,080
because of magic coming back 
into. 

1270
00:59:55,080 --> 00:59:58,280
The world, Yeah. 
So what if Daenerys's Dragons 

1271
00:59:58,280 --> 01:00:01,640
fight in or above the capital 
and a shot of dragon flame hits 

1272
01:00:01,640 --> 01:00:04,000
the right or wrong spot? 
Yeah, wrong, depending on how 

1273
01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:06,240
you look at it, right? 
Or just a regular old battle. 

1274
01:00:06,240 --> 01:00:10,520
And unlike when Stannis tried, 
this time armies fight within 

1275
01:00:10,520 --> 01:00:12,280
the city. 
Burn, burn. 

1276
01:00:12,880 --> 01:00:14,880
I was making a show, 'cause he 
said that I'm like when? 

1277
01:00:14,880 --> 01:00:17,840
Stannis thought. 
You'd burner but torch in the 

1278
01:00:17,840 --> 01:00:20,360
wrong place might be all it 
takes for the Battle of the 

1279
01:00:20,360 --> 01:00:23,600
Blackwater or Summerhall itself 
to just like some funny colored 

1280
01:00:23,600 --> 01:00:26,840
campfire compared to King's 
Landing itself awash in 

1281
01:00:27,320 --> 01:00:30,600
unquenchable emerald flame. 
Now by looking at Aries was 

1282
01:00:30,600 --> 01:00:34,440
shaped, how Rhaegar responded 
and what befell them both, we 

1283
01:00:34,440 --> 01:00:37,160
see how the past can haunt the 
future. 

1284
01:00:37,400 --> 01:00:40,920
The shadow of Summerhall looms 
over Westeros still, and the 

1285
01:00:40,920 --> 01:00:43,760
flames that destroyed it so long
ago may yet ignite again. 

1286
01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:46,440
And none of the characters are 
going to see it coming, but you 

1287
01:00:46,440 --> 01:00:49,800
will. 
Now stay tuned, pass the credits

1288
01:00:49,800 --> 01:00:52,840
for a short after episode chat. 
We're going to talk a little bit

1289
01:00:52,840 --> 01:00:57,600
more about Bragging Egg right 
here, Pyromancers, Summer Hall 

1290
01:00:57,600 --> 01:00:59,880
art, and toss out a few random 
facts. 

1291
01:00:59,960 --> 01:01:03,560
But first though, thanks to all 
the we got a great response to 

1292
01:01:03,560 --> 01:01:07,200
our request for help with video 
and editing and lighting advice.

1293
01:01:07,720 --> 01:01:10,520
Too many people to name here, 
but a lot of you gave really 

1294
01:01:10,520 --> 01:01:12,040
fantastic advice that we're 
processing. 

1295
01:01:12,200 --> 01:01:14,960
And as soon as we start making 
use of a lot of that, we're 

1296
01:01:14,960 --> 01:01:18,160
going to certainly send out more
thanks and shout outs for the 

1297
01:01:18,160 --> 01:01:19,560
people that gave us such great 
help. 

1298
01:01:19,800 --> 01:01:21,760
But we appreciate just the 
people that took the time to 

1299
01:01:21,760 --> 01:01:25,680
contact us, to send us advice 
and to spend the time doing that

1300
01:01:25,680 --> 01:01:27,960
for us. 
So big appreciation. 

1301
01:01:28,320 --> 01:01:30,840
Also thanks to people who helped
with this episode. 

1302
01:01:31,200 --> 01:01:35,760
Yoke boy of Radio Westeros, NIA 
Freel from Wars and politics of 

1303
01:01:35,760 --> 01:01:38,840
A Song of Ice and Fire blog. 
I'm sorry, Wars and politics of 

1304
01:01:38,840 --> 01:01:40,480
ice and fire of ice and fire. 
I always do that. 

1305
01:01:41,520 --> 01:01:44,560
And Rainy Targaryen, Queen of 
Timelines, who helped us with 

1306
01:01:44,560 --> 01:01:48,280
some stuff in this episode. 
As usual, thanks again to Lord 

1307
01:01:48,280 --> 01:01:52,480
James of the Chicken Song and 
the Chicken Dance, who has been 

1308
01:01:52,480 --> 01:01:54,920
providing us with lots of 
support as well. 

1309
01:01:55,320 --> 01:01:59,480
And now to our Patreon credits. 
Thanks to 1st Lord Cash Craig, 

1310
01:01:59,480 --> 01:02:01,720
Hand of the King and Lord of 
Minds. 

1311
01:02:01,760 --> 01:02:03,880
I'm going to give, I'm going to 
start giving him a rotating 

1312
01:02:03,880 --> 01:02:05,520
title because he's got so many 
good ones. 

1313
01:02:06,080 --> 01:02:09,400
Lord Jim the Fortuitous of Lords
and Politics of Ice and Fire 

1314
01:02:09,400 --> 01:02:10,840
blog. 
Damn it, get it right. 

1315
01:02:11,920 --> 01:02:15,080
Lord George Stormsville, the 
cunning Lord of the Chiliad and 

1316
01:02:15,080 --> 01:02:18,160
Warden of the East. 
Lord John Reed of Castle 

1317
01:02:18,160 --> 01:02:20,800
Woodbridge, the Lord Borealis, 
the Light of the North and 

1318
01:02:20,920 --> 01:02:24,240
Warden of the North Frontier. 
Lord James Knox of the Poker 

1319
01:02:24,240 --> 01:02:27,000
Fort Hammer of the Dornish 
Session and Warden of the South.

