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Our subject again today is Lomas
Longstrider, who explored 

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farther and wider than any other
explorer we know of. 

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A scribe, not a Lord. 
Which makes his endeavour more 

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impressive because he had less 
wealth and protection and 

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probably less education, though 
maybe not that it made his 

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record better. 
That's the important thing. 

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No lordly explorer is going to 
outscribe a scribe unless they, 

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you know, hire some scribes to 
help them along with that. 

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But as far as we know, that's 
never happened. 

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Only Lomas has done that, and at
least as far as information 

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we've been given. 
And of course, his two books, 

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Wonders and Wonders Made by Man,
are very important books within 

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the setting. 
Tyrion owned them both, as we 

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told you. 
He read them over and over until

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they fell apart. 
I'm glad to know that podcasts 

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don't fall apart when you listen
to them over and over. 

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In this episode we will cover, 
Of course Wonders, the first of 

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the two books, and we will need 
a lot of imagination. 

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We needed a lot of imagination 
for the last one, but I think we

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need even more today. 
Definitely more guesswork 

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because we know less about the 
wonders he chose than the man 

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made ones. 
We had a lot more information on

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the Man Made Ones, but we have 
no shortage of candidates from 

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all over the known world, and 
we'll be describing what we know

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about these places, kind of 
comparing and contrasting within

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the setting as well to the real 
world. 

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We've got lots of examples of 
real world wonders that are 

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wonderful companions or 
parallels to some of these, and 

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we'll do our best to picture 
them the sights as Lomas saw 

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them while describing what we 
know of the candidates we've 

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chosen, many of which you have 
no doubt imagined prior to 

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today. 
But we'll go as deep as we've 

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ever gone on a lot of these 
places. 

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All that and more on this 
episode of History of Westeros 

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podcast. 
Hello and welcome, everybody. 

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It's another episode of our show
History of Westeros podcast Back

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Again. 
We're usually live on Sundays. 

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That's 3:00 Eastern. 
That time schedule does change 

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during TV season, but if we're 
not during ATV season, that's 

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when we're streaming. 
Every video can be found on 

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YouTube in unedited format. 
Of course have some edited 

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videos too, but every live 
stream is an unedited format on 

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YouTube and an edited format on 
Spotify. 

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00:03:05,480 --> 00:03:08,200
And of course anywhere you 
listen to podcast, you can find 

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the edited version in non visual
format, audio only. 

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Meaning this episode does 
contain a lot of images though, 

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a lot of visuals. 
Now, you don't need those to 

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enjoy it. 
They're useful sometimes, 

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stunning or epic or whatever, 
but they're not required. 

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You know, you can use your 
imagination. 

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That's that's totally fine. 
Sometimes underwhelming, as in 

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the one image I surfaced and she
was like, I don't care about 

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this image. 
Yeah, she got one from the 

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mother of mountains from the TV 
show and it just looks kind of 

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like a grassy hill. 
I'm like, that doesn't even look

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like a mountain. 
We're we're trying to pump these

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up, not make them look weak. 
So yeah, I was like, let's cut 

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that, cut that, cut that, cut 
that. 

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So anyway, but yeah, if you are 
listening and aren't usually 

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someone who watches, this is the
time to remind you that if 

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you're listening on Spotify, you
can click the video player and 

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the video will come on and then 
you can turn it right back off. 

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You know, it's like a toggle. 
So if you if you want to see 

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what we're talking about just 
for those few minutes, you flip 

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it back on and then flip it back
off if you don't want. 

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So it's it's a really useful 
feature to have if you have a if

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you prefer to listen, but every 
once in a while you want to take

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a look because we've got 
something on screen that's 

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useful, you know, that you 
really want to see anyway, your 

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choice. 
But we want to throw that out 

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there because it does add to the
experience a little bit if you 

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have those images. 
Sean, how's it going today? 

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So you've got a Star Trek shirt 
on. 

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I've got a Me First and the 
Gimme, Gimme shirt. 

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Shay and I saw them this last 
week. 

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I also went to Shake and Ease 
Festival and saw a whole bunch 

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of bands. 
It was crazy seeing a lot of my 

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favorite bands all in a short 
period of time. 

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I saw Queens of the Stone Age, 
Weezer, The Offspring, and Royal

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Blood in a span of 4 1/2 hours. 
Crazy. 

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You know, I also went to a music
festival this last weekend and 

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saw Primus Slipknot System of a 
Down, Alice In Chains in the 

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span of four. 
Hours. 

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That is so awesome. 
That is a heavier set than I 

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saw. 
But you know, I would have. 

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I love all those bands. 
Also, I'm wearing this Star Trek

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shirt in honor of Lomas, who was
trying to go where no one had 

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gone before. 
Good point exploration. 

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It's a nice follow up because we
were episodes being recorded on 

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May 5th. 
The day after May the fourth be 

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with you. 
So you go Star Wars yesterday to

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Star Trek today. 
Yeah, very good, very good. 

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Right on. 
So let's see here. 

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A good shout out to our friend 
Nina, Good Queen 

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allie.tumblr.com. 
Lots of great notes from her 

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today. 
We had a lot of fun discussing 

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some of these things and helping
each other discover some 

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peculiar facts about the real 
world, as well as what's going 

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on in Westeros and Essos and 
beyond. 

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Check her out good Queen 
allie.tumblr.com. 

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The latest blog post she has 
over there is about game and 

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pale hair, whether he was really
Aegon the Second's bastard, or 

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at least that Aegon the Third 
genuinely believed he was, which

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those are. 
Those can both be true. 

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He could not be one, but the 
King could have genuinely 

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thought he was. 
So it's a good question because 

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egg on the third was lonely and 
believing he had some kin seems 

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to have been part of that whole 
mix. 

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That whole scenario there. 
If you have questions for us, 

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you can post them live during in
the comments and Shay will 

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select certain questions during 
the episode will will get 

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answered live. 
And if you have questions 

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outside of that, send them to 
westeroshistory@gmail.com and 

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often we'll include them in an 
episode if it's pertinent to 

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that particular episode. 
At the end of this one, of 

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course, as usual, I will list 
off several episodes we've done 

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in the past that relate to this 
one, and it's a pretty good size

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list because we're talking about
a lot of different places and 

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and different characters and it 
comes up a lot. 

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Also, at the end of the episode 
will be the answer to this 

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trivia question, which is a 
three parter related. 

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What are the names of the three 
roads that pass through the Bone

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Mountains? 
The answer will be in this 

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episode. 
If you're paying attention, 

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you'll hear me say it, but you 
might already know the answer. 

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Let's start with the same brief 
intro quote we used last time. 

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It's so perfect, so fitting. 
Let's do it again. 

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Lomas long strider ass duck. 
A scribe long dead, said Halden.

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He spent his life travelling the
world and writing about the 

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lands he visited in two books he
called Wonders and Wonders Made 

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by Man. 
An uncle of mine gave them to me

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when I was just a boy, Tyrion 
said. 

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I read them until they fell to 
pieces. 

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The gods made seven wonders and 
mortal man made nine quoted the 

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half maester rather impious of 
mortal man to do the gods to 

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better, but there you are. 
So we don't have his lists, but 

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we can narrow it down. 
As I said, just like we did last

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time, we have more, we have more
of a list to narrow down because

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we have more guessing to do. 
But to build on what we said 

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last time, what Howden said and 
what Nina says, which is that we

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talked about the number of seven
being kind of important because 

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of the seven as of you know, 
worship. 

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Now we of course do 7 wonders in
the real world too, and there's 

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nothing necessarily religious 
about that. 

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So we can't be sure that's what 
he was doing. 

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But it's a strong theory. 
I like the idea, and it kind of 

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makes sense to me that he was 
willing to increase the number 

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of wonders made by man, because 
those are made by man. 

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But he wouldn't touch this. 
The wonders made by that's 

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seven. 
It's got to be 7. 

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We're not increasing that one. 
So I kind of like thinking about

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it that way. 
It's kind of a fun, fun way to 

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view it. 
I wonder if it's just a literary

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thing, like 7's the only number 
with two syllables, so 7 Wonders

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rolls out the tongue better, but
when you add made by man, then 

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you don't need the two syllables
from the number anymore. 

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So that's a great point, and 
it's similar to something I said

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a a while back about the number 
17 and why it comes up so often 

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in music. 
Because it's the only teen 

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number with three syllables, 
1819134. 

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There's all two syllables. 17 is
the only one that has another 

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syllable. 
So it comes up more in 

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songwriting because it gives you
another option that none of the 

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other numbers would do. 
And you just you just touched on

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that same thing here with the 
syllables. 

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That's, there you go. 
Very good. 

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I like that. 
Now if if this is the reason, 

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like religion, the worship of 
the Seven is part of why or the 

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entire reason why Lomas did it 
this way, then that's another 

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place we can kind of very safely
assume he went to, which is 

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00:09:03,080 --> 00:09:05,240
Andalos. 
Like he would go to the home of 

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00:09:05,480 --> 00:09:08,200
the Andal's, the fount where the
Seven were supposedly born. 

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00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:11,760
That said there isn't 
necessarily much in that region 

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00:09:11,760 --> 00:09:15,640
that's wondrous except for the 
Titan which is you know newer 

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00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:19,680
and was made by the Bravosi not 
by Andal so so we again to recap

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9 man made wonders, 2 unlisted 
we know seven and of the seven 

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made by the gods in our nature 
we only know one. 

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And I'm going to use those terms
interchangeably throughout the 

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episode. 
It's it's just called wonders in

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Lomas book. 
But we're nature the gods that's

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does the same thing in in for 
purposes of our discussion the 

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00:09:41,120 --> 00:09:44,160
Westerosi and SoC would see it 
as the work of gods. 

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00:09:44,400 --> 00:09:48,880
We see it as the work of George 
R Martin right. 

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So it's not quite the same, but 
you know, he's kind of God like 

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to us, right? 
The people of Westeros might not

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00:09:55,920 --> 00:09:57,600
realize it, but he's kind of God
like to them. 

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00:09:57,760 --> 00:09:59,720
That's very true. 
He is their ultimate God. 

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00:09:59,720 --> 00:10:03,560
There is only one God of it 
should be Monothea if they know 

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00:10:03,560 --> 00:10:06,680
the truth. 
So there's lots of comparisons 

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00:10:06,680 --> 00:10:09,520
to Mad Men wonders. 
Like I said in the intro, but 

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00:10:10,040 --> 00:10:13,240
it's a little tricky because the
real world doesn't get 

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00:10:13,240 --> 00:10:16,400
categorized in the same way. 
Like the ancient world didn't 

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00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:19,840
have natural wonders, it had man
made wonders only like they 

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00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:21,520
existed. 
There was wondrous things, but 

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00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:24,120
no one made a list of the 
ancient wonders of the world 

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00:10:24,120 --> 00:10:27,720
that were made by gods. 
Everything was wondrous back 

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00:10:27,720 --> 00:10:31,160
then. 
It was like, whoa, it was the 

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00:10:31,160 --> 00:10:35,640
end of the world. 
So yeah, so it's when nature 

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00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:38,720
makes something, it's it's a 
little harder to be impressed as

200
00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:41,240
compared to humankind making 
something like when humankind 

201
00:10:41,240 --> 00:10:44,840
makes 1000 foot statue or you're
like whoa, people did that like 

202
00:10:44,880 --> 00:10:47,680
that seems really hard. 
But like what's difficult for 

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00:10:47,680 --> 00:10:49,080
nature? 
It's not even like a matter of 

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00:10:49,080 --> 00:10:51,400
difficulty. 
It's just unlikely or just 

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00:10:51,400 --> 00:10:53,760
coincidental or. 
Or time passing. 

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00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:55,080
Yes, time. 
Like, you're right. 

207
00:10:55,080 --> 00:10:58,040
If humans made 1000 foot statue 
but it took them a million 

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00:10:58,040 --> 00:10:59,360
years, you wouldn't be as 
impressed. 

209
00:10:59,360 --> 00:11:00,280
That's true. 
That's true. 

210
00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:02,080
You went seven years like holy 
crap. 

211
00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:04,080
How'd you do that? 
I said it was still standing 

212
00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:06,240
after a million years, but 
that's different. 

213
00:11:06,440 --> 00:11:08,200
Still, your point? 
Is Stillwell taken? 

214
00:11:08,520 --> 00:11:11,360
Yeah, so there's There's 
probably less association with 

215
00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:15,520
these locations, too, because 
Tyrion is the closest thing we 

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00:11:15,520 --> 00:11:18,000
have to a modern Lomas and one 
of the few who's read him. 

217
00:11:18,320 --> 00:11:22,560
But he's mostly in his travels. 
Visiting the man made wonders, 

218
00:11:22,560 --> 00:11:23,920
we think. 
I mean, that's. 

219
00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:28,280
I say that not knowing what all 
the natural wonders are, but I I

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00:11:28,280 --> 00:11:29,560
kind of just looking at his 
chapters. 

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00:11:29,560 --> 00:11:32,040
It seems unlikely that that a 
lot of these qualify, but some 

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00:11:32,040 --> 00:11:34,000
of them do for like the for 
example the Royne. 

223
00:11:34,120 --> 00:11:38,280
To help us out here too we've 
enlisted a a a long time fandom 

224
00:11:38,280 --> 00:11:43,080
friend, Adam Whitehead. 
He is in the books as a 

225
00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:46,120
character named Sir Whitehead. 
Sir Adam Whitehead, He's in 

226
00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:48,440
there. 
His nickname is Wurthead and 

227
00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:51,040
he's a Blogger in the UK. 
We've met him and did a panel 

228
00:11:51,040 --> 00:11:56,520
with him when we were in Ireland
and he runs the Atlas of Ice and

229
00:11:56,520 --> 00:11:59,040
Fire blogs. 
He's particularly dedicated to 

230
00:11:59,040 --> 00:12:01,640
covering geography. 
It covers lots of things, but 

231
00:12:01,640 --> 00:12:04,280
this is one of his focuses, his 
foci, foci. 

232
00:12:04,680 --> 00:12:08,240
And so he's taken on some of 
these inherent difficulties and 

233
00:12:08,240 --> 00:12:09,680
wonders. 
And he's done a really good job 

234
00:12:09,680 --> 00:12:13,000
in terms of extrapolating 
distance and size based on 

235
00:12:13,000 --> 00:12:14,920
measurements we've gotten from 
within the books. 

236
00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:18,480
So we're going to cite him quite
a bit today, and I want to let 

237
00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:19,800
you all know where you can find 
him. 

238
00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:22,720
I'll repeat this at the end, but
it's Atlas of Ice and Fire. 

239
00:12:22,720 --> 00:12:26,280
blog.wordpress.com. 
Adam Whitehead. 

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00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:29,440
We're a Patreon supporter of him
and if you haven't visited his 

241
00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:32,680
site before you might decide to 
sign up after checking it out. 

242
00:12:32,680 --> 00:12:35,360
A lot of good stuff on there. 
He also weighed in on the Man 

243
00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:38,640
Made Wonders, but we we had 
three hours of coverage without 

244
00:12:38,640 --> 00:12:41,880
anybody's help there, so we're 
going to use him this episode. 

245
00:12:41,880 --> 00:12:45,880
Not as much last time, but yeah,
so let's let's get back to where

246
00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:48,920
he travelled to and help. 
That helps us narrow down the 

247
00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:52,640
scope of the regions will 
include for where these wonders 

248
00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:56,840
might exist the farther E the 
stories emerge. 

249
00:12:56,840 --> 00:12:59,800
Like the the things we hear 
about the East, they sound more 

250
00:12:59,800 --> 00:13:02,320
and more wondrous and legendary.
Which gives us some reason to 

251
00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:05,320
doubt that they're they're 
probably exaggerated, just like 

252
00:13:05,640 --> 00:13:08,840
the stories of Essos or the 
stories of Westeros told in the 

253
00:13:08,840 --> 00:13:11,800
East are exaggerated And those 
we can corroborate Like when 

254
00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:14,320
people say, oh, this casterly 
rock is made of gold, we're 

255
00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:17,280
like, well, OK, that's clearly 
not we know that's not true. 

256
00:13:17,400 --> 00:13:21,960
So what's the reverse? 
They say something like stories 

257
00:13:21,960 --> 00:13:24,320
about Ashai or things like that,
like that might be a little 

258
00:13:24,320 --> 00:13:27,120
exaggerated given that the 
stories of Castley Rock over 

259
00:13:27,120 --> 00:13:30,360
there are exaggerated. 
So yeah, it goes both ways. 

260
00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:33,960
Literally goes both ways east to
West and north to South, I 

261
00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:37,440
guess, but less of that because 
to the South it's there's a lot 

262
00:13:37,440 --> 00:13:41,520
less people down there. 
But here we also get a direct 

263
00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:44,480
contradiction in the world of 
Ice and Fire that kind of adds 

264
00:13:44,480 --> 00:13:47,280
to the mystery and and throws us
off off a little bit. 

265
00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:50,840
And here's a quote that both 
establishes that vibe and sets 

266
00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:52,760
up this contradiction, that 
we'll show it to you. 

267
00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:57,280
Is there any truth to these grim
fables, brought back from the 

268
00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:00,800
end of the earth by singers and 
sailors and dabblers and 

269
00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:02,720
sorcery? 
Who can say? 

270
00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:06,440
Lomas LON Strider never saw shy 
by the shadow. 

271
00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:10,240
Even the sea snake never sailed 
so far. 

272
00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:15,400
Those who did have not returned 
to tell us their tales. 

273
00:14:15,560 --> 00:14:20,120
That's clearly an error because 
not only do we have a different 

274
00:14:20,120 --> 00:14:23,080
quote that tells us the sea 
snake was in Ashai, but we have 

275
00:14:23,080 --> 00:14:25,000
a different quote that tells us 
that Lomas was in Ashai. 

276
00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:27,560
So there's two errors in there. 
So rather than the other two 

277
00:14:27,840 --> 00:14:30,800
separate instances being a 
mistake, it's probably this 

278
00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:32,960
instance of one paragraph with 
two mistakes. 

279
00:14:32,960 --> 00:14:35,920
Now it might be an intentional 
mistake, meaning that George or 

280
00:14:36,040 --> 00:14:38,320
Elio and Linda put that in there
to to intentionally have 

281
00:14:38,320 --> 00:14:41,080
contradictions in their source 
because that would be somewhat 

282
00:14:41,080 --> 00:14:44,000
realistic, but I don't know if 
that's the case or not. 

283
00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:48,040
So for example, the Sea Snake 
one comes from, which we covered

284
00:14:48,040 --> 00:14:51,200
in the Sea Snake episode, and in
the Sun Chaser episode he 

285
00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:53,120
mentioned seeing a ship that 
looked like the Sun Chaser 

286
00:14:53,120 --> 00:14:56,000
there, so he clearly was there 
if he's if he saw a ship in the 

287
00:14:56,000 --> 00:14:57,200
harbor that looked familiar to 
him. 

288
00:14:57,320 --> 00:15:01,400
Anyway, here is the conflicting 
Lomas Longstrider quote 

289
00:15:01,400 --> 00:15:04,840
regarding Ashai. 
Lomas Longstrider reports that 

290
00:15:04,920 --> 00:15:09,840
even in Far Ashai by the Shadow,
there were merchants who asked 

291
00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:15,200
him if it was true that the lion
Lord lived in a palace of solid 

292
00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:20,720
gold and that crofters collected
a wealth of gold simply by 

293
00:15:20,720 --> 00:15:23,000
plowing their fields. 
Right. 

294
00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:25,280
That's just ridiculous. 
We know how we know that's not 

295
00:15:25,280 --> 00:15:26,880
true. 
We've seen Castle. 

296
00:15:26,880 --> 00:15:28,200
Well, we haven't seen inside 
Castle, right? 

297
00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:31,360
We've heard a lot about it. 
We've never heard anything about

298
00:15:31,760 --> 00:15:35,560
gold just in the fields. 
Maybe an occasional nugget turns

299
00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:38,680
up there, but I seriously doubt 
that's a a regular occurrence. 

300
00:15:38,840 --> 00:15:40,720
And it's definitely not a palace
of solid gold. 

301
00:15:41,680 --> 00:15:44,920
So you can see why it's 
difficult to piece some of the 

302
00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:46,640
things together when we're 
getting stories like this that 

303
00:15:46,640 --> 00:15:49,560
are clearly false, demonstrably 
and verifiably false. 

304
00:15:50,520 --> 00:15:56,360
Here is another quote that's 
awesome, but full of speculation

305
00:15:56,360 --> 00:15:59,840
and perhaps half truth, but 
maybe seeds of truth, which 

306
00:15:59,840 --> 00:16:00,960
makes them all the more 
interesting. 

307
00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:05,840
Of the lands that lie beyond the
five forts, we know even less. 

308
00:16:06,120 --> 00:16:10,040
Legends and lies and travellers 
tales are all that ever reach 

309
00:16:10,040 --> 00:16:12,640
us. 
Of these far places we hear. 

310
00:16:12,640 --> 00:16:16,480
Of cities where the men soar 
like Eagles on leathered wings, 

311
00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:21,560
of towns made of bones, of a 
race of bloodless men who dwell 

312
00:16:21,560 --> 00:16:25,640
between the deep valley called 
the Dry Deep and the mountains. 

313
00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:30,040
Whispers reach us of the Gray 
waste and its cannibal sands. 

314
00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:33,920
And of the trikes who live 
there, half human creatures with

315
00:16:33,920 --> 00:16:37,040
green scaled skin and venomous 
bites. 

316
00:16:37,680 --> 00:16:43,320
Are these truly lizard men, or 
more likely, men clad in the 

317
00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:48,000
skins of lizards? 
Or are they no more than fables?

318
00:16:48,280 --> 00:16:52,120
The grumpkins and snarks of the 
eastern deserts and even the 

319
00:16:52,120 --> 00:16:56,560
Shrikes, supposedly live in 
terror of Cadath in the Gray 

320
00:16:56,560 --> 00:17:01,440
Waste, a city said to be older 
than time, where unspeakable 

321
00:17:01,440 --> 00:17:05,599
rites are performed to slake the
hunger of mad gods. 

322
00:17:05,839 --> 00:17:12,400
Does such a city truly exist? 
If so, what is its nature on 

323
00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:15,680
such matters? 
Even Lomas Longstrider is 

324
00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:18,760
silent. 
Perhaps the priests of Ye TI 

325
00:17:18,760 --> 00:17:24,280
know, But if so, these are not 
truths they care to share with 

326
00:17:24,280 --> 00:17:27,000
us. 
That line that even Lomas 

327
00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:30,280
Longtreder is silent on what's 
beyond the five forts pretty 

328
00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:32,320
much indicates he hasn't been 
there, because this is someone 

329
00:17:32,320 --> 00:17:35,800
who's read his books. 
And it's not like we can 

330
00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:38,720
speculate that Lomas went to 
Valyria because maybe it's just 

331
00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:42,160
not told to us. 
But this pretty much says he 

332
00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:43,920
didn't speak on them. 
We don't know if he spoke. 

333
00:17:43,920 --> 00:17:46,320
There's no, there's no like 
Lomas Lungdrider never spoke on 

334
00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:47,480
Valyria. 
We just don't know. 

335
00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:49,800
It might just have been omitted 
for authorial reasons. 

336
00:17:49,800 --> 00:17:51,400
This is pretty definitive, I 
think. 

337
00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:54,440
Don't you agree, Sean? 
Except that it's possible a book

338
00:17:54,440 --> 00:17:56,840
was lost or destroyed or 
incomplete or something like 

339
00:17:56,840 --> 00:17:58,920
that. 
OK, a third book that no one 

340
00:17:58,920 --> 00:18:00,600
ever knows about. 
Like it probably wouldn't have 

341
00:18:00,600 --> 00:18:02,320
been the first book or maybe it 
would have been referenced in 

342
00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:04,960
the 1st 2:00. 
But if he wrote a third incident

343
00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:07,400
or a follow up, yeah, that could
have been lost to histories. 

344
00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:09,120
That's definitely, that is 
definitely a real thing that's 

345
00:18:09,120 --> 00:18:11,040
happened. 
And maybe could still be 

346
00:18:11,040 --> 00:18:12,480
discovered, right? 
Like, maybe. 

347
00:18:13,080 --> 00:18:17,640
Fun to think, unlikely, but Sam 
pulls it up from the the library

348
00:18:17,640 --> 00:18:20,560
somewhere you know. 
Can I say I don't know about 

349
00:18:20,560 --> 00:18:24,400
you, but when they describe 
Cadath and the Gray Waste with 

350
00:18:24,400 --> 00:18:28,200
the Unspeakable Rites performed 
to slake the hunger of bad gods,

351
00:18:28,600 --> 00:18:30,360
it makes me think of weirwood 
trees. 

352
00:18:31,160 --> 00:18:32,120
Oh, OK. 
Yeah. 

353
00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:35,120
Comparing I'm trying to compare 
things from the 5 fourths region

354
00:18:35,120 --> 00:18:39,120
to the wall region and frankly 
that is what they do for the 

355
00:18:39,120 --> 00:18:39,960
weirwood. 
Trees. 

356
00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:43,240
They do sacrifice people to the 
trees and do like put hang their

357
00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:46,600
entrails in the branches. 
Or they did and maybe still do 

358
00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:48,640
in some distant corners of the 
north. 

359
00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:52,680
But you're right that's that's 
totally like that's unspeakable.

360
00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:56,320
I mean, we just spoke it, but I.
Mean if you were describing what

361
00:18:56,320 --> 00:18:59,440
happened around the weirwoods 
and around the wall to someone 

362
00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:03,640
on that part of the world, it 
would sound just as wild and 

363
00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:05,760
crazy and people go live in the 
tree like it. 

364
00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:09,160
It would sound just as as as 
exotic. 

365
00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:11,120
You're totally right. 
And like these stories about 

366
00:19:11,120 --> 00:19:13,240
lizard men and and people 
wearing skins. 

367
00:19:13,240 --> 00:19:16,720
Like what do people's what? 
What is an old Nan Tell Bran and

368
00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:18,720
the other kids about the free 
folk. 

369
00:19:18,720 --> 00:19:22,440
Like the her stories are away 
exaggerated from there and she 

370
00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:25,080
lives in the North like she's 
not even from the you know some 

371
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:26,080
other continent. 
Yeah. 

372
00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:27,760
The others though like what 
would people say about the 

373
00:19:27,760 --> 00:19:30,640
others like that what what tales
of the others would exist in the

374
00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:32,000
east. 
They would probably sound sort 

375
00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:36,520
of like some of this stuff like 
Cadath or the Gray Waste 

376
00:19:36,520 --> 00:19:38,960
compared to the the Frozen Waste
or the the lands of always 

377
00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:40,160
Winter. 
Yeah, you're absolutely right. 

378
00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:42,280
Shay. 
Like, are they wearing skins of 

379
00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:44,560
lizards, or are they Are they 
actually lizard men? 

380
00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:46,400
Or are they wearing skins of 
lions? 

381
00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:49,360
Or are they actually lion man or
bear bear men or whatever the 

382
00:19:49,800 --> 00:19:52,280
wildlings are wearing? 
Or are they actually undead? 

383
00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:55,640
Soaring like Eagle Eagles with 
leathern wings too. 

384
00:19:55,640 --> 00:19:58,840
I wonder if that is like you 
said, maybe it's some criminal 

385
00:19:58,840 --> 00:20:01,200
of truth to that. 
Like maybe there is some place 

386
00:20:02,200 --> 00:20:04,000
where they dive off cliffs, 
right? 

387
00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:07,720
Like and and over time someone 
realized like, hey, you can 

388
00:20:07,880 --> 00:20:11,440
catch a little air. 
With this device or whatever and

389
00:20:11,440 --> 00:20:12,920
in. 
That glider ritual. 

390
00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:16,320
They have these some sort of 
Cape or kite or something that 

391
00:20:16,320 --> 00:20:18,760
they dive off cliffs and they 
can kind of soar. 

392
00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:21,640
And so in seeing that and going 
back and tell the tales and in 

393
00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:25,080
flash forward 200 years now they
have wings, you know. 

394
00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:28,800
Yep, that fits really well. 
And it's it's, it's expressed 

395
00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:30,680
here too. 
Like, yeah, do they really soar 

396
00:20:30,680 --> 00:20:32,080
on Eagles or is this some sort 
of story? 

397
00:20:32,280 --> 00:20:33,800
Yeah, it is probably some sort 
of story. 

398
00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:37,080
Now Cadas adds to the vibe here,
because if that is straight from

399
00:20:37,080 --> 00:20:40,480
Lovecraft and anything straight 
from Lovecraft is going to be 

400
00:20:40,480 --> 00:20:45,040
creepy and mysterious and old. 
He loves doing old old and this 

401
00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:49,680
is and he loves mad gods and 
hungry mad gods and gods who are

402
00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:52,360
aren't neutral. 
I love one of Lovecraft's things

403
00:20:52,360 --> 00:20:53,880
was yeah, no, the universe isn't
neutral. 

404
00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:59,760
It's out to get you. 
So that that seems to be the 

405
00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:02,880
vibe in this place too. 
So we're going to bring all this

406
00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:06,400
up only to discard it because it
doesn't sound like Lomas went 

407
00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:08,320
there. 
It's entirely possible that The 

408
00:21:08,320 --> 00:21:11,280
Gray Waste, the Dry Deep, the 
Cannibal Sands would be worthy 

409
00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:14,400
candidates, but we'll omit them 
because I don't think Lomas went

410
00:21:14,400 --> 00:21:16,360
there, even though we do think 
he went to the 5 Fourths. 

411
00:21:16,360 --> 00:21:17,480
I just don't think he went 
beyond. 

412
00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:19,920
It's probably too dangerous. 
Like, how could he travel to 

413
00:21:19,920 --> 00:21:22,280
some of these places? 
It sounds inhospitable or like 

414
00:21:22,360 --> 00:21:25,520
the Dry Deep is no water and 
it's just it sounds like 

415
00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:27,440
something like Death Valley or 
something like that. 

416
00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:31,000
So like, yeah, don't go there. 
You know, there was. 

417
00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:34,440
AI didn't put in a document, but
there was a quote by John when 

418
00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:36,160
he was going through the Frost 
Fangs. 

419
00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:39,080
First he's talking about the 
dangers and the treacherousness 

420
00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:43,520
and the shadow cats and such. 
But then he says, but there were

421
00:21:43,520 --> 00:21:46,560
also wonders, you know, he was 
so glad that he was on this 

422
00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:48,680
adventure. 
And he described like, you know,

423
00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:52,080
you know, in the midst of this 
ice jungle, there would be a 

424
00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:54,400
field of flowers blooming and 
there would be like frozen 

425
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:57,560
waterfalls and, you know, 
spectacular stuff Lomas may have

426
00:21:57,560 --> 00:22:00,000
never saw, probably never saw 
that, right. 

427
00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:02,800
We are humans, very few humans 
who probably ever saw what John 

428
00:22:02,800 --> 00:22:05,080
saw there. 
And so he might have counted it 

429
00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:07,560
among the the wonders if he had 
seen it. 

430
00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:09,320
But even he didn't go 
everywhere. 

431
00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:12,320
Yeah, we don't have any evidence
He went beyond the wall and 

432
00:22:12,480 --> 00:22:14,800
yeah, I if he did, then you're 
right. 

433
00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:17,800
But he would maybe say the 
Frostbangs or the milk water. 

434
00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:19,440
I don't know. 
The haunted forest is awfully 

435
00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:23,160
large. 
I would be curious what he would

436
00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:25,960
have said about those things, 
but yeah, most likely he didn't 

437
00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:26,720
go. 
He would. 

438
00:22:27,560 --> 00:22:29,440
Have said, yeah, yeah, he would 
have said that for sure. 

439
00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:32,520
Definitely he say that. 
But also in Westeros is a 

440
00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:35,920
curiosity that we can't answer. 
That I deeply like to know is 

441
00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:38,320
did he go to the try or try to 
go to the God's eye? 

442
00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:41,320
Like was he one of many people 
that tried to sail there and the

443
00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:44,240
wind blew him off course or 
you'd think he would try, like 

444
00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:46,760
that was got to be on his list. 
But if he couldn't actually see 

445
00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:48,360
it, then what would he write? 
I was like, well, it's wondrous 

446
00:22:48,360 --> 00:22:50,600
that the winds blew me off 
course every single time. 

447
00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:53,440
It's like it's strange. 
I don't know if it's wondrous, 

448
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:54,600
but that would that would get a 
foot in there. 

449
00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:56,280
That would be written about in a
book probably. 

450
00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:59,040
Maybe not, depending on what the
rules of the God's eye are. 

451
00:22:59,120 --> 00:23:01,920
OK, the rules. 
The first rule of the God's eye 

452
00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,960
is don't talk about that. 
God's Eye Club. 

453
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:09,200
Yeah, that's right. 
So we're in our efforts to find 

454
00:23:09,200 --> 00:23:10,840
the basis. 
Like we we tried to come up with

455
00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:13,280
some categorization thing like 
So what? 

456
00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:15,520
One of the things we can do is 
like best of's not really best 

457
00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:17,080
of's. 
Actually it's more like biggest.

458
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:20,840
Is it the largest, the deepest, 
the tallest, the longest, or? 

459
00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:23,400
Superlatives. 
Yes, any superlative you can 

460
00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:26,600
think of. 
We tried to include here for 

461
00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:30,280
basis for judgement here the. 
Smallest forest in the world. 

462
00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:33,360
Yeah, it's the tiniest. 
It's just a little tiny. 

463
00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:36,880
It's a single leaf on the end of
a piece of concrete. 

464
00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:39,440
Yeah, I think that would that 
would mean more than 7 wonders. 

