The so-called great Bastards of aegon.
The fourth, the Unworthy are the children, he sired on
noblewomen, he had children with non-noble women as well, of
course. But of all of them of all those
children, only for that, we know of spent any significant time at
court, three, of course, were key players in the blackfyre.
Rebellion is while one our subject today at a more
mysterious Roll. Possibly a huge one, possibly a
distant calculatedly distant, one recently.
We spoke of how Celtic are or Celtic are both of them.
We spoke of both of them and an excellent example of soft power
rather than wielding Direct Control or influence over
cities, castles armies, other Lords and such they wield power
over the people who do have power over those other things.
Today's subject, share a sea star was far away, but I think
it's, I think it's Cherokee star.
Key in our I'm sorry. That's right.
Kiera. Key car.
Keytar. Far from Toys.
She's today's Cub jacked. Ha ha ha.
Yeah. This is difficult if it's all
Tiff assault. Yes.
What's up? She was far from impoverished
but she didn't wield great. Well either her influence came
from extraordinary birth, extraordinary beauty and the
fortitude to make use of both at court where such influence
matters. Most she was a A clever person,
not to mention the rumor. She and her mother used sorcery
and that she and bloodraven used sorcery.
Well, think about play with what kinds of magic she might have
used and in what? Circumstances?
Because we're not entirely, I was, that was a rumor.
It was a rumor. He was a little more than rumor
I'd say. But a strong rumor, she lived
during just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're
not a yes, just because it's a rumor, doesn't mean you weren't
really a star. Thank you.
And Nirvana for that one. Yeah.
Not to mention the room yet. That they use sorcery.
And we'll think about kinds of magic they would have used.
She lived during the type of during the era rather we're
Dragon dreams were prominent and spycraft was key, because there
was a lot of mistrust and uncertainty, in the realm,
especially in the, in around the red.
Keep she as characters, written by George r.r., Martin are known
to do flips, the script on beautiful women.
In a patriarchal society, far from being a part of it, all and
marrying into Power. She went her own way and reap
the rewards of being single and all she bucked the system and it
seemed to work out pretty well though.
We are left with a lot of gaps in her life.
Some caveats are to be made there, but she wasn't just the
greatest beauty of her age. She was she was highly
intelligent. She spoke a dozen languages and
possessed an Arcane library that she was said to have treasured.
Meanwhile the most treasured metal gold she found to be
vulgar. I like to think it's because the
pursuit of wealth is Distraction, you know, she was
interested in higher arts and intellectual things and I don't
know. I'm just guessing though and
that's what we have to do. A lot of today is make some
guesses, but two of the biggest pursuers of her hand in marriage
were none, other than bloodraven and bittersteel, who were, of
course, and Targaryen, family tradition, all siblings of each
other. Only half siblings is time but
still Yeah, it's still incest but there are fully violent
towards each other better, stealing bloodraven.
They hated each other. And she era, apparently enjoyed,
pitting them against each other though.
With all things said about her, it's take them with a grain of
salt maesters and historians don't tend to understand this
type of person very well and George understands that when he
writes it but her influence over bittersteel and bloodraven.
Her half-siblings is cited as a factor in starting the blackfyre
Rebellion. That might be a stretch, but
it's not entirely untrue. So we'll talk about that as
well. We also never hear what Damon
himself thought of his half-sister, she era, see star,
who was a good 10 or so years younger than her.
So we'll have to think about that as well.
A few stabs at what that might have looked like and all that,
all this mystery and Intrigue only serves to add more
curiosity, to a character already steeped, in so much.
We'll explore all that and more on this episode of history of
Westeros. Cast.
Hello and welcome everybody back again with another episode that
I hope you will find highly entertaining, and informative
and whatever other positive adjectives.
Do you want to apply to it? I think we're open to it.
John, how's it going? We're fresh back from Ice and
Fire con. The three of us will throw in an
anecdote or two around. The Midway Point depending on
Time, We Didn't Do It. Full ice and fire kind up.
So this time we occasionally do but you know a few things will
be said but we didn't have like a David J.
Peterson attendance this time where There's a lot of new info
that most people hadn't heard before is almost some only so
much we can talk about, you know, going to parties.
But there are few things we say if we have time.
Yeah. You got any beverage today or
anything. You want to talk about?
The kick us off. I've got a list of things one.
I didn't want people who didn't go to the condom missile on my
new shirt. The razor that's great.
Yeah, you know, that maybe not can't do a whole podcast about,
you know, parties and fun times that we had at the pecan.
And and some of you just kind of Experience stuff that we love,
like the musical that they do. But also, man, I'm Tony had some
of the panels that I went to we're inspiring and some of the
ones that I did I'm like, stewing over.
Can we make an episode about prisoner?
Oh yes, I'm sure we got really still stirred on that.
Like it's not possible to cover do 11 hours.
Yeah, that's nice. One of those panels you go in
there and you, you have like less time far less time than you
have and just a single podcast episode that we're doing.
You know, that's the nature of it.
I guess they don't have the typical bank because that's hard
to find right now but I got Red Bull and sparkling eyes and
doctor. Pepper and a naked drink but
also just because I'm worried that I'm getting to born and
then people got a taste of my drinks.
At the con might have been too tame here.
I have soy sauce mixed with pickle juice.
What? No, no, I want you to pull and
ask people if I should sip it throughout or take it like a
shot all at once. Okay, I'll take a little sip now
just to prove him. Well, that's like actually just
I really love story sauce Coca-Cola.
He's just spending bass is some round liquid.
Wow, that is yikes. It came up with some
conversation that calm that, you know, Rita told on me they when
I have sushi, when I get done, the little thing of soy sauce.
I drink the rest of it because I love it so much.
I don't want to go to waste. I said in the post could Sean
sip or take it as a shot and I give you answers as shot sip
for. No, it's good at holes as we're
so far, for sure. For sure it's in the leaving 13,
it's gonna be shot. No, no said, step size,
whatever. Want you to get this over with?
I want to see because I like the flavor something.
But I thought other people. Yeah.
Like the flavor of soy sauce. Right now shares.
The store has her secrets to Eternal Beauty.
I have my hair, so, I guess you're doing.
The shot was voted for sip. Didn't shot.
Gosh she are, I'll do it quicker your but I do have another on
topic point that I'm trying to make after I do this one.
Oh my God. He's doing.
That's a long shot that took several seconds.
Now, is might have been wearing a shot.
Mmm. And I'm not like, I'm like mmm,
which had a little bit more. We're gonna be talking about one
of the topics in this episode is bathing in blood to keep your
beauty like this is far grosser than what Is a good voice.
Austin is a good response hear from Karen Hightower who we met
at the con and who had your drinks at the con.
She said, Sean, I know you'll read this later.
I know, I promised I wouldn't laugh anymore after the drinks
at the con was so good, but you've taken it too far.
Speaking of bangs, it's funny. Yes.
They as we mentioned in a previous episode, yes they did.
They did lose some big lawsuit about false advertising and it
was because of what you said Shawn, right?
They don't, they don't really have creatine.
In the drink. And it says, so what we doing,
we want to go to Target right before the con and to bring
drinks to the Congress for driving.
What do we do at when we see at the at the end cap at Target
where you check out and buy drinks?
A bunch of Bank sitting there to say super creatine like okay.
So we bought those of course as you know so people who were a
consumed him. Yes people who are there.
Got to have some Roswell Target bangs.
I had my first Shawn drink because last year Shawn did the
drink bar and I just forgot to get a drink that I never tried
it. Was actually, it was actually
pretty good. I was tasting.
It was just hanging out a lot more tasty than soy sauce, and
pickle juice. Yeah, I'm not trying that.
So anyway, let's get to it. Heading on topic point, I want
to make is they don't think we get to it later on because I do
remember that quote about. I don't think of some share
herself said, but someone talking about her thinking it
goal was born. That was quote from himself.
So yeah, it's direct okay, okay. Yeah, I just hadn't thought
about it much until you brought it up.
Just now, I don't think we have it somewhere else.
So if you don't And I just a quick thought on it, I wonder if
there's some amount of like parallel there to like sand or
kind of having this disdain for nights even though he's a
knight. I kind of, you know, she is sort
of this royalty that you can just pull up just privileged
position but maybe she still has his disdain for the.
Yeah, I agree with you if she wouldn't have necessarily
thought about Robert Baratheon, but I'm just thinking of her
perspective being kind of like sand or is like if Robert
Baratheon is her father was a gandhian towards my goal.
Gold. Yeah.
It's a he's adorned by gold screw this here and I like, um,
yeah, with a night. Screw the gold.
Yeah, exactly. I totally agree with you.
I the more I was right working steps.
With the more I got picture of my head.
Canon was of someone that just thinks this is also really
stupid and that everyone liked politics and all this family
squabbling and their system of Monarch, she's just thought it
was all stupid. I've got books.
Like, this is smarter, this is a better use of my time because
she seems to be very neutral. Like, when the war's
everything's happened with nothing on her, taking sides, or
at least maybe, Both sides if anything.
Yeah, she's just like this is just entertainment because it's
just so dumb. Like, you guys are idiots, like
I'm not going to marry. You marriage is stupid?
Why would I marry you? It's dumb from.
It's a bad choice for me given society and way everything
works. Like, why would I do that?
Well, so two things happen that might be.
And I mention this later on when we're going through some stuff.
But I wonder if she might have also had some influence of a
vision of a prophecy. I want, I might as well.
Yeah. Yeah, whether it's, that might
make her think. Think less of the goal because
she's like, there's more important stuff might make her
think less of like marriage or some ain't even personal love or
whatever because it's like, we got to save the world.
Yeah, I understand. You know, she she might have
some bigger Vision that the other people are too caught up
in cells. See, and she might be prudent,
she might know, like, we've talked about a lot of times,
some of these characters might have these Visions.
No, they can't just go off telling everyone about it
because they'll think they're crazy us and we know bloodraven
a little bit. And that's why people think
she's a sorcerer, you know, already, you know, and of
course, bloodraven presents this to bran in the tree when this
was Lover, you know, and she, they were supposed to have done
magic together and she lived. During the time when that
prophecy was rediscovered, like that was Aries the first who who
really gets credit for that. So there's a lot to do with
that. We'll get into it in Greater
detail as move through this episode, we're getting a little
bit ahead of ourselves but that's okay.
That's all in good fun. Shout outs and Nina who added
some great thoughts of this episode as he so often.
Does her blog is that good? Queen Alia Bhatt tumblr.com,
that's one. L in a lie, latest blog post is
on of a serous. The And not too far off of this
topic. The saris the second would be a
sheer as uncle and she talks about whether the loyalty to his
elder brother and how that would have maybe played out in being
hand of the king for his children who became Kings after
his death. Very interesting, some good
parallels there and of course it's the human heart in conflict
with itself. So you're gonna want to check
that out as well as a lot of other great blog posts.
If the episode ends, anyone stay immersed.
We've got you covered with suggestions for topics related
to share a sea star will list them off at the end next week.
We'll be talking about an unusual episode.
It's a combination of a sort of a not an influence is absent.
But of parallels episode, we do influences sometimes this is
more of a parallels episode but it's going outside of A Song of
Ice and Fire. We're going to, we're going to
discuss parallels between the blackfyre Rebellion ends and a
little bit of the Targaryen Dynasty, but mostly the black
buyers and the Mandalorian Civil War.
So we're going to get into some Our stuff, Sean will be here
next week. He's not into Mandalorian
anyway, so it kind of fits our schedule pretty well.
So that episode was not voted on this chair c star was and there
is of course, votes on most weeks on patreon, we have votes
for upcoming episode topic. So if you are a patron, you get
to participate in that, I will say him and and or so.
If we can find some parallels to Andorra, I'm all about land or
sand. Or it's like almost never the
name is. That's all I got.
Yeah, a trivia question also. So is it the end?
The answer is at the end of this episode big bucket wall wants to
bathe in Bolton blood. It's a literate Aviv but he's
not meaning to take an actual bath in a tub filled with blood.
It's a metaphor for revenge, on the bones.
Several women are rumored to have literally bathed in blood,
including our subject today shiera Seastar but also Danelle
lost in Alice Rivers even Danny as that rumor said about her
Allison was rumored to have one to do it, to one of her enemies
wife and children. Some of those rumors might even
be true. Two men, we know to have for
sure, bathed in Blood In A Song of Ice and Fire.
Can you name one or both of these men as we so often.
Do we start with first mention? Here we go.
With a nice quote to get a start Daenerys.
Targaryen loved her Captain but that was the girl in her.
Not the queen Prince rhaegar loved, his lady Rihanna and
thousands died for it. Daemon blackfyre.
Loved the first Daenerys and Is in Rebellion.
When denied her bittersteel and bloodraven, both love, share a
sea star and the Seven Kingdoms bled.
The prince of dragonflies loved Jenny of old Stones so much he
cast aside a crown and Westeros paid the bride price in corpses.
All three of the sons of the fifth aegon had wed for love in
defiance of their father's wishes and because that unlikely
Monarch had himself followed his heart when he He chose his
Queen, he allowed his sons to have their way making bitter
enemies where he might have had Fast Friends treason and
turmoil. Followed as night follows day,
ending at summer, haul in sorcery, fire and Grief, Lots of
impact with that quote. First of all, just the fact that
she era is connected or listed alongside some of these greatest
tragedies in Westeros history. Rate of Civil Wars is pretty
tough. Going on the other hand, it
seems to be exaggerated. The blackfyre Rebellion is
weren't rooted in bloodraven and bittersteel both loving shears.
He star it played a role in their rivalry but take share a
sea star completely out of the equation and there's the first
blackfyre Rebellion for sure and there's still probably the rest
as well. It probably doesn't change a
whole lot but I mean look at this example.
But he says Daemon blackfyre, love the first Daenerys and Rose
in Rebellion when denied her, that is just false.
That didn't, that's not what He was denied her yes, but he
didn't rise in Rebellion to like eight years after Daenerys, got
married to the prince of Dorne so that's not it.
The evidence for that is not very strong.
The source for this quote, of course is Berenstain.
Bear, arson has all sorts of wrong ideas about love and
romance as a man who's never had either and has was forced to
give those things up as a kingsguard.
I detect a little bit of sour grapes and all this.
Like, yes, he wants, you know, dangerous love is, that's why
it's good. To be a kingsguard because you
don't to deal with any of that. So there are some not only as an
experienced with it, he gets a little bit history wrong but I
think there's also little just denial of the truth of all this
because it suits his fomo. Maybe I would even want to try
to spin it more positively than that.
It's just the filter he has. You lived his whole life with
this idea that like people, when he's key positions of power and
responsibility can't get to mixed up in emotional.
Mentuk relationships because it gets in a way.
I mean, do you think Amon has sour grapes?
Hmm. You know like he had a similar
mentality but I don't think we spent him negatively.
Yeah. And we know it's going to talk
about it, you know, certain point not to necessarily spend
barisan totally positive. He maybe is being a little
dishonest with himself, but, but I don't think it's like right
now he's lying to himself because he wants to get Dario
agree, I think through his life, he has established this mindset
and he's applying it to Dario personal.
Ation ships can really screw things up and caused Great
turmoil within a realm. Like just two peoples romances
can cause everything to go wrong.
He's right about that. Even if his specific examples
are a little exaggerated, even if he's pushing the point little
far, he's right in general that relationships just two peoples
falling out and caused the Civil War or two people fighting over
a lover or being jilted. Yeah.
Like all those things true like Robert Baratheon and lyanna like
that's his rage towards rhaegar was Beyond Reason.
Because of partly because of things that weren't even true.
But yeah, how we interpret, his thoughts from, I don't know,
like a literary analysis way or a, like a wisdom of leading way.
There's also the we're trying to suss out the history of things
way and this it's us as far as the details of History.
Yeah. Yeah.
So Nina agrees that Daemon blackfyre represented a truly
different political position from that of dare on the second
and that had way more to do with why war broke out.
It was the The way people treated the dornish versus the
falling off of Knightly virtues and a whole lot of things, we
talked about it in there on the good episode in our, blackfyre
Rebellion Series. So yeah.
And the same goes for this tragedy of summerhall.
As you mentioned here, Shawn that's yes.
Summer haul happened and it was a huge tragedy but pinning it
all on allowing people to marry for love is going too far.