1320
01:02:27,760 --> 01:02:31,360
Our small council is Lord James,
the scholar, senior counselor 

1321
01:02:31,360 --> 01:02:34,440
and master of whispers. 
Grand Maester Itai wears the 

1322
01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:37,840
jeweled crown of mini medal. 
Jeweled chain of mini medal, 

1323
01:02:38,240 --> 01:02:39,880
Jeweled crown. 
Whoa, that's a big promotion. 

1324
01:02:40,440 --> 01:02:43,000
Lord Robert Jacobs is our Master
of coin. 

1325
01:02:43,120 --> 01:02:46,400
Rosie the Clever is our Master 
of Laws, and Lord James Tuttle 

1326
01:02:46,560 --> 01:02:49,400
is our Master of Ships, AKA 
Grand Admiral. 

1327
01:02:49,840 --> 01:02:52,400
Lady Darla is of Castle Naki is 
the alpha patron. 

1328
01:02:52,760 --> 01:02:55,680
Lord Dan of the Red Mountains 
and Castle Great Bell, breaker 

1329
01:02:55,680 --> 01:02:58,240
of the second stone. 
There's High Chief and Drew of 

1330
01:02:58,240 --> 01:03:01,480
the Frost Fangs, Lord of the 
Claymore, Lord Skip of the Belt,

1331
01:03:01,480 --> 01:03:04,880
Lord of Castle Ganges, and Lord 
Anonymous the Unknown, who will 

1332
01:03:04,880 --> 01:03:08,000
soon be named. 
There's also our Lord Commander 

1333
01:03:08,000 --> 01:03:09,960
Shepard commanding our 
Kingsguard. 

1334
01:03:10,120 --> 01:03:14,080
And sentence of voters episode. 
We'll also shout out to SER 

1335
01:03:14,080 --> 01:03:18,200
Andrew the prophet longest 
tenured white sword SER Paul 

1336
01:03:18,200 --> 01:03:22,800
Greenhand SER dollar. 
It's D SER Dare in the Red 

1337
01:03:22,880 --> 01:03:27,560
Knight of the forums, Elia of 
New York and Sir Patrick the 

1338
01:03:27,560 --> 01:03:29,640
Slaw the. 
Slaw the slaw. 

1339
01:03:29,640 --> 01:03:32,200
That's a great one. 
Also thanks to Lord Commander 

1340
01:03:32,200 --> 01:03:35,720
George the Golden of our history
of Westeros, Night's Watch and 

1341
01:03:35,720 --> 01:03:38,760
King's Justice, Sir Troy, the 
steady wielder of the Valyrian 

1342
01:03:38,760 --> 01:03:41,560
steel blade Fate. 
And thanks to our faceless 

1343
01:03:41,560 --> 01:03:44,240
person who support granted them 
three votes towards this 

1344
01:03:44,240 --> 01:03:47,400
episode. 
Now note that Patreon support 

1345
01:03:47,400 --> 01:03:49,160
could be used for advertising A 
blog. 

1346
01:03:49,400 --> 01:03:53,640
Examples such as Civilization X 
who has supported us and we put 

1347
01:03:53,640 --> 01:03:56,000
a link to their page on our 
supporters page. 

1348
01:03:56,000 --> 01:03:58,800
Also, Lucifer means 
Lightbringer, who we've 

1349
01:03:58,800 --> 01:04:01,200
mentioned before, who because 
he's one of our Northern 

1350
01:04:01,200 --> 01:04:04,560
champions and his name pops up 
from time to time in our episode

1351
01:04:04,560 --> 01:04:07,400
in the past. 
Episode Look at, you know, 

1352
01:04:08,320 --> 01:04:11,800
Maester David who is advertising
for Radio Westeros. 

1353
01:04:11,840 --> 01:04:14,840
That's right. 
Now we're very close to our next

1354
01:04:14,840 --> 01:04:17,440
Patriot milestone. 
As of this recording, less than 

1355
01:04:17,440 --> 01:04:21,360
$70.00 a month away from that 
milestone, which is regular Q&A 

1356
01:04:21,360 --> 01:04:23,240
UPS. 
That sounds fun for all of us. 

1357
01:04:23,240 --> 01:04:25,400
I hope we get there soon. 
We'll start doing those as soon 

1358
01:04:25,400 --> 01:04:29,080
as we get to that milestone. 
OK so a little post episode 

1359
01:04:29,080 --> 01:04:31,920
chat. 
Yeah, we thought we'd talk a bit

1360
01:04:31,920 --> 01:04:35,600
about there was some art of the 
tragedy at Summer Hall in For 

1361
01:04:35,600 --> 01:04:38,280
the World of Ice and Fire. 
If you haven't read The World of

1362
01:04:38,280 --> 01:04:41,000
Ice and Fire, we'll read it 
before you listen to this 

1363
01:04:41,000 --> 01:04:44,200
episode. 
I'm going to say, but probably 

1364
01:04:44,200 --> 01:04:46,680
most of you have, so if you've 
seen it, you can whip out your 

1365
01:04:46,680 --> 01:04:49,200
book and go look at it. 
This is done by the incomparable

1366
01:04:49,200 --> 01:04:53,000
Mark Simonetti, who did George's
favorite depiction of the Iron 

1367
01:04:53,000 --> 01:04:55,880
Throne. 
Yeah, that giant, that giant one

1368
01:04:55,880 --> 01:04:58,680
and the 2013 A Song of Ice and 
Fire calendar. 

1369
01:04:59,000 --> 01:05:02,840
So he's generally a little 
reliable, but there have been 

1370
01:05:03,040 --> 01:05:05,440
errors in the art in the world 
of ice and fire. 