465
00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:43,960
So these are widely considered 
that we're going to list, I'm 

466
00:23:43,960 --> 00:23:46,320
just going to list these off, 
Sean and I list these off these 

467
00:23:46,360 --> 00:23:48,320
modern natural wonders of the 
world. 

468
00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:50,440
Of course there is no central 
authority on this of course. 

469
00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:51,800
So there's just different groups
have done this. 

470
00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:54,480
And some of these you'll hear 
again because we'll compare them

471
00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:57,240
to some of the ones that are in 
Westeros and Essos. 

472
00:23:57,400 --> 00:23:59,280
I'll I'll list the first group 
of Sean will list the second 

473
00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:00,720
group. 
This is basically the list that 

474
00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:05,360
CNN made in 1997. 
So other people kind of 

475
00:24:05,360 --> 00:24:08,160
corroborated it. 
But like I said, it might be 

476
00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:11,760
kind of silly to think CNN's 
list but you know a lot of 

477
00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:14,000
people made lists. 
It's a good list, I think. 

478
00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:16,400
I wouldn't argue with any of 
these on here. 

479
00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:19,160
The difficulty being it's you 
got to narrow it down to seven, 

480
00:24:19,160 --> 00:24:21,560
and maybe my list would be 
slightly different, but these 

481
00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:24,200
are all very, very worthy. 
None of these are like Slack. 

482
00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:27,000
It wasn't just like Wolf Blitzer
coming up with 7, right? 

483
00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:30,480
Yeah, it was a panel. 
Effort into, you know, experts 

484
00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:32,720
and whatnot, so. 
So the list is Mount Everest, 

485
00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:35,840
the Grand Canyon, the Great 
Barrier Reef, the Northern 

486
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:40,800
Lights, Victoria Falls, which is
in Zimbabwe, Rio Harbor like Rio

487
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:42,440
de Janeiro, that's Brazil of 
course. 

488
00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:45,480
And then the Paracutin volcano, 
which is, I believe in Chile, 

489
00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:46,680
It's definitely in, in South 
America. 

490
00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:47,640
Mexico. 
OK, my bad. 

491
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:49,760
Yeah. 
And so Central America then. 

492
00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:52,000
And Sean, list the other ones 
here. 

493
00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:56,280
This next seven was a group that
an organization that had a a 

494
00:24:56,280 --> 00:24:58,800
bunch of funding and in a 
worldwide poll with hundreds of 

495
00:24:58,800 --> 00:25:01,480
millions of people voting. 
And this is the seven they came 

496
00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:08,680
up with was Port Au Princesa, 
the Amazon, Halong Bay, Iguaco 

497
00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:13,440
Falls, Jeju Island, Komodo 
Island, and Table Mountain. 

498
00:25:13,560 --> 00:25:15,040
OK. 
Right off the top, I want to say

499
00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:18,800
one, the second one has much 
more Asian representation and 

500
00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:20,480
all too. 
I remember you telling me about 

501
00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:23,960
the phone in campaigns that they
had for this. 

502
00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:27,280
We talked about that last week a
bit how it was somewhat 

503
00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:31,080
swayable, which you know, fair 
enough, but I think it gives a 

504
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:34,040
good array. 
The second list, but I feel like

505
00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:37,640
the first list has some more 
household names perhaps. 

506
00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:40,720
So like I think I would if I if 
I were, if it were me, I would 

507
00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:45,480
combine half of half of list one
with list 2 for my own natural 

508
00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:46,640
wonders. 
Yeah, it's interesting because 

509
00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:49,200
mountain out like only the Grand
Canyon is in the US you have 

510
00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:52,360
Victoria Falls is in Africa, Rio
harbors in South America, so is 

511
00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:53,800
paracut and volcanoes in Central
America. 

512
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:55,560
The Northern Lights are kind of,
you know, in a lot of places, 

513
00:25:55,560 --> 00:25:58,800
but only in the far north. 
And the Great Barrier Reef is 

514
00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:02,080
obviously like Australia and 
Mount Everest is Nepal. 

515
00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:05,920
So yeah, there, I like what 
you're saying, a Shaya too, 

516
00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:08,080
because there's no island 
represented there. 

517
00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:12,640
And the I like the idea of a Bay
and of course the Amazon River 

518
00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:17,480
is I think very worthy as well. 
Anyway, let's let's move on to 

519
00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:22,440
the actual, only confirmed 
Wonder of the World and 

520
00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:25,560
Planetos, the Caves of Norvas 
quote. 

521
00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:29,960
Close by the city walls, the 
norvashi work the land on the 

522
00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:34,400
terraced farms. 
Farther out, men gather behind 

523
00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:38,680
stout timber Palisades in 
holdfasts and walled villages. 

524
00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:43,520
The streams here are swift, 
running and Stony, and caverns 

525
00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:48,000
honeycomb the endless hills. 
Many of the caves are home to 

526
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:53,240
the brown bears common to these 
northern lands, others to packs 

527
00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:58,280
of red or Gray wolves. 
In some can be found the bones 

528
00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:03,440
of giants and painted walls that
speak of men's dwelling here in 

529
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:08,120
ages past. 
One cavern system some 100 

530
00:27:08,120 --> 00:27:13,760
leagues northwest of Norvos, is 
so vast and deep that legend 

531
00:27:13,760 --> 00:27:16,880
claims it is the entrance to the
underworld. 

532
00:27:17,120 --> 00:27:19,120
That's something that's come up 
in a lot of real world cave 

533
00:27:19,120 --> 00:27:23,040
systems like because so many of 
the wonders are associated with 

534
00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:27,080
religion or the province of 
gods. 

535
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:30,880
Very deep cave and and and if 
you have a religion that has an 

536
00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:34,160
underworld like the Greek myths,
for example, you would this 

537
00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:36,480
would be a portal to that. 
You can see why they would see 

538
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:38,120
it that way. 
But there's so many cool real 

539
00:27:38,120 --> 00:27:42,040
world things to hear that we've 
we've seen and mixed in with the

540
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:44,440
things like that are not real 
world like the bones of giants. 

541
00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:47,440
But but almost everything else 
is is very realistic to the real

542
00:27:47,440 --> 00:27:49,080
world like wolves living in 
caves. 

543
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:52,480
Just the fact that there are 
caves that people live in them 

544
00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:59,440
and the idea that there are cave
paintings, that's really cool. 

545
00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:02,160
Nina mentions The Cave paintings
in Lesko. 

546
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:04,560
But of course there's lots of 
cave paintings around the world.

547
00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:07,200
Lesko is just one of the really 
famous ones that has some some 

548
00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:09,520
of the oldest and most well 
preserved ones. 

549
00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:11,680
But there's cave paintings in a 
lot of places around the world 

550
00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:15,360
that were made thousands of 
years ago, if not in some cases 

551
00:28:15,360 --> 00:28:17,680
10s of thousands of years ago. 
And it sounds like that's the 

552
00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:19,720
case here with the caves of 
Norvas. 

553
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:22,520
Sean, you looked up some real 
world parallels. 

554
00:28:22,800 --> 00:28:25,160
Nina mentions Mammoth Cave in 
Kentucky, which is huge and I 

555
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:28,040
know they they sometimes bands 
play shows in there, which is 

556
00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:32,040
really neat, big enough. 
So you could have an audience of

557
00:28:32,280 --> 00:28:34,480
thousands of people, Yeah. 
Yeah, it's totally on our bucket

558
00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:35,560
list. 
I want to see a show there. 

559
00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:38,280
Oh, I was thinking of the 
caverns in Tennessee. 

560
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:41,400
Puerto Princesa is in the 
Philippines, and it's it's a 

561
00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:45,120
river slash cave. 
It's a river that flows into 

562
00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:48,120
like 10 miles of caves. 
And there's underground 

563
00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:51,280
waterfalls and you know, big 
openings of caverns and all 

564
00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:54,920
kinds of wildlife. 
And that I think it kind of 

565
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:57,120
recently, maybe in the past 10 
or so years, they even 

566
00:28:57,120 --> 00:28:59,440
discovered a whole new section 
and that it's still being 

567
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:02,800
explored today, a massive cavern
network with a river, running 

568
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:05,400
fluid and everything. 
So, and it was one of those new 

569
00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:07,120
wonders of the world. 
Right on. 

570
00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:09,920
I remember us talking about I've
honestly slipped my mind which 

571
00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:11,640
episode it was. 
We talked about this huge cave 

572
00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:13,840
system that's fairly recently 
discovered only in the last like

573
00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:16,080
70 or 80 years that was 
discovered in China. 

574
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:19,720
And it's so deep and wide and it
has its new species like species

575
00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:21,760
of monkeys that have never been 
seen before that live in there 

576
00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:25,680
and and under router underwater 
lakes that had new species of 

577
00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:27,240
fish and and other. 
Yeah. 

578
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:29,360
So there's talk about 
unexplored. 

579
00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:32,240
Like in the real world there is 
a lot of stuff unexplored. 

580
00:29:32,240 --> 00:29:35,840
We talk about the deep sea as a 
frontier of of exploration, and 

581
00:29:35,840 --> 00:29:38,960
it is, but caves are right there
with it. 

582
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:41,840
They're they're in some ways 
more mysterious, in some ways 

583
00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:44,040
perhaps less. 
But, you know, it just depends, 

584
00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:45,760
right? 
Different kind of creatures grow

585
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:47,960
there. 
And it's just amazing to think 

586
00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:50,200
about this in terms of a place 
like Norvos. 

587
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:53,480
I love the idea of bones, of 
giants, and I love the idea of 

588
00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:56,720
of ancient culture being 
preserved through not just 

589
00:29:56,720 --> 00:29:59,320
paintings, but I'm sure there's 
like tools, like an 

590
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:02,040
archaeologist could have a field
day finding Flint tools, stone 

591
00:30:02,040 --> 00:30:05,920
tools, things besides artwork, 
maybe some textiles that were 

592
00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:09,120
left behind, you know, shreds 
here and there, like worked 

593
00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:12,320
bone. 
All the sort of things that that

594
00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:16,360
archaeologists dig into. 
It's also begs the question if 

595
00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:20,120
there's probably cave systems in
the world that would maybe be 

596
00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:22,160
more impressive than this. 
Like Blood Raven's cave. 

597
00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:25,600
The Green Seer Cave is a 
potential example, but other 

598
00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:28,920
ones too that just we don't know
about, that he doesn't know 

599
00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:30,400
about. 
Like he probably didn't find all

600
00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:32,480
the biggest and deepest caves in
the world and he surely didn't 

601
00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:35,440
exploit these like in the area 
chapter when they find those 

602
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:37,400
caves, who else has been in 
those? 

603
00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:39,880
Like, I doubt Lomas went in that
cave and it's pretty creepy 

604
00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:43,480
because there's like carved 
stuff in there and humongous 

605
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:47,200
natural caverns formed by 
millennia worth of water and and

606
00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:51,680
other stuff. 
So yeah, it's this is by itself 

607
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:53,760
just really inspires the 
imagination. 

608
00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:56,800
And we know there's caves of 
sorts under the wall too, right?

609
00:30:56,800 --> 00:30:58,800
It's true, the worm waves, yes, 
yes, I'm. 

610
00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:02,680
Not sure how big or explored 
they are, but I and I don't know

611
00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:05,200
if Lomas went in there, but. 
And that might be relevant. 

612
00:31:05,200 --> 00:31:07,680
Plot directly. 
Plot relevant too, because you 

613
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:10,320
know, you wonder about stories 
like Gendel and Gorn that tried 

614
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:14,320
to tunnel under the wall. 
And is that going to come up 

615
00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:15,920
somehow? 
Is that was that meant to be 

616
00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:18,360
just a curious tale from the 
past or is that going to be 

617
00:31:18,360 --> 00:31:19,680
relevant? 
Is that going to be maybe one of

618
00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:22,840
the ways the others try to get 
around or maybe some free who 

619
00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:24,560
knows, I don't know. 
Maybe we may be past the point 

620
00:31:24,560 --> 00:31:25,920
where people are trying to evade
the wall. 

621
00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:28,200
The next thing that may happen 
is it goes down and that's that.

622
00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:30,920
But who knows? 
We'll see. 

623
00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:34,480
Lomas must have really liked 
Norvos, 'cause it has a natural 

624
00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:36,720
and a man made wonder. 
The bells of Norvos are right 

625
00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:39,680
there, the caves of Norvos are 
right there, and no other city 

626
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:41,720
can possibly claim that. 
Because this is the only 

627
00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:45,360
confirmed natural wonder, it's 
possible that there's another 

628
00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:47,560
city that has two wonders. 
We just don't have any other 

629
00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:50,400
confirmed natural wonders, so 
that's just impossible for us to

630
00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:53,320
say that. 
So eat your heart out, cohor 

631
00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:55,280
neighboring Cohor. 
They're just they feel jealous. 

632
00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:59,320
Actually, don't Don't encourage 
the followers of the Black Goat 

633
00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:01,440
to eat any hearts. 
They might take that literally. 

634
00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:04,760
So let me use a different, 
different wording there. 

635
00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:09,160
So with that solitary, confirmed
example, let us move on to the 

636
00:32:09,160 --> 00:32:11,360
joy of guesswork and theory. 
I would love to spend more time 

637
00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:12,720
on each of these, but of course 
we can't do that. 

638
00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:15,880
So again, if you want us to 
spend more time on any 

639
00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:18,520
individually, let us know what 
your favorite ones are. 

640
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:21,920
And of course, we're curious 
what your guesses are as to the 

641
00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:24,280
Six Wonders. 
So let's move on to the Black 

642
00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:27,000
Goat Worshipping Fellows. 
Since they are next door and we 

643
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:30,520
just mentioned them, let's talk 
the Forest of Cohor. 

644
00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:34,640
Start with a quote. 
The woods that surround Cohor 

645
00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:37,480
are the principal source of the 
city's wealth. 

646
00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:41,480
The earliest settlement here was
a lumber camp, the city's 

647
00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:46,200
histories reveal, and even to 
this day it is as hunters and 

648
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:51,000
foresters that the cohoric are 
most famed shining cities and 

649
00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:53,600
sprawling towns of the Lower 
Rhine. 

650
00:32:53,840 --> 00:32:59,000
Hunger for wood and their own 
forests have long ago been 

651
00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:03,400
depleted, cut down, and plowed 
under for fields and farms. 

652
00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:08,440
Huge barges heavy with timber 
depart the docks of Cohor every 

653
00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:13,240
day for the long voyage down the
coin to Dagger Lake and the 

654
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:18,920
markets of Selhoris, Valasar 
voluntaries, and old Volantis. 

655
00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:25,520
The forest of Kohor also yields 
up firs and pelts of all kinds, 

656
00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:30,920
many rare and fine and highly 
prized, as well as silver, tin, 

657
00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:34,560
and amber. 
The vast forest has never been 

658
00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:39,120
fully explored, according to the
maps and scrolls at the Citadel,

659
00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:43,680
and it likely conceals many 
mysteries and wonders at its 

660
00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:47,480
heart. 
Like many northerly forests, it 

661
00:33:47,480 --> 00:33:52,680
contains elk and deer in great 
numbers, along with wolves, tree

662
00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:58,960
cats, boars of truly monstrous 
size, spotted bears, and even a 

663
00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:03,840
species of lemur, a creature 
known from the Summer Isles and 

664
00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:08,159
Sithorios but otherwise rarely 
seen further north. 

665
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:12,159
Well said, Shia reads those so 
well. 

666
00:34:12,320 --> 00:34:14,840
A look at the map shows just how
big this forest is. 

667
00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:17,600
It's easily the biggest forest 
we can see in essence. 

668
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:22,320
Now if you distinguish between 
forest and jungle, there's it's 

669
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:24,520
not always easy to make that 
distinction. 

670
00:34:24,520 --> 00:34:28,120
Maybe some expert could do a 
better job than me, but I were 

671
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:30,600
separating them. 
I'm not sure how much they 

672
00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:33,360
deserve to be separated. 
Certainly Sothorios and Altos 

673
00:34:33,719 --> 00:34:37,520
appear to be entirely forest and
or jungle, and we don't know 

674
00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:40,320
that much about Altos at all. 
But Satorios's jungles probably 

675
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:42,639
have some hidden wonders. 
But they will also definitely 

676
00:34:42,639 --> 00:34:45,520
kill you. 
So that may subtract from the 

677
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:49,199
wondrousness, or at least from 
Lomas's ability to go and 

678
00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:52,719
explore the place on the first 
you know at all to make those 

679
00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:53,960
distinctions and those 
judgments. 

680
00:34:54,120 --> 00:34:55,800
Now, the summer Islanders might 
be different. 

681
00:34:55,800 --> 00:34:58,720
They may have actually explored 
quite a bit of Satorios, but 

682
00:34:58,720 --> 00:35:01,560
that's a tale for another time. 
We also don't know how big the 

683
00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:03,800
Force cohort is compared to, 
say, the Kingdom of the 

684
00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:07,600
Evequivron, which is also quite 
large, the forest. 

685
00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:10,760
Both of those forests are quite 
possibly the two largest in the 

686
00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:13,960
world. 
Nothing in Westeros even comes 

687
00:35:13,960 --> 00:35:15,960
remotely close, which is really 
saying something because the 

688
00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:17,760
wolf's wood is large, very 
large. 

689
00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:21,600
But a tripling of the wolf's 
wood probably doesn't match the 

690
00:35:21,600 --> 00:35:25,280
forest cohort, at least just 
judging by the the size on the 

691
00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:27,960
maps. 
So truly, the forests of 

692
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:31,320
Westeros are mere copses or tree
stands compared to the ones of 

693
00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:33,440
Essos. 
So it's it's just gigantic. 

694
00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:35,360
So you can believe that it's not
fully explored. 

695
00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:37,800
Like, yeah, I I can understand 
that. 

696
00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:42,160
However, a caveat that we're 
going to have to say many times 

697
00:35:42,160 --> 00:35:44,520
is our information is coming 
from the Citadel. 

698
00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:48,080
We know for sure that the people
of Cohort, the people who live 

699
00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:50,200
there longer, probably know more
about it than the people of the 

700
00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:51,440
Citadel. 
They haven't copied. 

701
00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:53,240
Every single piece of 
information hasn't been 

702
00:35:53,240 --> 00:35:55,880
transmitted to the Citadel. 
I'm sure they have secrets, 

703
00:35:55,880 --> 00:35:59,320
knowledge, books of their own 
perhaps that haven't made it to 

704
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:00,720
the city. 
So if we're looking at it from 

705
00:36:00,720 --> 00:36:05,400
a, you know, logistical, how 
would it function in Planetos? 

706
00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:08,360
You can see where there would be
more knowledge. 

707
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:10,880
That's outside of Lomas's 
province. 

708
00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:13,640
He probably didn't speak Kahoric
or read it, you know. 

709
00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:16,760
And so he may have been able to 
learn some of these things, but 

710
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:19,840
it still would would come up 
short in terms of comprehensive 

711
00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:23,440
knowledge. 
Now, in real life, the largest 

712
00:36:23,440 --> 00:36:27,600
forest is the Amazon rainforest.
No one's probably surprised to 

713
00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:29,640
hear that that's pretty well 
known. 

714
00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:33,680
It's 2.3 million square miles. 
It isn't just the largest, it's 

715
00:36:33,680 --> 00:36:36,000
the largest by far. 
No other rainforest on the 

716
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:40,360
planet even comes close. 
But the Brazil isn't the country

717
00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:43,480
with the most total forest. 
Their second, the most total 

718
00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:46,920
forest in the world by by 
country is Russia. 

719
00:36:47,320 --> 00:36:49,440
Which kind of makes sense 
because Russia is so huge and 

720
00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:51,200
large parts of it are 
unpopulated. 

721
00:36:51,720 --> 00:36:54,160
Canada is next. 
Same logic there. 

722
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:57,840
Canada is huge but doesn't have 
a huge population. the US is 

723
00:36:57,840 --> 00:37:01,520
next, followed by China, then 
Australia and then Congo. 

724
00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:03,480
Like we named all these big, 
like huge countries. 

725
00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:06,320
Russia, Brazil, Canada, US, 
China, Australia, Congo. 

726
00:37:07,000 --> 00:37:09,080
No shade against Congo. 
They're just, they got a lot of 

727
00:37:09,080 --> 00:37:10,680
forests there. 
That's that wasn't, that wasn't 

728
00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:12,760
meant to be a negative comment. 
I'm just surprised to see such a

729
00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:14,840
smaller country mixing with all 
these very large ones. 

730
00:37:16,240 --> 00:37:17,600
Yeah, there's lots of shade is 
right. 

731
00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:18,920
There's lots of shade. 
All those trees. 

732
00:37:18,920 --> 00:37:20,960
Exactly. 
Good point. 

733
00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:24,560
Nina adds that it's not just the
size of the force of cohort, 

734
00:37:24,560 --> 00:37:28,040
which by itself is pretty 
wondrous, but the mysteries that

735
00:37:28,040 --> 00:37:30,640
are hinted to be within it. 
The fact that it's not fully 

736
00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:34,040
explored or mapped would be 
intriguing. 

737
00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:37,720
So someone like Lomas at regular
folk too. 

738
00:37:37,720 --> 00:37:40,200
I mean, I'm not an explorer and 
it sounds pretty cool to me. 

739
00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:43,200
I want to know more. 
It's it's just adds, you know, 

740
00:37:43,400 --> 00:37:46,120
makes me curious and yeah, what 
else is in there? 

741
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:48,320
Riches of silver, tin, amber. 
What else is in there? 

742
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:51,600
You know what other like hidden 
alcoves and mountains and and 

743
00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:56,560
creatures what what obscure 
fauna have hidden themselves 

744
00:37:56,560 --> 00:37:59,040
from the works of mankind for 
for so long. 

745
00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:02,960
I mean there's animals that have
hidden from humankind in the 

746
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:06,280
real world and we're way better 
at tracking stuff and and 

747
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:08,640
locating stuff and our 
technology is much better. 

748
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:11,280
So you got to believe there's 
some undiscovered things in 

749
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:13,280
there. 
We do actually pass through it 

750
00:38:13,400 --> 00:38:16,080
with Danny. 
We pass through the core, the 

751
00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:19,280
force of cohort with Danny very,
very early in the series on the 

752
00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:23,720
Valyrian roads, which is yet 
another example of wonders 

753
00:38:23,720 --> 00:38:25,360
merging. 
Now the well it's the first one 

754
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:28,120
that where they merge and and 
Norvas you have two wonders in 

755
00:38:28,120 --> 00:38:30,880
the same basic location, but we 
will see other ones that 

756
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:34,240
actually merge. 
So this is the man made Wonder 

757
00:38:34,240 --> 00:38:37,920
Valyrian roads going through the
natural wonder candidate forest 

758
00:38:37,920 --> 00:38:39,640
of cohort. 
And we will have similar 

759
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:43,400
examples like that sticking with
Daenerys. 

760
00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:45,680
This is another one we've seen 
up next. 

761
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:48,400
It's the mother of mountains and
the womb of the world. 

762
00:38:48,760 --> 00:38:53,600
It's possible the two should be 
separated, but maybe together 

763
00:38:54,200 --> 00:38:56,960
using their combined powers they
can become Will Wonder. 

764
00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:59,720
Wasn't that the name? 
Weren't there two superheroes? 

765
00:38:59,720 --> 00:39:02,280
The Wonder Twins? 
Yes, and with their power 

766
00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:05,040
combined. 
Wonder 20. 

767
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:06,600
They were the wonder twin. 
That's good. 

768
00:39:06,600 --> 00:39:08,960
Call Sean. 
Yeah, they can combine. 

769
00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:10,920
Why not. 
Those were two so funny because 

770
00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:13,240
the the girl had such better 
shape shifting. 

771
00:39:13,240 --> 00:39:15,880
She could be any animal. 
And the dude would be like, I'm 

772
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:19,800
a bucket, Yeah, yeah. 
And then she would turn into an 

773
00:39:19,800 --> 00:39:23,320
eagle and carry the bucket. 
You know, like, dude, you're you

774
00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:25,040
got the short end of this one. 
She's way. 

775
00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:26,880
Cooler than you can come up. 
With yeah I. 

776
00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:29,680
Mean he had to just sit there 
and get carried and she had to 

777
00:39:29,760 --> 00:39:31,640
pull him. 
It sounds like he got the better

778
00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:33,800
end of that. 
To me, she had better shape 

779
00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:35,400
shifting, but she also had to do
more work. 

780
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:39,320
Yeah, yeah. 
So we've seen this one, the both

781
00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:42,040
of them, the Mother Mountains in
the womb of the world, and 

782
00:39:42,240 --> 00:39:44,480
they're connected. 
The Dothraki connect them by a 

783
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:46,680
thing called the Gods way. 
There's like like a long road 

784
00:39:46,680 --> 00:39:48,920
that leads from the womb of the 
world to the mother of 

785
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:50,880
mountains. 
Now the interesting thing is, 

786
00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:54,320
even though they're both 
feminine, the mother of 

787
00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:58,360
mountains and the womb of the 
world, women aren't allowed on 

788
00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:00,960
the mother of mountains. 
Only men can climb the mother of

789
00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:02,600
mountains. 
And I don't think men are 

790
00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:03,640
allowed in the womb of the 
world. 

791
00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:05,120
They're not allowed to 
necessarily use the water. 

792
00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:08,880
I'm not clear on that part, but 
I know the Crohn's associate it 

793
00:40:09,240 --> 00:40:10,720
the Crohn's of the Dosh Colleen 
associate. 

794
00:40:10,720 --> 00:40:14,280
And Danny has that dream. 
Of crohns coming out beneath the

795
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:16,440
mother of mountains, out of 
emerging from somebody of water 

796
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:18,600
which could only be the womb of 
the world. 

797
00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:22,800
So that's really cool. 
And the road, this God's way, 

798
00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:25,360
that connects the womb of the 
world to the mother mountain is 

799
00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:28,560
lined with a lot of those stolen
monuments that the Dothraki 

800
00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:31,400
have, which definitely increases
the wondrousness of the place. 

801
00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:35,760
Though those aren't natural, 
clearly those are man made and 

802
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:37,760
stolen from elsewhere. 
And that was an interesting 

803
00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:40,200
point we discussed on Discord 
with some of the Discord 

804
00:40:40,200 --> 00:40:42,840
regulars. 
Is that the Dothraki had stole a

805
00:40:42,840 --> 00:40:45,720
lot of these monuments, and this
collection of monuments might be

806
00:40:45,720 --> 00:40:48,320
worthy of a one of consider for 
wondrousness. 

807
00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:50,080
And they wouldn't have stolen 
them all directly. 

808
00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:51,800
They would have stolen some of 
them from other people who had 

809
00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:53,880
stolen them. 
It was like some of them they 

810
00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:56,680
didn't. 
None of them originated in Vaste

811
00:40:56,680 --> 00:40:58,920
Dothrak, but they may have 
stolen them from somebody who 

812
00:40:58,920 --> 00:41:01,280
first stole them from some 
other, like the Valyrians for 

813
00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:02,840
example. 
The Valyrians took things from 

814
00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:05,560
other cultures when they 
conquered dozens of other 

815
00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:08,120
nations. 
The Dothraki might have gotten 

816
00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:11,560
some of those and and re removed
them back to the base Dothrak. 

817
00:41:12,040 --> 00:41:15,720
Now on the other hand, Lomas 
might not have seen some of 

818
00:41:15,720 --> 00:41:17,480
this. 
Like we're pretty sure he saw 

819
00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:19,800
the Dothraki Sea which wouldn't 
have been called that at his 

820
00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:22,600
time because he went to Sarnath.
In fact we're we can be certain 

821
00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:25,000
he saw it because the the 
Sarnath is sitting right square 

822
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:28,360
in the center of the Dothraki 
Sea, AKA the Great Grass Sea. 

823
00:41:28,680 --> 00:41:30,000
But did he go to the mother of 
mountains? 

824
00:41:30,000 --> 00:41:31,280
Did he go to the womb of the 
world? 

825
00:41:31,880 --> 00:41:35,720
That's not necessarily. 
We definitely can't assume that 

826
00:41:35,720 --> 00:41:37,000
he did. 
He might have. 

827
00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:41,080
Why would he have, though? 
Well, the Mother Mountains. 

828
00:41:41,440 --> 00:41:44,480
It might not be a lot special. 
It might just be sacred to the 

829
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:46,040
Dothraki, and that's the end of 
it. 

830
00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:47,840
That's why it's special because 
of its sacredness. 

831
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:51,040
But maybe it's special to them 
because it's pretty wondrous. 

832
00:41:51,040 --> 00:41:52,560
Maybe that's why. 
And I don't know. 

833
00:41:52,560 --> 00:41:56,280
What else explains that? 
Why do the Dothraki esteemed 

834
00:41:56,280 --> 00:41:58,560
this one mountain? 
What is it about this place that

835
00:41:59,800 --> 00:42:02,200
is such a big deal to them? 
You know, I don't know. 

836
00:42:02,200 --> 00:42:03,640
But. 
And that might have drawn Lomas 

837
00:42:03,640 --> 00:42:06,840
there, That very question of 
what makes the mother of 

838
00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:10,400
Mountains so important? 
Is it a special geographical 

839
00:42:10,400 --> 00:42:13,160
feature or is it purely because 
of its sacred status to this one

840
00:42:13,160 --> 00:42:15,480
culture? 
So it could be quite impressive.

841
00:42:15,480 --> 00:42:17,600
And a standalone mountain is 
kind of unusual. 

842
00:42:17,600 --> 00:42:19,440
It's hundreds of miles from the 
Bone Mountains. 

843
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:22,960
It's it's nearby, but it might 
be like a like a bump, you know,

844
00:42:22,960 --> 00:42:26,120
far away from the the large, 
imposing Bone Mountains. 

845
00:42:27,200 --> 00:42:30,640
I'm not sure. 
Now the womb of the world is 

846
00:42:30,640 --> 00:42:33,840
also very interesting because 
it's really big. 

847
00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:38,120
It's much larger than the God's 
eye, and it might be the biggest

848
00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:40,040
lake in the world. 
Depends on what's a lake and 

849
00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:41,560
what isn't. 
Because there's a body of water 

850
00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:43,960
called the poison sea in the 
Bone Mountains region, which I 

851
00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:45,960
think is a lake, but it's called
the poison sea. 

852
00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:48,920
And that one looks to be bigger,
but it might, but it's probably 

853
00:42:48,920 --> 00:42:53,000
not deeper because there is 
supposedly no bottom to the womb

854
00:42:53,000 --> 00:42:54,600
of the world. 
Now, that's almost certainly not

855
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:55,800
true. 
That just means they haven't 

856
00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:59,400
found the bottom, but that it 
does imply it's incredibly deep.

857
00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:05,000
The Dothraki actually believed 
the first man came out of the 

858
00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:07,480
God, the womb of the world 
riding the first horse. 

859
00:43:07,520 --> 00:43:10,560
And there's an interesting 
potential for buried truth in 

860
00:43:10,560 --> 00:43:13,720
that myth. 
Because remember, the Dothraki 

861
00:43:13,720 --> 00:43:16,760
Sea. 
The Great grass sea used to be 

862
00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:20,000
the Silver Sea, an actual body 
of water that has long since 

863
00:43:20,000 --> 00:43:21,880
vanished. 
The womb of the world is 

864
00:43:21,880 --> 00:43:25,800
probably a remnant of that. 
It's probably a deep the deepest

865
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:31,320
section of that former bygone 
body of water and the poison sea

866
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:33,240
to the South was probably part 
of it as well. 

867
00:43:33,240 --> 00:43:36,600
It's just changed dramatically 
over 10s of thousands, if not 

868
00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:40,560
longer years. 
So why does that associate with 

869
00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:44,080
the Dothraki myth of the first 
man coming out of the the womb 

870
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:47,160
of the world? 
Because many people believe that

871
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:50,200
human life on Planetos began 
around the Silver Sea. 

872
00:43:50,360 --> 00:43:53,720
So it would be like that myth 
was passed down to those early 

873
00:43:53,720 --> 00:43:57,240
humans, passed down to the 
Dothraki who you know, emerged 

874
00:43:57,240 --> 00:43:59,080
from that culture in some sort 
of offshoot. 

875
00:43:59,360 --> 00:44:01,680
And those beliefs would have 
been passed on to them and be 

876
00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:04,600
associated with this region. 
They would associate it with the

877
00:44:04,600 --> 00:44:07,160
body of water that they have, 
rather than the long gone Silver

878
00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:08,880
Sea that they probably aren't 
even aware of anymore. 

879
00:44:09,720 --> 00:44:12,600
So I I really like how those 
things tie together so neatly 

880
00:44:12,600 --> 00:44:17,040
and speak to the same mythology,
the same origins of life are 

881
00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:19,960
contained within these sort of 
complimentary myths, and that's 

882
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:21,920
pretty cool. 
I'm not sure that we'll ever go 

883
00:44:21,920 --> 00:44:24,120
back there, but we might. 
Danny is in the Dothraki sea. 

884
00:44:24,120 --> 00:44:29,360
She's probably going to get 
captured by Kyle Joko, and that 

885
00:44:29,360 --> 00:44:32,440
might mean going back there and 
and fulfilling that vision of 

886
00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:36,160
the crones of the dash Khalin 
kneeling to her beneath the 

887
00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:38,280
mother of mountains after, you 
know, dripping wet from the womb

888
00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:40,560
of the world. 
So this one may not be wonder 

889
00:44:40,560 --> 00:44:41,880
status. 
I think it's close. 