That was it was a factor but putting it all on that.
It's no that's eggs. Dreams didn't come from jilted
Love and his planned to hatched dragons wasn't born from his
kids falling in love outside of their marital or you know, Royal
obligation exactly. As far as we know, Matt might be
interesting to find out why there's some hot summer haul
that bears, the nose. And we don't, yeah, you know,
that's a good point because barristan was alive during
summer home. He was he wasn't there, but he
was a teenager when it happened. So, So, he was, yeah, he has a
little more. He would have more insight to it
than than we've gotten at this point.
I do hope he thinks about it as well.
So, embarrassed in again, as I said he doesn't have a lot of
experience with well, any experience with relationships
really or women so does that apply to Masters who are the
main source here? This is a carrot type of
character that they don't understand.
Well I mean they don't understand a lot of people,
well, because their closeted academics, which is, you know,
that's the thing that comes with the lifestyle, you don't have a
lot of Experience talking to people and living a life outside
of Academia. You get some things wrong,
right? You get other things really,
really right, but magic, not so, well, women, if you're living
only with men, you're not gonna have a lot of insight there and
relationships for the same reason, you know, unless you're,
you know, even if you are gay and have relationships with
another Meister, that's a different sort of relationship
than hyper talking about here between royalty, Between people
that have massive influence over the entire realm in ways that
are hard to proceed and also something that they wouldn't let
bleed out in their writings true.
And even if they did, like say someone, I don't became a major
didn't even start trying to be may still there into the 30s.
Maybe they had gotten, married had kids or wife died, or some
whatever it is, where the maybe they would have a better more
worldly experience or perspective.
There's still a certain filter that they're going to have to
write and study through, right? All the other majors are
downplaying magic. And whatever they write, the
king might execute him if he doesn't like it.
You know, you can see all these reasons why they might not say
what they really want for know about Shara over else guys?
Yeah, maybe it was even literally burned or edited out
after the fact. Yeah.
They have to tow sort of the line there in terms of what's
accepted and expected. That's a great point.
You made there about talking about magic like maester aemon
and archmaester. Marwan for example, a basically
say these things like yeah you can't just you want poison in
your porridge you know. Don't talk about the hey really
far with it. Like, well they're gonna kill
you. I thought they would just like
shown you or or talk down to you or like drum you out, you know,
not murder. You like wow, I didn't know it
was that serious but it might just be a laxative.
It might not be a deadly poison, something to keep you out of the
way for a while. So let's talk about her early
life. This is a little familiar, she
wasn't a high tower but she was indirectly the result of
Hightower Mission and we're only talking.
Y'all about 50 years. She was born a 50 years after
the dance of the Dragons. So these are high towers that
are probably related to. Well, definitely rely on their
height. H deaf, I mean like closely
related to Auto and late and not late in Auto and Ormond and the
other high towers of the Arab dance.
This might be, we might be talking about some of their
children or grandchildren here in a minute.
The downside of not knowing about enough about share is the
obvious we have left to say than we About other characters.
The upside is that we get to come back some day with new
information and play around with that.
And in the meantime, as well, we get to play around more with
people. She's connected to like, her
parents lens into, one of our favorite periods.
The blackfyre billions, of course, a big part of this.
She was least impacted by aegon, the Unworthy, as compared to all
the other children of aegon. The Unworthy because she was his
last child, and he died, pretty closed after she was born.
So, she didn't have to like Like suffer, having this horrible?
Father around, that probably is a good thing.
You usually want your father around.
But this one of those cases where it's probably good that he
wasn't. She was the least changed by his
deathbed legitimisation to given how far down the line of
succession she was and because she's a woman and, you know,
women don't tend to inherit. So she's less of a quote-unquote
threat. In terms of the succession,
which by the way, doing the math.
Her half siblings had already been fighting over her before
the blackfyre Rebellion. She would have been like 10 or
12 when they started kind of fighting over her.
Just kind of yikes more on that later.
She's also a great window into the reign of dare on the second.
A welcome change for restaurants because they're on was good.
I mean he was there on the good and that was a wonderful Turn
Around from aegon the Unworthy so she probably liked her half
brother. Darren more than she liked her
father's memory. Of course like with the word
memory there is. That's what It was it was a
memories, she would have them not much of an actual
relationship. So yeah, her father, aegon the
fourth, you unworthy Circa, 178 179, aegon catches Terrence
point with Bethany bracket, right?
Remember that from the aemon? The dragonknight episode more
recently and as well as the aegon the fourth episode many
years ago both of them are executed.
Cruelly. So is Bethany bracken's father
who was hand of the king so that opens up the spot for both the
new hand of The King and I knew main mistress for a god On now
aemon the dragonknight of course dies defending him from Towing
Revenge, which also opens a spot in the kingsguard and also maybe
keeps an obstacle out of the way for even greater scheming
because a ganar Amon was, you know, such a good guy in place.
Close to the king and was probably a buffer against a lot
of bad things that became more frequent after his death.
So what happens is this guy John Hightower Nina suggest?
Maybe he was the son of Lord Lionel and Samantha tarly that
would that would fit pretty well.
If that's true. Lord John would be very close to
aegon's age because aegon was born in 135, four years after
the dance ended. So if this person was a child of
people who got together during the dance, he would be very
close and aegon's age, which would give them something in
common would, maybe give him a little more of an in to
manipulating slashing Influencing him.
There's so many obvious things a high tower.
Lord would want from a king, just a slight reduction in
taxes. Would mean so much money for
them or like a complete waving of taxes on certain Goods would
be a windfall. There's so many opportunities
for corruption here and it was extremely well established.
By the end of aegon, the Unworthy, is rain that the way
to get favors from him is to bring him a woman, he's into
which and John went all out here.
He went and found a Incredibly beautiful woman from lease
Saran. A sweet Serenity was her name.
Why they called her sweets arena is odd because apparently, she
was proud and haughty, and cold, doesn't sound like a very sweet
person at all. Seems purely rooted in her looks
or because like what they call something like, well, Kev, but
he's real big. Yeah.
Sweet tea ready? Yes.
Our, it could have told her sour Saran.
I really might it change over time.
She might have started out as sweet and become bitter.
As oh yeah, that's her experience to King's Landing,
you know, having to be mistress to this guy's.
Yeah, it doesn't probably doesn't uplift.
You probably worried. She was treated as an outsider,
you know. Yeah, amen.
Kinda naive and helpful, and everyone treated her like crap.
Well, big surprise suddenly, she's not sweet anymore.
Yeah. And so consider what the way the
height H, tried to manipulate the Sarah's and get their way
into the royal family. This is more of a proxy version
that I was like, I'm going to gain favor with the royal family
but I'm not going to directly embroil.
The high Towers in it. So he's kind of controlling this
woman that he brings her from lease and she's got very little
connection to anyone there. So she's sort of isolated.
So she kind of needs John and Oregon to do anything.
To go beyond being a gilded cage Persona Court.
It's a clever move by John. It's following the path that's
been laid out by prior hands of the king even though that
resulted in execution brutally for Lord, Bracken, John
Hightower was game to try and not make the same mistakes.
Let's talk about Serena out here for a second.
There's all these other Mistresses as well that are
politically connected and that was always a problem.
Like what's the Blackwood? Her being a black wood, became a
problem because the Brackins got involved and Pushed back and of
course, before that, they were bracken's in.
After that, their practices Bracken Blackwood thing going
back and forth. She's not involved in any of
that. She's not connected and he's
families. She's got no political baggage,
right? There's no, this family hates
her family, like they don't know.
One in Westeros even knows her family, right?
They have no connection whatsoever there.
She's just looks Valerian. And she set the silver hair and
the and I guess you had blue eyes, the serenity I did and
just none of that. Stuff that would make her
political liability but there's more to it than this.
I find this angle really clever and Insidious and cynical on
Lord. John's part remember that
aegon's Mom was lice any and she left when he was young that's
going to mess you up. I think your Mom leaves when
you're three or four at least it could.
It's not that it's not an excuse for why he was such a bad guy.
Especially because someone like Amon and Mary's, also their
mother left and they were good people.
Yeah. But he was the oldest and it
maybe maybe hit him the hardest nerys.
Would I have been too young even remember it, but they both
became very extreme individual xamon, very like chivalric and
dutiful and egg on. Well, he complete opposite.
These extreme personalities might be rooted in their mother
leaving early on. So this might be a little bit of
psychology like play on his mommy issues by finding him a
lice. Any woman that might even kind
of looked like his mother and just the psychological impact of
that could be substantial. And from Lord, John's
perspective, it was probably all about getting whatever he could
out of Okay you know manipulating this guy to get
favors and like we said tax write-offs and all that stuff.
Wow right like that's quite an angle.
Hmm. Bring in someone who's from his
mother's Nation. That's that's probably not
random. That probably isn't just an
accident. It probably was calculated.
And then like you said, maybe she grew cold over time.
That's why Lara left that's why Lara regarding guns.
Mom left was because she was isolated and treated like a
foreigner. And there was lots of prejudice.
They mocked the God, she Ship the whole rumors about what she
was doing behind closed doors and she also didn't speak the
language, which didn't help that made her seem even more distant
siren. I did speak common.
As far as we know it's possible, she didn't, but we didn't hear
anything about that. She may have just been cold
because no one accepted her, and people were prejudiced against
her on the other hand. It provides an interesting
possibility, to keep her perception as someone that won't
cheat. Remember what just happened?
Bethany Bracken cheated on him. Now, aegon's may be paranoid
about his mistress cheating on him, a cold proud woman, that
doesn't talk to anyone that sort of doesn't give off the vibe
that she's going to cheat, right?
She's like, no, I'm too good for anyone but the king that might
be what he wanted at that point, because he's paranoid about
being cheated on someone, that's too proud to slay.
It's not about looks and lust. It's about status with someone
like that. A couple of their angles.
It could be that she was still sweet and warm and whatever else
positive, but people just didn't like her.
And it was a way to talk bad about her or might, it was
spread of Midway to take her down a notch, whatever, or that?
However, cold or warm or kind or whatever, maybe she just was
more virtuous and maybe even judgmental made some of the same
black that alicent gets, you know what I mean that she was
trying to be loyal and honest and do it.
In other people weren't and so she makes them look bad.
So they talk bad about her and maybe people that really knew
her or cared about her. Still thought she was sweet.
But people who plenty of people who might be, who died
motivation and not like her be distrustful would want to say
that she was holier than our, you know, things that might be
wrapped up in cold or hot in here.
That's a good point. Of course, the being super hot
came with a little bit of room erring.
There was rumor, she used sorcery to stay beautiful.
That is a recurring Trope about You keep their beauty,
especially ones who have extreme Beauty in stories, like this.
Also in real life, maybe not so much anymore, but in times past
Nina writes, this could be a little bit of expression of
xenophobia. There's lots of ambitious,
westerosi Nobles who want to marry their daughters to the
king or the prince or just someone above that.
They want to move up through marriage, right?
They would hate the idea that this foreign woman is just
prettier than all their daughters or wives.
Whatever. And maybe take that personally,
like a like a little bit of westerosi nationalism, like,
surely this foreign woman can't be the most beautiful woman in
the country, right? They just don't like that idea.
It's just touches on their prejudices and well.
Sorry y'all. They said she was the most
beautiful. We'll go with that.
And with that, she's kind of isolated.
She's not going to have, you know, hard trauma finding
allies. And but why did she come in the
first place? She's not a slave.
What's in it for her? Of course.
She had this impeccable lineage and we hear that her family had
fallen on Hard Times financially.
So there was probably a big payoff.
This may have been the reverse of your normal scenario where
there's a when you get married the the wife's family pays a big
Dowry. This may have been this was
sounds like the opposite where John Hightower paid off her
family's debts or a lot of them in order to make this happen.
So she may have been making some big sacrifice for her family by
agreeing to come and be the mistress to the king in order to
Taylor family out. This may have been a very big
deal to her family. Like she may have been like kind
of a martyr to her family here in a sense.
Might have been the other way around too.
Yeah might have been like you know exactly the height H might
have had some something overs, this ice any family.
Okay. You OSX money.
All your do we trust burned down so sad but you stopped the past
will take your daughter? Yeah.
Kind of, she might have been given up, you know, may not have
been slavery but it had been effectively.
Free. Yeah.
Which I mean a lot of these arranged marriages kind of our
that like the one doesn't have any say in it.
The difference. I don't think I'm stretching to
think that's what might have happened.
Yeah, like sir. And I apparently was a little
bit older, she wasn't in her twenties or anything.
She wasn't a super young woman, but we don't actually know how
old she was. Given the rumors that she used.
Sorcery to keep her beauty. It sounds like she wasn't that.
You don't start saying that when someone's 22, you know, like she
is a stupid young to look like that or to hold look like what
she's 22. Y'all look what you mean?
That's another kind of missing piece here is how old is her in?
I was Now, they probably did it. They probably came out ahead on
that, their family, not her, but because some she'd get dies in
childbirth a few years later. So this definitely don't work
out, great for her. But what other you know, what
other promises maybe had been extracted?
There's a whole world of possibilities here.
If Nares was dying or dead by the time, we don't know an Aries
died. Remember she died after Amon,
but before egg on and we know that sir and I died before egg
onto and this is all kind of a tight time line roughly in the
Years 180 to 184. There's already precedent for a
life's, any woman, being a bride to a king of Westeros.
In fact, aegon's on mother as we've already said.
So that, that was not, at least that way it already been paved.
You wonder to, like, what kind of flowers did she have over,
like, was she using her influence to get more for her
family? Like John's doing that.
John hightower's doing, who knows what for his family via
being handed. The king to this corrupt, King.
What was she getting out of it? Besides the initial Arrangement?
Well, we don't really know, No, but we know that it couldn't
have been great having to spend time with him, the state of
health egg on was in. I like to think of him as Take
him as the combined versions of book and show viserys the first
book. Viserys never had that weird,
like, leprosy thing that we saw on the show but he did get
heavier and heavier through excessive partying, eating and
drinking and his way became a problem, Hague on the fourth did
as well. But aegon, the fourth also had
strange disease. And anyway, here's a quote that
I needn't explain it. This quote does a better job.
He was grossly fat, barely able to walk And some wondered how
his last Mistress ceranae of lease.
The mother of Sheriff's, he star could ever have withstood.
His braces, the king himself died, a horrible death, his
body. So swollen and obese, but he
could no longer lift himself. From his couch, his limbs
rotting and crawling with flesh worms.
The maesters claimed. They had never seen its life
while septons declared it, a judgment of the Gods.
Hagen was given milk of the poppy to bail his pain, but else
was little could be done for him.
This is very similar to the death of sulla, the Roman
Consul, he had very odd flesh. Worms crawling in him like
before he died and she had slave just pick them out every day and
they couldn't couldn't control those crazy.
And people said it was a judgment of the Gods on him
because if he had killed so many so many People in his life I
believe we talked about in the aegon the Unworthy episodes been
so long. I don't remember for sure but
anyway, more and more examples of potential taking advantage of
a guy in ill health to make political calls like Auto and
Allison did during the early before the dance broke out.
And this guy, the sicker, he gets the less likely.
He's the participate in courtly decisions.
He wasn't all that interested in the first place.
And being a being a king in terms of ruling his people, he
liked what the Did for him, in terms of slaking his thirst and
appetites and lusts, but not so much taking care of people with
that notable difference here, that Alison, not over at where,
you know, or when bottom or so, I suppose are Allison's book
Alice, and maybe more. So we're aiming for the throne.
Whereas here, there are just more aiming for influence.
They weren't trying to displace the targaryens.
They weren't trying to marry a child into this.
Current state of family. They couldn't like are on airs
already. Married to Mariah Martel, his
sister Daenerys married to Marilyn.
On Martell. So there wasn't any way into the
royal family, that way that this was that path was kind of
blocked. This was what was available and
very risky in a sense. They couldn't go too far with
the Kings power. They'd seen what happened to
Lourdes Bracken, but they also had may be limited time left.
They could see the writing on the wall.
This Kings got flesh, worms crawling in his body.
How much more time does this guy have on this Earth?
He doesn't. This is not a picture of Health.
They had to know that whatever influence they had.
Is going to be limited in time, so they had to make their moves
quickly if at all. So this is something that I
never really thought about until think.