1371
01:05:05,440 --> 01:05:10,880
So there's there's a lot of 
details in this summer Hall 

1372
01:05:10,880 --> 01:05:12,960
piece. 
For instance, in the bottom left

1373
01:05:12,960 --> 01:05:17,000
corner you can see Ryella giving
birth there with a maester there

1374
01:05:17,800 --> 01:05:19,960
birthing her. 
Problem One of the problems with

1375
01:05:19,960 --> 01:05:21,960
the art I see it's the flame is 
the wrong color. 

1376
01:05:21,960 --> 01:05:25,040
If wildfire was the reason that 
Summer Hall went wrong, the 

1377
01:05:25,040 --> 01:05:27,160
flame should be green. 
George said he was real 

1378
01:05:27,160 --> 01:05:30,520
particular about the art being 
accurate, but he may have not 

1379
01:05:30,520 --> 01:05:34,960
noticed that, or that one may 
have snuck by or something very 

1380
01:05:34,960 --> 01:05:36,320
different happened at Summer 
hall. 

1381
01:05:36,320 --> 01:05:39,680
But if wildfire is clearly 
stated to be the a main thing 

1382
01:05:39,680 --> 01:05:42,120
that went wrong, so I just, I 
think that's, I think it's just 

1383
01:05:42,120 --> 01:05:43,480
a mistake. 
I think it's a mistake. 

1384
01:05:43,480 --> 01:05:45,520
That's far more likely. 
When you look in the picture, 

1385
01:05:45,560 --> 01:05:48,640
you can see figures in Summer 
Hall there, which is kind of 

1386
01:05:48,640 --> 01:05:50,640
interesting too. 
You can see people bringing, 

1387
01:05:50,920 --> 01:05:54,720
bringing people along the shore.
Yeah, it's an interesting piece.

1388
01:05:54,720 --> 01:05:58,320
I don't think we should read too
much into it, but definitely 

1389
01:05:58,320 --> 01:05:59,880
worth a look. 
I guess that would be, you said 

1390
01:05:59,880 --> 01:06:00,880
to shore. 
I guess there's a little lake 

1391
01:06:00,880 --> 01:06:02,400
there or something. 
Yeah, it's like a like, I, I, I 

1392
01:06:02,680 --> 01:06:04,760
don't know, I mean, I, I might 
just be, I just like, look like 

1393
01:06:05,000 --> 01:06:06,760
an embankment, like a little 
hill. 

1394
01:06:06,760 --> 01:06:09,640
I don't think there's water. 
I think I'm just like I was just

1395
01:06:09,640 --> 01:06:11,600
calling it that. 
OK, because I can remember that.

1396
01:06:12,040 --> 01:06:14,400
Yeah, yeah, it was just like 
she's like like an embankment 

1397
01:06:14,400 --> 01:06:16,240
and and the maester is like in 
front of her. 

1398
01:06:16,240 --> 01:06:18,800
And then like, you see some 
other people, like someone bring

1399
01:06:18,800 --> 01:06:22,400
someone, and you see some people
in the in summer hall burning. 

1400
01:06:23,440 --> 01:06:24,640
Yeah, it's definitely worth a 
shot. 

1401
01:06:24,640 --> 01:06:28,000
There's like no artwork or 
summer hall or anything. 

1402
01:06:28,000 --> 01:06:29,960
There's like no art. 
There's hardly any historical 

1403
01:06:29,960 --> 01:06:31,360
artwork in general. 
I try. 

1404
01:06:31,360 --> 01:06:35,600
I do the Fan Artist Fridays on 
our Facebook page where I try to

1405
01:06:35,600 --> 01:06:39,040
share historical artwork when 
possible, but there really, 

1406
01:06:39,040 --> 01:06:41,120
really isn't any. 
Yeah, it's usually, we pretty 

1407
01:06:41,120 --> 01:06:46,160
much are mostly showing current 
characters and current art and 

1408
01:06:46,160 --> 01:06:47,840
current cast, which is fine. 
That stuff is fun too. 

1409
01:06:47,840 --> 01:06:50,520
It's great fan art. 
Friday is is a lot of fun. 

1410
01:06:50,960 --> 01:06:53,280
Yeah, it's Fan Artist Friday. 
Fan Artist Friday. 

1411
01:06:53,280 --> 01:06:56,680
Excuse me? 
But anyways, if you have your 

1412
01:06:56,680 --> 01:06:58,720
copy of The World of Ice and 
Fire, definitely recommend 

1413
01:06:58,720 --> 01:07:01,320
checking out this one depiction 
Summer Hall. 

1414
01:07:02,560 --> 01:07:05,120
No, it may not be entirely 
accurate, but it seems like the 

1415
01:07:05,120 --> 01:07:07,960
color of the flange is the only 
thing that seems to be obviously

1416
01:07:07,960 --> 01:07:10,040
wrong with it. 
Yeah, well, there's also just 

1417
01:07:10,040 --> 01:07:12,160
like the thing about, like, how 
many people were surviving. 

1418
01:07:12,160 --> 01:07:14,400
Like you can't read too much 
like that maestro right there 

1419
01:07:14,400 --> 01:07:17,880
birthing Rhaegar. 
And like we who know you know 

1420
01:07:17,880 --> 01:07:19,920
who knows about that? 
Yeah, exactly. 

1421
01:07:19,920 --> 01:07:23,400
That's but it's it's nobody. 
I mean, it's not like the artist

1422
01:07:23,600 --> 01:07:29,440
was there Summer Hall. 
OK, so let's talk a little bit 

1423
01:07:29,440 --> 01:07:32,920
about the eggs. 
There were dragon eggs used, of 

1424
01:07:32,920 --> 01:07:34,920
course, at Summer Hall. 
That was the main thing. 