890
00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:44,360
I think it's a nominee. 
Maybe it's more like top 20 than

891
00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:47,440
top seven, but it's got more 
story relevance than a lot of 

892
00:44:47,440 --> 00:44:49,680
the others, which which makes it
special to us in a different 

893
00:44:49,680 --> 00:44:51,680
way. 
Anything to add on that one? 

894
00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:54,440
Y'all. 
I just that honestly you're 

895
00:44:54,440 --> 00:44:57,160
you're critique of the mother of
mountains image from Game of 

896
00:44:57,160 --> 00:45:00,560
Thrones really took the wind out
of my sails in terms of it being

897
00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:03,880
a wonder like if if he I don't 
know what to say. 

898
00:45:03,880 --> 00:45:08,160
I'm like if ever it had a shot 
and making my list it lost its 

899
00:45:08,160 --> 00:45:12,640
shot. 
It's Dan and Dave's fault, not 

900
00:45:12,640 --> 00:45:17,040
yeah. 
We got to do our our, our 

901
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:19,520
guesses, our individual guesses 
at the end. 

902
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:22,360
But I'll say now, this isn't 
this one doesn't make my cut. 

903
00:45:22,480 --> 00:45:23,800
OK, yeah, I don't think it does 
for me either. 

904
00:45:23,800 --> 00:45:25,320
But like I said, probably top 
20. 

905
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:27,840
But Next up is is related. 
We'll talk about the actual 

906
00:45:27,840 --> 00:45:30,080
Great Grass Sea, AKA the 
Dithraki Sea. 

907
00:45:30,520 --> 00:45:34,320
It's also called the Haunted 
Lands, AKA the Great Desolation.

908
00:45:34,320 --> 00:45:36,320
It's got a lot of names, which 
that's kind of wondrous. 

909
00:45:36,320 --> 00:45:39,800
That implies something, right? 
But that is not the feature. 

910
00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:41,760
We're not interested in the 
ruins so much. 

911
00:45:42,840 --> 00:45:45,040
Here's another one. 
We get a straightforward POV 

912
00:45:45,120 --> 00:45:48,160
take on with a quote. 
The Dothraki Sea. 

913
00:45:48,360 --> 00:45:52,720
Sir Jorah, Mormont said as he 
reigned to a halt beside her on 

914
00:45:52,720 --> 00:45:56,480
the top of the Ridge Beneath 
them, the plane stretched out 

915
00:45:56,480 --> 00:46:01,760
immense and empty, a vast, flat 
expanse that reached the distant

916
00:46:01,760 --> 00:46:05,760
horizon and beyond. 
It was a sea, Danny thought 

917
00:46:06,040 --> 00:46:09,000
past. 
Here there were no hills, no 

918
00:46:09,000 --> 00:46:15,160
mountains, no trees nor cities 
nor roads, only the endless 

919
00:46:15,160 --> 00:46:19,320
grasses, the tall blades 
rippling like waves when the 

920
00:46:19,320 --> 00:46:22,960
winds blew. 
It's so green, she said. 

921
00:46:23,200 --> 00:46:26,440
Here now, Sir, George agreed. 
We ought to see it when it 

922
00:46:26,440 --> 00:46:30,960
blooms all dark red flowers from
horizon to horizon like a sea of

923
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:33,200
blood. 
Come the dry season and the 

924
00:46:33,200 --> 00:46:35,360
world turns the color of old 
bronze. 

925
00:46:36,040 --> 00:46:39,600
And this is only Hirana child. 
There are 100 kinds of grass out

926
00:46:39,600 --> 00:46:41,880
there. 
Grasses as yellow as lemon and 

927
00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:44,920
as dark as indigo. 
Blue grasses and orange grasses 

928
00:46:44,920 --> 00:46:49,280
and grasses like rainbows. 
Grasses like rainbows. 

929
00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:51,880
That is so cool. 
So This is why you can think of 

930
00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:53,800
it as wondrous because like, 
just imagine that it's kind of 

931
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:57,840
hard to, but the varying colors 
and the vast size of the place 

932
00:46:57,840 --> 00:47:00,560
is what I think qualifies it as 
a potential wonder. 

933
00:47:00,720 --> 00:47:05,080
Danny is odd and she's odd when 
it's green and having been to 

934
00:47:05,080 --> 00:47:08,960
like Ireland and places that has
this incredible greenery, it is 

935
00:47:08,960 --> 00:47:11,160
really spectacular. 
Even though it's just a solid 

936
00:47:11,160 --> 00:47:13,400
color and this is not a solid 
color, this is something you 

937
00:47:13,400 --> 00:47:15,920
would see all these varying 
colors for. 

938
00:47:15,960 --> 00:47:18,960
Another one the show just didn't
do justice to because it really 

939
00:47:18,960 --> 00:47:22,040
just looks like a pretty arid, 
boring place it. 

940
00:47:22,040 --> 00:47:23,800
Looks more like a step than a 
true grassland. 

941
00:47:23,800 --> 00:47:26,800
Yeah, yeah. 
Which is what a lot of people 

942
00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:28,760
think of when they think of the 
dysraki, because they are, to be

943
00:47:28,760 --> 00:47:32,480
fair, inspired by step peoples. 
But this is not, this is not the

944
00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:35,680
steps of Mongolia, right? 
This is, this is way different. 

945
00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:38,680
And you should not picture that 
because this is far more 

946
00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:41,960
wondrous and beautiful from the 
sound of it. 

947
00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:45,440
And yeah, again, this used to be
the Silver Sea. 

948
00:47:45,440 --> 00:47:47,240
So this is like what was the 
basin? 

949
00:47:47,240 --> 00:47:50,120
And many millennia later it's 
it's turned into this. 

950
00:47:50,360 --> 00:47:53,120
And that's the case with like 
the Great Plains of the US. 

951
00:47:53,120 --> 00:47:56,680
They they're not as beautiful as
this, but it also used to be a 

952
00:47:56,680 --> 00:47:59,480
sea, you know, an inland sea or 
the ocean or whatever, like 

953
00:47:59,480 --> 00:48:02,080
long, long, long time ago. 
When we're talking real, real, 

954
00:48:02,080 --> 00:48:04,480
long, like millions of years, 
which might also be the case 

955
00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:06,360
with Westeros, probably not, 
because I don't think humanity 

956
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:08,160
would would have a memory of it 
if that were the case. 

957
00:48:08,440 --> 00:48:12,640
When did Lomas travel here? 
Danny thought it was incredibly 

958
00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:14,760
beautiful when it was green, but
did Lomas see it when it was 

959
00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:17,920
green, or if if he saw it when 
it was rainbow colored, I've got

960
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:20,200
to think it made the list or was
a strong candidate. 

961
00:48:20,200 --> 00:48:23,000
And again, he saw the Palace of 
1000 rooms, so he definitely was

962
00:48:23,000 --> 00:48:24,680
there. 
But what season did he see it 

963
00:48:24,680 --> 00:48:26,000
in? 
Did he see it in purple season? 

964
00:48:26,000 --> 00:48:28,600
Did he see it in green season, 
red season, Did he see multiple 

965
00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:31,200
colors? 
Did green again, green alone 

966
00:48:31,200 --> 00:48:33,200
might have been enough, but I 
feel like if he saw some of 

967
00:48:33,200 --> 00:48:36,880
those other colors, he'd be 
like, whoa, there's that's just,

968
00:48:36,880 --> 00:48:38,560
there's nothing like it. 
I don't think there's anything 

969
00:48:38,560 --> 00:48:39,720
else like it in the world 
either. 

970
00:48:39,720 --> 00:48:42,200
We don't have like a comparison 
for this, and there's nothing 

971
00:48:42,200 --> 00:48:44,320
like it in the real world, at 
least not these colors. 

972
00:48:44,440 --> 00:48:46,640
The size and scope of the 
grassland. 

973
00:48:46,640 --> 00:48:48,440
Yes, there is something like 
There are things like that in 

974
00:48:48,440 --> 00:48:50,840
the real world, but not with 
colors, not with this beauty, 

975
00:48:50,840 --> 00:48:53,120
not with this vibrance. 
You know, that's one I don't 

976
00:48:53,160 --> 00:48:55,600
know factor when picking out a 
wonder. 

977
00:48:55,800 --> 00:48:58,560
And again, we've talked a lot 
about how there's not some 

978
00:48:58,560 --> 00:49:01,200
consistent scientific standard 
for all these. 

979
00:49:01,200 --> 00:49:06,560
But one thing that most of them 
have in common is you can look 

980
00:49:06,560 --> 00:49:11,200
at it and see it all at once. 
So I think that some of the 

981
00:49:11,200 --> 00:49:14,680
things that are, but you know, 
we might name as contenders, but

982
00:49:14,680 --> 00:49:18,040
they're so big, you can't really
see all of it at once or 

983
00:49:18,040 --> 00:49:20,640
something like this that you 
might have to see over time. 

984
00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:23,840
I think it makes it harder for 
them to count, or most likely 

985
00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:25,200
for Lomas to have named them, 
you know. 

986
00:49:25,200 --> 00:49:26,240
That's fair. 
That's fair. 

987
00:49:26,240 --> 00:49:28,960
I mean like some of them we we, 
we feel pretty good about like 

988
00:49:29,160 --> 00:49:30,040
the forest of cohort. 
Yeah. 

989
00:49:30,040 --> 00:49:31,880
You're not going to see it all 
but that's part of why it's so 

990
00:49:31,880 --> 00:49:33,560
impressive. 
And the the Mother Royne, like 

991
00:49:33,560 --> 00:49:35,680
you might be able to sail up 
every little tributary, but good

992
00:49:35,760 --> 00:49:40,600
good Lord, you don't need to to 
be to be impressed by it or to 

993
00:49:40,600 --> 00:49:43,520
see it as wondrous. 
The the ruin, for example, you. 

994
00:49:43,960 --> 00:49:45,920
There's no question of his 
existence. 

995
00:49:45,920 --> 00:49:49,720
It's not some legend from 
forest, you know, and you could 

996
00:49:49,720 --> 00:49:53,240
see some individual portions of 
it and and that be enough. 

997
00:49:53,520 --> 00:49:55,680
The forest. 
I'm suspicious of the forest for

998
00:49:55,680 --> 00:49:59,560
partly for this reason, because 
if you're standing, you know, at

999
00:49:59,560 --> 00:50:04,160
the edge of it, looking out, it 
may be wider or deeper than the 

1000
00:50:04,160 --> 00:50:06,440
other forests, but you can't 
really see that. 

1001
00:50:06,440 --> 00:50:09,400
You, you just just have to tell 
you this force is 3 times bigger

1002
00:50:09,400 --> 00:50:11,560
than anything Westeros, you 
know, like, yeah, sure it is. 

1003
00:50:11,560 --> 00:50:14,520
You know, like it's even if you 
actually believe them, it's so 

1004
00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:16,880
hard to process or witness that 
all at once. 

1005
00:50:16,880 --> 00:50:18,920
So it's like a point. 
Suspicious but. 

1006
00:50:19,560 --> 00:50:24,440
I can see that argument now. 
The largest real life grassland 

1007
00:50:24,440 --> 00:50:28,640
is 570,000 square kilometers. 
It's called the Lanos Ianos 

1008
00:50:28,640 --> 00:50:29,800
grassland. 
I'm not sure how to pronounce 

1009
00:50:29,800 --> 00:50:31,200
it. 
They're near the Andes in the 

1010
00:50:31,200 --> 00:50:34,920
Amazon River, but that's 
different from the largest step,

1011
00:50:34,920 --> 00:50:38,600
which is sort of a grassland, 
but not steps aren't necessarily

1012
00:50:38,600 --> 00:50:42,160
considered grasslands, but it's 
kind of debatable, I guess This 

1013
00:50:42,160 --> 00:50:44,880
is, this is kind of unclear to 
me, but the Eurasian steps are 

1014
00:50:44,880 --> 00:50:47,200
much larger, for they go from 
Hungary all the way to China, 

1015
00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:49,760
and that's very similar to the 
Dothraki Sea in terms of its 

1016
00:50:49,760 --> 00:50:52,120
real world parallel, not 
necessarily the grass, but the 

1017
00:50:52,120 --> 00:50:55,240
region, because it's the 
Dothraki collective. 

1018
00:50:55,240 --> 00:50:58,040
Meaning the various inspirations
for the Dothraki are the various

1019
00:50:58,040 --> 00:51:02,440
step peoples that have emerged 
from these Eurasian steps, 

1020
00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:06,000
whether it's the Allens, the 
Huns, the Kipchaks, the the 

1021
00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:09,240
Turks, the OR the Mongols, for 
example. 

1022
00:51:09,240 --> 00:51:12,680
There, it's a there's a it's a 
mishmash of all of these, and 

1023
00:51:13,080 --> 00:51:16,120
these grasslands are represented
here in a similar way. 

1024
00:51:17,160 --> 00:51:22,200
Let us now move on to the next 
one, the Bone Mountains. 

1025
00:51:22,360 --> 00:51:24,480
This is one of my favourites 
quote. 

1026
00:51:24,600 --> 00:51:28,520
The hills grow Wilder and 
steeper, and soon enough the 

1027
00:51:28,520 --> 00:51:32,440
mountains appear in the far 
distance, their great peaks 

1028
00:51:32,440 --> 00:51:37,200
seeming to float against the 
eastern sky, Blue, Gray giants, 

1029
00:51:37,200 --> 00:51:42,600
so huge and jagged and menacing 
that even Lomas long strider, 

1030
00:51:42,800 --> 00:51:47,400
that dauntless wanderer, if his 
tales be true, lost heart at the

1031
00:51:47,400 --> 00:51:52,800
sight of them, believing that he
had at last reached the ends of 

1032
00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:55,920
the earth. 
Also, they're called bleak on 

1033
00:51:55,920 --> 00:52:00,160
his inhospitable peaks. 
And and an immense Stonewall. 

1034
00:52:00,520 --> 00:52:02,440
It's crazy. 
Now, this is a good example of 

1035
00:52:02,440 --> 00:52:04,480
what Sean was saying. 
Like this is a huge mountain 

1036
00:52:04,480 --> 00:52:06,640
range that stresses across 
stretches across the entire 

1037
00:52:06,640 --> 00:52:08,360
continent. 
He surely didn't just like start

1038
00:52:08,360 --> 00:52:10,280
at the top and walk South and 
see the whole thing. 

1039
00:52:10,720 --> 00:52:14,200
So what portion did he see? 
You know, did he go east from 

1040
00:52:14,200 --> 00:52:16,880
the mother of mountains and then
go and see that or did he had 

1041
00:52:16,880 --> 00:52:19,720
east from Karth which I think is
more likely because we 

1042
00:52:19,720 --> 00:52:21,720
definitely know he saw the 
triple walls of Karth. 

1043
00:52:21,720 --> 00:52:22,680
And so that would kind of make 
sense. 

1044
00:52:22,680 --> 00:52:26,960
He would follow the caravan Rd. 
which you know and he but he 

1045
00:52:26,960 --> 00:52:29,200
also went to Sarnoir which is 
kind of in the center of all 

1046
00:52:29,200 --> 00:52:31,480
that, like it's it's between 
these two. 

1047
00:52:31,520 --> 00:52:33,680
So he really could have seen 
multiple regions of the Bone 

1048
00:52:33,680 --> 00:52:36,280
Mountains, quite possible. 
It's also unknown whether he 

1049
00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:38,800
passed through them or what took
ship around them. 

1050
00:52:39,160 --> 00:52:43,160
I tend to think he took one of 
the pass through even though he 

1051
00:52:43,160 --> 00:52:44,640
quote lost heart at the sight of
them. 

1052
00:52:45,520 --> 00:52:47,640
Well, once he got closer he 
would discover that there are 

1053
00:52:47,640 --> 00:52:48,520
people that know the way 
through. 

1054
00:52:48,520 --> 00:52:49,920
There are guys that could find 
him way through. 

1055
00:52:49,920 --> 00:52:52,720
So he probably did go there and 
go through, especially because 

1056
00:52:52,720 --> 00:52:55,320
we know he went to Ashai and ET,
which are absolutely on the 

1057
00:52:55,320 --> 00:52:57,680
other side of those mountains. 
One way or another, he got past 

1058
00:52:57,680 --> 00:52:58,640
them. 
We just don't know what he 

1059
00:52:58,640 --> 00:53:00,840
walked or not. 
Is it possible that he saw them 

1060
00:53:00,880 --> 00:53:03,440
from one side and in a different
voyage saw them from another 

1061
00:53:03,440 --> 00:53:04,680
side or angle or? 
Whatever. 

1062
00:53:04,680 --> 00:53:07,000
Yeah, yeah, definitely. 
Because he definitely saw the 

1063
00:53:07,000 --> 00:53:09,840
cities on the other side by 
Asabad Samiriana and Kaya 

1064
00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:11,600
Kayanaya. 
He's definitely saw those. 

1065
00:53:11,600 --> 00:53:14,880
And those are just like right up
on the mountains, like carved 

1066
00:53:14,880 --> 00:53:17,520
into them, like they're mountain
fortresses, basically, mountain 

1067
00:53:17,520 --> 00:53:19,000
cities. 
So yeah, he had to have seen 

1068
00:53:19,000 --> 00:53:20,960
them from both sides. 
That's the image we have on the 

1069
00:53:20,960 --> 00:53:24,120
screen is of Biasabad in the 
Bone Mountains. 

1070
00:53:24,120 --> 00:53:25,560
Very nice, yeah. 
We've got some really good 

1071
00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:26,800
images. 
A lot of them are from unseen 

1072
00:53:26,800 --> 00:53:29,120
Westeros, which we mentioned 
last time. 

1073
00:53:29,120 --> 00:53:32,120
Always deserves a shout out. 
So good car throws a lot of 

1074
00:53:32,120 --> 00:53:33,880
trade to the east too. 
So it would also make a lot of 

1075
00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:36,320
sense for Lomas just to like 
hook up with a caravan, you 

1076
00:53:36,320 --> 00:53:38,520
know, I'm going to ride with 
Y'all for safety, you know, 

1077
00:53:38,520 --> 00:53:41,880
that's it's a common way to 
travel for a solo person. 

1078
00:53:41,880 --> 00:53:44,880
A lot less dangerous than a 
ship. 

1079
00:53:45,120 --> 00:53:48,880
You know these caravan roads are
super old and have been going 

1080
00:53:48,880 --> 00:53:51,080
back and forth for a long way. 
They're pretty safe and and you 

1081
00:53:51,200 --> 00:53:53,480
think they have the experience 
to protect themselves properly 

1082
00:53:53,480 --> 00:53:56,600
against whatever might happen 
and know who to pay off for 

1083
00:53:56,600 --> 00:53:59,600
protection and etcetera. 
You know, So it seems like, 

1084
00:53:59,600 --> 00:54:02,560
yeah, travel with people that 
have gone that way before and 

1085
00:54:02,560 --> 00:54:05,800
avoid the dangers of the sea. 
And one of the reasons they seem

1086
00:54:05,800 --> 00:54:09,560
very a very strong candidate is 
just Lomas's reaction is very 

1087
00:54:09,560 --> 00:54:11,480
telling, right. 
He's he's like lost heart. 

1088
00:54:11,760 --> 00:54:16,840
This is a guy that's an 
explorer, like he is pro going 

1089
00:54:16,840 --> 00:54:19,040
all over the place and this made
him lose heart. 

1090
00:54:19,040 --> 00:54:21,160
That's really saying something. 
This isn't like you or me being 

1091
00:54:21,160 --> 00:54:22,960
like, Oh my God, that looks 
really difficult. 

1092
00:54:22,960 --> 00:54:24,840
This is a guy that lives for 
that sort of thing. 

1093
00:54:24,840 --> 00:54:27,240
And it was, it was like a it was
intimidating to him. 

1094
00:54:27,800 --> 00:54:30,680
Like if you're a world traveler,
a guy who just got his 

1095
00:54:30,680 --> 00:54:32,440
wanderlust and will go just 
about anywhere. 

1096
00:54:32,440 --> 00:54:34,600
If you see something that if 
this person is intimidated by 

1097
00:54:34,600 --> 00:54:37,000
something, well, yeah, that that
really says a lot. 

1098
00:54:37,160 --> 00:54:41,720
That he was big in his feels 
when he saw that, like, Oh my 

1099
00:54:41,720 --> 00:54:44,320
God, I'm not. 
How can I possibly cross that? 

1100
00:54:44,320 --> 00:54:46,480
How can I possibly deal with 
that? 

1101
00:54:46,480 --> 00:54:47,960
Maybe I can't traverse it. 
Maybe. 

1102
00:54:47,960 --> 00:54:48,960
What's? 
What's the line? 

1103
00:54:48,960 --> 00:54:50,320
They should have sent a poet. 
They. 

1104
00:54:50,640 --> 00:54:54,480
Should have sent a poet quoted 
by both. 

1105
00:54:54,480 --> 00:54:56,880
Wait, which character in contact
said that? 

1106
00:54:56,880 --> 00:54:59,000
I just remember, of course, 
Frank Reynolds saying it on It's

1107
00:54:59,000 --> 00:55:00,560
Always Sunny in Philadelphia, 
but. 

1108
00:55:00,760 --> 00:55:02,000
Was it Ellie? 
I think it was. 

1109
00:55:02,160 --> 00:55:03,560
That was her name. 
Jodie Foster's character. 

1110
00:55:03,560 --> 00:55:04,960
Was that? 
Was it Jodie Foster who said it 

1111
00:55:04,960 --> 00:55:06,320
OK? 
I was remember For her character

1112
00:55:06,320 --> 00:55:07,440
or not. 
Yeah, that's good. 

1113
00:55:07,840 --> 00:55:11,800
He would have also haven't seen 
the Red Mountains, the mountains

1114
00:55:11,800 --> 00:55:15,120
of the moon, probably the 
Painted Mountains 'cause they're

1115
00:55:15,640 --> 00:55:18,400
closer to him if he's traveling 
E before seeing the Bone 

1116
00:55:18,400 --> 00:55:20,600
Mountain. 
So he would have seen several 

1117
00:55:20,600 --> 00:55:23,280
great mountain ranges and then 
be like, Oh my God, this one's 

1118
00:55:23,280 --> 00:55:25,240
so much bigger than all those 
other ones. 

1119
00:55:25,600 --> 00:55:26,680
How can this be? 
So? 

1120
00:55:26,680 --> 00:55:29,000
I can see why he was so 
impressed and even perhaps 

1121
00:55:29,000 --> 00:55:32,640
despondent. 
In Denver, just the western 

1122
00:55:32,680 --> 00:55:34,600
horizon is just a mountain 
range. 

1123
00:55:34,600 --> 00:55:37,760
It's just, you know, the Rocky 
Mountains and I and when I look 

1124
00:55:37,760 --> 00:55:40,480
at it, when I I still haven't 
gotten used to it and I still 

1125
00:55:40,480 --> 00:55:43,200
like in awe of how beautiful and
the massive it is. 

1126
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:47,040
The Himalayas are five times 
taller. 

1127
00:55:47,880 --> 00:55:50,200
I just can't like, like 
sometimes when I look at it the 

1128
00:55:50,200 --> 00:55:53,840
way there's like, you know, 
waves of ranges, you know, you 

1129
00:55:53,840 --> 00:55:56,920
could see like the the the first
ones are, the lighting is a 

1130
00:55:56,920 --> 00:55:58,560
little different. 
They're not quite as high. 

1131
00:55:58,560 --> 00:56:00,200
Then next you can see the snow 
captain. 

1132
00:56:00,200 --> 00:56:04,720
Like, I can't imagine that going
up 2345 more levels. 

1133
00:56:04,720 --> 00:56:08,200
I also would be daunted, like I 
don't understand how any human 

1134
00:56:08,440 --> 00:56:11,720
could ever get across there 
without an airplane. 

1135
00:56:12,240 --> 00:56:14,640
With an airplane even. 
Yeah, I mean, especially if we 

1136
00:56:14,640 --> 00:56:17,880
think that Lomas would have done
a certain amount of surveying of

1137
00:56:17,880 --> 00:56:21,600
other mountain ranges both in 
Westeros and s s before he 

1138
00:56:21,600 --> 00:56:25,200
reached the Bone Mountains. 
So he had that context. 

1139
00:56:25,200 --> 00:56:28,440
He had his, his, his Rockies in 
Denver, You know he was like 

1140
00:56:28,920 --> 00:56:31,960
this like cast of The Rock is is
nothing compared to this 

1141
00:56:31,960 --> 00:56:35,080
etcetera. 
And it's also the longest 

1142
00:56:35,080 --> 00:56:37,520
mountain range by far. 
It's also just the the sheer, 

1143
00:56:37,520 --> 00:56:40,480
not just the sheer height, but 
length and girth. 

1144
00:56:40,480 --> 00:56:42,800
And yeah, it's got, it's got all
the superlatives. 

1145
00:56:43,760 --> 00:56:46,200
It's very impressive. 
Oh yes, that's why they're the 

1146
00:56:46,200 --> 00:56:49,560
Bone Mountains, right. 
The spine of the world I think 

1147
00:56:49,560 --> 00:56:52,600
is an influence there. 
And that's this is not the only 

1148
00:56:52,600 --> 00:56:55,880
time that we will reference 
Wheel of Time 'cause there's a 

1149
00:56:56,040 --> 00:56:57,800
the spine of the world is a 
thing in Wheel of Time. 

1150
00:56:57,800 --> 00:57:00,200
And yeah, we've got another 
parallel to to Wheel of Time 

1151
00:57:00,200 --> 00:57:02,320
coming later. 
Now there another interesting 

1152
00:57:02,320 --> 00:57:06,120
thing about them is the the way 
they frame what's around them. 

1153
00:57:06,120 --> 00:57:09,400
We've talked about how the Red 
mountains are the reason why 

1154
00:57:09,400 --> 00:57:13,240
there's a desert and Dorne on 
one side and fertile green on 

1155
00:57:13,240 --> 00:57:14,960
the other side. 
This is a common real world 

1156
00:57:14,960 --> 00:57:16,560
feature, cause mountains trap 
moisture. 

1157
00:57:16,560 --> 00:57:20,560
So you have the winds blowing 
mostly One Direction and then 

1158
00:57:20,560 --> 00:57:22,680
that that moisture is captured 
by these mountains. 

1159
00:57:23,000 --> 00:57:25,520
And that's why the Dothraki Sea 
is so big. 

1160
00:57:25,680 --> 00:57:29,080
It stands to reason that if a 
mountain range can do that, a 

1161
00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:31,760
bigger mountain range will do it
even more so. 

1162
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:35,320
So it created the Great Grass 
Sea on one side, or at least 

1163
00:57:35,360 --> 00:57:37,400
supported the creation of the 
Great Grass Sea. 

1164
00:57:37,400 --> 00:57:38,960
It's probably vital to its 
existence. 

1165
00:57:39,240 --> 00:57:42,520
And on the other side of the 
Bone Mountains is the Great Sand

1166
00:57:42,520 --> 00:57:46,120
Sea, which is there you go. 
It's the same pattern of real 

1167
00:57:46,120 --> 00:57:48,560
world, geographical or 
geological features. 

1168
00:57:48,560 --> 00:57:52,880
Mountains do that. 
And I think it's entirely 

1169
00:57:52,880 --> 00:57:56,080
possible that the Bone Mountains
deserve to be a wonder for 

1170
00:57:56,080 --> 00:58:00,400
several reasons, one of which is
they may have a key role in 

1171
00:58:00,400 --> 00:58:03,720
creating two of the other great 
world wonders, the Great Grassy 

1172
00:58:03,720 --> 00:58:06,760
and the Great Sand Sea. 
So no other wonder I know of can

1173
00:58:06,760 --> 00:58:10,360
really claim that fame. 
Maybe the Royne can claim some 

1174
00:58:10,360 --> 00:58:15,360
credit for the Forest cohort, 
for example, but it's hard to 

1175
00:58:15,880 --> 00:58:19,000
that's not necessarily the case.
And it's not like you have to 

1176
00:58:19,000 --> 00:58:20,440
pick the bone mountain instead 
of the roaring. 

1177
00:58:20,440 --> 00:58:22,720
It could just be both of them. 
Yes, exactly. 

1178
00:58:22,720 --> 00:58:25,440
Now, we can quite possibly pick 
all of these, or since we have 

1179
00:58:25,440 --> 00:58:28,240
so many candidates that we have 
so many slots to fill in. 

1180
00:58:28,640 --> 00:58:32,240
But here's another quote 
describing those roads that 

1181
00:58:32,240 --> 00:58:35,160
we're talking about, which is 
possibly how Lomas made his way 

1182
00:58:35,160 --> 00:58:40,360
through. 1000 Roads lead into 
the bones, Wise men say from 

1183
00:58:40,360 --> 00:58:46,400
karth to cohort, but only three 
lead out as impassable as the 

1184
00:58:46,400 --> 00:58:50,680
bones appears from afar. 
There are indeed hundreds of 

1185
00:58:50,680 --> 00:58:56,280
footpaths, goat tracks, game 
trails, stream beds, and slopes 

1186
00:58:56,280 --> 00:59:00,520
by which travellers, traders and
adventurers may find their way 

1187
00:59:00,520 --> 00:59:05,320
into the heart of the mountains.
In certain places, ancient 

1188
00:59:05,320 --> 00:59:10,280
carved steps and hidden tunnels 
and passages exist for those who

1189
00:59:10,280 --> 00:59:14,320
know how to find them. 
Yet many of these paths are 

1190
00:59:14,320 --> 00:59:19,640
treacherous, and others are dead
ends or traps for the unwary. 

1191
00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:23,320
Loma says the mountain warriors 
of Kaia, Kai, Anaya, Sumeriana 

1192
00:59:23,320 --> 00:59:25,800
and Bayasabad are the fiercest 
fighters in the world. 

1193
00:59:26,080 --> 00:59:30,000
And they're they're women. 
And of course, each of those 

1194
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:35,560
three places represents the path
along one of those three roads. 

1195
00:59:35,560 --> 00:59:38,640
Those key three roads which are 
the Steel Rd., the Stone Rd. and

1196
00:59:38,640 --> 00:59:41,080
the Sand Rd. 
Now with these carved steps and 

1197
00:59:41,080 --> 00:59:44,440
paths, that sounds awesome. 
It reminds me a little bit of 

1198
00:59:44,520 --> 00:59:47,920
Petra, one of the more modern 
man made wonders of the world 

1199
00:59:47,920 --> 00:59:51,960
which is carved into like a this
large sort of castle ish kind of

1200
00:59:52,480 --> 00:59:57,080
edifice that's carved into the 
mountains and is old. 

1201
00:59:57,080 --> 00:59:59,640
And it's not entirely sure who 
made Petra, which is kind of 

1202
00:59:59,640 --> 01:00:02,760
neat, but this doesn't refer to 
the fortresses, although it just

1203
01:00:02,760 --> 01:00:04,920
refers to steps and passages. 
Kind of assume there are some 

1204
01:00:04,920 --> 01:00:07,320
fortresses there, as well as 
these mountain cities, These 

1205
01:00:07,320 --> 01:00:09,000
mountain fortresses, which seems
kind of similar. 

1206
01:00:09,640 --> 01:00:12,080
But, but it's another example of
where the Citadel's knowledge is

1207
01:00:12,080 --> 01:00:15,840
probably somewhat lacking, 
because this is, again, the 

1208
01:00:15,840 --> 01:00:17,920
farther E you go, the less they 
seem to know. 

1209
01:00:17,920 --> 01:00:20,320
And this is very Far East. 
I mean, anything on the farther 

1210
01:00:20,320 --> 01:00:23,480
side of the bones is even 
farther away just by distance, 

1211
01:00:23,480 --> 01:00:26,320
because that's it's one thing to
go 10 miles or 20 miles or 50 

1212
01:00:26,320 --> 01:00:28,200
miles. 
When those 50 miles or 100 miles

1213
01:00:28,200 --> 01:00:30,160
are across the largest mountain 
range in the world, it's it's a 

1214
01:00:30,160 --> 01:00:32,560
different 100 miles than 100 
miles of the grass, sea or 

1215
01:00:32,560 --> 01:00:33,880
Caravan Rd. you know what I 
mean? 

1216
01:00:34,120 --> 01:00:36,960
So it's in effect, it's even 
farther away once you get on the

1217
01:00:37,000 --> 01:00:40,360
other side of that border. 
Let's actually quote the Atlas 

1218
01:00:40,360 --> 01:00:43,040
of Ice and Fire blog and and 
hear what Adam Whitehead has to 

1219
01:00:43,040 --> 01:00:44,720
say here, because it's very 
interesting. 

1220
01:00:45,120 --> 01:00:49,600
A colossal series of mountain 
ranges which start off being big

1221
01:00:49,800 --> 01:00:54,400
and then get even bigger, each 
range getting way to an even 

1222
01:00:54,400 --> 01:00:58,440
more massive 1. 
Beyond it, the bones stretch for

1223
01:00:58,440 --> 01:01:04,560
over 2100 miles from north to 
South and are almost 300 miles 

1224
01:01:04,560 --> 01:01:08,520
across at their widest point. 
Compare this to the Himalayas, 

1225
01:01:08,720 --> 01:01:14,400
which extend in an arc for only 
approximately 1500 miles and are

1226
01:01:14,400 --> 01:01:17,800
about 200 miles wide at their 
widest point. 

1227
01:01:18,120 --> 01:01:22,920
It is possibly on this basis, 
and given the greater size of 

1228
01:01:22,920 --> 01:01:27,000
the planet, that the tallest 
peak of the bones are even 

1229
01:01:27,000 --> 01:01:30,440
taller than Everest. 
Now I read a commenter on Adam's

1230
01:01:30,440 --> 01:01:33,040
blog that suggests actually 
since Planetos is probably 

1231
01:01:33,040 --> 01:01:35,960
larger than Earth, that the 
mountains should be shorter on 

1232
01:01:35,960 --> 01:01:37,320
average. 
Like the bigger the planet the 

1233
01:01:37,320 --> 01:01:40,040
smaller the mountains will be 
because you have like the fault 

1234
01:01:40,040 --> 01:01:42,120
lines would be different and 
they would push things up. 