Until this episode, which is the possibility that Daemon
blackfyre, when he was given the sword blackfyre and before he
was actually named Daemon blackfyre that was in the year
1982. And this is when he revealed
that a gun revealed that this child was actually, his son had
been kept under outcome, may be an Open Secret but he hadn't
officially said. Yeah, this is my son.
I did that after Damon one that Squires tournament.
So this decision to look to give Damon The Sword.
And his deathbed legitimisation is two years later happened
during this period where John Hightower and serenity had
influence over him. She wonder if they had any play
here. Did they suggest this?
Like they knew knew he wanted to get back at his son.
They knew he hated his son and wanted to usurp him in, but
failed given his prior Were plotting.
So maybe this was an idea, kind of like, how little finger gave
Joffrey the idea to execute Ned. You could easily say, oh Joffrey
would would have done that on his own, but he didn't think of
it. Yes, if he had the idea on his
own, he would have done it, but he needed someone smart with an
ulterior motive to give him that idea and let him run with it.
I kind of think there might there's room for that here, I
can more than kinda. There's it's possible.
It doesn't need to have happened like what's their angle but they
might have planted the seed you know.
Yes even if they didn't have a Plan or even if they didn't do
it intentionally, they might have just said something like,
what if you legitimised all your bastards into yours?
One conversation, he's drunk or if they did, have some ulterior
motive, just get her thinking about, it has the power to do
that. Just like, I'm just saying the
king, your, you know, that's that's within your power, a king
could do that. Yeah.
It's pretty compelling and might even use it as a threat and
didn't really mean it. Yeah.
But if enough people say that, what if you really did do it,
you don't mean that like you might have been pushed into It
just show them. Yeah boss.
You know, if you want to go a little farther with it when idea
I had would be that they were thinking maybe they could.
If Serena gave birth to a daughter, maybe this happened
while she was pregnant. She could they could plan on
maybe betrothing this daughter to Damon one day now.
Understand this is a 12-year age Gap so it's not the smoothest
Arrangement but it could be done and it's possible anyway or they
may have had other plans for this child but Saran, I died
apparently not during childbirth but shortly after because she
did give the name was her name. She chose the name, she era.
So there's a little bit of a must have been enough time for
her to say that name. Maybe she had already chosen at
name before could have. Yeah, it's true.
She could have chosen it before. She would want you to.
Like, if it's a boy, I'm gonna call her this.
It's a girl called that but it's an interesting name because I
feel like there's some only circumstantial evidence that the
child that share was born and that sir.
And I saw Saw her before she died because the name share a
starved. See if that's the full version.
It's, she Stars shortened version.
She's striking one green, one blue eye.
And I feel like that name comes from that and I wonder you she
would have had to see her to say that.
I'm not sure about that. Like I said, that's kind of
circumstantial, it's pretty much guesswork here but also she's
from lease and they're an island nation.
So, I really wonder, I'm just curious what that name come from
like why did she call her? Are the sea like this baby?
Like, where does that Nick? That wasn't.
That's like, a something you earn as a nickname.
Like, I have Abyss Daenerys, Stormborn shirt on while she was
born during a storm. So that fits.
But where does yeah. Where did your mother come up
with that? It's a Grilli.
Cool evocative name, but I was not a lot to go on with where
she pulled that from. I remain.
Very curious, Nina, isn't so big on this idea of this little
conspiracy between Serena and John Hightower.
So she's a good person to have argue against it here.
Push back on a little bit. It's easy enough to see this
none of this has to be in place for egg on to have done all this
himself and there's any number of other corrupt counselors
around him. That could have planted the
seed. It doesn't have to be these two
or even this or even one of them.
So yeah, I the part I like about it is that egg on isn't very
clever and he needs other people to suggest schemes to him.
Like Joffrey did like if he was smart, I think he wouldn't have
been that hard for him to displace his son.
It's just he's just not smart enough that they've done it.
Gone about it the right way. He did it.
He did it with Like a person who's angry he approached it,
vindictively in with rage, not with Calculus, not with logic,
you know? So he's right Petty about it,
you know, and another piece is this, we didn't quite get into
is the idea that like fire, the sword wasn't quite the symbol
and the past. That's just it became.
Yeah right made it was never like you got to make it a
symbol. You got to do something with
this. Yeah.
And whether aegon thought that himself or someone planted that
idea or maybe it was something it was developing over time.
Anyway, when I can see how especially over time, there
would be new symbols if you will write and write and write.
And I'm and I'm reminded specifically.
There was a quote in how the dragon when they were trying to
rush. It, the new agon into into
power, right? Like before anyone can respond,
it went to get. Let's have this.
We need to have a public ceremony.
We need to get the King's Guard and the septon and like Otto
said, every symbol of legitimacy is Yeah.
And we're trying to tell Renee trainees, you know, or renew a
rather like your moment passed. Sorry possession.
Is nine-tenths of the law lie here and she was hoping they
were have might even see it that way?
Yeah, it was like, look, we just overwhelmed you, like give up,
you know. It's so if some symbols of
legitimacy had passed or diminished, or if the ones they
had weren't quite enough and it needed another one.
And if this one, particularly fits the moment because we have
this one Warrior guy and it's whatnot.
Warrior guys will put the sword in his hand like I think that's
a neat. To Dynamic to consider, however,
it came about as I agree. It's just that one thing that
really gets me is I just hard for me to see aegon the fourth
and clever enough to figure that.
I was like, I know I'll make this the seem like he could have
done it casually to accident. Like I'm just going to give some
sort of way because he gave eggs away just for this and now like
he was known for just giving away valuable things so that it
doesn't have to be a conspiracy or this calculated decision.
But I definitely don't think he came up with that idea on his
own without And what it would do.
Well, I think he might even come up with the idea and it's only
given that sort of way and he didn't think it was relevant,
but retroactively people who yeah, invested interest in like
think how big important this sword is?
Why did he give it to me? And they would hammer that home
and if anyone bites that they're going to run with it?
Yeah like it's entirely possible sir and I died before this even
happened but that still doesn't mean it wasn't like an idea that
she or John Hightower planted. So there's there's enough
timeline fog here during a lot of uncertainty but We do know
that it's still happening within a pretty narrow range.
Egg on died in 1844, he gave dare Damon the blade and 182 and
sir, and I became his lover sometime after 179.
So there's just all, it's all just pretty tightly packed in
there, so let's get to actual Sharon.
Oh, she obviously had to have been born before.
Aegon, the fourth died or his deathbed legitimisation wouldn't
have even applied to her? That's how we know that.
Sure and I died first. So she died probably 182 183, a
year. R2 before egg on it really
sounds like egg on wasn't even able to perform in bed in his
final months, considering how overweight he got.
So, he made this is this maybe pushes share as birth back a
little bit based on that. Maybe Nina also says, on the
issue of naming her, she era she suggests that he probably didn't
care much about names or giving him his like that.
Let the mom giving him his hair. So sir and I had now has a
daughter of Royal Blood which if she was an ambitious person, if
this was part of her angle in the first place, like why did
she accept this marriage offer in the first place?
We're still still an open question, then she would have
her peace, her pain to maybe manipulate and use her own
daughter, but then she dies in childbirth.
So, that's gone. You know, since egg on died in
1884 and shares. Mother had died a little bit
before. That means both.
Her parents are dead by the time.
She's like Two at most. So, she wouldn't even have a
memory of him. And if she did have a memory of
him, it would be at his end, which would be terrifying for a
two-year-old, whatever, like Dykes.
That's your dad. So, think about this.
This is like, she has this reputation for being kind of
cold, maybe Lovelace. Maybe playing with men rather
than I get it. She lost both her parents by the
time, she's to whatever memory she might have had her of, her
father, was terrible. And then, just the memory of him
is and what he did was terrible. No.
Love. No, aunts our uncle's really
either only older siblings. And two of them were like trying
to hook up with her when she was like 10 surrounded by a
tradition of incest. Yes, yes, just total all that no
Role Models. Know people like being people
being possessive over her, and rather than your brother being
protective of you, they're fighting over you, which is not
great. That doesn't, so, loving
environment. That doesn't teach you the value
of camaraderie and healthy relationships.
This is Everything is a contest, everything is people fighting
for what they want. Everything comes down to
personal desire, that's not a good spot for a child to be.
I don't think, right. And also in the context of
entitlement, there are also no wealth.
He's and that worried about day-to-day stuff, they're not
probably even worried about the lives of other people.
Much less the well-being of the for consideration in
relationships on and on. Yeah, so sometimes people say
Sharon ever married, as far as No.
Do we know she didn't marry George said, so George said she
never married. It's not a rumor.
It came directly from George so that's pretty straightforward.
And yeah. So I just find that very
compelling in a very sad way. Like this is all these elements
that would make her a distant kind of Lovelace.
Like a lot of things you say about people who are too rich or
too detached or just to not normal to not have a you know a
lot of this fit Cersei. Yeah, it does.
It does love his, she's got some combinations of Cersei and
Daenerys little of Santa. I supposed to be see Santa as a
young person kind of stuck at court, but I share a seems like
she had a lot more. She wasn't as demure as Sansa
kind of like maybe she got startled fam, so much compact
competition around her so much Cutthroat.
And if she wasn't isolated in the North she was right in the
thick of things from the get-go. Santa also did get parental love
and guidance and even if maybe a little misguided, but still
yeah, no sensors. May be a little More naive going
egg like because she didn't start off in this.
I'm going to say hostile environment.
Oh King's Landing him like she has.
These are would have come up from infant and Beyond where
sanso had sounds is naive ideas. The world.
She might have gotten by with it.
Winterfell. Yeah, you know, share with no.
But yeah, yeah, I feel like I said yeah, that's thing that you
could say they're opposite song. Like Cheryl would never very
unlikely to ever have these like romantic ideals like Prince is
going to come rescues. Like she was like nah that's all
Bs. That doesn't happen for my
perspective. It's older.
Men fighting over a young, girl, like a civil war, family,
squabbles, all this other stuff. Yeah, it's very different than
like, says his life became that later.
But, yeah, it's yours. It was, that was like that from
the, from the beginning and did share have any connections to
her lysine family. Like Serena, I died.
So young. She may have been kind of cut
off from that, but you may have had like a grandmother or
something that got back in the mix but not her paternal.
Grandmother was Lara, who was probably dead by then and
paternal grandfather. Viserys second who was
definitely dead by then maternal.
Grandmother and grandfather AKA Serena's parents.
Don't know who they were. They might have been alive
especially given what we said about Sir and I'm probably not
being really old. So sure family good chance were
still alive and they were presumably lysine as well.
So there may have been some sort of hey our daughters like the
King's Daughter over here. This is an inroad for us.
He may have contacted her and been like let's keep this
relationship going there. Could be some mutually,
beneficial Arrangement here. Who knows if not about family,
what about cultural connections did share with share a cut off
from her Culture, by not having any family around her.
Did your mother have like a retinue, some of whom were lice
any that some of them stayed with her.
And like, I've some serving people that like a, I don't
know, like, the equivalent of ladies-in-waiting, something
like that. I don't know how that works for
Mistresses at court, but she probably had some people like
Lara had sand DOC, The Shadow and And a few other people whose
names didn't get mentioned. But feel, like, kind of like how
Ned may have had a few more people with him at the tower of
joy and how the kingsguard nights almost definitely dead.
Because, like, who's gonna have to put on their armor and who's
going to take care of this baby that Leon has, like, right there
had to be other people. There's always a few other
people around that don't get named by the histories.
But these these really rich people they always have servants
around them, right? Like that's kind of a given Even
Santa, who is basically a prisoner still had attendance.
She still have people, you know, washing her clothes and making
her bed and escorting, her around and even crash tyrion's
mistress, okay? Shay.
Yeah, she maybe didn't have her own attendant, but she still
had, I don't know, Liberties and favors finances if you girl
favors. There you go.
You know, she was better off if she was like she was
specifically secret and I'll sensibly a servant.
But still had values that the average person wouldn't have
because of her connection to Tyrion so.
So imagine, you know, you go up a couple levels from that from
shade to. Yeah, right.
Okay, yeah. And Anita asks a great question
here given how her grandmother Lara and their family had been
treated by Westeros which was with a lot of xenophobia.
What did we say? Share is a very intelligent
person. Probably very perceptive.
She may have seen that mean, like, I'm not going to put
myself in the position to be Treated with all this Prejudice.
So I'm going to downplay, my lice any connections and not
face what my grandmother faced. It's so interesting that it's
her grandmother. The face that I just didn't give
that a lot of thought before working on this episode.
But yeah the connection between Lara gauri and she RC star is
not to be downplayed even though they never met.
Yeah, I'm really imagining Shara maybe sometimes getting comments
about her grandmother hearing about her grandmother hearing
negative things about Laura ra and like internalizing it even
if people weren't saying it to her, they might even like.
Yeah, like that b word Lara, very, you know.
Yeah. Yeah.
It's very compelling. This is part of the setup for
what would be going on at court between certain individuals and
ways they would Express their Prejudice and maybe try to try
to take her down a peg because she's there's there'd be a lot
of jealousy over her station and her beauty and things like that.
And her back. She's a foreigner because people
suck and I hate foreigners. And she may have taken some
pride. May have emphasized her West
Rossi side. Like yes I am.
Yes, I'm listening but she would emphasize that she's the
daughter of King. Yeah I wonder how much she
really internalized that you know phobia and hatred like does
she love and embrace her Vice any Heritage or did she downplay
it and hate it about herself, right?
Yeah, I really had to really open question.
I really wonder it's very compelling to think about such a
thing and I wonder if it's like the way she dressed.
Like we said, she thought gold was vulgar, that's a really
unusual position to take and I'd like to read into that.
Like I said earlier, in the intro, but it might just be
something simple. Like another way to stay out of
it. Like I'm not a part of this like
way to Mark herself as separate. Like I'm neutral I'm I'm reading
my books like she's the reader except the reader was like super
hot. So people wouldn't Leave him
alone because we gotta that irrelevance relevant chat or
earlier that I put in them. I'll put here.
Now you got from tooka tooka. They said she doesn't like gold
yet. Better steel has a golden
company to fans on the Aesthetics but also yeah.
Like she didn't like Gold's about was vulgar.
Yeah, he called that's that's a really good catch.
Very good cat. Yeah.
Yeah, absolutely. I think I think it's on purpose.
And that's a great catch. Wow.
Yeah. The golden company and she hated
Colts as I thought it was vulgar.
Yes, yeah. Better still is vulgar beneath
the gold, the bittersteel like yeah that's why he's bitter, you
didn't give your crush what she wanted.
Like what do you think, man? You think the being combative is
going to work? No, course not.
George is really laid some excellent groundwork for these
personal relationships, which is what we started describing, why?
Barristan, perceives the squabbling over, she era between
Egor and Brendan as a crucial factor in the blackfyre.
Rebellion ends. I like this pointing ahead here.
Here. Yeah, about what, you know, the
debate on whether Cheryl took pride or not in her life said,
he Heritage, you know, Compares it to Henry the fourth
granddaughter and Marie Louise dorland's.
Who, when asked about her maternal, grandmother said that
the woman was not her grandmother because she was not
a queen. Yeah, I'm only.
Yeah, if you're not a queen, you can't be my relative.
Wow? Really?
That is Hottie right there? Yeah.
How hot each year was I mean and to be very you can be haughty
and expressed that but not really feel it deep down like
she might have put on an air of - to like protect herself but
might have still had a lot of insecurities about her parentage
and her grandparents and all of that same as this likely this
Anne-Marie will be squirrel. Actually probably like said that
but like said it because she's bothered by her Heritage.
Hmm. So an open question is what
happened to large on after? Whether he cared, what happened
to Sierra weather? Just gave up his Ambitions
because they're on fired all of aegon's small Council so he was
he was out so he probably went back then old town and back to
being lord of the high tower tough break for him but there is
no is daeron the good right? Yes yeah I can imagine the next
king executing with the council. Yeah yeah I was a bit too Pious
and trying to keep you didn't want any yeah you're executing.
Young Lord hightower's a bit. Yeah, risky.
We don't know if they maintain contact if it mattered or it's
not clear. Like, she was so much older
shares, only like 23 years old at this point so it's not like
he can like stay in contact via letter.
You know, it seems kind of strange to stay in contact with
the bastard of the mistress you brought for the king.