1425
01:07:35,520 --> 01:07:38,000
And this egg itself, Was there a
dragon in here? 

1426
01:07:38,880 --> 01:07:41,800
No crumbs. 
This one's immune to fire. 

1427
01:07:41,800 --> 01:07:43,520
Yeah, it's just. 
Now some crumbs. 

1428
01:07:43,640 --> 01:07:49,560
Of course, Egg would have his 
own egg in there, his own egg 

1429
01:07:49,560 --> 01:07:52,320
that he was put into his cradle.
That would be the most likely 

1430
01:07:52,320 --> 01:07:55,080
egg to be one of the seven. 
I would think that maybe Amon's 

1431
01:07:55,080 --> 01:07:57,080
egg would be 1 of theirs. 
I don't think Amon took his egg 

1432
01:07:57,080 --> 01:08:00,920
with him to to to the wall. 
He didn't have it when he left 

1433
01:08:00,920 --> 01:08:03,200
for Bravos. 
He would have brought that, 

1434
01:08:03,240 --> 01:08:06,800
Yeah. 
Yeah, maybe Ray and Ella. 

1435
01:08:07,080 --> 01:08:08,960
Aryan, Aryan had only died a 
year before. 

1436
01:08:08,960 --> 01:08:11,000
Aryan the monstrous, the bright 
Aryan, Bright flame. 

1437
01:08:11,000 --> 01:08:17,800
His egg would still be on hand. 
That's his other nickname, Da 

1438
01:08:17,800 --> 01:08:19,640
Ella. 
Of course, like you said, little

1439
01:08:19,640 --> 01:08:23,080
Magor, Aryan's son, maybe his 
egg was around, but I would 

1440
01:08:23,200 --> 01:08:26,080
maybe think that Aryan's egg 
just passed to him, but he was 

1441
01:08:26,080 --> 01:08:28,040
born before Aryan died, so 
that's tricky. 

1442
01:08:28,040 --> 01:08:31,920
And then there was Egg's older 
brother, Darren the drunkard, 

1443
01:08:32,439 --> 01:08:35,560
and his son Darren the brave. 
Neither of them could have had 

1444
01:08:35,560 --> 01:08:36,399
Eggs. 
We're not sure. 

1445
01:08:36,399 --> 01:08:39,800
Yeah, we might have had, you 
know, Jerry's and Shara might 

1446
01:08:39,840 --> 01:08:42,640
have had eggs, but their eggs 
might have been recycled egg. 

1447
01:08:42,800 --> 01:08:44,080
Yeah, it's that's that's the 
thing. 

1448
01:08:44,080 --> 01:08:46,800
Once we go back too far in the 
past, you're starting to get 

1449
01:08:46,800 --> 01:08:49,120
into eggs that may have belonged
to somebody and then given to 

1450
01:08:49,120 --> 01:08:53,399
somebody else after they died. 
Like Regal, who was the the one 

1451
01:08:53,399 --> 01:08:56,120
that danced naked through the 
red Keefs that he was kind of 

1452
01:08:56,120 --> 01:08:58,080
born. 
Father Yeah, a war and a war. 

1453
01:08:58,080 --> 01:09:00,800
Yeah, and so he probably had an 
egg too. 

1454
01:09:00,800 --> 01:09:04,120
And his his he had children, 
even though he was mad, his 

1455
01:09:04,120 --> 01:09:06,359
children probably had eggs too. 
And they were most they were all

1456
01:09:06,359 --> 01:09:09,800
dead before, even well before 
egg was king. 

1457
01:09:09,800 --> 01:09:11,680
So their eggs could have been 
around. 

1458
01:09:11,680 --> 01:09:14,040
But again, those could have eggs
could have been belonging to 

1459
01:09:14,040 --> 01:09:17,080
multiple people. 
One thing I think is pretty 

1460
01:09:17,080 --> 01:09:19,760
likely, though, is that none of 
these eggs survived. 

1461
01:09:19,760 --> 01:09:23,520
I I know that eggs can survive. 
These dragon eggs seem kind of 

1462
01:09:23,520 --> 01:09:25,920
tough, but wildfire is awfully 
destructive. 

1463
01:09:25,960 --> 01:09:28,520
And yeah, I don't know none of 
these eggs. 

1464
01:09:28,520 --> 01:09:32,800
None of these eggs that we know 
of match the descriptions of any

1465
01:09:32,800 --> 01:09:34,479
of the any. 
Plus, you think that that would 

1466
01:09:34,479 --> 01:09:37,600
be more likely to be mentioned. 
You know, once the once the 

1467
01:09:37,600 --> 01:09:41,680
flames had died down, you know, 
they picked up the dragon eggs 

1468
01:09:41,680 --> 01:09:44,560
dropping back. 
You know, it's somewhat notable.

1469
01:09:44,960 --> 01:09:48,560
They all just like ditch out 
Summer Hall, you know, get away.

1470
01:09:48,560 --> 01:09:51,000
The fires are still burning. 
The fires are still burning. 

1471
01:09:51,240 --> 01:09:54,400
And then someone just comes up 
along Summer Hall and is like 7 

1472
01:09:54,400 --> 01:09:55,000
dragon. 
Eggs. 

1473
01:09:55,000 --> 01:10:01,240
Hell yeah score. 
And then they start hatching 7 

1474
01:10:01,240 --> 01:10:03,360
Dragons. 
Oh my goodness. 