1235
01:01:42,120 --> 01:01:44,200
It's more gravity pulling in. 
More gravity. 

1236
01:01:44,200 --> 01:01:45,880
Good point. 
It's a lot on the time when the 

1237
01:01:45,880 --> 01:01:47,640
mountains are creating, how 
they're creating things like 

1238
01:01:47,640 --> 01:01:48,440
that too. 
Yeah. 

1239
01:01:48,640 --> 01:01:51,440
For example, you mentioned the 
Rockies, the Appalachian 

1240
01:01:51,440 --> 01:01:54,240
Mountains, or the other great 
mountain range in the US The 

1241
01:01:54,240 --> 01:01:56,360
Appalachians are way shorter and
less impressive, but they're 

1242
01:01:56,360 --> 01:01:59,640
way, way older than the Rockies,
which is part of why they've had

1243
01:01:59,640 --> 01:02:02,680
a longer time to erode and 
shrink and etcetera. 

1244
01:02:02,800 --> 01:02:04,800
Not that the Rockies are young. 
They're still hundreds of 

1245
01:02:04,800 --> 01:02:07,120
millions of years old, but 
they're young in terms of the 

1246
01:02:07,120 --> 01:02:09,400
Appalachians and yeah, 
relatively. 

1247
01:02:09,400 --> 01:02:11,280
And the Himalayas. 
I'm not sure how old the 

1248
01:02:11,280 --> 01:02:13,520
Himalayas are, but it's possible
they used to be taller, too, and

1249
01:02:13,600 --> 01:02:15,760
they're probably not at their 
peak height. 

1250
01:02:15,760 --> 01:02:17,600
Get it? 
Yeah, you get it. 

1251
01:02:17,600 --> 01:02:20,280
I think the Himalayas, I 
probably should research this 

1252
01:02:20,280 --> 01:02:23,880
more, but I I think they're more
of the result of like land being

1253
01:02:23,880 --> 01:02:27,200
pushed into each other and it 
going up from a fault line where

1254
01:02:27,200 --> 01:02:30,000
they think the Rockies were like
carved out by glaciers coming 

1255
01:02:30,000 --> 01:02:31,080
down. 
OK. 

1256
01:02:31,080 --> 01:02:32,000
Yeah. 
So there's different ways. 

1257
01:02:32,120 --> 01:02:34,440
And and Adam, you see he got 
those numbers in there and 

1258
01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:36,560
that's just from him measuring 
things on the map and 

1259
01:02:36,560 --> 01:02:38,880
extrapolating distances like we 
know how long a wall is. 

1260
01:02:38,880 --> 01:02:41,880
So you can measure the wall on a
map and kind of compare that to 

1261
01:02:41,880 --> 01:02:44,800
other places around the world 
and get a rough guesstimate 

1262
01:02:44,800 --> 01:02:46,440
based on that. 
It's a pretty good way to do it.

1263
01:02:46,440 --> 01:02:48,800
Yeah, Rough because it's so 
again, it's think about our 

1264
01:02:48,800 --> 01:02:51,120
world maps and how skewed they 
are. 

1265
01:02:51,120 --> 01:02:54,800
I can't help but think that 
there's some element of that 

1266
01:02:54,800 --> 01:02:59,880
that would go on there, but 
still you can get a rough guess.

1267
01:02:59,880 --> 01:03:02,280
Yeah, I appreciate the the 
effort for sure. 

1268
01:03:02,280 --> 01:03:04,040
I think it's the best numbers we
have. 

1269
01:03:04,040 --> 01:03:07,760
That's for that's also for sure 
and and this matches the eye 

1270
01:03:07,760 --> 01:03:10,160
test. 
This hugeness that Adam is is 

1271
01:03:10,400 --> 01:03:14,440
relating here with numbers 
matches what Lomas seemed to 

1272
01:03:14,440 --> 01:03:17,520
have felt when he saw them 
because he they just dwarfed 

1273
01:03:17,520 --> 01:03:19,480
everything else he'd seen 
mountain wise before that. 

1274
01:03:19,480 --> 01:03:21,560
Like he had probably seen the 
Giants Lance the tallest 

1275
01:03:21,560 --> 01:03:23,400
mountain Westeros almost 
certainly like why would he have

1276
01:03:23,400 --> 01:03:25,480
not checked that one out? 
Like would he not go to the 

1277
01:03:25,480 --> 01:03:27,280
eerie. 
Of course he did right that 

1278
01:03:27,280 --> 01:03:29,720
seems almost almost impossible 
that he wouldn't at least check 

1279
01:03:29,720 --> 01:03:33,560
out the sights in Westeros. 
You know so. 

1280
01:03:33,560 --> 01:03:35,080
But beyond that, it's hard to 
assume. 

1281
01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:39,080
So they're they're so huge as 
well that they really not only 

1282
01:03:39,080 --> 01:03:44,240
do they just serve as a a huge 
barrier, but they to to 

1283
01:03:44,240 --> 01:03:47,440
geographical features and 
affecting the climate on either 

1284
01:03:47,440 --> 01:03:49,360
side. 
But it's also like a way to keep

1285
01:03:49,360 --> 01:03:52,760
civilizations apart, right? 
It's basically impassable for 

1286
01:03:52,760 --> 01:03:55,360
most civilizations. 
Seafaring civilizations would be

1287
01:03:55,360 --> 01:03:58,480
a little different. 
But most civilizations are not. 

1288
01:03:58,480 --> 01:04:01,480
Seafaring or not, it's it's not 
the biggest part of their 

1289
01:04:01,480 --> 01:04:03,720
culture. 
So most people would have been 

1290
01:04:03,720 --> 01:04:06,960
stuck on one side or the other 
for most human existence. 

1291
01:04:07,680 --> 01:04:10,800
That by itself is a potential 
reason for Lomas. 

1292
01:04:10,800 --> 01:04:13,560
To to label them was like this 
this thing, this natural thing 

1293
01:04:13,560 --> 01:04:17,360
that keeps civilizations apart, 
that keeps cultures apart. 

1294
01:04:17,360 --> 01:04:19,760
There's almost nothing like it. 
Like the Force of Cohort doesn't

1295
01:04:19,760 --> 01:04:21,840
do that. 
Oceans do that. 

1296
01:04:21,840 --> 01:04:24,280
But for more obvious reasons, 
you know, that's the only other 

1297
01:04:24,280 --> 01:04:26,520
necessarily comparable example 
there. 

1298
01:04:27,400 --> 01:04:30,720
Like the the deep swamps of the 
neck are a deterrent to 

1299
01:04:30,720 --> 01:04:33,600
invaders, but they don't keep 
like foot traffic or merchants 

1300
01:04:33,600 --> 01:04:34,640
in and out like that. 
There's plenty. 

1301
01:04:34,640 --> 01:04:37,080
It's pretty easy to go back and 
forth and that if you're not 

1302
01:04:37,080 --> 01:04:41,560
like a invading or something. 
And like a swamp isn't a wonder 

1303
01:04:41,560 --> 01:04:43,400
to behold either. 
No, you're right. 

1304
01:04:43,400 --> 01:04:46,600
And oceans are sort of pervasive
around the world too than that 

1305
01:04:46,600 --> 01:04:48,600
That's unique thing that you 
come upon so. 

1306
01:04:48,760 --> 01:04:51,960
And also, just in general, it 
seems like Lomas didn't do a lot

1307
01:04:51,960 --> 01:04:53,720
of sailing. 
It feels to me like he avoided 

1308
01:04:53,720 --> 01:04:55,640
sailing whenever possible. 
He took the overland routes 

1309
01:04:55,640 --> 01:04:58,160
whenever possible, partly 
because you're more likely to 

1310
01:04:58,160 --> 01:05:01,520
see something impressive on land
and you also have more ability 

1311
01:05:01,520 --> 01:05:03,680
to stop and go look at it like 
if you're on someone else's 

1312
01:05:03,680 --> 01:05:05,480
ship, you can be like, hey dude,
can you sail over there for a 

1313
01:05:05,480 --> 01:05:06,480
minute? 
Let me take a look at that. 

1314
01:05:06,480 --> 01:05:11,440
Like, no, sorry, I'm. 
I got somewhere to be. 

1315
01:05:11,440 --> 01:05:12,960
This we're on a schedule here, 
you know. 

1316
01:05:12,960 --> 01:05:15,920
You know, we're not. 
We can't move at the speed of of

1317
01:05:16,480 --> 01:05:20,200
you know, world explorer 
charting things, you know, so he

1318
01:05:20,200 --> 01:05:22,640
would have more leeway to do 
what he wanted on foot. 

1319
01:05:24,280 --> 01:05:27,720
All right let's let's take a 
little break here and come back 

1320
01:05:27,720 --> 01:05:32,600
with a lot more wonders. 
If you want to continue to hear 

1321
01:05:32,600 --> 01:05:36,640
content like this, if you listen
to us regularly, maybe it's time

1322
01:05:36,640 --> 01:05:38,840
to sign up to just support us on
Patreon. 

1323
01:05:38,840 --> 01:05:40,000
You know, that's how that's how 
I do it. 

1324
01:05:40,040 --> 01:05:42,920
The the shows I listen to the 
most or watch the most. 

1325
01:05:43,280 --> 01:05:46,040
The creators that I engage with 
the most are the ones that I 

1326
01:05:46,040 --> 01:05:48,040
support on Patreon. 
The ones that we as a podcast 

1327
01:05:48,040 --> 01:05:49,720
support. 
If you go to our page, you can 

1328
01:05:49,720 --> 01:05:52,760
see that we're supporting a a 
large group of of artists and 

1329
01:05:52,760 --> 01:05:54,920
other podcasts and other things 
here and there. 

1330
01:05:54,920 --> 01:05:57,560
Mostly things that fall into 
those two categories are and 

1331
01:05:57,560 --> 01:05:58,920
other podcasts, but other things
too. 

1332
01:05:59,560 --> 01:06:01,240
Writers. 
Writers, yeah. 

1333
01:06:01,240 --> 01:06:02,880
And we support. 
Yeah. 

1334
01:06:02,880 --> 01:06:04,240
There's other people on there 
too. 

1335
01:06:04,640 --> 01:06:10,000
It's a good list of things that 
we support, and I think that's 

1336
01:06:10,000 --> 01:06:12,040
just a good way to go about it. 
The things that you consume the 

1337
01:06:12,040 --> 01:06:16,440
most are probably the ones that 
you should subscribe to support,

1338
01:06:16,560 --> 01:06:18,320
tell your friends about. 
I mean, you probably do that 

1339
01:06:18,320 --> 01:06:19,640
already if it's one of your 
favorites. 

1340
01:06:19,840 --> 01:06:22,800
If we happen to qualify for 
that, consider signing up at 

1341
01:06:22,800 --> 01:06:26,160
historyofwesteros.patreon.com. 
And it's not just about 

1342
01:06:26,160 --> 01:06:28,000
supporting us. 
We give you things in return, 

1343
01:06:28,000 --> 01:06:32,800
like access to scripts, access 
to our bonus episodes, which is 

1344
01:06:32,800 --> 01:06:34,520
probably the best perk. 
We got a lot of them now. 

1345
01:06:34,520 --> 01:06:37,200
I've lost count of how many 
bonus episodes you get, but it's

1346
01:06:37,200 --> 01:06:38,520
a lot. 
It's several dozen. 

1347
01:06:38,520 --> 01:06:41,200
Some of them are scripted, some 
of them are panels we did at 

1348
01:06:41,200 --> 01:06:43,640
conventions. 
Some of them are just kind of 

1349
01:06:43,640 --> 01:06:46,040
regular discussion episodes of 
variety. 

1350
01:06:46,040 --> 01:06:47,720
We got guest episodes as well in
there. 

1351
01:06:47,960 --> 01:06:51,960
All all the basic selections you
might find in our public 

1352
01:06:51,960 --> 01:06:54,200
catalog. 
A smaller version is found in 

1353
01:06:54,200 --> 01:06:57,720
our private catalog. 
Also, in terms of supporting us 

1354
01:06:57,720 --> 01:07:01,080
by sharing us with your friends,
with House of the Dragon season 

1355
01:07:01,080 --> 01:07:03,320
coming up, that's the prime time
to do it. 

1356
01:07:03,320 --> 01:07:06,240
There's a whole host of friends 
I'm sure you'll have who are 

1357
01:07:06,240 --> 01:07:11,440
more casual fans of House With 
the Dragon, and it really could 

1358
01:07:11,440 --> 01:07:14,440
do a lot for us if you just 
suggest that they watch our 

1359
01:07:14,440 --> 01:07:17,280
synopses or coverage during the 
season. 

1360
01:07:17,280 --> 01:07:20,080
Something that I meant to 
mention earlier in the episode 

1361
01:07:20,080 --> 01:07:23,280
that I skipped over. 
We had Alt Shift X and Glidis 

1362
01:07:23,280 --> 01:07:25,560
visiting us last week and that 
was a lot of fun. 

1363
01:07:25,560 --> 01:07:27,640
We got to show them America 
because they're Australian 

1364
01:07:27,640 --> 01:07:33,520
folks, and we did a podcast 
recording for Alt Shift XS 

1365
01:07:33,520 --> 01:07:37,360
Channel for his patrons, and it 
was about the Tough voyaging 

1366
01:07:37,360 --> 01:07:41,200
series that George R Martin has 
written and the first of which 

1367
01:07:41,200 --> 01:07:45,000
has been adapted as a graphic 
novel by Rhea Golden, who was 

1368
01:07:45,240 --> 01:07:47,640
one of his assistants as well as
a career artist. 

1369
01:07:47,640 --> 01:07:51,800
She's really good. 
And we made a joke during it 

1370
01:07:51,800 --> 01:07:55,720
that in George's Thousand Worlds
series that he loves the horror 

1371
01:07:55,800 --> 01:08:00,160
sound like there's The Rangan's,
The Hoon, the there's a few 

1372
01:08:00,160 --> 01:08:02,160
others that are missing. 
And what is the what is that 

1373
01:08:02,160 --> 01:08:04,680
grass called in the Dothraki Sea
Crana. 

1374
01:08:05,360 --> 01:08:09,120
So it was like another he loves 
that HR thing, he just loves for

1375
01:08:09,120 --> 01:08:12,520
him That sounds like good 
generic foreign sound that's not

1376
01:08:12,520 --> 01:08:15,160
you know. 
So yeah, George has his 

1377
01:08:15,160 --> 01:08:17,800
favorites too. 
I thought y'all might get a kick

1378
01:08:17,800 --> 01:08:20,520
out of that. 
Also wanted to take the moment 

1379
01:08:20,520 --> 01:08:23,479
to announce the winners of our 
RISE giveaway. 

1380
01:08:24,439 --> 01:08:28,800
Michael McLaughlin and Jordan, 
of a long expected soundscape 

1381
01:08:28,800 --> 01:08:32,720
both won a lifetime membership 
to Rise. 

1382
01:08:32,960 --> 01:08:36,479
If you want to join RISE, you 
can just go to rise dot IO/U 

1383
01:08:36,479 --> 01:08:38,560
slash westeros. 
It's been a really big deal, 

1384
01:08:38,560 --> 01:08:41,319
like the more months to pass, 
the more I appreciate RISE help 

1385
01:08:41,319 --> 01:08:44,080
and keep me focused. 
I'm not a very I can get into 

1386
01:08:44,080 --> 01:08:46,880
the zone and be like lost in 
Westeros and get hours of work 

1387
01:08:46,880 --> 01:08:48,240
done at once. 
But sometimes I struggle to get 

1388
01:08:48,240 --> 01:08:50,120
that started. 
RISE really helps me with that 

1389
01:08:50,120 --> 01:08:52,120
because it's like, Are you sure 
you want to be looking at 

1390
01:08:52,120 --> 01:08:53,880
baseball scores? 
OK. 

1391
01:08:53,920 --> 01:08:55,120
Yeah, I don't I. 
Don't. 

1392
01:08:55,120 --> 01:08:55,880
You're right. 
You're right. 

1393
01:08:55,880 --> 01:08:57,080
Rise. 
I should be looking. 

1394
01:08:57,080 --> 01:09:02,760
At basketball scores. 
And I also want to shout out our

1395
01:09:02,760 --> 01:09:05,319
Twitch channel. 
We started a new campaign as of 

1396
01:09:05,319 --> 01:09:10,160
May 3rd, and that is the we're 
playing House Tarly. 

1397
01:09:10,160 --> 01:09:13,200
We started a House Tarly's 
campaign starting in the era of 

1398
01:09:13,200 --> 01:09:17,120
the Ninepenny Kings, and we have
Randall Tarly as a grandson. 

1399
01:09:17,920 --> 01:09:20,439
So he's he's really young, so 
I'm trying to raise him to be 

1400
01:09:20,439 --> 01:09:24,399
better than the Randall Tarly of
Canon, but we'll see if that 

1401
01:09:24,399 --> 01:09:25,840
works out. 
I'm not sure. 

1402
01:09:25,840 --> 01:09:27,960
He might be. 
The nature part might be too 

1403
01:09:27,960 --> 01:09:29,279
strong. 
The nurturer will do all our 

1404
01:09:29,279 --> 01:09:30,160
best. 
But I don't know. 

1405
01:09:30,240 --> 01:09:33,000
It doesn't seem like too hard of
a challenge to make him better 

1406
01:09:33,160 --> 01:09:34,720
now. 
Making him good, I don't know. 

1407
01:09:34,720 --> 01:09:36,120
Yeah, good point. 
He could. 

1408
01:09:36,120 --> 01:09:39,520
It's hard to make him worse now,
but it can be fun to role play a

1409
01:09:39,520 --> 01:09:41,800
character like that in a 
fictional setting where you 

1410
01:09:41,800 --> 01:09:43,240
know, there's no real people 
that you're hurting. 

1411
01:09:43,240 --> 01:09:46,439
It's like, ha ha, I'm an evil 
cruel jerk, you know, ha ha, 

1412
01:09:46,720 --> 01:09:50,640
Take that fictional, you know, 
virtual characters. 

1413
01:09:51,160 --> 01:09:56,000
So anyway, twitch.com/history of
Westeros Fridays at six Eastern 

1414
01:09:56,280 --> 01:10:00,040
hang out with fellow historians 
and chat about fun stuff and and

1415
01:10:00,080 --> 01:10:02,800
and watch this great game and 
participate by helping me make 

1416
01:10:02,800 --> 01:10:05,240
decisions. 
When you watch, you are part of 

1417
01:10:05,240 --> 01:10:08,840
the large council that does 
things like naming of children, 

1418
01:10:09,240 --> 01:10:12,920
key decisions like whether we go
to war or who we go to war with 

1419
01:10:12,920 --> 01:10:15,280
or whether we should ally with 
certain people who to marry. 

1420
01:10:15,600 --> 01:10:19,480
All sorts of things like that. 
Some questions from Y'all Bryson

1421
01:10:19,480 --> 01:10:22,080
Chung says the Himalayas are 
still growing as the Indian 

1422
01:10:22,080 --> 01:10:24,960
subcontinent smashes into Asia. 
OK, so the Indian subcontinent 

1423
01:10:24,960 --> 01:10:27,400
is on a fault line. 
It's slowly pushing into Asia. 

1424
01:10:27,400 --> 01:10:29,120
They're kind of ramming into 
each other, which is how the 

1425
01:10:29,120 --> 01:10:31,600
Himalayas got formed in the 1st 
place, according to Bryson. 

1426
01:10:31,600 --> 01:10:33,800
So that's still happening. 
So they haven't reached their 

1427
01:10:33,800 --> 01:10:35,000
peak. 
I guess not. 

1428
01:10:35,640 --> 01:10:36,360
Good point. 
Yeah. 

1429
01:10:36,360 --> 01:10:37,800
So we did it kind of answer that
question. 

1430
01:10:37,800 --> 01:10:39,640
So they might, wow, they haven't
reached their peak yet. 

1431
01:10:39,640 --> 01:10:41,720
I mean, in our lifetime they'll 
probably only grow a few more 

1432
01:10:41,720 --> 01:10:43,880
millimeters. 
But just this goes to show that.

1433
01:10:44,360 --> 01:10:48,000
Woof. 
The world is large and moves 

1434
01:10:48,080 --> 01:10:50,840
slowly, except when it doesn't, 
like when volcanoes happen, 

1435
01:10:51,920 --> 01:10:54,800
that's quite fast, or floods, or
whatever natural disasters, 

1436
01:10:55,000 --> 01:10:57,680
Amanda M says. 
You think since Lomas visited 

1437
01:10:57,680 --> 01:11:00,240
the summer Isles, the talking 
trees could be a candidate? 

1438
01:11:00,240 --> 01:11:02,360
As in, just the trees themselves
as the carvings. 

1439
01:11:02,360 --> 01:11:05,200
I always envisioned them akin to
the Redwood trees in California.

1440
01:11:05,840 --> 01:11:09,040
If they are the size of the red 
ones, then IA 100% agree with 

1441
01:11:09,040 --> 01:11:10,640
you and feel like we should have
included them. 

1442
01:11:10,800 --> 01:11:13,200
We did talk about them last time
so it's not like we omitted them

1443
01:11:13,200 --> 01:11:16,840
entirely but I feel like the 
carvings lean them more towards 

1444
01:11:16,840 --> 01:11:19,640
a man made wonder. 
But if they are redwoods, 

1445
01:11:20,480 --> 01:11:22,960
personally, I think the Redwood 
forest is a candidate for a 

1446
01:11:22,960 --> 01:11:25,680
modern wonder of the world now. 
And that modern natural wonder 

1447
01:11:25,680 --> 01:11:27,840
of the world, because those 
things are just so freaking big 

1448
01:11:27,840 --> 01:11:28,840
and they're just it's 
incredible. 

1449
01:11:29,000 --> 01:11:31,600
There's ecosystems in the 
branches. 

1450
01:11:31,600 --> 01:11:34,520
There's animals that live in the
like, there's soil layers 

1451
01:11:34,520 --> 01:11:37,160
created by the branches of the 
Redwood trees, that there's 

1452
01:11:37,160 --> 01:11:39,160
creatures that live up there 
their whole lives, never touch 

1453
01:11:39,160 --> 01:11:40,640
ground. 
I'm not even talking about 

1454
01:11:40,640 --> 01:11:42,840
birds, Do we think? 
The forest of cohort could be a 

1455
01:11:42,840 --> 01:11:45,040
candidate for trees like that as
well. 

1456
01:11:45,040 --> 01:11:48,400
Maybe. 
Maybe mainly because I'm 

1457
01:11:48,400 --> 01:11:50,560
thinking of the climate. 
Yeah. 

1458
01:11:51,000 --> 01:11:54,840
The climate of the Summer Isles 
seems less Redwood less Northern

1459
01:11:54,840 --> 01:11:57,960
California, and cohort seems 
more like not. 

1460
01:11:57,960 --> 01:11:59,600
Neither is exactly 1 to one at 
all. 

1461
01:11:59,760 --> 01:12:02,040
But I don't know. 
I don't see Summer Isles as 

1462
01:12:02,040 --> 01:12:05,040
being exactly Northern 
California. 

1463
01:12:05,280 --> 01:12:08,040
You know, that's a great point 
because I don't know what large 

1464
01:12:08,040 --> 01:12:10,840
trees grow in like, tropical 
climates, maybe banyan trees. 

1465
01:12:10,840 --> 01:12:11,440
I don't really. 
I'm not. 

1466
01:12:11,440 --> 01:12:14,760
Banyan trees are beautiful. 
I grew up with a Banyan tree, a 

1467
01:12:14,760 --> 01:12:16,800
really famous banyan tree in 
Lahaina. 

1468
01:12:17,400 --> 01:12:21,320
I used to climb all over it as a
little girl all over the banyan 

1469
01:12:21,320 --> 01:12:23,120
tree. 
It's it's very much banned now, 

1470
01:12:24,360 --> 01:12:27,640
but I grew up all climbing is 
the most magical experience, 

1471
01:12:27,640 --> 01:12:30,080
honestly. 
So yeah, I love that call they 

1472
01:12:30,080 --> 01:12:31,560
do. 
Those do grow in tropical 

1473
01:12:31,560 --> 01:12:34,960
climates and are very wondrous 
the way that they all are are 

1474
01:12:35,040 --> 01:12:37,680
are like banyan tree. 
Underwater and yeah, they're 

1475
01:12:37,680 --> 01:12:39,680
really cool, you're right. 
So that's and and and they're 

1476
01:12:39,680 --> 01:12:42,640
very important as far as like 
the preventing erosion and other

1477
01:12:42,640 --> 01:12:44,800
things like that. 
So they also serve a great 

1478
01:12:45,040 --> 01:12:48,120
ecological niche. 
I will say I haven't come 

1479
01:12:48,120 --> 01:12:49,240
across. 
I might have missed. 

1480
01:12:49,240 --> 01:12:52,480
You guys know better than me any
mention of there being 

1481
01:12:52,480 --> 01:12:55,240
particularly tall trees in any 
of these forests. 

1482
01:12:55,240 --> 01:12:58,280
That doesn't seem to be pointed 
out as a feature of any of. 

1483
01:12:58,280 --> 01:13:01,240
Them I agree that at least big, 
but maybe not Redwood big you. 

1484
01:13:01,240 --> 01:13:03,440
Know, you know, another 
beautiful type of tree that 

1485
01:13:03,440 --> 01:13:07,080
could be represented that I grew
up with in Hawaii are the 

1486
01:13:07,240 --> 01:13:09,280
eucalyptus trees, which are 
painted trees. 

1487
01:13:09,280 --> 01:13:11,880
They're referred to. 
It's like the painted trees, 

1488
01:13:11,880 --> 01:13:14,160
like that. 
When when the bark peels off of 

1489
01:13:14,160 --> 01:13:16,760
these trees, it looks like a 
rainbow under there. 

1490
01:13:16,760 --> 01:13:19,720
It's so beautiful. 
They had them where I grew up on

1491
01:13:19,720 --> 01:13:21,800
Lanai all over. 
I have pictures of me as a 

1492
01:13:21,800 --> 01:13:25,400
little kid with them. 
But yeah, that would be also 

1493
01:13:25,400 --> 01:13:29,600
possible to be summer like the 
Summer Isles and and stunning. 

1494
01:13:30,280 --> 01:13:33,360
Anthony De Palma says what if 
the old man of the river itself 

1495
01:13:33,360 --> 01:13:34,840
is a wonder, meaning the giant 
turtle? 

1496
01:13:34,840 --> 01:13:39,160
Because when he appears and as 
the Dragons Tyrion thinks gods 

1497
01:13:39,160 --> 01:13:41,600
and wonders always appear to 
attend the birth of kings. 

1498
01:13:41,800 --> 01:13:44,120
That's a great observation. 
He literally uses the word 

1499
01:13:44,120 --> 01:13:48,520
wonders and a turtle of enormous
size like a dragon sized turtle 

1500
01:13:48,520 --> 01:13:53,480
does sound pretty darn wondrous.
However, I I want to consider 

1501
01:13:53,480 --> 01:13:56,000
fauna a different category. 
Wondrous animals. 

1502
01:13:56,000 --> 01:13:58,040
I feel like that belongs in a 
different category. 

1503
01:13:58,720 --> 01:14:03,760
However, some people in the real
world have pushed for animal 

1504
01:14:03,880 --> 01:14:06,960
type inclusion within the 
natural wonder of the world. 

1505
01:14:06,960 --> 01:14:09,400
For example, the great 
migrations of some of these, 

1506
01:14:09,920 --> 01:14:12,760
these huge bird migrations are 
included on some of the modern 

1507
01:14:12,760 --> 01:14:15,760
world wunderlists and so like 
the great migration of the red 

1508
01:14:15,760 --> 01:14:18,360
crabs is a really fantastic and 
amazing thing. 

1509
01:14:19,320 --> 01:14:21,920
So, but personally I would 
categorize that separately. 

1510
01:14:21,920 --> 01:14:23,920
I think there's enough that why 
are we trying to jam these all 

1511
01:14:23,920 --> 01:14:25,400
into seven? 
Let's just make a category for 

1512
01:14:25,400 --> 01:14:28,120
the most wondrous animals, 
especially for our purposes. 

1513
01:14:28,120 --> 01:14:29,760
If we're going to do that, an 
episode on that. 

1514
01:14:29,760 --> 01:14:33,160
For West Rose and Planet Toast 
100% that would be included, but

1515
01:14:34,000 --> 01:14:36,560
it's easier if we have a whole 
separate designation for it. 

1516
01:14:36,680 --> 01:14:39,560
Fox and Bramble says. 
I wonder if the butterflies from

1517
01:14:39,560 --> 01:14:41,040
Knoth would be a contender 
under. 

1518
01:14:41,080 --> 01:14:42,320
That 100. 
Percent, right. 

1519
01:14:42,320 --> 01:14:45,080
So like I do think maybe in our 
unnatural wondering we should 

1520
01:14:45,080 --> 01:14:49,080
have a little sub area where we 
just talk a bit about animals 

1521
01:14:49,080 --> 01:14:53,880
because I actually really do 
like the idea of I I mean Lomas 

1522
01:14:53,880 --> 01:14:55,560
wasn't exactly scientific with 
this. 

1523
01:14:55,560 --> 01:14:59,320
So I think the idea of him being
like Old Man of the River is 

1524
01:14:59,320 --> 01:15:03,000
what represents the Roin isn't 
incomprehendable to me like 

1525
01:15:03,000 --> 01:15:04,400
that. 
That could be the case to me, 

1526
01:15:04,400 --> 01:15:07,520
even though like I, I doesn't 
make sense today to do that for 

1527
01:15:07,520 --> 01:15:11,640
our wonders to merge them. 
I could see him doing that. 

1528
01:15:11,640 --> 01:15:15,120
Yeah, he could. 
Although it's got the big the 

1529
01:15:15,120 --> 01:15:18,800
big problem is he very it's he's
very unlikely to have seen this 

1530
01:15:18,800 --> 01:15:21,880
big ass turtle. 
You know like unlike Tyrion and 

1531
01:15:21,880 --> 01:15:23,960
the others saw it. 
They were like, wow, it like the

1532
01:15:23,960 --> 01:15:30,000
Yandel or Yandel. 
Isila and Yandry, Y names like 

1533
01:15:30,000 --> 01:15:33,440
Yallo were just awestruck. 
They were Gosling. 

1534
01:15:33,440 --> 01:15:34,520
They were like, oh, we're 
blessed. 

1535
01:15:34,520 --> 01:15:36,080
It's a blessing. 
You know, Like, doesn't seem 

1536
01:15:36,080 --> 01:15:38,480
like they had seen that before 
either. 

1537
01:15:38,480 --> 01:15:39,680
Maybe only once or something 
like that. 

1538
01:15:39,680 --> 01:15:41,280
And they've been going up and 
down the river their whole 

1539
01:15:41,280 --> 01:15:43,520
lives. 
Most of their lives, anyway. 

1540
01:15:44,520 --> 01:15:47,640
Now, Dornish James says the 
quote about the caves with 

1541
01:15:47,640 --> 01:15:50,040
Norvos makes them think of The 
Cave system of Gendel and 

1542
01:15:50,040 --> 01:15:52,720
Gordon, which we also mentioned.
So we're on the same page there,

1543
01:15:52,800 --> 01:15:56,160
especially with the wolves, 
bears and giants idea of Gendel 

1544
01:15:56,160 --> 01:15:57,840
and Goren's cave network going 
under the wall. 

1545
01:15:58,400 --> 01:16:00,720
Maybe they were too busy trying 
to find their way to make any 

1546
01:16:00,720 --> 01:16:02,720
cave paintings such as what they
say. 

1547
01:16:03,120 --> 01:16:05,160
And that's entirely possible. 
But yeah, maybe there are some 

1548
01:16:05,160 --> 01:16:07,320
cave paintings down in the worm 
ways that would be really cool 

1549
01:16:07,360 --> 01:16:10,320
for for us to discover that, 
like a grant took John to those,

1550
01:16:10,320 --> 01:16:13,000
like Hot Springs. 
And you know, that's just one of

1551
01:16:13,000 --> 01:16:15,880
many cave systems that must 
exist in that region. 

1552
01:16:15,880 --> 01:16:17,240
We know. 
And we know there's like the hot

1553
01:16:17,240 --> 01:16:19,840
steam vents and things like Hard
Home and Winterfell. 

1554
01:16:20,240 --> 01:16:23,320
We didn't mention any of these 
as natural wonders potentially, 

1555
01:16:23,320 --> 01:16:25,920
but I also I do wonder about Hot
Springs. 

1556
01:16:26,200 --> 01:16:29,960
If Lomas would have been 
impressed by like for example 

1557
01:16:29,960 --> 01:16:32,760
Winterfell's Hot Springs or any 
any Hot Springs that he might 

1558
01:16:32,760 --> 01:16:35,120
have been. 
I think we just there's so many 

1559
01:16:35,120 --> 01:16:36,720
to list. 
I don't think it quite made the 

1560
01:16:36,720 --> 01:16:39,760
cut for any of us, but I think 
it might be one. 

1561
01:16:39,760 --> 01:16:42,760
It might be wondrous to lots of 
people, especially without 

1562
01:16:43,040 --> 01:16:45,320
modern heating and plumbing and 
all that. 

1563
01:16:45,320 --> 01:16:47,200
It would be extra wondrous. 
We might take that for granted. 