Yeah, we're transparent. So, in 1884, right before Darren
becomes king, she gets legitimize like all her Blings
and others all her half-siblings, the many of them
she wouldn't have understood exactly the significance of that
at her age but later as she grew into it, she would've been like,
huh, well but like all the other she didn't call herself
Targaryen and that's an open question as to why probably
because dangerous puts them in the line of fire makes them
Target. Makes them dangerous.
So make some a Targaryen estimate.
Our Target area has a few questions from you all before we
move into share. His later life Lizzie.
I've says those poor mistress is this is probably when reverse
cowgirl was invented, whatever? It's called.
Then I said reverse Dragon. Right?
First dragon from yeah. Seriously painkiller Jane says
probably from Serena's Island Home Star, the seats.
See starved, see name. And then yeah, if you do said
well, Lisa is an island city-state with ports could see
her being named in relation to that.
Yeah, it does fit. I did think of that.
I wonder. It's hard to think of anything
else. Honestly, I like that a lot
painkiller Gentiles So pointed out, her name could also be
derived from shirokiya. The Dothraki word for bleeding
star. Yes, I got that for a second
because Shawn you noticed that too, let me explain the word he
or she Rach Gia is the Dothraki word for bleeding star.
Meaning the red comet in this context, the Chirac is star and
death rakia is bleeding. We know that because of well
David Peterson wrote this language and it's not that hard
to look these things up. So Chirac meaning star is very
interesting, isn't it? That she era is seizure C star.
I think this is somewhat straightforward explanation from
this Dothraki language probably derives in part from Valyrian
valyria is way older than the Dothraki people and they
dominated that region for thousands of years at the track.
He's language has some connection to the Valyrian
language. Makes some sense to me, if in
proximus is time, I was surprised when we were, when I
was starting to do research for this episode, you know, one of
the things I do is I'd go to a search of Ice and Fire and, you
know, search the topic or some subtopics are connected,
keywords, whatever, they know, I searched Serie C star and like
Five results and like, how does this character have so much
Mystique around her? And I like people cosplayer,
we're doing a whole episode, and there's only five, so, I thought
maybe it's a glitch. Let me, let me just try just
Sierra instead of see Stark, just maybe I'll find More.
Maybe they don't always refer to her the whole name and his
quote. This, you know, this is B with
Danny and the in the comic came up and it's a slightly different
word but it was so similar I couldn't ignore it especially
when the meaning was so similar with said, you know, these star
etc. Etc.
So I was in my mind just thinking about like directions,
George might have been going or Parallels.
He was trying to draw it and connected.
It might just be like a language standard, David Peterson piece
together, but which it could still be both those things.
But Don't know quite what to draw for this but I thought it
was noteworthy. What wouldn't it be in the David
J? Peterson made that connection.
It would be that this this existed for build on it.
Yeah, built on this existed in the books, prior to his
involvement. In your language, that phrase
shiraki was one that David had to add to his lexicon when
starting off he's like, hey what words do we already have?
Because that's, that's book one. So yeah, Peterson wasn't
involved. Yeah.
That was one of the much later that one of the building blocks
of how to build the Dothraki language.
Yeah. Yeah.
It's unclear would have been if David?
Guided to connect, that's Rocky and blurry and at all either.
He may not have considered this link between their them.
Proximity wise region wise or he may have decided just that's not
how it would have worked. You may have intentionally.
Don't that way matter clarification it's book to
write. I'm sorry.
Yes, you're right book. Tune up.
Okay. Yeah, you're totally right.
The comic comes right at the end and they named it.
Beginning of the to. Yeah, you're right.
Dang, just also that and balerion the translation for
stars not share at all. It is Telos.
Hello. Okay.
Yeah that's very different. All right cool right if it might
just be a coincidence them. Yeah I mean it might not be as
my other point is that it might not be a coincidence in the
books and then David simply did not, you know.
Yeah sure think about that at that relation potentially I
suppose but I don't I think George did it on purpose in the
books. Personally, share a sea star
longtime Patron at and listener. And who I joked with them about?
Who are you voting for in this? This poll, they did, in fact,
vote for Shira and they say considering her mother died in
childbirth. It's no wonder she'd want to
stay single. Maybe marriage is quite
endangered mother. Yeah, I mean I think we can just
take that as fact throwing from Shara, C star herself.
She's weighed in seriously Stars cannon on sheer.
Sea star. Yes, that's true.
Yeah, and it makes sense because we've cast share as a highly
intelligent persons when you can look you can see stimulus and
result better than a lot of other people whose detached and
more educated and And it is less beholden to following in
lockstep with existing societal Norms.
Yeah, I could see her thing like know.
Like why would I do that? Like, it's such a risk to me and
children any children, I have could be in danger because of
their Heritage and yeah, it's just, it doesn't make sense, you
know? So for a lot of reasons, Joe
magician says just on a basic level the person she was closest
to is the widely feared weird and notable Outsider bloodraven
see Seems like a towel that they bonded over having similar
experiences at court, that's a good point.
They both were a little bit isolated Like Blood Ravens, mom
was popular and that gave him a bit of an in route but like just
from his look and his his interests.
He was an Insider Outsider kind of like she was like all the
benefits of being a Targaryen connections to the royal family
both Karen and she Darren was liked bloodraven was like by
dare on maybe Shara was to maybe they helped him.
Him and either way, he kept them close as we're told, because he
that was his policy towards dealing with threats was the
old, keep your enemies, your friends, close your enemies,
closer kind of thing, and not that he saw them as enemies, he
saw them as potential dangers because of their Heritage and
they've been legitimized by his their awful father.
Folks, we are still in the midst of our patreon drive.
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where there are not such things. Let's talk a little bit about
some of our fun experiences at ice and fire con.
We want to shout ice and fire con out and share our love of
that event. It won't be happening next year
and it should be back in 20, 25. Want to make sure we share a
little extra love since we won't be having much to say about it
next year. I wanted to say a thing about
musical, which will be out for everyone to watch will be
sharing links, but I wanted to hand as he's my Memento for me.
Here you go. Vote young grass, young, aegon,
that's Daisy, a folk wise, they played young Griff in the
musical and handed out these flyers campaign Flyers during it
and it was very delightful and I saved one and framed it as did
some other people, and I'm going to hang it up.
But before I hung it up, I thought I would show it off to
y'all. Hey, it's great.
Yeah, we talked a little about the musical last year, it was
the same one. They sometimes do the same
musical, two years in a row, because it's such a big
production. Ian and enables them to maybe
tied it up or maybe make a few changes and it's so good.
So funny. It's based on Queens the musical
and it's westerosi queens and that the young agon part comes
from a little skit that falls during the bit about Arianne
Martell and it has young Griff getting on Tinder and swiping, a
different queens and princesses of Westeros.
It's great. It's great.
Yeah, if you are impatient We the original Queens musical is
on YouTube right now and you could watch it there.
But if you're patient, you can wait for the new version, that's
just yeah. So I dressed up as upscale Crag
has crabs heater. I had a mask, the same mask, he
has a 3D printed mask of his, you know, Harpy mask, that was
kind of melted and I had a suit jacket with gold all over it and
some crab necklaces, I had a ring on every finger and I had
suit pants with gold trim. All over the map was of blinged
up crab feeder for sure. Yeah, gold shoe.
Laces on my dress shoes are for Nami, had a matching
high-fashion crab Peter and I were together it was cool to see
a couple crab feeders. We were big crabs as big theme
of the weekend. I even had a dark sister tats, a
temporary tattoo on my chest that people could see.
It was like, you know, because that's what kills me.
That's correct. Figures picture on screen for
everyone to see, is he? Yes.
And I me in their crab feeder outfits and you see the
necklaces are giving out. Marty Of beads, I gave a lot of
people crabs. Haha, yeah, that was crap.
I didn't like people crab one crab one crab.
Each know multiple crab that gets out of hand big.
Shout out to the organizers, the volunteers and the small Council
of nicaea Park on put in a lot of work to make sure we all have
a great time and we appreciate it.
And we did a parade by the way. Yeah, Tommy organized, got had a
snare drum and we like marched across the hotel leading into
the masquerade ball. That night, it wasn't a fun
moment. Yeah, Got a good job of it, that
I will be sharing. I'm going to get through all my
pictures and videos and share them on Facebook and photos and
all that. I think we had 12 griemann of
the Isle of faces, right? Mashup.
Her mashup of Charlie Day and yeah, yeah, yeah.
Charlie Kelly Green, Man. Safely.
Saving Our lives. Our lives right now, right?
Yeah. It was great there.
There were dozens of us so we like double their numbers and we
had two green people competing in the tourney melee because it
was Sean and Ally both representative.
Us is very lovely. Yeah, I wanted to say I'm share
a brief story about The Faceless Man game, which I always
participate in and this year Tommy Pappas was playing too,
and so, the first night of the con Skelly night, we're hosting
our party together, the Skelly party.
And you know we're talk, we had to like come to an agreement to
be like we're we don't have each other as we're not each other's
targets right now because like otherwise how are we going to
make this party? Fucking let me jump into the
faceless Man. Game is like a party game that
happens throughout. The whole weekend where fastened
because it's an assassin game where certain people who are
playing our hunting, other people who were just at the con
and then no one knows who's trying to kill who or whose
targets are. So this is kind of an open thing
where, unless there's collusion which girls go on, I will admit
a certain amount of like, we're, I want to point out.
I was in this too, by the way. Sean was in it too.
So, on Skelly night, I get my target.
It's the my target is Guy, David who made pizza for the whole
party and you tried to kill him anyway.
Well II didn't kill him. Wait until the pizza was like
giving out and then I can save it and I killed him and I was
great. And then he gives me his Target
and he's like, okay, my target is Tommy, and I was like, oh no,
that's like my clothes. I can't kill him tonight.
So I simply did not. I did not kill him.
And I went, I was like, I'm gonna give him the night, you
know. Well then I'm talking to a
fellow over pizza. And what do you know, he kills
me. Good job.
And I give him his new Target,
which is Tommy. And I looked, you know, him
like, do you know him? And he's like, no, I don't know.
Anyone, like, I didn't even know who you were, blah, blah.
But I'm like, okay, okay, great and I look to my like left and
Tommy's just in the room with us and I'm like, oh my God, it's
awful. And I'm like, trying to distract
him, I keep him in conversation. I see Tommy like exit, the
cabin, and I'm like, okay, bye. Nice to meet you about a great
and like I follow Tommy out, I think and I lose Me, I'm like,
oh no, where'd he go? And I turned back around and
Tommy's back in the cabin like feet away from his would-be
assassin. So I like, go inside, I run back
inside and I like grab Tommy like a secret service agent, you
know, like I grabbed him like someone is trying to kill you.
Come with me. And I like fairy him out of the
cabin. And as I do, I like make eye
contact with the Assassin like really intense eye contact.
And I know in that moment, he knows who his Target is now.
And that moment we're like, okay, when we gonna do so we
sneak Tommy back into the cabin back inside.
We're Tommy has a costume change that he'd planned but it is like
the perfect costume, change. He going to give people a chance
to guess with the costume us, do you think anyone might guess
what? He can't.
Imagine, that's what the costume to put it on screen for everyone
changed into a bikini, a yellow bikini, and ski a full ski mask
and then like went out, Party and it was gonna have like
fishnet fishnets. Hey, it's time to hit the stores
all over them. So he does that right?
And I see this guy, our assassin, Botta, like a minute
later, like after Tommy's made the change and he's like, I see
your friend went to bed real. Real slick.
And I'm like, yeah, yeah, he's asleep.
This isn't his cabin at all and like that.
He goes to bed and so Tommy survives the night, and then the
next day, Tommy's real, real paranoid all day until a person,
in a son of the harpy mass comes up to him, and kills him, and
which was very slick. And yeah, that was a very big
highlight of my Cod. I love the faceless Man game and
I really loved experiencing it with Tommy and saving his life.
Yep. You just needed to have said,
come with me. If you want to lose a total of
Terror and Tommy's eyes of a crowded room and like covered
him with my Ash and I sang A filk, we say to this the tune of
Jolene. We sang Shereen instead.
Yeah, we sure begging of you. Please don't burn her stand
this? Yeah, it was my first time doing
karaoke like that. And I was real nervous, but it
was a nice short little song and I had a good time.
There's a video in our Facebook group if you care to watch our
song. That's right.
We did the Me First and the
Gimme Gimmes version rather than the Dolly Parton version.
Because the me first version is shorter
or even more fired up for that. After having done so many
stories, I would love to share, but most one that was important
for me was the faceless Man one. And that took plenty of time, I
had to communicate Kate this store to y'all.
Well shout out to you and Tommy as well for arranging.
The Skelly night party Thursday night tradition.
All did a fantastic job. Thank you.
It was real fun. It was awesome.
Maybe 15 16 other people in a group chat planning, it only a
few weeks before the con. But yeah, we went, we went real
big with, it was fun. Yeah, I said Farah, Khan really
relies on people stepping forward and making things happen
because it's not like a corporate convention where
there's people with salaries that are paid to make these
things happen. So, Cause y'all.
That's what happened. Yeah, I was just really happy
with the the yoga. Did.
I did plank pose at a plank pose.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
That was good. That was a good way to like get
moving again. After Sean did that after
hurting himself at the attorney at the melee, he had took a
little tumble and messed up his knee a bit.
So, the first, You spy hurting, my knee was still spectacular.
He was limping. Sean, not dancing.
Sean, but yeah, I'm still limping Sean to tell you.
Let's get back to. It was like about daeron.
The good recalled. Darren was her half-brother, but
it's one of those weird half-brothers when your
half-brother is 30 years older than you.
That is. Yeah, you don't see a lot of
that. Now, even in old times or now or
ever, yeah, you don't see that very often.
Let's have a quota About what she looked like she was Slender
elegant called the greatest beauty of her age.
Quote, she had the silver gold hair of the targaryens, thick
and curling and wore it very long.
At some points in her life. It fell well below.
Her waist almost to the back of her knees.
She had a heart shaped face full lips and her mismatched eyes
were strangely large and full of mischief.
Her rival said, she used them to melt men's hearts.
Look like a Disney Patrick. Yeah.
Hurting her rivals, in this case, not like women.
Who were jealous. Here's hater.
Yeah, haters, that's the right term.
Her haters said, she used him to melt Miss, like, well, what
wouldn't you like? They would do that to?
I would give you that. Yeah, I'm using it to freeze
meant are, or both, she freezes them.
And then, she melts them his so much power over the temperature
of men's hearts that quote is direct from George, not from the
maesters or anything like that. So that's that's like Like the
way he sort of how he described her to amok for drawing.
That's one bright green eye and one dark blue eyes.
That is outstanding and unusual and sounds pretty cool.
And she's depicted as her favorite necklace was a silver
necklace, with alternating Star, Sapphires and emeralds to
reflect her eye color perfectly. And as we said, she didn't like
wearing gold. She did like Ivory and cloth of
silver which Do a lot of pain that she was very coordinated,
like her eye color matches, her necklace, her hair color matches
her silver and ivory, and yeah, I mean what the heck?
She's super super beautiful. So like, apparently she
accessorized well also. So none of her close Brothers
had these features really in combination.
Anyway, like Damon had the silver hair and the purple eyes.
Hey Gordon had dark hair and purple eyes Brendan's, hair was
white, not silver and he had red eyes.
So his eyes were Also outstanding, but in a very
different way and of course there's a lot of other bastards
of aegon the fourth who we've never seen.
Like we don't even know what Brendan sisters look like his
half-sisters when us and Mia. And for all we know they were
like friends with Sierra, they would have maybe been a.
They were pretty close in age, probably early, suppose ish.
So yeah, kind of unclear there. But so, even in terms of
appearance, she had some unusual unique features that would have
just like I says, they're just added to her beauty.
I'm making her more outstanding and unique, as from 180 to 185
996 ish. That's when she was about just
born to about age 14. So, I'm like her siblings, there
weren't questions about her birth right Daemon, blackfyre,
and King daeron there were all sorts of questions and if not
questions, just considerations name and yes, both, his parents
were Targaryen so that makes them better than other bastard,
blah, blah, blah or family politics.
Like the long-running feud between Bracken and black has
said it right that time. Yeah.
Obviously fuels the hatred, we bittersteel and bloodraven, like
they did just come out of nowhere.