1475
01:10:04,720 --> 01:10:06,760
Duncan the Small is another one 
who might have had an egg, you 

1476
01:10:06,760 --> 01:10:09,000
know. 
And he was, I don't know why you

1477
01:10:09,000 --> 01:10:11,000
wonder if he gave up his claim 
to the throne, did he also have 

1478
01:10:11,000 --> 01:10:14,600
to give up his egg? 
Another kind of sad possibility 

1479
01:10:14,600 --> 01:10:18,280
that I don't think anyone wants 
to believe but but makes sense 

1480
01:10:18,520 --> 01:10:21,120
is something we mentioned at the
beginning of the this whole 

1481
01:10:21,120 --> 01:10:23,320
Summer Hall saga. 
It's the possibility that the 

1482
01:10:23,320 --> 01:10:26,000
sword Black Fire was destroyed 
by Summer Hall. 

1483
01:10:26,360 --> 01:10:29,280
If not, if not Black Fire, 
perhaps Dark Sister, perhaps 

1484
01:10:29,280 --> 01:10:31,120
both. 
Which would suck because the 

1485
01:10:31,120 --> 01:10:33,640
swords are cool. 
I want them to be around, but 

1486
01:10:33,640 --> 01:10:35,080
there's just no hint for where 
they could be. 

1487
01:10:35,080 --> 01:10:37,280
And I'm not one of those people 
that believes that Blood Raven 

1488
01:10:37,280 --> 01:10:39,760
was allowed to take Dark Sister 
with him to the wall. 

1489
01:10:40,120 --> 01:10:43,360
So yeah. 
So I just don't. 

1490
01:10:43,360 --> 01:10:45,160
I just don't know about that. 
I mean, I'm not saying it's 

1491
01:10:45,160 --> 01:10:46,160
impossible he took it to the 
wall. 

1492
01:10:46,160 --> 01:10:47,400
I've just. 
If I had to guess, I would say 

1493
01:10:47,400 --> 01:10:51,000
no, he was not. 
I mean, the dude was sent there 

1494
01:10:51,000 --> 01:10:52,480
as a traitor. 
Why would they allow him to keep

1495
01:10:52,480 --> 01:10:55,080
this ancestral sword that it 
belonged to Visenya and all 

1496
01:10:55,080 --> 01:10:57,920
these other famous people? 
Like it's a really valuable 

1497
01:10:57,920 --> 01:11:02,200
sword. 
So that's hopefully not the 

1498
01:11:02,200 --> 01:11:03,760
case. 
But we'll be talking more about 

1499
01:11:03,760 --> 01:11:05,760
Dark Sister and Black Fire. 
They're going to get their own 

1500
01:11:05,760 --> 01:11:08,480
episodes down the line. 
They're already the part written

1501
01:11:08,480 --> 01:11:10,920
already. 
Now there's another. 

1502
01:11:10,920 --> 01:11:13,040
We're going to get a little 
crackpot for a minute here. 

1503
01:11:13,040 --> 01:11:15,720
Just for fun. 
A theory that's been tossed 

1504
01:11:15,720 --> 01:11:20,600
around a bit is the exploding 
egg theory that would be the 

1505
01:11:20,600 --> 01:11:25,200
reason given for what happened 
in the IT could be a reason for 

1506
01:11:25,200 --> 01:11:27,960
what happened at the Doom, the 
dragon egg at the Doom, as well 

1507
01:11:27,960 --> 01:11:32,480
as Heart Home and Summerhall. 
So I don't know what would cause

1508
01:11:32,480 --> 01:11:35,080
an egg, dragon egg explode. 
And there's not like strong 

1509
01:11:35,080 --> 01:11:37,440
evidence for it. 
It's just a something, an idea 

1510
01:11:37,440 --> 01:11:39,840
that some people out there had. 
It was the theories introduced 

1511
01:11:39,840 --> 01:11:42,680
to me by our own Lucifer means 
Lightbringer, who we mentioned 

1512
01:11:42,680 --> 01:11:46,000
earlier as a supporter of the 
show and a great a song of eyes 

1513
01:11:46,000 --> 01:11:48,120
and fire thinker. 
I really like his his some of 

1514
01:11:48,120 --> 01:11:50,840
his real ancient like large 
scale history analysis. 

1515
01:11:50,840 --> 01:11:53,200
So like I said, his blog, his 
link to his blog on our 

1516
01:11:53,200 --> 01:11:54,480
supporters page. 
Check that out. 

1517
01:11:54,840 --> 01:11:58,720
But that's basically the idea 
that that's something that This 

1518
01:11:58,720 --> 01:12:02,800
is why the faceless man wanted 
the egg from Euron, that Euron 

1519
01:12:02,920 --> 01:12:06,360
may have paid them to 
assassinate Balon Greyjoy with 

1520
01:12:06,520 --> 01:12:09,560
that they have somewhat desire 
for this egg, some use for it. 

1521
01:12:09,800 --> 01:12:12,680
And that would be, you know, 
they they've had an egg to blow 

1522
01:12:12,680 --> 01:12:15,040
up, you know, hard home and the 
doom. 

1523
01:12:15,040 --> 01:12:16,640
And now they want to do that 
again. 

1524
01:12:16,640 --> 01:12:20,200
I don't know where what they 
would use it on that would be 

1525
01:12:20,200 --> 01:12:22,480
building on something that's 
already a bit crackpot. 

1526
01:12:22,480 --> 01:12:27,000
But it's a cool idea. 
I'm not a big tinfoil guy, but I

1527
01:12:27,000 --> 01:12:31,600
do enjoy some tinfoil. 
And I when a theory has, you 

1528
01:12:31,600 --> 01:12:34,520
know, is pretty well developed, 
you know, I think it's fun to 

1529
01:12:34,520 --> 01:12:36,920
talk about a couple other things
just for fun. 