1564
01:16:47,280 --> 01:16:50,240
However, Adam Whitehead did not.
He included Winterfell as a 

1565
01:16:50,240 --> 01:16:52,760
potential wonder of the world 
for man made even though it's 

1566
01:16:52,760 --> 01:16:55,000
the hot, the Hot Springs are 
natural. 

1567
01:16:55,000 --> 01:16:57,920
It's it's the repurposing of 
those Hot Springs into into a 

1568
01:16:57,920 --> 01:17:00,480
castle that perhaps makes it 
wondrous or just the whole the 

1569
01:17:00,480 --> 01:17:05,280
whole shebang of Winterfell. 
So at least someone that that 

1570
01:17:05,280 --> 01:17:07,160
we're including here did see it 
that way as well. 

1571
01:17:07,160 --> 01:17:10,280
So you're right on Ishaya. 
Speaking of influences, Ashea 

1572
01:17:10,320 --> 01:17:14,160
found this great text called 
Ludus Thronus, which is the 

1573
01:17:14,200 --> 01:17:16,240
wonders of the ancient world, 
and George RR Martin's The Song 

1574
01:17:16,240 --> 01:17:18,560
of Ice and Fire. 
It's from a great textbook 

1575
01:17:18,640 --> 01:17:22,640
called Game of Thrones, A view 
from the humanities of Volume 

1576
01:17:22,640 --> 01:17:25,040
one. 
There is a second volume with 

1577
01:17:25,040 --> 01:17:27,800
some other really fascinating 
essays in it. 

1578
01:17:28,440 --> 01:17:29,960
Yeah, it's awesome. 
It's a great read. 

1579
01:17:30,640 --> 01:17:33,280
Some of the stuff in there 
inspired some of the takes we 

1580
01:17:33,280 --> 01:17:37,120
have here today, but I want to 
particularly divert your 

1581
01:17:37,120 --> 01:17:41,120
attention to a person they 
pointed out Who I didn't know 

1582
01:17:41,120 --> 01:17:45,520
existed was a guy named 
Dionysius Perigetus, which means

1583
01:17:45,520 --> 01:17:48,040
Dionysus the Voyager or Dionysus
the traveler. 

1584
01:17:48,040 --> 01:17:52,240
And he was a regular old school 
world, ancient world, Lomas long

1585
01:17:52,240 --> 01:17:55,400
Strider. 
He made a point to go to the 

1586
01:17:55,400 --> 01:18:00,360
most famous man made buildings 
edifices, describe them in a 

1587
01:18:00,360 --> 01:18:03,000
book so that people who couldn't
get around, which is, you know, 

1588
01:18:03,000 --> 01:18:06,960
most everyone in the ancient 
world, could have a way to 

1589
01:18:06,960 --> 01:18:08,720
interact with them or read about
them or hear about them. 

1590
01:18:08,720 --> 01:18:10,760
Like they probably wouldn't be 
reading a lot of them, but maybe

1591
01:18:10,760 --> 01:18:13,520
it would be read to them or you 
know people who were literate 

1592
01:18:13,520 --> 01:18:17,400
back then could read it. 
And he he lived in Alexandria in

1593
01:18:19,000 --> 01:18:22,000
so he would have been associated
with the Library of Alexandria 

1594
01:18:22,280 --> 01:18:25,440
and like we said, with Lomas LON
Strider with the Hightower. 

1595
01:18:25,840 --> 01:18:28,480
Maybe Lomas Long Strider wasn't 
that impressed by the High Tower

1596
01:18:28,480 --> 01:18:31,520
because he grew up there. 
Likewise, Dionysus Peregatis 

1597
01:18:31,520 --> 01:18:34,280
wasn't super impressed by the 
Lighthouse of Alexandria because

1598
01:18:34,280 --> 01:18:37,480
he grew up there. 
He still included it and wrote 

1599
01:18:37,480 --> 01:18:39,880
about it for people. 
But it's, you know, it's it's, 

1600
01:18:39,880 --> 01:18:42,520
it's comes off as like he's a 
little less impressed than these

1601
01:18:42,520 --> 01:18:43,640
places that he didn't grow up 
around. 

1602
01:18:43,640 --> 01:18:45,920
And that's just like very human,
you know? 

1603
01:18:46,080 --> 01:18:48,280
And like you said too, Sean, 
like this isn't a scientific 

1604
01:18:48,280 --> 01:18:50,880
text. 
It's rational, it's logical, 

1605
01:18:51,200 --> 01:18:54,120
it's comprehensive. 
But it's not written by a 

1606
01:18:54,120 --> 01:18:56,880
scientist or an anthropologist 
or someone that, like knows, has

1607
01:18:56,880 --> 01:18:58,400
some deeper knowledge of some of
these things. 

1608
01:18:58,440 --> 01:19:00,200
Or even who? 
Someone who isn't one of those 

1609
01:19:00,240 --> 01:19:03,000
things still might come up with 
some parameters, right? 

1610
01:19:03,000 --> 01:19:05,840
Even if they don't have the 
exact background, but they can 

1611
01:19:05,840 --> 01:19:09,040
still decide that it needs to be
at least X height or have blah 

1612
01:19:09,040 --> 01:19:12,200
blah blah. 
But if any of that is in there, 

1613
01:19:12,200 --> 01:19:15,080
we're not Privy to it. 
And it doesn't seem even for the

1614
01:19:15,080 --> 01:19:18,040
the the real world wonders. 
There doesn't seem to be an 

1615
01:19:18,040 --> 01:19:21,760
exact standard that's being 
measured that certain things 

1616
01:19:21,760 --> 01:19:25,520
meet or don't meet, you know? 
It's just it's largely 

1617
01:19:25,520 --> 01:19:27,040
subjective. 
I think maybe we'll put the 

1618
01:19:27,040 --> 01:19:30,160
links in in the description for 
Y'all to find that you can also 

1619
01:19:30,360 --> 01:19:33,400
click on a map that he made, 
which is really cool to look at 

1620
01:19:33,400 --> 01:19:36,200
this ancient world map. 
This version now a little bit 

1621
01:19:36,200 --> 01:19:37,760
more on influences. 
We're talking about fantasy 

1622
01:19:37,760 --> 01:19:39,680
influences. 
Lomas Longscrider might remind 

1623
01:19:39,680 --> 01:19:44,440
some Wheel of Time readers of 
Jane Far Strider, an explorer 

1624
01:19:44,440 --> 01:19:47,360
who actually lives during the 
events of the Wheel of Time 

1625
01:19:47,360 --> 01:19:48,640
book. 
So he's an actual on screen 

1626
01:19:48,640 --> 01:19:51,520
character, unlike Lomas. 
And he's in disguise. 

1627
01:19:52,160 --> 01:19:55,840
So maybe when we talk about how 
maybe Lomas would have disguised

1628
01:19:55,840 --> 01:19:58,040
himself, although we also 
couldn't think of a lot of 

1629
01:19:58,040 --> 01:20:00,800
reasons why he would need to, 
because he's not some famous 

1630
01:20:00,800 --> 01:20:03,040
person. 
He wrote a book called The 

1631
01:20:03,040 --> 01:20:06,880
Travels of Jane Forrestrider. 
So kind of similar to, you know,

1632
01:20:06,880 --> 01:20:08,800
the wonders and wonders of the 
Made by Man. 

1633
01:20:09,560 --> 01:20:13,480
He details adventures in very 
far off places that most people 

1634
01:20:13,480 --> 01:20:14,760
would never have been able to go
to. 

1635
01:20:14,760 --> 01:20:17,880
That kind of helps bring people 
to places that they'll never be 

1636
01:20:17,880 --> 01:20:20,360
able to travel to. 
Including lands like Shara. 

1637
01:20:20,360 --> 01:20:22,920
If you're familiar with the 
Wheel of Time books, Shara is 

1638
01:20:22,920 --> 01:20:25,640
beyond the aisle waste. 
Even so, it's really far away. 

1639
01:20:25,640 --> 01:20:27,640
It's a giant far. 
Strider went beyond the aisle 

1640
01:20:27,640 --> 01:20:31,440
waste to Shara, which is that's 
really, really far. 

1641
01:20:31,920 --> 01:20:34,160
The book actually also gets to 
mention giant far. 

1642
01:20:34,160 --> 01:20:36,160
Strider's travels of giant 
forest rider is actually 

1643
01:20:36,160 --> 01:20:38,600
mentioned on both mentioned in 
the TV show as well. 

1644
01:20:39,240 --> 01:20:41,520
So it comes up in book and show.
I appreciate that detail. 

1645
01:20:41,880 --> 01:20:45,840
It's a Gwaine's, I said a 
Gwaine's favorite book both in 

1646
01:20:45,840 --> 01:20:48,040
book and show, so that's nice. 
I like that. 

1647
01:20:48,360 --> 01:20:51,240
But both Jane Far Strider and 
Loma's Long Strider might be 

1648
01:20:51,240 --> 01:20:56,880
influenced by tokens. 
Strider AKA Aragorn himself, who

1649
01:20:56,880 --> 01:21:02,320
is even more an influence on Jon
Snow, but still because he's 

1650
01:21:02,320 --> 01:21:04,360
known for quite a bit more than 
exploring. 

1651
01:21:04,480 --> 01:21:08,360
But he was a Ranger and he's a 
central figure of his story like

1652
01:21:08,360 --> 01:21:10,360
Jon Snow. 
So that's that's pretty big 

1653
01:21:10,720 --> 01:21:13,680
good, good comparison there. 
Nina adds one more, which is 

1654
01:21:13,680 --> 01:21:17,680
that George may have borrowed a 
bit of influence from Lomas from

1655
01:21:17,680 --> 01:21:21,400
Walter, the protagonist of The 
Black Rose by Thomas Costain, 

1656
01:21:21,400 --> 01:21:23,720
who George has cited many times 
as an influence. 

1657
01:21:23,720 --> 01:21:27,680
There is a House Costain in the 
Reach in the Black Rose is a 

1658
01:21:27,680 --> 01:21:31,920
medieval historical fiction 
book, and it's a journey of a 

1659
01:21:31,920 --> 01:21:34,960
guy from England to Antioch and 
across Asia all the way to 

1660
01:21:34,960 --> 01:21:37,000
China. 
So, historical traveler book. 

1661
01:21:37,000 --> 01:21:41,160
That's pretty darn cool. 
George was once asked if he cut 

1662
01:21:41,280 --> 01:21:44,360
any Loomis long strider content 
from the World of Ice and Fire. 

1663
01:21:45,000 --> 01:21:48,120
Unsurprisingly, he said yes. 
Like, yeah, of course you did, 

1664
01:21:48,120 --> 01:21:50,640
George. 
Why didn't that person ask what 

1665
01:21:50,640 --> 01:21:51,560
he cut? 
What did? 

1666
01:21:52,040 --> 01:21:54,000
You did. 
You cut like, Yeah, yeah, I did.

1667
01:21:55,240 --> 01:21:58,320
So we'll we'll have to check 
back on that. 

1668
01:21:58,320 --> 01:22:00,360
You know, to see if maybe 
eventually he'll release some of

1669
01:22:00,360 --> 01:22:02,120
those other notes that could 
come out here and there. 

1670
01:22:02,120 --> 01:22:04,480
Maybe it'll be in fire and 
Blood, two pieces of it here and

1671
01:22:04,480 --> 01:22:05,560
there. 
Because certainly Fire and Blood

1672
01:22:05,560 --> 01:22:07,760
Two is after Lomas's time. 
So you never know what what 

1673
01:22:07,760 --> 01:22:09,680
could make it in there. 
There's always a chance for 

1674
01:22:10,040 --> 01:22:12,320
something he wrote to make it 
into a future piece of work. 

1675
01:22:12,560 --> 01:22:15,080
So let's let's move on more 
natural wonders of the world. 

1676
01:22:15,240 --> 01:22:18,080
Let's go with the great Sand 
Sea. 

1677
01:22:18,080 --> 01:22:20,080
As we finish with the Bone 
Mountains and the and the 

1678
01:22:20,120 --> 01:22:22,280
Dothraki Sea. 
This is the other side of it. 

1679
01:22:22,800 --> 01:22:27,160
Let's go a vast wasteland of 
restless dunes. 

1680
01:22:27,160 --> 01:22:32,200
Dry river beds and ruined forts 
and towns baking beneath the 

1681
01:22:32,200 --> 01:22:35,600
sun. 
Water is said to boil away. 

1682
01:22:35,840 --> 01:22:40,560
It is so hot in the deep 
southern portions of the sea. 

1683
01:22:40,920 --> 01:22:43,160
Again, that sounds a bit like 
Death Valley, just the heat 

1684
01:22:43,160 --> 01:22:45,160
part, which. 
Is you know one of the I think 

1685
01:22:45,160 --> 01:22:47,080
the hottest place in in North 
America. 

1686
01:22:47,080 --> 01:22:48,680
If I'm not sure, I'm I'm not 
positive about that. 

1687
01:22:48,760 --> 01:22:50,880
There's there's almost certainly
hotter places in the world, but 

1688
01:22:52,240 --> 01:22:55,600
they aren't as coolly named as 
Death Valley or hotly named as 

1689
01:22:55,600 --> 01:22:59,480
definitely so. 
We're told that this formed 

1690
01:22:59,480 --> 01:23:03,720
during the so-called dry times, 
which I don't know what that is 

1691
01:23:03,720 --> 01:23:06,200
or when that was, but it was 
surely long ago. 

1692
01:23:06,440 --> 01:23:10,240
Sounds like climate change 
brought on by deforestation or 

1693
01:23:10,360 --> 01:23:13,840
larger global events, perhaps 
related to the long Night, 

1694
01:23:13,840 --> 01:23:16,760
perhaps related to the silver 
sea drying up, Perhaps both. 

1695
01:23:17,320 --> 01:23:21,720
And like some of these other 
areas, like the caves with 

1696
01:23:21,720 --> 01:23:25,040
Norvas, maybe the forest. 
Nina suggests that Lomas quite a

1697
01:23:25,160 --> 01:23:28,400
could have been very intrigued 
by the lingering mysteries of 

1698
01:23:28,400 --> 01:23:30,640
the area. 
The idea of a lost Kingdom 

1699
01:23:30,920 --> 01:23:32,800
abandoned but with remnants that
remain. 

1700
01:23:32,800 --> 01:23:36,040
There might be some 
archaeological finds to be made.

1701
01:23:36,520 --> 01:23:39,640
Definitely the kind of unsolved 
mystery that you can kind of 

1702
01:23:39,640 --> 01:23:42,880
picture Lomas enjoying. 
Anything that would draw him 

1703
01:23:43,160 --> 01:23:45,640
definitely has. 
Besides Death Valley Vibes, it 

1704
01:23:45,640 --> 01:23:51,560
definitely has Grand Canyon 
vibes, which is 277 miles long 

1705
01:23:51,560 --> 01:23:54,320
and 6000 feet deep. 
It's the only modern world 

1706
01:23:54,320 --> 01:23:57,680
wonder that I've seen. 
Personally, I'm out of natural 

1707
01:23:57,680 --> 01:23:59,760
ones. 
The Grand Canyon I, it's Shay 

1708
01:23:59,760 --> 01:24:02,800
and I went together. 
It's so big. 

1709
01:24:02,800 --> 01:24:05,560
It's like, it's the biggest hole
you can have. 

1710
01:24:05,640 --> 01:24:08,600
It's such a big hole. 
Pictures of me in front of it, 

1711
01:24:08,600 --> 01:24:10,960
like you have the bit behind me.
They look fake. 

1712
01:24:11,280 --> 01:24:13,000
I look at them now, my doesn't 
look real. 

1713
01:24:13,000 --> 01:24:15,000
It's like I'm standing in a 
green screen that someone put 

1714
01:24:15,000 --> 01:24:17,480
Grand Canyon behind me. 
It just it looks fake, but it's 

1715
01:24:17,600 --> 01:24:21,160
definitely real. 
And when something is so real it

1716
01:24:21,160 --> 01:24:24,360
looks fake, that that feels like
it's achieved a status that few 

1717
01:24:24,360 --> 01:24:26,680
real things can. 
It's like, now this is so real 

1718
01:24:26,680 --> 01:24:29,600
it looks fake. 
The Colorado River has been 

1719
01:24:29,600 --> 01:24:33,920
cutting through the Grand Canyon
for millions of years exposing 

1720
01:24:33,920 --> 01:24:38,280
like 2 billion years of 
archaeological like geological 

1721
01:24:38,280 --> 01:24:40,720
layers. 
So it's a it's a wonder of for 

1722
01:24:40,720 --> 01:24:43,240
scientists too because they can 
see all these layers and just 

1723
01:24:43,240 --> 01:24:47,120
like track time back. 
So far it's a trove of 

1724
01:24:47,120 --> 01:24:49,680
information. 
I I suspect the same would be 

1725
01:24:49,680 --> 01:24:54,120
true for the Great Sand Sea were
there modern, you know, 

1726
01:24:54,120 --> 01:24:57,200
archaeologic, archaeological 
archaeologists and 

1727
01:24:58,080 --> 01:25:02,960
anthropologists and whatever 
other types of isologists might 

1728
01:25:02,960 --> 01:25:06,840
be relevant here. 
And so just wondrous because of 

1729
01:25:06,840 --> 01:25:09,400
the great size of it and the 
great desolation, and it's got 

1730
01:25:09,400 --> 01:25:11,680
to have a lot of beauty too. 
Deserts can be pretty beautiful 

1731
01:25:12,360 --> 01:25:13,640
at certain times of day 
especially. 

1732
01:25:13,640 --> 01:25:16,200
And apparently there's glass, 
It's so hot that glass just gets

1733
01:25:16,200 --> 01:25:19,680
created in some spots, which 
that would add to the wonder. 

1734
01:25:19,680 --> 01:25:21,160
The place almost was aware of 
it. 

1735
01:25:21,160 --> 01:25:23,320
You know. 
So funny story. 

1736
01:25:24,000 --> 01:25:27,480
Nina was looking up some 
comparisons and and I believe 

1737
01:25:28,120 --> 01:25:29,920
Sean you may have discovered 
this on your own as well. 

1738
01:25:29,920 --> 01:25:32,040
There is a great Sansi Me too. 
I had to look at you. 

1739
01:25:32,040 --> 01:25:32,480
Yeah. 
It was you. 

1740
01:25:32,520 --> 01:25:33,600
I'm thinking I was thinking of 
you. 

1741
01:25:33,600 --> 01:25:34,800
I'm. 
Sorry, there is a. 

1742
01:25:34,800 --> 01:25:39,720
Great Sansi On Earth, it's only 
part of the Sahara. 

1743
01:25:40,240 --> 01:25:42,040
It doesn't. 
So the Sahara's actually larger,

1744
01:25:42,440 --> 01:25:44,600
but the Great Sansy is like the 
hottest part of it. 

1745
01:25:44,600 --> 01:25:47,080
The worst part of it. 
I don't know how you categorize 

1746
01:25:47,080 --> 01:25:49,040
it, but so they stole it from 
Essos. 

1747
01:25:49,040 --> 01:25:51,400
Yeah, the Earth stole this from 
Essos. 

1748
01:25:51,760 --> 01:25:57,200
It's a 72,000 kilometer desert 
Siwa, the famous Oasis of Siwa 

1749
01:25:57,200 --> 01:25:58,880
which has existed since ancient 
times. 

1750
01:25:58,880 --> 01:26:07,480
Is there named after JoJo Siwa? 
Sorry, that's blasphemous. 

1751
01:26:07,560 --> 01:26:10,400
Now it's only recently been 
discovered by Europeans. 

1752
01:26:10,400 --> 01:26:14,040
It's only been like only since 
like the late 1800s, early 1900s

1753
01:26:14,040 --> 01:26:17,400
has have Europeans been allowed 
or able to explore it. 

1754
01:26:17,400 --> 01:26:20,800
Of course, the locals have been 
there for who knows how long, so

1755
01:26:20,800 --> 01:26:24,040
obviously it isn't new. 
But in terms of people writing 

1756
01:26:24,040 --> 01:26:28,400
about it in a way that can be 
consumed by the world, it's it's

1757
01:26:28,640 --> 01:26:32,600
a fairly recent discovery in 
terms of that sense, and it's 

1758
01:26:32,600 --> 01:26:34,720
huge. 
It's apparently like looking at 

1759
01:26:34,720 --> 01:26:37,520
the map, it's not as big as the 
Dothraki Sea, but it's pretty 

1760
01:26:37,520 --> 01:26:40,160
darn big. 
It's one of the largest 

1761
01:26:40,160 --> 01:26:42,680
geographical features on the 
entire planet or the known world

1762
01:26:42,680 --> 01:26:46,080
that we can see. 
That alone makes it impressive. 

1763
01:26:46,080 --> 01:26:49,480
So you can see why it is a 
strong candidate for one of the 

1764
01:26:49,680 --> 01:26:54,920
remaining 6, farther east of the
Great Sand Sea, South of the 

1765
01:26:54,920 --> 01:26:58,960
five forts. 
So probably at the limits of 

1766
01:26:58,960 --> 01:27:03,880
where Lomas went is the bleeding
sea, named for the quote 

1767
01:27:03,880 --> 01:27:07,520
characteristic view of its deep 
waters, supposedly a result of a

1768
01:27:07,520 --> 01:27:11,160
plant that grows only there. 
This is a real world thing, 

1769
01:27:11,840 --> 01:27:15,360
right? 
It's algae and or bacteria. 

1770
01:27:15,360 --> 01:27:16,760
Scientists are trying to figure 
it out. 

1771
01:27:16,760 --> 01:27:19,120
They're not entirely sure what 
causes it, but there are like 

1772
01:27:19,120 --> 01:27:22,120
literally hundreds of lakes in 
the world that do this, that 

1773
01:27:22,120 --> 01:27:23,920
turn red or pink, but not 
always. 

1774
01:27:23,920 --> 01:27:28,120
They're not that way all year 
round, and they're usually very 

1775
01:27:28,120 --> 01:27:30,280
salty. 
Now, the Colorado River runs red

1776
01:27:30,280 --> 01:27:31,640
in a lot of parts, but that's 
just sediment. 

1777
01:27:31,640 --> 01:27:33,600
That's just mud, red mud. 
So that's fine. 

1778
01:27:33,600 --> 01:27:35,120
But that's a different, this is 
clearly different. 

1779
01:27:35,120 --> 01:27:39,520
This is not that, although maybe
some of them are, but not the 

1780
01:27:39,520 --> 01:27:41,240
bleeding sea. 
The bleeding sea is not mud. 

1781
01:27:41,240 --> 01:27:42,480
It's first. 
First of all, it's a sea, not a 

1782
01:27:42,480 --> 01:27:43,800
river. 
So it wouldn't be constantly 

1783
01:27:43,800 --> 01:27:46,120
washing the sediment into 
itself, which is where a lot of 

1784
01:27:46,120 --> 01:27:48,560
that red comes from. 
There's literally like hundreds 

1785
01:27:48,560 --> 01:27:51,720
of pink lakes in Australia. 
If you come across that and you 

1786
01:27:51,720 --> 01:27:53,760
didn't know it was a real thing,
it might be wondrous. 

1787
01:27:53,760 --> 01:27:56,320
But if you come across, like, if
Lomas comes across one of those,

1788
01:27:56,320 --> 01:27:58,360
you're like, whoa, But then he 
sees like five more of them. 

1789
01:27:58,360 --> 01:28:00,120
He might be like, OK, well, 
maybe that's not so wondrous 

1790
01:28:00,120 --> 01:28:01,800
after all. 
What do you think, Sean? 

1791
01:28:02,040 --> 01:28:04,800
Yeah, I wonder. 
I'm I'm imagining his his like 

1792
01:28:04,840 --> 01:28:06,920
list. 
And there's like a lot of things

1793
01:28:06,920 --> 01:28:10,560
that crossed off, you know, like
he's got like 38 things on the 

1794
01:28:10,560 --> 01:28:12,440
list, but 30. 
Of them are crossed off. 

1795
01:28:12,960 --> 01:28:15,040
Oh, never mind, never mind. 
That's not as impressive as I 

1796
01:28:15,120 --> 01:28:17,440
thought. 
I jumped the gun with that 

1797
01:28:17,440 --> 01:28:18,920
Norvis Bells thing. 
Didn't I? 

1798
01:28:20,800 --> 01:28:22,440
Yeah, like, oops. 
I should have just. 

1799
01:28:22,440 --> 01:28:24,240
I should have held off and just 
waited, Yeah. 

1800
01:28:25,320 --> 01:28:29,120
So this is pretty interesting. 
So this is one that's like I 

1801
01:28:29,120 --> 01:28:32,280
said still being still not fully
understood by scientists in 

1802
01:28:32,280 --> 01:28:34,360
modern times. 
But clearly is a natural 

1803
01:28:34,360 --> 01:28:36,480
phenomena and not something 
unique to Essos. 

1804
01:28:37,200 --> 01:28:39,880
Maybe unique to well, it might 
not exist in Westeros. 

1805
01:28:39,880 --> 01:28:43,000
We don't know of any red water 
in well, I can't think of any 

1806
01:28:43,000 --> 01:28:44,480
red. 
What is the Yellow River? 

1807
01:28:44,480 --> 01:28:46,680
The sulphurous river in the near
the Hellholt. 

1808
01:28:46,680 --> 01:28:49,120
But we only we only have one 
example. 

1809
01:28:49,120 --> 01:28:52,560
Well, we have two. 
Examples of red water in my in 

1810
01:28:52,560 --> 01:28:56,240
my estimation one is the sea of 
size which in Valyria and we 

1811
01:28:56,240 --> 01:28:58,800
don't really know if it looked 
like that before the Doom of 

1812
01:28:58,800 --> 01:29:02,480
Valyria and that might just be a
different mechanism doing that 

1813
01:29:02,480 --> 01:29:04,080
and and just a whole different 
thing. 

1814
01:29:04,360 --> 01:29:08,920
Two is definitely not one Lomas 
would have seen or or thought of

1815
01:29:08,920 --> 01:29:12,160
as Red Lake. 
Oh yeah, but that was just red 

1816
01:29:12,440 --> 01:29:13,520
from the. 
Blood, you know, that's a 

1817
01:29:13,520 --> 01:29:15,280
different thing. 
Entirely, it's not. 

1818
01:29:15,520 --> 01:29:18,800
It's not typically red, nor 
would it, Nor would it have been

1819
01:29:18,800 --> 01:29:22,600
red when or if Lomas saw it. 
Yeah, Red Lake is a nickname, 

1820
01:29:22,600 --> 01:29:24,400
apparently isn't red. 
It's like the. 

1821
01:29:24,400 --> 01:29:28,200
Sunset or I think they they they
make a remark that it turns red 

1822
01:29:28,200 --> 01:29:29,640
that the. 
Blood has made it red. 

1823
01:29:29,640 --> 01:29:31,720
Like it's made the way, the way 
exaggerating, they're 

1824
01:29:31,720 --> 01:29:33,840
exaggerating. 
I think after a fight, right 

1825
01:29:33,840 --> 01:29:35,680
after a battle, though, it isn't
something that like regularly 

1826
01:29:35,720 --> 01:29:37,280
happens. 
No, it has been red and it. 

1827
01:29:37,280 --> 01:29:39,160
Might not have even happened 
then to be. 

1828
01:29:39,400 --> 01:29:42,360
They might have simply just been
like being exaggerating about 

1829
01:29:42,360 --> 01:29:45,160
how many deaths happened at Red 
Lake, that it turned the water 

1830
01:29:45,160 --> 01:29:46,840
red, but it might not have 
really been very red. 

1831
01:29:46,840 --> 01:29:48,080
OK, OK. 
I don't know. 

1832
01:29:48,280 --> 01:29:50,320
That makes sense. 
Yeah, like we definitely hear of

1833
01:29:50,360 --> 01:29:52,040
other. 
Battles where like blah blah, 

1834
01:29:52,040 --> 01:29:54,880
there was so much blood. 
The water ran red or roaring ran

1835
01:29:54,880 --> 01:29:58,000
red or the God's eye ran. 
Yeah, there's other examples 

1836
01:29:58,000 --> 01:29:59,360
like that. 
So that that's fitting, that's 

1837
01:29:59,360 --> 01:30:01,040
fitting. 
We have a little more on the sea

1838
01:30:01,040 --> 01:30:04,400
of size in the Mantarus episode 
that is a patrons only episode. 

1839
01:30:04,400 --> 01:30:08,800
We talk about concepts like 
magical fallout like comparing 

1840
01:30:08,800 --> 01:30:12,400
the supernatural elements of the
doom to Chernobyl and other 

1841
01:30:12,400 --> 01:30:16,080
things like that that that kind 
of explain the doom and what's 

1842
01:30:16,080 --> 01:30:18,720
still there. 
Because Mantaris is seated right

1843
01:30:18,720 --> 01:30:20,640
on the outside of the fallout 
zone of the Doom. 

1844
01:30:20,640 --> 01:30:23,320
So it's kind of like right in 
the like right on the cusp of 

1845
01:30:23,400 --> 01:30:25,800
being hit by the doom, but not 
so much that it didn't survive. 

1846
01:30:25,800 --> 01:30:30,360
So it's kind of an unusual city 
that it's got a lot of the 

1847
01:30:30,360 --> 01:30:34,360
ancient heritage of Valyria, yet
it's not one of the free cities.

1848
01:30:34,880 --> 01:30:37,840
And it's also got that magical 
fallout that my inflicting at, 

1849
01:30:37,840 --> 01:30:41,000
which explains why there might 
be some 2 headed people there, 

1850
01:30:41,000 --> 01:30:45,680
which is said in a few places. 
So very interesting. 

1851
01:30:47,080 --> 01:30:50,920
All right, let's move on to one 
of the more I think 

1852
01:30:50,920 --> 01:30:53,440
straightforward inclusions here.
But some of you all may 

1853
01:30:53,440 --> 01:30:56,040
disagree. 
Let's go with Adam Whitehead 

1854
01:30:56,160 --> 01:30:58,840
again for a quote here. 
Thanks Adam. 

1855
01:30:59,720 --> 01:31:02,480
There are many great rivers in 
the world. 

1856
01:31:02,640 --> 01:31:06,960
But none quite like the Royne. 
Starting as streams and 

1857
01:31:06,960 --> 01:31:10,840
tributary streams forming in the
Highlands, hills, and mountains 

1858
01:31:10,840 --> 01:31:15,800
between Norvos and Braavos, 
these soon combine into one 

1859
01:31:15,840 --> 01:31:20,000
colossal waterway, already 
hundreds of feet wide. 

1860
01:31:20,000 --> 01:31:24,320
Even before it winds its way out
of the flatlands, the river 

1861
01:31:24,320 --> 01:31:29,440
still has 1000 miles and more to
run until it empties into the 

1862
01:31:29,440 --> 01:31:34,720
sea through 4 immense deltas. 
The river mouth at Volantis 

1863
01:31:34,720 --> 01:31:39,240
alone is five times the width of
the Black Water rush at King's 

1864
01:31:39,240 --> 01:31:41,480
Landing, and that's only one of 
them. 

1865
01:31:42,200 --> 01:31:46,840
The Rhine is, in fact, so wide 
in places you can barely see the

1866
01:31:46,840 --> 01:31:50,320
other side, making it more than 
a match for some of its 

1867
01:31:50,320 --> 01:31:55,680
inspirations, namely the Amazon,
the Nile, and, of course, the 

1868
01:31:55,680 --> 01:31:58,600
Mississippi. 
The waterway that George RR 

1869
01:31:58,600 --> 01:32:02,680
Martin previously studied in 
depth for his classic horror 

1870
01:32:02,680 --> 01:32:05,960
novel Fever Dream. 
Nice pun there, Adam Waterway 

1871
01:32:05,960 --> 01:32:08,360
that he studied in depth. 
Good one. 

1872
01:32:08,360 --> 01:32:10,800
Good one. 
Yes, that last part is fun for 

1873
01:32:10,800 --> 01:32:14,000
sure, Cuz yes, I 100% agree and 
Nina agrees as well. 

1874
01:32:14,000 --> 01:32:17,160
Wholeheartedly, the enormous 
Mississippi River is not only an

1875
01:32:17,160 --> 01:32:19,520
inspiration for the Rhine, but 
we previously pointed out that 

1876
01:32:19,520 --> 01:32:22,320
Volantis is inspired by New 
Orleans in a lot of ways similar

1877
01:32:22,320 --> 01:32:28,200
like rot as described by the way
George described it in that 

1878
01:32:28,200 --> 01:32:29,520
period. 
It's not he's not talking about 

1879
01:32:29,520 --> 01:32:32,400
modern New Orleans, he's talking
about in the Civil War era. 

1880
01:32:32,440 --> 01:32:35,360
And the temperature, the 
climate, it's a very similar 

1881
01:32:35,360 --> 01:32:36,560
climate. 
And of course, it's a river 

1882
01:32:36,560 --> 01:32:39,360
delta, like a humongous river 
delta area. 

1883
01:32:39,400 --> 01:32:43,600
And Nina also quotes Tyrion 
here, which she says yellow. 

1884
01:32:43,600 --> 01:32:46,160
Shouted Yandri as the shy maid 
past the point, Tell me again of

1885
01:32:46,160 --> 01:32:49,520
those Westerosi rivers as big as
Mother was, like being 

1886
01:32:49,520 --> 01:32:51,400
sarcastic. 
Like, I did not know. 

1887
01:32:51,400 --> 01:32:54,840
Yeah, So Tyrion was, like, 
downplaying it like he tends to 

1888
01:32:54,840 --> 01:32:56,640
do because he'd only seen some 
of those tributaries. 