Part of that is the existing Grudge between their two
families and the sitting current fighting between them to be as
close to the king as they could be first.
It's Barbara, then it's Melissa Blackwood then it's Bethany
Bracken. So shares not involved in any of
that because her mother not only dies young but isn't connected
to any of that past feuding politicking.
John Hightower if there was any business with him.
He was at least one degree separate from it.
Nino says, it's interesting to speculate where she lived.
She probably lived at court because of this Lack of
problematic Heritage and family politicking that would have
gotten in the way. On the other hand, Darren might
not have wanted to raise her. Right?
With the other children, the other Royal children the same
age to sort of differentiate her in a sense, on the other hand,
he kept the great bastards clothes for said.
So he may have treated her as one of the group in order to
keep her from feeling isolated, which would in long-term, a
beekeeper in the fold and make it less likely that she would
say join another faction. Or her Heritage could be used
against them, her bloodline, or whatever.
And maybe that impacted her young upbringing as a as a
scholar. If he was allowed to stay at the
red keep, which I do suspect. I don't know where she would
have gone summer haul. Some real didn't, what was
around but I don't know if that's much better to still
going to keep her around the Royal other Royals.
So anyway if she's a threat you could have gone to the Tower of
Joy. Ha ha ha no!
She's at the red. You got access to all these
great libraries that have on the books.
The same library that are he's the first in a decade or a
decade and a half from now discovers the prophecy that the
dragons will be reborn. Again, the very same Library so
that's the same Library. Rhaegar discovers and says, I
seems, I must be a warrior. So I'll all these things are in
the red keeps Library, whatever. And this is post baelor, the
Blessed it's burning. So there is still stuff in
there, clearly. Because He didn't, he clearly
didn't burn the thing that are he's found that said the dragons
would be born again. When she again my supposing it
maybe she had some bigger picture view what's going on.
She had some awareness of some prophecy whether she dreamed it
herself or read it somewhere or someone else dreamed it and told
her it might have affected her interactions.
Her getting married or not etcetera.
Yeah like unheard are on it's hard to tell what her role was
but under area. The first he's concerned with
prophecy and more was mauritian books than ruling.
He doesn't want to get married either, or he did get married
and have kids, like, it sounds like he had things in common
with share alike. They're both interested in
books. They don't care about marriage,
they're like politics is like what a bother.
You know there's no evidence of a bond between them but they had
things in common and they lived at the same time in the same era
and bloodraven. We know bloodraven was highly
trusted by Aries and Blood Ravens, her lover.
So like It's one degree of separation there.
So getting a little little ahead of ourselves by talking about
areas that jump run back to the time of Tehran and typically
young Noble girls, they're not around boys except when there's
a belt around right there. It's, they keep it very on the
quote-unquote up and up, like there's no, no rumors of
untoward Behavior. Right, the way Society has
always had a Septa with her at all times, right.
A chaperone but the loophole is Especially brothers, and her
brothers are targaryens. And so she did have suitors at
an early age, whereas someone like Sansa like they kept her
away from all that because it's inappropriate but the targaryens
have a loophole because of their exceptionalism and incest and
those two things are kind of thrown together.
That's why I bloodraven and bittersteel were so close to her
when they probably shouldn't have been like.
They're already like flirting with her and trying to like get
her attention when she's like 9 or 10 or Evan, or even younger
than Sansa was, which I wonder if this affected her later.
She's like, this is why she never married any of them cuz
they were like, creepy, from early age.
She's like, I don't want no like, y'all know?
Yeah, I'm going to, I'm going to turn this around Karma.
Y'all. I'm turning this around on you.
I'm gonna keep you at arm's length and make you maybe make
you think. I might marry you one day but
I've never actually going to screw you.
Yeah, I'm done with this but I'm going to let you think it's it's
Like there's a lot of room for her to be very like jaded about
the whole thing because of how it went for her, as a young
person before she was ready for it.
Like she's not going to be interested in this stuff when
she's six, you know, but they could already they're already
looking at her as a six-year-old, probably like, oh,
man, when she's an adult, she's gonna look like, uh, you know,
that's not normal for this for this setting plus because
there's power involved in it too.
It's also like, oh, she chose me over, you brother.
Like, they want this win over each other.
So, as she's kind of made into an Object, which it's not going
to make her more interested. And like you're treating me like
a thing and not a person. Like why, what's in it for me
here? Right?
So there's a lot of reasons why she would be better about the
whole process and this kind of disinterested in love and again
this goes back to her not having a mother and father as well.
That's not exactly the best thing for having role models of
healthy relationships around. Other than her siblings though.
There are other like family members that could have been in
her life. They wouldn't have been the same
age at her, but you wonder about the women of the made involves
like, Dan of the defiant Daemon, blackfyre is Mom.
We don't even know if she's still alive when she died, but
she might have some things in common with share, even though
she's a lot older than her might have taken her under her Wing or
something to Elena as well, who's highly intelligent so that
might have been something to talk to share about not Rana the
SEPTA. The one who was more SEPTA,
like, I don't think they would have had too much to talk about
the narrative. Maybe, you know if she was still
alive, you know, after egg on the third Steph she might have
still been around Dianna Dane who married make our?
What was her deal? She died young and cider another
Outsider. Yeah, she was may be brought in
for political reasons because of the whole situation with Dorn
and tying Dorn to the realm after Daenerys.
Mary's mayor on a couple, other marriages to shore up that
situation makes sense. So they're on marries his son.
Make our 2D on a Dane to you've got a Sunspear marriage.
You've got a star fall too far, west and sunspears, in the Far
East to get sun and stars my sun and stars.
Yeah, that's right. So short up on both sides there
and there are other half sisters, right?
All the non-common, all the non-noble born, half sisters,
that would have been out there. Any one of them, she could have
sought out or could have sought her out as well.
We've got this in common were Bastards of aegon.
The Unworthy, maybe we could just hang out.
Some of them are bloodraven sisters, you know?
Yeah, Rivers maybe had more of a Reason to have a connection with
Sheriff share as close with their brother.
Yeah. And earlier, we mentioned Daemon
blackfyre. What?
A Daemon. Blackfyre, think of share, maybe
just she was too young to be of much consideration to him.
She had the he died when he was 26 and she would have been only
about 14 or 15. So they may just maybe never had
a whole lot of contact but he was in court and got chased out
and you know was warned they were coming for him when that
happened. So he was at court right before
the Rebellion broke out, she probably was too so they would
have had contact Maybe she liked a lot of the other people at
court had a crush on him because he was like the perfect
Targaryen in terms of look and Manner and bearing and all that.
But she may have just been just like all the other guys.
Like I just don't care. No, I'm not, I'm not, he's to
he's too old for me, he's already married, he's already
got kids. And speaking of that, his kids,
his twins, aim, a gun at a man who were also killed in the red
grass field. They would have very close in
age to her. So you wonder maybe that's if
Damon took an interest in her and that have been for that
reason. I think maybe I should marry one
of my twin Sons to share a sea star.
Stood like Nick, the family even more prestigious and I don't
know something it. Yeah, I mean it's Char up like
different claims. Yeah, just cut them off rather
than have all these branches flying all over the place.
You can maybe reduce the number of Targaryen branches also Valor
de matar has Baylor break Spears.
Son's. This would have been pretty
close in age to share as well. They were born around the same
time, all these people. So they are all in the same
generation as a lot of open questions here, between what
personal relationship. Could have gone on between these
care. Allotted, so many Dynamics we
can't possibly guess at people that you can't just predict who
would be friends and who wouldn't just because I have
things in common doesn't mean they like each other it's
because they don't have things in common as I mean they
wouldn't, you know, Opposites Attract sometimes, who knows.
So we're really just shining a light on what we don't know here
to point out there's a lot when the stuff ever gets written or
put on TV, it's a lot to work with.
It's a very compelling groundwork.
Even if it's not super detailed in some places care of tire off,
another one who would have been maybe around another Foreigner.
Whoo. Maybe they would have had
something to bond over being not from there or somewhat, not from
their shares. Obviously born in Westeros, but
I was your heritage is outside Westeros.
Now Caritas if you get to that was that was Darren the
drunkards wife. He married Val are.
And then, yeah, it was Val our first and Valor divers, great
spring sickness and then she remarried to to him to bear on
the drunkard. And they only had one girl, who
may be died young, she was a simpleton so that she wasn't
really part of this. Succession share was a great
reader, a big reader of books that's why I compared to the
reader like a noble who would rather just read books and be
ignored. But she can't be ignored because
she's too attractive and the readers who powerful he's the
Lord of higher law. So like you can't just ignore
him, you know, he say when you say the reader that was an iron
born. Yeah.
Right. Yeah.
Roger Karloff. Yeah.
And he was unlike most ironborn a little more intellectual and
educated. Yes exactly.
So she's kind of like that. She's a lot more.
Added then like a like aerion brightflame or or even Baylor
break spear, he was well educated but maybe not bookish,
you know, but very smart or like maester aemon who was very
bookish as well. So another person she may have
had some things in common with like he didn't go to, he went to
the Citadel, you know, in early 200s if I remember right around
there. So she are have been you know,
20-ish by then so they could have they could have had some
conversations or connections or what?
Who knows? She learned a dozen languages.
That's one of the things that just like striking is my God.
This is a smart person really are talented.
At least like that is that is no small thing.
So she surely spoke licensing is one of the most certainly
because she would, she had connections to her mother even
though her mother wasn't around to like teach her given.
I mean, it's a safe guess I'm not 100% sure.
She knew by sending, you know, a dozen languages.
He probably knew the one from her family, as well as whatever
else. We think some languages are then
like common balerion. Yeah.
Hi Blair. That's three right there but
like the Dozen more Really Gonna name.
Nine more. Images Cheetos.
What are these other dialects? Like, she knew, maybe maybe she
knew like this gauri. Yeah, yeah, yeah, some of them
have just been dial, Askari, gaze.
Also known as Askari K. So the blackfyre Rebellion, the
first one broke out 196, she has no like direct family
connections except to the split here.
Like obviously she has no stake in it from her own house.
Like she's not like oh God if this side wins I'm screwed or if
the side wins a know, she's kind of positioned neutral.
We it's very personal to her like well if she's likes
bloodraven, then maybe she wants that side to win or Darren is
giving her access to the libraries and letting her live
there. She may not want to have a
change at the top because that might restrict her access to
what she has now. Why have a change when things
are good? The way they are.
You know, that's a with change comes uncertainty.
Does she really want her to have siblings fighting against each
other para some sources? Say, yes, she liked men dueling
over. Although liked is maybe like a
cynical thing. Like she just thinks the whole
thing is stupid and like, yeah, go ahead, man.
Like I don't care like you guys were idiots.
I'm not gonna marry any of you anyway like why are you just
she's toying with out dumb? They are you know, I'll accept
the outcome of the Duelist. I chose Angela sea star.
Yes, need to make some point like which Fest side of him and
she feel closest to if Darren was giving her an income,
another reason just not screw with that, like I'll just keep
the status quo, it's better than A whole nother team coming in
and taking the throne. And who knows what I'll be
allowed to do. Maybe, maybe they're all nightly
chivalric values. Wouldn't allow me to study
Supernatural stuff as much? I don't know that.
I mean, Darren was Pious and he allowed it.
So who knows? You know, just one thing.
I feel motivated to throw out there, I think there's got to be
at least some potential that maybe she did like bloodraven in
there. Still better still if you like
it. Maybe, maybe she couldn't
choose. It would be awkward to choose
one over the other or there's that the political pressures but
maybe she really did. I mean, at least semi
romantically care for them both. And it's about have had a period
in her life where she was real close with one of them and then
a different period where she was close to them both and it fit
didn't. Yeah, that's true.
I mean it might have been reciprocated for some period of
time and then not. Yeah, you're right.
There's no reason to think of it as just a monologue.
Her feelings would have been the same for her whole life.
She could have had, they could have had falling outs and then
getting back together or an interesting person young like
young, like teen Rings. Sheriff.
Like she's like 14 might have been so different than 28
year-old she Rose. Yeah absolutely and I feel like
as well that she has a lot of incentive to be neutral at least
on the outside to project neutrality.
Yeah. It doesn't want anyone thinking
she's like a spy for the other side, or passing info to her
other brother like you're on our side, but you had a relationship
with our number one, enemy bittersteel.
Like just make it clear that she's not invoke.
I'm not involved. I'm not connected to any of
this. I'm just watching to see who
wins. And I'll congratulate the winner
and just I just want to be with my books, you know, this is this
is kind of comes back to the beginning quote where barristan
thinks that this rivalry played a big role or if not caused it
which we know he's exaggerating. But it's not a completely
made-up lie. Either there's it's partly true
or just not sure how true. Like my boss is be that she
could have stopped it. Okay?
Maybe she had the power to do something that she'd just opted
not to or maybe she's blamed for that when she isn't because, you
know, Yeah, women for something. She's as her duty to do that,
but like the assessment might be like, oh, if she era had loved
bittersteel back the wars wouldn't have happened.
Okay? Just like that.
Again, that's not on her but like she could have stopped it
but then she may have been one of the few people with the power
to smooth it over because of their love of her.
And yeah no and there's no one else that they both respected
that much that they would agree to negotiate with or something
like that. No one else had their Mutual
affection anywhere close to that level that they had.
Or her. So yeah.
That is it really? Yes, she does.
Kind of someone that I'm trying to paint his neutral.
There would be a lot of incentive for her, not to be and
not necessarily that she did. But it's a tough spot to be in.
So maybe a bit of a tightrope walk for her to be there and you
can imagine also be an interesting drama.
There would be a lot of conflict and Intrigue and dilemma that
if, you know, if we were to get any of this on screen, there's
enough there enough players and enough, unknown and intrigued,
they could stick to Cannon, If you will but create a very rich
story first, I'm picturing it, I spark on John Eagan, much
family, they wrote a telenovela script.
Forehead Olenna talking to Old Man and it was Becca played when
I was very funny, but I'm picturing.
This is like a telenovela style that Sharon bittersteel and
bloodraven and all that only you can I just bring the sides
together. You can mend the family
close-ups on her face tears. Forming any eyes before he was
like sweet steel and he looks now, I will be called Bitter.
Sweet, Sweet serenity. Later rain the so her ages like
fifteen to twenty seven is, we're gonna, you know, we're a
little loose with the timelines here because we're not entirely
sure. When she was born that we do,
have it narrowed down to a range of about four years.
But we're also kind of jumping around with the topics about her
because they are a bit vague in some spots.
So we said Darren was said to have kept the great bastards
close Shara that may have been less of a consideration for him
because she was the least dangerous and a political sense
because she wasn't double Targaryen or Bracken or
Blackwood or married. To a family with a big interest
in one side of the other and need a says, Serena as well.
As seem likely seemed the least threatening of all the great
bastards for multiple reasons are sharabi.
She was not remotely of an age to consider marriage early on,
so she couldn't have been a pain and the normal considerations
that makes someone a threat are there for her.
I wonder if she was used as a diplomat or an ambassador.
Certainly, that's a Theory comes later.
Under eggs, rain, which she may not even be alive during that
time. But 12 languages, beautiful and
kind of intimidating. How makes a good Ambassador like
a representative. Someone that's knows how to talk
some his courtly and experienced feels like that would have been
a good role for her mate. Like she simply has seems to
have the qualifications and the disposition and just a lot of
qualities that you need to have a Time, some expert on what
those qualities are. But feels right, you know,
someone who's like little disconnected but has all the
raised a court. Yeah, just I feel like that
works. On the other hand, they're on
may not have liked this idea because for Heritage and just he
doesn't want her making connections or maybe her
connections to sorcery, might have made him uncomfortable
using her as a representative because he's so Pious.
I mean there, I don't know. There might still have been the
exact xenophobia we mentioned. Yaks, is a mention as multiple
reasons, why someone might say, hey, yeah, this person has all
the qualities you want in a diplomat and an ambassador but
But they make us look terrible, you know, which I don't think is
true, but it might be, I feel like Darren would want to do
that because he was known for having a more diverse cord like
he had Masters and Scholars and Poets and musicians, and more
women than West Rossi were used to seeing at court.
He was trying to have a more to use of modern.
He was, he was Progressive, even though he was also religious,
which is not something you kind of tend to associate together,
but it that's a thing people. There's religious progressives
that's a thing for sure. I heard of Martin Luther.