1530
01:12:36,920 --> 01:12:40,400
There's a few things that we ran
across while researching this 

1531
01:12:40,400 --> 01:12:45,440
episode that didn't really fit 
in any narratives that we kind 

1532
01:12:45,440 --> 01:12:48,320
of decided to go with for this 
episode. 

1533
01:12:49,040 --> 01:12:51,240
What about Jaharius living a 
little longer? 

1534
01:12:51,240 --> 01:12:52,560
I'm not a big on what ifs 
either. 

1535
01:12:52,560 --> 01:12:54,800
It's just it's just so 
complicated. 

1536
01:12:55,480 --> 01:12:57,200
But I like simple what ifs are 
OK. 

1537
01:12:57,200 --> 01:12:59,480
I just don't like what ifs after
other what ifs. 

1538
01:12:59,480 --> 01:13:02,080
That's just going too far. 
It becomes fan fiction 

1539
01:13:02,080 --> 01:13:04,360
basically. 
But simple what ifs, I think are

1540
01:13:04,360 --> 01:13:07,960
kind of fun because you're just 
not stepping too far away from 

1541
01:13:07,960 --> 01:13:09,800
the source material. 
So what if? 

1542
01:13:10,040 --> 01:13:13,120
Who would Jaharis have married 
Rhaegar to if Jaharis hadn't 

1543
01:13:13,120 --> 01:13:14,600
died so young? 
See, that isn't a what if, 

1544
01:13:14,600 --> 01:13:16,160
that's a who? 
That's a what? 

1545
01:13:16,160 --> 01:13:16,600
Who? 
Yeah. 

1546
01:13:16,600 --> 01:13:19,760
Who, what, where, but. 
I think probably would have had 

1547
01:13:19,760 --> 01:13:23,640
another kid, they would have had
a daughter, they would have had 

1548
01:13:23,640 --> 01:13:26,400
some sort of child. 
That's possible, yeah. 

1549
01:13:26,400 --> 01:13:29,160
Maybe, you know, maybe it would 
have been easily possible for 

1550
01:13:29,160 --> 01:13:31,720
Jaharis and Shara. 
Everyone wiped out you. 

1551
01:13:31,800 --> 01:13:33,520
You think they try to have 
someone else? 

1552
01:13:33,720 --> 01:13:35,320
That's a good point. 
That's a very good point. 

1553
01:13:35,320 --> 01:13:37,040
And so he would have married his
aunt. 

1554
01:13:38,360 --> 01:13:39,840
Stress. 
Weird. 

1555
01:13:40,480 --> 01:13:41,520
But you know, it's even 
possible. 

1556
01:13:41,520 --> 01:13:42,800
What's even? 
It's kind of funky to think 

1557
01:13:42,800 --> 01:13:44,680
about. 
Harris and Shara were not too 

1558
01:13:44,680 --> 01:13:45,880
old. 
They could have had more kids 

1559
01:13:45,880 --> 01:13:46,880
themselves. 
I'm. 

1560
01:13:46,920 --> 01:13:48,640
Just my mean. 
That's. 

1561
01:13:48,640 --> 01:13:50,200
Shara would. 
Have a child. 

1562
01:13:50,200 --> 01:13:52,960
They would have tried to have a 
kid because everyone was wiped 

1563
01:13:52,960 --> 01:13:55,000
out, so they maybe would have 
tried. 

1564
01:13:55,080 --> 01:13:56,320
To have some, Yeah, I 
misunderstood. 

1565
01:13:56,320 --> 01:13:58,320
That makes a lot of sense. 
Yeah, because Rhaegar's a baby, 

1566
01:13:58,320 --> 01:14:00,000
and if they had another baby, 
their age would be pretty close.

1567
01:14:00,000 --> 01:14:02,240
Obviously Aries and Raella were 
trying. 

1568
01:14:02,480 --> 01:14:05,440
So like if they if they lived, 
then they would be like, OK, 

1569
01:14:05,440 --> 01:14:08,240
well, they're not succeeding. 
Let's have a child again. 

1570
01:14:08,480 --> 01:14:15,840
It'd be kind of a reversal sort 
of of what happened with Prince 

1571
01:14:15,840 --> 01:14:18,360
Damon and Rainiera. 
This is the first time an uncle 

1572
01:14:18,360 --> 01:14:20,200
married a dog. 
And this would be, of course, 

1573
01:14:20,200 --> 01:14:24,040
would be reversed, sort of. 
This child wouldn't be 

1574
01:14:24,080 --> 01:14:24,840
Rhaegar's. 
Aunt. 

1575
01:14:24,840 --> 01:14:27,600
Well, it would be the same for. 
Yeah, well, it would be. 

1576
01:14:28,320 --> 01:14:30,760
It would be the same for 
Daenerys and Rhaegar. 

1577
01:14:30,840 --> 01:14:32,840
Oh, yeah, I'll put uncle. 
And that's true. 

1578
01:14:32,840 --> 01:14:33,920
Maybe not for Daenerys and 
Rhaegar. 

1579
01:14:33,920 --> 01:14:35,160
Daenerys and Aegon. 
You're right. 

1580
01:14:35,200 --> 01:14:38,560
Oh yeah. 
But yeah, that's awfully funny. 

1581
01:14:39,760 --> 01:14:41,000
It's random. 
All right. 