1889
01:32:56,640 --> 01:32:58,800
But once he gets out on the main
waterway, they're like, yo, what

1890
01:32:58,800 --> 01:33:00,440
do you think? 
Now he's like, all right, you 

1891
01:33:00,440 --> 01:33:02,560
got me. 
This is in this is way bigger 

1892
01:33:02,560 --> 01:33:03,840
than I thought you guys were 
right. 

1893
01:33:04,120 --> 01:33:06,640
He says it's way bigger than the
man or the Yeah, he just goes 

1894
01:33:06,640 --> 01:33:10,680
off on how impressed he is. 
So yeah, it's a that helps its 

1895
01:33:10,680 --> 01:33:13,520
case is an inclusion in the 
world Wunderlist. 

1896
01:33:13,680 --> 01:33:15,880
I feel like true to George's 
form. 

1897
01:33:15,880 --> 01:33:19,440
He turned it up to 11. 
It's like Tyrion knew about the 

1898
01:33:19,440 --> 01:33:21,920
Mississippi and couldn't believe
there was a bigger river. 

1899
01:33:22,320 --> 01:33:24,920
But George's like, what if the 
Mississippi and the Nile ran 

1900
01:33:24,920 --> 01:33:28,040
together? 
That's like, OK, I guess that's 

1901
01:33:28,040 --> 01:33:29,240
bigger. 
Yeah, that's so big. 

1902
01:33:29,680 --> 01:33:32,200
And. 
It also adds to the mystique. 

1903
01:33:32,200 --> 01:33:36,040
And impressiveness of the long 
bridge which spans this thing, 

1904
01:33:36,320 --> 01:33:37,480
right. 
We talked about the Long bridge 

1905
01:33:37,480 --> 01:33:39,360
last time. 
This is an example of what I 

1906
01:33:39,360 --> 01:33:41,840
brought up with the forest of 
cohort, which is is a potential 

1907
01:33:41,840 --> 01:33:44,120
wonder of the world with another
man made wonder of the world 

1908
01:33:44,120 --> 01:33:46,040
running through it in the 
Valyrian roads. 

1909
01:33:46,160 --> 01:33:49,320
Here we have a similar thing. 
Mother Roin, probably a natural 

1910
01:33:49,320 --> 01:33:52,320
wonder of the world with the 
Long bridge, a man made wonder 

1911
01:33:52,440 --> 01:33:54,160
crossing it or connecting both 
sides of it. 

1912
01:33:54,160 --> 01:33:57,800
So that's pretty cool. 
Like many of the candidates 

1913
01:33:58,040 --> 01:34:03,520
worship, religious awe and or 
other associated ideas are 

1914
01:34:03,520 --> 01:34:08,400
connected because deities are 
often connected to these places.

1915
01:34:08,400 --> 01:34:11,560
Like especially that's the case 
with bodies of fresh water 

1916
01:34:11,560 --> 01:34:14,640
because that's where 
civilizations grow from in the 

1917
01:34:14,640 --> 01:34:16,800
1st place. 
And there'd be kind of a natural

1918
01:34:18,160 --> 01:34:23,640
gratitude for the landscape that
allows human life to exist and 

1919
01:34:23,640 --> 01:34:27,040
not just exist but thrive. 
Because Mother Royne is amazing.

1920
01:34:27,520 --> 01:34:30,680
And so the mother, like the 
Egyptians, worship the Nile. 

1921
01:34:30,680 --> 01:34:35,040
And cultures in South America 
have worshipped the Amazon. 

1922
01:34:35,040 --> 01:34:38,520
Lots of people have worshipped 
the rivers that were the basis 

1923
01:34:38,520 --> 01:34:42,080
of their food, of their entire 
culture's existence in the 1st 

1924
01:34:42,080 --> 01:34:44,720
place. 
And so that's very true here. 

1925
01:34:44,720 --> 01:34:46,280
Obviously, they worshipped the 
turtles. 

1926
01:34:46,280 --> 01:34:48,560
They worshipped the river. 
They refused to live far away 

1927
01:34:48,560 --> 01:34:50,120
from it. 
You know, they had a religious 

1928
01:34:50,120 --> 01:34:51,800
connection to it. 
When they had to flee, some of 

1929
01:34:51,800 --> 01:34:55,360
them went back, which was not a 
good idea, but it goes to show 

1930
01:34:55,360 --> 01:34:57,400
how connected they were to their
homeland. 

1931
01:34:58,080 --> 01:35:00,080
And that's all about mother Roy.
And they wanted to return to 

1932
01:35:00,080 --> 01:35:04,640
their mother despite the 
dangers, despite the near 

1933
01:35:04,640 --> 01:35:06,040
certainty that it would go 
poorly. 

1934
01:35:06,360 --> 01:35:09,280
So this is just reflected by so 
many real world cultures and 

1935
01:35:09,280 --> 01:35:12,560
fantasy cultures that they have 
a religious awe or wonder 

1936
01:35:12,560 --> 01:35:15,600
associated with a river or a 
lake of freshwater. 

1937
01:35:15,600 --> 01:35:18,240
Basically, compared to the real 
world, the Nile is the longest, 

1938
01:35:18,600 --> 01:35:22,360
4160 miles. 
But the Amazon has higher 

1939
01:35:22,360 --> 01:35:24,600
volume, it runs faster and it's 
deeper. 

1940
01:35:24,840 --> 01:35:26,160
So whatever. 
Those are both two amazing 

1941
01:35:26,160 --> 01:35:28,040
rivers. 
But that's a good example of 

1942
01:35:28,040 --> 01:35:30,600
like both of those are just they
would if you were voting on 

1943
01:35:30,600 --> 01:35:32,120
which is the most wondrous river
in the world. 

1944
01:35:32,120 --> 01:35:34,440
They're both so close that it 
would be they would take votes 

1945
01:35:34,440 --> 01:35:36,200
away from each other like, well,
I only want to include one 

1946
01:35:36,200 --> 01:35:39,960
river, but which of these two in
Westeros or in in in planets? 

1947
01:35:39,960 --> 01:35:42,320
O, it's no problem. 
Nothing comes close to the 

1948
01:35:42,320 --> 01:35:46,080
Rhine, as far as we know. 
It also has the rich cultural 

1949
01:35:46,080 --> 01:35:48,440
history. 
It also not only does it create 

1950
01:35:48,440 --> 01:35:52,440
life, but it's the basis for so 
much of the Roinish culture 

1951
01:35:52,440 --> 01:35:55,240
beyond giving life like 
everything else comes from that 

1952
01:35:55,240 --> 01:35:57,320
as well. 
And it's so embedded in their 

1953
01:35:57,320 --> 01:36:00,880
culture, which might add to the 
wondrous nature of it all, 

1954
01:36:01,080 --> 01:36:04,320
showing just how deep its 
connections to everything 

1955
01:36:04,320 --> 01:36:08,120
Roinish runs. 
Not just their existence, but 

1956
01:36:09,000 --> 01:36:12,800
their art, their worship, their 
just all all sorts of little 

1957
01:36:12,800 --> 01:36:15,440
minutiae within their day-to-day
lives. 

1958
01:36:16,520 --> 01:36:20,160
And that would be more true than
for any other culture, perhaps 

1959
01:36:20,160 --> 01:36:22,920
because no culture gets more 
from their waterway than the 

1960
01:36:22,920 --> 01:36:26,760
Roinar do. 
Pivoting to the people that 

1961
01:36:28,320 --> 01:36:31,480
doomed the Roinar. 
Let's talk about one that Lomas 

1962
01:36:31,480 --> 01:36:35,520
may or may not have seen, though
a lot of us agree that if he did

1963
01:36:35,520 --> 01:36:40,000
see the 14 flames, he probably 
would have included them, but he

1964
01:36:40,000 --> 01:36:41,920
may not have. 
Either way, let's have a quote. 

1965
01:36:42,440 --> 01:36:46,040
The burning mountains of the 14 
Flames were rich. 

1966
01:36:46,040 --> 01:36:50,480
With ore and the Valyrians 
hungered for it, copper and tin 

1967
01:36:50,480 --> 01:36:53,120
for the bronze of their weapons 
and monuments. 

1968
01:36:53,320 --> 01:36:57,320
Later iron for the steel of 
their legendary blades, and 

1969
01:36:57,320 --> 01:37:01,160
always gold and silver to pay 
for it all. 

1970
01:37:01,400 --> 01:37:04,360
Not just ore, however, they were
perhaps supernatural power to be

1971
01:37:04,360 --> 01:37:07,280
harnessed. 
In those volcanoes, you know, 

1972
01:37:07,280 --> 01:37:09,160
harnessing the fires of the 
earth, whatever they did. 

1973
01:37:09,160 --> 01:37:12,800
Not to mention Dragons who 
apparently were discovered or 

1974
01:37:12,800 --> 01:37:15,960
rediscovered by the Valyrians 
and are quite possibly 

1975
01:37:15,960 --> 01:37:19,240
supernatural beings themselves. 
Even without all that, they're 

1976
01:37:19,240 --> 01:37:21,080
all even take away the 
supernatural stuff to take away 

1977
01:37:21,080 --> 01:37:23,160
the Dragons. 
It's awfully impressive. 

1978
01:37:23,560 --> 01:37:25,960
It's kind of fun to think of 
them as like the the parallel to

1979
01:37:25,960 --> 01:37:29,160
Weirwoods in their way, because 
weirwoods are usually found solo

1980
01:37:29,160 --> 01:37:31,000
or in small groups like 
volcanoes. 

1981
01:37:31,000 --> 01:37:33,240
They're rarely found in large 
groups like this. 

1982
01:37:33,400 --> 01:37:36,000
They're also referred to as 
great volcanic mountains, which 

1983
01:37:36,000 --> 01:37:37,760
makes me wonder just how tall 
they were. 

1984
01:37:37,840 --> 01:37:40,560
We've speculated before that the
individual ones probably had 

1985
01:37:40,560 --> 01:37:42,760
nicknames like the local 
Valyrians probably gave each. 

1986
01:37:43,040 --> 01:37:45,960
They probably like character 
qualities like, oh, old old 

1987
01:37:45,960 --> 01:37:51,760
Smokey sure is belching extra 
fumes today, you know, But they 

1988
01:37:51,760 --> 01:37:54,240
probably had names of Valyrian 
gods, kind of like the Dragons 

1989
01:37:54,240 --> 01:37:56,120
do or something like that. 
Maybe That's kind of how I 

1990
01:37:56,120 --> 01:37:58,120
would. 
That's my my best guess anyway. 

1991
01:37:58,480 --> 01:38:01,440
Alexa Nina described it here. 
It's kind of where I fall on it,

1992
01:38:01,640 --> 01:38:03,160
although. 
I, if you remember from last 

1993
01:38:03,160 --> 01:38:07,160
week, said I, I firmly don't 
think he travelled in Valyria. 

1994
01:38:07,480 --> 01:38:10,080
But she says part of the 
question here is whether Lomas 

1995
01:38:10,080 --> 01:38:13,960
travelled in Valyria or the 
extent to which he would have 

1996
01:38:13,960 --> 01:38:16,720
gotten close. 
I don't think Lomas would have 

1997
01:38:16,720 --> 01:38:19,280
put somewhere he didn't travel 
on the list, I agree. 

1998
01:38:19,680 --> 01:38:22,200
But at the same time, he 
wouldn't have necessarily needed

1999
01:38:22,200 --> 01:38:26,280
to get too close to Valyria to 
appreciate the magnitude of the 

2000
01:38:26,280 --> 01:38:30,640
14 flames, exactly as she says. 
After all, I don't think he 

2001
01:38:30,640 --> 01:38:34,680
necessarily climbed to the top 
of Casterly Rock or navigated 

2002
01:38:34,680 --> 01:38:38,560
every tributary of the Rhine. 
So I agree with her, as she says

2003
01:38:38,560 --> 01:38:44,440
here, simply seeing even from 
far away, 14 huge active 

2004
01:38:44,440 --> 01:38:49,480
volcanoes all very close 
together, that would probably 

2005
01:38:49,480 --> 01:38:53,160
have been enough for the 14 
flames to become a wonder. 

2006
01:38:53,280 --> 01:38:57,120
I don't think you need to get 
very close to Sea Tyrion and 

2007
01:38:58,040 --> 01:39:01,960
what he was sailing. 
On the stinky Stewart, the 

2008
01:39:01,960 --> 01:39:04,680
celisory Koran Maccoro told him 
about Valyria. 

2009
01:39:04,680 --> 01:39:06,800
He's like, yeah, the captain 
doesn't like being even this 

2010
01:39:06,800 --> 01:39:09,160
close to Valyria, and he could 
see it from a distance, and it 

2011
01:39:09,160 --> 01:39:13,880
was it was inspiring in a 
foreboding and dark way, but it 

2012
01:39:13,880 --> 01:39:17,160
was wondrous even from 
shipboard, pretty way farther 

2013
01:39:17,160 --> 01:39:19,720
away than than Nina is 
suggesting that Lomas might have

2014
01:39:19,720 --> 01:39:20,960
come. 
But even that would have been 

2015
01:39:20,960 --> 01:39:23,800
enough, potentially. 
So yeah, I could see it. 

2016
01:39:23,800 --> 01:39:26,400
Yeah, even after the even after 
they all blew their tops, it 

2017
01:39:26,400 --> 01:39:28,600
could still be a wonder. 
Although I might argue that's 

2018
01:39:28,920 --> 01:39:32,280
falls in the unnatural wonders 
of the world because of the the 

2019
01:39:32,320 --> 01:39:36,080
the the Remnants feel very 
supernatural, or at least partly

2020
01:39:36,080 --> 01:39:37,000
supernatural. 
Yeah. 

2021
01:39:37,000 --> 01:39:39,760
But I don't know what I think 
Lomas thought of it when he saw 

2022
01:39:39,760 --> 01:39:40,360
it. 
He would have. 

2023
01:39:40,360 --> 01:39:42,560
Just been like, wow, look at 
those big volcanoes. 

2024
01:39:42,600 --> 01:39:44,480
That's a great point. 
What I was about to say, we have

2025
01:39:44,480 --> 01:39:46,080
developed that perspective. 
But I. 

2026
01:39:46,080 --> 01:39:49,000
Don't know if the people. 
Of Planetos have, or even if 

2027
01:39:49,000 --> 01:39:52,280
they have, if they had winter, 
how quickly they did at the 

2028
01:39:52,280 --> 01:39:53,960
point that Lomas is looking at 
it. 

2029
01:39:54,280 --> 01:39:57,560
That's true cause 'cause our 
best guess, which isn't 

2030
01:39:57,560 --> 01:39:59,880
necessarily. 
Shared by Nina but but is my. 

2031
01:39:59,880 --> 01:40:02,560
I think is our best guess 
personally is that he traveled 

2032
01:40:02,560 --> 01:40:04,320
during the century of blood 
which would have mean that yes 

2033
01:40:04,720 --> 01:40:06,800
the doom would have been very 
recent and a lot of the like 

2034
01:40:06,800 --> 01:40:09,960
rumors of what's still going on 
and the and the destroyed 

2035
01:40:09,960 --> 01:40:12,200
continent wouldn't have 
necessarily spread yet or 

2036
01:40:12,200 --> 01:40:14,160
developed yet. 
Well, I guess my other question 

2037
01:40:14,160 --> 01:40:19,320
is if you think that the the. 
Volcanoes would be obscured by 

2038
01:40:19,320 --> 01:40:21,800
like ash and smoke still, you 
know. 

2039
01:40:21,800 --> 01:40:23,480
Do you think? 
Do you think he could see their 

2040
01:40:23,480 --> 01:40:26,840
full glory or do you think they 
were going off more than than 

2041
01:40:26,840 --> 01:40:29,640
they are now? 
It might make it even more 

2042
01:40:29,640 --> 01:40:31,480
impressive because they would 
have like the Ash and the and 

2043
01:40:31,480 --> 01:40:33,480
the Lightning would be. 
Flashing through because we 

2044
01:40:33,480 --> 01:40:35,440
talked about that, how that 
creates huge amounts of static 

2045
01:40:35,440 --> 01:40:37,960
electricity. 
All those like the spewing of 

2046
01:40:37,960 --> 01:40:41,600
ash and like seeing these 
distant, half destroyed peaks 

2047
01:40:41,600 --> 01:40:45,280
with giant clouds and lightning 
and flame that might even look 

2048
01:40:45,280 --> 01:40:48,640
more impressive. 
You know, in a way I think Shia 

2049
01:40:48,760 --> 01:40:50,680
might be saying it. 
What if you couldn't even see? 

2050
01:40:50,680 --> 01:40:51,880
Oh, I agree. 
I agree. 

2051
01:40:51,880 --> 01:40:54,000
The sky. 
You know, if they were obscure, 

2052
01:40:54,000 --> 01:40:55,640
that would. 
That's a negative, but it but 

2053
01:40:55,640 --> 01:40:57,720
it's possible that it would 
frame them even more 

2054
01:40:57,720 --> 01:41:00,280
impressively anyway. 
Yeah, but that's just 

2055
01:41:00,280 --> 01:41:04,120
speculation. 
I think if he saw them pre or 

2056
01:41:04,120 --> 01:41:06,280
post destruction, they would be 
a strong candidate. 

2057
01:41:06,360 --> 01:41:08,840
Casterly Rock. 
We devoted a full episode to 

2058
01:41:08,840 --> 01:41:11,480
Casterly Rock and the process of
going through it in such detail 

2059
01:41:11,480 --> 01:41:13,600
definitely made it worthy of 
wonder status. 

2060
01:41:13,960 --> 01:41:16,160
The real life inspiration is the
Rock of Gibraltar. 

2061
01:41:16,160 --> 01:41:18,560
Of course, the Rock, it's still 
the Rock, not Dwayne Johnson, 

2062
01:41:18,560 --> 01:41:20,880
but you know, Casterly Rock is 
called the Rock. 

2063
01:41:20,880 --> 01:41:25,960
So similar thing. 
So, and we say this, the natural

2064
01:41:25,960 --> 01:41:31,240
beauty and just suitability for 
human habitation without any 

2065
01:41:31,240 --> 01:41:36,000
change to it is impressive. 
Yes, it has been heavily altered

2066
01:41:36,000 --> 01:41:39,440
by humanity, but I'm pretty sure
just the way it started by 

2067
01:41:39,440 --> 01:41:41,160
itself is wondrous. 
Yeah. 

2068
01:41:41,160 --> 01:41:45,680
It's not a whole mountain range 
like the Bone Mountains and it's

2069
01:41:45,680 --> 01:41:48,520
kind of maybe kind of falls into
that talking tree category where

2070
01:41:48,520 --> 01:41:50,480
it's a little of both. 
Like it's partly wondrous 

2071
01:41:50,480 --> 01:41:52,920
because of humanity, partly 
wonders because it just came out

2072
01:41:52,920 --> 01:41:57,040
that way by the gods or by 
nature or like the Erie where 

2073
01:41:57,400 --> 01:41:59,680
the the Giants Lance is a 
candidate we have today. 

2074
01:41:59,680 --> 01:42:03,520
But we talked about the Erie 
last time as a candidate was 

2075
01:42:03,520 --> 01:42:07,440
like, well, which the castle on 
top of a mountain like those are

2076
01:42:07,520 --> 01:42:08,920
those two things kind of work 
together. 

2077
01:42:08,920 --> 01:42:10,680
It's also the view that makes 
special sense. 

2078
01:42:11,080 --> 01:42:13,600
Yeah, that's also kind of a 
hybrid example where the beauty 

2079
01:42:13,600 --> 01:42:15,640
is partly natural, partly man 
made. 

2080
01:42:16,320 --> 01:42:18,360
So Cassidy Rock kind of falls in
that category. 

2081
01:42:18,360 --> 01:42:22,600
But I think it's the only one 
out of these that has a strong 

2082
01:42:22,600 --> 01:42:24,600
candidacy without the man made 
elements. 

2083
01:42:25,160 --> 01:42:28,520
Because I just think of some of 
these qualities. 

2084
01:42:28,520 --> 01:42:32,280
It's taller than almost every 
skyscraper in the real world. 

2085
01:42:32,440 --> 01:42:35,440
Like it's 3/4 the size of Burj 
Khalifa, which is the tallest 

2086
01:42:35,440 --> 01:42:37,680
building in the world. 
It's taller than the Hightower. 

2087
01:42:37,840 --> 01:42:39,440
It's three times higher than the
wall. 

2088
01:42:39,960 --> 01:42:45,400
It's a 200 foot high cavern that
serves as a natural port that's 

2089
01:42:45,520 --> 01:42:48,760
unbelievable for a human habit 
that's so perfect. 

2090
01:42:48,760 --> 01:42:52,360
It's like you found a castle 
that was already built. 

2091
01:42:52,360 --> 01:42:54,400
It's like this castle just 
dropped out of the sky and was 

2092
01:42:54,400 --> 01:42:57,400
just waiting for humans to 
discover it and just move in. 

2093
01:42:57,760 --> 01:43:00,040
It's it's so perfect for 
humanity. 

2094
01:43:00,120 --> 01:43:03,840
It's not like an Everest where 
it's just foreboding and like 

2095
01:43:03,840 --> 01:43:05,880
people die. 
Like 300 people a year die 

2096
01:43:05,880 --> 01:43:08,520
trying to climb Mount Everest. 
Like no one dies trying to climb

2097
01:43:08,520 --> 01:43:11,280
cast with the Rockets. 
It's pretty well suited for 

2098
01:43:11,280 --> 01:43:12,640
humans. 
You know, maybe you get lost in 

2099
01:43:12,640 --> 01:43:16,320
those tunnels, can't find your 
way back, but you're not going 

2100
01:43:16,320 --> 01:43:21,440
to freeze to death or die of 
oxygen deprivation or whatever. 

2101
01:43:21,480 --> 01:43:26,360
Yeah, so it's also super wide 7 
miles from east to West, just as

2102
01:43:26,360 --> 01:43:28,720
a stand alone mountain. 
Which it's maybe not completely 

2103
01:43:28,720 --> 01:43:31,320
stand alone mountain, but it's 
amidst the western mountains and

2104
01:43:31,320 --> 01:43:34,840
hit which are mostly hills. 
It really is by far the largest 

2105
01:43:34,840 --> 01:43:37,800
point as far as we know. 
Visenya was awestruck by it. 

2106
01:43:37,800 --> 01:43:40,080
She's like and this is a person 
that's not easily intimidated, 

2107
01:43:40,080 --> 01:43:43,000
she's like, woo glad we didn't 
have to besiege that. 

2108
01:43:44,080 --> 01:43:46,440
Good thing we caught that 
Lannister before he got back 

2109
01:43:46,440 --> 01:43:49,920
inside, so that is pretty huge. 
It's also the fact that it's 

2110
01:43:49,920 --> 01:43:54,280
even even the fact that it's 
mentioned in Ashai, despite the 

2111
01:43:54,280 --> 01:43:56,880
fact that it's mentioned wrong 
or like it's a whole thing made 

2112
01:43:56,880 --> 01:43:58,920
of gold. 
And the fact that they've heard 

2113
01:43:58,920 --> 01:44:01,040
of it at all is kind of telling.
You know, they probably, only 

2114
01:44:01,080 --> 01:44:03,360
people in Ashai have probably 
heard of like I don't know, the 

2115
01:44:03,360 --> 01:44:07,200
Hightower, Castley Rock, the 
Wall, that's probably about it. 

2116
01:44:07,560 --> 01:44:09,840
Maybe they've heard of King's 
Landing but only that's King's 

2117
01:44:09,840 --> 01:44:12,600
Landing is only 300 years old. 
So even that maybe they're not 

2118
01:44:12,680 --> 01:44:14,560
super familiar but they probably
are because it's a huge trading 

2119
01:44:14,560 --> 01:44:16,080
port and they're they're a 
trading port. 

2120
01:44:16,400 --> 01:44:20,480
But yeah, like Ashai people 
wouldn't be very well known 

2121
01:44:20,480 --> 01:44:23,320
about Westerosi geographical 
features but they've heard of 

2122
01:44:23,320 --> 01:44:25,800
Castley Rock. 
It's so legendary slash mythical

2123
01:44:25,800 --> 01:44:28,960
slash well known. 
Do you think there's an aspect 

2124
01:44:28,960 --> 01:44:31,240
where Lomas would have wanted to
represent? 

2125
01:44:31,240 --> 01:44:33,240
Westeros. 
Well, and so he might have been 

2126
01:44:33,240 --> 01:44:37,160
like, well, you know, maybe some
other mountains are technically 

2127
01:44:37,160 --> 01:44:39,080
better. 
But let's play up for our 

2128
01:44:39,080 --> 01:44:40,920
Westerosi pride. 
This is the best. 

2129
01:44:41,080 --> 01:44:43,200
Like, if it's that. 
If that's the only natural 

2130
01:44:43,200 --> 01:44:46,600
wonder, for example in Westeros,
he might have chosen it when he 

2131
01:44:46,600 --> 01:44:49,080
might not have. 
Otherwise, just to give Westeros

2132
01:44:49,080 --> 01:44:50,480
something. 
That's a good point. 

2133
01:44:51,080 --> 01:44:53,360
But there's one other feature I 
didn't even mention, which is. 

2134
01:44:53,360 --> 01:44:56,160
That not only does it so well 
suited for human habitation in 

2135
01:44:56,160 --> 01:44:59,240
both in like land and sea, the 
great natural harbor, the 

2136
01:44:59,240 --> 01:45:02,680
defended port, all the tunnels, 
all the all the water and all 

2137
01:45:02,680 --> 01:45:06,120
the natural stuff, the gold, it 
has that too. 

2138
01:45:06,120 --> 01:45:09,000
It's also got enormous wealth, 
the best according to George R 

2139
01:45:09,000 --> 01:45:10,280
Martin. 
Lomas wouldn't have necessarily 

2140
01:45:10,280 --> 01:45:13,200
known this, but he would know 
the gold mines are amazing. 

2141
01:45:13,560 --> 01:45:14,560
He wouldn't necessarily know 
that. 

2142
01:45:14,560 --> 01:45:17,040
According to George, they are 
the best gold mines in the 

2143
01:45:17,040 --> 01:45:19,040
world, which is already 
incredible. 

2144
01:45:19,040 --> 01:45:21,200
And don't forget folks, don't 
think of the show. 

2145
01:45:21,200 --> 01:45:23,880
Tywin says in the show that the 
gold mines are exhausted. 

2146
01:45:23,880 --> 01:45:27,600
That's show only the the book 
Castley Rock is still churning 

2147
01:45:27,600 --> 01:45:30,560
out gold like it always did. 
So Nina says this is a literal 

2148
01:45:30,560 --> 01:45:34,040
mountain of gold plunked down 
next to the sea with with easy 

2149
01:45:34,040 --> 01:45:37,720
landing and all that. 
So yeah, just just really 

2150
01:45:37,720 --> 01:45:42,120
impressive, even without the the
human carving out of tunnels and

2151
01:45:42,120 --> 01:45:45,280
halls and caverns which would 
add to it, I'd say. 

2152
01:45:45,680 --> 01:45:48,120
So yeah, check out our episode 
on Casually Rock. 

2153
01:45:48,120 --> 01:45:51,680
For more on that, let's move on 
to the giants. 

2154
01:45:51,680 --> 01:45:55,200
Lance. 
Sean Yeah, just sort of a segue 

2155
01:45:55,200 --> 01:45:57,200
between Castle Rock and Giants 
Lance. 

2156
01:45:57,400 --> 01:46:00,480
A couple points is it, you know,
because both of them have a 

2157
01:46:00,480 --> 01:46:03,840
little bit of the combining man 
made element connected to them. 

2158
01:46:04,040 --> 01:46:07,480
And so I'm thinking about in in 
the real world, Christ the 

2159
01:46:07,480 --> 01:46:10,880
Redeemer statue at the top of 
the the Bay of Rio de Janeiro 

2160
01:46:10,880 --> 01:46:12,920
and that was chosen as a natural
wonder. 

2161
01:46:13,480 --> 01:46:16,560
And Christ the Redeemer also is 
one of the new man made wonders.

2162
01:46:16,800 --> 01:46:20,480
And so the combining of the two 
might help get get the count, 

2163
01:46:20,560 --> 01:46:22,240
you know? 
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. 

2164
01:46:23,120 --> 01:46:24,880
And that's something I think, 
Castle Rock and. 

2165
01:46:25,360 --> 01:46:27,360
The giant. 
Slants have in common, you know,

2166
01:46:27,520 --> 01:46:31,000
but they're both mountains with 
man made structures incorporated

2167
01:46:31,000 --> 01:46:35,200
into them and I think Castle 
Rock, another factor when you're

2168
01:46:35,200 --> 01:46:37,800
talking about mountains. 
Like, you know, like the Bone 

2169
01:46:37,800 --> 01:46:42,360
Mountain seems so much more 
immensely massive, right? 

2170
01:46:42,640 --> 01:46:46,280
But whatever the tallest peak in
the Bone Mountains is, it 

2171
01:46:46,280 --> 01:46:48,600
doesn't stand out on its own as 
much because it's just part of 

2172
01:46:48,600 --> 01:46:52,600
this huge mountain range where 
casted rock and a giant slants 

2173
01:46:52,600 --> 01:46:54,440
might stand out. 
A little bit more. 

2174
01:46:54,640 --> 01:46:57,240
Maybe casted rock even more so 
because I think the giant slants

2175
01:46:57,240 --> 01:46:59,440
is more part of a mountainous 
area, right? 

2176
01:46:59,440 --> 01:47:01,720
And casted rock kind of rises up
on its own. 

2177
01:47:01,960 --> 01:47:04,840
But it is interesting to note 
that is one way or I guess 

2178
01:47:04,840 --> 01:47:06,440
there's multiple ways to measure
mountains. 

2179
01:47:06,440 --> 01:47:09,080
Like, everyone kind of knows 
that Mount Everest is the 

2180
01:47:09,080 --> 01:47:12,520
tallest mountain, but it is part
of the Himalayas. 

2181
01:47:12,520 --> 01:47:15,200
And so some mountains appear 
larger because they're more 

2182
01:47:15,200 --> 01:47:16,880
independent. 
And that's like another measure 

2183
01:47:16,880 --> 01:47:20,560
of mountains is how tall they 
are relative to the land around 

2184
01:47:20,560 --> 01:47:22,440
them. 
Mountain Everest is still the 

2185
01:47:22,440 --> 01:47:25,080
tallest, by the way. 
That's amazing. 

2186
01:47:25,680 --> 01:47:27,120
And there's another. 
Mountain. 

2187
01:47:28,280 --> 01:47:31,640
I think it's. 
In Ecuador, which in a way is 

2188
01:47:31,640 --> 01:47:35,280
taller, like if you were from in
space looking at the profile of 

2189
01:47:35,280 --> 01:47:37,720
Earth, it would jut out more 
than Mount Everest. 

2190
01:47:37,720 --> 01:47:39,440
Just cause Earth isn't a perfect
circle. 

2191
01:47:39,440 --> 01:47:42,680
And so that the sort of the warp
of Earth toward the equator 

2192
01:47:42,840 --> 01:47:45,920
actually makes it like closer to
space or closer to the sun. 

2193
01:47:45,920 --> 01:47:47,640
And I hope I'm saying this 
right, a shade. 

2194
01:47:47,640 --> 01:47:50,680
But Mauna Kea is a mountain in 
Hawaii. 

2195
01:47:50,680 --> 01:47:54,160
Yeah, Mauna Kea and all those 
other measurements. 

2196
01:47:54,160 --> 01:47:59,680
Are above sea level. 
But from base to tip, most of 

2197
01:47:59,680 --> 01:48:02,240
Mount IKEA is below the ocean. 
But if you measure it from the 

2198
01:48:02,240 --> 01:48:07,120
base of the ocean to the top, 
it's the tallest above ground 

2199
01:48:07,440 --> 01:48:09,880
Denali. 
In Alaska, is the tallest. 

2200
01:48:10,240 --> 01:48:12,920
But I pulled all this out 
because there's different ways 

2201
01:48:13,040 --> 01:48:15,560
you could measure or even 
observe whatever the 

2202
01:48:15,560 --> 01:48:17,680
measurements are. 
Like, I don't think George or 

2203
01:48:17,680 --> 01:48:19,960
the people Westeros know these 
exact measurements. 

2204
01:48:19,960 --> 01:48:20,960
No. 
Yeah, definitely not. 

2205
01:48:20,960 --> 01:48:23,520
Look at it kind of like we're 
saying this is kind of. 

2206
01:48:23,520 --> 01:48:25,760
Subjective, so we know. 
Which of these looks more 

2207
01:48:25,760 --> 01:48:28,280
impressive? 
And I I debate back and forth a 

2208
01:48:28,280 --> 01:48:32,040
lot between I think the castle 
at the top of the Erie puts it 

2209
01:48:32,040 --> 01:48:34,240
over over the top over the 
giants. 

2210
01:48:34,240 --> 01:48:37,080
Lance puts it over over the top 
of Castle Rock for me. 

2211
01:48:37,080 --> 01:48:38,320
But interesting. 
All right, cool. 

2212
01:48:38,320 --> 01:48:39,880
That's a that's a fair argument 
and and you're right. 

2213
01:48:39,880 --> 01:48:42,480
Like, you're right. 
To to talk about relative wonder

2214
01:48:43,040 --> 01:48:46,040
compared to just the region, not
compared to the each other. 

2215
01:48:46,200 --> 01:48:47,600
Like there's two different ways 
to to categories. 

2216
01:48:47,600 --> 01:48:49,840
Like you compare a Castle Rock 
to the bones, but you compare 

2217
01:48:49,840 --> 01:48:53,040
the bones to the rest of the 
bones and it's different. 