Yeah, like, absolutely. Like, it's just the matter of
the time and place for what. Can what sensitive relative
sometimes? Yeah, absolutely.
So ringing door and into the realm was very Progressive at
the time, it was like the old garbage, like know, there are
life term Lifeline, lifelong enemies, we have to fight them
now. You have dornish princesses just
hanging out here. It's like that was offensive to
them. So Darren may have yielded to
that to political expediency. But I think he would have wanted
to show the diversity of of his court and the intelligence of
the people that he kept close and shares a smart person.
So would have maybe reflect on him.
Well, if if the xenophobia wasn't too overwhelming, which
it may have been, it's also possible that she could have
gone along with diplomats to learn from or be an advisor for.
So maybe if she wouldn't be accepted as a foreigner as a
woman but she still has the insight and the best interest of
the court in mind or whatever so she can go along with someone
else. I like that idea, like not the
only enough. Lead Diplomat.
But part of the Diplomatic party.
Yeah, she'd be in the group. Maybe not the actual leader of
it. Let's talk about marriage and
why she never got married and play around with this notion of
bit and but it did for it said, she refused many suitors.
Maybe politics played a role, she just didn't want to choose
because choosing a marriage. Using husband means, take,
you're going to end up on a side either then or later.
She's seen all these Civil War. She comes.
She's born when she was there. This was blackfyre Rebellion.
'S comes along. That's the second Targaryen
Civil War of that century. Right.
So she's well aware of Dance of the dragons and what it cost,
the family dragons, right? And now the blackfyre rebellion
was costume even more like, okay, all this comes from, he's
entangling alliances. If I just don't get married, I'm
never going to be forced onto a side here.
So may have been part of her calculation.
Again, I must mention Darren taking care of the great
bastards didn't to lessen their incentive to feel jilted to feel
like he's their best spots for he's their best bet.
So he was probably getting an income.
Like an allowance, there's probably substantial.
I mean to live. Like a royal does you got to
have some money? So she may have been like yeah.
Again other reason just to keep things the way they are.
I don't need to if I change out, who's paying me?
It may not be as much for the mean, I pay me at all.
Yeah. By the way, that might be
another reason to think of gold is Borger because she wants
gems, whatever. She thinks of it, whatever she
thinks have other people, find it valuable.
So her allowance She would get more spendable, money from her
allowance. It's like, here's X money to buy
gold and all the other princesses go buy gold.
She buy silver and has its extra money left.
Over to go buy books, or to go researcher.
Whatever money on books. Yeah, you're right.
It's a good point as far as marriage.
So I think we're coming up with these reasons.
Why I like politics and not wanting to get involved, not
wanting to be beholden to a husband, not wanting to be
second fiddle to you. Like I'm subordinate to you now
because that's how West Rossi marriages tend to work.
She just didn't want to sign up for that, but you may have just
also I had really high standard. She's like now I'm just not you
were good enough for me like nope.
Nope just does not want to ever be pregnant and yeah first and
died in childbirth. Like so many other parents and
is yeah yeah I think that by mean I think.
Yeah. The giving of her power and
freedom but yeah I think probably because a lot of these
yeah all these things right like there's a lot of reasons on the
con list you should make a pro/con lists like we just named
several major cons the only real reason for pros like if she
wanted kids or if she wanted love but she could have love and
not married. Yeah.
Maybe just was kind of just like
we said, it talking about her childhood.
She maybe not had a lot of love in her band that interested in
it. You know, this is the way he
lacked role models, for loving relationships.
This may not have been something she cared about.
Yeah. Also, she could have some of
these reasons could have she had reason X when she's 19.
And reason why when she's 24 and reason, see why she's 27, why
are they could change over time? There could have been a phase
where she really did want to get buried but bitter Stills like I
can't right now. I have this other Duty or, you
know like, you know, so moments when she may have wanted to kill
the Stars, weren't the Stars weren't lining up for her and
yeah, maybe she just wasn't like, I don't want to marry one
of my. Brother's neither of them are
gonna end up his king or even prints, maybe she was holding
out for someone of higher rank that would does not fit in very
well with some of these other notion that she just didn't want
to get married at all but these are all possible.
She's holding out for someone of lowering haha.
No and but I think about it from her other.
The other angle as an unmarried but super high status woman, it
could make sense to stay unmarried either.
Wait for some amazing opportunity or just reap the
benefits of being single and beautiful and Highborn.
And just continuously use that like continuously recycled.
It's been, it's been are going to keep dueling in her honor and
giving her favors just to sit by her.
I would she give that up like I mean you can there are some
reasons why but you can see why she wouldn't he be like, yeah,
I'm gonna just keep this running as long as I can like why
they're just giving me Jewels too.
Sit by me if I'm married. There's only one guy.
Is he gonna keep giving me Jules to sit by me?
If I married him probably, he's gonna put babies in me and they
might kill me. Yeah, no.
Yeah. I'm gonna, I'm gonna stay
single. This is better for me.
Yeah, like not everyone can do that but she can and so she did
once again, I think of Angela. So you've had two different men
dueling over you at two different points in life?
Oh yeah, I guess I have a lot more than that.
Apparently and yeah for a lot lesser reasons.
Yeah I guess I have I forgot about the, you know, you didn't
John Mark and John David. Yeah, don't have a lot of
choices. You know, it's not what you
would say to her. I once again want to bring up
the thought here that another potential motivation.
Something it is like new since south of the Dragon for us to
think of this angle but maybe she thought Or knew she wasn't
supposed to marry more was supposed to marry some certain
individual based on some prophecy.
Maybe she was waiting for something to happen and it just
never happened. It's hard to know.
But but so many of these characters in this time, period
might have been wrapped up and hand or had knowledge of certain
prophecies, right? Yeah.
And and and that could have guided some of the decisions
that were being made and including her getting married.
I posited in our document I wonder if Darren while i+
several things about what his thoughts on this was, whether he
wanted her to get married or whether he was glad she didn't
or whether he influenced her to not get married, stay that way.
Maybe like the that she was staying in Mary's like.
Okay, that's a good thing. No new targaryens.
None of this mess needs to happen.
We could just keep it where it is and he might have just done
incentivised her. There's like I see that she's
not seem to want to get married. I'm going to be okay, do things
to that status quo. Like yes, let's encourage that.
On the other hand you may have considered her as a bride for
one of his son. You have four Sons Right?
Makar would have been the closest in age to her and make
ours, one who married the on a day, and he may have considered
marrying him to share. Instead of the on a Dane that
would've been interesting. Need a doubts that she says, I
don't think Darren wanted to treat.
The great bastards is equals to himself his descendants Hagen
the for that seriously undermined Iran's position by
his death bed. Blanket legitimisation placing
Darren in the position politically uncomfortable
edition of suddenly having a number of extramarital siblings,
whose legitimacy now never be reversed, I don't think Darren
went out of his way to be cruel to them.
M and indeed, I think he tried to play nice with him but I
think he did what he could to treat them as separate from his
own legitimately born line. Royals less.
Anyone start wondering whether any of these children, had more
of a right to the throne than Darren himself.
That's another tightrope like well by start marrying them into
my family that sort of accepts, their deathbed legitimisation
and furthers that that belief and and makes in shrines them as
truer. Targaryens, I never took the
name Targaryen, but if they were to get married to targaryens,
they might say, okay. Yes.
I am a Targaryen And yeah, it's still best of might have been
better though, because it least you like, and I say it but like,
clean it up a little bit? Yeah.
Like, all right. There's like four.
Great bastards and 30 other bastards.
Well, how about these two bastards?
Get married and now let's move forward.
Those are the clear Top Dog set precedent.
Move on a specially. Like once one generation passes
that you like, clarify things a little better and have a bunch
of lingering ones out there for me.
Maybe intermarry all of them to each other.
Just like, look, we're also part of the same family, you know?
And let's just get past this one, tricky generation, and it
be more clear moving forward. That it's just the same one
line. Yeah, good.
Not, maybe that's hard for him to realize or coordinate or get
everyone to agree to, but I wonder if that maybe would have
been better, maybe he won't even got a chance because they're
going to rebuild before he could be said together.
I don't know. So, in terms of us wondering
about shears Ambitions and wanting to marry, Someone had a
Highborn or whatever. If we're believing share, had
any kind of charm or sorceress abilities or actual abilities,
do anything like that and was some seductress?
Well, I don't think she had those Ambitions, then it's like,
she fails. She did.
She never married her, right? You think, I guess she wanted
one of those men, you kind of think she could have had them if
you write code of? Yeah, you're right.
Like, the way it sounds like she could have had any man, she
wanted basically. It kind of seems like if she was
like, yeah, I want to marry an heir to the throne like it seems
like maybe she could have an angled that like, every believe,
Even in these things said about her.
But the point, I don't know that.
We believe that maybe she thought she was supposed to
marry some Dothraki horselord and learn that language trying
to get ready for horselord. He's all that and yes she does
everything make that happen. I like maybe they and seeing
Danny Mario yunkai with or what's a guy with the his
daughter. Whatever I ghiscari.
What's his language? Yeah.
Meereenese marigny is yes, are ya?
Yeah. So we theorized that maybe John
Hightower and Serena. I conspired to have a daughter
too. For Sorrento's daughter to maybe
Mary Damon Waters later Daemon blackfyre, maybe she era wanted
that for herself. She saw Damon talking about
marrying multiple wives and thought maybe I can be one of
them later and be married to a King.
That way that would have come when she was much younger.
And would have maybe been a childish fancy.
Like this is because she would have dreamed of when she was
like 8 like I'm gonna marry my brother Damon.
You know like everyone has a crush on him so she may have had
that too and when she was older she was like actually never mind
but of course when she was older, Damon was dead.
I said there's that's wouldn't have even been possible.
It's also possible Nina says that after the first block
fire-bellied and are on the second, he just Carriage cheer
ever marrying because he saw what happened?
Marrying? Damon.
Black fire de Rohan of Irish that enabled, the Rebellion.
He thought he was maybe trying to shore things up and it
actually led to them having all these children and multiple
blackfyre Rebellion has followed a.
He only lived through one of them himself there on did.
But still that maybe he didn't repeat that mistake and say okay
we're going to not let these other great bastards marry if it
all possible. Maybe she era took it on herself
and not Mary for that very reason.
Like she saw what happened and she was able to Noodle that out
herself. Be like I don't want to be a
part of all that, I don't need to throw myself into that and
that fire with a why fire and just stay back and read her
books, some more, right? It's I want to stick with my
Scrolls. I'm not interested in rebellions
and that kind of crap. She's not injured in politics.
Like you said, it doesn't seem like she was at interested.
Like, she could have married high if she wanted to, and just
doesn't seem like she did. You know, I thought I had
earlier, you said something to the effect, you know, once once
these once, aegon the Unworthy is legitimized all these
bastards. Now you can't really go back in
that they're all legitimate or have this claim going forward.
But how true is that can someone legitimize some someone else?
It's like kind of a gray area cuz King is it seems like if you
can legitimize him you can only chittim eyes or maybe people
wouldn't accept it. Or maybe there's not precedent
but it's a possibility. But I'm just imagining if Dwight
was King legitimized, some legitimate legitimate, some
legitimacy, yeah, yeah, it is interesting.
Like, what, how does that how does that click?
Like, how do they what do they think it's?
It is a very gray area because they never took the name if they
had. What would have happened?
What's their status of their children had?
They not rebelled would have been an interesting question.
Like what if Damon never bail How our like, what's the status
of his children as far as where are they?
Royal I their princes? But what?
Yeah, it really gets into the heart of the way monarchy Works,
which is the King's word is law. If people follow his orders,
like, if enough people agree, then yeah, then that's what
happens. But if people push back then
they don't like are, he's like he wanted to burn them all and
Jamie's like no, you can't. Yeah, and he didn't you can't go
too far. Yeah.
Jamie had the Sori helps have precedent sets and you know
there's all these things that you know traditions of factor
and you know the power you have at the moment and all these
things but it seems like you know maybe his name was aegon
the Unworthy and it seemed like he wasn't following traditions
and there's all sorts of motivations to not obey his
decrees but they did like what he said it.
Well, they're all legitimate now.
Well if they're on then says okay they're not legitimate now.
Carol. Well, he said it they're not
legitimate now like it seems life is that he's you just say
to happens. Can we at least run that out
there and try on her? Yeah.
So it seems like they tried to play the half measure like yes
they're legitimate but they're still not.
We're not going to fully treat them legitimate.
Like we're going to give them the honor of legitimacy but not
the political rights necessarily and the name.
So yeah, it feels like they sort of did a half measure their,
maybe they degrade their own power if they set the precedent,
the king says X, we say no. Remind our necks then that.
Then I say why? Well, they might say, never mind
on why I gotta have to stick it with it.
If I want people to stick with what I see exactly.
If you undermine a prior King, it undermines herself.
Yeah. Like kings were then you're not,
you're no. The Kings word is law if you do
things like that. Yeah.
So some things are easier to undermine than others or more
acceptable to undermine than others or Let's talk about the
duels that were part of her life that it says men not just
bloodraven and bittersteel fought over her.
Here's a quote this is just crazy y'all though.
She never wed, she had many offers and several lovers
Through The Years. Jewels were fought over the
right to sit beside her. Men killed themselves.
After falling from her favor. Poets outdid each other writing
songs about her beauty her. Most Ardent admirer was her
Half-brother bloodraven who proposed marriage to her half a
hundred times. Shara gave him her bed but never
her hand. It amused her more to make him
jealous so that is not masterly editorializing that is also from
George so it's fact ascriptions of some of these characters.
Yeah. We artists amok many years ago
and that's that's important because it's like well if this
was a major be like did he really did she really amused her
to make him jealous? Yes.
Because George said, I'd say, this is this is this quote is
probably the most actual information we have about share
has personality of anything, like it, almost that last line.
Yeah, because we would be suspicious of just meshed
release saying that, like, they don't know better and they just
interpret it that way. But nope, that's what it was
play with him, a little. Yeah, and even this, you have to
wonder did did it amuse her when she was 16 or when she was 22?
You know, you're right there though.
A very good point and we don't Know how old she got to be.
Some people think she's still alive, which not the most
likely, but hey, bloodraven stole the craziest thing ever.
Yeah. So yeah, what is her for her
favorite music? It's a favor for like riding in
a tournament or just like I say your name kindly, I acknowledge
you when you're in the room, what does that even mean?
There's it falling from her favor.
I don't think that's the same as giving someone your favor an
attorney, I think That is like no, you're no longer sit.
Exactly. Next to me is my right.
Like you're no longer welcome in my bedroom.
Yeah. Yeah.
And they killed him. Some of his men multiple men.
Plural killed themselves over this laws.
Like whoa. No wonder people think there's
magic involved. Especially men that never liked
saw her in person. If you saw her in person, we
were like, oh, I get it. Damn.
She's beautiful. But, but like, writing about it,
after the fact, there's no pictures you're like, man, is
it? It almost makes sense to us.
Scribe sorcery in there somewhere because people are
killing themselves. All right?
Yeah, words. I'd like to use here to describe
this, but you can fill in the blanks yourself and be like,
blank, so good. It makes men kill themselves.
Yes. And it's not mismatched eyes.
Yeah, so this is pretty extreme, right?
It's very much an inversion of the chivalric Romantic dual
women but you know men fighting for women's honor and the best
man wins or the most honorable whinge like no none of them win.
None of them get this. Some of them maybe get to hook
up, but none of them get the marriage.
They all get to give gifts. And yes, it's so different.
So she sees this as entertainment.
Maybe she's a little bit, has a little bit of a cruel streak to
her. She enjoys the men fighting over
her and the attention. It shades of Sarah Targaryen
even, the name is similar, Sarah and Shira member sarahx
Targaryen was one of Joe Harrison.
Alice Sands daughter's the one who had multiple lovers which
that was a real Scandal. When you're an actual true born
princess, Who they wanted to marry to some Lord to shore up
their alliances. She never got married member,
she ran away. Never got married.
She escaped. She was sent to be with the
silent sisters, I think, and escaped, and got overseas.
And she did all this by charm, like most of her Escape.
She like, talk dude into like, letting her on the ship and
accused her beauty to break down barriers.