1582
01:14:41,040 --> 01:14:45,240
You know, if Sheriff Rhaegar 
marries Sharon, she's been way 

1583
01:14:45,240 --> 01:14:46,440
older. 
Yeah, that'd be too. 

1584
01:14:46,440 --> 01:14:47,920
Well, she wouldn't be so. 
Just looking at other. 

1585
01:14:48,200 --> 01:14:50,960
Marrying her, that's. 
Wait, would it be marrying his 

1586
01:14:50,960 --> 01:14:52,240
own grandmother? 
Yeah, that would be weird. 

1587
01:14:53,000 --> 01:14:54,280
Weird. 
But if the timeline worked out 

1588
01:14:54,280 --> 01:14:55,680
differently, that kind of thing 
would be possible. 

1589
01:14:55,800 --> 01:14:58,080
It'd be possible for the 
grandmother to not be that much 

1590
01:14:58,120 --> 01:14:59,280
older. 
That's what I was thinking of 

1591
01:14:59,280 --> 01:15:00,960
because I knew that they were 
real young. 

1592
01:15:00,960 --> 01:15:02,720
They both said the parents were 
really young. 

1593
01:15:02,720 --> 01:15:04,960
So I was like, is it, was it 
technically possible for her to 

1594
01:15:04,960 --> 01:15:06,960
have kids? 
No, I'm not with. 

1595
01:15:07,160 --> 01:15:11,520
Fun with incest, yeah. 
But. 

1596
01:15:11,880 --> 01:15:14,440
When is incest ever fun? 
Well, the Targaryens make it 

1597
01:15:14,440 --> 01:15:16,320
fun. 
But yeah, there's not really any

1598
01:15:16,400 --> 01:15:20,840
family ties that Jahari's had 
that we could draw from in terms

1599
01:15:20,840 --> 01:15:23,480
of who we would marry Rhaegar to
other than a Targaryen, if he 

1600
01:15:23,480 --> 01:15:27,160
was so into an intermarriage. 
Yeah, that's true. 

1601
01:15:27,160 --> 01:15:28,080
He was in here. 
You're right. 

1602
01:15:28,080 --> 01:15:30,120
He was an intermarriage with his
father that was kind of breaking

1603
01:15:30,120 --> 01:15:32,360
the tradition he and his his 
sister kind of brought. 

1604
01:15:32,360 --> 01:15:36,320
That back Aries and Rail and 
Mary and he thought it was the 

1605
01:15:36,320 --> 01:15:39,280
thing to do. 
He brought it back into vogue, I

1606
01:15:39,360 --> 01:15:40,960
guess. 
But bringing. 

1607
01:15:41,040 --> 01:15:45,040
Incest back. 
So yeah, I I guess it would have

1608
01:15:45,040 --> 01:15:47,440
been a priority of his to get 
some sort of female in the 

1609
01:15:47,440 --> 01:15:51,160
family for Rhaegar, but I don't 
know what his alternative would 

1610
01:15:51,160 --> 01:15:53,440
have been. 
Me neither. 

1611
01:15:53,440 --> 01:15:55,800
It's it's it's big. 
That's just the hence the 

1612
01:15:55,800 --> 01:15:57,960
problems with what if question. 
Do you ever know what they would

1613
01:15:57,960 --> 01:15:59,640
have done or what decisions they
would have made? 

1614
01:15:59,640 --> 01:16:03,000
Or maybe they could have brought
out one of the maybe they could 

1615
01:16:03,000 --> 01:16:04,240
have been a Baratheon or 
something. 

1616
01:16:04,240 --> 01:16:05,440
I don't know. 
Yeah. 

1617
01:16:05,960 --> 01:16:08,920
Anyway, yeah, I. 
Mean maybe they would have let 

1618
01:16:09,240 --> 01:16:13,120
let Tywin marry Sorcey to him. 
Yeah, Harris might have been OK 

1619
01:16:13,120 --> 01:16:13,760
with that. 
Yeah. 

1620
01:16:13,840 --> 01:16:15,800
Well, he would have been like, 
that makes perfect sense. 

1621
01:16:15,800 --> 01:16:19,920
And she's blonde, so it'll at 
least be decent in terms of, you

1622
01:16:20,000 --> 01:16:21,920
know, Yeah, it'll. 
Keep the Targaryen good looks 

1623
01:16:21,920 --> 01:16:22,880
around. 
Yeah, yeah. 

1624
01:16:22,920 --> 01:16:24,720
That's the what if I I like is 
yeah. 

1625
01:16:25,040 --> 01:16:26,480
Rhaegar had married Cersei. 
It's funny. 

1626
01:16:27,400 --> 01:16:30,960
To think about cause Cersei 
Arias is, you know crazy and and

1627
01:16:30,960 --> 01:16:34,240
random and Rhaegar is who he is.
But Cersei to me, you know, 

1628
01:16:34,240 --> 01:16:36,880
there was there used to be 
rumors and theories that Cersei 

1629
01:16:36,880 --> 01:16:41,200
was a potential child of Aries's
too, but the you know, the song 

1630
01:16:41,200 --> 01:16:43,120
about the world of the license 
fire pretty much crushed that 

1631
01:16:43,120 --> 01:16:45,720
theory. 
But, and it actually in a way I 

1632
01:16:45,720 --> 01:16:48,800
like to think about Cersei as 
Cersei isn't dragon fire. 

1633
01:16:48,800 --> 01:16:49,320
She's wow. 
She. 

1634
01:16:50,040 --> 01:16:52,600
You know, she's that kind of 
crazy, just whatever she 

1635
01:16:52,600 --> 01:16:55,280
touches, she destroys and you 
never can tell where it's going 

1636
01:16:55,280 --> 01:16:58,560
to go next. 
Whereas, you know, Rhaegar was 

1637
01:16:58,560 --> 01:17:04,360
more focused but illogical as we
went over before. 