2218
01:48:53,040 --> 01:48:57,520
Or as or to consider for example
Greg or Clegane the Mountain, 

2219
01:48:57,760 --> 01:49:01,840
the real world actor half Thor 
Bjornsen. 

2220
01:49:01,840 --> 01:49:04,960
If I think I said that right, if
you see him next to his wife, 

2221
01:49:05,880 --> 01:49:07,960
you're like, well, he could pick
her up with one hand. 

2222
01:49:07,960 --> 01:49:10,360
And literally he does this. 
He's picked her up with one 

2223
01:49:10,360 --> 01:49:11,880
hand. 
But if you see him next to his 

2224
01:49:11,880 --> 01:49:14,880
father and brothers, you're 
like, he's just a little bit 

2225
01:49:14,880 --> 01:49:17,480
bigger, you know, Like those 
dudes are also enormous and 

2226
01:49:17,480 --> 01:49:19,360
they're like, they're like hills
and he's the mountain. 

2227
01:49:19,360 --> 01:49:21,720
But still, yeah, it's like when 
you're watching a basketball 

2228
01:49:21,720 --> 01:49:23,920
game. 
One guy in the team is like the 

2229
01:49:23,920 --> 01:49:24,560
short. 
Guy. 

2230
01:49:24,720 --> 01:49:26,880
But then you see him be 
interviewed by the reporter and 

2231
01:49:26,880 --> 01:49:28,640
you're like, Jesus, he's a foot 
taller. 

2232
01:49:28,680 --> 01:49:32,040
Yeah, exactly, exactly. 
And Sean, you bring up a great 

2233
01:49:32,040 --> 01:49:33,960
point here as. 
Well, is that one of the real 

2234
01:49:33,960 --> 01:49:36,840
world wonders we we mentioned 
early on was Victoria Falls. 

2235
01:49:36,840 --> 01:49:38,640
It's an incredible world, 
Waterfall. 

2236
01:49:39,080 --> 01:49:41,520
Alyssa's tears you bring up here
is the really the only like 

2237
01:49:41,520 --> 01:49:44,240
Waterfall we really hear about. 
And so that's it's a potential 

2238
01:49:44,240 --> 01:49:45,960
candidate for inclusion because 
of that. 

2239
01:49:46,160 --> 01:49:47,920
I didn't say that, but that is 
the reason. 

2240
01:49:47,920 --> 01:49:49,680
In the end, I'm going to pick 
the giant. 

2241
01:49:49,680 --> 01:49:53,160
Slants, because there's no other
waterfall represented on our 

2242
01:49:53,160 --> 01:49:55,960
list, and there's a bunch of 
waterfalls that are contenders 

2243
01:49:55,960 --> 01:49:57,680
in real life. 
They're all even ones that 

2244
01:49:57,680 --> 01:50:00,840
aren't the biggest or whatever 
still are beautiful, majestic 

2245
01:50:00,840 --> 01:50:03,560
when people come upon them. 
And I think the one in the giant

2246
01:50:03,560 --> 01:50:06,320
slants and everything else 
combined, I think it puts it 

2247
01:50:06,320 --> 01:50:07,640
over the top. 
That's a good argument. 

2248
01:50:07,640 --> 01:50:08,720
Like you. 
It's, it depends on what you 

2249
01:50:08,720 --> 01:50:09,720
value more, I think. 
Nina. 

2250
01:50:09,720 --> 01:50:11,640
Nina. 
Would take the opposite side 

2251
01:50:11,640 --> 01:50:15,640
here because of just Castle 
rocks, the sheer amazingness for

2252
01:50:15,640 --> 01:50:18,040
human habitation and the gold 
and all that. 

2253
01:50:18,160 --> 01:50:20,920
You're going more about the 
natural beauty of the place, 

2254
01:50:20,920 --> 01:50:22,600
which I think is a totally fair 
argument. 

2255
01:50:22,600 --> 01:50:26,760
Like, so yeah, that works. 
But also goes to show how 

2256
01:50:26,760 --> 01:50:29,200
subjective this whole thing is, 
which is why we brought up the 

2257
01:50:29,200 --> 01:50:30,680
beginning. 
Like CNN has their list, and 

2258
01:50:30,680 --> 01:50:33,600
then these other people have 
their list and then yeah, which 

2259
01:50:33,600 --> 01:50:39,040
is why the guesswork is both fun
but hard to take too heavily. 

2260
01:50:39,040 --> 01:50:40,360
Like, no, it's got to be this 
one. 

2261
01:50:40,680 --> 01:50:43,880
Blah blah blah, Let's move on. 
We've talked about forests, 

2262
01:50:43,880 --> 01:50:47,240
waterfalls, mountains. 
Here's a jungle ET or the 

2263
01:50:47,280 --> 01:50:50,680
jungles. 
Not just a jungle, a fabled land

2264
01:50:50,680 --> 01:50:55,720
even in the Seven Kingdoms ET. 
Is a large and diverse country, 

2265
01:50:55,840 --> 01:51:00,240
a realm of wind swept plains and
rolling hills, jungles and 

2266
01:51:00,240 --> 01:51:04,840
rainforests, deep lakes and 
rushing rivers and shrinking 

2267
01:51:04,840 --> 01:51:08,480
inland seas. 
Its legendary wealth is such as 

2268
01:51:08,480 --> 01:51:13,760
to allow its Princess to live in
houses of solid gold and dine on

2269
01:51:13,760 --> 01:51:17,720
sweetmeats powdered with pearls 
and jade Lomas. 

2270
01:51:17,720 --> 01:51:23,360
Longstrider awestruck by its 
marvels called Yiti the land of 

2271
01:51:23,360 --> 01:51:29,240
1000 gods and 100 Princess ruled
by one God Emperor. 

2272
01:51:29,680 --> 01:51:32,000
See this castley Rock rumor in 
reverse here. 

2273
01:51:32,000 --> 01:51:34,040
Oh, the Castle Rock is a. 
Castle made of solid gold. 

2274
01:51:34,040 --> 01:51:36,360
We have Princess that live in 
houses of solid gold here. 

2275
01:51:36,360 --> 01:51:38,160
This just feels like the the 
same. 

2276
01:51:38,160 --> 01:51:41,240
You know, it's funny because it 
makes me think of how our rich 

2277
01:51:41,240 --> 01:51:45,280
people do eat like gilded food. 
Like gold covered food or 

2278
01:51:45,280 --> 01:51:45,960
whatever. 
That's true. 

2279
01:51:46,000 --> 01:51:49,560
I haven't heard of people eating
pearls and jade, but oh really? 

2280
01:51:49,560 --> 01:51:52,240
Cleopatra did it. 
Cleopatra dissolved pearls and 

2281
01:51:52,240 --> 01:51:54,760
vinegar and drank them. 
I did know about her, but what 

2282
01:51:54,760 --> 01:51:56,640
about Jade? 
I don't know about Jade or. 

2283
01:51:56,640 --> 01:51:58,880
Doing that, Yeah, the pearls are
bio. 

2284
01:51:58,880 --> 01:51:59,520
Organic. 
So. 

2285
01:51:59,600 --> 01:52:01,320
So it's different like you can 
dissolve in vinegar or jade. 

2286
01:52:01,320 --> 01:52:03,600
I don't know. 
It's got to like powder it with 

2287
01:52:04,160 --> 01:52:08,160
force, I don't know. 
But the jungles of ET are 

2288
01:52:08,160 --> 01:52:12,800
definitely on the list. 
But I tended, I think they maybe

2289
01:52:12,800 --> 01:52:14,840
come up a little short. 
They're they're amazing. 

2290
01:52:14,840 --> 01:52:17,000
They got all sorts of variety of
flora and fauna. 

2291
01:52:17,000 --> 01:52:21,360
Cohort isn't a young city, but 
it's so much younger compared to

2292
01:52:21,360 --> 01:52:23,880
ET. 
So they have they explored their

2293
01:52:23,880 --> 01:52:26,960
vast jungles as much as Cohor 
has not explored the forest? 

2294
01:52:26,960 --> 01:52:29,800
Maybe, I don't know, They've had
a lot longer to do it. 

2295
01:52:29,800 --> 01:52:31,520
But also, it's not like it's a 
static thing. 

2296
01:52:31,520 --> 01:52:33,680
It's these vast jungles that 
will change over time. 

2297
01:52:33,680 --> 01:52:37,320
Different animals will evolve 
and have their time. 

2298
01:52:37,960 --> 01:52:41,960
And does that make does the 
mystery or lack of mystery make 

2299
01:52:41,960 --> 01:52:44,440
the jungle more wondrous? 
That's another point. 

2300
01:52:44,440 --> 01:52:47,360
Like does mystery increase the 
wonder of a place? 

2301
01:52:47,360 --> 01:52:50,480
Or does sometimes learning about
it and realizing how amazing 

2302
01:52:50,480 --> 01:52:53,040
those facts are make it 
elevated? 

2303
01:52:53,040 --> 01:52:55,600
It kind of depends. 
Sometimes mystery does enhance 

2304
01:52:55,840 --> 01:52:59,240
the one to replace. 
Sometimes removing the veil of 

2305
01:52:59,240 --> 01:53:00,520
mystery makes it less 
interesting. 

2306
01:53:00,520 --> 01:53:03,000
But sometimes those facts are so
interesting that it's more so. 

2307
01:53:03,000 --> 01:53:06,760
I guess you just can't say it's 
it's never so easy. 

2308
01:53:06,760 --> 01:53:08,240
Well, sometimes yes, sometimes 
no. 

2309
01:53:08,240 --> 01:53:10,080
Sometimes more mysteries are 
revealed. 

2310
01:53:10,080 --> 01:53:12,920
You, like lift the veil of this?
Mystery and like wait, there's 

2311
01:53:12,920 --> 01:53:15,680
four more mysteries. 
Yes River, reveal the curtain. 

2312
01:53:15,800 --> 01:53:18,600
Pull the curtain back to find. 
More curtains? 

2313
01:53:18,600 --> 01:53:21,160
Oh no. 
Yeah, a smaller Amond. 

2314
01:53:24,000 --> 01:53:24,840
That was right. 
Good. 

2315
01:53:25,240 --> 01:53:27,440
Reference to our last reference 
from our patron call. 

2316
01:53:27,600 --> 01:53:29,360
Yeah, it was really funny. 
I just want to share it. 

2317
01:53:29,360 --> 01:53:30,920
It was. 
It was. 

2318
01:53:31,040 --> 01:53:34,000
Everyone was shocked to to 
discover that when Eamon took 

2319
01:53:34,000 --> 01:53:36,200
off his eye patch, what was 
underneath it? 

2320
01:53:36,280 --> 01:53:39,280
A smaller Eamon. 
Yeah, it wasn't a sapphire, it 

2321
01:53:39,360 --> 01:53:41,840
was a smaller Eamon. 
It cracked me up. 

2322
01:53:41,960 --> 01:53:44,200
And then that Eamon took off his
eye patch and they were a 

2323
01:53:44,200 --> 01:53:45,560
smaller. 
Eamon and below that. 

2324
01:53:45,560 --> 01:53:47,680
Was a Cheeto or something? 
Yeah, it was. 

2325
01:53:47,840 --> 01:53:49,880
Not real silly, yeah. 
It's not infinite. 

2326
01:53:49,920 --> 01:53:54,560
It does end with a Cheeto, yeah.
Now, roughly looking at the map,

2327
01:53:54,720 --> 01:53:56,320
the jungles. 
Of ET are roughly. 

2328
01:53:56,320 --> 01:54:00,200
The size of the Force of Cohort,
but the jungles of ET are 

2329
01:54:00,200 --> 01:54:02,600
nothing compared to the 
Sothorios and Altos jungles, 

2330
01:54:02,600 --> 01:54:08,840
which probably weren't explored 
by Lomas, but they do exist, so 

2331
01:54:08,840 --> 01:54:10,920
we're looking at the map. 
It's like kind of hard to choose

2332
01:54:10,920 --> 01:54:13,280
that one when there's that one 
just South of it that's just so 

2333
01:54:13,280 --> 01:54:15,600
much larger. 
As cool as they sound, it sounds

2334
01:54:15,600 --> 01:54:18,720
like they might be beaten by 
less explored, more mysterious 

2335
01:54:18,720 --> 01:54:22,640
jungles that are nearby. 
But anyway, It's a worthy choice

2336
01:54:22,640 --> 01:54:26,800
though, because jungles can 
contain more flora and fauna 

2337
01:54:26,800 --> 01:54:28,640
than forests. 
They're more there's more 

2338
01:54:28,640 --> 01:54:32,160
biodiversity more just life in 
general and that in a fantasy 

2339
01:54:32,160 --> 01:54:35,080
setting can just there's just 
more that can happen with that. 

2340
01:54:35,080 --> 01:54:37,800
Especially with sorcery existing
in ET you've probably got 

2341
01:54:37,880 --> 01:54:40,320
similar things to Valyria where 
they've probably people have 

2342
01:54:40,320 --> 01:54:42,840
experimented on animals and 
changed them permanently with 

2343
01:54:42,840 --> 01:54:45,760
sorcery and then those animals 
go off and the ones that aren't 

2344
01:54:45,760 --> 01:54:47,520
sterile might breed with real 
animals. 

2345
01:54:47,520 --> 01:54:49,560
And this is something that 
happens in like D&D worlds where

2346
01:54:49,560 --> 01:54:52,240
like owl bears exist and the owl
bears, just they're out there. 

2347
01:54:52,240 --> 01:54:56,720
Now someone, some wizard created
that, some crazy creepy wizard 

2348
01:54:56,720 --> 01:54:58,120
like, what the hell were you 
doing, guy? 

2349
01:54:58,440 --> 01:55:01,280
And but Bowser, now those are a 
thing that exists in the world 

2350
01:55:01,280 --> 01:55:04,640
because they actually can breed.
And and that's probably a thing 

2351
01:55:04,640 --> 01:55:07,440
in in Westeros or not in 
Westeros, but in Essos as well, 

2352
01:55:07,680 --> 01:55:10,080
even if it's not currently a 
thing that's happening, it was a

2353
01:55:10,080 --> 01:55:12,400
thing that happened. 
You know one thing about the 

2354
01:55:12,400 --> 01:55:14,680
jungles of ET? 
It's kind of. 

2355
01:55:14,680 --> 01:55:16,760
Like you were talking earlier, 
if you had a bunch of candidates

2356
01:55:16,760 --> 01:55:19,960
for wonders of the world, like 
in the real world, neither the 

2357
01:55:19,960 --> 01:55:22,840
Nile or the Amazon might make 
the list 'cause they would steal

2358
01:55:22,840 --> 01:55:26,040
votes from each other. 
But similar contenders, I think 

2359
01:55:26,040 --> 01:55:29,360
ET has that problem with with 
some of these others that force 

2360
01:55:29,360 --> 01:55:32,520
the cohort or even to segue into
the island Isle of Lane. 

2361
01:55:32,520 --> 01:55:34,920
You know, I agree, yeah, which? 
Let's do, let's do that. 

2362
01:55:34,920 --> 01:55:36,640
Well, here is what the Isle of 
Lange. 

2363
01:55:36,640 --> 01:55:39,360
Which is just South of ET, used 
to be part of ET. 

2364
01:55:39,440 --> 01:55:42,200
It was ruled by ET. 
The the people connected 

2365
01:55:42,480 --> 01:55:45,320
anthropologically. 
There's some, you know, ethnic 

2366
01:55:45,320 --> 01:55:47,760
connections, but they have 
diverged in some ways. 

2367
01:55:48,120 --> 01:55:52,160
Let's hear what Lomas said about
it, southeast of Yin, surrounded

2368
01:55:52,160 --> 01:55:55,520
by the warm green. 
Waters of the Jade Sea, the 

2369
01:55:55,520 --> 01:56:02,080
verdant Isle of Lang, is home to
10,000 tigers and 10 million 

2370
01:56:02,080 --> 01:56:05,680
monkeys, or so Lomas long 
Strider once claimed. 

2371
01:56:06,120 --> 01:56:09,440
The great apes of Lang are also 
far famed. 

2372
01:56:09,600 --> 01:56:14,160
Amongst them are spotted 
humpback apes, said to be almost

2373
01:56:14,160 --> 01:56:20,160
as clever as men and hooded apes
as large as giants, so strong 

2374
01:56:20,320 --> 01:56:24,760
that they can pull the arms and 
legs off a man as easily as a 

2375
01:56:24,760 --> 01:56:27,720
boy might pull the wings off a 
family. 

2376
01:56:27,920 --> 01:56:30,320
That's pretty darn strong if 
you've ever seen, like, a video 

2377
01:56:30,320 --> 01:56:32,800
of an elephant, like, just. 
Pulling down a tree with a 

2378
01:56:32,800 --> 01:56:34,320
trunk. 
With their trunk they can just 

2379
01:56:34,320 --> 01:56:36,520
pull a whole tree down. 
Like, that's what I think of. 

2380
01:56:36,600 --> 01:56:40,720
I think of apes that can pull 
legs and arms off of a person. 

2381
01:56:41,160 --> 01:56:43,000
Think of King Kong. 
King Kong. 

2382
01:56:43,000 --> 01:56:44,240
Yeah, why not think of King 
Kong. 

2383
01:56:44,240 --> 01:56:46,120
It's a pretty good match. 
Yeah, why not so? 

2384
01:56:46,120 --> 01:56:48,120
Lang is clearly a place of great
interest. 

2385
01:56:48,120 --> 01:56:49,440
There's lots of cool stuff 
there. 

2386
01:56:49,440 --> 01:56:52,040
The jungles are impressive. 
It's just like ET. 

2387
01:56:52,280 --> 01:56:53,840
The whole island is covered with
jungle. 

2388
01:56:54,240 --> 01:56:55,400
No? 
Probably not more impressive 

2389
01:56:55,400 --> 01:56:58,360
than the ET jungles, although 
what's in them might be. 

2390
01:56:58,400 --> 01:57:01,440
And I don't mean the fauna, but 
that's impressive too. 

2391
01:57:01,440 --> 01:57:03,920
I mean like some of these 
ancient cities that might even 

2392
01:57:03,920 --> 01:57:06,560
be older than some of the Yitish
cities which so many of them 

2393
01:57:06,560 --> 01:57:09,760
should have been sealed off by 
the rulers because people go in 

2394
01:57:09,760 --> 01:57:11,720
there and disappear or come back
mad. 

2395
01:57:12,640 --> 01:57:14,960
Very much a Lovecraft reference.
There's There's references to 

2396
01:57:14,960 --> 01:57:16,560
the Old Ones, which are a 
Lovecraft thing. 

2397
01:57:16,680 --> 01:57:18,920
That would be unnatural, 
however. 

2398
01:57:20,200 --> 01:57:24,120
So not wondrous, but not man 
made or not. 

2399
01:57:24,120 --> 01:57:26,240
Yeah, but not. 
Or is man made rather, or 

2400
01:57:26,240 --> 01:57:30,680
perhaps made by some other 
creature, but not by nature, not

2401
01:57:30,680 --> 01:57:33,560
by the gods that we know of. 
And the people are unusual too. 

2402
01:57:34,200 --> 01:57:36,440
They're kind of like a mix of 
the Sarnori 'cause they're the 

2403
01:57:36,440 --> 01:57:39,720
tallest people on earth on 
Planetos, the the Yitish are, 

2404
01:57:39,840 --> 01:57:42,400
but they have golden eyes, kind 
of like the children of the 

2405
01:57:42,400 --> 01:57:44,640
forest. 
So they're like they're a very 

2406
01:57:44,640 --> 01:57:47,640
unusual and sounds like they're 
very attractive people. 

2407
01:57:47,640 --> 01:57:50,320
Tall and, you know, not 
obviously tall alone doesn't 

2408
01:57:50,320 --> 01:57:52,840
make you good looking, but the 
eyes and all that, like that's 

2409
01:57:52,840 --> 01:57:55,800
that sounds pretty cool. 
So people have spoken of that 

2410
01:57:55,800 --> 01:57:59,000
and you know, Loma speaks of 
that along those lines of their 

2411
01:57:59,000 --> 01:58:01,520
people being perhaps a world 
apart but still considers them 

2412
01:58:01,520 --> 01:58:03,520
human. 
They're not like some other race

2413
01:58:03,520 --> 01:58:06,480
entirely, but there might be 
something else going on in their

2414
01:58:06,480 --> 01:58:07,360
bloodlines. 
You never know. 

2415
01:58:07,760 --> 01:58:10,840
So there's a lot there, 
obviously, as I've said, but 

2416
01:58:10,840 --> 01:58:13,440
does it all add up to a wonder? 
There's no one thing you can 

2417
01:58:13,440 --> 01:58:15,960
point to. 
It's a really cool place, but I 

2418
01:58:15,960 --> 01:58:17,920
don't know what you would say is
a wonder out of all this. 

2419
01:58:18,040 --> 01:58:21,600
I would pick Ling over a lot of 
the others, especially compared.

2420
01:58:21,600 --> 01:58:27,360
To the ET because there he talks
about like, oh, there's so many 

2421
01:58:27,360 --> 01:58:32,440
Princess in gold, but here he 
says there's 10,000 tigers and 

2422
01:58:32,440 --> 01:58:35,440
10 million monkeys. 
Like, that's more natural. 

2423
01:58:35,440 --> 01:58:38,720
That's in that the wildlife 
sometimes itself can be at least

2424
01:58:38,720 --> 01:58:40,320
part of why something's a 
natural in a life. 

2425
01:58:40,880 --> 01:58:43,320
Komodo Island or the Galapagos 
Islands or something like that. 

2426
01:58:43,320 --> 01:58:45,960
OK, that's a good point, 'cause 
they're very different, like you

2427
01:58:45,960 --> 01:58:48,040
end up on certain islands. 
Around the world you end up with

2428
01:58:49,560 --> 01:58:53,040
microcosms of evolution and 
things develop very differently 

2429
01:58:53,040 --> 01:58:54,960
there. 
And yeah, so maybe Lang has some

2430
01:58:54,960 --> 01:58:55,880
of that. 
Maybe that's part of why the 

2431
01:58:55,880 --> 01:58:57,600
people are the way they are. 
But you also have some of these 

2432
01:58:57,600 --> 01:59:00,640
animals that are different. 
And so maybe as a whole it's a 

2433
01:59:00,640 --> 01:59:02,400
very wondrous country. 
But it's hard to point to one 

2434
01:59:02,400 --> 01:59:04,240
thing. 
If you say the the fauna of Lang

2435
01:59:04,240 --> 01:59:06,840
is a bit broad, especially 
'cause we're trying to, from my,

2436
01:59:07,080 --> 01:59:09,120
from my perspective, trying to 
maybe separate fauna into a 

2437
01:59:09,120 --> 01:59:10,960
separate category and say OK, 
well what are the most 

2438
01:59:10,960 --> 01:59:13,880
impressive animals then you 
might include some of these in 

2439
01:59:13,880 --> 01:59:15,520
that list. 
But if you're separating them 

2440
01:59:15,520 --> 01:59:18,320
from like natural geographical 
features, I can and I can see 

2441
01:59:18,320 --> 01:59:20,360
why it makes sense to separate 
that. 

2442
01:59:20,400 --> 01:59:23,480
And I I also did argue earlier 
that you kind of need to be able

2443
01:59:23,480 --> 01:59:27,160
to see. 
It all at once to count it, and 

2444
01:59:27,160 --> 01:59:28,920
I'm only kind of arguing that 
but that. 

2445
01:59:29,040 --> 01:59:31,560
That would keep this from. 
Counting if that's you know, 

2446
01:59:31,560 --> 01:59:34,120
it's a huge island. 
So Lang kind of reminds me of 

2447
01:59:34,120 --> 01:59:38,440
like a mishmash of Madagascar. 
New Zealand and Sri Lanka, like 

2448
01:59:38,440 --> 01:59:40,680
these islands that are just off 
the coast of much larger 

2449
01:59:40,680 --> 01:59:43,640
continents that have some things
in common with the mainland but 

2450
01:59:43,640 --> 01:59:45,240
have quite a lot. 
That's not the same. 

2451
01:59:45,240 --> 01:59:47,400
It's very different in terms of 
their biodiversity and some 

2452
01:59:47,400 --> 01:59:48,640
other things, some other 
factors. 

2453
01:59:48,640 --> 01:59:51,160
And they're also so big, I 
almost feel like it's not really

2454
01:59:51,160 --> 01:59:52,280
fit. 
You can't just say like. 

2455
01:59:52,840 --> 01:59:55,920
Asia is a natural wonder. 
Well, yeah, exactly. 

2456
01:59:55,920 --> 01:59:56,840
Yeah. 
That's kind of, it's a little 

2457
01:59:56,840 --> 01:59:59,240
extreme, but you see my point. 
Is some somewhere you got to 

2458
01:59:59,240 --> 02:00:01,560
narrow it down to like. 
Just this thing and not this 

2459
02:00:01,560 --> 02:00:03,640
whole massive area, you know? 
I agree. 

2460
02:00:04,320 --> 02:00:07,400
All right, Next up is Marahai. 
Perhaps the most obscure of 

2461
02:00:07,400 --> 02:00:09,040
these, a lot of y'all, may not 
have even heard of it. 

2462
02:00:09,200 --> 02:00:11,360
The sea snake's description 
makes it sound like it could be 

2463
02:00:11,360 --> 02:00:15,320
a candidate, which is it's a 
pair of volcanoes or like 

2464
02:00:15,320 --> 02:00:17,840
basically a volcanic island 
surrounded by like a Crescent 

2465
02:00:17,840 --> 02:00:19,520
island. 
I'm pretty sure this is based on

2466
02:00:19,520 --> 02:00:24,200
the Greek island of Santorini, 
which is named for Saint Irene, 

2467
02:00:24,560 --> 02:00:27,960
and it has a similar shape. 
Santorini is a Crescent with a 

2468
02:00:27,960 --> 02:00:30,040
smaller island in the middle. 
It's part of the Saccades 

2469
02:00:30,040 --> 02:00:33,120
Islands, but it also has a 
volcanic it was a volcanic 

2470
02:00:33,120 --> 02:00:35,280
island. 
It was believed to be the the 

2471
02:00:35,280 --> 02:00:39,160
volcano that blew up there 3600 
years ago is believed to be what

2472
02:00:39,160 --> 02:00:41,720
destroyed the Minoan 
civilization which dominated the

2473
02:00:41,720 --> 02:00:43,480
Mediterranean. 
You know, we're talking about 

2474
02:00:43,480 --> 02:00:48,000
the the people of Crete and it's
still the most active volcanic 

2475
02:00:48,000 --> 02:00:52,280
era, rather most active volcano 
in the Mediterranean region. 

2476
02:00:52,440 --> 02:00:54,880
Yet it's also a huge tourist 
destination because it's not 

2477
02:00:54,880 --> 02:00:56,960
believed to be dangerous at this
point. 

2478
02:00:57,200 --> 02:00:59,560
So that's pretty awesome. 
Like you imagine, like a 

2479
02:00:59,560 --> 02:01:02,600
volcanic island that's like 
jutting out of the middle of the

2480
02:01:02,600 --> 02:01:06,000
sea with this really unusual 
shape and it's visible from a 

2481
02:01:06,000 --> 02:01:12,520
distance. 
However, I given our guesses at 

2482
02:01:12,520 --> 02:01:14,800
least, my guess is that I think 
Loma's preferred overland 

2483
02:01:14,800 --> 02:01:15,840
travel. 
It's a very good chance he 

2484
02:01:15,840 --> 02:01:18,960
didn't see this spot. 
It might not be famous enough 

2485
02:01:18,960 --> 02:01:20,280
for him to have been drawn to 
it. 

2486
02:01:20,880 --> 02:01:22,200
It's in the middle of the Jade 
Sea. 

2487
02:01:22,200 --> 02:01:23,960
It's not the most easy place to 
access. 

2488
02:01:23,960 --> 02:01:24,920
It's not like you can land 
there. 

2489
02:01:24,920 --> 02:01:26,600
There's no people living there 
as far as we know. 

2490
02:01:26,880 --> 02:01:28,600
So it would be like sailing 
there. 

2491
02:01:28,600 --> 02:01:31,440
It'd be expensive to travel 
there because you'd have to sail

2492
02:01:31,440 --> 02:01:34,520
by it and do an expedition. 
Would you even land there or 

2493
02:01:34,520 --> 02:01:39,440
would you just pass by? 
So it's got some logistical 

2494
02:01:39,440 --> 02:01:41,960
flaws as an inclusion here, 
though it sounds like it might 

2495
02:01:41,960 --> 02:01:43,720
be beautiful enough, I'm not 
sure. 

2496
02:01:43,720 --> 02:01:45,760
What do you think, Sean? 
I think it might be similar to 

2497
02:01:45,760 --> 02:01:48,120
the the 14 Flames that you might
not have. 

2498
02:01:48,120 --> 02:01:51,000
To land there and walk up to the
baseball, you know, just swing 

2499
02:01:51,000 --> 02:01:52,880
it from a distance, but still be
impressive. 

2500
02:01:53,800 --> 02:01:55,440
But did he? 
See it from a distance. 

2501
02:01:55,720 --> 02:01:58,440
If he saw the 14 flames and saw 
this one, I don't think he would

2502
02:01:58,440 --> 02:02:00,920
have picked this one. 
It's probably 2nd place to the 

2503
02:02:00,920 --> 02:02:02,880
14 Flames tender, but I don't 
know if it makes the. 

2504
02:02:02,880 --> 02:02:06,040
List another real. 
World comparison would be the 

2505
02:02:06,040 --> 02:02:08,560
Ring of Fire, which. 
Is a series of volcanoes in the 

2506
02:02:08,560 --> 02:02:11,360
Pacific that are connected along
a fault line. 

2507
02:02:11,360 --> 02:02:16,960
I believe and often kind of go 
off together or are emitting 

2508
02:02:16,960 --> 02:02:20,240
lava at similar rates, and I 
don't know a whole lot about it,

2509
02:02:20,240 --> 02:02:21,800
but it's an awesome name. 
The Ring of Fire. 

2510
02:02:22,040 --> 02:02:23,280
We've talked about it a few 
times before. 

2511
02:02:23,440 --> 02:02:26,440
Can I say a little bit of a 
funny thing that happened to me?

2512
02:02:26,440 --> 02:02:29,360
You must I. 
Originally made our wonders made

2513
02:02:29,360 --> 02:02:36,000
by man map, cropped it to 16 by 
9, which is landscape style for,

2514
02:02:36,000 --> 02:02:38,360
you know, YouTube and whatnot as
you would imagine. 

2515
02:02:38,800 --> 02:02:40,880
And in doing that I had to make 
sure the wall was in it. 

2516
02:02:40,960 --> 02:02:45,000
Cropped it, got it already, 
edited it, went to make this one

2517
02:02:45,320 --> 02:02:48,920
and realized I was like, where 
is Marahai? 

2518
02:02:49,240 --> 02:02:52,680
It's exactly cropped out. 
Here's the wonders made by man. 

2519
02:02:52,680 --> 02:02:56,520
I just switched to it. 
You can see it now that the 

2520
02:02:56,520 --> 02:02:58,840
wall's now. 
Once the wall's visible it crops

2521
02:02:58,840 --> 02:03:00,760
out. 
Mara high not. 

2522
02:03:00,760 --> 02:03:04,440
It's not possible to do a 16 by 
9 crop of of of Michael 

2523
02:03:04,440 --> 02:03:09,320
Clarifel's Westeros known world 
map with both the Wall and Mara 

2524
02:03:09,320 --> 02:03:11,320
high. 
That's neat that they're kind of

2525
02:03:11,320 --> 02:03:13,480
apparent, like you got the 
volcanic wall and the. 

2526
02:03:13,480 --> 02:03:16,640
Sea and the land based ice wall.
They're kind of opposites. 

2527
02:03:16,920 --> 02:03:18,400
Coincidence. 
Does Michael Clarifel? 

2528
02:03:18,400 --> 02:03:23,200
Know something we don't? 
Our final inclusion is the 1000.

2529
02:03:23,240 --> 02:03:26,440
Isles, it's a distant 
archipelago, archipelago, 

2530
02:03:27,120 --> 02:03:30,520
archipelago, archipelago. 
It's a distant archipelago far 

2531
02:03:30,520 --> 02:03:31,600
to. 
The east of IB meaning. 

2532
02:03:31,600 --> 02:03:34,440
North of Essos. 
It could be the site of an 

2533
02:03:34,440 --> 02:03:36,760
ancient civilization is now 
gone, and it could be that they 

2534
02:03:36,760 --> 02:03:39,800
are long gone, thanks to an 
undersea race like the Deep 

2535
02:03:39,800 --> 02:03:41,480
Ones. 
This was more of an honorable 

2536
02:03:41,480 --> 02:03:43,440
mention to me. 
I kind of doubt Lomas even went 

2537
02:03:43,440 --> 02:03:45,080
there. 
Yeah, exactly. 

2538
02:03:45,200 --> 02:03:47,320
So far north, we're not even 
sure he went to the. 

2539
02:03:47,320 --> 02:03:50,040
Dothraki region and this is. 
North of that, and it would take

2540
02:03:50,040 --> 02:03:52,320
a ship to get there, and there's
no ships in that region. 

2541
02:03:52,320 --> 02:03:58,600
You'd have to go sail like from 
Braavos or Laura or something, 

2542
02:03:58,600 --> 02:04:00,280
'cause you wouldn't get the 
Ebenezer to take you there. 