That a lot of people would have gotten caught and this and been
sent back to where they'd been, but she escaped, and then went
overseas and her children eventually made.
Add their play at the great Council and they didn't get very
far, but you see why Darren didn't want this person having
children necessarily because they could come back and
threatened the dynasty later. But yeah, lots of similar Sarah
was kind of out of control her father killed one of her Lover's
and it do laughter. He Dishonored her, you know,
supposedly that was Braxton bees.
Barry. I think if I remember correctly.
Yeah. So this is a very much a
reversal of the like noble honorable duel for the woman's
Over. That got the kind of things
Sansa grew up, fantasizing about and reading these stories about
Sarah. Ashera is totally flip that
script and taking control of it for her own Amusement rather
than from some like ideal that she's trying to live up.
If she's like nah, this is just fun, Campbell wonder if there's
another Potential there. That, for example, maybe
bloodraven is worried about the men that share has had
relationships with. Yeah.
What they might know. They might be privy to certain
information and he has them killed and makes it look like a
suicide. Wow, dark.
Whether it's out of jealousy, or protection of, its secrets of
the realm or something like that.
Yeah, I liked it. Thats dark, but I can buy it
because we're getting into one of them were about to get into
one of the more interesting section.
We haven't talked about magic yet in detail.
We're about to and Magic was at use.
That's one of the rumors that she and bloodraven used magic to
ferret Out secret supposedly as Master Whispers.
Hey, let's get to that in a minute.
Now, as far as the fact that she had a lot of lovers, never had
kids, probably took care of that herself.
Like me was Aria said on the TV show I made, I took care to make
sure I would never have children.
She may not have made it permanent but she may have.
You may have mean she's well-read, she knows tansy T and
the recipes for not having children.
Yeah. I wonder if any of her suitors
were smart enough to like bring her books, like that's what she
wanted. Like, okay, this guy's you
brought me gold. You dumbass like, I don't know
anything about me. You know.
I don't like gold. You see any gold on me now?
What? Hello?
Pay attention golden company, everybody.
I thought you needed to yeah. Like if they brought her books
that would be like okay this guy at least he's not a dumb ass.
Like the others he at least knows what I like that's
courtship 101. Give per the person you're
trying to woo things. They actually like, you know
find a few things out about them and be like okay you like this.
Let me get you a good version. Thank you, a fancy rare book.
I found you signs and portents like oh, I'm interested.
Now you know, bring me bring me the Jade compendium and you know
I'll fall into your arms, you know kind of thing.
So that Nina says this is like a reverse an inversion the reverse
of Brianna and the sick games they played.
Make her think they They were actually interested.
This is like they the reverse of that, we're brand was to them so
unattractive, that this is, okay.
It's okay to make fun of her because she's unattractive or
she has the opposite end of the spectrum.
Based on West Rossi, beauty standards that are pretty
similar to real world ones, at least Western ones.
And yeah, so that What she says, here, Nina rights brand was more
confused than impressed, by the traditional displays of West
Rossi romance. But she noted, that Hiles
training with her meant more than all the rest.
Like when someone actually trained with her like a treated,
her like a knight in the process.
I can work ship or the oh, even better or like an equal and
engaged with her in what she's interested in and treated her
like an equal, that meant a lot to her.
Like, even though she doesn't like her Heil hunt, but the fact
that he was willing to train with her, Hey, this guy if he
was really trying, this is the right way to do it.
He was more cunning in his evil prank because he actually picked
something that she would be interested in something that
showed respect, even though it was behind that was was not
respect at all and you think the same thing here with Sierra but
in Reverse so that's very good catch by need in there.
So this rumor here, let's talk. Let's get into the magic stuff.
This rumor exists about Danny. So think about she era when
you're hearing this, this quote I have heard it said that the
Silver Queen feeds them with the Flesh of infant's, while she
herself bathes in the blood of a virgin girls and takes a
different lover every night. Now, that's what garos.
That's my kind of woman the Widow of the Waterfront saying
that with that. And, of course, the winner of
the Waterfront, doesn't believe these rumors.
She's just repeating this. This is what people say about
Danny and well, what's so interesting about this is the
way these rumors are applied, okay?
So the bathing in the blood A virgin girls.
Now let's talk about that one first because it's, it's a
little peculiar. We're not rumors said about, say
Danelle Austin, it's a reference to her red hair and parts and in
a few other cases as well. But it can't be when in the case
of Danny or she are because they don't have red hair.
They have silver hair. So that's it's not about.
It can't be the hair dye thing that we sometimes think might be
what the servants are seeing. Like, oh my God, that's blood.
It's know what's this red hair dye?
Well, these two and some other kind of fluid.
Everyone, the Flesh of infant's. That's what she means.
Yeah, no, but there's no, yeah, yeah, we know.
But there are citizens that doesn't apply, or they can't
have stumbled on Danny or Shira dying their hair red because
they don't have red hair, that just couldn't be it.
I guess Rohan Weber was another one that people say that about,
I can't remember, but there's some other it comes up with some
of the redhead. So it's kind of an easy
explanation, but it doesn't work here as an expert.
It's just something that people make up.
And Yeah, it's babies. You know, just throw that out
there, just the worst in the worst.
Slander you can imagine, you know, Ares.
The first is sort of our transition into a more magical
era. We know that they're on the
second had a good rain, was his nickname.
And after all, but he wasn't big on Magic.
He died during the Great spring sickness.
We know she survived it. We don't know how if she for all
we know she died. Not long after it but for all we
also know she loved the long time after it.
All we know is he definitely lived survive the great spring
sickness because she's mentioned as having used magic to help
even as master of hand and she's also mentioned in the present
tense by egg. In a quote, we're going to get
to later and that quote in the present tense comes after the
great spring sickness. So there you go.
But it did kill off many of her cousins.
And of course, her half-brother bear on the king so that could
have affected her personally, even though it didn't kill her.
And as a person interested in sorcery, this is where we get
back to the part that Ares. The first is a really compelling
King for her to live under when he's the It rekindled the
dragons will come back prophecy. This is the same era where Amon
maester aemon, refers to his brothers, having dreams of
dragons, that killed them, all right?
She's at like, a young adult, right in this are smack dab in
the middle of all this. This is almost unfathomable that
she's not involved and it seems likely that she's very involved
just behind the scenes, a bit again, the red keeps books, read
keeps access big deal. Huge Factor here.
By the way, Sheridan still didn't marry bloodraven after
here. Ascended to handle King, she
didn't? She refused him when before.
He kept asking, she kept refusing so it wasn't his rank
or at least. It wasn't enough rank for that
to matter. Here's that quote between egg
and dunk set us up with further discussion of Shara.
See sorceress you've known queens and princesses that they
danced with demons and practice the Black Arts lady.
She era does Lord, Blood Ravens paramour.
She bathed in blood to keep her beauty And once my sister Rhea
put a love potion in my dream. So I've marry her instead of my
sister Jaya. Yeah.
Like wait. What egg?
What how much does rumor did? He witness this?
He sees here? Like I don't think he's watching
sheer a bathe but I mean this Kate didn't come from nowhere.
I mean he lived at court, presumably the same time as her.
So it's kind of like this isn't just like a distant rumor about
people from afar the rumor mill, the game of telephone A phone
getting expansive in the rumor growing with each retelling.
This is he's pretty close to the source here.
This business with a love potion.
I think, if you're young Ray living at court and you want a
love potion, you go to Shira Seastar.
You're like this is the person that would know about such
things. Like she's the, you're a young
girl. You see the extremely beautiful
woman, who's like all put together and courtly and
assertive, seemingly and Powerful sought after sought
after you would look dirty would be maybe a something of a role
model and you'd be like especially if you heard she's
into magically taking you make. So share a my I'd like to think
there's a lot of ways. Just go share.
Could have just entertained her just played along like yep
here's your love posher. Here you go, here's a little.
That's what I tend to lean towards told her that doesn't
eliminate the potential for their or her really being
magical but I still tend to think that.
Yeah, she just gave her some root beer.
Yeah exactly. I totally think so too.
I by the way that's the Sworn Sword that quote comes from, but
also yeah. But she's accused of the
standard Beauty magic, like the blood bathing and Beauty,
creating a blood for beauty. Which maybe she was using
clamors you know I mean she wasn't using them to like you're
eight years old or something like that or even ten or twelve
probably but maybe later in life she was using glamour's.
I mean, if she's using magic bloodraven, definitely use
glamour's and she's super associated with him so it
really, really makes sense. Maybe she used it to go out and
disguise like he did. She could have done some of the
same things. She was said to possess a quote
large, Arcane Library. She surrounded herself with
Scrolls so the rumors of magic are not unfounded like she's
definitely in. Evolved in it.
Like how many spells use actually casting?
Who knows? But she was interested in the
topic and her mother was too though.
They had no direct connection because her mother died.
So young. But she inherited whatever her
mother had like whatever books her mom left behind a might have
kicked off her interest. She's like well this is my only
connection to my mother. I want to bond with my dead
mother Through The Possession, she left behind and try to take
up some of her interests, because that's the only
connection she has to her. It's a little sad, right?
But It makes sense. That's that's pretty human thing
to do. Like you don't you have no
connection to your family but you've, they leave you some
stuff. So you're kind of like, well
this is all I have want to try to bond with this and explore it
and see where it takes me. Well, it just happened.
Some of that is Scrolls, Arcane Scrolls and magic, and stuff
like that. So also, you know, maybe she
really did bathe in blood one time just to try it.
Yeah. Doesn't it mean it worked but it
does mean everyone will talk about it for the rest of the
history, right Point. Yeah, and yeah and maybe some of
these things. Came from like ergy reconnected
with her lysine family and they sent her things and talk to her.
Who knows? Yeah.
What about divination. Like, what about seeing secrets
and seeing the future? Or looking into the flame there?
Something like that. Here's another quote that gets
us started on this subtopic. Bloodraven, proved to be a
capable head but also a master of Whisperers who rivaled lady
misery and there were those who thought he and his half-sister
and Paramore share. A sea star, you sorcery to
ferret Out. Secret, it became common to
refer to his thousand eyes and one and Men.
Both high and low began to distrust their neighbor for fear
of there, being a spy and Blood Ravens employ.
I like the reference to his eye because she fits in out so
nicely, like his one eye, and His Thousand eyes has two of
those thousand eyes are bright, green one, and a dark blue one.
Yeah! Perceptive.
Pair of eyes. He's highly intelligent and
capable. Mmm, gotta love it now and maybe
traveling around and diplomatic missions picking up and dropping
off. Informational around Pro true,
Nina points out that losing and I made her made them even more
similar because they both have mismatched eyes now because his
matching because there's one in there.
Isn't. But while her different colors
but still using magic, help the master Whispers like that just
it's really hard. It's she was kind of a
straightforward thing to do. We talked about that in a number
of cases, like Iris doesn't seem to be using magic but other
Master Whispers, he's even mentioned, lady misery here.
Miss Aria is talked about Even if you don't use magic or you
use magic, it could be case like Melisandre a year on where you
use some magic but you also spread rumors about yourself
using more magic than you actually do.
So you're let's say you're a level 3 magician but you make it
seem like you're a level 13 magician, you know.
So that's that's pretty big and intimidation and retire.
Big part of of the Spy game. I'm actually only at level 3, R
Izzard, but I make it seem like I'm a little surprised that I'm
Stormborn, but it was really more of a Also, just like a
heavy rain. Yeah.
And I was really boring, then it was really just a few days let
you anyway. So those both fit with nazaria
and spreading rumors and Tiana of the tower as well, who's also
rumored to be someone who cared about secret special, cause
you've met Gore. He was very cruel and harsh, and
bloodraven isn't cruel, but he was harsh.
He was a hardliner in a lot of ways.
And so, you kind of see this sort of spy network of secret
police. That's very kind of
authoritarian under bloodraven, and And if she are, I was
helping that engine run. Yeah, like I wonder what
relationship you had with the Ravens teeth.
She have Raven teeth guarding her half the time like following
her around protecting her like the cat.
Detachment of a few of them to keep her safe around the red.
Keep, who knows? Did she have dragon dreams?
I would guess not, but it's definitely possible.
And she might have had other ways that use divination.
We, maybe, I don't know that she had a glass candle, but all the
people to have insight into how they might work.
She would be one of them Damon this.
I would add to her and blood raving seeming magically
powerful. Yeah, between them, they had a
glass candle. They were sharing.
So I could just know things that people like how can they
possibly know that? You know.
Yeah, and combine that with spies and secret passages.
All this other stuff they can really put up a front of having
more knowledge and power than it seems possible without magic
which might also have the effect of making people.
Just tell you anyway. Yeah.
Like like that's what virus find out.
Anyway I'm magical. So just tell me now and save us
both the trouble as far as is introduced as so good at his job
that people assume he's got black magic and then later, like
know this guy hates magic, he's just really good at spies, you
know, of course, maybe he's fooled us and in thinking he
hates magic and he really is into it, but there's no
evidence. Dance of that.
It just seems like, no, he's just a really damn good spy.
And so our, I mean, bloodraven and share maybe they were too
but they probably did the magic. Another interesting about
bloodraven in the idea that there's dreams or some prophecy
that they're worried about for the future aegon's dream,
however you want to phrase it or call it.
At some point. Bloodraven weather.
Early in life later in life, is a big open question.
He got on that track, he found himself communicating with some
greens here I guess they brought him into the fold somehow just
how it looks like a brand was brought into the fold but
saying, I know exactly what happened.
Of course I don't we have a lot of theories in our bloodraven
episodes about what might have happened here.
But at some point he became concerned with that and if he
was still connected to share sea star at that time, he would have
absolutely told her and maybe she Been reading about as well,
maybe she could corroborate it from things he'd already read or
dreamed or something and then there are all the been they're
Off to the Races. Like oh my God, this is real,
this is a big deal and then that opens up all kinds of
possibilities with bloodraven and with maybe with her help and
or consent manipulating the succession.
Like one of our theories is that Aryan didn't just drink Wildfire
because he was drunk and crazy. Someone kind of like egged him
on to get him out of the way because he was set to be king
and no one wanted that think of anyone.
Gonna take care of that. It could be bloodraven or even
share. Sea Star like know, Aaron was
interested in Black Magic, as well, as a kind of an untapped
subplot that he was involved in Magic, but this guy involved in
Magic. Now this does not seem like a
match for someone like share or bloodraven to work with on
magical topics because he's he's a Joffrey you know like who can
get work with a guy like that. Like this isn't the careful
cautious approach. You need to work with magic.
This is a guy that drinks Wildfire when he's drunk.
I mean you can't can't work with that so you see why they would
want him? Abi Way, like if you really,
this is pretty tinfoil e, but it's within the realm of
possibility that they that they had a hand in murdering him or
tricking him into doing something that would get him
killed. It's much is like, Cersei
getting Robert drunk. Like, yeah, Robert did him to
himself but Cersei pushed it along, they enabled it.
They were like, what's this, create the scenario, where the,
where the best case for us could happen, eventually?
They keep getting him drunk hunting?
He's gonna die? Yeah.
May not happen.
Yeah, they were lucky that. It happened that particular
time. I mean, to serve the story kind
of Needed to but like maybe you share and bloodraven were
themselves. Curious, what happens if we
drink Dragonfire? Like, yeah, would it work?
We read this pellet. Let's get Aaron to do it.
I guess the wind like, yeah, we can 50.
If he kills himself then, thank goodness.
We don't kill ourselves and we're rid of him.
If it doesn't kill him, if it hatches a dragon world.
We're doing it next. Yeah, so I really there's super
wide open like, damn Damon the second have prophetic dreams.
So this is yet another On this era that had, you know, Dragon
dreams prophetic dreams, there's a lot of it in this era maybe
even more so than any other era might be because there's no
dragons and everybody's the dreamers are picking up on these
dream waves that are out there. They're the problem it's the
closer or the prophecy comes to fulfilling true the closer to
the point in the real timeline and it comes to happening the
more the dream start to happen because the event is closer in
proximity trying to explain the unexplainable, trying to make
but Logic on something that's kind of illogical but hey it's
fun to do that. Aries, considering areas and
dragons returning and Bloodlines.
You wonder if he had a thought to marry share to someone
because she has no proper Valyrian Heritage.
And that might they might need to ensure that that bloodline
propagates but obviously that wasn't enacted.