1638
01:17:05,120 --> 01:17:09,560
One other random fun fact that 
we'll throw out who remembers 

1639
01:17:09,560 --> 01:17:12,360
Squire Dollbridge? 
I know that name is familiar to 

1640
01:17:12,360 --> 01:17:13,440
you. 
If you don't remember exactly 

1641
01:17:13,440 --> 01:17:18,360
who he is, he's the guy that was
in Corn Halfan's party when Jon 

1642
01:17:18,360 --> 01:17:20,800
Snow went beyond the Wall for 
the first time. 

1643
01:17:21,360 --> 01:17:24,520
He's the one that stayed behind 
to guard the Gorge to sacrifice 

1644
01:17:24,520 --> 01:17:27,720
himself, picking off wildlings 
as they went through to delay 

1645
01:17:27,720 --> 01:17:31,600
them so that Corin and John and 
Eben and Stonesnake could get 

1646
01:17:31,600 --> 01:17:35,240
away. 
Well, remember who Squire 

1647
01:17:35,240 --> 01:17:37,080
Dollridge was a Squire for in 
his youth. 

1648
01:17:37,560 --> 01:17:42,800
King Jahari's the second old guy
apparently, and Jahari, as we 

1649
01:17:42,800 --> 01:17:45,080
know, wasn't much of A fighter. 
So I don't know, maybe he had an

1650
01:17:45,080 --> 01:17:47,800
easy job. 
But you wonder why he ended up 

1651
01:17:47,800 --> 01:17:49,960
on the wall. 
Did he do something wrong? 

1652
01:17:50,600 --> 01:17:53,000
Did he did he fight in the war 
of 9 Penny Kings? 

1653
01:17:53,000 --> 01:17:54,800
I mean, he probably would have 
stayed behind with his king if 

1654
01:17:54,800 --> 01:17:58,360
he was Squire to him or but he 
certainly never got beyond 

1655
01:17:58,360 --> 01:18:00,000
Squire. 
Or of course, the nickname 

1656
01:18:00,000 --> 01:18:02,680
Squire is his nickname. 
That's not, you know, he he 

1657
01:18:02,680 --> 01:18:03,920
doesn't seem like he was ever 
knighted. 

1658
01:18:04,200 --> 01:18:06,280
But it's interesting. 
I like to think about that. 

1659
01:18:06,440 --> 01:18:09,920
And such are these small dot 
connectings that we can always 

1660
01:18:09,920 --> 01:18:11,880
do with the Song of Ice and 
Fire. 

1661
01:18:13,080 --> 01:18:19,120
That concludes today's episode. 
If you are a sports fan and you 

1662
01:18:19,120 --> 01:18:23,880
like drafting or fantasy sports,
go to historyofwesteros.com and 

1663
01:18:23,880 --> 01:18:28,240
sign up for DraftKings. 
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01:18:28,240 --> 01:18:30,600
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01:18:30,600 --> 01:18:34,240
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1668
01:18:40,320 --> 01:18:43,720
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1669
01:18:43,720 --> 01:18:47,120
see how your players do. 
It's a lot of fun and frankly, 

1670
01:18:47,120 --> 01:18:51,640
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1671
01:18:51,640 --> 01:18:54,680
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That's why we're advertising it 

1672
01:18:54,680 --> 01:18:56,720
here. 
It's one of the only the only 

1673
01:18:56,720 --> 01:18:59,120
thing we talked about that's 
unrelated to A Song of Ice and 

1674
01:18:59,120 --> 01:19:00,360
Fire. 
But hey, we got to do what we 

1675
01:19:00,360 --> 01:19:06,160
got to do to make this thing 
workable as a job for us and. 

1676
01:19:06,160 --> 01:19:08,320
You've done it. 
We'll have look at this, look at

1677
01:19:08,320 --> 01:19:09,600
this. 
The egg is empty. 

1678
01:19:09,600 --> 01:19:13,360
There's no cookies. 
In here we have no cookies, but 

1679
01:19:13,360 --> 01:19:16,160
we do have cats, as you saw 
walking around earlier. 

1680
01:19:16,400 --> 01:19:20,200
So sign up for DraftKings on 
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1681
01:19:20,200 --> 01:19:24,440
so inclined and a sports fan. 
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1686
01:19:34,400 --> 01:19:39,080
All right, folks, that concludes
our episode as well as our 

1687
01:19:39,080 --> 01:19:43,880
cookies. 
So Valar Morghulis, everyone 

1688
01:19:43,880 --> 01:19:49,040
will be back sooner than usual 
with the next episode on Damon 

1689
01:19:49,040 --> 01:19:51,760
Black Fire. 
We'll have Steven Atwell back as

1690
01:19:51,760 --> 01:19:55,200
a guest and we're looking 
forward to getting back to the 

1691
01:19:55,200 --> 01:19:57,240
black Fires as I know a lot of 
you are as well. 

1692
01:19:57,360 --> 01:20:00,360
Hope you enjoyed our two parter 
on Summer Hall. 

1693
01:20:00,560 --> 01:20:03,640
And if you want to get involved 
in the episode voting, check out

1694
01:20:03,640 --> 01:20:07,840
History of westeros.com. 
Click on the Patreon links and 

1695
01:20:07,840 --> 01:20:10,560
see what it's all about. 
Everybody. 

1696
01:20:10,600 --> 01:20:12,320
Valerie Margolis, see you next 
time.