2543
02:04:00,280 --> 02:04:03,000
They're they're pretty 
xenophobic and they're not going

2544
02:04:03,000 --> 02:04:05,520
to, OK, they're not going to. 
Lomas doesn't have the money to 

2545
02:04:05,520 --> 02:04:08,320
pay some Ebenezer whaler to go 
all the way over there just for 

2546
02:04:08,320 --> 02:04:09,840
him, so I kind of doubt he went 
there. 

2547
02:04:09,840 --> 02:04:13,200
Also, even if he did, it sounds 
really cool as an archaeological

2548
02:04:13,200 --> 02:04:17,080
wonder and its association with 
some of these supernatural other

2549
02:04:17,080 --> 02:04:20,640
world, or maybe not 
supernatural, but just like non 

2550
02:04:20,640 --> 02:04:23,040
human races that live beneath 
the sea, they're not even 

2551
02:04:23,040 --> 02:04:25,520
necessarily supernatural, 
they're just not human. 

2552
02:04:26,000 --> 02:04:28,080
But they might be supernatural. 
They might have sorcery of their

2553
02:04:28,080 --> 02:04:31,200
own, they might have the ways to
get in our dreams or something 

2554
02:04:31,200 --> 02:04:35,360
creepy like that. 
But the sea snake did go there 

2555
02:04:35,360 --> 02:04:37,360
and he's like, yeah, it's not 
really 1000 islands, it's more 

2556
02:04:37,360 --> 02:04:39,640
like 300. 
And if you compare that to the 

2557
02:04:39,640 --> 02:04:45,000
real world, that's nothing. 
The Philippines is 7641 islands,

2558
02:04:45,640 --> 02:04:49,720
the Indonesia is over 17,000 
islands. 

2559
02:04:49,920 --> 02:04:52,880
So this is really not much my 
real world standards. 

2560
02:04:53,080 --> 02:04:55,440
Then again, it's all relative 
Lomas. 

2561
02:04:55,560 --> 02:04:58,080
This might be the biggest chain 
of islands Lomas has ever seen, 

2562
02:04:58,080 --> 02:05:00,560
the biggest archipelago Lomas 
has ever seen, assuming he's 

2563
02:05:00,560 --> 02:05:01,880
seen it, which is kind of 
doubtful. 

2564
02:05:02,240 --> 02:05:05,920
So again the relative argument 
that Sean made so well comes up 

2565
02:05:05,920 --> 02:05:08,480
here is like, Oh yeah, it was 
Sean, But that Lomas never saw 

2566
02:05:08,480 --> 02:05:10,520
the Philippines, Lomas never saw
Indonesia. 

2567
02:05:10,520 --> 02:05:11,880
To him, this might be 
incredible. 

2568
02:05:11,920 --> 02:05:14,000
So yeah, that's it's worth 
consideration. 

2569
02:05:14,000 --> 02:05:15,440
Personally, I don't think it 
quite makes the cut. 

2570
02:05:15,440 --> 02:05:18,160
But I but it was worth including
because of arguments like that. 

2571
02:05:18,200 --> 02:05:20,560
It depends too on you know. 
When you talk about the number 

2572
02:05:20,560 --> 02:05:23,160
of islands that you know the. 
Philippines and Indonesia are 

2573
02:05:23,160 --> 02:05:25,600
spread out over a huge, huge 
area. 

2574
02:05:25,600 --> 02:05:28,480
That's true. 
So for example, one of the seven

2575
02:05:28,480 --> 02:05:34,000
wonders how long Bay in Vietnam 
it has, it only has 300 islands 

2576
02:05:34,000 --> 02:05:35,760
and they're kind of small, but 
they're also kind of 

2577
02:05:35,760 --> 02:05:39,960
concentrated, just a bunch of 
like little islands jutting up 

2578
02:05:39,960 --> 02:05:41,440
just enough for trees to grow on
them. 

2579
02:05:41,440 --> 02:05:44,160
But there's 300 of them, but 
it's in kind of a small area. 

2580
02:05:44,520 --> 02:05:47,160
But when I look at the map, it 
doesn't look like the Thousand 

2581
02:05:47,160 --> 02:05:49,760
Islands are a small area. 
It seems like a similar 

2582
02:05:49,840 --> 02:05:51,920
Philippines huge spread out 
area. 

2583
02:05:51,920 --> 02:05:55,840
So it's another one of my Orient
before. 

2584
02:05:55,840 --> 02:05:56,960
Kind of against it, you 
couldn't. 

2585
02:05:56,960 --> 02:05:58,640
See this all at once? 
You know what I mean? 

2586
02:05:58,640 --> 02:06:02,680
Like, it's it's. 
Even if you did go there, I 

2587
02:06:02,680 --> 02:06:04,760
don't think this one is going to
make the cut for a bunch of 

2588
02:06:04,760 --> 02:06:05,680
different reasons. 
Right on. 

2589
02:06:05,680 --> 02:06:07,000
Fair enough. 
Okay. 

2590
02:06:07,400 --> 02:06:08,960
Well, let's do our final 
guesses. 

2591
02:06:09,240 --> 02:06:11,200
Start off with Adam Whiteheads. 
Wordheads. 

2592
02:06:11,200 --> 02:06:14,040
He was a big resource for us 
throughout this episode, so 

2593
02:06:14,040 --> 02:06:17,920
let's take his guesses first. 
Casually rock 14 flames The 

2594
02:06:17,920 --> 02:06:21,000
Roin, the Bone Mountains. 
The Great Sand Sea those are his

2595
02:06:21,000 --> 02:06:24,760
top five and then he has a 
secondary list of for the fill 

2596
02:06:24,760 --> 02:06:27,280
that last slot and the top of 
that list is the forest of 

2597
02:06:27,280 --> 02:06:28,800
cohort. 
So we'll we'll say he picks 

2598
02:06:28,800 --> 02:06:32,000
forest of cohort for his sixth 
one and but he had a lot of 

2599
02:06:32,000 --> 02:06:35,280
honorable mentions as do we I'll
go next these are in no 

2600
02:06:35,280 --> 02:06:38,440
particular order the Rhine the 
Bone Mountains the Forest of 

2601
02:06:38,440 --> 02:06:41,840
Cohort, the great Sand Sea the 
Great Grass Sea and Casualty 

2602
02:06:41,840 --> 02:06:43,480
rock. 
So I differ from him in that I 

2603
02:06:43,480 --> 02:06:47,480
don't have the 14 flames and I 
do have the Great Grass Sea. 

2604
02:06:47,840 --> 02:06:51,000
Now if he saw the 14 Flames and 
y'all made some good arguments 

2605
02:06:51,000 --> 02:06:52,920
to how he could have maybe seen 
them even after the fact and 

2606
02:06:52,920 --> 02:06:54,800
seen them from a distance that I
didn't fully consider. 

2607
02:06:55,040 --> 02:06:58,720
But I'll stick to what I wrote 
here and say that if he saw 

2608
02:06:58,720 --> 02:07:00,400
them, he picked them. 
But I'm guessing he didn't. 

2609
02:07:00,560 --> 02:07:03,320
And I also kind of wanted to 
include the jungles, but because

2610
02:07:03,320 --> 02:07:05,800
of the larger winds and 
Sithorios and Altos, I thought 

2611
02:07:05,800 --> 02:07:07,880
maybe they would be. 
That's a fair reason to keep 

2612
02:07:07,880 --> 02:07:10,320
them just out of the top seven. 
I'm going to make it tough, 

2613
02:07:10,360 --> 02:07:13,080
uneasy. 
OK, say you did include the 14. 

2614
02:07:13,120 --> 02:07:14,720
Flames. 
What Gets kicked? 

2615
02:07:14,920 --> 02:07:18,440
Oh gosh, if it's too hard, you 
don't have to probably. 

2616
02:07:18,440 --> 02:07:19,840
The sand, sea, I think the 
grass. 

2617
02:07:19,840 --> 02:07:21,680
Sea is more impressive because 
it's more beautiful. 

2618
02:07:21,840 --> 02:07:25,080
But it might be the forest or 
Cohor, because like, the forest 

2619
02:07:25,080 --> 02:07:27,360
sounds awesome, but if it's just
like a forest in a jungle aren't

2620
02:07:27,360 --> 02:07:28,600
that different. 
And we've already got these 

2621
02:07:28,600 --> 02:07:31,160
other huge jungles so it feels 
like it's got comparisons that 

2622
02:07:31,160 --> 02:07:32,840
like, there's nothing. 
There's no comparing to the 

2623
02:07:32,840 --> 02:07:34,160
Rhine. 
There's no comparing to the Bone

2624
02:07:34,160 --> 02:07:36,080
Mountains. 
And the Great Grassy and Great 

2625
02:07:36,080 --> 02:07:37,560
Sand Sea are pretty unique to 
themselves. 

2626
02:07:37,560 --> 02:07:39,320
Cassie Rock as well. 
Like, I I can't. 

2627
02:07:39,320 --> 02:07:40,800
It's hard to not include Cassie 
rock. 

2628
02:07:40,800 --> 02:07:43,280
So Forestar Cohor seems like it 
gets the boot, which is what 

2629
02:07:43,280 --> 02:07:44,680
Adam apparently would do as 
well. 

2630
02:07:45,800 --> 02:07:49,640
OK, here's Nina's. 
The Royne, the Bone Mountains, 

2631
02:07:49,760 --> 02:07:53,040
Cast of the Rock 14 flames, 
Forester Cohor and Great Sand 

2632
02:07:53,040 --> 02:07:56,520
Sea. 
So I think that's the same as 

2633
02:07:56,520 --> 02:08:00,480
Adam's looks like which fair, 
fair play she had. 

2634
02:08:01,400 --> 02:08:03,200
She was doing the same thing 
with the superlatives kind of 

2635
02:08:03,200 --> 02:08:05,120
that we were. 
Which was like she wanted to 

2636
02:08:05,120 --> 02:08:07,680
pick the deep caves of Norvas. 
Well, it's the deepest cave 

2637
02:08:07,680 --> 02:08:09,160
system that he's seen. 
The Royne. 

2638
02:08:09,280 --> 02:08:11,880
Biggest river, Bone Mountains, 
biggest mountains cast the rock.

2639
02:08:11,880 --> 02:08:16,240
Most impressive, like singular 
feature 14 flames, biggest 

2640
02:08:16,240 --> 02:08:19,200
volcanoes, forest of cohort, 
biggest forest, great sand sea, 

2641
02:08:19,200 --> 02:08:21,720
biggest desert. 
So yeah, like the biggest X or 

2642
02:08:21,720 --> 02:08:23,520
whatever. 
Now that does leave a few out, 

2643
02:08:23,720 --> 02:08:28,880
like the biggest jungle and the 
biggest grassland, but you got 

2644
02:08:28,880 --> 02:08:31,320
to leave something out. 
There's no way to, right? 

2645
02:08:31,480 --> 02:08:32,920
I'll show you you're up. 
All right. 

2646
02:08:32,920 --> 02:08:35,160
Mine are pretty similar. 
I also did it in order of 

2647
02:08:35,160 --> 02:08:37,280
likelihood I started. 
With the Roy and I just can't 

2648
02:08:37,280 --> 02:08:40,960
imagine a way the Roy is not 
there bone mountains same same 

2649
02:08:40,960 --> 02:08:44,080
deal based on how he described 
it and we know he saw it and and

2650
02:08:44,080 --> 02:08:48,280
whatnot 14 flames I I put pretty
high up there because I just 

2651
02:08:48,280 --> 02:08:51,720
think I think he did see it I 
think I I I think from afar he 

2652
02:08:51,720 --> 02:08:55,040
would have seen it he would have
been awed by the destruction it 

2653
02:08:55,040 --> 02:08:57,720
would have wreaked upon such a 
large culture. 

2654
02:08:57,880 --> 02:08:59,840
I don't know. 
I'm putting the 14 flames on 

2655
02:08:59,840 --> 02:09:02,600
there. 
Casterly Rock, You know, I think

2656
02:09:02,600 --> 02:09:05,920
he wants Westeros to be 
represented in some respect. 

2657
02:09:05,920 --> 02:09:09,120
Without Casterly Rock or the 
Giants Lands, there's just no 

2658
02:09:09,120 --> 02:09:10,840
wonders in Westeros. 
That doesn't. 

2659
02:09:11,040 --> 02:09:13,880
No, no, no natural wonders in 
Westeros and that doesn't make 

2660
02:09:13,880 --> 02:09:15,520
sense to me. 
So I think there has to be a 

2661
02:09:15,520 --> 02:09:18,280
Westeros one. 
OK, then I'm going to say the 

2662
02:09:18,280 --> 02:09:21,640
Forest of Cohor, but I think 
Sean really convinced me against

2663
02:09:21,640 --> 02:09:24,240
it a little bit. 
Like I said it before, Sean made

2664
02:09:24,240 --> 02:09:26,840
his case about what would he 
have really seen? 

2665
02:09:27,000 --> 02:09:29,000
I mean, maybe if I tell myself 
there were some really 

2666
02:09:29,000 --> 02:09:31,640
impressive trees, like some 
Redwood trees or something he 

2667
02:09:32,480 --> 02:09:35,920
that's the one after this, after
this discussion, I might be most

2668
02:09:35,920 --> 02:09:40,960
likely to change away from 
forest of Kohor and I have as my

2669
02:09:40,960 --> 02:09:44,880
last one the bleeding sea, which
I'm just partial to again, 

2670
02:09:44,880 --> 02:09:49,480
because I think if he went to 
the five forts, he saw the 

2671
02:09:49,480 --> 02:09:51,400
bleeding sea. 
And what a sight that would 

2672
02:09:51,400 --> 02:09:53,320
have. 
Been like this, blood red, this,

2673
02:09:53,320 --> 02:09:56,440
this Red Sea, like a base of 
these crazy forts, maybe. 

2674
02:09:56,440 --> 02:09:57,520
I don't know. 
I think it might have been 

2675
02:09:57,520 --> 02:10:00,640
particularly amazing. 
I don't know that I think these 

2676
02:10:00,640 --> 02:10:04,600
red seas and lakes are common 
throughout Essos and Westeros. 

2677
02:10:04,600 --> 02:10:09,000
Even if we said they're common 
in in in our world, I don't know

2678
02:10:09,000 --> 02:10:10,680
that I think there's many of 
them there. 

2679
02:10:10,680 --> 02:10:12,600
It might have been the first one
he'd seen. 

2680
02:10:12,600 --> 02:10:14,520
Yeah. 
And it would be like, whoa, it 

2681
02:10:14,520 --> 02:10:16,440
would be very stunning, 
especially at the. 

2682
02:10:16,480 --> 02:10:18,040
End of the world, You're at the 
five. 

2683
02:10:18,040 --> 02:10:22,240
Forts, however, because I don't 
necessarily think he saw the 

2684
02:10:22,240 --> 02:10:25,240
five forts, as I said in our 
last episode, I really want to 

2685
02:10:25,240 --> 02:10:26,840
think he did, but I don't know 
for sure. 

2686
02:10:27,320 --> 02:10:31,040
So assuming he didn't see the 
five forts or the bleeding sea, 

2687
02:10:31,280 --> 02:10:34,320
I'm going to say the Giants 
Lance as my other one. 

2688
02:10:34,320 --> 02:10:36,400
Eighth. 
You're all from 8th if if, if I 

2689
02:10:36,400 --> 02:10:37,880
say no. 
Bleeding sea? 

2690
02:10:37,880 --> 02:10:40,200
No. 5 forts I think. 
The Giants, Lance and I think 

2691
02:10:40,200 --> 02:10:45,000
Sean again convinced me here by 
arguing for Alyssa's tears. 

2692
02:10:45,000 --> 02:10:47,400
By arguing for the waterfall. 
The stunning waterfall. 

2693
02:10:47,400 --> 02:10:49,960
Because it's a good argument. 
It's not represented elsewhere. 

2694
02:10:49,960 --> 02:10:52,200
There's not many water features 
in general. 

2695
02:10:52,640 --> 02:10:56,960
So I think I I think that's I I 
go back and forth between and I 

2696
02:10:56,960 --> 02:10:59,600
can be swayed a lot and honestly
just looking at the map and 

2697
02:10:59,600 --> 02:11:02,360
seeing how things are 
concentrated a bit and I'm like 

2698
02:11:02,360 --> 02:11:05,680
well I feel like it's very empty
over in Westeros side and I 

2699
02:11:05,680 --> 02:11:08,640
don't know that he would have 
wanted Westeros to see him so 

2700
02:11:08,640 --> 02:11:11,800
paltry Good said. 
Those are good arguments you 

2701
02:11:11,800 --> 02:11:13,680
like really getting into Lomas's
head, and I like. 

2702
02:11:13,680 --> 02:11:15,560
That that's a that's a good way 
to think about it. 

2703
02:11:15,920 --> 02:11:17,280
Sean. 
Tell us what you think. 

2704
02:11:17,280 --> 02:11:19,400
What are your picks? 
I did the hard thing and left 

2705
02:11:19,400 --> 02:11:21,480
Casterly Rock off. 
That is hard. 

2706
02:11:21,480 --> 02:11:22,880
That's. 
Tough was is it 8th? 

2707
02:11:22,960 --> 02:11:26,000
Did it barely miss the cut? 
Yes, I think it would be eighth 

2708
02:11:26,000 --> 02:11:28,000
there. 
There's a couple like a if then.

2709
02:11:28,000 --> 02:11:31,520
Kind of choices I'd make like 14
flames. 

2710
02:11:31,800 --> 02:11:34,520
Assuming you saw it. 
Yeah, I think if you didn't see 

2711
02:11:34,520 --> 02:11:36,640
it then Casterly Rock. 
It gets in there. 

2712
02:11:37,280 --> 02:11:41,080
Bone mountains for sure. 
I picked the Giants, Lance, the 

2713
02:11:41,080 --> 02:11:44,400
Great Sansi and I picked the 
Island of Ling. 

2714
02:11:44,800 --> 02:11:45,960
Nice. 
We all picked the Roy. 

2715
02:11:46,120 --> 02:11:49,240
But I think the Wild, I kind of 
talked myself into it, thinking 

2716
02:11:49,240 --> 02:11:51,200
about all the wildlife that he 
was referencing there. 

2717
02:11:51,200 --> 02:11:52,400
That made me want to pick that 
one. 

2718
02:11:52,600 --> 02:11:54,480
Cool, right on. 
Well said everybody. 

2719
02:11:54,480 --> 02:11:56,080
Now As for our Facebook group, I
also. 

2720
02:11:56,080 --> 02:11:59,120
Put up a poll in our Facebook 
group that's just facebook.com. 

2721
02:11:59,720 --> 02:12:01,920
History of Westeros. 
You could find that group. 

2722
02:12:01,920 --> 02:12:04,840
We got over 3000 members in it. 
It's a very pretty active group.

2723
02:12:04,840 --> 02:12:07,840
Lots of good discussions and 
occasionally fun stuff like this

2724
02:12:07,840 --> 02:12:10,080
to participate with. 
Technically that's the link to 

2725
02:12:10,080 --> 02:12:12,360
our Facebook page, but that'll 
that'll get you set. 

2726
02:12:12,400 --> 02:12:14,320
The right way. 
Go to our Facebook page. 

2727
02:12:14,320 --> 02:12:16,600
You'll find our Facebook group. 
Yeah, Thanks for the correction.

2728
02:12:16,600 --> 02:12:19,320
Yeah, that's good. 
So the this is. 

2729
02:12:19,320 --> 02:12:21,640
In order because this was a 
multi choice poll. 

2730
02:12:21,640 --> 02:12:25,680
So in order of most picked to 
least picked top seven The Roy 

2731
02:12:26,000 --> 02:12:30,080
14, Flames, Giants, Lance, 
Mother Mountains, Slash, Womb of

2732
02:12:30,080 --> 02:12:32,600
the World, Bone Mountains and 
Castley Rock. 

2733
02:12:32,720 --> 02:12:35,320
So there's the the the Facebook 
group like Mother Mountain's 

2734
02:12:35,320 --> 02:12:37,400
womb of the world is an 
inclusion unlike the rest of us.

2735
02:12:37,680 --> 02:12:39,480
Otherwise it was some of the 
similar ones. 

2736
02:12:39,640 --> 02:12:43,520
They didn't get their image 
choice downplayed by Aziz. 

2737
02:12:43,800 --> 02:12:44,680
That's true. 
They didn't see. 

2738
02:12:44,840 --> 02:12:46,880
They didn't have that argument 
staring them in the face there, 

2739
02:12:46,880 --> 02:12:48,280
yeah. 
Like like this one did. 

2740
02:12:48,280 --> 02:12:51,120
Yeah, this one kind of got off 
to a false start with that for 

2741
02:12:51,120 --> 02:12:56,560
this, for this live version. 
But that is our episode, folks. 

2742
02:12:56,560 --> 02:12:58,400
That is. 
I hope you all enjoyed it. 

2743
02:12:58,400 --> 02:12:59,920
It's really fun going through 
these and guessing. 

2744
02:12:59,920 --> 02:13:02,280
We'd love to hear your guesses. 
Did we miss one? 

2745
02:13:02,640 --> 02:13:04,760
Is there something that we 
didn't include that maybe 

2746
02:13:04,760 --> 02:13:07,520
deserved it to be included? 
I'd love to hear that thought as

2747
02:13:07,520 --> 02:13:10,080
well. 
And I'm curious as well. 

2748
02:13:10,080 --> 02:13:14,440
Another thing I'm curious about 
is it if we'll see any of these 

2749
02:13:14,440 --> 02:13:16,200
that we have yet to see, like 
some of them we've seen already,

2750
02:13:16,200 --> 02:13:17,360
we've seen. 
We're definitely going to see 

2751
02:13:17,360 --> 02:13:19,160
more of Castle Rock and we 
really haven't seen that much of

2752
02:13:19,160 --> 02:13:20,360
it. 
We haven't been inside it really

2753
02:13:20,360 --> 02:13:21,800
at all. 
So that's coming. 

2754
02:13:22,200 --> 02:13:28,240
I doubt we'll see, you know, the
Bone Mountains, but we might 

2755
02:13:28,240 --> 02:13:29,760
see. 
And we have seen the Roin 

2756
02:13:29,760 --> 02:13:32,080
already and we we won't see the 
Caves of Norvos. 

2757
02:13:32,320 --> 02:13:33,960
We might get a little closer to 
14 flames. 

2758
02:13:33,960 --> 02:13:35,560
It's possible. 
It's possible we'll see the 

2759
02:13:35,640 --> 02:13:39,080
forest with Cohor Giants Lance. 
I kind of doubt we'll ever see 

2760
02:13:39,080 --> 02:13:42,320
that again actually, because 
it's winter now and you can't go

2761
02:13:42,320 --> 02:13:46,560
to the Erie in winter Lang. 
Unlikely we'll go there during 

2762
02:13:46,560 --> 02:13:48,360
the book, during a song of 
license fire, but maybe some 

2763
02:13:48,360 --> 02:13:50,480
other, maybe that ET show 
happens. 

2764
02:13:50,480 --> 02:13:52,440
We'll get to see it there. 
So a lot of these we will 

2765
02:13:52,440 --> 02:13:54,160
probably never see. 
We'll definitely see more of the

2766
02:13:54,160 --> 02:13:56,720
great grassy cause. 
Danny's already there again. 

2767
02:13:57,160 --> 02:14:00,000
But yeah, so I'm curious to see 
what if these other will pop up 

2768
02:14:00,000 --> 02:14:03,680
actually in A Song of Ice and 
Fire or in future related 

2769
02:14:03,680 --> 02:14:07,760
properties, you know, like other
TV shows or that could change 

2770
02:14:07,760 --> 02:14:10,880
our view of it. 
Maybe we get a really good image

2771
02:14:10,920 --> 02:14:13,240
of the Mother Mountain to a 
place that's kind of weak one. 

2772
02:14:13,240 --> 02:14:14,720
And maybe people will think 
about it differently. 

2773
02:14:14,720 --> 02:14:16,920
Look at the shining waters of 
the womb of the world. 

2774
02:14:17,080 --> 02:14:18,320
Are you sure? 
That's not a wonder? 

2775
02:14:19,360 --> 02:14:22,600
What Real World Lake enhanced by
modern production techniques 

2776
02:14:22,600 --> 02:14:24,880
will they use to show that? 
I don't know, Shawn, a cat has 

2777
02:14:24,880 --> 02:14:26,640
been requested. 
I'll see what I can do. 

2778
02:14:26,680 --> 02:14:29,000
In the meantime, I will give you
all the answer to this trivia 

2779
02:14:29,000 --> 02:14:30,080
question. 
What 3? 

2780
02:14:30,080 --> 02:14:32,760
Roads pass through the Bone 
Mountains. 

2781
02:14:32,760 --> 02:14:35,240
It says 1000 roads lead in, but 
only three lead out. 

2782
02:14:35,400 --> 02:14:39,360
Those three have nicknames the 
Steel Rd. the Stone Rd. and the 

2783
02:14:39,360 --> 02:14:41,160
Sand Rd. 
This question has a little bit 

2784
02:14:41,160 --> 02:14:43,360
in common with the three 
traditional offerings of the 

2785
02:14:43,360 --> 02:14:45,600
Dothraki. 
I forget what they are, but they

2786
02:14:45,600 --> 02:14:50,640
all start with S This is like 
silk and seed steel Silk. 

2787
02:14:50,640 --> 02:14:52,640
Or was it God I? 
Mixed it up because I did the 

2788
02:14:52,640 --> 02:14:55,200
true I I come up, came up with 
the trivia options and I made it

2789
02:14:55,200 --> 02:14:57,920
confusing on on on per. 
I made it so confusing the 

2790
02:14:57,920 --> 02:14:59,840
disease got it wrong. 
Yep, I got it wrong. 

2791
02:14:59,840 --> 02:15:05,680
But one of them is definitely 
seed because I find it very 

2792
02:15:05,680 --> 02:15:07,480
dirty. 
I know that's not what they 

2793
02:15:07,480 --> 02:15:11,160
mean, but agriculture? 
Yeah, I will never forget that. 

2794
02:15:11,160 --> 02:15:13,120
One of them is seed. 
Yeah. 

2795
02:15:13,120 --> 02:15:15,640
On the other hand, the dis rock.
You don't like farming, So like 

2796
02:15:15,640 --> 02:15:17,960
why are they care about? 
Seeds, maybe. 

2797
02:15:17,960 --> 02:15:21,160
So maybe it is the the version, 
the inappropriate version you're

2798
02:15:21,160 --> 02:15:23,520
thinking of. 
But also there is a Silk Road, 

2799
02:15:23,800 --> 02:15:26,160
but it doesn't. 
It kind of merges with the Sand 

2800
02:15:26,160 --> 02:15:27,480
Rd. 
The Silk Road only exists on the

2801
02:15:27,480 --> 02:15:30,040
Eastern side. 
Either way, it's pretty cool. 

2802
02:15:30,160 --> 02:15:34,320
Episodes that we've done in the 
past that relate to today 

2803
02:15:34,320 --> 02:15:37,640
include an episode on Castle 
Rock, The Doom of Valyria. 

2804
02:15:37,640 --> 02:15:39,600
We've done that plus a lot of 
other episodes in Valyria. 

2805
02:15:40,160 --> 02:15:42,920
We did an episode on ET, we did 
an episode on Cohor. 

2806
02:15:42,920 --> 02:15:45,240
Of course the forest figures 
largely in that. 

2807
02:15:45,240 --> 02:15:48,320
Mother Rhine is part one of our 
Nymeria series, talks a lot 

2808
02:15:48,320 --> 02:15:52,640
about the River Mantaris patrons
only episode that talks about 

2809
02:15:52,640 --> 02:15:57,240
the sea of size and the fallout 
zone of the doom that is 

2810
02:15:57,240 --> 02:15:59,640
connected to mantaris 'cause 
they live right on the outskirts

2811
02:15:59,640 --> 02:16:02,080
of that. 
We have various other episodes 

2812
02:16:02,080 --> 02:16:05,240
that connect to some of these in
ways as well that I didn't 

2813
02:16:05,240 --> 02:16:07,680
mention. 
We have so many episodes that I 

2814
02:16:07,680 --> 02:16:11,840
can't always remember which ones
connect to what, but you all can

2815
02:16:11,960 --> 02:16:15,960
point out that if you care to 
assist on that regard. 

2816
02:16:16,360 --> 02:16:19,840
And Sean is back with a Kitty 
cat in arms, cradled like a 

2817
02:16:19,840 --> 02:16:21,760
little baby. 
And I got the answer. 

2818
02:16:22,400 --> 02:16:24,240
Seed was correct. 
We were wrong about. 

2819
02:16:24,240 --> 02:16:25,320
The other two? 
It's salt. 

2820
02:16:25,320 --> 02:16:27,560
Silver seed salt. 
Silver. 

2821
02:16:27,560 --> 02:16:29,440
Not silk at all. 
That's why it's so tricky. 

2822
02:16:29,440 --> 02:16:31,320
But salt. 
Silver and seed. 

2823
02:16:31,880 --> 02:16:34,360
Salt. 
That makes sense, yeah. 

2824
02:16:34,360 --> 02:16:36,280
Yeah. 
Silver also makes sense. 

2825
02:16:37,639 --> 02:16:40,719
Cool. 
All right, we have We have a cat

2826
02:16:41,280 --> 02:16:45,000
that is dangling by one arm and 
looking very cute. 

2827
02:16:45,200 --> 02:16:47,840
Cat's so well behaved. 
Yet another reason for y'all to 

2828
02:16:47,840 --> 02:16:49,920
have your video. 
Option occasionally enabled to 

2829
02:16:49,920 --> 02:16:52,719
see. 
This cute cat jet's so good. 

2830
02:16:52,719 --> 02:16:54,840
Oh, look at those those glowing 
eyes. 

2831
02:16:54,840 --> 02:16:59,000
Yeah, thanks as well to Nina for
her. 

2832
02:16:59,559 --> 02:17:03,320
Thoughtful guesses and 
assistance on takes on each 

2833
02:17:03,320 --> 02:17:06,520
wonder as well. 
Thanks to Joey, Jesse and Bran 

2834
02:17:06,520 --> 02:17:12,160
for helping us with our intros 
and outros and video both music 

2835
02:17:12,240 --> 02:17:15,360
only and video intros. 
Thanks to Michael Klorfeld for 

2836
02:17:15,360 --> 02:17:22,240
his maps and his video intro as 
well, and Sean is really trying 

2837
02:17:22,240 --> 02:17:23,400
to get his headphones on with 
one. 

2838
02:17:23,400 --> 02:17:27,000
It was really amusing. 
It was really amusing to watch. 

2839
02:17:27,000 --> 02:17:31,400
That happen in fact you did it 
very well Sean, I think. 

2840
02:17:32,320 --> 02:17:34,920
Well, I didn't even quite do it,
can I say. 

2841
02:17:35,639 --> 02:17:38,680
You got one here on good enough.
The Seven Wonders of History of.

2842
02:17:38,680 --> 02:17:41,000
Westeros are 7 cats we have. 7 
cats. 

2843
02:17:41,000 --> 02:17:43,200
We do have 7 cats between us. 
That's right. 

2844
02:17:43,320 --> 02:17:47,000
Yeah, so. 
One day, as I said, we will do 

2845
02:17:47,000 --> 02:17:49,879
the unnatural slash unknown 
wonders of the world, and as a 

2846
02:17:49,879 --> 02:17:52,400
teaser, I'll list off what we 
have so far for that the giant 

2847
02:17:52,400 --> 02:17:57,879
toad statue, yen, the butterfly 
Spirits, the the doom area of 

2848
02:17:57,879 --> 02:18:01,559
Valyria, the Sorrows, the Shadow
Lands, the caves of the 

2849
02:18:01,559 --> 02:18:03,440
children, the Greensier Cave, 
whatever you want to call it, 

2850
02:18:03,440 --> 02:18:07,680
the Ghost Grass, the God's Eye, 
and whatever else we can come up

2851
02:18:07,680 --> 02:18:08,879
with. 
This isn't a comprehensive list 

2852
02:18:08,879 --> 02:18:10,719
because these are just things 
that that came to mind while 

2853
02:18:10,719 --> 02:18:12,879
working on this other topic. 
If you have other suggestions 

2854
02:18:12,879 --> 02:18:15,080
for that, hit us up. 
That'll be a future episode. 

2855
02:18:15,080 --> 02:18:17,320
It won't be next week, but 
sometime in the future. 

2856
02:18:17,680 --> 02:18:21,320
And we also maybe we'll do a 
fauna episode of some kind 

2857
02:18:21,320 --> 02:18:23,959
Obesiary. 
That'll include things as well 

2858
02:18:23,959 --> 02:18:27,000
that we talked about today, like
those hooded apes of Lang and 

2859
02:18:27,000 --> 02:18:29,840
the millions of tigers and the 
monkeys and all that stuff and 

2860
02:18:29,959 --> 02:18:33,280
whatever else might make our 
list TBD. 

2861
02:18:33,840 --> 02:18:37,240
Perhaps Shawn's cat Jet will 
make the list That we're seeing 

2862
02:18:37,240 --> 02:18:40,280
there, because of her amazing 
stillness and cuteness is pretty

2863
02:18:40,280 --> 02:18:43,320
wondrous, I got to say. 
But that's a discussion for 

2864
02:18:43,320 --> 02:18:46,799
another time. 
Cats, dogs, apes and other 

2865
02:18:46,799 --> 02:18:50,920
creatures. 
So until next time, everybody, 

2866
02:18:51,440 --> 02:18:56,400
on behalf of Ashea, Sean and Jet
and the other six cats of 

2867
02:18:56,400 --> 02:18:59,520
History of Westeros. 
We'll see you next time and 

2868
02:18:59,520 --> 02:19:05,600
Valar re read us the.