Aries didn't have her. Marry anyone's it's maybe a dead
end. A theory there in the year.
2019, the third blackfyre Rebellion happened.
This is the one. We know the least about George
clearly decided to hold off on fully, describing it in order to
write it at a later date. What we do?
No. Is that it was another defeat
for better steal. It was the closest probably that
they came to winning arguably. Maybe the first one, they were
even closer, but something super interesting here.
That relates to she era was that bittersteel and Hague on
Blackfire? Hang on, hang on was the number
one black fire. The time and better, she will
both capture someone killed Hague on in captivity.
We don't know who it was. It was it may have been Aryan.
It may have been bloodraven and bloodraven argued that they
execute bittersteel too. Aries said, no.
It's like, no, we're going to spare him and send him to the
wall. What did she era say?
She probably had a voice in this.
It may not have been a voice that anyone listen to, but I
kind of tend to think she had influence has given everybody
who cared about what she thought.
I'll men like trying to win her favor and bloodraven clearly
worked with her. I feel like areas would have at
least value her opinion on some things.
I don't suspect she pushed for his death but bloodraven,
certainly did. Did she even maybe she argued,
for Hague on to maybe that? Maybe she was involved in that
one way or another, she argued against killing him and someone
killed him anyway. And maybe that maybe this was
some part of something that put a wedge between her and
bloodraven. That she's like, look, I love
you both or I don't love either of you.
Maybe another, somebody open possibilities here that she was
turned off, by him wanting to execute his brother.
It's also possible that she's the mole.
He escaped captivity on the way to the wall which is like, whoa!
That is some escape artist of Harry Houdini business.
They're just escaping a ship on the way to the wall, someone
told there's other possibilities beside her but she would be in a
position to if anyone's gonna know.
Like when the ship is departing, what ship it is.
Yeah it's possible that it was her that she is there's like I
don't want my brother to go to the wall or she just It enjoys
the fight between her brother so much, like I'm gonna make sure
he escaped so they can do this all over again.
Yeah. Like it's possible.
She's that kind of evil, you know, that she enjoys been
fighting jet, a lot of it in her life.
Men fighting over her. She may have gotten cynical
about it, you know, like these idiots.
So, yeah. The next rain, after the third
blackfyre Rebellion would have been two years later when it
began. Make our started his reign in
the year to 21. And that would have been 12-year
rain and egg would have been elected King following the great
Council of 233. Was she there?
Was she part of the Great Council?
Was she one of the people pushing for someone or not
pushing for someone or arguing one side or another when she for
egg was she even alive then? Yeah, like what she decided to
go elsewhere, she went to court somewhere.
In Russia was an ambassador to some other city or maybe she
just left, she went to a shy. She's like you know, there's
lots of magic there, I can there's all sorts of things I
can do there. Maybe.
Yeah, maybe under make our things weren't so great.
Make ours a hardliner, kind of a jerk.
Maybe he didn't let her do things.
Yes, I mean make our changed his tune, he named bloodraven hand
after for a long time, being bitter.
That fluttering was named hand over him.
So something changed in his mind or he was willing to accept
bloodraven. Maybe he was just mad at his
brother and not. So mad at the guy that he's
chosen chosen to protect a replace him or take his spot
that he thought was going to be his lot of personnel, a lot of
personal feelings and beliefs that are untapped here, that can
really change the picture. But I'm very curious and if she
was there and what about during the Great Council, a nice black
fire. Remember what?
This is, what got bloodraven sent to the wall, right?
He's like, yes, a nice. Black fire.
Come come. Make your play at the great
Council. Give your speech.
Do your thing. One of my theories is that a
nice was surprisingly. Convincing and butter is like oh
crap. This guy is actually like a
really good speaker. He's making a good point, so I
gotta kill it as I may have pivoted to that plan to kill
him, but more likely he just planted Kill them all, long
invited him there as a trap and like, okay you dumbass, you came
here and I'm going to kill you now that got bloodraven sent to
the wall when egg took the crown.
He's like, no, you can't the Crown's word was sullied.
Here you'll you, you were you acting as the crown lied,
someone in the whole world saw it.
We can't have that our word has to be as good as gold as vulgar
as that may be, especially in his type of scenario, you know
what I mean, the whole realm it. Maybe it's one thing in the
middle of War. Or you're trying to figure out
where the divvy up the troops and until a commander that will
give them three ships. But then you don't because
someone else needed more but this is like relatively a time
of peace and a time of diplomacy, this is you know what
I mean? This is like a moment where
people need to be able to trust you, you know?
Yeah. So it's a bad precedent to set.
Its really interesting to consider.
She are here to cheer a know he was going to do that.
She know he was going to kill a nice black fire.
Like that was just like he may have confided in her, that was
his plan. Like if they Plus together if
they're still working close together at that point, she
might have known a lot of what he was going to do before he did
it because they talked through. It's a very unclear on how much
they operated in concert or whether he just did these things
on his own, or who knows. And she may have argued against
it you market for it. She made, but she may have been
able to tell him. Well, this is a bad idea, you
know? Like we could for you personally
politically like, this is gonna get you fired.
She may have seen that coming and he may have like nah or just
I got to do it or he's just hates the blackfyre.
So Much that he made a bad decision because he's so full of
hate. Either way their relationship.
If it still existed that point would certainly be over by then
because he's going to the wall, which another possible wrinkle
here is, maybe this is why he was so reckless, maybe she died
and he was bereft. Maybe she left him for good
like, no, I'm moving to Ash. I'll never see me again or maybe
never see me again. He was just, like, sad about
this. And, you know, took things too
far because he was in his things in this person, like we're going
bad, which brings us back to bearson's, quote About how major
decisions that affect the entire realm can come because one dude
feels jilted. One guy, the guy in charge his
wife left him or his child died and now he's decision-making is
suspect because he's just so personally wrecked and can't do
things properly anymore. I wonder if Blood Ravens rash
decision here was something to do with his personal life was
sheer total, Theory, nothing to suggest that directly, but I
think there's some Merit to the idea at least even if it is kind
of random. And because she's magical and
her death is uncertain and because her lover is still
alive, former lover, there are theories that she is to one pot.
One of the theories suggest she is quate her dream mask is made
of Starlight. The eyes don't match.
Those quite sighs. Aren't the color isn't describe
their called wet so you could so they're described like it's
someone has looked at these eyes and describe it they were
mismatched you really think that would we'd see that?
Another theory suggests, she's the mother of Melisandre.
The timeline is pretty tight on that possibility.
It does. It is possible that she would
the idea would be that she went to a shrine to learn and
practice more sorcery and then got enslaved while she was over
there and then her child Melisandre, who earliest
memories are being sold at auction for more on this idea.
Check out radio. Westeros is episode of
Melisandre. You know, just thinking about
that system at Melisandre. I'm just think about the
parallel of like Stannis be on in this track.
And in this Witchy Woman comes along and says, you need to go
to the wall. Hmm, wonder bloodraven was on
some certain track and share see stars, like, no, you need to go
to the wall, but that is a good idea.
What? Ever reason, whatever Vision
they had whatever attention or motivation.
I wonder if there's a parallel to be had there.
It's a good idea because people have wondered it along the lines
of when did bloodraven decided he needed to start working
towards. Saving the realm from the great
winter, that's coming. Rather than being handed the
king. When did they, when he
transition from one to the other and did he get sent to the
walls? And people think he got sent to
the wall on purpose? He's knew he would get sent to
the wall, right? As a little much for me, but he
knew exactly what the penalty would be.
But also you just voluntarily take the black.
You know, if you wanted to know if it's it might not be a
stretch that you know, of the penalty would be because he
might have proposed it ahead of time.
Oh okay might have said well what if I kill him?
Then I'll send him to the wall. Okay?
Okay, let's do that. What you gonna do Sam is of all,
he kind of like, set it up so that, that was the thing he
knew. Okay?
Yeah, okay. Yeah, I guess I could see that.
I think whatever the idea though connecting this to Shara
whatever point at, which these Visions came to her, this became
clear. I imagine they were Connected on
this like they talk about it or they discussed it previously or
assuming. She's still alive that she would
have been involved and maybe would have been aware at least
of what he was doing and maybe even the importance of it.
Which, which is part of why some people think she's still alive
because quaithe is trying to steer Danny, without ambition,
apparently towards saving the world, right?
So that is part of why it's connected here.
There's like, okay, well we've got bloodraven on One side
trying to save the world through brand.
Well, what about this other main player?
Like his right? And you still got the golden
company involved in between these plot lines.
So the great bastards are still having their huge impact on
Westeros even now, it's pretty cool.
And when Brandis covers bloodraven in the cave Beyond
the Wall, he mentions bloodraven does a girl.
He desired. He pauses he's like a girl.
I a woman I desire. He's indicating maybe that he
never loved her or maybe that's just bitterness maybe because
she Reciprocate as much as he wanted to.
He just tells himself that. No, just because his brother's
name is better, doesn't mean he can't be better to, maybe he
doesn't want to Cloud Brands Judgment of things.
Okay, just saying that. Now, 10 years from now, brand
might think I never got the chance to love anyone, you know?
Like, it's hard to know what effects that might have as a
mentor to a young boy. A good point because bloodraven
from a from a rational perspective like this, kid's got
to get to saving the world now. Now he doesn't have time to be a
kid as I'm time for love and all this other stuff.
So yeah, maybe he's trying to just Poison the Well of love
because the see just that he doesn't have that luxury.
It's pretty sad but kind of understand.
Hmm. From Kirsty Angel.
Her eyes remind me of Alyssa Targaryen.
That's a good point. Melissa Targaryen did have a
green and blue eye. That's a great point.
I'm some kind of surprise. I missed that and what doesn't
tear? You have a green Diner.
Blue green. And a black man.
Black man. Yeah close.
But not quite Some people wonder if that black eye is is like
dark purple because that, that would be, because of a giveaway
of a Heritage. That may not be his Soaker
changes. Her eyes remind me of listen,
Targaryen share a sea, star sounds like shahrazad in 1001
Nights links to bloodraven 2001. I do ya see.
She cursed, he pointed something shahrazad out in a couple
episodes ago and here we are. Again, that's so cool.
It keeps coming back up and George of course, is aware of
that story. George is such an Avid Reader.
He's aware of all these things. Maybe that was sunk into his -
yeah, thousand eyes and one 1001 Arabian Nights.
Yeah. That is that's just
scheherazade. She heresy stars like some
parallel to the word. It's you know the pronunciation.
Whatever. That's cool.
I like it. And she's also wondering if old
man at Winterfell is may be related to the Starks through
their bad mother based on the story telling ya.
It's you know we have old man's a really wonderful mystery.
I don't think she's related to the Starks because we're told
Told that she came or she says she came to Winterfell for a
young Brandon, it will be a wedding that doesn't sound like
she was a stark. You don't, you know, she wasn't
part of Winterfell and she was brought in as a wet nurse
doesn't really sound like saying a stark with you.
That's like that's the duty of someone of a lower station, you
know, the way they handle things but you never know what, what an
old man's heritage's. She could have some Stark blood
in her from way back. Who knows?
Who knows. Okay.
Trivia answer the question was, which men have bathed in blood
in the series share C. Star guest, Sam.
That's correct. Sam did bathe in blood.
His father, forced him to bathe and Bulls blood to make him lose
his cowardice. He didn't like it so much.
It made him throw up shocking. I would probably make me throw
up too. That's pretty nasty.
Animal lover, Nicole guess, truce.
I don't think Bruce is bathed in blood.
He's had the leeches on him. And he talks about bad blood.
I don't think he's bathed in it. Maybe he has, I could be wrong.
I didn't find that in my searching.
Scott W said, Khal Drogo, which is correct.
That's the other one he did bathe in blood.
His stallion Zone. Stallions blood was put into the
bath with him and I was part of the ritual with Miriam as door.
Yes. People.
You did well on the guess is they're proud of Sheriff's
Easter. Yeah, she sure.
Got one of them that's your stuff.
I appreciate that. Sam and called Drogo.
Have in common bathing in blood. Drogo didn't need the basket.
Current for courage, you have had sex, maester drug Do you
imagine them reversed like Sam Hollis are like letting the
where's Drogo at the pouring over an old book, like reading
some book that is the tallest Meister I've ever seen.
Yeah, do not mess with that. Master Cheese, he's like ripping
other. He's like that guy's where he
just rips the chain right off? You know and hold.
Someone's head off with it. Do we have any examples?
Do we specifically know that Khal?
Drogo has killed someone with one blow.
Whoa. Yeah, because Sam is told
someone with one below so that would be another parallel to the
show he did. But I don't think we see it.
Maybe we don't know that we see him kill anyone on TV in the
books. He just slap do another didn't
he write did Drogo ever kill anyone with a single book?
Yeah, I don't. I mean, he surely did, we don't
see it, you know, we actually never see him fight at all
books. Just show he kills that uppity
covid. Yeah.
So next week, Blackfriars and mandalorians some episodes.
We mentioned, if you want to stay immersed, the entire black
Fire series, aegon the Unworthy and daeron the good bittersteel
Daemon blackfyre. Lots of blood.
We have multiple bloodraven episodes are all very relevant.
Here comes up here and there and knows, she's not directly
involved in the war effort. Oh, so some more than others.
Radio Westeros is episode of Melisandre.
As I just mentioned a few minutes ago is a good example as
well and other things from this era.
Some of the things that happened before, like the Dare on the
first or baelor, the Blessed lots of things we've got, you
look at our back catalogue and you will probably find something
that tickles your fancy to further your Westeros immersion.
Thanks to everyone who came and hung out in the live chat.
We appreciate your presence. It adds a lot to our discussions
y'all's takes off, and make their way into our episodes.
So do your votes on Sean's drinking of sea, salts and soy.
And when pickle juice crazy, I see the smoke in there.
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Now it's fun. We like to we like to highlight
our sense of humor. Yes, we do.
Yeah. And if you haven't been watching
our little shorts is watch us live.
I hope you at least checked out. We did a little Shake talk and
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Not on Instagram though. It's right.
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abusive. Incestuous family, rescued one
rescue them. And put them into another one
but wasn't incest. You still.
That's again parallel, you're not wrong.
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You just had a birthday. He did, happy birthday been
here. You know who else had a book
birthday recently was Roy. Dotrice would have been 100 if
we're he's still with us. So that's the only a few weeks
ago. He would have turned 100.
So I know not everyone, loves his rendition, I do.
I'm a Roy Stan. I think he he is an important
part of having Song of Ice and Fire to a lot of people and I
should acknowledge his contributions, just depend the
fact that it's really impressive thing to do, all these voices,
even if I love shouldn't have been doing all those voices
cousin, a seven year old man, doing a young girls voices, but
not really think you should be asking someone to do, even if
I'm not a fan of him as voices. I am a fan of him is wisdom.
Helene and Game of Thrones. I thought he was great in the
show as well. He was originally, I think most
of, you know, this already perhaps but he was originally
going to be maester pycelle instead of Julian Glover, but he
was ill. He got ill.
So, Julian Glover came in to replace a man, which is fine.
Julian Glover did a fantastic job and Julian Glover, that way
was able to be both A Game of Thrones and Star Wars and Empire
Strikes Back. I mean, and our anniversary.
I meant Star Wars it technically it wasn't perfect back that he
was in, but I meant to say Indiana Jones.
He was in that also. So, that's an interesting
Trifecta. Probably some other big names to
plus, he has a Game of Thrones theme, music lover.
Yay, yeah. All right folks, we will see you
next week for mandalorians and black fires and Sneak preview in
two weeks. We'll be doing an episode on
high guard. Yeah.
Patrons voted on that one. Steve ahead in our schedule.
There is that alright know that yet?
Actually, yeah. Surprise for me.
Technically, the pole doesn't end till tomorrow, but it would
be crazy for highgarden to boost poll.
We're gonna see like, a bunch of like, sunspear Martel fans come
in. We like it's real.
Yeah, it's better. If they knew that they were.
Yeah, sunspear them second place.
So, you know, you could actually fans come on.
There's no such thing as it was highgarden, but Yuri Pike and
that's something else that lost. It was more saying that they
would come in and just vote for something else.
Oh yeah, just to just to knock highgarden.
Yeah, you're right cool. All right folks, you know what
to do until next time Valar reread us.